Pop goes the MB: Does anyone have a Promise PDC20378 compatible controller? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: marmad
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 10, 2012, 10:31:29 pm
content: Today I tried to boot up one of my old work computers (ASUS PC-DL - dual Xeon) and it wouldn't POST. Unhooked and removed everything as per SOP, and the next time I applied power I got a nice mini-explosion, smoke, and that smell we all love/hate from the circuitry under one of the sockets (see attached photo).Anyway, I suppose I might be able to fix the MB if I throw some time at it - but honestly, I don't really care about it (I have other newer faster work computers) except in one regard: it had a Promise PDC20378 controller for RAID - and there's a bit of data I'd like to retrieve from the array (most of the data had already been backed-up - there are just a couple of leftover files).Well, even though I thought it highly unlikely, I tried hooking the array to Intel, JMicron / Gigabyte, Marvell RAID controllers in succession on the off-chance one of them might recognize it - but, as suspected, no luckSo, the question is - does anyone have either an old unused PCI card or motherboard with a Promise PDC20378 compatible controller?

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 10, 2012, 10:34:36 pm
content: What sort of array was it?If it's a simple mirror it should be easy to recover without needing a compatible controller.

author: marmad
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 10, 2012, 10:40:17 pm
content: Quote from: Monkeh on December 10, 2012, 10:34:36 pmGive me some credit! I wouldn't be posting here if it was just a mirrorSeriously though, it's 4 drives in a RAID0+1; obviously the mirror is irrelevant - I need to be able to read the stripe.

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 10, 2012, 10:43:34 pm
content: These are not hardware RAID controllers, they are merely standard ATA controllers with its own BIOS so computers can boot from them and a Windows driver since Windows can't boot from software RAID.Linux Live CDs may recognize it automatically or after some mild persuasion with the aptly named 'fakeraid' driver. There are also software solutions like the commercial Raid Reconstructor.

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 10, 2012, 10:45:06 pm
content: Okay, stripe is a bit harder, yes.I have a PDC20375 somewhere, I'm not sure if that will work. Let me have a look.E: Yeah, don't think so.alm has a point, though. dmraid might be able to sort that array out without the controller present.

author: marmad
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 10, 2012, 10:57:21 pm
content: Quote from: alm on December 10, 2012, 10:43:34 pmSemantics? It's a piece of hardware (a physical IC) that controls drives hooked together in a RAID array - it has it's own physical connectors on the MB for the RAID drives - which are not the same ones as the connectors controlled via the ICH5R South Bridge. OMG, please don't let this devolve into one of those tedious discussions about what IS and ISN'T a 'true' RAID - geez... shoot me now.

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 10, 2012, 11:01:03 pm
content: Quote from: marmad on December 10, 2012, 10:57:21 pmHe actually had a point with that. And it's a very important definition, especially when it comes torecovering your data.

author: marmad
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 10, 2012, 11:08:01 pm
content: Quote from: alm on December 10, 2012, 10:43:34 pmQuote from: Monkeh on December 10, 2012, 11:01:03 pmYes, I understand these distinctions; I know well that there are other options. But here's the thing - I could fiddle and fuss for hours trying to get other software to either recognize the array or recover the data - and I will likely succeed sooner or later. OR I could pop another Promise board in place and just get the data in 5 minutes. I posted here on the off-chance that someone might have an old board laying around - rather like I have dozens of old PC expansion cards and MBs here in my lab.

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 10, 2012, 11:08:32 pm
content: If the RAID functionality runs on the host CPU, then it will be easy to emulate and might work out of the box on operating systems other than Windows with any other controller. You might even be able to trick the Promise RAID driver to work with other controllers. If the RAID functionality runs on a separate processor, than your average OS is not likely to implement emulation for it (no point except data recovery). Granted, a recovery solution like Raid Reconstructor (I'm sure there are free equivalents) will support either.Do you want to have your problem solved or your question answered?

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 10, 2012, 11:11:14 pm
content: You might well be able to get the data in five minutes with dmraid. Instead of next week assuming you can find anyone with a compatible controller today.

author: marmad
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 10, 2012, 11:22:56 pm
content: Quote from: Monkeh on December 10, 2012, 10:45:06 pmYou don't think it works - or you don't have the card?Quote from: Monkeh on December 10, 2012, 11:11:14 pmI have no Linux machine accessible here to check with, so that's not a viable solution at the moment.

author: marmad
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 10, 2012, 11:25:11 pm
content: Quote from: alm on December 10, 2012, 11:08:32 pmI'll check the software recovery options that are available.

