Hilarious labelling FAIL - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Lomax
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2025, 03:39:11 pm
content: While hunting for an LCR meter I found this Chinese one, which has a surprising label for the input BNCs... I can only imagine that the translation software they used couldn't provide a translation for the word they wanted to use, and simply said it was "unknown" - which they then of course printed on the case.

author: eutectique
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2025, 03:46:15 pm
content: My guess is that you connect a component withunknownvalues, and make themknown. Like an unknown in an equation.

author: Lomax
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2025, 03:53:08 pm
content: Perhaps.

author: krish2487
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2025, 04:00:59 pm
content: I would venture a guess that their intention is .....unknownBa dum..... tuss!!!!! I ll see myself out!!

author: themadhippy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2025, 04:05:55 pm
content: It aint just the chinese who have translation troubleshttp://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/7702913.stm

author: Lomax
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2025, 04:08:55 pm
content: Quote from: eutectique on April 14, 2025, 03:46:15 pmYeah, I think you're right; this one from OWON has the same labelling. Ah well. I thought it looked funny. Nothing to see here, move along!

author: Lomax
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2025, 04:10:53 pm
content: Quote from: themadhippy on April 14, 2025, 04:05:55 pmThat was the story that popped into my head when I saw the label. Genuinely funny, that one.Edit:2008!?Blimey. Time flies.

author: TimFox
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2025, 04:11:51 pm
content: Quote from: Lomax on April 14, 2025, 03:39:11 pmThe instructions for the classic General Radio 916-AL impedance bridge designate the three connections as “Generator”, “Detector”, and “Unknown”.This unit was manufactured In Massachusetts, and other similar bridges had the same labels.

author: Lomax
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2025, 04:54:22 pm
content: Quote from: TimFox on April 14, 2025, 04:11:51 pmI... feel a bit silly now.

author: squadchannel
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2025, 05:08:27 pm
content: "UNKNOWN", hp also uses it. I think it is normal.

author: Lomax
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2025, 05:22:00 pm
content: Ok,verysilly.

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2025, 11:51:07 pm
content: Quote from: Lomax on April 14, 2025, 05:22:00 pmeh I still think its a dumb carryover. If you are going to label the 4 terminals, could put "Component" or "DUT" or something similar so its clear that is where you hook part to be tested up. Most just don't bother to label it.

author: TimFox
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 01:02:33 am
content: Quote from: thm_w on April 14, 2025, 11:51:07 pmNo, "unknown" makes perfect sense in this context, just like "x" is the unknown in algebra.

author: Analog Kid
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 01:26:37 am
content: Well, why not just a row of question marks?That'd make it pretty multilingual as well.

author: eutectique
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 12:51:51 pm
content: It could have been SOMETHING or WHATEVER.

author: TimFox
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 02:32:24 pm
content: "Unknown" is a term used by mature people.The mantra for curmudgeons like me is "Oh, that's what they're calling it now...".

author: fzabkar
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 05:55:32 pm
content: I have a bench drill with a rating plate that says "MACHWERY". The "IN" in "MACHINERY" was misread, perhaps due to bad handwriting.

author: TimFox
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 05:59:08 pm
content: This is why modern English spelling tends to avoid ligatures.

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 09:37:11 pm
content: Quote from: TimFox on April 15, 2025, 01:02:33 amNot really, it may very well be a known component that you are testing to verify its still within tolerance.Its just a historical carryover from the bridge setup as mentioned above. Which, if you are older makes sense (eg the people at HP that designed it). When there are just 2 or 4 terminals on the front of a device its kind of obvious what they are intended for as a group.Some bench DMMs say "Input" to differentiate from Sense, most handheld DMMs say nothing. Scopes usually say nothing. Basic bench PSUs usually say nothing (a few HPs say "output").

author: shakalnokturn
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 09:41:30 pm
content: Yet another random topic.Make sure to use the patrol terminal when measuring a tri-stated "unknown" else measurements may be up in the air.

author: TimFox
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 09:44:09 pm
content: Quote from: thm_w on April 15, 2025, 09:37:11 pmIf the component is being tested to compare with its nominal value and tolerance, its value is unknown until you complete the test.For the next few minutes thereafter, its value is known.When a DMM has separate input and sense terminals, that is to measure resistance with four wires to avoid errors due to the wires. Usually, the "input" terminal is shared with the voltage mode.

