Be aware defective products from Amazon NO recourse - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Jester
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2022, 05:34:50 pm
content: I’m located in Canada, so the situation may vary by country.Purchased from Amazon a camera that plugs into MAINS as well as PC. Upon connection huge arc and destoyed the PC.Response from Amazon after 10 hours on the phone:- customer service useless, other than offering to refund the price of camera- will not provide contact details of their legal departmentResponse from consumer protection we can’t do anything contact a lawyerResponse from lawyer, unless you can prove that Amazon sold the device knowing that not just the unit they sold you was defective, but all cameras of that type were defective and then they decided to sell them anyways, you have no recourse but to attempt to recover from the seller directly.I imagine if this burnt the house down the insurance company would know how to collect.Welcome to 2022 in Canada.

author: bdunham7
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2022, 05:44:12 pm
content: The liability of a reseller or 'middleman' varies with jurisdiction, so if you consulted a Canadian lawyer you probably go the right answer for Canada. But (again, I don't know specific Canada law) if you struggle to reach the seller directly, the importer may be liable. Good luck with that unless they just happen to be a real company.When you say the camera plugs into mains, do you mean a mains cord directly to the device or do you mean a brick or wall wart setup?

author: Stray Electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2022, 05:49:06 pm
content: You say purchased from Amazon but it sounds more like you purchased from a vendor on Amazon and not from Amazon themselves. There is a BIG difference!IMO the WORST thing that Amazon has ever done was to allow 3rd party sellers on their platform."blew up the PC."Really?Pictures or it didn't happen."Welcome to 2022 in Canada."What? You don't have small claims court in Canada?

author: Jester
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2022, 06:23:07 pm
content: Quote from: bdunham7 on August 11, 2022, 05:44:12 pmDevice is/was a nanny camera disguised as a USB charger. It plugs into the wall and has a USB connector and cable that your supposed to plug into a pc to set the time and date. When I say blew up, it didn’t physically explode, it just would no longer turn on. From the arc that occurred it looks like in applied full MAINS to the USB port.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2022, 06:30:03 pm
content: That sounds entirely plausible. Isolation failure due to typical inadequately made transformer in cheap generic Chinese charger, people have been electrocuted by these. Applying mains to the USB port is probably exactly what happened.Do you have homeowners or renters insurance? They may replace the PC for you and if it's worth it to them they may go after the seller themselves to recover.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 11, 2022, 06:38:43 pm
content: Not sure about Canada. But usually you need to bring a faulty item to independent expert and get report. Then if report is favorable to you, the company either reimburses the damages voluntarily or you sue them. I guess you need to bring both items, so you get a report that camera has fatal insulation failure and that computer got fried via USB.The seller is likely Chinese (check their business details on Amazon), so it's another problem. But I guess it's not totally impossible to get their goods sized if their items are dispatched from Canadian warehouse of Amazon.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 11, 2022, 06:49:15 pm
content: As of dangerous item, Canada has a proper authority to reporthttps://www.canada.ca/en/health-canada/corporate/contact-us/consumer-product-safety-program.html, consumer protection is not the right one.

author: Jester
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2022, 08:04:37 pm
content: I have reported the device to consumer product safety in Canada.The seller is actually based out of Sugar Land Texas. It's interesting, because the ad claims designed in USA manufactured in China, however it looks like countless Chinese knock-offs with just as many names, so I'm highly skeptical that it was actually designed in the USA. If it was I would love to know what safety standard they designed to?I think the relevant standard in the USA would be UL 60950-1 Edition 3Can someone confirm that?

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2022, 09:51:16 pm
content: Looks like this is the item in question:https://www.amazon.ca/Spy-Camera-Charger-Premium-Surveillance/dp/B083QNJQK2/Its a Chinese company registered in USA:https://opencorporates.com/companies/us_tx/0803710625Might be possible to sue in small claims here:https://www.gilbertsondavis.com/enforcement-ontario-judgment-us-u-s-american-states/I wouldn't bother.But either way, do not buy mains powered devices from china that are not appropriately approved. Too much risk. Amazon should really not be selling them, or post warnings.

author: Someone
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2022, 10:34:42 pm
content: Quote from: Jester on August 11, 2022, 05:34:50 pmInternational trade has always been complex but only with internet shopping has it hit consumers.From what has been said it was bought from a US seller? then you're the importer and responsible for all/any safety compliance. Shake your local safety bodies too hard and they could come back at you with scary strength. Buy something from a local seller if you want your local standards and protections.

author: Someone
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2022, 10:36:50 pm
content: Quote from: thm_w on August 11, 2022, 09:51:16 pmLike ebay, that side of their business is a platform ... for which they will take no responsibility beyond "yes, we did facilitate a transaction and take our cut, any problems are between the two of you".

