Newsgroup: it.comp.macintosh
Titolo: HFS+ fat32 insieme!

E' possibile?
Come?

 E' possibile?
I matrimoni etero sono proibiti presso i macchisti.
-- 
[ RiK0                                ]
[ non credo negli schemi non vincenti ]
[ two is an odd prime number          ]

 I matrimoni etero sono proibiti presso i macchisti.
LOL
Io l'ho fatto ma non riesco a fare l'fdisk e creare l'MBR (passo 5).Non 
so perche.
Ecco le istruzioni che ho seguito.Se qualcuno mi puo aiutare....
Thanks to simoncha, I was finally able to create FAT32 and bootable Mac 
partitions on the same disk. I'm posting my process in detail so others 
will know how. I was able to simplify some things and I had to guess 
with some of the steps so if anyone sees something that should have 
been done differently, let me know. So far, everything seems to work 
fine. I included the results of some compatibility testing at the end. 
The following steps should work in 10.3.
1) Determine the device (e.g. /dev/disk1) associated with your disk. I 
will be using disk1 and rdisk1 in my examples. You can use steps 2 
through 4 in the original hint to find the correct number for your 
disk. Unmount any partitions that are already on the disk (ejecting 
from Finder is sufficient). These partitions will be deleted.
2) I made two new partitions, one 18GB Mac (HFS+) called "Mac" and one 
10G FAT32 (MS-DOS) called "PC":
diskutil partitionDisk disk1 2 HFS+ Mac 18G MS-DOS PC 10G
3) Unmount the newly created partitions (eject from Finder).
4) Get the partition information. You can use the command pdisk in 
Terminal. Enter l (lower case L) to list a device's partition map and 
then /dev/disk1. Then q to quit pdisk. Here's what mine looked like:
/dev/disk3  map block size=512
   #:                 type name                 length   base     ( size )
   1:  Apple_partition_map Apple                    63 @ 1
   2:           Apple_Free                           0+@ 64
   3:            Apple_HFS Apple_HFS_Untitled_2 37486592 @ 262208   ( 17.9G)
   4:           DOS_FAT_32 DOS_FAT_32_Untitled_3 20856304 @ 37748800 (  9.9G)
   5:           Apple_Free                           0+@ 58605104
5) Now use fdisk to create the master boot record (MBR) so Windows will 
recognize the FAT32 partition:
fdisk -e /dev/rdisk1
When prompted to initialize the partition table, enter y.
fdisk doesn't actually create any partitions. It just edits the MBR 
partition table. That's what the information from pdisk is for. The MBR 
created by fdisk can only contain information about four partitions. 
The important ones to enter are the Apple partition map and the HFS+ 
and FAT32 partitions. This means that in step 2, you can create a total 
of three partitions. The commands for the two partitions I created are:
edit 1 partition id: af (I wasn't sure what partition id to use for the 
Apple partition map so I just used HFS+) edit in CHS mode? n partition 
offset: 1 (This is the value in the base column for the Apple partition 
map in the output from pdisk.) partition size: 63 (from the length 
column for the partition map)
edit 2 partition id: af (for HFS+) edit in CHS mode? n partition 
offset: 262208 (from the base column for the HFS partition in the 
output from pdisk) partition size: 37486592 (from the length column for 
the HFS partition)
edit 3 partition id: c (for Win95 FAT32L) edit in CHS mode? n partition 
offset: 37748800 (from the base column for the FAT32 
partition) partition size: 20856304 (from the length column for the 
FAT32 partition)
