Sparkfun multimeter video teardown.... - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2015, 10:39:04 am
content: I just did a teardown video of a $15 Sparkfun multimeter. I think it's pretty well designed/built for the money.Don't be too hard on me, it's my first video. I mainly did it just to practice using the camera, etc.I also caught a cold half way through filming so the voice varies a bit :-(

author: ModemHead
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2015, 04:16:15 pm
content: Thanks for the video. I like your presentation style and the camera setup, although the auto-focus capability of your camera is a bit sluggish.Awwww, did you have to carp on the Fluke being big and slow and heavy? Too bad you didn't crack the case just for a quick comparison of industrial-grade versus hobby-grade. Just for educational reasons, of course.You probably already know this, but the Sparkfun meter is essentially the same ICL7106-based design as the ugly cheap-Os. There is nothing inherently wrong with a 7106-based meter, it can be a very good measuring instrument as you demonstrated. The Sparkfun version shows it only takes a few bucks to make it a bit more useable and reliable tool.

author: Excavatoree
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2015, 05:13:30 pm
content: Quote from: ModemHead on February 09, 2015, 04:16:15 pmThe 27 is older technology, and yes, it is a bit slow. A comparison to a 117 or even a model 77 (I, II, III, or IV) would have been more appropriate. The benefit of the 27 is that it is rugged - try dropping it and the sparkfun meter. (That's why it's heavier. Measure the thickness of the plastic body) I've purchased 27's for the same 15 dollars that one would have to give for the sparkfun.In short, the comparison seems a bit unfair to me as well.

author: Excavatoree
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2015, 05:14:20 pm
content: I forgot to add that it's a good thing that Sparkfun meter doesn't have a yellow holster, I almost confused it with a Fluke.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2015, 05:17:48 pm
content: Quote from: ModemHead on February 09, 2015, 04:16:15 pmThanks!I'll see if I can tweak the auto-focus. It has different speed settings but I don't remember what it was set to. I think I need a bit more light in the talking-head shots as well.(These are all things you notice in the editing stage...)Quote from: ModemHead on February 09, 2015, 04:16:15 pmI was trying to figure out a way to explain why I like using the Sparkfun meter.It's not easy to put into words but I suspect it's the same reason why Dave normally uses his little Brymen 357 when he's got shelves full of high-end Flukes, $1000 Gossen MetraWatts, etc., just a few feet away.Quote from: ModemHead on February 09, 2015, 04:16:15 pmDave's already done it and I don't think I could do better (and besides, my video was already getting too long...)They really are a work of art inside.Quote from: ModemHead on February 09, 2015, 04:16:15 pmIf you search for "VC830L" on eBay you get a lot of multimeters thatlooklike the Sparkfun meter,http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=VC830LSome are a lot cheaper, some have backlights, some have hold buttons... etc.Anyway: One of the scenes that ended up on the cutting room floor was a scene pointing out that the two cheapo meters have the exact same model number on the outside ("DT-830B") but are completely different meters on the inside.Sure, you can get a generic "VC830L" on eBay, but will it be the same as the Sparkfun meter? I dunno ... but I think it's better to pay a couple of extra bucks for postage and get one from Sparkfun.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2015, 05:25:57 pm
content: Quote from: Excavatoree on February 09, 2015, 05:13:30 pmThat's the only Fluke I own...According to the Fluke web page the 117 is a bit lighter but not really much smaller (about 3cm shorter, width and height basically the same as a 27...)I think Dave's mentioned that modern Flukes can be annoying as well - "AC" mode by default, anybody...?

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2015, 05:27:48 pm
content: Quote from: Excavatoree on February 09, 2015, 05:14:20 pmMaybe Sparkfun should make one and sell it as an accessory...

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2015, 05:51:58 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on February 09, 2015, 05:17:48 pmI've checked and it was already set to 'fastest'.Not much I can do - maybe be a bit more careful when moving things towards the camera.

