# Talk:At Seventeen

There was once an NPR story about how "Janis Ian" is a pick-up basketball slang term for those who aren't wanted by either side, but I can't find much on-line evidence for this except for a somewhat parodic reference here: [1]... AnonMoos (talk) 16:54, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

It would not be appropriate for this article as it is specifically about the song. Aoba47 (talk) 22:31, 9 December 2018 (UTC)

Ms. Ian has also done a variation for the Science Fiction and Fantasy Writers of America titled Welcome Home, which appeared at the 2009 Nebula Award ceremony, to the considerable appreciation of the audience.  Whether or not this should be mentioned on the Wikipedia page I'm not sure, but the song is available on her website (http://www.janisian.com/mp3_downloads.html) and Wikipedian fans of At Seventeen can make up thier own minds once they know it exists.  Wyvern (talk) 14:02, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

The link is no longer working for me. If you could find another link (preferably one from a third-party, reliable source), then I can add it into the article. Aoba47 (talk) 02:25, 11 December 2018 (UTC)

It is stated that the song was inducted in Grammy Hall of Fame i 2008; however, it is not found on the lists of the inductees mentioned in that article, nor is the external link of any help (dead). Moreover, at the beginning of the Janis Ian article you can read that she received a Grammy for the song in 1975 - this should probably be 1976, and this information could be included. 
But what is the truth about the Hall of Fame and "At Seventeen"? --Amjaabc (talk) 12:06, 6 April 2011 (UTC)

Added reference for this. Aoba47 (talk) 22:32, 9 December 2018 (UTC)

Ian wrote this song in 1973. There are strong melodic similarities to the songs "Can't Smile Without You', written in 1975,  and "Last Christmas" 1984.  George Michael was sued by the publishers of 'Can't Smile' for plagiarism, which was settled out of court.   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Can%27t_Smile_Without_You  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 101.164.193.33 (talk) 19:45, 16 September 2014 (UTC) 

You would need a reliable source to support that. Aoba47 (talk) 22:33, 9 December 2018 (UTC)

August 1975 can't possibly be the release date, for numerous reasons, not the least of which is that the single debuted on the Hot 100 on 14 June 1975.107.185.145.26 (talk) 17:54, 22 September 2016 (UTC)

Unfortunately, I can only find a source for the August 1975 release date and it is quite vague. That's the problem with sourcing release dates for older songs. I will try to look for more information on this in the future, though I cannot promise anything. Aoba47 (talk) 02:26, 11 December 2018 (UTC)
Remember that the album was released first so the song could have charted prior to an official single release. According to sources, radio stations played it prior to the official release so that is probably the reason. Aoba47 (talk) 02:34, 12 December 2018 (UTC)

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What, no mention of Ian's filk song to the same melody, "Welcome Home (The Nebulas Song)"? How could this have possibly passed WP:GACR 3a without any coverage of this crucial aspect of the topic? —David Eppstein (talk) 05:49, 28 April 2019 (UTC)

@David Eppstein: Please provide a source that supports this information. I could not find any sources that mention this connection when doing research on the article. The closest thing that I could find to support this is the lyrics from her official website which reference "At Seventeen". I am uncertain if it would be enough to support a connection as the website itself does not say it has the same melody and I believe that using this particular source would most likely fall under Wikipedia:No original research. Again, a source would be need for this "crucial aspect of this topic". Aoba47 (talk) 18:01, 28 April 2019 (UTC)
The "crucial" part was hyperbole, in case you didn't notice. But in any case: File770 (a reliable source for fandom-related activities) tells us that she wrote that version of the song for the Nebula Awards banquet, but doesn't mention that it is a version of "At Seventeen" (maybe because it's obvious from the quoted lyrics): [2]. The official Nebula Awards site says that she wrote and performed a science-fictional version of "At Seventeen", obviously the same song even though they don't give the altered title or lyrics: [3]. Ian's own site breaks down the references in the lyrics: [4]. And the official blog of Locus Magazine (see WP:NEWSBLOG) provides more detail: [5]. —David Eppstein (talk) 18:37, 28 April 2019 (UTC)
@David Eppstein: I will incorporate the information into the article shortly. I did notice that it was a hyperbolic statement. I was just emphasizing that it required citations. Aoba47 (talk) 18:58, 28 April 2019 (UTC)