Possible to invent an electronic device without capital have any here done this? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Beamin
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 24, 2021, 11:09:52 pm
content: There are a lot of smart people here on this forum and I'm sure many of you are inventors. I won many invention awards as a school kid, but thats just for creativity and practicality. In 3rd grade I won with a "Drive by wire" where the steering wheel was connected to motors eliminating power steering racks pumps maintenance etc. I had a few more inventions I won over the years. So creativity runs in my blood and my family.So right now I have two great ideas which if I owned a company or had a degree and engineering lab with lots of capital I would be on my way right now.One invention finds lost pets specifically dogs and another is a simple idea where a group of soldiers would know in seconds where sniper fire or other fire is coming from using simple off the shelf technology that would cost a few hundred per unit or to be competitive with industry a couple thousand. I would like to give out the whole details but once its on the internet it becomes public info.I'm sure some here are inventors that had no resources and made it. I'll post some threads asking about things like I always do. FYI I have only been posting to my own posts because Im having a hard time seeing and dont want to flood the forum with a myriad of questions.BTW is there a way to invert the color on this forum? My iphone I can change almost everything to "dark mode" where you get that old school computer look black background white/colored text. Makes it 1000X easier to see. I know there is some wway in windows to invert but it inverts everything like video and pictures so then I cant see those. Come on microsoft apple figured it out...

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2021, 03:15:14 am
content: Many of the well known names in electronics begin with very little. I would say that was without capital, but of course, they did need some money.Here are four names that come to mind:Bill Hewlett (Hewlett-Packard)David Packard (Hewlett-Packard)Michael Dell (Dell Computer)Varian brothers (Varian Associates)

author: bob91343
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2021, 03:55:58 am
content: Times have changed. Nevertheless, inventions are welcome as long as they aren't just ideas. Investors want to see something that works, not plans or ideas. So you will probably have to build your idea and be able to demonstrate it. And you have to prove you aren't infringing on some patent.In other words, the technical part is not enough. You have to have a convincing presentation and convey your ideas with authority and salesmanship. Then you appeal to those whom you feel may have an interest and wherewithall to finance it.

author: sandalcandal
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 25, 2021, 04:55:44 am
content: Money/capital is out there and available for "free" if you know where to look and are willing to work for it (and of course you should be willing to work it). Starting our own business we were able to obtain tens of thousands of dollars which was certainly more than enough for us to develop proof-of-concept hardware and start getting "traction" despite the high costs of power electronics and ESS hardware. This was purely through local grants, without the need to give up equity/ownership or take out any sort of loan; though there were requirements for reporting and transparency obviously. This was also fairly recently and in Australia. The general impression I get is that entrepreneurship money is much easier to come by in the US.I'd suggest having a look around for any local small business or entrepreneurshipgrants. I see DoD awarding many grants to small US domestic businesses to produce proof-of-concepts (some of them quite questionable) so that might be a good idea to look into for your gunfire locator idea. They also will be able to give you plenty of good input with first hand experience using similar devices which should be invaluable in developing your product. Failing that, you might have to enter an arrangement where you give up ownership/equity i.e. get "investment" but you'll need to be properly and well prepared if you want to do that.I'd also suggest doing some reading (or maybe watching videos) to get some foundational knowledge of entrepreneurship. This book is more targeted towards Australia but I think the general principles are good and apply anywhere; the advice provided is solid and inline with advice I've received from many experienced entrepreneurs and business leaders.https://www.asx.com.au/documents/resources/EntrepreneursGuide_REV_5_16.pdfFor videos, some good sources areY Combinator, andSlidebean. Though I would caveat these are very Silicon Valley in perspective so if you don't live in Silicon Valley YMMV. Also plenty of people sharing their small business entrepreneurship experience on YouTube if you're looking to run something more moderate in scale.Also Shark Tank is a load of bullshit reality TV show. Don't think for a moment real world entrepreneurship is anything like what they represent there.Quote from: bob91343 on September 25, 2021, 03:55:58 amCertainly not enough to have a cool idea. You need to convince investors there is a market for your product (product-market fit), the amount you are asking for is commensurate to this market opportunity and most importantly that you (and your team) are capable of pulling through given the money. I don't think anything else has ever been the case but I wasn't alive and raising money 50 years agoThere are plenty of investors which have given talks published on Youtube describing what they are looking for in entrepreneurs in an effort to attract high quality investment opportunities.Edit: I'll also add that though not yet "successful" we've managed to develop commercial prototypes and obtain patents (which might satisfy OP's idea of "inventing") and done so as per OP's question; without personally having any "capital".

