# Talk:SegaSonic the Hedgehog

This needs to be fixed up more from all the crappy editing it has had
--Blah2 12:38, 24 December 2005 (UTC)

Hello guys,
I actually played this game in an (American!) arcade. Apparently, it was test-marketed in the U.S.; I played it at Golfland in Milpitas, California, back in 1993. The instructions on the cabinet were all in Japanese, so it was obviously just the normal Japanese version. I remember being absolutely confounded by the game; it seemed almost impossible to play, and I kept losing. Obviously, most U.S. test audiences felt that way, because, as we all know, it never was actually released stateside.--TServo2049 19:40, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
If You need screenshots go to http://www.theghz.com/sonic/segasonic/segasonic.html It's got tons of description of the game as well.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Patmancav66 (talk • contribs) 19:37, 15 February 2008 (UTC) 


### Sort of Confirming
In 1993 or '94, I saw a very unusual Sonic the Hedgehog game in the arcade section of a Golfland in the San Jose area. I cannot confirm whether it was the Milpitas Golfland, or the one at 976 Blossom Hill Rd, or the one in Sunnyvale; I was 9-10 years old and had no idea that there was more than one Golfland or where any of them were. This particular Sonic game was unusual in a number of ways. The first was that it had an isometric perspective instead of a side-scrolling one; another was that it featured Sonic, a character that I thought at the time was Tails, and a red character that I had never seen before; and instead of the player only controlling one at a time, all three followed each other around like in Sonic Heroes. I didn't pay it much attention at the time, so I can't confirm anything about its difficulty or Japanese writing or anything else. A few months or a year afterward, I heard about Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles, and assumed that Knuckles was the red character I had seen in that arcade game. And so, I spent the next TWENTY-FIVE YEARS swearing up and down that knuckles had appeared in a game before Sonic 3, and that I had seen this game at Golfland arcade. Only recently, in a Facebook group dedicated to '90s nostalgia, did I find someone who told me about this alternative explanation.
Now, can I be absolutely, 100% sure that the game I saw was Segasonic the Hedgehog? No. But based on the available evidence and TServo's comment above, I'm about 99.99999% sure. Too many different things line up for it to be a coincidence.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.70.13.107 (talk) 06:49, 23 August 2020 (UTC) 

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/458636/features/retro-vault-double-dragon-segasonic-the-hedgehog-legends-of-wrestling/ - Nothing new really, but could be used to source some parts of the article. Sergecross73 msg me  16:37, 12 April 2014 (UTC)
What exactly did this article say? The archived version isn't loading for me on the Wayback Machine and archive.is redirects to GamesRadar at page 2. JOEBRO64 23:03, 12 October 2017 (UTC)
Here is the archived page, had to type in the page number into the url to get it to work. It doesn't tell us anything new: https://web.archive.org/web/20141211075407/http://www.computerandvideogames.com/458636/features/retro-vault-double-dragon-segasonic-the-hedgehog-legends-of-wrestling/?page=3 TarkusABtalk 12:36, 15 October 2017 (UTC)

The way I look at it, mentioning a game is a sufficient source. Sourcing statements in this encyclopedia all have one thing common: they mention a particular media wether it's a website, a magazine, or a newspaper. And naming something like a video game pretty says everything to those who want to know where an idea comes from. Duke17 (talk) 15:15, 19 September 2015 (UTC)

Yes, there are ways to cite games, though just removing the "citation needed" tag that's been there for years is not one of them. Sergecross73 msg me 15:50, 19 September 2015 (UTC)
If removing the tag isn't one of them, what more is needed? Duke17 (talk) 15:25, 12 October 2015 (UTC)
Adding an actual citation? You can't just "Oh its in the game" or people are going to abuse it. What if someone wrote in "And then Knuckles the Echidna ran in and slapped Sonic in the face" and put in the edit summary "Totally happened in the game, trust me." If that were acceptable, there'd be all sorts of abuse. I'd recommend finding a website/magazine that actually found it to be a noteworthy aspect of the game/character, but there's also a way to directly cite video games as well if need be. Sergecross73 msg me 16:00, 12 October 2015 (UTC)

