No more Oz $ <-> US$ <-> China Yuan  - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: BravoV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2013, 05:53:14 am
content: It is going to be Oz $ <-> China Yuan, US$ will be pulled aside.So does this mean the tsunami of Chinese even cheaper stuffs coming to Oz's shore ? Or else ?Interesting progress.Highlights :- Australian PM Julia Gillard begins six-day visit to China Friday- Gillard expected to secure major currency conversion deal with China- Currently, Chinese and Australian companies must use U.S. dollar as intermediary for trade- Deal would be step towards full convertibility of Chinese yuan on international marketsSource, CNN ->http://edition.cnn.com/2013/04/04/world/asia/australia-gillard-china-trip/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

author: Ed.Kloonk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2013, 07:54:35 am
content: Our dubious Prime Minister. Who knows what she might do next.

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2013, 07:59:29 am
content: Quote from: Ed.Kloonk on April 05, 2013, 07:54:35 amI do know that she will definitely support the carbon tax scheme until (her) bitter end.It's what she was put in place to do.About the currency thing, I just hope it means the Au$ will drift higher relative to the USD. Because, ebay.

author: BravoV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2013, 09:33:07 am
content: Quote from: TerraHertz on April 05, 2013, 07:59:29 amC'mon, you guys at down under have been enjoying the drift quite high since 2009 aren't you ?

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 05, 2013, 10:30:44 am
content: Quote from: Ed.Kloonk on April 05, 2013, 07:54:35 amWhatever it is, it won't be as bad as Abbott come SeptemberIt'll be our own Bush era

author: Galenbo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2013, 10:54:06 am
content: Quote from: BravoV on April 05, 2013, 05:53:14 amDon't be surprised if they start some war to avoid this.

author: mickpah
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2013, 11:25:08 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on April 05, 2013, 10:30:44 amThese is a newly installed NBN fibre hub 200 metres from my front door, just my luck these utter luddites will take over before its connected to my house. Fibre to the node what a fab alternative policy when most of the copper is 20 years old and bandwidth drops by more than 50% on a rainy day. Back to the 1960's we gogrrrrrrrrrr

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 05, 2013, 11:56:28 am
content: Quote from: mickpah on April 05, 2013, 11:25:08 amYep, genius policy huh?One of the few times the government does a BIG bold thing with my tax dallars that is good for the country in the really long term (even if it was to get elected short term), and now it's going to go down the toilet

author: digsys
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 05, 2013, 12:25:34 pm
content: Thanks !! Now you've got me depressed :-( A two-faced bitch with one unionist hand and an extreme green hand up her arsepulling the strings or a religious zeolot incapable of thought ! Just mouths "I want whatever THEY don't want" .... GREAT !

author: GeoffS
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 05, 2013, 01:55:23 pm
content: Not to worry, all the NBN fibre will be replaced with wireless, according toAlan Jones, well known Luddite shockjockit'll be much better.

author: SeanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2013, 03:17:20 pm
content: And here I am with a fibre running underneath me, but it is only a backhaul for a cellular site. I did say to the techs to leave a patch cord hanging out of the door but..............

author: MacAttak
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 05, 2013, 10:08:44 pm
content: Good to know we don't have a monopoly on bat-shit-crazy politicians over here in the lower 48

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 05, 2013, 10:26:40 pm
content: Quote from: digsys on April 05, 2013, 12:25:34 pmYes, two horse races are never good. In theory there is a viable third party in the Greens, but people vote like sheep.At least this year you'll be able to vote for Julian Assange in the senate (if you are in Vic).http://www.wikileaksparty.org.au/That'll at least shake up the system

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 05, 2013, 10:28:03 pm
content: Quote from: GeoffS on April 05, 2013, 01:55:23 pmYeah, because wireless has so much more bandwidth than fibre. Oh, wait...

