Pursuing Electronics as a Med Student: Seeking Guidance and Advice - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / beginners

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2025, 11:17:22 am
content: Hi EEV Blog Community,I am currently a medical student and will be starting my surgery classes in four years. While I deeply love medical studies, a few years ago, I discovered a passion for electronics. I've been learning about ESP32s, MCUs, and various electronic components through youtube videos here and thereThis newfound interest led me to assist my engineering friends with their projects and even sell some ESP-based projects to local businesses, give Arduino and esp courses to first year engineering students . Now, I'm curious if it's possible for someone who isn't in an engineering school to become a professional in the electronics field.Do you know anyone with a similar background who could offer some advice?maybe recommend any courses or resources that provide proper information on electronics (not just hobbiest stuff)?Or maybe your experience on how you balanced two different things while being good (especially in both hard fields)Thank you a lot for your help and for sharing your experience !Edit : for the TLDR community, I will do a summary of the next 3 pages including my decision, if you have a similar situation this thread is very helpfulI've been sending this thread to students in med school who has similar situation to mine , I sent this thread to multiple students and it helped them choose their career pathHere is my conclusion1- being aprofessionalin both EE and medicine is a dream and can only happen in your imagination, however you can be a professional at something and be a hobbiest at another thing , there is nothing wrong or shameful to be a beginner/hobbiest2- being a hobbiest doesn't mean to just stick to Arduinos and adafruit sensors, you can dive deep into the world of EE , you could try FPGAs , RF , pcb designs , stm etc.... , the only difference is that you're not making a living of that and there is no consequences to your design choices , where a professional on the other hand has to account for thousands of things that you don't even know that existed , especially if we are talking about high reliability devices like medical devices,airplanes, safety equipment etc....3- If you decide to go in the medical route and still wants to get good at electronics, make a list about the interesting things that you like and start learning about those , for my case , I'm not interested in power electronics or RF , so I don't learn about those , while a professional must learn those essential things , remember you are doing EE for fun , don't waste your time on not interesting stuff that doesn't generate money nor happiness4- @jpanhault made a fantastic 9 advice comment, make sure to read it (it is in the first page)5- if you are based in the US/UK read jpanhault comments about the specifics of med school there6- as @Rick_law mentioned, you need to consider job market , if you are a professional med/engineer but no job in your country/region you will end up homeless, research the job market in your area before deciding to switch , if you like EE but there is no jobs around you , you'd better stick to med studies, as Rick mentioned, the number of hospitals is always greater than the number of professional electronics companies7- read @NE666 and @tgzzzz comments , they are useful8- if you want to be demotivated, read Smokey's comments on the 3rd page , but he is correct, using Arduinos and adafruit sensors is no where near engineering/professional, don't over estimate your skillsAnd if you are curious about my decision, I decided to stay in med school and "hopefully" go to surgeryThe main reason is the job market , since I live in Syria most engineering professional jobs is lost due to war, there is always the need for professional doctorsAnother factor is that I enjoy EE , but I don't enjoy the stress of the deadline , also I hate math ,being a professional means that you are constantly using your calculator while designingI will stay learning electronics, but now I know what I need to know and what I don't , I don't like RF,AC, power, Audio stuff so I ignore them , I like MCUs so I read a lot about free rtos , i2c , communications , pcb designing etc.....Thanks to all commenters who took time to write these helpful comments, you've helped lots of clueless students make a decision

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2025, 11:26:02 am
content: Here is an example on a project I worked on before :https://github.com/Osmax-Br/time_keeper_esp32I am some what good in software but horrible at hardware

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2025, 11:35:39 am
content: Good for you, but be aware that engineering is as difficult and time consuming as medicine. I think you are likely to find it difficult to learn both simultaneously. I'd concentrate on doing one thing well rather than two things poorly. Have one as a career and the other as a completely different hobby that you can "escape" into.I did know a lovely person that took biophysics (IIRC) as an undergrad, then a masters in electronics, and became a very innovative engineer. It may or may not be of relevance that two of his ancestors had Nobel prizesAs for becoming a professional in the electronics field, be aware of the important differences between technicians and engineers. Neither is better and both are needed - the same is true for nurses and doctors.

author: NE666
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2025, 12:28:31 pm
content: Quote from: tggzzz on January 26, 2025, 11:35:39 amI think surgery as a hobby would be frowned upon. Your need to 'escape' may then be from state incarceration.It's an unfortunate fact that in life, binary choices have to be made sometimes. However, that is not to say that all choices are irreversible when you have youth and time on your side.I left medical school without graduating. I wouldn't describe myself as being academically gifted but I could focus and I worked hard throughout my school and college years. I'd never intended to study medicine or pursue that career path but as my schooling progressed, I found that I was more successful in the biological and chemical sciences, than in maths (and hence 'A' level physics). There's always a tendency to gravitate to where we achieve the greatest successes, and when young, the most recognition and praise. In that way, I was encouraged to apply to medical school and willingly did so.I found medical studies all consuming but initially, I loved them and everything about them. Looking back, I think that was because what I really enjoy is systems, and the ability to diagnose their operation. And that continued right up until the moment I wasn't interested any more, because my head had been turned. That started when I was introduced to some CS students, and I learned of their studies and got to see their labs and their projects. It reignited in me the interest that I had from early childhood in electronics and computers, and the genie wouldn't go back in the bottle again. I dropped out of university, and pursued a technical career, starting in IT support and working my way up 'on the shop floor' to senior management in software development.Now, would I do the same again? I honestly don't know, based on my overall experiences.To answer your question, 'can you become a professional in a field of electronics?', I would still say yes. The fact that you've earned entry to a UK medical school shows that you have the aptitude to commit to a long, hard study path.'Should you?', is entirely another question. For a start, I don't think it will be anything like as easy for you as it was for me to make such as change. The world has changed a lot since I was at medical school (early nineties). The jobs market has changed radically, and I'm not sure what employment prospects will look like for western engineers in the future. In recent years, I've had both roles I've held and the roles of people I've managed outsourced overnight, to cheaper alternatives. I was able to find well paid, rewarding work in computing without a university degree. That's no longer possible. If you want to make the switch, you're going to need a formal education, which means ending your medical studies and re-starting on an engineering path. That of course, has serious financial implications.And then there's job security. If I'd wanted that (or had known how important that can be), and knowing what I know now, I'd have continued in medicine. It's pretty much a guarantee of a continual source of income and, at least in the UK, a decent pension. There's no such guarantee in private industry.If you stay in medicine, there's no reason not to keep electronics as a very intellectually rewarding hobby. It's just that when you're able to give it limited bandwidth, it will take you longer to achieve a level of deep knowledge and competence.Finally, for consideration; given the direction the world seems to be heading in, perhaps learn some programing on the side first, and then decide when you graduate whether you'd rather have a clinical career, or perhaps try to transition into a 'bioinformatics' one.

