149080-when-i-raid-in-wildstar

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. . . all is right with the world. This has been highlighted for me as I've checked out streams of our raid. I watch a few clips and realize, raiding in this game is *fun*. Kal (who streams our raids) said this last Friday night: "When you are playing a video game, you should have a smile on your face", and yes, that is her (and my) experience in raids. It's just a joy. As much ado is made about how HARD WS raids are, that never was the point. The point is that they are FUN. Really FUN, and they keep being fun even after you've done them once or twice (maybe not 50 times, though, looking at you Avatus guilds!).
 
I say this because I know all is NOT right with the world elsewhere. When I read the forums, /lfg, reddit, or just talk to people, I know there are many who have concerns. Some people aren't having the kind of fun I am. And that's criminal with this kind of content available. If you aren't consistently smiling when you play this game, and you also aren't raiding, give it a whirl. Whatever happens, people should experience this stuff. Even if Redmoon comes out, gamble boxes are scrapped, everything becomes account bound, all is right with the world, and the game makes millions, if you miss the raids in this game, you've missed a real treasure.
 
I know some people worry about their time constraints. I know some people worry about elitism. I'm telling you, try to find a guild that fits you- you may be surprised. There are plenty of progression guilds out there that come up short every once in a while. You can be that raider that fills the gap for them- maybe you can do once a week. Maybe you can do once every three weeks. But I see enough guilds look for "a few more for System Daemons/GA/Whatever that I'm guessing they'd love to have a few bench players that can fill in when real life comes up for a few players.I know, not every guild does this, some have more consistency than others. Some demand perfection. But not all of us do, and I get enough tells from fellow raid leaders asking if I have any people to help fill in (and send those tells myself) that I know there are spots for casual players, even in DS sometimes. Putting yourself out there might get you that same experience that I've had, and really you owe it to yourself.
 
Raiding really is *that* good in Wildstar. Good people + good raids = a really good time in this game. If you aren't having as much fun as I am, and you aren't raiding, give it a whirl. Whatever happens, as many people as possible should have experienced all that this game has to offer.One day, you may get to play with grappley hooks. And once you do, you'll realize that whatever it took to get there, it was worth it.
			
				
	Edited January 19, 2016 by SlyJeff	
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I totally agree!  
 
I love running through the stuff for our raids first progression through DataScape.  I know there was some flame on reddit about posting DS progression on 'farmed' bosses, but when you are pushing through for the first time as a group, its an achievement and if you are having fun, why not share it, and why not share the celebration!?!?!
 
I'm excited to play with grappley hooks tonight :), we got our first pulls on Maelstrom last night, and we get to go have some more fun tonight.  I'm loving the mechanic based fun that the DS bosses are providing for the raid.
 
(Also if you need fills or anything feel free to add me to your whisper list :))	
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(Also if you need fills or anything feel free to add me to your whisper list :))
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			I love dying	
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Raiders seem to like to wax poetic about how great the raids in this game are. I believe them. The curious bit here is why Carbine seems utterly incapable of making any other parts of their game even close to as fun or rewarding. Stranger still are the amount of completely arbitrary gates that STILL exist to get into it.
 
It's like they don't want their players to play the best part of their game.	
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The curious bit here is why Carbine seems utterly incapable of making any other parts of their game even close to as fun or rewarding.
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			I'm normally bored whilst farming, I love progression raiding.  But I'm a terrible farmer/grinder. 	
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I'm normally bored whilst farming, I love progression raiding.  But I'm a terrible farmer/grinder. 
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I think I'm lucky in that I really don't mind a little grind, especially if there are people on to chat with. Our guild is social enough that there's generally someone on to shoot the breeze with that makes the grind a nice, chill experience.
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We are putting in our second night of attempts on Maelstrom tonight, and I think there's a better than even chance he goes down. Fingers are crossed anyway!
 
