Newsgroup: it.cultura.linguistica.inglese
Titolo: Corsi di inglese su CD-ROM

Ciao a tutti, sto cercando un buon corso di inglese su CD-ROM. Quello che mi
interessa soprattutto è che ci siano dei brani in inglese letti da speaker
madrelingua, a velocità moderata, e con i testi ovviamente. Questo poichè mi
sto allenando per il FCE, ho provato ad ascoltare un brano di esame ma è
troppo veloce per me.
Giusto per la cronaca, ieri ho preso un cd della finson, a 5 euro. E'
proprio vero, il risparmio non è guadagno :|

Nei libri di past papers ci sono i CD con i brani per l'esame e anche
una trascrizione.

Giò
How do you expect me to grow, if you don't let me blow?
(Rachel a Ross, Friends 2x19)

Legolas ha scritto:

"EasyEnglish" del Corriere della Sera, metodo Shenker.
E' un DVD molto piacevole da studiare, con una storia vera e degli
attori molto bravi e simpatici. Ci sono listening, pronuncia,
grammatica, reading e esercizi. 7 livelli.
Puoi anche trovarlo nella versione 7+1 CDrom (ediz. precedente). Io ho
questa versione, sto al CD 4, ottimo e divertente, te lo consiglio!
Per comprarlo (Prezzo: € 69.00)
http://www.libreriauniversitaria.it/BIT/8817932272/Easy_english__Nuovo_corso_multimediale_di_inglese_by_Shenker__DVD-ROM.htm

 
Hello Adam,
People from another NG suggested me to ask you about a course on CD's to 
study Italian. I need something a bit more than crash courses for 
travelers.
I would appreciate any help.
BTW, Do you know anything about this course?
http://www.languagequest.com/home/product.php?prodCode=FSMIL1CD&lang=Italian
Thanks in advance,
SN

"SN" <N...@Spam.No> wrote in message
news:RJWdnZabCrP...@teksavvy.com...

I'm no Adam, but I am familiar with the FSI language courses.
I have used the FSI French, Russian, and Spanish courses extensively.
I never used the Italian, since I learned Italian in Italy.
As far as I am concerned, the FSI courses are the best method ever
devised for teaching foreign languages to English speakers. At one
time the US State Department, which developed these courses, was
convinced that Foreign Service Officers would be able to teach
themselves a foreign language before being assigned to foreign
countries, but this did not work out. Most people did not have the
discipline to study on their own, and the State Department now relies
almost exclusively on the Defense Language Institute in California for
teaching State Department personnel foreign languages.
As far as this FSI Italian course is concerned, it seems an
abbreviated version of the standard FSI courses.
This Basic Italian course consists of 15 CDs and a 352 page textbook,
where the Basic French series consists of 101 CDs and four textbooks,
so I would say that although it may be an excellent course, it
probably does not go as deeply into the grammar as the French course
does. Unlike some other languages, there appears to be only one level
of Italian in the FSI catalogue.
All of the FSI courses are accompanied by excellent textbooks written
specifically to accompany the tapes.
Contrast this with the Pimsleur courses, which are a fairly good
method of learning basic spoken Italian, but which have absolutely no
accompanying grammar book or guide of any kind.
The heart of the FSI courses is a dialogue in each lesson, which, by
the end of the lesson, is essentially memorized by the student. You
learn grammar as you go along, using a carefully structured and
progressive method.
These courses are not for the faint-hearted. They require a lot of
work and dedication. They are not intended to give you a quick and
easy tourist's vocabulary. They start from the very beginning, and
emphasize pronunciation in great detail, which to some may seem
excessive, even unnecessary.
You can expect to repeat each CD 3 times. You must follow the
instructions carefully, listening, and repeating aloud all answers to
questions. It may seem tedious to some, but I always found these
courses very thorough.
The audio CDs may be used in the car, but I think the most effective
use is on the computer, so that you can "rewind" to a specific place
on the CD when you want to repeat something.
Not everyone shares my view of FSI courses, as is seen here.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0812073231/francoismichelouA/104-2308349-8590316
More reviews
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0812078675/ref=cm_aya_asin.title/104-2308349-8590316?%5Fencoding=UTF8&v=glance
Other general information.
http://language.bin.org/FXM/le/faq3.htm
http://www.transitionsabroad.com/publications/magazine/0305/teachyourselfalanguage.shtml
I have seen some FSI courses in public libraries in the US which are
available for loan. They seem to get stolen quite a bit, so they must
be popular.
You may be able to find a better price by googling barrons mastering
italian
http://www.audiobooksonline.com/shopsite/0812078675.html
http://www.craigslist.org/eby/bks/90410137.html
This last one is used, on ebay, only $45.
Good luck.
Joe from Massachusetts

 does.
101 CDs? I beg your pardon?? Of course you'll learn French, but it'll take
a lifetime, won't it? How long can it take to listen to 101 CDs, supposing
they're 101 fully burned ones? By the way, it seems to me that Amazon
doesn't account for 101 CDs.
And, by the way, what would it cost?
[...]
Bye, FB
-- 
Marcel: Gentlemen, may I present Miss Betty DeBoop from the Islands?
Colonel Schlissel: Caribbean or Virgin?
Betty DeBoop: Well, let's just say I came back a Caribbean.
(The Cheap Detective)

