First Lab: Need a scope Looking at DS2072A and DS1104Z but can't decide. - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / beginners

author: ClearZ
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: June 17, 2014, 11:55:51 pm
content: Hey All,I'm a long time watcher of the EEVBlog podcast but this is my first time posting at the forums. I am a software engineer but have always kind off, regretted not doing EE instead. To remedy this situation I have decided to build a lab here at home and start doing electronics as a hobby. I have lots of components, arduinos, raspberry pi's etc but recently came into a bit of cash that will allow me to finally buy some much needed test equipment. I have been looking at the following items.Equipment TypeManufactureModelPriceWebOscilloscope:RigolDS2072A€710LinkPower Supply:RigolDP832€304LinkFunction Generator:SiglentSDG1025€310LinkI have been doing a lot of research before selecting these items. The only issue I may have is with the DS2072A which looks like a wonderful scope and the "Upgrade Options" (300Mhz) make the deal that much more attractive.I was all set until I noticed theDS1074Zwith its 4 inputs and about €250 cheaper. It seems to do a lot what the DS2072 does but slower but isn't as hackable. I have seen similar questions asked about these two scopes but the answers lack much depth. I am looking for reasons as a beginner I should go for one over the other. The difference in cash saved is really only secondary to more functional reasons to choose one. Looking forward to hearing some advice.John.

author: mrflibble
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 18, 2014, 12:41:07 am
content: Re: scope choice, I had much the same decision to be made some time ago. And I went for the DS1074Z over the DS2072A because of 1) the extra channels and 2) the difference in cost. I've been using those extra channel so many times already that I don't regret the decision for a minute. The main thing that I think I would have liked is a dedicated jog wheel to scroll through recorded waveforms; but the current capability is workable. Also, the multiple channels are really handy if you use 2 channels to make a poor man's differential measurement. I used that for the measurement of high side mosfet gate voltage in an H-bridge, and it worked a treat. Better than I expected actually.Anyways, it will depend on what you need it for. You said"I have seen similar questions asked about these two scopes but the answers lack much depth."... what kind of information are you looking for? If you could give more detailed information on the type of measurements you are likely to be making, then maybe people can give some better advice.As for the DP832, I don't own one myself, but from what I read it is not super duper value for money. I did look into getting one, but decided not to. Anyways, there's an entire thread with more info on that...

author: rodpp
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 18, 2014, 03:49:30 am
content: The DS1074Z is hackable.

author: raw-electrons
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: June 18, 2014, 04:38:53 am
content: I just bought a DS1074Z, and it should arrive in two days. I, too, am a CS guy who has always been interested in EE, recently turned to electronics as a hobby, and this will be my first scope. I had to make the same decision you are having to make, and this is how I arrived at my choice:I was actually content to get the DS1102E, but for just $150 more the DS1074Z seemed like a good price just for the iterative improvements. Add in the 2 extra channels, and it is an absolutely great deal!Going to the DS2072(A), gives some nice improvements in features over the DS1074Z, but the key for me is that they are nearly all improvements. There aren't that many exclusive features that only the DS2072(A) has. My research leads me to believe that the DS1074Z has most of the same features as its bigger brother, just not as refined. Thus, in the end, it came down do which one I would find more useful, the ability to go to 200Mhz or 300Mhz (with the corresponding memory depth), or having two additional channels.Given that I'm a beginner, I will likely be playing around with analog circuits which even a 20Mhz scope would easily handle. I've been playing around with AVR chips, and they max out around 30Mhz (which is just at the end of the viable range for a 100Mhz scope). I kept trying to think of the things I might need that additional bandwidth for, and kept realizing that all the higher frequency things I'm interested in are digital, so if I ever get there, a high end digital signal analyzer might be what I'll need.Ultimately the question that made up my mind was: As a beginner having to debug my own circuits, will it be more useful for me to have additional probes or more bandwidth. I think I'll be able to find my mistakes faster with two more probes in my circuit. I think it's unlikely that my circuits will be plagued by glitches which a 100Mhz scope can't detect, or that will require some of the more advanced triggering and waveform playback.The worst part of having to make this decision is that I'm a beginner, so I don't have enough experience to know what I'll need and what I won't, and I'm scarred of investing my money in a scope that won't meet my needs; I know how you feel. I decided to dive in and start learning, I'm confident that this is more than enough scope for me, at least for the next few years, if not more.Good luck making your choice!R-E

