Fake Panasonic caps? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: electrotwelve
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2018, 12:00:54 pm
content: I bought a bunch of Panasonic capacitors from RS Components and this is what came. I haven't opened the bag yet but none of the caps has Panasonic printed on them on them. Are these fake? Part # isECA1HM101.

author: precaud
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2018, 12:30:57 pm
content: The caps have Matsushita's logo on them. Matsushita Electric is the former name of the company, Panasonic was one of its brands.So I'd guess they are probably not fake, but are quite likely old stock; the name changed to Panasonic about a decade ago.

author: electrotwelve
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2018, 12:59:02 pm
content: Should I return them?

author: bob225
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2018, 01:56:03 pm
content: There not old stock or fake there just branded Matsushita aka Matsushita Electric Industrial (MEI) with the M logo as are many of other Panasonic capsYou can find them world wide from all sorts of suppliers just put ECA1HM101 into google or Panasonic capacitor logo

author: rsjsouza
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2018, 02:06:26 pm
content: Exactly. The M is for Matsushita and at first glance they look the real deal.One detail I find somewhat strange: they came in loose in a bag and not in cut tape - did you buy a bag or did you buy per unit just like any other part?

author: helius
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2018, 02:11:26 pm
content: Through-hole capacitors are most commonly available in bulk packaging as pictured. The alternative as "ammo pack" style on paper tape; reels are obviously not an option.

author: bob225
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2018, 03:09:51 pm
content: Places like RS, Mouser and Farnell give you the option of tape, reel (depends on the component), bagged, or singular packaging (for smaller quantities)

author: rsjsouza
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2018, 04:28:30 pm
content: Quote from: helius on August 11, 2018, 02:11:26 pmI wasn't aware of the bulk packaging; thanks.However, the type of through hole parts with paper tape can also be called reel.

author: bob225
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2018, 04:52:03 pm
content: Quote from: rsjsouza on August 11, 2018, 04:28:30 pmThe tape/card usualy comes in a concertina format that come out of a box (larger components)

author: rsjsouza
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2018, 05:05:18 pm
content: Quote from: bob225 on August 11, 2018, 04:52:03 pmI am not talking out of thin air; I have received through hole capacitors in a reel lots of times.What I have seen before is resistors coming on a concertina shape, (but I am not saying capacitors can't come this way as well).

author: bodger
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2018, 05:11:51 pm
content: I've got a bunch of Panasonic FR series caps, they have no branding on them, not even the 'M' for Matsushita. As far as I'm aware quite a few Panasonic capacitors are not branded, they just have the series name printed on them.

author: rdl
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2018, 06:39:19 pm
content: Quote from: bodger on August 11, 2018, 05:11:51 pmI also have a bunch of Panasonic FR series bought several years ago from Mouser that have no branding.

author: scuzzyTerminator
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2018, 06:48:41 pm
content: QuoteIf they are not reel they must be faek.Sorry.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2018, 07:18:38 pm
content: Quote from: helius on August 11, 2018, 02:11:26 pmHow are they normally installed on PCBs in a high volume production environment? Manually, complete with the occasional bang when an assembler makes a mistake?

author: rsjsouza
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2018, 07:43:57 pm
content: Quote from: scuzzyTerminator on August 11, 2018, 06:48:41 pmNot necessarily. I have seen through hole capacitors in wafer (concertina) supply as well. After helius posted, I looked at Mouser, Vishay and others and confirmed they can have bulk, reel and wafer packaging.

author: rdl
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2018, 08:30:25 pm
content: I just looked and I have a few very old Panasonic TSW series large electrolytics bought from Digikey around 1990 or earlier (a few still in Digikey labelled bags). Some have the Matsushita "M" and a few have a stylized triangle logo, but none of them have any brand name on them.

author: c.coyle
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: August 11, 2018, 08:46:00 pm
content: If you see a capacitor actually marked "Panasonic", you should be suspicious.

author: helius
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2018, 12:41:02 am
content: Quote from: NiHaoMike on August 11, 2018, 07:18:38 pmMy understanding is that bulk packaging is indeed mostly used by manual assembly operations. Manual assembly is still widespread in two segments: some high profit margin goods in specialized markets; and low-tech items assembled as piecework in developing countries. The factor common to both is that the volume of goods assembled in each facility is too low to support the capex of automation.There is potentially a third story for bulk packaged components, if flexible robots continue to increase in capabilities.

author: mariush
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2018, 01:00:50 am
content: Yeah, Panasonic sells electrolytic capacitors in bulk packaging.They also sell some series of capacitors without any branding whatsoever, for example the FR series. You know they're Panasonic by the vent shape and by buying them from a reputable distributor...The M logo is not the code for tolerance (+/-20%), it's the Matsushita logo like others said... though I have to say usually the "legs" of the M are slightly more curved normally. Maybe it's a limitation of the printing process, or the logo is changed to fit in smaller vertical height considering the small diameter of these capacitors... I don't know.Anyway, unlikely to be fake... not sure who would fake 85c rated capacitors when they can fake more expensive low esr 105c capacitors...ps. bulk capacitors can be easily used in assembly lines where you have 10-20+ persons each with one job, like placing an inductor, placing 3 capacitors, placing a heatsink etc etc ... no sense to use lead tapes and whatnot, it would only slow down the process.See for example from around 5:20 .. even Gigabyte used to make motherboards around 2012 by placing some components manually: