Newsgroup: it.politica.internazionale
Titolo: Tondelli, visto che passi di qui

sarebbe gradito un tuo commento su queste sofferenze inflitte alla popolazione 
palestinese. 
 
Oppure siccome il colpevole non e' lo Stato ebraico hai poco preferisci (laicamente) non intervenire? Per dire, ti importano i diritti dei palestinesi o sei solo alla ricerca di colpe degli ebrei e del loro Stato? Parliamone.
 
http://elderofziyon.blogspot.it/2013/08/jordan-treats-palestinian-syrian.html
 
 
From Amnesty:
Cyber City is an unusual camp beside a desolate crossroads outside Irbid, in northern Jordan. Hidden behind a wall and some pine trees, a dreary six-floor block looks out over rusting machinery and a dry plain. Formerly for migrant workers, it now hosts around 500 refugees from Syria.
 
After passing security checks I bump into Abu Alaa, a dignified 60-year-old refugee whose two sons are missing in Syria. “No news still,” he sighs, holding my hand warmly. “I was just calling again.” His phone shows repeated unanswered calls to numbers back home. He says his two grown-up sons had tried following him into Jordan but were refused entry due to their Palestinian origin. On separate occasions over the coming months, each appears to have been detained by the Syrian security forces and Abu Alaa fears they may not be alive.
 
Palestinians have been heavily affected by the violence in Syria. Almost half of the 500,000 or so Palestinian refugees in Syria have been displaced. Refugee camps and other areas in which they live, including Dera’a Camp, and Yarmouk and Sayida Zaynab in Damascus, have witnessed heavy fighting. Some 6,000 residents were forced out of Ein al-Tal Camp in Aleppo in April 2013. Sbeineh Camp in Damascus was reportedly hit by a ground-to-ground missile in May 2013, killing at least five people. Two children and two women were among at least five others killed by mortar shells fired into Khan Eshieh Camp near Damascus in June 2013.
 
Yet Abu Alaa’s sons are among hundreds if not thousands of Palestinian refugees fleeing the violence in Syria who are believed to have been turned away at the Jordanian border, in violation of international law. While Jordan is hosting around half a million people from Syria, it is generally not allowing access to Palestinian or Iraqi refugees...
 
Of some 7,000 or more Palestinians who did manage to enter Jordan, either before the country denied all access to them early last year or as a result of using false documents, some were later forced back to the border, also in violation of international law.
 
Bilal, who entered Jordan ahead of other family members, tells me his father and brothers were detained in Amman and escorted to the border in December 2012. “One night my elder brother rang and told me they had been taken there at gunpoint. My younger brother had been pulled by his hair and forced into the security vehicle that took them there. They waited three days just 100 metres beyond the Jordan border post, with fighting nearby, hoping to be allowed back, until my elder brother was injured and they realized the only option was to seek aid inside Syria.”
 
A worse fate befell Mahmud Merjan, who Cyber City residents say was killed on a Syrian street in late 2012, three weeks after being forced to sign a “voluntary” paper that he would go back to Syria. “It wasn’t an arbitrary killing,” says one man who knew him well. “He was known and wanted by the regime.”
 
All those in Cyber City have fled from Syria. But while the Palestinians from Syria used to be the majority, I am told, their numbers have dwindled as many got fed up with conditions and returned to the conflict zone. “I prefer to go back and die in Syria with some dignity rather than live without it here,” many say.
 
Complaints about the conditions here are many. Palestinians are not officially permitted to leave Cyber City. Now and again informal permission is granted to visit relatives in Irbid and Amman and so on, but mostly they are confined to the building and the immediate vicinity. Such conditions amount to arbitrary detention. “I’m sorry, but a dog can come and go more easily than we can,” says a very frustrated Ali, who has been here for more than a year.
 
The closed border to Palestinians and the arbitrary detention of Palestinians is further dividing families, whose identities reflect decades of turmoil and flight. Sena, a Syrian woman, is here with her children while her Palestinian husband is unable to enter Jordan. Ziad is in Cyber City while his Syrian wife and children are in a Jordanian town. Elderly Abu Khaled has to stay here while family members holding Jordanian nationality do not.
 
While Syrians and Palestinians from Syria appreciate being in safety in Jordan, they struggle to make ends meet. Individuals are entitled to a monthly coupon worth 24 Jordanian dinars (about US$34) which they exchange for food in a small shop next to Cyber City. This works out as a mere 0.80 dinars per day, it is repeatedly pointed out. A 160g tin of tuna on the shop’s shelves costs more than that.
 
