Newsgroup: it.comp.retrocomputing
Titolo: IBM 5360 - Nuovi manuali tecnici su Bitsavers

Scrivo per segnalare (a Dino Baldi di ComPVuter e a tutti gli altri curiosi)
che in questi giorni sono in corso di pubblicazione molti manuali tecnici
piuttosto interessanti relativi al 5360 (il Sistema/36 formato comò) e
probabilmente in un prossimo futuro verranno pubblicate anche diverse immagini
di floppy originali con software, diagnostici e quant'altro.
 
In particolare vedo che ci sono diversi manuali diagnostici abbastanza utili
per diagnosticare (appunto) la salute dell'hardware se mai si decidesse di
riaccendere un 5360 (sto pensando a quello di Pavia) e altri molto comodi per
identificare le varie schede (anche in base alla loro posizione) e quindi
capire bene le possibilità e la dotazione della macchina.
 
Vedere qui: 
http://bitsavers.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/pdf/ibm/system36/ce/
 
 
Ciao,
G.

Mitico !!!
 
Dino
comPVter

 Mitico !!!
 
Ora con calma potete iniziare la ricognizione del vostro 5360. Occhio perch�
le schede IBM "blindate" sono sensibilissime alle scariche elettrostatiche. 
 
Ormai un anno fa avevo chiesto ad Al Kossow (il curatore di Bitsavers) se
avesse per caso materiale sul 5360... Nei giorni scorsi avevo gi� notato che
stava comparendo nell'archivio diverso materiale in merito e stamattina ho
avuto la sorpresa: mi ha scritto direttamente lui, quasi un anno dopo,
quotando la mia mail originale, per segnalarmi che aveva trovato qualcosa. :)
 
Mi ha anche detto di avere un lotto di 300 dischetti da analizzare/leggere...
 
Ciao,
G.
 

 Mi ha anche detto di avere un lotto di 300 dischetti da analizzare/leggere...
 
As part of understanding the content of this new flood of IBM System/36 material, does anyone have detail of the on-disk data structure of the VTOC (Volume Table of Contents - the diskette "directory" structure)?
 
It was likely documented in IBM internals documentation, but so far none has come available to decode the disk format.
 
thanks.

 (Volume Table of Contents - the diskette "directory" structure)?
 
Disk or diskette (floppy)?
 
Diskette is here: 
http://goo.gl/ftdyo
 (/pdf/floppy/ on Bitsavers)
 
Hard disks on older systems use similar structures, at least at first glance,
but they are obviously more sophisticated. MVS VTOC structures are described
here: 
http://goo.gl/kpYmv
 (IBM site, z/OS VTOC DSCB structure description).
 
HTH, :)
G.

 Hard disks on older systems use similar structures, at least at first glance,
 
yes I would agree, we are particularly hoping to find suggestions about the System/36 (SSP) "directory" format.

 System/36 (SSP) "directory" format.
 
Which "directory"? The only format I have is the library directory one, e.g.
the index at the beginning of every library which is used to locate members. I
found it years ago in comp.sys.ibm.sys3x.misc (when Google groups search was
still something usable), checked it and corrected some minor typos. Do you
want/need it? I can post it here: it's not very long. 
 
For the VTOC format I'd check the MVS documents, I'd bet they're quite similar
because in the end the overall storage concepts are the same: SSP files and
libraries are almost the same thing as MVS datasets and partitioned datasets.
Moreover, in some S/36 service manuals there are references about format-1 and
format-5 VTOC entries which then appear to be named like MVS format-n DSCBs.
 
To other readers:
should we switch to private mail? Does someone need a translation?
 
Per gli altri:
dobbiamo continuare via mail? Qualcuno desidera una traduzione?
 
G.

 G.
 
 
Don't worry ! We understand english language very well ;)
 
 
-- 
http://www.supervinx.com/Retrocomputer
 

 should we switch to private mail? Does someone need a translation?
 
enjoying it!

 Don't worry ! We understand english language very well ;)
 
You do! Thank you everyone for your patience and consideration with us
non-Italian speaking folk, everyone has been very helpful.

