Remove HDMI Audio? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / projects

author: Joshsstuff
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 14, 2017, 08:21:01 pm
content: I wish to remove the audio properties of my HDMI display cables.Is there a way to do this by making an adapter that cuts out certain pins?The problem:I'm having problems with Audio being diverted to my monitors instead of the desired audio device.(Windows 10 has a tendency to re-route Audio to a newly plugged in device. This has been a problem for my system.)Solutions I've tried:Software:I've already tried the Software solution of disabling all audio sources, however when Windows updates mysteriously these audio sources get re-enabled!I've searched this topic and found a few places where people wanted to extract the Audio from HDMI.(SPDIF- so perhaps there is a way to omit the Audio?)DVI output:Since DVI does not carry audio, a DVI to HDMI cable is safe from this behavior.(Windows does not even recognize the display as a potential audio device)Using DVI outputs from the graphics card and HDMI adapters would solve the problem, however I don't have enough.Here is the pinout of HDMI from Wikipedia:Compared with the pinout of DVI:(Single link pins circled)If you count the flat pin, This seems to be a 19pin to 19pin direct connection.But I didn't think HDMI and DVI used the same standard.Does anyone know of a way to disable only the pins responsible for Audio?

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 14, 2017, 08:29:46 pm
content: There are no separate data lines for audio, it comes together with video. Only thing you can do is providing different E-EDID data to computer by reprogramming EEPROM in display or adding different EEPROM to SDA and SCL lines. If you aren't using this with intel iGPU, you can use CRU utility to remove audio data block without making any hardware modifications.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 14, 2017, 08:38:34 pm
content: The easiest solution might be to install Windows 7. I have not experienced this particular problem on my home PC, but my work laptop has 10 and it's been a disaster.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 14, 2017, 08:44:14 pm
content: Quote from: Joshsstuff on December 14, 2017, 08:21:01 pmWindows 10 installs new drivers as it wishes often breaking things in the process. Particular device driver updates can be disabled with some tinkering.

author: Buriedcode
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 14, 2017, 08:57:22 pm
content: So you're constantly plugging and unplugging monitors? Because windows only switches to HDMI audio when a device is plugged in. After that you can switch playback device, and set it to default. I too have noticed windows 10 updates can rest settings (irritating) but it takes seconds to switch it back, and the setting will stick. You can also disable playback devices permanently (as in, that don't re-enable themselves after a reboot).This facility hasn't changed in windows 10, was just the same in windows 7.I'll admit it can get a bit tricky when dealing with two/three HDMI devices, desktop speakers, headphones and optical out. But generally you can set things up so route HDMI audio when (and if) you want it to, whilst muting other outputs, or leaving them enabled (like headphones and speakers at the same time). Seems a bit overkill to try and do it digitally. Maybe don't buy monitors with speakers?

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 14, 2017, 09:04:28 pm
content: I do not know if f W10 still has the Control Panel. If it does, try looking there tor the associated device HDMI audio driver and disable it. Or perhaps the monitor itself has a control to switch audio off.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 14, 2017, 09:16:54 pm
content: Quote from: Bud on December 14, 2017, 09:04:28 pmIt's useless. Once win 10 installs a new driver, it will be reenabled.QuoteVery unlikely that monitor will provide different E-EDID data depending on settings. All video data lines are one-way only.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 14, 2017, 09:20:39 pm
content: Quote from: Buriedcode on December 14, 2017, 08:57:22 pmAnd will enable again once drivers are reinstalled on it's own.QuoteNo it wasn't the same. Win 7 don't forcefully push new drivers on you.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 14, 2017, 09:33:52 pm
content: I finally resorted to disabling Windows Update entirely on Win10. The cure is worse than the disease.Since I know a few people are going to freak out and whine that I'm endangering the whole world and will quickly be infected by every malware and virus known to man I'll just point out that every one of the many infections I've cleaned up on various PCs were caused by the user installing something. I've never actually witnessed a genuine exploit infecting any PC I've dealt with, it's always the weakest link, the user themselves. Can't patch that.

