Watts and resistance - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / beginners

author: krayvonk
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 03:39:37 pm
content: With voltage and amps the same proportions on the psu, Will 90 watts and 1000 resistance, react exactly the same as 9 watts 100 resistance?I dont know why, but my last experiment with my circuit tested no. And I dont understand, cause my mental model would say yes.

author: Tom45
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 03:50:32 pm
content: Quote from: krayvonk on April 02, 2020, 03:39:37 pmYou don't tell us all the details of your experiment.From what you have said:90 watts and 1000 ohms: E2/ 1000 = 90Solving for E gives 300 volts. So from that you are feeding 300 volts into a 1000 ohm resistor rated at least 90 watts. I'm doubtful that is what you really did.9 watts and 100 ohms: E2/ 100 = 9Solving for E gives 30 volts. So you are feeding 30 volts into a 100 ohm resistor rated at least 9 watts. At least a little more likely, but probably still not what you did.

author: Ice-Tea
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 03:52:26 pm
content: Your... mental model? Nothing of what you say makes any sense. Voltage and amps "the same proportions"? What do you mean by "react the same"?In case you haven't picked up on that: P = RI²

author: TheHolyHorse
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 03:53:15 pm
content: The watts of a PSU is just a rating of how much power it can supply, it doesn't mean it will. If the voltage of the supply is 10V it will draw 10mA with a 1000 Ohm load. 10 * 0.01 that's 100mW, as long as the supply can supply that it will, doesn't matter if it's rated for 100W or 1000W.It's just Ohm's Law, study that and you'll get a better mental model.

author: krayvonk
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 04:48:24 pm
content: 30 volts 3 amps, is what I was doing.Im making an oscillator, and the difference was when i jacked up the power supply into the larger resistor the output on my led changed, it went from a pulse to just constantly on. and i was just shaking my head, cause it doesnt make sense 2 me.Yeh. it wasnt rated 90 watts - does that make a difference???I always thought little resistors with high ohmage take high power! =) heheits only light resistors that fry.

author: Ice-Tea
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 05:59:14 pm
content: Have you attempted to understand how Ohms law works? Doesn't sound like you did...

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 06:22:00 pm
content: here read and understand this... to correct your mental model...https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voltagehttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_currenthttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_powerhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wattin short, current is derived from V and R you use according to V = IR law, ie I = V / R. and then power (wattage) is derived from V and I according to P = VI and other formulas Ice-Tea gave. you dont simply make V and I in the same proportion, its nonsense.

author: Wimberleytech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 06:26:11 pm
content: Quote from: krayvonk on April 02, 2020, 04:48:24 pmThat is 30/3 = 10 ohmsQuoteThis is a new wrinkle. Are you driving the load resistor with a square wave??? Different calculation if you are.QuoteWhat LED? Where is it connected? In series with the resistor (10, 100, 1000 ohms???)QuoteDoes not make sense to me eitherQuoteRead Ice-Tea post very carefully and many times until it sinks in.It is helpful to provide schematics which are easier to decipher than descriptions (most of the time).

author: krayvonk
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 06:41:19 pm
content: Heres my new invention, the transistorless oscillator->I put the resistance up and the power, and then it just went constantly on.Its probably not oscillating really quick, but its runnin down the side shorts too much. (the discharge loops for the caps)But with the resistance low and the power low, it pulsed.its 3 resistance to drain the cap.its 1 resistance to charge it, but i lose 33% of the charge due to the proportions down the short alleys.then if ones charging and one isnt, they cut out each others power, to 50% even resistance either side. which puts the opposite cap in reverse polarity. (if u get the resistance right.)so its a balance of 33% loss, going to 16.5%, which then causes the cap to go backwards.and the drain is a third - of what goes through to the charge it. so its it beats it 2 parts to 3, charging it, and then its 50% of 2 parts - 33% forwards , 33% backwards, backwards doesnt win, because it doesnt quite reverse polarity!FIX->looks like ive got the resistance wrong - but why would it react differently at high ohm high power, wouldnt it be exactly the same?

author: Ice-Tea
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 07:13:29 pm
content: Are those the actual values you used? In that case, you're overloading your power supply, it goes into hickup mode and pulses.Everything else you wrote is gibberish. And I'll ignore you untill you have studied Ohms law, its implications and applications. In detail.

author: krayvonk
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 07:23:15 pm
content: Do you hate me because im giving ideas away? Im just looking for help cause i know you guys are good.I only showed the project cause u asked me to.

author: StillTrying
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 07:43:53 pm
content: I think the answer is very simple me-self.

author: BU508A
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 07:47:49 pm
content: Quote from: Ice-Tea on April 02, 2020, 07:13:29 pmDon't waste your valuable time with this troll.Just my two cents.

