Newsgroup: it.cultura.linguistica.inglese
Titolo: domani è un anno

Salve,
   come tradureste: "domani č un'anno che ci conosciamo!", I'd say: 
"I've known you for a year tomorrow"...
grazie

 "I've known you for a year tomorrow"...
That sounds a little strange.
Io direi "tomorrow it will be a year since we met"  anche se la frase
e' leggermente diversa dall'originale.
bye
ari

 
Could I have said: "tomorrow it will be a year since we *first* met" ?
anyway, andrebbe bene se dicessi: "tomorrow it will be a year since I've 
worked here"?
ciao


No. I wouldn't use the present perfect with "since".   If you want to
use "since", you should put the verb in the simple past and also use a
different verb.  If you are still working there, you can't have work in
the simple past, so....
Tomorrow it will be a year since I started working here.
Or
tomorrow it will be a year that that I've been working here.
(I'm, not too crazy about the last sentence, but unless you want to be
very formal, it will do).
Maybe someone else can give you a better translation.
ciao
ari

 Io direi "tomorrow it will be a year since we met"
Io avrei detto "tomorrow it will have been a year since we met"? 
E' sbagliato? Ha un significato differente? 
Max

 No. I wouldn't use the present perfect with "since". 
I haven't killed anyone since 1954.


No, e' correttissimo secondo me (but then again, I speak American
English).  Infatti e' la traduzione piu' corretta, pero' il future
perfect non e' piu' tanto in uso :-((
bye
ari


OH MY GOD!  you must think I'm nuts!  did I say that?  I think I was
trying to exlain something else and got confused.  You have to forgive
me!  Eight months of chemotherapy have fried some of my neurons.  Well,
at least I didn't use my school address in that post.
Yes, OF COURSE you can use the present perfect with since.  I think
what I wanted to say was that if you do not give a specific point in
time, you cannot use the present perfect.
OK let me see if I can go back and explain it again....or maybe I
shouldn't.
ari

 Tomorrow it will be a year since I started working here.
ok here I am replying to my own post.
What I meant to say is that you can't say "tomorrow it will be a year
since I've worked here".  You can say "tomorrow it will be a year since
I started working here"  IN YOUR SENTENCE you cannot use "since" with
the present perfect as you have it down.  You can say "I've worked here
since 9/23/04" Or I've worked here for a year.  I think the best
translation is It will be a year tomorrow since I started working here.
I hope I was clear enough.  Sorry about the confusion in my previous
post.
bye
ari

 Tomorrow it will be a year since I started working here.
I'm not sure "since I've started working here" wouldn't do; in BritEng at
least. What do Brits think?
[...]
Bye, FB
-- 
"Oh oh... Oh my God. My parents are having an affair."
(Gilmore Girls - 512)

Giovanni
.......
#10 Non desiderare la roba d'altri.
#11 Fatti i fatti tuoi.
#12 Non portare obbligo.

 --
Hmmm...that sounds weird.  No, I don't think you can say that.
ari

 I haven't killed anyone since 1954.
But what ari is saying (in context) is that you wouldn't use the present 
perfect *after* since (i.e. in a clause beginning with 'since') . Wouldn't 
you say , 'It's 51 years since I killed anyone' rather than '...I have 
killed...' ?
Mike 

 least. What do Brits think?
It wouldn't do for me , for the same reason that Larry's original sentence 
('since I've worked') won't do ; that is , that 'since + present perfect' in 
a future sequence doesn't seem correct to me . The present perfect implies 
that you are looking at a perfected act from the standpoint of the present ; 
if the verb in the main clause is in the future tense (and therefore places 
you at a point in the future) the present perfect is inappropriate .
(Apart from that , your sentence wouldn't , I'm afraid , have the merit of 
being very likely even if it were in a present tense sequence : 'It's a year 
since I have started working here' - 'starting' isn't an activity that begun 
in the past can still be carrying on now , so it would have to mean that you 
were some kind of serial work-starter here who last work-started here a year 
ago but haven't work-started here since .)
Mike

 wrote in message 
news:1127498352.3...@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

Well , I don't think it's *more* correct - in any English ; from the 
perspective of the present , the future perfect puts you at a point in the 
future looking back at a perfected action which has not yet been 
accomplished : 'Tomorrow we shall finish our task' ; 'The day after tomorrow 
we shall have finished out task' : the completion of the task is in the 
future , and the second sentence takes us forward to a point where we can 
look back upon the completion of the task .
If today we say 'Today it is a year since we met' , then yesterday we would 
have said , 'Tomorrow it will be a year since we met' (simple present > 
simple future) and there can't be a correcter version .
If today we say  'It's been a year today since we saw Tom' , then this , 
simply projected into the future , becomes 'Tomorrow it will have been a 
year ...' (present perfect > future perfect).
Italian learners of English should note that the odd thing about the 
construction 'It's a year since' is that usually  it introduces something 
which has not happened since that time ('It's a year since we made love') 
and sometimes something which is understood as continuing from that time to 
the present ('It's a year since we became lovers') ; in the latter case , 
what is expressed is usually the initiation of a state , as opposed to a 
finite action , but in some cases (where the 'state' is implied) both 
meanings are possible , as is the case with 'met' ; usually the context 
avoids ambiguity : 'It's a year since I met their Chairman' is likely to 
mean you had a meeting which hasn't been repeated since ; 'It's a year since 
Sheila and I met' in another context clearly might imply a relationship 
which has continued since that time ; but introducing the word 'last' (or 
'first') , as we often do , avoids any ambiguity ; and of course there are 
several other ways we could choose to express the same idea .
Mike