author: Joshsstuff
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 14, 2017, 10:04:40 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on December 14, 2017, 08:38:34 pmUnfortunately this option will not work in this case, for several reasons, one being Win 10 App support.Quote from: Buriedcode on December 14, 2017, 08:57:22 pmSurprisingly these monitors do not get unplugged. One video output goes to a Coax extender to a network of 2 TVs.I was surprised the extender preserved the audio, ordinarily that would be a desirable feature.There are 3 monitor outputs needed, I have 2 DVI ports, so I can just get adapters to fix those.So that leaves just one of the 2 the PC monitors to fix.One is a LG screen, the other is an Asushttps://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005BZNEVQ/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1QuoteYeah, I had no idea this would be a problem when purchasing, if everything suggested here fails that might be a good last option.Quote from: Bud on December 14, 2017, 09:04:28 pmWould this be the same as disabling in Windows Device Manager?Quote from: wraper on December 14, 2017, 08:29:46 pmOk, yeah I see that now.Quote from: wraper on December 14, 2017, 08:29:46 pmWow, I didn't even know this was possible!Here is the card I'm using:EVGA GT 710https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01AZ8EQBK/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o06_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1I started researching this tool.I captured the interface screen from a video describing how to overclock monitors:Is there a setting here do disable the "Audio Block" as you say?

author: Buriedcode
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 14, 2017, 10:28:05 pm
content: Quote from: wraper on December 14, 2017, 09:20:39 pmIndeed, generally though, that is a good thing, it allows any security bugs to be patched quickly, without letting the user decide. I was referring to the settings, they haven't changed in windows 10. And whilst settings can change/revert when new drivers are installed - new driver updates are hardly a daily occurrence.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 14, 2017, 11:57:59 pm
content: Quote from: Joshsstuff on December 14, 2017, 10:04:40 pmJust tried it. For some reason it shows extension blocks only for a first in the list out of two identical monitors. But you should be able to just completely replace the E-EDID file used. With second monitor even if exporting, it saves only first E-EDID block out of 2, I've seen this issue with many E-EDID editing programs.

author: RoGeorge
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2017, 12:17:34 am
content: Hey, Microsoft, you there?!This thread is a little surrealistic: Windows 10 is in such a mess that people start crippling their good hardware in order to fit your crippled Windows 10.On topic:TryAutoHotkeywith a script that make all the sound settings, and associate that script with a shortcut, or make it run each time the PC wake up, or after Win10 update scheduled event.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 15, 2017, 12:17:50 am
content: I just replaced E-EDID for both monitors in CRU and no longer have such audio playback devices. Will see how this works long term as I occasionally had the same issue.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2017, 01:21:08 am
content: If Windows Update was only used to push security patches then I would have no issue with it. The problem is that Microsoft has been abusing it to increasing levels to the extent that I have lost every bit of the trust they had built up over the years. I simply do not trust windows update to act in my best interest any more than I trust the hackers it purports to help defend me against.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 15, 2017, 02:40:49 am
content: Quote from: Buriedcode on December 14, 2017, 10:28:05 pmI have my dad's computer sitting right next to me and 250km away from where my dad lives. All because win 10 updated GPU driver with one that doesn't work correctly with this GPU. Also it keeps replacing my notebooks MEI driver which does not work correctly as well and causes notebook to hang, sometimes being unable to switch off completely, and other weird issues. Only slapping it on dirty hands keeps it away from doing it but that is beyond of ability that most users have. My colleague who is computer specialist and has the same laptop model couldn't figure out wtf is going on for months and thought it was a hardware failure until I told him after finding myself.

