What to do with your electronic stuff after you're dead! - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: edpalmer42
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 04:23:33 pm
content: A few years ago I was getting my will straightened out. My executor looked around my workshop / playroom / mad scientist's lab / disaster area and said "What am I going to do with all this stuff after you're gone?". She won't be able to deal with the hassles of selling it. At the time, all I could think of was "rent a dumpster". I now have a better idea. A school probably wouldn't want a miscellaneous collection of junk and treasures because it wouldn't fit in their curriculum. But I think most Makerspaces would love to get that kind of stuff. Keep it, fix it, sell it, whatever.Any thoughts?Ed

author: zapta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 04:26:25 pm
content: Quote from: edpalmer42 on June 09, 2016, 04:23:33 pmThat's an easy one.http://www.1800gotjunk.com

author: Tandy
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 04:45:14 pm
content: Identify any particularly valuable/rare items that would be a shame to get dumped, put the rest on freecycle maybe?

author: Muttley Snickers
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 04:58:38 pm
content: I plan to take a temperature meter along so that I can verify which way I went, but if it's a cold day in hell like others forecast then I could have a few issues.

author: coppice
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 05:36:26 pm
content: One of the nice things about being dead is you don't need to worry about your belongings any more.

author: edpalmer42
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 05:56:32 pm
content: Quote from: coppice on June 09, 2016, 05:36:26 pmTrue, but those you leave behind do have to deal with your belongings. If you care about those people, make it easy for them.Muttley, you can forget the thermometer. We all know where you're headed!Tandy, whether it's freecycle, craigslist, used, kijiji, etc. they're all variations on a theme. Advertise, wait, get rid of some of the stuff, then have to deal with the rest. For some people, that's fine, but the idea of "come clean out the entire room" would be attractive to me.Zapta, you're right. 1800junk is a good possibility if we can't come up with anything better. I hadn't thought of them. Thanks.But I'd still like to find somewhere that could make use of the stuff. Am I wrong about makerspaces wanting this kind of stuff? I think I'll drop by one of our local makerspaces and see what they say.Any other ideas?Ed

author: daqq
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 06:26:16 pm
content: Assuming you do not have any hereditors that might be interested, have it given away - makerspaces, hackerspaces or individuals will gladly come and pick though your items.

author: pelule
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 06:47:36 pm
content: As my last day will come some day, I created a four step plan:1. design children (Nmin = 1) - done2. motivate one of them to be highly interested in electronics (N >= 1) - done3. calculate the rough price of the equipment - done (needed for the insurance anyhow)4. make my last will, compensate the rest of the children with similar amount of money - doneSo I am ready for that day.But there is still one uncertainty left: what happens, if I'll be back?PeLuLe

author: MT
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 07:01:32 pm
content: Quote from: edpalmer42 on June 09, 2016, 04:23:33 pmAre the grim reaper already at your house, and complaining about your stuff to?!

author: chris_leyson
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 07:03:59 pm
content: Bloody good question Ed, I think anything that could be sold through test equipment dealers should be listed together with a list a of dealers. Schools, maybe not nowadays because of the narrow curriculum and health and safety issues, amateur radio clubs perhaps and you've already mentioned makerspaces. Sometimes on Ebay I've seen stuff listed from "silent keys" but sold by a fellow ham. If it's rare and valuable, perhaps a specialist auction house. I believe there are charities that will recycle computer equipment. As for "house clearance" compamies they keep what they can sell and dump the stuff they can't.At the end of the day, sorry no pun inteded, in life I would rather see stuff go to people who would appreciate it rather than metal recyclers or landfill, in death I would like the same to be true.

author: edavid
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 07:14:25 pm
content: The hackerspace/makerspace idea is fine, but they tend to come and go, so it's unlikely you'd be able to identify one ahead of time. Your executor has to be willing to be flexible and deal with possibly flaky people. Maybe you could have some additional executor payment just for that.If you have a local ham club, you could also do a straight donation, or they might be willing to have an auction (even if you're not a ham). Or, a member might be willing to do a consignment sale.Another option is to give everything to Goodwill. You don't have any control over where it goes, but your estate gets a tax deduction. (Have your executor do a valuation based on eBay sales.)If there are some specific high value items, have an eBay agent sell them.

author: Cubdriver
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 07:20:25 pm
content: I volunteer at a vintage radio and communications museum. Some of our operating capital comes from e-bay auctions of donated items such as old radios and test equipment. Perhaps if there's something like that in your area you could have the stuff donated to them when you pass.-Pat

author: German_EE
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 07:49:02 pm
content: The contents of my workshop and ham radio shack are left to the local ham radio club, they will know what is useful and what is junk. The bequest also contains a request to securely erase all hard drives.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 08:07:45 pm
content: Quote from: edpalmer42 on June 09, 2016, 04:23:33 pmIt is not going to be your problem so why bother?

author: chris_leyson
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 08:18:27 pm
content: QuoteI think you need to mature a little bit nctnico. Not my problem what the fuck do I care, you statement shows that you are perhaps selfish and don't care about people in your life. WTF

author: JoeO
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 08:32:22 pm
content: I already talked to my son. It will be payback for all the grief he gave me when he was growing up.

author: shawnb
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 08:39:17 pm
content: As the joke goes, my biggest nightmare is that I died and my wife sold all of my equipment for what I told her I paid for it.I guess it depends on the value of what you have... I buy a lot of expensive tools, but I also accumulate junk too! I'm not planning on going anywhere soon, but I am trying to be more conscious about dispersing the junk while I'm still around so there is less confusion when I'm not.We have a couple of local auctioneers that handle estates, so I would probably go that route. Depending on what you have, they either have a live auction on site, or run an online auction on their website with one certain pick-up day for everything. It's not the way to get top dollar, but it's a decent compromise for having someone else deal with the hassle.I would also consider the charity route too, most of them have connections to recycle stuff if it doesn't sell, and there could be a tax benefit for your estate.Assuming you don't have any nearby friends or relatives who are technically inclined and would love to have your stuff (and/or coordinate selling the high-value stuff for a cut), you could reach out to the electronics teachers in your area and see if they have any ideas. Even if the schools won't take it, the teachers might be willing to come get it and give it away to students.As a last resort, after everything else of value has been removed from your home, the executor could have a walk-in yard sale. Advertise it, say the prices reduce every hour, and tell those who show up that what's left is free after a certain time. I doubt there would be much left to clean up.

author: uncle_bob
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 08:51:08 pm
content: HiThis is *far* from a minor point for some of us. My junk pile extends into several areas. Both in terms of sheer bulk and weight, there's a lot of "collection" there. In terms of worth, very little of it would be of interest to a dealer. It's already "to old" and getting older all the time.Bob

author: chris_leyson
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 09:06:27 pm
content: QuoteQuoteThanks Ed, that was the point I was ranting on about.

