The mysterious case of the hanging BIOS screen - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Ampera
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 01:52:19 am
content: I bought a second hand ASUS A8N-SLI Deluxe Socket 939 motherboard to play older games on. It's a really nice board, and I have put an AMD Athlon 64 FX-55 in there (single core).The machine turns on with an HD 8000 series workstation Radeon card I had lying around (the actual cards won't get here for a while), and displays the BIOS splash screen where it prompts me to press delete if I want to enter into the setup screen. If I press del, it will say "entering setup", prompt for an integrated RAID controller BIOS (which I CAN enter), clear screen, then hang at a flashing cursor. It doesn't bring up the BIOS setup, or do anything else. Keypresses have no effect, and it just hangs forever (ran for a few hours to make sure).If I do not try to enter setup, it will list devices, and complain about no bootable disk. I can boot from floppies using the on-board controller, but booting by USB or IDE optical doesn't work (even though the devices are fully detected)I have no clue why it's doing this. I have attempted to flash the BIOS to latest using the DOS flashing utility and a DOS boot disk. The boot disk can't detect an optical drive, but I haven't tried too hard with this one, I may just be using a bad driver. I have attempted this inside and outside a case with two different power supplies, one of which is a brand new 650w Corsair unit. The board has no obvious signs of physical damage at a cursory inspection, all the caps appear fine, and the board is physically in decent condition. It's obviously doing almost everything right, it's only issue is that it doesn't boot to setup, and I can't change boot order or boot from a non-floppy device.I have tried 3 different memory sticks, both DDR-400 and DDR-333 (I have some DDR-200 laying around, but considering it seems to function perfectly fine everywhere else, I don't believe it's the memory).Any help would be well appreciated.

author: Halcyon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 02:07:44 am
content: Have you tried clearing the BIOS by removing the battery and/or shorting the clear BIOS jumper? There may be existing settings configured which aren't compatible with your CPU/RAM.

author: Ampera
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 02:16:35 am
content: Quote from: Halcyon on January 03, 2018, 02:07:44 amI have already done that, I guess that is something I forgot to mention.I cleared the BIOS, removed the battery, cleared the energy, and even tried operating it without the battery. One thing to note is that the board came to me without a battery installed.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 02:22:39 am
content: Have you tried the old trick of removing *every* component that is not absolutely necessary to boot up? Try powering up with only a CPU, RAM and keyboard, use internal video if present rather than having a video card installed, see if you can get into the setup.Was the board sold as working? Did it arrive properly packed in antistatic packaging?

author: Halcyon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 02:25:07 am
content: I would also try your RAM in a different slot. Maybe there is an issue with that one slot?Is the software version that is currently on the board up to date? If not, perhaps there is an issue with an older version and your CPU/RAM combo. Check out the release notes on any subsequent versions to see if there are any bug fixes.Do you have another power supply you can try?

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 02:26:16 am
content: Quote from: james_s on January 03, 2018, 02:22:39 amAgreed. It sounds like a USB device might be interfering with the boot process, causing the system to hang. A broken component might also cause issues.

author: Ampera
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 02:28:06 am
content: Quote from: james_s on January 03, 2018, 02:22:39 amThat's what I've been running on multiple times. The board was sold as working, and seemed to ship in antistatic foam (it was pink in colour), although it could in theory be just colour.Quote from: Halcyon on January 03, 2018, 02:25:07 amI have not tried memory in another slot, I could do that real quick, but I doubt that's the issue.The BIOS is the newest version for that board, freshly flashed.I have tried two power supplies.I have also stuck in there a PCI S3 Virge/VX as another video controller to see if it was for whatever reason the video card. It was not. There is no integrated video present on the board.Quote from: Mr. Scram on January 03, 2018, 02:26:16 amThe only USB device present is a USB hub with a single keyboard on it, but I have tried this with a PS/2 keyboard to the same result. This ran with a single video card, one stick of memory in the first slot, a PS/2 keyboard, and 0 else attached.It could be something broken, but I have no clue what.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 02:29:22 am
content: Quote from: Halcyon on January 03, 2018, 02:25:07 amA lot of boards require the stick to be in a specific slot to work at all of there's just one stick present. Sometimes it's a specific pair of slots. This is often denoted by a different colour or markings on the PCB, but often requires reading the manual.

author: Ampera
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 02:30:15 am
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on January 03, 2018, 02:29:22 amThe board works and can boot into MS-DOS. I do not believe it's the RAM. It is in the first slot, the one that it needs to be in.EDIT: Just realized I was a bit ambiguous here. I did not mean to say the original problem has gone away, I meant to say the board doesn't not work at all, and that it can boot into MS-DOS. I still can't get into BIOS setup.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 02:38:51 am
content: Quote from: TwoOfFive on January 03, 2018, 02:30:15 amAs suggested, it helps to remove everything that isn't absolutely essential. Remove everything but power, RAM, the GPU as you have no IGP, the monitor and a PS/2 keyboard. After that, it's down to swapping parts until you find a culprit. You tried the keyboard, GPU, RAM and PSU already. Have you tried to enter the BIOS without a HDD or other storage attached? Does that work?The most likely culprit is generally the HDD. Just to be sure, you didn't accidentally switch the boot mode from IDE to AHCI or the other way around?