“It is 100 per cent worse for Palestinians here than for the Syrians,” says Ziad. “One, they are allowed to leave this place while we are not and, two, when they go out they can visit charitable organizations, show their UN refugee agency card” – which Palestinians do not have as they fall under the mandate of [the UN Relief and Works Agency] instead, although they should receive the same services – “and collect further relief.”
 
“Every day here is the same,” Bilal continues. “Eat, sleep, eat, sleep.” With others, he counts off the names of families who have decided to risk their lives to go back into Syria. “Yes, this is what the Jordanian government wants, for us to go back. But what is the alternative? We live without purpose here. This is not life.”
 
A friend of the deceased Mahmud Merjan summed up the despair: “It was one of our life’s dreams to visit Jordan, but we came and encountered such hate. Let’s hope there are no more refugee camps for Palestinians in heaven.”
Even Lebanon, which has anti-Palestinian laws and severe restrictions on what Palestinians are allowed to do, allows refugees from Syria of Palestinian ancestry to go to overcrowded UNRWA camps there to get services. Jordan isn't even allowing that, preferring to send them to their possible deaths in Syria.
 
Here we have systemic and institutionalized discrimination against Palestinians by their fellow Arabs, far worse than anything Israel does, and the world media is silent. I cannot find a single English language media outlet to report this story from Amnesty even though it was published on Monday.
 
Just yesterday, five more Palestinians in Syria were killed, including two children. The media silence is deafening.
 
Similarly, so-called "pro-Palestinian" groups say nothing.
 
The reason is because so-called "pro-Palestinian activists" who are brilliant at getting press coverage for anti-Israel stunts don't really give a damn about real Palestinians - when their suffering cannot be blamed on Israel. The media similarly doesn't consider Arab hate for Palestinians to be newsworthy.
 
The double standards applied to Israel are crystal clear.

 sarebbe gradito un tuo commento
 
Ne ho parlato altre volte (purtroppo non sei riuscito a leggere), ma sono ansioso di farlo di nuovo se me lo chiedi.
 
Sul serio, non vedo l'ora.
 
C'è solo questo piccolo problema, che prima vorrei verificare definitivamente se i gay in Israele possano sposarsi o no, e se tu possa sposarli (come hai affermato di poter fare). 
 
Per adesso da una parte c'è tutta l'internet che dice di no, e dall'altra parte tu che dici di sì. Tutta l'internet contro un rabbino. D'altro canto internet è notoriamente inaffidabile, e non fidarsi di un rabbino sarebbe antisemitismo, almeno 100 points.
 
Quindi io vorrei fidarmi di te. Purtroppo tu hai totalmente smesso di parlare di questa cosa, e ciò mi causa un'irreprimibile, e dolorosa diffidenza.

 Ne ho parlato
 
il link riportato e' dell'agosto 2013. Se lo hai gia' commentato, non deve essere molto tempo fa. Potresti indicare dove hai commentato  il silenzio dei 
---
so-called "pro-Palestinian" [dei] so-called "pro-Palestinian activists" who are brilliant at getting press coverage for anti-Israel stunts [and] don't really give a damn about real Palestinians - when their suffering cannot be blamed on Israel. 
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di cui parla il testo che ho citato? 
Grazie. 
 

 il link riportato e' dell'agosto 2013. Se lo hai gia' commentato, 
 
Non hai capito. Non sorprende.
 
 
Comunque non vedo l'ora di discuterne con te, davvero.

 Non sorprende. [GIMEL] 
 
questo post consiste esclusivamente in insulti. 
 

 questo post consiste esclusivamente in insulti.
 
Quanto sei suscettibile. Allora, discutiamo o no?

 sei suscettibile. [GIMEL] 
 
E' triste che Tondelli sappia solo insultare. Ma d'altra parte, e' un problema suo. 
 
 
 

 E' triste che Tondelli sappia solo insultare. 
 
Insomma, non vuoi discuterne. 
 
Vabbe', pazienza.


I goim, poverini, sono abituati a credere che quel che c'è scritto non necessiti di interpretazione (cit.), ma anche quelli che dove è scritto "non hai capito" leggono un insulto, non sono esattamente i primi nomi che saltano in mente agli accademici di Svezia quando devono scegliere il prossimo Nobel...
(ti dò anche l'interpretazione:  è il modo britt per darti del pirla).