138555-elitists-kicking-new-players-from-party-uninstalled-page-3

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Oh, my mistake, you do have a lot more time than 5 seconds between when he says to get interrupts ready and when the fight starts.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ReNQAvbN86E
 
You have 7 seconds.	
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Oh, my mistake, you do have a lot more time than 5 seconds between when he says to get interrupts ready and when the fight starts.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ReNQAvbN86E
 
You have 7 seconds.
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so I dropped it for something I figured was more useful since hey, I can just move out of the way of nasty attacks right?
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Maybe it's just because I play as a tank a lot but I never go anywhere without an interrupt readily available.  
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The game taught me, and apparently the rest of my group, to play a certain way. That way was that big attacks will be telegraphed and need to be dodged, it was a huge selling point of the game even. Why don't any of the fodder in the world have disarms or interrupt required abilities? There are some elite types/important characters you fight during quests that would be perfect to introduce these mechanics even. Even in a dungeon you do usually fight fodder, or as it is more commonly known, trash. They could have thrown some trash that needed to be interrupted or they do serious damage (not wipe damage, say, enough to bring you to 20% or whatever) and that would be enough to get us to slap an interrupt on our bars, still be challenging, yet doable without an interrupt, then there's the boss fight with the killer moves. These are much more natural transitions.
 
Important abilities fell off our bars because the game made it look like we didn't need them, then when it decided to teach us that we would need this ability and it is important, that monsters can have layers or interrupt armor and that interrupting lets you do bonus damage it does it at a very inappropriate moment, the first dungeon, the training dungeon, the first boss, the penalty for failure is instant unavoidable death. It is not a great learning experience, it is a failure on the game's part that could be made better.
 
Quoting is all broken for me for some reason.
 
>Strayhand
 
I'm playing a Spellslinger at the moment, I replaced my stun with a root which felt more useful to keep enemies away so I could keep shooting them, it also felt useful that I was able to keep myself in a good position to keep attacking while the enemy was winding up one of their big attacks that was going to miss me anyway, why stun them when I can get in free attacks no worries anyways was the rationale. The game didn't mention the bonus damage you get from an interrupt until that bossfight, if I'd known earlier it would have given me good reason to keep it on my bar and I probably would have had it for the dungeon. Which is my point, yeah the game taught me this stuff, but the lessons don't seem to be in a good order or in the right places.
			
				
	Edited October 8, 2015 by Karrakazul	
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The game taught me, and apparently the rest of my group, to play a certain way. That way was that big attacks will be telegraphed and need to be dodged, it was a huge selling point of the game even. Why don't any of the fodder in the world have disarms or interrupt required abilities? There are some elite types/important characters you fight during quests that would be perfect to introduce these mechanics even. Even in a dungeon you do usually fight fodder, or as it is more commonly known, trash. They could have thrown some trash that needed to be interrupted or they do serious damage (not wipe damage, say, enough to bring you to 20% or whatever) and that would be enough to get us to slap an interrupt on our bars, still be challenging, yet doable without an interrupt, then there's the boss fight with the killer moves. These are much more natural transitions.
 
Important abilities fell off our bars because the game made it look like we didn't need them, then when it decided to teach us that we would need this ability and it is important, that monsters can have layers or interrupt armor and that interrupting lets you do bonus damage it does it at a very inappropriate moment, the first dungeon, the training dungeon, the first boss, the penalty for failure is instant unavoidable death. It is not a great learning experience, it is a failure on the game's part that could be made better.
 
Quoting is all broken for me for some reason.
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The veteran community is really split down middle. You have half that are ready to help and support the newcomers but then you have the other half that simply don't want to tolerate your existence. The whole anti-F2Per crowd is the big issue though.
 
10 good experiences can be made irrelevant by a terrible one. The problem is when the amount of good experiences and bad are almost equal in number, there is little reason in bothering with it.	
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You have half that are ready to help and support the newcomers but then you have the other half that simply don't want to tolerate your existence.
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Welcome to planet Earth... This is not Wildstar's invention...
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Oh, my mistake, you do have a lot more time than 5 seconds between when he says to get interrupts ready and when the fight starts.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ReNQAvbN86E
 
You have 7 seconds.
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So because everyone else does it, it is ok here? Terrible logic.
 
This is a bigger problem for Wildstar than other games, the community isn't exactly big. So running into jerks is far more common than many other games. We should never view this as acceptable behavior because it has somehow become the norm.
 
If you want your game to live, start being more accepting and courteous. 
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Seems that ppl forgot why this game went f2p, and the community is  clearly over estimated in its "kindness".
Elitist, veteran players making new alts, and are kicking new players from dungeon, if they dont dare or arent capable of clearing the dungeon at the pace these elitists want to. Ofc smurf account, already decked in gear with vast knowledge of the game will trump over any new player, at any day, but this....this is for you TO JUDGE, and to remember maybe why this game went f2p ( sorry for it but its truth).
This wasnt an isolated case either, i guess i should have learn to keep my mouth SHUT .
 