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 10:20:08 pm
content: If my wife outlives me she knows to give everything to my ham radio club. Our club is also a 501c3 charitable organization and will give a receipt for everything picked up. We have given donated radios to hams who couldn't afford them and have sold donated equipment to upgrade/repair the club repeaters.

author: mrpackethead
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 10:53:17 pm
content: I'm an EE, and so was my dad. THough in later times, he was more into the consulting side rather than the doing side. I was also the exeuctor of his estate.Nobody else wanted any of dads "Junk".. and i took it all home and most it sat around for quite a number of years. 30-40 year old electrolytic caps.. thousands of old TH resistors.. old transistors and misc old school logic IC's.. A 1Mhz Scope, various projects in various states of compelted-ness. I cou'dnt bring myself to throw it out.. My head said this is junk, My heart said its dads junk and i shoudnt chuck it. the reality is that i had my own junk as well, and it was just becoming a crazy mess. There were some jems in there thats for sure.. but even dad should have chucked out those old caps. They were no use to anyone.Lesson is, keep your junk to a minimum.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2016, 11:11:05 pm
content: Quote from: chris_leyson on June 09, 2016, 08:18:27 pmDid you ever think about the people you are leaving behind may have other ideas about your belongings? Maybe it is complete crap to them or maybe they want to keep certain items because they are useful to them or have sentimental value. Either way I don't want to make that choice for them. Going through stuff from a deceased family member could be good for the mourning process as well.

author: John_ITIC
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 01:13:06 am
content: Quote from: edpalmer42 on June 09, 2016, 04:23:33 pmTry to find one of those companies that picks up the stuff, list things on Ebay, handles the shipping etc and takes a chunk of the profit. Better to get 50% of the value now rather than 0% once you are on the other side...http://www.ebay.com/s/valet

author: uncle_bob
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 01:16:03 am
content: Hi.... or face up to the fact that those gems you got out of the scarp pile in High School maybe aren't going to get used for anything 60 years later ...Bob

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 01:42:02 am
content: I certainly need to consider this.It's fine to leave the lab and gear to Sagan & Huxley, but they are a good 10 years away from being able to appreciate what they would have.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 01:43:45 am
content: Quote from: John_ITIC on June 10, 2016, 01:13:06 amThose companies are awful at selling test gear, they are completely and utterly clueless at what things are worth, how to list and describe them etc for the best sale.If Nicole had to flog off a lot of my stuff, I'd like to think she'd be smart enough to make use of my audience and get crowd opinion via the forum or blog on listing prices etc before hand.

author: all_repair
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 03:01:31 am
content: Quote from: pelule on June 09, 2016, 06:47:36 pmEnvy you. I have the same plan, but mine are at the anti-Dad state. At least N>1 are getting into engineeringOne thing about not bothering too much and leave them to sort them up is so that you can extend the living moment you have in their minds , or they shall be "praising" you while clearing your messWhat about your e-Wealth? I am working hard to organise them as much as I can so they can be useful. I am not winning this battle.

author: FlyingHacker
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 03:03:44 am
content: I would say pick a friend who is familiar with this sort of thing and ask them to take care of selling it after your demise... Like a sub-executor just to handle the electronics stuff.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 04:24:20 am
content: While this forum constitutes a world wide club with lots and lots of talent, stuff like this is best handled locally. A good way to do this is to be active in a local group of people with like interests. A ham club, a robot club, a maker club, whatever. Make sure the ones you love are also at least a little involved (holiday parties, dinners or whatever).Then when the end comes your loved ones will have a place to go for help in disposing the collection. For most of us it will be important to remember that the value has little to do with what we paid or how we loved the stuff. So it will not provide financial security to those left behind. But having a way to get it gone will take one stress off of them.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 07:47:08 am
content: What I'm missing in this thread so far: make sure someone has the password to your computer and online services/fora so they can shut things down in an orderly fashion. I've seen it in newsgroups a couple of times already; someone stops posting for a while and people will start to ask what has happened and eventually someone manages to track the person (or relatives) to find out.

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 07:58:36 am
content: Donate test equipment to other engineers, donate dev boards and miscellaneous kits and boards to local hobby electronics guys, throw the rest in the trash or have someone pick it up. Or better yet, get a friend who has the same hobby as you.

author: batteksystem
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 08:01:47 am
content: Quote from: edpalmer42 on June 09, 2016, 05:56:32 pmHave you tried Tindie? Sell and get back cash by paypal, may help paying for funeral cost.

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 08:41:30 am
content: Quote from: batteksystem on June 10, 2016, 08:01:47 amThat is what life insurance is for. And leaving money for your loved ones. Money is kinda useless after you are dead.

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 11:52:14 am
content: Quote from: wilfred on June 10, 2016, 08:23:20 amI have a printed copy of all my passwords organized into catagories in a fireproof box for SWMBO

author: razberik
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 12:00:05 pm
content: I was considering it too, although I am quite young. Car accident, falling from stairs, electric shock accident ironically.I wrote to few of my friends to claim some of my acquired equipment in case of my pass away. My relatives will definitely understand that.If I am too old and I am not sure about my days, I'd write some list of equipment with suggested prices and some instructions of possible ways of selling it.Prices should be adequate motivation for my survivors to not throw my treasures away."Dear children, this funkwerk cost this amount of money. Sell it here or here and keep money from it. With love ..."What I don't understand is why are commonly accepted jokes, abuses and jeers from relatives about my hobby like "Junk, what you need it for ?".I can't imagine that my beloved one would ever release a word "junk" from her mouth about my hobby. That is unacceptable for me.Damm if my family dislike my hobby and they are insulting me "junk, throw it away !", I don't have a motivation to ease them throwing it away after I am gone.This is my numerous experience when I visited some houses to acquire some treasures and survivors were showing their hatred of some beautiful hobby of their decease.

author: kolbep
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 12:53:05 pm
content: Facebook now has a nomination system, where you can nominate somebody that can post on your wall (and close your account) when you are deceased.Quote from: wilfred on June 10, 2016, 08:23:20 am

author: uncle_bob
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 01:19:13 pm
content: Quote from: GreyWoolfe on June 10, 2016, 11:52:14 amHiIf you have unique passwords (and user names) to each of a few hundred things and change them on a regular basis, a printed list can be tough to keep up with. I just did a quick count and my list is at about 400 or so entries. Password managers are a "love them / hate them" sort of thing. If you use one, make sure somebody else can access it. With the rise of two factor authentication, that process may be a bit complex. If the next step is biometric, it may be quite complex.Bob

author: Kilrah
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 02:57:37 pm
content: Quote from: chris_leyson on June 09, 2016, 08:18:27 pmQuite the contrary IMO, by deciding you're forcing them to do what you wanted instead of what they might find a more appropriate fit.

author: uncle_bob
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 04:07:52 pm
content: HiOne essential part of all this: Have a serious conversation with those likely to be involved in disposal / distribution of the "collection". Quite possibly, have multiple conversations over a period of time. Having had several of those conversations, it is quite clear to me that the "stuff" is a concern and that some sort of plan(ing) is needed.The first step of my plan is to take a hard look at what is simply junk, what has no future use to me, and what might possibly be worth keeping for a bit. Volume wise, that has cut things by about half on the limited amount I have sorted through. Could the discards have been of use to somebody / somewhere / sometime / somehow? I suppose they might have. Linking those who could use things like parts pulled from old TV chassis in the 1960's up with those parts .... not worth my effort. Certainly not worth somebody else's effort. The slightly more useful stuff has been dribbling out to some of the youngsters at work.Bob

author: edavid
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 04:17:38 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on June 10, 2016, 07:47:08 amLastPass has an emergency access feature that seems well thought out:https://helpdesk.lastpass.com/emergency-access/Even if you don't normally use LastPass, it might be worthwhile to sign up for that reason.

author: AndyC_772
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 05:18:08 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on June 10, 2016, 07:47:08 amI'm not sure this would be top of my list. Or even on the first page. Possibly not on the list at all.The things I have that matter are the valuable assets. The lab gear is pretty obvious, just google the part numbers stamped on things, flog on Ebay anything that's worthwhile, and bin the rest - but then there are other things that require more thought. Intellectual property, like source code and schematics, of which my company is the owner. Licenses that mean I - or my estate - am entitled to royalties. Shares in companies I've supported one way or another.These are the things that my executor would need to know about and deal with; there's considerable value there, and it's not immediately apparent how to unlock and realise it. Doubly so if you don't have the admin password for my file server, or any clue what to do with it even if you do.If I simply stopped posting on forums, I doubt anyone would even notice for a long while. You might well be able to track me down with some detective work, but why bother? (Obviously, if you stopped posting then I'd miss you terribly, but could you honestly say the reverse is true?)#include "montypython/always_look_on_the_bright_side.flac"

author: bitslice
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 07:57:27 pm
content: Quote from: mrpackethead on June 09, 2016, 10:53:17 pmAny 74LS series or Zilog chips are still useful to meThe thing that depresses me is the thought that advancing technology is going to make my hoard pointless,like right now we are still buying equipment from the 70's and it's great to be able to reuse expensive equipment.But what if in the future electronics boils down to simply adding a 50 year battery to a AI module and telling it what we want it to do?Like I may want a parallel processor to compress an image, to do that now I could use a bunch of PI compute units and some CAMs, in the future it may simply be a matter of buying a 2" black box with the appropriate level of TerraFlops, getting an AI to code the interface and 3D printing the rest.

author: Nozzer
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 08:32:55 pm
content: A solution in the UK is to leave it to a club you belong to. For example I have a collection of film cameras (which I still use) including some gear amateurs dream about but never get access to. I am leaving that specialist kit (Ebony large format camera, lenses, etc) to the Royal Photographic Society, to do with as they please, though I have specified the use I should like them to put it to.I also have other scientific apparatus including some microscopes which I am leaving to the Queckett Microscopical Club. They will auction them off to members (sealed bids) and put the proceeds to the benefit of the Club. I would expect to do the same with my electronics gear, once I have built up a lab (some years off on a pension!).I presume charity law elsewhere makes such bequests a viable option, unless you live somewhere remote.

author: uncle_bob
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 10:17:00 pm
content: Quote from: bitslice on June 10, 2016, 07:57:27 pmHiOk, let's say I have 400 pounds of assorted 74xx00 era chips in various forms. It will cost me roughly $1000 to package them up and ship them to you. At that point I make noting on the deal. If you want them sorted / itemized / categorized ... the cost goes up quickly. I get paid for my time doing that stuff ... I'm not cheap.Just how bad do you want them?Unless you are a bit crazy (or very trusting of some jerk named Bob) ... steer clear. Far easier to buy only what you need, when you need it.Before everybody goes crazy -- this is purely an example. I'm not trying to sell almost a quarter ton of chips. I don't do bulk export shipping for a living. Learning contracting for a container would indeed be expensive (to me, and thus to you). I also don't want to spend the rest of my life tending to eBay listings for "74ls00 5 pieces NOS". Even for me (who does understand this stuff) there is a level that is not worth going to. I have friends who do the eBay stuff. I see the amount of their time it soaks up. Selling what they do and the hours they put in, McDonalds would pay better. *They* won't touch this sort of thing.So there's the flip side of all this. There is a cost of disposal. There's even a per pound cost I pay when I haul it to the recycle center (can't throw that nasty lead stuff away in the trash).Bob

author: Someone
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 10:50:53 pm
content: Quote from: uncle_bob on June 10, 2016, 10:17:00 pmYes, having tried listing piles ofjunkolder hardware for $1 NR the time spent listing answering questions and dealing with the sale do not get covered by the return. Thinking back even selling consumer hardware that was still available new was hard work and didnt pay for my time!

author: bitslice
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 11:37:28 pm
content: Quote from: uncle_bob on June 10, 2016, 10:17:00 pmIronically some old school chips are so rare that the only suppliers of genuine parts left are either in the USA or Poland.eBay vendor shipping for a tube of IC's is a bit variable though, sometimes $13.50, sometimes $33.95.Like now I could with a tube of 74LS612, so it's either buying a possible clone from China or paying double via the USA,

author: lemmegraphdat
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 10, 2016, 11:44:09 pm
content: Dead Man Switch. And it all goes back to me. The paradox works itself out.

author: sarepairman2
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 12:00:56 am
content: stay alive

author: lemmegraphdat
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 12:26:24 am
content: Quote from: sarepairman2 on June 11, 2016, 12:00:56 amBut eventually you'll find yourself at the end of the universe. What then?

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 01:52:30 am
content: Bury the stuff with you. Then it would drive future archeologists crazy. To really drive em crazy, get yourself stuffed with transistors. They will think you were an ancient robot that went bad.Next week I am going to look into the Ebay valets at FedEx and see if that will work.

author: rich
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 02:20:22 am
content: I have some very recent insight into this topic as I just organised and redistributed contents from my late father's workshop last weekMy additional thoughts to all the good comments above:When writing a will, consider the time constraints to clear your lab. E.g. If your lab/house is rented, it may need clearing quickly if your estate won't be paying any more rent to the landlord. Your loved ones probably won't want to start these tasks immediately and there are also much higher priority tasks which need starting first.Don't horde. I threw out dozens of boxes which were probably spares for equipment X, Y and Z but were unlabelled. I could have reintegrated some of these parts back into main 'stock', but I did not have the time or inclination to figure it out so they went in the bin.Stay organised. Bonus points for labelling containers. Boxes of items that were 'similar' were 100x easier to redistribute than a random assortment of parts with no logical grouping.If your equipment has significant value, be clear who benefits from it and controls its redistribution where necessary, or be explicit about where big ticket items are going. People aren't the greatest at making decisions or figuring out the correct etiquette at times like these.Sorting his workshop was a nostalgic trip for me, remembering my old man through his tools. When it was cleared it felt very different though and just served to emphasise his passing. My tip - keep your lab in a state where you're proud to show it to those who come after you, and if you find yourself clearing a loved one's possessions take the time you need to say goodbye before parting with it all.

author: uncle_bob
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 02:43:30 am
content: Quote from: bitslice on June 10, 2016, 11:37:28 pmHi.... but ... the batch of parts you bought from some jerk named Bob likely didn't have any 74LS612's in itBuying that quarter ton of stuff got you no closer in this case to the part you needed. You still have to go off and get the part you need. In addition, once they get to you from Bob, you need to sort them, inventory them, (test them?), and find someplace to *store* them. Currently the monthly storage bill here runs $550 a month. That would pay for a lot of tubes of parts, even at $34 a tube. Storage is only to a very small extent dedicated to chips and the like. It's also not inventoried / indexed / sorted. Each of those things tends to expand the amount of room things take up. Rationally, when I look at the $100K directly put into storage of the "collection", it's not been money well spent so far. The dumpster has it's advantages. It's *not* just the impact on your estate after you die.So I still claim, you are better buying the tube you need, when you need it, than investing thousands of dollars in a pile of assorted who knows what and ultimately having to pay storage rental fees.Bob

author: VK3DRB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 02:59:14 am
content: Most of us in electronics will have no legacy from our profession even when we retire let alone die, unlike for example, some builders and architects whose creations will be around for centuries. That is perhaps the worst thing about being into electronics. You can design or build the best gadget or PC application today but it won't be around in a few years and no-one will give a stuff.Think of geniuses like Dan and Kathe Spracklen, or those who wrote Clipper, or the creators of the stringy floppy. Very few people have heard of any of them except us old bastards who will die off in the not too distant future. Try telling your grand kids you wrote Alley Cat. What's Alley Cat you might ask? My point exactly.

