# Talk:The Fame Monster

A recent edit by User:Gabi.X.Pretty.X.Little.X.Mind redefined this release as the "second album' by Lady Gaga. That definition was discussed extensively in 2010 as can be seen in multiple threads at Talk:The Fame Monster/Archive 2. The consensus is that this release was a reissue of The Fame plus some extra songs defined as an EP. Variety said the release was an EP, "The first extended play ever to be nominated for the album of the year Grammy (and Gaga’s second consecutive contender for the Recording Academy’s top prize), The Fame Monster clocks in at 34 minutes over eight tracks. Less an official follow-up to Gaga’s debut album than a placeholder to keep her momentum going, the EP was bundled with The Fame for a two-album deluxe edition."
Wikipedia follows the media, and the media are generally in agreement, counting Lady Gaga's albums as 1: The Fame, 2: Born This Way, 3: Artpop, etc. This particular release is not part of the studio album sequence. The following sources support Born This Way as the second album, or Artpop as the third album, and so on:

Observer said in 2018, "Artpop, her divisive third studio album..."
Billboard said in 2016, "'ARTPOP' Revisited: Arguing the Pros & Cons of Lady Gaga's Challenging Third Album"
Junkee said in 2021, "More than seven years after its ill-fated release, Lady Gaga’s third album ARTPOP is having its time on top."
Insider said in 2013, "Artpop... As divisive as her third studio album is, it is perhaps her most Gaga project yet, in that it's her most ambitious and uncaged."
Consequence of Sound said in 2021 that Born This Way was Gaga's "sophomore album", meaning her second one.
USA Today said in 2020 that Chromatica is Gaga's sixth album.
Billboard said in 2020 that Chromatica is Gaga's sixth album.
So we are not going to contradict all of these sources (and many more) by trying to redefine The Fame Monster as Gaga's second studio album. Binksternet (talk) 23:16, 3 October 2021 (UTC)

The edit summary reads: "The album has been confirmed her 2nd studio album. Documents leaked last year confirming it and in a previous interview with Zane Lowe gaga confirmed she has 8 studio albums and then again on Instagram". Which documents? We don't know because they are not sourced. If they were leaked, why do they satisfy WP:LEAKS; the Lowe-Gaga interview I assume is this one, but I'm not going to watch over 60 mins to verify when that was said, and "then again on Instagram" is a WP:PRIMARYSOURCE. (CC) Tbhotch™ 23:23, 3 October 2021 (UTC)
The video is titled
First listen - lady gaga & Tony Bennett and the time stamp is 2:58 Gabi.X.Pretty.X.Little.X.Mind (talk) 23:34, 3 October 2021 (UTC)

That's just Gaga calling Love for Sale (Tony Bennett and Lady Gaga album) her "eight studio album". If you see the sources above, you will see that Artpop, her hypothetic fourth studio album, is consistently called her third studio album. Gaga said in 2009: "I would not add, nor take away any songs from this EP.". This is pretty much the reason why we don't give undue weight to primary sources (like Gaga in this case) when secondary sources exist, because they tend to contradict themselves. (CC) Tbhotch™ 23:42, 3 October 2021 (UTC)
I personally believe its her 2nd studio album. There is a discussion on gaga daily about her having 8 studio albums and many others also believe tfm is her 2nd album.  Gabi.X.Pretty.X.Little.X.Mind (talk) 00:03, 4 October 2021 (UTC)

"Wikipedia articles should be based on reliable, published sources". Gaga Daily is self-described as "the largest fan site dedicated to pop queen Lady Gaga". Per WP:RSP: "As an Internet forum, it is a self-published source that incorporates user-generated content, and is considered generally unreliable." (CC) Tbhotch™ 00:16, 4 October 2021 (UTC)
Also Chromatica being promoted as her sixth album means sixth SOLO album. In that Zane and gaga interview she said she has 8 studio albums if u count her jazz records. So technically she has 6 studio albums but she counts L4S and C2C, making it 8 Gabi.X.Pretty.X.Little.X.Mind (talk) 00:19, 4 October 2021 (UTC)

You are not commenting on something new, just a paraphrased version of your previous comment. You need to debunk all the evidence already presented with reliable independent sources, as Gaga has demonstrated to be contradictory on her discography. (CC) Tbhotch™ 00:23, 4 October 2021 (UTC)

Hello, sorry for the inconvenience, but when does the protection of this page expire? I checked the history and I didn't find when 170.51.104.30 (talk) 20:59, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

