121345-filthy-casual-i-think-not

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I’d like to say that I love Wildstar! The combat in this game is fast and furious, and it only gets better as you keep playing. Unfortunately the original attitude of the DEV team crushed this game into the state it is today. “It’s for the 1%” well how did that work out for you? I think you will continue to find that if your game doesn’t give something back to the 99% then you have no subs and a failed game.  The simple fact is people think they want one thing, large raids (40man), Attunement quests, hardcore only, having to unlock everything in the group finder, no group finder, no easy content, only the best of the best. The truth is and this game proved it is that in the majority players don’t want that. It sounds like a great idea but no one loves the roster boss and no one loves running every new guild member through the world bosses. The combat and play style of this game draws people in and then they hit a wall and leave for either easier or games they already have characters in that they can jump back in and have fun right away.
The new patch gets us going in the right direction but leaves a lot to be desired to bring some casual players back into this game. Let’s not mince words without casual subs this game won’t last. It’s a fact. You create a game for 1% of the players at end game and you lose players. Let’s not delegate causal into only being able to complete simple content like adventures and dailies that won’t keep them around very long. They need content just like the hard core, dungeons and raids. IF they can’t at least sample and enjoy the best content in the game they will leave. No one joins a combat game like Wildstar and says wow I hope I can craft and do dailies for the next six years. A casual player might be that way because of time constraints, or because they just like to play and have fun in a group setting not meticulously count ever stat, every piece of gear, and has to only have one rotation cause it’s the best in the game. I think the fear of the casual is that the hardest content in the game will get dummied down. I don’t think that should ever happen. What I do think should happens is that there is more than one option for that content. Let’s call it Story and Hard Mode.
 
After I decided to make a class switch in Wildstar I grew extremely frustrated with the attunement process having to do it again was something that made me think it probably just wasn’t worth it and I would be stuck playing a character I didn’t have as much fun on, or I would be forced into the endless world boss hunt with our new limited player base. It really turned me away from the game so I went back to playing SWTOR with my old guild that didn’t make in Wildstar. I couldn’t enjoy the combat in SWTOR anymore Wildstar has ruined it me. The moving, dodging, interrupting, action set based combat is just too good. Looking at SWTOR again though I did notice that they offer their content in a variety of ways. They have flash points, which would be like Wildstars Dungeons, or adventures. Then they offer raid content in three categories SM, HM, NM. Story, Hard, Nightmare. The first two you can access via the group finder, nightmare requires a premade. Each one has a separate lockout and offers a different level or grade of gear. No Welfare epics, if you want the best gear in the game you need a dedicated guild and you have to work together. If you are a little less dedicated but still love raiding you have options.
 
For the health of the game I hope the Dev’s can do a few things I know it would help increase Wildstars chances of success.
 
1.       Embrace the Casual they are your bank roll. Don’t alter the hardest content in the game you need something that every player strives for.
 
2.       Scrap the attunement quest.
 
3.       Maybe make a training raid at 50. 10 or 20 players just to get people use to the content.
 
4.       You won’t need a training raid if you implement a Story version of the raids. One that is still hard but maybe more on the level of dungeons but with more people. A couple ways you could do this. For the raids that are out now, you could just reduce some HP, and maybe the damage done from some of the abilities. For new ones you could leave a mechanic out and then add it in HM so that players doing both cane see the difference, al HM would have increased HP and damage.  Gear from these new raids would be on par with say dungeon gear or maybe reduced version of GA. You would have to do the HM version for the best gear in the game.
 
5.       Add story mode raids to the group finder. Got ten people awesome, now you need ten more and don’t have to spam for a day and half.
 
6.       Make all the world bosses level 50 offer a weekly quest for a certain amount of kills, and give them some decent loot. There aren’t enough low level players to have world bosses that are not at end game.
 
7.       Less pointless trash in the raids. They are long the boss fights are challenging and the trash is a waste of time, it drops nothing of value and respawns if you come back the next night. Either that or make it so trash doesn’t respawn after you kill a mini boss or an actual boss. Keep the trash in place only on the way to the next boss.
 
8.       Maybe a raid that doesn’t take quite as long, or get rid of pointless egg hallways. Yes it’s funny to see your friends die the first few times it’s not as funny when you have 20 minutes left in afraid and can’t get everyone through the room.
 
