Rigol DS1000E --> DS2000 - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: olsenn
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 01, 2012, 11:59:26 pm
content: Apparently Rigol is producing yet another scope, this time what appears to be a replacement to the DS1000E series. It features 70Mhz/100MHz/200MHz analog bandwidth, 2GSa/s, 14Mpt - 56Mpt memory depth, and some other neat looking features.Unfortunately, the product desciption is only in Chinese at the moment, and the Yahoo translation is, albeit hillarious, unreadable. You can find more information for it here:http://cn.rigol.com/prodserv/DS2000/

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 02, 2012, 12:36:38 am
content: 500uV/DIV ? Awesome!At 50,000wfs and 14Mpoint this is serious business.If it does actually replace the 1000 series, and is a similar price point, then that's pretty game changing at the bottom end of the market.Dave.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 02, 2012, 12:47:23 am
content: Looks like it was released 1st March?http://www.epc.com.cn/news/20120301/14937.aspDave.

author: A Hellene
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2012, 01:01:17 am
content: There is nothing wrong with Google-translate:http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=en&u=http://cn.rigol.com/prodserv/DS2000/Of course, life can always become easier when we try to combine information!http://www.rigol.com/prodserv/DS2000/Quoting (and proofreading!) text of the original page:----------------------------------------DS2000 Series is the newmainstreamdigital scope.Features:* 2 channels* Lower noise floor, larger vertical range: 500uV/div ~ 10V/div* Bandwidth: 70MHz, 100MHz, 200MHz* Max. Sample Rate: 2GSa/s* Standard Memory Depth: 14Mpts. Optional Memory Depth up to 56Mpts* Waveform capture rate up to 50,000 wfs/s* UltraVision technology with Multi-Level intensity grading display* Hardware based real time waveform record and analysis function (Standard)* A variety of trigger and serial bus decoding functions* Automatic measurements with statistics* Advanced math functions (user defined)* Complete connectivity: USB Host, USB Device, LAN(LXI), AUX* 8 inch TFT (800x480) WVGA----------------------------------------Not bad for their entry-level scope. Not bad at all!-George

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 02, 2012, 01:11:32 am
content: Quote from: A Hellene on March 02, 2012, 01:01:17 amFrigg'n brilliant if you ask me.The question is what will it cost?No way they can do it for the current DS1052E price, if they did, the low end scope market is 100% theirs and they won't be able to make enough.I expect pricing of at least double.Dave.

author: amspire
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2012, 01:14:39 am
content: It looks like it is a big range with 25 different models.The model numbering for the E series will beDS2XX2E where XX is the bandwith: 05 - 50MHz, 07 - 70MHz, 10 100MHz, 20 200MHz and 30 for 300MHz.http://www.lxistandard.org/products/ProductList.aspxRichardEdit: Dave, when are you going to do the blog on upgrading the DS2053E to the DS2302E ?

author: A Hellene
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2012, 01:19:39 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on March 02, 2012, 01:11:32 amIt should be around USD 1000-1800, since DS4012, the lightest member of the DS4000 line, costs USD 2100.-George

author: amspire
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2012, 01:39:10 am
content: That LXI reference I posted above indicates that all the scopes in the Rigol 2000 series will come with LAN interfaces using the LXI (LAN-based eXtensions for Instrumentation) protocol. There will also be the USB interface.This is a consortium which includes Agilent aiming at a replacement for IEEE488/GPIB.Richard.

author: amspire
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2012, 02:08:02 am
content: Back at the release of the DS4000 series and DG4000 series, the first two of the "Four Diamond" series of products, Xing Fei of Rigol mentioned that the next generation of upcoming "Four Diamond" products (like the ds2000 series) will have “incredible” prices.There were going to be two big releases coming, so there is one more big release to be announced after the DS2000. Perhaps new function generators? They already have lots of them, but then again, the current DG2041 is overpriced compared to the DG4000 series generators. Low end spectrum analysers?

