# Talk:Winter white dwarf hamster

(We generally calls it normal/sapphire/pearl white/pudding winter white hamster for Djungarian hamster and campbell hamster for Campbell's dwarf hamster) leaving out the dwarf in my country, so notice I will use what I used to call for my explanation.) Lets get to the point.

Reason 1 on the article, (The first picture in this article is no Winter White Hamster  It is a campbell.)

Reason 2 on the article,
Q. Should I get a male or female Russian Dwarf Hamster?
A. Female Russian Dwarf Hamsters tend to be easier to tame then their male counterparts. It seems that males need more patience to domestic properly.
I have many of both actually, and in fact it is the female that are usually stressed more easily when they are pregnant and female doesn't necessary meant a better pet. (In terms of difficulty to tame, I dont see any different if you are using the correct treats as different hamster likes different food. This is definitely an unreliable study view, as it properly goes only to the author's hamsters. Beside from my observation of my own litters, many female(1 day to 6months old) tends to display scared and stressed position when disturbed by stranger during sleeps and squeaked more often, while the male counterparts not as much, and usually involve attempts to shove of your fingers when disturb rather than squeaking at you. On usual, the only time when a male hamster squeak which means it is scared is usually during fights and when its young of 1day to 4 weeks old from my observe.)

Reason 3,
Q. Why do male hamsters start riding the backs of other male hamsters? Are they mating?
A. No silly, male hamsters cannot mate. First make sure that they are actually both male and if they are males then it is simply that the male hamster is reaching its puberty stage of development.
(Looking at how the author replied, it seems that author is totally unaware, homosexuality do exist in any mammals. I for one kept winter white of sapphire/normal colors myself, and I did observed older males(10months old) mounting on young males one of 1month old who is his son. The young mounted male is now 7months old fathering another 4, while the older one is dead. Hence I can confirm to you its a young male he mounted. Definitely again, not a study view and goes only to a few in the author's pet shop and he just happen to see for reason and think of it.)

reason 4,
Q. Can I place my Russian Dwarf Hamster with other hamsters such as Syrian or Chinese or Winter White or Robo Hamsters?
A. No, this is absolutely not a good idea. Each breed of hamster should be enclosed into a den of its own kind of species. For example, Syrian hamsters should never be placed with any other kind of hamster because it will naturally fight and try to kill rival hamsters
(A winter white should never be placed together with a campbell as well, unless you are going to produce hybrids which is far more of critical importance than mixing with other species, author failure to bring this out clearly show author properly didn't even know that campbell and winter white are 2 difference species. As a result, it is not ok to put hamster together just because both are dwarf because there are serveral species of dwarfs. Robo hamster is one of them though the author can only see this.)
Than again my observation is no deep analytical study views as well, but is definitely more reliable than the site I removed. Dsdsasds (talk) 02:59, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

i think there is a big mistake in the article:
"They enjoy each others company and are possibly the most communal hamsters in terms of living arrangements."
On pages like
http://www.petplanet.co.uk/petplanet/breeds/Hamster_-_Dwarf_Winter_White_Russian.htm
http://www.petwebsite.com/hamsters/dwarf_winter_white_russian_hamsters_behavior.htm
or in (german) books like
Judy Fox: Mein Zwerghamster zu Hause Bede 2003, ISBN 3-89860-027-0
you can read that they can be kept together but often fights occur.
This page has lots of errors and needs to be re-written by experts.
For the natural history of Phodopus sungorus, please refer to Steinlechner, 1998
[1]
Also, large volumn of research done by Wynne-Edwards:
[2]  unsigned comment by 84.59.230.180 (talk) 21:51, 6 November 2005
---
I agree with the above comment on them often disliking company and changed the text. Simon A. 14:15, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

I just got home from buying two of these animals and have just found out that one has died. The reason is obvious, there should be something in this article about traveling home with the Hamster in cooler temperatures. One of the hamsters I bought died of a heat stroke. Punk18

See WP:NOT, Wikipedia is not a "how to" guide. Puffin Let's talk! 18:02, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