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 09, 2015, 06:54:28 pm
content: Thanks for the review. I bet there are still people who will defend thosebargaingarbage bin meters.

author: ModemHead
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2015, 07:21:31 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on February 09, 2015, 05:17:48 pmI'm not positive about this, but I think those "830" DMMs originated in Taiwan back in the 80s when they could command a higher profit margin. Once the Chinese began to copy them, they started taking out bits and pieces and coming up with ways to make them cheaper. My go-to line here is I think the basic 830 schematic is printed on the back of every restaurant menu in ShenZhen.Anyway, looking forward to your next video.

author: JohnnyBerg
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2015, 07:27:01 pm
content: Nice review, I enjoyed it very much!I liked your presentation style, and unbiased look at the meters!

author: retiredcaps
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2015, 08:17:07 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on February 09, 2015, 05:25:57 pmThe 87V defaults to AC in the current range. Before that, the original 87 and 87 III defaults to DC in the current range. Thus, on the 87V, you have to hit the yellow button each time you want to measure DC current.Some of the Brymen meters remember which mode you are in (AC or DC) even after you turn it off.PS. I suspect the reasons Dave uses the Brymen 257 in his videos recently is due to the smaller size and the larger lcd digits compared to the 87V.With a smaller meter, he can fit more other "stuff" in frame composition. With the larger lcd digits, the audience and Dave can see the readings more easily.

author: rollatorwieltje
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 09, 2015, 10:21:29 pm
content: I had similar experiences with those cheap nasty ones. Surprisingly accurate for something that looks that horrible. Mine (Topcraft TMMH 930) even came with a rubber boot. The interior was completely different though, it used all through hole stuff. The connectors were also full tubes, no folded mess. The mA range was fused, the 10A range wasn't.If you want to laugh (or cry) even more, cut the probe leads and see how much copper is there. Mine had only a few strands that even made poor contact at the connector. I noticed it when the leads actually started glowing very brightly near the connector when measuring the current of a discharging capacitor bank (wasn't really supposed to draw that much current, but a certain FET lived up to it's name, Fiercely Exploding Transistor, effectively shorting it).A technical remark, check your audio levels. I had to put my tablet at max volume. Looking at the audio track in Audacity most of the speech never exceeds about 1/3th, several other random Youtube videos seem normalized at around 0.5.

author: retiredcaps
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2015, 10:51:26 pm
content: Quote from: rollatorwieltje on February 09, 2015, 10:21:29 pmSame here on a computer running lubuntu using vlc to view video. I had vlc at 125% and was still straining to hear a bit.

author: cosmicray
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2015, 11:05:47 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on February 09, 2015, 05:27:48 pmDidn't Sparkfun go a round with Fluke about use of a particular shade of yellow on test gear ?

author: tom66
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2015, 11:28:26 pm
content: Could those glass fuses really meet a CATIII rating? I'd imagine they would destroy themselves on a serious overload. I've had glass fuses explode on me when used in mains power supplies that fail, and that's just on a normal 32A breaker UK ring mains... not particularly high energy compared to what else is out there.BS1363 fuses are cheap (£0.12 in bulk, Bussman genuine), I wonder if any MM manufacturers have considered using them. They're ceramic and rated to 250V and will safely interrupt normal mains failure current without a dangerous explosion. Obviously, it would limit the current range to 250V, but I can't think it'd be a good idea to use a meter like this above 250V, especially a mains connected one.

author: miguelvp
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2015, 08:24:49 am
content: Quote from: cosmicray on February 09, 2015, 11:05:47 pmYup, those are the meters that Fluke put a hold on importing and they were either destroyed or returned to origin. But they did offer to match the cost as a charitable contribution or something like that. I think this was 6 months or so ago.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2015, 09:58:46 am
content: Quote from: retiredcaps on February 09, 2015, 10:51:26 pmPremiere Pro strikes again. The very last thing I did before exporting the video was "Select All->Normalize".I'll have to play around and figure out what Adobe understands by "normalize". Premiere Pro is just a huge trap for new players.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2015, 10:00:16 am
content: Quote from: miguelvp on February 10, 2015, 08:24:49 am...as mentioned in the video.

