Newsgroup: it.cultura.linguistica.inglese
Titolo: Online etimology dictionary

http://www.etymonline.com/
etymology 
    1398, from Gk. etymologia, from etymon "true sense" (neut. of etymos
"true," related to eteos "true") + logos "word." In classical times, of
meanings; later, of histories. Latinized by Cicero as veriloquium.

Giò
-Tutto ciò che può esistere, esiste.
          (Tullio Regge)

 I just LOVE these kind of things!
I suppose you mean "this kind of things". Your sentence makes sense but
means something else, in my opinion.
Bye, FB
-- 
"Golden orb... The golden orb... The golden orb..."
(Cold Comfort Farm, the film)

means something else, in my opinion.
imo they're (slightly) different, but both right.


 imo they're (slightly) different, but both right.
In their respective meanings.
Bye, FB
-- 
"While I'm here, might I make a few changes? I adore my bedroom, but do you
think I could have my curtains washed? I believe they're red, but I should
like to make sure."


In their respective meanings.
which are?


 which are?
As _I_ understand them, your version could mean "queste specie di cose",
"queste cose qui", whereas mine "questo genere di cose".
Ciao, FB
-- 
"Golden orb... The golden orb... The golden orb..."


 imo they're (slightly) different, but both right.
These kinds of things
This kind of thing
I would not say 'this kind of things'.
Having said that, a Google search results in 27,300 instances of  'this kind 
of things'. The results for the other two versions are 58,100 and 736,000 
respectively. I have no explanation why more than 27,000 people chose to 
write 'this kind of things'. Perhaps it's a regional issue.
Regarding the difference in meaning, the first version acknowledges slightly 
more the existence of  things similar to this one, however, they are 
virtually identical in meaning.

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I think we were talking about "these kind of things", to which I tried to
give a meaning, and "this kind of thing" (though I did write "this kind of
things").
Bye, FB
-- 
Io ho deciso di rifiutarmi di vederlo: Ettore con la faccia di Eric Banana
mi fa venire i conati.
(commento sul film "Troy" apparso su it.fan.scrittori.tolkien)

"queste cose qui", whereas mine "questo genere di cose".
in italiano chi è che dice "questE speciE di cose", e non "questA
speciE di cose"?
Comunque mi sembra tutto uguale, anche tra i due (tre) modi che hai
messo tu. In italiano, almeno, non cambia niente.


 things").
That's an easy mistake to make. I made a similar mistake while typing the 
Google searches. Just to keep the record straight, it was 'these kind of 
things' that returned 58,100 sites. The expression 'these kinds of things' 
returns 158,000. 

 Shame on Webster's New World Italian/English Dictionary.
What does it say exactly?
Bye, FB
-- 
L'importante è che risplenda tu, sola primadonna e immarcescibile leggenda
del tuo pianerottolo.
(Lucangel su it.cultura.libri)

 virtually identical in meaning.
I think we already went over this. You English speaking people like best to 
refer to "these kinds of things", while we Italians think of "questo tipo 
di cose".
I'll tell myself: ITIUS! It's the idiomatic usage, stupid! :)
Yet, in strictly logical terms, I believe we are right, in most cases, and
you are  wrong :-PPP  
because, in most cases, there is just *one* category (kind) that groups
more similar items (things). 
What do you reckon?
-- 
Enrico C
...still legal tender...

 wrote in message
news:16r8jjzwerq9x.1...@40tude.net...
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I agree with Tony, but would also say that "These kind of things" is
wrong,
when it should be "These kinds of things", even though many people
may use the wrong form. The same goes for "This kind of things"
instead of the correct "This kind of thing". These type of mistake are
very common, as is this type of mistakes.   :>)
Joe from Massachusetts

 What do you reckon?
Il problema sul tipo di questo è sempre in dubbio. Come diresti 'this
vintage of wine' o 'this variety of plum' in italiano?

 What does it say exactly?
tipo ['tipo] 1sm (a) (genere) kind, sort, type; _vestiti di tuttti i ~i_ all 
kinds of clothes; _sul ~ di questo_ of this sort. 

 tipo" is "on this kind".
Shame on Webster's New World Italian/English Dictionary. 

 prugna".
Vabbè, ma Enrico chesidi'? There is just *one* category (variety) that
groups more similar items (prugne)?