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2022, 10:44:46 pm
content: Quote from: Someone on August 11, 2022, 10:36:50 pmI realize that, but the layperson does not. Which is where a warning would have some value, if they browse through light switches and see "oh this is not certified for use in my country, maybe I should choose an approved one for $5 more instead?"They do provide some warnings when you buy certain "professional" equipment here, not sure why.

author: floobydust
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 11, 2022, 11:53:36 pm
content: The Canadian government, and US, UK, Australia etc. - willingly allow import and resale of mains-powered devices from china that have no safety approvals or certificates. Many with hazardous, unsafe construction.We allow it to happen.Everyone loves cheap junk and china gets to build up their industries the easy way with no regulatory burden or accountability.USB charger, Christmas lights, SMT hot air station, SMPS etc. all of these can be quite dangerous.Flip the table and I couldn't make a mains-powered product to sell, having no safety approvals. china won't allow such an import, and in other countries maybe blocked at Customs and I'd be liable.There are also instances of importers putting fake approval labels on cheap imported products i.e. San Francisco stores you might remember.On Amazon, I'd purchased a Shark USB charger and noticed the mains cord was very thin, and that there are no safety approvals, aside from the usual fake CE. I posted this in a review and the product vanished, it got pulled by either the seller or Amazon.

author: abquke
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2022, 12:15:33 am
content: Amazon and eBay have converged to the point where I just use eBay.

author: Stray Electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2022, 12:25:15 am
content: Quote from: abquke on August 12, 2022, 12:15:33 amYes, I frequently do the same! The prices on a lot of items on Amazon have gotten ridiculous. Usually thanks to a 3rd party seller. At least I KNOW that I can get my money back with Ebay/payPal. I can't say the same of 3rd party amazon sellers.

author: Someone
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2022, 01:17:00 am
content: Quote from: Stray Electron on August 12, 2022, 12:25:15 amOn the off chance there is a better deal/coupon/discount/membership price on Amazon the bots quickly match it with a small markup on eBay. Had a few packages arrive drop shipped (even internationally!) while having dealt entirely with a local "private" seller. Saves me hours hunting for the best price.

author: blacksheeplogic
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2022, 04:24:14 am
content: Quote from: Jester on August 11, 2022, 06:23:07 pmSo your an upstanding ethical member of the community wanting to record people without their knowledge for whatever reason, bought the cheapest device you could find from a company with catering to these morally outstanding people and got burnt (or rather your laptop did).Sorry to hear that.

author: Jester
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2022, 11:36:56 am
content: Quote from: blacksheeplogic on August 12, 2022, 04:24:14 amWow!Should someone enter a room that they have been told is strictly off limits?You are in no position to judge as you have no idea of where this is located, what signs are posted etc. FWIW it was located in a secure workplace room with multiple cameras and warning signs, this was a backup in case the other camera at that vantage point failed.All the people that purchase from Amazon are “morally outstanding”, please explain that?Please enlighten me on where you would purchase such a device, and what is an appropriately high price to pay?

author: bd139
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2022, 11:53:04 am
content: Quote from: abquke on August 12, 2022, 12:15:33 amThis is ok until your eBay purchase turns up in an Amazon package and you worked out you paid 2x the amazon amount for it and some bastard has pocketed the difference.If this ever happens, open a return with eBay. It’s hilariously expensive and time consuming for the seller to deal with so they mostly ignore you and you get to keep the itemAs for buying stuff, well if you buy off brand then you get this shit. Horse flavoured lasagne here for example…

author: floobydust
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 12, 2022, 06:21:38 pm
content: OP, about the safety aspect- I typically see IEC 60950 certification but this standard is 30 years old, now withdrawn andreplacedby IEC 62368 Dec. 2020, as part of the change to hazard-based safety standards.edit: Amazon could easily have a "safety approvals" field with the item information. "NONE"

author: Jester
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 13, 2022, 01:00:14 pm
content: Quote from: floobydust on August 12, 2022, 06:21:38 pmIMO the IEC 62368 hazards-based approach is more intuitive than the older 60950/61010 standards. Many years ago I found myself perusing the standards page by page to determine what was applicable and what was not for a particular product. Other than spelling out the nuances for example the details of ground stud wiring a fair bit of the standard would not apply to the device you were designing. Ultimately is was mostly about identifying the hazardous energy sources and dealing with them.I actually have an isolated USB hub on my bench and normally use it with unknown devices, I’m kicking myself for the rookie mistake of trusting an unknown device, the isolated and un-isolated ports are within 6” of each other.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 17, 2022, 05:36:08 pm
content: Quote from: blacksheeplogic on August 12, 2022, 04:24:14 amIf you don't want to be recorded, stay off my property, you have no room to try to shame anyone for protecting their own property when you don't even have any idea of the circumstances it is being done. I'm sick of pro-criminal people falling all over themselves to protect the crooks at the expense of everyone else.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 17, 2022, 05:39:44 pm
content: Quote from: bd139 on August 12, 2022, 11:53:04 amThis has happened to me a few times and it annoys me, I didn't bother to try to screw them over though. Ironically I've had the same thing happen with Amazon too, I ordered something a while back and it arrived in a box from Sam's Club.I absolutely loathe these ridiculous marketplace things that nearly every online seller is using now. You never really know who you're actually buying from and they make it difficult to avoid. It's going to eventually dilute all these brands as they become nothing more than a facade for dozens of other retailers.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 17, 2022, 06:45:02 pm
content: I couldn’t agree more. I used to enjoy Amazon back when, other than used books, it was just them selling. The search worked well, and Amazon’s prices, while not alwaysthelowest, were always decent.Now I literally can’t be bothered. Ordering just takes way, way, WAY too long. Between wading through pages of keyword-stuffed third party crap that isn’t the specific thing I want, to often only third-party availability even if it is what I want, only to discover that it can’t be shipped to Switzerland anyway (since their stupid search lists an item ifanyvariant fromanyseller happens to ship to Switzerland, even if the variant I searched for isn’t available from any seller that ships here). Sometimes it’ll tell me that right on the product page, other times it won’t tell me until I attempt to check out. It’s absolutely maddening, and shows absolute disdain for the user’s time.Amazon used to design its website to be user-first. I used to work in user interface design, and in regards to online shops, people used to say “when in doubt, look to see how Amazon is doing it” because they were so consistently good. That’s certainly gone out the window…

author: bd139
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 17, 2022, 06:47:27 pm
content: It’s designed carefully to confuse you into making a profitable purchase for them.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 17, 2022, 08:35:23 pm
content: I don’t think that sending me fleeing into the arms of their competition is profitable for them.

author: bd139
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 17, 2022, 08:41:10 pm
content: There are plenty of morons to the left of you on the bell curve who are customers still

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 17, 2022, 08:50:31 pm
content: If you pay for Prime they give you a "Prime eligable" search option.If you DONT pay then you can't easily search local stocked items.There is probably some way around this but didn't bother to find out, just saw one questionable extension.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 17, 2022, 09:31:00 pm
content: I have never seen any real point in Prime. I already get free shipping on every order I place from Amazon, all I have to do is pool up enough items in my cart to cross the $35 threshold which is rarely difficult. If I couldn't plan ahead and really needed something quickly, I could pay for expedited shipping on quite a few orders before I had spent as much as prime costs. I'm not sure why so many people fall for the "free" expedited shipping and don't realize that it isn't free at all, they're paying for it ahead of time in the form of the membership dues.