author: PaulAm
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2021, 02:27:10 pm
content: You're in the US so you should look into what's available from DARPA; they have many small business programs to encourage innovation.You can make yourself a small business by forming an LLC. Costs around $50 and there are online law firms to supply everything you need. Tax reporting is minimal until you start to make some money, but it gives you some cred.Get yourself a company email address to go along with the LLC. Again, there are cheap ways to do this. Practically no one will respond to a gmail address.The majority of small businesses fail but that doesn't mean people don't make money off them. I was involved in two startups; one failed and the other transitioned into something different but I did OK off of both of them. Watch venture capital though. Their game is to put out enough funds so they can control things when it starts to make money. Owners and founders are often pushed out at that point.Patent issues can be a killer. These days they are more to restrict innovation.

author: fourfathom
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2021, 02:51:18 pm
content: Quote from: PaulAm on September 25, 2021, 02:27:10 pmBut be aware that in most states there are annual filing fees for an LLC. In California it's $800. A few states have no filing fee.If money is really tight I would develop the invention as far as possible, to demonstrate feasibility, and *then* form the initial business structure. If you want to use other people's money then you will probably need to set up your "legal entity" first.

author: mawyatt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2021, 04:46:01 pm
content: Lots of good advice here. One thing to consider is "if you aren't willing to invest $ and time in your idea, why would you expect others to invest!!". After you've developed your idea to a point of viable demonstration with your own $ and time and consider outside funding, be very careful with the arrangement. Almost always the creators are the ones left without significant gain, the $ folks end up with all the pie!! It's been advised before to have a lawyer on your side help with the initial paperwork when seeking outside funding.There is mention of DARPA, be aware that usually when engaging in a USG agency that the "ownership" of the emerging technology has USG rights attached for limited use, usually direct military or "special" uses. They can even give your technology creations to others to produce for USG use, so be sure to study the regulations carefully before engaging with the USG for funding.BTW if your idea involves sniper location by means of gunshot signature time of arrival and phase, this technique has been employed for a number of years to locate gunshots in cities and urban areas I believe.Anyway, good luck with your adventures.Best,

author: RJSV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 27, 2021, 07:21:12 pm
content: Ha! SPOT ON DISCUSSION !(I) took up inventing, on an assembly line job that had lots of 'blank brain' time. Next, I rented an OFFICE SUITE, in seedy downtown Hayward (pop. 210, 000).My patent attorney, well, he was a quiet drunk: they don't always show their colors, publicly. But he was pretty good lawyer, later: HE BEAT ME IN SMALL CLAIMS COURT.But it's important to take such matters, of the past, in a light hearted, even humorous manner.Heck, think of the (little) stories I could tell. Extorted for Cash, by a 'crack-head', all while assembling and proof reading my own US PATENT APPLICATION.(PLS SEE: US 20030172205 )One maybe clever thing I did, to get some document contents organized: Presented a flow-chart style drawing, instead of a table, that way a set of directional arrows can be included, for associating various sub-system components.In fact, there are some (mechanical) Patent work that deals only with associated 'components', and interconnection, with virtually no care for actual device. (Especially in nanotech world).At any rate, my special interest has a lot to do with the 'run-down' cities, doing business anyway, in spite of some 'indignities', (like crime risks).NICE TOPIC, really.Rick

author: Just_another_Dave
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 27, 2021, 09:35:25 pm
content: Quote from: sandalcandal on September 25, 2021, 04:55:44 amThis is a really good recommendation. Most entrepreneurs I know which have been successful started with small amounts of capital provided by grants or prizes.Learning to make a prototype with little money is also part of the process. If your project requires millions of euros just to be started, it will be nearly impossible to achieve unless you already have that money

