# Talk:American game show winnings records

Ken was a guest on the Howard Stern Show this year. A long running segment on the show is "Win Fred's Money" in which guest compete against Fred Norris. Ken won $5000 on that show which is televised on Howard Stern On Demand. Should we add $5000 to his winnings total?--96.49.243.17 (talk) 11:40, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

If the show is televised nationally, I see no reason why the $5,000 he won wouldn't count, as long as a reliable source is provided. --Bentvfan54321 (talk) 00:13, 27 February 2013 (UTC)
So it's a radio show, but I've got a YouTube link. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3qcVIRdtYI BoiledYam241 (talk) 03:58, 17 April 2023 (UTC)
1) Here's the actual link to Ken's appearance, apparently from 2012.
2) Hate to revive this 12-year-old discussion, but based on how this article currently counts celebrity, charity, and split team winnings, if we give Ken his $5,000 from this...he reclaims the record by just over $1,000.
Pinging TheJay123 as they're the only other editor who seems to have kept up with this page's top 25 list in recent months, and Andrewbethke who asked the most recent question on how to define our terms. We should probably come to some sort of consensus at this point, if that's even possible with how many layers there are to tracking these records. --Bcschneider53 (talk) 00:52, 31 July 2025 (UTC)
I would say that this does not count, because Jennings did not win the money on a program classified as a "game show", this was on Howard Stern's show, so I lean more towards not including that win on the chart. TheJay123 (talk) 12:06, 31 July 2025 (UTC)

Should Andrew Kravis, who won $2.6 million U.S. on the Million Second Quiz be included in the list of all-time American game show winners? WadeSimMiser (talk) 23:58, 21 September 2013 (UTC)

Erin Brodie won $1 million at her first time in the competition and again another $1 million.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.50.184.98 (talk) 17:53, 3 March 2014 (UTC) 

This is something that has been pointed out before. There is a difference between typical game shows like Jeopardy! and Millionaire, and reality competitions like Survivor. I think that creating an article for winnings records on these shows would settle this dispute, so I'm open to suggestions and thoughts from others. --Bentvfan54321 (talk) 18:40, 3 March 2014 (UTC)
As it has been two months since this discussion began and nobody has replied, I'll go ahead and remove them from the list in a week, unless someone raises a concern before then. I will also note that there were no Survivor contestants on the list until Diaz-Twine's second $1,000,000 win, meaning the article did not include these contestants originally (many would have appeared on the list before it was shortened to the top ten). --Bentvfan54321 (talk) 01:54, 5 May 2014 (UTC)
As it has been eleven months since I first mentioned this and I have not gotten a single reply, I will remove Diaz-Twine and Mariano from the list, and add back Carpenter and Rose (with citations) back into the list. Again, if anyone disagrees, please do not hesitate to let me know. --Bentvfan54321 (talk) 19:18, 10 May 2014 (UTC)
You are right. I am the one who created this page and did not do so for reality shows to be included. These are GAME SHOWS. --ChrisP2K5 (talk) 17:15, 13 May 2014 (UTC)

So ironically, this came to my mind watching the NBA Christmas Day game between the Cavs and Warriors, but LeBron's new game show The Wall just gave away $1.3 million…to a couple. I wanted to bring this up because the series becomes a regular thing soon and may well hand out more big money prizes (apparently up to $12 million is up for grabs?). I personally would be in favor of adding any couples who win enough to earn a spot in the top ten to the list but wanted to bring it up at the talk page first. $1.3 million is not an amount seen everyday so I think it deserves mentioning here in some capacity. Another possibility could be adding a second chart just for teams/couples. Thoughts? --Bcschneider53 (talk) 20:17, 25 December 2016 (UTC)

I know it has been a long time since this comment was posted, but any winnings on The Wall would be split between two contestants. A team would have to win more than $2,100,000 on The Wall in order for their win to be included in this article. As of November 2025, such a win has not occurred. TheGameShowFan123 (talk) 01:39, 7 November 2025 (UTC)

