EEVblog 1675 - Ninja Blender REPAIR because WHY? (Right To Repair) - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 18, 2025, 08:38:32 pm
content: Our Ninja blender blade failed. For a warranty replacement they wanted us to DESTROY and DISPOSE OF the old perfectly working base unit before sending a new one. Let's see about that...The first ever EEVBlog video with zero commentary.

author: golden_labels
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 19, 2025, 08:03:14 am
content: Dave, please share the recipe for whatever you’re drinking. Looks yummy!edit:jump to the answer⁂Before the crowd shouting “planned obsolescence” appears, I’m going to preemptively make a comment.First, useHanlor’z razor. If Hanlor’s razor is too dull, move to understanding the situation in terms of a systemic issue. Humans have weird tendency to explain reality by putting blame and attributing negative traits.(1)Perhaps it’s easier, maybe it’s more comfortable, possibly evolution promoted that as using less energy — I’m not the one to explain this. But it makes humans blind to the actual problems. On top of that people notoriously fail to realize their perspective is not the only valid one.Put yourself in the position of the company. You offer a warranty. Under the assumption, that you don’t accept being cheated: how do you protect yourself from scammers? You may demand returning the device. This is how it’s often done, and allows the company to reject the claim. It’s also adds costs for the company(2)and requires additional effort and time from the customer. You know, what’s the cheaper and nicer way? Just sending a new unit, but requiring the customer to prove the old item is actually turned into waste.(3)See, it’s that simple. Basically, they’re just nice to the customer.From my perspective, and I believe many people here share it, they could be nicer by just sending the blades. But here come the systemic issues!By authorizing repairs carried out by users or in any way helping with them, the company puts themselves on the line. A multitude of risks: legal, financial, and to the brand image. We may like it or not, but this is the world humans created. The shape has been molded by the society, and the company fits into it.I’m not in position to demand of anybody to be a hero. Neither can I blame one for not taking a risk. But that may be irrelevant too, as there may be no choice in the first place. Even if we assume total honesty, managers and board of directors is often legally required to run the company in a way, that works best for its owners. Or face criminal charges. There is no definition of “best” and, contrary to what some claim, it’s not defined as “profitable.” But in practice almost universally this is the effective meaning. Our society simply made it hard to be nice. And set up system, where jerks naturally bubble up.The next problem is company’s format. It’s nice to imagine things as they were until 20th century. A small workshop or at worst a major factory run by people on site. This is no longer true. You’d be lucky the company handling this warranty is the same, which originally introduced the blender. In either case, it’s a highly (over?)optimized set of pipelines with a cloud of delegations. There is literally no space for decisions about sending blades. There is nobody to take make that decision. There likely is no blades too. The one carrying out communication is probably just some poor person in a cubicle, in a room handling 1000 different companies, just replaying the script they’re given. Should I repeat the mantra? You know, who decided to spend $1 less in a store, eliminating the better company from the market?Finally, all this costs money. The market got ultra-optimized to fit what the majority pays for. And neither we are the majority, nor the majority holds our values. Personally I do believe those values are worth paying for. But how many buyers are willing to pay for our whims? I’m not questioning the idea here. This is a literal question: who is going to pay for it? How are you going to make them pay for it?(1)With the usual second step: interpreting any disagreement as “defending” or “taking sides.”(2)Though it may be balanced out by deterring scammers or increasing claims rejection rate.(3)Don’t delude yourself: to majority of the population a device with a cut off cable is completely broken and useless. At least in the north-west culture. In 21st century we are rare exceptions.

author: bitwelder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 19, 2025, 09:16:45 am
content: Hmm.. they could have asked to send a picture of a smashed plastic part (or something harder to repair - although nowadays there are also 3d-printers to the rescue), but maybe that could be a cause for injuries to customers, so that would make things more complicated for the company.

