I'm and idiot. I tried to transfer my Firmware Chip. Maybe Fried It. Now What?  - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: NeedsPractice
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2021, 04:38:06 am
content: I tried to transfer my BIOS/Firmware Chip from one PCB Board to another Donor PCB Board. It might be okay and yet it might not be okay. (I'm currently getting it looked at professionally) Let's assume worst case scenario. Is there someone out there that can extract my rom information from my platters and reprogram another chip and get all this working again? The hard drive is in perfect shape and spins up beautifully, I just had a bad pcb board. I know its a long shot but I thought I would ask.Sincerely,Idiot

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2021, 04:47:42 am
content: I'm not even sure what you're saying, you asked about a BIOS chip but then you mention platters in a drive? Which is it? What exactly did you do? There is no relation between what is on the platters of a hard drive and what is in the BIOS ROM.

author: Nusa
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2021, 05:14:42 am
content: I know what he's talking about...there's firmware on the hard drive PCB that's matched to the head assembly and motor type installed with the platters. Replacing the PCB with a donor is practical, but often requires transferring the NVRAM chip with the firmware on it. Whether that PCB was ever the original problem is another question entirely.Quote from: NeedsPractice on April 28, 2021, 04:38:06 amWorst case is you throw lots of money at it, it doesn't work, and you write it off and forget about whatever was on that drive.Second worst case is you save your money and write it off now.The right professionals do have some options for data recovery, but it's not going to be cheap. How much $ is your data worth to you?I'd recommend this place if you want to go that route:https://www.rossmanngroup.com/data-recovery-service-nyc/

author: magic
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2021, 07:21:39 am
content: What exactly have you have done to that poor ROM?ICs are somewhat tough, problem like a broken leg should be salvageable.

author: NeedsPractice
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2021, 10:24:45 am
content: Quote from: james_s on April 28, 2021, 04:47:42 amNusa is correct.Quote from: Nusa on April 28, 2021, 05:14:42 amYes, I have stumbled on that website before. I am waiting on my firmware chip back and my pcb board after professional installation from another establishment. If they receive my rom and say there is no hope and they can't even install it for me I will look to another professional recovery service.The data is not life altering. Its a really nice to have but not mandatory, thank goodness.However, I do have drives that have failed over the years that I would mind having the data back, I have just collected them and stored them away. I would mind sending them off one by one to see if it wouldn't be possible to get the data back. I mean I even have some from the IDE days with the old connections.https://www.rossmanngroup.com/data-recovery-service-nyc/Can this company do this that non traditional companies cannot? I mean if this firmware chip is fried are there other methods like I mention earlier, or should I just let go of this data? It just seems sad because the drive boots up perfectly. I mean if I order a new donor board and install it, its ready to go except it can't read it because it has the wrong calibration instructions. Maybe Gilware misunderstood me but they seemed like they didn't want to deal with a fried bios chip.In hopeful news, my chip may still be salvageable, and all this is moot. I am waiting to see if that is so in the next few days.Quote from: magic on April 28, 2021, 07:21:39 amI just transferred it from one pcb board to another. I used a rework station but may have over heated it. I doubt it but I could have. The odd thing is when I transferred it nothing happened. Maybe I didn't transfer everything that needed to be transferred.

author: Microdoser
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2021, 10:37:59 am
content: I would first check that you have soldered it back on properly. I have used old chips on new boards and quite often, they just don't work right until I recheck the connections and maybe add a boatload of flux and run a soldering iron round the connections.I have particularly found the LTC4040 (battery backup manager chip) is a difficult chip but then again, I have also found that as my skill improves, there are less 'difficult' chips.For example, it would operate seemingly fine, operate the device, have correct voltages but not charge the battery. The connections looked soldered under the microscope but after running a soldering iron round all the connections it just worked.If the chip has a central heat pad then make sure you press it down as you heat it. Always use at least twice the amount of flux you think you need...

