MEMO: (CONVERSATION WITH 8 JUNE 1965, WASHINGTON, DC.)
Originator: CIA
To: CHIEF, SECURITY RESEARCH STAFF
Document date: 1965-06-09 00:00:00
Document type: PAPER - TEXTUAL DOCUMENT

# DOCID-32400624

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Date: 02/15/05

JFK ASSASSINATION SYSTEM

IDENTIFICATION FORM

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AGENCY : CIA

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NUMBER: 104-10136-10401

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: JFK

AGENCY FILE NUMBER

80T01357A

DOCUMENT

INFORMATION

AGENCY ORIGINATOR : CIA

FROM

TO

: CHIEF, SECURITY RESEARCH STAFF

TITLE : MEMO: (CONVERSATION WITH 8 JUNE 1965, WASHINGTON, DC.)

DATE: 06/09/1965

PAGES

: 9

SUBJECTS : COMMUNIST

CIA

KING

DOCUMENT TYPE : PAPER

CLASSIFICATION: SECRET

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1B 3

CURRENT STATUS : RELEASED IN PART PUBLIC - RELEASED WITH DELETIONS

DATE OF LAST REVIEW : 07/26/93

COMMENTS : JFK51: F13: 1993.07.26.18:53:48:310390 : FILE

ORIGINAL IS NOT PREVIOUSLY SANITIZED DOCUMENT.

HOWEVER, 1993 RELEASE WITH DELETIONS STANDS.

ARRB

DECLARED NOT RELEVANT

Released under the John F. Kennedy

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1992 (44 USC 2107 Note). Case#:NW

55924 Date: 10-26-2021

[R] - ITEM IS RESTRICTED

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9 June 1965

MEMORANDUM FOR

Chief, Security Research Staff

SUBJECT

KENVEDY, Jay Richard

(Conversation with 8 June 1965,

Washington, D.C.)

1. On 8 June 1965, the writer met with Mr. Kennedy at the Hilton

Hotel, Washington, and had a long discussion with him beginning at approxi-

mately 1:15 and ending at 5 p.m. Mr. Kennedy's comments covered a wide

range of matters, but: basically they can be broken down into 3 main topics:

(a) His attitude towards the FBI;

(b) |

His thoughts concerning the writing of a series of books

with the protagonist. a CIA agent; and

(c) Comments on the Negro Civil Rights Movement, the various

personalities connected with it, and some of Mr. Kennedy's

opinions and theories regarding future events connected

with the Civil Rights Movement.

viviadated

Each of the above will be discussed separately.

Mr. Kennedy's attitude towards the FBI

2. Sometime back, Chief, SRS, decided that it would be advantageous

to have Mr. Kennedy give information, particularly regarding the Civil Rights

Movement, to agents of the FBI in New York City, particularly if this infor-

mation concerned domestic or local events and activities. Chief, SRS, felt

that it would be a faster means of communication than heretofore used where-

in Mr. Kennedy communicated with SRS officers who, in turn, passed the in-

formation to either the FBI or areas where it was useful.

3. Mr. Kennedy made it very clear that he did not wish to conmuni-

cate with FBI agents, that the Civil Rights Movement should be regarded as

an international situation because of the Communist directed infiltration

auer of thet

into the movement, and that he felt in some respects that he was being

"downgraded" by being used as

LiL Colice by the fat and tot in a higher echelon.

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of Government.

While Mr. Kennedy did not absolutely refuse to cooperate

with the Bureau, he made it obvious that only if there was a matter which

he felt was of interest directly to the Bureau locally, would he furnish

this type of information; otherwise, he would furnish it as he has done

previously or cease altogether. The writer attempted, more or less unsuc-

cessfully, to discuss jurisdiction with Mr. Kennedy, but Mr. Kennedy main-

tained his position that the matter was not one of jurisdiction for the FBI

or any single Government agency, but was one that the Government, including

CIA, should be interested in; namely, the international Communist efforts

at corrupting and seizing the Negro Civil Rights Movement.

vividelated

Mr. Kennedy's thoughts regarding a possible writing of a series of novels

limed at improving the picture of CIA and defending this Government's action

nd the activities of the CIA in support of the Government

4. During the long conversation,

Mr. Kennedy introduced this sub-

ject by saying that he was sick and tired of the poor public picture that

constantly being presented of the CIA by all sorts of writers, left.

wing and otherwise.

He stated that Government agents were generally painted

as fools and idiots, and that the Headquarters activities obvicusly were

some sort of super government who acted solely on their own and aten against

the interests of the United States.

He stated that he had read a number of

books such as

"The Invisible Government"

, and this type of reporting dis-

gusted him.. "He stated that he had in mind the writing of a series of novels,

using a CIA agent as hero, which would reflect decent, intelligent, and

courageous work on behalf of the United States.

