I need a better (cheap) probe(holder) for measuring signals on arbitrary devices - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 10, 2015, 11:41:45 pm
content: So frequently i find myself wanting to measure signals in some arbitrary device and the thing that most frequently ends up being the barrier - is the barrier that is presented by the PITA of holding the probe and manipulating the device at the same time. So I guess I am asking about innovative ways to get your desired signal into your measuring deviceWhat do you use?test clips, probes, beds of nails, etc. Several times I've made little probes using a sewing needle or something, just because the target is so small. It also has to have some bite to stay in place.My current one uses a needle and a ground clip attached to a length of mini coax held in a rubber dental pick held against the DUT by a rubber band strung between two screws sunk into a block of wood.It works, kind of. Assuming i don't move anything. I guess its a 1x probe without frequency compensation.. Not so great.I have real probes, but they are kind of bulky for the current arm. Tek (and probably other companies) make pro probe holders but they are insanely expensive. I guess that is kind of what I want a probe holder that will hold a probe in exactly the right spot with exactly the right amount of pressure to prevent it from moving around.What do you do?

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 10, 2015, 11:55:01 pm
content: First limit the types of signals you wish to observe, particularly voltage and frequency.Then, since this is a standard problem, look at the major test equipment manufacturers' catalogues.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2015, 12:24:03 am
content: The devices i've seen in that context are mostly too pricey for hobby use, at least for me right now.It wouldn't make sense for me to spend more on a probe holder than I did on the scope!A long time ago I saw an article by Bob Pease about making your own.Does anybody know which article that was in?I think I remember that the way he suggested to do it was using PCB material, which would be good, its light and strong and has a bit of springiness to it.I could include the compensation by integrating the circuit into the PCB.Quote from: tggzzz on April 10, 2015, 11:55:01 pm

author: Marco
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2015, 12:55:54 am
content: Lots of other threads about thishttps://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/probe-positioners-any-good-recommendations/https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/oscilloscope-probe-holder-with-vision/As long as you can come in from above a simple two leg holder using gravity to keep it in place works. If you absolutely need to come in from weird angles maybe you could solder a pogo pin on semi-flex coax (some people use it for a third hand as well).

author: coflynn
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2015, 01:08:25 am
content: I made a probe holder for my scope probe, and the scope probe tip is a fine-pitch spring-loaded tip so makes probing very easy. Here's an image (I forget why the background is removed, sorry it makes it looks like it's floating, I must have wanted to use this for something else):I've got some details including a video here:http://colinoflynn.com/2014/01/making-a-simple-scope-probe-holder/. The base is a 'magnetic base' which you can get at all sorts of places, and is available in various sizes. I've got some smaller ones now.The probe itself is a PicoScope probe, but is available from most of the manufactures too under their own name. Here's a comparison to a normal scope probe tip:The probe is the same as these ones:*PicoScope TA150 (350-MHz bandwidth)*PicoScope TA133 (500-MHz bandwidth)*Agilent N287xA*Teledyne LeCroy PP007*Rohde & Schwarz RTM-ZP10 (NB: this is very slightly different possibly, the others are clearly all made by the same manufacture though)One nice feature of the above probes is they sell little caps which make it easier to probe QFP packages too:So it's possible to vaguely hold the probe with one hand that waySee for exampleLecroy's accessory list, but again they are the same upstream supplier that is making all of them. There is also a nice ground blade that connects to a piece of copper tape you mount on the IC for your ground connection when using the caps.It's not the exact same (i.e. the above accessories DO NOT fit), but see Pomema Electronics part # 6491 - 6503, which are similar probes in terms of stabby sprining ends, but are much lower cost to buy separately.

author: Sailor
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2015, 01:21:26 am
content: @OPYou may have been thinking about 'What's All This Copper-Clad Stuff, Anyhow?' p65 from 'The Best of Bob Pease'www.ti.com/ww/en/bobpease/assets/www-national-com_rap.pdfThere are several other books/collections of Bob Pease's work. e.g.'A Tribute to Bob Pease - Troubleshooting Analog Circuits''Troubleshooting Analog Circuits - EDN Series for Design Engineers'and a lot more, I'm sure.It would be great if someone had a definitive list...

author: joeqsmith
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2015, 02:30:37 am
content: Quote from: coflynn on April 11, 2015, 01:08:25 amGood idea.

