What does a kw/h cost in your area? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Beamin
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2017, 09:56:45 pm
content: In New England USA its $0.25 USD because of all the storms we have (fixing ice storms). Further down the coast it drops down to ) $0.08.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2017, 10:08:50 pm
content: Natural gas export is going to dramatically increase the price of electricity and of course also natural gas in the US. (Electricity prices "track natural gas prices" nationwide, according to the LA Times) Nobody knows how much but it could be a LOT because exporting natural gas was banned since the 1970s, so its a very big change.Something similar happened in Australia a few years ago but it was not because of a trade deal, it was because of new facilities that were built which made it possible.Australia, being sunnier and having less cold winters, was able to use solar power to fill in some of the loss, it seems.Its very hard to say how much prices will rise. Higher wholesale prices elsewhere are not the exact same as prices here because the cost of transport is substantial. But prices here may as much as double and then continue moving upward, depending on how much people can generate themselves with solar - as well as cut consumption.Its possible that some industries may not be able to continue to operate if energy becomes much more expensive.I think that's possible, but luckily energy costs are not the highest cost for most industries..Many energy costs have been generally higher elsewhere for some time, especially with gasoline, but in other countries, other costs like health care and education have been much lower.A substantial number of Europeans are perpetually in debt to their local energy utility. That may happen here, and it will occur at the same time other prices, like health insurance, prescription drugs and rents are also rising.This shift would be locked in by writing energy export into the TTIP trade deal (also known as Tafta)The price is three to five times higher in some other countries than it is here.No matter what the alleged trigger is, once the export begins, and a commodity becomes tradeable, WTO rules and jurisdiction kicks in and they may also require we export it to the highest bidder until its gone, according to the Peterson Institute.Asia, for example has an insatiable appetite for energy.Spot prices there are much higher than in the US.This change will also enable a lot of older housing stock to be declared blighted, opening the door to massive real estate development under eminent domain laws- as older "obsolete" buildings are replaced with new. ("redevelopment")They can actually do that on a huge scale now even when the motive is simply profit, and getting more tax receipts by replacing working people with richer people.Lots of people will have to move. Where? Its going to be a major disaster for poor and middle class people who live in cities who have to re-rent at market rates. Many people who live in cities dont drive so suburbia isnt the option for them it is for others. To keep jobs many might have to commute many hours to and from work. This is already happening in San Francisco Bay Area as huge numbers of people have been forced outward, many as far as Central Valley cities like Stockton. More than a two hour commute each way.TPTBs like these trade deals because it "takes it out of their hands", making it so they can do an end run around democracy, "forever".

author: A@ron
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2017, 10:10:09 pm
content: Here in NE Indiana it's $0.086 / kWh prior to all the taxes and fees.

author: HighVoltage
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2017, 10:18:06 pm
content: In northern Germany I pay 21.2 Euro Cents per kw/h

author: sleemanj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2017, 10:27:26 pm
content: Currently 0.23 nzd/kwh + 0.84 nzd/day (about 0.17 USD kwh + 0.61 USD/day)

author: Mr.B
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 27, 2017, 10:34:31 pm
content: Location: Nelson, New Zealand.Supplier: Contact Energy.$0.262/kWh plus $1.299/day.22% discount for paying on line and on time.Actual is $0.204/kWh plus $1.013/dayEdit: Above figures are NZD

author: Alex Eisenhut
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2017, 10:35:53 pm
content: http://www.hydroquebec.com/residential/customer-space/account-and-billing/understanding-bill/residential-rates/rate-d.html

author: jordanp123
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2017, 11:24:03 pm
content: $11 Service charge/Monthly then $.087/Kwh, that does not include any "Riders" and fuel adjustments.

author: Halcyon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 27, 2017, 11:26:36 pm
content: I'm paying something like AUD$0.22/kWh in Sydney.

author: Homer J Simpson
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2017, 11:27:41 pm
content: Near Olympia, WA$10 / month basic charge..10 up to 600..12 over 600.

