145413-botting-and-cheating-blame-how-we-can-fix-it-ourselves

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			So its been confirmed that Aion the mmo is heading to steam on the 29th. This mmo is published by Ncsoft. So it stands to reason that Wildstar more likely then not will also head over. Right now though there is a serious problem that has returned with a vengeance and its Bots.  Why Do people play a game.. and not want to actually play a game. It makes no sense to me. I understand for some its all on CArbine's feet. But it has to be on the feet of the players who look to exploit games. When Wildstar first launched.. there were players who realized that there was no rules against cheating in pvp. So they decided to cheat and keep cheating till the point they ruined the game for themselves. Then they blamed CArbine. Does there have to be a security fence around a neighbor's home in order for yourself to realize.. that hey.. Its wrong to go on their property? Does there have to be A sign on the beach saying.. don't swim at night.. Shark's  present? In order for you to not tempt fate and jump in? And when you get bit.. are you going to sue the county for not having a warning? I understand its frustrating for us honest players. But lets face it its all the damn cheaters that are the real jerks in this. They don't care about the future of this game or the community. They just want to dominate RIGHT NOW. They don't care about tomorrow or the long term. Its selfish desires that cause them to go ahead and look to exploit a game. So how can we as a community do something? If you run a guild and realize a guild mate is botting..Boot them. Don't give them a home. IF you see a player's character botting.. report them and Add them to a block list. Don't group with them. Shun them till they either give up or quit the game. This is what we can do as a community. 	
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			While I do appreciate the sentiment, does putting a PVP bot on "Ignore" actually keep you from being in a group with them? If not, then it's pointless. If so, eventually the honest players are going to end up waiting ages for a full-human match, as the HUNDREDS of current bots rotate through the queues.	
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			Would wait a bit to play with actual players then play with stupid bots.	
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So its been confirmed that Aion the mmo is heading to steam on the 29th. This mmo is published by Ncsoft. So it stands to reason that Wildstar more likely then not will also head over. Right now though there is a serious problem that has returned with a vengeance and its Bots.  Why Do people play a game.. and not want to actually play a game. It makes no sense to me. I understand for some its all on CArbine's feet. But it has to be on the feet of the players who look to exploit games. When Wildstar first launched.. there were players who realized that there was no rules against cheating in pvp. So they decided to cheat and keep cheating till the point they ruined the game for themselves. Then they blamed CArbine. Does there have to be a security fence around a neighbor's home in order for yourself to realize.. that hey.. Its wrong to go on their property? Does there have to be A sign on the beach saying.. don't swim at night.. Shark's  present? In order for you to not tempt fate and jump in? And when you get bit.. are you going to sue the county for not having a warning? I understand its frustrating for us honest players. But lets face it its all the damn cheaters that are the real jerks in this. They don't care about the future of this game or the community. They just want to dominate RIGHT NOW. They don't care about tomorrow or the long term. Its selfish desires that cause them to go ahead and look to exploit a game. So how can we as a community do something? If you run a guild and realize a guild mate is botting..Boot them. Don't give them a home. IF you see a player's character botting.. report them and Add them to a block list. Don't group with them. Shun them till they either give up or quit the game. This is what we can do as a community. 
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			What a silly post.. Ignoring and shunning a ROBOT is not going to make them stop queueing. Carbine needs to remove the bots, plain and simple.	
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			Um.. Bot farms.. to farm for gold.. are successful only because Players Buy gold. so Yes its on the players. Nuff  Said.	
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Um.. Bot farms.. to farm for gold.. are successful only because Players Buy gold. so Yes its on the players. Nuff  Said.
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			Massive gold sinks? Really? Where? I don't see any massive gold sinks. There are tons of ways to make money in this game.  Thats a terrible excuse used by cheaters.	
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But it's also on Carbine. if you put massive gold sinks into the game (as they have since F2P) then all you are doing is creating demand for the gold sellers and fanning the fire.
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Um.. Bot farms.. to farm for gold.. are successful only because Players Buy gold. so Yes its on the players. Nuff  Said.
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http://youtu.be/0dkkf5NEIo0
 
^ same principle that's happening in Wildstar.
 
There is a gold sink in this game and alas due to F2P credd sells a lot lower now and the farmers have been advertising to get more plat @ less RL money than what credd gets you, so silly players are taking the bait.	
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There is a gold sink in this game and alas due to F2P credd sells a lot lower now and the farmers have been advertising to get more plat @ less RL money than what credd gets you, so silly thrifty, clever players are taking the bait.
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Fixt.
 
