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Date: 09/20/94

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JFK ASSASSINATION SYSTEM

IDENTIFICATION FORM

AGENCY INFORMATION

AGENCY : HPSCI

RECORD NUMBER: 135-10001-10283

RECORDS SERIES :

CIA HAS NO OBJECTION TO

DECLASSIFICATION AND/OR

RELEASE Of CIA INFORMATION

N THIS DOCUMENT

8/20/98

AGENCY FILE NUMBER :

ORIGINATOR : CIA

FROM : MURPHY, DAVID E.

TO : RECORD

TITLE :

DOCUMENT INFORMATION

CIA HAS NO OBJECTION TO:

DECLASSIFICATION AND/OR

RELEASE OF CIA INFORMATION

IN THIS DOCUMENT AS SANITIZED

kp1zapr99

DATE : 03/12/64

PAGES

:

SUBJECTS :

MEMORANDUM FOR RECORD: "MEETING WITH THE WARREN COMMISSION ON 12

MARCH 1964." (WITH ROUTING SHEET ATTACHED)

DOCUMENT TYPE : PAPER, TEXTUAL DOCUMENT

CLASSIFICATION : S

RESTRICTIONS : OPEN IN FULL

CURRENT STATUS : 0

DATE OF LAST REVIEW : 09/19/94

OPENING CRITERIA :

COMMENTS :

Contained in file entitled, "Hoch/Warren Commission Paper"

"O/R (V-F) "

2025 Release under the President John F. Kennedy

Assassination Records Collection Act of 1992.

[R]

- ITEM IS RESTRICTED

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COUTING AND RECORD SHESE

SUBJECT: ¡Optional)

FROM:

Chief, SR

1O: (OFicer designation, room number, and

wilding)

1.

DDP

2.

3.

ExTENSiGHi

SEAT

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RECEIVED

DATE

FORWARDEO

OFFICER'S

INITIALS

GSR

тю.

DATE

18 March 1964

COMMENTS (Numor each commens lo show trom vinom

to whom. Dran a line across coiumn äfter each comment.)

72

Attached

is the memorandum

for recorá of our discus-

sions with

the warren

Connission Staff.

The

nenorandu was reviered in

draft by ilI. Rocca.

DEM

5.

7.

3.

154

Well time-

Thank you

).

!.

610 USE PESHOUS

EDITIONS

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SECRET

CONFIDENTIAL

CIA HAS NO OBJECTION TO

DECLASSIFICATION AND/OR

RELEASE OF THIS DOCUMENT

AS SANITIZED eCc

128563)

(6 pages (812-94)

INTERYAL

USE ONLY

UNCLASSIFIED

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ling iles

12 March 1964

MEMORANDUM FOR THE RECORD

SUBJECT: Meeting with the Warren Commission on 12 March 1964

1. On 12 March 1964, Mr. Helms, Mr. Murphy and Mr. Rocca

met with Mr. Rankin, Chief Counsel for the Warren Commission, Mr.

Willems, and other memkers of iir. Rankin's staff. The purpose of

this meeting was to discuss the current status of the CIA contribution

to the work of the Warren Commission.

2. The first topic raised by Mr. Rankin concerned information

on Lee Harvey Oswald's stay in the Soviet Union as reported by the FBI,

based on their interview of the defector,

• This

discussion is reported in a separate memorandum.

3. After disposing of the question of

information on

Oswald, Mr. Rankin's staff showed us a detailed memorandum they had

prepared based on all of the information available to them, including

our own contribution concerning Oswald's stay in the USSR. This ma-

terial, together with some questions specifically related to the material

we provided, will be forwarded to us by Mr. Rankin's staff. It was then

suggested that a ClA officer most familiar with the material provided

by CIA on the USSR aspects of the Oswald case visit the Commission in

order to review on the spot the testimony given to the Commission by

Marina Oswald. We agreed to send the appropriate officer to review

this testimony but suggested that we wait until aîter receipt of the ma-

terial just shown to us.