author: Ed.Kloonk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2013, 10:56:39 pm
content: Seriously, you shouldn't be hatin' on Tony.I'll need Tony to tell me how to live my sex life. If I had one.

author: codeboy2k
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2013, 11:03:30 pm
content: Well John Titor did say that Australia becomes fed up with the USA and starts to have stronger ties with China, and during "the war" China tries to invade Australia, but you Aussies push them back and hold your ground. However, the result is that Australia becomes divided internally, he didn't say why that is.Not that I believe in John Titor, but I'm just saying....

author: lemmegraphdat
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2013, 01:07:46 am
content: Don't do it. The Chinese economy is just a phony as the US economy is. Both places are run by Reds.

author: GK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2013, 01:45:09 am
content: I thought the Republicans were the red ones?The deal with China looks OK to me, but it would be nice to see it properly leveraged by pressuring China into hardening its stance on North Korea.And who in their right mind should feel the urge to pointlessly vote for a narcissistic, pathological attention seeking cretin like Julian Assange? Any residual credibility that creep had thoroughly evaporated when he accepted "asylum" from a despotic regime; rather than simply face a Swiss court on allegedly frivolous charges with the best pro bono legal team anyone could hope for. But then things might all be over and done with rather quickly, the media spotlight wouldn't be on him any longer and he could no longer pretend to be a martyr, pontificating from his Ecuadorian hovel. Couldn't possibly have that! And of course as a result of his pathological attention seeking he continues to earn the unconditional admiration of paranoids and idiots the world over convinced that the whole court case is one big American plot to ultimately have him extradited to the states. The Swiss government couldn't legally ship him off to America even if America demanded it.

author: staxquad
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2013, 01:46:37 am
content: Quote from: BravoV on April 05, 2013, 05:53:14 amAustralia's population is China's rounding error.It's an opportunity for increasing trade with China in Australia's favour since China will take all it can get while Australia will take until saturation, without giving a cut to a hegemonic parasitic power who only uses it's privilege for imperialism (or uses imperialism to protect the privilege of a hegemonic currency).

author: staxquad
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2013, 02:38:41 am
content: Quote from: GK on April 06, 2013, 01:45:09 amAll American provocation against NK, then from the propaganda, more contracts with the Military Industrial Complex.Swiss? Sweden.Ecuadorian hovel?If you're all for Imperialism and crimes against humanity, then you would be against Asssange publishing evidence exposing such atrocities.Julian Assange is worthy of a Nobel Peace Prize, and the 2009 recipient of the Nobel Peace Prize is worthy of a trial in Den Hague.

author: GK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2013, 03:29:37 am
content: Yeah, Swiss/Swedish; my bad; they're typically incorrectly used interchangeably. Ecuadorian hovel - that little patch of land in London of course.And YAWN.I have many misgivings with American foreign policy, but that does not make me a brainless cheerleader for a self-absorbed creep like Julian Assange (and not a deluded apologist for the behavior of NK either) . The Nobel Peace prize is quite clearly a joke; so yeah, Assange is just as worthy of it as anyone else.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 06, 2013, 03:39:12 am
content: Quote from: GK on April 06, 2013, 03:29:37 amYou do have to admit that he would shake the political system up a bit though if he got elected.Or perhaps you prefer the status quo of Australian politics?QuoteAs was Obama's, only bigger.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 06, 2013, 03:41:00 am
content: Quote from: GK on April 06, 2013, 01:45:09 amSo who are you voting for in the senate next time around?

author: GK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2013, 03:50:07 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on April 06, 2013, 03:39:12 amFor the better? I hardly think so. The "status quo" is farcical enough already.

author: SeanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2013, 05:41:17 am
content: If I was in that state I would vote for him. At least there you know how he will be when in office, not like the rest of the 2 faced moneygrubbers. When last did you see a local pollie actually in the flesh other than during election time. Voted in they vanish and look to see just how much they can suck out for themselves.