I know my view on the situation will probably be flamed into oblivion but I hope at some point on of the DEV’s takes a look. This game is great it just needs more people to make it come alive again. I joined Wildstar for the first time with my guild Grievance Gaming they had about 250 people on the Exile side and about 80 on the Dominion side. Now they have less than twenty people in Wildstar. They are a more casual guild but they have plenty of great players that and an even better community. Sadly this games attunement and raids process nearly wiped their presence from Wildstar. I imagine there are more guilds out there that suffered the same fate. Let’s bring some people back to this game with the addition of end game content for a slightly wider player base while still offering the hardest content in the game for those that love it. I hope the DEV’s are listening!
 	
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			Some of these issues you seem to have might be addressed in the new update. 	
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irrelevant  post is irrelevant.
This discussion is old and long over, and it already has been confirmed numerous times that the game will change.	
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			I don't raid, I don't plan to raid, I'm slowly working on the attunement just because, so I don't even think I should be trying to tell Carbine their raid/set up to raid is wrong.  I'm uber-casual, predominantly solo player.  I don't think I'm being ignored because "HARDCORE!"(I saw that a whole thing as a tongue in cheek poke at the whole issue, and not them trying to say that's what their whole game is going to be, just maybe the raiding aspect, which again since I'm probably not ever gonna raid, /shrug).  Drop 4 is coming out with a bunch of stuff that is very appealing to me, can't wait :D	
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Okay just gonna play devil's advocate here but...aren't veteran dungeons already basically training raids?
 
The first time you do these you won't have GA gear or DS gear so high leveled gear won't be your crutch, you basically have to know your fights and know your rotation and be aware no tunnel vision...etc. Things you will need in a raid.
Nowadays you have people farming dungeons or even carrying people through dungeons but that wasn't really possible last year in a PUG.
 
What I see now is people who failed to defeat SSM go on to raiding, or people who got carried through dungeons as they died every boss fight. 
They go on to raid...and well if you get picked up by a 5/6 GA guild the baddie isn't really noticed as the higher geared players can pick up the dead weigh, but if this type of player joins a new guild that is just starting raiding (where no one has GA gear or DS gear) this type of player holds the group back. Every boss fight you know this guy is going down 3 mins in, and he had to stun Kuralaks egg on phase 4 so there goes the inevitable wipe.	
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Okay just gonna play devil's advocate here but...aren't veteran dungeons already basically training raids?
 
The first time you do these you won't have GA gear or DS gear so high leveled gear won't be your crutch, you basically have to know your fights and know your rotation and be aware no tunnel vision...etc. Things you will need in a raid.
Nowadays you have people farming dungeons or even carrying people through dungeons but that wasn't really possible last year in a PUG.
 
What I see now is people who failed to defeat SSM go on to raiding, or people who got carried through dungeons as they died every boss fight. 
They go on to raid...and well if you get picked up by a 5/6 GA guild the baddie isn't really noticed as the higher geared players can pick up the dead weigh, but if this type of player joins a new guild that is just starting raiding (where no one has GA gear or DS gear) this type of player holds the group back. Every boss fight you know this guy is going down 3 mins in, and he had to stun Kuralaks egg on phase 4 so there goes the inevitable wipe.
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Disagree completely, Carbine IS making the game more accessible, but the raiding is there for the people who WORK AT IT. When you work at the raiding you feel accomplished, when you add "Story Modes" (COUGH LFR) It completely removes incentive to hardcore progress through the content. Casuals don't nead *cupcake*ing lfr to be happy. Ever sense WoW added that stupid system people like to think that it's been around forever, Casuals were more than happy in WOTLK, and Casuals were happy in BC, Now with 4 adventures, 8 shiphands, and 4 dungeons, casual players have plenty of content to do, also, 1 more dungeon coming in about a week, and 1 more adventure in drop 5, combine this with housing, dailies, 20 man events, world bosses, omnicore. Casuals have way more content in Wildstar then they do in WoD at the moment, all they have is LFR highmaul.
 
As for scrapping the attunement, It shouldn' leave the game but what they should do is revamp it. Attunement: 1.) hit 50, 2.) buy key, 3.) Do all Adventures/Dungeons. Datascape: 1.) Kill Ohmna.
 
