Newsgroup: it.cultura.linguistica.inglese
Titolo: headline

Dolphin Memory May Be Even Better Than Elephants
 
Is this headline correct?
 
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/08/07/dolphin-memory_n_3715929.html?ncid=edlinkusaolp00000003
 
 
 
-- 
"There are three things I always forget.  Names, faces -- the
third I can't remember."
                -- Italo Svevo
 

 
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/08/07/dolphin-memory_n_3715929.html?ncid=edlinkusaolp00000003
 
 
No. It's incorrect for several reasons.
Here are two of many ways to correct it.
The memory of dolphins may be even better than (the memory/that) of 
elephants.
And even in these cases, the sentence needs context for precise meaning.

 
 
Yes, as a headline it's fine. It's a headline: not a sentence. It might have 
an apostrophe after "Elephants" but, again, headlines always cut corners.
 
Some are so cryptic they need to be read more than once to make sense. Those 
are the really badly written headlines.
 
 
-- 
Joey from New York
Among those whom I like or admire, I can findï¿œno common denominator,
but among thoseï¿œwhom I love, I can: all of them make me laugh.
ï¿œ ï¿œ-- WH Auden
 

 are the really badly written headlines.
 
Some are fun!
 
"Meat head resigns"
http://i2.listal.com/image/3734756/600full-my-profile.jpg
 
 
"Priest marries his own son"
http://www.mockpaperscissors.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/priest-marries-son.jpg
 
 
 

 are the really badly written headlines.
 
No, it sucks. If you were to react to it in its context as a headline 
instead of an Italian-English newsgroup, where grammar matters, there 
are more adequate ways to write it.
 
Dolphins May Remember Better Than Elephants
Dolphins Better Elephants' Memory?
 
That's the best I can do in 20 seconds.
 

On Aug 10, 2013, Tony the Ice Man wrote

I give your second one a FAIL. You should have taken a full minute.
 
Even your first omits the point of the story "memory" but it's not bad.


 Even your first omits the point of the story "memory" but it's not bad.
 
Besides, the question is not "Can you think of a better one?", but "Is 
this headline correct?".
 
 


Exactly. The grammar in the headline not correct, but instead, 
substandard. If you had carefully read my first post, you would have 
seen that statement in my first sentence. I just gave some other 
examples, because an excuse was given that it was just a headline, to 
show that it isn't a difficult task to avoid bad structure in a short 
headline. If you have some investment in considering this headline OK, 
that's fine and no concern of mine.
 
 

 that's fine and no concern of mine.
 
Well, as a learner I am not going to get into a dispute with a native 
speaker over a point of English grammar, but I just say I am inclined to 
believe that the "standard" for short headlines is not exactly the same 
as for a long text. Some corners can be cut, as Joe put it.
There were similar threads on the newsgroup about the Italian language. 
Posters criticized as sloppy some newspaper headlines not considering 
the context, that is, the restraints of the fixed length.

 the context, that is, the restraints of the fixed length.
 
You're right, E: this shouldn't devolve into a dispute. In any writing, style 
plays a big part. If you've taken any writing classes you'll know that 10 
students can turn in 10 very different exercises and they can all be very 
good.
 
In headline writing, grammar does not hold the same degree of importance as 
the following text that it introduces. A headline is, by nature, terse. It 
needs to catch one's eye and interest, and should always include the key 
word(s) relating to the article. Length, line breaks, punctuation all take 
hits when trying to fit headlines into the allowed space.
 
I believe the same occurs in every language.
 
I thought Tony's "it sucks" comment was a bit caustic and misleading, as the 
only problem I saw with the original headline was the missing apostrophe-s on 
the two possessive nouns,
 
Dolphins' Memory May Be Even Better Than Elephants' 
 
but even that lack is permissible in a headline, and given the source of this 
one, I feel the language is entirely in keeping with that publication's 
standards.
 
-- 
Joey from New York
Among those whom I like or admire, I can find no common denominator,
but among those whom I love, I can: all of them make me laugh.
   -- WH Auden
 

 with that publication's standards.
 
 
That was my doubt, I had written
"Dolphin Memory May Be Even Better Than Elephants One"
 
 
Related questions:
 
"Dolphin memory" ("dolphin" as an adjective of "memory") could
mean 
"Memory as we see it in dolphins" ?
 
In Italian:
Form 1 - La memoria dei delfini
Form 2 - Memoria da delfino (this form wouldn't work in an
Italian headline like the original one)
 
Using the second form, "dolphin memory", the comparison should
go with "elephant memory" rather than
with "elephants' memory" ?
 
IOW:
Form 1: dolphins' memory ... elephants' memory (or elephants'
one)
Form 2: dolphin memory ... elephant memory
 
 
-- 
Perhaps, after all, America never has been discovered.
I myself would say that it had merely been detected.
    -- Oscar Wilde
 

 Form 2: dolphin memory ... elephant memory
 
Good for you! Well, kinda. A native English speaker would typically not 
say "elephants' one." But at least you see the importance of parallel 
construction. You can see my original post for more typical English 
constructions.
 
 

 
 
Hot dog, you got it. :)
 
Now let's try to keep it in memory.


  someone's memory of a dolphin.
 
 
Ha! I didn't see that.
 
 
-- 
In a Rome laundry:
"Ladies, leave your clothes here and spend the afternoon having
a good time."