Beginner scope: MSO5000, SDS1104X-E, GDS-1054B/GDS-2000E - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: Antonio90
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 06, 2020, 06:34:37 pm
content: Hello everyone. I'm a beginner hobbyist setting up an electronics lab, and yeah, I'm also looking for advice on what scope to buy, and I've been reading quite a few posts about the most popular oscilloscopes, including reviews, opinions and "feature unlocking" threads.I already have the parts for my first project (a linear power supply with 0-30v and 5 or 10 amps max.), a few more basic components and arduinos, soldering equipment, a few leads and connectors, two DMMs, some breadboards and a boatload of wall warts and laptop power supplies. I also have one of those little 15€ scopes which claim 200Khz bandwidth but are more like 50KHz.I'm really a beginner: don't know much more than ohm's law and Thevenin and Norton's theorems, and I have a basic intuitive grasp of what most electronic components do. In the theory department of the hobby, I'm refreshing calculus, following The Art of Electronics, and periodically looking for help and exercises in books like Practical Electronics for Inventors and a few others.As for what is the inteded use for the scope, well, I'm mostly interested in learning about power supplies, and my plan is to try and upgrade my power supply project to have at least two independent channels and tracking switching inputs before the linear regulators. It would also be nice to add some digital controls with programmability and data-logging, but I might be way over my head. I'm not in a hurry in any way though.After that project, or maybe starting inbetween, I would like to build an audio amplifier with an integrated DAC. Most likely it wont be very good, but I want to learn about amplifiers. That's all I have planned right now, I guess there will be more projects coming along as I continue learning.So, provided I have never used a scope (bar some analog ones at the university 10 years ago) and I'm not really fully aware of it's capabilities, I probably cannot be specific enough, but well, I want a tool that helps me "see" how the different components work in test circuits for learning and I want to use it to learn about power supplies and audio amplifiers, and to try and design my own (with a lot of external help).That being said, I have around 1000€ left for test equipment and I guess I would need both a scope and an AWG. I was pondering the following options:- Rigol MSO5074. Seems like a lot of bang for the buck, has a built-in AWG and it's hackable. ~1070€ total.- Siglent SDS1104X-E and an external AWG. 850-1000€ total, depending on the AWG I choose.- Rigol 1054Z + external AWG. 110-120€ cheaper than the siglent, but a bit too old and most people around here recommend the siglent when in doubt between the two.- GW INSTEK GDS-1054B or 2000E + AWG. 850-1000+€. I like the Insteks with the dedicated controls for each channel, and I've seen them used in some youtube channels and the user interface seems pretty good. The problem is that the prices ramp up pretty fast from the basic model and MDO series is out of my price range, also, I don't know if things like the FRA (which I think would be useful for the amplifier project) will work with an external AWG with a hacked GDS 1000 or 2000. Also the 1054B is a bit too pricey in Europe; in Tequipment is around 280 vs 410 in EU.- A MICSIG with an external AWG (the one with knobs and buttons). It looks nice and has features like video recording and a pretty intuitive interface, but I don't need portability and I don't know what tradeoffs it's form factor has.I guess that's It. Any opinion is appreciated, be it about second hand scopes, different models or no scope at all. Also I have not yet researched much about AWG, but I guess that if I choose the siglent, it should also be siglent to easily use the bode plots.Thank you in advance.Antonio.

author: jemangedeslolos
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 06, 2020, 06:44:33 pm
content: Hummmm you could also consider the Analog Discovery 2 wich has only 30MHz bandwith but 14bit resolution. Very usefull for audio and power supply. Comes with logic analyser, AWG, pattern generator and very limited symetric power supply but has its use

author: Antonio90
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 06, 2020, 06:52:21 pm
content: I'll have a closer look at the AD2. Tried to get the edu pricing, as I'm finishing a masters degree right now, but it's not EE related at all and they ask for a lot of information (including an instructor e-mail) so no chance. Full price seems a bit expensive per specs, but maybe it's my best bet right now. Will look in the used market.Thanks!