author: NeedsPractice
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2021, 10:46:31 am
content: Quote from: Microdoser on April 28, 2021, 10:37:59 amYes, I think you are exactly 100% right. When I installed the rom chip it would almost pop off every time no matter what I did. I tried to touch up with solder but was having no luck at all. I am not that good at that part. Therefore I sent it to a company that specializes replacing roms chips on pcb boards. I will see if they can put it on the board for me and send it back.I just hope I didn't fry the board. Idon't think I did but I may have unless they can take tons and tons of heat. I mean I never really directed the heat right on the rom chip for too long and was trying to make sure I didn't overheat it. So there is that.However, I definitely needed to solder the tips which I did not.I'll see what they come up with and I hope it works. I'm sure they will do it perfectly. However, I might try as well when they ship the parts back to me if they are unable too.

author: Nusa
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2021, 10:53:05 am
content: A drive spinning up is not the same thing as "booting". Anyway, here's one of a number of videos from that place.

author: NeedsPractice
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2021, 11:00:30 am
content: Quote from: Nusa on April 28, 2021, 10:53:05 amI agree.Is that the place from New York?I will definitely consider other options if this part of my journey doesn't work. I definitely think this drive is recoverable some how. Just need to get it into the right hands for sure.

author: Microdoser
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2021, 01:44:52 pm
content: Quote from: NeedsPractice on April 28, 2021, 10:46:31 amDid you add flux? If you are just using solder alone that might be your entire problem. I find that if I just use solder my success rate is about 10% on rework, if I use a boatload of flux as well that turns into 95% success rate.It helps the solder wet (stick) to the metal on both sides of the connection, without it, you find that chips can just pop off and don't work...

author: NeedsPractice
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2021, 05:13:41 pm
content: Quote from: Microdoser on April 28, 2021, 01:44:52 pmI did not use a boatload, but I did use I thought a decent amount. I could have used a small amount butt I thought it was decent. Based on what you are saying I could have used a whole lot more. I will see what they do. Hopefully with PC Max 3000 software they can solder it perfectly and ship it back to me and everything works and this will be a moot point.If not, I might try some things you have suggested or just ship it off to a professional recovery service as is. I mean the drive is in perfect condition. I would think someone could salvage this drive.

author: Microdoser
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2021, 07:53:04 pm
content: Quote from: NeedsPractice on April 28, 2021, 05:13:41 pmWorst case if the platters are in good order, they can put them on a new spindle and read them at slow speed with known working heads and make an image of your drive that can be put on to an empty drive. Sometimes they just fit a working board into your drive and get it to read itself and dump an image (sounds like this would be the fix for this drive). Here's hoping they can just put the chip on and it works.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2021, 08:15:37 pm
content: About 20 years ago I was given a few dead hard drives and I fixed one of them by just swapping the boards between two drives of the same model, didn't mess with the ROM at all and I used that repaired drive for non-critical storage for several years after that.If the soldered IC is falling off the board then something is definitely wrong, a soldered joint should be strong enough that if you were to tug on the chip it would tear the pad off the board before the joint failed.

author: magic
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2021, 09:03:17 pm
content: I have done it too but these days some disks have small SO8 memory chips with some calibration data / whatever which need to be transferred to the new board if it's to work.

author: NeedsPractice
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2021, 09:34:55 pm
content: Quote from: Microdoser on April 28, 2021, 07:53:04 pmExactly. So you recommend the NYC place to do this if it comes to that? Or should I use Ontrack? I asked Gilware and they were not interested. I would definetly be interested in this if the ROM is fried beyond repair. However, from an expert on another forum he said the roms can take some serious abuse and that might is probably okay. I mean all of the prongs are perfect and everything. I sure heated up the little guy but I think he is okay. If the place I sent it to puts the rom on perfectly and does a great solder job I am guessing we will all be good to go.

author: NeedsPractice
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2021, 09:36:52 pm
content: Quote from: magic on April 28, 2021, 09:03:17 pmExactly, other makes and older drives you could use that technique, now newer drives especially seagate have to have that calibration information from the rom chip in order to let the os read the drive. Who knows why they do this. BS. I did buy some donor boards and pop them on the hard drive wishing, but of course no luck.

