Interviewer(s): I004
Interviewee(s): P476

I004: How are you?

P476: I am fine.

I004: When were you born?

P476: 1971.

I004: Do you recall anything major which happened in 1971, either in the family or in the nation?

P476: I would say the notable changes for example would be to do with weather, during that time we had more rainfall and now it is drier because people are cutting trees.

I004: Where were you born and brought up?

P476: In Msangeni.

I004: Msangeni is in which district?

P476: Mwanga district.

I004: Which Ward?

P476: Msangeni Ward.

I004: Where exactly?

P476: Kilimanjaro region.

I004: I would like to understand the family structure, while you were growing up living with your parents, or with other siblings. What was the family structure like? Parents and children, or parents children and uncles and cousins or did you all stay in one home?

P476: We are three children, two girls and one boy. We lived altogether, grandmother, uncles and aunts in the same compound.

I004: How many were you all in total?

P476: There were eight of us.

I004: Did you all live in the same house?

P476: No we did not. We had our house and my aunts had theirs too but we were all in the same compound.

I004: Could you please share with me your family’s main economic activity which earned the family income?

P476: My father was a doctor and my mother was a housewife who also did some cattle rearing.

I004: As you were growing up, what would you say were the responsibilities of boys and men in your family?

P476: Boys and men were concerned with farming and cattle rearing.

I004: And what else?

P476: They were also engaged in small scale business.

I004: Was small scale business carried out by young boys or men?

P476: It was done by young men who are not yet married. Like my young uncles.

I004: What kind of business were they engaged in?

P476: Selling sugarcane and coffee.

I004: And what about the women, what did they do besides selling bananas?

P476: They would look after the family, selling chicken, vegetables, grains, milk, eggs and fodder for cattle.

I004: For the fodder crop, did you have a section of farmland allocated just for this?

P476: Yes. And this would be sold to others who had not planted the same during the dry periods

I004: How large a parcel of land would be allocated for this?

P476: It would be small sections within the farm.

I004: What kinds of fodder crops were grown?

P476: Matamara, steria, fundo fundo and leaves from trees like soursop (stafeli) and avocado trees.

I004: What about you young girls?

P476: Fetching water and gathering fodder.

I004: Can you recall how many in your family were educated and to what level?

P476: We are lucky to have been educated to form four level and others to form six level and university.

I004: In your homestead, who was educated to what level?

P476: I got to form four: my younger sibling went to university and the third to form six.

I004: Regarding foods, what foods would you say were eaten regularly in your family as you were growing up?

P476: We had the average three meals a day. We ate Plantain, Ugali, Beans, Cassava, various vegetables and fruits.

I004: Which foods were eaten regularly?

P476: Beans and plantain.

I004: And what foods were rarely eaten?

P476: Ugali and kande (cracked maize boiled with beans).

I004: What foods were prepared specifically for certain family members like mothers or children and nobody else would eat it?

P476: We were lucky and everyone ate what was available, there were no special foods for certain people. Although new mothers, women were given ‘mtori’ thick banana soup and it was mixed until it was light, the sick ones were given porridge as well as mtori and the mixed beans and plantain food called kiburu.

I004: You said they were not given kande or ugali, why is that?

P476: Because kande is dry and considered hard foods which may be difficult to process especially after child birth. They can only have it after recovery.

I004: What about young children?

P476: They had kiburu or regular plantain mixed with some meat and mashed together.

I004: While you were growing up, what were your sources of food supply?

P476: We had plantain on the farm. We also planted maize and beans. When the dry season hit and we didn’t have enough, we would buy.

I004: What about milk and meat?

P476: Meat we would buy. We would have milk available when the cows have given birth.

I004: During what period would the cows give birth so that milk was available?

P476: It would depend but mostly around December. They were also not grade cows so milking would last briefly and so milk would reduce quickly and we would buy from other neighbours.

I004: What about wild vegetables or fruits did you used to eat those?