 For the VTOC format I'd check the MVS documents
 
thanks for the suggestion.
 

 
https://groups.google.com/group/comp.sys.ibm.sys3x.misc/browse_thread/thread/fcb068add1b31db1
 
 
That's the very same I have, but there is a couple of typos in that list,
which I have corrected by comparing it to an actual library index. Here is my
corrected version. If you compare it to the "original" from the other NG,
you'll see that's almost the same (I've just shuffled around some things):
 
LIBRARY DIRECTORY
 
 Macro Name: DIREQ
 
 The directory is a variable-length area that contains one 51-byte entry
 for each member in the library. Members are grouped in ascending
 alphabetic order by name within each member type: load (O),
 procedure (P), subroutine (R), and source member (S).  Each sector can
 contain up to five entries with one entry used to indicate the end of
 the directory.  The directory contains a maximum of 2500 sectors for a
 library.
 
 How to Find
 
 The address for the library directory is in field F1ADSDIR of the
 library format-1.  The library directory starts the first sector
 after the library control sector.
 
 Format
 
 The format of a library directory entry follows.
 
 HEX    DEC     HEX    NAME
 DISP  LENGTH   VALUE  SYMBOL     DESCRIPTION
 
     0      1          DIRTYPE    DIR TYPE
     1      8          DIRNAME    NAME
     9      3          DIRADDR    RELATIVE  SSS ADDR
     C      1          DIR#TXT    NUMBER OF TEXT SECTORS
     D      2          DIRLINK    LINK EDIT ADDR FOR O ONLY
     D      2          DIR#STMT   NUMBER OF STATEMENTS FOR S OR P
     F      2          DIRSCA     START CONTROL ADDR, ENTRY POINT
    11      1          DIRRLD     RLD DISPLACENEMT
    12      1          DIRCORE    CORE REQUIRED, NUMBER OF SECTORS
    13      3          DIRATTR    ATTRIBUTES OF MEMBER
 
   BYTE ONE     80     DIRSCP     SCP ATTRIBUTE BIT
                40     DIRPRIV    PRIVILEGED MODULE  - O ONLY
                40     DIRNHIST   DO NOT LOG OCL - P ONLY
                20     DIRNOINQ   NON-INQUIRABLE MODULE
                10     DIRSFGR    SFGR FORMAT LOAD MODULE  - O ONLY
                10     DIRPDATA   PROC WITH DATA - P ONLY
                08     DIRSORCE   SOURCE REQUIRED
                04     DIRSCPOP   NON BASE SCP MODULE
                02     DIRPTF     PTF APPLIED BIT
                01     DIROVER    MODULE HAS OVERLAYS
 
   BYTE TWO     80     DIRDED     DEDICATED MODULE
                40     DIRNEP     NEP MODULE
                20     DIRXRFXT   MODULE HAS OXRF FORMAT INDEX TBL
                10     DIRSYSLD   SECURITY AUTHORIZATION REQUIRED
                08     DIRNONEX   CANNOT LOAD PROGRAM VIA // LOAD
                04     DIRCOMON   PROGRAM COMMON
                02     DIRUCLAT   PGM WITH UTILITY CONTROL STMTS
                01     DIROXRF    MODULE HAS OXRF WTG TABLE
 
   BYTE THREE   80     DIRKORK2   $WORK2 FILE REQUIRED
                40     DIRNSWAP   DO NOT SWAP THIS TASK
                20     DIRHDEAD   HIGH LEVEL OF DEDICATION
                10     DIRFORT    PROGRAM NEEDS FORTRAN MICRO-CODE
                08     DIRCNFIG   MEMBER IS A CONFIGURATION RECORD
                04     DIRXFER    MEMBER MUST BE TRANSFERRED TO
                02     DIRXRFBL   MEMBER CROSS-REFERENCABLE
                01     DIRMRTNW   P - NEW COPY OF MRT PGM REQD
 
