TDS5054B SSD Swap-in Fail - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: daveyk
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 23, 2020, 12:09:01 am
content: I used a Clear Sky boot CD to create an image of the internal hardrive. Clear Sky is a Windows XP boot environment on a CD and it has Norton 11. I use this to backup and restore numerous systems.So today, I un-hooked the internal IDE hard drive and hooked up a Samsung 500 GB SSD to one of the SATA ports (the one I could reach without a total tear-apart). Anyway, I used Norton 11 to restore the SSD with the image I recorded. It went well, but now when the SSD boots, it gets to the Windows 2000 BLUE Screen of death. It is stating "inaccessible boot device" after seeing Windows to start to boot. I have attached a picture of the screen.I have not run across this restoring a system before. Most of the systems I restored in industrial environments are Windows 98SE (!!!) and Windows XP.ThoughtsThanks kindlyDave

author: gslick
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 23, 2020, 01:19:09 am
content: Somewhat random guess, does the BIOS/motherboard support configuring the SATA ports for AHCI mode, and are the SATA ports currently configured for AHCI mode? If so, does changing the SATA port mode to IDE mode help?

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 23, 2020, 01:45:56 am
content: You cannot run windows XP and earlier from SATA port without SATA driver. If possible, set SATA port to IDE emulation mode in BIOS, boot into windows, install sata driver, Then change port to AHCI mode.

author: daveyk
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 23, 2020, 04:58:40 am
content: Thank you. Also, I don’t think Windows 2000 can support a partition over 256mb. I’ve ordered a 120gb SSD (PNY $22) from Amazon. I should have it before Saturday. I’ll have to look through the bios. I really don’t think there is support other than regular IDE.On my dell M6600 laptops, I know you can set the Hard Drive to IDE or HCHI () mode. I have an XP, W7, and Win 10 boot drive for that machine. I have Win10 set up as AHCI (). I found if I leave the 1tb data drive (ide) in the machine with the Windows 10 boot drive, Windows 10 corrupts the 1tb data drive (IDE mode). So when that machine is running Windows 10, I have to pull the IDE data drive. I should have left the Windows 10 SSD set up as IDE.Anyway, with this scope, I’m guessing, Windows 2000 can’t run on a 500gb Drive.

author: daveyk
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 23, 2020, 05:02:16 am
content: Can the Tektronix Scope software run on Windows 7? I would love to put Windows 7 on the TDS5054. Then it could work on the network.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 23, 2020, 11:23:42 am
content: To use above 137GB partition on windows 2000, you need windows 2000 SP4 and 48-bit LBA enabled.

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 23, 2020, 11:35:49 am
content: Quote from: daveyk on April 23, 2020, 12:09:01 amWell, that may be, but using something so antique for modern media like SSDs isn't necessarily the best idea. Even more when it's something made by Norton (yuck!)There are many better tools out there. Personally, I use EaseUS ToDo Backup Free, which can create USB and ISO recovery media (Linux and Windows PE based, so you can add Windows drivers if necessary) and which has worked fine transferring the W2k and XP images of numerous older instruments to SSDs.QuoteThat very much suggests your SATA port is using AHCI mode (and AHCI support in W2k isn't great and often causes issues). You can avoid this by using a decent SATA-to-IDE bridge adapter, however if the IDE cable is 44pin then you might hit a problem with faster UDMA modes which can cause data corruption.Frankly, for a W2k based instrument with IDE port I'd just get a decent IDE SSD like the Transcend PSD330 Series which already has a firmware fix for the UDMA issue and which, unlike SATA drives, doesn't require TRIM support by the OS to keep the drive healthy.Quote from: daveyk on April 23, 2020, 04:58:40 amThe following is from memory:Windows 2000 can boot from partition sizes up to 2TB (MBR limit) when formated with NTFS (FAT32 partition limit is 32GB).There also was a limitation in the stock Microsoft IDE driver in W2k and XP pre-SP2 I believe which limits the recognized drive size to 137GB. I'm not sure W2k Sp4 fixed that. That limitation goes away when appropriate IDE drivers are used.QuoteRunning a SATA SSD in IDE mode is a bad idea because you lose several important functionality, one of which is TRIM support to keep the drive healthy.A Dell Precision M6600 is powerful enough to run XP and Windows 7 in a VM with little performance penalty, which you can do using Hyper-V which comes with Windows 10.QuoteI'd be surprised if you couldn't, it's more likely your specific approach is failing you here.

