Newsgroup: it.politica.internazionale
Titolo: Iraq: L'enigma dei morti civili

http://www.occupationwatch.org/article.php?list=type&type=8
      The War's Toll on Iraqi Civilians
      by Jefferson Morley, Washington Post
      September 21st, 2004
      When the 1,000th U.S. soldier was killed in Iraq earlier this month,
more than a few commentators in the international online media took note of
another death toll: Iraqi civilians.
      "While so much is made of the 1,000 US military fatalities," said a
columnist for Gulf News in the United Arab Emirates, "an eerie silence
surrounds the tally of Iraqi casualties since the invasion."
      "Silence" is perhaps too strong a word. Many news organizations have
run stories about civilian deaths in Iraq. But overseas reporters and
commentators emphasize the issue more than their American counterparts and
play up civilian casualties in ways the U.S. media rarely pursue. After
recent U.S. bombing raids on Fallujah, al-Jazeera.net published graphic
photos of wounded children that are unlikely to appear in a U.S. news
outlet.
      While American journalists can say, correctly, that definitive
statistics on civilian casualties are hard to come by, the true number is
certainly a multiple of U.S. casualties, according to Human Rights Watch. In
a 2003 study, the New York-based watchdog group said "thousands" of Iraqi
civilians had been killed or wounded in the three weeks between the invasion
and the fall of Baghdad.
      Human Rights Watch cited two other attempts to quantify the dead. The
Los Angeles Times did a survey of 27 hospitals in the Baghdad area after the
U.S. invasion and found that at least 1,700 civilians died. In June 2003,
the Associated Press canvassed 60 of Iraq's 124 hospitals and calculated
that at least 3,420 civilians died in the first months of the war. AP
described the count as "fragmentary" and said, "the complete toll -- if it
is ever tallied -- is sure to be significantly higher."
      Since then, other figures have been floated. Commentators for the
Jordan Times and the Daily Star in Beirut, Lebanon, have cited an estimate
of 30,000 deaths. That is the figure disseminated by the Iraqi Human Rights
Organization, an independent group in Baghdad.
      A more conservative figure comes from Iraqbodycount.net, a British Web
site that compiles media reports on Iraqi civilian deaths. Based on such
reporting, the site says there have been a minimum of 12,778 civilian deaths
in Iraq and a maximum of 14,820.
      Reporters in Iraq do not need a statistic to tell them that civilian
deaths are common but difficult to accurately report. Patrick Cockburn,
Baghdad correspondent for London's Independent, wrote this week that "the
truth about who is being killed by the US air strikes is difficult to
ascertain exactly because Islamic militants make it very dangerous for
journalists to go to places recently attacked. Bodies are buried quickly and
wounded insurgents do not generally go to public hospitals. But, where the
casualties can be checked, many of those who die or are injured have proved
to be innocent civilians."
      Last week, Cockburn noted that "the US was claiming to have precisely
hit insurgents in Fallujah while Iraqis were watching pictures on television
of an ambulance gutted from the air in which a driver, paramedic and five
patients died."
      At the same time, the Iraqi insurgents are also killing civilians,
forcing the issue of which is more newsworthy. There is no one right answer.
In a Sept. 17 report on the fighting in Fallujah, Associated Press reporter
Kim Housego mentioned the deaths of women and children in the first
sentence. That story was picked up by 
washingtonpost.com
 and many other U.S.
news sites. The coverage in overseas sites like the state-run China Daily
and the Straits Times in Singapore also led off with the civilian deaths
caused by U.S. forces.
      But that same day a suicide car bomber killed five Iraqi civilians in
Baghdad. A staff-written story in the print edition of The Post the next day
opened with an anecdote about that attack. The civilian deaths caused by the
U.S. military were not mentioned until the seventh paragraph.
      Andrew MacLeod, columnist for the Age in Australia, pointed out last
month that Iraqi civilians were also dying violently under Saddam Hussein's
regime.
      MacLeod cited estimates that the former dictator "killed between
500,000 and 1 million of his own people in the 13 years since the Gulf War,
not including the effects of the sanctions." Thus, he argued that the former
Iraqi leader might have "killed between 53,445 and 106,890 innocent people"
in the 500-plus days since he was deposed. Those numbers far exceed the
minimum and maximum figures provided by 
iraqbodycount.net
, he noted. He
concluded that the U.S.-led invasion was justified because it "probably cost
between 38,938 and 92,383 fewer lives than the so-called peace would have
cost."
      Michael Jansen of the Jordan Times used a lower estimate of Baath
party abuses and a higher estimate of Iraqi civilian deaths in the past 18
months to reach the opposite conclusion. He says the "Bush occupation" is
killing twice as many Iraqi civilians per month as the Hussein regime.
      But no matter which news sources you read or how you play with the
numbers, the consensus of international commentators is that the U.S.
military may have replaced Saddam Hussein as the biggest threat to Iraqi
civilians.

first months of the war.
Figuriamoci che muoiono civili pure in Italia. Almeno qualche decina
ogni weekend. Ma saranno sicuramente vittime degli americani :)
*LOL*
-Stefano

,
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Ma ti ha dato di volta il cervello, oppure stai con i decimatori?
Qui si parla di un rapporto di vittime di 30 ad 1.
Ma forse lo consideri normale con la tua logica di accerchiato...
A.

"amalric" <ama...@REMOVEaliceposta.it> wrote in message
news:amalric-63BFA5...@twister1.tin.it...
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#_Pazienza ...quella e` la sua classica risposta predisposta per
l'occasione, ha solo lasciato da parte: gli incidenti stradali; oramai
diventa sempre piu` sintetico, al punto che pubblichera`una FATAQ(Frequent
Answer To Any Questions), tutte sue risposte classiche tipiche, accompagnate
da una sigla o un numero e la prossima volta scrivera` solo il numero di
riferimento.
Giano

A.
E' semplicemente idiota.

 Ma forse lo consideri normale con la tua logica di accerchiato...
Logica e De Cesari sono due cose che fanno a cazzotti.

Qui si parla di un rapporto di vittime di 30 ad 1.
Guarda che nello stesso periodo ci sono stati piu' ***MORTI CIVILI***
sulle strade italiane che soldati americani in Iraq.
Colpa degli americani? :)
-Stefano

 E' semplicemente idiota.
...disse l'idiota... :)
-Stefano

 Logica e De Cesari sono due cose che fanno a cazzotti.
...disse il bue all'asino... :)
-Stefano

 ha scritto nel messaggio
news:4165A503...@people.it...
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Complimenti per il paragone!!!
Potresti andare da Vespa

Potresti andare da Vespa
...disse il bue all'asino...
-Stefano

 ...disse il bue all'asino...
Al massimo la vespa...

 paragoni simili.
Eh, già. Ma con i morti incivili come la mettiamo?
Namib

Eh, già. Ma con i morti incivili come la mettiamo?
Qualificami tale categoria e poi ne riparliamo.
-Stefano