Newsgroup: it.cultura.linguistica.inglese
Titolo: cristina is back

hello everybody, sorry I've been only lurking for so long, but I'm always
fearful and too respectful to put my tongue in, which i consider to be a
right of our beloved Queens and Knights.
Nevertheless, here I am with a silly question:
WITH and WITHOUT (yes I know it's the title of a U2's song, Sal)
If I'm not mistaken (and I am very rarely) one can pronounce both using
eth (like 'they') sound or thorne one (like 'thin'), am I right?
if this is the case, does anyone of you know if there is any differences
between the two kind of pronounciation, such as regional differences (and
here I'm bothering our Britts) or social ones, maybe.
Don't know, I just couldn't sleep last night and that's what I was
thinking of....
thanking you in advance
best regards....mmmm...too formal, let's say ciao
Chrisa

thinking of...
Lucky you!
Welcome back,
-- 
Isa
Work like you don't need money,
Love like you've never been hurt,
And dance like no one's watching
http://web.tiscalinet.it/alfabeto_auschwitz/

 eth (like 'they') sound or thorne one (like 'thin'), am I right?
Credo si tratti di "rilassatezza" di pronuncia, come quando noi diciamo
"seh" per dire "sì".
--
Er Roscio.

Lo and behold!  Before answering I looked in my Webster's and saw there
were two pronunciations.  One as in thIn the other as in bAnana or
cOllect.  I've only heard the thIn in the US and Canada.  I know my
Irish relatives do strange things with words and in London I have more
problems communicating than in Napoli.
Stick with thIn through thick and thin
Unless you prefer a wobbly chin
Martin

Appro... hai notato che ben pochi italiani sanno che U2 =  "you too"
seh
saluti
Crissy, chrisa, cristina o come vi pare

Appro... hai notato che ben pochi italiani sanno che U2 =  "you too" ?...
Ma potrebbe essere anche 'you two', o no?
Heidi

 here I'm bothering our Britts) or social ones, maybe.
La "th" di with e without viene pronunciata come quella di "they",
"this", "though", ecc.
Non mi sembra di averla mai sentita pronunciare come in "thin", "think",
"throw", ecc.
Mary
-- 
A woman without a man is like a fish without a bicycle.

 and Sal isn't the only rock expert here! :-DD
<I was recently appointed Slang Master and I'm currently running for the
title of Cinema Master
  (if one is ever going to be established in the realm ).
  I confirm that Our Might Queen Isa is the real rock expert together with
the Privy Counsellor
Annie Oakley Martini "the fastest rocket(te) in the west(ern ) Italy.
(Wrong use of definite article due to licenza poetica)
Yours
Sal


cara Mary, 
prova a sentire proprio la canzone degli U2, mi sembra proprio che Bono li
pronunci come thin e think. Certo le mie orecchie non sono più quelle di
una volta, però....
baci
Chrisa

four or five of us we'd set up a mailing list, don't you think :-)?
Of course I didn't mean that!!
weren't you who once told me (or had told me?): flattery will take you
everywere?
That has become one of my favourite rules!
kisses
Chrisa

pronunci come thin e think. 
Remember you're listening to an Irishman, though.
("There's been a lout of toulk about this next soung. Maybe, maybe
toou mouch toulk. This soung is not a rebel soung. This soung is
Sounday, Blooudy Sounday...") 


(Wrong use of definite article due to licenza poetica)
Sweets! You can do as you please. In Sal We Trust.


That has become one of my favourite rules!
LOL
I didn't mean you to take me seriously, for Pete's sake! :-DDD


Remember you're listening to an Irishman, though.
that's exactly what I was referring to, dear sweet Isa.
Shall I presume that Irishmen do pronounce it as 'thin'?
As I normally go to the South of England, I know for sure that with is
pronounced as in 'they' (or at least in Hampshire).
Do you think I'd better dream of something else while sleeping?
Chrisa

and Sal isn't the only rock expert here! :-DD
Vero. Ce ne sono almeno altre due.
'scolta... se ti mando il mio numero di telefono ed una scheda da 10000,
me la canti?
saluti,
Peltio, che deve cambiare lo stereo.
PS
Ne approfitto per comunicare che il desiderio di HRH Bambi riguardo
all'indirizzo del sito è stato esaudito. Welcome.To/TheIlluminatedRealm.
Non ho ancora capito perchè il contatore non funzioni, però...

 una volta, però....
Per quanto riguarda "with", il mio Collins Cobuild riporta entrambe le
pronunce come possibili. Due parlanti nativi londinesi in effetti mi hanno
confermato che anche la pronuncia sorda, sebbene meno frequente, è
possibile. Per "without" parrebbe invece che esista solo la pronuncia
sonora.
Forse, ma questa è soltanto una mia ipotesi azzardata, potrebbe darsi che
vi sia una qualche tendenza a pronuciare il "th" sordo qualora segua una
consonante sorda, come accade per la 'v' in, ad es., "have to", che tende
ad essere pronunciata come una 'f'.
Max

 Ma potrebbe essere anche 'you two', o no?
Beh, che "2" e "two" si pronunciano allo stesso modo mi pare scontato!
Certo che potrebbe essere, ma non e` cosi`. :)
-- 
Emanuele

 Sweets! You can do as you please. In Sal We Trust.
<Blooshing again.
   (Remembering my Manchester days)
Yours
Sal


Anch'io avrei detto, come Mary, che esistesse solo la pronuncia con la "th"
di "they" (/wID/ e /wIDaUt/). Così dice pure il mio vocaolario Cambridge.
Poi per scrupolo ho controllato nel Webster's, che invece dà le due
varianti. Che strano! Posso dire solo di non essermi mai accorto di
quest'altra pronuncia. Non è certamente standard né in Inghilterra né in
America. Noi cockneys usiamo solitamente /wIv/ come "give" o /wId/ come
"did" e poi credo che l'americano nero usa spesso /wIt/ come "bit". Forse è
vero che in Irlanda si usa anche /wIT/ come "myth". Bisogna che risponda un
irlandese.
Chris Pain

me la canti?
LOL
Questo no... dovrai portarmi fuori a cena, caro.
In topic, da 
www.kissthisguy.com
, The Archive Of Misheard Lyrics:
(quote)
Song: With or Without You 
Artist: U2 
The real lyrics were: 
See the thorn twist in your side 
But I misheard them as: 
See the phone twist in your side 
The embarrasing moment of revelation: 
When I first heard this song I was so young I didn't question the
validity of a phone twisting in one's side. Years later I was asking
some friends if they knew the song--trying to clear up the
confusion--none of them knew the verses, only the chorus. I had to buy
the CD and look at the lyric sheet to clear up my confusion. Now I am
an obsessive U2 fan and I cannot believe I ever thought that could be
the line. 
Age when I realized how wrong I had been: 16 
Misheard by: Julia 
(unquote)
Lurve,



 Dear Peltio,
A preference. I merely expressed a preference. But, so be it and I am still
of the opinion that the address now our residence,  'works'.
Our thanks as always.
The site is looking as it should: Illuminated.
The FAQ's will be sent out within the coming days.
You remain a K.I.S.A and I remain, as always,
Bambi
dtb
P.S. Welcome back Cristina