author: factory
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 19, 2025, 10:52:17 am
content: They've missed a step in theirinstructionsdestructions, damage the moulded on mains plug, so it cannot be plugged in before or after cutting the cable.David

author: voltsandjolts
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 19, 2025, 01:19:47 pm
content: They should make you send a video of the old one being blended in the new one

author: factory
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 19, 2025, 04:16:21 pm
content: Have you got access to more than 400V? It will never blend again.David

author: Ranayna
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 19, 2025, 05:16:39 pm
content: Up to a couple years ago, Logitech did the same with their wired periphals.After the warrany claim was processed they wanted a photo of the device with a cut cord.I didn't mindI got a new mouse and was able to replace the cable of the originally broken one for cheap.

author: bdunham7
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 19, 2025, 06:00:23 pm
content: Quote from: golden_labels on March 19, 2025, 08:03:14 amThis is not a budget product, it is premium. And paying more simply doesn't guarantee you any level of service, in many cases it is quite the opposite.If Ninja chooses to only provide complete new units for warranty cases because it works out for them economically, then so be it. My only concern is when parts are not available for out-of-warranty repairs. In this case, those blades are readily available as a replacement for $15 or so from Amazon. IDK if any of them are genuine or OEM. There's a whole Chinese cottage industry now of supplying common replacement parts for appliances and other household goods. This has actually improved repairability of consumer products in many cases.Since companies like this, even "premium" ones, have outsourced manufacturing, engineering-- and pretty much everything other than accounting and shareholder relations--to their Chinese subsidiary or supplier, all they get in their shipping containers are fully packaged complete products. A few companies, like Fluke, KitchenAid and Milwaukee Tool, realize that their customers won't tolerate the idea of disposability and thus offer parts and service even though those departments probably operate at a loss. We'll see how long that lasts. Others just hand out free product when needed and that probably costs them a lot less than it seems.

author: floobydust
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 19, 2025, 06:14:03 pm
content: This is the future: chinese appliance (Shenzhen Hai Xin Technology) disposable is cheaper than managing replacement parts.All this e-waste for a leaking gasket, which you can buy...Always check for product recalls, US only the old NinjaBL600,663,665had the blades break off and ninja people. They make air fryers and hair dryer too etc.I don't get it - it leaks but didn't seem to work in the end, compared to the new one?Common electronic fails are the dropper cap or electrolytic cap, or the motor windings.

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 19, 2025, 09:36:30 pm
content: Quote from: floobydust on March 19, 2025, 06:14:03 pmThe leaking part is the cup top with the blades, not the motor base. So either Dave had a spare, or bought one. Its a common wear item.The are $30 here:https://www.ninjakitchen.com/products/hybrid-edge-blades-zid703KKU100Aftermarket ones are cheaper on amazon, as noted above.Main product:https://www.sharkclean.ca/products/ninja%C2%A0foodi-power-nutri-duo-smoothie-bowl-maker-and-personal-blender-zidSS101C?bvstate=pg:9%2Fct:rQuote from: Ranayna on March 19, 2025, 05:16:39 pmWhich makes total sense, the cost to ship a mouse is more than it is worth, and no one is going to be repairing them.I had a dewalt EV cable fail, they wanted it shipped back. I'm suspicious if they'd ever repair it as the PCB area was waterproof and heat sealed shut. Maybe they can re-case it.

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 19, 2025, 10:15:39 pm
content: Quote from: floobydust on March 19, 2025, 06:14:03 pmIf you compare electronics and mechanical parts.Electronics: Almost everything is standard parts that can be substituted and replaced, with the exception of PCBs.Mechanical: Almost everything is custom made parts. They cannot even use a single screw or an O-ring that would be a standard part. Everything is injection moulded to serve a single purpose.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 19, 2025, 10:46:08 pm
content: Quote from: golden_labels on March 19, 2025, 08:03:14 amhttps://www.youtube.com/shorts/-2mf1mqZVQ0

author: sleemanj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 19, 2025, 10:54:37 pm
content: I was considering buying my mum a Ninja Creami last year (grinds frozen stuff into sorbet or icecream like stuff), but decided against it, because they seem designed to very easily fail - from memory if your ice is "too frozen" it can destroy the splines on the final drive shaft at which point the several hundred dollar unit is trash.I wouldn't mind a designed to fail gracefully part (a mechanical fuse if you will), but a designed to very easily fail part that can't be easily replaced on a relatively expensive device...

