Just sit there Engineering Guy, ok? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 08, 2013, 11:36:33 pm
content: Engineer guy, just sit there in your lab coat and keep your mouth shut, ok? We have suit jackets so we'll do the talking!http://electronics360.globalspec.com/article/216/video-teardown-what-s-inside-nokia-s-20-phone

author: smashedProton
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 09, 2013, 02:01:11 am
content: The guy looks like a great engineer too. He probably had a lot to say about it personally.Why do companies always try to do this shit to appeal to engineers? Do they expect an engineer to buy their 20 doller burner phone? Well at least siglent knows how to do it haha

author: ampdoctor
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 09, 2013, 03:59:49 am
content: Feels like I'm watching dueling Lumbergs!

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 09, 2013, 04:03:33 am
content: Quote from: smashedProton on August 09, 2013, 02:01:11 amYep, but didn't even give him a go. He wasn't even mic'd up, so it's clear they didn't want him to say anything.

author: c4757p
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 09, 2013, 04:05:23 am
content: Quote from: ampdoctor on August 09, 2013, 03:59:49 amFeels like I'm watching an engineer slowly die inside...

author: TerminalJack505
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 09, 2013, 04:14:45 am
content: Maybe it's just a Marx brothers gag? The engineer is Harpo, of course.

author: casper.bang
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 09, 2013, 04:28:22 am
content: We have all seen this in real life one way or another no? Even if it's only management taking uninformed decisions without consulting the engineers.

author: Stonent
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 09, 2013, 05:43:28 am
content: It's almost like they just took some random guy and threw a coat on him.

author: Bored@Work
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 09, 2013, 05:56:46 am
content: Well, I would qualify the guy in the middle as a technician, not an engineer. But that doesn't change the awkwardness of the whole scene. Why place him at the table if he isn't allowed to talk?The big question for me is what is their target audience? Are they targeting engineers? Then big FAIL. Are they targeting managers? Then half of a FAIL.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 09, 2013, 06:19:34 am
content: Quote from: Bored@Work on August 09, 2013, 05:56:46 amWhatever it is, the segment was designed by committee, no doubt.

author: IonizedGears
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 09, 2013, 07:30:13 am
content: I bet the marketers thought that it would be a privilege and an honor for that guy to be forced to sit there quietly whilst they most likely butchered the product with marketing bull shit.(Can you say killing a baby whilst the parents are forced to watch quietly for fear of their jobs? )

author: MacAttak
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 09, 2013, 07:39:44 am
content: Is this kind of thing common in the hardware world? I'm asking out of ignorance, really.In my part of the industry, this wouldn't happen (or at least not very often). The engineer would be front and center, taking all of the air in the room if you know the expression (overpowering the suits). Engineers are expected to be Alphas, and will quickly put the sales/management guy in their place if they need to.I know if I was in that guy's shoes I would have just got up and walked out.But again, I profess ignorance here. Is this really how hardware engineers are treated in this kind of situation?One thing that comes to mind though is this - do EE's get exposed to the "soft skills" needed for self-promotion and taking command of a business environment? Those are very important and not obvious or natural to technically-inclined people. I didn't make it past my second year of EE in the early 90's so I have no idea what comprises a modern EE degree these days. But if it doesn't include those skills, then that's a huge problem in my opinion. You're going to be stuck in a hellhole of a career without the upward mobility that often only comes from leveraging those skills.

author: IonizedGears
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 09, 2013, 07:47:08 am
content: Really only if it is meant to go for those who don't know better than to go by what the marketers say do the engineers get left in the back scenes. But if you were proposing the product to a company you would kind of want the engineers to explain everything. Remember this: most consumers are easily persuaded by buzz words and such.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 09, 2013, 07:56:03 am
content: Quote from: MacAttak on August 09, 2013, 07:39:44 amSadly, it's not uncommon.QuoteUsually not. If you are hired as a regular engineer, you are expected to do the engineering work and nothing more. And usually to STFU and tow the company line if you have ideas or opinions that differ from those of the company and/or management.But to be fair, companies are usually not in the business of training their people with those sorts of "life skills". That would change a tad if you are in some form of project or other management role.Outspoken people (like me) at most most engineering companies are swiftly put in a corner, and are seen as people to be "controlled", and not encouraged.

