100296-crickets-on-server

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== Content ==
			I don't know if it is the same on all servers, but Roms... feels dead.  Is there some epidemic I don't know about?	
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Strain. It has killed most of us.
 
It was a horrible chest-bursty death.
 
 
On a serious note, where exactly is it feeling dead on your server? Cities? High level zones? Low level zones? :(
 
Sometimes, it's just a case of not being in the same place as other people leveling. Other times it's when you play. And occasionally it does have to do with the amount of people still playing on the server. Any more information you're able to give us? (what level range, when you play, etc?) :)
 
There's currently no way for us to know for sure the exact server populations. Some servers suffered from the boom and bust of the launch server loads. But it's hard to tell when this is the case and when you're just not running into as many people for other reasons.	
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			It's called Tuesday in the middle of a work day.	
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It's called Tuesday in the middle of a work day.
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Not everyone has the same job that requires you to clock in for 'the man!'
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But most people do.
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Well, I wish they didn't, at least for today. 
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Strain. It has killed most of us.
 
It was a horrible chest-bursty death.
 
 
On a serious note, where exactly is it feeling dead on your server? Cities? High level zones? Low level zones? :(
 
Sometimes, it's just a case of not being in the same place as other people leveling. Other times it's when you play. And occasionally it does have to do with the amount of people still playing on the server. Any more information you're able to give us? (what level range, when you play, etc?) :)
 
There's currently no way for us to know for sure the exact server populations. Some servers suffered from the boom and bust of the launch server loads. But it's hard to tell when this is the case and when you're just not running into as many people for other reasons.
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Obviously some realms have it worse than others. I wish we hadn't guild xferred over to avoid queues on Pergo, I had a feeling this would happen :(
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People are obviously leaving by masses. Guilds fold left and right. But keep on holding on that nothing is wrong.
Have fun with attunement.	
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It's dead everywhere on Rowsdower. You get slightly more people on at primetime but it's still really, really empty. The AH/CX is deserted (good luck finding any gear on there, you're lucky if you get two pages a slot). I think Dominion side is more deserted than Exile side but I can't be sure. Either way, 15 people sitting in Academy Corner at primetime is really sad.
 
Obviously some realms have it worse than others. I wish we hadn't guild xferred over to avoid queues on Pergo, I had a feeling this would happen :(
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Can we transfer to Pergo yet or is that still off limits?
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Pergo hasn't been off limits since June 30. Unless you're coming from PVE.
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			For real? Woot!	
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For real? Woot!
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I never reply to threads like this but what the hell .....
 
I cancelled my sub recently and figured i have 2 credd saved so although i like WS a lot i also have the feeling of playing an MMO alone/solo ... its the same story every time i log in ... lose a few BG's .. get bored with pvp .... do a few quests ... get bored with the same quest (same style, kill 20 .. ) in different zones.  then i start farming seeds and stuff ... work on my house some ...  I even tank the 2, yes TWO whole dungeons i can choose from and oh wait .... the TWO bg's i try and play as a tank .....
 
then I switch toons and start all over again ... i have 3 chr's i play all are lvl 20-28 ... they ALL feel the exact same.
 
so i think the zones are empty cause all the hardcore guys are doing hardcore stuff!
 
i feel this game is empty because well ... no one wants to play casually ... hell even if i could just fish or something ... maybe low level raids (lvl 30 not high enough to die a million times?)
 
anyways Everyone knows why the low level areas are dead ..... no one is there because they quit and are waiting for fixes .....
 
I love Wildstar ... but WildStar hates me .... so i will use my CREDD when the game becomes more friendly.
 
-Myth	
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			Pago is alive and well, its great not being greedy and picking the right server.	
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I don't know, I don't have this experience at all.  I was off work all last week and played Wildstar for over 40 hours and I was never alone.  Guild mates are on, people always around in quest areas, lots and lots of Exiles (I'm Dom).  Last night was no exception, were tripping over each other.  If it helps, I'm now level 42 and just completed Wilderun zone.
 
I can tell you that a friend I play the game with also had friends on Rowsdower and a few of them transferred to our server (Orias) to join us. 	
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Pago is alive and well, its great not being greedy and picking the right server.
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Pago is alive and well, its great not being greedy and picking the right server.
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People are obviously leaving by masses. Guilds fold left and right. But keep on holding on that nothing is wrong.
Have fun with attunement.
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			Next time pick the server with the longest queue. They are always the last to die. While frustrating at release, every queue dies down.	
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If derping was painful you'd be in trouble. My server is bouncing like a hyper active white girl in a twerking contest. Have fun stomping your feet and pretending that the sky is falling, maybe you'd have a better time going back to console gaming kiddo.
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			broken link to patch server no-one can get in atm	
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It's called Tuesday in the middle of a work day.
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			Solution: breed frogs.	
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			itt people that picked pergo, raged about queues because the server was popular and then xfer'ed to empty servers. Pago had a queue... for like 2 days I didn't whine about it, I just delt with it because I knew it would fix itself	
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We didn't "pick" the wrong server. We transferred in good faith because queues on Pergo were obscene, partially because you could autorun in place for ages and not get logged out. Then, when they fixed that, people were running macros so they wouldn't lose their spot on server. Additionally, it wasn't my call to make. It was the GM's. I don't think he was at fault either, avoiding queues so we could actually raid was a logical move at the time, regardless if I agreed with it.
 
Please tell me how the declining server pop of what was, at best, a medium pop (Rowsdower) is my fault for not "picking the right server". Go on, I'll wait.
 
EDIT: Seriously though, what was the point of your post? Was it to go "neener neener neener" at the people on empty servers? If your server is so great, why are you on the forums rubbing our noses in it?
I don't get it.
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Came here expecting....
 
 
I leave disappointed. 	
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Queues are things that go away on their own after players fall into their usually play patterns instead of everyone being on 24/7. Guilds didn't have to get antsy and transfer, as if waiting 30 minutes in a queue would have killed them.
 
I'll say it again - the worst thing about MMOs are the players.
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Please tell me how the declining server pop of what was, at best, a medium pop (Rowsdower) is my fault for not "picking the right server". Go on, I'll wait.
 