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2025, 01:18:02 pm
content: Don't continue in medicine unless that is your passion. As for other, perhaps unrelated training, I can recommend it, particularly if your plans are more for academic medicine than simply clinical practice. I was part of small group (8 or so) of pre-med friends in college. We had a variety of declared majors including pre-med per se, EE, biology, and chemistry. The EE and I ended up as roommates in med school. That was in the mid-60's and the landscape of medicine in the US was changing rapidly with the introduction of socialization, e.g., Medicare. It was a research oriented school. So-called "leaves" were not an established thing, except for MD/PHD programs. The Dean was very generous, though. We both dropped out for a period at different times in training to pursue another interest and were able to get re-admitted to finish up. He studied computer science and was one of the founders of teleradiology in the US. I went into chemistry and pathology. About half of the rest of that group went into academic medicine at major American universities and the rest took traditional paths into clinical medicine. Here's my perspective having been through it:1) The most important thing has already been stated. Don't continue in medicine unless that is what you really want to do. Money is not justification.2) Don't skimp on math as an undergraduate. You don't need to go full EE, but at least have calculus and differential equations.3) You will need to become Board certified (or British equivalent) in some specialty. That will add significantly to your time in training, particularly for surgery and its subspecialties.4) Any leave should be during med school, not during or after your specialty training. Generally, you will go from specialty training to your first full-time position. Those positions are easier to find while still a resident. Time off after your residency, except for the military, may raise doubts in the mind of any potential employer/partner.5) Taking time off to seriously pursue something else is not alway possible, but when it is, remember that you will lose step with the rest of your classmates. If the first year of med school is like ours was, bonds formed during anatomy are strong. When you return, you will not have that bonding with any of your classmates. You may feel a little isolated that first year back.6) Marriage can be both an advantage and a hinderance. Consider what profession your spouse might want to pursue.7) Time moves on. I built my first radio at age 9 for RC model airplanes. That was in the early 50's and was pretty primitive. I continued to fiddle with electronics even in grad school, but I didn't devote serious time to it until I was nearing retirement. Electronics changed a lot over that period. I am glad I didn't pursue it early on, but today might be a different story. No one knows how it will be in 20 years. You can always pick it up as a hobby. If in doubt, refer to #1.

author: artag
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2025, 01:34:30 pm
content: Quote from: tggzzz on January 26, 2025, 11:35:39 amIt's true, but also some of the best developments come from mixing disciplines, because we're often too blinkered by having all our knowledge in one field. So a medical student might think of some product that's needed and know enough electronics to see how it could be solved. Art an engineering make a great combination too. If you can't do it all, collaborate with someone who has very different skills.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2025, 02:35:15 pm
content: Quote from: artag on January 26, 2025, 01:34:30 pmAll true, but I don't think it changes my point.

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2025, 02:40:31 pm
content: Thank you for sharing your advice with me , I appreciate itYou are right , job security is nearly guaranteed in medical studies , especially that I am not in the UK or a UK citizenI now believe more that electronics must be a hobby since people don't accept hobbiest surgeons nowadaysThanks for your advice , again

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2025, 02:43:21 pm
content: Quote from: NE666 on January 26, 2025, 12:28:31 pmThank you for sharing your advice with me , I appreciate itYou are right , job security is nearly guaranteed in medical studies , especially that I am not in the UK or a UK citizenI now believe more that electronics must be a hobby since people don't accept hobbiest surgeons nowadaysThanks for your advice , again

author: NE666
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2025, 02:47:30 pm
content: Quote from: artag on January 26, 2025, 01:34:30 pmIf you have a specific venture in mind, I agree. As an individual contributor, being a 'jack of all trades and master of none' with a wide range of deep interests, can be both a blessing and a curse. Whereas, as you say, well-formed multi-disciplinary teams rarely fail to make for a productive and enriching experience.If the OP has a real passion for electronics and wishes to pursue it professionally, I don't see that being possible without making the hard decision to forgo medicine. Both are highly professional careers which, if they are to be fully realised, are each of such demand that there's no possibility to be a true master of both, nor to do both justice.Think carefully about what you really see yourself wanting to do for the next 50+ years of your life, and yes, that does include thinking about remuneration, career prospects, family and eventual retirement. Above all, coming from someone now getting closer to the end of the journey than its beginning, think very carefully about what will actually make you happiest, and what you are happy to let take a backseat - 'if you enjoy what you do, you'll never work a day in your life'.

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2025, 02:55:19 pm
content: Quote from: jpanhalt on January 26, 2025, 01:18:02 pmThanks for the advice , I am in my early 20s and it is always a good idea to hear advice from someone olderI actually do like medicine and was top ranking in the medical entry exam (100k highschool student competes for 4000 seats in the medical schools in the country and out of these 4000 I placed 80th place)So I am taking my med studies seriously, I was thinking of EE as a passion , but I think now that EE must be a "hobby" not something else.I am thinking of enrolling is some courses on Udemy for electronics to just get good at the hobby not to replace medicineAlso I don't live in the UK so the laws are a bit different regarding specialist training (I live in Syria , unexpected I know)I am grateful for your advice , thanks a lot

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2025, 02:57:31 pm
content: Quote from: tggzzz on January 26, 2025, 11:35:39 amyeah I am sure genetics plays a role hereThx for the advice

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2025, 03:15:54 pm
content: Quote from: osmax_br on January 26, 2025, 02:57:31 pmDon't neglect nurture and the environmentIn whatever subject there is a fundamental choice to be made: become a jack of all trades and master of none, or a world expert in a niche. Both are valid choices, both have advantages and disadvantages, but it is a useful way to think about a future path. Personally I chose the jack of all trades route, since I find many things interesting and didn't want to be discarded when my niche vanished.At the end of my first job I realised the key question was "do I want to remain technical or do I want to move into business (sales, marketing, project management)?". That realisation made me seek out a job (mulitidisciplinary contract R&D) where I would try all of those. I chose to remain technical.As others have mentioned, cross-disciplinary projects can be extremely interesting. You are more likely to encounter them in research rather than production, and less likely to encounter them as a technician/nurse.

