Newsgroup: it.politica.internazionale
Titolo: Who's a fascist and who's a Zionist?

Fantastico.  Mi fa pensare al bagarozzo, che prima inventa campagne per 
vendere merendine immangiabili e poi, convinto da se stesso medesimo, 
corre a comprarle...
 
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Who's a fascist and who's a Zionist?
By SUSAN HATTIS ROLEF 02/27/2012 23:27
By Courtesy
The Jerusalem District Court will soon be deliberating on an interesting 
libel suit; the Im Tirzu movement is suing a group of talkbackers who 
claimed that Im Tirzu’s campaigns against the New Israel Fund and 
various human rights organizations in Israel smack of fascism.
 
The defendants claim that what they said is the truth, and have 
presented the court with several expert depositions that attempt to show 
that the ideology of Im Tirzu, as publicly manifested by its founder, 
Ronen Shuval, contains fascist elements, especially in terms of how it 
views the nation and the role of the individual within it, its contempt 
for “decadent” Western liberal values and its obsessive search for 
“traitors.”
 
It should be noted that until Benito Mussolini became Hitler’s ally 
there were right-wingers in the pre-State Yishuv, such as Abba Ahi-Meir, 
who openly sympathized with Italian Fascism. It should also be pointed 
out that in the current public discourse in Israel it is not only the 
left-wingers who accuse certain right-wingers of fascist inclinations, 
but also vice versa. For example, Moshe Feiglin and his Jewish 
Leadership Movement in the Likud refer to the removal (or expulsion) of 
the settlers from Gush Katif as a fascist act, and those who 
participated in the act as fascists.
 
Beyond the issue of who is or is not a fascist, and when calling someone 
a fascist is libelous, there is another question of definition that is 
intricately connected with the doctrines and activities of bodies such 
as Im Tirzu and the Jewish Leadership Movement.
 
Both Im Tirzu and the Jewish Leadership Movement, as well as many other 
bodies in the political Right, are in the midst of an attempt to 
redefine the term “Zionist” in the public consciousness.
 
This process has even manifested itself partially in a teaching kit on 
Gush Katif recently issued by the Ministry of Education to all the 
schools in the national education system.
 
According to this new definition, to be considered a Zionist you must 
believe that the whole of Eretz Yisrael belongs exclusively to the 
Jewish People, support Israel’s settlement activities in the West Bank 
and Gaza Strip and object to the removal of any Jewish settlements in 
these territories.
 
True Zionists, so it is implied, should refrain from any public 
criticism of the State of Israel and its agencies, and are expected to 
believe that the Jewish faith, heritage and culture are superior to all 
others, including the Western cultural heritage, which emphasizes such 
universal values as equality and human rights.
 
Certainly all those who hold the above-mentioned beliefs are Zionists, 
but so is anyone who believes that the Jewish People has the right to a 
state, like all other Peoples, and that this state cannot be anywhere 
else but in Zion – the historical homeland of the Jewish People.
 
However, he (or she) does not stop being a Zionist even if he also 
believes that our rights in the Land of Israel are not exclusive, and 
that the Arabs of Palestine have inherent rights here as well.
 
One can be a Zionist and a liberal as well, and believe in equality, 
human rights and other universal democratic values. One is still a 
Zionist if one believes that whether or not we are a chosen people, due 
to our historical experience we should set higher moral standards for 
ourselves than those we expect from others. That means that it is 
perfectly OK (and not an act of treason) to seek to ensure that the IDF 
– one of the most moral military forces in the world – avoids performing 
acts that fall within the definition of “war crimes.” It also means that 
one can criticize the humiliating treatment of Israeli Arabs at security 
checks at Ben-Gurion Airport and still be a Zionist who supports 
Israel’s legitimate right to defend itself against enemies.
 
Incidentally, in the early years of the state the Mapai leadership had 
us believe that kibbutzniks and members of the Histadrut were somehow 
superior Zionists, and that others were at best second-rate Zionists. 
That was as objectionable as the claims of Im Tirzu, the Jewish 
Leadership Movement and the Ministry of Education are today.
 