author: uncle_bob
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 03:12:40 am
content: Quote from: wilfred on June 11, 2016, 02:39:46 amHiOk, how do I identify the person who *needs* this item in front of me right now, and get it to them without loosing more money? The whole point of this is to pass on to your heirs something of value. If all of your time is spent loosing money, that's not a good start.I'm here in the US. You (the needy person) are many time zones away. I (quite literally) have several thousand items I will go through next week, just as I have gone through several thousand bits and pieces in each of the last four weeks. The process will go on through the middle of the summer. Simply coming up with a list of things like "black headed odd topped bolt with xxx thread about this long ... probably 5 pieces (still digging)" takes a lot of time. Certainly a lot more time than "not going to use them ... toss". If I do the full index / list / save / re-store on each item, the process does not complete in the summer. I'm still in the middle of it years from now. That does not count additional time I need to spend finding you the one who needs the 5 bolts. I could put them in a big bag with similar items . Now I have to find someone who *needs* 400 lb of weird nuts, bolts, washers, and fittings. The time issue is not as great, it's not at all clear that the batch goes anywhere useful. The needy individual has no way of knowing that the black bolt they desperately need is in the 400 lb bag.If this it how long it takes *me* to go through it all ....is there any reason to believe that others would do it more quickly? Why would I assume that they would invest many months in the process of just doing a rough sort? They have lives to lead. If it's going to take more than a couple weeks .... not going to go over well at all. It's going to have to be pretty well sorted out (and weeded out )if anybody is going to do anything other than get a great big dumpster.Bob

author: vk6zgo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 05:07:14 am
content: Most of my stuff would be useful to Hams,so hopefully,when I become a "Silent Key",it will be "Glommed onto" by my Ham friends.

author: Halcyon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 05:53:08 am
content: On a similar note, I know a guy who has a huge collection of vintage computers just sitting in storage, some still in their original packaging including old DEC machines and mainframes to pretty much any 8-bit machine you can think of. I would just hate to see stuff like that get thrown out or neglected when he passes on. I'm a firm believer that some things like that should be preserved for as long as possible.

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 07:18:31 am
content: Questions that should be answered before deciding how your possessions should be distributed:* Do you have any family or close friends who would appreciate and use any of it?If yes, make sure they are going to be given what they want, for free, no matter what it's worth. They'll have to come and pick up. You may wish to specify that someone/group can take whatever and however much they want.(A friend of mine who has some nice gear and books, and isn't well, has this arrangement, for me to be given his tech stuff if he kicks the bucket.)* Is any of it of sufficient and easily realizable commercial value, that your heirs should receive the money?If yes, make sure you have an executor, and instructions to them on how to sell the things for reasonable value, and who the money goes to. Or simply have the things passed to the heirs, with instructions to them on how to sell the stuff.* Are you still alive, and have decided you won't be needing the stuff any more, and still have the ability to handle online sales, postage, etc?This is an ideal, and although sad it's great to see people taking the trouble to ensure their treasures go to people who understand and want them. Libraries of technical works & manuals in particular, given that so many people these days seem to have the insane idea that paper is a worthless burden since "it's all online now." Nuts to that. No it isn't, and most digital copies that do exist are crappy quality in awful file formats, and a pain in the arse to use onscreen.The real problem is everything else, your giant hoard of precious relics (historic, sentimental, junk, whatever) after you died and that none of your family values, wants or could possibly deal with sensibly or respectfully. Especially if it's large and they are unable to store it.I have several comments on this.* I'm the guy that accepted that "free; world's largest parts collection" recently.https://www.eevblog.com/forum/buysellwanted/free-(aus)-world's-largest-electronics-parts-collection-as-seen-on-eevblog/This could be considered a model. It's really a totally worst case - *huge* pile of stuff, that already had the best creamed off, and lots of absolute junk. The deal was 'It's free, but you must take it by a certain date, and you must take it ALL.' But it worked well. I'm having fun, and there's plenty of useful stuff that made it worthwhile. There are even some fun ideas (mine and friends') on what to do with the total dregs.Lesson: Offer a bulk 'as a whole' giveaway to anyone interested. This should always be tried first when wondering what to do with a deceased estate (or not quite deceased, if you have time.) This results in the stuff going to someone who passes the 'will put in the work to deal with it' filter. Meaning someone who respects and values the stuff, and also thinks they have the means (time, knowledge and storage space), and need to deal with it.If that fails, then there's the garage sale model (with event advertising in gumtree or local media.) I've seen a few of these, along the lines of 'workshop full of stuff, deceased estate, everything must go, onsite inspection and pickup only, prices marked or name your price.) Run it over a period of time. This is easy, and everything of use to anyone will go, if you advertised widely enough. Ha ha, recently a saw an ad for a house demolition sale - "Vaucluse mansion, pre-demolition sale, house and contents including *everything*, all contents, fittings and building materials, structure etc. Would have been fun to see.It could be done in stages; room by room perhaps, or obviously valuable items first with bargaining, then some equivalent of a $10 per item, then 'fill your car for X dollars, then finally an 'everything free' givaway.A friend of mine who needed to clear his family home after it was already sold, and he was going overseas, did this - advertised a 'take it away free' among an extensive circle of friends. It worked, and we all got things we valued. (In my case, including some Helium-3, amazingly.)And obviously, for the kind of things we are interested in, one venue for advertising is eevblog! If you have electronics-related stuff you're wondering how to offload, why not start a thread a thread in the Buy/Sell area? (Btw, that should be called "Buy/Sell/Wanted/Giveaway" to encourage the latter.)The guy with half a ton of IC stock for instance. Did you even consider offering to give it away, to whoever can come pick up? That people sometimes take collections of tech-stuff to the tip, for lack of imagination in how to pass it on usefully, is shameful.Things you *don't* want to happen:* Your spouse, who didn't like you or your hobby, gets your stuff and dumpsters the lot. Either as a last hostile act or because they don't know any better. For eg:- A dumpster I found full of all the possessions of a guy who ran a small air charter business. Piles of aircraft tech manuals, photos, aircraft machinery curios, etc. (I skimmed with permission.)- Two large rolley bins put out on garbage collection day, full of the entire library of a doctor, who'd worked in New Guinea much of his life. Amazing hoard of medical texts. (I grabbed the entire lot. Bugger whoever did that.)* Your spouse, who has no clue about your stuff, and some batty ideas of their value, sits on it expecting to sell for near-new prices. For eg someone I knew had an uncle who was a ham. His wife inherited his ham setup. Stored it badly, and wants to get rid of it. At first it seemed like I'd be able to take it away for free, but it turned out she says she has the receipts, and wants to sell it for something like original value. Sigh, the gear is nice but old and certainly needs work. Someone might pay something for it, but no way she'll get what she wants. So, it sits deteriorating until she dies too, I guess.In my case (hopefully not for a good while yet) I plan to ensure a sequence like: friends with electronics interest (not many) get first dibs. For the remainder, first a 'take all of it for free' offering via eevblog, and if no one bites (it would need a very big bite), then a low price garage sale , then a free for all.

author: AndyC_772
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 07:26:19 am
content: Quote from: sarepairman2 on June 11, 2016, 12:00:56 amI plan to, at least for a good while yet. But I also ride a motorbike.