EDIT: Seriously though, what was the point of your post? Was it to go "neener neener neener" at the people on empty servers? If your server is so great, why are you on the forums rubbing our noses in it?
I don't get it.
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If derping was painful you'd be in trouble. My server is bouncing like a hyper active white girl in a twerking contest. Have fun stomping your feet and pretending that the sky is falling, maybe you'd have a better time going back to console gaming kiddo.
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Are you people literally blaming players for xferring after 5+hr queues
 
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Carbine opened Rowsdower and opened free xfers, what do you think people were going to do
Are you insane
Are you people literally blaming players for xferring after 5+hr queues
 
I don't even have any words for this. Foot meet mouth. This speaks for itself
Confirmed worse than SWTOR forums, dear christ. At least there people don't blame someone for following a community they've been w/in multiple games to a server that later died because of poor management.
 
I give up, there is no arguing against the terminally dumb
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Except they weren't 5 hour queues. People, in typical hyperbolic fashion, cannot have patience and said "gimme nao!!!!!"
 
How do I know? I'm on Pago and have been there since day 1.
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I rolled on pERgo, L2Read son
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I rolled on pERgo, L2Read son
They were 5 hour queues because I literally sat there for 5 hours
Then I'd CTD less than an hour in
And would have to wait in queue for hours more
 
And that was how I was the last player in my guild to hit 50. The end.
(also, I had to go back to work on Thursday. Booo.)
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Just block him. He's one of those simpletons who go into every thread to point out that everyone is at fault for everything except Carbine. It's probably in your guild's best interest to convince everyone to transfer. Merging servers so soon after launch would be bad press and so it won't be done even if everyone and their dogs can see that there are population issues on certain realms.
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Queues weren't 5 hours either, son.
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			Well, you see, my anectodal evidence trumps yours because as a veteran gamer, I	
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Queues were over 5 hours on Pergo at Headstart.  You obviously weren't here if you didn't get them.  I waited atleast 4-5 hours several days when headstart launched to even log in for a few hours.
 
They should have just built bigger servers, and kept the amount of servers available to a limit.  Would have solved world hunger.
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Dang them crickets, worse than those bots!	
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Hey now, don't bring your logic and facts into this thread ;)
Here, we run on ~*~feelings~*~ and ~*~should've picked a diff server guise~*~
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Yeah.  I mean.  I am not really mad about my current servers population because I am in an established guild.  But the population on a few of the PvP servers are so low that they could combine them all and they would still have less of a population than Pergo or the other big PVE servers.  It is pretty depressing.
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			Can we just have a sticky topic specifically for anyone who wants to moan about population? Instead of 600 a day? Also add [Opinion] tag to the title, let's at least make it a little accurate.	
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I'd also like to see PvE -> PvP xfers, too, but that's a different story :P
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even more so, what did you expect... your issue is self inflicted, I suggest deal with it and re-roll
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Let's all leave the low pop servers, that'll solve the problem of low pop servers!
 
edit: let's all reroll dominion to exile, that'll solve the problem of exile>dominion faction imbalance!	
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I don't begrudge anyone a full server. That's the goal and I'm glad that there are healthy and thriving ones.
I just wish they'd let our guild move again without slapping 40+ people with a $20 fee, or merge some of the smaller servers together.
 
I'd also like to see PvE -> PvP xfers, too, but that's a different story :P
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Yes, let's tell the guild with the world 3rd ohmna kill to reroll
That sounds like a great idea. Let me just tell all my guildmates, I'm sure they'll love it and think that in no way are you just digging your hole deeper and deeper
 
I want PvE -> PvP transfers because the raiding pool on PvP servers is tiny. I don't see how it would hurt anyone by increasing the recruitment pool
 
WHO KNOWS THOUGH, MAYBE I'M JUST CRAZY.
 
seriously though this is completely irrelevant to the topic at hand, which is why you used it to derail. /golfclap
 
EDIT: changed to "PvE -> PvP". It is now correct. My bad.
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Yup.  Instead of having 7 PvP servers, they could cut it down to about 3-4 and several population issues would be easily resolved.
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Permanently dumb?
 
You are the idiots who jumped ship the first chance you could.  Where are those 5 hour queues now? You really thought they would last forever?
 
Fool.	
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			Reminder that Carbine had 1 (One) EU PvP server up at launch. 	
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Permanently dumb?
 
You are the idiots who jumped ship the first chance you could.  Where are those 5 hour queues now? You really thought they would last forever?
 
Fool.
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It's hard to farm PPPs when there are none to buy
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I just want to ruffle your feathers (are you aurin?). Go farm them instead of making others farm them for you to buy! :P
 
More feather ruffling: Didn't DnT rerolled on Blackrock after disbanding on Korgath?
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			I honestly hope they do not fix the low realm pop issue, that way more players will quit and the game is that much closer to F2P. Feels so good to read these threads.	
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			Alright so is it just me or do you find less and less people on every day? Out of the 20 hard core gamers on my friend list and a guild that had 500 players, only 3 are still active in the last week and in the gulid only 30 or so have been active this week... I have already unsubscribed myself and running off of credd it seems day by day people are losing interest in the game... I was really into pvp since I got 1800 but it annoying, every other comp is double stalker and we'll being globaled is a thing now so what now? The imbalances are obvious... warrior was fotm now it's stalkers, I tried re rolling out of boredom and basicly it's full of hybrid classes that can heal so it's annoying that every game lasts 25 damn minutes because 8 of their 10 can heal... am I not seein somthing or is this game FUBAR?	
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			It's You	
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Yes, because server populations dropping after the first free month is something that has never happen in any other game, and it is a well-known fact that WoW and any other game for that matter made all classes perfectly balanced in less than 2 months and never ever had to tweak them again...
 
 
Seriously, this thread again?	
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i wouldnt be mad at other people for playing a Hybrid, if it works for them. There will always be a "fotm" and i laugh at those who constantly re-roll to that class. smh.
 
