124055-i-am-a-greedy-collector-appease-me

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			I know how this sounds.  However, I really like the Highwayman costume, and the Malgrave Sandwrap. (which I missed by a day due to processing time)  Pretty please let us who missed this great item purchase it somehow.  Please.	
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Sandwrap, couldn't care less.
 
Highway man : No.
That thing should stay as rare as it is.
Call me selfish, don't care.	
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I think he is saying he was on-time though due to the processing of his information he missed out on this because someone else took long is my best guess. Olivar. But otherwise i agree those whom are very late to the party missed the boat, perhaps to help crb with some more funds the specialty items could be located v.i.a a purchase store of some kind. Because even BLi.z.z had mounts and people still enjoyed the game without "B!7ch!n" too much. This is still a business after all.
 
Edit:
I wouldn't want them to get used to that idea nor do i like it but it is a biz and funds need to be made not that I am for those actions but actions need results.*cough*	
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Sorry, 
 
The Highway man set was a reward for those who played during the beta and actually helped testing the game.
It's a fair reward and should not be handed out.
As you said, came late to the game, so missed the boat.
There will be unique new rewards later on.
 
The sandwrap was a loyality reward for those who have been subbed since day one.
If you had the sub, you should have received if. If not open a ticket with support. Pretty sure they can correct this.	
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To illustrate with an example from my side:
 
I've been subbed on WoW for 10 years.
Except for 2 weeks where I had to replace my credit card.
Exactly in these 2 weeks the Blizzard Baby Bear was handed out to people with a sub as reward.
 
Guess who doesn't have that bear.
Guess who doesn't get the bear from support because "they cannot grant this item anymore".
Sometimes you miss out on stuff due reasons.
These costumes are such of that "stuff".	
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Sandwrap, couldn't care less.
 
Highway man : No.
That thing should stay as rare as it is.
Call me selfish, don't care.
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I'm all for giving them a way to purchase those items.  Why the Hell not?  Nobody is impressed that I was around in beta, and it does suck that I have friends who have now supported the game directly for half a year but can never get those boots with spurs.
 
I don't consider that fair.  It's a perfect waste of good items if we're hoarding these "exclusive" rewards.  I think it's worth enough that we wouldn't have to pay for them as beta testers.	
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Pretty much this, I played all betas I could to get the entire set on my beta character because I thought in live, you would only get what you unlocked. Still ended up missing the boots on my medic =/
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			I don't really care about exclusivity. Let 'em get the items. EGs or renown or whatever.	
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I still have Boom Boxes I haven't opened. o_0
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Yep, me too! Like 80+ just because I got bored of opening them.
 
 
I tend to disagree, the outfit shows I helped the game during beta testing, which I did. But then again, the same could be said for the title. Not my fault they didnt play during many of the beta weekends. Just because they want it, doesn't mean my reward for helping the development of the game, before it was released, should be be made available to every Dick, Bob and Mary.
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And yet, why shouldn't it be?  Exclusivity doesn't have much meaning, it's a way of telling other players they can't even purchase something you got for free.  Is that fair?  
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And yet, why shouldn't it be?  Exclusivity doesn't have much meaning, it's a way of telling other players they can't even purchase something you got for free.  Is that fair?  What if that person hadn't even known Wildstar existed until now (if I hadn't checked my junk email folder one day, I wouldn't have known about open beta).  That person would essentially want to say, "Look, I wasn't here for beta.  I want to contribute some money so that I can, at least, retroactively support that cost."  I don't think it's fair to tell them the answer is, "You should have been here, irrespective of the circumstances for why you might not have been here or the offer of remuneration for not being here."
 
That's why I recommended the cash shop idea that actually gives subscribers the items while it comes out, including all the exclusive items.  It seems more fair for everyone involved.  If someone wants to essentially fund the game's development for a period they weren't here (including beta), I'm not opposed to them getting that item.  It's not like I didn't benefit; I got it for free.  And if this game ever does hit that one-million subscriber mark, that's a lot of people who would better serve the continued development of the game if they could essentially pay backwards to times they weren't even probably aware of the game's existence.
 
It just doesn't seem worth it to be able to lord it over someone who may not have even had the opportunity and has every intention of making up for it.  It's not like it would have been an exclusive cash shop item (obviously, we got them without paying a cent, just for being there to support the game).
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Life aint fair.
See my post about the blizzard bear. WoW doesn't hand it out either afterwards.
You can't have everything in life.
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The way I see it and imagine it, if a new player would start playing and then get to know that he cannot get these neat things he really would like, it gets to sorta a "Oh, you want these cosmetic items? Tough shit, you are too late, you are not as worthy as these veteran subbers! Take your money to devs that actually give a damn!"
 
Yeah, I just think its douchy that they make stuff completely unavailable. Put it in for extremely high prices, behind super hard encounters or just behind an extremely long grind. But atleast have them available.	
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Except, in this case, they can.  I wouldn't want to be party to the vote that says that we can make it happen, but we refuse.  Especially when there are no losers in the equation in this case.  Hell, at this point, someone paying for the Highwayman set will probably do more good for the game than any of us open beta testers did.
 
 
 
True enough, but someone is offering to actually pay for it.  We got it without needing to pay for it (we weren't paying a subscription at the time, either).  Does that mean someone who wants to drop twenty dollars on it to compensate for not being around for beta shouldn't even have the opportunity?
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I think exclusivity is good so long as the items in question aren't going to waste. I also think the promise of exclusivity should be respected. To detail that a bit...
 
The Datascape Window was a terrible waste. Very few players would ever receive it, and not many of those  who did would make good use of it. Raiding takes a lot of time, building takes a lot of time. So to have such a cool item used by a minority of the minority seemed bad to me. In cases like this I think exclusivity does not work well, and I'm super happy they lifted the restriction and let us all buy Datascape Windows with EGs last drop.
 
In the case of the Highwayman gear, I wouldn't have a problem if it was kept exclusive, as it wouldn't be a waste in the same way. I also wouldn't mind if they made it widely available, since it wasn't really earned by doing anything exceptional. I believe all you had to do was log in during beta (I got a suit and I spent maybe 30 minutes playing beta, and did not give feedback— the poor optimization and screen spam sent me running, though I knew it was beta and so vowed to return at launch).
 
