I killed my USB flash. - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: vlad777
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 26, 2016, 08:48:01 pm
content: Hi,Anybody into reviving USB flash drives?My problem is that windows doesn't recognize it in any way (device descriptor request failed).So my question is about the controller in this thing.Is it like an empty micro-controller, where you don't expect it to do anything?Or does it have ROM or hardware that would establish basic USB communication?Here is some info:Transcend4GBJF V85(JetFlash)-------Chip:Alcor AU6984 (controler)Samsung K9LBG08U0M (flash)http://www.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/pdf/219004/ETC2/AU6984.html-------Recovery software:JetFlash Online RecoveryChipGeniousAlcorMPMany thanks.

author: Aodhan145
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 26, 2016, 09:18:31 pm
content: buy an identical one and replace the controller chip? (This is an idea i dont know what im talking about really)

author: vlad777
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 26, 2016, 09:29:12 pm
content: I do get that desperate, just to show it I'm smarter than it(But other than that , it makes no sense in any way , not economically justified, why solder if you can just program it)

author: rs20
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 26, 2016, 09:49:06 pm
content: Quote from: Aodhan145 on August 26, 2016, 09:18:31 pm+1 This is by far the most interesting option, and the most likely to succeed if indeed the controller chip (andonlythe controller chip) is fried.

author: vlad777
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 26, 2016, 09:55:17 pm
content: But that is my question.Is it fried or just bricked?(Someone may know if they are into this.)

author: kc8apf
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2016, 01:51:25 am
content: Could be either. The controllers I've evaluated for work all had flash for firmware. They are just microcontrollers with specialized peripherals.Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk

author: edy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2016, 02:30:30 am
content: I thought I had a dead USB stick and used a utility to reprogram it, and it came to life. I had to try different versions and most were in Chinese so I had trouble figuring it out, but they were from the website of the original chip controller which I found by using another program that reads ID codes.By the way, the drive died while I was running a live Linux distribution off of it that I had booted from USB. Turns out that also the reported memory size was faked.

author: Brumby
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 27, 2016, 02:38:28 am
content: Quote from: edy on August 27, 2016, 02:30:30 amThis is a danger. I never trust anything out of the box these days, so I run H2testw. It's slow, but thorough.

author: Voodoo 6
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2016, 06:59:34 am
content: This is a tough nut to crack, Everyone on the planet knows that electros from country x have a very high failure rate, yet everyone keeps buying from that country. Basically sowing the seeds of our own destruction globally. You want crime to go down impose super strict regulations for it. Same for electronics, they drive our world, bad components put everyone in harms way. Drop a plane from the sky due to faulty component is that not proof positive? Cant sue them, they are immune and they know that. Its not country x that is the problem, its the people who are buying from them. They have elevate the fakes to an art. You want to have a successful industrial base go back to the German model pre 1990. The concept of giving a hoot about what you are making is a lost art.

author: R005T3r
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2016, 07:24:04 am
content: Quote from: Aodhan145 on August 26, 2016, 09:18:31 pmCould be a good idea, but you need proper equipment to replace it...Actually, I would try it on a Linux environment to see if it changes anything. I don't think the controller is faulty: electronics these devices rarely fails... Maybe it's only windows that's not liking the usb drive (won't be the first time that happened to me, after I've lost 1 day I've decided to buy a proper hard drive for backups and always do that)

author: R005T3r
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2016, 07:57:01 am
content: Quote from: edy on August 27, 2016, 02:30:30 amYes, especially USB sticks and sd cards are faked.This problem appear to be common on ebay $5 cards. Actually I was likely to get scammed by one of these, however I asked myself "how it's possible it's about $5 instead of $30" and after buying I've made a search founding that was a scam...

author: plazma
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2016, 08:03:27 am
content: I have fixed many USB flash sticks. Check for cracks in the USB connector pads. If the controller chip is fried you can swap chips with an identical stick.

author: rob77
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2016, 08:12:59 am
content: also you might try to read the flash chip only (with a micro with enough IO pins) and hope the disc sector allocation policy of that dead controller was linear.

