MPLAB X a PIC usage inhibitor! - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / projects

author: fourtytwo42
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2017, 07:04:53 pm
content: Bit of a rant I have used PIC processors for years and stick by MPLAB 8.92 seemingly the last release, I tried MPLAB X several years ago when it first came out and decided it didn't work very well.Recently wanting some extra horsepower I looked at several DsPIC33 chips, all was well until I discovered they are not supported in MPLAB 8.92 so resorted to loading the latest MPLAB X.OMG it seems to be Java based as it insisted upon it's installation too (I don't usually have it loaded for security reasons), well no surprise then it is incredibly SLOW!! It takes a minute or so for the program to start, there are no shortcuts from where you store the code for a particular project, the whole thing is extremely difficult to navigate and frankly rather than learn something very slow and not user friendly I will simply not use the newer PIC's.Instead I will invest my time in something else that is fast and user friendly.Anybody else had this experience and what are your opinions on toolchains for other chips ?

author: Leo Bodnar
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2017, 07:50:54 pm
content: I am still happily on MPLAB 8.92 chomping away at dsPIC33s using assembly.For the last 6 years I had an annual ritual of building up hope, downloading MPLAB-X, watching it install, trying to connect to the tool, trying to create a project, giving up and wiping it out. It is such a pile of shit - still. For someone else, who is born into cloud devtools MPLAB-X might look "an OK".MC already dropped support for MPLAB from ICD 4.0 - squeeze-out is continuing.PICs to me were always simple as nails so enforcing the use of complex and bloated tool to whip up even a simple project is very off-putting.Luckily, MC does not obsolete old silicon (they still sell PIC14000 from stock) but for high performance (above dsPIC33E) I am using ARM cores.Leo

author: fourtytwo42
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2017, 08:14:46 pm
content: Hi Leo, I would say an identical experience apart from I have not yet transitioned to ARM but am seriously considering it due to MPLAB X. I too write everything in assembly, out of interest do you also do that on ARM ?I am very sorry one and all, I lost this post till it turned up in my "new replies" so I wrote it again in the mpu's section!

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2017, 08:19:44 pm
content: It appears that Microchip has abandoned Assembly programmers in everything new. There are threads on several other forums to that effect; however, every time a link to such external threads, it gets deleted. Why bother? According to some, MPLAB X 4.01 can be made to work with Assembly, but even that person ( a senior moderator on that forum) seems to use C to set the configuration.Good luck. As for my near term use, I will use enhanced mid-range devices. Some PIC 24Fxxx are supposedly supported, but that seems to come with conditions.I just hope Microchip doesn't make everything in the future rely on the Arduino platform.

author: Mjolinor
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2017, 08:49:33 pm
content: Go and spend a few hours trying to do something with Android Studio. MPlab will seem like a text editor when you come back.They all seem to be going that way, no choices for you, brackets where they want, hundreds of white spaces everywhere. Tourettes syndrome stability test is the end point.

author: Leo Bodnar
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2017, 09:15:20 pm
content: Quote from: fourtytwo42 on November 03, 2017, 08:14:46 pmI only do it now for really time-critical stuff which happens very rarely.You will find that even if you attempt to write everything in ARM assembly you will eventually start trusting C.The best two books that got me going were:https://www.amazon.co.uk/Definitive-Guide-Cortex-M3-Cortex-M4-Processors/dp/0124080820/https://www.amazon.co.uk/Designers-Guide-Cortex-M-Processor-Family/dp/0080982964/much else is armduino mush.Trevor Martin from Hitex is a very nice chap, bumped into him just last weekLeo

author: TomS_
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2017, 07:55:13 pm
content: Quote from: fourtytwo42 on November 03, 2017, 07:04:53 pmNot having any significant difficulties myself. The biggest issue I have is with my ICD3 needing to be unplugged and re-plugged (USB wise) on a semi regular basis. More recently was getting it to work with git, although I subsequently found out that it doesnt use the command line git client, but jgit. That kind of sucks, as jgit is missing some functionality, like pre/post commit hooks etc.Quote from: fourtytwo42 on November 03, 2017, 07:04:53 pmWhat exactly do you mean by that? Project file you can double click to open it up?Quote from: fourtytwo42 on November 03, 2017, 07:04:53 pmPerhaps you just need to spend some more time with it to "get used to it". Its very different, so I wouldnt be expecting too many similarities.As for the slowness, what are the specs of your PC? How much RAM? SSD or spinning disk (would impact the speed for swapped memory for example)? I get the feeling that NetBeans is rather bloated (and yeah, Java) so probably needs a bit of horsepower to work super smooth. Personally, I am using a 2012/2013 MacBook Pro with 16GB RAM, SSD and a quad core i7 at 2.6GHz and MPLAB X starts up and loads all of my previously open source files in 10-12 seconds.

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2017, 08:37:07 pm
content: Note that this thread is a duplicate of the one the OP started in Microcontrollers & FPGAs.https://www.eevblog.com/forum/microcontrollers/mplab-x-a-pic-inhibitor!-alternatives/I suggest restricting all replies to that one (it has more replies).

author: aandrew
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2017, 10:23:45 pm
content: Quote from: fourtytwo42 on November 03, 2017, 07:04:53 pmWhile I do not like MPLAB-X (or Eclipse in general), this kind of exaggeration does nothing to help. Unless you're running on an old Core solo processor or something along that line, it is reasonably fast both to develop and debug in.QuoteI like ARM Cortex series, and STM32 specifically. Good documentation, good support, great selection of peripherals and CPU cores, excellent availability. I use the STM32CubeMX HAL and libraries, but develop using the good old command line. I use a modified version of Steffen Vogel's stm32-cube-gcc Makefile which makes building using CubeMX from the command line very nice.https://github.com/stv0g/stm32cube-gccis a link to his work.For debugging I use a Segger J-Link (Base, don't need plus especially on Linux/OSX). Segger even gives you a free license turn any ST-Link that is part of an STM32 dev board into a J-Link. Their tools and Ozone debugger are very nice. I don't have nearly the same troubles with them that I do with ST-Link and OpenOCD.

author: fourtytwo42
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2017, 10:36:26 am
content: Quote from: aandrew on November 04, 2017, 10:23:45 pmSo your suggesting I am unable to use a clock ?

author: Mjolinor
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2017, 11:11:13 am
content: Quote from: fourtytwo42 on November 05, 2017, 10:36:26 amPerhaps the British Summer / Winter time change caught you out while testing, it can do that.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 05, 2017, 12:33:25 pm
content: As this is the shorter thread and the other is in a more suitable location can we direct answers to the other thread.