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First, the content that Carbine NAILED from the "fun" stand point was undeniable dungeons/raids and housing. Someone at Carbine understands what makes raids fun, and someone at Carbine understands what makes housing fun. But the people responsible for what "casuals" find fun I think assumed that daily zones was it. I dunno.
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Leave it to Yas to poop all over a thread celebrating something people are enjoying.
 
Ugh.
 
Seriously? I don't raid, I am exactly the kind of player you think you are championing for - and I have to tell you, straight up, you don't speak for the entire casual player base and you should probably have just left this thread alone for people who enjoy something to express that joy together.
 
I suppose that's too much to ask out you though, isn't it? Of course it is.	
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The idea that Carbine NAILED the "fun" in dungeons and raids is only true if you're a player who enjoys highly demanding and precise tasks of group coordination.
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Leave it to Yas to poop all over a thread celebrating something people are enjoying.
 
Ugh.
 
Seriously? I don't raid, I am exactly the kind of player you think you are championing for - and I have to tell you, straight up, you don't speak for the entire casual player base and you should probably have just left this thread alone for people who enjoy something to express that joy together.
 
I suppose that's too much to ask out you though, isn't it? Of course it is.
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i saw the post and thought to myself "oh here we go again" LOL
 
dont do it sly, DO NOT ENGAGE
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Hey sly, 
 
I'm a bit of a lurker here but I wanted to say that I respect your posts quite a bit. You seem like a stand-up guy and you're absolutely right about raids in Wildstar. They are great fun and I think anyone with an eye for teamwork and a little bit of dedication to improvement. You do have to pay attention but that's a good thing, not a bad thing. 
 
Also I'd love to help you out with any fills you need, feel free to add me if you'd like. 
 
PS. There does seem to be something about grappely hooks that makes a raid devolve into children. TT had designed some great fun fights in this game.	
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Yeah, I like raiding endgame.  I like dungeons too.  In an MMO, thats what I do, if I want solo play, I do that leveling up.  This game has probably the best GROUP content on the market now.  Could of they had improvements, yep, all games need improvements but the actual content I don't see as much.  The improvements is accessibility.  But the product they produced and is out there is still the best.  And if you don't like group content be it small or large, well, sorry that you choose a game that has that as it's main content.  5 adventures/6 dungeons, 2 raids is a lot to do.  Its fun.  Every encounter is different in some way or form.  It's not tank and spank, it's moving, interupting, dodging giant tornados.  Fun stuff.
 
Also better than having an endgame that is dependent on crafting, open world grinding, raid content, dungeon content, pvp content all to just get the best gear.  I don't like sandbox mmo's, they are meh to me.  	
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Leave it to Yas to poop all over a thread celebrating something people are enjoying.
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Why all the annoyance at opposing opinions?  I thought it was a forum.
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How do you know that though? And he did give his opinion on raid/vets as well as delving into other things. You don't expect people in a thread staying exactly ontopic without mentioning any side things, you put your praise public expect a spectrum of opinions.
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i do not think it is an opposing opinion as much as the individual who made the post and quickly went off on a tangent about end game this and that blah blah blah.  we are talking about raids in particular, something they talk a lot about without having ever set foot in one.
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How do you know that though? And he did give his opinion on raid/vets as well as delving into other things. You don't expect people in a thread staying exactly ontopic without mentioning any side things, you put your praise public expect a spectrum of opinions.
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How do you know that though? And he did give his opinion on raid/vets as well as delving into other things. You don't expect people in a thread staying exactly ontopic without mentioning any side things, you put your praise public expect a spectrum of opinions.
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I have not met many players that have stepped into this games raids and not have fun. The only time is when they don't like wiping for the 200th time and not their fault but when you do get it down, you shout, you go F YEAH!!!!
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			Want to add, there are players that don't like the wiping actually, and want to experience the content but it be ez mode so they don't struggle.  Maybe spend a few wipes on the boss first time than kill it.   I like to call these the Yasfan's of the world.	
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Past experiences with this user.  She's very against any raid content or group content.  She's yet to step into any vet dungeon content and is very against group content.  Look at her past posts.  Anyways, post is about fun in dungeons and raids.  If not having fun, than that's the opposing view not the most MMO players dont like group content (hahahahahaahahhahahaha) so dont bother doing it and instead do solo player stuff.  
 
