hakko T-15 tips lifetime - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: nour
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2015, 10:30:56 am
content: I am about to buy new Hakko FX-951 soldering station and I have a questionHow long does the hakko T-15 series last before you need to change them?say I am using the station for about 3-h hours a day every dayhow much do you expect the tip to last before it is totally unusable or damagedI am asking this because I am used to the cheap soldering iron which I usually change the tip every 2 or 3 months and they are cheap around 1$ for the tipbut the T-15 tips can be with in the 15-50 $ range which I can't imagine changing it every couple of monthswhat do you think, any one using those T-15 tips can tell us about ?

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 15, 2015, 10:47:43 pm
content: Caring for your tips is what is really important. Make sure you properly tin them when done using them, this will go a long way to making the tips last. Buy OEM. I have mine only a few months and I don't use it regularly so my tips still look new. Some years back, I was working on repairing LCD monitors for my company and was using my Hakko 936 regularly. I recently sold it when I upgraded to the FX-951 after owning it for about 6 years or so with the original tips that still were in excellent condition. Also realize that if you are going to do RoHS soldering, you will need higher temperatures which will shorten tip life.I noticed your other thread about the Amazon sale of T-12 tips. If you purchase them, you may find that they last a fraction of time against an OEM tip. Buy some of both, keep them separate and see how long each lasts. Fakes may be cheaper up front but may cost more in the long run due to more frequent replacements.Another thing, make sure you buy the iron from an authorized dealer. I bought mine from TEquipment.net. Hakko is probably the most faked line of soldering irons there is for some reason.

author: nour
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2015, 11:26:43 pm
content: I don't know but hakko orginal tips seems to be very expensivedo you think for example a weller or any other brand in the same price range would provide a lower price for the tips with the same quality and efficiencyI really haven't searched yet about other brands all my search was about hakkoIf you think about it, it will cost almost 350 - 400 $ for the hakko fx951 + tipsso I may end up paying more money for the tips even more than the station it self to get a decent collection of tips.I think I will open a new topic about other brands

author: wblock
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2015, 12:36:02 am
content: Going through tips that fast is unusual. It could be the temperature is way too high or some abrasive cleaning is being used. Quality tips should last more than a few months, even longer for a soldering iron that drops the temperature when idle. I think the FX951 does that.

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 16, 2015, 01:03:55 pm
content: Weller seems to have it's own issue with dodgy tip quality, tips are made in various countries and quality varies quite a bit. I hope nanofrog weighs in here as he is a Weller owner and knows the ins and outs of the tips much better than I. The FX-951 does have an adjustable autosleep mode. The default setting is 5 minutes, I changed mine to 15. The other issue with that is that there is a beep coming in and out of sleep mode and it is loud. I originally put a piece of electrical tape over the piezo buzzer to mute the sound but later found a setting to turn the buzzer off altogether. As for cleaning, I used to use a wet sponge with the 936. The FX-951 comes with brass curls and I like that better. There is no thermal shock to the tip with the curls and a few stabs into the curls cleans the tip just fine. The stand for my Metcal MX-500P also came with brass curls so I guess I am a convert/fanboy

author: Alfons
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2015, 03:44:14 pm
content: Quote from: GreyWoolfe on December 15, 2015, 10:47:43 pmWhy? For example. there is no single Ersa articles as China Fake. Why Hakko?

author: Shock
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2015, 12:18:29 am
content: Quote from: Alfons on December 16, 2015, 03:44:14 pmDo you have a map of the world handy?