 I personally see a ton of people playing, on my server, and most of the people on my friends list / circle are always on when i am, at some point. So i dont share the same viewpoint as you on that either, but im sure others do.	
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			I didn't say I'm quiting I'm just trying to grasp the overall intentions of a game here, it's been out for almost 2 months and they boasted about dungeon replay ability and I feel like I go brain dead after the second time I run it, the pvp has gotten worse with their updates I just am at a loss, I'm not looking for smart ads remarks but I play a medic myself and we'll I have to heal in pve the dps is sad, I know they addressed that issue (ish) but to give stalkers yet another buff in the up coming patch seems absurd... I know wow wasn't balanced but they released content WHEN IT WAS READY not just here is a bunch of broken shit that will ultimately hurt the game forever. I really want to see how drop 2 changes things that's why I'm sticking around but I feel like I should get ready for a letdown	
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warrior was fotm now it's stalkers
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 I know wow wasn't balanced but they released content WHEN IT WAS READY not just here is a bunch of broken shit that will ultimately hurt the game forever.
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Just typing "wow broken" on Google shows me a bunch of eerily similar-looking thread titles on the official forums.
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			All I thought should of happened for drop 1 should of been balance and overall playability NOT more broken content.	
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Alright so is it just me or do you find less and less people on every day? Out of the 20 hard core gamers on my friend list and a guild that had 500 players, only 3 are still active in the last week and in the gulid only 30 or so have been active this week... I have already unsubscribed myself and running off of credd it seems day by day people are losing interest in the game... I was really into pvp since I got 1800 but it annoying, every other comp is double stalker and we'll being globaled is a thing now so what now? The imbalances are obvious... warrior was fotm now it's stalkers, I tried re rolling out of boredom and basicly it's full of hybrid classes that can heal so it's annoying that every game lasts 25 damn minutes because 8 of their 10 can heal... am I not seein somthing or is this game FUBAR?
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Alright so is it just me or do you find less and less people on every day? Out of the 20 hard core gamers on my friend list and a guild that had 500 players, only 3 are still active in the last week and in the gulid only 30 or so have been active this week... I have already unsubscribed myself and running off of credd it seems day by day people are losing interest in the game... I was really into pvp since I got 1800 but it annoying, every other comp is double stalker and we'll being globaled is a thing now so what now? The imbalances are obvious... warrior was fotm now it's stalkers, I tried re rolling out of boredom and basicly it's full of hybrid classes that can heal so it's annoying that every game lasts 25 damn minutes because 8 of their 10 can heal... am I not seein somthing or is this game FUBAR?
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The majority are out in the game world playing.
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Do you have any data to support that opinion?
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Well, the server population at medium or high on a regular basis in prime time is the data.
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I've seen nothing to indicate that that is what is happening. Do you have any source or proof that the servers are behaving thus?
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Sure, you can see for yourself by logging in tonight after 8pm EST to any of the US servers...
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anyone who actually plays this game now the situation, the state of the game is obvious.
 
threads locked with any hint of truth about the game , people who sit and craft and play house think the games fine.
 
I'm not saying its dead but the difference between a month let alone a  week is huge.
 
moderator edit: content 
			
				
	Edited July 23, 2014 by Chillia	
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I've been logging in at those times for the last month, and making a habit of checking the server populations for the US. I haven't seen high in a very long time.
 
I feel like your opinion is completely unwarranted and unsubstantiated. Why don't you just share a screenshot you took of the server populations at that time on previous days?
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Last night there were 2 high servers, though I do not recall which ones. Keep checking!
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anyone who actually plays this game now the situation
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Last night there were 2 high servers, though I do not recall which ones. Keep checking!
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I don't think there were. It's a shame you can't prove your claim.
 
In the future, please don't post opinions and pretend that they're facts. This doesn't help anyone gain any information from the process, it simply spreads confusion and obfuscates the truth.
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Hey Folks,
 
Population has been an important topic here in the forums this week, but please keep in mind posts need to be constructive and not flame one another. Talk about the game, discuss things, but please try to leave your personal remarks at the door and stay on topic. 
 
Thank you
- team WildStar 	
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I'm telling you like it is. And Carbine has all the data they need. It's up to you if you need more.
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threads locked with any hint of truth about the game 
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And yet you can't show that this is how it is, and your claimed experience differs greatly from that of others who have spoken about the same subject.
 
Carbine may have the data, but they haven't given it to you, and as such, your "facts" are just opinions. Please don't misconstrue them as actual data unless you can prove them.
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And yet you can't show that this is how it is, and your claimed experience differs greatly from that of others who have spoken about the same subject.
 
Carbine may have the data, but they haven't given it to you, and as such, your "facts" are just opinions. Please don't misconstrue them as actual data unless you can prove them.
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I don't take screenshots of "server screens" because... why? I could just as easily post one from launch and you wouldn't know the difference.
 
These are the facts I observed yesterday, you only have to wait a few more hours to see what it looks like.
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Even then, you claimed only 2 server were at "high", while during the first weeks after launch many servers were at high.
 
So even IF your opinion about the current server loads was correct, it still reflects that far fewer people are playing or playing at the same time, which is what the OP was asking.
 
I'm glad you agree with me (and him/her).
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Not to discredit that individual, as I have no personal knowledge of his reliability, but generally when someone asks for hard information and is told, "It's fine", I think of this:
 
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwFKSl-3dPc the link since the embed seems wonky on my end.
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Not to discredit that individual, as I have no personal knowledge of his reliability, but generally when someone asks for hard information and is told, "It's fine", I think of this:
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwFKSl-3dPc
 
 
 
 
 
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So basically there is nothing that can be said to make you think differently in the slightest. Which is fine. But that doesn't mean you're right.
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And of course, you are correct, none of that means I'm right. But we haven't seen any numbers to show what IS right, besides the census data from players using that add-on.
 
 
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I'll never understand why people need other peoples' enjoyment to satisfy their own. If you're having fun who cares? If you're not then that's fine too... find something you enjoy. Why do you need to know exactly how many people are still playing to know if you are enjoying yourself? Form your own opinions. 
 
And no the OP is not just saying that there are less people he's saying the game is fubar and I don't see any evidence myself to back that claim. I'm still loving it and that's all that matters to me. 	
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Yet we're on page 2 of people arguing about data that doesn't exist and trying to prove one another wrong with anecdotal observations and references.  Good thread. 10/10.  Would read again.
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I'll never understand why people need other peoples' enjoyment to satisfy their own. If you're having fun who cares? If you're not then that's fine to... find something you enjoy? Why do you need to know exactly how many people are still playing to know if you are enjoying yourself? Form your own opinions. 
 