author: Ian.M
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2015, 02:44:41 am
content: When I was still in the service trade, we'd simply tack-solder an offcut of component lead to the pad in question and use the usual hook ended clip on probe tips.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2015, 04:12:20 am
content: That looks perfect..checking out the magnetic bases now.A magnet-enabled test area for rf devices..is perfect for positioning all the parts of the signal chain and also grounding everything, reducing RFI.Quote from: coflynn on April 11, 2015, 01:08:25 am

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2015, 04:22:25 am
content: Here are some more- Love his stuff..http://www.introni.it/pdf/Bob%20Pease%20Lab%20Notes%20Part%209.pdfhttp://www.introni.it/pdf/Bob%20Pease%20Lab%20Notes%20Part%208.pdfhttp://www.introni.it/pdf/Bob%20Pease%20Lab%20Notes%20Part%207.pdfhttp://www.introni.it/pdf/Bob%20Pease%20Lab%20Notes%20Part%205.pdfhttp://www.introni.it/pdf/Bob%20Pease%20Lab%20Notes%20Part%204.pdfhttp://www.introni.it/pdf/Bob%20Pease%20Lab%20Notes%20Part%203.pdfhttp://www.introni.it/pdf/Bob%20Pease%20Lab%20Notes%20Part%201.pdfhttp://www.introni.it/pdf/Bob%20Pease%20Lab%20Notes%20Part%206.pdfhttp://www.introni.it/pdf/Bob%20Pease%20Lab%20Notes%20Part%202.pdfQuote from: Sailor on April 11, 2015, 01:21:26 am

author: ivaylo
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2015, 06:49:32 am
content: Someone posted their Kickstarter campaign above but now you can buy whatever bits you need and DIY -http://pcbgrip.com/collections/fittings

author: Karel
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2015, 07:21:41 am
content: I use the Rigol probe brackets. They came together with the probes of the DS6000 series.The Rigol product number for the bracket only is RP5600A-0200701, I don't know the price.I like them very much. It gets a little crowded when you want to use 3 or 4 probes on a QFP-64...

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2015, 08:51:27 am
content: Quote from: coflynn on April 11, 2015, 01:08:25 amI 3D printed something similar for my existing 150MHz probes, and the result is electrically better: no ringing at 100MHz. HP produced similar devices for "500MHz" probes. With low-impedance Z0 probes similar techniques are available for 1.5GHz probes. (I've just received a version in nylon from Shapeways, but haven't verified its performance yet, but see no reason that it would be any worse.)Seehttps://entertaininghacks.wordpress.com/2015/04/23/scope-probe-accessory-improves-signal-fidelity/for more details.

author: Howardlong
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2015, 10:47:36 am
content: You can use those spring clamp things you get from the DIY store.

author: HighVoltage
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2015, 01:15:50 pm
content: I am using a granite measurement table that has a quick adjustment arm installed.This arm came with a holder for a micro gauge and one of the holes fitted perfectly for an Agilent scope probe.

author: codeboy2k
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2015, 01:33:10 pm
content: @howardlong I like that DIY probe holder of yours! I'll give that a try too.This guy from Teledyne-Lecroy has the Jaguar of probe and work clamps, it has a micrometer adjustment to move the probe tip up and down to touch the work.

author: SArepairman
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2015, 05:54:56 pm
content: One of the best methods for positioning arbitrary things is to use the liquid cooling "hose" from a lathe.http://www.instructables.com/id/Third-Hand-A-multi-use-helping-hand-for-electro/They show attachments for oscilloscope probes and such if you read the tutorial.

author: coflynn
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2015, 06:30:27 pm
content: QuoteWhile not a micrometer adjustment, the$15 magnetic-base dial holder I'm using has a knobthat allow you to achieve the same goal of adjusting pressure/moving the tip down nicely:EDIT: The magnet part isn't used for me at least, as don't have a steel workstation! But the base is very heavy so all you need for holding a scope probe. Just keep it turned 'off' to make it more difficult to bring near your hard drive...

author: ivaylo
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2015, 07:52:01 pm
content: Quote from: SArepairman on April 11, 2015, 05:54:56 pmI find these useless for precision work. Or at least the set I got from Sparkfun. They are super rigid so when once set you try and move them a milimeter, you push and push until it goes clank... and jumps half an inch. Tried lubricating and what not to no avail...

