New Zhiyuan ZDS2022 scope released - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: Hydrawerk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 17, 2015, 05:21:14 pm
content: http://www.ittsb.eu/forum/index.php?topic=783.0http://www.zlg.cn/upload/OSC/pdf/oscilloscope_en.pdfhttp://www.soku.com/search_video/q_ZDS2022_orderby_1The front panel is inspired by Rigol DS2000 and Agilent (=Keysight) DSOX2000. I like it.This ZDS2022 scope might be available only in China.How do they achive the 6 seconds boot up time?

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 17, 2015, 06:37:14 pm
content: Seems to be expensive at $1600 for what it is.

author: Hydrawerk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 17, 2015, 08:52:32 pm
content: The back is inspired by Rigol DS4000. I wonder if they really have only a 30 Watt power supply.

author: Guni
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 17, 2015, 09:53:45 pm
content: Funny.Rigol box+ Agilent panel inspired. Picture is not a real just a render. Scale of BNC connectors looks wrong - too small.

author: FrankenPC
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 18, 2015, 03:07:59 am
content: Ughh. The firmware is so damn buggy on these types of scopes. It's almost unbearable to use. If they guaranteed that they had an internal continuous dev model on the firmware, I might go for it. But my experience is these devices are cranked out and basically forgotten.I'll tell you what...the first company to put out OK hardware with open sourced firmware...I'd go hog wild with that. I'd pay extra for that.

author: free_electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2015, 05:00:46 pm
content: eagle vie ?

author: rdl
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2015, 06:11:20 pm
content: It's probably eagle view, the stylized electric bolt forms the W.

author: JohnnyBerg
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2015, 06:15:14 pm
content: Quote from: ataradov on March 17, 2015, 06:37:14 pmIf it;s only for the Chinese market, it's gonna be a runner

author: rdl
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2015, 06:20:55 pm
content: It's certainly a much better looking front panel than the crap Rigol has been spewing onto their latest scopes.

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2015, 06:22:52 pm
content: Remember that you are looking at computer rendering. Look at actual pictures in the first link and you will see that they are not much better than Rigol.

author: dadler
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 18, 2015, 06:45:40 pm
content: Quote from: ataradov on March 18, 2015, 06:22:52 pmI don't think this:Looks better than:In fact, I think it looks much worse?

author: Hydrawerk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 19, 2015, 10:10:01 pm
content: Yes, the ZDS2022's rotary knobs seem to be too small.

author: Hydrawerk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 27, 2016, 09:20:35 pm
content: Any news?

author: coppice
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2016, 04:35:35 am
content: Quote from: Hydrawerk on April 27, 2016, 09:20:35 pmThey are available for sale, but the aren't cheaphttps://world.tmall.com/item/43297144205.htm?spm=a312a.7728556.0.0.i9tjlJ&id=43297144205&skuId=80988978306

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2016, 11:44:17 am
content: Quote from: ataradov on March 17, 2015, 06:37:14 pmIf it does what it promises and has no severe bugs then the price certainly seems like a good deal to me. It's a pity products like these don't find their way outside Asia because I'd like to see a review of it.

author: robert_
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2016, 12:04:15 pm
content: Quote from: Hydrawerk on March 17, 2015, 05:21:14 pmNot too hard. Good enough CPU, very basic embedded OS, not doing extensive self-cal every boot time (but store the constants), offloading FPGA configuration to a dedicated device instead of loading from the main CPU or using nonvolatile FPGA.The older iwatsu scopes (Lecroy Wavejet) took around 3 seconds from pressing the button to first trigger.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2016, 02:09:30 pm
content: Quote from: robert_ on April 28, 2016, 12:04:15 pmBoot time is largely affected by how fast the boot medium is. Plain Linux can start within a few seconds from a Sata SSD.

