Everything GREAT About Batman Forever!

Everything GREAT about Batman Returns! is a review of Batman Returns done by Alanomaly in the style of CinemaWins.
==Review==
===During the Movie===
*While the soundtracks of the DCEU are the one consistently good thing for me, I don't think I'll ever get over the 90s Batman music. It's a bit self-centered for Danny Elfman himself to have said there's only one Batman theme, especially when that's objectively not true and it's his own theme he's talking about, but his is definitely the definitive one. Wait, what? The music was composed by Elliot Goldenthal? Eh, whatever, I'll give it a win anyway for being good.
*This movie is the last live action movie that Batman has the golden moon around the bat. Batman & Robin doesn't have the moon, it just makes the bat silver by the end for some reason. The Nolan trilogy has a golden belt with the symbol on the buckle, but it's not really the same as the chest symbol, which is just black on black. And of course, there's the DCEU one, which is black on grey. As unlikely as it is that we'll ever get a flashback Batman movie showing his missing history from before BvS, I like to think that he had gold on his outfit and around the chest bat all Rebirth style until Jason Todd's death, where he removed the gold as a visual symbol of him going into his dark, murderous phase we see in BvS. His own Superman "S stands for Hope," if you will. Also, yes, I know this is one of the Bat-Nipple suits, but the gold being there is enough to make me not take off a win for it.
*I'm just imagining going through a drive through with this ridiculous Batmobile and it's got enough hilarity to it that I'm giving it a win.
*Fine. I'll remove a win for this. '89, Returns, Forever, and B&R are all supposed to be one continuous continuity. However, that continuity is only really kept through Alfred and Commissioner Gordon being the same people in all the movies, as well as Chris O'Donnell playing Robin in the two later ones, and a few subtle references here and there. The biggest issue with them all being the same continuity is Gotham City, and admittedly there's an obvious reason, which is the director's style. The first two movies have Burton written all over them with the way Gotham City looks, and it does feel like a fictional comic book city. Shuemacher's however is a drastic change, and doesn't even feel like any version of Gotham City that isn't taken over by its criminals already. It's all bright and colorful like the amusement park Joker and Harley take over in the Lego Batman video game instead of the dark city Gotham is usually depicted as. The CGI for Gotham in both this movie and the one after it are just god awful to look at, and the giant statues make absolutely no sense.
*Yes, Two-Face's coin in the Dark Knight definitely looks cooler being burnt on one side, and does make it easier to determine which side it landed on, but I still like the detail that this Two-Face has his initials H.D. written on the bad side of the coin.
*In case you didn't already guess, this will have a lot of comparisons to Aaron Eckhart's Two-Face, who is without a doubt the definitive Two-Face. But, I do like Tommy Lee Jones' version, even if it is a bit weird that Billy Dee Williams wasn't brought back for him after playing Harvey Dent in 89. He's got his own twisted philosophy on luck, pretty similar to the one he had on chance in The Dark Knight, especially the last thing he says. "The only true justice" is a pretty paralleled claim to "The only morality in an unjust world is chance."
*Oh, Two-Face, always using loopholes to make chance play how you actually want it to.
*Two-Face being obsessed with things related to duality is something later used in the last Adam West movie, Batman vs Two-Face, so I like this even more in hindsight.
*She does have a point. Someone who goes around Gotham fighting crime dressed as a bat probably does have some fucked up shit in their mind. Wait, that's Nicole Kidman. Maybe that's where Aquaman gets it from.
*Compliments?
*Classic Batman.
*I like the fact that all of Two-Face's goons have two-toned masks.
*Two-Face refers to himself, or themselves, as multiple people, playing into the dual personality thing in a way we only really see in Batman vs Two-Face and Season 1 of the TellTale game.
*Two-Face being so far gone that he actually shoots the guy piloting the helicopter he's in. Seems like a Joker move, and honestly a lot of this Two-Face's actions feel Jokery, but it plays to his insane side really well.
*Whether intentional or not, Batman referring to Two-Face as "Harvey" instead of his criminal name seems like a way to appeal to his humanity, even if in vain.
*Yin and Yang parachute for Two-Face.
*Some of these camera angles are very reminiscent of Thor. Win off.
*I'm probably gonna be giving a lot of praise to Jim Carrey in this movie. My first point being both praise to him and the writer. Edward Nigma doesn't have any real set backstory before becoming Riddler aside from his name, so you can take a lot of creative liberties with that. And that's exactly what they do here, with Edward being a fanboy of Bruce working at Wayne Enterprises. A pretty unique and fun take on it. Yes, BvS fans, I said fun. it's a comic book movie. Come to terms with the fact things are allowed to be fun.
*Still trying to figure out who little pre-Riddler is that Edward has a bobble head and fortune teller of in this movie. Are there two Riddlers? I don't hate it.
*Jim Carrey is always a win.
*The way Edward holds himself in this movie is a lot like how Lex Luthor does in BvS, which furthers my point about how Jesse Eisenberg is a terrible Lex Luthor but would be a fantastic Riddler. #HeisenbergNotEisenberg.
*Eh, fuck it. Gonna give Val Kilmer some praise too. The way he questions Edward's invention and the look on his face both play into his distrusting nature. It really feels like he's against this device.
*Oof. Big oof. You clearly see something snap inside of him at that moment. He was obviously already a little on edge, but being shut down by his idol was clearly something that pushed him over.
*I'm pretty sure CinemaSins gave a sin for the chair and lock voice commands, but I figure Bruce and Alfred (both or individually) are smart enough to come up with a way to let the words be said in the room without the commands activating, like saying them in a certain tone of voice or isolating the word. Uh... Win for BatTech?
*If you're interested in rubber, Danny DeVito last movie would've had some choice words for you. Specifically, "condom," "dong," "monster," and "magnum," but not necessarily in that order.
*Ooooooof. Nicole Kidman is always a win.
*One should never complain about the idea of combining skin tight vinyl, whips, and Nicole Kidman.
*Sorry Val, your cape just isn't as cool as that of Bale's or Affleck's. One point off.
*Are any of those questions named Vic Sage?
*The Riddler's always been about proving he's smarter than Batman, and becoming "mutiple geniuses" really plays into that motive. This entire scene really shows how he's both the smartest Batman villain and one of the most insane.
*Yep. This feels like an Eisenberg Luthor moment. Again, make Eisenberg be Riddler, you fucks.
*And that's exactly why Bruce was suspicious. If you can pump something into someone- Oh. Don't say that? Okay.
*Ha. I like how he seems like he's actually concerned in hindsight for Fred but is actually just running to him to grab the helmet off him.
*Remember what I said about being on edge then finally being pushed over the edge? I doubt this was on purpose but it's a good visual parallel to that idea.
*It's moments like this where I somewhat wish Riddler and Two-Face were switched. Edward Nigma has no set backstory but Harvey Dent does, and while having an original backstory to Edward is fun, it would've been nice if he was the already-villain while Dent was the one who was changed into a villain during the movie. I feel like there was some sort of relationship between Bruce and Harvey at some point, the way Batman tries to connect with Harvey in the beginning fight, along with the obvious guilt he has over not having saved Harvey. It's a thing that would have pay off if given the proper development. Which makes me conflicted. I honestly do like how much guilt there is in Bruce's face, so I'd like to give it a point, but that'd be unfair and hypocritical of me to give this undeveloped payoff a point when I'd not give a point to the undeveloped payoff in BvS, so I won't be giving or removing a point here. Just wanted to talk about this.
*I know he got Fred's intelligence by the time he altered the security footage, but does Edward really need other people's intelligence? Not only did he create a brain-manipulating machine on his own, but he altered fucking security footage on his own too.
*The idea that Edward can write like the person he absorbs the intelligence of is pretty interesting. That probably also has a lot of implications, such as acting like them, talking like them, you'd make a good impersonator of the person you absorb the brain of.
*Exactly.
*As coincidental as it may be, I love the fact Edward lives in a place that has a name playing on the idea of crosswords.
*Nicole Kidman's workout routine.
*That's too relatable of a conversation for me to not give it a win.
*There's definitely a Watchmen Rorschach joke to make. I am not the one to make it.
*Ha, the doll looks like Two-Face.
*I'd love to stay there chatting too. And I'd also like to get you out of those clothes. A black dress would be nice but would you pass up the chance of this with Nicole Kidman? I know I wouldn't.
*You'd think he'd have a problem with freaks dressed like clowns. But I guess he got over it.
*This isn't a musical and you aren't Hugh Jackman. Win off for false advertising.
*I feel like I should give a win for including Robin's origin story. So I will. Not sure why, but I will.
*Compliments.
*Ironically named leap since he's the only Grayson to survive this.
*Edward just has pure joy written on his face at the sight of Two-Face and I love it.
*I think this is Val's only time he gets to say that line this whole movie. I know some people might wonder why Bruce would just give up his identity like that, even if no one hears him, but I think it's pretty justified. Harvey blames Batman for what happened to him, and Bruce feels guilty about it. There's also the fact that he has 200 sticks of TNT that he's about to use to kill everyone there, and we know that Bale's Batman was also willing to give up his identity to save the city, also in a situation with Harvey.
*A lot more subtle of a flashback to his parents' death than the Martha scene in BvS.
*The amount of pain on Bruce's face from knowing how losing your family feels.
*I know this is Dick Grayson and not Jason Todd, but the red helmet sure does feel like a nod to Under the Red Hood.
*So, if Metropolis exists, which Superman exists in this universe? Was there a 90s Superman movie? No? What about TV? Oh, Lois & Clark: The New Adventures of Superman? Is that canon to this? Either way, win for the idea that this was its own expanded universe by having both Gotham and Metropolis exist.
*Robin's hatred for Two-Face is so justified, and I think Chris, especially in later scenes, really shows that hatred.
*Does this mean Batman has killed before? I mean, I know that Penguin died, he doesn't know Catwoman lived as far as I'm aware, and Joker was "killed," assuming he did die (then again, it's Joker), and it was Batman's fault essentially, so maybe he does feel bad about those because he blames himself for them? Uh, win for Bathistory.
*A 1917 Harley Quinn? Does he say 17 or 70? Judging from the small amount we see it's probably a '17. 
*If there was any doubt this Batman and the Nolan Batman aren't the same, the presence of dogs in Wayne Manor is a good piece of evidence to prove they aren't.
*Point off for actually showing the origin story again, but point back on for not constantly repeating "Martha" the entire time.
*In fact, just give it a point for having the rose there and tying into Bruce in the last movie leaving flowers at the place of his parents death.
*Aww, flashback Jack Napier didn't say the dance with the devil line. Oh well. At least he didn't claim to say it before he kills everyone he kills like he did in '89.
*And there it is. The entire reason Bruce takes on the Batman persona. He feels like he killed his parents. Sure, he plays it off like he's talking about Two-Face killing the Graysons, but we all know what he really meant. And for all we know he probably feels guilty about them dying, too. Not to mention the guilt I keep bringing up about Harvey, he also feels guilty that he couldn't get it to Two-Face that he's Batman, and he wasn't able to help save the Graysons as himself, either.
*Shiiiiit, I didn't even notice that robin design when I said the Red Hood win.
*Bird metaphors.
*Sure, we all know Dick is gonna become Robin, but I'm going to give the writers a win for setting it up. Not giving it a win would be like not giving an origin movie a win for setting up the protagonist becoming their hero/anti-hero/villain persona just because we know it's gonna happen.
*Two-Face doesn't look like he actually cares about killing his own goons. There was a chance Batman would dodge the bullet, or uh, rocket, and Two-Face's whole thing is about chance.
*Bat wheelie.
*I guess this is sort of a callback to the Adam West days, but with the entire Batmobile going up the building instead of just Batman.
*How about Scaredevil?
*There's something I enjoy when it comes to seeing Riddler trying to figure out his villain persona and outfit. It's got a nice feel to show how much time it probably actually takes to determine your alter ego, good or evil.
*Something about the wording of "refusal to expire" is funny to me.
*TLJ's Two-Face really plays into his dual personas a lot more than most other versions of the character, and I like it. It's very comical, and definitely over the top. From what I understand, that's actually kinda how Two-Face would've been had he shown up in the Adam West era, not counting West's final movie of course. His outfits, his cars, his goons, his home, and even the way he eats and smokes. He's also got one lady for each personality. There's such a distinction between his Harvey side and his Two-Face side. And I love it. Y'know what? Two points, one for each personality.
*Aaaaaand there he is. If he wasn't already killing it, he sure as hell is now. Jim Carrey in the question mark tights is just a win. Win win win.
*I also like that they're meeting up this late in the movie. It's not exactly the middle, but it's also not too early or too late for their partnership to work out. As much as I would love a Riddler Luthor team up in the DCEU (preferably one that shows Jesse Eisenberg has been Riddler in disguise this whole time and Bryan Cranston is the real Luthor), I'd also love to see these two team up again at some point. I love their dynamic. It's a shame that working together made TLJ dislike Jim Carrey, though.
*He's very over the top and silly, but this Riddler still holds the Riddler's title of the most intelligent Batman villain. He's really getting into Harvey's psyche, both of them, and making him, or them, question what to do after the fact of getting revenge on Batman. And I bet you he's speaking from experience. Part of his mental breakdown might be due to the "post-homicidal depression" he got from killing Fred earlier in the movie.
*Credit to TLJ too. You see him actually thinking over Riddler's talk mentally. Getting all excited and giddy at the idea of killing Batman, but actually taking into consideration Riddler's words about what will happen after the fact.
*Goddamnit, everything about this is just like Luthor in BvS. Why isn't Jesse Eisenberg Riddler, damnit?! Even if you don't make some convoluted plot about it being Riddler in disguise and just replace Luthor with Riddler, BvS would increase in quality by at least 50%, which is a lot for me.
*I saw CinemaSins give a sin for Riddler having already placed his mind boxes in Two-Face's place, but seeing as how Riddler found out where it was, he could've put them there any time that night while Harvey was out, then snuck back in when he knew he was home to propose his idea to him. If anything, it shows his intelligence even more.
*"So you, and yet so YOU!" If there was any way to describe Two-Face, that'd be it.
*Calling out Two-Face's impulsive problem while also yelling loudly as he does it. I love their dynamic.
*The laser effects of these mind boxes are so simple but also really nice to look at. Just a glowing green beam. And that beam is also used in the Lego Batman games, or at least the first one. Haven't played two and I don't remember if Riddler is in three. The 90s era (including the cartoons) just has a huge impact on the first Lego Batman game. Two-Face and Riddler are on a team, which also happens to have Mr. Freeze and Poison Ivy, Penguin and Catwoman are on a team, and then Joker has his own team akin to being the only villain in his movie, and his team also has Harley Quinn and Scarecrow on it, a possible nod to the cancelled Batman Triumphant (or Continues) movie where they were gonna be the villains. Also, Danny Elfman's theme is in the game. I've looked too far into it and have gotten past my point. A point for the simple but appealing laser.
*Nice little detail that he has the brains of both Two-Face's girls scanned into Two-Face.
*I'm not sure how intentional this is, but every time Riddler is connected to the box, he gets a little more over the top, if that's even possible. The song-and-dance gig he does when he uses it on Fred, and the fried egg comment here. I imagine this machine has side effects, and Jim Carrey plays them perfectly.
*If there was ever a Batman villain to figure out who Batman is, it's Riddler. Of course, Joker more than likely has figured it out as well, but he doesn't care who Batman really is, that's not important to him. But it is important to Two-Face so he can kill him, so he's got a good deal there.
*Yep. That's Two-Face.
*If you wanna talk diamonds, you might wanna wait a movie... Or don't. Just... Just don't.
*That was just all kinds of silly, and I'm pretty sure Bruce can afford a dryer, but I don't hate it.
*Excelsior? But this is DC! Well, Stan Lee did say that DC could get more money if they just announced he'd be in one of their movies, maybe this is as close as they could get.
*Ha. He's Batman's smartest villain, but he's without a doubt not the strongest. Which is usually why people underestimate him.
*I really don't wanna take a point off for Bruce not really having a reason to not suit up, mainly since so many have been taken away as is, so.... Compromise! No point given or taken here.
*I think people not recognizing Edward as Riddler works out fine. People honestly should recognize him, but I can see why they wouldn't. He puts on a bit of makeup and makes his hair a bright red when playing as Riddler, but as himself he goes with blackish brown hair. Works better than a Superman disguise.
*Ha, even a dog likes the Mind Box.
*Fair enough marketing ploy.
*I'm guessing these lasers either aren't visible to the people in-universe and are only their for our convenience, or everyone is too caught up in getting a Box and/or being enticed by the Box to care.
*Remember how I said there could be side effects from draining all that knowledge and using the machine? Right there.
*Ha. Master Dick. I'll grow up one day.
*Really utilizing those acrobatic skills. And goddamn, he must have really good acrobatic skills and speed to be able to get across the hall and down in time to keep the door from closing.
*Yep, Batman probably does have an intruder alarm that detects when someone not him or Alfred enters.
*"Oh my god, I have two dads? And one of them's Batman?!"
*Starting to sound like Two-Face. Honestly, that line just makes me love Two-Face and Batman even more. They're both two people. Bruce became Batman and eventually Batman became the true persona while Bruce was the mask he worse, but Harvey becoming Two-Face left him in a state of being two people constantly without having to wear a mask to conceal one or the other. The duality concept is real.
*This isn't suspicious at all. I mean that. Of course Bruce Wayne of all people has an Apple Watch in the 90s.
*Bruce has so many cars it's difficult to tell which car the "other car" is.
*Also, I think Michael Gough is just constantly underrated. That stern and somewhat aggravated look when Bruce doesn't realize he's talking about the Batmobile. If we're being honest, I like every version of Alfred. Napier, Gough, Caine, Irons, and even the animated ones. There's not a single version of Alfred I don't like. They're all great in their own ways.
*Yep. Admit it, this is exactly what we'd all do if we had the 90s version of the Batmobile.
*Oh my god, is that El Diablo?
*Chicks dig the car.
*Embracing the Bat.
*Yeah, we're not buying it.
*That's probably a fair enough reason to get into superheroing.
*Remember how I said Chris would later pull off the hatred and anger caused by his parents' death? Here you go.
*And he did try to, to be fair.
*I'm sticking by my theory that this 90s era Bruce did intentionally murder someone out of revenge. In fact, I'm willing to bet that Joker was an intentional kill, and possibly his last intentional one, given that Joker was the one who killed his parents in this continuity. It's easy to believe Bruce actually realized how much of his life was getting revenge instead of bringing justice when he killed Joker, giving him this wisdom that he's now sharing with Dick.
*Fuck, I like their parallels even more now. Bruce does see himself in each of the Robins, and that's probably why he's so hard on all of them, to make them better than him. Dick, Jason, and Tim are all orphans so of course he has a connection there, and Damian is his own son who is okay with murder, so of course he's hard on him. But they have a bigger connection here with Joker having killed Bruce's parents and Two-Face having killed Dick's family.
*One could easily say that Edward got this far way too easily, but if anything, it makes sense. He has control of so many minds in Gotham already, anything from subliminal messaging to outright mind control could easily make something like this happen this fast. In fact, the way that woman acts is very unnatural. It's almost like Edward is venting out through her.
*See what I mean?!
*Just like Bruce, not letting it get to him.
*Ha.
*Hahahahaha. He puts on glasses to seem smart. He's nothing if not intimidated and made jealous by Bruce. And he proceeds to take them off when Bruce does.
*Questions, Mr. Wayne?
*The way Edward goes from concentrated on Wayne to happy his very necessity-based plan worked is just great.
*We made it!
*Oof. I'm not sure if sliding down that ladder like that feels good. Bruce's training must have some vigorous shit in it for that to not even phase him.
*As funny as it is, I'm without a doubt sure that a movie about two supervillains killing Batman would definitely have been made into a movie. And a really good one, at that.
*Compliments.
*Does Batman kiss differently than Bruce? I mean, Bruce and Chase shared a kiss earlier, so...
*He sure fell right into that one.
*Batman really is ready for anything. Or at least his suit is.
*He really hates Batman. And it's plenty justified.
*Robin to the rescue.
*I mean, you did talk about being a hero flying in like a robin earlier in the movie. Sooooo- Wait, did he say Nightwing?!
*Val Kilmer's workout routine.
*I only just realized how well Val plays this part, especially this moment. He shows how much he cares for Robin the way Bruce actually does. Dick could easily reveal Bruce's secret now that he knows it, and I'm willing to bet that was implied in the "How are you gonna stop me?" But Bruce doesn't care. He just so confidently says he can stop Dick, who is immediately shut down by it. That one line screams Batman to me.
