Best place to buy Micsig STO1104C these days? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 16, 2021, 07:11:10 am
content: I've held off long enough. I've got a trip coming up where I'll be doing on-site debugging and firmware refinement, and I'll need a scope. As discussed in several other threads the STO1104C is a good choice for a truly portable, multichannel, battery powered scope with reasonable specs.But I'm having trouble finding a domestic (USA) seller, and the sellers that do pop up seem to have prices all over the place. I'm willing to pay a bit more to buy from a reliable domestic seller but none of the usual TE sources seem to carry it.Any recommendations? Thanks!

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 16, 2021, 07:13:24 am
content: Sorry for double post. I got a "database error" the first time which suggested trying again and reporting the error to "admin" if it recurred, then when I did that two copies popped up. Weird.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 16, 2021, 10:35:51 am
content: The USA doesn't seem to be well served with distributors.You can buy through Amazon:https://www.amazon.com/stores/page/49200411-033F-496E-BBCB-EF3EA82081F2

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 16, 2021, 05:45:29 pm
content: Yikes, the prices appear to have gone up a lot. $600-800 and shipping from overseas sources?EDIT: Found that the specific combination of "STO1104C + battery + 5 decoding + HDMI" is shipped by Amazon. All the other options are shipped from overseas. Still a bit shocked at the price. I thought I recalled these being in the ~$550 range.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 16, 2021, 06:49:33 pm
content: Quote from: IDEngineer on February 16, 2021, 05:45:29 pmYou said"I'm willing to pay a bit more to buy from a reliable domestic seller"With Amazon you get the garantee that you'll get a full refund if it's DOA.Quote from: IDEngineer on February 16, 2021, 05:45:29 pmYes, I got mine for that approx that much from Batronix. Batronix will ship overseas.https://www.batronix.com/shop/oscilloscopes/Micsig-STO1104C.htmlPS: I sense a business opportunity for an American here...

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 16, 2021, 07:58:58 pm
content: Yes, that's what I'm convincing myself. The "Amazon surcharge" is my insurance policy. It's worth it for something like this.QuoteIndeed. Perhaps a one-time bulk buy? See how many here would be interested, then buy a quantity direct from Micsig and share the savings.My point wasn't that Amazon was so expensive, but that overall the STO1104C seems to have gotten more expensive everywhere. I've found a few unknown sellers who ship from China in the mid-$500's but no word as to whether they include a battery, etc. I recall this device just costing less a while back, but maybe I'm mis-remembering.That said, a quick scan of USA TE vendor websites reveals that other portable scopes are either relabeled Owon's or well north of a kilobuck for a much less useful form factor (though likely much more rugged). Given those details, and the pretty positive comments here on EEVblog about this particular device, it's probably time to "just spend the money".

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 16, 2021, 08:15:10 pm
content: Hey, another quick question: What voltage/current does this expect into its charging port? I've downloaded the "manual" but it's utterly silent on that. The power supply is known to be noisy so the word on the street is to get a high quality substitute, but I can't find any reference as to what the voltage/current requirements might be.EDIT: A YouTube review suggests the power supply is 12VDC @ 5.4A. But the same review suggests it only consumes "about six watts" so that means it draws perhaps 500mA. Odd they included such a beefy supply. In any case, it sounds like a 12VDC ~1Acleansupply would do the trick.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 17, 2021, 02:43:05 am
content: Quote from: IDEngineer on February 16, 2021, 08:15:10 pmMy PSU says 12V 3A on it.

author: wolfy007
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 17, 2021, 12:01:41 pm
content: Mine says, 12v 5.4A from Delta Electronics

