# Talk:Virginia Christian

Why is Wikipedia calling her a criminal when we have no reliable sources that state she committed any crimes? Polygnotus (talk) 06:33, 16 October 2022 (UTC)
I complained over at Wikipedia:Neutral_point_of_view/Noticeboard#Alleged? Polygnotus (talk) 02:59, 30 January 2025 (UTC)
Turns out she is not a "criminal" but an intellectually disabled and abused child who was not given a fair trial. 
under Virginia law at the time, juveniles (defined as age 17 or younger) were not supposed to be incarcerated, let alone executed[1]
The case is the subject of a new historical novel, "Forsaken," by Ross Howell Jr. Howell will appear at  the 11th Alabama Book Festival on Saturday alongside Alabama State University professor Derryn Moten, who wrote his Ph.D. dissertation on Christian's trial and execution, to discuss the case.[2]
https://morbidology.com/the-execution-of-virginia-christian/ Not sure how reliable this one is.
Sixteen-year-old Virginia Christian worked as a washer woman in Hampton to help support her paralyzed mother. https://edu.lva.virginia.gov/200/stories/57
This fact is the backdrop for the historical novel "Forsaken" (New South Books/2016). The book tells the story of Christian through the lens of a young, idealist reporter Charles Mears. It's a tale woven with historical fact and fictional narrative that combines racial prejudice with hope and redemption. https://www.wunc.org/arts-culture/2016-02-05/forsaken-examines-the-story-of-virginia-christian
https://uncommonwealth.virginiamemory.com/blog/2010/09/14/virginia-christian-the-last-woman-executed-by-virginia/
https://uncommonwealth.virginiamemory.com/blog/2012/08/15/souls-of-the-departed-ida-v-belote/
A Gruesome Warning to Black Girls: The August 16, 1912 Execution of Virginia Christian by Derryn Eroll Moten - University of Iowa, 1997
https://www.jstor.org/stable/43308822
http://trials.erinbush.org/schedule-2/virginia-christian/
Polygnotus (talk) 03:39, 30 January 2025 (UTC)

@Polygnotus, I saw your note at the NPOVN and see that you've gathered a bunch of sources above. Forsaken: The Digital Bibliography, listed in the external links, has a lot of primary source material as well as what look like historical excerpts from Howell's book. Derryn Moten is now a professor at the Alabama State U.: https://www.alasu.edu/faculty/DerrynMoten.php (lists his email address, he might respond to a query, though we wouldn't be able to use an email response since it's non-verifiable; still, he might point to some text in his dissertation, which is wiki-published)
In addition to Moten, citation 4 also refers to: Streib, V., & Sametz, L. (1989). Executing female juveniles. Connecticut Law Review, 22, 3-16. (I haven't found an online copy, only an abstract here)
A couple of other possibilities:
“Christian Virginia vs. Virginia Christian,” Crisis 4 (September 1912): 237–39. (haven't been able to find a copy, but perhaps it will be among the primary materials you linked to)
Jones, L. E. (2018). “The most unprotected of all human beings”: Black Girls, State Violence, and the Limits of Protection in Jim Crow Virginia. Souls, 20(1), 14-37. (online copy)
FactOrOpinion (talk) 01:50, 31 January 2025 (UTC)
@FactOrOpinion: Thank you! This article could use some work. Let's collaborate and improve it. It doesn't have to be perfect, but at least better than when I discovered it. I have not yet read (or even found) all the sources. Polygnotus (talk) 02:02, 31 January 2025 (UTC)
Right now, I'm just going to investigate potential sources a bit more. You're right, that W.E.B. Du Bois quote came from the same edition of The Crisis that I mentioned. Thanks for the pdf! I also found a copy on the Internet Archive, but your pdf is easier to read.
A few other potential sources (some only minor info, but I figure I might as well keep track when I come across things):
Battle, Nishaun T. (2019). Black girlhood, punishment, and resistance: Reimagining justice for black girls in Virginia. Routledge.
Linders, Annulla, and Alana Van Gundy-Yoder. "Gall, gallantry, and the gallows: Capital punishment and the social construction of gender, 1840-1920." Gender & Society 22.3 (2008): 324-348. I don't have access to the paper, but this footnote, which might be the only relevant text, is accessible: In the event that the Black papers did comment on the execution of Black women, they sometimes provided a somewhat different reading of events than the white papers. This is particularly clear in the case of Virginia Christian, who was executed by Virginia in 1912. We have data from three different Black papers (the  Chicago Defender, Cleveland Gazette, and Washington Bee), and all three raised objections to her execution, even if not always in terms of racial inequality. Rather, the most common objection among both Black and white advocates was based on the age and ignorance of the girl (she was 16 at the time of execution). One of the papers, however, made an overt link to racist practices: “The color of one's skin, alas, too frequently, either opens the door to liberty or closes it on freedom” (Washington Bee, August 3, 1912).
Hylton, Raymond Pierre, Rodney D. Waller, and Kimberly A. Matthews. Richmond's First African Baptist Church. Arcadia Publishing, 2023. (not really readable through Google Books, but the limited search info suggests that the focus is on people who sought clemency for Christian, pp. 73-75)
Green, William D. "Nellie Griswold Francis: The Vicissitudes of Activism for Women and Race." Minnesota History 67.3 (2020): 128-138. "Terrell enlisted Francis to join her in going to the office of Virginia governor William Hodges Mann to persuade him to stay the execution of a 17-year-old Black girl named Virginia Christian, convicted of murdering her abusive employer." (Terrell = Mollie Church Terrell, president of the National Association of Colored Women’s Clubs, Francis was president of the Minnesota Federation of Colored Women’s Clubs), also has a newspaper clipping from an unidentified paper saying that Terrell and Francis obtained a 2 week stay of execution from the governor.
Tepedino, Therese C. "The founding and early years of the National Association of Colored Women." (1977). "In 1912, a sixteen-year-old Negro girl killed her employer, a White woman in her fifties. Although there was some question as to the girl's mental stability and the degree of premeditation, she was condemned to death. Despite several stays of execution, she was executed. It was the feeling of many Negro as well as White citizens of Virginia that if a reformatory for Negro girls had existed, she would have been committed to the institution. The State Federation of Virginia, formed a few years earlier, had been diligently working toward the establishment of such an institution. After the execution, their dream was realized."
Shipman, Marlin (2002). The penalty is death: US newspaper coverage of women's executions. University of Missouri Press, pp. 19, 160-162 (was able to read some of these pages through Google Books, the focus is on press coverage, including differences between local and Chicago coverage, quoting some of the Chicago Defender, mentioned above)
FactOrOpinion (talk) 01:11, 1 February 2025 (UTC)
Excellent, thanks again! Google Books always hides those pages I need most. Polygnotus (talk) 01:48, 1 February 2025 (UTC)