author: GK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2013, 06:38:27 am
content: Quote from: Ed.Kloonk on April 05, 2013, 10:56:39 pmI'm pretty sure Abbot sees the NBN as little more than an expensive conduit for downloading porn.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 06, 2013, 06:57:54 am
content: Quote from: GK on April 06, 2013, 03:50:07 amHe can't make it any worse.Your personal hatred of his "narcissistic and pathological attention seeking" side of him aside, have you actually listened to him talk on various issues?He is articulate, incredibly knowledgeable on local and world affairs, with strong and clear views that don't flip-flop every day. His modern progressive viewpoint on social issues and openness would be a breath of fresh air in the world of politics. Streets ahead of any career politician I've seen for a long time.

author: peter.mitchell
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2013, 07:09:56 am
content: Woo! no import duty on goods valued below $1000!I'm so gosh darn annoyed with the NBN as it is; where i live they're replacing the ADSL with fixed wireless, however, i'm quite certain it will be unable to supply as much bandwidth with as low latency as adsl in my particular case.

author: GeoffS
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 06, 2013, 08:08:34 am
content: Quote from: GK on April 06, 2013, 06:38:27 amIt can be used for other stuff too?

author: GK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2013, 08:33:34 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on April 06, 2013, 06:57:54 amJust as a comparative example, I have listened to Kevin Rudd articulately speak at length on various issues of personal interest (Radio National / Late Night Live with Philip Adams) and it was difficult to comprehend that the person speaking was in fact the infantile and dysfunctional imbecile who's ridiculous antics I see broadcast on television and read about in the papers almost on a daily basis. However Rudd doesn't so much as hold up a candle to Assange, as far as questions of character go. It is also worth mentioning that it is very easy to give a consistent lip service, without "flip-flopping", to high and lofty ideas when one isn't bound to the working pragmatism required of an actual politician. Just ponder in hindsight how quickly (and all along utterly predictably) Obama fell into toeing-the-line mediocrity after winning office and all of the brainless sloganeering, jingoism and pathetically evangelical waves of "hope" for instant and miraculous reversals of fortune gave way to reality.............As for Assange, it seems to me naive at best to be willfully blind to his personal flaws and his questionable conduct in both his personal and business affairs, just because you happen to favorably connect with some of his views and/or expressed ideals on the way the world operates or how it should operate. There is also a limit to how far I can go along with Assange, or any dead-set admirer, on his political views. Like many protagonists on the far left he has at heart a Pilgeresque contempt and paranoia for the established Western democracies that makes him just plain blind, dismissive, disinterested, or even apologetic for evils born elsewhere. That, to me, indicates a serious shortcoming in moral judgement.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 06, 2013, 09:55:53 am
content: Quote from: GK on April 06, 2013, 08:33:34 amSo, who you gonna vote for in the sentate this year?

author: GK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 08, 2013, 09:06:23 am
content: Well I've ruled one candidate out!

author: David_AVD
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 08, 2013, 09:58:14 am
content: Several candidates yet no real choices eh?

author: peter.mitchell
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 08, 2013, 10:41:24 am
content: Is it irresponsible to not enroll to vote? I haven't yet as I don't particularly like any of the choices presented.

author: GeoffS
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 08, 2013, 11:34:49 am
content: Quote from: peter.mitchell on April 08, 2013, 10:41:24 amIt's illegal not to vote if you're eligible.Fortunately, I'm not eligible so can't be blamed for the current lot of clowns or the new set we'll get in September.