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 17, 2021, 12:44:06 pm
content: Quote from: wolfy007 on February 17, 2021, 12:01:41 pmMine is super efficient and has a UL listing(which checks out on the UL web site!)The scope works fine so I guess 3A is enough to show wiggly lines and charge the battery at the same time.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 17, 2021, 06:49:51 pm
content: Ordered via Amazon this morning. Amazon claims they are the fulfillment entity (meaning they have it in their stock and are shipping it, it's not being shipped by/from the seller). Strangely they estimate delivery is a week from this Friday... nine days is a very long time for a domestic shipment. I compared having them deliver it to a nearby Amazon Locker - figuring they control that delivery mechanism more completely so it should be faster - but it was exactly the same delivery date. So I went back to the convenience of having them deliver it directly to me.I'll report back once it arrives with some first impressions. I plan to use it on preparatory debugging for this upcoming trip so I gain familiarity before being on the road with it.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 24, 2021, 12:11:54 am
content: Six days later, Amazon finally shipped it. Admittedly, they're shipping it from their facility in Ft. Worth so there may have been some local issue slowing things down.Supposed to arrive next Monday. I'm planning to prop it up on the bench and use it as my primary scope to force myself to learn its user interface until the upcoming trip for which it was purchased.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 27, 2021, 12:02:04 am
content: Amazon shipped it via UPS, yet they claim it will be delivered tomorrow (Saturday). I'm interested to see how Saturday delivery via UPS works out.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2021, 03:44:44 am
content: Not surprisingly, UPS didn't deliver on Saturday - so two MORE lost days. But finally, it arrived today.Nicely packaged. Scope itself was shrink wrapped and then suspended in hard foam in its box. I've never seen a piece of T&M equipment actually shrink wrapped before.First thing I did was plug it in. Power-off battery display indicated almost fully charged, so I felt OK turning it on.Up came a rather typical Android tablet interface with a few preset icons, one of which is the oscilloscope "app", so I pressed that. It fired right up with a copyright date of 2019, which surprised me since I thought there was a later firmware/app revision and this unit was manufactured in Dec 2020 according to its calibration certificate.EDIT: It's actually 2018, so even older than I first thought.Given the rumors, I immediately looked for signs of a noisy power supply. The unit they shipped is a 12V 4A unit by HuntKey with a blue backlit "MicSig" logo on it. A bit classier than most puppy-in-the-python power supplies. I enabled and cranked up all four channels to their maximum 10mV/div sensitivity. This revealed a background noise level (open BNC's, not even shorting caps) of about 5mV/div on all four channels. Granted a 5mV background noise floor isn't lab quality. But this device isn't intended to be a reference standard at NIST. For field work 5mV is fine.Channels 1 and 2 have a slightly discernable ~71KHz sine-ish wave riding on +1-2mV of DC, while channels 3 and 4 appear random and centered on 0V. I figured the sine-ish wave was the power supply, but nope - disconnecting the supply madezero differencein the display. Granted the battery shouldn't be drawing much charge current so perhaps things get worse when heavy charging is occurring. But so far I'm not concerned about the power supply. Plugging in the supply does cause a large glitch in the on-screen traces which was a little surprising, but that would be a foolish thing to do if you were making real 10mV measurements so it's not really a fair gripe.The fan is very quiet, when it's on at all. All four channels are enabled, and the A/D is running at its full 1GSa/sec (250MSa/sec per channel) so it should be working its hardest. I do have both the wired and wireless network interfaces disabled, which I presume depowers them (this is a tablet, after all) so that perhaps saves some dissipation. When the fan is on the emitted air is not noticeably warmer than ambient. Later: The fan finally stopped cycling and stayed on continuously, so perhaps the unit's internal temperature takes a while to stabilize. The emitted air is still no warmer than ambient.Display viewing angle is a big issue with this device, so I checked that too. The comments about straight-on viewing are accurate... normal to the display is about as "low" as you want your eyes to be. Below that 90 degree position things like the graticule and "shadow features" of the layout fade away first, but you can still use the brightly colored aspects like the traces and numerics. For field work, this means to me that if you find your head a bit too low it's not immediately useless; if that's your new extended viewing position you might want to rearrange, but for quick sanity checks you can see the traces just fine down to perhaps -45 degrees below horizontal.Display brightness seems reasonable. In a brightly lit room it's very comfortable at about 75%. Not sure what will happen in direct sunlight but that's hard for any display.One thing that immediately jumped out was the mismatch between channel 1's yellow trace color and its legend data on the right edge of the screen. The legend data is a sort of army green, not yellow. Indeed, all of the legend colors are shaded significantly darker than their associated traces, which is a weird user interface choice. This means channel 1 (army green) and channel 4 (darkish green) aren't that different. Depending upon how you have the traces arranged on the screen there's some room for misunderstanding.The button layout is reasonable and it's already becoming second nature. One unexpected detail is that while there are multiple Menu buttons, the one in the Trigger group actually brings up not just the Trigger menu but all other menus too. You can select the actual Trigger menu, but across the top you can select the Measure, Save, Sample, Display, etc. menus too. You can invoke/dismiss the menu system by swiping down/up at the top of the screen, and thankfully the app designers did it right: If you recall the menu by swiping it remembers which submenu you were in, but if you recall the menu with the Trigger group's Menu button it snaps back to the Trigger submenu. A big THANK YOU to whomever made sure that little detail was done properly!I just now discovered something I don't like: You can reposition a channel by swiping it up and down. Guess what happened when I swiped away the menu? Channel 2 got swiped to the top of the screen. That's annoying. Hopefully the user interface allows you to disable that "feature".Those are my first impressions. As mentioned earlier, I'm going to set this in front of my primary scope and use it instead for the next little while which will allow me to put it through some paces. So far it's the best packaged portable scope I've used. Four digital channels of 100MHz with 1GSa/sec in a battery powered, hand-held form factor... what's not to like?

