131563-lets-talk-about-population-exiles-vs-dominions

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Hi guys,
 
As you know, there is a difference of population between Exiles and Dominions (NA and EU). This difference grows up day after day.
 
With F2P, this difference will be really problematic because as I know, many people will go in the Exile side, some dominions guilds have already switched to exiles (in EU).
 
On EU server (Jabbit dominions), queues for dungeons and adventures doesn't pop, you need to create a team for that. Yesterday there was only exiles vs exiles in RBG for a long time because less than 10 dominions was in queue etc...
 
Some guilds just stop to play (Dominion EU) just because they are unable to recruit new players to their roster (20 players for DS and GA) and don't want to create new characters in the exile side and lose everything they have done.
 
So Carbine, what are you doing about this ? After F2P, if nothing change, dominion side will be in a huge inferiority ...
 
*This post take for example EU dominions but I think this is the same thing for NA dominions.
 
			
				
	Edited September 18, 2015 by Cataract	
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			As a raid leader trying to fill a raid roster on Dominion it's becoming a pretty much daily job for me to login and try to recruit people.  I have to chuck the game on and sit mainly AFK *spam* *spam* *spam* in the hope someone will bite.Very tiring to keep doing.	
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What would you have them do?
 
Offer incentives?
Give bonuses?
Free stuff?
 
I mean what exactly, do you think they could do to change people's minds about what they like to play?
 
Oh, I know! AURIN FOR DOMINION! That would solve everything. :lol:	
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Yes maybe you think it's funny @TexArcana, but trust me this is not funny at all.
 
This problem is on all games with factions (Aion for example), and if nothing is done there will be no faction in the future.
			
				
	Edited September 11, 2015 by Cataract	
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This conversation again?
 
Maybe we can hold off on our opinions until after....say....September? 
 
I also have a Dominion character and in the lower levels I see just as many people as I do on my Exiles. Now I don't know about end game but the whole crying for the dommies is getting old and not necessarily accurate. :angry: 
 
(I need coffee)	
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I'm a Dominion player now and while I was having fun, I wasn't ridiculing you or making fun of you.
 
I am serious. What would you have them do? Offer some solutions.	
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I feel like my guild has been lucky.
As a guildie has said: Jabbit EU Domi - population, Venus Rising
I can't imagine what it's like outside of my guild, but I can observe the massive population difference by world events. It's insane how Exiles out number Dommies on Jabbit!	
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(I need coffee)
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*HUGS* (Don't look at Morning Coffee yet)
 
Well, about Illium.....
 
It's just laid out so badly that I think it seems empty even when it's not. Exiles are all in and around Academy Corner and the Space Port, so you always see them. 
 
I say we wait. Wildstar has been low population for quite a while now and being a Dominion has a hard starting point. I truly believe a lot of people are turned off by the 'serve and obey' attitude if you play a human and it is my opinion that humans out number the other races.
			
				
	Edited September 11, 2015 by Khandi	
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This conversation again?
 
Maybe we can hold off on our opinions until after....say....September? 
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So "wait" it's not a good answer, the problem is known since months and if nothing is done it will be too late.
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You *do* know that in less than three weeks, the games goes Free-to-Play? That means we're going to see a HUGE population explosion on both sides. That's why she's saying to wait and see, because with any luck, we'll be able to grab enough new players to start living La Vida Dominion.
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Wouaa F2P is the answer ... ALL people will go on the dominion side and no one on the exile side ? We are saved, God bless Wildstar.
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Wouaa F2P is the answer ... ALL people will go on the dominion side and no one on the exile side ? We are saved, God bless Wildstar.
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I will create one pink chua and one aurin, so I will be on both sides.
I'm even considering rolling pvp server, am I crazy?=)	
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			Or many players will go on the exile side and the population between dominions and exiles will be more problematic than ever. After that, good luck to "normalize" the population.	
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			Personally I play both sides but that is mostly to expirence both sides of the lore. F2p will definatly help they population though. It may not be the end all fix but when Aion went f2p the asmodian population did expand by a large margin. At this point I think it's just general population of the game. I've seen about the same population on both sides of the US PVE server since I got back.
			
				
	Edited September 11, 2015 by Dragoon130	
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Or many players will go on the exile side and the population between dominions and exiles will be more problematic than ever. After that, good luck to "normalize" the population.
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			The only option I can think of is to have cross faction Dungeon/Adventure queues!It's not the more "appealing" thing.  It's the fact, just like the PvP to PvE exodus, that you can't play a multi player game on your own or with very few players so everyone has jumped ship to Exile and rerolled.
			
				
	Edited September 11, 2015 by Charge	
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It's not the more "appealing" thing.  It's the fact, just like the PvP to PvE exodus, that you can't play a multi player game on your own or with very few players so everyone has jumped ship to Exile and rerolled.
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			was about to start a post with "HELP I cannot decided between Aurin(exile) or Chua(Dominion) but clearly I see I am needed more on the Dominion side so there is where I shall go...enjoy both races backstory and how they look in game so was a toss up as a new player which to choose but now i see it is Chua all the way!:P	
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was about to start a post with "HELP I cannot decided between Aurin(exile)
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Well, they are fairly solely responsible for the dilemma this thread is discussing and always have been.
 
You just CAN NOT give one race a Neko Catgirl race and not the other, and expect the player bases to be not be totally lopsided.
 
The only hope the Dominion would have - and I am being 100% honest - is to recruit the Lopp to their cause. The Chua were *supposed* to be the answer, but let's get serious, the appeal level is nowhere near the same.
 
Without a pure "cutesy pretty happy animal-girl" race, the Dominion will never, ever equal the Exiles in number.
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Never Aurin. They are a sickness.
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Yeah. Wrote that same thing (in a more condensed form) in another post on page one :X
 
Playable lopp would be great. And freebots for the exiles? :P But I honestly don't think that would be the answer to the problem. Aurin appeal to a very... specific demographic, I'd say. Lopp don't appeal to said demographic. Because they're lacking... uh... secondary female reproductive organs. *cough cough*
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Well, they are fairly solely responsible for the dilemma this thread is discussing and always have been.
 
You just CAN NOT give one race a Neko Catgirl race and not the other, and expect the player bases to be not be totally lopsided.
 