author: MadScientist
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 27, 2021, 09:51:03 pm
content: As a serial startup , hardware is much more difficult then software as the transition from prototype curio to any sort of volume requires considerable capital and VCs typically don’t like sinking money into something with large upfront commitments and potentially delayed income streams.Software has a much better chance as trial markets can be acquired and product interest stimulatedIt can be very easy to raise about €50K , I did it locally through development grants. But this is a drop in the ocean for any sort of hardware development. The issue is getting the next €250k that’s the very difficult phase ( the VCs call it the funding valley of death )Don’t get advise from people in the initial funding phase , look at those successfully climbing out of the valley of death phase.Note references to entrepreneurs like Dave Packard etc are entirely mis guided, these were , like Zuckerberg, simply in the right place at the right time. If your that lucky , fine. But for every Dave Packard , there are thousands of unknowns that didn’t make it.My advice , funnel the money into building and attracting a team , don’t worry about developing hardware. VCs invest in people not things.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 27, 2021, 11:17:12 pm
content: Ideas are a dime a dozen, if you want to get anywhere you'll have to come up with a prototype or at the very least a proof of concept.

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 27, 2021, 11:22:15 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on September 27, 2021, 11:17:12 pmYes and mostly no. The real money is made in the market (i.e., sales). Very few patent owners per se made it compared to great and ruthless sales, like Dell, Musk, Bezos, and Gates.

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 27, 2021, 11:34:03 pm
content: Quote from: sandalcandal on September 25, 2021, 04:55:44 amIt was better in earier days. Uber and AirBNB were on Sharks Tank when nobody knew them. I remember them 'cause at the time i could not make sense of their company names in relation to their businesses.But these days yes, those "sharks" will not even put their glasses on if you already not making half a million dollars in sales.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 28, 2021, 12:56:16 am
content: Quote from: jpanhalt on September 27, 2021, 11:22:15 pmWell yes, but the discussion was around inventing a device, not coming up with a way to make a lot of money, in which case yes, you're right, inventing a device is usually not the easiest way to make a lot of money.

author: sandalcandal
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 28, 2021, 01:48:51 am
content: Quote from: Bud on September 27, 2021, 11:34:03 pmI don't remember anything on either Uber or AirBnB being on Shark Tank and a quick search seems to confirm that neither them ever were. There are plenty of other companies which have appeared and have later been successful though (obviously most successful ones didn't do deals with the Sharks). The many of the offers given (particularly earlier on) are completely non-sensical e.g. equity for money worth less than the assets of the company, just get a business loan instead?Early Shark Tank was even worse, I remember having discussion with other entrepreneurs years ago and hearing that they take 5% equity or 2% royalties just to appear on the show. So of course any company which knows they're worth a damn would never bother to appear. They've since changed that policy a while ago howeverhttps://www.inc.com/will-yakowicz/mark-cuban-forces-shark-tank-to-remove-equity-clause.htmlQuote from: MadScientist on September 27, 2021, 09:51:03 pmThis 100%. Though if you have no plan and no prototype, they're likely to judge you poorly as people unless you are already well known to them (unlikely for a new entrepreneur).Quote from: james_s on September 28, 2021, 12:56:16 amPatents are tickets to sue (or threaten to sue) people. Patents have near zero value in and of themselves. You make money providing goods and services to people, not by sitting on patents.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 28, 2021, 01:50:58 am
content: Quote from: sandalcandal on September 28, 2021, 01:48:51 amNo argument from me there. I think patents are mostly worthless, especially for an individual inventor. I have never suggested anyone go out and patent something.

author: sandalcandal
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 28, 2021, 02:02:34 am
content: Quote from: james_s on September 28, 2021, 01:50:58 amYes, not disagreeing with you either. Just elaborating further on why: having "ideas" is less important than actually being able to deliver on a desirable product/service.

