Red Tesla launch - Is it still driveable ? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 06:41:51 pm
content: Edit - the launch is overNow what happens to the Tesla ?Can the doors be sealed and the car used as a capsule?The big question - can car electronics survive a lift off?If you still want to follow along:https://twitter.com/SpaceX?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

author: raptor1956
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 08:24:30 pm
content: I'd bet the electronics will do OK after all a car has to survive for years in pretty hostel environments. OTH, I would not be surprised if the battery pack was removed, not so much for weight but to reduce the chance of fire or other mishap. If they leave the battery in I'd guess it will be about mid level charge. Playing "Space Oddity" in space is not going to happen without an environment to transmit sound. If the animation is correct the Tesla is going to be set free by itself and not be attached to any adapter -- can you imagine an alien race discovering it just floating by?Brian

author: tpowell1830
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 08:41:09 pm
content: After skimming the article, it doesn't seem like there is any real science going on with the car? Going in and out of the Van Allen belt and then on to an elliptical orbit around Mars forever...

author: glarsson
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 08:44:22 pm
content: It's a red Tesla because a block of concrete or a tank of water is booooring.

author: mrflibble
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 08:51:06 pm
content: Quote from: tpowell1830 on February 06, 2018, 08:41:09 pmTest flight, so just a fun payload + data payload like on Voyager. Only unlike Voyager, this one won't leave our solar system. But nice touch IMO. I mean, if you're going to expend this much fuel might as well.

author: Muttley Snickers
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 08:52:29 pm
content: I hope they get a speeding ticket.

author: mrflibble
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 08:54:19 pm
content: Woohooh, 2 out of 3.

author: glarsson
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 09:00:12 pm
content: Quote from: ez24 on February 06, 2018, 06:41:51 pmIt will keep orbiting the Earth, Mars and the Sun for a very long time.Quote from: ez24 on February 06, 2018, 06:41:51 pmIt is too late to seal the doors. Also, what about the missing roof?

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 09:01:22 pm
content: AmazingI cannot figure out how to link a video of their landing - I am sure it will be on the news tonight. Is there a missing third core?================Falcon Heavy side cores have landed at SpaceX’s Landing Zones 1 and 2.https://twitter.com/SpaceX?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 09:06:15 pm
content: It would be really funny if there is a stowaway sitting in the Tesla

author: tpowell1830
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 09:09:36 pm
content: Yea, woohoo.. Red Tesla in space, yeah.. I guess Elon Musk has money to burn. The Tesla wasn't free, although I don't know if it was complete or not, so, expensive car. It costs about $20,000 a pound to launch anything into space from earth, so, as I said, burning money is fun!!If it was actually a science payload that sent data back, it would be useful. A part of me says "Wow that is cool! Launching and landing the boosters, awesome! Going to Mars orbit, super awesome! A red Tesla in orbit around Mars... weird, but cool... what a waste of opportunity."

author: glarsson
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 09:14:12 pm
content: It was the first test of a new rocket. Who would place their new billion dollar satellite or a crewed capsule on top of that?Would you still complain if it was the usual water tank or concrete block?

author: grumpydoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 09:17:20 pm
content: Quote from: glarsson on February 06, 2018, 09:00:12 pmDoes anyone else find this faintly obscene - just creating a huge piece of space junk for the sake of showing off.

author: PChi
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 09:19:12 pm
content: Is the rocket Lots Of Trouble Usually Serious! (The Tesla Roadster is an electrified Lotus Elise).

author: ajb
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 09:31:53 pm
content: Quote from: ez24 on February 06, 2018, 09:01:22 pmIt's not unusual for them to lose the link (or at least the video feed) to the ASDS during landings, although usually it comes back before they end the broadcast. So either there was a RUD or the link went down a lot harder than usual for some other reason. I would assume they have a more reliable telemetry link from the stage itself, but in all of the landings I've watched they've never seemed to pass along any such info to the livecast, they always seem to wait for the video. Perhaps that's just for dramatic flair.Anyway, two out of three isn't bad for a test launch like this, and on top of the apparently successful high thrust near-landing they performed on the last launch, everything seems to be coming up SpaceX lately!

