Finally buying proper equipment to start my bench (on a tight budget) - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / beginners

author: czbaterka
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2025, 09:45:19 am
content: So I finally got around to buying equipment and I want to share it with you guys before buying everything to make sure I am not doing some stupid decisionsFor a long time now, I plan to work on some projects related to my house smart home automation. I am planning to build my own CAN bus based network (between actors and sensors) from gound up as I am sick of Zigbee (and similar) based pre-made stuff. I will be mainly working on smart PWM dimmers, heater actors, blind controllers, temp sensors, fan controllers and similar.I also want to get into building buck converters (low voltage ones for now, but maybe some switching power supplies in future) and learning audio amplifiers.So I am currently planning to buy those devices to start my workbench:OscilloscopeRigol DHO804 (with plan to hack it to support CAN, SPI, etc. decoding)Reasoning: I like the price, size, ability to operate it as floating device, Android OS (USB devices support, HDMI, ability to potentially develop my own USB LA and make an Android app for it)Alternatives I was also considering: Siglent SDS804X - I was originally about to buy that one because of the higher sampling rate, "better brand" and built-in LA, but it costs more and dont have the other pros of the Rigol. I know that there are more minor pros in the Siglent like lower fan noise and faster boot time but those are not dealbreaker for me.MultimeterUNI-T UT-139I actually already bought that one last month. I did some research and came to conclusion that it is good basic multimeter for that price. I originally wanted to go with the EEVBlog edition BM786 but it seemed as too much money for features I will probably not use + the fact that the precision between those cheap multimeters is almost the same.PS: The probes are trash tho. I will be buying some gold plated ones.AWGDGE2035/DGE2070I know that there were some flaws mentioned here on forum about the OWON units but afaik they were fixed by fw update?I am not sure if I will go with the 35MHz or the 70MHz version, but I think that I dont need anything fancy for my purpose. I just want to be able to generate some signals to test stuff like PWM controllers, audio amplifiers and switching power supplies.I was also considering UTG932E/UTG962E but those have almost double the price and seems to be similar to the OWON ones.Power supplyRIDEN® RK6006 module + some switching power supplyI just want some programmable power supply. I will be pairing it with some standard switching power supply unit from Banggood. I think I dont mind the potential voltage ripples that it will produce as I am not planning to get into audio stuff atm.This should be good for general use right?After I buy those, I will be probably also buying some cheap USB logic analyzer for my PC and current probes for the scope.Is there anything else I should buy for my lab bench which is essential?Do you guys have any comments to my picks?Thanks in advance!EDIT: Oops, forgot to add power supply to the list.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2025, 10:07:14 am
content: Quote from: czbaterka on February 18, 2025, 09:45:19 amNot really...DC accuracy:BM786: 0.03% + 2d (60 000 counts)UT139: 0.5%+2dThe Zoyi ZT-225 is most bang for the buck for low energy applications (0.05%+3d, 25 000 counts)

author: czbaterka
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2025, 02:26:22 pm
content: Yeah sorry I was actually comparing it to BM235 before. It may have a little better accuracy but it was not worth the higher price and need to buy it from different country.

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2025, 05:11:58 pm
content: Soldering iron\station ?

author: BillyO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2025, 05:46:09 pm
content: Too bad you bought the UNI-T. There are dozens of much better meters for less money.One example would be the Habotest HT118E: 20,000 counts, DC accuracy 0.08% + 5d, under $33.

author: armandine2
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2025, 07:49:54 pm
content: Quote from: czbaterka on February 18, 2025, 09:45:19 am... thanks for sharing, it's not what i bought, but that's not very strange.Sometime ago I heard a consumer affairs piece on the radio about how well the people who put produce in supermarkets know their intended purchasers - i.e. much better than their buyers know their products.

author: czbaterka
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2025, 08:34:15 pm
content: Quote from: osmax_br on February 18, 2025, 05:11:58 pmI have the Ifixit Fixhub which was gifted to me and I am quite happy with it for now

author: czbaterka
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2025, 08:37:16 pm
content: Quote from: BillyO on February 18, 2025, 05:46:09 pmOh. Never mindI was quite in a hurry with buying one to do some quick measurements around house. I think that for my usecases, the precision does not matter that much, really..

author: czbaterka
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2025, 08:39:08 pm
content: Quote from: armandine2 on February 18, 2025, 07:49:54 pmI don't really understand where you're going with that

author: armandine2
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2025, 09:32:18 pm
content: .. the contention is , the product chose you not the other way round. It literally saw you coming for it.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 26, 2025, 05:27:23 am
content: Quote from: czbaterka on February 18, 2025, 09:45:19 amYes, perfectly fine picks.QuoteWhat soldering gear do you have?I'd get a 2nd multimeter as well, handy for all sorts of stuff, e.g. measuring current and voltage at the same time.