    16      1          DIRMRT     O - MRTMAX COUNT, P - FF => MRT
    17      1          DIRREL     RELEASE LEVEL
    18      2          DIRTOTL    TOTAL NUMBER OF SECTORS IN MOD
    1A      1          DIRATTR4   FOURTH ATTR - USED INTERNALLY
 
   BYTE FOUR    80     DIRBASIC   PROGRAM NEED BASIC MICRO-CODE
                40     DIRPAD     PROGRAM IS PAD MODULE
                20     DIRSNGLO   SUNGLOW PROGRAM
                10     DIRIBM     IBM SUPPLIED PROGRAM
                08     DIREXTNT   MEMBER IS CONTAINED IN EXTENT
                04     DIRDDS     DDS LOAD FORMAT MEMBER - O ONLY
                02     DIRXIENT   MEMBER IS A SYSTEM XIENT
                01     DIR1COPY   1 COPY EXECUTION ONLY
 
    1B      1          DIRRESV    RESERVED BYTE
    1C      3          DIRMOD     REFERENCE NUMBER
    1F      3          DIRDATE    DATE MEMBER CREATED/CHANGED
    22      2          DIRTIME    TIME MEMBER CREATED/CHANGED(HM)
    24      1          DIRATTR5   5TH ATTR BYTE (MBR SUB-TYPE)
 
   BYTE FIVE    02     LMSDTA     DATA
                11     LMSARS     AUTO RESPONSE
                12     LMSARP     AUTO REPORT
                13     LMSBAP     BASIC PROCEDURES
                14     LMSDFU     DFU
                15     LMSFMT     SCREEN FORMAT
                16     LMSMNU     MENU
                17     LMSMSG     MESSAGE MEMBER
                18     LMSPHL     PHONE LIST
                19     LMSSRT     SORT
                31     LMSASM     ASSEMBLER
                32     LMSBAS     BASIC
                33     LMSCOB     COBOL
                34     LMSFOR     FORTRAN
                35     LMSRPG     RPG
                36     LMSWSU     WSU
                40     LMSUNS     UNSPECIFIED
                41     LMSBGC     BUS GRAPHICS CHART
                42     LMSBGD     BUS GRAPHICS DATA
                43     LMSBGF     BUS GRAPHICS FORMAT
                51     LMSICF     CONFIG ICF
                52     LMSSSP     CONFIG SSP
                53     LMSEDT     EDITABLE TEXT
                54     LMSFFT     FREE FORM TEXT
                55     LMSHCT     HARD COPY TEXT
                56     LMSX25     X.25 PACKET SWITCHING LINK CNTRL
                57     LMSCSM     COMMUNICATIONS & SYSTEMS MGMT
                58     LMSQRY     QUERY
                59     LMSCSP     CROSS SYSTEM PRODUCT
                5A     LMSQDE     QUERY DATA ENTRY
                5B     LMSDLS     DOCUMENT LIBRARY SERVICES
                5C     LMSKEY     KEYS PROCEDURES
                37     LMSSDM     SOFTWARE DISTRIBUTION MBR
 
    25      2          DIRPTF@    DISPL OF PTF TABLE IN MEMBER
    27      1          DIRATTR6   ATTRIBUTE BYTE # 6
 
   BYTE SIX     80     DIRDYNPR   DYNAMICALLY PRIVILEGED
                40     DIRSWAP    MEMBER DOES NOT NEED SWAP AREA
                20     DIRSDOWN   EMULATION MEMBER
                10     DIRROLAY   HAS MEMORY RESIDENT OVERLAYS
                08     DIRLANMC   PC LAN MICROCODE MEMBER
 
    28     11          DIRRESV2   RESERVED AREA
    31      2          DIRENTRY   DISPL OF LAST DIR ENTRY BYTE
 
These two are not actual part of a directory entry, but just constant values:
 
                33     DIRLENGH   LENGTH OF DIRECTORY ENTRY
                05     DIR#PERS   NUMBER OF DIR PER SECTOR
 
HTH,
G.
 
 
P.S. If you're brave you may want to try to write to the Bitsavers manager
(that is Al Kossow) and ask him if he has IBM document LY21-0592 available...