eevBLAB 96 - BUSTED! - Dymo Gets WORSE! - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: graybeard
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2022, 03:56:21 am
content: I went toamazon page for the Dymo 550to add a rating for the Dymo 550 and got this message"Amazon has noticed unusual reviewing activity on this product. Due to this activity, we have limited this product to verified purchase reviews."Ratings are rarely trustworthy any more.Fakespot is using the many old ratings to rate this new product.

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2022, 04:11:05 am
content: I mean limiting to verified purchasers is a good idea no matter what. What is not a good idea is allowing companies to completely replace the product under the same listing.Butt, yes, amazon reviews are pointless. Especially positive ones. I always filter by 1-2 stars and see if there is a common problem people are seeing rather than trying to figure out positives from reviews.

author: MrMobodies
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2022, 04:19:05 am
content: QuoteIf that is true then they might be manipulating the feedback.According to what I found in the reviews in my previous posts:It seems you are also locked in with using their software when it comes to printing1and Office/word support is done through their plugins.Their new software not very good compared to the old ones and missing features.Can't important from address book and the older package.The only importing they say you can do is Google/Outlook online? where it could have access to everybody's details that may not be needed for that printer (maybe their attempt at going to the so called cloud bullsh*t).1Can anybody confirm this with the 450 to the 550 model?

author: MrMobodies
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2022, 04:46:07 am
content: I think I found my answer:Quote101 people found that helpful that seems a lot.QuoteSo no windows driver/ won't install on servers and can't also use it on a print server.100% proprietary, paper, software and drivers(if any) with so many restrictions to use it in a certain way.Sound disgusting coming from a reputable manufacturer.Locked in left, right and center.

author: SL4P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2022, 08:17:05 am
content: I can see a Product Manager thinking about grovelling, or working on his resume for a new opening.

author: grumpydoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2022, 10:44:28 am
content: Quote from: ataradov on March 10, 2022, 04:11:05 amEven the 1-2 star reviews are often more about the reviewer's misunderstandings, or problems with delivery rather than the product itself.https://xkcd.com/937

author: MrMobodies
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2022, 01:39:53 pm
content: I see. I have taken a screenshot of one early this morning with the 943 reviews see first attached picture.https://www.amazon.com/DYMO-Label-Printer-LabelWriter-Thermal/dp/B08TMG88RP#customerReviews10/03/22 04:22:10/03/22 13:23:943 global ratings reduced to 131.812 reviews removed.Now it's about 3 times worse.1 star: 11% to 42%31% increase.That didn't get them very far.Very deceptive.Locking someone in with the paper is one thing but then restricting what applications they can print from now isn't that just as bad?Joke: Dymo love these printers so much if I find one down the dumpster I'll mail it back to them.Dumpster too good for it.I have just called their support on this number:0203 5648354Polite lady answered, I asked her a few questions and it is indeed true, according to her with these new models you can't print from any application on a PC (no print driver for PC just the software) only the sofware that comes with it and the plugins. Very fast help desk and straight answer. Sounds a bit sad.What about compatibility though?I think she said she knows it not going to work.I still find it hard to believe... Later on I am going to download the package and see if there is a driver in there and what type, if it is USB there has got to be something for it.

author: MrMobodies
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 10, 2022, 11:05:08 pm
content: Reviews and Frequently asked Questions about the Series 450 still on these 550 series UK listings:DYMO LabelWriter 5XL Label Printer Listinghttps://www.amazon.co.uk/product-reviews/B09DY3W7DN/ref=cm_cr_getr_d_paging_btm_next_2?filterByStar=five_star&pageNumber=2DYM0 450labels for printerreview in what is now 5XL printer listing they obviously reused retaining the positive feedback for that was left for thedifferent product model.OOps, my fault, completely DIFFERENT PRODUCT.Clear manipulation. So There are indeed doing this deliberately for some time now.https://www.amazon.co.uk/LabelWriter-High-Speed-Automatic-Recognition-Connectivity/dp/B09DY3SG2Chttps://www.amazon.co.uk/Dymo-LabelWriter-Version-S0838810-Silver/dp/B0031SG048/https://www.amazon.co.uk/LabelWriter-Printing-Automatic-Recognition-Shipping/dp/B09DY3YT4YJust reported them myself thanks to Odysee member RhombusStorm:QuoteHow embarassing.... the ones I found are not what they seem.I made a mistake:Selecting different accessories and items within the listing doesn't change the feedback.It seems they are merged for all three things.That doesn't sound very convenient when you are trying to find reviews specific for that selected item.Sorry about that.I have found the drivers from the installer which was compressed twice which I will show the details later.

