can I remove the tuner from a TV? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / repair

author: mortos360
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2015, 01:40:29 pm
content: To answer the first logical question, "why would you even want that" is that here in Austria, if you own a device that can recieve the public television signal, you have to pay 25 euros//month... no matter if you watch it or not. Now there are so called Public Viewing devices that have no tuner in them, with such a device you dont need to pay that tax but since I dont have such a device, I was wondering if I can just remove the Tuner from my plasma without disturbing the HDMI port?It seems that the Tuner is just 1 of this metalic boxes with a few pins soldered, which I can remove easily. Here is a schematic from the service manual:[url=http://oi59.tinypic.com/2jz8kl.jpg]http://oi59.tinypic.com/2jz8kl.jpgMy first idea was to just desolder that thing and try it... but can this damage other electronics in the device, or will it just realise that something is missing and shut off?In case I cant remove that thing and keep the TV working, ill have to sell it.

author: grumpydoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2015, 02:01:06 pm
content: While technically possible you might find that the authorities will charge you anyway as you still own a "TV"It will probably be less aggrivation to sell the TV and buy a monitor with HDMI input (unless it is a gargantuan TV, of course).

author: mortos360
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2015, 02:07:02 pm
content: its a 50" plasma and the authorities don't charge you if you have a broken TV... which technically this would be since it cant receive the signal! The whole argument is really about the ability of getting the signal or not. For example, if I have an DVD player with a Tuner, but no TV... i still have to pay since I can receive the signal, no matter if I can watch it or not.

author: digsys
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 11, 2015, 02:09:36 pm
content: First I'd definitely try to find out what constitutes "No tuner". ie What if the P/Supply to it were disabled (fuse?), or the output coupling cap(?)was removed? rendering the Tunerincapableof working. Disabling it, may be quite safe and easily restored.It may just be that simple. I don't see it being any different to removing the whole tuner module, as EITHER can be re-inserted.

author: opty
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2015, 02:12:13 pm
content: Are you sure that is how the law works in Austria?Ie. As far I a know in Ireland self removing/destroying tuner from a device that was originally sold capable of receiving TV does not automatically relieve you from paying for TV licence.There was a nice article on the web about it, can't find it now ;(.

author: mortos360
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2015, 02:23:13 pm
content: Quote from: opty on February 11, 2015, 02:12:13 pmnot 100%.. its really hard to find clean informations about this. what I know for sure is that you dont pay for broken TVs or Radios.. and for TVs with no tuners (public viewing devices).There is too many strange informations about that Company here in Austria, and it seems they will tell you anything just to make you pay. For example, the law here clearly say that if you haveinternet you dont have to pay taxes for radio... even tho you can stream radio. Still, this company which is really a company and not the government itself... tho they work with government... says the opposite. They want you to pay for radio if you have internet. There is enough cases where people did fight with them about the internet and radio argument and they won.The easiest would be to call that company and ask, but I really cant relay on the informations they tell me, and paying a lawyer just to get me that information is more expensive then buying a new TV with no tuner :/

author: janoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2015, 02:30:49 pm
content: I second the view of better checking what the law says *exactly*. Otherwise you could end up messing up your TV for no gain.E.g. here in France you are taxed for simply having the possibility to receive the signal - whether by air or over internet, watching it on a TV or a PC or a tablet - all irrelevant. As long you could conceivably view it somehow, you have to pay.When I lived in Denmark, it was pretty much similar - you could declare you don't have a TV, but then they would dispatch an "inspector" to your place to actually check! As long as you had something with a screen at home, you had to pay. Later they changed the law and it was enough to have internet access - whether wired or wireless and you were liable to pay.

author: mortos360
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2015, 02:42:23 pm
content: Quote from: janoc on February 11, 2015, 02:30:49 pmAustria is betterhttps://www.bvwg.gv.at/entscheidungen/Internethaushalt___GIS-Gebuehren.pdfThis is german but if you translate it in english it will be more clear. We dont pay for devices that stream. In fact you dont even pay for the TV or Radio... you pay for the being abel to receive the AIR signal. All the devices that are not abel to receive the AIR signal do not need to be resigtered and therefor you dont need to pay for them. You do pay for your PC//Laptop if you own a USB Tuner!!I am not a lawyer, but thats what I can understand from this text!

