Is there a math/equation GUI program like this ? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: MathWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2023, 07:12:08 pm
content: When you are lying down and using a notebook/pencil is not easy, I could draw eqn's in a paint program, but I'm not good at that, especially lying down with a mouse on my chest.So I was wondering is there some program, meant for people writing eqn's , to put as a picture in a presentation, or on a form. So in the program, there would be toolbars, and instead of placing circles, or resistors, you choose some math symbol or number/letter, and place it on the work space.And I don't care if the program actually does math, I just want something else besides trying to draw eqn's in paint, when lying down. Maybe it would be really slow and not worth it. But I would put a circuit together in a sim, rather than draw it on paper or in paint, so I'd try a symbolic math editor/notepad

author: Hawaka
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2023, 07:50:39 pm
content: I found that Microsoft Word does a decent job at displaying equation and such. Also once you get use to it it's pretty quick. Never tested the LibreOffice Writer version.The most professionnal looking and most complete package will probably come from LaTeX. But the learning curve is probably steeper.

author: TimFox
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2023, 07:51:24 pm
content: Have you tried the equation editor built into Microsoft Word?

author: Infraviolet
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2023, 08:01:33 pm
content: LaTex has a much nicer way to generate equations than any of the M$ office products do, far more logical to define them according to LaTex's language than with lots of fiddly clicking in M$ office.Google docs apparently has good support for multiple ways of defining equations too.

author: Benta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2023, 08:09:56 pm
content: Forget the MS stuff.Either LaTex or LibreOffice Math.

author: rcjoy
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2023, 08:11:37 pm
content: If you use a Mac, the included Pages word processing app supports LaTeX for equations. Works really well!

author: dave j
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2023, 08:21:10 pm
content: TheLyX editoris basically a user friendly front end to LaTeX and has both a good equation editor and can export to lots of output formats. You can also type equations in using LaTex commands if you end up finding that easier.

author: ledtester
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2023, 08:25:19 pm
content: There are online Markdown editors which support LaTex math notation, e.g.:-https://stackedit.io/app#-https://upmath.me/Also there are online LaTeX editors:-https://www.overleaf.com/-https://www.tutorialspoint.com/online_latex_editor.phpand a math-only online LaTeX formatters like:-https://www.hostmath.com/-https://latex.codecogs.com/eqneditor/editor.php

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2023, 08:29:49 pm
content: This:https://www.codecogs.com/latex/eqneditor.phpLet's you click on the form/operator you want, then add between curly brackets (braces).I find it a little easier than trying to remember all the operators.

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2023, 08:36:33 pm
content: Second the LaTex option.

author: Benta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2023, 08:42:03 pm
content: LibreOffice Math example. Is that the kind of thing you're looking for?

author: MrMobodies
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2023, 09:39:36 pm
content: I came across this very old program called Derive at I once used over 20 years ago for equations and drawings and I think it could have been Derive 5.Derive 6:A few years ago I was looking for a new version of it and found Derive 6.1. I looked at the trial and couldn't find it selling or even older copies even on ebay, I found a newer version somewhere but the url broke:Still there and broke:https://www.chartwellyorke.com/derive.htmlBuy -> 404 not found.Just emailed them now to find out if they still sell the keys for the trial version.Apparently from 2007 they abandoned it:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Derive_(computer_algebra_system)Derive 6.1 Trial:https://filehippo.com/download_derive/I came across this this discussion about it:https://www.hpmuseum.org/forum/thread-18478.htmlLeading to this abandonware website with the program and key for it.I don't know if that work I never tried it.https://vetusware.com/download/Derive6.1 Math Software 6.1/?id=11729I don't know where it falls in copyright with the program being abandoned and keys posted but it would be nice to be able to buy it legally or even a used copy to avoid any complications.

author: Benta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2023, 09:55:28 pm
content: Ne reason to search for Derive, it's dead.The modern equivalent is GNU Octave, free and open-source.But I don't think that's what the OP is looking for.

author: Nominal Animal
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2023, 11:45:01 pm
content: I often use Maxima for solving equations and systems of equations.Its GUI version,wxMaxima(available for all OSes, free and open source) might be useful for you: when you type an expression or equation, wxMaxima renders it on screen, and you can copy the rendered expression in MathML, LaTeX, Octave/Matlab format, SVG, image, and even RTF: just select what you want to copy, and right-click, then select the type you want to copy it as.There's lots ofdocumentation for maxima/wxMaxima, but I recommend doing a web search for "maxima cheat sheet", and either print or bookmark the one(s) most useful to you.For "cheat sheets" and math tutorial notes I've done for others, I've used LibreOffice Writer and Math. In LibreOffice Writer, if you type "fn" and press F3, it automatically inserts a standard-form auto-numbered equation for you, which you can edit (in sub-Math editor) by double-clicking. I really should use LaTeX instead, but this way others can edit the notes further without having to learn LaTeX (yet).

author: Benta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 13, 2023, 12:05:38 am
content: @Nominal Animal, that sounds really cool!I'll try it out as soon as I can.

author: MathWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 13, 2023, 03:13:27 am
content: Ok thanks I'll try a few links. I have Octave, but as far as I know, that needs a lot of typing.Yeah I never thought about an online eqn editor, something just lazy point and click on symbols is all I'm thinking of.For decades I've thought about hanging a board from the ceiling, or an arm from a wall, to put a book on when lying back in bed. But it would have to be pretty solid for writing on. I guess that's the stuff of dreams.

