Recommend a general purpose all round handheld DMM? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: Tracker
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2020, 07:32:01 pm
content: Hi Folks,I'm looking to get a fairly decent all round DMM for repairs and projects.For years I've been using a range of sub €50 meters, from Uni-T to Vichy but now I want something more reliable, accurate and feature packed.I have accurate bench equipment such as 34401A and others, but these are not always as handy as a nice hand held DMM.Budget is about €250 which probably rules out top end Fluke's etc, but I'm open to any brand so long as it's quality.Suggestions?Thanks

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2020, 07:39:10 pm
content: Daves BM235 that you can get from moderator Simons shop in the UK.https://simonselectronics.co.uk/product-category/eevblog/

author: Tracker
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2020, 07:51:15 pm
content: Thanks, I'll check out BM235.I was hoping for something a but more feature rich, dual display etc.

author: Muttley Snickers
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 25, 2020, 08:00:05 pm
content: Quote from: Tracker on January 25, 2020, 07:32:01 pmThe Keysight range of meters are loaded with features and certainly worthy of consideration.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2020, 08:01:45 pm
content: I agree about the Keysight meters. At least you can expect A-brand service without the Fluke pricing. When looking for a new handheld DMM I ended up with one from Keysight.

author: jack-daniels
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2020, 08:05:17 pm
content: Brymen BM869s?

author: Tracker
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2020, 08:35:36 pm
content: Interesting,The Keysight U1250 Series have great specs with 4.5 digit and 50,000 count but priced at about €500Whereas the Beymen 869s seems to have similar spec but at only €207, hard not to ignore that price difference which is on budget !General feeling about the Brymen? I see Joe Smith seems to use one as his daily driver, it can't be too bad?

author: RoGeorge
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2020, 08:51:51 pm
content: Quote from: Tracker on January 25, 2020, 07:32:01 pmThat will make absolutely no difference for the given purpose. You might be a victim of some marketing hype.

author: Tracker
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2020, 09:07:34 pm
content: Quote from: RoGeorge on January 25, 2020, 08:51:51 pmThanks Joe,I don't doubt you for one second, but I see Brymen claim dual display... perhaps it's because it's not full dual display but pseud-dual which only shows frequency and some other limited range of parameters?

author: Tracker
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2020, 09:10:06 pm
content: That will make absolutely no difference for the given purpose. You might be a victim of some marketing hype.Perhaps there is something but my UT61e has terrible terminals which starting to weaken loose grip, so I'm not in love with it anymore.

author: joeqsmith
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2020, 09:26:14 pm
content: Quote from: Tracker on January 25, 2020, 09:07:34 pmYes, I guess we could call it a quasi multi-display. For example, you can display frequency and voltage. I like that it can display two temperatures. If you watch the video, you can get a better idea of what some of these real multi-display units can do and how they can save you time. It really depends on what you are looking for. Running a lot of meters side by side can be a pain which is why I left out the Gossen.I know people on this site are really down on CEM but I have one that I've been using I think for 8 years now and I do like that tri-display.

author: RoGeorge
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2020, 09:27:04 pm
content: Quote from: Tracker on January 25, 2020, 09:07:34 pmWell, Truck,If we are going to go that nickname petting way, please let me say it once again:You might be a victim of some marketing hype, or maybe you might just need another pair of better probes.

author: Tracker
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2020, 10:06:14 pm
content: Woops, my quote error obviously but you guys figured it out.Cheers!

author: RoGeorge
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2020, 10:41:51 pm
content: Whoops here, too, so I understand the Joe answer was about answering to "joeqsmith".My bad, sorry, if so then no offense taken, I apologize.

author: Tracker
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2020, 10:47:59 pm
content: It's all good.Meanwhile I'm looking at the Brymen... might be the one.

author: DaJMasta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2020, 10:52:46 pm
content: I would argue that the 869s or 867s are better meters overall, but they come at a price - size. In the form factor, it's tough to beat the BM235 in my opinion.There's the 121GW that is feature packed for the size and in that general price bracket as well.And I don't know what the argument for the 869s not having dual display is? I have an 867s and it displays two distinct things just fine in quite a few modes.... it may not be fully configurable to the degree some want, but I use the DC/AC display mode frequently and it definitely displays both, albeit with a slower update rate.

