Taking audiophoolery to the extreme - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: leppie
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2015, 11:12:06 am
content: http://www.enjoythemusic.com/hificritic/vol5_no3/listening_to_storage.htmQuoteQuote

author: Howardlong
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2015, 11:18:28 am
content: You couldn't make this shit up, doh, I guess they did.

author: dannyf
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2015, 11:28:33 am
content: QuoteWhat's the utility one gets pounding a deadhorse?However ridiculous it may be, it is his/her personal taste and his/her own money / resources wasted.What do YOU get? Showing off your superior intellect? .....I am sure you can spend your time somewhere else.

author: leppie
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2015, 11:31:37 am
content: Quote from: dannyf on January 05, 2015, 11:28:33 amFirst day back at work and not much going on...I thought it was funny, and it has nothing to show off any intellect, not even sure how you got that idea...

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 05, 2015, 11:41:37 am
content: Quote from: Howardlong on January 05, 2015, 11:18:28 amThe sad thing is they didn't make it up, they actuallybelievethey can hear the difference

author: ConKbot
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2015, 11:51:48 am
content: Quote from: leppie on January 05, 2015, 11:31:37 am2 sides to it.1) Yes, its comical to see people suggesting that different storage devices will provide different digital data though a series of buffered interfaces.2) Most the "lol audiophiles" or even threads about audio on here turn into posting links to $5000 power cables, stone power strips, $500 rocks, and people commenting 'lol audiophile r so dum, we r so much smart-r then them' And people likehttp://xkcd.com/386/everysinglethread.So while there isnt anything particularly offensive, annoying or bad about what you posted (I skimmed, cracked a smile, rolled eyes a tad), It will devolve into the same shit-show within 2-3 pages.

author: leppie
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2015, 12:00:00 pm
content: Quote from: ConKbot on January 05, 2015, 11:51:48 amThanksI will know better in the future.

author: amyk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2015, 12:00:35 pm
content: No double-blind testing as usual... despite the fact that using a NAS probably makes it even easier to do that.

author: LoyalServant
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2015, 12:03:08 pm
content: Oh my god more audiophools.QuoteWHAT?!?!?!?!??!?

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2015, 12:06:47 pm
content: Quote from: dannyf on January 05, 2015, 11:28:33 amIf someone wants to waste their money that's fine but when they have a website geared towards ripping people off and spreading audiophool propaganda then calling them out is the right thing to do.QuoteNo, we'd rather have a laugh at their expense and hopefully prevent them from ripping other people off.

author: daqq
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2015, 05:53:40 pm
content: QuoteFirst off, I get the satisfaction that when someone searches for "Does my HDD affect my audio?" then more than one source will pop up, one side containing engineers, scientists and similar, saying NO, the other side will contain nutjobs selling diamond optical cable, golden cables, crystals which you should affix to your ceiling to improve sound quality and a giant bag of manure because if you're stupid enough to pay 10k$/m cable then you'll buy anything labeled "It really works!". Adding relevant (in my opinion) opinions and information to the internet is it's own reward.Second, I get to see the new depths that man is willing to go to sell crap and make a quick buck through scams and with that I get to appreciate good actual engineering some more rather than snake oil vendors.Third: this dead horse deserves to be pounded again and again until people (customers of crapsellers) realize that it IS a dead horse and STOP BUYING SCAMMY PRODUCTS - while it may not be as critical here (here only a wealthy nutjob pays 100kUSD for a piece of dubious engineering), there are other areas where the general public needs to be taught to apply critical thinking - be it curing cancer with bleach and crystals and orogonite, buying "medical devices" of dubious origin, purpose and repeatability, or bomb detectors made from an antennae and marketing.

author: electr_peter
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 05, 2015, 06:45:33 pm
content: I think that a big part of audiophoolery is aconsciousscam (that is, a business model).Salesmen tell things that are 1) so vague that you cannot argue/dispute/prove/disprove them directly, 2) yet at the same time they create "positive feeling". They target specific market segment with this tactic and it is successful so far.