author: NeedsPractice
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2021, 09:38:24 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on April 28, 2021, 08:15:37 pmExactly, a lot has changed since then. Check this out. Especially the Seagate seciton.https://www.donordrives.com/pcb-replacement-guide/

author: magic
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 29, 2021, 06:51:26 am
content: It's not for the OS, it's for the disk's firmware and it's some specific data about the particular mechanical unit / platters / whatever.AFAIK the firmware won't be able to read anything from the platters if this ROM isn't present.

author: Microdoser
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 29, 2021, 10:11:44 am
content: Quote from: NeedsPractice on April 28, 2021, 09:34:55 pmFrom what I have seen Rossman seems like the sort of place that would either fix it or tell you they couldn't. They wouldn't break it beyond repair trying. AFAIK they have a no fix-no fee thing too so...

author: NeedsPractice
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2021, 10:53:14 pm
content: Another Update:Okay I got my ROM back. Well, I got my ROM back that is a New ROM. They said that my original ROM was too damaged, but they were successful at transferring the ROM information from my Original ROM to this NEW ROM. They checked twice that it was transferred over successful.Well of course it did not work. The drive is seen in windows but barely. It is doing the same thing before like the original problem. Completely and 100% silent. (I think all windows recognizes is the bridge that it is connected to).This is the weirdest part. I ordered some more PCB Donor Boards and if I put any of those on this hard drive the drive comes to life. It boots up twice or tries to read the drive twice and gives up.What dose all this mean? Did some how the original ROM get corrupted and is permanently damaged?Long ShotThey suggest the file system could be corrupted and that this is almost 100% fixable. Connect PC Max 3000 and either get lucky and extract the data by bypassing the software lock because the drive is in defensive mode or rip the data off raw but will take a while (same as bypassing the locked codes).Recap:1-Original PCB Board with Original BIOS in perfect shape (something happened):-Drive would not boot up, completely silent, not moving or humming at all. OFF.2-New PCB Donor Board with random bios that is already on the board (Testing):-Drive boots up and tries to read but gives up and fails.3-New PCB Donor Board with Original BIOS (I installed it myself, botched it up)-Drive would not boot up, completely silent, not moving or humming at all. OFF.4-New PCB Donor Board with New Rom (Installed by professional, bios information transferred over)-Drive would not boot up, completely silent, not moving or humming at all. OFF.…What does all this mean? Something is corrupted with the original bios? How does the drive power up and try to read with a random donor board with whatever BIOS that came with it; but when it is connected with the original bios its dead as a door nail?I will be getting back my original pcb board and original bios/rom. I’m sure the ROM is in ruff shape but the information has been transferred over to a new ROM. So that is good at least.What are my options at this point? Is my data lost forever?

author: amyk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 06, 2021, 04:13:28 am
content: In all the posts you have made so far, you have not mentioned the name/model of the drive and the part numbers of the various ICs even once.

author: NeedsPractice
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 06, 2021, 06:28:18 am
content: Quote from: amyk on May 06, 2021, 04:13:28 amST8000AS0002, 1NA17Z-569, RT18, 9666 J, Seagate SATA 3.5 PCBPCB Specification:Model: ST8000AS0002Part Number: 1NA17Z-569Firmware: RT18PCB Sticker: 9666 JPCB Number: 100769673 REV AHere is a link for the photos:Front:https://ufile.io/89t3dg39Back:https://ufile.io/r8487cz0

author: NeedsPractice
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 06, 2021, 10:18:52 pm
content: Update:I got my original pcb board back and my original rom. They did put my original rom on another pcb donor board and the drive does not boot up at all. I do not even think it is allowing power to turn on the drive.I put my best donor board with a random rom back on the hard drive and get this.https://ufile.io/45vfe3t3The drive stays on and sounds great. However, I’m afraid to initialize because I know it will erase my data however, even if I do, I will get an i/o error and it wont do it.…They emailed me back and said they do not have my ROM Dump on file. I guess they do not want to work with me on that.…Please on please let me know what device exactly I can buy to get this ROM dump!!! I will post asap when I download it.…wow. I did not even know PC3000 or MRT Lab could not even fix the problem. What about going around the problem? Can either of these programs help rip the data off the drive RAW?“Encouraging Sum” I completely and totally understand and respect this. What are we talking here?I would love to have a healthy ROM Chip on a beautiful new PCB Donor Board.…“Some drives have a feature called Power Up In Standby (PUIS). If this is enabled, then the drive won't spin up until a certain command is issued. PUIS can be disabled with free tools such as HDAT2.”How do I get this tool and software? Please help me troubleshoot this. I can buy tools and have them shipped to me.…“One other feature that may prevent your drive from spinning up inside a PC is SATA power pin #3. This has now been redefined as the Power Disable pin. However this does not appear to be present in your model.”Do I need some software or hardware to disable this?

