# Talk:Ethel Sands

This review is transcluded from Talk:Ethel Sands/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.
Reviewer: Royroydeb (talk · contribs) 13:05, 3 March 2014 (UTC)


### Early life
1. Why did the family leave United States for England? Can you provide a brief explanation?
2. The second and third paragraph hardly contains any details about his early life, but instead says about the parents. This section should contain things about his early life like schooling etc and those can be fitted into personal life section


### Art
3. What do you mean by she guardian?
4. The article says that he studied painting in Paris in 1894. Do we know where he studied? I mean the name of the institute.
5. Why were the works evaluated differently?
6. Why the last paragraph is doubly referenced?
RRD13 (talk) 13:05, 3 March 2014 (UTC)

13.Since its a new section, you should link Tate.
14.The year of her first exhibition?
15.She was a London Group founding member- it should be "She was a founding member of the London group"
16.Mention what is "Château d'Auppegard"
RRD13 (talk) 04:08, 13 March 2014 (UTC)


### World War
7. "In 1916 attained her British citizenship"- grammatical error.
8. How were the houses destroyed?


### Personal life
9. "Socially active" and "social work"- please provide a little description about it.
RRD13 (talk) 16:43, 4 March 2014 (UTC)

Great comments and questions. I'll tackle them and reply here with updates.--CaroleHenson (talk) 18:24, 12 March 2014 (UTC)
Numbered for responses:
1 and 2. I don't remember running across the reason that the family went to England or her early life - just in the context of her parents. I added what information I could find that might provide some insight, but there was actually little to find that is relevant to cursary background of her mother and father (there's more about their social life and relationships and her father's work on the national movement for free trade in U.S. and some info about his interest in British politics. But I could not find much as all about Ethel's childhood. Done, based upon what I was able to find.
3. Guardian: She became their guardian when her parents died, reworded the sentence. Done
4. School: Added Académie Carrière and reworded the paragraph to be clearer, concise. Done
5. Works evaluated differently: Reworded to be clearer. Done
6. Double citations at the end of the paintings section: Removed an unnecessary citation for the first sentence. The next two double citations are for different works of art. They could be placed after each painting, but it makes it choppy. But, if you prefer that, I can make that change. Done for consideration
7. Citizenship: Fixed the grammatical error. Done
8. Updated information about how the houses were destroyed. Done
9. "Socially active" working on this without repeating info early in the article. Reworded. Done
Numbered responses, reworded 3 guardian / 7 citizenship items in the article. Comments for next steps for the others.--CaroleHenson (talk) 18:42, 12 March 2014 (UTC)
Updates to 4-9.--CaroleHenson (talk) 21:56, 12 March 2014 (UTC)
@Royroydeb: I have completed my updates to the items you provided. As I was digging around, I made some updates, including images, to the article. Please let me know if you have any questions or comments about the responses and changes.--CaroleHenson (talk) 19:59, 13 March 2014 (UTC)


### Socialite and patron
10.Are these pictures drawn by her? I dont think so. Just for the mention of these people in the secrtion, it is completely unecessary to put pictures of them.
11.What is "provided a place"?
12." she funded by her inheritance" - unclear
RRD13 (talk) 04:02, 13 March 2014 (UTC)

10. No, they weren't drawn or photographed by her. There are three key sections art, socialite and patron and the world wars. The Socialite and patron section is about the significant role that she played as a cultivator of literature and artistic talent... not about her art. I removed four images and kept three images for three people who were significant in her life. Optionally, maybe the Bloomsbury Group could stay and the other three go.
11. Reworded the sentence.
12. Reworded the sentence.
 Done--CaroleHenson (talk) 20:18, 13 March 2014 (UTC)
Oh, just saw these from the Art section:
13. Yep, linked Tate
14. 1904 was the year of her first exhibition - added the year and source
15. We could reword the London Group sentence that way, it's definitely better - but it would be a WP:Close paraphrasing issue. Since it's such a short sentence, that may not be an issue. Reworded sentence to be clearer, without being a paraphrase issue.--CaroleHenson (talk) 21:43, 13 March 2014 (UTC)
16. I'm not sure where you're seeing Château d'Auppegard, but it's described in the last paragraph of the paintings section: "Hudson purchased Château d'Auppegard near Diemme, France in 1920,[17] which was the subject of several of Sand's paintings."
 Done with this set. I think this is all of it now.--CaroleHenson (talk) 21:34, 13 March 2014 (UTC)

The following claim regarding Ethel Sands is, as far as I can tell, inaccurate:
"She was made Dame Ethel Sands in 1920. "
NOTE: One link (nationalarchives.gov.uk) cites a "Dame Ethel Sands" but it is not confirmed anywhere. It would have to have been gazetted to be valid. I consulted the London Gazette and there is no record of any honours bestowed on Sands, much less a damehood, although she probably deserved one. I don't have access to Wendy Baron's book but any such claim there would be a mistake. 
There was another woman named Ethel -- Ethel Pearson -- who was made a Dame Commander of the Order of the British Empire (DBE) in 1920, the same year Sands reportedly received one. In 1922, another lesbian named Ethel (composer Ethel Smyth) received a damehood. Possibly, one of these other damehoods is the genesis of the misunderstanding. Nirva20 (talk) 00:50, 11 February 2024 (UTC)