author: Jr460
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2017, 11:29:13 pm
content: $.0829 in Southwest Ohio

author: langwadt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2017, 11:52:00 pm
content: if I got the exchange rate right around $0.40

author: chickenHeadKnob
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 12:25:35 am
content: British Columbia residential rates:step1 $0.0829 (0.066 us$) /kW.h step2: $0.1287 (0.103 us$) /kW.hstep 1 is 22.1918 kW.h per day or 1350 kWh averaged over 2 month billing periodoops forgot basic fixed charge $0.1899/ day and 5% G.S.T federal general services taxThe exchange rate value for $cad has just gone up recently, didn't know. Now I need to buy stuff on ebay

author: Gregg
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 12:34:01 am
content: On an electric cooperative in Montana:Basic Charge (Single Phase Service): $23.21/mo.Energy Charge:$0.0649/kWh (for first 600 kWh/mo.)$0.0799/kWh (for 601-3,500 kWh/mo.)$0.1166/kWh (for 3,501 and over kWh/mo.)Since the co-op is non-profit, there is usually an annual rebate of between 2 to 3 months basic charge

author: floobydust
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 01:05:24 am
content: Electricity costs are hidden now. $15 in electricity becomes a $111 bill in Alberta.kw/h pretty much meaningless because it's all "distribution charges, transmission charges, deferral fees, administration fees, balancing pool allocation rider" etc.

author: Fsck
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 01:07:37 am
content: Quote from: floobydust on August 28, 2017, 01:05:24 amI just approximate it by using what I pay divided by kWh consumed which comes out to like 0.24$

author: Beamin
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 01:28:18 am
content: My other question I forgot to ask:Are you buying direct off the power company (PSNH) in NH or one of these new degregulated companies that promise to save you money but its BS because now you have a middle man between you and your power. I really want to find if customers hve been saving with these new plans so if you are on one tell us about the weird quarks and features of it like contracts and insane late fees.

author: Macbeth
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 01:57:06 am
content: UK here, leccy is 16p/kWh with a 16.4p daily charge, and gas 3.6p/kWh with 21.9p daily charge.in USD $0.21/kWh electric and $0.05/kWh gas.Yes I have a gas cooker and combi-boiler.

author: TiN
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 04:47:54 am
content: Taiwan, so far $0.13/kWh USD.

author: TheSteve
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 05:07:50 am
content: BC rates have already been posted but it would also be interesting to hear what people end up paying per month(or post your rate and average usage). I average about $75.00 CAD/month(about 60 USD at current exchange rates).

author: fourtytwo42
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 05:50:49 am
content: UK for me 0.4$USD/Kwh on a quarterly cash basis.

author: Mr.B
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 07:21:05 am
content: Quote from: TheSteve on August 28, 2017, 05:07:50 amAverage per month:NZD300~USD217Here is the kicker... That does not include hot water or cooking - we have gas for those.Gas bill is about NZD110 per month (USD79)Big energy consumers are probably:Spa pool heating, Swimming pool filter pump, 2 old Dell servers, 2 large tropical fish tanks and a daughter.Time for me to initiate a "Where is all my energy being burned" audit me thinks...

author: Mr.B
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 07:54:11 am
content: Yes, the Spa costs a fortune to run, but it is my Wifes little indulgence, so I would not dare go there...I know Nelson is not as hot as some parts of Aus, but coming home form work in the summer and taking the plunge is just pure relaxation...We are due for a server refresh at work, so the obsolete ones from work will be a lot more energy efficient compared to the ones I am running that were decommissioned 5 years ago - therefore 10 years old.In fairness they earn a few dollars to pay for themselves anyway.Yes, aware that the "line costs" will never decrease.I currently get a 22% discount from my supply authority. Made up of: On line and on time, along with a 20 year loyalty discount.We have been progressively replacing lighting with LED only and trying to do other stuff.I just need to do a full audit to fully understand where the big ticket items are... And then do something about them.

