What is Element14's problem?? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: AlfBaz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 12:38:49 am
content: Thought I'd look around for some low tempco trimmers and it seems Vishay foil trimmers are the go at 10ppm/degCHere is ozRS Components ~~ $47 eaDigikey ~~ $36 ea (+ postage of about the same, so double unless you buy 4 of them)Element14 ~~ $68 - $110!!I still remember them selling DDR ram for around 500-600 when you could buy it at the local computer markets for around 70, not to mention 15" LCD monitors for around 2.5k!

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 01:54:36 am
content: As usual you need to shop around for the best price. Farnell is easy but I often order from RS-components and Distrelec.

author: Corporate666
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 02:08:43 am
content: It always varies. I remember years ago the distributors were sending reps over here whenever I placed an order... they'd see you order a reel of caps and figure "they must be doing production! Salesmen, get thee over there stat!". The sales drones from Arrow, Avnet, Future and some local "technical sales reps" always laughed that we bought a majority of our stuff from Digikey, and told us how much we were wasting. Until they saw the prices - and they were almost always a lot higher!I find Digikey and Mouser seem to be evenly matched on just about everything. I think they check each others prices regularly and match. Future is often MUCH lower on some things (like a regulator I buy that is $0.28 in reels everywhere else, but Future is $0.156 in 1000pcs quantity, less on reels).Occasionally Avnet will be lower on something, like the MBR0520LT1 diodes we use a ton of. But Avnet screws up probably 50% of my orders. They have cheap express shipping - $15 for 2-day and $25 for overnight. But they always send it ground from Utah, which takes 5+ business days to arrive.Arrow... let's not even talk about Arrow. They are so much higher priced than everyone else that I don't understand how they stay in business. When the rep came, I mentioned this. He said "Yeah, but if you have an account, the prices are much lower - so just call me and I'll get you a quote!". Most of the time, their "so low we can't even publish it!" prices were much higher than Digikey's price. I told the rep to check the Digikey/Avnet price and if he wasn't lower, don't bother calling me back with a quote. He stopped calling, so I stopped buying.

author: c4757p
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 02:16:45 am
content: Quote from: Corporate666 on August 07, 2013, 02:08:43 amReally? I've found Digikey to almost always be more expensive. Maybe it depends on quantity...

author: Corporate666
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 02:26:29 am
content: Quote from: c4757p on August 07, 2013, 02:16:45 amMaybe depends on what you are buying. Just off the top of my head,ATTINY13A they are about the same, Digikey a little less I think. Aforementioned MBR0520LT1 diode, Digikey a little less. LXM2-PL01-0000 LED. Digikey a bit less than Mouser.I usually buy reels - not always, but I never buy one's and two's unless I am just prototyping something, and in those cases usually care more about getting it all from one place than the price (within reason). I like that I can order from Digikey until 8pm and it ships same day by US Postal and I get it 2 days later. Only one better is Future. Bafflingly, I can order until 10pm (IIRC) and it ships same day, and I can have it the next morning for $25. Boggles the mind - especially since they ship from somewhere out west - Arizona I think?

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 02:34:37 am
content: I find Digikey cheaper than RS/Element14/Mouser for about 80% of the things i buy on a regular basis.For the other 20% it's usually Mouser which are cheaper.I've found rolls of wire routinely cheaper from element14 though.I wonder how much difference there is between currencies on digikey.eg, NZD digikey price vs AUS digikey price in relation to the actual exchange rate.

author: David_AVD
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 02:40:37 am
content: I need 100 x PIC16F1827-I/P for a job and will order from Element14 as they are only a couple of cents more than Digikey. (E14 maybe actually be cheaper due to the Digikey freight cost)Mind you, E14 only have 50 in stock (balance in 7 days), but I only *need* 25 to get production started so that's fine with me.EDIT: I need a few LM323K for another job so thought I'd check E14. $36 for a part I can buy for $8 from another regular supplier! The moral of the story is to always check.

author: David_AVD
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 02:45:59 am
content: Quote from: Psi on August 07, 2013, 02:34:37 amI went to try Mouser's "free freight for Australian orders over $300" deal once. Cancelled the checkout as the freight may have been free, but the parts price difference was way more than the exchange rate. Paying the USD $30 freight is still a better deal.

author: Corporate666
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 02:48:43 am
content: Quote from: David_AVD on August 07, 2013, 02:40:37 amWhen you Ozzies order these parts, I presume they are shipping from local warehouses? I hear a lot of folks (justifiably) complaining about shipping, but I know all of the big distributors have warehouses in China and Europe at a minimum (because sometimes I order parts and they tell me "Oh, it's on the way from our warehouse in Europe/China so it will be a while). Since Oz is so geographically separated from the USA/EU, I would imagine there should be warehouses down under too, no?

