Screen flickering on DS1052E - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: kyren
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 13, 2011, 10:12:03 pm
content: I'm not really sure if this is a problem or not, but I just bought a DS1052E scope and I'm noticing an odd screen flicker now and again. It's VERY intermittent, like maybe once every 10 minutes or so, but it seems like the whole screen goes white for a split second, then is fine again. Is this indicative of some dodgy connection somewhere? Do DSO scopes normally do this? Should I make a warranty claim?Any advice would be appreciated.

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 13, 2011, 11:17:33 pm
content: It's a fault of some sort as that doesn't happen on my ds1052e.I have seen other people talking about getting a permanent white screen, maybe your have the same fault but it's intermittent. It does sound like some sort of bad connection or solder joint.If it's easy to return for warranty claim do that, might be a good idea to record a video of the fault and burn it to a CR-R and include it with the scope when you send it back.often when you return goods with intermittent faults you just get them returned 2 weeks later with "no fault detected"You could try give the scope a good shake, it's win-win. If it fixes the problem thats good, and if it makes it worse that's good too as it's easier to make a warranty claim

author: kyren
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 13, 2011, 11:57:59 pm
content: You know, shaking it doesn't really make the problem any different. The problem is such that you could use the scope for an hour and not even really notice it. I contacted Rigol about it, and I'm waiting to hear back from them. It almost seems like it's a software problem because the problem doesn't seem to be tied to anything I can physically do to the scope at all.What firmware are you using? Could it be an issue that only happens with the more buggy 00.02.05.02.00 version firmare?

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 12:41:35 am
content: mine is 00.02.02 SP2 i flashed it with the 100mhz firmware.If you plan to try that version on your scope, read up on the scope hardware and firmware version issues before doing it.There are issues with the newer versions being bricked with old firmware.I dont know enough about the versions to say if it's safe to try that on yours or not.If it's still under warrenty it's best to let rigol fix it than to play around with the firmware yourself and risk voiding the warrenty.

author: kyren
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 12:57:45 am
content: It's hw version 58, so IF it came with one version lower of firmware, I would have already hacked it and gone to 00.02.04.01. Hw version 58 is fine with 00.02.04.01.00, but no luck because no hack has been found for firmware 00.02.05.02.00, so as of right now I'm still waiting for one.Something a little off topic, I was double checking something a second ago and I did something kind of stupid. At the DS1052E system info screen, I did the ch1/ch1/ch2/ch2/math sequence to check on the hardware version number, then backed out. Then later, I wanted to double check something else and I went back to the system info screen and did the ch1/ch1/ch2/ch2/math sequence again without realizing that it was already in the "extended" mode! I know I've been warned about pressing ANYTHING other than Run/Stop while in that mode, and I wasn't paying attention and messed up badly.The scope seemed to be working fine, I recalibrated it just for good measure, and it seems totally okay. The probe calibration square wave seems normal, and at the correct 3.0V, so did I screw something up?Edit: Disregard that, it turns out messing up the scope while in the extended info screen is only possible if you have an older firmware, it's a bug that they fixed in later firmwares.

author: quirmche
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 03:52:02 am
content: It might be asking a lot, but could you post a video of the flicker?

author: kyren
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 04:42:01 am
content: Here you go, I got lucky and caught it:Though I'm more worried now about whether or not I've screwed up the scope while in the system info screen.Edit: depending on which youtube encoding get's served to you, it may not be visible (thanks youtube), I uploaded the mp4 further down the thread.

