Newsgroup: it.cultura.linguistica.inglese
Titolo: Con i se e con i ma non si fa la storia

come tradurreste la frase in oggetto in inglese nel modo pi� "letterale" 
possibile ma con risultato che sia "credibile"?
"with if and with but did not make history"?
"with perhaps did not make the history"?
Boh!
 
Grazie.
 
-- 
Massy 
 
 


 
-- 
Joey from New York
Among those whom I like or admire, I can find no common denominator,
but among those whom I love, I can: all of them make me laugh.
   -- WH Auden
 


Non � molto "letterale", ma grazie mille! :-)
 
-- 
Massy 
 
 

 Christmas.
 



Allora, letteralmente,
 
With 'ifs' and 'buts' one doesn't make history.
 
O meno litteralmente, ma meglio per capire il senso,
 
One doesn't make history with 'ifs' and 'buts.'


Perfetto!
Grazie mille ad entrambi! ;-)
 
-- 
Massy 
 
 

 
 
No, it's not too literal, but the expression is somewhat obscure and isn't 
very common in English, to my knowledge.
 
A literal translation, "You don't make history with 'ifs' and 'buts' " has 
*about* the same meaning ("Don't make excuses for your shortcomings") but is 
much less colorful, IMHO.


 One doesn't make history with 'ifs' and 'buts.'
 
 
quello che trovo interessante è: come viene percepito da
un parlante di madrelingua? Un uso creativo/sofisticato
dell'inglese o si sente proprio che è un "idiom" portato
da un'altra lingua?
 
ciao!
 
Apx.
 

Tony the Ice Man, 21:15, venerd� 2 novembre 2012:

"One doesn't make pens with whens and thens."
(My creation, does that means anything?   :-)
 
 
-- 
Reader, suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member
of Congress. But I repeat myself.
    -- Mark Twain
 

 da un'altra lingua?
 
Non ï¿œ un'idioma inglese ma se vuoi diffondere le parole, hanno senso e 
possono diventare un'idioma senza problema. Ma in realitï¿œ, le idiome 
inglesi sono piï¿œ "folksy" come "Ifs and buts won't change the world."

 (My creation, does that means anything?   :-)
 
Not really. But then, one doesn't make pies with hows and whys.
 

 "One doesn't make pens with whens and thens."
 
Non si fanno le penne con i quando e gli allora?!?!
Non ho capito cosa volessi intendere...
 
-- 
Massy 
 
 

 
 
Nor do I. The original meaning is lost here. These are cutesy rhyming 
phrases, but none of them carry the original meaning.
 
"If" and "but" are words used to excuse oneself from failures...
"If I had xxx I would have done it..."
"But I tried my best..."
 
Words that are used in the face of one's shortcomings.
 
There's another English-language saying that expresses a similar thought:
 
If wishes were horses, beggars would ride. (No it doesn't rhyme; it's not 
meant to.)
 
IOW: Get real and face the facts of your own responsibilities.


 IOW: Get real and face the facts of your own responsibilities.
 
Se i desideri fossero cavalli, gli accattoni vorrebbero cavalcare?
Mi sfugge il senso... Significa che gli accattoni seguono sempre e ad ogni 
costo i loro sogni?
Però non capisco come possa sottintendere "prenditi le tue responsabilità"
Boh!
 
-- 
Massy 
 
 





 
Ah ok! Ora � molto pi� chiaro!
 
-- 
Massy 
 
 

 rhyming phrases, but none of them carry the original meaning.
 
 
Nessun significato, era solo un gioco di parole. 
 
 
-- 
The one charm of marriage is that it makes a life of deception a
neccessity.
    -- Oscar Wilde
 

Anche: se mio nonno avesse le ruote, sarebbe una carriola!

 Anche: se mio nonno avesse le ruote, sarebbe una carriola!
 
 
Io la sapevo come 
"se mia nonna avesse le ruote sarebbe un tram."
 
:-)
 
 
-- 
The brotherhood of man is not a mere poet's dream; it is a most
depressing and humiliating reality.
    -- Oscar Wilde
 

 :-)
 
Io sapevo:
"se mio nonno avesse avuto tre palle sarebbe stato un flipper"
 
-- 
Massy 
 
 

 
 
"Balls!" said the Queen. "If I had two I'd be King."


 
 
 
Oppure "Se mia nonna avesse le palle avrei tre nonni".
 
G