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 17, 2015, 02:33:57 am
content: Quote from: Alfons on December 16, 2015, 03:44:14 pmI truly don't understand why unless the sole driving reason is that people want CHEEP and can't be bothered to look at total cost of ownership including the aggravation of buying cheap crap to begin with. I have tried cheap. Now I prefer to save the additional coin of the realm to buy it right the first time and only buy it once.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2015, 02:52:02 am
content: Quote from: nour on December 15, 2015, 11:26:43 pmYou really don't need that many different tips.A basic set that would allow you to tackle most anything you'll encounter would consist of"Chisels:Say one of each of 0.8mm (T15-D08), 1.2mm (T15-D12), 1.6mm (T15-D16), 2.4mm (T15-D24), 3.2mm (T15-D32); they also offer a 4.0mm and 5.2mm should you need them.Drag Solder Tip:T15-3BCM; alternately, you can use a hoof/bezel shape, preferably tinned face only (T15-BCF3). The bevel/hoof can handle additional tasks, but isn't quite as forgiving & easy to use for drag solder as the dedicated tip. But it's not far off.Bent Conical:T15-J02This tip is good for pulling bridges you may have missed when drag soldering, tacking IC corners prior to drag soldering, and soldering passive SMD components.You'd truly be amazed at just how much you can do with just these 3 or 4 shapes. Take a look atHakko's Tip Selection Page by Shapeto see what you can do with each shape.Other shapes are handy too (knife, which is good for plastic rivets & drag soldering, and bent chisels to get into tight spaces/weird angles, such as cup terminals in a wire connector). But please understand, you don't have to go buy every shape & size made either. Start with a basic set based on above ^ for example, and if you find what you have doesn't work well enough or there's a major comfort issue, then buy the specialty shape you need at that time (add over time as required/desired).TEquipment sells the chisels for $10.47 each, the bevel/hoof for $10.47, the drag tip for $20.97, and bent conical for $16.77. Worst case and you get all of them, it's $100.56 ($94.53 after using the discount code; add theFX-951to it, and the total comes out to$316.83worst case after discount <means station + bevel/hoof + drag tip + bent conical + 5 chisels>, and free shipping since it's over $99). Ditch the drag tip and just use the bevel for drag soldering, and it comes down to $297.12 after discount. So you can get the station + a decent selection tips for just under $300.Quote from: wblock on December 16, 2015, 12:36:02 amIt is. Either the tip care is appalling (i.e. set temp is too hot, not keeping it tinned, abrasion, beating on the tips, ...), or the plating is too thin from the manufacturer, which is usually the flaw in the counterfeits/knock-offs (iron plating is sacrificial, so it's eroded away over time). Tin lead solders don't have as high an affinity for the iron as the RoHS lead-free alloys do, and the fluxes used for the lead-free stuff tends to be more aggressive as well (shorter time to do it's job due to higher operating temps).Hakko's tip plating is some of the thickest out there, if notthethickest of the major manufacturers. Which means for a hobbyist, they can last for years. Even a decade isn't unheard of.Same goes for the other major brands.FWIW, the FX-951 does have setback features tied to it's stand (stand is electrically connected to the station). Nice feature, and it comes OTB, not an option as it does on the Weller WD series.Quote from: Alfons on December 16, 2015, 03:44:14 pmHakko's are easy to copy (tend to be on the simple side, but very reliable), and there's a large enough demand for them, that it's well worth the effort.They've started to copy Weller's WD series as well (heating tech & station features; not looks though - even Quick has gotten in on it, so there may be some expired patents involved). Ersa's I-Con Pico is made in China, so there may be fakes of that soon as well (heating elements are made in Germany though). Metcal/OKi is also building stuff in China, and the HCT-900 hot air rework station is a rather dodgy POS as I understand it (same quality as the cheap shit on Aliexpress, eBay and so on, but runs $704.63 at Mouser). No need to steal Metcal's tech, as the patents have expired. So look to see Chinese brands with induction based systems (Quick has already done so, but for a Chinese brand, the build quality of what I've seen is extremely good, and their products are used professionally).A bit OT, the Quick 861DW offers an amazing value (or -DS and -DA models that are for 220V and EU & UK plugs respectively). They're very similar to a Hakko FR-810 in features and tech, but sell for $235. Yet the build quality wasn't compromised to meet that price point (neat inside, quality components, wiring is correct, ...).Quote from: GreyWoolfe on December 16, 2015, 01:03:55 pmMexico and Bosnia are the two locations that have quality issues (some are fine, but the ~33% failure rate I've had with the Bosnian tips ... you'll have such wonders as the plating comes right off or is too thin). German, US, and Japanese made tips are just fine.A wet sponge is fine for tin-lead alloys to this day. It's with the lead-free stuff that there are issues with, which led to the brass curls/wool being introduced as a better alternative. The brass wool is nice to use though, and no more need to keep distilled water or replace nasty sponges (most kept them too long, which is what causes them to not clean as well as a fresh one). Personally, I'm using the brass most of the time, but I still like sponges (they actually get the tip cleaner IMHO, but it removes the tinning in the process, so re-tinning right after is rather important).

