119602-sorry-guys-cant-continue-supporting-w-in-its-condition

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I have played mmos since I was 13 years old. That is a total of 15 years. And I have NEVER made a goodbye post or something similar in any game, but I am so sad to leave Wildstar that I had to do one. I have tried to stick with it. To log in everyday. But today is my last day. I am level 20, on Luminai EU PvP server, and I can't convince myself anymore to beleive it is healthy and has zero problems. It is EMPTY. No one in Thayd it doesn't matter which time or which day you check. You never meet with people at any zone map. You get no conversation or replies from the global or zone chat. I had to try to contact a guild (which is the guild with more newbie players on the server btw) to join them for 2 weeks (!!!!!)  till I found someone online to get an invite. LFG NEVER EVER pops up, I have been trying to do my first adventure zone  (I really wanted to check it but I guess I will leave the game without seeing the adventure zones or dungeons :(  ) for 2 weeks and I never get a party (I am a tank...). These are just realistic examples of a low level player experience that just joins Wildstar and really wants to play it cause it is a great game.
 
I love the game. Every aspect of it. I would love to play and level my toon and do dungeons and progress and join a guild and do warplots and battlegrounds and dungeons and get to endgame and raid etc etc. I really want to do it. But it is impossible to enjoy it or even get to it with the state of the game at the moment, because you are always ALONE, and if you get lucky and get inside a guild, the guild is always empty or 5 lv50s online at peek hours and even with that, dungeons, battlegrounds or Open world pvp never happen...
 
I know, I could change to a PvE server, but I won't. I need a PvP server in my mmos, it is one of the main reasons I choose to play a mmorpg over other one, and Wildstar was designed to have pvp servers and open world pvp (the launch feature trailer even shows it).
 
I really want to play, I would love to come back very soon, but seriously, something NEEDS TO CHANGE and it has to change NOW. By now, I mean in December, or January if you want to be risky. Dont make it free to play, that would suck. But stop getting more content ot whatever you are working on no Carbine, and invest on publicity, make promotions, make a free trial, make come back campaigns, make people return to PvP servers if they changed, make the game B2P with a subscription option, I don't know. But your game is dying. I am a lover of the game, not a hater. But I want to play with people, more if I have to pay a subscription and a box price. I can't really beleive you are all so blinded at the real state of the game.
 
 	
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I really support your decision. For a few days now I can't force myself to even log in because the state of the game upsets me. I'm a leader of one of the two major guilds on Luminai. Our concurrency is pathetic. Server has less than 50 people in /who majority of the time. What can you even do? Dailies? And I tried, I tried, I tried to get attention of Carbine. And for what? They refuse to even discuss what they're planning. So I'm going to assume that they're okay with dead PvP servers.https://forums.wildstar-online.com/forums/index.php?/topic/119502-bandaid-for-pvp-servers/https://forums.wildstar-online.com/forums/index.php?/topic/119250-what-will-be-done-about-the-state-of-pvp/I even talked to the support and these are the answers I got: "Hello there Simona!
Thank you for contacting WildStar Support Team.
I know how frustrating it is to not be able to crack some skulls and unleash the beast inside you for PvP.
Kidding aside, thank you so much for letting us know about this. The Development Team is aware of this issue and they are working on a resolution, however we don't have a fix or workaround for this quite yet. Please keep an eye on our forum posts where we are tracking known issues and providing updates as we have them. Please also be sure to review the Game Updates section of the forums regularly as any bug fixes or new content will be posted there.
Open Issues:https://forums.wildstar-online.com/forums/index.php?/topic/85171-top-known-issues-open/
Game Updates: https://forums.wildstar-online.com/forums/index.php?/forum/99-game-updates/
Please note that the open known issues thread is not a comprehensive list of all of the issues the Development Team is working to resolve. If your issue is not listed, don’t worry; this doesn’t mean the issue is not being investigated. If you have any other questions, please let us know.
Also, we cannot do anything with regards the population of the server. If you want, you and your friends or guildmates can use the free realm transfer to transfer to the Jabbit server.
And one more thing, if you log into your forum account, and then click on “Forums” and in the list of forum discussions, there is one called “General Discussion,” which I've linked for you below:
https://forums.wildstar-online.com/forums/index.php?/forum/102-general-discussion/
The developers are reading that forum thread constantly. If you can, please go there and submit any feedback or request that you have.
Thanks for helping to make WildStar great!
With warmest regards,
GarryWildStar Support Team""Hello again, Simona!
First of all let me assure you that we at Game Support do everything we can to assist the players to the best of our capabilities. While it may seem like your opinions go unnoticed let me assure you that all comments and suggestions are being reviewed by the Devs and they are doing what they can for the fanbase. We can only ask for your patience and understanding while this matter is being handled accordingly. Again, any news about the game will be posted in the Forums and on our Social Media Sites.
If you have any other concern, please don't hesitate to contact us again.
Regards,
NikkoWildStar Support Team"We're probably in the minority by now, so the company simply disregards our existence. The problem with that is that MMOs with one dead side, tend to die completely. 	
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			Everyone on Luminai transferred to the other server a couple months back. Why not take advantage of the free transfer and join the rest of the population?	
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Everyone on Luminai transferred to the other server a couple months back. Why not take advantage of the free transfer and join the rest of the population?
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and what to do there? 
Open world PvP is a no go, 
Practice battlegrounds, arenas, rated battlegrounds, arenas, have the same chance of popping, which is 0. 
Dungeons have the same chance of popping, which is 0,
 
so what? Raid? That's it? 
 
