Software to Create Drawings of Schematics? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / beginners

author: Wil_Bloodworth
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2023, 12:51:16 am
content: Hello!I am manually redrawing a schematic by looking at the actual device (radio) and drawing all of the connections. This tends to get messy on paper quite quickly so I tried to start doing it in Microsoft Visio (because I have it). This is slow, cumbersome, and tedious and I do not have the appropriate symbols for Visio.Below is an example of one I'm working on right now:What software do you recommend for drawing a schematic for visualization purposes only? I have no intention of trying to create PCB board or anything that complicated. I only want to draw the diagrams.Thank you,- Wil

author: Smokey
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2023, 01:24:44 am
content: Ltspice might be a good free option for just schematic capture.

author: bill_c
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2023, 01:58:26 am
content: Have you looked athttps://fritzing.org/You could do an image search to find examples.

author: prosper
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2023, 02:24:00 am
content: eeschema from kicad

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2023, 02:46:45 am
content: Draw.io is free and has electrical/electronic symbols you can use to draw schematic, its pretty similar to visio though. Other than it's free.Draw.io has symbols for some basic vacuum tube types, 7 or so. diode, triode, pentode etc..

author: TRa757
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2023, 03:37:48 pm
content: I have been using Eagle for several years and although I have a beef with several things with it, I won't be able to use it past 2026. Autodesk "recommends" using Fusion360. They have the free version that streams, so if you don't have a big pipe to the internet, you might be in trouble. So with Eagle approaching EOL, it's time to find and learn another app. My old brain isn't what it used to be, but if there is something out there that is logical and not some add-on to a 3D CAD hack and is logical in its operation, I think I can deal with putting in the time to learn it.I get it, everyone uses something, bit is there one that is more better than others? Lots of parts, not so hard to learn, quality files, etc.

author: Wil_Bloodworth
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2023, 04:02:37 pm
content: Thanks for all the suggestions! Draw.io looks like a winner (for me for my situation). I've been using Fusion360 for many many years and don't know why anyone would "draw" with it. I do use it for 3D modeling of parts though.- Wil

author: Terry Bites
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2023, 06:12:27 pm
content: Visio is truly byzantine. I usually end up self harming after about ten minutes of it.LT spice is the worst capture I've ever tried.The simplest and most effcient capture I've tried is MC12 microcap, its not CAD but its a cool simulator. (https://web.archive.org/web/20200218212700/http://spectrum-soft.com/download/download.shtm)There are loads of demo versions of professional CAD packages. Kickad seems to be very popular and its free.

author: Veteran68
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2023, 06:22:56 pm
content: Sure, at the end of the day, a schematic is just a drawing. But general drawing tools and schematic capture tools are very different things. If you just want a drawing of a circuit to document for posterity or reference, then you can use anything. But if you have any intention of, say, laying out and producing PCBs from your schematics, or simulating circuits, then go ahead and learn a proper electronics circuit design tool. I suggest KiCAD. It has matured a great deal and is a solid tool now. Or EasyEDA, which has a free online version that's pretty easy to learn and use.

author: 3roomlab
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2023, 07:19:11 pm
content: its got to be Kicad i guesshttps://forum.kicad.info/t/valve-tube-preamp-kicad-v6-schematic/41782

author: Wil_Bloodworth
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2023, 08:12:27 pm
content: Nice!

author: rstofer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2023, 10:21:48 pm
content: I use the editor that comes with ExpressPCB although an earlier version:https://www.expresspcb.com/

author: Ground_Loop
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2023, 11:28:57 pm
content: Quote from: Terry Bites on November 05, 2023, 06:12:27 pmI think the target users are graphic artists, definitely not engineers. And I have a similar disdain for the product. Our sales team uses Visio to produce project phasing diagrams that later get turned over to the engineering team to update as the project progresses. I gave my latest one back to the sales team to keep updated. Asking engineers to maintain a Visio diagram borders on punitive.