author: bktemp
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2015, 02:46:18 pm
content: In Germany it is probably worst: Here everybody has to pay regardless of you have a TV or radio or computer or not.If you remove the tuner, some TVs refuse to work completely when communication with the tuner fails during power on test. Others work fine with hdmi. It depends on how the software handles errors.

author: mortos360
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2015, 02:48:02 pm
content: Quote from: bktemp on February 11, 2015, 02:46:18 pmCan I damage the other electronics just by powering the TV without Tuner?

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 11, 2015, 03:02:31 pm
content: Quote from: grumpydoc on February 11, 2015, 02:01:06 pmMy sister lives in UK and don't pay anything. She was able to prove that don't use a TV for watching broadcast.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 11, 2015, 03:06:09 pm
content: Quote from: digsys on February 11, 2015, 02:09:36 pmWhat if glue some piece of plastic from the inside to cover the hole? You can say that there is no TV input.

author: bktemp
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2015, 03:06:33 pm
content: Quote from: mortos360 on February 11, 2015, 02:48:02 pmIt is unlikely that the tv gets damaged when operated with a missing tuner.On a modern tv it can be difficult to remove the tuner without damaging the pcb. If the tuner has exposed leads, I would start by cutting them. If the tv refuses to work, you can simply solder them together to make the tv work again.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 11, 2015, 03:39:43 pm
content: Probably you can disable the tuner from the service menu.

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2015, 04:02:23 pm
content: Wouldn't it be easier if you remove the antenna? Does it need an external antenna or does it have it built in?

author: mortos360
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2015, 04:05:02 pm
content: you guys answer too slowjk... thanks for all your feedback guys.. I just tryed it and worked!!Selfcheck doesnt pass anymore because its missing the tuner, but the TV itself works perfectly fine!!here are some pics from it.

author: grumpydoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2015, 07:26:18 pm
content: Quote from: wraper on February 11, 2015, 03:02:31 pmYes, it's easy in the UK - if you don't pay the licence they will (eventually) send someone round to check. If you can prove you can't receive broadcast TV you don't have to pay.If you don't have an aerial then they generally accept you can't watch TV - BUT it might become harder because you actually need a licence to watch live streamed TV so if you don't already you might soon have to prove you don't have a computer either

author: vk6zgo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 12, 2015, 04:44:26 am
content: They cut out Radio & TV receiving licences in Oz back in the 1970s--they said it cost more to police the rule than they made from it.The ABC (Govt financed network) is financed out of general taxes,the Commercials from Advertising revenue,& The SBS half & half!

author: digsys
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 12, 2015, 04:59:59 am
content: Quote from: vk6zgoAhhhhhhh fond memories of "Jimmy, quicka hida da televishun, the govment is in da streit" :-) Then the false panel in theentertainment cabinet ... then detectors, jammers .... those were the days

author: dadsarmy1
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: May 21, 2017, 02:53:05 pm
content: Hi, I hope it is ok to continue this thread because I want to do exactly the same as the original poster. I will need to buy a TV say up to 25" but am wondering what to buy. I need one that will work for playing dvds if tuner is removed. However which model to buy? It looks like some tuners can be removed and some can not.

author: BMack
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: May 21, 2017, 04:15:03 pm
content: Quote from: dadsarmy1 on May 21, 2017, 02:53:05 pmI presume removing the F connector is enough for your needs, in this case, they're all removable. There are some lower end TVs where the tuner section is on the board and the f connector is attached to a shielding can that has no electronics attached but I don't think anyone will disassemble the TV to check. If you really don't care about the tuner and will never reattach it, you can just grab the f connector and break it off, they're made to break off.