And no the OP is not just saying that there are less people he's saying the game is fubar and I don't see any evidence myself to back that claim. I'm still loving it and that's all that matters to me. 
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			you guys are still going at it? wow.	
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When lethality starts posting wildly unlikely things as "facts", someone has to remind him of what facts are, or he'd drown this whole forum in optimism and soap bubbles. Just happened to be me for this thread.
 
 
Then if you DID see evidence that it was "fubar", you still wouldn't care, right? So why even say that?
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Do you know what fubar stands for? If it were fubar then I wouldn't be enjoying myself as it would be messed up beyond repair... I am enjoying myself there for I see no such evidence. Why do you need numbers to know whether you like the game or not? Can you not decide on your own? 
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My friends list is still the same as before, everybody on it is still happy.
 
 
 
Although that doesn't say much ... I have 0 people on my friends list.	
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My friends list is still the same as before, everybody on it is still happy.
 
 
 
Although that doesn't say much ... I have 0 people on my friends list.
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My friends list is still the same as before, everybody on it is still happy.
 
 
 
Although that doesn't say much ... I have 0 people on my friends list.
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***Mod Note***I changed the title of this thread to clearly state the premise so people who are interested can find this topic. Carry on.
 
~Morwynne	
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I normally don't do this, but since you opened with a line about what words mean, "there for" is "therefore", one word.
 
You don't need numbers to know whether you like the game or not. When you start seeing fewer and people around, fewer people talking in zone chat, fewer things on the AH/CX, you start to wonder if it's just you or if other people are seeing this as well. And that's what the OP was asking.
 
You certainly don't NEED other people to have fun with the game. You can play from 1 to 50 solo, give or take a handful of optional quests. But it's an MMO. If you're going to be simulating a single player game while paying a subscription, most people would rather save the sub and play something else. 
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			Yep it's pretty dead	
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At least until you got that somewhat-off RPer's attention.
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Official Population:  There's more people than Tabula Rasa had, but less than World of Warcraft.  If you want more than that, buy some NCSoft stock and wait for the Shareholder's meeting?  Or.. you know.. we can keep running around in this circle of veiled insults and various other nonsense until the Mods lock it.  
 
OP:  Yes.  Some people have left.  Some have come back.  (Reddit.)  What will happen?  Unless someone here is Miss Cleo.  Who knows.	
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Someone sure is condescending and you have been this whole thread. English is not my native language. I was serious when I asked if you didn't know what it stood for. Some people use it and don't really understand the meaning and it seemed you did not as you assumed I would still like the game if it was fubar. As someone said from the beginning, mmos do this, there are always drops after launch. It is normal and to be expected. This was backed with "I need proof" and when given proof you wouldn't accept it. Two servers at high and a decent amount at medium during peak hours is plenty to sustain the game. An employee stated that the game is doing fine. Still not enough. Numbers from census addons have been pretty decent as well but that's not enough either... even though all the things I've listed are all we have to go by. 
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Official Population:  There's more people than Tabula Rasa had, but less than World of Warcraft.  If you want more than that, buy some NCSoft stock and wait for the Shareholder's meeting?  Or.. you know.. we can keep running around in this circle of veiled insults and various other nonsense until the Mods lock it.  
 
OP:  Yes.  Some people have left.  Some have come back.  (Reddit.)  What will happen?  Unless someone here is Miss Cleo.  Who knows.
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			Just trying to be Smokey the Bear.  Only you can prevent Forum Fires and such.  	
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			Maybe this employee that refused the direct request for hard numbers is not authorized to share such information. And those who are authorized simply dont want to for reasons. My guess is the reason isnt "to *cupcake* off the players and keep hard numbers from them, they dont deserve to know" I bet its actually more along the lines of a legitimate business reason, or that they could be waiting for things to stabilize, or who knows,	
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Just trying to be Smokey the Bear.  Only you can prevent Forum Fires and such.  
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I didn't assume you would like the game if it was fubar, you yourself said "I like it so it can't be fubar", emphasis mine. Yes, MMOs lose population after launch, although I've never seen one lose so much so quickly before.
 
I didn't say "I need proof", if you're going to quote me. I said "Do you have proof of that?" in response to an outlier claim. That person didn't provide any proof, simply his opinion without backing.
 
You apparently misunderstand the information that the census add-on has been reporting. The add-on has been reporting data that supports the opinion that the population has been (and continues) dropping sharpy. It does not support the opinion that everything is just peachy, hunky-dory, A-okay, whatever phrase you want to throw on it.
 
An employee refused a direct request for hard numbers and said "it's fine". That's a little different than the way you're saying it. Again, watch the Futurama clip, as that happens quite often in customer service and marketing.
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You're flaming a spider.  I'm perfectly okay with that.  We'll replant the trees later. 
 
 
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Maybe this employee that refused the direct request for hard numbers is not authorized to share such information. And those who are authorized simply dont want to for reasons. My guess is the reason isnt "to *cupcake* off the players and keep hard numbers from them, they dont deserve to know" I bet its actually more along the lines of a legitimate business reason, or that they could be waiting for things to stabilize, or who knows,
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
You've seen no numbers... how do you know how quickly the game is losing players exactly? Do you have proof of how quickly it's losing players? 
 
As for addons all I've seen are the numbers from Raptr and they looked great. 
----
			
Game is doing fine. Some are quitting, some are coming back and others are joining.
 
Also i don't know where is the problem with server beeing full, medium or low. Im on Thunderfoot and last night my server was low. Thayd was full of players and i had 10 to 15 other people questing in the same area i was. 
 
So for me low, medium or full dont mean anything. I think the game is doing pretty well and some minority here simply don't want to accept that.	
----
			
^  You guys should just reply to each other with Street Fighter moves going forward.  
 
HIA-YUKIN!  (Insert picture) (Insert arguement).  
YOGA FLAME! (same thing)
SONIC BOOM! (Same thing).
 
At least we'd get some where.  :)	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
As I have said, multiple times now but I guess you ignored it, I'm going off my own experience, the experiences posted by others on this forum and that I have know from other games, the snapshots of server load levels at various times, and the census data. Raptr is a separate program and only tracks people using Raptr, while the census add-on eventually tracks everyone on the server it is being used on.
 
And as I have said several times, it is my own experience and opinion. I'm not trying to purport that as fact. Please learn the difference.
 
