INTERVIEW.
Agency: CIA
Originator: FORGOVT
Document date: 04/26/1963
Document type: PAPER - TEXTUAL DOCUMENT

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104-10181-10236

Released under the John F. Kennedy Assassination

Records Collection Act of 1992

(44 USC 2107 Note)

NW 53216 6/27/17

MICROFILMED

OGIS

1970

DOC, MICRO. 8K7

JOTE FOR FILE

It is

LUCBOEILMED

¿ vised falifax on Sta March to Intersar 2A9R26962

arivod at Polfco_ huadquartors. at 4.30 p.m. e

no: SLOBODi mis eventually troduced at about 6 o'dach dinare

noantire I talked over tho case vith Dotoctive Constable-Thoapson,

tho 'Special Branch' of tho Enlifar Polico Force,

paporo in ordor to cofrooh my serory:

I invitod Dotective Coratable

Thorpson to be prosent during the intervion although in fact he took

no part in 1::

2.

XB. SIOSODa Ivas tho 'spression of being a rather quiet,

nervous and

not very irtelligan. north country mozar, ill-equipped

to grapple nith tho upheaval of tho past two years.

At the outset

I told her that I mas not a police officor but a reber of the War

office in London concerned nith security ratters and in this

connection there vere a ley questiona I mished to ask her.

she was under no obligation to enover any gicotions or indeed to be

intervierod at all, but should rico agree to iover sy questines then

she should bear in mind that the contents of our intervier mist not

Do discuosod with anyone else at any time.

Sho said that she mas

quite prepared to be intorviened although the did not think that she

had any information of value to us. I should mention here that st

the boginnirs she was obviously very nervous and reticent, then for

a period she seerad mich more cell-assurod, and tonaris the end of

the intervien, nhen

one or two ratter delicato ratters were raised

Bho bocane sorembat distressod, flushed and uncertain of hersolf.

Before recording what she had to say i feel bourd to nake the

reservation that I do.not boltavo she told to the whole truth and that

I do not consider that sho 1a quite so guileless as tho ingression

she gave mo at the sozirning of the intervio. led no to believe.

brief, she may not be very intelligent, but she has lots of native

cunning.

3.

Sho supplied the folloring ancers to the quectiong put by ne

on the basio of the questionnaise received from

as at 88a:-

KUbORK

A.

Under viat circustango wes she romanited to retum to

Enclara ?

Does the plan to return to the ü.S.S.2.?

Fier object in returning to this country fron tie U.S.S.R. in

March 1962 was to taxe a holiday vich,

cho said, sno folt she

badly needed.

It nas obvious faey what irs. S20E0DA had to

say that sho had found life ir. Ivor very difficult, largely

bocause of her lack o? Russian, ard to fact chai her husbara's

paronts vore living in the sure apartrert.

Artes discussing

the nattor nith hor husband sie first applied for = exit visa

in August 19ó1 and she admitted trat tho Pussian Erociligence

Ofricer rosponsible for her hussand's dusettlesent askod her

mora than once thy sho wished to leave her husbars in Russia and

roturn home to ingiand.

Dio recattlcaent offices isplorad her

husband to bring pressure to bear on her on tco grounds that cer

husband was now living ir. Pussie and that it was up to ber to

inucklo down and becore "acclin-tised" and stay by ais sido

rathor than to return to tiej..

Howeves, in tio ond to:

porcistence nor the day and aftor copositing har rassport 1e:

tho authorities in Ivor Bac-raceived it back again in haru :952

with an oxit visa stamped trureir.. Shu mished to tato to: uriy

hor sall daughter but alvo der second con with her and or

arrival in l'oscor fron Lvov by icroflot abo visited the sritish

Eribaosy to discuss the status of tha son in question, Victor

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104-10181-10236

Zaria, som in 1956 1r the ü.S.d.

Ee: Lusbard accompariod be= to descow and mado the

arrangelento sea ber duparturo:

sio did not cention any

coattro mita dry los. offlalace in Icaoor.

Sorore leaving luer she mas anesorted mith 50 roubles by

the settiesent officer mits uhich to buy a grocent sor tes

nother in tha üok. and she ras aávised to contact the Soviet

SEbassy in Lordos regarding amargarents for ber roturn trio

to Missia at the conclusion of der boiday;

bor passport mas

valicated for ninety days.

is: SLObOd, when intoriered

on iges carch, said that sie, is no: dosirous of returniro to

the ü.s.s.3.