4. Members of Mr. Rankin's staff then spoke about having found

a book in Oswald's possessions wich had certain leiters cut out giving

the impression that this mignt have formed the base or key for a cipher

system. They asked whether it would be useful in our opinion to send

this book to NSA for review. We assured them that NSA was the appro-

priate Agency for this and Mr. Rocca commented that when this was

done reference might also be made to the portion of Lee Oswald's notes

which mentioned microdot. Another member of the Rankin staff

NIV

CIA HAS NO OBJECTION TO

DECLASSIFICATION AND/OR

RELEASE OF THIS DOCUMENT •

AS SANITIZED:

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commented on the fact that Oswald had obtained employment in this

country in a photographic firm through a Russian friend. He thought

this might have a possible bearing on any clandestine communications

systems he might have received from the Soviets.

5. Members of Mr. Rankin's staff then commented on the testi-

mony of Mrs. Oswald to the effect that the letters from her son regard-

ing his desire to return to the United States had the appearance of being

dictated since they contained none of his usual grammatical errors and

used legal language with which he would not have been familiar. In this

connection, the fact that Lee Oswald wrote to the Embassy requesting

help in arranging his return to the U.S. soon after receipt by the Embassy

of a telegram from the Department reporting on correspondence with

Oswald's mother seemed to incicate to members. of Mr. Rankin's staff

that the Soviets might have had access in some fashion to the contents

of the telegram.. They did not believe it was coincidental that Oswald's

letter to the Embassy came immediately on the heels of the telegram

from the Department. This led to a discussion of the appearance in the

press of another telegram or report, from the Embassy in Moscow to

the Department. Mr. Rankin said he

would undertake to clarify this.

6. Mr. Willems noted that Mrs. Oswald had introduced a state-

ment to the effect that she suspected her son to be a ClA agent. Mr.

Willems asked whether in fact Oswald had been a ClA agent. Mr. Helms

replied that he had not been.

Mr. Willems then asked if there were any,

way of proving this. Mr. Helms first remarked that in him and Mr.

Murphy the Commission had the two Clandestine Services officers who

certainly would know whetner or noi Oswald had been an agent for CLA

in the Soviet Union. He then said that the Commission would have to

take his word for the fact that Oswald had not been an agent. Mr. Rankin

interjected the view that the Commission had not adopted this procedure

with other agencies and wondered whether there was not some way to

clarify this point more effectively for the Commission. One suggestion

he made was to have Mr. Dulles, who is familiar with CIA records

procedures, review the material which would normally be held on agents

and report to the Commission. Another suggestion was to follow the

lead of the Director of the FBI who forwarded an affidavit to the Com-.

mission regarding the nature of FBI relations with Oswald.

7. A considerable part of the meeting from this point forward

consisted of a review by Mr. Rankin and his staff of the gaps in their

investigation to date. They noted that the most significant gap appeared

in the Mexican phase. For example, they had no record of Oswald's

—thi

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daily movements while in ivexico City nor could they confirm the date

of his departure or his mode of travel. The original assumption that

he had returned by bus could not be proven. Several possibilities were

discussed whereby the Commission could fill in the gaps of its investi-

gation of the Mexican phase. The suggestion was made that the most

effective way of resolving the questions they had would be to have a

member of the Commission visit Mexico City and discuss the issues on

the spot with those American and Mexican officials directly concerned.

Mr. Helms noted that it would be possible for a member of the Com-

mission to visit our Chief of Station who would then be able to work out

with the Warren Commission stait member the best way to handle inter-

views with Mexican police officials, particularly if it is desired that

these interviews be informal in nature. Our Chief of Station would also

be able to put the Warren Commission staff member in contact with the

FBI officials and Immigration and Naturalization Service officers stationed

in Mexico City. Mr. Helms cautioned that our Chief of Station Gould be 32

under State Department cover and that it would be proper to advise the

Department of the planned visit and upon arrival to meet briefly with the

Ambassador or Minister Counselor before proceeding to work out details

with the CIA Chief of Station.

8. In connection with the Mexican phase of the investigation, mem-

bers of Mr. Rankin's staff questioned Mr. Helms and Mr. Rocca regarding

the extent of the CIA file on Oswald for the period 8 October to 22 November

1963. They questioned the sanitized extracts which they had been shown

and wondered if there were not more. Mr. Rocca summarized the ma-

terials that had come to the attention of the Secret Service, or had been

disseminated to the Secret Service, immediately after the assassination.

