natgillin/translations-raw huggingface dataset:
Immuniteten kan ikke påberåbes af et medlem — det gælder også i vore nationale parlamenter — som gribes på fersk gerning, og kan ikke hindre Forsamlingens ret — og det er selve grunden til at vi forhandler her i dag — til at ophæve immuniteten.
The content of that immunity varies from one Member State to another, but its purpose is always to ensure that the work of Parliament is not disturbed by the possibly arbitrary arrest of one of its members; a further aim is to protect the freedom of expression of an elected representative in the exercise of his official functions.
Ferri, formand for retsudvalget. — (IT) Fru formand, ærede kolleger, fru Gaspards betænkning, der er et forbillede på hendes fuldkommenhed og klarhed, kunne fritage mig for at tage ordet.
Mrs Gaspard, rapporteur. — (FR) Madam President, ladies and gentlemen.
Problemet var faktisk at finde ud af, om immuniteten dækkede et medlem af Europa-Parlamentet uden for Parlamentets møder.
This is the first time that our directly elected Assembly has had to consider a question of parliamentary immunity.
Domstolen traf sin afgørelse med dom af 12. maj 1964.
Our predecessors in the former Assembly were only called upon to do so once, in May 1964.
Når disse ting er nævnt, lad os så komme til Gouthier-sagen.
On the contrary, it has considered the specific case and also the point of principle at considerable length.
Fru formand, den 14. oktober forelagde De os en anmodning fra Den italienske Republiks myndigheder om ophævelse af vor kollegas immunitet.
For several months it has been examining the status of Members of Parliament in the ten Member States to ascertain their immunity and has tried to define a legal position on the proce dure to be followed in our Parliament.
I henhold til artikel 51, stk. 2, i forretningsordenen fremsendtes denne anmodning til retsudvalget, som gennemgik kendsgerningerne og de proceduremæssige spørgsmål og desuden i overens stemmelse med forretningsordenen hørte vor kollega.
We have done so pending the delivery, as is desirable, of an opinion on changes and additional provisions to be embodied in the protocol on the privileges and immunities of Members of the European Parliament.
Det drejer sig ikke om at komme ind på spørgsmål af teoretisk karakter; det er tilstrækkeligt at erindre om, at institutionen immunitet blev fastsat i traktaterne, endnu inden Parlamentet blev valgt ved direkte almindelige valg, eller dengang da Parlamentet bestod af medlemmer udpeget af de nationale parlamenter, som havde fordel af den immunitet, der er fastsat i de forskellige nationale forfatninger.
The immunity of Members of the European Parlia ment is defined in the Protocol on the privileges and immunities of the European Communities; reference to it is made in Article 4 (2) of the Act of 20 September 1976 on the election of representatives to the Assembly by direct universal suffrage.
Traktaterne ville derfor fastsætte en særlig immunitet, som kun Europa-Parlamentet havde beføjelse til at suspendere eller ophæve.
As to the procedure for lifting immunity, we have based our considerations on Rule 51 of the Rules of Procedure. What do the texts actually say?
Hvis dette var gældende under den tidligere ordning, så repræsenterer den naturligvis, idet den er meget mere velbegrundet i dag, hvor Parlamentet er valgt ved almindelige direkte valg, således som man har erindret om det i en dom fornylig fra Domstolen, i ligevægten mellem de euro pæiske institutioner den uomgængeligt nødvendige demokratiske bestanddel, det direkte udtryk for folkets vilje.
Article 10 of the Protocol to which I referred indicates that 'for the duration of the sessions' — a term to which we shall return in a moment — 'Members of the Assembly shall benefit on their national territory from the immunity recognized to members of the parliament of their country and, on the territory of any other Member State, from exemption from all measures of detention and judicial action.'
Der er således ingen tvivl om det teoretiske og retlige grundlag for denne institution.
Furthermore this immunity naturally covers Members of Parliament while travelling between their place of residence and the place of meeting of the Parliament.
Det må stadig være Parlamentet selv, der med den største omhu og den største ansvarlighed, skal varetage den opgave at udtale sig om anmodninger om ophævelse af immuniteten. teten.
It cannot be invoked, as is also the case in our national parliaments, when a Member is caught in the act of committing an offence and the Assembly itself clearly has the right to lift that immunity when it considers this appropriate — and it is for that very purpose that we are discussing this matter today.
Jeg erindrer om disse kendsgerninger, idet jeg dog præciserer, at vi ikke skal dømme derom, men simpelthen udtale os om ophævelsen eller afvisningen af at ophæve immuniteten.