Also, if said person has not done any of the group content, that person's view is thrown out the window and is not credible.  If they did the content and didn't have fun, than thats a leg to stand on.  Yasfan is known to derail threads and is very against group content in this game.  Think's its all staged and timings and not the RNG of alot of encounters are.  Also having to depend on others to do something and their role is hard to do.
 
I have not met many players that have stepped into this games raids and not have fun.  The only time is when they don't like wiping for the 200th time and not their fault but when you do get it down, you shout, you go F YEAH!!!!
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I've encountered quite a few people who play this game and don't do raids and vet dungeons because they aren't enjoying it and find it too hard.To me it looks like the percentage of players who are raiders is very small in this game. This thread is a love song to a very small minority. The majority of players in this game will not experience the raids. That being said, I am happy for all of you having fun.
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I've encountered quite a few people who play this game and don't do raids and vet dungeons because they aren't enjoying it and find it too hard.To me it looks like the percentage of players who are raiders is very small in this game. This thread is a love song to a very small minority. The majority of players in this game will not experience the raids. That being said, I am happy for all of you having fun.
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I've encountered quite a few people who play this game and don't do raids and vet dungeons because they aren't enjoying it and find it too hard.To me it looks like the percentage of players who are raiders is very small in this game. This thread is a love song to a very small minority. The majority of players in this game will not experience the raids. That being said, I am happy for all of you having fun.
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Just to weigh in from my past experience that some of the most fun ive had in mmo's have been running challenging content. It is even more fun if you have a decent guild where you can get a good laugh whilst doing it, I remember back in SWG running the Corvette with the guild I was in and it was really fun.  Especially running new players through it because it can get confusing if you have never done it before with all the lifts and game quirks that made it look like you never used the lift and just ran out again only to have vanished.
 
If the content isnt challenging and you can breeze through it then it will get boring fast so for me im happy that vet dungeons and raids are viewed as being challenging as it means when I attempt those im going to have alot of fun. Wither I wipe a ton of times I wont care because its a learning curve and its about having fun and I can do that without being flawless. I look forward to when im able to attempt them and no-one should begrudge there being challenging group content in an MMO, if you are looking for solo play there is also some of that in Wildstar too. 
			
				
	Edited January 19, 2016 by Scarran	
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Leave it to Yas to poop all over a thread celebrating something people are enjoying.
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Look, I wasnt "taking a swipe". It just seemed to me that daily zones were a big part of the "casual endgame". But it was a casual aside- I'm not invested in that viewpoint. I certainly meant no disrespect to casuals. And at launch, I definitely considered myself casual. Even today, I'm certainly more casual than the hardcore raiders.
 
I've often said that not having get shiphands at launch was a big miss.	
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Actually, Tex, what prompted my post was this comment right here:
 
That's when this thread moved off of celebrating the raids and the guy responsible for them for tailoring them to his intended audience, to criticizing the casual PvE content and taking a swipe at the people who made that content. And it's even more commentworthy because his opinion of who to blame for it isn't just "unverifiable" but verifiably false. Gaffney made it very clear that the studio was well aware how much of a grind daily zones are.
 
The casual endgame content is fun, but there's nowhere near enough of it--just like is the case for all endgame content here--and the casual endgame progression is simply unrewarding. It stalls out quickly into diminishing returns that takes months of grinding to cap--for rewards that can be reached and exceeded in a week or two of more challenge-oriented group play.
 
Carry on with praising the raid content as the masterpiece that it is, for the small fraction of the playerbase who really enjoys that kind of thing. It's not my cup of tea, but I'm glad they've got something to enjoy.
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Having finally reached 50 on my first toon, grabbing some gear from the AH and leeching on a couple of wubba kills, I've built a 70-ish set for both roles on my baby Engineer. I hope to experience some of this fun myself soon. The expeditions are a blast but I haven't stoned up and gotten into any other content yet. I really need to find a group to start the progression path with. I'll put some emphasis on that in a couple of weeks after my surgery. I'll have several months off work to play around while I'm recovering.
 