Just noticed in the prose section, $1,000,000 in 2004 being "$130,000" today? Nomader (talk) 15:37, 26 March 2018 (UTC)

@Nomader: Thank you for noticing this; someone forgot a 0 in the template, so it was converting $100,000 into today's money. It's been corrected. --Bcschneider53 (talk) 15:56, 26 March 2018 (UTC)

Ed Toutant, who won a total of $1,871,401, has passed away from brain cancer. He will no longer be able to add money to his record. J4lambert (talk) 03:14, 7 November 2018 (UTC)

@J4lambert: Do you have a source? I just did a quick Google search and couldn't find anything... --Bcschneider53 (talk) 03:45, 7 November 2018 (UTC)
It's according to one of the tweets I found on BuzzerBlog's Twitter handle. [1] J4lambert (talk) 13:16, 7 November 2018 (UTC)
Obituary for Ed Toutant is now posted: [2]. J4lambert (talk) 14:25, 9 November 2018 (UTC)

is there a worldwide  list Fanoflionking 17:23, 7 January 2019 (UTC)
There is none. J4lambert (talk) 00:59, 15 May 2019 (UTC)
I currently making this list List of Highest amount won on a game show and would like people to come to helpFanoflionking  11:23, 28 July 2019 (UTC)

@Fanoflionking: I would suggest moving the title to "Worldwide game show winnings records" for consistency's sake. --Bcschneider53 (talk) 13:36, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
I moved it to Draft:Worldwide game show winnings records is there anything else can you come help edit it. Fanoflionking  13:47, 1 August 2019 (UTC)

J4lambert (talk) 00:59, 15 May 2019 (UTC)

Hi, J4lambert, could you explain the purpose of this list? Men and women (usually) aren't separated or segregated in game show competitions so I see no need to make a distinction here. I would be open to expanding this list to the Top 25 though now that there have been several other contestants to win more than a million dollars on a game show. I will also note that Katie Ohh won $1,000,000 on The Winner Is; I personally would consider that a game show (The Singing Bee is a music show but considered a game show) since, despite it being a season long tournament, prize money can be won on a single program (as is the case for The American Bible Challenge or Pyramid). --Bcschneider53 (talk) 01:35, 15 May 2019 (UTC)
The purpose of this list is because there are just too few females who have won $1,000,000 or more on a game show. J4lambert (talk) 11:37, 15 May 2019 (UTC)
Ok, but is there a plan to incorporate that into the article somehow? I think the best way to include some of these women is to (within reason) expand the list a bit, not sure an entirely separate list is the best thing to do (especially if it's only here on the talk page). --Bcschneider53 (talk) 01:57, 17 May 2019 (UTC)
Table is now updated J4lambert (talk) 21:52, 11 November 2019 (UTC)
@J4lambert: Again, I see no reason why we should segregate them. If they're not usually separated in game show competition itself, why should they be here? Like I said, I'd be open to expanding the list a bit (perhaps top-20 or 25?) but I don't see the purpose of separation by gender. I'll ping AldezD for some thoughts too. --Bcschneider53 (talk) 18:39, 12 November 2019 (UTC)
Absolutely no reason to include WP:LISTCRUFT breaking it out by gender. Also, none of this information is referenced. The article already includes a top 10 list. AldezD (talk) 19:04, 12 November 2019 (UTC)

​To whom it may concern when I write this article I meant it all when I want to improve the article's clarity and consistency, as seen here, but the next day I saw a user, AldezD, removed my edits. Then two anonymous users (not me, honestly) revert back or minor edited the article. I did not do it on good faith I came to Wikipedia was to improve the articles out of my interests. If there is any suggestion, let me and him know and we can discuss further, since it is a talk page. TVSGuy (talk) 08:28, 16 November 2020 (UTC)
​ Please reply if you seen this. TVSGuy (talk) 11:08, 16 November 2020 (UTC)