author: RJSV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 08, 2021, 05:20:40 am
content: Oh, also I wanted to say, about patent protection:With (my) computer training system, I did not want to face a situation, where someone else got wind of my idea (s), put forth their own application, after which I could face a real, actual shut-down, of my own work !A usually distant possibility, but too wild to think of, my 'precious' work didn't come easy...Certainly, at the scale I was working, the patent 'Disclosure' temporary program offered no help. The application itself was jumbo sized, and took over two years to assemble.I also had a great invention / consumer product idea, that, by opposite, involved very little innovation:A POCKET SHOWER WITH TANKS.That little hand-held shower device had a vacume suction water puller system, (for the dirty), and even included LITHIUM battery water warmer shower head.ALL for use on the train, bus whatever... (Actually that's not too appetizing lol, Rick).

author: Berni
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 08, 2021, 05:37:03 am
content: Well you can see one example of a small company having a go at a huge undertaking of becoming the next optical HD video format that Bluray ultimately became:They really did try hard to make it happen, and even got some early hardware out the door(tho mostly in the form of a special modified off the shelf DVD drive). But as you can imagine this is not easy to pull off, especially when the big guns that fight these format wars come in. As a result they flopped so badly that they even forget to mention them in articles about the failed HD video disc formats that lost the war.

author: Beamin
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2021, 11:18:34 pm
content: Quote from: sandalcandal on September 25, 2021, 04:55:44 amI used to own my own business and it was so hard to get investors and capital to buy cars, we need 10's of thousands a week.My "Shot spotter" would also work in cities with devices on telephone poles to alert police. I really want to make this before some one else realizes how easily It could be done.

author: Beamin
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2021, 11:40:53 pm
content: Quote from: sandalcandal on September 28, 2021, 01:48:51 amMy father made a shitload off patents on computer devices in the late 70's early 80's but he sucked at business, one of his devices is used around the world to this day and he sold it with no royalties. idiot. I rule at sales have been for twenty years often the top three where I worked I know how to BS people and the psychology...

author: Beamin
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 10, 2021, 12:21:18 am
content: I need to pull an elizabeth holmes less the fraud.

author: PlainName
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 10, 2021, 12:41:31 pm
content: QuoteThis is already being done, isn't it?https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gunfire_locator

author: nigelwright7557
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 10, 2021, 03:16:19 pm
content: If you have little capital then expand slowly.That way you get money coming in to spend.I have designed about 20 hardware/software systems and they all worked well that way.

author: Buriedcode
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 10, 2021, 05:11:27 pm
content: I have no advice that is better than any of the replies here, so I'll spare you my two cents. Whilst ideas are the start, and can often fail to bear fruit, but need to be tried, I'll just drop this link:https://www.riskology.co/idea-guy/I have known several people who have their pet ideas for invetions/patents, and the ones who are secretive about it - even one who remortgaged his house to keep the rights to his ideas - have never made any progress. You can't do everything alone.

author: jmelson
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 10, 2021, 05:28:12 pm
content: Quote from: jpanhalt on September 25, 2021, 03:15:14 amI'm certainly not in the same league as those guys, but I am running a small business from home, mostly making motion control boards for small shops/home shops. Seehttp://pico-systems.com/osc2.5/catalog/index.phpto take a look at the kind of stuff I make. I have never used outside capital or borrowed against my home. None of this stuff required very serious lab development, however. Just a concept, skecth up a schematic and design a board, buy some parts and build a prototype.Jon

