Microscope I need! - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 20, 2015, 03:28:05 pm
content: WELCOME!!For any 01005 SMT soldering stuff, I or in that case anyone need an EYE which can ZOOM good X.....??........ times than the one bestowed upon to do a decent job...........Yea, guys, it's the time to consider a Microscope...My knowledge on the subject is very poor! Hence, I seek your aid in selecting one for me!Is STEREO >> VIDEO, binocular over USB. What should be Latency factor then? Zoom factor?what is barlow lens? Any co-relation between barlow lenses and range? What is IMO zoom?Which product has what features...hmmm...... jarring words!!Only Tech guys can rescue us. So, pl help!Price not a constraint!______________________________________________________________________________________________________________My other blog/s:Multimeter review:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/%27professional-multimeter-on-table-top%27/msg735449/#msg735449Buying FLUKE meters:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/buysellwanted/where-to-buy-genuine-fluke-multimeter/

author: PaulAm
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 20, 2015, 04:40:45 pm
content: You probably can't do better than a Mantis. Search the forum; you'll find lots of posts.

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 20, 2015, 07:41:18 pm
content: Which is a better angle to work??pl Rate 1,2,3

author: McBryce
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 20, 2015, 08:27:54 pm
content: This is what I currently use and can fully recommend:http://www.bresser.de/en/Microscopes-Magnifiers/Bresser-Biorit-ICD-CS-Stereo-Microscope.htmlMcBryce.

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 20, 2015, 08:42:45 pm
content: @ McBryceThanks for your share!! I honestly appreciate it!Dear McBryce, can working distance be upgradable??

author: McBryce
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2015, 09:42:25 am
content: I don't think so. For normal desktop use the length is fine for me.McBryce.

author: rolycat
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2015, 09:57:31 am
content: If price is not an issue then for most people a Mantis will be superior to any conventional binocular microscope such as the Bresser. Take a look at Dave's review:http://www.eevblog.com/2012/11/25/eevblog-390-mantis-elite-microscope-review/

author: McBryce
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2015, 10:53:21 am
content: I took a look at the Mantis when I was looking for a new Microscope. Other than the price shock, I also found that it would take up a huge amount of desk space. If you've loads of room this isn't a problem, but for me it was a deal-killer.McBryce.

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2015, 11:31:24 am
content: Tagarno magnus ZIP maybe. Less space with a wall mount LCD TV but still price shock

author: McBryce
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2015, 12:00:10 pm
content: That's only good for inspection, you can't solder under something like that.McBryce.

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2015, 12:01:38 pm
content: You most definitely can

author: McBryce
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2015, 12:03:58 pm
content: Really? I've tried soldering under video microscopes in the past. The tiniest of lag and the lack of spacial 3D feeling made it a nightmare.McBryce.

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2015, 12:06:09 pm
content: Totally agree, soldering under a normal USB webcam is impossible.But the Tagarno FHD ZIP is 60fps HDMI output. It's as smooth as a baby's bottom.The tagarno is shown a bit in this video starting ~ 20:40

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 22, 2015, 03:02:27 pm
content: Possible to disguise a DSLR camera with optical zoom 30X or higher to a professional (atleast for 0201 SMT soldering stuff ) microscope ??Pl park your comment/s here..

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 22, 2015, 03:31:22 pm
content: S to M

author: zapta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 22, 2015, 03:45:28 pm
content: Quote from: rotnoraj_kanungoe on August 20, 2015, 03:28:05 pmStrong yes. Stereo optical will give you the best sense what's going on.Quote from: rotnoraj_kanungoe on August 20, 2015, 03:28:05 pmFor SMT work you don't need high magnification. Make sure you can get down to x5 magnification or so.Quote from: rotnoraj_kanungoe on August 20, 2015, 03:28:05 pmIf it's not a constraint that Mantis is probably the best choice. Never use it but people swear by it, especially for working long hours with the microscope. If not, almost any Chinese stereo zoom microscope from ebay will go a long way. Make sure you can get down to x5 magnification, it has good light (e.g. LED ring), and a base that fits your need (e.g. a boom base). If you also need to photograph get one with an extra port for camera. I am using a ~$300 Amscope and have no problem with the working distance.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 22, 2015, 04:30:16 pm
content: No arguments with the recommendations about the best, but for the readers of this thread who do have cost limits, any microscope wins over none. I am quite happy with a thrift store score, a no name stereo scope that was obviously aimed at the bio sciences. Wouldn't want to spend eight hours a day on it, but for more casual use it is far superior to options like loupes and visor style magnifiers.

