Fake vs. Poor Quality - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: dnwheeler
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 24, 2017, 07:38:29 pm
content: I can't be the only one who is annoyed by the constant use of the term "fake" to refer to poor quality generic components. To me, a "fake" transistor would be a block of plastic with legs that didn't do anything. If it is just a poor quality device made cheaply, it isn't fake - it's just bad. There are a few different categories that are very distinct to me:1. Counterfeit - these are parts that, regardless of quality, have markings indicating they are manufactured by one company but are actually made by another. This is usually done to deceive the buying into thinking the parts are good quality. They may, in fact, be of good quality, but the market is fickle and won't pay the same for a no-name part even it is high quality. This may also be done with the less nefarious purpose of identifying a "generic" part as equivalent to another name-brand part. I'll concede that a counterfeit Bourns potentiometer could be called a "fake" Bourns pot, but it isn't a fake pot - it's a real pot with a fake logo.2. Fake - these are truly non-functional, or "wrong-functional" parts. These may be empty IC shells, ICs that have been relabeled as a completely different part. These are entirely fraudulent and are usually created to supply some impossible-to-get parts, or very expensive part at a low cost. Generally, it is assumed the buyer will simply assume the part is defective and won't bother trying to get a refund.3. Poor quality - this is the category that many people call "fake". These include no-name parts, poorly formed plastic, undersized components, etc. They are "real" in the sense that they are generic clones of common parts, but through cost-cutting measures don't perform as they should. There is a sub-set of these that are simply out-of-spec parts. There are reports of sellers buying large quantities of out-of-spec parts (i.e., they failed QA) and selling them cheaply as if they were OK.4. Generic, no-name, off-brand - these are simply normal parts made by different manufacturers. Just because a part isn't made by TI, Signetics, Nippon Chemicom, etc. doesn't mean they are "fake" or even inferior quality. Many of these are perfectly acceptable and are simply made by companies that don't spend millions of dollars on international marketing.5. Reprocessed - these are pulled from products (maybe new, maybe used) and refurbished. In some cases, the fact that they are pulls is clearly stated, but sometimes these parts are sold as new. It isn't always cut-and-dried case of fraud and deception. At what point does a component become used? When it is sold to a customer? When that customer inserts it into a socket? When that customer solders it into a circuit board? When power has been applied? When the circuit board is shipped to another down-line customer?So, maybe I'm just being pedantic, but I think it would help the general discourse if people would use the correct term rather than labeling all of these "fake".

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 24, 2017, 07:49:45 pm
content: Fake denotes the parts being a faked brand, not that the parts themselves might be fake. If I have a fake TI regulator, it denotes a probably functioning regulator, but not manufactured by Texas Instruments. The definition of the word fake seems to be a little less narrow than you make it to be:fake1adjective1Not genuine; imitation or counterfeit.‘she got on the plane with a fake passport’‘a fake Cockney accent’1.1 (of a person) claiming to be something that one is not.‘a fake doctor’https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/fake

author: dnwheeler
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 24, 2017, 08:37:18 pm
content: I somewhat agree that using "fake" to denote counterfeit makes sense. The more annoying uses are "fake MOSFET" or "fake 555 timer" or "fake BNC connectors". In these cases (these are real examples from the forums), they aren't talking about counterfeit brands, just potentially poor quality parts. Another one I saw recently was "fake Fluke-style leads". Again, these aren't pretending to be Fluke leads, the are just similar looking leads that are probably poor quality.

author: Cyberdragon
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 24, 2017, 08:41:48 pm
content: Some counterfeit components can indeed by "fake" in both terms in that they are the wrong manufacturer and the wrong component. Most notable of these are fake batteries with tiny capacities and fake transistors with tiny transistors inside of a larger and higher rated package, some of which may claim to be name brand.EDIT: In that case, they are still barely functioning components, but are claiming to be far beyond their capability.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 24, 2017, 08:50:36 pm
content: Quote from: Cyberdragon on October 24, 2017, 08:41:48 pmYes, the suspiciously light batteries of unknown heritage. They tend to come with the cheaper stuff. I'm yet to take one apart, but I've always suspected that part of it is simply cardboard or another cheap filler. It might even be waste that's dumped, as batteries should be disposed of responsibly at the end of their life and this way you make the chemicals some else's problem.

author: rdl
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 25, 2017, 04:28:35 am
content: I agree that the word "fake" is all too often used incorrectly. In most cases "cheap ass crap" would be more appropriate.

author: Old Don
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 27, 2017, 01:37:27 pm
content: Quote from: dnwheeler on October 24, 2017, 07:38:29 pmDon't forget "store brand" which might be exactly the same, but cheaper only because OEM marketing costs are not factored into the sales price. Or may be overrun production sold to a store to recoup production cost.