However... if Carbine actually told people that the Highwayman outfit would be exclusive for beta testers, that's a promise. And I don't think they should break that promise.	
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In the case of the Highwayman gear, I wouldn't have a problem if it was kept exclusive, as it wouldn't be a waste in the same way. I also wouldn't mind if they made it widely available, since it wasn't really earned by doing anything exceptional. I believe all you had to do was log in during beta (I got a suit and I spent maybe 30 minutes playing beta, and did not give feedback— the poor optimization and screen spam sent me running, though I knew it was beta and so vowed to return at launch).
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Honestly, I'd really rather not have any children learning that it is worthwhile quality of a man in life to want to have something he makes sure no one else can ever have.  I suppose we'll have to respectfully disagree, because I believe that the idea of "they missed out, tough luck" is a rather poor way to treat a paying customer.  And these are paying customers we're talking about, people subscribed to the game that want to pay for time they weren't even around for.  That's not "Money can get you anything", that's just common sense.
 
We didn't do anything worthy of being able to stick our tongue out at someone who actually wants to contribute now, especially monetarily in addition to their monthly obligation.  Not for any item.  It's a very ugly sentiment.
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And I'm looking at the educational value from it.
"Here's money, give it to me", "Money can get you anything".
I don't know how old the OP is, probably old enough. But this is not what I want my children come running for.
It's a valuable lesson.
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			As much as I would personally love to get my hands on the Highway stuff, amongst many other items (for example, Rest in Piecemaker), things that are exclusive for certain loyalty conditions are what give it its value. It sucks but it isn't something that totally hinders my gameplay, I just move on and create a different costume using other pieces.	
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I worked for it. They said upfront that the highway man costume was for beta testers, and that there would be a cycle of the items per week. I wasn't lucky enough to be a full time tester, so I had to be on the spot at what ever source was handing out the codes for that weekend. I watched the twitter, I stayed in the know about what piece was when and my hard work got me the set, and the rest-in-peace maker. It was a one time thing for the beta testers, just like they said.  
 
I wouldn't want a cosmetic costume shop showing up anyway, as I think it sets a bad precedent for future content.   	
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Honestly, I'd really rather not have any children learning that it is worthwhile quality of a man in life to want to have something he makes sure no one else can ever have. I suppose we'll have to respectfully disagree, because I believe that the idea of "they missed out, tough luck" is a rather poor way to treat a paying customer. And these are paying customers we're talking about, people subscribed to the game that want to pay for time they weren't even around for. That's not "Money can get you anything", that's just common sense.
 
We didn't do anything worthy of being able to stick our tongue out at someone who actually wants to contribute now, especially monetarily in addition to their monthly obligation. Not for any item. It's a very ugly sentiment.
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By this logic, if you're late to a concert, but still bought a ticket, the band should restart the show when you walk in. You want children to learn that the world needs to stop and rewind for their dollar.
 
I could care less if the Highwayman outfit gets handed out, but I'm getting pretty tired of being told one thing by Carbine then having my face spat in a bit further down the road. This was a beta reward, this stays a beta reward.
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It was a reward. This is more like if I walk into a restaurant and I say, "Can I have a tortilla soup?"
 
And they say, "No, you have to be in by five o'clock on Monday."
 
"Are you out of tortilla soup?"
 
"No, just that the people who got in before five o'clock on Monday would be angry that someone could get it afterwards. We've made it a rule you can't get tortilla soup after five o'clock on Monday, even if we have them. It's for our loyal customers who taste-tested our new menu."
 
"And they can have it whenever they want?"
 
"Yes, they were here then."
 
"Okay, can I pay any extra for it? I really want it?"
 
"No, absolutely not! You have to learn to come before that. We don't just give out tortilla soup to people who want to pay for it. Only for our loyal customers who knew about us before that day!"
 
"I hadn't even heard about this place before today!"
 
"Well, that's a shame. You missed out. You should have heard about us before."
 
"Well, can I get a tortilla soup next Monday? Or how do I get on this list?"
 
"You can't, we are no longer going to serve tortilla soup to anyone who wasn't here. But it's okay though, you can have anything else on the menu."
 
"But no tortilla soup. Ever. Even though you have it, I'm willing to pay extra for it, and didn't even know that this was going to happen or that this was the only way I'd ever get it?"
 
"Yes."
 
It's ridiculous to me. He can't even go to the PTR to do the same kind of testing and get the costume, he's forever barred from having it no matter what he wants to do for it? So that we can feel big about ourselves? We were beta testers, it's not a medal of valor.
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It was available to everyone who felt like downloading the client and signing in during the Open Beta. My wife and I both got it, and we were only involved in the open beta events. People had the opportunity, they missed out, that's that.
 
Is it because it's a digital item people feel they should be rewarded it? Companies don't give out Exclusive items after you've missed their reward or loyalty windows, why should it apply here?
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Let's take a second and look at, say.. League of Legends:
 
**********
Hey Beta Testers,
 
With our recent public announcement that the game is free, we can now announce two special rewards we're planning for our testers.
 
1. All beta testers will get an exclusive champion skin that will be available only to beta testers. We will put up a poll in the near future so testers can decide which champion we'll make a skin for.
2. All beta testers that were added PRIOR to 07/14/2009 will have their summoner names listed in the League of Legends credits.
**********
 
Should I be able to go and pay them money to get my exclusive champion skin and my summoner name in the credits? Feels like a pretty ridiculous request.	
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I think Vics examples a bit on the extreme and unusual side...
 
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It's a pretty simple thing to me. Did Carbine promise the Highwayman costume as an exclusive item only ever for beta testers? Or did they say, "we're going to give this as a reward for beta testers"? There is an important distinction here.
 
If it's the first, then Carbine can do whatever they want with this item and still maintain integrity.
 
If it's the second, then Carbine should keep the item exclusive and maintain their integrity.
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Let's take a second and look at, say.. League of Legends:
 
**********
Hey Beta Testers,
 
With our recent public announcement that the game is free, we can now announce two special rewards we're planning for our testers.
 
