Athletes, administrators debate scholarship stipends

Jerry Carino

USA TODAY Sports

Implementing any supplemental plan %22incredibly sticky%2C%22 says Rutgers AD Julie Hermann

Retiring Princeton AD Gary Walters views idea as a %22bait-and-switch tactic%22

Monmouth AD Marilyn McNeil%3A %22This is a Title IX lawsuit waiting to happen%22

Jen Hilgenberg laughs when she reads about the NCAA's proposed $2,000 stipends for scholarship athletes.

A former captain of the Villanova women's basketball team, Hilgenberg runs a customized merchandising business called Red Dog Glass. In her mind Villanova paid her handsomely — and continues to do so every time she makes a sale.

"It was absolutely a lot of work, but it was an amazing experience," she said of her time in a Wildcats uniform. "As a business professional, it taught me almost every life lesson as far as being successful afterward: the teamwork, the commitment factor and learning how to prioritize your time, which is huge in the real world."

Hilgenberg, who earned the Big East's Sportsmanship Award as a Villanova senior in 2005, keeps her hand in hoops as an assistant at Division III Swarthmore (Pa.). She does not see the need for a stipend on top of a scholarship.

"As a Division I athlete, my question would be, 'What do they need it for?' " she said. "Your room and food is paid for. You're getting apparel. You're pretty much taken care of until the day you go home over the summer. In four years, at the end of the day I didn't ask for anything financially from my parents. The school provided it all."

Not everyone views it that way, which is why the stipend idea has morphed into a national debate.

"I think there's a big misconception a lot of people have — that a full scholarship takes care of everything. In reality, it doesn't," said Monmouth junior Julian Hayes, a leading rusher for the Hawks' football team. "There are simple things like gas money, toiletries, clothing — things people take for granted. A student who is on an academic scholarship has time to bring in some extra income, whereas a full scholarship player most likely is not able to do that."

Hayes is business management major whose current credit load includes courses in economics and business law and business history. Between football and academics, most of his waking hours are tightly scheduled.

"I think of it and the other athletes look at it as job schedule," he said. "Practices and meetings take up a large part of your day."

As a result, Hayes said, the $2,000 stipend is "definitely something that's on our radar. It would be welcome by most if not all players."

On the surface this seems like a simple moral issue: Should athletics scholarships be expanded to cover what is called the "full cost of attendance," including a moderate amount of spending money?

A vast amount of energy has been spent by the news media, advocacy groups and commissioners of the so-called power conferences arguing the moral case for the stipend. But the high logistical hurdles to implementing such a policy — compliance with Title IX, application to sports that rely on partial scholarships and, most significantly, how athletics departments would foot the bill — receive scant public attention.

Those problems prompted NCAA member schools to send the stipend legislation back to the drawing board last year, and that's where it remains. A revised version is supposed to be rolled out soon, possibly as early as October. In the meantime, it's a festering wedge that threatens to permanently divide Division I as power brokers in the affluent Big Ten and SEC line up against mid- and low-majors that populate the membership.

"I think it's the right idea," Rutgers athletics director Julie Hermann said of the stipends. "It struggled to get passed because it was done so quickly. It was done with a very small group of administrators out of the national office with limited notice, without thinking through the complications of its application — including Title IX and including how we're going to pay for that. Depending on what campus you're on, that's another $200,000 to $700,000 (a year), and we had less than a couple of months' notice to apply that."

Over the past month New Jersey Press Media interviewed athletics directors at four Division I schools — Rutgers, Seton Hall, Monmouth and Princeton — and spoke informally with several athletics department staffers who work with college athletes. Opinions varied on the moral necessity of a stipend system, but all agreed on one salient point: Putting it into place looms as a practical nightmare that could foment hikes in tuition and the elimination of some non-revenue sports.

"It's incredibly sticky," Hermann said.

Unbalanced budgets

The forces pushing for stipends cite gaudy numbers in support: Television networks CBS and Turner Sports are paying the NCAA $785 million a year for the rights to broadcast the men's basketball tournament. Fueled by television money, the Big Ten paid its schools $25 million apiece last year. NCAA President Mark Emmert made nearly $1.7 million last year. Pac-12 Commissioner Larry Scott raked in $3.1 million in 2011.

Locally, Monmouth spent $57 million to build its new Multipurpose Activity Center, which houses several sports. Rutgers is paying $1.25 million a year to new men's basketball coach Eddie Jordan.

In a vacuum those seem like over-the-top investments, but they are in line with industry standards. This is the cost of doing business in Division I, and it's a big reason every year, without fail, only about 10% of athletics departments show a profit. The rest operate in the red, which means relying on a subsidy from the main university budget to cover the shortfall.

It should be noted that the NCAA's billion-dollar haul from the networks does not get divided among the schools. It does fully fund 89 championship tournaments for men's and women's sports in Division I, II and III.

Still, the raw numbers fan flames of discontent in some quarters.

"The problem is 20 years ago the TV contracts were not at the level that they are now. We're using the B-word now — billions," Seton Hall athletics director Pat Lyons said. "(The pro-stipend argument) becomes, 'If the schools and conferences are making all this money, what about the athletes?' I don't think the issue (regarding stipends) is that the need is big. There is this thought process that because the schools and conferences are profiting so much, why aren't the athletes getting more?"

The truth is that most schools are not profiting, not even close. Rutgers athletics ran a $28 million deficit in 2012 and used university and student-fee money to balance its budget.

"Every school I've been at has hiked tuition drastically. So tuition is going up already $8,000 a year, and now you're adding $400,000 (in stipends)," Hermann said. "You're stressing the system. This automatically put most athletic departments in serious financial cross hairs."

And there is a hidden cost beyond just paying the stipends to athletes who currently have full scholarships. Schools with football have a much higher percentage of male athletes on full scholarship. Some of the most populated women's sports — soccer, lacrosse, field hockey, track and field and softball — use the "equivalency" model where scholarships can be broken into halves and quarters and spread out as a head coach sees fit.

Because the stipend legislation only targeted athletes on full scholarships, it created a problem with Title IX — the gender equity law passed by Congress in 1972.

"You automatically have a Title IX shortfall," Hermann said, using Rutgers' projected stipend costs as an example. "You have $200,000 you can now award to your men, which is great. But that only gives you $60,000 that you can award on the women's side. You're automatically $140,000 off."

For those who would promote only paying stipends to the sports that produce revenue — football and men's basketball — Monmouth athletics director Marilyn McNeil acknowledges the likely result.

"That's a Title IX lawsuit waiting to happen," she said. "I don't think it would take five minutes."

So how to bridge the aforementioned Title IX gap? There are two ways, and neither is easy. One would be raising more women's sports to full-scholarship status.

"But as you do that, your costs continue to soar," Hermann said, adding that eliminating partial scholarships would decrease the number of women who get athletics aid.

"Do we take more of those university subsidies that maybe would be going to a science program or the arts and give student-athletes money in their pocket?" McNeil said. "If I was a member of the general student body I'd really be questioning that."

The second option, which nobody wants to address — but nobody will discount, either — is that non-revenue sports will suffer drastic cuts or be eliminated to avoid adding to the subsidy.

"Speaking generally, it's just another thing that now creates so much financial stress in athletics that people would be looking in all directions to relieve it," Hermann said. "I'd hate for that to happen."

These unresolved questions are why, as Hermann put it, the stipend legislation "went off the rails."

Real student-athletes

It's been a rough month for college football, from Johnny Manziel's autograph-gate to a scathing series by Sports Illustrated outlining alleged improprieties at Oklahoma State. Many of the loudest voices in the pay-the-players crowd cite these and other scandals as proof that amateurism is dead, the term student-athlete is a farce and the intercollegiate model needs to be blown up.

They haven't met Mael Corboz.

The Rutgers men's soccer sophomore was just named offensive player of the week by the American Athletic Conference. Somewhere between a class in differential equations and a three-hour physics lab, he posted three goals and two assists in a two-game span, both wins for the Scarlet Knights.

Corboz bristles at the notion that a few highly publicized scandals represent the state of college sports.

"We're not just athletes who are here to play sports," he said. "That is completely not true. If you miss class, the coaches are going to find out and the whole team has to run. Even if you don't want to be a student-athlete, if you just want to be an athlete, you're kind of forced to do both. There is no other way."

Corboz said he's never heard of the stipend initiative, and although he wasn't thrilled last year when he had to stand throughout a three-hour chemistry lab on the day of a soccer match, he's not concerned about getting paid for it either.

"I'm not looking for money or anything like that," he said. "I'm doing what I love every day."

Maybe that sounds quaint, but it's not uncommon. For every Manziel, there are scores of student-athletes such as just-graduated Rutgers men's basketball center Austin Johnson, who is pursuing a master's degree and serves as a graduate assistant with the Scarlet Knights. There are many in the mold of former Seton Hall basketball star Jerry Walker, who was sidelined by academic issues as a freshman but eventually became a community activist and just ran for mayor of Jersey City.

There is Kaitlin McWhorter. She is a senior at the College of Charleston who competes on a track and field scholarship. This past summer she traveled to Kenya and volunteered at an orphanage while assisting team of eye surgeons. Her dream is to work for Doctors Without Borders.

McWhorter is in favor of the $2,000 stipends, but she would like to see them awarded on merit. Not for the fastest runner or highest jumper, but for student-athletes who engage in service projects on campus or in the community.

"A lot of athletes go above and beyond," she said. "It's not just about what happens on the field."

Mauri Horton offers an interesting perspective. She was a captain on the Rutgers women's basketball team in the early 2000s and now coaches the girls varsity at Plainfield (N.J.) High. She knows the value of an athletics scholarship, but she also sees value in the stipend.

"To say you can get your school paid for and leave without any debt is huge," she said. "It gives a lot of kids a chance to get a better education. Five years after (graduating from Rutgers) I went back to see Coach (C. Vivian) Stringer, and I broke down and cried. I told her I appreciated that she gave me the opportunity to be successful in life. If you don't have that education, it's hard to make it. She's giving all these young ladies an opportunity to make a decent living after basketball, which is a very short life. You learn that as you get older."

But, she added, "A young person who has a full scholarship but comes from a home with low income, how are they supposed to get necessities? I have a meal plan, but I also need socks. Or I need to get my hair done."

Horton would award the stipends based on financial need and regulate their use.

"If you buy a dress for a banquet, you have to turn in the receipt," she said.

That's what some schools did when the legislation initially was approved in 2011. It was overturned two months later, but athletes who signed a Letter of Intent in the interim were grandfathered in.

"The campus I just left, they have a card where they can go make outside charges, run out and get shampoo or whatever," Hermann said. "Part of the problem is they were running out and buying an iPhone 5 that you and I don't even have. They're buying a $500 pair of jeans that you and I don't spend money on. So yes we could make them a card, but you have to teach them financial management. We're trying to feed and clothe you, give you everything you need (via the stipend), but we're not trying to make you into fashionistas."

Motives and values

The logistical hurdles speak for themselves, but beyond that stands a layer of philosophical opposition to stipends. Within college athletics, the prime forces behind the stipends are the commissioners of the major football conferences — the ones whose schools comprise the 10% that make money off sports.

More than a few skeptics view their push for stipends as a way to give the big-money schools an added advantage over mid-majors such as Butler and Boise State that occasionally crash the party in high-profile sports. And perhaps even a way to split off from those schools entirely — a view reinforced when those commissioners threatened to do just that after the stipend legislation crashed.

"Their ability to disguise self-interest in the name of any number of principles has been raised to an art form," said Princeton athletics director Gary Walters, a former member of the NCAA basketball tournament's selection committee. "When you see the NCAA president making $1.7 million, and that all of the (major conference) commissioners, many of whom are friends of mine, are making $2 million, where your treasure lies, so shall your heart beat."

In other words, the less competition there is from pesky mid-majors, the more money for the big conferences and their bosses.

"I believe the desire to pay student athletes is a bait-and-switch tactic which is taking place now under the name of student-athlete welfare," Walters said. "But student-athlete welfare wasn't considered at all — not at all — when the conferences expanded beyond regions."

Walters is worried that an ultimate casualty will be the NCAA tournament, one of the crown jewels of American sports. He's not the only one.

"We talk now about the haves and the have-nots. You're going to widen that gap to the point where you're not going to have (Cinderella) upsets in the NCAA tournament anymore," said Seton Hall's Lyons, who previously served as athletics director at mid-major Iona. "I like the fact that there are 340 teams in Division I and for the most part on any given night anyone can beat the other team. But if you start to push (a pay model) and you'll have mid-majors who can't do it. Mid-majors don't have a lot of money. Then you will start seeing that gap."

Big picture

What's a full scholarship worth? A number that gets thrown around a lot is $50,000 a year. Seton Hall's Lyons said there is more to the picture.

"When you go all-in on what a full grant-in-aid student-athlete gets, you can quantify some things, but there are some things that you can't," said Lyons, who was a scholarship athlete as an undergrad at Iona. "You're getting tuition, room and board, books and fees, food. But you're also getting this support system around you that is absolutely free. Tutors, nutritionists, the best doctors, strength coaches. It's certainly worth more than the $50,000 for tuition, room and board and books and fees."

The larger point these ADs want to make is this: Change is good, but overhaul is a strong word when there are thousands of college athletes in dozens of sports who really go to class and play sports for the sake of sports, not money or fame.

"What I've told anyone who is willing to listen is, 99% of this enterprise is everything you wished it was — young people pursuing a degree who take pride in playing for their school colors," Hermann said. "It's only the 1% we have to find a way to manage. I walk around every day and see 600 student-athletes who are so put together for young people, it's incredible. Those are the stories that don't get reported and it's frustrating."

Jerry Carino also writes for New Jersey Press Media, a Gannett property.

The 10 best RI High school coaches during their playing days

There were plenty of terrific athletes who performed on athletic fields throughout Rhode Island during this past high school season. Many will go on to compete in college and just maybe some will go beyond that. We’ll have to wait and see.

But there’s also some incredible talent that have helped guide these athletes along the way – and we're not just talking coaching skill either.

Chris Collins embraces challenge of lifting Northwestern to NCAAs

Nicole Auerbach

USA TODAY Sports

Chris Collins played and eventually coached for 13 years under Hall of Famer Mike Krzyzewski%2C

Northwestern sits at 7-5 and opens Big Ten play next week against Wisconsin

Having a famous father%2C Hall of Famer Doug Collins%2C in your profession comes with some pressure

EVANSTON, Ill. — Not far from here, two couches learned a lot about basketball.

Doug Collins lay on one, his son Chris on the other, in their home in Northbrook during Chris's childhood.

The NBA coach and former four-time NBA all-star would put on a basketball game and start talking. His son, working his way toward a scholarship to play at Duke, would listen. He'd chime in sometimes, helping to analyze a team's strategy or a particular player's strength. Most nights, the couches got an earful. When Chris left for college, these were the moments Doug would miss most.