P476: We had hare lettuce, sweet potato leaves, amaranth, black jack leaves, mostly nightshade. Fruits like avocado, passion fruit, bananas and guava.

I004: Who would make the decision in the home over what foods to prepare?

P476: My mother.

I004: Who would make decisions on the quantity of food allocated to be prepared for the family?

P476: My mother.

I004: What about the decision on what food items to keep and what to sell?

P476: My mother and I.

I004: What about your father?

P476: He would usually come over during the holidays and return to work thereafter.

I004: So even when he was around during the holidays, who made decisions on food supplies?

P476: It was still my mother as she was the one who spent most of her time with us.

I004: While you were growing up, what would be used to determine that one has grown up? Say a boy growing up and can now be referred to as a young adult?

P476: The changes in behaviour, for example becoming rebellious and would not wish to do chores like dish washing which would be done by girls or young boys.

I004: And what things would he do differently cognizant of the fact that he is becoming a young man?

P476: He would associate more with the boys of his age group and adopting things as done in those groups.

I004: At what age would a boy usually be identified as becoming a young man?

P476: At about age fourteen.

I004: And what about with the girls, what changes would you observe that you would say a girl has transitioned to become a young woman?

P476: The observation of menstruation periods.

I004: And at what age would they be celebrated with song and dance to mark the beginning of adolescence?

P476: At age of fifteen or fourteen.

I004: How about on the part of young girls?

P476: Similarly, the girls would adopt behaviours of age mates.

I004: What about initiation ceremonies?

P476: There were no ceremonies for girls as such, only for boys during circumcision as is Islamic culture.

I004: We are moving now to the next section regarding family make up. You were born and brought up in Mwanga and moved here to Handeni. When did you move here?

P476: In 1996.

I004: What celebration happened around the time you moved here?

P476: There was Sabasaba (a public holiday/Dar es Salaam International Trade Fair day) happening at that time.

I004: What is the main reason for which you moved here?

P476: For work.

I004: What do you do for work?

P476: I am a teacher?

I004: Who lives with you in your homestead?

P476: For now I am alone.

I004: Why is that?

P476: My children are in school and my husband works in Moshi.

I004: What would you say is your main economic activity?

P476: Farming and my work as a teacher.

I004: What is your main income generating activity?

P476: Teaching.

I004: How is the lifestyle you lead now different from when you were growing up?

P476: Not really. The difference I would mention would be then responsibilities were guided by my parents but now I am a parent and I guide the responsibilities in my home.

I004: What are your husband’s responsibilities when he is around?

P476: Farming and livestock rearing.

I004: And what is his main duty when he is around?

P476: Livestock rearing.

I004: And what about you, what is your main responsibility?

P476: Ensuring we have enough food and that my children get an education.

I004: What about your children’s responsibilities while on holiday? Let us start with the girls.

P476: Keeping the homestead clean, cooking and helping out with the cattle.

I004: And what about the boys?

P476: Also keeping the homestead clean, helping out with the cattle and helping out with farming.

I004: You mentioned your husband is based in Moshi and you are based here in Handeni, how has this affected the decision making for your family?

P476: I am most affected when children are going back to school. As for the children’s responsibilities I manage on my own. I find people to hire temporarily to help out when my husband and children are not around and I do what I can myself.

I004: What about livestock rearing?

P476: I have employed someone to look after them.

I004: How has this affected you?

P476: I have pains in my body from time to time.

I004: Please talk about the changes in the preparation of foods nowadays in comparison from when you were growing up. For example nowadays people fry more than boiling food?

P476: There are changes yes. Nowadays food is served and eaten in an individual plate as opposed to a shared tray. Even hand washing has changed where people wash one by one from water poured from a jug whereas when I was young, everyone washed from one bucket and that encouraged the spread of diseases.

I004: Please talk about the change in diet for men nowadays as opposed to when you were younger?

