Beginners, say hello to DS212 ($89 open source 1Mhz STM32 Color Pocket Scope) - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / beginners

author: Cliff Matthews
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 15, 2017, 02:49:58 am
content: Banggood favors this fun German blogger, I can't imagine the freebies he gets.. This looks like a winner.https://www.banggood.com/MINI-DS212-Digital-Storage-Oscilloscope-Portable-Nano-Handheld-Bandwidth-1MHz-Sampling-Rate-10MSas-p-1202288.html*edit - They've dropped the price to $89 for now (same as the JYE's plastic tiny touch screen DSO112A)

author: xani
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 15, 2017, 04:25:43 am
content: .... why? beginners would benefit more from used $50-100 analog scope or one of those USB scopes.Sure it can have some niche uses, especially with software open and all but, as one that had one of first versions of it as "first scope", would not recommend it as first scope.

author: Cliff Matthews
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 15, 2017, 12:51:09 pm
content: Not saying it 's better than a used CRO, but as a parent I'm aware of what appeals to our latest crop of hobbyists.- It looks like a phone and it's black, so it fits trends- It's got a metal case, so the iphone crowd will notice- Like Minecraft, you'll be able to get OSS "mods" for it- It's at the right price point: "Awe mom! it'snot evena hundred bucks.."- Big sell: They don't like math (my sons hate counting divisions.. "dad, that's so old school")- Sig-gen and as shown a small arb-gen is possibleFrom DSO138, to DSO-shell and now this... but there is a progression. Maybe not this model (I don't think those encoders will last 3-months) but they are getting closer.

author: TomS_
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 15, 2017, 12:58:53 pm
content: Quote from: Cliff Matthews on November 15, 2017, 12:51:09 pmForm over function .. kids these days

author: kalel
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 15, 2017, 01:06:04 pm
content: "Real" (faster, larger) oscilloscopes start at $200+. Okay, the first I found is the $270 Hantek 100MHz 1GSa/s DSO5102P. I have no idea if it's any good, but the sample rate difference is much larger than the price difference and it looks good (to a novice like me).So if it was supposed to be a first oscilloscope (to beat the USB ones starting at $50), it does need to be either cheaper than it is (to have a comparable price) or have some better specs in my opinion.I'd be happier to see the next DSO138 "step up" at a similar price point (either official or from someone else).

author: Peabody
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 15, 2017, 02:47:48 pm
content: It's nice that it has two whole channels. :-) But I don't think the price needs to be that high just for that. I would bet you that JYE Tech will have a two-channel version of the Shell in due course for a lot less than $100.

author: Cliff Matthews
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 15, 2017, 05:09:07 pm
content: Quote from: Peabody on November 15, 2017, 02:47:48 pmHope you're right, novice's can benefit from heathy competition.*Now if only RD Tech can iron-out the kinks in their power supply's, Dave could update the "Build an Electronics Lab for $330" to even more agreeable levels. With DMM's like those made by Aneng/Kasuntest, entry level could drop to $250.*edit - I forgot it was "Electronics Lab for $330" not $300

author: xani
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 16, 2017, 12:33:24 am
content: The only niche I can see for those is either something you carry with your toolbox for occasional debugging of problems, or "my desk space is really tiny and I can't have a PC near it"Quote from: Cliff Matthews on November 15, 2017, 05:09:07 pmStuff like Analog Discovery 2 seems like a better option for ~$300 budget tbh. If you do low power stuff you could probably get by with just AD2 builtin power supply. And it probably won't go obsolete once you get a "real" scope as it can still be useful (differential inputs, signal gen, spectrum analyzer etc)

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 16, 2017, 01:02:08 am
content: This little scope could likely be made for very little in parts.

author: mikeselectricstuff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 16, 2017, 01:09:43 am
content: Quote from: Cliff Matthews on November 15, 2017, 02:49:58 amBanggood offer stuff to anyone who will give them the free publicity.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 16, 2017, 02:19:11 pm
content: Its very cute and neat looking but its too slow for most of the things many people do. That said, it likely would be useful as a 2nd scope despite its speed because its battery powered and so, floating.Quote from: xani on November 16, 2017, 12:33:24 am

author: xani
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 16, 2017, 03:09:57 pm
content: Quote from: cdev on November 16, 2017, 02:19:11 pmWell apparently you can now get a differential probe for ~$150 so even that niche is shrinkinghttps://www.aliexpress.com/item/Micsig-Oscilloscope-Probe-Accessories-Parts-1300V-100MHz-High-Voltage-Differential-Probe-kit-3-5ns-Rise-Time/32828136026.html(altho common mode voltage on 50x is a bit low to make it useful in a lot of cases)

author: Cliff Matthews
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 16, 2017, 06:50:57 pm
content: Not really for beginners and you're not going to makesomeonetoo happy hereDon't tell him it's $148.However it doesn't show any CAT markings either.. Maybe that's par for the course with Micsig?.

