Choosing between two oscilloscopes - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / beginners

author: mike_mike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 29, 2024, 05:23:57 pm
content: Hello. I would like to choose between Hantek DSO2C10 and the Uni-t UTD2102CL+ ?I saw on the forum a lot of information about the Hantek model but very little information about the Uni-t model. I can buy the DSO's at same price.I heard that there are a lot of bugs with the Hantek firmware, but I saw updates on their site that I could install. On the other hand, the Uni-t does not have any updates.What do you recommend ?The oscilloscope will be used to replace a Owon SDS1022.

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 29, 2024, 07:03:14 pm
content: I know your thread title is 'Choosing between two oscilloscopes' but I would look for deals on the Rigol DS1102Z-E too. There seem to be some good deals from time to time (currently £225 inc VAT UK), being based on the tried and tested DS1054Z chassis it has a good heritage. At 24Mpts, it has significantly more memory depth than either of the above (there seem to be some 64Mpts / 64kpts typos on various Uni-T listings), twice the sample rate of the Uni-T too. Yes, watch lots of reviews of the Hantek, there do seem to be some irritating bugs in the Hantek f/w (eg. the freeze when moving vertical trace position), I don't know how many of these have been fixed but Hantek support is poor.

author: Microcheap
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 29, 2024, 08:23:37 pm
content: I was looking at the SDS1022 specs that you currently own and it is a very basic device, but the other two options are entry levels models too and, in my opinion, are not a big step up.Unless you have a specific reason to buy another scope now, I would try to wait a bit and save to get a more modern model from Siglent or Rigol, for example. But, of course, only you can determine what your needs are and decide if you really need a more advanced oscilloscope.Now, between the Hantek and the Uni-t options only, the DSO2C10 has a bigger sample rate (1GSa/s vs only 500MSa/s of the UNI-T), more memory depth (8Mpts vs 64kpts), has serial decode options and you can easily have the function generator unlocked.The DSO2000 firmware is much more stable now and although Hantek's support is not stellar, it's not as bad as many people claim, at least in my experience.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 29, 2024, 10:47:35 pm
content: I wouldn't buy a 500MS/s oscilloscope like the UTD2102CL+ today.The Hantek is better in terms of specifications, but of course it is also a cheap device with a few rough edges.If you want the Hantek, buy the cheapest version from the cheapest dealer, e.g.here.

author: BillyO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 29, 2024, 10:59:21 pm
content: Quote from: mike_mike on October 29, 2024, 05:23:57 pmAnd probably never will. UNI-T have ZERO support.Quote from: mike_mike on October 29, 2024, 05:23:57 pmHave you looked at the Siglent SDS1102CML+ ? Not a whole lot more than the two things you are looking at but it's a real scope, with real support.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 29, 2024, 11:35:10 pm
content: Quote from: BillyO on October 29, 2024, 10:59:21 pmI would not recommend that.If you want to pay real money, don't go for the SDS1102CML+ for €355.81 but spend €70 more for theSDS802X HD.If you want to pay as little as possible, there is basically only the Hantek.

author: BillyO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 29, 2024, 11:44:31 pm
content: Quote from: Aldo22 on October 29, 2024, 11:35:10 pmIt's total crap. The SDS1102CML+ is not.Where are you seeing a price of €355.81? On siglent.eu the price is shown as €279.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 29, 2024, 11:54:23 pm
content: Quote from: BillyO on October 29, 2024, 11:44:31 pmNow it's starting again.You don't have a Hantek, I have one.I don't know what that scope did to you to make you hate it so much without owning it.It's a bit strange.Quote from: BillyO on October 29, 2024, 11:44:31 pmSame shop as the SDS802X HD link above.https://www.batronix.com/versand/oszilloskope/Siglent-SDS1102CML+.htmlVAT included.

author: BillyO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 30, 2024, 12:05:17 am
content: Quote from: Aldo22 on October 29, 2024, 11:54:23 pmNot strange at all. I did have one, for about 3 weeks and sent it back. I think I was even the first one according to what I've read on this forum. It is (as you well know) racked with problems that you and the others (especially DavidAlpha) over on the Hantek DSO2000 threads have kind of sorted out over a long period of time with practically no, if not zero, assistance from Hantek.I could not wait to get rid of it. Do you really expect people to buy the thing, then have to drag it through allTHISjust to get a working scope? Why not spend a few more dollars and get something that will work, and work well, right out of the box?