​ Your edits included unsourced changes to dates. I undid my edit but removed the italics and changed the section header "The $1,000,000 prize money phenomenon" to "Million Dollar Game Shows." AldezD (talk) 21:47, 16 November 2020 (UTC)
​ I see. I understand why my edits are gone but apparently there I know that Stouber's big episode was on October 14, not 28 as according to various sources, as well as other shows. I understand now and I glad I learn something. TVSGuy (talk) 04:09, 17 November 2020 (UTC)
​ "According to various sources" is the main issue why your edit was undone. You need to add sources which meet WP:V when you change dates. AldezD (talk) 14:34, 17 November 2020 (UTC)
​ I got it. Next time I should do so, but this case I was careless because I did not include it. I let it slide, you can delete the message now, but I'll remember you and your lesson; after all, it's learning. TVSGuy (talk) 12:15, 18 November 2020 (UTC)
​This would fall under "improvement", and actually goes into the back-history, rather than the list itself.  I'm trying to recall the year (and I know that all references have been removed from YouTube) of the "$1,000,000 Joker's Wild Tournament" of the late 1970's.  If we are to use the same basis we do with John Carpenter's $250,000 win on his second appearance on Who Wants To Be A Millionaire?, then the winner of this tournament (and I forget the woman's name entirely, would be the largest game-show winner in the United States until Curtis Warren.  I also forget how much she won on her main appearance on The Joker's Wild, but, for winning the tournament, she won $500,000 -- half for herself, half for "a nationally recognized charity". -- 47.34.135.71 (talk) 06:40, 17 August 2021 (UTC)

If she won half of $500k that's $250k, an amount far lower than the #10 current entry at $1.25 million cumulative winnings. This isn't a list of game show tournament winners and The Joker's Wild tournament has nothing to do with the additional $250k Carpenter later won. AldezD (talk) 18:43, 18 August 2021 (UTC)
To be fair to the IP, I think this would still be $500K under the current top ten list's standards. IMHO, it doesn't matter what Jennings, Rutter, or Carpenter did with their winnings. If they donated half to charity, bought a sports car, invested it, whatever, they still "won" it either way, which is why I think charity winnings should be acknowledged and ultimately included.
Of course, $500,000 is still nowhere close to enough to break into the top ten, so in this case, I don't see a need to include it here. --Bcschneider53 (talk) 01:12, 19 August 2021 (UTC)
It would be $500,000 under the current list's standards.  But I'm talking, not either list, but the back-history.  If we use that criteria, that woman, not McKee or even Shutterly, would be the USA record holder until, I think, Warren or Carpenter.  --47.34.135.71 (talk) 21:52, 5 September 2021 (UTC)
She didn't win the tournament. The Joker's Wild#Tournament of Champions "Cassandra Dooley won $200,000 for second place, half of which went to Big Brothers Big Sisters of America."—Which still does not meet WP:V. Also, "The eventual winner received $500,000 ($250,000, paid $25,000 annually for 10 years, plus $250,000 to the charity of his or her choice)". Neither were the biggest winner "to that point" in history. AldezD (talk) 12:27, 6 September 2021 (UTC)
I think you're still confusing what I'm trying to go -- and I could've sworn it was an African American female (but if it wasn't, that's not relevant).  Whoever won this tournament, under the criteria on which the list gives Carpenter the full $250,000 from his second Millionaire appearance, would've actually held the all-time record past Shutterly, because that person would not have only won the $500,000 for the tournament, but whatever he or she had won on The Joker's Wild previously -- so that's kind of where the backstory is a bit of an issue here.  The usual convention is that charity winnings are not counted (nor are teams/couples, which takes care of another case), and that's why McKee was recognized as the record-holder for all those years until Shutterly. --47.34.135.71 (talk) 11:16, 7 September 2021 (UTC)
Make whatever edit you feel is necessary. Be sure to follow WP:V and WP:Citing Sources. AldezD (talk) 11:35, 9 September 2021 (UTC)
Can I make the edit with the previously linked (Joker's Wild ToC) Wikipedia article portion as source and it actually qualifies, or must I find a more direct source under those two policies? --47.34.135.71 (talk) 15:29, 12 September 2021 (UTC)
You can cite the same source the article in question cites, but you shouldn't simply cite another Wikipedia article and use it as a reference. --Bcschneider53 (talk) 17:25, 12 September 2021 (UTC)
Well, I can't edit it at all in my "semi-retired" state (forced into such because I didn't want to end up site-banned because of a massive argument I got in which was impacting other people as well at my location several years ago), because the entire article is protected, meaning no one can edit it without either an account or some degree of approval.  I'll propose it here, though -- Since Sony or the successor to Barry-Enright has scrubbed most video record of Griffin's victory in the Tournament (much less his previous winnings, which would be needed for the article in the event we keep the full $1,250,000 for Carpenter), the easiest edit, to me, would be to have it consistent with the conventions which allow McKee to hold the record and "ret-con" Carpenter to $1,125,000, meaning Adam Rose's $1,153,908 from The Price is Right would then hold the #10 spot.  (And, from the TPiR article on Wikipedia, that number is sourced properly.) --47.34.135.71 (talk) 05:52, 14 September 2021 (UTC)
What was your registered user ID? ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 17:34, 15 September 2021 (UTC)
On the IP's talk page, it's reported as Starcade (talk · contribs), which was indef'd 10 years ago. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 16:00, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