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 13, 2023, 03:20:16 am
content: If you're looking to just *type* equations for "publishing" purposes, neither Octave nor Maxima will be of much useful help. They are great tools though if you want to compute stuff. Two different things entirely, and you clearly stated that you weren't interested in doing the maths. So forget about Octave or Maxima here. Or if the suggestion was so that you would uh, copy the bitmaps by taking screenshots in those? Yuck.Use one of the options we've been suggesting - directly LaTeX, or LibreOffice, or any tools that can take LaTeX math but is not as intimidating as the full LaTeX environment, there are online tools out there, or you could also usepandoc, which is great for converting markdown (in which you can insert LaTex math) to PDF, or HTML, or a ton of other formats.

author: Infraviolet
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 14, 2023, 03:06:34 am
content: Noting the mentions of Derive and Octave, If you're doing graphing and calculations then R and R-Studio can be helpful, but these are programming languages for working with equations, not for displaying the equation itself in a comfortably readable format.

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 14, 2023, 04:01:35 am
content: Quote from: MathWizard on January 12, 2023, 07:12:08 pmHave you looked at the MS Office equation editor? You can create almost all equations from the keyboard about as quick as you can type. It automatically reformats your text as equations, building up as you go.So, for example, you type "\sqrt(x^2+y^2) " and you see \$\sqrt{x^2+y^2}\$For another example, if you type this: "\sum_1^n\of x^2 =n(n+1)(2n+1)/6 ", it will automatically be rendered like this:$$\sum_1^n{x^2}=\frac{x(x+1)(2n+1)}{6}$$If you can't remember the keyboard codes for certain things, you can also use the mouse to select them from the ribbon, but most are intuitive, for example "\theta" will give you \$\theta\$You can also enter LaTeX directly if you prefer that entry method, but it doesn't build up as you go along the same way as the native Unicode markup does.

author: RJSV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 15, 2023, 10:09:00 pm
content: One relative of mine, (disabled), used a microphone stand, having that heavy stand base, plus it had a horizontal 'boom' going out, over his legs in the bed.But I would have thought, there might be a 'Sharper Image' type of catalog, offering a wide range of aiding devices (??).

author: RJSV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 15, 2023, 10:10:59 pm
content: (Continued)The mike stand was used to hold a book, for arms free reading in bed, but could be a laptop, small DVD player, etc.

author: alm
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 16, 2023, 12:13:59 pm
content: I prefer LaTeX and frontends like LyX, because I feel they integrate much better in a larger document than Word where you have to keep opening the equation editor modal for every small inline equation that you want to change and last time I looked had more advanced features like equation numbering or units, but if you want a more advanced version of the Word Equation Editor, thenMathTypemight be worth a look. It wouldn't surprise me if earlier versions of the Word Equation Editor were licensed versions of MathType.

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 16, 2023, 06:29:01 pm
content: Quote from: alm on January 16, 2023, 12:13:59 pmIn the current version of Word equations are inline with the text as an integrated feature and contained in special "math markup regions". As soon as you move the cursor into a math region you are in equation editing mode. There is no modal editor to open. You can begin a math markup region with the Alt-= key.Equation numbering is also included, and is easily achieved by putting "#(number)" after the equation. You can replace "number" with a sequence field if you want automatic numbering.

author: mathsquid
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 16, 2023, 07:52:29 pm
content: I use LaTeX almost exclusively for rendering math.The exception occurs when I'm making a drawing and I need to label it with rendered math. Notability is great for this. It has a feature where it can recognize handwritten math and convert it to what looks like rendered latex, and then you can drag it around and place it where you want it.Here's a video I found of someone using it:

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 16, 2023, 08:18:33 pm
content: The same feature is available in Office as "Ink to Math". The neat thing about the Office feature is it renders in real time as you go along, so if anything doesn't look right you can immediately undo and correct it.I haven't tried it before now, but it's really cool how it picks up all the Greek letters, mathematical symbols and layout as you enter your equation.