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 07:50:18 pm
content: Quote from: krayvonk on April 02, 2020, 07:23:15 pmits not an idea, it is shit, people here dont help making shit. and err... beer doesnt fix things, how many did you have? bring your delusion somewhere else.

author: krayvonk
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 07:59:10 pm
content: NP dudes. I guess the secret stays safe with U.

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 08:05:46 pm
content: Quote from: krayvonk on April 02, 2020, 07:59:10 pmno the secret is just right behind you down there, you just too lazy to read, its everywhere in the net... if you continue to be this lazy, i suggest this might be a good hobby...no math and no book involved... i dont even have a clue how do you even know what a resistor is? just be safe off the road.

author: krayvonk
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 08:06:59 pm
content: Sewing machine circuits can be made in different ways.Theres a way, with IC's to make it look modern.But... theres a way to make them like a 50s circuit as well,and also to the very first electrical sewing machine in the 1800's.And thats what I like better.Who knows who the smart one is, the infamous one or the famous one.Magnets dont turn themselves forever, silly.

author: TheHolyHorse
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 08:08:03 pm
content: This guy just keeps surprising me, how ignorant can you possibly be

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 08:15:02 pm
content: a good candidate for that sprint day X: ventilator machine design thread.

author: krayvonk
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 08:15:45 pm
content: Ill make a maryjuana gas helmet/facemask thinger.May as well just blow up a balloon, and just use rubber power.Im on my 5th extra life since bad ol' days with balloons.

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 08:44:12 pm
content: Quote from: krayvonk on April 02, 2020, 06:41:19 pmAndwe've looped back around to the 'Original' oscillator inventions again...https://www.eevblog.com/forum/projects/my-own-original-oscillator/The path is complete.P.S. 6th July to today makes that about 43nHz.

author: TheHolyHorse
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 08:53:02 pm
content: Quote from: Gyro on April 02, 2020, 08:44:12 pmAh yeah his new "invention" which is ground breaking and out of this world, why hasn't someone done this before

author: Siwastaja
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 08:58:08 pm
content: Quote from: BU508A on April 02, 2020, 07:47:49 pmNo one has realized he's likely a young kid?In which case it's all fine. We have different ways of learning things, and different kinds of attention span.I made all kinds of "inventions" as well before I understoodanything. Cut off components like resistors and ceramic capacitors off some PCBs, taped them together, bragged to friends what I thought the circuits do.Somehow, all this built up into good design intuition during the decades.

author: krayvonk
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 09:26:05 pm
content: Quote from: TheHolyHorse on April 02, 2020, 08:53:02 pmWhen it was working, it was about just a visible 4-10 hz i had it running off a 9v, just thumpin along. But I dont know what the resistance was... its taken me like 2 years now still not working.

author: Nerull
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 09:40:05 pm
content: Maybe you could build something that works if you put in any effort to learn at all.Simple 3rd grade math can only be explained to you so many times before people just give up.

author: krayvonk
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 09:43:17 pm
content: Parallel lines splitting up the power from the battery via ohmage is the 3rd grade I know, I dont use no 5v regulator, and I dont know what yous are on about either. But I know its a good way to do it too.So its just volts is it? what works out the current is the resistors?I cant quite get my head around it!! seriously!Im wierd. making a computer seems easy to me, but the ezy things seem harder!

author: bob91343
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 10:06:50 pm
content: Part of the problem appears to be a language barrier. No complete sentences, no concept of giving sufficient information, etc.It was fun while it lasted.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 10:16:00 pm
content: Before spending time answering the OP, have a look at the other threads he has started.My thoughts are not charitable.