There's more than just the pvp servers that are dead by now.
 
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I've given Carbine nurmerous amounts of advice over the time I've been here, for almost a year now.
Unfortunately a lot of people have, and Carbine listened to all the wrong people for all the wrong reasons.
 
Too many people asking for too large scale of content implements, too many people asking for more and more PVP options and not realizing that the more options they create the less people will be able to play consistantly.
Rated gear... why
Dual Factions... why?!
Poor guild implements...
Poor questing mechanics(why the hell do some quests count for all players and why do some quests count for only one sometimes in a party??? Really?)
Warplots, and other wastes of time where as there would have been far better older PVP mechanics that would have served the same purpose with a far better support.
Supershort leveling cap, with fluff being imbalanced and rather annoying at times.
 
Housing is about the most fantastic thing they did, and the 20 player raids are fantastic, Datascape being swapped to 20 players is fantastic. Drusera instances, fantastic, Omnicore please for the love of the Weave let us skip bell walkers rambling and then it will be fantastic, Combat system FANTASTIC.
 
So many great ideas and yet at the same time, so many screw ups that are damning this game.
 
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Don't rely on the queue system... there was a time when people didn't have this nifty queue system. Back then you would organize yourselves in town. I would recommend transferring to jabbit and giving it a shot. In a week if you're not happy, quit.
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You realize though that alot of games before the LFG systems had party boards that you could see what active parties were around and looking for people right?
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			I don't see why Carbine don't implement some of the ideas users on here have come up with. There are so many good ones to fix PvP as well as several other aspects of the game. We've basically done all the thinking for them. All they'd need to do is implement them. TBH it seems kind of pointless for us to suggest anything since most, if not all, of the ideas end up being ignored :(	
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and what to do there? 
Open world PvP is a no go, 
Practice battlegrounds, arenas, rated battlegrounds, arenas, have the same chance of popping, which is 0. 
Dungeons have the same chance of popping, which is 0,
 
so what? Raid? That's it? 
 
There's more than just the pvp servers that are dead by now.
 
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			Yep, most people know how to find a group without the LFG tool.   But rather than get sidetracked by a tree, lets look at the forest - LFG isn't working.  Because there aren't people.   Sure you can forge a mighty group occasionally by asking (begging), but.... if there aren't the people... the point is about the people...  y'know, and the game.  and the people in the game.  which, if they were copious, would be seen in LFG...  statistical indicators of overall health...  actually, never mind.   The game is doing great, it's probably just that LFG is bugged.  Come the next hotfix all those queues will pop.   Rite?	
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What are you talking about?
 
Wherever I go there's always some exile fools asking for a gank when I go to a daily quest area. If you're playing exile that's your choice, don't blame the game. You have chosen the most populated faction by far, which always, always sucks for pvp related things, no matter which game you play. :)
 
I can get dungeon queues quite reliably. I'm a dps so it takes time but getting 2-3 dungeon queues during the evening has never been an issue for me. I don't try to get more during week days because that's enough for me, I'm mentally exhausted after 1h or 2 of dungeon crawling here. Just as a reminder there are 3 times (more or less, that's just my guess) more exiles... So your pve queues should be a lot better. Tried to queue as a healbot or tank lately?
 
Practice battlegrounds... I could play that all the time if I was willing to pvp more. Queues are so fast that sometimes I don't have time to vendor the crap we get in reward boxes. But yeah, dominion. Always pick the evil side if you ever want to have an interesting pvp experience, that's a rule for all MMOs.
 
And I'm on Jabbit. Queues are cross server. I see many players from luminai in battlegrounds (the potato guys, surely you know them). So you're either not playing when everyone else does, or you've just not tried and made a rage post full of crap, because this is simply not true.
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The game is doing great, it's probably just that LFG is bugged.
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			If you like the game, you stay.	
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Do you even read my first post? I AM a tank. I queu as a tank combined with DPS and I have been 2 whole weeks playing daily trying to get to my first adventure zone (level 15, I am level 20 already) and I could not find a group, neither with the LFG tool or inside a circle made for newbies in Luminai Server (the maximum players online I have seen there was 4). I also tried to join a guild, and again the same, 5-6 players and all level 50.
 
Don't you see that you are just thinking as a high level player? This game is empty. It is bleeding subs and players each hour. Luminai server is empty. What it needs is NEW PLAYERS, which won't be at the daily quest maps, but at Thayd, at newbie areas, middle-level areas etc. All of those are empty. And half of the great content of the game like adventures, dungeons or battlegrounds aren't playable for the few new newbies because they never get the chance to form a group.
 
Keep playing as a level 50 and thinking the game is fine because you can use 10000 different ways from the ingame way (LFG tool, which should be efficient an sufficient ) to get a group to do your hard mode dungeon or your daylies, meanwhile low level players will buy the game, pay a sub and play 3 weeks and leave because there are no players in the main capital cities, no people around to chat with or party or do open world pvp or form groups etc etc etc. And in less than you think, your level 50 toon will be deleted because the game will have to close.
 
