# Talk:Cancer (song)

I've kept "Piano ballad" in the genre of the infobox because it is referred to as such as the sole description for the song in multiple, reputable sources:

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-lists/best-concept-albums-1234604040/
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/12/18/arts/music/my-chemical-romance-black-parade.html
https://www.loudersound.com/features/the-20-greatest-my-chemical-romance-songs-ever
Not the Life It Seems: The True Lives of My Chemical Romance (pg. 170)
It is true that some other Wikipedia pages do not choose to put "ballad" or "piano ballad" inside of the infobox. However, a piano ballad is irrefutably a music genre given that it "identifies some pieces of music as belonging to a shared tradition or set of conventions" --- in this case, there are clearly a set of conventions intrinsic to piano ballad which justified why so many sources would refer to it as such with no other explanation. As such, I fail to see why we cannot overcome the precedent in usage in order to make the article better. Leafy46 (talk) 21:04, 6 December 2024 (UTC)

@MagicatthemovieS: Pinging so that you're aware of this. Leafy46 (talk) 21:08, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
@Leafy46: Look at my talk page. It's two against one. No "piano ballad."MagicatthemovieS (talk) 21:10, 6 December 2024 (UTC)MagicatthemovieS
@MagicatthemovieS: "Two against one" how? I've given my reasons, and you are the only person who has replied to that thread on your talk page. And in any case, Wikipedia is not a democracy; simply saying it's two-against-one is not a valid argument to make here, and consensus has most certainly not been met yet. Leafy46 (talk) 21:15, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
@Tbhotch: Pinging you to this thread as well, given that you've also removed Piano Ballad from the list of genres. While I see the argument for calling a piano ballad a style, I don't see why that also invalidates it from being a genre; the Wikipedia page on music genres even mentions that the two are used interchangeably in practice, and multiple sources refer to the song solely as being a "piano ballad". Leafy46 (talk) 05:44, 10 January 2025 (UTC)
Well, if multiple people are telling you the same, it is because it is likely that it was discussed before. Rap is also a musical style and multiple sources will note it when discussing a song featuring rap verses. But that doesn't make it a genre by default. The template parameter is for genres, not styles, anyway. (CC) Tbhotch™ 05:56, 10 January 2025 (UTC)
@Tbhotch: I suppose? That's not the case with this song however, as sources do not simply "note" that it is a piano ballad, they explicitly call it one with no other labels attached. I think I may start an RfC on this though, just to clear it up once and for all; I'm obviously assuming good faith in your decision to remove the genre, but I also think it's worth reaching a wider consensus on the matter. Leafy46 (talk) 06:41, 10 January 2025 (UTC)
Sources explicitly calling it a piano ballad won't make its genre a piano ballad, because neither piano nor ballad are genres, that's just the description of its performing style. On the opposite, in the sentence "emo piano ballad" there's a genre, emo, an emo song sung with sentiment accompanied by a piano as the main instrument. This is more notorious when you replace the word ballad with "song": "Cancer is an emo piano song". In the case of rock bands like MCR, when critics say "ballad", it simple means that the song is (generally) not a rock song and it's just a soft / tranquil song. (CC) Tbhotch™ 07:02, 10 January 2025 (UTC)
@Tbhotch: I see your argument, and this is not a hill I'm willing to die on, however I still think there is an argument that "piano ballad" as a whole phrase does contain an implied "set of conventions" which a reader is expected to understand, which therefore qualifies it as a genre. I'll post a topic on the Music WikiProject, just to set the consensus in stone if there is one to be reached. Leafy46 (talk) 07:10, 10 January 2025 (UTC)
Here it is: Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Music#"Piano Ballad" as a genre?. I believe that I have presented both sides of the argument fairly, so it's a matter of seeing where the consensus on the matter lands. Leafy46 (talk) 07:25, 10 January 2025 (UTC)