author: krayvonk
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 10:38:23 pm
content: (this is my electronics sim btw)here, ill give u guys a free lesson.Kravonks "mental model" v0.4b___________1ohm_________ 1/6th of the resistance 4/12 = 2/6ths of the amps| || ||___________1ohm_________| 1/6th of the resistance 4/12 = 2/6ths of the amps-_______| |_____+| ||___________2ohm_________| 2/6ths of the resistance 2/12 = 1/6ths of the amps| || ||___________2ohm_________| 2/6ths of the resistance 2/12 = 1/6ths of the amps1+1+2+2=6 pathways.(1+2+2-1)=4x (all other pathways minus this pathway) -convert from resistance to current(1+2+2-1)=4x (all other pathways minus this pathway) -convert from resistance to current(1+1+2-2)=2x (all other pathways minus this pathway) -convert from resistance to current(1+1+2-2)=2x (all other pathways minus this pathway) -convert from resistance to current(and i did that maths in year 3, not.)4+4+2+2=12 current unitsand all circuits break down to so many parallel pathways. (if ur lookin' at from this aspect...)Ok I dont think I can get help here, so I have to help myself. Just I dont get how its supposed to be any other percentage of the amps when power changes, and voltage just cancels off resistance, i dont know why changing the resistance made it behave in a different way, when I jacked it up to be about the same, more power, but more resistance to cancel the power. and it should have been the same result no? but it wasnt, it was different.Im not finished with my theory, its flawed.So if that was 1000 ohms and 2000 ohms, and watts 1000, wouldnt it be exactly the same as 1 ohm and 2 ohm at 1 watt? (and I mean entry watts, not post resistance watts.)

author: krayvonk
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2020, 11:10:30 pm
content: Im like "wanna see the magic smoke?" And then I get out my pack of cigarettes.

author: Ground_Loop
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 02:22:30 am
content: Would you mind telling us how old you are.

author: krayvonk
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 02:25:03 am
content: Im old mate.I realize theres something i dont know, and you guys think its really funny.I blow up my little components alot, because of what I dont know. But ill get to the bottom of it, help or no help.

author: krayvonk
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 03:09:45 am
content: Whats the difference between a voltage divider and a current divider, they look exactly the same to me!!How can you say one is volts and one is current - what difference does it make, because it comes to same amount of power.I dont know...

author: atmfjstc
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 03:19:25 am
content: Quote from: Ground_Loop on April 03, 2020, 02:22:30 amLike many others here, I thought he was a kid too. Acts exactly like one. Except the clips he posted show him to be in his late 30s at least.So if he's not a troll... the implications are... unfortunate.

author: krayvonk
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 05:21:59 am
content: Im less than a year before my 40th birthday, to be honest. Im actually not an electrical engineer, im a software developer.Get rid of me. how do you know im not useful to have around as long as i be polite?!?!?!?!?If there is a problem with popular theory, you need wierdos like me to reinvent the wheel in slightly different ways.If u dont think I can code -> I coded this physics engine for a motorized ragdoll by myself. Didnt use an engine like box2d, its from scratch. (Thats one of the reasons why its 3d)

author: krayvonk
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 05:38:33 am
content: I worked out my own prob.Guess what i know why it was different at the higher resistance, higher power.Because the battery changed volts, but the capacitors didnt, so ive drawn up another one without the cap discharge loops. but ill just keep it a secret.

author: TheHolyHorse
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 05:42:02 am
content: Quote from: krayvonk on April 03, 2020, 02:25:03 amThe things you don't know like Ohm's Law is what people are trying to help you with but you just don't care.Quote from: krayvonk on April 02, 2020, 10:38:23 pmYet again learn Ohm's Law.You can get help here, it's just that you can't take criticism. You immediately start saying you cant get help here or some other B's. Start LISTENING to people who actually know what they are talking about and drop your "inventions" because they are nothing to waste your time on.Continue like this and you'll NEVER learn.

author: TheHolyHorse
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 05:42:39 am
content: Quote from: krayvonk on April 03, 2020, 05:38:33 amThis makes no sense.

author: krayvonk
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 06:47:08 am
content: I need to know one thing to base my whole career on, the current divider.And Ill slowly work out what ohms law is, right at the end.(but i actually know, so dont worry yep the same.)

author: TheHolyHorse
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 07:05:54 am
content: Quote from: krayvonk on April 03, 2020, 06:47:08 amAbsolute vast majority of your questions are answered by knowing ohms law.And you're claiming you know it. This is getting better and better

author: krayvonk
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 07:15:19 am
content: Well, I know that 1000 watts 1000(1k resistor.) ohms, outputs 1 watts worth of current? (and then you do it with a piddly one. just stick it in a bucket a water shell be right)and... 1 watt 1 ohm, outputs 1 watt worth of current. (i mean power)I think ive been writing pretty dizzy stuff.