"He's talking the game out; I'm a kid," Chris says now. "He's talking about what teams are trying to do, matchups and situations, why coaches are doing certain things. That's how I learned."

Chris picked up tips and tidbits about the game he loved from his father in other ways, too, though Doug never coached him (on purpose). At Bulls practices or camps, Chris would watch the way his father handled other players. Chris also learned from his coach at Glenbrook North, Brian James, who spent 18 years at four different high schools in Illinois and then 14 years as an assistant coach in the NBA. At Duke, Chris played and eventually coached for 13 years under Hall of Famer Mike Krzyzewski, another invaluable resource.

During those 13 seasons in Durham, Chris and his wife, Kim, would often get asked how long they planned on staying there. Kim always said three to five years; assistant coaches rarely stay in one spot too long.

"People would say to me all the time, 'Why aren't you leaving? Why are you still here? He's so ready (to be a head coach),' " Kim says. "He's been ready for awhile, but it was about finding the right fit."

Northwestern came calling in March.

Chris liked its similarities to Duke – the academics, the values, the standards of excellence it preached. He liked the idea of moving back to the area he'd grown up in. And then, of course, there's that whole thing about Northwestern never reaching the NCAA tournament.

"The fact that it was a program kind of on the cusp, that hadn't made the jump to where everybody wants it to be, to the NCAAs – to me, that was an exciting challenge," Chris says. "It may not be a fit for everybody … It fit everything I was looking for."

***

After Northwestern fired Bill Carmody last March, athletics director Jim Phillips met with the basketball team to break the news. He then asked players to meet him again, later that weekend, prepared with a list of the attributes they'd want in a new coach.

"Having someone who would develop great relationships with his players," was important, redshirt senior Drew Crawford says, a sentiment that was repeated throughout the meeting. Players wanted someone hungry to win. Someone who had played the game. Someone who'd experienced success in basketball.

Phillips took their notes, along with his own, and went to find the Wildcats' next coach. He met with seven candidates over two days before sitting down with Chris on March 25, a day after the Blue Devils beat Creighton to advance to the Sweet 16. Phillips felt instant chemistry with Chris; he announced him as his new coach two days later.

"Could he do the job?" Phillips says. "Could he lead and be a head coach? Did he have the basketball acumen and all the rest of that? And oh, by the way, he's also from Chicago – the stars aligned. It came together that he was the perfect choice."

On the day he was hired, Chris sent texts to the current Northwestern players to introduce himself. "He's gotten to know each guy individually," Crawford says. "We're able to communicate with him about the team or life in general. That's one thing that's great about him, we all have a good relationship with him."

In the days and months that followed Chris's hire, excitement followed him nearly everywhere he went. To events with boosters, to Wrigley Field, to throw out the first pitch, to potential recruits' homes. In July, the 66th-ranked recruit in the class of 2014 and Chicago native Vic Law committed to Northwestern. He was the Wildcats' first top-75 recruit since 1993.

"The city of Chicago identifies with its own," Phillips said. "It gave us instant credibility."

Chris had kept those Chicago-area ties strong through the years. He played a key role in the recruitment of Jon Scheyer, another Glenbrook North star who went to Duke in 2006. Both Chris and Scheyer had been Illinois' Mr. Basketball.

James, Chris's former high school coach and current assistant, also maintains close relationships throughout the state of Illinois and is a former board member of the Illinois Basketball Coaches Association.

"We are right in the middle of what I think is as good a hotbed as there is in this country, not only in Chicago, but the whole Midwest," Chris says. "Kids in the Midwest, they grow up, they want to be in the Big Ten. … The challenge now is to get those local kids to want to stay home and understand they have everything they need in their backyard."

***

Northwestern sits at 7-5, with one game left in its non-conference season. It opens Big Ten play next week against Wisconsin. Those around the program are realists; they know this won't be easy.

"I told Chris this is probably going to be the hardest year that he's ever had in sports," Doug says. "It's going to be tough to get wins in the Big Ten – the Big Ten is loaded. It's going to be interesting to me to see how he manages that. Working hard every day and playing to win, and being able to absorb the losses, understanding it's a part of the process of getting Northwestern where it needs to be."

Like most coaches, Chris doesn't handle losing well. Kim says he even refuses to lose to his children while playing Candy Land and other board games. These on-court losses may sting more.

"There are going to be some bad moments, there are going to be some great moments," James says. "He's used to winning at such a high level all the time with an 85% or 90% ratio of wins versus losses. That's not going to come overnight here."

A program – particularly one with a long history of losing (Northwestern's first 20-win season came in 2009-10) – cannot transform instantly. Carmody-recruited players were used to running the Princeton offense; Chris wants to give players more freedom and to play faster. Conditioning had to improve. Recruiting had to get better, too, and it has. (Northwestern's 2014 class, highlighted by Law, is ranked No. 25 in the nation by ESPN.com.)

Though the athletic department is in the midst of building a new lakefront football facility, there are no immediate plans to upgrade the basketball facilities. But it's coming, eventually – "In time, we all believe and know that will be the right thing," Phillips says.

It's a start; Chris knows he's far from his finish line.

It's no secret that, ultimately, Chris would like to be the coach to lead Northwestern to its first NCAA tournament appearance. He talks about wanting to build a legacy here; he likes that he can start from scratch.

Harvard coach Tommy Amaker knows exactly what that's like. Amaker led the Crimson to a share of its first-ever Ivy League title in 2011 and to its first NCAA tournament win last spring, against No. 3 New Mexico. Amaker also gave Chris his first job in college basketball, back at Seton Hall in 1998.

"He gets a chance to put his identity and his stamp on it," Amaker says. "He'll do it – no question in my mind. He's capable. What another neat story. … Knowing him the way I know him, I can't imagine that's not something that's really attractive and intriguing to him, to be a part of it, to be a part of one of those incredible sports stories that will be talked about for years and years. We know how that feels."

Krzyzewski said Northwestern made a "terrific" hire in Chris. Stanford coach Johnny Dawkins, another coach from the Duke/Krzyzewski tree, said he has no doubt Chris will achieve whatever he wants at Northwestern. "Chris will have many sleepless nights trying to accomplish it," Dawkins says. "No one's going to work any harder to get that done."

***

As soon as Chris was hired at Northwestern, Doug bought a place in the Chicago suburbs. His primary residence is in Arizona, but he says he's actually spent more time here this fall. Partially because he wanted to be around Chris and his grandchildren and partially because he didn't want to be part of the 76ers rebuilding project, Doug left Philadelphia and coaching this spring.

He now works as an analyst for ESPN, though his informal job is one he's had all of Chris's life: as his son's most trusted advisor. The conversations are different from the ones they had on couches back in the day, but they're still lengthy and intriguing. Sometimes Doug will sit down with his son after stopping by practice. Or he'll stop by Chris's house for a bite and a chat.

"Men are funny," Kim says. "Guys don't talk on the phone all the time, but Chris and his dad talk everyday. They are best friends. They literally could sit in a room and talk basketball for 24 hours straight."

James, who coached with Doug in Philadelphia, overheard many of those conversations over the years. He remembers father-son phone calls while the 76ers were bussing back from games that dissected matchups and in-game strategies.

"(Chris) is a thinking man's coach," James says. "He's proactive, not reactive. A lot of that is how smart I feel his father is. I think Doug is a genius in terms of basketball, strategy, game management, substitutions, what to do in the end of games. Obviously, Chris has learned from Coach K, but also having a very astute father, who's one of the best basketball minds in the world as well."

Having a famous father in your profession comes, understandably, with some pressure. But those close to Chris don't think of it that way. Because Chris has coached college basketball and Doug has mostly stayed in the realm of the NBA, they have been able to respect one another's space and domain while offering help or advice when asked.

Kim sees a third Coach Collins in the making. Ten-year-old Ryan already mimics his dad, motivating his sister, Kate, and her teammates during their soccer games. He also models his grandfather pretending he's a commentator by doing play-by-play for games his classmates play at school.

"Ryan obviously lives in the shadow of his grandfather and his dad, but it's such a big compliment," Kim says. "No pressure there, Ryan." She laughs. "He's like a little Collins-in-training."

When Doug's in town and drops by his son's house, he often sees something that makes him pause: Chris lying on one couch and Ryan lying on the other, talking hoops.

"It puts a smile on my face," Doug says. "It wasn't too long ago that I was doing that with Chris."

Nicole Auerbach, a national college basketball reporter for USA TODAY Sports, is on Twitter @NicoleAuerbach.

Tennessee baseball coach Tony Vitello was hired by Vols in 36 ...

Tony Vitello was so heartbroken he could physically feel it.

Missouri State had walked into Arkansas’ Baum Stadium and ended the Razorbacks’ season on June 5, 2017, weeks before Vitello ever imagined. The distraught Arkansas hitting coach headed to a taco place in Fayetteville, ordered three times more than normal and went home after the jarring NCAA Regional loss.

He watched a movie and then another. “Tombstone” started after midnight, and Vitello couldn't resist.

“Oh hell, I have to at least watch a little bit of this,” Vitello thought.

As Vitello spurned sleep in favor of the 1993 Western, his phone rang around 1:30 a.m. It was Tennessee athletics director John Currie.

“I was upset still but my mind was racing,” Vitello said.

That fateful phone call launched Vitello into a 36-hour blur. It united him with Tennessee baseball and put him on a path to coaching superstardom, setting the stage five years later for him to lead the juggernaut Vols in their pursuit of College World Series glory this season and a stake as one of the greatest teams of all time.

“I like people who are willing to bet on themselves,” Currie told Knox News in an exclusive interview. “'I am going to take this job because I see the opportunity. I know what I can do and I am going to do it.'”

How Tony Vitello entered Tennessee's search

That first call lasted a couple of hours. Vitello finished “Tombstone” before he fell asleep on the couch with his phone next to him. Currie, now the athletics director at Wake Forest, told him to expect a phone call in the morning, and Vitello didn’t want to miss it.

“(The coaching search) had to be one of the quirkiest ones that has ever gone down and one of the quickest,” Vitello said.

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UT vetted a handful of candidates, both head coaches and assistant coaches, after Dave Serrano stepped down following the 2017 season after mostly losing seasons.

Currie and Blair DeBord, a special project manager at UT and former baseball player at Kansas State, led the search. DeBord spearheaded the efforts to build a profile of its ideal candidate by talking to former players and longtime SEC baseball figureheads.

Tennessee needed a coach with the ability to recruit at a high level and build a roster with power arms and power bats — a hallmark of winning teams in the SEC. Simply, the Vols lacked the roster and talent to win. They needed a coach who could stockpile talent and develop it.

“One of the things we noticed about Tony was that every place he had been, they had really good players,” said DeBord, now an associate athletics director for development at Memphis. “It was this trend of Tony was going to places and now all of a sudden, they were winning at a really high level.”

Vitello, 43, had a proven track record as a recruiter and developer at Missouri, TCU and Arkansas. DeBord, a natural and cerebral right-hand man for Currie in the search, provided firsthand experience of Vitello’s ability to relate to players.

DeBord was a standout prep prospect in Manhattan, Kansas, and was destined to be a multiyear starter at Kansas State. Vitello, then Missouri's pitching coach and recruiting coordinator, left a lasting impression with DeBord as “one of the coolest guys I had ever met." DeBord always planned to go to Kansas State, but Vitello made him second-guess himself as a recruit.

That experience carried weight with Currie, who trusted DeBord and the character reference he provided.

“All the dynamics that Tony Vitello represents are all the right dynamics that we needed,” Currie said. “But especially his ability to connect with his student-athletes and build a competitive team culture."

Why John Currie kept thinking about Tony Vitello

Two phone calls followed Currie’s initial late-night contact. UT administrators Angie Boyd-Keck, Carmen Tegano and Donna Thomas called in the morning for a follow-up conversation.

“He is a problem-solver and he is smart,” DeBord recalled Tegano saying. “He can get through stuff. I can just tell by how he is answering questions.”

Currie called again as Vitello headed to Baum Stadium for exit interviews and recruiting planning. He asked Vitello where he could fly to that day. They agreed upon Washington — the nation's capital. Vitello let Arkansas coach Dave Van Horn know the situation and searched for flights on Kayak, the online travel agency, in his office.

“He is really smart and is intentional about everything he does," Currie said.

DeBord was actually the first person from UT who had reached out to Vitello that season, given their prior relationship. Vitello brushed aside the overture while Arkansas played in the regional, not wanting any distractions.

Currie proceeded with the coaching search as Vitello focused on trying to help Arkansas reach the College World Series.

“Tony kept being on my mind,” Currie said. “He really hit all the things that we wanted even though he hadn't been a head coach”

Currie was known to target past head coaches in his searches. Yet he broke that mold when he hired Vols tennis coach Chris Woodruff earlier in 2017, promoting the associate head coach to the top position. And he did it again when he hired Vitello.

Vitello wowed Currie with his energy and understanding of who he was as a person. His baseball savvy and enthusiasm popped. He also displayed sound awareness of what it would take to be successful at Tennessee.

“He was just ready for the opportunity,” DeBord said. “He was ready for the role. … He felt in his heart like he could do it at Tennessee.”

Everything he did backed up what Currie and DeBord had already known or garnered through research. Vitello called it “a reframing” of the way to view the job, which had its obvious challenges with facilities and successful rivals.

“A lot of it got boiled down to personalizing everything to Tennessee,” Vitello told Knox News. “Why don’t we make Tennessee baseball as good as we can and not worry about anyone else? And let’s tailor it to what our place is like with the park and campus and town.”

Why Frank Anderson was important

Vitello sat on a couch in Currie’s hotel room in Washington, less than 24 hours after scarfing down those tacos on his couch in Fayetteville.

It was highly informal. But that worked for Vitello.

“I didn’t really have time to prepare or overthink things,” Vitello said. “Maybe that was a blessing in disguise.”

Vitello flew into Washington late on June 6, then waited to meet with Currie. He filled the time by talking to Frank Anderson and Sean McCann, two of his longtime sounding boards and eventual hires at Tennessee as pitching coach and video coordinator, respectively.

Anderson was in favor of the opportunity for Vitello, and Vitello wanted to bring the decorated former head coach with him.

“He had a really good feel for his weaknesses as a coach and what he needed to supply himself with on his staff to be successful,” DeBord said.

Currie and Vitello met for three hours, their first in-person meeting.

Vitello’s vision for a staff resonated with Currie. He knew not only the type of coaches he needed around him, but who they would be as he proposed a staff.

Anderson would be the pitching coach, a veteran presence to help Vitello navigate a new situation.

"Instead of having to call him, I could just walk down the hall," Vitello said.

Vitello envisioned a hitting coach who could share the burden of recruiting. Josh Elander was the fit. McCann, whom Currie knew from overlap at Kansas State, was another veteran voice to hire.