author: rollatorwieltje
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 08:00:49 am
content: Around 0.20€ including taxes. We use gas for hot water and cooking, although we do have 2 small AC units in the bedrooms.I wonder what kind of connection people have when everything is electric? We only have 1x35A (230V), it can be upgraded to 3x35A. Still seems a bit marginal, I assume you use boilers and heatpumps then? Our gas heater has a peak output power of roughly 30kW.

author: Halcyon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 09:01:54 am
content: Actually just reviewing my last bill (which has the new pricing as of July this year). The standard energy rate for Sydney, AU is 32.098c/kWh (including taxes) but I effectively pay 22.468c/kWh with all applied discounts through my particular reseller/plan. This is not taking into account the 12.5c/kWh I feed back into the grid with my solar array, so that lowers the bill again.I also worked out that just by decommissioning an old Dell server in my rack which runs 24/7 and doesn't really do much any more saves me ~$100 per quarter (it uses about 206 watts just idling). $1.11 per day doesn't sound like much, but as wilfred said above, it adds up and that's just ONE machine.I just measured the consumption of my desktop PC (without monitor) and to leave that idling when I'm not using it consumes about 120 watts. Just shutting that down and waiting a few minutes for it to boot when I need to use it would save me another $50/qtr.With just those two machines alone, that's at least $600 a year I was paying (up until today!)

author: VK5RC
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 09:11:20 am
content: In Adelaide, South Australia, 41c/kWh, feed in 11c/kWh.Thankfully we have gas on-demand hot water.

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 09:22:35 am
content: 0,3426257 €/kWhOr about 0.407 USD/KWh.I'm buying 100% renewable. It costs more. I dont care.

author: brucehoult
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 12:26:43 pm
content: Quote from: Beamin on August 27, 2017, 09:56:45 pmIt's actually quite difficult to find the price of electricity here in Moscow. I think it's about US$0.05, but in fact it's almost irrelevant as most people use electricity only for lighting and fridge and computer/TV and maybe some AC in mid June to mid August. I average about 250 kWh per month (8 per day), so it's something like US$12 or so. I just give my landlord 2000 rubles (US$35) a month to cover electricity and hot and cold water (kitchen/bathroom) so I don't have to bother with it. I think he probably makes a profit from this. Heating in the winter (via hot water radiators) is always just included in the rent.Back at home in New Zealand, you can see the the current wholesale electricity prices at any substation in NZ at any time (in 5 or 30 minute intervals) athttps://www1.electricityinfo.co.nz/.There exist retail electricity companies (e.g.https://www.flickelectric.co.nz/) that charge you the average wholesale price in each half hour period, plus a fixed margin. The wholesale price at your local substation is generally around 8c - 10c (US $0.06 - $0.07), while the retail price is more like 25c - 30c.MOST of the cost of electricity in NZ is in the last km or two of wiring from the local substation to your house. This, quite coincidentally I'm sure, is the only part of the electricity system that is a regulated monopoly, with prices determined not by the market but by the companies making more or less plausible pleading to politicians for why they need so much of our money.

author: TheUnnamedNewbie
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 12:31:21 pm
content: We actually looked this up during lunch just today. About 25 eurocents/KWh if my memory serves me right.

author: BBBbbb
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 12:53:59 pm
content: Electricity prices in Serbia for domestic use are well below average in Europe, commercial consumers have higher prices. Basically the electrical production is almost completely state owned and subsidized, keeping the prices low, and although everyone know it should be higher, for cheap political reasons it's still maintained that way. But what they lose here they try to make up in gas price taxes, while the environment for private sector and the improvement of the production in the state owned plants remains poor.Green zone (up to 350 kWh/mo): 0.058 USD +20%VAT savings tariff* 0.015 USD +20%$ VATBlue zone (351-1600 kWh/mo): 0.088 USD +20%VAT savings tariff* 0.022 USD +20%$ VAT.Red zone (over 1600 kWh/mo): 0.175 USD +20%VAT savings tariff* 0.044 USD +20%$ VAT.*savings tariff varies from region to region, and where available is usually a period during the night hours (e.g. Belgrade 0:00-8:00am).And yes, I know several people with mining rigs.

author: schmitt trigger
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 01:16:36 pm
content: In South Texas about US$0.13/Kw-Hr, plus a fixed connection charge.All sales-taxed, of course.

author: Tom45
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 03:54:56 pm
content: No sales tax in Oregon, but plenty of other items to confuse the customer. No warnings about danger of cancer or electrocution. Yet.