I have submitted the idea of 10 man lfg instances called incursions, they would be on the same level of vet dungeons, and offer similar gear, but it would simple be an alternative from of gearing up for raids.	
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I totally disagree with your point Gorenkillchua I'm not asking carbine to get rid of hard content the makes you feel "epic" that you "have to work for" I'm asking them to add additional content for large groups and guilds that can be completed without having to dedicate a huge chunk of your life to it. The problem is anytime anyone says something like that people get all up in arms about dedication and having to work for it, I already have a job, I already work hard, and all I want is to be able to enjoy my time gaming without silly barriers.Trust me when I tell you there is a small percent of casuals that will be happy with a few adventures and a dungeon, but being casual doesn't mean you don't want to raid, it just means your not willing to dedicate your life to it. 
 
I do applaud Carbine for moving in the right direction with this game and I hope they keep it up, but I'd like to see more. There is no reason this game can't be more successful than any MMO out there it just needs to get out of it's own way. 
 
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Yeah the OPs suggestions would completely ruin this games core vision.
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This I agree with! Being carried through attunement isn't good for anyone not to mention it's boring for the people to keep doing it. I also agree everyone knows the people that die right away, raid groups are normally keeping their eyes out for replacement so of those players. If you can't handle it then you should get replaced. What if you had content that was a little easier that person could be a part of, and maybe after doing that for awhile could jump in and help in a top tier raid having learned the mechanics in a slightly easier version while earning Dungeon or slightly above dungeon level gear. Wouldn't that be nice :-)
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I stopped reading the OP at Story Mode...I can't help but get frustrated by these posts calling for easier raid content.  I've written and deleted this post a half a dozen times trying not to flame too hard. In the end, I'm just not going to say much.
 
If you feel your play-style is underrepresented, ask the developers for more NEW content you can experience in the future; If I'm not mistaken, much of drop 4 is in response to that very call.  Every 'type' of player deserves a piece of cake that has been developed for them; wither it be for Crafters, Questers, Pvp-ers, Roleplayers, Housing experts, and so on.  
 
I understand ...modern gamer mentality can be boiled down to: I bought the game, so lay everything you have out in front of me...for free...and make it quick...and easy...cause I got *Cupcakes* to do...Now!....Eh, I don't like it...Burn in Hell...Dead Game is Dead. and so forth. But there's no need to take the piece of cake raiders have been nibbling on for 6 months, enjoying, and mainly encouraging others to try it, and then smash it down into paste for everyone to consume.  And I say paste deliberately, because at that point you wont even need to chew.
 
~Lord Rhodrick
 
P.S. Drops Mic 	
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7.       Less pointless trash in the raids. They are long the boss fights are challenging and the trash is a waste of time, it drops nothing of value and respawns if you come back the next night. Either that or make it so trash doesn’t respawn after you kill a mini boss or an actual boss. Keep the trash in place only on the way to the next boss.
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Go play the PTR, Drop 4 is great for the dirty casual who spends most of their time solo like me!
They have toned down attunement already and they may do more? Guessing what your really asking for is LFR type content.  	
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I totally disagree with your point Gorenkillchua I'm not asking carbine to get rid of hard content the makes you feel "epic" that you "have to work for" I'm asking them to add additional content for large groups and guilds that can be completed without having to dedicate a huge chunk of your life to it. The problem is anytime anyone says something like that people get all up in arms about dedication and having to work for it, I already have a job, I already work hard, and all I want is to be able to enjoy my time gaming without silly barriers.Trust me when I tell you there is a small percent of casuals that will be happy with a few adventures and a dungeon, but being casual doesn't mean you don't want to raid, it just means your not willing to dedicate your life to it. 
 
I do applaud Carbine for moving in the right direction with this game and I hope they keep it up, but I'd like to see more. There is no reason this game can't be more successful than any MMO out there it just needs to get out of it's own way. 
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Go play the PTR, Drop 4 is great for the dirty casual who spends most of their time solo like me!
They have toned down attunement already and they may do more? Guessing what your really asking for is LFR type content.  
 
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I have unsubbed and resubbed twice already, and just like you OP I love this game and its unique combat system, but at the same time there are issues and limitations I can not bear!
Carbine has already said that they were working on making content for everyone, and some of the issues I address below are already on their agenda. Let's see how that turns out. But acknowledging a problem and working on solutions is a step in the right direction.
 
Here's what I have already said in a previous post.
 
