Which one to choose Logic Analyzers - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: itvend
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 04, 2014, 09:00:05 pm
content: So i was planning to buy logic analyzer after David's video about it but then i saw Saleae Logic 8 price. Now i feel like reposting but which on to buy? if at all. I want to debug SD Card and UART, SPI, I2C. I personaly would buy Open Workbench Logic Sniffer with my dumb brain.Open Workbench Logic Sniffer - 50$FeaturesCapture 50MHz+ waveforms on 32 channels200Msps captures up to 100MHz waveforms on 16 channels100Msps captures up to 50MHz waveforms on 32 channels16 buffered channels, 5volt tolerantM74LCX16245DTR2G transceiver tolerates voltages from -0.5V to +7V.216K Block RAM supports following memory configurations*8 channels with 24K sample depth16 channels with 12K sample depth32 channels with 6K sample depthExternal clock and trigger inputAllows interfacing with external test equipment and daisy chaining OLS's for additional channels.Internal clock and trigger output16bit wing expansion headerUSB interface, USB poweredUSB upgradable everythingDesigned for the SUMP logic analyzer clientOpen sourceLow priceMemory depth is the maximum supported by the hardware, the current firmware implements the following memory depths:8 channels with 16K sample depth16 channels with 8K sample depth32 channels with 4K sample depthScanalogic-2 Logic Analyzer and Signal Generator - 60$Basic information20MSPS (million samples per second) with Ultra precise, Quartz-based timings4 channels to be used for input, output or mixed mode (Record/playback)256K x 4 Sampling bufferTrigger position from 0% to 100%Decoding UART, SPI, I2C, 1-Wire, LIN1.x, LIN2.x, Maple bus and more with every software update!Saleae Logic 4 - 99$Basic informationDigital/Analog Inputs 1Digital Only Inputs 4Digital Sample Rates (max) 12 MS/sAnalog Sample Rates (max) 6 MS/s

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 04, 2014, 09:08:02 pm
content: The ScanaPlus V1 is currently on sale here and there since V2 was just released. I'd add it to the list as it's really nice. Besides. IkaLogic currently has a Xmas discount in their own shop.I also own the OLS which is still nice for the price, but the work on the GUI has slowed down in the last years and I guess the "Demon Core" advanced trigger settings will never be available in the GUI. Also the pretrigger setting doesn't really work when you use runlength encoding - which you want to use.

author: bktemp
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 04, 2014, 09:31:32 pm
content: With only 16k sample depth the Open Workbench Logic Sniffer looks almost useless to me if you want debug longer sequences like large SPI packets with idle/busy periods.

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 04, 2014, 09:40:26 pm
content: It has run length encoding, so it's pretty far from being useless.Then again, for really long recordings, a USB based analyzer is a more practical choice.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 04, 2014, 09:44:06 pm
content: Quote from: bktemp on December 04, 2014, 09:31:32 pmThat sounds like a classic case where you would want to use an external clock.Make sure there is a good ground near each data and clock connection, in order to ensure signal integrity and eliminate pattern sensitivity. You really don't want to have to debug your connections to the UUT!

author: PChi
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 04, 2014, 09:46:59 pm
content: One of the requirements was for SD Cards. SD Cards have a fair amount of protocol overhead, decoding it will be hard work and need plenty of memory depth. Ideally it needs an SD Card protocol analyzer, not cheap though.

author: marshallh
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 04, 2014, 09:54:43 pm
content: for both SD and SPI you want state recording mode and use the clock as a storage qualifier. I don't know that any of those will do that.Why not get an Altera fpga devboard, write some verilog to decode the protocol, and use Signaltap?

author: itvend
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 04, 2014, 09:59:25 pm
content: Quote from: PChi on December 04, 2014, 09:46:59 pmYes, i wanted to learn and hack sd card comm between host and card. I am student so i dont have hundreds of dollars free money the analyzer should be near 100$ and not perfect, i have cheap usb oscilloscope VDS 1022Ihttp://www.owon.com.hk/products_info.asp?ParentID=79&SortID=81&ProID=175#sthash.h7S6AxDX.dpbs

author: itvend
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 04, 2014, 10:02:17 pm
content: Quote from: marshallh on December 04, 2014, 09:54:43 pmsomething specific ? Altera fpga devboard??EDIT:FPGA-s may be to hardcore for me, studing new language is not easy.

