New bench, hoping my selections aren't outdated - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: capt.asic
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 05:26:17 am
content: Just looking to get a thumbs up that things aren't BAD choices in 2022. I need a new bench here in Japan, so I'm looking at the following 3 items:Rigol 1054Z scope - should pair nicely with my Saleae Logic Pro 8Siglent SPD3303X power supply - I'm mostly working 1-12vdcFLIR DM93 multimeter - need TRMS and handheld type, unless someone can give me a good argument to go benchtype.Being in Japan, space is extremely limited so many of my choices gained points for size.

author: RoGeorge
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 06:10:01 am
content: Rigol DS1054Z is a nice scope, I have one and been very happy with it, but it's a while since it was designed. Meanwhile, a similar 4 channel appeared from Siglent, and for about the same price it has extra features.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 06:39:30 am
content: Nothing wrong with the Rigol DS1054Z.Quote from: RoGeorge on June 03, 2022, 06:10:01 amSiglent is betterin some areasbut it costs more, so.It all depends on the relative prices of Rigol vs. Siglent where you liveandhow important FFTs are to you. If you're working on Arduinos and digital stuff then there's not much advantage.(nb. audio-frequency FFTs can be done better with a cheap sound card than a Siglent)

author: jeremy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 07:03:47 am
content: I have the first two items. The 1054Z is fine, but the rigol 5000 series is a *lot* better in the UI area (it is much more responsive). But it does cost more.The Siglent PSU I use every day. Absolutely no complaints and I am getting close to buying a second one.I have never actually seen a FLIR multimeter in real lifeAre they more common in Japan? My own rough idea for handhelds is that keysight and fluke are top end (in terms of price, not necessarily worth it though!) and more budget friendly is something like Uni-T. If I was just playing with electronics at home, I would be able to do everything with a Uni-T I think. Maybe an EEVBlog meter also?

author: capt.asic
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 07:08:02 am
content: Love too hear nothing is bad. Since the meter seems to be the only "questionable" item, I really only chose FLIR because it appeared good, was black, and has TRMS. My current meter in the US is an extech something that I paid around $80 for. I'm open to anything same or better than what I have there.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 07:12:09 am
content: Quote from: capt.asic on June 03, 2022, 07:08:02 amWhat do you feel is missing from your extech? There's lots of cheap meters with TRMS and owning two (or more) meters is always better than just one no matter how good it is.I'd have thought Hioki would be the go-to "luxury" meter brand in Japan.

author: jeremy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 07:15:38 am
content: Quote from: Fungus on June 03, 2022, 07:12:09 amI would have thought Kyoritsu or Yokogawa. I have a fancy Kyoritsu clamp meter (which is definitely overkill for me) which is build like a tank.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 07:16:28 am
content: Quote from: jeremy on June 03, 2022, 07:03:47 amThe only thing theyreallydo better than other brands is tick little corporate checkboxes.

author: capt.asic
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 07:26:34 am
content: I'm not really missing anything from the extech I have in the USA, I just need something here in Japan since this is "home". I even looked at picking up an ‎EX355, which runs about 17,000JPY. We have KAIWEETS True RMS for under 4,000JPY, but I have never heard of them and they look like a "chinese ripoff"

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 08:10:49 am
content: Quote from: capt.asic on June 03, 2022, 05:26:17 amInstead get the somewhat cheaper X-E model then research here how you can go about improving it.Consider a SDS1104X-U or if you have the budget SDS1104X-E for all the additional bells and whistles it has.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 08:23:22 am
content: Yeah, don't get Kaiweets.For a "cheapo" meter I'd get something by Zoyi. Their new ZT303 looks tempting:https://zotektools.com/products/zt-303/https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000224226842.html