author: stj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 21, 2017, 10:51:10 pm
content: what is actually needed is a europe-wide lawsuit over being forced to fund a service you dont want or use.let the state propaganda bullhorn's like RTE,BBC,TFx,ORF etc fund themselves through advertising.the shakeup may actually make them broadcast some decent material!!

author: xrunner
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 21, 2017, 10:58:32 pm
content: Quote from: dadsarmy1 on May 21, 2017, 02:53:05 pmOk I'm gonna bite.I live in the US so I have no idea about this, are you saying if you buy a TV that can tune channels you have to pay a fee? Then, if you take a part out that disables that ability you don't have to pay a fee?How do you report that you took out the tuner, who is it that gets your report, how do they verify it ...This reminds me of that old question - how many parts can you take out of a new car before it cant be called a car anymore.

author: stj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 21, 2017, 11:35:47 pm
content: in general terms, if you have a tv then you are supposed to pay towards the cost of the state broadcaster.these bs laws existed prior to private satellite dishes or the internet, so it was pretty simple then - if you had a tv you had to be watching state broadcasts.

author: retrolefty
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2017, 12:01:06 am
content: Just for us not subject to such a usage tax, what amount do they charge a month? Do they charge per TV set or just per household?

author: stj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2017, 12:14:59 am
content: it depends on the country.in the u.k. it's about £150 a year i think and covers a property - regardless of how many devices you have.they keep changing the law to keep up with technology btw.it used to be that you could use a sat dish or remove the tuner from the tv & vcr.if things get any worse, they will just tax people for having eyeballs - the blind will get a discount but still be accused of being able to hear the audio!!!

author: grumpydoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2017, 07:10:24 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on May 21, 2017, 11:52:26 pmIf you buy a TV in the UK from one of the main online vendors or in a bricks and mortar store then they have to inform the licensing authority of your name & address. If they can't find a TV licence registered to you they will send you a nice little letter and if you ignore that send a couple of people round.We used to get it a lot when the licence was in my other half's name but I paid for the new TVs (of which we got through one about every two years for a while in the 90's/early 2000's)Even if you buy the TV in a way that flies under the radar then they will simply send households without a TV a letter and/or visit to check. Most people have licences so residential addresses without will tend to be pretty obvious.Very soon you will have to have a BBC account to watch iPlayer - I suspect before too long simply ticking the box to say "I have a TV licence" will not be enough and the licence number will have to be entered.Face it, we live in an Orwellian world whether you realise it or not.

author: grumpydoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2017, 08:18:17 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on May 22, 2017, 07:37:17 amPresumably because they perceive no demand for TVs which have no RF input, yet.

author: RGB255_0_0
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2017, 08:27:27 am
content: Quote from: grumpydoc on May 22, 2017, 08:18:17 amIt's called a monitor. Most even remove the speakers too!

author: grumpydoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2017, 08:48:11 am
content: Quote from: RGB255_0_0 on May 22, 2017, 08:27:27 amSure but there isn't that big a market in 40-50" 4k monitors - compared with similar spec TVs

author: janoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2017, 08:52:41 am
content: Quote from: stj on May 21, 2017, 10:51:10 pmYou are naive - then the funding will be changed to a generalized tax (as it is in many countries already). What did you gain? The role of someone like BBC is very different than a commercial (advertisement supported) TV, it includes serving the communities and needs that may not get served otherwise (because they are not commercially sustainable by themselves).If by "decent material" you mean pandering to the lowest hanging (commercial) fruit by broadcasting the various talent shows, reality shows, tabloid-style news reporting and all movie re-runs that have all guaranteed viewership so that they can be interspersed with commercials every 10-15 minutes, yes, that would be the result. In Slovakia where I am from it is exactly this - the commercial, ad-supported TVs are universally unwatchable crap thanks to this approach. I can literally feel my IQ decreasing whenever I go back home to visit my parents and have to deal with the local TV."the state propaganda bullhorn's" - lol, really, come to Slovakia. If you want a "state propaganda bullhorn", you the politician (or your business friends) buy a TV (or newspaper) and push your views like that. It is far easier than trying to pervert a statute protected medium with an obligation of neutrality. Not that that prevents the politicians from trying but it is not as easy as it used to be.What would most give for the quality of BBC or ORF back home ...

