Newsgroup: it.cultura.linguistica.inglese
Titolo: shame on me

Ho vergogna ad ammetterlo, ma pare proprio che sino ad oggi io abbia 
sbagliato a pronunciare 'were', avendolo da sempre ritenuto omofono di 
'where'.
Max

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Had you never heard it pronounced? Anyway, "were" can well be a homophone
of "where" in some accents, according to the SOED.
Bye, FB
-- 
Just as I thought. Another test that could have cost us our lives, saved
only by the fact that I am enormously well-bred.
(Murder by Death)

 of "where" in some accents, according to the SOED.
I think it is in some varieties of Aussie and Kiwi English.
Bye, FB
-- 
"Che cos'è un fallo da tergo? E non stiamo parlando della tua vita
privata."
(Intervista della Gialappa's Band a Elisabetta Canalis)

 of "where" in some accents, according to the SOED.
Ah, yes. In my accent, for example.
Thanks,
Max

 Well, you know, sometimes you ear what you expect to ear.
And sometimes you *hear*, as well.
Max

 'where'.
Ma davvero?
Allora anch'io sono nella tua stessa situazione!
:-))))))
Tschüss,
Enrico il Pentolaio
-- 
(visita il mio sito: 
http://members.xoom.it/srw
)
_____________________________________
"L'arte ci attrae solo per cio' che rivela del nostro io piu' intimo." (Jean
Luc Godard)

Giň
A man has dreams of walking with giants,
to carve his niche in the edifice of time.
Before the mortar of his zeal
has a chance to congeal
the cup is dashed from his lips,
the flame is snuffed aborning.

 la parziale omofonia :-) )
I don't think think the tense is necessarily wrong, but I would leave out
"in" before "all these years". I might be mistaken, of course.
Bye, FB
-- 
In any case, if you say 'I gotta go' at an important job interview you're
contributing to being allowed just that privilege.
(Tony the ice man on it.cultura.linguistica.inglese)

 "in" before "all these years". I might be mistaken, of course.
The typical expression is 'where have you been for all these years?'
Where were you during the earthquake? 

 :-))))))
We're both in the same situation.
^^^^^
-- 
Today no, tomorrow yes.

No, you are right.
bye
ari

 Ah, yes. In my accent, for example.
Ma nel mio accento (scozzese) c'e' una difference importantissimo tra
"w" come "were" e "wh" come "where". Per dire niente delle vocali.
Anzi, nello scozzese ("standard"):
"Which witch was tied to the rocks to die at high tide"
"which" e "witch" *non* sono omofoni. Le vocali di "tied: e "die" e
"high" sono uguali; "tide" invece no..  NB "die" in scozzese si dice
anche come "di", pronuncia italiana. Participio passato "deid" = "did",
pronuncia italiana.
"Here's tae us, wha's like us? Damn few, an' they're a' deid."
-- 
"The past resembles the future as water resembles water"  Ibn Khaldun
My .
mac.com
 address is a spam sink.
If you wish to email me, try atlothian at blueyonder dot co dot uk

"in" before "all these years". I might be mistaken, of course.
you're right, but then its meaning would be different from what I was
aiming it to be.
to say what I wanted to say, I'd better have said : where have you
been, in all these years? I've been at the greenwood, mother make my
bed soon.....


 pronuncia italiana.
What words among "tied", "die", "high" and "tide" are pronounced with a
sort of [ei] vowel ("find" ==> more or less [feind])?
[...]
Bye, FB
-- 
After a year of speculation, inventor Dean Kamen unveiled his mysterious
"It", which is a battery-powered two-wheel people mover. Many believe it
will completely revolutionize the way people get hit by cars.
(Saturday Night Live)

 been, in all these years? 
Ma come ti hanno detto, non si dice "in all these years".
Più idiomatico sarebbe "where have you been all this time?" o "where
have you been for the last few years?"
-- 
Mary

 Ma come ti hanno detto, non si dice "in all these years".
non esageriamo : "One thing I've learned in all these years is not to make 
love when you really don't feel it; there's probably nothing worse you can do 
to yourself than that."
Norman Mailer