author: mike_mike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 30, 2024, 04:28:50 am
content: If I increase the budget, I could buy something like Uni-t UPO1102. I saw that this model have some kind of support from Uni-t like firmware upgrades on the uni-t site.The problem is that I can only buy from a single vendor, which is located in Poland. And this vendor does not sell Rigol or Siglent.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 30, 2024, 09:22:47 am
content: @BillyOYou don't have to “warn” me about the DSO2000.I own one. I paid $131 for it a year ago including shipping.It works well for me. I would buy it againat that price.It has a lot of features you have to discover first.The AWG alone is almost worth the $130.If I realize I need a better one, I'll buy a Siglent SDS804X HD and will not regret for a second having bought the DSO2000.So far the Hantek does everything I need though.So please stop bashing this poor thing!It is simply the lowest price category.I understand that it's not foryou.Quote from: BillyO on October 30, 2024, 12:05:17 amI don't know what you mean. I haven't had to do anything other than a firmware upgrade and to "liberate" the AWG.A large "community" is also a great advantage for any device or car or anything. Of course, bugs (and possibly solutions) come to light, but that's better than a thing that nobody talks about.And don't tell me Rigol etc. are free of bugs or have much better support.I have had questions answered by email from hantek.com.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 30, 2024, 09:31:17 am
content: Quote from: mike_mike on October 30, 2024, 04:28:50 amUPO1102 is certainly better in terms of specifications than UTD2102CL+, but I have not found any further information on it in this forum.There are a few videos on Youtube.It does not look bad!

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 30, 2024, 11:51:31 am
content: Quote from: mike_mike on October 30, 2024, 04:28:50 amThat's a shame, I was assuming that you would have access to Rigol.EU. It's curious that there are no video reviews of the UPO1102 - I only found one very short Uni-T one, it does show a really smooth looking X-Y mode though and decent looking UI. Looking at the datasheet, it has low 100uV noise and a maximum 1mV/div sensitivity. The Hantek is known for being a little noisy (which appears to come from the screen and isn't improved by additional PSU filtering). The UPO1102 also has protocol decoders that are missing from the lesser model (the Hantek, of course, inculdes this), non-interleaved sampling and a deeper memory than the Hantek (and Rigol). All things being equal (bug wise) it looks like a solid machine. The lack of videos is really odd.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 30, 2024, 12:02:50 pm
content: Btw. there is aUPO1102and aUPO1102CS.UPO1102 looks newer, but has otherwise quite similar specs (except Wfms/s).Just to avoid any confusion.

author: BillyO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 30, 2024, 01:52:56 pm
content: Quote from: Aldo22 on October 30, 2024, 09:22:47 amI can confirm that would be an excellent choice.Okay, I'll leave your Hantek alone

author: lokin4areason
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: October 30, 2024, 03:12:58 pm
content: have you searched online review(s) for the oscilloscope(s) or for any other suggestion(s) on other one s ?

author: radiolistener
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 30, 2024, 04:51:09 pm
content: I suspect both are crap and will be worse than original Owon which you want to replace...

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 30, 2024, 07:05:16 pm
content: Quote from: radiolistener on October 30, 2024, 04:51:09 pmWhat you "suspect", without any detail of backup information isn't really any help to anyone is it? You don't know what additional features the OP is looking for - I can see several that differentiate them from the Owon. In short, an utterly pointless post.

