SIGLENT SDS1102CML - First Impressions - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: hgg
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 15, 2013, 07:23:17 pm
content: Hello,I received today my first oscilloscope and I am really excited!Its a really nice tool.The quality of its construction is quite good actually. The plastics feel nice, and do not have anyannoying smell. The knobs are very good, except the small ones that could have been a bit moresolid.photo hostingI had no problem with the layout of the knobs apart from the general purpose (intensity/adjust)that is too close to the big vertical Volts dial. They had so much space above it, but they decidedto put it as close as they could to the vertical... Go figure...how to take screenshotsThe big knobs feel very nice indeed and I love that they all have a push to center function.It would have been a lot better design if all the knobs were the same as they big ones!All the little rubber buttons are great, they have a positive feel and they are very well lit.The On/Off switch is very springy and quite hard to press.how to print screen on pcAll the connectors, USB, BNC, etc feel solid. Very nice.how to do a screen shotThe display is very crisp and has excellent viewing angles. You can see the pixels, so in thesame space they could have used a higher resolution one. The display is for bench use onlybecause it goes dark fast if you look at it from below the horizontal. From any other angleits excellent! I have not yet removed the protective cover from the screen but it looks likethat the lcd is protected with a glass. Very nice.The little plastic feet work fine. When they are closed, the unit feels like that will fall on itsface because its a bit heavy in front. So, you should use it all the time with the plastic feetextended.The probes feel a little cheap and fragile and this is probably because they are...Having said that, I did not have any problems with them all day today. Maybe they willshow their quality in the Mhz range. They were calibrated very easily.image hosting 12mbSome measurements.- Power Consumption : 18.7 Watts- Temperature : from 23 degrees Celcius ambient to 34 degrees after one hour of use.The hottest part is the right side.- Time to boot : 9 seconds.- Time to Auto trigget its own signal : 5 seconds. It can become much slower with different signals.- You can hear a relay clicking when you change from 200mV to 500mV and from 50ns to 100ns- Software Version : 5.01.02.13- Hardware Version : 11-62-3.3- Sound Noise : Its a very quiet oscilloscope! My house is very quite. From a background noisefloor of 34.3dbC it goes to 49.6dbC 20cm from the actual fan.One negative thing I found in the few hours I've played with it is that if you switch it off and then onwith a USB stick plugged in, it will not recognize it until you unplug it and plug it again.Very annoying! I think that this should be fixed in the next firmware version.Other negative is that when you turn the vertical and horizontal dials, the indicator lines are lagging.They are not instant and the waveform takes some time to be displayed again. Definitely somethingthat needs to be fixed.Some screen captures of different signals:Its own 1kHz signal:image hosting over 10mbSeveral PWM ones:image upload no adsimage url uploadimage uploading sitehow to make screen shotimage hosting 10mb limitimage hosting no accountBellow you can see a very nice sinewave with the probes not connected to anything...50Hz, so its picking the mains frequency somehow.Do you know how can I prevent this?When I moved it to a different room it stopped.upload photosNow if I switch on the main light of the room I get the following signal.Its not like that actually, because if I turn on 5sec persistence I can see two different 50hz signals.I can also see spikes when I turn on & off some lights in the room.screen capture windows 7So, these are my first impressions of the oscilloscope and I would have to say that in generalthey are positive.If you have any questions that I can help with, please feel free to ask.Any suggestions for testing the oscilloscope functionality are welcomed.Thank you.George.

author: Hydrawerk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 15, 2013, 08:03:36 pm
content: A nice basic scope. Quite similar to Rigol DS1000, but the screen and front panel is better. It even hasprintandsinglebutton.

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 15, 2013, 08:25:50 pm
content: Nice review and great pictures! Saves me doing one for my Siglent SDS1102CNL (which is the same the CML minus the large 2M memory).QuoteYes, the probes are really very cheap and flimsy, and probably won't survive long. I guess for all the money they put into the scope to make it good for that price they probably had to cut corners somewhere. But good standard probes (ie Testec) aren't that expensive so I don't think this is a major issue.Aside from the problems you already mentioned, I also found some idiocracy in their logic for the RUN/STOP and SINGLE button. If you press RUN/STOP the scope stops its acquisition cycle as expected. But if you press RUN/STOP again it only does a single sweep. You have to actually press SINGLE to get the scope going again.Maybe we should collect all the issues and then pester Siglent together for them to fix the problems.

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 15, 2013, 08:29:19 pm
content: Quote from: hgg on May 15, 2013, 07:23:17 pmThere is real true glass. You can take protective plastic off.Probes are cheap and not best possible mechanically (and electrically they are just as chap probe is, no complex passive compensation circuits, not high class resistive coaxial...etc)). And rotary joint to scope end BNC is not very strong construction. But freq response is quite ok, as can see one my BW test image made using probe.There is limit of processing capacity. With it need live. It is hard to make this faster. Of course if change priority of processes but then perhaps some other thing suffer. It is compromise.You see signals without connecting... just from "air"... ok, try with one meter wire as antenna...If it do not pick-up electric field signals there is something wrong - and badly. This is just normal, take what ever oscilloscope and High-Z probes. Scope input is under 20pF and 1Mohm. Probe tip with 10x is 10Mohm (with small parallel capasitance what do not mean anything with 50Hz) I'm very worry if it do not pick up these signals. Why it show 2 (or more) traces with persistence.. becouse signal have lot of variations and it trigs sometimes where ever. Just normal.

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 15, 2013, 08:38:27 pm
content: Quote from: rf-loop on May 15, 2013, 08:29:19 pmI don't think the delay between changing the time base or vertical setting and the time when the trace re-appears is a problem with processing capacity. It's much more likely that this is just a firmware bug. The scope is quite fast and this problem only occurs sometimes (at least on my CNL scope). I'm pretty sure Siglent can fix it easily in one of their next firmware releases - if they are aware of the problem, that is.

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 15, 2013, 08:51:35 pm
content: Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on May 15, 2013, 08:38:27 pmYes, of course also I hope it is as you think.Btw, I know one "feature" in SDG FW and I just now have idea (perhaps wrong) it is propably same kind of reason... perhaps. (there is my suspect that some lag in UI in SDG in some situations is related to user actual settings updating to setup memory (continuously) for next start up (if this feature is selected), and perhaps they have done it wrong way in SDG and now I just think if it is possible reason for this lag.. ) Oscilloscope keep record about user settings. Next time you turn scope ON it use settings you last used. Diffrent scopes do this different way. Some scopes have several seconds period, some perhaps try do it always you change something. Some scopes have setting where you can select if next time it use factory default or "last".Now I feel that it is possible this is somehow related to this.In Siglent SDG1000 generator, if you select start up last settings it slows dramatically some adjustments, perhaps it store every change?There need be some compromise. Owon write settings to memory using perhaps too long period. If you change someting and soon shut off, it have not stored this new adjustment. Hantek use more short period for this.But, all this is now only mutual suspect about one possible reason for this in SDS1000 scopes.If it is this or not, I hope they add selection. Startup using "factory default" or "last state" or "setup memory number n".

author: Hydrawerk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 15, 2013, 11:27:27 pm
content: Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on May 15, 2013, 08:25:50 pmReally??

author: rstoer
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 12:31:33 am
content: It looks nice. Thanks for posting the photos. Best of luck with it!

author: hgg
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 06:07:04 am
content: You are welcome!Hydrawerk, the Print button is indeed very handy!Wuerstchenhund it is a bit strange the way they are using the Single button.That confused me in the beginning. Can you suggest which Testec probes will be good for this scope?I removed the protective screen film and yes, its real glass.for thatAnother 'fault' in the UI is that when you press the Measurement button, it displays on the rightside 5 user selected measurements which is very handy, but labels and numbers all have thesame white colour! How difficult is to think that if you use a different colour for the labels it willbe much more easily readable... Come on... Simple things that make a difference.They also should have used double lines for each measurement.Easier to see and space for 7 handy measurements.image upload no registrationrf-loop I am playing with solar panels, and a 50hz sine wave is been displayed whilethe probes are connected to its terminals and with the room lights off. Only ambient light.The scope is in AC coupling, 20mV, 5ms and the waveform is 180mV peak to peak. If I usethe same setup on a different room, then its ok. Strange.Below its the same setup but with one room light on and 2sec persistence.Can anybody decode what is happening???how to do a screen shotAnother thing I noticed was that the frequency measurements I did with the Siglent andthe UT61E were exactly the same down to 2 decimal places! Not bad.

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 08:28:55 am
content: Quote from: hgg on May 16, 2013, 06:07:04 amIt's probably not even by intention. As I said, I suspect this is just a bug.QuoteI once had some TT-MF312 (1x/10x, 250MHz) probes which were really good, but I guess for this scope even the TT-LF312 (1x/10x, 150MHz) should be sufficient.QuoteI don't really like the measurement boxes in the menue area (which should be limited to settings that can be changed, and not mixed with display of information). They should have placed them somewhere else, i.e. as a column on the left side of the screen or on the bottom.QuoteFor the "All" measurements they should have reduced the vertical graticule and put them as a block on the bottom, not having them hover in the middle of the waveform area, or again as a column on the left side of the screen (reducing the graticule length,I also miss an indication of the current sample rate in the screen area (it's annoying to have to go into the aquisition menu, where the sample rate sits there as a menu point which suggests it can be altered by pressing on the associated soft key, which it can't.).In addition, I also don't like that, when you switch off the menu by pressing MENU ON/OFF, the selected menu section (i.e. AQUISITION) remains illuminated even if the manu is switched off. The button should only be illuminated when the related menu is active, i.e. visible.

author: hgg
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 08:32:52 am
content: Wuerstchenhund, you are right. Exactly! I totally agree with all the above!

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 08:40:15 am
content: Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on May 16, 2013, 08:28:55 amAre you sure?Perhaps after few days you find reason why...(you turn off menu only from display area but... )

author: hgg
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 08:54:14 am
content: Actually this might be handy, because if you press the 5 vertical display buttonsyou would already know their function by looking at which option is lit.

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 09:09:59 am
content: It need think what is information. (menu led)If only meaning is that led is on if menu is open visible on the screen and off if menu is not visible on the screen what information this led is for - nothing. Situation can know if just look display. So.. it can think, do it include some information. If only informatoin is show that menu is on or off on the TFT this information can get if look TFT and this led can take off and save manufacture costs some tenth of jiao.Menu can be displayed on the screen or it can be hide, also including this that meny can disappear from display automatically. You can shut off menu display automatically or manually but still this menu is active (but not on the screen area). Also if display go screen save, still you can see what menu there is active and push button and do "blindly" setting in this active menu. This led is not there without reason. It give information, even if selected menu is not displayed.