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2025, 05:05:01 am
content: Quote from: tggzzz on January 26, 2025, 03:15:54 pmYeah you are definitely right , I even asked our professor (head of the research facilities nation wide and genetics researcher in the US before returning to Syria)He told me that there is an engineer who has medical knowledge (medical engineer) who makes MRIs , XRAYs etc..and there is a doctor who has electronics knowledge (which is rare since no one in the medical field has passion for electronics) ,you can assist engineers or point out design failures in medical devices while in use + research advantage , so he recommended actually in favour of having electronics as a hobby or a second passion with prioritizing surgery , he said that you would get an edge over your colleagues by doing thatSo he basically shares the same opinion with youI am thinking of maybe watching a course on Udemy about electronics, it is about 100 hours so I can finish it in one or 2 monthshttps://www.udemy.com/course/crash-course-electronics-and-pcb-design/?srsltid=AfmBOoqQqYJ5FFm37nYGh_e4usrk46oJTJU5JdPoDatrMRw5n5phbBUZ&couponCode=LETSLEARNNOW

author: Smokey
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2025, 05:55:58 am
content: Arduino projects is to Engineering as dissecting a squid in high school biology is to Surgery. There is a reason you spend years in school for either of those things.With that said... find something someone wants to buy and make that thing if you can. Everything doesn't need to be the control panel of a nuclear reactor.but with that said.... manufacturing is non-trivial. I guarantee if I was a surgeon I would not have enough time or energy to manage BOMs and argue with parts distributors and test production boards.

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2025, 06:48:18 am
content: Quote from: Smokey on January 27, 2025, 05:55:58 amYeah you are totally right and I understand that , Arduino is just a beginner thing (even I stopped using it a few years ago in favor of free rtos based esp32)Of course I wouldn't think of electronics as a job or a career instead of surgery or medicine , but I just want to get good at this subject that I'm interested in , not to design F35 avionics systems , maybe assemble some boards , make a few prototypes here and there , use some arm cpus but nothing critical or serious

author: Smokey
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2025, 07:17:48 am
content: Quote from: osmax_br on January 27, 2025, 06:48:18 amthen hell ya. have at it. but remember.. you said no F35 avionics... I'm holding you to that!

author: Terry Bites
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2025, 07:44:58 am
content: See this interview medic with a keen interest in electronics.I was married to a medic and we both felt that it was the same "how does that work or not work" mindset in operation.If you have the problem solving mind then there is no barrier.You will already have enough biophysics know how to understand networks and control theory and that will serve you well.Ultimately all electronics is the analysis of flow. Visualisation skills help with theory and practice.Start with basic analog circuits, amplifiers, oscillators and linear power control. There are many on line courses and books.Get yourself some basic kit. Become familair with major component manufacturers and suppliers.Digital is a doddle.I'm thinking of taking up surgery as a hobby, any tips?

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 27, 2025, 08:22:36 am
content: Quote from: osmax_br on January 26, 2025, 11:17:22 amA mate of mine won a Nobel prize in medicine and is an electronics hobbyist:

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 27, 2025, 08:26:02 am
content: Quote from: osmax_br on January 26, 2025, 11:17:22 amEasy answer, yes.Harder answer is, it can depend on specifics and your country.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2025, 08:45:54 am
content: Quote from: osmax_br on January 27, 2025, 05:05:01 amThat's gratifying, but all I can do is suggest perspectives and questions that are worth answering. It is up to you to choose the best route for you.N.B.answeringa question correctly is relatively easy. It is much more difficult and valuable to work out which questions are important.Hence the first question should usually be "what are the important questions?".Good questions are those which:are simple, but the answer to which illuminates many aspects of the context in which it is asked. Examples... Electronics: where are the clock domains. Software: what does an address/identifier mean and not meanhave answers that highlight whether you should choose this path or that pathA characteristic of some extremely impressive people that I have met is that they reliably ask good questions.Anyway, it is good to see you are thinking, asking around, and not trusting any one response. Too many people seem incapable of that!

author: rstofer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2025, 04:22:50 pm
content: When choosing a career, all else being equal, pick one that requires you to place YOUR hands on the product. Those jobs are harder to outsource. I have read articles where various insurance companies were shipping surgery patients to cheaper markets (than the US) so even medicine isn't immune.According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, the median pay for a physician/surgeon in the US is around $240,000 per year. I suspect there is quite a range around that median but I doubt there are any professionals living in poverty. OTOH, $240k isn't what it used to be if you are trying to live in the Bay Area of California. If you drill down on the BLS page under the State and Area Data tab, you will find cardiologists in California have a median pay of $389,000. That's more reasonable. You can just about afford a decent house with that income.I have also read that math types leading the AI charge get around $300k in the Bay Area but those jobs are easily outsourced. You need to get an equity position with these companies (stock options).https://www.bls.gov/ooh/healthcare/physicians-and-surgeons.htmIn the end, it is better to make more money. Go for medicine and keep electronics as a sideline after you are established in the medical field. To actually get anywhere in electronic engineering, plan to spend a lot of time studying math. It's the same for AI, of course. I hated statistics (still do) and it turns out that AI is all statistics and linear algebra.I have no idea how the salaries would relate to any other country but there is probably a way to find out.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2025, 04:31:00 pm
content: Quote from: rstofer on January 27, 2025, 04:22:50 pmNote also that those jobs are niche; while in demand you will be well rewarded, but when the company decides "AI is a solved problem" <cough, splutter> or not of strategic interest, then the rewards will rapidly evaporate.If going for stock options, beware they can easily bankrupt you; that happened in ~2001. Mechanism is that options vest on day 1 at $X, but they cannot be sold for 6 months. In that six months the shares fall to $X/100. Taxman insists you pay tax on the $X and that is much more than $X/100.

