147532-dont-get-mad-at-the-pvp-tanks

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We're suppose to be hard to kill. Don't call us a double cupcake especially because one is being a stalker tank. Trust me if you want us to lose our defense just so we can become squishier like in WoW. Prepare for tanks offense damage to increase drastically and imagine stalker tank spamming nano field. The damage will be similar to neutralize, but tad lesser except there is no repercussion. They can spam that until suit power is 0, but with suit power regen this can go on forever and then you'll have something to complain about.
 
 	
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I agree.  I'm actually glad to see a game where tanks have a role in PVP.
 
Rather, I'd suggest getting mad at the map design.  Click-to-capture objectives instead of stand-and-hold objectives are what makes tanks overpowered.	
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exactly..... tanks are sorta pvp minibosses. you need either a grip of your buddies, OR A STRATEGY TO OUTSMART THE TANK to get what they are guarding. I made the important part easy to see.
 
There have been tons of times ill run in the room with a  stealthd stalker and ill click on the objective the tank engages and i slowly but surely backpedal making sure the tank is watching me, the stalkers waits the bait is taken and then snatches the mask, that is when i lay down all my slows while the stalker takes on one of my energy augers.
 
If the tank is on a platform CC HIM OFF THE PLATFORM. 
 
If your only bringing personal dps and minimal debuffs/only 1 CC, I'm telling you now your doing it wrong.
			
				
	Edited November 26, 2015 by Techr	
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I'm sorry, but they are just too tough. When a single tank can control a point against 3 or more DPS, there's a problem. Toss in a healer, and that tank can be essentially unkillable. That is a serious issue if they get control of a mask in Walatiki, or sit on a point in Halls. It essentially means your team is much better off ignoring the tank and focusing on other players. Those tips you provide are basically worthless against any good player. They won't be tricked off the point, and they won't get close to an edge to be pushed off. If it's an engineer tank, then all they really have to do is stand there and shoot, knowing you won't be able to kill them.
 
Now, maybe it is pointless to be angry at PVP tanks. But I can get angry at Carbine for letting them be so unkillable.	
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I'm sorry, but they are just too tough. When a single tank can control a point against 3 or more DPS, there's a problem. Toss in a healer, and that tank can be essentially unkillable. That is a serious issue if they get control of a mask in Walatiki, or sit on a point in Halls. It essentially means your team is much better off ignoring the tank and focusing on other players. Those tips you provide are basically worthless against any good player. They won't be tricked off the point, and they won't get close to an edge to be pushed off. If it's an engineer tank, then all they really have to do is stand there and shoot, knowing you won't be able to kill them.
 
Now, maybe it is pointless to be angry at PVP tanks. But I can get angry at Carbine for letting them be so unkillable.
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if a single tank is controlling a point against 3 dps the dps are idiots for not chain CCing him long enough for the first caster of the chain CC to interact with the objective. so L2P.
 
Just because you don't adapt to the situation to overcome it doesn't mean its broken.
			
				
	Edited November 26, 2015 by Techr	
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if a single tank is controlling a point against 3 dps the dps are idiots for not chain CCing him long enough for the first caster of the chain CC to interact with the objective. so L2P.
 
Just because you don't adapt to the situation to overcome it doesn't mean its broken.
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Doesn't matter how long you CC an Engi tank, they don't die.
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Doesn't matter how long you CC an Engi tank, they don't die.
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There's a huge circular discussion about this in the pvp section.
 
Looks like it's gonna happen here too xD	
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lol............. So your upset that a character traded in all their damage capabilities to stay alive forever..... seriously......... BGs ARE NOT ABOUT KILLING RED TAGS, THEY ARE ABOUT ACCOMPLISHING THE OBJECTIVES. YOU CAN GET AROUND AN ENGI TANK HOLDING ONE OF THESE OBJECTIVES BY CCING THEM.
 
Also instead of just bring your personal DPS abilities, so you can try to extend your very tiny epeen, try DEBUFFING THEM.
 
You can kill engi tanks...... you can get past them to the objectives they are sitting on. If you don't adjust your play style to try to do that then you honestly have no right to complain. PVP in pretty much all games is about adjusting your kit and play depending on the opposition you face. If you don't adjust your kit and play according to the situation your gonna *cupcake*in fail lol.
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			Lol did you come here just for attention? Post this in the PvP section.	
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1 - This seems like it would be better off posted in the PvP section
2 - WildStar PvP in general has been on the back burner of lower priority compared to everything else
3 - Objectives can be changed to be 'stand & hold' objectives so that this type of thing is far less commonplace
4 - Disabling the 'Support' tree of every class would be a kludge to 'fix' this issue but severely limit any options for healers or tanks at all in PvP.  Pick your poison.	
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if a single tank is controlling a point against 3 dps the dps are idiots for not chain CCing him long enough for the first caster of the chain CC to interact with the objective. so L2P.
 