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 10:01:25 pm
content: Point was, every scope could say "Input" above the channels, every PSU could say "Output" above the channels, every handheld DMM could say "Input" above the jacks, every AWG could say Input/Output above the channels, but most don't bother. Its unnecessary text.Its a style thing that we would just have to disagree on.

author: TimFox
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 10:05:32 pm
content: If the text is unnecessary to you, then just ignore it.The original poster thought the text was incorrect.My passive impedance bridges have three connections: generator, detector, and unknown.Modern LCR meters have four terminals, which connect to the unknown.They may also have a guard terminal and possibly more terminals for a bias supply.I see no need to change from well-defined and well-understood usage to leave terminals unlabeled.

author: Smokey
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 10:50:30 pm
content: You could repurpose UUT as "Unknown-Under-Test"

author: TimFox
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 16, 2025, 02:42:45 am
content: Quote from: Smokey on April 15, 2025, 10:50:30 pmYeah, that would simplify things.

author: EPAIII
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 16, 2025, 04:02:25 am
content: Well, before you feel too bad, there have been examples of real bad translations for some top notch equipment. I worked in TV engineering and some years ago the Japanese were just starting to get seriously into the professional, broadcast level equipment. My station purchased some of this Japanese equipment. It was top notch, right up there with the big US companies and, to be truthful, probably better.I didn't say what item of equipment this was so you can see if you can guess from the title on the cover of the maintenance manual. It read,"Color Handy Lookie System".Go ahead, take your best guess as to what item of equipment that referred to. I will supply the answer in a second post.Now I don't know just how they translated the manual from Japanese to English, but every page, every paragraph, every sentence was translated the same way and many of that text was quite difficult to understand. It was not unusual for the tech. who was trying to make some adjustments to the device to gather two or more others and discuss one line of a procedure for 10, 20, even 30 minutes. In some cases phone calls to the support people at the company were necessary to obtain an understanding of what was to be done. Before long, that manual had scribbled notations on just about every page.So, these things do happen. And sometimes it is not just one or two words or sentences.Have you figured out what this item of equipment was? Just a good guess? Partial guess? Well, when think you have or when you just give up, read my next post.

author: EPAIII
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 16, 2025, 04:05:50 am
content: This was around the time when the TV news departments were changing from 16mm film to video cameras to cover news events. The answer to my mystery manual title is:"Color Handy Lookie System" meantHand held, color (video) camera.

author: RAPo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 16, 2025, 06:24:21 am
content: Is there any more background to this HP nomenclature?Is it unknown because the device can be set to 2/3/4/5 terminal mode?Or is it unknown because there can be a DC-bias on the high terminals?Quote from: squadchannel on April 14, 2025, 05:08:27 pm

author: TimFox
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 16, 2025, 02:38:47 pm
content: Quote from: RAPo on April 16, 2025, 06:24:21 amIt is "unknown" because it is an external component being measured and you don't know its value yet.This normal term started with bridges: a Wheatstone bridge, q.v., for resistors has four branches (forming a quadrilateral), one of which is "unknown".You excite the bridge across one diagonal and adjust the three branches for zero voltage (null) across the other diagonal.

author: RAPo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 16, 2025, 03:24:10 pm
content: Thanks for the clarification, really appreciated.But time goes on, and not all LCR-meters are of the bridge type (see this greatfrom Rudi´s Electronics lab).Quote from: TimFox on April 16, 2025, 02:38:47 pm

author: TimFox
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 16, 2025, 04:06:06 pm
content: Yes, most true LCR meters (for use below RF frequencies) now apply an AC voltage to the unknown component and measure the AC current with a phase-sensitive sensor, computing the complex impedance.The capacitance measurements in DMMs are essentially relaxation oscillators that time the charging of the unknown capacitor, and cannot measure ESR or loss.Others may be "auto-balancing" bridges, which are automated versions of the older bridge circuits.At higher frequencies, reflection bridges (actually related to Wheatstone bridge basic circuits) are used with transmission lines.In my education, our laboratory exercises used traditional systems (bridges, galvanometers, potentiometers, analytic balances, etc.) to learn how measurements actually work.We then went on to use magic boxes with unknown insides and automatic digital readouts, to do our measurements faster.