author: rollatorwieltje
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 10, 2015, 10:13:56 am
content: Quote from: Fungus on February 10, 2015, 09:58:46 amIt looks like it did "peak normalize". There are some loud spikes (clicking of range switch, hitting the desk etc), it used that as maximum. You probably want to increase the overall gain and just let those peaks clip.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2015, 10:25:12 am
content: Quote from: tom66 on February 09, 2015, 11:28:26 pmIt's borderline at best, that's why I said "maybe".With CAT III you still have arc protection between you and "utility power" (CAT IV). In theory the fuse can't arc over.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arc-fault_circuit_interrupterhttp://faculty.riohondo.edu/jfrala/fluke_multimeters_-_abcs_of_multimeter_safety_multimeter_safety_and_you_application_note.pdfSo yes, itmightbe CAT III but glass fuses aren't a good thing.(Experts: Please correct me if I'm wrong about any of this)HRC fuses aren't expensive or hard to get (it's basically the same construction as the glass fuse but filled with sand). I don't know why all multimeters don't have them.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2015, 10:59:47 am
content: Quote from: rollatorwieltje on February 10, 2015, 10:13:56 amLooks like it...All that would do is find the loudest sound in the video and normalize everything to that - not at all what I wanted.I've just googled a bit and seen several pages saying there's no way to do what I need automatically (ie. some sort of automatic gain control).The best thing I could find so far is to go through the video manually looking for loud sounds, chop the video either side of the sound, then do "Normalize all peaks" (which normalizes each individual clip to the level of the loudest sound in it).(Maybe I'm just using the wrong editing software...)

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2015, 11:19:59 am
content: Quote from: Fungus on February 10, 2015, 10:25:12 amHRC fuses are an IEC requirement now, with a voltage rating equal to the meter's highest CAT voltage. Glass fuses don't meet those standards.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2015, 04:36:31 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on February 10, 2015, 10:59:47 amI've been looking around for a few hours and it doesn't look like there's a way to do it in Premiere Pro.Cyberlink PowerDirector can do it with a single click. It also seems to do this type of editingmuchmore easily then Premiere Pro. I'll give it more of a test tomorrow.

author: mrgregs
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2015, 10:34:27 am
content: Quote from: Fungus on February 10, 2015, 04:36:31 pmCould you try something like exporting the audio, running it through something like theLevelator, and then reimporting it? That was the way I used to normalize the audio in Sony Vegas.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2015, 12:41:59 pm
content: Quote from: mrgregs on February 11, 2015, 10:34:27 amI've been looking into PowerDirector because it seemsmucheasier to use for this sort of work (ie. take a load of video clips, trim start/end of each one, put them in a sequence, single-click to match the audio levels across all the clips).Looks like I still have compress it as a separate step to get itreally loudbut that's quite easy to do as well.Plus it's only 80 bucks.Edit: If you search google for "cyberlink coupon" it comes up with "10POFF" for a 10% discount at their store.So...what happens if you type "20POFF" instead? Yep, 20% discount...(I tried other numbers but nothing else seems to work :-( )Edit 2: Plus... it encodes video over six times faster than Premiere Pro. No doubt about it, I'm switching to PowerDirector.Quote from: mrgregs on February 11, 2015, 10:34:27 amSo Sony Vegas can't do this either?Is it just me? This seems like a very basic requirement....

author: mrgregs
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: February 12, 2015, 08:03:01 am
content: Quote from: Fungus on February 11, 2015, 12:41:59 pmOh, it can do it, but I was never happy with the result - Levelator seemed to do it in a more intelligent manner.

author: necessaryevil
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2015, 10:33:07 am
content: Thank you for this video! I liked it.Since I sense that you want some feedback: next time put a link and the type in the video title or description.//edit:I just bought the sparkfun VC830L meter from ebay, so that's some proof of my appreciation for the video! Well, it's actually branded Victor. Seems like it is changed a little bit, the version I bought has a hold-button and a backlight-button; there are more slightly different versions of this type.I 'll probably open my VC830L as soon as I get it so I can see if there are any other changes. I have had a few multimeters which looked similar to the ones your 4 dollar meter - those look the same but are all different internally. And usually crap.//edit 2Quote from: tom66 on February 09, 2015, 11:28:26 pmIs that normal in the UK? In the Netherlands you usually have a few 16A "groups" and a 32A fuse for all groups together - the latter can only be replaced by the power company, it is sealed. Isn't UK equipment supposed to have an additional fuse in the plug?Voltage in the UK and the Netherlands are both 230v~