1. All beta testers will get an exclusive champion skin that will be available only to beta testers. We will put up a poll in the near future so testers can decide which champion we'll make a skin for.
2. All beta testers that were added PRIOR to 07/14/2009 will have their summoner names listed in the League of Legends credits.
**********
 
Should I be able to go and pay them money to get my exclusive champion skin and my summoner name in the credits? Feels like a pretty ridiculous request.
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So wave money around and complain? That's what's ridiculous. What makes you so special that the restaraunt changes its ways for you? I can't agree that this logic even vaguely sits well with me.
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It was a reward.  This is more like if I walk into a restaurant and I say, "Can I have a tortilla soup?"
 
And they say, "No, you have to be in by five o'clock on Monday."
 
"Are you out of tortilla soup?"
 
"No, just that the people who got in before five o'clock on Monday would be angry that someone could get it afterwards.  We've made it a rule you can't get  tortilla soup after five o'clock on Monday, even if we have them.  It's for our loyal customers who taste-tested our new menu."
 
"And they can have it whenever they want?"
 
"Yes, they were here then."
 
"Okay, can I pay any extra for it?  I really want it?"
 
"No, absolutely not!  You have to learn to come before that.  We don't just give out tortilla soup to people who want to pay for it.  Only for our loyal customers who knew about us before that day!"
 
"I hadn't even heard about this place before today!"
 
"Well, that's a shame.  You missed out.  You should have heard about us before."
 
"Well, can I get a tortilla soup next Monday?  Or how do I get on this list?"
 
"You can't, we are no longer going to serve tortilla soup to anyone who wasn't here.  But it's okay though, you can have anything else on the menu."
 
"But no tortilla soup.  Ever.  Even though you have it, I'm willing to pay extra for it, and didn't even know that this was going to happen or that this was the only way I'd ever get it?"
 
"Yes."
 
It's ridiculous to me.  He can't even go to the PTR to do the same kind of testing and get the costume, he's forever barred from having it no matter what he wants to do for it?  So that we can feel big about ourselves?  We were beta testers, it's not a medal of valor.
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Not sure if this is in response to what I wrote. If it is, I think you can answer the question yourself pretty easily based on the premises I put forth. :P
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Honestly, I'd really rather not have any children learning that it is worthwhile quality of a man in life to want to have something he makes sure no one else can ever have. 
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I think you inverted what you were trying to say in that previous post.
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Bad analogy is bad.
 
I don't normally disagree with you Vic, but exclusivity IS important. You can't possibly compare an exclusive beta reward to FOOD, they just aren't the same. This is better compared to, lets say, a limited edition toy. Once they're gone, you can't get any more from the manufacturer, no matter how much money you throw at them. They also instantly lose value if you open and use them. It's not a perfect analogy, since the Highwayman set is soulbound, but it's close. Far closer than your poor analogy.
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			I will say that IF it is true that the OP missed the headwrap by one day due to payment processing, they(support) should be able actually see that this is the case and give the headwrap to them since the transaction dates should show that this was the reason they missed it.	
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I will say that IF it is true that the OP missed the headwrap by one day due to payment processing, they(support) should be able actually see that this is the case and give the headwrap to them since the transaction dates should show that this was the reason they missed it.
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nobody cares if you wear the highwayman's set.  They only care that they can't get it themselves.
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So they don't care, or they do care? Obviously it has a value if someone wants it.
 
 
No matter how badly someone wants it, no one can get a Super Bowl I ring, except those who participated in it. Sure they can get OTHER rings, some maybe considered bigger or better, but that specific one? Nope. It's exclusive.
 
If Carbine wants to come up with a SIMILAR costume and offer it up for in-game sales (not for cash), I don't think anyone would mind. But the same thing, THE exclusive set? That's just not cool with me.
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So, you'd be fine if they released a recoloring of the set, and called it something else?  I'd be totally fine with that if that's what is bothering you.  I've got no problem calling it the Marauder's Set V.2 if the name brand is really, really important.  As long as it's the same thing and they can functionally use it the same way, it wouldn't matter.
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I think there's a lot less argument on whether he should be able to purchase the headwrap, though.  People aren't as married to that idea.
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If Carbine wants to come up with a SIMILAR costume and offer it up for in-game sales (not for cash), I don't think anyone would mind. But the same thing, THE exclusive set? That's just not cool with me.
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I wouldn't mind if a similar costume to the Highwayman one, all I want from that set is the boots. If they do eventually release a similar costume I just hope it won't be handed out to players who have active subscriptions, have stayed subbed for X amount of time, or for those who took part in certain events/logged in certain days. I've had to cancel my subscription because I can't afford to pay for it ATM (and I don't have time to farm for CREDD) so doing this would just be cruel  :(
 
TBH, if Carbine just released another pair of boots with spurs I'd have no need for the Highwayman costume so I wouldn't mind whether or not it remained a Beta exclusive costume or not.
 
Sort of topic related: For the Malgrave Sandwrap, did players have to be subscribed to the game constantly since release or was it for staying subbed for a certain amount of time?
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This makes no sense to me. :P
 
I'll give it a go in the interest of ensuring my position is clear!
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			I'm with the Chua on this one. Excluives rewards should stay that way, at least for the time being. Look at LoL and Smite. Both games have exclusives skins for an event. You can't buy those skins you just had to be at the right time and place to get them. Sure they could sell them on the side, but then the items are no longer exclusive, just items for an item shop. Keeping cosmetic items exclusive makes them rare and unique. It's nice to have an item you can no longer get.Plus I like being one of the few warriors wielding my gravestone sword.(If this game ever goes F2P/B2P, you can bet all those excluvies items will be in the item shop)	
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Hence is the problem.  People are under the impression you want them because they're rare (or not), or care that they have them.  It's a fundamental misconception.  I know I'm a far more functional person, and I'm very well aware that if I start a sentence with, "You can't get them anymore, you had to be here for open beta...." the first thing that will run through that player's mind is not, "ZOGM, OPEN BETA?"  Nobody cares that I or anyone else was here for open beta.  The first thing that runs through their head will be, "Well, I can't get it then.  That sucks."  And hopefully Carbine might release something close-but-can't-be-exact that looks the same or better.
 
I'm fine with them recoloring it and adding a new name, so that if I ever really wanted to get my nose in the air, I could just link it to chat.  It just seems like a ridiculous concept, all someone had to do to get this "rare" piece of gear was to be paying attention to their junk email folder, click a link, and login.
 
