Newsgroup: it.cultura.linguistica.inglese
Titolo: Bacon

Where does the expression "to bring the bacon home" come from, when you mean
"to succeed in a venture" ?
Bye Asoka xx'82
<< However fast you may run, you will never overreach the ball >>

 "to succeed in a venture" ?
I always interpreted it as "to bring money home", "to support a
family", or to be the one who brings home the paycheck.
It's similar to "to be the bread winner".
ciao
Arianna
Sent via Deja.com 
http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

 "to succeed in a venture" ?
To bring home the bacon. Hmmm, at a guess (probably wrong..) perhaps
some reference to taking a pig to market and later on collecting the
nicely cured bacon which would obviously take time for the curing
process. The process which also increases the value of said pig.
And like Arianna I've always understood it to be something like  a
breadwinner, or bringing back the spoils of a venture, be it a job or
something else.
On the topic of bacon there are these two other idioms.
To sell one's bacon = to sell one's body, which comes from Schiller "To
the Kaiser therefore I sold my bacon. And by him good charge of the
whole is taken."
To save one's bacon = to escape from personal injury, generally in an
undignified way.
cheers,
Loki

Arianna
Yes, and the phrase is "bring home the bacon"
Raymot
[[[[[[[[


Penso che la frase "bring home the bacon" significhi" guadagnare un stipendio.
Per esempio, se il marito lavorasse e la moglie rimanasse a casa con il figlio,
si potrebbe dire che lui "brings home the bacon" or "is bringing home the
bacon". 
Likewise, if the wife works and the husband stays home with the children, one
would say that she "brings home the bacon"...
I've not heard this phrase used in a "suceed in a venture" sense. I've only
heard it in a "earning a livelyhood for the family" sense.
Also regrettably I do not know the origin of this expression.
Bye,
stefstef

undignified way.
In quest'ultima accezione, ci puo` essere qualche relazione con l'italiano
"salvare la pelle"?
Ciao.

C'è un'espressione forse ancora più vicina a quella inglese, ossia "salvare
la cotenna", anche se il bacon è mooooolto più buono della cotenna... ;-)
Ciao,
Midori
Giovanni Zezza heeft geschreven in bericht ...


Non ho mai sentito la frase "to save ones bacon" in America ma le frase, "to
save ones skin" o "to save ones hide" sono molto comuni" e traducono come:
"salvare la pelle".
Ciao

dear loki,
i am an admirer of your posts.
please forgive me my interruption, but i see that you use the word "one's" as a
possessive. it's not. rather, it's a contraction meaning "one is" (=one's). the
possessive is simply "ones".
i know you know this and i'm pretty darn sure that it's just a
typo...but...just in case...
stefstef

 
As far as I know, the correct form for the possesive is "one's". Don't
know if "ones" is used somewhere as a variant of "one's", but none of the
dictionaries I've looked it up on actually mention it.
Max

 "to succeed in a venture" ?
Dear Asoka,
From  the Morris Dictionary of Word and PhraseOrigins, Harper and Row,
Second Edition:
  Bring home the bacon.
As so often happens, there are two theories of the origin of this phrase.
The first is that it refers o the fact that the winner of the greased pig
contest at country fairs traditionally keeps the pig and thus brings home
the bacon.  Am earlier story goes that all the way back to A. D. 1111 and
the town of Dunmow in England.  A noblewoman, wishing to encourage marital
happiness, decreed that "any person from any part of England going to Dunmow
and humbly kneeling on two stone at the church door may claim a gammon
(side) of bacon, if he can swear that for twelve months and a day he has
never had a household brawl or wished himself unmarried."  So the 'Dunmow
flitch', as the side of bacon was called, became a symbol of domestic
felicity and a man bringing home the bacon would be a rare and happy fellow.
Let cynics male what they will of the record that in a period of five
centuries (1244 - 1772) there were only eight claimants of the prize.
--
I remain, as always,
Bambi
dtb

Though not in my dictionary either, it should probably follow the
general rule for personal pronouns having unique possessive forms
without an apostrophe - yours, his, hers, ours,...
Marty


Mi dispiace, ho dovuto ricercare prima di scrivere.  La regola nel
grammario e per "personal pronouns" ma il libro anche distingue dentro
"personal" e "indefinite."  "One" e classificato come "indefinite." 
Ergo rinuncio il mio posto precedente!  


 wrote in message
20000625090650...@ng-ck1.aol.com...

