Making of SMT ceramic capacitors - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: calexanian
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 25, 2016, 05:20:36 am
content: I was looking for any main stream companies making SMT caps or resistors in the US and found none. This is a Kemet plant somewhere else. I see no reason we could not be doing this here in the sates. Its mostly automated obviously.Enjoy!

author: T3sl4co1l
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 25, 2016, 07:09:57 am
content: Nice, thanks!Mainstream? Yeah no... I mean, you're kidding right?... Mil spec maybe, but no, nothing cost critical and "mainstream". They've got to wring every last thin cent out of those buggers to sell them competitively in the billions. The machines are probably custom built with local materials and engineering -- cost savings even on the capital! You can't do that in the US, even just for the machines. US labor is expensive AF, and even just operating costs (property taxes?) would probably be enough reason for them.Tim

author: JoeN
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 25, 2016, 07:47:06 am
content: I watched the video and saw quite a few different workers and manual processes. Of course, that may be either a huge part or an insignificant part of the overall costs of those capacitors, but it's hard to know which.

author: Kjelt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 25, 2016, 08:32:43 am
content: Not only the salaries but did you see how much real estate you need for that factory, that thing is HUGE!So real estate and prices for energy (a lot of ovens) tax rules for the country and so on.You can also produce your ipads/iphones in the USA they won't become more expensive only the margin will drop, but on ceramic capacitors, they will double or triple in price if you produce them in the western world. Unfortunately though, we sure could use the jobsStill we make a lot of the production machines that are used.

author: T3sl4co1l
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 25, 2016, 08:43:07 am
content: Quote from: Kjelt on May 25, 2016, 08:32:43 amBut obviously ... we don't. If we did, either the cost of labor would fall, or the demand for it would rise.I'm an engineer, so, I work smarter, not harder. I have no idea what fraction of the population is capable of working "smarter", though, even with assumed ideal schooling...What will be interesting, is when China's labor costs go up, as their economy matures from manufacturing to consumption. Jobs will return here, yes, but the cost of EVERYTHING will go up, compounded. Which will probably happen as oil peaks (if not sooner), compounding even more costs.Interesting times...Tim

author: coppice
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 25, 2016, 09:26:25 am
content: Quote from: T3sl4co1l on May 25, 2016, 08:43:07 amCosts already have risen massively in China. The jobs haven't moved back to Europe and the US, though. Much of the electronics you buy today has been assembled in Vietnam or Indonesia.

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 25, 2016, 09:56:44 am
content: Quote from: coppice on May 25, 2016, 09:26:25 amYes, as labour costs increase in China, production will move to cheaper countries.There are however other reasons for production in China: cheap energy, close proximity to raw materials, good transport infrastructure etc.

author: apis
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 25, 2016, 04:27:16 pm
content: I agree with others that production will probably move to poorer countries. There are plenty of poor people in the world and China has been working hard establishing relations with countries in Africa for example. I presume they will outsource manufacturing there.What happens when Chinese companies become skilled enough to design new products, not only make clones. Then the west will be mostly obsolete, no longer having any production capabilities or know-how?What scares me is that since the USA and the NATO countries still, without a doubt, make up the most powerful military force in the world, they might be tempted to use force to solve growing economical problems. The "average joe" might blame unemployment and declining standard of living on some traditional scapegoat and populists will gain power making problems worse.Quote from: T3sl4co1l on May 25, 2016, 08:43:07 amFrom what I've read Peak oil production is probably happening right now (+/-10 years or so), but it will take a while before the effects become apparent.

author: daqq
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 25, 2016, 05:49:38 pm
content: Thanks for the video, fascinating really.I was actually expecting something far more automated - particularly when you see a 10k roll of the little buggers for 11 EUR. It did seem to involve a fair amount of people.

author: T3sl4co1l
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 26, 2016, 12:30:52 am
content: Quote from: apis on May 25, 2016, 04:27:16 pmThey're already there. Rigol and Siglent are entirely Chinese, AFAIK.No, not everyone; there's still an awful lot of junk and copying kind of work going on over there, but more and more, they're creating reasonable-to-excellent stuff themselves. But as their education and SES* advances, so will their means of production on all levels, including design and engineering.*Socio-Economic Status.QuoteNo need; they've got our money.http://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/china-cold-open/n12611(skip ahead a minute or two where it gets juicy)Tim

author: apis
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 26, 2016, 10:48:24 pm
content: I believe it's the other way around (the you got their money) and in the unlikely event they want them back... well,https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nixon_shockbut that trick only works once!