The End of Public Execution Race, Religion, and Punishment in the American South was written by Michael Ayers Trotti, professor of history at Ithaca College. I think we can use it for the claim that the jury took all of twenty-three minutes to decide that she was guilty.
Unceasing Militant - The Life of Mary Church Terrell was written by Alison M. Parker, chair of the history department at the university of Delaware. We can use that source for these claims:
Terrell was chosen to chair a small contingent bringing a petition signed by three hundred NACW delegates to Virginia governor William Hodges Mann.
The governor listened to Terrell and granted the women a visit with Christian. He also granted the teen a ten-day stay of execution so that civil rights activists could find more exculpatory evidence but indicated that he had no intention of commuting her sentence. Upon returning to the convention, Terrell’s committee issued a pessimistic report. In a show of appreciation for their efforts, NACW member and businesswoman Madam C. J. Walker paid for their travel expenses. The NAACP hired investigators to help, and five hundred northern blacks and whites who opposed capital punishment wrote letters to the governor, but the death of a white woman could not go unpunished.
"The “Commonwealth of Virginia vs. Virginia Christian”: Southern Black Women, Crime & Punishment in Progressive Era Virginia" was written by LaShawn Harris who is an Associate Professor of History at Michigan State University. I would consider her a biased source. Quote: Her response to racialized violence was a spontaneous yet conscious act of self-preservation and survival and arguably a direct challenge to race oppression, labor exploitation, and white brutality. Christian’s act of self-defense, like many African Americans responding to white violence during the era of Jim Crow segregation, was firmly anchored in African Americans’ individual and collective expressions of self-protection. So I think we can use it for facts, but her opinions would have to be attributed if they are mentioned.
On her own ground - The Life and Times of Madam C. J. Walker was written by A'Lelia Bundles, granddaughter of Madam C. J. Walker. We can use her as a source for:
the claim that the NACW and the NAACP co-operated.
In the evening, as Madam Walker was formally introduced to the group, she opened her remarks with the announcement of her donation to cover all travel costs for Terrell and the two other committee members who had ventured to Richmond.
This is also supported by Beauty Shop Politics - African American Womens Activism in the Beauty Industry which says that Madam C. J. Walker offered to pay for "the travel costs of Mary Church Terrell and two other women to travel to Richmond, Virginia, and appeal to the governor on behalf of Virginia Christian, a seventeen-year-old washerwoman who was set to be executed for killing her white employer." 
Polygnotus (talk) 02:12, 1 February 2025 (UTC)