“Why not make that as great a group of coaches as possible?” Vitello said. “Then combine it with the fans in Knoxville, you have a great recruiting tool. Then if recruit great people, that is your niche — relationships. …

“That is kind of your weapon to go into battle in the SEC.”

Currie was well-versed in Vitello’s background. He became familiar with him during his time as Kansas State athletics director, and was floored sitting with him into the night in Washington. As Vitello asserted himself as the man for the job above two other finalists, Currie was left feeling that Vitello's success wouldn't just be likely — it would be inevitable.

“He had essentially been an offensive coordinator and defensive coordinator,” Currie said. “It is just so rare that you would have an assistant coach who has not just done all those things, but been the best in their league in those elements.”

Tony Vitello, the perfect fit

Currie told Knox News he stopped to take a picture as he walked through Reagan National Airport on May 24 after interviewing Megan Gebbia, his eventual hire as the Wake Forest women’s basketball coach.

He texted the image of a nondescript seating area by a food court to Vitello.

“Here’s the seat where you signed that crappy contract!” Currie wrote.

“Worked out alright!!” Vitello replied.

Following the meeting with Vitello, Currie worked through the night with former deputy athletics director Reid Sigmon and then-university lead general counsel Matthew Scoggins. They had to prepare a contract.

Currie and Vitello met again the next morning, and Currie offered Vitello the job. Vitello had the contract reviewed by a pair of advisers as he rode to the airport with his soon-to-be boss.

Vitello packed the only orange shirt he had, a deeper orange shirt with a dark gray collar, and wore it when he signed the contract with an orange pen. Currie took a picture on that day, too, and posted it on Twitter on June 7, announcing Vitello as the baseball coach.

“It was one of the few times where I have had that feeling that the kids get from us when we recruit them,” Vitello said. “This guy believes in me. He recruited me. He gave me an opportunity.”

Vitello arrived in Knoxville a day later and was introduced June 9. Currie called Vitello "a perfect fit" at an introductory news conference that day, and Vitello has spent the past five years backing it up.

He took Tennessee to the NCAA Tournament in 2019, the first appearance since 2005. He had the Vols roaring to start the 2020 season before the COVID-19 pandemic shut it down. UT won 50 games and went to the College World Series in 2021, then had an even bigger 2022 with a roster laden with first-round MLB talent and well-developed pieces.

The Vols (53-7) have been the No. 1 team in the country for two months, won the SEC regular-season title by a record six games and never trailed in the SEC Tournament en route to their first title since 1995. They will open NCAA Tournament play in the Knoxville Regional on Friday (6 p.m., SEC Network) against Alabama State (34-23) at Lindsey Nelson Stadium.

“It isn’t always about hiring the biggest name or hiring the most expensive person," DeBord said. "It is about finding the right person for the job. It is about fit and what your program needs at the time. Tony was that.”

DeBord was in Knoxville when the Vols hosted a regional last June. He watched from the balcony outside the coaches' offices in the opener against Wright State. He knew the buzz had grown about Tennessee baseball, but seeing it was different. He gazed across a packed Lindsey Nelson Stadium, and watched it reach a fever pitch when Drew Gilbert hit a walk-off grand slam.

It was the vision that Tennessee had when Currie called Vitello in 2017 — and it was real.

“This is what everyone thought it could be and Tony made it happen,” DeBord said.

Mike Wilson covers University of Tennessee athletics. Email him at michael.wilson@knoxnews.com and follow him on Twitter @ByMikeWilson. If you enjoy Mike’s coverage, consider a digital subscription that will allow you access to all of it.

How Notre Dame's Arike Ogunbowale forged her championship spirit

SOUTH BEND – Had things gone differently for Arike Ogunbowale, she might be starring on the soccer pitch instead of the basketball court.

Long before the senior guard became a buzzer-beating national champion, long before she broke Notre Dame’s all-time scoring record or competed on “Dancing With the Stars,” she dreamed of becoming the female version of Didier Drogba.

“She was a very good soccer player,” Yolanda Ogunbowale says of her only daughter, who faces fourth-seeded Texas A&M on Saturday in a Sweet 16 matchup in the Chicago Region. “She had some colleges that looked at her.”

Older brother Dare Ogunbowale, the former Wisconsin running back now with the NFL’s Tampa Bay Buccaneers, says Arike’s soccer potential went well beyond that modest assessment.

“She was great,” he says. “She was so much stronger and more physical than the other girls. On top of that, she had the speed. It’s the same now. She just has a knack for scoring. She’s always found ways to put the ball in the net.”

Arike, whose father, Gregory, played soccer and rugby in Nigeria before becoming an elementary school principal, played club soccer through her freshman year at Divine Savior Holy Angels High School. Her clubs (FC Milwaukee and Lake Country United) won four straight Wisconsin State Cups from 2009-12 and traveled throughout the country for high-level youth soccer showcases.

During one of those events in California, the women’s soccer coaches at Stanford and Baylor showed advanced interest in the budding phenom. Unlike many of her soccer teammates, however, Arike still played other sports, including softball and most notably basketball.

“She was incredible at all the sports she played,” Dare says. “She was actually a very good track runner when she was younger (200 and 400 meters). She also played softball. She was an infielder. She could have been good at it if she wanted to.”

Eventually, the young prodigy realized if soccer wasn’t her first love, she might be hurting her friends’ chances at securing scholarships of their own.

“A lot of her friends when she played soccer were good, and they went to a lot of showcases too,” says Yolanda, a former softball pitcher at DePaul University. “And then she realized, ‘You know, mom, they might be looking at me, and I don’t want a scholarship for soccer in college.’ She knew back then.”

Even then, the natural scorer’s inclination to put others first had taken root. After her freshman year of high school, basketball became the sole focus of Arike’s athletic pursuits.

“She just stopped playing soccer,” Yolanda says. “She had some nice offers, but she knew she didn’t want to pursue that. Once it got too tough (to play multiple sports), it was all strictly basketball.”

'She was gone'

Along the way, there was another sport Arike briefly dabbled in – flag football. Because there was no girls’ league, she played up with the boys on Dare’s team.

“That’s when I was really, really young,” Arike says. “I would say I was around 7 or 8, so (Dare) had to be like 10 or 11.”

That didn’t stop Arike from finding the end zone more than a few times that season. Dare still remembers one play in particular.

“We ran a reverse,” he says. “I pitched it to her, and she scored a touchdown against a bunch of guys. She ran around the left end and she was gone. I’ll never forget that. It was funny, man. It was funny.”

Asked about that famous reverse, Arike doesn’t deny it happened but suggests it wasn’t a seminal moment for her.

“He probably remembers better than me,” she says. “I was younger than him. That probably is true.”

Was that her only touchdown of the year?

“That’s the one he remembers,” she says with a laugh. “Let’s say that. That’s the one he remembers.”

As a matter of convenience, it was nothing for the pre-teen Arike to play with her older brothers, including Mario, who is 9 years older. That was both informally and on Dare's youth teams.

Being the only girl on those teams wasn’t easy, but it also taught her early on to ignore the doubters.

“I used to play with my brothers a lot, so I would play on Dare’s team,” she says. “I played on the boys’ team in basketball. I played AAU (with boys) in fourth or fifth grade. The team was called the Wizards. And I played in a boys’ league when I was younger.”

Did she ever receive encouraging feedback from her male competitors?

“Not really,” she says. “I don’t think they really liked competing with me at that age, but my brothers always did though.”

Playing with older boys in various sports merely expedited the learning process for Arike. It also built confidence.

“Definitely,” she says. “Especially with having two older brothers, I used to be physical with them all the time at home. And then playing in those leagues, I wasn’t the best yet, but it got me prepared and it got me used to being competitive with boys, so once I started playing with girls it was a little easier.”

Dream sequence

One constant for Arike, regardless of sport or age or level, is her incredible competitive spirit.

“She’s always had that from a young age when she was playing against us,” says Dare, who turns 25 in May. “Playing against her brothers or our cousins, she was always in the back yard competing just like she was one of the guys or she was as old as us. We had to make sure we toughened her up.”

If anything, Dare’s mentorship to his younger sister would center on finding ways to lessen the self-applied pressure.

“I never, ever had to ever talk about her effort or her competitiveness or her toughness,” Dare says. “That always just came natural. Sometimes we actually had to tell her to calm down. Some things weren’t as serious as she’d make them seem, but she was just such a fierce competitor. She made everything a competition.”

It’s still that way for Arike, whose first name means “something that you see and you cherish” in her father Gregory’s native Nigeria.

After closing out a 64-2 home record over her four-year college career, she is two wins away from a return trip to the Final Four and four away from making Notre Dame (32-3) the first non-UConn repeat champion in the women’s game since Tennessee in 2007 and 2008.

Even if that doesn’t happen, a future in the WNBA awaits, as does an eventual jersey retirement ceremony for her Number 24 at Purcell Pavilion. At 5-foot-8, she is one of five national finalists for the Ann Meyers Drysdale Award as well as a Naismith Award semifinalist for national player of the year after earning second-team All-America honors as a junior.

“Arike has always wanted the ball in her hands,” Yolanda says. “Ever since she’s played basketball or just been in that competitive environment in sports, we knew she had that desire to be one of the best.”

Still, could her parents have imagined all of this happening for their daughter?

“No,” Yolanda says. “Never, ever. It never even crossed our minds.”

Big brother politely disagrees.

“Imagine? Yes,” Dare says. “I definitely could have imagined this just because of how very few people in my opinion have her talent mixed with her work ethic. You see a lot of people that are very talented or you see people that work hard but maybe they don’t have the talent. When you put them both together the way she has, I definitely could have imagined it.”

He shakes his head and smiles.

“Seeing it actually come to fruition, seeing her eventually maybe being one of the jerseys hanging up in the rafters, is just incredible,” he says. “I guess I couldn’t have predicted this, no.”

Entering the national spotlight with her heroics at last year’s Final Four only added to the dream-like quality of the experience. Her family marvels at Arike’s ability to push all the noise aside and stay in the moment.

As the stakes climb higher and the end of her college career draws closer, those qualities will only become more vital.

“She still goes back and looks back on it and says, ‘Wow, I can’t believe we won,’ “ Yolanda says. “I think it’s just made her a better person, a stronger person. She knows what she has to do. Arike is a different breed, so to speak. She just takes it as it goes. She’s handled it all with a lot of poise and grace.”

Follow Mike Berardino on Twitter @MikeBerardino. His email is mberardino@gannett.com.

Emotions spill over in aftermath of AIA canceling winter sports

For the first time in the history of the Arizona Interscholastic Association, full sports seasons have been canceled, after the Executive Board voted 5-4 not to have winter sports seasons.

The COVID-19 pandemic that in March canceled the spring sports season surged in recent weeks in Arizona, making the state the No. 1 hotspot in the country and causing the Sports Medicine Advisory Committee to recommended to the board to not start the winter sports season.

Emotions spilled over in the high school sports community in the aftermath of this decision that impacts basketball and soccer players and wrestlers in Arizona among the nearly 300 schools in the AIA.

"It's a tragedy that a handful of adults made a decision that robs thousands of young women and men across the state," said Phoenix St. Mary's boys basketball coach Damin Lopez, whose team was ranked No. 1 in 4A by The Arizona Republic in preseason. "With a vaccine increasing in distribution and the fact that student-athletes were competing in AIA activities on the day of the vote just makes one wonder what their real motivation is."

The winter sports season was set to start in 10 days.

During the December special AIA Executive Board meeting that pushed the start date back from Jan. 5, AIA Executive Director David Hines said that the only way the season wouldn't start is if Gov. Doug Ducey would shut down the state.

That hasn't happened.

MORE:AIA board's decision to cancel winter sports season angers Arizona high school community

"It's disappointing," said Kwame Hymes, who was battling the AIA for his son Isaac to have his entire sophomore basketball season at Goodyear Millennium restored after leaving national prep program Hillcrest. "My heart goes out to all the seniors that this decision is affecting."

Mesa Mountain View coach Gary Ernst, the winningest boys basketball coach in AIA history, said he felt the AIA could have compromised and pushed the season back two more weeks with a five-week season. He also suggested a varsity-only spring season for basketball.

"Give us two more weeks off and give us a five-week season with a tourney," Ernst said in an email.. "Give us a spring season varsity only. But don’t take away our seniors last year after weeks and weeks of practice with the idea they were going to have a chance to play. PLEASE!!"

Phoenix Thunderbird head boys basketball coach Buddy Rake, who is an attorney, called the cancellation of winter sports "heartbreaking."

But, he added, "Under the present circumstances, I think it is the right decision."

Rake said tight mitigation measures were used during practices.

"Our coaches at every level have maintained a protective bubble," Rake said. "We didn’t allow players to move from freshman to JV or varsity. We kept teams segregated and didn’t allow more than 12 players in the gym. We did a history every day and if a player sneezed we sent them home and requested a Covid test. Coaches had to wear masks throughout practice."

Rake said there was great concern about COVID-19 as he led his team through practices.

"A Mayo cardiologist was consulted informally and he educated me about the rising number of myocarditis and other heart problems occurring in young athletes with Covid," Rake said.

Rake says that his players will join a club team and "have far less protection than they would" with his team. He believes testing would have been a better thing to do than canceling the season.

College basketball across the country has been playing with daily testing conducted. The AIA doesn't have COVID-19 testing for athletes.

"Since the Glendale Union District has been very successful in preventing spread among athletes, I would have preferred that the district determine that we would have games limited to Glendale Union High Schools," Rake said. "We could have tested each player and coaches for Covid an hour before game time. The recent test I was required to have before leaving for Hawaii took thirty minutes. In Hawaii anyone can get a test for free. Athletic trainers could be trained to give and evaluate."

Laurie Jones, mother of Washington-committed senior and The Republic’s 2019-20 All-Arizona Girls Basketball Team selection Marisa Davis of Valley Vista, feels it is sad that but can see both sides to this.

Medically, I see the bigger picture and the liabilities,” Jones said.

Queen Creek Casteel transfer guard Grace Oken, who left Gilbert Perry in June, lamented the AIA canceling the chance to play for senior season.

“I’m honestly heartbroken, this was our year at Casteel and we all knew that,” Oken said. “It’s upsetting how other sports could do whatever they wanted like nothing was going on in the world, but we get to winter sports and it’s all different for us. I’ve never been more excited for a season before like I was for this year. I have been dying to get onto the floor with my teammates and get that ring, and it all just got taken away from us in the blink of an eye. I never expected my senior season to get ripped away from me like this.”

Valley Vista girls basketball coach Rachel Matakas of The Republic’s top-ranked Super 10 poll girls basketball team and 6A defending championship team has had her team practice since August with masks on awaiting the season.

MORE:AIA board votes to cancel high school winter sports season amid surging COVID-19 cases

Valley Vista was scheduled to play its first game of the season against No. 5-ranked Phoenix Xavier Prep on Jan. 20.