author: PChi
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 05, 2014, 02:36:40 pm
content: Working out what the SD card protocol is doing is going to be hard work and requires access to the standards which aren't freely available.For SPI and I2C decoding the Saleae products work well (despite the name being impossible to pronounce).

author: itvend
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 05, 2014, 03:01:07 pm
content: i think we are far from topic just wanted to know which of these three i should buy or somthing better in the same price range, but all tips and tricks are welcome , thx you wery much all

author: free_electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 05, 2014, 03:42:40 pm
content: on the risk of opening another can of worms1) NONE of the mentioned products are logic analyzers. They are simply samplers streaming as fast as they can over a , timing indeterminate, usb port. No logic buffers, no proper input conditioning circuitry, no programmble levels , no state control engines , no qualifier logic , no nothing. you may as well put a video camera in front of an analog oscilloscope, record the trace that way and play it back in slow motion.2) the chances that you need a real logic analyzer are pretty slim. Unless you are designing million gate logic devices , are trying to trace a program running full throttle with source code tracing correlated to the pinched off samples from data and address bus of the target machine , or you are trying to find up setup and hold times on complex busses, or transaction decoding on transport buses.so stop calling these things logic analysers. they aren't, not in hardware, not in software. they are simply a multichannel , free running sampler with some protocol decoder bolted on in software. no warranties against missing packets, missed frames due to usb latency , or incorrect behavior due to improper input circuitry.Now that we have that out of the way. The salae's work great. I have one. use it for quick and dirty work.

author: aroby
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 05, 2014, 03:44:48 pm
content: I bought the Open Workbench device a while ago, more to play around with and learn. I haven't yet been able to figure out what software to use with it and also how to use it. It does not seem as simple as it's made out to be!Anthony

author: itvend
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 05, 2014, 04:24:46 pm
content: Quote from: free_electron on December 05, 2014, 03:42:40 pmI saw video about that. So is 4 channel salae good idea or bad i to need to do some quic and dirty stuff now i propably buy it.

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 05, 2014, 04:53:22 pm
content: Quote from: free_electron on December 05, 2014, 03:42:40 pmLetting aside if your definition is valid by any means, but the Open Logic Sniffer doesn't even meet that definition. It uses FPGA block RAM to store the samples ad its internal trigger logic mimics a HP 16550a.The scanalogic is also not a streaming device, but its triggering possibilities are extremely basic indeed.Quote from: free_electron on December 05, 2014, 03:42:40 pmA streaming LA can theoretically trigger on any indefinitely complex trigger pattern. That the triggering doesn't happen in real time would be only important if a trigger output was needed. But that is not a typical thing a logic analyzer would provide.Quote from: free_electron on December 05, 2014, 03:42:40 pmIt is true that most of the people development these devices are not experienced in high frequency design. Also some of the devices are limited by SW or HW to provide only extremely limited trigger possibilities that really make it difficult to call them logic analyzers. Anyway, some devices like the OLS (even though complex triggers are not supported by the GUI) and ScanaPlus have complex trigger possibilities that qualify them as LAs - independently of how they are working internally.

author: mrflibble
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 05, 2014, 08:04:18 pm
content: Quote from: 0xdeadbeef on December 05, 2014, 04:53:22 pmIndeed. Things like the OLS and Sump (on which it is based) sample to bram and have some simple trigger conditions. The newer verilog based version (demon core) does have that HP16550a like triggering, but unfortunately there is exactly zero client side support for those advanced triggers. At least AFAIK...QuoteMmmh? I'd think that a commercial logic analyzer surely can export the trigger condition. Darn handy if you want to trigger your scope to capture a trace when only such and such logic condition occurs. I did exactly that with a modified version of sump. Export LA trigger and trigger scope with it. I still don't understand why they didn't do that by default in the original sump/ols design.And what marshallh mentioned is indeed a good suggestion. Although I am biased because I do exactly that, but then the xilinx equivalent (chipscope). Run a small FSM to do decoding, and create trigger. Instantiate chipcore to have some more advanced triggers + have an ILA on the side for sanity checks. It's not pretty because you have the chipscope gui side by side with the OLS client if you want all the triggering, but what the hell, gets the job done. The main drawback with the FSM based decoder is you have to do a partial resynth + place & route for the FSM related block every time you do some other custom decoding. So I really really wish the client side support for those HP style triggers would materialize. Then I can ditch my horrible duct tape solution, and use that properly coded demon core.Anyways, OLS is not just a streamer. It does fast sampling, and main drawback currently is limited triggering. The fpga firmware has advanced triggering support, but the client software doesn't let you use it.

