The Chinese Moon Landing - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: xrunner
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2013, 02:21:23 pm
content: Found this buried on a newspage. I hadn't even heard this happened. We better get our act together or they'll take over the Moon!Quote

author: Abstr7ct
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2013, 03:44:56 pm
content: Did they take a permission from the US government to land on the moon?

author: jancumps
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 15, 2013, 03:47:46 pm
content: Cool that someone is picking up space age duties.

author: all_repair
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2013, 03:55:31 pm
content: Quote from: xrunner on December 15, 2013, 02:21:23 pmNASA actually wanted to collaborate with the Chinese. It is the US congress trying to find an enemy. Anyway the Chinese is not approaching as a race with anyone. Just like Dave proceeding with his uCurrent project, they are proceeding slowly as they see fixed. Maybe others may want to join in as it is a more predictable engineering project. I am always impressed by the big thinking of the UK. After UK lead the way, maybe all can join in later.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2013, 03:56:31 pm
content: The Chinese are proving their copycat skills again: to boldly do what everyone has done before.

author: jancumps
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 15, 2013, 03:57:59 pm
content: Ah, has the Netherlands been on the moon then?

author: xrunner
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2013, 04:18:21 pm
content: Quote from: Abstr7ct on December 15, 2013, 03:44:56 pmNo! The U.S. has already claimed it for ourselves, as we will the rest of the solar system. Mars shall be the next piece of solar system property we will inherit!

author: SeanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2013, 04:35:01 pm
content: The best ex equipment ones they could get from the recycling yard of course.

author: rozeh
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2013, 05:06:17 pm
content: I think its a toy.Iran successfully sends second mokey into space

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2013, 05:38:00 pm
content: Iran has a modest ambition: a man in orbit by 2020. India wants to send humans to the moon in the same year!

author: sdg
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2013, 05:48:40 pm
content: Quote from: rozeh on December 15, 2013, 05:06:17 pmDear Iran,Here in France, we have some useless politicians. We would gladly donate them to your space program, should you ever run out of test monkeys. Please help yourself. No need to return them after use.Best regards, etc...

author: staxquad
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2013, 07:04:46 pm
content: Quote from: xrunner on December 15, 2013, 04:18:21 pmchuckle, they can't even afford to have a spacecraft go to the International Space Station,they need to hitch a lift from the Russians every time they go there.you've got military spending, can't afford anything else

author: MatCat
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2013, 07:16:55 pm
content: Quote from: staxquad on December 15, 2013, 07:04:46 pmPerhaps JFK needs to come back from the dead?

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2013, 08:23:42 pm
content: Quote from: jancumps on December 15, 2013, 03:57:59 pmNeither have the Belgians (no, Urbanus doesn't count!)

author: lemmegraphdat
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2013, 08:33:47 pm
content: Quote from: Abstr7ct on December 15, 2013, 03:44:56 pmI think the US sold them the rocket tech. during the 90's. Should have had to steal It, like in the old days.

author: jancumps
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 15, 2013, 08:42:06 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on December 15, 2013, 08:23:42 pmHe does count. I have evidence:

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 01:17:17 am
content: Quote from: Wytnucls on December 15, 2013, 05:38:00 pmFixed that for you.

author: all_repair
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 01:47:16 am
content: The only way to stop the Chinese and the German is to replace their leaders with non-engineers. Engineers make very bad politicians.

author: johansen
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 02:06:00 am
content: i would say good on them.either man is going to get of this planet permanently or we're going to destroy ourself, we should have had a manned moon base already.there is not much time left, either mankind makes it to 9 billion people, or we end up at around one billion left alive. or we go to the moon and do the other things, again.lol, iran.. they could launch a nuke into orbit if they wanted to.. the support structure needed to keep a monkey alive is about the same weight as a medium warhead...and any idea that they haven't bought a number of nukes on the black market is nonsense.. if they want to start a nuclear war they can, but that would be suicide.

