Disputatio:Bibliotheca Rylandiana

message: "in commentario de manuscripto Pap. Ryland. 16." How do we know that "Ryland." is an abbreviation for "Rylandianus"? An abbreviation can stop in various places in a word: e.g. "Zwei Anmerkungen zu P. Ryl. III 457" on :en:Rylands Library Papyrus P52. However it would be surprising if the form "Rylandsiana" existed.--Johnsoniensis (disputatio) 19:39, 10 Iulii 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: I usually believe what IacobusAmor says, but if you don't believe him, and want to know for yourself, you can follow up his reference. The link he gave no longer works, but there is still online access to the book he cites: here it is. There's no abbreviation involved (perhaps you misunderstood his note). The phrase used is rather nice, so I will quote it verbatim in the note. Incidentally, the author did not know, or did not use, the usual Latin name for Manchester. Might cite him on that too. Andrew Dalby (disputatio) 08:48, 11 Iulii 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: :Did someone say something? Even the scent of matutinal coffee (already brewing) actuates no memories. IacobusAmor (disputatio) 11:31, 11 Iulii 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: ::Sorry, Iacobe, for not speaking clearly! Back in 2017 you changed the lemma to "Bibliotheca Rylandiana", duly citing a source. Johnsoniensis yesterday changed it back without touching the footnote. I reverted the change because your footnote correctly justified the name, and a further change ought to have been justified by some other source or some new argument.

text: ::Johnsoniensis, to judge by the comment afterwards added above, maybe hadn't quite understood your footnote. Andrew Dalby (disputatio) 11:44, 11 Iulii 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: :::Or perhaps the purpose of footnoting a lemma? We've seen others doing the same thing: changing a lemma but leaving in place a footnote attesting the discarded lemma. In any event, I've added another attestation this morning. IacobusAmor (disputatio) 11:51, 11 Iulii 2019 (UTC)

message: From the small sample of evidence found via Google, it seems that "P[ap]. Ryl[and]." expands to "Papyrus Rylandensis": in the abstract visible here for example. This is useful to know, but it doesn't signal a conflict with the author of the work Iacobus cites. The library's connection with Rylands is founder/memorial/commemoration (hence -ianus works well), whereas the papyri are thus named because that's where they are (hence -ensis works well). Andrew Dalby (disputatio) 11:44, 11 Iulii 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you both for your thorough explanations: in writing about the institutions of the University of Manchester Ryland's is often used erroneously for "of Rylands" and similarly with "Owens College" named after John Owens (not John Owen). The Catalan WP had "Beatus Ryland" as the title of an article; now it is "Beatus Rylands", though they use the English name for the JRL itself.--Johnsoniensis (disputatio) 08:04, 12 Iulii 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: :No problem! There is a legitimate question whether we should rely on any single author, if not connected with the institution in question, for a Latin form of that kind. As he says above, Iacobus has now footnoted a second attestation, which makes the thing quite secure. Andrew Dalby (disputatio) 08:23, 12 Iulii 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rylandiana vs. Rylandensis