# Talk:Niggas in Paris

Can someone clean up the Live Performances section? It's borderline incomprehensible.   — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.27.250.171 (talk) 17:16, 24 March 2013 (UTC) 

Is anybody willing to clean up the Blades of Glory references?  It's mentioned no less than 4 times in the article currently.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by SilentStryk07 (talk • contribs) 18:36, 1 February 2012 (UTC) 

I've seen some articles around Google that mentioned the line "that shit Kray" doesn't mean "crazy", it's actually a reference to the Kray twins. I added a {{cn}} template. All the articles I looked up were either a forum or a unreliable source. If anyone can find a reliable secondary source, that would be great. --  Luke  (Talk) 05:33, 20 November 2011 (UTC)

It's definitely "cray". This video proves that BeŻet (talk) 11:54, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

Um, so how is this industrial and/or noise music?
AnimalCrackerr (talk) 02:59, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

The large amounts of white noise and distortion throughout the song (particularly after the dubstep-styled bass drop at the end) are characteristics of industrial hip hop. Patdog (talk) 11:16, 28 January 2012 (UTC)
Ah, makes sense! I see someone edited it for "industrial hip hop" instead of simply industiral. 72.222.222.99 (talk) 19:05, 5 February 2012 (UTC)

On all track listings; CDs, iTunes; the song's title is listed as "Ni**as in Paris". Shouldn't we mention that's the "official" title? Kjinho (talk) 03:08, 16 February 2012 (UTC)

WP:CENSORED. iTunes and other online/retail outlets typically do not accept profanity in titles, no matter if they are clean or explicit on the actual song. Internally, copyright agencies still claim the song as "NIGGAS IN PARIS" in their DMCA notices. Ellomate (talk) 22:59, 30 June 2013 (UTC)

Me and Status have run into a snag while improving the article. We are at odds whether the alternate cover for Niggas In Paris should stay or go, and we need your help in deciding. To establish a precedent, artist Kanye West has make alternate covers in the past multiple times, including projects such as My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy where he used a ballerina as an alternate artwork for his original cover art, which depicted him and a phoenix having sex. Another example is on Cold, where he has twice changed the cover art for undisclosed reasons. The first edit censored the logo of Theraflu on the bottle (making it the "milk bottle" some claim of it to be), and the second edit is of a George Condo painting. I conceded with Status that the first edit takes prominence in its appearance on the article, due to my being a gentlemen and the second edit not being used often outside of West's declaration of an "official" artwork, but this instance is different. The Pandora cover of Niggas In Paris is exactly that; an alternate cover art because of censorship. I presume that the embroidered words "NIGGAS IN PARIS" on the French flag were too much for Pandora to handle, so they used the alternate cover. Nonetheless, I believe it is notable as it shows a cover art that is indeed used by a well-known music site, for the same reason as My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy, and at the same behest of a music publisher. What do you think? Is its inclusion as an alternate cover art reasonable or is it too much? Ellomate (talk) 23:18, 30 June 2013 (UTC)

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No articles that I have found, include the Baltimore stop on 11/1. They played it 12 times total that night. 2604:2D80:920F:1D00:9E3:786E:B2C1:F0F2 (talk) 23:04, 25 September 2022 (UTC)

The redirect African-Americans in Paris has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 May 10 § African-Americans in Paris until a consensus is reached.  Pichpich (talk) 21:04, 10 May 2023 (UTC)

"The last record (established in Paris as well) has been broke again on June 18, 2012" -- the part in bold should be "was broken". 86.33.68.251 (talk) 21:04, 16 May 2024 (UTC)

I see this has been renominated for GA without fixing the issues I raised above. At time of writing, any subsequent nomination would quickfail per WP:QF#0e, as it still contains issues that have not been adequately addressed. I will leave it for another reviewer to adjudicate on whether the nomination should be quickfailed or just removed.--Launchballer 07:44, 23 July 2025 (UTC)