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 03:59:06 pm
content: Quote from: Tom45 on August 28, 2017, 03:54:56 pmWARNING: Electricity contains chemicals known to the State of California to cause cancer and birth defects or other reproductive harm.

author: Beamin
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 06:03:20 pm
content: Quote from: Beamin on August 28, 2017, 01:28:18 amI always buy directly off the source. Those electricity salesman get a lecture on the horrors of deregulation and what happened in south America when the deregulated the water. People were paying 80% of their income to the water company. The hidden costs are late fees and canceling your contract. To pay a late fee off the supplier will cost a dollar or two a month. Many poor people are constantly a month behind. These companies will charge 5 to 10 a month just in late fees totally dissolving the 3-4$ you save by switching. How does adding a middleman who getting rich actually save the consumer? That money comes from somewhere and that some where is the end user. How people don't get that boggles my mind.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 06:51:47 pm
content: Southern Oregon.Rates are complicated mishmash of base charges, delivery charges, fixed prices and fuel cost related prices. According to the power company it is supposed to come out to about $0.10/kWh for the first 1000 kWh and $0.12/kWh for usage above that. Dividing my bill by usage gives a bit over $0.11 with average usage of 1300 kWh.That runs everything, the well which pumps all domestic and irrigation water (big hitter), refrigerator and freezer (next in line), stoves, lighting, lathes, compressors, table saws and the lot. Then only thing non-electric here is a kerosene heater and the wood stoves.Air conditioning would be a big driver, and was in a recent record setting hot stretch, but we really minimize its use. During the hot stretch it added over 200 kWh and $30 to the bill.The attached plot shows that there is no simple relationship between usage and rate. Somewhere near $0.11/kWh is about the best you can say.

author: Miyuki
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 08:00:14 pm
content: Here in hearth of Europe I pay:0.23 $/kWh / 0.195€/kWhplus~11$ / 9€ montlytaxes included

author: WA1ICI
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2017, 11:38:01 pm
content: Location here is in northern Nevada, power company is NV Energy, formerly Sierra Pacific Power.My latest bill for August was 1440 kWH, total US$149.15. This comes out to $0.104 per kWH, including overhead. The incremental cost per kWH is $0.08822.My heating/cooling system is an in-ground "geo-source" heat pump system. It doesn't work too hard in the summer, but in the winter, my power bill more than doubles (about 3750 kWH/month in Jan. and Feb.).The utility-supplied "power content label" show origin of the power here:Coal - 16.77%Natural Gas - 54.61%Oil - 0.02%Hydroelectric - 9.08%Geothermal - 9.07%Solar - 4.13%Nuclear - 2.87%Wind - 2.50%Biofuel - 0.29%Biomass - 0.48%Other - 0.18%- John Atwood

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 29, 2017, 12:20:44 am
content: Quote from: WA1ICI on August 28, 2017, 11:38:01 pmInteresting. About 25% renewable. About 27% non-carbon dioxide creating. About 83% low-polluting. Categories overlap so they add to more than 100%.

author: ovnr
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 29, 2017, 01:04:42 am
content: Around $0.036 per kWh for the power, plus $0.052 for the privilege of receiving it (grid fee), and a fixed fee of around $50/month (more grid fees). I literally pay 4-5 times as much in fees as I pay for the power.All added up, I pay on average $0.075 per kWh. This is in Norway, incidentally. We have quite cheap power.