author: free_electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 05, 2014, 10:00:30 pm
content: Quote from: 0xdeadbeef on December 05, 2014, 04:53:22 pmi stand corrected. didn't know that. even then the 16550 is 45 years old... no loop triggering , no windowed times , no state loops. i;d like ot see things like the 167xx or 169xx blades have ... if this happens and within time y that happens , or this pattern flies by ( or a serial pattern flies by ) please show me the one million samples before and after that time , disassemble them and show me what the sourcecode looks like.that is what logic analyzers do. they are often coupled with source code debuggers/tracers and they do have hardware trigger interlink with scopes. ( i link my infiniiums with my LA's. when the La fires the scope fires as well. i can even run qualifiers between analog and digital domain ( using the trigger adapter box. The LA and scope's trigger in / out are interconnected and time skew is corelated using a common pulse. the data is transferred over an ethernet link between La and scope.Grab a t&M cataloge and look for Logic analyser and what those things can do. even in a cataloge form 1990 from HP or TEK. those little streamers and open logic sniffers don;t come close.heck a mixed signal oscilloscope has more functionality.Quotereal ones do. as they can interlink with other equipment like pattern generators and scopes.Quoteit's not just high frequency design. tracing a running cpu for example. Intel still uses these things today to test the bios or uefi code debug. they simply trace the io and can set trigger points in sourcecode which the analyser will react to.People think that an LA is just capturing ones and zeroes. You can do that with a ram and a counter. It is actually the pre and post analysis combined with very complex state and timing trigger qualification that is the most powerful aspect of these machines.a pc is not fast enough to do such things on the fly ( technically the pc is fast enough , but usb is a shitty transport medium with unguaranteed throughput and uncontrollable latency.

author: janoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 05, 2014, 10:20:18 pm
content: I have both the Open Bench Logic sniffer and a cheap Saleae Logic 8 clone from eBay.The Logic sniffer is good if you need to look at a wide bus, because you can have up 32 channels. That costs big bucks otherwise. Unfortunately, the software that is available for it is universally crap, as others said already. It also uses the block RAM in the FPGA to capture, so the amount of data you can record is very limited. Then there is a slow serial to USB converter to download the data in a PC for analysis. The RLL encoding is actually not working, at least I haven't found a single client software where it works correctly, so it will be happily filling its limited memory with useless dataAlso the project seems pretty much abandoned, thus I wouldn't recommend buying one of these today unless you want a cheap FPGA dev board.The Logic 8 (and their clones) - the software is basic, but easy to use. Unfortunately, the device has no own memory, so you are limited by the speed of the USB connection. 8 channels only, I haven't seen the cheap clones with 16. However, you probably will not want to use one of these for anything significantly more complex than some I2C, SPI or serial decoding, because there are no advanced triggers, limited sample rate, etc. The new Logic Pro series is significantly more capable, but also the price is a bit elsewhere than the $20 eBay clones.

author: Rasz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 05, 2014, 10:57:50 pm
content: Quote from: free_electron on December 05, 2014, 03:42:40 pmnot trueQuote from: aroby on December 05, 2014, 03:44:48 pmwhere did you get the idea its simple? Open Workbench Logic Sniffer was made to be CHEAP first, its very hardcore and requires a lot of screwing around (sometimes including rewriting verilog) to make it work the way you want itthere is also this in cheap category:http://www.seeedstudio.com/depot/DSLogic-p-2184.htmlit was a kickstarter, they started shipping recently, sadly not a single independent review yetI think they are also using Sigrok as the base GUI.

author: janoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 06, 2014, 03:06:47 pm
content: Quote from: Rasz on December 05, 2014, 10:57:50 pmUm, that's news for me. I have it in the drawer here and I certainly didn't need to touch any Verilog to make it work. The hardware itself is OK if you can live with its limitations (primarily the lack of dedicated RAM).What sucks is the *client software* (the one in Java). It can be made to work, but you will be swearing a lot, because it is quite buggy and the communication with the analyzer is rather fragile. Maybe sigrok has a more usable client for it, but I didn't want to spend hours setting that up.And re cheap - the original Saleae Logic 8/16 devices are made even cheaper than this (a single Cypress USB micro) and you weren't complaining about it.

author: PlainName
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 06, 2014, 03:25:20 pm
content: QuoteIndeed, but that doesn't define what is a logic analyzer. Simplistically, a logic analyzer analyzes logic signals - such analysis doesn't have to be all-singing and all-dancing, it merely has to look at logic signals and figure out something about them. Hell, if you want to be pedantic, just representing analogue inputs as valid logic levels goes a long way towards that.Most expensive logic analyzers will sample on a free-running clock. Are they then not logic analyzers when in that mode?I think you were telling us what makes a logic analyzer useful (particularly in the context of modern electronics) rather than what allows some equipment to be called a logic analyzer.

author: SteveyG
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 06, 2014, 04:52:04 pm
content: Quote from: marshallh on December 04, 2014, 09:54:43 pmNo one who has brains uses Verilog. VHDL all the way

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 06, 2014, 06:27:20 pm
content: Quote from: janoc on December 06, 2014, 03:06:47 pmHonestly, the Java client for OLS is pretty decent. I may not be perfect, but it's certainly stable and works nicely for standard tasks. What it lacks is mainly support for the advanced triggers. It also has no means to write own decoders in a scripting language. There's also a native Window client called OLSFront which I like a bit more - it also has support for writing own decoders in JavaScript (as far as I recall). However it also doesn't support advanced triggers and my impression is that development came to a full stop some time ago. Closed source, one person -> probably dead.That being saif, I personally put my hope into Ikalogic's ScanaPlus. It has only 9 channels and the FPGA is not updatable, it's streaming via USB so it's bandwidth limited, but it has complex trigger capabilties and nice GUI and you can write your own decoders in JavaScript. It also has good input protection and even configurable differential inputs.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 06, 2014, 07:41:08 pm
content: Quote from: dunkemhigh on December 06, 2014, 03:25:20 pmActually the more modern high end logic analysers have such high samplerates that they use the external clock edge as an event/condition to store a sample.

author: PlainName
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 06, 2014, 08:52:20 pm
content: QuoteI think that is not exactly moving the goalposts but playing on a different pitch. Nevertheless, the Saleae does that - does that make it a pukka 'high end logic analyser'? (Rhetorical question, BTW) I think you may have been slightly wooly in that description of functionality

author: janoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 07, 2014, 04:01:48 pm
content: Quote from: 0xdeadbeef on December 06, 2014, 06:27:20 pmI guess you were more lucky than me then. I had lots of problems with the software hanging in weird ways, not wanting to trigger reliably, sometimes it didn't want to connect to the analyzer at all ... Some of it could be also bugs in the FPGA core code, but I don't think that the OLS is being developed further.What sold me on the Saleae was the software - it is so much easier to use and more reliable than the Java client for OLS. Basically I am using a cheap Saleae clone for all the basic SPI/I2C debugging and keeping the OLS only for when I need more than 8 channels (which is really rarely).

author: Galenbo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 07, 2014, 07:53:45 pm
content: Other way around: The Saleae Logic 8 costs 200 dollar now.Are there other products that (perform better AND are cheaper)Are there much cheaper products (20 dollar?) that do the same thing?Are there other products that have really-needed extra features for the same price?