That said, it is an experience shared by a number of individuals, so when someone comes along and says "Nothing happened, everyone is still playing", it bears a certain requirement of skepticism to take seriously.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
As I have said, multiple times now but I guess you ignored it, I'm going off my own experience, the experiences posted by others on this forum and that I have know from other games, the snapshots of server load levels at various times, and the census data. Raptr is a separate program and only tracks people using Raptr, while the census add-on eventually tracks everyone on the server it is being used on.
 
And as I have said several times, it is my own experience and opinion. I'm not trying to purport that as fact. Please learn the difference.
 
That said, it is an experience shared by a number of individuals, so when someone comes along and says "Nothing happened, everyone is still playing", it bears a certain requirement of skepticism to take seriously.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
There was this tweet from Stephen Frost recently to help backup that numbers are good overall.
 
 
----
			
I don't notice a declining server population.  I see plenty around when I play and hear shouts for 2+ frequently.
 
And I don't need some daily affirmation from the forums that I am making the 'right choice' by playing the game.
People come yelling that the charts say servers are LOW. It can read whatever it wants as long as I log in and people are buying my stuff I'm good.
I don't need a meter to tell me how much fun I am entitled too.
 
 
 
If I applied that to other aspects of life,..I'd of moved into a cave just from reading the newspaper.
 
I play Lotro too still,...go there,.way less traffic, but it's still going,..with a new Content upDate to boot.
 
 
Sounds like you are not getting enjoyment,...Play until you don't.    But leave because you don't like it,..not because the forums 'agreed' with you. 
 
my 2 copper.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Alright so is it just me or do you find less and less people on every day?
----
			
I'd love to argue about the ups and downs of sub numbers, but Carbine won't release them. NCsoft might, they seems to like to brag about that sort of thing but it'll takea  few months to have data worth bragging about. This shouldn't be everyone's first rodeo
 
Moderator edit: content. You can't talk about doing that with a horse, and definitely not at a parade of all places, please keep all discussion on-topic	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
No one said that everyone was still here... someone said simply that 2 servers were at high and most were medium and you asked for proof. You said you've never seen people leave an mmo faster but you have no actual numbers to go by and can provide no proof of your own. Surely you see the problem here. I'm done arguing with someone who's so condescending... not to mention contradictory. 
----
			
Again (feeling like a broken record), I don't see a decline other than the 30-dayers are gone.  All but one of my friend's still play the game (he had to quit because he can't pay $$$ - lost his job).  2 of my friends are gone on vacation for a whole month and will return (although now way behind the rest of us :ph34r: ).  Guild is active and growing without recruiting (friends of friends, new members daily).  I completely love the game, extended my sub because there is so much to do that I haven't even touched the tip of the iceberg.  I'm taking my time and enjoying the game, no rush, no race to the end game... just take it all in and enjoy the ride. 
 
I really can't figure out all the negative posters on these forums, are you just trying to fill them with your negativity to drive away potential players?  I am not talking about those that post constructive criticisms, those that enjoy the game but would like to see some things changed for what they consider to be "the better".  All these "the sky is falling" and "go F2P" threads are just stupid.  I have played almost every MMO released since 2004, even obscure ones like Fallen Earth, and this is by far one of the best to be released in ages.  If you don't like it for whatever reason, please just move on... stop hating here, we don't want to hear about it.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Was that before or after he got it from Games Workshop?
----
			Maybe I'm strange or odd...or blind(I've only got one eye anyway now lol)...but to me it's actually felt like more are gradually joining. It's not as high as I admittedly would love it to be, but I know my server is VERY Exile heavy too.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Again (feeling like a broken record), I don't see a decline other than the 30-dayers are gone.  All but one of my friend's still play the game (he had to quit because he can't pay $$$ - lost his job).  2 of my friends are gone on vacation for a whole month and will return (although now way behind the rest of us :ph34r: ).  Guild is active and growing without recruiting (friends of friends, new members daily).
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
This isn't news or even insulting in any way. Everyone knows Blizzard pitched Warcraft as a warhammer game to Games Workshop and they passed on it, because it was over their standards of mediocrity.
 
 
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
That tells me that you don't have the context to have any insight into overall player population.  You've got a circle of people you work with, so you're insulated from overall population.
 
Which is good!  That means you don't need to care about it, and the game will likely stay pretty fun for you even if the general population were to drop by 98.6% (as long as it stays funded).
 
Cliques are certainly doing fine, and will continue to do so.  But, the experience for a player with no friends and no guildmates is... not quite the same as it was during the first week.
----
			*checks in*  Not one Tiger Knee?  Not even a Yoga Teleport.  *sighs*  Ah well.  As you were.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
No, not true.  I see plenty around me when we're playing.  Constantly people questing in the areas we're in and at times its annoying because we're all trying to get the same mobs or collect the same things.  Exile are definitely outnumbering us Dominion but I do not ever find these barren areas people keep claiming to see.  Last week when I was off and played Wildstar from morning to night I was surprised to see people standing around the AH when I logged on at 5am (I couldn't sleep).  I absolutely don't see the "servers are dead" that people keep posting about, maybe I'm lucky but mine seems just fine (Orias).
----
			Well, it's OK if others don't want to play. I'll be here to turn the lights out. I can just do solo content all I want. I'll do dailies except for Rotter and Empress and level other toons and and all the crafting and just vendor stuff.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Alright so is it just me or do you find less and less people on every day? Out of the 20 hard core gamers on my friend list and a guild that had 500 players, only 3 are still active in the last week and in the gulid only 30 or so have been active this week... I have already unsubscribed myself and running off of credd it seems day by day people are losing interest in the game... I was really into pvp since I got 1800 but it annoying, every other comp is double stalker and we'll being globaled is a thing now so what now? The imbalances are obvious... warrior was fotm now it's stalkers, I tried re rolling out of boredom and basicly it's full of hybrid classes that can heal so it's annoying that every game lasts 25 damn minutes because 8 of their 10 can heal... am I not seein somthing or is this game FUBAR?
----
			Orias seems much more populated as of late.  The daily areas are pretty busy now.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
 Warcraft lore.
 
----
			not seeing a decline	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Well, the server population at medium or high on a regular basis in prime time is the data.
----
			
Guilds merging and losing raiders due to lackluster gear progression.
 
