# Talk:Magnum P.I. (2018 TV series)

You are invited to join the discussion at Talk:Magnum, P.I. § Requested move 10 December 2020.  TheDoctorWho (talk) 20:27, 10 December 2020 (UTC)

See this Help Desk question. I just now saw it. Apparently, the person wants to be able to do what is possible on the pages for MacGyver (2016 TV series) and Hawaii Five-0 (2010 TV series). I see that the episode lists for those series are separate articles.
— Vchimpanzee •  talk • contributions •  00:00, 19 January 2021 (UTC)

@Vchimpanzee: From reading the message at the help desk it sounds like the person is requesting an article be created at Magnum P.I. (2018 TV series, season 3) (currently a redirect). I'm currently working on one here but it's not quite ready for the main space yet. I'm hoping to get the article finished soon. If I misunderstood and they were requesting a split to List of Magnum P.I. (2018 TV series) episodes I checked at the beginning of this season and it did not yet meet the size requirements for MOS:TVSPLIT so it likely still wouldn't only four episodes later. TheDoctorWho (talk) 00:55, 19 January 2021 (UTC)
I think the difference between the Magnum article and the other two is that all episodes are listed separately from the main article. Are we ready for that?— Vchimpanzee •  talk • contributions •  17:01, 19 January 2021 (UTC)
Actually, the request could only be for the separate list of all episodes, because I am more than two months behind in the archives, and those four episodes would not have aired yet.— Vchimpanzee •  talk • contributions •  17:11, 19 January 2021 (UTC)
@Vchimpanzee: MOS:TVSPLIT says that an television series should not be split into a List of Episodes (LoE) page (List of Magnum P.I. (2018 TV series) episodes in this case or what would be the equivalent of List of Hawaii Five-0 (2010 TV series) episodes and List of MacGyver (2016 TV series) episodes) until the parent article reaches 50-60kb of readable prose. Checking it now as of Season 3 episode 5 the readable prose comes out to 6529b (the equivalent of 6.52 kb). Since those five episodes aren't included in the size adding the assumed 1kb of readable prose per episode (as suggested by Wikipedia:Article splitting (television)) it would still only come out to 11.52kb which doesn't yet justify division per WP:SPLIT. Assuming that the third season gets split out soon it would lower the prose size back to 6-7kb. TheDoctorWho (talk) 01:30, 20 January 2021 (UTC)
Although I accounted for the difference in the episode table I did forget to estimate that the cast section was not included in that number (as it's a bulleted list) and none of the viewing figures are included either as they're in tables. With those two things it would probably justify a split towards the end of the season (would have been the beginning if the first two seasons weren't already split). TheDoctorWho (talk) 01:35, 20 January 2021 (UTC)
There must be a way to solve the person's problem. Anyway, I put a message on the IP's talk page.— Vchimpanzee •  talk • contributions •  17:04, 20 January 2021 (UTC)
@Vchimpanzee: I mean essentially there's not a way to do anything immediately because what the person is asking for goes against the long-established Manual of Style. I believe it would be worth splitting if and only if the series is renewed for a fourth season because the season pages. The third season will conclude at 56 episodes which is at the suggested 50-60 split but I don't think it'd be worth it since they've already been split to seasons. As soon as it's renewed for a fourth I'd support a split because it would put it well over the 60 suggested. If someone disagrees with me I'd be open to discuss but I just haven't seen a valid reason to ignore MOS at this point. TheDoctorWho (talk) 23:48, 20 January 2021 (UTC)
I was referring to the printing out of each season. There may be a way for the person to do that.— Vchimpanzee •  talk • contributions •  23:31, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

Just a quick inquiry, MOS:TVSPLIT usually recommends about 50-60 episodes before splitting to an episode list but I imagine that this is generally valid for an article where season articles do not already exist. Since season articles do already exist there are no plot summaries on this article which significantly reduces its prose size. A quick check of the current readable prose comes out to 10kb, which is still well short of the 50-60kb needed to split the article. Given this it seems like a split isn't yet justified, and likely won't be even once the fourth season has completed airing. If anyone has any other opinions on this or believes that is justified at this time I'm open to discuss. Thanks, TheDoctorWho (talk) 02:27, 18 October 2021 (UTC)

This review is transcluded from Talk:Magnum P.I. (2018 TV series)/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.
Reviewer: Firefangledfeathers (talk · contribs) 02:15, 1 June 2022 (UTC)

Hi TheDoctorWho. Thank you for working on this interesting article. I'll have part 1 of my review out to you soon. Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 02:15, 1 June 2022 (UTC)