“For (the AIA) just to say a blanket no, or seven days out before our first game, it’s not equitable,” Matakas said. “A lot of coaches have put a lot of things in place. There’s a lot of money already been spent on the season. For them not to even come up with a plan or an alternative to try and save the season I think is atrocious.

"We all know that there are other prep (basketball) teams currently still playing and I understand it’s a safety issue and that’s OK. But we can find ways to still be safe. Like, all athletes go online and they just show up to school for practice and then they play games. For a blanket statement and the vote to be that close, and just because one district has more pull than the others, I just don’t think that’s right.”

Defending 3A conference girls soccer state champion Gilbert Christian’s head coach and former Arizona Cardinals kicker Jay Feely is disappointed on the 5-4 vote.

"Never been more disappointed in the leadership of the AIA," he said. "The board members didn’t put the best interests of the high school athletes at the forefront. The mental health consequences of their decision is certainly more detrimental to the high school athletes than Covid. I’m heartbroken for our seniors. The actions of the AIA board didn’t protect the athletes they simply kicked the can down the road to club sports and punished those who love high school sports.

"My message to the five board members is the seniors will never have this opportunity back. You stole something from them that can never be replaced. I hope that resonates deep in your soul. You were put in a role to lead and today you failed in your obligation. Today, you failed the very people you were entrusted to protect."

Arizona NCAA scout for girls basketball Ron Coleman believes kids could lose college recruitment opportunities.

“It's a tough situation for sure but our Covid numbers are the worst in the country," he said. "Collectively, we need to continue promoting our 2021 players to colleges at all levels. Many deserve to play at the next level.”

Steve Sangillo, whose daughter Gabby is one of Goodyear Millennium's top soccer players, pointed out that he would always send his children to Phoenix Children's Hospital for injuries. He said he has had at least one child over the last nine years competing in sports.

“Are the children’s hospitals at the same capacity as regular hospitals?,” he said. “I ask because that being the main sticking point, if my child was injured in a high school sports, we would send them to Phoenix Children’s, not a regular hospital as they are better suited to handle injuries of those under the age of 18.”

Gabby Sangillo, who will be playing college soccer, feels for her fellow seniors who wont' be moving onto the next level.

“I was really disappointed,” she said. “Not only for myself but for the players not playing at the next level, because they won’t have those games.”

Mesa boys wrestling head coach David DiDomenico understands the AIA’s decision and how club sports could be student-athletes’ alternative this winter:

“It won’t end up stopping anything. The logistics and the supervisor of the organization is just going to change. However, I feel with the AIA board. They made a tough decision," DiDomenico said. "And each one of them, I know it weighs on them because they’re caring people. A lot of them are former coaches and teachers. They were us, so it wasn’t a lightly based decision.

"Now what's going to happen is we’ll change vehicles on how we’re going to end up competing. They follow the science, the data, and safety is the No. 1 concern. There is no winning decision. Who knows what it is? We have discrepancies in the least running our own staff. They had to have made that call. It wasn’t a pro-football ‘lemme just get that done.’ It was the (COVID-19) numbers are through the roof.”

Phoenix Brophy Prep still held a soccer practice as planned Friday three hours after the AIA's decision to cancel.

"We had a lot of new faces anxious to be apart of the program for the first time," coach Paul Allen said. "Jumped through a lot of hoops to even get this far. We knew we had an uphill battle in order to complete a season in a pandemic but we were ready for the challenge.

"Heartbroken for our seniors who won’t get to finish the three peat many of them started. We understand the decision and fully support what has been done by the AIA board, just had hoped we could try to be as safe as possible and give this kids something to look forward to."

Chandler Hamilton wrestling coach David DeSilva said he feels bad that the kids have been practicing hard for the season only to have it ripped out from under then 10 days before the start of competition.

"We've actually had a kid with COVID-19 go to the protocols and come back with no problems," he said. "It seems that at this point we need to just bite the bullet and forge forward because these kids are actually handling it pretty well and if someone has any concerns they are free to opt out, which quite a few kids have.

"We were down 50% from last year but everybody that came back, including the parents, are fine the way we are navigating through the beginning of the season. It's a lot of work to try and get the kids into college on some kind of athletic scholarship when they are not competing in their sports."

Desert Vista junior guard Andrew King was declared eligible to return to play for Desert Vista this season after leaving PHH Prep. But now he said if there isn't a club season created by AIA schools, he'll just train on his own to get ready for his senior season.

“To be honest, it’s heartbreaking,” King said. “I feel really bad for the seniors. They don’t get their year. It’s unfair. Football got their season. And they had fans. Then they were saying winter sports would not have fans. I even heard we would have to wear masks in games, which I was fine with that. I thought they would do that. I feel this is unfair. They even promised Jan. 18 would be the date (to begin competition) and that they would only not have a season if Gov. Ducey shut down the state.”

To suggest human-interest story ideas and other news, reach Obert at richard.obert@arizonarepublic.com or 602-316-8827. Follow him on Twitter @azc_obert.

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Michigan coach John Beilein's Pistons interest wasn't fake news

This wasn't a ploy to get more money. Or a way to raise his profile to lure 5-star recruits. Or a rope-a-dope so that John Beilein could remind the University of Michigan who he is.

He doesn't need any of that. Besides, it's not in his nature to sneak around. He's too sincere to be playing games. Remember, this is a coach without an agent.

And so, when Beilein announced Wednesday on Twitter that he was staying at U-M to lead its basketball program, you could hear the collective sigh from the program's fan base.

Because his interest in the Pistons was real. And if you think he wouldn't have strongly considered the job if he'd gotten an offer, then you're not thinking about what drives John Beilein: to teach.

The U-M coach said as much in San Antonio, site of this year's Final Four, when he met with the media a couple of days before the semifinals and talked about his legacy.

"I want to be known as a teacher and mentor,” he said. "Not the coach.”

This wasn't coach-speak. Or some cliché he hoped would take the pressure off if his team didn't win.

He meant it.

That may be difficult to believe in the ulterior-motive world we inhabit. If so, I'd invite you into the hallway outside U-M's locker room inside the Alamodome after his Wolverines lost to Villanova in the national title game.

There stood Beilein, the center of a media scrum, holding his final informal press conference of the season, having come up one game short for the second time in six years, expressing a kind of … joy?

Yes, joy.

Seriously.

Not that there wasn't pain and disappointment. Not that he isn't competitive. Not that he doesn't love to win.

It's just that those things miss the point. For him, a season is about learning, and improving, and watching habits he instills lead to success on the court.

When someone told him his players were crushed they hadn't been able to win the title for him, this was his response:

"Oh, man, don't worry about me. I would love to win a national championship for those guys. For the University of Michigan, for all those great students, for the alums. But, for me? This is why I coach. To be in that locker room with those kids. To have this opportunity to tell them: this is life, (and) all of a sudden, in a blink of an eye, you have this great sadness, your season is over … but in the long run there is a lot of joy."

More:Michigan's John Beilein to Detroit Pistons? With his mind, it'd work

There is a sense that this kind of sentiment doesn't play in the NBA. That's not true. Almost everyone likes learning, likes getting taught.

Whether you're a teenager learning to pivot or set your feet for a jump shot, or a 12-year NBA vet learning to navigate evolving defenses, or a retiree learning to identify birds, or how to use Instagram.

Seeking knowledge doesn't cap out at a particular age. Nor does the desire to impart it.

In that sense, the NBA would've given Beilein a chance to teach the most gifted basketball pupils in the world. That was the appeal. Not the money. Not the stage. But the NBA classroom.

And, yes, it is a classroom. The students are just older and make more money.

No wonder Beilein listened when the Pistons offered to meet with him informally in California a couple of weeks ago. Then met with team brass a second time last week. Then met with team owner, Tom Gores, after that.

It was serious.

It also made sense, considering Beilein's eternal basketball quest. But also remembering how irrelevant the Pistons are beginning to feel.

Gores is desperate to get back to the playoffs. To create some juice around a franchise that's mostly created disappointment in the seven years since he bought the team. Thus, Beilein's ability to teach and develop players held appeal.

In the end, a job offer never came. Beilein announced he was staying. U-M is set to sweeten his contract.

Still, the old coach got to experience a part of the league. He got to talk basketball, share his ideas, think about what he could do and how he would do it at the highest level of the game.

Knowing him, whatever boost in profile he may get from the attention won't matter. Yet he deserved the consideration. Deserved, too, the chance to ruminate about how best to spend the final years of his teaching and coaching career.

Turns out that will be in Ann Arbor, which is obviously good for U-M and its basketball program. As for Beilein?

He'll keep returning to the film room, to his notebooks, to his grease board, to his classroom, forever in search of ideas and of the best ways to teach them.

Contact Shawn Windsor: 313-222-6487 or swindsor@freepress.com. Follow him on Twitter @shawnwindsor.

College basketball in June? There's no shortage of ND topics to ...

Thomas Noie: Happy summer everyone! We made through those dog/dark days of January and February and, if you live around these here parts. March and April and May. But we're here, so what better time to talk some Notre Dame men's basketball. There's no shortage of topics to discuss today - from last week's NBA draft, to the news that broke Wednesday of assistant coach Ryan Humphrey leaving for another coaching position (more details on that coming). To join today's discussion with a question or comment, make sure to include your name (no aliases, please) and hometown. With that, let's light this Notre Dame men's basketball summer chat.

Steve Duff: I’m curious about how you think Blake Wesley will do in the NBA. Also is playing for Pop a good or a bad thing for his development? Thanks Tom!

Thomas Noie: Steve: The first one-and-done in Notre Dame men's basketball history, former Irish guard Blake Wesley was taken in the first round (No. 25 overall) by San Antonio in last week's draft (https://tinyurl.com/mr2ymn6m). At first, the thought was he'd probably have his rookie season to ease into NBA life, maybe spend some time with the Spurs' G League team in Austin, see some time here and there. San Antonio then traded guard Dejounte Murray to Atlanta, which opens a window of opportunity for Wesley. The Spurs seem to be headed toward full rebuild mode, which means, play the kids, which means, Wesley might see significant minutes. Normally, warm and cuddly Gregg Popovich has no use for rookies. Now, though, he seems to have embraced going young, which means Wesley has a chance. No matter how it shakes out, Wesley will be a way better pro in two, three years as his game develops. He needs time. If the Spurs give him that, he could be special.

Linas fr. Orange Cty, CA (Rex Pfluger territory): Hey Tom, Happy Summer :) So I feel a Matt Zona breakout coming this year. Jack Cooley, Martinas Geben and John Mooney had similar profiles and really broke out around junior years. Are you allowed to attend/observe informal summer workouts for ND players? Have you heard any scuttlebutt from Brey or others about Zona's off season or upcoming season's prospects? Thank you

Thomas Noie: Linas: I can hear you now all the way from Orange County - "WE WANT ZONA!!!" Better keep that chant handy. Matt Zona might - stress MIGHT - find a spot in the rotation this season as the third big man behind Nate Laszewski and Ven-Allen Lubin, who apparently is better than advertised to date in summer workouts. Matt Zona would be the first big off the bench if needed - it's going to be a heavy dose of perimeter guys this season, so the backup bigs (Matt Zona, Dom Campbell) might be squeezed for minutes. The Irish have been back on campus for about three weeks. We usually get to see a practice toward the end of summer school. That's where we can see how everything's starting to shake out...

Thomas Noie: ..Early returns? There are eight Irish currently rotating through the white (starter's) jerseys in practices and scrimmage situations. You can pen (not pencil) in Dane Goodwin, Nate Laszewski and Cormac Ryan as starters. There might be a lot of nights where those three never leave the floor. Freshmen Ven-Allen Lubin and J.J. Starling have also been in starter's jerseys a lot. When they go blue, Marcus Hammond (Niagara grad transfer) and Trey Wertz get run with the white jerseys. Sometimes, Matt Zona will slide into the mix. That's how Mike Brey will go for the rest of those summer. Right now, it's those eight.

Jim in Charlottesville: Hi Tom. The Irish seemed to try hard to sign a portal Big. What’s your take on that they didn’t? Anything NIL about it? What do you see for Matt Zona this season? He’s not earned any meaningful minutes thus far, yet several of Mike Brey’s bigs have come of age later in eligibility.

Thomas Noie: Jim: It's still early, but it looks like Matt Zona is the leader in the clubhouse for most popular/asked about offseason guy. Look below (or above) to see some early thoughts on Zona, who's getting closer to the rotation but not all the way there yet. Why isn't he? And why didn't Notre Dame sign a big man out of the portal? Everything changed when Nate Laszewski decided to return for his super senior season. The thinking was that Laszewski might be ready for his next basketball challenge. That he was done with college. When he decided to give it another run, it changed the urgency (really, erased it) to find a big. Laszewski's going to play a lot. Ven-Allen Lubin is going to play a lot, to the point where an All-ACC freshman team spot might be realistic. Add those two bigs, Matt Zona and Dom Campbell as ready reserves and a stacked perimeter and getting a transfer big was not going to happen. Sign a transfer big and he's going to play. A lot. That would've pinched other players in terms of minutes.

Mike: Tom, do you know if Coach Brey put out any more 2023 offers the past 2 recruiting weekends? Has 10 offers out and he needs at least 4, not the greatest odds.

Thomas Noie: Mike: Does he? Need four? The early thinking might be that if Notre Dame can land Xavier Booker and T.J. Power, that might be enough for the 2023 class. Mike Brey would be ecstatic with those two, and would probably be done. Then, he'd turn his attention to a guard (local kid Markus Burton from Penn is someone that the staff is liking more and more, so keep an eye on him). That probably would be it in terms of high school seniors. With the portal being the portal, the Irish would look hard at veteran transfers. Notre Dame may eventually get to a four-man class, but it will be a combination of high school seniors, transfers and maybe a grad transfer.

Tony: Tom, if JR, JJ, Matt, Tony, Dom, and V-A are the only returns. How many recruits and transfers do you see the staff bring in?

Thomas Noie: Tony: Whoa, that's a lot of first names/initials there. Have to take a minute and figure them all out....lol. Probably answered your question with the last question - it would be difficult from a management standpoint to go any deeper than four. Remember when that freshman class with Hubb/Goodwin/Laszewski came in? Yeah, it was ranked as high as the Top 15 in the country, but that was a five-man class. That was way too big. Too many guys to try and keep happy. It kind of played itself out when Robby Carmody got hurt and Chris Doherty transferred. That saved some minutes migraines for Mike Brey. Five freshmen? Too many. The transfer portal will solve that - sign a couple of traditional recruits, then hit the portal and get old and stay old. There also is a chance - a very slim one at that, but a chance - that Cormac Ryan returns for another year. Ryan does have that option, but given the arc of his career, especially as last season ended, this likely will be it for him at Notre Dame. He has pro aspirations.

Nick from Goshen (formerly South Bend): Tom hope summer is off to a good start for you. I’m going to guess this will be a reoccurring topic, but what are ND’s realistic chances of landing Xavier Booker? Blake getting drafted seemingly helps their chances, but I just have a bad feeling ( a Hunter Dickinson feeling) about this one. Thoughts ?

Thomas Noie: Nick: If Notre Dame doesn't land Xavier Booker, it won't be from a lack of effort. Almost from the day he returned for his third stint on Mike Brey's staff, associate head coach Anthony Solomon has made Booker his top priority. If there's an open gym, Slo's there. Cathedral playing for a state championship? Slo's there. He's also at the Top 100 camp in Orlando this week to watch Booker. The thinking now (and it's still kind of early, though Booker already has made an official to Notre Dame) is that it should come down to Notre Dame and Michigan State. Indiana will be there. Duke, too. But it could/should be Michigan State and Notre Dame...

Thomas Noie: ...That Blake Wesley became the first one-and-done in Notre Dame history (and a first-round pick on top of that) can do nothing but help the chances of landing Booker. Mike Brey has a new go-to recruiting pitch. He'll mention how Big Ten guys like Keegan Murray and Johnny Davis and Jaden Ivey all were NBA lottery picks, but they were TWO YEAR college guys. Brey will then say, my guy, Blake Wesley, was a one-and-done and still went in the first round, so come to Notre Dame, play one year and I'll get you to the league. Will it work? Stay tuned...

Bob from chicago: It is hard to see ND as any kind of serious ACC or NCAA threat with zero post presence. Unless Zona or Campbell can be that guy ? What do you think ?

Thomas Noie: Bob: Understood, but you do know that the game has changed - gone are the days where you plant a seven-footer in the lane leave him there. It's all perimeter and stretch fours and bigs who can step out and shoot it. I like Notre Dame's chances in that regard. The Irish won't have someone they can throw it to like they did with Paul Atkinson, but try and guard that perimeter. Watch them pull a big away from the basket with Nate Laszewski stepping out and shooting shots that he passed up last year. Nate's not going to be the post-up guy. Ven-Allen Lubin might not be the post-up guy. But let's see teams try to match that perimeter. An interior presence might be a problem, but the potential of that perimeter? Scary. Notre Dame will find a way to compensate. Just watch.

Victor K. From Salem: where does JR Konieczny fit into next season’s Irish team…or does he?

Thomas Noie: Victor: It was a looooooong learning year for former South Bend Saint Joseph standout J.R. Konieczny. He played in only seven games with totals of 11 points and one rebound in 22 minutes. That was often his stat line for three quarters in high school, but this ain't the Northern Indiana Conference any more. It's going to be really difficult for Konieczny to crack the rotation this season. At 6-foot-6, and maybe now closer to 6-7, Konieczny considers himself a guard, but Notre Dame has a whole bunch of really good guards. With Cormac Ryan, Dane Goodwin, Trey Wertz, Marcus Hammond and J.J. Starling, it's easy to do the math - before the Irish even play a real game, or hold a fall practice, Konieczny is the sixth guard in a group that went only five deep last season. Notre Dame loses Prentiss Hubb and Blake Wesley, but adds a veteran (Hammond) and a McDonald's All-American (Starling). It might be best for Konieczny to take a redshirt season in 2022-23 and stay patient with the process.

Mike S: Hey Tom, has Carmody played at all this summer, and if so, any chance he can crack the rotation this year? Thanks!

Thomas Noie: Mike: Robby Carmody returned for his super senior season, though he really has like nine years of eligibility remaining (not really, but you get the point). There was a thought that he would earn his degree and just walk away from a game that has been so cruel to him from a health standpoint since he arrived. Carmody returned for another year and still is striving to get back to full health. It's been hard. He could get back to 200 percent health and he'd be at a similar crossroads as J.R. Konieczny. Notre Dame is loaded on the perimeter. Carmody can still be an asset as a team/bench/locker room guy who preaches Brey's gospel. He still believes and at this point, for him, that's half the battle.

joe from the south side: Tom, What was the impetus behind Carmody's decision to stay on? I think he knows he will never contribute, on the court, in any way for the program. Is it graduate school? His brother?

Thomas Noie: Joe: Asked and answered. Look at the previous question/comment. He just wants to prove that he can still play. It may not ever materialize, but Carmody just doesn't want to let it go. You know what Red said about hope in Shawshank....

joe from the south side: Tom, How do you think the minutes will play out for the guards? I assume JJS has to start. You don't recruit him to "wait his turn." Goodwin is the leading returning leading scorer. He plays. Ryan showed at the end of last season he has to be on the court. Has to. And Marcus H didn't transfer to get splinters in the butt. Looks to me like last year's Miami team. 4 out, 1 big, and just try to outscore the opposition, since that team won't get any OFF REBs, and won't be able to defend the opposition's interior post play. Looks like Nate L. gets to do all of the grunt work, with Big Zone or a freshman as the backup there, and Wertz as the 5th Guard. How do you see it?

Thomas Noie: Joe: Didn't you kind of answer your own question? LOL. Ryan and Goodwin will be 40-minute guys. Seriously. They're never coming out of the game. Laszewski as well. Forty minutes on a lot of nights. Starling's a starter. Blake Wesley played 30 minutes a game. Starling might be better than Wesley. And you're right - grad transfers under Mike Brey don't come to Notre Dame to be bit players. Hammond's going to play a lot. Trey Wertz is going to play a lot. It's a big dose of four around one...

Thomas Noie: ...As for the interior, I must have missed this - was Paul Atkinson, Jr., the second coming of Dikembe Mutombo? Shaq? Atkinson was just what this team needed last year, but he wasn't THAT much of a game-changing presence. Nate Laszewski was that team's most important player in terms of defense. That will continue this year. And every early indication is that Ven-Allen Lubin will be able to hold up and do the heavy lifting left behind by Zona. There's a reason Notre Dame didn't land a transfer big.

joe from the south side: Tom, Brey has 12 on scholarship, since he whiffed on 3 pitches looking for an experienced Forward. That said, 6 of those 12 are gone. Nate, Robby, Trey, Dane, Marcus, and likely Cormac. Thrown in a disgruntled transfer from the 2 Juniors and he may have 7 or 8 slots to fill. How likely is he to fill those slots and is that any way to run a basketball program based on "get old and stay old"? Also, if this is the new reality of college BBL, is Brey, at 63, up for the challenge? It certainly impacted the decisions of Jay Wright, Muffet, etc..........If they make the NCAA Tourney, and they certainly have enough talent and experience to do that, is it time for him to walk away?

Thomas Noie: Joe: That's a lot of words to spend on....NEXT SEASON!!! LOL. Seriously? Let's see how 2022-23 unfolds before we start wringing our hands about what may or may not happen a full year from now. I'm sure there's a plan. That staff isn't going to wake up a year from now and be like, whoa, where did everybody go? Enjoy the ride this year, then worry about what's coming next. Sound good? Please? 😃

Ray: Hi Tom. What's the chance that Brey will sign a big man from the portal? Brey needs to replace Atkinson unless he thinks Lubin can give us good minutes in the paint. Besides avoiding injuries IMO this is the key to the upcoming season. We have a good team coming back but without someone giving us good minutes in the paint we will get manhandled. If we can compete in the paint against the better ACC teams we will have a good/great season.

Thomas Noie: Ray: Chances? Less than zero. I might go dig up some of our NDI chats from last summer. Think a lot of the same verbiage was used in wondering/worrying about Paul Atkinson. How is someone who played in the Ivy League going to fare in the big, bad rough and tumble Atlantic Coast Conference? He's going to get manhandled!!! It all turned out all right. And those wondering/worrying about interior defense, man, let's give Nate Laszewski at least a little credit. He was a key guy to get back because of what he does on defense. That often went overlooked last season.

Mark Oliver: Hi Tom, Looking forward to this latest chat, but honestly I wish your stay in Omaha had been several days and a few Irish wins longer. Anyway, couple quick things. I'm with you for sure on the not so enthusiastic reaction to seeing Sparty again in the Challenge. I wish we had faced attractive opponents like Wisky and Michigan by now, particularly since ND is by far the closest ACC team geographically to almost all these Big 10 stalwarts and has had football relationships with them as well. I get that the Challenge appears geared to the marquee matchups for Duke, Carolina, UVA, but why isn't there more variety? And second, is there any upside in your mind to Blake's departure for the NBA as far as this year's team goes. Would have been great to have him back, but I also get the vibe that the returnees and new additions can develop a nice chemistry without the presence and possible distractions of a year-long NBA audition. Am I on the right mindset on this? Thanks Tom as always for your insight.

Thomas Noie: Mark: You got me all worked up at Sparty and Challenge. Ooof. How and why they concoct the matchups that they do is beyond baffling. Notre Dame has been in the Atlantic Coast Conference for 10 years. It will be Michigan State three times, Illinois three times, Iowa twice and once each for Maryland and Ohio State. That's it. I love Tom Izzo, but man, change it up...

Thomas Noie: ...As for Blake Wesley, he just had to go to the NBA. It was just time. It was best for all involved. Yeah, it would've been sweet to see Blake Wesley and J.J. Starling in the same backcourt, but at what price? Wesley might've improved his stock, but what would it have done to the team dynamic? Might've been hard to chase the team goal when everyone would've known your individual goal (see Ivey, Jaden). Everything about this season for Wesley was too pure that you couldn't duplicate it. He wasn't thinking one and done in November - he was just trying to get in the starting lineup. Then it all took off. Notre Dame is going to miss Blake Wesley, but Notre Dame might be better this season. That's nobody's fault. Like Bruce Hornsby once crooned, that's just the way it is.

Zach P: Given Blake Wesley’s selection by the San Antonio Spurs in the first round of the NBA draft, what are the chances he returns to ND for a second run? On a serious note, does this make ND a more attractive landing spot for more one and done type players? And how are the three freshmen looking in summer practice?

Thomas Noie: Zach: Don't hold your breath on Wesley returning to Notre Dame...think that door is closed...lol. Really, though, it closed the minute he announced. He was going all-in to chase that and he did. He's a first-round pick. It's a great story, and a great story moving forward for the program. It opens the door for a J.J. Starling this season, maybe Xavier Booker next season. Like, you CAN go to Notre Dame and still be a one-and-done. In this basketball day and age, that's a pretty good gig...

Thomas Noie: ...As for the freshmen, we'll get to see them for ourselves later in July. But Starling and Lubin have been maybe even better than advertised with their court senses. Dom Campbell is coming along, but his path toward playing time/meaningful minutes might be a little longer. And that's OK.

Todd Waynesville, NC: Can’t help but believe the two months Nate spent In “NBA” training will make him leaps and bounds better than he has been. (And he has been a solid player). Thoughts on that premise. Has the coaching staff said anything to that thought? Excited for the 22-23 season. I think it has the makings of a great season.

Thomas Noie: Todd: Early returns are that this is a different Nate Laszewski than we've seen. There's a lot of layers to that. Part of it was working out in Las Vegas for two months. Part of it also is that there's a different dynamic. There's no more Prentiss Hubb. There's no more Paul Atkinson. He's got to be more of a leader (without Hubb) and more of an interior presence (without Atkinson). Just the natural progression/maturation of a college basketball player. He could've decided to chase a two-way or gone to Europe. He believes there's more for him - and for Notre Dame - to do.

Jim Tal, Valley Center, CA.: Hi Tom, thanks for your time and by the way, splendid work on the baseball front. Some may say this is heresy but is it possible that if JJ Starling turns out to be as dynamic as expected, he could greatly minimize the loss of Blake Wesley to the point where the Irish won't be all that diminished by the departure of the latter? In other words, does Starling have the overall game to pick up the slack left by Wesley's exit so that the Irish backcourt suffers no appreciable drop-off?

Thomas Noie: Jim: Thanks for the kind words on the baseball front. It was fascinating to get to know and then watch Link Jarrett up close through June. You could say Notre Dame baseball was better because of this and because of that, but any conversation starts and ends with one person - Link Jarrett. The guy can absolutely lead. He will be missed...

Thomas Noie: ...Back to basketball, J.J. Starling can and should absolutely step into the shoes left behind by Blake Wesley. We're talking about a Top 15 national recruit, a five-star prospect and a McDonald's All-American. From that standpoint, he was better than Blake Wesley. Will that translate to a breakout one-and-done season? Not necessarily. Blake and J.J. are different kind of players. Wesley wanted to get downhill, get in the open court and get to the basket. Starling's more of a bigger picture guy. What does the team need from him in this game? In this half? Wesley was really, really good in his one season. Starling can be really, really good next season. Can't wait to watch him.

Mark Kruz from Mishawaka: Hi Tom what is up with the ACC/Big Ten challenge schedule in which ND is playing Mich St again?? If ND keeps playing the same 4 or 5 teams over and over the challenge will become a stale event just like the Crossroads Classic has been the past few years. Will there be a return trip by Georgia in the 23-24 season? Also you mentioned to keep an eye on Markus Burton from Penn HS. Do you think he can play at the Power 5 level?? I seen he had a really good weekend down in Indy at a Indiana HS classic tourney especially against Cathedral and Xavier Booker.

Thomas Noie: Mark: It's like the leagues forget about the ACC/Big Ten Challenge matchups on the agenda. Then, while the decision-makers are walking out the door, they're reminded that, hey, we need to get the pairings complete. Somebody says, what did we do three years ago? Four years ago? Let's just scratch off whatever that year was and scribble 2022. Let's go with it. Nothing against Michigan State, but Notre Dame has done that dance. Let's hear some different music, see some different moves. You're so right - stale's a great word. There's no thought or creativity. As for the Georgia game, that's a neutral-site game at State Farm Arena in downtown Atlanta. It's part of a doubleheader, so it's a one-time thing. No return game. But a cool day of hoops in place of the Crossroads. And an easy flight from SBN, so there's that.

Jim in Charlottesville: Hello again, Tom. While Mike Brey’s Assistants keep low profiles (e.g. not available to media, seldom mentioned in game day planning, post game recount, and recruiting), they hugely contribute to individual player development. Ryan Humphrey boosted Jack Cooley Martinus Geben, and Paul Atkinson, Jr. How important is it that Brey hire acBigs Coach to succeed him??

Thomas Noie: Jim: The replacement for Ryan Humphrey, who will leave the program soon for another opportunity, doesn't necessarily need to have a background coaching bigs. Doing those jobs - coaching bigs, coaching perimeter - is pretty interchangeable. Coaching basketball is coaching basketball. It's more important that the new AC bring a similar passion and personality to all aspects of the job as Hump did. He will be missed, but when someone leaves, in any position in any profession, it offers you a chance to get better. Notre Dame has that chance.

Guest: what does the outlook look like for robby carmody this season? Any chance he plays?

