Fail safe again rain while windows are open - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / projects

author: MARCEBELE
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 23, 2024, 09:37:42 am
content: Hi all.I have a work branch in my home second floor the stairs is outside of my home, it have 3 windows, that always open, atleas 1 of them. And today I forgot to close it while there a heavy rain and flooded all my equipment.It's the 2th time it happen, so I decided to make a fail safe if incase I forgot again. Iam thinking hooking a weather resistance rolling blind to a motor of some kind, and will got triggered by a sensor in the roof if water is detectedHave anyone try this before or maybe have opinion to what material to use and how to apply it, it be much appreciated

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 23, 2024, 12:01:08 pm
content: Quote from: MARCEBELE on November 23, 2024, 09:37:42 amWhymustone be open all the time.IMHO your suggested solution is too complex and has too many failure modes. KISS!https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KISS_principleHow about having burglar alarm magnetic switches that detect when the windows and door are open. If one or more windows plus the door is open, then a light next to the door flashes. Then every time you leave the room, you will be alerted if you have left a window open. You can, of course, choose to ignore the alert.That only requires three easily available switches, an indication, a battery, and some low-voltage interconnecting wire - and it can be easily installed and removed.BTW, congratulations for mentioning not only your suggested solution, but also the problem. Far too many people askonlyabout their solution

author: MARCEBELE
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 23, 2024, 01:20:22 pm
content: I live in equator so the temp here is high and I don't have AC installed so I open the windows for air and also to push fume form solder out.I suggested using roller blind because I already installed it and i only need to make it motorized and control it, I always lock the door on my way out and if I forgot it doesn't matter, water will not splash inside because of the canopies and there a drain in the corner room if water do come inside ( there nothing in path off water and the drain ).I dont thing alarm work for me because the access to second floor is outside the house and my room, closet, food, water ,bad still inside the house I constantly going up and down and I can't keep opening and closing the windows everytime.That why I op to a more automatic approach

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 23, 2024, 02:54:26 pm
content: Quote from: MARCEBELE on November 23, 2024, 01:20:22 pmDo you need the windows open when youaren'tthere?If/when you don't want to close the windows, then just ignore the flashing light.You don't "only" need to motorise and control a roller blind. You need to reliable detect the presence and absence of water, and reliably mechanically attach a motor. Much more difficult that a simple "did you intend to leave the windows open" alarm.

author: MARCEBELE
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 23, 2024, 05:02:50 pm
content: Quote from: tggzzz on November 23, 2024, 02:54:26 pmI work from home, and so most of my time I ether on my house or on the my second floor, Reflecting on my past behavior mosh likely I will ignore the windows open warning end doesn't come back up ( exactly how my banch got floded )I go up and down more then 10times a day so yes I intend to keep it open until I come down at noon it impractical to open and close it everytime.I never work with a water detection before so it's a new territory, to get the reading off a presence of water definitely the hardest part, it need to detect water before it rain got to heavy and reliablyAs for motor mounting, the an female gear slot on the roller blind and I can 3d print the mounting for it.

author: BILLPOD
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 23, 2024, 06:38:23 pm
content: Good Morning Marcebele, I must be missing something, but with the blinds down,doesn't the rain run down the outside and drip off the bottom and down on the floor

author: inse
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 23, 2024, 06:56:21 pm
content: Some kind of spring loaded mechanism that closes the window?That only needs to be unlocked in case of moisture…

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 23, 2024, 07:04:07 pm
content: you would need the blinds to follow a cam so they end up hanging out the window on the bottom

author: ejeffrey
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 23, 2024, 08:14:21 pm
content: Skylights that work this way are pretty common. They have either moisture sensors or vibration sensors that detect rainfall and close the window. It seems like a pretty reasonable approach assuming you are comfortable with the mechanical side of getting a motor hooked up to your blind mechanism.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 23, 2024, 11:47:07 pm
content: How about add some sort of deflector to direct the rain out when the window is open? Then you can leave the window open when it's raining.

author: watchmaker
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 24, 2024, 12:40:22 am
content: Quote from: BILLPOD on November 23, 2024, 06:38:23 pmThis exactly what we do. I installed exterior solar shades to keep radiant heat out of the house (as in European awnings). tis allwas us to see outside, have windows open and does keep out the rain.

author: MARCEBELE
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 24, 2024, 05:33:57 am
content: Thankyou all for the responseI've attach how the room construction and curenly situated , this room use to be a rooftop balcony so there a drain holeUsing a shade on the double windoes will not be an option idle be too big and will interrupted my neighbor sunlight and constructing it will be difficult because there no support on the Far end. It is possible on the sigle windows I'll take that to considerationYes, the rain will go inside but there is a drain hole and the goal is to keep water away from the table it's still a winThe rain here sometime will go full blash in just 20 seconds after it start drizzling the objectives is to gave me a little bit off time to notice it raining and close the windowsI use a swing to open windows, I may also able to use on of those automatic close " door" think to close the windows, but I never seen one that programble.

author: BILLPOD
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 24, 2024, 03:03:34 pm
content: Ahhh, now I get it, MARCEBELE, I did not know that water on the floor was not an issue. From your new pictures, (from outside), it appears the single window has more of an overhang from the eaves, not that it would be much of an advantage during a driving rain. Another thought is to consider making that window swing out from the bottom, (move hinges to the top)? For me even water on the floor would be unacceptable, even though the drain hole keeps it to a minimum, I would not like to have to wear waterproof footwear indoors. I'll keep your unique problem in mind, but let us know what is the final solution that you decide on. Best of luck

author: Poroit
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 25, 2024, 04:47:34 am
content: G'day MARCEBELE,Is it the Wind that is causing the rain to blow in the window?If yes, would swapping the hinges to the other side of the window frame prevent the problem?

author: Tation
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 25, 2024, 08:40:51 am
content: Some time ago faced a similar problem. I had all blinds motorised and remotely controlled, but I was unable to locate a means to detect rain falling in a reliable and fast way. Any pointer will be appreciated (I didn't knew such vibration based method, thanks).

author: BILLPOD
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 25, 2024, 01:34:18 pm
content: Quote from: Tation on November 25, 2024, 08:40:51 amGood Morning Tation, There are motor vehicles with rain sensors that turn on the windshield wipers. Maybe you could look into incorporating those into your project.

author: inse
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 25, 2024, 06:05:37 pm
content: No, those automotive rain sensors are not suitable, they have a non disclosed digital interface and need to be mounted under a glass plane.Rain sensors for skylight or window control are available even at Amazon

author: Poroit
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 26, 2024, 03:09:09 am
content: G'day All,If MARCEBELE wants to actuate the windows, maybe use Automotive Tail Gate Actuators (ex Wrecking Yard?) combined with a Floor Water Sensor that is used under Computer Room floors.Mount the Floor Water Sensor in the Gutter (attached). It would need regular inspecting/cleaning.Actuators would look ugly in their raw state but maybe dress them up with a suitable housing.If the OP is a Raspberry Pi or Arduino fan, he may be able to build a suitable interface/controller.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 26, 2024, 03:43:06 am
content: Just install a shield to block the rain from the bench while still allowing airflow into the room. What room was that originally? The only "wet floor" design I have seen in residential are some fancy bathrooms.

author: MARCEBELE
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 27, 2024, 09:03:28 am
content: HI allthe water come inside not just because the wind but also becasue the nothing holding it back to come inside i.e its complitly open.ive decited to contol the windows instade the blind, i think it be a better solution and also not to expensivei found a suitable motor it a DC motor with a worm gear reduction, its 12V 5rpm with 18.8kgcm Torque and 65kgcm Holding Torque for 15 USD each, the down side there no encoding i have to figure our how to control the motor.my windows is 70.5 cm x 126 cm the hinge is smooth and i think if i mount the motor 5 cm form the hinge and using a 25 arm idle happly open and close the windows ( if someone can calculate the optimal posisition and arm lenght it be great)and ill attach a rail shaft guide and if my calculation is correct it will slide 10 cm from close to open positionand i need to make the arm that attach to the windows to rotate following the rail guide i still not sure how to do thatplese let me know if there something iam missing before continuing to buy the item

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 27, 2024, 09:35:35 am
content: Quote from: MARCEBELE on November 27, 2024, 09:03:28 amThere's no point in installing that untilafteryou have found areliablerain sensor.General principle... If a solution reqiures both X and Y, then try the more difficult one first. If a solution requires either X or Y, then try the easier one first.

author: MARCEBELE
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 27, 2024, 10:02:37 am
content: Yes, iam now waiting for a rain sensor to arrive i will try if the sensor can be hook on series to widened the detection area, and will let you know how it progressAlso bought a vibration sensor and will compared those 2

author: inse
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 27, 2024, 10:42:44 am
content: Why don’t you go for a linear actuator (linear motor)which could be mounted on the window frame direcltly?There are solutions for e.g. skylighths available.

author: MARCEBELE
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 27, 2024, 11:06:05 am
content: It's esthetic and costIf I use linear actuator there realy no place to hide it and I'd cost me 15 dollars more for etch one

author: Doctorandus_P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 28, 2024, 04:29:38 am
content: You could use something like some pieces of string, pulleys, a weight and a strategically placed sugar cube.

author: BILLPOD
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 28, 2024, 02:45:17 pm
content: Quote from: Doctorandus_P on November 28, 2024, 04:29:38 amGood Morning Doctorandus_P, That sounds like what MacGyver would do....and I can picture it