You have been genre-warring and delivering personal attacks left and right, using the IP range Special:Contributions/170.51.104.0/21. It's a good thing this article is protected indefinitely. Binksternet (talk) 21:47, 19 January 2022 (UTC)
To answer the question posed, the lock is indefinite. It will expire when the community requests it to be unprotected which can be done at Wikipedia:Requests for page protection. Walter Görlitz (talk) 01:50, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

I do think the genres should be changed to Europop, dance-pop and electropop as the majority of the songs have very heavy europop influences as written in the composition sections. 2A02:C7C:382E:8E00:61E4:3DA2:8A94:316B (talk) 12:37, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

 Not done. Wikipedia is supposed to be a summary of published facts. The song's genre can only come from publications describing the song's genre. Binksternet (talk) 12:52, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

I've noticed that quite a lot of albums since The Fame Monster have also been rereleased with a bonus EP full of new material, usually available seperately as well, e.g. Born to Die: The Paradise Edition by Lana Del Rey, Animal + Cannibal by Kesha, Pink Friday: Roman Reloaded - The Re-Up by Nicki Minaj. Maybe this should be considered for the legacy and impact section. 84.69.1.151 (talk) 17:34, 24 June 2023 (UTC)

 Not done. You need to provide a reliable source for this statement, otherwise it is just your opinion. GagaNutellatalk 00:41, 27 June 2023 (UTC)

Change 'iTunes' to 'digital and streaming' above Disco Heaven in the track listing section.
Source: The Fame Monster (Deluxe Edition) on Spotify
(See Talk:The Fame) 84.66.14.150 (talk) 00:37, 1 August 2023 (UTC)

 Done  Xan747 (talk) 14:41, 1 August 2023 (UTC)

At the end of the second paragraph:
'The cover artwork, shot by Hedi Slimane, has a Gothic theme and was declined for release by her record company, but Gaga persuaded them.'
What I think this should be changed to:
'The album's two covers were shot by Hedi Slimane. One of the covers has a Gothic theme and was declined for release by her record company, but Gaga persuaded them.' 84.69.60.48 (talk) 13:13, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

 Done — Paper9oll (🔔 • 📝) 07:02, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

The infobox should say 'cover used for most standard releases' for the brunette cover and 'cover used for most deluxe releases' for the blonde cover. The two covers are interchangeable between editions depending on the region. 90.240.127.233 (talk) 20:22, 3 October 2023 (UTC)

Discussion underway at Talk:Lady_Gaga#Revisiting_the_sequencing_of_Gaga's_main_albums:_'Monster'_as_second_album.
See you there. Binksternet (talk) 22:32, 7 December 2024 (UTC)

It’s time to update The Fame Monster as Gaga’s second solo studio album. By not changing that you guys are not respecting her ideas and artistic vision. 2A02:14F:F:D069:4871:5DA1:9851:194F (talk) 23:03, 18 February 2025 (UTC)

Please feel free to join the discussion underway at Talk:Lady Gaga#Request for comment: Is the Mayhem album number 7 or number 8 in Gaga's chronology?
The discussion is about how we are to number Gaga's albums. Binksternet (talk) 16:05, 6 February 2025 (UTC)

Did this discussion ever really get anywhere? It seems that both Gaga herself and major music industry sources like Billboard consider Mayhem her seventh solo studio album. Is the issue whether The Fame Monster is a studio album or an EP in its standalone release? Abby Abangan (talk) 20:27, 12 May 2025 (UTC)
I believe it is considered not one of her "official albums" as even the wiki on it says that it is a reissue, but considering none of the cites on the mayhem page has "LG8" but there was a few for "LG7" I would argue that this is number 7, but canonically its her 6th. MusicGene (talk) 20:58, 12 May 2025 (UTC)
I agree that the album is usually just a reissue, but I'm not sure that it's accurate to call the standalone version an EP. Abby Abangan (talk) 23:21, 12 May 2025 (UTC)
From her website: “Released in 2009, The Fame Monster expands upon Lady Gaga’s debut with a new album featuring eight new tracks that delve into the darker side of fame.”
New album being the key word.
The Fame = LG1
The Fame Monster = LG2
Born This Way = LG3
ARTPOP = LG4
Joanne = LG5
Chromatica = LG6
Harlequin = LG6.5
MAYHEM = LG7 24.7.88.10 (talk) 01:02, 27 August 2025 (UTC)