author: radiolistener
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 30, 2024, 10:55:33 pm
content: Quote from: Gyro on October 30, 2024, 07:05:16 pmWith a solid understanding of available oscilloscopes functionality, I can confidently say that I would not consider replacing the designated Owon model with mentioned alternatives like Hantek or Uni-T, as the Owon’s quality holds up well, even with its 20 MHz bandwidth.I just saw people who bought these "oscilloscopes" from hantek and I sincerely felt sorry for them that they threw away their money and got such a piece of crap. At the same time, I did not dare to tell them the truth, because I understood that it would hurt them to hear about their mistake.As a recommendation, I’d advise against considering oscilloscopes priced below $400, as they typically don’t provide adequate value for the cost. Instead, I suggest looking at entry-level models from reputable brands like Siglent or Rigol, which offer better performance and reliability in this range.Quote from: Gyro on October 30, 2024, 07:05:16 pmYour misunderstanding here is that you think I was uncertain due to my use of the phrase “I suspect”. But in reality, I’m well sure about what I said. I used “I suspect” wording here just to be more polite and avoid stupid discussion with these noobs who are ready to suggest better crap from several craps, they can talk that they see "nice features" and other marketing bullshit.Quote from: Gyro on October 30, 2024, 07:05:16 pmOn the contrary. I'm sure your post are utterly harmful, especially for newbies, because you suggesting to choose one of these craps.Notice that the topic starter didn’t ask for your opinion on "several features that differentiate them from the Owon". He asked for a recommendation.And my recommendation is not to buy either of these devices, as they’re simply not worth it.If I were in topic starter position, I would either stay with Owon or save up money for a more or less normal oscilloscope from Siglent (but definitely not CML models, old like mammoth bone as suggested above, they also just a crap).

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2024, 08:55:37 am
content: Quote from: radiolistener on October 30, 2024, 10:55:33 pmThe truth is that I see and measure everything I need to measure with this $130 “crap”.The truth is that I wouldn't have bought a benchtop scope at all if I'd had to pay €400 or more straight away.The truth is that the DSO2000 has opened up new worlds for me (protocol decoding, fully documented SCPI interface -> bode plot script, AM/FM AWG, measurable FFT, many triggering options etc. etc.). Maybe it has something of a experiment box. So what?The truth is that I've had almost a year of fun with the DSO2000 now and that's definitely worth $130.The truth is that if I paid $300 more, I wouldn't be getting any use out of it right now (And then I still wouldn't have an AWG).The truth is that there are products in different price categories and there are obviously people who just can't accept that even though a VW Beetle is not a Porsche, it will still get you where you want to go.You only make a mistake if you pay too much for a cheap thing. $130 shipped is not too much for the DSO2000.Perhaps we could ask the topic starter why he wants to replace his Owon SDS1022, or what improvement he is looking for.Maybe it's just broken?Or maybe the 100MS/s is not enough for him, because an omniscient "radiolistener" once said that any scope with less than 1GS/s or better 2GS/s is useless?

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2024, 10:34:43 am
content: Quote from: radiolistener on October 30, 2024, 10:55:33 pmI have absolutely no issue with the Owon, it is, after all, effectively the desktop version of the USB VDS1022 that I started a (now very long) review and teardown thread on back in 2015. Sadly it lacks the ability to use Florent's alternativefirmwaresoftware but the stock UI is fine, as is basic performance. Both versions make good very beginner scopes (the term 'entry level' has become very distorted here, not helped by silly statements like "I’d advise against considering oscilloscopes priced below $400, as they typically don’t provide adequate value for the cost". Since when did an arbitrary $ value become a technical order of merit?*If you look at my first reply in this thread (in which the OP is asking about two specific scopes), my response was 'non of the above' and pointed him at the decent Rigol. Unfortunately he doesn't seem to be able to source this. The second Uni-T scope that the OP later identified actually looks to be a decent scope, at least as far as I can see from the datasheet, manual, and limited videos. It has all the features and performance that you would expect from a 'more recent entry level scope'. Certainly a lot better than their two originally questioned ones.I agree with Aldo22 that it would be extremely helpful to know what additional features the OP wants, but I would lay odds that deep memory is probably high on the list as it is something that is conspicuously lacking on the Owon. I would probably put that ahead of bandwidth, but let's see what the OP comes back with.In the meantime, please try to avoid the one line 'they're all crap!' type replies. You're not the only one with a solid understanding (and long professional use) of scopes.EDIT:*Typically a >$400 'forum entry level' scope has 4 channels, that is a functional choice rather than a quality one, and the scopes they listed are all 2 channel.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2024, 11:26:30 am
content: Quote from: Gyro on October 31, 2024, 10:34:43 amI think the most important question is whether he uses the scope professionally and / or on a daily basis.I wouldn't recommend the DSO2000 or similar for that. It is an exciting experiment box, but not a professional tool, that is quite clear.The handling is not great.

author: mgroz
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: November 01, 2024, 03:16:02 pm
content: Personally, product support needs to weigh in as well. I own both Hantek and Rigol scopes and utilize SCPI for program control. Hantekhas "absolutely zero support". They will not respond to email, phone and have outdated manuals. My experience with Rigol is not only email support but a human being I can speak to.Spend the extra $$$ or be prepared for