author: daveyk
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 23, 2020, 05:54:50 pm
content: "To use above 137GB partition on windows 2000, you need windows 2000 SP4 and 48-bit LBA enabled."The version of Windows 2000 in the Tektronix TDS5054B-NV-AV is SP4. I assume you mean "48-bit LBA" in the BIOS? I would have no way to enable it in the OS. I will look through the BIOS shortly, but I have my doubts it will support that. Even if the BIOS supports it, the system image was created in a non-48bit LBA environment.Worse case, I have a PNY 120gig SSD on the way.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 23, 2020, 06:16:15 pm
content: Quote from: daveyk on April 23, 2020, 05:54:50 pmNo, in registry.https://aaltonen.wordpress.com/2004/11/07/enable-48-bit-lba-in-windows-2000-and-xp/

author: daveyk
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 24, 2020, 02:17:42 pm
content: "No, in registry.https://aaltonen.wordpress.com/2004/11/07/enable-48-bit-lba-in-windows-2000-and-xp/"I guess I would have to do that on the working Windows 2000 hard drive before imaging it? Will that Windows 2000 installation still work on the old 80gb hard drive after setting that registry value? The 120GB SSD should be here tomorrow, if not today. I'll try that first. 8-)Dave

author: HalFoster
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 25, 2020, 12:01:12 am
content: All-Just upgraded my TDS5054B-NV-AV to a Sandisk 240GB SSD using Clonezilla. Made a Cd, plugged in the SSD to the primary SATA port and booted. Clonezilla made a copy, I shut down, removed the IDE and power cable from the original drive and booted. Everything came up exactly as always, just a bit faster ;-)Next, I added 4 sticks of 1G PC3200/DDR400 (2.6v and a Pentium 4 2.8GHz - again, everything just came up as always - just quite a bit faster this time. I really expected there to be issues, but am thrilled it all went smoothly. Mine is running Win 2K SP4 on an Intel D865GLC MB with bios BF86510A.86A.0069.P21For some reason, I'm remembering that there may have been other MBs in this series used but I could be wrong there.Hal

author: daveyk
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 26, 2020, 07:21:02 pm
content: I got it to work on an SSD! I ordered a 120gb SANDISK for $22 from Amazon - lol. Restored the image using Norton Ghost 11 and it works like a champ. Except when my fat hand were in there, one of my knuckles hit the CPU fan and broke a blade off. It (the entire scope) vibrated so bad it caused numerous problems. I unhooked the fan and only booted long enough to know the system is working again. I ordered a brand-new in the box dual core CPU for $25 and a new fan kit for about $12 off of EBAY:Intel Core 2 Duo E6600 2.4GHz Dual-Core (BX80557E6600) Processor NOS! Sealed boxHopefully it will work. It is supposed to be compatible with the that mommy board and faster. I need more RAM also (well don't need, it want it). I will order what you did, four sticks of 1G PC3200/DDR400. I guess the processor I ordered is not as fast as yours, but I went by what an upgrade page recommended (https://xdevs.com/fix/tds5000b/). I should have gotten a faster one; I just didn't know. Its not a big loss if I have to order another one again.

author: daveyk
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 26, 2020, 07:37:41 pm
content: "Next, I added 4 sticks of 1G PC3200/DDR400"I don't know if those work in the TDS5054B mother board. I am thinking it needs 1 GB DDR2 UDIMM?? Personally, I am quite good at certain aspects of electronics and quality systems, but I lost tract of computers, other than in sing them, after 2000. I can build them, and a lot, but am not familiar anymore with what works with what mommy boards.Will the memory you mentioned work in the TDS5054B with the original mother board? When you state you put in a P4 2.8GHz, was that the same mother board that came in the scope or do you update the mother board?

