EE career path... - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: s.mosfet
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 29, 2012, 02:22:07 pm
content: I'm 24 years old student in electronics engineering.Shortly I'll spend 8 months at University of Cambridge (UK) for my master's degree thesis, on nanomaterials.My fear is that they are wasted months.In fact, a thesis like that could be good only for who would like to be a PhD students and a researcher, I think.But I'm afraid of low salary for researchers...Moreover, my courses path at University was based on physics devices... and not much on IC design for example.I aspire to high salaries, and a good EE career.- What do you think I should do?- What are the best competences required, and that I should have?- Do you think that I should study VHDL and IC design by myself, to get a job in a big company?thanks...

author: AndyC_772
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 29, 2012, 06:49:22 pm
content: Adding Cambridge to your CV will do you no harm at all - unless that's where you did your first degree already, of course.I actually think it's beneficial to have covered material on your degree course that's not exactly the same as what you'll be doing every day at work. You'll learn a lot from other engineers in industry, so I wouldn't worry too much about not already being familiar with how an IC is designed. Your colleagues will teach you everything you need to know about the everyday practicalities, and if you already know how a device is fabricated as well as some of the physical rules that govern its behaviour, you'll be in a great position to understand why things are done the way they are.With a sound theoretical background, you'll also be in a good position to suggest improvements, and to spot and reject bullsh*t! (Just don't be too hasty to do the latter... at least, not openly. Sometimes good engineers do stuff that seems odd for a good reason).Perhaps the decision you need to make is whether you really want to work in academia or whether you'd rather go into industry. It can be hard to switch later on. Are you more interested in how a device works, or the things that can be done with it?The skills required are very different. I studied quite a few modules on semiconductor device fabrication, so at one point (not any more!!) I could integrate the electric field across a p-n junction and calculate the forward and reverse V/I characteristics from first principles. That's great if you're working on trying to design a better kind of diode, but not really useful if all you need to do is choose between a 5p diode that might overheat and an 8p diode which won't overheat but takes up twice as much board area.I reasoned that there were a lot more engineers out there who make cool products using diodes than there are engineers actually designing new diodes. Plus I'd swear my 3rd year control theory course burned a small hole in my brain where the ability to grasp complex equations used to be, so after a 4 year MEng I couldn't wait to escape. Now I still understand (qualitatively) how stuff works, but I use simulation tools to fill in the actual numbers.If you're after a decent salary, arguably engineering isn't the best course of action either way. One thing which the engineering industry really hasn't grasped is that, if companies want to attract the best people, they need to offer salaries which don't just compete with other engineering companies - they need to compete with *all* the other companies which employ engineering graduates. So by all means sell your soul to an investment bank or a management consulting firm if you want, but you'll only have yourself to blame when you're burned out after a year and hate every minute of your working life!Really good engineers can make decent money, but do expect to have to work at it and be patient. If you don't need the security of a full-time job in one company, working on short-term contracts can still be lucrative even without the tax breaks that used to exist. But then you'll need to be flexible, maybe travel or commute further, and there will be gaps between the end of one contract and the start of the next.So, what should you do...?Do stuff that actually interests you. You'll do better at it, and your working days will go much faster.If you have the opportunity to add Cambridge to your CV, take it. *Every* potential employer will recognise it as valuable, and it'll always differentiate you from other candidates.As an interviewer for a general EE job, I personally wouldn't care what you actually studied, as long as it's in a vaguely relevant subject area (ie. electronics or physics, rather than law or history).The skill I've seen most often lacking in interview candidates isn't really a technical one at all: it's the ability to give a straight answer to a straight question. If I ask you about a subject, chances are I don't really care whether you know the subject well or not - I care whether or not you can explain what you do know with confidence and clarity. Engineers spend a lot of their time describing their work to their peers, and they often don't appreciate that the value in their work isn't necessarily what they've done - it's what they can explain to other people that they've done.If you can tell me what a diode is in 15 seconds, clearly and unambiguously, I'll be much more impressed than if you spent the last 6 months fabricating one but can't actually describe it without getting flustered and waffling.I appreciate I'm going a bit off-topic here, but my point is: don't worry too much about what people might think of the particular subjects you've studied. As long as they're reasonably technical and relevant, they'll look good on your CV and they'll get you through the door, and that's half the battle. So do what you enjoy!