 And, by the way, what would it cost?
French Basic Course - CD version
Level 1 - 19 CDs  $239
Level 2 - 29 CDs  $269
Level 3 - 29 CDs  $269
Level 4 - 24 CDs  $269
http://www.multilingualbooks.com/fsi-french.html
Joe from Massachusetts

Joe,
Thanks a lot for all the detailed information that you provided. This 
course is exactly what I am looking for. My only concern is that 
Barron's is in no hurry to follow up with Level 2 and I may get stuck in 
the middle. Could you post a link to the full course, at least the name 
of it?
Best regards,
SN

"SN" <N...@Spam.No> wrote in message
news:9NqdnbOlToz...@teksavvy.com...

Barron's is not the developer of the course. The course is based on
the original FSI course, and Barron's is only one of the marketers of
the course, not the developer. Since there was only one original FSI
course, there will be no follow-up to the Barron's course. There are
some FSI courses which have been updated, but there are no new FSI
courses. There are no other FSI Italian courses, other than this
level.
There is another version of the FSI course (23 CD's, 1 text) available
here.
http://www.foreignserviceinstitute.com/languages/italian/
Still, I don't think you can go wrong with the Barron's course, if you
are a serious student, and think you are capable of working alone,
with discipline. You will get an in-depth exposure to the
pronunciation and grammar, and a good basis for continuing on in
Italian.
So influential was the FSI language program that a 5-level scale,
ranging from 1 (Elementary level) to 5  (Native ability) was developed
to grade language learning based on the FSI system.
«The Interagency Language Roundtable (ILR) scale is a set of
descriptions of abilities to communicate in a language. It was
originally developed by the United States Foreign Service Institute,
and is still widely known as the FSI scale. It consists of
descriptions of five levels of language proficiency.»
http://www.sil.org/lingualinks/LANGUAGELEARNING/MangngYrLnggLrnngPrgrm/TheILRFSIProficiencyScale.htm
Pimsleur tries to make its courses sound better by using both the
misleading description of the ACTFL rating (Intermediate-high
proficiency), and the number for the FSI rating (1+). The description
of the FSI rating of 1+ is "Elementary level".  Evidently the very
descriptive ACTFL rating was concocted by language teachers to make it
appear that the purported level of students' accomplishments was
greater than the actual level.
«Level III Pimsleur Instruction 30 more Lessons, after the final 15
hours of the Comprehensive Program - for a total of 45 hours of
training, you will be at the ACTFL Intermediate-high proficiency, (a
FSI -1+ rating), able to participate in casual conversations and
conduct everyday transactions with success and pleasure in your
achievements.»
http://shopping.netsuite.com/s.nl/c.440887/sc.5/category.-105/it.I/id.7/.f
So, after completing all the Pimsleur courses for Italian, you would
be at Elementary level.
I think you would be better off with the Barron's.
Joe from Massachusetts

 Italian.....
Joe, I just ordered this course. From a description the full course 
covers the same grounds, probably with some more details or exercises. 
They both cover mostly present tense, and then introduce past and 
future. Well, by that time I will be able to figure out the next step on 
my own.
One more question. I found this online dictionary.
http://it.wordreference.com/it/en/translation.asp?iten=
Is this good enough or there is anything better on the Web?
Thanks a lot for all of your help.
SN

 Thanks a lot for all of your help.
On 
www.garzantilinguistica.it
 (you'll have to sign up, for free) you'll
find a rather good dictionary, which I take to be an abridged version of
the dictionary on sale. The best bilingual dictionaries on sale are the
Picchi, published by Hoepli, and the Ragazzini, published by Zanichelli;
both have a CD.
Bye, FB
-- 
"It is not idiocy, father, I assure you." "What is it then, sir?" "Well, it
is what is called nowadays a high moral tone, father. That is all" "Hate
these new-fangled names. Same thing as we used to call idiocy fifty years
ago. Shan't stay in this house any longer."
("An Ideal Husband", Oscar Wilde)

"SN" <N...@Spam.No> wrote in message
news:ya-dnWre8ex...@teksavvy.com...