author: abeyer
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2023, 01:44:46 am
content: Quote from: Ground_Loop on November 05, 2023, 11:28:57 pmI'd disagree with that. I think most pure graphic artists are unlikely to use its features that actually make it stand out and would be more familiar with other tools anyway, while engineers absolutely should care sometimes about visual presentation and not dismiss something because it offers that.Visio is certainly idiosyncratic in how it does some things, and like any tool needs some time to learn and use well... but I find it's quite powerful for building data or computation driven diagrams when you come at it from the right perspective. You shouldn't treat it as a general drawing tool (though it does that), nor as a powerful special purpose tool like schematic capture (though it could be used to build a kinda janky not great version of one.) Rather think of it as a lightweight 2d parametric cad engine, but one that starts from the perspective of illustration and excel, rather than from blueprints and drafting.

author: abeyer
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2023, 01:58:23 am
content: Quote from: Wil_Bloodworth on November 05, 2023, 12:51:16 amSo I'm still left a little unclear what you want from the final result, an actual schematic, or more of a pictorial diagram of the wiring of a device.Quote from: Wil_Bloodworth on November 05, 2023, 12:51:16 amNot necessarily advocating this as the best route... but they're notthatdifficult to build if you need something custom. And there are most of the usual suspects as far as electrical/electronics/circuit/logic symbols in the engineering package of standard ones.

author: Wil_Bloodworth
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2023, 02:01:00 am
content: Just a drawing of the wiring. That’s it.- Wil

author: abeyer
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2023, 02:08:49 am
content: Quote from: Wil_Bloodworth on November 06, 2023, 02:01:00 amIn that case, I'm not sure of agreatoption. But you might want to look at fritzing as mentioned above, if you haven't. It tends to aim more at the arduino & breadboard crowd than the tube & point-to-point... but it's the closest in terms of functionality of a specialized tool that I know of to what it sounds like you want. I'm not sure how much work it would be to adapt, but seems like it could be an interesting base.

author: SmallCog
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2023, 03:22:56 am
content: I use Visio.As well as the built-in symbols there are countless available on the net, just search for whatever you're after + visio and it'll often come up - I've built quite the collection.It's not necessarily best practice but I'm also known to simply grab an image of something like a proprietary connector or module (or better yet a screenshot of a cad diagram) and then just add anchor points to it, particularly if I'm doing a wiring diagram rather than a circuit diagram.I'm not saying visio is the best option, there are undoubtedly better options out there, but it's what we use at work. View the above as a tip on how to work with it rather than a glowing endorsement.

author: EPAIII
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2023, 11:13:52 am
content: Any 2D CAD program can be used to draw a schematic. You can either find a library of electronic symbols for use in the program of your choice or create your own as most 2D CAD programs allow you to create parts libraries. I have used several 2D CAD programs in the past.That being said, KiCAD is a free program that is specifically designed for drawing schematics as well as creating PC boards. There are extensive, existing libraries of electronic components and it is fairly easy to create new ones to add to those libraries or to create a personal library with both existing and newly created components in it. I strongly suggest that you give it a try.Did I mention that it is free?

author: liaifat85
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2023, 11:18:28 am
content: There is 'Export as BITMAP' option in some software like proteus.

author: enz
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2023, 11:32:31 am
content: Maybehttps://bancika.github.io/diy-layout-creator/could be interesting for your needs.The name "layout" is more targeted towards laying out wires and perfboards than to laying out a PCB.

author: TRa757
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2023, 03:25:07 pm
content: I used to use Visio for anything and everything, from house layouts to schematics, but the more complex the drawing the more it slows down. I've had to wait 30+ seconds for the screen to get redrawn and that's on a 48 core server with 96 threads and 512GB of ram. I am pretty much done with Visio.Fritzing is a good way to get your feet wet, but there are some frustrating things that make it frustrating to use. I got KiCAD and have been watching the videos on how it works and I am very impressed with it and the guy that did it. Once I have a few projects in the books, I think it will be second nature on building projects. The learning curve is steeper than Fritzing for sure, but I prefer to wire up proto's from the schematic and not some colorful physical representation.