author: drussell
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2017, 01:15:03 pm
content: You should be able to set it up to simultaneously use multiple audio output devices. It is convoluted and I can't remember precisely how I did it but, for example, I have my aunt's 42" plasma upstairs connected via HDMI to the computer downstairs and a wireless keyboard/mouse so she can use it from upstairs. Downstairs there is the main monitor and a set of regular PC speakers. Both are set to be always be used simultaneously so it doesn't matter if you are upstairs or down, you always get sound.It seems to me, IIRC, that uf you set the main speakers as your default playback device, then you go into the recording input selection and set the stereo output mix to be your recording source, then use the "listen" tab (normally used like a record monitor function when recording) to enable output to the HDMI.As long as Windows doesn't automatically change your default on you for some reason, it should stay like that regardless of what you do. If Windows changes it on you sometimes there is probably some tweak somewhere that tells Windows to not automatically change sound devices. Might be a registry tweak or something. When jack sensing became a thing most drivers' utilities had a way to turn that off. There is probably such a knob somewhere, its probably just buried and not exposed in the UI like so many things lately.

author: Buriedcode
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2017, 03:04:51 pm
content: I'm unsure why the windows 10 bashing has started - as I have stated twice so far - the settings for audio playback and recording deviceshas not changed in windows 10, and is the same as windows 7. So if you are struggling to configure your audio devices in windows 10 - reverting to windows 7 won't help.I said generally, driver updates are a good thing. What that means is, on the whole - for most users - the benefits of an updated driver outweigh the inconvenience of having to reapply certain config. Any 'crippling drivers' that have been automatically updated are generally (not always, as windows does provide a hell of a lot of drivers) the fault of the hardware manufacturer and are rare. Also, you can turn off automatic driver updates - a quick google provides several methods. Any faulty drivers can be bypassed by booting into safe mode, rolling back or uninstalling the offending driver, turning off automatic driver updates, and booting normally. Again - this also applies to windows 7.To the op - have you tried disabling the HDMI audio output in playback devices? You replied to my post, but didn't mention this. I have three displays on my PC, one of which is a large TV, I disabled the HDMI audio in playback devices and it no longer routes audio to it. This has held after many reboots and several windows updates. As has been the case since XP - right click the speaker in your in-tray, then (new to vista,7,10) playback devices.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 15, 2017, 03:14:58 pm
content: Quote from: Buriedcode on December 15, 2017, 03:04:51 pmThere is no such setting in windows 10, there is no menu to disable driver updates. AFAIK it was there deeply hidden in preview builds but then was removed.Look what microsoft offers:https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/3073930/how-to-temporarily-prevent-a-driver-update-from-reinstalling-in-windowDownloading a tool to temporarily disable update for particular device until newer version comes out.QuoteIt was already said that it won't help because devices are reenabled when drivers are reinstalled.

author: jc101
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2017, 04:04:55 pm
content: If you set the network connection to 'Metered' it appears to calm the Windows 10 updater quite a bitSettings -> Network -> Connection Properties -> Set as metered connectionDoesn't seem to cause a problem for anything else, but has helped reduce things.As for EDID tweaking you can by small EDID minders that you can set to whatever you like, I don't have one handy but have used them over the years in AV installations to get round software issues in kit caused by duff EDID data.

author: Buriedcode
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2017, 05:12:58 pm
content: Quote from: wraper on December 15, 2017, 03:14:58 pmhttps://www.howtogeek.com/223864/how-to-uninstall-and-block-updates-and-drivers-on-windows-10/Quote from: wraper on December 15, 2017, 03:14:58 pmWhich doesn't happen very often. We seem to be going round in circles here. You're suggesting that simply disabling the audio device isn't a valid solution because driver updates will reset the config - which it probably does. But unless one is getting a driver up date every day, I don't see why this is much of a problem? Also I'm not suggesting disabling drivers, I'm talking about disabling the device in the audio settings.If the OP tries the solution, and it doesn't work, or if for some reason his PC is constantly updating drivers (unlikely) then I'll drop it. But until then, try to keep on topic rather than complain about windows 10's update system. I don't particularly like it either, but they make it difficult to defer updates because time and again it is users refusing to update anything that leaves them vulnerable attack. It's not just 'security' updates, drivers updates can be considered 'security' as well.Are you you telling the OP that he shouldn't change any settings because windows will constantly update the drivers and remove settings? In that case no settings will take hold and one cannot change anything. You are confusing the issue with your own frustrations with the OS. Ones that can be mitigated if you wish.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2017, 06:06:15 pm
content: Offering driver updates is a good thing. Automatically installing them without checking with me or at least providing a convenient method to opt out of this is another thing entirely and absolutely unacceptable.As far as app support, I'm curious what needs that. I played around with the app store initially and quickly determined that it's all a bunch of useless garbage. For every "app" I looked at that might have some potential utility, there was either a proper desktop program or a website that performed the same function better. IMHO mobile apps are stripped down programs for pocket sized devices and have no place on a proper computer.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 15, 2017, 06:09:53 pm
content: Quote from: Buriedcode on December 15, 2017, 05:12:58 pmI'm pretty sure you did not read anything from that link.QuoteWhich I already wrote in the post you quoted.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 15, 2017, 06:14:37 pm
content: Quote from: Buriedcode on December 15, 2017, 05:12:58 pmIf you consider that issue happening once in a month or two is fine, then you should go work at microsoft. It happens every time GPU driver is updated which is quiet often. To me it also often rearranges desktop icons.