author: David_AVD
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 03:03:34 am
content: E14 and RS do keep local stock, but increasingly (especially for RS) larger quantities are "ex stock with a 6-7 day lead time". So it's "in stock" somewhere in an E14 warehouse, just not the Australian one! That's on the Australian specific E14 and RS web sites too.Digikey and Mouser deliveries only take 4-5 days to get here from whatever warehouse they use.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 03:37:31 am
content: The ecommerce revolution changed everything.Farnell, I'm talking 80's/90's pre-internet here used to be massively overpriced on practicallyeverything, because you couldn't just search online and use your credit card and have it in a few days from another country.Now Element 14/Farnell are pretty competitive one-off for the majority of stuff like components, and occasionally I've found them the cheapest on volume out of the major catalog suppliers. It depends entirely on what part you are talking about. I think it was about 5-6 years back or so that Farnell actively promote that they were going to be much more "competitive" on pricing, and that has largely happened due to the competition from Digikey and Mouser primarily I think.Yes there are the oddball stuff still left at ridiculous prices, but hose days are mostly gone.

author: johnboxall
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 05:03:19 am
content: element14 will price match RS, digikey, mouser etc. for volume buys and one-offs for large items (test equipment etc).http://au.element14.com/quotesEnter your target price and the supplier in the comment box.Then you get the price you want and the overnight delivery if it's in stock.

author: David_AVD
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 05:15:02 am
content: That's a good tip. RS say they'll quote on items, but I found the process a royal PITA (and slow) so I hardly ever ask them now.

author: ElectroIrradiator
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 06:45:38 am
content: Quote from: tronixstuff on August 07, 2013, 05:03:19 amThis may be the case, but something funky is up with their low volume pricing (hobby level quantities). It seems like if a component suddenly start to sell well across many small orders, then the low volume (<100 per order) prices skyrocket. So they really fleece the hobbyists / low volume manufacturers, if a particular design temporarily gets popular.

author: David_AVD
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 11:53:58 am
content: Quote from: ElectroIrradiator on August 07, 2013, 06:45:38 amYou know, I was thinking something similar only the other day. I put it down to the exchange rate going south.Sometimes the items drop in price after I've bought them too.

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 11:58:15 am
content: The problem i have with RS, at least with the nz website, is you cant easily limit your searches to items in-stock at the trade counter. (20min drive from me).That's really the only reason i use RS, when i need components right away.

author: David_AVD
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 12:00:28 pm
content: I find the search feature on RS infuriating to use, hence why E14 is always my first choice even when I know RS has free freight while E14 is only free > $45 + GST.

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 12:05:17 pm
content: Yep, its terrible.They re-did their website a while back and must have thought.. "hey, lets make the new website even worse than it currently is"heh, i think the real issue was that they let a non-engineer design it, worst mistake ever.

author: David_AVD
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 12:28:47 pm
content: Digikey and Mouser are great. E14 is pretty good now. But RS... ughh.... I have to keep guessing what they have decided to call something which is totally at odds with everyone else!

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 12:44:18 pm
content: Quote from: David_AVD on August 07, 2013, 12:00:28 pmOver here Farnell/E14 ships free and RS charges a few euro. Does anyone know how to get a paper catalog from RS and/or Farnell? For some stuff a paper catalog still beats the website hands down.

author: AlfBaz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2013, 02:53:37 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on August 07, 2013, 03:37:31 amYep, and that business paradigm has stuck in my mind since way back then and unless they only care about customers in their 20's seeing thee huge pricing discrepancies only reinforces my perception of them as an overpriced "local" stockist.To be fair I have noticed their prices have become a lot more reasonable over the years but they really need to go through all of their listings and ensure they don't have ridiculous 100+% mark-ups on their competitor prices and if its really old stock... cut their losses and sell them at the current prices so they don't put off customers

author: MrAureliusR
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 11, 2013, 02:54:00 am
content: I do find element14 (Newark) more expensive but back in the beginning of 2013 (last time I could afford to treat myself to something cool!) they shipped it from North Carolina and it was here the next day... free shipping via UPS air. Great for $20 or less IMO. I've done a LOT of price matching because I am a deal-seeker... spend more time buying the parts than assembling something!IIRC, at least for Canadian buyers, Mouser, Digikey and element14 (Newark in Canada) it's just a flat rate shipping for everything. I added all the parts needed to build a decade resistance box -- same shipping as a single resistor, which is good in my opinion. I guess if it was some huge order maybe the shipping would go up, but for me shipping costs are always the one to watch. If the difference in price plus shipping versus bussing across town is more... then... well..

author: marshallh
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 11, 2013, 03:28:38 am
content: 15% discount code:THANKS3valid until august 31, enjoy

author: David_AVD
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2013, 04:04:11 am
content: Maybe that code only works in USA ?

author: edavid
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2013, 04:24:30 am
content: Quote from: Corporate666 on August 07, 2013, 02:08:43 amDid you get Arrow and Avnet backward?Pricing on the MBR0520LT1 you mention, qty 3000:Arrow $0.0301Avnet $0.1140 (or $0.0861 next month)DigiKey $0.05658, but no stockMouser $0.061, but no stock

author: jeroen74
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2013, 06:49:50 am
content: I noticed that at Farnell some components (usually from LT it seems) are ridiculously expensive at 1-5 pieces, but the price almost halves at 5+ quantities; so it's cheaper to buy 6 pieces then 5...