Before turning to the case in hand, allow me to remind you of the foundations of the concept of immunity and of the texts on which our proposed decision is based.
Det er imidlertid nyttigt at dømme i sagen: Anselmo Gouthier blev, fordi han havde taget ordet under en offentlig demonstration den 24. december 1979, en demonstration for fred og nedrustning på et sted, hvor den nævnte demonstration ikke var tilladt — den var tilladt nogle få hund rede meter fra stedet — anklaget for den lovovertrædelse, der er nævnt i artikel 18 i lovens eneste tekst om den offentlige sikkerhed i Den italienske Republik.
The concept of immunity is directly linked to that of democracy and to the separation of powers. In the late XlVth century in England, the concept began to appear when a member of the House of Commons, Thomas Huxey, was'sentenced to death for taking the initiative in tabling a bill denouncing the scandalous practices of the court of Richard II and the resulting financial burden on the taxpayer.
Den domstol, som dømte i denne sag, suspenderede den restssag, der var indledt imod Anselmo Gouthier i betragtning af hans egenskab af medlem af Parlamentet, og det er således at vi har fået forelagt sagen.
The idea of the imperative need for Members of Parliament to discuss and debate in Parliament without interference from the executive or judiciary made its appearance as long ago as that.
Retsudvalget har ikke villet gå ind på en
The Court handed down its judgment on 12 May 1964.
Retsudvalget har kun kunnet konstatere, at de kendsgerninger, der ligger til grund for den sag, der er indledt imod Anselmo Gouthier, åbenbart er forbundet med udøvelsen af hans mandat.
At the origin of the French parliamentary system in 1793, a second aspect of immunity became clear when Robespierre obtained the adoption of a resolution depriving the judiciary of the right to initiate proceed ings against a member of parliament.
Det er faktisk som medlem af Parlamentet, at Anselmo Gouthier tog ordet.
Against that background let us now return to the Gouthier case.
Men i sådanne sager viser det sig, at det italienske parlaments kamre ikke giver den tilladelse, der er fastsat i artikel 68 i den italienske forfatning, dvs. at de under alle omstændigheder nægter at ophæve immuniteten.
On 14 October, Madam President, you referred to us a request from the authorities of the Italian Republic for the immunity of our colleague to be lifted.
Ferri teoretisk forhandling: det har enstemmigt erkendt ikke alene kendsgerningernes i høj grad politiske karakter, men også deres udelukkende politiske karakter og har enstemmigt foreslået at afvise anmodningen om ophævelse af immuniteten.
Gaspard lated a specific form of immunity which only the European Assembly had the power to suspend or revoke.
anmode Parlamentet om at stemme for den betænkning, som foreslår, at immuniteten ikke ophæves, således som man har anmodet om det fra den italienske domsmyndigheds side i forbindelse med vor kollega Anselmo Gouthier.
That was so under the old arrangements and is obviously even more justified today for our Assembly elected by direct universal suffrage which, as recently recognized in a judgment of the Court of Justice, represents, in the overall context of the balance between the European Institutions, the indispensable democratic component as the direct expression of the will of the people.
Tyrrell. — (EN) Fru formand, jeg vil blot føje nogle få ord til, hvad ordføreren og formanden for retsudvalget har sagt.
It remains for the Assembly itself to exercise, with the greatest possible fare and sense of responsibility, the task of pronouncing on requests for immunity to be lifted.
Den anden betragtning, jeg gerne vil fremsætte, drejer sig om formuleringen af afgørelsen.
May I remind you of the facts of this case while pointing out that it is not for us to judge them; we have simply to pronounce on the lifting of immunity or the refusal to do so.
Det udvalg, jeg har den ære at være formand for, har lige ledes enstemmigt ment, at afgørelsen i disse tilfælde bør være en ren og skær afgørelse uden nogen form for begrundelse eller overvejelse af kendsgerningerne.
However, it is useful to know the facts: by reason of the fact that he spoke during a public demonstration on 24 December 1979 in favour of peace and disarmament at a place where the said demonstration was not permitted — it had been authorized to take place a few hundred yards away — Anselmo Gouthier was accused of the offence stipu lated in Article 18 of the single text of the law on the public security of the Italian Republic.
Allerførst er dette et nyt spørgsmål for Parlamentet, ikke alene af de grunde, de gav, men fordi alle medlemmer af Europa-Parlamentet, indtil de direkte valg, også var medlemmer af et andet parlament, og derfor enten havde dobbelt immunitet eller ingen, alt efter hvordan det nu forholdt sig.