I am a low level player, experienced mmorpg player which loves wildstar and really wants to play and tried hard. And the reality is the one I explained in the first post. You can tell me to change server, you can tell me to look for groups joining 40 circles or paying the game to 10 friends of mine so they try the game, and any other stupid argument you want to give, but all of them are useless. There is a very BIG problem with Wildstar's state. If  the game by itself can't  not make it easy to group with people because there are none, or to see low level players because there are none, or to make me doubt to which guild I should join because there is only ONE viable guild to join in the whole server... low level players leave. Like me. Like many. And it is sad, because many people love the game but there is no game without people.
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Anyway I wouldn't be surprised if the devs make a forced open pvp daily quests zone at some point, and then the very concept of pvp servers would be irrelevant. That's what I'm expecting. A final pve/pvp servers merge and a new kind of content to make everyone happy with it.
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If you like the game, you stay.
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The day they make a forced PvP daily quest zone is the day this game's PvE community will walk away and never look back.
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https://forums.wildstar-online.com/forums/index.php?/topic/85171-top-known-issues-open/
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 :lol: Oh, wow. This game's management may not know what they're doing, but I'll at least give them credit for knowing better than to do THIS.
 
The day they make a forced PvP daily quest zone is the day this game's PvE community will walk away and never look back.
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Another suggestion is to play both support and DPS specs and queue up as both. If there are 100 dps in queue and no tanks.. well you'll be waiting a long while.
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I think that "PvPers" voted already... The fact that the open PvP server is dying is the answer you need. That formula simply didn't cut it on WS. If you value Open PvP over the rest of the game, sadly you are in the wrong game...
 
...Paradoxically I hate RPG games that support Open PvP... They are just nest of gankers that simply look for ways to grief other players after accumulating piles of loot/stats/levels earned somewhere far from direct PvP, so for one part I'm glad to see this dissapearing from WS (I'm also thinking that Luminai will be simply merged into Jabbit at some point)...
 
...But I understand you fully when you come to a game following a promise and you find yourself shouting in the desert... I know it very well...
 
...I came to Wildstar to enjoy 40 men raids... Go figure :(.	
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 :lol: Oh, wow. This game's management may not know what they're doing, but I'll at least give them credit for knowing better than to do THIS.
 
The day they make a forced PvP daily quest zone is the day this game's PvE community will walk away and never look back.
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I think that "PvPers" voted already... The fact that the open PvP server is dying is the answer you need. That formula simply didn't cut it on WS. If you value Open PvP over the rest of the game, sadly you are in the wrong game...
 
...Paradoxically I hate RPG games that support Open PvP... They are just nest of gankers that simply look for ways to grief other players after accumulating piles of loot/stats/levels earned somewhere far from direct PvP, so for one part I'm glad to see this dissapearing from WS (I'm also thinking that Luminai will be simply merged into Jabbit at some point)...
 
...But I understand you fully when you come to a game following a promise and you find yourself shouting in the desert... I know it very well...
 
...I came to Wildstar to enjoy 40 men raids... Go figure :(.
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Please can we stop bringing up that "jabbit is the best server". It is just a server which has more people on it.
 
Luminai is not fine, but at the same time our guild populates dominion and whatever server we are on should not change how long queues are, hence why we did not move.
 
Oh and the queue system is broken. Reason I stopped logging in is because I will wait in a queue for almost 2 hours prime time to get no practise battleground pops at prime time EU.
 
If that doesn't point to a broken system I don't know what does.	
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I've given Carbine nurmerous amounts of advice over the time I've been here, for almost a year now.
Unfortunately a lot of people have, and Carbine listened to all the wrong people for all the wrong reasons.
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that's kind of the point. If a game launched with pvp and pve, shouldn't they be getting equal treatment and care? How long has Wildstar been without a PvP lead even? 
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I've given Carbine nurmerous amounts of advice over the time I've been here, for almost a year now.
Unfortunately a lot of people have, and Carbine listened to all the wrong people for all the wrong reasons.
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I keep seeing this repeated over and over and over and over again but its simply not true at all. Carbine pretty much listened rarely anyone on the forums.
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			I love the game but population is an issue so I better leave and perpetuate it.  Such a vicious cycle, just waiting for Carbine to fix the current state of the game, maybe they can tie people to their computers and make them play only WS somehow.But seriously, put on some big boy pants and level to 50 (maybe transfer to jabbit) or come back for drop 4 when there may be more pushes for advertising WS and getting more players and such. No one is under any obligation but I like WS and I continue playing because other MMOs are essentially junk anyways.Not to mention by the time drop 4 comes out WoD hype will be back to WoD lull, it's already pretty dull based on the raids I've watched.	
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that's kind of the point. If a game launched with pvp and pve, shouldn't they be getting equal treatment and care? How long has Wildstar been without a PvP lead even?  -_-
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Am I the only one who does NOT agree with this guy at all? I am also a new player. Probably joined the game where it was even more empty as it is now (Drop 3 brought some ppl back). Yes, the game SEEMS empty, but its really not. I managed to push through, get myself to 50 and now I am half way done with my attunement by just queuing up to dungeons + adventures, joined a guild etc etc.
 
Trying 2 weeks as a tank to get a group and did not happen to you? What a bunch of cup****! I que to low lvl and veteran dungeons DAILY and get a group really fast and I am not even a tank. With that role in my group I get an INSTANT match! Just yesterday did 5 runs within 3 hours and all that queuing up alone as a healer and dps.
 
My advice is, if you like the game, suck it up! Enjoy the game, turn a blind eye to its empty feeling (bc it is only a feeling), keep trying to join a guild, get to lvl 50 and start doing some serious stuff and you'll find plenty of ppl to do it with. Most people are 50, so you should be expecting not much going on on the lower zones.
 