The only hope the Dominion would have - and I am being 100% honest - is to recruit the Lopp to their cause. The Chua were *supposed* to be the answer, but let's get serious, the appeal level is nowhere near the same.
 
Without a pure "cutesy pretty happy animal-girl" race, the Dominion will never, ever equal the Exiles in number.
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- female chua
- prettier cassian options (update/fix all the human models already, wtf?!)
- some sick dominion side only mounts, weapon skins / costumes, different and more hardcore looking pvp sets costumes, housing stuff, hairstyles, whatever new
- one way faction change / free ? (xD) - might get some of the new / old guildless stray cats switch over, wouldnt expect whole guilds to go (but dev intensive and prolly lossy xfer)
- get someone to dev a clientside modelchanger and dont ban it? 
(just quick random thoughts based on other mmos)
 
dom side just not attractive to me personally anyway, decent player who just happens to like playing aurin even if not actually a completely clueless airhead personality.
made a 50dom recently too on a separate acc just so i can kill exiles as well (ghetto PK workaround !) once f2p repopulates the pvp server but yea it feels bland on dom side, i dont feel any striking difference or atmosphere/attitude change when i log from thayd to illium. ppl look the same, armor looks the same, nothing darker or more evil, no fire no smoke no lightning, the exile faction logo actually looks more evil than the dominion (shouldnt it be more like tree/bunny ears on the exile logo and skull on dom one?)...  i just dont feel the same difference as i do in other faction based mmos (played all more or less)
			
				
	Edited September 11, 2015 by Mln asdfggh	
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God, how I wish Aurin had never been implemented :P
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*faceplam*
How about this, all Aurin-lovers are actually super happy they exist. Including myself, without a single cutey girly race some people probably wouldn't play because they actually love their Aurin absolutely much?! xD
Not a solution nor a good wish to forward to God.
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I have a level 50 Aurin female. I love Lola. She's one of my favorite RP-toons ever.
 
But she's not an Aurin. She's a Lopp. She's just trapped in Aurin form. :lol:	
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			Yeah I would not be playing Aurin if I had for them being "cutesey" that is  something to do with the generation of gamers in the last 10 years or so i think(im much older so that is not would appeal to me) it was more of their backstory and I I think the male Aurin look way better over the female.  But I do enjoy Chua's as well so will stick with them	
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I remember one of the very first Wildstar Census' taken way back at the end of Open Beta. Even at that time, with thousands of players voting, Aurin ALONE made up something like 62% of the ENTIRE GAME POPULATION.
 
Let that sink in. Almost TWO THIRDS of active players (at the time, and lets be honest, there were a LOT more people around back then) played ONE RACE on ONE FACTION.
 
That, to me, should have been a huge red flag.	
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Yeah I would not be playing Aurin if I had for them being "cutesey" that is  something to do with the generation of gamers in the last 10 years or so i think(im much older so that is not would appeal to me) it was more of their backstory and I I think the male Aurin look way better over the female.  But I do enjoy Chua's as well so will stick with them
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I also think Carbine could make Draken women sexier in a more seductive way. 
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I'm just waiting for f2p to finish leveling my Chua, so I can do so through pvp.  The pve grind is just too tedious now that I'm at Whitevale and have seen everything before twice through already.
 
I also think Carbine could make Draken women sexier in a more seductive way.  That might offer a counterpoint to the Aurin on the Dominion side.	
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			What Dominion needs is Luminai as future playable race. Problem solved.
			
				
	Edited September 11, 2015 by Brobot	
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I also think Carbine could make Draken women sexier in a more seductive way.
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Yeah I would not be playing Aurin if I had for them being "cutesey" that is  something to do with the generation of gamers in the last 10 years or so i think(im much older so that is not would appeal to me) it was more of their backstory and I I think the male Aurin look way better over the female.  But I do enjoy Chua's as well so will stick with them
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I have a level 50 Aurin female. I love Lola. She's one of my favorite RP-toons ever.
 
But she's not an Aurin. She's a Lopp. She's just trapped in Aurin form. :lol:
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			Actually I think they had the fix to this in their hand. We all know how the people like these kind of characters like aurins and this could become a problem in the population (like it's now) so they should have made aurin avalible in both factions, it could really fit the lore, like a civil war between aurins, some of them didn't trust the exile, they think the exiles only bring trouble so they rebel against their queen and join the dominion. The dominion attack arboria and the rest go with the exiles. This would have required another race for the exiles tho
			
				
	Edited September 11, 2015 by Mapacher	
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Make us an evil aurin....everyone likes a nutter!!  :huh:Forget the lore, merge the factions and just let people beat down on one another and focus on your content instead.
 
moderator edit: content
			
				
	Edited September 11, 2015 by Chillia	
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... sounds superficial but watching a Granok all day would probably depress me after a while... maybe.
 
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exile for life here!
 
btw becarefull what you do to tempt players to either side for the other side might start saying carbine favours this faction over the other.
 
i like exile doesnt mean i wont plsy domi , but not right now	
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Actually I think they had the fix to this in their hand. We all know how the people like these kind of characters like aurins and this could become a problem in the population (like it's now) so they should have made aurin avalible in both factions, it could really fit the lore, like a civil war between aurins, some of them didn't trust the exile, they think the exiles only bring trouble so they rebel against their queen and join the dominion. The dominion attack arboria and the rest go with the exiles. This would have required another race for the exiles tho
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Didn't realise I was playing with so many people who want to touch their character inappropriately!!!!!  :lol:
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My main is a Granok female. I chose the "thickest" model, the one with huge bewbs and a big ol' booty. I wanted to see if I could get into a non-traditional MMO body style, and I have to admit ... I love her more than Lola. She is amazingly fun to watch. Her last name is "Brickhouse" ... because "she's mighty, mighty!"
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Oh please no, I chose Dominion so don't have to look at that disgusting race all the time.
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My main is a Granok female. I chose the "thickest" model, the one with huge bewbs and a big ol' booty. I wanted to see if I could get into a non-traditional MMO body style, and I have to admit ... I love her more than Lola. She is amazingly fun to watch. Her last name is "Brickhouse" ... because "she's mighty, mighty!"
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If carbine made them less obviously the "bad guys" I bet more people would play them. Maybe just up the evil factor for the exiles or something? Idk seems like story/lore could fix it because I actually think most Dominion races are more appealing, I personally just don't enjoy doing "torture x and y" quests.
 