Looking forward to it, thanks for picking up the review! TheDoctorWho (talk) 02:30, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
Just a quick update, I'll address everything here by the end of the weekend. Started my summer semester on Wednesday (9 credits in 4 weeks), so I'm a tad busy, but I should have to get back to this before Monday. Thanks, TheDoctorWho (talk) 03:05, 3 June 2022 (UTC)
That's a very helpful update! I should have the last bits of the review up before then. Hope the semester's starting off well. Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 03:18, 3 June 2022 (UTC)
@TheDoctorWho: do you think you'll be able to address the remaining review items in the next 48 hours or so? Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 15:20, 9 June 2022 (UTC)
Apologies its taken me so long. Keep getting slammed with new stuff to do. I should have a chance to get to it Friday afternoon or late in the evening. I'll let you know if anything changes. Thanks for your patience, TheDoctorWho (talk) 07:08, 10 June 2022 (UTC)
@Firefangledfeathers: Alright I think most everything has been addressed other than your lead and [the first bullet point in the] cast section comments which I'll have taken care of in the next 24 hours. To answer your few questions:
I expanded the plot section quite a bit (just under 300 words at its current standing) from its previous version. I felt giving a 100 word summary of each season would limit the point of it being an overview of the whole series, so taking the 400 word count limit (4 seasons @ 100 each) my goal was to just buff it up but not have anything too in-depth.
Although not being considered recurring in any individual season, when all his appearances are added together he was considered recurring throughout the series as a whole. (If you had a 5-season show with 10-episodes a season there would a total of 50 episodes, if an actor appeared in three episodes of each season that would be 15 episodes, not always enough to be considered recurring in any particular season, but definitely enough for the series as a whole.)
In the development section, Lenkov did not continue. Based on the previously signed contract he would have continued through the third season, but the toxic work environment allegations caused CBS to terminate that contract. If that's not clear from the current wording I can try to reword it.
Let me know if you have anymore questions, I'll give you another update tomorrow night after I address the rest. Thanks, TheDoctorWho (talk) 08:17, 11 June 2022 (UTC)
I couldn't find much real world information on the cast other than casting information which already exists later in the article. I did significantly reduce the list though to brief descriptions so that it's not strictly a duplication of information. I will bring up the fact though that despite MOS:TV calling for it, other good articles (30 Rock, Fringe (TV series)) mainly list a description of the characters and nothing more. Those that do follow this guideline (Smallville, Glee (TV series)) lack an actual casting section because the cast and characters ends up essentially taking its place. I went through today and fixed most things in your "other comments" section. Also realized I did forget to actually answer about my changes in the casting section. The section itself was already mostly chronological, but some of the paragraph breaks were placed in awkward spots, I cleaned that up last night (the first two paragraphs correspond to the first season, second two third, and last one third), which would explain the pieces about Thornton's casting being split, and the placement of Selleck's information. Thanks, TheDoctorWho (talk) 06:37, 12 June 2022 (UTC)
@Firefangledfeathers: Just pinging the above response(s). TheDoctorWho (talk) 16:02, 13 June 2022 (UTC)
Thanks. I have to confirm the fixes and give the article a final read through. Sometime in the next 12 hours I'll have either a few final comments or good news about a pass. In the future, it really helps if the nominator interpolates "done" responses into the review. I'll be sure to add that to the start of my future reviews. Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 16:07, 13 June 2022 (UTC)
 Final thoughts:
Premise: "Five-0 Task Force" – this is now the first mention of the sister show, needing an explanation and wikilink. This might mean tweaks in §Development
Premise: "They also form relationships with people they meet through investigations that assist them in later cases" is too generic to give any real information. The summary is fine if you cut this.
Premise: one unaddressed item from below re:Masters never appearing
Development: please italicize the original series' name
Casting: Not clear that paragraph 3 is about Season 2, as it begins with "Thornton continued to recur throughout the second and third seasons." This make the following "the season" confusing.
Casting: unlink the orginal series in the line about Manetti
Casting: why not split the last paragraph so Season 3 and Season 4 are separate?
TheDoctorWho, please ping me once you've addressed these or have questions/disagreements. Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 19:57, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

@Firefangledfeathers: I've fixed everything except the first one. I wasn't sure if including the link there would violate WP:EASTEREGG, people clicking that link may be expecting an article about the fictional organization (similar to the Phoenix Foundation) and not the series? If you don't think it's a problem I have no trouble including it, but just wanted to check first. Thanks, TheDoctorWho (talk) 16:12, 14 June 2022 (UTC)
@TheDoctorWho: I'd prefer to step out of universe briefly to explain. Something like: The show shares a fictional universe with Hawaii Five-O. The six main characters of Magnum P.I. share many allies with the Five-0 Task Force, including further law enforcement professionals, confidential informants, and city employees. In rereading, I also think we should drop the "who they also receive assistance from", which provides little info beyond that implied by "allies". Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 16:25, 14 June 2022 (UTC)
@TheDoctorWho: you can fix this at your leisure, as it's not something that should hold up the GA process. I am going to pass the nomination. Congrats on another Good Article! Pleasure working with you. Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 02:44, 15 June 2022 (UTC)
@Firefangledfeathers: Just fixed it now, thank you for pushing it through! Don't hesitate to ask if I can ever help you on anything in the future.  TheDoctorWho (talk) 04:04, 15 June 2022 (UTC)