He stated that the James

Bond books by Fleming averaged 190-200 pages, and he felt that he could.

write this type of a novel once or twice a year in addition to his serious

work as a novelist.

NOTE:

Mr. Kennedy's latest novel is about to be published, and he was in

Washington for the American Booksellers Association Convention.

5. Mr. Kennedy stated he was certain that he could handle this type

of writing since he had demonstrated his capacity as a writer, but that he

might require certain technical assistance, particularly in terms of trade-'

craft and certain fundamental matters of which he had little knowledge.

He

indicated that perhaps some support could be given him if it was agreed that

the idea of the novels had merit, and that support could take the shape of

area knowledge, tradecraft, terminology, and perhaps some operational

matters which were not sensitive or classified.

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uncelate

6. The writer indicated that the idea had merit and that possibly

he could be given some technical support on a covert basis.

The writer

wanted to know who would publish this, or did Mr. Kennedy have in mind

any

particular publisher who would publish this if Mr. Kennedy wrote it. Mr.

Kennedy stated that he was absolutely certain that his own publisher would

jump at the chance to publish this type of novel if he thought Mr. Kenredy

would write them, and Mr. Kennedy was quite willing to discuss the matter

with his publisher, quite possibly during the following evening. Mr. Kennedy

stated that he had given this matter considerable thought and because he

was incensed at the bad press the Agency and other Government institutions

were getting, he would be quite willing to undertake this task. He added

that he already had conceived three plots that he felt would be suitable in

this connection.

7. The writer, as mentioned above, encouraged Mr. Kennedy but stated

he could make no substantial. cormitment, but that he would like to discuss

these proposals with Chief, SRs and other associates.

8. On 9 June 1905; Mr. Kennedy, who was then leaving Washington,

called the writer and stated that he had talked this idea over with his

publishers and they are enthusiastic about the idea since he said he would

be willing to undertake it, and that, in turn, they would bring to bear all

of their capacity for distribution of literary works. Mr.. Kennedy stated

that his publisher is with the world Publishers, Inc., who are, in turn,

controlled by the Chandler interests of the west Coast. The writer again

thanked Mr. Kennedy and stated that the matter would immediately be discussed.

NOTE: It should be noted that Mr. Kennedy is a thoroughly experienced

writer with a number of books to his credit and is not given to idle con-

versation in matters such as this (see attached.).

Civil Rights Movement

9. For background information, it is to be recalled that Mr.

Kennedy has long provided information on the Negro Civil Rights Movement

and its various leaders.

Mr. Kennedy's position is one of complete sympathy

with the Negro and the Civil Rights Movement, but holds that only through

legal means and peaceful means should the Negro aims. be accomplished. Mr.

Kennedy, who is a violent anti-Communist, has been alarmed at the Communist

movement into the Negro Civil Rights field and the Communist penetration into

the various Negro organizations. He has undeniably done everything in his

lero sation he fiel

capacity to help the Negro leaders, particularly James FARMER Of CORE.

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It is worth noting for the record that Mr. Kennedy has been involved with

various Negro leaders since as early as 1934; and he has known a number of

the leaders, on a very close personal basis, since that time.

10. Mr. Kennedy's main concern has been that the highly derogatory

information, of which he is familiar, concerning Martin Luther KING, Jr.,

will be exposed to the public by the wrong people and at the wrong time

which, in Mr. Kennedy's opinion, will set the Civil Rights Movement back

vears and would perhaps give the Communists a chance io either further dis-

rupt it or to seize control of the movement.

11. To make certain that this report reflects as accurately as

possible the derogatory information on Martin Luther KING, Jr., here are

three main categories:

(a)

Highly derogatory information on sexual abnormalities and

sexual activities which have taken place within the United

States and overseas;

(b) A possible theft of money; and

(c) Association with identified Communist or pro-Soviet types

on an intense personal basis, particularly Harry BELAFONTE,

the Negro actor/singer.

To further set the background, it should be recalled that several months

ago a very serious dispute erupted between Mr. John Edgar HOOVER and Martin

Luther KING, Jr. At that: time James FARMER, head of CORE, received infor-

mation, from an absolutely reliable source, that the FBI had derogatory in-

formation on Martin Luther KING, Jr., that Mc. HOOVER was incensed on attacks

on his agents and the integrity of his organization, and that grave possi-

bilities existed that Mr. HOOVER would turn loose to the public the derog-

atory information which has been presented above. In turn, FARMER gave the

information, in confidence, to Mr. Kennedy and at approximately the same

time, FARMER confronted Martin Luther KING, Jr. with the facts. It is suf-

ficient to say that the matter was hushed up by KING visiting HOOVER.

A

number of meetings took place between the top Negro leaders and discussions

were held as to what to do about the derogatory information, since obviously

other individuals would know about it. To date, nothing has been done, and

the debate is going on in the top Negro channels at the present time.

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11. With this background in mind, the writer asked Mr. Kennedy who

were the top Negro leaders that he was in contact with and what were their

relationships one to another.

The writer named the following individuals,

and these were acknowledged by Mr. Kennedy as persons with whom he was

dealing:

Whitney YOUNG of the Urban League

Roy WILKINS of the NAACP

James FARMER Of CORE

A. Phillip RANDOLPH, veteran Negro union leader

Allan MORRISON, top Negro editor and journalist in the

United States:

The other leaders of first magnitude that entered the

discussion are Martin

Luther KING, Jr. and Harry BELAFONTE, who has been established clearly as

a close and intimate friend of Martin Luther KING, Jr. and whose left wing

background is also known.

Some of the lesser Negro leaders will be mentioned

later,

but those of the greater strength and opposed to KING are YOUNG,

WILKINS, FARMER, RANDOLPH, and MORRISON. Mr. Kennedy replied to the ques-

tion of rapport

among these leaders by saying flatly that there was ro rap-

port at all, that all mistrust and dislike the other, and in certain cases,

there was often antagonism. Mr. Kennedy stated that the brightest, shrewdest,

and cleverest of all was Roy WILKINS, but a man who had no popular or grass

roots following. He stated that Whitney YOUNG was a bright Negro, but who

had no following whatsoever in the popular sense, but was making a definite

play to gain power by seeking to be publicly connected with important

individuals both in the Government and out. Mr. Kennedy describea A. Phillip

RANDOLPH as a controversial old man, possibly becoming senile, who was afraid

to act for fear of damaging his own reputation and who liked to imagine

himself as the "Moses" of the Negro race.

ing, but he is aloof and has not committed himself as intensely as some of

the .others.

James FARMER, according to Kennedy, is probably the most sin-

cere and devoted of the leaders, but is naive and has a complete capacity

for saying the wrong thing at the wrong time. FARMER personally is clean

and he does,

in fact, have the grass roots support of the large organization

CORE, which he controls. Mr. Kennedy insisted that he is law abiding: non-

violent, and a decent individual, but not too politically intelligent.

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Mr. Kennedy stated that for weeks the problem of Martin Luther

aware of the details. Mr. Kennedy stated that to show the range of con-

example.

He said that a few days ago, he was in the office of Whitney

YOUNG to discuss with him this matter. Mr. Kennedy stated that

for the first 15 minutes or so, YOUNG was constantly being called

to the telephone and the conversation was interrupted: Mr.

Kennedy commented that the first two calls that came in were in-

consequential, but he stated that the third call was from the

President of the United States:

Mr. Kennedy stated that he

listened to two more calls then told YOUNG that either he would

have to quit accepting phone calls or Mr. Kennedy would no longer

discuss anything with him.

Whitney YOUNG then told his secretary

to stop the calls, and they discussed the matter. Mr. Kennedy

stated that the conversation was basically his attempting to

get Whitney YOUNG to come to some agreement with the other leaders

on the KING matter by pointing out that Roy WILKINS was in favor

"of "dumping" KING, and that he, Whitney YOUNG, hadn't committed

himself to anything.

was not profitable.

13. Of considerable importance. to Mr. Kennedy was the following.

He was having a conversation with Allan MORRISON, the Negro editor, and

MORRISON said to him that he had received confirmation, in exact detail, of

the derogatory KING story. Further, that the information had come from

Washington from a highly placed official in the Department of Justice, Mr.

also attached to the Department of Justice, who was working in Chicago and

who had given it directly to Allan MORRISON. MORRISON stated that he was

told that the Washington source had the entire KING file in his office in-

cluding photographs and tapes on Martin Luther KING, Jr. Mr.. Kennedy said

he asked MORRISON if he had done anything about this; and, according to

Mr. Kennedy, MORRISON told him that he called a meeting of the top editors

and officials of the Johnson publications (Ebony, etc.) of which he,

According to MORRISON, he told those present

the story. After some shocked silence, Mr. JOHNSON said to MORRISON and

those present, we cannot publish that; and Mr. Kennedy said that MORRISON

told Mr. JOHNSON, if we don't publish it, it is going to blow up underneath.

our

noses because it is certain to come out sooner or later.

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14. Mr. Kennedy stated that the details of the KING matter are

definitely known to the editors of the New York Times and the New York

Herald Tribune, but they will not break the story because they have been

asked not to.

Mr. Kennedy stated presumably by the President.

15•

The writer than referred to the Kennedy thesis that Martin Luther

KING,

Ir. is moving in a way that is indicative that he is being controlled

by the Peking line Communists, possibly or probably through BELAFONTE, from

whom there is some information that would indicate he is a Maoist. The

writer asked Mr. Kennedy what possible action would the Peking line Comnu-

nists take in the KING matter.

Mr. Kennedy replied by saying that it is

certain to him that the Communists, both the Moscow and the Peking types,

are aware of the Martin Luther KING, Jr. matter. Mr. Kennedy stated as far

as he could figure out, the Peking Communists would handle KING in one of

two ways:

(a) We will permit you to remain head of the Negro movement in

the United States and you may continue to rise in public ac-

claim. The other Negro leaders have no courage and they

will not expose you.

They are cowards and controlled by

the Capitalist leaders of the United States. You will, how-

ever, remember that we know what the story is and you will

do what you are tola. Or

(b) They, themselves, the Peking Communists, will expose KING

and in so doing they will end him, they will everlasting

discredit all the other Negro leaders, and they will then

be in a position to disrupt the Negro movement, cause chaos

and trouble, and possibly gain control of it.

pose KING, they will say to the Press and public media which

to the

If they ex-

they control to the Negro people, that you leaders have be-

trayed you, they knew this story of KING all along and were

cowardly. They obeyed instructions from their capitalist

leaders.

16.

Mr. Kennedy stated that he is absolutely convinced that the

Peking line Communists are moving ahead of the Moscow Communists, both in

the world area and in the domestic scene. He pointed out that BELAFONTE has

taken over the Student Non-Violent Coordinating Committee and that James

FORMAN, its National Executive Secretary, is going along with this. He

stated that there are other indications of the Peking line Communists show-

ing strength, and that there are a number of ways this can be demonstrated.

He called attention to the fact that for the last 3 or 4 weeks there has been

a period of inaction and that none of the Negro leaders, except James FARMER

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of CORE, have been doing anything when they should have been strongly

active.

Mr. Kennedy states that it is his opinion that this is due to the

movement being held in check by Peking line Communists who are demonstrating

and consolidating their strength.

nothing more than small ad hoc groups which the Peking line Communists have

set up as needed and are, in fact, riding on the back of CORE. Mr. Kennedy

stated that they are not CORE groups, but are activist Negro advocates of

violence and who are working to disrupt and smear CORE and its leadership.

They are constantly working to convert CORE from a non-violent group into an

action group which would, of course, put CORE in the Peking line.

17. The writer asked Mr. Kennedy if there was any indication that he

knew of that would show that the: Negro leaders--YOUNG, WILKINS, FARMER,

RANDOLPH or MORRISON--were going: to expose KING. Mr. Kennedy stated that

there is no such information, that none of them wanted to be responsible for.

the exposure, nor could they agree among themselves to do it as a group.

MORRISON, himself, according to Kennedy, would like to expose the situation,

but he could not do this alone and unsupported. Mr. Kennedy stated again,

as he had many times previously, that unless this exposure comes from the

Negro leaders themselves, the attacks on KING. will be useless and will end

up only making him perhaps a martyr and would set

back the Negro Civil Rights

Movement for years.

18.

Toward the end of the conversation, Mr. Kennedy pointed out that

any examination of the Civil Rights. Movement, at the present time, would show

a clear and concise picture of Communist penetration and activities, namely,

from the Peking line Communists. Mr.. Kennedy said it is well to note that

the war in Vietnam has now been linked to the Civil Rights Movement and,

gradually, the two unrelated areas are being blended together in an all out

Communist Party line attack on U.S. policy.

Mr. Kennedy stated that this has

spread confusion into the Negro Civil Rights Movement and has duped many of

the leaders of the movement and caused them to make utterances which are

stupid and certainly unpatriotic.

Mr. Kennedy referred to the activities and

statements of A. Phillip RANDOLPH in behalf of the "Refusal to Fight" move-

ment.

19.

Mr. Kennedy further said that the aims of the Communists were

clear in that they wanted to link the Negro leadership and the Negro mass

Civil Rights Movement into a position of anti-government action, and that

the Peking line would be away from the Moscow "peaceful coexistence line"

and would be continuous agitation for violent action and disruption. He

stated that so called leaders like Martin Iuther KING, Jr. and Harry BELA-

FONTE have very clearly started blending the Negro Civil Rights Movement into

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a merger with their attacks on the government policy in Vietnam and, even to

a lesser degree, into attacks on government policy in the Dominican Republic.

Mr. Kennedy predicted that more and more of this will appear as the surmer

goes along.

He stated that among the most important leaders of the movement,

he felt that only Allan MORRISON had a thorough understanding of the problem,

that FARMER in a vague way understood the problem, but was not acute enough

to clearly understand it and combat it.

He said WILKINS and Whitney YOUNG

probably understood this matter, but they are too busy attempting to create

a good image of themselves in the public eye to be willing to get down and

fight

this penetration in an all out manner.

20.

Mc. Kennedy stated that he would be continuously in touch with

either Chief, SRS or the writer as he obtained information of interest.

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