 year ...' (present perfect > future perfect).
Well, that was the concept in the original sentence even though Italian
uses the simple present in place of the present perfect.  As you know,
Italian uses the simple present in instances where English uses the
present perfect.
I've worked here for a year = lavoro qui da un anno  OR e' un anno che
lavoro qui.
Here are your two last examples:
'It's been a year today since we saw Tom' --> present perfect + simple
past
'Tomorrow it will have been a year since we saw Tom --> fut. perf. +
past
Let's change the last part of your sentence, which is not what the
discussion focuses on anyway, and instead of "since we saw Tom", let's
say "since we met".
We now have "tomorrow it will have been a year since we met".  If
"tomorrow it will have been a year since we saw tom" is correct, why
not "tomorrow it will have been a year since we met"?  Again, the
present perfect in Ialian is there in "concept" although the sentence
is in the simple present.
And with these Socratic remarks I now leave you.  It's my bedtime.  I
have to go....
ciao
Ari

 correct .
An engineer or an economist was sent for by a firm to solve a specific
problem; he stayed there ten days, then he went away. After a year the firm
rings him up again, to solve another problem. While dining with two
managers who work at the firm, he says "It's (been) a year since I've
worked here (i.e. since I did that particular job)"; or indeed "It's (been)
a year since I worked here". Would the sentence still be incorrect?
[...]
Bye, FB
-- 
If you knock on my door and I call out "Who is it?", you, as a normal
person, knowing that I would recognize your voice, would say "It's me". If
you said "It is I", I would not be nearly so inclined to let you in.
(Geoffrey K. Pullum - 
http://snipurl.com/bhtu
)

Hmmm...that sounds weird.  No, I don't think you can say that.
tomorrow we'll have known each other for a year, then


 have to go....
OK - but I didn't say it wasn't correct : what you still have to prove when
you wake up again is why it should be MORE correct than the other version !
Mike


I can only repeat : you can say that , but would you ? Both sentences sound 
contrived . It is possible to imagine conversational contexts in which both 
these might appear , but they remain unlikely forms of expression .
(I'm not sure what the 'still' refers to ; the only sentences I said were 
incorrect were Larry's 'Tomorrow it will be a year since I've worked here' 
and your 'Tomorrow it will be a year since I've started working here' , in 
both cases because the sequence of future > future perfect seems to me wrong 
; and my modification of your sentence ,'It's a year since I have started 
working here' , on the grounds of sense - 'started working here' isn't 
something susceptible of repetition ) .
I don't mean that 'It's a year since + present perfect' constructions , of 
the type you quote , aren't  found in common usage ; but even in the limited 
range of situations in which they could be used , you're still much more 
likely to find one of the alternative structures (and that's even more 
likely with 'met') .
Mike 

 wrote:
One more thing them, suppose I'm taking an exam: "Are you ok? yeah, I'm 
just quite jittery about the interview, maybe cause it's years since I 
was in front of a teacher, that's it!", then at the end of the exam: 
"How do you feel know?, I'm fine! I just felt quite jittery about the 
interview maybe because It was years since I have/had been in front of a 
teacher, that's it!"...
what about you?
thanks
-- 
Alla batteria dai retta, ballA!

 'It's two years since I met Mr. Berlusconi at the Verona Economic Conference' 
"Ho conosciuto Berlusconi alla Conferenza economica di Verona due anni fa"


 something susceptible of repetition ) .
I see. A present perfect seems correct when "last <simple past>" would make
sense.
Thanks for your thorough explanation.


 wrote in message 
news:kglvlo3afr1f$.dlg@news.lillathedog.net...

Yes , the Italian versions do make the distinctions more clearly than the 
English .
Mike 


Either ' maybe because it's years since I've been in front of a teacher '
or       ' maybe because it was years since I'd been in front of a teacher'
(present + present perfect OR past + past perfect)
Mike 

 Either ' maybe because it's years since I've been in front of a teacher '
It's the "it's a year since I've worked here" pattern. Do you remember the
engineer/economist? I might as well give him a name, poor chap. (smiling
face)
Bye, FB
-- 
Nasalization is just a part of life.
(Joey DoWop Dee on it.cultura.linguistica.inglese)


 It is . It doesn't alter my view of the relative likelihood of that 
expression , though , as opposed to 'it's years since I've been in front of 
a teacher' . I think perhaps the more specific the time and the more 
precisely located the action , the less likely you are to choose this 
pattern . 'It's years since I've been able to do what I want at the 
weekends' , 'It's years since I've felt this way about anyone' - this sort 
of expression is both common and natural . Imagine a school-teacher who went 
into industry for 15 years , but has come back to teach for a term ; 'It's 
years since I've had anything to do with children , but I felt immediately 
at home in the classroom again' - this strikes me as a quite natural usage 
(whatever the idea lacks in verisimilitude) , indeed the most likely choice 
of expression . If the same chap were back in his old school , 'It's fifteen 
years since I've taught English here' sounds much less so - you'd have to 
think hard to construct a dialogue into which this would fall naturally .
Same with your engineer - if you can create a dialogue in which 'it's a year 
since I've worked here' falls naturally and appears the most likely choice 
of expression , then I may have to admit I'm barking up the wrong tree (or 
simply barking) .
Mike 

 [...] Gli è che degli inglesi affamati mi hanno chiesto di preparare un
risotto per un centinaio di persone. [...] pericoli? [...]
Che la pentola ti cada addosso sotterrandoti. (sai che speciale di Studio
Aperto che viene fuori)
(Dott. Vernes su it.hobby.cucina)

 Would "since I taught English here" your choice, then?
I'd say "it's been 15 years since I taught English here".
-- 
Mary