 
 
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I never said it was ok. But I'm fed up with people saying the community is toxic, because they run into some bad people. It's not the community, it's those people! And I don't think those people read this topic, so it's of no use to tell me that I should be more accepting, because I'm from the accepting people.
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Maybe the community is not as toxic as it is sometimes made out to be. But know this. Wildstar, it's staunchest of supporters, and Carbine, have been trying shed this toxic/elitist stigma since the ORIGINAL launch. So far, it seems that their efforts haven't been particularly successful as I'm seeing a lot of the same kinds of threads (and responses) that were popping up from when the game was on life support NOT all that long ago.
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Yes, the game made it seem like interrupting was unimportant and I made my call based on that information. 
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Yes, the game made it seem like interrupting was unimportant and I made my call based on that information. My entire ride to lvl10 there was nothing, nothing that wasn't telegraphed and dodgable, nothing that was so threatening that made me think that if I fight another one of those an interrupt might be a good thing to use. I've played a couple of MMOs and they've each handled it slightly differently, in WoW interrupting can be very important, not required or the boss might be outright immune, but you don't need to worry about which because you've always got your interrupt. Last I played GW2 bosses were pretty much outright immune to all forms of CC, stuns, interrupts and so on, interrupts took a massive backseat to dodging and positioning since you could very well have a weapon (abilities are tied to your weapon) that didn't have anything like an interrupt on it and enemies don't even have cast bars, but the game would tell you if an enemy had something that really really needed to be dodged as it would have something like "big attack" written on the enemy character portrait, so you weren't in the dark at any point about what you were up against. Champions Online let you choose any ability you wanted, class roles were non existent, combat was pretty much a mess, I can't comment too much on the necessity for interrupts as I got three characters to max level with absolutely no form of CC at all no problem. Every game handled it differently and I was playing to the current style that Wildstar was teaching me, which seemed like it was going in GW2's direction, dodging>interrupts, but if you need one we'll let you know.
 
We made a call with the information we had, it was the fault of the game for giving us information that led to a bad call then punishing us for this bad call with unavoidable death. I am not adverse to challenge and I am not adverse to learning, but I see a way that the learning experience early game can be improved.
 
>Enitzu
 
What I had at the time was:
Quick Draw
Charged Shot
Ignite
Flame Burst
Wild Barrage
Vitality Burst
Healing Salve
Flash Freeze
 
I know that Vitality Burst and Healing Salve were stupid to have now, but at the time I was trying out and comparing the different heals while questing and when the queue popped figured, eh, a little extra healing help in a dungeon might do in a pinch.
			
				
	Edited October 8, 2015 by Karrakazul	
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I've been keeping an eye on the general discussions forum pretty much since the F2P launch and this is maybe the second or third 'community is bad bluh bluh' thread I've seen.  It's definitely the longest-lived for sure.
 
I'm getting the feeling that a lot of people WANT to paint the community as toxic when it's really only a minority of the players rather than it being an actual issue.  I speak only of the recent transition to F2P though and primarily regarding these forums as I don't particularly trawl the chat channels in-game as I'm too busy...you know...actually playing the game.
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Yes, the game made it seem like interrupting was unimportant and I made my call based on that information. 
 
the rest is blah blah blah i didnt know blah blah blah 
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yes, was kick
rest is server errors...
No need to bump this no more, the game files are gone from my system
For whats worth it, while playing alone i did had fun, leveling up to 25 , i loved the combat moves and how one ability can buff another.
Also i liked a lot the path system that allowed me to buff myself and others that was awesome, for a change hehe, i even managed to buy me a mount  :)
Well, have fun everyone, and thank you for your company.
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			That kind of treatment has been since the start of OBT I remember when I got kicked from Stormtalon at lv19 because I was a tacking a physical mob instead of caster.	
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IF the game gives you a stun at what ... lvl 3 ... do you not think that it is important? 
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OBT 
 
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Maybe the community is not as toxic as it is sometimes made out to be. But know this. Wildstar, it's staunchest of supporters, and Carbine, have been trying shed this toxic/elitist stigma since the ORIGINAL launch. So far, it seems that their efforts haven't been particularly successful as I'm seeing a lot of the same kinds of threads (and responses) that were popping up from when the game was on life support NOT all that long ago.
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That kind of treatment has been since the start of OBT I remember when I got kicked from Stormtalon at lv19 because I was a tacking a physical mob instead of caster.
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			Yeah and I was a newbie then but those must been CBT testers that knew how the du geon worked back then.	
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Karrakazul, on 07 Oct 2015 - 11:46 PM, said:
I think the Protostar Academy and the first few levels need a bit of redoing to make the introduction of Wildstar mechanics a little smoother, especially the first boss. You need to interrupt this guy or else he wipes the group, when does the game tell you this? 
 
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A lack of preparation on your part isn't necessarily a failure on the game's part.
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Yeah and I was a newbie then but those must been CBT testers that knew how the du geon worked back then.
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>Genoshock
 
If the game gives me an ability that it makes it look as if I don't seem to need to use it and I have the opportunity to switch it out for something that I will use then I'm going to switch it out and so did quite a few others by the look of it.
 
>Mumboejumboh
 
I'm only lvl16 and I have 19 abilities total at the moment, I had plenty of other abilities to fill my bar out with at 10. I've been looking at a wiki and I have abilities that according to it I'm not supposed to have yet, if I had to guess, I'd say you get abilities a lot more often now?
 
>Entzu
 
Pretty much my point, interrupts were made to look useless by the outside world. Their virtue only made apparent in a life or death situation, I know it now, I have an interrupt on my bar now, but the way in which the game taught me it could have been better, that's all.
 
>Gaber
 
The Protostar agent tells you the boss requires interrupts after you're all in the circle to start the encounter and the boss appearing puts you in combat, you don't have to attack him, this is about 7 seconds worth of reaction time.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKZOj8MJxgs
			
				
	Edited October 8, 2015 by Karrakazul	
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... You do realize that he's talking about the tutorial dungeon, right? How prepared should he have to be?
Should he go study a guide? Look up a youtube video? To do a tutorial?
 
#hardcore.  :rolleyes:
 
All he's doing here is pointing out the experience of his group, a few ways in which what could have been a good training experience was instead a source of irritation. Feedback does not need to always rate the game at 100% SUPER AWESOME A++++++++ to be valid or helpful--in fact, out in the real world, the most helpful feedback is exactly the kind he provided, that respectfully goes through what could be improved about the experience in some detail.
 