If you are going to be studying Italian, you will find most of these
resources invaluable.
Dictionaries:
These are from major publishing houses,
and they are all good.
Garzanti (useful for verb conjugations)
http://www.garzantilinguistica.it/
De Agostini (useful for verb conjugations)
Besides Italian-English, it also has dictionaries
for Italian and 8 other languages, which I use
as an indirect means of going between English
and French or Spanish.
http://www.sapere.it/gr/DictionarySearchServlet?DS_action=Init
DeMauro Paravia
http://www.demauroparavia.it/
Hoepli
http://www.hoepli.it/dizionari.asp
Oxford Paravia
http://www.oxfordparavia.it/
Radio and Television:
RAI home page:
http://www.rai.it/
Raiclick Web
There are about 1500 streaming TV programs from the RAI  television
archives, including 9 daily newscasts (slightly delayed from their
over-the-air broadcast in Italy), documentaries, series, films,
travel, science, etc. Windows Media Player 9 and a broadband
connection (>300 kbps) are required.
http://213.140.30.67/raiclick/pc/website/0,4388,,00.html
Raiclick Web Catalogue - list of most streaming programs currently
available.
http://www.raiclick.it/raiclick_web/guida_programmi.html
BBC Introductory Italian Course
You can fool around with this while you are on line.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/languages/italian/lj/menu.shtml
Interesting, but of questionable value, some might say:
Italian hand gestures - only those in good taste.
http://www.eurocosm.com/Eurocosm/AppEC/Pdcd/Handsignals/HandsigsGB.asp
Joe from Massachusetts

 
http://www.eurocosm.com/Eurocosm/AppEC/Pdcd/Handsignals/HandsigsGB.asp
Mind you, it also has a few not-so-kind gestures, actually. ;)
-- 
Enrico C
...still legal tender...

 wrote in message
news:1q5wbsurd8po9$.dlg@news.lillathedog.net...

You mean that sweet young lady is not as sweet as she appears?
It could be worse.   :>)
Joe from Massachusetts

 Bye, FB
Thanks for the link. I prefer online resources to any others. I just 
can't force myself back to flipping dozens of pages in search of a 
single word. :}
SN

 Joe from Massachusetts
Joe,
Thanks for the resources. I bookmarked them all. Only Italian Hand 
Signals would not work for me. Neither in IE no in FF. :{ Oh, well. If 
push comes to shove, I am in good working relations with quite a few 
Italian guys. They won't hide anything from me. :}
Best Regards,
SN

 Signals would not work for me. Neither in IE no in FF. :{ Oh, well. If
You need Real Player.



Speaking of Real Player:
I regularly watch Raiclick Web streaming video.
Until several months ago, the servers used Real technology for the
transmission of the RAI programs.
The quality of the video was fair.
Then, Raiclick switched to Windows Media technology, so I had to
switch from Real Player to Windows Media Player.
The quality improved immensely.
I was wondering if you or anyone else in the group ever watch Raiclick
Web, and if you had noticed the great improvement in the streaming
video since the changeover to Windows Media Player?
Joe from Massachusetts

 
TV is another good resource. Up until this summer all Italian 
programming on local cable (Toronto)consisted of only 1/2 time on 
Telelatino channel. Now RAI has finally come followed by three more 
channels - SKY TG24, Leonardo World and Video Italia.
SN

 
I installed RP, but it would not help. Could be my firewall to blame.
SN



I've watched something once or twice: interviews to Italian writers. They
seem to have vanished, though...
Bye, FB
-- 
Una volta ho comprato un salmone all'Ikea.
Sono arrivato a casa.
Era da montare.
(citato da Alessandro "Il Patriarca" Valli su
it.cultura.linguistica.italiano)

"SN" <N...@Spam.No> wrote in message
news:UOmdnRxRSoD...@teksavvy.com...

I don't have satellite, and my cable only has Univision, the
Spanish-language channel, so I depend on the Internet and Raiclick for
Italian programming. The quality is quite good, but naturally not as
good as "regular" TV, but it is good enough so that I can tape
programs if I want, and the quality is acceptable.
Joe from Massachusetts

 wrote in message
news:Of4Ne.746$5U2.680@lakeread07...

One good thing about Raiclick is that it is essentially "TV on
demand", and a program can be paused or repeated at any time.
Sometimes the internet is flaky, and the transmissions are
interrupted. I can go back and view the program when conditions are
better.
As far as the on-line resources  available for learning Italian, I
think that they far exceed the resources for any other language,
whether it be French, Spanish, German, or any of the less-studied
languages.
Joe from Massachusetts


I wasn't concerned with the intellectual acumen of the broadcasts,
only wondering if anyone had noticed an improvement in the
transmission's video quality after the change from Real to Win Media.
Joe from Massachusetts


I never liked Real, actually I always hated their products. As much as I 
  dislike Microsoft products, I prefer Win Media to Real products. MS 
products may not be user friendly, but at least they don't irate me like 
Real. No matter what I try to do in Real, it throws at me tons of 
totally unrelated garbage and, the worst part, I can never find what I 
am looking for.
This is just a personal opinion, of course.
In general, at least in my area, Internet connections aren't good enough 
for video stream. My sons leave their computers connected overnight to 
download the latest episodes of their favorites shows, but this is not 
for studying.
Anyway, 15 CD's will last for a while. By that time the Internet will 
improve. :}