author: Ampera
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 02:42:32 am
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on January 03, 2018, 02:38:51 amAs I said, there was no HDD attached in most experiments. No floppy drive either.The list of things attached are the CPU, cooler, power supply, a GPU, a stick of memory in the first slot, and a PS/2 or USB keyboard.Nothing else as attached.

author: jmelson
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 02:44:17 am
content: Most BIOS'es time out eventually if there's no bootable disk. But, I can easily imagine some BIOS that doesn't time out in the setup screen.So, you might just put ANY bootable device out there, and see if the setup screen come up.Jon

author: Ampera
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 02:47:09 am
content: Quote from: jmelson on January 03, 2018, 02:44:17 amI believe I have done that. I will double check on this one.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 02:49:19 am
content: Quote from: TwoOfFive on January 03, 2018, 02:42:32 amSorry, I missed that. I think you swapped everything out, except for the CPU and the board itself. You also cleared the BIOS settings. It's starting to look like there might be a defect, though it might pay to try a few combination of hardware the board might or might not expect.

author: Ampera
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 02:54:31 am
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on January 03, 2018, 02:49:19 amI've been there too with the S3 Virge. Idk I could throw in a modem or a SCSI controller if that counts.actually that sounds like it might be an idea, with the SCSI controller....I'm beginning to think the same, however. What sucks is that this is my second DOA board. I did try to boot to the setup screen with bootable media (floppy drive on the controller with a DOS bootdisk inserted)I might return the board, but if anybody has any other ideas, that would be welcome.

author: Ampera
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 03:47:39 am
content: After taking the board out, giving it a proper and full inspection close up, clearing out the CMOS as thoroughly as possible, and giving the board a few slight flexes, I guess I have to pronounce this board dead proper.I am going to try a third time with a third board, but if that ends up not working I guess I'm gonna have to go for an nforce 590 board I have.Never get into building legacy computers, guys, it basically sucks your wallet dry ten ways to summer. Then again, what decent hobby doesn't?

author: Halcyon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 03:54:37 am
content: Just confirming you've also tried with no drives connected? Not even a hard disk?Quote from: TwoOfFive on January 03, 2018, 03:47:39 amIf you do, avoid the AMD stuff. They were flaky at best. I would sooner build an old machine with a Cyrix/IBM processor than AMD.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 03:57:33 am
content: Quote from: Halcyon on January 03, 2018, 03:54:37 amI don't think I've ever heard that claim before. AMD was known for building some very serious chips in those days too.

author: Halcyon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 04:00:57 am
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on January 03, 2018, 03:57:33 amI'm not saying AMD is specifically the issue in this case, but I've been building PCs since around 1994. I found AMD processors of that era performed well, but tended to be more unreliable than Intel counterparts. Then of course there were all the heat-related issues with K6 and Athlon processors. If someone wanted a solid, reliable machine at the expense of a small amount of processing power, I'd choose Intel every time and rarely had problems. Since then, AMD have left a bad taste in my mouth. Even today I have more AMD GPU's die than NVIDIA ones.

author: Ampera
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 04:04:21 am
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on January 03, 2018, 03:57:33 amSome of the strongest and best built machines I own are AMD. My Am486-DX4-100 is rocking strong, and has given me an amazing computing experience. Intel has been really good too.It's a case of what you get in what situations. With thousands of variables to go wrong and only one way to go right, computers are a tricky business. I've never used Cyrix CPUs, and my only experience with IBM CPUs are POWER architecture things.I just built a Phenom 2 machine, and it's a snappy little guy, even for being on slow DDR2 memory. I do love making these machines, even through the hell they put me through, because when you do get it working, and trust me, the mania will make you get it to work, it's an amazing time.See you some time with a working 939 machine mates.Quote from: Halcyon on January 03, 2018, 04:00:57 amIt's actually kind of funny, I was planning a Penitum 4/Pentium D machine instead of a 939 one, but my choice of graphics solution would have created a huge bottleneck. This was NOT a good time for Intel, believe me. Latter Pentium 4s, and basically the entire Pentium D line was just one giant furnace with terrible implementations and shitty performance. AMD was rocking it especially during this time, and Intel had nothing to show for themselves besides space heaters until Core 2 rolled around.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 04:18:24 am
content: Quote from: Halcyon on January 03, 2018, 04:00:57 amIntel marketing has done an amazing job. Despite all the issues they've had over the years, people still view them as the inherently more reliable option. Don't get me wrong, AMD has built stinkers too.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 04:40:53 am
content: Quote from: TwoOfFive on January 03, 2018, 04:04:21 amThe Pentium 4 was an interesting idea, but it just didn't pan out and they had to make due while they whipped up a replacement. Being caught totally off guard by AMD's X2, they had to quite literally glue two of these troubled chips together to create another disaster in the shape of the Pentium D. At least they could say they also had a dual core processor, right? Intel finally managed to regain credibility when they launched the Core 2 Duo much later. We can only guess what the market would have looked had Intel not paid OEMs not to use AMD chips.Believe it or not, but I actually found one of these Pentium Ds in active duty the other day. The power it has consumed in its lifetime would probably have paid for more than one replacement.