1. Remove tiers and different gears in PvP, everyone should be geared the same way so that skill is promoted and new players don't get crushed as soon as they set foot in instanced PvP. 
    Millions of players enjoy PvP games (DOTA, LoL, GW2, TF2, FPS etc.), but all these games have one thing in commun : same gear for all, skill-based, cosmestic rewards at best. 
 
2. Support and encourage re-rolling (everything should be account-wide, from dyes to mounts, from currencies to reputations). By making it easier on rerolls, you will actually keep players playing more and longer.
 
3. Implement LFR and flexible raids. Make raids and dungeons accessible, no welfare epics but different rewards according to the difficulty chosen by the players. Players who choose the highest difficulty need a solid guild and get the best loot, there's no debating it. Something for everyone, I don't see what's wrong with that. Many other MMOs have already chosen this path, there's gotta be a reason.
 
4. Endgame feels like a sweatshop. Be creative with daily/ weekly rewarding missions that require a bit of everything (going back to lower level zones, dungeons, adventures, BGs, boss killing, challenges...).	
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I stopped reading the OP at Story Mode...I can't help but get frustrated by these posts calling for easier raid content. I've written and deleted this post a half a dozen times trying not to flame too hard. In the end, I'm just not going to say much.
 
If you feel your play-style is underrepresented, ask the developers for more NEW content you can experience in the future; If I'm not mistaken, much of drop 4 is in response to that very call. Every 'type' of player deserves a piece of cake that has been developed for them; wither it be for Crafters, Questers, Pvp-ers, Roleplayers, Housing experts, and so on. 
 
I understand ...modern gamer mentality can be boiled down to: I bought the game, so lay everything you have out in front of me...for free...and make it quick...and easy...cause I got *Cupcakes* to do...Now!....Eh, I don't like it...Burn in Hell...Dead Game is Dead. and so forth. But there's no need to take the piece of cake raiders have been nibbling on for 6 months, enjoying, and mainly encouraging others to try it, and then smash it down into paste for everyone to consume. And I say paste deliberately, because at that point you wont even need to chew.
 
~Lord Rhodrick
 
P.S. Drops Mic
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*Pics up Mic*
 
Your acting like its only gear were after, and its not.  I'm after exclusivity to put it bluntly.  I want to exclusively say that I've killed Ohmna, That I've achieved that level of coordination with 19 other people and completed that objective.  Putting in multiple tiers is simply re-using content for the sake of re-using content and taking what was already established and manipulating it in some way.
 
Your missing the point. In other games it IS all about the gear...CAUSE THAT'S ALL THERE IS.  I quit Wow because I was forced to raid the same raid instance twice 10 and 25...then three times with the introduction of LFR...The same damn thing! Wildstar doesn't have that problem...and I pray the developers never make that mistake.  
 
I understand exclusive content may be scary to you, and you may not have 19 other friends to raid with or be able to raid all the time, but that doesn't mean the developers have to hand it to you on a silver platter either.  There are more people than ever raiding GA, there is even a PuG running GA weekly and getting close to clearing it if they haven't already, the content is accessible.   
 
~Lord Rhodrick
 
P.S.  I try not to get too overheated with these posts, and it seems I'm redlining already.  I'll say again, if you feel your play style is underrepresented ask the developers for NEW content that can fit your needs.  A new 10 man raid isn't that out of pocket as making two versions of an already established raid. The developers have a whole universe and multiple years to expand this already great game.  See you on Nexus.
 
P.P.S.  *Throws down Mic*
 
P.P.P.S  *Drops to Knees, Douses Mic in lighter fluid, casts Ignite*
 
P.P.P.P.S.  *Throws up double Bullhorns*	
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Yeah I feel youbbates024, I know exactly what you mean. 
 
I'm not afraid of speaking out because just like you I'm not asking to dumb down the content for hardcore raiders, I'm not asking to get their shinies without a sweat, I think it's great for those guys to be able to challenge those difficult raids and they should be rewarded accordingly. I've been there, I know how it feels. All I'm asking for is different levels of difficulty and more flexibility, lower requirements/ difficulty and lower quality loot as a reward of course, so that everyone gets to enjoy all the content and still get a sense of character improvement.
 
