Newsgroup: it.cultura.linguistica.inglese
Titolo: Congiuntivo presente

Perdonate la domanda, ma il congiuntivo presente come si esprime in inglese?
:'o(
Frase semplice: Che io vada a Roma č una possibilitą..
Potreste tradurmela, vi prego
Saluti Davide Lo Giudice

 Frase semplice: Che io vada a Roma è una possibilità..
    Dal momento che il congiuntivo inglese è scomparso, lasciando scarsi
residui, è necessario usare il "congiuntivo strategico", ossia quello che
sentiamo spesso utilizzare anche in italiano, basta accendere la
televisione... ma non istighiamo sterili polemiche.
    Il congiuntivo, in italiano, può esprimere svariate sfumature:
DUBBIO
"Che sia di Perugia?"
    In questo caso, al presente semplice (il tempo si rispetta, non il modo,
essendo il congiuntivo, appunto, inesistente) si può aggiungere un avverbio
od una locuzione che esprima il concetto di dubbio, per esempio:
    "Perhaps she's from Perugia" oppure:
    "She must be from Perugia" ("must" per esprimere possibilità è molto
diffuso in inglese, talvolta equivale al nostro futuro cólla medesima
funzione)
    "I think she's from Perugia" (in questo caso accentui il fatto che si
tratta di una supposizione)
    Etc.
    Chiaramente, il contesto e la sensibilità linguistica sono i parametri
fondamentali per scegliere la forma piú appropriata.
ESORTAZIONE
"Che vada a Roma!"
    In questo caso lo si può considerare alla stregua di un imperativo
(segnatamente se si tratta di una forma di cortesia) oppure ricorrere ad un
verbo modale, tipo "may" oppure "let":
    Let him go to Rome!
    May he go to Rome! (Quest'ultimo assomiglia anche al congiuntivo
imperfetto: "Se andasse a Roma!").
POSSIBILITÀ
"Che io vada a Roma è possibile"
    Non potendo esprimere la possibilità col modo verbale, sarà necessario
adoperare un verbo cosiddetto modale che svolga detta funzione. Per esempio,
"may" (o "might" se la possibilità è minore): I may go to Rome, per esempio.
Oppure, compatibilmente col contesto e cólla sfumatura che si intende dare,
si può riformulare il tutto come: "My departure for Rome is possible" oppure
"Perhaps I'll go to Rome", etc. Per tradurre con efficacia, è sempre meglio
avere una visione d'insieme, concentrarsi eccessivamente sul particolare può
essere fuorviante.
    Questa è solo una parzialissima rassegna, ma spero possa aiutarti.
    Ciao,
            Nicola
--
Multa non quia difficilia sunt non audemus, sed quia non audemus sunt
difficilia (Seneca).

 Frase semplice: Che io vada a Roma è una possibilità..


 Saluti Davide Lo Giudice
Dovresti sapere che il congiuntivo non è molto usato in inglese come in
italiano, ma direi io che questa frase si traduca:  "It is possible that
I might go to Rome."
-- 
Dale Erwin
http://home.earthlink.net/~erwintech

Congiuntivo per ( I ) 
I = were
If I were a girl , I'd like to have long sandy hair
( Se fossi una ragazza mi piacerebbe avere lunghi capelli biondo scuro )
1 )
I think he to go 
[ penso che tu vada ]
I want you to go
[ Io voglio che tu vada ]
I'd like you to go
[ Mi piacerebbe che andassi ]
I can't stand you to go
[ Non posso sopportare che tu vada ]
diverso
I can't believe you'd go
[ Non posso credere che tu sia andato ]
2 )
 
Con passato congiuntivo
I wish you'd go
[ Vorrei che tu andassi ]
I whish I could go to Rome
[magari potessi andare a Rome ]
I whish it would stop raining
[ vorrei che smettesse di piovere ]
3 ) Futuro dentro passato
You explained why you'd go to Rome
[ hai spiegato perche saresti andato a Rome ]
( con intenzione prime che azione )
You explained why you was gonna to go to Rome
4 ) preso esempio da ( CHE IO VADA A ROME E UNA POSSIBILITA )
POSSIBILITA
There's the chance that I might go to Rome
[ E possibile che io vada a Roma ]
ESEMPIO DIVERSO
Is there any chance that I might get pregnant
[ E possibile che io rimanga in cinta ]
COSTRIZIONE
There's the chance that I gotta go to Rome
VOLONTA
There's the chance that I would go to Rome
anche :
There's the chance for me to go to Rome
5 ) PASSATO
 
There's the chance that I might have gone to Rome ( before )
( E possibile che io sia andato ( gia ) a Roma )
ESEMPIO DIVERSO
Is there any chance that I might have got pregnant ??
( E possibile che io sia rimasta in cinta )
There was the chance for me to have gone to Rome
6 ) TRAPASSATO
I didn't remember whether I might had been to Rome or not
( Non ricordavo se fossi stato a Roma oppure no )
 