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2024, 03:27:35 pm
content: Quote from: mgroz on November 01, 2024, 03:16:02 pmNot true. Just ask zhangqiang@hantek.com. I got replies from this address....Best regardsHanHan ZhangqiangQingdao Hantek Electronic Co.,Ltd.Add:35# Building, No. 780 Baoyuan Road,Qingdao City, Shandong Province, China 266114Website:www.hantek.comEmail:zhangqiang@hantek.comTel:+86-0532-55678770-662And that is more than I ever expected.Do you really think you get personal support for a highly complex $130 device? What world do you live in?But you get that with Hantek. Maybe not every time, but...Are you all retailers who want to sell Rigol or Siglent and therefore bash Hantek?These are completely different price ranges. Nobody claims that the cheap Hanktek products are equivalent to Rigol or Siglent, these are different prices for different needs.Why do you want to sell people expensive devices when cheaper ones would most likely be enough for them?It's getting ridiculous.

author: u666sa
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2024, 06:07:06 pm
content: Quote from: mike_mike on October 29, 2024, 05:23:57 pmI was looking at DSO2C10, ended up buying Siglent SDS1104X-E.UNI-T is also not serious.You buy either Siglent or Rigol. That's it.SDS1104X-E was a good choice sometime back. Now there is a better choice, I don't know what it is, find out. That choice vs similar offering from Rigol, that's your choice.

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2024, 08:17:29 pm
content: Quote from: u666sa on November 01, 2024, 06:07:06 pmThe problem is that the OP doesn't seem to be able to buy either. I'm sure they must have a good reason for that but I have no idea what it it, even Amazon sell Rigol (not Siglent though), I don't know about Ali. It currently seems insoluble though.

author: BillyO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2024, 08:20:51 pm
content: Quote from: Gyro on November 01, 2024, 08:17:29 pmIn North America Amazon sell Siglent.

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2024, 08:28:05 pm
content: Ah, a UK / EU(?) thing then.... Actually, Amazon UK have more Siglent items than when I looked a few months ago (irrc, the only hits I got were screen protectors)

author: BillyO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2024, 08:33:55 pm
content: Only guessing, but I think the OP may be getting a deal from someone they know. I just don't see how either of the scopes he's looking at is much better than what he has.Honestly I think he should save his money for a time longer and get the Siglent SDS804X HD, or similar modern scope.

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2024, 08:48:33 pm
content: The more expensive of the two Uni-Ts is the only 'possible'. It is pretty featured on paper, eg. big 56Mpt memory, that doesn't get cut in half when you enable both channels, colour graded display like a Siglent etc. What the downsides are is pretty unknown though.Unless the OP comes back with more info on needed features and issues, it's hard to say. If he could get a demo arranged, it would help a lot.

author: u666sa
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2024, 08:55:11 pm
content: Romania is like European Union, I was there recently. They have busses going all over the union, to and from Bucharest on flexibus, you can even take bus to harkov ukraine like nothing's happening. Busses there are more reliable than trains, lul. So Eleshop is accessible. I just checked the price, it is 418 euros, which is like 460 bucks for siglent which cost 399 plus tax in the U.S.. Still, cheaper than ordering it from the U.S., paying the tax, having it shipped, then paying the customs.Hantek could be really tasty because of its price. You can get hantek from official store on ali for right under 200 bucks.So yea, choices.When I had to make my choices, I watched a ton of youtube videos. Guys with hanteks had to modify them to take care of the heat so that it won't glitch. Then someone on these forums told me it's all in vain, it would glitch anyway. I believed those words.I suggest spending a bit more money and getting Siglent or Rigol. Not Uni-T, not hantek, not fnirsi. Save some cash, and order a good tool. If you want something cheap now, without waiting, good oscilloscope is OWON HDS2102S for around 180 bucks, it does its job well.

