SmarterEveryDay #134 - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: dexters_lab
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 30, 2015, 08:17:11 am
content: Been subbed to the SmarterEveryDay channel for a long time now, i always enjoyed this videos but this latest episode really irked me to the point of ubsubscribing......to be honest i have been getting pretty tired of his annoying product promotion/advertising recently, but right at the end of this particular episode is a some particular text in the titles which reads "Psalm 111:2"so thats it, i'm unsubscribedin any case, the whole episode is a rip-off of what mike did two years ago on his channel

author: lutkeveld
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 30, 2015, 02:52:38 pm
content: Are you for real? You mean the Ford 'sponsorspot' in the acoustic levitation video?Without them he wouldn't even be able to go there and make the video.Thanking them at the end of the video is the least he could do.

author: ajb
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 30, 2015, 03:08:01 pm
content: He's had the bible verse thing at the end of his videos for a while--long as I've been watching in fact. Given that the actual content of the videos is entirely secular and usually scientific in nature, and whenever I've looked up the referenced bible verses they've been pretty inoffensive, I have a hard time seeing why anyone would have a problem with it. I mean, it'd be different if he brought religion into the videos themselves, or if the referenced verses were something morally problematic. As it is, I really don't give a shit.Psalm 111:2, by the way, is "Great are the works of the Lord; they are pondered by all who delight in them". Clearly this is a guy who is religious in a way that at least is compatible with--if not outright encouraging--a desire for deeper understanding of the world. Hard to take issue with that.As for the ads, well, if it helps him keep making videos, they're okay by me, although I haven't watched the last couple videos yet. Still better than TV commercials!

author: rollatorwieltje
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 30, 2015, 03:11:41 pm
content: Quote from: dexters_lab on April 30, 2015, 08:17:11 amIt's on pretty much all of his videos, at least since the last 2 years or so.Personally I'm getting more tired of those Squarespace / Audible / Harry's / whatever ads, they are everywhere and every host seems to be using those services personally... Right. I understand the money has to come from somewhere, but really...

author: nitro2k01
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 30, 2015, 03:14:03 pm
content: Eh, what? It's hardly a rip-off of Mike's video. Mike made his own levitator from an ultrasonic cleaner and whatever he had in his lab. It was an exercise in creative engineering. This video approached it more from a pop science angle and was using a purpose-built levitation controller and high speed cameras filming colorful drops of water. They're both videos on ultrasonic levitation, but completely different focus. If you want to talk about rip-offs, criticize the dickwad CrazyRussianHacker.I will say that I too was slightly irked the first time I noticed the Bible references, but I'm trying tell myself that at least he's competent in science and engineering, and the religious content is limited to 1 second of each video and 1% of the screen area.

author: dexters_lab
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 30, 2015, 09:06:40 pm
content: right, just me then!maybe its the way he drops the adverts in that winds me up

author: PeterFW
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 30, 2015, 09:21:17 pm
content: Quote from: dexters_lab on April 30, 2015, 09:06:40 pmYou know what grinds my gears?People who have to tell "I unsubscribed." as a comment, utterly useless.And before you ask... i do not like the guy, there is something off about him.But i am subscribed to the channel, once every blue moon there is something interesting on there.

author: george graves
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 30, 2015, 10:08:02 pm
content: Quote from: dexters_lab on April 30, 2015, 08:17:11 amI'm sure he could not care less. It's his videos, he can put what ever he wants on them. You're welcome to watch them or not. But you trying to penalize him by starting this thread because he believes in something you don't, is childish at best.Let me put it this way. Who would I rather be stuck next to on a long flight? The guy that goes around and says "Waaaaa!!!! I'm going to unsubscribe!", or a very pleasant person, intelligent person, that I might learn something from?

author: zapta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 01:42:13 am
content: Quote from: dexters_lab on April 30, 2015, 09:06:40 pm... or maybe it challenges your view of religious people.