ESEMPIO DIVERSO
Was there any chance that I might had got pregnant
( Era possibile che io fossi rimasta in cinta? )
7 ) POSSIBILITA con ( SE )
If I went to Rome what highway would I get ??
( Se andassi a Roma quale autostrada prenderei ? )
Passato
What highway would I have got if I would have gone to Rome
( Quale autostrada avrei preso se fossi andato a Roma ?? )
ESEMPIO DIVERSO
I don't know where he might be , but I don't think he would have been interested in going to Rome
( Non so dove sia , ma non credo che fosse interessato a andare a Rome )
anche
You wouldn't have gone to Rome , if you hadn't got you car fixed
( Non saresti andato a Roma , se non avessi fatto aggiustare la tua macchina )
If I had known you'd go to Rome , I would have come with you
( Se avessi saputo che saresti andato a Rome ,sarei venuto con te )
If it wasn't for you , I wouldn't have gone to Rome
( se non fosse per te , non sarei andato a Roma )
If I weren't working , I would come to Rome
( se non stessi lavorando , andrei a Rome )
You've been to Rome without letting me to know ??
Anyway , well done !!!
You could not have chosen any better even if you'd have asked me for
a tip and bought a guide
( Sei andato a Roma senza dirmelo ??
 Comunque , bravo !!
 Non avresti potuto scegliere meglio nemmeno se mi avessi chiesto
 un sonsiglio e avessi comprato una guida )
CON SHOULD
I should never have gone to Rome ,if you hadn't helped me
( Non sarei mai riuscito andare a Rome , se non mi avessi aiutato )
If you should feel sick , please get hold of me !!
( Se dovessi stare male , perfavore chiamami !! )
CON SHOULD SENZA IF 
I can dare tell him I'll go to Rome , afraid that he should be angry
with me
( Non oso dire che andro a Rome , ho paura che si arrabbi con me )
We kept that from him , so as he should not find it out !!
( Le abbiamo tenuto questo nascosto , perche non lo scoprisse )
The only rule is , that you should be on the dot
( La sola regola , e che tu sia puntuale )
I asked that you should come to Rome with me
( Ho chiesto che venissi a Roma con me )
I'm amazed that you should pull such a thing
( Sono sorpreso che tu possa fare simili cose )
CON NEED
Non cera bisogno che andassi a Roma
( you needn't have gone to Rome )
INPERSONALE
Se non si dicesse che Roma e bella , dove avresti tu ?
( If Rome weren't said to be beautiful , where would you go ?? )
Se non si potesse andare a Rome , dove andresti ?
( If you couldn't go to Rome , where would you go ?
DURATION FORM 
If it wasn't for you , I wouldn't been living here 
[ Se non fosse per te , io non vivrei ( starei vivendo ) qui
If you hadn't talked me out of not going to Rome
I wouldn't have been figuring everything out about Rome history
( Se non vi avessi esortato dal non andare a Roma
Io non starei capendo ogni cosa riguardo Roma )
Articolata
1 ) Livello 
I hadn't been sleeping for three hours when he dropped by my room
if you wouldn't have forgotten to set the alarm
( Non sarebbero state tre ore che dormivo quando lui entro di sorpresa
dentro la mia camera , se tu non avessi dimenticato di programmare la sveglia )
2 ) Livello
I hadn't been sleeping for three hours when he dropped by my room
if you wouldn't have been forgetting to set the alarm
( Non sarebbero state tre ore che dormivo quando lui entro di sorpresa
dentro la mia camera , se tu non stessi dimenticando di programmare la sveglia )
3 ) Livello
I hadn't been sleeping for three hours when he dropped by my room
if you wouldn't had been forgettin to set the alarm
( Non sarebbero state tre ore che dormivo quando lui entro di sorpresa dentro la mia camera , 
se tu non ( stavi dimenticando ( per un certo tempo
sempre ha dimenticato ( DURATION FORM ) 
[ like : used to forget ] di programmare la sveglia )
8 ) PARAGONE con AS IF
I stink as if I wore the same clothes for six days
( puzzo come se indossassi gli stessi abiti da sei giorni )
I feel like I were spellbound
( Mi sento come se fossi stregato )
I could never kill an animal for sport ,
because it would be as if I were killing a human being 
( Non potrei mai uccidere un animale per sport , 
perche sarebbe come se uccidessi un essere umano )
I was bleeding as much as if I were have been cut with a sword
( Stavo sanguinando forte come se mi avessere tagliato con una spada )
If I look up the sky , it would be as if were staring the heaven
( Se guardo il cielo , e come se stessi guardando il paradiso )
He was scared , as if he had seen a monster
( Era spaventata , come se avesse visto un mostro ) 
He looked me as if I were supposed to say something
( Mi guardava come se dovessi dire qualcosa )
(sarcastic)
Can you fix that right now ??
Right !! 
As if I were supposed to fix it in one minute !!!
( Puoi aggiustarlo adesso ??
 Come no !! ( sarcastic )
 Come se potessi aggiustarlo in un minuto !!! )
9 ) RIMPIANTO
Only if you could understand !!!!
( Se potessi capire !!! )
Only if you knew what I've been going through !!!!
( Se sapessi cosa sto passando !!! )
Only if I had taken the train
( Se avessi preso quel treno !! )
FORME SPECIALI
1 )
As beaten as you're , you gotta sort your room out
( Per quanto stanco tu sia , devi sistemare la tuo camera !! )
As strange as it sounded , I used to have 30 kittens
( Per quanto strano sembrasse , Io avevo 30 gattini )
2 )
I wonder whether it might be true
( mi domando se sia vero )
I doubt that she might mean it 
( dubito che dica seriamente )
I wondered it might had been true
( Mi chiedevo se fosse vero )
I'm afraid that could be not the movie theater
( Ho paura che non sia il cinema )
3 )
FOSSE VERO !!
(Only it were true !! )
FOSSE FACILE !!
( If it were easy )
IL MINIMO CHE POSSA FARE
( the lightweight point I could do )
IL MEGLIO CHE CI POSSA ESSERE
( As goog as it gets )
LA TUA FORTUNA , SEMPRE CHE SI POSSA PARLARE DI FORTUNA...
( your lucky star , assuming we could call it lucky star.... )
------------------------------------------------------------------
"She must be from Perugia" ("must" per esprimere possibilità è molto
diffuso in inglese, talvolta equivale al nostro futuro cólla medesima
funzione)
    "I think she's from Perugia" (in questo caso accentui il fatto che si
tratta di una supposizione)
    Etc.
------------
Must e cambiato con GOTTA in AMERICAN ENGLISH
You gotta be stupid
( Devi essere stupido )
She gotta be at home
( deve essere a casa )
CONTACT
jodie foster
IT GOTTA BE VEGA [ la stella ]
( deve essere vega )
_____________________________________________________________
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     Etc.
A me verrebbe da dire:
I wonder whether she's from Perugia?
Ma non so... Che ne dici tu?
Karamel