Launchballer I appreciate you commenting about this as you would have not seen what I put recently, however I had posted on the other reviewer's talk page that I was considering seeking a second opinion on the last issues due to it being unclear and as a result have now re nominated the article. In this context, why would it not be acceptable? --K. Peake 20:00, 23 July 2025 (UTC)
I did see that. I have popups enabled, so scanning contributions is trivial for me. I also asked for a second opinion, at Wikipedia talk:Good article nominations#Talk:Niggas in Paris/GA1, and got it. Not sure why the quickfail anchors don't work, but criteria 5 says "It has issues noted in a previous GA review that still have not been adequately addressed, as determined by a reviewer who has not previously reviewed the article". Also, it isn't really accurate to say these were 'the last issues', as I didn't check the lead or images or perform any spotchecks and may very well have found further issues. I'm going to head into the article myself at some point, though it won't be immediately.--Launchballer 22:15, 23 July 2025 (UTC)
Launchballer Regarding the points still remaining though, why are you against including these stats and rankings reported by sources? Why does reliable sources writing them out not make them notable? --K. Peake 12:24, 25 July 2025 (UTC)
Launchballer Any clarity on this question please? --K. Peake 18:56, 28 July 2025 (UTC)
Most of In early December 2011, the track reached number eight on the US Billboard Hot 100, with 113,000 digital units. It became the first top-10 single from Watch the Throne and Jay-Z's 18th top-10 on the Hot 100.[86] "Niggas in Paris" rose two places for the chart dated December 18, 2011, then peaked at number five on the Hot 100 Christmas issue and had sold 2,000,000 copies by this point. comes under WP:CHARTTRAJ; you really only need "Niggas in Paris" peaked at No. 5 on the Billboard Hot 100, becoming the first top 10 single from Watch the Throne and Jay-Z's 18th top-10 on the Hot 100. That section needs a pruning per that and WP:CHARTMATH; I'd also like to see some independent sourcing for the charts as well.--Launchballer 19:56, 28 July 2025 (UTC)
Launchballer I understand about cropping the chart positions down, however as for the 18th top 10 of Jay-Z and 10th of West is that not notable? Also, I mean stats like the Nielsen SoundScan's 200 best-selling songs one are these not notable? --K. Peake 15:58, 29 July 2025 (UTC)
Apologies for omitting that part of the tq quote. I'm fine with the 18th of Jay-Z and 10th of West; Nielsen SoundScan is a dynamic list, so I recommend attributing.--Launchballer 17:29, 29 July 2025 (UTC)
Launchballer I have edited the commercial section with cropping and attribution now, how is it looking? --K. Peake 11:33, 30 July 2025 (UTC)
Launchballer Your thoughts please? --K. Peake 20:39, 6 August 2025 (UTC)
I trimmed that paragraph myself. What you now need to do is find independent sources for the other two paragraphs. You may find that what's left needs merging into another section per MOS:OVERSECTION.--Launchballer 17:38, 7 August 2025 (UTC)
Launchballer So do you mean that any chart positions not sourced to independent sources, even number 19 in Denmark, should be removed? --K. Peake 09:23, 18 August 2025 (UTC)
Yes, that's exactly what I mean. The information is already in tables, so the article will still have the information.--Launchballer 11:46, 18 August 2025 (UTC)
Launchballer I have now removed the last para, are you happy to re-review? --K. Peake 20:02, 20 August 2025 (UTC)
Wasn't planning on doing /GA2 for multiple reasons.--Launchballer 23:53, 20 August 2025 (UTC)
That is your choice, ill see if someone else picks this up. K. Peake 08:34, 21 August 2025 (UTC)

This review is transcluded from Talk:Niggas in Paris/GA2. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.
Nominator: Kyle Peake (talk · contribs) 20:33, 22 July 2025 (UTC)
Reviewer: TonyTheTiger (talk · contribs) 04:09, 28 August 2025 (UTC)

