Historic Preservation Commission — Naperville, IL
Date: 2022-01-27

400 S. Eagle Street
 City of Naperville Naperville, IL 60540



 Meeting Agenda

 Historic Preservation Commission

Thursday, January 27, 2022 7:00 PM Council Chambers



TO PROVIDE LIVE PUBLIC COMMENT, TESTIMONY, OR TO CROSS-EXAMINE WITNESSES
DURING THE MEETING: To address the Historic Preservation Commission (HPC) in-person
during the meeting in City Council Chambers, members of the public must sign up in-person on
the day of the meeting outside of City Council Chambers between 6:30 and 6:50 p.m.
TO SUBMIT WRITTEN COMMENTS OR MATERIALS:
1. You may submit written comments to planning@naperville.il.us in advance of the meeting.
(Please note, because emailed written comments are available for advance review by the HPC,
they will not be read into the record during the HPC hearing). Below are the deadlines for written
comments provided in advance of the meeting:
• Written comments received by 5:00 p.m. on January 20, 2022 will be included in the meeting
packet sent to the HPC. This meeting packet is also posted on the City’s website.
• Written comments received after 5:00 p.m. on January 20, 2022 through 5:00 p.m. on January
26, 2022 will be emailed directly to the HPC, but will not be included in the HPC packet or posted
online.
• Written comments received after 5:00 p.m. on January 26, 2022 will be added to the case file.
PUBLIC ACCOMMODATION:
Any individual who may require an accommodation to listen to or participate in the meeting
should contact the Community Services Department at (630) 305-5300 as soon as possible, but
no later than by 5 p.m. on the day of the meeting.

PARTICIPATION GUIDELINES:
The citizen participation guidelines are outlined in 1-5-6-6: - CITIZEN PARTICIPATION of the
Naperville Municipal Code.
• ALL VIEWPOINTS AND OPINIONS WELCOME: All viewpoints are welcome, positive
comments and constructive criticism are encouraged. Speakers must refrain from harassing or
directing threats or personal attacks at Commission members, staff, other speakers or members
of the public. Comments made to intentionally disrupt the meeting may be managed as
necessary to maintain appropriate decorum and allow for city business to be accomplished.
• IF YOU SIGNED UP TO SPEAK, the HPC will call your name at the appropriate time during the
Historic Preservation Commission meeting. Once your name is called you may identify yourself
for the public record. Once you have been sworn in, then you may address remarks to the
Historic Preservation Commission as a whole. Speak clearly and try to limit remarks directly to
the matter under discussion. Speakers are called in the order they sign up.

A. CALL TO ORDER:

B. ROLL CALL:

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Historic Preservation Commission Meeting Agenda January 27, 2022



C. PUBLIC FORUM:

D. OLD BUSINESS:

E. CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS
1. 22-0089 Conduct the public hearing to consider a request to designate the property
 located at 34 South Washington Street (Kroehler YMCA) as a landmark in
 accordance with Section 6-11-3 (Designation of Landmarks) of the
 Naperville Municipal Code - HPC 21-4482

F. REPORTS
1. 22-0021 Approve the minutes of the July 22, 2021, Historic Preservation
 Commission meeting

G. NEW BUSINESS:

H. ADJOURNMENT:




City of Naperville Page 2 Printed on 1/21/2022

400 S. Eagle Street
 City of Naperville Naperville, IL 60540



 Meeting Minutes

 Historic Preservation Commission


Thursday, January 27, 2022 7:00 PM Council Chambers


TO PROVIDE LIVE PUBLIC COMMENT, TESTIMONY, OR TO CROSS-EXAMINE WITNESSES
DURING THE MEETING: To address the Historic Preservation Commission (HPC) in-person
during the meeting in City Council Chambers, members of the public must sign up in-person on
the day of the meeting outside of City Council Chambers between 6:30 and 6:50 p.m.
TO SUBMIT WRITTEN COMMENTS OR MATERIALS:
1. You may submit written comments to planning@naperville.il.us in advance of the meeting.
(Please note, because emailed written comments are available for advance review by the HPC,
they will not be read into the record during the HPC hearing). Below are the deadlines for written
comments provided in advance of the meeting:
• Written comments received by 5:00 p.m. on January 20, 2022 will be included in the meeting
packet sent to the HPC. This meeting packet is also posted on the City’s website.
• Written comments received after 5:00 p.m. on January 20, 2022 through 5:00 p.m. on January
26, 2022 will be emailed directly to the HPC, but will not be included in the HPC packet or posted
online.
• Written comments received after 5:00 p.m. on January 26, 2022 will be added to the case file.
PUBLIC ACCOMMODATION:
Any individual who may require an accommodation to listen to or participate in the meeting
should contact the Community Services Department at (630) 305-5300 as soon as possible, but
no later than by 5 p.m. on the day of the meeting.