author: ptricks
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 09, 2013, 10:11:05 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on August 09, 2013, 07:56:03 amSame . I left GE because every time I would design something the way it was supposed to be , reliable and not overly expensive I would get told to 'cut cost more, if it makes it through the warranty period that is good enough" . It disgusted me to be an engineer and have to argue with marketing over a 19 cent capacitor and be told " are you sure it is necessary ?"Not surprising the Andrew guy in the video is typical of what I encountered, he has a Bachelor of Science degree in Finance.

author: deephaven
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 09, 2013, 12:00:30 pm
content: Dress sense(?) gets me. Why do people think a smart jacket + jeans = smartly dressed?

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 09, 2013, 03:45:58 pm
content: Quote from: deephaven on August 09, 2013, 12:00:30 pmbecause the advert says so and people applause. what i dont get is why there put the cowboy hat away.

author: MatCat
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 09, 2013, 05:52:02 pm
content: ROFL, coming from the software world I thought us programmers where bad at over analyzing things, I can see in the EE world it's just as bad!

author: komet
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 09, 2013, 06:58:38 pm
content: It looks farcical, almost as if he is only there due a clerical error. Perhaps there is a union rule requiring a union member to be present in all videos.Somebody can probably overdub their own spoken lines onto the video and make a comedy sketch out of it.

author: c4757p
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 09, 2013, 07:23:03 pm
content: Quote from: komet on August 09, 2013, 06:58:38 pmThat soundswonderful. I will save you the pain of my corny sense of humor doing it, though...

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 10, 2013, 06:52:49 am
content: Oh, painful. Blue coat guy had to be there, because they wanted to show the phone being taken apart, but he was the only one who could use a screwdriver, spudger and hot air gun. The other two treat him like a tool.He should stab them both in the eye with that xacto knife.That said, I've been in similar positions. Hardware dev area (myself and one other), to which the company management would now and then bring potential investors to show off company's tech-monkeys.One of them was Bob Hawke once. The unstated text was that we'd better smile, shake hands, and shut the f up, or things would go badly for us.Tell you what - I don't believe all that crap about 'reptilians', but shaking Hawke's hand gave me the weirdest, most terrifying chill sense of horror I've ever felt. Never felt anything else like it, ever. Completely inexplicable. I mean I don't like the man, but nothing that would cause that. I thought 'hair standing up on back of neck' was a figure of speech until that one time.

author: MatCat
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 10, 2013, 07:16:11 am
content: Quote from: TerraHertz on August 10, 2013, 06:52:49 amI must ask... who is Bob Hawk? I googled and all I came up with was a radio personality which doesn't make much sense on how you portray this person?

author: IonizedGears
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 10, 2013, 07:30:06 am
content: Quote from: MatCat on August 10, 2013, 07:16:11 amHe meant Bob Hawke, an Australian prime minister. I don't mean to be rude, but the picture of him on Wikipedia is very... creepy

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 10, 2013, 07:44:18 am
content: Quote from: MatCat on August 10, 2013, 07:16:11 amSorry, my spelling error. As noted, it was Bob Hawke, a past Australian Prime Minister.Who btw, studied overseas then returned to Oz and entered the trade union movement.Through a series of union disputes which seemed 'stuck' until Hawke got involved and then magically 'resolved', he rose through the ranks. Ended up as PM.Some consider he was a CIA asset the entire time, and the union events were manipulated to boost his career, to ultimately get him into power.Even having that opinion doesn't explain the weird feeling that time. I've shaken hands with a few scumbags before, that I'd have rather kicked them in the balls. No such shiver effect in any other instance.It seriously felt like shaking hands with the Devil. And I'm an atheist.

author: MatCat
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 10, 2013, 04:49:21 pm
content: Read the Wiki on him, saw a picture of him with Ronald Reagan, that is enough for me not to like him.

