PC LCD Monitor - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: elcomtel
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 23, 2013, 11:03:01 am
content: I'm one of these 'old fuddy-duddy' type of people who resists change in technology just for the sake of change. Just 'cos' it's new doesn't make it better. I've been putting off buying a new LCD monitor for my personal PC.I've decided to 'bite the bullet' and upgrade from my two 17" CRT monitors that I currently use.My PC is a twin PIII (ASUS VP6 motherboard) 1GHz with 2GB of 133MHz SDRAM with a Dual Head G450 Matrox video card.Matrox G450 Video Cardhttp://www.matrox.com/graphics/en/products/legacy/g_series/g450/Maximum resolutions (per display)Main display: 2048 x 1536Secondary display: 1600 x 1200Old analog VGA DB15 standard.My intention was always to always to run dual VGA LCD monitors.These days there seem to be some impressively large LCD monitors that is causing me to reconsider my desire for two monitors to have one large wide-screen monitor.A couple of years ago I was going to acquire two DELL 27" IPS monitors.I will be using my PC as a Electronics Engineering 'hack' to run various CAD and EDA programs such as Altium Designer, GIMP, LabVIEW and an assortment of IDE for various compilers, just to give an idea of some of the graphics intensive applications, not to mention the gamut of typical office class applications.I always err on a fine line between performance and value, preferring to make decisions on value because computer equipment depreciates so quickly, so I don't like to invest money into hardware.Given that my ideal LCD monitor is Hi Res, fast refresh, true colour rendering and over 27" (as large as possible),has a VGA analog DB15 interface with HDMI.Given that I was prepared to spend the money on two LCD monitors is there a single LCD monitor that will outperform a two monitor setup.While I could have done my own research with Google to answer my question I like to listen to other peoples ideas and suggestions.What is a good single LCD monitor that is at least 27" without breaking the budget?Should I buy a monitor with DVI-? interface and use a VGA-DVI adapter so that I have a more modern LCD monitor that can work better with more modern video interface standards if I decide to upgrade my motherboard with graphics card with something more up to date?What kind of LCD monitor will support 2048 x 1536 ?I'm trying to search eBay with --->monitor 2048 1536and nothing comes backValue is of utmost importance.I would love to hear your ideas.Many thanks in advance.

author: apelly
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 23, 2013, 11:07:56 am
content: You're looking for tomshardware.comTrust me.

author: dr_p
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 23, 2013, 11:38:47 am
content: Quote from: elcomtel on October 23, 2013, 11:03:01 amthose are present on Google too, but let's say I bite: get the cheapest 22" LED monitor that has VGA.P.S. VGA is analog, DVI is digital, but DVI can be DVI-I or DVI-D. The I variety also has the analog pins used for VGA-DVI coversions. The DVI-D doesn't and you cannot use a converter to VGA.

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 23, 2013, 11:51:48 am
content: Two monitors is always better than one.2048 x 1536 doesn't exist in the world of consumer LCDs (it maybe available on custom CAD LCDs but they are super expensive).Common LCD monitor resolutions are1024x768 1280x768 1280x1024 1440x9001600x1050 1600x1200 1680x1050 1920x10801920x1200I'm pretty sure the matrox G450 doesn't support any widescreen resolutions so your only option, LCD wise, is 2x 19" or 20" non widescreen (1280x1024 or 1600x1200).24" and 27" will always be widescreen unless it's something custom and expensive.Quote from: elcomtel on October 23, 2013, 11:03:01 amI question whether Altium Designer will even run on a PIII with G450. I doubt the G450 has enough OpenGL/Direct3D support to meet the 3D requirements and Altium may need P4 cpu extensions. (Unless you mean an older version you're already using)If i was you i'd try to upgrade the PC to something with 2 cores. No need to pay money if you don't want to, you should be able to get a much faster PC for free. Seriously, people throw away lower spec core2 duo's.Couple that kind of system with any 7000 series or later nvidia graphics card and you will be fine for running altium and other CAD stuff and any LCD including widescreen ones(7000 series is also very old now and should be easy to find for free)

author: dr.diesel
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 23, 2013, 12:14:54 pm
content: I've been using one of these for the past year, love it:http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824236294Resolution is 2560 x 1440, however you must have a dual link DVI capable card to use it. Most current gen HDMI ports are a max of 1920x1080.