author: rstofer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2025, 06:54:06 pm
content: Quote from: tggzzz on January 27, 2025, 04:31:00 pmOn miine, nothing happened until I exercised the options and that would involve buying the stock at the grant price and owing tax on the gains (exercise price minus grant price). Hopefully the exercise price was much higher than the grant price - said profits were considered ordinary income and tax was due for that fiscal year.The company would make a short term loan to allow me to actually purchase the stocks at the grant price and I would have to repay it as soon as the stock transaction was complete. In effect, I got a check for the gains, let the brokers figure it out.There is usually a lag between the grant date and the earliest exercise date - multiple years. Indeed, the price could go down and at one company it went down by more than 50%. The company renegotiated the grant price so there was some hope of making a bit of money but it would be like starting over. Still, better than nothing.My only interest in AI would be for machine (process) control. I have little interest in Large Language Models but neural networks can be useful. I just picked up an NVIDIA Jetson Orin Nano Developer Kit and, apparently, it can run some of the smaller LLMs - on the order of 8 billion parameters. Just getting it up and running...

author: Wallace Gasiewicz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 28, 2025, 12:09:52 am
content: I really like jpanhalt's comments.I only have 2 years of EE at university. My Bachelor degree is not in Engineering.I also realize that the med school system in England is different than in the US. In US we almost always have a Bachelors Degree before being admitted to med school.I went into Medicine and have Several Board Certifications. I also have a Master's Degree. I am now retired.There are so many things changing in medicine that to treat patient you need to devote so much time to the art that there is really little time for other "scientific" pursuits.I have also known several people here in the states who were successful engineers who subsequently went to medical school. They were OK.Here is my advice: Unless you plan on being a researcher, maybe something in medical electronics, I would keep as much time and energy for your medical studies. I took the Calc and Diffy Q as an undergrad. To understand what is going on in engineering you need some understanding of these things as well as at least College level Physics and Chem. We will leave out stress and strains on deform able bodies. You do not have the option of getting a four year degree and covering all this material, then attending med school.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 28, 2025, 02:18:45 am
content: Medicine is likely to be a safer career than engineering, and likely to be better paying. Both are difficult studies, though in my opinion medicine is harder. More years.But all of that is trumped by your passions. The most difficult things in the world seem easy if you are passionate about them. While the simplest tasks are difficult if you hate every minute performing them. It is also a disservice to those you will be providing services to. It is nearly impossible to be average or better in a field that you have lost your love for.

author: jwet
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 30, 2025, 05:34:50 pm
content: There are a few guys with this combination- Greg Kovacs (Stanford- retired?), Mitra at Stanford, Pauly at Stanford. There is an established field in BioMed etc. at schools Berkeley, Stanford, Illinois, Michigan, MIT and many others.MIT has a program called MEDRC - Medical Electronics Realization Center that is fascinating. They work with companies and med schools to bring far out tech up. We (Maxim) used to fund some work there.

author: Wallace Gasiewicz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 30, 2025, 07:27:21 pm
content: In the US there are more than a few people who have attended med school after matriculating from an Engineering School I have known a few myself. BUT.................... the higher education system in Europe is not the same as here in US.In the United Kingdom students generally begin medical school after secondary education.This contrasts with the US and Canada, where a bachelor's degree is normally required for entry to medical school.You can apply for med school with a bachelor in EE in the US, just as you can with any other bachelor degree. You normally apply in your senior year of undergrad.In Europe and UK you apply for med school admission at the end of Secondary School....normally...... .there are exceptions to both general rules. It is unlikely in UK to have someone with EE degree apply to or get into med school.

author: Rick Law
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 07:53:16 am
content: II would imagine there would be very good opportunity and demand for someone who knows both; both being electronics and medicine.From designing a pace-maker, to diabetic blood measurement, to cancer treatment machines -- all are electronics dedicated to medical use. EKG, blood glucose monitor... are the small ones. Then there are the big ones -- such as radiation treatment machines, CAT scan machines... those are the big electronic device for medical purpose.Someone with say an internist (general practitioner) type focus could come up with all kinds of ideas for personal electronic medical device. Apple Watch, FitBit Watch, fancy themselves as personal "kind-of medical"/"health" devices. I would imagine someone with good medical and electronics can think of devices that is useful and yet be the first of the kind (thus plenty of financial fain opportunities). I can think of "blood detection" with "bag full" alarm for catheter bags -- simple electronics but electronics none-the-less... With an MD sitting around thinking about the other simple but practical ideas, opportunity is endless..Financial opportunity for medical is huge, for example, this yet another "new idea" machine - electronics+medical. The Paxman machine, basically, a micro-controller controlled small refrigeration unit that pumps refrigerants to a cap on the patient's head to keep it a very low but a specific temperature during chemo-therapy and doing so in three phases (pre, during, and post) with preset durations. It helps the patient keep the hair follicles alive so it minimize hair lost. Possibility this was an old idea, but as of (around) 2023, Medicare (USA's retired person government run medical insurance) begin paying for Paxman treatment so it was "new" in that sense. I'm not sure how much the machine is worth, but the patient (with Medicare) will pay around $600 out-of-pocket to use that during a single chemo session (half a day). Just a small mobile refrigerator, with an MCU, and a silly cap, $600 for having it put on (helped by a trained nurse to ensure proper thermo-contact) and wear for merely a few hours...So, my opinion is, by all means pursuit both. I think the opportunity for medical electronics is practically limitless...

author: Picuino
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 01:15:55 pm
content: Currently what is most in vogue is Artificial Intelligence applied to medical data.There are already studies on the identification of pathologies using IoT wristbands/watches.Or early diagnosis of pathologies by studying analytical tests with AI models.It has to do with electronics, but more so with programming and data science.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 02:40:20 pm
content: Quote from: Picuino on January 31, 2025, 01:15:55 pmBy the time the OP is looking for a job, the "AI bubble on unrealistic expectations" will have slowly deflated.Big unsolved problem with modern "AI" is that it can't statewhyit produced the result.Classic example is that predictions of an infection's seriousness were based on the patients'positionand thefonton the scan!https://www.technologyreview.com/2021/07/30/1030329/machine-learning-ai-failed-covid-hospital-diagnosis-pandemic/There are many many other examples, going back 40 years to WISARD, which distinguished cars from tanks based on the weather (sunny=>car, cloudy=>tank).