I guess all of you guys in whitevale wouldn't notice this, no.	
----
			
So, this is my own experience here before I get the venomous remarks from certain individuals in this thread, who apparently need "hard data" (which is currently unobtainable)
 
I run a guild, on Contagion eu dominion side. We started off with a couple of friends. Then it went very quiet, and over the past fortnight (since the 30days ran out I may add) the population has boomed to over 100 members. We very often have between 35-40 people online during the evenings.
 
For my "low population" server, we have two main raiding guilds dominion side (plus a few other smaller ones who are actively raiding), and it seems the exile population is just as busy. Plus the population is still growing, I see new names pop up everyday, there are people transferring from hazak still (too busy) and the community is nice.
 
Illium is not packed, nor are the zones, but I frequently run into people.
 
TL;DR just because you can't see the people playing does not immediately show a game is dead. My server is far from dead for a low pop, it's actually more populated than a "dead" server on wow for instance (even with the realm merges). 
 
TL;DR again: Stop sensationalising. Stop worrying about population issues. Play the game and enjoy it.	
----
			
Well, my guild is extremely active. The lowbie zones don't seem as active, but the 50 content is. I have noticed the server pops being low to medium most days, but do we even know how many players that actually is? Carbine has boasted their servers have a higher cap than "most games", no clue what that cap actually is.
 
Like mentioned before, there are always a lot of people who leave after the free month. I've done it plenty myself in games that just weren't for me. It's pretty common to have a large launch, drop off then gradual growth.	
----
			
I just wanted to throw this out there, but I see a lot of folks using their perceptions of "crowds" in the capital cities to gauge their server is dead or not...
While on some servers I know there are large crowds, I've noticed that in contrast to the capital city for Dominion on Evindra which is moderate to sometimes low(during my sessions)...more activity is present in the housing. Most of the people I talk to only visit Illium for a short time to do AH/CX and runecrafting once in awhile then they go out into the world or spend time in their house or someone else's house...	
----
			
If you check a bit some forums that has ppl selling MMO accounts,like for example "EpicNpc" site you will see that the number of ppl who keep selling WS accounts is increasing daily,game keeps losing players on daily basis,maybe not every server but on most.
Some of you that keep saying that you don't notice any changes,well that's probably bcs you only play with your guild/friend list mates,sou you're basically unaware that there's daily decrease of ppl.
 
Game is boring,even thou it's only a start it doesn't offer much,especially if your server is empty,like mine is Archon,game is like 2 months old ppl already have 2-3 chars different classes maxed lvl.And what does that say about the game? that it doesn't offer much at end game,i understand that some ppl like to enjoy to play/try few classes etc,but usually in MMO ppl fall in love with 1 class at least in the beggining of the game,and try to enjoy it much as they like,you basically can experience 1 class to full potential at lvl 30,you get most important skills while u reach that level.
 
Don't want to start a flame war or anything,just bringing my opinion and what i mostly saw and read other ppl opinions too,i quited the game,barely could stand it for 10 days,only reason i still read forum is cause im wondering if anything is change,but it won't,game has a bad start,and don't even try to compare it with that stuff "how WoW had a bad start etc" that was 8-10 years ago when WoW first came,different times now,this game only way to save it,is to go free2play,much like Tera did and many others.
 
Bad copy of WoW with cartonish graphics, game for kids.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
If you check a bit some forums that has ppl selling MMO accounts,like for example "EpicNpc" site you will see that the number of ppl who keep selling WS accounts is increasing daily,game keeps losing players on daily basis,maybe not every server but on most.
Some of you that keep saying that you don't notice any changes,well that's probably bcs you only play with your guild/friend list mates,sou you're basically unaware that there's daily decrease of ppl.
 
Game is boring,even thou it's only a start it doesn't offer much,especially if your server is empty,like mine is Archon,game is like 2 months old ppl already have 2-3 chars different classes maxed lvl.And what does that say about the game? that it doesn't offer much at end game,i understand that some ppl like to enjoy to play/try few classes etc,but usually in MMO ppl fall in love with 1 class at least in the beggining of the game,and try to enjoy it much as they like,you basically can experience 1 class to full potential at lvl 30,you get most important skills while u reach that level.
 
Don't want to start a flame war or anything,just bringing my opinion and what i mostly saw and read other ppl opinions too,i quited the game,barely could stand it for 10 days,only reason i still read forum is cause im wondering if anything is change,but it won't,game has a bad start,and don't even try to compare it with that stuff "how WoW had a bad start etc" that was 8-10 years ago when WoW first came,different times now,this game only way to save it,is to go free2play,much like Tera did and many others.
 
Bad copy of WoW with cartonish graphics, game for kids.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Alright so is it just me or do you find less and less people on every day? Out of the 20 hard core gamers on my friend list and a guild that had 500 players, only 3 are still active in the last week and in the gulid only 30 or so have been active this week... I have already unsubscribed myself and running off of credd it seems day by day people are losing interest in the game... I was really into pvp since I got 1800 but it annoying, every other comp is double stalker and we'll being globaled is a thing now so what now? The imbalances are obvious... warrior was fotm now it's stalkers, I tried re rolling out of boredom and basicly it's full of hybrid classes that can heal so it's annoying that every game lasts 25 damn minutes because 8 of their 10 can heal... am I not seein somthing or is this game FUBAR?
----
			
People keep attributing opinion as fact.
Wild sensationalism is apparently contagious.
 
I have my opinion that the game is fine, in fact I feel like my realm is getting better, but who knows! Noone does until carbine release figures :)
 
If the game was really in that much danger of low population, I'm pretty sure carbine would be doing something drastic to fix it.	
----
			I can confirm that Widow, Evindra and one other realm that I don't recall were all medium last night. I do actually have a screenshot somewhere, but I'm at the office atm.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Alright so is it just me or do you find less and less people on every day? Out of the 20 hard core gamers on my friend list and a guild that had 500 players, only 3 are still active in the last week and in the gulid only 30 or so have been active this week... I have already unsubscribed myself and running off of credd it seems day by day people are losing interest in the game... I was really into pvp since I got 1800 but it annoying, every other comp is double stalker and we'll being globaled is a thing now so what now? The imbalances are obvious... warrior was fotm now it's stalkers, I tried re rolling out of boredom and basicly it's full of hybrid classes that can heal so it's annoying that every game lasts 25 damn minutes because 8 of their 10 can heal... am I not seein somthing or is this game FUBAR?
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Stalkers are FOTM?
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Yes, chocolate too.
----
			
@Wiawymr
 
From an outside perspective, I figured id let you know that you come across as attacking people or challenging what people say just because you can, and you do it an overwhelming amount in this thread. I just figured Id let you know. I wouldnt be surprised if you were completely calm, but you come across as incredibly hostile for no reason.
 