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2021, 03:31:58 pm
content: Quote from: IDEngineer on March 02, 2021, 03:44:44 amMine doesn't have that.Quote from: IDEngineer on March 02, 2021, 03:44:44 amThe first of many things you'll find as you use it.Quote from: IDEngineer on March 02, 2021, 03:44:44 amYou don't have to swipe to get rid of the menu, just touch the screen anywhere below it.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2021, 04:40:28 pm
content: I'm in a quandry. When I was shopping for this unit, I (thought I) looked at all the major T&M vendors in the US market and the Micsig units were hard to find. So I paid $720 on Amazon (fulfilled by Amazon) for this STO1104C. Today I find that Saelig is offering the more advanced version, the STO1104E Plus, for $659. Given the shipping delays, I could order the E Plus version and still make the business trip.

author: ResistorRob
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2021, 04:48:47 pm
content: Quote from: IDEngineer on February 16, 2021, 05:45:29 pmI could swear that a while back these were $500 on eBay. The night I planned on buying one I was doing research on which specific model to get, and went to the MicSig website which was down completely. I wasn't sure if they went out of business and didn't know if I could get product support. Spooked me from buying one, so I started looking at other options. I haven't thought about that scope much since, but definitely seems to have gone up in price.I once watched a video about the psychology of pricing, and how sales of video game consoles drop off sharply after $400. I must be part of that herd mentality, because of right now I would snap one up at $400 but not more than that. I think it's definitely worth $550 or $600 but if I got one now it would be a second scope and not my main one, so it's value to me is diminished. Initially I was looking at it not for mobility, but instead for the touchscreen. Currently saving my pennies for a Siglent SDS2000+ which ticks all the boxes of everything I need, so if I got a MicSig it would be for it's portability and ability to be used detached from mains power.Anyway, after some use write a mini review of what you think of it. Would be interested to hear your thoughts.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2021, 04:57:14 pm
content: Quote from: IDEngineer on March 02, 2021, 04:40:28 pmIf you can return it 'no questions asked' then why not? Getting a better unit for a lower price is a no-brainer. DO IT!

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2021, 05:33:46 pm
content: Quote from: ResistorRob on March 02, 2021, 04:48:47 pmI agree. Not sure what happened with the pricing but there's definitely been an uptick. Perhaps they got popular and the distribution chain realized they could raise the price?

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2021, 05:36:03 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on March 02, 2021, 04:57:14 pmThat's the way I'm leaning. User rickv14623 has already responded with the Saelig discount code (not sure what percentage it yields) and confirmed the unit ships with four probes despite their webpage saying only two. I've asked about their shipping speed - I need this unit for that upcoming business trip - and presuming they can get it here to Idaho promptly I'm going to order the E Plus. I would have done that in the first place but I swear when I checked all the T&M sites Saelig didn't have it in stock at that time.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2021, 06:03:31 pm
content: Just ordered from Saelig after getting a free UPS return label from Amazon and boxing up the older unit. Saved $144 (~23%) in the process AND got the later version.Big thanks to Saelig and user rickv14623 for making this a VERY streamlined transaction this morning. I see that Saelig is based in NY, which means the unit has to make it all the way across the continent... I'm hoping they ship today! I will post again when their unit arrives and report on the differences I see between them. I'm suspecting a later firmware revision, for example.Again, THANK YOU to rickv14623 and Saelig!

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2021, 06:34:45 pm
content: Quote from: IDEngineer on March 02, 2021, 05:33:46 pmAround here they've gone down massively. I thought I got a bargain on mine in October. They were cheaper than on Aliexpress and Germany lowered their sales tax due to COVID. Now they're 100 Euros cheaper even though sales tax went back up:https://www.batronix.com/shop/oscilloscopes/Micsig-STO1104C.html

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 02, 2021, 09:01:27 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on March 02, 2021, 06:34:45 pmMicsig may have had some production issues or something. The distribution chain seems affected for sure, which may be why I couldn't find any from Saelig nor others at first, which drove me to Amazon.One reason I justified returning the original unit was that, despite Amazon openly stating they had fulfillment responsibility and could ship immediately, they took something like a WEEK to ship it... and then it took three days longer than promised in transit to actually arrive! The timing was already tight for my trip, and then when I found Saelig's lower price for more features the correct answer became obvious.I just got the email saying Saelig has already shipped it, too. Top notch service!

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 12, 2021, 02:05:31 am
content: The E version arrived today!I've just unboxed it, plugged in the power supply, and turned it on. So far things look generally the same... roughly the same peak to peak noise on all four channels, zero effect with the power supply connected or not, etc.That ~71KHz sine wave is thankfully absent on channels 1 and 2 on this unit. Channels 3 and 4 didn't have it on the original "C" version and it's not visible here either. So this unit's vertical amps are, if anything, cleaner than the original unit.The app software has the same 2018 date. For all I know it's identical between the two devices, and just checks its hardware environment each time it's initialized.The power supply is the same brand and specs, but has swapped the blue backlit Micsig logo for a simple, embossed, non-backlit name of the supply manufacturer ("HuntKey"). I miss the cool little Micsig logo but not enough to downgrade back to the "C" version of the scope!It's now sitting in front of my regular bench scope. I'm going to let it burn in for a couple of hours before doing anything serious with it. More soon!

author: hgjdwx
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 12, 2021, 04:35:49 am
content: In a few months (maybe two months), the new STO2000C will be available, with 300MB bandwidth, 2GB sampling rate, 280MB storage depth, 270K refresh rate, segment storage, but also more than double the price of the 1000C, and only two channels

author: 2N3055
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 12, 2021, 10:11:21 am
content: Quote from: hgjdwx on March 12, 2021, 04:35:49 amWill they port back segmented acuquistions to STO1104C ??That would be very nice..