P476: Traditionally, in Islamic culture here, the men would eat first then the women. But nowadays is some settings, there is a buffet and all queue and serve and eat at the same time.

I004: What about changes in the types of foods?

P476: They still eat ugali and jute mallow also wild bitter vegetables but nowadays in addition they add foods like plantain and Kande. They also eat it fried with the addition of carrots and capsicum.

I004: What do you think has caused these changes?

P476: The interaction of tribes.

I004: What other reasons?

P476: Perhaps education. The children learn more about foods, nutrition and methods of preparation.

I004: What other reason?

P476: Perhaps level of income. This enables to buy foods they otherwise cannot grow for example rice.

I004: When you talk about changes in level of income, kindly expound

P476: Nowadays people keep cattle and grow crops and receive additional income allowing them to allocate money for food and clothing.

I004: In the past what economic activities were the people of Kibaya involved in?

P476: It was still farming and cattle rearing but nowadays the thinking are different, they will farm extra to enable them get more income to do other things such as visiting a doctor. Nowadays also they keep ducks and chicken not just for celebrations in the home but for sale or even the sale of their eggs to enable them pay school fees and so on.

I004: What about changes in prices of foods?

P476: Changes in prices of food items is dependent on the seasonality of those foods. For example at present people have planted so maize is not so expensive. Those who have stored some maize will be able to sell it when there is a shortage.

I004: Do you think availability of food items is a factor in the change of diet?

P476: Yes, but also education.

I004: What about the interaction with other tribes?

P476: Yes some tribes have come like Masaai’s form Arusha and Mbulus and when they came here they grow food items such as maize, beans, cowpeas in one farm so people in the area are now emulate mixed farming, so you will find that they grow cowpeas for commercial and maize for domestic use.

I004: What about the availability of firewood, has this affected the foods people prepare?

P476: Yes. In the past people mostly used firewood. But they receive information telling of the health hazards of using firewood and some have opted for gas instead.

I004: Let me rephrase. Certain foods take a long time to cook such as beans or Kande and therefore somebody could decide to cook green vegetables and sardines instead in order to minimize on the amount of firewood they would use. Do you think this is a factor?

P476: Yes perhaps that too would influence the choice of foods.

I004: Do you think the changes in the responsibilities of men and women are an additional factor?

P476: Yes. Nowadays both men and women work together to obtain food for the family it is not just the man’s responsibility.

I004: What are some of the changes in the responsibilities of women?

P476: Selling vegetables they were not doing in the past and also selling charcoal and firewood their main economic activities was selling of water.

I004: Let us discuss foods that are looked down upon such as kididio (porridge cooked as relish) would someone prefer not to eat it because people think he is poor or broke?

P476: Yes I think so. Sometimes also some complain about some greens vegetable such as hare lettuce and sweet potato leaves some men are saying they are too bitter which affects the choice to eat them.

I004: Have you ever investigated why they refuse to eat these vegetables?

P476: Apart from bitterness I think they do not know the importance of that vegetable, and some are saying some of the traditional vegetables are meant for animals.

I004: Of the many reasons we have discussed like interaction with other tribes, Education, Price of food, availability of food, source of energy (firewood), level of income, changes of responsibilities of men and women, inferior food which do you think is the primary reason for the change in diet?

P476: Interaction of tribes.

I004: And the second main reason?

P476: Education.

I004: Of the two reasons, which do you think is the stronger reason for the change in diet?

P476: I would say education. Children learn about the nutritional value of foods and explain the same to their parents and this often influence changes in what the choices the family make on foods.

I004: Do you think children can influence changes in the diet?

P476: Ohh yes, children are capable of that especially a girl child because most of the time she participate in preparation of food.

I004: And the third main reason?

P476: I would say level of income.

I004: Why income?

P476: Because when both a woman and a man are working and earn they will influence their choices on the food to eat.

I004: And a fourth reason?

