PLC programmer or electrical engineer designer? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 25, 2010, 07:55:38 am
content: I know im going to school for electrical engineering but im still undecided on either a PLC programmer or a electrical designer. there so many to choose from any suggestion?

author: DJPhil
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 25, 2010, 09:41:36 am
content: I didn't vote in the poll because I'm just a hobbyist myself, so I don't know the details of either job very well. I might be able to share some advice though.Choosing a specialty within a field is something I've got some experience counseling on. Many of the people I spoke with who were partway through school were trying to decide on a specialty on it's intellectual appeal alone. This works just fine if that appeal is your highest priority, but there are other factors worth considering. For example, would you be happier in ten years if you were 'a really good software guy that the hardware guys can actually talk to', or the other way around? Consider travel, working out of the office (perhaps even outdoors), and the other sorts of things that make up your average day at work. In the end, all this will vary widely, but there are certain trends you can look for.It helps a lot to have examples and know a few pitfalls (ask Dave about sales and marketing, I dare you).It's difficult to have a good conversation distilling years of experience over the internet though, but the good news is that most folks love to talk about their work. Consider taking a spin through the phone book, shooting out a few emails, phone calls, or just drop in to some of the local companies and see if you can find some folks who are willing to meet you for lunch (somewhere reasonable, you're a student after all) and tell you what their work is like. Be prepared to do a lot of listening, but have a few questions to get them started. It takes some guts and preparation (good practice), but the advice you get is potentially much more valuable than a cheeseburger. The whole idea is to get a real feel for what it can be like doing the work. Some care must be used, as it's way easier to see, and hear about, the bad parts. What you're really looking for is the hidden awesome bits.There may be a program like this at the college already. If not, you might want to work with the counseling department to set one up. Something regular that's slightly more formal would be a good deal for both parties. Students get some mentoring, the guys who take the time get thicker resumes. Use and abuse your counselors, they can help and you're paying for them!It sounds a bit weird, but I've seen this idea work to good effect. It helped a friend of mine rule out a specialization that he would likely have been miserable trying to make a living at.I hope that helps some, I know it's a bit scrambled.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 25, 2010, 10:38:25 am
content: Without knowing anything about the actual courses, my first reaction is that PLC programming seems like a pretty specialized (and usually not very highly regarded) branch. The Electricla Designer one sounds a lot better.Dave.

author: qno
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 25, 2010, 05:51:54 pm
content: I think the opposite.Electrical engineers here in Europe are seeing theire jobs disapear to China and india.Alle engineering done here is buying ready made boxes from China or india and changing the program a little.

author: monstrum
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: February 25, 2010, 08:10:41 pm
content: Is this really comparable in terms of level?IMHO PLC-programming is lower in the food-chain, and is more like a craft such as electrician. Sure nothing wrong about that but electrical engineering is at least one step up. You could be the one designing the PLC-devices, or write the development software for it.They don't send PLC's into space, do they?

