Which STM32 board? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Jon86
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 29, 2013, 10:28:29 pm
content: I want to get into developing real 32 bit ARM based micros, and I decided the STM32 range would be a good route to take.Which development board should I buy? Are there any that are breadboard compatible?Or is there maybe another manufacturer that would be better?Any help greatly appreciated

author: AlfBaz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 29, 2013, 10:36:56 pm
content: I took the plunge with the very, very cheap discovery board series. They come with built in stlink with headers to use on your own boards (in SWD mode) and have simple .1" headers for nearly all pins to jump over toa bread board. There are also expansion boards available for these such asthis

author: Jon86
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 29, 2013, 10:39:44 pm
content: Great, any particular discovery board? There seems to be a big range.

author: Bored@Work
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 29, 2013, 10:52:47 pm
content: It doesn't matter. Any can keep you busy for a long time. I would look for one with an F4 (M4 Cortex core), but that is just for bragging, not that you need one for learning. Maybe a 32F429IDISCOVERY, the LCD and the gyro seem to be fun.

author: jeremy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 29, 2013, 11:25:46 pm
content: The F4Discovery (not the 429) is supported by mbed, which is an ARM backed peripheral/usb/Ethernet/RTOS library. St just joined the consortium, and new mbed specific boards are expected in February if you can wait that long

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 29, 2013, 11:34:38 pm
content: Yes, the discoveries are really good, I highly recommend getting one. In fact, if you make PCBs afterwards, I would get a range of them, just to have the correct/closest one. I dont even remember how many of them I have at work or home. Must be 5-6. Lot of times they give it for free at exhibitions.

author: AlfBaz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 29, 2013, 11:46:00 pm
content: Yeah I have the 429 and 407. The lcd on the 429 is very useful, they have a set of files that allow simple text output for debugging and diagnostics.I find some of their library documentation a bit "scattered" in that you'll sometimes find it under their other mcu's docs. It also appears that they expect you to generate documentation on a lot of their code by running doxygen on the source

author: MasterBuilder
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 29, 2013, 11:51:47 pm
content: Ive a Discovery board and the much more expensive Mikroelektronika STM32 Dev board. I would recommend the Discovery board, the extra features of the Mikroelektronika board arent needed when starting out and there are a couple of annoying documentation errors with the Mikroelektronika board.

author: dannyf
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 30, 2013, 03:20:43 pm
content: QuoteI would think about what tools you intend to use to program those chips and for what applications before deciding on the hardware.I use CoIDE for free work. That means I am limited to STM0x, STM1xxF (no L), and STM40x chips. STM0x chips are good / simple chips, especially if you migrate from an 8-bit environment. I don't like them due to their dissimilarity with the bigger chips.STM1xxF chips are the mainstream one, with more limited peripherals than available on the newer chips.I would say that STM1xxF or STM401 are both good chipces for typical "embedded" fun (STM401 doesn't offer as much value however). STM42x gives you the option to run an OS.

author: dannyf
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 30, 2013, 04:18:59 pm
content: QuoteI would recommend the CM4 launch pads from TI: incredibly feature rich.

author: Jon86
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 31, 2013, 11:47:21 am
content: I just tried to place a order from them, and when I got redirected to their payment page, they wanted $30 or more for shipping! For an item that costs less than $10!I'm probably going to be going for TI then, as far as I know they don't charge for shipping. I could've bought from farnell or somewhere else, but they still charge way too much for shipping. Bastards.

author: gnif
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 31, 2013, 12:33:38 pm
content: I have been working with the STM32F1xx development boards for some time now, I even wrote the flash program (stm32flash) for the thing, which I no longer maintain for reasons shown down below.For price, the best I have found is Futurlec, they have two offerings:They have the STM32 Stamp module also:http://www.futurlec.com/ET-STM32_Stamp.shtml($24.90 USD)This one contains the STM32F103RET6 which has 512K and pretty much every peripheral you could want.http://www.futurlec.com/STM32_Development_Board.shtml($39.90 USD)This is quite a nice board as it has a JTAG header among other peripherals for testing and development.The only thing to note here is the chip is a STM32F103RBT6 which is only the 128K version, and missing a few peripherals, a shame really. I bought some RET6 chips from alibaba and swapped it over as I develop on this board but deploy onto the stamps.As for development, I learnt the hard way that using the serial interface/uploader etc. is a major pain in the ass as there is no way to debug the running code other then provide some kind of visual feedback. You will save yourself a world of pain if you get yourself a USB JTAG interface and use OpenOCD which supports the STM32 range of devices. This allows you to debug your code on the device, set breakpoints, step the code, inspect registers/ram, etc.These are wonderful devices IMO, fairly cheap, and very powerful for the price. There is also a nice open support library,libstm32which is FAR superior to the ST library. It is a bit lacking in documentation, but it is very nice to work with.It is also possible to run FreeRTOS on these devices making them very useful.