Just because you don't adapt to the situation to overcome it doesn't mean its broken.
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Doesn't matter how long you CC an Engi tank, they don't die.
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Clearly, having to COORDINATE 3 PLAYERS TO CC IN A CHAIN IN ORDER TO TAKE AN OBJECTIVE take less skills than SPAMMING UNSTEADY MIASMA.
It shouldn't be possible for 1 completely retarded player to be able to hold off 3 good players. Yet, it's possible for them to do so because YOU CAN'T CC A GTAE DoT.
 
Anyone defending the current state of tanks in PvP are nothing more than a bunch of griefers. I certainly hope you enjoy ruining PvP with your cancer tank.
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			last i checked UM has a duration.... so it ends... anyone that whines about a problem instead of figuring out a solution to it is just a whiny whiny baby face that cant do anything for themselves. Look i can do that too :)
			
				
	Edited November 26, 2015 by Techr	
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This is the exact reason why I haven't touched PvP in this game I played too much PVP in other MMO's and wanted to get away from what this thread is turning into. Can people please keep the PVP talk to the PVP forums as no matter what you do there is always people who will complain about x class or x build being overpowered and shouting for a nerf. 
 
Next stop people will be complaining about DPS dealing too much damage and want them to get there damage nerfed. It is like a vicious cycle for some to complain when they get beat about everything and anything, its the nature of PvP and in the end unless they split out skill sets it's the ones who do not wish to PvP that get punished in the end. 	
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last i checked UM has a duration.... so it ends...
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It's not about how difficult it is to kill a tank.
 
It's about how easy it is for a tank to hold a point.
 
No skill required, just bring T8 PDU.
 
All these scrub PvP tanks defending their role...lel. L2P.	
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could always play a class that isnt crit based........ ohhh wait...... common sense? NO!@
 
There are ways to get around the tank,s your just to busy insulting people and being a whiny.......
			
				
	Edited November 26, 2015 by Techr	
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could always play a class that isnt crit based........ ohhh wait...... common sense? NO!@
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Lol did you come here just for attention? Post this in the PvP section.
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*rolls eyes*
 
there is a 14 page thread about this already.
If we're going to complain about pvp in gen disc, can we PLEASE complain about the fact that carbine HAVE COMPLETELY RUINED SEASON 2 AND NEEDS TO IMPLEMENT FIXES ASAP TO ENTICE MORE PEOPLE TO PARTICIPATE
 
:(	
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*rolls eyes*
 
there is a 14 page thread about this already.
If we're going to complain about pvp in gen disc, can we PLEASE complain about the fact that carbine HAVE COMPLETELY RUINED SEASON 2 AND NEEDS TO IMPLEMENT FIXES ASAP TO ENTICE MORE PEOPLE TO PARTICIPATE
 
 :(
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From a newbie's perspective:
 
-PvP has been a hostile and antagonistic environment to any newcomers in just about every MMO.  The primary way some other (poor-quality) MMOs have worked around this is to make PvP either mandatory for character-progression items (SkyForge) or make it so rewarding that you'd be silly not to take full advantage of the obscene amounts of loot & money that can be obtained; this basically breaks the in-game economy and massively inflates prices (TERA).
 
-Entire PvP-specific games & genres have perpetuated the 'toxic' online environment of anything related to PvP.  The excessive toxicity in this thread has only reinforced that ideal.  There are millions of people that only WATCH the MOBA games instead of playing them because they don't want to dip their toes into that toxic environment.  The concentrated best efforts of an entire studio (RioT) to evaluate and manipulate player psychology to NOT be sour cupcakes has not improved the situation.
 
-WildStar has no concrete and definitively desirable PvP rewards to most players that would justify suffering through the toxicity.
 
-WildStar PvP is an afterthought rather than a strong pillar of gameplay as it should be done.
 
-Name any MMOs where PvP has been done properly, then tell me whether the MMOs you named are still profitable/alive today or are running on fumes/life support.  Whether anyone wants to admit it or not, the MOBA genre has pretty much made 'MMO PvP' a non-starter.  You can throw it in there but there is no point in dedicating the resources to improve it if everyone is just gonna leave for the next new shiny MOBA content drop or new MOBA that comes out.
 