author: TheHolyHorse
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 07:26:55 am
content: Quote from: krayvonk on April 03, 2020, 07:15:19 amNo.Look at the attached image.

author: Siwastaja
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 07:45:37 am
content: Ohm's law is often confusing to the early beginners, because it seems it doesn't often hold. This is caused by the fact that the units are used in different contexts, without explicitly specified so. Sometimes, the values are "actual" measurable values at a certain point in time (whenever this is true, the Ohm's law definitely holds), but sometimes, they aremaximum ratingsof components (without saying so).The very beginner needs to understand that something called "1000W power supply" doesn't produce 1000W power in the load, because the 1000W power supply almost never is a constant-power supply, but a constant-voltagesupply, so 1000W is just the maximum rating, not an actual value of power.OTOH, a thing labeled "12V power supply"doesproduce 12V on its output, because itisa constant-voltage supply. If rated at 1A, it still doesn't produce 1A at the output, unless the load happens to be exactly right. But if it is a constant-current supply, like an LED driver, then itwillproduce 1A.For professionals or advanced hobbyists, all of this is intuitively so obvious because we struggled with the concepts decades ago, and have forgot about it. For laymen, things like "you can substitute a 2A power supply for a 1A power supply" are not obvious at all. They think a 2A power supply puts 2A to the load, destroying the "1A things". And, confusingly, if it is a CC LED supply, it actuallydoesthat, and isn't replaceable! The fact that such "new" CC LED supplies are making the heads of even quite experienced designers spin around, proves the fundamental difficulty in the intuition.

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 07:49:26 am
content: Quote from: krayvonk on April 03, 2020, 05:21:59 amnot sure how to explain it... hilarious or spooky. mind sharing your code? i'd love to see your idea/invention of physics engine.

author: nali
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 08:04:59 am
content: Quote from: krayvonk on April 03, 2020, 06:47:08 amNo as everybody is trying to tell you, you have it backwards. You need to reset, take several steps backwards, and learn the basic relationship between voltage, resistance, current & power. THEN you can start looking at your magic oscillator. If you keep with the "tell me the answer I wanna hear"approach then you'll just end up in a downward spiral on hereTry this for startershttps://youtu.be/8jB6hDUqN0Y[Edit: How do I embed a YT video? I thought I could just embed it with the URL tags]

author: TheHolyHorse
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 08:22:29 am
content: Quote from: Siwastaja on April 03, 2020, 07:45:37 amYou're 100% correct, it's just that what you mentioned above about power ratings of a power supply has already been explained to him several times in different ways. If he were to drop all his current "knowledge" and all those magic new "inventions". And read listen to what people are saying, everything should start to clear up.

author: krayvonk
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 08:25:30 am
content: You can tell the current is changed not the voltage, cause the water still goes fast.........That physics engine, I can tell you about, cause i just want one of those little spiders as a pet i can sick on men that defy me, its why im ere.When your scared, it scares the fairies and they run away from ya.

author: TheHolyHorse
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 09:06:01 am
content: Quote from: krayvonk on April 03, 2020, 08:25:30 amRight.......

author: atmfjstc
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 09:16:54 am
content: It's beginning to look like this guy's needs may lie outside the set of specialties this forum can provide.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 09:29:00 am
content: Quote from: atmfjstc on April 03, 2020, 09:16:54 amNicely put

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 03:50:27 pm
content: Quote from: tggzzz on April 03, 2020, 09:29:00 amI would have used a less politically correct term.

author: Cubdriver
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 04:29:21 pm
content: Good riddance to the troll! Some people need to get lives...-Pat

author: schmitt trigger
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 04:47:18 pm
content: Just like a virus, what a troll requires is....ISOLATION!

author: AVGresponding
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2020, 10:39:08 pm
content: Quote from: schmitt trigger on April 03, 2020, 04:47:18 pmHe'd just try and implement it using a resistor network...

author: cliffyk
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 12:42:57 pm
content: The way I was taught many years (70+) ago was that anIndian saw anEagle over aRock:Probably too "insensitive" for these modern times...