The Jerusalem District Court will have to determine whether those who 
accuse Im Tirzu of Fascist inclinations are guilty of libel. It has not 
been called upon to determine whether Im Tirzu, and others, are guilty 
of libel when they claim that those of us who do not accept their 
ideological premises are not Zionists, or are even anti-Zionists. 
Refusal to accept the legitimacy of those who disagree with you is not 
necessarily a manifestation of fascism. However, it is a manifestation 
of intolerance, and a denial of the pluralistic nature of our democratic 
state.
 
The writer teaches at the Max Stern Yezreel Valley College and was a 
Knesset employee for many years.
 
http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Op-EdContributors/Article.aspx?ID=259661&R=R1
 
-- 
Sostieni Rete ECO
 
http://rete-eco.it/it/sostienici.html
 
 

 Abba Ahi-Meir, who openly sympathized with Italian Fascism. 
 
bisogna anche ricordare che il papą di Bibi era suo sodale, e che Bibi ha un
timore reverenziale quasi infantile verso il padre, ancora vivo.
 
"in this holy city, a public lecture was offered by Benzion Netanyahu. It was
in honor of a man named Abba Ahimeir.  Abba Ahimeir was a writer and activist
in British Mandate Palestine, and a zealous lieutenant of Jabotinsky. In the
pages of the magazine Doar Hayom, during the late 1920s and '30s, he wrote
a celebrated column titled "From the Notebook of a Fascist." He hymned Mussolini,
referred to Jabotinsky as "Our Duce," and even went so far as to say that Hitler
was on the right track, except for his excessive anti-Semitism. Ahimeir, said
the elder Netanyahu, had been his mentor. And it is very well attested that
Netanyahu the younger makes few moves without consulting his revered papa"
http://www1.salon.com/col/hitc/1998/04/nc_13hitc2.html
 
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uomo bianco parla con lingua biforcuta.
 
il Diamat č la spiegazione di tutte le cose

 bisogna anche ricordare che il papà di Bibi
 
lui no, lui ammirava l'America.
 
Bombacci, lascia stare le equivalenze, e' roba che non capisci.
 
 

lui no, lui ammirava l'America.
 
però ancora oggi ricorda commosso l'amico e fascista Abba Ahimeir
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uomo bianco parla con lingua biforcuta.
 
il Diamat è la spiegazione di tutte le cose

 else but in Zion – the historical homeland of the Jewish People.
 
ho la netta impressione che Persio anche questa volta non abbia capito
un cazzo.
 
 
 

 però ancora oggi ricorda commosso l'amico e fascista Abba Ahimeir
 
vedi, Stalinist Dandy, le persone possono dissentire anche stando
dalla stessa parte. Ed esiste anche quella cosa che si chiama fattore
umano: se uno della tua parte e' stato in galera, da innocente. Forse
Ahimeiri non era poi cosi' tanto fascista (ho casa a Gerusalemme
vicino ad alcuni suoi parenti). E certo non ha cacciato nessuno da
casa sua. Contrariamente a Ben Bella, tanto per fare un esempio di un
politico che non ti scandalizza poi molto.
Il boicottaggio dei beni tedeschi, proclamato da Ahimeiri, era un
male? La difesa del diritto di pregare al Muro, era un male? Bombacci
e' un cretino?

 Fantastico.  Mi fa pensare 
 
Esagerato.
 
 
-- 
“Those who expect to reap the blessings of  freedom, must, like men,
undergo the  fatigues of supporting it.”  - North Idaho 21st Batallion of
Light Foot

 Ahimeiri non era poi cosi' tanto fascista
 
già, gli elogi a Mussolini e l'omonimo notebook li ho scritti io


direi che ti avresti persino problemi a trovarlo, quel notebook.

On 28 Feb, 17:04, il Jabotinsky della Pelota Basca

Ahimeir joined the Revisionist movement in 1930, but before joining he
wrote a regular column entitled "From the Notebook of a Fascist" in
the unaffiliated but pro-Revisionist magazine Doar Hayom.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revisionist_Zionism#National-messianism_vs._Jewish_nationalism
 

 the unaffiliated but pro-Revisionist magazine Doar Hayom.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revisionist_Zionism#National-messianism_.
..
 
dicevo che, a parte la voce su wikipedia, se tu avessi lo scritto
davanti, non riusciresti manco a leggerlo.
(BTW, quanta gente Ahimeiri ha sbattuto fuori di casa?)