Investing in DMM. First year uni student.  - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / beginners

author: i997219
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 03:18:34 am
content: Hi! I got accepted into a Computer/Network Engineering course at uni, and I understand that I'll need a DMM. Just watched EEVblog #75 - Digital Multimeter Buying Guide for Beginners and I was wondering which one I DMM I should get.I really don't mind shelling out a bit as an investment, but I'm not really sure what I should be buying. I'm not sure what kind I things I'll be facing in later year classes and that if I should buy an expensive one if it'll last me.Live in Australia, so any help would be great!(Also, a solder iron suggestion would be good too, but I'm going to be searching the youtube page for that too).

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 03:30:18 am
content: How much do you want to spend? The best mid range buy IMHO and that of many others is the Brymen BM257S. It costs $138 USD shipped to your door. It should cover almost anything you need a multimeter for and will last a ling time.http://www.ebay.com/itm/Brymen-BM257s-Digital-Multimeter-6000-count-Brand-New-Fluke-alternative-/200922627340Dave Jones will also be selling a similar model to that with his name on it, but I don't know when or at what price.

author: grifftech
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 03:54:56 am
content: For low voltage a “one-hung-low" will be fine.

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 04:27:11 am
content: Quote from: grifftech on November 19, 2015, 03:54:56 amYes, probably. The UT136B would probably do the OP well for a few years as well:http://www.ebay.com/itm/UNI-T-UT136B-Auto-Range-Digital-Multimeter-AC-DC-Frequency-Resistance-Tester-/111534967989?hash=item19f8008cb5:g:T8gAAOSw2XFUe-QOHow long will it last?Would it be good enough until the OP learns what he really needs? Probably. The BM257S I recommended is something I can recommend and feel good about it. This one too as long as the user knows its limits and that it will probably be a very short term "investment".

author: i997219
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 05:50:43 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on November 19, 2015, 03:29:19 amI think the network stuff is a bit more fundamental than doing Cisco type stuff (http://www1.rmit.edu.au/programs/structure/BH072AUSCY) could be wrong though. Hoping it's more circuit designing network stuff or computing stuff.The Fluke 101 looks good.Quote from: Lightages on November 19, 2015, 03:30:18 amThis is the perfect kind of price range will to go. Going to really look into this.Quote from: Lightages on November 19, 2015, 04:27:11 amThis honestly seems like a good work-around. tbh, I'm not too sure how this course will fold out. "Is it networking as in learning cisco stuff and getting certification, or like more fundamental?"Thanks for suggestions.

author: nowlan
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 06:21:23 am
content: A lot of the pure electronics look to be electives for that degree.Looks to be some embedded systems. I think you be more keen on a saelig.The multimeter will be more for checking system rails, 3,5,12volt. and continuity.

author: tec5c
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 06:32:40 am
content: I have done nearly all of the subjects in your course, well, the equivalent versions offered by different Universities in Australia.Getting a DMM isbarelygoing to benefit your coursework studies. The only time I have ever used a DMM during labs is to check that various bias circuitry is as expected (verifying simulated values) for some analog circuits. Which by looking at your course outline, is dependent on the subjects you choose in the 3rd and 4th years of the course.I can say with 99% certainty that none of the networking subjects are going to get anywhere near using a DMM. Also, I highly, highly doubt that you will get CISCO certification out of the degree, no matter which subjects you choose.Getting a DMM and/or soldering iron is NOT going to directly aid your studies. However, having the basic skill set of how to use both pieces of equipment is essential for any half decent engineer to be.

author: mtdoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 06:36:20 am
content: The Fluke 101 cannot measure current. It would be a terrible choice as a first DMM IMO.If you can afford it, I'd reccomend the Brymen 257s.

author: mtdoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 06:58:44 am
content: Regardless of his major, if he wants to learn electrronics, he is going to want to measure current at some point. I think that with all the good full featured DMMs available, it makes no sense to buy one of the few meters that cannot measure current. The Fluke 101 is meant as a rugged,pocketmeter and it is a good one. It is not, however, a full featured electronics meter.

