Is there anything worth salvaging here? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / projects

author: Alex_Baker
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2023, 08:30:00 pm
content: Hello folks!I recently picked up this interesting device, it was cheap and I really liked the enclosure it was in, but little did I know that it would be so interesting on the inside, several pictures are attached for context, there are more but they were too big, I will attach more below this post.First I will explain what I think it was. This was an Econolite Autoscope 2004, it was built in the first half of the 90s and was designed to analyze incoming video feeds from traffic cameras. In the field you would connect this device to another computer using a piece of software to set detection zones on the camera feeds, then the processor in the autoscope would use pixel thresholding to detect vehicles. That is the gist for it I think, details are quite hard to find. It was a new idea at the time to use cameras for traffic control, but I don't think it worked very well.So, is there any thing worth saving from this? I would have loved to do more with it as it is, and even though it has all the bits of a PC (CPU, RAM, Chipset, I/O controller, Flash storage) I don't think it can be made to function as such.I will definitely be saving the CPU, power supply, and case, but I don't know what else. If any body has any ideas or wants any of the other bits, let me know!

author: Alex_Baker
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2023, 08:30:33 pm
content: Here is the rest of the photos

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2023, 08:46:33 pm
content: I save the case, if it's small and reusable, small RF boxes, knobs, mechanical stuff, transformers, and maybe inductors. As for chips, including the CPU, from something 1990, they are worthless unless you plan to repair other equipment from that era for a profit, and the chips are no longer available.The only things I have ever reused were knobs and a case/box or two. However, save what you have space for, and in 10 years, throw it out. Removing stuff can be a problem. I use a propane torch on the back side and a trash can to catch them.

author: Conrad Hoffman
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2023, 08:47:37 pm
content: Maybe somebody sees something valuable, but I'd just keep the PS, the BNC connectors, some hardware and pitch the rest.

author: capt bullshot
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2023, 08:49:20 pm
content: Sorry, my maybe disappointing answer:I wouldn't touch that thing with a barge pole, nor keep any of the obsolete components.I have to admit, it's cool vintage stuff, really tempting - no I don't want anything from it

author: Vincent
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2023, 08:53:05 pm
content: dat 486...I'd be curious to know if it's actually a PC architecture.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2023, 08:53:34 pm
content: Looks like all sorts of interesting bits there. The 486 CPU is worth something, though SX is not nearly as valuable as a DX. 5V flash chips are getting hard to come by and are useful, and SRAM is handy stuff that is getting harder to find too. Those ULN transistor arrays are nice for driving lamps and relays and stuff. Ultimately it depends on the sort of projects you're interested in.I would dump all the ROMs and see what's in there, I'm curious what operating system it has.

author: Alex_Baker
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2023, 09:57:26 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on January 02, 2023, 08:53:34 pmThat would be cool, Though I don't know where the ROMs are, either the BIOS or the OS. I assume something is permanently stored in the flash memory. If I were to guess the flash labeled C: and D: was just general storage, and the flash labeled A: was used to boot an OS, like the floppy on an older computer.Quote from: Vincent on January 02, 2023, 08:53:05 pmI don't know, all I know is that is has all the bits of a PC, even A, C, and D drives like I mentioned earlier, I was really hopeful that it would just boot into DOS or something, there is an internal keyboard connector and several Microsoft stickers, who knows!Thanks for the feedback everybody!

author: eutectique
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2023, 10:23:33 pm
content: Quote from: Vincent on January 02, 2023, 08:53:05 pmI spy a paper sticker on the connector of CPU board reading literally "software licensed from Microsoft Corporation".

author: Vincent
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2023, 10:50:46 pm
content: Quote from: eutectique on January 02, 2023, 10:23:33 pmSharp eye, didn't even notice that! Doesn't strictly prove it's a PC, but it's very much possible. Since this device has a video output it'd be possible to power it up and see what it does.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2023, 04:53:49 am
content: Quote from: Vincent on January 02, 2023, 10:50:46 pmIt's almost certainly a PC if it has anything from Microsoft on it. Probably embedded MS-DOS or Windows 95.

author: pcprogrammer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2023, 06:53:31 am
content: The memory board does mention drive c:, drive d: and drive a: on the silk screen. Looks like the forerunner of the modern SSDIt could well be running MS-DOS.But there is one photo missing. The board with the five BNC connectors on it. Can't fully read the markings on the big chip, but think it is a Xilinx FPGA. If it is for handling camera signals, I wonder what ADC's are used to read them in.Could be fun to do a project with it to turn it into a four channel oscilloscope, if you are into something like that.

author: vk6zgo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2023, 08:23:39 am
content: Quote from: Alex_Baker on January 02, 2023, 08:30:00 pmInterestingly, my old work built a "one-off" device which was intended for use as security on a "hard to see" gate.The CCTV image had a "sweet spot" in the form of a rectangle in the picture which was normally displayed by the CCTV monitors as a brighter image than the rest of the scan.To enter, an intruder would have to enter that rectangle, & motion in that area of the screen would trigger an alarm.Limiting the size of the detection area in this way was supposed to limit the number of false alarmsThis was back in the late 1970s/early '80s, so I assume the processing was done in analog, & fairly basic.Even with this design, it still was prone to false alarms, so I don't think anything came of it.