moderator edit: content
			
				
	Edited September 11, 2015 by Chillia	
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If carbine made them less obviously the "bad guys" I bet more people would play them. Maybe just up the evil factor for the exiles or something? Idk seems like story/lore could fix it because I actually think most Dominion races are more appealing, I personally just don't enjoy doing "torture x and y" quests.
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If carbine made them less obviously the "bad guys" I bet more people would play them. Maybe just up the evil factor for the exiles or something? Idk seems like story/lore could fix it because I actually think most Dominion races are more appealing, I personally just don't enjoy doing "torture x and y" quests.
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Hey folks,
 
A reminder about our forum rules. Insults are not allowed and will be removed. Commenting on the game is great - but we do have a code of conduct. There are certain topics that are also not permitted on the WildStar forums (real life politics, religion, and all sexual content is not permitted). If you're not familiar with our code of conduct, please read them here. 
 
- Team WildStar 	
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Thinking about dungeons... I don't see any problem with cross faction or even cross server grouping. I think bringing down the factions entirely might be problematic though. So much of Wildstar is totally soloable but it's always been finding groups for dungeons that seems to be the main issue.
 
My stance on factions for purely PvE is that I think it's silly but I understand why MMO's have it in place.
			
				
	Edited September 11, 2015 by Khandi	
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Well, they are fairly solely responsible for the dilemma this thread is discussing and always have been.
 
You just CAN NOT give one race a Neko Catgirl race and not the other, and expect the player bases to be not be totally lopsided.
 
The only hope the Dominion would have - and I am being 100% honest - is to recruit the Lopp to their cause. The Chua were *supposed* to be the answer, but let's get serious, the appeal level is nowhere near the same.
 
Without a pure "cutesy pretty happy animal-girl" race, the Dominion will never, ever equal the Exiles in number.
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I think they just need, as some others have said, to eventually implement new races to both sides. Maybe a "less" appealing one for the Exiles, and a more appealing one for the Dommies. Personally, not a single one of the Dominion Races appeal to me, even a little bit. Humans with funky hairstyles? Meh. Demon people? More interesting but they are pretty fugly (imo) and I wouldn't be able to stand playing one for long. Mechari are...frankly, the thought of playing one is very boring even if they look kinda cool. Chua can go rot. It's exactly as they said happened with WoW. Or maybe a "traitor" system. I know one particular Aurin player who prides himself on being a Dominion Spy  -_-  I'm even ok with neutral races that can pick a side at a certain level, though, as much as I love Lopp, I am stoutly against them being playable. I think part of the charm of their race is they really give no cupcakes at all about our problems/war, they just want shinies. It's like Ekose...I feel like players would ruin them somehow.
 
Also, not all of us Aurin players are bubble-brained, fairy princess, fantasy cat lovers.
Personally, I've always gravitated to the more "natural" race. The one that dwells in forests or caves, and might be magical in some way. That live -with- the land instead of destroying it and making it adapt to them (or at least somehow shape their homes to use the trees n things without ruining everything around...*cough*OrcsHumansGoblins*cough*). Night Elves, Wood Elves, Aurin...it's basically almost always an elvish race lol (I love Dwarves and while Granoks are basically our Dwarves...they're just too tall for me to stand playing)...and when I first wanted to play this game, I looked into what Lore I could. What the Chua did to Arboria is, to me, completely unforgivable and even if I don't play a Chua, it tarnishes the entire Dominion Faction to me, even if they disapproved of what happened (whether before or after they learned the Aurin weren't simply animals).
 
I'm not even going to get into why I so vehemently oppose merging the factions.
 
A cross-faction content finder would probably be beneficial, too. I think WoW just implemented a Mercenary system for their BGs, though Im not entirely sure how it works. But say we used something like that here. If there isn't cross-faction queuing, then say, maybe an Exile could select a toggle to also queue as a Mercenary, and fill an empty spot in a Dominion side queue that simply isn't getting filled. I believe that on the servers, the AH is already Cross-Faction, but if they could somehow make it Cross-Server that would help (though I don't know if that's even possible).
 
To the OP, though...I don't think this is a "quick fix". Right now, we're pinning our hopes on what will happen come the end of September and start of October. Nothing will be fixed immediately, but hopefully the sides will begin to even out, at least a little.
			
				
	Edited September 11, 2015 by Kavi	
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love the traitor idea yea, that would add infinitely more variety to the population than just adding one extra race / gender to the dominion and it wouldnt break game mechanics as the race silhouettes for recognition purposes in this game arent really too defining and its all about nameplates anyway and as i already commented in the previous post, i personally dont feel a striking difference in the feel/atmosphere/attitude of the factions when logging between them. i think the races would blend in just fine. and the items/rigs/animations should be all compatible already.
as aurin i wouldnt mind getting spit on for some time on the dom side until i prove them that i actually am a warrior
 
(but technically i guess then its the same as having a faction change or simply the ability to pick any race and side on the char creation screen in the first place.  changing the faction later on would only create dev heavy complications and problems with transferring items that are faction specific, i gues i just get carried away abit by the "rp" idea of the treachery)
			
				
	Edited September 11, 2015 by Mln asdfgghI	
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Look on the bright side. 
 
If F2P flops, we don't have to worry about population imbalance.	
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Look on the bright side.
 
If F2P flops, we don't have to worry about population imbalance.
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I am not sure that's "technically" a bright side, Madda. :lol:
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			Need more chuas!  Kick a Chua, the new game coming to nearest Exile post near you!	
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I'm hoping the new Dominion Arkship tutorial will help the faction imbalance. Back in beta, I remember a lot of people saying that the Arkship was what instantly pushed players away from Dominion.
 
I also think adding more girly options for Chua would help. In particular, I want hairstyles (I dream of pigtails). The player Chua voice is also absolutely unappealing for me. Even though they are supposed to be gender neutral, I just get a male vibe off of them.	
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All Faction flavor goes out of the window once you reach the middle of Whitevale anyway. It briefly returns for Wilderrun, where Dominion players join the Radiant Legion. Otherwise, they are the same thing with different buildings are slightly different personalities telling you what to do.
 
