A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: dmcdonald
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: February 04, 2019, 07:20:32 am
content: https://www.gizmodo.com.au/2019/02/crypto-exchange-says-it-cant-repay-262-million-to-clients-after-founder-dies-with-only-password/amp

author: RoGeorge
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 04, 2019, 07:36:06 am
content: Well, time to de-dust my vintage quantum computer, and let it run KEyExtrc.qb for a couple of minutes.Muaahahaha!

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 04, 2019, 07:46:00 am
content: The article should be"Canadian crypto exchange QuadrigaCX found to be grossly negligent after discovery only one person knew the password to $262 million in crypto currency.

author: Marco
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 04, 2019, 08:11:24 am
content: So they employed one technical expert to try to access a laptop, to retrieve a fucking quarter billion? And he died in India? Where is the bitcoin address for their cold storage? Why don't they just throw the specs of the laptop and encryption on the internet and offer a 10 Million bounty?Yeah, sure.

author: Red Squirrel
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2019, 03:44:14 pm
content: Had an account there, thankfully not much funds. Don't remember how much, maybe like 10-20 bucks worth at most. Too bad though, it was one of the few Canadian exchanges. Most of them are American.It's crazy it was on a laptop of all things. I bet there was no raid or backups. Accident waiting to happen. Should have had it on a home server with proper backups, at the very least. Ideally air gaped. Maybe a backup in a safety deposit box too.Not that any of that would have prevented this particular incident though but could have had the unlock info in his will.Will be interesting to see how this unfolds though, as it does seem all very fishy and the death may actually be faked. Supposedly there is a place in India that will help fake your own death. Interesting speculations on the quadrigacx and quadigacx2 subreddits.

author: Stray Electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2019, 09:22:04 pm
content: With the possibility that the users will lose 262 Million in income and various governments losing the tax due on 262 Million of income, I would think that many governments would launch a federal investigation into whether this might be part of a scam operation. But the real question to me is whether the 262 was real physical money or just paper profits on much less. Real money doesn't just disappear, somebody somewhere has it. Paper "profits" on the other hand....Hey I have an idea. All of you send me $1. In return I will promise you a profit of $262 million. But if I die first or if I forget some mythical password, you're all screwed. Get the idea?

author: metrologist
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2019, 10:30:50 pm
content: I thought crypto currency had real value in its space.Anyway, this guy probably went to India to fake his death and is probably hiding it out somewhere.I also thought crypto was serialized in every transaction so that its entire history could be tracked?

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2019, 11:48:13 pm
content: Coins can be sent to a mixer service where they will transact with other members' wallets in random manner so tracking becomes very difficult if possible at all.

author: RoGeorge
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2019, 07:15:31 am
content: Quote from: Stray Electron on February 08, 2019, 09:22:04 pmAFAIK, there is no such thing like real physical money, and this is so for a very, very long time.Back in the days there was a time when money bills were backed by gold reserves, or maybe by other physical goods. Not any more. Now, governments are simply printing money when they think so.Money is nothing but trust in the current world, current power and current govs. So, I'll say no, those were no physical money. Just numbers, like any other type of nowadays money.Roosvelt started typing extra money, and Nixon made it final:http://mentalfloss.com/article/12715/why-did-us-abandon-gold-standard.Those were hard times back then, not judging the past, just saying we are living in an era of economic trust.Money is volatile. Cryptocurrency is even more volatile.

author: chickenHeadKnob
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2019, 07:18:18 am
content: There never was a cold wallet as described in these stories, hence there is no wallet address to track on the block chain. Quadriga was an embezzlement scam from the outset. A co-founder and significant shareholder was Michael Patryn alias Omar Dhanani convicted fraudster. Very likely all crypto on Quadriga was moved from Quadriga's hot wallet(s) to wallets kept on other exchanges, like Bitfinex, huobi, kraken ect. On a continual basis. Spent and gambled away, in a kind of fractional reserve banking scam.reddit official Quadriga column, moderated by someone at Quadriga:https://www.reddit.com/r/QuadrigaCX/reddit unofficial column:https://www.reddit.com/r/QuadrigaCX2/excellent youtube reviews:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xfoZewsUWo&feature=youtu.be