P476: The discussion and decision of men and women to buy what they need for their family.

I004: And the fifth reason?

P476: I would say it would be looking down on certain foods.

I004: How have these changes affected you and also the people of Kibaya?

P476: It has taken a longer time for people of Kibaya to learn about the importance of different foods.

I004: What about the interaction of people?

P476: Mixing of people has brought shared knowledge on importance of other foods and changes in preparation.

I004: Another advantage?

P476: People are healthier because they eat different foods creating variety in their diet.

I004: What about disadvantage?

P476: People were eating one type of food which could cause illnesses like malnutrition and children are being stunted.

I004: Mother can you expound more?

P476: In the past people were eating one type of food especially carbohydrates so there were lacking protein and vegetable in their bodies and that was the cause for being stunted.

I004: Okay, that was before interaction with other tribes what about the disadvantages after the interaction with other tribes?

P476: Using a lot of time to change after the interaction with other tribe.

I004: Let us discuss about milk and its importance to you and to your family?

P476: Milk is important because it offers supplements to the body especially protein which promotes good health and gives us strength to work.

I004: And what about to the family?

P476: It is important also to my family because the family grows well in terms of behaviour and mind.

I004: What about in other ways?

P476: It is important because some we consume and we are able to sell the rest and get some income.

I004: What about its importance to your tribe here?

P476: In my tribe it is very important because it is used to earn an income; it is used as a food accompaniment and is also drunk as a beverage. And it reduces the risk of continuously falling ill.

I004: Do you think that milk is of great importance, of little importance or of average importance now in comparison to when you were growing up?

P476: I think it is equally important now as it was then.

I004: Why do you say that?

P476: Because even then it was used to supplement other meals and the rest was sold to earn some income and we still do that today.

I004: We have been able to learn that many families say that the availability of milk has changed and the prices have gone up in recent times as compared to when you were young. What are your thoughts on that?

P476: The drought nowadays I think is the main reason for which milk is not readily available. The drought has affected the availability of pastures for the cows.

I004: What else could you say is a contributing factor?

P476: Animal diseases.

I004: Why do you think that is?

P476: When the animals fall ill, seeking treatment is expensive and if one cannot afford the treatment they end up having to sell some of their cattle to meet this cost.

I004: What other reasons could you site?

P476: The cattle rearing methods used are still of the old days. Many have not adopted newer rearing methods. For example, I keep my animals on my farm and find fodder for them to eat while some still walk long distances in search of pastures for their herds and this may affect milk production.

I004: How about other reasons?

P476: The unavailability of nutritional supplements for the animals like corn bran (pumba) or oilcake (mashudu) which increase milk production. If they are not available then milk production falls.

I004: Let us talk about conflict in the area. Do you think this affects the availability of milk?

P476: Yes, the conflict between farmers and herders is also a reason for this. The herders tend to assign the herding task to young children. When they are out with the animals, they find themselves at play and the animals may wander into someone’s farm land and eat up some of the food crops. This causes some disagreement and sometimes it goes so far as to seek legal redress. This really affects the farmer because the income from the lost crop will not be retrieved.

I004: How about within the family, how can this conflict affect the milk production within the community?

P476: Well as a result of the conflict between the crop farmer and herder, the herder may be forced to sell off some of his animals in an attempt to reduce the number of incidences of his animals wandering onto someone else’s farm. Once the herd grows smaller, this directly impacts the family as the amount of milk also will reduce.

I004: What about the tastes and preference of milk; does this affect its consumption?

P476: I think it does because some would like it fresh while others prefer it fermented. This difference in individual tastes and preference affects the usage of milk in general.

I004: You have mentioned a couple of reasons which have affected milk supplies, which of the reasons do you think are the main one which has affected milk supply?

P476: I would say drought.

I004: How about diseases?

P476: I would put that at second or third.

I004: How about the herding methods?