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 07, 2014, 10:06:21 pm
content: As I said: I'd put the Ikalogic Scanaplus on the list. It has 9 channels, always samples with 100MSa/s, has protected and configurable (e.g. differential) inputs and comes with a nice (Multi-OS) GUI with JavaScript decoders. It's not a dumb streamer but uses an FPGA to send only the actual edges. Very nice complex trigger setup.Downsides: for signals which actually are > 10MHz (e.g. 10MHz clock on SPI) it reaches its bandwidth limit and then messes up the signals without error detection. The FPGA is not upgradable. Only V2 allows to increase the bandwidth by reducing the number of channels (V1 always samples all 9 channels internally). Also currently the GUI doesn't allow a manual trigger. I'm somewhat optimistic though that my suggestion regarding this can and will be implemented. Also protocol trigger is being worked on.If you can live with the limitation of V1, it's currently on sale for ~130€ including VAT. V2 is available for ~180€ including VAT.

author: Jane
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 08, 2014, 08:41:23 pm
content: Some time ago Dave used ( in his video ) a LA made by Acute. (http://www.acute.com.tw/product/la.php).Can anyone compare these LA with other brands?

author: janoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 09, 2014, 12:05:44 am
content: Quote from: Galenbo on December 07, 2014, 07:53:45 pmYep, eBay is full of Logic 8 clones that sell for around $20 and less, e.g. (in no particular order or preference):http://www.ebay.fr/itm/USB-Saleae-Logic-Analyzer-IC-Circuiti-Integrati-/281087931941?pt=Automazione_domestica&hash=item4172257625http://www.ebay.fr/itm/USB-24M-8CH-24MHz-Equipement-analyseur-logique-dernier-Support-1-1-30-Pr-Saleae-/191441573033?pt=FR_YO_MaisonJardin_Bricolage_ElectroniqueComposants&hash=item2c92ce94a9etc. Just search for "Saleae" on eBay and one of these cheapo devices will pop up. The original Logic 8 was really easy to clone because it is only a simple Cypress USB chip, I believe.The current $200 Logic 8 has higher sample rate (up to 100MS/s) and can handle some analog inputs. However, I have found the 24MS/s sampling rate on the cheap clones more than enough for the usual SPI/I2C stuff you will find on microcontrollers. Certainly worth the 10 euro or so I have paid for mine.

author: Flump
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 09, 2014, 06:17:09 am
content: i dont know if its been mentioned as i just had a quick scan throughbut this might be helpfulhttp://www.bitscope.com/product/BS05/

author: Rasz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 10, 2014, 02:54:05 am
content: if you can live with 2000 points of buffer (either samples or transitions with compression) then "34 CHANNEL LA1034 LOGICPORT LOGIC ANALYZER"http://www.pctestinstruments.com/might be interesting, chinese copy is ~$70

author: free_electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 10, 2014, 04:42:30 am
content: Quote from: Flump on December 09, 2014, 06:17:09 amOH NO . .SHITSCOPE .. that thing was crap in version 1.0 and it is still crap... tghey use a silly pic processor to execute a state machine to do sampling. that thing cant get samples right if its life depended on it

author: janoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 10, 2014, 11:17:34 am
content: Quote from: free_electron on December 10, 2014, 04:42:30 amEspecially that BS05 - that's really an overpriced toy ($145 for THIS?!?!). They are selling these for prices that you can get a good, used scope or a very decent new logic analyser for. Bitscope isn't neither - stay away and save your money.

author: BloodyCactus
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 10, 2014, 03:19:53 pm
content: Quote from: Rasz on December 05, 2014, 10:57:50 pmi was in on the kickstarter, hardware looks nice, specs seem ok. software (copy of sigrok pulseview) is a pile of shit, and the probe/hook had impedence issues they wanted to sell you new ones because the ones they shipped were so bad you got nothing but noise.looked more like hardware issues, they didnt fix it just muted the signals. this image from their last backer only update, you can see what they did.I didnt want to pay yet MORE money to them so I never got the updated wire bundle.

author: Rasz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 11, 2014, 02:46:00 am
content: Quote from: BloodyCactus on December 10, 2014, 03:19:53 pmdid they ship them already? how is the triggering?

author: BloodyCactus
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 11, 2014, 03:26:57 am
content: Quote from: Rasz on December 11, 2014, 02:46:00 amkickstarter shipped back in june I think? software is terrible. its prettied up PulseView from sigrok. its not anywhere near Saleae quality. triggering is ok.you can make 'advanced' triggers, up to 16 of them. see screenshot.I'd be more happy if I got the wire bundle for free rather than being asked to pay extra money for fixing something that should have been found in prototype stage.

author: BloodyCactus
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 11, 2014, 03:31:16 am
content: i would say, if your thinking of buying one, dont just spend it on saleae honestly. they invested into the software (which all the ebay clones rip off), and it works.

