Testing the NEW SIGLENT SDG1022X-PLUS, output 100Mhz!!  - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: Tankj
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 01:48:02 pm
content: After a bad experience on buying the SIGLENT SDS2204X-HD, I finally switched to SDS1204X-HD and SDG1022X-PLUS instead.EDIT: due to the improper vertical scale setting, all tests blew with green FFT trace has introduced the scope's frontend nonlinear distortion.I redid these tests in subsequent replys, changing to brown FFT trace To distinguish.Did a quick signal test on the new SDG1022X-PLUS in to SDS1204X-HD,SDG outputs 0dBm sin wave into scope 50Ω terminal with RF cable (BNC to SMA on SDG side).FFT are fixed 256kpts, Varying time bases for different frequency resolution. Flat top on most time for best amplitude accuracy.Testing desk：1，Signal Quality Test1kHz with 50k span1kHz with 2k span10kHz with 100k span10kHz with 5k span100kHz with 1M span100kHz with 190k span100kHz with 10k span1MHz with 10M span1MHz with 1M span

author: Tankj
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 01:54:38 pm
content: 10MHz with 100M span10MHz with 1M span25MHz with 100M span25MHz with 1M span

author: Tankj
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 02:37:16 pm
content: 2，Square Wave and Rise TimeIn the SDG1000X PLUS datasheet, the rise time is 10-11nS.1Mhz and 20Mhz Square Wave, 10.3nS rise timeWhen I set a fast rising edge triangle wave, see what happensRise time is 5.38nS!3, Higher frequency outputAs the top model is 60Mhz, I want try some tricks on my 25Mz model see if it can do higher waves, it actually puts 5.38nS rising time right?I've tried to create a file containing multiple repeated waveforms and output it in True Arb mode. As the True Arb mode is point-to-point output and the maximum sample rate is 250M, there will only have 4.16 points at each wave if I need to output 60Mhz.It works. But the wave frequency is coupled with sampling rate, NO stable output at most time. It dose stable just on certain specific frequencies.Next I tried to use DDS mode, the output was still unstable. Given the way DDS works, the waveforms I created before may have too few points. So I created a 256k waveform consisting of 5 repeated sine waves, and then, the magic happened20Mhz Arb in DDS mode, outputs 100Mhz sine wave! the rise time is just under 3nS!!You can see that the 100Mhz sine wave is very clean, even cleaner than the old Rigol DG1022U at 20Mhz I used before.I also created a 10 repeated sine waves Arb to test higher frequencies, the output rapidly decays right after 105Mhz, which shows the limit of the output stage bandwidth also the 250M DDS generator.

author: KungFuJosh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 03:38:43 pm
content: Quote from: Tankj on December 12, 2024, 01:48:02 pmWhat happened with your SDS2204X HD? Or are you referring to the issue with the firmware update on the Plus model?Also, is that TH2830 running as a 2832? 😉

author: Tankj
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 03:48:29 pm
content: By setting the output frequency in proportion (here is 5X), we can get any output up to 100Mhz through DDS Arb mode.Here is a 50Mhz sine wave4, FFT test above 25Mhz50Mhz with 100M span100Mhz with 500M span100Mhz with 1M spanat 50Mhz, the signal drops to -0.14dBmat 100Mhz, it drops to about -1.1dBmThis seems perfectly acceptable to me.

author: newbrain
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 04:05:14 pm
content: Thanks for your tests, I'll be deciding in a few months which AWG to buy and every additional piece of information is useful.There's one thing that looks a bit odd, though.According to the data sheet, the harmonic distortion should be lower than -65 dBc for frequencies less than 10 MHz at 0 dBm over 50 Ω - your test conditions.In many of your pictures, I see values for the 2nd harmonic about 20 dB higher than that.I can expect some non linearity in the scope front end, but less than what I see.Maybe changing the vertical scale of Channel 1 to a higher value (200 mV/) would help?