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 09:23:06 am
content: Quote from: rf-loop on May 16, 2013, 08:40:15 amYes, I am sure. It's common logic in good user interfaces that for such functions buttons are only lit to indicate that the specific function is active. If you switch of the menu via MENU ON/OFF then this is no longer the case.Quote from: hgg on May 16, 2013, 08:54:14 amThe thing is that when the menu is switched off the soft keys should not work (I assume they don't, which is the correct behavior; I haven't tried it yet). Having them working with no menu displayed is nonsensical, especially since many menu areas have more than one layer.

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 09:27:50 am
content: Quote from: rf-loop on May 16, 2013, 09:09:59 amI'm not sure I understand what you're trying to say. The LED in the buttons is there to indicate which section of the menu is active. If it is on then it means the displayed menu belongs to AQUISITION or whatever has been selected, if it is off then it means no menu area is currently active. If you switch off the menu via MENU ON/OFF then the menu is no longer active, hence the LED in the button should occult.This is standard logic in user interface design for years.QuoteAre you saying that the soft keys remain active even if you switch off the menu (I assume they are not, although I haven't tried it yet)? If so then this is a design flaw, contradicting well researched and established user interface design conventions.I'm also surprised you really suggest that being able (let's assume the soft keys remain active when the menu is off) that pressing softkey buttons blindly is actually a good thing, as it's pretty stupi to manipulate a control if you're not sure what it really does (remember that many menu areas have multiple layers). Doing that is not a good idea, it simply is sloppy behavior which will only lead to errors.Any device that allows what you're suggesting is simply badly designed.

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 02:08:15 pm
content: Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on May 16, 2013, 09:27:50 amYes, I know it is good and bad. I do not know why they have selected this.Perhaps thinkin that user may want shut off menu bar over the waveform area but still keep meny active in backround. This is what there is.You can try, select cursors. Select example cursor A for adjust with adjust knob. You see there is now led on top of this knob. Then you want turn OFF displayed OR there is timer what turn menu bar off. But, in bacround it is still active and turn adjust know still you can move selected cursor. If hit any of menu bar buttons, menu bar coma agen to displau and it ius just this menu bar what is active n bacround. I personally feel it is nice feature more than bug. Also same for display menu.Activate it. Turn menubar timer to 2s. Then select example brightness or in other some menu some other adjustment. But fast menubar disappear, still your control is active.Bad or not but it is easy and perhaps more fast to use. And in some menubar it can fast remember if frequently use some adjustments in it... 2sec timer and this hidden active menu... it is handy. And if have bad memory, led tell what menu there is active... but not tell what sub page... just keep this timer short and do something where need frequantly adjust / chane some 1 or 2 setting in active menu bar selected page. And "always" your screen is all for waveform.Of course if this is car, train, aeroplane... it need really be different for safety reasons but here..in oscilloscope, nothing bad happend if you push any these menu bar buttons... only it may step to next available setting behind this button in order and if there is three possible setting... example in trgger it just jog up, down both edge every time you push it... and menu bar pop up on screen also for tell what happend...(until it disappear how you have selected) ... if it was wrong button just push next time it or more until setting is agen what need and then push right button. After people is familiar with it... I think it more positive than negative feature. It may make oscilloscope using very fast. Ok, there is opposite thinking... in some kind of just very opposite is Owon. Every time you push this, and this and this and that and what ever you do all agen and agen... but you always know. But in long run... it start sometimes feel very "stupid" or frustrating.

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 02:40:53 pm
content: Then about RUN/STOP and Single shot.Scope is run and acquiring. You push Run/stop... scope stop and it is now red. , you push it agen it run agen and it is green as long as you want agen stop.. run....stop...run...No any hassle with Single button.If you want use use Single, it can activate in trigger menu or just pushing this Single button.After you press single... it IS in Single mode AND single button is green. And now also Run/stop is red... becouse it just ago turn to single mode and after last capture it is now in single mode waiting what user want next.It works just perfect.Now in Single mode you can start new single shot or you can return back to normal running.(now single is green, run is red)Push run once and it run next single shot... single is still selected and there is green light in single button.If you want continue normal use you turn off single mode... what need do... ok...push agen Single button and now light is off and single mode is off. Scope run now normally and run/stop is green until you push it to stop or until you go agen for single mode.Push single...light on... push it agen...light off.Do default.Scope run now.Push single. (green light and run/stop red and scope is now stopped and in single mode.)Push run/stop (it change green as long as this single acquire takes (depends horizontal speed (1) and also if it need wait trig event!!) and then it stop and display it and run/stop is agen red and scope stopped.Push Run/stop agen... it do next single shot. and then stay red as long as you want next.If you want stop single mode, just push it and this green light also shut off.(1) Note with very slow speeds. When you start sigle shot by run/stop button. There read waiting... until it meet trigger event after pretrigger buffer.Note TFT left top corner status display...If it is in single mode, and run is green (single run in progress) and if nothing happend... look TFT left top corner if there read example "Waiting" (waiting trigger) or there is green Trig'd (it have get trigger and now it is capturing signal... soon there read red clor "Stop" and also Run/stop button is red.

author: Deckert
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 03:13:47 pm
content: Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on May 16, 2013, 09:27:50 amThe LED staying lit is exactly right, because if you press the Menu button, the menu that was last used comes back up - and the last used menu is the function LED that was lit. In my view this logic is sound and preferred.And yes, the soft keys stay active based on the active function that is lit by the LED. Makes for very handy short-cut to functions. I use it a lot of the time after getting to know the 'scope well.--deckert

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 05:12:23 pm
content: Quote from: rf-loop on May 16, 2013, 02:40:53 pmUnfortunately it doesn't. If I press SINGLE then the acquisition stops, and SINGLE lights green and RUN/STOP is red. So far so good.Now if I want to do a single shot acquisition, the logical thing would be to press SINGLE (that's how it works on most scopes out there). However, if I press SINGLE then the scope returns to normal (continuous) acquisition mode.If I however press RUN/STOP instead, the scope does a single acquisition shot.The standard (and expected) behaviour would be the other way around: a press of SINGLE initiates a single acquisition shot, and RUN/STOP would start and stop normal acquisition.What's worse is that the behaviour seems to be erratic, as sometimes pressing SINGLE does indeed only start a single acquisition shot.QuoteAgain, this is contrary to what are established standard conventions for most scopes, which is that RUN/STOP starts and stops normal acquisition and a press of SINGLE fires a single acquisition shot.I can somewhat see what the thinking was behind the current design (using SINGLE to 'pre-select' single shot mode, and using RUN/STOP to 'start' the single acquisition shot). But that is not very logical and defies most principles for good user interface design.And idiocracies like these do their part why the reputation of cheap Chinese scopes remains bad amongst EEs.

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 05:24:07 pm
content: Quote from: rf-loop on May 16, 2013, 02:08:15 pmWell, I found out now that the soft keys indeed remain active even if the menu is switched off, which is poor UI design.As to the cursors, the correct behaviour would be that when you switch off the menu, that either the cursor stops or (probably the better solution) that another indicator comes up showing that the rotary knob still controls cursor A.QuoteThe thing is that this is just bad UI design. It's no problem having a 'short cut' for certain functionalities but it's not ok having soft keys remaining active without the corresponding labelling via the menu. A solution would be to replace the menu items with symbols if the menu is switched off (i.e. a small bar containing symbols for currently available soft key functions which could take very little space). Then the MENU ON/OFF key behaviour could be modified to toggle between full menu - symbol menu - off.This is just an example. There are many ways to make the UI better. But ignoring common and well established UI conventions is not earning them any award.

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 05:31:34 pm
content: Quote from: hgg on May 16, 2013, 08:32:52 amI have put together two examples of how the screen with all measurements active could look like.In the examples below, the measurements are located on the bottom of the screen instead of hovering over the waveform. This reduces the vertical waveform area slightly but in my opinion is better than having the measurement data block covering a large part of the waveform.I have also moved the frequency counter display outside the waveform area (there's enough space for it anyways), and the trigger level readout is now located close to the trigger indicator on the top. I also added a sampling rate indication, which is what I miss a lot on the screen.The difference is in the location of the lower status bar.As comparison, the third image shows the current design.

author: hgg
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 06:27:41 pm
content: Way better!

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 06:42:19 pm
content: Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on May 16, 2013, 05:24:07 pmYes. But IF make changes, it really need carefully think how it is wise and think it from many different "angles".many times I have told that manufacturer NEED arrange useability test group who look also things in some time points when design is going forward... and then in protrotype / final tst phase specially. AND these peoples need be totally from outside ot least totally different peoples that designers and programmers. Also they need be well experienced with lot of real lab and working experience with equipments in real use. But there need also be some entry level peoples becouse sometimes they find some things just becouse they do NOT have experience.So it need mixed group. THis is not long time and expensive.. but it need do, if want be good and if want also grow to better.

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 06:55:33 pm
content: Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on May 16, 2013, 05:31:34 pmYes, this kind of things there is lot of what can easy do better.Specially this mesurment window (all or time/voltage group)I can not understand why it middle of screen.I think and also believe that Siglent also listen customers. I have seen some changes what are clearly collected from customers opinions. And I believe they want do more. But these need do carefully for avoid "hantek effect".

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 07:14:02 pm
content: Quote from: rf-loop on May 16, 2013, 06:55:33 pmI was thinking of collecting bug reports and improvement suggestions, put it in a document and send this to them. I really like this little scope and it would be a real shame if the software side would let it down.Do you have any contact email for Siglent that is actually active and which could be used for this?

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 07:18:51 pm
content: Quote from: rf-loop on May 16, 2013, 06:42:19 pmWhat manufacturers should do is to involve a Human Factors/UI specialist in the design phase. Unfortunately most good software developers are just awful UI designers (and most mediocre programmers are simply shit at UI design, just look at the mass of very poor websites).

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 07:29:47 pm
content: Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on May 16, 2013, 07:14:02 pmYes I have.But I will ask also if they have better contact just directly for this Oscilloscope specials.(last time I have talked about SDG's some things and I do not know exactly if they have separate team for oscilloscope things. But least also my direct contacts can forward these to right persons inside Siglent) I will PM it after I know.Also I have some kind of "wish" list + bug list.... but it is not at all ready yet due to lack of time.