Sho indicated that nilist in this countar ste had

tairen stoot of ter position aid felt duty bourd to retum to

hor children.

She considered i: unlincly that too Russiars

mould be prepared to allon all thrse children to leavo. tho

U.S.S.?. and thus she felt trat tio only alterrative was for

her to satum thero. In this corruction sho had recently

roceived a talegram fron her, susuard saving that he mas

plarrirs to dospatch the eldost caild, David, vom in the U.t.

in 1953, to Falifax, but she had sent a telegran in reply

tellirs de= cusbard to abandon this plan as she herself aroposed

to retars to fussia in tha near future.

ürs. SECSODA was

questioned about her notives sus sonding this télegram, seeing

that bes busband appeared to have ado a decision to return

the British born son to this country and bearing in rind that

Mrs. SICSOA herself had inüicated ber sispleasure at the fact

that tàis sticular son (abo nas at boarding school and tho

now spate aluent Russian) gavo evazy abpcaranco of croniro aray

¿ron the daily and becosing a Yourg Courunist.

Sze averred

that sia vas still vory much in love with hor busbira.

did not seen to envisagolary difficulty in obtairing the

assista-se or the Soviet Consulata in jondon to retum to the

U.S.S.Ro, and she expects the Cossulato to provide her with

the recessary passages when recuested to do so;

sho added that

she hai recaived an assuranco ascut the availabili: of free

passages ¿ca 'anton'.

3.

Eas ahe souruited in Soviet Blee Intellirence ? El so,

CERBER JOY: Leaces of

com uneazior did she recoita ?

Lins. SIOSODA donied taat sia was approached by sovie:

Intelligence at my stage or tos stay in tho U.S.5.a., lus

alone recruited by then.

en. der arrival in treü.s.s.R. t

leningrad she was rot by: ber busband who intrcauced nor to ice

?.I.S. insettierent officer rafered to above.

This Official

arranged forder to stay a ron dais beforo maicing irangements

for her ¿curney to Lvov.

Pine naza or this resosticuont officer

nas diver bu las. SIOBODA as "daton! and suo said ches ho is

betreen 45 and 50 joars of 1ão.

She said trat all tie

Const ate a toront to card too escort anat

lotter ana bor Husband ir Russia.

The soviez Consul binsois

candled der sifairs in a countecus and kind cares.

the duacians

raid all has ergonsas for the trip and in addition chippoi:=

She maintained that ca arrival it leningrad in. was

subjected to no security intercation or intervin procoduces

by the sariet authorities and that tea only person corrested with

Sorio: Intelligence sion dio set during hor stay in to l.s.s.a.

uas too Arion refarrod to above.

Furthercoro, sho cairtaired

that the R.I.S. had attaccos no conditions (involving intelligorco

activities in tale country) to tice granting or persission to

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€ 8.79

- 3 -

C.

Ec:one Stezona defected, did lie noseal Els antentions ic anyone ?

contacts

sator to durection rho azy havo influercod ca aired big

corection ?

2'r3. SLOBODA maintained that at no otago prics to his

dofoction did her husband givo hor the slightest litt or

indication o1 sio plane to dofoot.

On tho day in question te ment

off to work drossed in civilian olothes in the norai ray and quite

simply, did not come back at the nornal hour.

Istasikorever,

he telephonod fron Enst Berlin to infor hto mifa *ast ho would

not be hone that night but mould oee her again soch and that in

no circuinstances vas she to worry.

A day or so prior to those

events SLOSODA had received his army pay and had harded over the

usual arount e houserooping to his nifo.

A day or ao after

receiving the tolephone call lirs. SLOBODA received a postcard

saying in effect. "don't worry, I will vrite again soon, ard

ohe necrod to thirl: that the postcard bore a Berlin postuark.

She said his car nas found abanderod noar Colome.

N'5s.

SIOODA said she know nothing Lout her husband having had ary

contact with any Russiano in Cerary. at any time prior to his

dofection.

Sce indicatod that she had boen close questioned

about this matter by the Anerican authoritios in Farfurt

whon her husband's defection had boon reported to sec.