You can verify what you've entered using the print command:
         Starting       Ending
 #: id  cyl  hd sec -  cyl  hd sec [     start -       size]
------------------------------------------------------------------------
 1: AF    0   0   2 -    0   1   1 [         1 -         63] HFS+
 2: AF   16  82   3 - 1023 192  19 [    262208 -   37486592] HFS+
 3: 0C 1023 192  20 - 1023 254  47 [  37748800 -   20856304] Win95 FAT32L
 4: 00    0   0   0 -    0   0   0 [         0 -          0] unused
Nothing is written to the partition table yet so use the write command 
to do that. Then quit to exit fdisk.
You're done. If you compare this process to the one described by 
simoncha, you'll see that it's basically the same except that I left 
out steps 5 and 7 through 10. This is because I was getting "invalid 
argument" at step 10 and nothing was being written back to the 
partition table. Since step 10 wasn't really doing anything, the other 
steps aren't needed.
Compatibility Information
Windows All the versions of Windows I tried can read and write to the 
FAT32 partition. I tested 98SE, Millennium, 2000, and XP. ScanDisk and 
chkdsk don't report any problems with the partition. I reformatted the 
FAT32 partition using Disk Management in Windows XP. I then examined 
the Apple partition table with pdisk and the MBR with fdisk. They 
appeared to be unchanged. Disk Management also shows unallocated space 
and an unknown partition. Don't format those.
Mac OS X 10.2 I have not been able to create the MBR using fdisk on 
10.2. I also have not been able to install from a 10.2 CD to the HFS+ 
partition. It may be possible to clone 10.2 using Carbon Copy Cloner 
but I have not tested this. Otherwise, 10.2 reads and writes to the 
drive without issues. Disk Utility can be used to erase the HFS+ 
partition and it does not seem to alter the Apple partition table or 
the MBR.
Mac OS X 10.3 (and beyond) Everything appears to work with 10.3. It can 
create the partitions and the MBR. It can read and write to both 
partitions. Sometimes the FAT32 partition doesn't appear in the Finder 
even though it is mounted. Unmounting and mounting it with Disk Utility 
will make it show up. 10.3 can be installed to the HFS+ partition and 
it is bootable. Disk Utility can be used to erase the HFS+ partition 
and it does not seem to alter the Apple partition table or the MBR. 
Additional testing suggests that things will continue to work, even 
after April 29th.
Occasionally, repairing the FAT32 partition with Disk Utility will show 
something like:
Next free cluster in FSInfo block (3) not free
fix? yes
It always fixes it and the next scan finds nothing wrong.
Mac OS 9 OS 9 can read and write to the HFS+ partition only. Disk First 
Aid can be used to erase the HFS+ partition and it does not seem to 
alter the Apple partition table or the MBR. Because OS 9 drivers were 
not installed when the partitions were created, it cannot be used as an 
OS 9 startup disk. I tried using the OS9Drivers argument when I created 
the partitions with diskutil but this made the partition table much 
more complex. I don't think it will be possible to make it bootable 
with OS 9.
I also tested the disk with three third-party Mac disk utilities: 
DiskWarrior, Drive 10, and Norton Disk Doctor. Norton was the only one 
that reported any problems. They were invalid creation dates for the 
volume header block and alternate volume header block. These problems 
were fixed. The Apple partition table and the MBR appear to be 
unchanged.