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2024, 09:04:54 pm
content: Quote from: u666sa on November 01, 2024, 08:55:11 pmApart from being a handheld - which is definitely a go/no-go decision for the OP, much as I like low end Owons, they are persistently dogged by very small memory against the competiton - In the case of the HDS2102S, only 8kpts, barely more than he has now. The only thing it gives is more bandwidth / sample rate.Personally I wouldn't put my money there.P.S. I see that the OP is reading... just not writing.

author: BillyO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2024, 09:11:23 pm
content: Quote from: Aldo22 on October 31, 2024, 08:55:37 amActually it is!Quote

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2024, 09:24:04 pm
content: Quote from: u666sa on November 01, 2024, 08:55:11 pmCurrent models have no thermal problems. I have had my DSO2000 for a year and have never had a heat problem. Hantek once made some changes to the power supply (8V -> 7V afair).But I admit that I hardly ever leave it running for more than an hour.It boots up again in 12 seconds, so there's no need to leave it running all day.Quote from: u666sa on November 01, 2024, 08:55:11 pmI don't know what makes you think that.Hantek DSO2000 offers much more for less money.1GS/s vs 500MS/s and 8Mpts vs 8kpts for example.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2024, 09:26:45 pm
content: Quote from: BillyO on November 01, 2024, 09:11:23 pmOK, 1:0 for you.

author: mike_mike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2024, 10:09:27 pm
content: Hello. I read all of yours replies, and now I am thinking about a solution to get a Rigol. If not possible, probably I would stick to Hantek or Uni-t.I had a few months ago some question about my Uni-t meter and I asked directly Uni-t on Facebook, and they asked me to send photos of the problems via email, to one person named Ray Zeng.Unfortunately, I didn't found the other messages in my mail. I have only a photo of the Facebook message.I watched a video of Uni-t UPO1204 and the capacitors in PSU looked odd to me because they were no major brand one.EDIT: Are the new versions of Hantek better that the older ones ? did they installed heatsinks on the chips ?

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2024, 10:28:32 pm
content: Quote from: mike_mike on November 01, 2024, 10:09:27 pmMaybe I'm just lucky or blind, but I've never seen thermal problems with this Hantek.Quote from: mike_mike on November 01, 2024, 10:09:27 pmNo, it doesn't seem to be necessary afaics.Btw. You know that UPO1204 is almost €700?

author: radiolistener
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2024, 10:42:47 pm
content: Quote from: Aldo22 on November 01, 2024, 03:27:35 pmNo, I'm not a retailer and have nothing to do with selling or marketing. Hantek and Siglent/Rigol are not equivalent, very not equivalent.If money is a concern, you can find a previous model or a second-hand unit for 100-200 USD. However, Siglent/Rigol provides a much better scope, and it’s really worth the extra money.All what is worse than Siglent SDS1102X is just a toy. Like all these FNIRSI, HANTEK, UNI-T, etc. This is not oscilloscope but a toy. Perhaps this toy might be useful and interesting for school-children, but it's definitely not suitable for real use. It can show you something but it is very limited and suffers from many issues, it don't worth to spend money on that crap.

author: mike_mike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2024, 10:43:43 pm
content: Yes, I know that the price of upo1204 is high, but I post the review only for information.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2024, 10:56:52 pm
content: Quote from: radiolistener on November 01, 2024, 10:42:47 pmNot in Switzerland.I've been watching the second-hand market for a long time.I've never been able to find a comparable second-hand model for the CHF 124 I paid for the Hantek.As I said, I'm happy with the Hantek and I still can't believe what it offers for the money.However, I am aware of its limitations and quirks.Don't expect perfection for this price and all is fine.If I realize that I want to measure or see something with my scope that I can't measure or see with it, then I'll buy a Siglent, I've said that before.But so far that hasn't happened to me and that's why the DSO2000 is the right thing for me at the moment.For others it may not be enough, that may well be the case.Btw. please stop using the word “crap”. It's not informative, just insulting.

author: radiolistener
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2024, 12:06:53 am
content: Quote from: Aldo22 on November 01, 2024, 10:56:52 pmHm... As I know, Switzerland is known for its pretty high salaries, averaging around 8k USD per month. Isn't it? The average salary in my country ranges from 200 to 300 USD per month, with an average pension of approximately 55 USD. We have tax about 40% (18%+22%+5%) which is probably the same as your. Your housing is of course more expensive. But this means that your income is about 20 to 30 times higher than in my country. Given that prices and tax are similar, I am just curious why you are considering so low-quality device simply to save 100-200 USD?When I see someone in my country purchasing a Hantek device, I can understand the reasoning behind it. However, when a Swiss citizen makes the same choice, I find myself a bit confused... Why?