author: xani
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 16, 2017, 11:32:54 pm
content: Quote from: Cliff Matthews on November 16, 2017, 06:50:57 pmRead the specs. 1300V is on x500, x50 is only 130V common mode (for comparision, one Dave's is stocking has 700V on both x10 and x100 (and a CAT rating).there is, of course, already a thread on ithttps://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/new-low-cost-($170)-100mhz-differential-scope-probe-from-micsig/

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 17, 2017, 03:33:36 am
content: Here is another STM32-based O-scope project.http://stm32duino.com/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=1847I'm amazed at the functionality they can extract out of these amazingly affordable boards and chips.Basically one can get pretty close to a $20 O-scope with an STM-32 and a color touch screen TFT display..

author: xani
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 17, 2017, 03:58:38 am
content: The power of open source and affordable hardware; you will get *someone* that have more time and/or knowledge than the original author and doesn't have project manager to veto every feature you want to put in the productMakes you wonder what would happen if say Rigol software was open source

author: paulca
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 17, 2017, 07:49:42 am
content: Quote from: xani on November 17, 2017, 03:58:38 amCorporations be all like:

author: Kjelt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 17, 2017, 09:48:49 am
content: If it had a touchscreen it could have been a nice roomcontrol or display device to put your own code in.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 17, 2017, 12:10:10 pm
content: THIS IS NOT OPEN SOURCE HARDWARE UNLESS THE PLANS, FIRMWARE, ETC ARE ONLINE AD PUBLISHED UNDER AN OPEN SOURCE LICENSE SO PEOPLE CAN BUILD ONE THEMSELVES.Are they, if so, where?

author: mikeselectricstuff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 17, 2017, 01:41:58 pm
content: Quote from: cdev on November 17, 2017, 12:10:10 pmDid anyone claim it was open source hardware ?The firmware is, which is by far the most useful thing to publish.http://www.minidso.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=1816Nobody is going to bother building one - schematic might be useful but this thing looks simple enough to work out anything you really need to.

author: jaromir
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 17, 2017, 02:10:33 pm
content: Quote from: cdev on November 17, 2017, 12:10:10 pmManufacturer's site contains firmwarehttp://minidso.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=1816&extra=page%3D1%26filter%3Dtypeid%26typeid%3D112It's not released under any particular open-source license, as many Chinese folks don't have time to play those games.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 17, 2017, 03:35:36 pm
content: The price seems low enough so that its quite attractive to buy.Ive seen a bunch of STM32 scope projects and some of them are quite nice. The cost of some STM32 boards is very low. So the possibility definitely exists to build one's own or something quite similar.Quote from: mikeselectricstuff on November 17, 2017, 01:41:58 pm

author: Cliff Matthews
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 17, 2017, 04:36:59 pm
content: Quote from: mikeselectricstuff on November 17, 2017, 01:41:58 pmI'd say some misinformation in the video? at 42 sec. ("this one's completely open source")https://youtu.be/lxxS6rvrk3o?t=41I'm not sure who minidso.com is, but the OEM could be Sainsmarthttps://www.sainsmart.com/collections/tools-instruments/products/dso212-2-ch-handheld-mini-digital-oscilloscopehttps://www.sainsmart.com/collections/tools-instruments/products/dso212-2-ch-handheld-mini-digital-oscilloscope

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 17, 2017, 07:05:16 pm
content: QuoteI don't think so but they may be re-selling them. You have to watch Sainsmart, they pirated the DSO138 for instance.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 17, 2017, 07:50:18 pm
content: Quote from: TomS_ on November 15, 2017, 12:58:53 pmYeah, god forbid someone pay attention to fit and finish... since we suffered with ugly, hard to use tools, so should everyone else...I think this is also the first time I’ve seen an engineer disparage somethingbecauseit’s extensible... so closed-box (like iPhone) is bad, and open-source and extensible is bad, too. Got it.

