Is This A Standard AMP Connector Pin - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / projects

author: bostonman
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2022, 11:40:27 pm
content: A wire broke off this pin and the connector only has 'AMP' on it which I assume is the manufacture. I can dig out the old wire and try soldering the new wire back in, but thought replacing them would be better since they are old (thankfully I have the extraction tool).I believe I've used these pins before and looked online, but don't know for sure whether one standard size exists or I need to narrow it down. From what I measured, it's about 21.20mm long and approximately 2mm at the female end.Sometimes measuring stuff like this isn't easy unless the models differ greatly in size allowing you to figure out which one is needed by discarding the obvious wrong sizes, however, I also know connector pins and know the slightest missed detail could result in buying the wrong one.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 15, 2022, 09:24:42 am
content: If your extraction tool is original AMP, it might have a part number on it that you can google to find out what connector series it's for.

author: bostonman
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 15, 2022, 01:30:57 pm
content: It does have a part number, however, I don't know if it's the correct tool.I had a few sizes and tinkered with the one that fit best. It may be a good idea though, I'll try that approach too.

author: bostonman
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2022, 02:38:25 am
content: Unfortunately it's not an Amphenol connector pin - I sent an email to them. I'm trying TTI.

author: ConKbot
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2022, 01:29:27 pm
content: AMP also gets used by a company that TE bought. I thought it was a CPC pin, but it is definitely not one from the basic CPC family. Those use 3 locking tabs on the over wrap, not 2 tabs from the body itself.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2022, 10:11:21 pm
content: Quote from: bostonman on March 18, 2022, 02:38:25 amAMP isn’t short for Amphenol, but for Aircraft and Marine Products, which is now part of TE Connectivity, as ConKbot said. (TE itself being short for Tyco Electronics.) But nobody knows AMP by the full name, just as AMP and now TE.Amphenol connectors are generally branded as such, they never abbreviate it. So if you see AMP, it means AMP itself.

author: bostonman
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 20, 2022, 03:53:50 pm
content: Wow, this is great information. My assumption was Amphenol couldn't fit on the connector, so they just marked it 'AMP'.TE responded, but provided a socket pin series that didn't match what I have. Since my initial post, I took zoomed in photos.As for the connector, I don't need to replace it, but wouldn't mind replacing it with a new one since this one is aged. Oddly, I can't figure out how to remove it due to those wings; nor can I find a connector on TE that has one with wings. I'm thinking Weller (this is from a Weller WES51 solder station) used epoxy to mount the wings after installing the connector.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 20, 2022, 06:41:47 pm
content: Quote from: bostonman on March 20, 2022, 03:53:50 pmWhile that is decidedly made by AMP, it looks for all the world like an Amphenol C091B series (which is basically an industry standard plastic-bayonet DIN connector). Chances are AMP makes (or used to make) a compatible connector.The wings are part of the connector, they’re not added afterwards. See e.g. Amphenol T 3427 500 (the solder cup version of that connector).

author: bostonman
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 21, 2022, 02:14:55 am
content: This is confusing.Amphenol stated this is not their socket pin (or connector), but you're correct, page 35 of their "datasheet" (which is really a catalog) clearly shows what appears the exact connector; although I'm uncertain the difference between the 7 pin and the 7 with the superscript 2 (part number 3437-500 and 3447-500).If they sell the exact connector on this iron, then one would believe they sell the connector for it.I'm fearing that if I don't find the correct one, then it won't mate correctly with the soldering iron connector.On a side note, am I correct about how to remove/install this connector which is bend those plastic tabs all the way so they wrap around the circular connector? I tried a bit of pressure on it, but felt they would crack, so I backed off.Edit: Mouser has the actual datasheet and shows the difference between the 7 pin and 7pin with the superscript 2. Looks like I need a plain seven pen (mine has a center pin).

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 21, 2022, 10:00:58 am
content: Quote from: bostonman on March 21, 2022, 02:14:55 amYou misunderstand:yourconnector clearly is made by AMP, not Amphenol. So yeah, Amphenol was correct when they said it’s not theirs.But it’s common for compatible components to be made by multiple manufacturers, especially connectors, especially for connectors following a national or military standard like these DIN connectors. TE doesn’t seem to make any connectors like this any more, though they clearly did at one time. Note that a compatibleconnectormight not use compatible parts: for example, don’t expect one manufacturer’s contacts to fit in another’s housing, even if the finished connector is completely compatible. So while it’s possible that the Amphenol contact would fit in your housing, it might not. And based on your questions, I think it’s fair to assume you don’t have the right tool to crimp it anyway. If you do, then you could order a few contacts and see if it fits.Quote from: bostonman on March 21, 2022, 02:14:55 amNot necessarily. Companies discontinue components they once made, but also, they frequently make custom components for large clients, without them ever going on sale in general.Quote from: bostonman on March 21, 2022, 02:14:55 amA valid concern, though unlikely, since that’s a DIN type connector, so quite standardized.Quote from: bostonman on March 21, 2022, 02:14:55 amThis I don’t know. They’re surely not intended to be removed. I wouldn’t attempt to remove it until you’ve received your replacement connector and verified it mates.Quote from: bostonman on March 21, 2022, 02:14:55 amLook A LOT more carefully: Yours is a six-pin connector, not 7. (The difference between the two types of 7-pin connectors is shown in the table of pin arrangements, by the way. See p. 25 of the catalog.) The trapezoidal hole isn’t a pin hole, and in your photo of the rear of the connector, you can plainly see it’s 6 pins. So for the snap-in type, you’d need the 3427-500 I mentioned. Though you could use the screw-in 3427-000 which would likely be easier to install.

