Which scope to buy with a budget of around $1000 - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: DigitalAura
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2023, 01:30:48 pm
content: Hey folks,I'm struggling like hell right now trying to decide which scope I should buy. My budget is around $1000 USD.This question is reliant upon the scope I buy being able to be hacked.I currently have a Rigol ds1074z and Keysight DSOX1102G, plus a Rigol 1052e I'm wanting to sell to fund an upgrade.I'm currently considering the Rigol MSO5000, Siglent SDS2000X-Plus, or maybe the newish Rigol HDO1000 12-bit scope.I'm completely stuck as to what to purchase, bearing in mind the scope I want must be hackable to be able to upgrade the bandwidth and enable all features.Which scope would you suggest I buy? This is a similar question to the old question about spending a maximum of $800 on a scope, but with inflation etc and new scopes on the market.I'm completely stumped as to which would be the best purchase.Any help and advise would be appreciated.I accidentally posted this in the newbies section.Thanks

author: wasedadoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2023, 01:47:42 pm
content: Quote from: DigitalAura on September 10, 2023, 01:30:48 pmWhich is where I replied. Why didn't you remove the post in the Beginners section?

author: DigitalAura
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2023, 01:59:27 pm
content: An Error Has Occurred!You cannot delete your own topics in this board. Check to make sure this topic wasn't just moved to another board.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2023, 04:27:48 pm
content: This question has been asked many times before. Better look in the test equipment section for existing threads; you'll find a lot of relevant information

author: KungFuJosh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2023, 05:32:46 pm
content: The question has been asked a million times, and the answer is always Siglent SDS2000X-Plus. 😉If price is an issue, and you're patient, the Siglent will eventually go on sale again. If you're impatient, buy it anyway, it's a great value for what it is.

author: DigitalAura
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2023, 05:54:47 pm
content: I was thinking the Siglent looked the best from what I could see. Much faster serial decode etc and a nice bright screen. I'm not that fussed about HDMI Out, just looking for something that will do me for the long term.Sorry to anybody who found my grammar etc not right, I'm in a hell of a lot of pain right now and thinking isn't always easy.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2023, 05:56:15 pm
content: Above all, why do you feel the need to upgrade at all? You should only do that if/when you actually run into concrete limitations with your existing gear, and in that case, you should be sharing what those limitations were.

author: DigitalAura
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2023, 05:59:21 pm
content: The biggest limitation with my current hardware is the screen size. I find them too small as my eyesight isn't great. A nine or ten inch screen would make a huge difference.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2023, 06:09:06 pm
content: Quote from: DigitalAura on September 10, 2023, 05:59:21 pmAs someone whose presbyopia has increased dramatically over the past 2 years or so, I totally feel for you there!

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2023, 06:10:52 pm
content: P.S. In that case, one of the latest generation Rigol models may be well suited, since Dave showed in a recent video that they render to their HDMI ports at higher resolutions than the internal displays! That means one option could even be to use an external display.

author: Kean
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 10, 2023, 06:27:07 pm
content: You don't need a model with HDMI out to make use of a large screen, you just need a model with LAN and ability to do web based control from a computer.Easy to read with old eyes, and super quick to grab a screen shot. I do this often on my R&S RTB2004, but I've read that the Siglent models do it really well too.

author: DigitalAura
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2023, 06:49:37 pm
content: Thanks.I'm thinking Siglent SDS2000X-Plus will probably do just fine and being able to hack it to 500mhz is a bonus.I was initially thinking the Rigol 5000 series would be good, just the O/S looks kinda flaky, it does have 8Gs/s though.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2023, 06:53:44 pm
content: Quote from: DigitalAura on September 10, 2023, 05:59:21 pmI'd look at MigSig in that case.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2023, 07:40:37 pm
content: Quote from: DigitalAura on September 10, 2023, 05:59:21 pmThe best option for "big screen" seems to be the new Rigol DHOs with HDMI out. You can connect a big monitor to them and it scales the UI nicely.