Thomas Noie: Can Robby Carmody take it a step further this season after last year? That would be a positive for him. It's next to impossible to expect that he can be a rotation player. He basically hasn't played major minutes in what, four years? Five? You lose track. Just give him the hope that he can continue to work his way back, and see where it all ends up.

Ryan Mars pa: tom how has the team looked so far i am interested in watching starling lubin Hammond and Campbell when season starts go Irish

Thomas Noie: Ryan: So, in other words, all the new guys grab your interest, right? LOL. Early returns have been nothing but positive with all four. Starling and Lubin are as advertised, so too is Hammond, a veteran/experienced/confident guard who can score it and get to the rim. Campbell? We'll see. The practice we're scheduled to see in July will offer a better indication. Last year, we watched Blake Wesley for that one day and it was apparent, like, whoa, that kid's different. Special. I hope to feel that again this time around with a couple of the new guys.

Mike in Pittsburgh: Tom, any chance Blake Wesley comes back for his sophomore year? (I kidd, I kidd). What are your thoughts on Tony Sanders? Is there a role for him on this team? Defend and rebound are his keys to minutes but he seems to be a guy (they have had them in the past) that is okay at everything but not great at anything.

Thomas Noie: Mike: Wait, Blake Wesley's gone? As in, not coming back? WHen did this happen? Does Mike Brey know about it??? LOLOLOL. Tony Sanders may be heading into his junior year, but he remains the proverbial blank slate. I don't know where or how he may fit, mainly because he's played behind veteran guys the first two years and likely will do the same this season. Defending and rebounding may be keys to his minutes, but if you can't prove you can do something on the offensive end, it's going to be difficult to find you some minutes. That's where the Irish are with Sanders. Give him credit - he just works. No public gripes. No complaints. No disrupting the locker room. It's almost fitting that Sanders and Matt Zona are so close. They're like the same player - keep working, keep progressing and see where it all takes them. At the end of the day, it's important to both that they get their degrees. Basketball is a bonus.

PortND: Any info on where Hump is going to end up and any big man Coach options you've heard of?

Thomas Noie: Port: It's way too early on AC options, though I will say Notre Dame won't be looking exclusively at a "big man" coach. Does he know the game? Can he mesh with the fabric (sorry, had to say it) with the current staff? How does he do as a recruiter? Player development? The next AC is not expected to have Notre Dame ties. Mike Brey will take next month to consider all options.

PortND: Seems many thought Carmody would have moved on, how's his health? I certainly don't see how he has a role on this team.

Thomas Noie: That he's still at Notre Dame tells you all you need to know about his health. He still believes he can contribute in some way, shape or form to the success of the program. That might not be in minutes played. He's a high character guy that can be an example to guys who get down on themselves.

PortND: Last one for me, I have to think JR is just too talented to not somehow carve out a role with this team. In my opinion I could see him jumping someone like Wertz who really needs to step up.

Thomas Noie: Port: Probably wishful thinking there, but we'll see how it plays out. That Konieczny is not expected to spend summer session in a white (starter's) jersey is kind of the proverbial writing on the wall as to what the expectation for him is this season. He's stuck behind a veteran, deep, talented perimeter. He'd have to make the push of pushes to scramble into the rotation.

Clint from Winnipeg: What do you see as the fit and role of Marcus Hammond this season? Does he take playing time away from JJ Starling? How much would they be on the floor together?

Thomas Noie: Clint: Does somebody take playing time away from a five-star, Top 15 McDonald's All-American? Uh.....Yeah, that answer is a hard no. No, Marcus Hammond isn't taking minutes from J.J. Starling. Marcus is a really good, talented, experienced, veteran guard who will be a really good addition. But, it's J.J. STARLING. Cormac Ryan and Dane Goodwin will be 40-minute guys. Starling will play a lot. Then how does it fill in around that? Hammond will play. Trey Wertz will play. How those minutes will be dispersed will remain to be seen. So will how many minutes the guards will play together. What's best for this team? Is it playing four around one? Playing two bigs? That will be determined in November and December.

PortND: I lied, not my last question.....................reports have been Lubin being better than advertised, any idea what sort of size he's at??? When recruited thought more of a wing but spunds like he's more of a big for ND.

Thomas Noie: Port: Those who would and should be in the know have Ven-Allen Lubin at 6-9 and 210 pounds. That Notre Dame didn't add a grad transfer or traditional transfer big is an indication of how important Lubin is to the plan. He's going to get a really big chance, maybe really early.

Jeff from Schererville, IN: Hi Tom and thanks for having this summer chat. So you're saying the Michigan St-ND ACC-Big Ten Challenge game might be renamed the Xavier Booker Classic? In all seriousness, I'm wondering if you can expound upon your tweet showing disappointment in having that matchup this year other than we've seen that movie before back in 2014 at ND and a couple other times in East Lansing. As a season ticket holder and ND hoops fan, I wouldn't mind seeing someone new like a Wisconsin or Maryland (though it still doesn't feel right they're in the Big Ten) or a school I'll mention later, but this is a marquee non-conf home game we don't often get, and I'm not sure any other team besides IU, Purdue or Michigan would generate the same energy in the building as Sparty, even if it's a repeat of a previous matchup.

Thomas Noie: Jeff: Simple. Notre Dame has done the Michigan State dance. It's the ACC/Big Ten Challenge, but it feels more like a conference game between two schools that aren't conference colleagues. Even Mike Brey sighed when he learned that it's Michigan State yet again. What's wrong with a rematch with Rutgers after what those teams did in the First Four. Now that the Crossroads Classic has ceased (praise the Lord), think a home game against Purdue would've moved the meter? Or a visit from Wisconsin for the first time since 1968? Part of the attraction of playing in the ACC/Big Ten from a Notre Dame perspective was running though a host of schools close to campus that would pique interest. But playing Michigan State for a third time in the challenge, and a fourth overall, has a been-there/done-that feel. Let's try something else. It's not that hard. And Notre Dame fans should be beyond being glad about a non-league opponent generating energy in their own building. But that's a rant for another day...😃

Jack: Hey Tom - Are the main non-conference games all set? I think you tweeted that there are three yet to be announced - Is it expected that those will be "bye" games at home against low RPI teams, or could one or two be a major opponent?

Thomas Noie: Jack: You must have my tweet confused with someone else...don't think I'd ever count down the number of non-con games remaining...ugh. LOL. By my count, and again, it's late June and I'm still trying to get clear of baseball mode and Omaha and everything CWS, Notre Dame has non-league games set against Georgia (neutral), St. Bonaventure (neutral), Marquette (home) and Michigan State (home). Given the ACC slate, where the repeat opponents will be Boston College, Georgia Tech, Florida State, North Carolina, Syracuse and Wake Forest, they're pretty much done in terms of power. The other home buy games will fill out November and early December, but even that comes with a wrinkle. ACC teams are scheduled to play three league games in December.

joe from the south side: Tom, With the 4 Guard, 1 Big lineup that looks to be the bread and butter for this year's squad, I thought, who would be the perfect big to complement the 4 guards. My pick. Ty Nash. Unselfish, athletic, can guard the opposing big, rebounds, and averaged, AVERAGED 2.6 APG as a Point Center. In the Big East. You could use him handling the ball at the top of the key and basically empty the paint for drivers and slashers. Your thoughts?

Thomas Noie: There was nobody better - or more underappreciated - than my man T-Nash. He was really good. The ultimate lunch pail/dirty work guy. Never needed touches. Never demanded the ball. Just found a way to operate around the four perimeter guys. He could play/thrive in 2010-11. He could do it in 2022-23. There's a reason he's still playing professionally after all these years. He's a true pro.

Paul: Are Georgia and Michigan State it for "promising" nonconference games? Any other rumors?

Thomas Noie: "Promising?" That's a new term for....what? Notre Dame also is playing Marquette at home and St. Bonaventure at UBS Arena on Long Island on Black Friday.

JDub, Ft. Wayne: I would like your thoughts on Ryan Humphrey's departure. Last time we talked you mentioned there was little chance of staff turnover, so I would assume you are surprised by this? How much do you think it hurts recruiting in that Humphrey seemed to relate well with the recruits?

Thomas Noie: JDub: It was stunning to learn that Ryan Humphrey is leaving for another coaching opportunity (more on that when it's finalized). Staffs just don't turn over at this time of year. That's like having a high school team lose its head coach this week (which actually happened to a South bend school, but I digress) Hump's the definition of a Notre Dame man. He went to Notre Dame. He coached at Notre Dame. He lived Notre Dame. But there comes a time when you have to see what else is out there if you want to max out your coaching potential. It's a big loss, but only if Mike Brey doesn't add someone who will also do the job and do it well. In terms of relating to recruits, don't forget about Antoni Wyche, who played at and graduated from Notre Dame. Hump's leaving, but that staff is still pretty strong.

Paul, here in the Bend: Got a few minutes to kill before golf, it's been a great season for that here! Georgia, Michigan State in the nonconference....am I missing anyone? Any rumors? I know Mike will want to have 10 wins going into ACC if possible.

Thomas Noie: Paul: Hope you got out early. It's already close to 90 here in the Bend. Marquette and St. Bonaventure as well in terms of non-league. Getting to 10 wins before league play starts might be a stretch in that league play will start with three Atlantic Coast Conference games in December. And don't forget, this team had only six overall wins before Jan. 1 - and last season turned out OK. 😃

Matt from North Dakota: Hey Tom, I understand you probably can’t get into a ton of info but I was shocked by the timing of Coach Humphrey’s departure. Any ideas where Coach Brey looks?

Thomas Noie: Matt: Still relatively early - he only made his plans known Wednesday, but Mike Brey did say that he'll look beyond his circle of former Notre Dame players for the hire and won't be rushed to make a decision. It will be intriguing/interesting to see where he goes. With Humphrey, Antoni Wyche and Anthony Solomon, you had a staff of three really strong personalities. Three Alphas. Who joins that group? Can't wait to see.

Robb, Colorado: Hey Tom, Surprised to see Humphrey leaving at this point. Any intel on that?

Thomas Noie: Robb: Stunned at the timing but not all that surprising. Stick around long enough in this profession and you realize that everybody eventually leaves - coaches, players, writers, bosses, administrators. Everybody does it.

Todd: Any idea on who the other two teams are in Atlanta? I am about 2.5 hours driving time from ATL and will definitely make that trip. Also, when will the ACC game schedule come out? Got to mark my calendar for all those I can attend. Great to be a ND fan in ACC country!!!!

Thomas Noie: Todd: It will be Georgia Tech against an opponent TBD in the other game of the doubleheader at State Farm Arena on Dec. 18. Notre Dame will play Georgia that day, then remain in the Atlanta area to play a league game against Georgia Tech at McCamish Pavilion on Dec. 21. The Atlantic Coast Conference schedule usually comes out a week or two after Labor Day. Repeat opponents will be Boston College, Georgia Tech, Florida State, North Carolina, Syracuse and Wake Forest...start making plans!

Guest: Tom, if you had to pick the best player from the Brey era… and also your favorite. Not necessarily the same guy but if it is cool.

IMO I’d go Murphy as best and T Jackson as favorite

Thomas Noie: I'll go only the best player, and not favorite, because I can't play favorites. I just can't. Have to treat them all equally, but there was something different being able to cover guys like Ryan Humphrey, David Graves, Matt Carroll, Chris Thomas, Pat Connaughton, Tory Jackson, John Mooney, Bonzie Colson and Ben Hansbrough just to name a few. Best? That's easy. Nobody better than Troy Murphy. He was a future pro the minute he walked in the door. He was good, he was goofy, he was Murph.

Matt from North Dakota: Tom, curious as to when the ACC releases the conference schedule? Late July right? Also, when is the next time the Irish can go on a foreign tour?

Thomas Noie: Matt: Schedule usually drops sometime after Labor Day. It gets later and later each year. Notre Dame is overdue for a foreign tour - that might be in the cards for next season. Veteran teams don't need/seek foreign tours. Gotta wait until they're young and the extra games/practices will have a pay off. No reason for these guys who are going to log heavy minutes as it is to spend any additional time on the court.

Jim Tal, Valley Center, CA.: Tom, who do you see having a more successful career in the pros, Atlkinson or Hubb? Also, since you've been covering ND, which former Irish player did you think would make a real impact in the NBA but wasn't able to do so?

Thomas Noie: Jim: Good question, but hard answer. There really might not be one. It's hard, because neither Paul Atkinson or Prentiss Hubb will play in the NBA. So then it comes down to, what are they looking for in their professional careers? How good are their situations in Europe? Do they still love the game when the game becomes the life? Atkinson has a degree from Yale and a graduate degree from Notre Dame. Is he still hungry to play? There's just so many factors. A lot of times, the love fades, and guys decide, yeah, it might be time to do something else. I can see both sticking it out, or both saying, yeah, next chapter time. It's so hard to say. How's that for a middle of the road answer?😃

PortND: That size from Lubin says alot about why the urgency once Laz decided to return wasn't there to bring a big into the program. Been a long time since we've had a bouncy 6'9" athlete on the team.

Thomas Noie: Port: Ven-Allen Lubin is going to play and play a lot. Right away. Watch.

joe from the south side: Tom, As unexciting as ND MSU is in the ACC/Big10 challenge, could you imagine if they sent ND to Lincoln, NEB or State College? YUCK!

Thomas Noie: Joe: That's bottom-feeder stuff reserved for the Pittsburghs and Clemsons and Boston Colleges of the Atlantic Coast Conference. There's so many good Big Ten road trips beckoning that make so much more sense - Michigan, Minnesota, Northwestern, Wisconsin, even Purdue and Indiana become options now that the Crossroads is done. You get sent to Lincoln or State College, that's an indictment of your program. Let's hope Notre Dame never gets there.

Jeff from Schererville, IN: Thanks for the additional explanation. I do think the powers that be try to create evenly-matched games based on how they think teams will be ranked in the preseason while at the same time trying to alternate home and road games for teams year by year. This year I know there's a Nike event in Oregon Thanksgiving weekend that features Duke and Purdue in one bracket and Mich St and UNC in another, so they probably didn't want to schedule those teams to play each other less than a week after they might play in another event. They wouldn't match up Duke and Mich St to play in the ACC-Big Ten thing the same year they play in the Champions Classic either, and the same goes for when Ohio St plays UNC in the CBS Sports Classic. We chatheads can do better but it might be harder than it looks. The fact ND gets a marquee team even if it's a repeat I think speaks to ND's ability and watchability and overall interest level nationwide.

Thomas Noie: Here's an easy flix/flip - send Michigan State to Florida State and move Purdue to Notre Dame. See, it's not that hard! 😃

Clint from Winnipeg: Have the new basketball facilities had a positive impact on recruiting? Or is it more a case of no longer having the old facilities being a drag on recruiting?