author: dadsarmy1
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: May 22, 2017, 06:10:32 pm
content: Thanks for your interest.Legally in this country if you untune a tv so no live or catchup broadcasts can be received one is reasonably safe from the possibility of a summons for no licence. We do not have to report it to anyone. We just stop paying the licence fee which we did some 14 years ago. I removed the tuners from two crt tv's on that occasion as an added precaution. Hoping to do the same with a modern led tv so we can update a bit with HDMI cables from a new dvd player.

author: Kilrah
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 22, 2017, 08:27:46 pm
content: Quote from: blueskull on May 21, 2017, 11:52:26 pmThen you get bill collectors sent at you, credit default etc as for any unpaid bill.Quote from: blueskull on May 22, 2017, 07:37:17 amBecause they'd only sell a handful to a couple of weird guys, most people actually DO want to receive TV and are OK to pay for it.

author: free_electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2017, 08:45:13 pm
content: so anyone with a metal coathanger has to pay 25 $ ? ( coathangers can receive tv signals ... )

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2017, 09:56:06 pm
content: The whole concept of needing a license to own a TV receiver is totally foreign to me. Seems like there would be a large market for monitors with no tuner in them. I haven't watched broadcast TV in probably 20 years, 25 euros a month seems exorbitant. That's 2.5 times what I pay for my Netflix subscription and that provides all the TV I need.

author: P90
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2017, 11:04:49 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on May 22, 2017, 09:56:06 pmbut you still have to pay a presumably exorbitant sum for internet to use Netflix... can't win either way...

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2017, 11:10:41 pm
content: My internet service is only $39/month and I use it for way more than just Netflix. I don't mind paying for internet service, it costs money to provide it and it's something I rely heavily on. I don't want to pay a license for having a TV because I don't watch broadcast TV, it's a non-essential service that I see no value in so I shouldn't have to pay for it and I'm glad I don't.

author: Rasz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 23, 2017, 04:04:06 am
content: tunerless TVshttp://business.panasonic.com/products-avtechnology-professionaldisplays-led?sc_sp=business-category_featuresAd_products-avtechnology-professionaldisplays_%20LEDhttps://www.vizio.com/tuner-freeetcHotel TVs, commercial displays, there are many uses for tuner free TVs, of course they are more expensive due to artificial market segmentation, size of the market, lesser competition and implied business use.Quote from: james_s on May 22, 2017, 11:10:41 pmYou dont want to play that game, because:Explains US medical system fiasco in a nutshell. This is why you have people going homeless/dying just because they needed some medical procedure.$40 a month? hope you get at least FCC mandated 25Mbit/s "broadband", even 300-600Mbit/s plans in Europe cost less than that, and those usually additionally bundle unlimited mobile calling + >100 TV channels.As for wondering how weird a TV without tuner vs License is, do I really have to mention 80% lower?

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 23, 2017, 04:27:14 am
content: Oh come on, you can't seriously be comparing TV, a mostly pointless luxury item to life saving health care? I'll be the first to admit that the US health care system is a complete nightmare, but TV? It could go away entirely for all I care, most of us would probably be better off and might not need as much health care, IMO watching TV is a waste of time and most Americans anyway watch far too much of it. If I had cable TV for free I still wouldn't bother to hook it up.I don't even know how fast my internet is, that's how much I care. It has enough bandwidth to stream HD video, it's reliable and always on, what else matters? I think it's 25/25Mb, used to be 10Mb and that was fast enough that I wouldn't have paid extra to get more but they bumped it up at some point. Infrastructure like internet is relatively expensive in the US because it is a massive country with many of our 50 states being larger than entire nations in Europe. There are vast swaths of sparsely populated land where the cost per customer would be prohibitive if those of us in the heavily populated coastal areas didn't pay a bit more to subsidize those who otherwise would never be profitable to service.

author: CJay
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 23, 2017, 06:31:39 am
content: Quote from: stj on May 22, 2017, 12:14:59 amha, you joke but the blind still have to pay, albeit with a 50% discount.It's not quite as bad as it sounds though, the licence fee pays for the transmitter network mostly which covers the cost of broadcasting radio as well as TV and also funds the BBC, the amount we pay per month is a ittle over the cost of a netflix or Amazon Prime multi-user account so, personally, I reckon it's pretty good value.

author: CJay
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 23, 2017, 06:41:48 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on May 22, 2017, 07:37:17 amThere was a time when you could buy Video Players and monitors for just that reason, Tatung, Salora/Finlux and a few others used to manufacture monitors which were TV chassis with the tuner and associated circuitry not fitted.Some, i think Salora/Finlux and Grundig, used to offer tuner kits so you could retrofit VHF/UHF options.

author: P90
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 23, 2017, 09:46:41 am
content: Quote from: james_s on May 22, 2017, 11:10:41 pmWe get ripped off in California$60/ month for just basic 15mbps internet and no cable tv and nothing else.my uncle in France pays around 30€ for internet, tv, phone bundle, and it's infinitely faster internet. we're getting screwed.

author: fcb
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 23, 2017, 10:11:44 am
content: My understanding of the UK law is that they have to catch you in the act. So it's perfectly legal to own a TV/media device that is capable of receiving, just not legal to use it if you don't have a valid TV license.They only very recently updated the law to cover devices other than TV's (such a recorders, laptops, mobile devices, etc..), and there was some talk that they have methods of sniffing your WiFi and looking at the packet structure and pattern to work out if it is coming from monitored servers (such as BBC's iPlayer) - no idea if it's true though.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 23, 2017, 10:25:21 am
content: Quote from: fcb on May 23, 2017, 10:11:44 amIn UK you just show that TV is not connected to any antenna and it's enough (my sister done this).QuoteBS, unless someone is an idiot, WiFi is encrypted. And if it's not, virtually anyone can use your internet. In theory, if your internet provider discloses address/ip address relation, then they could track it on iPlayer server side. But even then, it becomes a very muddy area. With modern portable devices you can pay for a licence, then go somewhere else, say restaurant or friend's home, connect your laptop to WiFi and watch iPlayer.

author: CJay
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 23, 2017, 10:28:56 am
content: Quote from: fcb on May 23, 2017, 10:11:44 amKind of, it has to be 'installed' which means plugged in to power and an antenna.For Students covered by the home licence the equipment has to be self contained, I.E. battery powered and have its own antenna built in, plugging it into mains or an external antenna means it's unlicensed.Those requirements may have changed recently though.

author: RGB255_0_0
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 23, 2017, 11:08:32 am
content: It's only a matter of time before iPlayer requires your TV Licence number before allowing you to watch. They've recently began coercing you to log in, and soon it will be mandatory. So far it's to "better personalise content", which is clearly bullshit.

author: CJay
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 23, 2017, 11:57:55 am
content: I dislike DRM or region locking on things I'd happily pay for but it seems fair to me that those who consume the content should pay for it and it's no more restrictive than ITV, C4 or the others who stream or allow 'catchup' on their programs.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 25, 2017, 04:42:52 am
content: You guys think you have it bad, look at the very end of this video at around 38:30 and you'll find that some people are asked to pay a very high price, the ultimate price, for watching TV reruns.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 26, 2017, 03:36:59 am
content: Interesting!Really, how could they be so stupid!Have you ever seen the hilarious Chinese spoof video about "North Korea's 007" ? Example..

author: dominicM
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: May 27, 2017, 04:26:33 pm
content: Similar story in Ireland, if you have a device capable of receiving a TV signal you must pay the licence fee every year. I never paid it and in practice you won't end up in court unless you really push it. I do remember reading about one guy whole was taken to court even though the tuner was removed but not sure how that worked out in the end. The inspector came buy just last week though I didn't open the door thinking he was a salesmen. Doesn't matter anyways since I now only have a 40" monitor