She

said that her husbard rorked as a "plain clothes" zar. in the

U.S. Arry Lilitary Intelligonce group based in Frariurt.

never sougit to discuss his work with her but ho seesed to

enjoy it and it used to involve a cortain amount ca travelling:

L'rs. SLOBODA said that whilot relations betwoen be= end her

husband vere normal as at tho tire of his dosection, bare bad

been a number of dicputes over ncnoy.

It cecmod trat SLOBODA,

contrary to arny regulations, had taken to visiting sight clubs

and cabarets in Frankfurt and also to gambling.

dil this had

led hin to incurring substantial dobts and in this ccrrection

L'T3. SLOBODA said that at the timo her husband was in dobt to

the extent of $4,000, a fact which he feered would i tiro

reach the ears of the military authorition and resuit in him

being court mártiallod.

Urs. SLOBODA hintod that sio had had

nore than her share of financial vorries whilst they were living

in Gormary.

Sho said that lifo as a soldico's wife in the

U.S.d. had been extrerely ploasert and that both her busband

and

horsolf had more than once cursed the day when they had been

ported to Gorany.

Urs. SLOBODA said that she did not know why

her husband decided to defect but agreed that bis stata of

indobteanoss had been playing on his mind for sone ti=o..

(Ircidentally Lichael SLOBODh, brother of Vladimir, siated in

October 1960 that he know his brothar to be heavily i debt

duo to sarbling and that on ono occasion Vladinir SISaUDA had

renarised cryptically:

"I don't mant to 80, but I rus:".)

lirs. SLOBODA indicated that her husbard bad beon out ca

gambling excursions for many monthe prior to hio actusi defection.

D.

Details of her travel arranrements innediately aror to her

donanture from En-land For ü.S.Jo3o, ard details c: per trio

from Enflarc to ultinato destination in U.S.S.2.

See (A) above.

E.

that Sordet Bloc Intelligence and propagards emicitation ca

SLOBEDA ard iro. SICSODA mere made ?

mature nd eatont. of incoration did they dialed

How many

ard in what tie of pronazanda process vera thes Harolrea

ard shat vess their theos ?

Urs. SLOBODA said that during her tine in the U.S.S.R. her

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WET

é irono.

fandly roso troubies ly propaganda mortora ca eno occasion only.

à Sovlot journalis: scught to intervice her to sird cut ron Bio

foit about livirg in iso U.S.S.Ro; in fact iso reportor 1a9

handled bi hor bustand.

F.

Mit notiods it indoctrination in thn Co:

0 520 825

in ü.S.S.ả. ?

Nono.

G.

mat 1a her oriaten of SIOSODA's 270sont S

Comnish ?

TimE in SLOSeDA's aresent

tude tomarde

attitude

tomares thie

ian:ca Statos ?

"IS. SlOBODA said that her husbard did not discuss political

mattors with her but that he appoared to lika bio job as a

tranglator/librarian at tho Polytechnic Instituto in Lvov.

Additionally he agaruciatod living in close proxisity to his om

father and mother..

The authoritios had provided a tiree-rooned

flat and SLOSOD!'s incone was in ercess of 300 roubles a nonth

which was quite good by local standards.

The oldest boy

aztended a boarding school and he now ooko fuent Russian and

corrospondirgly, little English.

In short, SiOSODA seenod

quite content with his present lot but tirs. SICSOJA caid she

did not know what bes husband thought about tle United States.

She roceatedly asserted that her husband had iot only been

reticent about his plans to doroct,

but rofrairod fron discuosing

any of hio experiencos in Soviot hards prior to ior arrival at

Loningrad.

¡irs. SLOBODA did not soem

to

think that such

reticence no. betrean ran and wife was at all wiusual !

Ihat is SLOnGs soing son to include emnicant, political

activities, names and descrintions of norsons with whor he 1s

in contact

Soo (G) abova.

(701-234212)

I.

Is or unspolcazà cormected of nasculatod en

tor var with

Did

LIPSKI liew about stra

ush'e deication

Lians i

::1-1:34.312

At first lirs. SEOSODA achiod all triolodgo of Tadeuse LIPSKI

but later said die trcught that no must have beor the person

responsible for erscuraging her husband to consider joining the

Mrs. S10502A recalls tint LIPSI called on tag in

2r3. SiCSoDa suid cho

thought LiPSiT mes baairian who had been mich nor busbans

in thc l'.K. as

a D.?. aitor the was.