author: Jon86
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 31, 2013, 12:51:10 pm
content: Those boards look pretty good, I'll definitely consider those.The only thing that's pushing me away from these devices is the awkward packages (for me at least).I want to make a load of projects with microcontrollers, but it's going to be a huge pain in the ass to keep ordering PCBs for a simple little project. I loved the MSP430s because I could just solder the chips straight into a stripboard.I guess I could put the dev board straight into the project, but that's hardly practical really. I'll probably just bit the bullet and see how it goes, there's not much to lose.

author: gnif
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 31, 2013, 01:01:37 pm
content: Quote from: Jon86 on December 31, 2013, 12:51:10 pmWell you can buy the chips individually and incorporate them into your design that way, these are mainly for development/prototype use.

author: Jon86
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 31, 2013, 01:04:37 pm
content: What I mean is it's difficult to incorporate the chips into small one-off projects when they're in a small surface mount package, I'd probably have to send off for a PCB each time.

author: andersm
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 31, 2013, 01:07:36 pm
content: Quote from: gnif on December 31, 2013, 12:33:38 pmThe old-fashioned way to debug was to run a debug stub on the device, communicating with the remote debugger over a serial port or similar interface. It's not as robust as JTAG, but still a useful technique.

author: dannyf
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 31, 2013, 01:07:44 pm
content: QuoteLQFP, especially in 0.5 pitch, is very easy to solder - it does take some practice to get started.

author: Jon86
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 31, 2013, 01:13:18 pm
content: Quote from: dannyf on December 31, 2013, 01:07:44 pmThat's reassuring, I'd definitely need to buy myself a new soldering Iron, but I really should do that anyway.I'll probably give it a shot then

author: gmb42
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 31, 2013, 01:26:32 pm
content: Quote from: Jon86 on December 31, 2013, 11:47:21 amPreusming you're in the UK, Farnell (UK) offer them at reasonable prices, £6.78 for anF0, £10.85 for aF407and £16.64 for theF429with LCD (all prices ex VAT). Spend more than £20 (just top up the order with another board or bits and bobs) and the £3.95 handling charge disappears.

author: gnif
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 31, 2013, 02:30:33 pm
content: Quote from: Jon86 on December 31, 2013, 01:04:37 pmAh, understood. Perhaps these would be of help, not sure if you would want to keep these around either though:http://www.futurlec.com/SMD_Adapters.shtmlThe STM32F103RET6 is a LQFP-64 package.

author: quint
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 31, 2013, 06:05:52 pm
content: Quote from: gnif on December 31, 2013, 12:33:38 pmOne of the nice features of the Discovery boards is that they come with a built in flash loader/debugger called STLINK V2. This allows for programming and interactive debugging (via Eclipse or gdb etc) via USB. OpenOCD supports STLINK V2 but a simpler program to use is stlink (https://github.com/texane/stlink) which is easy to set up on Linux, Mac or Windows. The Discovery boards also have headers and jumpers which make it easy to use a Discovery board to program and debug other boards. So they end up being some of the cheapest SWD programmer/debugger dongles you can buy, even if you don't use the on board STM32 target chip.I'd also recommend ChibiOS (http://chibios.org) which is a nice RTOS which supports the Discovery boards very well.

author: edavid
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 31, 2013, 09:49:07 pm
content: Quote from: Jon86 on December 31, 2013, 12:51:10 pmThere are 2 ARM CPUs available in DIP packages:NXP LPC810M021FN8 - ARM Cortex M0 4KB/1KB DIP8NXP LPC1114FN28/102 - ARM Cortex M0 50MHz 32KB/4KB DIP28If they are of interest, you should get probably get an LPCXpresso board...

author: Jon86
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2014, 12:16:36 pm
content: Quote from: gnif on December 31, 2013, 02:30:33 pmThanks, that's the sort of thing I was looking forQuote from: edavid on December 31, 2013, 09:49:07 pmHaha that's brilliant, an ARM CPU in a DIP-8 package! I'll definitely have to give those a go too!