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 02, 2012, 02:24:09 am
content: It looks like I'll eventually have a 4000 series scope to review (in month or two), and hopefully this new 2000 as well.They already have a new function gen, the DG4000 series which is nicely priced, and this might be on the way too.Things are in motion...Dave.

author: hugos31
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2012, 12:27:55 pm
content: DS2000 shares characteristics with his older brother DS4000http://www.rigol.com/prodserv/131/

author: olsenn
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2012, 02:15:25 pm
content: QuoteI'll be (hopfully) getting the new Rigol DSA-815 spectrum analyzer soon, and when i do I'll be sure to do a review of it.

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2012, 03:24:10 pm
content: Nice scopes, thanks for that post and leads. Can't wait for them to show up, it appears to be Agilent's only real competition at fast update rates.

author: robrenz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2012, 05:50:38 pm
content: On this page from abovehttp://www.rigol.com/prodserv/DS2000/all but one of the screens shows 4Gsample/sec.

author: robrenz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2012, 06:01:26 pm
content: So I guess sales borrowed a 4000 to show the features the 2000 will have.

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2012, 06:37:49 pm
content: Wow, this looks pretty awesome and could break Owon's puny neck. Probably I should sell my SDS8102 as long as I get some money for itJust a pity that the 4ch scopes seem to be exclusive for the DS4000/6000 series.I wonder if they will be able to decode SPI with the trigger channel as CS and if the pricing of the decoder will be a bit more competitive. Prices for decoder options on the DS4000 are pretty damn high compared to that on Hameg HMO where you get two or three protocols for half the price.

author: Kilroy
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 03, 2012, 12:27:24 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on March 02, 2012, 12:36:38 amFor sure.I'm not sure why there are so few scopes out there with 500uV sensitivity, or better, because it certainly is useful. I have a HP 1201A low frequency storage scope that does 100uV/Div. Really low drift and CMRR...nice for low noise circuitry, biomed, audio and the like.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 03, 2012, 12:57:47 am
content: Quote from: Kilroy on March 03, 2012, 12:27:24 amIt's a function of bandwidth essentially. It not easy to design a low noise front end with high bandwidth, but it is possible, especially so with bandwidth limiting options. Most just don't bother I guess. However, now it seems to be becoming popular, with Lecroy/Hameg, and now Rigol advertising such a feature.Dave.

author: ejeffrey
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 03, 2012, 10:07:03 am
content: The Johnson noise of a resistor is:sqrt(4*k*T*R*B)A 1 megaohm scope using a 10x probe sees about 900 kohm impedance which gives 1.2 mV RMS(or 6 millivolt Pk-Pk) noise in 100 MHz bandwidth. In reality it isn't quote so bad as all that. At high frequency the resistors are shunted by the compensation capacitors which don't add noise. Still, the Johnson noise is already a significant fraction of the noise floor and the vertical amplifiers add their own noise.So to get much utility out of a 500 uV/div input you need to engage the bandwidth limit, turn on signal averaging, use a 50 ohm input coupling, or drive the scope from a low impedance source instead of using a 10x probe.

author: A Hellene
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 03, 2012, 10:35:36 am
content: Ah, yes, the Johnson-Nyquist thermal noise. Fortunately,Quote from: A Hellene on June 06, 2011, 06:54:06 pmNot to mention the all time classic Tek manual,Oscilloscope Probe Circuits (Joe Weber, 1969).-George

author: hugos31
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 03, 2012, 12:00:13 pm
content: betray my old tektronix TDS3012 and buy Rigol DS2102 100mhz

author: Randall W. Lott
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 04, 2012, 02:02:34 am
content: I'm hoping for a price drop in the DS1052E after this. I've been wanting one, but my student budget doesn't agree.