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 12, 2021, 07:34:50 pm
content: Starting to test things on the STO1104E Plus.Does anyone know if this unit has a "record and playback" feature? I can't find one in the PDF manual (which isn't all that comprehensive anyway, doesn't even have a "specifications" section). Seems like with 70Mpts of memory and ~700 waveform display pixels across the 800x600 display it should be possible to record 10K "screen widths" worth of history, then scroll back through that to review results. But so far the only way I've found to do that is set the horizontal rate low enough and that directly interacts with "visible" frequency response.

author: 2N3055
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 12, 2021, 07:46:01 pm
content: Quote from: IDEngineer on March 12, 2021, 07:34:50 pmThat is called segmented mode, and no it doesn't have it. That is what I asked about. It would be great upgrade for the scope-

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 12, 2021, 08:13:10 pm
content: AFAIK segmented memory allows you to ONLY "spend memory" on trigger events, rather than all of the potentially useless dead time between events. Yes, that would be nice.But in this case I'd be happy with just "record everything after 1) the first event that satisfies the trigger, or 2) user presses button X". Basically, set up the sample rate and the display as desired, then just store until the 70M samples have been captured or the user stops the recording. Continuous recording, even between trigger events, would be OK. You could play off sample rate against record length as necessary, based on the bandwidth of the signals in question.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 12, 2021, 08:23:12 pm
content: Quote from: IDEngineer on March 12, 2021, 08:13:10 pmThe Migsig lets you set the memory depth manually under the last menu entry at the top (Is it called "Other", I don't have it in front of me). You can tell it to record the entire 70Mb if you want to.After that you just zoom/pan to your heart's content.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 12, 2021, 08:32:12 pm
content: Ahhh, there we go. Thank you! Works great. True segmented operation would of course be an improvement but this will cover 80% of what I need to do when debugging in the field.Again, thanks!

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2021, 06:21:36 pm
content: Quick note from this morning.I applied the included screen protector. I'm pretty good at doing this and got it installed with zero particulates, zero air bubbles, etc. It looks perfect. It's matte finish so it helps with glare, though that's always a tradeoff with clarity and sharpness. It definitely worsen the viewing angle issue... now you REALLY need to be above zero vertical degrees to properly see everything.I was very pleasantly surprised that a screen protector was even included. They're not expensive, but it's a "little thing" that many products neglect to include. Props to Micsig for providing it.That said, this particular one is especially sensitive to smearing. Any touch on the screen at all, even with meticulously clean fingertips, leaves marks.The combination of the loss of clarity (again, an understandable tradeoff for antiglare) with the smear factor almost convinced me to remove the protector. However, for now, I'm going to leave it on and see how it goes.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2021, 09:26:59 pm
content: I much prefer it with the protector. I'm definitely a "matte screen" type of person (hate all those shiny computer screens) and it really works for that.I can't say I've noticed the fingerprints that much.