Keep on rollin'!	
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and what to do there? 
Open world PvP is a no go, 
Practice battlegrounds, arenas, rated battlegrounds, arenas, have the same chance of popping, which is 0. 
Dungeons have the same chance of popping, which is 0,
 
so what? Raid? That's it? 
 
There's more than just the pvp servers that are dead by now.
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At this point- sorry for stating the obvious here- but it sounds like you're being really prideful.
Come to Jabbit. It's honestly not that bad for pvpers. We've got open world pvp happening all the time, I see it during the Defile zone- people get side tracked a lot and go on killing sprees. It's a fun sight to behold to be honest!
 
As for the queues. You may need to look for an active guild that does everything. A guild that has the numbers to support queuing together for BGs and arenas and dungeons.
 
Cause I've not been sinking in this dead game as so many people like to call it. But then again, I'm blessed with a populated, active guild that will jump at the chance to help its members.
 
I still see a lively population full of people who love this game. Sure, Carbine has it's issues but I've got faith. I love this game, I love the art, I love the lore. I've never been so challenged before. Before ya'll say I have no experience in PvP- I've been hosting warplots and forming arena teams for my guild.
 
I'm sorry Luminai is dying- I really am. But there's a solution here and pride is standing in your way.
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I don't think its pride but rather "shit's not working like it should, can yall fix it please?"
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I don't think its pride but rather "shit's not working like it should, can yall fix it please?"
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It's pride to not come to Jabbit, it's as simple as that.
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I have played mmos since I was 13 years old. That is a total of 15 years. And I have NEVER made a goodbye post or something similar in any game, but I am so sad to leave Wildstar that I had to do one. I have tried to stick with it. To log in everyday. But today is my last day. I am level 20, on Luminai EU PvP server, and I can't convince myself anymore to beleive it is healthy and has zero problems. It is EMPTY. No one in Thayd it doesn't matter which time or which day you check. You never meet with people at any zone map. You get no conversation or replies from the global or zone chat. I had to try to contact a guild (which is the guild with more newbie players on the server btw) to join them for 2 weeks (!!!!!)  till I found someone online to get an invite. LFG NEVER EVER pops up, I have been trying to do my first adventure zone  (I really wanted to check it but I guess I will leave the game without seeing the adventure zones or dungeons :(  ) for 2 weeks and I never get a party (I am a tank...). These are just realistic examples of a low level player experience that just joins Wildstar and really wants to play it cause it is a great game.
 
I love the game. Every aspect of it. I would love to play and level my toon and do dungeons and progress and join a guild and do warplots and battlegrounds and dungeons and get to endgame and raid etc etc. I really want to do it. But it is impossible to enjoy it or even get to it with the state of the game at the moment, because you are always ALONE, and if you get lucky and get inside a guild, the guild is always empty or 5 lv50s online at peek hours and even with that, dungeons, battlegrounds or Open world pvp never happen...
 
I know, I could change to a PvE server, but I won't. I need a PvP server in my mmos, it is one of the main reasons I choose to play a mmorpg over other one, and Wildstar was designed to have pvp servers and open world pvp (the launch feature trailer even shows it).
 
I really want to play, I would love to come back very soon, but seriously, something NEEDS TO CHANGE and it has to change NOW. By now, I mean in December, or January if you want to be risky. Dont make it free to play, that would suck. But stop getting more content ot whatever you are working on no Carbine, and invest on publicity, make promotions, make a free trial, make come back campaigns, make people return to PvP servers if they changed, make the game B2P with a subscription option, I don't know. But your game is dying. I am a lover of the game, not a hater. But I want to play with people, more if I have to pay a subscription and a box price. I can't really beleive you are all so blinded at the real state of the game.
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At this point- sorry for stating the obvious here- but it sounds like you're being really prideful.
Come to Jabbit. It's honestly not that bad for pvpers. We've got open world pvp happening all the time, I see it during the Defile zone- people get side tracked a lot and go on killing sprees. It's a fun sight to behold to be honest!
 
As for the queues. You may need to look for an active guild that does everything. A guild that has the numbers to support queuing together for BGs and arenas and dungeons.
 
Cause I've not been sinking in this dead game as so many people like to call it. But then again, I'm blessed with a populated, active guild that will jump at the chance to help its members.
 
I still see a lively population full of people who love this game. Sure, Carbine has it's issues but I've got faith. I love this game, I love the art, I love the lore. I've never been so challenged before. Before ya'll say I have no experience in PvP- I've been hosting warplots and forming arena teams for my guild.
 
I'm sorry Luminai is dying- I really am. But there's a solution here and pride is standing in your way.
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That's why I put the example of 40men raids... The targeted population "marked for extermination" is diametrically different... But the effect is exactly the same.
 
I have a friend that refers to all this MMO marketing strategy as "selling the box". It's about announcing a pile of features, luring ppl into buying/subbing and then AFTER release you perform a reliable metrics analysis on what your playerbase is really doing and decide to priorize further development based on that REAL data extracted from your players (This, obviously, is a biased way to get data, because if your launch state prevents certain parts of your playerbase to do what they were promised, their "tastes" will inevitably score lower on any metrics).
 
This is what seems to be happening here... After the layoffs, Carbine staff is just priorizing into the sections of their playerbase they consider "the future" (ie solo casuals). What you have to do as individual, imho, is identifying your tastes and the exact point at which this product will not cover them and then let it be and look for alternatives (ie "voting with your wallet").
 
