135405-solo-play

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Why is it that tanks and healers are punished so much in this game that it is compulsory to have a dps spec to be viable in all formats especially solo play?
 
You want to pull all 4 packs of mobs and kill them all together ...aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaang nope 5 target cap
Can you survive ?Yes , would it save time ? No
 
Shiphands shiphands shiphands oh i am sorry expeditions !!!!!!!!!You do it so smoothly as a dps, effortless getting gold by the time you finished , the tank is at the first boss having half hp remaining and the healer just says FU!!!!!!
Can they survive?Yes so can the dps, will they save time ??nope , better go dps -_-
 
The only good thing i could come with to play a tank would be to solo group quests, which should not be soloed hence the word "Group" quests even that takes too long with me pranting at the chat dps welcomed help kill :)	
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Tanks and Healers are also DPS's. Actually, if we think about it everyone is tank or healer too.
 
Tank and Healing is called Support in Wildstar for a reason ;)	
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all classes have a dps role and a support role
 
shiphands, AKA  expeditions were done to be soloable, and slighty difficult as group so a tank/healer isnt that very much needed on those if you know what you´re doing
 
however try doing a dungeon without a tank or healer and you wont make it pass the first trash wave
			
				
	Edited October 2, 2015 by Tora Skywing	
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but DPS/Support Hybrid has been the best viable solo mechanic in graphical online gaming since The Realm Online... 
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			Correct me if I'm wrong, but DPS has been the best viable solo mechanic in graphical online gaming since The Realm Online... 	
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			If I recall, isn't that why they gave us multiple roles for us to dump our points into?	
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If I recall, isn't that why they gave us multiple roles for us to dump our points into?
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all classes have a dps role and a support role
 
shiphands, AKA  expeditions were done to be soloable, and slighty difficult as group so a tank/healer isnt that very much needed on those if you know what you´re doing
 
however try doing a dungeon without a tank or healer and you wont make it pass the first trash wave
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			They give us quite a bit of bag space at a faster rate than most MMOs do.  Sure, the bags aren't amazingly huge or anything but all of the tradeskill items go into a tradeskill bag and everything else goes in your primary bag.  You've got more than enough bag space, I promise you :)	
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			Okay, that's all very well and good, but why aren't DPS roles as good at tanking or healing?  Every time I group up with people in my DPS spec and gear as a healer, everyone dies.  It's not fair!	
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			You don't need two sets of gear to solo... Just swap ability sets. You won't kill things very fast but you can absolutely solo with DPS abilities in tank / healer gear
			
				
	Edited October 2, 2015 by Nazryn	
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Okay, that's all very well and good, but why aren't DPS roles as good at tanking or healing?  Every time I group up with people in my DPS spec and gear as a healer, everyone dies.  It's not fair!
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You can mix gear to get a more balanced Assault Power / Support Power ratio. More Support Power will increase the effectiveness of your heals or tanking abilities. For tanks it's mainly threat and the damage output on abilities though. So a hybrid build is not impossible while leveling and then fine tune it when you hit 50 and wish to focus more into a specific role within group content.
 
But apart from that. The current roles do have their use, but not to kill things. If the idea is to kill stuff, then a Damage Dealer or "DPS" is what's needed. Sorry to say, gotta do it if you want to do it efficient. If you want to mitigate damage and handle a load of damage or avoid someone else take damage, the tank is there. To survive a lot of damage or missteps and regenerate health, your healer steps in. It's the "Holy Trinity" within games and MMO's.
 
But a short recap. Assault Power increase your Assault abilities, while Support Power increase the output of your Support abilities, wither that be Tanking threat/damage or heals.	
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You can mix gear to get a more balanced Assault Power / Support Power ratio. More Support Power will increase the effectiveness of your heals or tanking abilities. For tanks it's mainly threat and the damage output on abilities though. So a hybrid build is not impossible while leveling and then fine tune it when you hit 50 and wish to focus more into a specific role within group content.
 
But apart from that. The current roles do have their use, but not to kill things. If the idea is to kill stuff, then a Damage Dealer or "DPS" is what's needed. Sorry to say, gotta do it if you want to do it efficient. If you want to mitigate damage and handle a load of damage or avoid someone else take damage, the tank is there. To survive a lot of damage or missteps and regenerate health, your healer steps in. It's the "Holy Trinity" within games and MMO's.
 
But a short recap. Assault Power increase your Assault abilities, while Support Power increase the output of your Support abilities, wither that be Tanking threat/damage or heals.
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			tanking?  healing?  What the hell are those things you speak of?  I hit things and they die.  If you mean that squishy thing behind me making my health bar go up then I know.  Otherwise, stop making things up.	
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I personally feel this is a great question.  But not so much as why can't a solo Tank or Heal spec deal with basic mobs as well as DD (damage dealer) but rather why can't in most games (Wildstar falls into this category), and from what I can tell, a Heal and Tank (duo) take care of mobs as well if not better than two DD taking on the same mobs (in the same amount of time if not faster)?  Generally speaking in most MMO's the only advantage of playing a Tank or Heal is in large groups (4+) while DD always outshines all other content.  This not only makes little sense but also discourages those that want to play those specs (tank/heal) from doing so because while they are questing (solo content) they are actually at a disadvantage compared to the DD specs (and thus accepting anything other than the DD reward items means you aren't gaining as much from questing as your DD counterpart).
 