author: DaneLaw
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 15, 2021, 11:09:13 am
content: Yep a no-brainer if you can get the E variant for even less.. a tad higher capturerate and more memory depth while everything else is the same..Its the E variant I reckon they are testing here with around 137.000 capture rate. (1.45m in the clip)I got the C variant with battery and bag in 1Q 2020 and on that it seems to be around 95.000 to 100.000 wfps 95k to 100k freq... (highest reading was 103k).at least on my crude test-setup with a DSO from MiniWare // STO1004C waveformcapture test: .https://i.imgur.com/wFNDOf0.mp4Are those wfps-value align with what other users are getting on their Micsig scope-units and who have two full-fledged scopes to test the optimal wfps margins..?and no doubt that the prices on the Micsig scopes vary a lot... - when I looked into them from EU resellers like Batronix a year or two back.. it was a tad under 800Euro (950USD) for the battery variant, and then the price would likely be even higher when I logged in from Denmark and danish adresss with 25% danish VAT in regards to 19% in Germany.And where I mostly recall it was around 550 to 600USD (not Euro) on eBay..and then I suddenly saw I could purchase it from Banggood with a coupon I had on hold, to around 430USSD and then another -5% cashback to ones Paypal, so a final price coming in just a tad over 400USD which seemed to god to be true.I also told some friends later after I got my unit about this purchase and they could not replicate it at that price, Banggood changed their system soon after, so the use of coupon now changes the price to something else and way higher, that you then get the percentage from.(and a practise that other wholesalers like Gearbest also uses, and who makes it very non-transparent)MY unit arrived with all the options included, though the 1553B and 429 seem uninstalled.also purchased the Micsig bag, were a tad under 30UD delivered.but overall been very happy with it.MY PSU is the standard UL listed 5.4A noisy fellow.But I tend to always use these 90w 18650x8cell power banks with adjustable 3v to 25v + QC fastcharge and Power delivery..so a TypeC 12v decoy cable to barrel DC, and the scope just asks for 12v, when i use any PD-able power bank.The scope uses under or around 30w while in use and charging, so the native 65watt PSU is massive overkill.There looks to be slight variations on the STO-C-line.. the newer version seems to use a soft plastic-end handle (intended for one-handed use), while my unit. have one of these detachable velcro-handle with some plastic PU leather-look-alike.I tend to use that pouch there is in between the layers, to store a few of the probe tips and it obviously not intended for that.. but it works when Im only having 1 or two probes active out of the 4 channel and that doesn't seem to figure on the newer variant, that I'm not even sure you can take off / adjust?.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 15, 2021, 03:00:47 pm
content: I can't seem to find the carrying case for sale anywhere, so I'm hunting for generic alternatives.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 15, 2021, 04:28:07 pm
content: Quote from: IDEngineer on March 15, 2021, 03:00:47 pmYour best bet is to email Micsig and ask. They'll probably send you one direct.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 15, 2021, 05:58:17 pm
content: A responsive company? That's unexpectedly delightful! I'll reach out as you suggest. Thanks!EDIT: Email sent to sales@micsig.com.EDIT2: Lightning fast reply! Micsig will ship the bag direct via DHL for USD 99.00, which honestly seems a bit steep. I'm going to explore eBay options first. Micsig also recommended checking with another US distributor, momysh.com, but their website goes dead when you click on the Micsig bag link so no joy there.

author: DaneLaw
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 15, 2021, 06:03:11 pm
content: There are a few you can choose.I got this STO-valid-one from China and the wholesaler Banggood..https://www.banggood.com/custlink/DmvYZ7NwzQthere looks to be a tool-coupon that takes another -15% off with free shipping to Denmark' so the final price in my case would be 43½US-15%= 38USD (with another -5% in Papypal Cashback).But there is other variants from Micsig, though if they will play along with STO.. ? cant say.the EU reseller batronix have two other versions of Micsig tablet-bags, one out of stock intended for tBook, and the other looks to be the TO-minibaghttps://www.batronix.com/php/index.php?cmd=find&loc=en&query=micsig+bagthen you at least have some models, you can judge size and what you wanna pursue when asking Micsig in regards to US resellers.The top bag I got, here you have an adjustable far-right-compartment that you can adjust with velcro on each side., for the PSU etc..

author: electr_peter
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 15, 2021, 07:42:18 pm
content: Quote from: DaneLaw on March 15, 2021, 06:03:11 pmAccording to Batronix, "Micsig BAG tbook miniTIP" holds Micsig STO1000 series with no issues.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 15, 2021, 09:06:23 pm
content: Quote from: IDEngineer on March 15, 2021, 05:58:17 pmI've written to them four or five times and they've always replied same-day.I messed up my screen protector so I wanted another one. Their shipping department messed up and delayed the order a few weeks so they sent me two protectors to make up for it.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 15, 2021, 09:07:50 pm
content: Quote from: electr_peter on March 15, 2021, 07:42:18 pmMine's the minibad and it holds the scope + power supply inside (there's a moveable velcro separator) and the probes go in the outside pocket.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 15, 2021, 09:20:23 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on March 15, 2021, 09:06:23 pmI buy tablet screen protectors as raw material all the time. That gives me material I can cut to any size and shape, AND I get to pick the characteristics of the protector material (gloss vs. matte, thin vs. thick, etc.). So if you need another replacement someday, you're not beholden to just Micsig's OEM part.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 15, 2021, 09:22:32 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on March 15, 2021, 09:07:50 pmHmm... Batronix says the original carry case is no longer available. I sure hope it just means it's not available from THEM... I vastly prefer its style compared to the "big overflap" minibad.EDIT: See above for results of my email to Micsig. VERY fast response.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2021, 04:10:11 am
content: Quote from: IDEngineer on March 15, 2021, 05:58:17 pmTold you!Quote from: IDEngineer on March 15, 2021, 05:58:17 pmThat's a lot, I paid 35 Euros for mine.I bet half of that is DHL.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2021, 04:13:27 am
content: I'm going to try a laptop sleeve. The scope is thicker than a laptop but a slightly too large sleeve will likely work, and I can 3D print an end cap to add protection for the knobs.