author: mgroz
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: November 02, 2024, 01:02:58 am
content: Quote from: Aldo22 on November 01, 2024, 03:27:35 pm

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2024, 08:05:22 am
content: Quote from: radiolistener on November 02, 2024, 12:06:53 amBecause it's good enough for my purpose and because it's so cheap that I don't have to think twice about buying it.I'm not a professional, not even an advanced hobbyist.I don't like buying expensive things that I can only use 10% of their capabilities just to watch them gather dust.It does what I want to do with it and that's what matters.And it can do so much more than all those scopemeters that are fashionable now and cost a similar amount of money.Perhaps you should compare the DSO2C10 with these devices anyway, because that is the price category.Isn't the “Test Equipment” forum full of posts about cheap things bought just to have a new toy?Do I really need the third clamp meter / SMD tweezer / transistor tester or the tenth DMM?Would I pay “real” money for a NanoVNA or TinySA if it wasn't dirt cheap? Do people seriously need that?Would many people pay $5000+ for that functionality if these little thingies didn't exist?No, they buy them like a toy and because the price doesn't bother them.Btw.can you tell me specifically what basic things I can do with the $450 Siglent/Rigol that I can't do with the Hantek?I mean basic hobbyist stuff, not “find a single 2ps glitch over 24 hours” or something.Maybe that will convince me?As I said, maybe one day I'll buy a “better” scope if I see a benefit in it.But I will certainly never regret buying the DSO2000. I will keep it anyway, if only because of the AWG.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2024, 08:16:22 am
content: Quote from: mgroz on November 02, 2024, 01:02:58 amYou should have read eevblog first.The DSO2D15 has the same hardware as the DSO2C10.Only the DSO2C10 for about $150 is worth considering if you want the cheapest benchtop scope.I wouldn't pay $250 for the DSO2000.For that kind of money, I'd add a little extra for a Siglent.It's all about the price.

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2024, 11:18:03 am
content: Quote from: mike_mike on November 01, 2024, 10:43:43 pmThe UPO1204 is a 200MHz, 4 channel version. That will obviously push up the price significantly. Dropping to 100MHz would probably reduce it by a fair amount - I don't know if they do a UPO1104 for that? Of course for 2 channel (100MHz) there is the UPO1102 that you already mentioned. As Aldo22 said on the previous page, the UPO1xxx is more recent than the older CS version. Visually you can see three additional navigation buttons under the Multifunction knob, the CS version doesn't have these.Regarding the capacitors in the PSU, I missed the brand in the teardown video, but maybe not unusual - Rigol uses all CapXon caps in the PSU of the DS1054Z for instance (I don't know what they use in their latest, you'll have to watch Dave's teardown video).From the teardown video, generally, apart from the difficulty getting to the LCD ribbon, it looks very (!) comprehensively screwed together and screened. There is a lot of linear regulation on the main board too.Kerry Wong did an accompanying review video, again of the 200MHz 4 channel version (but presumably the same s/w features)...Not pushing the Uni-T, just for information.

author: radiolistener
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2024, 07:00:18 pm
content: Quote from: Aldo22 on November 02, 2024, 08:05:22 amFor example with siglent you can look at high frequency signal modulated with low frequency with no aliasing. With hantek you will get incorrect waveform due to aliasing much earlier due to low memory. And many other things.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2024, 09:24:30 pm
content: Quote from: radiolistener on November 02, 2024, 07:00:18 pmThank you. I am not quite sure if I understand you correctly.On the attached screenshots you see a 20MHz carrier with 1kHz AM.This comes from the TinySA, hence the steps.Is that what you mean?

author: mike_mike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2024, 12:03:01 pm
content: Finally I ordered Rigol DS1102Z-E for about 260 Euro.