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 09:40:43 pm
content: Quote from: tpowell1830 on February 06, 2018, 09:09:36 pmAccording to the BBC news site it's his own 'old' Telsa roadster.Quote from: grumpydoc on February 06, 2018, 09:17:20 pmHmm, maybe. All new experimental launch platforms have to lift off with some sort of 'low value' test payload though (nobody is going to trust it with a real one), and it did make for some cool viewing. It is also designed as a Mars space mission launcher, so that's where the payload needs to go. Sometimes a bit of sheer exuberance is appropriate. The car is also contains on of those Ark data disks.

author: ajb
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 09:40:58 pm
content: Bummer, sounds like the center core didn't make it, according to the unhosted stream audio here:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-B_tWbjFIGI&feature=youtu.be&t=2307

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 09:56:26 pm
content: Live Stream of car...https://youtu.be/aBr2kKAHN6M

author: Stray Electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 09:57:49 pm
content: Quote from: ez24 on February 06, 2018, 09:06:15 pmThere is, inside of the car there's a tiny red model of the Tesla roadster complete with it's own driver.

author: babysitter
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 10:00:07 pm
content: There would have been a block of concrete or something other useless deadweight, otherwise.But:CORE?

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 10:01:07 pm
content: Quote from: Gyro on February 06, 2018, 09:40:43 pmI wonder if they sterilized it. Maybe someday aliens will find his DNA and make millions of Musk clones.

author: glarsson
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 10:05:11 pm
content: Also a copy of the Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy in the instrument panel (DON'T PANIC in big friendly letters).

author: AF6LJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 10:16:54 pm
content: This is just too much fun.

author: Stray Electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 10:17:19 pm
content: Quote from: Gyro on February 06, 2018, 09:40:43 pmFWIW, The news here reported that it's a 2008 model.

author: mac.6
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 10:17:34 pm
content: and a towelcore seems lost (heard on live audio stream)

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 10:18:21 pm
content: I wonder if 'Starman' is still repeating on the radio. In space, nobody can hear....

author: AF6LJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 06, 2018, 11:36:27 pm
content: Here ya go...Live streaming video from the first car to orbit the Earth.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2018, 01:37:59 am
content: Seems like a far more use of the test payload capacity would have been a bunch of small amateur satellites, something similar to the cubesats created by students.Instead all this did is create more space junk.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2018, 01:47:39 am
content: Quote from: james_s on February 07, 2018, 01:37:59 amOn this trajectory cubesats are no use. Normally those benefit from a nice, low orbit and the easy communication that allows. The trajectory of this mission is normally reserved for the flagship missions of major space agencies. It goes way out into interplanetary space quickly. Nobody capable of building a satellite suitable for such a mission would be willing to spend millions or even billions on development, only to get the craft shot into a useless trajectory and with a high probability of losing the craft.Besides, space junk is a problem in Earth orbit. On this trajectory, not so much.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2018, 01:53:17 am
content: Apparently, it's not an actual car. If you look at the footage, it seems to be a support structure with Tesla panels mounted on top. See the wheel well in the attached imagine. In the actual footage you can see right through the car in some shots. This all makes sense too, because you don't want an unpredictable payload in your rocket.Driving it would be out of the question.

author: BradC
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2018, 01:58:04 am
content: Quote from: james_s on February 07, 2018, 01:37:59 amGiven there was a very real chance of the launch failing in some spectacular manner, that would leave a number of junior satellite fabricators feeling very let down.

author: AF6LJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 07, 2018, 02:29:56 am
content: It is the actual car complete and ready to drive.It's Musk's personal Model S Roadster.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2018, 02:48:46 am
content: Quote from: AF6LJ on February 07, 2018, 02:29:56 amDo you have a source that states it's unmodified and ready to drive? The footage seems to quite clearly show it is. There's a frame and empty space where the steering rack and motors normally would be. None of the pre-launch photo's show the bottom, conveniently enough.