author: DaneLaw
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2021, 05:35:20 pm
content: Quote from: IDEngineer on March 15, 2021, 09:22:32 pmQuote from: IDEngineer on March 15, 2021, 05:58:17 pmJust so there is no confusion as it doesn't look like you saw that you could get it, as your clearly not in the market for the flap-variant Micsig bag.- I reckon it's the zippertop-variant above from my post #38 your pursuing ?? then it will of course be ludicrous to pay anywhere around 99USD (85euro) from Micsig China and the quote they seem to give you' when you can get it for a tad over 30Euro (also from China' and the specific Micsig-wholesaler (#38) there seem to have them in stock' as I pointed out above..Though' can only guess if BG will ship to the USA, free of charge and if the price is the same, though usually is, or cheaper, - and sure an old thick laptop-bag, will also fit the purpose, and likely be way cheaper to an extent of no cost, recall Mike took that approach with the first TO-variant until he got the specific zipper-bag, that I link & highlighted above.If you pursuing these thin Neoprene sleeves, be careful with the screen on the scope, as I doubt there is any reinforced Gorilla-like glass on the Micsig scopes and the risk of crack by uneven pressure or blow' and the thin incl. matte screen sticker is not gonna change that, mostly for scratches & glare.3.20minutes in.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2021, 05:57:07 pm
content: Quote from: DaneLaw on March 16, 2021, 05:35:20 pmAgreed, which is why I'm thinking of 3D printing a snap-over cover for the front of the scope (like most bench scopes have). Not sure the printbed of my largest 3D printer will be large enough but I can likely find one to use. There are lots of places around the perimeter of the scope to "grab" for a cover like this, and once it's in the bag it will stay in place on its own anyway. Probably can just fit it over the face of the scope and slide it into the bag with no mechanical retention at all.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2021, 06:01:34 pm
content: Any ideas on if/how to remove the ground lead from the Micsig probes? It's attached via a ring instead of the usual clip. Trying to slide it off towards the tip looks like it will disassemble the probe itself so I'm not too anxious to force that.When using the (included) spring contacts for the signal and ground, the ground lead just flaps around and gets in the way, always looking for something to short to ground. It would be nice to remove the ground leads when they're not being used.

author: electr_peter
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 17, 2021, 04:21:30 pm
content: Quote from: IDEngineer on March 15, 2021, 09:22:32 pmI have ordered "Micsig BAG tbook mini" (style with flap) bag for STO1000 series (one with knobs) from Batronix, but I received bag with zippers which is more convenientI thought Batronix did not have this bag style in stock, but it seems they do. Ask them directly if need one, they provide excellent service.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 20, 2021, 05:17:50 pm
content: Continuing to use the STO1104E Plus. So far I'm really happy with it.Somewhat discouraged that no one replied to my question about removing the ground leads from the Micsig probes. I'd really like to be able to do that.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 20, 2021, 05:23:42 pm
content: Quote from: IDEngineer on March 20, 2021, 05:17:50 pmOn mine the clips are attached to a ring that slides off if you push it towards the tip of the probe.Above the ring there's a black plastic tube that comes off as well, you can put that back on afterwards to make it neat and tidy.Edit: More photosbelow...

author: electr_peter
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 20, 2021, 07:53:54 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on March 20, 2021, 05:23:42 pmHow much force do you apply? It seems that I will break a probe doing this

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 20, 2021, 08:16:56 pm
content: Quote from: electr_peter on March 20, 2021, 07:53:54 pmNot huge amounts. I just sort of squeeze behind the ring with thumb/finger and it moves upwards.Does your ring rotate freely around the probe? I think the difficult part is to get the plastic sleeve above the ring moving. Try twisting that first to see if it loosens a bit.Think: If your probes come with springs then the clipMUSTcome off somehow.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 20, 2021, 08:58:40 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on March 20, 2021, 08:16:56 pmThat's what I thought too, but the forces involved made me pause.Based on comments here, I went ahead just now and pulled off 1) the hook tip, 2) the plastic sleeve, and finally 3) the ground ring. That plastic sleeve took a LOT of force to remove, which is why I was asking if there was another method of removing the ground lead... pulling off that plastic seriously felt like I was going to break something.I suspect if I made a habit of removing that plastic sleeve it would "get easier" (read: degrade) with time and start being too loose. At the moment I believe this probe is NOT intended for casual removal of the ground lead. For now I will just bite the alligator clip back onto the ring's strain relief. That will keep it out of the way electrically and, to some degree, mechanically. If it proves too much of a PITA I can always buy a few 200 MHz passive probes to use instead of the Micsig ones.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 21, 2021, 12:28:51 am
content: Quote from: IDEngineer on March 20, 2021, 08:58:40 pmMaybe it's stiff the first time but I don't think it's any more likely to wear out than one of the other designs of probe.Maybe you could leave it permanently off on one of them (eg. channel 4).

