Replacing Keysight MSOX3024T - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: GlowingGhoul
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 03:54:48 pm
content: Back on the market for a high-quality 200mhz mixed signal scope after mine was destroyed in a n accident. I'm surprised no new high-quality alternatives seem to have been developed after all these years.Am I missing any alternatives that are as good as the Keysight unit? Last I checked the Chinese brands were excellent value but not as refined, but perhaps that's no longer the case. Dislike the low memory on the 3000T series, but other than that it was an excellent unit.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 07:48:47 pm
content: I'd start looking at the R&S RTB2004 / RTM3004 units. I'm also wanting to check what Yokogawa has to offer but no hands-on experience yet except for an older model.

author: javadesigner
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 08:14:16 pm
content: RTB2004 doesn't have gated measurements and (I think) the Keysight does.The RTM 3000 series might also have this capability.With gated measurements, you can measure only waveforms between (or above) some voltage level and ignore the rest.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 08:44:07 pm
content: Is active probe support required ?

author: 2N3055
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 08:52:04 pm
content: Take a look a Siglent SDS2000X+ and SDS5000X, Rigol MSO5000 (if you don't need 50 Ohm inputs), or Rigol MSO7000..If none of them satisfy you, then you have to look elsewhere...But do look at them, because they might be good enough..You can get MSOX3000T again, or R&S 2000/3000 ( make a note that even segmented memory is an option here, and it has NO search on serial protocols, despite high price).There is also unorthodox option of MSO Picoscope, a USB PC scope, that is very good for mixed signal and decoding work. Large memories, huge (even multiple ) PC monitors...

author: salvagedcircuitry
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 10:23:53 pm
content: I second trying out an RTB2004 / RTM3004, unless you get lucky scoring another MSOx3000 on the cheap off ebay.What happened to your old MSOx3024?If you don't want it, let a brotha know

author: TheSteve
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 04:17:47 am
content: Just how destroyed was it? I've fixed stuff that had holes drilled through it and/or was hammered to remove chips/components.

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 09:32:31 am
content: Quote from: GlowingGhoul on March 31, 2021, 03:54:48 pmIt depends on what you need, really. And of course your budget.If you're keen on extreme waveform rates or want the snappy UI that so far only MegaZoom scopes provide then your only real option is another Keysight scope. Since the Infiniium-X is nearing the end of its market life there should be some good incentives, and of course there's always Keysight's used equipment store or the general 2nd hand market (you can buy a repair agreement for a used scope which is essentially like warranty, and it's not even overly expensive).If you're more focused on functionality then theSiglent SDS2000X+andSDS5000Xare very good options. I only have access to a SDS5104X but that scopes compares very well against our Keysight DSO-X4104As (which are the smallest scopes we have). It has a low noise front end, lots of memory (250MPts) and tons of functionality you don't find in any other scope in this class. Bugs have been resolved quickly and Siglent appears to be very responsive to customer requests. Siglent is also working on probe adapters for LeCroy and Tektronix probes so there will be a wide range of probes that can be used with that scope. I haven't seen the SDS2000X+ that was mentioned here but since it shares the platform and many of the features of the SDS5000X it's certainly worth considering.Other options:LeCroy WaveSurfer 3000z: older Siglent hardware design using LeCroy software (XStream Lite), a good although sometimes a bit slow scope but due to its limited features and memory (20Mpts) I wouldn't recommend to buy it at this timeR&S RTB2000/RTM3000: nice scopes and if you want 10bit hardware then it's currently the only option right now, however functionality is limited, options areveryexpensive (as are active probes) unless you buy one of the bundles, and the RTB doesn't even have 50ohms inputs or active probe interfaces.Tektronix 3 Series MDO: a rehash of the old and slow MDO3000 Series which itself was based on the even older and slower MSP/DPO3000 Series, has the bonus of a separate RF port which can be used for FFT spectral analysis. Other than that it's still a very slow scope with comparably small memory (10Mpts) at high prices, with average to poor support by Tek. Unless you really want that built-in RF port I'd recommend to look elsewhere.Rigol MSO7000: good scope with lots of memory (up to 500Mpts) and a very high sample rate (10GSa/s) as well as a decent feature set (although not as expansive as the Siglent SDS5000X, which is in the same price range). Firmware appears to be pretty mature, however Rigol is generally very slow reacting to bugs so that should be kept in mind. Probe selection is limited and options like power analysis aren't always at the same level as with other scopes. Also FFT is limited to 1Mpts.Yokogawa DLM3000: nice scope which comes with a 32bit MSO option, so if you need this then the DLM3000 is a contender. It also comes with large memory 125Mpts, up to 500Mpts optional) and a nice high resolution display and some really nice functionality (e.g. search). However, Yokogawa, which only has two scope models (DLM3000 and DLM5000, both older designs based on VxWorks) in its portfolio, targets certain industrial (power electronics/automotive) industries, and that shows in these scopes' feature sets (for example, FFT is limited to 1.25Mpts only). On top of that, the probe selection is very limited, options are very expensive, and support can be slow and difficult at times (as it's Japan centric). If that's what you want then these are good scopes, but power analysis isn't unique to Yokogawa and if you don't need 32bit MSO then you're generally better off with another brand.In any case, unless you decide for another Infiniium-X I strongly recommend you try to get a loaner before you decide what to buy.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 10:18:50 am
content: For completeness: Tektronix has some newer DSO series indeed but the impression I get from people who have had one in their hand is not very good. However the firmware may have been improved in the meantime. I'd start looking at the 4 series though. Recently I bought a relatively new (as in recent design) Tektronix function generator and other than the UI being a bit clunky in places the functionality is rock solid.Either way: in this price range getting a loaner to check it out is a must.