author: Frenchie
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 02:19:09 am
content: Quote from: xrunner on December 15, 2013, 04:18:21 pmThere's no American flags on the moon any more.Ifthe nylon is still intact, those flags have long been bleached white by the Sun (less than a year after they were placed by most estimates). The poetic thing is it makes the engraving on Eagle's landing leg more truthfulHere men from the planet Earth first set foot upon the Moon, July 1969 A.D. We came in peace for all mankind.There are, however, two steel pennants with the Hammer and Sickle stamped on them from when the Russians impacted the moon in 1959 with Luna 2. As I understand it, there's only one surviving example left on Earth, the one given as a gift to Eisenhower.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 02:27:23 am
content: Quote from: johansen on December 16, 2013, 02:06:00 amPolitical suicide that is... If they would kill their 'enemies' they would have to fantasize hard to come up with new enemies to keep their subjects ignorant.

author: JohnnyGringo
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 03:17:50 am
content: Quote from: johansen on December 16, 2013, 02:06:00 amJohansen, how is having a manned moon base going to help solve some of our problems that could destroy civilization? I'm having a hard time making that leap of faith.It won't reverse or slow global warming, prevent Iran from going nuclear, fix the US health care fiasco, etc.. I suspect that we could doanyorallof these things with the same amount of money and time as it would take to build a permanent self-sustaining habitat on the moon. EDIT: (moon habitat is also doable in short term, but I don't see how that's going to solve other problems back home).Serious inquiry, not a bust on your post.

author: staxquad
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 03:27:12 am
content: Quote from: Monkeh on December 16, 2013, 01:17:17 amThe USA has over 7,700 nuclear warheadsRussia has over 8,500The United Kingdom has over 225France has over 300China has over 250India has over 110Pakistan has over 120North Korea has over 10Israel has over 200Iran has 0The US has already used 2 nuclear weapons.The US, UK, France start most wars, most overthrows, Iran none.The US, UK, France steal resources, Iran has them.Iranian nuclear warheads is a red herring, BIG OIL is after Iranian OIL (and their access to the sea for Caspian OIL)Iran is way down the list as the next country who might use a nuclear weapon.

author: JohnnyGringo
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 03:30:36 am
content: Quote from: staxquad on December 16, 2013, 03:27:12 amThose were mere firecrackers compared to today's WMDs.

author: staxquad
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 03:37:14 am
content: Quote from: JohnnyGringo on December 16, 2013, 03:30:36 amIf only we could put the genie back into the bottle, nuclear is mutual assured destruction (and it's a toss which will get us there first, nuclear arms or nuclear reactors for power)

author: rozeh
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 04:40:37 am
content: I mean that robot(chinese robot) is a toy not our monkey.(I think it was a mistake)Quote from: Wytnucls on December 15, 2013, 05:38:00 pmYou can't compare the indian with us!! the indian is really weak for us!Quote from: sdg on December 15, 2013, 05:48:40 pmHuh?Quote from: Monkeh on December 16, 2013, 01:17:17 amYou are truly naive, Monkeh. Do you think we have couldn't make nuclear bomb? Do you think it's difficult to make a nuclear bomb? It's really simple for us!! but WE DO NOT NEED TO IT!Quote from: johansen on December 16, 2013, 02:06:00 amPlease don't speak about war, nuclear bomb or... and also NO POLITIC!Where are you from?

author: smashedProton
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 08:35:24 am
content: Quote from: staxquad on December 16, 2013, 03:27:12 amThis is false, Iran definitely has nuclear warheads. Do you want to know how I know? Its because nobody has invaded them yet and they have oil.

author: smashedProton
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 08:36:45 am
content: Quote from: staxquad on December 16, 2013, 03:37:14 amNuclear bombs brought peace to europeI think that is a good thing.

author: johansen
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 09:17:36 am
content: yeah, like i said iran has nukes.in fact, there were some western journalists if i recall who successfully found someone willing to sell them a nuke, and they made a documentary about it.anyone who's heard stories about suitcase nukes... knows about how much they would weigh, and its about the same as a monkey and an oxygen tank + scrubber + everything eleseQuote from: JohnnyGringo on December 16, 2013, 03:30:36 amthis is really the scary part... 1 megaton in a city is 10 millions+ dead...and its not the nuke that will do it, but rather the firestorm that follows a few hours afterward.look up stories of Dresden.. for a 12 mile radius the wind speed was such that you could not escape.

author: Kjelt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 09:21:51 am
content: Quote from: smashedProton on December 16, 2013, 08:36:45 amYou should get your facts straight: it brought the japanese to surrender and bring peace to the east (pacific) region. Europe was already liberated.

author: Kjelt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 09:23:58 am
content: Quote from: xrunner on December 15, 2013, 04:18:21 pmWhich has no meaning at all. The indians claimed the United States more then a thousand years ago..........

author: Galenbo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 09:54:55 am
content: Quote from: nctnico on December 15, 2013, 03:56:31 pmNobody has ever copied like the chinese before.So in that way, they are innovative :-)

author: Kjelt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 10:55:22 am
content: Quote from: wilfred on December 16, 2013, 10:28:54 amYes not to mention their kitchen, if something is alive they have a recipe for it!