I am reviewing this as part of the WP:GARP related to Talk:America Windows/GA1.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:09, 28 August 2025 (UTC)
TonyTheTiger Initial responses given below. --K. Peake 16:21, 29 August 2025 (UTC)
TonyTheTiger I have left comments on Launchballer's talk page regarding removal of commercial info, what do you think? --K. Peake 20:42, 5 September 2025 (UTC)
I left a message, that I too am puzzled by the content removal.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 21:45, 5 September 2025 (UTC)
The content I removed was chart listings sourced entirely to the vendors itself. I don't regard the content as WP:DUE for prose, especially given that it's already presented in tables. See also WP:INDISCRIMINATE.--Launchballer 22:49, 5 September 2025 (UTC)
User:Launchballer, Does "sourced entirely to the vendors" mean we can't include prose on a Billboard ranking if the only source is Billboard?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 23:23, 5 September 2025 (UTC)
I don't think the ranking itself should be mentioned in prose if that's all we have to say about it, so in my opinion "In 2015, Billboard listed it as the fifth best song of the 2010s" shouldn't be there. I did mention that at GA1 and didn't spot that it hadn't been done. I'm fine with things like "The song was named as the 12th best track of 2011 by Pitchfork, whose author...", since it would be silly to start it with "For Pitchfork's end-of-year listicle," but isolated outposts such as Billboard are better presented in tables. It might be easier if I trimmed it myself.--Launchballer 11:59, 6 September 2025 (UTC)
I view Billboard as such a reliable source for music articles that it is unfathomable that it should not be used to support its own charts. I view this as falling under WP:ABOUTSELF as sourced info about simple facts that are not exceptional. Billboard content on its own charts is merely simple fact. Further, I don't neessarily agree with DUE or INDISCRIMINATE. People actually rely on WP to find chart info.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 12:12, 6 September 2025 (UTC)
@Launchballer:-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 13:03, 6 September 2025 (UTC)
I have no problem whatsoever with Billboard's reliability (though most of the content I removed was actually mostly UK-based anyway) nor any objection to the chart info being in tables (which is where people are more likely to look anyway). My objection is to them being in prose when they are not independently sourced. That said, I'm not inclined to argue with two of you, so if you both think it should be there, I withdraw my objection.--Launchballer 09:31, 7 September 2025 (UTC)
User:Launchballer, Even the non-Billboard stuff seems to have been chart publications as sources for chart information, which I think we accept as WP:ABOUTSELF. Should that have been removed? If the only source was the artist themselves, their publicists, their agents, or their own label, then we should remove it, but I think chart publications, do count as sources for their own charts.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 12:18, 7 September 2025 (UTC)
Already withdrew my objection, though it didn't relate to reliability (and thus ABOUTSELF wouldn't have applied). What else needs to happen here?--Launchballer 22:39, 8 September 2025 (UTC)-
User:Launchballer, To be clear, I was inquiring about the paragraph of content that you previously removed. I think that was based on chart list content sourced to chart publishers. Should that have been removed?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:50, 9 September 2025 (UTC)
In my opinion, yes. Chart publications are not independent and as such their content should only be in tables. I won't be putting this back, though will not object to either of you two doing so.--Launchballer 14:03, 9 September 2025 (UTC)
Honestly, I don't know what is right, so I have put out feelers at Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Songs#Chart_listing_ICs and Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Music#Opinions_welcome_at_Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Songs#Chart_listing_ICs.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 23:50, 9 September 2025 (UTC)
Given my elevated understanding of the subject, User:Launchballer' August 20, 2025 edit is making a lot more sense to me. I am now satisfied with the coverage of this article. Thx to User:Chubbles and User:Sergecross73 for their clarifications at WT:SONGS.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:08, 11 September 2025 (UTC)