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 04, 2012, 09:42:54 am
content: Unfortunately I think the price drop has already happened. The DS1102E halved in price from $800 to $400 and the DS1052E was reduced to $350.

author: hugos31
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 04, 2012, 02:32:55 pm
content: when the sale begins by oscilloscope DS2000 ?

author: Joy at MCS
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 05, 2012, 05:38:47 pm
content: Rigol are scheduled to come out with the 2000 series of scopes in June of this year, but I wouldn't be surprised if it falls in to July.They will be :2 channel 70mhz2 channel 100mhz2 channell 200 mhzPricing for Europe hasn't been released yet.As far as I'm aware this isn't to replace the 1000 series but just in addition to it. The new 2000 series have an 8 inch screen.There are also going to be coming out with some other exciting products in the New Year.Have a good example everyone,joy

author: hugos31
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 05, 2012, 11:53:32 pm
content: Jason ChonkoJason Chonkojason_chonko@rigoltech.comEnviar correoBuscar correo electrónicoAgregar a contactosPara Hugo nelson Parra M.Hello Hugo,My mane is Jason Chonko and I am an Applications Engineer at Rigol Technologies USA.Thank you for writing in.The DS2102 is going to be ready for sale in mid-2012 with shipments likely in June. The costs are still being worked out, but I would expect the 100MHz to be below $1000.If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me at any time.Sincerely,JasonOn Sun, Mar 4, 2012 at 4:02 AM, Hugo nelson Parra M. <hugos_31@hotmail.com> wrote:cost Rigol DS2102 100mhz ? when it started selling in the U.S.?--Jason ChonkoApplications EngineerRigol Technologies7401 First Place, Suite NOakwood Village, OH 44146Email: jason_chonko@rigoltech.comPhone: 440-232-4488 x152

author: olsenn
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 06, 2012, 12:51:56 am
content: Interesting... I never thought the boys at Rigol and it's distributers would be replying to my message, haha; I guess they want to clear up some things before the rumours spread beyond control.If you're still listening to this forum, I'd recommend you suggest to your boss selling the 200MHz model for under $1000. The reason I say this because most hobbyists and people who are tight on budget won't want to spend for than $500 - $1000 on a DSO, and most people who want a better scope than the DS1102E and have the money to spend on it will likely jump straight to the DS4000 series; that of course is just my assumption and I'm sure your marketing dept. is more informed about market trends in this field than I am... but just imagine the dominance you'd have in the hobbyist market if you sell this device in their (our) price range.

author: hugos31
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2012, 03:18:53 pm
content: http://www.rigol.com/prodserv/DS2000/document/

author: ljfont
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: March 23, 2012, 10:57:31 am
content: Prices from a store in china.DS2072 6800 Yuan = $1080 USDDS2102 9800 Yuan = $1555 USDDS2202 13800 Yuan = $2189 USD

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 23, 2012, 11:31:56 am
content: Quote from: ljfont on March 23, 2012, 10:57:31 amThat's rather disappointing actually, as I got the impression it would start at substantially sub $1KDave.

author: A Hellene
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 23, 2012, 11:45:59 am
content: Disappointing, indeed...Let's see if the main processor firmware is hackable, since I think that the DS2000 must be using the same probably ASIC/HW setup the DS4000 and DS6000 do (due to the strong similarities of their features)!-George

author: olsenn
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 23, 2012, 12:35:59 pm
content: Bummer; not worth it

author: T4P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 23, 2012, 12:51:48 pm
content: Jeez , just saw the prices for the DS1102E , DS1202E and DS1302E so i'm not surprised they are charging over a thousand dollars .The only good thing about the DS2000 is its 50,000 wfrms ( which they dub it Ultravision ... Agilent design too ? ) and 14Mpts .Attempting to compare this scope to the Agilent can be a big problem , since for me the DSOX2012 costs 2.2kSGD . ScrewedIf the DS2102 is cheaper then thousand and a half then it can be good but it yields no good since the DSOX2000 only costs 200$ more .BUT ! 200$ less for 14mpts ? Must consider agilent's speedy fixes and support .If i wanted another scope then a Owon SDS7102V i would have gone for the DSOX3024A as it's only 5,766SGDAt the same time the Rigol DS4042 on storeinfinity costs like 4,781 which corelates to 6.2kSGDbut yeah , 140MPoints for a whole lot more money .

