EEVsmoke #2 - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: rs20
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 01:00:45 am
content: Awesome stuff!!!I'd really like to try replicating (and videoing) the captured-smoke failure. Seems like a worthy exception to the "natural failures only" rule

author: Vgkid
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 04:15:27 am
content: Some major self destruction, on this one.

author: SL4P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 06:12:10 am
content: Gives you an idea of how good coffee is for us!They say cockroaches will survive a nuclear blast - but not an active coffee machine!

author: Halcyon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 07:13:21 am
content: Quote from: SL4P on November 07, 2016, 06:12:10 amIt looked more like a cricket to me.

author: blackbird
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 09:03:15 am
content: About the last picture of the escaped smoke (the Jaycar UPS), I noticed the most right component looks still OK, at least it has not exploded or burnt.Could it be that because the most right one has a sil-pad underneath it survived, or better, because the other three does not had the sil-pads made them go 'booom'?

author: G7PSK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 09:19:59 am
content: The fourth mosfet in the Jaycar UPS looked liked it had got rather hot as well. I once had a 400KVA gen set that had the insulation on the stator removed by ants, but unfortunately I do not have any photo's of it as it was quite a few years ago now.

author: lowimpedance
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 10:57:42 am
content: The captured magic smoke is amazing, worth framing.Also an interesting picture of the 'dark side of the moon' ......... well maybe not that dark!

author: EPTech
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 12:08:18 pm
content: Hi there,Nice episode. I remember now that this is the actual meaning of debugging, LMAF.I especially liked the power module that blew up "discretely", capturing the act in the gel, very nice. This would be difficult to recreate actually.To dave: I would use your friends "joule bomb", not sure what the technical term it for that demonic device, the one you used on the multimeters. The trick would be to determine just the correct amount of energy not to blow up the IGBT completely but still have the effect of the smoke caputered in the gel. The setup itself is quiete simple. Hook up source and drain to the "joule bomb" and put an isolated control signal over gate-source to make it conduct, like a 9V battery. If the battery blows up with the rest, that is not a big loss.

author: max_torque
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 03:09:50 pm
content: Here's the DC link contactor that died alongside that IGBT from me:Current monitor on DC link opened it automatically when IGBT shorted, but contactor had 850A flowing through it at the time! Which it did break, but resulted in significant arc damage to the contactor contacts and cracked the porcelain of the housing.Love the fact the contactor looks soo sad in the picture!

author: vinicius.jlantunes
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 04:22:21 pm
content: That magic smoke captured picture is mesmerizing... the video was good in its entirety but that picture alone would have made it worthy no doubt.

author: Len
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 06:04:53 pm
content: Quote from: blackbird on November 07, 2016, 09:03:15 amMore likely, the one with the sil-pad failed previously and was replaced, that's why it's mounted differently, and then the other 3 failed.

author: dansan
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 09:07:43 pm
content: I can't be the only one who saw in that first example a Chinese emperor holding a Super Bowl trophy.

author: retrolefty
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 09:36:20 pm
content: Cochrouch my ass, that's a grasshopper.

author: electrophiliate
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 08, 2016, 04:33:13 am
content: The captured smoke in the IGBT gel is impressive.

author: EPTech
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 08, 2016, 02:25:49 pm
content: Quote from: max_torque on November 07, 2016, 03:09:50 pmHi there. I have not encountered a contactor like that in the drives I repaired, with the porcelain base I mean. Was it and older drive or maybe a high voltage one?

author: SgtTech
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 08, 2016, 08:09:20 pm
content: Excellent stuff Dave, l like the magic smoke stuff. Maybe need to take another look at the multimeters you blew up! or maybe blow up a few more with a slow mo camera?

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 08, 2016, 11:55:17 pm
content: 80k views, 5k thumbs, and a normal 5% thumbs down ratio.So the segment seems very popular.Although it could still be anomaly because of the awesome captured smoke photo.

author: Brumby
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 09, 2016, 12:20:40 am
content: You never know, this series might find a cult following.But aside from that, I am beginning to warm to the content - and it's not because one of my photos was in there (but that didn't hurt).What is beginning to appeal to me is, I think, the dramatic nature of the failures - and the chances of seeing those one-in-a-million shots ... like the smoke captured in the gel. That was just awesome.I'll be interested to see how this theme tracks over time.

