120916-welp-thought-id-like-it-page-3

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I really wonder if you read what I say sometimes.  Well, here we go, I will try to make sense of all of this and give you an answer that will hopefully explain this all to you.
 
You're arguing a circuitous argument, so I feel I can safely assume you're confused about what the actual conversation is about.  I'll break it down into bulletpoints for you.
 
-This post by the OP (so you have the original quotes he was responding to, because there's nothing worse than trying to argue a point out of its original context), which you must have missed, indeed says that the problem is that the introductory dungeons are too difficult (in response to a quote saying they were not) and has touched off the conversation you entered.  Hence why we are speaking about detuned, level 20, 5-man dungeons, he directly says that a normal 20 man dungeon should not be as difficult as a level 20 STL or KV currently is.  He also stated, directly, that the game should cater more towards solo players than hardcore 40-player guilds, meaning a raid team (in response to the assertion that there is plenty of things to do for the casual player, and that the casual player is not necessarily less skilled, therefore requiring easier content).
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TL;DR
 
If you think collecting dyes is such a swell form of endgame progression, YOU go collect dyes for your endgame. But if you're raiding and collecting the best gear in the game while you do it, you've got a hell of a lot of nerve telling ME to be fine with collecting dyes. 
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I like dyes.  I wish I had more of them tbh.
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Go collect dyes, you should be fine with it.
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Quote #1 was in direct response to quote #2 was it not?  Please indicate for me in quote #2 where I said the words, "It couldn't possibly be a comparable investement of time and effort". You've made it clear that you're capable of dissecting a sentence with exacting detail.  How exactly am I supposed to interpret you changing my words to means something I did not say?
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If you think collecting dyes is such a swell form of endgame progression, YOU go collect dyes for your endgame. But if you're raiding and collecting the best gear in the game while you do it, you've got a hell of a lot of nerve telling ME to be fine with collecting dyes. 
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And thanks to both of you for your respectful and constructive contributions to the thread.
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My intent had been to use the quotes to note the beginning and end of a paraphrasing of the concept, not to indicate your exact wording. I certainly understand why you feel you've been misquoted, however, and I apologize for the ambiguity. I have edited the post to remove the offending quote marks and replace them with the tags [paraphrase][/paraphrase] for clarity.
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This game is made for a VERY select few, mainly close-nit guilds that want to challenge theirselves. This game is extremely too hard and frustrating, questing was fun for a while, but a level 20 dungeon should not be so frustrating(if you for some miracle find a group for low level content) I have nothing but a headache from playing this game. Also this game should lean towards casual players more, you need a lot casuals for a massive player base, all your doing is catering to these hardcore guilds, that complain about everything and leave, come back later when you obey them and leave again. Anyways /endsubscription. Make an enjoyable game, I wanted to play a game not die form high blood pressure doing it
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I have suggested many times for carbine to make content easier, especially for the pre veteran leveling dungeons but... I'm quite sure carbine would rather lose all their jobs and be homeless over giving average or casual players a chance at this game.
 
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Even more strangely, you're offended by the idea that he should think these guilds have too much influence
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Alright, so I did not think this thread would explode, while I still think the lowbie dungeons are too frustrating no matter what arguement gets thrown at me, its a level 20 dungeon give me a break. I have decided to keep playing at least until the end of my current sub. in hope I enjoy the rest of the game, which I am.. just avoiding dungeons for now. I've found a small guild who's helping me with intel and giving me motivation to keep going, haha.
 
On a side note to re-evaluate my statement for the 2nd time because I don't think I explained well enough, when I said "catering to hardcore guilds", it seems like dungeons are built around that atmosphere to be able to complete it. Where you have voice communications, people know eachother and their playstyles, they've played together a while in their guilds. They can get through these horrific dungeons a lot easier for that being - but when your a normal single player(which there are very many, or were many.) joining an MMO using the group finder feature, you in for one hell of a ride. I hope you understand now. This first 20 levels or so being a first impression and a hellashish dungeon is not very appealing to many many people, but of course some people will like it. Some people also like a dead game.	
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Alright, so I did not think this thread would explode, while I still think the lowbie dungeons are too frustrating no matter what arguement gets thrown at me, its a level 20 dungeon give me a break. I have decided to keep playing at least until the end of my current sub. in hope I enjoy the rest of the game, which I am.. just avoiding dungeons for now. I've found a small guild who's helping me with intel and giving me motivation to keep going, haha.
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Alright, so I did not think this thread would explode, while I still think the lowbie dungeons are too frustrating no matter what arguement gets thrown at me, its a level 20 dungeon give me a break. I have decided to keep playing at least until the end of my current sub. in hope I enjoy the rest of the game, which I am.. just avoiding dungeons for now. I've found a small guild who's helping me with intel and giving me motivation to keep going, haha.
 
On a side note to re-evaluate my statement for the 2nd time because I don't think I explained well enough, when I said "catering to hardcore guilds", it seems like dungeons are built around that atmosphere to be able to complete it. Where you have voice communications, people know eachother and their playstyles, they've played together a while in their guilds. They can get through these horrific dungeons a lot easier for that being - but when your a normal single player(which there are very many, or were many.) joining an MMO using the group finder feature, you in for one hell of a ride. I hope you understand now. This first 20 levels or so being a first impression and a hellashish dungeon is not very appealing to many many people, but of course some people will like it. Some people also like a dead game.
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Whats so brutal about them? 
 
DPS gets 2 AIs each, tanks 2 and the healers at least one. Before you pull you say: DPS 1 and 2 you get the first cast, there will be a bar under his health, when you see it use your AI skill(s). Hell if you done the dungeon before you can even tell people the actual skill he will cast. If he isnt dead the rest of the group will manage the next cast.
 