Anyway, I'm not sure what could be done to fix the population imbalance. I don't think the morality of the side has much to do with the problem, since if it was then games that rely on giving the player the option of being a complete *cupcake* wouldn't be as popular as they are (see: GTA and...uh... Dungeon Keeper back in the day).
The Dominion apparent emphasis on religion IS a problem because player are more offended with their characters being part of a religion than with their character torturing and killing for the State. But, as I said once in another thread, that has nothing to do with the underlying morality of the fictional religion and all to do just with the player's preferences. In this particular case, no religiosity allowed. 
You can't fix that problem, though, without making the Dominion suffer a very big shaking. The Vigilant Church is at the core of the Dominion ideology: the eldans are gods, the Luminai are the best of the best because they have godly blood, everyone who doesn't have godly blood in them is a lesser being (see: only Luminai can be Emperors) or a tool at best (hello, every lowborn ever!).
Curiously, the basis for that shaking is there in the game. Before you embark in Omnicore-1, you get the fantasy Popess Cazalon to abstain her voting from helping Drusera because there have been a lot of 'troubling discoveries' in Nexus. Specifically, that the Eldan attempt at reaching godhood ended up with them extinct and creating a new creature that wants to devour the universe. That's some pretty bad PR for a religion that says that the Eldan are totally gods and that '(the Dominion) will soon follow'.
 
In another note, the Exiles have cool rock people, cool undead people and cat-people. Meanwhile, the Dominion has robots with extremely ugly faces that look like someone threw random scraps of metal to a magnet (or designed a fish), a race where the men have horrible back problems forever while the women look like succubi (to fight off the cat-girls, I bet), and, lastly, the Chua who have the exact same problems that gnomes had in WoW. 
So yeah, that's another factor to take into account: ugly faces.
			
				
	Edited September 11, 2015 by Ildur	
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Anyway, I'm not sure what could be done to fix the population imbalance. I don't think the morality of the side has much to do with the problem, since if it was then games that rely on giving the player the option of being a complete *cupcake* wouldn't be as popular as they are (see: GTA and...uh... Dungeon Keeper back in the day).
The Dominion apparent emphasis on religion IS a problem because player are more offended with their characters being part of a religion than with their character torturing and killing for the State. But, as I said once in another thread, that has nothing to do with the underlying morality of the fictional religion and all to do just with the player's preferences. In this particular case, no religiosity allowed. 
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			What's with people and all the religion hate, I'm not religious at all and think it actually brings an interesting aspect to the faction.	
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What's with people and all the religion hate, I'm not religious at all and think it actually brings an interesting aspect to the faction.
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I have heard quite a few people say they don't want to play Chua because costumes/armour won't look good on them
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			I have heard quite a few people say they don't want to play Chua because costumes/armour won't look good on them, true to a point but doesn't really bother me too much.  I was more put off by the roll they did after jumping as I thought it would hinder movement/make the character in precise when jumping but haven't really noticed it much and its not like you can't break out of the animation.	
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What's with people and all the religion hate, I'm not religious at all and think it actually brings an interesting aspect to the faction.
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Need more chuas!  Kick a Chua, the new game coming to nearest Exile post near you!
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I agree with Yasfan: Carbine shouldn't be trying to fix the Dominion by smudging the morality line between the factions. By doing so they are only opening the doors to all kind of nasty people with dodgy morals who will feel 'vindicated' by the game's pretenses of being 'morally grey'. Even if their current streams and wathever use more the Dominion, that won't take away the morally dodgy players who feel their dodgy morality vindicated by that faction. People might join the Dominion because of the added publicity, but will they stay when they notice that there's a very vocal group of players who defend the morality of the Dominion as valid in the real world?
 
But as I said in another thread long ago, Carbine will not do this: the writting team belives that having players disagreeing on matters of morality in their fictional universe is a sign of them being awesome writers.
 
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Mmmh, that is definitely a problem with dominion, I admit. Not just Chua, Draken and Mechari experience a lot of clipping as well, something I noticed less with my Exile characters.
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Mechari are particularly egregious examples since their exanite cores (their 'hairstyles' made from an unbreakeable fantasy alloy) gets butchered whenever they put a helmet on. Some drakens have the same problem (those with the 'fin-like' hairstyles). 
Edit to add: And the Granok also have that problem with some hairstyles (some of which are literal extensions of their flesh as far as we know) and, to a lesser extent, Mordesh too.
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			 I don't want to sound like a doombringer here but I have yet to play a game that didn't have a big faction imbalance outside of warcraft(which may not be the case now). Especially after a f2p transition which in some cases only agitated the situation further. The only real answer to a faction imbalanced situation is integration of the two sides.. outside of that its just a temporary fix to a long standing problem.	
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Not just that, but it's really a grab-bag of what shoes will actually fit on a Mechari and not force him to be barefoot.  I imagine some of this is due to the shape of their feet, which creates clipping issues unless the shoes are a certain size.  Lack of foresight there...
 
For the most part, all the Exile races are human-shaped.  They all stand upright, mostly have humanoid proportions (with the Granok pushing the bounds of that some), and only one has extra features that require being worked around (ie Aurin's tails and ears).  The Dominion, on the other hand, has two races which don't have humanoid proportions, both of which have larger tails and either ears or horns to be worked around.  And then, for some reason, the Mechari has those additional problems we've already mentioned despite being humanoid shaped themselves. 
 
I can understand why a person might choose Exile over Dominion due to the level of polish one has compared to the other.
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Some Wildstar version of blood elves that Look Better Than You And Know It would fit with the Dominion's general tone and probably pull some people in who just want to look good but don't want to play humans.
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			Luminai currently use a white-washed Mordesh model. They'd have to remake them in a way similar to how Blizzard had to remake Sylvannas and the other High Elves who were just pallete swapped Night Elves until Burning Crusade.	
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*cough* Luminai *cough*?
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Yeah, but how would you introduce such a race out of thin air? :X That's the problem right now, I feel. They should've done something like that during early development, but now that the lore is somewhat established it becomes rather difficutl to introduce new races that aren't already in the game in some way.
 