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 03:01:06 pm
content: "Because patients scanned while lying down were more likely to be seriously ill, the AI learned wrongly to predict serious covid risk from a person’s position."Haven't those designers learned the difference between correlation and cause and effect? My wife taught ^early elem. ed. for many years (50 years ago). She liked the example that children with big feet did better in school. Of course, the cause was not foot size, but that they were older. Some modern day measures of quality medical care are likewise silly.As for training in both, be sure you are better trained and experienced in medicine than in electronics or computer science.Edit: added "early"

author: Picuino
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 03:08:11 pm
content: Precisely because of such problems, it is important to know both medicine and data science.The fact that some errors can be found in the application of AI to medicine does not mean that it does not have potential.It is like saying that autonomous driving has no future because there have been two accidents.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 05:07:58 pm
content: Quote from: jpanhalt on January 31, 2025, 03:01:06 pmIt issolelystatistical correlation; there iszerounderstanding of cause and effect.There is zerodesigninvolved. Unless, I suppose, you think your brain and personality are designed.It isallrote-learning train-by-example. That has the side effect of entrenching existing behaviour, which ought to give even HR-droids pause for thought.

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 06:40:02 pm
content: The last sentence you quoted, "Haven't...," was criticism of the lack of understanding by the researchers. Yes, I realize it was 100% statiscal, just as the example of foot size was, but why publish something like that about a particularly hot topic, unless the results are intended to be useful?

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 07:12:23 pm
content: Quote from: osmax_br on January 26, 2025, 11:17:22 amI read the whole thread, but I didn't really see anyone suggest the possibility of an inter-disciplinary career, for example in medical electronics?Who designs (for example) defibrillators, or heart monitors, or patient monitors in general, or any number of electronic devices used in medicine? You mentioned surgery also. So who designs the robot surgeon tools that are becoming a big thing these days?Do you get the best outcome on these things if an EE specialist simply works together with a Med specialist, and neither is able to speak the other's (technical) language?If it appeals to you, you certainly could consider a career that bridges the interface between medicine and technology.You could, for example, complete your qualifications in medicine and surgery, and then consider doing a specialist Master's program in EE to add some formal electronics training to your qualifications? The truth is that you cannot practice medicine without formal certification, but you can certainly do electronics without such restrictions.

author: PGPG
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 08:08:38 pm
content: Quote from: osmax_br on January 26, 2025, 11:17:22 amI discovered a passion for electronic in 1968 when being 10 I have build myself (without any help from my parents who know nothing about electronics) my first detector radio receiver. From my point of view those time electronic was the most interesting discipline of all. My main impression from electronics studies was "Oh shit, everything I know from practice can be calculated". Then working as academic teacher after 3 years my older colleagues asked me how am I doing it that students from the groups that I teach are always the best in the exams. Then we (with my brother) setup our small electronic company and we have it till today (we manufacture devices we design ourselves).What I want to say to you is that nowadays I would not assume electronic being the most interesting discipline. Genetics (with all its expected possibilities) or astronomy (looking for planets like Earth) seems for me being more interested now - I expect more breakthroughs there than in electronics.

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 08:28:37 pm
content: From Google,QuoteInnovative electronics today may be expensive, but I am not so pessimistic. Electric cars* were invented in the late 1800's. That didn't stop Elon Musk from becoming the richest person in America. Until it's been done, you don't know whether it can be done.*From Google: "The first production electric car was built in 1884 by Thomas Parker, an English inventor."

author: NE666
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 08:35:12 pm
content: Quote from: IanB on January 31, 2025, 07:12:23 pmAmongst others; medical physicists, physiologists and biomedical scientists. These fields generally are the practitioners of "medical electronics", nuclear medicine, imaging etc. And as previously mentioned, multi-disciplinary teams combining these skills with those of experienced clinicians.I suggest these endeavors are rarely, if ever, staffed by those who've invested years (decades) in specialised clinical practice. That's what the OP would really need to decide: whether to undertake basic medical studies and then immediately attempt to diversify their subject area, or whether to fully commit to a clinical path. There's not really the option for both, save perhaps for the very best.

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 08:58:13 pm
content: Quote from: NE666 on January 31, 2025, 08:35:12 pmThe only data I have on that is anecdotal. Based on that, I disagree. First of all, it's usually years, not decades in the US. That is, 4 years of medical school + 4 years of residency + 1 to 2 years of fellowship. That time can be abbreviated. Secondly, a good understanding of the clinical need, a little inspiration, and a lot of work is what's needed. As mentioned earlier, my roommate who was a pioneer in teleradiology exemplifies that. He became competent, saw an opportunity, and developed it. While physicians may not be the greatest brains of multidisciplinary teams, they provide an irreplaceable element -- appreciation and access to patients who need the advancement.One also needs to be aware that in the US today, protective laws enacted by various states (New York is a prime example) may affect what you can do. That comes into play in specialties such as internal medicine (per se) and pathology.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 09:33:48 pm
content: Quote from: NE666 on January 31, 2025, 08:35:12 pmQuite likely a medical specialist will define the basic biology, other people will translate that into a product specification, and other people will implement it.In a research environment the product specialist may be omitted.