Telling him that the instance is perfect and he's doing it all wrong misses the entire point of the dungeon. It's a training instance, he's not supposed to know how to do it right yet. 
 
Karrakazul, would it have solved this problem to just have a pop-up window upon entering the dungeon that says something like "Dangerous foes like these use a lot of attacks that can be interrupted! Be sure to have an interrupt in your LAS before we start!"? It seems to me like that would've addressed this particular problem very straightforwardly.
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>Genoshock
 
If the game gives me an ability that it makes it look as if I don't seem to need to use it and I have the opportunity to switch it out for something that I will use then I'm going to switch it out and so did quite a few others by the look of it.
 
>Entzu
 
Pretty much my point, interrupts were made to look useless by the outside world. Their virtue only made apparent in a life or death situation, I know it now, I have an interrupt on my bar now, but the way in which the game taught me it could have been better, that's all.
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>Genoshock
 
If the game gives me an ability that it makes it look as if I don't seem to need to use it and I have the opportunity to switch it out for something that I will use then I'm going to switch it out and so did quite a few others by the look of it.
 
>Mumboejumboh
 
I'm only lvl16 and I have 19 abilities total at the moment, I had plenty of other abilities to fill my bar out with at 10. I've been looking at a wiki and I have abilities that according to it I'm not supposed to have yet, if I had to guess, I'd say you get abilities a lot more often now?
 
>Entzu
 
Pretty much my point, interrupts were made to look useless by the outside world. Their virtue only made apparent in a life or death situation, I know it now, I have an interrupt on my bar now, but the way in which the game taught me it could have been better, that's all.
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What is going on in this thread? I haven't been following. Seems OP had a run in with a few bad apples and left the game. Not much to go on there.
 
Overall, this dominate has been great, in my exepreonce, and only has a few toxoic people. I've certainly met more helpful prolle than toxic ones. Don't let a few bad apples spoil the game or define the community.	
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>Mumboejumboh
 
I'm only lvl16 and I have 19 abilities total at the moment, I had plenty of other abilities to fill my bar out with at 10. I've been looking at a wiki and I have abilities that according to it I'm not supposed to have yet, if I had to guess, I'd say you get abilities a lot more often now?
 
>Entzu
 
Pretty much my point, interrupts were made to look useless by the outside world. Their virtue only made apparent in a life or death situation, I know it now, I have an interrupt on my bar now, but the way in which the game taught me it could have been better, that's all.
 
>Gaber
 
The Protostar agent tells you the boss requires interrupts after you're all in the circle to start the encounter and the boss appearing puts you in combat, you don't have to attack him, this is about 7 seconds worth of reaction time.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKZOj8MJxgs
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>Mumboejumboh
 
I had a boatload of skills at lvl10, I wasn't going to keep an ability on my bar that I wasn't using and that the game hadn't explained the usefulness of "just in case" and I ended up putting some crummy heals on my bar instead because even those looked more useful to try out, I had Flash Freeze too which seemed like all the utility I needed. I'd been fighting equal level mobs for a while, why weren't they an indicator of the kinds of mechanics I might face in the dungeon? Why wasn't there maybe some trash to ease me into the situation? Why were we put into combat with a boss that could one-shot us simply for not having the right ability on our bar at lvl10? That is poor design and overly punishing for a tutorial dungeon in my opinion. The dungeon did nothing to warn us of what was to come until it was literally too late, the outside world did nothing to help either. Nobody in my team had an interrupt! Not just me, four other people I hadn't even met before. Does this not sound like maybe, just maybe something could be improved in the learning here before throwing us into this scenario where we can do nothing but die?
 
>Enitzu
 
The boss does engage as soon as he spawns, he throws up his shield and starts his instant kill attack, you can see in the youtube video there that nobody was even close to him and they all got put into combat.
 
>yasfan
 
That sounds a bit too spoonfeedy to be honest and a bit jarring, if the Protostar guy started his speech a bit sooner (maybe when you're in that waiting room at the very start), if there was an enemy during a questline that you had to interrupt so it would highlight that not everything can be dodged and that interrupting gives you bonus damage or if there was some less dangerous trash with a similar ability before the boss I think that would both be sufficient and more natural than a pop-up.	
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>Mumboejumboh
 
I had a boatload of skills at lvl10, I wasn't going to keep an ability on my bar that I wasn't using and that the game hadn't explained the usefulness of "just in case" and I ended up putting some crummy heals on my bar instead because even those looked more useful to try out, I had Flash Freeze too which seemed like all the utility I needed. I'd been fighting equal level mobs for a while, why weren't they an indicator of the kinds of mechanics I might face in the dungeon? Why wasn't there maybe some trash to ease me into the situation? Why were we put into combat with a boss that could one-shot us simply for not having the right ability on our bar at lvl10? That is poor design and overly punishing for a tutorial dungeon in my opinion. The dungeon did nothing to warn us of what was to come until it was literally too late, the outside world did nothing to help either. Nobody in my team had an interrupt! Not just me, four other people I hadn't even met before. Does this not sound like maybe, just maybe something could be improved in the learning here before throwing us into this scenario where we can do nothing but die?
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Yeah, I was totally telling him that the instance is flawless and he's a stupid dumbface.
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>yasfan
 
That sounds a bit too spoonfeedy to be honest and a bit jarring, if the Protostar guy started his speech a bit sooner (maybe when you're in that waiting room at the very start), if there was an enemy during a questline that you had to interrupt so it would highlight that not everything can be dodged and that interrupting gives you bonus damage or if there was some less dangerous trash with a similar ability before the boss I think that would both be sufficient and more natural than a pop-up.
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"Understand both sides"? I understand your position just fine. I just don't agree with it. And if you don't want to respond, you certainly don't have to.
 