Notice that this kind of 180º turns are rarely taken by the Developer of the game... Are enforced by the owner when, obviously, wants to get a profit (This is usually marked by key figures in the creative department of the Developer going away... When the original roadmap they invested years to create is suddenly twisted by the owner, it's usually a hard blow to swallow). Usually this translates to a "streamlined" clone of WoW aimed at making it "appealing" to current WoW playerbase. This, in turn, make ppl really looking for MMO approaches different from it to start wandering again looking for a new "home". Until the "niche" you belong to doesn't grow enough to be able to sustain its specialized tittle (This is the clue I'm looking for this days the most... Tittles with very specific features, instead of "all-in-one" wonders that end like this), we are cursed to keep wandering around "buying boxes" based on promises that aren't kept after launch.
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The only thing we want is for the queue system to WORK so we can pvp 
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This interesting... Why you need the queue to PvP at all? 
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This interesting... Why you need the queue to PvP at all? It's a rethorical question to highlight how the basic problem here is that users like to blame Carbine about their own decissions, while at the same time they do not realize their own actions damage what, in theory, want to see it reinforced... When freedom was given, the mayority of players in Luminai put their priorities in order... Result = Bottom priority was Open World PvP.
 
I was reading with attention when some "Messiahs" back in the day that were advocating that the opening of PvE -> PvP transfers was the "cure"... Given, Result? Nothing... Priorities are still in the same order.
 
The curse of the Open PvP player is that it needs visble (and reachable) opposition... So they require a minimum population to support their gameplay. Some ppl is blaming specific aspects of WS because they are the current "hate target" but Open world PvP has a well known list of enemies:
 
- Safe Zones.
 
- Instant Travelling.
 
- Heavy Instancing.
 
- Gear/Level/Faction high advantages.
 
Well, WS have all this "enemies" from day-0... How the hell did you really expect this was going to end well?.
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P.S. there's solo casuals that were PvP oriented. There are solo casuals on Luminai that are PVE oriented. Either way from our server you can't get a group trough LFG, so I don't see how they're prioritizing them. 
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Oh... Well, LFG queues are Datacenter-wide if you disable "server only", so queue problem is gamewide, not restricted to a particular server (True needs to be said that due to how PvP mechanics work on WS the proportion of tanks present on Luminai should be much lower, meaning that the population on Luminai is heavily biased to DPS which would make the average Luminai player to wait longer).
 
Regarding why they are priorizing solo casuals... It's not restricted to PvP alone. I till take the risk of using my Crystal Ball and tell you that the "Gear Revamp" due to Drop 4 may give all of us a clearer insight on were the game is going... And if you have been following NCSoft way to operate recently, you will also be expecting an specific announcement right after Christmass pass and Drop 4 start to be announced.
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Sorry if you missed the memo but most of the pvp'ers joined specifically for the instanced pvp. Namely Arena, RBG and warplots.  
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Coupled with:
 
I think you have the answer you need already... It's not Carbine, but the playerbase it attracted... it's exactly the same reasson on why 40-men is to be erradicated, the players that support it have dissapeared for whatever reasson you want to bring in... We don't have timemachines to get them back...  Can you blame NCSoft for wanting to have profits on their investment?
 
Don't you understand that when you are in instanced PvP you are invisible to players looking for open world PvP?... The enemy to beat to have massive events on any MMO (Doesn't matter if they are PvE or PvP oriented) is Community fragmentation (Server segregation, Faction segregation, etc, etc). The problem is that ppl asks for features thinking they aren't related, while in fact, they are asking precissely for features that, over time, ALWAYS evolve into this situations, game, after game... After game. It's not the 1st time this happens, and, I'm afraid, will not be the last.
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That's the problem. We're queueing with "server only" disabled. Meaning that either the queues are broken, or nobody queues from both servers at all.  
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 If you are refering to PvP queues... You should have seen this coming... Question: Do you really think the reasson behind Leaderboard Site removal was the actual one advertised?
 
Or maybe the fact that it was a tool to meassure objectively how much PvPers were really participating actively in this game and was showing on its 1st week, lets be politically correct, an alarming tendency that could create a cascade effect similar as to what some ppl is blaming now on why Luminai is a desert?
 
I just want you to perceive the situation of PvP in WS from my eyes... Perceived population (All those phrases that start by "5k players and more than 50% of them participating..." or "most ppl is interested in [insert here poster prefered gameplay]") is ALWAYS extremely subjective because precissely no sane MMO owner allows players to have a clear idea on how many of each playing type are playing together.
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{| class="blockquote"
Dude... What people? Server concurrency is less than 50 online at the same time. 
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Despite how things look, I find it very hard to believe wildstar is dead. If anything it is sleeping. I will play wildstar to some extent until it shuts down, whether that is next year or in 50 years because I do think it is an excellent game with some great content and one of the best combat systems ive ever had the pleasure of using. However there is no way in hell I will be subscribing long term. Ive got about 6 subscription only mmo's on my roster and about 40 f2p games. Out of the 4-6 sub mmo's ive chosen(including wildstar) only wow and maybe eve online has earned my dedication for an indefinite and potentially lifelong subscription. The others will only get a few months per year as long as they stay subscription. It is very hard to justify $150 per year when you could go for weeks or months without playing more than an hour or two a week. A subscription also sort of traps you, if you dont pay you cant even log in.. so why heavily invest in something that you will be forced to resubscribe to at a later date even if you only want to for a few hours or days at a time. it makes it very hard to ever justify a return once you leave.
 