author: Nusa
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 06, 2021, 10:46:22 pm
content: My advice is to stop thinking about saving the hardware, and focus on how important the data is to you, in terms of $$. If the hardware happens to work when you're done, don't use it for anything you care about.The answers to most of the questions you're now asking are easy google searches. You'll find that PC3000 and MRT Lab are both expensive pieces of software, north of $5000 each....I don't even have to do a search to tell you that.As for "they", I suspect they did exactly what you asked for (save this ROM), not what you really wanted (save this drive). And now you're a squeaky wheel they don't want to deal with anymore. Can't blame them.

author: NeedsPractice
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 06, 2021, 10:49:43 pm
content: Quote from: Nusa on May 06, 2021, 10:46:22 pmHD-Fronthttps://ufile.io/lk1a7uhhHD-Backhttps://ufile.io/c3svwk11Repair – Fronthttps://ufile.io/ez3jou40Repair – Backhttps://ufile.io/h77bd47aGranted please note they said that the original rom was too damaged to transfer. They did this as a courtesy. I have another pcb donor board that has supposedly a new rom with my original bios information transferred over to it. However, you can see here the "condition” of the original rom. I am hoping all the information can still be transferred from this rom. Its not beat up too bad right?Both pcb donor boards; the one with the original rom and the new transferred over with the information rom do not power up the drive at all. Zero, zilch, nada.I can post photos of the new rom and new board if needed as well however, it looks good I believe. If the information was transferred over properly.

author: NeedsPractice
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 06, 2021, 10:50:15 pm
content: Quote from: Nusa on May 06, 2021, 10:46:22 pmSo what do you recommend at this point?

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2021, 01:10:35 am
content: Quote from: NeedsPractice on May 06, 2021, 10:50:15 pmOne of the following, depending on your budget and how valuable the data is to you:1. Hire a professional data recovery service to recover the data.2. Locate an identical working drive and try swapping the boards, maybe you will get lucky and that will allow you to read back at least most of the data.3. Give up, write off the data as a lost cause, put the drive away in a drawer somewhere in case you later change your mind, and use it as a reminder to make frequent backups of important data.

author: NeedsPractice
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2021, 01:40:53 am
content: Quote from: james_s on May 07, 2021, 01:10:35 amWho do you recommend for a professional data recovery service?

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2021, 06:13:48 pm
content: Sorry I've never had a need for such a service so I don't have a recommendation. Perhaps somebody else here does have some direct experience.

author: NeedsPractice
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2021, 03:20:11 am
content: Quote from: james_s on May 07, 2021, 06:13:48 pmRecap:1-Looks like my original bios was erased.2-Looks like my original bios was only partially copied over to the new rom.: 512K worth.3-I have one PCB Donor Board that boots up the hard drive and keeps it running but o/s can't read the data.4. Data Recovery Place that transferred my bios to another PCB Donor Board, said they don't back up roms and they don't have my rom to email me.What are my options?

author: Microdoser
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2021, 03:42:05 am
content: Have you considered something like this?I mean, at some point very soon you might have to really give a hard think to the actual final value you place on this data.Then find a place that will charge you less than that and give you your data on a new drive.If the value you place on the data is less than the price of a new drive plus a new donor drive to use as parts and then arealisticamount for the time required to get the data from a drive which is effectively dead at this point then just give up and save your time.I know that generally at Rossman for example there is a flat fee of $250 for board level repairs, I imagine hard drive recovery is more than that. The minimum I would guess is the price of two drives plus $250.Relevant to your situation:Here, Steve explains why he doesn't replace the PCB to solve the problem with a drive that was sent in requesting PCB replacement. As is almost always the case, the problem the customer thinks they have, is not the problem they actually have.