author: MTNELECTRONICS
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2016, 08:42:39 pm
content: Just thought I'd add my experiences with the Hakko T15 series tips:As a bit of background, I actively use my iron on average about 4 hours a day, 5 days a week, and it is turned on about 10 hours every day. I almost always use 63/37 leaded solder and usually set my tip temperature to around 660F (~350C), but sometimes go up to 760F-800F if needed for large thermal mass objects. I have the iron set to throttle down three minutes after being set in the holder.I do clean and tin the tips on a regular basis, but I am by no means meticulous about it and sometimes I use a lot of flux and get quite a bit of black burned flux on the tips. I normally use the brass sponge, but occasionally I use the water sponge for extra cleaning. I always try to keep the tips covered with solder.I have had the same D24 tip for about 9 months now, which is longer than I've had any other tip last. I usually get about 6 months from the T18 series tips before they're gone. Either the thermal throttling helps a lot, or these tips have thicker/better plating than the T18 tips do.The T15 tips are expensive, as are the irons that power them, but I can say that they do have better thermal performance than the T18 tips do---not only during initial warmup, but also when soldering large mass components. The iron is also quite a bit thinner and lighter than the T18 iron. All-in-all I would say that the T15 series tips are an improvement over the T18, but definitely not a quantum leap.

author: Je24
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: January 22, 2016, 05:10:37 pm
content: Quote from: nanofrog on December 17, 2015, 02:52:02 amHad the same question as the OP and found great info in this thread, including nanofrog’s initial tip choices. Initially had a T15-ILS on my list but may be changing that to a J series, leaning more towards the JL02. Since you recommended the J02 was wondering if you used a JL02 and had thoughts between the two? Do those sharp tips have a shorter life span than thicker ones, or if using proper care will last the same?

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 22, 2016, 07:03:14 pm
content: Quote from: MTNELECTRONICS on January 20, 2016, 08:42:39 pmActually, they aren't expensive.I've simple plated copper tips (Weller LT series) that cost as much or more than basic profiles for the T15 series from TEquipment (i.e. $10.47 per), and the FX-951 is the best value out there for the type of tech it uses (for those that live in North America at any rate).You can do better, but you'll be pushing $500 for the station, and ~$30 per tip for basic profiles (cartridge types from JBC or Weller).

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 22, 2016, 07:05:00 pm
content: Quote from: Je24 on January 22, 2016, 05:10:37 pmFor disclosure, I don't own anything from Hakko. My kit is comprised of a Weller WD1 + WSP80 iron + WMP iron + WDH10T connected stand + WDH10 non-connected stand (bought before the FX-951 came out).Regarding the T15-J02 (bent conical), I do use that shape.It's excellent for pulling bridges, tacking IC corners, and tacking in passive SMD parts without having to swap tips so much (I do have spare tip retainers to speed things along).I also have a very fine point conical (tip that came with the WMP). It's useful, particularly for tacking corners on SMD IC's, but I do prefer the bent conical. It's not only more useful (can do more), but I find it's more comfortable to use as well (tip angle of bent conical or bent chisel for that matter = you don't have to do as much gymnastics with your iron hand).

