Electronics parts shortage leads to coffee shortage? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: VK3DRB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 11:03:35 am
content: There is a world wide component shortage. Anyone who buys from Digikey or Mouser will know this. Some leading-edge MLCC's eg: 10uF, 0603, X7R, are almost impossible to get - certainly at a reasonable price. Here is a very interesting article on the cause of the problem and guide to survival...https://resources.altium.com/pcb-design-blog/design-survival-guide-in-a-world-of-parts-shortages?utm_source=altiumdatabase&utm_medium=email&mkt_tok=eyJpIjoiTmpNek1XTm1Nek5oWlRJeSIsInQiOiI4aGF5YTc0REdFYWJYb3NRTU14SFFKUWhmbDkzOGN1dVlWZFVtMkxUZlJWbm41S1wvQ0FuSTQzbVJYbWtpNDZ5UHkwTG02VEhNUTlGaERocWdlWU5IVGc5cVVnQU9JaEhLVHZoQm9nd1wvZHJPQk5Pdm9yTlBFMFV6R2RPVXhLV1FkIn0%3DThe parts shortage is a headache and a half. Even a new design we have been working on for 9 months is now finding many MLCC's are now zero stock with long lead times and the pursuit of alternatives is time consuming and a little risky. X7R's and C0G's are getting scarce. One vendor recently gave us a lead time of 998 weeks (19 years) for a capacitor. But despite the article saying there might be a coffee shortage - that will not affect me in any way as I have never drunk coffee and do not know what it tastes like.What do you think the flow-on effects of this long term parts shortage will be:Higher prices?Lower quality products?Brokers getting rich from the grey market?Engineers leaving the profession?An eventual glut of parts that are now scarce?Creative engineering to avoid rare parts?Coffee shortage as addicted engineers work long hours to find component alternatives?

author: mikeselectricstuff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 11:15:54 am
content: Quote from: VK3DRB on November 19, 2018, 11:03:35 amFrom the article :QuoteBullshit.Nobody specs 100nf 1% ceramic caps

author: LapTop006
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 11:54:15 am
content: Quote from: VK3DRB on November 19, 2018, 11:03:35 amThe other day I had to pay 30c for an 0603 capacitor from Digikey (one of 0.1u, 1u or 10u, the other two were cheap).

author: bd139
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 12:21:54 pm
content: Where the fuck are people looking?There's over 6 million 100nF in stock here (Yageo X7R)https://lcsc.com/product-detail/Multilayer-Ceramic-Capacitors-MLCC-SMD-SMT_100nF-104-10-50V_C14663.html1 million 10uF in stock here (Samsung X5R)https://lcsc.com/product-detail/Multilayer-Ceramic-Capacitors-MLCC-SMD-SMT_SAMSUNG_CL10A106MQ8NNNC_10uF-106-20-6-3V_C1691.html

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 01:02:30 pm
content: Quote from: bd139 on November 19, 2018, 12:21:54 pmBecoming an LCSC fanboy, are you?

author: mikeselectricstuff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 01:16:44 pm
content: Digikey also have plenty of 0603 100nf. interestingly a lot of different lines are are showing Qty 40K - I wonder if they are rationing...

author: bd139
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 01:43:40 pm
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on November 19, 2018, 01:02:30 pmYeshttps://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/ceramic-multilayer-capacitors/1364098/<-- this is whyBasically what's happening is close manufacturing and suppliers close to origin are getting the stock and the main distributors in the West are at the end of the food chain.Honestly I have considered starting a logistics company at this time to get some of the high demand stuff here because it is available. Some premium price gouging is possible for sure and I'm not ashamed to leverage it.

author: T3sl4co1l
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 06:45:51 pm
content: Quote from: bd139 on November 19, 2018, 12:21:54 pmYeah, show me one with a C(V) curve.Tim

author: bd139
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 07:14:57 pm
content: Samsung part ... datasheet near end:http://www.sphere.bc.ca/test/production-parts/samsung-chip-cap.pdfSearch “electrical characteristics”

author: T3sl4co1l
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 07:18:58 pm
content: What, "CAPACITANCE - DC VOLTAGE CHARACTERISTICS"?There are no part numbers on that. There aren't even any values on that.From the Samsung char sheets Ihaveseen (seems like they're batting about 0.24 at Digikey, as far as having a char sheet linked AND the link working), those curves are as meaningful as a Jackson Pollock!Tim

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 07:22:54 pm
content: Quote from: mikeselectricstuff on November 19, 2018, 11:15:54 amAhahah, indeed! Never seen any design using 100nF bypass caps requiring 1% tolerance or even 5%. That's hilarious!Obviously the guy is just giving an example but is probably more a top-level manager than an actual engineer.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 07:45:21 pm
content: Quote from: VK3DRB on November 19, 2018, 11:03:35 amYou left out: creative clever design so to not need the #'s of MLCCs we currently use.Particularly for decoupling, they're plastered all over PCB's as insurance against decoupling woes when some simple use oflocal and fastbulk capacitance could serve a similar purpose.I'm sure Dave did a vid on this not too long ago...........a few in fact !https://www.eevblog.com/2018/05/05/eevblog-1081-are-bypass-capacitors-really-needed/https://www.eevblog.com/2018/05/19/eevblog-1085-bypass-capacitors-visualised/https://www.eevblog.com/2018/09/03/eevblog-1117-pcb-power-plane-capacitance/Sharpen your pencils and get on with it !

author: boffin
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 08:03:47 pm
content: If they're just decoupling caps, check out the price of 0.082, 0.068 or 0.15. I'll bet the availability is a lot better

author: KL27x
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 09:04:46 pm
content: Yeah, I'm not worried at all. If you designed it, you should know what other caps will work. As long as it's not a project where changing a decoupling cap will necessitate additional testing/validation, then it should be no problem to find an alternative that isn't this magic multiple of 10 in value.My favorite engineering inquiry, regarding substitution of a resistor, I stated "Rx can be any sized resistor you can place/reflow on the pad, with any value between 3K and 600K." (was a FET gate pulldown/up with a sub 1% duty cycle and push pull driver, already). Knowing they wouldn't know what to do with this, I also gave them an actual suitable part number/source. Predictably, they ordered the specific part. And I can't believe a large pcb assembler as they were doesn't have 20 lbs of suitable resistors lying around, already, waiting to be written off and thrown into the garbage.

author: ajb
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 10:08:30 pm
content: I've been bitten by a few cap choices where I picked a relatively high capacitance for its size part. Those have been challenging to replace, and in one case increased the per-unit cost on a recent board reorder by about 9% over the previous batchLesson learned there. For better or for worse, we're relatively low volume, so the price increases don't rack up like they would on higher volume parts, but on the other hand it's harder for us to do long-term purchase planning.

author: julianhigginson
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 10:35:34 pm
content: I had a horrible time with this earlier in the year (may? June?) For basic jellybean caps. But it seems a lot better now.