author: rexxar
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 23, 2013, 02:21:13 pm
content: I second Psi's opinion. Get an old, discarded core2. With your new pci-e slot, you can drop in a better card. I like the GeFORCE 8400, I think it cost me a whole $30 on Amazon, and it keeps up enough that my processor is the biggest bottleneck for me. It also has reasonable overclocking capabilities, if you're into that.Quote from: elcomtel on October 23, 2013, 11:03:01 amOne P3 wasn't bad enough?Seriously though, you're long overdue for an upgrade, I think.

author: mariush
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 23, 2013, 05:06:46 pm
content: Please for whatever is holly in this world, stop using VGA for anything above 1600x1050... the vga cables that come with lcd monitors are shit, thin, noise catching antennas.There's no ... 2048 x 1440 ... there's 2560:1080 or 2560x1440 (16:9).To get that you're looking at 27" lcd monitors or better, and dual dvi or displayport connection.Price wise, you're better off with 2 x 24-27" lcd monitors that work at 1920x1200 or 1920x1080. Plenty of IPS monitors matching these parameters and they work with regular DVI/HDMI/Displayport cables (cheap and good).Should I buy a monitor with DVI-? interface and use a VGA-DVI adapter so that I have a more modern LCD monitor that can work better with more modern video interface standards if I decide to upgrade my motherboard with graphics card with something more up to date?A lot of monitors that have dvi and vga ports in the back have dvi configured as digital only. monitors that have only dvimayhave the vga part connected but there's no 100% guarantee - if they do then you may use a vga to dvi adapter. But please, forget about vga and high resolutions on lcd monitors. You DO notice the difference in clarity, sharpness and so on between vga and digital connections.I agree with what the others say here... Get a Core2 Duo or an AMD and get a plain Radeon card with 2 DVI or 1DVI+1HDMI outputs and you can easily connect two monitors at same time (but be aware radeon cards usually have only one vga/analogue output)edit: as i had to come back and edit some typos.. an answer to tom66: of course the vga cables back then were of much better quality, shielded pairs of cable in an extra shield, with ferrite beads at both ends and so on. LCD monitors these days come with crap vga cables, with copper clad aluminum wires, unshielded, ferrite bead only at one end etc etc...

author: tom66
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 23, 2013, 06:41:10 pm
content: My VGA cable can do 1920x1080p 60Hz crystal clear. The poundshop VGA cable has an awful image, I think this cable came with some computer I bought a long, long time ago.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 23, 2013, 08:13:46 pm
content: Quote from: mariush on October 23, 2013, 05:06:46 pmThe problem is that the G450 can only display its highest resolution on the analog output. Digital goes to 1200 something so read the specs of the G540 very carefully before buying a monitor. I had to upgrade my G450 to a P690 in order to use two high res LCD monitors.

author: amyk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 23, 2013, 08:47:11 pm
content: Quote from: Psi on October 23, 2013, 11:51:48 amActually there's oneverypopular consumer product that has one... the iPad 3 and its successors, and the panel itself is rather cheap. It's only 9.7" though, which means an insanely high DPI for desktop use, but it is rather easy to use as a monitor:http://hackaday.com/2013/04/22/connect-a-retina-display-to-a-regular-computer/Now how about someone figure out how to tile 4 of these and use them as a 19.4" 4096x3072 monitor?And VGA works fine for 2048x1536, with a suitably good cable.

author: edavid
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 23, 2013, 08:49:24 pm
content: If you want to use VGA, your best upgrade would be to get a couple of used 20" 1600x1200 IPS monitors, such as Dell 2007FP (maybe $100 each).For a single monitor upgrade, you could get a Catleap or similar 27" 2560x1440 IPS ($300-400), but then you would need a dual-link DVI card as mentioned.The ultimate would be a 30" 2560x1600 IPS monitor, but they are pretty expensive ($600-1000).