To use the Mordesh analogy; PvPers in WildStar are afflicted with the Contagion and the Dominion (Carbine) would rather quarantine them instead of helping them out and hope that the plague 'burns itself out' through self-destruction.  Hardcore PvE is where the MMO money market is currently at; go look at the insane success of FFXIV and you'll see that for yourself.  I'm sure NcSoft and Carbine want a slice of that pie and I wish things were different but I don't blame them.  PvP-specific MMOs tend to attract a certain toxic breed of player that contributes heavily to a negative online player community.
 
The only way that myself or most others will bother to suffer through it (and likely just afk or derp around to die as fast as possible) is to have it provide unique and fantastic rewards for doing so.  I'd say they could kill two birds with one stone and solve the RuneCrafting issues and the PvP issues by having RNG loot bags for RuneCrafting be given out after every PvP match.
 
TLDR:
The attitude of the toxic PvP WildStar cupcakes (and this thread) is the reason nobody cares about it.  This is not something Carbine can fix easily without massive modding/banwaves on an already struggling population.
 
EDIT:  This entire thread should be in the PvP section.
			
				
	Edited November 26, 2015 by FantasticCupcake	
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-Name any MMOs where PvP has been done properly, then tell me whether the MMOs you named are still profitable/alive today or are running on fumes/life support.  Whether anyone wants to admit it or not, the MOBA genre has pretty much made 'MMO PvP' a non-starter.  You can throw it in there but there is no point in dedicating the resources to improve it if everyone is just gonna leave for the next new shiny MOBA content drop or new MOBA that comes out.
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From the mmorpgs I've played only GW2 comes to mind even if the game isn't that extremely popular. It kept the two field separated in the right direction like you didn't have to be heavily gear for it besides inserting combo rune sets + weapon runes that interested the player. Only thing you had to buy were the cosmetic armor and weapon box depending on the player's pvp level.
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Doesn't matter how long you CC an Engi tank, they don't die.
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			Why does everyone perpetrate pvpers as toxic? Most of the people I play with are really nice, kind people. The toxic idiots get ignored and eventually end up quitting because noone likes them either :/	
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The problem isn't tanks - they trade all their damage for that survivability.  I have a Glass Cannon esper that can trade shots with an Engie tank all day, neither one of us dying.
 
The problem is the the map design, that allows a tank to accomplish more then other players. 
-Tanks on Tiki are certainly trouble, but can be mitigated by good teamwork (if they have a tank mask runner, go steal some, run interference, etc, instead of just trying to burn him down).  Actually, thats a good place to be IMO, it encourages team-level counterplay and communication.  So tanks are actually GOOD to have in PVP from that standpoint. 
-Daggersworn is just a bad map in general (too long, too much space, mounts suck in pvp, etc so forth), but again, there are enough alternate objectives that a tank can't dominate on their own.
-Which leaves Halls.  A terrible, badly designed map, with a mechanic (click to capture control points) that's easily exploitable by tanks.  Fix that, and the general appeal of playing tank in pvp will go down, which means you'll see less of it, which means.... etc.  The chain of complaining is broken.
 
PS.  It also means you can solo-queue for Tiki and avoid the problem.  Too bad about missing the prestige bags though, those are *really* important if you aren't geared yet.	
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I would respond to this but it's been beaten to death...
 
I'll leave new comers with the tldr... there's a thread of a few engi tanks saying l2p and the rest of us asking why someone missing a chromosome can defend a point against 4-5 players playing their ass off. Every l2p argument they have revolves around the TANK making many mistakes in front of a FEW dps. 
 
It speaks volumes that after a few days of the thread dying they made a "self assurance" thread defending themselves against (no attackers) just to feel like maybe they aren't just lying to themselves...
 
 
I would like to see any of you defending tanks in a dps class... you'll find one thing in common, their all bad and using something broken atleast made them useful. Nobody RESPECTABLE in the pvp community plays a tank in pvp other than to troll.	
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Why does everyone perpetrate pvpers as toxic? Most of the people I play with are really nice, kind people. The toxic idiots get ignored and eventually end up quitting because noone likes them either :/
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I would like to see any of you defending tanks in a dps class... you'll find one thing in common, their all bad and using something broken atleast made them useful. Nobody RESPECTABLE in the pvp community plays a tank in pvp other than to troll.
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			toxic players are only successful with other toxic players... dont join their guilds and encourage sportsmanship... period	
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I don't understand why your bad experiences with other games has made you somewhat think everyone who plays pvp is a horrible, toxic person.
 
