Do We Live In A One Electron Universe ? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Sionyn
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 18, 2012, 12:13:39 am
content: Every generations has asked the purpose and fate of the cosmos, our generation has the potability to answer some of these questionsYou are placed in a dark room, against the middle of one wall. The room has a light capable of very fast switching. There is a rock opposite you in the right corner sitting on a scale. There is nothing special in the left corner. The light briefly flashes on/off. You see a rock, on a scale, and a measure wieght. The rock and scale is very quickly moved to the left corner where the light again flashes on/off. The rock/scale returns to the right corner. This process repeats indefinitely.It seems you can see 2 rocks - one in each corner on a scale. They have identical characteristics it seems, even the same mass. Amazing! As far as you are concerned you accept they are separate rocks and, furthermore, exact twins, in the common sense.Now substitute the word electron for rock and read it again. Just think about that for a momentthen there is this picture of electron taken by a stroboscope

author: tom66
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 18, 2012, 01:22:34 am
content: Fascinating. It is conceivable, but from an elementary physics standpoint, it sounds like the meta-electron would need information about every individual electron in the universe. How is that stored on a point-charge particle?

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 18, 2012, 01:36:28 am
content: so what do we know?

author: LAZLOT
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 18, 2012, 04:51:36 am
content: Or... is the sun a nucleus, and the planets in our solar system the electrons, so our local solar system is but one atom in a far-far larger universe, with a massively different time scale?Getting a bit existentialist there... And not meant to be taken too seriously, but food for thought!Begs the question though... What is our galaxy? -A grain of sand on the shore, being battered by the waves???

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 18, 2012, 08:31:00 am
content: Quote from: LAZLOT on November 18, 2012, 04:51:36 amWould that makes us Quarks?Dave.

author: Kozmyk
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 18, 2012, 08:44:20 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on November 18, 2012, 08:31:00 amA lot of us are certainly Strange but there's not too much Charm and way too much Spin.

author: AndyC_772
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 18, 2012, 09:24:19 am
content: Quote from: Sionyn on November 18, 2012, 12:13:39 amNot really. The moment I try to interact with the rocks, or examine the way in which they interact with each other, it becomes immediately obvious that there aren't really two of them. I can't, for example, stack them one on top of the other, or smash them together and watch them bounce off each other if there's only really one rock.

author: Blofeld
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 18, 2012, 10:51:00 am
content: Sounds completely crazy, but you are in good company: Prof. John Wheeler had a similar idea in 1940:"...I received a telephone call one day at the graduate college at Princeton from Professor Wheeler, in which he said, "Feynman, I know why all electrons have the same charge and the same mass" "Why?" "Because, they are all the same electron!" And, then he explained on the telephone, "suppose that the world lines which we were ordinarily considering before in time and space—instead of only going up in time were a tremendous knot, and then, when we cut through the knot, by the plane corresponding to a fixed time, we would see many, many world lines and that would represent many electrons, except for one thing. If in one section this is an ordinary electron world line, in the section in which it reversed itself and is coming back from the future we have the wrong sign to the proper time—to the proper four velocities—and that's equivalent to changing the sign of the charge, and, therefore, that part of a path would act like a positron." "But, Professor", I said, "there aren't as many positrons as electrons." "Well, maybe they are hidden in the protons or something", he said."http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One-electron_universe

author: Sionyn
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 18, 2012, 12:03:00 pm
content: yesevery electron seems to have the same metric, within experimental error.This is in accordance with quantum theory which posits every electron is identical to every other election, except for possible differences in their quantum states. So all electrons have precisely the same mass, same electric charge, same spin, and exactly the same weak and strong force properties...but they may have different locations, different spin directions and different energies for example.Another example of this thought experiment ?Just as a 'stickman' in a cartoon strip can not understand (prove) how 2D-drawn objects in his Universe can appear and then disappear, as the artist draws and then erases them, we may be unable to understand similar mechanisms happening in 5- or higher dimensional spaces as they appear to us in 4-space.Or there may be an endless succession of Infinities, Cantor-style, without beginning or end whose cardinalities are supersets of preceding ones.I'd say we have as much chance of understanding as a stickman is able to comprehend the existence (in our -space) of an artist, which is zero.

author: FenderBender
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 18, 2012, 10:10:35 pm
content: My reaction pretty much:

author: Leo Bodnar
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 18, 2012, 10:26:59 pm
content: There are two many holes in this experiment.You are saying you can see electron in a specific locationandbeing stationary. This is impossible if you admit uncertainty principle is still holding true. In other words electron can be in two places at the same time or everywhere at once.Also byobservingelectron you modify its location and momentum, etc.Leo

author: G7PSK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 18, 2012, 11:37:33 pm
content: The real problem with there being only one electron is who owns it, the lawyers will have a field day claiming that it is the rightful property of their clients and any one using it has to pay up. No doubt first to lay claim to it along with a patent will be Apple.

author: funkimunky
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2012, 11:42:22 am
content: Quote from: G7PSK on November 18, 2012, 11:37:33 pmThey have already patented it. The electron has rounded corners.

author: Leo Bodnar
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2012, 12:34:48 pm
content: Quote from: funkimunky on November 19, 2012, 11:42:22 amPatents seem to be the only way to force competition to evolve. Otherwise nobody is interested in picking up the fight. Well done, Apple. Kick some ass.

author: G7PSK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2012, 04:28:13 pm
content: Quote from: Leo Bodnar on November 19, 2012, 12:34:48 pmExcept that patents are used these days to stifle competition, also Apple cannot have the rights to the electron as I was around before Apple were so I claim all the rights to it.

author: AlfBaz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 20, 2012, 02:15:31 pm
content: only one electron hey.... those pricks at CERN better not break it then: