Report 801

Report #801
Skillset: Discipline Skill: Breathing
 Org: Nekotai Status: Completed Aug 2012
Furies' Decision:
We will change Breathing to a 1-minute on/off timer but it will start out
blocking 100% of damage and be calculated outside of DMP. This will give a
consistent fall in resistance over time instead of DMP's extended period of high
resistance due to DMP scaling.
Problem: Former report 709 identified the problem of Breathing. which introduced
an admin-driven solution: change the near-impossible to use "immunity" skill to
a 4-minute 200 DMP countdown w/4-minute cooldown. In short, the defense nearly
negates all damage-based, asphx PVP attacks such as Aquamancy Tsunami and
Nekotai Oothai.
[A: 0 R: 0] Solution #1: Halve the duration of the defense and cooldown (from
 4 mins to 2 mins).
[A: 0 R: 0] Solution #2: Halve the effect of the defense (from 200 DMP to 100).
[A: 0 R: 0] Solution #3: Introduce an aspyx weakness on
 hyperventilation/cooldown.
Player Comments:
---[Janalon on 7/26 @ 11:52 writes]:
Or any combination of solutions presented in this report.
---[Talan on 7/26 @ 19:39 writes]:
Solution 2
---[Rivius on 7/27 @ 12:58 writes]:
Solution 1 and 2 seem reasonable to me either implemented separately or
together.
---[Neos on 7/28 @ 18:11 writes]:
Fan of any of these solutions, or a combination of them.
---[Shuyin on 7/29 @ 08:10 writes]:
Solution 1 or 2 is fine, leaning on Solution 1
---[Janalon on 8/1 @ 11:50 writes]:
Notes from REPORT 791: 10 DMP is lost every 15 seconds and the defence lasts 5
minutes with a 5 minute cooldown. If my math is correct, 5 DMP would be lost
every 15s under Solution 2. In contrast, Solution 1 would suggest 20 DMP is lost
every 15. This fact is very significant when you begin to factor how DMP
weighting impacts resistance upon each deflation tick. If I am not mistaken (and
I have made mistakes before), Solution 2 appears to be the only true fix.
Besides, who can hold their breath for more than 2 minutes anyway?
---[Shuyin on 8/2 @ 06:19 writes]:
Guybrush Threepwood
---[Tacita on 8/3 @ 10:46 writes]:
Happy with both solutions 1/2, with a preference for solution 2.
---[Janalon on 8/4 @ 00:28 writes]:
Http://pastebin.com/8L3Mz8Dy --> Gives data for current Discipline Breathing,
Solutions and 2.
---[Celina on 8/5 @ 01:07 writes]:
Solution two
---[Tulemrah on 8/7 @ 19:01 writes]:
Saying that "the defense nearly negates all damage-based, asphx PVP attacks" is
a gross overstatement. 200 dmp is only a 2/3 reduction. 110 seconds later, it's
1/2. Judging by my own dmp levels, I would say 33% is a pretty good benchmark
for what's usually attainable in any given damage type. So breathing offers
above average dmp for 225 seconds out every 600, or 37.5% of the time. It gives
normal dmp for 75 seconds, or 12.5% of the time, and then no dmp at all for the
remain 50%. I have yet to see a compelling reason for why breathing needs to be
changed, as I think its unique mix of benefits and drawbacks is a very good
balance.
---[Janalon on 8/7 @ 19:45 writes]:
@Tulemrah general impression is that both solo and group PVP encounters rarely
last more than a couple of minutes. A ten-minute breathing cycle, from defup to
cool down, seems a bit long in duration by these standards (with Villages as the
exception). Besides, calculating breathing only asphyx DMP ignores the other
common DMP sources such as tattoos, devout shield, constructs, amber malt,
attune, orgami, etc. Although these DMP sources wouldn't have much to offer at
the top end, they have significant impact on deflation. Therefore your
calculations are not accurate. Solution 2 only scales duration, not Besides, are
there any other expert level "general" skills that cuts offense to this degree?
---[Celina on 8/7 @ 19:46 writes]:
All those numbers were based off of an arbitrary "average dmp" you seemingly
chose out of nowhere, so they have to be taken with a pretty big spoon of salt.