Hope to be noobing up your vets very soon. :D	
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What's fun for you and others are two different things, so whose to say that the "casual" playerbase finds these things "fun?"  More often than not I find that most "casuals" want to raid, but due to real life commitments/duties they cannot.  I never hear that the solo content is fun.  Sure if you have a limited timeslot to play you can find enjoyment in the simple things solo content has to offer, nothing wrong with that at all.  This goes back to an arguement I made in earlier threads about not being content with where you were in said content.
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			and threads gone. Back to BnS i go	
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Thanks for sharing OP.
 
I am a new player (taking a break from GW2) and I had a great time in the game so far. It plays well and is FUN! 
 
It sucks that the game is not doing well.
 
Anyway can't wait to try out vet dungeons and the like.	
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Raiders seem to like to wax poetic about how great the raids in this game are. I believe them. The curious bit here is why Carbine seems utterly incapable of making any other parts of their game even close to as fun or rewarding. Stranger still are the amount of completely arbitrary gates that STILL exist to get into it.
 
It's like they don't want their players to play the best part of their game.
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Is this aimed at the second bit of text you highlighted, where I noted that most people who play MMORPGs don't do challenge-oriented raids? If so, that's really not an opinion so much as a summary of known metrics that comes from several games, both indirectly through datamining and directly through statements from game management. It's really not a point of debate. The demographics are well known and have been since before this game even launched. Not everything in life is an unknown unless you choose to actively ignore the things that are known. If you do choose to do that, that's really not my problem.
 
And to be clear, I'm bringing up the demographics of highly challenging raiding to place the opinions of people who do enjoy that kind of content in the context of the playerbase as a whole, not to dismiss those opinions as meaningless. I have no doubt that Jeff sincerely loves the raids and that many other people who raid share his opinion. I'm glad they have content they love. I hope they will continue to have new content that they love made available at a rate appropriate to their ability to financially support its development.
 
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[...]
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My personal, biased and unverifiable, opinion is that there are a couple of things here.
 
First, the content that Carbine NAILED from the "fun" stand point was undeniable dungeons/raids and housing. Someone at Carbine understands what makes raids fun, and someone at Carbine understands what makes housing fun. But the people responsible for what "casuals" find fun I think assumed that daily zones was it. I dunno.
 
Second, a lot of the fun content is hampered by rewards. I think the adventures (that aren't MT) are fun done with appropriate gear. I think that expeditions done with appropriate gear are fun (But they don't scale right with groups, so are more fun solo, sadly). Even dungeons, which are great fun, are dulled by being completely skippable in the gear progression due to contracts and world bosses. The two newest dungeons are a load of fun, but hardly ever run because the rewards aren't worth it.
 
At launch, this was not the case regarding the content. Adventures and dungeons were relevant and the gear from them was important. People did them and they enjoyed them (though they did not enjoy "gold or bust"). But Carbine had a DIFFERENT problem at launch, still regarding rewards for effort. The rewards stunk and most gear was being salvaged. Even the raiding wasn't that rewarding, and people burned out.
 
Carbine has done an awesome job at creating fun content. But that content has to have the right kind of incentive to keep people running it, and running it in a way that is fun (they've currently incentive dungeons to be speed run, for example). In my mind, WS will forever go down as a warning that you can't have just good, fun content, but you have to give people the right rewards to ensure they are motivated to run (and more importantly, re-run) it.
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and threads gone. 
 
Back to BnS i go
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Having finally reached 50 on my first toon, grabbing some gear from the AH and leeching on a couple of wubba kills, I've built a 70-ish set for both roles on my baby Engineer. I hope to experience some of this fun myself soon. The expeditions are a blast but I haven't stoned up and gotten into any other content yet. I really need to find a group to start the progression path with. I'll put some emphasis on that in a couple of weeks after my surgery. I'll have several months off work to play around while I'm recovering.
 