Thanks to you all for your answers.
Just to clarify, there are two ways to interpret this phrase : one is "to
bring money home",
the other is "to succeed in a venture, in a deed".
Of course it's all about slang, in any case.


 l'italiano  "salvare la pelle"?
These may be more related : 
"To escape by the skin of one's teeth." = to escape very narrowly; to
come within an ace of falling a victim.
another is: "To save one's skin." = to escape bodily hurt
cheers,
Loki

 typo...but...just in case...
Thanks for the admiration..every little bit counts ;-)
But no, they are not typos but accurate copies of the printed word.
Written by a James Dixon, M.A, F.R.S.E. (whatever they mean). So you can
argue the point with him but since the book was printed in 1927, I
rather fear he is passato remoto now.
As far as the genetive s goes, its usage has changed but only for its'
as far as I can tell. One is not plural. Maybe this is an
Alantic/Pacific difference.
Further  (I love it when I'm right...) another grammar book states:
"Remember that its genetive form is one's." Although they then go on to
say it's preferable to use 'we' or 'people' instead. Boring I say.
Cheers,
Loki

Loki
Of course, you are right. The possessive is "one's".
I will cite some specific references in case anyone has been
swayed by the misinformed opinions to the contrary heretofore 
expressed:
Oxford Guide to English Grammar.
Fowler's Modern English Usage
Shorter Oxford English Dictionary on Historical Principles
Macquarie Dictionary
...
Naturally, I'd be interested in seeing stefstef's evidence
that it's "ones".
Raymot
[[[[[[[[[[[

Sono veramente esterrefatto. Pensavo che la parola, "one's" fosse una
contrazione per: "one is or one has". Per esempio, quando facciamo una
distinzione fra due studenti, potremmo dire, "One's been regularly on time,
while the other one's been  late."
Rendo conto che nel mondo di poesia, "one's" e' stato usato per secoli...ma la
poesia ha le regole variabili e un po' di "sui generis".
Your cites are quite daunting yet I resist the compelling reflex to "say
uncle". Instead, I've e-mailed the editor and chief of Bedford University Press
for some up-to-the minute American English  authority. 
One's determined when one's painted in a corner.
stefstef

 contrazione per: "one is or one has". 
Certo che lo è. Stai solo facendo confusione tra il possessivo è il
pronome + verbo.
Tu avevi detto che il possessivo si scrive "ones", invece si scrive
"one's", come molti ti hanno già detto (es. "by the skin of one's
teeth").
Forse ti ha fuorviato pensare ad "its", che si scrive senza apostrofo
quando è possessivo e con quando è la contrazione di "it is", ecc.
Mary

ben detto...esattamente che stavo pensando...pensavo che ci sarebbe
un'ambiguita' insopportabile se ci fossero due "one's"(possessivo e
contrazione) e dunque, ho cercato usare la stessa logica che si trova con la
parola, "it"-faccendo una distinzione fra il possessivo e la
contrazione...ma...ero sbagliato.
oh well.  apologies and red-faced toe-kicking of the ground. additionally,
please find a response to my e-mail:
I'm an English editor at Bedford/St. Martin's, and I work with
Diana Hacker on her grammar books. Here's what her books say: you would not
use an apostrophe with the possessive pronouns its, whose, his, hers, ours,
yours, and theirs. But you would use an apostrophe to show that an
indefinite pronoun (everyone, someone, no one) is possessive.  Also, you
would always use an apostrophe to mark a contraction with a pronoun.
If you're looking for a good book for grammar, I recommend Diana Hacker's A
Writer's Reference, Fourth Edition.  Here's our catalog page for more
information about it:
http://www.bedfordstmartins.com/book.asp?disc=ENG&id_product=1124001461&@id_
course=1058000064&disc_name=English&cd_booktype=HDBK
Please let me know if you have other questions.  I'm glad to help.
Best wishes,
Leasa Burton
 
muti saluti,
stefstef 

the other is "to succeed in a venture, in a deed".
Says who?
-- 
Isa
Work like you don't need money,
Love like you've never been hurt,
And dance like no one's watching
http://web.tiscalinet.it/alfabeto_auschwitz/

stefstef
-- 
Danny Stewart