author: joeqsmith
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2020, 01:06:07 am
content: Quote from: DaJMasta on January 25, 2020, 10:52:46 pmNo argument. Crest and Rec requires the user to cycle through the values rather than using the second display area. It's always best just to read the manual, before you send your money.A few cases where I would recommend the 121 are 1) you want to support Dave, 2) you like the EEVBLog logo, 3) you like playing with your meter and testing firmware, 4) you like the color blue

author: Gandalf_Sr
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2020, 01:43:17 am
content: There's a Keysight U1272A available 'used' from the Keysight store on eBayhttps://www.ebay.com/itm/Keysight-Used-U1272A-DMM-handheld-30-000-counts-true-RMS-Agilent-/193314004378?hash=item2d02699d9aAsiking price is $217.25 and I bet they'd accept an offer of $200. It's available from Amazon for $465.

author: PTR_1275
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2020, 08:36:18 am
content: I have a few keysight u1252b and they’re my go to meter. I keep one in my toolbag that goes everywhere with me.At the workbench I have a u1282 and several flukes, but the 1252 is the go to meter.Don’t go for one with OLED. Some people have good life out of them, others don’t.

author: Tracker
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2020, 09:49:42 am
content: Quote from: joeqsmith on January 26, 2020, 01:06:07 amUnfortunately that meter was released way too prematurely IMO, definitely not for me.

author: Tracker
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2020, 10:06:32 am
content: Quote from: Gandalf_Sr on January 26, 2020, 01:43:17 amThanks, but unfortunately they wont ship to Europe.

author: chronos42
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2020, 10:06:48 am
content: Quote from: joeqsmith on January 26, 2020, 01:06:07 am5) you like the 15V diode test voltage.6)you like the low burden voltage (with the disadvantage of higher offset errors)7) you like the VA mode (which is limited to DC and implemented in a wrong way, no compare to a Gossen Energy)you like to deal with hardware flaws and lots of software flaws.(Number 8 is converted to afrom the forum software)

author: Muttley Snickers
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 26, 2020, 10:23:38 am
content: Quote from: Gandalf_Sr on January 26, 2020, 01:43:17 amThere was also a Keysight U1273A in the forums classified section just the other day but I think it has gone already, the OP should monitor this section regularly as something is bound to turn up sooner or later.Buy/ Sell/ Wanted.https://www.eevblog.com/forum/buysellwanted/

author: J-R
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2020, 10:26:24 am
content: It would probably be helpful if you provided a list of the top features/functions that you will be using on a daily basis. I can also tell you that it's not always in your best interest to simply take people's recommendations without doing research yourself and weighing the information you've gathered.Specific aspects of test equipment matter more to some people than others and there just simply isn't the perfect device that will make everyone happy.

author: Mortymore
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2020, 10:31:03 am
content: Quote from: Tracker on January 26, 2020, 10:06:32 amI second thatOr should I be glad to cast away the thought of "needing" another DMM.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2020, 10:38:43 am
content: Quote from: Tracker on January 25, 2020, 10:47:59 pmBrymens get a thumbs up from me.Quote from: Mortymore on January 26, 2020, 10:31:03 amMe? I think you should be getting aFluke 101to go along with your new Brymen.

author: Tracker
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2020, 10:42:13 am
content: Quote from: Mortymore on January 26, 2020, 10:31:03 amI'm kinda in the same boat, my UT61E is a good all round meter (for the price) on my bench. But the split terminals are letting it down and making me look elsewhere.If I could replace the split posts somehow I would.

author: Gandalf_Sr
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2020, 12:00:29 pm
content: You could buy an Aneng AN8008 while you think about things, after all the world could end tomorrow - especially with our current 'leadership'.Perhaps you'd be better off buying a Geiger counter?I Googled "Keysight uk used" and landed on a web page that asks what country I'm in, that list includes Ireland if you click on 'more countries'. There aren't any U12XX meters there right now but you can watch.

author: Tracker
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2020, 12:15:24 pm
content: Quote from: Gandalf_Sr on January 26, 2020, 12:00:29 pmHa ha, already have an AN8008, someone gave it to me foc.Regarding your prediction... where I'm located I feel sandwiched in between two lunatics

author: Jan Audio
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2020, 02:59:15 pm
content: I would like to have the super-fast Hioki meter :https://www.hioki.com/en/products/list/?category=20The only downside why i dont want it because you have to take out and insert the cables every time, so its only fast when measuring a whole lot, not fast for measuring 1 resistor.Safety Terminal Shutters

