P&W Electolimit (OLD) Analog Meter Repair - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / repair

author: thehater
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2016, 03:37:30 pm
content: You'll see in the pictures, I have old analog meters that are in need of repairs. The meter is mounted on a Pratt & Whitney Supermicrometer (used for measuring linear distance). The analog meter is translating the linear movement of an LVDT Probe into movement of the needle.There is damage to the bezel and to the needle. There are some marking on the name plates, but I cannot locate a specific manufacture. The OEM of the instrument is difficult to work with and will not provide information, nor partsOn one unit Reads: ES=360UA, 49-8916 D-10024-003, there are no other markings on the housing, not on the movementOn a second unit it reads: 2333-1 ES=360 ua, 1% D008468-001, there are no other markings on the housing.Outside Dimensions of the Bezel 4.5x3"Do you know who is the OEM?Any suggestions on where to get the units or who would repair?Any suggestions for other options?I have contacted Triplett (now Jewell Instruments), Simpson, Bryam Labs (NJ), Mobile Instruments (AL). I'm hoping someone might have had some experience, or recognize the meterAhead of time, thank you for your help!Mike

author: Jwalling
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 12, 2016, 04:17:18 pm
content: I don't know whether a 360uA movement is an off-the-shelf panel meter.I'm sure someone will correct me if wrong.If there's a gain adjustment on the board that this connects to, it may be possible to put a more standard movement meter in it.Jay

author: thehater
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2016, 05:21:47 pm
content: @jay - I am not 100% this is a 360ua full range. When the unit powers on, the needle pins to the left (zero position), as the LVDT (probe) moves the analog meter needle moves to the right.My assumption is this would be an off-the-shelf analog meter with a custom nameplate. I'm having a hard time locating an OEM

author: Jwalling
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 12, 2016, 05:32:15 pm
content: Quote from: thehater on August 12, 2016, 05:21:47 pmNot sure either. Have you tried asking a Brontosaurus?Sorry, couldn't help myself. My knowledge of vintage stuff is poor at best.Now that I'm thinking about it, it does say 360uA on the plate, but that *is* a custom plate and may be referring to the instrument is some way. Is that possible?If you send me one of the ones that has a bent needle, I could measure exactly what the movement is. That might be your best bet - you have my address already.Jay

author: edavid
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2016, 07:51:23 pm
content: Have you tried Standard Meter Laboratory,http://sml-inc.com?They used to repair meter movements... I can't tell from their website if they still do.

author: thehater
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 15, 2016, 01:45:31 pm
content: @edavid Thank you for the heads up. Right now I'm working with Byram Labs (NJ), SML will be my next effort!

author: thehater
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 15, 2016, 02:11:10 pm
content: For a replacement it is 4.5x3"Please excuse the meter that I am using, it was handy@ "Left" side of the analog meter the unit measures: -.50ma@"center" side of the analog meter the unit measures: .00ma@"Right" side of the analog meter the units measures +.36maThis is taking into account that the analog meter has a bent needle.I would have to get the name plates manufactured (I have a source)

author: Jwalling
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 15, 2016, 02:16:23 pm
content: Quote from: thehater on August 15, 2016, 02:11:10 pmYou're missing 1 picture.Also, use the uA setting to get more accurate results, but it's starting to look like 1mA full scale.JayJay

author: thehater
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 15, 2016, 02:53:16 pm
content: I switched analog meters because I noticed the mechanical stop on the meter first displayed was giving me false numbers.I'm working off of the gage, so please excuse the deviations, its hard to setup.As It is printed:@Full left of meter = -360ua@center of meter = 0ua@Full Right of meter = 360uaHowever, the analog meter can overrun the Printed measurement lines and the full range appears to be +/-400ua

author: Jwalling
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 15, 2016, 02:56:04 pm
content: Quote from: thehater on August 15, 2016, 02:53:16 pmI think that's your answer. Somehow that rings a bell to me...Here's an oldie:http://www.ebay.com/itm/Large-Bakelite-vintage-strain-gauge-meter-400uA-Bruel-Kjaer-Steampunk-N-/272055296470?hash=item3f57c261d6:g:-TsAAOSwcBhWUHTuToo big and has issues with sticking.http://www.ebay.com/itm/1PC-Panel-Meter-SD-670-1-50-DC-50uA-60x70mm-DC-50uA-Class-2-0-Center-0-/252478558639?hash=item3ac8e511af:g:jFIAAOSw-YVXmZ-mToo small, and you'd have to mess with a new current shunt as it's +/-50uA.Jay

author: Jwalling
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 15, 2016, 03:24:31 pm
content: Wait a second, what about this one:http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Simpson-Electric-Company/03930/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMtFJx2zDaGuWCtUtEt6GtDkZ7b9r5xDXDc%3dYou'd have to calibrate it. Surely there must be a gain adjustment for the meter in the instrument?EDIT: And if there is, 500-0-500 appears to be a good keyword for eBay hits:http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw=500-0-500&_sac=1&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR5.TRC2.A0.H0.TRS0&_nkw=500-0-500&_sacat=0You'll have to do research on the mech. aspects.Jay

author: thehater
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 15, 2016, 03:41:47 pm
content: I hate making assumptions but there seems to be good evidence the unit was produced by Triplett (formerly of Ohio, now New Hampshire)1. They have existed for a while. This gage has been manufactured in its current state since the 1970s. Knowing the former manufacture (P&W, Colt Industries, Moore Technologies, and finally GCA TROPEL) they would lean towards such a company (my other assumption was Simpson)2. If you look at my original post, the photo of the rear of the meter, there is a serial number printed on the back in white. Now look here (http://www.ebay.com/itm/DC-MicroAmmeter-Triplett-Model-420-GL-500-0-500-UA-4-1-2-Meter-New-USA-/162156471633) A similar panel meter used to calculate distance, with similar printing on the back of the meter (similar color, similar font)Triplett Model 420 GLThe problem is that I am now looking for a 4.5 x 3" (rectangular meter). I'll follow up with them again, like most old things, the knowledge is lost (at the MFG) for this vintage equipment

author: Jwalling
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 15, 2016, 03:51:04 pm
content: Quote from: thehater on August 15, 2016, 03:41:47 pmIt doesn't look like 3" from the pictures, perhaps its the photo? Not that I'd doubt your measuring skills.Is it possible to modify the front panel for the Simpson meter?Jay

author: thehater
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 15, 2016, 04:14:07 pm
content: I've heard it described of me, "Error exists between keyboard and seat."

author: thehater
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 15, 2016, 04:19:54 pm
content: Viola, a Triplett Model 420-RBrochure:http://larsonmetercraft.com/Catalogs/Triplett.pdf

author: Jwalling
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 15, 2016, 04:50:25 pm
content: Quote from: thehater on August 15, 2016, 04:14:07 pmThat would be PEBKAC.Problem Exists Between Keyboard And Chair. See also ID10T form.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_error#ID-10-T_errorWhich led me to "press any key"https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_FriendlyJay

author: Jwalling
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 15, 2016, 04:59:08 pm
content: Quote from: thehater on August 15, 2016, 04:19:54 pmI don't see a 420-R in that pdf that's 500-0-500, though.What about 420-GL/B? Specifically part # 152-2282Still would need to modify the gain as well, assuming your current measurements are spot-on.Jay