I have 111 Tons of Gold, nop I do not share it !!  - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: firewalker
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 02, 2011, 08:40:07 am
content: Quote from: Kiriakos-GR on October 02, 2011, 02:41:36 amMaybe it's time to demand the Gold Germany stole during WW2.Oh, wait... Our politicians gave up that right years ago. In the name of good partnership.Alexander.

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 02, 2011, 09:29:17 am
content: She sounds like Amelia Dalton.http://www.eejournal.com/archives/articles/20110930_fishfry/

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 02, 2011, 06:37:08 pm
content: Compared to the hundreds of milliard (AE: billion) Euros that Greece will need over the next years to avoid bankruptcy, those 4.x milliard Euros would not make much of a difference anyway.

author: Kiriakos-GR
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 02, 2011, 07:04:32 pm
content: Quote from: 0xdeadbeef on October 02, 2011, 06:37:08 pmI have a better idea ....I will return all the overpriced F16 back to the Americans.I will return all the overpriced leopard armored tanks back to the Germans.I will return all the overpriced and technically terrible made submarines back to the Germans.I will return all the overpriced SIEMENS communication systems back to the Germans.And my dept will be Zero ....The dept came from weapons sales ,and scams about telecommunication equipment.If the dept was because I had buy lots of hamburgers, I would be able to repay it by sale them.But the NATO does not aloud me to sale their expensive garbage to any one !! Only to buy them.All the countries with great dept, had recently buy American F16 and German leopard.And no it was not a subject of free decision.

author: FreeThinker
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 02, 2011, 08:01:06 pm
content: 140% of gnp due to defence expeniture? Grow up and start checking the pockets of your great and good!

author: ciccio
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 02, 2011, 08:14:42 pm
content: Hi Kiriakos.I'm certain thatthe debt(not only the Greek one, but also the Italian and the Spanish and the Portuguese all the other's ones)cannot and should notbe payed back.Those who created it, by acting as we all know, should repay it, not those (like you and me) that payed, without reacting, all the taxes and the pension funds that they asked from us.They are always there, always sitting at the places where power is exercised, faithful and obedient butlers of the economic superpowers, and demand us to sacrifice our future and the future of our families.Iceland, and Icelanders, did not pay.They changed the Constitution and want to put into jail the politicians and the bankers that started all this.

author: FreeThinker
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 02, 2011, 08:48:23 pm
content: Quote from: ciccio on October 02, 2011, 08:14:42 pmI am certain that the Greek Debt will not be repaid. Simple arithmetic shows it to be impossible. Europe has two options1) Cancel the Debt or2) Let Greece Default(Paying off the Debt is NOT an option financially or politically)Cancelling the Debt means the creditors do not get paid BUT may save the Euro.Letting Greece Default will likely have a severe impact on the Euro.In both situations the Greek economy is left shredded, no one willing to Trade or loan money and a vacuum will exist much like the Polish economy of the last few years. It doesn't look good for anyone but for certain the weaker economy's will be hit hardest and it will only be a matter of time before the stronger ones get together and cut adrift the weaker ones to sink or swim. God Help us all.What amazes me is Everyone owes everyone else money just WHO is raking it all in? Where has it all gone? The whole world needs a reality check, hopefully it can be done without the measures of the last two (ww1 and ww2)

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 02, 2011, 10:34:07 pm
content: Quote from: Kiriakos-GR on October 02, 2011, 07:04:32 pmThere are so many structural problems in Greece that it would probably take more than 20 years to overcome an obsolete system based on privileges, bribery and state-owned enterprise. Well, in case they finally would stop going on strike and actually start changing something to the better. E.g. about 25% percent of the working people work for the state. When trying to explain the system of taxi licenses this sounds like the system of guilds in the European middle ages. There is no competitive exporting industry. Of course the excessive military budget (which was about twice that of the average NATO states in the last decade) was part of the problem. But certainly nobody forced them to ruin themselves, but this is the result of the ongoing Cyprus dispute with Turkey. Instead of finding a peaceful solutions, they invested in tanks.So honestly, now probably the European partners have no other choice than to pump another few hundred milliards in a country with just 11 million inhabitants. But then, it was a mistake to introduce the Euro in so many countries with weak economy that had to cheat to fulfill the stability criteria.

author: Kiriakos-GR
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 02, 2011, 11:43:23 pm
content: Quote from: FreeThinker on October 02, 2011, 08:48:23 pmNo shit .... LOLThey was aware about it, even 20 years back.They was hopping that one day they will grab a big chunk of the Greek resources in Gold Gasoline or natural Gas.Paper money its worthless this days..Quote from: FreeThinker on October 02, 2011, 08:48:23 pmEurope has no options at all .The European citizens has only one option, to get-rid all the politicians who get payed under the table, from all the countries.And to start loving all their neighbors, because those are the only faithful friends that they have, or will ever have.By the way, the money about the weapons, have be payed back, to the Americans and Germans,their money is back in their countries, and no one lost a cent until now.0xdeadbeef put your flag on your profile, the least that you can do.

author: Achilles
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 03, 2011, 12:28:01 pm
content: Quote from: Kiriakos-GR on October 02, 2011, 11:43:23 pmSoem true words... we should keep in good mood with our Neighbors, but it seems that every land worldwide is somehow not best friends with its neighbor.....I have been in Costa Rica this summer. No army since 1948, which is a quite nice way and, apart from the criminality which may be due to the wide income gap between typical tourists and workers, it works.... A lot of policemen to present and so you feel a bit more safe (but be careful at night....).... To all those overprized Tanks and F16 your country bought but never wanted to actually have. Sell them to the middle East.....They seem to love that stuff......(Ok I will stop my cynism now)...I may try it next time when I go shopping. Ask at the shopping mall for a debt and then pay with it....but wait, still something missing in the calculation....I honestly understand that the people around you are upset and frustrated, but it's always easy to complain. You may agree that sth. has to be done, no matter in which way, because otherwise you are stuck. Not only in Greece they are lowering social support, increase the age for retirement, increase taxes and so on. Please try not to forget that.....I really hope there will be solution soon which helps all and not that there are just some people in your government which just want to fill their pockets before they let you down....

author: Kiriakos-GR
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 03, 2011, 03:38:03 pm
content: Well Achilles of Troy ....Even if I am aware about your soft spot, I will not hit it.As long you keep me listed as friend.

author: ErikTheNorwegian
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 03, 2011, 03:52:13 pm
content: Quote from: FreeThinker on October 02, 2011, 08:48:23 pmYou all are victims of the biggest pryamid scheme in the world..everyone is gonna be rich? Yeah right..

author: Achilles
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 03, 2011, 04:20:23 pm
content: Quote from: Kiriakos-GR on October 03, 2011, 03:38:03 pmOf course!We all have our points and shouldn't keep this forum as political platform.....it's all about electrons here and they are equal everywhere (as far as I know)

author: FreeThinker
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 03, 2011, 05:50:27 pm
content: And so it begins......http://web.orange.co.uk/article/news/asian_markets_slump_amid_greece_default_fears

author: A Hellene
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 03, 2011, 06:34:43 pm
content: Ahh,debt: One of my favourite subject matters to rant on!Well, first things first: Can we speak ofdebtwithout really understanding what it is, where it comes from and how it works? It sounds like trying to make an LED flash without even knowing what an LED is, how it works and what the Ohm's Law is --if such a Law really exists, as the mass media would easily tell their gullible clients...Debt is something that canneverbe repaid back in full,by design.If, hypothetically, the whole society attempted as a single unit to pay back their debt, they would eventually discover that the very instant they would have managed to return thePrincipal(the initial sum of money they borrowed from the banks), there would be no more money left in the money pool for them to pay theInterest, which the banks asked for in the initial loaning deal. To add insult to injury, the money pool will be empty right after the payment of less than 3% of the principal sum, since more than 97% of the money in circulation are nor really money but mere entries in accounting book records of the banks; but this is another story... Anyway, the economy will collapse while the Interest will have not yet been redeemed; so the banks will proceed in confiscating whatever assets were pledged as collateral to the initial loans.Isn't it brilliant? We lend themprinted paper symbols of value, they usually think of asmoneythat no one else has the right to print, and, in the end of the day, we end up with property of some real value (such as the land is) in our hands!It is impossible for everyone to pay back the Principal PLUS the Interest because the Interest money will not yet be existing; the Interest money will be created by the banks (out of thin air, due to the "fractional reserve lending" legal scam) right after the next time someone will sign up for a new loan; for which he will be convinced to return the new loan principle plus more interest money that will not yet be in existence until the creation of an even newer loan...Yes, I know, it sounds like every minute is born one --but this happens only because of theircultivatedignorance...For a crash-course on the Debt-Based Economy we all suffer from, I strongly recommend everyone to watch a lecture given by Gary Fielder at The University of Colorado School of Law on Dec. 4, 2008, called:The gig is up: Money, the Federal Reserve and YouAnother excellent piece that should be taught at schools is an eye-opening documentary that exposes and explains the monetary mechanism of our civilization era, since the times of the ancient Rome: It is the famous, non-fictional, three and a half hours long historical documentary "The Money Masters (1998)" written by Patrick S.J. Carmack in 1996: It is about how the private banks gained control of the global economy, step by step, as well as what happened to anyone who tried to oppose or to fight them. For anyone interested, it is available to be freely watched by video-sharing services, as I have already postedhere.Additionally, for those who assume that these banking tricks are new (even though we actually have new banking crafty procedures, like the Predatory Lending with the Credit Derivatives, Complex Derivatives, etc), let me state that this model of usury has its roots not in ancient Rome but further back in time. Excavations in the Mesopotamian region have revealed ancientclay tablets, most of them representing the very first archives of promissory notes, personal debt or other debt instruments or accounting lists, where several millenia ago the ancient Babylonian Priests were loaning gold to farmers who could not eventually pay back the loan they took plus the interest (which could be redeemed in gold ONLY and not in commercial products of the same or greater value), resulting in massive land confiscations and the enslavement (== being sold as slaves) of whole families, since those were the assets pledged as collateral to the initial loans. Unfortunately, the mercenaries "accidentally" destroyed all these archaeological sites in Afghanistan in 2003 plus its National Archeaological Museum. History Rewriting in Action? Probably...So, property confiscation and personal enslavement by debt is not a new practice.Want some more? Persia conquered Babylon in 536 BCE because they could not pay back their debt to the Babylonian priests, when the latter ones started loaning huge amounts of gold to the Persian state, a practice that led the Persian Empire in temporal prosperity and in further loans to pay back their previous and practically unredeemable debt. Please, keep in mind that the interest rate in those days was fixed at a yearly 33.3% rate and the interest was redeemable in gold only, which could not be found easily because the availability of gold was strictly controlled by the priesthood. Rings any bells?Later on, during the Peloponnesian Wars in 404 BCE, Spartans were forced to attack, conquer and enslave the Athenian states because in 412 BCE Sparta took from Persia a loan of 5,000 talents of gold (the Attic talent, as a weight, was about 26 Kg or 57 lbs) in order to build a fleet; and seven years later Sparta's debt grew to the astronomical amount of 37,500 talents of gold, forcing them into wars to find the gold they did not have and to move the burden of redemption of their own debt to the enslaved states. During the next century, an unbearable debt of about 1.5 million talents was also the initial reason Alexander the Great attacked and conquered, in his turn, Persia, where he built a temple (== a bank) in every city he acquired. The very next offensive war was initiated by the heavily indebted Rome against her own creditor, the Greek Empire. And it went on and on, until the present day...But this is just me,repeatingmyself...-George

author: FreeThinker
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 03, 2011, 07:55:18 pm
content: Money is all about confidence (read credit) the more people have confidence in your money the more you can borrow and the stronger your perceived wealth. Once peoples confidence in your money wanes the credit dries up and your money becomes worthless. Once upon a time money was backed by gold in the national reserve. Then the money started to run out.... not literally but just was not circulating quickly enough... what to do? PRINT MORE MONEY. So the gold standard went out of the window and governments simply printed printed money as required. Of course this only works if the recipient of your money can exchange it for something of equivalent (perceived ) value, once that confidence goes it simply becomes paper.I worked for a textile company that had a production facility in Poland, we made the raw textile and they processed it on to an end product and sold it Euro wide. EVERY order was a nightmare of credit guarantees because of the lack of confidence in the Polish economy even though in reality it was a simple stock transfer from one company to another in the same group. Multiply this a thousand times and you start to see the pending problems. Your economy my be strong at the moment but as the weaker ones struggle you have less and less markets to trade in and you slowly strangle alongside of them.