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2013, 02:35:19 pm
content: Quote from: TerraHertz on August 10, 2013, 07:44:18 amyou felt it and deny it. congratulation! you are that close.

author: smashedProton
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2013, 06:29:50 pm
content: Hahaha! Mechatrommer strikes again!

author: IonizedGears
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2013, 07:14:51 pm
content: Quote from: Mechatrommer on August 11, 2013, 02:35:19 pmHe just said that to show the viewers how he felt, not that there was actually any proof of a devil or god.Atheists:1 Religious people:0

author: jancumps
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 11, 2013, 08:12:20 pm
content: Quote from: ptricks on August 09, 2013, 10:11:05 amYou have to drop some too expensive but easily replaceable parts in the design to keep the bean counters busy and allow them to achieve their quota.Rumour says that when The Young Ones in the 80's wanted to get some highly controversial subject through the BBC censorship, they would film half an hour of extra material (mostly involving the prime minister of that era) that they were sure would be cut. It kept the censors distracted and they managed to sneak in the intended content.

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2013, 08:34:06 pm
content: Quote from: smashedProton on August 11, 2013, 06:29:50 pmif i can, next time i want to rename to "Bored@Home"but... i want to deny it, so let stick my name as is

author: c4757p
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2013, 08:54:56 pm
content: Quote from: IonizedGears on August 10, 2013, 07:30:06 amHehe... it is.In his defense, many photos of people on Wikipedia are unflattering, because they're stuck using whatever public domain/open pictures they can scrape off the floor of the Internet...

author: ivan747
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2013, 09:36:55 pm
content: Quote from: jancumps on August 11, 2013, 08:12:20 pmThat actually sounds like a decent idea! Seriously!

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 11, 2013, 10:47:37 pm
content: Quote from: MatCat on August 10, 2013, 07:16:11 amhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_HawkeYes, our former Prime Minster once held the world record for sculling a yard glass of beer!And another former Prime Minister simply vanished in the ocean one day:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harold_HoltTaken by a shark, or Japanese sub, take your pick.We just shrugged our shoulders.Gotta love Australia.

author: Stonent
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 01:05:07 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on August 11, 2013, 10:47:37 pmWell I guess when you vote for a party and not a person, I suppose politicians are disposable?

author: c4757p
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 01:24:10 am
content: I'm all for disposal of politicians...

author: Stonent
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 03:29:16 am
content: Quote from: c4757p on August 12, 2013, 01:24:10 amLike dirty diapers, and for the same reason.

author: Corporate666
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 04:42:28 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on August 11, 2013, 10:47:37 pmIt's so amazing to me that leaders of other countries seem to have so much more normal lives. You can hear plenty of stories about the UK Prime Minister taking commercial flights.. the Australian PM going swimming... or the leaders of other countries being driven to work each day....then in the USA, if the Prez is coming to down - the secret service shows up a week early, does background checks on everyone who will be within 100 yards of him, they shut down cell service as he's passing, have multiple identical motorcades (2 decoys plus the real one) that drive along roads which have been closed by police and no cars are allowed on, and flies around in his own plane with electronic countermeasures, an escape pod, and more firepower than some small countries on board... plus they fly three of his custom-made bomb-proof limo's to any place he's visiting, along with millions of $$ in supplies, equipment and personnel.Makes us look a wee bit paranoid

author: David_AVD
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 04:49:53 am
content: Quote from: Corporate666 on August 12, 2013, 04:42:28 amParanoid or just more nutbags per capita ? LOL

author: BravoV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 04:52:45 am
content: Quote from: Corporate666 on August 12, 2013, 04:42:28 amWhy ? Really, I just can't think of the rationale.

author: Corporate666
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 05:12:26 am
content: Quote from: BravoV on August 12, 2013, 04:52:45 amPresumably because they worry about cell-denoted bombs?I am not sure if it's standard practice to do so - but I was leaving a museum once and when the light went red, a cop on a motorcycle parked in the middle of the street and held up his hands in a "STOP" fashion. We sat there for about 10 minutes... I had been texting my girlfriend, and then I noticed the reception vanished. I was with 3 other people and we represented 3 different cell phone providers, and all of us lost reception. But after we saw the convoy of cars go zipping past, within a minute or two it worked again.

