The Emperor of Test Equipment - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 27, 2025, 07:48:08 am
content: From this post:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/blog/eevblab-91-why-are-fluke-meters-so-expensive/msg5796847/#msg5796847I figured it's better here to be seen.https://emperoroftestequipment.weebly.com/

author: factory
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2025, 05:51:05 pm
content: That's a great website for finding out about TE you didn't know existed, I've know about it for years, the author is on here somewhere.P.S. I've also taken a severe dislike to unreliable National Semiconductor parts.David

author: temperance
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2025, 07:18:25 pm
content: Huh, and why would you count all those?

author: electr_peter
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 27, 2025, 07:44:16 pm
content: QuoteThis guy obviously went through a rehab, otherwise how can he haveonly double digitsof DMMs?

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2025, 08:32:49 pm
content: The emperor of trash you mean. A huge pile of junk

author: coromonadalix
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2025, 08:43:37 pm
content: you have to make a round of flipping switches / turning knobs once in a while loll

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2025, 10:15:04 pm
content: When you make a histogram of the prices of equipment, I think you have a problem.Just imagine how many equipment is integrated into one nowadays. You can use an AWG in place of a:Function generatorLow distortion oscillatorPulse generatorAudio generatorVideo generator (not that anyone would repair a TV nowadays)All the audio test gear can also be condensed into 1 box which typically going to have 1 CODEC and some amplifiers. Imagine this guy has a separate box to measure "Wow and Flutter" on cassette audio players.

author: ZGoode
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2025, 10:47:40 pm
content: Seeing that long list, which probably consists of a lot of boat anchors (albeit probably some interesting ones), makes me feel a lot better about my test equipment hoard. Although I will admit I do fall prey to buying a piece of equipment for use in one project and then have it collect dust until I might need it again (looking at you, weird audio equipment on the bottom shelf).

author: schmitt trigger
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 28, 2025, 12:26:32 am
content: Audio cassette Wow and Flutter meter.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 28, 2025, 01:18:07 am
content: Quote from: tszaboo on January 27, 2025, 10:15:04 pmAdd Mark/Space generator

author: 44kgk1lkf6u
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 28, 2025, 03:31:26 am
content: Quote from: tautech on January 28, 2025, 01:18:07 amAnd also voltage and current source.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 28, 2025, 06:11:07 am
content: Quote from: 44kgk1lkf6u on January 28, 2025, 03:31:26 amOh, and LF counter.

author: J-R
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 28, 2025, 06:28:22 am
content: Looks like the Emperor's site was first presented here in the Test Equipment forum back in 2014:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/test-equipment-webpage/We can see some of his progress via Archive.org. For example, the first capture was April 29th, 2015 with "only" 280 (he's up to 475 now) pieces on display:https://web.archive.org/web/20150429221102/https://emperoroftestequipment.weebly.comA common theme throughout is that he's frequently buying this equipment for the fun of fixing it. I subscribe to a similar line of thinking, although I don't have nearly as much sitting around and I mostly prefer newer.One problem with such collections and even my collection is that you just won't make much money by selling most of it. I think if I added up all my TE purchases I might be in the $5k-$10k range, which if sold might net me 50%-75% of that value once you consider fees, shipping and inevitable scammers.

author: wn1fju
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 28, 2025, 12:52:16 pm
content: I am the aforementioned author of the site. As the webpage says, I originally created this site to keep track of what I had and what some of the repairs were. I don't really publicize the site and I figure that anyone who comes across it is pretty good at web searches. I do know that it has helped others with their repairs.I do enjoy repairing this stuff and if my choice is between spending $50 for a dinner and a movie or spending $50 on a piece of broken vintage test equipment that could potentially give me hours of entertainment, the latter usually wins. And so the collection has grown steadily over the past 20 years.What's amusing (at least to me) is that with a collection so large, there seems always to be something that needs fixing. I often just start turning things on until I find something that doesn't work anymore (usually blown capacitors). So I can quench my thirst to fix test equipment without buying another piece. Which is probably a good thing since the offerings on eBay (my usual source) have been terrible lately - a lot of overpriced pieces or pieces that I already have).I do worry what I am going to do with all this stuff. As the previous post says, it is not really profitable to sell stuff. I pity my poor wife when I drop dead and she has to get rid of this collection.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 28, 2025, 01:04:47 pm
content: Quote from: wn1fju on January 28, 2025, 12:52:16 pmThis unhappy topic has been discussed before. As a test equipment hoarder myself, it pains me to realise and write that most (if not all) of the equipment will end up in a dumpster and hauled away to the recyclers.