author: Dave
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 01:46:04 am
content: He's doing something to make science appealing to the average Joe. There may be a tiny fragment of his viewers that end up pursuing a career in science/engineering, because they are motivated by his videos. Anyone that does that is alright in my book.I've noticed those bible quotes at the ends of his videos a long time ago. As long as he doesn't start blabbing about his religious views in the videos themselves, I don't mind them at all.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 01:51:38 am
content: Quote from: dexters_lab on April 30, 2015, 08:17:11 amI saw that too and was pretty disappointed. I gather he's heavily religious?I still like his stuff of course.A few of the science youtubers have gone the in-video advertising route, either Audible (who approached me also), or some other company.I know a few electronics bloggers (including myself) who have turned down big money to have in-video ads.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 01:53:19 am
content: Quote from: george graves on April 30, 2015, 10:08:02 pmNo it's not, it's called raising a discussion, that's what forums are for.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 01:56:33 am
content: Quote from: PeterFW on April 30, 2015, 09:21:17 pmIt's not to a content producer, it tells you why people are unsubscribing and that can be useful info should you chose to care about such things and use that info.

author: dexters_lab
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 06:21:24 am
content: i dont fault what he shows in his videos aside from the shameless plugs and product placementsi wonder though, here in the UK the level of advertising is much less than in other parts of the world so maybe i just notice it more!as for the bible references in the titles, i hadn't noticed it before and if it's been there a while well maybe i should tolerate it?

author: ajb
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 06:37:51 am
content: Quote from: dexters_lab on May 01, 2015, 06:21:24 amA better question to ask is why you wouldn't tolerate it. Is the slightest reference to religion that repugnant to you? I'm not trying to pick a fight, I just honestly don't understand why things like this provoke such a strong reaction. Maybe some people just assume that someone can't have the slightest bit of religion in them without turning into a bible thumping fundamentalist who wants to take us back to the stone age?Personally I prefer to avoid lumping people into a binary rational/nutcase classification. There's a whole spectrum of religion between Dawkins and Ken Ham, and the inability to acknowledge that sort of spectrum of experience is a fundamental underpinning of every sort of human conflict.

author: Mechanical Menace
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 06:56:22 am
content: Quote from: ajb on May 01, 2015, 06:37:51 amI think, like the advertising, it's a societal thing. Brits don't tend to be as... overly open about our particular religious stances unless it's directly related to the subject at hand. Not that we aren't just as happy to identify ourselves by our beliefs or have arguments about them but the video had nothing to do with religion in the slightest so we wouldn't expect a religious/atheistic/whatever slogan to be tagged on for no reason.

author: dexters_lab
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 06:57:22 am
content: Quote from: ajb on May 01, 2015, 06:37:51 ami think it's about balance, it seems acceptable to put some kind of religious content on the end of videos... but how would people feel if someone was quoting Dawkins at the end of their videos? What reaction would they receive?

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 07:51:24 am
content: Quote from: ajb on May 01, 2015, 06:37:51 amFor me, when I first saw it, I was:a) Very surprisedb) Very disappointedIf it was any other normal youtube channel, then meh, whatever, they're a Yank, I get itBut this is asciencechannel, and to find bible quotes at the end of the videos leaves me feeling a bit dismayed. It's like having the science content polluted with a little bit of religion. If there is one place you (atheists who care about such things anyway) don't expect, nor want to find any reference to religion, it's in science content. To mention a channel who's name and slogan is Smarter Every Day. Even the book ad recommendations he gives at the end are desinged to make you Smarter Every Day, and thenwham, you get hit with a bible proverbIndeed, many people seek out such science content because we know it's going to religion free, kinda like a place you can confidently go to escape all the religion in the world.So I can understand why others might find it more than enough to unsubscribe.I haven't unsubscribed, as I still like his stuff and totally support him creating it, but his stock did drop a few points when I saw it.

author: dexters_lab
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 08:07:30 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on May 01, 2015, 07:51:24 amexcellent points and sums up pretty much how i feel about it

author: george graves
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 09:33:02 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on May 01, 2015, 07:51:24 amGo take a look at what we're talking about - watch one of his videos. Take this one for example (I picked one at random)It's literally 2 seconds....and not at the end of the video - no, it's way past the end. It's even past the end of the "also watch these video" that plays for another 60 seconds...(you should start doing that as well! - apparently it works). It's on screen from 10:03 to 10:05. ~2 seconds.Dave you've ranted about being an atheist for (collectively) hours. I don't want to put words in your mouth....but what your saying is that you're so offended by someone that has a religion, that you look down upon them? "Very disappointed" in what? His he not as good of a scientist now that you know this?You don't think that you can believe in science and God at the same time? And who are you to judge?Quote from: EEVblog on May 01, 2015, 01:53:19 amSure, it's a discussion a 5 year old would have. It's usually called "Screw you guys, I'm taking my ball and going home"A discussion would be sending a him a message, and saying "Hey, I don't like your bible verse - loose it or I'm going to unsuscribe". And he would say, "Sorry - it's part of who I am and you're welcome to unsubscribe" - and that would be the end of the conservation. This is totally different.

author: mikeselectricstuff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 09:48:53 am
content: Quote from: george graves on May 01, 2015, 09:33:02 amScience is all about discovery via repeatable, objective evidence. A belief in something based on nothing more than cultural traditions and writing from an era when nobody knew any better can only undermine credibility as a scientist.

author: Mechanical Menace
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 09:57:59 am
content: Quote from: george graves on May 01, 2015, 09:33:02 amErm are you saying there's only him who we're allowed to have discussions about his videos with? Would you agree with that if the criticism was purely positive? Should Dave only share his review videos with the manufacturers? I think you're arguing that if he has anything negative to say he should...Me personally I'm not just not bothered by the the pointer towards a line of scripture but think the passage chosen helps show a very common and damaging false dichotomy to be such, the idea pushed by many religious fundamentalists that you have to make a choice, science or religion. But that doesn't mean others have no right to criticise the choice and do it publicly.Quote from: mikeselectricstuff on May 01, 2015, 09:48:53 amThat would be fair if say all Christians believed the same thing and that belief hadn't changed since the religions conception, but that's not the case. Many a "soldier" on the pro-science, pro-secularism side of the anti-science argument are strong believers who's particular personal interpretation of the religion sees no incompatibility between the two subjects. I may strongly disagree with their reasoning that the areas don't overlap but if it doesn't effect their professional impartiality what's the problem?

author: george graves
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 10:00:23 am
content: Quote from: mikeselectricstuff on May 01, 2015, 09:48:53 amYour fallacy is that the two are mutually exclusive.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 10:05:58 am
content: Quote from: george graves on May 01, 2015, 09:33:02 amI know exactly where it is, I subscribe to him and back him.QuoteYou just did put words into my mouthShow me were I said I was offended?QuoteThe fact that he puts bible quotes at the end of science videos.QuoteDid I ever say he wasn't?Nope, trying to put words into my mouth again.QuoteHave I ever said that?Nope, trying to put words into my mouth again.Of course people can, people are free to believe whatever they want, and I'll fight for that right.QuoteIt's called an opinion, get over it.QuoteYeah, it's called having a little rant and starting a public discussion.You do it all the time.

author: george graves
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 10:08:10 am
content: I love how you pick and choose what I say- but don't get to the real conservation. I can 1 for 1 you too. It's easy to do.I sent him a link to this thread - he just might reply. Now - that might be a real conservation - no?Or have him on the amp-hour? No?

author: Richard Head
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 10:10:31 am
content: They are mutually exclusive. Stop sitting on the fence.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 10:13:18 am
content: Quote from: george graves on May 01, 2015, 10:00:23 amMike is bang-on.It makes no difference whether or not the two are mutually exclusive, that is completely beside the point Mike was trying to make.Note Mike's use of the phrase "can only undermine".Destin is free to do whatever he wants, that doesn't change the fact that Mike is right, it does not do him any good at all, itcan only underminehis credibility in the eyes of many people. Well, except perhaps where he lives in Alabama.If he doesn't care about that, then that's fine, more power to him, doesn't change the fact that's it's true.If I was to put L. Ron Hubbard Scientology quotes at the end of my videos itcould only underminemy credibility in the eyes of many people.

author: Mechanical Menace
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 10:15:37 am
content: Quote from: george graves on May 01, 2015, 10:08:10 amThat was actually a point by point response to everything you had to say, there wasn't any cherry picking at all and he addressed everything you said. But please do explain how you think he avoided the real conversation.And yeah, I know this will look like I'm brown nosing the forum admins lol.Quote from: Richard Head on May 01, 2015, 10:10:31 amIf that was aimed at me I believe some religions (maybe all but don't know them all) and science indeed are mutually exclusive and believing scientists must have some cognitive dissonance going on, but again if it doesn't effect their science and only their personal lives what's the issue?