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 28, 2016, 07:33:14 pm
content: They also have a 4-channel model in that series.Here is a nice render scenehttp://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMTU0MTc2ODkyNA==.html?from=s1.8-1-1.2

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 04, 2016, 08:30:18 pm
content: The number of FFT points seems very high!How come that a company coming from nowhere can reach such a good FFT implementation,while Rigol, Siglent, GW-Instek with years of experience do not even come close in the number of FFT points?Where is the catch? =)

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 04, 2016, 08:32:57 pm
content: Quote from: pascal_sweden on May 04, 2016, 08:30:18 pmThey may have more computing power on board. The scope is 2-4 times more expensive than Rigol and Siglent counterparts. Hopefully some of that went into the hardware, not just the profit margin.

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 04, 2016, 08:49:10 pm
content: How can we get this scope in the hands of Dave Jones for an in-depth review?

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2016, 12:17:40 am
content: Quote from: pascal_sweden on May 04, 2016, 08:30:18 pmGW Instek has 1Mpts FFT which is already a lot (certainly compared to 1k for Siglent and -since recent- 16k for Rigol) but the 4MPts the ZDS2000 offers is more ofcourse. My guess is the ZDS2000 is also based on the Xilinx Zync (multi core ARM + FPGA) platform.

author: coppice
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2016, 03:43:31 pm
content: Quote from: pascal_sweden on May 04, 2016, 08:30:18 pmZLG has been around longer than Rigol or Siglent.

author: pxl
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2016, 04:15:57 pm
content: Nice:http://www.zlg.cn/upload/OSC/pdf/oscilloscope_en.pdfThe only problem with that, you cannot buy this from any reputable distributor outside of China.

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2016, 10:57:25 pm
content: Here are some documents which you can download from their website:http://www.zlg.cn/OSC/ZDS2022_download.phpYou can expand a folder with more documents, by selecting the blue chinese button on the bottom.

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2016, 11:04:24 pm
content: I don't get it. Why do people even consider this thing when all documentation is in Chinese, but the prices are comparable to properly documented and warranted scopes?What's so special about them? The company obviously does not want to sell to western markets, otherwise they would have bothered to have a site in English.

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2016, 11:10:32 pm
content: This company seems to make a lot of other test and measurement stuffhttps://zlgwj.world.tmall.com/Yes, maybe only for the Chinese market, but still it is exciting to hear more about them,and find out what they have.Oscilloscopes:http://www.zlg.cn/OSC/https://zlgwj.world.tmall.com/category-1027829331.htm?spm=a312a.7700824.w9379600-9881157136.5.0bh3JG&search=y&parentCatId=1027756370&parentCatName=%B5%E7%D7%D3%B2%E2%C1%BF%D2%C7%C6%F7&catName=%CA%BE%B2%A8%C6%F7https://world.tmall.com/item/43297144205.htm?spm=a312a.7700824.w9379684-9999358152.118.dbYo35&id=43297144205&scene=taobao_shopMultimeters:http://www.zlg.cn/multimeter/https://zlgwj.world.tmall.com/category-1027830493.htm?spm=a312a.7700824.w9379600-9881157136.7.0bh3JG&search=y&parentCatId=1027756370&parentCatName=%B5%E7%D7%D3%B2%E2%C1%BF%D2%C7%C6%F7&catName=%C1%F9%CE%BB%B0%EB%CD%F2%D3%C3%B1%EDhttps://world.tmall.com/item/43226795202.htm?spm=a312a.7700824.w9379684-10003325403.112.dbYo35&id=43226795202&scene=taobao_shopLogic Analyzers:http://www.zlg.cn/LA/https://zlgwj.world.tmall.com/category-1027830492.htm?spm=a312a.7700824.w9379600-9881157136.6.0bh3JG&search=y&parentCatId=1027756370&parentCatName=%B5%E7%D7%D3%B2%E2%C1%BF%D2%C7%C6%F7&catName=%C2%DF%BC%AD%B7%D6%CE%F6%D2%C7https://world.tmall.com/item/43247386200.htm?spm=a312a.7700824.w9379684-10007956065.118.dbYo35&id=43247386200&scene=taobao_shopMultiple Instrument:http://www.zlg.cn/MI/https://world.tmall.com/item/43247842227.htm?spm=a312a.7700824.w9379684-10007634161.115.dbYo35&id=43247842227&scene=taobao_shop&skuId=75229498163Isolated probes:https://world.tmall.com/item/523926332487.htm?spm=a312a.7700824.w4011-9881157174.27.b6tD0g&id=523926332487&rn=96c7365acdf1e462dffcdc6b957e69e9&abbucket=1Power meters:http://www.zlg.cn/PM/https://zlgwj.world.tmall.com/category-1027830491.htm?spm=a312a.7700824.w9379600-9881157136.8.0bh3JG&search=y&parentCatId=1027756370&parentCatName=%B5%E7%D7%D3%B2%E2%C1%BF%D2%C7%C6%F7&catName=%B9%A6%C2%CA%BC%C6