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2020, 04:37:35 pm
content: Quote from: Jan Audio on January 26, 2020, 02:59:15 pmMe, too, but they're even more expensive then Flukes.Quote from: Jan Audio on January 26, 2020, 02:59:15 pmIt's just the same as most other meters. You switch cables for measuring amps.

author: rstofer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2020, 05:59:50 pm
content: J-R has the right idea. In a spreadsheet, list the various attributes and assign a value for how much it is worth in relation to other features. Then, for each DMM, figure its total score against your desired attributes and, voila', you have a winner. Maybe...Include a score for price.I figure my Fluke 189 covers the high end and my Aneng 8008 covers the low end. The two EEVblog meters are in the middle - both good meters. After all the fiddling around, I reach for the 8008 when I want to actually use a meter.

author: Gandalf_Sr
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2020, 06:22:37 pm
content: You guys have got me thinking, I think I'm going to sell my U1242B either here or on eBay. I have a U1252B and a U1242C and this kind of sits in the middle plus I'm downsizing as I approach full retirement. Plus I have another 3 or 4 multimeters including an AN8008.

author: J-R
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2020, 04:59:53 am
content: OP, the Fluke 87-V could be what you're looking for. It's just very nice to use. No connectivity options, though. I picked up a new/return with cal+data for under $300. Mine is unbelievably accurate. 400 hour battery life.The BM235 is in my toolbox. Paid around $100 a couple years ago. Among the regular features, the flashing continuity indicator and EF detection have been great for typical residential duties. 200+ hours battery life.I found the Brymen BM869s a little difficult to like. It was just under $300 for essentially a full deluxe bundle + USB interface and some misc. accessories/fuses/etc. After giving the selector switch a once-over and calibrating it, I suppose it may stick around. The software hasn't been updated since 2012. Out of the box accuracy was atrocious and just barely within spec. Battery life is a low 100 hours.I've always liked the 121GW. Great form factor, features and price (about $200). I did make some minor tweaks to the selector switch so it's light and smooth as silk. I also went through some of the calibration processes for the fun of it and being able to save/restore the calibration data is one of the many aspects I like about it. My biggest complaint is that it is generally slow. 500+ hour battery life.Honorable mention to the Fluke 233 which I snagged new/return with cal+data for a little over $100. That removable display is some oddball fun....

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2020, 08:32:43 am
content: Quote from: J-R on January 27, 2020, 04:59:53 amMaybe you could tell us all where to buy them at that price. I don't see any around here.

author: J-R
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2020, 08:48:57 am
content: Quote from: Fungus on January 27, 2020, 08:32:43 amWell, I assume you noticed my location...there is a used/return on Amazon right now for $242.81:https://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B01CFXJDWK/

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2020, 09:28:16 am
content: Quote from: J-R on January 27, 2020, 08:48:57 amI clicked that and I get this:(plus I probably get to pay taxes and handling fees on that)

author: J-R
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2020, 09:44:49 am
content: Are you in the US?

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2020, 09:46:08 am
content: Quote from: J-R on January 27, 2020, 09:44:49 amNo.

author: J-R
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2020, 09:59:09 am
content: Quote from: Fungus on January 27, 2020, 09:46:08 am

author: Gandalf_Sr
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2020, 10:08:21 am
content: How about anAneng 888S? It's got dual display and you can listen to music while making measurements.There's a thread on ithere.It's on sale at Banggood for $65 US for the Chinese New Year.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2020, 10:26:19 am
content: Quote from: J-R on January 27, 2020, 09:59:09 amNeither is the person you're advising.(and for somebody who posted "Well, I assume you noticed my location..." then it seemed a bit much)

author: Mortymore
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2020, 11:42:12 am
content: Quote from: Gandalf_Sr on January 27, 2020, 10:08:21 amThis guys are awesome!I'll wait though, for one were I can take a coffee and beer (the model with dual display, you see). Always useful in the shack

author: Jan Audio
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2020, 03:15:04 pm
content: Why dont they have that many count in the handheld version from aneng ?Hope this year they make a 100000 count at least.Dont need a radio.

author: Tracker
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2020, 06:12:50 pm
content: Quote from: Mortymore on January 27, 2020, 11:42:12 amI'd love to see Joe zap-test that meter, we need to crowd fund one for him!