author: sarel.wagner
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 29, 2017, 09:54:29 am
content: South Africa inland:The energy tariff charge/kWh- inclusive of environmental levy of 5.5c/kWh is the following:A Bulk fee of R 494.00 (US $37.77) + consumption100 kWh 130,32c (US $0.0996)400 kWh 152,50c (US $0.1165)650 kWh 166,10c (US $0.1270)>650 kWh 179,00c

author: Beamin
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 18, 2017, 09:46:18 pm
content: Quote from: sarel.wagner on August 29, 2017, 09:54:29 amI subscribed! Watching your meter videos now...

author: Sal Ammoniac
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 19, 2017, 12:07:18 am
content: Here in Northern California the rates are based on tiers. You get a baseline, which costs USD$0.20 per kWh. Use 101-400% of your baseline and the rate goes up to $0.25. Use more that 400% of baseline and the rate goes up to $0.40 per kWh. Your baseline is based on where you live and on the time of year (winter or summer).If you have solar and produce more than you consume, the utility will buy it back from you at $0.06 per kWh.

author: djacobow
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 19, 2017, 12:27:33 am
content: I live in the same PG&E territory as Sal, so already answered. However, I thought that I'd just say that if you do not know your rate, or want to know the rate somewhere else, the magic Google search term is "tariff" or "tariff book" combined with the name of the utility in question.Interestingly, in CA the two tier system is actually a simplification of the previous FOUR tier system.

author: justinjja
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 20, 2017, 10:24:04 pm
content: Total cost including fees is 0.078/kwh for me.I'm in a CO-OP in Dallas, Texas.And yet I have a $500 electric bill every month...Bitcoin minging lol...

author: David Hess
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 20, 2017, 11:13:22 pm
content: Here near St. Louis, Missouri the charges are $9 per month plus 12.6 cents per kWh in summer (June through September) and 8.8 cents per kWh in winter.

author: KuroZ
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2017, 11:23:25 am
content: R$0.638/kWh in São Paulo, that's around US$0.20.

author: Connoiseur
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2017, 01:27:39 pm
content: It's Rs 3.2/kWh (or 0.049 USD as per current exchange rate) for domestic consumers + fixed charges of about 1 USD/month.

author: jm_araujo
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2017, 02:11:02 pm
content: In Portugal,Dual rate is 0.119€/KWh ($0.142) from 0:00 to 7:00 and 0.239€/KWh($0.285) from 7:00 to 24:00, and an extra 0.391€/day($0.466) with my current supplier. The market isn't very competitive, all the suppliers have very similar rates.My monthly average was 91€ for the last year, everything in my home is electric.

author: MarkS
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 22, 2017, 08:43:18 am
content: $0.026~ right now in Oklahoma City, but that changes month to month, so it is a useless number.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 22, 2017, 11:11:01 pm
content: We in the US, because of an export ban thats been in place since the 70s enjoy the lowest wholesale energy prices in the world but that's about to change dramatically because they're about to start exporting natural gas.A lot of the impact depends on the weather. Recently the winter weather in large parts of the US has been milder than the average but natural gas (and electricity) prices are likely to rise more the colder (and likely also hotter, in the summer) it gets as local customers start competing with export for the same LNG. The shift may take more time to effect prices if weather gets milder and demand falls. But if not wages will have to rise or many people will not have any options but to move. Nobody knows where they can go if they lose affordable housing as its unlikely to be replaced with more affordable housing.The impact is likely to be felt the most in thoselarge parts of the US where most of the housing stock is older, built when energy was cheap and wages higher in relative terms than they are today.Most US homes built before the 1980s or 90s are not very well insulated with construction techniques which are no longer seen in many other cold winter areas. Many commercial buildings also lack adequate insulation.Its not a little thing. Many older Americans unable to afford heating (and cooling) may be in grave danger of freezing to death (or dying of heatstroke in the summer). Their homes may become physically dangerous to live in without energy (or retrofits) they can't afford. But, well connected lobbyists and PR pros claim this is "our energy moment", and frame the US as becoming the new Saudi Arabia, exporting energy to quench the thirst of Asia and the rest of the world until its gone. A series of articles in the New York Times revealed that some of this is hype, with the natural gas reserves overestimated and investors being led into a bubble.Regardless of how much energy is actually there, nobody seems to be expecting this change, except the energy and construction industries. Construction.. is expected to rise as older postwar buildings are replaced.Even areas like California with relatively mild winters may see changes because the price of electricity there like everywhere else in the US, basically tracks natural gas prices.