author: abeyer
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 28, 2025, 08:41:32 pm
content: Sounds like a business opportunity... someone sets up a TEA bequest registry and you can list everything you own for interested parties to request and pay packing/shipping costs to your estate.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 29, 2025, 12:43:19 am
content: Quote from: wn1fju on January 28, 2025, 12:52:16 pmI always say that I should sell a lot of my unused gear, but I hardly ever do it because it's just so much work to test, photograph, list, and then pack and ship oddball items that need a trip to the dumpster room to get a suitable box and packing material and then going to the post office or arranging a custom shipment via DHL.Small items I can fit into my existing store shipping workflow aren't a problem though, but you still have to photograph and list.

author: joeqsmith
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 29, 2025, 01:06:07 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 29, 2025, 12:43:19 amWell, I did offer you a k, no questions asked. Tiny package, no photos, no listing. Just admit you have a problem and join the TEA group.

author: J-R
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 29, 2025, 01:46:48 am
content: I think the best system I've seen is to apply a small, permanent label with a number on it, then have a notebook (physical or digital) that explains the object, where it came from (family heirloom?), how much you paid for it, how much it should sell for, etc. Then someone else can more easily deal with the situation. You can also use this to gift certain things to specific people.

author: schmitt trigger
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 29, 2025, 01:54:26 am
content: Donate it to a museum? I know for a fact that Tek does have its own equipment museum, and that there are Radio museums and Computer museums at several locations.Time to create a T&E museum?

author: schmitt trigger
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 29, 2025, 02:03:30 am
content: Quote from: wn1fju on January 28, 2025, 12:52:16 pmNo need to apologize. I have met hoarders of all sorts. Vintage (mechanical) clocks, model trains, shop tools.Even Star Wars paraphernalia hoarders. The latter I simply cannot understand, but hey! It’s their choice of spending their time and money. Who am I to judge them?

author: DaJMasta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 29, 2025, 02:08:47 am
content: Looking at the date-of-manufacture histogram, my gear is almost the opposite of his in terms of timeline. That means I've got at least 30 years before I'm the same person, what a relief!

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 29, 2025, 03:46:17 am
content: This is ebay telling me something...

author: zepto
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 29, 2025, 04:35:45 am
content: I like the website, and I think it's an interesting collection of test equipment. Thank you for posting about your experiences.

author: jh15
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 29, 2025, 06:25:36 am
content: I have THE Ampex/micom wow and flutter meter, came used for telemetry analog tape recorders. Was calibrated by Raytheon not long before I bought it. Used it for decades on reel-reel, and other machines. I wish it had the the frequency analysis knob, you could tell by the flutter freq what rotating component was bad.It sits under my media cabinet in the living room. Has acvm db meter, and looks cool.

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 29, 2025, 08:51:21 am
content: Quote from: nctnico on January 28, 2025, 01:04:47 pmI've seen this done a few times. All the test equipment gets uploaded to a website, some blurry pictures from far away, only local pick-up. They make an estimate that the ie 50 Equipment is worth 2000 EUR. Even if there was 1-2 items that are worth keeping, you don't buy it, because it's filled up with obsolete stuff that can only be used to measure or fix other obsolete stuff. Buying the lot is not worth it, because half the stuff you cannot sell or use. So nobody bids on the lot in the end.Quote from: wn1fju on January 28, 2025, 12:52:16 pmGood for you, it's a nice hobby. And I totally get that having so much stuff is mesmerizing.Meanwhile I don't get why someone would want to have more than ie. 3 oscilloscopes. Some of them are just going to collect dust for 20 years, until they are too old to be useful. While others (who would use it) cannot afford to buy equipment.

author: watchmaker
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 29, 2025, 11:31:59 am
content: Quote from: joeqsmith on January 29, 2025, 01:06:07 amI am loathe to selling good machine and measurement tools. I bought a lot of this stuff int he late 1980s and 1990s when mechanical watches were supposedly dead. I no longer do involved work yet I still refuse to sell things like my fully equipped Nikon optical comparator.Part of the problem is the story behind acquiring them (makes me a collector then), another part is that most people wil treat them like crap, and the other part is that there are things that I use maybe once every 5 years, but when you need them nothing else will do.I called myself a tool slut. Would date any tool but dump it as soon as something better came along.My wife understands this (she services the marine chronometers) and accepts "the kid" has an issue to deal with.Now I am hoarding old stockroom supplies of capacitors and discrete semiconductors. Strikes me as being very similar to the quartz "crisis" of the 80s/90s. So it goes.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 29, 2025, 11:39:11 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 29, 2025, 12:43:19 amI only sell electronics stuff locally (through a local small ads website) and people typically come and pick it up. Much easier. I have unhoarded a vast volume of stuff that way over the last couple of years. Maybe you don't get 'top dollar' but your own time is money as well.

author: schmitt trigger
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 29, 2025, 02:01:07 pm
content: Fortunately for you, the Benelux area is relatively compact, has a high population density and a highly educated population. It makes selling locally the superior option.People in other areas of the World, with the exception of places like SoCal, Silicon Valley or the greater Boston area, are forced to ship the goods.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 29, 2025, 11:43:06 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on January 28, 2025, 01:04:47 pmI have wondered what would happen to all my stuff (and the forum) if I dropped dead tomorrow and Mrs EEVblog and the dudes were left with a full lab and two storage bunkers.I'd like to think that a trusted local viewer(s) would be happy to donate some time to come in and label everything with an approximate base level price so most of it could be sold off so they at least get some decent financial benefit from it.

author: wn1fju
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 30, 2025, 01:06:05 am
content: A couple of years ago when I was worrying about the eventual disposal of my stuff, I contacted one of the major test equipment vendors (here in the USA) that advertises they will buy used/obsolete test equipment. I just wanted to see what kind of prices they would offer for an "as-is" piece, so I selected my HP 53310 Modulation Analyzer since that is a relatively modern piece and works flawlessly. The vendor had one or more 53310A's in stock and they were being advertised for about $1,300. I took pictures of my unit, wrote up a description and submitted it to them for a bid. They came back at $250 if I remember correctly. And that was only after I shipped it to them and they had 15 days to evaluate it.In other words, I am still worrying...

author: MK14
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 30, 2025, 01:33:35 am
content: Quote from: wn1fju on January 30, 2025, 01:06:05 amIf they are a proper, brick-and-mortar store, doing it purely as a business exercise.They need to recover all the various costs, storage of these large/heavy/delicate item(s). Since they (probably) don't know you, they need to get their tech(s) to check out your equipment. Writing adverts/descriptions for your item, etc. Possible research on it. It all takes time, which costs a business money.They need to price in, for minor repairs, possible quick calibration (course rather than precise), cleaning, advertising. Possible return under guarantee or even dishonest buyers, costs. As things don't always go smoothly.Then they have to pay their various overhead bills, website(s), telephones, office staff, security, insurance, taxes, etc.The selling process/transaction, would take time, time to pack and ship the item. Loans to pay for the stock until it sells, and other business costs. I don't know about the US, but in the UK, there would be VAT at around 20% (sales tax), and significant business rates (taxes on the business property) etc.Plus reasonable profit margins. Also, I've probably missed out on many other charges/costs.So it doesn't surprise me.

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 30, 2025, 01:41:14 am
content: Working 53310A sells on ebay for $200-400, $1800 was for one with cal cert.$250 seems reasonable.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 30, 2025, 10:39:24 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 29, 2025, 11:43:06 pmI hate to be the devil's advocate here, but if it isn't worth the trouble for you selling your stuff now, how does that change after you pass away? In your special case your gear may have some added 'celebrity status' value but that only works for a limited number of items. For example: your 'outatime' license plate featured in many of your videos might be worth quite a bit to the right collector. The model railway (if you still have it???) probably not so much because it is huge.If you love your family, you unhoard before you pass away. One of my elderly family members is doing that fortunately. He used to have a decent sized machine park from the days he was doing lots of metal and woodworking. As he is no longer able to operate /use his machines, he got rid of most of them. I don't think he got 'top dollar' but then again dealing with a bunch of 200+ kg machines is not going to be fun after he passes away. We'll probably need to deal with a few of such machines though.

author: ubata
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 30, 2025, 01:16:58 pm
content: Quote from: tszaboo on January 29, 2025, 08:51:21 amUnfortunately, this is one of our bad traits as humans, that we are never satisfied with accumulating things, while perhaps our neighbors are in real dire need of that particular stuff.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 30, 2025, 01:28:40 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on January 30, 2025, 10:39:24 amA lot of it is in the "I might need it for a future video" category.I did actually get off my butt and list three things the other day. Progress.