author: HalFoster
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 26, 2020, 10:36:03 pm
content: No, it's the MB that came with the scope - it's the Intel one listed. I don't know if *all* of the "B" variants of the 5054 have the same MB - I thought not, but maybe I was thinking the "non-B" having a different MB. It's - as far as i know - completely stock; other than changing out the HD/RAM/uPC all I did was to replace one leaking electrolytic cap near the SATA connectors.Hal

author: HalFoster
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 26, 2020, 10:40:10 pm
content: And, re the ram - all that I can say is that it works perfectly in *my* scope. I downloaded the manual for my MB and used that as the guide to what I bought to upgrade.Hal

author: daveyk
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2020, 05:31:45 pm
content: "No, it's the MB that came with the scope - it's the Intel one listed. I don't know if *all* of the "B" variants of the 5054 have the same MB - I thought not, but maybe I was thinking the "non-B" having a different MB. It's - as far as i know - completely stock; other than changing out the HD/RAM/uPC all I did was to replace one leaking electrolytic cap near the SATA connectors."Well the processor I ordered did not work, it's a ball grid type and the mother board is a 478 pin type. I did not know. $20 is all I'm out and seller says he will refund me even though I told him please don't it was my fault.I then found a P42.8GHz, Socket 478, with 400MHz FSB on Amazon, used, for $20. I ordered it for try:https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00NVN4H6Q/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1It is probably the same mommy board as yours. To change that cap, you had to get the mother board out. It is difficult to remover the back of the scope? I found it a real bitch just to get the right side panel off and top to change the hard drive. LOLDave

author: HalFoster
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 04, 2020, 12:19:19 pm
content: Disassembling the thing was difficult until I finally decided to RTFM. One thing that I ran into, though, was when removing the back panel with the MB on it, there are two metal pegs on the lower side that you have to lift the back panel's tab over to remove (and reinstall). Oh, and remove a *lot* of screws. It wound up being one of those things that involves a lot of head scratching the first time but afterwards it's all "Oh, that's easy and makes sense."As for the caps, the only one I replaced had been leaking from the top and not, thankfully, from the bottom. Computer MBs, for me, are high on the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" list for me. On something like this scope I will open it up once a year or so, blow out the dust bunnies, give it a good visual inspection and leave well enough alone unless something appears wrong.Hal

author: skylape
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: May 05, 2020, 10:22:06 pm
content: Quote from: HalFoster on April 25, 2020, 12:01:12 amIs your motherboard the one that the scope comes with? I wonder if I can upgrade the motherboard whole together.

author: HalFoster
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 06, 2020, 01:03:54 pm
content: Yes, it was the original motherboard. That being said, it is a TDS5054B-NV-AV scope which was a series made under a Navy procurement - whether or not the MB in it is different from a standard TDS5054B or not I don't know. I am pretty sure it is different from the TDS5054 (non-B) scopes, though. I would think, though, that the easiest - and no more expensive - option would be to just find one on the 'bay that already has the MB you are looking for. If nothing else, get the SN and run it by Tek support - like everyone else right now they are running short handed and somewhat slow, but they *are* very helpful.Hal

author: madao
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 19, 2020, 03:18:54 am
content: I got TDS5054B-NV, i want save & clone HDD to 64GB SSD (64GB SLC SSD was a gift from work)A Notice, NV-variant, it means: You got a TDS5054B without touch. I press on screen and it didn't work.Display unit is out of TDS5054B-NV and i found partial unsoldered pcb on display, all touch-compoment is not on place.

author: daveyk
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 19, 2020, 08:13:37 pm
content: "A Notice, NV-variant, it means: You got a TDS5054B without touch. "My TDS5054B-NV-AV" does indeed have touch and it works. I still prefer to use the mouse.Dave

author: uccoskun
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: December 01, 2021, 05:26:02 am
content: I'm writing just in case somebody ends up here to find an upgrade solutions.I upgraded my tds5054b-NV to XP on an intel motherboard (Intel DQ77MK Motherboard). There is another tread by Strick here where he explains how to do it step by step.

author: Joebeazelman
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 18, 2023, 06:26:21 pm
content: As the famous saying goes, "keep scope alive!"I started another thread on documenting TDS5000/TLS5000 motherboards and the upgrade process. Head over to:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/repair/help-with-replace-tektronix-tla5000tds5000-motherboard/?topicseen

author: Jamieson
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 28, 2024, 11:39:05 pm
content: We have quite a few of these TDS5054B-NV-T scopes still kicking around in the lab and they are all pushing 20 years old now. So far the only failures I've encountered are the 70x70x15 CPU fan bearings and the 80GB PATA IDE hard drives.We replace the drives with 128GB SATA SSDs. I also get the bootup BSOD when I attempt to use drives larger than ~250GB, suspect some LBA issue going on with the Windows 2000 drivers.