author: NeedsPractice
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2021, 12:27:26 pm
content: Quote from: Microdoser on May 11, 2021, 03:42:05 amAwesome. Yea, I think I am real close to having to go this route. I have a couple of pros that might have one last ditch effort to maybe do something with my bios, but not sure what they can do. I know one of them can actually code so we shall see. If not, you are exactly right. I will have to evaluate and see how much this data means to mean.

author: Microdoser
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 12, 2021, 10:23:49 am
content: After watching part 2 of the second video it seems likely that the donor board you put into the drive did not have the correct micro-stepping values and that it is unlikely for a random donor board to work.

author: NeedsPractice
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 12, 2021, 12:41:25 pm
content: Quote from: Microdoser on May 12, 2021, 10:23:49 amThanks for trying but I am ready to give up. Yea, I need my original bios information which was erased on purpose by a recovery company to hold my repair hostage.

author: NeedsPractice
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 12, 2021, 12:44:02 pm
content: Well, looks like this is where my journey ends. For everyone that has been thoughtful and kind. Thank you. Looks like with the unexpected crash of this hard drive and the mistakes that I have made, I will not be able to retrieve this data. I will hold onto this drive-in case technology changes in the future or if I become independently wealthy and can afford a “professional recovery service”.To all the negative people out there. Humans are human. We make mistakes even when we know better. My father has been in computers for over 50+ years in the military. I know a lot about computers and backups. Life got in the way. I have a lot going on right now and the last thing I need is smart aleck comments about backing up data.Anyhow, I hope everyone has a wonderful day and wish all of you the best of success in life.

author: NeedsPractice
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 12, 2021, 09:50:54 pm
content: fzabkar said:I found the problem. There is a stuck bit at this location:Code:Offset(h) 00 01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09 0A 0B 0C 0D 0E 0F00025C10 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 08 00 00 00^^When I change the 8 to a 0, the CRC becomes 0x0000.F3RomExplorer is happy with the edit. If you can reprogram your ROM after making the change, then hopefully you will recover your data.I use HxD (freeware hex editor).https://forums.tomshardware.com/threads/seagate-archive-hdd-failure-no-crash-no-spin-silent-troubleshooting-advise%E2%80%A6.3699522/FZABKAROH MY GOODNESS! YOU ARE AMAZING! YOU DID IT! PRAISE GOD! YOU ARE A SAINT!2.82 TB - 3,106,287,262,945 BYTES - 748,329 FILES, 57,259 FOLDERSTAKING (1) DAY TO COPY! IT'S COPYING RIGHT NOW!YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THIS MEANS TO ME! THIS WAS MY MAIN BACKUP DRIVE THAT I BACKED EVERYTHING UP TO RIGHT BEFORE IT DIED. I WAS MOVING STUFF AROUND AND PICKED THIS DRIVE TO BACKUP STUFF TOO. I WAS GOING TO ORGANIZE EVERYTHING WHEN I PLUGGED IT IN AND ALL OF A SUDDEN IT WAS GONE.THIS IS INCREDIBLE!

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 12, 2021, 10:37:15 pm
content: Holy crap, that fixed it? Buy that guy a beer.

author: Microdoser
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 13, 2021, 05:03:12 pm
content: Well that is fantastic!I have to admit, I felt like I was looking at a patient that had flatlined. There is no hope... but wait!A crazy maverick comes in at the last second and saves the day!EDIT:Now, what lesson did we learn today?Always keep at least 2 copies of every bit of data you value. Make sure at least one of those copies has redundancy like a RAID 0, also make sure that the two copies are not on the same machine.Some people say to make sure they are not in the same building (in case of fire, flood, pestilence, or famine)Any data that is not backed up is data you are planning to lose.

author: amyk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 14, 2021, 01:15:53 am
content: Great to see a happy ending.fzabkar is also a member here and at the HDDoracle forums.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 14, 2021, 07:31:29 pm
content: I thought the name sounded familiar. Couldn't remember where I'd seen it though.