author: wn1fju
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 30, 2025, 01:55:41 pm
content: I previously misspoke when I said a test equipment vendor would offer me $250 for my HP 53310A. I found their original e-mail from 2022:"I can offer you 175.00 for your 53310A. I would pay all inbound freight costs and require a 15-day acceptance period for my lab to check the unit out to test basic functionality."Anyway, I understand they are a business, not a charity.The whole point of that exercise was to get some sort of feel for whether there is any advantage to contacting a test equipment vendor over simply selling pieces on eBay. There doesn't seem to be. But as Dave mentioned, selling on eBay is not exactly loads of fun.

author: schmitt trigger
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 30, 2025, 02:34:07 pm
content: Another person who also loves to collect dozens of boat anchors is Paul Carlson of Mr Carlson’s Lab of Youtube fame.https://youtu.be/qqmegXoB7lA?si=oy89WF3gUAUrtVgy

author: MK14
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 30, 2025, 03:15:52 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 29, 2025, 11:43:06 pmI'm not sure that would work out too well, really. As other(s) have already said in this thread, but I will give more reasons against it.(Hypothetically speaking, and talking about my situation, to avoid upsetting anyone in this thread).Let's say, I have a pretty reasonable, but not that recent, function generator, in good condition. Which usually sells for $200 on ebay (selling in pounds in the UK), in good/working condition.I can (could), reasonably quickly, check it still works, photograph it working, with oscilloscope traces, with a nice clean square wave at 2 MHz, explain that I had it from new. Include the original manual, as I know where it is, I might even know where the original box is hiding.Whereas, other(s) (if I was to disappear), probably wouldn't know what it is, or how to switch it on and test it. So, the ebay advert would have to say, working status unknown, age unknown, condition unknown, etc. The manual(s), original box, accessories. Would probably end up being lost, as they wouldn't know where they were.Hence it would probably only get $100 (since untested, poorly described, etc) on ebay. So, by the time you remove the packaging/postage time/costs, ebay/paypal fees (applicable at the time), hassle/time factors. It may not really be worth the exercise of selling it.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 30, 2025, 11:26:31 pm
content: Quote from: wn1fju on January 30, 2025, 01:55:41 pmThe advantage is it sounds like the test equipment speciality dealer would bulk buy your stuff. If you know they work, or should work, and want the minimum amount of hassle, it's probably a good option.I've met these people at large test equipment auctions, they just bulk buy without checking and take a risk they can flip it for a large amount if they list it for long enough.

author: MK14
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 12:20:33 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 30, 2025, 11:26:31 pmMy suspicion, is that 'professional' companies like that, who notice (can tell), the seller of the 'estate' is both naive to the value of electronics test gear, and really needs/wants to just get rid of the stuff, with little hassle/quickly, can get away with low ball offer(s).Also bulk purchases like that, probably reduce the scale of the offers.Just look at the electronics test gear, bulk (as in all the hundreds of lots), equipment auction sales.A powerful, somewhat recent oscilloscope, might be worth (used), $1,000 if known to be working and in reasonable condition. But, if in unknown (and possibly bust up inside) condition, possibly poorly stored in an outside (open to the elements) shed etc. May be relatively worthless, and unrepairable (economically).But it is a nice/easy/quick option, for friends and relatives, to clear out, estates. Even if I'm NOT convinced it would be profitable.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 04:09:51 am
content: Reading the some of the last pages of his report he says he hasn't learned the lesson I am slightly learning. Paraphrasing, every few months he gets one of his repaired lovelies off the shelf, only to find that it is no longer working. More caps have gone south, or the switches have crusted up again, or whatever form entropy has taken. Which is OK with him because the repair is the objective in his case.While I love those boat anchors, they were what I used professionally at the start of my career, and what I dreamed of having in my home lab, the reality is not so pleasing. I also find that more often than not when I pull out one of those things it isn't working. So the instruments I use are modern, even when the older stuff has better specs, or is easier (particularly for me) to use. I want to do something, not repair the tools that will let me do something.So now I starting to let go of the old goodies, and resisting buying the ones I haven't got my hands on yet. There are those things that just keep on ticking, and I'm not getting rid of them.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 06:05:05 am
content: Quote from: CatalinaWOW on January 31, 2025, 04:09:51 amOh this 100% !While I learnt a lot keeping old stuff going, it was the only benefit but overrun by the frustration of limited hobby time seemingly never-endingly eaten by old failing junk.If only what is now available for so little cost was available back then......

author: watchmaker
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 10:59:14 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 30, 2025, 01:28:40 pmIn the 1980s the Washington Post ran a story about an antique car auction in rural Maryland. Average price was $50. These cars were in great condition when collected but he had them in a field. Over the years he had been offered fair prices for many of them. But his response was "They will be worth something some day".By the time they were sold, trees were growing in thru the engine compartments.