author: Wil_Bloodworth
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2023, 04:38:49 pm
content: KiCad looks nice but seems to be considerably, "overkill" for just drawing connections. I'm never going to design a PCB or anything anywhere close to that.My only goal is to document (for myself only) how something is wired up so I don't screw it up when putting it back together... that's it, that's all, nothing more. To me, the $1,000,000 pen that will work in space versus the $0.05 pencil analogy is 100% appropriate here. So, it seems like the pen/paper/Visio route is probably the simplest/fastest option for now.Thanks for all of the suggestions!- Wil

author: abeyer
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2023, 10:27:48 pm
content: Also maybe consider a sketching app on a tablet if you want lo-fi? That would at least give you the option to edit things a bit neater and/or convert them to some more structured format later if you decide you want to.

author: EPAIII
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2023, 10:13:38 am
content: Fritzing is a terrible way to start. It will teach you to draw in a manner that your circuits will be more difficult to understand than if you just place the parts at random on the page and connect them with lines at every odd angle.Avoid Fritzing at all costs.Quote from: TRa757 on November 06, 2023, 03:25:07 pm

author: LinuxHata
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2023, 07:10:22 pm
content: Fusion, Kcad and Eagle all require long learning curve.I found out that Splan7 is the simplest to use (it is not free, but trial is free and price is modest)And it has huge library of almost all components, including the tubes.

author: abeyer
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2023, 09:28:38 pm
content: Quote from: EPAIII on November 07, 2023, 10:13:38 amI mean if you want a schematic, yeah, it's not the right tool. But if the explicit goal is a wiring diagram style output, then it seems better or at least no worse than many of the other options from what I've seen. (The diy-layout-creator linked above seems like a valid contender too, though I just learned of that one, so haven't tried it yet.) Is there something better you would recommend for that use?

author: Sredni
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2023, 11:50:59 pm
content: I second the motion in favour of DIY Layout Creator. It's simple, has an almost nonexistent learning curve, and gets the work done. Not exactly a professional product, but more than adequate for hobbyist use.https://youtu.be/OSwkM7YzeDQ?si=K1Y5N2W_Py44vnnZI only wish it was more customizable, but for the price I paid, I cannot complain too much.

author: Wil_Bloodworth
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 08, 2023, 01:34:46 am
content: Oooh! I like this option!- Wil

author: alligatorblues
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 08, 2023, 06:51:39 am
content: This one is pretty good. 500,000 parts library, intuitive, easy. PCB Artisthttps://www.4pcb.com/free-pcb-layout-software/

author: slugrustle
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 23, 2023, 05:34:22 pm
content: With the caveat that the wiring diagram the OP has drawn is not quite a schematic, and I'm talking about schematics...I have usedInkscapewith the symbols inthis SVG file(and slight modifications / combinations thereof) to draw schematics. It's a little tedious due to all the guide lines it takes to draw the wires. And Inkscape apparently doesn't let you change the default line width, or didn't when I was using it. That said, I have achieved some nice looking results with Inkscape.Thank you, LinuxHata, for mentioning Splan7 (now up to 8 and sold atABACOM). I should try that out. It's nice because it's a real piece of software that can run on my local computer and not some online thing that could make all of my prior work inaccessible or unmodifiable by going out of business. Perhaps even more importantly, it appears to be made for drawing schematics!I also draw schematics with a drafting table, parallel bar, triangles, drafting vellum, and technical pens. Vellum + technical pens is important because the resulting lines scan in very cleanly compared to drawings with ballpoint pens or mechanical pencils on regular printer paper. I use aLeroy lettering setfor any text. I'm working on machining custom Leroy templates for circuit symbols (they used to make these, but they're hard to find). So far I got a reasonable result with a resistor symbol on a delrin blank, but I need to improve the software I wrote to do the geometric transformations from SVG primitives to the cut paths on the stencil to make the workflow more efficient. Am also having trouble with warping in 1/8" thick Delrin stock but am looking into alternatives. Presently, I freehand most circuit symbols and they're not the cleanest, but machining new templates is a learning curve for me.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 23, 2023, 07:01:18 pm
content: Everybody will find their own favorite methods. I fled manual drafting with templates as soon as ECAD tools became available, and would choose Visio or Inkscape over manual drafting. My personal recommendation for a hobbyist is KiCad.For those who really prefer the manual approach I am attaching a couple of my surviving templates. They may be of use in creating your own. One workflow for doing this would be to import these images to GIMP or other image manipulation program and enhance the contrast, then import the result into Inkscape and use its image trace to contours feature to convert it to a vector drawing which can then drive a laser cutter.

