149892-friends-of-rotostar-datamine-currently-free-aspects-going-behind-a-paywall

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So I was looking at Wildweave's datamine stuff and noticed the following in the Rotostar strings.
 
 
Supply Satchel Stack Size
50 per itemStack size starts at 80 and scales based upon your F.o.R. tier.
 
That would be the tradeskill bag which currently allows stacking of 250 per item yes? Players without this premium service would then have a fifth of what they have now in storage capacity. Right. I get this is just datamining and that the Rotostar business isn't a thing yet and that everything is subject to change etc. but I'd like to point out the following.
 
If you want to try and make your subscription model better than it is right now, I would advice against removing QoL that's currently in position and putting it behind a paywall. That's a fantastic way to seriously rile up people. Have the baseline remain at 250 then, and give even more to those with Rotostar. Same goes for the guild holomark that will be reduced to only the back, and locking AH/CX and mail to players below level 15. Though that last one's not that bad since you get it eventually anyway it's still an example of taking stuff away from people. Don't take stuff away from people, give people that pay for Rotostar more stuff instead. Not things we have now for free. Just makes people angry and nobody wins like that. Not us, not you.
			
				
	Edited February 24, 2016 by SoulEquilibrium	
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			This is the thing that Trion Worlds are doing with Rift to encourage people to buy patron (signature) and it caused a huge shit storm.	
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Carbine:
 
 
Only warning I will give you for the shitstorm and damage you re going to unleash if what in the OP stands is correct.
This is NOT the path you want to be going, at ALL.
Tell your product manager who is in charge for the F2P CashShop to come to the forums and have a chat with his community.	
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			People really really don't like it when you take things away from them. While the model doesn't look bad, robbing players from what they have now is just a very bad idea.	
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Well we've been telling them that F2P's been getting too much.  Seeing them walk back some of the benefits isn't much of a surprise.  I would caution Carbine about any plans to restrict mail at any level.  At the very least they need to be able to receive and I'd rather see the limitations on it and the markets lifted earlier like level 10.  The crafting mats stack size is a non-starter though, don't go there please.
 
The guild holomark one gave me a giggle though.  I find those obnoxious particularly since they tend to clip so I rarely turn them on.  That's more of a punishment for those guilds that insist people wear their guild tags.
 
Between the Omnibit cap increase and some of the other things suggested by those strings I'd say there's a LOT of carrot in there.  Not sure that much stick is going to be required.	
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Can we opt out of a silly name badge... -_-;
 
Have to agree with the OP. Removing things that people currently have is NOT a good idea...	
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			I suspect this might be an incentive they'll include in the Chinese client.  They have shown themselves to be very hesitant to pull back anything they previously extended to us, but they're opening in a new market that will require a separate version of the game.  Since it will be new to Chinese players, they could hold a lot more behind the pay wall at launch.	
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Seems like a weird thing to translate then, if it was only going to be implemented in the Chinese client.
Either way, it would be nice to get some information from Carbine about what they're intending to do.
			
				
	Edited February 26, 2016 by Xychosis	
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			Yeah, I don't think it's a great thing to do. I think there need to be more bonuses for premiums on top of what's here since they set it up this way. However, this is why I hate F2P. "OMG, I'm going to lose something I haven't been paying for. This game sucks now!"	
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Seems like a weird thing to translate then, if it was only going to be implemented in the Chinese client.
Either way, it would be nice to get some information from Carbine about what they're intending to do.
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Can we opt out of a silly name badge... -_-;
 
Have to agree with the OP. Removing things that people currently have is NOT a good idea...
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Sounds to me like what Blade & Soul does.  Not only are there bonuses for subscribing, but the longer you are subscribed, there are additional bonuses which increase over time.  They're sort of like veteran rewards.
 
But yeah, changing stack size to provide a bonus is stupid.  That's like what SWtoR does and what the Wildstar devs said they were originally trying to avoid.  Putting QoL things behind a paywall makes your game more frustrating to unpaying customers - and that doesn't guarantee they'll become paying customers.
 
We either have to be misinterpreting things or this is something new.  I'd be dumbfounded if they reduced the stack size to 80 for everyone and then you had to work back up to 250.	
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Strange, what will they do with players with maxed out inventories after such a patch arrived? Send in mailbox forcing players do vendor the stuff?
Increase stacks to 500 for subscribers would be a better option.	
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Strange, what will they do with players with maxed out inventories after such a patch arrived? Send in mailbox forcing players do vendor the stuff?
Increase stacks to 500 for subscribers would be a better option.
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Putting QoL things behind a paywall makes your game more frustrating to unpaying customers - and that doesn't guarantee they'll become paying customers. 
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			Ahhh.. datamining, the video game equivalent of reading tea leaves... and generally about as accurate.	
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Hey all -
 
We do appreciate the concern, but what you're seeing in the datamined content is some changes for China - not for you. We strongly encourage anyone who reads datamined content, to do so knowing that nothing is set in stone - at least from our end - and is apt to either change, or may be for a different region.
 
Hope that helps a ease concerns a bit.
 
Thanks!	
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Seems like a weird thing to translate then, if it was only going to be implemented in the Chinese client.
Either way, it would be nice to get some information from Carbine about what they're intending to do.
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Kids in front of Social Security office: 'Why give old people all this stuff for nothing?'
 
Same kids as old people in front of same Social Security office: 'I DEMAND FREE MONEY!'
 
#Futurama	
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Hey all -
 
We do appreciate the concern, but what you're seeing in the datamined content is some changes for China - not for you. We strongly encourage anyone who reads datamined content, to do so knowing that nothing is set in stone - at least from our end - and is apt to either change, or may be for a different region.
 
Hope that helps a ease concerns a bit.
 
Thanks!
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Hey all -
 
We do appreciate the concern, but what you're seeing in the datamined content is some changes for China - not for you. We strongly encourage anyone who reads datamined content, to do so knowing that nothing is set in stone - at least from our end - and is apt to either change, or may be for a different region.
 
Hope that helps a ease concerns a bit.
 
Thanks!
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I did not have concerns. I had hopes that you were adding value to our Signature service.
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			I am aware what the current market is and how the business model works. It's not at all relevant relevant to what I said. Nor are the announced changes. I made this thread to give feedback to Carbine, which they ask for, and seeing as Sunshine responded I did so in kind with my honest feelings. If you don't agree with those feelings that's fine but I kindly request you do not belittle me by presuming I don't understand the simple concepts of the situation we are in.	
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I am aware what the current market is and how the business model works. It's not at all relevant relevant to what I said. Nor are the announced changes. I made this thread to give feedback to Carbine, which they ask for, and seeing as Sunshine responded I did so in kind with my honest feelings. If you don't agree with those feelings that's fine but I kindly request you do not belittle me by presuming I don't understand the simple concepts of the situation we are in.
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So you missed the memo about the tripling of omnibit drop rate and weekly cap then?
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The increased drops are nice but Signature benefits still pale next to the sub perks in SWTOR, ESO, Tera and (ugh) even Daybreak's games. The mention of Lockbox Keys was what most interested me.
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The increased drops are nice but Signature benefits still pale next to the sub perks in SWTOR, ESO, Tera and (ugh) even Daybreak's games. The mention of Lockbox Keys was what most interested me.
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The increased drops are nice but Signature benefits still pale next to the sub perks in SWTOR, ESO, Tera and (ugh) even Daybreak's games. The mention of Lockbox Keys was what most interested me.
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The mention of Lockbox Keys was what most interested me.
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The increased drops are nice but Signature benefits still pale next to the sub perks in SWTOR, ESO, Tera and (ugh) even Daybreak's games. The mention of Lockbox Keys was what most interested me.
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but in order to make a profit they need to monetize things ingame, and i do not think anything talked about is something that I would say "thats not right".  all content is playable, but QoL things, costumes, dye, mounts, and other vanity items are totally fair game to monetize imo.
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The increased drops are nice but Signature benefits still pale next to the sub perks in SWTOR, ESO, Tera and (ugh) even Daybreak's games. The mention of Lockbox Keys was what most interested me.
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And therein lies the problem. For people like me that don't care about cash shop gambling boxes, vanity costumes and the like, there is nothing to pay for. In fact, loading up the cash shop like SWTOR does and ignoring any in game activity rewards will drive people like me away due to not having any carrots to chase. At least, it would cause people like me to stop paying for Signature. The f2p model in this game is FAR too generous in comparison to Signature. The cat's out of the bag on that, though. Taking things away would seriously *cupcake* off a lot of people.
 
