Repair laptop keys with WD40 lubricant? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / repair

author: Faringdon
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2024, 04:05:59 pm
content: Hi,We have lots of laptops in our electronics lab.....students have spilled coffee over their keyboards. They are now extremely clicky, and contractors are walking out.They seem to be made more silent by bathing the keyboard in IPA, then allowing that to dry off.I wonder if we can bath the keyboards in WD40?....to really make them go silent?The keys cannot be removed. So we cant take them out and clean behind them....they are impossible to get back on, we already tried it with the squiggly bracket key, and it wont go back on.WD40https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/lubricants/0189068?cm_mmc=UK-PLA-DS3A-_-bing-_-PLA_UK_EN_Catch+All-_-PPE,+Safety,+Test+%26+IT-_-189068&matchtype=e&pla-4575480221734510&cq_src=google_ads&cq_cmp=554644865&cq_term=&cq_plac=&cq_net=o&cq_plt=gp&gclid=27ce86253c601faaba11e3f6405d5314&gclsrc=3p.ds&msclkid=27ce86253c601faaba11e3f6405d5314

author: coromonadalix
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2024, 04:22:02 pm
content: do not use WD40 or any petroloeum based lubricant ...for a case like this normally the keyboad pad is removableuse non mineral water heated a say warm 50 degree, soak the keyboard, and do small movements once in a while let it soak for a dayworked for meipa can work, but you need to soak and remove the gummy caramel ...

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 19, 2024, 04:39:11 pm
content: To remove sugar and other water soluble stuff you need water. Organic solvents like IPA work very poorly for that. As of WD40, you can use that for creating a mess before throwing out the laptop.QuoteNearly all laptop keys can be removed if you know what you're doing. Also unless keyboard is embedded in enclosure, it's better to just replace it. Sometimes you don't even need to take the laptop apart as unscrewing a few screws on the bottom and releasing a few latches will do the job.

author: factory
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2024, 05:34:15 pm
content: Quote from: wraper on February 19, 2024, 04:39:11 pmSome Dell laptops require removal of everything to get to the keyboard, which the service manual mentions, they consider the keyboard to be non replaceablewithoutreplacing the entire base plate that it's part of too.David

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2024, 07:51:12 pm
content: Quote from: Faringdon on February 19, 2024, 04:05:59 pmUnbelievable! This is taking the p*ss even for a Faringdon/treez thread!Don't waste your time replying.

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2024, 07:54:46 pm
content: Quote from: Faringdon on February 19, 2024, 04:05:59 pmHard to believe given your other thread about needing a corporate umbrella. Just buy new ones with the tuition they pay. If it's your personal unit, the same advice applies.

author: xrunner
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2024, 07:57:24 pm
content: Quote from: Faringdon on February 19, 2024, 04:05:59 pmAbsolutely! I wouldn't hesitate if I were you. I'd gather the students together and have a go at a classroom project to restore them.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 19, 2024, 07:59:09 pm
content: what contractors are walking out?

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2024, 08:16:55 pm
content: I would soak in hot (about 50°C, just too hot to hold your hand for too long) water with dish washing detergent, for 10 minutes, rinse three times in deionised water and dry at 40°C. The detergent will help to dissolve fats found in coffee creamer, milk and hot chocolate and the deionised water will remove any detergent and salt residues.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 19, 2024, 08:33:31 pm
content: Quote from: Zero999 on February 19, 2024, 08:16:55 pmI would not suggest detergent in this case, as it will get in between of the films with no chance to get it out entirely. It's very different from washing PCB. The problem with washing keybords is to not make them more bad.

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2024, 08:47:53 pm
content: Quote from: wraper on February 19, 2024, 08:33:31 pmI thought I would get some disagreement, when I said detergent, but why? Rinsing throughout in deionised water aught to remove the detergent. It shouldn't be a problem, as long as you don't make it extremely concentrated. Heck, I've heard stories of people washing ordinary computer keyboards in the dishwasher, but I certainly wouldn't recommend that, especially a laptop keyboard, which is more sensitive.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 19, 2024, 09:03:15 pm
content: Because films are lying on each other with no gap and only a very small gap under buttons. So there will be no water flow to wash everything out. It's for the same reason why switches and non sealed relays are non washable. You get the stuff in but cannot get it out entirely.

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2024, 09:29:21 pm
content: I hate to take this seriously, but there are a lot of "non-ionic" surfactants. When aquatic areas are involved in agriculture, they are used to avoid hurting fish eyes. Hence, they are quite cheap. Similarly, one might consider cellosolves that are non-ionic and great solvents when diluted with water. Many household cleaners contain butyl cellosolve, which has a distinctive odor. Diluted 1:50 or greater, and it is safe with most plastic and paint.I don't see keyboard clicking as the real problem.

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2024, 09:33:55 pm
content: Quote from: wraper on February 19, 2024, 09:03:15 pmIf that's true, then no detergent, food residue, water etc. will get in, so whatever you use to wash it, won't be a problem.If you don't want to use detergent, then use a mixture of IPA and deionised water. The IPA will dissolve any fats and the water will deal with the sugars and salts.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 19, 2024, 11:19:52 pm
content: Quote from: Zero999 on February 19, 2024, 09:33:55 pmThey are not glued together, just lay directly on each other. Capillary effect will suck the liquid in between of films almost immediately but there will be no flow. The problem with detergents is that they're way more conductive and corrosive than sugar.

author: Faringdon
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2024, 09:01:24 pm
content: QuoteThanks, i actually already bathed the keyboard in IPA, and it did help...i will try it again, and with the de-ionised water. The worry is that liquid seeps through to the microprocessor beneath.They are Huawei Matebook D laptops:https://consumer.huawei.com/uk/laptops/matebook-d-15-2022/

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2024, 09:07:55 pm
content: It is well know that solvent mixtures do not add their individual properties arithmetically. Just one example: Absolute ethanol is a great solvent for human fat. Add a little water, and it is much less so.Now, what do you really want to do with the keyboard you wrecked and are too cheap to replace? Does it work OK regardless of the clicking? If yes, wear ear plugs. If not, then let's consider solutions that are possible, but unlikely to succeed.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 20, 2024, 09:59:50 pm
content: Quote from: Faringdon on February 20, 2024, 09:01:24 pmYou must not wash it with water, and frankly with anything without disassembling the laptop. It's always powered from the battery, so no liquids should get on electronics until you take the battery out.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 20, 2024, 10:03:38 pm
content: Key construction seems to be the same as in D15.

author: Jwillis
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2024, 10:21:47 pm
content: Quote from: wraper on February 20, 2024, 09:59:50 pmAgreed.Remove all power before washing with anything. On mother boards you must remove the bios battery as well. You can wash ICs in water because they are sealed. But must be completely dry before adding any power. Tap water is fine to use for initial wash but the board should be rinsed with distilled water or IPA to get rid of any impurities left behind from the evaporated tap water. Then completely dried before assembly and power connection. Although IPA has a very low conductivity, there is still a risk of fire. Even the slightest arc (battery re connection )can ignite IPA.

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2024, 11:00:43 pm
content: Quote from: factory on February 19, 2024, 05:34:15 pmThis may be true, but I have seen a repair technician completely disassemble a Dell laptop to replace the mainboard. Lots of parts and dozens of little tiny screws all over the place. I think most laptops can be completely stripped down, just so long as you are comfortable with putting it all back together again (which is honestly less daunting than disassembling and reassembling a smartphone). All of which is to say, that the keyboard module could in principle be separated out for cleaning by itself.

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2024, 11:14:49 pm
content: Some keyboards have the assembly screws buried under a plastic fascia. Logitech K360 is one example. That may not apply to a laptop. But considering the "non-repairability" built into most things today, a $400 laptop is likely to be designed with such mouse traps. Once that fascia is removed, it will be hard to replace cosmetically.

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2024, 11:15:06 pm
content: Quote from: factory on February 19, 2024, 05:34:15 pmYeah, I can see why manufacturers want you to do this. I once had to replace a UV damaged plastic speaker grill on the back shelf of my car, and the car manufacturer said I have to replace the entire shelf which also includes the second speaker grill. They quoted me $1200 or something. Long story short, I bought an aftermarket 2-speaker grill set for $20 on Ali and saved on installation fees

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2024, 11:23:28 pm
content: Quote from: jpanhalt on February 20, 2024, 11:14:49 pmLaptops do seem like they are more repairable. Every laptop I have owned or used has been repairable at the module level by disassembly and module replacement. Buried screws would cause problems since the manufacturer would be forced into replacing the whole laptop under warranty or service agreements, and it would create user hostility into the bargain.Dell in particular has an absolute "repair first, replace as a last resort" policy.Logitech keyboards, I would have to say, are a kind of disposable item, in spite of their cost.

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2024, 11:31:29 pm
content: Quote from: IanB on February 20, 2024, 11:23:28 pmI have to agree. After I popped off all the keys, I discovered LogiTech's secret. I saved the keys, just in case I wear the labels off my current keyboard too early.

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 21, 2024, 08:12:40 am
content: Quote from: Faringdon on February 20, 2024, 09:01:24 pmWater/detergent controversy aside, I didn't even think you were considering washing the whole laptop. You must remove the keyboard from the laptop before washing it. There will be parts inside the laptop: batteries, fan bearings, speakers which will be ruined by water and there are small spaces which are difficult to dry out.I repeat. Remove the keyboard fist, before washing it. You still need something which will remove both grease as well as water based contaminants, hence why I suggested detergent. If that's too strong, then perhaps baby shampoo would be a milder option. Obviously rinse well with deionised water afterwards.

author: max.wwwang
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 21, 2024, 08:07:46 pm
content: Please don’t use WD40. It does not have the permanent resident status in an electronics workshop, a visitor at most.

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 21, 2024, 08:17:17 pm
content: Quote from: Zero999 on February 21, 2024, 08:12:40 amWell now you know why the "contractors are walking out". The motherboards must be a mess by now.