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 06:26:00 am
content: here is a freeze of it

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 02:22:56 pm
content: That looks very much like a timing error, a very subtle one. Sorry to see. Don't let Rigol know you hacked this box, warranty is voided if you did.

author: kyren
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 03:04:56 pm
content: Well that's okay, because I haven't hacked it... except for putting in the system info ch1/ch1/ch2/ch2/math code.

author: sadman
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 03:31:11 pm
content: Quote from: kyren on March 13, 2011, 10:12:03 pmno advice but i'm seeing this too on my rigol

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 03:46:07 pm
content: send back for replacement.

author: quirmche
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 03:56:29 pm
content: Probably one of those lousy Ball Grid Arrays on the main board or a capacitor. I assume that is an LCD screen.Does it get better or worse under different circumstances? Better/worse the longer the unit is on/off?Oh yeah, where did you buy it from?

author: kyren
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 03:59:48 pm
content: Gets better (it seems) the longer it's on. Bought it from Saelig, and I'm gonna call them today.Quote from: sadman on March 14, 2011, 03:31:11 pmHuh, how old is your scope and what firmware does it have? I *just* bought mine, so if it's a hardware problem, then it might be a certain run of them, or if it's software then it might be the latest firmware.

author: kyren
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 04:36:11 pm
content: Wow, I'm really glad I bought from Saelig and not from DealExtreme. Very nice customer support, have an RMA number and don't have to pay for return shipping. I expected some kind of run-around because the unit wasn't "really" broken, or something like that, but it turned out to be as easy as it could be.I guess that's supposed to be how it normally works, but I've had such bad luck with online retailers lately that it kinda caught me off guard how easy it wasThumbs up for Saelig.

author: sadman
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 04:47:24 pm
content: Quote from: kyren on March 14, 2011, 03:59:48 pmbought in january from dealextreme00.02.05.01.00HW version 58

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 05:05:59 pm
content: Great, then its a defect, you should get the unit replaced, that's why its good to have warranty and buying it from a legit channel.From non-US or authorized dealers, please report your experiences. It maybe bumpy but others should learn of the risk.Quote from: kyren on March 14, 2011, 03:04:56 pmQuote from: sadman on March 14, 2011, 03:31:11 pmQuote from: kyren on March 14, 2011, 04:36:11 pm

author: quirmche
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 05:23:34 pm
content: Quote from: kyren on March 14, 2011, 04:36:11 pmSaelig plus Rigol 3 year warranty, I gues you can't go wrong!!!

author: kyren
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 06:08:10 pm
content: It looks like youtube re-encoded the video and it's hard to see depending on what version youtube serves... here's the mp4 just in case.

author: kyren
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 06:17:02 pm
content: Quote from: sadman on March 14, 2011, 04:47:24 pmWell, not the same firmware version, and I guess way more people would be complaining about it if it was some software problem, so forget what I said about that.What does your unit look like when it turns on? I've seen video of other's scopes' boot sequence, and the screen looks, well, clean as it's starting up. Mine displays all kinds of garbage for a second or two, but by the time it gets to the actual boot splash screen, it stabilizes.I'm sorry your scope has the same problem. At least with mine it didn't really impact the *usability* of the scope, it just made me worry that the display might not be working right after, say, a few months of use. I hope your problem isn't any worse than that.

author: sadman
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 07:52:14 pm
content: Quote from: kyren on March 14, 2011, 06:17:02 pmwhite screen, black screen, splash screenQuoteit's not something i couldn't live with, it happens only sporadicallyso unless it gets worse, i'm ignoring it

author: bilko
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 08:37:56 pm
content: I bought my 1052E from Aidetek. Despatched from USA, arrived a few days agoFW 00.02.05.02HW 58Mine does the same, on power up I get the random garbled screen for about a second.The white 'flash' appears on various screens, I get it worse when in cursor measure mode.I think it is a firmware bug.Does anybody else get white screen on other firmware ?

author: kyren
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 09:43:56 pm
content: Quote from: yachtronics on March 14, 2011, 08:37:56 pmWell, now I'm not sure what to do. It'd be great if anyone could chime in that had a display with *no* glitches and 00.02.05.02.00 firmware. It's not at all possible to downgrade to 00.02.04.01.02 from 00.02.05.02.00, right?

