B: and we have to decide how stringent we want to be in these things ,
B: but they will always come back with saying that , um , you need to you want to have someth some paper trail or which includes electronic trail  that they have , uh , in fact O K 'd it .
F: Mm - hmm .
B: So , um ,
B: I think that if you f i if we send the email as you have
B: and if there 's half the people , say , who don't respond at all by , you know , some period of time , we can just make a list of these people
B: and hand it to , uh B: you know , just give it to me
B: and I 'll hand it to administrative staff or whatever ,
F: Right .
B: and they 'll just call them up and say , you know , " have you B: Is is this OK ? And would you please mail you know , mail Adam that it is , if i if it , you know , is or not . "
B: So , you know , we can we can do that .
E: The other thing that there 's a psychological effect that at least for most people , that if they 've responded to your email saying " yes , I will do it " or " yes , I got your email " , they 're more likely to actually do it <comment> later than to just ignore it .
B: Mm - hmm .
E: And of course we don't want them to bleep things out ,
E: but it it 's a little bit better if we 're getting the their , uh , final response , once they 've answered you once than if they never answer you 'd <comment> at al at all .
E: That 's how these mailing houses work .
E: So , I mean , it 's not completely lost work
E: because it might benefit us in terms of getting responses .
A: Mm - hmm .
E: You know , an official OK from somebody is better than no answer , even if they responded that they got your email .
E: And they 're probably more likely to do that once they 've responded that they got the email .
A: I also think they 'd just simply appreciate it .
A: I think it 's a good a good way of of fostering goodwill among our subjects .
A: Well , our participants .
B: I think the main thing is I mean , what lawyers do is they always look at worst cases .
F: Sending lots of spam .
B: So they s so so Tha - that 's what they 're paid to do .
F: Yep .
B: And so , it is certainly possible that , uh , somebody 's server would be down or something
B: and they wouldn't actually hear from us ,
B: and then they find this thing is in there
B: and we 've already distributed it to someone .
B: So , what it says in there , in fact , is that they will be given an opportunity to blah - blah - blah ,
A: Mm - hmm .
B: but if in fact if we sent them something or we thought we sent them something but they didn't actually receive it for some reason , um , then we haven't given them that .
F: Well , so how far do we have to go ?
F: Do we need to get someone 's signature ?
F: Or , is email enough ?
F: Do we have to have it notarized ?
B: I i i em email is enough .
F: I mean F: OK .
B: Yeah .
B: I mean , I 've been through this B: I mean , I 'm not a lawyer ,
B: but I 've been through these things a f things f like this a few times with lawyers now
F: Mm - hmm .
B: so I I I I 'm pretty comfortable with that .
C: Do you track , um , when people log in
C: to look at the ?
F: Uh . If they submit the form , I get it .
C: Uh - huh .
F: If they don't submit the form , it goes in the general web log .
F: But that 's not sufficient .
C: Hmm .
F: Right ?
F: Cuz if someone just visits the web site that doesn't imply anything in particular .
C: Except that you know they got the mail .
A: Mm - hmm . That 's right .
F: Right .
A: I I could get you on the notify list if you want me to .
F: I 'm already on it .
A: For that directory ?
F: Mm - hmm .
A: OK , great .
B: So again , hopefully , um , this shouldn't be quite as odious a problem either way ,
B: uh , in any of the extremes we 've talked about
B: because uh , we 're talking a pretty small number of people .
F: W
F: For this set , I 'm not worried ,
F: because we basically know everyone on it .
B: Mm - hmm .
A: Hmm .
B: Mm - hmm .
F: You know , they 're all more or less here
F: or it 's it 's Eric and Dan and so on .
F: But for some of the others , you 're talking about visitors who are gone from ICSI , whose email addresses may or may not work ,
B: Mm - hmm .
B: Mm - hmm .
A: Oh .
F: and F: So what are we gonna do when we run into someone that we can't get in touch with ?
A: I don't think , uh They 're so recent , these visitors .
A: I and and I they 're also so F: Mm - hmm .
B: Mm - hmm .
A: They 're prominent enough that they 're easy to find through A: I I mean , I I w I 'll be able to if you have any trouble finding them , I really think I could find them .