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 21, 2021, 12:47:01 am
content: Quote from: Fungus on March 21, 2021, 12:28:51 amI had the same thought. We'll see how often it becomes an issue. This is my "field scope" so I don't expect to be doing super precision work with it where the ground lead would be removed a lot, but it occurred to me because I'm using it as my bench scope right now to gain familiarity and I definitely do "spring tip" stuff here.

author: DaneLaw
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 21, 2021, 03:49:50 am
content: Thx for the hint about the ability to remove ground #51 and yep pretty straightforward to disassemble the probes for the ground-lead with the info present above.Gonna use one of my 4 probes for that purpose, and be able to fx hook thirdparty-clip to the bare ground-metal on the probe, or use the short bundled ground-spring.

author: voltsandjolts
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 21, 2021, 09:44:38 am
content: Could you please stop linking to external image hosting sites and instead embed images here in the forum.Links inevitably go dead at some point, leaving a disjointed mess on the forum, looking at you PhotoBucket.Thank you.

author: DaneLaw
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 21, 2021, 11:12:27 am
content: Quote from: voltsandjolts on March 21, 2021, 09:44:38 amcalm down and stop trying to moderating... you ain't. !!and you seem confused since you think this is Photobucket.it ain't !!This is imgur old private proaccount and where imgur has put its whole backbone in storage forever .- though such a label is wide and shall IMO be taking with an intent of forever storage and no decade deadline etc, but imgur whole backbone is account-storage-hosting-forever and that people will use their hosting, for forums, as their whole backbone is with this mediaforumhosting-service in mind...Here you can read, one of IMGUR employs claim of forever storage, no timedeadline.https://webapps.stackexchange.com/questions/75993/how-long-does-imgur-store-uploaded-imagesbut like everything here in life, no guarantees things can crack..and exactly the same with YT vids, third-party, Alphabet inc hosting' that can go haywire, just as video-hosting on imgur, and their ltd 1 min,that is also with the intent on forever storage.But you seem to think it's Photobucket for some strange reason, so maybe get ur things straight.. - if you don't know it, there is quite a difference on these mediahosting sites, and what market they prioritize.But as I emphasized your not a moderator here, so if you have more to say take it by PM.Here you can see the topic, & also Dave's reply on how much he can store & host and also link to other of his replies #32.. and Dave in #39https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/best-way-to-post-pictures-on-eevblog/in this +7-year-old thread, also many that uses imgur and all these pictures like +7 years are all still present with the use of direct links..and again voltsandjolts' it aint "photobucket" like you seem to think' or one of those 3 or 6 months anonymous hosting sites.. its a registered account on Imgur' that plays & live on the intent on storage forever..And here you can see Dave's reply in another thread on IMGUR (link from #32).https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/how-to-include-images-in-a-post/msg298456/#msg298456back on track, cheers,.

author: voltsandjolts
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 21, 2021, 11:34:34 am
content: Oh dear. Having a bad Sunday?I said "looking at you Photobucket", alluding to their fiasco, as described herehttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PhotobucketIt was a suggestion, you carry on as you wish, with the low SNR.

author: DaneLaw
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 21, 2021, 11:44:05 am
content: Quote from: voltsandjolts on March 21, 2021, 11:34:34 amHmm sure buddy' You're a funny guy...https://youtu.be/r_DwZfyXAXI?t=60(nope' explaining & linking to context' doesn't mean people pr say having a bad day, It's usually quite the contrary, otherwise they would just ignore).But always a good start if you wanna dictate or guide other people on forum behavior, that you at least get your facts straight, - as I emphasized there is quite a difference from one to the next when it comes to these media hosting sites.and numerous forums, do indulge the exact use of imgur for their "forever-claims" and the ease of in-house hosting-amount' particularly media-content like videos and pictures.Though problems can occure with the use of specific BB-codes if those changes, but direct native-links shouldn't.Lets get back on track..cheers.Jakob

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 21, 2021, 05:57:50 pm
content: Quote from: voltsandjolts on March 21, 2021, 09:44:38 amUnfortunately adding pictures to the forum has been fixed and then got broken over and over again. I've given up on it as well and started using Flickr again.

author: DaneLaw
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 23, 2021, 04:45:10 am
content: Also wondered about Flickr, and believe it is Dave's prefered image-hosting platform for his high resolution picturs though with pro-acc..https://www.flickr.com/photos/eevblog/Remembered Flickr had been flipped a year or two back to SmugMug, and so-called "new owner" is something that can change previous incentives on fx long time picture-storage, and Flickr's new owner actually implemented very soon after acquiring Flickr' to delete pictures for non-paying customers that stored more than 1000pictures on their account as of 2Q 2019, and it was under 1 year after Flickr were purchased by them 2Q 2018 ..https://www.flickr.com/help/forum/en-us/72157678376733808/-https://techcrunch.com/2019/12/19/flickr-owner-smugmug-emails-subscribers-with-an-urgent-request-help-us-find-more-paying-users/If it has changed since' I dont know, but Flickr's media size-limits is also way way higher then Imgur.On Flickr the media size is like 200MB pr picture and 1GB pr video.(max 3min) that's a lot.On Imgur it is a fraction of Flickr's sizemargins with only 20MB pr picture and 1/10 of Flickr and only 200MB pr video or GIF (max 1 min) so the size-amount is obvious way less om IMGur.I'm not familiar with that any of them support raw, I doubt it., - I just tried with a DJI MA2 19.7MB JPEG 8000x6144 picture over Christiania Copenhagen to IMGur and right-click to download / save it again and it was then merely 5MB though still in native resolution' so quite aggresive 1/4 conversion in play.https://tinyurl.com/cmvecy9h[Sorry about the OT.]