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2018, 03:20:39 am
content: Quote from: james_s on February 07, 2018, 01:37:59 amThis was discussed on the radio. There was a great chance the rocket would explode and if it did the students experiments would be destroyed. They determined it was not worth the chance.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2018, 03:37:29 am
content: Must not have had the battery on board, since Musk announced in the post launch news conference that the batteries for the live TV from the car would last only about 12 hours. Even half charge on the vehicle battery should give far more amp-hours than that.Pretty bold move to launch the Tesla, no matter how much they simplified and braced it. The advantage of the concrete block is the very simple and reliable dynamics. I'm sure things were dancing every which way in there during the boost.Another thing that surprised me about the video section between the 2nd and 3rd burn of the second stage is that it is not stabilized during this phase of flight as you can see by watching the earth and sun drift past. Makes for some really great shots but seems riskier to shut down stabilization and restart than to keep it on for the few hours.And just in case you haven't heard, the third booster apparently ran out of fuel for the igniters and couldn't start two of three rocket motors. Hit at 300 mph either on or close to the landing barge. Close enough to take out two of the barge propulsion systems.

author: AF6LJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 07, 2018, 04:00:36 am
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on February 07, 2018, 02:48:46 amIt was in one of his news conferences.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2018, 04:03:37 am
content: If I were to design the "payload", I would add a few solar panels and have it constantly transmit some SSTV mode that any hobbyist can receive with a RTLSDR and a sufficiently good antenna/preamp setup. It would definitely be interesting to see how long such a "simple" device would stay operational. And maybe even get some good astrophotography out of it.

author: bitwelder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2018, 06:09:37 am
content: Elon Musk: "Printed on the circuit board of a car in deep space"

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2018, 06:46:46 am
content: Quote from: bitwelder on February 07, 2018, 06:09:37 amSomeday this car will be so valuable, someone will send a rocket to get it back

author: Brumby
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 07, 2018, 08:14:57 am
content: Quote from: ez24 on February 07, 2018, 06:46:46 amNot sure about sending a rocket to get it ... but the thought did cross my mind about it becoming of interest as an historical artifact.

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2018, 08:30:11 am
content: Elon Musk Gives Updates on Mission to Mars.If you missed this, watch it. BFR, heh, heh. Old Doom players will understand.As for what's underneath the Tesla, given some discussions of the intended possible final orbits, I'd guess it still has the booster attached.Let's hope there are no fire engines parked out around Mars.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2018, 11:39:59 pm
content: Quote from: BradC on February 07, 2018, 01:58:04 amSo what? How often does a private citizen have a chance to launch something into space? So there's a good chance the mission will fail, that's a fact of life when talking of space exploration. I certainly would have been willing to volunteer time designing and constructing something that might make it to space, even if there's a very real chance the launch will fail. A workable satellite doesn't have to cost millions of dollars, it could be done for a few thousand with volunteer efforts. Certainly had Elon put his car up for auction it would have fetched more than enough to fund such an endeavor.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2018, 11:43:55 pm
content: Quote from: AF6LJ on February 07, 2018, 04:00:36 amDo you have a link? As far as I can tell, they never actually say it's a drivable car.

author: raptor1956
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2018, 11:49:59 pm
content: It's Elon's personal roadster and the only thing that would prevent it from being driven if it were recovered is the high likelihood that the battery pack was removed for safety. The "Don't Panic" sign on the center console display looked more like a sign attached to the screen than the screen itself. I'm not sure how a consumer LCD panel would handle the vacuum of space -- my guess is not very well.Brian

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2018, 11:57:39 pm
content: Quote from: raptor1956 on February 07, 2018, 11:49:59 pmDo you have a source? Because I've seen a lot of claims being made either way, but nothing trustworthy to substantiate it. The only real thing I've seen so far is the footage, which seems to quite clearly show an empty front end with a support frame not part of the car. Obviously, if you did use a shell of a car rather than a full car, it would be beneficial to be vague about it for PR purposes. It having been Elon's personal Roadster wouldn't prevent them from stripping it and modifying it for their purposes either.

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 12:12:04 am
content: Quote from: raptor1956 on February 07, 2018, 11:49:59 pmThe battery pack.. the motor. The transmission. The drive shafts. The suspension.It's a shell.It's not like they just drove it up there and tied it down with some ratchet straps. It is very much modified and undrivable.

author: AF6LJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 12:13:35 am
content: Quote from: Monkeh on February 08, 2018, 12:12:04 amDo you have a link to support this claim?

author: AF6LJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 12:15:43 am
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on February 07, 2018, 11:57:39 pmAt this point we are only guessing, however....During the end of the of the 2 hour plus live in space video you could see the car venting something, maybe battery coolant.I am not convinced the car is a shell, however it could be.