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 11:11:42 am
content: Quote from: Kjelt on December 16, 2013, 09:21:51 amSmashedProton probably had the cold war period in mind, when the likelihood of mutual nuclear destruction reduced the threat of a Soviet conventional invasion.

author: G7PSK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 11:44:28 am
content: Dose the Chinese rover, rove or hop around the moon, its called the Jade Rabbit.The launch and landing were plastered all over the BBC TV news.

author: Bored@Work
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 12:15:26 pm
content: Quote from: wilfred on December 16, 2013, 10:28:54 amActually, the Chinese space program got a head-start because they got equipment and knowhow from their Russian comrades - when they were still comrades. And they helped themselves to more knowhow with espionage. For the current moon landing they had to enlist the help of ESAhttp://www.esa.int/Our_Activities/Operations/ESA_teams_ready_for_Moon_landingfor tracking.As for Chinese breakthrough inventions like gunpowder, compass, paper and printing. Yep, and that's about it. Ok, I know of one more chinaware. But what else? It isn't as if there was historically a constant stream of innovations.

author: chickenHeadKnob
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 12:57:39 pm
content: The real deal chinese full moon golden jade rabbit:http://www.sextoy2990.com/usr/product.aspx?id=236For added pleasure checkout the companion rover "armour missile rabbit vibrator". That thang is scary!

author: Kjelt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 01:34:58 pm
content: Quote from: Bored@Work on December 16, 2013, 12:15:26 pmI think that is just a question of time, the japanese copied everything from the 1920's to early 1970's , pretty amazing what they manufacture and think of themselves now.In China there are more cum laude university graduates each year then in the USA in probably 20 years. That said, the real brains in the USA are also mostly imported from India, China, Russia, you name it. Look at the differences in discipline and the school system.Nope just a question of time and the wealth, knowledge, resources all shift to China just as history has shown so many times before when it shifted to the West.

author: JohnnyGringo
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 02:01:35 pm
content: Quote from: Kjelt on December 16, 2013, 01:34:58 pmWhy build when you can buy?

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 02:23:52 pm
content: Quote from: wilfred on December 16, 2013, 05:22:59 amThink how much fun it would be for amateur groups to start a Moon Bot Wars combat show for TV. The advertising would easily pay for several teams to build the necessary rocketry and landers.

author: Kjelt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 03:22:54 pm
content: Quote from: JohnnyGringo on December 16, 2013, 02:01:35 pmSoon your country can not buy anything anymore with that deficit

author: echen1024
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 05:05:53 pm
content: Quote from: G7PSK on December 16, 2013, 11:44:28 amAnything that hops and looks remotely like a bunny would be cooked. I'm Chinese. Trust me.

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 05:10:38 pm
content: Quote from: Kjelt on December 16, 2013, 03:22:54 pmDutch public deficit 4.1% in 2012.The Netherlands' public deficit came in at 4.1 percent of GDP last year, the fourth year in a row the eurozone country breached the EU's 3.0 percent ceiling.The public deficit, which also includes local government and health spending, declined from 4.5 percent of gross domestic product in 2011 and a high of 5.6 percent in 2009.The Netherlands' public debt rose to 71.2 percent of GDP. The EU ceiling, widely breached, is 60 percent of GDP.The US public debt stands at the same level of 71.43% of GDP, as of June 1013.

author: Kjelt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 06:29:15 pm
content: Quote from: Wytnucls on December 16, 2013, 05:10:38 pmYeah not very good alsohttp://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/us-person-debt-now-35-percent-higher-greece_660409.html

author: JohnnyGringo
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 06:44:21 pm
content: Quote from: Wytnucls on December 16, 2013, 05:10:38 pmYea... We be good at printing money. O0

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 07:48:10 pm
content: Quote from: Wytnucls on December 16, 2013, 05:10:38 pmNot a problem. The debt per person is about half that of the US. A lot of the money the Dutch government borrowed is invested into the infrastructure (roads and railways). Instead of reducing spending, the government increased spending to keep jobs and have the infrastructure ready when the economy goes up. A lot of income is generated from transporting stuff to and from Germany and other countries in Europe through the biggest port found in 'the western' part of the world. Except for tomatoes (world's no1), flowers, meat, cheese and XTC there is not much being produced in the NL.

author: staxquad
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 10:38:31 pm
content: Quote from: Kjelt on December 16, 2013, 09:21:51 amThat ain't right either, the Japanese were defeated already, it was just to get them to capitulate a few days earlier so that the Russians could not get in the mix and also to let the Russians know who could push who around (until Russia got their own).QuoteThe Japanese casualties at Hiroshima and Nagasaki were just a byproduct of the US displaying their power.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 11:58:55 pm
content: Quote from: DiligentMinds.com on December 16, 2013, 04:52:36 pmWhat do the USA hide?Got proof of this?

author: staxquad
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 11:59:12 pm
content: Quote from: AcHmed99 on December 16, 2013, 11:25:28 pmYes, I could have worded it better, maybe that the Japanese were collateral damage to American ambitions.The quote I provided regarding Russia spells it out, Japan was already defeated, the US dropped the atomic bombs to affect Russia, not Japan.The estimated casualties was supplied by the same who bombed. It's all justified when they can get what they want and invent excuses. The same went for attacking Iraq because of 9-11, but Iraq was not involved, so pile on the excuses, Saddam killed his own people, WMD (nowhere to be found), so the US is justified in murdering over 1 million Iraqis? Ulterior motives (oil capture) but you are led to believe some cock and bull story to hide the theft and murder of it all. Make you believe a noble justification when it's all ignoble.

author: c4757p
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 16, 2013, 11:59:59 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on December 16, 2013, 11:58:55 pmMoon martians! Duh!

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 12:01:45 am
content: Quote from: AcHmed99 on December 16, 2013, 11:25:28 pmWhether it was a "good move" or not is probably beside the point. The fact is it was almost certainly inevitable that any new weapon would have been used in war.But yes, it gave an example to the future generations of what even crude prototypes of these things are capable of.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 12:05:28 am
content: Quote from: TerraHertz on December 16, 2013, 02:23:52 pmVery likely!That would be pretty awesome

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 12:06:40 am
content: That reminds me. Whatever happened to the Google Lunar X prize?

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 12:38:15 am
content: Quote from: DiligentMinds.com on December 17, 2013, 12:28:00 am*plonk*

author: xrunner
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 12:44:17 am
content: Quote from: JohnnyGringo on December 16, 2013, 06:44:21 pmMoney is a good product that's easily produced in large quantities and it has inherent value right off the production line. People like it and will use it everyday. What more could you ask for?

author: c4757p
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 01:06:55 am
content: Quote from: DiligentMinds.com on December 17, 2013, 01:02:03 amMoonlight casts shadows on the Earth; I would suspect that Earthlight casts shadows on the moon...? I mean... am I missing a reason why this is not stupidly obvious?QuoteWhat if somebody discovered something in the data protocol that hinted at a vulnerability in either the receiving system or in the probes and rovers themselves and tried to exploit it? Encryption is a good idea in general whenever data is to be sent through clear space.

author: xrunner
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 01:31:50 am
content: Quote from: xrunner on December 17, 2013, 12:44:17 amQuote from: Mechatrommer on December 17, 2013, 01:23:12 amQuoteSo wealth has to be associated with material things. But of course you are iching to inject some sort of religious interpretation here, as usual.

author: lemmegraphdat
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 01:34:56 am
content: Gold and silver have almost zero intrinsic value. The value is based on the dollar which is the true measure. You "precious" metal guys live in a fantasy land. We say 10 dollars worth of gold for a reason.

author: c4757p
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 01:40:42 am
content: Quote from: DiligentMinds.com on December 17, 2013, 01:36:06 amYou might notice that I gave one.Quote from: DiligentMinds.com on December 17, 2013, 01:36:06 am"You're suffering from cognitive dissonance. It's perfectly understandable! It's just that your long held beliefs are causing you mental discomfort!"QuoteQuotes deleted text.

author: echen1024
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 01:47:15 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on December 17, 2013, 12:38:15 amOh right. You have no absolute proof but think that they absolutely are faked.I have no proof that quarks are massive, but they obviously areYou sir, are full of bullshit.

author: xrunner
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 01:52:38 am
content: Quote from: DiligentMinds.com link=topic=24091.msg348830#msg348830Yea, that's all it takes to find the truth. Search for it on the internet.

author: GeoffS
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 01:54:29 am
content: This thread is about the Chinese moon landing not your own personal conspiracy theories.Can we get it back on track please?

author: c4757p
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 01:56:28 am
content: Quote from: DiligentMinds.com on December 17, 2013, 01:50:20 amThen explain to me how you think encrypted devices get hacked. Usually it has to do with the few unencrypted channels they must expose.Text deleted by moderator. Please read your PM

author: GeoffS
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 02:13:56 am
content: You have to assume that in any space mission there is probably (almost certainly) a military component, perhaps more so for the Chinese missions.Sanitizing the data would make sense in this case - at least to the military mind.

author: c4757p
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 02:19:19 am
content: Quote from: DiligentMinds.com on December 17, 2013, 02:10:28 amSimple - once you have an encryption scheme, spreading it to more data costs you nothing, whereas the repercussions offorgettingto spread it to one particular thing that happens to be vulnerable cost you a lot. So you use care and encrypt everything just in case.There is nothing in my bathroom worth stealing, but I don't have a parallel, non-locking door to it from outside my house. I still need my house key to access it.

author: chickenHeadKnob
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 02:29:39 am
content: Quote from: GeoffS on December 17, 2013, 02:13:56 amThere is an even more basic motivation, self preservation and control of information in a military/space bureaucracy. Control of information = power. I can just barely remember some details of the story from the sixties when a British school teacher who was also a Ham and his students decoded some images from a soviet space probe. These were then published on the front page of some major daily. That newspaper was then plunked down on the desk of Kruschev, or who ever was in power, who then subsequently threw a conniption fit that english children had the pictures first. The delay through the soviet bureaucracy was typically 10 days for that information chain. I wish some english hams with a better memory would fill out the details.

author: JohnnyGringo
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 03:03:07 am
content: It makes me wonder, "Why?". Why bother going back to the moon? Unless they thought there was something to gain. Russia and China both received some of the materials that we brought back. Was this just a display of capability?If so, is this all they were capable of? Why not go for some of the more unexplored regions, like the asteroid belt?Even if this was a prelude to a manned moon mission, why bother going back? They should be reaching further and higher.

author: JohnnyGringo
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 03:16:13 am
content: One of the reasons the US never went back (to the moon), was because it became decidedly "uninteresting" (scientifically) and rather ho-hum.(culturally)I think a trip to Titan would be much more interesting:sen.com/News/nasa-s-cassini-spacecraft-reveals-clues-about-saturn-moonQuote

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 03:23:50 am
content: Quote from: DiligentMinds.com on December 17, 2013, 02:10:28 amCould be any number of systems engineering reasons.Perhaps, because the control data must be encrypted, it was just easier to have everything use the same encryption (and likely compression) system. One less system issue to deal with.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 03:28:32 am
content: Quote from: JohnnyGringo on December 17, 2013, 03:03:07 amThere is plenty to gain.There is still a LOT to be leaned about the moon. All the Apollo era stuff was pretty crude scientifically.I think at present we know more about Mars than about the moon.The main reason however is that the moon is a close target. You get to try out all your long range navigation stuff, comms, propulsion, landing, rovers etc, without having to wait years to get there, you are there in 4 days.

author: JohnnyGringo
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 03:39:26 am
content: From a "news" source:www.stuff.co.nz/world/asia/9523988/China-plans-next-space-launchQuote

author: Frenchie
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 04:34:31 am
content: Quote from: JohnnyGringo on December 17, 2013, 03:03:07 amIt was still interesting enough for the Russians to send probes to bring back more (albiet tiny) samples in 1970, 72 and 76. (Luna 16, 20 & 24 respectively). Even though N1 was a dud and their manned program subsequently never went anywhere the soviet Moon probe program is actually quite interesting. First man made object to leave Earth orbit (by accident) in Luna 1, First man made object on the moon in Luna 2, a full ten years before a human set foot on it.Actually, the Soviet (and Russian) space program is interestinggenerally. Every manned launch they've ever conducted has been on a descendant of the R7 ICBM, if it aint broke...