author: Muttley Snickers
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 07:39:25 am
content: I’m hesitant to tell this story as it brings back memories but I feel it probably should be shared with you good people to serve as a warning and hopefully not be repeated ever again as it could happen to anyone.My grandfather was a painter and decorator with the public works department, painting out hospitals, prisons, government buildings and the like, he also served in WW2 and was a highly respected member of a returned serviceman’s radio club for many years, he enjoyed the occasional beer in moderation and a bet on the horses every weekend, he never told my grandmother what he had won and from what I discovered later he did pretty well indeed.After his passing my grandmother who was a complete fruit loop would ask me to do ridiculous tasks around the place and one example was to install barbed wire on the fence to keep out the possums, I spent hours trying to explain to her that it would have no effect and probably upset the neighbours but after I left she then engaged a shifty local handyman to do the work that I had refused and he would happily take her money by the bundle, he charged her over four thousand dollars to put up the barbed wire and pour the worst 6 foot concrete slab that I had ever seen in the garage which I ended up removing a few months later along with the barbed wire which she was ordered to take down by the council after a number of complaints from adjoining property owners, she would drive the neighbours completely bonkers and I got little relief because they would ring me directly to try and mediate her disturbing activities and those of the unscrupulous handyman.Anyway I’m starting to waffle on and here’s the bit that gets me wild every time I think about it, the garage was full of paint tins and some did have paint in them or appeared to anyway and at some point she had asked the handyman to clean up the garage which he did by removing all of the paint tins along with a lot of useful tools, after her passing and whilst organising the estate I asked the neighbour next door who was my grandfathers dearest friend if there was anything he would like from the estate and he requested all of the ladders, painting tools and his choice of pocket watch, what I didn’t know until he informed me was that my grandfather was an avid collector of pocket watches with a substantial collection that he would wrap in soft cloth and store in the paint tins along with the money from the horse winnings which he would hide from her indoors, the neighbour knew my grandmother was unaware of the stash but took it for granted after my grandfathers earlier passing that I knew about the concealment as I was very close to my grandfather, or so I thought.I am not into watches so not bothered in that regard, what I am into is making sure that people who take advantage of others get a lesson in common decency where possible, after I found out about the matter I pursued the handyman for weeks but he would not return phone calls and refused to answer his front door knowing full well who I was and what I was there for, unfortunately as we had no proof in this case I eventually let it go but I know who you are and what you did so if you happen to be reading this one day arsehole I hope you get what’s coming, and by the way sunshine pop had another eighty odd grand hidden in the back room underneath the Apollo base station which you missed out on, want to try your luck again parasite ?, I dare you.In loving memory.

author: jitter
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 08:21:08 am
content: Quote from: edpalmer42 on June 09, 2016, 05:56:32 pmIt's not nice to deliberately dump your stuff on the next of kin when you die, so if I felt the end was nigh, I'd probably try to take care of the rubbish and put valuables in a will.But you don't always have the luxury to take care of it in time. And in that case, I would be perfectly fine to leave all behind unfinished. Going through my stuff would simply become part of the 5 stages of loss and grief.

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 08:22:34 am
content: Arrgh, Muttley, the pain!And most of all you are annoyed for not volunteering to clean out the garage for her.Ha ha... when exploring anything, I have a rule: look in every volume of even remotely accessible space. It's served me well. And this is now the second story I've heard of valuables hidden in old paint tins.Lesson: it's often a disaster when a very old person is left in charge of someone else's possessions.Similar stories from my family:My grandfather in his youth bought the entire series of Amazing Stories magazines. As a kid I read many of them, and loved them. After my grandfather's death they sat on shelves in granny's house for years. I'd assumed they were safe there, and I'd eventually inherit them. I'd look at them now and then, for childhood memories. Many of the colour printed covers had come loose, and were in a stack on top, since they were cool to look at. Early 20th century SF artwork, their ideas of scenes of future, etc. Wonderful stuff.One day I noticed the covers weren't there. Asked granny where they were. She said they'd come loose from the magazines so she threw them out.Simply didn't have any words. Plenty of thinking about senile old fools.I did inherit the magazines and about half still have the covers. So painful to think about the missing ones.Another story about stupid organizations, as opposed to senile people:My grandfather Myles Dunphy was a bushwalking pioneer in NSW. Famous conservationist, person primarily responsible for creation of the Blue Mtns National Park, hand drew the renowned walker's maps of the Kanangra Boyd wilderness (which are still in use today) from his own walking notes, etc. Invented the light oiled canvas A-tent and made one for himself, and when all his friends in the Mountain Trails Club wanted him to make some for them too, he didn't have time so suggested his mate Paddy Pallin make them (and yes, that began the Paddy Pallin company.) One thing he did was carry a glass-slide box camera into the wilderness areas of the Blue Mountains, and take *many* photos of areas probably never before seen by Europeans. Long before the environment in those places was massively changed by cattle grazing, unplanned fires and introduced pests and weeds.He was also an architect, lecturer in Architecture at Sydney Tech, and took many glass plate photos of prominent Sydney buildings in the early 1900s.He had about 40 large wooden boxes of those developed glass plate photos. On his death those and all his papers, journals and books went to the Mitchel Library in Sydney. Who have never, over the last 30 years done a thing to make those photos public. For a long while they actually lost the boxes. Eventually found, but still no scanning. I've offered to have them scanned myself, but no, they won't allow. I wish I'd simply taken them from granny's place before those bastards got their hands on them. Hey Mitchel Library retards, you suck. Get your f*cking incompetent act together.Anyone with contacts at Mitchel Library, feel free to kick them for me.

author: Muttley Snickers
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 09:18:23 am
content: I still don’t understand to this day why he never told me about the collection yet shared it with the neighbour who was also a returned serviceman, funnily enough I actually installed an entire wall of shelving in the garage specifically to store all of the paint tins whilst he was still alive, she on the other hand was a strange one who like myself was dead against anyone on drugs yet as we found out later had a habit of going around to various doctors to load up on the same prescription of mind bending crap, there were cupboards full of all sorts of shit and I only realised after her death that she was probably the worst drug addict that I ever knew, at least it explained the regular phone calls we would receive at 3 in the morning with her talking complete nonsense and garbled gibberish, I wish I could but I can't say I miss her.

author: uncle_bob
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 12:10:11 pm
content: HiAt least in my case, there is pretty much nobody on the planet who is unaware of my piles of stuff. There are no secret stashes of this or that. We have done long distance moves many times over the years. Each time everybody and anybody I can think of has driven off with grossly overloaded carloads of stuff. That's been true since I was in school. I have also hauled truck loads of stuff off to ham gatherings many times. I always come back with a new loadBob

author: HighVoltage
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 12:36:54 pm
content: Some are hiding real value without knowing it....A good friend of mine is a dentist and about 20 years ago, he took over a dental office from an older dentist that had past away. This older dentist had his own lab for like ever in a very wealthy neighborhood.In this lab was an old carpet on the floor and my friend wanted to replace the carpet and ripped out the old one.He was so surprised, that this old carpet was so heavy, it took three men to carry it out.A few month later he read an advertisement in a dental paper:"We take out your old lab carpet and recycle all the gold dust and pay you cash for the value"

author: uncle_bob
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 01:27:42 pm
content: Quote from: HighVoltage on June 11, 2016, 12:36:54 pmHiYou can say a *lot* of things about the auction sites and the way they mess up markets. The one thing they do indeed do is make prices on a *lot* of things visible. They may not be correct prices, but you have a way to value things. To your point, *first* you have to figure out you have something unusual ....Bob

author: AndyC_772
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 03:39:35 pm
content: Quote from: HighVoltage on June 11, 2016, 12:36:54 pmCool! I wonder if they offer the same service for 0603's, brass wool and cat hair? That's about all my carpet is likely to harbour... or at least, all I like to think is embedded in it.