Maybe you should get to know some of us who go out of their way for the community, and it might change your mind instead of being prejudiced.
 
The wildstar pvp community is one of the closest, kindest, more helpful ones there is out there. We all have friendly competition but have made great friendships, both cross factions and cross regions. The players that have stuck around the longest have been striving to keep pvp fair and balanced for all and are often some of the people who test the beta extensively and give great feedback. 
 
It just makes me so annoyed to be pigeonholed into some "you're an instant *cupcake* because you play pvp". 
I've met raiders who are more toxic than pvp'ers. People in general are either idiots or not. Stop focusing on the minority and you might actually see the majority of pvp players are just there to enjoy themselves and have fun and don't very often involve themselves with the horrible people. 	
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Unfortunately NA side has some truly toxic and disgusting players which may skew our view of it, and unfortunately they are also an organized group.
 
But yeah no it's not specifically a tag all PvPers carry, nor is limited to PvPers. I know plenty of truly toxic and disgusting PvE players too.	
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Now, maybe it is pointless to be angry at PVP tanks. But I can get angry at Carbine for letting them be so unkillable.
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Except the game was never intended to be "pve only". The devspeaks, everything pointed to the game being 50/50.
 
To fix tanks ALL they need to do is change skills/put soft caps on certain stats in pvp instances only. Simple as that. They already have the technology to change things per instance (gear scaling), it is possible to do that with skills and stats too.
 
No need to change anything for pve. This way it would be easier to balance pvp and pve separately. But it will never happen.	
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			Trust me, deflect shouldn't even exist in pvp aside from blind... reward players for aiming. And being wiggly... not for rolling 17-20	
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Its ignorant to say that one group of players are toxic tbh.. both the pve and pvp spectrum have their fair share of toxic players.. Its just how it is. You can choose not to discuss with them and once past that you'll see that the majority in fact is friendly.
 
I've seen plenty of pvers as well as pvpers acting like they are 5 years old and in a sandbox..
 
 
As for tanks, well.. There are situations where they can be extremly strong and other places where they are extremly weak.. vs a pug they will be strong on point defend and mask carrying because there we have the problem of people tunnelvision the tank even if there is a healer on them (seriously focus the healer). Once the healer is dead you can learn to recognize different keymoves the tanks have and when they are vulnerable to attacks.
 
With that said.. Tanks are tanky but thats sorta their job.. there are a few things that could change (dots not preventing cap) that would make things like Unstead Miasma annoyance go away but the problem doesnt lie with their surv.	
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Trust me, deflect shouldn't even exist in pvp aside from blind... reward players for aiming. And being wiggly... not for rolling 17-20
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I agree, deflect in this game doesnt belong. You can avoid attacks afterall
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A large part of the issue is allowing DoTs to cancel capture channels. Even SWToR for all its failings realized very early on that it was a horrible idea. It should be the first tick of the DoT only that can interrupt. That would make UM more balanced, as well as all the other 100% uptime long DoTs (Ignite/storm/fatal wounds/ruin etc).
 
As for tanks being "unkillable griefing morons who need to L2P". No. There are definitely balance changes (see above for a huge one) to be made, but raging because you/your team is incompetent doesn't mean Carbine needs to run around dumbing PvP down to a level you can handle.	
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A large part of the issue is allowing DoTs to cancel capture channels. Even SWToR for all its failings realized very early on that it was a horrible idea. It should be the first tick of the DoT only that can interrupt.
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			I don't think it's DoTs per say that's the problem, since they can be cleansed and those abilities really need more of a reason to be used, but Miasma and other world-targeted spells can't be cleansed so for those yeah I'd agree.	
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I don't think it's DoTs per say that's the problem, since they can be cleansed and those abilities really need more of a reason to be used, but Miasma and other world-targeted spells can't be cleansed so for those yeah I'd agree.
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lol............. So your upset that a character traded in all their damage capabilities to stay alive forever..... seriously......... BGs ARE NOT ABOUT KILLING RED TAGS, THEY ARE ABOUT ACCOMPLISHING THE OBJECTIVES. YOU CAN GET AROUND AN ENGI TANK HOLDING ONE OF THESE OBJECTIVES BY CCING THEM.
 
Also instead of just bring your personal DPS abilities, so you can try to extend your very tiny epeen, try DEBUFFING THEM.
 
