Anyone know what PCB this is? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: VK3DRB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2021, 12:07:13 am
content: Hi.I have been asked to debug a 10 year-old laser machine. Fortunately there is a second machine and I have proven the fault to be in the industrial PCB CPU motherboard. Apparently as of six years ago, the board is no longer available from the laser manufacturer and there is no support.Prior to debugging it further, I would like to know if anyone knows what this board is - who the original manufacturer is; or get even a schematic diagram; or know if someone has a spare anywhere.Unfortunately, this board is a nightmare to access when installed inside its case with all the other unique electronics, so I can see myself spending days or weeks if I have to debug it to component level (soldering wires, scoping, rinse and repeat...)Happy to spend big $ for a replacement of the same type.

author: andy3055
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2021, 12:23:58 am
content: The label 0030D606DC4 did not come up There must be another label that has the FCC ID. Do a search for it on:https://www.fcc.gov/oet/ea/fccid

author: mikeselectricstuff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2021, 12:31:38 am
content: Looks like an off-the-shelf industrial PC, surprising no maker name on it though. - a little unusual in that it appears to have both PCI and PC104 - that alone might give you a start looking at industrial PC suppliers ( unfortunately there seem to be a ridiculous number of these).Long shot but maybe try Google reverse image search.Any clues as to maker name in the bios messages etc.? Or maybe drivers on the CF card.I wonder how specific it needs to be - if it is a bog-standard PC board an not something customised, I doubt it would be hard to find another industrial PC with comparable spec, interfaces etc.I assume you've already tried copying the CF card from the working unit?

author: mikeselectricstuff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2021, 12:35:05 am
content: That label looks like a MAC address. Searching on that herehttps://macvendors.com/leads tohttps://www.msc-technologies.eu/home.htmlLooks promising...

author: Medved
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2021, 12:38:30 am
content: I think there was an embedded PC standard using this card format and a PCI bus at the backbone, so there should have been be many more manufacturers of (more-less) interchangeable boards.But the flash-disk for the OS and SW often is on the CPU board, so you may have hard time porting it to other model, unless you have the installation package available (bootable CDROM,...)...

author: mikeselectricstuff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2021, 12:41:47 am
content: Quote from: mikeselectricstuff on March 10, 2021, 12:35:05 amJust noticed MSC on the label on the memory SIMM - maybe that's the board model no., not the SIMM?Can't see enough of it in the pics

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2021, 12:44:48 am
content: Also, this is not PCI, but EISA. This would date this from 1988 to 1995 or so.

author: ANTALIFE
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2021, 01:17:53 am
content: Don't know the board/manufacturer, but does looks like board started from a PC/104 dev board and then grew from thathttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PC/104EDIT: This might be usefulhttps://www.vogons.org/viewtopic.php?p=845571

author: helius
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2021, 02:08:37 am
content: mikeselectricstuff beat me to the punch, but the network OUI is owned by MSC Vertriebs GmbH.QuoteMSC is an Avnet subsidiary (so it is under the same corporate umbrella as Newark and Farnell). They no longer list EISA modules in their brochure, but you could try contacting them. They also trade as "Avnet Integrated".A little searching for "MSC Vertriebs" + "EISA" turns up this:PISA-PIII-TwisterT All-In-One Socket 370 CPU Card

author: VK3DRB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2021, 02:44:04 am
content: Quote from: mikeselectricstuff on March 10, 2021, 12:35:05 amMike,THANKS!. Great sleuthing. It never dawned on me that was a MAC address. And there are two labels - two MAC addresses. I have emailed MSC, asking for a schematic diagram, a user manual or a replacement board. I'll let the forum know what happens.Fortunately it is a German company. If it is their board, they will likely have records.

author: VK3DRB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2021, 03:47:30 am
content: Quote from: helius on March 10, 2021, 02:08:37 amBRILLIANT!I downloaded the manual which is clearly for this CPU board. It tells me heaps. Like a lot of German products, it is well documented. Surprisingly, board was designed in 2002. That CPU is quite leading edge for its day. I will see if I can get a replacement. Another reason I don't want to debug this is because the machine is in a clean room where the industrial PC enclosure/backplane cannot be removed, and I have to put on or remove protective clothing, shoe covering, beard covering, head covering every time I go from the electronics lab to the clean room, and you cannot solder in the clean room - it would drive me nuts.This reminds me of in the 90's, IBM had a $750K solder paste screening machine made by New Long in Japan with scant documentation available and no schematic diagram. Murphy's law: It died an a couple of hours before the family Christmas party was to start. So everyone headed off to the party except myself and another guy who had to fix the machine as priority. The machine had 12 large PCB's in it. VERY difficult to debug as there was no schematic and PCB's removed, circuits traced, wires soldered, system powered up each time etc. I traced the fault to a faulty small signal transistor and replaced it with an equivalent I had in the junk box at home. Got the machine fully up and running at 2am the next morning. Although management at IBM did not consider bringing us a beer or snags from the Christmas party BBQor even checking to see how things were going, I did get a great sense of achievement in debugging that board.

author: mikeselectricstuff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2021, 10:10:56 am
content: Quote from: VK3DRB on March 10, 2021, 03:47:30 amHope you sent them a big fat invoice for that transistor, considering how much it would have saved them....

author: VK3DRB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 11, 2021, 02:00:11 am
content: Quote from: mikeselectricstuff on March 10, 2021, 10:10:56 amI was an IBM professional employee, so not even any overtime pay. In this solder screen printer case, not even a thank you, let alone a beer. It was my big mistake working 50 to 60 hour weeks for years for IBM. Finally when they sold us off to a startup, IBM confiscated about $40K of my retirement funds, but they did offer a 30% discount on a new IBM Aptiva PC to recognise my 18 years of service. However, I did get a great sense of satisfaction fixing that challenging machine and a few other machines in the plant over the years even though it was not my primary job to do so.Now I run my own consultancy, I am much happier doing PCB design work (and some manufacturing) and getting paid for my efforts. Clients just get an invoice for the actual hours spent to which I pay my fair share of taxes. I like to sleep at night.

author: coppice
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 11, 2021, 02:12:46 am
content: Interesting. I didn't realise anyone ever put this kind of industrial PC on an EISA bus card. It must date from quite a small window in time. EISA took quite a while to get some momentum, then died quite abruptly when PCI finally started to work.