W.E.B. DuBois wrote: Virginia Christian was a product of Virginia far more than of the colored race. It was the social organization of white Virginia that made this girl what she was and then brutally killed for it. The State pushed her down into poverty despite the hard-earned pennies of her father; the State refused to educate her or even to let Northern philanthropy do it; the State put her as a servant, body and soul, into the hands of her mistress and constituted that mistress judge and jury over this ignorant, wayward child. At the age of sixteen … this child was convicted of murder, when there is not a white man in the nation who after impartial review of the facts would not have to admit that every circumstance shows lack of premeditation with a strong case of self-defense. Make this child as brutal, immoral and irresponsible as you will and the black fact remains that a civilized community made her and then murdered her for being herself. And that community was Christian Virginia! I think that this quote comes from The Crisis 4 you mention above. Polygnotus (talk) 02:25, 31 January 2025 (UTC)
https://www.marxists.org/history/usa/workers/civil-rights/crisis/0900-crisis-v04n05-w023.pdf page 236 bottom right. Polygnotus (talk) 02:40, 31 January 2025 (UTC)

@Polygnotus: It looks like you've done a lot of digging for historical sources. I know you asked me for help earlier. Is it due to not feeling like there's an easy way to incorporate them? A second set of eyes? In general, plenty of articles can be rewritten without people objecting. I think it's worth a chance to try going ahead and being bold. Clovermoss🍀 (talk) 18:40, 31 January 2025 (UTC)
@Clovermoss: Thank you! I am certainly not afraid of people objecting, and I doubt they will, but I just really really suck at writing. I am pretty decent at finding sources and excellent at gnoming, but writing is not one of my talents. Collecting sources on the talkpage helps me, and anyone who wants to join me, find the best ones and decide which sources can be used for which claims. Incorporating information from sources into articles is not my strong suit. Currently one of the refs literally says Corroborated by Virginia Christian's own sisters, and descendants. Retrieved 2024-05-02. I currently have another 10 or so sources I want to dig through. When I discovered it this article was so bad that it annoyed me. I believe that, to increase the overall quality of the encyclopedia, we need to work on its weak points. Polygnotus (talk) 19:40, 31 January 2025 (UTC)

@Space4Time3Continuum2x: In response to this edit, Virginia Christian is mentioned on page 76 (page 77 of the PDF version). Polygnotus (talk) 22:07, 2 February 2025 (UTC)

Thanks, Polygnotus. I searched for the name but must have overlooked her mention. I changed the infobox template to "person". Will look at other material in the next few days. Space4TCatHerder🖖 22:25, 2 February 2025 (UTC)

Polygnotus, according to Baker, Black Female Executions in Historical Context (2008), Virginia was mentally disabled, one of eight children of a sharecropper on Belote's farm. According to Lindsey Jones, The most unprotected of all human beings”: Black Girls, State Violence, and the Limits of Protection in Jim Crow Virginia (2018), she was the third child of six, her father was a fisherman, and her mother had worked for the Belotes before becoming paralyzed. Both documents say that she was working for Ida Belote as a laundress. Baker's source is an article: Streib, V., & Sametz, L. (1989). Executing female juveniles. Connecticut Law Review, 22, 3-16. Jones's source is a dissertation: Derryn Eroll Moten, “‘A Gruesome Warning to Black Girls’: The August 16, 1912, Execution of Virginia Christian” (Ph.D. diss., University of Iowa, 1997), 39, 203. I don't have access to either one. Your table says that "Virginia State Penitentiary: A Notorious History" contains the whole story, in more detail than most other sources. Does it mention her family or her being mentally disabled? Space4TCatHerder🖖 19:42, 3 February 2025 (UTC)