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 08:25:36 am
content: Quote from: capt.asic on June 03, 2022, 05:26:17 am- I'd go for the GW Instek GDS-1054B oscilloscope. Better performance compared to the Rigol 1054Z which is extremely outdated.- Look at the GW Instek gpp-4323 PSU. Also acts a load and has a numeric keypad for easy entry of settings- Vici VC8145 is a nice bench DMM. It never runs out of batteries and can be stacked (on top of a PSU for example)

author: Kleinstein
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 08:29:48 am
content: With the DMMs there is a lot of choice and competition. True RMS is no longer an exclusive feature and it can be found even in rather cheap ones. The question is more like the BW and response time of the RMS readings. For the TRMS solution there are 2 ways to be found in the handheld meters:1) with an analog RMS converter, with often reasonable good frequency response also to cover the audio range, but a bit sluggish response2) with digital RMS with a fast response but with handheld meter usually a limited frequency response (e.g. 1 kHz with the Uni-T 139)With modern auto ranging DMMs slow ranging in the ohms mode can be anoying and some meters are worse than others in this respect.The other point is on how important the protection / safety is. So is the meter used with mains or maybe even CAT3 situations.With many DMMs the safty specs are dubious. So selecting a meter for mains use needs extra care. If one does not care about mains, a cheap meter may be sufficient and worst case get a 2nd meter later.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 08:46:08 am
content: Quote from: nctnico on June 03, 2022, 08:25:36 amThat, too.Instek prices vary a lot by region but sometimes it's very close to Rigol. If that's the case then get one.

author: TurboTom
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 09:01:30 am
content: If bench space is a major concern, you may consider Rigol's DP832 PSU since it permits operation oriented vertically placed on its "rear" on the floor next to your bench. I often use mine like that and find it very useful. Admitted, when placed on the bench, it's rather deep. It provides three channels with all kinds of pipes and whistles and a decimal keypad which I consider a "must have" for a modern, digitally controlled lab PSU.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 12:18:38 pm
content: Quote from: Kleinstein on June 03, 2022, 08:29:48 amI agree. For use on mains (or other sources that can deliver a large amount of energy) I always buy a DMM from an A-brand.

author: jeremy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 12:19:53 pm
content: Be careful of the gpp-4323 if you want ethernet; it seems hard to buy one with the option installed (at least in AU). It is the reason why I bought a siglent PSU at the time as it comes standard.

author: AVGresponding
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 01:09:35 pm
content: You might want to consider a Brymen BM789 or EEVBlog BM786, not sure what the availability is like there though.

author: BeBuLamar
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 02:16:50 pm
content: Being in Japan you don't consider Yokogawa, Kyoritsu and Hioki? I think those companies make good instruments.

author: KevinA
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 04:07:01 pm
content: A few years ago, I met one of my old employees, who had left me to join another company.He recounted to me about a workshop inspection where their main contractor was looking over their company. He was petrified when it came to inspecting his department. He explained to the inspector that because of thermal drift, the door had to be kept closed to ensure accuracy of his equipment.The inspector had seen all he needed to se. He smiled at my friend and said "In five years time, you will; have the best equipment money can buy, but you will still be designing the top class equipment that you make here. It is not the equipment, but your ability to use what you have that makes you so good".

author: capt.asic
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 08:59:04 pm
content: Instek are 3x Rigol from what I'm finding, so if i go that route, I'll have to pack in a suitcase on a trip to the USA, lolI did find a HIOKI DT4253 for a price I'm willing to pay, so that answers my DMM need I guess. Just need to keep the eyes peeled for the scope and psu.

author: capt.asic
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 09:07:09 pm
content: just managed to find a good price on siglent 1104x-e, 1104x-u, and 1202x-e, all within a few coins of eachother

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 09:20:14 pm
content: Quote from: capt.asic on June 03, 2022, 09:07:09 pmSDS1104X-E is the pick of the bunch by a significant margin if you have the budget for it.

author: talenphillips
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: June 03, 2022, 09:29:36 pm
content: Quote from: capt.asic on June 03, 2022, 05:26:17 amI'm genuinely shocked that this scope is 20 USD more expensive than when I bought it in 2015... and yet somehow it remainsone of the best dealsI can find. Not to mention unlocking it made it unbeatable at that price. FYI the unlocker program and the firmware modifier still both work like a charm. I just updated the firmware and put a custom boot screen on it a few hours ago.If you don't need all 4 channels, check out the DS1102Z-E, which is essentially the same scope but 110 USD cheaper.Otherwise it really looks like the SDS1104X-U is the same scope. I don't have enough information to say which is better.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2022, 07:36:39 am
content: Quote from: capt.asic on June 03, 2022, 09:07:09 pmBeware: The 'u' models have a lot of missing/downgraded features compared to the 'e' models.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2022, 07:47:40 am
content: Quote from: Fungus on June 04, 2022, 07:36:39 amThey are also different HW to meet a lower target cost price.