The Legal Affairs Committee found that the facts on which the case brought against Anselmo Gouthier was based are quite evidently linked to the exercise of his mandate.
I dette tilfælde har vi et medlem, som ikke er medlem af et andet parlament.
Anselmo Gouthier spoke at the meeting in his capacity as a Member of Parliament.
Vi beskæftiger os med første del af artikel 10 i protokollen til fusionstraktaten, der bestemmer, at
In such cases the chambers of the Italian Parliament do not grant the authorization provided for in Article 68 of the Italian Constitution, in other words they always refuse to lift parliamentary immunity.
Det er derfor min og retsudvalgets mening, at der i forbindelse med afgørelser af denne art ikke kan stilles ændringsforslag med henblik på at tilføje betragtninger, som bør forblive sagen helt uvedkommende.
The case now before you, ladies and gentlemen, is exemplary in the sense that it is entirely and solely political in nature — so much so that we maintain that it falls even more within the province of Article 9 of the Protocol on Immunities than within that of Article 10.
Begrundelsen herfor er med sine korte og væsentlige betragtninger vedføjet afgørelsen. Parlamentet har kun én pligt: når det først har vurderet de forelagte oplysninger, enten at udtale sig for eller imod anmodningen om ophævelse af immuniteten.
A necessary condition for impunity exists in this case since a representative of the people who speaks in public to express his views to electors in his own constituency — as Mr Gouthier did — is in my judgment and in that of the case law on this subject, performing an act which must be treated as the exercise of his own duties in the fullest sense of the term.
Hr. formand, det er retsudvalgets opfattelse, at dette bør ske med én enkelt afstemning om udvalgets forslag, idet det er underforstået, at hvis udvalgets forslag forkastes, udtaler Parlamentet sig i den modsatte retning.
The Legal Affairs Committee did not wish to engage in a theoretical discussion: it unanimously recognized the not only eminently but indeed exclusively political nature of the facts and unanimously proposed that the request for immunity to be lifted should be turned down.
I den italienske stat — og det pågældende medlem er statsborger i denne stat — behandles dette spørgsmål specielt i artikel 68 i forfatningen, hvor der indrømmes en immunitet, som kun det kammer, medlemmet tilhører, kan ophæve.
Mr Ferri, chairman of the Legal Affairs Committee. — (IT) Madam President, ladies and gentlemen, Mrs Gaspard has presented us with a report of exemplary completeness and clarity so that I might myself have refrained from taking the floor.
Jeg vil gerne under strege, at medlemmet selv ikke kan ophæve immuniteten: kun parlamentet kan gøre dette.- Det er forholdet i Italien; det er også forholdet her i Parlamentet.
The Committee of which I am chairman unanimously felt that the decision in this matter should be a simple and straightforward decision unaccompanied by any explanatory statement or factual considerations.
Så der er på ingen måde tale om, at det pågældende medlem, hr. Gouthier, kommer til Parlamentet og anmoder os om ikke at ophæve hans immunitet; tværtimod har han helt overladt det til Parlamentet at træffe afgørelsen.
The recitals are confined to references to legal provisions, treaties, and provisions of the Italian Constitution applicable in this instance and to the judgment of the Court of Justice inter preting the meaning of the term 'session'.
Jeg ved, at hr. Pannella har stillet et ændringsforslag, der går ud på i teksten at indføre en ting, der selv om den er væsentlig, dog kun bør blive stående i den begrundelse, der er vedføjet afgørelsen, nemlig om kendsgerningernes politiske karakter.
But, as Mrs Gaspard pointed out, this directly elected Assembly is being asked to pronounce for the first time on a request for the parliamentary immunity of one of its Members to be lifted.
Jeg vil gerne bede hr. Pannella om at være opmærksom på de betragtninger, jeg nu har fremført, og som for øvrigt også henholder sig til, hvad der er sket i det italienske parlament, både i deputeretkammeret og i senatet, og om derfor at trække dette ændringsforslag tilbage.
I therefore believe it my duty, as chairman of the Legal Affairs Committee which, on the basis of our Rules of Procedure, is responsible for reporting to the House on matters of this kind, to call your attention to a number of points.
Vi i min gruppe er ikke begejstrede for medlem mernes immunitet. Tværtimod tror vi, at der i princippet ikke skulle være nogen særlig immunitet for medlemmer. Vi tror, at Richard Ils dage, som ordføreren henviste til, nu ligger langt bag os.
In my own opinion and in that of the Legal Affairs Committee no amendments seeking to add considerations totally extraneous to the issue, can be entertained in the case of a decision of this kind.