*But determined Dick is still determined. No innuendo intended.
*And Alfred has a ton of experience in that regard from having raised Bruce.
*Really? What about Vikki Vale or Selina Kyle? Were those just flings?
*Nicole Kidman was naked under the blanket during this whole scene. Naked Nicole Kidman is and always will be a win.
*Keeping your Batpromises.
*Batsmiling.
*See, Edward has a grudge with Bruce, and Two-Face has a grudge with Batman. But, keeping in mind that Harvey and Bruce are supposed to have history with each other, it makes sense that he'd be curious as to what was in Bruce's mind, and them finding out Batman and Bruce Wayne are one in the same, their motives are aligned, strengthening their partnership.
*Pretty sure that mistle toe would work to figure out Batman's identity.
*I just love their dynamic.
*It just keeps coming back to Bruce wanting Dick to be better than him.
*Rebel Robin.
*Fine. I'll take a point off for this.
*Y'know, I have to appreciate how each universe shows the Batman origin. It's essentially the same basics every time, but they do it in their own ways which I like. 89 only shows the murder of the Waynes (while also having a fakeout in the beginning of the movie) while Forever shows the discovery of the Batcave and how Bruce got his fear of bats. Batman Begins, which is nothing if not the definitive Batman origin story movie, has him discover the Batcave earlier than his parents death, and BvS gives us a quick recap of it in about the only way I'd accept the origin being shown at all anymore. Sure, 90s era and Begins had a bit more to do and work with, but BvS does what it needs to with it, and is one of the things I'd keep from the final product if I was to remake it.
*Batshadowing. Double meaning since this movie has the bat shadow on the moon symbol like the suit is supposed to have.
*Aww, Two-Face's mask isn't two-faced. But I suppose Jim Carrey is distracting enough.
*The constant reminder of Two-Face being two personalities in this version is great.
*I am completely fine with Riddler destroying all of Batman's stuff. It's also Bruce's stuff, so of course he'd want to destroy as much of it as he can to put himself on top.
*Hahaha, what?
*An original take on the "fat lady sings" phrase.
*I'm guessing that's once again to test Bruce/Batman's intelligence against his own, and I suppose Riddler wouldn't even want him dead until he can prove himself smarter.
*See what I mean?
*I don't care what the reasoning is for altering the logo like that, it looks great.
*This plays to something that is both a strength and weakness to the Riddler. This extremely convoluted and interconnected set of riddles is exactly something he'd do, so I have to win it for that. And in testing Batman's intelligence, he ultimately leads to his own downfall, something most Batman villains resent him for. And that would be a sin, but it's so perfect to the character that I have to give it a win. Two wins.
*Bat ass is great and all, and I do like the golden bat on the belt buckle, but... I have to remove a win for taking the gold around the bat away.
*I'm just now realizing something. Val is doing the Conroy thing. His Batman voice is slightly deeper than his Bruce voice. And it's not the Bale voice. Win!
*I'll be honest, this suit looks a lot more like a suit from the DCEU than it does the 90s era Batman movies. But I don't hate it. Except the nipples. I'll give it a win, anyway.
*Isn't that two against three? Two-Face is two people, right?
*Character continuity and growth at the same time. He's admitting that he'll try not to kill Harvey like Bruce suggests but he also is still ultimately driven by revenge so he may end up doing it anyway.
*Acceptance.
*Yup.
*Two movies ago Commissioner Gordon was skeptical of Batman's existence. Now he's rejoicing over him showing up.
*Hahhaa. They have a Battleship game that affects the island around them putting Batman and Robin into peril. I love it.
*It's forced, I'll admit, but any callback to Burt Ward's Robin's catchphrases is a win from me. Honestly I'd probably do the same if a current DCEU film did it, or if Infinity War had done a awesome facial hair bros joke. There's always Avengers 4, I guess.
*Joel Sheumacher loves his grappling hooks. Maybe that's why Lego Batman 1 had so many grappling hook moments...
*Honestly the shot of Robin after he beats up Two-Face looks really cool.