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 23, 2012, 03:25:02 pm
content: Comparing the Rigol DS2000 to the Agilent DSOX2000 is kinda pointless as the DS2000 seems to be superior in about every possible aspect. If at all, you must compare it to a 2ch DSOX3000 or a Hameg HMO2xx2, though both have much less memory.What's not 100% clear to me at this point is if the memory in the memory is really full speed. It would be also interesting to know what the 56Mpts upgrade or the protocol options will cost.

author: T4P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 23, 2012, 04:31:33 pm
content: I know , it's closer to a X2000 but the memory depth on the X2000 series is pathetic .But the only one it can compare to is a X3000 , and by then , although it has deep memory , it can't compare in terms of wfrms update rate !The X3000 blows it out of the water , when talking wfrms update rate .I would really buy the X3024 instead .And the X3024 compares to the DS4042 which is 533$ cheaper .Rigol or Agilent , i will give it to Agilent .

author: RRobot
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 23, 2012, 08:48:40 pm
content: "And the X3024 compares to the DS4042 which is 533$ cheaper ."To be fair the Rigol 4 channel 'DS4024' is 2899 USD vs the Agilent DSOX3024A is 4060 USD, So about 1150 USD difference. In addition the Rigol has 70x the memory, a larger screen (that doesn't waste space always showing the menu), VGA and Ethernet (available as added cost on the Agilent) as well as some minor things. On the other hand The Agilent has 10x the WFPM and until August 31, 2012 the Function generator option is free. Personally all things being equal, even if they were priced the same I would say advantage Rigol.That said I'm looking for a new scope this summer and it will probably be a Agilent X3000 series, not the Rigol.I have a Rigol DG1022, a DM6061, a DS1204B and have a DSA815-TG on order so I'm not a Rigol hater, but if I'm blowing 4+ grand on something I want after sales support and so-far I am not satisfied with the support I've received. The products have generally performed well, but when I have any questions, it seems I'll get an automated response to my emails promising a followup that never seems to come.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 23, 2012, 09:44:03 pm
content: Don't forget that the Agilent's are:a) Bandwidth upgradableandb) Mixed Signal upgradable.Neither of which the 2000 series Rigol has.Dave.

author: T4P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 24, 2012, 06:57:47 am
content: Quote from: RRobot on March 23, 2012, 08:48:40 pmOn the website it claims that , but going to a trustable shop it is miles ahead in terms of price.

author: slateraptor
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 24, 2012, 07:56:09 am
content: Quote from: ljfont on March 23, 2012, 10:57:31 amI literally laughed at those price points.

author: Bored@Work
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 24, 2012, 11:40:34 am
content: Quote from: slateraptor on March 24, 2012, 07:56:09 amIf these are the prices for the local Chinese market you can expect even higher ones for the rest of the world.

author: mAJORD
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 24, 2012, 01:38:12 pm
content: Prices from one store.. I wouldn't automatically assume that's what it will be everywhere..Still, I wouldn't expect much less than a 1K starting price given Agilents equivilent start at ~$1200

author: T4P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 24, 2012, 04:07:12 pm
content: Quote from: mAJORD on March 24, 2012, 01:38:12 pmIndeed .Agilent's site may mark up a 5.9k for the DSOX3024A but E14 is selling it at 5,766 SGD .With rigol i have seen extremely wide gap of prices .Dissapointed .

author: ljfont
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: April 10, 2012, 02:08:55 am
content: another store. same prices. oh well..

author: Galenbo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 22, 2012, 11:44:49 am
content: I hope they won't be too cheap.I just bought a DS1204, and don't want to regret that too fast....

author: olsenn
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 22, 2012, 01:08:11 pm
content: QuoteThe DS1000 series scopes are quite nice (I own a DS1102E) and should last you quite some time. That being said, I think what Rigol started, but seems to be wanting to get away from, is providing a source for test equipment that isn't priced too far off from what it costs to build the thing. I recently purchased a DSA815-TG spectrum analyzer from Rigol, and once again, this is the only option right now for a semi-affordable spectrum analyzer that is actually decent; however, that was $1500, and Rigol seems to be trying to get into the $4000+ market as well.I hope Rigol continues to make new devices for the $400 - $800 market as well. Most hobbyists can't afford anything much more than that, or wouldn't be able to justify the cost.