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2023, 08:29:45 am
content: Any of those ceramic package CPUs are wanted by people doing gold recovery. They usually have $3-$10 of gold on them.But yeah, they are not going to give you more than a dollar or so probably.

author: oz2cpu
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2023, 09:15:03 am
content: the fun thing is : it often takes less space on your storage, to keep it intact,this way if you need a few BNC connectors one night, it is easier to hunt down this box and then score them,and so forth.the other method : take all parts you think you could need one day in the future, and throw the rest out..now both the empty case and all the parts take up more total storage space, you spend a lot of time salvage parts,and in 10 years you realize none of them where actually used, OR the part you really need, is on a board you thrown away.

author: Haenk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2023, 12:33:47 pm
content: As a part scavenger, I would pretty much only keep the PSU. The PCBs (and parts) are coated, plus extracting from multi layer PCBs is always requiring some effort - IMHO too much effort for just a couple of EUR/USD worth of clean parts (whiche there are none).

author: Stray Electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2023, 02:17:38 pm
content: Quote from: oz2cpu on January 03, 2023, 09:15:03 amThis. Take it from an old parts scrounger that used to pull all of the parts and save them. Later I often couldn't find the parts that I knew that I had somewhere. And I used spent a LOT of time pulling parts, identifying them and then testing, and then usually not using them! Now I just save the whole assembly and pull the parts when and if I need them.Quote from: oz2cpu on January 03, 2023, 09:15:03 am

author: eutectique
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2023, 02:57:45 pm
content: A similar box is on ebay for $485 (item 114506443338). You can offer yours to the seller for $200.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2023, 06:09:45 pm
content: Quote from: Psi on January 03, 2023, 08:29:45 amThey're probably worth several times more as CPUs. There's a huge market for vintage computer parts. Some like the Pentium Pro are quite rare and valuable now because so many got scrapped to recover a few dollars in gold.

author: Alex_Baker
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2023, 06:37:18 pm
content: Quote from: Vincent on January 02, 2023, 10:50:46 pmI did power it up, but unfortunately all I could get it to do was pass-through composite video from one of the inputs to the output. The com port seemed to be quiet. I also tried hooking a PS/2 keyboard to the header which traces back to the keyboard pins on the I/O controller, but that seemed to be dead as well.I think some things are running, the selector switch on the CPU board would select the preview of all the cameras, The LEDs would also light up and blink while "Booting". There was one position of the selector switch that would show just a blank screen, the diagnostics position I think. There may be things that are supposed to be displayed there but there was nothing.

author: Alex_Baker
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2023, 06:51:44 pm
content: Quote from: pcprogrammer on January 03, 2023, 06:53:31 amHere is a better picture. The input ADCs seem to be dedicated 8-bit image digitizers.

author: pcprogrammer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2023, 07:30:07 pm
content: Thanks for the picture. The FPGA is an oldie. XC4005 has approximate 5000 gates, so small compared to modern day cheap FPGA's.It looks like a nice board, but probably not worth any effort to do something with it.

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 04, 2023, 02:37:13 am
content: Quote from: james_s on January 03, 2023, 06:09:45 pmAgreed.ah yes, the old Pentium Pro.Contained around US$20 of gold per chip and was pretty accessible.

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 04, 2023, 04:11:33 pm
content: Quote from: oz2cpu on January 03, 2023, 09:15:03 amSo true!

author: Alex_Baker
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2023, 03:31:51 pm
content: Well thanks everybody for the feedback and information, I enjoyed it!I will store as much as I can, I may be able to purge some other stuff in the process. I have an interest is older computers so perhaps some day I will actually use that I486sx in a computer build.

author: Doctorandus_P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2023, 11:01:38 pm
content: BT252 is a 20Msps ADC, and four of them connected to an FPGA an I/O accessible via a standard connector could be a basis for quite some nice experiments. The PCB is probably relatively easy to reverse engineer, I assume the rest is some TTL buffering or similar.The problem with these things is that it takes a lot of time to write software for it, and after you've invested all that time you have one piece of hardware. If that dies somehow you're out of luck.