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 16, 2023, 08:24:24 pm
content: Quote from: MathWizard on January 12, 2023, 07:12:08 pmI just noticed, as per my post above, that the "Ink to Math" feature in MS Office (e.g. Word, or PowerPoint) lets you write equations with a pen on a touchscreen, and it converts them to properly formatted equations as you go. This seems to be the kind of thing you are looking for?It obviously works also with a mouse, but it is very painful trying to write or draw with a mouse cursor. A pen and touchscreen is much easier.

author: alm
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 16, 2023, 10:05:58 pm
content: Is Word usable for complex technical documents these days? Let's say a hundred pages, dozens of large figures, tables across multiple pages, equations, cross references everywhere and all that jazz? My experiences in the 2003 days were that Word would completely choke, references would break at random, scrolling would be at glacial speed, and the only way around it would be to give up on automated cross references and split the document in pieces.

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 16, 2023, 11:43:18 pm
content: Quote from: alm on January 16, 2023, 10:05:58 pmI certainly use Word for technical documents with figures, tables and equations. Is it better for large documents than it used to be? I couldn't say, since large documents have always been Word's Achilles' heel. I don't hit too many bugs with the Office 365 version, but I do hit some, especially with the drawing tools. Most of the time if something misbehaves I can undo the change with Ctrl-Z and try it a different way, or close and reopen. What bugs I come across are mostly with mishandling of user inputs rather than corrupting the document. It's been a while since I have seen a corrupted docx file.One thing I have learned is to work with the low level LaTex-like features of Word, such as proper use of paragraph styles, field codes and so on. Many of the "ease of use" features such as ad-hoc formatting controls tend to create a mess behind the scenes. For figures, one should always insert a drawing canvas, and never put graphical shapes directly on the page. The new equation editor has been improved in recent versions and now accepts a subset of LaTex equation macros.I can't tell you it is bulletproof, but it does satisfy my working requirements for very technical engineering documents.

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2023, 03:25:07 am
content: Quote from: alm on January 16, 2023, 10:05:58 pmProbably, but I personally use LaTeX for that kind of documents. This invariably leads to less frustration and much better looking documents.

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2023, 03:31:13 am
content: Quote from: SiliconWizard on January 17, 2023, 03:25:07 amOn the other hand, such documents generally end up looking like "LaTeX", which gets boring after a while. Few people bother to change the default font and style options.

author: berke
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2023, 11:33:09 am
content: Quote from: SiliconWizard on January 17, 2023, 03:25:07 amFor writing equations in Word you need to run Windows though. The on-line version does not support equations. The few times where a client insisted on a document being written in Word I usually Pandoc'd it from a sane format to Word then told them to figure out the formatting.You can always tell when a technical document has been written using Word by the awkward look of the math.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 18, 2023, 06:42:16 pm
content: Quote from: alm on January 16, 2023, 12:13:59 pmhttps://www.adeptscience.co.uk/products/mathsim/mathtype/mathtype-windows-vs-equation-editor.htmlsays:Quote

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 18, 2023, 06:54:25 pm
content: Quote from: berke on January 17, 2023, 11:33:09 amOr Mac (or, with some entry limitations, iOS).

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 18, 2023, 06:59:26 pm
content: Quote from: alm on January 16, 2023, 10:05:58 pmIMHO it’s gotten a lot better.FYI, it’s actually possible to break up a document into smaller pieces and have references work: use subdocuments (an obscure Word feature).

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 18, 2023, 08:39:05 pm
content: Quote from: tooki on January 18, 2023, 06:42:16 pmEarlier versions, yes, evidently.QuoteThis is a bit misleading, since Word does not use Equation Editor anymore, and has not done so for over a decade. The current equation feature in Word is a replacement that uses inline equation markup using Unicode characters, somewhat similar to LaTex.The current equation markup feature in Word is described here:https://unicode.org/notes/tn28/UTN28-PlainTextMath-v3.pdf

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 18, 2023, 08:44:35 pm
content: Quote from: tooki on January 18, 2023, 06:54:25 pmOr possibly with fewer limitations, with the latest version of iPadOS. I have been trying to find out how full featured is Microsoft 365 for iPad. It does rather seem like the full program.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 19, 2023, 09:40:11 am
content: I only looked at it quickly, but I couldn’t find any of the gallery menus of equation elements like on the desktop version. Maybe it’s there and I didn’t see it?

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 19, 2023, 09:40:49 am
content: Quote from: IanB on January 18, 2023, 08:39:05 pmIs the old one still there for compatibility with old documents?

author: pardo-bsso
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 19, 2023, 01:23:26 pm
content: I also suggest trying Mathics (https://mathics.org/) and GeoGebra (https://www.geogebra.org/)

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 19, 2023, 05:49:48 pm
content: Quote from: tooki on January 19, 2023, 09:40:49 amApparently not for creating new equations. It seems Microsoft removed the old equation editor from Office 2007 onwards. See here:https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/office/editing-equations-created-using-microsoft-equation-editor-08a44b8c-ae15-41a7-bc15-7239890c0cecWhat happens instead is that if you try to edit old equations they will be automatically converted to the new format.If you simply open the document without trying to edit the equations then the equations retain their original display formatting so you can continue to read the document as it was.