Ricorda che questa operazione cancella i dati presenti sul disco fisso
del BOX esterno e devi cambiare *attentamente* i parametri che puntano
al tuo BOX. Occhi aperti quindi!
Per una migliore visualizzazione, cerca il post intitolato:
"Create HFS+ and FAT32 partitions on one external drive.
Authored by: moritzh on Mon, Jan 12 '04 at 07:43PM"
I'll share what I've found out because I think it gives you the best
possible solution for the problem. Possible that some of you know about
this already but from my point of view, my method has not explicitly
been described before and I feel it is a good summary of various details
spread over many previous posts.
Simply use
diskutil
to partition your extrnal FW drive! No need for a Windoze machine to set
this up. Check out the man page for diskutil, it describes pretty well
what you need to know and even gives an example which is almost exactly
what you want.
The command line tool diskutil pretty much does what the well-known Disk
Utility application does (duh...), except it also allows you to mix
Apple (HFS+, ...) partitions with MS-DOS partitions on the same drive
(you cannot do this with the Disk Utility).
Basically what you want is sth like this:
diskutil partitionDisk device numberOfPartitions MBRFormat <part1Format
part1Name part1Size> <part2Format part2Name part2Size>
Replace
<part1Format part1Name part1Size>
with the appropriate details for your HFS+ partition and
<part1Format part1Name part1Size>
with the appropriate details for the MS-DOS partion (or vice versa).
Keep in mind that the name for the DOS partition should be uppercase and
less than 12 chars, otherwise the partition will not be assigned a name
(but be created anyway).
When thinking about the size: You can use abbreviations like
10G
for 10 GByte (see man page). And you don't have to take out a calculator
to determine how much space is left for your second partition (given the
size of the first one): Simply use the desired size for the first
partition and then give a number which exceeds the amount of space left
for the second one - then automatically every little byte left will be
used for the second partition.
As for the device: Use the procedure described in the original post to
find out which device to use (to find out the disk #). Then use sth. like
/dev/disk2
Check out the man page for details.
Although you cannot repartition your boot up disk anyway, I think, be
careful here and eject any other disks (such as iPods etc.) before using
this command, just in case... As you know, there will be no confirmation
question after entering the command and all data on the whole disk (all
volumes) will be lost, so make sure you find out the appropriate disk #
before typing in anything for fun.
Using the parameter
MBRFormat
specifies that the partition table be written in such a way that Windoze
machines can read it.
And here is what you get using the procedure described above:
A partition which will be recognizable on Windoze machines AND Mac
machines without problems and a HFS+ partition which will be recognized
automatically on the Mac without any problems (no need to manually mount
the volume after logging in as described in the original post, the
volume will automatically be mounted upon log in and can be unmounted
just like any other external volume in the Finder).
HOWEVER, YOU CANNOT BOOT UP YOUR MAC FROM THE HFS+ PARTITION.
As has been said before in previous posts: The way partition tables are
stored on Win and Mac systems differs. (At the moment) you cannot have
HFS+ and FAT32 (Windows) partitions on the same drive and boot up into
the appropriate partition on BOTH systems. See also Pierre Duhem's
concerns expressed in a previous post above on this. So if you are
REALLY concerned about your data you might want to not use the procedure
described and instead stick with ONLY HFS+ or ONLY FAT32. However, I
have not experienced any problems with the setup described above (apart
from the fact that I cannot boot off the partition which is not so
relevant for me anyway and which I don't consider a problem now that i
know about it). But can't guarantee total functionality, of course.
[Insert "Batteries not included, only valid where not prohibited" and
your other favorite legal warnings here.]
As I said, the Finder can perfectly handle the HFS+ volume created in
the above manner. It's the Mac's open firmware that does not allow
booting with the created HFS+ partition (because it does not like the
partition table in MBRFormat). It took me quite a few tries to find out
the details on this. For instance, I created a separate HFS+ partition
onto which I cloned my whole internal boot up hard drive (via Carbon
Copy Cloner). In System Preferences under Startup Disk you can then also
select the cloned system for the next start up, BUT IT WILL NOT WORK.
Apparrently, the open firmware does not like it (the external FW drive
is not detectable at start up (press the [option] key when switching
your Mac on to select the start up drive and the FW drive won't show up)
but System Preferences does not know this and would let you choose the
FW drive for start up although it will not work. On the other hand, by
not using the parameter MBRFormat, which you might think would be worth
a try, you would end up with a FAT32 (MS-DOS) partition which can be
handled perfectly on your Mac but won't be recognized by Windoze which
makes the whole thing pretty much pointless.
So Win machines can only handle MBRFormat type partition tables. So
whichever way you turn it: Both Mac and Win systems don't really like
each other's partition tables (or mixtures thereof) - however, the Mac