author: Joshsstuff
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2017, 07:11:20 pm
content: A note about Windows and Drivers.It's true that this has been a long time and ongoing issue with Windows.When you support every piece of hardware under the sun this will almost inevitably be the case(however I'm sure we have all seen the typical "Microsoft" behaviour only exacerbate the scope of this problem)You can't conclude that just because your not experiencing the same issue with updates and drivers, that the issue does not exist.I am right now typing on my home PC that has 3 monitors and I have never experienced this problem. Likewise this PC has had issues that the other has not seen.The PC I started the thread for is in my church and for some reason I've had to guide (over the phone) several people, several times through the process of correcting the issue I describe above.I'm trying to avoid this problem coming back again so I will try the practical suggestions listed here in an effort to simplify my lifelol.I just hope that any solution I try does not backfire and cause other unforeseen nuisances, only way to find out is to try it, which I will soon.Just to reiterate what I've tried so far, I have tried disabling all of the undesired Playback devices. I think I mentioned that somewhere in this thread.To clarify further, the system in question does not ever have "new" monitors or sound devices plugged in.However, the desired audio output is a PA system amplifier, and since this has an independent power switch, it is "possible" that someone can power on the PC with NO available audio device.If this is the case, a reboot does not fix the problem unfortunately.This may be the problem some of the time at least.This is one reason I was originally looking for a hardware solution, it would be great if the option to send sound elsewhere simply did not exist.I will try the suggestions posted this weekend to see if any work.Thank you for your imput gentlemen!(and any ladies I missed

author: technix
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2017, 07:12:50 pm
content: If you want to disable Windows 10 forced updates and telemetry, you need to either pirate it to switch to Windows 10 Enterprise, or pay for Windows 10 Enterprise. Cortana may be helpful but she also slurps as much of your data and send them to Microsoft, regardless of your privacy options. In fact there was even a keylogger in Cortana.

author: BrianHG
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2017, 07:45:42 pm
content: How is it that you are unable to disable, not remove, then 'Display Audio' drivers in the audio drivers section?I know in Win 7 on my laptop and PC, it works...And I switch between multiple Projectors and LCD screens. Though, perhaps Win7 remembers my selection since it is always the same 3 different HDMI devices.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 15, 2017, 07:48:25 pm
content: Quote from: BrianHG on December 15, 2017, 07:45:42 pmYou can disable, until win 10 will install a new GPU driver without asking anything.

author: RoGeorge
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2017, 08:06:59 pm
content: Quote from: wraper on December 15, 2017, 06:14:37 pmFor that problem you can install a free program named "DesktopOK". It will allow you to save or restore the icons position with only 2 clicks. It is possible to save multiple icons arrangements, and it has a few more options to modify the mouse cursor, drag mode, hide all icons, etc.

author: BrianHG
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2017, 08:16:37 pm
content: Quote from: wraper on December 15, 2017, 07:48:25 pmI guess you need Win7 so you can choose to always approve updates instead of being forced to auto-update everything.There is no such feature in Win10 to freeze your hardware configuration. I mean, what if your PC provided an important service like drive an outdoor billboard sign and such an update could potentially bring everything down.

author: LaserSteve
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2017, 04:30:11 am
content: Buy a EDID ghost from Black Box.Steve

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 17, 2017, 11:07:50 am
content: Quote from: LaserSteve on December 17, 2017, 04:30:11 am$140 for each of 3 displays?

author: Buriedcode
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2017, 03:59:28 pm
content: Quote from: Joshsstuff on December 15, 2017, 07:11:20 pmOK. So, lets recap. Monitors are permanently connected to the PC is question, and is connected to a PA system via its line out (or SPDIF?).1) Every time you boot, it routes audio to the monitors via HDMI, and possibly mutes the analogue line out, or whatever the output is for the PA. Correct?2) Disabling the HDMI output (usually "AMD output", or "NVIDIA output" depending on your GPU) in audio playback settings doesn't work? (as in no option to disable) or simply resets when you reboot (re-enabled)?3) Disabling the GPU High Definition Audio in device manager also resets when you reboot?4) You wish to be able to power up the PC, have the line out (PA) as the default output that does not change, regardless of what you do?You're right in that, just because the win10 PC's I use don't have that problem that the problem doesn't exist. There are many factors here, some branded PC's have custom setups, there are obvious differences in hardware (GPU, sound devices) and limitations (laptops). But judging by the replies, many others have similar problems, although I'm not sure what new GPU drivers re-arraging icons has to do with HDMI audio. With problems like this, there may be no solution, but it is always handy to have things to try. Even perhaps purchasing a $2 USB sound card, as that will have different drivers that may, or not may not have the same problem. Humour me with the above questions please.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 17, 2017, 04:02:12 pm
content: Quote from: Buriedcode on December 17, 2017, 03:59:28 pmYet again, apparently didn't read anything but makes assumptions.QuoteIf monitor does not support audio, you'll never see this problem.QuoteWhen GPU driver is installed (includes audio driver), default audio device settings likely will be screwed up and desktop icons probably rearranged as well.Though this problem may be not limited to a driver reinstall. Sometimes windows may just redetect the display for unknown reason, make it as new playback device set it as a default playback device as well.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2017, 04:05:02 pm
content: Maybe just use the S/PDIF output on one of the monitors if there is one? Or if there isn't, add a HDMI audio extractor?

author: The Soulman
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2017, 04:47:08 pm
content: How is the PA amplifier connected?Thru usb as a external sound device?Also had a w10 audio incident a couple of weeks ago, laptop was connected to a roland video mixer thru hdmi and the analog headphone output connected to the PA, checked in windows the playback device: headphones, all good.Opened up a power point (2016) presentation hit f5 play a video clip, no audio.Closing the presentation and re-checking playback device: hdmi output.PP 2016 is definitely also capable of adjusting all those settings, had similar issue´s with display preferences before in w10/pp2016 it's just to stupid for words.

author: bw2341
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2017, 06:38:47 pm
content: Have you already tried HDMI graphics card output to DVI monitor input? If the monitor designers were sensible, they'd have made a DVI specfic EDID on the DVI input. This would not have the EIA/CEA-861 extension block that offers HDMI audio.If the monitor designers were idiots, they'd have copied the HDMI port's EDID to the DVI port. This would allow users to use the DVI input like a second HDMI input, but it will stop you from working around this problem with a simple cable.

author: Masa
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 17, 2017, 09:07:33 pm
content: You could install a tool called "nircmd" by nirsoft.It is a command line tool that let's you change the default audio device. So you can make a bat script, that changes the default audio device to be your speakers.Then you can make an icon for the script on desktop and by clicking the icon very quickly change the audio device. Or you could even automate this to run always at startup, by putting it in scheduled tasks to run always on windows startup, so it keeps the default audio device regardless of windows updates or driver resets.I use this tool and script to toggle between TV and speakers sound and it has been working well so far. Much faster to change the audio device than by going trough all the menus.