As for my motivations, there are behaviors that I have seen happen a lot in this game and on these forums that gave this game and its community a terrible reputation back at the launch of P2P, followed by a massive exodus of players and the game's financial model utterly collapsing because the community had been purified down to something very cohesive but too small to be viable.
 
I see a lot of those same behaviors reappearing at the launch of F2P, and I'm not just sitting back and watching it happen this time. To the extent that I see you participating in those behaviors, you can pretty much count on me to show up and do what I can to make sure it's clear to the people posting and reading that not everyone in the community shares those perspectives.
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How absurdly melodramatic.   <_<
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I do not think so. I do not even dare to log onto my ex-main because I know that me screwing up will cause a metric tonne of drama. And after one year of absence, I WILL screw up. My muscle memory simply isn't tuned for Spellslingers anymore. So level 50 content is already out the window. I can level an alt, but according to this thread being new at level 20 also means I will need to prepare more for leveling dungeons than I used to do for progress raids in WoW.
When I left the game, I didn't have content left to do. Adventures were too easy and I've done them way too often t enjoy them There was ONE level 50 dungeon that I couldn't even make it past the first trash pack. And I've quested enough on the way to 50 to want a break from dailies.
Now with F2P I wanted to check back to see the improvements made to the game. But if I'm completely honest I haven't found the courage to actually log onto my old mains. I haven't even had the courage to queue up for STL on a level 20ish alt. So I quested for a bit, and lost interest again. And when threads like this one pop up and I see that the community would rather I didn't play either... It doesn't help :P
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While yes, Protoacademy does tell you (in voice-over, if I remember right...so people with sound off or ignoring NPC text in the chatbox might not see/hear it) that interrupts are important and to use them, there's something I've noticed.
 
Many new players think things like CC breaks and Interrupts aren't important because they're bombarded with tons of skills really early on now and, let's be frank, with the way they've made the new low level right-off-the-ship experience they don't need those yet, and they won't look up guides because it's early game. Before this, we slowly obtained our skills as we went. Interrupts are/were there right off the bat, but now you quickly get other abilities that do damage, etc. and with all of the non-hostile yellow named mobs, and the way they're making lvling easier, it seems most of these new players really don't expect to suddenly need to understand a mechanic that they've probably not really had to use at all yet.
 
Despite all the posts where incoming players ask for advice and we tell them "bring ints!" they just don't see a need for it until it hits them in the face with a table several times while laughing in the wonderful voice of the Holocrypt guy. Do they know what a MoO is? Do they know how Interrupt Armor works? What about CC Breaks? True, that dungeon is lvl 10, and it is a tutorial, but you have to try and see it from their perspective.
 
As for elitist players...yeah. Every MMO anywhere has them, and they're the reason I wish we had a /votekick off the internet button somewhere in the magical workings of computers. Unfortunately, all we as a community can do is try to out-weigh and out-voice them and be the positive influence in dungeons that we wish we had had back when we started in WildStar and no one knew how to do any of this.	
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I see that the community would rather I didn't play
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>Mumboejumboh
 
I've not played a great number of MMOs, the one I have played the most thus far is WoW. In WoW there is no option to not have an interrupt, you have access to all your abilities at all times, if I die to an ability that needs to be interrupted it isn't because it isn't available to me when I need it, but because I didn't push it. That would be my fault. Wildstar only lets me have 8 active abilities out of a decent pool, it made certain abilities seem more useful than others and I chose what felt appropriate with this knowledge. For the game to throw me and others into a situation where suddenly one of these abilities is totally necessary or you die, that is the game's fault, other people have even said that the game world does nothing to teach you the importance or function interrupts until this point, this is bad design.
 
I've posted two youtube videos now that show all the warning you do get from the dungeon is literally seconds. That is bad design, it can be improved.
 
I'm not saying the game is terrible or that it ruined everything for me, but it was annoying and cheap and it could easily have been avoided and taught to me and my group a lot better. It killed me and four other people for no good reason, how many others might it be catching? What if I'd skipped the dungeon and kept questing instead? How long then until I or someone else might learn about MoO and that not everything can be dodged? Why not improve the learning experience? There's nothing to lose and everything to gain with some pretty simple changes, I don't get where you're coming from at all.
 
>yasfan
 
Yes, this is actually a frequent occurrence in WoW dungeons and raids. For example there's a boss with some very dangerous adds, they have an AoE that both does a lot of damage and casts more frequently the longer they are alive, in the rooms leading up to this boss you fight some of them by themselves and you learn very quickly that the cast needs to be interrupted and that it needs to be killed quickly before it casts too fast to be interrupted and eventually kills everyone, you are now armed with the knowledge of what to do when they spawn during the boss fight and you didn't need to alt-tab or wipe to find out.
 
Anyways, I have to go sleep and work and all that jazz. I look forward to playing more and earning some more dosh to decorate my house, building stairs at 50s a step is expensive. Sorry about my formatting, don't know why quoting suddenly stopped working for me.
			
				
	Edited October 8, 2015 by Karrakazul	
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>Mumboejumboh
 
I've not played a great number of MMOs, the one I have played the most thus far is WoW. In WoW there is no option to not have an interrupt, you have access to all your abilities at all times, if I die to an ability that needs to be interrupted it isn't because it isn't available to me when I need it, but because I didn't push it. That would be my fault. Wildstar only lets me have 8 active abilities out of a decent pool, it made certain abilities seem more useful than others and I chose what felt appropriate with this knowledge. For the game to throw me and others into a situation where suddenly one of these abilities is totally necessary or you die, that is the game's fault, other people have even said that the game world does nothing to teach you the importance or function interrupts until this point, this is bad design.
 
I've posted two youtube videos now that show all the warning you do get from the dungeon is literally seconds. That is bad design, it can be improved.
 