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 17, 2022, 09:33:17 pm
content: The point is, "Prime eligible" means you will get it within a few days, regardless of if you are paying for a Prime membership. Which is why they make it hard to filter it.

author: PlainName
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 17, 2022, 11:43:10 pm
content: QuotePrime isn't for you, then. But everyone else isn't you, so maybe it works for them even though it doesn't for you? Worth considering.

author: Stray Electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2022, 12:32:14 am
content: Quote from: tooki on August 17, 2022, 06:45:02 pmI have to say that I completely agree. I can search for one very specific items and Amazon shows me hundreds of items that have to relationship to what I'm looking for. Then bombards me with numerous large banner ads of "Similar items" (NOT!), "people also bought", "children's toys" and other ridiculous categories. It's become impossible to find what you're looking for an Amazon and I rarely bother to even look now. It's much easier to go Ebay, and immediately find what I want and order it and pay for it with PayPal. I also KNOW that E-bay/PayPal will stand behind the product.Several weeks ago I ordered one item from Amazon, the first thing that I've ordered in months. Delivery was quoted as taking almost two weeks!!! I had ordered well in advance so I agreed to that. But since then, the deliver date has been extended FOUR times! FYI this is pet food made in the US and shipped within the US. There is no "china", "overseas shipping" or other "Covid" related excuses, just very slowing shipping time from the seller (two weeks) and now I think they're sending it via tortoise post.I'm just about DONE with buying anything on Amazon!

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2022, 12:43:32 am
content: Only buy items that are marked as "sold and delivered by Amazon" or something to that extent. This stuff is delivered promptly from their warehouse. Otherwise you are buying from a private seller.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2022, 12:54:29 am
content: Quote from: dunkemhigh on August 17, 2022, 11:43:10 pmI never claimed it didn't, I'm not sure why you sound so defensive. Perhaps you could explain what is so great about it? It's not charity from Amazon, they offer it because it generates profit. The shipping isn't free, you pay for it in the membership cost and by buying things from Amazon instead of other places where they might be cheaper. The main thing I don't get is what the draw of faster shipping is and why that's worth so much money. I have never once paid for shipping on an Amazon order since I never order less than the threshold anyway, so I don't understand why SO many people are willing to pay such a large sum each year just to get their orders a bit quicker. If I need something by a certain date I simply order it sufficiently prior to that. I am one of the only people I know who doesn't have prime and I don't see what I'm missing.

author: xrunner
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2022, 01:00:57 am
content: Quote from: james_s on August 18, 2022, 12:54:29 amThere's more to Prime than shipping.For example, I want it because Amazon has exclusive broadcast rights now to NFL Thursday Night Football. Now whether or not you care about that isn't my point, I'm simply pointing out what Prime offers.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2022, 01:01:49 am
content: Quote from: Stray Electron on August 18, 2022, 12:32:14 amAmazon still has two very significant advantages. Returns are super simple, I fill out the request and then I drop the item off at the UPS store down the street from me, it doesn't cost me anything to ship it back. The other big advantage is they handle their own shipping so they can provide free shipping, that's a substantial savings, and it's FAR more reliable than FedEx which is the most common "free" shipping service offered by other retailers. Amazon is the only retailer that owns the whole process end to end. Ebay has some advantages but it has its own issues too.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2022, 01:03:51 am
content: Quote from: xrunner on August 18, 2022, 01:00:57 amWell there's the streaming video service which I have used at friend's houses and was never impressed with. I did not know about the NFL tie in, I don't personally care about that but I can see how some would. Is there anything else compelling that it offers? The only thing I ever hear anyone talk about is the shipping.

author: LaserSteve
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2022, 01:53:46 am
content: Did you mention Texas? They have a Deceptive Products Act in liu of a Consumer Product Safety Commission like many states and our Federal government here in the US. Even if you don't have legal standing in Texas, they can possibly choose to take corrective action on behalf of safety of the general public, depending on how the local law is worded.Overseas law suits are communicated by the foreign court in question to a US Court via the US Secretary of State's office. That is one of SecState's lessor known functions, certifying and relaying international judicial communications. Depending on how the treaties between our nations are worded, and how much Texas or Federal law has in common with your laws, you may actually have standing in a US Court via your local court, your diplomats, and one heck of a lot of slow international processes.Drop this agency an email:https://www.texasattorneygeneral.gov/The US CPSC takes their duties seriously, like forcing horrid changes to lawn mowers and spare gas tanks. Your welcome to send them an email. I seem to remember a vague Federal law on exporting dangerous goods as a no-no.I'm not saying you'll get justice, but never doubt the possibility of a state agency to pop in on a small business for an inspection.Steve

author: Bassman59
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2022, 04:52:23 am
content: Quote from: Stray Electron on August 18, 2022, 12:32:14 amIt's remarkable how you can enter specific details about an item, including manufacturer SKU, and get complete nonsense as search results.I'm convinced they're using artificial intelligence, because as we know, "To err is human. To really fuck things up requires a computer."