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 08, 2013, 01:15:29 pm
content: I haven't seen anything yet on how the Au$ to Yuan exchange rate will be set.It would be ironic (and bad for my US ebay needs) if it's to be a fixed rate. Just as China and Japan get into a 'my govt bonds printing press is bigger than yours' pissing contest.Sigh. It's sad to be short of funds when gold and silver are low.Quote from: Galenbo on April 05, 2013, 10:54:06 amThey're really trying hard this time, aren't they?I won't be surprised if the US navy Seals on Baengnyeong Island get a request for another Cheonan false flag incident. Or there's those two small diesel NK subs we're told were 'lost track of' a few days ago. So now if *someone* were to let off a nuke in some western harbor, of course NK would be blamed.

author: BravoV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 08, 2013, 01:42:54 pm
content: It is done deal ->http://money.cnn.com/2013/04/08/investing/china-australia-currency/index.html?hpt=hp_t3

author: peter.mitchell
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 08, 2013, 02:19:42 pm
content: Quote from: GeoffS on April 08, 2013, 11:34:49 amI'm pretty sure it's illegal to not vote if you're enrolled, but I'm not on the electoral roll, so i don't get called up for jury duty nor is my name on the list if i go to a voting centre.

author: jhalar
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 09, 2013, 07:16:12 am
content: Quote from: peter.mitchell on April 08, 2013, 10:41:24 amFriends of mine don't actually vote. They go to a polling booth, get a tick next to their name in the roll, place the empty ballot papers in the boxes and walk out. This is apparently legal.

author: GeoffS
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 09, 2013, 07:27:00 am
content: Quote from: jhalar on April 09, 2013, 07:16:12 amIs this their way of protesting something? Sounds easier and probably cheaper to pay the $20 infringement if not.

author: cwalex
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 09, 2013, 08:13:24 am
content: Quote from: peter.mitchell on April 08, 2013, 02:19:42 pmyeah, it is my understanding that if you never enrol you don't get fined. I think it is a loophole that not many know about. If you do enrol though, you are stuck with the fine if you don't vote.

author: David_AVD
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 09, 2013, 08:45:36 am
content: Quote from: jhalar on April 09, 2013, 07:16:12 amIt's called an informal vote in the results, sometimes referred to as a donkey vote.

author: GK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 09, 2013, 11:37:11 am
content: Quote from: David_AVD on April 09, 2013, 08:45:36 amI thought that was the term for actually selecting a candidate.

author: David_AVD
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 09, 2013, 12:39:05 pm
content: Quote from: GK on April 09, 2013, 11:37:11 amYeah, you vote and it seems a donkey always gets in !

author: Ed.Kloonk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 09, 2013, 12:53:06 pm
content: Quote from: David_AVD on April 09, 2013, 12:39:05 pmMore like an ass.But anyway...

author: Bored@Work
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 09, 2013, 04:42:45 pm
content: Quote from: David_AVD on April 09, 2013, 12:39:05 pmI though you are more into sheep there down under.

author: AlfBaz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 09, 2013, 04:45:30 pm
content: Quote from: Bored@Work on April 09, 2013, 04:42:45 pmThat's New Zealand

author: SeanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 09, 2013, 07:31:10 pm
content: Quote from: Mechatrommer on April 09, 2013, 12:52:47 pmAlso known as voting the cemetery. Very popular in some places, you have 150% voter turnout in places.

author: staxquad
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 09, 2013, 07:57:05 pm
content: Quote from: GK on April 06, 2013, 08:33:34 amthe ruling elite nurture their puppets into office, then the selected puppet reads the teleprompter after being electedthe ruling elite are so successful in their character assassinations that they leave no doubt that its far better to vote for complete corruption than to waste your votes on changing anythingstatus quo forever, and don't whine about what results, you caused it by not having a mind of your own (you being the general population)