author: westfw
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2021, 08:49:48 pm
content: Quote"Inventing" is seldom a viable "business model." You have to provide what the customer wants. In the examples of your ideas, customers don't want plans for a dog or shot finder; they want a service that finds dogs or spots shots. Those are much more complex to provide. An actual product. Manufacturing. Pre-sales support. Sales. Installation SUPPORT. Post-sales SUPPORT, reliable SUPPORT. Oh - no deserting the people with shot-spotters to go off and find dogs, either; if you're going to support LE and/or Military, they'll want some evidence that the tech providers are going to be around for at least a decade.I too have an idea for a cheap shot spotter. It's just an audio detector, an arduino-class CPU with GPS (gets location and does time sync), plus a comm link to central computing that can take a set of of "bang heard at x,y at t=h:m:s.us" and triangulate. Easy Peasy. Fits in a lunchbox. The compute part can happen on your phone. Shucks, you can use a phone for the "comm" part and do the calcs in each unit, too.The fact that real units are apparently more complex than that PROBABLY means that I don't fully understand the problem(s) involved. I mean, "how much are those weatherproof housings and microphones? Oh Crap!" And what does it take for its logs to be legally admissible? (is that even necessary?) (Is someone going to sue me for violating 4th amendment rights? Listening to and locating their noises? (https://www.npr.org/2019/04/23/716248823/court-says-using-chalk-on-tires-for-parking-enforcement-violates-constitution)) WTH costume do I wear to impress LE and Military during the sales meetings? And wait - does someone already have patents on the underlying ideas for this? (how many?) How many LAWYERS am I going to need?I've got several Arduino-like designs "out there", and I'm painfully aware that I can't actually manufacture ANY of them at a "price that the market will bear", not to mention that I really have no interest in doing manufacturing and sales and related business stuff. So I'm happy if ever ONE other hobbyist orders PCBs from China and builds one for themselves... I'd be ecstatic if some vendors "stole" the design and it started to show up on Aliexpress at prices I could never hope to achieve.As for "intellectual property protection" - One of the effect means to protect an idea is to PUBLISH it. That prevents other people from patenting the same thing. If you're lucky, maybe some company will approach you to license the idea for one-time-cash or maybe royalties (less likely. Having to pay royalties really sucks, from a company perspective.) Maybe they'll offer you a job. If you're unlucky you might get a cease-and-desist "we already OWN that idea, and we think you're leaking trade secrets!" :-(The whole "I have a great idea but don't want to say anything about it" is probably the WORST IP PROTECTION EVER.

author: ejeffrey
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2021, 09:24:57 pm
content: In terms of getting investment capital: there is plenty of it out there (too much by some accounts) at pretty much every scale from a a $10,000 kickstarter project to $100M venture capital investment to a $500M SPAC.Everyone else has covered that you need more than an idea, you need a prototype and eventually a product and a business. However there are a couple other things you need, especially if you are going to raise capital.First you need the product people want. Obviously people want to find their dogs and people want to avoid gunfire. That is great. But you have to make sure that your product will actually solve their problem. It has to work in the conditions they want, at a cost they are willing to pay, in a way that makes sense to them. and it has to be better than the alternatives they are currently using. Too many "brilliant" inventions are technically clever but solve a problem different than the one their customers actually have. VCs will want to make sure you understand your market and your customer.Second, raising money is a skill and it is different from engineering. Most engineers are bad at it and many of them don't even realize it is a skill. You need someone who can both do the financial analysis of your product and present it in a way that makes sense to investors. This is mostly basic stuff like how bit is the potential market? How much would people likely pay for this? How much will it cost us to produce? How easy would it be for someone to undercut us? How big of a team will we need to run this operation and how much money do we need to raise to have a shot at succeeding in the market? Investors want to know this, and they want to see that you have done your homework and that you have the experience that your projections can be trusted.I have a friend who invented a dog toy. It's nothing special, but he built prototypes, gave them to friends who gave good reviews, worked out how to manufacture it, patented it, and trademarked both the name and appearance it and made industry contacts. He eventually sold it to a major pet toy manufacturer and at least for several years it was sold at every petco in the US, it may still be. It's possible to do this, but it takes a lot more than just having an idea.

author: Beamin
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2021, 09:28:21 pm
content: Quote from: dunkemhigh on October 10, 2021, 12:41:31 pmThis is implemented differently It uses 95% cheap off the shelf components/systems and combines them through software. So the parts are already made, like instead of rolling your own PSU (See eevblog"worlds crappiest tablet" where dave cant stop laughing at a medical device made to be a real production product. Not even duct tape but cheaper scotch tape hold together the custom PSU where it had to have been much more parts and labor then buying off shelf PSU's, GTW one of my fav videos. Its like the crosby record players: to save about 0.01$ per unit on screws they hold the whole thing together with not even hot snott but low temp. hot glues) you just buy a lambda PSU with the specs you need.So even if someone already has the idea this is better because of production cost and taking hard, specific custom hardware thats; expensive, hard to test and assemble with a high BOM uses software to tie it all together. That really the idea its making a better wheel WAY cheaper and have run flat tires.Quote from: wikipediaSo you could sell this to the afgan army who cant afford other systems.ALSO doesn't it suck waking up at 3:00AM with an awesome idea only to find some one just created it within the last few years, AND got rich off of it? The storyof my life. Like I got a second place invention award in elementry school to the kid that invented the little plastic thing that attaches your cap to your car so dizzy drivers dont leave it on the pump or pump. Thats a patent that you can get rich off of just licensing it.Ben at applied science youtube said "And like every good idea I seem to have , I look it up and someone just patented it"