Mr. Rocca said there was not additional substantive information and that

the sanitized version seen by the Commission constituted the sum of our

holdings. Mr. Helms then explained that as a matter of practice we did

not release actual copies of our messages because they contained code-

words and digraphs which would be unintelligible to a person not familiar

with them. He added, however, that he would be happy to show the file

with the original messages to any staff member of the warren Commission

who might come to visit him at Langley.

9. The question of why no action was taken by other agencies of

the government after their receipt of CIA information that Oswald was

in contact with the Soviet and Cuban Embassies in Mexico City was next

discussed. Mr. Rankin and members of his staff clearly felt that this

was a crucial question which needed careful review. They appeared to

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believe that the information on Oswald was unusual enough to have

caused recipients to take special measures which might conceivably

have led to a closer scrutiny of Lee Harvey Oswald and his movements.

Mr. Helms pointed out that the information on Oswald's visit to the

Cuban and Soviet embassies in Mexico City came from telephone inter-

cepts which were placed on both embassies. These intercepts were

recorded on tape and reviewed by persons at our Station for any infor-

mation affecting U. S. security.

Such information is routinely passed

to other agencies and entered in CIA files. Given the enormous bulk

which is involved, the tapes are not kept on file but erased after a brief

period of time. Thus the information on Oswald was similar to that

provided on other American citizens who might have made contacts of

this type. In Oswald's case, it was the combination of visits to both

Cuban and Soviet Embassies which caused the Mexico City Station to

report this to Headquarters and Oswald's record of defection to the

Soviet Union which prompted the Headquarters dissemination. At the

conclusion of his remarks on this subject, Mir. Helms specified that

the information he had given Mr. Rankin was extremely sensitive and

that the very existence of these telephone intercepis had to be very

carefully protected.

10. The Commission, Mr. Rankin said, would be interested in

any information held by CIA on Jack Ruby. Mr. Rankin said the Com-

mission staff had prepared a roundup on Ruby, a copy of which he handed

Mr. Helms. He said he would appreciate any

file reflections or comments

that CIA analysts might make on this material. Vir. Rankin and members.

of his staff then discussed Ruby's confirmed trip to Havana in 1959. The

Commission has received information from an unspecified source that

Ruby was in Havana again in 1963 under a Czech passport. Mr. Rankin

asked whether CIA could provide any assistance in verifying this story.

Mr. Helms replied that CIA would be limited in its possibility of assist-

ing, to air manifest checks in Mexico. These would be carried out he

said.

11. Mr. Helms was then asked if CLA had done any follow up to

its original telegraphic dissemination of the information on Oswald's

visits to the Cuban and Soviet embassies in Mexico City. Mr. Helms

replied that there had been no CIA action following our initial dissemi-

nation. Mr. Willems then asked if there were any liaison problems

faced by CIA in its efforts to deal with other agencies in matters affect-

ing internal security. Mr. Helms replied that there were always under-

standable human problems in conducting any liaison on any subject but

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that by and large the procedures for dealing with internal security and

counterespionage information which needed to be brought to the attention

of other agencies were effective.

12. Mr. Willems then asked if CIA's. intelligence collection system

was automated. Mr. Helms replied that we did in fact have a machine

records system for recovering file information wnich was unique in that

it had been designed specifically with the requirements of the CIA Clandes-

tine Services in mind. Thus, any information reposing in our files could

be recovered by means of this machine system rapidly and efficiently. Mr.

Helms invited Mr. Rankin and members of his staff to visit the Langley

Headquarters and inspect the machine records system which he had des-

cribed.

13. In speaking of the broader question of protection for the Pres-

ident, Mr. Rankin asked about our procedures for working with the Secret

Service when the President travels abroad. Mr. Helms described how

the system works and cited examples from the past to illustrate. He com-

mented on some of the South American trips and on the visit to West Berlin

to show the way in which the effectiveness and competence of the local

police force plays a key role in efforts to insure the President's safety.

14. Mr. Willems asked if we could check on a memorandum sent

to Mr. Karamessines on 12 February regarding one of the pictures identi-

fied by Mrs. Oswald as that of Jack Ruby. These pictures were from

clandestine photographic coverage of the Soviet Embassy in Mexico City :.

which was provided by the FBI and then cropped to make a display to show

to Mrs. Oswald soon after the President's assassination. The Commission

has not been able to determine which of these pictures was shown Mrs.

Oswald. Mr. Rocca will follow up on this.

DavidE. Murphy

Chief, SR Division

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