At least not without making it feel *really* shoehorned in.	
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Experimental cloned Mordesh from before the Contagion, clearly! That would be a huge popularity boost for the Dominion: Out of universe, they are the only ones getting ACTUAL ELVES! In universe, they get to gloat how they 'saved' the Mordesh and how if all the Mordesh on the Exiles would have simply stayed put and died like the Dominion intended, now every Mordesh would be a cured clone!
 
Speaking in seriousness, I don't know. I guess they could have an off-screen race join the Dominion while the Exiles get...Freebots? Actually, Ekose seem to be popualr. Let's do that: Dominion get Ekose; Exiles get Freebots!	
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Ekose fit Exile faaar more than they fit the Dominion, though (although I'm certainly not opposed to playable Freebots for the Exiles). Dunno, I just can't seem Ekose making sense inside the Dominion.
 
The Mordesh thing actually makes a lot of sense, though. Feels shoehorned in, but it would make sense for the Dominion to either discover a cure (which could lead to a sort of civil war amongst the Mordesh, with some moving to the Dominion, while others choose to endure the Contagion instead of betraying their Allies - maybe with a big fight about the cure, during which it gets destroyed - oh, here's an idea - make said 'cure' an Eldan facility.) or do the cloning thing you mentioned.	
----
			Let's save the ideas for new races for both factions until we can get back to a decent sized population.	
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I want the next Dommie race to be a highly evolved plant-humanoid that
1) are unparalleled in their agricultural advances, making them a species worthy of invitation to the ranks of the Dominion;
2) are beautiful and deadly, making them appealing to players; and
3) considered a delicacy by the Aurin, making the most sympathetic and innocent of the Exile species to seem less appealing and more immoral. 
 
 :P	
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{| class="blockquote"
I want the next Dommie race to be a highly evolved plant-humanoid that
1) are unparalleled in their agricultural advances, making them a species worthy of invitation to the ranks of the Dominion;
2) are beautiful and deadly, making them appealing to players; and
3) considered a delicacy by the Aurin, making the most sympathetic and innocent of the Exile species to seem less appealing and more immoral. 
 
 :P
----
			I think it would be a bad idea to give players incentives for playing dominion... that would only work short term, and looks a bit desperate. Instead, I think Carbine needs to make the dominion more appealing. Maybe a new desirable race...
			
				
	Edited September 13, 2015 by Debrained	
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{| class="blockquote"
I want the next Dommie race to be a highly evolved plant-humanoid that
1) are unparalleled in their agricultural advances, making them a species worthy of invitation to the ranks of the Dominion;
2) are beautiful and deadly, making them appealing to players; and
3) considered a delicacy by the Aurin, making the most sympathetic and innocent of the Exile species to seem less appealing and more immoral. 
 
 :P
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			Dominion Races aren't that attractive 2 play on the other side Exiles have Aurins
			
				
	Edited September 13, 2015 by Myri Everstar	
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{| class="blockquote"
 
I am rolling a Radish Medic.
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			Personally I'm not sure why anyone would want to play exiles, <_<  but there you go acquired taste I guess.  Personally I feel bile in my mouth whenever I think of them.  I anticipate a large influx of dominion in a few weeks time.	
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{| class="blockquote"
Yeah, but how would you introduce such a race out of thin air? :X That's the problem right now, I feel. They should've done something like that during early development, but now that the lore is somewhat established it becomes rather difficutl to introduce new races that aren't already in the game in some way.
 
At least not without making it feel *really* shoehorned in.
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{| class="blockquote"
Personally I'm not sure why anyone would want to play exiles, <_< but there you go acquired taste I guess. Personally I feel bile in my mouth whenever I think of them. I anticipate a large influx of dominion in a few weeks time.
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{| class="blockquote"
Personally I'm not sure why anyone would want to play exiles, <_<  but there you go acquired taste I guess.  Personally I feel bile in my mouth whenever I think of them.  I anticipate a large influx of dominion in a few weeks time.
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{| class="blockquote"
We're just lucky they can't be all classes, or there would be nothing else on Exile side.
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{| class="blockquote"
 
 
I am rolling a Radish Medic.
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I should think the ONE MAJOR difference between the Empire and the Dominion would be obvious.
 
The Empire has had 40 years to gather fans - six movies, untold comics and books, video games and cartoons out the wazoo.
 
The Dominion? Not so much. 
 
EDIT TO ADD GENIUS IDEA:
 
You want me to switch factions? Here's what you do:
 
1. Let me mail myself money from the Exile side. My toons aren't at war with each other and *I* earned that money.
 
2. Account unlock my pets, mounts and dyes.
 
Boom. Done. I will never look back.
			
				
	Edited September 13, 2015 by TexArcana	
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{| class="blockquote"
Domingo Races aren't that attractive 2 play on the other side Exiles have Aurins
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{| class="blockquote"
I should think the ONE MAJOR difference between the Empire and the Dominion would be obvious.
 
The Empire has had 40 years to gather fans - six movies, untold comics and books, video games and cartoons out the wazoo.
 
The Dominion? Not so much. 
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{| class="blockquote"
A more relevant major difference is that the Star Wars franchise makes no attempt at ambiguity about which side is better than the other. When you play a Sith and the game rewards you for committing atrocities, we all understand clearly that the views of the Sith Overlords who look on approvingly do not represent the views of the game's creators. The people running the show don't feign an inability to tell the difference between the Rebels and the Empire just to maintain an illusion of moral equivalence that doesn't really exist in the narrative.
----
			To be honest what throw me off sometimes about the dominion is that feeling of "what we do is what we have to do, is the rigth thing" I would really like if they were more like "this is *cupcake*ed up but we gotta do it cause it's good for us and we are evil motherf****" you know, that over the top thing. This is a personal opinion, don't know if the rest see it that way,	
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{| class="blockquote"
Nah. The Sith act evil, but they don't consider it evil. They consider it right.
 