author: pdeal
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 20, 2025, 12:06:09 am
content: Well done but i prefer your commentary.Funny this similar thing happened to us with a toaster oven. Our toaster oven had an element that didn’t work in a certain mode (can’t remember the mode). My wife called them and they said they’d send us another if we destroyed the current one by cutting the cord off. Did so and new oven came (like you couldn’t bring myself to throw out the old one). New oven same issue! Must have been the way it was made. So apparently the old now “destroyed “ oven wasn’t bad. Even the manufacturer’s phone service people didn’t seem to know how it ought to work. Fast forward a year or so my son needed a toaster oven. Ah me thinks, new cord on “destroyed “ oven. He’s still using it.

author: BradC
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 20, 2025, 03:27:44 am
content: 20 years ago we had a failing Navman unit on a boat. Navman wanted to see photos of the unit smashed to pieces before they'd send a replacement. They even suggested a large hammer. As much as I wanted to try and break it up in a manner where it could be repaired, it just wasn't going to happen.

author: golden_labels
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 20, 2025, 04:40:43 am
content: Quote from: bdunham7 on March 19, 2025, 06:00:23 pmI didn’t say, that Dave should have paid $1 more. Just like half of that post, it was about systemic problem, which leads to this situation.

author: bdunham7
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 20, 2025, 05:14:15 am
content: Quote from: golden_labels on March 20, 2025, 04:40:43 amI agree it is systemic, but I took your "$1 more" to imply that consumers have some control over this. They don't because corporations compete by imitation and anyone offering a better solution gets flayed by "activist investors" aka pillagers. As soon as a company finds a better way to screw their customers, others are obliged to follow suit. Southwest Airlines is their latest success.

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 20, 2025, 11:40:24 am
content: Quote from: bdunham7 on March 20, 2025, 05:14:15 amThis entire though that "capitalism alone will yield the best result" doesn't really work anymore. It worked, when your product was a shoe, and your tools were a hammer or a knife. The barrier to entry for a competing product was very low. Now imagine Google is doing something anti-consumer. The barrier to entry to the market is Billions of dollars. Even for something as simple as a blender, you need several injection moulids, several customized machines to bend or sharpen metal. Certify everything. Hire people. Rent a location. The entry could be easily in the range of a million dollars, and you need to sell tens of thousands to hundreds thousand just to amortize that cost. Which means marketing, distribution, additional costs.And once you do that, and deliver a better product, they hostile takeover your company, and stop your product line.There is rarely any choice for these products. Try buying something as simple as an impact drill, that can be repaired.It's just a battery, a motor driver, a motor, maybe a gearbox and a head. All could be standard parts.

author: Haenk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 21, 2025, 12:37:51 pm
content: Honestly, cutting the wire is not a consumer-friendly way, I'd say it's dangerous and potientally even lethal.Think about all those ignorant people leaving the device plugged in, then cut the wire. Or kids fiddling with the cut off wire and plug it in, with lethal voltages accessible at the end of the wire.They surely did think about that, didn't they?

author: golden_labels
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 21, 2025, 01:48:44 pm
content: Quote from: Haenk on March 21, 2025, 12:37:51 pmSee at 00:27 in the video: “ENSURE THE APPLIANCE IS NOT PLUGGED INTO ANY LIVE POWER SUPPLY BEFORE ATTEMPTING TO CUT THE CORD”.

author: factory
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 21, 2025, 09:09:43 pm
content: Not good enough, the moulded plug needs to be damaged first, to prevent it being plugged in beforeorafter the chop, as I already mentioned in post #3.David

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 21, 2025, 09:58:33 pm
content: Quote from: Haenk on March 21, 2025, 12:37:51 pmThey did, I showed the warning note in the email, and was the subject of one my meme images in the video. Still dumb. Way safer to get people to bend the mains pins until they snap off.