And yet people like Rhodrick still manage to read half way through and refuse to even let us get some crumbles of a raid as he puts it so elegantly.. How nice and considerate. Exclusivity... you still get exclusivity Rhodrick when you beat the hardest raid on the hardest difficulty level and get the highest rewards. Nothing can take that away from you! No offense but I just can't  understand that hardcore mentality, that desire to feel so singled out... it's a freaking game, you're not climbing the social ladder here for God's sake, let everyone enjoy what the game has to offer, that seems more inclusive and sensible to me.
 
The only point we seem to agree on Rhodrick is 10 man raids. That could be a great idea and a good compromise for casual players, and then you could have your exclusive raids for like-minded people who don't like mingling and sharing with the plebs like us! Though developing different raids in parellel would most likely require more resources and time than just adapting a raid to different difficulty levels. 	
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yeah no, this ain't wow.
 
Casuals are doing just fine in the raids here.
Some guilds take longer then others in clearing all content, but it's doable.
So thanks, but please keep it as is.	
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That could be true but this games core vision already ruined it. We have seen 40 mans turned into 20, and the attunement process change, as well as the group finder not having to be unlocked. The original version of this game failed, and sad to say it's still in a rocky place, but it can be great. I don't want the hardest content in the game changed at all. I'm playing it right now and it's awesome. The problem is it's not enough to keep people coming back, we need casual players, we need people that don't raid 5 nights a week, we need people to be able to access content and have fun. 
 
Do you remember when this game came out and everyone was super excited about it. I remember that and I think Wildstar could bring a ton of people back with a few changes. If you are working on the hardest content in the game nothing would change for you accept maybe you find a nice way to get people into raiding a story version and you can see how they handle it and bring them into your main group. 
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I have unsubbed and resubbed twice already, and just like you OP I love this game and its unique combat system, but at the same time there are issues and limitations I can not bear!
Carbine has already said that they were working on making content for everyone, and some of the issues I address below are already on their agenda. Let's see how that turns out. But acknowledging a problem and working on solutions is a step in the right direction.
 
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I totally disagree with your point Gorenkillchua I'm not asking carbine to get rid of hard content the makes you feel "epic" that you "have to work for" I'm asking them to add additional content for large groups and guilds that can be completed without having to dedicate a huge chunk of your life to it. The problem is anytime anyone says something like that people get all up in arms about dedication and having to work for it, I already have a job, I already work hard, and all I want is to be able to enjoy my time gaming without silly barriers.Trust me when I tell you there is a small percent of casuals that will be happy with a few adventures and a dungeon, but being casual doesn't mean you don't want to raid, it just means your not willing to dedicate your life to it.
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there's my problem, the idea that you can't even get 3 hours every couple days to play (you don't even have to show up every day). How is this a huge chunk of your life, why even play games if you can't play for a few hours every few days? Hell, a lot of GA raiders only spend 4 hours raiding a week inside GA.
 
So no I don't think the game is something that requires you dedicate your life to it and attunement itself basically has one nuisance that needs removed or halved and that's WBs. The rest can be done with leisure in under 2 hours mostly.
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To those of you who feel the game is too taxing because you just want to relax when you play a game: I think games, in general, are not for you. I can't think of a single game where the base purpose isn't to put you in a stressful situation, in one form or another, and make you work your way out of that situation using the given set of tools. This applies to video games, card games, board games... you name it. So, if you're playing to relax; you're doing it wrong.
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I'm in favor of making casual content, especially pre 50 dungeons so they are easy enough to be 1 or 2 shotted first time through in less than an hour.
 
But the difficulty at veteran level is fine and now noobies have Vet Shiphands, vet adventures, then vet dungeons. With the itemization improvement, things will get a lot easier over time	
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You could not be more wrong Been playing for 30+ years now, from boardgames to roleplaying games, from Games Workshop wargames to video games as early as 82.
Always played, always will, born gamer! I enjoy playing games because they are relaxing after work as they take my mind off the day, especially if they are challenging as they require to focus on something different and fun.
 
That's not relaxing, it's shifting your focus to something more entertaining. Games force us to remain alert and aware, which is a direct contridiction of being relaxed. By the way, I'm an old school gamer, too. The 'Old Man' in my name holds some truth. That being said, how much credibility does age really bring to this argument? 
 