author: skander36
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2023, 08:06:47 pm
content: It's up to you. If you are willing to pay extra 4-500$ for the Siglent 2104 then go for the Siglent. If not, Rigol 5k offer a lot of features. DHO 1K/4K is not a complete soution. It is a scope for those who need 12 bit but rely on the other scopes for Bode plot, LA, etc.

author: NE666
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2023, 08:13:35 pm
content: Quote from: DigitalAura on September 10, 2023, 06:49:37 pmHow so? I use mine daily and don't experience any issues. It's not perfect and it isn't suitable for all use cases but "flaky" is rather a leap, imho.

author: KungFuJosh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2023, 08:45:08 pm
content: I use the Siglent over the network cable on 27" screens. No issues reading anything there. 😉You should also consider bode plot speeds and other capabilities that the others just don't compare with in this price range.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 11, 2023, 12:43:37 am
content: Quote from: Kean on September 10, 2023, 06:27:07 pmI’ve used the RTB2004 and RTM3004 and agree that they have a great web interface. However, they don’t actually scale the user interface to higher resolution. (You just scale the bitmap.)As I understand it, the new Rigols actually scale the user interface on external displays (that is, they render it at higher resolution).

author: Kean
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 11, 2023, 03:05:02 am
content: Quote from: tooki on September 11, 2023, 12:43:37 amFrom what I saw, that was just the UI elements and not the scope traces. So it might be a little prettier, but it appears that it doesn't convey any extra measurement resolution.

author: adam4521
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 11, 2023, 07:09:44 am
content: If I was going to rely on the larger screen as prime, I’d want a video connection, not a web/VNC, to get the ‘update rate’.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 11, 2023, 07:17:56 am
content: Quote from: Kean on September 11, 2023, 03:05:02 amIt will have a much higher frame rate than a web connection.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 11, 2023, 07:36:37 am
content: Quote from: Fungus on September 11, 2023, 07:17:56 amNo. Likely the SoC Rigol used has an encoder which can stream video realtime with the same framerate as the display.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 11, 2023, 10:57:19 am
content: Quote from: Kean on September 11, 2023, 03:05:02 amYes, but that alone is already a big help in usability.

author: KungFuJosh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 11, 2023, 01:49:53 pm
content: Lots of speculation. Here's a screen capture video I made a couple years ago:

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 11, 2023, 10:44:02 pm
content: Quote from: KungFuJosh on September 11, 2023, 01:49:53 pmThat certainly doesn’t look very fast.

author: KungFuJosh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 12, 2023, 06:00:08 am
content: Quote from: tooki on September 11, 2023, 10:44:02 pm🤣🤣🤣 Sure. It updated in real time, same as the scope. But not all signals are that fast.

author: Kean
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 12, 2023, 01:10:45 pm
content: The web view doesn't replace the main scope display, it augments it (unless you are actually working remotely where HDMI output is of less help). So you can still see the fast updates on the scope but read the finer detail and text on the large screen. And easily take screenshots. With my RTB2004 it gives the best of both worlds in my opinion.I haven't tried the VNC control or HDMI out on my MSO5000 as that is on the bench where I typically just do testing of assembled PCBs. The RTB2004 is my primary scope on my R&D bench.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 12, 2023, 01:21:35 pm
content: Quote from: KungFuJosh on September 12, 2023, 06:00:08 amThen do a demo with a fast signal. It’s impossible to demonstrate UI responsiveness and display update rate of a web interface if all you show is a slow signal!(And what’s impossible to show in a screen capture is latency. I know from experience that even another 100-200ms of latency makes it much, much harder to use the controls of a scope. The RTB2004 and RTM3004, for example, have a fair bit of UI lag even when just using the internal display, enough that I often find them annoying to use. This is in stark contrast with every Keysight scope I’ve used, because they update the UI very quickly, no matter what else is going on.)

author: KungFuJosh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 12, 2023, 01:35:55 pm
content: Quote from: tooki on September 12, 2023, 01:21:35 pmThat's a fair point. I think I might setup my laptop over wifi near the scope so both screens can be seen at the same time. Over ethernet the latency is minimal, I'm curious to see how it will work on my old macbook.