If Pusha T is notable enough to mention in WP:LEAD he should be linked.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 15:10, 28 August 2025 (UTC)
What does providing the largest number of performances at a concert in Paris mean?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 15:10, 28 August 2025 (UTC)
 Done --K. Peake 16:21, 29 August 2025 (UTC)
Can we flesh out "the first nigga in Paris" with his rock star appearance. Michael Jackson first charted a single in France in 1972. "Billie Jean" and "Thriller" both charted #1 in France in 1983. Prince charted his first single in France in 1979. "Purlple Rain" charted #1 in France in 1984 and he had 2 other top 10s in the 1980s. Kravitz charted his first single in France in 1991 and his first album in 1998. I doubt MJ was even the first N there.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 15:10, 28 August 2025 (UTC)
I know Ye can just say cray stuff. So I am not asking you to remove the content. Just summarize it in a more meaningful way.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 15:12, 28 August 2025 (UTC)
 Comment: I have edited this to reflect the broader meaning of Kanye's comments, is this ok to be kept as is now? --K. Peake 16:21, 29 August 2025 (UTC)
I guess our task is to summarize RSs and not to assess truth. It seems unlikely to me that Kravitz hung out with models on a more significant scale than Prince did, but I do concede the only time that I know that I have ever been within shouting distance of Kravitz, at least one Victoria Secret model was also within shouting distance. This was 30+ years ago at a cafe in Manhattan. I've never been anywhere near Prince (or MJ for that matter), but would imagine if I was, models would not be too far away. I guess we are just trying to make sense of Ye's statements. I guess you also have to define what a model is in this context and whether they are different than other women of above average first impression ability.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 21:29, 29 August 2025 (UTC)
These last two issues are surprising elements of a second nomination. I am now looking back at the Talk:Niggas in Paris/GA1 review by User:Launchballer to figure out where this article is coming from.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 15:19, 28 August 2025 (UTC)
My review didn't actually get to the lead as I have a policy of leaving it until last. Not much point trying to understand a summary until I've understood what it's supposed to summarise in my opinion. The Kravitz comment is a fairer cop; I'd personally add ', and by the success of Lenny Kravitz' to the end of the sentence beginning 'West revealed'. Also, discussion of that GA continued on the talk page.--Launchballer 15:44, 28 August 2025 (UTC)
I've reworded this now to echo that it is moreso West's views if this is ok? --K. Peake 18:57, 1 September 2025 (UTC)
The artwork displays the performers' names and the song's title in white letters against the colours of the French flag seems to only describe 2/3rds of the cover art.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 16:20, 28 August 2025 (UTC)
 Comment: This is all of the information available from the sources and the motif shared with "Otis" is the flag colours, I am not sure what the final 1/3 is are you referring to the shape of this cover art? --K. Peake 16:21, 29 August 2025 (UTC)
Doesn't the final third of the artwork include the album name.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 21:36, 29 August 2025 (UTC)
Yes it does, however I looked and no sources mention this - is it ok to add in prose per the image being included in the references? --K. Peake 18:57, 1 September 2025 (UTC)
I guess I would link to a source stating what the name of the album is. That name is the exact same as the words in the artwork, which is sort of a source.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 20:32, 1 September 2025 (UTC)
I'm sorry this is unclear - do you mean a source saying this song is from Watch the Throne? K. Peake 14:14, 5 September 2025 (UTC)
I think that would work.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 17:23, 5 September 2025 (UTC)
What about this?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 21:45, 5 September 2025 (UTC)
The article mentions West's hah ad-lib. Source mentions italicizes "Hah?!" with punctuation at least 7 times in a three paragraph stretch. The punctuation is key to understanding the dynamics of the delivery.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 17:21, 28 August 2025 (UTC)
 Done --K. Peake 16:21, 29 August 2025 (UTC)
On the final night of the Cowboy Carter Tour at Stade de France, I was in attendance when Jay-Z performed this as a special guest. Should performances like that be listed here?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 17:37, 28 August 2025 (UTC)
 Comment: I would say yes, are you saying you are for or against before I add this one if sourceable? --K. Peake 16:21, 29 August 2025 (UTC)
It is quite a legacy for a song to be the one (Maybe he did 2 or 3, but I remember this one and have it on my phone) that a megastar performs if he does a pop-in surprise guest appearance.  Maybe he only does this in Paris. But still. When I think of Jay-Z, this is one of the two or 3 most important songs for his fans to hear (along with "Izzo (H.O.V.A.)" and "Dirt off Your Shoulder", IMO).-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 21:41, 29 August 2025 (UTC)
The internet seems to suggest that on this tour he often guested with "Crazy in Love" and this song. He seems to have done it in Vegas and some other stops. We are here to summarize the PD.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 21:37, 31 August 2025 (UTC)
 Working --K. Peake 18:57, 1 September 2025 (UTC)
TonyTheTiger I have now added this in, thoughts? --K. Peake 14:33, 5 September 2025 (UTC)
There is more to the story. Not just Paris per this. I would make it clear he did it the tours last night in Paris and the tours final show, unless you can find more nights. At first, I thought I found a source for more than two shows, but I may be mistaken.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 17:25, 5 September 2025 (UTC)
 Done --K. Peake 20:42, 5 September 2025 (UTC)

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