Matt Amodio should be in number 10. He exceeds Carpenter’s winnings with $1,267,801 2603:7080:7000:A13C:F961:198F:2C8:5633 (talk) 19:23, 1 October 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. RandomCanadian (talk / contribs)  02:22, 2 October 2021 (UTC)

Matt Amodio now has $1,350,801 2603:7080:7000:A13C:5D14:D596:498B:F659 (talk) 22:12, 4 October 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. RandomCanadian (talk / contribs)  03:31, 5 October 2021 (UTC)

Change "His total is the second-most all-time behind Jennings" to "His total number of wins is the second-most all-time behind Jennings". It's ambiguous whether "second-most" refers to games or money won. Dmasel (talk) 22:04, 15 October 2021 (UTC)

 Done Done, thanks for the suggestion. --Bcschneider53 (talk) 00:07, 16 October 2021 (UTC)

Does Melissa Joan Hart now go to 20? 2603:7080:7000:A13C:A5DD:6165:730D:ACE4 (talk) 08:36, 18 October 2021 (UTC)

I don't know. In your edit request, please make it clear what changes you want to be made and please give reliable sources to support those changes. --Ferien (talk) 18:52, 18 October 2021 (UTC)

I have noticed there have been several inclusions of celebrities in this list based on their performances on special episodes of various shows. I don’t believe these should be counted, because they’re not winning any of this money (it’s all going to charity). The page is “winnings records”, not “charitable donations records”. —-ChrisP2K5 (talk) 18:13, 2 March 2023 (UTC)

@ChrisP2K5: I disagree. It doesn't matter what a contestant, regardless of celebrity status, does with the money they've won on the show. If they choose to keep it all to themselves, if they give 10 percent to their friends and family, if they donate it all to charity...the money was still "won" through the playing of a "game show," no? Think we had this discussion several years ago regarding contestants such as Jennings and Rutter who have had Jeopardy! winnings that were donated to charity. That's my opinion on this, but let's see if anyone else chimes in.
(Also, thank you for taking this to the talk page first rather than just changing the standard right away.) --Bcschneider53 (talk) 03:18, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

I do believe that Mai Nguyen from Squid Game: The Challenge should be on this list. She won 4.56 million dollars in the show. Lakadium837 (talk) 13:44, 7 December 2023 (UTC)

Its a reality competition, and that is not a Game show. Same goes to Beast Games. I need the editors to correct those and readers to inform @Jms934: about this that game shows and reality are separate. Beast Games is not a game show. The purpose of this page shows on game shows only, not reality shows. 122.11.246.139 (talk) 14:17, 14 February 2025 (UTC)