is a bit more flexible here, as usual. :-) So decide for yourself if the
pros or cons of this method overweigh. (I decided to go for it.)
BTW: Am using Mac OS X (10.3.2), if this is of any relevance.I'll share
what I've found out because I think it gives you the best possible
solution for the problem. Possible that some of you know about this
already but from my point of view, my method has not explicitly been
described before and I feel it is a good summary of various details
spread over many previous posts.
Simply use
diskutil
to partition your extrnal FW drive! No need for a Windoze machine to set
this up. Check out the man page for diskutil, it describes pretty well
what you need to know and even gives an example which is almost exactly
what you want.
The command line tool diskutil pretty much does what the well-known Disk
Utility application does (duh...), except it also allows you to mix
Apple (HFS+, ...) partitions with MS-DOS partitions on the same drive
(you cannot do this with the Disk Utility).
Basically what you want is sth like this:
diskutil partitionDisk device numberOfPartitions MBRFormat <part1Format
part1Name part1Size> <part2Format part2Name part2Size>
Replace
<part1Format part1Name part1Size>
with the appropriate details for your HFS+ partition and
<part1Format part1Name part1Size>
with the appropriate details for the MS-DOS partion (or vice versa).
Keep in mind that the name for the DOS partition should be uppercase and
less than 12 chars, otherwise the partition will not be assigned a name
(but be created anyway).
When thinking about the size: You can use abbreviations like
10G
for 10 GByte (see man page). And you don't have to take out a calculator
to determine how much space is left for your second partition (given the
size of the first one): Simply use the desired size for the first
partition and then give a number which exceeds the amount of space left
for the second one - then automatically every little byte left will be
used for the second partition.
As for the device: Use the procedure described in the original post to
find out which device to use (to find out the disk #). Then use sth. like
/dev/disk2
Check out the man page for details.
Although you cannot repartition your boot up disk anyway, I think, be
careful here and eject any other disks (such as iPods etc.) before using
this command, just in case... As you know, there will be no confirmation
question after entering the command and all data on the whole disk (all
volumes) will be lost, so make sure you find out the appropriate disk #
before typing in anything for fun.
Using the parameter
MBRFormat
specifies that the partition table be written in such a way that Windoze
machines can read it.
And here is what you get using the procedure described above:
A partition which will be recognizable on Windoze machines AND Mac
machines without problems and a HFS+ partition which will be recognized
automatically on the Mac without any problems (no need to manually mount
the volume after logging in as described in the original post, the
volume will automatically be mounted upon log in and can be unmounted
just like any other external volume in the Finder).
HOWEVER, YOU CANNOT BOOT UP YOUR MAC FROM THE HFS+ PARTITION.
As has been said before in previous posts: The way partition tables are
stored on Win and Mac systems differs. (At the moment) you cannot have
HFS+ and FAT32 (Windows) partitions on the same drive and boot up into
the appropriate partition on BOTH systems. See also Pierre Duhem's
concerns expressed in a previous post above on this. So if you are
REALLY concerned about your data you might want to not use the procedure
described and instead stick with ONLY HFS+ or ONLY FAT32. However, I
have not experienced any problems with the setup described above (apart
from the fact that I cannot boot off the partition which is not so
relevant for me anyway and which I don't consider a problem now that i
know about it). But can't guarantee total functionality, of course.
[Insert "Batteries not included, only valid where not prohibited" and
your other favorite legal warnings here.]
As I said, the Finder can perfectly handle the HFS+ volume created in
the above manner. It's the Mac's open firmware that does not allow
booting with the created HFS+ partition (because it does not like the
partition table in MBRFormat). It took me quite a few tries to find out
the details on this. For instance, I created a separate HFS+ partition
onto which I cloned my whole internal boot up hard drive (via Carbon
Copy Cloner). In System Preferences under Startup Disk you can then also
select the cloned system for the next start up, BUT IT WILL NOT WORK.
Apparrently, the open firmware does not like it (the external FW drive
is not detectable at start up (press the [option] key when switching
your Mac on to select the start up drive and the FW drive won't show up)
but System Preferences does not know this and would let you choose the
FW drive for start up although it will not work. On the other hand, by
not using the parameter MBRFormat, which you might think would be worth
a try, you would end up with a FAT32 (MS-DOS) partition which can be
handled perfectly on your Mac but won't be recognized by Windoze which
makes the whole thing pretty much pointless.
So Win machines can only handle MBRFormat type partition tables. So
whichever way you turn it: Both Mac and Win systems don't really like
each other's partition tables (or mixtures thereof) - however, the Mac
is a bit more flexible here, as usual. :-) So decide for yourself if the
pros or cons of this method overweigh. (I decided to go for it.)
BTW: Am using Mac OS X (10.3.2), if this is of any relevance.
Saluti ;)