author: GK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 12:18:55 am
content: Quote from: staxquad on April 09, 2013, 07:57:05 pmYeah no worries mate.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 12:31:38 am
content: Quote from: peter.mitchell on April 08, 2013, 10:41:24 amSure, but the fun part is you can voteagainstthe biggest idiot you hate, and help get them booted out. Worth turning up just for thatI've been thinking about running, just for kicks, so I could tweet a photo of my name on the ballotIf I got enough votes (but not win), the taxpayers would foot the bill for my next campaign.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 12:39:06 am
content: Quote from: jhalar on April 09, 2013, 07:16:12 amI don't know why?Why not give your vote to some independent, or one of the silly joke parties?BTW, "Donkey Vote" is an official term used by the AEC:http://www.aec.gov.au/Voting/Compulsory_Voting.htmAnd the Macquarie dictionary defines the term as numbering the candidates on the ballot in the same order as they are listed.A blank (or defaced!) form is an "informal vote".But Donkey Vote is often used to describe both.We have quite a high rate in Sydney:www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary_Business/Committees/House_of_Representatives_Committees%3Furl%3Dem/elect10/report/chapter9.pdf

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 03:20:47 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on April 10, 2013, 12:39:06 amBecause your vote will ultimately be redistributed to one of the major parties anyway. Thats the way our vote counting system works. If you vote  Jack-the-clown, then 2, 3, 4, etc for the groups you don't like, when Jack fails to get a significant proportion of the vote your vote slip is transfered to the next down your list of preferences. If that guy also fails to get a significant fraction, your slip is transfered again. And so on.The problem with this is that you can't avoid ultimately voting for people you loathe. For instance with both major parties supporting the US foreign wars, some people (me included) absolutely can't morally allow our vote to go to either labor or liberal.Years ago someone figured out that if you numbered your voting slip 1, 2, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3... it fixed this problem, Your vote was valid (you'd numbered every square), and you'd voted for the one or two guys you liked, but then your vote slip couldn't be reallocated to the guys you hated.This system was catching on, and was becoming a threat to maintenance of the illusion that the majority of people found one or the other of the two major parties acceptable. So the government banned it.The election year they banned it, I went to the trouble to get a JP to witness me casting a (banned) 1,2,3,3,3... type vote. So I've got a legally solid proof of having my perfectly good vote disenfranchised (since it would be counted as informal, ie discarded under the new law.)Too bad there's no way do anything about it.It's another example of the system being morally screwed. If you cast a blank or defaced vote, you're aiding evil by inaction. If you cast a valid vote, you can't avoid voting for evil.Personally I look forward to the year only lead weighted votes count.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 03:37:00 am
content: Quote from: TerraHertz on April 10, 2013, 03:20:47 amYes, there is. Get over it and continue to vote until one of the independents actually votes enough votes to get elected in!It's attitudes like the one you are suggesting that is the reason why the system never gets fixed. The attitude of hopelessness is self perpetuating.Using the old preferential voting system excuse is just a cop out.When it comes down to it, we have a system were essentially the person with the most number of votes wins. They can't win if you don't vote for them.It's worse in the US where a majority of people think their vote is "wasted" if they vote for an independent.

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 04:43:44 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on April 10, 2013, 03:37:00 amYou misunderstand. I meant I wanted to mount a legal case over having my perfectly good vote disenfranchised, even if it meant going to an international court. But my resources were insufficient. I do vote, for the reasons you give. Lesser of two evils, etc. But it still burns, that my vote ultimately goes to support people complicit in mass murder and the destruction of entire, innocent nations. DU weapons... sigh.QuoteYou are starting to show a bit of personal bias there Dave. Do you really think I sound like someone with a hopeless, apathetic attitude, prone to inaction?QuotePlease don't point at the US system as an example of anything other than utter, vile and perverted brokenness.Btw, speaking of minor parties, I have a story from the early days of the Greens party in Sydney. I was attending all the early public meetings, which iirc were held in a public hall in Balmain. A very interesting event occurred.Those early meetings were attended by honest, well-meaning, generally competent ordinary people, who genuinely believed there was a chance of creating an uncorrupted viable third party. The meetings were well run, operating along the lines of Roberts rules of committee - a chairperson, formal movements, clear voting, minutes carried forward, etc. It was going very well, the new party had a clear and sensible platform, attendance was rising, the group was getting a lot of media coverage and donations.Then all of a sudden... at one meeting there was an astonishing number of new faces. Curiously, they all seemed to be dressed as if they'd gotten up that morning and gone through their wardrobe looking for anything to make themselves look like 'trendy political progressives'. (None of the regular attendees were like that.) Scarves, beanies, Che badges, whatever. They were all extremely vocal and not a trace of shyness in loudly addressing a public meeting. As if they'd all had training in public speaking. They cooperated and supported each other, and were easily able to manipulate the meeting. Kind of like Zerg rushing, except no one had that concept label back then. Just about the very first thing they did, was propose and pass a resolution switching the meeting format from Roberts Rules to something they called 'consensus voting'. They all seemed to understand implicitly what this was. The rest of us learned.... it meant the most vocal, externally organized group rules.From that day on, forever, The Greens were a subverted organization. A front, predominantly controlled by TPTB, as a pretense that there's some valid 'opposition' to the status quo.The best way to control the opposition, is to BE the opposition.I could tell you some interesting things about the One Nation party's origins too.