 Ma non so... Che ne dici tu?
    "Chissà se è di Perugia?".
    Accettabile, direi. Come già dissi, sarebbe opportuno avere un contesto
piú ampio, e comunque c'è sempre un margine di scelta del tutto individuale.


 Ma non so... Che ne dici tu?
Perhaps more often said  as: I wonder if sh's from Perugia?"
I feel as if the 'whether' really needs an 'or' as well. "I wonder
whether she comes from Perugia or not?" Che ne pensate? Cheers,
Loki
-- 
  Brevity is the soul of wit.    W.Shakespeare

whether she comes from Perugia or not?" Che ne pensate? Cheers,
Yes, normally whether is used to introduce alternatives.


si', ma penso che nella frase I wonder whether she's from Perugia "or not" sia
sottinteso. 
Altro esempio:  He's taller than I (am).  Would you say that "he's taller than
I" is incorrect? Just asking.
(I am ) just asking.
ciao
Arianna

I" is incorrect? 
(I am) not sure; I would say "he's taller than me"; 


And you would be among the majority, however you would be mistaken.



And you would be among the majority, however you would be mistaken.


-- 
So not only I am too short, I am wrong, too... thanks for the information :)



I would say that too, but I don't really speak English and my intuitions
aren't worth much, if anything.
According to my grammar, though, both forms are acceptable, although the
one with 'I' is regarded as being more formal.
The first form is tipically upheld by prescriptive grammars, based on the
fact that 'I' is actually a subject. Moreover, the first contruction would
help resolve ambiguities, such as:
  I love the dog more than her
which apparently has two different meanings in informal English, but not
in formal English.
Max

 in formal English.
Yes, "I" and "she" function as subjects while "me" and "her" function as
objects. It is correct English to say "I love the dog more than her." which
means "I love the dog more than I love her."  If you said "I love the dog more
than she" that would mean "I love the dog more than she loves the dog." If you
say "He's taller than I" you are really saying "He's taller than I am tall." To
say "He's taller than me" is incorrrect English but very, very common, even
among native speakers. I might easily make the same mistake myself while
speaking to a friend.
Ciao,
Ron
USA

-- =
Excellent explanation; I know better now

il Mon, 06 Aug 2001 21:22:42 GMT, Dale Erwin ha scritto: [snip,
sorry]
Hmmm. I came across this on my searches some time ago:
Are You and I You and Me?
Occasionally we drive a long way down the wrong road, knowing we have
made the
wrong turn, but press on, hoping we will somehow end up in the right
place.
Do you ever hear anyone say things like:
   Mama told I to clean up my room.
   They came over to watch TV with I.
   The next drinks are on I.
Of course, not. In all these instances we would all say:
   Mama told me to clean up my room.
   They came over to watch TV with me.
   The next drinks are on me.
So why do the same people, who use "me" correctly when it stands
alone, say
things like this when it is compounded:
   Mama told you and I to clean up our rooms.
   They come over to watch TV with Fernando and I.
   The next drinks are on you and I.
The choice of "I" or "me" in English depends on the same rule as the
choice of
"he/him" and "she/her," the rule that determines the function of the
pronoun in
sentences. In the Subject position, where "he" and "she" would be
used, "I"
must be used.
.   I love broccoli.
.   S/he loves broccoli.
As the Object of a verb or preposition, however, "I" is replaced by
"me," just
as "he" is replaced by "him," and "she" is replaced by "her."
   Broccoli doesn't like me.
   Broccoli does like her.
The difference between "I" and "me" in English is the difference
between the
function of a Subject or Object in a sentence. The Subject of a
sentence is
what the sentence is about and for that reason is usually the first
noun or
noun phrase in the sentence. It usually occurs before the verb, "I
like
Fernando," and never after it, "Fernando likes I."
"Me" is the Object form of "I," just as "him" is the Object form of
"he." The
Object form is used after the verb but also after prepositions:
"Fernando likes
me" or "Fernando likes working with him."
As we saw above, we cannot use "I" and "me" randomly; we must observe
its
function in the sentence. This applies to all the personal pronouns.
First Person Singular   Third Person Singular   Third Person Plural
I like broccoli.             He likes broccoli.          They like
broccoli.
Fred saw me.              Fred saw him.               Fred saw them.
Fred looked at me.      Fred looked at him.        Fred looked at
them.
Coordinated noun constructions like "you and I" change nothing. It is
equally
incorrect to say "Me worked late" and "Maureen and me worked late."
And it is
equally incorrect to say "Fred looked at I" and "Fred looked at
Maureen and I."
So why do we say things like "Fred saw Maureen and I"?
A common ungrammatical dialectal construct in U.S. English is "Me and
Maureen
ate all our kohlrabi." Grammarians who try to write rules for
language rather
than describe the ones that are already there, "prescriptive
grammarians,"
found two problems with such constructions. First, the Subject
contains an
Object pronoun: "me." Second, the placement of "me" before the name
of someone
else was at one time considered impolite. Of course, politesse has
nothing to
do with grammar, that is, what is right or wrong in speech.
The result is that prescriptive grammar books used in U.S. schools
for years
have taught children to avoid constructions like "me and X" in favor
of "X and
I," where "X" represents any other noun or pronoun referring to a
human being.
They seldom make clear that this rule applies only in the Subject
position. The
critical grammatical rule, that "I" appears only in the Subject while
"me" must
be used in all Object positions gets lost in the concern for
etiquette.
Young people in the U. S. have been so exposed to this oversimplified
explanation of the "me-and-you" problem, that about 20 years ago U.
S. English-
speakers began switching "me and X" to "X and I" everywhere the
phrase
occurs in Subject and Object positions. When actors and others on TV
and radio
began speaking with this error, it spread like wildfire.
However, since yourDictionary.com has caught this speech error in its
early
stages, it is possible to stop its spread. The prescription is
simple: first,
we must all stop making the error. Second, we must make sure that
when we, as
teachers and parents, correct "me-and-you" problem, we keep in mind
that it is
a dual error: the grammatical error of using the Object form of "I"
in the
Subject position and a point of etiquette that is at best optional.
It is
crucial that everyone understands that changing the "me" to "I" is
restricted
to Subject position. Here is a simple table with some examples that
might be
helpful.
WRONG                                                 RIGHT
Sarah helped you and I.                       Sarah helped you and
me.
Can we keep this between you and I?    Can we keep this between you
and me.
She blamed everything on you and I.     She blamed everything on you
and me.
They served him before you and I.         They served him before you
and me.
Keep the following mnemonic sentence in mind: "I" am the Subject but
the Object
is "me." There are no exceptions. Join yourDictionary in the fight to
nip this
linguistic virus in the bud!
©2000, yourDictionary.com Inc. All Rights Reserved.
Any clearer now? :-)))


 CUT
Erny:
-------
No! But you can hear Bob Marley singing:
"Old pirates yes they rob I
Sold I to the merchant ships
Minutes after they took I
From the bottomless pit"
But I'm afraid Bob Marley isn't the best Queen's English testimonial.
:>))))))
Ciao
Erny
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

 Are You and I You and Me?
[snip]
Sorry about the formatting. I should've paid more attention to those
lines.


 :>))))))
But it's probably good Jamaican dialect. :-))