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2015, 08:57:45 pm
content: The bast probe holder is the lab assistant. Since companies tend to be frugal, and dont spend money to get us help, technicians, lab assistants, secretaries and or even apprentices, we use other engineers to hold the probe. Even though they are kinda over qualified to do that. They also complain a lot more.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2015, 10:16:51 pm
content: That looks very professional. Those adjustable/articulated arms look ideal.

author: jadew
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2015, 09:47:21 am
content: Wouldn't it be simpler to just solder a small wire? Probably takes a lot less than trying to position some whacky probe holder.

author: PCBGRIP
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2015, 02:16:15 pm
content: At the risk of self promotion, I wanted to share some ideas:We built our own "probing pcb",build details found here:http://pcbgrip.com/blogs/blog/19160631-building-a-probing-pcb. Basically building a simple PCB that connects pogo pins at your custom spacing location to a standard 0.1" header and you connect your test gear to the header. Custom probing PCBs could be built inexpensively to suit your own needs:In this picture you can also see a pogo pin (with head shrink) being held, with the test gear attached to the pogo.If your looking to hold a probe, this is another option, which can be found here:http://pcbgrip.com/collections/fittings/products/probe-clamp

author: cyr
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2015, 04:31:44 pm
content: The PCBGRIP parts to do work nicely with small scope probes, a little fiddly to get into the right position sometimes but hold very well. If you use the stand you can even probe both sides of a board.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2015, 05:07:09 pm
content: Quote from: PCBGRIP on April 12, 2015, 02:16:15 pmDon't worry about promoting good ideasIf push-comes-to-shove you can say something about "eating my own dogfood" or "believing in what I promote"More seriously, how well does/doesn't it work with scope probes that don't have pogo pins?Ditto, if you can't use a 6" ground lead because of its inductance, and have to use a probe plus its ground spring clip?

author: Fsck
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2015, 06:20:47 pm
content: Quote from: tggzzz on April 12, 2015, 05:07:09 pmdepends on your creativity with the set up. it's painfully configurable so your ability to visualize the solution is the only limit to what angles you can probe from.I'm not the most spatially aware so it takes me a bit to get the perfect setup.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2015, 07:07:18 pm
content: Quote from: Fsck on April 12, 2015, 06:20:47 pmMy question is more about whether a non-springloaded probe point (or two!) can be held against a pin/track. Pogo pins are undoubtedly more compliant in that respect. I'm sure I can adequately position the probe in an x-y plane, but the z-plane is more critical.

author: Fsck
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2015, 07:31:13 pm
content: Quote from: tggzzz on April 12, 2015, 07:07:18 pmx-y is idiotproof, but getting the critical amount of z-axis stability is your problem. in general it's quite difficult to get it perfectly stable for me. I guess the question is how stable do you need it to be?I can get my probing set up, but if you bump it, you'll need to restart.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2015, 08:15:10 pm
content: Quote from: Fsck on April 12, 2015, 07:31:13 pmDrat. But I'm not surprised.I'm still looking for something better thanorhttp://www.edn.com/ContentEETimes/Images/00PCB/cclad1f3.jpg

author: Fsck
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2015, 08:26:26 pm
content: I get solid, stable readings when I have it set up.

author: dadler
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 12, 2015, 10:02:22 pm
content: Quote from: PCBGRIP on April 12, 2015, 02:16:15 pmThanks for posting this. I have seen PCBGrip posted before but could not remember the name.I have been tempted to buy one of these kits a couple of times now, but I've had two reservations:1) The kit pages on your site, while showing all components quite neatly, don't really demonstrate the various ways you can configure all the parts. The pictures just look like a whole bunch of parts. It's not obvious to me which kit is appropriate, because I can't really see it in action. Some actual action pics of each kit would really help.2) (and this is more personal/subjective) I wonder if I would actually use the kit in practice, or if it will be more work than it's worth/take up more space than is practical. I have lots of various panavise bases and tops and for the most part they cover my PCB-holding needs well. I also have a cheap Aven PCB holder (http://www.amazon.com/Aven-17010-Adjustable-Circuit-Holder/dp/B00Q2TTQEE/), but I almost never use it because of how high it holds the board. The awesome anodized parts of PCBGrip appeal to my nerd-self, but I fear the setup would be much too fiddly and I would be constantly adjusting it.