author: Stonent
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 04:44:52 am
content: Quote from: Frenchie on December 17, 2013, 04:34:31 amI guess it was because it was Soyuzful?

author: rozeh
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 04:45:59 am
content: Dear EEVblog(Dave) and GeoffS,I had already said to guys that it's better you don't speak about politics or war or... because it will cause to contention.(I hope my remark don't will upset the guys. I like the all american and aussie and europeans)

author: JohnnyGringo
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 04:58:55 am
content: Quote from: Frenchie on December 17, 2013, 04:34:31 amRight, that was 37 years ago. But today, flying to the moon to enrich your rock collection seems a little childish. Time to grow up and reach higher and further! On to Titan I say! (I think Titan is our best chance at finding an extra-terrestrial example of a carbon-based life-form)

author: rozeh
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 05:14:05 am
content: Quote from: JohnnyGringo on December 17, 2013, 04:52:00 amUh-ha. Thank you for discourage me(put sb down me).

author: JohnnyGringo
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 05:28:46 am
content: Quote from: rozeh on December 17, 2013, 05:14:05 amWhat's "sb"? Antimony?Chemical ElementAntimony is a chemical element with symbol Sb and atomic number 51. A lustrous gray metalloid, it is found in nature mainly as the sulfide mineral stibnite.Symbol: SbI shouldn't have been so rude in my response. I apologize. But there certainly are POLITICAL and MILITARY implications / aspects to this or any adventures. And trying to stifle that kind of discussion "because it will cause to contention" or a few would be offended ... is well, offensive in its self.Contention is what debate is all about. It should be encouraged, not discouraged.We don't all live in a country that stifles public debates.

author: rozeh
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 12:24:49 pm
content: Quote from: JohnnyGringo on December 17, 2013, 05:28:46 am

author: JuKu
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 01:21:31 pm
content: Quote from: DiligentMinds.com on December 17, 2013, 03:10:50 amNot a secret, the Chinese have stated that one of the long-term goals is a permanent mining station. And one of the reasons in indeed helium-3. It is known that the top two meters of lunar soil is rich in that, as helium-3 comes from solar wind. On earth, the sun-produced H3 is trapped in top part of the atmosphere, and being so light, it is blown away. On the surface, you can get some from particle accelerators. It is enormously usable stuff: I once saw a documentary clip of a desktop proof-of-concept fusion reactor burning H3, controlled by an ordinary PC. No practical use - unless you have a helium-3 mine...The other goal is a permanent base and a space station: If you have water (moon has plenty) and power (moon has plenty of sunlight and H3), you have fuel. Operating missions to rest of the solar system is far more easier from moon's small gravity than from earth.The Chinese are good in big, long-term projects.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 01:35:54 pm
content: Quote from: JohnnyGringo on December 17, 2013, 05:28:46 amWe also don't all contribute to a forum that provides anything goes debates.There are countless forums to discuss politics, military, and alien conspiracy theories on, but this isn't one of them. This is primarily an electronics (and technology) discussion forum.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 17, 2013, 01:42:26 pm
content: Quote from: rozeh on December 17, 2013, 04:45:59 amPersonally, I'm all for a free-for-all debate on anything, and verbal fisticuffs, and I find both politics and war rather interesting myself. But professionally, unfortunately I have to try and run an electronics forum with a modicum of responsibility.So if it look like threads like this a going to take off into the mud, threads do have to get reigned in occasionally.The odds comments and banter are ok, but it's the nasty slippery slope into the gutter that needs watching out for.

author: GK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 18, 2013, 12:03:50 am
content: Quote from: JuKu on December 17, 2013, 01:21:31 pmHelium 3 is a byproduct of the decay of tritium in nuclear warheads. I use helium 3 tubes for neutron detection (geophysics). Helium 3 is the best gas for he job, but world wide stocks are seriously depleted and the price has gone through the roof since 911 as neutron detectors are used for "Homeland protection". A recent quote for a tube that I bought in 2003 for $1300 costs $8500 now.Though homeland security has been the biggest impacting factor, Helium 3 has also been going up in price over the past decade of so due to the efforts of both the USA and Russia to reduce their number of nuclear warheads, which are the primary source for commercial helium 3.