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 12:58:14 pm
content: why dont change Eagle with Virgin? it will be more attractive and easier to memorize. we dont need another symbol, E is for Energy

author: cliffyk
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 01:12:43 pm
content: E =Electromotive force...

author: Siwastaja
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 02:09:37 pm
content: Quote from: cliffyk on April 04, 2020, 01:12:43 pmSince about 1960, E = energy.In 2020, it's finally time to get rid of the archaic and weird non-standard symbols for physical quantities. The SI system was established in 1960, and if anyone wants to use your own non-standard notions, please pick a letter, or better yet, a full word, which can't be mixed up within the context. (Energy calculations often exist when talking about voltage, so the danger for confusion is real.)"Electromotive force" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromotive_force), as a word and also as a concept, is truly stupid and not a part of SI system, either.Force(unit: Newton)isan SI unit so it's super duper confusing, since "electromotive force" has absolutely nothing to do with force, it's a voltage (generated bysomething, wheresomethingis very arbitrary and problematic to define), and possibly, if enough handwaved, also current and power, but definitely not force.

author: cliffyk
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 02:47:23 pm
content: I said it was 70+ years ago... (at MIT BTW)I apologise for getting your panties in a wad...

author: TimFox
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 02:51:28 pm
content: In 1971, I was taught to call it "ee-em-eff". There is a subtle difference between "emf" and "potential", even though they both have the same units, when one discusses induction by a changing magnetic flux.

author: TheHolyHorse
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 03:13:45 pm
content: Quote from: cliffyk on April 04, 2020, 12:42:57 pmWhat about this is not too insensitive?

author: schmitt trigger
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 03:28:36 pm
content: For me, I memorized the law with:Victoria =ReinaInglaterra.

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 05:57:12 pm
content: I've had no problem withVI | RThat makes it easy to visualiseI = V/RV = IRetc.Power is easy given volts and amps.P = VIWith other quantities it's a bit more tricky, so I just remember them:P = I²RP = V²/RI can derive the others fairly easy, using basic algebra which I can do in my head, if needs be.I² = P/RI = √(P/R)V² = PRV = √(PR)etc.If I'm having a brain fart, I just use Google.Here's a nice chart showing all the permutations. I used to have a copy of this next to my desk at work, when I was an apprentice. It's good to know it's still on the Internet for others to use. Now I've uploaded it as an attachment, so it'll be here as long as this site lives.https://www.calculator.net/ohms-law-calculator.html

author: Ice-Tea
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 06:56:46 pm
content: Linked in twice already

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 07:07:09 pm
content: Quote from: Siwastaja on April 03, 2020, 07:45:37 amI had memorized Ohms law by the time I was 12 years old and knew how to use it to calculate resistors for LEDs, it's really hard for me to grapple with people who can't grasp a simple concept like that after repeated attempts to show them. I'm still not sure if the OP was deliberately trolling or has some kind of mental illness. I gave up trying to help them when it became apparent that they don't listen to anything I (or anyone else) says and can't be bothered to learn. Not understanding Ohms law and Kirchoff's laws is a showstopper that makes any further study of EE concepts moot.

author: Ice-Tea
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 07:10:22 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on April 04, 2020, 07:07:09 pmI teach. Electronics lab is one of my subjects. You wouldn't believe how hard it is sometimes to get the basic concept of Ohms law across.

author: Siwastaja
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 08:58:10 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on April 04, 2020, 07:07:09 pmAnd I was there at about 9yo. This being said, we are all different, and our brain work differently. As you can see, this guy can clearly write some software that outputs non-trivial graphics.I was pointing out the potential hurdles to understanding why the Ohm's law seemingly does not hold when applied to actual products which come printed with actual numbers. What I said isn't taught in most books or classes. It shouldn't be too difficult once you get the aha moment, though, but as said, we are different.Besides, I truly believe that understanding thevery basicsproperly is one of the keys of being a world-class expert. You can even see professors who know all the tiny details of their field, struggling with the absolute basics of their own area. This is the lithmus test whether they are the "real deal" or not.

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 09:32:40 pm
content: Quote from: Siwastaja on April 04, 2020, 08:58:10 pmWell I knew Ohm's law as soon as I could walk.Seriously, I can't remember exactly how old or young I was when I knew V= IR, probably between 10 and 13, but P = V²/R took a little longer and I admit still need to think about the more obscure ones such as R = R/I², as I don't use them often, but remembering P = V²/R = I²R helps, as I can transpose them in my head.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 09:45:40 pm
content: Quote from: Siwastaja on April 04, 2020, 08:58:10 pmIt's not the level of knowledge that bothers me, I don't mind explaining that to people. What drives me nuts is when someone is clearly making no attempt whatsoever to understand something. He just kept plowing forward ignoring all the help people were trying to give him. It's a complete waste of time to try to help someone who won't even try. Almost all of his problems would be solved by gaining a rudimentary understanding of the basics. I'm not expecting deep expertise, just make even the slightest attempt to understand the the relationship between volts, amps and ohms. If the explanation makes sense then ask for assistance in understanding it, don't just blow it off and go back to fumbling around cluelessly.I mean you don't try to learn to write software by typing a bunch of gibberish into an IDE and then asking for help getting it to compile. You've got to learn at least the most basic concepts and syntax of the language before asking for help getting your program to work is anything but a waste of time.