author: uncle_bob
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 04:37:36 pm
content: Quote from: AndyC_772 on June 11, 2016, 03:39:35 pmHiDon't forget all the bits of lead solder that probably turn it into "hazardous waste"Bob

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 06:16:15 pm
content: No carpet, just concrete here. So I get to actually step on the dirt from the dogs tracking it into the house through my office, dog hair from said dogs, cut component leads and the odd small screw and nut. There are also used retaining rings but they are flat and I don't notice them when I step on them. Naturally, all the above is done barefoot.

author: mrpackethead
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 08:33:30 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on June 10, 2016, 07:47:08 amMaybe Dave should implement a weekly "are you dead function".. If you dont' respond to the nagging. we assume you are dead. and come and take yoru gear.

author: uncle_bob
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 08:37:04 pm
content: Quote from: mrpackethead on June 11, 2016, 08:33:30 pmHi... bring a *very* large truck ....Bob

author: TheSteve
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 09:00:54 pm
content: Ed, I'm calling dibs on your cesium reference.

author: uncle_bob
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 09:11:28 pm
content: Quote from: TheSteve on June 11, 2016, 09:00:54 pmHi... ahhh ... Cesium is a nasty substance. It's *listed* as such so everybody knows that. If you pick up that standard with it's 0.012 grams of Cesium in it, you will need to have all the proper paperwork for transporting it.That all sounds like a joke doesn't it? Try shipping one some day and see what you run into. Been there / done that / no fun at all.=========In the context of leaving stuff after you are gone, this sort of thing is one of those points that *somebody* will need to understand. The actual risk associated with the device is zero (unless you drop it on your foot). The "hassle risk" of the device is quite large. Navigating between the two is possible, it just takes some care.Bob

author: wkb
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 09:29:49 pm
content: Quote from: uncle_bob on June 11, 2016, 08:37:04 pmTruck... no"Antonov An-225"

author: uncle_bob
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 09:33:04 pm
content: Quote from: wkb on June 11, 2016, 09:29:49 pmHi.... that would wake up the neighbors ...Bob

author: ZeTeX
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 10:03:28 pm
content: Quote from: wilfred on June 10, 2016, 07:15:35 amYeah well I'm not sure about that, I'm pretty sure it is magically passed in the genes.My dad's dad was into electronics, my dad is into electronics, and I'm into electronics, could be just a coincidence, I don't know.

author: TheSteve
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 10:06:59 pm
content: Quote from: uncle_bob on June 11, 2016, 09:11:28 pmAt least it wouldn't have to cross a border...

author: Seekonk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2016, 11:42:50 pm
content: And yet I keep buying. Just got out of hospital with heart and kidney failure and the prospect seems a bit more real. I have riverfront property and the wife says she will just let it go for taxes if I kick off because she can't figure out how to turn on the off grid utility system I designed. Dumpster is the only practical solution for the electronics.

author: klunkerbus
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 12, 2016, 01:12:27 am
content: Quote from: Seekonk on June 11, 2016, 11:42:50 pmOf course, even that is getting tougher to treat as an option. It's illegal almost everywhere to dispose of electronics in the trash.EDIT: Sure, small component stuff will go through without anyone noticing, but at least in my part of the world, my last dumpster rental included a "no electronics" clause.

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 12, 2016, 06:36:31 am
content: Which reminds me. I don't suppose anyone knows what happened to eevblog member Deathwish?There must be someone here who'd met him and knew where he lived, so could go check. Surely?He last posted Jan 5th 2016.Unrelated to electronics, I'll be lodging a 'concern for welfare' next week with police, about someone I know. He sails a yacht, sometime is in Oz, sometimes NZ. Not answering email atm, and a high value property owned by his family has been put up for sale by another family member. I'd have thought my friend would be contactable while this was going on. He's supposed to be a beneficiary of the sale.

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 12, 2016, 06:10:28 pm
content: Quote from: TerraHertz on June 12, 2016, 06:36:31 amI think there was a post that stated he got his wish ie died.

author: VK3DRB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 13, 2016, 03:13:49 am
content: Hoarding electronic parts is taking up real-estate and is false economy. In Australia at least, real estate is very expensive. Except for common parts like 0603's and a few semi's, throw the lot out and reclaim your real estate. Your inheritors will simply dump all the electronics at the local garbage dump (we call it a rubbish tip) but take your home. You cannot take it with you, except in my case I would like to be buried with my Fluke 179 multimeter.Prior to moving from Melbourne in 1986, I took six trailer loads of electronics to the tip, vowing never to hoard again. I did not learn my lesson. In 1999 prior to returning to returning to Melbourne, I took eight trailer loads of electronics to the tip, and that was after hosting a big garage sale. Never again.These is nothing better that a well organised, clutter free electronics lab that will attract the chicks. There is nothing worse than an electronics lab that looks like a tornado has gone through it.Live simply so you can simply live. And if in doubt, chuck it out.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 13, 2016, 02:33:39 pm
content: Quote from: VK3DRB on June 13, 2016, 03:13:49 amI agree. A bigger house automatically leads to more junk. Over the last two years I build a shed in the garden. Before starting to build it I asked myself what I was going to store in it and whether it was cheaper to just throw the excess junk away and buy again when needed. I ended up doing both: build the shed and throw the excess junk out because I wanted to have a space where I can work on larger pieces and junk would just be in the way.

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2016, 12:13:08 am
content: Quote from: nctnico on June 13, 2016, 02:33:39 pmTrue for most people's needs. But it's a trade off between storage space, and your anticipation of future availability of parts.Personally I'm one who thinks there's a real chance of a serious economic collapse, possibly going so far as a civilization collapse and technological regression. Many different possible scenarios, including some kind of computing/OS endgame that requires reverting to much earlier hardware and software. (Thanks Microsoft-Intel.)And so, I store a lot more stuff than I would if I was confident of everything staying sane, stable and prosperous over the next couple of decades I hope to remain active.Thanks to a particular government initiative that *isn't* sane, I'll probably have to relocate in the next few years. My plans for the move and new property include moving away from the city, allowing both a better workspace, and a small warehouse for storage. A large space with rows of industrial shelving, multiple times my present storage space. Big enough that I can implement sparse stacking, a searchable inventory database, everything directly accessible and plenty of distributed space for more stuff.It's not just for hoarding. I have a specific long term project that's important enough to me that I want to have a chance of continuing with it regardless of whatever happens in the world. And that means having a very extensive stock of stuff I might need. I can never have *everything* I will need, but whatever I do have reduces potential for things later being unobtainable.Ha ha, and when I die, that warehouse will be an interesting problem for someone. Hopefully, someone will enjoy it.By the way, that recent 'world's largest collection of electronics junk' pile is already proving useful. Some of the 'old electros, good only for the bin' allowed me to fix a HP 8160A power supply board at zero cost. Ugly but it works. I'll write it up in Repair and link here.See here:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/repair/show-us-your-ugly-repair/