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 12:15:55 am
content: Quote from: AF6LJ on February 08, 2018, 12:13:35 amHave you looked at the video showing a total void between the front wheels? That's where the motor and transmission and suspension should be. They ain't.E: Correction, the motor and transmission are in the arse. Still.. where's the brake disc? Where's the hub? Where's the shock and the spring and..Right. Not there, because those parts bouncing around is not desired.It stands to reason they'd take the batteries out - they're not going to cope well with the temperature swings, for a start. And the motor.. well, you've got the batteries out. The transmission and driveshafts went away with the suspension..

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 12:44:30 am
content: Quote from: Monkeh on February 08, 2018, 12:15:55 amDon't see it, sorry. Do you mean this reflection? (1st pic)Or the A & B things in 2nd pic?

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 12:46:16 am
content: https://youtu.be/aBr2kKAHN6M?t=7298It took all of ten seconds to find that.Oh, and yours alone shows plenty: Where's the brake disc, hub, strut? I know what a reflection is, thanks.. Oh, and that's not a reflection, that's a mud guard. Holy hell, it's like you've never seen a car before.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 12:51:10 am
content: Quote from: AF6LJ on February 08, 2018, 12:15:43 amI think that was residual propellant or fuel venting from the engine combustion chamber, though it could have been monopropellant too.

author: Red Squirrel
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 12:55:31 am
content: They may have removed parts that could have compromised the mission, like brakes and any small "loose" items. Maybe even the battery pack. Now with a real pay load you normally you would not worry that much about that as the odds of something going wrong is slim, but the last thing you want is the cause of the mission failure to be because of your dummy pay load. Now if the mission was specifically to send the car then they probably would have sent it as is.Even the tires, I wonder if they were actually filled with some solid material. Wouldn't they burst in space?It would be cool if they had made it so a solar panel module popped out of the trunk and that they could continue to communicate with it. But then you need reaction wheels and a high gain transmission antenna etc...

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 12:58:22 am
content: Quote from: TerraHertz on February 08, 2018, 12:44:30 amYes, the A and B things.

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 01:01:04 am
content: Quote from: Red Squirrel on February 08, 2018, 12:55:31 amThey're probably solid filled just because of the temperatures. As far as the pressure goes, it's only 1 bar. Underinflate them by 1 bar and they'll expand just as if down here. And they'd probably take the overpressure just fine, too.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 01:01:55 am
content: Quote from: Red Squirrel on February 08, 2018, 12:55:31 amI don't see any disk brakes or a steering rack. Regardless of what's in the rest of the car, it's not a drivable car without those. The wheel doesn't seem to have a real axle either, which points towards it being a shell mounted on a frame.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 01:03:59 am
content: I don't think there's gas in the tires. Not necessarily because of the pressure difference, but one of the tires inadvertently bursting could send the spacecraft into a spin or damage something. It's not as if people are going to kick your tires anyway.

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 01:09:27 am
content: OK, that's what I get for assuming the pic someone posted would actually be the best illustration of their point.And I'd watched the Starman video before; didn't want to watch it again. It's cool, but not much action...Anyway, better shot below. Yeah, it's been hollowed out.I suppose the struts are attaching it to the booster rocket.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 01:25:38 am
content: Quote from: TerraHertz on February 08, 2018, 01:09:27 amThe point of the earlier picture is that you can see the actual struts. Those aren't normally inside of cars. It also shows the lack of parts you would expect. Having the Earth picture would just have people yelling that it's too dark to see anything.Both imagines combined paint the most complete picture.

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 02:06:18 am
content: Even if the car was 100% in perfect condition, it is not drive-able because there is nothing to drive on. But I wonder what would happen if someone could floor it and get the wheels spinning. Would all the forces cancel each other? Would there be any difference between front wheel drive and rear wheel drive? My guess it would turn over end to end?Regardless I find this amazing. I just think this will confuse aliens. We need new laws against confusing aliens.

author: Brumby
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 04:17:59 am
content: Quote from: Red Squirrel on February 08, 2018, 12:55:31 amMy guess is they simply removed the valves. The air would then escape as the launch vehicle flew into less and less dense atmosphere.