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 10:07:25 pm
content: This thus sound like a bug; I have 2.04 unhacked, its has some minor bugs but no screen or measurement issues. The only one's I've found are here:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/index.php?topic=2222.0You may want to read the 1052e hack thread, but there is a firmware update at the Rigol website, just touch base with Rigol USA before attempting to change yours:http://www.rigolna.com/products/digital-oscilloscopes/ds1000e/Quote from: yachtronics on March 14, 2011, 08:37:56 pm

author: kyren
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 10:36:37 pm
content: Quote from: saturation on March 14, 2011, 10:07:25 pmWell, the firmwares on Rigol's site are 02.04.00.03 and 02.02.02.00, neither of which should be compatible with hw58, right? I don't even really care if it's hackable or not, I'd love to downgrade to 02.04.01.02 just because it's apparently much more stable, but I didn't think it was possible.

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2011, 11:53:20 pm
content: I don't know, but Rigol has posted it on their website as a 'fix' so I presume they know there is a bug. But there are firmware upgrade instructions on the Rigol link, just fill in the form with bogus info, you'll get through so you can download it.But since the DSO is under warranty you should officially speak to the Rigol folks via email and mention the issue, before doing the fix, I think the firmware instructions mention this so at least they are aware of your complaint and can confirm the fix will work, or not.Quote from: kyren on March 14, 2011, 10:36:37 pm

author: kyren
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 15, 2011, 12:13:34 am
content: Quote from: saturation on March 14, 2011, 11:53:20 pmI've emailed them about it, but haven't heard back. I looked at the hex dump of the two firmware files available, one marked v2 SP2 (seems to be 02.02.02.00), and the other one marked v2.04 (seems to be 02.04.00.03). The 1052e hack thread would have me believe that downgrading to those would not work, and that they would be incompatible with the hw58 scopes. Guess I'll wait to see what Rigol says.

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 15, 2011, 01:30:35 am
content: Quote from: kyren on March 15, 2011, 12:13:34 amlucky you if you got the reply next week.

author: looser101
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: March 30, 2011, 12:13:55 am
content: I'm experiencing the same problem.00.02.05.02.00DSP 00.00FPGA 02.00hw58

author: bilko
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2011, 12:20:44 am
content: Quote from: looser101 on March 30, 2011, 12:13:55 amIt looks like a bad batch or firmware bug. Anybody heard from Rigol ?If you have a 'useful' contact at Rigol I wouldn't mind knowing his email address

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2011, 11:43:00 am
content: How didhttps://www.eevblog.com/forum/index.php?topic=2788.msg37693#msg37693fair? He bought from a local dealer, and the link above was his solution.Quote from: yachtronics on March 30, 2011, 12:20:44 am

author: looser101
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: March 30, 2011, 12:26:04 pm
content: I contacted Rigol on their website last night. I asked if, what I am experiencing, might be a firmware or a hardware problem. This was their response:Dear ********?Thanks for contacting with RIGOL.As with your question ?it's probably the firmware problem.so please turn to our local agency where you purchase it for directsupport.If there is any other question ?please feel free to let me know.Thanks for your great support to RIOGL.Since I bought it from DX and I'm in Canada, I will probably wait it out. One thing I did notice was that after several hours powered on, it did seem to stop (~3hrs).

author: kyren
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 26, 2011, 05:43:33 pm
content: Sorry for posting in such an old thread, but since other people are having the same issue I figured it would be good to reply.I got a new scope from Saelig a while ago, but nearly identical behavior. I figured this would be the case after so many other people saw the same issue.Since there is now a way to downgrade from 00.02.05.02.00, I was able to do the normal DS1052 -> DS1102 hack, and as part of that went back to firmware 02.04 sp1 (whatever specific version that the ds1052 hack thread recommends, can't remember).The problem seems to be entirely gone, and I have a much better scope to boot!So yeah, go forth and downgrade.

author: bilko
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 26, 2011, 07:15:38 pm
content: @KyrenThanks for the feedback. I reported the same problem too.Now with the 'downgrade facility' being made available. I don't see why Rigol can't release an official firmware update to fix this problem.Whoever wants to change the bandwidth can, either by firmware or hardware modification. Rigol should concentrate on eradicating the reported bugs.