Paper vs. Silicon - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Jozef
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 05:22:26 pm
content: Hi all,How much academia and professors contribute to the real world of electronics in terms of new applicable theories (not paper research) and inventions? I know that many professors write books, but this cannot be considered as innovation, such as inventing some ICs or a new fabrication technology, for example.

author: Bored@Work
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 06:11:27 pm
content: What answer do you want to hear? All professors suck? OK, all professors suck. There you have it.

author: Balaur
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 06:25:24 pm
content: Quote from: Jozef on April 10, 2013, 05:22:26 pmThe formulation of your question would seem to imply negative connotations about the professional categories you mention. Furthermore, you express your disbelief in their ability to significantly contribute to the development of the industry.As an industrial from a strongly R&D-oriented company who has strong ties with the academic world, I tend to respond very violently to this kind of ignorant question.However, please formulate your own opinions and act on your own observations.

author: Excavatoree
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 06:27:29 pm
content: All of my engineering professors worked in their lab doing various research. They tried to explain to us undergrads what they did, but all we could do was look at the pretty pictures on the walls and admire all the cool equipment.This is a bit about what one of my professors does. He has published papers, but has done a lot of innovating.His main research focus is in microelectromechanical systems (MEMS), which uses microfabrication techniques to create mechanical structures in silicon and other materials that can be added to electronic devices. A key participant in the Microelectronics Research Center and the Microsystems Packaging Research Center, Dr. Allen also serves as a co-director for the Center for MEMS and Microsystems Technologies. He leads the Microsensor and Microactuator Group at Georgia Tech, where he has advised 17 postdoctoral fellows and has graduated 27 Ph.D. students. During his career, he has published almost 90 refereed journal papers and 165 refereed conference papers.To date, Dr. Allen and his research group have been issued 36 patents, two of which have led to the development of two companies—Redeon and CardioMEMS—that are graduates of the Advanced Technology Development Center. In 1999, Dr. Allen and his colleague Mark Prausnitz of the School of Chemical and Biomolecular Engineering co-founded Redeon, a microneedle company that commercialized microfabrication-based approaches to transdermal delivery of drugs such as insulin.

author: krish2487
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 06:42:46 pm
content: Quite a moot point actually.It is like saying Josef fourier is good for nothing because he has not done anything other than write a paper about fourier series.We use fourier series in almost every digital signal processing application and it does not stop at that.Not quite the exact analogy but makes my point.The true contribution of a professor to his fieldneed not be limited to what he actually does personally.They can and many times do act as a catalyst to a bigger revolution.Maybe the reason why you are unable to see their contributions directly is because they might be limited by todays technology to achieve what they forsee.And of course, let us not forget that professors get funding from companies which have the right to patent the work of the professor.As excavatoree pointed out the work might be that of the professor, but the practical product is from a company.Does not mean that the professor was not essential is realizing the technology.

author: ecat
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 07:30:18 pm
content: There is a single light of science, and to brighten it anywhere is to brighten it everywhere. - Isaac Asimov

author: kxenos
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 08:04:58 pm
content: I think he didn't mean to sound like that. There is theoretical research and applied research. Most universities lean towards theoretical research because that sets the fundamental principles upon which the applied research is based. This job, more often than not, is the one that opens the road for applied science to do it's job. Also this kind of job is not so fancy because usually it doesn't produce tangible things like new ICs etc. And because of this usually there are less/no money made. So, for a company to invest all that time and effort without even being sure that it will pay off is a risky thing. Also, usually research is bound (by ethics and Theses) to be published and that's an other reason companies wouldn't want to mess with it. On the other hand, applied research requires things that universities usually don't have. Facilities, motive and hierarchy!In all these of cource there are exceptions like published papers from employees of i.e HP, IBM etc. and non-public research of i.e MIT for high tech DoD projects etc.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 08:19:21 pm
content: Professors' research is indeed an important part of the R&D process, whether their work extends into applications or not, as it can be picked up by others and carried further (it has to start somewhere, and tends to be a collaboration between universities and private industry). And given the fact that numerous companies have scaled back their R&D budgets due to the effect on short-term balance sheets (won't do it all on their own as they once would have), the research generated by the academic world has taken on a greater importance IMHO (a lot less would be generated without the academic input).

