Newsgroup: it.scienza.medicina
Titolo: Chiedo parere mucca pazza

In questi giorni sempre in prima pagina (TV e giornali) si parla di mucca 
pazza e dei casi francesi.
C'è una reale possibilità che parecchi italiani abbiamo mangiato quella 
carne e che vedremo le conseguenze fra qualche anno?
Pensate che le autorità italiane ci abbiano nascosto qualcosa??
Ora la situazione è sotto controllo e paradossalmente anche se c'è molta 
paura è forse il momento in cui si può acquistare carne più 
tranquillamente.
Mi piacerebbe sapere se il contagio è così facile e quali sono le 
modalità, e inoltre se l'encefalopatia si può curare.
Non sono del tutto ignorante, sono uno studente di medicina, ma vorrei 
sapere qualcosa in più da persona informata.
Grazie mille.
David

pazza e dei casi francesi.
Gia'... in effetti i media stanno propagando notizie assai allarmistiche
che hanno poco a che fare con la realta' dei fatti.
I casi di malattia di Creutzfeld-Jacob (variante) che si manifestano
oggi sono conseguenti a fatti avvenuti molti e molti anni fa. La
"incubazione" -se cosi' si puo' dire- della encefalopatia spongiforme e'
assai lenta, e l'aumento dei casi verificati in Francia non e' la
conseguenza di problemi attuali. Per cui ben vengano le norme piu'
restrittive e i controlli, ma i vantaggi di tutto cio' si vedranno tra
molti anni...
-- 
        ___
 /\/\/\/ _/  -Doctor Diabolicus-
/     / /_
\/\/\/\__/

 conseguenza di problemi attuali.
Io non ne sarei cosě sicuro.  Questo č apparso su "Lancet":
  [1] Lancet 2000 Oct 7;356(9237):1224-7
 Variant Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease in UK children: a national
 surveillance study.
 Verity CM, Nicoll A, Will RG, Devereux G, Stellitano L
 PIND Surveillance Group, Addenbrooke's Hospital, Cambridge, UK.
  BACKGROUND: Variant Creutzfeldt-Jakob Disease (vCJD) was first reported
 in 1996; the youngest patient developed symptoms at 16 years of age. We have
 done 3 years of prospective active surveillance for progressive intellectual
 and neurological deterioration (PIND) in UK children, and have searched for
 vCJD among the children who were reported. METHODS: Since May, 1997, there
 has been active surveillance for patients younger than 16 years old with
 PIND by means of a monthly card sent to all UK consultant paediatricians by
 the British Paediatric Surveillance Unit. Clinical details of cases of PIND
 are obtained from reporting paediatricians by telephone interview or site
 visit, and an expert group of paediatric neurologists then classifies the
 cases. FINDINGS: After 3 years, 885 patients with suspected PIND have been
 reported. Among them were two fatal cases of definite vCJD and one case
 of probable vCJD; all were reported in 1999. One girl was age 12 years at
 onset--the youngest ever case of vCJD. No other children with the clinical
 features of vCJD were identified. The expert group has discussed 655 cases,
 of which 360 have a confirmed underlying cause, being categorised into 88
 known neurodegenerative diseases. INTERPRETATION: That this prospective
 active surveillance in the UK has found few children with suspected vCJD is
 relatively reassuring. However, 3 years is a short time to survey a disease
 with an unknown incubation period. Since one probable and two definite cases
 of vCJD were reported to the study in 1999, there is concern that more
 childhood cases may appear.
 PMID: 11072940, UI: 20523092
In effetti, nessuno sa ancora a quanto puň scendere il tempo di incubazione
della variante umana vCJD derivata dalla "mucca pazza":
  [2] Neuropathol Appl Neurobiol 2000 Oct;26(5):405-7
 Annotation: vCJD - predicting the future?
 Hilton DA
 Department of Histopathology, Derriford Hospital, Plymouth, UK.
  The recent emergence of variant Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease (vCJD) in the UK,
 and demonstration that vCJD is caused by the same prion strain that causes
 bovine spongiform encephalopathy, have led to concerns about the possibility
 of a human epidemic. Although only 79 cases of vCJD have occurred to date,
 it is likely that hundreds of thousands of infected cattle entered the human
 food chain in the late 1980s and early 1990s, and the average incubation
 period of vCJD is unknown. Mathematical models have not yet been able to
 give useful predictions of future numbers of cases, and in the absence of a
 blood test for vCJD, current attempts to reduce uncertainties about future
 numbers of cases are based on the accumulation of PrPSc in lymphoreticular
 tissues. Extensive lymphoreticular PrPSc accumulation has been seen in
 all cases of symptomatic vCJD so far examined, and in one case 8 months
 prior to the onset of symptoms. Animal models of prion disease suggest
 that lymphoreticular involvement occurs early in the incubation period and
 reliably predicts future neurological disease. Based on these data, large
 scale anonymous studies looking for PrP accumulation in surgically removed
 tonsillectomy and appendicectomy specimens are underway. Examination of
 the first 3000 specimens has not revealed any positive samples, but at the
 moment the significance of negative findings is uncertain. It is anticipated
 that by the time these studies are complete more data will be available on
 how early PrP can be demonstrated in lymphoreticular tissue in vCJD, which
 together with the results from examination of further samples, will allow
 some comment as to the likelihood of a large human vCJD epidemic.
 PMID: 11054179, UI: 20508533
Comunque, diversi casi di CJD possono essere iatrogeni:
  [3] Neurology 2000 Oct 24;55(8):1075-81
 Iatrogenic Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease at the millennium.
 Brown P, Preece M, Brandel JP, Sato T, McShane L, Zerr I, Fletcher A,
 Will RG, Pocchiari M, Cashman NR, d'Aignaux JH, Cervenakova L, Fradkin J,
 Schonberger LB, Collins SJ
 Laboratory of CNS Studies, NINDS, NIH, Bethesda, MD 20892, USA.
 