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 21, 2025, 10:42:41 pm
content: Nah boring, the proper looney toons way would be to chuck the middle of the cable into the blender while it's running.We all do that with the lawnmower anyway.

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 21, 2025, 11:02:16 pm
content: keep the means of production functional in the kitchenspeaking of annoying gotcha's with consumer electronics, thermistor repair in motors.. so you can resurrect a $500 dyson that has a burnt thermistor ... so many people are getting wrecked because of Overtemp protectors of various kinds. Its like finding a cure for the common fluSomeone brought a dyson for repair, and it was discovered that if you disconnect the thermistor? (that goes into the motor crap) it works fine. What a dilemmaI wonder how many tons of waste you can get rid of per year if you1) specified winding resistance and leakage current to earth for repair people (its kinda getting cheap to measure this accurately)2) made thermal sensors replaceableThe miliohm meter and the megger have gotten SO CHEAP now that its basically a revelation for common repair people. Like $60 fully integrated hand held meggers. It used to be like $1kUSD a decade ago, minimum. That is like the tools people always needed finally becoming available... when I looked at megger prices last year I thought this is how a mini-revolution starts, with some kind of low cost HV current source (as much as I like my high voltage BJT current mirror module that connects to equipment that is way too precise)

author: McRib
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: April 02, 2025, 12:22:43 pm
content: Had the same thing happen to me with a brand new airfryer, they had me cut the cord and as soon as I got confirmation I tore it apart and found an overtemp sensor had tripped, I reset the sensor and it has worked perfectly for the past 4 years. I gave the new airfryer to some friends and posted what I did on the retailers site where I bought it. The post lasted a few days and was buried and deleted after that.

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2025, 01:37:39 pm
content: Actually, after thinking about this for another 5 seconds, I think most of my kitchen appliances are coming with IEC C13 power inlets. Pizza maker, grill, air fryer. They market themselves as a premium brand and don't have simple quality of life things like replaceable power cord?

author: Langdon
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2025, 01:51:53 pm
content: Nobody ever recycles E-waste, this preactice is terrible for the environment.Also, a message to Logitech: mouse cords areSTANDARDISED!They all a USB-A on one end and a 5-pin Molex connector on the other.Even Apple uses the standard cord.Keyboard also use the same cord.They are all interchangeable.They are all standardised.They are all easily replaceable.

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2025, 11:23:33 pm
content: Quote from: tszaboo on April 02, 2025, 01:37:39 pmAll of that stuff is probably hardwired for various reasons: safety, cost, and efficiency. Even on expensive ones here.The risk is someone puts in a 10A rated C13 cable, or one thats really long, and it melts. Maybe with 240V its less of an issue though.What brands use C13?

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2025, 10:36:38 am
content: Quote from: thm_w on April 02, 2025, 11:23:33 pmEvery C13 plug and wire needs to be rated for 16A.Quick check. Tefal , Ariete, Russell Hobbs all seem to just have C13 and that's just my kitchen.

author: Ranayna
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2025, 02:07:04 pm
content: IEC C13/C14 is rated for 10 amps.For 16 amps you need to go to C19/C20.

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2025, 09:57:31 pm
content: Quote from: tszaboo on April 03, 2025, 10:36:38 amI've seen them rated for 10A, and as low as 18AWG.https://www.infinitecables.com/products/iec-c13-to-iec-c14-power-cable-sjt-18awg-10a-250v

author: VK3DRB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 10, 2025, 04:36:38 am
content: Quote from: Langdon on April 02, 2025, 01:51:53 pmI saw a Sony Bravia at the side of the road for garbage collection as I drove by a few kilometres from my home. Very thin, Smart TV, worth around $1,300. Didn't have a scratch on it. I took it home and found it had a dry joint on the LED backlighting mechanism causing an intermitted error on bootup. Fixed it, downloaded the latest firmware - all within an hour. It is a fabulous TV. It is now hanging on the wall in the kitchen and looks great.E-waste is not always waste. One reason recycling does not occur is there are a lot of people around who don't know anything about electronics.