Bravo!Io ho seguito le istruzioni che stanno piu giu e celo fatta!Ma 
non fi fa il mbr e i XP non mi riconoscono la partizione!

Ma questo tuo metodo non riesco a capirlo (purtroppo sono nuovo ai 
mac).Melo puoi spiegare con un esempio?Il mio HD esterno viene 
riconosciuto come disk2
grazie



cioe' tu hai fatto questo?diskutil partitionDisk disk1 2 MBRFormat HFS+ 
Mac 200G MS-DOS PC 79,46G

 riconosciuto come disk2
Facciamo un esempio: hai un BOX con un HD da 100GB e vuoi suddividerlo
in due partizioni da 50GB ciascuna: una HFS+ da usare con il Mac e una
FAT32 da usare con Windows XP. Ricordando che tale operazione cancellerà
irrimediabilmente i dati sull'HD del BOX esterno, la sintassi del
comando (mi raccomando che é su un'unica riga!) da digitare nel Terminale è:
diskutil partitionDisk device numberOfPartitions MBRFormat <part1Format
part1Name part1Size> <part2Format part2Name part2Size>
...nell'esempio che ti ho appena fatto diventa:
diskutil partitionDisk disk2 2 MBRFormat HFS+ Nome_partizione_Mac 50G
MS-DOS Nome_partizione_WinXP 50G
Ovviamente ti consiglio di controllare che i parametri corrispondano al
tuo caso e alle tue esigenze. Io ho seguito queste istruzioni e riesco
ad usare il BOX esterno sia con MacOS X che con Windows XP.
Facci sapere.
Saluti ;)

 Mac 200G MS-DOS PC 79,46G
Minchia, ma quotare da essere umano no?
-- 
Uccidete i filosofi e tenetevi riso e bacchette per voi.

 Minchia, ma quotare da essere umano no?
Scusa ma avevo fretta :)
CMQ ho rinunciato la partizione perche  non mi boota dalla partizione 
HFS quindi ne faro' una ntfs da 200GB e il resto fat32 

 ntfs
Mi sa che puoi solo leggerla da Mac, no scrittura. O almeno cosě č stato
ieri con un amico che č venuto da me con un hd usb2 formattato in ntfs.
-- 
Popi (dall'iBook 12" G4 9550)
WARNING: sono un profittatore, un parassita, un mentecatto, un 
calunniatore e ho persino venduto un iPod mini lucrandoci 50 euro.
Pensaci prima di rispondermi.

Sul Forum di Macity di qualche mese fa avevo letto questo metodo
che sembrerebbe semplice... poichè devo comprare un HD esterno
da usare sia con Mac che con PC volevo sapere se funziona:
"Quindi, se vuoi creare due partizioni, una in formato HFS+ (avviabile
da MacOS X) e una in FAT32 (per lo scambio di dati con un pc), il modo
più semplice è quello di utilizzare Utility Disco per eliminare la
partizione FAT32 esistente e creare al suo posto 2 partizioni, una come
spazio libero e una in HFS+. La prima volta che collegherai il tuo disco
a un pc con Windows 2000 o XP, attraverso Gestione Disco potrai poi
creare sullo spazio libero una nuova partizione in formato FAT32."

 Mi sa che puoi solo leggerla da Mac, no scrittura.
togli il mi sa