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 02:47:34 am
content: Quote from: dannyf on January 05, 2015, 11:28:33 amFighting willing ignorance is not pounding a dead horse. The woowoos and believers don't stop. If the opposers of woowoo and BS stop shooting it down then the scammers and ignorance win by default. There is no harm or waste of time debunking BS, it does have effect for those who have never seen the opposing view.

author: steve_w
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 05:55:29 am
content: If anybody needs to build a dickhead I know where to find a blueprint

author: Stonent
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 06:21:21 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 05, 2015, 11:41:37 amHello? Yes, my tap water hasn't been sparkling quite as nicely as it used to...

author: zapta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 06:27:02 am
content: Quote from: electr_peter on January 05, 2015, 06:45:33 pmI don't think this is a scan but filling a need, the need to feel special, unique and discerning, above the crowd (see the Narcissism of small differences). With a scam the victim eventually figure out he was scammed. Here it's different, but as long as they do it on their own dime, who cares. I am more concerned about people that subsidize their pet causes with my tax money.

author: Stonent
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 06:28:35 am
content: Quote from: LoyalServant on January 05, 2015, 12:03:08 pmAh yes, a vintage 2014 Corsair drive with the Vishay decoupling caps on the main ASIC. Don't EVER buy one with the Panasonic decoupling caps, throw it in the trash, don't even bother to return it, it's not worth your time and they'd never understand.

author: steve_w
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 10:19:13 am
content: Whats a sibilant?

author: leppie
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 10:21:21 am
content: Quote from: steve_w on January 06, 2015, 10:19:13 amA fancy word to make them sound clever. Google says it means 'hissing'

author: coppice
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 10:35:49 am
content: Quote from: leppie on January 06, 2015, 10:21:21 amWhen did sibilant become a fancy word? Have people's vocabularies shrunk that much?

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 10:53:52 am
content: Quote from: zapta on January 06, 2015, 06:27:02 amNo, it's a scam, preying on the uneducated. Here are some quotes from people on another forum confessing to making audiophool purchases:http://hddaudio.net/viewtopic.php?id=417QuoteQuoteQuoteQuotehttp://hddaudio.net/viewtopic.php?id=417Although we like to have a laugh about it, the reality isn't so funny. People are hurt by these scammers. What annoys me more is some people here (not mentioning any names but one has already responded to this thread) seem to support these fraudsters.

author: leppie
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 11:26:58 am
content: Quote from: Hero999 on January 06, 2015, 10:53:52 amYou dont have to uneducated to think the same file on 2 different storages (HDD/SSD/network/etc) will sound different. You have to be complete f*ckin moron to think that!I can understand how people fall for the other stuff, but this is taking the bull to a new level.As an experiment, I asked my uneducated wife if she thought it would sound different, she said no.

author: dannyf
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 12:03:13 pm
content: QuoteFunny but in a sad way.End of the day, money that bought happiness is money well spent, whether it actually enhances the (physical) "sound" is 2ndary. Who are we to say that someone a world away shall or shall not spend money in a way just because we approve or disapprove it?QuoteIt depends on what you meant by "different", as someone famous said some years ago that you can never cross the same river twice.The point is that there is very few things in that world that are that absolute.QuoteI am sure you didn't mean it but "uneducated" can be a derogatory word and she may not appreciate your using it to describe her.

author: leppie
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 12:05:12 pm
content: Quote from: dannyf on January 06, 2015, 12:03:13 pmShe calls me an arsehole (and worse), I am pretty safe on that front

author: dannyf
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 12:26:44 pm
content: Well, that sounds like a resilient relationship. Good for you all.