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2013, 07:38:30 pm
content: Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on May 16, 2013, 07:18:51 pmI confirm this.| Signature and stamp |

author: hgg
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 17, 2013, 12:50:28 pm
content: I have found the source of the 50hz noise.The oscilloscope was plugged on a mains power meter.I don't know how, but that meter was causing the 50hz noise...Perfect flat line now down to millivolts!

author: Fay
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 29, 2013, 09:08:20 am
content: Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on May 15, 2013, 08:25:50 pmGreat idea!

author: bluey
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2013, 09:34:24 am
content: Thanks for posting on this scope. Looking at getting my first.Haven't found a teardown, but this video review seems like a manufacturer sponsored teardown.Compared to Rigol DS1052Ehttp://www.eevblog.com/2009/10/12/eevblog-37-rigol-ds1052e-oscilloscope-teardown/which seems well regarded around here, the Siglent looks to have near identical main board with same component manufacturers - at least the few that a are visible and very similar power supply. The Siglent has white ?silicone around the power supply components, which the Rigol does not. Siglent also has a cable tie on the left rear of the case securing the ribbon cable from main board to the power supply. Perhaps this helps with calibration stability? These two details are also present on photos of LeCroy scope I saw.Siglent has downloadable service manual, which Rigol does not that I can find.The only indications I have seen of cheap/nastiness so far are wrong brand logotype on the LCD screen and comments on cheap probes.I guess there might be cooperation or intellectual property sharing or generic board design/manufacturing sponsored by the chipmakers to help lower the costs of the low-end machines. Perhaps it's a government sponsored strategy to gain market domination??? Amazing that all these DSO companies have risen from nothing in the late 1990s. While they have a steep learning curve, being OEMs for major old-world companies gives them signficant access to knowledge which they will be able to use in pursuit of market domination.

author: bluey
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 25, 2013, 01:22:00 am
content: Have just got my SDS1102CML build 2013-05-18. Same firmware and hardware as first post. Still learning to use it.Bugs so far:English instruction manual is underbaked - poor quality english in parts and a bit confusing in parts.No packing list to check.Probe instructions aren't clear that the adjusting screwdriver is included.Instructions don't describe software or installation.Note that the EasyScopeX on the included CD does not have NI-VISA drivers which are needed for it to work. Finding out this required a web search.http://siglent.freeforums.org/siglent-easyscopex-pc-software-for-oscilloscopes-t44.htmlRigol Ultrascope download includes NI-VISA runtime 3.4MB. Siglent requires a download of NI-VISA from National Instruments.http://www.ni.com/visa/Site navigation is poor - clicking Downloads brings up a huge list. I went for the first one which is a full version 700MB. Probably could have used the runtime version 7MB - separate downloads for Windows and Linux but you have to open the page to see which one you have got. Present NI-VISA is 5.3.I had previously downloaded Tektronics OpenChoice software to play with. At about 500MB, guessing it also comes with a full version of NI-VISA rather than the runtime.

author: David Aurora
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 25, 2013, 03:31:52 am
content: Got the same scope yesterday. Not really sure how I feel about it yet to be honest. Here's my first impressions as they spring to mind.- This thing just feels painfully slow. To use an analogy that'll probably start a flame war, it's like using Windows when you're used to Macs. I'm used to turning on the CRO, plugging something in and looking at it. It's that simple. Unplug and you see the spike. Add a load and see the effect instantly. And so on. Whereas on this thing you can pretty much go get a cup of coffee or learn to yodel waiting to see the screen update. Ok, maybe that's a tad dramatic. But it's slow enough to really put you off, as a new user there's that split second of doubt on every measurement where you start wondering if you actually connected the damn circuit or if you're in the wrong mode or something. But from what I've seen that's somewhat normal to a degree with DSO's so maybe I'm expecting too much.- Yep, the manual is atrocious. There's some truly classic Chinglish in there though and I'm a huge fan of that artform. I've just been exploring the menus and working things out for myself, and if you know how to use a scope already it doesn't seem like rocket science to find things. I've probably played around with the thing for an hour total between last night and today and I feel like I know where everything is now within submenus and how to adjust things.- I don't like how the Auto function turns on both channels automatically. Maybe I'm missing a workaround, but the only way I've found to avoid it is to physically disconnect the second probe. If I've got channel 2 turned off and hit auto, in my brain it means I want channel 1 up and running, not a split screen of my signal and low level noise from an unused probe.- Did I mention how painfully slow it is?- Menu gets stuck a lot. It'll be halfway between sliding on screen or off and just stop there until you press a button to remind it where it's supposed to be.- Buttons and knobs feel fine, no probs there.- It isn't obscenely loud, no worse than other stuff on my bench.More to come when I do some actual work on it later today, I'm sure...

author: Siglent
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 25, 2013, 07:54:54 am
content: Quote from: bluey on June 25, 2013, 01:22:00 amEasyScopeXThe following is EasyScopeX Installation Instructions: (you could look the file "EasyScopeXEN.chm")System Requirements1. NET framework 3.5 SP1The application you are installing requires the Microsoft .NET framework version 3.5 to run. You can download the Microsoft .NET Framework 3.5 SP1 package directly from Microsoft. This is a small 3 MB download with just the .NET framework installer. When you run it, the installer downloads the actual framework components that need to be installed on your computer. Once you've installed the .NET framework, you can continue installing the application.If you plan to install version 3.5 of the .NET framework on a large number of computers, you can also download the full package of the Microsoft .NET Framework 3.5 SP1. This 231 MB download comes directly from Microsoft. The small 3 MB installer likely needs to download much less than this, depending on what is already present on your computer.2. Ni-VisaThe application you are installing requires the NI-VISA to run. You can download the NI-VISA package directly fromhttp://www.ni.com/visa.at the bottom of the web, you will see the “Also see”, then click the “Downloads” option, you will get what you want. Once you've installed the NI-VISA, you can continue installing the application.3. Window XP(32 bits) or Windows Vista(32 bits/64 bits) or Windows 7(32 bits/64 bits)4. Net Framework was installed on the machine when installing Windows 7(64 bits) or Windows Vista(64 bits), follow next steps to use it:a. Open control panel, select Uninstall Program.b. Select Open or Close Windows Functions in the new window.c. Check Microsoft .Net Framework in the Windows Functions Dialog box? click OK button.NI-VISAThe drive of EasyScopex is used a commom driver- the NI-VISA driver. (If using special driver, we can pack it into a CD drive, but in fact it is not advisable to )Rigol using "NIVISARuntime.msi" driverwe are verifing the driver, if it is passed, the new installation instructions and driver will be updatedProbeThe probe instructions is put into the package bag?which including usage instructions.

author: Siglent
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 26, 2013, 01:34:41 am
content: Quote from: bluey on June 25, 2013, 01:22:00 amwe have verifed the driver, installing the EasyScopeX driver, you only need to install the "NI-VISA runtime" driver, the new installation instructions and driver will be updated

author: bluey
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2013, 07:50:05 am
content: For some reason, EasyScopeX does not want to talk to NI-VISA driver. NIMAX will talk to the scope mostly happily, but not EasyScopeX. EasyScopE->add device ->USBTMC fails with "have not find any device". Have uninstalled and reinstalled all software, but same problem. Oddly, the vendor I got the scope from says theirs works fine on same OS. Hoping to hear exactly which driver they have talking, as I presume they have a load of drivers on the showroom computer.SDS1102CML firmware 5.02.02.13NI-VISA full 5.3EasyscopeX p08Windows7-64bitdriver selected by windows ausbtmc.sys (IVI)NI-VISA 5.3 installs .NET framework 4. So I didn't install 3.5. Will try that to see if it makes a difference. The EasyScopeX help files show an earlier version of the software with different "Add Device" dialog box titles "USBTMC..." rather than "Connect..." with the latest software version. So I don't trust that .NET 3.5 is required over .NET 4.xIt looks like others have the same trouble with ATTEN machines, with no answers.http://tlfong01.blogspot.com.au/2013/06/atten-ads1102cal-easyscopex.htmlhttps://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/atten-ads1102cnl/There are bugs in permissions, since EasyScopeX does not seem to install properly unless "run as administrator". I also set the application properties to "run as administrator". Every time I launch EasyScopeX, User Account Control wants permission to change the system. Oddly, there are no registry entries for EasyScopeX (excepting uninstall info).While messing around, I have also tried Atten EasyScope3 on Win7, Atten EasyScope3 in XP Mode, Lecroy Wavestudio. WaveStudio looks like EasyScopeX, with a different skin. It will actually find the USBTMC scope "USB0::0xF4EC::0xEE3A::SDS0000nnnnnnn::INSTR" , but says it is "dead" - perhaps because it wants to talk to LeCroy firmware.Have emailed all this to someone at Siglent (name I got from vendor), but still awaiting a reply.

author: Siglent
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2013, 09:35:30 am
content: Quote from: bluey on June 27, 2013, 07:50:05 amOn the windows 7-64bit, it needs to use the NI-VISA 5.1.2If you have any questions,you can continue to ask questions

author: bluey
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2013, 09:57:51 pm
content: NI-VISA 5.1.2 does work with EasyScopeXp07 (CD version) on Win7-64bit. I have installed the full version because i was using the NI Measurement and Automation Explorer for debugging, but presumably the runtime would work too.Thanks for your help, Siglent.

author: Siglent
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2013, 02:10:45 am
content: Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on May 15, 2013, 08:38:27 pmThis is not problem, in the different time base, it needs a different sampling time, therefore, when the large time base, you will find that a longer delay (between changing the time base or vertical setting).

author: Siglent
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2013, 02:21:19 am
content: Quote from: hgg on May 15, 2013, 07:23:17 pmThis is normal, the probe and oscilloscope constitute antenna system, the signal waveform that on the screen of the ambient radiation ( such as power radiation etc. )

author: ChildOfVision
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2013, 01:33:05 pm
content: Hello to all!@hgg: Really nice review and pictures!Quote from: hggI have a little confusing question, NOT related to SDS1102CML but to SDS1072CML (Siglent)! It is HW version "issue".I will get Siglent SDS1072CML for about a month, it is already bought from amazon.de (299€) by my cousin living in Germany. Scope came very fast, everything (visual) seems fine. I asked before the seller (Futu-Tech) what are exact hardware and firmware versions for this scope: seller answered me next day: HW version: 11-66-3.3, and FW: 5.01.02.13 (the latest if I'm not wrong).Since my cousin doesn't know virtually anything about that kind of equipment, I asked him (remote assistance by the phone hehe) to turn scope on and to tell me HW and FW numbers from utility\system status!The Firmware ver. is : 5.01.02.13 (seems ok),BUTthe Hardware version is: 11-62-3.3 !? -just like on your 1102 (100MHZ) scope, not 11-66-3.3 as it should be?I don't know anything else, besides very very quiet fan!What do you thing what is what here?As you all know, Siglent produces oscilloscopes also for Atten, LeCroy...I found that Atten ADS1102CML (Siglent of course) has that HW version!So, is it possible that, whoever does this, built in 100MHz PCB, intended for Atten1102 into Siglent's 1072CML shell? What is more reliable: label on the scope (and "Siglent1072CML" on welcome-screen!) OR data from System status?Is it possible that I will get Siglent 1102CML 100MHz scope in 1072's housing?Of course I can't measure triseright now (frankly I'm not sure how to PROPERLY do this) - that would reveal actual BW ( if tris less than 3,5ns =>100MHz -true?).Also I want to "warn" you all - User Manual that comes with o'scope (and from net) is quite obsolete - no mention about time/date adjustments for example - you can find more recent data from appropriate LeCroy's User manual!Any clue appreciated!

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2013, 03:54:43 pm
content: Quote from: ChildOfVision on June 28, 2013, 01:33:05 pmThis 11-66-3.3 must be typing mistake.I have SDS1072CML and 1102CML in stock.Both models have HW: 11-62-3.3System data and boot up screen tell you have Siglent SDS1072CML.And its rise time is near 3.5ns and its -3dB BW is over 100MHz.(in EEVblog forum you can find test result)https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/is-rigol-ds1052e-still-the-best-option-in-its-class/msg247100/#msg247100

author: ChildOfVision
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2013, 04:26:25 pm
content: Quote from: rf-loopOK, thank you rf-loop! I will recheck this!What did you mean under "typing mistake" - my cousin "misread" screen content or am I heard (and wrote to paper) wrong value (he repeated that numbers at least 3 times, because it was suspicious to me (I knew what I should expect)!) OR Siglent made typo in firmware?...EDIT:Please, SORRY, you meant that guys from amazon made typo? That's understandable.But, can I ask you, since you have both o'scopes, if the hardware is the same (or the same HW version doesn't mean that PCBs and parts are the same?) is there any substantial difference between 1102 and 1072CML except 70/100 MHz bw (and 50 EUR more for 1102)?Quote from: rf-loopAccording to this, there is no reason to pay extra 50€ for 100MHz version!?I will study now your link, thanks alot!

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2013, 06:15:18 pm
content: Quote from: ChildOfVision on June 28, 2013, 04:26:25 pmThey are same, exept analog front end BW..Analog front end BW is different, but I do not know (read: I do not want take a position) how the difference have been made.In some needs difference is "substantial" and in other needs difference is "big". It depends...

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 06, 2013, 09:19:56 am
content: Just bought one of these scopes (the SDS1102CML) and it's not to bad I guess. Firmware could be better but se-la-vie.They have a problem with their software channel filter, at lower frequencies rather than do proper low-pass-filtering it slightly rounds off the edges (which is correct) but then cuts the amplitude down (which is wrong).This is looking at the scopes own 1kHz reference ..

author: illyesgeza
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 06, 2013, 09:29:01 am
content: Can anybody who has a SIGLENT SDS1102CML dso help me?Please save the data from channel 1 from the scope's calibrator signal with the horizontal position on 250us in LongMem mode to a fileThe file size would be 2MI'd like to post it to meThanks

author: illyesgeza
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 09, 2013, 10:08:12 am
content: Look at this two signals. The difference is longmem on and longmem off.800khz / 20khz = 40, but the samplingrate was 500KS/s and 25MS/s25 / .5 = 50There is a bug in the FFT calc.

author: Deckert
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: July 09, 2013, 09:34:19 pm
content: Quote from: illyesgeza on July 09, 2013, 10:08:12 amAgreed - I noted the same discrepancy in my review of the Siglent/Atten 'scope using the 3.x firmware. So this is an issue they did not fix in the 5.x firmware? When I tested this on the Rigol DS1102E, I noted that the Rigol simply switches back to short-mem "Normal" mode when you enter FFT mode.--deckert

author: ChildOfVision
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 25, 2013, 06:42:36 pm
content: Again, a few questions about SDS1072, not 1102, sorry (I believe those are 99% identical scopes anyway...):1) How can I use RS232 for some practical, useful and fun (of course) things?2) In order to use EasyScopeX, I have to download a huuuuge NI-VISA package(>600M?) - Easyscope is just a few MB, so how can I use this software with minimum additional software - what should I download?What other software can I use with SDS? Can I use LabView (it already includes NI-visa) - is it better than EasyScope (I don't plan to do nothing special; to see waveforms on PC monitor, change colors of images, simple measurements (but on bigger screen), simple analysis. If it is better than ES, I will rather downl....hmm... buy full version of LabView instead of ES+NI-VISA!3) Does somebody know how to calculate/estimate number of waveforms per sec (I don't have any fancy equipment!)?4) Can I kindly ask, if somebody has ECG simulation image (in scope's format) that I can put on USB-stick and see it on my scope, I will be veeery grateful if he/she puts that file here!?TIA!Child

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 26, 2013, 02:43:59 pm
content: 2)No need full version. Runtime package is enough.http://siglent.freeforums.org/post145.html#p145runtime 5.1.2: (afaik, Siglent recommend version 5.1.2)http://joule.ni.com/nidu/cds/view/p/id/2918/lang/en4)- one wink for do what ever waveform (manually, or can also do string with some program.You can store known waveform to USB. (do not use LongMem for exercise)then open this file with some nice HEX editor, example HDD hex editor neo (free version). Very fast you find where is waveform samples data. In sample data string, do not use 0x00 (#00). If there is zero, there is not any kind of trace (first in bottom line is 0x01)Note that sampling speed base in data is of course what is used when you first store .DAVIf you want do zero line.DAV for working first do .DAVSet example 10us/divjust for example 500mV/divcenter verticalyou see horizontal line.Save .DAV to USBRead usb with hex editor.edit data in address area from #03ff to#2bf2#2bf1 to value #80Edit address#2bf3#2bf2 value to example#c0#cb (+3div) and also example next 10 memory positions same. And then after this point to #53d0 agen all #80(in this case time between memory positions is 10ns (100MSa/s)Now you have straight line, then center of screen there is 100ns long peak.do not make other changes in file lenght etc and other memory position equal as before.Load it back to scope. You see one around 100ns spike center of screen. Zoom just turning horizontal speed to it. Change display to dots. Zoom until you see every dot.Remember to do work DAV first with this settings you want use later after you download file to scope.Samplerate is what it was in original DAV (yes these can also edit but better that not change before know what do)So, you can "draw" what ever signal shape and then display these with scope.After this exercise you can do what ever signal.

author: ChildOfVision
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 26, 2013, 09:48:25 pm
content: THANK YOU VERY MUCH rf-loop!

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 27, 2013, 06:45:34 pm
content: Here is what can play using example some hex editor. There is clear zero line and middle is short -3V and then +3V and back to zero line.First, load attached setup to scope, and just after then load attached waveform to scope.Signal area (CH1) there is #3E8 to #A3E7 (do not change out of this area things)(note: signal area is different if scope use 40k memory (in single channel and 1GSa/s speed)All other exept middle pulse are set for vertical value #80One vertical div is 25 so 3 div is 75 ( #4B) so +3V pulse top is #CB becouse voltage setting was 1V/div.Btw, vertical baseline position is byte in address #30 where data is now #80(if play with these, save and load with same scope settings becouse dav file included settings do not set all exactly right)With this dav file it is easy to make what ever signals to scope screen and example inspect how sinx/x work (or other fun things). (yes Sinx works right even if first feel there is something wrong - not)There is 10us/div, short memmory, sinx/x off (x) etc.Signal is zero exept 2 samples -3V and 2 samples +3V just around center of screen.With this speed sampling speed is 100MSa/sAfter loaded to scope, zoom in/out just turn horizontal speed more fast.(note that in stop mode of course there is not trigger time position fine adjust process working)If edit these files with example HexEdit do not change other area than signal and keep care file lenght is equal also of course.One disclaimer. I have not tested if these works with earlier FW version!(Tested and made with FW 5.01.02.22 only)Setup file filetype .TXT change to .SETDav file type .TXT change to .DAV

author: ChildOfVision
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 27, 2013, 07:58:34 pm
content: Thanks, again,I'm right now playing (and studying manual) with my scope, I don't know what scope you have (I assume it is 1702 or 1102CML); my HW version is:11-62-3.3and software ver:5.01.02.13. I found that there is no date/time adjusment under Utility menu - should this scope have this, not essential, but nice feature? I saw, on LeCroy's copy of SDS1072CML there IS that possibility - there is time and date down-right at screen. Furthermore, I saw picture of Siglent SDS1072CML also with date and time!? Maybe sellers put that image from 2000 series? But, anyway, there is no reason that this is missing!OK, for now I found that I can't adjust 1GSa/s for single channel (ch.A!) (just up to 500MSa) whatever I do! Only when I turn channel B (with nothing attached on it) - here it is! Then I turn off ch.B and continue with ch.A, this time with maximal speed! One of bugs...I only have my scope 1 day, I'm trying to be more familiar with it, so I will try to do what you said, sounds interesting, thanks!!!See you later!ChildEDIT: I realise now you have FW 5.01.02.22 ? Is this newer version than mine? Or you just have different scope, but if it is Siglent there is no newer version than mine on their website, except if you have 2000 series or so?Huh, there is no Siglent's 2000 series, I mixed this with Rigol, sorry. I meant Siglent 1xx4 (4-ch.) version, but I see there is picture of SDS1102CML WITH time/date right on Siglent page!

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 28, 2013, 09:35:53 am
content: Quote from: ChildOfVision on July 27, 2013, 07:58:34 pmLater there is coming Siglent SDS2000 (soon) and later more.Afaik, SDS1000CFLmodels (2 and 4 channel) have real time clock. SDS1000DL/CNL/CML do not have real time clock circuit (it is not FW it is hardware).This time when I play with this DAV file I use:SDS1102CMLFW:5.01.02.22 (not just yet available from Siglent download center, I hope they update download center asap so that peoples can update new FW)If you change horizontal speed to fastest speeds and LongMemory is selected. It do not shut off LongMemory and it use then max 500MSa/s. It is not bug. (but yes there is still some other small bugs in some samplerate related things)If there is onlyone channel selectedfor use (CH1 or CH2) andif horizontal speed is 50ns/div or fasterand ifmemory selection is Normalthen it use 1GSa/s. And in this case it also use 40k memory (becouse these two channels memory is combined together, not one after one but interleaved becouse here also 2pcs 500MSa/s ADC blocs. (both 500MSa/s ADC's are also made by interleaving several 100MSa/s ADC's)In long memory mode it can not use 1GSa/s at all. This is normal, it is also in other similar principle working scopes, as example Hantek 5000B and Rigol DS1000E etc. All these have half speed LongMemory. 1M or 2M.Siglent have 2M (in two channel mode 1+1M)

author: ChildOfVision
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 28, 2013, 11:18:45 am
content: Quote from: PippyQuote from: rf-loopYou both are right! I knew this. But I'm pretty sure scope was in short mem. mode! Look what I did: 1) Turn on the scope, check all stuff (I believe I've checked memory too) - isn't memory set to short by default btw?2) I connected probe (not probe that comes with oscilloscope - it is really bad quality, I can't do probe compensation at all, but ok) to the BNC-A only.3) I either press "Auto" button or turn chanel A manually - only "A" (or "I" if you want) button is illuminated!4) When I rotate "S" dial, sample rate increases, but only up to 500MSa/a!Then I turn off scope, and repeat all this few times - all the same!After that, I "accidentally", by feel, how it usually goes in life, decided to try ch.B ONLY (manually turned off ch.A), repetated steps 1-4 and I got 1GSa/s! Than, I can (without restart) change ch.B to ch.A and 1GSa is still there!I must note: I turned scope on/off only few times after purchase, so maybe it was long memory somehow stayed switched on (remains from factory testing)?I forgot to mention: I also have/had problems with switching from Real-time to Equ-time mode - it was impossible to do that - I got message: "Function isn't useable!" - I didn't use any "special" things, just normal, fundamental measurement of some sine waves! But, it seems to me, after, say, 10 switching-on's that both problems disappeared - I have to check this again!Quote from: rf-loop"Well, I'm sure you know about this better than me! But, I think I saw somewhere in Siglent's leaflet or datasheet something like "SDS1072/1102CML have precise 6-digit frequency measurements based on"real-time clock"(or something like that), not by counting pixels from screen" - but I'm really not sure about that! Just look at this picture (it has zoom) - SDS1102CMLwith clock- if there is no way (simply because there is no RTC onboard) that it has clock - than they just photoshoped image from CFL series, as you said! "False advertising" -hehe.http://www.siglent.com/en/product/detail.aspx?id=100000005058775&nodecode=119008001That "clock-issue" isn't really a big thing, but I want to know do I have correct FW (or FW/HW combination).Quote from: rf-loopWhere you find this version (no need to answer!!!)? Industrial espionage?Just kidding!What did you get with this new FW?Do you guys know is it possible to "drag" automated-measurements "block" across the screen, I can't find that in Manual? It is especially irritatingly during FFT measurements: that "info-block" anchors itself just far left covering the FFT spectrum in really important part!?Cheers!Child

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 28, 2013, 11:58:37 am
content: Where there read Ch A. There read on the buttons and on the front panel CH1 and CH2 exactly and also in menu system.Real time clock (perhaps chinglish)This is internal reference clock (oscillator) what is used for two frequency counters. They are different as this what is measured from captured signal using Measure menu selections.This counter counts trigger events and it is internal reference and works like normal frequency counters and result(s) is displayed on the screen. (separate counter for both channels (of course if both channels run with separate trig!)In measurement menu, freq measurement is totally different method.Real time clock is clock what show time and date. This function is in CFL models.If you have get broken probe (manufacturing error), there is 1 year warranty.Btw, of course you use 10x setting for compensation adjustment. (1x do not have adjustment at all)Where I get scope(s) with FW 5.01.02.22 = from factory as normal for distributors..Can you repeat this what you say about 500MSa/s limit with really known settings?If you can repeat it so that you sure know, please tell exactly how I can setup and use scope so that I can find this situation. I have now tried with 5.01.02.13 and 5.01.02.22 many many times and I have not finded this.

author: ChildOfVision
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 28, 2013, 12:45:26 pm
content: Quote from: rf-loopI will double-check this!Quote from: rf-loopUnderstood!Am I thinking right: f-measurements on the main screen is more accurate than readings from far-right menu?Quote from: rf-loopWhy they didn't put RTC chip on ALL models, it is few cents costs...First of two probes I can't compensate, second is OK, but pretty flimsy design, It is almost twice thinner (probe, not cable) than my Testek LF-312 (official replacement for older Hameg's HM probe, afaik, 1:1/1:10, 150MHz)! I don't know is it worthwile to ask replacement... Interestingly: they have a whole spectra of probes; 60MHz AND 70MHz - if there is some difference - kill me! Maybe 60MHz and 200MHz have some difference... (I got 2x 70MHz).Quote from: rf-loopNote: I worked hard with analog oscilloscopes at my university (physics) for many years, I own Hameg HM-303, so I'm almost TOTAL beginner in digital "oscilloscoping", thus I know (basics, at least) about compensation (only applicable and necessary for "non 1:1" probes)...Quote from: rf-loopYES, I will! Just, please, be patient, I'm struggling now with my PC (perhaps due to high temps here (over 40°C))!Thanks again!Child!

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 29, 2013, 08:18:45 am
content: Quote from: Deckert on July 09, 2013, 09:34:19 pmI hope Siglent also do this: If FFT then LongMem ---> NormalIt is simple and easy and does not require much.Other even better solution is if user have selected LongMemory. "Function is not useable in LongMemory mode".There is no any reason to run FFT in LongMem mode. Nothing.FFT use just 1024 sample points and thats all.

author: illyesgeza
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 29, 2013, 02:11:08 pm
content: because the FFT calculation is too time consuming for more than 1024 points,it would be better to set a window of 1024 points on the wave in LONGMEM modeand compute the FFT on this window.in this way the user can obtain a much better rezolution in frequency domain.the only thing what Siglent has to do is to compute FFT on 1024 points from anuser defined startingpoint on time domain. so no need to inhibit LONGMEM.I bet on what you want that Siglent newer will do so

author: margrove
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: September 05, 2013, 11:46:25 am
content: Although much of this thread is Greek to me it seems that the SIGLENT SDS1102CML is a good bet for a first time DSO buyer. I'm very glad to see that SIGLENT has a presence on this forum which augers well for bug squashing.Or can I do better for the price?

author: sameerdhiman
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: September 05, 2013, 01:15:04 pm
content: Hi Siglent Representative,A suggestion from my side: Please provide Cross-Cursor under FFT measurement to get V & Fq values at the same time.Regards,Sameer Dhiman(DSO-5070A Metravi India == Siglent SDS1072CML)

author: bjoernx
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: September 05, 2013, 08:11:30 pm
content: Got my 1072CML today!So far did not get the hang of this FFT thing.Just looked up the manual... and guess what: there on page 22 it explicitely states, that their FFT function is designed as a LOL-detector! So what..."Analyze the Humorous wave in the Power cable.""Test the Humorous content and distortion in the system"L*MAO!

author: sameerdhiman
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: September 06, 2013, 09:59:50 am
content: Actually, they are right to some extent because the noise floor is too high and you won't see harmonic contents in the noise grass other than high Hum signals.

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 06, 2013, 02:27:23 pm
content: Quote from: sameerdhiman on September 06, 2013, 09:59:50 amAnd you have data for this?Opinions are opinions and joking is joking but I respect data.Also this same test can repeat where ever lab.Siglent use 1024 point FFT calculation as also so many others in same class.But where is this high noise floor? There is just natural noise floor. It have 8 bit ADC also.There is not any kind of averaging in use, no high res mode etc.Signal, in this case HP8657B and coaxial to scope input where is T connected 50ohm terminator (becouse it is enough accurate for this kind of use)Siglent model used here: SDS1102CMLInput 50mV/divFFT zoom 10x, Filter Blackman, vertical 10dB divInfinite persistence on.Signal 21MHzin image there is 10dB steps from -54dBm to -4dBm (and end of test signal is left to -24dBm level)If I run only -54dBm signal, noise floor is more down and then example -64dBm is well detectable over noise floor. This visible noise floor is mainly from -4dBm input signal what rise some amount noise floor and infinite persistence keep it visible.Incoming signal level steps are:447uVrms (-54dBm)1.41mVrms (-44dBm)4.47mVrms (-34dBm)14.1mVrms (-24dBm)44.7mVrms (-14dBm)141mVrms (-4dBm)Where is now "high noise floor" if stay in this kind of oscilloscopes class.Note that visible noise floor is max peak noise floor, not average noise floor.Visually with eyes it can easy look that minimum detectable signal is around 55 - 60dB under maximum signal level.Why I use this splitted display. Becouse infinite persistence looks some amount terrible if there is full screen where input signal in time domain and FFT overlay.

author: bjoernx
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: September 06, 2013, 03:55:07 pm
content: Quote from: rf-loop on September 06, 2013, 02:27:23 pmsameerdhiman was probably referring to the noisefloor in LOL terms: ratio of bad jokes with broken punch-lines lying around on the floor, prematurely deceased and misunderstood for life. O0Quote from: rf-loop on September 06, 2013, 02:27:23 pmNice testcase, thank you! As said, I'll have to get my head around this to find out, how it can be useful to me.I will test this scope some more over the weekend and finally decide, wether to return it or not. Think I've found quite a few bugs and glitches so far, will see if I can repeat and screenshot them and will report back here if time permits.

author: sameerdhiman
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: September 06, 2013, 05:14:55 pm
content: I apologies, It was purely a joke. Please don't take it otherwise.I apologies again.No doubts, Siglent device is good. I do not regret after purchase. After all this is my first DSO.BTW, in my scope waveform does not align to center (0,0 coordinates) it always remain shifted few point to left side even after Self-Calibration. Is it normal?Regards,Sameer

author: zoltan
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: September 09, 2013, 07:11:50 pm
content: Hi there,Today I become a proud owner of one brand new Siglent SDS1102CML.This one is:SW 5.01.02.22HW 11-62-3.5The very first annoying thing i've found is that the damn thing won't remember the language setup. It will remember the channel choice etc. but not the language.Maybe if I set it to chinese

author: Zbig
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 09, 2013, 08:43:58 pm
content: Quote from: zoltan on September 09, 2013, 07:11:50 pmHmm, my SDS1072CML SW5.01.02.13/HW11-62-3.3 does remember the language preference correctly. A 5.01.02.22 bug, perhaps?

author: johansen
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2013, 04:00:13 am
content: My SDS1102CNL5.01.02.13hardware version11-62-3.3i've read through several other threads..you can buy the memory chip for 23$ off mouser solder it in, and then upgrade it to CMLand from what i read the only difference between the CML and CNL is the configuration file, not the software...

author: pickle9000
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2013, 04:44:39 am
content: Do you have the part number for the memory?

author: johansen
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2013, 05:57:14 am
content: Quote from: pickle9000 on September 10, 2013, 04:44:39 amread this thread:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/beginners/atten-oscilloscope-firmware/you'll need solder paste and hot air. unless you want to risk it with a very fine point soldering iron and lots of flux

author: pickle9000
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 10, 2013, 06:15:39 am
content: Digi key has it as well (part number IS61LPS51236A-200TQLI).I have a T-862 for this sort of stuff, it's not the best but does a fair job. Hot air not required.

author: xtv
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: September 19, 2013, 06:25:21 am
content: Quote from: margrove on September 05, 2013, 11:46:25 amI would like to know that too..This will be my first scope, and besides many low freqs applications, I plan to play with RF oscillators, so I belive a better bandwidth is a must have for me (in this modest price range).I'm still between the SDS1152CML Siglent (which is the 150MHz version of this scope), the Owon 7102 (which some people here says can go up to 170MHz - is it true?) or the Hantek DSO5102, which is 100MHz hackable to 200MHz.. (there's also a native 200MHz for a few bucks more). I don't even discard the Rigol 1102, but I hope there are more modern 'n better options..As this Siglent model was sort of unknown by most people few months ago, what do you guys think?If you want to give your opinion about these other scopes in PM for not messing with this section, please, PLEASE do so! You'll probably select a better scope for me than I will

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 19, 2013, 08:35:56 am
content: Here you find some tests. Some of these are some amount old but afaik nothing changed any markable amount.http://siglent.freeforums.org/sds1072cml-tests-new-fw5-x-hw-11-x-t42.htmlhttp://owon.freeforums.org/some-tests-with-new-sds7102v-version-2-6-and-2-8-2-t10.htmlThere is one test image with FFT what also show frequency BW. (this image where signal sweep from 1MHz up to 500MHz)http://owon.freeforums.org/some-tests-with-fft-t8.htmlThese test are also made so that these can repeat in what ever lab. Test results are not opinions.These Siglents and Owons (and all other scopes) have individual pros and cons. What is suitable depends user needs and other things. It is good to remember that also check samplerate tables and think what are user needs, what are signals specifications what need test.

author: johansen
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 19, 2013, 09:18:42 am
content: this is a 1102CNL, which is apparently equivalent to other scopes, for example, CML, etctake a close look an notice the skew, and the fact that it missed several data points.at 500MS/S per channel , it should capture 25 samples per division per channel.not so. in fact, you might be able to say it is capturing 10 data points per division, or it can't tell the difference between the LSB.buy an analog scope if you want to know for certain what is going on.note the decay rate and you should see something is seriously wrong.

author: echen1024
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 19, 2013, 06:02:28 pm
content: Quote from: johansen on September 19, 2013, 09:18:42 amAre you sure your probe attenuation is set correctly?

author: kenw232
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: October 08, 2013, 05:50:45 am
content: I'm trying to get EasyScope working for my Siglent SDS-1052DL so I can take screenshots of the LCD waveform. I figure the best way is to see it on my laptop unless someone knows if I can take a screenshot with the SDS-1052DL by itself?Anyway I can't get WindowsXP to install a driver for EasyScope when I plug the Siglent into the USB port. XP wants to install a driver but I have no idea where to tell it to get the driver. I installed NIVISA 5.3 but that did not help.SDS-1052DLSoftware Version: 5.06.0216Hardware Version: 11-62-2.6Anyone have any idea where to actually get the USB driver for this thing?

author: kenw232
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: October 08, 2013, 06:28:53 am
content: Forget it, I figure it out. The scope can save a BMP to a memory stick on the fly.If anyone knows how I can freeze the waveform I'm seeing on the LCD so I can save it when I'm ready do tell. They shoot by too fast for me to click the Print button.Thanks.

author: johansen
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 08, 2013, 06:41:54 am
content: press the single button? or configure the trigger properly?

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 08, 2013, 07:06:16 am
content: I do not know your model and firmware.Also you did not tell what EasyScope version you have.There is two totally different EasyScope softwares. EasyScopeX and EasyScope|somenumber|Main thumb rule is: If your oscolloscope menu have USB selection USBTMC you need EasyScopeXSDS1000DL/CNL/CML User Manual V1.2, pages 106 - 110. There is instructions.As far as I know, NI-VISA version 5.1.2 is compatible.No need huge full package, only small runtime is enough.-------------Screen image (BMP format) you can of course save directly to USB stick.Just connect FAT32 formatted usb stick to front panel and push "PRINT".If want save some other things to USB. Push SAVE/RECALL button.In menu select "Save to" = FILEIn menu select "Type" you can select Setups, Waveforms, Picture and CSV (also there is selection for recall factory settings)Then there is "Save" and "Recall" menu.. where you continue (I think menu is self explanating)-----------Note for PC communication becouse I do not know how is your model default or settings: Go to UTILITY menu.Page 2/4There is "Back USB" selection.Look that you can select between Printer / USBTMC.If it was otherchange it to USBTMC. Wait 15 seconds. Shut off scope and then boot agen.If you have done many kind of failed installations and also windows have done some crap usb istallations etc hassle. I will recommend first clean all installations related to this case and then follow instructions for just your EasyScope version.I have used XP for all testings (becouse I test every single unit before sell) and it works.I hope Siglent write better instructions and exatly explanation what version to use with what oscilloscope version (FW version).(example older FW's did not have at all USBTMC. There was selection Printer/Computer and in some equipments USBTMC/USBRAW)Some links for some manuals and Ni-Visa can find alsohere.

author: roberto.pietrafesa
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: October 08, 2013, 02:22:00 pm
content: Dear friends, good afternoon!Excuse me if I jump-in on this thread just to ask you a question about Siglent SDS1102CML.Since I would by a new one by china (€324 shipping included) I would kindly ask you if you checked the "frequency meter" function in a HF typical maximum range. So, for example, on 28 MHz (28.000.000 MHz).If you put in a 28 MHz sinusoidal signal, how DSO measure it? What does appear on display? I'm afraid if it shows, for example, 28.0001 MHz, that should be not good for my purpouse.I need to calibrate/set-up oscillators on the range (7-28 MHz) for CW (Continuous waveform modulation of radio-frequence, Morse Code in other terms). So I need a precision of 20Hz (twenty Hertz), no more.So, again, is there anyone can have this test for me?Thank you very much indeed.I appreciate the time you will spent to answer to my question, and excuse me for this not perfect written english ..... anyhow better than Chinenglish!Best wishes from southern Italy.Roberto.

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 08, 2013, 04:18:31 pm
content: Quote from: roberto.pietrafesa on October 08, 2013, 02:22:00 pmBy finchinglishJust simple answer.It do not meet your needs about frequency measurement accuracy. (and around same for also other this class of oscilloscopes, Owon, Rigol 1000E, Hantek etc)Its accuracy is least 1:100 what you need.No need test. It read in datasheet.If one test it is just random individual unit, some unit may be "accidentally" perfect but also tomorrow it may have other result..This separate frequency counter what display appear bottom right corner of display.Specs sheet tell (typical) accuracy +/- 0.01% (+/-100ppm).With 20MHz it can show up to +/- 2000Hz wrong and still inside specs.It is cheap ordinary oscilloscope, not frequency meter.(but of course this separate freq counter is nice also in oscilloscope use becouse it measure frequency by counting trig line)Also there is not any adjustment for internal frequency reference. It is just with its (oscillator component) factory default. But if some really want, it can modify (change reference, good 100ppb or better class TCXO or OCXO. But, then it can ask, is is clever if think this tiny counter functions and other things, (example resolution. It have 6 digits. 20MHz least significant digit is 100's Hz.)Automatic or cursor measurement from displayed captured waveform is of course much much more inaccurate.

author: Deckert
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 08, 2013, 04:54:43 pm
content: Quote from: johansen on September 19, 2013, 09:18:42 amEh. The CNL and CML are very different - the CNL does not have deep memory (only 40kpts), thus cannot sample at high rates over slower time bases. The CML has 50 times more memory to fit sampling in over the same time base. Did you check the Acquisition menu to see what the sample rate was? Switch to DOT mode to show the actual sample dots. Also switch off sin/x interpolation.Quote from: johansen on September 19, 2013, 09:18:42 amVerify that by checking the Acquisition menu and placing into DOT mode.Quote from: johansen on September 19, 2013, 09:18:42 amWhat should it be?--deckert

author: roberto.pietrafesa
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: October 08, 2013, 08:11:42 pm
content: Dear friends, thank you very much indeed for your explanations. These are very useful for me.I will consider what I have to buy now.Again, thank you and have a good luck for all!I'm involved in built (DIY - Do It Yourself) HF kits, so principally up to max 30 MHz.So now I would like to buy a SIGLENT DSO, since I like the possibility to save data on USB and after analyze these data on PC. But I'm not sure if I have to buy:1) a 100MHz or 60/70MHz DSO2) a CNL/CML/CFL/DL typeThe price differences are up to 120€. That is not a problem to spend much, but if I save about 100€, I can buy a good used frequency meter, so that I can complete the instruments set I need (I just have a FLUKE 87V DMM).I don't want to buy a "better" DSO that I will pay more but it is not needful for my purpouse.Thank you for your further suggestions.Sincerely,Roberto.Roberto.

author: johansen
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2013, 09:13:19 pm
content: Quote from: Deckert on October 08, 2013, 04:54:43 pmI was likely not very clear.by decay rate i meant the decay rate of the 50Mhz ringing on the drain waveform (20ns period)you'll notice it isn't forming the usual logarithmic decline.instead, it appears to be sort of "sustained"by my estimation, the blue trace should reach all the way to 60 volts, instead it is sort of clipped at 55.also, the DV/DT of the blue trace changes at about 48 volts.. i've never seen such with similar circuitry and analog scopes.when i have some time i'll have to compare this scope with something 50 times the price..and yes i changed it to single channel and the sampling, etc, it doesn't seem to "go any faster"edit, in both of those captures, the dv/dt is indeed changing once the drain gets to about 48 volts, about 20ns before the fet fully turns off and the gate voltage starts to drop again... hmm...edit2: at 250ns per division and below, the scope claims 500MS/s for two channelat 50ns/div and below, its 1Gs for one channel, 500Ms for two.i'll have to investigate this weird stuff further, there's "plenty of dots" even at 500MS/s and two channels.. it should show what's going on a bit better...