author: rossmoffett
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 25, 2010, 10:59:33 pm
content: They're both pretty much the same concept, IMO. In PLC design your circuit and devices are bigger. Instead of using silicon chips you're using macro devices that measure pressure, temperature, sense objects, control motors, and etc. etc.I consider myself an expert PLC programmer. I think if in the course of your electronic studies you take computer science I and II (most universities require it), you will quickly excel in PLC programming also. It's a different control structure, not like computer programming languages at all, but the concepts are similar and when you learn to work within the limitations you'll be fine. Digital logic is very handy for PLC programming also, there is a lot of and/or logic.As an electronics engineer, as you can see above, people will regard you in higher esteem, as piddly automation specialists such as myself are not well regarded outside of their workplaces. I interned in an oil field last semester and I can tell you that demand for PLC programming is extremely high right now. I felt more valuable there (as a student!) than I have ever felt in any position. They don't put them in space, but that's because people are using them up everywhere else! You can certainly earn equivalent salaries in the near-term and also in the long-term should you rise in ranks. There are jobs for PLC programmers in places where there are not jobs for electronics engineers, but not vice-versa. I find myself looking at job openings where an electrical engineer is requested, but my practical knowledge and theory background would likely be much more valuable. I've been told that this is the case through many factory tours that I've taken, also. The difference is that PLC programmers must be willing to get their "hands dirty." You'll be expected to tolerate some weather, get dirty, be on a factory floor.The PLC is the Arduino of the professional world. It's easy, so people that do more complicated things piss on it. You'd be surprised at the level of complexity that can be managed with some very limited computing and instruction power. You might be surprised at the level of complexity an industrial control system can reach, also. As a PLC programmer you'll also be expected to understand the devices that allow them to communicate, like industrial ethernet networks and microwave band radios. There are a lot of variables to consider in failure mode analysis, system architecture, alarm notifications and consequences and so on. In my internship I worked a lot on watching for and preventing environmental damage through process interruptions. To these guys who think it's too low on the food chain, geez, you don't know what you're missing! Electronics engineers are designing the devices that form the system that I design, in that case you would be the Navy whom the Marines refer to as their chauffeurs! (erroneously) It's a BS argument, both occupations take some people with serious brainpower if the job is to be done right.I began as an electrical/computer engineering student and changed majors after two years. I don't have a bias to one or the other, it depends on your personality, desires and where you would like to live. As said above, people don't mind talking about it. If you're in the US pm me and we can phone. I'm abstaining from a vote too, because it's a BS question, you need to do whatever is the best fit for your needs and wants. I can tell you that if you're not the type of person that likes to work on things out of the air conditioning, though, PLC programming is probably not for you. Someone has to troubleshoot those systems after they're installed in their working environment, usually you!

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 26, 2010, 10:55:29 pm
content: Thank you for replying back....It really help me with all u guy opinion...

author: ShiftPlusOne
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 06, 2010, 03:03:55 am
content: Isn't PLC programming a subset of electrical engineering? I do electrical engineering at uni and we do work with PLCs.

author: rossmoffett
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 06, 2010, 03:26:44 am
content: It depends on your concentration. When I was going to school for Electrical and Computer Engineering there weren't any that I know of.

author: Junkey
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: March 09, 2010, 05:03:12 am
content: My friend who graduated with me as an EE took one PLC class that was listed as a EE class. He said it was very easy.

author: Mark_O
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 19, 2010, 09:10:13 pm
content: Quote from: rossmoffett on February 25, 2010, 10:59:33 pmRoss,that was a great post (the whole thing). Thanks for sharing your experiences.- Mark

author: Anthony1
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: January 10, 2012, 04:20:11 am
content: Who says programming a PLC is easy?! Maybe in the classroom on a little demo device, but certainly not on a considerable project with many stakeholders involved.You can research PLC Jobs at PLCEdge.com and many other topics related to programmable logic controller and applications.http://www.plcedge.com/plc-jobs.html

author: DavidDLC
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 10, 2012, 04:26:14 am
content: What if the PLCs dissapear in the future ?You never know !!!

author: Neilm
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 10, 2012, 07:50:08 pm
content: I am primarily a designer, but I would like to think I could programme PLCs if required. I have had to do designs while considering the restrictions of the PLC I was asked to use.Personally, I would say that having the ability to find that the problem is not with your code, but rather with the PCB it is sat on looks much better to a recruiter than someone who can only programme.Neil

author: Spikee
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 10, 2012, 08:03:34 pm
content: I'm in high school Electrical installation techniques and we work alot whit Siemens step 7 plc.I can tell you that ik suck... lol not very exiting , verry expensive because Siemens has an monopoly position so for evry extra thing you want you have to buyan expensive module from Siemens ofcource ...Plc needs 3 parts: Power supply (Siemens) , CPU (S7 is around 800 euro) , output/input modules ( some cpu have like 24 digital and 6 analog ports build in but most dont) .Most plc dont have anything inside except rs232 port and it still uses a special sd like card for saving your programme which cost like 80 euro for 64Mb .... and only avaible at Siemens.As an beginner electronics person which uses arduino you get verry annoyed at plc programming its not programming at all its just placing some symbols and you run into many faults inthe system that gets you angry at the software. My advice : if you can program anything like arduino you wont like plc programming.Just my opinion hate or appriciate.