Siglent SDM3065X - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: eurofox
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 26, 2018, 08:08:22 am
content: Hi guy's,I would like to buy a 6 1/2 digit multimeter with trending capability without breaking the bankOf course there is Keysight, Keithley, PeakTech and Siglent....maybe some other.When I look the the datasheet the Siglent SDM3065X seems to be a winner when I look to the price/performance.Service from Siglent is maybe not yet on the level of Keysight.Thank you for sharing your experience if you have such a multimeter.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 26, 2018, 08:18:36 am
content: Thread about all the SDM3k models:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-new-bench-dmm-sdm3055/I've got one with the 16ch logging card if there's anything you want me to check for you.I sold another one to member Defpom and he uses it for his repairs on his YouTube channel....easy to find him if you look.

author: eurofox
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 26, 2018, 08:27:34 am
content: Quote from: tautech on May 26, 2018, 08:18:36 amI check already the Defpom 2hour video but it does not show any test about accuracy, is more relate to use the the multimeter.Nobody connect it to a calibrator ar compare to a Keysight 34465A?

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 26, 2018, 08:57:23 am
content: Quote from: eurofox on May 26, 2018, 08:27:34 amYou only need compare the datasheets, on my one the Cal cert specifies it was calibrated with a Fluke 5522A which was 3 months inside its Cal period so should ensure the specified datasheet accuracy. There's also a specified 1 year accuracy listed.Member kj7e had one but I think he updated it for 7.5 digits or more.He had a rough start with his and got another one from Siglent USA.His first impressions are here:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-new-bench-dmm-sdm3055/msg824341/#msg824341

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 26, 2018, 09:02:30 am
content: The cal sheet doesn't really guarantee anything. Peope doing tests with calibrators and way better instruments found some accuracy related bugs in the Keysight 3446xA series DMMs for example (which got fixed by a firmware update after Keysight reproduced it).

author: kj7e
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 26, 2018, 03:08:47 pm
content: Ive had both the SDM3055 and SDM3065, both where calibrated from the factory bang on and worked quite well. They are good meters for the price. My experience has been, Siglent seems to do a proper job with their factory calibrations.As pointed out, my first SDM3055 had an issue, I never even removed the plastic wrapping as I could hear something rattling inside the meter when I unboxed it. The distributor I bought it from was not as helpful as I would have liked, but Siglent USA stepped in and quickly resolved the issue.

author: Kleinstein
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 26, 2018, 08:47:28 pm
content: For the accuracy and longer time stability it is very difficult to tell how good the new meters are actually. There is a little more trust in the way Keysight or Keithley calculate the specs, but time will tell. Just measuring a few new meters against a more or less accurate source does not give much information. The old established companies have there experience with older models. At least the LM399 is about the same for all.

author: kj7e
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 27, 2018, 02:29:30 am
content: ^Agree, I think the Siglent specs are honest, but Keysight specs are conservative.

author: JDubU
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 27, 2018, 03:01:08 am
content: Quote from: kj7e on May 27, 2018, 02:29:30 amFrom the Keysight 34401A DMM service manual (see attached):"The Agilent 34401A is designed and tested to meet performance betterthan mean ±4 sigma of the published accuracy specifications."

author: eurofox
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 04, 2018, 10:01:42 am
content: I just order one from Batronix.I will post results .....

author: analogRF
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 06, 2018, 05:16:18 am
content: Quote from: kj7e on May 26, 2018, 03:08:47 pmI am having difficulty in choosing between SDM3065X and Rigol DM3068. Any advice? are you happy with it? any pros or cons?I hear many people complain about the siglent being very slow and sluggish. I also have two specific questions: is the capacitance resolution 4 decimal digit or 3 at lowest range? In reading hold mode can you adjust the sensitivity of capturing a new reading?

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 06, 2018, 05:28:28 am
content: Quote from: analogRF on September 06, 2018, 05:16:18 amThe earliest releases were troublesome until firmware became mature and this only applies to early 3055 FW.You cannot judge the 3065X on 3055 old commentary, one they are entirely different units and two, they run different FW.QuoteC measurement.22pF, 50V 5% NPO disc ceramic.ST3 Smart Tweezers measurement 26-26.1pFSDM3065X, 5 digits available on 2nF range4 wire measurement, leads nulled.QuoteNo, not while in a Manual range setting with the Range buttons below the display.In the Hold GUI you must select; Probe Hold=OFF then the range selection buttons become available.Then re-enter the Hold UI with a press of Shift and Single/Hold.

author: skander36
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 06, 2018, 12:04:34 am
content: Hi Tautech ,How can I modify files definition for K Type thermocouple in SDM3065X . It show a lower temp - 18* instead of 23* C .Thank you !

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 06, 2018, 12:56:14 am
content: Quote from: skander36 on December 06, 2018, 12:04:34 amDidn't know so had a look.....In the Temp UI select the Load softkey and the right arrow key to select the correct file for your probe.In the Load menu after selecting the correct File, press Read to check your thermocouple measurement File is a correct match for your probe.Or you can use Define for which there are 128 offset corrections available.

author: skander36
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 06, 2018, 01:15:42 am
content: Hi,Thank you , but how can I use values from Define ?Everything I choose don't change anything .Thank you !

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 06, 2018, 01:35:51 am
content: Quote from: skander36 on December 06, 2018, 01:15:42 amNot sure.....having trouble to do that too.From what you say you need ~+5*C correction, that fits well with a #40 or 41 adjustment but it does not seem to be saved.I'll ask tech support.

author: eplpwr
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 06, 2018, 09:13:31 pm
content: Quote from: Kleinstein on May 26, 2018, 08:47:28 pmYes and no. LM399 is the same for sure. What you get from the big names are burned-in and binned '399s. Also note that many brands have 10V range as opposed to Siglents 20V. This is great except that part of the accuracy spec is % of range.My SDM3065 was spot on day 1, then drifted exactly as LM399 datasheet predicts. Buy the meter, you do the burn-in.

author: DaJMasta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 06, 2018, 09:27:19 pm
content: I've gotta say, while the Siglent offers very good price/performance.... I've got a 34461A and I really like the meter. The two are very similar in look and form factor, and the specifications are around about the same, but the price premium for the Keysight is not so crazy either, and they can be found (at least in the US) for only $100 more or so used in good condition. It may be worth seeing some videos of each in action to verify UI responsiveness and such to get a feel for the differences between them. The minor advantage of the Keysight is that the lowest range has half the scale (100mV DC vs. 200mV DC and comparable across the ranges), whereas the Siglent has a faster rated frequency measurement, though I just clocked my 34461A reading a 820kHz 1Vpp sine wave, so maybe not by as much as it appears.Either meter is probably a good choice, but see if you can see the Siglent in action or use it yourself, could help make your choice or differentiate otherwise similarly specified instruments.

author: Performa01
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 06, 2018, 10:19:21 pm
content: Quote from: DaJMasta on December 06, 2018, 09:27:19 pmHow could this be an advantage?What counts is resolution and dynamic range.The resolution is the same 100nV per count on both meters. But the Siglent can provide this resolution up to 219.9999mV because it has nearly twice the dynamic range, whereas the Keysight falls back to 1µV above 119.9999mV.I own neither of them, but prefer my Fluke 8842As (5-1/2 digits) and Keithly 2001s (7-1/2 digits) over my other DMMs for this exact reason. The higher dynamic range also means high impedance up to at least 20V, whereas the 6-1/2 digit DMMs with only 1.2 million counts (like the Keithley 2015THD) tend to already show a noticable non-linear increase in input current once entering their overrange, i.e. above 10V.For old style analog precision work in +/-15 to +/-18V systems, found in many calibrators, the high impedance 20V range with good resolution (1µV in case of the Keithley 2001) is just indispensable.

author: skander36
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 08, 2018, 08:15:04 am
content: Quote from: DaJMasta on December 06, 2018, 09:27:19 pmUsed Keysight , Fluke , or Keysight may be a good choice in US , but in Europe they are very rare and at a high price . Import from USA is not an option and you must add 100-200E for calibration , because there is no means to use this precision device without being calibrated. So for me a good source for meters and scopes are clearance from Rigol or Siglent .(I've got the SDM3065X from a Batterfly promotion at 585 E -no VAT ).

author: DaJMasta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 08, 2018, 02:46:39 pm
content: Quote from: skander36 on December 08, 2018, 08:15:04 amIt's certainly true with less of a used market the value proposition goes down, but I would pretty strongly disagree with this statement. It your application requires significant measurement accuracy, sure, but you still get all the linearity and resolution of an out-of-cal instrument, and an LM399 is no slouch. While calibration is required for traceability and specific measurement tasks, the majority of uses for a meter don't depend on it, and the likelihood that the meter is going to be out of cal even years after its certificate expires is low, given the architecture.Regarding my 'range advantage' comment, yes, resolution would be the pertinent thing, and while I have not seen a counts equivalent metric for the 34461a and don't know how the ADC ENOB between that and the SDM3065X compares, but if the ADC portion is equivalent, a range setting that is half a competing meter would havedoublethe resolution. Yes dynamic range is important, but with equivalent converters, dynamic range is the same, so the same dynamic range on a full scale measurement that's twice as large means your minimum resolution step is also double the size. Now I don't know if the ADC portions are comparable and don't know if there's enough of a noise floor in the bottom of the range to negate any potential resolution benefits, but while the larger range may be preferable in some applications, the smaller lowest range means the higher resolution on very low measurements.

author: skander36
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 08, 2018, 05:54:48 pm
content: Quote from: DaJMasta on December 08, 2018, 02:46:39 pmCan you argue this ?

author: DaJMasta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 08, 2018, 06:17:17 pm
content: What is your measurement requirement? Can you argue that the inherent drift of the reference, the resistors, or the integration cap or something used is enough to realistically cause a problem with your measurements?It takes a demanding measurement requirement to really need it and the majority of instruments that go in for a cal need no adjustment. Your application may require extreme precision, in which case adhering to the calibration cycle and expecting only the specifications on the data sheet are acceptable, but the vast majority of measurement situations don't require that. Keysight has a long history (at least, as Agilent and HP) of instruments that live up to their specification even after their calibration cycles are up, and the 34461a has been around for plenty of time to have its aging characterized.None of this is a slight at the Siglent, which from what I can tell uses very similar parts to maintain its stability and specification, but unless your application requires traceable calibration or absolute accuracy, I don't think there's a compelling argument for keeping an instrument regularly calibrated at a lab. Have some other references as sanity checks and understand how the instrument works, then if anything seems awry you can address it at that time (cal or fix as needed). Sending it in to cal every 2 years when it's not even going to be adjusted unless its out of spec.

author: skander36
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 08, 2018, 07:53:33 pm
content: I understand you point of view about the necessity or not about accuracy, but if you can focus on your statement maybe will be more useful for me , i mean technical.I think that if you don't need precision you don't buy 5,5 / 6,5 digit mutimeter . Instead Fluke 87 or even a more cheaper Brymen 869 will be enough .And if you decide to buy SH 6,5 multimeter , you will verify against one with the same specification to find if it still maintain his accuracy .You don't tell me that you will buy a 5,5 digit Agilent and you don't care if it is specifications . Why dont you buy a Brymen then ?

author: DaJMasta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 08, 2018, 08:41:15 pm
content: I have a 6.5 digit meter because I want the precision, even though the accuracy of a 4.5 digit meter would be fine for me. You can use a 6.5 digit meter to measure small scale drift trends, and even when well outside of calibration, it can happily demonstrate that down to at least 5.5 digits or so accurately. That said, since my measurement requirements don't require 6.5 digits of accuracy, letting it drift and be out of cal for a decade or two will still likely be within 5.5 digit meter accuracy spec, which still exceeds my requirements, but will show me all of the fine detail of the nicer meter.I can use my 6.5 digit meter to measure the tempco of a thick film resistor accurately at room temperature - just a few degrees of fluctuation, and that is a useful/fascinating measurement to me that would be tough with a 5.5 digit or less meter. I don't particularly mind if the resistor I'm measuring starts at 101.256k Ohms or 101.254k Ohms (for example), so the calibrated accuracy spec far exceeds my requirements and I trust enough in the architecture, component choice, and testing done by the manufacturer to not be dramatically out of calibration for no reason even well beyond the calibration period.Maybe others don't have the same trust or do demand accuracy or traceability, and it's their choice to make, but for my use-case, a meter that's over-specified for my requirements but is out of cal shows me fine detail lesser meters can't, and is very accurate, even if it's out of its specification. Then if I get my hands on a reference that's been checked against a real standard, or a different 6.5 digit meter in passing or something similar, I can use that as a transfer standard to check my instrument out and verify that at the level of detail I can't otherwise verify on my own, it at least agrees with other instruments. As I've said, It's not the approach for every application or every person, but I think it suits a lot of use cases well. A calibrated instrument does have some extra value, but I don't think it's an inherent requirement for a purchase of a high resolution meter for most people/situations.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 08, 2018, 09:25:37 pm
content: Quote from: skander36 on December 08, 2018, 08:15:04 amThat was a good deal with ~100 Euro off.BTW, no reply yet on the thermocouple measurement offset yet so I'll shoot another reminder email through.Have you tried another thermocouple to find one that measures closer to true ?I only ask as the Vichy VC99 one I have measures quite close to actual, not some 5 C off like the one you have.

author: skander36
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 09, 2018, 10:49:44 am
content: Yes, ok, and is the warranty problem . Maybe is not too much but it's costly to repair such baby ...Shit happened , look here :.For me the best option was SDM3065 although I am not a Siglent fan . I had a choice between Rigol and Siglent and the winner was Siglent due to the LCD display. If it had not been the LCD I would have chosen Rigol with eyes closed.

author: skander36
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 09, 2018, 10:58:28 am
content: Quote from: tautech on December 08, 2018, 09:25:37 pmI test another type with the same termocouple , E-type and is getting closer , at only 2 grade , but what good is 5 decimals then ?It must be a way to modify those files . (download/edit/upload) .If you are getting a response please share .Thank you very much !

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 09, 2018, 11:03:10 am
content: Quote from: skander36 on December 09, 2018, 10:49:44 amYes I sold that unit to Defpom.Oh yes, and on that matter check the fuses in your SDM3065X.There's been some issues with the wrong fuses used.....the rear panel should be fast blow 10A and the internal one slow blow 12A.See here for background and understanding:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sdm3045x-ma-current-measurement-weird-behaviour/

author: wolfy007
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 09, 2018, 05:45:16 pm
content: I bought a sdm3065x three months ago, but still havent used it in anger. It came in and despite having a Siglent cert saying calibration checked in may this year it was out of spec. I have bought a few pieces of Siglent gear over the years with no issues, but I guess my expectations for a 6.5digit multimeter not being delivered out of spec made this experience a little disappointing.In any case its currently still at Siglent, Im assuming getting a re-cal but they have had it 6weeks and got a promise last week it would be shipped back this coming week. I did buy it from overseas because the Australian distributor promised delivery twice and didnt deliver, so they had my money for 5weeks and then gave me a story it world be another three weeks, so I cancelled and purchased overseas and got it in a week only to get one thats out of spec. Another reason this has all been disappointing, not currently happy with Siglent.Sorry for a downer of a post, guess I just needed a little vent.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 09, 2018, 06:48:10 pm
content: Quote from: wolfy007 on December 09, 2018, 05:45:16 pmWhat ranges were out of spec if I may ask ?What reference did you use to check them ?

author: Synthtech
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 09, 2018, 10:11:53 pm
content: Quote from: wolfy007 on December 09, 2018, 05:45:16 pmInteresting, I noted last week that the Australian distributor has removed the pricing for this meter from their website and replaced it with a “contact us for price” message. I had been tempted to buy one some months ago and as part of the decision making process I called them and asked who their recommended calibration lab was and the person that I spoke to had no suggestion, I wondered if it was even a consideration for them. In the end I decided to avoid the brand in case I found myself in a situation where I took it to a cal lab in the future and found that they didn’t deal with Siglent gear or have right docs or if it requires some kind of hardware key like the Instek meters. I have an Instek 5.5 digit bench meter and it has drifted badly so it’s basically a junker, I don’t have a cal key for it to take with it to a cal facility.To be fair Rigol might be in the same boat, I purchased one of their 5.5 digit meters from Emona a couple of years ago and Emona do have an in-house calibration service but 5.5 digits is as high as they go for multimeter calibration so if I had purchased a 6.5 digit meter from them I would have been looking for another cal lab anyway.Fortunately I have a rock solid Agilent 34401a that I can use to keep an eye on the other meters and getting it calibrated is no issue.

author: H.O
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 10, 2018, 06:07:25 am
content: QuoteAs far as I'm aware that cal key is nothing more than a resistor (or even a dead short) between two of the pins in the USB plug. Sorry for the OT.

author: wolfy007
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 10, 2018, 04:43:15 pm
content: Quote from: tautech on December 09, 2018, 06:48:10 pmUnfortunately I cant put my hand on the log data (I re-arranged the home lab since then) but I remember it being 2v and 20v DC ranges (mV range seemed to be OK), I didnt check other ranges mainly concentrated on these DC voltage ranges after noticing larger than expected numbers.I was using IanJ's PDVS2 and comparing the 3065x readings against my 3458A and 3457A. I sent some data back up the chain with a picture and was asked to send it back for Siglent to re-calibrate. Unfortunately my Fluke DC calibrator needs some attention and my 4808 project is still in repair phase and then needs calibration.

author: Kibabalu
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 26, 2022, 08:35:42 am
content: Result of a lazy and boring Christmas Day: Two CLI c programs for computing the confidence interval for a SDM3065X in DCV and DCI mode.For both kinds of operating systems, Unix and Linux, just compile and link the programs using gccgcc dcv_ci.c -o dcv_ciresp.gcc dci_ci.c -o dci_ciusage examples: Start up a terminal and use the functions like shown below.❯ ./dcv_ci 2.5+/- 0.000180.[2.499820 2.500180].❯ ./dci_ci 5+/- 0.008000.[4.992000 5.008000].Maybe it's useful for some of you too.Merry Christmas!

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 26, 2022, 08:47:54 am
content: Linked on the SDM3000 thread but not yet here:https://www.thedefpom.com/siglent_sdm_calibration.phpMight be useful for those that have trusted references they can adjust their meters to.Defpom has some videos for guidance on adjustments and using his website to construct the adjustment files.