Anyways, The last MMO I played had like 50 active people. Cash Shop, so they could support an entire MMO with that. Either way, I have played big and small MMOs, most recently small so this game is kind of overwhelming in population for me. Every time you refresh the forums you get 5 new posts that consist of like 15 paragraphs. You literally cannot stay ontop of everything players are discussing, Im surprised Devs and management can keep up lol	
----
			
If the only counter argument that can be made  is "yes people leave after the free month." then you're not paying attention to what is being said in the forums, that or you have the reading comprehension of a potato.
 
It has nothing to do with the free month considering we're nearing the end of the second month, meaning all the people making these post are playing now on subbed time they payed for.
It's all the other issues with the game, and changes being made that are making people leave. I could list them all out here, again but what's the point, if you've read the forums you've seen them already.
 
I like the game, and have fun playing it, but I find it harder and harder for myself to log in. I see it taking the same direction swtor did when it launched and I am not sure I want to give it the benefit of the doubt like I did swtor. Maybe I'm just jaded I don't know..
 
Lastly the community here, my god people talk about the toxic community in league or dota.... they should come here. These forums are like the Mos Eisley Cantina of forums trolls, never have I seen such a wretched hive of scum and villianary  and the plain idioticness of the white knights is simply stunning.
 
My opinion is this, Carbine doomed itself when saying they made a game for hardcores. Hardcore players only make a very small percentage, I'm talking miniscule here, of any mmo's player base.
 
All they've done with this is created a game with  a crap ton of bugs despite 10 years of development and beta testing, extremely poor designs to crafting, loot itemization, and a extreme overuse of RNG.
Riddled with terrible choices from the dev's that are punishing to the vast majority of the players. Now these supposed hardcore players who I'm 98% possitive most don't even understand what whadcore even means, thinks despite being the extreme minority of the player base, that this game is only for them and they alone can carry the game.
 	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Riddled with terrible choices from the dev's 
 
, loot itemization, and a extreme overuse of RNG.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
 
Lastly the community here, my god people talk about the toxic community in league or dota.... they should come here. These forums are like the Mos Eisley Cantina of forums trolls, never have I seen such a wretched hive of scum and villianary  and the plain idioticness of the white knights is simply stunning.
 
----
			
some of these people saying the game is fine and population is not dropping really do need a reality check. posting a twiter picture of a dev saying pr fluff "game is doing fine" as legit proof has to be the bigest joke ive seen yet on here. OF COURSE HE IS GOING TO SAY THAT.
also go take a look at the raid forums even the top guilds and raiders are saying the game is in trouble and major issues need adressing fast or they are going to  lose even their core niche demographic. you know. the one the game was targeted at to begin with.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
they wanted that from the begining but zomg the pergo queue, fix or ragequit people...
----
			
Illium at this hour.
 	
----
			Evindra Exile side is still bustling at 2 in the morning, and my guild is growing.  I'll start to worry when I finally discover what the Commodities Broker looks like in person.	
----
			I haven't logged in for 3 days so I don't know how true this is....	
----
			I was originally on Rowsdower, but recently rerolled on Pergo, because the economy just didn't have the players to support it.  IMO, Carbine did a good thing by expanding when they had to to fix queues, but now they need to contract as populations have smoothed out.  IMO, Pergo and Pago are in a good spot for PvP servers, and they could probably take all the other PvP servers and combine them into two servers.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
People keep attributing opinion as fact.
Wild sensationalism is apparently contagious.
 
I have my opinion that the game is fine, in fact I feel like my realm is getting better, but who knows! Noone does until carbine release figures :)
 
If the game was really in that much danger of low population, I'm pretty sure carbine would be doing something drastic to fix it.
----
			
Bleh – “nope/we’re doing fine” sounds like a PR response to stop the bleeding. I mean seriously it’s not like they’re going to get on Twitter and tell everyone to head for the lifeboats the game is sinking. If populations were fine then there would be population numbers for us probably? Who knows? I hope that in reality if the issue is the server populations being lower than expected they at least have a good handle on why and legitimately expect things to improve.
 
As for me, I’m really enjoying myself with Wildstar. I don’t care if the game is perfect, it feels fresh and it’s fun for me. I like questing. I like finding all the bits of story hidden all over the place. I love the pvp. I love the housing and the costumes and such (customizable mounts!). There’s a ton of stuff I like to do in Wildstar. I really feel for the people that only play games like this to do one specific thing, like “I just pvp” or “I just raid”. I imagine that if you only enjoy one facet of this game then it’s harder to be patient with the normal development process because when whatever that one thing you like to do is altered by a bug/bug’s it must feel like the entire game is broken.
 
That being said, even though I don’t expect population numbers to be released very soon I can’t say that I’m not curious about them. When I play an mmo I devote a lot of hours to it, it ends up being a pretty big personal investment of time. Between school and work and my family I have only so many hours of free time and it’s precious to me. I might reconsider investing as much time into a game that was struggling abnormally and population numbers could be an indicator of just that.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
If the only counter argument that can be made  is "yes people leave after the free month." then you're not paying attention to what is being said in the forums, that or you have the reading comprehension of a potato.
 
It has nothing to do with the free month considering we're nearing the end of the second month, meaning all the people making these post are playing now on subbed time they payed for.
It's all the other issues with the game, and changes being made that are making people leave. I could list them all out here, again but what's the point, if you've read the forums you've seen them already.
 
I like the game, and have fun playing it, but I find it harder and harder for myself to log in. I see it taking the same direction swtor did when it launched and I am not sure I want to give it the benefit of the doubt like I did swtor. Maybe I'm just jaded I don't know..
 
Lastly the community here, my god people talk about the toxic community in league or dota.... they should come here. These forums are like the Mos Eisley Cantina of forums trolls, never have I seen such a wretched hive of scum and villianary  and the plain idioticness of the white knights is simply stunning.
 
My opinion is this, Carbine doomed itself when saying they made a game for hardcores. Hardcore players only make a very small percentage, I'm talking miniscule here, of any mmo's player base.
 
All they've done with this is created a game with  a crap ton of bugs despite 10 years of development and beta testing, extremely poor designs to crafting, loot itemization, and a extreme overuse of RNG.
Riddled with terrible choices from the dev's that are punishing to the vast majority of the players. Now these supposed hardcore players who I'm 98% possitive most don't even understand what whadcore even means, thinks despite being the extreme minority of the player base, that this game is only for them and they alone can carry the game.
 
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Read what you just wrote, compare your complaint about others behavior with your own (especially toward the end of your post), reflect on how criticism of the game is received versus how you, the other guy in this thread, and your dozen or so steady posters are received, notice the difference between hyperbole and concrete suggestions, step away from the computer and get more life experience, and come back when you are ready to contribute to a community.
 
Hint - if you use words like white knight, you're the cause of the toxic community. There are changes I'd like to see made, but if you actually believe the game is as poorly designed as you say it is, why are you wasting time raging about it here? I'd only spend time on something I thought was mostly good and could be improved, so, I don't really understand the mindset.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Actually, mate, white knighting causes lots of projects (not just games) to suffer. When people try to refute reality and say everything is fine, or that things are much better than they really are, it sends a false impression to the creator/developer that leads to the wrong things being worked on. Then, when the white knight encounters people who don't feel the same, they clash, and the creator/developer sees (person who praises them and who they like) vs. (person criticizing them and who they may or may not like). Even if you know it's happening and you're trying to avoid it, people generally favor the person they like in a confrontation like that. This leads to sources of beneficial ideas/criticism being driven away, and large parts of the "potential" that the project had is lost due to white knighting.
 
So saying that people who point that behavior out are the cause of a toxic community, well...that's just wrong.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
You didn't read what I wrote which is about what I would expect. I have criticized the game and posted agreement in some threads that are well written about things I'd like to see changed. What you do gets in the way of valid concerns. You make everything emotional and hyperbolic and then use internet logic on half of a post your responding to. Add in some white knight and other insults and you can get the reactionary reponses you need to feed off of. It does nothing for this game but clearly some people feed off of creating chaotic environments. If you can't figure out why your behavior is toxic (and God knows how that is possible, but its always the case) then there's not a lot I can do for you. And if you really were concerned about changing the devs mind, it won't happen the way you do it. There are gigantic bonfires of threads in the WoW forums about LFR getting sidelined. If people raging on a game company's internet forum amounted to anything, you'd think LFR would get purples again, but alas Blizz hasn't changed their mind.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
If the only counter argument that can be made  is "yes people leave after the free month." then you're not paying attention to what is being said in the forums, that or you have the reading comprehension of a potato.
 
It has nothing to do with the free month considering we're nearing the end of the second month, meaning all the people making these post are playing now on subbed time they payed for.
It's all the other issues with the game, and changes being made that are making people leave. I could list them all out here, again but what's the point, if you've read the forums you've seen them already.
 
I like the game, and have fun playing it, but I find it harder and harder for myself to log in. I see it taking the same direction swtor did when it launched and I am not sure I want to give it the benefit of the doubt like I did swtor. Maybe I'm just jaded I don't know..
 
Lastly the community here, my god people talk about the toxic community in league or dota.... they should come here. These forums are like the Mos Eisley Cantina of forums trolls, never have I seen such a wretched hive of scum and villianary  and the plain idioticness of the white knights is simply stunning.
 
My opinion is this, Carbine doomed itself when saying they made a game for hardcores. Hardcore players only make a very small percentage, I'm talking miniscule here, of any mmo's player base.
 
All they've done with this is created a game with  a crap ton of bugs despite 10 years of development and beta testing, extremely poor designs to crafting, loot itemization, and a extreme overuse of RNG.
Riddled with terrible choices from the dev's that are punishing to the vast majority of the players. Now these supposed hardcore players who I'm 98% possitive most don't even understand what whadcore even means, thinks despite being the extreme minority of the player base, that this game is only for them and they alone can carry the game.
 
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
I think you're forgetting carbine's chief advertising slogan: "This isn't WoW".
----
			Leveling zones are dead on a lot of servers. Hard core guys are doing hard core things and not a lot of people leveling now. A lot of people couldn't even do the first two dungeons and quit. I think it's to be expected in a hard core game like this that there wont be a lot of casual banter in leveling zones. That said, a server consolidation or a zone consolidation might help down the road. If a zones empty, filter people into it from various servers until it is full.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Are you going to copy and paste this in every negative threads on the forum? 
 
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
There are gigantic bonfires of threads in the WoW forums about LFR getting sidelined. If people raging on a game company's internet forum amounted to anything, you'd think LFR would get purples again, but alas Blizz hasn't changed their mind.
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			I don't think the game is failing but I do see a huge population imbalance with Exiles and Dominion. I can see 50 people easily in Thayd. Illium on the other hand, it's really hard to point out 50 people at a given time. I wouldn't mind server merges for those ones that were created after release and before the server expansion. I will still think this game is great...although I shutter at the thought of seeing MORE people at Scorchwing. >.<	
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And yet when I pointed out how carbine says, "This isn't WoW", you say...
 
Hmm. Odd. That was you making the post about WoW forums, right?
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My last sentence was one example among many and not even the main point. You should have read the part where I said this - "and then use internet logic on half the post your responding to", but probably I should have read my own post here - "If you can't figure out why your behavior is toxic there's not a lot I can do for you".
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You mean there's this:
 
 
 
... on this?
 	
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I don't think the game is failing but I do see a huge population imbalance with Exiles and Dominion. I can see 50 people easily in Thayd. Illium on the other hand, it's really hard to point out 50 people at a given time. I wouldn't mind server merges for those ones that were created after release and before the server expansion. I will still think this game is great...although I shutter at the thought of seeing MORE people at Scorchwing. >.<
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However, as some others have pointed out, if they did something drastic, i.e.; server mergers, free transfers, that would be both admitting that they were in trouble and sending out signals to potential-buyers that the game is in trouble. At least, that's the story if it was done so close to launch.
 
I personally feel like it could cut both ways; it might show the game is having a bad start, but it would also show the dev company is willing to act quickly and appropriately to keep the game in good shape. That's all based on supposition though, who knows? The game might actually be okay.
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Cricket? I love Cricket! How cool would a fabkit be for this:	
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