bro...@ninds.nih.gov
  The causes and geographic distribution of 267 cases of iatrogenic
 Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease (CJD) are here updated at the millennium.
 Small numbers of still-occurring cases result from disease onsets after
 longer and longer incubation periods following infection by cadaveric human
 growth hormone or dura mater grafts manufactured and distributed before the
 mid-1980s. The proportion of recipients acquiring CJD from growth hormone
 varies from 0.3 to 4.4% in different countries, and acquisition from dura
 mater varies between 0.02 and 0.05% in Japan (where most cases occurred).
 Incubation periods can extend up to 30 years, and cerebellar onsets
 predominate in both hormone and graft recipients (in whom the site of graft
 placement had no effect on the clinical presentation). Homozygosity at codon
 129 of the PRNP gene is over-represented in both forms of disease; it has
 no effect on the incubation period of graft recipients, but may promote
 shorter incubation periods in hormone cases. Knowledge about potential
 high-risk sources of contamination gained during the last quarter century,
 and the implementation of methods to circumvent them, should minimize the
 potential for iatrogenic contributions to the current spectrum of CJD.
 PMID: 11071481, UI: 20521160
Bye,
  -= Ginzo =-

 e inoltre se l'encefalopatia si può curare.
Attualmente no, e non si sa se e quando sarà possibile curarla.
In effetti, tutte le malattie da prioni sono invariabilmente fatali.
Di esse, nell'uomo si conoscono: la malattia di Creutzfeldt-Jakob (CJD),
il Kuru (in Nuova Guinea), la sindrome di Gerstmann-Sträussler-Scheinker
(corbezzoli, che nome difficile), e l'insonnia familiare fatale (FFI).
Bye,
  -= Ginzo =-

Non ho il diritto di chiederlo... ma un riassuntino in italiano??
CMQ grazie 
ciao

 Non ho il diritto di chiederlo... ma un riassuntino in italiano??
Sorry.  La conoscenza dell'inglese è un requisito fondamentale per un medico
al giorno d'oggi.  Senza saper leggere l'inglese, non si va molto avanti.
Fai un piccolo sforzo per impararlo: oltretutto, l'inglese scientifico
non è difficile, con tutti quei termini tratti dal latino e dal greco.
Bye,
  -= Ginzo =-