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 10:11:49 pm
content: Quote from: tggzzz on January 31, 2025, 09:33:48 pmThat may be true today, but it was not always that way.Many years ago (1950's), the FDA was not so involved. My dad, who practiced about 1/3 obstetrics/gyn, had an idea to facilitate cervical dilation and curettage (D&C), I made the model for him, and he used it. He patented it. Some of his associates also used it without paying royalties. All of that was done before Washington took control. It was never FDA approved. (Are we all criminals?) I don't know whether that device can still be used. My dad's motive in patenting it was not to make money but to prevent others from doing that. The Mayo Clinic had the same policy until about 1990 when it got screwed by a very large national laboratory for the HemoQuant test for stool blood.Medicine has evolved in the US, and probably elsewhere, and that has not been all for the good. I stand by my position, do not go into medicine for the money. If you go into medicine for the right reason, you can do anything, including basic research and electronics.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 10:25:09 pm
content: Quote from: jpanhalt on January 31, 2025, 10:11:49 pmYou appear to have omitted my paragraph which seems to describe some aspects of your experjence, viz "In a research environment the product specialist may be omitted. "Many things can and do happen.I saw the situation I described 40 years ago, and I very much doubt it was specific to that time and place.

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 11:21:16 pm
content: I observe many times that if you get a specialist in domain A, and put them in a room with a specialist in domain B, and ask them to solve a problem or create a solution that overlaps both domains, you will not get such a good result as having a person with good knowledge of both domains.To the A person, everything looks like an A problem. To the B person, everything looks like a B problem. If you need an A + B solution, you need an A + B person included.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 11:45:02 pm
content: Quote from: IanB on January 31, 2025, 11:21:16 pmHopefully person A becomes A+b at the same time as B becomes B+a. That strategy is beneficial in many situations, technical, commercial, political, etc.One classic way of expressing it is "know your custo!er", not in the sense of being friemds, but in the sense of knowing what makes them successful so ha you can help them be successful.The concept can be encouraged by, for example, gettingyouto explaintheirposition and vice versa.In software implementation it is necessary that the lowest levels of abstraction correspond with the hardware, ideally the highest level of abstractions match those in the problem domain (so the domain expert can spot flaws), and there can be several levels in between.

author: Smokey
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 01, 2025, 04:27:54 am
content: Quote from: IanB on January 31, 2025, 07:12:23 pmWell I can tell you who does NOT do all those things.... Doctors who like playing with electronics on the side.All the things you mentioned are made by full time EEs, who probably worked at a company that also employs some trained medical people to help write the specification for the devices. Medical devices require hard core engineering and should not be taken casually (did we really not learn this lession from the COVID-19 open source ventilator debacle?)You want doctors selecting dc-dc converter inductors about as much as you want EEs selecting what IV fluids to give someone.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 01, 2025, 04:20:41 pm
content: Quote from: Smokey on February 01, 2025, 04:27:54 amI agree that equipment attached to humans that has health implications should be done by people who know what they are doing. And for liability protection those people should have proper credentials.Where I disagree with you is that having a degree only proves that one of those boxes is checked, and lack of a degree doesn't prove that neither is checked.There is more than one path to safe and effective medical devices and the approved method does not always achieve this.

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 02, 2025, 07:44:15 pm
content: Well , thank you all for the valuable adviceI am not in the UK so it is a bit different here regarding specializing and carrer path , you study 6 years as a med student , then you do a test , and depending on your score you can choose which major to enter (radiology, Emergency,surgery, diagnostic etc.......)For me I have to study 6 years (currently at 2nd year) and then hopefully get accepted in surgery and have to do 5 more years thereFor the people that suggested making electronic medical device , I think that it is not feasible since these devices require teams of skilful engineers and very presice measurements, there is no room for failure here , you cant compete with big corporations on thatAs I said in the thread above , I don't intend on doing electronics as professional, I want to do it as a hobby, but I do want to be lets say a "professional hobbiest" , I do want to be able to prototype anything that comes to my head , do some repairs , be able to understand electronics, have an electronics lab with oscilloscopes , dmm , power supplies etc (no need for top of the line tektronics or keysight stuff)The difference between a professional and a professional hobbiest is that while both can designs , a professional would consider a lot of more things (economics , ability to mass produce , repairability or non-repairability for apple , and most importantly RELIABILITY) , a hobbiest would only consider functionality , a prototype only needs to work properly regardless of said stuffAfter this long discussion I am more leaning into being a medical professional and a electronics hobbiest (and hopefully a "professional hobbiest" )So the main source of income is surgery (or medicine in general ) , and Electronics would be a side thing that I am good at (but not a professional at)I would like if someone could have a better term for "professional hobbiest"

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 02, 2025, 08:17:58 pm
content: Quote from: osmax_br on February 02, 2025, 07:44:15 pmIf that is how it really is done, it's incredibly stupid. I can't imagine anyone assigning specialties based on some score from a written test, even if there is a practical component.Medicine (per se) is probably the hardest intellectually. In my school, the Chair of Ob/Gyn told us that one had to be in the lowest 10% of the class to qualify. Of course, he was joking, but behind every joke is a little truth. There are plenty of jokes about brain transplant donors. Medicine donors are the cheapest because they may be big, but they are too used up. Surgeon's are small and too hard to find. And pathologist brains are the most valued. They are large and hardly used.

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 02, 2025, 08:59:16 pm
content: Quote from: jpanhalt on February 02, 2025, 08:17:58 pmwell yeah it is somewhat a bad way , but considering the fact that all your last 6 years tests (with practical tests) is actually 60% of this test mark and there is 40% for this testI think that the US has also an entry exam like that (correct me if I am wrong)but yeah sometimes people with lower grades are better but I think it is an exception rather than a general advice , no one wants a surgeon to operate on them who scored lowest 10% in anatomy classes , he might remove a liver instead of a spleen (ACTUALLY HAPPENED BEFORE)

author: Wallace Gasiewicz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 02, 2025, 09:47:18 pm
content: Physician characterization in the US:Internist: Knows a lot but does not do muchSurgeon: Does not know much but does a lotPathologist: Knows a lot and does a lot only a little too late.I do not know where I got the idea that the OP was in UK, but the timeline of education seems similar. It would be hard to get an Engineering Degree and a Medical degree. In the US and Canada it would be a normal path (although one of the hardest, because of the engineering course load) to get an undergrad EE degree and then go to med school. I have known personally two people who have done this. Obviously there are many more.There are a lot of doctors who are Ham Operators and a lot who have electronics as a hobby, it is not the same as being an EE and we know that.