----
			
We have enough plant based races in NCSoft's library already
 
ANet still rubs them in our faces, after the majority of 2014 being focused on them via content patches.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Well, of course. But what Yasfan was saying is that the creators (that is, the writers) do not consider the Sith good. That's probably the most important difference, because it informs how the fictional world will be shaped and how it will be presented to the players/readers/viewers, who are not in-universe entities. 
We don't have that in Wildstar except in the publicitary material. Then it's all about moral grayness and how the Dominion's actions are presented as uplifting and morally correct even when they are clearly despicable.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
A more relevant major difference is that the Star Wars franchise makes no attempt at ambiguity about which side is better than the other. When you play a Sith and the game rewards you for committing atrocities, we all understand clearly that the views of the Sith Overlords who look on approvingly do not represent the views of the game's creators. The people running the show don't feign an inability to tell the difference between the Rebels and the Empire just to maintain an illusion of moral equivalence that doesn't really exist in the narrative. 
 
----
			
 
{| class="blockquote"
I'm not sure that the writers think the Dominion are good, or right. Considering the game was basically advertised as the plucky browncoats vs those other assholes. Even in their most sympathetic moments the Dominion are just the ones who didn't get away after the Eldan subjugated the human race. In the publicity material for WildStar it's always been the good guys vs the bad guys.
 
----
			I think what Carbine sought out to do with the Dominion is to create a Horde like faction, instead they created more of an Empire like faction.	
----
			Allow free faction transfers to Dominion? Bring in Voxine? Exterminate the Aurin? Add new races, and have the new Dominion one appease the same people who play Aurin? These would all help.
			
				
	Edited September 14, 2015 by Mental Surge	
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{| class="blockquote"
I think what Carbine sought out to do with the Dominion is to create a Horde like faction, instead they created more of an Empire like faction.
----
			If the new tutorials are anything to go by, what Carbine will do to 'fix' the Dominion's Public Relations is to start making the Exiles more and more evil until they are truly the same shade of grey. Because it's easier to ruin the Exiles than to fix the Dominion.	
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{| class="blockquote"
If the new tutorials are anything to go by, what Carbine will do to 'fix' the Dominion's Public Relations is to start making the Exiles more and more evil until they are truly the same shade of grey. Because it's easier to ruin the Exiles than to fix the Dominion.
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Yeah, good luck getting Pappy to do anything smart to achieve that. He'll just fill us with neurotic murderous Aurin and claim he has achieved Absolute Moral Grayness. :P
 
Editted for reasons unknown. WHO KNOWS!
			
				
	Edited September 14, 2015 by Ildur	
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{| class="blockquote"
In Wildstar the Dominion is pretty much cartoonishly evil, with Chua being cardboard-cutout evil scientists, Cassians doing the whole "arrogant elf-without-the-ears" gig and Mechari being pretty much the Terminator.
----
			Now I want to roleplay a mechari with an austrian accent.	
----
			Yup, now I've got the terminator theme stuck in my head.	
----
			Delete Chuas and i would consider to join Dominion	
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{| class="blockquote"
Delete Chuas and i would consider to join Dominion
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{| class="blockquote"
Not all Chua are bad, but the people who tend to create them *really* love them...like straight up *love* them, which is fine in the bedroom but don't stand in Illium talking about stuff stuck in your fur and making everyone else uncomfortable!
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			PvP has a lot to do with faction affiliation. People tend to go to the winning side. Pve is much more about lore and personal avatar preference.  Some people out there will feel a desire to be a chipmunk while others dig on outer space zombies.  To each his own.  After the game has firmly planted it's roots and the population grows, alts will be created on both sides and many folks will feel more at home on dominion.  It's always been popular to go against the flow.  The dominion is the anti-everyone else faction at the moment and that in itself will appeal to many eventually. 	
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I agree, faction balance should be a concern, don't underestimate it's importance!
However, this is easily a problem that can be tackled later on. (eg. ~re-evaluate faction balance after next drop)
 
I've thought about this for a while and I think the easiest way to solve it would be to provide a VERY small XP buff to characters levelling (=lower than level 50) on the faction with the lowest ACTIVE population. You could even make the XP buff scale with the current faction balance. (=The boost becomes bigger if the faction imbalance grows, and small if the faction imbalance shrinks)
 
Above all else, I hope Carbino tries at least "something". 
Most of us here know what happened with that popular Blizzard MMO who never took any real action against faction imbalance, the only "solution" was opening your wallet and doing a paid faction transfer. (=I'm sure someone got a promotion for coming up with that idea)
 
What follows below is a little bit of MMO history to illustrate why I believe faction balance is very important.
 
{| class="blockquote"
PvP has a lot to do with faction affiliation. People tend to go to the winning side. 
----
			
Actually, the PVP argument is a solid one, and a good reason why I expect the Dominion *will* see a sizable up-tick in population post-transition.
 
Players will come in droves, and the PVPers will naturally gravitate to the PVP server. Only they'll see, right away, that no one players there. They'll come here, ask "Where is everyone" and the answer will be "on the PVE servers."
 
So they'll migrate - and they'll migrate to the faction with not only shorter PVP queues, but also just better PVPers in general: the Dominion.
 
(and before anyone starts, yes, there are good PVPers on the Exile side. I'm just saying that, in general, I haven't bothered to queue for PVP in months, because the Exiles never seemed to win more than once a day.)	
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Honestly what is up with the fur creature and anime creature hate?! 
It's like geeks forgot they were seen as parayah (spelling?!) once upon a time... Playing games or reading comics made you a weirdo or pervert or a permanent child... And now we do the same to others within our geek community?
 
Jerks and inconsiderate people exist in every group. Doesn't make anyone playing Chua or Aurin some sort of pervert.
 
I main Mechari, I love Dominion, I hate ilium and I have one Chua and one Aurin. My Mechari is highly suspicious of Chua but as a player I gotta admit they are adorable as all heck and they got the best animations. 
 
Dominion are sometimes grey and sometimes cartoonish. I personally dig it. 
But you can't make that and then not make FEMALE version of the cute race. No, gender neutral is bullshit. Look at the dude undies on them, look at the majority of the customization options. Female Chua is for the really determined (me!). 
 
Chua are adorable and will one day kill me in my sleep. That's okay. 
 