author: PCBGRIP
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 13, 2015, 02:45:47 am
content: Quote from: dadler on April 12, 2015, 10:02:22 pmAgreed, the kit pages how a lot of parts. For each of the kit pages, there is a table on the page that shows the name and quantity of each part included in the kit. If you click on the part name, it will take you to that individual part and show some pictures of the part in action. But, we still need to show more parts in action - something we will work on.Quote from: dadler on April 12, 2015, 10:02:22 pmWhen I started building PCBs, I was building custom jigs made of various parts, including wood and springs. I could not find a setup to hold the PCB and be able to hold other things too (like hold through hole components upside down while I soldered). PCBGRIP is great at holding the PCB and 'something else'. PCBGRIP uses a open source aluminium extrusion (OpenBeam), which accepts standard 3mm hardware. That way, it is easy to attach what every you need to your setup, it addition to holding the PCB. The hinge assembly allows you to rotate the PCB 360 degrees. The PCB can be tilted. Also, the height of work can be adjusted, by raising or lowering the hinge assembly on the 10mm stainless rod. Here is an overview of the work height that can be accomplishedhttp://pcbgrip.com/blogs/blog/18208587-work-height-and-position. Here is a holder we designed to hold a Saleae logic analyzer, to give you an idea of how things can be attached to the OpenBeam:The Saleae holder is available on Thingiverse here :http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:735911

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 13, 2015, 04:41:15 pm
content: Quote from: jadew on April 12, 2015, 09:47:21 amMy colleagues do this with sometimes 10-15CM wires. Signal integrity is a magic world.I prefer soldering a small, 1-2mm hook. Best is a 1K resistor to SMA, SMA cable, BNC adapter scope, 50Ohm. 1:20.

author: jadew
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2015, 08:45:27 pm
content: Quote from: NANDBlog on April 13, 2015, 04:41:15 pmDepends a lot on the frequency. For most things, a 1-3 cm wire will have no noticeable effect on the reading and you can easily connect with the oscilloscope probe to it. Slow digital signals are more forgiving and you can definitely get away with longer wires.The SMA setup sounds interesting, but I'm having trouble imagining it, could you maybe post a picture?

author: SArepairman
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 23, 2015, 06:06:59 pm
content: Also, if you are making the boards yourself it is wise to include ground plane on top so you can do the oscope ground spring trick.You wind a spring around a drill blank the same diameter as your probes ground shield, then solder that spring to some ground plane exposed on the top of the PCB. The center of your spring should be where you want to probe, so you just stick a probe in it and everything is held in place nice.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 23, 2015, 09:58:59 pm
content: Quote from: SArepairman on April 23, 2015, 06:06:59 pmThere's also the very convenient commercial and homebrew techniques outlined inhttps://entertaininghacks.wordpress.com/2015/04/23/scope-probe-accessory-improves-signal-fidelity/

author: Cortex
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 19, 2018, 08:56:15 pm
content: I have just finished developing this great system for probing and injecting low power signals.Quite cheap too.https://www.ebay.ca/itm/High-Precision-Needle-PCB-Probing-System-Quick-Magnetic-Holders-Low-Profile/263447821265?autorefresh=trueNormCortex R&D IncQuebec, Canada

author: Neomys Sapiens
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2018, 01:04:53 am
content: I also collected all the small tip inserts for the Tek SMD probes which clumsy colleagues left wasted or simply lost and made pogo tip extensions and angular shifts out of them.

author: ivaylo
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2018, 07:41:19 am
content: Quote from: Cortex on January 19, 2018, 08:56:15 pmeBay says you don't ship to US, that right?

author: Cortex
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 02:50:31 pm
content: Quote from: ivaylo on January 20, 2018, 06:41:19 PM

author: Muxr
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 03:03:20 pm
content: One of the things I worry about is shorting pins when measuring live circuits, it's incredibly easy to do in some cases (particularly on dense ICs, trying to measure individual pins) and can result in unexpected damage.What I do if I need to measure delicate electronics, particularly if high bandwidth isn't important, I take some 30AWG wrapping wire (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00GWFECWO/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1) And lightly solder the wire onto the test points I like to measure. I then hook my probes to the wrapping wire and turn on the device. This then gives me the full freedom of connecting as many DMMs (most of my DMMs have clip leads on them) as I want and as many scope probes I need.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2018, 03:30:25 pm
content: @cortex seems to have relisted his little probe kit for a bit less than $50 and it actually looks quite competitive compared to similar products, IMHO.Cortex, have you ever considered using mini coax, and including a grounding connection for the metal plate? If I bought something like that I would either expect it to have a grounded shielded probe or I would modify it afterward to use shielded probe wire. I tried to build something similar using mini coax, it remains in a semi unfinished state, I need some more parts.I was using old drafting tools as the source for my parts. They are very cheap considering what they originally sold for.