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 05:14:56 am
content: You remember that interstellar asteroid Oumuamua that passed through the Solar system recently?https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%CA%BBOumuamuaThe latest imagery would seem to show someone, somewhere, a long time ago, beat Elon to it.

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 05:29:42 am
content: Quote from: ez24 on February 08, 2018, 02:06:18 amI wonder how much fuel that booster has left?Because it would be pretty funny if Elon has planned to soft-land it on Mars. Say, within camera range of one of the rovers.He's talking about permanent eliptical orbits. But you never know with him.Considering his planned BFR Mars mission rocket probably has the lift capability to bring that car back to Earth, imagine the sale price. "First private car to stand on another world." He could practically fund the entire Mars project with that.QuoteProbably way too late.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 07:51:42 am
content: Quote from: TerraHertz on February 08, 2018, 05:29:42 amLanding on a planet that can potentially sustain life requires very stringent decontamination of everything involved. Landers are the most strictly regulated, with different tiers depending on the likelihood of contaminating the target body or area. The Curiosity lander has been decontaminated for surface duty and even it wasn't allowed to investigate salty streams found on the surface of Mars, as that would require even more stringent decontamination. Wet conditions are graded differently than dry conditions and the Curiosity team didn't expect to encounter fluids on the surface. Its successor is likely to be decontaminated to a higher level.Landing the car on Mars isn't really something you can do on a whim. We're not even talking about the complexities of getting through the annoyingly uncooperative Martian atmosphere.

author: ChrisLX200
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 09:44:20 am
content: I would think that anything that could move on the car would have been thoroughly secured - welded probably. A rocket launch involves tremendous vibration and stress so things like the suspension - which may end up vibrating sympathetically - would be locked in position. Further, none of the plastics/synthetics/oils/greases/seals/paint are rated for use in vacuum, nor the temperatures and hard radiation to be found in space. The car will be destroyed pretty damn quick, it might not survive in one piece for even one loop out to the asteroid belt and back.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 10:09:21 am
content: Quote from: ChrisLX200 on February 08, 2018, 09:44:20 amThere's no suspension any more, at least not in the front. I also imagine UV radiation wreaking havoc on the carbon and plastic panels. Even with the protection of the atmosphere, plastics quickly deteriorate to dust in sunlight. If the car is spinning there will be thermal stresses too.

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 11:25:36 am
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on February 08, 2018, 07:51:42 amYeah yeah yeah, we all know this. But you are forgetting that Elon is proposing to have humans on Mars by 2025. So much for bacterial sterility. Also, his proposed mission involves a lot of rocket-braking on Mars entry.I was _partly_ joking about landing the car. But not entirely. Hence wondering how much fuel (if any) the booster still has.Btw, I'd missed the news of salty streams found. Thanks, now to go googling. You sure you're not thinking of Liberal tears?

author: Howardlong
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 12:05:01 pm
content: Regarding placing third party experimental payloads such as those from AMSAT, this has been done several times on test launches particularly with Arianespace until recent years. Then the aerospace engineering company became an accountancy conglomerate with a few engineers, and since then free rides have been elusive.Arianespace gained quite a bit from AMSAT's involvement. Firstly, they pioneered the adapter rings that allow multiple payloads on board Ariane rockets, spreading cost from the prime contractor across secondary payload customers. They also act as an open organisation for platform and integration demonstration for Ariane's customers: most launch customers don't like third parties sniffing around their IP during integration.Yes, AMSAT have had launch failure, such as the Phase IIIA launch failure in 1980 which saw global news coverage at the time. The reaction to this by AMSAT was immediately to try again. Frankly, if you go into space, and can't accept any risk of failure, you should find something else to do with your life.The difference nowadays is the degree of risk-averseness, and that includes such things as mitigating against the risk, say, of an in-orbit collision of multiple launch objects. As such, insurers have become key parts of the equation, and the associated costs of that, which can be prohibitive.The car itself, well that will not be simply a car popped into the faring with a few bolts. It will have been through substantial thermal, vacuum and vibration testing to mitigate against such things as outgassing. I doubt there's much actually inside the body, and what's left will have been highly modified to satisfy the aforementioned testing.

author: AF6LJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 05:34:42 pm
content: Some more information of the future of the Tesla Roadster.https://spaceflightnow.com/2018/02/08/starman-puts-earth-in-the-rearview-mirror/

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 05:59:38 pm
content: Quote from: TerraHertz on February 08, 2018, 11:25:36 amAs soon as humans touch Mars, quarantine is obviously over. Humans are terribly messy when they live or even go somewhere. There's bags of poop on the Moon. However, we're currently sending various robots there with the explicit purpose of looking for signs of life. We haven't really done that before. Other than the quest for life having pure scientific value, we're also trying to answer the more morally loaded question whether we might destroy a unique branch of life by going to Mars. Finding life might ultimately mean not colonising the planet, though that's a complicated discussion.Are Ozzies doing this horrible liberals versus conservatives thing now too? I have trouble understanding how people relish in basic tribalism while whole countries tear themselves to shreds.

author: AF6LJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 06:22:28 pm
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on February 08, 2018, 05:59:38 pmWe might destroy some odd form of mold or something on Mars.Survival of the fittest is the rule of the day.If we are to survive as a species we need to reach out and colonize space, including Mars and anywhere else habitation is easy.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 06:36:18 pm
content: Quote from: AF6LJ on February 08, 2018, 06:22:28 pmOne simply mold could learn us an amazing amount of things about ourselves and the nature of the universe.Killing the first otherworldly life we find isn't a good look either. Space is quite big. There's other places for us to go. Unless the entire solar system turns out to be teeming with life making it literally impossible to avoid, we should be able to not act as pubescent as we've done in most of our history.

author: schmitt trigger
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 06:44:04 pm
content: We need to see this as what it really is: A brilliant publicity stunt. Definitively beats a Super Bowl ad.Look right now how the web is trending with these stories. How many more people will now consider purchasing a Tesla.I'm almost sure that Tesla will be inundated with orders for similar red roadsters.

author: glarsson
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 07:02:59 pm
content: Quote from: schmitt trigger on February 08, 2018, 06:44:04 pmUnfortunately this red Tesla roadster was from 2008 and the model hasn't been manufactured for several years. The new Tesla roadster is not ready yet (probably several years away).

author: AF6LJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 07:04:29 pm
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on February 08, 2018, 06:36:18 pmI am of two minds on this...On the one hand I agree with preservation of life, however we like every other form of life on this planet are programmed from the genetic level to succeed.For us as humans time is short; we need to get off this rock within the next ninety or so years, or we won't be able to and that will lead to our extinction.Sooner or later...The whole solar system is teaming with bacteria. Comets contain in their ice amino acids, it is theorized RNA may exist in some form in comets.From a purely evolutionary point of view we are suppose to colonize the planets, and down the road, the stars.We like to think of ourselves as being civilized and having a high moral standard, more humane... Truth be known; We are only slightly above the rest of the land dwellers, and maybe behind the whales and dolphins that are at the top of the food chain in the sea.Overpopulation is not helping our cause, we need to get off this rock and get off now.

author: AF6LJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 07:06:10 pm
content: Quote from: schmitt trigger on February 08, 2018, 06:44:04 pmThey are having trouble filling existing orders now.The car side of Musk's business empire could very well be a victim of its own success.

author: donotdespisethesnake
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 07:32:41 pm
content: Quote from: AF6LJ on February 08, 2018, 07:06:10 pmI don't get that. They have been losing money hand over fist, in what way is Tesla a success? They may become a victim of their failure to make a profit, that would make sense.

author: metrologist
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 08:54:03 pm
content: Quote from: ez24 on February 08, 2018, 02:06:18 amWhen I raced RC, we used mid-air throttle to control pitch. If you floored it, the car would pitch up. Once I hit the brake hard and the car rotated forward and landed on its roof.

author: calexanian
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 09:14:59 pm
content: There was science being done. The Air Force was having SpaceX conduct maneuvering operations while in the Van Allen Belt, and beyond. As said before the car was just a fun thing. Better than a concrete block as mentioned. The car itself, an older roadster, is not particularly valuable. They pop up on ebay from time to time for reasonable prices. They are nowhere near as functional as say a model S and the mindset of a Tesla buyer is not to have an impractical two seater with limited range and none of the fancy toys. They want newest, latest and greatest.I don't know about you buy seeing the pictures of Starman floating about if his chariot did my head and soul some good. In these days of over sensitization and politicization of everything I needed a little old fashioned can do attitude kind of thing and a little humor to know the current human condition is not as tragic as it might seem.