author: Antonio90
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 06, 2020, 11:22:15 pm
content: Well, I have found an used one for 250€. I might try and ask for a lower price, since it's just the AD2 plus a few wires and breadboard pieces, which I don't really need. I'd have to add the BNC board, impedance analyzer and probes which would amount a total of around 315€, quite a bit less than any of the options above, but I don't know if it will be enough. Also the maximum input voltage is quite limited.On the other hand, the "pro bundle would set me back ~440€ with 2 years warranty, but at that price I have a GDS-1054B from tequipment and 40 bucks to spare.I'll let it sleep tonight and try to decide tomorrow. Any input on the options mentioned?

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 06, 2020, 11:44:27 pm
content: Bode plot is likely a handy feature when it comes to developing amplifiers. You can quickly measure the frequency and phase response (even with different loads connected). I don't see needing a seperate AWG as a handicap since the internal AWGs in oscilloscopes are very limited anyway.

author: jemangedeslolos
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 06, 2020, 11:54:28 pm
content: With your student status, even if it's not related to electronic, you could grab the EDU discount.You can download the Waveforms software and see by yourself all possibilities.But you have to realise that even if it's a really good instrument, the scope side is very limited compared to a bench scope.There are only few triggering type, little memory, only 100MS/s, 2 channels etc etcBut it meets your actual requirements so you have to compute the pros and cons and wait for others advices.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 07, 2020, 06:57:09 am
content: Quote from: jemangedeslolos on June 06, 2020, 11:54:28 pmOn the plus side you also get a logic analyzer, 14-bit ADC and some incredibly powerful software.They look expensive for a little plastic box but the secret's in the software. If you can live with 30MHz bandwidth then they're extremely powerful devices.

author: egonotto
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 07, 2020, 08:11:13 am
content: Hello,perhaps a Siglent SDS1104X-E (Batronix € 510.51) and the AD2 (250€) and a wall wart for the AD2.The AD2 is more a little lab as a scope and ideal adapted to work with breadboards.The scope part has differential inputs, but only the input sensitivity 500mV/div and 5V/diff are native. The other input sensitivities are digital zoom.You can than later decide if you need BNC board and impedance analyzer for the AD2.Best regardsegonotto

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 07, 2020, 09:53:10 am
content: Regarding the Analog Discovery 2 and the Digital Discovery 2: They only support 3.3V voltage levels and not 5V voltage levels.In my opinion this is a design mistake!

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 07, 2020, 10:08:10 am
content: Quote from: pascal_sweden on June 07, 2020, 09:53:10 amAll the pins are 5V tolerant.

author: Gandalf_Sr
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 07, 2020, 01:56:49 pm
content: If you want to save money, the Rigol DS1054Z is OK but it is getting old. I recently got a Rigol MSO5074 and, as you say, it's a lot of bang for the buck and close to overkill for what your needs are but gives you a load of room to grow into it, I like the big touch screen on it plus you can use it with a wireless mouse.You can get the MSO5074 without the (outrageously priced) LA Probe set and then build your own seemy thread hereon that.The MSO5074 has an annoyance (for me) that may be solved by firmware upgrades: the HDMI out doesn't always start up properly and needs a power cycle to get it to work.I don't represent Rigol or any other OEM and I am not making money from selling PCBs for the LA probe system, just covering my costs.

author: Antonio90
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 07, 2020, 04:12:07 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on June 07, 2020, 06:57:09 amThank you all very much for the responses.I've been doing some research about the AD2 and now I want one: it seems like a really good learning tool and there's people using it for audio work. It looks like I was falling in the old trap of considering only the physical specs. The Waveforms suite looks great too.I have asked for edu pricing on the spanish distributor page and I'm awaiting the response, guess it'll come in a day or two. With the edu pricing i'm guessing ~200€, which is even better than the second hand offer I found. Is it functional for measuring power supply ripple?Quote from: Gandalf_Sr on June 07, 2020, 01:56:49 pmThe MSO5000 is very tempting, but it would take all my budget. The HDMI issue doesn't bother me much TBH, I have no plans to put an external monitor in the workbench, at least until I get a VESA arm for it.I've also been reading the thread about your LA probe design, and it actually adds to the scope's versatility along with the hackability (unless they somehow fix the firmware patching). It will certainly be my first option if/when I need a LA.Also, regarding the integrated AWG in the Rigol, how does it compare with a basic dedicated one like the Siglent SDG1032X?Quote from: nctnico on June 06, 2020, 11:44:27 pmI don't think it is a handicap but, AFAIK, there are no cheap scopes in my price range that can do FRA (or Bode plots) with an external AWG except the Siglent ones so it's either a Siglent with external AWG or a scope with an integrated AWG I guess.

author: Gandalf_Sr
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 07, 2020, 05:08:27 pm
content: The Rigol MSO5074 can do Bode plots with the latest firmware update, I've attached one below. The built in dual AWG has a (severe IMHO) limitation in that it can only do 5V pk-pk and is limited to + or - 2.5V so you can't even get a 0 - 3.3V square wave out of it. There's a project here somewhere to put a voltage doubler on it. The Rigol DG811 ($262.26 from Tequipment with the eevBlog discount) is very good and I understand it can be 'converted' to a DG992 if you have a 'magic' USB drive; the only thing the DG8xx and DG9xx don't have is LAN.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 07, 2020, 05:23:33 pm
content: Try to measure a crystal.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 07, 2020, 07:05:46 pm
content: Quote from: Antonio90 on June 07, 2020, 04:12:07 pmI'm getting one this month, too.I got the educational prices last month. Don't expect miracles, it's just a small percentage discount.I live in Spain, too, for me it will be cheaper just to buy one from mouser.es and reclaim the VAT then buying one from Digilent with the discount.If you buy from Digilent I think they ship from the USA so you rrisk adding tax and import duties to the price. If that happens it would be more expensive than simply buying one here in Spain!

author: Antonio90
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 07, 2020, 07:26:37 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on June 07, 2020, 07:05:46 pmHm, It seems I was wrong then, for some reason I thougt this would be sent from Spain:https://www.ni.com/es-es/shop/select/analog-discovery-2Which doesn't make sense being National Instrument's page, and also the express shipping is 63€, and that is not the price of an intra european delivery.I guess the second hand option still stands then. Wish I could reclaim the VAT too, suddenly my budget would look 21% higher, but there's no way right now.Quote from: Gandalf_Sr on June 07, 2020, 05:08:27 pmThat looks like a big limitation, as I don't want to spend more than 1k (1100€ at most) and it would leave both the AWG and AD2 out for quite some time. But I don't know, maybe it's not really necessary right now.I'm kind of thinking that the best option might be what egonotto said, the AD2 and an oscilloscope like the siglent or the Instek, which even with customs and delivery is more than a 100 bucks cheaper in tequipment.

author: Antonio90
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 07, 2020, 10:24:04 pm
content: Well, I'm now leaning toward two main options. One being the AD2 second hand + BNC adapter + Instek GDS-1054B (just under 400€ from tequipment) for around 650~680 total, included Vat and shipping. That would leave ~300€ for an AWG if the one integrated with the AD2 is not enough down the line.The other option is a second hand MSO5000 + an "upgraded" DG811 for 1000€ + shipping, which fits into the budget just barely.That's a tough choice TBH.