You can kill engi tanks...... you can get past them to the objectives they are sitting on. If you don't adjust your play style to try to do that then you honestly have no right to complain. PVP in pretty much all games is about adjusting your kit and play depending on the opposition you face. If you don't adjust your kit and play according to the situation your gonna *cupcake*in fail lol.
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I don't understand why your bad experiences with other games has made you somewhat think everyone who plays pvp is a horrible, toxic person.
 
Maybe you should get to know some of us who go out of their way for the community, and it might change your mind instead of being prejudiced.
 
The wildstar pvp community is one of the closest, kindest, more helpful ones there is out there. We all have friendly competition but have made great friendships, both cross factions and cross regions. The players that have stuck around the longest have been striving to keep pvp fair and balanced for all and are often some of the people who test the beta extensively and give great feedback. 
 
It just makes me so annoyed to be pigeonholed into some "you're an instant *cupcake* because you play pvp". 
I've met raiders who are more toxic than pvp'ers. People in general are either idiots or not. Stop focusing on the minority and you might actually see the majority of pvp players are just there to enjoy themselves and have fun and don't very often involve themselves with the horrible people. 
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I'm toxic when somebody who's useless opens their mouth mid bg... or people who are just dumb as hell(i.e. people who rush to pick up the flag with no heals nearby at 5% hp instead of letting the other 2 players at full pick it up... 
 
Also, I get toxic when players don't even try... I'm sorry but if I qued into a dungeon in pvp gear I atleast run a buff build with lots of interrupts... pve players who que into bgs don't even bother buying the blue pvp gear... Don't bother running any pvp gear they get, and don't bother even looking up a pvp build, just run in with their raid build... I have seen warriors running 7 button dps builds with leap.... no pvp gear, just getting kited and tickling people.... blow their innate only to get instantly cc'd because they stick out like a sore thumb... It's okay if you're in blues with high runes... I absolutely don't mind that... if you have gear and you're just running a bad build, when I say something I usually get toxic responses... "yo dude, idk what kind of build you're running but I'll msg you after this bg. We'll fix it" and I get responses like "umm, I'll play the game how I want thx" this is like the nicest way to *cupcake* me off.
 
People being useless and stubborn makes me wish I could just break the pvp rules. Transfer to entity, and camp the entrance to ga until shits like that quit the game.
 
I'm not the most friendly player when I'm pve'ing, but I have no problem asking for tips on how to do a boss, or build/rotation... so yeah if you feel like pvp players are toxic it's because of players LIKE YOU who take 0 time and perpetuation to actually be useful in pvp. How would you feel if raid night came, 3 dps couldn't make it so you had to pug those spots, automatically got pvp'ers who went in their pvp gear/spec didn't bother listening to the encounters mechanichs, did really bad rdps, didn't interrupt, whipes your group over and over and you can't kick them. This is part of the reason people run premades, to get rid of stubborn terrible players who are just farming amps/abilities	
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The PvP population on any one realm is often not enough to pop queues fast enough so Carbine enabled cross-realm queues instead.
 
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You're one of the reasons I turn my chat off in pvp.
 
Attitude like this makes me want to quit PvP in ANY game.
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I'm toxic when somebody who's useless opens their mouth mid bg... or people who are just dumb as hell(i.e. people who rush to pick up the flag with no heals nearby at 5% hp instead of letting the other 2 players at full pick it up...
 
Also, I get toxic when players don't even try... I'm sorry but if I qued into a dungeon in pvp gear I atleast run a buff build with lots of interrupts... pve players who que into bgs don't even bother buying the blue pvp gear... Don't bother running any pvp gear they get, and don't bother even looking up a pvp build, just run in with their raid build... I have seen warriors running 7 button dps builds with leap.... no pvp gear, just getting kited and tickling people.... blow their innate only to get instantly cc'd because they stick out like a sore thumb... It's okay if you're in blues with high runes... I absolutely don't mind that... if you have gear and you're just running a bad build, when I say something I usually get toxic responses... "yo dude, idk what kind of build you're running but I'll msg you after this bg. We'll fix it" and I get responses like "umm, I'll play the game how I want thx" this is like the nicest way to *cupcake* me off.
 
People being useless and stubborn makes me wish I could just break the pvp rules. Transfer to entity, and camp the entrance to ga until shits like that quit the game.
 