author: suicidaleggroll
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 11, 2014, 03:52:20 am
content: Quote from: BloodyCactus on December 11, 2014, 03:31:16 amLet's eat grandma!Let's eat, grandma!Punctuation saves lives.I agree though (I think). 90% of a logic analyzer's utility is in its software interface. If you have a crap interface, it doesn't matter how powerful the hardware is, the device is unusable. Saleae has a terrific cross-platform UI that puts it leaps and bounds above the competition, even those that have more powerful or flexible hardware.

author: dannyf
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 11, 2014, 12:23:21 pm
content: QuoteAgreed.

author: BloodyCactus
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 11, 2014, 01:33:54 pm
content: Quote from: suicidaleggroll on December 11, 2014, 03:52:20 amlol. i had a sick boy that only wanted cuddles last night in my lap, thats my excuse.but I wanted to say, put you rmoney into Saleae, you get fantastic software and support.I just wish they ignored all the analogue stuff on the new models and stuck to making the digital better. I do feel that 16 channels for $500 on the pro16 is very steep.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 11, 2014, 04:56:00 pm
content: IMHO it is clever that Saleae uses the PC to store data. The biggest downside of other USB logic analysers is the short memory. OTOH $500 get's you far into MSO (mixed signal oscilloscope) territory. If the oscilloscope can also trigger and decode on serial protocols the added value of a seperate logic analyser diminishes quickly.

author: janoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2014, 10:41:57 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on December 11, 2014, 04:56:00 pmWell ... $500 gets you one of the new DS10x4Z Rigols. They do have serial decoding ($200 option). Except it does suck badly, because they are crippled and decode only what is on the screen, not from the sample memory. See the other threads about it on the forum. If you want decent decoding, you need to pony up for the DS2000 series, which is a tad more expensive, I am afraid.

author: suicidaleggroll
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2014, 11:34:39 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on December 11, 2014, 04:56:00 pmThe crazy-long recording with Saleae is very helpful, I've used it on more than one occasion to debug intermittent issues. 1.3 MHz McBSP plus an oddity that only pops up once every 30 seconds or so means capturing a couple billion samples (clock, sync, Tx, Rx at ~10x the clock rate) and decoding close to a hundred million bits. Even the bottom of the line Saleae has no issues with this (just barely, but still), provided the computer has enough RAM. A cheap LA that tries to buffer everything locally, or even a budget MSO, is probably not going to be a lot of help.

author: Galenbo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 14, 2014, 06:01:36 pm
content: Can I say that for 200 dollar, the Saleae Logic 8 is a good choice, because it has the best interface and for that price you don't get more samplerate and memory somewhere else?I saw 20 dollar devices that "work well", but I'm afraid they lack support, and that if I buy it, they put me 20 dollar further away from what I need.

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 14, 2014, 06:10:53 pm
content: I kinda feel like an IkaLogic salesman, but I still want to suggest at least having a look at theScanaPlus.V2 is available for166€and V1even cheaper. Nice multiplatform GUI, JavaScript decoders, good input protection, support for differential signals, fixed 100MSa/s sample rate, 9 channels and quite complex trigger setup (infinite levels, edges and times) with the hope for protocol triggers in the near future.

author: Rasz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2014, 09:39:09 am
content: Quote from: Galenbo on December 14, 2014, 06:01:36 pmthe only 20 dollar devices on the market are 100% salea copies

author: janoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2014, 11:06:52 am
content: Quote from: Galenbo on December 14, 2014, 06:01:36 pmUm, what "support" do you need exactly? The clones works perfectly with the official Saleae software - that's the whole point. I have one like that in my drawer.Now, if you can spend the $200 for an official device, by all means - the hardware is certainly better and you are supporting the future development of it. But for quick SPI or I2C debugging the $10-20 clone is just fine and won't break the bank even if you throw it away later.

author: Galenbo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2014, 12:53:25 pm
content: Quote from: Rasz on December 15, 2014, 09:39:09 amPlease specify. They are not "Saleae Logic 8" clones.