author: wasyoungonce
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 23, 2017, 12:46:01 am
content: Hey EEVblog..Actually this is a good subject matter, maybe worthy of a stickyHere is Australia, Melbourne, Origin supplier:$.28c ~$.38c per Kw Hr...and a supply charge of 117.42c per day!...do I win?Yes read and weep for us. Wow...talk about being screwed by "free market"!edit:Some stats:0-347 kWh @ $0.2813c (28c) per kWh.. We used this 347kWh ...plus347kWh and up @ $0.30.99c (31c) per kWh..we used another 664kWh....wowWe use an avg of 32.64kWh per day...we are not heavy users... I think? I mean we don't waste pwr...maybe its my 121Gw MULTIMETER.....nah haven't got that yet.Supply charge: 117.42c per day! wow!.Anyone want to donate to our cause?...obviously we need solar ~ 5kW's of panels. Love to see the harmonics that puts on the grid....let alone enough roof space to do this.Billing period15 Aug -14Sept 2017. (exc GST)! Oh we are in credit $600 dollars plus..guess our supplier is screwing us.

author: Beamin
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 23, 2017, 03:47:36 pm
content: Quote from: cdev on September 22, 2017, 11:11:01 pmAlmost every place I have rented even in places that cost 1500 a month have little to no insulation. This one place I rented had NO insulation built in the 1960's and slum lord will NEVER upgrade them. The AC ducts are totally uninsulated and were exposed to the outside air with tons of leaks. In the winter you heat would run full time below a certain temp. With electric heat this was an exponential rise in heating costs. 2'F difference would result in the heat running 100% of the time vs 75%. Same with the AC. I bashed a hole in the Freon line in mine thinking they would put in a new unit. Nope they got an identical used unit and stuck it in. Only option was to move but many poor people can't because their electric bill is so high then they go on gov asst. heating and the tax payers have to pay for the slum lords not willing to spend 100$ on spray insulation. Think of the millions of tons of CO2 just from that.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 23, 2017, 05:04:35 pm
content: Quote from: Beamin on September 23, 2017, 03:47:36 pmI agree that many places built before the 1970s had little or no insulation. Remember in the 1950s nuclear energy was going to make electricity "too cheap to meter".But having been the owner of rental property (I guess that makes me a slumlord), I want to point out that there is no payoff to the owner for for insulation upgrades. You spend money and or time on insulation and your renters bills go down, but your rent doesn't go up. So you are asking for a free gift from the property owner. The only case where that might not be true is when there is a glut of rentals available and property owners are trying to compete for tenants with amenities rather than with reduced rents. But even then, people tend to look for low rents instead of good insulation. It is easier and the savings are immediate, not a few months later.I also will point out that insulation generally costs far more than $100 if it is to have significant payoff. If it were that inexpensive renters could do it themselves and see the savings within a single rental contract.Bottom line, I did one of my biggest happy dances when I unloaded the rental property. There were no huge profits and endless headaches.