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2022, 06:01:52 am
content: Quote from: Bassman59 on August 18, 2022, 04:52:23 am”Remarkable” really is the right word for it. It’s impressively bad. I’ve experienced the exact same thing, where even a specific SKU doesn’t find the right item (even if they have it, with the same SKU saved in the item’s metadata).I’m sure part of the search sucking has to do with the fact that third party sellers can modify the dataset: if they add the ASIN (Amazon Standard Identification Number) to their list of items they sell, they can then modify the authoritative metadata of that ASIN. This is how they steal obsolete listings for highly-rated products, resulting in an ice cube tray becoming a trashy smartphone gimbal, with the hundreds of positive reviews of the former outweighing the overwhelmingly bad reviews of the latter.But even when not used for outright fraud, third party metadata editing is likely how we end up with inconsistent product options, with some variants missing and listed as their own separate item, while other variants are listed multiple times, etc. I wonder whether former/discontinued variants are still considered in the search, perhaps due to reviews. Maybe the content of reviews is also part of the search index.Either way, what a goddamned joke it’s become. Thank goodness that, at least for consumer electronics, computers, cameras, etc. Switzerland is now one of the cheapest countries in Europe to buy in, so that there’s no need to import and I can happily use a local online shop whose standard shipping will have the goods at my door by the next day.

author: PlainName
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2022, 09:37:52 am
content: Quote from: james_s on August 18, 2022, 12:54:29 amPerhaps it's just the way you tell them. Similar to how you "never really understood the point of a static IP", and then rubbish someone who does.QuoteFor me, I buy enough that it covers the shipping I'd otherwise pay, and the post-sales support is better than most other online resources. I may have watched one or two films (not my bag, so not a significant driver) and downloaded a number of books (but the range is limited and I think I've exhausted their stock).So, not one thing in particular but the overall experience. I guess they could change something for the worse and the other benefits (for me) might keep me there.QuoteThat's certainly a biggie. A couple of weeks ago we had an issue with our boiler and figured the on/off switch could usefully be replaced by an IoT doobrey (as you do). A fairly long browse of Amazon turned up the exact thing which didn't seem to be available from anywhere else. Ordered, delivered, fitted and programmed within 22 hours of having the idea. That's worth a couple of bob. Maybe you could have foreseen your need a few weeks previous and arranged a cheaper delivery.QuoteLike I said, Prime isn't for you, then.QuoteOf course. And the benefit I get is worth the cost to me - it's a two-way thing, you know. Do you always choose the cheapest of anything and everything, or do you perhaps grudgingly accept that some things are worth paying for?

author: Jester
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2022, 12:20:16 pm
content: Quote from: LaserSteve on August 18, 2022, 01:53:46 amSteve, thanks for your post. I spoke with a Texas lawyer and she recommended the same thing. Prerequisite before SCC is to send a demand letter, I just took that step.Thanks.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2022, 04:20:29 pm
content: Quote from: dunkemhigh on August 18, 2022, 09:37:52 amI'm too lazy to quote inline to all that stuff but yes, some things are worth paying for, in general I have a policy of buying good tools, buy cheap, buy twice and all that. If I need fast shipping I can pay for it as needed, last I ran the numbers I'd need to expedite around a dozen orders just to break even.I also did not "rubbish" the guy who claims he needs a static IP, in fact he's one of my best and longest term friends, he's a great guy but he's also like me a bit odd and that is one of his quirks. I know what he's doing with his internet service and it isn't something that really needs a static IP, and he's gone through a great deal of effort and paid considerably more for much slower service than I have over the years.I'm not saying Prime has no value to anyone, but what I do find shocking is that literally EVERYONE I can think of has it, except for me, and I am confused as to how so many people find value in something that I can't see much value in. I think most people get suckered in by the "free" shipping and don't realize that they are paying for it. I also get annoyed at the way Amazon is constantly hounding me to sign up for it, in fact I have accidentally enrolled on two different occasions and had to go find out how to cancel it. They very deliberately make you jump through hoops to not enroll.

