Newsgroup: it.cultura.linguistica.inglese
Titolo: terza persona

se dovessi dire.
"He read a lot of books"      read o reads?
"She go to the cinema"   è giusto?
"She goes to the cinema"  ?
"She like cake"  (like o likes)?
mi fate degli esempi in cui alla terza persona
ci va la s finale nel verbo scusate per la grande confusione...

 ci va la s finale nel verbo scusate per la grande confusione...
ci va quasi sempre. tranne quando stai usando il congiuntivo
presente (cioe' quasi mai) o quando il verbo e' modale o
semi-modale cioe' can, could, will, would, may, might, must, should,
shall, should, (need), (dare) e magari qualcuno che mi sfugge.

quindi
"she can go to the cinema"
"he could catch the train"
"She may go to the cinema"
son giusti? 

Mario ha scritto:

si'

 "she can go to the cinema"
pero' "She cans fish", perche' il verbo normale "to can" e' diverso
dal verbo
modale "can"

 ha scritto nel messaggio 
news:1177065782.5...@o5g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
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urca che casino :-)
ma ho capito, dipende se è modale o no 

 ma ho capito, dipende se è modale o no
beh, "inscatolare" e "potere" sono abbastanza diversi.
She can fish = sa pescare / puo' pescare.
She cans fish = mette i pesci in scatola.

 wrote in message
news:46289f69$0$36440$4faf...@reader5.news.tin.it...
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She can Can-Can while she cans, or can she?
Joe from Massachusetts

 
e' l'unica cosa semplice coi verbi inglesi. La s alla terza persona c'e'
sempre tranne che nei verbi che reggono altri verbi, con funzione
"ausiliaria" (so che i linguisti arricceranno il naso per queste
definizioni, ma se servono a chiarire non me ne vogliano)
-- 
senza tenersi
da sola galleggia
la ranocchia

 sempre tranne che 
but then the Americans often forget about it, see the movies, like in 
the title "She hate me", or so many other times they say "he don't" etc...

 or so many other times they say "he don't" etc...
Quello sì, ma è proprio linguaggio basso basso...
Tschau,
Enrico il Pentolaio.
-- 
Five by five. 

 but then the Americans often forget about it, (...)  or so many other times they say "he don't" etc...
Not just Americans! Try watching Eastenders! :-)
Claudia

 
but common.

 Not just Americans! Try watching Eastenders! :-)
Ok, I thought it was more an american thing. Actually, while I write 
this, I think: why should "american" mean "from the united states"?


finalmente un ottima spiegazione masticabile :-))
semplice e precisa...

 I think: why should "american" mean "from the united states"?
The United States of America is the only country with 'America' in it's 
name, so it's become a convention to call US citizens, Americans. 
Technically, all people in the Western hemisphere are Americans, so you must 
determine from the context which group the writer intends to identify. 

 but common.
Uhm... i ragazzi di strada, forse? I ne(g)ri?


 Uhm... i ragazzi di strada, forse? I ne(g)ri?
yeah or like Carlito Brigante (I saw Carlito's way again yesterday) :)

 yeah or like Carlito Brigante (I saw Carlito's way again yesterday) :)
Ah, gli italo-americani allora. That's anything but regular American 
English, unless you call romanesco the purest form of Italian, me thinks.


 English, unless you call romanesco the purest form of Italian, me thinks.
Well, I heard it many times in the movies, but when you people here say 
that is not correct (of course) nor common, I'm happy :)

On Apr 20, 9:13 am, "Enrico il Pentolaio"

Si' hai ragione.  E' una GRANDE generalizzazione.  "she hate me" is a
pretty  bad mistake and, as you said, "he don't"  denotes a lack of
formal education.   Mi azzardo a dire con il rischio di attirare l'ira
di alcuni che sarebbe meglio non fare commenti del genere almeno che
uno non  abbia vissuto negli Stati Uniti per un certo periodo di
tempo.
bye
Ari


Because the United States is the only country in the Americas that has
the word "America" in its official name.  No other country in the
Americas has the word "America" as part of its name.  The name of our
country is "United States of America" so we take the last word which
is "America" and we use it as an adjective to indicate nationality.
You take the first two words and use "statunitense".  We take the last
word and say "American".
bye
Ari

 that is not correct (of course) nor common, I'm happy :)
neither... nor... forse andava meglio, ma forse si dice anche come hai 
scritto tu (dovrei trovare conferma, ma è tardi e non mi va).
Comunque mi sa che guardiamo roba totalmente differente in inglese, dal 
momento che siamo arrivati a conclusioni opposte.
:-)


 neither... nor... forse andava meglio
You're right. Either:
..that is neither correct nor common...
or
..that is not correct or common..
-- 
Disclaimer:
My goal in posting here is to provide readers with
acceptable, viable, correct examples of how an
American speaks day-to-day English; how to sound
like an average person, not a great work of literature
or someone who speaks like a grammar book. jdwd

 ..that is not correct or common..
this one is new to me

 tempo.
Fai bene. Again, my apologies.