Thomas Noie: Clint: Little of both. Notre Dame's a place where prospects want the full campus experience. They're as impressed with a conversation they may have with a business professor as they are with the stand-alone practice facility. So it's just a piece of the entire puzzle. But it does help. When Paul Atkinson walked into Rolfs Hall for the first time, he couldn't believe it. Like, the training table food, he could eat anytime? He could make a smoothie after a late-night workout? He was blown away. Same holds true now with Marcus Hammond. He couldn't believe how ACC teams live after four seasons at Niagara. It blew him away. Covering an ACC team, you have a tendency to take that stuff for granted, like, that's just how it is at that level. But a level or two down, they'd crawl across campus to have what Notre Dame has.

Jeff from Schererville, IN: I would've been ok with MSU-FSU and Purdue-ND for sure!

Thomas Noie: Get Jim Phillips on the phone now! Kevin Warren as well. We can fix this!😃

joe from the south side: Tom, I get that Lincoln and State College are reserved for the low end squads. But, I think it's also indicative of the apathy that has set in among the 2 leagues as to genuinely trying to generate some excitement. To me, it looks like they are just going thru the motions for these matchups. Which is why I would put nothing past them since care and concern went out the window a long time ago.

Thomas Noie: Joe: Understood, but at the same time, it's television's fault going for the must-see matchups. The country's still fully invested in football, be it the NFL or college or the upcoming conference championship games or the impending bowl announcements. It doesn't matter what the matchups are, the casual fan isn't suddenly dropping his football fix for hoops. And from an ACC perspective, there's only so many Big Ten schools (not many) that move the meter at Duke or Carolina. So it limits matchups. That's what you get when you have TV pulling all the strings. They do just go through the motions.

Paul R: Any concern about JR, Zona, Sanders leaving for more playing time after this year? Or wait and see how this season goes before we worry about 2023 roster construction

Thomas Noie: Paul: Given today's transfer portal world, there's always a concern (often on a daily basis) if somebody from your roster or somebody from somebody else's roster is in the portal. It's just the way of the free agency world that's college basketball. Don't like your situation? Leave. Don't want to work harder? Leave. Not saying anybody is unhappy on the current roster (it's way too early for that), but that's the game today. Get out and get somewhere else. Here's the thing, though. If this rotation remains status quo, there won't be enough minutes for Zona or Sanders or Konieczny. There just won't be. Will they want to stick it out and see if it changes next year? I think so, but you never really know. That's portal life of college basketball 2022.

Matt from St. Louis: Thoughts on scheduling the Georgia game? Feels a bit like the Crossroads Classic in that it is a "neutral site" game for quadrant purposes but basically a road game so I thought it was odd. As for the Big 10/ACC challenge, I'm sure Purdue wouldn't mind your quick fix either considering they played Florida State last year!

Thomas Noie: Matt: Like it, especially since there's no more slog of a drive (usually in dicey weather) down 31 to watch Notre Dame play what essentially was a road game in a "neutral" site game. Don't think the clamor for Georgia basketball in downtown ATL comes close. It would be odd if it was a one-off weekend game, but Notre Dame is scheduled to play at Georgia Tech days later, so why not get a few days in a big city, play in an NBA arena, turn the page and get focused for a league game all before Christmas break? Looks good on paper. Let's see what Dec. 18 brings...😃

Tom from Gary: With Prentiss Hubb graduated, who do you think will be the point guard/primary ball handler for this season?

Thomas Noie: Tom: Great question. The ball goes into the hands of Cormac Ryan given what he did and how he played at the end of the year. Like, we really didn't know he had THAT in him. That was Ben Hansbrough-esque the way he just kind of drove that program. Like, he wasn't going to let them lose. They almost got to the Sweet 16. He'll be the main handler/facilitator, but there will be others. J.J. Starling was supposed to be that guy, but the more I watched Starling last year at La Lumiere, the more I realized he's more than just a point guard. He can play off it, move and cut and get it back, then make a decision. Marcus Hammond might be a problem in the open court. Like Prentiss Hubb, he's a lefty, but unlike P-Hubb, he's built closer to a football player. He has the physicality to get to the rim more, and be more productive. Trey Wertz is sneaky productive as a handler as well. But the ball first goes to Ryan.

Taylor - Elkhart: Tom, I believe ND hosted a center from Harvard a month ago. I apologize I can’t remember his name, but do you recall? If so, chances he could join as a grad transfer?

Thomas Noie: Taylor: Michael Wang, who was hurt a lot at Penn and had an official at Notre Dame. It never got beyond that. Wang returned to his national team in China instead of doing the grad transfer stuff. Might work out better in the end for Notre Dame. Wang comes to Notre Dame, he would've needed heavy minutes, maybe at the expense of Ven-Allen Lubin.

Tom from South Bend: I thought Humphrey was headed to Long Island, but they just announced Rod Strickland as their new coach.

Thomas Noie: Good one. No.😃

Mike in Wisconsin: Five-man recruiting classes are common in college basketball and other coaches manage them fine. Given how you and others who watch these guys in practice have evaluated the returning reserve players, combined with the loss of Laszewski, Goodwin, Ryan, Wertz, and Hammond, it would seem foolish to arbitrarily place a limit of two on the next recruiting class.

Thomas Noie: Mike: Ah yes, the proverbial "other coaches." Yep, because it works with program A, B and C it should work for Notre Dame. Sure. Arbitrarily? Does a conversation with the head coach who outlined how he views what the 2023 recruiting class count? Or does that fall into the other coaches category? Asking for a foolish friend. 😕

Mike from Mount Holly: In my opinion, one of the many traits about that great 2015 team was its ability to put 2 super-quick athletes (Demetrius Jackson and Jerian Grant) at the top of their 2-3 zone. It was a difference maker! It looks like we may be able to approach that level with this year's roster, too...though it sure would be nice to have a Zach Auguste-type waiting in the paint to erase anything that got through... :)

Thomas Noie: Mike: Can we get Pat Connaughton back for another year too? Steve Vasturia? A lot of that was Jerian Grant, who was an All-American, kind of just orchestrating everything. Have ZA in the back line was good as well, so was being able to call on a relatively unknown freshman named Bonzie Colson. Still the gold standard team in program history. And yeah, that includes 1978. Sorry Digger.

p.rose: I think Wertz has the potential to shine this year. He got into his own head too much last year, but had some pretty great assists and was reliable as a ball handler. I'm predicting he'll surprise fans with his productivity.

Thomas Noie: That would be huge. If Blake Wesley had come back, Trey Wertz likely wouldn't have. But now along comes Marcus Hammond. Wertz's body language often isn't the best. He showed flashes, but too often drifted. Like, he was just kind of there. Did hit a big shot in San Diego. Now build off it.

joe from the south side: Tom, I'll take Pat C. off of that team any day. Heart of a lion, didn't know what "quit" meant, freak of an athlete, ice in his veins, etc, etc. etc.....What always amazed me about him is he was this skinny white boy, who kind of looked like he just woke up in time for the game, and at the end of the game 15-16 points, hit big shots and 8 or 9 rebounds against Duke or NC's front court. That guy was a coach's dream.

Thomas Noie: Joe: The best. Leader. Senior. Captain. Doubt him and he'd make you regret it.

PortND: Crystal ball time, this ND team a sweet 16 unit?

Thomas Noie: In June...why not? Let's go.😃

Mike from Mount Holly: I remember watching that Kentucky tourney game and thinking to myself (at the end) "That's as close as we're ever going to get to going all the way. ND just doesn't get a team like THAT". How much fun would it be if this year's team, with the remaining members of that top-15 freshman class and the influx of new blood, could make a run like that?? I get goose bumps just thinking about it.......

Thomas Noie: Still the best team I've covered, and not even close. Remember thinking, holy cow, they're going to the Final Four. And if they had, they would've won the national championship. Easy to say now, but you could sense it with that team. You could see it. Even today, it's hard for Irish fans to look back at how that season ended. But I often look back on it and remember what it was like in Greensboro that weekend, then the weekend in Pittsburgh, then Cleveland, and the ride home the next day. As a beat guy, all you ask for is a good ride of a season. That one was better than any. Ever.

Mike in Wisconsin: Sure, sure Tom. At no point did I say that everything that works at other programs will work at ND, so you can dispense with that strawman. Why precisely again would a four or five-man class put the roster outside an optimal level of scholarship players? Am I correct that your previously stated position was that you have too many players competing for minutes? Was that sarcasm?

Thomas Noie: Mike: Read more, post less. Have a great day.

joe from the south side: Tom, If I am not mistaken, Pat C. was one of Mike Crotty's guys. Can you speak to Crotty's relationship with Brey, and if I am not mistaken, one or two of the guys Brey is currently recruiting, also play for Middlesex Magic. I think Dom C came from there as well. Can you expand on that?

Thomas Noie: Joe: Michael Crotty is the head coach of the Middlesex magic AAU program in Massachusetts. He coached Pat Connaughton. He coached Cormac Ryan. He coached Dom Campbell. He's as good as they come. Just gets it. Has been around the game his whole life. Doesn't so much coach kids in the game of basketball as he does the game of life. Gets them to see the bigger picture, not just what happens in the gym. Anytime Notre Dame gets a Middlesex Magic kid, and I get a chance to talk hoops with Michael Crotty is a good day.

Mike in Wisconsin: I mean, how could anyone question Brey's roster management, particularly over recent history? Certainly no keen-eyed beat reporters ever broached that subject...

Thomas Noie: If you know, you know...if you don't, well you're Mike from Wisconsin. Read closer. Post less. It really does work.

Dan - Chicago: I had in my mind that Hammond would be the 5th starter, but from this chat I am sensing that spot might go to Lubin. It is close?

Thomas Noie: Dan: Absolutely, It's not even June - not for another 10 hours. That starting lineup isn't in pen. It all depends on what the staff feels is the best way to move forward. Do they want to play two bigs? Ven-Allen Lubin starts. Do they want to go four around one? If that's the case, maybe Trey Wertz gets the first chance at a starting job. Then Marcus Hammond. Or vice versa. Marcus Hammond is going to play. A lot. Grad transfers usually aren't part-time guys. I'm anxious to see them in person and see who can do what, who can bring what. It's going to be interesting.

John from Naperville: With Ryan, Goodwin, Wertz, Hammond and potentially Starling leaving after this year, where does this put the backcourt starting in 2023. Ryan will technically have another year. Will Wertz? The staff doesn't seem to be actively targeting guards outside Burton and Jackson. Grad Transfers? What am I missing?

Thomas Noie: John: Cormac Ryan technically has another year, one that he probably (likely) won't use. Trey Wertz has only this season remaining. As mentioned earlier (and apparently ignored by upper midwest readers), Mike Brey may only go two deep in the 2023 recruiting class (Xavier Booker, T.J. Power) and use the remaining grants for a guard (Markus Burton) and then grad transfers/traditional transfers and see what they can get out of the returning guys.

Matt from St. Louis: 2024 Big 10/ACC matchup of ND vs UCLA??

Thomas Noie: Matt: Post of the day. Well played. We should just shut it down right now, but we press on. That was awesome! And yes, please, sign us up for Notre Dame and UCLA in the ACC/Big Ten Challenge. Every. Single. Year.👍

Jim Tal, Valley Center, CA.: Damn, Tom Noie the marathon man. Just got in from a lengthy power walk to find that you're still at it. I mean talk about logging some heavy minutes! Ok, I'm still game. If ND is to have another rewarding and redeeming season like the past one, what are the absolute keys that must happen? Can you pick out three or four critical elements that definitely need to take place?

Thomas Noie: Jim: I've moved from the home office to the patio with the sun beating down on an 89-degree day, but we're not stopping now. Three keys (1) The Big Three (Goodwin, Laszewski, Ryan) max out their college careers with career best years. (2) J.J. Starling is as good as advertised and plays in a way that allows everyone to forget (just a little bit) about Blake Wesley (3) Notre Dame continues its Road Dawg mentality in ACC play and picks off six or seven league wins away from Purcell Pavilion. Bonus - Marcus Hammond or Ven-Allen Lubin have a wow type of Blake Wesley season.

Bob from chicago: Ok Tom. I get where we might be tough to guard, but teams with bigs like Illinois and Purdue were impossible for us to stop and defensive rebounding is a huge problem. The trade three for two is not a winning proposition against good teams.

Thomas Noie: Bob: True, but if I had a dime for every season where defensive rebounding/bench depth was an issue, I'd be the Notre Dame men's basketball beat writer. Oh, wait....This is a different type of team with guys who can get to the basket and also finish. It's not chuck it from deep and trade twos for those threes. Marcus Hammond, drive and kick. J.J. Starling, drive and kick. Cormac Ryan, drive and kick. All three will finish better than Prentiss Hubb. Let's see how it plays out.

Jeff from Schererville, IN: Haha I think Kevin Warren might be busy today planning for a future USC or UCLA at Notre Dame ACC-Big Ten Challenge matchup.

Thomas Noie: Stunning.\

Todd: Or what about a ND-USC football/basketball doubleheader in Los Angeles over Thanksgiving Break?????

Thomas Noie: Where do I sign up? Can't make those reservations quick enough.

Jim Tal, Valley Center, CA.: Tom, really enjoying this extended ride. One more from me. I've always wondered if it's really in Brey to bring the hammer down on a player if, for whatever reason, he deserves it. I mean, can the loosest and one of the most personable coaches in America really crack the whip if necessary? It's just near impossible for me to envision Brey playing the bad cop role. I would have loved to have played for a guy like him, but can you give me any insight into moments where he has really gotten after some guys? I know he must have done it but it's really hard for me to envision that side of him. Have you seen any examples of him being really hardnosed?

Thomas Noie: Jim: Yeah, don't get sucked into the whole Loosest Coach in America narrative with him. It makes for a nice national storyline, but Mike Brey can be the bad cop when needed. He needed to three times last season - after the Boston College game, after the great escape at Howard and heading into the NCAA tournament after the disappearing act against Virginia Tech. He basically threw everyone out of practice in the days leading to the Kentucky game. He told them after Howard that they all could up and transfer if they wanted. Ditto for after the ACCT. Don't let the looseness fool you. When Mike Brey wants to light somebody up, they're getting lit up. He just does it away from the cameras. But it definitely happens, a lot more often than anyone would ever imagine.

Jake: Do you think that having a better collection of guards more adept at getting to the rim will push the PPG average closer to or near 80 for the season? My thinking was that we should average more free throws (unless we get treated like football isn't fully in the ACC haha), along with presumably having 4 established collegiate scorers starting around a 5-star. Feel like maybe 80 or a number in the high 70's points could be like the 10 3-pointers stat from last year. I know that ND isn't known for their blazing tempo, but maybe the efficiency from 2-point range could bring the PPG up a bit. Also maybe scoring more than 43 against Duke could be helpful.

