EEVBlog video idea... Make a Galaxy Note 7 catch fire....... - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Smokey
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 01:15:08 am
content: Get your hands on one. Check out the battery circuitry... Then stress it and see if you can get it to blow up. That would get a TON of youtube hits.

author: Brumby
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 01:39:57 am
content: With a couple of million Note 7's and only a few dozen failures, the odds aren't good.... and anything you did to 'encourage' the failure would simply neutralise any conclusions you might come up with, since the failure did not occur under normal use.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 01:53:43 am
content: Quote from: Brumby on October 13, 2016, 01:39:57 amYep.Same thing with the Hoverboards catching fire. It would be like finding a needle in a haystack.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 01:55:05 am
content: Quote from: wilfred on October 13, 2016, 01:37:46 amThe cause is imperfections in the battery manufacture. Finding it exactly require tearing down countless units and having intimate access to the manufacturing line.

author: retiredcaps
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 02:03:35 am
content: A more generic and likely timeless video topic would be something likeWhat makes a "battery" catch on fire?This could be applied to cell, laptop, etc batteries. Dave could explain all the complexities of- charge circuits- battery chemistry- manufacturing tolerance- fail safe operation- shielding- heat- abuse- etc, etc

author: Smokey
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 02:19:12 am
content: There is a chance that there just wasn't enough design margin on something. Maybe a little overvolt is all it takes. Or they used a cheap protection circuit or something. Hook it up to a meter and see the actual charge voltages and currents and what the profiles look like.If nothing else it would be interesting to see how much abuse the battery system could actually survive.::EDIT:: At this point Dave is kind of the internet battery expert anyway...

author: Smokey
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 02:20:52 am
content: Quote from: retiredcaps on October 13, 2016, 02:03:35 amTimeless??? You gotta be kidding!! Ride the wave. Title the video:"10 things you didn't know about the Galaxy Note 7 battery that could kill you RIGHT NOW!"

author: retiredcaps
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 02:23:54 am
content: Quote from: Smokey on October 13, 2016, 02:20:52 amThat depends if Dave is an ambulance chaser or not. Certainly, he could have way more views if he did more pop culture technology/electronics with click bait titles. If he did though, he might find a certain portion of his core viewership leave and replaced with questionable supporters.

author: Refrigerator
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 04:26:59 am
content: How about we send one to the Hydraulic Press Channel ?

author: Red Squirrel
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 04:56:01 am
content: That would actually make a cool video, to do a teardown and speculate on what the cause may be. I imagine it would be hard to find if it's a software fault though, but could maybe monitor it while it's charging or discharging to look for any weird spikes in voltage or current.May need to rent a bomb shelter for this one.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 05:50:39 am
content: Quote from: Smokey on October 13, 2016, 02:20:52 amThat would actually work

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 05:52:19 am
content: Quote from: Red Squirrel on October 13, 2016, 04:56:01 amProbably would if I had one.

author: station240
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 09:38:59 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on October 13, 2016, 05:52:19 amI'd imagine the post office wouldn't let anyone post one to you.http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-10-12/samsung-ceases-note-7-but-unlikely-to-suffer-permanent-damage/7924972QuoteGiven that Samsung must have had more than 25K of these phones in one place before they were sold, it's clear you have to start using the device before it can fail.http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/12/business/international/samsung-galaxy-note7-terminated.html?_r=0QuoteQuoteSamsung cannot even get the phones to blow up in the lab, what chance has Dave got ?

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 11:13:59 am
content: Quote from: wilfred on October 13, 2016, 02:30:46 amNo charging or protection circuitry can stop thermal runaway in a LiIon battery if it's susceptible by design/manufacture. i.e. an internal short/process that causes thermal runaway by nature of the exothermic process.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 11:17:35 am
content: Quote from: station240 on October 13, 2016, 09:38:59 amNone.Best I could do is put a nail through it (which is actually an industry standard test) and then waffle on about exothermic reactions, maybe with thermal camera running.https://www.tuv-sud-america.com/uploads/images/1392328973947243720521/designing-meaningful-lithium-ion-abuse-tests.pdfhttp://energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2014/03/f13/es142_sriramulu_2013_p.pdf

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 02:16:37 pm
content: Noone seems to be talking about analysis of what apps were on the failed phones. I think it is not only the battery charge rate but also discharge rate that needs to be analyzed. My iPhone 5 for example gets as hot during use as when it is charged. E.g. Clearly, this happens when browsing java bloated web sites. It could be a weird combination of applications causing some sort of power glitches even in turned off state. Just thinking.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 03:18:59 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on October 13, 2016, 11:13:59 amI read in a news article that the original battery got compressed which caused a short in some cases. With the newer batteries they don't know what is wrong but it is a different problem. Either way it seems Samsung has pushed the boundaries of technology too far.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 11:10:27 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on October 13, 2016, 03:18:59 pmIt's either:- bending/compression causing physical damage and internal short- Overcharging causing internal short due to some unknonw chemisty/manufacturing thing- Other manufacturing issue from the get-go leading to a short. The units that have failed are right on the edge of the manufacturing bell curve.All roads lead to an internal short.

author: Don Hills
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 11:30:15 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on October 13, 2016, 11:17:35 amIt'd be just your luck to have the same result that Clive did...

author: Brumby
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 01:34:30 am
content: Quote from: Don Hills on October 13, 2016, 11:30:15 pmSamsung need to sign up the manufacturer of that battery ... fast!

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 01:47:00 am
content: Not everyone has the resources of UL: (warning slow on slow connections and 30 second ad )http://www.nbcnews.com/nightly-news/video/samsung-battery-recall-draws-more-attention-to-smartphone-fires-785548355963?cid=eml_nnn_20161013In the talk, I believe he said Samsung's batteries do not have protection in them. ?I do not think Dave is going to blow up his lab. I guess he could put them inside old test equipment and then say "Don't take it apart - Blow it up" !

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 01:56:51 am
content: Quote from: wilfred on October 13, 2016, 10:41:12 pmI guess processor load?Just stating the fact, the best way to drain the battery for me (iPhone 5) is to go to a news web site, practically any news web site (they all garbage).EDIT: on EEVBlog Forum site I can stay for long time, it does not have that overheat effect

author: stj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 02:46:01 am
content: are the "world market" battery's made in japan, or korea?because the phones sold in china use chinese battery's - and not a single incident with them!

author: D3f1ant
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 02:59:09 am
content: No they having the same problem in china, and have been since the beginning.http://qz.com/805991/samsung-ssnlf-will-recall-190084-galaxy-note-7-phones-in-china-and-consumers-there-are-angry/

author: 3roomlab
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 03:25:57 am
content: Dave? remember the episodes you make with the microphone expert Doug Ford? Is there a local uni prof that is willing to go on YT with you to make a video about batteries voltages limitations charges and then some controlled bangs? Or do it with an Australian Lithium factory expert, or some interesting stuff like Zcell? I think battery storage alone is a huge topic and very interesting, and it helps alot with the electrical side of design when understood well.

author: Brumby
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 04:07:05 am
content: Quote from: 3roomlab on October 14, 2016, 03:25:57 amThat would be a better idea than taking on the Note 7 directly.Dave ... Do you think this approach could fly?

author: Red Squirrel
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 06:16:23 am
content: Quote from: Don Hills on October 13, 2016, 11:30:15 pmThat's odd, I've seen a few other videos where I really figured the battery would explode but didn't, including hydraulic press channel actually crushing one. I've also seen them violently explode in other cases. I guess there are different designs that have some kind of build in mechanism to fail more gracefully even to physical damage? Maybe some kind of layer that reacts in a way to suppress the heat?