Do we add David’s win of $5,800,00 on here as a game show win or is it a reality competition win? He did win in a game of Deal or No Deal.But he did need to eliminate players to get to this point and it’s episodic. I think yes just know this question will be asked so why not discuss it now. 199.250.237.52 (talk) 03:25, 26 March 2025 (UTC)

Guidance in the article hashed out notes calls out Deal or No Deal Island as a game show, even though it is a bit of a hybrid. CreepyHammer (talk) 04:01, 26 March 2025 (UTC)

This page is focused on U.S. TV game shows. David Genat's winnings in Survivor Australia can be mentioned as a footnote, but should not be highlighted in the table of the top 25 winners in U.S. game show history. CreepyHammer (talk) 03:41, 26 March 2025 (UTC)

Also, according to the article, Survivor, on its own, does not fit the definition of a game show. CreepyHammer (talk) 04:00, 26 March 2025 (UTC)

I've looked through this talk page and the archive, and, as best I can tell, there was never any discussion on how to define the term game show. There's this "discussion (or lack thereof), which claims that there's been "so much discussion" in "archives for this talk page" about the subject, but I can only see the one archived talk page.
I'm curious because the distinction seems rather arbitrary, and I would like to open a new discussion into that, but obviously I'd like to avoid rehashing any past discussion that I'm not aware of. Any help would be appreciated. Andrewbethke (talk) 23:21, 12 April 2025 (UTC)

@Andrewbethke: Sorry for the late reply. I am not nearly as active as I used to be, but I did bring this to GA status...10 years ago? Good grief, where has the time gone...
Anyway, at this point, it's become clearer than ever that the line between game show and reality competition is, well, less clear than ever. Deal or No Deal Island perhaps blurs the line more than anything in recent memory. DoND is obviously a game show, while Survivor is (by most definitions) a reality competition that would be part of a different category. Then again, I've heard many people describe The Weakest Link as a cross between Who Wants to Be a Millionaire and Survivor, and no one is questioning that show fitting the "game show" definition.
There's also the charity winnings to take into consideration. Years ago, I advocated for their inclusion on the basis that it shouldn't matter what's done with the money. If a contestant "won" the prize on an "American game show," then it should be noted as such, whether it's an average citizen like you or me or an A-list celebrity on a charity special. But today, that's also become a more complicated issue. Ken Jennings, for example, earned his fame as a civilian game show contestant, but has now competed as a "celebrity" contestant on Celebrity Wheel of Fortune. Does a distinction need to be made there, too? Millionaire celebrity contestants are now competing as pairs, yet Lisa Ann Walter had a separate charity from Rosie O'Donnell while Ike Barinholtz and his father Alan played for a single charity. How are those winnings split? It's clear Walter's charity got half of her prize while O'Donnell's got the other half, but wouldn't it be more accurate to say Barinholtz won the full prize since his charity received the full million-dollar check? But doesn't that create another inconsistency? Does any of this matter if we suddenly decide charity winnings shouldn't be included?
I could go on with even more examples. Even if Beast Games is considered a "game show" (and I could admittedly see an argument if we're including DoND Island)...do we define it differently as a streaming series rather than a show that airs on a traditional television network? Like I said, I don't contribute as often these days, but I must confess this article's GA status should probably be, at the very least, up in the air until clearer distinctions, definitions, and standards are established. --Bcschneider53 (talk) 03:13, 6 May 2025 (UTC)

I don't see how they split the money $500,000 each because they were both playing for the same charity Water.org. I still think it counts as a full $1 million since all of that money went to the charity. What do you all think?And1987 (talk) 02:36, 31 July 2025 (UTC)