 
Wildstar and carbine definatley don't deserve all the negative publicity they have gotten. They created a unique  feature rich game comparable to wow in its 4th or 5th year of operation. This crisis Wildstar has found itself in is now one of perception. They have fixed most of the weaker areas and early problems, and have been releasing good content, but the damage is done and it will take time to regain confidence with their existing users who left and to attract new players. I think that if they truly made a mistake it was not anticipating and reacting to the way the market has changed over the past 5 years. The only new mainstream MMO to come out that MIGHT have been successful enough to sustain itself is ESO. There is also FFXIV although it took them a few years to make it work. If there are any others I cant think of them. I would also be willing to bet ESO would have been in a similar situation as wildstar is now in if it didnt have its strong existing IP and fanbase to draw upon.
 
I am hopeful that they are at the very least building a solid plan to turn things around.	
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			I would 100% agree that PvP state of the game needs to change and we def need weekly patches.	
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{| class="blockquote"
veteran dungeons 
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That's the danger about subjectivity... Precissely yesterday at an awfull time (12:15 GMT) we queued for... *drums* Veteran Crimelords to help an alt attuned... Result = Instant Team. Followed soon after by a Veteran STL, result? Instant Team.
 
Magic Recipe? Nothing special... Healer and Tank in team already... The 2 remaining DPSers poped from thin air in seconds.
 
The problem is that no ammount of population can solve the waiting times when an activity is controlled by a certain type of players. In the case of PvE queues is very simple as average waiting time tells you exactly the proportion of players using specific roles. If you always need a tank to do a run... And the average run takes like 1h to finish... If you aren't a tank you will have to wait on the average 30m doesn't matter if there are 10 tanks and 100 DPSers or 1 million tanks and 10 million DPSers (The numbers are aprox., ofc, but wanted to show what a bottleneck is like on PvE queues that are easier to model).
 
...The case of WS PvP queues is that they have been made more complex over time with a series of extra checks so I have no clue which type of player is controlling them... Just do an effort in checking which profile of PvPers is actually enjoying them (I'm sure Carbine know perfectly this) and try to become one like it if you are tired of waiting.
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queueing as healer and DPS. Normally a queue doesn't pop for hours even on prime time. Turn back time by around 3 weeks or so and I was getting groups in 10-20 minutes.  
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I've given Carbine nurmerous amounts of advice over the time I've been here, for almost a year now.
Unfortunately a lot of people have, and Carbine listened to all the wrong people for all the wrong reasons.
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{| class="blockquote"
I've given Carbine nurmerous amounts of advice over the time I've been here, for almost a year now.
Unfortunately a lot of people have, and Carbine listened to all the wrong people for all the wrong reasons.
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Examples? (Where they listened to "all the wrong people"? Please, not f2p again.................)
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Let's be fair here, what people really mean when they say they listen to the wrong people is "they didn't listen to my opinion" which is kinda obvious from the first example.
 
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This is why there was no rollback. Go back and read what Tony said again.
 
 
 
The focus is all on "we will punish the bad people and take their stuff." No where in there does he guarantee that the items or plat that have been cycled through the market will be affected in any way. 
 
The amount of plat you get for 20 bucks just shot through the roof. I guarantee you that cash sales of CREDD just shot through the roof. The exploiters have just been told "you have 24 hours to move everything to other accounts, gift it to friends, launder it through the market."
 
This is fundamentally no different from what Carbine did when they announced that ratings tankers in PvP would be banned once drop 2 went out. Once people knew that they'd be just fine until then, they redoubled their efforts to keep milking the system for plat as hard as they could before the party was over.
 
And Carbine raked in the proceeds from the CREDD sales the entire time.
 
Tony, I get that you need the money. I get that it must be really agonizing to look at the cash you're pulling in from CREDD right now and question whether you should keep it or give it back. And I'm not going to make some smarmy argument about you should do a rollback and send that money back because it's the right thing to do. Your job is to make money. Not doing a rollback lets you keep the money. I get that.
 
The reason to do a rollback and give that money back is because when you make a profit off of some of your players cheating, the rest of us slowly come to realize that even if you didn't directly plan it with them, even if you didn't actively collaborate with them, you put the system in place where you could make a profit off of the damage to the game that happens when cheaters trash the experience for the rest of us.
 
If you don't make it clear that you refuse to make that profit, then what you do make clear is that you're just fine with making a buck off of your customers getting screwed, as long as there's someone to punish for it other than you. And when that happens, a lot of people will walk away and never come back.
 
Your game took a real hit from what happened here a few months ago with PvP. What you choose to do here can cause it to take another real hit.
 
Choose wisely. Because the players are listening.
 
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Let's be fair here, what people really mean when they say they listen to the wrong people is "they didn't listen to my opinion" which is kinda obvious from the first example.
 
Thanks for the links, sorry they didn't validate your opinion in any case whether it be good or bad. Wintrading is obviously a bad thing and all but I was fine with no rollback personally.
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I must say I wasn't aware of that. With that in mind, I offer the following bit of wisdom:
 
What the pickle was that, Carbine?	
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No, let's be fair and focus on the post that I linked to--Cougar's--instead of the one you quoted, which I didn't link to.
 
The link was to Cougar's post, because the thing they listened to was a bunch of cheaters who were worried that they might get punished for cheating. And they wanted to make sure those cheaters would have some peace of mind. That's listening to the wrong people.
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Mhm, so they got everyone together and said we're going to listen to the exploiters harming their MMO. I believe it, when you put it that way at least.
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At one point yesterday I heard that over 300 accounts had been actioned, and it wasn't the final tally by any stretch. 
 