Thomas Noie: Jake: Good stuff. Notre Dame averaged 72.8 ppg last season, and the core of the returners all are a year older and a year wiser. So they should be better. The next guys are as skilled/talented as Blake Wesley. Think they can find eight more points a game. Maybe if they play a heavy dose of four around one, they play quicker. But you're right, they'll always be treated as the step-child of the ACC. No calls for you! Kidding (not kidding)

Wadelite from Long Beach: Tom, realized you addressed this already: but it seems you are saying that Carmody might be enough of a factor for spot minutes in a 4 around one offense that Brey may pitch the Abromaitis sophomore redshirt to JR. Also, why I can see Zona being some what effective versus mid major teams he will be eaten up versus major conference big men. Brey will then go down to 7 guys or throw some occasional crumbs to Carmody or Sanders or JR if he is active. A not ready for prime time big man is much more exposed than a wing bench guy.

Thomas Noie: Wade: It's going to be really, really difficult for Robby Carmody to get his health in a position where he can play. And even then, he's so far removed from everything. Those eight are going to be those eight, unless somebody comes from nowhere and claims a spot. A lot of what Notre Dame looked like last year, it will look like this year. Subtract Atkinson and Hubb and add Starling, Lubin and Hammond.

Mike in Pittsburgh: Tom - This is Mike from Pittsburgh, not to be confused with Mike from Wisconsin. Where would you slate ND in the hierarchy of the ACC this year. Clearly think Carolina is #1. Duke will be up there because they are well, Duke. But I think this ND team can be every bit as competitive for a 3/4 spot as anyone else. Louisville will be down, not all that excited about Syracuse. UVA maybe? Who am I missing?

Thomas Noie: Oh, yeah, North Carolina is the clear-cut favorite. Duke will be No. 2 because it's Duke. Miami will be good. Virginia Tech will be good. Virginia will be penciled into one of the top five spots because it's Virginia. Florida State will get the benefit of the doubt that last year was an outlier. I'd say Notre Dame would be slotted in a 6-7-8 spot, which is fine.

Thomas Noie: Think that will do it for today. We passed the six-hour mark with relative ease. Solid effort. We'll try and sneak one more chat in before that certain sport on campus gets going in early August. Stay tuned to Twitter (@tnoieNDI) for exact date and time later in July. Thanks to all who participated. Have a great holiday weekend!

Follow South Bend Tribune and NDInsider columnist Tom Noie on Twitter: @tnoieNDI. Contact: (574) 235-6153.

ASU Rose Bowl teams celebrate major anniversaries

The Arizona State Rose Bowl teams are like starships linked with some sort of time-bending tractor beam that binds them together in a never-ending journey.

When one celebrates an anniversary so does the other. It's been that way since 1996 when the Sun Devils went undefeated in the regular season, advancing to ASU Rose Bowl II against Ohio State, coached by John Cooper. That came 10 years after Rose Bowl I, when Cooper coached the Sun Devils to a win over Michigan. The connection only deepens with each five- and 10-year increment, especially since Rose Bowl III remains elusive 20 years after what fans believed would become a more frequent occurrence.

Memories of the 1996 team are in sharper focus because they are more recent and because ASU came so close – 100 seconds – to a national championship. It's easier to forget how good the Sun Devils were in 1986. "We were the best team in the country that year," Cooper flatly says. "If we had a playoff back then, we'd at least have played for it. I still thought we were the best team even though we lost after we had the Rose Bowl cinched. That's what killed us."

Actually ASU fell two spots to No. 7 in the Associated Press poll after losing 34-17 in the 60th Territorial Cup and almost certainly would not have been in a 1986 final four playoff. That instead would have paired Miami against Michigan and Penn State vs. Oklahoma. But what Cooper wouldn't have given for a shot at Penn State after watching in person at Sun Devil Stadium, on the night following ASU's 22-15 Rose Bowl win, as the No. 2 Nittany Lions intercepted Heisman Trophy winner Vinny Testaverde five times in a 14-10 upset of No. 1 Miami.

Imagine how different ASU football would be perceived as a two-time (or three if you believe the undefeated 1975 team was robbed) national champion instead of finishing No. 4 in 1986 and '96 final AP polls.

"It didn't end up with a victory and a national championship, but it ended up in what I truly believe to be one of the greatest college football games I've ever watched but I actually was playing in," quarterback Jake Plummer says of the 20-17 loss to Ohio State in Rose Bowl II. "Sad we didn't win it, but it ain't dampening our spirits right now."

The 1996 team's 20-year reunion was in September, a more informal get together than the 1986 team's 30-year celebration that was the center piece of Homecoming in October. In another decade, the '96 team will get its full Legends Luncheon treatment during Homecoming as the balancing act between the two continues.

"I know a lot of guys from that (1986) squad and have come to realize they were rooting their butts off for us to do well," Plummer says. "What we did was special, but it still wasn't what they did. Van Rapper (quarterback Jeff Van Raaphorst) won the Rose Bowl. We lost. Maybe some day we'll combine (for a reunion) because having that many great Sun Devils together could be a pretty awesome experience."

MORE: Reliving 1997 Rose Bowl: Ohio State 20, ASU 17

RELATED: Reliving 1987 Rose Bowl: ASU 22, Michigan 15

The coaches

Time passage has been crueler on the younger of the Rose Bowl teams.

Not only did linebacker Pat Tillman die fighting in Afghanistan in 2004 but five years later to the month coach Bruce Snyder died of cancer at age 69. So while Cooper, 79, returned in good health this fall for induction into the ASU Athletic Hall of Fame, Snyder's absence leaves a void for his 1996 players.

"He always talked about there's going to be ups and downs, not only in the game of football but in life," running back Terry Battle says. "It was the people who could play right through it or never get too high or low that were going to be successful. Because you know what it takes to kind of weather the storm and put yourself in a better situation as a man in your community and with those around you, trying to uplift them."

The intellectually inquisitive Snyder – remember his trip to Libya in 2006 to view a total solar eclipse? – would take more pride in a life message being remembered than in any scoreboard result. Even after the Rose Bowl loss, secured when Ohio State quarterback Joe Germaine of Mesa threw for the winning touchdown with 19 seconds left, Snyder reassured his wife there was no need to put him on suicide watch.

"I just coached a team for 12 games that did everything I could possibly ask them to do," Snyder said in 2006. "How wonderful is that. Not many coaches in the world have that. To be angry didn't seem as legitimate to me as being proud to be around such a great group."

There is some Jean-Luc Picard in Snyder, to expand the starship analogy to its captains, but Cooper is less James Kirk and more Andy Taylor, the aw-shucks sheriff of Mayberry who is much savvier than he lets on.

"It may look like at times he was kind of separated, but he really wasn't," says Larry Marmie, 1986 defensive coordinator. "John Cooper knew exactly what he was doing. He always had a pulse on his football team and he let his coaches coach. He'd say, are we putting it in or are we working it in? We can tell them to do a lot of things, but that ain't good enough. Did we work it in?"

Like at his other coaching stops, Cooper retained some coaches from the previous staff for continuity. At ASU, it was quarterbacks coach Mike Martz, offensive line coach Tom Freeman and recruiting coordinator Don Bocchi (hired days before head coach Darryl Rogers left for the Detroit Lions).

Bocchi still is at ASU as senior associate athletic director. "John had an outstanding way of administering the program," he said. "It was a different style, but he did everything to make sure we were in order at practice, in order at games, handled the alumni and the administration so the coaches coached."

Martz said he "changed who I was as a coach" from working with Cooper and emulated him when he became a head coach with the NFL St. Louis Rams. "He put the players' face to the fire and wouldn't back off," Martz said. "He demanded attention to detail. There wasn't any other way we could have got that done because it was a group of a lot of big personalities. Left alone or without discipline, we would have never accomplished what we did."

If they met

It's not coincidence that two of the three consensus All-Americas on ASU's Rose Bowl teams were offensive linemen – Danny Villa (1986) and Juan Roque (1996). Or that the other was a defensive lineman – Derrick Rodgers (1996).

Both teams were built for offensive balance – each almost evenly split between rushing and passing yards – and to stop the run. Opponents averaged just 13.9 points/112 yards rushing in 1986 and 18.0/100.9 in '96.

"It was nice the coaches would leave it to us saying we're going to run the ball, it starts up front with you guys," said Randall McDaniel, now widely considered to be ASU's greatest offensive lineman given his college and pro football hall of fame status. Like all the offensive line starters in 1986, McDaniel was from Arizona, the famed Home Boys. "We knew we could throw it at any time, but we had the horses in the backfield that could get the job done. We knew if we just gave them a little gap or that first three yards, they would take it the rest of the way."

Cooper and offensive coordinator Jim Colletto knew that they didn't need 500-yard passing games from Van Raaphorst to win, something that the quarterback and QB coach Martz came to accept.

"It was hard for me because I knew how talented we were on the perimeter," said Martz, who would become architect of the Rams' Greatest Show on Turf offense. "What Jim understood was we were really good on defense and why take those kind of risks when we're going to win by playing percentage football. It was hard for Jeff because we had led the Pac-10 in every offensive category the year before John got here. We had to dial it all back, but by doing that you become a team instead of just an independent contractor."

Each team had a 1,000-yard rusher – Darryl Harris (1,042) in 1986, Battle (1,077) in '96 – among a stable of backs. "We had a lot of great backs," said Battle, who shared carries with Michael Martin and J.R. Redmond among others. "We understood that it didn't matter who was going to be the starter. It really meant when your number was called what were you going to bring to the table for the team. As long as we got wins, that's what we really focused on."

On defense, the 1986 team was two-deep across its four-man front and like the '96 team stocked with future NFL defensive linemen. By the time all the talent off the Rose Bowl trees had been plucked, ASU's all-time NFL list was some 30 players longer, including all of the starting Home Boys and eventual Pro Bowlers McDaniel, Eric Allen, Dan Saleaumua and Plummer.

It's an entertaining fantasy exercise to imagine how a game between Rose Bowl I and Rose Bowl II ASU teams would turn out. The 1996 team was higher scoring (40.7 ppg to 31.6), but there's every reason to believe the '86 defense would limit Plummer and company like it did Jim Harbaugh-led Michigan. And in a lower-scoring game, it's hard to go against the 1986 team because of its power ability.

Jon Dokter of Tucson developed his Entropy System that measure "dominance relative to the competition, physicality, and rules of a given year." In his list of the 222 most dominant teams since 1945 at the fittingly named timetravelsports.com, Dokter puts ASU's 1986 team at No. 150 and the '96 team at No. 192.

In a performance formula created by Bob Boyles of Phoenix and Paul Guido for their College Football Encyclopedia, the 1996 ASU team comes out second highest in school history behind the 1970 team with the '86 team rated sixth best.

"It's just different styles," said an admittedly biased Van Raaphorst, ASU's long-time football radio analyst. "We were a play action, power run team. Who knows with Jake (Plummer) running around. He is certainly the wild card. We used to get yelled at when we got out of the pocket. Where we would have an advantage is in overall quality depth. Our 4-5-6 (players) were better than their 4-5-6. Going through it position by position, I think we would have beat them."

Public perception probably favors the '96 team in no small part because Plummer, Tillman and tight end Steve Bush went on to play for the Arizona Cardinals. "Their personalities were bigger than ours," Van Raaphorst said.

Beacon of hope

In case you missed it, ASU is not playing in the Rose Bowl this season. Or any bowl for the first time in six years.

After a 10- to 11-year cycle of football highs – 1975 (12-0, WAC/Fiesta Bowl champion), 1986 (10-1-1, Pac-10/Rose Bowl champion), 1996 (11-1, Pac-10 champion/Rose Bowl), 2007 (10-3/Pac-10 co-champion/Holiday Bowl) – 2016 was a clunker, ending with six consecutive losses and a 5-7 record.

But it's worth remembering that two years before Rose Bowl I, ASU was 5-6 and still feeling some effects from NCAA sanctions imposed for violations at the end of Frank Kush coaching era. And that from 1993-95, the Sun Devils were a combined 15-18 and did not play in a bowl game, extending their postseason absence to eight years.

So no matter how much of a hangover remains for fans from the Territorial Cup, remember that a 16-13 loss to Arizona in 1985, keeping ASU out of the Rose Bowl, was the seed for the Sun Devils the next season becoming the first Pac-10 team to win at UCLA and USC and return for a Southern California hat trick in Pasadena. "The way we lost that (1985) game really had an effect on us the next year because we should have won," Marmie said. "We could have been back-to-back (champions). As we get older, you realize those things more, but I realize more too how special those guys were. Sometimes we get a gift, but we really don't open it until 20 (or 30) years later. You see that in those guys today when they come back."

Snyder won 13 fewer games than current ASU coach Todd Graham in his first four seasons (1992-95). The patience and steady build paid off with 20 wins over the next two including the stunning 19-0 shutout of two-time defending national champion Nebraska on the way to the Rose Bowl. Snyder's nine-year coaching run still is the second longest in school history.

"What culminated after three tough years in '96 was magical," Plummer said. "Bruce Snyder told me as an 18-year-old in my house in Boise, if you come to ASU, we'll win the national championship. I didn't hear that from any other coach. It almost came to fruition with a lot of guys that poured their heart and soul into this and really loved and cared about each other. That emanated down from our head coach. We loved each other. We still do."

Graham encourages players from the Rose Bowl teams to speak to the current Sun Devils whenever possible. Most welcome the opportunity, especially during the players' only Rock Walk on the night before home games, to encourage them to boldly go where only two ASU teams have gone before.

Reach Metcalfe at 602-444-8053 orjeff.metcalfe@arizonarepublic.com. Follow him at twitter.com/jeffmetcalfe.

Indiana names Judson new director of operations

Zach Osterman

zach.osterman@indystar.com

BLOOMINGTON Indiana has named Rob Judson its new director of basketball operations.

Judson most recently served as an assistant at Illinois State. He played at Illinois and served as head coach at Northern Illinois from 2001-07.

His biography on Illinois State's website credits Judson "as a master recruiter and a detailed teacher" with nearly two decades of experience in college basketball.

Judson played for four years at Illinois, from 1977-80 under former Illini coach Lou Henson.

He coached as an assistant at Bradley, where he was part of the Braves' 1996 Missouri Valley Conference title team. From 1996-2001, he served as an assistant at his alma mater, before taking the head coaching position at Northern Illinois. Over six seasons in charge DeKalb, Ill., Judson compiled a 74-101 record.

According to his Illinois State biography: "

"During his 16 years as a NCAA Division I assistant coach, including last season at Illinois State, the teams he has coached have compiled a 258-148 record and a .635 winning percentage."

He replaces Calbert Cheaney, who left this past offseason for an assistant coaching position at Saint Louis.

As IU's director of operations, Judson will not be allowed to recruit off campus or participate actively in practice. He will be permitted to offer guidance to players who seek it, and he can be a part of Indiana's on-campus recruiting efforts. Cheaney often served as an informal guide when prospects visited Bloomington.