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 07:20:07 am
content: Nobody ever complained about having quality tools. This is reason enough to buy something like a BM257S. If the OP really doesnt want to spend that much, then that is his choice. We can only make suggestions. If the cheapest route is wanted then something has been suggested.If the OP wants to buy something that will serve him/her for a long time and can be used for learning more and is built to last, who can argue?

author: tron9000
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 09:34:31 am
content: Quote from: i997219 on November 19, 2015, 03:18:34 amFirst off congratulations!secondly, are you wanting buy on so you can do work at home from uni, or are you under the impression that you need one to do your work?cos most labs like the one I look after have DMM's - loads of them. If you have to supply your own: that's very strange! I'd be quite put out if I had to buy my own to do the coursework if I'd forked out a small fortune in tuition fees.I have had a few students ask me about soldering irons too, most of them say they can't afford a decent temp controlled one, but can afford the knock off's on ebay - which I find are the same price as a decent Antex soldering pencil you plug into the mains:I find its a toss up:low quality, some some degree of temp control that may fail in a few months orhigh quality construction, but no temp control and are limited to the work you can do - small PCB traces would suffer and run the risk of damaging your workall depends on how much your willing to spend/invest

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 09:36:52 am
content: Quote from: Lightages on November 19, 2015, 03:30:18 amVery soon, supposedly, I need to chase the shipment.It will be less than that price.UPDATE: Was supposed to be early Dec for shipment, still haven't got confirmation that it is still on track.With any luck I will have an EEVblog branded meter for sale before xmas.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 09:39:25 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on November 19, 2015, 06:48:32 amA multimeter by definition measures multiple things. Current measurement is as almost basic as voltage and resistance.

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 10:56:57 am
content: The university and the labs in the dorm had way better equipment than what I could afford back then. I wouldnt spend money on equipment just in case, there will be way more money spent on unforseen stuff like food. After uni, you will be able to afford something decent. Unless of course you are swimming in money like Scrooge McDuck.

author: Stupid Beard
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 11:01:17 am
content: Quote from: tron9000 on November 19, 2015, 09:34:31 amMan, that brings back memories. That was my first and second iron. I got the second one because it was easier to just buy a new iron than it was to replace the tip on the first one when it went. I don't remember why that was.I remember getting really annoyed at the cord length. It was always too short and restricting, and since the power socket was on the floor the cord would always pull it in that direction.Looks like I still have one of them dangling off a shelf where it's likely been sat for over 15 years.

author: tec5c
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 11:08:49 am
content: Quote from: NANDBlog on November 19, 2015, 10:56:57 am+1

author: rgawron
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 03:52:11 pm
content: I would suggest FLUKE 114, I have one and I'm happy.It's really, really solid made, should serve you for years, input protection is OK, the continuity tester works great (very fast, latching), has auto-ranging, has bar-graph, resistance, DC and AC voltage, min/max/avg, hold button - IMHO all useful things for a (handheld) multimeter. Contrast of the LCD is too low - that's a disadvantage for me. This multimeter doesn't measure current (higher models from this series do, but I don't remember accuracy/range - people on the Internet complain about it). It's generally designed for electricians (has low impedance mode but lacks many features like capacity measurements, data logging etc), not electronics, but I think, it's still a good option.http://www.fluke.com/fluke/r0en/digital-multimeters/fluke-114.htm?pid=55992If later you will want more precision, data logging, or other more advanced options, you may always buy a bench multimeter, if you will want to look how the signal change you can buy an oscilloscope. Different tool for a different job.

author: retiredcaps
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 06:11:21 pm
content: Quote from: rgawron on November 19, 2015, 03:52:11 pmThe Fluke 114 also lacks a diode test function.

author: tec5c
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 09:00:15 pm
content: To the OP.I believe I have a Fluke 77 (can confirm the model later on) laying around somewhere which I basically never use (it's the backup to my others), if you are interested I would be willing to sell it for a small price that's within your budget. Note that I don't have any accessories for it, unfortunately can't even add in some probes sorry, so it would literally be just the meter itself.I am in Sydney. If you're interested, let me know.

author: KL27x
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 09:40:39 pm
content: A meter that lasts, huh?Unless you work on rooftops or power lines or enjoy the sport of bungiejumping/component-testing, just about any meter that costs $5-10.00 will probably last... the rest of your life.I was gifted a Fluke 117(?), and I have never used it. For what I do, I have as much need for a Fluke as a bullet-proof calculator.I primarily use a 25.00 Uni pen meter. When I need a DMM with banana jacks, an Amazon special off-brand that has a large easy to read display. I still have my first Sperry Pocket Pro I bought on Ebay for $5.00. It still works fine. The most important criteria for my meters is ergonomics.And one thing about multimeters. It is much more useful to have two cheap meters than the Greatest-Meter-in-the-World.