We are issuing perma bans, 7 day bans, and 3 day bans based on the severity of the exploiting, and the overall damage done to the economy through laundering (yes we can see them doing that - if you make it harder on CS to fix, we come down harder on you in the punishment). The leniency clause was as much to provide a security blanket to those people who sampled the exploit out of curiosity as it was to save us some time on hunting down each one of the exploiters. One point late in the evening last night, over 40 people had already written in - some of whom had gained only 8 plat, others who had perma bans, and a everything in between. I can't count how many people were asking me in game when I was chatting with people, "if I only did it once, am I okay?" The response to that is "contact CS and you shouldn't have anything to worry about" given the leniency clause. The value of that peace of mind is extremely important given how many Good People might have been concerned because they touched the poisoned fruit once and then remembered they were good people  :)
 
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{| class="blockquote"
Let's be fair here, what people really mean when they say they listen to the wrong people is "they didn't listen to my opinion" which is kinda obvious from the first example.
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{| class="blockquote"
 
 
 
I guess the wrong people told them to do that too? Look we both know what's going on here, you feel you're a good honest player and that all the exploiters should have all been banned forever no matter how few times they did it. Since they decided on letting some of the exploiters get away with a lighter sentence you feel they listened to the wrong people.
 
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			Do we really have to continue this tinfoil war that happened like 2-3 weeks ago? 	
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Not one confirmed record of any perma bans given that has arisen on the forums or on reddit or twitter. Giving 3 day and 7 day slaps on the wrists for cheating and creating hundreds and thousands of illicit plat is a joke. Everyone (except you maybe) knows it is a joke. Problem is if they had any integrity and actually banned people like they should have they would have lost 100's of raiders. When the game is in this sorry of a state and raiders are your bread and butter, you are not going to do that. Which is exactly what happened.
 
Dead game = dead.
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{| class="blockquote"
Or maybe they are thinking long term, and realised that any damage to the economy will be a small blip in the lifespan of the game?
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{| class="blockquote"
Or maybe they are thinking long term, and realised that any damage to the economy will be a small blip in the lifespan of the game?
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I have played mmos since I was 13 years old. That is a total of 15 years. And I have NEVER made a goodbye post or something similar in any game, but I am so sad to leave Wildstar that I had to do one. I have tried to stick with it. To log in everyday. But today is my last day. I am level 20, on Luminai EU PvP server, and I can't convince myself anymore to beleive it is healthy and has zero problems. It is EMPTY. No one in Thayd it doesn't matter which time or which day you check. You never meet with people at any zone map. You get no conversation or replies from the global or zone chat. I had to try to contact a guild (which is the guild with more newbie players on the server btw) to join them for 2 weeks (!!!!!)  till I found someone online to get an invite. LFG NEVER EVER pops up, I have been trying to do my first adventure zone  (I really wanted to check it but I guess I will leave the game without seeing the adventure zones or dungeons :(  ) for 2 weeks and I never get a party (I am a tank...). These are just realistic examples of a low level player experience that just joins Wildstar and really wants to play it cause it is a great game.
 
I love the game. Every aspect of it. I would love to play and level my toon and do dungeons and progress and join a guild and do warplots and battlegrounds and dungeons and get to endgame and raid etc etc. I really want to do it. But it is impossible to enjoy it or even get to it with the state of the game at the moment, because you are always ALONE, and if you get lucky and get inside a guild, the guild is always empty or 5 lv50s online at peek hours and even with that, dungeons, battlegrounds or Open world pvp never happen...
 
I know, I could change to a PvE server, but I won't. I need a PvP server in my mmos, it is one of the main reasons I choose to play a mmorpg over other one, and Wildstar was designed to have pvp servers and open world pvp (the launch feature trailer even shows it).
 
I really want to play, I would love to come back very soon, but seriously, something NEEDS TO CHANGE and it has to change NOW. By now, I mean in December, or January if you want to be risky. Dont make it free to play, that would suck. But stop getting more content ot whatever you are working on no Carbine, and invest on publicity, make promotions, make a free trial, make come back campaigns, make people return to PvP servers if they changed, make the game B2P with a subscription option, I don't know. But your game is dying. I am a lover of the game, not a hater. But I want to play with people, more if I have to pay a subscription and a box price. I can't really beleive you are all so blinded at the real state of the game.
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Letting cheaters stay in the game without a substantive punishment to deter them from cheating again is the exact opposite of "thinking long term", so... not so much, no.
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Hello there,
 
I'll just drop a small comment regarding exploiters and suspension.
 
Customer Support couldn't care less if you are a Raider or not. They define criteria and set thresholds to determine who should be suspended or not. There is no such thing as a VIP treatment because you Raid. If you meet the criteria defined by Customer Support to be suspended/terminated, then you will. You name/popularity will not save you, I really want to make that point clear.
 
If you believe that you have been treated unfairly, then please reach out to us so we can escalate that case.
 
I would like to stress out that whatever players may say after being suspended often differ from what actually happened. In many cases people state to either have done "nothing wrong" or minimize what they have actually done. We won't call that out publicly because we want to protect our customers and we believe that investigations should remain private, between incriminated players and our teams. Regardless of how badly someone cheated / violated our rules, nobody deserves to be exposed publicly. We aren't fond of public trials, transparency has its limit. It doesn't mean that because nothing is visible publicly that our Customer Support team is slacking or is being too lenient. 
 