På den anden side erindrer vi os, at der kunne være nogle medlemsstater, hvor denne immunitet er nødvendig, og det er deres sag at afgøre, når de ophæver den.
Parlia ment has therefore a single duty: it must consider the facts before it and then decide in favour of or against the request for immunity to be lifted.
Det er en tungtvejende grund, som vi holder os for øje. Vi er forsikrede om, at det italienske parlament under denne sags omstændigheder vil nægte at ophæve immuniteten; så under disse omstændigheder, tror vi, at vi i denne sag bør handle på samme måde.
The opinion of the Legal Affairs Committee is that this must be done through a single vote on the Committee's proposal on the understanding that if that proposal is rejected Parliament is in fact adopting a contrary opinion.
Spørgsmålet har naturligvis ikke nogen bindende karakter, men det er alligevel vigtigt med henblik på en vedtagelse af vore afgørelser: det vil sige at det italienske parlament i begge sine to grene — det vil sige både deputeretkammeret og senatet — over for kendsgerninger, der er rent politiske, ikke alene med hensyn til deres formål og deres begrundelse, men også med hensyn til deres reelle indhold, har den sædvane altid at afvise en anmodning om ophævelse af immuniteten.
I do not wish to go into the theoretical aspects; suffice it to say that provision was made for parliamentary immunity in the Treaties even before this Assembly was elected by direct universal suffrage, in other words, at a time when it was composed of Members designated by the national parliaments who benefited from the immunity laid down in the respective national constitutions.
Jeg har derfor også på hele udvalgets vegne den ære at tilslutte mig det, ordføreren allerede har sagt og at
The Treaties therefore stipu
Hr. Gouthiers sag er meget ligetil.
I know that Mr Pannella has tabled an amendment seeking to add to the text of the resolution a factor
tiske virkninger eller er politisk motiveret.
Ferri also the case in this Parliament.
Men her i tilfældet Gouthier er det så entydigt, at man næsten kan tale om et klassisk tilfælde.
So there is no question here of the Member concerned, Mr Gouthier, coming to the Parliament and asking us not to waive his immunity; on the contrary, he has left it entirely to the Parliament to decide.
Hvor ville vi nå hen, mine damer og herrer, hvis vi ville tillade en regering eller en strafferetlig myndighed, at indskrænke et parlamentsmedlems virksomhed, når det pågældende medlem har gjort brug af sine grundlæggende parlamentariske og poli tiske rettigheder? Fru formand, af disse grunde anser den liberale og demokratiske gruppe det for ubetinget nødvendigt, at hr. Gouthiers immunitet ikke ophæves.
I would ask Mr Pannella to consider the arguments which I have put forward and which are in any case based on the procedure followed by both the Chamber and Senate of the Italian Parliament, and therefore withdraw this amendment.
Irmer. — (DE) Fru formand, mine damer og herrer!
On the contrary, we believe that there should in principle be no special immunity for Members.
Den liberale og demokratiske gruppe glæder sig meget over, at hr. Gouthier i dag giver os lejlighed til helt generelt at sige et par ord om immunitetsspørgsmålet.
We believe the days of Richard II, which the rapporteur referred to, are now well behind us.
Jeg benytter i særdeleshed denne lejlighed, fordi der i offentligheden ofte hersker misforståelser om, hvad immunitet egentlig betyder.
On the other hand, we bear in mind that there may be some Member States where this immunity is necessary, and it is a matter for them to decide when to dispense with it.
Man møder mange borgere, der siger: hvorfor skal et parlaments medlem have et privilegium, medens den normale borger rammes af lovens fulde hårdhed?
One thing is certain: we are not willing that Members of this Parliament should receive in their own States less protection than members of their own national parliament receive.
Hvorfor skal parlamentsmedlemmet næsten holdes under en glas klokke og unddrages strafferetlig forfølgelse, medens den almindelige borger skal stå til ansvar for dommeren?
That is a weighty reason which we bear in mind. We are assured that in the circumstances of this case the Italian Parliament would refuse to waive immunity; so, in these circumstances, we think in this case we should do likewise.
Fru formand, heri ligger der en stor misforståelse, og jeg tror, denne misforståelse også kom til udtryk i det, hr. Tyrrell fra den konservative gruppe sagde; det drejer sig dog ikke om et personligt privilegium for parlamentsmedlemmet, men om en garanti for Parlamentets funktionsdygtighed.
The last consideration to which I wish to draw your attention arises in the explanatory statement accompanying Mrs Gaspard's resolution.