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2016, 12:34:57 am
content: When society collapses the last thing you'll need is electronic components because there won't be any electricity to drive them. I'd hold on to a wood and metal working tools for constructing whatever needs constructing. After all engineers build societies.Then again I strongly doubt the world as we know it collapses or goes through a severe technological set back. Unlike previous technological set backs like the fall of the Egypt and Roman empires knowledge about technology is infinitely more redundant nowadays. 3/4 of the earth's population can die tomorrow without any knowledge or abilities being lost.

author: uncle_bob
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 14, 2016, 01:21:04 am
content: Quote from: nctnico on June 14, 2016, 12:34:57 amHi..... might I suggest a course on "The History of Science and Technology" at the local university?Turns out (at least based on a couple of courses on the subject) that the whole "technology went away" thing really was not quite the way it happened. Science took a bit of a bender, but technology held in there pretty well. There were a few exceptions, but most of the technology of the Roman Empire stayed intact through the middle ages.Bob

author: coppice
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2016, 01:30:49 am
content: Quote from: uncle_bob on June 14, 2016, 01:21:04 amNot really. They clung on to the technology they could. However, without properly teaching the maths and science which underpinned it, the technology gradually became unusable. Examples are the tables the Romans produced for constructing and aiming their machines of war. These tables were copied and copied through the centuries, with ever more typos, until they became worthless. Until the maths and science behind those tables got moving again, the technology was essentially lost.

author: shawnb
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2016, 02:05:55 am
content: Quote from: TerraHertz on June 14, 2016, 12:13:08 amI was there for a while, but turns out after a certain point you can no longer find within a reasonable time the part you need that you know you have somewhere, so you just end up ordering another one anyway. Either that or spend almost what your parts are worth to buy/build storage and organization systems.Quote from: TerraHertz on June 14, 2016, 12:13:08 amIn that case, I'd rather use that space to store prepackaged lead -- at least that can be used to acquire something healthier to eat than capacitors!!

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2016, 02:11:45 am
content: Quote from: nctnico on June 14, 2016, 12:34:57 amYou're just saying stuff without thinking about it. Of course there'll still be electricity, for those with the ability to keep small scale local generation systems going. Solar, hydro, even wood-burning steam generation. It's the larger grid systems that depend on cohesive social organization, functioning monetary system, and absence of vandalism to wide area distribution infrastructure that will fail.QuoteOnly in the presence of social cohesion, which has a lot of prerequisites in terms of mindsets, education, honesty, high eroei energy sources, functioning law, trade, currency and general social stability.Lacking critical elements of those, no amount of engineering capability can achieve anything useful to society, because there isn't any 'society.'QuoteI recommend a book:http://www.abebooks.com/servlet/SearchResults?an=Tainter&sts=t&tn=collapse+of+complex+societiesThe Collapse of Complex Societies, by Joseph A. Tainter. Published by CAMBRIDGE UNIVERSITY PRESS, United Kingdom (1990)Incidentally, your understanding of civilizational resilience is simplistic and wrong. Our present civilization's technology base is vastly more fragile than any previous civilization's. For multiple reasons, including critical interdependencies, high complexity of key technologies, advanced technology required to extract key materials from low grade ores (since the easy, good ore bodies are mostly exhausted), heavy reliance on long distance transport (that will fail in snowball fashion at any fuel/economic upset), weapons technology that can easily cause massive long-term environmental damage in any serious conflict (for eg the existing widespread DU contamination of Iraq and Bosnia, causing extremely elevated birth defect rates and cancers, that will continue effectively forever), population levels globally that are unsustainable without technological support via fuels and infrastructure that will fail in any upset, absence of widespread public availability of knowledge of how critical tech is maintained, time-fragility of current data storage technologies, a top-level financial & banking system that has abstracted away into la-la land, absence of any solid allodial, non-fiat, non-fakeable store of wealth (gold and silver currency), and so on.

author: edavid
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2016, 02:31:12 am
content: Quote from: nctnico on June 14, 2016, 12:34:57 amSo I guess this collapse will also destroy all the solar panels?

author: coppice
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2016, 03:30:02 am
content: Quote from: nctnico on June 14, 2016, 12:34:57 amI can't imagine what you were thinking when you said this. Most of the technologies we take for granted in our everyday life are the culmination of a lot of very narrowly focussed expert's work. No one person knows how to make a modern piece of electronics, for example. Some people know about the metallurgy; some know about making ultra pure monocrystalline materials; some know about computer architectures; and so on for hundreds of other specialities. Sure, I know a bit about a lot of fields outside my own, but I only know enough about a few to be effective in those areas. Rome and Egypt had substantial pools of genuine polymaths, and the technologies they knew about were fairly easy for them to recreate. There are no more true polymaths. Its just not feasible to be one right now. The term now gets applied to people who have worked seriously on at least two things. You would need to locate a huge number of people, encompassing all the right skills, and expertly bring them together in a well resources manner, to reproduce anything but the simplest of modern technologies.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2016, 12:25:03 pm
content: Quote from: edavid on June 14, 2016, 02:31:12 amWithout the ability to make new solar panels, fuel for generators, batteries, parts, etc you'll likely be without electricity within 10 years. Maybe 20 years tops if you don't get robbed.There are several series on TV nowadays about how people live in wilderness of Alaska and from those it is very clear to me those people rely heavily on imported parts, tools and fuel. If they have to do without that they are basically screwed and many of them will just die.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2016, 12:33:04 pm
content: Quote from: coppice on June 14, 2016, 03:30:02 amNowadays anything can be manufactured at any place in the world. There is a huge amount of redudancy BECAUSE things are so complex to make. For example: if the US gets wiped out due to a meteorite impact will that stop the factories and engineers in China and Japan? Assuming no severe damage to the atomosphere they will go on business as usual.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2016, 02:46:28 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on June 14, 2016, 12:33:04 pmIt certainly won't be business as usual. A huge part of the market for those factories lies in the US, so at the least there will be massive production cuts. Layoffs and other social disruption will ripple out.All of that without even contemplating the massive changes that would result from the rest of the world jockeying to take advantage of the resources of the suddenly under occupied North America.For better or worse the world is heavily interconnected. It is a dance we dare not stop, and stumbling will not be fun.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2016, 07:38:08 pm
content: Quote from: CatalinaWOW on June 14, 2016, 02:46:28 pmNot really. In 2008 China already experienced such a large drop in exports and the country still exists.

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2016, 08:32:11 pm
content: From information in another posthttps://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/new-way-to-sell-your-junk-on-ebay-in-the-us-ebay-valet-service-through-fedex/

author: System Error Message
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 15, 2016, 10:10:04 am
content: You could always haunt your electronics after you die, it would scare people quite well.

author: razberik
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 15, 2016, 12:01:13 pm
content: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3640731/Train-mad-grandfather-72-builds-incredible-3-000-square-foot-model-railway-garden-shed-girlfriend-won-t-house.htmlI don't understand this, why is anybody willing to marry or live together with somebody who refuse his passion ?I have the same rights to share the house as my beloved one.

author: VK5RC
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 15, 2016, 12:11:08 pm
content: Perhaps that is why he spent GBP250,000 and also he might like that he has to go to the shed. A lot of relationships need a 'bit of distance' at times.

author: bitslice
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 15, 2016, 12:35:32 pm
content: Quote from: razberik on June 15, 2016, 12:01:13 pmThat's not a passion, that's an obsession akin to hoarding.And tbh he's not particularly skilled at modelling, he's just bought stuff and plonked it down.Besides, the first thing a bloke does after getting married is to build a shed, just as the first thing a woman does is to buy a large glass vase and fill it with twigs.