author: Je24
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: January 22, 2016, 08:38:33 pm
content: Quote from: nanofrog on January 22, 2016, 07:05:00 pmThanks for the reply.Of the 5 chisel tips you recommended what 2 or 3 would be the best to start with (to handle most situations)? This is for general hobby work.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 22, 2016, 09:53:31 pm
content: Quote from: Je24 on January 22, 2016, 08:38:33 pmIt'll depend on what you're doing.For example, if you're doing mostly PTH (plated thru-hole), then the 1.6, 2.4, and 3.2mm would be more appropriate (they also offer a couple of larger sizes). For more SMD OTOH, it will depend on the package sizes as to how small you need to go, but the 1.2, 1.6, and 2.4mm would probably do you without further information (0.8 and 3.2mm are still useful though).

author: MTNELECTRONICS
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 23, 2016, 03:04:53 pm
content: Quote from: nanofrog on January 22, 2016, 07:03:14 pmI suppose that 'expensive' is all relative to what you're comparing it against. The station is more than twice as expensive as an FX-888D, and the tips are also almost twice as much, so for an occasional user it is really hard to justify the cost when there is another good option available. Even though I use the machine every day to make my living I can only really justify it on terms of extra comfort and a tiny bit of speed increase. I use two irons still with different profile tips so the tip swapping speed doesn't help me all that much (I would also recommend that a hobbyist buy two separate FX-888D irons if they planned on swapping tips a lot instead of a single FX-951).

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 23, 2016, 07:17:38 pm
content: Quote from: MTNELECTRONICS on January 23, 2016, 03:04:53 pmKeep in mind, the FX-888D isn't in the same league as the FX-951 in either performance or features though. And those features can mean a lot; particularly the performance, operator comfort, speed of tip changes, and reduced operational costs (tips last longer due to setback features).As per cartridge tips, they're the least expensive out there (vs. Weller or JBC). I've even simple plated tips (LT & NT series) that cost as much or more than the basic profiles in the T15 family for the FX-951. And don't forget the quality & longevity of Hakko's tips, which make them an even better value.So yeah, pricing is relative, but to be fair, the FX-951 needs to be compared with it's direct competition, not entry level stations, as those considering this station would be after the improvements it provides over an entry level station. And it's in this instance where the FX-951 really shows it's value, as it's literally half the cost for the station vs. it's direct competition from Weller or JBC.As per fast tip swapping, it's more cost effective to buy additional tip retainers for the FX-888D (metal tube,B3469+ nut,B1785), and the plastic & foam sleeves for the FX-951 (B3216- B3219, for yellow, orange, blue, and green respectively).FWIW, I do this with my WSP80, and it works well; only takes a few seconds to unscrew the existing tip and screw on the next one I need. It does mean I have to plan what tips I need before-hand and slip them into retainer tubes, but that doesn't take long.

author: TheBay
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 12, 2016, 11:44:41 am
content: Quote from: nanofrog on January 22, 2016, 07:05:00 pmSorry to drag up an old post, I also use a WSP80 iron but with a WD80 base, I see you're a fan of the bent conical, what one do you use with the WSP80?I also have a FX951 but mainly use that with Chisel tips, I use the Weller for SMD stuff, I'd rather put a bent conical in that as the FX951 tips are too expensive over here.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2016, 04:14:14 pm
content: Quote from: TheBay on December 12, 2016, 11:44:41 amNo worries.I use theLT1LX.For T15 tips (or anything Hakko),Batterflyshould be the least expensive source for the UK (seeing common profiles for 14EUR). Easier than buying from dancap.co.uk too.

author: TheBay
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 12, 2016, 08:35:48 pm
content: Quote from: nanofrog on December 12, 2016, 04:14:14 pmI did an order with Dancap today funnily enough, just grabbed some more T15-D16/D24. For some reason I prefer the Weller station for smaller stuff.I went to order some tips from RS but they said a few of the LT series are now discontinued! - I've always used a 1.2mm Chisel on it, but really fancy trying out one of these fancy bent tips.Keep meaning to check Batterfly out, thanks for reminding me.*Edit* Just checked Batterfly they are more expensive than Dancap.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2016, 08:46:21 pm
content: Quote from: TheBay on December 12, 2016, 08:35:48 pmCheck out Weller's site for LT series tip profiles, as there have been some additions as well as deletions. Most notable to me, were the addition of a couple of bevel/hoofs in both 3.0 & 4.0mm (tinned face only), as well as a larger gull wing.Regarding the LT1LX, you may find you'll have to enter in an offset or just raise the temp a bit, say ~15C due to the length and small mass at the business end.Definitely give Batterfly a look-see for Hakko and Rigol.