author: factory
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 11:03:59 am
content: Quote from: nctnico on January 27, 2025, 08:32:49 pmThat's how I would describe the contents of a shipping container from Riglent or Sigol.Quote from: tautech on January 28, 2025, 01:18:07 amJack of several trades, master of none then.As a collector of vintage TE, modern TE is bland & boring to me and not built to last, or designed be repairable to component level, not helped by the shrinking component sizes.Old TE can be made more reliable, whether it's used regularly, or infrequently. It just requires a bit more time, to identify & replace parts that are known to fail with age. This is mostly capacitors, both wet electrolytic, tantalum and paper based ones in really old equipment. And careful cleaning of switches.The same is true for most vintage equipment, YMMV.The video generator is still required, apparently for setting up/repair TV/monitors for retro gamers and vintage arcade machines. The movie/TV programme industry also requires working TV sets & monitors (for props), some of which are modified for movie camera frame rates, I guess not every film company or TV studio has the budget, or time to use CGI.Quote from: schmitt trigger on January 29, 2025, 01:54:26 amThere are antique & vintage scientific & measurement instruments (including TE) in the collection of the Science Museum group in the UK.https://collection.sciencemuseumgroup.org.uk/The National Museum of Scotland was donated some UK made HP TE, when AgilentEOL'ed the South Queensferry site.The smaller museums will accept donations and will sell on the stuff that is duplicates, or doesn't fit their collection to raise funds.It's a shame we lost Lucien Nunes, as he was going to start a Musuem where vintage TE was a part of the collection. Plenty of his collection did get re-homed to other museums & collectors, some went to auction (can't remember if it was Ramco or PP), some on ebay, but I don't know what happened to the larger & more industrial equipment he had.David

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 11:16:22 am
content: Quote from: factory on January 31, 2025, 11:03:59 amTest equipment is a tool, not the goal. The goal is to verify a design, or the functionality of a DUT. I can achieve this better with modern test equipment, therefore it is better fit for the purpose. I can program my current power supply and DC load to take 100 measurement points and sweep the entire working range of a DC-DC converter while I drink a coffee. I can set up a bode plot in a minute. I can analyze any digital communication and apply decoding with a logic analyzer. Or look at 10 seconds of data on an oscilloscope (try doing that on an analogue one).Our goals are different. I'm an engineer, not a collector.This is the same discussion as someone praising old cars, because he knows how to fix the carburetor in it, or how to tear down the two stroke engine.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 11:40:38 am
content: Quote from: tszaboo on January 31, 2025, 11:16:22 amYup.As a one time owner of a Telequipment D83, from a time when they were acquired by Tek and used the same CRT as in Tek 5603 IIRC, it was a nice old 60 MHz CRO with one of the crispest traces one ever seen but it was old tech and little else.Yet it started my journey and many CRO's followed it as well as FG'sand frequent use of a 100 MHz Phillips Mark/Space generator that a buddy had.Time was valuable with 3 kids and 60+ hr weeks and the idea of fixing old shit instead of pursuing hobby projects soon got old. MoreAfter discovering the power of even early DSO's, the game changed, projects finished and so much more was accomplished.Looking back, now with the time and more coin, a 2ch AWG, ~100 MHz DSO and a analyzer/VNA leaves little chance any project couldn't be covered.

author: wn1fju
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 01:43:24 pm
content: "I want to do something, not repair the tools that will let me do something."Been there, done that. I worked for 20 years as a researcher for a federally funded organization and used state-of-the-art test equipment daily. I also had what could only be described as an unlimited budget and the authority to buy whatever I deemed necessary to complete my projects. I probably spent over one million dollars on test equipment over the years. I'm not bragging - it's just the way it is. So I am quite familiar with modern gear.Yet I also find modern gear to be exquisitely boring - a few ASiCs, a digitizer, a CPU, a display and lots of software (I know I am generalizing). I simply enjoy working on the stuff from the 1970's, 80's, 90's and I thoroughly appreciate the ingenuity of the engineers of that era and how they designed equipment with the technology they had at the time. And not to mention the serviceability, which is non-existent today.And that is one of the reasons my basement has a lot of vintage test equipment.

author: schmitt trigger
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 07:14:28 pm
content: As I had previously mentioned, you don’t need to apologize. You aren’t collecting Star Wars paraphernalia nor Cabbage Patch dolls.