author: hugos31
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: May 06, 2012, 01:32:25 am
content: when will be released DS2000 ?http://detail.tmall.com/item.htm?id=16203488762&9,800.00 CNY = 1,557.34 USD

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 06, 2012, 03:47:43 pm
content: Assuming that this doesn't include taxes, this would be around 1400€ including a 19% VAT (or a bit under 1200€ without VAT), which is still a bit cheaper than a Hameg HMO1022 (100MHz, two channels, 2GSa/s, 2MPts), which costs around 1550€ including VAT.The Rigol has much deeper memory, the Hameg has relatively cheap decoder protocol and MSO upgrade options. Also the Hameg's software seems to be pretty good which I would consider one of the major question marks for the Rigol. So with good software and support, this price would be acceptable.Then again, compared to a Rigol DS4012, which costs around 1900€ here including 19% VAT, the DS2102 seems too close to that regarding features and price. Maybe it would have been wiser to make the DS2000 line a bit cheaper and more distinct to the DS4000 line.Anyway, I wished that Rigol decided to release also 4ch scopes in the DS2000 series. At least an LA option would have been nice for serial decoding.

author: marmad
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 06, 2012, 05:19:55 pm
content: Quote from: 0xdeadbeef on May 06, 2012, 03:47:43 pmI don't know... double the real-time sample rate and wfms/s (2GSa/s-50k/wfms/s to 4GSa/s-110k/wfms/s) plus 10x more memory (14Mpts to 140Mpts) seems a reasonably large gap between DS2102 and DS4012 for about a 35% price difference.Now, if the published prices and specs are correct, and you compare the entry level model with the Agilent DSOX2002a you get:Rigol DS2072Agilent DSOX2002AVertical range:500uV/div to 10V/div1mV/div to 5V/divMax. wfms/s:50k50kMemory depth:14Mpts (56Mpts opt.)100kpts MAX.Standard outputs:USB, LAN, TriggerUSB, TriggerPrice:$1080 USD$1230 USDPlus what appears to be better usage of the same-size screen real estate as the Agilent - and most likely a better selection of triggers (which, let's admit it, are rather lousy on the Agilent 2000X series), and you have what seems to be a considerably better deal than the Agilent (not that I wouldn't mind even lower prices on the Rigols) Of course, you don't have all the various expensive Agilent upgrade possibilities, but honestly, how many personal users (not companies) actually buy that stuff? If I bought the Agilent 2000X series, the main thing I'd want to upgrade might be memory - which is impossible to do. It's just a pity Rigol didn't include a VGA output as well - that would have put it's price even further from the Agilent DSOX2002A + DSOXLAN module price.I'mverycurious to see how they perform.

author: M0pmz
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: June 06, 2012, 03:25:26 pm
content: Quote from: hugos31 on May 06, 2012, 01:32:25 am…these latest DS2000-series Rigol's seem to be out now, with newer pricing:e.g. 200MHz DS2202, the 100MHz DS2102 and the 70MHz DS2072 showing up here:http://www.rigol-uk.co.uk/rigol-ds2000-series-digital-oscilloscope/

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 06, 2012, 04:41:17 pm
content: Also the manual is available now on the Rigol site.Some € prices including VAT:http://www.batronix.com/versand/oszilloskope/Zwei-Kanal-Oszilloskope.htmlor a bit cheaper here:http://www.zeitech.de/RIGOL-DS2000-Oszilloskope1150€ (or 1090€) for the 100MHz model...Then again, some of the trigger options described in the options seem to be part of an "advanced trigger addon" but these triggers are not described as optional. So this adds another ~224€ (including VAT) on the price if you want to use all triggers as described in the manual.It's nice however to see that the serial (SPI, I2C, UART) trigger option costs only ~224€ including VAT which is about the same as the HOO11 option for Hameg HMOs. The same (?) packet costs 1500€ on the DS4000.It's not so nice to see that some of the shortcomings of the DS4000 series seems to be there as well (no way to count number of edges/pulses between the cursors, automatic and manual measurements limited to 4 digits, no way to search in the sample memory).So I'm still not convinced that the DS2000 is a better choice than an Hameg HMO despite of the seductive record length and much higher wfs/s.