I'm not the most friendly player when I'm pve'ing, but I have no problem asking for tips on how to do a boss, or build/rotation... so yeah if you feel like pvp players are toxic it's because of players LIKE YOU who take 0 time and perpetuation to actually be useful in pvp. How would you feel if raid night came, 3 dps couldn't make it so you had to pug those spots, automatically got pvp'ers who went in their pvp gear/spec didn't bother listening to the encounters mechanichs, did really bad rdps, didn't interrupt, whipes your group over and over and you can't kick them. This is part of the reason people run premades, to get rid of stubborn terrible players who are just farming amps/abilities
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I'm toxic when somebody who's useless opens their mouth mid bg... or people who are just dumb as hell(i.e. people who rush to pick up the flag with no heals nearby at 5% hp instead of letting the other 2 players at full pick it up...
 
Also, I get toxic when players don't even try... I'm sorry but if I qued into a dungeon in pvp gear I atleast run a buff build with lots of interrupts... pve players who que into bgs don't even bother buying the blue pvp gear... Don't bother running any pvp gear they get, and don't bother even looking up a pvp build, just run in with their raid build... I have seen warriors running 7 button dps builds with leap.... no pvp gear, just getting kited and tickling people.... blow their innate only to get instantly cc'd because they stick out like a sore thumb... It's okay if you're in blues with high runes... I absolutely don't mind that... if you have gear and you're just running a bad build, when I say something I usually get toxic responses... "yo dude, idk what kind of build you're running but I'll msg you after this bg. We'll fix it" and I get responses like "umm, I'll play the game how I want thx" this is like the nicest way to *cupcake* me off.
 
People being useless and stubborn makes me wish I could just break the pvp rules. Transfer to entity, and camp the entrance to ga until shits like that quit the game.
 
I'm not the most friendly player when I'm pve'ing, but I have no problem asking for tips on how to do a boss, or build/rotation... so yeah if you feel like pvp players are toxic it's because of players LIKE YOU who take 0 time and perpetuation to actually be useful in pvp. How would you feel if raid night came, 3 dps couldn't make it so you had to pug those spots, automatically got pvp'ers who went in their pvp gear/spec didn't bother listening to the encounters mechanichs, did really bad rdps, didn't interrupt, whipes your group over and over and you can't kick them. This is part of the reason people run premades, to get rid of stubborn terrible players who are just farming amps/abilities
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Someone who makes no attempt to learn to play or win but keeps queing is essentially griefing the other 9 people in the bg. That's toxic right? Griefing people is toxic behavior and im 100% confident that making those people quit will only improve the gameplay experience for everyone else.
 
I miss rating effecting matchmaking... if your rbg rating was 1600+ it was pretty much granteed everyone on your team AND the enemy team knew what they were doing... that said if mmr worked there would be less toxicity	
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This would apply to Arenas, Battlegrounds, and any structured PvP that you queue into.
I'd like to know the specific limitations regarding how much a character is *required* to participate in order to not be negatively affected by player reports.
 
For example, a person does not want or care for PvP until they can get enough Prestige to get their PvP gear so they want to just move around and die without fighting back with bare-minimum effort.
 
Would such a person suffer any Carbine-authorized retaliation for such behavior?  Would it break any of the game rules?  Considering how vague the rules on 'harassment' and 'griefing' are, I am unsure whether such a scenario would fall under those or other vague categories of 'trolling'.
 
Also unsure if remaining in the starting zone (and not dropping down) while moving around or doing /dance or chatting with others will still count as being 'afk' or 'non participation' and earn moderation or negative in-game actions.
 
So I'd like some explicit clarification on what is REQUIRED to be done within a structured PvP area to avoid moderation/punishment for not playing the game the way other sour cupcakes want people to play it.
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and then you have some players that can't control their emotions at all and sometimes resulting to insulting if their vocabulary words are limited. What's the point of adding if you can't even debate and defend your view in a good manner? If no ideas comes to thought to debate and all is left is to attack with insults. Don't bother posting because you lost whatever you was trying to debate or defend.
 
 
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 Griefing people is toxic behavior and im 100% confident that making those people quit will only improve the gameplay experience for everyone else.
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and then you have some players that can't control their emotions at all and sometimes resulting to insulting if their vocabulary words are limited. What's the point of adding if you can't even debate and defend your view in a good manner? If no ideas comes to thought to debate and all is left is to attack with insults. Don't bother posting because you lost whatever you was trying to debate or defend.
 
 
 
That view depends on the player whether they're griefing on what they don't understand or because they can't beat a specific class with their gear. Making players quit is never a good way to improve a gameplay experience if it comes from misunderstanding. Sometimes players just need tips and advices to know how to play their classes which is why guides are created on forums or videos. However of a toxic player quitting because they can't beat a specific class, troublemaker in general and name calling on their teammate is the only way to have a healthy gameplay experience.
 