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 11, 2022, 07:12:53 pm
content: Quote from: ataradov on March 10, 2022, 04:11:05 amYep.What I find weird - or concerning - it that Amazon, by helping that - or at least letting that happen, knowing it as well as we all do - favors sellers rather than customers.Is it really in their best interest? If so, how can that be? Has business become so twisted that shitting on customers actually makes no difference (or even helps)? (It's a trend I've been noticing way beyond Amazon.)As to Dymo. They are resorting to deceiving customers because they perfectly know that their DRM decision would make their new products FAIL.Sure printer vendors make most of their money on consumables, so this DRM thing is no surprise. Dymo was probably expecting the whole industry to switch to DRM in a matter of a few years, so that consumers would have no choice anyway. Next thing you know, you won't be able to print on any paper other than the vendor paper on any general-purpose printer. Making cash with ink/toner is not going to cut it anymore to get more revenue, I guess.I do hope those new products fail hard so that the DRM trend collapses, but I don't hold my breath. It's just a matter of all companies doing the same (and it's in their immediate interest for maximizing revenue), and customers will just be trapped. We'll see who "wins" this one.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 11, 2022, 07:24:07 pm
content: The difference between ink/laser printers and Dymo is that latter is much simpler and has a lot more profit margin within the device itself. It costs significantly more than entry level ink/laser printers, yet is way simpler and cheaper to produce. For ink/laser printer manufacturers DRM is a way to survive while selling printers at current prices, for Dymo DRM is nothing but greed. Especially considering that original consumables from ink/laser printer manufacturers are much cheaper than stickers from Dymo.

author: amyk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 12, 2022, 04:47:48 am
content: Quote from: wraper on March 11, 2022, 07:24:07 pmLooking at the generic Chinese thermal label printers on Ali, a lot of them are far cheaper.Quote from: MrMobodies on March 10, 2022, 04:46:07 amHow about Linux...?It looks like the everything up to the 450 did have Linux drivers:https://www.dymo-label-printers.co.uk/news/download-dymo-sdk-for-linux.htmlA little better than I expected, but not by a lot --- for the DRM-riddled 550, it looks like they decided to close everything up.

author: darkspr1te
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 12, 2022, 09:01:18 am
content: Quote from: amyk on March 12, 2022, 04:47:48 ama simple nop in the right place will stop the countdown, am sure withhttps://github.com/darkspr1te/swd_extractoror the jlink race dump trick we can dump firmware and add that need nopdarkspr1te

author: Kleinstein
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 12, 2022, 02:15:32 pm
content: The limitation to there special software could indicate that much of the DRM part is actually in the software side.A way around could be modifying the old driver also to recognize the new version.One may even get lucky with a rather old version, from before the DRM part was considered.

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 12, 2022, 06:24:08 pm
content: Quote from: darkspr1te on March 12, 2022, 09:01:18 amDo you really think they spend a ton of resources implementing this DRM scheme and then just forgot to lock the MCU from reading?This repo does not seem to indicate which device ti intends to dump. Not all devices have race conditions and not all devices easily extractable.I went back to the video. Main STM device does not have any widely known glitches, neither does NXP on the reader.