author: T4P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 06, 2012, 05:23:34 pm
content: Just think of it as a X2000 replacement, just more memory length.Not bad for a X2000 lower cost replacement though, 1 thing i don't like is well, it's not a agilentand it's in the infantile stage now so nobody's got their hands on it yet as far as i know

author: krenzo
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 06, 2012, 05:51:57 pm
content: http://www.rigolna.com/products/digital-oscilloscopes/ds2000/"DS2002APrice: $0"Well that's one way to undercut the competition!

author: T4P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 06, 2012, 06:06:33 pm
content: Quote from: krenzo on June 06, 2012, 05:51:57 pm

author: free_electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 06, 2012, 06:29:56 pm
content: DS2072Price: $839DS2102Price: $1,143DS2202Price: $1,626

author: olsenn
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 06, 2012, 06:41:01 pm
content: QuoteAnyone else think this isn't such a great deal? I mean, the larger screen and depper memory are nice, but is it worth 3 times as much as the DS1102E of the same bandwidth?

author: T4P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 06, 2012, 06:44:53 pm
content: It's waveform update. That's the deal straightenerDefinitely not the scope for beginners that is.

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 06, 2012, 07:04:45 pm
content: Another drawback: no real SPI decoding, as you can't use ext. trigger as CS. Hameg 2ch scopes can do this...Besides I'm still confused that the manual doesn't clearly mark the optional triggers as "optional".Windows trigger, Nth edge trigger, HDTV trigger, delay trigger, timeout trigger, duration trigger and USB trigger are all only optional (AT-DS2).

author: krenzo
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 06, 2012, 09:19:40 pm
content: I think this is very attractive if you need 200 MHz. No other scope I've seen can do 200 MHz+2 GSa/s+Deep Memory at that price.

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 06, 2012, 09:48:17 pm
content: Is it completely sure that the full record length is available at full sample speed? I mean this was also proclaimed for the Owon SDS when it came out but later on it became clear the this was not the case.Besides: while the large buffer is surely cool, it would be much more useful if you could search it and measure at least manually with 6 digits or so. Truncating even the manual measurements to 4 digits (e.g. 100.1µs) kinda cripples the scope's performance. This is even worse in the DS4000 line of course where you have up to 4GS/s and 140Mpts and still you can neither search nor measure anything exactly due to the weird 4 digits truncation (ok, agreed, all the Tek DPOs limit to 3 digits, which is even worse).

author: T4P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 07, 2012, 10:25:16 am
content: deadbeef does have a point there, but it's still better then a Tek which hasn't been too well recently

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 07, 2012, 11:35:50 am
content: It's a shame with Tek. The DPO2000/MSO2000, which came down to affordable regions recently has just such a miserable screen resolution. And all the Tek DPOs, including the DPO3000 and DPO4000, truncate all measurements to 3 digits (e.g. 100µs) - even in cursor measurement. I just don't get why anybody would do this. Even the Agilent DSOX3000 - though measuring in the display buffer - has an "ok" resolution of 5 digits for automatic measurements (e.g. 100.01µs), but (as far as I recall) at least 6 digits for manual cursor measurements (e.g. 100.001µs).Now if Rigol had copied at least the Agilents resolutions, I could live with that. And heck, they should implement that edge/pulse counter auto measurement and fix the cursor bugs in zoom mode.Last but not least, I wished they released a 4ch DS2000 or offer the serial decoding options for the DS4000 a bit cheaper.

author: hugos31
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2012, 02:04:27 am
content: TEKTRONIX es 100% mejor que una imitacion china

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2012, 04:20:26 pm
content: Yeah, in a lot of regards this is probably true - and yet still they cripple all time measurements on the scope by truncating times to three digits. While Rigol's crippling to 4 digits is not much better, it's still better by the factor 10.