author: ledtester
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 26, 2025, 06:11:15 am
content: Given a tight budget I would de-prioritize the purchase of an AWG. I have several function generator instruments and I've hardly used any of them.Make sure you reserve some funds for things like: prototyping tools and supplies, soldering/desoldering tools, circuit board holders, hook-up cables, components, modules, microcontroller kits, .... I would even suggest getting a 3D printer before getting an AWG.

author: Berni
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 26, 2025, 06:21:54 am
content: Don't bother with a AWG for now, they are very rarely needed and cost a fair bit.Put that money towards soldering tools like a good soldering iron, get a cheap Chinese hot air station(fan based), one of those micro dremels, good tweezers, sidecutters, spotlights..etcHeck even a 2nd multimeter is more useful to have.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 26, 2025, 08:06:31 am
content: A signal generator can be useful.However, if you are on a tight budget, anFY3224swill suffice.This leaves you plenty of money left for a second DMM etc.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 26, 2025, 08:41:34 am
content: Quote from: ledtester on February 26, 2025, 06:11:15 amI'd also agree with those about the AWG, there are more useful things to spend your money on.

author: Refrigerator
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 26, 2025, 02:43:34 pm
content: For a start focus on the essentials. As a tightass i feel perfectly qualified to give you some advice on my part.First is get some UNIT UT136C multimeters. Notice the C, this is important. These have a K type temperature probe, and measuring temperature is very useful.Unlike the "battery test" options that the B variant has, which are useless.These DMM's have a 8000 count capable chip inside and a very nice UART interface on the main board, and you just need to solder some wires on two clearly marked pads to get data out.Combine this with the ability to turn off the auto power off function and you can log data from these meters very easily.As an example, you can connect this DMM to an ESP32 and you can log temperature, voltage, current or anything the DMM can measure straight into an SD card or an MQTT server on your wifi network.I've made a post about it:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/uni-t-ut131c-serial-data-output/msg3937228/#msg3937228You only need one accurate DMM, everything else can be cheap and cheerful.Buy a cheap 7$ knockoff logic analyzer. These are a great bang for buck and will get you quite far. I have one of these and it's great:Get power supplies - multiple. Adjustable buck boost converters are a great choice. Have at least one power supply that can provide adjustable high current.Same as with DMM's, you only need one good lab power supply and the rest can be cheap.Get a cheap T12-style soldering station.AVOIDhakko 936- style chinese soldering stations. The heaters and tips in those suck and are a pain to interchange.T12 tips are the best low price option that will do basically everything.I use one of these and it's just as good as any ERSA, or JBC, or Weller that i've used in the past.You can use these with a battery pack, which will be very useful if you plan to do any soldering around the house and can't be bothered to drag an extension cord over.The station itself is also very very light, so it doesn't weigh down if you need to solder anything high up. And if you want weight then just glue a rock to it.Get solder and make sure you have multiple rolls, simply because sometimes a roll gets misplaced and catching yourself out of solder sucks and breaks your workflow.Flux - get some flux. Youtube is full of reviews of cheap fluxes, so pick your favorite.Component kits. Get resistor kits, capacitor kits, inductor kits, LED kits, potentiometer kits, connector kits, transistor kits, jelly bean IC kits. SMD and THT. Get breadboards too and plenty of jumper wires to go along.Signal generators are very useful, but you most likely don't need an arbitrary waveform generator for your home lab. Most of the time it's just a PWM signal, or something similar.Get good lights on your bench. Soldering under a bad light feels miserable and makes it hard to see if you're doing well or not. I like 4500K LED's on my bench.Get some good tweezers. There are good cheap tweezers out there, but don't get caught by the crappy ones. Having a set of good tweezers makes life so much easier when playing around with electronics.No matter what advice any of us give you, there will always be something we missed or something you discover yourself that you need, so always keep some spare change for that.Don't expect that you will buy everything now and will never need anything again, because you will.You can always turn money into tools, but rarely turn tools back into money, so don't rush. Make sure you justify your purchases with actual real world applications.I've seen people buy tools just because they're cool and "can do many things" and then never use them. I've done it myself with a Siglent SDX1030 that i've used a total of 0 times.With what i've mentioned here, together with an oscilloscope, you can do basically everything an electronics hobbyist might want to do.

author: BillyO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 26, 2025, 02:49:39 pm
content: I dunno, I use an AWG at least 3 times a week. In my mind it's one of the five essential lab instruments. Scope, Power supply, AWG (or FG), DMM and 2nd DMM (first being a bench DMM). I'm using one right now as I write to check out a tone control circuit.

