A: Cuz we 've had the problem before that you get show some nice improvement on something that 's that 's uh , uh it seems like too large a number ,
E: Mm - hmm .
A: and uh uh people don't necessarily take it so seriously .
A: Um .
A: Yeah .
A: Yeah .
A: So the three point four percent for this uh is is
A: uh A: So why is it A: It 's an interesting question though , still .
A: Why is why is it three point four percent for the d the digits recorded in this environment as opposed to the uh point eight percent for for for the original TI - digits database ?
A: Um .
E: Yeah .
E: th that 's th that 's my point
A: Given given the same E: I I I don't I A: Yeah . So ignore ignoring the the the SRI system for a moment ,
E: Mm - hmm .
A: just looking at the TI - di the uh tandem system ,
A: if we 're getting point eight percent , which , yes , it 's high .
A: It 's , you know , it it 's not awfully high ,
E: Mm - hmm .
A: but it 's , you know it 's it 's high .
A: Um . Why is it uh four times as high , or more ?
E: Yeah , I guess .
A: Right ?
A: I mean , there 's  even though it 's close - miked there 's still there really is background noise .
E: Mm - hmm .
A: Um . And uh I suspect when the TI - digits were recorded if somebody fumbled or said something wrong or something that they probably made them take it over .
E: Mm - hmm .
A: It was not I mean there was no attempt to have it be realistic in any in any sense at all .
E: Well .
E: Yeah .
E: And acoustically , it 's q it 's E: I listened .
E: It 's quite different .
E: TI - digit is it 's very , very clean and it 's like studio recording
A: Mm - hmm .
E: whereas these Meeting Recorder digits sometimes you have breath noise
E: and
E: Mmm .
A: Right .
A: Yeah .
A: So I think they were E: It 's <nonvocalsound> not controlled at all , I mean .
A: Bless you .
B: Thanks .
A: I Yeah . I think it 's it 's E: Mm - hmm .
A: So . Yes .
E: But
A: It 's I think it 's it 's the indication it 's harder .
E: Yeah .
A: Uh . Yeah and again , you know , i that 's true either way .
A: I mean so take a look at the uh  um , the SRI results .
A: I mean , they 're much much better ,
A: but still you 're getting something like one point three percent for uh things that are same data as in T TI - digits the same same text .
E: Mm - hmm .
A: Uh . And uh , I 'm sure the same same system would would get , you know , point point three or point four or something on the actual TI - digits .
A: So this I think , on both systems the these digits are showing up as harder .
E: Mmm .
A: Um .
E: Mm - hmm .
A: Which I find sort of interesting cause I think this is closer to A: uh I mean it 's still read .
A: But I still think it 's much closer to to what what people actually face , um when they 're they 're dealing with people saying digits over the telephone .
A: I mean . I don't think uh A: I mean , I 'm sure they wouldn't release the numbers ,
A: but I don't think that uh the uh the the companies that that do telephone speech get anything like point four percent on their digits .
A: I 'm I 'm I 'm sure they get A: Uh , I mean , for one thing people do phone up who don't have uh uh Middle America accents and
E: Mm - hmm .
A: it 's a we we it 's it 's it 's US .
A: it has has many people  who sound in many different ways .
A: So .
A: Um .
A: I mean .
A: OK .
A: That was that topic .
A: What else we got ?
E: Um .
A: Did we end up giving up on on , any Eurospeech submissions ,
E: But A: or ?
A: I know Thilo and Dan Ellis are are submitting something ,
A: but uh .
E: Yeah .
E: I  I guess e the only thing with these the Meeting Recorder and , well , E: So , I think , yeah I think we basically gave up .
A: Um . Now , actually for the for the Aur - uh
E: But A: we do have stuff for Aurora , right ?
A: Because because we have ano an extra month or something .
E: Yeah .
E: Yeah .
E: Yeah .
E: So .
E: Yeah , for sure we will do something for the special session .
A: Yeah .
A: Well , that 's fine .
A: So th so so we have a couple a couple little things on Meeting Recorder
E: Yeah .