author: bostonman
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 24, 2022, 04:12:57 am
content: QuoteYou are absolutely correct and surprised I missed that. This can be loosely attributed by you can't judge a book by its cover since I was looking at the front and not the back too. I didn't look in depth, but guessing having the seventh pin wouldn't change the six other pin locations, however, I clearly made an error, and I'll chalk this up to a learning experience to remember going forward about dealing with connectors.Just an update, I contacted Amphenol the other day (prior to your response) and they stated this would be an Amphenol-sine connector pin. I contacted Amphenol-sine and this is the email I received:Unfortunately, this is not our part, this would be a TE Connectivity part.I contacted TE, and this is their response:Unfortunately, I could find any other match on the part number, I think this would be a custom restricted part hence we wouldn't have the informationI thought this would be a slam dunk because I expected this to be a standard pin; especially since I provided dimensions rather than just a picture asking "what is this".

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 24, 2022, 12:12:43 pm
content: The real lesson is “there’s no such thing as a standard pin”!The only truly standardized contacts I’m aware of are the military-standard circular connector pins, where there are unambiguous military standards to adhere to. But they’re far, far too expensive to use outside of military and aerospace projects. Most (all?) of the other non-manufacturer-specific standards I’m aware of define only compatibility of the finished connectors, but not of the parts within them. :/Often, when a connector is designed to be a clone of another (like in Chinese clones of JST XH connectors), the parts are interchangeable. But even so it’s not guaranteed: for example, Chinese “DuPont” connectors are loose clones of the Amphenol Mini-PV, and while real Amphenol contacts will fit in a clone housing, clone contacts won’t fit in a genuine Amphenol housing.FYI, most connectors are designed so that connectors with different pin counts cannot be mated, since that’s usually a desirable trait. There are occasional exceptions (like one of the 5-pin DIN layouts) expressly designed for a higher-pin-count female socket to accept a lower-pin-count male plug.

author: Jeff eelcr
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 26, 2022, 11:36:07 am
content: AMP/TYCO/TE connectivity, old part proably discontinued look for CUI / Stack DIN replacement/ modify.Jeff

author: bostonman
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 26, 2022, 01:56:08 pm
content: I plan to dig deeper into this very soon as I've been busy with a few other projects.These have to be very cheap basic pins and sockets because I can't see Weller spending much money on custom and/or good quality.I'm finding the circuit design for this solder station, PCB, and parts layout, to be poor, so I'd imagine their pins/sockets aren't much better quality.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 26, 2022, 02:01:29 pm
content: And I think you’d be mistaken, then: AMP (which is what you have in yours) is top quality, and Weller’s recent stations do in fact use custom connectors.FWIW, this style of DIN connector is possibly the most common in the world on soldering stations, since Weller uses it (even if it is now a custom version), as well as Ersa and Pace, two very large manufacturers of soldering equipment. (I use Ersa and Pace at home, in fact.)

author: bostonman
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 28, 2022, 04:07:41 am
content: After re-reading this thread and digging deeper, I understand:AMP = Aircraft and Marine which TE (Tyco Electronics) owns (although I don't get how they own the product line since I assume anyone can make for aircrafts and marine).Amphenol is not the same as AMP as stated above.Having said this, I began searching for female pins that look similar and are sized, so far I only found 571-350417-5 (Mouser part number) which look similar.I guess my question is: based on TE stating this could be a custom part number and the feedback on here, am I to believe that I just can't get these and/or I need to try finding something that MAY fit my Weller station?

author: david77
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 28, 2022, 06:45:57 am
content: If you can't find the proper pin you could replace the whole socket using this:https://www.conrad.de/de/p/lumberg-71207060-din-rundsteckverbinder-flanschbuchse-kontakte-gerade-polzahl-num-6-silber-1-st-738157.html

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 28, 2022, 08:53:33 am
content: Quote from: bostonman on March 28, 2022, 04:07:41 am”Aircraft and Marine Products” isn’t adescription, it was thenameof a company that ultimately ended up in the hands of TE.Quote from: bostonman on March 28, 2022, 04:07:41 amCorrect, they’re competitors.Quote from: bostonman on March 28, 2022, 04:07:41 amI feel like I answered that in detail in previous replies. But here we go again:Whether the connector (and thus its contacts) was a custom part or a standard part when it was made, TE doesn’t make the contacts now.Because it’s a standard DIN connector, any number of companies make compatible connectors (though as stated, do not expect compatibility of individual connectorparts, like contacts, between manufacturers). So I would not expect the Amphenol contact to fit in your AMP housing. You can try, but no guarantees. But the whole Amphenol connector will definitely work as a replacement for the whole AMP connector. Part numbers were given already.

author: bostonman
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 28, 2022, 01:54:58 pm
content: QuoteYou did answer this in the previous replies, but I wasn't certain if you meant replace both, the solder station connector and soldering iron connector (which I think is overkill) or if you meant an entire connector will mate with the existing soldering iron connector; or if replacing only one doesn't have any guarantees (which seems most logical).Some of my confusion is that it's a 'standard' connector since you provided the part number (and corrected me on it being six-pins instead of the seven I thought), but maybe I interpreted it as the connector may still be the same, but not necessarily the pins/sockets. In this case, I should be able to compare the existing socket pin dimensions to what I'm measuring and take a stab at whether they are the same/similar.I do, however, understand that similar sockets should work from other companies, and it seems this is a simple socket pin because it has the locking wings and split end to expand for the male pin; doesn't seem it's too involved.As you can understand, buying and hoping a different set of socket pins isn't necessarily an issue providing I can find minimum quantities less than some ridiculous amount, but I also have to invest in the crimping tool. Once I discover the socket pin isn't compatible, I'm out the cost of the crimping tool too.This is why I wanted to double check my understanding of your replies.You seem to have much more experience with connectors where as my experience is sticking two together, and, if they mate, they are good. Sometimes when you know something well, it seems the other party should understand simple explanations very quickly too.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 28, 2022, 06:01:18 pm
content: Quote from: bostonman on March 28, 2022, 01:54:58 pm1. At no point has replacement of the mating connector on the soldering iron cord been brought up. Nobody’s talking about that.2. This is a standard bayonet-lock DIN connector. (DIN is the old national standards body of Germany.) It is not manufacturer-specific. A finished connector from one manufacturer will mate with a finished connector from another manufacturer, just like a USB plug will fit a USB port, regardless of who manufactured the connectors.3. The parts WITHIN a connectoraremanufacturer-specific.Quote from: bostonman on March 28, 2022, 01:54:58 pm4. All of the connectors being discussed are standard bayonet-lock DIN connectors.5. The AMP part in your station may have been a “standard part” (=regular AMP catalog part, not custom made), or it might have been custom made (as in, manufactured for a specific customer and not made available for general sale)to the standard bayonet-lock DIN standardfor Weller. We simply don’t know, and have no way of finding out.5, stated differently. As in, it’s possible Weller went to AMP and said “hey guys, we need standard bayonet-lock DIN connectors, you got any?” and then AMP says “no, we don’t, but we can make ‘em just for you.” Or maybe AMP sold them to everyone back then.6. Either way we don’t know, and it doesn’t matter, because AMP (now TE) definitely doesn’t sell those connectors now, so they can’t sell you parts for them.7. The part numbers I provided are for readily available substitute connectors from Amphenol, a different manufacturer who currently sells compatible connectors. These are “standard parts” from Amphenol because they sell them to anyone, right out of the catalog. I recommended solder connectors because it makes no sense to invest in a crimp tool for literally 6 contacts.Quote from: bostonman on March 28, 2022, 01:54:58 pm8. The “connector” means the whole thing. The contacts are part of the connector. (In the cases where they’re sold separately, we talk about the “housing” or “shell” and the “contacts” or “terminals”. The original connector in your station is such a connector: housing plus contacts.)Quote from: bostonman on March 28, 2022, 01:54:58 pm9. Not sure what you mean with existing vs. measured.10. The pin (as in, the actual male mating element) dimensions are defined by the DIN standard: 1.5mm diameter at whatever length it says. The dimensions of the female contact can be very different between connectors, as long as they’re designed to mate with that 1.5mm male pin.Quote from: bostonman on March 28, 2022, 01:54:58 pm11. Are you talking abouta) mating compatibility of the finished connectors, orb) compatibility when combining one manufacturer’s contacts in another manufacturer’s housing within the same connector?(a) is definitely provided. (b) is unlikely to be compatible (possible but unlikely: I looked at thedrawingof the Amphenol female crimp contacts and they’re substantially different from the AMP ones, and thus almost certainly would not mount securely in your existing AMP housing).Quote from: bostonman on March 28, 2022, 01:54:58 pm12. Do you have any idea how expensive crimp tools are?Unless you’ve already got access to the right tool, you shouldn’t even bethinkingof crimping any contacts. You could probably replace the soldering station several times over for the cost of the original tool!13. If you don’t already have access to the crimping tool, forget about a crimped connector and just replace the entire connector with a soldered version, using the part numbers I gave you in a prior reply.Quote from: bostonman on March 28, 2022, 01:54:58 pm14. Well… Yes, that is sometimes the case, but here it’s really been spelled out for you in excruciating detail!

author: bostonman
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 28, 2022, 11:41:32 pm
content: QuoteExisting meaning the catalog/datasheet dimensions versus what I measured with the calipers.QuoteI appreciate your responses and explanations. Some of what I've read obviously confused me a bit even though it was spelled out in excruciating detail, however, we are all a bit stubborn in our ways of learning. Mine so happens to be getting confused over terminology and at some points I got mixed up, other times I'm trying to make sure I fully understand before I waste time/money buying sockets. You have to admit, it can be confusing when you see AMP isn't Amphenol, but Aircraft and Marine, but it's now TE, etc...If I remember correctly (maybe I have my user names mixed up - therefore I apologize in advance), I helped you with a Cesium Atomic Clock some time back and you spent multiple emails reiterating that you were trying to get impossible specifications. I too had to painstakingly repeat myself on why you were wasting your time trying to achieve crazy accuracy.In either case, if we weren't stubborn, we wouldn't be on here seeking assistance, but I also hope I didn't tick off anyone with my confusion.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 29, 2022, 09:07:48 am
content: Nope, definitely not me, I’ve never done anything with cesium clocks!Anyhow, is the situation now clear for you, such that you can move forward with your repair with confidence? That was my goal here.No worries, I’m not ticked off at all!Yes, the names can get confusing. (I know that, years ago, I also naively assumed AMP was short for Amphenol, until I was reading wiki articles and realized they were unrelated.) It doesn’t help that, likely due to second-sourcing agreements, many companies have product lines that overlap a TON. For example, Bourns and Alps, which have drop-in replacements for most of each other’s potentiometers and encoders. Or Pomona and Johnson Controls (now named… something else?), whose banana plug cables are identical — did Pomona make them for Johnson, or are they second-source?FWIW, if I find myself confused by a text that isn’t making sense, I find it helpful to take a step back and go back and carefully re-read it multiple times — sometimes, dwelling on a term that isn’t making sense and pondering how it differs from what I’m expecting to hear will result in a “eureka!” moment of clarity.

author: bostonman
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 29, 2022, 02:01:44 pm
content: Actually, I should have looked at the country you're from because the person I exchanged messages with was from the US.On a side note, it wasn't a big deal, but this person was stubborn with trying to achieve unattainable specifications and I was using that example to point out that sometimes we get fixated on our own thoughts/desires and lose focus on the advice we are given.Sometimes I wonder how I'd manage some of the repairs I've performed if not for this forum.In any case, I should have enough to move forward. What I'm finding lately (this doesn't have anything to do with this thread or any other thread on here, but more general) is that projects I start can't get completed over simple things such as lack of responses from customer support, lack of product availability, etc...The reason I point this out: I have several projects in process and it's a spinning wheel of confusion; with each one seeming to dive into a rabbit hole. I'm uncertain if others are experiencing similar issues, but around here it seems lack of care from employees contributes to delays on my part. Plus what should be a simple repair ends up being a lengthily on going project.I think tonight I'll have time to devote towards this, however, I'm waiting for a Mouser shipment. The original issue with this iron (which I've exchange some messages in another thread about) is somewhat fixed, but believe the PIC has been damaged and one of the parts I'm waiting for from Mouser (it's currently in Texas and just began updating the shipping status after placing the order several days ago). If I can't program another PIC, then I can't worry about moving forward with the pins/sockets/connector and the iron may be junk anyway.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2022, 03:33:16 am
content: Quote from: bostonman on March 29, 2022, 02:01:44 pmYep, those things are extremely frustrating. Why do companies even bother putting up contact info when they have no intention of replying?Quote from: bostonman on March 29, 2022, 02:01:44 pmHah, don’t I understand the rabbit holes! 🤣 It’s an ongoing struggle for me to try and suppress my inner perfectionist and actuallyfinishanything!Quote from: bostonman on March 29, 2022, 02:01:44 pmAh. Hey, at least anything Weller sells for silly prices on the used market, so even selling it as a parts unit should get you something to apply towards something new and nicer.