Am colour blind, need help identifying bands - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Tim88
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 24, 2022, 05:53:17 pm
content: Howdy, could use a little colour identification for you colour see-ers. Have three inductors to identify, hopefully someone can lend a hand, or an eyball...Thanks!

author: Zoli
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 24, 2022, 06:01:33 pm
content: L1=L2=11µHThird one=68µHEdit: All tolerances 5%

author: Benta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 24, 2022, 06:30:08 pm
content: Agree on 68 uH, but not on L1/L2.They could be 22 uH (most likely), but 33 uH is also a possibility. The green base colour combined with the modern semi-opaque stripe colours is terrible. That also goes for resistors. It's a guessing game nowadays.

author: pcprogrammer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 24, 2022, 07:10:42 pm
content: My initial reaction was brown brown black, but Benta might be right that it is red red black. Orange I don't think so.

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 24, 2022, 07:11:36 pm
content: I vote for brown too here.

author: magic
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 24, 2022, 07:11:51 pm
content: I wouldhopethat a 33 wouldn't look that red, so it's 22 or maybe 11.11 isn't a standard value until you get to E24, not sure if they make E24 inductors?editAre there any other inductors on this board for comparison?

author: Tim88
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 24, 2022, 07:33:06 pm
content: Quote from: magic on August 24, 2022, 07:11:51 pmJust those three.

author: Benta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 24, 2022, 07:45:52 pm
content: Believe me, modern resistors (and inductors) with blue or green body colour are a nightmare since years. The stripe colours are almost unreadable, probably due to some RoHS demand resulting in low colour saturation.If you'd like a nice quiz, I'll take some photos tomorrow in daylight and let you decode the resistor values.It'll be fun to watch.In this case, I'll stick with 22 uH. Red+green=brown.

author: Tim88
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 24, 2022, 08:30:19 pm
content: I took a pic outside in daylight, any better?

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 24, 2022, 08:36:36 pm
content: I vote for red (22uH). But if you want to be absolutely sure, desolder one and use an LCR meter.To the OP: you can import the photo into a paint program and look at the RGB values of the colors and see what matches best with these color values:https://people.duke.edu/~ng46/topics/color-code.htm

author: JohanH
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 24, 2022, 09:26:03 pm
content: I have a bit of red-green color vision deficiency (that's not blindness!) and I can see that it is more red, although it looks a bit brownish. Gimp tells me#9a584afrom a random point, which is a shade of red (60.4% red). So 22 µH.

author: David_AVD
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 24, 2022, 09:27:06 pm
content: I reckon 22 (not 11) too. I hate it when they use a red that's bordering on brown, or orange that's bordering on red.

author: mc172
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 24, 2022, 09:30:23 pm
content: It looks brown to me, especially when compared to the red in the bottom of the 2nd picture.

author: hans
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 24, 2022, 10:15:04 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on August 24, 2022, 08:36:36 pmAlso looks 2x red to me.That 2nd tip exactly my thoughts as well. Digital devices aren't handicapped.I've Myopia (pretty common) with strength -4 ish (can't read anything more than a foot away). When relaxing I am tired wearing glasses, so I put them down.. but occasionally I do need to check things in the distance.Mobile phone to the rescue. I hold it right in front of my face with the camera app (with small/wide angle sensor views) and occasionally some digital zoom to get an idea about what's going on there in the far distance.. works great. I imagine computer color probing can be similarly useful.

author: David_AVD
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 24, 2022, 10:34:40 pm
content: Quote from: mc172 on August 24, 2022, 09:30:23 pmThat's the problem in real life though, the colours are never as clear cut as any data sheet depiction or computer generated chart.

author: EPAIII
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 12:56:25 am
content: This conversation makes me wonder if there may be a need for some kind of color recognition device. Not just for resistors/inductors or other electronic devices, but more general. Perhaps something that could be built into a pair of glasses.But then, perhaps that already exists. I don't have time to do that search.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 01:11:27 am
content: Place a sheet of white paper off to the side (and in view) so that the color balancing will work.Quote from: EPAIII on August 25, 2022, 12:56:25 amThat does exist, it's called a color filter.