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 17, 2017, 07:55:42 pm
content: Hantek 6022BE USB scope, 20 MHz for $70.56 on Banggood. Hook it up to a laptop and you have a screen you can read.

author: Cliff Matthews
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 17, 2017, 08:27:18 pm
content: Quote from: tooki on November 17, 2017, 07:50:18 pmI think it's just the dry German humor, at 43 seconds he sounds in favor of open source (of course, the Chinese makers will say almost anything to sell something..). His remark, "what seals the deal is the OS firmware", so that's also in favor and the snake game (although true) was just more humor. I will post a schematic if I can get one.

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 18, 2017, 12:27:41 am
content: This one has a casehttps://www.aliexpress.com/item/CCDSO-Mini-Digital-Oscilloscope-DS212-DSO212-Thumb-Wheel-1MHz-8MB-LCD-Display-Handheld-Pocket-Osciloscopio-Silicone/32834287981.htmlAmazon has only one two star reviewhttps://smile.amazon.com/YKEY-Original-Portable-Handheld-Oscilloscope/dp/B0741BNCTT/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1510964301&sr=8-2&keywords=dso212+oscilloscope&dpID=41KTfCeAuGL&preST=_SY300_QL70_&dpSrc=srchThey said it was because the traces cannot be separated. Could not find a video that mentioned this but from what I can see, they can be separated. Why would someone design it otherwise?

author: Cliff Matthews
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 18, 2017, 01:03:04 am
content: Quote from: GreyWoolfe on November 17, 2017, 07:55:42 pmYes, prices on those are falling too. Size has to include a USB host computer (and grounding issues at times). I'd gladly swap display and thumb-wheels for control data to run over WiFi via ESP32. IMHO, it's cheaper than the LCD and the Hantek IDS1070A is a good example.

author: baltersice
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 18, 2017, 01:41:06 pm
content: Quote from: Cliff Matthews on November 17, 2017, 04:36:59 pmminiware.com is the manufacturer, minidso.com is their forum, where they i.e. release firmware sourcesQuote from: Cliff Matthews on November 17, 2017, 04:36:59 pmYes, I may have used the open source hardware logo prematurely there, because the schematics are not yet public. (But those of the older DS203 are)But the software is there and it compiles.Quote from: Cliff Matthews on November 15, 2017, 02:49:58 amMe neither tbhBG have 'adopted' me at 4k subscribers with the TS100 soldering iron and haven't stopped since.If I ever become a big deal, I will try to be more mindful about these product placement deals.But as long as I am such a small fry I'll continue to accept everything, because it's fun.

author: kalel
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 18, 2017, 02:20:43 pm
content: Just out of curiosity, when they send you random stuff with a decent value, do you have to pay some fees to receive the item (doesn't matter what the fee is exactly, simply the amount)?If so, the freebies might not be free after all. I'm not considering the work you do to make a video, since you probably accept items that you have interest in and might purchase otherwise, not items that are completely useless to you.Regarding the promotional videos, I don't think they spoil anyone's channel as long as they are done well. In case of technical reviews, it's great to still keep the review as objective as possible in addition to making it clear the item was sent by whomever sent it in order to do a promotion. So, not simply a video that keeps mentioning how great the item is but one that considers the advantages and disadvantages and the price point (you might have gotten the item for free, but is is it good value to purchase).

author: baltersice
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 18, 2017, 03:13:18 pm
content: Quote from: kalel on November 18, 2017, 02:20:43 pmOnly thing I had to pay were taxes and customs on a few rare occasions. Most expensive item yet, the laser machine, was free. I am not sure how they do it, but I think they might be working with smaller logistics companies in the EU, because I think I saw return addresses in the Netherlands oder the UK.

author: Cliff Matthews
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 18, 2017, 03:13:58 pm
content: baltersice- Thanks for the reply, it's always nice to hear from someone real working their way to the top and still enjoying it (like Dave Jones). If I can speak for many here, we wish you tremendous success on your channel (your humor and photography skills achieve professional levels to be sure).Q - We've had your YT channel listed for a while, but may we add your member name to our Youtubers list?

author: baltersice
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 18, 2017, 04:50:01 pm
content: Yes, of course you can add it!

author: soubitos
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 18, 2017, 05:19:49 pm
content: It sells for the very low price of €488.73 on gearbest.... wtf? is it a different version or they price it wrong? I told them this model sells for 80-110$ tops (those are the prices i see around) and am curious to see what they will do