The State of Affairs Regarding RFID in the Consumer Market - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: xrunner
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 15, 2013, 11:10:50 pm
content: Does anyone keep up with RFID and the state of affairs regarding it's implementation costs as far as the consumer market is concerned? Specifically, how far are we from embedding each low cost consumer product with an RFID chip, i.e. each can of soup, each pair of underwear, and each package of gum and so on. Presumably this would enable near-instant checkout speed, among other efficiencies.I had heard that they wanted to reach a cost of 1 cent/RFID chip before this could happen, but that was some time ago.

author: mikeselectricstuff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 16, 2013, 07:37:36 am
content: Can't see it ever happenning - Barcodes are always going to be cheaper, and "good enough" for the job on low-cost items.RFID is an excellent solution for numerous niche applications, but there isn't sufficient cost/benefit payback to use it on everything,

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 16, 2013, 08:07:30 am
content: I remember that mythical 1 cent per unit hype maybe 15 years ago, and the "instant checkout". I don't think it ever actually eventuated?Also it depends on the form factor of the RFID device and the thing it's on/in. i.e. would it even work stuck on a metal can of soup?

author: ve7xen
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 16, 2013, 08:22:08 am
content: Quote from: mikeselectricstuff on September 16, 2013, 07:37:36 amI think the real advantage is really pre-consumer. Some time consuming inventory and logistics problems can be solved much more quickly if everything is tagged. IIRC WalMart or some other large retailer was going to require all of their suppliers to either tag every product or tag every box of product (not sure which). I don't know if that ever got off the ground, but for a business like that I can see it saving a lot of time.If "instant checkout" comes along with it, that'd be nice, but I doubt it'd be the driver for the additional upfront cost.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 16, 2013, 11:07:20 am
content: Quote from: mojo-chan on September 16, 2013, 10:55:07 amIt's a New World Order & gumm'nint conspricy to track everyone I tells ya!

author: xrunner
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 16, 2013, 12:42:18 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on September 16, 2013, 08:07:30 amWould it work if on a metal can? I don't know.Assuming the RFID device was embedded in the paper label, and basically floating above a piece of metal (the can), would it receive enough energy to power up and transmit? That's a good question. I would envision the cart being radiated with RF from at least both sides as you entered the checkout lane (maybe from above and below too). That and the fact that the RF would bounce off all the other metal and all that lot, I could imagine it would work, but it would definitely have to be tested. I'm sure they don't want to give away free cans of spinach due to a flawed RFID design.But maybe the industry just does away with metal cans altogether? Lots of food that can spoil is marketed in plastic containers, and not only that but very heavy items like gallon sizes of milk. I don't see why soup and the like can't also be put in plastic cans.

author: digsys
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 16, 2013, 12:53:17 pm
content: I do a lot of work with RFID. Companies like Fieg etc have made some awesome advancements in Tags and Readers.I have Tag samples costing a few cents to many $s. Some that work only on metal or glass or ALL types of surfaces.I have readers that read to 1M, 3-5M, 10-20M and 40M !! Some at up to 100s Tags a second. They have come a longway since my first systems 20+ yrs ago. But, for all that, they still have one enduring weakness, very easy to shield.SO, If your application is "looking for stolen items", thieves already know how to get around it.Otherwise, it's definitely a technology that has it's niche. In one application, 4 Readers are set up on 4 corners of alarge plant entrance. As forklifts drive in out out with pallets of goods, ALL items are read instantly, with no speedreduction required. I've tested similar applications, can't do that with barcodes :-)Edit: One tag type I've been using is designed to work - stuck on the inside of a metallised windscreen. It uses thewindscreen itself as the "tuned antennae". Many tags now are designed for direct metal placement, and these areVERY thin paper tags !!

author: xrunner
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 16, 2013, 12:58:56 pm
content: Quote from: digsys on September 16, 2013, 12:53:17 pmHow does the system know all the items have been read? Is it because it knows that 144 items are expected to be on the pallet. Does it know that each pallet has X number of things, but it doesn't know what kind of things until the reading?

author: digsys
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 16, 2013, 01:16:08 pm
content: Quote from: xrunnerIt's a "typical" warehouse / distribution centre. Pallets are loaded and await trucks for distribution. Pallets are "itemised" as theyare loaded, and x-checked as they get loaded on to the trucks. Any "missing" items / wrong pallet are picked up.There will ALWAYS be margin for error, but it must be pretty reliable, as no-ones complained yet. Not to say that there are NO errors,but I have NO reliable numbers. The system is used in many places, so I assume it's been set up right.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 16, 2013, 11:21:56 pm
content: A relative of mine works in a large warehouse. Over there they simply weigh every box going out. Because they know the weight of every item and the box they can quickly determine if the order is correct / complete.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 17, 2013, 04:54:52 pm
content: Theft is a problem but then again I ask why would someone risk his/her job by stealing a couple of batteries or some USB sticksHow stupid can someone be?