author: rolycat
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 22, 2015, 06:41:02 pm
content: Quote from: rotnoraj_kanungoe on August 22, 2015, 03:31:22 pmYou can use a smartphone as a hammer as well:It's not agoodhammer, though.

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 22, 2015, 07:19:21 pm
content: @ zaptaThank you so much for your suggestions on the topic!!I, actually, didn't remember where I read it. But, came across the fact that a 0.5X barlow lenses can bring a drastic change in working distance....is this fact correct?

author: zapta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 22, 2015, 07:40:56 pm
content: Quote from: rotnoraj_kanungoe on August 22, 2015, 07:19:21 pmYes it will increase the working distance,I thick by the same factor (e.g x2) but will also elevate the eye pieces. I don't use one and the working distance is just fine for me.

author: KJDS
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 22, 2015, 07:45:11 pm
content: Most cheap scopes have a working distance of about 85mm. Some find this enough, some don't. A 0.5X barlow will increase this to 170mm. Depending on the arrangement of the workspace, this may elevate the eyepieces to an uncomfortable height.If you're soldering small stuff then you want your wrists flat on the bench for stability, so if your upper arms are short then it's worth trying before buying. You may need to invest in a more expensive unit if you have big hands and short arms.

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 22, 2015, 08:16:44 pm
content: Another vote for stereo optical ones. They can sometimes be found on ebay when a school or college is having a clear-out. They use, or used them as biological dissecting microscopes - another application that needs very good 3d depth perception. They usually come in 5x - 20x magnifications. Microscopes with x1 objective and x5 or x10 eyepieces will give you the best unobstructed working distance and field of view. The trouble is that they turn up on ebay in batches, with long gaps between.I prefer the ones with straight eyepieces (like binoculars - BM style in attached PDF) rather than the ones with the eyepieces tilted at 45'. Tilting the whole head towards your eyes gives you a much better view than the objective looking straight down on the board you can see the sides of the components, see between IC legs etc.

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 22, 2015, 08:24:53 pm
content: I could well see my viewers are aiding me in the process of selecting one. Thank you!presumably Mantis is echoing! rt ?Any suggestion on model# as you can trace my requisites from forum. Yeah, soldering and inspecting 02005 SMT stuff...Hope some model# will come to light in no time.........

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 22, 2015, 08:25:54 pm
content: Here's the datasheet for the same microscope, badged by Prior, It gives working distance and field of view information.Note that where it gives different working distances for different objectives, the eyepieces stay at the same height, the objectives are just longer. As I say, X1 objective is best and use different eyepiece magnifications as needed.

author: Rupunzell
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 22, 2015, 11:42:19 pm
content: There are many technical, optical and other reasons why surgeons use direct viewing stereo microscopes for micro-surgery.Much of this has to do with depth perception. It is nearly impossible to see and gauge depth on a flat 2D image. Don't believe this, try driving a motor vehicle with one eye closed and note the limited depth-distance perception while driving a motor vehicle.The other skill that must be learned for using a stereo microscope properly is adjustment and alignment of the eye pieces to the eyes of the specific user. This is critical to reduction of eye fatigue, eye strain and reception of a high definition optical image. Stereo eye pieces must have separation distance adjustment and at least one eye piece with adjustable length to compensate for the reality that human eyes are never perfectly identical for visual balance. Other factors are optical alignment of the microscope which can have a extreme effect of user eye fatigue and overall user experience.The other major factors in eye strain and fatigue when using a microscope is optical quality for resolution, color rendition, contrast and image stability. This is a direct matter of microscope quality. Some of the very best stereo microscopes made were from Wild Heerbrugg (Swiss) and Zeiss (West Germany). These offer some of the very best stereo microscope optics available. When they are in good optical condition, proper optical alignment, with the eye pieces set up properly for a specific user's eye's, there is little to absolutely no eye fatigue even after hours of use. When all is proper stereo microscopes of this caliber are an absolute pleasure to use and own.Other factors are lighting. Quality of light, color temperature of the light source and method of lighting will can have as much of an effect on the microscope image as the microscope itself.As for magnification, 3X to 10X is plenty for SMD work, resolution, contrast, color rendition and all those other factors are often far more important than basic magnification.Bernice