author: Stray Electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2019, 12:00:32 am
content: Quote from: RoGeorge on February 09, 2019, 07:15:31 amPoint taken but paper dollars (or Pounds, Yen, etc) still have a physical presence and are always going to be worth whatever the US Dollar is worth in the world market. OTOH a number on a computer screen from someone like Quadriga or Bitcoin has no inherent value what so ever and never has. It's only worth what ever value someone else thinks that it's worth and is willing to give you paper dollars in exchange for. If no one thinks that it's worth anything than it's worth zero regardless of how large the numeric number is. It's only the power ofbeliefin the value of virtual currency that makes it worth anything and how anyone can believe in a virtual company that exist only in the cloud of the internet and with no physical presense or assets is beyond me.The entire reason that paper currency still has "value" even though it is no longer baked by gold is that it established avaluein the economic marketplace when it was backed by gold and it still retains that "value" even after the gold reserves were removed. Not every currency was able to retain it's value against other currencies so they have fallen when compared to others. The most widely known example was the value of the Germany Mark in the 1930s. Today's Venezuela is rapidly heading down the same path.Pretty much everyone, worldwide, has confidence in US Dollars and will accept them. Quadriga and othervirtual currency, not so much.

author: sokoloff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2019, 01:38:01 am
content: http://dayssinceacryptocurrencyexchangehaslostmorethan100million.com/

author: Dave
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2019, 01:14:03 pm
content: Quote from: Stray Electron on February 10, 2019, 12:00:32 amSo you're saying that it's only the power ofbeliefin the value of fiat currency that makes it worth anything, gotcha.

author: MT
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2019, 03:35:44 pm
content: One solar storm strong enough and all your bitcoins are gone while gold stays and remains in its shape where it is.Quote from: Stray Electron on February 10, 2019, 12:00:32 amyou rely buy into bitcoin/dollar banksters official constructed explanation. Notice how loads of folks labels thislatest bitcoin fraud in "million of dollars"! So there you go Bitcoin isn't a currency, but dollar are yet both is systematized ponzi like scams.I leave you pondering over why numerous countries repatriating their gold reserves from US and UK and why there is so much fuzz about it for the past 5-6 years also on why China, Russia and other has been stock piling gold for a decade at least and why Europa is starting up their own Swift while everyone else is doing their best to abandonUS dollar toilette paper. US have national debt of 23 trillion, will they pay? of-course not, so what can they do except hard reset, so US as of today is already bankrupt while FED continues print toilette paper as crazy's.Interesting to see in reality it is to increase a nations debt, some paper, ink and men in suits, and there you go!

author: Red Squirrel
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2019, 07:43:57 pm
content: Quote from: sokoloff on February 10, 2019, 01:38:01 amNow that is pretty funny lol.I kinda want to look at what it takes to run an exchange... I feel I would do a better job than half of these operations because my motive would not be corruption. I imagine it would be decently profitable to run one without having to be corrupt or negligent.

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 16, 2019, 03:15:37 am
content: Seems a perfect scam...Quotehttps://www.halifaxtoday.ca/local-news/details-emerging-about-gerald-cotten-the-young-founder-of-quadrigacx-1233825No offices, no employees, no regulations. Single laptop, single owner, run out of a home office.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 16, 2019, 03:32:32 am
content: It's remarkable how many cryptocurrency exchanges face unlikely and mysterious external conditions which render them unable to pay out the vast wealth they're holding for the rightful owners.

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 16, 2019, 03:43:23 am
content: Yes possibilities are endless. Forgotten password, failed hard drive that had no backup, hacker erased the data, the dog ate the paper with the cold storage keys, etc.And noone has seen the dead founder body yet BTW.

author: sokoloff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 16, 2019, 12:59:28 pm
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on February 16, 2019, 03:32:32 amYes, it seems like an extraordinarily difficult business...

author: rsjsouza
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 16, 2019, 01:14:24 pm
content: Quote from: RoGeorge on February 09, 2019, 07:15:31 amYou are talking about two different things:physical moneyandmoney value. The latter is what you are talking about in the rest of your post.Physical money exists: having a chest of US$100.00 bills is real and can be exchanged anywhere with very little difficulty.Having US$260M in a pendrive or in the computer screen of your bank account website is what is perceived as real but loses value as soon as the password is lost or the bank goes bankrupt or other scenarios: war, government seizure, economic crash, etc. (I have been through the latter two scenarios)