So I do play games to relax and for the entertainment, and I don't find them taxing because they offer a challenge, nowadays I find them taxing when they are too time-consuming and feel like a second job. Not everyone can raid several nights a week for hours in a row you know. why even bother with a game that you know you don't have time for? You are the reason you feel like you're working, Carbine is not forcing you to play. Now don't get me wrong, I'm a certainly not saying because I can't raid like that any more other people can't either, that would be f* absurd to say. All I'm saying is modern MMOS should find some room to accomodate with players like me who do not have as much time as before but who would still love to take part in some raids from time to time in memory of the good days of yore. Pretty sure there are tons of players around my age who feel the same. Yup! I'm one of them! Which is why I took the time to find a game that had what I wanted rather than sticking with a game I didn't want and demand they change it. But hinestly, how do you please everyone? It can't be done, so I think your expectations are a bit high. There should be something for everyone, the MMO that shall not be named has been pretty succesful at that! You're kidding, right? If WoW has proven anything at all, it's that it's not for everyone, and if it is for you, it won't be for long. The simple.proof is in us being here rather than there. Good thing the devs are listening though, because they have ackowledged the problem and are now moving the game in the right direction, embracing and catering for all playstyles and making their game less grindy and more rewarding. 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
·		 "We will encourage and listen carefully to your – the player’s – feedback and focus development on making WildStar a more fun, less grindy, game."
·		 "We will make these updates with both present and future players in mind, to support a multitude of play styles, durations, group sizes and levels."
·		 "We will invest in, enhance, and grow this game."
Source: http://www.wildstar-online.com/en/news/2015-01-15-wildstars-big-plans-for-2015/ 
This does not translate into, "Attunement, rep, etc... are going away." Don't read too far into dev posts, they're usually very picky about the words they use so they are being understood as best they can. There's generally not a whole lot hidden meaning in dev posts, aside from the occasional joke... that's marketing's job.
 
EDIT
 
Come to think of it, this pretty much did come from marketing, so I'd put even less stock in that statement.
 
I'm really glad NCSoft is not shutting this game down, it would be such a waste and a shame! Wildstar has such a great potential and the combat mechanics are beyond fun! I really hope it will continue to grow and attract some old and new players alike. But that can't be done without some real changes. It's a theme park, and as such it must have something for everyone.
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I think the misconception is that you can't add more to a game to draw more players in without hurting the people that are having fun now. I like raiding in GA and due to my schedule I'm an alternate but have been in on every kill accept Ohmna. The raids are fun and challenging but their are people that need something less and like to have that option, some weeks I would love to have that option. I could still get in put in a night or two of a couple hours feel like I worked with a group to accomplish a goal and come back next week ready to compete again in a harder raid that takes more time. Simple fact is we need more people on in this game we have one server and it's a ghost town. We need to find a way to get subs in and adding some kind of large group content through the LFG tool is one way to do it. It's not the only way but it might be the fastest way to get people playing this wonderful game again.We need people playing and leveling alts and not forcing them to jump through hoops to get those characters into end game content. I never want to hear people saying I don't want to make an alt it's to tough when I hit 50 before I can do anything. 
 
The Atunement quest is a whole different issue but I find it complete waste of time. Maybe it could be a one time thing or account wide but bring alts through it is a barrier I don't want to always be facing. Anything that keeps people out of content is something that can kill a game. Attunement is also baring content from new players. 
 
I can't wait to see what is in store for this year I am hoping for great things in this game but all of that comes with bringing players back. 	
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" Don't read too far into dev posts, they're usually very picky about the words they use so they are being understood as best they can. There's generally not a whole lot hidden meaning in dev posts, aside from the occasional joke... that's marketing's job.
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Funny little fact here that people keep forgetting.
You can make hardcore content for solo and small group players.
You can make hardcore Soloist and 3 player mods.
 
Hardcore=/=lots of people	
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			Wildstar is like that high school teacher that gives you a ton of easy homework every night, because they think that makes the class hard, when it really just makes it tedious and pointless.	
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			Always agree with making the game WITH MORE casual content AND at the same time keeping the hardcore stuff. 	
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Funny little fact here that people keep forgetting.
You can make hardcore content for solo and small group players.
You can make hardcore Soloist and 3 player mods.
 