So griefing varies in its own term.
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Oh dear, well this thread certainly has gone places...
 
In reference to the "toxicity" of pvp, I've not personally seen much of that. I've barely PvPed prior to F2P and when F2P ccame  IStarted over from 6-50 purely doing BGs and small bits of Owpvp, the amount of unsavory behavior wasn't worst or better than PvE. IF someone was clearly making the match unpleasant by afking or not participating, I'd simply report them, If someone used language way over the top even , again report them. Also unless something has changed recently I have had no issue palcing the 1 or 2 people on ignore. Heck the game reminds me every time i log in that I have people on ignore. It's no worse or better than the PvE crowd and if I'm honest I wish I had been part of the pvp side more earlier.
 
However with that said...
 
In regard to tanks, I feel that Wildstar simply took an approach that conflicts with the map design as others ahve said. If the approach had been more like how warhammer handles their tank role in pvp(which i think was actually better) it probably wouldn't be as much. However even in that instance I would say that just general handling of persisting aoe fields is the bigger issue; It is one thing for a tank to be tough, it's another thing for a tank to be tough and just plop down a field aoe and weeeeee	
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Griefing doesn't have its own terms, it's either griefing or its not... that player is a griefer, complaining about toxicity... insult my vocabulary but this is very simple English to understand
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I've never played before so this is actually my first game tanks aren't easy to kill in pvp without 2 or more players that happens to be geared. I think if players actually took the time and learn to counter that many are doing now in pvp. Well I can't say many, but I've seen some difference in some players ever since counters been posted on forums.
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Basically in Warhammer they designed the tanks so that they were tough to kill in and of themselves, but in addition to being hard to kill solo(in some cases impossible if they were played well) they served role as protector of their team mates via taunts, sharing damage, reducing damage, etc. If you ere to for example go after my healer I'd taunt you and if you did not pay attention to me I'd either hit you like a mac truck and or your damage was reduce to a wet noodle; Only way to get rid of it was to outlast the effect or to actually hit me with direct damage(a dot would only work for 1 tick). This put tanks into a very active role that they carried with themselves in both PvE and PvP.
 
 
I do agree that have an understanding though of tanks has helped though and it from my point of view has been improving on the player side over time, but I think there is some tweaking that needs to be done on Carbines end as well to get it all "okie dokie"
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			As an engineer tank you can just fire off a ground targeted dot onto the objective, so it doesn't matter if they are chajn cc'd. Also, there are only 3 classes capable of knocking a tank off the objective, and interrupt armor or careful positioning can completely negate that. Why do only engi tanks argue that engi tanks are not op in pvp?	
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Why do only engi tanks argue that engi tanks are not op in pvp?
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Though I agree that the tank classes (through careful positioning) can be ridiculous to counter, even with CC, there's a few key points not being stated. 1. Do you know what makes PvP Tanks (Engi mainly) so OP? - Their Mitigation + healing.2. Do you know what counters Healing + Mitigation? - Crit Sev / Crit Sev. Runes and MS (Mortal Strike/Reduced Healing effects)3. Do you know who can utilize Crit Severity and MS effect skills on their PvP LAS? - Every single DPS class4. Do you know how many average "PvPers" carry MS or Crit Sev utlity either in their gear or on their LAS? - Not that many5. Do you know whose fault that is? - Those same DPS
 
It's pretty obvious that when you break things down, even in the most simplest of forms, it's not the Tanks being OP that makes them seem OP, it's the lack of forethought from hundreds of DPS to even allocate their LAS or Runes properly.  While I'll concede that some classes are able to DPS and bring more Utility than others (War vs Medic), both of them are just as able as the next Stalker, SS, or Esper to switch out their LAS out of combat inside the battleground or res point to adapt to whatever Tanks might be there and suddenly causing a problem.  If they choose not to, well then I suppose the forums are here to tell them how stupid that is. Every single class forum has threads with listed builds designed around bringing that extra utility, and I'd argue that any DPS should be bringing it anyway by default, only switching them out if no healers or tanks are on the enemy team (which is rare).  In the end, the choice and choice not to do so is entirely a player issue. 
			