author: Cortex
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2018, 08:20:23 pm
content: Quote from: Muxr on February 08, 2018, 03:03:20 pmI understand your concern. But when the needles are very sharp, this never happens because as soon as it touches the IC's lead, it bites right into the metal and won't slip. If you have the possiblilty to stick the needle in the softer solder, that's even better. In worst case, if you're really worried about shorting a critical circuit, you have the option of scraping off a bit of PCB enamel to uncover the trace of interest, and use that bare copper spot to probe the signal.But as an example, I've been debugging a baud rate problem on a super small circuit, the VESD05A8A in the LLP1713-9L package, where pins are 0.2mm wide and 0.4mm apart! The probes did a marvelous job. Before that, I tried the scope probes, and I got that slipping+shorting problem all the time.

author: Cortex
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2018, 08:31:19 pm
content: Quote from: cdev on February 08, 2018, 03:30:25 pmThanks! I think the quality/price ratio is hard to beat. I sure would love to mass produce them because right now, the profit margin is ridiculous.About the coax idea, I must admit that I try to stay away from specialy items like this. The less parts the better.The only other model I might create is an universal probe holder, so you will be able to position your fancy 500MHz+ probe precisely and directly on the PCB. The grounding challenge is left to you as usual, because it depends on each circuit's topology (where's the nearest ground) and the wire must be as short as possible.

author: AntonLoeb
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: October 08, 2018, 06:45:38 pm
content: Does someone have experience with this probe holderhttps://youtu.be/FUY33geMrq0?

author: HighVoltage
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2018, 07:10:01 am
content: Quote from: AntonLoeb on October 08, 2018, 06:45:38 pmWelcome to the forum, AntonLoeb.Do you have any idea who makes it or where to get it?

author: georgd
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2018, 07:27:19 am
content: https://www.probeholder.com/Swiss made, costs 98 CHF.

author: JohnG
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2018, 01:51:52 pm
content: Harbor Freight is your friend (or your regional equivalent):https://www.harborfreight.com/multi-position-magnetic-base-with-fine-adjustment-63663.htmlJohn

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2018, 06:11:31 pm
content: Quote from: Cortex on February 08, 2018, 02:50:31 pmAny updated listings?Also, pity about Torx — I think it’s the superior screw head for nearly all applications. I kinda wish Phillips would shrivel up and die. (Up in Canada you use Robertson screws a lot, right? So maybe you have fewer hateful experiences with Phillips. It doens’t help that many screws are actually PoziDriv, which works with a Phillips driver, but with even worse performance... and most people aren’t aware of PoziDriv so they don’t have the right drivers.)

author: MrW0lf
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2018, 07:46:07 pm
content: And Phillips is popular where? Masoland?For big things Torx and small things hex. For example with power tools everything adjustable is hex, and everything you screw into things is Torx. My CNC was also all hex and for stuff I added to it also did choose hex. No failures.

author: capt bullshot
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2018, 07:49:08 pm
content: Quote from: NANDBlog on April 13, 2015, 04:41:15 pmDo you happen to work for the same company as I do?I've seen this "technique" (the long wires) way too often.

author: Performa01
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2018, 08:50:43 pm
content: Quote from: capt bullshot on October 09, 2018, 07:49:08 pm... this would already make three of us!seriously though, at least for the two of us, the chance we both work for the same enterprise isn't even that low...

author: 2N3055
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2018, 09:18:21 pm
content: Quote from: Performa01 on October 09, 2018, 08:50:43 pmWhat else would you do ?+ on both wire hook and 1k and 450 ohm resistors terminated into 50 ohm scope...

author: bostonman
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 21, 2023, 02:11:06 pm
content: I'm digging up an old thread rather than start a new one.I like the Harbor Freight item (https://www.harborfreight.com/multipositional-magnetic-base-with-fine-adjustment-5645.html), but wondering if anyone has made a 3D holder?My needs would be for various scope probes and meter leads, so I'd need something that can adapt to different lead types.Recently I began repairing a board with 0402 components and need a spare hand. Something that would hold a probe lead and/or multi meter leads would be great.

author: hvontres
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 21, 2023, 08:22:59 pm
content: Quote from: bostonman on January 21, 2023, 02:11:06 pmYou might want to check out Noga arms (https://www.noga.com/Products/hold/Holding%20System) (or one of the knockoffs). I haven't used mine to hold probes, but for getting dial indicators into strange positions quickly, they can't be beat.

author: bostonman
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 22, 2023, 01:58:44 am
content: I didn’t see prices. Did I miss something? From looking at their products, I’d guess they aren’t cheap.

author: TopQuark
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 22, 2023, 08:38:01 pm
content: I use these surgical locking clamp thingys. Cheap, universal and effective.