author: TheHolyHorse
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 09:46:18 pm
content: Quote from: Ice-Tea on April 04, 2020, 07:10:22 pmThat's true, but it's just as true as the fact that not everyone is meant for this. Doesn't matter how much they want to they just don't get it.This is true for everything, not everyone is meant to have a drivers license yet they are out on the streets causing trouble, and never learn.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 09:52:14 pm
content: Quote from: TheHolyHorse on April 04, 2020, 09:46:18 pmVirtually anybody is capable of dabbling in electronics *if* they are sufficiently interested and willing to make an effort to understand the fundamentals. One doesn't even need to be an expert at them, but at least try. Without at least a rudimentary understanding of the basics one cannot move forward.

author: TheHolyHorse
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 09:56:48 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on April 04, 2020, 09:52:14 pmYeah problem is he doesn't have the rudimentary understanding and isn't willing to learn. And then starts getting bright ideas like "just putting wires in the socket". He shouldn't be doing this, if not for his own sake at least for everyone around him.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 10:08:22 pm
content: Quote from: TheHolyHorse on April 04, 2020, 09:56:48 pm*That* is the problem, the lack of rudimentary understanding can be dealt with, but one has to be willing to learn, otherwise it's just a waste of everyone's time.

author: TheHolyHorse
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 10:35:52 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on April 04, 2020, 10:08:22 pmYes which makes me wonder why he even bother asking for help when he just doesn't care what people are telling him. This (as you probably know) isn't the first thread he's made and they all end the same way.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 10:39:21 pm
content: It's why I eventually decided he was just trolling and wasting everyone's time for kicks.

author: Cubdriver
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 04, 2020, 11:22:45 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on April 04, 2020, 10:39:21 pmThat quickly became my conclusion, too. I often use plumbing analogies to explain the concepts to people, but in order for any of this to work, THEY need to be willing to listen and apply themselves. I think he was just here to yank our chains. I fail to see how that can be a source of amusement to people, but apparently it is to some at least...-Pat

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 01:23:22 am
content: you must be from the 50's

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 01:27:17 am
content: What makes you say that? I grew up in the 80s and often use plumbing analogies as well. It's not perfect but you can see and touch water, everybody has encountered water, it's a universal substance. Flowing water is the most electricity-like but tangible substance I can think of.

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 01:43:04 am
content: i mean this line...Quote from: Cubdriver on April 04, 2020, 11:22:45 pmno objection at all to the plumbing analogy. hope that clear up some confusion.

author: Cubdriver
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 06:09:36 am
content: Quote from: Mechatrommer on April 05, 2020, 01:43:04 amLOL - no, from the mid sixties. But I just have better things to do in life than to waste time trolling people online, so it's one of those things that puzzles me. I realize that there are plenty of people on the interwebs who get their jollies doing so, I can simply think of more interesting things to do with my time than trying to wind unknown people up. I don't get rabid sports fans, either, so maybe I'm just weird. (Ok, who am I kidding - there's no 'maybe' involved in that statement...)-Pat

author: atmfjstc
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 06:13:48 am
content: Trolls have existed since time immemorial. But before the advent of widespread electronic communication, it was much more difficult to be an ass to those around you without paying a price.

author: nali
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 08:01:51 am
content: Quote from: james_s on April 04, 2020, 10:39:21 pmAssuming that the "spider" video belongs to OP, take a look at some of the other videos on that channel which should give you an insight to the person behind the posts.

author: TheHolyHorse
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 08:25:49 am
content: Quote from: nali on April 05, 2020, 08:01:51 amYikes wtf is that channel, this dude is beyond salvation.