 Incubation periods can extend up to 30 years
Il fatto che non sappiamo quanto duri l'incubazione della malattia non
vuol dire che tale incubazione sia breve, anzi! E con cio' ribadisco che
chi manifesta oggi i sintomi della malattia si e' infettato anni fa...
-- 
        ___
 /\/\/\/ _/  -Doctor Diabolicus-
/     / /_   
\/\/\/\__/   -URL   : 
http://web.tiscalinet.it/Scienza_e_Medicina

 Salve,
 vi chiedo gentilmente ancora un chiarimento.   Il prione viene "degradato"
e
di
conseguenza inattivato dalla cottura oppure è l'ennesima bufala che ho letto
nei NG???
 Grazie e saluti a tutti voi MG.

Mi hanno chiesto quale possono essere i sintomi del cosi' detto " morbo
della mucca ( i.e. vacca pazza )
In particolare lo ha chiesto piop ( 
pi...@mac.com
 )
Fra i frequentatori del Ng , c'è qualcuno che ne può stendere un
elenchino ?
Vi ringrazio a nome mio ( ? ) e di " piop " che non ha chiari il
meccanismo del Re: ma che è preoccupata  delle info ( disinfo imho ) che
appaiono sui media  .
TIA e scusate la " prevaricazione "
sgas
*
*
*
*
ma i motori di ricerca  a che cazzo servono ?
( questo è per piop e per chi legge ! )
 il 3d è sotto osservazione , passeranno solo post strettamente aderenti
al manifesto .

 ma i motori di ricerca  a che cazzo servono ?
Boh... vediamo un po':
 
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi
   National Library of Medicine - PubMed
  Search PubMed for [mad cow & symptoms]
  Result: 24 Items
   Item 2:
  Neurol Clin 1999 Nov;17(4):835-59
 Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease, new variant creutzfeldt-jakob disease,
 and bovine spongiform encephalopathy.
 Weihl CC, Roos RP
 Department of Neurology, University of Chicago Medical Center, Chicago,
 Illinois.
  Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease (CJD) is a subacute spongiform encephalopathy
 (SSE) that is manifested by a variety of neurologic signs that usually
 include dementia, myoclonus, and an abnormal electroencephalogram (EEG).
 In 1996, a new variant of CJD (nvCJD) with a somewhat distinctive clinical
 presentation and neuropathology was reported in adolescents and young
 adults, a cohort of patients not normally affected with CJD. The appearance
 of nvCJD coincided temporally and geographically with the emergence of
 an SSE in cattle known as bovine spongiform encephalopathy (BSE), or
 mad cow disease. This article discusses the clinical syndrome, pathology,
 and pathogenesis of classical CJD, nvCJD, and other human SSEs, as well as
 the link between BSE and nvCJD.
 PMID: 10517931, UI: 99447880
   Item 16:
  Nord Med 1996 Jun;111(6):180-3
 [Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease--a human prion disease]. [Article in Danish]
 Buchwald E, Vorstrup S
 Neurologisk Afd, Rigshospitalet, Kobenhavn.
  The human prion diseases, Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease, Gerstmann-Straussler-
 Scheinker syndrome and kuru, are neurodegenerative disorders sharing
 clinical features of rapidly progressive neurodegenerative dementia and
 cerebellar symptoms of marked ataxia and tremor, resulting in death within
 one year after onset. Similar diseases have been described in animals,
 such as scrapie in sheep and goats, and bovine spongiform encephalopathy
 in cattle (mad cow disease). The very long incubation period, the lack of
 a host immune response, and a neurological triad of spongiosis, astrocytosis
 and amyloid plaque formation have suggested these diseases to have a common
 aetiology. A highly effective transmissible agent, fundamentally different
 from viruses, has been identified and the term prion adopted to distinguish
 it from viruses and viroids. CJD is unique in occurring both in inherited,
 sporadic and acquired forms.
 PMID: 8700643, UI: 96255501
Bye,
  -= Ginzo =-