author: IonizedGears
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 05:14:22 am
content: People could use cellphones as remote detonators etc. It is a good thing no electrical engineers are terrorists.

author: Bored@Work
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 05:28:43 am
content: Quote from: Corporate666 on August 12, 2013, 04:42:28 amOr, because they need to do some PR stunt, play a taxi driver for several hourshttp://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/aug/12/norway-pm-jens-stoltenberg-taxi

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 09:14:12 am
content: Quotelet me add... have you heard the first lady try controlling the PM in governing a country? bought 24 mils worth of purse and another 24 mils worth of ring, family stayed in the most expensive suite of Burj Dubai etc etc, which she claimed the money from her childhood saving? well welcome to our country we are tourism country we have many tourists here. the opposition parties who want more "fair and transparent government for the people" are labelled as terrorists? well thats common tactic by now in any countries i guess.

author: GK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 10:02:03 am
content: Quote from: c4757p on August 12, 2013, 01:24:10 amSomething you have in common with this thing then:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jared_Lee_Loughner

author: c4757p
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 11:28:42 am
content: Eh, don't have to go that far, we could always just exile them. I wonder, is Australia still accepting, or have those days passed?

author: smashedProton
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 12:40:56 pm
content: Quote from: IonizedGears on August 12, 2013, 05:14:22 amYou can do it by setting the phone to vibrate and hacking into the vibrate motor to power the detonator. A simple n channel FET or relay will do.

author: digsys
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 12:46:46 pm
content: Quote from: Corporate666We've had our fair share of serious security breaches on our leaders here to !! The other month one was nearly hit by a saladsandwich, thrown by a student !! Since then ALL salad sandwiches are confiscated and then blown up !! A terrible incident !!

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 12:51:37 pm
content: Quote from: Corporate666 on August 12, 2013, 04:42:28 amNot at all, it's a sensibly practical response, to the reality that a very, very large number of people would dearly like to end him.And for good reason.But the Russians... they get a good laugh out of it all:http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/71m-russia-triples-price-fly-us-astronauts-space-station$71M: Russia Triples Price to Fly U.S. Astronauts to Space StationRussia will charge the U.S. National Aeronautics and Space Administration (NASA) $71 million to transport just one American astronaut to the International Space Station (ISS) aboard its Soyuz spacecraft in 2016.WRH: So, here we are with Obama the first US President to preside over a nation without a manned space program since Eisenhower, making us dependent on Russia to reach the space station, then Obama throws a tantrum over Snowden and insults the Russians, who decide they don't really relish the idea of carrying Americans into space any more and charge a "nuisance fee" for the service, tripling the costs of getting an American to the station. Well played, Obama. Well played!Hey, the thread was already completely derailed, don't look at me like that.

author: smashedProton
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 02:16:58 pm
content: Quote from: TerraHertz on August 12, 2013, 12:51:37 pmI showed that post to my family, thanks!

author: GK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 03:10:53 pm
content: Only a thoroughly ignorant dullard would would fail to see the irony of a "defender of free society" such as Snowden taking refuge in a corrupt, repressive backwater such as Russia, or think there is anything to triumphantly gloat about over that part of the saga.http://www.amnesty.org/en/region/russiahttp://www.hrw.org/news/2013/08/01/if-snowden-really-wants-learn-russian

author: IonizedGears
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 07:47:12 pm
content: Quote from: smashedProton on August 12, 2013, 12:40:56 pmYeah i know that, i just didn't want to get too detailed with the NSA and such.