I played Sonic 2 before, and I know how Sonic looks when he's in Super Sonic mode. Although that anon user didn't provide any links or whatever with his edit, it does seem plausible. Ray does kinda look like Super Sonic. Red White Blue and Yellow (talk) 21:55, 16 October 2015 (UTC)

Well, that's original research without a source, so we're going to need a source for that claim. Sergecross73 msg me 22:15, 16 October 2015 (UTC)

I just wanted to let everyone know that the Russian version of this article has a ton of information and sources that could be used here. JOEBRO64 22:21, 10 October 2017 (UTC)

Also, there are several magazine articles that indicate a 32X version of the game was once planned. JOEBRO64 23:35, 10 October 2017 (UTC)
Nice work. I'm usually up on my Sonic factoids, but I did not ever know a 32x version was planned. Good find. Sergecross73 msg me 12:23, 11 October 2017 (UTC)
Did you already go through and pull from their sources? Seems like there is still more stuff on there than here currently. I'd suggest sifting through everything there and carrying over here before doing the GAR. TarkusABtalk 22:54, 12 October 2017 (UTC)
I've got all the English ones here except this one, which doesn't say anything we don't know (and confuses Ray for Tails). There is a French article though, but I'm not too well-versed in foreign languages. It's apparently "brief coverage" of its appearance at CES 1993. JOEBRO64 23:00, 12 October 2017 (UTC)
Download google translate on your phone and use the camera feature. Take a picture of the French text, and it will translate it for you. This is what I got:
Not satisfied with his unsuccessful success on our dear little consoles, Sonic arrives in Arcade. It was to be expected, given the mastery of the "Arcade technology" by Sega, which regularly releases us hits that make real ravages in the games room. Regarding the game in particular, Sega adopted an isometric 3D view, reminding us of arcade hits like the notorious and ancestral "Zaxxon", or like the last small "ViewPoint" of SNK. The Sega fetish characters are obviously present, that is to say Tails and Sonic. Besides, you can play two simultaneously by controlling each one of the heroes of the Sega world that you know so well. Normally, it should not be long to disembark in France, so be ready for the shock of "Sonic Arcade".
I think the only thing worth mentioning is that the 3D view reminded them of Zaxxon and Viewpoint in the reception section. Also, i found it funny how it translated "Sega fetish characters"...lol TarkusABtalk 23:37, 12 October 2017 (UTC)
The article currently words it as "SegaSonic was favorably compared to Zaxxon and Viewpoint". Is...that what they're saying? The article's content makes it sound like they said "The game is great, much like Zaxxon" whereas the source itself sounds more like its saying "This game is like Zaxxon". Sergecross73 msg me 12:41, 13 October 2017 (UTC)
Agreed, magazine does not specify favorability. TarkusABtalk 13:35, 13 October 2017 (UTC)

The article now claims that it is one of four games in the SegaSonic series of spinoff games. Is...there any source that defines/declares such a sub-series delineation? I skimmed the sources given, and none of them seemed to actually say this. I was going to just reword it to something like "titles with SegaSonic in the name", but even that doesn't seem to be true, given the inclusion of "Waku Waku Sonic Patrol Car". Sergecross73 msg me 18:42, 12 October 2017 (UTC)

This review is transcluded from Talk:SegaSonic the Hedgehog/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.
Reviewer: MWright96 (talk · contribs) 18:30, 1 December 2017 (UTC)

Going to review this article. MWright96 (talk) 18:30, 1 December 2017 (UTC)

It is reasonably well written.
a (prose):  b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists): 
It is factually accurate and verifiable.
a (reference section):  b (citations to reliable sources):  c (OR): 