Can you tell I own a cat? Lol	
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{| class="blockquote"
Honestly what is up with the fur creature and anime creature hate?!
It's like geeks forgot they were seen as parayah (spelling?!) once upon a time... Playing games or reading comics made you a weirdo or pervert or a permanent child... And now we do the same to others within our geek community?
 
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{| class="blockquote"
*Pariah. :lol: ;)
 
As for "feminine Chua" ... I know we've been over this before, but I am pretty sure that bushy eyebrows and droopy mustaches are the Chua equivalent of super-model level hawtness. Just go with it, Dea. Apparently, you can find Chua ERP on the EU servers if you look around for it. :huh: :blink:
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{| class="blockquote"
So, I think we agree in terms of Carbine needing to embrace the Dominion's tone, but we differ in the direction we'd like to see them go.  I'd like to see the Dominion more ambiguous and nuanced, because I find that characters are always far more interesting when they aren't unflinchingly good or firmly evil.  The Dominion can still be authoritarian without being mustache-twirling cartoons.  They can still have someone as reckless as Mondo Zax while having someone as noble as Toric Antevian.
 
Obviously, I can't see Carbine just rebooting the entire Dominion storyline, but as they go forward, I'd like to see them stop emphasizing one aspect of them and balance things out some.  If Carbine intends the Dominion to be a grey faction, they need to add content that reflects that more.
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{| class="blockquote"
Actually, the PVP argument is a solid one, and a good reason why I expect the Dominion *will* see a sizable up-tick in population post-transition.
 
Players will come in droves, and the PVPers will naturally gravitate to the PVP server. Only they'll see, right away, that no one players there. They'll come here, ask "Where is everyone" and the answer will be "on the PVE servers."
 
So they'll migrate - and they'll migrate to the faction with not only shorter PVP queues, but also just better PVPers in general: the Dominion.
 
(and before anyone starts, yes, there are good PVPers on the Exile side. I'm just saying that, in general, I haven't bothered to queue for PVP in months, because the Exiles never seemed to win more than once a day.)
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{| class="blockquote"
 
 
 
That is an interesting point and I kind of hope this will come true and the faction inbalance will fix itself (and Carbino does not need to spend time and resources on solving this..)
Only time will tell. I do however think it is a bad solution in terms of design.
 
I see that many other posts here blame faction balance on faction limited races or faction image and propose making changes in those areas, I don't see this working for the long-term either.
 
----
			You forgot to include throwing down the Faction divide from a meta persepective. No, it won't help making the Dominion more populated, but it will limit the practical effects of the problem by making the player pool the same for both sides as far as queueing for group content goes.	
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{| class="blockquote"
You forgot to include throwing down the Faction divide from a meta persepective. No, it won't help making the Dominion more populated, but it will limit the practical effects of the problem by making the player pool the same for both sides as far as queueing for group content goes.
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{| class="blockquote"
But I'd say your last few sentences demonstrate the problem with going in the direction of nuance.
 
They can't have someone as reckless as Mondo Zax. Mondo Zax is the ultimate cartoony villain. They can't keep Chua the way they are and get nuanced because Chua are the complete opposite of nuance. It's the whole point of why they're funny. They're adorable sociopaths. Without that contrast, they may be more nuanced, but humor that underlies their entire existence will be gone.
 
They can't just reboot the entire storyline. The Dominion's society is based around the falsehood that the Eldan ascended to godhood and that the more Eldan you are, the closer to a god you are. The Dominion's attitude towards the rest of the universe is If you're strong, join us or die. If you're weak, we couldn't care less about you either way. That is the guiding philosophy throughout the backstory and lore. How do you make that more nuanced without rewriting the story?
 
How do you propose that they reshape the game for moral nuance without entirely rewriting the background, redefining the races, and completely rewriting the central character elements of major NPCs?
 
The alternative is to just say "Yeah, they're bad guys. But they look pretty damn slick while they force the rest of the galaxy to submit, don't they? Look at how clean those streets are! But not too close, because the ICI has a camera watching you right now. ;) " Which is completely in line with the spirit and tone of the entire rest of the game.
 
This game isn't supposed to be some kind of deep srs bidness examination of the struggle between ambition and compassion. It's supposed to be a romp through Space Bunnies vs. Space Hamsters.
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{| class="blockquote"
Take that back!
 
(But really, I adore my Draken female, I find her to be pretty damn hot. In fact, the Draken female is the entire reason why I went from Exile to Dominion during closed Beta. I think I had an Aurin for a day, really.)
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{| class="blockquote"
Draken are ugly 1 of the reasons I play Exiles
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Draken are ugly 1 of the reasons I play Exiles
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{| class="blockquote"
Ask yourself what the Dominion's ultimate goal is. The Dominion isn't trying to fight a never-ending war, but trying to create stability for their citizens, They aren't trying to take over Nexus just to annoy the Exiles, but because they see it as their holy land. They want peace, but they do it in a very extreme and controlling manner.  But the Dominion see this as a means to the end in creating a stable society on what they see as their holy land - and that's where the nuance lies.
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{| class="blockquote"
Draken are ugly 1 of the reasons I play Exiles
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{| class="blockquote"
Draken are ugly? What? AND YOU PLAY AN AURIN? IS THIS A JOKE?
 
Seriously though, why am I not surprised that it's an aurin player saying that?
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{| class="blockquote"
Draken are ugly? What? AND YOU PLAY AN AURIN? IS THIS A JOKE?
 
Seriously though, why am I not surprised that it's an aurin player saying that?
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{| class="blockquote"
...I think we're pretty firmly out of the realm of nuance and into the realm of apologetics at this point.
 