author: electr_peter
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 23, 2021, 04:38:01 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on March 20, 2021, 08:16:56 pmWith twisting motion ground clip and plastic near probe tip became looser and I was able to remove ground clip easily. Trick is twisting, not force.Not sure about long term reliability, but it should work for few years at least with no issues.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 23, 2021, 07:00:00 pm
content: Quote from: electr_peter on March 23, 2021, 04:38:01 pmYep. The trick is to get the tube to start moving.Here's another photo for anybody who's still unclear on how they come apart:Here it is with clip removed, tube replaced and the spring attached:Remember that twisting the spring in one direction tightens it and in the other direction loosens it. You should only twist in the "loosen" direction when attaching/removing the spring.Quote from: electr_peter on March 23, 2021, 04:38:01 pmIt seems at least as reliable as the ones with the metal fork system.If you're worried you can rotate between your four probes every 25 removals.For delicate work this system might be better then the other one - there's no finger guard to get in the way so you can hold the probe further down.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 23, 2021, 07:27:55 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on March 21, 2021, 05:57:50 pmI've never had a problem.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2021, 12:02:28 am
content: Been using the STO1104E as my primary bench scope for a while so it felt like time to comment again.My overall impression continues to be positive. I haven't yet had to fire up one of the "formal" bench scopes to do anything, so for normal hardware/firmware development it's doing a great job.Three things that caught my attention:* It was not obvious how to select the non-default cursor and reposition it with the control knob(s). Seems like the upper two knobs would automatically control the two cursors for the cursor mode (horizontal or vertical) most recently selected, but instead the knob labeled "X" is always associated with vertical and the knob labeled "Y" is always associated with horizontal. This means that when just one set of cursors is enabled, the "other" knob is nonfunctional. Maybe it's just me, but my most common usage of the cursors is one set or the other so it would have been more useful to have both knobs operational even when only one set of cursors was enabled. To switch which cursors are controlled by the pair of knobs, you'd just select that set of cursors again. Not a huge deal, and maybe they did some testing and this was the preferred approach. What DID confuse me was I couldn't figure out how to get the single knob (per pair of cursors) to control the second cursor. Turns out you just touch the cursor you wish to control. A reasonable choice but I don't use this like a touchscreen scope so it honestly never occurred to me until I looked it up in the manual.* The battery charge level is reported differently at different times. I was using it on battery only and it shut itself off. When I turned it back on, it reported 44% battery - which seemed like a very high threshold for auto-shutoff! But then I cycled power and checked it again and it reported 12%.* This brings up the third issue. There seems to be a large portion of the standard Android OS menu system hidden on this scope. For example, when I select "Settings" I get a very limited menu that does not include anything related to the battery. Yet if I search in Settings for "Battery", several options come up and selecting those presents the typical Android human interface for that area of the Settings menu. So far I haven't found where the battery thresholds for auto-shutoff are hidden because I haven't figured out what magic text sequence you need to search on to have it revealed. I only found the Battery area by searching on it, Battery Saver is only visible with a search, etc.These are all small issues WRT the normal use of the scope. Again, overall I'm very pleased and have no strong complaints. If I could revert its Android OS behavior back to the standard that would eliminate most of my concerns.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2021, 02:38:39 am
content: Quote from: IDEngineer on June 03, 2021, 12:02:28 amYou can also push the knob to cycle between A/B/AB(AB=both together).Quote from: IDEngineer on June 03, 2021, 12:02:28 amYou can drag them around individually or use a two finger gesture to move both at the same time.You also get fine control of the last thing you touched using the two "Fine" buttons at the bottom of the screen. They change to horizontal/vertical depending on what you touch.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2021, 03:10:39 am
content: Dang, I don't know how I missed that press-the-knob rotation. I did try pressing the knobs, but all I ever got was either the original cursor or both. Somehow I missed the "other" cursor. But I just tried it and it works perfectly. Thank you for that tip!As for the fine control... on mine the fine buttons are equal to a single click of the knobs. So no reason to let loose of the knobs, just click instead of tapping the screen. If there's a way to enter a "fine mode" that I'm missing please let me know.Thanks again!