I would never suggest that a solo Tank or Heal do as much DPS has a your average DD but certainly the desire to play a role shouldn't be discouraged simply because you wish to play the game the way you want to should it?  If the "Holy Trinity" is the way MMO's are supposed to played (and even GW2 has conceded the fact that it's damn difficult not to) then it's about time that all AAA MMO's get it right by actually encouraging the various roles to excel in both solo, duo and group content.  And stating that a Tank or Heal spec has an easier time dealing with a solo encounter vs the DD matters little if the DD still has no issue taking down said encounter faster and without dying as a result, in the same level gear no less.  Otherwise we will certainly always be faced with the dreaded LFG (Looking For Group) system that currently exists in which DD on average are waiting stupid amounts of time in comparison to their counterparts while the same can be said for Tank/Heal roles is anything less than group content.  I simply cannot understand why this concept of balance in all levels of play is SO damn hard in MMORPGs when freaking MOBAs of all things tends to get it right (don't get me wrong they still have a long way to go in terms of balance but at least "support" roles are definitely rewarded for their contribution).
			
				
	Edited October 2, 2015 by miguksaram	
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Actually its pretty easy to solve, remove the target cap for tanks , if i can tank many groups  at the same time then i deserve to attack them all at the same time :) ,
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Yeah like i said not about group play >.> (Even my title stats solo play -_-)
 
I am not asking they do better dps than dps specs  but make it reasonable l
 
 
If support power worked with assault abilites sure no problem  but that's not the case :( and we are back to the same problem
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You articulate my point exactly. Currently the role of Tank and Heal are relegated to group only because anything less in terms of leveling (the major role for most players) is sub par.  When was the last time you can say an optimal Tank or Heal spec had an easier time with an encounter (in the same time frame) as a DD spec?  My position is PvE only because I can't speak for PvP as that is too dynamic in the first place but in the vast majority of MMORPGs I've played in recent years even when a Tank or Heal spec had a certain advantage over a DD in an encounter it was quickly nerfed because the DD felt their personal role was being encroached upon.
 
My suggestion is simple (at least in my mind anyway), DD always thrive in single target combat (typically boss encounters) while Tanks thrive in 4+ mob content (DPS wise).  Healers on the other hand have the option of supporting either, meaning DD or Tank and are rewarded in kind (based on the total amount {ratio} they healed their partner/group).  While it's not a perfect concept, specifically in terms of healing (but you have to assume your role isn't based on damage and thus you rely on at least one other person to do DPS) it's at least closer to a competent system that what's in place now. 
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Hehe, I suppose. But that could also make it in a way easier to keep Threat, if you can hit them all at the same time with some sweeping blows. Tanking more than 5 could sometimes require an additional tank or threat management by everyone in the group. I dont know, I kind of like the idea of threat management in games. Tanks need something to do as well instead of just standing there spamming some abilities with their faces. DPS need to worry about not geting aggro and healers need to avoid overhealing. Makes everyone be a bit more alert and not zone out with their minds. A cap at 5 might be reasonable in the end :)
 
 
 
It can be a bit tricky while leveling when it comes to Quest rewards. Some rewards doesn't benefit your DPS spec actually, as they are more for your Tank/Heal spec. Needed at times, I must admit. but overall, the whole purpose with a DD/Dps spec is to do damage and to kill enemies. The other 2 roles doesn't really do much about that. They got other purposes.
 
Something I miss is proper support roles as well, from my time in Rift. 4 roles in a raid. Tank, heals, DPS and 1-2 Support. It was interesting to play, because if you did your Support assignment well, you made everyone else look good. It wasn't about your own personal Hps/Dps. I liked that. There are parts of it here as well in Wildstar, but people tend to see it as a broken DPS build, because a raid leader forced you to use a shitty ability that make others look better than yourself. It's a shame. I bet some people enjoy these buffing support builds in Wildstar though.
 
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To be exceedingly fair, there are situations where a dominantly heal / tank spec is preferential to a pure DPS spec while soloing. 
 
But more to the point, There are very few situations (barring raids) where anyone should ever be a pure "heal/tank/dps" spec. There should almost always be some versatility in your build IMO
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While I'm a HUGE fan of hybrid specs Wildstar is not the best example of a game that rewards those who decide to do so (over DD specs).   I wish it did mind you because it would mean that we, as a community, had more options without feeling min/maxed the reality is that those who tend to offer leveling/end-game advice rarely, if ever, let a player know that such options exist beyond the "optimal" build for a given level/progression point in the game...
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Hmm... you can go warrior with tank gear but dps spec then! :O
 
You can take on groups of 10-15 and still kill them quickly.	
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			Playing solo, one needs to have enough DPS to kill mobs in reasonable time. It's not rocket science but when I started, I did not realize that. Leveled a healer and killing mobs got slower and slower and slower until at lv 40 or so I hit a holdout which was simply impossible. My error, but easy to correct.	
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but DPS has been the best viable solo mechanic in graphical online gaming since The Realm Online... 
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The trinity used to be balanced in solo and group content. That balance has been shattered over the years by devs who didn't understand the balancing mechanics involved, and then they wonder why there are tank and healer shortages at end game.
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If you can manage to get support gear that is entirely devoid of any assault power I will give you a CREDD
 
Yea, you're not gonna be tearing it up as a tank or healer spec with support gear and DPS abilities... but you can do it. In fact, in certain situations its preferable to be in an off heal / tank spec to survive certain fights solo.
 
Don't forget also that there is hybrid gear available...
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Ye talking about GW2 ?
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the system carbine put in is EXTREMELY flexible for whatever encounter you are doing. as some have said, you can mix/match abilities/gear for a desired outcome and do it on the fly!
 
think it's wonderful design that allows max uptime for actually playing and playing how you want to play	
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