author: Ed.Kloonk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 08:47:16 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on April 10, 2013, 12:31:38 amI just spilt bourbon all over the place!Dave, you are highly talented and very good at a lot of things.However, you and politics...You wouldn't like what they'd do to you anyhow.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 10:14:05 am
content: Quote from: TerraHertz on April 10, 2013, 04:43:44 amIn the case you stated, it didn't, you said it yourself. Your vote was invalid.So you have now given up doing that and cast a valid vote?

author: SeanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 06:31:44 pm
content: Enter Dave, nothing to lose other than needing a few hundred signatures ( probably doable just from the Aus blog members and friends) and then you are in the running.

author: AlfBaz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 09:38:52 pm
content: First point of order. If the libs win, renaming the NBN to NNN. National Narrow band Network

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 10:45:20 pm
content: Quote from: AlfBaz on April 10, 2013, 09:38:52 pm

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2013, 02:18:21 am
content: Call me paranoid if you like, but I can't help feeling a sense of doom every time the NBN is mentioned. The idea of a government running the design and implementation of a shiny new national Internet infrastructure... which ultimately will push aside the existing infrastructure that the government can't control. I don't think it will matter much which of the two major pretend-democracy parties are running it. It will still be used to gradually lock everything down tighter and tighter.The Australian government, that in the early days of the internet was seriously proposing to contract Microsoft to provide ALL internet services to Australia, via MS servers in the USA?The government, who wanted to charge higher phone bills for people who were using modems to log into BBSs?The government that wanted to make public use of encrypted electronic communications a criminal offense?The government who recently wanted to force ISPs to implement a mandatory black list of web sites; a blacklist that the government would give them?There are more examples, I just can't recall all of them right now.Oh wait, here's a good one.Years ago I had a friend who worked as a programmer at Telstra. To date this, I was in his office one day and he showed me Mosaic running - the first time I'd ever seen a web browser. One of his colleagues was away on holiday, so my friend let me sit in that office for a couple of hours having my first experience of the Internet. At one point I got curious about the papers sitting on that guy's desk, and had a quick read.They were the design for a system Telstra was implementing on the phone system servers. Which have 'data quality maintenance access' to the data streams of ALL phone connections. They were building a system to have software analyze EVERY SINGLE CONNECTION, and categorize it in a tree of data types. Whether it was voice or data. If data, what format - modem, fax, etc. If modem, what baud rate and standard. Once that was determined, to examine the user data and determine if encryption was being used. And then to determine what type of encryption.This was around the time the government was talking in general terms of making encryption illegal. So, they weren't just raising the issue, they (together with Telstra) were actually implementing the methods to enforce it. For all I/we know, they may have actually rolled it out, just waiting for the enabling legislation. (I can't ask my friend, because he died a few years later.)I wish I'd been a bit more nimble, and thought to photocopy a few choice pages. But didn't think of that till after leaving. Wasn't terribly savvy about government's total-control fantasies in those days.Forgive me if I never trust these bastards now.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 11, 2013, 05:16:01 am
content: Quote from: TerraHertz on April 11, 2013, 02:18:21 amSo what's your solution?Yes, they'll almost certainly cock something up.Yes, they'll almost certainly overspend.Yes, they'll almost certainly try (but will fail) and slip in pull some right-wing lobby group's pet idea (like filtering)Nothing new there.There are two issues here.1) The rollout of fibre to every home to secure this countries communications future.2) Actually designing and running the whole shebangIf our $40BN just got fibre to every home it's money ultimately well spent IMO.There is nothing wrong with the government owning the company that installs it, and also designs and runs it, in fact, IMO, that's how all essential community infrastructure should be (telecoms, water, sewage, roads, and power). Owned by the government, a.k.a the people.