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 12:54:21 pm
content: hehe yeah, i ordered some tiny 3mm DFN accelerometers and they came in a big foam box with cutout sections.I actually found an extra chip down the side of the foam.

author: metalphreak
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 02:31:00 pm
content: Quote from: David_AVD on August 07, 2013, 02:40:37 amWhy not microchipdirect? I've always found them cheapest for anything remotely considered a volume order. Quick international delivery which is capped at $17 or something (haven't ordered in a while).

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 03:41:59 pm
content: That probably only works if you have a credit card. US based companies think everyone in the EU has a credit card...

author: Marco
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 04:56:06 pm
content: Why wouldn't you have a credit card? Even if you don't think the annual fees are worth it something like mywirecard has no subscription or annual fees, for a purely online "card", just need to pay a euro to deposit money into the account.PS. oops, I see that's only true for people in Euro countries ... you get hit with a 1.5% exchange fee otherwise. Might be different online pre-paid credit cards with better deals though.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 08:43:13 pm
content: In the EU credit cards are expensive and slow. I can use my debit card everywhere and it charges directly from my bank account. Besides that I want companies to send me a bill which I pay afterwards. Companies from Europe understand that. Digikey and Mouser don't so despite their efforts they won't get much business from Farnell's customers.

author: mrflibble
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 09:02:22 pm
content: You can also pay digikey with Ye Olde IBAN + BIC.Since you probably read German, see this one:http://dkc1.digikey.com/de/de/mkt/Terms.html#Paythe key part being "Vorauszahlung per Ueberweisung". Your moneys then go to their German office, and you get your goodies either from Koeln or from the US as per usual. So far I always got things shipped straight from the US, but at least now with decent banking options instead of that credit card silliness.

author: Marco
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 09:44:26 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on August 12, 2013, 08:43:13 pmThat's a different complaint from the credit card complaint though.Prepayment vs. invoicing isn't really a US vs. EU issue, more a low margin vs. old school business issue ... invoicing and collection cost tons of money.

author: David_AVD
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 10:23:48 pm
content: Quote from: metalphreak on August 12, 2013, 02:31:00 pmI wanted them (or at least some of them) next day. Sometimes rush orders happen and E14 had a perfectly acceptable price. I also have a credit account at E14.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2013, 11:42:52 pm
content: Quote from: Marco on August 12, 2013, 09:44:26 pmI don't do prepayment (too much hassle with proforma invoices and its slow) and I'm not going to fill out endless amounts of forms for credit applications. US companies default to that if you don't pay by credit card.

author: Tepe
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 13, 2013, 02:42:36 pm
content: Quote from: mrflibble on August 12, 2013, 09:02:22 pmMileage really does vary. In this country bank transfers are officially frowned upon for internet purchases.http://www.forbrug.dk/Artikler/Dine-rettigheder/Forbrugerguides/Ehandel/5raad?tc=B59025F69D274B4C812582C9CBB83E04

author: ElectroIrradiator
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 13, 2013, 04:20:18 pm
content: Quote from: Tepe on August 13, 2013, 02:42:36 pmCorollary: Try paying online for an expensive luxury product, or a new car, using that piece of advice, and the sellers here are going to laugh at you (possibly behind your back). If the *buyer* is dishonest, then the seller can maximally get [the equivalent of] $750, 4000DKK, from the bank, if an online sale via credit card was fraudulent. The seller accepting online transactions here have no way of checking if, for instance, the balance on a credit card can actually pay for the goods.

author: metalphreak
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 07, 2013, 04:05:58 pm
content: Quote from: David_AVD on August 12, 2013, 10:23:48 pmFair enough. I've paid $10ea for 3 or 4 chips for quick prototyping runs while I had 100 @ ~$3ea from microchip direct on the way.I recently bought some DIN rail off E14 as part of an order. 10x 500mm steel lengths for $7. Arrived within a week from the UK warehouse!Got a bunch of these trays as well on clearout special for 25c each! They hang off of DIN rail just fine

author: David_AVD
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 07, 2013, 10:25:53 pm
content: Quote from: metalphreak on September 07, 2013, 04:05:58 pmWell done! I love seeing items re-purposed.