It's pretty clearly the direction they're going, so I guess we're all in for it either way.
I just don't see how they're going to do it with Mondo Zax rolling past all that nuance with his new Orbitron Deluxe With Aurin Crunchymuncher Attachment, yelling "Die! For SCIENCE!".
----
			
Honestly, Dominion and Exile don't need to be equally 'grey' in terms of morality for it to work. You can have the Dominion being more "nuanced" and still have the Chua as evil comic relief. The goal shouldn't be to make both factions equally neutral, but to make the Dominion more relatable in its evilness. Be it via propaganda, or by simply showing the side-effects the actions of the Exiles have on ordinary dominion citizens. I could easily see the Exiles attacking Dominion convoys to get supplies and military hardware (heck, I'm pretty sure there are quests with that very theme in-game), which from their point of view is a great thing to do. But this could very well lead to lack of starving lowborn, because the convoy happened to be intended for a remote settlement, instead of the military, which the Exiles didn't know.
Or the Dominion could be trying to prevent a disaster. Let's say an Eldan lab full of bioweapons or something like that is rigged to blow for whatever reason and Dominion forces are rushing to disarm the bombs, only to be surprised by Exile forces who try to keep them from doing exactly that - not because they want the Lab to go boom, but because they naturally expect the Dominion to rush there to gain control of a Superweapon, an Eldan artifact or similar things.
 
There are lots of ways in which the Exiles can be painted as the bad guys, without actually *being* the bad guys, while the Dominion can play the hero.	
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			I don't think the problem is anything to do with the lore.  It's to do with people logging into the game and seeing nobody on the Dominion side.  They then create a char on the Exile side and keep it because it's banged out.Sugar coat it how you want and focus on the lore etc, it's simply the population is stacked Exile and it's supposed to be an MMO.  MMOs where you don't see anybody else running round are dead.  The Exiles have more people, more guilds and are therefore the best place for people to go so everyone is doing it.Several guilds / people have switched over.
			
				
	Edited September 15, 2015 by Charge	
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{| class="blockquote"
I don't think the problem is anything to do with the lore. It's to do with people logging into the game and seeing nobody on the Dominion side. They then create a char on the Exile side and keep it because it's banged out.
 
Sugar coat it how you want and focus on the lore etc, it's simply the population is stacked Exile and it's supposed to be an MMO. MMOs where you don't see anybody else running round are dead. The Exiles have more people, more guilds and are therefore the best place for people to go so everyone is doing it.
 
Several guilds / people have switched over.
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{| class="blockquote"
And ofc no answer by Carbine... no surprise. -_-
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			And ofc no answer by Carbine... no surprise.  -_-	
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{| class="blockquote"
Well, the truth is that any attempts to "fix" the problem by the developers will end up back-firing in one way or another.
 
Offering incentives (Increased XP, free goodies, free title, whatever) is not fair to the other side - and is EXTRA UNFAIR if the incentive is a tangible reward like a pet, mount, title or other visual sign. I mean, the more-populated side didn't do anything wrong, and rewarding the LESS POPULAR faction just reeks.
 
Racial unlocks (Aurin for Dominion? Wut?) flies in the face of established Lore and is a stop-gap measure, at best. "Traitor" quests, same thing. The only thing that would accomplish is making sure the Exiles were filled with Chua, not that Aurin would go Dominion.
 
NEW Races is always fun, but at this point, any new Exile race would almost have to be purposefully designed to be unpopular - and seriously, can you think of anything more wasteful than spending a years work animating an entire race that no one would want to play? Just saying, if the point of a new "cutesy Dominion race" is to attract people to that faction, wouldn't having an equally cool new Exile race be a "zero sum" game?
 
That leaves, what? Just opening all the races to both factions? Not going to fix anything.
 
I just don't see any equitable solution. It has to be left to the player base to solve, not the developers.
----
			
Offering rewards for players moving towards the less populated side?
 
WildStar must totally be in a good spot right now.	
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{| class="blockquote"
Offering rewards for players moving towards the less populated side?
 
WildStar must totally be in a good spot right now.
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			It should not need any reward or anything to shift over.  What about the people bustin their nuts on Dominion at the moment to keep their guilds going and the raids/group content going etc?The fact is as soon as a big movement of the population started shifting to Exiles because there were more guilds and more people their to recruit it was a vicious circle and it wont end because everyone who comes now wants to go to the side where it's easy to do their daily boss kills and get groups for stuff.If people actually started to come to Dominion and balanced the numbers a bit then both sides would be fine but they simply aren't because they want to jump on the easy bandwagon.The only way it can possibly halt is if there is a MASSIVE influx of players and nothing is pointing toward that right now!
			
				
	Edited September 15, 2015 by Charge	
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{| class="blockquote"
Nothing's been offered yet. I think they're waiting for free to play to determine what to do. Cause while I'm cozy enough in my guild, I would hate to see another case of Lightspire where we struggled to see new people logging on to play.
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{| class="blockquote"
Hopefully it will stay that way. Even if it does work, what if the population shifts and Dominion is the popular one? How do you explain taking away a bonus that they've had for a long period of time just because their side is unbalanced because of factors players themselves can't control?
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{| class="blockquote"
Hopefully it will stay that way. Even if it does work, what if the population shifts and Dominion is the popular one? How do you explain taking away a bonus that they've had for a long period of time just because their side is unbalanced because of factors players themselves can't control?
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{| class="blockquote"
If the new tutorials are anything to go by, what Carbine will do to 'fix' the Dominion's Public Relations is to start making the Exiles more and more evil until they are truly the same shade of grey. Because it's easier to ruin the Exiles than to fix the Dominion.
----
			
If they wait again until it's clear that the problem isn't going away just with influx of new players... It will be too late just like for the pvp servers. 
 
Lots of new players when they see 20 exiles to 2 Dominion on a world boss will move to exile.	
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I think that really depends on the raw number of new players on each faction. There's a quantity large enough that, if achieved, will cause most players to not really notice the imbalance because the game can't support/render enough players on the map/screen. Meanwhile, queues will increase in frequency, hiding the imbalance further. All thanks to the raw 'new player' number.
 
I remember Warhammer Online tried to battle population imbalance by giving a bonus to the less populated faction depending on how 'far behind' they were. I don't remember there being major population imbalances when I played it (it has since dropped to the ground and died, that game). But then that was a PvP focused game.
			
				
	Edited September 15, 2015 by Ildur	
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{| class="blockquote"
...I think we're pretty firmly out of the realm of nuance and into the realm of apologetics at this point.
 
It's pretty clearly the direction they're going, so I guess we're all in for it either way.
I just don't see how they're going to do it with Mondo Zax rolling past all that nuance with his new Orbitron Deluxe With Aurin Crunchymuncher Attachment, yelling "Die! For SCIENCE!".
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