Disputatio:Massachusetta

message: sorry, I'm new to Latin. Anyways, the English pronunciation of "Massachusetts" is like "Massa-too-sitts" or "Massa-too-setts". So I think the Latin transliteration should reflect that pronunciation. Revolucion 02:07, 15 Decembris 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Um, what English?  I've only ever heard /ˌmæsəˈtʃusɪts/ (i.e., massa-choo-sitts).  At any rate we are not in the business of inventing words for things; that counts as original research (as opposed to source-based research) and is discouraged.  See what is excluded from articles.  —Myces Tiberinus 06:45, 15 Decembris 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: :I too have never heard any pronunciation but the one Myces cites. I suppose UK speakers might pronounce "tue" and "choo" more or less the same though.

text: :Of course it is likely that whoever originally named the article Massaciusseta made that form up too, based, presumably, on Italian. (We would need to consider more than "what English"—there's also the question of "what Latin", since not everyone uses the same pronunciation.) In terms of preexisting names, we can immediately cite two texts:

text: #The state seal, as shown on the page, reads "SIGILLUM REIPUBLICÆ MASSACHUSETTENSIS"

text: #Egger's Lexicon Nominum Locorum, p. 197, s.v., reads:
replies: text: ::Massachussets
replies: text: ::Massachuseta, ae, f.

text: ::Quo nomine Latine reddendo prope secutus sum Graecos recentes, a quibus ponitur Μασσαχουσέττη.

text: ::Ita appellatur una e Foederatis Civitatibus Americae Sept. Secundum sermonem autochthonum huic locutioni, cui ex Anglicae linguae usu littera s, pluralis numeri index, est addita, haec vis videtur esse subiecta: ad magnos colles (massa - wad - shuash - et; Egli 586).

text: ::Massachusetani, orum; Massachusetanus, a, um

text: :--Iustinus 06:57, 15 Decembris 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: :: Traupman has the Massaciusseta this page was at.  Trying to find older cites; all I have atm is part of, apparently, a book title, which has an indecl.: "Foederatarum Nov-Angliae Coloniarum Massachuset Plimouth Connecticut".  "Nov-Angliae", hee. —Myces Tiberinus 08:22, 15 Decembris 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: :::Oddly, I've usually heard it as "Mass." But then, I did live in New England Sinister Petrus

message: Si sigillum sequere volumus, res movenda est ad "Massachusetta". Vide etiam Universitas Harvardiana! Alex1011
thread_title:  movenda res? 

message: In rebus reipublicae ipsae, ego "respublica Massachusetensis," aut variationem eius semper vidi.  Nominem esse "Massachutens" aut quidquid simila insinuare parit.  Nonne hic alter nomem sit?  72.166.213.223 02:20, 4 Septembris 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Nominem?

text: The state seal and other authorities (e.g., Harvard) have the adjective Massachusettensis. For a noun, this cannot yield the spellings Massachusseta and (pace Egger) Massachuseta because it provides no warrant for doubling the ess a second time and cutting one tee. The noun should apparently be Massachūsetta (or perhaps Massachūsettia). But we've been through this before. Traupman's form wrongly doubles the ess twice, cuts a tee, and works only with church-Latin pronunciation. IacobusAmor 03:26, 16 Iulii 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: :I don't know any latin, sorry, but i stumbled on this page. The thing is that Massachusetts is the name of a tribe and/or one man. The "official" state demonym is "Bay Stater" because no one could come up with anything else. It's one of the only states that had to decree the demonym through government. 67.204.48.2 06:13, 4 Novembris 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Massachusettensis" 

message: Could the name be "Massachusetts, Massachusettis," or some comparable 3rd declension?  "Massachusetta" just doesn't sound right.  Perhaps "Massachusetts" as an undeclinable, using "respublica Massachusettensis" when necessary? [ usor:TimotheusL ]
replies: text: Usor ignote, Mssachusetta (with different number of t's and s's) is the attested form in the sources, therefore it is the right name.--Xaverius 09:21, 20 Novembris 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Nomen

message: Salve,
Sil placet, describe mihi cur forma nominis "Massachusetta" est melior quam forma nominis "Massachusettensis", quod haec forma in omnibus scriptis auctoritate apparet, in scripis Harvardiensis Universitatis, in signo Massachusettaeve, exempli gratia, etiam quod naturalior canor Latinae linguae affertur in usus formae "Massachusettensis" quam "Massachusetta".
Dictionario (locuta in supra pagina) capere attentionem grandiorem quam historiam usus in locutis et in scriptis debetne?
Gratias.
replies: text: "Massachusettensis" est nomen adiectivum, rite constructum; "Massachusetta" est nomen substantivum. Fontes citavimus pro ambobus. Nemo, nisi fallor, clamat unum melius esse atque alterum; ambobus uti licet.

text: "Massachusettensis" is a correctly formed adjective, "Massachusetta" is the noun. We cite sources for both. I don't think anyone's claiming that one is better than the other; we can use both, as we need them. Andrew Dalby (disputatio) 08:51, 14 Iunii 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Disputatio de "Massachusettensis" in loco "Massachusetta" pertenda