I'm not saying the game is terrible or that it ruined everything for me, but it was annoying and cheap and it could easily have been avoided and taught to me and my group a lot better. It killed me and four other people for no good reason, how many others might it be catching? What if I'd skipped the dungeon and kept questing instead? How long then until I or someone else might learn about MoO and that not everything can be dodged? Why not improve the learning experience? There's nothing to lose and everything to gain with some pretty simple changes, I don't get where you're coming from at all.
 
Anyways, I have to go sleep and work and all that jazz. I look forward to playing more and earning some more dosh to decorate my house, building stairs at 50s a step is expensive.
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Just calling it like I see it here. 
 
Yeah, in the absence of definitive proof there's just a lot about this guy we don't know. :rolleyes:
 
"Understand both sides"? I understand your position just fine. I just don't agree with it. And if you don't want to respond, you certainly don't have to.
 
As for my motivations, there are behaviors that I have seen happen a lot in this game and on these forums that gave this game and its community a terrible reputation back at the launch of P2P, followed by a massive exodus of players and the game's financial model utterly collapsing because the community had been purified down to something very cohesive but too small to be viable.
 
I see a lot of those same behaviors reappearing at the launch of F2P, and I'm not just sitting back and watching it happen this time. To the extent that I see you participating in those behaviors, you can pretty much count on me to show up and do what I can to make sure it's clear to the people posting and reading that not everyone in the community shares those perspectives.
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I'm not saying the game is terrible or that it ruined everything for me, but it was annoying and cheap and it could easily have been avoided and taught to me and my group a lot better. It killed me and four other people for no good reason, how many others might it be catching?
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ok my 2 coppers for what they are worth
 
As a new player (dinged all of level 7) I solo'd that first shiphand (Planet Zero) this morning. It was BRUTAL (died 3 times in there). However I did learn a whole lot about playing a spellslinger while doing it. One of those things was using my interrupt on one of the major MOBs in there. That Moo was the difference between taking down the boss and eating dirt once again. Another was pulling carefully. It was super easy to get swarmed and flattened in there. Was it frustrating? Sure it was. After it was done however I can honestly say it was a whole lot of fun.
 
Now I am not god's gift to playing MMOs and being older my reaction times are not those of a 20 year old so I rather expect that the super high end stuff will be totally out of my league. That does not mean I can't learn along the way.
 
And there you have it a reason to use your interrupt long before this protostar thing.	
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When we are working at a difficult task and strive after a good thing, we are fighting a righteous battle, the direct reward of which is that we are kept from much evil. As we advance in life it becomes more and more difficult, but in fighting the difficulties the inmost strength of the heart is developed. Indeed life is a have to defend and protect ourselves, and with a cheerful and brace spirit we must battle; we plan and calculate in order to make progress.” 
I've been around since CB2 and i just had a group fail in protostar. Asked if anyone wanted an explanation of fights. Tank yelled YOLO and fought, we died i explained interrupts. We fixed it, died to a few more times due to people not using their interrupts. Had a great time, dealt with people learning, yelled YOLO a few times, accepted that i was on an adventure with four people i hadn't met before.
			
				
	Edited October 8, 2015 by >Daedwax<	
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So I quested for a bit, and lost interest again. And when threads like this one pop up and I see that the community would rather I didn't play either... It doesn't help :P
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I'm not saying the game is terrible or that it ruined everything for me, but it was annoying and cheap and it could easily have been avoided and taught to me and my group a lot better. It killed me and four other people for no good reason, how many others might it be catching? What if I'd skipped the dungeon and kept questing instead? How long then until I or someone else might learn about MoO and that not everything can be dodged? Why not improve the learning experience? There's nothing to lose and everything to gain with some pretty simple changes, I don't get where you're coming from at all.
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I was a tacking a physical mob instead of caster.
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			Yea I had this happen on my little lowbie toon I rolled on Dominion.  I just make note of who the players are and who kicked me (without warning) and then block them or ignore them in game.  This way I don't get partied up with them again.  I really do think if you can find a good guild join one and get with other players in your guild.  By the way your welcome to play with me and level up your toon with me.  I can do Dominion or Exiles.  I have lowbies on both and a level 50 on Exile side (entity).  But I can always roll a new character if your looking for someone to play with in game.  I have Bandit Jolene on Dominion (Entity) and I have been on her alot more lately than my other toons.	
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{| class="blockquote"
I've been around since CB2 and i just had a group fail in protostar. Asked if anyone wanted an explanation of fights. Tank yelled YOLO and fought, we died i explained interrupts. We fixed it, died to a few more times due to people not using their interrupts. Had a great time, dealt with people learning, yelled YOLO a few times, accepted that i was on an adventure with four people i hadn't met before.
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I hope you realize that this is raiding 101. when you start a raid as a new group with all the expectations of glory what is more likely to happen is that the 1st trash pack (the patrol) will wipe you and the other 19 people present
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Ok, I have better things to do than posting on this stupid forum, but I just can't beleive you people...
 
{| class="blockquote"
And when threads like this one pop up and I see that the community would rather I didn't play either...
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And when threads like this one pop up and I see that the community would rather I didn't play either... It doesn't help :P
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I haven't read the entire thread but my girlfriend had a similar experience and she has not played since. She was trying to be a healer because it's what she has done in just about all MMO's she has played. Some asshat warrior basically demeaned her because they kept wiping on her first dungeon and she was new. He was moving around so much she had trouble healing him. I personally told her to have a thicker skin and not everyone will be a jerk, but she had issues with it and doesn't want to heal now nor load up the game anymore. 
 
I just might try to roll a healer and I'll let asshat warriors join the purple club... 
 
If you don't know what the purple club is, google everquest purple club. 
 