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
No need to apologize (you did, later): you're right. It's street talk, (not 
the kind I advocate!) but that doesn't mean it's all that common.
Some "creative language" is fine -- and fun, even. Other things are examples 
of ignorance and are not fine. This may be one of the most difficult things 
to ascertain when learning a language, particularly when using films or TV as 
aids to learning.



.. an American thing...
  why should "American" mean from the United States

 
mmm... one could argue that people from Tonga Island or Samoa are not
americans.
By the way, how do you define the "western" hemisphere? If it is
anything between 0 and 180 degrees longitude therefore the Welsh are
"americans", according to what you are saying...
Otherwise, if you start your "western hemisphere", say, from New York,
therefore it ends somewhere in Japan...
-- 
Primo autunno,
grandina sulla citta'.
Cazzo la Micra!

 
con l' eccezione di To do, che regge altri verbi per le forme negative e
interrogative ma prende la s alla terza persona (does), e di to be e to
have, che si coniugano come dei verbi da cristiani cambiando le persone.
-- 
l'amore del gatto:
indifferente anche al riso
rimasto sui baffi

 therefore it ends somewhere in Japan...
Actually, I was being sloppy in that while I wrote it, I wondered what
exactly was considered "western hemisphere" but figured that it wasn't
important enough to nitpick, because it still got across the main point. I
could have said "the Americas" but it seemed too self-referent. Besides, I
figured that someone else would just add a post with some more exact
definition. Although your post only questions, and doesn't provide any other
definitive information, I suppose it does still do the job.

  why should "American" mean from the United States
that's what I said

 word and say "American".
Yes, but it is the "United States OF America". That *of* makes me read 
the whole thing as "united states, part of the american continent". 
Therefore, "America" is in the name, yet is only a genitive case, 
something secondary.
Does this make any sense?
I read form wikipedia that it was Benjamin Franklin who started to
spread the term "Americans".

 
well, I was just pointing out that "America" has a precise geographical
meaning (they are two continents!), and that there is not need to
involve some not well defined hemispheres in its description.
But I agree that all the people dwelling in the southern or northern
American continents are Americans.
Ladybat
-- 
sera:
la bianca orchidea si nasconde
nel suo profumo

 that's what I said
There are lots of words that have accepted meanings that are ambiguous in
regard to their literal meanings, but we use them because they become
conventions. Word connotation is by its nature, based on commonly accepted
conventions. You could always start using "statunitese" in Italian and
"United Statesians" in English and see if it catches on with others.
Two people have already explained to you that the USA is the only country 
with 'America' in its name. I don't see you acknowledging that revelation. 
Are you just too excited about the idea of stumbling upon this tired old 
observation that American can mean two different things, depending on 
context?
 In England, the word 'yanks' means people from the United States, but in 
the US it means only people from the North East of the United States. Each 
group continues to use their own definitions because those are the 
conventions of their group.

 context?
I certainly agree with you as far as the muddiness of the definition, but a 
tired old observation is neither tired nor old to one who has just "stumbled" 
upon it. Rather, it can be enlightening, informative, astounding, bewildering 
-- take your pick.
Just last week I had a bit of an altercation -- "misunderstanding" might be a 
better way to put it -- with a Canadian who insisted he was not an American. 
His reason for arguing might have been more political than geographical, but 
the confusion persists even on this continent.
When I went to South America for the first time, I quickly learned I was 
*not* "americano"; I was "*norte*americano* or "estadounidense", but everyone 
present considered themselves "americano." Maybe in this political framework 
they would argue to the contrary, like my northern neighbor.
I'm guilty of referring to myself as an American in this NG, and elsewhere. 
Maybe it's because there is no one single English word for 
"United-States-National." I think that's part of your argument, as well.


"Giff" <giff...@gmail.com.invalid> wrote in message
news:f0aphp$vbh$2...@aioe.org...

I agree. Let's change it from America and American to Vespuccia and
Vespuccian.
Joe from Massachusetts

 context?
No. I was just asking the actual reason that gave birth to this 
convention. I recognize, however, that I did not state my question 
clearly, and that it sounded like I had just discovered that the whole 
two continents are called America.

 Vespuccian.
Well, let's call them Cristofora and Cristoforians then. :)



I'd rather not be referred to as an Ugly Little Wasp, if it's all the same to 
you. But then again, that might be better than some people's descriptions at 
the present time... :-D
-- 
Joey DoWop Dee
Disclaimer:
Ihope to provide readers with acceptable,
viable, correct examples of how an
American speaks day-to-day English.

 continents are called America.
Although we all know the etymology of the term 'America', I don't know when 
'Americans' was first used to refer to people living in the 'New World'. I 
would imagine that the European colonists in North America began to refer to 
themselves as Americans even before their independence from Europe. 
Although, more likely, they probably first assumed the moniker of their 
locality, such as Bostonians and Philadelphians. Once the colonies were 
united, a more far reaching term would have had to come into common use.