So, what can Carbine do to make Signature worth paying for? My Signature payment went through for March a couple of days ago. Unless more happens to differentiate it from not paying, it will be the last one. That is not a threat, it's feedback. There was thread back in January where a few people posted things that would really incentivize going Signature. Sunshine liked a few of them and promised to pass the word along. The first hint that they listened is the Omni-bit stuff. Again, it's a nice gesture but is it enough to offset spending $15/mo on N-Coin instead?
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 Again, it's a nice gesture but is it enough to offset spending $15/mo on N-Coin instead?
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I'm OK with grinding for my omnibits, however, it would be nice if, in tier 7 of the cosmic reward system, there was a perk along the lines of the following. 
 
Basic: Increases your omnibit cap from 120 to 240.
Signature: Increases your omnibit cap from 360 to 480. Additionally, you will receive a [sack of Omnibits] at each week's reset containing 360 Omnibits. 
 
This would turn the current omnibit grind into a stipend after a significant level of investment in the game while retaining some of the grind for the remaining 120 til soft cap and then of course beyond. 	
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If you're looking at it purely in terms of NCoin, then you would be better off subscribing.  The increase of 240 Omnibits per week gives you a good possibility of making that $15 back in Omnibits on top of what you'd get normally plus the Signature bonuses.  Of course, that is subject to how much you play.
 
 
There's a good side and bad side to it.  The good, which I agree with you on, is that it incentivizes playing.  If you want those extra 240 Omnibits every week, you have to get in the game and actually participate.  You can't just pay $15 a month, sit back, and accrue shop currency.  The more concurrent people we have online playing, the better.
 
The bad side to this, however, is that it also imposes a time commitment on Signature.  If you're in it for the Omnibits, then you have to make sure you're playing enough to actually make it worth your while.  If something comes up and I can't commit as much time to the game, then there isn't much benefit to me keeping my subscription going.  If I take a break from SWtoR, I'll continue to earn 500 Cartel Coins and have that to come back to.  If I take a break from Wildstar, that Omnibit bonus isn't going to be doing much for me, meaning there's no reason to keep my subscription going.
 
That's why I thought we were seeing this Rotostar stuff pop up.  It looks sort of like a veteran reward system where, the longer you are subscribed, the more bonuses you earn.  Something like that could be beneficial to Wildstar on top of the Omnibit increase due to making people to reconsider whether or not they want to cancel their subscription rather than how it is now, where you can start and stop it based on your playtime with little impact.
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And therein lies the problem. For people like me that don't care about cash shop gambling boxes, vanity costumes and the like, there is nothing to pay for. In fact, loading up the cash shop like SWTOR does and ignoring any in game activity rewards will drive people like me away due to not having any carrots to chase. At least, it would cause people like me to stop paying for Signature. The f2p model in this game is FAR too generous in comparison to Signature. The cat's out of the bag on that, though. Taking things away would seriously *cupcake* off a lot of people.
 
So, what can Carbine do to make Signature worth paying for? My Signature payment went through for March a couple of days ago. Unless more happens to differentiate it from not paying, it will be the last one. That is not a threat, it's feedback. There was thread back in January where a few people posted things that would really incentivize going Signature. Sunshine liked a few of them and promised to pass the word along. The first hint that they listened is the Omni-bit stuff. Again, it's a nice gesture but is it enough to offset spending $15/mo on N-Coin instead?
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Grinding to the higher cap takes longer, because you're earning two bits for one but the cap is three times as high.
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Pretty much on spot. On a personal note: I actually prefer W*'s method of Omnibit accrual versus SWTOR's allowance; because one incentivises just paying; while the other incentives paying AND completing content (granted that's just my opinion; YMMV)
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I like the omnibit change, personally. Makes the subscription more desirable. I won't be renewing it once mine goes under in April, though, for the simple reason that I spend most of my time roleplaying and in housing (dailies bore me, I don't like dungeons, don't have the time to raid, I'm terrible at PvP, I have burned myself out levelling alts up already). I don't get any omnibits from what I like doing in the game, so the improvement is actually lost to me. I expect that will change once Arcterra is released and gives me something new to do.
 
Still, it's a good change.	
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The increased cap is great IMO because my playtime had started to drop off lately but now I'm like "gotta grind them omnibits or I'm missing out!" Which keeps one extra player in queues!
 
However as Cantatus said it does remove the incentive for people to keep their sub going even if they're not playing. How you fix that while keeping the incentive to log on and play the game I'm not sure.	
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