author: magic
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 04:46:48 am
content: Quote from: Tim88 on August 24, 2022, 08:30:19 pmYes, I am now starting to wonder if the second inductor could be 221 rather than 220(But it really looked identical to the first on the original picture, so I think they are the same).

author: ivaylo
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 05:17:35 am
content: Just measure them. This system is ridiculous. I have the red/green deficiency too and always thought people with normal color vision just see stuff where I usually stumble. Thanks for this thread…

author: magic
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 05:24:02 am
content: It's easier when you have the device in front of you and can compare it with other stuff on the board and try a better light.In comparison, decoding markings from somebody's single small picture is like reading tea leaves.

author: JohanH
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 06:16:52 am
content: I've been curious about those "color blind" correction glasses that are touted online, but I haven't bothered when they are all made with tinted lenses (and I would like to use them inside). They supposedly improve color contrast and I'm sure that in theory that could work, unless you have a total lack of color perception. With good lighting I anyway see the difference, so for me they wouldn't be a big benefit anyway.

author: pcprogrammer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 06:17:18 am
content: In the second picture you can see that the colors are bleeding in the edges and changing color. At least I can on my system.The red in the second picture to me is indeed red, but near the edges it is brown due to the bleeding.The black ring seems to show some brown in the middle and bleeding to black in the edges so the value might well be 220uH.De-soldering and measuring seems the best option to get to the truth.

author: Ed.Kloonk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 06:28:06 am
content: I wonder if some color filters used in image manipulation software could reveal the markings.Do the resistor codes have any sort of standard color palate spec like international flags do?If you present the inductor or resistor in front of a known color temp light source, the code colors should fall between certain ranges, shouldn't they?What about color-blind apps for the phone. Do any of them help?

author: Kleinstein
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 06:45:06 am
content: For good color recognition it helps if there is also quite some white the picture - cameras may adjust the white balance and this can cause additional difficulties / skews for the whole picture.In the 2nd picture, at the lower edge there seem to be some brown/red capacitors, like the red Wima ones. This may indicate a poor white balance (or tinted light) in the picture.The 2nd picture with daylight still is preferrable over indoor LED of CFL light that can also cause errors in the color perception. It likely does not apply here, but the purple / deep blue part can be a problem for electronic sensors / cameras.It is hard to tell, but given that 11 µH would be an odd value I would guess more like 22 µH.The part below looks more like a 68 Ohms resistor and not an inductor.The color look boarderline, more brown than red. So a color regocnition app on a phone would not really help.I don't hink there are strict standards on the colors, more like ROHS limitations that prevent some pigments (e.g. Hg containing red). red paint is often relatively transparent, so that the green background could effect the color.

author: magic
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 06:48:45 am
content: Yes, it's hopeless.Look at the second picture and the third band of L2 appears brown when compared to the black on the resistor below.Look at the first picture and they are more similar.So which picture is true?

author: Ed.Kloonk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 06:50:06 am
content: Quote from: Kleinstein on August 25, 2022, 06:45:06 amI reckoned that's why the color codes around red/brown and blue/violet are adjacent to allow for a bit of hit and miss. Doesn't help, I know but imagine how interesting it would be if the colors values chosen were random!