Lets try and be nicer to us noobs, you were a noob too. We are both noob subscribers too, not just ftp noobs.	
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This thread reminds me of launch. The OP and the replies! But, the game turned out fine since then, right? 
 
I'm not saying OP is in the right, and quitting over that is kind of silly. I also think the community in general is pretty alright. But, y'all keep chasing anyone that may have potentially stuck around, and the game is going to be empty... again. Also, the whole "we dont want ppl like that anywayz!" statement is ignorant as hell. Almost has ignorant as people comparing "digital thick skin" to real life. This game has a reputation of having a negative community, no need to continue to concrete that assumption/generalization. 
 
Some people in this thread/game are pretty silly. "I shouldn't have to devote 100% of my time to helping new players!" : "shouldnt have to bend over backwards to help someone that cant use google" : "not going to hold someone's hand". Y'all act like hitting Enter and typing, "CC this boss on [this tell]" is hard. If that's too much for you, then instead of telling them to uninstall the game or vote kicking, just don't say anything. I get it, Googling something isn't hard either. But, instead of dousing the flames by giving a quick and easy answer, you decided to fan them. 
 
Anyways, rambling about something indirectly off-topic! I'm personally enjoying this game, and look forward to meeting y'all! I personally don't think this game's community is as negative as some other MMOs, such as SWTOR. Definitely no where near as positive as GW2, but maybe W* is undeserving of it's community reputation. Of course, this thread would likely make some people think it is deserved. 
 
Back to the game and making friends! Y'all are awesome.  ;)
			
				
	Edited October 8, 2015 by SkyCake	
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			I don't really believe any of the regular posters (at least in this thread) are the sort of people who'd tell people in game to uninstall or harass anybody.A lot of the people telling folks to learn and practice are doing it in the best interest in the health of the community.I was piping up during a run with my boyfriend in protostar when people were getting confused or we wiped - "gotta interrupt at this point" and what not and I also had somebody doing an essential walkthrough when I started. (Just before F2P launch, however. I got in early to avoid the crowd.)The only place I've seen actual blaming of new players and extreme "negativity" is in the PvP community in this game - which is really a part of any PVP styled game.Sadly - That's where it's going to matter most because setting up in that aspect is actual hell (not protostar) and the regular crew there is essentially defending elements of the game that will cause people to quit in droves.	
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One thing through this whole thread that i do not think is addressed is the use of addons.  if you don't use them, start!  they help you develop your situational awareness by letting you know what is coming your way as far as interruptable mechanics and other quality of life improvements.
 
if you do not have interrupter and you are running group content, shame on you.  this will allow you to see more clearly which spells are interrupt-able and how many interrupts the mob has.  this is a must have addon for group content.
 
Another must have is raid core, if you are planning on raiding.  this is the DBM of wildstar.  it has timers for all the fight mechanics so that you can be prepared.  there are also more specific adds for some of the fights that require special positioning, target priority, and markers for locations, that will make your life easier.
 
edit: for those who may say "I dont use addons", there is a phrase that i use which is "smarter not harder"
			
				
	Edited October 8, 2015 by Foul Wind	
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			This is not even a new game, you go to youtube, or get on google(futuristic search engine, get out of that bubble) and you will know tactics, and be allright.	
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{| class="blockquote"
This thread reminds me of launch. The OP and the replies! But, the game turned out fine since then, right? 
 
I'm not saying OP is in the right, and quitting over that is kind of silly. I also think the community in general is pretty alright. But, y'all keep chasing anyone that may have potentially stuck around, and the game is going to be empty... again. Also, the whole "we dont want ppl like that anywayz!" statement is ignorant as hell. Almost has ignorant as people comparing "digital thick skin" to real life. This game has a reputation of having a negative community, no need to continue to concrete that assumption/generalization. 
 
Some people in this thread/game are pretty silly. "I shouldn't have to devote 100% of my time to helping new players!" : "shouldnt have to bend over backwards to help someone that cant use google" : "not going to hold someone's hand". Y'all act like hitting Enter and typing, "CC this boss on [this tell]" is hard. If that's too much for you, then instead of telling them to uninstall the game or vote kicking, just don't say anything. I get it, Googling something isn't hard either. But, instead of dousing the flames by giving a quick and easy answer, you decided to fan them. 
 
Anyways, rambling about something indirectly off-topic! I'm personally enjoying this game, and look forward to meeting y'all! I personally don't think this game's community is as negative as some other MMOs, such as SWTOR. Definitely no where near as positive as GW2, but maybe W* is undeserving of it's community reputation. Of course, this thread would likely make some people think it is deserved. 
 
Back to the game and making friends! Y'all are awesome.  ;)
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			This thread's still going? Uninstalled.	
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This thread's still going? Uninstalled.
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The Secret World has an amazing thing, a solo instanced boss fight which implements all important mechanics. Noone can help you there, you are on your own, you and your skills.
 
You practice, practice, and practice, until you are skilled and familiarized with all mechanics enough to be able to kill the boss.
 
This -> unlocks nightmare dungeons for you.
 
As a result, NM dungeons don't have any newbs in them (unless someone gave his acc pass to friend to finish it for him, but thats extremely low %).
It's amazing game mechanics if you ask me.	
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Perhaps the solution to this problem would be the mandatory requirement to finish SOLO mode dungeon before you are able to queue up for group version.
 
SOLO mode dungeon should implement (as much as possible) all the mechanics as a group dungeon, only ofc be adjusted to 1 player difficulty (mobs HP, damage...).	
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Perhaps the solution to this problem would be the mandatory requirement to finish SOLO mode dungeon before you are able to queue up for group version.
 