E: Mm - hmm .
A: and we have  We don't we don't have to flood it with papers .
A: We 're not trying to prove anything to anybody .
A: so .
A: That 's fine .
A: Um .
A: Anything else ?
E: Yeah .
E: Well . So .
E: Perhaps the point is that we 've been working on is ,
E: yeah , we have put the um the good VAD in the system
E: and it really makes a huge difference .
E: Um .
E: So ,
E: yeah .
E: I think , yeah , this is perhaps one of the reason why our system was not  not the best ,
E: because with the new VAD , it 's very the results are similar to the France Telecom results and perhaps even better sometimes .
A: Hmm .
B: Huh .
E: Um . So there is this point .
E: Uh . The problem is that it 's very big and  we still have to think how to where to put it
E: and  um ,
A: Mm - hmm .
E: because it it E: well , this VAD
E: uh either some delay
E: and we if we put it on the server side , it doesn't work ,
E: because on the server side features you already have LDA applied from the f from the terminal side
E: and so you accumulate the delay
E: so the VAD should be before the LDA
E: which means perhaps on the terminal side
E: and then smaller and
A: So wha where did this good VAD come from ?
E: So .
E: It 's um from OGI .
E: So it 's the network trained it 's the network with the huge amounts on hidden of hidden units ,
E: and um nine input frames compared to the VAD that was in the proposal which has a very small amount of hidden units and fewer inputs .
A: This is the one they had originally ?
E: Yeah .
A: Oh .
A: Yeah , but they had to get rid of it because of the space ,
A: didn't they ?
E: Yeah .
E: So .
E: Yeah .
E: But the abso assumption is that we will be able to make a VAD that 's small and that works fine .
E: And . So we can A: Well . So that 's a problem .
A: Yeah .
E: Yeah but E: nnn .
A: But the other thing is uh to use a different VAD entirely .
A: I mean , uh i if if there 's a if if A: I I don't know what the thinking was amongst the the the the ETSI folk
A: but um if everybody agreed sure let 's use this VAD and take that out of there E: Mm - hmm .
E: Mm - hmm .
E: They just want , apparently they don't want to fix the VAD because they think there is some interaction between feature extraction and and VAD or frame dropping
E: But they still want to just to give some um requirement for this VAD
E: because it 's it will not be part of they don't want it to be part of the standard .
A: OK .
E: So . So it must be at least uh somewhat fixed but not completely .
E: So there just will be some requirements that are still not uh not yet uh ready I think .
A: Determined .
A: I see .
E: Nnn .
A: But I was thinking that that uh s " Sure , there may be some interaction ,
A: but I don't think we need to be stuck on using our or OGI 's VAD .
A: We could use somebody else 's if it 's smaller
A: or E: Yeah .
A: You know , as long as it did the job .
E: Mm - hmm .
A: So that 's good .
E: Uh . So there is this thing .
E: There is
E: um E: Yeah .
E: Uh I designed a new a new filter
E: because when I designed other filters with shorter delay from the LDA filters , there was one filter with fif sixty millisecond delay and the other with ten milliseconds
E: and uh Hynek suggested that both could have sixty - five sixty - s
A: Right .
E: I think it 's sixty - five .
E: Yeah .
A: Yeah .
E: Both should have sixty - five because E: Yeah .
A: You didn't gain anything , right ?
E: And . So I did that
E: and uh it 's running .
E: So , let 's see what will happen .
E: Uh but the filter is of course closer to the reference filter .
A: Mm - hmm .
E: Mmm .
E: Um . Yeah .
E: I think A: So that means logically , in principle , it should be better .
A: So probably it 'll be worse .
E: Yeah
A: Or in the basic perverse nature uh of reality .
A: Yeah .
A: OK .
E: Yeah .
E: Sure .
C: Yeah .
A: OK .
E: Yeah , and then we 've started to work with this of um voiced - unvoiced stuff .
A: Mm - hmm .
E: And next week I think we will perhaps try to have um a new system with uh uh MSG stream also
E: see what what happens .