You are really downplaying how significant a 2/3rds reduction to a given damage
type is. I'd venture to say it's the reason why mages use pure poison/cold/etc
staff casts over asphyxiation, it's certainly a large reason as to why I use
nightgaze over nightkiss in pvp. It's simply not possible to constantly track
where their dmp is and how much damage you are doing, so rather than providing
"a unique mix of benefits and drawbacks," the damage type just goes unused in
favor of more reliable damage types. If asphyx dmp game wide is too low and this
provides mages who use pure asphyx staves too much damage, perhaps we should
look in to staff tuning. Until then, though, I don't see a reason to punish
guilds with more limited options with a skill that provides extreme levels of
dmp game wide.
---[Tulemrah on 8/8 @ 21:50 writes]:
My point is that the 2/3 reduction is very temporary. And as I said, the choice
of 33% as the benchmark in my example is based on my own dmp levels. I just
looked at what I have for the common damage types (cold/electric/fire) and
bumped it up a little, because I know I don't min/max near as much as most
people. I am not aware of mages forgoing asphyx on their staffs being a trend,
but if I had the choice, I would use it instead of cold or electric.
---[Janalon on 8/9 @ 03:16 writes]:
@Tulemrah you aren't accounting for other forms of asphyx DMP. Based on my
Bodyscan Resistances Full (fully deffed up as you blatantly ignore), I can gain
another 55 asphyx DMP from Low Magic Blue, Kirigami, Amber Ale, Devout Shield,
Commune Construct, and monk Tattoos. It appears that I can run well over 50%
resistance for at least three full minutes, and never dip below 35% resistance,
even during the five-minute cool down. Review the results here:
http://pastebin.com/puWvCKFg Your conjecture is simply wrong. There is simply
not a need for a 200dmp common skill in the game especially one as low as
"expert" skill level.
---[Janalon on 8/13 @ 09:58 writes]:
Rainbow curio, 25 asphyx -> Scratch that. Now I could potentially earn +80
common DMP against asphyx damage type. WOW. I'm now thinking that solution 1
~OR~ solution 2 don't go far enough in light of the recent curio additions.
Would it be possible to completely change breathing to a 3s balance to set def,
and then the first asphyxiating attack strips the defense? Give it back the 100%
immunity considering it would only protect against the first hit.
---[Janalon on 8/14 @ 11:20 writes]:
I hate to have a strong opinion change so late in the process, but DMP curios is
the straw that broke the wakabi's back. As per Announce 2055, Rainbow curio
provides 15 DMP. Granted, there are limited asphyx-specific skills in-game, but
the DMP curios PLUS common resist-all defenses make up for that gap. A DMP-
solution is no longer warranted for Breathing (as per Report 709). My ONLY
recommended solution is to make a tea-like defense: 3s bal to raise, gives
immunity to an asphyx, attack after which the Breathing def is stripped.
---[Celina on 8/14 @ 14:31 writes]:
With all these dmp sources it's getting hard to keep track of things. I think a
lot of damage sources are beginning to suffer from the continual introduction to
widely available dmp. Without breathing, asphyxiation currently dwells around
excoro/divinus dmp wise. With it, it surpasses even blunt/cutting which is
generally the most accessible of the dmp types. The trick is to make it so it
has some value, but doesn't end up being the go to choice for every mage in the
game, which is difficult since asphyxiation dmp generally exists in one or the
other extremes I mentioned above. As long as the defense doesn't consume
balance/eq I can get behind it.
---[Janalon on 8/25 @ 12:50 writes]:
I agree about the influx of DMP sources. However, I would liken Asphyx to Poison
rather than Excoro/Divinus. This can especially be see in the release of DMP
curious with Ex/Div offered in a split 5/5 and Asphyx/Poison each offered in a
full 15. Also consider there are pockets of skill-based Asphyx DMP such as Acro
Tattooist Monk, Lowmagic Eco Druid, or Acro Eco Bard just as there are pockets
of skill-based poison DMP. However, there are no DMP negating mechanics against
Poison (or Psychic) for that matter. Not sure why this damage type is singled
out.
---[Onenmaru on 8/28 @ 07:33 writes]:
I like sol 1 and 3, but adding just 3 by itself would seem to render it more of
a detriment.