I think the same thing in the above section on this page: it has ultimately become too complicated to succinctly define our terms. Think of Jennings alone for a second. He's played as a civilian on his own behalf (Jeopardy!), as a civilian for charity (half of his IBM Challenge winnings), as a celebrity on his own behalf (5th Grader, Millionaire in 2014), as a celebrity for charity (Celeb Wheel of Fortune), and as a celebrity team of two playing for one charity (Millionaire in 2025). Do we count charity winnings at all (a long-standing debate on this talk page)? Do we credit Jennings and Damon both with a million since their charity was the same (as opposed to Lisa Ann Walter and Rosie O'Donnell, who played for separate charities)? And we haven't even gotten to whether Beast Games or Deal or No Deal Island bridge the gap enough to be considered "game shows" as opposed to reality competitions like Survivor.
Again, I could go on with more examples that make this question more complicated to answer than ever. I'm hoping to find some sort of consensus here, but until that happens, I think we can only credit Jennings with half of the prize since he was part of a team of two. Another user made that distinction after Barinholtz's win, though I'm not sure I can ping them since they made the edit as an anonymous IP... --Bcschneider53 (talk) 03:03, 31 July 2025 (UTC)
Deal or No Deal Island is slightly more complicated because it models elements of Survivor but also retains game show elements from Deal or No Deal, so I would say that that counts as a game show; however, Beast Games is a reality show that airs on YouTube, so that does not count as a game show. TheJay123 (talk) 12:09, 31 July 2025 (UTC)

Didn’t people win like $10MM on the beast games tv game show by Mr beast? That should be captured here 2600:6C4A:793F:64B6:10C8:9A0:B085:AAE9 (talk) 22:49, 13 August 2025 (UTC)

Beast Games ran on YouTube, so it does not constitute as a game show as that is a social media site, not a television channel or subscription streaming service. TheGameShowFan123 (talk) 01:34, 7 November 2025 (UTC)
Beast Games is on Prime Video, not YouTube, but is considered a "reality competition show" under this page's definition, not a "game show." Andrewbethke (talk) 16:46, 22 November 2025 (UTC)
That is a good point, however, Beast Games involves elimination based on contestant voting, so that does not count as a game show on this page (that rule has existed since before I even joined Wikipedia). Game shows are based on a completion of tasks based on data, not votes. TheGameShowFan123 (talk) 20:02, 22 November 2025 (UTC)
@TheGameShowFan123: Not sure about that one...by that standard, wouldn't Weakest Link not count as a game show? Like I've said on this page before, I think the line between "game show" and "reality competition" is more blurred than ever. --Bcschneider53 (talk) 22:09, 22 November 2025 (UTC)
I thought about that when I was writing the original reply, and Weakest Link is definitely a gray area because it has voting but also includes trivia and climbing up a money tree (which counts as the standard definition of a game show), that's why I think Weakest Link is more of a game show than a reality competition, but game shows are a lot more broad today than they were when they started in the early 1900's. TheGameShowFan123 (talk) 22:15, 22 November 2025 (UTC)

Forgive me in advance as this will be a long comment, but I think it's important to clarify what is a game show and what is not. While the exact definition of a game show is becoming more broad as time progresses (especially with the rise of streaming shows), the article states that prizes can be won within a single episode through objective completion of tasks and not through fan or contestant votes. Although American Ninja Warrior (ANW for short) is a season-long tournament, it can still count as a game show as the prize money is awarded based on objective completion of tasks, and advancement depends solely on performance, not fan or contestant voting. Deal or No Deal Island and Jeopardy! are exceptions in the sense that Deal or No Deal Island  is a hybrid show where contestants accumulate money as the season progresses, and on Jeopardy! contestants can keep playing as long as they keep winning (contestants that advance do not win all of their money in one episode alone). Jeopardy! Masters, for example, is a season-long tournament in which the prize money is awarded at the end of the season, and it is still included in the article. I do agree that shows like Survivor, The X Factor, Squid Game, etc. would NOT count as a game show, as they are solely reality shows that rely on fan/contestant votes. Overall, a game show should be defined by skill (whether mental or physical) with an objective criteria for success. Please let me know if you have any questions, comments or concerns. Thanks! (talk) 00:15, 7 November 2025 (UTC)