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 23, 2015, 12:41:18 am
content: Quote from: rotnoraj_kanungoe on August 22, 2015, 03:02:27 pmIm trying that atm. using a 135mm zoom lens 3 macro rings and a 2x teleconverter.Will let you know how it goes once my camera battery is chargedFrom the few quick tests i did before the battery died it looks like it might work well with a really nice working distance.But you'd want a DSLR with hdmi output as opposed to one of the older ones that only has composite video. (Although you might be able to do some hacking to get HD video out over USB in webcam mode)The hard part might be fixed mounting the DSLR to the top of your work bench so it doesnt shake around from vibrations.

author: MT
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 23, 2015, 01:02:02 am
content: How to: make a microscope from a webcamhttp://www.bbc.co.uk/science/0/22600308Instructables web cam to microscopehttp://www.instructables.com/id/Simple-Super-MacroMicroscope-Webcam-Conversion/

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 23, 2015, 04:51:48 am
content: @ PsiI wish you a VERY good LUCK!! May your attempt/s come true!!"From the few quick tests i did before thebatterydied it looks like it might work well with a really nice working distance."Is the concept of rectifier to a desired specification of any help?"The hard part might be fixed mounting the DSLR to the top of your work bench so it doesnt shake around from vibrations."As a Electro-Mechanical designeer, I would certainly recommend you to build a strong, holding cabinet to fit your camera [[[ may can apply mold & cavity concept ]]]...In that case, you can even think of placing the knob of your camera's steeper motor to a desired place and angle sited your need/s....If possible design an absolutely new Electro-Mechanical system by tearing down your camera..

author: Campus
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 23, 2015, 05:34:12 pm
content: I also recommend going for binocular microscope. I bought thishttp://www.aliexpress.com/item/6-7X-45X-BINOCULAR-STEREO-ZOOM-MICROSCOPE-DOUBLE-BOOM-STAND/594767180.html] http://www.aliexpress.com/item/6-7X-45X-BINOCULAR-STEREO-ZOOM-MICROSCOPE-DOUBLE-BOOM-STAND/594767180.html and I love it. Using a barlow lens of 0.5x gives a nice magnification with a large working area (~18cm).

author: JuKu
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 08, 2015, 02:22:44 pm
content: I have used Mantis and "regular" stereo microscopes. In my lab I have a regular type now. It is just fine, but I don't do soldering work that much anymore. I used to work with a Mantis. I tried USB, but there is no way I could give up stereo vision once I got used to it.Mantis is superb in ergonomics, because you don't need to hold your head steady. You don't develop more neck ache than you do from computer work. With a regular microscope, you need to hold your eyes right at the eyepieces, which gives you a stiff neck if you do that many hours a day.And of course, the optical view quality of Mantis is great, too.

author: LabSpokane
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 08, 2015, 06:24:43 pm
content: Get an optical stereo microscope. I have no idea how I'd live without one now. And what Bernice said about optical quality is spot on. The big problem with buying used is ending up with a scope that is not aligned and or outright broken. I bought Meiji that was shipped improperly and it was totally useless. The Chinese Olympus clone that replaced it was so much better it was ridiculous.If you can buy used. Try to get a good enough price that sending it to someone like Absolute Clarity for overhaul works for you. Mine was damaged to the point that it wasn't worth the risk.