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 10, 2012, 11:25:56 pm
content: Quote from: marmad on December 10, 2012, 11:22:56 pmI have the card. It is mixed PATA/SATA and does not support RAID, as it's an entry level card.QuoteUse a LiveCD..

author: mariush
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 10, 2012, 11:30:02 pm
content: Are you sure you can't just get the board working by removing the tantalum capacitor that blew up and the small ceramic ones?Should run with a single processor, I think...

author: marmad
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 11, 2012, 12:39:10 pm
content: Quote from: mariush on December 10, 2012, 11:30:02 pmYes, the board will run with a single processor - but at this point, I don't know what the underlying problem is/was and starting to repair it starts me down another path of ever-decreasing circles: it might work very quickly - or - it might take a day or two of time.I appreciate the fact that members here have offered alternative solutions for me - I really do - but I guess I didn't make myself clear from the start. There are a couple of files I would like from this RAID - they are not critical - either in the sense that I can't live without them - or in terms of needing them instantly. What I don't have at the moment is time to invest in the process. The RAID is in perfect working order - meaning that the ONLY surefire method of retrieving the data using very little time is a compatible controller.As an example, following alm's advice, I first downloaded and trialed RAID Reconstructor - it couldn't find or recover the RAID - total time: approx. 30 minutes to install and test various configurations searching for the RAID.Next I tried DiskInternals RAID Recovery - after something in the neighborhood of a half hour of scanning - it said it could recover files. When asked to save the recover files, it started another 'search' by signatures scan which, at this point, has taken approx. 60 minutes and is approx. 50% done. Whether it will actually come up with usable files at the end of this 2 hour process is yet to be seen - in any case, going down the software recovery route has already cost me hours of time.These solutions - including the Linux one - are all possible answers - but they are time black holes - pure and simple. Again, if anyone has the Promise hardware around and unused (expansion card or MB), shoot me a PM.

author: SeanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 11, 2012, 04:20:31 pm
content: Dead cap, just remove and apply power and see if it boots...... Most likely it will, then you can connect drives up and do the copying.

author: marmad
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 11, 2012, 04:24:03 pm
content: Quote from: SeanB on December 11, 2012, 04:20:31 pmThere is at least one other part which fried on another portion of the board not shown in the photo.

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 11, 2012, 07:23:27 pm
content: This may be obvious, but RAID 0+1 can be considered RAID-0 from a data recovery perspective as long as the array was not running in degraded mode.Both software and hardware solutions can be time sinks. Hardware can also fail to work or show compatibility issues. For example, someone sends you a mainboard that supports a CPU you have available, but it needs a BIOS update before it can boot with this CPU. Or a board that's picky about memory.Some of the early Promise PATA controllers could be used as firmware RAID controller by something trivial like flashing a different firmware. I'm sure Google knows whether this also works with more recent controllers. This might be another way to spend your time if you can't find the RAID version.It might be useful to indicate your country for shipping purposes. Is Antarctica a correct assumption?

author: marmad
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 11, 2012, 08:02:01 pm
content: Quote from: alm on December 11, 2012, 07:23:27 pmYes, I mentioned this in my post describing what kind of RAID it was.QuoteTrue, but there's a logical reason why the first thing we often try when repairing something is just to replace constituent components - because it's the easiest method that's most-likely-to-succeed. For example, I have now wasted a good portion of this day on 'retrieval' software. As mentioned before, RAID Reconstructor doesn't even recognize the array - and although RAID Recovery does, it has proceeded to crash 3 or 4 times during the hour upon hour attempts to scan for files to 'recover' (even though the RAID does not need 'recovery' - it was in perfect order when last turned on). Trying to extract data from something using a different method than used for embedding it isalwayslikely to be a longer way around.QuoteNL - but if itwasAntartica, I could likely just buy a brand new Promise controller board down at the local computer repair shop

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 11, 2012, 11:11:26 pm
content: I should have a Promise Fasttrack 100 PCI / PATA controller somewhere. Is that of any use?

author: marmad
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 11, 2012, 11:53:00 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on December 11, 2012, 11:11:26 pmThanks for the offer, nctnico. The Fasttrack 100 predates the FastTrak 376/378 by a couple of years, so I'm not sure if it would be compatible or not - but as it turns out, after slogging through various software packages and stripe settings today, I finally did manage to mount the RAID and copy the needed files. But I really appreciate your offer anyway - thanks again

author: marmad
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2012, 01:13:35 am
content: @alm - BTW, thanks for the suggestion of software recovery. Although it wasn't quite as painless as hoped, it got the job done eventually.

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 12, 2012, 02:51:42 am
content: Glad you solved it. Too bad the RAID configuration auto detection didn't work as advertised. RAID 0 should be fairly straightforward however, the only free parameters are stripe size (usually a multiple of 512 bytes) and initial offset.If it doesn't take too much time, it might be useful to describe your final solution (eg. software package and settings). From experience, I know it's very frustrating to spend time searching for solutions to a problem, and finally find a forum conversation about that exact problem that ends with 'solved it!', without any indication how.

author: marmad
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2012, 02:27:24 pm
content: Quote from: alm on December 12, 2012, 02:51:42 amYes, RAID 0 is straightforward - although neither software package I tried was able to auto detect the stripe size (and, as mentioned, RAID Reconstructor didn't even see an array). And that was where my trouble lay - since I incorrectly remembered that the stripe size was 128kb(in my defense, I have 5 other RAIDS running here - and this particular one was setup in 2004). If I had remembered from the start that it was, in fact, 64kb, I would have spared RAID Recovery (and myself) the hours of scanning that it did - ferreting out thousands of 'deleted' files in a RAID with a 'virtual' stripe size of 128kb. Since I have never used RAID recovery software before (everything important here is backed up x3 minimum), it didn't dawn on me until later in the day that the behavior wasn't normal - and as soon as I tried and discovered the correct stripe size, everything went quickly and smoothly - and I was able to retrieve my 3 files