Is bike wheel light dizzy and unnecessary? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: BlueSKY
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: June 03, 2017, 07:57:20 am
content: We live in coastal city, the weather is warm year around, many people walk and cycle the coastal park after dark. I bought this wheel bike lighthttp://amzn.to/2rTBXZtfor my nephew one month ago. I have to say the light is super cool, makes him safe and easily seen when riding.However, I came across an article about StVZO Compliance, I didn’t go deeply into this law, but I start to think seriously is it right to install this kind of light? Because I myself really hate to see the flashing light on the police car, the red and blue blinking is dizzy. Is the wheel bike light the same case and actually walkers just want to turn it off?

author: steve30
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2017, 04:20:49 pm
content: What colour did you get?I don't know about America, but here in England it is illegal to use blue lights on a vehicle, as these are restricted to police/ambulance/fire etc. Blue LEDs are awful to look at anyway and should be avoided unless absolutely necessary.Any other colour would probably be OK to look at so long as it isn't flashing/flickering. If the LEDs are situated all around the wheel, and the wheel is spinning, it would probably just look like a solid circle of light. I think it will be fine as long as it looks solid and doesn't flicker. Flickering/flashing lights are annoying.Personally I wouldn't normally use any decorative lights on a bike. I'd just use a normal white front light and rear red light.When making/buying lights for a vehicle, just remember that you are trying to a) see where you are going, and b ) be seen by others. You are not trying to give others seizures.

author: jolshefsky
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2017, 04:34:12 pm
content: What I've found as both a bicycle rider and car driver is that when I see a cyclist, lights help me see them, but it is also an important reference for their orientation, speed, and direction of travel. Flashing front and rear lights—particularly super bright, brief blinks—are very hard for my brain to process into useful orientation information. Steady lights, even if dimmer, are much easier to track.Wheel lights only seem to ass some side-visibility. The strings you linked generate the outline of wheels which would tend to make a recognizable outline for a bicycle, and I would guess a positive thing overall.As to its legality, well, that depends on your jurisdiction. Few places have very good understanding of cycling laws, so if that's the case and the cops are dicks, you lose pretty much no matter what you do, but if they are friendly or don't care, then you're probably okay.

author: DaJMasta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2017, 04:44:19 pm
content: Lights like that should appear mostly solid at any decent speed - it wouldn't take too many RPMs on the wheels before they effectively blur into a disc, so I wouldn't be too worried. For something with such a large profile, I also wouldn't bother with blinking modes, as they should be noticeable enough.That said, those lights may provide some visibility, but are basically just bling. The normal minimum is a flashing, mostly red tail light and a white solid or flashing headlight. A flashing headlight is sufficient if the places you are riding are well lit, as you really only need the attention grabbing, but if you're going on dark paths, you actually need a fair bit of light to go any speed. There are a number of high-powered LED headlights and options for a helmet mount for tracking where you look too (though I think a handlebar fixed one is a better choice if you only pick one), and a bunch of options also include a rechargeable battery, since just AAs won't last hugely long.

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 04, 2017, 01:13:41 pm
content: I am with jolshefsky, I hate the blinking lights on bikes, they are as annoying as all get out. If cars have to use solid lights outside of turn signals, so should bikes.

author: CJay
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2017, 05:20:04 pm
content: Quote from: GreyWoolfe on June 04, 2017, 01:13:41 pmHere in the UK the flashing 'headlight' and 'tail light' is illegal and they are incredibly distracting when driving plus most cyclists are clueless as to how to align them so they don't blind oncoming traffic.I like the 'laser' prjected cyclist images, when fitted properly they give an excellent indication of how much room to give a cyclist.As for the OP, a set of 'spokies' or POV lights, I don't mind that much but you may want to check into local laws concerning colours as well.

author: BradC
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2017, 07:28:27 pm
content: Quote from: GreyWoolfe on June 04, 2017, 01:13:41 pmI'm very pro cyclist, but flashing lights make me actually want to run them into the ditch. Vehicles have to comply with ADRs and flashing high intensity lights sure as fuck don't come close. Want to be treated as an equal road user, start behaving like one.

author: Cerebus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2017, 07:46:09 pm
content: Quote from: jolshefsky on June 03, 2017, 04:34:12 pmYes. Classic bike front and rear lights offer little or no hint to the presence of a bicycle when seen from the side. As long as a bike has the standard, and usually legally mandated, front and rear lights I'd think that the addition of 'decorative' lights like this, that will actually create a very clear "It's a bike you blind Volvo driving idiot!" profile from the side that can only be a good thing.

author: Cerebus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2017, 07:54:05 pm
content: Quote from: CJay on June 04, 2017, 05:20:04 pmThe law on this changed quite some time ago, specifically in the Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations 2005; so you're only 12 years behind the times.For better or worse, flashing lights are now legal and subject to a minimum 4 candela output.

author: steve30
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2017, 07:58:18 pm
content: I've seen flashing lights around for a long time, even back when they were illegal.No idea why they had to legalise them as it seems rather pointless.

author: CJay
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2017, 08:23:12 pm
content: Quote from: Cerebus on June 04, 2017, 07:54:05 pmWell I stand (sit) corrected, what a bloody stupid law, especially now we have idiots on bicycles riding around with halides, 50W LEDs (or larger) etc. blinding oncoming traffic...

author: MagicSmoker
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2017, 08:57:31 pm
content: So... the OP registered yesterday and their first and only post is a link to a product on Amazon?

author: Red Squirrel
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 05, 2017, 12:42:44 am
content: I would definitely avoid anything that's blue, or along that spectrum (hard on the eyes) and that flashes. It's also illegal to use blue on a vehicle as it's meant for emergency vehicles. Not sure whether or not bikes would be exempt from this law but I would avoid it anyway, and definitely don't make it flash.But a trend I noticed in the past 5ish years or so is people putting those super bright HID lights on their cars. Those should be illegal. They're super hard on the eyes. I've also seen LED version and the PWM them at a very low frequency and it's like as strobe light. I really don't know what goes through people's minds when they install these kind of things. I guess they're just assholes.If you're going to put lights on a bike (and probably should if you ride at night) make sure it's a solid color and not flashing. And don't use blue, purple etc, stick to white, maybe yellow or red. Could perhaps have a back light that's red and front that's white.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 05, 2017, 01:06:35 am
content: The pattern of a forward bike light is all important. I like to actually have two lights - one shines far ahead, the other is aimed down for pothole avoidance. I also have a rear LED blinkie that is so bright its almost blinding and I leave that on all the time whenever I am riding, even in daylight, as I want people behind me especially to be able to see that I'm there. It has three settings, one of them is continuous- which I use at night. Daytime I turn it to blink. Some countries (Germany) ban blinking LED lights on bikes. I also have a more traditional taillight but its not attached now. Its a Dutch brand and it does not blink.The tail light was not very expensive, ($9?) but its very good. I don't remember the model number but its made by Sette, it runs forever on two AAA batteries and its shaped like a keyhole, sort of.For side visibility I use reflectors attached to my wheel spokes. If i was going to put a light there I would use yellow. I am pretty sure that blue lights on any non police moving vehicle in the US is illegal, or likely will eventually be.No matter how "cool" it is alleged to look, I would be terrified to have a blue light on my teenagers bike. Police would likely pull a biker over and ticket them wherever blue lights are illegal.I also have reflective tape on my bike, and helmet.

author: BlueSKY
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: June 05, 2017, 02:29:26 am
content: Quote from: steve30 on June 03, 2017, 04:20:49 pmHi Steve, thanks very much for your reply, unfortunately i bought blue, i thought it's cool and young boy would love it, it turned out to be correct, but now looks like a mistake.:-(Yes, you are right, less is more, maybe a normal white front light and rear red light is enough.

author: BlueSKY
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: June 05, 2017, 02:50:34 am
content: Quote from: MagicSmoker on June 04, 2017, 08:57:31 pmSorry to leave you a bad impression. I am not a cyclist and totally newbie to this forum,i bought this gift to my nephew and i think i should figure it out, sorry if this violates any forum rules.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 05, 2017, 02:56:19 am
content: With bikes, themore visibilitythe better.You can't have too much of it as long as its appropriately colored and situated.There is a lot of variation insidevisibility of different light setups in particular.Reflectors on wheels are good for helping a bike be seen by cars and they have the BIG advantage of always being there and not requiring batteries. But they won't help unless the seeing entity has a light to be reflected.So you can do a lot worse than having several lights too. Be aware that nice bike lighting setups can be expensive and try to balance the cost with the worth of the bike and the environment the bike will be ridden in. For me, there are times when I need to lock my bike up and not worry about it so my lights are removable so i can take them with me while shopping etc. Some bike lights (I would imagine a POV might not be friendly to this) might be hard to take with you and stick back on rapidly when you needed to use them. generator lights are good to have again because of they dont wear out. There are also dynamo hubs for bikes that embed a generator.Also 3M reflective tape is really bright and can be seen a long way off by cars. If the bike frame is cleaned well before its put on it can last for decades. get an assortment of colors and put dabs of red (back) white (front) and yellow (sides) on both bike and helmet.

author: BlueSKY
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: June 05, 2017, 03:01:42 am
content: Thank you guys, this is really a great forum, those advice are very helpful. I will check local rules and other night riding people, and also explain this to my nephew and let him to make the choice if he would like to keep the wheel bike light. Thanks again.

author: Rick Law
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 05, 2017, 10:40:44 pm
content: Quote from: CJay on June 04, 2017, 05:20:04 pmIn the USA, it is State dependent. In the State of New Jersey, blue light is volunteer fireman - you should yield but you don't have to pull over and stop. Blinking red is law enforcement, official fire trucks and/or other official vehicles.As to bright blinking lights, I found it very disruptive. Beyond that, it could cause dangerous seizure to others with brain illness - 1 in 4000 are affected. So if you see a car passing your bike with a passenger in the car having a seizure... Best documented is how blinking light triggers seizure for epilepsy sufferers. If you must have a blinking light, make the frequency slower than 1 Hz blink rate.Wired Magazinearticle: How Strobe Lights Cause Seizureshttps://www.wired.com/2007/06/mias-new-websit/Cambridge Research Systems, online flash test (it suggests 1 in 4000 affected, most likely with 5Hz to 30Hz. Hence my suggestion for below 1Hz)http://www.onlineflashtest.com/photosensitiveepilepsy.aspx

author: PointyOintment
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2017, 11:13:27 am
content: Quote from: Rick Law on June 05, 2017, 10:40:44 pmTheEmergency Stop Signal(intended to indicate that the vehicle is decelerating rapidly) flashes at 4 Hz. It's not yet common, though.

author: RobK_NL
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2017, 12:49:26 pm
content: Here in The Netherlands, blinking lights on a bicycle are illegal. You must have a front light (either white or yellow) and you must have a red tail light. In addition,you must have a red reflector on the back, yellow reflectors on the pedals and white or yellow reflectors on the wheels or tires.No lights other than front and tail are allowed.Failure to comply can result in a fine of up to 55 Euro.

author: Cerebus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2017, 04:07:02 pm
content: Quote from: RobK_NL on June 08, 2017, 12:49:26 pmAre you sure? As in, have you checked the current law rather than relying on your memories from earlier in life? The reason I ask is prompted not by disbelief in your perspicacity but the fact that the law in the UK was changed a while back andthese things usually happen to bring us into line with harmonized European rules*and I wonder if the same hasn't also happened in the Netherlands.* I don'tknowthis to be the case but it'susuallythe explanation when the normally conservative UK government changes its mind on something.

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2017, 05:41:40 pm
content: Quote from: RobK_NL on June 08, 2017, 12:49:26 pmI've yet to see a policeman give a fine to a cyclist. No matter what they do. If they cut red light, go through solid lines, overtaking moving cars from the right. They always have the right of way. Even on the walkway, even if bicycle is banned from that road. They can literally do whatever they want, no rules apply for any cyclist. And also, any kind of self preservation is immediately gone when you are on the bicycle.

author: RobK_NL
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2017, 08:12:50 pm
content: Quote from: Cerebus on June 08, 2017, 04:07:02 pmYup, I checked. Article 35Quote from: NANDBlog on June 08, 2017, 05:41:40 pmThat doesn't mean they never do.In my own town, in 2015, 68 fines were given for cycling on the walkway and 123 for "no light"In Amsterdam, in the same year, this was 13086 and 1033, respectively.Quote from: NANDBlog on June 08, 2017, 05:41:40 pmMy bicycle is my main mode of transport (I don't even have a driver's license) and I can assure you that I amacutely aware of my vulnerability. That's not to say there aren't any suicidal maniacs on bikes out there. Just as there are homicidal maniacs in cars ...

author: Cerebus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2017, 08:19:55 pm
content: Quote from: RobK_NL on June 08, 2017, 08:12:50 pmThanks, you hopefully understand why I wanted clarity.Quote from: RobK_NL on June 08, 2017, 08:12:50 pmThe later is no surprise. For every 50 parked cars I've seen in Amsterdam, I've seen 1 car moving, a couple of trams and about 100 moving cyclists. I've tended to stick mostly to central Amsterdam but it still gives a flavour.

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2017, 08:45:08 pm
content: You can probably fine 123 cyclist in 10 minutes where I live in the town center, if you check if all the mandatory* equipment is working on their bike. I would like to see the police stopping people running red lights an doing all the crazy shit they do on a daily bases.They shouldn't even fine them, just put them in one of the "human cannons" from a circus, and shoot them into a wall at 50 kmh or 90 kmh if they did it outside the city. No helmets of course if you dont wear one!*not optional by law