I replied by email. Polygnotus (talk) 04:36, 4 February 2025 (UTC)
The relevant paragraph of Streib, V., & Sametz, L. (1989) is entirely sourced to The Crisis:
The last female juvenile executed was Virginia Christian. She was born on August 15, 1895, to poor black parents living in Hampton, Virginia. Christian's mother, who had a widely-known reputation for dishonesty, became paralyzed in 1909 when Christian was only thirteen years old. Christian's father was a hardworking laborer, but his wages of $1.25 per day were not enough to support his invalid wife and eight children. Therefore, the older children, including Christian, had to quit school and work to support the family. It was generally agreed that their home and family life remained squalid and miserable and that Christian adopted her mother's habits of immorality, dishon-esty, and thievery. Compounding this was Christian's "dubious mental responsibility."
The Crisis talks about Christian's "utter ignorance" in confessing without a lawyer, and her generally dismal situation, but I don't see an unambiguous claim that she was disabled. I'll take a look at Polygnotus' email tomorrow. In any case, I wouldn't use this specific source for that claim. Ghosts of Europa (talk) 09:02, 4 February 2025 (UTC)
If I remember correctly one of the sources says she was called "dull" at the time, and a later source used "retarded" which I changed to "intellectually disabled" for obvious reasons. Polygnotus (talk) 11:02, 4 February 2025 (UTC)
Baker (2016) explicitly calls her "mentally retarded", but his source is Streib, V., & Sametz, L. (1989) page 25, which is just the paragraph above, cited to The Crisis. Am I missing something in The Crisis that makes this more explicit?
FYI, if you want to check out Streib, V., & Sametz, L. (1989), it's available through HeinOnline via The Wikipedia Library. Ghosts of Europa (talk) 19:15, 4 February 2025 (UTC)

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/171642357/virginia-christian
https://www.virginiamemory.com/online-exhibitions/items/show/1067
https://www.virginiamemory.com/online-exhibitions/items/show/892
https://www.virginiamemory.com/online-exhibitions/exhibits/show/forsaken/chapter1
However, Governor Mann granted a second respite on 18 July, one day before the rescheduled execution, in order for Christian to see her spiritual advisors.  Governor Mann granted a third respite on 26 July, the Newport News Daily Press reported, after meeting with a committee from the National Federation of Colored Women.
Polygnotus (talk) 06:47, 4 February 2025 (UTC)

David Baker has twice described Virginia Christian as "mentally retarded". 

Page 76 of the article Black Female Executions in Historical Context (Baker 2008), cited to Streib, V., & Sametz, L. (1989).
Pages 172–173 of the book Women and Capital Punishment in the United States: An Analytical History (Baker 2016), also cited to Streib, V., & Sametz, L. (1989).
In Baker (2016), he also includes a direct quote ostensibly from Streib & Sametz: 

In contrast, Ida Belote was an older white woman and one of the town’s “white aristocracy by way of her father’s prominence as the owner of a large grocery.”62 
He cites that quote to page 25 of Streib & Sametz, but the quote doesn't appear there at all. Streib & Sametz never mention a grocery. Here's a link to Streib & Sametz; you can sign in via The Wikipedia Library: https://heinonline.org/HOL/LandingPage?handle=hein.journals/conlr22&div=9&id=&page=
Reposting from above, the relevant paragraph of Streib & Sametz relating to Christian's mental state:

The last female juvenile executed was Virginia Christian. She was born on August 15, 1895, to poor black parents living in Hampton, Virginia. Christian's mother, who had a widely-known reputation for dishonesty, became paralyzed in 1909 when Christian was only thirteen years old. Christian's father was a hardworking laborer, but his wages of $1.25 per day were not enough to support his invalid wife and eight children. Therefore, the older children, including Christian, had to quit school and work to support the family. It was generally agreed that their home and family life remained squalid and miserable and that Christian adopted her mother's habits of immorality, dishon-esty, and thievery. Compounding this was Christian's "dubious mental responsibility."
"Dubious mental responsibility" in turn is sourced to the article in The Crisis.
It seems like a stretch for Baker to turn "dubious mental responsibility" into "mentally retarded", and the fact that he apparently mis-cites Streib & Sametz in a different context makes me trust his interpretation even less. I don't think we should cite Baker to affirmatively say Christian was disabled. Ghosts of Europa (talk) 20:57, 4 February 2025 (UTC)

Page number is missing from ref 19?  scope_creepTalk 06:38, 6 February 2025 (UTC)

@Scope creep: It appears to be a website: Curnutt 2016. Or am I missing something? Polygnotus (talk) 05:11, 14 February 2025 (UTC)
Morning @Polygnotus: It is ref 20. Somebody has already fixed it. Bundles ref.p=186. It must have been fixed in the interim.  scope_creepTalk 05:31, 14 February 2025 (UTC)
Life on this planet is very confusing. Thank you! Polygnotus (talk) 05:32, 14 February 2025 (UTC)