Hardcore=/=lots of people
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The raids are fun and challenging but their are people that need something less and like to have that option, some weeks I would love to have that option. I could still get in put in a night or two of a couple hours feel like I worked with a group to accomplish a goal and come back next week ready to compete again in a harder raid that takes more time.
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			the thing is and I m not saying make any thing easier is but we need bigger pop. So at some point I see them doing what a lot of the others mmos did and make it where u can see them. Its not about hardness! Most act like o they are making easier. Well most games have vet and normal easy mode. Like was said they need a mode for people that don't have the 3 plus hours a night to raid but want to see the story in there. I don't care about the gear or being the best or what not. I want the story I paid for the game I pay 15 o month so I don't see y any one care's what I do as long as it not making me better then them. I say make a one play mode of it that u are in a npc group. You guy now if they just keep making raids and more of this hard stuff and not get more people in the game will close. When x is more then b is making then x must be shut down. If there idea about all the raids and what not where so great why did so many leave? You should ask your self. don't make it weir if u play games for story and solo that u cant even hear it all with out being into raids! I mean look at it this way u buy a book well you get to the last 10 pages now u need to find 20 people that have the same book to unlock it to finish the store. So a lot of people left for not making it to the raids so if they have a way to see it and NOT GET THE GEAR witch is what people are missing the point of it should not mater what they are doing. More would stay the raid groups will still get all there stuff new people will see the store and more will be in the game. PS Its also not about HARDNES its about how much time some people have to play. If the people don't feel like if they only play 1-2 hours a day and cant see all the stuff in the game then they just leave. Which is not good for any of use I m attuned so I can raid but for the new people and some old people this is a problem that they need to work on more and I m sure they will at some point!	
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Holy **** dude, use some paragraphs.
 
Also what story do you want to see? The raids have no story, Carbine separated story from raids for a reason. If you want to see the story go do the Drusera instances, do the Omnicore etc. There's not a single piece of story to be found in GA or Datascape.
 
Also just because you pay a sub doesn't mean you should be granted access to everything. Paying a sub gives you the chance to see everything, however you have to take that opportunity. Paying 15$ does not entitle you to have everything thrown at you.	
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			the story of datascape is in the omnicore 1 already, and the next omnicores will have the story about the others that will come. and all the history of GA its in blighthaven, defile and the attunement quest chain (the relation between drusera and ohmna)	
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TL;DR, Support casual players. No LFR; more Dungeons instead!
 
1. Absolutely embrace the casual player, make them feel at home and give them things to do, without borking the harder endgame. Veteran shiphands. Also give some meaningful reward to max level players who queue for normal dungeons - they're a fantastic difficulty for casual players (But low enough that if you can do veteran dungeons you're better off).
 
2. I definitely think alts shouldn't have to do the whole attunement quest (dungeons/adventures would be fine).
 
3. Augmentors 20. Easier than GA (without doom switch), probably attunement free (or super light attunement - if it can be knocked out in two hours it's fine). Also, SSM Veteran. It's a dungeon, but it's a 5 man raid. Ultimate Protogames is probably the same.
 
4. There isn't enough story in the raids to justify it, and having multiple difficulties of the same content is something carbine has specifically mentioned they will not do. Instead of creating a new branch of content (training raids) just give us more dungeons. Wildstar dungeons are incredible, and creating more of them is where that effort should be going - more dungeons with lengths like STL/KV but easier/harder.
 
5. Absolutely not. Queue systems are terrible for making groups that need to coordinate. You get much better, more reasonable, cooperative groups from an old fashioned PUG than a queue system. The game doesn't have the population to support a raid group finder. Having a group of 10 at the entrance, and a few people poking around the Defile/Thayd/Dailies zone chats and /lfg should be enough to scrounge together the extra players needed for a puggable easy/short raid.
 
6. The world bosses don't need to be buffed to level 50. They die as slow as if they already are, and increasing their damage would probably be a huge exercise in frustration. The weekly quest is a GREAT idea that I highly endorse. Decent loot (some gold, EGs, boosts, food, cosmetics, glory/prestige) is also a great idea [Everybody involved in the kill gets a World Boss Loot Bag. There are 2 versions: A level 50, and a level sub-50].
 
7. The trash is sometimes a little much. If they aim for 3-4 trash packs between each mini/event/boss it should be fine (sometimes it's closer to 8 packs). Stalker/slinger scientists make this not a problem.
 