author: bd139
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2022, 04:26:11 pm
content: I work from home. Prime means I don’t have to go to the shops or piddle around trying to find the cheapest shipping combo for stuff or have to queue stuff up reduced cost shipping. I did 255 separate orders in the last 12 months. Works for me.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2022, 04:36:35 pm
content: Quote from: bd139 on August 18, 2022, 04:26:11 pmHave you tried just keeping a cart open and pulling the trigger as soon as you have $35 worth of items in it? I also work from home and have ordered quite a bit from them lately so a similar use case and I can almost always hit that threshold within a couple of days. If I really want to order something today I can usually find something else like toilet cleaner, cat treats, shop towels etc that I'm not out of yet but that I'll need to replenish sooner or later so I just toss one of those in the cart or I go look at my wishlist and see if there's anything I want to grab now. I have the option of just paying a few bucks for fast shipping but so far I haven't had to resort to that, the free shipping threshold is so low that I don't have to go out of my way to hit it.

author: bd139
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2022, 04:37:26 pm
content: Sometimes I need a roll of tape or something same day. And that’s it.I’m in London in UK so we have same day, sometimes under 4h delivery.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2022, 04:43:21 pm
content: Quote from: bd139 on August 18, 2022, 04:37:26 pmBut it's a whopping $140 a year these days, how often do you really need just a roll of tape? You can get that same rapid shipping as needed by paying for it when you order. Personally I toss tape in my cart when I notice I'm down to the last couple of rolls, that avoids that whole situation of needing something NOW. I also have the option of just stopping at a store when I go out to buy groceries, at least for now Amazon hasn't completely put all the local shops out of business but they certainly are trying.Prime is one of those things that is a good deal for a handful of people, you may be one of those, but most people that have it do not get their moneys worth, otherwise it would not be so profitable for Amazon and they wouldn't push it so hard. It is a psychological trick.

author: bd139
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 18, 2022, 05:40:20 pm
content: I’ve got three kids, work from home, run my own company so plenty of last minute purchases. I do buy in bulk where possible. $113 equivalent a year here is the pricing and it isn’t a big deal for me. Also Prime video is ok. I got The Expanse and The Boys

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 19, 2022, 06:08:47 am
content: Quote from: bd139 on August 18, 2022, 05:40:20 pmYou’re clearly just the hapless victim of psychological sorcery.

author: bd139
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 19, 2022, 09:58:50 am
content: Quote from: tooki on August 19, 2022, 06:08:47 amNo I'm just very lazy and have better things to do than chase the lowest priceEdit: actually that's not true. I'm moving house so I have a big spreadsheet going. Amazon got a lot of business because they were the cheapest and most convenient supplier:You can see some of the other suppliers in there...

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 19, 2022, 05:11:37 pm
content: Well that’s the thing… I no longer consider Amazon to be convenient. Low prices be damned, if it takes me hours of clicking around to actually select and purchase the item I want, I’m going to go elsewhere.I’m too lazy, err, “my time is too valuable” to waste on their stupid website. :/

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 19, 2022, 05:25:03 pm
content: Quote from: tooki on August 19, 2022, 06:08:47 amSome of you are taking this WAY too personally. I've said several times there are exceptions, you may be one of those exceptions. I still think for most people that have Prime it is not really a good value, they fall for the marketing trickery. That doesn't mean YOU don't get good value from it. Does anyone really think the average consumer is all that savvy? They still fall for tricks like shrinking the package to hide price increases. Just a few weeks ago I taught an otherwise intelligent person about the price per unit that is legally required on supermarket price signs but printed in tiny font, she was 41 and was not even aware it was there. Most people fall for this stuff, I don't, I suspect a much larger percentage of the engineering community doesn't vs the general population. Deception and psychological trickery are some of the core principals in marketing, making people think they're getting a better deal than they are, and it works.