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2020, 06:46:24 pm
content: Has anybody got pictures of the insides?

author: Veteran68
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2020, 07:04:17 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on January 27, 2020, 08:32:43 amA couple of years ago I lucked across a retailer unloading new old stock on eBay. Bought a brand-new factory-sealed 87-V manufactured 3-4 years prior that I was able to register with Fluke for the lifetime warranty, for the grand total of $250 shipped. One of my proudest electronics finds so far. So the deals are out there to be found, it's just a matter of fortuitous timing.

author: Veteran68
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2020, 07:09:25 pm
content: Quote from: Gandalf_Sr on January 27, 2020, 10:08:21 amIf memory serves, that's basically the guts of the Aneng 870 with OLED, BT and clock bits added on. The 870 is itself a pretty decent meter for its $30 price range. Not on the level of a Bryman, but pretty good specs. I have one, although it's not seen much use.

author: Tracker
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2020, 08:28:03 pm
content: Just watched Joe's UT181A review videos, wow nice meter with great data logging features...I need to put on my list of considerations!I can get one for just 50 Euro more than the Brymen 869s and as Joe mentions it comes with PC -USB kit included, so effectively the same price.If only it didn't fail the ESD zapper test at ~15kvI respect Joe's wishes to keep the mod between himself and Uni-T.But I'm guessing a good hint is in the first part of Joe's video where he mentions there was good PCB clearance on around input terminals but no cuts implemented by Uni-t.Besides, Ireland isn't known for it's dry climate so doubt it will be much of an issue.

author: joeqsmith
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 28, 2020, 01:41:22 pm
content: Quote from: Tracker on January 27, 2020, 06:12:50 pmThere's not much of a reason to run one. I've looked at a few ANENG meters and they perform poorly. Then again, if the 121GW is the golden baseline that had a problem with the grill starter and was total damaged at 2KV, the AN8008 made it to 2.5KV, the AN8002 to 3KV and the AN860B to 4KV. Not only that, alcohol does not appear to effect the lettering on the ANENGs where it will strip the lettering off the 121GW.Yes, the layout of the 181A needs some help. I won't be showing details on DMM mods or how to make nitroglycerin on YouTube anytime soon. The world is filled with people who would attempt to sell kits and mod them themselves. If someone were injured, you know that they will not take responsibility.You may remember a kid that died a few years back after watching a video on MOTs and playing with one at home. Who do you think the family blames for their death, the kid who had no understanding of the risks, the family who wasn't involved with helping the kid learn, or the YT channel that shows it? Three simple mistakes cost him his life.

author: Jan Audio
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 28, 2020, 01:51:46 pm
content: What is MOTs then ?

author: Tracker
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 28, 2020, 02:05:46 pm
content: Quote from: joeqsmith on January 28, 2020, 01:41:22 pmPoint well made and understood Joe. I've emailed UNI-T to ask if there is any improvement on the UT181A ESD protection since your video, if they respond I'll let you know here.After all, their product safety is their responsibility, not yours.

author: Gandalf_Sr
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 28, 2020, 03:01:54 pm
content: Quote from: joeqsmith on January 28, 2020, 01:41:22 pmPretty bad that alcohol will strip the lettering off a meter designed by an Australian bloke; good job I don't own a 121GW, all the numbers would be gone by now with all the drink I spill over my gear

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 28, 2020, 05:40:07 pm
content: Quote from: Jan Audio on January 28, 2020, 01:51:46 pmMicrowave Oven Transformer - a source of high voltage with plenty of current to kill you.Youtube is full of videos of idiots "playing" with them.

author: Jan Audio
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 29, 2020, 04:55:24 pm
content: LOL, youtube is full of idiots who make a metal-melter LOL crazy.

author: Tabian
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: March 18, 2021, 02:07:08 am
content: Hey Tracker did you get any update from UniT on the 181A to see if they have done any fixes on the static issue that Joe found? I cant find anything to show they meet the specs for this?