author: Tankj
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 04:06:48 pm
content: Quote from: KungFuJosh on December 12, 2024, 03:38:43 pmHi, I got a old white version of SDS2204X HD when pay for the newer black version.I returned it without power on. I don't think there will be any problem with the machine itself. SIGLENT build their machine like a tank.I sold my 2504X+ to get the money for this new 12bit scopeI didn't do the firmware upgrade to the TH2830 in the end, it still stays on TH2830 thing.

author: 2N3055
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 04:11:38 pm
content: Quote from: Tankj on December 12, 2024, 04:06:48 pmYou returned it because of color?It is exactly the same machine AFAIK....

author: KungFuJosh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 04:14:39 pm
content: Quote from: Tankj on December 12, 2024, 04:06:48 pmOh, gotcha. I have the white one. The only thing that I know of that's better in the black version is the newer/better BNC ports. I also sold my 2504X+ to get my HD model.QuoteIt's worth it if you ever need the higher frequencies or DC bias. If not, it doesn't make much of a difference if you have one of the newest firmwares where the arbitrary frequency values also work on the 2830.Quote from: 2N3055 on December 12, 2024, 04:11:38 pmThe only difference is the BNC ports AFAIK. Most of the white ones have the 3 split with mediocre chamfer. The newest ones/black ones have the 4 split with better chamfer.

author: Tankj
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 04:20:19 pm
content: Quote from: newbrain on December 12, 2024, 04:05:14 pmYes, you hit the point.on the datasheet it also mentions Non-harmonic spurious, which is -70dBc under 50MHz. My test results also seem to be a bit higher.I don't think its due to the non-linearity of the frontend of scope. The scope has a very good test Results.But I'll test it as you said and see how it goes.

author: 2N3055
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 04:27:16 pm
content: Quote from: Tankj on December 12, 2024, 04:20:19 pmFor least distortion, don't stretch signal across whole vertical, but less.Experiment where you have least distortion..

author: Tankj
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 04:31:18 pm
content: Quote from: 2N3055 on December 12, 2024, 04:11:38 pmPart of itplus a cheaper price for SDS1204XHD + SDG1022XPLUS, when the seller didn't want to give full refund. maybe business is hard for him

author: 2N3055
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 04:51:19 pm
content: Quote from: Tankj on December 12, 2024, 04:31:18 pmFair enough!

author: Tankj
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 07:00:47 pm
content: Quote from: newbrain on December 12, 2024, 04:05:14 pmDid a quick test again, all settings are the same except the vertical scale to 200mV, this time 0.63Vpp on 1.6V full scale.You are right, the noisy harmonics are gone, all tests met the specified performance. I can get even lower harmonics with 250mV vertical scale after I did the screenshots.1kHz, all harmonics are under -65dB1Mhz, highest harmonics are around -64.5dB25Mhz, -55dB 50Mhz harmonic1Mhz spurious, under -77dB

author: Tankj
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 07:09:23 pm
content: Quote from: 2N3055 on December 12, 2024, 04:27:16 pmThanks!I repeat the test, result on previous post. You are definitely right here, the nonlinearity of the scope frontend indeed have a huge impact on this test!

author: Tankj
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 07:28:10 pm
content: Quote from: KungFuJosh on December 12, 2024, 04:14:39 pmThe main consideration that stop me to install the ST firmware is the impact of second-hand value. I'm thinking to sell it(TH2830) for the newer version, or go for a TH2840A something when I have enough moneyBut this don't have much value other than self-satisfaction, most of my work is in the audio range.Maybe it will has some other HW difference, like the newer CPUs or FPGAs, like the newer SDS1000XHD has (better Zynq processor).I'd like to see someone has the black version and teardown

author: Tankj
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 07:42:42 pm
content: 50Mhz harmonics100Mhz harmonicsMuch better than the previous tests!