author: hans
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 18, 2014, 07:45:13 am
content: I've had to make the same choice (as many hobbyists do these days!) between the DS2072 and DS1xxxZ (I actually got the DS1074Z-S).It is hackable; Bandwidth, Memory depth, UART/SPI/I2C Decoders & Trigger options. There is a very very buggy 500uV/div "option" which I do not recommended to install (there is an option for All including 500uV/div, and one All without 500uV/div - pick wisely).I choose the DS1074Z-S over the DS2000 because:- 4 channels; very useful to abuse it as a LA for SPI and such.Or probe an I2C device with 1-2 analog channels.Poor man's 2ch "differential" probe.- Unit is more compact. I'm a bit cramped for space. Downside; fan is quite small and noisy.- It does most of the stuff the DS2000 can, although it's down in the product range, and I suspect wont get the first attention of the DS1/2/4 products.- The 2 channel signal generator for a reasonable price. (Optional)In favor for the DS2000:- Slightly faster, 14 horizontal instead of 12 horizontal divisions, more dedicated knobs. I'm also a casual scope user, and I am relating this to how much I get for how much I pay.- It will be sampling twice as fast as the DS1000Z.I don't mind the DS1000Z doing only 250MS/s at 4 channels, because the DS2000 doesn't even do 4 channels. O0- The DS2000 has a CAN decoder, which I wonder why it's missing on some other scopes (I reckon the processing power is similar in all scopes - they just didn't push it down the bottom range scopes)And also a remark about the function generator: it's a 25MHz AWG unit with AM/FM modulation; but I am missing a basic sweep function. When I found it was quite a bit of a bummer; because you can abuse FM modulation for that but that's not ideal. You do have different AM/FM modulation functions, like sine, triangle, square, etc.I see you're already picking up a dedicated signal generator. I guess you can - I'm still happy that the Rigol packs all these features in 1 compact instrument.

author: idpromnut
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 18, 2014, 12:35:58 pm
content: I had this choice to make about 2 years ago (the DS1052E or the DS2072?), and I decided to follow Dave's advice and choose neither and go with an analog scope (2225 bless its soul!).I really really really really can't tell you how frustrating it was to try and figure out how to use that scope, to troubleshoot why my signals were not coming in clearly, not fully understanding what I was seeing, etc. But the upshot to struggling with this was that when I bought my DS2072A this past January, I was able to understand and use the DSO more to its full capability.I also don't find myself needing to 'scope more than a couple of signals at a time (I use an LA for digital probing). Whether this was because I got used t not having the single-shot capability of a DSO when viewing signals or not I can't tell but there you have it.So I recommend for your first scope, get an old analog "beater" off fleabay or locally and start exploring!

author: Dago
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 18, 2014, 01:37:34 pm
content: Recently I sold my DS1052E and was also pondering between DS2072 and DS1074Z. I decided on the DS1074Z because of the extra channels and lower price. My reasoning was that I do not want to pay considerably more for a slightly bigger screen, less channels and higher sample rate. 1GSa/s vs. 2GSa/s is not a huge difference and I'm sceptical I personally will benefit from it. I'm also slightly sceptical I will benefit too much from the four channels but maybe they're more useful with the decoders and such...

author: jlmoon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 18, 2014, 04:49:21 pm
content: I opted for the DS2202. and gave it the 300Mhz bump. Yes, only a 2 channel scope but that 500uV / div comes in handy at times. I prefer this one to "bang around" in my tool kit. I like the larger screen the 2000 series provides as well. If I need more channels I resort to a Agilent MSOX4100 series which does not get bounced around.