Hope to be noobing up your vets very soon. :D
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Raiding in this game is seriously incredible. xD It took me a while to get to it - in large part because I just couldn't be arsed to find a group. I'd run raiding guilds and lead raids for the past.. multiple MMOs I'd played and I just did not want to do that again haha. Luckily I stumbled into a fun group who lets me just show up, heal, have some fun, and still have time for RP! :3
 
The dungeon content is what truly got me hooked on WildStar. Even now that I kinda outgear them, they're still a blast. I just wish I could afford to have more than one character geared for them. XD	
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			dungeons/raids in WS are the best in the genre since they were designed the way vanilla/tbc content was in WoW. Everyone who likes mmo pve content imo has to give WS a try	
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 I wouldn't. Looks like NCSOFT is living up to its reputation: https://forums.bladeandsoul.com/topic/149596-queue-time-lying/
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Yea queue times are pretty bad. We shall never log out again xD
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It's actually surpisingly fun to play.
And it has this Wildstar feeling as well in combat.	
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I must admit I dont know how the game is that busy as when I tried it the thing felt and looked very dated and it was nothing special.  I couldn't even bind my different mouse buttons in the keybind section of the game which for a game released in 2016 is ridiculous. 
 
Good on those having a good time though but don't worry about queues as they eventually always go away.  First month is normally the worst and then after that things normally start getting better if they don't have a knee jerk reaction and open up more servers before then.  
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yea i created my char as well and typed /dance. was not disappointed.
not sure if i progress much further tho, we will see.	
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People will stop playing B&S eventually.  It has a lot of outdated stuff that people don't like in MMO's.  Non-shared quest mobs, massive grinding for gear, non-existant pve (on release, has 4 max level normal dungeon and 1 multiple difficulties big dungeon).
 
Back to Wildstar, raids and dungeons are there, just people I think are used to them and just tired of running the same stuff.	
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People will stop playing B&S eventually. 
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HAHAHAHA I bought an advance pack. I played all day Sunday and a little bit on Monday afternoon.
 
I think I am already done.   :lol:
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Yep, and after seeing their f2p model and comparing it to Wildstar, Wildstar is BY FAR way better f2p system.  I think it's funny in order to upgrade your inventory, you need something called dragon trade pouches....guess what, you can only get dragon trade pouches via the ingame store.  And a couple here and there on the daily login reward system.  
 
But yeah, fun game on the side, maybe take away pvp'ers and casual/solo players, but for the pve dungeon/raid people love, will come back here quick.  Especially when Carbine adds new dungeons...eventually....one day......in the future.....while I'm alive.....	
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I must admit I dont know how the game is that busy as when I tried it the thing felt and looked very dated and it was nothing special.  I couldn't even bind my different mouse buttons in the keybind section of the game which for a game released in 2016 is ridiculous. 
 
Good on those having a good time though but don't worry about queues as they eventually always go away.  First month is normally the worst and then after that things normally start getting better if they don't have a knee jerk reaction and open up more servers before then.  
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Did it on my G600 just fine :) .  Unless you are talking about modifiers.  And FYI it was ported in 2016....been around for years in the east.
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Good on those having a good time though but don't worry about queues as they eventually always go away. 
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			Great post OP. Hopefully more players who find the dungeons and raids intimidating will give it a try when the new mentoring system Carbine has been working on is released.	
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Hope to see you soon.
 
Sorry about the surgery tho :(
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Yep, and after seeing their f2p model and comparing it to Wildstar, Wildstar is BY FAR way better f2p system.  I think it's funny in order to upgrade your inventory, you need something called dragon trade pouches....guess what, you can only get dragon trade pouches via the ingame store.  And a couple here and there on the daily login reward system.  
 