I understand that from a Community point of view this can be really frustrating (not to have any solid proof on actions being taken), sadly there is no way for us to give any proof without compromising the privacy of players, so all we can do is try to give you global data during mass actions (like Cougar did).	
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{| class="blockquote"
Hello there,
 
I'll just drop a small comment regarding exploiters and suspension.
 
Customer Support couldn't care less if you are a Raider or not. They define criteria and set thresholds to determine who should be suspended or not. There is no such thing as a VIP treatment because you Raid. If you meet the criteria defined by Customer Support to be suspended/terminated, then you will. You name/popularity will not save you, I really want to make that point clear.
 
If you believe that you have been treated unfairly, then please reach out to us so we can escalate that case.
 
I would like to stress out that whatever players may say after being suspended often differ from what actually happened. In many cases people state to either have done "nothing wrong" or minimize what they have actually done. We won't call that out publicly because we want to protect our customers and we believe that investigations should remain private, between incriminated players and our teams. Regardless of how badly someone cheated / violated our rules, nobody deserves to be exposed publicly. We aren't fond of public trials, transparency has its limit. It doesn't mean that because nothing is visible publicly that our Customer Support team is slacking or is being too lenient. 
 
I understand that from a Community point of view this can be really frustrating (not to have any solid proof on actions being taken), sadly there is no way for us to give any proof without compromising the privacy of players, so all we can do is try to give you global data during mass actions (like Cougar did).
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As I am the one who started this thread, and I never talked about exploits, suspensions or anything related about that, but the main focus of my post was to show my experience in the EU PvP server as a new player who loves Wildstar and would love to continue playing but I clearly show in my post how population is so an issue that I can't even find people on Thayd (doesn't matter which time I log in) or even do the first adventure after 2 whole weeks trying at peek times to get a group, and then you as a Carbine Staff answered in my thread regarding those other issues that I never touched in my first post...... could you be as attentive to me and the main theme of my thread an give me (and us EU Luminai players) any kind of information regarding if Carbine is aware of the issue and is planning ANYTHING to promote people to join the PvP server and promote the return of people who left to the PvE server due to the one way server transfer you oppened and caused the problem?
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As I am the one who started this thread, and I never talked about exploits, suspensions or anything related about that, but the main focus of my post was to show my experience in the EU PvP server as a new player who loves Wildstar and would love to continue playing but I clearly show in my post how population is so an issue that I can't even find people on Thayd (doesn't matter which time I log in) or even do the first adventure after 2 whole weeks trying at peek times to get a group, and then you as a Carbine Staff answered in my thread regarding those other issues that I never touched in my first post...... could you be as attentive to me and the main theme of my thread an give me (and us EU Luminai players) any kind of information regarding if Carbine is aware of the issue and is planning ANYTHING to promote people to join the PvP server and promote the return of people who left to the PvE server due to the one way server transfer you oppened and caused the problem?
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The whole reason this thread turned the way it did is because the game's population issues have a great deal to do with the game's management and the decisions that they make and the rationalizations they use to justify them. Like this statement, for example.
 
{| class="blockquote"
I understand that from a Community point of view this can be really frustrating (not to have any solid proof on actions being taken), sadly there is no way for us to give any proof without compromising the privacy of players, so all we can do is try to give you global data during mass actions (like Cougar did).
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{| class="blockquote"
 
The "we can't tell you about specific accounts" statement preceding this quote is one that has been made by several of Carbine's staff and it is, in all frankness, a straw man. You don't need to tell us who was banned to tell us how many people were banned. You don't need to tell us who you confiscated plat from to tell us how much plat you remove when someone creates it through exploits or cheats. And this point has been made clearly to your game's management several times and in several different ways.
 
 
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I don't know anyone who quit over the exploit issue but Yasfan has a point that it certainly doesn't help.
 
What I see 90% of the time is people quitting because they are bored.	
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{| class="blockquote"
and >0 people had been permanently banned.
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{| class="blockquote"
There isn't much to say on that topic sadly. We cannot force players who moved to PvE to come back to PvP. The population level is the issue here and it's not something that can be solved by itself since it is related to much bigger problems we are currently addressing.
 
Are we aware of the Luminai issue? We have concurrency data so obviously yes. Can we solve it straight away or by taking quick measures? No :(. This in an on-going process which will take time. The November update was only the very first step. We will disclose more information about what's coming in 2015 soon.
 
If we do not reply/intervene on a thread it's not because we are ignoring the problem or anything, it's just because there is not much we can say regarding that matter -right now-.
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{| class="blockquote"
Not one confirmed record of any perma bans given that has arisen on the forums or on reddit or twitter. Giving 3 day and 7 day slaps on the wrists for cheating and creating hundreds and thousands of illicit plat is a joke. Everyone (except you maybe) knows it is a joke. Problem is if they had any integrity and actually banned people like they should have they would have lost 100's of raiders. When the game is in this sorry of a state and raiders are your bread and butter, you are not going to do that. Which is exactly what happened.
 
Dead game = dead.
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{| class="blockquote"
"Substantive" is a subjective term. Punishments were issued and the exploit was closed. This just sounds like one of the many "they didn't do it my way therefore they did it wrong" posts that have come to typify this forum.
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			Well, since this thread has wandered pretty far afield, I think it's time to close it up.	
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