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2016, 11:12:28 pm
content: Yes, they seem to have a site full of test gear. Or maybe they are into 3D-modleing test gear? No way to know really, unless you read Chinese

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2016, 11:43:57 pm
content: FFT implementation===============Here are some videos about their FFT implementation with 4M points:Video 1:http://www.zlg.cn/pdf.php?file=http://www.zlg.cn/down.php?id=278Video 2:http://www.zlg.cn/pdf.php?file=http://www.zlg.cn/down.php?id=438Serial protocol decoding==================Here is a video about serial protocol decoding:Video 3:http://www.zlg.cn/pdf.php?file=http://www.zlg.cn/down.php?id=443Other cool videos=============Many other cool videos can be found in the earlier provided link under the Chinese blue button:http://www.zlg.cn/OSC/ZDS2022_download.phpEnjoy!

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2016, 11:49:10 pm
content: Those "videos" are big ZIP archives of something. The download speed is abysmal, so I have no idea what's in the archives. Do they not know about YouTube, Vimeo and other video services? I assume some of them are banned in China, but surely there is a way to get around that. Or there must be Chinese video streaming service.pascal_sweden, do you know Chinese, or just click random links until you get something interesting?

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 06, 2016, 12:02:33 am
content: I don't know Chinese, but for the videos you can recognize English keywords in the description.(E.g. UART, FFT, CAN, etc.)The videos are in FLV format, and they play very nice with VideoLAN.Really cool videos. Believe me! It's definitely worth the download.Although they speak Chinese in the videos, they have very good details on the look&feel of the scope.And I must say that the scope looks very responsive!

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 06, 2016, 06:00:45 am
content: Quote from: ataradov on May 05, 2016, 11:49:10 pmHe's our forum ferret, he hunts out all sorts of neat info to share with us.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 06, 2016, 06:32:40 am
content: Quote from: ataradov on May 05, 2016, 11:04:24 pmWell finding a relatively cheap oscilloscope which works and has meaningfull features is much harder so even from that perspective it is worthwhile to investigate how well (or not) ZLG's scopes work.

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 06, 2016, 10:56:49 am
content: I watched a few of their videos, and I believe that the protocol decoding is done in hardware,as it is blazing fast!This is really a strong contender250Mpts memory, >330.000 waveforms/sec, FFT with 4M points, protocol decoding in hardwareIt has support for many protocols, including RC5 and RC6 infrared protocols.So, you no longer need to use your sound card for capturing and interpreting this stuffTheir 6 1/2 multimeter for 800 EUR is pretty neat too!

author: Carrington
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 06, 2016, 03:07:15 pm
content: I like what I see, these instruments looks very good.And by the way, amazing PC software.Oscilloscope:http://www.zlg.cn/OSC/ZDS2022_firmware.phphttp://www.zlg.cn/down.php?id=840Logic Analyzer:http://www.zlg.cn/LA/index.htmlhttp://www.zlg.cn/down.php?id=739

author: Carrington
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 06, 2016, 04:39:38 pm
content: I had seen these logic analyzers before, I was sure, here they are:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/what-logic-analyzer-would-you-recommend-(for-a-sane-price)/msg254784/#msg254784

