Raspberry Pi 3 B+ vs 4 what is your experience - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / beginners

author: sairfan1
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 15, 2020, 04:33:14 pm
content: I came to know that Raspberry Pi 4 is here and i was looking to buy one, I want to install Node-Red and some other work with MQTT broker and Web Server on Raspberry Pi.While looking on some videos looks like RPi 4 has some issues, I'm not well experienced i want to know, if I should buy RPi 3 B+ as because its stable or RPi 4 is stable enough that it can work for above projects? or if i should wait a little

author: rstofer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 15, 2020, 06:52:23 pm
content: Just for giggles, and because it is running, I decided to reply using my Pi 4 desktop. This version of the Pi makes a perfectly adequate desktop.I did install a web server and connect it to the GPIO ports (a Freenove kit example project) and it worked very well. It's on a different Pi 4 so I don't recall the details.I don't know anything about your applicatiion but I understood both th 3 and 4 use the same code base. It's been around for a while so I expect most driver issues have been resolved. The 4 is dramatically faster:https://magpi.raspberrypi.org/articles/raspberry-pi-4-vs-raspberry-pi-3b-plusIn the summary, at the end of the article, they recommend the 4 but also give credit to the 3B+, I would try the 4 just for the speedhttps://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B06W54L7B5

author: atmfjstc
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: July 15, 2020, 06:59:03 pm
content: Yeah, the Pi 4 definitely has some major thermal issues. I had a 3B that worked just fine in an enclosed case with no fan, doing light Web server work. When I got a Pi 4 I noticed right away that even with no case, and totally idle, its temperature gets very high, like 60+ Celsius. When you put it in a case (kinda required, to protect it from dust etc.), the temperature rapidly maxes out at 80+ C and the thing goes into continuous thermal throttling. This - remember - when fully idle.It's basically unusable in a case without active cooling like a fan. And that significantly changes the way you can work with it. It'll no longer be dead quiet and solid state, you'll have to keep cleaning the fan etc.

author: dcbrown73
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: July 15, 2020, 08:19:04 pm
content: My Raspberry Pi 4 just runs automated tasks. (written in Python and scheduled in crontab) It is in a solid clear case and has a small (practically useless) fan on it blowing onto the heatsinks. The reason I say practically useless is because it hardly moves any air at all.I haven't had any issues with mine, but it's not being pushed really either. (ie, not running it as a desktop)As rstofer mentioned. It's far faster than the Rpi3B. Of course, that's why it generates more heat too so that was not unexpected.

author: rstofer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 15, 2020, 08:23:23 pm
content: Speed and heat are tied together.I have a couple of PI 4s in this heatsink and the desktop idles around 42 deg C. There is some thermal foam between the 3 devices and the underside of the heatsinkhttps://www.amazon.com/innomaker-Raspberry-Heatsink-Aluminum-Extender/dp/B082X4RGNFThermal testing:https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/thermal-testing-raspberry-pi-4/I ran the CPU test for a couple of minutes and the temperature reached 61 deg C Not a big deal!I don't know what I would do that could tie the machine up much more than the stress program so I'm not going to worry about heat.I have added to .bash_aliases:temp='vcgencmd measure_temp'Now I have a simple command to test the temperature.I also have a couple of acrylic cases and they work well given they have a fan and heatsinks:https://www.amazon.com/GeeekPi-Acrylic-Raspberry-Cooling-Heatsinks/dp/B07TXSQ47L

author: dcbrown73
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: July 15, 2020, 08:47:42 pm
content: Quote from: rstofer on July 15, 2020, 08:23:23 pmThe is either the exact same case, or very similar to the one I have. (fans from the picture too)

author: atmfjstc
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: July 15, 2020, 08:50:01 pm
content: Quote from: dcbrown73 on July 15, 2020, 08:19:04 pmI think even that small "useless" fan is more effective than you'd think. I've actually undervolted the fan in my case to reduce the noise, and it still works almost as well as it did at full speed (i.e. 5V vs 3V3). I think the trick is to have just the minimal airflow required to stop the hot air from accumulating inside the case like in an oven.I think the ginormous heatsink solution could also work, yes, if we want to keep things noiseless. Still, the point remains that the Pi 4 kinda forces you into buying extra stuff just for keeping the machine thermally stable at idle - which was not the case with its predecessors.

author: rstofer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 15, 2020, 10:16:20 pm
content: I have used the bare Pi 4, just the PCB with three small heatsinks held on with sticky thermal pads, no case, and had no problems with heat. I imagine the stress test will develop some high temps.Bare board with 3 small heatsinks:Idle after startup 50 degrees CAfter downloading and installing the stress test code 61 degrees CRunning the stress test for a couple of minutes 82 degrees C <=== I think it's beginning to throttleFans are good. So are very large heatsinks. The small heatsinks don't do a good job without airflow.

author: rstofer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 16, 2020, 12:03:25 am
content: Using that large monolithic heatsink and the stress test program, I let the system run for 1-1/2 hours and the temperature is asymptotic at 72 deg C. I didn't include the graphics stress test. I don't see the point in running a 24 hour test.https://www.amazon.com/innomaker-Raspberry-Heatsink-Aluminum-Extender/dp/B082X4RGNF

author: sairfan1
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 16, 2020, 01:42:23 am
content: Is there some newer version of RPi 4? if yes how can i identify

author: Gixy
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: July 16, 2020, 06:26:50 am
content: No harware versions. Just firmware upgrades which cure the thermal problems with CPU and USB controler.

author: ChunkyPastaSauce
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 16, 2020, 07:12:48 am
content: There are different pcb versions, 1.1 and 1.2. Most of the rpi4 sold before start of this year had problems with the USB charge port and I believe something to do with sdcard power.dmesg | grep "Pi 4 Model B Rev" gets the versionhttps://i1.wp.com/tutorial.cytron.io/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/compare-raspberry-pifront-v1.1-and-v1.2-1.jpg

author: cs.dk
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 16, 2020, 12:10:08 pm
content: Pi4 is way more powerful - Running two of them in Argon ONE cases. The fan only starts on really warm days (set it to start at 50C)This is the normal temperature while running (this is for 24H)

author: Renate
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 16, 2020, 01:20:57 pm
content: Yeah, I'd upgrade my RPi 3 to a RPi 4 but it seems so wasteful to have two HDMI on a headless server.

author: rstofer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 17, 2020, 01:49:15 pm
content: Here's another heatsink with DUAL fans:https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07TZQHXZ6

author: sairfan1
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 17, 2020, 06:12:34 pm
content: QuoteNot sure how many out there are using this one, but looks really cool, its also available on aliexpress i hope that one is also original

author: awallin
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 18, 2020, 08:06:54 am
content: at work we find the SD-cards die in about 6-12 months quite often. is there a good solution for that?a PI4 with SATA or M2 drive would be great..Now considering low-power intel NUCs instead.

author: sairfan1
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 18, 2020, 02:41:56 pm
content: I have Cubieboard it has sata and it can run linux though i never had chance to play with it