author: mrflibble
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 18, 2013, 02:15:44 am
content: Quote from: DiligentMinds.com on December 17, 2013, 03:10:50 amThe moon as proving ground for capabilities makes a lot of sense IMO. And there is indeed plenty of exploration that can be done there. Checking for viable amounts of He-3 would definitely be on the list. Another thing that could be very interesting is to put a long baseline array on the farside of the moon for some serious radio astronomy. You could even expand the baseline over time. And big advantage is no need for fuel for orbital adjustments, because well, moon.Or the ever popular space elevator. Last time I checked we didn't have fibers strong enough for a terrestrial tether. But for the moon you can make do with a lot less tensile strength, for which fibers are already commercially available. "All" we need is someone crazy enough to pick up the outrageous tab without any immediate payoff. Just like on earth it will probably make more sense for a while longer to just use chemical propulsion. Anyways, my main point here being that should spinning long fibers become a lot cheaper over time, it might become affordable to actually deploy a tether above the moon. That would 1) be totally awesome and 2) be a good way to practice operations of such a thing. But we'll see probably see electrodynamic tethers around the Earth sooner since there's plenty of payoff there and it's not nearly as expensive. Luckily there is a pretty big market for strong fibers so that will get progressively cheaper over time as manufacturing keeps improving.At any rate, I wish the Chinese the best of luck with their moon missions. And more of it please!As much as the various countries differ, we're still along for the same ride on the same rotating mudball hurtling through space at ludicrous speed. XD

author: mos6502
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 18, 2013, 06:07:02 pm
content: Quote from: JohnnyGringo on December 17, 2013, 03:03:07 amCouple things:- a radio telescope on the back of the moon would be awesome, because a huge problem with radio astronomy today is all the man made noise. On the dark side of the moon, you could be sure that any signal you pick up isn't man made.- an optical telescope on the moon. Hubble had only a 2.4m mirror and blew all other earth based telescopes out of the water. A large mirrored telescope could be built on the moon that would provide immensely detailed pictures.The problem is, it would be hugely expensive to transport all the necessary materials to the moon. A solution could be to send robots that mine the required materials directly on the moon and then build most of the stuff from the raw materials.In any case, sooner or later, we will run out of resources and/or living space. There are 7 billion people on this planet right now. By 2080, it could be 14 billion. Any nation that gains a foothold on the moon right now will be at a huge advantage later on.

author: rozeh
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 19, 2013, 05:21:30 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on December 17, 2013, 01:42:26 pmYou are owner(for forum). in all cases, you are right, Dave. personally, I like the all aussie (I have many friend from australia in avrfreaks.net (john, Ross,...) or etc).my remarks just was for prevention of probable conflicts (Because I saw that some post has modified).anyway, Thanks Dave for create this forum. in many cases, I had already seen your videos in youtube and enjoye of those. we iranian like you.

author: Kjelt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 19, 2013, 07:42:39 am
content: Quote from: mos6502 on December 18, 2013, 06:07:02 pmProblem are not the people themselves but the comsumption of these people and most important fresh water and food. I don't see how the moon can significantly contribute there at least with current technology. Besides living on the moon requires an atmosphere to protect from cosmic radiation or people won't have a long life.But hey let's contribute to stay on earth and let's all stop procreating.

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 19, 2013, 08:26:12 am
content: Quote from: mos6502 on December 18, 2013, 06:07:02 pmHow so?To be clear, I'm not questioning the value of space exploration, and agree there are over 7 billion people on Earth now, and it's still going up. I even agree to some extent with the Global Cull types, that Earth would be (and was) a nicer place with under one billion humans.But I don't see space technology making any difference to the population problem. There simply aren't the resources (energy or materials) to boost enough people out of the gravity well each year, to make any significant difference to even the population growth rate, let alone the static population. Not to mention the food, air, water and machinery they'd need to stay alive.Space exploration _might_ get started with small numbers of people boosted up there - tens or even hundreds. Then IF (big if) the problems of creating self-sustaining biospheres capable of growing food could be solved, they could begin increasing numbers the natural way. That's also putting aside issues like the high background radiation level outside Earth's atmosphere, long term epigenetic error accumulation, and so on.But the idea of space travel ever making a difference to Earth's population problem - nope. Not without a reactionless anti-gravity drive, or something like that.The only 'big advantage' any nation would gain through having an active Moon base (or asteroid belt base) would be the kind in Heinlein's 'The Moon is a Harsh Mistress'. It's a good place from which to throw big rocks at Earth.

