silver on ferrite inductor? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / rf-microwave

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 03, 2024, 12:51:53 pm
content: I was thinking about ceramic PCB and such, and I thought of silver on ceramic inductors, which use silver paste to make a coil on a ceramic rod or pipe.I thought of another component, that is a silver on ferrite inductor. I never saw one or heard of one and I know it might require some special provisions.I think if you take a ferrite rod and put a ceramic insulator coat on it (thin, like pottery), you could then put silver paste on that.So it would not have wire and its all firmly attached to the core. The easy option is to put a ferrite core in a ceramic pipe, if you just want to get rid of wires.Anyway, has anyone ever seen a direct metalized ferrite inductor?And I also wondered about circuit boards on ferrite substrates, for some kind of generally dampened PCB. I wonder what good that would be.

author: ArdWar
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 03, 2024, 01:18:39 pm
content: Isn't that basically how multilayer chip inductors are made? The difference is that they're planar instead of MELF-style wraparound.Or do you have specific use case/performance in mind?

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 03, 2024, 01:22:50 pm
content: I thought they had wire in them. I mean a big one you can make yourself like a through hole sized part. My chip inductors have wire, the ferrite bead might be metalized, but I don't know if they have a helix metalized ferroceramic inductorthis is what my small inductors look likeits very fine wireI mean a monolithic structure. All sinter bonded

author: Kean
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 03, 2024, 01:40:33 pm
content: From the same page that includes your diagram of a wirewound chip inductor, they have info on multilayer ceramic chip inductors.https://article.murata.com/en-eu/article/basic-facts-about-inductors-lesson-2Not sure if the conductive film layers are silver or some other metal, but isn't this basically the same as what you describe?

author: ArdWar
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 03, 2024, 01:43:43 pm
content: Yeah, the one with longitudinal winding are often simply wirewound, but the one with "multilayer chip" moniker are usually perpendicular wound using some sort of metal on ceramic deposition

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 03, 2024, 08:38:21 pm
content: Ok, I thought all of them were wire, because the high end ones I took apart were wire.but this is not multi layer, its single layer? outer layer? what would you call it

author: T3sl4co1l
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 03, 2024, 09:10:02 pm
content: Basically these:https://nascentechnology.com/ltcc-productsTim

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 03, 2024, 09:12:26 pm
content: well that is also multi layer. this would be single layer. nice and simple, I don't see a diagram on the website to be sure what it isI am actually wondering now if you can make a common mode choke like that too. just uses alot of silver but you can make it pretty beefy Its like drawn on, so there is no BS with trying to make neat windingsI need to try to 3d print a round stencil and a split doughnut stencil to fit over ferrites, if I find its possible to insulate them

author: RadioNerd
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 04, 2024, 01:34:50 pm
content: Maybe I do not completely understand your "silver on ferrite" inductor concept, but if you want the ferrite to have any effect, the conductor must be *inside* the ferrite, not outside. Otherwise there will be no magnetic field inside the "conductor tube" that could interact with the ferrite...

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 04, 2024, 02:08:27 pm
content: not sure what you mean

author: RadioNerd
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 04, 2024, 02:33:15 pm
content: OK, now I understand... if you put the silver patterned in a way to form a coil like the inductors in the picture, it will work of course...Sorry, I thought that you wanted to entirely coat the ferrite rod with conductive material without any gapsAlthough I like the idea, I assume that the main challenges of this concept would be to achieve a reasonable current handling and to find a suitable method to attach it to the actual circuit.

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 04, 2024, 04:24:27 pm
content: its not that fragile, you can even make it through hole if you make a end cap and then wrap a wire around it and solder it on. I think it might be OK to run this thing quite hotor actually you can even wrap a copper strip around it instead of a wire for lower inductance to make it 'surface mount"Also I imagine if you have some dies, like a daping block, you can make quite a interesting end point connection on the sides, to cut copper into a lolipop outline, make a thimble in the circle part, and solder it to the inductor, so you have a strip left to mount the thing.the contact can be this shape