P476: It is one of the reasons because if the animals do not get enough food then they cannot produce enough milk.

I004: So between the uses of old herding methods and diseases, which is a stronger factor affecting milk production? Which would you place second after drought?

P476: I think the use of old herding methods comes in second.

I004: What about diseases?

P476: I would place that as the third reason.

I004: Why do you place diseases at third?

P476: I say that because during the dry seasons there is a lot of litter all over like plastic bags which get embedded in the ground. When the wet season comes, the animals may feed on those plastic bags among the pastures.

I004: Between the shortage of nutritional supplements for the animals and conflicts between farmers and herders, which do you think is a stronger reason?

P476: I would say conflict.

I004: Why is that?

P476: I say this because when the farmer and herder collide, the herder may opt to move to prevent harm from coming to his animals and once he leaves the area with his herd there will be a reduction of milk supply in that area.

I004: Let us discuss the purchasing of food items for the home. Who buys the food in the home?

P476: The mother.

I004: What food items do you buy?

P476: Cooking oil, rice, sugar and ingredients like tomatoes, onions and carrots. I do not buy maize because I grow it on my farm.

I004: How do you come to the decisions on what exactly to buy and when?

P476: We sit together as a family, my husband and I agree on items we need to replenish for the month.

I004: Who makes the final decisions on the items which will be bought?

P476: It is I, the mother.

I004: When you were young living with your parents were you involved in the discussion on food items to buy?

P476: The discussion was between my parents, they would involve the children perhaps in sending them to go and buy some of the items but the decision had already been made by the parents.

I004: And when you were young, what foods were available in the market?

P476: I would say food items like tomatoes; maize was also sold in the market. Also vegetables like eggplant, fruits also were sold like pears and apples.

I004: How about now since you moved here to Kibaya, what items did you find in the market?

P476: Sweet potatoes, Irish potatoes, bananas, cabbage, carrots, capsicum.

I004: And how about nowadays?

P476: All those are still available still potatoes, sweet potatoes and cassava.

I004: And how about the distance travelled to the market then when you were growing up and now? In which case did you have to travel a longer distance to get to the market?

P476: When I was younger the market was further.

I004: Okay I would like to discuss on the food items you prepare in your home for your family?

P476: I make ugali, meat, beans, sardines, boiled cassava, Irish potatoes, sweet potatoes, rice, kande and plantains.

I004: How do you determine what you will cook for your family for the day?

P476: It is mostly based on what my children like to eat.

I004: What else besides that?

P476: The tastes of food. The preferred foods are the ones I prepare more often.

I004: And what other reason?

P476: The nutritional value of certain food items.

I004: Any other reason?

P476: The availability or seasonality of food items.

I004: And what else?

P476: The ease of preparation of food items. Some foods cook faster than others and use less cooking fuel.

I004: What other reasons?

P476: Popular foods. For example children may try something somewhere and like it then come home and ask that we also prepare that food item.

I004: Any other reason?

P476: The choice to eat healthy foods.

I004: You have mentioned various factors which determine what you prepare for your family. Which do you think is the main reason?

P476: I would say availability.

I004: Why is that?

P476: Foods which are readily available will be prepared more in the home.

I004: What else?

P476: My family’s favourite foods, foods they like.

I004: What would you list as a second reason?

P476: I would say the tastes of my family. People tend to cook more of the foods they find to be tasty.

I004: A third reason?

P476: I would say ease of food preparation.

I004: Between ease of preparation and tastes which do you think is a greater factor in determining what you cook?

P476: I would say ease of preparation.

I004: Why have you placed ease of preparation as the second factor?

P476: Because its preparation takes a shorter time.

I004: If you compare the taste of foods versus popular meal items, which do you consider a stronger factor in determining what you cook for your family?

P476: I would say the popularity of foods.

I004: How about tastes, popularity of foods and nutritional value which do you think is a stronger factor among these?