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 10:59:00 am
content: Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on April 01, 2021, 09:32:31 amPlus there were/are special offers where you get most options for free. And, well there's a keygen for options and bandwidth. The 350MHz model can be upgrade to 500MHz, actually unofficially to 1GHz, but due to different frontend than the 500MHz/1GHz models, the bandwidth is limited to something like 750MHz.

author: Andree Henkel
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 01:01:02 pm
content: I´ve a RTA4004 350MHz it´s noise floor is less than 1/3 of DSO3034X which I used before. And has a real 500µV range. RTB2xxx is close in low noise performance. RTM should be too, but I´ve no experience with this.

author: EE-digger
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 02:18:48 pm
content: I have a 3000T series and its bigger cousin 4000A. A few years back I had Yokogawa, RS in the lab for evaluation. Tek fan for about 25 years then ditched them for Agilent / Keysight. Wasn't a fan of any of the UIs. You were always taking more steps than you would on an Agilent to get the job done.While the noise floor on the Keysight scopes is not that great, as mentioned, no one compares in the area of responsivity of the UI. On the 3000T, I think they really got it right in terms of touch sensitivity, key sizes, etc. The zone trigger, when you need it, is a thing of beauty (frequently, not always).Forgot the LeCroy I was stuck with for a year in a recent position. It was in the WaveSurfer 3000z family and a POS. Somewhat crippled in the function department. When I contacted LeCroy support, thinking I was missing (in my mind) how to access that function or measurement, LeCroy's answer was that it's a cheaper scope and doesn't have features of more expensive units.HelloWe also has $495 Rigols which would run rings around the LeCroy (in many areas). The missing function has been pretty basic fare for 10 years or more.As mentioned, the Keysight Megazoom, to the best of my knowledge, is still unmatched. This, along with the overall UI response mentioned, never makes you feel like you're waiting for a slow computer.Almost forgot ... being old school, I worship independent vertical channel controls. While the 3000T and other touch capable scopes let you move the traces at will, those with one knob thats shared kinda s-ck.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 06:49:48 pm
content: Quote from: EE-digger on April 01, 2021, 02:18:48 pmYep, the SDS2000X Plus and SDS5000X have this too....but Dual zone triggers !Set them up properly and there's nothing that get past unnoticed.