author: janoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2014, 02:28:27 pm
content: Quote from: Galenbo on December 15, 2014, 12:53:25 pmThey are clones of theoriginalLogic, not the new Logic 8 series. I.e. this one:https://www.saleae.com/logicThat device is not sold anymore, but is still supported by the software, as there are tons of users of it around (the new Logic 8 was only recently released).

author: chicken
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 10, 2015, 05:06:32 am
content: The real thing just got even more expensive:http://blog.saleae.com/need-raise-logics-price/Logic 4: $109Logic 8: $219Logic Pro 8: $479Logic Pro 16: $599Love my (old) Logic 8, but not sure I'd recommend it to a friend for these prices. One can get a pretty decent Oscope for that.

author: mrflibble
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 10, 2015, 05:25:59 am
content: Quote from: chicken on January 10, 2015, 05:06:32 amThat blog post is refreshingly low on bullshit.Edit:Just noticed there's a separate thread on the subject:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/saleae-logic-price-increases-and-interesting-blog-post-explanation/

author: Galenbo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 10, 2015, 12:14:03 pm
content: Quote from: chicken on January 10, 2015, 05:06:32 amWhat's the price you payed for it?In what year? I tought the Logic 8 was a recent product?

author: PlainName
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 10, 2015, 12:50:36 pm
content: QuoteIn December 2008 I paid $149 plus $29.95 shipping (total £119.23) for my original 8-chan.

author: janoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 10, 2015, 12:57:13 pm
content: Quote from: dunkemhigh on January 10, 2015, 12:50:36 pmI think that was the original Logic (24MHz, 8 channels), not Logic 8 (new hw, 100MHz).

author: dannyf
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 10, 2015, 01:01:39 pm
content: QuoteThen Salae has succeeded in killing the clones, by killing themselves,That's the saddest part of this whole thing. There is a parasitic relationship between the clones the saleae: the clones are successful because of saleae. However, if too many people buy the clones, saleae will die. If saleae dies, the demand for the clones would go away....

author: PlainName
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 10, 2015, 02:49:24 pm
content: QuoteYes, that's why I called it an 'original 8-chan' rather than a Logic 8

author: Rasz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 10, 2015, 03:40:09 pm
content: nah, cloners started copying look and feel of salea app, but they develop their own software now

author: bingo600
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 11, 2015, 07:52:04 am
content: The reason i got/use the Saleae is that it has Linux support for the GUI.I'll have to try out Sigrok one day.I also have a OLS , but unfortunately it has a very smal capture depth.And the Java GUI development seems to have come to a stillstand, it's made by an external hobbyist.I saw the Pippistrello FPGA board can be used and it has a lot of capture mem , but i'm still waiting to se if the GUI will support the advanced capture triggers that's already in the FPGA.I simply haven't gotten room for a fullsize HP./Bingo

author: janoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 11, 2015, 09:13:09 pm
content: Quote from: dunkemhigh on January 10, 2015, 02:49:24 pmAh, sorry, it was meant to @Galenbo, I have quoted the wrong post.

author: Galenbo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 18, 2015, 10:39:11 pm
content: In my language, original-Logic means uncloned-Logic, this makes it even more complicated.Can we give the first serie another name? First-Logic or so?

author: ivan747
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 19, 2015, 06:33:32 pm
content: Quote from: PChi on December 04, 2014, 09:46:59 pmhttp://sigrok.org/wiki/Protocol_decodershttp://sigrok.org/wiki/Supported_hardwareIf you get a logic analyzer supported by this project, you're all set.

author: janoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 23, 2015, 03:48:02 pm
content: Quote from: Galenbo on January 18, 2015, 10:39:11 pmI (and the post I was replying to) was referring to the original (as in genuine) Logic made by Saleae, not a 3rdparty clone. Nothing complicated there.

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 23, 2015, 06:49:09 pm
content: At this point, from my investigations, if you are going to buy a Salaea, then maybe you want to have a look at the Ikalogic Scanaplus V2. I was considering all the cheap options and it seems to coming out on top so I am buying one. It can be had for lower prices from resellers.http://www.ikalogic.com/ikalogic-products/scanaplus-9-channels-100mhz-logic-analyzer/This is after 0xdeadbeef held my hand and walked me through some details. Salaea have changed their prices and have admitted they are having financial problems. Maybe they won't be around much long and support will go away too? Who knows?