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2016, 11:14:47 pm
content: I found the following company information about ZLG, that I thought is good to share here:http://toshiba.semicon-storage.com/us/product/microcomputer/designsupport/partner-list/partner-26.htmlhttp://www.nxp.com/webapp/connect/displayPartnerProfile.sp?partnerId=1-BRTJ-16&tid=vanZLGThis confirms that ZLG is a professional company with a good reputation, and not just some new Chinese kid on the block

author: Hydrawerk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2016, 11:17:17 pm
content: Why the hell do they copy that Rigol design whenQuote??

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2016, 11:21:19 pm
content: Quote from: Hydrawerk on May 09, 2016, 11:17:17 pmI don't see a copy. It looks like any other scope (with exception for LeCroy). If anything, it looks worse than Rigol, but it is mostly a matter of personal preference.I'd like to see some independent reviews. Do they even sell them for real?

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2016, 11:27:07 pm
content: Also, getting on that list of "partners" is very easy in many cases. I would not consider it a proof of anything. Company has been around for 15 years, but not a single product of that company ever got into hands of people willing to write a review? I smell BS.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2016, 11:51:25 pm
content: Quote from: ataradov on May 09, 2016, 11:27:07 pmTry and find a review of a recent Lecroy scope!edit: BTW these scopes are rather expensive. $2250 for the 2 channel model with 56Mpts of memory to $4500 for the 4 channel model with a whopping 250Mpts of memory (all 200MHz bandwidth). This isn't exactly hobbyist territory.http://www.beststore-online.com/item?id=42027292068#81254081006

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2016, 11:58:12 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on May 09, 2016, 11:51:25 pmI'm not asking for recent. I'm not even asking for a scope. Any product released by this company in the recent 5 years will do.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2016, 12:00:16 am
content: Quote from: ataradov on May 09, 2016, 11:58:12 pmThere is lots of gear out there from reputable manufacturers for which you won't find a review.

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2016, 12:02:34 am
content: Quote from: nctnico on May 09, 2016, 11:51:25 pmCheck your link!Responses: 11394Positive: 99.36%There you have your reviews!BTW: On Taobao.com these scopes range from ¥ 10.000 up to 20.000 = 1350 EUR up to 2700 EURhttps://world.tmall.com/item/43297144205.htm?spm=a312a.7700824.w4011-9881157174.33.9oLMRn&id=43297144205&rn=50010330b590a3d6cecd3f9b976f2238

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2016, 12:03:34 am
content: Quote from: nctnico on May 10, 2016, 12:00:16 amThere are also lots of crappy manufacturers. The thing is, we don't know. And they did absolutely nothing on western market. They may not be interested, but then why pursue them? Why do you want to even learn about the scope you can't buy?

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2016, 12:08:22 am
content: Quote from: ataradov on May 10, 2016, 12:03:34 amYou didn't see the link to the webshop I posted above? You can buy it for sure! What would worry me more is being able to return it if it turns out to be a buggy lemon.

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2016, 12:10:25 am
content: I will contact ZLG tomorrow and ask them if they look for a distributor in Scandinavia and BeneluxWill keep you posted on my conversation! Stay tuned =)

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2016, 12:14:12 am
content: You can buy one, of course. Are you even sure it has English UI? All documentation and software is in Chinese.