author: razberik
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 15, 2016, 01:04:16 pm
content: Quote from: bitslice on June 15, 2016, 12:35:32 pmNo I don't mean any hoarding. Just passion for some hobby. I see it all around me. Men have their little ham shacks hidden in wardrobe and their wives are always complaining about it. They were complaining about it before marriage. I don't understand it.I asked them why they did it and they can't answer. Sometimes I receive answer like "I have so low self-esteem that I don't believe I will ever find someone who is nice to me".After years, they are both unhappy.Quote from: bitslice on June 15, 2016, 12:35:32 pmTrue, I told me beloved one that I reserve one room in our apartment. She is allowed to enter it, but not touching anything. And vice versa.Or perhaps I live with very well converted shemale.ad) Either I am allowed touching her business. But not in an extreme way of course. We love each other and there is a full support from each other.

author: bitslice
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 15, 2016, 01:32:13 pm
content: She sounds like a keeper, some men end up as slightly rumpled accessories to a pristine house.

author: joeqsmith
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 17, 2016, 11:58:47 pm
content: I read this and have been giving it some thought. I checked with a local radio club and put some feelers out. I gave away my old LeCroy 7200A that I had gone through complete with enough parts to rebuild it. It's been my main scope for about 14 years but the WaveRunner made it obsolete.So the world has a new LeCroy user....I also gave away my old HP 20GHz SA. I think the last time I used it was to show those 10GHz oscillators I made for fun.I had given away my old Hitachi analog scope as well to a beginner. I plan to keep my first LeCroy 7200 that I bought. It gets used anytime I think I am going to blow something up. That and I have an attachment to it.I would like to get a new / used RF generator to replace my old 8660D and my 8640B but I am starting to wonder what to do with all the empty space??!!

author: rstofer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2016, 12:08:17 am
content: Quote from: razberik on June 15, 2016, 12:01:13 pmIt would have taken a separate building anyway. Consider what 3000 SF of railroad will do to the average 2000 SF house. Even to a 4000 SF house! Three thousand SF and expanding out into the garden is a monstrous layout!That is the most magnificent model railroad I have ever seen. That it is O gauge makes it even more spectacular.My wife has no interest in most of my hobbies and I have absolutely none in hers. That's fine, we go to our separate rooms to do hobby stuff.

author: MT
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2016, 03:26:03 am
content: Sex qualifies as hobby, so you do leather bondage in your room and your wife go do rubber spanking in her's and never they meet!

author: Cubdriver
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 18, 2016, 06:08:43 am
content: Quote from: joeqsmith on August 17, 2016, 11:58:47 pmWhat do you do to the stuff you're NOT attached to?!?-Pat

author: Jwalling
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 18, 2016, 09:59:59 am
content: Quote from: rstofer on August 18, 2016, 12:08:17 amIn the town where I grew up (Stamford CT.), there's a model train club in the basement of a church. They would open the doors to the public a few times a year, and we always went.http://stamfordmodelrrclub.com/In the second video, they mount a video camera on the engine, which is pretty cool.

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2016, 10:24:34 am
content: Quote from: Jwalling on August 18, 2016, 09:59:59 amHoly crap ! Did you see the giant at 9:38 ?Great video - thanks

author: Jwalling
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 18, 2016, 12:05:15 pm
content: Quote from: ez24 on August 18, 2016, 10:24:34 amYou're welcome! I don't see any giant (I'm assuming you mean a person) at 9:38?Jay

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2016, 12:46:12 pm
content: Quote from: rstofer on August 18, 2016, 12:08:17 amHave look athttps://www.pendonmuseum.com/galleryStarted in the 50s, still being built. It is unlikely the quality of the modelling will ever be surpassed. The website picturesreallydon't do it justice.

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2016, 06:22:43 pm
content: Quote from: Jwalling on August 18, 2016, 09:59:59 amI really liked the camera on the train view - do you have any more?

author: Jwalling
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 18, 2016, 08:23:36 pm
content: Quote from: ez24 on August 18, 2016, 06:22:43 pmOh, that's not my video, I found that using Google. I moved away from Stamford in 1981, and now live near Boston which is about 140 miles away.Jay

author: Assafl
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 19, 2016, 12:00:34 pm
content: Hopefully, by the time this becomes relevant we'd all transferred our brains to an Arduino.Must think of a way to ensure that Arduino is always powered up.

author: Tandy
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 19, 2016, 12:14:30 pm
content: Quote from: Assafl on August 19, 2016, 12:00:34 pmNot sure an Arduino could hold as much information as a Goldfish brain.

author: razberik
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2016, 07:24:49 pm
content: I visited my friend this weekend. He bought beautiful house in baroque fortress. His house was built in 1803. He showed me the attic.I have seen something wonderful. Tons of hoarded junk by generations. We both believe that none of previous owner never did a single clean up of this attic. 200 years old bottles, rusty tools, tons of hoarded newspapers. We blown out dust from articles about d'Este assassination, creation of first republic, german invasion, Fuhrers end, german capitulation. Older articles written in schwabach were illegible.I was amazed. Hoarding junk can store values too.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josefov_Fortress

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2016, 10:24:54 pm
content: FYII believe somewhere in this topic there was mention of eBay Valet service. I tried it and it really really SUCKS. Never again. Too many problems to write out and it brings back too many bad memories.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 22, 2016, 06:35:48 pm
content: Quote from: razberik on August 21, 2016, 07:24:49 pmI find some old books and articles interesting. I recently was given an old atlas from 1947 which used to belong to my grandfather (he died long before I was born) and it is interesting to see how much the world has changed after WWII and the cold war era. I also helped to tear down a very old kitchen and the builders used newspapers from the 1950's to shield some cement work. They where still perfectly readable after 60 or so years.

author: joeqsmith
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2016, 12:07:30 am
content: Quote from: Cubdriver on August 18, 2016, 06:08:43 amHook it to the transient generator....My 8660D had developed a couple of small problems. The RF signal started to drop out at random and the LED display was starting to loose some segments. The RF signal turned out to be a bad connection in the RF section (due to age) and the LEDs seem to be a similar problem. It needs a good cleaning. I corrected the problem with the plug in and its been fine the last few weeks. It has a 2.6GHz RF and AM/FM modulation plug ins.It's heading to it's new owner, free of charge. Giving the gear away has proven to be a good way to clean house. There is actually some room on one of my shelves now!

author: Tandy
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2016, 10:34:09 am
content: Quote from: nctnico on August 22, 2016, 06:35:48 pmI find that although a lot of the information in old books on electronics is outdated there is also a lot of valuable information. When a technology is new a great deal of effort goes into explain how it works but once it becomes mainstream authors seem to either assume people already know this or focus on the applications without 'burdening' the reader with detailed explanations of how it is made possible.One of the most difficult things to find is something in between the simple how to guides and research material with undecipherable quantum physics equations that are as comprehensible to me as klingon. I wish I did have the capacity to understand these advanced mathematical models but alas I don't, often what I am looking for is an explanation that an ordinary person can understand. This I find can often be found in old books, offering valuable insights that are rarely found in modern titles.So my advice would be don't dismiss old titles some of them are absolute gold mines and most cost very little.

author: jnshadow
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: August 25, 2016, 01:47:02 pm
content: If you family does not want your stuff and does not want to list it on ebay/where ever to sell it off, I suggest donating it to the local hobby robotics club -- can be boxed up and dropped off or allow them to come collect it. Find them online athttp://www.firstlegoleague.org. Look under the STEM search.