Need Oscilloscope Advice (Philips PM3055) - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / beginners

author: jyaan
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 17, 2012, 09:16:23 pm
content: I've found someone locally who has a new (?? thought these were made in the '80s ??) Philips PM3055 60Mhz oscilloscope with a hardshell case for $149. I would probably try to talk him down on the price a bit (might not be able to, I don't know). Is this worth pursuing in the first place? Anyone have experiences to share about this model or even just Philips scopes in general? Anyways, $149 seems sort of high since I've seen them on ebay going for that price with "buy it now" (unless it is actually brand new -- which I think is really unlikely). I was able to find a service manual pretty easily, but I don't know about the availability of parts if something goes wrong in the future, and I suspect it would be a lot more problematic than a Tektronix.Would I be better off saving up for a digital scope like a DS1052e, or trying for a used Tektronix, Hitachi, etc. on ebay? I want to keep expense down (I have a tight budget right now), but most of all I need to know that I'm getting something that will be adequate for my purposes, and that it would still be useful when I finally get enough saved up to buy a digital scope. I'm doing a lot of general electronics stuff (example projects from books and such), and I'm currently working on making a small variable power supply and a little function generator. I also have a lot of interest in microcontrollers, so a large number of my projects are likely to use a micro somehow. I would also probably like to play around with audio at some point.This is the YouScope demo playing on the same model:The service manual:http://www.qsl.net/vk5bar/AHARS-Resources/Philips%20PM3055/PM3055%20Service%20Manual.pdf

author: vk6zgo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2012, 12:05:54 am
content: They are certainly not currently made,I'm not sure anything is labelled "Philips" anymore--probably new stuff would be Fluke.Maybe it is "New Old Stock",but you should follow it up with the seller.If they are being accidentally deceptive,point that out to them in a nice manner.If they are being deceptive on purpose,leave them alone!The good thing about "local" buying,is you can look at the thing,test it to see if it works,maybe negotiate a better price.Philips stuff is not quite as reliable as Tektronix,but they use readily available parts & are fixable.$149 seems like a lot for a 60MHz 'scope,but comparing it to a new "El Cheapo" 10MHz analog from Jaycar,( or any of the cheapie DSOs),it's a fairly good deal.I got a Tek 7613 for $135 at a Hamfest---great CRO,but it is quite large,whilst the PM3055 is reasonably compact.There have been several people on this forum who have bought Philips 'scopes,& had good experiences with them.If you search the forum you will find them.PS: You will probably have to search manually or go outside the site & Google--the "search" function here just brings up this thread!

author: jyaan
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2012, 12:35:02 am
content: I've tried searching around and I think it would be a good scope, but yea the asking price... $150 is basically a 100Mhz Tektronix or half of a Rigol DS1052E, so unless he comes down a lot I'll have to pass on it.

author: jyaan
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2012, 04:02:37 am
content: He agreed to $80 so it looks like I'll have a new scope tomorrow.

author: Spawn
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2012, 04:21:01 am
content: Congratulations mate, it’s a good scope for a nice price. I think you will have pleasure with this one for long timeMake sure everything works ok with this one, if my memory serves me right, I read something about this scope having a lot custom IC’s which can fail, which are difficult to find (watch out for the vertical measurements).

author: jyaan
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2012, 08:57:45 pm
content: Well I got the scope now and it is really quite nice. I not sure whether it's "new old stock" or what, but I can easily understand why he decided it was new.Either it really was "new" or saw very little use. There are no scratches or blemishes anywhere, has the face protection plate, and even came in a tough lockable metal case. The plastic covering is still over the LED display section.Accessories came in their packages, and it has the manual as well. There's even a "customer satisfaction" card from Philips/Fluke in there. Came with two 100Mhz probes and a nice carrying pouch to hold them. The power cord is still in its package -- but maybe that's just because it's a European plug. Fortunately I've got a whole bunch of US power cables.The cal is off somewhat, but it shouldn't be a problem since I already have the service manual. I'm really happy with it overall. Looks like I finally got a nice scope and managed to stay within budget. It's too bad I don't have a better camera because these low-res photos don't show how nice it really looks.

author: grumpydoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2012, 09:30:21 pm
content: Buy a lottery ticket quickly - at $80 for that 'scope you must be in a run of luck!Seriously - it looks a great deal for the price.

author: ModemHead
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2012, 09:39:56 pm
content: You should be in jail. You stole it!Seriously nice piece of gear. Enjoy.

author: jyaan
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2012, 11:48:05 pm
content: Yea I'm really happy with how everything worked out. In the end I volunteered $90 instead because everything was in such good condition. The seller was a great guy, seems hard to find people like that these days. Anyways, I need to go read the manual and find out what that matrix of buttons on the lower half does...

author: T4P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 19, 2012, 03:48:04 am
content: Quote from: jyaan on March 18, 2012, 11:48:05 pm"Press this button and it goes off ... AND I'LL BE DOOMED !" - Jeremy Clarkson

author: jyaan
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 20, 2012, 01:26:36 am
content: After playing with the scope a bit I realized that all of my readings were spot on. Kind of odd considering I thought the cal was off. Turns out that the square wave cal hook is actually 1.2V. Feeling kind of stupid for not noticing that (since it's printed right on the front...), but why the heck is it 1.2V anyways?? Anyways, the good news is that the vertical is actually spot on.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 20, 2012, 08:20:53 am
content: I lusted after that LCD scope when I was a kid!Dave.

author: vk6zgo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 20, 2012, 09:25:07 am
content: Quote from: jyaan on March 20, 2012, 01:26:36 amWhy?--Because they can!Philips were always prone to going their own way------It's the Philips' way or the highway!!A bit like Microsoft when you think about it!

author: jyaan
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 28, 2012, 07:24:19 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on March 20, 2012, 08:20:53 amI'll admit that I've turned out the lights just to see the glow of it (quite a few times, actually...). For that extra touch, it's really great to turn up the graticule lamp since it matches the LCD backlight. One of the first things I tried was the YouScope demo, and just soaked in that odd blend of green and orangish-brown. Ahh... Analog beauty... really! I love the LCD because it gives you those nice clear digits -- just like you'll find on a multimeter.Quote from: vk6zgo on March 20, 2012, 09:25:07 amYea, there are quite a few quirks. Especially irritating is how you lose auto trig if you switch to ground coupling. Apparently you're supposed to press the "ground reference" button on the Philips probes instead... (??) Others, like the layout, are pretty damn weird but not bad once you get used to it. Then there are things like the 1.2v cal which make you think they forgot to take meds that day. A few -- like the LCD -- are really fantastic. It's unfortunate that many of the quirks tend to be a meld of various shades of weird -- But hey, at least they weren't afraid to try out different things.

author: tekfan
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 28, 2012, 08:16:10 pm
content: I would say that they thought carefully about the 1.2V calibrator amplitude. If you're on the 0.2V/div deflection factor then you get a nice 6 division high square wave so you can precisely compensate the probes.The layout of the controls looks rather nice. All the buttons are where you want them and you don't need to go to menus to change a setting.What really baffles my mind is why they used a very strange 1.86kHz calibrator frequency on the HP1980 oscilloscope. You can control the output frequency and amplitude by the GPIB port but that's the only way.

author: vk6zgo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 29, 2012, 12:05:52 am
content: Yeah,I never really suggested that there was anything wrong with the Philips (or Microsoft) way of doing things.It's just that they "follow the beat of a different drummer" to others.Philips had a virtual monopoly on domestic Radios & TVs in their home country,& massive sales elsewhere in Europe,back in the day,so they could pretty much say their way was the right way!

author: bfritz
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 29, 2012, 02:00:49 am
content: I think $80 for the scope seems fair. But it looks like you got probes, a scope pouch for accessories, and a hard side case. I can see paying more than $80 for the probes! You got a steal. Looks in great shape. Congrats!

author: CampKohler
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2012, 12:46:07 am
content: You'd be hard put to buy the knobs for $80.The cal voltage is 1.2, because it's metric. They always have strange numbers that need converting.

author: vk6zgo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2012, 02:15:10 am
content: Sounds more like Imperial ,one tenth of the length of the King's foot!