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 02, 2025, 10:17:14 pm
content: One of the admission hurdles in the US is the MCAT (medical college admission test). Once in medical school, a student is free to apply for any speciality, but selection is up to the program. The most popular programs (surgical specialties, including dermatology) are most selective. But, not everyone wants to be a surgeon. In the US, you will see many of the best students apply to non-surgical specialties like medicine or pediatrics.

author: Smokey
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 02, 2025, 11:15:41 pm
content: Quote from: osmax_br on February 02, 2025, 07:44:15 pmUntrue.The difference between a (good) professional and a hobbyist is that the professional, in addition to the required base understanding (IE school stuff), has a career worth of experience and intuition that has been shaped by real world problems and solutions and mentorship by other professionals. They spend the majority of their focused effort on this one thing and have done so for many years. Example. When they say something about power dissipation in a switching transistor, they are not copying Wikipedia, or repeating a YouTube video. They have calculated those number and measures those numbers many times in many different real world applications. They have suffered the consequences of getting it wrong and learned from those consequences.This also mostly applies to a recent engineering student graduate, who may have a job and get paid to be an engineer and is technically a professional, is still mostly a drain on whatever department they are working for until they get enough on the job training and experience to be capable of actually doing design work on their own.Saying a hobbyist and a professional are only different by how many of something they make is something only a person that has never made anything of any real complexity would say.The vast majority of actual designs are out of the realm of possibility for a hobbyist electrical designer. I am not talking about strapping a power supply you bought off Amazon to a Arduino you bought off eBay, and hooking up a sensor you bought off Adafruit while following the step by step instructables. First of all that's not engineering, and it's certainly not design.If you are actually being serious and are this delusional about engineering, I hope to god you are never my surgeon.

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 02, 2025, 11:34:06 pm
content: Quote from: Smokey on February 02, 2025, 11:15:41 pmCould you tell me where I exactly said design is to strap a few sensors from adafruit on a breadboardWhat I meant by a hobbiest is that you don't do complex reliable products and I definitely didnt mean that the difference between hobbiest and professional is based on HOW many , please reread my commentNever have I meant that a pro is like a hobbiest in anywayQuoteAlso you can say that I am wrong without being rude and offensive

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 03, 2025, 12:03:17 am
content: The thing I meant about design, lets say a gps navigation systemA good hobbiest might go to lcsc and get desired gps chip and other chips , design a pcb , do the tests to make sure it functions properly, and then maybe put it in a droneThe professional has a thousand more thing to account for designing gps system for a modern aircraft, literally there is no room for error here , you don't want your F35 going to undesired places because of a simple design error , as you counted before literally thousands of things must be put into considerationWhile both did a gps system , you cant compare them both , yes they are both gps system , but one is a million times betterThe good hobbiest doesnt care much if the gps system gave an error once a thousand times , but it is catastrophic for the F 35 engineerThat is the point I meantAnd by no means I intend on doing F 35 avionics as a hobby (not even a gps system for a drone) , I am not delusional about engineeringThe desire to be a good hobbiest at electronics doesn't mean that you want to be a top notch professional EEand being a good hobbiest doesn't mean that you are a bad surgeonBut I guarantee, if your surgeon told you that he is a professional at surgery and EE ,you should take a deep breath, stand up , and run through the operation room door and dont look back , because he is neither a professional at surgery nor a professional at EEBut saying I am a professional at surgery and a good HOBBIEST in electronics doesn't mean that I am bad at surgeryAnd being a GOOD hobbiest doesn't mean that you have 0 knowledge, or just use adafruit sensors with a breadboard and some instructables and call it a dayA good hobbiest should be able to design some electronics, but surely isn't comparable to the complex design of a real professional

author: armandine2
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 03, 2025, 12:51:29 pm
content: ...perhaps some of the responders suffered from white coat syndrome.

author: Smokey
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 03, 2025, 09:54:29 pm
content: Quote from: armandine2 on February 03, 2025, 12:51:29 pmI see your "white coat syndrome" and raise you a Dunning-Kruger. Your move

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 03, 2025, 10:04:02 pm
content: So, what's your definition of "white-coat syndrome?"Here's the CCF definition:https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/diseases/23989-white-coat-syndrome

author: armandine2
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 04, 2025, 09:01:01 am
content: ...I'm with Karl Popper - re definitions, here.I think if the OP had said he was a science student he would taken less flak - may be a lesson learned.There is an interesting education question here - people are more concerned about how medics might be educated into their profession than they are education students say - I speak, remembering when I mentioned an alternative way of recruiting and training doctors by UK university, my fellow educational studies students were reluctant to favour alternatives to their vague notions of the present system.

author: NE666
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 04, 2025, 10:19:45 am
content: What this thread is currently presenting with appears more symptomatic of an outbreak of 'ass hat' than of 'white coat'.I prescribe a chill pill, to be taken as necessary.

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 04, 2025, 08:02:01 pm
content: Quote from: NE666 on February 04, 2025, 10:19:45 amWell yeah, I agreeBut come on, it’s expected to be attacked and insulted online in a heated argument—that’s why it’s called an "internet argument"However, I do believe this thread changed something in me. I realized that you can’t be a professional in both the medical field and EE, but that doesn’t mean leaving electronics altogether. You just have to know your limitations. You’ll never be able to make complex or commercially viable products or compete with real engineers, and you’ll always have less knowledge than others in the field of electronics. But there’s nothing wrong with that (provided there’s always someone professional willing to answer my stupid questions on the EEVblog forums).I’m thinking of getting *The Art of Electronics* book (or something easier) and restarting my journey in electronics again! (While keeping my main focus on the anatomy textbooks, of courseno need to worry about being close to a white coat)And definitely no need to worry about me swapping my white coat for an oscilloscope anytime soonPS: I’m not a complete beginner in electronics, but I’m more experienced in software than hardware. I did provide my GitHub page, which links to a project of mine (in the second reply on the first page) with the ESP32. I’d be glad if someone could give me their opinion about the code (possible errors, suggestions, etc.).But seriously, A huge thank you to everyone who took the time to read and reply to my thread. Thank you all for your kindness and help , I really appreciate it !