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2016, 12:19:08 am
content: Distributors don't buy stuff, but get free samples

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2016, 12:35:27 am
content: Quote from: pascal_sweden on May 10, 2016, 12:19:08 amThat was addressed tonctnico, but I did that post from the phone with limited quoting ability.Good luck getting a sample. Actually, good luck getting any reply to your request at all

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2016, 12:41:40 am
content: I will keep you posted!For me this stuff is just too weird, not to further investigate

author: Hydrawerk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 06, 2016, 08:16:13 pm
content: There were some new models released, like ZDS4000 series.http://www.zlg.com/Osc/Osc/index.htmlThey have that Tektronix-like waveform inspector.http://www.zlg.cn/osc/osc/product/id/135.html

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 06, 2016, 08:18:45 pm
content: I emailed them back in May but never received an answer from them!Regarding the new ZDS4000 series:Bandwidth: 500M, 350M, 200MSampling rate: 4G Sa/sMemory depth: 512MptsWaveform capture rate: 1Mwfms/sThat's a whopping memory and waveform capture rate!Note that they talk about waveform capture rate, which is not the same as waveform update rate!

author: Hydrawerk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 06, 2016, 08:21:49 pm
content: I think these scopes are not distributed outside China.

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 06, 2016, 08:30:35 pm
content: They are not cheap either!

author: crazyguy
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 06, 2016, 11:36:46 pm
content: Quote from: pascal_sweden on August 06, 2016, 08:18:45 pmno, according to the website data, the figure > 1Mwfrms/s is waveform update rateupdate :on their English website : they use the term "waveform capture rate"http://www.zlg.com/osc/osc/index.htmlon their Chinese website : the term used is "waveform update rate"http://www.zlg.cn/osc/osc/product/id/126.html

author: Muxr
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 06, 2016, 11:59:22 pm
content: Those original pictures don't look like renderings.. photoshopped maybe with good lighting but they are real.. The display is probably just a screenshot photoshopped on.If they can provide better software than Rigols and Siglents than there might be room for them in the market perhaps.

author: zapta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2016, 12:42:14 am
content: Quote from: dadler on March 18, 2015, 06:45:40 pmThe design of the Rigol's panel was inspired by these road markings:

author: jjoonathan
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2016, 12:51:37 am
content: Sure, but the DS1054Z is a tiny little thing. The lines are much straighter on my Rigol DS4014, which I suspect is more in line with the size of these scopes.What's the difference between waveform capture and update rate?

author: Muxr
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2016, 01:14:47 am
content: Quote from: jjoonathan on August 07, 2016, 12:51:37 amWaveform capture sounds like the sampling rate, but they mean the update rate on the screen. 1Mwfms/s seems like quite a lot.. kind of doubt it to be honest.

author: jjoonathan
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2016, 01:23:21 am
content: Quote from: Muxr on August 07, 2016, 01:14:47 amYeah, even ultra-fast TN gaming monitors switch 1000x slower, and they're designed to push generously past the limits of perception. I think we can safely assume it's a capture rate.

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2016, 09:35:12 am
content: The Siglent SDS2000X has some special mode to achieve higher amount of waveforms per second, but as Dave tested in his video, it turns out to be a waveform capture rate instead of a waveform update rate, as you can only see it after the capture has been made in memory, and you can not see it live.

author: TheAmmoniacal
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 07, 2016, 10:56:32 am
content: Quote from: pascal_sweden on May 10, 2016, 12:10:25 amIf you become a distributor, give me a job! I can do email support, haha.ZLG's gear looks nice.

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2016, 11:01:09 am
content: Quote from: jjoonathan on August 07, 2016, 01:23:21 amThe reality is that no scope with a LCD screen as display can achieve a true display rate of anything close than 1M wfms/s, or even 10k wfms/s, not even a Keysight DSOX3000. It's simply impossible when the physical screen refresh is some fixed at 60Hz or so. What the scopes can do is to collect display data between refreshes in a buffer and then update the screen at the next refresh cycle. Which is close enough.The waveform update rate, for which the better term would betrigger rate, simply describes how many time per second a scope can update the waveform data in its memory. On an analog scope where the CRT phosphor acts as both, waveform memory and display memory, the display rate obviously follows the trigger rate, which could reach in excess of 600k triggers/s. Which means the trigger rate is limited by timebase (the time it takes for the beam to sweep from left to right), the trigger re-arm time, and the time for the electron beam to fly back to its initial position.On a DSO, the trigger rate is limited by memory length (larger memory leads to longer time to complete an acquisition cycle), trigger re-arm time, and backend processing (how fast can the captured data be processed and fed to display memory) but not the display refresh rate (which, again, will stay at 60Hz or whatever it is). With modern real-time DSOs with fast ADCs which cretae large amounts of data, the limiting factor in regard to the trigger rate is the backend processing. Some digital scopes (i.e. Tektronix) have special modes where some or all analysis/measurement functionality is disabled to provide more ressources for waveform processing, leading to higher trigger rates. Keysight deals with it through its own proprietory waveform processor (MegaZoom), LeCroy through its high bandwidth architecture (X-Stream).In regards to these Zhiyuan scopes, I pretty much doubt that they can reach anything close to 1M wfms/s, not as display updat rate nor as trigger rate.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2016, 11:15:26 am
content: Quote from: pascal_sweden on August 07, 2016, 09:35:12 amThat is called segmented recording. Most DSOs have that ability.

author: jashugan
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 11, 2016, 12:34:35 pm
content: I saw those oscilloscope in Electronica, Munich, in these days, and I have to say I have been surprised how responsive and good are.I mailed them, but the prices the technician told me were not low at all (surprised in negative way, unfortunately): ZDS2000 4 channel plus at maximum is 3000$, while ZDS4000 4 channel at maximum is about 10k $.I saw the lowest ZDS2000 range is about 1k$, which is good, compared the performance of the scope.Anyway, I asked some documentation. I'll keep you updated!

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2017, 04:00:44 pm
content: Do they already have a distributor in Europe?I mailed them back in May 2016, but never got a response from them.Below is my email for reference:Dear Sir/Miss,I wanted to reach out to you, to hear if your company already has a distributor in Scandinaviaand Benelux for your Zhiyuan Test&Measurement product line, such as digital oscilloscope,digital multi-meter, logic analyzer, mutiple instrument, isolated probe?I am very impressed by the features of your digital oscilloscope:http://www.zlg.cn/OscThe same counts for your other products:http://www.zlg.cn/Multimeterhttp://www.zlg.cn/Lahttp://www.zlg.cn/MiDo you have support for the English language in your UI?Are your products certified for the European market?CE mark, EMC tests, other certifications, etc.?Do you already have a distributor in Europe and/or the US?Maybe we can talk about the distributor partnership in more details on a Skype session?Below are some more questions that we could discuss over Skype.Best regards,Pascal==========================================Additional questions about Zhiyuan T&M products==========================================Target users===========What target users do you foresee for your scopes?Are we talking here students, hobbyists, small business users, professional companies?How do you position your oscilloscope compared to other A-brands or other Chinese brands?Isolated front-end================Does the scope have an isolated front-end?Can it be used to measure floating measurements?How about the ground of the BNCs for both channels? Are they separate or common?Input protection==============Do you have input protection for the analog front-end?What about input protection for the digital inputs of the logic analyzer?Can you provide more details about the input protection in your product?Background noise level====================Can you provide details about the background noise level of your oscilloscope?How do you compare, compared to the overview of noise levels that I provided in attachment.See attachment for a comparison between Siglent, GW-Instek, Rigol and Keysight.Protocol decoder===============Which protocols do you support?Do you plan to add more protocols in the future?Have you implemented the protocol decoder in hardware or do you do the decodingin software?Do you have examples on performance measurements when decoding a protocol?Do you plan support for the Sigrok framework?https://sigrok.org/Waveform update rate===================What is the waveform update rate in your product?Most of the cheap Chinese oscilloscopes these days have waveform update ratesthat are bigger than 30.000 waveforms/sec.How do you compare?Intensity grading waveform display=============================Do you support an intensity grading waveform display?How many color levels do you support?Here is an example of intensity grading on a cheap Rigol oscilloscope and Siglent oscilloscope:http://images.batronix.com/products/oscilloscopes/Rigol/DS1000Z/intensity-grading.jpghttps://mediacdn.eu/m/media/catalog/product/s/d/sds2004x-2_1.jpgFFT in software=============Do you support FFT in the software?How many points do you use for the FFT? Are we talking Kpoints or Mpoints here?Sampling memory===============How big is the sampling memory in your product?The entry level scope from Rigol has a 24MPts sample memory (12MPts enabled standard).How do you compare?External trigger input and Pass-Fail output===================================Does your product have an external trigger input?Does your product have an external Pass-Fail output?Chinese oscilloscope manufacturers==============================Is your company familiar with brands such as Rigol, Siglent, GW-Instek?Rigol DS1054Z:http://www.rigol.eu/products/digital-oscilloscopes/ds1000Z/ds1054z/Siglent SDS1104X:http://www.siglent.com/ENs/pdxx.aspx?id=1133&T=2&tid=1GW-Instek GDS-1000B:http://www.gwinstek.com/en-US/products/Oscilloscopes/Digital_Storage_Oscilloscopes/GDS-1000BDo you see them as competitors, or is your product for a different target market?Optimal hardware architecture for a digital oscilloscope==============================================Are you following the latest trends of the oscilloscope market?Are you also using the Xilinx Zynq-7000 architecture in your products?The company GW-Instek is using this:http://www.xilinx.com/publications/prod_mktg/zynq7000/goodwill-casestudy.pdf

author: ebastler
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2017, 04:09:07 pm
content: Quote from: pascal_sweden on April 02, 2017, 04:00:44 pmI am sure they were delighted to be swamped with more than two dozen questions on first contact!Maybe a different approach next time would increase the chance of actually receving a reply?

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2017, 04:16:23 pm
content: I provided them my question list upfront, to convince them that I am a professional player and not a new kid on the block

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2017, 04:31:38 pm
content: They talked about this scope on the Owon forum:http://owon.freeforums.org/new-advanced-zlg-oscilloscopes-t49.htmlThe support level seems quite impressive. See picture below.

author: ebastler
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2017, 04:37:18 pm
content: Quote from: pascal_sweden on April 02, 2017, 04:16:23 pmOr it might have convinced them that you are an amateur with way too much time on your hands...(Which, given this dialog, both of us might be?)

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2017, 04:44:15 pm
content: Quote from: ebastler on April 02, 2017, 04:37:18 pmDoes it really matter? I'm a person with money. They either want to sell or not. In this case seems to be the later. That's fine their scopes are expensive, and there is a new wave of equipment in the same price range from real manufacturers.

author: coppice
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2017, 04:44:35 pm
content: Quote from: ebastler on April 02, 2017, 04:37:18 pmHe asked questions that sound like insults, and asked if how they would compare their scopes to ones with lower specs. What sort of response was he expecting?

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2017, 04:46:33 pm
content: Quote from: coppice on April 02, 2017, 04:44:35 pmIn western "culture" it is a proper question. It is salesman's job to convince me that I should buy his product and not competitor's. And in western companies sales people have "fighing guides" prepared by marketing comparing everything to everything. If you are better than competition, then you should be able to prove it, otherwise, bye bye.

author: coppice
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2017, 04:50:30 pm
content: Quote from: ataradov on April 02, 2017, 04:44:15 pmWhat constitutes a real manufacturer? ZLG has been a good source of tools since before, say, Siglent started. I don't think they've ever tried to export, though.

author: coppice
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2017, 04:53:24 pm
content: Quote from: ataradov on April 02, 2017, 04:46:33 pmI can assure you that its far far easier to piss off a western salesman than one in China.Do you really think that asking a Chinese test equipment maker if they are aware of people like Siglent and Rigol is a way to start a conversation?

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2017, 04:53:39 pm
content: Quote from: coppice on April 02, 2017, 04:50:30 pmAnd that's the problem here. I don't have any trust in the brand or their hardware, I don't know how it holds against competition. Not because it is bad, but because I simply don't have any information.I also don't understand why people here want this thing so much. Go look at a new R&S, at least you don't need to pull information from the sales people there.

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2017, 04:56:42 pm
content: Quote from: coppice on April 02, 2017, 04:53:24 pmNever worked with Chinese salesmen or buyers, really.Quote from: coppice on April 02, 2017, 04:53:24 pmBut I do work with American buyers, and they often start the conversation with "Manufacturer XXX has this feature set at this price, what do you have to offer?"In general, I would leave them alone, if they don't want to sell scopes outside of China. It is not like there is something unique about them.

author: BravoV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2017, 05:17:54 pm
content: Quote from: pascal_sweden on April 02, 2017, 04:16:23 pmReally ? Just curious what kind of professional that ishauntingbuggingkeep asking at the forum on buying a new scope "for years" ? Just look at your own created thread for the past two years.Btw what brand/model of scope do you own / use now ? If any ...

author: all_repair
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2017, 05:18:55 pm
content: You are no wrong. Most China sellers still do not know how to sell to the West. They sell on their advantages, hardware with minimum English manual and English-speaking/writing support. They do not think the price with these additional are what the market want to pay. They are also the one taking the risk in not able to take back their investment if they judge the market wrong.I prefer their current practices.

author: ebastler
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2017, 05:24:43 pm
content: Quote from: ataradov on April 02, 2017, 04:44:15 pmYou missed the point here. Pascal_sweden was asking to be theirdistributor. By way of introduction, he asked them two dozen questions which (a) imply that he thinks they might be clueless, and (b) give a clear sinal that he would be a huge time sink for them.I have never seen any business inquiry like that, and I think I know the reason why...

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2017, 05:28:10 pm
content: Quote from: ebastler on April 02, 2017, 05:24:43 pmYeah, that changes things. In that case asking if they are interested at all would be niceBut on the other hand, all his questions were basically asking for that "fighting guide" to help him better sell those scopes. So it is still a very valid list questions, you just don't ask for it right away.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2017, 06:02:45 pm
content: Quote from: ataradov on April 02, 2017, 04:56:42 pmJudging from the specs they do have some interesting features compared to what is out there on the Western market. They also have the texts on the screen and buttons in English so ZLG doesn't target their instruments at just China. Maybe the Chinese government simply doesn't allow them to export?

author: coppice
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2017, 06:12:46 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on April 02, 2017, 06:02:45 pmHaving English on panel labels says nothing about where they aim to market. Chinese designed cars made only for the Chinese market have English all over the dashboard - and that's in a world where most cars only use symbols on the dashboard, so they can sell internationally.Export is an issue. A Chinese company needs to obtain a licence to export, and the licence constrains how and what they can export. Obtaining one can require a considerable investment in effort. You have to be export focussed to start exporting.

author: AR
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 07, 2017, 10:24:12 am
content: I made a few enquiries about these oscilloscopes the on screen menus are designed to be switchable to English language menus , on all the scopes. They plan to do international shows to show their products, so they are interested in the export market outside of China.For those interested I have some pricing on their best selling 4 channel models PM me if you want some Idea of what they cost.

author: silds
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: May 19, 2017, 09:55:56 am
content: Hello,From ZDS4054 PlusMaximum real-time sampling rate 4GSa/s, use every two channels interleaved. What is the characteristic for 1 channel? 1GSa/s or 4GSa/s.Thank you. Sorry for my english.

author: janekivi
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 21, 2017, 07:35:57 am
content: Quote from: AR on April 07, 2017, 10:24:12 amLooking into firmware files withHackerNotepad- they have boot_ui2_chand boot_ui2_enthere.

author: Ink
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: May 21, 2017, 08:54:27 am
content: Quote from: silds on May 19, 2017, 09:55:56 am4GSa/s,and 2GSa/s for 2 channels.