SOLO mode dungeon should implement (as much as possible) all the mechanics as a group dungeon, only ofc be adjusted to 1 player difficulty (mobs HP, damage...).
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Protogames Academy does the same thing with the added benefit of implementing teamwork.
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This is not even a new game, you go to youtube, or get on google(futuristic search engine, get out of that bubble) and you will know tactics, and be allright.
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i will never do any such thing.
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I've done several dungeons with nothing but randoms, and have not experienced anything like this. Most banter involves Chua superiority, or people asking what kind of build they should be going for, or whatever.
 
I know it's a bit of confirmation bias on my end, but I'm going to have to chalk it up to pebcak.	
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Seems that ppl forgot why this game went f2p, and the community is  clearly over estimated in its "kindness".
Elitist, veteran players making new alts, and are kicking new players from dungeon, if they dont dare or arent capable of clearing the dungeon at the pace these elitists want to. Ofc smurf account, already decked in gear with vast knowledge of the game will trump over any new player, at any day, but this....this is for you TO JUDGE, and to remember maybe why this game went f2p ( sorry for it but its truth).
This wasnt an isolated case either, i guess i should have learn to keep my mouth SHUT .
 
 
 
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i will never do any such thing. i will learn the game like the first players did, trial and error. that is fun, not following some played out script i see on youtube to get the fastest kills or runs.
as far as i am concerned, if a person wants a fast run with people that have already done it, they should set up their own team with whatever requirements they want.
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Have what? Players who want to have fun and experience the game for the first time by playing it themselves rather than by watching someone else tell them how to do it?
How awful. How unacceptable.
 
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Exactly. I am glad you can admit that out loud.
 
Carry on.
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i know you two have you relationship here on the boards, so if this is you messing with yas cool beans, but what is wrong with me wanting to learn without the vids?
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Nothing, that's why I advocate reworking solo mode versions to be more like group versions in mechanics, only with reduced damage/HP so they are suitable for solo player.
And making the solo version completion requirement to join the group version.
 
So you can learn without vids, and once you do, you can join groups for harder challenge. :)
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i know you two have you relationship here on the boards, so if this is you messing with yas cool beans, but what is wrong with me wanting to learn without the vids?
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{| class="blockquote"
There's nothing wrong with someone wanting to learn the fights without a video or instruction. But you also can't be upset and uninstalling based on toxic people who do have an issue with it. That's kind of the nature of the beast when it comes to pugging things now a days. There are some that will help you out. There are some that will be royally pissed off. Which is why most people try to form their own groups for runs. Whether its to learn the dungeon or to speed run it makes no difference. And yes you should form a group to learn it because with a lot of vets being very overgeared it makes cheesing a lot of mechanics very easy so you really don't get to learn like you should. 
 
As for their relationship on the forums ... most people who don't want the game to change just for the sake of being easy have issue's with Yas as he/she is a big advocate for making the game very easy which most of us do not want in any way. MMO's should have a challenge to them and should require teamwork (it is a social game after all) but some people prefer the wow route of being able to Q and spam 1 button to victory and free purps.
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{| class="blockquote"
There's nothing wrong with someone wanting to learn the fights without a video or instruction. But you also can't be upset and uninstalling based on toxic people who do have an issue with it. That's kind of the nature of the beast when it comes to pugging things now a days. There are some that will help you out. There are some that will be royally pissed off. Which is why most people try to form their own groups for runs. Whether its to learn the dungeon or to speed run it makes no difference. And yes you should form a group to learn it because with a lot of vets being very overgeared it makes cheesing a lot of mechanics very easy so you really don't get to learn like you should. 
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{| class="blockquote"
i know you two have you relationship here on the boards, so if this is you messing with yas cool beans, but what is wrong with me wanting to learn without the vids?
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{| class="blockquote"
Which is why having the ability to queue for a progression run and be grouped with other people who are there to learn the dungeons instead of being tossed into a queue full of vets looking to speedrun would be a big improvement over the current system, no?
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			Here in lies the problem with many mmos nowdays most communities are toxic . i have played mmos for the past 14 years and they have gone from people being willing and frinedly and helpful to scew you google it or just gtfo . i have been kicked from groups  not sure why at lower lvl  stuff . yes it took 3 people to kick him but most people just see kick player and accept it . until people relize you need to help and teach new players things all mmos will continue to fial . 	
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9/10 times when someone says they're new or don't know the dungeon, people are happy to tell them the boss mechanics and understand if the player goes down in 3 seconds.  I see it all the time and it's pretty "eh whatever, he'll learn after he dies for the 8th time"
 
It's when players don't even try to move or use ints. that I think most people have an issue with when it comes to teaching new players.
 
Protostar is a good step, but I also like the idea of having a solo-scenario as well to make the player have to pay attention. 
 
At least for dungeon bosses, I see looking them up as a little.. odd?  They're pretty simple and it takes all of one sentence to tell people what to look out for.
 
Raids on the other hand - you bet your buns you better be watching TONS of videos before you show up lol.	
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{| class="blockquote"
Good on paper, but won't work. Queue times will be longer, as there will be, especially over time, more people who know the content than those who don't, and people don't like sitting in queues. Most of them will then queue for the vet line, to get in faster, and it'll be back to how it is currently except probably worse because there will be an excuse for kicking the new player; "You have your own line to stand in."
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Best way for me to learn raid/dungeon  encounters is by doing it myself instead of checking videos.( I dont mind checking videos for certain raid boss tactics but I really dislike being forced to watch videos for tactics)
 
Besides not everyone learns the same way as everyone else, some learn better the hard way.
 
EDIT: Still in order to do raid nearly all the guilds(Not saying every guild out there but at least the ones i found[Which are nearly half if not 70% of the server]) require you to watch the videos, which I dont understand WHY.
 