author: peter.mitchell
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2013, 06:46:52 am
content: What I don't like about the criticism of this government's NBN plan is;Often criticized for poor progress. The criticism comes from the people who are trying everything in their power to slow it down, it's like you chasing and trying to tie lead weights to someones legs while they're running a marathon, and then saying "ha, you suck, you're slowwww"Often criticized for poor price estimates. As the contractors, pricing committees and analysts used would be essentially the same if the opposition did a cost analysis, their estimates would likely be off by the same factor.Essentially, regardless of which plan for the NBN, it would take a long time, cost a lot of money and suffer the same problems regardless of party, because thats how government funded projects go, contractors say "woo, Govt, how much can we charge for how little we do" then they get paid to do it. Essentially it comes down to "do you want to pay $20bn for a half assed job or $40bn for a good job, and you have to choose one, there is no backing out", personally, i'd say stuff it, if we have to pay, may as well get the good one.

author: Ed.Kloonk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2013, 07:43:42 am
content: Angry much?Serves you right for believing either gummit would actually build something.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 11, 2013, 08:17:08 am
content: Quote from: peter.mitchell on April 11, 2013, 06:46:52 amI agree. It's probably the biggest infrastructure project in Australia's history, with plenty of unknowns. Who'd wanna be the one to estimate the cost and time on that? Is there a pissing up the flag pole emoticon?It's a critical long project for our countries long term viability, and must/should be done at almost any cost, without any thought to how long it takes. The benefits will pay off over the next 50-100 years.My hat is actually off to the current government for proposing a project that is beyond the election cycle, it's pretty rare that they do that.

author: peter.mitchell
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2013, 09:49:50 am
content: http://m.smh.com.au/opinion/blogs/blunt-instrument/free-floppies-a-policy-flop-20130410-2hldq.htmlRegardless of what political party you side with, THAT is funny.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 11, 2013, 10:11:31 am
content: Quote from: peter.mitchell on April 11, 2013, 09:49:50 am*snort*

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2013, 03:00:38 am
content: Quote from: peter.mitchell on April 11, 2013, 09:49:50 amHeh. Looks like smh is trying to compete with The Onion.If I cared about any of these jokers, I could point out the article is ad hominem combined with well-poisoning, but meh.In reply to Dave's "So what's your solution?"a. I don't need to have a solution, to have an opinion the present path is probably going to work out badly.b. One good step towards a solution would be to remove legal restrictions on who can provide telecommunications services. For cable there's no need for spectrum allocation or any such controls. No licensing, no nothing. Just let the market do whatever it wants. Private line-of-sight laser linked local mesh networks, private local copper/fiber LANs/WANs, anything.c. The biggest infrastructure investment we already have, is Telstra's underground ducts. Use them.d. I agree getting fiber to every home (including in the outback) is #1 priority. But I don't see this as an excuse for ending up with a system in which the government controls the routing hardware.e. Allowing the massive investment in co-ax cable TV/net hardware dangling from the street poles, was hugely stupid. At some point all that crap is going to have to be taken down and sent to recycling.f. Yes, I agree large scale civil infrastructure (water, power, sewage, gas) should be government run. And selling such stuff off to corporate interests was/is a treasonous betrayal of the Australian people. But I'm not so sure about communications infrastructure. It wouldn't be good to have the government (or any small group, hint hint) controlling all newspapers, etc. Same goes for telecommunications, in an age when content is easily monitored and blocked based on content.g. Any telecommunications architecture that fundamentally includes DRM controls, media content rental, etc, is going to be obsolete after the revolution. Say what you like, but that's going to be the case. Our civilization has to get over this unworkable idea that data can be owned and rented out, or it's going to end in some nasty way.Nobody is going to try and manipulate the knowledge content of your water or gas pipe. But your internet content - everyone from your local church zealots up to the Rothschilds wants to control that in the baddest way. A net infrastructure has to be designed to STOP that happening, not assist it.Simple litmus test. Does the NBN allow individuals to realistically run publicly accessible web/ftp servers at home, with useful outgoing bandwidth, no extra cost, and no way for anyone else to restrict the content? I don't know. But I bet it doesn't. When asked, watch them switch from boasting about nearly limitless bandwidths, to talking about how intrinsic bandwidth limitations make such usage infeasible.Every time I go to the cinema and see the paid 'shiny happy people in a perfect world' advertisements for how excellent the NBN is going to be, my forebodings about this get worse.

author: DrGeoff
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2013, 03:12:36 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on April 11, 2013, 05:16:01 amI heard Conroy say the other day that the money being put in by the Government is only a loan, and will be paid back by NBN Co (with interest) from operating revenue. If so then the taxpayer is not burdened with the infrastructure cost, only an investment loan.NBN Co is likely to be sold off in a public float eventually, however it is not permitted to compete in the retail environment, only provide wholesale bandwidth.

author: jhalar
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2013, 04:40:06 am
content: Quote from: TerraHertz on April 12, 2013, 03:00:38 amIts up to the rules for your chosen ISP and plan as they control the layer 3 routing for your premises after your NBN POI.If one RSP does not allow you to have servers at home switch to another RSP that does.The NBN is only providing a layer 2 bitstream service, they do not care what is transmitted.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 12, 2013, 05:00:41 am
content: Quote from: TerraHertz on April 12, 2013, 03:00:38 amCorrect me if I'm wrong, but those cables (Optus/Foxtel) were installed by (and hence owned by) private corporations.QuoteI agree in principle, we should have done the NBN fibre solution a long time ago.But in my case, that cable is the ONLY way I can get any sort of reliable internet connection at my home, so I can't really complain.QuoteBut that fibre is just like your water pipe or power cables, no difference.Yes, if they control the infrastructure they can control what you can access, but remember that the people control the government. I'd rather have the government (i.e. me and you) own it and run it, than some privite corporation.The government at any time can make a law to direct the private companies to control the information too, so the issue remains either way.QuoteYou'll get no argument from me.QuoteSo once again, what it your solution?I don't think there is anything major stopping some private company getting equal rights to installing fibre to your home too in competition with the NBN. If there is then we as citizens need to put pressure on your elected government to allow that to happen if needed.But when putting fibre to every home costs $50BN+, you have to be realistic about how much freedom in competition you can realistically have in your base communications infrastructure.Once the NBN is built and running, if you don't like how it's run, then put pressure on and vote for the candidate that will push for those changes.

author: Ferroto
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2013, 05:27:45 am
content: Quote from: AlfBaz on April 10, 2013, 09:38:52 pmWe finally got Fiber in my small canadian town and I went from 600kbps(ADSL) to 50Mbps(Fiber) Trust me fiber internet is worth fighting for.

author: Ed.Kloonk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2013, 10:11:16 am
content: Quote from: Ferroto on April 12, 2013, 05:27:45 am