*Sparing your enemies.
*It's over the top but I love it.
*I don't know how he did that but I don't care. It was great.
*Yes! It was over the top! And I love it!
*Honestly, yes. That is the biggest riddle of all. Can the two coexist? Can they really?
*Apparently Jim Carrey broke a lot of Riddler canes during this movie. I imagine doing that move caused him to accidentally throw a cane and break it. Well, you can't make an omelette, I guess.
*He's not just saying foolish to mock him. Honestly, her line about skin tight vinyl and whips isn't just a joke. Selina is honestly the only one who can hope to be Batman's love and it not be a fool's errand. They both lead double lives and have dual personas, they're made for each other in a way Bruce/Bats can't be with any of the women he swoons as either persona. Vikki Vale was proof enough, she left because of his dual life. And considering the events of the next movie, we know Bruce and Chase didn't last. Bruce and Selina are torn between decisions about the other. Selina and Bruce are in love of course, but before her anti-hero days, Catwoman and Batman were enemies. So, yes, it very much is foolish for Chase to assume she'll be the love of Bruce's life, or even strive for it. But, I suppose it's better to have loved once than never to have loved at all. I guess.
*Riddler may be the one with his finger on the death button, but this plan wreaks of Two-Face. Going back to those parallels between the two I pointed out earlier, as well as Riddler's riddle, Two-Face is ultimately something Batman can never be. Harvey Dent and Two-Face are always simultaneously existing, two sides of the same coin, always together. Bruce Wayne and Batman never simultaneously exist. He either has a figurative mask to put on as Bruce Wayne or a literal mask to put on as Batman. The closest he can come to being simultaneously Bruce and Bats is when he's not in disguise while doing detective work in the BatCave. But even that's just Batman. The riddles were all tests of Batman's intelligence, while this final battle is a test of Batman's psyche.
*I know this got a Sin for Riddler not seeing what Batman is doing but I'll play devil's advocate and defend it. Two-Face and especially Riddler are both caught up in finally having Bruce/Batman in their grasp, it's believable that with how unhinged they are they might not even notice. It's even more believable for Riddler who's just stroking his own ego. Also... this place doesn't have the best lighting.
*When I said side effects earlier, I didn't exactly mean it'd backfire this bad, but holy shit it did.
*Nicole Kidman ass.
*Saving your significant other and your partner.
*Oof. That solidifies it. Bruce and Harvey did have a history. So everything I've said going off the idea that they do have a history is pretty much confirmed.
*Also, Two-Face once again showing his philosophy for luck and chance.
*And that's the story of Achilles and his heel.
*I'm not entirely sure what the emotion here is. Shock from Harvey falling, confusion at Bruce being the one to make him fall, or anger that he didn't get to do it himself. Maybe a combination? Maybe even a mix of satisfaction.
*There goes my second favorite Batman villain. Maybe the DCEU one won't die. These movies just love to kill the villains, though.
*Catching his coin even in death. I think that's his coin, anyway.
*Ohhh, Robin even has a little R on his mask, I didn't even notice that.
*Welp, devil's advocate time again. Both of the villains in this movie have a major Achilles' heel that Batman exploits. For Two-Face, it was the coin. For Riddler, it's the fact he feels the need to prove himself better than Bruce/Batman, who exploited it with the riddle earlier. Riddler's downfall has always been the need to be better than him, which he can't really prove if he just kills him, causing him to hold off the killing until he can prove better than him which proves to be in vain since he constantly loses. He was pretty close though. Not as much as Max Shreck who shot him in the chest last movie, but still pretty close.
*Thanks for proving my point wrong earlier. But in a way that makes this a win.
*Okay, this is something I've been waiting to win since I started this. The entire reason for using a Bat is to instill Bruce's own fear of bats into enemies, and this is honestly the best usage of it I've seen. Batman gets closer to Riddler, but given how much brain power, including Bruce's, that Riddler took in, he sees Batman the way Batman wants his opponents to see him: a horrifying bat.
*It's ridiculous, and he honestly is acting more like Man-Bat, but like I said, he absorbed Bruce's mind along with all the others. The backfire caused enough damage for him to eventually think he was Batman, and I'm all for it.
*Ha. Callbacks.