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 26, 2025, 03:12:21 pm
content: Quote from: BillyO on February 26, 2025, 02:49:39 pmit depends on what you normally do in your lab in order to use awg 3 times a week

author: BillyO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 26, 2025, 03:36:29 pm
content: Quote from: osmax_br on February 26, 2025, 03:12:21 pmI do all sorts of things. This and last week is all about an amplifier I'm designing. The week before that I was experimenting with over-clocking some little 6502 based computers I had designed a few years back. The previous week I was comparing small AC voltages and currents between a known good DMM and two I was testing. Before that I was trying to figure out some small transformers I got at a junk shop. Before that I was testing out and fixing an old Pioneer receiver I picked up on eBay. Before that I spent a few days experimenting around with op-amps. There is always something.I know most of these things can be done with a simple signal generator, but these days inexpensive and very capable AWGs are more readily available.

author: Berni
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 26, 2025, 09:05:44 pm
content: Not saying that a AWG is not useful at all, just that it is a fair way down the priority list for a lab setup.I have multiple signal generators around and they see very little use. Most real world circuits have all he required signal generation happen internally, and a lot of modern stuff is digital so to excite those you would need a pattern generator instead of a AWG (or better yet a simple Arduino board). As for when it comes to just simply generating a fixed square wave for driving simple stuff like clocks or PWM, you can build one of those yourself out of a 555 timer and is actually an excellent beginner project (teaches you about circuit design and you get a new tool as a reward)When it comes to testing transformers and the like, just a LCR meter gets the job done most of the time, or if i want to test amplifiers i have more specialized gear (VSA) that can generate and measure signals with much lower distortion and noise than a generic AWG.So id say better to pick up a AWG later on once you already have all the most useful stuff. At that point you can also justify getting a AWG with some nice specs (that will last you a lifetime in most cases)

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 26, 2025, 10:07:18 pm
content: Quote from: Refrigerator on February 26, 2025, 02:43:34 pmWell , I do read a lot on this forum that you need at least 2 dmmsI know that we use multiple dmms to have better readings (compare 2 readings and get a middle value)Put why not have only one accurate dmm , why to buy 2 dmmsAnd for seeing voltage changes on multiple parts of the circuit at the same time why not use an OscilloscopeYou have a Nice 800$ decoration btw

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 26, 2025, 10:09:36 pm
content: It seems no one mentioned soldering station with hot air gun

author: BillyO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 26, 2025, 10:16:51 pm
content: Quote from: osmax_br on February 26, 2025, 10:07:18 pmTo measure current and voltage at the same time.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 26, 2025, 10:27:20 pm
content: Quote from: BillyO on February 26, 2025, 10:16:51 pmYes, or to observe different measuring points in a circuit simultaneously.The picture shows an example of how a small resistor (0.1Ω) can be measured quite accurately with two cheap DMMs.19.228mV / 190.71mA = 0.1008Ω

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 26, 2025, 10:53:39 pm
content: Quote from: Aldo22 on February 26, 2025, 10:27:20 pmNice psu , is that the fnrisi dps150?I was about to buy it , but figured out it was type c powerd , I didn't have a type c PD brick , so with the psu it would cost me 79$ , very expensiveAt that price a can buy bench psu like wanptek for 50$I landed in the end on this psuhttps://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005001566667677.htmlIt is good for me , ripple is 200mv pp , when the battery is charging it becomes 400mv pp , obviously it cant do 400 watts or 8 amps , the ui is greatHowever since most of my work is digital, I dont do analog stuff I think 200mv ripple is acceptable, since esp32 is fairly forgiving in that manner

author: BillyO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 26, 2025, 10:59:51 pm
content: Quote from: osmax_br on February 26, 2025, 10:53:39 pmIt also has a DC barrel jack input that will accept up to 30V.

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 26, 2025, 11:05:07 pm
content: Quote from: BillyO on February 26, 2025, 10:59:51 pmI'm stupid , didn't check for thatWell , if it really has 20mv pp ripple it is a very nice dealHowever as we saw in 1014d , fnrisi loves to overestimated their products

author: BillyO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 26, 2025, 11:11:13 pm
content: Quote from: osmax_br on February 26, 2025, 11:05:07 pmIt is typically about 13mV at full output. It goes up to about 33mV in CC mode.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 27, 2025, 09:53:12 am
content: Quote from: osmax_br on February 26, 2025, 11:05:07 pmI'm not a fan of Fnirsi in general, but they did a good job with the DPS-150 imo.It's extremely practical and accurate. I would really miss this device.You can power it with pretty much anything.The max voltage is limited to what's at the input.

author: Refrigerator
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 28, 2025, 06:36:18 am
content: Quote from: osmax_br on February 26, 2025, 10:09:36 pmI mentioned a soldering station, but not the hot air. That's a good point since hot air is massively useful.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 01, 2025, 09:28:14 am
content: Quote from: osmax_br on February 26, 2025, 10:07:18 pmVoltage and current at the same time for starters. Watching multiple voltage rails. And also gives oyu the ability to make sure neither meter has drifted (i.e. a poor mans calibration check).Here is a video of me having to useFIVEmultimeters to measure multiple rails to troubleshoot a fault.

author: czbaterka
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 12, 2025, 05:59:05 pm
content: Quote from: ledtester on February 26, 2025, 06:11:15 amI already have Prusa MK3S. Its ancient at this point but still does the job wellQuote from: ledtester on February 26, 2025, 06:11:15 amI am currently seeking for some soldering iron. I was considering TS101, Pinecil v2, FNIRSI HS-02 or iFixit soldering station (tho its not cheap)