Does this perfboard look any good?  - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / beginners

author: n0b
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2015, 02:16:06 am
content: I read the reviews and stuff, people just say you get what you pay for you know. But does anyone know of a cheap supplier of multiple sizes of perfboard?Thanks, replies are much appreciated.-Mr.Clarkhttp://www.amazon.com/dp/B00ARTP1J4/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=1N29CDDZNIORJ&coliid=I1K49SDFTN7SZG&psc=1

author: peterthenovice
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2015, 02:19:10 am
content: you should check out adafruits protoboards.https://www.adafruit.com/product/1609

author: n0b
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2015, 02:21:22 am
content: Thanks Peter, I have looked at that and it is very nice but quite expensive for me a hobbyist who doesn't have a lot of money.I was going to buy one of those though because they look awesome!But yeah thanks for your reply.

author: peterthenovice
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2015, 02:23:39 am
content: i have used the cheap Chinese perf boards and i do not recommend it. bread boards are great for prototyping.

author: n0b
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2015, 02:30:05 am
content: The main reason I want some perfboard is for projects I want to keep. But I will keep looking for a better brand.Thanks for your replies.

author: Ian.M
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2015, 02:45:14 am
content: Things to look for:Square pads - improves adhesion and makes it easier to link adjacent pads.HASL or immersion tin finish - for solderability so you don't cook the pads off the boardWell centered drill holes - If they cant get that right, what else did they ^&*% up?Cleanly drilled holes - ragged ones are probably punched, or the drill bit was about to get its state pension. Either stresses the pad and microfractures the board, making lifted pads more likely.Nice to have:Topside ground plane (with clearance on each hole)Power bus tracks round the edgeFR4 boardI could probably make those boards off Amazon work O.K for me: Lightly wet sand with 1000 or 2000 grit wet&dry paper. Wash with IPA, paint on neutral Rosin flux and oven dry. Then use 60/40 flux core solder and be quick with each joint, putting in veropins for any components I'll be selecting on test to avoid pad side rework.I've soldered worse doing repairs. However the average hobbyist without weeks or months of 9-to-5 fine pitch / SMD manual rework experience is not going to have a fun time with them, and the reviews reflect that.How much do you value your time at and how many components will you kill because of cheap&nasty boards? For most of us these low quality phenolic boards are a false economy.If you can, use tripad. The three hole strips have much better adhesion, and there is less need to bridge pads, reducing the risk of lifting them.

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2015, 02:51:53 am
content: Ebay is full of boards like this onehttp://www.ebay.com/itm/Virtuabotix-3-x-7-cm-Double-sided-Prototype-perf-board-/321347562843?hash=item4ad1cead5b:g:b2YAAMXQVT9SthLN(don't buy this specific one, that's just a first result, look for this style and design).They are available in variety of sizes and are really well made. You can find very cheap bulk deals with shipping from China.Don't buy that single sided phenolic crap.Edit: The same thing on Amazon at a reasonable price considering local delivery -http://www.amazon.com/Vktech-Double-Side-Prototype-Universal-Printed/dp/B00COGNWXA/ref=pd_sim_328_4?ie=UTF8&dpID=61EwK1pn4CL&dpSrc=sims&preST=_AC_UL160_SR160%2C160_&refRID=0QG21YDE5XXR142C79G1

author: Gurpreet
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2015, 02:54:34 am
content: I have used similar quality of boards and they worked fine for me even though i had a crappy soldering iron. As long as the circuit is not too complicated, you should be good... best of luck

author: JacquesBBB
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2015, 03:22:46 am
content: Quote from: n0b on November 11, 2015, 02:16:06 amThese are very bad. There is barely no copper. The pads will easily lift.I second the recommendations of ataradov. You ca n get these on various sizes at very good price athttp://www.electrodragon.com/product/double-sided-prototype-board-high-quality-pcb/

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2015, 08:27:46 am
content: Quote from: peterthenovice on November 11, 2015, 02:23:39 amThey are great way of learning how to debug circuits containing excessand variableinductance capacitance and resistance. Just say no.

author: KL27x
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2015, 11:22:55 am
content: QuoteIf you plan to make a large circuit that is not throw-away, you might want to use the FR-4, because the phenolic is very bendy. But you will throw it away, because it will suck... That's what proto board is for... for making stuff that sucks and which you will throw away. So yeah, phenolic is fine. It's easier to snap off small pieces, too, for when you just need a few copper pads on which to stick some small components to fix/modify another circuit board.Veroboard is quite handy, too. The holes are connected in strips, which you cut/scrape to separate.