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 12:31:23 pm
content: Quote from: leppie on January 06, 2015, 11:26:58 amIt's still not right for someone to take advantage of it.These sort of people are like the crooked shop workers who short change the mentally retarded because they know they can't count their change. Just because someone is incapable of understanding something and is therefore easy prey, it's still wrong for someone to take advantage of them.

author: Yago
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 01:10:39 pm
content: I understand Conkbot's point of view, threads that are clones don't contribute to the forum.On the subject of misleading customers, is this a whole grey area for some of the electronics industry?Alan sugar performed some slight of hand, rehashing old spectrum computers and selling them for many, many times their value.Then there's the maths trick with power output of audio amps.The audiophool are at the extreme in a range from a dodgy car salesman to a medium/psychic.

author: coppice
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 01:15:25 pm
content: Quote from: leppie on January 06, 2015, 11:26:58 amIn the early days of HD LCD TVs most of them wouldn't display a picture without screwing around with it. in some way, like forcing overscan on you. After a while sanity prevailed, and a 1:1 pixel mode was introduced, but the default is still to overscan. You need to go into deep menus with most TVs to select 1:1 pixel mode. With that background, why would an an intelligent person without detailed knowledge of server equipment not expect it to be manipulating things in some way?

author: senso
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 01:47:23 pm
content: Its a file, if there is any wanking of the bits that make that file, the file is no longer intact, does your computer boots everyday with a new glitch in the OS text, or in the display, or in any other sub-system?

author: zapta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 02:01:34 pm
content: Quote from: Hero999 on January 06, 2015, 10:53:52 amNothing is perfect, not even placebo.

author: madires
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 02:11:12 pm
content: What about cryogenic-treated USB sticks?

author: Red Squirrel
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2015, 04:07:45 pm
content: spindle disks are better than SSDs. You get that record quality sound with the clicks and pops for that true overall music warmth. The multi platter drives are best for stereo or surround sound.You need to put the cable in the right way though. They're directional.

author: manzini
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2015, 08:16:59 pm
content: oh no !!! I have to sell my noisy kingston SD"for Premium Sound" tagline means quieter data transfersJoking aside, if it have some basis and affect the sound measurably, and perceived by humans, not only for bats. Would not it be easier, effective and practical to better shield the SD socket?I guess also have to change my AAA batteries and seek others with audiophile grade.

author: SL4P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2015, 09:26:57 pm
content: Quote from: Hero999 on January 06, 2015, 12:31:23 pmAnd that my friend, is a significant part of modern society's problems. They do.

author: calexanian
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2015, 09:48:22 pm
content: Its not only memory cards, but extends to hard drives, sata cables, and everything else they can mark up. CES was full of that crap.

author: John Coloccia
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2015, 10:47:46 pm
content: What a BS test. He didn't have the network cables sitting on little blocks of vibration dampening wood. And look at those open USB ports on the drives. All of the mid-range glissanance and low end scowl are leaking out all over the place, not to mention the high end fantitude. And why are the drives sitting right near the records? Doesn't he know that they're going to cross-contaminate the differential clock fulcrum? What was he thinking? I'll bet those plants in the listening room haven't even been synchro-tuned with the speaker cabinet's coniflanger.

author: SL4P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2015, 10:52:36 pm
content: Quote from: John Coloccia on February 19, 2015, 10:47:46 pmIt's ok, they're classical plants. We all know that plants like music.I'd be more concerned with the resonant frequencies of those pots holding the plants = that can cause all sorts of harmonic disturbances of the inner field.

author: nitro2k01
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2015, 11:02:36 pm
content: Quote from: manzini on February 19, 2015, 08:16:59 pmWhat's most likely referred to hear is not sonic noise emanating from the card itself, or even radiated electrical noise, but conducted noise. What happens to the system's Vcc if the card reads data in bursts 1000 times per second and draws a current spike each time? And in turn, what happens to the DAC's and audio amplifier's Vcc if the player is crappily designed? Granted, the better way to solve this problem, would be to use a player that is well designed.Also, I'm taking the tagline as referring to the customer group, not an endorsement of the quality of the product. Just like, "for DV recording", or "for automotive applications".

author: madires
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2015, 01:41:30 pm
content: Quote from: manzini on February 19, 2015, 08:16:59 pmAudio phoolery is a market with high profit margins. 64GB for US$ 160 is about 5 times the price of a common 64GB card.

author: Rico
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2015, 02:10:47 pm
content: I've considered getting into the snake oil market as a "manufacturer", but I just can't bring myself to do it.Well, here's some audiophile guys doing a bottled water taste test: