Overleg:Cleveland (Middlesbrough)

message: Hi. Sorry to pop up here speaking the wrong language. I think that this page needs to be moved: the correct spelling of the town in England is Middlesbrough, not Middlesborough. Middlesborough is only the correct spelling for the town in Kentucky, USA. Thanks and best wishes 138.37.199.206 17 jul 2008 09:42 (CEST)
replies: text: You are right :) Middlesbrough is a town, Cleveland (Middlesborough) is a motorcycle brand ;-) EdoOverleg 17 jul 2008 09:52 (CEST)
replies: text: :Hi Edoderoo and thank you very much for the response. I'm sorry to argue but are you sure that's right, and is there a source for this? I have tried to look it up and all I have succeeded in finding is that yes, there was a Cleveland Motorcycle Co. operating in Middlesbrough 1911-1914. But I have not yet found any reference to it using the name Cleveland (Middlesborough) nor indeed Cleveland (Middlesbrough) - it just seemed to call itself the Cleveland Motorcycle Co. So where did the spelling Middlesborough come from? Sure, if that was what the company was really called, and they (despite being based there) spelt it wrongly, then fine, great, no worries. But if it has just been called Cleveland (Middlesborough) here on nl.wikipedia, by a wikipedia editor, to differentiate it from Cleveland (Cleveland, Ohio) then that would be a mistake, and it should be moved to Cleveland (Middlesbrough). I'm really very happy to discuss this further, and I am absolutely ready to stand corrected, apologize prettily, and offer to buy you beer if/when it is demonstrated to me that Cleveland (Middlesborough) really is correct. Until then, I continue to be pursued by this doubt, based on what I see as its unlikeliness (see Ockhams scheermes!) and I would still like people to consider whether it is really correct or not for it to be here and whether the move I proposed might not be correct. Thanks and best wishes, 138.37.199.206 25 jul 2008 18:37 (CEST)
replies: text: ::I'm not sure about sources. I believe that historically the names borough and brough were used for several places, and often they seemed to be interchanging one another. But it can be that the original creator of the motorbike made a spellingmistake. EdoOverleg 25 jul 2008 20:31 (CEST)
replies: text: :::Hi and thanks for that. Sure, brough, borough, burgh etc do get used, but they are NOT interchangeable. Edinbrough is not an alternative spelling for the capital of Scotland, and Middlesborough is not a correct spelling for the town in North-East England. I'm sorry, but it just isn't. It is called Middlesbrough and that's honestly it. So we are left with the possibility that they made a mistake in naming the bike company - except, was it ever actually called Cleveland (Middlesborough)? You haven't really answered my point here - I worry that it is what I have suggested - that the company was not called that, that it was called Cleveland Motorcyle Co, and that the Middlesborough is just a mistake, introduced, here or elsewhere, by someone trying to disambiguate between the two companies, who did not understand the spelling issue with the English town.  I will go on trying to find evidence for either, but I would love to hear why you seem so sure that the current name of this page is correct. I am beginning to seriously doubt this, but I would be very pleased to hear your arguments. Thanks and best wishes, DisillusionedBitterAndKnackered 26 jul 2008 00:33 (CEST)
* The conclusion to this is that I asked the person who started the page, Gebruiker:Piero, for his opinion and he agreed that I might be right, and has moved the page, which is why it is now happily here. Thanks very much both Piero and Edo for the discussion and help. DisillusionedBitterAndKnackered 30 jul 2008 18:24 (CEST)
thread_title:  Middlesbrough not Middlesborough