author: c4757p
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 08:04:04 pm
content: Quote from: GK on August 12, 2013, 03:10:53 pmHow the holy hell did we get from a video of two dickheads talking while an engineer pretends to be a brick and holds a chair down to Edward Snowden? Anyway....I don't really think it's right to fault him for that. He's done as much as he can, his only choices now are to either give in to the US government or to flee it. Regardless of how noble it may seem to die (perhaps literally) for your cause, the only thing it accomplishes is the unnecessary termination or imprisonment of a person. And Russia is just about the only place to where he could safely flee the US government. It's not like his being there is going to make their human rights violations any worse.If he turns from whistle-blowing to espionage and willingly divulges sensitive information to the Russians, my opinion will certainly change, but I have yet to hear of him doing that. Not that I don't suspect it..... but I refuse to judge him on my own unfounded suspicions.Quote from: IonizedGears on August 12, 2013, 07:47:12 pmDude, you're already on a dozen watch lists because you know what a MOSFET is...

author: GK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 13, 2013, 03:39:03 am
content: Quote from: c4757p on August 12, 2013, 08:04:04 pmHe knew what the consequences of his actions would be. Racism and xenophobic nationalism is a growing problem in Russia, to which the government both turns a blind eye and actively encourages whenever it suits their purposes. Anti-Americanism and anti-America paranoia is particularly rife, and virtually a right of passage in becoming an "official" patriot. The only reason Russia has granted Snowden temporary asylum is because he is, in a not insignificant degree, somewhat of a hero over there due to the anti-American sentiment, so that perceived act of humanitarianism necessarily translates in theory to greater support for the government. It of course has absolutely nothing to do with a humanitarianism or a respect for freedom or democracy, but the polar opposite. America has bugger all trade and no extradition treaty with Russia, so Russia really has nothing much to loose by capitalizing on the Snowden fiasco for its own corrupt ends. While there are no longer millions of "dissidents" dying in gulags or quarantined into starvation, the basic methods of propaganda of the Russian political machine remains remarkably little changed from when the Allies took control of Berlin. So here we have the most recent hero of the Left in effect a neutered political pawn in something much more rotten. Having said that bit I think I'll tune out of this thread now.....http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-American_sentiment_in_Russia

author: c4757p
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 13, 2013, 03:42:09 am
content: Well, I can't claim to disagree with anything you said there.Quote from: GK on August 13, 2013, 03:39:03 amI think it's time to let this one die. It's so far derailed it's heading back up the tracks in the other direction...

author: ddavidebor
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 14, 2013, 11:01:31 am
content: Quote from: smashedProton on August 12, 2013, 12:40:56 pmIt's a awesome thing that no electrical engineer are terrorist.When i see apocaliptyc scenes in films, is nuts compared to what an agry engineer can do.

author: IonizedGears
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 14, 2013, 11:05:06 am
content: Quote from: ddavidebor on August 14, 2013, 11:01:31 am

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 14, 2013, 11:54:17 pm
content: There's another layer of that 'silent engineer' video that struck me later.OK, so they wanted to have the disassembly of the phone in the video. And my first thought was that neither of the talking heads knew how to do that, so they included Mr Shut-up-and-do-it.But actually... I bet they could have taken it apart themselves if they'd wanted to. So what we're seeing is really due to their attitude, that to be seen using simple hand tools *themselves* would be a huge loss of face. They see themselves as thinkers and managers, not 'manual laborers'.All the more reason to stab them in the eye with the exacto knife.Btw, on terrorists and engineers, any engineer who hasn't spotted the one simple detail that proves there are no real terrorists, only state-sponsored false flag fake attacks intended to justify ramping up the 'security' apparatus, is some kind of ignorant dullard.Think about it from an engineering point of view - if you wanted to take down a major city long enough for the chaotic collapse syndrome to take hold, can you see how to do it? (Better not discuss the means; lets not book ourselves in for SWAT team visits.)The point is, you shouldn't take more than a minute to think of a way to completely disable the critical infrastructure of any large city, for weeks or months, and with no risk to the person doing it. There are multiple ways, and it's *easy*.And yet this doesn't happen. Well, except in two small trial runs in recent years that I can think of, that appeared to have been official 'proof of concept' exercises.There really is a war going on. Only it's not 'Terrorists vs the Free World'. It's the out of control corporate-government-banking self-styled ruling class, vs everyone else. And we can thank Snowden for also giving us a good litmus test to observe where any particular person stands on this matter of principle.