*This shot of them running away from the bat signal has no reason to really exist, but it's cool enough for a win.
*Two-Face's ladies were named Salt and Pepper.
*Wait, Jon Favreau was in this?! So before he worked for Tony Stark, Happy Hogan worked for another billionare playboy philanthropist superhero.
*The music during the end credits is great.
===Post-Movie===
*This was the last of the 90s era Batman movies I saw, somehow having missed it while having seen the Keaton ones and unfortunately the Clooney one. I'll be honest, I think I was missing out. It's not as serious as the previous two films, and not nearly as campy as the film after it, but I think it has a nice mix of the two.
*Val Kilmer is such an underrated Batman. Honestly, after this watch, I've got to say sorry to Bale and Affleck. Kilmer definitely is my second favorite now, as he's really good at both Batman and Bruce, especially when he's being both at the same time. Bale was a good Bruce, and Affleck is a good Batman, but for me, you have to do a really good job at both to actually be Batman. Bale's is more of a fault to him because of how he decided to make his Batman, but the scripts for him were better, while Affleck is someone I believe could do a great Bruce just as he does Batman, but the scripts haven't been as good. Kilmer, for me, had a good enough script, and played both personas perfectly, even channeling Kevin Conroy's method for voicing Batman when in disguise. The way he makes Bruce really seem to care about Dick's safety in this really shows, and I love it. As far as I'm aware, Val Kilmer was actually Bob Kane's favorite version of Batman before he died. If you're the creator of Batman's favorite version of Batman, you've done something right.
*I think Batman & Robin honestly is what puts a dent in Chris O'Donnell's Robin. I think he does a great job in this movie as the young, cocky Dick Grayson who is also fueled by revenge against Two-Face. He really shows it. It's the next movie where everything for everyone except Uma Thurman really goes downhill.
*I've been giving praise to both Tommy Lee Jones and Jim Carrey this entire movie. And I'm not ashamed to say that they both deserve it. Usually I'm not a huge fan of over the top, but something about how over the top these two are as these roles just sells them both for me. Paired with their over the top nature is basic character elements that both shine through and work with said nature. Two-Face's obvious hatred for Batman, hinting at his relationship with Bruce prior to being Two-Face, and even just having his philosophy of luck and chance are great with how TLJ plays the part. Jim Carrey is just Jim Carrey in a question mark suit and that's nothing but great for this Riddler. Fanboy Edward, broken Edward, Edward that is just overjoyed by watching Two-Face in the circus, Edward after making NigmaTech, and everything as Riddler is just so good, and it just makes me feel all the more mad about how BvS wasted Luthor on Jesse and wasted Jesse on Luthor when Jesse as Riddler would be a perfect follow-up to this previous live action Riddler. I love the dynamic of these two throughout the entire movie. Their team up is a little shakey at first but once they realize their goals actually align, they become so much better, which is saying something cause I liked them before that part even happened. And like I said, I do find it a real shame that the making of this movie caused TLJ to, as Carrey put it, "hate" Jim Carrey. I'd have loved to see them do something else together. Something else I have to give Tommy Lee Jones credit for is the fact that he took on the role of Two-Face because that's his son's favorite Batman villain.
*Everything I've given for Nicole Kidman has pretty much just been on her looks, and while she is very attractive, I'm selling her short. Chase is a nice one-off character and I like Kidman's performance as her. She's not too in-depth but what we do see of her shows how much she notices how in-depth everyone else is. She's like a sane version of Harley Quinn, picking apart people to help them instead of just to mess with them.
*Michael Gough Alfred will always be a win for me, even in B&R. May he rest in peace.
*This movie is not popular by any means, and I'll probably get a lot of hate for saying it's my favorite of the 90s era. But I honestly thing it would benefit from repeated viewings. Yes, people who are fans of movies will say that about the movies they love no matter what. My recommendation to rewatch it still stands. Especially if you look at it after taking all these points into consideration. You might like it more, you might like it less, your opinion might not even change, and that's okay. This is still just how I view the movie and how much great stuff I think is hidden in this movie. I think it's secretly a brilliant movie with as campy as it is. If anything, I thought it was better than it was before.
===Final Score===
Final sin talley: 189
Award: Wakanda Batman Forever!