author: janoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2016, 11:49:28 am
content: Quote from: rob77 on August 27, 2016, 08:12:59 amThat would be pretty rare. Most of the flash controllers do (some) wear leveling and transparent bad block reallocation, otherwise the frequently written parts of the flash (e.g. where FAT resides) would die really quickly rendering the stick useless after only short time.I think Bunnie had a good article on the SD card controllers explaining how this worked.

author: rob77
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2016, 01:04:04 pm
content: Quote from: janoc on August 27, 2016, 11:49:28 ami know how it works. but in this case there is separate controller and separate flash chip.so after first write ,or few writes the allocation might still be linear - that's why i wrote "and hope the allocation was linear"

author: vlad777
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2016, 01:29:46 pm
content: I will try under Linux, good idea , i did try under XP.So if this controller is firmware based , and the boot-loader is gone how am I suppose to program it?Apart from D+ and D- there is this pin : "20 FMWP In Reserved for firmware " . (Write Protect?)Any ideas?Edit:Could this firmware actually be inside the flash chip? I know that some hard drives keep their fw on the platters.

author: vlad777
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2016, 01:48:50 pm
content: Quote from: janoc on August 27, 2016, 11:49:28 amIs this it ?https://www.bunniestudios.com/blog/?p=3554Great find!So I can use this stick as a micro with loads of storage, cool.That is, if I can reverse engineer it.

author: janoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2016, 09:22:09 pm
content: Quote from: vlad777 on August 27, 2016, 01:48:50 pmI think I have seen yet another article on this but as Murphy would have it, I can't find it right now. It might have been related to his work analyzing fake SD cards and flash sticks.EDIT:Here it is - it finally wasn't Bunnie:http://joshuawise.com/projects/ndfslaveShould give you an idea of what is involved ...

author: janoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2016, 09:31:20 pm
content: Quote from: rob77 on August 27, 2016, 01:04:04 pmCheck this article on reverse engineering an SD card data layout in order to recover them. Should give you an idea why your hopes are pretty futile:http://joshuawise.com/projects/ndfslave

author: rob77
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2016, 11:20:48 am
content: Quote from: janoc on August 27, 2016, 09:31:20 pmonce againin this case there is a separate flash chip , here is the datasheethttp://downloads.qi-hardware.com/hardware/datasheets/qi_lb60/U9~K9GAG08U0M~~2GB-FINAL_NAND-NOT_ON_SOME_PROTOTYPES~~.pdfit's describing also the initial invalid blocks etc.... so the hope is not so futile as you think

author: janoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2016, 11:27:18 am
content: Quote from: rob77 on August 28, 2016, 11:20:48 amDid you actually check what is in that SD card being reverse engineered? Surprise - a controller anda separate flash chip.So I am not quite sure what are you trying to achieve with this argument.

author: rob77
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2016, 11:50:12 am
content: Quote from: janoc on August 28, 2016, 11:27:18 amprobably to suggest yet another possibility how to recover data ?the datasheet doesn't mention any kind of sorcery needed.... that flash chip has a well defined interface with linear address space (from interface perspective). so reading it out with a micro followed by substracting the invalid blocks (identified as per datasheet) would give you a very good basis for data reconstruction. once you have the image read out, you can try to analyse it with some software (GetDataback for FAT) or analyse it manually - look for FAT table and start to manually reconstruct your important files.

author: Aodhan145
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2016, 12:29:22 pm
content: Quote from: rob77 on August 28, 2016, 11:50:12 amStupid ass method though. He hasn't even tried the other ones.

author: VK5RC
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 28, 2016, 12:38:03 pm
content: Sorry if I have missed this (dumb) suggestion, have you tried 1 another computer and 2 tried gently cleaning the contacts?

author: janoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2016, 02:20:40 pm
content: Quote from: rob77 on August 28, 2016, 11:50:12 amYes, but the problem is you have the data scrambling on top of that, as well as dead block remapping and wear leveling. So by definition you are not going to have a continuous block of sensible data you can "just read out" unless you figure out this scheme. You will read only meaningless garbage. That is what that article I have linked to actually documents, just nobody seems to be bothered to read it

author: edy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2016, 02:43:39 pm
content: If you just want to get the drive recognized again without the data, the controller reprogramming utility should do it. I will post the link here when I have a chance. Whether the data is still recoverable I don't know.