Notice, I didn't say they were right. Sometimes being thrifty and clever is a bad thing.
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Agreed, Fixing the pvp bots is more a priority than the ones yelling out in the capital cities selling plat tho. 
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The bots yelling in capital cities are selling the gold that the PVP bots farmed up. Where you think they get the gold from?  :lol:
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			I've always wondered why it wouldn't be worth it to pay a moderator or GM who's sole job it is to sit in capital cities and monitor BGs, muting every gold-selling spammer that pops up. I know that supposedly collecting data and shutting them all down at the same time in one fel swoop is the better way, but I still think it would be worthwhile to mute/squelch the spammers anyway.   I also always wonder why someone would be stupid enough to give CC info to a shady 3rd party website too.  	
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I've always wondered why it wouldn't be worth it to pay a moderator or GM who's sole job it is to sit in capital cities and monitor BGs, muting every gold-selling spammer that pops up. I know that supposedly collecting data and shutting them all down at the same time in one fel swoop is the better way, but I still think it would be worthwhile to mute/squelch the spammers anyway.   
 
I also always wonder why someone would be stupid enough to give CC info to a shady 3rd party website too.
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I don't agree with the "ban them all in one swoop" method as it frankly barely works.
The bots will be gone for a few days at the most until the next wave comes.
(Over in WoW the bot problem got so bad that "top" arena players were running them in matches to do their skillshots for them and even perform rotations for them - most common with hunters and rogues.)
 
It has to be a constant fight so I do agree with hiring or or two moderators to just keep an eye on things.
It's better than just letting all of them run rampant - shutting down bots on a steady pace would help deter "actual" players from using them and leading to the issues other games have had.Nothing's really going to stop the gold sellers but quite frankly I'm more concerned about actual gameplay elements being utterly destroyed having watched it happen once before.	
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 "I have money to spare, I am tight on time.  I want to be able to keep doing things with my guild and raiding periodically, etc. but with the drop rates the way they are, I was falling behind.  THIS way I can keep up on the curve, still have fun with my guild AND have a social life."
 
So that is why some people do it.
 
I have no idea how you actually combat Gold sellers, as if there is a market, *SOMEONE* is going to supply it.
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I have no idea how you actually combat Gold sellers, as if there is a market, *SOMEONE* is going to supply it.
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I had a guild leader get reported for being a gold farmer because his name was the initials of his kids.  We made a joke about it and I started saying "NiHao!" any time I joined his group.
 
But yeah, the problem lies in there will always be people who pay for a short cut.  If  a player is caught, a temp ban at the least as well as total loss of gear/money should happen.  OR a deletion of the character too.  The player could come back, but they have to start over.  yeah - I like that.
 
Banning plat farmers, bot accts should be done by default.  You see em running around like a chicken with its head cut off and you ban them for a week.  If they come back and do again, do it again, 3 strikes and permaban.
 
Would that be so terrible? 
 
I liked the concept of the CREDD market.  IT was a way for people to buy sub time with in game currency, and people to basically buy plat with real currency.  It was a win - win.  The problem now is that CREDD has too little meaning.  The price on it has dropped to around 6-7 plat being offered.  That is less than HALF of what it used to go for.  Perhaps if there was a way to make CREDD more valuable, the price would go up.  *shrug* no idea really.
 
But banning and character wiping sounds like a good start to me.	
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I think you misunderstand my question. It wasn't why people do it. That's obvious: It's convenient.  LOTS of people have more money than time.  But I asked why someone would be stupid enough to give a third party website their CC number.  That's virtually ASKING to be ripped off, hacked, or to be the victim of identity theft.
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I had a guild leader get reported for being a gold farmer because his name was the initials of his kids.  We made a joke about it and I started saying "NiHao!" any time I joined his group.
 
But yeah, the problem lies in there will always be people who pay for a short cut.  If  a player is caught, a temp ban at the least as well as total loss of gear/money should happen.  OR a deletion of the character too.  The player could come back, but they have to start over.  yeah - I like that.
 
Banning plat farmers, bot accts should be done by default.  You see em running around like a chicken with its head cut off and you ban them for a week.  If they come back and do again, do it again, 3 strikes and permaban.
 
Would that be so terrible? 
 
I liked the concept of the CREDD market.  IT was a way for people to buy sub time with in game currency, and people to basically buy plat with real currency.  It was a win - win.  The problem now is that CREDD has too little meaning.  The price on it has dropped to around 6-7 plat being offered.  That is less than HALF of what it used to go for.  Perhaps if there was a way to make CREDD more valuable, the price would go up.  *shrug* no idea really.
 
But banning and character wiping sounds like a good start to me.
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Yeah, the bot people can make new accts and will be most likely to do so, the people who use those sites, they may or may not.  See when you have a level 50 that you put a lot of work into and suddenly that acct is deleted, it is a punishment.  Some will quit, others will start over, but be much less likely to use the gold seller again.  Now as word spreads of acct deletion, more and more players who were on the fence *MAY* back off and avoid said sellers.  In the long run, removing the market will drive the bots away.
 
So we need viable punishment to the people who use the sellers (as well as the sellers) AND we need a fix to the existing CREDD issues.  Right now CREDD is not worth anything, it costs 20 dollars a sub is 15.  Credd does not give the one who uses it a big value for the gold so the price has dropped to around 6 plat, credd needs to be bolstered so that it maybe gives a set amount of omnibits or service tokens as well, then maybe the price goes up.  Credd becomes more lucrative and players have even less reason to use gold sellers.	
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