author: PlainName
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2021, 10:13:59 pm
content: QuoteBeen there, done that. Had a brilliant idea (non-electronic), ran up prototypes (actually, cooked them), grabbed the appropriate really clever domain names, etc. Tried it out on friends who were mostly positive, then found out it'd already been an ongoing Thing for some while and I just wasn't in the right demographic to come across it before.Also had a great idea to fix a problem a new way using better technology than the practice du jour but made the mistake of discussing the issues with a user/purveyor of the old way. Decided to patent it only to find the git had beat me to it, even though he didn't know anything about the technology (he basically patented every method I'd vaguely mentioned). Still got a patent out of it, though, which suitably impressed my folks (one thing patents are good for).

author: westfw
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2021, 11:26:02 pm
content: QuoteI invented web services. "Gee, it ought to be possible for someone who can write HTML and has a fast internet connection to create web pages and host them for small companies that can't/don't. (too bad my expertise is down in the "putting bytes into packets" area. Oh well; somone will probably do it.)" (in fact, I'm pretty sure people were already doing it at the time I thought of it. I just hadn't noticed.)(and again, an Idea like that is very far from being a viable product._

author: mawyatt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2021, 03:13:28 am
content: Lots of good stories of inventions that didn't pay off. Here's one that did. In the early 90s a couple colleagues approached about starting a company to develop GPS based electronic monitoring by means of the "ankle bracelet". Since I wasn't interested in managing things later on after the design phase I declined and said I might consider helping out as a consultant. They formed the company and asked about my consulting fee, I said a Porsche 911 would work (that's the red 911 993)!!They had a brilliant product idea as well as a brilliant business model and staff. The puppet president was a former state governor with lots of political connections, and got all sorts of "free" publicity like on Good Morning American, and national exposure. The business model was to have no cost to the state/county but have the user pay the bracelet fee. A condition of "parole on the bracelet" was that the user could not miss a payment, or back to jail.The initial product development cost was under $2M, and the company changed hands a few times eventually being acquired by a foreign company, then sold to 3M for ~$250M USD!! A few unethical and unscrupulous things transpired as the company changed hands and my former colleagues did not receive their fair share of the rewards IMO.Anyway, as others have said, just having a great idea is only part of the success story, you'll need additional support and some luck. However, watch out for the VCs or "Angles", they'll take your idea, help you develop it and they'll profit from it, but leave little for all your hard work and creativity.Best,

author: mawyatt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2021, 01:33:32 pm
content: Another interesting somewhat related success story. Back ~2000 DARPA funded a program called SUO SAS (Small Unit Operations Situation Awareness System) to develop a self forming ad-hoc network with various battlefield radios including aircraft, vehicles and solders. The general idea was to have a traveling wireless network that is self forming & healing with very sophisticated and secure routing protocols. This was so successful that a commercial spin off company was formed called MeshNetworks and a couple colleagues headed up the adaption of SUO SAS for commercial use. We got involved to implement a single Silicon chip for the entire radio, but that's another story.In 2004 Motorola acquired MeshNetworks and all the $ investors made out, however the IP investors (former colleagues) did nothttps://www.eetimes.com/motorola-buys-wireless-mesh-networking-startup/Another good example of getting legal contacts and agreements in place before becoming involved with outside $ investors.Best,

author: ebastler
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2021, 07:08:24 pm
content: Quote from: Beamin on October 11, 2021, 09:28:21 pmThen what you have is not an "invention", I'm afraid. Just taking someone else's existing concept and making it cheaper is called "cost-down", "knock-off", or "patent infringement", depending on the exact circumstances.And the big guys in this space do have patents, and I am sure they would be inclined to enforce them. And I'm afraid they would not even let you use the "shot spotter" name...https://www.shotspotter.com

author: RJSV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 15, 2021, 12:25:14 am
content: I was thinking: Electron Microscopes now somewhat 'more' available, than 1960's, things like that. Certainly need partner(s), in bigger project.However, in BIO-TECHNOLOGY, maybe uhnnh-uhh no!They'd skimp on the 'clean-up', andThere We GO Sister : Covid III here we come !!!