author: Red Squirrel
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 23, 2017, 06:42:43 pm
content: Too much.Actually it's not the usage that's so bad, I could cut that down if I added a solar system or what not. It's the fixed charges that are ridiculous. Even if you don't use any power you're paying quite a lot, as they just adjust those charges to be higher for that particular bill. You can't get a bill that is under $100. If you don't use any power at all (ex: cottage that is closed for season) they'll just raise delivery to $100.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 23, 2017, 09:02:25 pm
content: A sudden jump in energy prices will give landlords who want to leave the business an excuse to do so. Also in the US a 2005 legal decision, Kelo v. City of New London, made large scale redevelopment of well maintained owner occupied homes legal based on profit oriented economic arguments that tax receipts would increase if they were replaced with more expensive housing. That is just madness in my opinion.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 23, 2017, 09:43:12 pm
content: We all should keep an open mind on energy to homes, maybe its time to rethink the whole situation.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 23, 2017, 10:14:39 pm
content: Quote from: cdev on September 23, 2017, 09:02:25 pmOr will give many more the incentive to do what is already a common practice - making the utilities the renters responsibility. Which is actually an appropriate thing to do from one perspective. When utilities are included in the rent there is no incentive for the renter to reduce usage. Run air conditioning with the windows open. Why not? Take four hour hot showers? Why not?Of course having utilities be the property owners responsibility does provide them with incentive to provide insulation and energy efficient appliances - if they can justify it financially. Insulation is probably a yes in most cases. Probably HVAC systems. But other than that, probably not. Unless you have maintained rental property you have no idea how short the life of fixtures and appliances that are in the hands of someone with no skin in the game. That is not universal, some do take excellent care of rental property. Most are just careless, not outright malicious. But an amazing percentage deliberately destroy stuff. Maybe it is a way to "get back at the man" or something like that.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 23, 2017, 10:46:10 pm
content: When I was a teenager growing up outside of NYC, I used to have a lot of friends in the City, and one of my friends lived in a building which had been abandoned by its landlord over unpaid taxes and utility bills. His building was actually quite nice. Really unusually nice. They were lucky, other buildings in that area were getting burned down by landlords for the insurance money. That said, CatalinaWow, you are right about some tenants being destructive. But I think both really bad landlords and really bad tenants are rare in nicer cities/communities. When they happen, though, you don't forget it.----One way other countries are claimed to be framing the low natural gas prices is as a subsidy or "protectionism".

author: Raj
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2017, 06:34:36 pm
content: Quote from: Connoiseur on September 21, 2017, 01:27:39 pmWow, that's pretty low.In punjab, its 8 Rs or 5-6 cents

author: SeanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2017, 06:55:59 pm
content: As to rentals including utility, here is South Africa the bill is required to be in the owner's name ( or the juristic owner), and then is a separate part of the rent each month, typically being 2 months behind the actual billing, mostly due to billing dates not being fixed, but staggered over the month by the Metro's, and thus you can have your rent due on the first of the month ( or the 15th, for those paid by Government) and the utility bill being sent the next day, up till the last day of the month, so typically you will be up to 6 weeks behind on the payment for consumption.Then you get the bills that are wrong, like the person who got a $1 million plus bill, and had to pay within 21 days or be cut off. Hard to get that kind of a water bill with a 3/4in connection that is read each month. Ah well, at least the energy part for me is typically under $50 per month, and the water is a lot less, I watch for leaks and check regularly, plus I live in a small unit. A pox on being charged for sewage, which used to be part of the water bill, but which was split out ( and water price was not lowered either) to increase revenue. Septic tank users also have a charge, plus have to pay for the private honeysucker every few years.

author: Beamin
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2017, 09:54:07 pm
content: I rented this one place that wasn't cheap: 1400 for a two bedroom and they had this scam where you would have two utility bills. You had gas stove, heater, and electric. Then your hot water heater ran on its own gas that was on one meter for the whole apartment of 16 units. The second utility bill was usually $40-50USD a month which was the average for the whole apartment building which was also bullshit. Since it went to a third party billing company you had no way of checking to see if the hot water heaters were actually using that much. You got doubly screwed if you lived in a unit where it was primarily indian families with 8 kids each taking tons of hot showers. The people in the rental office were all women in their 40-50's but acted like high school kids and would just argue with you in the most unprofessional setting I have ever dealt with. That place has about 100 reviews on google all bad and the 10 good ones are fake.