author: bd139
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 19, 2022, 06:05:00 pm
content: Quote from: tooki on August 19, 2022, 05:11:37 pmAs with all shops they’re fine if you know what you want and how much it costs.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 19, 2022, 07:18:56 pm
content: Quote from: bd139 on August 19, 2022, 06:05:00 pmI could not disagree more. I can know exactly what I want, what it’s called, who makes it, and even the part/model number and Amazon will still fail to find iteven if they carry it.For example, try “Clairefontaine 60g A4”. It’s currently sold out on Amazon UK (as I can verify by copying its ASIN to a URL), but even expressly selecting “include out of stock” won’t find it. Adding the product number (1929C) doesn’t help.And as I’ve explained above, since their search makes it essentially impossible to successfully filter only to the items that can actually be shipped to Switzerland, even “successful” searches frequently aren’t, in that they are incapable of resulting in a sale.While I recognize that the different Amazon country sites have differing success rates — the English language ones seem to do better — it’s still appalling how bad their search has become.Another example: a Rotring 600 0.5mm mechanical pencil. On Amazon UK, entering “Rotring 600 0.5mm” gets two results, right at the top. On Amazon Germany (the preferred Amazon for Switzerland), and the country where the damned thing is made, the same search finds all manner of Rotring 600 products, but with useless item titles that don’t include the lead thickness, so I have to click every damned one and scroll into the weeds to find what thickness it is. The search is doubly sucky because when set to German, it struggles with German compound nouns, so fails to find things and instead proposes all manner of crap. And when set to English, it doesn’t use the native English product databases from the US and UK, but instead machine translates the English into German, and then feeds that into the lousy German search. It’s a joke.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 19, 2022, 07:23:46 pm
content: Quote from: tooki on August 19, 2022, 07:18:56 pmSame here. It has always amazed me how Amazon became so popular with such a poor search feature (if you can even call it that). I don't even bother; I use Google to find product and if that happens to be Amazon, so be it but in most cases a different webshop pops up earlier in the search results. For me Amazon is the last resort after Aliexpress (which has a much better search function).

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 19, 2022, 07:26:54 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on August 19, 2022, 07:23:46 pmAnd that’s saying a lot, given how awful AliExpress’ search is!P.S. I edited my post to include another section about non-English search.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 19, 2022, 07:31:48 pm
content: Quote from: bd139 on August 19, 2022, 06:05:00 pmI wish that were the case, but as others have pointed out, the search is heavily biased to show you what Amazon wants you to buy instead of what you're looking for. I too have often tried searching for an exact item and it will show me all sorts of irrelevant stuff and there is no effective parametric search. Just last night I was looking for some .22 airgun pellets and it showed me pages and pages of the more common .177 caliber. I gave up and bought some from a different vendor that allowed me select the size I wanted. I run into this sort of thing constantly. On the other hand sometimes I search for something and I find products that are totally suitable, but it's usually when I want something less specific, say a new belt or a pair of slippers, I'm not looking for a specific item, so I browse until I encounter one that looks suitable.

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 19, 2022, 08:13:15 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on August 19, 2022, 07:31:48 pmNot saying their search isn't garbage, but I could not reproduce that. I don't see a single .177 listing.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 19, 2022, 10:02:29 pm
content: Oddly that search is working for me now too, but it certainly wasn't the other day.

author: PlainName
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 20, 2022, 12:15:22 am
content: QuoteDidn't have a problem here.Edit: maybe those having a problem don't have Prime

author: MrMobodies
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 20, 2022, 12:19:26 am
content: I see someone posted a picture of theirs falling apart:https://www.amazon.ca/product-reviews/B083QNJQK2/ref=acr_dp_hist_1?ie=UTF8&filterByStar=one_star&reviewerType=all_reviews#reviews-filter-barQuoteI wonder what the clearance is.Shouldn't there be heat shrink on those terminals or a plastic separator in between the rest of the casing to insulate it better?

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 20, 2022, 09:27:28 am
content: Quote from: dunkemhigh on August 20, 2022, 12:15:22 amI can only surmise that delivery location also comes into play? (Bear in mind that Amazon.decanship this item to Switzerland right now, so it’s not as though Amazon can’t do it.)

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 20, 2022, 11:54:50 am
content: Quote from: tooki on August 19, 2022, 07:18:56 pmWhy so picky? You'll buy whatever they have from whichever marketplace seller has extruded it into their common stocks and you'll like it. If you don't, you can return it for free and they'll just put it straight into the bin.At least, that's how they think it should work..

author: HobGoblyn
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 20, 2022, 10:45:31 pm
content: Quote from: Stray Electron on August 12, 2022, 12:25:15 amIn the UK Amazon give a 3rd party seller guarantee but reading through it, doesn’t cover you for market place sellerswww.amazon.co.uk/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=GQ37ZCNECJKTFYQV

author: PlainName
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2022, 09:38:29 am
content: Hmm. It says at the end:QuoteDoesn't seem to exclude marketplace items (other than to deal direct with Amazon if it was a Prime delivery).