"Winter Whites are not sociable and won't live together peacefully unless they are siblings, but even then, the hamsters might fight fatally. It is advised to keep them single, as in wildlife each of them has a territory of 12km²." Many places only sell them at pairs for a reason.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.180.61.186 (talk) 23:01, 21 May 2008 (UTC) 

So why not you replace the info instead of posting everything here? Source? There are so many random info article on 'dwarf hamsters' care all over google, but even before reading them, one know the article is no trustworthy, and is properly written by a random pet shop owner/random owners, that knows nothing except spending lots of time idling with this rodents, and only know his/her hamster favorite food actually though act very professional. I'm always wondering if the author even know, dwarf hamster can comes in Roborovski, Winter White and Campbell. Because the title they usually give for their article are generally the likes of, 'care on dwarf hamster' 'breeding dwarf hamster' etc. When there are so many types of dwarf hamster out there, all with different characteristic and looks and cares are definitely different in a large way. Dsdsasds (talk) 10:11, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

Biological information - habitat, lifestyle, behaviour and such - should be present and indeed should come first. The German wikipedia has such info and one may translated from it or from some other non-English wikipedia.--91.148.159.4 (talk) 22:35, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

I put in a request for article name change from:  Winter White Russian Dwarf Hamster to Winter white Russian dwarf hamster.
Two naming possibilities, both getting equal google hits:

Winter white Russian dwarf hamster
Dwarf winter white Russian hamster
I chose the former because there are other dwarf hamsters. There is a big backlog for reaming, so any objections, please speak up. Thanks.  Anna Frodesiak (talk) 15:58, 5 August 2010 (UTC)
(This is per conventions). Anna Frodesiak (talk) 16:05, 5 August 2010 (UTC)

Move to Djungarian hamster, which appears to be by far the most commonly used name in reliable sources. By contrast, both "winter white" variants appear only very rarely in high-quality sources like scientific journals. There are several other names in use for this species—the IUCN Red List gives "Dzhungarian Hamster" and Mammal Species of the World uses Striped Desert Hamster, and "Siberian hamster" is also in use. There may also be some confusion with Phodopus campbelli, and some sources seem to limit "Djungarian" to that species. P. campbelli may actually occur in Dzhungaria, unlike P. sungorus, but I'm not sure of that point. If Djungarian—under whatever spelling—is too ambiguous, "Siberian hamster" is an acceptable alternative. The use of lowercase follows WP:RODENT guidelines. Ucucha 16:27, 5 August 2010 (UTC)
Wow. They did it so quickly. Oh, well. Your suggestion is still a red link, so no harm done.
I thought it was completely uncontroversial (looking at the nature of the talk page). I like your plan about Djungarian hamster. I think the spelling is fine. I completely agree. I suggest giving it a couple of days, and then making the move. I doubt anyone will squeak about it. Nice to know somebody who is not 6 years old is watching this page. Best, Anna Frodesiak (talk) 00:31, 6 August 2010 (UTC)

This page should be completely redone. It is filled with misinformation. First of all the Siberian dwarf hamster (phodopus sungorus) also known as the Russian Winter White hamster is NOT the Djungarian hamster. The Djungarian hamster is the Campbell hamster (phodopus campbelli). However, in the Wiki page for the Campbell hamster it says that it is a mistake to call it the Djungarian hamster when it is in fact the Djungarian hamster.
216.38.186.74 (talk) 14:01, 19 April 2011 (UTC)AA

I am working on this article. I enjoy the subject and have many books and internet sources. Puffin Let's talk! 19:31, 2 August 2011 (UTC)

This review is transcluded from Talk:Djungarian hamster/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.
Reviewer: GRAPPLE X 19:23, 16 August 2011 (UTC)