author: jonovid
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 12, 2022, 11:26:38 pm
content: why pay more for less? when you have an alternative on AliEx genuine 100% Chinese Sticker Printer.Xprinter Label Barcode Printer Thermal Receipt Bar Code Print 20mm-80mm Sticker Printer Bluetooth WIFI LAN USBhttps://www.aliexpress.com/item/33008599496.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.157c4c6fHEeG8P&algo_pvid=a137826b-6203-49ed-b1ec-b8badf721272&algo_exp_id=a137826b-6203-49ed-b1ec-b8badf721272-27&pdp_ext_f=%7B%22sku_id%22%3A%2212000016278968835%22%7D&pdp_pi=-1%3B95.37%3B-1%3B11.81%40salePrice%3BAUD%3Bsearch-mainSearch

author: amyk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 13, 2022, 04:39:58 am
content: Quote from: Kleinstein on March 12, 2022, 02:15:32 pmThat's what I was thinking. They might be not 100% certain they wanted this as there could be others in the company who thought this was a bad idea, so they thought being able to update the software to disable the check instead of having to do that to the firmware on the printer itself could be a possibility. Of course that also means cracking the host-side software could be much easier than the printer FW. If there's sufficient interest I might look into it, but it's a >100MB download.

author: MrMobodies
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 13, 2022, 05:06:42 am
content: Quote from: amyk on March 12, 2022, 04:47:48 amGoogle reviews:QuoteNo linux.QuoteSo at some point they buggered up the editor and some time after that the rest of the printer.I emailed Dave Jones yesterday early morning to confirm whether a driver did install and he said that he saw a virtual usb print driver when he plugged it into the usb.Also I found that there is a print driver that was compressed twice and I can print from notepad and it does communicate with whatever it is pointed to. Maybe they set some protocol between their software, driver and printer where the printer just ignores everything else. Looks like I was told wrong on the phone but I found it was compressed twice in a msi installer "DYMO Connect.msi". No matter what I print, a word "Test" or a printer test page and it just kept on printer many pages with a smiley symbol on one of my normal A4 HP printers. Nothing happened with the Brother labellers even though the driver did send some data across to them.See attached images.For anyone who wants to have a little experiment, I have attached the driver for the 550 series, the windows 10 and one for Windows 7 where I just changed the version numbers accordingly to make it install as I couldn't be bothered going across the room to install it on the Windows 10 stuff.

author: richnormand
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 15, 2022, 02:08:46 am
content: After refrigerators filters, cars, printers, tractors, software, etc...etc... why the outrage?Read: "Unauthorised bread" to see our future if this goes on...https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2020/01/unauthorized-bread-a-near-future-tale-of-refugees-and-sinister-iot-appliances/#:~:text=%22Unauthorized%20Bread%22%E2%80%94a%20tale,award%2C%20the%20Canada%20Reads%20prize.This novella is part of a book has four other short stories (and you can keep the dead tree book as long as you want without extra monthly fees)...

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 15, 2022, 02:13:39 am
content: A lot of the outrage is mostly because of bait and switch tactics. Both amazon stuff and sketchy model numbers.And as far as locking things down - Chinese manufacturers to the rescue. And western manufacturers are basically making a case for them.I did not need the label printer, but as soon as I've heard the news, I headed out to Aliexpress and checked if there are decent alternatives. There are, and so I don't care what Dymo does. Good to know to avoid their products.And if we want to have a talk about relying on China, then I suggest governments regulate this stuff and make DRM like this illegal. Until this happens, I don't care - the product that meets my needs will get my money, no matter who makes it. But chances of this happening are almost zero.

author: richnormand
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 15, 2022, 08:03:19 pm
content: I agree as long as credible alternatives are available as you point out.There is already situations where rules and regulations do conspire against alternative though (pharmaceuticals like some recent cases for example).

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2022, 01:32:39 am
content: China has questionable positions on a number of matters - well, at least from our typical western POV - but I don't think they're very fond of DRM. It's kind of against the whole "collective approach" that China defends. So yeah, if you want DRM-free stuff, your best bet is to look for chinese stuff.As to regulations, you're right. "All" it would take is for western countries to take measures prohibiting the sale (and importation) of products without DRM (at least in some categories, that would naturally expand over time). All this, of course, for people's own security. Of course. And if you think this is impossible, uh, yeah. I don't think so.

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2022, 02:29:13 am
content: Well, that did not take too long to bypass that stuff -https://github.com/free-dmo/free-dmo-stm32,https://hackaday.com/2022/03/30/freedmo-gets-rid-of-dymo-label-printer-drm/I assume a more refined solution would appear too. It is good that they used standard connectors for everything, no soldering mod is incoming.At the same time, given that they also made their software worse, there is really no point in using their products anyway.