author: Ed.Kloonk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 07:08:33 am
content: Quote from: EPAIII on August 25, 2022, 12:56:25 amOur illustrious reg authorities back in the dark ages decided to select red/black/green for active/neutral/earth for what is called building wire used in houses. Of course people with red/green deficiencies (their words, not mine) (most common, I believe) showed up. So they added a yellow stripe to the green one. Or sometimes, you'd swear it is green stripe on yellow.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 07:45:58 am
content: Tim88Do yourself a big favour and get a set of smart tweezers, those that have LCR and ESR measurement capability.You’ll then be covered for TH and SMD.There are cheaper and dearer but these are excellent value that a number of us have given input into their design:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/design-a-new-precision-lcr-tweezers/

author: mikeselectricstuff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 08:03:10 am
content: Definitely 22 - inductors like this are not high precision parts, so unlikely to exist in E24 values

author: Miyuki
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 08:35:56 am
content: Those color stripes are sometimes so annoying, especially when they use some crap paints that tend to shift hues over time or temperatureI know the tiny numbers have other issues and always ended in a bad place when inserted into the board. But at least it was clear and not a guessing name.But once you have a picture taken you can use some graphics app to identify colors, even the dumbest MSPaint will allow you to show R,G,B, or a Hue value to say what color it is

author: pcprogrammer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 08:52:15 am
content: Quote from: Miyuki on August 25, 2022, 08:35:56 amBut if you try it with these pictures it depends on where you sample the color. Also has to do with compression like jpeg, where colors might blurr. Zooming in might help though.

author: pcprogrammer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 08:58:16 am
content: Quote from: Ed.Kloonk on August 25, 2022, 07:08:33 amWith the colors you mention for building wiring, you would be in for a surprise in the Netherlands or France. In both countries blue is neutral, and black is live for lamps comming from a switch to connect to the light socket. In France red is usually live, but brown is also used, while in the Netherlands brown is live. Earth is the same here, green with a yellow stripe.

author: madires
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 09:32:05 am
content: On the first picture the colors are darker. So it's hard to tell if L1/2's first two rings are red or brown. The third ring looks more like a dark brown than black. The second picture shows brigther colors. The first two rings are red and the third is brown. I'd say L1 and L2 are 220µH.

author: JohanH
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 10:39:07 am
content: Quote from: pcprogrammer on August 25, 2022, 08:58:16 amEuropean countries (including UK) have adapted international standard IEC 60446, where blue is neutral, green/yellow earth and brown is live. With three phases, live colours are brown, black and grey. Live red is old colour coding from prehistoric times. Of course there are still old installations with the old colour coding.

author: pcprogrammer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 11:03:55 am
content: Quote from: JohanH on August 25, 2022, 10:39:07 amUnless this was very very recent you should tell that to the French. Red is still very much used and sold when it comes to single wires. In cables with only 3 conductors it is either brown or black that is present for live. At least last time I bought which would be about 6 years ago. They also tended to use white and purple for switch wires but could also be used as live. This to distinguish between different circuit breaker groups.Build an extension to the existing house we own and redid a big part of the wiring in the existing house. Looked into the French rules at that time, which is about 10 years ago. The French rules differ from the Dutch rules.

author: JohanH
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 11:21:07 am
content: Quote from: pcprogrammer on August 25, 2022, 11:03:55 amOK, that's laziness from their part. Most European countries are expected to adapt the standards. Let's check again in a few years... In my opinion things like these should be enforced within EU (relates to electrical safety etc.).

author: Zenith
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 11:23:10 am
content: Tim88.I am slightly red-green colour blind. For instance I can't tell the brown from the reds on some sets of snooker balls.The resistor colour code is an invention of the Devil, especially when used with small 0.5W or 0.25W resistors. I usually use a DMM. I find I can usually use the colour code if I use a watchmaker's eye glass and good light. Maybe that's worth a try. Otherwise get an LCR meter.

author: pcprogrammer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 11:32:55 am
content: I zoomed in on L1 and my verdict is red red brown

author: Tim88
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 07:42:09 pm
content: Thanks for all the input, one post made me think to try reducing the colour depth so I reduced it to 16 colours. L1 and L2 look red, red, brown to me, much easier to see. Colour blindness really doesn't bother me in everyday life except for daggum resistor/inductor stripes and finding specific wire colours. Red-green-brown-grey and blue-purple both look similiar depending on the shade.On a funny sidebar, when I joined the Navy years ago, I had to identify 3 red, 3 brown and 3 green yarn balls of out a box when I failed the Colorblind test. I thought, well, that shouldn't be too bad, just have to separate the red, brown and green. However... There was not just one shade of each colour, there was 50 million shades of each! To this day, I don't know how I passed that test. I found out in kindergarten I was colour blind when I drew a crayon pic of a house on a hill and coloured the grass grey!Will desolder those when I get time, still taking bets on the right value!

