This is why we should all leave the EU - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 11:53:45 am
content: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-28878432I mean seriously ? what version of prick dreamed this up ? where did they get their technical background ?

author: Yago
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 12:14:11 pm
content: Quote from: Simon on August 21, 2014, 11:53:45 amThis bit made me wonder:"No models made by Dyson are affected, as all the motors on their machines are below 1600w."How did they come up with that threshold that suits our "national inventor champeen" so well?

author: lowimpedance
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 12:22:40 pm
content: And in three years it will be 900W , eventually only a broom will be legal.Don't worry this will spread, so no point in leaving!.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 12:28:19 pm
content: Quote from: Simon on August 21, 2014, 11:53:45 amMakes sense.Because a vacuum cleaner is a device that it typically left on for many hours every day. Oh, wait...

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 12:29:21 pm
content: OK, I'm using the vacuum cleaner for about 10 minutes every week. So I'll save about 3.5KWh over a year going from a 2KW to a 1600W. That is about one euro per year.Totally worth it.

author: bookaboo
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 12:29:24 pm
content: 1600w is plenty, those henry hoovers are 1200w as it is, then you have all the Dysons plus their clones.900w might be pushing things a bit though.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 12:35:53 pm
content: Quote from: NANDBlog on August 21, 2014, 12:29:21 pmNot factoring in that a less powerful unit might potentially not do as good a job, and therefore require to be on for longer...

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 12:37:58 pm
content: Lol, what's the big deal? It's a vacuum cleaner, they are barely used. Sheesh.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 12:38:13 pm
content: There are various designs and some are better than others. The dust filled test comment is very valid. I wash my filter on my 2KW vacuum cleaner regularly and i notice the difference as it blocks and yes it just takes longer or i waste a whole load of time and power before realizing that it needs cleaning.This really is not a priority for the EU it's a low usage device. I'm guessing that the math around how much power/air flow is needed to clean "x" amount is pretty constant, there will be little room for manauver. At 900W it will be a waste of time using the unit or they will be so poorly made that they will fail prematurely damaging the environment even more.The EU should legislate for quality of construction and designed lifespan if they want to cut emmissions. But no, no legislation cares about quality and the amount of stuff landing in landfill.

author: DenzilPenberthy
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 12:40:41 pm
content: Err, the sort of prick who thinks energy efficiency in mass-market appliances is a good thing. Presumably Dyson have already put in the effort in this regard which is why their vacuums don't have such powerful motors in.If you want to be nationalistic about it, this is a good thing because it makes Dyson more competitive.Are you going to go crying to Nigel Farage about how you can't go and buy a new traction engine because it won't meet Euro 6 emissions regs or you can't cook toast on your bedside lamp?

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 12:43:34 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on August 21, 2014, 12:35:53 pmAnd not to mention that the 2KW unit has a slideing potentiometer to make it "eco friendly".

author: bookaboo
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 12:45:04 pm
content: Quote from: Simon on August 21, 2014, 12:38:13 pm+1 to this, I'd love to see something like a minimum 3-year warranty on all consumer goods. Start getting things built to last again.

author: ctz
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 12:50:02 pm
content: Quote from: Simon on August 21, 2014, 11:53:45 amthe actual docs:http://ec.europa.eu/smart-regulation/impact/ia_carried_out/docs/ia_2013/swd_2013_0240_en.pdfhttp://ec.europa.eu/smart-regulation/impact/ia_carried_out/docs/ia_2013/swd_2013_0241_en.pdf(summary of first document)http://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:32013R0666(actual law)http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2010/2617/contents/made(UK law from adoption of EU regulation)It seems pretty reasonable and well thought-through to me. It seems intuitively wrong that hoovers across the EU use more power than the whole of Denmark, and produce more emissions than washing machines and dishwashers. This at a time when other household devices have been becoming more efficient (eg computers are drastically more efficient than 15 years ago) hoovers have been getting worse by 2.5% PA.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 12:50:12 pm
content: I'm certainly not a UKIP supporter, they are just headcases that are jumping on a band wagon. I don't have too much obnjection to the principle of the EU but when you stuff like this coming out of it and all of the other pointless crap then clearly it's a waste of our time and money

author: DenzilPenberthy
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 12:52:32 pm
content: Quote from: Simon on August 21, 2014, 12:50:12 pmso you've read through all the documents linked to by ctz above then? Or is this based on a Daily Mail headline version of events?

author: wagon
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 12:55:49 pm
content: We have a Kirby. It's about 15years old, still works as well as it did when it was new. The only repairs it's had are a minor gearbox repair and a lead repair (I ran over and damaged the lead). Made to last, but not cheap.

author: PA0PBZ
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 01:04:26 pm
content: I don't think it is a bad idea to make manufacturersthinkabout their products instead of throwing in some energy hungry monster and call it 'solved'.

author: bookaboo
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 01:08:26 pm
content: Quote from: ctz on August 21, 2014, 12:50:02 pmFrom the summary:QuoteSounds like they have a valid case.

author: 22swg
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 01:33:10 pm
content: This is like the regulations to reduce the toilet flush to 6 Ltr of water, now I guess most of us have to flush twice... well done EU.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 01:55:44 pm
content: Err it's based on the BBC "interpretation" i originally posted. No i have not read those doc's as if I have time. The question is, is the power consumption of vacuum cleaners just been limited ? will this limit be practical ? I'm a very ecological minded person, but i also look at the bigger picture.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 01:57:57 pm
content: Quote from: mojo-chan on August 21, 2014, 01:54:15 pmThen the rules should be about using agitators, you really think manufacturers use more power just to spend more money on motors ?

author: Rufus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 02:09:26 pm
content: Quote from: ctz on August 21, 2014, 12:50:02 pmDenmark is a little country with a population lower than London - your intuition is failing. Heating water to wash things requires a lot of energy. The other point never considered in these bullshit justifications is for half the year heat not produced by a vacuum cleaner will be replaced by central heating systems.Quote from: ctz on August 21, 2014, 12:50:02 pmPower consumption is not a measure of efficiency. Look at their numbers another way and vacuum cleaner usage in the EU consumes 1.27 trillion man hours which is about 256 times more than that available from the entire Danish workforce. What a terrible waste of human life the equivalent of 1.8 million 80 year lifetimes annually.The efficiency I want from a vacuum cleaner is measured by how long I need to spend using it and an hour of my life is worth a crap load more than a unit of electricity.Eco green tossers are happy for us to sacrifice our lives on the alter of eco green tosserness. They would prefer us to use brooms.The EU gave an army of unelected bureaucrats and barely elected politicians the power to make it happen.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 02:17:10 pm
content: Being ecological (green) does not have to be such a problem. It becomes a problem when knee jerk policies are inacted in the name of being green without looking at the overall picture.My sister bought a nice little 700W vacum cleaner, did not work very well and broke down after 3 months........ is that the EU's idea of saving the planet ? or lining manufacturers, importers and retailers pockets ?

author: GK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2014, 02:18:57 pm
content: Quote from: Rufus on August 21, 2014, 02:09:26 pmThis is exactly what I do, ever since I ripped out all of my shitty carpet and had floating floor boards installed. Best thing I ever did in the house.