Giò
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alessandro coricelli ha scritto:
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Norman Mailer can get away with saying things like that because he's an
acclaimed author.
Mary's right that in normal speech, and especially in the original context,
it's not used. "Where have you been in all these years" is
foreign-sounding.
It isn't that "in all these years" can never be said; it doesn't fit the
context given. That's all.
-- 
This is my opinion of modern, colloquial, *conversational* American
English. 
If you feel the need to e-mail me, un-not my address first.

 context given. That's all.
Also, Mailer couldn't have written "for all these years" (as if he'd never
stopped learning such thing), nor "all these years". Maybe "during", but I
dare say "in all these years" is just fine, not in the least daring or
unusual. Would you say so?
Bye, FB
-- 
Mrs. Palmer, in her way, was equally angry. 'She was determined to drop his
acquaintance immediately, and she was very thankful that she had never been
acquainted with him at all'. (Jane Austen)

 context given. That's all.
this is more reasonable.

 sinceramente non capisco la differenza tra i due casi.
Il primo è un complemento di tempo, non di stato in luogo (figurato o no).
Anche in italiano del resto si può dire senza "in".
Dove sei stato tutti questi anni?
-- 
Maria Luisa C - 08/01/2005 22.34.28

Dove sei stato tutti questi anni?
hai ragione.


 Dove sei stato tutti questi anni?
But "Where have you been all these years?" is the version I've suggested,
which appears not to have been confirmed by any native speakers. Apparently
all of them go for "where have you been *for* all these years?" (but "where
have you been all this time?"). Mailer's sentence is another kettle of fish
altogether.
Bye, FB
-- 
Conversation like television set on honeymoon: unnecessary.
(Murder by Death)

 which appears not to have been confirmed by any native speakers. 
Perfectly acceptable and quite common.


 kettle of fish altogether.
I thought you suggested 'where were you all these years?'
You can say it, it's just less common than 'where have you been (for) all
these years?'

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You're right. I shouldn't have relied on my memory.
Bye, FB
-- 
Se dico "siedi!" manca l'oggetto.
Siedo chi? Lei o me?
(da it.cultura.linguistica.italiano)


Yes . 

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In case you misunderstood, I meant "Would you say it is unusual, instead?".
I'd be interested to know, if you did misunderstand, why my question was
unclear.
Bye, FB
-- 
Locked from the inside. That can only mean one thing, and I don't know what
it is.
(Murder by Death)

 wrote in message 
news:1qxrbaw5yjsx1$.1cpng082z5mc8$.dlg@40tude.net...
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After 'I dare say A is this , not that' it's natural to read 'Would you say 
so?' as 'Would you say the same ?'
'I dare say A is fine. Would you say so ?'  would  be equivalent to 'Would 
you agree ?'
'I dare say A is not in the least unusual . Would you say so ?' could well , 
however , be taken to mean ,'Would you say that it is ?'
Since you combine these two , there is certainly scope for ambiguity , 
though as I said it's more natural to attach the 'Would you say so?' to the 
main part of the preceding sentence ; when I originally read it , I took it 
to mean 'Would you agree with me?' without even considering an alternative 
possibility .
To avoid any confusion , it would be simpler to say ,'Would you agree?' (or 
'Wouldn't you agree?') .
(In case there's any lingering doubt , I meant that I do agree !)
Whilst splitting hairs , I have to say that the use of 'I dare say' doesn't 
sound quite right to me here ; the view previously expressed is that the 
usage was unusual , and you're challenging that view , not accepting (or 
conceding) the probability that it's not unusual , which is what 'I dare say 
' would suggest . (I wondered whether perhaps you meant something along the 
lines of 'I would venture to say '.)
Mike

 lines of 'I would venture to say '.)
Something like "It really seems to me". 



In that case , 'I dare say' isn't right . You could just say , 'I would say 
that' (or , of course, 'It really seems to me that') ; 'I would venture to 
say' expresses (as no doubt you understood) a tentativeness due to 
politeness rather than lack of conviction - in fact , it's often the sly jab 
that heralds the knock-out punch .
Mike 

 in fact , it's often the sly jab that heralds the knock-out punch .
Hehe.
Bye, FB
-- 
"What meaning of this, Mitter Twain?" "I will tell you, Mr Wang, if you can
tell me why a man who possesses one of the most brilliant minds of this
century can't say his prepositions or articles"
(Murder by Death)