It's not a super bowl ring, it's just a costume people would like to use pieces of but can't right now.  Not even if they put more effort in than the people who own them ever will.
 
On the subject of your sandwrap, you're thinking of FFXIV:ARR's somewhat superior rewards system, which gives you rewards for length of service rather than period.  Wildstar forces you to be around at the period in which it is given out; you have no recourse at present.
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I understood your position, but when you initially stated it you said "If it's the first...." but that should have been stated to the second scenario. But, now I'm just bumping post count.
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I understood your position, but when you initially stated it you said "If it's the first...." but that should have been stated to the second scenario. But, now I'm just bumping post count.
 
 
As far as the food scenario, I have a better one for you.
 
I went to McDonald's yesterday, and there on the menu in all its fluorescent green glory was the Shamrock shake. I ordered one and was told, "I'm sorry sir, we're no longer selling the Shamrock shake". I'm sure they've still got some mint syrup sitting around, but its after St Patty's, I just don't get my milkshake.
 
Another is Quizno's garlic prime rib sub. My favorite sub ever, for a limited time! They took it off the menu about 6 years ago and it has never come back. I don't get to eat them any more, but I'm sure they still have all the ingredients sitting around.
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I would really like to have the entire set, I get really jealous of those who do have it, but the boots are the part I want the most and the fact that I can't get them or anything similar, quite frankly, sucks. Mind you, I've never had to deal with a situation like this (in most other games I've played I've been able to buy rare items or costumes from other players because they don't get locked to characters regardless of whether or not they use them beforehand) so being unable to buy the rare costumes or items in WildStar is even more frustrating.
 
As for players who do use the costume all I think of when I see them is "they got to participate in Beta tests. Lucky them."  :( I myself never got to participate in any of the Betas because they all happened during my Honours Year at University and I couldn't afford to have any distractions. If the Beta wasn't during this time I would have definitely taken part and wouldn't be having this issue. I was desperate to but I get distracted by games far too easily and couldn't take the risk with WS.
 
If there was an option to, I'd happily trade the Rocket House or any other account item for the Highwayman set but, sadly for me, I can't and I have to live with it.
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Informed my entire viewpoint, because I know people, real excellent players, who are literally kept from getting these despite having put in more time in this game making it better than a lot of the people that do have them.  They aren't a symbol worthy of respect, they don't make you a good person or player or pillar of this community.  They're just a pair of boots you got for logging in during open beta, and *cupcake* you for having the temerity to not be aware of the game as soon as we were if you want them.
 
Believe me, I have the same reaction you do hearing it, and I have that costume set.
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Look, you absolutely HAVE to stop acting like the people that want this to stay are stuck up snobs that want to rub it in the nose of those that weren't there. You are only making yourself sound petty and bitter. I don't even know if I have highwayman anything, I'd have to dig though characters banks to check on that. But I don't think they should take an exclusive reward and just hand it out for cash. Sure, it sucks for those that didn't get it, but thems the breaks. You can't always get something you want, because sometimes, they just stop making them. And yes, I understand it's a virtual code that still exists, but just because it exists doesn't mean they should just hand them out.
 
Things like the fez and the headwrap, I'd be ok if they changed it to "If you've been subed for X months, you can have it" instead of "If you were subbed during X time frame, you got it." But any of the beta rewards should remain exclusive. I only did open beta for about 4 days, I don't expect to get rewards that were given during CBT or anything prior to when I joined. Those people deserve something special IN GAME to show that they were there first. And it's nothing to do with being a snob or rubbing someone's nose in it.
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Except that it isn't something that isn't easily replicable.  How exactly am I going to be bitter about something I have already?  This isn't for me, I don't need a Highwayman's set (and I don't need to check to see if I have it, I have pictures of my characters wearing the pieces).  For what possible reason, beyond snobbishness, is exclusivity worth anything?  That's its entire point.  And at least with real world goods, it makes some sense, there are only a few real Rembrandts in the world and are unlikely to be more made.  But this is nothing but a purely digital item, easily replicated, absolutely without real value, absolutely without actual scarcity.
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Lets be real, nothing in this game has any REAL value. But within the game, there are very valuable items, and very common items, and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. Having exclusive items available for people who were invited into beta is not a new concept, and I don't think there's anything wrong with it. It's a way to say thank you for taking the time out of your life to test the game before launch, to attempt to help get the game out running. I have no idea what the Real World value has anything to do with it, except that you're perfectly willing to throw your real world money to get it.
 
ANYONE who enters a game late in its life cycle and expects to have access to every single item that has ever graced the servers is disillusioned at best. EVERY game changes, every game has items that were once available that are no longer available. I have items on my EQ2 characters that were named after well-known members of the community, but are no longer of any use in the game, but I keep them because, to me, they are amusing reminders of players I used to play with. They are most definitely not of any real value, in OR out of game, but to me, they mean something. That's the point. They MEAN SOMETHING to people, they mean "I was here first, I helped in beta, I showed up, I participated, I helped form this game at launch." And you want to just take that away, because you think they're snobs for wanting that.
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For once have to agree with Olivar. The highwaymans costume was given to Beta players. In Carbines own words it will never be available again. 
 
Exclusivity in some things, even in a game, perhaps especially in an MMO does matter. I am proud to have earned that costume. I tested as much as I could and reported as many bugs as I found. I did the intro levels and zones like celestion, algoroc, whitevale, auroria plus all quests over and over and over to test changes and bug fixes. Now you want to give my reward for doing that to anyone and everyone? NO
 
 
edited stupid autocorrect	
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Now you want to give my reward for doing that to anyone and everyone? NO
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You need to dial it back, Vic.
 