author: Phaedrus
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 23, 2013, 09:44:00 pm
content: Or you could use a modern $100 GPU that supports 2-3 DVI/HDMI monitors right out of the box. You'd need to upgrade away from your Pentium 3s, but you should have done that 10 years ago anyway...I can respect a certain amount of technophobia and hanging on to old kit, but there comes a point where you're spending more, and sacrificing more, on backwards compatibility than it would cost to just use modern technology.Why stick with two VGA LCD monitors (with likely poor image quality) when you could use 2-3 digital LCD monitors with much higher resolution. I've experienced it, and I have to tell you, 3x 2560x1440 is amazing. And those monitors are only $400/ea these days if you buy the Korean off-brands (which use the same LG panels as the expensive ones).

author: elcomtel
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 23, 2013, 10:44:40 pm
content: Quote from: dr_p on October 23, 2013, 11:38:47 am@dr_pWith that advice I went off to eBay to discoverSamsung SyncMaster S22A150N 22 inch LED LCD Monitor Full HD 1080p 1920x1080 5msfor only $100See:http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/181226584028For the Australian market this is a very good price.The Matrox G450 will handle the Samsung's 1920x1080 resolution.Two 22" LCD monitors is quite a lot of screen size for only $200.I often need lots of windows opened (IDE, a couple of PDFs at the same time, a web browser) and I often have more than two PCs running (I'm not a software guy so I don't use virtual machines on VMWARE) at my desk, so having two monitors is a good thing for me.I've also fulfilled my requirement for good value.Thanks to everyone who contributed to my question. I could have done my own research with Google and used sites such as Tom's Hardware or CNET and so on, but throwing this question out to a public forum and observing what came back delivered a much better result than I could have achieved on my own.

author: tom66
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 23, 2013, 11:03:11 pm
content: Beware of those Samsung monitors, they have an ugly firmware bug.Whatever you do, do not install the software on CD from Samsung.It installs a driver on your PC which periodically updates the firmware of the monitor over the VGA or HDMI/DVI cable.If the cable comes loose, the computer goes into sleep or there is a power cut, the firmware of the monitor gets corrupted. This bricks the monitor (most cases leaving it with a "no signal" display, or sometimes preventing it from powering up at all.) It is fixable, but requires a second monitor to complete the update.I have the 24" A350 on my desk which is a nice monitor, I bought it from a computer supply shop very cheap with the aforementioned fault. Black level is poor, but that's kind of expected from a cheepish LCD. Uniformity, sharpness and colour is excellent, even on VGA (does 1080p over VGA too!) Did a little teardown and it's well made, just a single main board with one chip and an LED driver, and nothing else. Power brick gets roasting hot so would suggest that is kept away from feet. Will run off a DC 12~14V input but has a proprietary connection for its power brick.

author: mariush
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 23, 2013, 11:39:27 pm
content: Quote from: elcomtel on October 23, 2013, 10:44:40 pmSeriously, do yourself a favor and spend $5-10 more on each monitor to get one that also has digital input. Buying a vga only monitor today is just silly... like buying a cassette player these days which doesn't have a cd drive.

author: elcomtel
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 24, 2013, 12:42:04 am
content: Quote from: mariush on October 23, 2013, 11:39:27 pm@mariush, you are right on the money. I don't know what I was thinking. I became so focused in my immediate needs that I lost sight of the bigger picture.Minimum should be with VGA, DVI(digital) and HDMI.For this reason I am very keen on the Asus PA248Q (which has VGA, DVI, HDMI) 24" LCD LED monitor that is highly regarded.I haven't been able to find out how a Asus PA248Q will work with the Matrox G450 graphic card.

author: amyk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 24, 2013, 02:13:17 pm
content: Quote from: tom66 on October 23, 2013, 11:03:11 pmThat's incredibly stupid. The fact that something as simple as a monitor even needs firmware updates is disturbing enough, but to not make it failsafe!? I have a few Samsung monitors from a few years ago and they work perfectly fine with whatever firmware they came with.

author: tom66
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 24, 2013, 04:27:01 pm
content: There is a failsafe, you can still upload the firmware if it is bricked, but it requires a second non-Samsung monitor to do so.