author: calzap
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 23, 2023, 07:42:53 pm
content: I use Visio. I like it because I can use it for a variety of project types, not just electronics. There are huge libraries available for objects for all sorts of projects. Yep, there is a learning curve but once learned, it’s a versatile tool. Help is readily available via the internet. If you use PowerPoint, you’re part way there. I’ve never had problems with its speed, but I use it on a fast HP workstation. One caveat is that although Visio is considered by Microsoft to be part of the extended Office family, it’s not really compatible with other members like PowerPoint, Excel or Word. If you copy a vector object from PowerPoint to Visio, it will come in as a bitmap. This incompatibility is because Visio was developed by another company that Microsoft bought. Microsoft hasn’t considered it worthwhile to change the basic Visio code to make it compatible.I don’t do enough electronics to spend time learning a specialized electronics drawing program … I do schematics, wiring and layouts, never PCBs. I started to learn a couple of CAD programs but found they offered more than I needed with correspondingly complex learning curves. Visio fit the bill as being more versatile than PowerPoint, especially the ability to do layers and create object libraries, but not as complex as CAD programs.Mike

author: slugrustle
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 24, 2023, 07:59:46 pm
content: CatalinaWOW, thanks for posting those. I tried such templates, but I draw in ink with technical pens directly, and none of those templates had inking edges.If you haven't used alettering setlike Leroy or similar, they're incredibly versatile in ability to position / align / space the symbols. Perhaps even more important, they allow for symbols and letters that are not possible to create directly in one pass with stencils. I have machined ordinary stencils with inking edges for stuff like squares, rectangles, circles, mains outlets, etc. but for little things like circuit symbols, I'm betting the lettering set method will be a bit easier to use.Also, I got a subscription to the IEC 60617 and a copy of IEEE Std 315-1975 and am trying to make the symbols as standard compliant as feasible. Some of the circuit symbols in Visio are just bad...

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 25, 2023, 12:48:03 am
content: Quote from: slugrustle on December 24, 2023, 07:59:46 pmThe logic one has beveled edges and works well for inking when the appropriate face is down. The other one is not set up for inking, but cutting a second one with wider line widths and bonding them together would do the job.I let all of my LeCroy pens and most of the related drafting paraphernalia disappear when I fled manual drafting so ink edges no longer matter to me. I have kept a set of trammel points which are convenient for layout in the shop and the set of inking tools my dad used in college, but haven't actually done any inking for almost 50 years.My real intent for posting is just to save the folks the minor effort of thinking through how to decompose the symbols into pieces that can be templated. I don't know what your machining process is so can't suggest how best to go from there. I have a laser cutter so that approach is very convenient for me.I agree that inked drawings by a talented draftsman are beautiful and reproduce quite well. But find that appropriately generated printed drawings do well also. It does require attention to line widths and spacing, selection of appropriate fonts and sizes and other care. In the industry I retired from our drawings were contractually required to meet legibility standards after three generations of copying, and when the first generation is done right the printed versions met this standard easily.