1) No one is telling these people to go to hell, or they don't deserve it, or they are unworthy. YOU are putting those feelings and emotions onto us, and it's unfair of you.
2) Someone who ACTUALLY got these in beta and are saying any of the above has nothing to do with whether the costume should remain exclusive or not. That's on the person who's being a dick, not on the devs for making an exclusive item.
3) Yes, making everything available to everyone takes away exclusivity, and to some people, that is important. It has much less to do with "Haha you can't have it!" and more to do with "Sweet, I got something cool for doing something different."
4) You say both that beta rewards are good and that they're bad if they're exclusive. What's the point of giving a reward for being in beta if it's just given to anyone who comes along afterwards? Does it suck for someone who didn't hear about the game before beta? Sure. I hadn't heard of Wildstar until halfway through Open Beta. I don't think I deserve the highway man set, because I DIDN'T DO WHAT WAS REQUIRED TO GET IT. Time-lock restrictions are as valid as "Kill a super hard raid mob" restrictions.	
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{| class="blockquote"
True enough, but someone is offering to actually pay for it.  We got it without needing to pay for it (we weren't paying a subscription at the time, either).  Does that mean someone who wants to drop twenty dollars on it to compensate for not being around for beta shouldn't even have the opportunity?
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
You need to dial it back, Vic.
 
1) No one is telling these people to go to hell, or they don't deserve it, or they are unworthy. YOU are putting those feelings and emotions onto us, and it's unfair of you.
2) Someone who ACTUALLY got these in beta and are saying any of the above has nothing to do with whether the costume should remain exclusive or not. That's on the person who's being a dick, not on the devs for making an exclusive item.
3) Yes, making everything available to everyone takes away exclusivity, and to some people, that is important. It has much less to do with "Haha you can't have it!" and more to do with "Sweet, I got something cool for doing something different."
4) You say both that beta rewards are good and that they're bad if they're exclusive. What's the point of giving a reward for being in beta if it's just given to anyone who comes along afterwards? Does it suck for someone who didn't hear about the game before beta? Sure. I hadn't heard of Wildstar until halfway through Open Beta. I don't think I deserve the highway man set, because I DIDN'T DO WHAT WAS REQUIRED TO GET IT. Time-lock restrictions are as valid as "Kill a super hard raid mob" restrictions.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
1. Yes, just because you try to be nice about it doesn't mean it's not exactly that.  And I'm not even the guy you're saying that to, I'm the guy that has to watch while people do it and try to justify it.  The guy wants a pair of boots for a costume, he's been told "no", that people don't care that it's unfair, that they don't care it sucks, that they wouldn't like it if it was them in that situation, and everyone's fine with that?  That's pretty clear.  It wasn't the devs saying they shouldn't be made available, it was the players.
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{| class="blockquote"
I'm of the opinion that, if you're willing to work for it, you should get it.  If you want it to be epic, make it hard to get.  But the second you can't get it anymore, it's meaningless.  At that point the only reason other people don't have it is because they can't actually access it, not because they can't do what you did.  It's a costume set anybody got just for clicking an NCSoft advertisement that put them in open beta in time.  It's not even a reward for hard work.  You may have worked hard during beta, but it's not what that means.  You didn't get it for writing bug reports.  In my case, it's a reward for being susceptible to advertising, they would have given it to me without any further work.
----
			
I'll post a little bit more when I get back, but I'm gonna ahve to side with Mae, Olivar, and Aralon, etc on this one...
 
One thing I wanted to just pop in really quick of note too before i have to run off is that I am reading people say that there were some who did nothing to earn it to begin with, but really them logging in was part of the test for server stability primarily. Actually I remember that they originally set it up where you were only going to get pieces of the highwayman set that you unlocked. These unlocks were cycled and they didn't tell people which week it was that unlocked which part either as a means to encourage people to log in. It was only later on decided to award this to all beta testers as a full set for helping regardless of which week you came in on. So I wouldn't invalidate people who only logged on as doing "nothing"...	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
I'll post a little bit more when I get back, but I'm gonna ahve to side with Mae, Olivar, and Aralon, etc on this one...
 
One thing I wanted to just pop in really quick of note too before i have to run off is that I am reading people say that there were some who did nothing to earn it to begin with, but really them logging in was part of the test for server stability primarily. Actually I remember that they originally set it up where you were only going to get pieces of the highwayman set that you unlocked. These unlocks were cycled and they didn't tell people which week it was that unlocked which part either as a means to encourage people to log in. It was only later on decided to award this to all beta testers as a full set for helping regardless of which week you came in on. So I wouldn't invalidate people who only logged on as doing "nothing"...
----
			No, I am not in favour of just handing The Highwayman costume out to anyone who wants it. It should be exclusive to the beta testers.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
things that are exclusive for certain loyalty conditions are what give it its value. 
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Technically you got the suit for logging in, not for all your hard work. I'm sure they appreciate what you did, but I got the same suit for doing nothing helpful at all. :unsure:
 
Felt the need to state that again, to keep the debate lucid. (I'm not against your opinion though, just this part of it.)
----
			
Hrm, well. Its not like we need any new players for Wildstar, right? So there is no problem at all to keep the only pair of cowboy boots in a space-western-esque game completely out of the reach of any new player.
 
Might as well keep giving the middle finger to any new player that would enjoy using any of these comsetic items, since we have enough players to circle-jerk the game up and into the ends of time.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Hrm, well. Its not like we need any new players for Wildstar, right? So there is no problem at all to keep the only pair of cowboy boots in a space-western-esque game completely out of the reach of any new player.
 
Might as well keep giving the middle finger to any new player that would enjoy using any of these comsetic items, since we have enough players to circle-jerk the game up and into the ends of time.
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{| class="blockquote"
Lol I am sorry, I don't really like pointing and laughing at posts but please tell me this was sarcastic. Yes people leave/don't play the game because of cowboy boots lol
 
I'm sorry, that was mean.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
It's not only because they have content completely unavailable to them on the only basis of them being new, but I would say it is a contributing factor. However small or big it is, I have no idea.
 
Back when I played Gw2, there was a lot of people I played with that stopped playing because of similar reasons. Being treated worse only because they started playing "too late".
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
It's not only because they have content completely unavailable to them on the only basis of them being new, but I would say it is a contributing factor. However small or big it is, I have no idea.
 
Back when I played Gw2, there was a lot of people I played with that stopped playing because of similar reasons. Being treated worse only because they started playing "too late".
----
			
Okay so I got caught up in a few things, but this is pretty much my stance on it.
 
Had the items not been promised as exclusives to beta testers when asked and when they were presented I would have no issue with this at all, but it was promised as such to the players and going back on that promise is a big "no no", especially for some people who already have issues with Carbine Studios' previous communication errors. To me personally it is important for people and businesses to keep their promises and while miscommunication is one thing an explicit statement(Which this stems from) is another. Call me foolish if you like, but that would rattle my trust in Carbine.
 
Now you can call me a jackass snob if you wish to, but I'm definitely not giving a finger to people who can't get the item(s) anymore. If I find anything more demeaning and an "F you" going through this thread is people using the technicality of "all you had to do was just log in" against people saying they worked for it. They probably did and feel more happy with the highwayman costume because they didn't just do bare minimum to acquire it, but how do you really gauge that? Do you just tally up reports? Do you count their number of posts?What if someone only got to test once and pointed out a really glaring flaw as opposed to someone who writes in countless minor and insignificant feedback? 
 
You simply can't gauge it well enough without resources being really dedicated and TRYING to be unbias as possible looking over and comparing all the players to eachother. They even offered that "wrecking ball" title, to some people who reported bugs. I know I didn't get it even though I know for sure I reported bugs, gave feedback and such, but from what I understand it was only specific type of bug reports that Cougar was looking for. So best way was just to give an overall encompassing "thank you" to those who participated.
 
I will also mention again that you shouldn't invalidate people as doing "nothing" for just logging in either as that was part of the testing purposes. As mentioned earlier:
 
{| class="blockquote"
Actually I remember that they originally set it up where you were only going to get pieces of the highwayman set that you unlocked. These unlocks were cycled and they didn't tell people which week it was that unlocked which part either as a means to encourage people to log in. It was only later on decided to award this to all beta testers as a full set for helping regardless of which week you came in on. So I wouldn't invalidate people who only logged on as doing "nothing"...
----
			
Out of all my years playing MMOs, this is the first time I have seen a thread like this. Has the MMO community really become nothing but brats with a self-entitlement issue? I know many have said it has, but I never believed it till now...
 
{| class="blockquote"
It's not only because they have content completely unavailable to them on the only basis of them being new, but I would say it is a contributing factor. However small or big it is, I have no idea.
 
Back when I played Gw2, there was a lot of people I played with that stopped playing because of similar reasons. Being treated worse only because they started playing "too late".
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Out of all my years playing MMOs, this is the first time I have seen a thread like this. Has the MMO community really become nothing but brats with a self-entitlement issue? I know many have said it has, but I never believed it till now...
 
 
Being treated worse? Its a beta costume...B.E.T.A. as in you had to play the BETA to get it. You dont get something just because you think are entitled to it. I been playing WoW since vanilla, missed the TBC event, missed the tabard, does that mean I am entitled to it then? Am I being treated unfairly? NO! Its the conditions for owning it. If you do not meet the conditions, why should you have it? Just because you want it?
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
yes
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{| class="blockquote"
Out of all my years playing MMOs, this is the first time I have seen a thread like this. Has the MMO community really become nothing but brats with a self-entitlement issue? I know many have said it has, but I never believed it till now...
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
To which part, I asked like 100 questions D-:
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Don't pretend that the only people who feel others should have access to these items are people who don't have them already.
----
			I simply disagree. I already have the Highwayman outfit but I guess I'm more of a generous type - especially when it comes to something that's just a game. >_>	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
I simply disagree. I already have the Highwayman outfit but I guess I'm more of a generous type - especially when it comes to something that's just a game. >_>
----
			
I have the costume on EU
I do not have any of the costumes on US
 
c'est la vie.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
I have the costume on EU
I do not have any of the costumes on US
 
c'est la vie.
----
			
No Vic.
You know my opinion, and nothing in this topic will change that.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Especially a costume set.... given away for doing the arduous task of logging in during beta.  Not writing bug reports, not playing, not recruiting friends.... just logging in during beta.
 
Something for everyone to be proud of.  I really thought we weren't going to be subject to this kind of elitism in this community.  It's the first time I think I can say I'm embarrassed to be a part of it. 
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
No Vic.
You know my opinion, and nothing in this topic will change that.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Out of all my years playing MMOs, this is the first time I have seen a thread like this. Has the MMO community really become nothing but brats with a self-entitlement issue? I know many have said it has, but I never believed it till now...
 
 
Being treated worse? Its a beta costume...B.E.T.A. as in you had to play the BETA to get it. You dont get something just because you think are entitled to it. I been playing WoW since vanilla, missed the TBC event, missed the tabard, does that mean I am entitled to it then? Am I being treated unfairly? NO! Its the conditions for owning it. If you do not meet the conditions, why should you have it? Just because you want it?
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Just don't expect that having an opinion makes it immune to challenge by better, more practical, and more fair ideas.
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This thread is getting way too heated up over a pretty minor thing. Applying ideological philosophies to a pixel reward is not worth losing friends over, everyone. :(
 
Typrop, if my last few posts felt like an "f you", sorry for that. My position on this is pretty mild: I'm cool with a reintroduction of the item, as long as it doesn't break any promises. As you maintain it would break a promise, I support you. As to the idea of hard work/reward, I wasn't trying to imply that people didn't work hard, or that they didn't deserve a reward for hard work, or even that, in their minds, it wasn't a reward for hard work. My only point— a very technical one but still valid, I think— is that folks shouldn't argue or imply that the suit was, objectively, a reward for hard work. If it was in your mind, great; but it obviously wasn't intended, by Carbine, as a reward specifically for hard work, because those of us who didn't put in hard work still got it!
 
Again, a very technical point but one I feel needed to be made. Not to diminish your own sense of accomplishment; but because it would be unfair and dishonest to present the reason it was given as something other than what it was in the end, when lots of us got it for a much smaller amount of effort than others. Hopefully you can sympathize with this rationale (and keep in mind that I'm not using it to undermine your position on exclusivity).
 
However, I don't think ANYONE should be made to feel guilty for wanting to feel like they got a nice gift for contributing, or for wanting that gift to stay exclusive.
 
 
And this leads me to my next point, to Vic... I think (just opinion) you're investing too much into this debate. Your last post made me cringe a bit, and it seems out of character. I know you've had a rough week, and I know it's tempting to judge people's responses no matter what the context, but you have to consider that this is a little thing in a game. While you may think it's worse that some folks want to prevent access to an item when it's easily replicated, in their minds it could be that they're willing to be firm on this specifically because it's such a small thing. I don't think anyone wants to stop hungry people from eating here. :P
 
And I think that's reasonable. It's not right to make someone feel bad because they didn't share their french fries, know what I mean? People get to be selfish from time to time, that's just life. So while I agree with some of your arguments, and deeply sympathize with the desire to spread fun everywhere, I don't think it's good or useful to make any ethical judgement in this kind of context.
 
On the flip side, if the digging can cease, I hope that those of you arguing against Vic can empathize with his desire to help others, and also acknowledge that he's been pretty outgunned here. While the latter point shouldn't affect your opinion, I hope it can take some of the edge off, to cut him some slack. It's difficult to juggle arguments and can quickly cause frustration that leads to overinvestment (not sure if that's the case here).
 
I've been pretty argumentative in the past so I might not be the best person to make this post. But I hope we can all dial it back a bit and remember that this topic is a drop in a lake. There's no need and no benefit to letting this generate bad vibes. Don't let ideology ruin compromise and understanding.
 
/2cents
 
 
edited for mistake in early post	
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who's losing friends?
Just cause Vic has a different view on this doesn't mean I will drop him like a brick.
We just see this different, that's all.
 
Vic just eum...puts more words in his responses.	
----
			
Maybe no one is, but the replies seemed to be escalating and moving farther from the point. :P
 
You know, I'm probably worried because this is the first time I've seen a bunch of people I like and respect going at each other. it's like I'm watching my parents fight.  :lol:	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Maybe no one is, but the replies seemed to be escalating and moving farther from the point. :P
 
You know, I'm probably worried because this is the first time I've seen a bunch of people I like and respect going at each other. it's like I'm watching my parents fight.  :lol:
----
			Agreed that this is getting too intense. In the words of Gryzzl: "Wouldn't it be tight if everyone was chill to each other?"	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Agreed that this is getting too intense. In the words of Gryzzl: "Wouldn't it be tight if everyone was chill to each other?"
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Jack Torrance knows intense when he sees it.
----
			
@ EsperXIV - Not aimed specifically at you, but rather the overall thread seems to really give me that impression. I'm not saying the point isn't valid but when you get comments such as "Hey, I'll have you know I'm very proud of my ability to push the login button!" it comes off as more as a an insulting jab at people who do feel they did wok for it by associating the highwayman outfit with their efforts despite it not being part oft the requirement. It isn't helped by other commentary calling those with disagreements snobs, elitists, and the other side calling people entitled brats as well further fueling it.(these people know who they are)
 
While I don't hinge on the "hard work" aspect as much as others may I personally can relate to and understand the feeling that "I worked for it" because originally it was only going to be something those of us who played in closed winter beta and prior would have had it, but that changed to all betas. It was not promised that it would only be black ops only, but promised to be beta so i didn't mind them expanding it further just to kind of add a bit more background for my perspective on that stance on where that feeling personally would come from for me if I was using it.
 
I'm simply going to say that I've never known any game or company to release times stated as exclusive. HOWEVER I know that they can and do modify said exclusives so they're different enough yet similar even in F2P and B2P games. As example on one in tera can ever get the regal frost lion mount that I have because I'm a pre-order collectors edition, but they can get a jeweled lion which shares the same mesh but has a much different overall look and feel giving players a lion that's similar. Myself, Mae and others would have no issue with that as we've said.
 
I'm going to dip out though now as I think this thread has run its course and I don't have much else to say.
			
				
	Edited March 26, 2015 by Typrop	
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I don't always agree with Vic's opinions and he is my GM. :) I also don't always agree with Olivar's, Esper's, and sometimes my own.  :wacko:  But that doesn't mean I'm going to put them down or call them names because of it. Please be nice people. (Yes, I have made a few not so appropriate comments to a certain someone in the past. I let them get under my skin. Not anymore.)
 
On topic: The Highway costume was given to beta testers and should be kept as their own reward. I don't want to see it made available for everyone. That takes away from the rarity of it.	
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{| class="blockquote"
 
On topic: The Highway costume was given to beta testers and should be kept as their own reward. I don't want to see it made available for everyone. That takes away from the rarity of it.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Fair point.
I don't think Vic has anything against us either. he just is passionate about the topic.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
and wrong.
*runs away*
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I think the costume should stay the way it is.    Right now it may not be as rare, but a while down the road, it  will be nice to show your pride for the game by saying "Hey, i supported it in beta".  yea it may have been a reward for just logging in, but just having people log in during beta tests does help, specially during stress tests.  
 
Overall, I think the item should stay exclusive.  I personally never heard about the Rest In Peacemaker voting and i never got one, even though i would LOVE to have gotten it.  I probably would have made a warrior because of it.  But unforunately, i didn't hear about it till it was already over and I never got one.  Its unforunate, but that is how it works.  Some stuff is exclusive, some isn't.  When they take these exclusive items and make them obtainable elsewhere, it make the item feel pointless for the ones who got it first.  If they made the highwayman costume availible, i'd probably never use it again, but thats just me.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Just don't expect that having an opinion makes it immune to challenge by better, more practical, and more fair ideas.
----
			
I did not play in beta, and bitterly wish I had because I -really- want the highwayman set...
However, I did not. I forgot WS was even a thing til the week before launch when a friend begged me to come play.
Yet I still don't want that set to be an "everyone" thing. It's a reward, like the malgrave sandwrap. It's a "Thank you for being here when we needed you to be" thing, even if you didn't give any feedback.
 
I love collecting things. Especially rare things. I like to be able to know I have something really rare. It's a point of pride, usually, when it comes to a really rare plushie or decor piece, a mount or a pet, or even a dye or gear model. Things like the Sandwrap and Highwayman set, which are unobtainable past a certain point, are typically called "loyalty rewards" because you were there. Especially for that time that it seemed like the sky was falling and people were leaving left and right and complaining everywhere, you stayed. For whatever reasons, you still played. Does it matter that the sandwrap is ugly? Not really. Does it suck that some people didn't know WS was a thing at the time? Yeah, but that doesn't change my mind.
 