author: egonotto
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2020, 04:13:49 am
content: Quote from: Gandalf_Sr on June 07, 2020, 05:08:27 pmHallo,do you mean this in 50 Ω or HighZ?Best regardsegonotto

author: ToThePub
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2020, 06:12:26 am
content: A lot of really good info in this thread.My only input is, you want to grow into whatever scope/devices you buy.The greatest waste of money is buying a scope that suites your needs today. As guess what, after you spend some time to grow your knowledge and use cases, the worst thing you want to realize is that you should have purchased the next step up.The Rigol MSO5074 (as you get 4 probes compared to the 5072) is a great buy (in my opinion, as it's hackable to unlock 350Mhz + all options. I have one, so there is my bias. Not the greatest AWG but serviceable. I have the original Rigol LA probes and they work fine, but are $$$. Gandalf_Sr is creating MUCH cheaper ones which helps.)The new Siglent SDS2000X Plus seems nice as well (hackable etc, higher freq & higher AWG compared to the mso5000 if you buy the SDS2354X Plus it seems (? not sure if the front end is the same), but that is way out of your price range.)It doesn't matter what you buy, just decide if you are serious or not and grow into the scope/equipment you buy.If you want to just mess around, and there is nothing wrong with that, just get the cheapest thing you can that suites your needs.The Rigol DS1054Z is an awesome scope for the money (I have one of those as well, somewhere in a cupboard, hackable etc).The GW Instek's.. People complain (so do I) about Rigol firmware and slow updates.. If you get any update to a GW Instek you are doing good.Decide if you are serious or not and listen to the smart people on eevblog. If you are serous though, my only recommendation is to spend the extra now rather than working out pretty quickly you have just wasted XXX dollars and need to buy something else.I know that's not really helpful, especially in the current global situation, but I would rather save up for a few months more to buy the next step up, than rush into it.Enjoy!ToThePub.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2020, 06:39:08 am
content: Quote from: ToThePub on June 08, 2020, 06:12:26 amEverybody who owns one says they don't need updates, they just work.Plus Instek just released a free update to add serial decoders and a spectrum analyzer. I don't think anybody can complain about that.

author: 2N3055
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2020, 07:01:31 am
content: Quote from: Gandalf_Sr on June 07, 2020, 05:08:27 pmThat is actually quite good. WGs on scopes are all limited with output amplitude.MSO5000 has +-5 HiZ and +-2,5V 50 Ohm.Siglent SDS2000X+ has +-3V HiZ or +-1,5V 50 OHmKeysight MSOX3000T has +-2,5V HiZ or +-1,25V 50 OHmR&S RTB2000 has +-5 HiZ and +-2,5V 50 Ohm.R&S RTM3000 is little better that the bunch: +-10 HiZ and +-5V 50 Ohm. But that is still half of what standalone gen will do.So Keysight, where license to unlock cost as much as complete small scope, has worst amplitude..That is why we usually recommend people that it pays to buy external siggen.Built in siggens are great for FRA and small signal ( like testing amplifiers, which is, really, most of the use for many people).Those who use it like I do, as a proper general purpose R&D instrument need to buy proper standalone AWG.

author: Gandalf_Sr
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2020, 10:39:50 am
content: I didn't realize that the built in AWGs, even on the high end, are all so limited in amplitude. My previous comment about not being able to get a 0 - 3.3V logic signal is actually wrong; the +2.5 limit is for a 50input and changes to +5V (which makes a lot more sense) if you're feeding a hi impedance input - all logic inputs I've ever worked with are very hi impedance.I own a Keysight MSOX4054A (which I'm trying to sell on eBay) but, apart from the fact that it's a 500MHz scope, has a slightly larger screen and a few extra serial formats (I was lucky enough to buy it with the full App bundle), it really doesn't do much more than the MSO5074 does (for my needs) and the resolution on the MSO5074 screen is better - the Keysight has the annoying aspect that you can't make all the menus disappear so the actual trace area on the screen is stuck as a window inside the bigger screen.I think ToThePub's advice is spot on though, if you're serious about getting into electronics and can stretch your budget to get the higher end stuff, you can grow into it. The $300 scopes will work for tinkering but have their limitations.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2020, 10:41:18 am
content: Quote from: ToThePub on June 08, 2020, 06:12:26 amIt is:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds2000x-plus-coming/msg3087116/#msg3087116

author: IamSynthetiC
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2020, 11:15:50 am
content: I'll try to chime in too.I am an electronics hobbyist aswell, designing and building things to suit my needs, take care of problems, or just for the hell of it.From my experience, the necessary tools to have on your bench are a good multimeter (or two), and an osciloscope. You can make do without the others.I personally invested very early on then MSO5074, and i too was skeptical at first of its big pricetag and worth.As several other users have previously mentioned, you want to grow into your scope, you do not want itscurrent limitationsto be yourfuture limitations, and a good tool is almost always worth it.It is my opinion, that you go for something like the MSO5074, or the new Siglent one. These scopes are proven and reliable (and hackable), and offer you enough features and specs to grow upon. I peronally dont regret bying the MSO5074 and i am even glad i did.

author: fkfaraz
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2020, 11:38:40 am
content: HiI hope u all will be fine.Please don't mind but why are u people not discussing the micsig o'scope? is it not a good bench scope(the knob version)now i understand that rigol or siglent is popular beginner brand here but micsig is also a good one too.P.s: i am interested in micsig as a begginer so i would like to see some discussion here..thanks and take care.....

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2020, 11:51:52 am
content: Quote from: fkfaraz on June 08, 2020, 11:38:40 amThe MicSig is an excellent o'scope, you can buy one without fear.

author: tv84
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2020, 11:55:11 am
content: Quote from: fkfaraz on June 08, 2020, 11:38:40 amIt's simple: because people who are writing here have mostly Rigol and Siglent.So, about Micsig, if no one has hands on experience you're better off judging for yourself based on the comparisons of the other brands!

author: Antonio90
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2020, 12:47:06 pm
content: Thak you all very much!That's a lot of info right there.I've also read about only buying what you need and not worrying too much about "future proofing" yourself. But I think it makes more sense in a professional environment and for specific purposes. It doesn't make much sense to take a snapshot of a beginner "needs" as, if everything goes well, those will change very fast at first (this is all a bit of guesswork, but seems logical). On the other hand I don't know if it is really that easy to outgrow some of the beginner scopes, they seem like extremely capable tools despite their limitations when compared with higher end oscilloscopes. Heck, I remember when I was around 12 a friend of my parents was extremely happy because he could finally afford a 20Mhz analog scope. He actually let me look at it but didn't seem like an interesting tool really, just a few wiggly linesAll in all, I don't mind having to buy a new scope two+ years from now if it costs ~400€, I would probably sell it in a heartbeat for 250€ and I'm pretty happy with that.Also the suitability of a tool for learning purposes is also to be taken into account. IE the AD2 kind of does "everything", albeit with very limited capabilities. I suppose that can help decide later on which specialised tools are worth investing into.As for the Micsig STO1104C, I've been doing some research. It looks great, nice user interface, touch and knobs, it's UI is quite fast, allows for video recording and comes with very nice probes. It's form factor is convenient, even if you don't need portability and should the need arise, it has batteries. The user nctnico had a review of the tablet only version and there's a review of the STO in mikeselectricstuff's youtube channel.However, nctnico mentions in his review that he could only get a 43kpts FFT if I understood correctly, and I don't remember listening anything about that in the youtube review. The spec sheet doesn't specify and I sent an email to their support with various questions including the FFT record lenght but they didn't answer that question specifically. On the other hand the Instek has great math features, and the FFT is really good according to the FFT comparison video from Dave. He also says you have to push many buttons and turn a knob a lot for that, but I'm not really in a position to nitpick about UI polish.So, it's a really nice 'scope with a lot of features and with better overall usability than the basic ones I was pondering, but It seems a bit limited in math features and it's also the most expensive.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2020, 01:06:35 pm
content: Quote from: fkfaraz on June 08, 2020, 11:38:40 amI have the MicSig TO1000 myself (without knobs) and I think it is perfectly suitable as a bench scope. With or without knobs is a personal preference. However the MicSig doesn't offer bode plot which is a useful feature when designing amplifiers (which the OP seems to be aiming for).