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 08:57:16 pm
content: Quote from: Tim88 on August 25, 2022, 07:42:09 pmYes often we need lift a leg to get a sensible measurement however there are other ways, a very old one called the razor blade technique. These days we would instead use a scalpel or snap off blade knife to break a nearby trace, get the measurement and later apply a solder bridge over the cut.

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 09:08:25 pm
content: Brown and dark red are either very close or for some brown shades, the same thing. So distinguishing the two is often pretty hard and not just for color blind people. Especially true on photos for which we don't have the full lighting context.Some of you may remember people going nuts on social networks about the color of a dress:https://www.cnet.com/tech/services-and-software/why-the-dress-lives-on-infamy-one-year-later-black-blue-white-gold/

author: 25 CPS
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 09:32:27 pm
content: I'm colourblind and remember one of my professors way back when saying, "I think the bands on resistors are scientifically designed to make you go blind," when we were discussing it once.Several things I've found handy are being able to change lighting between incandescent and LED even if it's shining a handheld LED flashlight can help different coloured bands stand out. Also having some plausible candidate values in mind based on the circuit the parts are in can help rule out some colour possibilities that just don't make sense given the context.Most of all, a DMM and LCR meter are the best thing to have. This way you get an actual value, rather than a stated value, plus it avoids another pitfall with colour codes that can affect everyone regardless of vision: Age and/or heat related deterioration of the colour coded bands can make them incredibly difficult or impossible to read. Once that happens, a measured or schematic/parts list value is what you're going to have to go with.

author: Bicurico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 25, 2022, 10:17:58 pm
content: Quote from: JohanH on August 25, 2022, 06:16:52 amThese glasses are amazing. While I don't need them, I have recommended them to students of mine.They work by filtering frequencies. Colour blind people have receptors that have overlapping response to green/red. The glasses simply work as a filter eliminating a frequency range in-between red and green or blue, whatever.It does work, but color resolution is reduced.

author: 25 CPS
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 26, 2022, 12:31:37 am
content: Quote from: Bicurico on August 25, 2022, 10:17:58 pmThis is a bit of a tough one since colourblindness takes so many forms. The overlap issue that the glasses can help out with by notching out the areas of visible spectrum that are doubled up isn't present in any of the -opia types of colourblindness where the sensitivity is severely attenuated or missing entirely. For example, the glasses won't help much for someone with protanopia since red isn't partially overlapped with something else that can be separated out by notching out the overlap, the red's completely gone.

author: Warpspeed
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 26, 2022, 02:46:43 am
content: Is that grey, or is it white ?Is that yellow, or orange, or maybe its brown ?Red, or perhaps brown.... who knows?Nothing wrong with your eyesight, but the terrible quality paint, or whatever it is they use.Time does not help, and if the thing has ever been hot, all bets are off.Often its not obvious which end to start reading from.Best solution is a way to test parts, a multimeter at least.But you can buy low cost component testing devices that are especially useful to identify the basic type of semiconductor devices, as well as the value of most resistors, capacitors and inductors. Not hugely expensive but extremely useful.I bought an earlier version of this a long time ago:https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/265208502923?hash=item3dbfa89a8b:g:vH0AAOSwNJRgEc~z&amdata=enc%3AAQAHAAAA4IluZckAF%2BuVgDj4CtuhyeHbrOwfxqW3bfuCtZGsYy4AoXppTjJaF2UK6NVRMkBelPnVfqKaxMfqllJmxlmB3at6TKNt%2B5x%2B0atNHRmb2KdAHZSMtA2hvsXohebskOzSFmzgif0FYmxFKk6aNHB4fYFxWnqz%2FKgd61KySqS7OXvmDN52BtAh5F6QYp5Z6KsEIStB6nj2L%2BgnmqgwKM%2FhfUX7%2BELy5wZOGLK5I9IgS%2BkdJy5%2BAwnbAFxIRbItSphErXTRW7Qbs1JLLawv%2FMlMVgeBj474RmcNPjlxGfBrbt17%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR5i4wIDbYA