author: AF6LJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 09:27:16 pm
content: Quote from: calexanian on February 08, 2018, 09:14:59 pmI couldn't agree more, glad to see something other than hand wringing, overly sensitive soy boys bitching and cry-bullying about everything...

author: drussell
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2018, 01:15:20 am
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on February 08, 2018, 05:59:38 pmReally?Can you cite a source for that piece of wisdom?

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 09, 2018, 05:54:57 am
content: Quote from: drussell on February 09, 2018, 01:15:20 amJust google moon poop.

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2018, 08:54:37 am
content: Sounds of the blast offhttps://youtu.be/ImoQqNyRL8Y

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2018, 09:09:05 am
content: Quote from: AF6LJ on February 08, 2018, 07:04:29 pmI actually mostly agree with you. It's time we buy ourselves some insurance. It still won't cover everything and comes with risks of its own, but we need to make that step. If we stay on our rock we're as good as dead.However, that doesn't mean we have to stomp on the rest of the solar system as we've done on anything else in our past. The will to survive doesn't require destroying everything else. There've been a lot of atrocities in the past that have been justified by "it's them or us". It's also time we become a more developed and grown up species. To grow into a solar system spanning society, we'll have to overcome some of the mechanism that served us in nature, but work against us now. It's no use colonising the solar system if we just continue our infighting. The threat of a nuclear holocaust is scary enough if the purpetrators have to live on the same planet they just bumbed. Just imagine how scary that threat is when someone is safely on his own planet and not dealing with the consequences.Of course, if would be rather disappointing to destroy the only other life we know in the universe, only to find out it actually was the only other life.

author: AF6LJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 09, 2018, 12:51:42 pm
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on February 09, 2018, 09:09:05 amI get it; I'm being pragmatic.Consider this when you take the top 6000 people on the planet, the Super Class, the ones who run this planet, the vast majority of them are less civilized less humane, than the rest of us.Who do you think is going to make the decisions regarding colonization??

author: paulca
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2018, 12:56:47 pm
content: First Lithium battery fire in space.

author: AF6LJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 09, 2018, 01:05:22 pm
content: Quote from: ez24 on February 09, 2018, 08:54:37 amThanks that was Good..

author: schmitt trigger
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2018, 02:00:59 pm
content: Quote from: paulca on February 09, 2018, 12:56:47 pmA good name for future Tesla Roadsters: Tesla Super Nova

author: paulca
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2018, 03:24:23 pm
content: Quote from: schmitt trigger on February 09, 2018, 02:00:59 pmOr to keep the ode to '2010' "The Tesla Lucifer"

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2018, 03:54:22 pm
content: Quote from: cleaningOut on February 09, 2018, 03:42:15 pmThank you for this useless contribution.

author: raptor1956
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2018, 05:17:42 pm
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on February 09, 2018, 03:54:22 pmCan you both be right?Brian

author: madires
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2018, 05:30:55 pm
content: Isn't there more than enough space junk already? They could have offered to transport a scientific satellite for free.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2018, 06:01:33 pm
content: Quote from: madires on February 09, 2018, 05:30:55 pmThis has been addressed:Quote from: Mr. Scram on February 07, 2018, 01:47:39 amQuote from: Mr. Scram on February 08, 2018, 02:56:30 pm

author: madires
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2018, 06:11:44 pm
content: IIRC, SpaceX have some experience in blowing up expensive satellites. There was a classified US one not long time ago (2 billion?).