Over the years in Gaming, I've missed out on many things that I really wish I could have had but I understood that I missed out on the chance. You can't have everything, and as much as it sucks to hear, Life isn't fair. Is that fair to the paying customer? Yes! To the paying customers who were -there- for the reward. To the ones who weren't? They didn't even know the game was a thing yet, or they did and didn't want to play yet because of friends or bad press or any number of reasons, but they weren't even a customer at the time. There will probably be more rewards in the future, so they can get more chances at things that they can feel proud of or show off or something.
 
You might as well say that having the gamescom dye and tophat is unfair to the customer, if that's your pushing point. I entered for those, too. I didn't get it, but a guildie did, and went on to use the tophat to complete a completely gorgeous costume that beat my own! Or that the people who have leftover beta boomboxes is unfair, or the people with the coconut monkey thingy, etc.	
----
			What about the DS mount?  That's an exclusive item, I love the way it looks, I WANT IT!!!!!  But why should I get it just because I WANT IT?	
----
			In the end I'm sure nothing will change. They might reskin the set some day (recolouring doesn't mean much with dyes). But other than that, I haven't played an MMO that broke the exclusivity rule (except in cases of recurring events, like maybe a Winterfest rowsdower that reappears each year). So imo, state your peace, expect nothing, and if there's no traction for good debate... let it go!That's my greatest challenge. If I get it in mind that what I think is objectively correct, I can get very stubborn and have to force myself to just let it go, or even 'give it to them'. Picking battles is hard but probably a skill our societies will need more and more as we continue elaborating and expanding social media, as well as undermining the concept of universal Truth.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
What about the DS mount?  That's an exclusive item, I love the way it looks, I WANT IT!!!!!  But why should I get it just because I WANT IT?
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Greetings,
 
We already stated in the past that these bonus items present in-game may be available in the future through other means. As it currently stands we do not have specific plans on when to make the Highwayman Costume available to players again. But it doesn't mean that it will never happen!	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Greetings,
 
We already stated in the past that these bonus items present in-game may be available in the future through other means. As it currently stands we do not have specific plans on when to make the Highwayman Costume available to players again. But it doesn't mean that it will never happen!
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
So another promise gone?
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
So another promise gone?
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https://forums.wildstar-online.com/forums/index.php?/topic/108842-costume-question-the-highwayman-set/
https://forums.wildstar-online.com/forums/index.php?/topic/66505-not-having-highwayman-costume/page-2
 
Original Topic where this was promised: https://forums.wildstar-online.com/forums/index.php?/topic/26809-welcome-to-pre-order-beta-details-inside/
Yes I saved the damned link!	
----
			
We always stated that no item will be available for a single time only. That's something Scooter and myself stated back then during beta as well. And I reiterated that during gamescom too.
 
{| class="blockquote"
Hello everyone,
 
We will be handing some of these codes online through various Community activities (more information on that will be announced soon). Players from both regions, NA and EU will have -a chance- to get their hands on these codes without having to travel all the way to Cologne for gamescom.
 
We understand that some players will be frustrated if they do not manage to get a code either through a giveaway or even during gamescom (these will be limited even there), but keep in mind that these items might be given away in the future through others activities as well, that has always been our policy.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
One Thing intrigue me
This is what is on open beta page
 
 
LOG IN TO BETA ONCE!
 
This badass Highwayman Costume is awarded at launch just for logging in during the Beta period. Once Beta is over, this costume will never be available again!
 
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
We always stated that no item will be available for a single time only. That's something Scooter and myself stated back then during beta as well. And I reiterated that during gamescom too.
 
----
			
 
 
At least I accomplished something meaningful at work this week.	
----
			^yeah..........................so about that....	
----
			
That's a mistake from us then, and I would like to apologise for that. These type of emails aren't managed directly by the Community Team and either there was miscommunication at some point or the policy changed between the time the email was made/sent and our Community Messaging on forums.
 
{| class="blockquote"
edit: Just read your expanded post, Youmukon. It does make sense, context and all that, but then players/customers need some grounding as well. Hopefully something like the compromise I suggested could work in this situation to make everyone happy.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
That's a mistake from us then, and I would like to apologise for that. These type of emails aren't managed directly by the Community Team and either there was miscommunication at some point or the policy changed between the time the email was made/sent and our Community Messaging on forums.
 
 
You can be certain that we will take that in consideration. I personally understand that players who obtained the costume during beta would like to retain that sense of exclusivity, being an avid collector myself. Exactly like getting the first print of a limited CD/12" LP right. It doesn't mean that this CD cannot be reprinted in the future.
 
We just need to find a way to "reprint" things while ensuring that the first print still retain value. At the end of the day, the music on the first print of a CD or a reprint will be the same, there'll just be a slight difference like the serial number or something on the cover to differentiate the original from the reprint :)
----
			
A reprint would be totally fine.
But the original needs to stay exclusive as promised.	
----
			I think going back on that promise in that email would be bad form. By all means, make a similar set, give new boots with spurs (and, FWIW, make them not so bulky!) but if you just give away the Highwayman set for anything else, that's just wrong (imo).	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
 
 
At least I accomplished something meaningful at work this week.
----
			put it in the eg vendor like the raiding costume (make sure they earn it by spending a "good" amount of time in-game).	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Ahem. Try to do some reading:
----
			
I'm fine as long as non-deluxe people don't get my sweet rocket house or other deluxe knick-knacks without paying extry for deluxe.
Seriously, I've hurt people for a 10 spot, please don't make us find out what I'd do over 80 bones, Carbine.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
*sigh* makes me sad when this is your retort. You couldn't just leave it as "immune to challenge by other ideas" but instead you implicitly state that your ideas are better and more fair. Whatever. I tried to step out of this pages ago, but I just had to comment on this, because it made me want to reach through my screen and smack you.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Yes, but you can get Super Bowl rings by earning them.  You can't even earn the highwayman's set.  That's like saying, "Doesn't matter if you are the best football player ever at this point, only the first super bowl will have rings.  You should have been in the first one."
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I'm fine as long as non-deluxe people don't get my sweet rocket house or other deluxe knick-knacks without paying extry for deluxe.
Seriously, I've hurt people for a 10 spot, please don't make us find out what I'd do over 80 bones, Carbine.
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Rocket house wasn't part of the deluxe package... I don't want anyone hurt for no reason ;)
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