It is broad in its coverage.
a (major aspects):  b (focused): 

It follows the neutral point of view policy.
Fair representation without bias: 

It is stable.
No edit wars, etc.: 

It is illustrated by images and other media, where possible and appropriate.
a (images are tagged and non-free content have fair use rationales):  b (appropriate use with suitable captions): 

Overall:
Pass/Fail: 


### Gameplay
Mighty the Armadillo is a redirect link and needs to be directly linked to List of Sonic the Hedgehog characters#Mighty the Armadillo
I don't think this is really necessary, per WP:NOTBROKEN: "It is almost never helpful to replace [[redirect]] with [[target|redirect]]."
"A bonus is awarded if the player collects over a certain percentage of rings within a level."  It would better off to the casual reader if you explained what exactly this bonus is.
Done.
"Upon the reaching Eggman at the end of the game" - remove the first the which is denoted in bold text
Done.


### Development and release
Similar to Mighty the Armadillo, Sega System 32 is a redirect link that needs tending to
See my previous response about WP:NOTBROKEN.
"The game was featured at the Summer International Consumer Electronics Show 1993 and the Amusement Machine Show 1993, being released worldwide in arcades the same year." - I believe this sentence would be better off written as The game was featured at the Summer International Consumer Electronics Show 1993 and the Amusement Machine Show 1993. It was released worldwide in arcades the same year.
Done.
Is there anything in the sources that states the exact reason why the 32X port was not released?
No, just that it was planned. No more details have surfaced.


### Reception and legacy
"praising its "superb" graphics, "awesome" music," - this section of text coan be worded slightly better. How about reserving high praise for its graphics and music,?
Done.
"Ray never appeared in any subsequent games,[16] but he and Mighty would both be featured in the Sonic the Hedgehog comic book series published by Archie Comics." - change this so it reads as follows Ray never appeared in any subsequent games, but he and Mighty were both featured in the Sonic the Hedgehog comic book series published by Archie Comics.
Done.


### References
Add page numbers for references 2, 12 and 14
Done.
That is all from me. The article is looking in good shape overall but the review will be put on hold until all the issues raised above have been addressed. MWright96 (talk) 19:37, 1 December 2017 (UTC)

@MWright96: I think I've resolved everything. Responded above. JOEBRO64 20:02, 1 December 2017 (UTC)
Alright then. Now promoting to GA class MWright96 (talk) 07:31, 2 December 2017 (UTC)

I don't think this game was released outside Japan. The source here citing a worldwide release is KLOV which says "Class: Wide Release", but I don't think that means worldwide release. The game is completely in Japanese text and there are no english flyers I've seen. TarkusABtalk 17:26, 10 December 2017 (UTC)

The game was actually released in North America, but it was test launched and never fully localized. Sonic Jam says the NA release was in September, but I'm not sure if that's true since the release dates in the game contradict some of the ones RSes say. JOEBRO64 20:15, 10 December 2017 (UTC)
Sounds like it wasn't really localized then. It was demoed at a couple shows, a couple journalists talked about it, but there is no core evidence it came overseas. I agree Sonic Jam museum is wrong a lot. Not to mention there is no English ROM I know of. Sega would have never released the game overseas with Japanese text in it. TarkusABtalk 00:27, 11 December 2017 (UTC)
Agreed. Sounds like you can say it was planned, but it doesn't sound like it really happened. Sergecross73 msg me 00:37, 11 December 2017 (UTC)
I fixed this. I'd also like to mention that the History of Sonic the Hedgehog book by Pix 'n' Love makes this same error. If anyone can find an English flyer or unmodified English ROM, we can discuss again. TarkusABtalk 00:56, 11 December 2017 (UTC)
I highly doubt any reliable sources have covered this, but it seems like a localization was planned... JOEBRO64 01:01, 22 March 2018 (UTC)
It was absolutely, positively, definitely released in a few locations outside of Japan, including at least one of the Golfland arcades in or near San Jose, California. Unfortunately, proof will be hard to come by because 8-year-olds weren't running around with iPhones and taking video of everything back then.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.70.13.107 (talk) 06:59, 23 August 2020 (UTC)
I hear you, but Wikipedia goes by what can be verified, not just what people claim to be true. Sergecross73 msg me 14:08, 23 August 2020 (UTC)
Jumping on a very old thread here to say that I remember seeing Segasonic the Hedgehog in SegaWorld in London back in the '90s. I don't have a photo of my own but I found this one: http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/3349/1529/400/segaworld07.jpg from here: http://sega-memories.blogspot.com/2007/09/segaworld-part-2.html which shows the cabinet in SegaWorld. 86.1.173.221 (talk) 11:29, 23 May 2022 (UTC)

Is there a source for the October 1993 release date? Sega's website says June 1993. http://sonic.sega.jp/SonicChannel/history/1993.html  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2.121.179.31 (talk) 00:36, 19 March 2018 (UTC) 

https://sega-interactive.co.jp/special/history/title/sonic.html JOEBRO64 00:43, 19 March 2018 (UTC)
Interesting that two Sega websites give different release dates. Do we have any reason to go with one or the other? TarkusABtalk 01:55, 19 March 2018 (UTC)
Yeah, that's a bit odd... but I'm pretty sure the link the IP provided is using the same dates from Sonic Jam, which has a ton of inaccuracies. JOEBRO64 23:15, 19 March 2018 (UTC)

In regards to this change of mine and this response by JoeBro

I'm curious, since I can't read the source material - you objected to the addition of "graphics" before the statement about the game's "fuzziness". What exactly is he referring to in that part if he's not talking about the graphics? Honest question, I wondered if I was missing the context here. I couldn't think of anything else that he could be referring to.
Also, for the record, when I made the comment not sure a direct quote is warranted for such a short, basic comment of calling a game bad, I didn't mean to imply the commentary from the book wasn't substantial or anything. I just meant that I didn't think it made sense to use the direct quote of "[SegaSonic the Hedgehog] is not a good game" because it was a pretty basic concept that could be easily paraphrased, that's all. Sergecross73 msg me 19:22, 20 March 2018 (UTC)
The exact quote about the fuzziness is: "The controls are imprecise with a noticeable feeling of, not quite input lag, but an irritating fuzziness." He's talking about the controls.
I get a bit messy with quotes, and I was a bit tired when I put it in. That's my rationale for the "bad game" commentary.
JOEBRO64 19:32, 20 March 2018 (UTC)
I scanned the source material for Joe, it's here: here. TarkusABtalk 19:33, 20 March 2018 (UTC)
It's a short paragraph, but it's got some good commentary (I didn't like having only three opinions in the reception section). JOEBRO64 19:37, 20 March 2018 (UTC)
Yeah, its a good addition, especially for such an obscure and older game. I find the "fuzziness" comment slightly confusing, but I think the current wording handles it well enough. Sergecross73 msg me 19:41, 20 March 2018 (UTC)

In regards to the recently added bit about the possibility of a Switch port if the Sega Ages line does well - Sega ended the Switches Sega Ages line about six months later. I can't imagine it was because it was doing well. So, I'm not really sure if it's worth mentioning or not. Feels pretty unlikely. Sergecross73 msg me 21:11, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

Time Extension has been giving the game some coverage this year. Nothing huge, but this is a relatively short article, so it could be useful for expansion. 

https://www.timeextension.com/news/2024/01/rare-segasonic-arcade-game-has-been-dumped-and-preserved
https://www.timeextension.com/news/2024/06/insanely-rare-sonic-arcade-game-crops-up-on-japanese-resale-site
Of note, I can't recall if we ever had an RS confirm an English/international version. These discuss that. Sergecross73 msg me 18:11, 6 June 2024 (UTC)