Report 415

Report #415
Skillset: Nekotai Skill: Sprongk
 Org: Nekotai Status: Completed Jul 2010
Furies' Decision:
Spronk lowers momentum loss by 1 instead of 2.
Problem: Sprongk is a kick which doubles the balance time of herbs, sipping,
smoking, or applying, depending on where it hits. Unfortunately, as a marjoram
cure with two momentum loss attached, the costs versus the benefits mean that
the skill is roughly useless.
[A: 0 R: 0] Solution #1: Remove momentum loss entirely from Sprongk.
[A: 0 R: 0] Solution #2: Reduce momentum loss to 1, and make Sprongk uncurable
 for 15 seconds.
[A: 0 R: 0] Solution #3: Reduce momentum loss to 1, and make Sprongk a cleanse
 cure.
Player Comments:
---[Thul on 7/2 @ 21:17 writes]:
I'd also like to note that a complementary skill to Sprongk, Ootangk, has been
completely nonfunctional for over two months (bug 11439,) rendering an entire
intended aspect of Nekotai combat nonfunctional.
---[Ruiku on 7/14 @ 05:33 writes]:
I'd be fine with just 1 momentum loss
---[Sahmiam on 7/14 @ 06:03 writes]:
Clt9 I will agree that a marjoram cure associated with two momentum loss is not
justified. Solution 1 is perhaps the most palatable of the three, but given the
ease herb cures can be stacked, some negative momentum loss should be applied to
prevent stacking the kick's afflictions. Continuing to solution 2, 15 seconds of
uncurable pinched nerve is way too overpowered. It would be possible to
permanently double all balance times when combined with Kaife, and far more
likely the case, allow Nekotai to completely overwhelm a target's curing.
Solution 3 is also too much for similar reasons as solution 2: the frequency of
the kick can easily shut down a single target's offense (needing to cleanse
regularly). Futhermore, I'm hesitant of all solutions due to the cohesion this
skill would have with Choke: in an organization that has an uncurable, aeon-like
ability, an easily applied affliction that affects balances is most definitely
overpowered. Keep the cure simple: marjoram is fine, but a reduction in momentum
loss is acceptable.
---[Thul on 7/15 @ 01:37 writes]:
Momentum gain from kaife is overridden whenever you use a kick that loses
momentum. While there is at least one momentum loss attached and at 250 ka, the
only way a Nekotai is going to be spamming the skill is if they mind doing
nothing else at all, at terribly slow speeds. As far as spamming cleanse cures
go, this is already quite possible through a particularly dedicated Necromancy
user via Ectoplasm, or unless there's some catch which I'm not aware of,
Transmology's Bulbous Nose modification, which doesn't even appear to cost
power. Finally, I fail to see what Choke has to do with this argument at all, as
if you're standing around in a room being Choked, with a monk hitting you as
well, and all you're trying to do is cure, you're probably already screwed. That
is how the situation plays out currently, how it should logically play out, and
none of the above changes to Sprongk will alter that situation.
---[Sahmiam on 7/15 @ 05:45 writes]:
It is very much possible to sustain momentum with Kaife while using Sprongk.
Ectoplasm originally did not cost power and has since been changed to require
it. Given the history of Ectoplasm changes, I expect Transmology's Bulbous Nose
to be brought in line with Ectoplasm's costs rather than the other way around. I
think it's a bit too early in the game to be using Transmology or Harmonics
skills as justification for buffing old ones. Furthermore, an Ur'Guard spamming
Ectoplasm (knight is more similar to a monk than a guardian) will GREATLY reduce
their effectiveness in one on one combat to the point that they are incapable of
building wound levels against decent curing, stancing, and parrying at the
additional cost of balance and power. Sprongk would not cost power and not
hinder a Nekotai's offense to the same degree. Lastly, Choke does play a small
part into the argument. Choke, as you admit, allows a second person to kill the
choked target with relative ease. Just as Choke slows down curing, Sprongk would
do much the same by doubling sip, herbs, smoking, and applying balances. An
uncurable or a cleanse cure that doubles balances within the scope of this skill
is too overpowered solo, obscene in a group.
---[Thul on 7/15 @ 08:47 writes]:
When I say momentum gain is overridden, I don't mean that the gain and the loss
cancel each other out. I mean that the gain doesn't register at all and you just
lose the momentum. The situation you describe with the Ur'guard's combat
effectiveness is pretty much where a monk would be trying to spam this skill as
long as it retains any momentum loss. The ka cost would mean that you're only
getting that one attack off each round, and since Sprongk only affects curing as
opposed to all balances, this is something of a losing strategy. Unlike the
Ur'guard, they won't be losing power and they'll be doing a little bit of
damage, sure. But they've also got the possibility of missing entirely, and it
doesn't immediately hurt anyone's offense to just ignore a little extra curative
balance. HerbBane exists, by the way, and people seem to deal with that just
fine. And if you really insist on harping on Choke, please explain to me a
situation where you'd want to stay Choked in a room with a Night user and a
monk, where you need to sip/smoke/eat/apply twice in four seconds instead of
TUMBLING AWAY.
---[Raeri on 7/15 @ 13:05 writes]:
Would like to comment that herb bane, while noncurable, doesn't cause the
blocked herb to consume herb balance when it fires, so the time-to-cure lost is
basically depenant on the afflictee's ping/system response rate. Unless they're
under an aeon-style affliction. Not sure if that's what you meant, but figured
I'd just point out that people do fine with it because they tend to just spam-
eat the herbs until it works.