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2018, 06:28:59 pm
content: Quote from: madires on February 09, 2018, 06:11:44 pmInformation is scarce as it was a classified mission, but SpaceX commented that the rocket performed nominally and did everything correct. Everyone else declined to comment.It's speculated that the payload didn't properly separate from the second stage with both of them falling back down to Earth, due to the inability to boost to the final orbit with the second stage attached. Considering the payload was secret, it's most likely that the connector between the second stage and the payload was also secret and therefore built by Northrop Grumman. If this part failed the payload would be lost through no fault of SpaceX, which coincides with their statement and the few things we do know. SpaceX is obviously bound by non-disclosure contracts, but they've been suprising explicit for something generally not commented on. It looks like they had or sought permission to publicly declare it wasn't their product that malfunctioned, which seems fair considering how high the stakes are and how failed launches tarnish a reputation.Some suggest that it actually may have made orbit and that it's all an elaborate ruse to divert attention from the satellite, but that seems less likely to me. You might fool the public, but the people you really want to fool will have equipment to track any new satellites coming by or going up.

author: madires
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2018, 06:47:26 pm
content: The highlight of this night is 2018 CB.

author: AF6LJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 09, 2018, 07:51:10 pm
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on February 09, 2018, 06:28:59 pmI believe the payload did in fact get deployed.Keep in mind our government is pron to disinformation, and if they can claim a highly classified payload that may or may not have been targeted toward some dysfunctional government did in fact get deployed, we will never know...This by the way is not the first time this would have happened.

author: Howardlong
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2018, 09:31:06 am
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on February 09, 2018, 06:01:33 pmFWIW, AMSAT has quite a history of sending experimental satellites (instead of concrete) into GTO, and has had a MARS mission waiting for a launch for well over a decade, but these are not cubesats, they're the size of a washing machine. The power and link budgets for cubesats would severely limit their usefulness much outside LEO or MEO. The other problem, is that the pace that SpaceX is innovating, developing and engineering limits the viability of being dependent on outside organisations who may not realistically have resources compatible with this.Irrespective, while it would've been great to have more experimental and science payloads, it did achieve enormous exposure, and while of course the car was a stunt, it's things like this that sit in the human psyche and encourages kids into science and technology. SpaceX is helping to make science cool.

author: nfmax
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2018, 09:43:19 am
content: One aspect I haven't seen commented on anywhere is that the Tesla seems to have survived the launch environment without being shaken to bits. Obviously, we don't know how much 'customisation' may have taken place, but it is at least plausible that the last 40 years or so of automotive engineering, from the great Japanese onslaught onwards, have seen reliability engineering improvements such that standard automotive practice is now more-or-less 'as good as' spacecraft structural engineering, only much, much cheaper. Which in turn may have implications on the cost of future spacecraft.Much cheaper launch + much cheaper payload = ?

author: raptor1956
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2018, 12:45:32 am
content: Quote from: nfmax on February 10, 2018, 09:43:19 amYes, 100% agree. I mentioned it before, perhaps in the other SpaceX thread, but automotive technology and manufacturing has evolved to deal with the harsh environments across the globe and function as expected for years with little maintenance other than oil and filter changes and consumable replacement. And you hit the nail on the head with reference to the Japanese for dramatically improving quality and doing so at consumer price points.Now, there are factors in space that vehicles on Earth don't have to deal with and I'd guess unfettered UV would be high on the list of factors that will quite quickly turn the roadsters seats and interior materials into powder. The tires might last a bit longer but they will also succumb before long. But, so long as it is able to avoid a debris cloud it should survive quite a while without much significant damage to the body or glass -- Hubble's mirror probably has a few micro impacts by now but it's still useable nearly 30 years later.Astronomers think the orbit should be fairly stable going out to some million years but sooner or later Jupiter will alter the orbit to the point where it might, well, Set the Controls for the Heart of the Sun.Brian

author: BrianHG
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 12, 2018, 01:14:38 pm
content: I have a question: If direct exposure to the sun can make dark materials in space even at earth's orbit over 200 degrees, why doesn't the any of the black plastic dashboard, or seats, or tires, or even the regular automotive red paint show any sines of deterioration, or evidence of being baked?

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 12, 2018, 01:41:41 pm
content: Quote from: BrianHG on February 12, 2018, 01:14:38 pmApparently, carbon fibre can stand that kind of heat.http://www.protechcomposites.com/high-temperature-carbon-fiber-panels/"High Temperature Panels. Protech's high temperature carbon fiber panels are produced using a specially formulated high temperature, high strength epoxy resin. The result is a lightweight carbon panel that can withstand heat as high as 400 degrees Fahrenheit with minimal thermal expansion."That's 205 degrees science.