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2024, 01:25:31 pm
content: Quote from: mike_mike on November 03, 2024, 12:03:01 pmAn unexciting but solid choice - It's the one I've got. The UI seems as good or better (measurement selection) than most, all options come unlocked.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2024, 01:30:49 pm
content: Quote from: mike_mike on November 03, 2024, 12:03:01 pmCongratulations! Certainly not a bad choice.These are cheap now, even inSwitzerland.I also briefly considered it, but it wouldn't be the right move for me atm.By the way: there are also complaints about Rigol, not just Hantek.I think the more popular a device is, the more grumbling there is in the comments.https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/rigol-ds1102z-e-vs-ds1202z-e/msg4768994/#msg4768994

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2024, 01:50:45 pm
content: Quote from: Aldo22 on November 03, 2024, 01:30:49 pmI've never got the fuss about the 5ns/div bug. Sure, they ought to fix it, the traceisdimmer but you can still see it ok. I did replace the fan with a Gelid Silent 5 one, which makes it much quieter. You need to strip back the correct one of the 3 wires, crimp a connector (or patch on a spare one) to the other two and get the warranty label off in one piece though.

author: radiolistener
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2024, 08:51:46 am
content: Quote from: Aldo22 on November 02, 2024, 09:24:30 pmI'm referring to the case where an incorrect waveform appears due to aliasing. This effect occurs when the time scale is increased (more time per division) until the oscilloscope starts to reduces its sample rate.In your first screenshot, the sample rate is 1 GS/s, so aliasing issues won’t occur at this time scale for frequencies up to 500 MHz.However, on the second screenshot, the sample rate has been reduced to 1.25 MS/s, which brings aliasing into play at this time scale.The most effective way to observe this aliasing effect is by using a square wave with a frequency above the Nyquist limit (half of the sample rate). In this situation, the oscilloscope will display an incorrect frequency for the square wave. With the settings shown in your second screenshot, try a square wave above 625 kHz (for example 625 kHz, 1.25 MHz, 2.5 MHz, etc) the oscilloscope will display very incorrect frequency waveform.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2024, 11:19:18 am
content: Quote from: radiolistener on November 04, 2024, 08:51:46 amOK, but isn't that a general phenomenon?You cannot select the sampling rate directly on the DSO2000. It is always an automatic result of the selected memory depth and the time scale.In the screenshot you can see the scenario you mentioned.It's true that it doesn't show the waveform, but it's very obvious that it's not what I want to see.The (I think hardware-) frequency counter still shows the correct frequency (625.060kHz).When I see something like this, I intuitively turn the S/div knob or increase the memory depth or press “Auto Set”.So far this has never led me into error.What is theHantek specificproblem?

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2024, 04:25:08 pm
content: By the way, for complete idiots like me, the DSO2000 also has a continuous auto mode (Horiz. and Vert.).I don't normally use it, but it's helpful if you want to use the scope as a DMM replacement via SCPI, as it always works in the optimum range (like auto range).I don't have a DMM from which I could read the data on the PC, so I use the scope for that.I find it quite useful and sufficiently accurate, considering it's "total crap" for most people here.

author: mike_mike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2024, 08:10:20 pm
content: Today I received the DSO and I am wondering which software should I install in my PC for downloading jpg or png screenshots from the DSO using USB cable ?I saw that on the site is mentioned UltraSigma and UltraScope but if I set the image type to JPG then the settings are not saved, and it is still saving the screenshots in bmp format, but I need jpg or png.

author: radiolistener
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2024, 09:31:35 pm
content: Quote from: Aldo22 on November 04, 2024, 11:19:18 amYou showed the simple case where user wants to reduce time scale, but this is not the only case when this effect can occur. It is possible to get nice square waveform on the oscilloscope, but it will be completely incorrect because actual frequency is much higher than you will see.Even experienced user can be confused, I often catch this despite the fact that I well know about this issue and how/why it happens.Quote from: Aldo22 on November 04, 2024, 11:19:18 amThe problem is that it shows just a filled square instead of signal details, because it don't have digital phosphor. It has too small sampling memory and as result it leads to bad experience with low frequency signals. And as I remember, it has some input frontend issues.Low sensitivity, noise, low speed, etc. This is just a box of issues, but not oscilloscope.For car repairs and school demonstration, such an oscilloscope may be suitable, but it is very expensive and bulky for this, although you can find a cheaper and more mobile alternative. For electronics, it is better to take something more or less worthwhile from the brands.

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2024, 10:40:14 pm
content: Quote from: mike_mike on November 05, 2024, 08:10:20 pmSorry, I can't help you with Rigol s/w as I run Linux. I just use a USB stick for screen captures. For best image quality for reasonable size it's best to use png (via the stick anyway).