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 11, 2015, 01:03:37 pm
content: Take a look at these. I bought them for a project-I didn't need that many but the price is right and the quality is quite good.http://www.ebay.com/itm/111278031424?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2015, 01:07:01 pm
content: Quote from: ataradov on November 11, 2015, 02:51:53 amCompletely agree about the Chinese FR4 boards. They sometimes discount them on eBay, so keep checking (and go for the bigger packs -- sometimes, you'll find vendors selling 20-packs of boards for less than others charge for 5-packs!!). I stocked up on a bunch of them in different sizes and they're great.I also concur that the phenolic ones from China are awful. They get the job done, but they're a pain to work with. (Some I got were so badly etched that there were solder bridges between traces! Not to mention missing holes where they forgot to drill here and there, the bendiness, often come warped...)Edit:Quote from: GreyWoolfe on November 11, 2015, 01:03:37 pmExactly, that's a good price. I mean, they're so incredibly cheap compared to buying from the big distributors that it's worth stocking up, since buying just a few boards at "full" price is more than these whole packs.

author: macboy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2015, 03:18:08 pm
content: Quote from: tooki on November 11, 2015, 01:07:01 pm+1 for the green FR4 boards. They are proper strong FR4, have durable plated through holes, the copper is tinned so it won't oxidize in a few months, they have solder mask and silkscreen top and bottom with row/column labels. They are about as good as pad-per-hole protoboards can get, and they are absurdly cheap.+1 to do NOT buy those cheap phenolic perfboards. Thin, weak, warped board with stamped (not drilled) holes and raw copper than becomes oxidized and hard to solder. Just no.

author: nbritton
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2015, 03:44:58 pm
content: http://www.aliexpress.com/item/10Pcs-DIY-Prototype-Paper-PCB-Universal-Experiment-Matrix-Circuit-Board-5x7cm-Brand-New-Hot-Selling/817578512.html

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2015, 04:32:35 pm
content: Quote from: macboy on November 11, 2015, 03:18:08 pmActually, that's the one defect I've found in them: the row/column labels are not mirrored on the front and back, so you can't use the coordinates to identify the same hole on the opposite side.

author: rdl
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2015, 06:56:58 pm
content: I bought some of these a couple of years ago. They're decent quality at a good price. I can't swear to it, but I think this might be the actual seller I got them from.http://www.ebay.com/itm/20PCS-Double-Side-Prototype-PCB-Universal-Board-/201137170265

author: KL27x
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2015, 07:30:15 pm
content: QuotePut all the components on the copper side, and your problem is solved. Switching to SMD parts might help you take the leap, but it works fine with thru hole parts, too. I clip the legs off, so they don't poke through the board. I run all jumpers on the copperside, too. You get one flat, bare surface, so no need for insulation or standoffs, and the results are easier to troubleshoot/debug/repair.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2015, 08:00:55 pm
content: Quote from: KL27x on November 11, 2015, 07:30:15 pmUm, I guess we're talking about different things, or maybe we just work entirely differently. I draw out the layout on paper before building it up, and it'd be really useful to have one single coordinate system for both sides of the board and the paper. As many people do, I like to bend leads across (as opposed to adding additional jumpers) when possible, and unified coordinates would make this easier. I never said anything about putting components on both sides, standoffs, etc.

author: KL27x
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 12, 2015, 12:24:09 am
content: QuoteTypically you insert thru hole components from the top side and solder on the bottom. So you have components on one side, and solder beads/leads on the other.If you just tack all your components and jumpers on the copper side, you don't need coordinates. You can see everything you're doing. And no leads sticking out the bottom (which would ordinarily be the top). This is why I mentioned no need for standoffs. If placing your circuitry onto another pcb, for instance, just glue it on, and there's nothing to short on the flat bottom of the board.After building a few circuits the conventional way, yeah. It looks neater. But it's actually harder to debug, and it's not worth the effort (IMO). The experience of using coordinates or looking at things backwards isn't useful once you start to use SMD parts and/or use CAD PCB software.In case you need a solid ground plane, the upside down method allows you to add one on the bare side of the cheap phenolic (non thru hole) boards, too. Just glue on a thin piece of copper clad and drill holes where you need them.In fact, I have used my own veroboard for the last 5-6 years. Made up a bit of it, and haven't had to buy protoboard in awhile. I have square pads on one side with 20 mil traces connecting them in vertical columns. The bottom is the same square pads but they're all connected, to be used as a ground plane, and/or jumpers can be cut out of it. I only need to drill holes if I want to access the ground plane, since I solder everything on the topside.QuoteCan't say I have ever done this. I shuffle the main parts around and figure out how to get the IO's where they need to be, tack parts down and start making connections. I'm gonna probably need some jumpers... keeping everything on the same side makes those jumpers easier to do.

author: netdudeuk
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 12, 2015, 09:32:40 am
content: I also like the FR4 boards because they have tinned pads and have copper on both sides. I gave up on one of the brown boards for my last project and ordered the same size FR4 boards.The only issue that I have with these eBay FR4 boards is that it would be easier to tack on extra wires to occupied pads if they were doubles or triples. Also, I always have to start off by adding wires to the top and bottom for power and ground.It is easy to add 0805 SMD components to these boards.