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 16, 2019, 02:55:48 pm
content: Quote from: rsjsouza on February 16, 2019, 01:14:24 pmGood luck spending that "physical money" when it's in a practically unbreakable vault.

author: rsjsouza
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 16, 2019, 11:07:58 pm
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on February 16, 2019, 02:55:48 pmMy post talks about any virtual representation of "physical money", which surely can be stored in an almost unbreakable vault. Actual physical money... Not so much.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 16, 2019, 11:32:53 pm
content: Quote from: rsjsouza on February 16, 2019, 11:07:58 pmUse any other comparison, like the paint they use to mark stolen bills. I'm simply illustrating the perceived difference isn't there. We're just more used to fiat money. Paper money is as much a representation of value as a blockchain stored on a drive is.

author: rsjsouza
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 17, 2019, 12:24:49 pm
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on February 16, 2019, 11:32:53 pmNo disagreement there, but you are talking about the value of money while I am talking about liquidity. And that is the caution I made in my original reply to RoGeorge's post. Your original post indicates the liquidity of "physical money bills" is equal to a criptocurrency or other representation. Being pragmatic, this is not simply a perceived difference; it was decided by international agreement that FIAT money carries value and was defined as the basis for goods exchange in intranational and international exchanges.I am not talking about the value money has in the act of goods exchange: I surely know in practice that FIAT money can be equally worthless or valued depending on the conditions (war, famine, transnational exchanges, etc).

author: edy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2019, 12:49:26 am
content: I keep hearing the terms cryptocurrency and block chain being thrown around in the media and everyone and their grandmother seems to be in on some kind of get rich scheme. My limited understanding of it is that while block chain technology has usage in many industries (one of which happens to be cryptocurrency) it does not necessarily validate or give credence to cryptocurrency as a stable, reliable, "secure" means of financial exchange. There are huge differences between what we use as money, even though it is a "fiat" currency as well (now far removed from the gold-backed treasury systems of yester-year), and cryptocurrency, with enormous risks found in the latter which are obviously downplayed by people rushing into this area looking to make big bucks in speculative investments... nothing more than the next derivative market, and I use the term "legalized" loosely when I say legalized gambling.For one, if you managed to get in on Bitcoin early enough, your "money" was really created on the backs of algorithms... computing cycles to fabricate and then lock in (as part of the block chain) the bitcoins. It was this "work" and difficulty and limited pool of bitcoin (which is harder and harder to calculate) that gave it value. After that, the entire value of bitcoin jumped exponentially due to people jumping in on the bandwagon speculating and not wanting to waste the resources needed to compute further bitcoin. Every cryptocurrency seems to start this way. As long as you have enough people believing this and treating it like money, it behaves that way (much like our little paper or plastic bills we carry around). However without major adoption by governments and all the legal protections, banking rules, financial oversight and controls that real money has, it will always fall short and be nothing more than a highly volatile "currency" and as such will result in continuing to be that way. Chicken-egg problem.Now I have nothing against cryptocurrrency as long as people are aware of what they are getting into. It also doesn't help its reputation when malware and crypto-jacking today scams people into buying cryptocurrency or hijacks your computing cycles to create more crypto for hackers or advertising agencies... much of it to avoid tracking for illegal purposes. I do find the idea interesting as a means for publishers to get paid for their content (by you donating some of your computing power in generating cryptocurrency for the site). However what we have today is a crazy market where you hear $300,000,000 worth of bitcoin lost... what does that even mean? Poof it's gone... but if it was just artificially created value which speculators drove up into the clouds, how do you equate this with real value?Anyways, just my two cents. I also contemplated running some cryptominers but realized it wasn't economical for me and when you have Chinese farms mining for next to nothing and cashing in on millions in illicit operations and hackers contributing to the rise in values by hording or holding people hostage by demanding they trade real cash for bitcoin (driving the "value" up) I just don't see this as an alternative at this time. Perhaps the entire system needs to mature a few more years and get through some major upsets before the masses trust it. Until then I am keeping far far away but keeping a keen interest in this.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2019, 12:57:01 am
content: Quote from: rsjsouza on February 17, 2019, 12:24:49 pmTry paying with Yen or Turkish Lira in the US, or any similar country and currency switcharoo. Or even try paying with the right currency cash in a card only place. It's probably easier to use that cryptocurrency. Internationally the latter may even be more universal than most fiat currencies.