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 01:09:03 pm
content: "Some of the strongest and best built machines I own are AMD. My Am486-DX4-100 is rocking strong, and has given me an amazing computing experience. Intel has been really good too."That was the first computer I built from scratch. I had cobbled together parts that people gave me before that. I really enjoyed that computer.

author: rdl
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 05:40:27 pm
content: First computer I put together myself used an Athlon XP 1900+ processor. That was 2001 and it was also my first Windows XP machine. I still have it and it probably still works, though it hasn't been turned on since 2012. I didn't switch back to Intel until 2008 when decent Core2Duo chips became available.

author: duak
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 09:10:41 pm
content: I remember working on a laptop of some sort from about 2012 or so where there was no way I could get it to go in to ROM BIOS setup. The disk had windows 7 or 8 but it also had a number of hard faults and would take about 20 min to finally boot into safe mode. Since I couldn't get into setup I couldn't get it to boot from USB or CD-ROM. From safe mode I did tell it to disable something in UEFI that I think is now called "safe boot". After that I could get into setup and then got Linux running to diagnose the disk.I don't know if the ASUS mobo has UEFI but it might be worth looking into this. I think I read somewhere that specific patterns have to be written into an NVRAM parameter before setup can be accessed and that some step has to be performed after an NVRAM clear to do this. ie., an NVRAM clear will not allow the setup menu. A chicken and egg situation but probably better from the security standpoint.Cheers,

author: amyk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 10:33:44 pm
content: Things like this are what Port 80 POSTcards are useful for.

author: apelly
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 03, 2018, 11:07:55 pm
content: Discl: Have not read the whole thread...Have you tried attaching a speaker? Most BIOSs have beep sequences to let you know what's not working as expected.But I've also had boot issues in the past caused by USB device compatibility issues.

author: HwAoRrDk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 04, 2018, 01:19:02 pm
content: I used a PC with an A8N-SLI SE board and Athlon 64 X2 4400 for several years. A very reliable system that was. I still have it, and it still works just fine. It amuses me that such a machine is considered 'legacy'.A few questions:- Do you have the manual? If not, it's all still available on the Asus websitehere.- Which revision of FX-55 processor do you have? According to theCPU support listfor the motherboard, one revision of that CPU works with any BIOS version, but the 'E4' revision only works with BIOS version 1010 and newer.- What size are the memory sticks you're using? If I recall correctly, the A8N-SLI doesn't work with anything > 1GB, nor with <= 128MB, and depending on the modules in use, may not recognise all 4GB if you put 1GB in every slot. Also, when using a single stick, the manual says you need to put it in the 'DIMM_B1' slot. Also you can check the memory against the QVL list at the link above.- Does the board have the 'EZ Selector' card installed in the special slot? It's a little jumper board that, depending on which way round it's plugged in, selects between single and dual (i.e. SLI) graphics card use. I could imagine it might cause problems if the thing is absent entirely. There is also a warning LED on the board that indicates error state with SLI configuration.- The Deluxe version of the board features 'Asus POST Reporter', which gives verbal audio messages of POST errors. Try plugging in some speakers and see if you get anything.

author: Ampera
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 04, 2018, 06:26:11 pm
content: I should probably post I am in the process of return the board and plan to use an nForce 590 SLI solution now, as I already have the board, CPU, and RAM.From what I can see, I've tried everything reasonable. The CPU should be compatible (although it reported it as an FX-57, which it most certainly is not, but it could just have been on THAT version of the BIOS)I have run it barebones, I have reflashed the BIOS, I have followed the guidelines for RAM to the T (this isn't my first computer anyways), and the board does POST. It boots into DOS, and does all of that. My issue is that I wasn't able to get it to boot into the BIOS setup menu to change any options, nor boot from any non floppy-based media.I'm taking a break from building these machines after this, as I am honestly getting annoyed with all this DOA bullshatner. Gonna go play around with 68k based machines like the Macintosh, Amiga, or ST machines now. I have a pretty good run of machines from a 486 to now this Athlon 64 machine.Thanks for all the suggestions, I don't think there was anything within reason I could have done. The board's unusable as I have it and no amount of basic stuff seems to fix it.