author: JohanH
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 26, 2022, 06:01:08 am
content: Quote from: 25 CPS on August 26, 2022, 12:31:37 amI have an issue with the terminology. Calling everyone with color vision deficiency "color blind" is flatly wrong. When I took the color test first time, the nurse flatly stated, "oh, you can't become an electrician now when you are color blind", even if the test showed I only had an issue with some red-green shades. I could even hear her snickering when I didn't see a number on one of the test pages that she could see! I have no issue separating red and green cables, or color of traffic lights, it's only closer shades of red and green I have an issue with. It's like even the professionals don't get it, that there are indefinite shades of colors and it's the majority's color vision that has defined where the boundaries go between different basic colors and shades. Someone with protanopia can correctly be called color blind, but if you have a lesser deficiency and can distinguish separate basic colors, it shouldn't be called "blindness". Clearly the tests are created so, that you can determine if the person is totally blind, or only has a certain degree of color deficiency. They should have made a numbered scale for it, just like for normal vision. I get that the scale can't be made accurate, but at least it would give an indication.

author: pcprogrammer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 26, 2022, 08:25:17 am
content: Quote from: JohanH on August 26, 2022, 06:01:08 amWe are sliding of the original topic of identifying inductors, but you have a fair point. And we all have to be aware that color perception is an individual concept. I have differences in blue between the left and right eye, I can clearly see this when looking at the sky. There is a slight color shift when I look with only one eye open.

author: Bicurico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 26, 2022, 10:31:22 am
content: I have over-simplified how the glasses work, but yes:- They work by filtering out frequencies which the patient receptors of different base colors will overlap.- There are many different causes for what is known as "color blindness": some people only have two color receptors, others have too much overlapping frequencies, etc.- The manufacturer of these glasses offers an online test that helps determining of the glasses will work for you: please take a look athttps://enchroma.com/pages/how-enchroma-glasses-workThe link describes how the glasses work and they offer the test.Sorry for being offtopic, but it hurts me that there are people with some forms of color blindness that could dramatically improve the way they perceive the world.

author: Tim88
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 26, 2022, 09:48:31 pm
content: Quote from: JohanH on August 26, 2022, 06:01:08 amThis is a coulour blindness test I took a few years ago in the military. It does provide a "scale" of each eye RGB deficiency. I thought it was a neat test...

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 26, 2022, 10:15:36 pm
content: Quote from: Bicurico on August 25, 2022, 10:17:58 pmThat looks interesting! One of my relatives is color blind. He didn't found out until 16 or so after doing an online test to confirm is suspicion. He went to the doctor to verify but the doctor said that they didn't really have a test for it (and thus nothing in terms of help / aiding as well).

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 26, 2022, 10:44:55 pm
content: Uh. AN eye doctor with no testing for color blindness? Really? They need to change eye doctors.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 26, 2022, 11:03:01 pm
content: Quote from: SiliconWizard on August 26, 2022, 10:44:55 pmNot an eye doctor, just the generic doctor. But the generic doctor didn't see any need to forward to an eye doctor.

author: 25 CPS
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2022, 12:50:39 pm
content: Quote from: JohanH on August 26, 2022, 06:01:08 amWhy even get into the weeds over the catch-all terms when the various forms and severities are already in named categories, eg. protanomoly and protanopia?For the record, I have protanopia and I have always described myself as colourblind.Lastly, as the person who needed to start the thread has experienced, dealing with the problems it causes is the bigger issue, by far, than picking a name for it which is a secondary - and by secondary, I mean a distant number two - consideration well behind figuring out how to work around the surprises it throws up.

