Report 1081

Report #1081
Skillset: Nihilism Skill: Dementia
 Org: Nihilists Status: Rejected Aug 2013
Furies' Decision:
We do not feel Nihilists need these afflictions.
Problem: Dementia is an affliction in the Baalphegar pact. It's useless due to
the fact it has nothing to do with any kill methods offered to Nihilists, and
the affliction itself is poor in terms of what it offers. This report aims to
change the affliction which offers more synergy with other pact afflictions,
Nihilist kill methods, and thematically based.
Solution #1: Replace dementia with Disrupt. This will remove the equilibrium
 from a target, requiring them to concentrate to regain it back.
Solution #2: Replace dementia with Freeze. This will give one level of freeze
 to the target. Allow this ability to do two levels of freeze on a
 25% chance.
Solution #3: Replace dementia with Bedazzle. This ability will make the target
 dizzy and confused.
Player Comments:
---[Enyalida on 7/27 @ 20:40 writes]:
While dementia is pretty bad (it's on my lists too), these are all too powerful.
---[Neos on 7/29 @ 07:28 writes]:
Overall my question is, is this needed? Are Nihilists hurting in such a way that
any of these changes will put them in a good place, or will it push an already
good guild over the top? From my experience, it'd be the latter, but I may be
mistaken.
---[Thoros on 7/31 @ 14:10 writes]:
Despite an inquisition of no's, I support solution 2 the most. I think this fits
the theme perfectly and meshes well with what Nihilism and Necromancy offers.
(Coldaura, lichdom touch, assistance in a balance lock, aka complete synergy)
---[Thoros on 7/31 @ 14:14 writes]:
@Enyalida, when a guild who's entire offense relies on what is invested in an
entity that impacts nearly 80% of their offense and revolves completely around
it, as an investible affliction, theres no reason this affliction would be
chosen. It would be different if I was envoying for dementia to be changed from
a skill that gave it randomly (let's just say for example, if contagion gave
dementia) I would see how your argument would state that these new effects are
too poweful. However we are looking at dementia as an investible affliction
which, if invested, the Nihilists combat technique revolves around dementia
being an affliction which is meant to be used as part of a kill method and not
out of random afflicting power. Never in the history of Lusternia will a
Nihilist (or celestine if they have dementia as an investible affliction too,
i'm not too sure) ever invest dementia as part of his/her strategy.
---[Enyalida on 8/1 @ 18:29 writes]:
@thoros What? How would having these on a random chance instead of a
strategically chosen, prep-and-buffable affliction giver be a more powerful
method of giving these affs? I'm going to Echo Neos, you don't need this buff.
You already have plenty of skills that focus around throwing a target off
balance, you don't need to be able to stack equilibrium off-balancing with that,
through freeze (extending all off-eqs and balances), confusion/dizzy (throwing
off balance and again extending offbalancing), and disrupt. Sucks that you won't
invest dementia, but the only way to fix that problem is make it a better or
equal choice to what you already have, which is powerful enough as is.
---[Enyalida on 8/1 @ 18:31 writes]:
Solution 2 without the extra chance for two is probably more or less alright.
You have the lichaura already doing passive freezes, and can beast spit mactans
for more freeze.
---[Thoros on 8/4 @ 14:32 writes]:
You can't stack disrupt and off-balance abilities, equilibrium and balance are
two separate entities. Equilibrium loss also does not assist in sacrifice kills,
which really is the weakest choice in all these solutions to be quite honest.
Confusion/dizzy would really assist in affliction-type strategies (the only one
I can indeed really think of that would help the most is jinx, and we all know
how often a Nihilist with hexes goes for jinx rather than sacrifice). Solution 2
is actually the one with most synergy and is in my opinion the best choice and
fits well for its theme.
---[Synkarin on 8/5 @ 22:54 writes]:
Nihilists already have it really easy in regards to balance locks, allowing them
to stack freezing on top of everything else isn't really necessary, and they
certainly don't need it at all. It's easily the most powerful solution here. I
don't really thinkg this is needed. I don't realy support any of these
solutions.
---[Shuyin on 8/7 @ 16:59 writes]:
Not convinced this is necessary for reasons stated above.
---[Wobou on 8/8 @ 00:39 writes]:
I'll echo the majority of the opinion in this and say that these are a bit too
strong. I understand Thoros' point about diversifying combat the difficulty is
balance. Right now there are a handful of investments that are clearly superior
to the rest, to add others to that list you have to make them more powerful than
the current list at least in some situations. These all speak to balance
manipulation which is something that Nihilists already excel at. If you went
with utility I would've gone with you, or if you had gone after making Dementia
itself a more valuable affliction. My primary issue is that nihilist investments
are already extremely good from both an offensive and defensive standpoint.
Shackles alone means that your target is off eq 25% of the time because
summer/tipheret is 2s and the demon is 8s IIRC. All three of these solutions
(but mostly solution 1) would increase a nihilist's passive ability to strip
balance which is already one of the best.
---[Kio on 8/13 @ 20:56 writes]:
This change is not needed. Dementia is not the only investable power which is
'useless' to a Nihilist. Along similar lines, both Celestines and Nihilists have
investable powers which are are rarely used because they lack synergy with their
kill methods. As it stands, Nihilists do not need their potential for stacking
balance robbing or balance increasing afflictions raised.
---[Rivius on 8/31 @ 12:53 writes]:
Strongly opposed. If you were able to convince us that Nihilists didn't have
other pacts that offered excellent strategic options, you might be able to make
a case for this. As far as I see it, narrowing down your pact afflictions is
probably not a bad idea overall, and is a better move than needlessly
strengthening your class. If anything, perhaps we should consider phasing out
the 'useless' afflictions from pacts across both guardian guilds if indeed there
is no use for them and start reducing the affliction count in the game. You
already have great, powerful and flexible pact effects. I hate to be that guy,
but the last 7 reports on Nihilist combat have been unequivocal buffs, and while
some of them were fairly minor or somewhat justifiable, I'm going to have to be
that guy here and say I'm getting a little worried now. Overall the guild is
nowhere in a bad spot and there are balance concerns on the other end of things
I'm sure we'd like to start seeing addressed.