PARTICIPATION GUIDELINES:
The citizen participation guidelines are outlined in 1-5-6-6: - CITIZEN PARTICIPATION of the
Naperville Municipal Code.
• ALL VIEWPOINTS AND OPINIONS WELCOME: All viewpoints are welcome, positive
comments and constructive criticism are encouraged. Speakers must refrain from harassing or
directing threats or personal attacks at Commission members, staff, other speakers or members
of the public. Comments made to intentionally disrupt the meeting may be managed as
necessary to maintain appropriate decorum and allow for city business to be accomplished.
• IF YOU SIGNED UP TO SPEAK, the HPC will call your name at the appropriate time during the
Historic Preservation Commission meeting. Once your name is called you may identify yourself
for the public record. Once you have been sworn in, then you may address remarks to the
Historic Preservation Commission as a whole. Speak clearly and try to limit remarks directly to
the matter under discussion. Speakers are called in the order they sign up.

A. CALL TO ORDER:

B. ROLL CALL:

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Historic Preservation Commission Meeting Minutes January 27, 2022

 Present: Franczyk, Garrison, Chairman Jacks, Kelly (non-voting), Sack (non-voting),
 Urda, and Wills
 Absent: Fawell, Fessler, and Ory


 A motion was made by Commissioner Urda and seconded by Commissioner
 Garrison to allow Councilman Kelly to attend the meeting by electronic means
 due to personal illness as allowed under the Illinois Open Meetings Act and
 Section 2-1-9 of the Naperville City Code.
 Aye: Franczyk, Garrison, Chairman Jacks, Urda, and Wills
 Nayes: None

C. PUBLIC FORUM:

 Dorris Wood spoke in opposition to the proposed Landmark
 Designation request during public forum.


D. OLD BUSINESS:

E. CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS

1. Conduct the public hearing to consider a request to designate the property located at 34
 South Washington Street (Kroehler YMCA) as a landmark in accordance with Section
 6-11-3 (Designation of Landmarks) of the Naperville Municipal Code - HPC 21-4482
 Becky Simon, Jane Burke and Joe McElroy presented as the
 Applicant and representatives of Naperville Preservation, Inc. They
 presented on topics including why the subject property should be a
 local landmark, the history, architects, landmark criteria, prior local
 cases of adaptive reuse, prior publications on the subject property,
 and other adaptive reuse YMCAs.


 Commissioner Urda asked why criterion 2.2.2 (That it has a direct
 connection to an important event in national, State or local history)
 was not included.


 Becky Simon responded that this was an error.


 Allison Laff, Deputy Director of TED Business Group, asked why
 criterion 2.2.4 (That it represents the notable work of a builder,
 designer or architect whose individual work has substantially
 influenced the development of the community) was excluded from
 the presentation.


 Becky Simon said excluding this criterion was also an error.


 Scott Day, attorney at Day & Robert, PC representing the Property
 Owner, requested that six new exhibits be entered into the record.


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Historic Preservation Commission Meeting Minutes January 27, 2022

 Day also asked Becky Simon if Exhibit 1 was sent from her through
 Naperville Preservation, Inc.


 Becky Simon responded that it was Naperville Preservation. Inc.’s
 letter.


 Scott Day asked the Applicant if any of the other Naperville
 examples shown were forcibly landmarked and if any of the YMCA
 adaptive reuse properties.


 Jane Burke responded that Old Main and Old City Hall were too old
 to be landmarked at the time of reuse and that Old Nichol’s Library
 was not landmarked by the owner.


 Becky Simon responded that they did not know of any of the YMCA
 adaptive reuse examples that were forcibly landmarked.


 Commissioner Urda asked if Scott Day knew of any forcibly
 landmarked YMCAs.


 Scott Day responded that he did not know and that he was
 concerned with the economics of adaptive reuse. Day also noted
 that the Commission can still recommend denial if the criteria are
 met.


 Allison Laff noted Section 6-11-3 describes procedures for owners
 that are not the applicants.