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 09:20:40 am
content: a good entertainment during covid lockdown

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 10:10:37 am
content: Quote from: nali on April 05, 2020, 08:01:51 amWhat channel?

author: Siwastaja
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 10:25:31 am
content: Quote from: tggzzz on April 05, 2020, 10:10:37 amSee the post on page 2,https://www.eevblog.com/forum/beginners/watts-and-resistance/msg2996516/#msg2996516

author: BU508A
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 10:35:56 am
content: Quote from: tggzzz on April 05, 2020, 10:10:37 amhttps://www.youtube.com/channel/UCpzQV1LX3pca2IJjbVRMtgw/videos

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 10:52:08 am
content: meet the guy, talking about wrong career here. he should be in america got talent or oprah show...and you can dig into his mental model with his transistorless motor controller evolution that got few people into head ache in the other thread..

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 12:04:40 pm
content: Quote from: Siwastaja on April 05, 2020, 10:25:31 amAh, thanks.For future threads he starts, that self-description is sufficiently useful (in terms of people realising his competence) that it is worth preserving in case he "amends" it. "competence" has overtones in the UK w.r.t. mental abilities.Quote from: krayvonk on April 03, 2020, 05:21:59 am

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 12:45:01 pm
content: Quote from: tggzzz on April 05, 2020, 12:04:40 pmWe really shouldn't laugh at him. It's blatantly obvious he's not well in those videos and needs help.

author: nali
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 03:39:12 pm
content: Quote from: Zero999 on April 05, 2020, 12:45:01 pmYou're right of course - my fault I shouldn't have mentioned his channel, I was naively thinking folks would take a look & form their own judgement.. I'm old enough to know better really

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 03:41:15 pm
content: Quote from: Zero999 on April 05, 2020, 12:45:01 pmOh, I'm not laughing and I would be horrified at someone that did.My intention is simply to help people decide whether to invest their time in responding to him.

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 05:33:22 pm
content: Quote from: tggzzz on April 05, 2020, 03:41:15 pmNot you, I shouldn't have quoted your post in my reply, sorry about that, but someone else appeared to be mocking him. I find his videos quite disturbing. He clearly wasn't trolling.: everything he said was real from his perspective.He could be telling the truth about being a software developer and might have even been a good one for all we know, before whatever it is (I'm no psychiatrist and even if I was, I couldn't diagnose over the Internet) went wrong with his mind.I hope he's alright. Clearly this place wasn't doing him any good.

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 05:45:59 pm
content: Quote from: Zero999 on April 05, 2020, 05:33:22 pmi know one or two ways to steer people back on track esp this type (when they choosed to ignore your advices and replied like nothing serious happening) when everything else failed. its a bit bitter, its not 100% effective... but its an alternative way at least.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 06:40:42 pm
content: Quote from: Zero999 on April 05, 2020, 05:33:22 pmI haven't seen any of the videos however there have been many cases of people who were exceptionally brilliant in some ways but completely off their rocker. Nikola Tesla being one, especially toward the end of his life his behavior became quite bizarre. Howard Hughes, Oliver Heaviside, Buckminster Fuller, Geoffrey Pyke, along with countless others. Each of them absolutely brilliant, but also extremely strange people who did not fit well into society.

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2020, 07:05:06 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on April 05, 2020, 06:40:42 pmHis videos are mostly of him rambling on, without making any sense, smoking goodness knows what. Here's the latest one which could be seen to be racist and Islamophobic, but I doubt it is, because it doesn't make any sense. It's just one bigword salad.

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2020, 01:19:51 am
content: i dont think he is a threat enough. maybe its just his style exaggerating things esp in his rap/dj lyrics. better him singing out loud like this than someone who's real isolated even from the net collecting gun powder and then popped up in some mosque or race/religious gathering.. let the wheatstone bridge motor controller/oscillator invention keep him occupied.

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2020, 08:54:39 am
content: Quote from: Mechatrommer on April 06, 2020, 01:19:51 amWho said he was a threat? Most people with mental illnesses aren't dangerous to others and we can't asses whether someone is a risk to society over the Internet. I've not seen any evidence of him threatening to harm anyone. If he has or does make threats, then it should be reported to the local authorities.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2020, 10:14:58 am
content: Quote from: Zero999 on April 06, 2020, 08:54:39 amAgreed.I'll add that the really dangerous people are those that are can act remotely (i.e. not in person) and aresuperficiallyplausible. Krayvonk isn't one of those.