GA review – see WP:WIAGA for criteria

Never done a biology article here, so if I'm going about it wrong don't be afraid to correct me.
Is it reasonably well written?
A. Prose quality: 
Few little niggles. I'll fix anything that I know how to, but stylistic things that you and I might differ on I'll list here."the length of the tail is five to 15 millimetres, and the hind legs are eleven to fifteen millimetres." -> use either the numerals or the word for both instances of 15, but one of each in the same sentence should be corrected."In males, the body weight ranges from 19 grams (0.67 oz) to 45 grams (1.6 oz), and in females, 19 grams (0.67 oz) to 36 grams (1.3 oz)" -> it would flow better as prose to have these ranges be written as "19 to 45 grams (0.67 to 1.6 oz)", although there's nothing technically wrong with how they are. Just my opinion so ignore it if you prefer the current wording.In addition to the natural, as "ruddy" or "agouti" and designated dominant inherited staining occur in captivity for more colours." -> I'm not really sure what this means. I assume you mean that hamsters in captivity display more varied colours than wild ones? I think that could be clarified.  Done - I think. Puffin Let's talk! 20:01, 16 August 2011 (UTC)
B. MoS compliance for lead, layout, words to watch, fiction, and lists: 
The body of the article is fine for MOS, but the lead isn't. It contains a lot of information not present in the rest of the article (about the furry paws, winter coats being used for camouflage, etc) and doesn't really sum up the article properly. I'd move anything not mentioned in the article down to its relevant section (taking it out of the lead, as you could just get away with a short physical description of the 'regular' hamster and then the seasonal changes), and try to include a short paragraph summarising the 'breeding' and 'pet ownership' sections - both of those could be summarised in one brief paragraph, really.  Done - I think. Puffin Let's talk! 20:01, 16 August 2011 (UTC)
Is it factually accurate and verifiable?
A. References to sources: 

B. Citation of reliable sources where necessary: 

C. No original research: 
Your citations are grand, no problem with their use. However, unless the red-linked authors are notable enough to have their own articles, I'd remove the links just for aesthetics.
Is it broad in its coverage?
A. Major aspects: 

B. Focused: 
Scope seems fine to me.
Is it neutral?
Fair representation without bias: 
Article is neutral.
Is it stable?
No edit wars, etc: 
History is stable.
Does it contain images to illustrate the topic?
A. Images are copyright tagged, and non-free images have fair use rationales: 

B. Images are provided where possible and appropriate, with suitable captions: 
Images are all commons and free so that's great. However, you have three thumbnail images in a vertical column which looks a bit off - perhaps adding them into one thumbnail frame, similar to how the two portraits are framed here, would make this look a bit better. It's entirely up to yourself, though.
I tried it, as you can see here, I don't think it looks good though, so I reverted it. Puffin Let's talk! 19:59, 16 August 2011 (UTC)
Overall:
Pass or Fail: 
Mostly the only problem with the article is the lead, so I'm going to put this on hold until that's sorted out. The rest of the issues should also be addressed but they're much lower priorities - the image thing is entirely optional, but some decision should be made about the points in 1A. If you want any help reformatting the lead, feel free to ask me about it. GRAPPLE X 19:23, 16 August 2011 (UTC)
Still think there could be more work done on the lead, but I'll do that myself now. Ready to pass now that that's done. Well done! GRAPPLE X 21:12, 16 August 2011 (UTC)

"yellow blue fawn" sounds odd to me, can someone with access to the sources check this shouldn't be two different colours such as "yellow, blue fawn". Ta ϢereSpielChequers 13:03, 5 September 2011 (UTC)

The book says yellow blue fawn. Puffin Let's talk! 19:20, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

I've renamed the article, breeders call these "Winter white dwarf hamsters", pet shops call these "Russian dwarf hamsters", virtually nobody calls them "Djungarian hamsters". "Winter white dwarf hamster" is the preferable name because a) pet shop "Russian Dwarf hamsters" are often cross breeds and b) they mostly live in Kazakhstan not Russia. Szzuk (talk) 21:32, 26 November 2018 (UTC)

I've converted the article to mostly mention them as winter white, i will check the redirects, read through and copyedit in due course. Szzuk (talk) 21:57, 26 November 2018 (UTC)

I think someone should add a section about care. 167.248.177.137 (talk) 01:16, 5 January 2023 (UTC)

The picture of a hamster in this article is of a Campbell's Dwarf Hamster, not a Winter White Dwarf Hamster! Please change the image to one of a Winter White, as the article is called "Winter White Dwarf Hamster" and the current image can be confusing to pet owners who are trying to identify whether their dwarf hamster is a Campbell's or a Winter White. Thank you! 104.35.156.99 (talk) 01:14, 24 July 2024 (UTC)