author: nigelwright7557
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 16, 2021, 06:44:02 pm
content: I have designed loads of stuff over the years to sell.I write the software, design hardware and build them all myself.They tend to be small systems but that keeps costs/risks down.You can quickly get out of your depth financially if your not careful.Like making a thousand only to find you only sell 5.I tend to ramp up slowly and see how it goes.I have found I need to be flexible as some things sell good for a while then die off.You have to move with the markets.

author: EPAIII
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 18, 2021, 08:47:11 am
content: It seems that no one has said anything about the colors used to display these BB pages. So I will address that first.I doubt that the BB software allows the readers to change colors. If anyone knows of a way, I would love to know about it. But one way you can change how the text is displayed by simply selecting it. I do this all the time to highlight the line of text after I have read it. That way, I can easily follow the next line on the screen and not either skip a line or read one line twice. This can be done for an entire message (post) or even for a full screen of text.Another way would be to use the browser's settings. I use Firefox and in the menu found at the top right corner of the browser's window (well, just below the "X") there is a "Settings" choice which has a "Language and Appearance" section which allows the user to change display colors. Of course, this would change the colors for all internet pages, not just those in this BB.As for inventing something, the costs of just inventing it can vary widely from a few cents to many millions of dollars. It all depends on the nature of the item being invented.I have had a number of ideas that I considered to be good and worthy of being converted into a product. For many of them I have constructed prototypes. Those prototypes have probably ranged in cost from under a dollar to many hundreds of dollars. But building a prototype is only the first step in the invention process.The next step you face is how you will market (sell) your invention. This is not a trivial decision. You can manufacture and sell it yourself. You can enlist others to do either or both of these. And your costs can vary widely depending on what choices you make.Then, you must decide how you will protect your idea. Patents can cost $10,000 or more - most likely more. Legal advice is also expensive. Some think that they can just mail the idea to themselves in a sealed envelope which is delivered with a receipt. DON'T fall for that one. Any decent corporate attorney will tear that to pieces in short order. You are going to be well over $10,000 by the time you ONLY have the ammunition to sue anyone who violates your patent. You still have to pay the legal fees to defend it: $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.Or you can just hope that you can keep the details secret (a trade secret) while you rush into production and sales. If it is a really great idea, you will see others, from other countries (China) selling your device and probably holding a patent on it in their own country. Then your only option would be to defend your right to sell it. Or abandon that product and move on to another. It is almost impossible to live in an advanced country and fight the prices that a Chinese company can offer on a product unless you are able to both patent it world wide and defend those patents in courts, also world wide.And sales holds it's own expenses. Advertising does not come cheap. I have worked for an ad company and $50,000 was a starting point. Yes, there are inexpensive ways to advertise on the internet. I have had phone conversations with them about products I was selling. My side of the conversation was "I will gladly pay a fixed amount for each sale you can generate." There response was, "CLICK". They want to be paid regardless of results.Some companies will actually handle the manufacture and sale of your invention and pay you a percentage of sales. If you have a hot idea, this can work. But finding the right company can be difficult. And you do lose a lot of control. I have entered into agreements of this sort but have seen little income from them. Part of the reason for the poor sales, at least in my opinion, was some bad decisions on how the items were marketed. But I could not insist on those details.I am not saying that you should not "invent" something. What I am saying is that it is not easy.I can also attest to the FACT that I have made a LOT more money by writing about my ideas, thereby placing them in the public domain, than by selling them. Magazine articles can generate income. And you can also sell the parts (PCBs, etc.) for your idea that would be difficult for the average reader to make on their own.

author: nuh
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: October 22, 2021, 07:31:58 am
content: I think the most important capital is time and knowledge, but a little money wouldn't be bad eitherGood luck.