author: rsjsouza
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2019, 09:54:57 pm
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on February 18, 2019, 12:57:01 amOk, last one on this from me.Quote from: rsjsouza on February 17, 2019, 12:24:49 pm

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2019, 10:04:46 pm
content: Quote from: rsjsouza on February 18, 2019, 09:54:57 pmThe conclusion is that it depends on the circumstances, in both cases.

author: Deodand2014
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 08, 2019, 09:02:42 am
content: And it looks like the cryptomoney has 'disappeared'...Quotehttps://www.gizmodo.com.au/2019/03/crypto-exchange-says-its-founder-died-with-clients-180-millionbut-the-money-is-missing/

author: macboy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 08, 2019, 04:27:38 pm
content: Quote from: sokoloff on February 10, 2019, 01:38:01 amBased on that, there are certainly a few people in the world making their mega fortunes in crypto, but it's not so much the miners or traders. It's the scammers who perpetrate these 'accidental' blunders causing multiple $100M to be 'lost'.

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 08, 2019, 05:44:52 pm
content: Seems they found the cold wallets but all of them are empty. So the passwords that only the dead CEO knew do not matter.https://www.halifaxtoday.ca/local-news/search-into-missing-cryptocurrency-turns-up-empty-cold-wallets-report-1268687

author: Marco
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 08, 2019, 05:54:09 pm
content: Ernst and Young seems pretty capable in cryptocurrency, of course they are going to eat up most of the recoverable money, but still.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 08, 2019, 05:56:18 pm
content: Quote from: Bud on March 08, 2019, 05:44:52 pmEmpty so far. I wouldn't get my hopes up, but still.

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 25, 2019, 09:59:43 pm
content: When it comes to crypto currency, if you want it safe you have to store it yourself.Only you can decide just how safe you want it to be.If you let someone else decide how safe they want your money to be then you cant be surprised when this sort of thing happens.

author: windsmurf
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 25, 2019, 11:33:30 pm
content: Quote from: Psi on June 25, 2019, 09:59:43 pmMany believe he faked his own death in India and made away with cash.https://www.theverge.com/2019/6/24/18715959/quadrigacx-canadian-cryptocurrency-exchange-report-founder-transferred-money-spending

author: Stray Electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 26, 2019, 12:40:31 am
content: Well so much for the idea that crypto currencies are secure! Anyone that puts their money into a crypto currency after this needs to have their head examined.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 26, 2019, 12:49:29 am
content: Quote from: Stray Electron on June 26, 2019, 12:40:31 amThat's like claiming paper money isn't secure after you gave a stack of it to that mysteriously successful uncle and he made it disappear.

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 26, 2019, 12:54:28 am
content: Evidently, from this case, cryptocurrency is secure. Do not confuse security with mismanagement. What happened was a case of lack of proper key management.I find it amusing that noone saw the dead body. No grave, no photos from the funeral, no documents of transferring the body from India to Canada (he was not buried in India, was he). Even more amusing is that noone seem to be doing investigation into this aspect.Edit: at least i have not seen any evidence.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 26, 2019, 01:07:09 am
content: Quote from: Stray Electron on June 26, 2019, 12:40:31 amCrypto currencies are just as secure as cash. If you give the cash to someone else to hold/manage then, well...It's trivial to get your own hardware wallet and store your crypto in that, then no one can steal it unless they physically have your hardware wallet and code, or your backup paper code.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 26, 2019, 01:15:03 am
content: Quote from: Bud on June 26, 2019, 12:54:28 amI think people smelled a rat right away.

author: AlbertL
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 29, 2021, 12:00:17 pm
content: The last time money disappeared from my conventional bank account is...let me check...seems like...apparently...never!

author: sokoloff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 29, 2021, 01:00:18 pm
content: Quote from: AlbertL on September 29, 2021, 12:00:17 pmAre you not married?