author: jpb
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 08:39:35 pm
content: I'm now in academia but in the field of computer science and not electronics.I used to be in industrial research in the field of GaAs monolithic microwave integrated circuits. We used to collaborate with universities but universities, in the UK at least, don't have the same funds as industry for very expensive capital equipment like multimillion pound clean rooms but they also don't have the same commercial constraints so can do interesting research which companies may not do because it is not got an immediate commercial outcome. (In the old days companies like IBM and AT&T Bell Labs used to fund a lot of blue-sky research but I think now-a-days they are much more commercially driven.)But the tone of your original post seems more to be a complaint about your professors making you do theoretical work and questioning whether this is of any use when your professors haven't done commercial stuff. The fact is that theoretical understanding is very important for advanced technical design (as apposed to just connecting up existing ics and components in a standard way). Additionally, most good professors have probably spent time in industry and so have experience of both worlds.Also many technology companies spin out from university work.

author: Jozef
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 10, 2013, 09:30:50 pm
content: Thanks guys i got a clear picture now how it's.Regarding the first rude posts...QuoteI want to hear some professional answers like Excavatoree, kxenos, nanofrog, and jpb'sQuoteQuoteI have no opinions, I asked a question that you could not answer and you took it as an offense.

author: Excavatoree
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2013, 01:23:51 pm
content: Kindly explain how my post was rude.

author: Jozef
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2013, 02:31:48 pm
content: My deep apology Excavatoree. I corrected my last reply.

author: BravoV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2013, 03:05:44 pm
content: Quote from: Jozef on April 10, 2013, 05:22:26 pmSeriously, this question it self is a great insult to the academic communities, and clearly shows your ignorance.Its normal and no wonder you're having negative replies as above.Its obvious you're using a computer to post this question, let me list down only few examples people that contributed to the computer you're using right now without even inventing IC or build something physically.- Maurice Karnaugh- Dennis Richard- Ken Thomson- Abraham Lempel- Jacob ZivNow go start googling and read them seriously who are they and what they've contributed so you can sit on your lazy brain & ass using the computer in asking this junk question.

author: G7PSK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2013, 05:42:22 pm
content: At one stage virtually every thing we touch or use these days was just some academics work or theory, they research prototype etc then engineers work it up and then an industrialist takes it to market and takes all the credit along with the profit.

author: Jozef
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2013, 03:42:34 pm
content: BravoV, FUCK YOU piece of crap loser.Moderator: This user has been banned for a month. Perhaps their attitude will be better when they return.

author: kxenos
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2013, 04:52:30 pm
content: Jozef, it's the first time I read a phrase like this in this forum. So I'm not used to it and I would like to keep it that way. I kindly request that you edit your post. Not because fuck is a bad word at all, nor because it's an unpleasant thing to do (if I remember correctly).Attack the opinion or the argument. Not the person.Bravo, the guy had a genuine question. He probably was slightly biased but that doesn't make his question invalid. Why should I consider anyone who is outside academia or academic research (and thus doesn't understand the reasoning) a lazy-brained person? And of course, even if your suggestion is useful, you know that you can't motivate anyone to follow if you speak like that.I don't like it when people don't remember that knowledge, reasoning and the like are destinations that you reach through experience and age. And that in their youth they had many wrong beliefs and sudo-knowledge. And so, it's better to guide and instruct young persons instead of disregarding and insulting them. Just my $.02...

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2013, 07:53:30 pm
content: Quote from: kxenos on April 12, 2013, 04:52:30 pm+1Such a tactic in one post could cause others to ignore that individual, even when it's genuinely useful and valid, in future discussions (i.e. "see the poster and think something like "here we go again...", and skip reading it).It's just not the best way to go about posting a response IMHO.

author: Balaur
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 12, 2013, 08:21:04 pm
content: What actually happened is that Jozef posted earlier a much, much nastier message towards BravoV, message that was removed promptly.Jozef thinks that BravoV was responsible for this. Actually no. It was myself who reported the message to the moderators. So, I'm waiting for punishment now.Cheers to all,Dan

author: krish2487
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 13, 2013, 12:32:02 am
content: I am with bravoV on this issue.He has said nothing that should cause the OP to respond in such a forceful manner.He quoted examples of several key figures whose work was crucial to enjoythe comforts of a PC.Moreover G7PSK did mention about the work of professors turning eventually into a commercial product, in just the previous post.Basic Courtesy is not overrated.The OP should not have jumped to conclusions based on his assumptions.Further, it is evident from his replies about the defensive attitude he has taken to respond.We are all open to logic here. Instead of presenting his arguments in a proper fashion, he has resorted tofoul language and mud slinging.Please do not post a question, the answer to which you do not want to hear.Forums such as these are a immensely helpful source of information and knowledge.You want a question answered, ask in the right manner and do not take comments to the heart.

author: lemmegraphdat
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 13, 2013, 02:07:38 am
content: I just flat don't get it.