Filter advice please on home made fume extractor - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: HobGoblyn
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 24, 2024, 09:07:56 pm
content: Hi all,I’m in the process of making my own fume extractor.I’ve been following the link at the bottom of this post.I have now got everything except the actual filter medium as I’m not sure the way he’s doing it is the best way?Basically it’s a deep plastic box with an in line mixed-flow fan, the exit going through the side of the box. And a smaller box that sits inside with the filter medium in.It’s just the design of this smaller box that I want advice on, the fan etc is already here, waiting to be installed.I’ve hopefully set the link to 19:36 where he shows how he does the filter.He uses two 30mm thick cooker hood filters on a cardboard gasket and covers the entire box with white wadding type stuff.I was thinking that instead of cooker hood filters with cardboard gasket etc, permanently installing something like a couple of 200mm (8”) flanges (or smaller, maybe 150mm/6”) , like in the below pic, but ones that allow me to put in metal mesh at the bottom of the flange.Then I could simply fill with loose activated carbon and cover with hepa filter sheet?I’d imagine in the long run this would work out a lot cheaper as those 30mm thick filters in the YouTube vid are around £10 each + delivery and activated carbon for aquariums can be bought fairly cheaply?(I will also make sure a hot knife is used to cut everything so the brittle plastic doesn’t shatter/break).Anyone think my way is worse than his or can anyone think of a better way altogether? Again I’m doing it roughly how he’s done it and already have everything except the filter medium.Many thanksYouTube clip belowhttps://youtu.be/JdrFsuAcm48?si=E_gZAbo8zq3uGZqv&t=19m36s

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 24, 2024, 09:23:05 pm
content: Is he using any HEPA filtration at all? Didn't see it.I would be tempted to use an off the shelf hepa filter and not some sheet because they are pleated which will increase the surface area. But if you have a really large surface you can drape it across maybe it would be fine.The cheapest source of activated carbon is usually the grow filters you can get on amazon ($30 for ~2kg). I would avoid the pelletized fish carbon (appears to be less surface area), but if you can get the granular stuff for a similar price I'm sure its fine.

author: HobGoblyn
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 26, 2024, 08:40:31 pm
content: Do you think this will be OK?£16.50 for 2.5 kghttps://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/351226809710Thanks

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 26, 2024, 08:57:19 pm
content: Quote from: thm_w on April 24, 2024, 09:23:05 pmI second this suggestion: you want a commercial pleated filter with a quite dense, deep pleating. Rosin clogs up filters (and can be sticky, trapping other dust), so a flat filter would probably clog very quickly. Look for “deep pleat HEPA filters”.

author: shabaz
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 26, 2024, 09:31:33 pm
content: Some vacuum-cleaner filters are a decent size, I gave it a shot a while back too, I can't say I was entirely happy with it all (it was a bit experimental; it would probably need a rebuild, with more air-tightness around the fans). I didn't complete : ( But I was happy with some aspects of it, it needed better execution. For the ingress end, I used a 3D-printed oval-shaped funnel, connected to a short length of conductive plastic hose (from eBay).

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 26, 2024, 09:35:12 pm
content: That’s tiny compared to what you want for a filter that shouldn’t make tons of noise (by needing a vacuum cleaner’s static pressure). And it has very shallow pleats.Look at this instruction sheet for an idea of the scale one wants for a large-surface (=low pressure, quiet) filter system:https://www.southernfilters.co.uk/theme-content/uploads/2017/07/unpack-hepa-filter-1.pdf(No, you don’t need one quite that big. But closer to that than to PC fan size.)

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 26, 2024, 09:43:53 pm
content: Quote from: HobGoblyn on April 26, 2024, 08:40:31 pmLooks goodQuote from: shabaz on April 26, 2024, 09:31:33 pmTooki beat me to it. Your construction looks very good but, the vacuum these filters are from is probably using a 500W+ centrifugal motor. Those 3 axial fans you have most likely aren't powerful enough in comparison. You could 10x the surface area of that HEPA filter and greatly decrease the pressure needed, which might make those fans usable (depends on their static pressure rating, if its from a PC they are probably no good).Also that mesh carbon filter is near useless. Get some granulated media in a mesh bag if you can.

author: shabaz
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 26, 2024, 09:55:08 pm
content: I used 120mm fans (since I had a load of them) and had to use 4 of them I think, to work through that filter!). A larger filter and different (and larger fan) topology for that sounds very sensible.Also you're right on the noise (I was hoping to put it under the desk with just the ingress hose exposed, but it's still unnecessary sound that could be solved by better design). Also needed a soft-start (I used extremely crude series resistors shorted out by MOSFET delayed by RC circuit) since the fans have so much demand on start-up. I definitely would scale it up and do things differently if I were to do it again.