author: Siwastaja
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2020, 11:09:11 am
content: Quote from: Zero999 on April 06, 2020, 08:54:39 amMostaren't, yes...I used to think exactly that way and really to give everyone a chance, I have stood for the bullied ones, those who are not understood. But, after a few really bad (some ending up just fine, some ending up in life-in-prison due to terrorism!) experiences, I have learned to understandwhythe large majority uses the group lynching mentality and/or "friends don't let each other play with them" paradigm. While this seems really harsh, and often causes grieve and loneliness to people who are not actually dangerous at all, the reaction is very understandable and works well for the first-order guesstimate to ensure our own safety; yes, evolution has made us selfish. After all, the safety is hard to assess, so people tend to default to "better safe than sorry". Heck, I'm notstupid, still I have failed numerous times to properly evaluate whether I should have anything to do with certain people! Most average people have no choice but to either ignore the "different" people, or carefully join the lynch party, the point here is that no one stands out specifically, so the risk is spread out and minimized.I have started thinking that maybe "the masses" have a point, after all. By intuition, not careful analysis. Nowadays if I see that 99% of people seem to turn against one, I'm not going to blindly defend the one poor guy anymore, I really think about the "justmaybethere is a reason I don't know" side. The bad thing is, most of us do not process these things consciously very well, so it's hard to discuss with others rationally; they just follow their instincts and reject the one poor guy.I know I sound harsh here, just some analysis about human behavior. Not saying I like it.OTOH, not too many seem to think depressed (I've been there, and recovered quite amazingly well) people are dangerous. I think our intuition mainly detects veryoddbehavior, and upredictability as a marker. Which makes us avoid "safely odd" people as well. I personally avoid unpredictable people the most, they give me the hardest time.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2020, 04:25:35 pm
content: Mentally ill people tend to make me nervous and I think it's because they behave and respond differently than I expect. This makes it difficult for me to determine their intentions or predict how they will act and respond. It's a bit like interacting with an unknown random dog, they may be friendly or they may bite you if you try to pet them.

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2020, 04:31:23 pm
content: Quote from: Zero999 on April 06, 2020, 08:54:39 amwhat still puzzling me is Krayvonk was playing with fractal rendering, he talked like he knows something but not fully understand. he got comment in his video about something related to 4th dimension or quartenion related i dont know. i never come across this thing. this is wonder of the world..Quote from: Siwastaja on April 06, 2020, 11:09:11 ami thought someone said long ago, men/civilization/knowledge will find out/formulate/theorize/implement better way to living... that made "ancient book" unnecessary. you proved/claimed them wrong...Quote from: james_s on April 06, 2020, 04:25:35 pmimho Mentally ill people are still a lot better than people under the influence of drug/ecstasy or alcohol.

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2020, 05:28:00 pm
content: Quote from: Siwastaja on April 06, 2020, 11:09:11 amSteer clear of people who make you feel uncomfortable, but never forget that one day it could be you or a loved one. Yes, some people with depression can be dangerous. I've had my fair share of mental illness to deal with and have done some pretty crazy things in the past. Fortunately nothing too dangerous or that really harmed anyone, other than myself, but looking back, I can see the potential danger. I'm okay now, despite being stuck at home due to this COVID-19 lockdown, but I know it's not my fault, I'm lucky to be on full pay and it will end, as my employer has made adjustments so it can open and everyone can resume work in a couple of weeks time.Quote from: Mechatrommer on April 06, 2020, 04:31:23 pmIt's easy to jump to conclusions like that. Going by those videos one could easilly be forgiven for thinking he's incapable of writing his own name, let alone posting on the forum, but it's not so clear cut.Perhaps he was lying about the fractal rendering, or maybe he learned how to do it before becoming ill which is hindering learning electronics?Either are plausible. Some people with mental illness lie about silly things and it wouldn't surprise me if the illness can hinder someone aquirirng new skills, yet not affect what they've already learned.QuoteIt's often the case we have to deal with both, since substance abuse is common with those who have a mental illness: I'm pretty sure it isn't a cigarette Krayvonk is smoking in those videos. In those cases it's questionable whether it's the drugs which have caused the illness, or the person uses to them to self-medicate. Some people firmly believe the later is always the case: i.e. an alcoholic drinks to numb the pain. Others think it's just the drugs affecting their brain chemistry. I think each case is different. Some people would have been fine had they never touched drugs, which have upset their brain chemisty. Look at how many people get temporarily get prescribed painkillers, whilst an injury heals, yet end up getting hooked and loosing everything, including their sanity. Then there will be others who initially started because the have other phycological problems i.e. someone drinking heavily at parties and out with friends, because they have social anxiety and it loosens them up, only to become hooked. In any case, he needs to quit the drugs before he stands any chance of recovery.