author: dannyf
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2014, 12:29:34 pm
content: QuoteNot terribly useful, in my experience.

author: Jon86
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2014, 12:31:25 pm
content: Quote from: dannyf on January 02, 2014, 12:29:34 pmWell 6 IO pins is never going to be that great, but I guess it could be fun to use.

author: dannyf
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2014, 01:27:58 pm
content: It has less to do with the number of pins: nxp did a great job actually implementing assignable pins on those chips.It has more to do with the (highly) limited flash and upward mobility. You are not going to code those chips in assembly. Once you start with C, the overhead will be significant for such a small chip. Not to mention that those chips aren't going to hold a lot of instructions to begin with.

author: SolarSunrise
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2014, 07:38:43 pm
content: I highly recommend the STM32F4Discovery board. It contains a accelerometer, LED's, a button, a DAC, a digital mic, a headphone jack, and a built in programmer. That certainly will keep you busy for a while.If you can't buy them cause the shipping is too damn expensive, check out Farnell - Farnell is great and the shipping isn't that expensive either (stuff there is little more expensive then Mouser or Digikey but hey it's in Europe)Check here:http://uk.farnell.com/jsp/search/browse.jsp?N=2031+203908&Ntk=gensearch&Ntt=stm32+discovery&Ntx=mode+matchallpartialSTM32F4Discovery:http://uk.farnell.com/stmicroelectronics/stm32f4discovery/stm32f407-usb-otg-discovery-kit/dp/2009276FYI, this book by Joseph Yiu is awesome and really helpful. It saved me bunch of times. Here's the UK amazon link:http://www.amazon.co.uk/Definitive-Cortex%C2%AE-M3-Cortex%C2%AE-M4-Processors-Edition/dp/0124080820/ref=dp_ob_title_bkEDIT: Just realized gmb42 already told you about Farnell. Oh well.

author: Harvs
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2014, 12:37:04 am
content: RE dealing with packages. The reality is the Disco boards are so close to the cost of the main chip itself you can just use the whole board instead if size isn't an issue. Treat it as a module. You can just rip the other chips off with a hot air tool if you don't want them (e.g. the DAC, accelerometer etc.) However, if you've got a project that can actually use those, the disco board just got cheaper than buying the chips individually (i.e. F407 board $18.69AUD, the main IC is ~$14.50 + $7.50 for the Accelerometer etc.)On two projects now which were one offs (i.e. <10), and the emphasis was 100% on getting it done ASAP I've drop the whole discovery board onto the finished product.I know some will cringe at this, and a year ago I probably would have to. But the reality is it's worked very well in these niche applications.

author: Bored@Work
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2014, 11:24:33 am
content: Quote from: Harvs on February 09, 2014, 12:37:04 amST tries to prevent this by trying to force a ridiculous license, yes, a license, on you.http://www.st.com/st-web-ui/static/active/en/resource/legal/legal_agreement/license_agreement/EvaluationProductLicenseAgreement.pdfWhile I personally think ST can stick this license to where the sun never shines and that any sane judge will show ST the door, it might deter a some people from using the boards in products.

author: Harvs
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2014, 12:06:57 pm
content: Quote from: Bored@Work on February 09, 2014, 11:24:33 amWow, what an absolute load of bollocks. According to that licence we shouldn't be using any part of their demo software either (i.e. their examples of how to use the libraries.) Doesn't matter for me, this is only for very small one off things with practically no commercial value attached to them.

author: andersm
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2014, 03:53:33 pm
content: Quote from: Harvs on February 09, 2014, 12:06:57 pmIt's a pretty normal CYA license. If you use the board in a product, and it all goes horribly wrong, it's your own fault.

author: Harvs
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 09, 2014, 10:13:25 pm
content: Quote from: andersm on February 09, 2014, 03:53:33 pmThat's perfectly reasonable, and I never would have expected anything else WRT liability. But I haven't seen another hardware licence before that restricts you to only using it for self education purposes and nothing else.

author: wisementor
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: February 11, 2014, 08:40:35 pm
content: I think thisdevelopment toolsupports some of discovery boards directly and most of STM32 devices. With free version you can utilize up to 25% of device flash memory capacity which could be enough also for medium sized project. Successfully compiled and debugged Chibi/OS and FreeRTOS with it. Includes also project wizard where with few clicks the basic project or example can be created.