author: free_electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 29, 2012, 09:59:42 pm
content: If your aspirations are high wages then you have chsen the wrong path and need to become a manager. The only way to make realnhard money in engineering is to become a product specialist in a meeded field with very few peers. Just being anpther code monkey, vhdl writer , spice operator or polygon pusher does ot get you large wads of cash. You will need motivation, hard work and essentially become a one man show that can work by himself and do a peoject end to end.Oh, and keep your know how to you.

author: slateraptor
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 29, 2012, 10:49:57 pm
content: Quote from: free_electron on August 29, 2012, 09:59:42 pmWord.

author: A-sic Enginerd
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 30, 2012, 12:37:23 am
content: I don't really recommend IC design as a field for people to go into. Especially greenhorns. It's becoming incredibly nitch. Yeah sure there will always bee a need for it, but the companies that can afford to do it these days is rapidly diminishing. Pretty soon it will be down to a number you could probably count on one hand.Now on the other hand, if your ambitions are to spend your career at the likes of Intel...knock yourself out. However, I would suggest you do lots of homework there and talk to people that are both currently working there, and have worked there and left.(it's a pretty hostile environment)

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 30, 2012, 01:27:24 am
content: Quote from: free_electron on August 29, 2012, 09:59:42 pmThis is both true and not true.As a pure engineer you can make comfortable money (more than most people in the population). Whether that is a lot of money or not enough is down to your own perceptions. Doing what you enjoy while being able to afford most sensible toys and luxuries is worth a lot to many people, and engineering fits that bill.If you want to make lots of money and you have the ability and desire, then climb the management ladder. You can do that too as an engineer. It's not only accountants that get to be CEO. To give only one example of many, consider John Browne, late of BP.As for university study, don't think if it as job training, think of it as education. If you can aspire to studying at Cambridge, you are far above the crowds of vocational job seekers out there. You can do anything you want. AndyC gave you the story and there is not much to add. You can choose your path, do what you want, and make it happen. It's all down to you.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 30, 2012, 03:52:40 am
content: Quote from: s.mosfet on August 29, 2012, 02:22:07 pmIt doesn't really mater what thesis you do, it will most likely never be useful in industry.8 months is nothing, it'll fly by, and as Andy said, it's won't do your resume any harm.QuoteThere can be more money in IC design (relative to general engineering) if you are good enough, and manage to get one of the few jobs around.What should you do?Do whatever youlikedoing and have an interest in.Dave.

author: free_electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 30, 2012, 04:34:49 pm
content: Quote from: IanB on August 30, 2012, 01:27:24 amTrue. From perception hard money is someone making 250k$ a year or more. Ain't gomna find that in engineering. You'll have to be a super guru to get there. Manager ? No problemo.Comfortable money. Perfectly doable. Although that is still relative too. Depends on geography. In th valley most engineering jobs begin at around 75k$ a year. To some that may sound like a lot but knowing your rent is 2500$ to 3000$a month ... It ain't that much ... An experienced engineer can easily top 100k a year. Be good amd you will jump the 125k barrier. Be really good and you will pass the 150k mark. Tack on a specialty with little competition and the 200k mark approaches.... And thats where the technical ladder peters out ... Its management or bullshittery (marketing and sales) after that. The 125k mark is already the 1-percentile .. The 150k mark is a 0.1 percentile and The 200k mark.. You'll have to be Jim williams or Bob Pease material ....The other problem s that, if you are only focused on the $$$$ you will never get into that peak area. If you treat it as a job but have no passion for it... Forget it. You will fall by the wayside. Simply because competition is fierce and it is not a competition at all. It's performance , know-how and capability.If you are not genuinely interested in what you do , eat , breathe and live the stuff ... Forget it. Because only those guys rise to that level. Once you hit the 100k mark it is the results you deliver that matter. And once in a lifetime shots don't count. You'll have to deliver over and over to move on. And the timespan between rising to the next level can be long.... Very long.So if you are doing it only for the money you will be stressed out and burn up very quickly. The other failing point wil be your inability of keeping up on a technical level. Stuff moves fast these days and keeping up is a full time thing that absorbs another 4 to 5 hours a day besides you 9 to 5 job ..So that' why i said that going into engicneering for the money is a path to failure.You go into it out of pure interest. The money will follow over time, but is not the driving goal. The driving goal is the chance to make thing, create and improve and if you are really good even put a dent in the univers.

author: T4P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 30, 2012, 05:49:17 pm
content: At least where i am it's prudent to "shift" companies every 3 years.Tip : Never ever trust any employer unless you wouldn't really want to hop over to another company (That you specialise in)