author: Rick Law
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 21, 2013, 06:00:47 am
content: As with the first satellite, achieving it was not about the event per se, but a statement about the state of technology of the achievers themselves. America was not worried because there was a metal basket ball overhead, America was worried because it told the world that Russia got it done and America was "not yet."In doing what it did, China proved to the world it can. I am sure some if not many of the technologies were "copied", but that's the way one learns.I believe it as Einstein, or someone with similar stature who said: "When standing on the shoulders of giants, one can see far." So, to learn from example is smart. Firstlearn how to do something by example, then learn to do something by themselves. Not a bad way.Let's say the entire thing was copied. And let's just say the blue print and specs are all done for them, tested for them, and available in kit form... Even under those terms, getting the kit assembled and getting the whole plan executed was still a hard job to do and doing so is a major accomplishment. Given the current state of international affairs, I am fairly sure no one shipped them a "kit with some assembly required."I like this a lot. We (the "developed nations") need a kick in the bud. We have been arrogant and got lazy. We need the competition between each other and with others. We need the pressure to keep us moving forward.

author: mrflibble
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 21, 2013, 06:22:48 am
content: Quote from: TerraHertz on December 19, 2013, 08:26:12 amI don't see space tech as being The Solution  either. But luckily we don't have to think in terms of any one solution. We can however think in terms of many parts of the puzzle, small and big. If we can even get some of us pesky humans out there, then we have a chance tofuck up the neighborhoodspread life out there as well.QuoteIndeed. Self-sustained biospheres are a BIG fat if. Without that it is already game over from the start.Hell, even a biosphere with planet Earth IN the loop (having crucial bits shipped from Earth to your habitat) is already a tall order. Problems number 1, 2 and 3 probably have something to do with water, water and more water.QuoteWhile I am all for reactionless drives, the lack of that doesn't have to stop us. Either fission or fusion powered reaction drives (preferably the kind that doesn't radiate your balls off) could get us a long way already. But we currently don't even have the tech to make that on Earth, so that requires some work. But in terms of payoff, we should definitely get going on that since energy production without burning more fossil fuels would be quite handy. Just cheaper energy (cheap in terms of messing up our planet, not cheap in terms of arbitrary strange units) + better desalination processes could help already with our big population.QuoteAnd lets not forget the big advantage of having a supercomputer with a good sense of humor!

author: Kjelt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 21, 2013, 09:12:31 am
content: To all moonlanding conspiracy theorists, this movie was just released, what really happened

author: mianchen
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 24, 2013, 08:33:56 pm
content: Quote from: Kjelt on December 21, 2013, 09:12:31 amroflmaosent from Mars

author: M0BSW
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 24, 2013, 08:50:37 pm
content: According to some UFO sites their looking for ET's, it's strange that some countries do everything to hide this stuff , while other countries don't , here in the UK there is or was a minister in government for UFO's, hiding it just make people suspicious , hope they do find something, they also just unveiled 3 yes 3 Stealth fighters in one go, which look pretty impressive. and did anyone see the TV program in the UK , that show the robot they made to keep their astronauts company on long missions, the robots adapt them selves to the interests of the human, enabling sensible two way conversations with the machine.

author: Galenbo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2014, 11:23:46 am
content: Quote from: Abstr7ct on December 15, 2013, 03:44:56 pmNo, but NSA hacked their equipment. So all data goes to the USA even before it goes to china.Everybody happy :-)

author: GeoffS
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 13, 2014, 11:58:51 am
content: Direct from the Chinese media:http://www.ecns.cn/2014/02-12/100479.shtml

author: xrunner
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2014, 12:32:52 pm
content: Quote from: GeoffS on February 13, 2014, 11:58:51 amSpace is tough China - come back to me when you land a human being there (and they live to tell about it) LOL.

author: JuKu
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2014, 12:35:27 pm
content: Better news today:"Yutu has come back to life," said Pei Zhaoyu, the spokesman."http://www.ecns.cn/2014/02-13/100662.shtml

author: G7PSK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2014, 01:41:16 pm
content: The curse of fake capacitors strikes again?

author: Mr Smiley
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2014, 08:05:32 pm
content: I heard on the news ( uk ) last night that the device might be coming back to lifeThey also said that it had an expected mission lifespan of 3 months.Isn’t that expecting tooo much from something made in china