Parlamentsmedlemmet selv — det sagde hr. Tyrrell ganske rigtigt — kan slet ikke give afkald på sin immunitet: selv om han skulle blive retsforfulgt, kan dette først ske, når Parlamentet samlet ophæver hans immunitet.
This is not of course a binding argument but it is nevertheless impor tant for the purpose of the adoption of our decisions: when faced with facts of an exclusively political nature not only in their aims and motivation but also in their material form, both houses of the Italian Parliament — the Chamber and the Senate — make it a constant practice to reject requests for immunity to be lifted.
Da retsudvalget enstemmigt tilsluttede sig afgørelsen i Gaspard-betænkningen, altså en afvisning af anmodningen om ophævelse af immuniteten, var der ingen af os, der tænkte sig andet, end at det således var hensigten at skaffe medlemmerne af Europa-Parlamentet en særlig, privilegeret stilling.
On behalf of my whole committee I therefore have the honour to associate myself with the rapporteur's conclusions and call upon Parliament to vote in favour of the report which proposes that the Italian courts request for the immunity of our colleague, Anselmo Gouthier, to be lifted should not be complied with.
Det modsatte er egentlig rigtigt.
President. — I call the European Democratic Group.
Det var det, det kort og godt gik ud på.
President. — I call the Liberal and Democratic Group.
Det ville være forkert at bilde os ind, at vi roligt kan læne os tilbage og sige, at vi ikke mere behøver at gøre noget derfor.
We often meet citizens who ask why a Member of Parlia ment should enjoy privileges which are denied to the man in the street.
Det gælder for de grundlæggende rettigheder, det gælder for de parlamentariske rettigheder, og det gælder ligeledes, således som det viser sig i dette tilfælde, for den parlamentariske immunitet. nitet.
Why should a Member of Parlia ment be specially protected and enjoy immunity from criminal proceedings when the ordinary citizen has to answer for his actions in the courts?
Jeg har som nederlænder tilsluttet mig dette synspunkt. Vi kender i det nederlandske parlament ikke en sådan fremgangsmåde, men da der er andre lande, som godt kender den, er der ikke nogen som helst grund til at stille hr. Gouthier i en dårligere position i forhold til sine italienske kolleger, fordi han nu tilfældigvis er medlem af Europa-Parlamentet.
First of all, this is a new issue for the Parliament, not only for the reasons they gave but because, until direct elections, all Members of this Parliament were also Members of another Parliament and therefore had ' either dual immunity or none at all as the case might be.
Vi betragtede sagen som betydningsfuld, idet den skaber præcedens.
In this case, we have a Member who is not a Member of another Parliament.
Det har fru Gaspard og vor formand, hr. Ferri, alle rede gjort fyldestgørende på hele udvalgets vegne.
We are concerned with the first part of Article 10 of the Protocol to the Merger Treaty, which provides that
Jeg vil dog lige udtrykkeligt fastslå: vi betragter overhovedet ikke dette som at tilkæmpe sig rettigheder, som den almindelige borger ikke har.
Members shall enjoy, in the territory of their own State, the immunities accorded to members of their parliament.
Det er derfor grunden til, at vi gerne støtter tendensen i denne betænkning, og naturligvis også hele systematikken.
Madam President, there is a serious misunderstanding here and I think the same misunderstanding was reflected in the words of our colleague Mr Tyrrell of the Conservative Group; it is not a matter of a personal privilege of a Member of Parliament.
Vi ville netop ikke have nogen lang forhandling om dette spørgsmål.
This issue is one of guaranteeing the ability of Parliament to function.
Mine damer og herrer, derfor skal vi holde os aktualiteten af denne ret til immunitet for øje, og tage dette som et eksempel på, at de grundlæggende rettigheder må forsvares dag for dag.
In the Italian State — and the Member concerned is a citizen of that State — the matter is dealt with specifically by Article 68 of the Constitution, where immunity is granted which only the Chamber to which he there belongs can waive.
Derfor vender jeg mig bestemt imod det, som vor kollega Tyrrell sagde, at man egentlig burde gå ind for en afvikling af denne immunitet.
I would emphasize that the Member himself cannot waive the immunity: only the Parliament can do so.
Her er der absolut ingen vanskeligheder med at definere spørgsmålet.
That is the case in Italy; it is
Formanden.— Gruppen af kommunister og beslægtede har ordet.
Of course we are no longer living in the days of bloodthirsty kings.
ville ikke have imødekommet anmodningen om ophævelse af immuniteten, og derfor kan vi heller ikke imødekomme den. Men, kære kollega Tyrrell, der ligger her en stor fare!
Of course immunity is a right which has grown in the course of history.