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2022, 06:31:03 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on August 26, 2022, 11:03:01 pmNot judging what they do or do not from afar without context, but anyone concerned with a vision problem should go see an eye doctor, if just to make sure. A generic doctor can do almost nothing serious about your eyes, except maybe treat a minor infection, and even so, an examination with proper equipment is often prefered to rule out any other more serious problem.I'm a bit surprised, things are probably different depending on countries and habits, but over here, eye exams are done routinely on children, and are recommended once a year or couple years when adult. And any eye exam I got included not just acuity but also color blindness tests. So that's definitely something that shouldn't go unknown for a long time. Just my 2 cents, I don't know the context, so just saying in general.

author: pcprogrammer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2022, 06:41:06 pm
content: Quote from: SiliconWizard on August 27, 2022, 06:31:03 pmIn the Netherlands it is more common to see an optician to have ones eyes checked. When done proper they also use the red/green tests next to the +/- deviation and other measurements needed on your eyes. Takes a burden of the real eye doctors.From what I understood from here in France is that the opticians have less allowance in this respect and that when you need a new prescription you have to see an eye doctor for it.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 27, 2022, 06:55:51 pm
content: Quote from: tautech on August 25, 2022, 08:57:16 pmWhy would you do this? It's literally faster to desolder a terminal. And then solder it back rather that cutting, scraping solder mask, soldering a jumper wire. The only valid reasons to me would be if the part is hardly accessible on the top side or it is a high pin count device.

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2022, 07:00:24 pm
content: I know that some countries have "optometrists" who can do a lot more than in others where opthalmologists are the only ones who prescribe.Over here (and I'm sure that's the case in many other countries as well), "opticians" are basically like pharmacists but for vision correction products only. So they are only allowed to sell, adapt and give some advice, but not prescribe anything indeed. They can also make some minor eye exams such as acuity but just as a check since they can't prescribe.Never going to an opthalmologist is an issue IMO. Some serious conditions could go undetected for a long time until it may be too late to take action, and opticians or optometrists may not be able to detect them.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2022, 07:02:56 pm
content: Quote from: wraper on August 27, 2022, 06:55:51 pmAgreed. Cutting a trace means you are physically damaging an otherwise good circuit board!

author: pcprogrammer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2022, 07:24:12 pm
content: Quote from: SiliconWizard on August 27, 2022, 07:00:24 pmIn the Netherlands the opticians have more qualifications and are trained to do a similar job as an eye doctor. They have a lot of the same equipment and test for all kinds of problems like eye pressure or cataract and will give advice to see a proper eye doctor when needed.

author: pcprogrammer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2022, 07:28:17 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on August 27, 2022, 07:02:56 pmAnother reason could be for SMD components, but more likely is that tautech is pulling our legs because he is pissed about the TEA thread.See here:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/test-equipment-anonymous-(tea)-group-therapy-thread/msg4383775/#msg4383775This is what he wrote on the new forum for TEAQuote

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2022, 07:34:11 pm
content: Quote from: pcprogrammer on August 27, 2022, 07:24:12 pmI see. But in this case and back to what nctnico said, the guy should probably have seen at least an optician and not just a GP, and I'm surprised the GP didn't suggest that. Oh well.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 27, 2022, 08:33:49 pm
content: Quote from: wraper on August 27, 2022, 06:55:51 pmOver the decades PCB layouts have evolved and still they present many faults, namely a lazy layout engineers consideration to possible rework in which there are risks of damaging the PCB.Older PCB and especially TH layouts and often small thin annular rings subject to lifting and we've all done that haven't we ?It's a case by case decision to know when to get the scalpel out.