P476: I would say for me nutritional value is of greater importance than the tastes or popularity of meals.

I004: Did you ever experience drought and hunger when you were young?

P476: No, I have not seen or experience that.

I004: And what about nowadays after you came to live here in Kibaya?

P476: Yes I recall in 1997 and last year.

I004: How long did it last?

P476: Almost a whole year.

I004: And the recent one, last year?

P476: From April to February this year. People were able to get a reasonable harvest this year in February after the rains.

I004: What do you think was the reason for this?

P476: The drought.

I004: What other reason besides drought?

P476: Lack of rains.

I004: What caused the food shortage last year?

P476: The lack of rains caused all this.

I004: What do you think causes the lack of rain?

P476: Environmental degradation, people cutting down forest trees and bad practices like burning areas of land.

I004: During that time, when you were young, what did people do to manage that situation?

P476: People used their earnings to buy food and I depended on salary earnings to buy foods.

I004: And what about last year, how did people manage the situation?

P476: Last year also my salary helped as well as the crops planted allowed me to bridge that gap.

I004: During the drought, how was your family’s feeding system affected? Regarding children and for adults?

P476: We would eat the same foods together; ugali, rice, kande.

I004: How many meals did you have in a day?

P476: The same, three meals a day.

I004: What about last year?

P476: The same, ugali, kande, potatoes, plantains.

I004: Before the drought hit, would you say you served more food than during the drought?

P476: No I did not reduce or increase with the changes from wet to dry season; we just consumed the same amounts of food.

I004: How did the drought affect you as a family?

P476: It affected us in that we were not able to earn additional income from the sale of various food items as we kept it for our own consumption. So we were not able to do other things we would have like to for our family.

I004: Who has been most affected by this in the family unit?

P476: The mother.

I004: Why is that?

P476: The mother had to think of ways to feed her family and think of additional nutrition supplements to ensure her family was well fed and nourished. It was up to the mother to see what to reduce or increase to balance things out. For example I had to reduce the amount of fruits.

I004: The means you had to use to manage the situation last year; how is it different from the last time there was a drought?

P476: Not really. Although it is different because last year I was smart enough to store extra food supply. Back then I did not plant so much, what I planted, harvested and stored was only enough to cover the dry season with no extra.

I004: What foods would you buy most during that period?

P476: I would say rice, cooking oil, cooking ingredients and sugar.

I004: Why would you buy those foods mostly?

P476: Because those were items I did not have on my farm, I did not plant food items to source those items.

I004: Now to my last questions. How do you convey information here in Kibaya to others say regarding nutrition, health or foods?

P476: Through reading newsletters, watching on the television and from hospital visits.

I004: Have you received any such information yourself?

P476: Yes I have received such information from reading various books, watching various programs on the television and from newsletters.

I004: How has this advice benefitted you?

P476: It has helped me in the food preparation in my home.

I004: How else has the education on health and nutrition benefitted the people here in Kibaya?

P476: It has been beneficial because it led to people eating well and being healthier and reduce the spread of diseases.

I004: How would we get more information out to more members of this community so that many more households can benefit?

P476: I think seminars in schools or in groups that would help.

I004: And what about through churches and mosques?

P476: Yes that too would be good.

I004: And how about in the hospitals?

P476: Yes this would benefit even expectant women and mothers visiting the clinics.

I004: How about radio and television?

P476: All of these are good methods to convey this information.

I004: Of the various methods we have discussed to convey this information, which would you say is the most important in terms of reaching the masses?

P476: I would say churches and mosques because most of the people frequent visit these places for worship.

I004: Which would you identify as a second method?

P476: Hospitals and health centres.

I004: And the third?

P476: In schools.

I004: And who would be the ideal person to convey this message to the people?

P476: The religious elders, doctors, nurses, teachers and village elders.

I004: Okay. I have completed my interview, thank you for your great feedback I am grateful.

P476: Thank you, I am also grateful.