author: KL27x
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2016, 11:50:03 pm
content: I have no interest in comparing cost:benefit of real hakko tips to fakes. Firstly, I can't even order fake tips in the styles I use the most. Secondly, since getting my first Hakko FX (analog) maybe 4 years ago, I have gone through at least 3 lbs of solder and many $ thousands worth of pcb and components and I still haven't worn out a tip.The whole "caring for your tip" thing? I leave my station on hours, doing nothing. I don't tin the tip before turning it off. I don't give a rat's behind. If my tips last thing long without care, it's good enough for me.OP: these are T18 tips, and using lead solder. YMMV. But in general, don't worry. Hakko tips are well built. If you are changing out your Hakko tip every few months, you are either doing something very wrong, or you have been a busy bee and certainly have gotten your money's worth. I'd be more concerned to save a few cents on my rolls of solder, because you must be using a LOT.

author: mrpackethead
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 13, 2016, 07:05:48 am
content: I have a 951 on my bench and the iron gets used all the time. Its pretty much on all the time the workshop is open. Though its mostly in SLP mode.. I've got a set of Tips for PbF and for PB ( never mix them ).. I've got no hard and fast data on how long they have bene used for, but some of them will be more than 5 years old. I've replaced some of the conical ones and my drag solder ones, ( sorry cna't remember the numbers ).. What i've replaced more often is the plastic barrel that holds it together.I've not bothter with clones/fakes, for saving a few dollars i dot' need the drama. Enought problems without causing more.

author: stj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 13, 2016, 07:42:26 am
content: Quote from: KL27x on December 12, 2016, 11:50:03 pmthat's the spirit!i also use my iron all day, only ever tin the tip once - when i buy it.and they seem to last atleast a year.wet sponges are for the bath, i only clean the tip with brass wool.and i dont throw flux on everything i solder like some people either - flux is for smd reflow.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 14, 2016, 12:30:56 am
content: Quote from: TheBay on December 12, 2016, 08:35:48 pmGood to know, so thanks.BTW, have they finally made it easier to purchase from them?I ask, as I still don't see a proper web-store, so presume you still have to order by phone and pay with bank-bank transfer, money orders, or cashiers' check types of payment (not so easy vs. a proper web-store that takes credit cards).Quote from: mrpackethead on December 13, 2016, 07:05:48 amFWIW, I find a stand that's connected to the base unit type of sleep mode a true god-send level of feature (helps save tips + returns to set temp much quicker than from cold/room temp).This, and Hakko's thick plating, is likely what's been saving your tips IMHO.As per separate tips for lead based & lead-free alloys, that's certainly the ideal method IMHO. But for those on tighter budgets, they can use the same tips for either; it just means they need to be properly rinsed before using them on any joints (I usually go this route on the rare instance I use lead-free, and I've had my current station since 2008 <Weller rather than Hakko>).Quote from: stj on December 13, 2016, 07:42:26 amI find additional flux has it's place, such as really old/crusty boards that need repair (i.e. RA in order to cut through the oxidation). But I find a little goes a long way.For desoldering, I find quality wick, a decent solder pump (i.e. Edsyn Soldapult or Engineer models), and adding solder to improve heat transfer work rather well for IME.Some additional flux to the wick may also be in order, depending on it's age & storage conditions.P.S. I use a brush pen to dispense additional flux (Bonkote), as it's way cheaper than the disposable pens.

author: neslekkim
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 14, 2016, 03:18:08 pm
content: Quote from: nanofrog on December 14, 2016, 12:30:56 amI asked couple of years ago, they didn't want to sell outside UK.I tried then to ask if I could buy stuff from my country, and get it sent to an hotel so I could pickup on an holiday trip, but no.. they are very difficult shop to deal with.