 Come diresti 'this vintage of wine' o 'this variety of plum' in italiano?
"Questa annata" (I wouldn't say "annata di vino"), "questa varietà di
prugna".
Bye, FB
-- 
"While I'm here, might I make a few changes? I adore my bedroom, but do you
think I could have my curtains washed? I believe they're red, but I should
like to make sure."


 OK, pensavo che si dica 'sul tipo di questo' per dire 'of this kind'.
"Di questo tipo" is indeed correct and would be appropriate. "Su questo
tipo" is "on this kind".
[...]
Bye, FB
-- 
"Melissa [P.] spazzola Thomas Fazi"
(notizia apparsa su it.cultura.libri)

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Oh, I see. It is correct, but I imagine it being used, for example, in a
shop: "Vorrei un vestito sul tipo di questo", which I feel as a little
vaguer than "vorrei un vestito di questo tipo". It means that you want a
dress more or less like that, even though you couldn't quite tell what a
dress like that is supposed to be.
Bye, FB
-- 
"Something to take to the country." (holding out a bunch of flowers)
"Flowers come _from_ the country, Charles."


 groups more similar items (prugne)?
Actually, either way is correct, AFAIK:
"Questa varietà di prugna." 
"Questa varietà di prugne."

 very common, as is this type of mistakes.   :>)
What about "These kinds of thing."?

 "Questa varietà di prugne."
But which is more logical?

 But which is more logical?
Hmmm... Both make sense to me.
Isn't it the same in English, in this case?
"This variety of roses."
"This variety of rose."


 wrote in message
news:16mny9es...@news.lillathedog.net...
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"This (these)" must always agree in number with "kind(s)".
This phrase may or may not agree in number with
the word following the "of".
The dilemma is not simply one of agreement in number between
adjectives and nouns, but also one of deciding how to classify
the noun following "of" in these phrases. In some cases, the number
of the word following the "of" would not agree with that of the
preceding adjective.
Some examples from the world of horticulture (which reminds
me of the old joke, "You can lead a horse to water but you
can't lead a horticulture") illustrate the problem of agreement
posed by the word following "of". Depending on how you
interpret the "class" of the word following the "of", or how the
speaker intends it, there may or may not be agreement in
number with the preceding adjective.
The word "plant" can refer to the plant "kingdom", which is the
category into which all living things which are not "animal" are
placed, but it can also refer to an individual member of this
classification.
"These species of plant are rare in America" coming from the
mouth of a scientist would be correct, because it is a
scientist speaking who is referring to some members of the
very general grouping into which all plants fall. It would not
be unusual for the word "Plant" to be capitalized in this context.
"These types of plants are found all over the Southwest"
coming from the mouth of a gardener talking about his
cacti would also be correct, since he is talking about growing
things found in his neighborhood, and is not using the word
"plant" to describe a rung in the ladder of classification, and
the word would never be capitalized in this context.
A similar conflict is found with "these races of Man" vs "these
races of men". The former is a placement of Man on a specific
rung in the hierarchy of living things, which an anthropologist
might use. The latter is a description of groups of individuals
in geographic locations, much as a historian might use.
Use of "races of men" in place of "races of Man" might lend a
racist tone to a discussion by implying that rather than being
members of the same Family, different groupings of men are
so different from each other as to be classified into separate
groups which emphasize differences rather than similarities.
I don't think the word "thing" is a descriptor used in any
classificatory system, so it would always require agreement
in number with the preceding adjective.
Joe from Massachusetts

 "This variety of rose."
Direi sempre 'this variety of rose'. 

 on 
it.cultura.linguistica.inglese :
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Okay, I suppose that sounds better. 
Still, the Oxford-Paravia dictionary allows "variety of roses" even in the 
meaning of kind, type. 
http://www.oxfordparavia.it/lemmaIta30998
varietą
2. (gamma) variety, range, assortment; una grande ~ di materiali a wide 
range of materials
3. (tipo) variety, kind; una ~ di rose a variety of roses.

 3. (tipo) variety, kind; una ~ di rose a variety of roses.
I think it's one of the many /pondian/ differences.
Bye, FB
-- 
Nasalization is just a part of life.
(Joey DoWop Dee on it.cultura.linguistica.inglese)


'A variety of roses' is a number of roses of different kinds ; 'a variety of 
rose' is a prticular kind of rose ; so I agree with Tony the Ice Man .
Mike