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 13, 2015, 11:16:46 am
content: Quote from: Fungus on February 10, 2015, 10:25:12 amThey ARE expensive. One 1000V HRC fuse costs more than some cheap multimeters.

author: necessaryevil
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2015, 12:07:18 pm
content: QuoteOff course it depends on what you call expensive. And on which HRC fuse: I recently discovered that the price ranges from <1 to >40 euro's. This makes me wonder, who defines if a fuse is a HRC type, is this a claim from the manufacturer or is this an official label? What are the other requirements for a multimeter fuse? (besides rupture capacity, speed and rated current?)check this:http://nl.rs-online.com/web/c/fuses-sockets-circuit-breakers/fuses/cartridge-fuses/?applied-dimensions=4294583799,4294851536&esid=cl_4294967294,cl_4294959321,cl_4294583985&m=1&aaaExp=Yhttp://nl.rs-online.com/web/p/cartridge-fuses/7833267/Makes one wonder: Is anyone fooling us? I guess both the cheapest and the most expensive are foolery.side note: for a multimeter with 40 euro fuses I wouldn't say a seperate fuse compartiment is always an advantage... It would make it way to easy to steal those things.

author: tom66
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2015, 12:13:22 pm
content: I do wonder how can a "simple" fuse cost so much to make?Has anyone torn down one of the Fluke's fuses to see what lies within... is there a complicated multi-fuse mechanism (as seen on some industrial fuses, a smaller fuse blows first, which triggers a charge and blows the whole fuse) or is it simply a fusible wire inside a sand and ceramic package?

author: electr_peter
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 13, 2015, 12:14:17 pm
content: Quote from: wraper on February 13, 2015, 11:16:46 amHRC are expensive, bigger and not so common (=hard to source). Cheapest glass and ceramic fuses are used in mains powered devices, HRC fuses are for DMMs and specialised equipment only.There is a category of fuses that are more expensive than HRC fuses. Audio fuses for audiophools (the cheapest glass/ceramic fuses with fancy color or sticker)http://sklep.fusic.pl/category/akcesoria-zasilanie273 PLN ~ 74 USD for 5 x 20mm fuse with a sticker

author: ModemHead
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2015, 12:57:05 pm
content: Quote from: tom66 on February 13, 2015, 12:13:22 pmThis is what the inside of a Bussmann DMM-B-11A fuse looks like after a 120VAC mains incident:

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2015, 03:33:11 pm
content: Quote from: necessaryevil on February 13, 2015, 10:33:07 amThanks!I just re-edited it using different software to try and fix the sound (it wasn't very equalized and some people complained it was too low). There's a new version here:Quote from: necessaryevil on February 13, 2015, 10:33:07 amWill do.Quote from: necessaryevil on February 13, 2015, 10:33:07 amIt will be interesting to see if it's the same internal build quality as my Sparkfun version. There are a lot of clones of that meter on eBay.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2015, 03:39:59 pm
content: Quote from: tom66 on February 13, 2015, 12:13:22 pmAs far as I know it's just the same basic construction but with added sand. There's places on earth with trillions of tons of it lying on the floor so I don't see why it makes fuses so expensive.For higher voltages you'll obviously need a physically longer fuse to avoid sparks jumping across. Still no reason for them to cost $10 each though (IMHO).

author: retiredcaps
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2015, 11:11:16 pm
content: Quote from: ModemHead on February 13, 2015, 12:57:05 pmIn ModemHead's link below, there is another link to another fuse teardown in the comment section.http://mrmodemhead.com/blog/inside-a-multimeter-fuse/

author: necessaryevil
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 28, 2015, 07:31:42 am
content: QuoteThat is the plan!

author: rollatorwieltje
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 05, 2015, 08:13:50 pm
content: I just read somewhere that this thing doesn't accept fully shrouded banana jacks, is this true? Would be quite an epic fail if it wouldn't accept most test leads.

author: necessaryevil
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 17, 2015, 01:20:48 pm
content: QuoteI just got mine and I did a quick teardown. It is different on the inside! Clearance/creepage is worse, and there is only one glass fuse, which is smaller than a 5x20mm fuse. Weird!I might post a picture later.

author: necessaryevil
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 17, 2015, 07:06:25 pm
content: OK, here are the pictures. This version is sold as a Sheng DE VC830L.Look at the weird-ass fuse! Never seen one like that before. There is only one fuse, on the front of the multimeter it says that it has two. Them liars! It seems that the 10A range does not work - I don't know which of the empty holes are for the 10A fuse.By the way, there are also two empty footprints for two diodes.

author: paulie
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 17, 2015, 11:45:03 pm
content: That is the "Excel" type meter and while 2nd most popular DMM in the world after cheaper $5 "Centech" it bears little resemblance internally, externally, or functionally. I do favor it though over some in my collection costing 20x to 100x more. Small, cheap, accurate, and most of all unlike Centech, has a beeper. That last feature accounts for 99% of my meter use. Also based on a different ADC than the Centech which uses the generic mainstay ICL7106 chip.ps. For anybody interested attached is the harder to come by than hens teeth schematic for the $5 one in the video:

author: necessaryevil
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 19, 2015, 05:01:07 pm
content: QuoteIs it both the multimeter in the video and the multimeter I took apart which you call the "Excel type"? Or only the one I took apart?

author: paulie
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 22, 2015, 05:53:26 pm
content: Yours I call "Excel" because thats the most popular branding from chinese sites. It's beeper makes it much more useful than the cheaper ones in the video which are given away free by the millions at Harbor Freight and often only $3 (shipped) on Ebay. The internals are quite different from the 2nd pair in Fungus video.The latter have a new cost reduced design which, as he hinted, are getting even cheaper by the minute. They were a big favorite of mine and I scattered them all over the place until the on/off switch disappeared. Now they are too cheap even for me. That switch was it's major redeeming feature. Fortunately still there on the HF ones but who knows for how long.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 22, 2015, 06:33:04 pm
content: Quote from: necessaryevil on March 17, 2015, 07:06:25 pmEw!That's alotworse than the Sparkfun meter.(mythbusters voice)"Myth confirmed!"The model number on the front really tells younothingabout the insides.(/mythbusters voice)(as I suspected after I took the two same-numbered cheapo meters apart).Can I ask how much you paid for it?

author: grythumn
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 23, 2015, 04:09:19 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on February 10, 2015, 10:59:47 amI think you're looking for an audio level compressor. Premiere is bound to have one...http://www.larryjordan.biz/premiere-pro-cc-boost-and-smooth-audio-levels/. It sounds a lot better than letting the audio clip.-R C

author: jgalak
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 09, 2017, 06:04:16 pm
content: Quote from: rollatorwieltje on March 05, 2015, 08:13:50 pmVery old post, but since I found it while looking for info on this topic, I figured I'd add this info, for posterity:The meter does not, in fact, accept fully shrouded banana jacks. The cords it comes with have a bit of a sleeve, which locks into a sleeve on the meter (so better than nothing). However, it will not work with fully shrouded jacks like on the Fluke. See photos attached. The Fluke leads will physically fit the sleeve, but no electrical contact is made.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 09, 2017, 07:24:12 pm
content: Yep.PS: My Sparkfun meter is languishing in a drawer since I got my ANENG AN860B+.

author: jgalak
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 09, 2017, 08:42:21 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on December 09, 2017, 07:24:12 pmIt's my second meter, for when I need to measure both V and I. My primary is a Fluke 87 V that I found damn cheap on ebay years ago. I've been wanting a second decent meter, but waffling on what to get - so I just put money down on the kickstarter for the new eevblog meter.