author: Antonio90
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2020, 01:26:02 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on June 08, 2020, 01:06:35 pmBut if I buy a scope in that price range it will be paired with an AD2, which does bode plots.EDIT: I'm going to buy an Analog Discovery 2. Based on some youtube videos from TheStuffMade and tomtektest I've concluded that it can do frecuency response analysis just fine for audio amps, at least for now. There's also an audio analyzer suite by TheStuffMade which looks useful.As the oscilloscope capabilities are still pretty limited, I will end up buying a dedicated oscilloscope, so any input on the matter is greatly appreciated. This means I'm left with 800€ budget now, which seems like a weird spot to buy a scope since it's more than needed for a basic scope but not enough for the next step up in price. Anyway, I have no problem whatsoever spending less than that.Thank you for all the help, I really appreciate it.

author: 2N3055
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2020, 05:23:45 pm
content: In that case you decide if portability and small space usage is important to you. In that case you cannot go wrong with Micsig.If you want more classical scope, GDS-1054B at price that it is now is also cannot go wrong option.Between AD2 and any of those two you will have tons of capabilities.Rest of the money use for something else and useful, like multimeter, soldering equipment, other tools..

author: Antonio90
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 08, 2020, 06:24:14 pm
content: Update: I got a response from Micsig, maybe this is well known already, but the FFT has 100Kpoints.Quote from: 2N3055 on June 08, 2020, 05:23:45 pmThat's what I will most likely do, now on to decide between those two!Edit: It's already done: I pulled the trigger on the GDS-1054B from Tequipment, even after shipping (with customs and VAT included) it's 392€, while in europe it is around 410 before VAT. The Micsig is 639€ in Batronix so those 240 bucks helped in making the decision.Thank you all for the help.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2020, 10:27:50 am
content: Quote from: Antonio90 on June 08, 2020, 06:24:14 pmTake them here:https://brymen.eu/product-category/multimetry/

author: fkfaraz
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 09, 2020, 08:03:13 pm
content: hellothank u all for your response @fungus @antonio @nctnicoI am from a south Asian country and i have access only to Chinese TE manufacturer through Ali express and banggood (Ebay and amazon does not work here).Now between rigol, Siglent and micsig, i am always attracted to the micsig despite the greater price. But my budget and field work does not allow me to setup my elcet work bench..BTWthe GDS-1054b had dedicated controls which is nice.Also Brymenis nice but PACE ads200 is more tempting

author: AlexBbb
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: June 24, 2020, 05:48:52 am
content: Hello All,Thanks a lot for all the information, I'm a new member of the forum who is slowly building a small electronics lab (hobby) with prime focus on microcontrollers/programming and signal processing, so yes, thinking about oscilloscope. My last time when I have used it was over 20 years ago (oh jeez time flies) and my old uses were relatively simple. Keeping all of this in mind I have looked on MicSig TO1000, Rigol DS1054Z, and Rigol MSO5074. I do suspect that 1054Z will fulfill all that I need today and potentially tomorrow, but thinking that I potentially will prefer a more recent product (MSO5074) with some capabilities which I can use in the future, but the reality I don't have any idea how deep into electronics I will go and will I ever need all those bells and whistles which MSO5074 offer.Putting the commercial side apart, what I will miss if I chose to go with DS1054Z today given I'm quite a basic user today?Upd: I do think I set myself for 5074, just a little too much of information for last few daysRegards,Alex