author: HobGoblyn
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 29, 2024, 06:35:13 pm
content: Many thanks everyone. Having trouble finding a pleated HEPA filter that will fit my design (which is strongly based on the YouTube vid I linked to in my OP)The actual pics below are from the YouTube vid.My base/ bottom box will look almost identical as per his pic hereThe top box with the filter media sits in the bottom box like thisHe’s used off the shelf carbon filters like thisI’m using something like the pic in my OP, probably 8” / 200 mm in diameter, with mesh at the bottom so I can fill with my own loose carbonHere’s a not at all to scale drawing of the top boxSo I’m going to have 8” / 200mm diameter filters and the maximum height of the box is 6 1/4” / 160mmIt will have a lid on it something like thisSo in reality I need a round pleated HEPA filter just over 8” / 200mm in diameter but no higher than 6” / 150mmI’ve found these, do people think they will be any good? I’ll need to block the tops off so all air is pulled through them.https://www.amazon.co.uk/SPARES2GO-Hepa-Filter-Dyson-Purifier/dp/B07H2XDDZP/ref=asc_df_B07H2XDDZP/?The whole point of building my own fume extractor is because to me, around £500 for a half decent one is too expensive for what it is.So far I’ve spent £15 on the 2 boxes, around £20 on hoses and grill, £50 on fan and around £10 on other bits like sealant.That comes to £95 and all I need to buy apart from filter media are the 8” / 200mm round inserts as per my original post. Can’t see them costing more than £20 for the pair, so £115 plus filter media.Ordered 2.5kg activated carbon for £16.50, if those HEPA filters are suitable then another £39A bit better than around £500 plus for a decent one, that’s presuming it works just as wellI don’t solder all the time but have health issues with lungs hence don’t want to inhale any fumes

author: HobGoblyn
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 22, 2024, 09:30:46 pm
content: Hmm, I’ve put it together except for the filter media and sadly it’s not sucking anywhere near as much as I had imaginedWithout the lid, if I cover up the two holes, it does seem to be sucking okayish but I expected it to be much more powerful.With the lid on there’s hardly any suction through the lids hole (don’t forget, this is without any charcoal or HEPA filters) I suspect the lid needs a better way of sealing to the other box.Hoped that maybe the motor was wired up to a slow speed, but no luck, there’s an L1 that’s fitted in a way with a bit of plastic on the case meaning it can’t be used. I did try ignoring this and wiring up to L1, exactly the same speed so put it back to L2.Motor claims to be:“ Up to 280 m3/hour extract airflow rate with a high pressure mixed flow impeller.”Here’s pics so farBottom box with motor in itTop box without filter mediaA close up of one of the filter media holders in the top boxThe lid that I suspect isn’t sealing properly as virtuous suction in the holeAnd just in case anyone’s interested, a pic of the motor wiring

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2024, 09:41:38 pm
content: I don't think that lid is a good airtight seal?Intake hole could be a bit small too, how big is it?

author: HobGoblyn
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 23, 2024, 10:53:10 pm
content: Thanks, I was thinking the same about the lid, am pondering various ideas, maybe buy a D shaped rubber draught excluder roll, and use small clamps all round it to hold it shut.Hole is 50mm / 2”Can easily be widened, bought this to go from lid to workbench, didn’t cost much so if I need a bigger option, should be easy to achievehttps://www.justkampers.com/028129087f-fresh-air-hose-silver-vw-beetle-1961-on-vw-t2-split-1961-1967-vw-t2-bay-1600cc-1967-1979.html

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 23, 2024, 11:09:14 pm
content: 50mm is the same as the older unit Dave was using and the Vevor unit I have. Might be ok.Maybe generate some smoke to see the drafts on the side, if any? Or just test the unit on the bench.Kind of hard to say if the suction is good or not just by feel.

author: HobGoblyn
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 19, 2024, 11:20:44 am
content: Another quick question.Round charcoal filters for cooker hood extractors are around £8 each.A pack of ten 1cm thick activated carbon filters for compost bins is £10 for 8I presume activated carbon is activated carbon so the cheaper ones should be fine?https://www.amazon.co.uk/Compost-Filters-Activated-Charcoal-Universal/dp/B09F65PNL3/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?https://www.amazon.co.uk/SPARES2GO-Charcoal-compatible-HJA2180-HJA2230/dp/B0CMXRWXFY/ref=sr_1_25?

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 19, 2024, 10:32:18 pm
content: Quote from: HobGoblyn on June 19, 2024, 11:20:44 amFirst link, worthless.Second link, near worthless, very small amount of carbon in there.Activated carbon is activated carbon to some degree, surface area is important (capture efficiency) and total mass is important (capture amount). You can only capture so much before the media needs to be replaced or heated to recharge.If you are going to use carbon there is no point unless you get a good amount of the stuff, IMO. Otherwise just don't bother.1kg can be had for $10-15. The ones you linked are like 30g worth.

author: Ian.M
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 19, 2024, 10:57:26 pm
content: I cant help thinking that unless you need a portable setup and don't have an opening window all the effort put into DIYing solder fume 'extractors' that vent back to the room would be better put into fume extraction to the outside air, using an ordinary kitchen or bathroom inline duct fan. If there is too much temperature differential to outdoor ambient use a DIY air to air heat exchanger (e.g.https://makezine.com/projects/heat-exchanger/). If possible make the vent permanent, otherwise make a board to carry the duct outlet to fit in the opening of your part-open window, with matching latches to secure it, and foam draft-seal tape on the edges.

author: HobGoblyn
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 23, 2024, 03:31:16 pm
content: Quote from: thm_w on June 19, 2024, 10:32:18 pmThanksI put in activated carbon. Initially I put about 2.5 cm / 1" deep in and it wouldn't suck in the smoke, I had to reduce it to 1cm to get it to work.

author: HobGoblyn
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 23, 2024, 03:34:24 pm
content: Quote from: Ian.M on June 19, 2024, 10:57:26 pmIt's a small upstairs front bedroom in a mid terrace house, plus I live in a very windy area. Last thing I want are the fumes going out my wall and blown into next doors window