Not trying to be rude here, its just how I feel about it as an old-school wow raider.
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Ive always believed that game mechanics reinforce both player behavior and player expectations.  If the game allows you to queue up for a dungeon at any time, any place, with no gear checking (im assuming here from what ive heard so far) then I would find it reasonable for a player to believe that they had a reasonable expectation of success in a pug setting.  If a straight up pug's success is not very likely, then, well the grouping mechanic needs to change to reflect this.  Leave the adventures puggable through the dungeon finder, they honestly felt even to easy back when I played at release. Take out and create a different mechanic for dungeons.
 
A party finder like FF14's for instance, where someone would create a group listing with a message like "Vet Skullcano - know the fights" or "SSM new players welcome", where a player could just join any of these groups, might be helpful in tempering expectations, and prevent the dreaded LFG spam. 
 
There was a reason why the 8 man raids in FF14 (sorry for going back there again) were not in the party finder until gearscore inflation, it demanded more of a group of players and had tighter mechanics than say the 4 man dungeons or the 24 man raids, all of which could be pugged with a decent success rate, and simple explanations of mechanics.
 
Now, you will not find a bigger supporter of dungeon finders than me, I love them, always have since WoW, but the dungeons need to reflect that ease of access, otherwise they can hurt the player base more than help by playing with expectations vs reality.  
 
All IMO
			
				
	Edited October 9, 2015 by Dantos	
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Nvm, didn't realise OP was a troll. ugh
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			I've actually experienced what the OP is referring to. On the last boss of that "intro dungeon". I know I was kicked because they kicked someone before me and right after I asked why, I was "removed by the server". Didnt uninstall though, but people need to realize there are new players coming in to learn. Alienating them only hurts the game more, and I doubt the devs would be happy to know that all the hard work they put in putting this game on F2P life support was undone by a toxic community.	
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{| class="blockquote"
Which is why having the ability to queue for a progression run and be grouped with other people who are there to learn the dungeons instead of being tossed into a queue full of vets looking to speedrun would be a big improvement over the current system, no?
 
 
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{| class="blockquote"
Best way for me to learn raid/dungeon  encounters is by doing it myself instead of checking videos.( I dont mind checking videos for certain raid boss tactics but I really dislike being forced to watch videos for tactics)
 
Besides not everyone learns the same way as everyone else, some learn better the hard way.
 
EDIT: Still in order to do raid nearly all the guilds(Not saying every guild out there but at least the ones i found[Which are nearly half if not 70% of the server]) require you to watch the videos, which I dont understand WHY.
 
Not trying to be rude here, its just how I feel about it as an old-school wow raider.
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{| class="blockquote"
Welcome to MMORPGs. Was this your first time? And goodbye, I guess.
 
If anything, I've noticed an increase in toxic behaviour since the game went F2P,  pretty much what one can expect when more people are involved. :rolleyes: So, I wouldn't really point fingers at "veterans" in specific. 
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 This game while its moving to casual still demands certain game play that a lot of other mmo's don't put as much emphasis on.. Lack of interrupts is the leading cause of wipes in this game and that includes not having enough because someone keeps dying because they can't stay out of the red... 
 
Sorry to see you leave before giving yourself the opportunity to get the fundamentals down... 	
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{| class="blockquote"
Ive always believed that game mechanics reinforce both player behavior and player expectations.  If the game allows you to queue up for a dungeon at any time, any place, with no gear checking (im assuming here from what ive heard so far) then I would find it reasonable for a player to believe that they had a reasonable expectation of success in a pug setting.  If a straight up pug's success is not very likely, then, well the grouping mechanic needs to change to reflect this.  Leave the adventures puggable through the dungeon finder, they honestly felt even to easy back when I played at release. Take out and create a different mechanic for dungeons.
 
A party finder like FF14's for instance, where someone would create a group listing with a message like "Vet Skullcano - know the fights" or "SSM new players welcome", where a player could just join any of these groups, might be helpful in tempering expectations, and prevent the dreaded LFG spam. 
 
There was a reason why the 8 man raids in FF14 (sorry for going back there again) were not in the party finder until gearscore inflation, it demanded more of a group of players and had tighter mechanics than say the 4 man dungeons or the 24 man raids, all of which could be pugged with a decent success rate, and simple explanations of mechanics.
 
Now, you will not find a bigger supporter of dungeon finders than me, I love them, always have since WoW, but the dungeons need to reflect that ease of access, otherwise they can hurt the player base more than help by playing with expectations vs reality.  
 
All IMO
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{| class="blockquote"
all these people that are saying bye and such are forgetting that YOU NEED THESE PLAYERS! low pop is one of the top reasons why this game went f2p.... actually cupcake it im talking to a wall.
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			all these people that are saying bye and such are forgetting that YOU NEED THESE PLAYERS! low pop is one of the top reasons why this game went f2p.... actually cupcake it im talking to a wall.
			
				
	Edited October 9, 2015 by Noble One	
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The only problem with this is that it won't solve anything. Do you think people will even click the box? It would mean longer Q times. No one wants that. They would deal with elitism before waiting an hour for a Q.
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As someone who was playing the leveling game before F2P - and am playing it again...
 
I've not seen this.
 
But where it occurs I would not tend to blame veteran players for it. By the time F2P was announced the pool of veteran players was thin enough that fairly decent etiquette had evolved. I always found groups that volunteered fight explanations, got chatty, and worked together.
 
I would more suspect players coming from other MMOs who are bringing the attitudes from there with them, and then a smaller pool of people on alts that I just managed to never notice before.	
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Personal experience from other games. Usually the most mouthy and objectionable players in any random grouping dungeon/raid are frequently the worst players deflecting blame.
 
An Example from WoW: A Warlock yelling at the group to kick the hunter because the hunter won't put away his voidwalker. The voidwalker was the warlocks OWN PET and they were the one pulling stuff ahead of the tank and faceplanting on every pull.	
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