				
	Edited November 30, 2015 by Macloud	
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			everyone bar 1 class runs crit severity... idk who you are but that's common sense... and not all classes have a healing debuff(or a good enough one for the situation) so its very clear you're new here. also the deal with it mentality simply doesn't exist with experienced players who DONT play tanks, so it's pretty clear you either don't face real players or play a tank yourself.I agree tex... I play as many classes in games as I can so I can eliminate the "pet class" mentality... and while I see many complaints as simply an L2P issue there are ones that I know(being on both sides of the fence) that are actually overpowered. please stop bumping this thread anymore... let the scrubby OP fade in the pages of time and find something other than a plea for self-assurance that his class isn't the most broken thing in BG's.​	
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			i know forums are generally negative, but goodness, it seriously sounds like this game is done for.	
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i know forums are generally negative, but goodness, it seriously sounds like this game is done for.
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			That PDU nerf. 	
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That PDU nerf. 
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Yep, pretty much worthless now. Will instantly vanish if anyone is on you. That in addition to moja gutting every other major suvivability tool they had = RIP engies. They're just DPS that stack defensive runes now. Move on to bitching about wars/stalkers.
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Yeah this is just the tip of the iceberg for you engineer tanks so be ready for those players to give ya future vulgar insults. Pvp is pvp after all and nothing, but negativity comes from that realm messing it up for pve players.
 
They should just increase tanks damage if they want to remove defensive abilities and not just be one sided about it. Those players want tanks to work hard right so in a fair exchange let damage done for support abilities increase.  That way they can be viable in arenas as well.	
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Yeah this is just the tip of the iceberg for you engineer tanks so be ready for those players to give ya future vulgar insults. Pvp is pvp after all and nothing, but negativity comes from that realm messing it up for pve players.
 
They should just increase tanks damage if they want to remove defensive abilities and not just be one sided about it. Those players want tanks to work hard right so in a fair exchange let damage done for support abilities increase.  That way they can be viable in arenas as well.
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its was more of an issue when Dps would take it and just laugh as they killed you
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			What was done?  I don't see patch notes posted anywhere.	
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What was done?  I don't see patch notes posted anywhere.
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not really, it worked... engi tanks are getting nerfed in pvp, as of today. it was basically just not fun for anyone except the few who enjoyed abusing it. that's why I gets nasty
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i missed thee double xp event due to computer crapping out, and im not even mad about it, because its starting to look like i would have wasted my time.
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i mean the game is on its way to dead. i never see anything good, and its all doom and gloom. and honestly i missed thee double xp event due to computer crapping out, and im not even mad about it, because its starting to look like i would have wasted my time.
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Though I agree that the tank classes (through careful positioning) can be ridiculous to counter, even with CC, there's a few key points not being stated. 
 
1. Do you know what makes PvP Tanks (Engi mainly) so OP? - Their Mitigation + healing.
2. Do you know what counters Healing + Mitigation? - Crit Sev / Crit Sev. Runes and MS (Mortal Strike/Reduced Healing effects)
3. Do you know who can utilize Crit Severity and MS effect skills on their PvP LAS? - Every single DPS class
4. Do you know how many average "PvPers" carry MS or Crit Sev utlity either in their gear or on their LAS? - Not that many
5. Do you know whose fault that is? - Those same DPS
 
It's pretty obvious that when you break things down, even in the most simplest of forms, it's not the Tanks being OP that makes them seem OP, it's the lack of forethought from hundreds of DPS to even allocate their LAS or Runes properly.  While I'll concede that some classes are able to DPS and bring more Utility than others (War vs Medic), both of them are just as able as the next Stalker, SS, or Esper to switch out their LAS out of combat inside the battleground or res point to adapt to whatever Tanks might be there and suddenly causing a problem.  If they choose not to, well then I suppose the forums are here to tell them how stupid that is. 
 
Every single class forum has threads with listed builds designed around bringing that extra utility, and I'd argue that any DPS should be bringing it anyway by default, only switching them out if no healers or tanks are on the enemy team (which is rare).  In the end, the choice and choice not to do so is entirely a player issue. 
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			I see tanks are getting nerfed in pvp. Too bad I don't care, #PremadePugStompLife	
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I see tanks are getting nerfed in pvp. Too bad I don't care, #PremadePugStompLife
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Yeah this is just the tip of the iceberg for you engineer tanks so be ready for those players to give ya future vulgar insults. Pvp is pvp after all and nothing, but negativity comes from that realm messing it up for pve players.
 
They should just increase tanks damage if they want to remove defensive abilities and not just be one sided about it. Those players want tanks to work hard right so in a fair exchange let damage done for support abilities increase. That way they can be viable in arenas as well.
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Arena pvp tanks is full ussles
All ignore me and kill my friends then slow kill me.
I no have dmg.	
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Arena pvp tanks is full ussles
All ignore me and kill my friends then slow kill me.
I no have dmg.
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