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 10:18:25 am
content: Quote from: Mechanical Menace on May 01, 2015, 10:15:37 amHe's trolling. I avoided the conversation he wanted to drag me into. Yep, no cherry picking on my part, just responded to his points.

author: george graves
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 10:27:38 am
content: No Dave - you're wrong. Sorry - You pick and choose. I wasn't dragging you into anything - only calling you out.Quote from: EEVblog on May 01, 2015, 10:18:25 amNo - I'm not. Sorry. I am a Christian. Do I think Dinosaurs are 2000 year old? - of course not. That's retarded.So do I believe in the big bang? Well - just as much as you do. All thing point to it. I don't "believe" in it - any more then I "believe" in gravity.Go and google the percentage of "scientist" that believe in a higher power - and let me know what you find.

author: Mechanical Menace
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 10:31:54 am
content: Quote from: george graves on May 01, 2015, 10:27:38 amThat's a nice strawman you're building there.Quote from: george graves on May 01, 2015, 10:27:38 amThat there's no definitive studies, that the studies so far suggest it varies enormously between disciplines (real scientists like physicists are much less likely to believe than so called "social scientists"), and that the studies so far suggest that it's always lower than the genral populations level of belief.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 10:33:41 am
content: Quote from: george graves on May 01, 2015, 10:27:38 amTell me what I'm factually wrong about. Please be very specific.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 10:38:01 am
content: Quote from: george graves on May 01, 2015, 10:27:38 amOut of curiosity, which one?http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_denominationsor do you have your own brand adding to the maybe 41,000 already out there?

author: george graves
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 10:41:32 am
content: It's a discussion of religion. You're not wrong. I've never said that. You win Dave - you're 100% right.

author: tom66
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 10:51:29 am
content: I have absolutely no problem with anyone's religious beliefs provided they do not adversely affect others (or my own) personal well-being and they do not preach to me or tell me I'm going to hell - I don't want to hear that nonsense.Quoting a bible verse in my opinion is absolutely fine. Anyone getting upset over this needs to re-evaluate their priorities, IMHO.Neither does a belief in a higher power affect my opinion of an engineer or scientist, provided they do not allow their religious beliefs to conflict with known scientific facts. It's fine to think of a higher power initiating life on earth and if it makes them feel like their life has more purpose - whatever - it makes them feel better. It's not in agreement with known scientific facts to suggest all life was created 6,000 years ago and that there existed a giant flood that wiped out most of life on earth. Stating that would reduce my opinion considerably.

author: mikeselectricstuff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 10:54:38 am
content: ..of course if one were to look at it totally cynically....For someone who makes a living from making videos, Given that the majority of income will be from the US, I suspect that adding some hint of having religious belief is probably more likely to increase than decrease subscribers.

author: george graves
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 10:55:52 am
content: Ok, I'll leave this here - and all you want to know about him is there.Skip to 13:20 - and there ya go. He said it better then I could. Watch the whole thing if you want to know more.

author: dexters_lab
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 11:07:38 am
content: well from my POV i dont see why the references need to be there in the first placeQuote from: george graves on May 01, 2015, 10:55:52 amwow, now that is something i do find very surprising, a belief in something that cant be proven. I would rather it be not believing in something until it's proven

author: Mechanical Menace
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 11:10:28 am
content: Quote from: george graves on May 01, 2015, 10:55:52 amOk, so he shifts the burden of proof when it comes to his faith then goes into an argument from authority, very common if unusually nicely done.Oh, you might get a response more to your suiting if you argue against what people are actually saying.

author: han
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 11:14:42 am
content: Is there any one that use quote from FSM bible for his/her video?

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 11:37:13 am
content: Quote from: tom66 on May 01, 2015, 10:51:29 amMentioning you don't like something does not imply any " priority ".You could say we all lack priority by getting upset about the latest bit of test gear instead of the endless suffering and death of thousands of 3rd world children every day.

author: madires
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 01, 2015, 12:02:08 pm
content: Quote from: mikeselectricstuff on May 01, 2015, 10:54:38 amSo his true belief is in money. Nothing's wrong with that

author: zapta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 02, 2015, 09:26:08 pm
content: It's ironic that some of the atheists here that get bothered by bible references have biblical names themselves.

author: tom66
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 02, 2015, 10:29:10 pm
content: Quote from: zapta on May 02, 2015, 09:26:08 pmThat's not irony.

author: kakureru
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 02, 2015, 10:38:22 pm
content: I remembered being a little irked but the useful / entertaining content outweighs the bible verse,but in the end, the content is very very palatable for anyone with an interest in science.Think of him as a gateway drug into science for those otherwise with their heads in the sand.THough on the other hand, I dumped kipkay for making one of his videos centering on his brand of christianity (a while ago)and the overall content of his videos in my opinion did not have enough weight for me to look past it.Like going to In and Out burger, you go for the food, not the bible verses on the bottom of the cups and packaging.