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 04, 2025, 08:28:41 pm
content: When you are young you are encouraged to believe you could be anything you want, and rightly so. As you get older, you unavoidably make choices that close and lock some doors. For me dropping biology at 16 (in favour of maths, chemistry, physics) meant it would be very difficult to become a doctor. I don't regret my choices, but nowadays I would probably choose to go into life sciences, since they are currently at the same stage as electronics and computing were back then.Overall the trick is to allow boring doors to be closed and locked, but to avoid locking doors that might become interesting in the future. It sounds like you are doing thatGlad we have been of some help in allowing you to make your decisions.Have fun, and good luck

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 04, 2025, 08:46:28 pm
content: Quote from: osmax_br on February 04, 2025, 08:02:01 pmGood.AoE2 is an easier read. I have both (AoE3), but started with AoE2. AoE2 has very little on micros or modern stuff, but I found it a good starting point. It might be a little cheaper (used) than AoE3, and refer to something else for micros.

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2025, 07:13:23 pm
content: Quote from: jpanhalt on February 04, 2025, 08:46:28 pmSorry for late reply, Actually I found a very rare translated copy of AoE1 in my grandparents place today , however its translation is horrible"word for word translation just like old google translate" , I think I am better off with the English version+ Fun fact : the book was banned for years since the government figured out that this book and electronic books in general are "dangerous" so they banned them for 20 years ,you cant buy or sell them or even publish your own book about them , probably they were afraid of someone making their own communication system without government censorshipApart from the "fun fact" , I found online that it is not so "beginner friendly" book , it is more oriented for being used as a reference or a text book in universities, it dives into some maths where a "beginner" or "hobbiest" might find hard ?I didn't read the book so I really don't know whether this is true , but the size of the book it doesn't suggest beginner levelSome people suggested "electronics for inverntors" or "make:electronics 3rd ed" as a more "beginner" or "hobbiest" friendly, so I really don't know now what to doSome other people stated that you should read those 2 first then dive into AoE

author: Rick Law
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 12, 2025, 03:41:38 am
content: Probably not what you want to hear, but perhaps you should also consider:Saying "get a job to do things you like doing" is all fine and good, but practicality is important. Unless you are independently wealthy, you need to consider the job market in your accessible area. You need to ensure you can make a living first, only then you can have the luxury to consider the fun/enjoyment factor.My guess is -- The nearest hospital/clinic from you is likely a lot nearer than the nearest electronics design/manufacturer from you. Within a 100 mile circle where you are (or plan to be), my guess again is you are likely to find more hospitals and clinics inside the 100 mile circle than you can find electronic design/manufacture shops in that circle.If my guess is right, you should consider go for Med (MD with a commonly needed specialty) so you know upon completion of education you can sustain your life with adequate resources. Having secure that, you have control of how much fun you want with the remaining resources. You can spend every weekend tinkering with every electronics widgets you can afford, and an MD should be able to afford quite a bit...Question: How good do you think you will be (MD or electronics) in your field, how much do you think they are paying at that level of accomplishment -- check your selected area.Question: How likely are you going to find a job for the skill level you expect to attain in your selected area?Question: How much does it cost to live in the area you selected and at the living standard you envisioned for yourself (and your family to come)...So on, so on.If you are going get an MD or an MS, you are smart enough to work that forward planning. Do the question list appropriate for your personal forward planning. I am confident the path forward will become self-evident as you do your planning.

author: osmax_br
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2025, 12:01:01 am
content: Well I'm returning to this old thread to state that Imade some edits to the original postFor the past couple months , I've sent this thread to multiple medical/engineering students who is unable to decide where to go , but mainly I sent this thread to my medical friends who went to medical school just because "they got a free scholarship" and now they believe that engineering is a better choiceThe contributors on this post helped multiple students leave/stay med school (but mostly they stayed)Since this thread is long and derailed multiple times from the topic , I made an edit to summarize the 3 pages long conversation, also told them to view some comments made by the contributors here (Special thanks to : @tggzzz , @jpanhalt , @NE666 for their support and long conversations)And thanks toeveryonewho commented here ,you helped real people make decisions in real life

author: Smokey
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2025, 01:42:03 am
content: Quote from: osmax_br on January 26, 2025, 11:17:22 amhah. glad I could help?Here is another career path. EE -> Law School = Patent Law. I have a couple friends that did that and they make more money than any of the guys that stuck with EE.

author: RJSV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2025, 05:42:02 am
content: Here is a small fragment of thoughts, when I started conversation with my RETIRING Opthamaligist:Doctor, you might consider, after retirement from the practice, here, perhaps you could do consulting work, on one of the big, Optical Computer innovators.Having the third leg, of. Medicine, Electronics, and PHYSICS, would help to get a good fit, with a very physics active product development cycle, might be successful.That's my own speculation. Excel in physics, and the other fellow Physics students will, literally fight over you, for informal tutoring !The retired, old dude .might, actually, miss out on a lot of social 'savvy', that any 22 year old has Imbedded inside.Just to mention that even a triple set of specialties might give advantage.My Dermatologist has an MBA, and is very s.art and 'clear-eyed' meaning that the Doctor talks and interacts, in natural smarts, making good eye contact, etc.o

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2025, 10:08:03 am
content: Quote from: osmax_br on March 30, 2025, 12:01:01 amYou're welcome.It is a pleasure to help anyone who asks a well-thought out question, then thinks about to the responsesNot everybody does that

author: watchmaker
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 30, 2025, 12:05:05 pm
content: Quote from: Smokey on March 30, 2025, 01:42:03 amThis is precisely what my son in law did. Money was not his object, but he really enjoys the work (has SkyWorks as client) and between him and my Structural Engineer daughter they are very successful.