LIPSKI continued te ceo

the SLOboDà family iron tico to tigo in Gormary but was stationed

in Bezlin and not Failut.

She did not see 2775:J after ter

husbard's derectior.

Sio is theodore unablo to say whotier or

not LIPsit inow aything about her husband's plats in

connection.

co..

J.

Whore are the SuChoDd chilaren iu U.S.SoR.? What school

are they attordena ?

he they boink diven ab: time ci

rolitical incestsination ?

Two of the Sicacat children are at precont with thoir ¿ather

in Lvor.

Tho clies: goes to the International boarding scaool

in Lvor whilst the secord son (torn in Aeorica) attends day

school.

The thirs child was too young attend echool in Russia and

io non in augland rita hor cotter.

SUmi

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vou

5

Tant

Men dog che bare ca ca

sioboed oald that cho travallod from loacor to London

with clo vito od in incrican citisen but sho cladaca to lo asle

to recall the nine of tula pocoa, oven thou, a at the timo dio

did arroo to mrito to tho neman

concorned ard took dotails of

hor addacos in fmerica.

This morar al00 crao irca Lvov.

Sho had to walt boven menths for a cult vida and did not propose

to roturn to the U.s.s.r.

Yor husbard mas an electrical

ergineer uni possibly cá celgro stock.

understood to mag a l.s. citizon in nuch tao Baso boat.ao hor

Lo How mus cramunication established with her husband bofore

In tho first plaço hor husbard proto to hor fros tho u.s.s.R.

and sho had coperienced no difficulty in serding letters from

Ivor to her fanily in the U.k. or indeed subsoquently recolving

lottors fron her bustard, ovon tough ico mail ras sootines

subject to dolays which might imply that censorship rag taiding

Has she contacted any U.s. miletner nomone? sinco leavirg

thoü.S.5.20? Becuest full dotails of artionative.

Sho has nado no contact rith any U.S. military personrol

since leaving the C.S.S.R.. Fer last contact with tho

American Mllitary was in Gerany in 1960 and she rocallod in

particular the nary iranosses sho thon received at the lands

oi the V.S. Rod Creau who woro of groat assistance to ber in

hor hour of noed, and libo in particular raisod surficient furds

to clear all outstanding SLOBODA canily liabilitios in Gerrany.

4. CCECLUSTOH

On the basis of by intorvion tien tato bestart, which lasted

upwards of two hours, I fowid it impossible to rake un my mind abcat

kro. SEOPODA.

Sho is aifzicult to tali: to ind the concitions urder

which no not in Halifar nolico Station tore y no nears ideal.

1t 10 possible that ohe has withheld information which aigat incriminata

hor as an

ascossory boforo the fact of her hustand's defaction I cano

cross nothing in my intorvie: mith bor to suggost that she mir beet

recruited by the R.I.S. or that her huskand was at all forthcoming with

hor when they vere reunited in the Soviet Union as to the roasona

and the rechod or defection.

Ten it nao cussestea to ber that it minit bo tourd desirablo

to see her again, and that it rigat to zore convendont ice such en

intervie to to corducted in London, ber reaction was memeccoaly

sharp and adverse.

With a flushed taco, sho said that sho dii not see

way, and indicated bor nursed reluoterce to take part in such i.

exercise zithout, howevor, being sole to adduco ary particulary soo

reason for being so reluctant.

She also seezed to be taiion abaci: wren

sho was asked that sho would bo savine to tho Russians soculd ther

question her on her return to the U.S.s.a. about possiblo apprcacaos

fror U.%. or U.S. irtelligenco agencies.

Tho question recrod to taise

her completely by surprise as though such a possibility had not occurred

to her up to tiat corent.

Eventually she mumbied tuat sho did not

She was therofora briofed to deny having had any such cortacts,

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and to linit terself to statozonts that of course she had been

intorriered in tho normal lay by cha local polico, as reli an by

the Press.

Sho was asiad to siriso us - throuch the Falifar Police -

if she did decido to proceid rita

bas plan to 60 back to Pussia, and

sho reluctantly agroes to do so.

Sazoro sho loft, I offered her

5/- to noet tho taxi fare to bor tee, and this she gladly acceptod.

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