 Scott Day, Day & Robert, P.C., Basil Fitzsimons, Vice President Real
 Estate and Facilities at the YMCA of Metropolitan Chicago, Jeffrey
 Lietz, Vice President of Commercial Architecture at Charles Vincent
 George Architects, and Laura Visher DeSimone, Vice Chair for the
 Board of Advisors at Naperville YMCA presented representing the
 Property Owner. They discussed topics including the reasons they
 request denial of the landmark designation, deferred maintenance,
 the RFQ process, architectural features of the building, prior studies
 done on historic buildings in Naperville, an appraisal done on the
 property, and the impact of YMCA on residents.


 Commissioner Urda asked if the Kroehler YMCA resembled other
 YMCAs visited by Jeffery Lietz.


 Jeffery Lietz responded that the Kroehler YMCA was not similar in
 style to other YMCAs visited.


 Commissioner Urda asked why the additions to the building were

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Historic Preservation Commission Meeting Minutes January 27, 2022

 shown in the cost estimates.


 Jeffery Lietz responded that the 2013 estimates were done to show
 the costs for renovation of the building for a YMCA use.


 Chairman Jacks asked if anyone has expressed interest in saving a
 portion of the building.


 Scott Day noted that the three finalists were not looking for
 adaptive reuse.


 Commissioner Urda asked for clarification on the deferred
 maintenance.


 Basil Fitzsimons responded that the costs shown are over the
 lifetime of the building which was done in 2019 and that the costs
 would be more today, but the YMCA of Metropolitan Chicago has
 done some maintenance on the building including the roof.


 Commissioner Urda asked for further information about the
 environmental contamination on the site.


 Basil Fitzsimons noted the site will need to be remediated, but the
 extent of how far the contamination has traveled on the site is
 unknown.


 Marilyn Schweitzer asked what Scott Day meant by “recreate” the
 YMCA and if there will be another YMCA added.


 Scott Day responded that the term “recreate” was used because the
 request would require landmarking only the original structure
 resulting in returning to the original structure which is different
 than what exists today. Day also noted he was unsure if there will
 be another YMCA, but that the revenue from the sale will go back to
 fund the YMCAs mission.


 Philip Buchanan asked if any developers specialize in adaptive
 reuse.


 Scott Day was unsure if there were any developers specialized in
 adaptive reuse.


 Public Testimony:


 Marilyn Schweitzer spoke in support of the landmark request.



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Historic Preservation Commission Meeting Minutes January 27, 2022

 Bill Simon spoke in support of the landmark request.


 Philip Buchanan spoke in support of the landmark request.


 Peter Fissinger spoke in opposition of the landmark request.


 Tim Messer spoke in support of the landmark request.


 Signe Gleason spoke in support of the landmark request. Signe also
 read a statement from Karen Solomon in support for the landmark
 request.


 Scott Day provided closing comments and requested the landmark
 designation be denied.


 Becky Simon provided closing comments and noted that the request
 meets the criteria and should be approved.


 A motion was made by Commissioner Urda and seconded by
 Commissioner Franczyk to close the public hearing for HPC 21-4482.
 Aye: Franczyk, Garrison, Chairman Jacks, Urda, and Wills
 Nays: None


 All Commissioners agreed that structure sought to be landmarked is
 at least 50 years in whole or in part.


 The Commission noted that there was little discussion or evidence
 presented related to this criterion found in Section 2.2.1 (Does the
 evidence that has been provided show that the structure sought to
 be Landmarked was owned or occupied by a person of historic
 significance in national, State, or local history?).


 Commissioner Urda agreed that 2.2.1 was not met.


 Commissioner Garrison, Chairman Jacks, Franczyk, Urda and Wills
 found that the criterion in Section 2.2.1 was not met.


 Commissioner Urda mentioned that evidence has shown that
 criterion in Section 2.2.2 (That it has a direct connection to an
 important event in national, State or local history) is met including
 numerous references to local events and that Naperville is the first
 community YMCA outside of Chicago.


 Commissioner Garrison, Chairman Jacks, Franczyk, Urda and Wills
 found that the criterion in Section 2.2.2 is met.



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Historic Preservation Commission Meeting Minutes January 27, 2022

 Commissioner Garrison did not believe the architectural style of the
 building was distinctive in response to Section 2.2.3 (Does the
 evidence that has been provided show that the structure sought to
 be Landmarked embodies the distinguishing characteristics of an
 architectural period, style, method of construction, or use of
 indigenous materials?).