But yeah, fun game on the side, maybe take away pvp'ers and casual/solo players, but for the pve dungeon/raid people love, will come back here quick.  Especially when Carbine adds new dungeons...eventually....one day......in the future.....while I'm alive.....
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I guess I didn't pick the Pergo of BnS, since I have 0 queue. Honestly, I just wanted to mess around with the character creation, so I never bother to research which server to be on. Can't really get a feel of classes yet as the early parts are like 70% cutscenes. UI is all kinds of terrible! :lol:  Btw, what's the difference between Yun & Jin besides legs?
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Dragon Pouches drop ingame from quests and the likes.
Sure you can buy them, but you can also farm them really.
Their system is really similar to Wildstar actually.
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Dragon Pouches drop ingame from quests and the likes.
Sure you can buy them, but you can also farm them really.
Their system is really similar to Wildstar actually.
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Add onto that I believe it is highly rng based
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[edit] TO BRING THIS BACK AROUND TO TOPIC! Can't wait for raid tonight! Although we've killed through Convergence, we still have to work on getting bosses down fast enough before we'll ever actually be able to work on Ohmna. I hope we get through many bosses tonight! Sad that I won't be able to attend Saturday, but alas... that's the price I pay for being married to a writer and having to attend cons to help him sell books. :P
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I'm looking forward to my guild downing SD. I might not be there for the kill though. I'd like to be, but damn real life stuff. We got them down to 8% on Tuesday.
 
On another note, I am probably the worst Kicker ever. 	
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I'm looking forward to my guild downing SD. I might not be there for the kill though. I'd like to be, but damn real life stuff. We got them down to 8% on Tuesday.
 
On another note, I am probably the worst Kicker ever.
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Oh, good luck to your team.
 
As for kicking, we use a variety of methods, but our easiest is running a warrior in a mitigation/self heal/power link build. Never has to drop stacks and provides buffs to the raid.
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 Especially when Carbine adds new dungeons...eventually....one day......in the future.....while I'm alive.....
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Oh, good luck to your team.
 
As for kicking, we use a variety of methods, but our easiest is running a warrior in a mitigation/self heal/power link build. Never has to drop stacks and provides buffs to the raid.
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I'm a DPS Stalker (at least for this fight). T_T We have like one Warrior on our team lol.
 
Right now, I'm still learning to pay attention to multiple things at once. Like sometimes I get super focused on Power Surge that I won't watch other things. Also Kicking during pillars is still tough for me right now. Sometimes, I'll go into tank stance when I get too many stacks. Also trying Steadfast, but I'm having trouble adjusting to the keybind because it's on another for tank spec and then I get confused. It was my first time Kicking so I'm still experimenting with what works for me. Though at least I'm not alone on Kicking.
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I'm a DPS Stalker (at least for this fight). T_T We have like one Warrior on our team lol.
 
Right now, I'm still learning to pay attention to multiple things at once. Like sometimes I get super focused on Power Surge that I won't watch other things. Also Kicking during pillars is still tough for me right now. Sometimes, I'll go into tank stance when I get too many stacks. Also trying Steadfast, but I'm having trouble adjusting to the keybind because it's on another for tank spec and then I get confused. It was my first time Kicking so I'm still experimenting with what works for me. Though at least I'm not alone on Kicking.
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			We have our kickers clear stacks right before pillar phase and rigt after, if we aren't using warriors in kicker builds (we sometimes have our main tank healers kick, and sometimes medics, but they clear stacks).	
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Thanks for the advice everyone!
 
I use both Interruptor and RaidCore so Power Surge is usually very visible to me. The main problems I have right now are focusing so much on Power Surge that I don't clear my stacks & die (damn tunnel vision), and Pillar Phases. For Pillar Phase, it's really just avoiding as much damage as possible. Like sometimes, I feel like I have to run through a laser (not so bad without debuff) to interrupt. And clearing stacks during this phase isn't really an option.
 
We also have 2 Kickers for each Daemon, and we switch with each DPS down (which my tunnel vision ignored sometimes). This was also my first time Kicking and second day on SD, so I think I just need more practice to get into the swing of things.
 
Best moment during boss fight: DC'ing in the middle of the the fight and logging back in alive. Thank you healer!	
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