author: hgg
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2013, 07:00:46 pm
content: Hi to all,After some months of use I would like to state the most annoying things about the specific oscilloscope.In general it is a very nice scope and if they fix the following in a future firmware it would be excellentfor its price range.1) The most annoying thing its the way it displays the measured data on the right. They list all the labelsand data with the same colour size and font! They have not even bothered to change the font colourdepending on the channel you are monitoring. You are not using the scope to look at nice waveform.only. You are making measurements as well. Its very confusing to locate the value you are watching,if everything has the same colour font and size. They took the time to implement different color themes,and left out that 'minor' detail'. How clever is that!? What were they thinking ?(they should also let the user use smaller fonts in order to fit more measured values)2) The other annoying thing is the sluggishness of the trigger and position adjustment knobs. Its likeplaying a game when you try to centre on a value... You have created a scope of 1Gsa/sec and youcannot move a single line cursor with a respectable speed. Nice.3) They are using the same colour for the waveform and the cursors. This is not so annoying but theycould have done better. Ok, don't use a different colour, but you can at least use a darker or lightershade to make them more visible.Finally the only firmware bug that I have found concerns the USB stick. If you leave it plugged in andswitch off the unit, it will not recognize it at power on. You have to remove it and reinsert it.Its seven months now and I have not seen any firmware updates. Not sure if they will ever releaseany...but If they can fix these minor details (especially the first one) it will make it a great option forthe beginner in electronics and at a great price.

author: Hydrawerk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2013, 11:06:25 am
content: Well, nothing serious when compared to Tektronix TDS1000 / TDS2000 scopes...

author: copperwings
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: December 28, 2013, 12:08:16 pm
content: Quote from: zoltan on September 09, 2013, 07:11:50 pmHello friends! this is a simple matter of reloading the config file (not the FW). Had the same (minor) issue (same HW and FW version as yours). Latest firmware along with config file needed can be found here:http://siglent.freeforums.org/new-fw-for-sds1000cml-and-cnl-t77.html

author: cheloski
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: December 30, 2013, 08:36:58 am
content: hello to everyone.... I am using my new Siglent 1102 CML for one week , and today when I power on the oscilloscope , it show me the screen of presentation like always (where say Siglent 1102 CML....) , but later the screen turn in white , and stay frozzen , like trying to charge the software......do you know if this happen before to other person?....or what to do ?....I sent a mail to Siglent , and I am waiting the answer..... I appreciate if someone can help me......thanks for your help....

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 30, 2013, 08:49:14 am
content: Siglent are on line right now. Send them a PM.Don't forget to share your results with us.

author: cheloski
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: December 30, 2013, 11:25:33 am
content: Thanks a lot... Fortunately, I have repaired the problem ..... I sent a mail with my problem to Siglent.eu , where I have bought the oscilloscope , and I received a fast answer ........ After power on , I have to pressed a lot of time the key "math" , after that the oscilloscope start normally.... He sayed me to put the English language like default (before have Spanish), may be the problem stay there.....I will continue using the unit, I hope not to have more problems....

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 30, 2013, 08:14:40 pm
content: Siglent frequently read this forum and will note problems for future tweaks to firmware.We all must remember to post problems so they are aware of them.

author: mcinku
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2014, 05:37:58 pm
content: Hi,I just bought SDS1102CML scope a few days ago and still learning about all the features of this scope.While playing with the scope I found one strange issue... I was hopping if anybody can test this on his scope. I want to find out if perhaps I have a faulty scope or maybe I'm doing something wrong here.I'm feeding 1k sine wave inverted signals on both channels. When I'm trying to use sum function, I'm expecting to get a flat line but what I get is...

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2014, 07:33:57 pm
content: I would suggest you ZERO the trigger level and check other trigger settings. I can try myself if you have no luck.

author: mcinku
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2014, 07:53:11 pm
content: Quote from: tautech on April 06, 2014, 07:33:57 pmOk, I tried to zero out the trigger level and also set the trigger coupling to AC but the issue still remain.I forgot to mention that my AC signal is riding on top of 300V DC signal. I'm guessing here but this DC component probably is the cause of this issue.Any ideas?

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2014, 08:19:26 pm
content: OK, 80V 1KHz AC on top of 300V DC, right?Do any of the other math functions display correctly?Have you tried triggering from Ch 1?Check if you can get the results you want with the Probe cal signal, but the timing will be the same for both channels.

author: mcinku
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2014, 08:33:17 pm
content: Quote from: tautech on April 06, 2014, 08:19:26 pmYes correct that is my signal.I think other math functions are fine.I did try triggering from CH1, nothing happened.Interesting, when I try to use only my sig generator and running same signal on both channels, obviously I have to deduct the signal and same thing happens. If I invert one channel and use sum.... Same thing happens.I'm starting to think something is wrong with my scope.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2014, 08:46:17 pm
content: Confirm you Firmware version is the latest. If you scope is doing everything else correctly, it might be a firmware bug.

author: Deckert
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 07, 2014, 12:02:38 am
content: Quote from: mcinku on April 06, 2014, 05:37:58 pmI suspect your math voltage scale is not set to the same scale as the other two channels. Select the math channel and go to page two of the setup. There are two options: one for setting the vertical position and the second to set the vertical resolution. Make sure it is not set to nV--deckert

author: mcinku
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 07, 2014, 05:48:26 am
content: Quote from: tautech on April 06, 2014, 08:46:17 pmMy SW Version is 5.01.02.22HW 11-62-3 5

author: mcinku
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 07, 2014, 05:51:53 am
content: Quote from: Deckert on April 07, 2014, 12:02:38 amUfff that's might be it, I didn't played with those options. Well I don't even know what those options are for... I didn't read the manual.I know I know RTFM!!I will report back.

author: mcinku
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 07, 2014, 07:22:00 pm
content: That was it, that little knob is a bit sensitive but it does the job.Thank you!Regards

author: 001
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 07, 2014, 08:20:37 pm
content: Is serial number disappears or not (after flashing Siglent SDS7102CML with WaveAce 1012 firmware)?Where I can find config file for LeCroy firmware?Thanx!

author: Retro
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: September 11, 2014, 07:22:56 pm
content: Hi has anyone sorted the Language not saving as I have the same problem with the SDS1102CMLCheers

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 11, 2014, 07:38:07 pm
content: Quote from: Retro on September 11, 2014, 07:22:56 pmAfter 5 or 10 startups the language option sets and remains with the language option you have chosen.Sorry I can't remember for sure, I think 10.It is this way so a seller can check or demonstrate the scope then ship to a buyer anywhere in the world.

author: Retro
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: September 15, 2014, 12:19:04 pm
content: Thanks for the replyBut when I press System Status it says system has been restarted 34 times and still the language has to be set on boot.software version 5.01.02.22hardware version 11-62-3.5Regards

author: geonicz
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2014, 08:02:17 pm
content: You can load a config file. This solves the problem with language menu.Unpack it to flash drive with FAT32 system and plug it into scope.Press "Save|Recall ->type(Factory) -> Update Cfg". Select the *.cfg file and you're done.

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2014, 08:25:31 pm
content: Just wondering when reading the comment about the reboot counter.Is there any way you can clear this counter or reset it to factory 0?This would come in handy for people experience the language issue, as they can then start with clean counter, and refer to the value later on, as fair indicative value for using the scope.

author: Siglent
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 10, 2014, 03:36:43 am
content: Quote from: pascal_sweden on October 09, 2014, 08:25:31 pmDear Sir,Do you mean the frequency counter? the frequency function can be turn off.

author: geonicz
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: October 10, 2014, 05:30:03 am
content: Did anyone find how to connect this device to PC with the help of RS-232 cable? I mean which pinout is used? I didn't manage to find it manual but this ability is present.

author: geonicz
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: October 10, 2014, 05:34:55 am
content: Quote from: Siglent on October 10, 2014, 03:36:43 amNo, I think he meant a startup counter that is displayed through "Utility->System-Status" menu. The question was if it can be cleared back to zero.And the frequency counter fuction is a absolutelly different thing that is bouncing in a bottom right corner of a screen.

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 10, 2014, 09:49:58 am
content: I meant the "reboot counter".If for some weird reason, people have to reboot their scope 10-20 times before they get the language setting right in the configuration, it makes sense that they can clear their "reboot counter", so that it reflects actual "fair" use of their scope.But maybe the best solution is just to fix the language issue, and any other issues that require 10-20 times reboot =)I am confused how Rigol support comes to frequency counter. That's like comparing apples with pears.

author: SharpEars
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 10, 2014, 01:34:17 pm
content: Quote from: pascal_sweden on October 10, 2014, 09:49:58 amI am confused how you can confuse Rigol support with Siglent, I do agree with you that having to reboot 10-20 times to get the Language setting to stick is just plain stupid!

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 10, 2014, 01:57:22 pm
content: The Siglent customer support engineer who mentioned the frequency counter is located at our factory in China. English is not his primary language so I think he misunderstood the question. I will follow up with him.Thanks.Steve

author: illyesgeza
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: October 22, 2014, 07:14:51 am
content: At last I have find a working EASYSCOPEX on WindowsXP 32bit with the SDS1102CMLThe problem is that you can't download all the 2Mega data, that's why I don't use this softwareI wrote a little program in C++ with which I can manage this problemMy question for SIGLENT is to tell us about that hardware limitation (in case of SDS1102CML) which explain that when you enter in SINGLE trigger mode the scope is automaticly disable the LONGMEM.So you can't access the longmem data (2Mega) in this mode.I have found some software workaround.First of all it needs USBTMC working, and use a few SCPI commands:1.) "WAIT"2.) "STOP"3.) "C1:WF?"4.) "C2:WF?"5.) "RUN"this above steps leeds you to access all the dataIt would be nice if SIGLENT in a firmware update solve this problem.i.e to be able to get all the data from both channels in the same session using the "ARM" or "*TRG" command without to disable the longmemory

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 22, 2014, 09:22:59 am
content: Thanks for pointing this out. I have pointed Siglent to your post.

author: Pipsa
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: December 25, 2014, 08:26:33 pm
content: I have also met a problem with FFT-measurement. Is it possible to "drag" automated-measurements "block" across the screen, hide, or something? It is especially irritatingly during FFT measurements: that "info-block" anchors itself just far left covering the FFT spectrum in really important part!? In the manual it is shown, there the measurement "block" is on the top left part of the display, but in the real life it is just a blocking the signal, it stays on the lover left part of the display. Any ideas how to move it?

author: Siglent
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 26, 2014, 03:47:41 am
content: Quote from: Pipsa on December 25, 2014, 08:26:33 pmIs it SDS1152CML? can you attach a picture to describe it?

author: Pipsa
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: December 26, 2014, 09:04:34 pm
content: Hello!I have attached two screen dump pictures. I have tried everything, also restore default settings, but it just stay there.

author: Pipsa
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: December 26, 2014, 09:11:11 pm
content: Yes, it is 1152CML, I forgot this detail from my screen dump mesage.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 26, 2014, 10:44:46 pm
content: @ PipsaThey are YT Cursor measurements.I think you can turn them off, I can in a latest version SDS1072CNL.In the Cursors menu.

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 27, 2014, 08:37:24 am
content: Quote from: Pipsa on December 26, 2014, 09:04:34 pmIt is different in manual. Manual details are from different FW version. Manuals are not fully updated after every FW change.In this case it is logical that FFT cursors are shown in FFT window and not on YT window. But what is logical for FW programmer is not always best for equipment useability. (UI handling ergonomy and visual ergonomy design need more than just skills for do program code. Example in this case YT window is not so important than FFT and it is better to overlay YT window than FFT window. Just only label it so that cursor information is from FFT)Also some (user adjustable) transparency, position and color settings may develop better (Siglent!)If you use overlayed FFT display mode this small cursor window is left top. Overlay (not separate window) mode it is mostly practical to adjust YT trace as dim as possible.Also if there is important part of FFT trace under this cursor window you can horizontally move FFT trace.I can also see that using FFT may need some more exercise for find more useful settings for signal under test, depending what want look. Many times 20dB/div is wrong, due to fact that 40-50dB is max useful dynamic range of this kind of FFT (theoretically 8 bit but in practice less due to analog front end noise and ADC noise(s))Then, it need carefully think what are signal under test things what want look. Then think what is maximum frequency wanted for FFT. Then select sampling speed for this. Example, if look 1kHz signal and want see range from 1st to 11th harmonic. It is 1 - 11kHz. To Mr Nyquist we give double and we need least 22kSa/s. (no it leaks and it is impossile to select in this case) 25kSa/s is also very borderline. Lets select 50kSa/s so FFT freq range is 0 - 25kHzAdjust YT horizontal speed (and or memory in some models) so that sample rate is 50kSa/s.Ok, now YT display is nearly as useless. (this is FFT and if we can not zoom YT so that there is used same sample points as FFT is using, then it is as it is but FFT works now nearly optimal related to resolution. (In SDS2000 there can can use windowed YT zoom with FFT (but not zoom directly to FFT used sample points)It need remember that these simple machines FFT use 1024 sample points and result is 512 point FFT) There is now FFT left 0Hz and right 25kHz. This trace include 512 points horizontally giving around 50Hz resolution. For some amount better visibility you can zoom FFT 2x or 5x. Then of course need shift FFT horizontally so that this part what you are looking is visible. (push once "math" and some controls works now for FFT)Also of course then select example 10dB/div and vertical shift FFT so that noise level is visible, so you have visible whole dynamic range from noise to maximum level. With YT display need carefully check that sany part of ignal do not clip. (best to think 8 vertical div is max. (true max is around 10 vertical div))It need also some exercise how to do FFT adjustments. (knobs function change)Also input channel separate DSP (low pass) filter optimal settings may help in some situations.If use FFT under 5-10MHz use always analog BW limit on for reduce noise (noise aliases from over Nyquist limit) And more, if use probe, it can also use as some poor low pass filter using 1x instead of 10x. (corner freq is somewhere 3-6MHz or something like it)I can see you did not use "Print" button for take screenshot to USB. With this function you get image what is just as on the TFT and also so that all menu is as it is displayed when push "Print" button. (no need use Save/Recall menu and also if want, right menu can shut off for more room for signal in image or if want show some menu, it can do using "Print" for image so that right menu can be as it is).(Suomeksi tämä olisi helpompaa.)

author: MrRadish
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 21, 2015, 08:19:35 pm
content: Quote from: illyesgeza on October 22, 2014, 07:14:51 amHi,Did you get a response from Siglent to the Single Trigger LONGMEM issue?I have SDS1102CML, S/W 5.01.02.22 F/W 11-62-3.5 with the same issue.Cheers

author: unfy
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: January 21, 2015, 11:03:38 pm
content: I recently picked up one of these scopes (SDS 1102CML) and have been fiddling with it for about two days.Synopsis: I like it.I can confirm the single shot memory depth weirdness (S: 5.01.02.22 H: 11-62-3.5). Unfortunate but not an immediate problem for me.... but I've not done much with the scope yet heh.But make no mistake, this is a serious problem.In my fiddling with the scope - I like it. It was priced in between the Rigol 1052E and 1054Z. Is the 1054Z a better buy ? Possibly. I dislike the $150 per "software feature" unlock on the 1054Z though.The display is nice enough. It's not super high res, but it's big enough and clear enough for my eyes. UI reaction speed to playing with knobs is definitely no analog scope, but it's reasonable / good in my opinion. The vertical position adjustments are perhaps the most noticeably laggy.From hitting the power button to ready to do work was 11 seconds.Buttons and knobs all feel decent. A dedicated "Trigger 50%" button is nice. Most of knobs have a label for what their "push" function does which is a nice thought.Probes: not the ultra hard thick PVC coated cheapies, but not high end probes either. At the price point the scope was bought - no complaints (and comes with two).The external trigger is on the front and is not replicated on the back (if that matters to you).Has an in-scope help feature that's.... well, it is what it is. You probably don't need it, but it's handy none the less.For the negatives:So far, my primary complaint (if any) would be the cursor system. The cursors are the same color as the CH1 trace. You only get 2 (two) cursors. Kinda. They have to be in the same domain (time or voltage). The interface remembers the positions for each domain of the cursors - so you can quickly switch between the two domains in order to loosely approximate getting cursors in both domains (so - you kind of have 4, but only one domain is visible at a time). I did this when using the scope to measure the values of a few capacitors (seemed like a decent quick test).The USB interface for remote scope work ? Relatively useless IMHO. Using the software to be able to look over waveforms and fiddle with some cursors is kind of nice, but the software just lacks. 3 second refresh rates makes it rather ewww. As far as working with waveforms in the software - things seemed tedious and not intuitive. The virtual control panel did work though.The 'feet' of the scope are plastic and not rubber. On a polished surface, this makes the scope willing to slide around a bit. The push feature of the knobs is the most noticeable. The scope is heavy enough that it's not a huge deal - but it is present. Bracing with some fingers of the same hand on top of the scope negates it all if you happen to be a button masher. In a good light, I've not had any instance where the scope ever wanted to fall over while playing with buttons - it's steady.The lower screen resolution makes on screen measurement display a bit of a pickle (as in covering up your waveforms). I wish there was a simpler way to turn them on or off without jumping through several menus -- but -- whatever. The measurement stuffisthere.

author: v81
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 28, 2015, 06:16:45 am
content: For the Aussies-Got word from the blokes @ ocau.com thatthis model is on sale @ Rockbys at the moment for $395 inc GSTI'm new to scopes, but looking a the screen shots it appeared this unit has a rather low res screen?I have little experience, bar from my 1st scope bought a few days ago (for $130 more than this!) DS1054Z @ 800 x 480

author: David Aurora
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 20, 2015, 11:43:38 am
content: Just went through the firmware update process to keep mine up to date (5.01.02.32) and I cannot for the life of me find the cfg file that's supposed to be part of the download and part of the update process according to the instructions. Am I missing something here? Firmware update seemed to work, scope is running and system status shows the latest firmware, but I can't complete the update config part of the instructions as I can't find the file!

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 20, 2015, 07:13:11 pm
content: Quote from: David Aurora on September 20, 2015, 11:43:38 amAFAIK the cfg file is only required if you are updating FW from a much earlier version.If your system status is showing the version you have just installed then all is well.

author: David Aurora
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 10, 2015, 08:17:34 pm
content: Quote from: tautech on September 20, 2015, 07:13:11 pmOnly just saw this, thanks mate

author: arivel
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 13, 2022, 07:28:59 am
content: Hello .sorry if I resume this post after some time.I went to read the SDS1102CML + datasheet (the improved version) and there is written real time sampling 1GSa / s. is this for each channel or in total for 2 channels? . does it have 2 converters or just one?

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 13, 2022, 07:39:52 am
content: Quote from: arivel on January 13, 2022, 07:28:59 amSingle ADC in these. Sampling and memory depth is halved when both channels are active.

author: David Aurora
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2022, 09:59:32 pm
content: Does anyone know what the last update for this scope was and where to find it? Mine barely gets used so I tend to forget about it, but lately I turned it on a few times and there definitely seems to be a couple quirks with the firmware version it has on it. When I search for it though all I can find now is firmware for the + version which I assume isn't going to work on the old version?

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2022, 11:33:25 pm
content: Quote from: David Aurora on May 05, 2022, 09:59:32 pmSDS1000CML_CNL_5.01.02.32 is the last version I have from July 2017.Attached as a TXT file so remove the TXT extension before installing to scope.

author: David Aurora
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 06, 2022, 06:51:20 am
content: Thanks, according to my reply in this thread from 2015 that's the version I updated to, so I guess that was the end of the line, bugs and allI might even try re-installing later just in case that's the issue

author: gavenkoa
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: December 08, 2023, 09:45:14 am
content: tautechprovided firmware is identical to what I downloaded from Web Archive, if you are afraid of integrity my calculations:Code:# md5sum SDS1000CML_SSP_V100R005B01D02P32.ADSd6409e48b26abc37f4f99ea49409ef09 *SDS1000CML_SSP_V100R005B01D02P32.ADS# sha256sum SDS1000CML_SSP_V100R005B01D02P32.ADSb2907a3850bb4f09e8fe27db7f5b2353f01953acdc16aa28d02e0ee1e190299c *SDS1000CML_SSP_V100R005B01D02P32.ADSSome archeological digging led me to the latest page the SDS1102CML is mentioned as discontinued product on Aug 2016:https://web.archive.org/web/20160809134722/http://siglent.com/ENs/prodcut-detailxx.aspx?id=27&tid=1&T=2The firmware is still available in 2018 at (so I assume it is the latest available version):Code:Version: 5.01.02.32 | Published：2015-07-09It is downloadable from the page:https://web.archive.org/web/20180713015239/http://www.siglent.com/ENs/prodcut-gjjrj.aspx?id=-1&tid=1&T=1Two direct download links:https://web.archive.org/web/20150908034130/http://siglentamerica.com/download/software/SDS1000CML_SSP_V100R005B01D02P32.rarhttps://web.archive.org/web/20180713015239/http://old.siglentamerica.com/USA_website_2014/Firmware&Software/firmware/SDS1000CML_SSP_V100R005B01D02P32.rar