F: Other methods ?
F: OK .
B: Yeah . Cuz it what it what it really does promise here is that we will ask their permission .
B: Um , and I think , you know , if you go into a room and close the door and and ask their permission and they 're not there , it doesn't seem <comment> that
B: that 's the intent of , uh , meaning here .
B: So .
F: Well , the qu the question is just whether how active it has to be .
F: I mean , because they they filled out a contact information
F: and that 's where I 'm sending the information .
B: Right .
F: And so far everyone has done email .
F: There isn't anyone who did , uh , any other contact method .
B: Well , the way ICSI goes , people , uh , who , uh , were here ten years ago still have acc have forwards to other accounts and so on .
F: Yeah .
B: So it 's unusual that that they , uh F: So my original impression was that that was sufficient ,
F: that if they give us contact information and that contact information isn't accurate that we fulfilled our burden .
B: Yeah .
E: Then they just come back .
C: All my files were still here .
E: Same as us .
A: I just B: So if we get to a boundary case like that then maybe I will call the attorney about it .
C: Yeah .
F: OK .
B: But , you know , hopefully we won't need to .
A: I d I just don't think we will .
F: Alright .
A: For all the reasons that we 've discussed .
B: So we 'll we 'll see if we do or not .
F: Yep . And we 'll see how many people respond to that email .
A: Yeah .
F: So far , two people have .
B: Yeah . I think very few people will
F: So .
B: and and and , you know , people people see long emails about things that they don't think is gonna be high priority , they typically , uh , don't don't read it , or half read it .
F: Right .
B: Cuz people are swamped .
B: But A: And actually ,
A: um , I I didn't anticipate this
A: so I that 's why I didn't give this comment ,
A: and it I this discussion has made me think it might be nice to have a follow - up email within the next couple of days saying " by the way , you know , we wanna hear back from you by X date
A: and please " ,
A: and then add what Liz said A: " please , uh , respond to please indicate you received this mail . "
B: Uh , or e well , maybe even additionally , uh , um ,
B: " Even if you 've decided you have no changes you 'd like to make , if you could tell us that " .
F: Respond to the email . <comment> Yep .
A: Mm - hmm .
E: Right . That would that would definitely work on me .
B: Yeah .
A: It is the first time through the cycle .
E: You know , it makes you feel m like ,
E: um ,
E: if you were gonna p if you 're predicting that you might not answer , you have a chance now to say that .
E: Whereas , I I mean , I would be much more likely myself ,
C: And the other th
E: given all my email , t to respond at that point , saying " you know what , I 'm probably not gonna get to it " or whatever ,
E: rather than just having seen the email , thinking I might get to it ,
E: and never really , uh , pushing myself to actually do it until it 's too late .
C: Yeah . I was C: I was thinking that it also lets them know that they don't have to go to the page to accept this .
E: Right . R Right . That 's true .
B: Right .
C: I mean , I I C: Yeah .
C: So that way they could they can see from that email that if they just write back and say " I got it , no changes " , they 're off the hook .
B: Yeah .
C: They don't have to go to the web page
C: and B: I mean , the other thing I 've learned from dealing with dealing with people sending in reviews and so forth , uh , is , um , if you say " you 've got three months to do this review " , um , people do it , you know , two and seven eighths months from now .
E: Yeah . That 's true .
F: Right .
B: If you say " you 've got three weeks to do this review " , they do do it , you know , two and seven eighths weeks from now  they do the review .
B: And , um So ,
B: if we make it a little less time , I don't think it 'll be that much F: Well , and also if we want it ready by the fifteenth , that means we better give them deadline of the first ,
F: if we have any prayer of actually getting everyone to respond in time .
B: There 's the responding part
B: and there 's also what if ,
B: uh , I mean , I hope this doesn't happen ,
B: what if there are a bunch of deletions that have to get put in and changes ?
F: Right .
B: Then we actually have to deal with that
A: Mm - hmm . Some lead time .
B: if we want it to F: Ugh !
F: Disk space ,
F: oh my god !
A: By the way , has has Jeremy signed the form ?
F: I hadn't thought about that .
A: OK .
F: That for every meeting F: any meeting which has any bleeps in it we need yet another copy of .
H: Oh .