author: LEECH666
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2012, 04:47:29 pm
content: I am not too happy with my Hantek/Tekway/Voltcraft crap China DSO that just permanently locked up because of software issues. So I am considdering selling the Hantekwaycraft and getting one of those Rigol DS2xxx series scopes instead.Do you think the 4-Digit limit is a hardware limit or smth that could be fixed later in software? I also wonder how responsive the unit is, cuz the Hantek I currently own is not so great ... it doesn't seem to capture unperiodic signals all too well.Florian

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2012, 05:43:46 pm
content: Well, the DS4000 is said to be quite decent and responsive, so I guess the DS2000 will be as well. However, the DS4000 still has some major bugs e.g. regarding cursor handling in zoom mode which make exact manual measurement more or less impossible at this point. So my bet would be that the DS2000 inherits a few bugs and introduces a few new ones and it will take the next 3 to 6 months to fix the worst of them (taking into account that the DS4000 is available for several months now).Regarding truncation of measured periods: in manual mode, I'd say this is most probably just a GUI limitation and thus could be improved in SW. In auto mode, there could be a hw limitation as well - as the Rigol DS2000/4000 is very close to the Agilent DSOX2000/3000 chances are that they also copied the automatic measurement in the display buffer. Then again, the DSOX3000 measures at least with 5 digits, so there's a chance that the Rigol could at be as accurate as this - which would IMHO be satisfying for automatic measurements. On the other hand, as said before, the Tektronix DPOs truncate all measurements to three digits and obviously either nobody ever complained about this or they didn't care.If there will be actually any improvement in the future is another question. I already tried to contact the Rigol support twice in the last weeks regarding this and other issues and I got no reply whatsoever. Not even an automatic reply. Furthermore there are no publicly available firmware updates. This gives me a bad feeling regarding customer support.

author: LEECH666
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2012, 07:12:06 pm
content: Thank you for explaining and sharing your thoughts on that matter.Florian

author: Gunb
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 11, 2012, 07:58:19 pm
content: I've bought the RIGOL DS4000 a few month ago and noticed the cursor bug in zoom mode during discussion with 0xdeadbeef. After that I've sent a note to RIGOL support and got a reply the next day. They informed me that responsible engineers will be contacted in Bejing.On Friday I've asked again if there are any news. Today they replied that RIGOL has accepted the cursor issue as a bug and an update will be available during the next 2-3 month. I'll get it automatically.So, from my point of view, I had no problem to get in touch with RIGOL.I agree with 0xdeadbeef that truncation of the decimals could have been implemented better.@0xdeafbeef: my eyes are everywhere ;-)

author: tinhead
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 12, 2012, 12:08:46 am
content: Quote from: LEECH666 on June 11, 2012, 04:47:29 pmFlorianregardless of how good or bad is your DSO, when the manufacturer is asking endusers to install important patchto fix serious issues don't blame the manufacturer for locked device only because you was too lazy.And btw, you do have warranty, you don't need to sell it.Quote from: LEECH666 on June 11, 2012, 04:47:29 pma basic understanding of "how to use oscilloscope" will probably help you more than 50k USD DSO.

author: LEECH666
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 12, 2012, 04:08:39 am
content: Indeed, I got notified by Conrad that the Scope might lock up when you shut it down in the 80mS/DIV setting. So I avoided using that range. It still locked up. I guess I could send it in.I am just disappointed ... or well ... let's say maybe I expected too much from such a cheap unit [not talking about the lock up here]. It's my first DSO. I've mostly used TEK analog scopes before. It may also be possible that I am just a moron who doesn't know how to use such a scope in a way that it gives me the results I want. I remember trying to measure some voltage and the scope trace only jumped up briefly and didn't really display much, or it took a long time. That's why it feels sluggish to me. I can't remember the exact circumstances of the measurement, but that's how I felt about the scope.Sorry my English and my short term memory is too limited to describe this matter in a more precise way.Florian

author: tinhead
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 12, 2012, 11:35:35 am
content: Quote from: LEECH666 on June 12, 2012, 04:08:39 amthere is topic on a very good german forumhttp://www.mikrocontroller.net/topic/249628