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2024, 11:52:45 pm
content: Quote from: radiolistener on November 05, 2024, 09:31:35 pmYou always try to convince people of problems with cheap devices where there are no problems.You've already done that to me in the Zeeweii thread.I'm not completely stupid, I know what I want to measure and roughly what signal to expect.The Hantek is a perfectly adequate oscilloscope for beginners/hobbyists.I have had the device for a year now and there is no such problem.Why are you doing this? What do you get out of it?Are you getting money from Siglent or Rigol for spreadingFUD?It is not helpful. Please stop, it's getting boring.

author: mike_mike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2024, 05:18:19 am
content: I just found this app which helps me to connect to the DSO and download the screenshots in jpeg or png format.https://github.com/FireDeveloper/Fire-SCPI

author: radiolistener
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2024, 07:14:23 am
content: Quote from: Aldo22 on November 05, 2024, 11:52:45 pmCompanies pay people to promote and defend their products. It's easy to spot such "bloggers" – they advertise low-quality products, claiming they're thrilled with how cheap and functional they are. These people won’t tell the truth because they're paid to lie. You'll easily spot them, as most reviews aren't done for free. The main lie they promote is that such low-quality products are supposedly well-suited for beginners or hobbyists.I won't take money to deceive people, which allows me to tell the truth as it is. Hantek is very bad choice from technical point of view.I can tell you many issues of Siglent and Rigol oscilloscopes, but even with all their issues, they still worth to buy instead of Hantek, even if they are twice expensive.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2024, 10:23:38 am
content: Quote from: radiolistener on November 06, 2024, 07:14:23 amThen don't buy it!But please stop spoiling people's hobby.That has religious overtones with you, whether Zeeweii or Hantek or...But it doesn't help! It doesn't help anyone!Both the small Zeeweii and the Hantek are great tools in their field and for their price if you don't pay more than necessary (of course you should pay attention to that).If this category doesn't interest you, then buy in another category.It's as simple as that.But don't warn me about devices that I've been perfectly happy with for over a year.What's the point?By the way, the TS has now bought a Rigol, which is great.You no longer need to “warn” him about your imagined problems.

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2024, 01:29:52 pm
content: I have to agree. There are many informative threads on the Hantek on this forum covering all operational features, hacking, bugs etc. in detail. There are also many video reviews covering operation and internal construction. Any purchaser should do their own research before buying a piece of equipment and there is a wealth of information available.I also don't see any reason to 'rub somebody's nose in it' for owning one, just because it is cheaper and less perfect than the competition (and that's a game that can be played forever more!). It is what it is, and what it is, is very well documented, so give it a rest @radiolistener!The OP's problem, apart from inexperience, was lack of the same level of information on one of the scopes he was being offered - before expanding his radar to other manufacturers. That issue has been well and truly resolved! Actually, after seeing Kerry Wong's videos on the more expensive of the two Uni-Ts, I was quite intrigued by some of the features, but I'm not in the market right now and I have some reservations with what I saw of the UI that can only be judged hands-on. Anyway, it's somebody else's turn to take a risk and do a full write-up on here!

author: mike_mike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2024, 09:23:34 am
content: I notified that if I set the trigger to auto and the memory depth is set at 600k or below, then if triggering to the LM555 output (the LM555 is from the psu tester) the waveform doesn't stabilize. But if changing the trigger to normal or set the memory depth above 600k then the waveform is stabilized. Is this normal ?

author: xavier60
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2024, 09:55:54 am
content: Quote from: mike_mike on November 07, 2024, 09:23:34 amIf the 555 is still running at ~18Hz, adjusting the Hold-off might help.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2024, 11:10:24 am
content: Quote from: mike_mike on November 07, 2024, 09:23:34 amNow that you've opted for the Rigol, I'd ask in the thread for that particular model, otherwise soon no one here will understand what it's all about.https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/rigol-ds1102z-e/

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2024, 02:05:20 pm
content: It would also be helpful to look through Dave's videos on scope use and anything on the DS1054Z (which Dave probably uses for most videos as it was his recommendation in past years) as the DS1102Z-E is basically the 2 channel 100MHz unlocked version of that scope - but yes, trigger hold-off should help, maybe reduce the bandwidth too in case of high frequency noise pickup.

author: mike_mike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2024, 08:36:44 pm
content: Quote from: xavier60 on November 07, 2024, 09:55:54 amI tried to set the Hold-off at different values but it doesn't help.I wrote in the dedicated DS1102Z-E topic.