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 19, 2015, 11:34:30 pm
content: Quote from: KL27x on November 19, 2015, 09:40:39 pmReally? Not even a Fluke can be said will to last the majority of anyone's life........ (given the OP has at least 50 years left)Quote from: KL27x on November 19, 2015, 09:40:39 pmGood for you. To many other people, if not most other, the most important criteria for a multimeter is #1 reliability, #2 accuracy, and tied for #1 safety if working in a situation that requires it. Of course ergonomics are important too but most meters have similar ergonomics.

author: KL27x
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 20, 2015, 12:47:42 am
content: QuoteIME, practical reliability and accuracy are a given, even with the cheapest meters. This why I am looking for ergos. These devices are mass produced because they work. It's not like any of a DMM's basic functions are new technology. For what I do, I personally have no concerns over safety, using a cheap meter. Your needs may be different. If your meters are continually breaking down in your everyday life, well, I guess your experience is different than mine! Maybe you also buy armored and waterproofed laptop computers that are drop-tested to 10 feet, and an Otterbox and screen protector for your phone.If your DMM sits on a shelf next to your bench, it is going to be just fine. The durability of a Fluke is desired by the guys that drive two hours to get to a site so they can climb 100 feet up a tower in rain or snow to make a repair with their gear hanging on a belt. And it's not because a cheap DMM is likely to fail. It's that a failure is going to have a big consequence. Taking the DMM from your dorm to the uni lab is probably not going to be very taxing. And the consequence if it fails is you are going to borrow someone else's until you replace it. For gosh sake, how in the world does 99% of the population live without any DMM, at all?If my highly ergonomic DMM breaks, I buy a new one and continue to use an ergonomic tool that saves me time and frustration. I don't see the big deal. My life does not depend on my DMM working. And even if it did, I have more than one!?If I need 6 digits of calibrated accuracy, I will use the appropriate tool. But complaining that a cheap meter isn't as accurate is pretty much complaining that a tape measure isn't marked down to mils and calibrated by the Department of Weights and Measures. For 99% of your uses, it probably doesn't matter. You will use the tape that is handiest most of the time, and break out the micrometer when you need it.What I'm looking for isMeter turns on fastContinuity test is responsiveEasy to readFast readoutFast and easy to change between the modes I use the mostAutorangingAnd I like to have at least one pen meter for less cords to tangle. Hang it up next to my bench when done. One "real" meter for changing out different purposed probes/leads. But hardly ever use anything but the pen. Anything that has to be hooked up to get running readings on a live circuit is usually better handled with the scope.

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 20, 2015, 01:10:17 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on November 19, 2015, 09:36:52 amWith Batterizers on the batteries as a special bonus for forum membersWhich brings up a question - can a meter measure its own battery voltage? If so these would be a hot item.

author: Ian.M
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 20, 2015, 01:57:55 am
content: A *GOOD* meter has a high probability of getting nicked in a uni lab. However for a Computer/Network Engineering course, you shouldn't need more than an affordable pocket DMM. Seehttps://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/mini-dmm-recommendations/I can personally recommend the Bryman BM22 (I actually have an OEM badged version the PG22, but its identical). No current ranges, but its got everything else including diode test, capacitance and frequency, and in the past 20 years, I've *NEVER* needed to measure current when working on a PC or chunk of networking kit. I keep it, some adapters and clips for stuff I frequently need to probe and a little gasPortasoliron in my pocket toolkit all the time. The Portasol iron is definitely more capable than the Antex shown above, and may well be better than cruddy solder-stations (if any) provided by your uni. Its hot gas exhaust also does a decent job of shrinking heatshrink tubing.Replacement tips are a little pricey, but worn out ones can be refurbed by drilling out the end (don't break through) and swageing in a very closely fitted short length of lightly tinned copper rod. Shape the end how you want it, paint the sides of the new tip with a dilute sugar solution to encourage the buildup of a carbon/oxide layer, and fire it up on full blast for about five minutes to carbonize the sugar and cause the tinning layer inside the hole you swaged it in to alloy itself with the surrounding copper to form one chunk of metal. Dress and tin the tip, and it will give you a lot more hours of use.You need to 'baby' the catalytic wool. Don't touch it with anything, don't knock it about, don't get it wet and try to avoid dirt/dust getting onto it. If it does, blow gently to try to remove it. Many types of dust will burn off safely with the iron on max, but plastic or metal dust may kill the catalyst. If refurbing a tip, tape over the exhaust ports to protect the catalyst before drilling out the old tip.If you want to self-study general electronics, that's another matter, and decent tools and test equipment on your bench at home are well worth having.

author: tron9000
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 20, 2015, 09:32:24 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on November 20, 2015, 03:30:14 amYep we have cameras installed to stop this andeverything is bolted to the benchAlso if your stupid enough to jeopardise your education that you've stumped up more money than the not-even semi decent DMM you've stolen - then your probably not university material!not come across anyone trying to nick the gear out of the lab yet - woe betide those who try!