author: Brumby
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 09, 2016, 12:25:21 am
content: Anyone have some good examples of a MOV failure?I had one, but I cleaned it up and repaired it. A dead short across 240V makes for an interesting afternoon.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 09, 2016, 01:15:33 am
content: Quote from: Brumby on November 09, 2016, 12:20:40 amYes, will be interesting.100% reliant upon viewer submission though, and to be honest there were a lot of submissions that really weren't worth showing IMO

author: rrinker
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 09, 2016, 01:05:02 pm
content: That captured smoke is going to be very hard to top. I'm with Lowimpedence - that's suitable for framing as art.

author: Brumby
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 09, 2016, 02:07:23 pm
content: Quote from: rrinker on November 09, 2016, 01:05:02 pmIt is.

author: StuUK
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 09, 2016, 02:11:04 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on November 08, 2016, 11:55:17 pmAnd the keywords in the title I suspect.....

author: amirm
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 09, 2016, 05:49:21 pm
content: Quote from: Brumby on November 09, 2016, 12:25:21 amHere you go:

author: bktemp
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 09, 2016, 06:24:11 pm
content: Quote from: amirm on November 09, 2016, 05:49:21 pmWhat is this device that needs so many MOVs? And what is the black thing with the toriodal core on top of it?Whenever metal vaporises, it leaves a horrible mess.That's why you need HRC fuses for multimeters, because cheap glass fuses can explode while trying to interrupt a full mains short.

author: Brumby
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 10, 2016, 01:54:43 am
content: Ah! Found the pics I took of my MOV drama:The direct view....From above (with enhancement)The PCB after cleaning...The casualties: (Yes, everything in the yellow frameiswas the MOV):

author: Brumby
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 10, 2016, 02:00:18 am
content: Dave - I'll send the Hi-Res to you ... in case you are interested.

author: amirm
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 10, 2016, 03:09:37 am
content: Quote from: bktemp on November 09, 2016, 06:24:11 pmIt is a service entrance/whole house SPD (surge protection device). I assumed they paralleled the MOVs to get higher energy absorption capacity.QuoteThat's right. Many of these SPDs unfortunately have no fuse so when the MOV goes, it goes really bad.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 10, 2016, 10:30:23 am
content: Quote from: Brumby on November 10, 2016, 01:54:43 amNow you know why some people wrap them with heatshrink....

author: Mike Warren
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 10, 2016, 10:55:13 pm
content: From quite a few years ago. The magic smoke had escaped, but it wasn't particularly dramatic. Looks like the mouse could smell fried lizard.

author: guido
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2016, 01:54:14 am
content: There's also magic liquid. One cap turned ballistic and tried to lift off.Got it working again, it's an off the shelf powersupply in a Kode time interval analyser.

author: strawberry
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 21, 2016, 06:24:47 pm
content: From some old TV 80's

author: iwasz
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 13, 2017, 07:29:03 pm
content: Mains went through USB port. Pictured below is an ESD protection IC.

author: Nobody2
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2017, 11:52:30 am
content: Quote from: Mike Warren on November 10, 2016, 10:55:13 pmAnd what's the mouse doing there? Or where both the mouse and the lizard fried? How did they get in there in the first place?!?

author: EPTech
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 30, 2017, 01:03:40 pm
content: Hi there,I was repairing a VFD and got another power IGBT module with a blown up brake chopper, massive gate failure. The TVS over the gate and emitter took the over voltage like a boss, shorted out and the mostfet driver seems to have survived thanks to the series resistor to the gate. Although not as impressive as OP picture, The magic smoke got caught in the act. Additionally you can see the bonding wires melted off the emitter, just below the black spot. The intense heat also boiled the gel around the area.

author: Mike Warren
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 02, 2018, 08:10:54 am
content: Quote from: Nobody2 on March 14, 2017, 11:52:30 amSorry, I missed this. Both animals had been killed by touching the 240V terminals. My guess is that the mouse smelled fried lizard and went to get some to eat.

author: madsbarnkob
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 04, 2018, 09:40:10 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on November 08, 2016, 11:55:17 pmI am happy that you like my photo and contribute it some success, it was however sent in by someone that has seen it on my website and did not include proper credits for it.Please link back to my original article where the photo is from:http://kaizerpowerelectronics.dk/technology/teardown-schneider-electric-frequency-inverter-altivar71/On your question on how the layers of smoke settled in the gel has happened, it is my thesis that the long and flat flower like black paths in the goo is actually the gasses from the exploded IGBT die, the gas expands out into the goo that blows a bubble and collapses as soon as the pressure is gone. Leaving a black trail of burned silicon, metal and goo.

author: EPTech
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 31, 2023, 09:37:39 am
content: Hi all,This one reminded me of this topic. Almost a piece of art. Magic smoke flowers. 😁Greetings and happy tinkering.