8. Augmentors 20. Also Scientists. Not a problem.
 
LFR has essentially made dungeons a tiny stepping stone for WoW. As a design choice, an MMO should pick one or the other. I pick Wildstar's fantastic dungeons over watered down, sleep-inducing, sociopathic, uncoordinated snorefests that queue-able raids are required to be in order to function.	
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1. And what is going to prevent this new community from whining till there's no tommorrow, that they cannot access the harder content?
 
 
2. I can agree with this.
 
 
3. 2 hours for a raid? Where's the run in that. And yes SSM Veteran is harder then most dungeons, but it's a damn good preparation for raids.
 
 
4. Did you actually read your quest lines? There's a whole story line leading up the Genetic Archives and the Datascape
 
 
5. I'm not really fussed about LFG systems, granted they work properly
 
 
6. Worldbosses are scaled. Fight them at the appropiate level or not makes no difference, the damage, HP and complexity scales
 
 
7. Trash can be cleared really fast. Just depends how you approach it. A small barrier to prevent you from just killing one boss after another is fine.
 
 
8. dunno
 
 
 
I really don't want to see a LFR here.
There's a reason these dungeons and raids require coordination. They're group content, and challenging at that.
If you're not interested in doing group content, then you should not be whining about the attunement in the fist place, nor about the difficulty or complexity.
 
 
((and no colours cause internet is half borked, preventin the JS from loading....))	
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Still a bit baffled at the complaints towards attunement being "long and hard" after they made it easier. Only thing in the attunement that should be removed / lowered / should make more sense is the world bosses part, it's just annoying without any reason. You just hit buttons for 5 minutes until they die, standing in all AOE without even needing heals for most of them.
 
Last weekend we helped a new guildie who had completed veteran adventure step (something anyone can do with LFG) and had completed one dungeon and killed one world boss. 5-ish hours later he was fully attuned and ready to join GA. Did it  require the whole guild? No, just 4 members running all dungeons and asking in thayd for people to help with world bosses, hellrose and R-12. 5 hours in one day might be a lot but not that much if you split it into a week, less than hour per day. 
 
If this is still too hard and long for you... I can only say that this isn't the instant satisfaction game you're looking for.
 
And like many others already said, running dungeons usually gives you kinda good idea how to play this game. If you're doing well in veteran dungeons, you'll also do well in GA (after learning how the fights work). I was partly sad for the removal of the silver screening because it was an important step teaching players about Consistency. Every dungeon has plenty of time for a silver if you're able to reproduce the fights consistently and without many wipes. Not sure if there's a dire need for a "story raid" before GA if you've actually spent some time focusing on Don't-stand-on-red and react-in-time while doing dungeons.	
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			I agree that WS needs to do SOMETHING for casuals. Right now there's literally nothing. Stl and KV is pushing it for what is an acceptable difficulty for dungeons for casuals, SC and SSM are completely out of the question. I think their plan is to retain raid content as is, but provide other things to keep casuals busy. They've commented on this on their dev talks and it looks like they're focusing ship hands, adventures, world bosses, public events for these players. 	
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Not sure about the word use of casual sometimes, casual does not mean you are bad at the game you know ;)
 
With drop 4 there should be quite a bit more to do for those we don't have the time to raid.	
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Not sure about the word use of casual sometimes, casual does not mean you are bad at the game you know ;)
 
With drop 4 there should be quite a bit more to do for those we don't have the time to raid.
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 I mean, I still don't know what to call myself.  I'm on every single day for hours every day spending my time not being hardcore.  So am I hardcore because of how much time I spend in the game, casual because I don't even run vets that often, or hardcore because I can actually complete a vet?  I still don't know.
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I'm generally logging on two nights a week to play, four hours each night, on a schedule.
 
I don't think that's hardcore. People invest more scheduled time in sports leagues.	
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I'm generally logging on two nights a week to play, four hours each night, on a schedule.
 
I don't think that's hardcore. People invest more scheduled time in sports leagues.
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Cascore?  Hardual?  Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious?   (and I'm not too proud to admit I Googled that :D )
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Cascore?  Hardual?  Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious?   (and I'm not too proud to admit I Googled that :D )
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I like hardual.  :D
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			I think I'll just settle for caling Vic weird....	
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{| class="blockquote"
I think I'll just settle for caling Vic weird....
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			Dinner....not your washing then  :)	
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Dinner....not your washing then  :)
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