author: fivefish
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 08, 2015, 06:36:23 pm
content: Don't just look at magnification factor. Depth of field is another important factor. Some lenses at high magnification have very very shallow depth of field... just a few hair width in front or behind the focus point and it's very blurred..

author: KL27x
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 09, 2015, 09:53:56 pm
content: All lenses have a shorter focal depth as higher magnification. That's how it works.More for FOV than for height, I prefer to use a 0.5 Barlow lens. (Heck, I think the main reason I use my scope is for the light ring; if my magnifying lamp was as rock steady and had similar working distance, it would be a much smaller gap between the two.)For the height issue using a Barlow, I find it very useful to have a 45 degree eyepiece and a tilt-adjustable head. You can get a lot of leeway with your eye-height by adjusting this angle, when you might need to work on taller objects.The problem with angling the objective is the focal depth becomes more of an issue. So it only works well to a certain point.

author: John_ITIC
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2015, 06:58:48 am
content: Quote from: McBryce on August 20, 2015, 08:27:54 pmI have the exact same microscope. I'm using 20x eye pieces. I went through a large number of light bulbs originally but, lately the quality have improved. The bulbs were a bit hard to find so I had to buy from the microscope seller. Apparently, some kind of "projector-lamp". Overall, the microscope is okay but the lighting is not good. Details are a bit dark and the lamp has to be adjusted sometimes. I've had mine since 2005 and still going strong. I have not had need to upgrade.

author: McBryce
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2015, 12:57:58 pm
content: Quote from: John_ITIC on September 10, 2015, 06:58:48 amThe two bulbs originally supplied with my microscope both failed after about 10 to 15 minutes each. I contacted Bresser and they sent me two new bulbs for free which had a completely different filament and the first of those has continued working since then (almost a year now).McBryce.

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 03, 2016, 05:12:30 am
content: @Psi"Im trying that atm. using a 135mm zoom lens 3 macro rings and a 2x teleconverter.Will let you know how it goes once my camera battery is chargedFrom the few quick tests i did before the battery died it looks like it might work well with a really nice working distance.But you'd want a DSLR with hdmi output as opposed to one of the older ones that only has composite video. (Although you might be able to do some hacking to get HD video out over USB in webcam mode)The hard part might be fixed mounting the DSLR to the top of your work bench so it doesnt shake around from vibrations."We haven't found any test result/s from your end............

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 05, 2016, 05:41:38 am
content: It does work but a camera and display isn't very good for soldering. I would take a $400 china microscope over a $5000 targano for soldering things any day.Got this microscope+camera at work and for the price its pretty damn good.The camera is zoomed in a bit more than I would like though.Camera quality is what you would expect. But at least it's hdmi so no USB lag unless you use its USB interface. Which is useful for taking screenshots or movies.There is a leaver that switches one of the objectives between camera or eyepiecehttp://www.aliexpress.com/item/Continuous-zoom-binocular-visual-7-90X-Trinocular-stereo-microscope-14MP-HDMI-USB-Industrial-Camera-56-LED/32510334237.html?spm=2114.01010208.3.18.VdBIsk&ws_ab_test=searchweb201556_3,searchweb201644_3_505_506_503_504_502_10001_10002_10016_10017_10010_10005_10011_10006_10003_10004_10009_10008,searchweb201560_2,searchweb1451318400_-1,searchweb1451318411_6451&btsid=69ca1442-6753-488e-ac76-683279906edc

author: Fat
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 05, 2016, 04:30:36 pm
content: Quote from: Psi on February 05, 2016, 05:41:38 amIt looks a lot like my Omano 2300S. The color on some of the parts are a bit different. Way cheaper too. Nice score.Did it come on that stand or did you get a boom arm for it?

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 06, 2016, 03:46:03 pm
content: @ PsiWe all would love to see if you can kindly pin some photo/s on both your former and current experiment/s....