If you are blind or just stupid you can also get the interruptor addon so you get a huge ass indicator right where you want it.
 
Why is that so hard? Honestly I don't get it. 
 
All there is to this game is, dungeon wise:
 
1) Don't get cleaved
2) Get out of telegraphs
3) Watch for a cast and interrupt it
 
If you can't handle that, sorry but then you should not be raiding in any MMO on the market today.	
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Whats so brutal about them? 
 
DPS gets 2 AIs each, tanks 2 and the healers at least one. Before you pull you say: DPS 1 and 2 you get the first cast, there will be a bar under his health, when you see it use your AI skill(s). Hell if you done the dungeon before you can even tell people the actual skill he will cast. If he isnt dead the rest of the group will manage the next cast.
 
If you are blind or just stupid you can also get the interruptor addon so you get a huge ass indicator right where you want it.
 
Why is that so hard? Honestly I don't get it. 
 
All there is to this game is:
 
1) Don't get cleaved
2) Get out of telegraphs
3) Watch for a cast and interrupt it
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Whats so brutal about them? 
 
DPS gets 2 AIs each, tanks 2 and the healers at least one. Before you pull you say: DPS 1 and 2 you get the first cast, there will be a bar under his health, when you see it use your AI skill(s). Hell if you done the dungeon before you can even tell people the actual skill he will cast. If he isnt dead the rest of the group will manage the next cast.
 
If you are blind or just stupid you can also get the interruptor addon so you get a huge ass indicator right where you want it.
 
Why is that so hard? Honestly I don't get it. 
 
All there is to this game is, dungeon wise:
 
1) Don't get cleaved
2) Get out of telegraphs
3) Watch for a cast and interrupt it
 
If you can't handle that, sorry but then you should not be raiding in any MMO on the market today.
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Now if someone explains all this to you, or better yet coordinates interrupts so you can avoid some of these mechanics, it's not to difficult to execute even for a fresh, new player. But if you are just figuring it out as you go with no direction, this might as well be a raid boss.
Now it's a great, FUN fight and I don't think it should be changed- but I completely understand why people who don't have that knowledge find it to be a horrible experience. I found that if I gave a quick summation of what to do before the fight, even completely new players had no problem with the execution.
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It's braindead easy- now lol. Did you ever do them early on in the game when nobody knew anything? You can dismiss literally anything with "well durr don't get hit and do mechanics", but look at it through the eyes of someone possibly never having had played an MMO before, and a few days into the game. With 4 other people in the same spot.
 
Difficulty is 100% relative to experience and personal skill.
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If you can't handle that, sorry but then you should not be raiding in any MMO on the market today.
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I wiped once in STL while doing my attunement a week after headstart, on the last boss. Maybe I'm just this super geek that knows how to play games. I dont know. Now SSM was another story. I must have tried that dungeon 5-6 times before I got my silver (gold is easy now because I kept practicing it). I liked the game so I kept playing it and improved so I could eventually move on to the next difficulty level, like any MMO should do.
 
You start at very easy, move on to medium, then hard and then you eventually get to the real endgame.
 
And I dont understand people problems with wildstar content being too hard.
 
The problem today is that people dont want to improve. They want to get to level 50 and then raid raid raid to get shineys (or do dailies to get the same gear, wtf?). They have no intention of improving and learning the ins and out of a game.
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But why must people one shot bosses?
 
What happen to learning the encounter by wiping and re thinking the strategy? Why must everything you do alone or in a small group in MMOs be easy.
 
Why is wiping = horrible experience? This is my main question.
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I wiped once in STL while doing my attunement a week after headstart, on the last boss. Maybe I'm just this super geek that knows how to play games. I dont know. Now SSM was another story. I must have tried that dungeon 5-6 times before I got my silver (gold is easy now because I kept practicing it). I liked the game so I kept playing it and improved so I could eventually move on to the next difficulty level, like any MMO should do.
 
You start at very easy, move on to medium, then hard and then you eventually get to the real endgame.
 
And I dont understand people problems with wildstar content being too hard.
 
The problem today is that people dont want to improve. They want to get to level 50 and then raid raid raid to get shineys (or do dailies to get the same gear, wtf?). They have no intention of improving and learning the ins and out of a game.
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			On a side note, I do feel like Bladewind the Invoker is the biggest shock to the system in the game. He really isn't that hard, but boy I did not expect anything like a three phase fight with room wide AoE when I entered my first dungeon. Once I got used to the idea that the bosses were going to have multiple mechanics and be interesting, I felt like a kid in a candy store as we encountered each new boss. But that first encounter was a doozie :)	
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Alright, so I did not think this thread would explode, while I still think the lowbie dungeons are too frustrating no matter what arguement gets thrown at me, its a level 20 dungeon give me a break. I have decided to keep playing at least until the end of my current sub. in hope I enjoy the rest of the game, which I am.. just avoiding dungeons for now. I've found a small guild who's helping me with intel and giving me motivation to keep going, haha.
 
On a side note to re-evaluate my statement for the 2nd time because I don't think I explained well enough, when I said "catering to hardcore guilds", it seems like dungeons are built around that atmosphere to be able to complete it. Where you have voice communications, people know eachother and their playstyles, they've played together a while in their guilds. They can get through these horrific dungeons a lot easier for that being - but when your a normal single player(which there are very many, or were many.) joining an MMO using the group finder feature, you in for one hell of a ride. I hope you understand now. This first 20 levels or so being a first impression and a hellashish dungeon is not very appealing to many many people, but of course some people will like it. Some people also like a dead game.
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