author: vlad777
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2016, 08:36:25 pm
content: Quote from: edy on August 28, 2016, 02:43:39 pmNo I don't need the data, I had memtest86 on there, and I killed it while formatting for something else.Yes please , I wanna try this utility , I have already tried AlcorMP but it needs the device to have reported back proper descriptors, and have VID and PID.Edit:I recently had a tooth extracted, so I really don't like your avatar

author: edy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2016, 08:49:55 pm
content: Ok, there are a bunch of utilities which I downloaded. One is called "ChipGenius".http://www.usbdev.ru/files/chipgenius/. This utility is supposed to figure out the controller chipset in your USB stick, so you can figure out what driver/programmer utility to use to rewrite the information to the USB stick. I used ChipGenius_v4_00_1024.exe. As usual, make sure you have a good virus-scanner around. I don't know if this site is trustworthy but I had no problems.Then I found out my USB drive was using a Phison chipset and so I downloaded the Phison UPTool.http://www.usbdev.ru/articles/a_phison/uptool-repair/. I also had to use a Phison "Format & Restore" utility here...http://www.usbdev.ru/files/phison/phisonrestore/.There are a few other tools available, it all depends on the chipset that runs your USB stick:Alcor MP:http://www.usbdev.ru/articles/a_alcor/alcormp-repair/Chipsbank APTool:http://www.usbdev.ru/articles/a_chipsbank/cbm2098aptool-recovery/Chipsbank UMPTool:http://www.usbdev.ru/articles/a_chipsbank/cbm2098umptool-repair/DYNA MPTool:http://www.usbdev.ru/articles/a_smi/dyna-repair/ITE DTMPTool:http://www.usbdev.ru/articles/a_ite/dtmptool-it1167b-repair/Phison MPALL:http://www.usbdev.ru/articles/a_phison/mpall-repair/Phison UPTool:http://www.usbdev.ru/articles/a_phison/uptool-repair/Skymedi USB3.0 PDT:http://www.usbdev.ru/articles/a_skymedi/sk6221pdt-repair/SMI MPTool:http://www.usbdev.ru/articles/a_smi/smimptool-repair/The links are all on the right side menu of this Russian site. By the way, it took a few tries... even with the Phison tool, I remember it didn't work at first. I think I didn't have the version number correct. Anyways, it fixed it. That's how I discovered the true capacity of my USB stick was "faked"... I never tried loading it totally with stuff, but if I did then I would have discovered that trying to read it back would give me errors on the files near the "end" of the drive. You can use this tool to check:https://sosfakeflash.wordpress.com/2008/09/02/h2testw-14-gold-standard-in-detecting-usb-counterfeit-drives/http://www.usbdev.ru/files/h2testw/Also, I remember when I first recovered the drive I think it came back as being 0 bytes. So it would recognize the drive and mount it, but show 0 bytes free even though it was EMPTY. Somehow I got it back to life and with the proper capacity with those tools but I can't remember how. Needless to say, I'm not using that USB stick for storing or working on anything important... it will just be for transferring files from one computer to another, or to play back media/music.Here are some more links... like I said, mine was a Phison controller chip so I used these tools.... I don't know what chip yours uses:http://usb-fix.blogspot.ca/p/phison.htmlOne last thing... before you rush to format your USB drive, read this article... it mentions something about the VID and PID and noting some important details to make sure you don't kill your memory stick:https://flashchiptech.wordpress.com/2010/12/07/chip-genius-the-good-and-the-bad-about-this-software-in-identify-flash-memory-chips-and-repairing-fake-hacked-memory-how-useful-is-chipgenius/

author: vlad777
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 28, 2016, 09:47:18 pm
content: Can anyone tell me what does the MP stand for? All these programs have it, and also there is MPLAB-X .

author: edy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 29, 2016, 02:23:42 am
content: From what I have seen on other links, MP stands for "Mass Production" but I don't know. See here:http://www.ceu-talk.com/s/k0EgKNen/how-can-i-merge-a-usb-stick-shown-as-two-drives.htmlCould also be "Memory Programmer".