Newsgroup: it.cultura.linguistica.inglese
Titolo: Lettucio = ?

Does anyone here know what a lettucio is? The phrase is:
ed una rozza scala che mette al granaio, entro cui, da un balcone senza
imposte, si vede un lettuccio
and a rough staircase that leads to the hayloft, between which, from a
balcony without shutters a ? could be seen.
Evi

 Evi
bye
Gennaro
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 balcony without shutters a ? could be seen.
<< Lettuccio means piccolo letto (little bed ).
      In Italy we use "uccio" a lot either to convey smallness or like a
vezzeggiativo.
       I must confess I had to look up the translation of vezzeggiativo in
my dictionary.
It is the following :
Diminutive noun of endearment, pet form of a noun.
Both definitions seem too literal to me.
How does one say "vezzeggiativo " in English ?
Yours
Sal


I think "entro"stands for "dentro" here, not for "between".
The suffix "uccio" denotes something that's small and somewhat poor.
Cinzia


Ah, I see. I think I'll use the word 'cot' for lettuccio. This now is used
to refer to a baby's bed with high sides but in older books, describes a
small, humble bed. Yes, I see what you mean about 'between which'.  So my
translation can now be
and a rough staircase that leads to a hayloft (I'll stick with hayloft since
the room is in the upper storey of a house and a barn is usually either
downstairs or a seperate building) in which, through a balcony without
shutters, a cot could be seen.
Thanks Gennaro
Evi

 wrote in message
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This is really useful information, Sal, since this probably won't be the
only 'uccio' I come up against.
I'd translate vezzeggiativo as a diminutive.  Diminutive can be used as a
noun. (The diminutive of Sarah is Sally)
Evi

 Cinzia
So, entro can equal Dentro.  That makes sense. That is very useful to know,
Cinzia.
Cot would fit the bill of a small, poor bed.  It is often used by Charles
Dickens in this way and Rigoletto was written in that era although, of
course, Rigoletto describes a far earlier time, when men were men and no one
died if they didn't sing an aria first!
Evi

 noun. (The diminutive of Sarah is Sally)
Questo è interessante. In italiano esiste (nel senso che le grammatiche ne
affermano l'esistenza) un sistema generale di alterazione dei sostantivi
(che, appunto, si definiscono "alterati"). In tale sistema il vezzeggiativo
e il diminutivo sono due figure distinte: con riguardo al letto, ad esempio,
si parla di lettuccio per il vezzeggiativo e di lettino per il diminutivo.
E' possibile distinguere queste due ipotesi in inglese?
Saluti
Arturo

 wrote in message
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I see what you mean.  'Pet name' is isn't exactly the same as vezzeggiativo
but it gets bit closer. Kitty is the  a pet name for a cat. Kiddy is the
petname for a child. But it has that sense of endearment which does not
necessarily have to be part of a vezzeggiativo. Thus you wouldn't describe a
cot as the 'pet name' for a bed.
I think the Italian just has a subtley of meaning here which the English
lacks.
It's one of the things that make other languages so interesting.
Evi

 Evi
Great, Evi, you got the point!!!
Cinzia

 lacks.
I thought so. Thank you for your kind explanation.
Regards
Arturo