### GA-criteria-related comments
Lead
Infobox image caption doesn't need "current"
Paragraph 2 is too overly-detailed a timeline for the lead. I'd cut the series order and renewal announcement dates. For the rest, it's up to you; you could go as far as trimming most of the paragraph entirely.
I'm not reading the Deadline source as verifying "despite ratings that would have justified a renewal". I think there are similar messages that could hew closer to the source.
Premise
"Also living on": switching the order of the two characters would bring Higgins closer to the parenthetical about her, improving flow.
Open question: should this be a Plot section with more extensive summary of all four seasons' story? MOS:TVPLOT recommends about 100 words per season for the main article. I'm not requiring compliance with MOS:TV, but I'm wondering whether the article hits this "main aspect" of the subject.
Not sure this is the place, but should it be mentioned somewhere that Masters never appears (I think)?
Cast
This cast list is focused on in-universe description, much of which is repeated from §Premise. Is there relevant real-world info about these characters/actors and their reception we could include?
If Bernsen guests seasons 1-3, when are they recurring
Should the reader assume that Thornton has recurring roles in every season? It might be worth it to say (seasons 1–4)
Same idea, but for Chun in §Crossover characters
That's it for pt. 1. Feel free to ping me if I drop off your radar for more than 48 hours or so. Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 03:43, 1 June 2022 (UTC)

Development
First sentence, how about "In October 2017, CBS announced development of a reboot ..."? It's not 100% clear from the source that October 20 was the first date of the announcement, and active voice helps for brevity and clarity here. Alternatively: "Deadline reported on October 20, 2017, that CBS announced development of a reboot ..."
Can we just drop source 90, futoncritic? It's just summarizing Deadline, source 91.
First sentence: comma after Lenkov
Second sentence is unclear. How about "The network ordered a pilot production commitment for the series with Lenkov and Eric Guggenheim, a Hawaii Five-0 writer and co-showrunner, as developers"?
Comma after "thirteen episodes"
"On July 7, 2020 ..." sentence is too long and is focused on the revelation instead of the termination. Just "July 2020" would be fine if the date is the sticking point.
"originally expected to continue work". Did he not?
"joining other co-showrunner Guggenheim who also co-developed and executive-produces for the series" I would cut, or trim to just "with Guggenheim"
"On October 27, 2020 ..." same passive voice/focus issue as above
Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 19:25, 1 June 2022 (UTC)

Filming
Paragraph 2, about the cars, needs a rework. Some clunky prose that will likely produce confusion, and many opinions are unverified. Inline citations are required for parts of this ("become a cultural icon", "inextricably linked to the series") and would be helpful for the rest.
Any info on filming season four?
Casting
Shouldn't this section come before §Filming?
Anything worth saying about the decision to gender-swap the Higgins role?
Some re-organization would help. Either strict chronology, or more thematic connection: both bits about Thornton might as well stay together. Both segments on athletes could be comined. Selleck's non-role is relevant enough to stand on its own and not follow the athletes. If it helps, I think it's okay if readers are left not knowing which season someone is a guest in. If they're really looking for a cameo, they could probably find it in a subarticle (or Google).
"the season" pops up a few times, confusingly
Season 4? We should probably know more now about Thuy's and Martinez's roles, and perhaps there are other relevant guest or recurring roles.
Reception
Rotten Tomatoes: should clarify this is a season 1 score/consensus (looks like there are none for later seasons)
Ditto for Metacritic
Cancellation
Needs more content. Right now it has less than the lead.
That's it! Copyvio check came out good (some false positives in the tool, spot checks all good). Sources are reliable. I want to spend some time with the tables but I don't expect anything to come of it. Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 02:41, 4 June 2022 (UTC)


### Other comments (optional for GA)
review for MOS:LQ fixes (saw at least "mixed or average reviews.")
review for MOS:REFSPACE fixes
review for MOS:CAPFRAG fixes
why cite only Stephen Hill in the first paragraph?
I'm not a fan of full sentence parentheticals. Could "Juliet Higgins replaces ..." be shortened or freed from the brackets?
I think there's a way to shorten Katsumoto's entry in the cast list to keep it in line with the approximate length of the others
That's it for pt. 1. Feel free to ping me if I drop off your radar for more than 48 hours or so. Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 03:43, 1 June 2022 (UTC)

Hawaii should probably be linked at the first use (in the body) of "Hawaiian" and delinked after
"Masters" not "Mr. Masters"
In §Filming, I'd cut
much of the exact dates of the season 3 COVID delays and go with "Delayed by the COVID-19 pandemic, filming for the third season began on ..."
and "wearing of" as just "masks" is fine
At a glance the references look good. The CNET piece about the cars could use more ref details.
Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 02:41, 4 June 2022 (UTC)

Old man 2600:1700:D8CB:8000:C141:223E:2F91:11E0 (talk) 02:10, 27 March 2023 (UTC)