author: srjaynes49
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 26, 2020, 01:15:08 am
content: I agree with the "Grow Into" comment, regarding the Rigol MSO5074. IF you're doing robotics, Arduino stye micro controllers, or even Raspberry Pi projects, there's a lot to be said for a 4-channel scope with the triggering facilities and built-in signal generator of the MS5000 family with the -BUND upgrade.THAT SAID, it's a lot to learn for a beginner. Approach it like eating an elephant. Take it a bite at a time.On the other hand, you're unlikely to outgrow the performance and features of this class of scope for many years.I chose the MSO5074 for several reasons but mostly because I could get a "Clearance Center" MSO5074 with VERY good digital specs at a significant discount: It was a priced only a few hundred dollars more than a "similar" scope with only 2 MegaSamples/sec.. I assure you, after owning a 1 MegaSample, 2-channel digital storage scope for 5+ years, that a big deal!You can apply the type of comparison below for your favorite candidates and see how they compare. Just because I chose a "Bargain Department" MS)5074 doesn't mean it's the best choice for you! Something about "Your Milage" is almost guaranteed to be different than mine.FIGURE OUT WHAT FEATURES AND SPECS ARE ESSENTIAL for YOU and try to be honest, leaving your brand prejudice at the door. I assume every dollar is important to you, but money spent without yielding the required utility is money wasted!SOME of my criteria:I chose it because of:01) PRICE / Performance / Features - i.e. Bang for the buck for MY needs. (Teaching science, robotics, electronics, beginning programming to home-school teenagers)02) Built-in TWO-CHANNEL AWG for educational and practical purposes03) AWSOME Triggering options04) Same AWSOME protocol decoding05) Available integrated Logic Analyzer06) 8 MegaSamples per second, vs 2ish MegaSamples per second of other options I considered, especially with 4-channels.07 200M points of recording, especially with 4-channels08) Larger Screen than some other models considered09) FOUR analog channels with INDIVIDUAL controls for the 4 vertical inputs.10) Help and action menus mostly pretty good. LOTS of information to display and its managed pretty well. Room for improvement? Sure, as always. May be helpful too newbies.I would NOT chose it for, but can give it a pass for:01) Ease of operation / learning curve. Going to take some work on your part.02) Black Color motif. Hard for my old eyes to discern labels in low light03) Rectangle reticle grid. Should be square like everyone else!04) DVM function should be at least 5 digit, especially with the great custom ASICS in the vertical front-ends05) I actually like the way the older series of OWON scopes display measurement data for each channel. MSO5000 is somehow sparse, yet crowded at the same time. I'm still finding my way around the display choices06) While they seem to meet performance specs, probes are nothing special. A little flimsy.07) Accessory pricing like scope front panel cover, carry bag, etc. are obscene. Even the Logic Analyzer probe is too expensive, but I don't have time or inclination to fab one myself.08) No auto-sensing for 10x probes. How much would that have cost??? Seems a shame...Did I mention PRICE/Performance ratio, especially if you hack???I DO NOT HAVE complaints about some items others dislike:1) Display brightness. Measurement Traces and reticle grid have independent brightness, just like an old analog scope. Works for me.2) General form-factor/weight/physical characteristics are not a problem.3) Customer Service has been awesome!4) Missing 50 ohm option on inputs. I have lots of 50 ohm terminators and it's too common to forget to check if someone else changed the input impedance.Read, test, question. Make your choice and dig in. ANYTHING you buy today is SO powerful than what was available anywhere near these prices even a decade ago!BTW, I still have my old Tektronix 1970's Model 475, 200-MHz analog scope under the bench, just in case....

author: AlexBbb
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: June 26, 2020, 09:41:00 am
content: Thanks a lot for comments, I'm coming from the view where I don't have any specific requirements and my past experience is not applicable anymore so regardless of the model I will need to learn how to use it basically from 0.Saying this, I already have placed my order and will be getting 5074 shortly, so will be another challenge is to learn and refresh my past knowledge, build (or not build) LA, etc etc ...

author: Rigel
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 11, 2020, 01:04:23 am
content: I just had to comment on your eating an elephant comment!Why on earth would you want to eat an elephant.... Do they taste like chicken?I first hear the quote as How do you eat a 1000 lb potato. One Byte at a time. (I was in a programming class). So Yay to Potato's boo to eating Elephants!Hopefully closer to being back on topic. Does anyone know of a good resource for Educational or Student discounts on test equipment. I am returning to finish my school program after awhile, I am going to be able to take some courses by distance, but I need to build a Home Electronics lab. (will be cheaper than moving across the country for a semester). We had 200mhz scopes in the lab a couple years back so something in that range should work. Do not really want to hijack the thread, so I wont go into much more detail. But if there is a really good education or student discount please let me know.Richard