 Commissioner Urda agreed that it was a difficult point, but he
 would support that the criterion in Section 2.2.3 is met based on the
 graphics provided by Marylin Schweitzer showing a consistent YMCA
 architectural style.


 Commissioner Franczyk found that Section 2.2.3 was not met with
 this case.


 Commissioner Garrison, Chairman Jacks, Franczyk, and Wills found
 that the criterion in Section 2.2.3 was not met.


 Commissioner Urda found that the criterion in Section 2.2.3 was
 met.


 Commissioner Urda found that the subject building is a notable
 work of architects for the YMCA building in response to the criterion
 found in Section 2.2.4 (Does the evidence that has been provided
 show that the structure sought to be Landmarked represents the
 notable work of a builder, designer or architect whose individual
 work has substantially influenced the development of the
 community?). Commissioner Urda did not have concerns with
 partial demolition as that happened with the Little Friends building.


 Commissioner Franczyk agreed that the Naperville YMCA is
 consistent with the general YMCA architectural style. However, she
 noted that the Naperville YMCA is the most lackluster of all
 examples shown. She had concerns with tearing down a portion of
 the building and what may remain. She did not find that the
 criterion found in Section 2.2.4 was met. She does not like the idea
 of tearing a building down; however, she supports the greater
 mission of the YMCA.


 Garrison noted that the Commission needs to keep the bar high. He
 did not feel that the petition provided evidence in support of 2.2.4.


 Commissioner Garrison, Chairman Jacks, Franczyk, and Wills found
 that the criterion in Section 2.2.4 was not met.


 Commissioner Urda found that the criterion in Section 2.2.4 was

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Historic Preservation Commission Meeting Minutes January 27, 2022

 met.


 In response to discussion about the criterion found in Section 2.2.5
 (Does the evidence that has been provided show that the structure
 sought to be Landmarked is included in the National Register of
 Historic Places?), staff confirmed that the property is included in
 the National Register.


 Commissioner Garrison, Chairman Jacks, Franczyk, Urda, and Wills
 found that the criterion in Section 2.2.5 was met.


 In response to a prompt to discuss whether the Property Owner has
 responded to the Landmark Application and the nature of the
 response Commissioner Urda noted that Scott Day presented a
 detailed case and will get a good hearing before the City Council.


 Donna Sack noted that “re-creation” is a commonly known term in
 preservation. Naperville’s example is the Pre-Emption House at
 Naper Settlement.


 The Commission did not make any other Findings of Fact relevant to
 the Application for Landmarking.


 Commissioner Franczyk noted that landmarking this property sets a
 dangerous precedent. She does not agree with landmarking.


 Commissioner Urda noted that the HPC is only a recommending
 body; the City Council will make the final decision. He supported
 the landmarking as history is important. Commissioner Urda noted
 support for a recommendation of approval, as the criteria were met.


 Commissioner Garrison noted that he was hard pressed to
 recommend designation of this structure. His opinion was that the
 facts presented only meet the minimum standard, which made it
 hard for him to support.


 Chairman Jacks stated he struggled to recommend this building.
 Chairman Jacks noted that after demolition, there is little historic
 structure left. He has not heard a lot of great feedback about the
 re-use of the Old Nichols site; the commercial space has also been
 difficult to rent. He doesn’t believe the outcome was great and
 should be considered when reviewing this request.


 A motion was made by Commissioner Garrison and seconded by Commissioner
 Franczyk to approve HPC Landmark Designation Request 21-4482 to designate
 the property located at 34 S. Washington Street (the Kroehler YMCA) as a


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Historic Preservation Commission Meeting Minutes January 27, 2022

 landmark in accordance with Section 6-11-3 (Designation of Landmarks) of the
 Naperville Municipal Code.
 Aye: Urda
 Nays: Garrison, Chairman Jacks, Franczyk, and Wills

F. REPORTS

1. Approve the minutes of the July 22, 2021, Historic Preservation Commission meeting

 A motion was made by Commissioner Garrison seconded by Commissioner Urda
 to approve the meeting minutes of the July 22, 2021, Historic Preservation
 Commission meeting.
 Aye: Franczyk, Garrison, Chairman Jacks, Urda, and Wills
 Nays: None

G. NEW BUSINESS:

H. ADJOURNMENT:
 A motion was made by Commissioner Franczyk seconded by Commissioner
 Garrison to adjourn the January 27, 2022, Historic Preservation Commission
 meeting at 10:48 pm.
 Aye: Franczyk, Garrison, Chairman Jacks, Urda, and Wills
 Nays: None




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