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 07:45:46 pm
content: Nice work, tidy setup.Please tell, what's with the white knob on the SDG1022X Plus encoder ?Easier to see ?

author: KungFuJosh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 07:53:58 pm
content: Quote from: Tankj on December 12, 2024, 07:28:10 pmThe ST2832 is more valuable than the TH2830. I sold my upgraded TH2830 on eBay (listed as upgraded TH2830 to ST2832), and did just fine. 😉 The buyer was very happy too.Switching back and forth is easy anyway, if you have a TH2830 firmware to go back to.

author: Tankj
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 08:06:07 pm
content: Quote from: tautech on December 12, 2024, 07:45:46 pmThanks.yes I found the large knob a bit fiddly to operate when needed to turn it quickly. the little white one is easier to see too.

author: Tankj
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 08:12:55 pm
content: Quote from: KungFuJosh on December 12, 2024, 07:53:58 pmI don't have the TH version firmware, guys from TH refuse to give me new firmwaresmaybe they have some policies on this. If I can't go back, better to leave the choice to the next user

author: Tankj
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 08:23:49 pm
content: For anyone who wants to try it, the 5X and 10X sinewave Arb files are attached!It should make your signal 5X or 10X faster if your signal generator support that fast of rise time.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 09:10:46 pm
content: Quote from: Tankj on December 12, 2024, 08:06:07 pmHmmm, is using the keypad unsuitable ?

author: Tankj
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 10:04:11 pm
content: Quote from: tautech on December 12, 2024, 09:10:46 pmNo, The keyboard is good and quite useful, The only complaint for me is that all buttons are a bit heavy, needs more force to press than usual.IMO, it is more convenient to use the knob when needs to continuously change paras, say frequency and amplitude. also when selecting Arbs or files.

author: newbrain
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 11:04:21 pm
content: Quote from: Tankj on December 12, 2024, 07:00:47 pmVery kind of you!Thanks a lot - I suspected as much, given my similar results with SDS804 and self built AD9954 based generator, when compared with a TinySA.I'm not bothered by the slow rise/fall times of the SDG10?2X-plus for square waves, so I might get one in the close future.

author: Tankj
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 12, 2024, 11:57:59 pm
content: Quote from: newbrain on December 12, 2024, 11:04:21 pmBased on the results of the 100Mhz sine wave, we can expect faster square wave rise time using Arbs, I'll do this later see how it goes.Fortunately, Siglent does not limit the bandwidth/rise time of the output stage on SDG1000X PLUS, even on the lowest 25Mhz model

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 13, 2024, 12:17:50 am
content: Quote from: Tankj on December 12, 2024, 10:04:11 pmThanks for your feedback.I had a short play with SDG1062X Plus on a recent HQ visit and I have some SDG1022X Plus coming in a few weeks when I can investigate your feedback more deeply and maybe pass recommendations to HQ.For now I'll keep using my SDG6022X.....

author: Tankj
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 13, 2024, 12:52:03 am
content: Square Arbs.1Vpp square into 50Ω terminal,C3 is Ordinary built-in square wave,C4 is Arb square，100Hz 11.12ns Vs 5.78ns rise time, more ripple on the faster square wave is expected.1Mhz, same result10Mhz, very noticeable ripple on faster square wave.20Mhz, Arbs are in DDS mode (True Arb can't do it due to the 250M max sample rate)We get that classic DDS jitter here.Any higher square wave above 20Mhz is useless on SDG1000X PLUS as limited high frequency content makes it closer to a distorted sine wave.If you really needs faster edge, the Arb square wave will simply do some help.Not as exciting as 100Mhz sine wave though.

author: gamalot
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2025, 12:59:57 pm
content: It looks like the SDG1022X Plus is a decent generator for its price, is it possible to upgrade it to the "SDG1062X Plus" for free to make it even more worthwhile?

author: newbrain
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2025, 02:35:21 pm
content: Quote from: gamalot on June 04, 2025, 12:59:57 pmIME, "liberation" of this nice AWG is possible without any complication, following the procedure you'll easily find on this forum.No issue with FW update, and zero calibration problems - at least that I could detect with my other limited (TinySA Ultra, SDSD800X-HD) equipment.