What is wrong with using a balloon ? Instead of this ... - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: BravoV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2020, 06:51:55 am
content: Assuming the internet connection will be serving people below it, for a "period" thats longer than the drone's battery charge, besides isn't that using a balloon is a lot-lot cheaper & reliable ? Say an "anchored" balloon that stay floating a certain optimal height.->Flying cellphone towers: Could drones bring internet coverage to remote areas?Cmiiw

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2020, 07:00:57 am
content: What qualifies as a remote area ?Solar powered permanent data relay installation ~1km from me:

author: BravoV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2020, 07:07:43 am
content: Quote from: tautech on February 20, 2020, 07:00:57 amWell, that is even better, but for the sake of argument, say its not for permanent, still a balloon is much-much cheaper and reliable for hanging those electronics way above there, right ?

author: nali
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2020, 07:08:28 am
content: Hmm.. I wonder if that's what Treez is working on?

author: BravoV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2020, 07:09:14 am
content: Quote from: nali on February 20, 2020, 07:08:28 am

author: beanflying
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2020, 07:10:23 am
content: Drone for a more or less permanent radio link is STUPID and smacks of someone looking for free media and company PRWind Blown Sand, dirt let alone dust devils and storms pick your weather phenomenon/disaster to screw it all up in an instant. Not to mention taking potshots at it would be good sport in a lot of the developed world let alone in remote lesser developed areasBalloons leak and need topping off or refilling frequently and gas is expensive. Same sitting target issue applies and even more so the weather. There is a benefit to balloons in simplicity but they lose out in other areas.Satellites for voice and even data if you have to is still the cost effective option and if you can get line of sight then build a tower.

author: babysitter
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2020, 07:18:12 am
content: ... stupid balloons are too easy !... stupid balloons can be used as reflectors without anything! (Echo 1)... stupid balloons can be nearly permanent when gas fill is under control and a low leak hull is used! (metallized mylar as used for echo 1 accidentally is)... stupid balloons are cheap!... stupid balloons are a bad buzzword for VC money!

author: BravoV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2020, 07:20:17 am
content: Quote from: beanflying on February 20, 2020, 07:10:23 amQuoting the article ...The drones cost from $40,000...Even though I don't have any experience with ballooning ... I'm pretty confident with balloon will be much-much cheaper, including the maintenance, and that includes the cost to pay the human to maintain it that is relatively cheap in Africa, especially the skill set needed is much more simpler than maintaining the whole drones and it's supporting stuffs.

author: beanflying
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2020, 07:27:27 am
content: I have done some playing with Kite/Balloon hybrids in my former life (pre drone availability) for photography. They are not a device for 24/7 and ignore it use.While there is some self interested BS here worth a read on assisted balloons for liftinghttp://www.allsopp.co.uk/index.php?mod=page&id_pag=56This graphic is fairly much why simple balloons are dumb as well.

author: BravoV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2020, 07:35:10 am
content: Quote from: babysitter on February 20, 2020, 07:18:12 amAs this is in Africa, I suspect its more toward corruption for draining the gov. money, instead of VC money.Imagine a conversation of a corrupted high gov. official with his kid ...... "Dad, I love to play drones whole day for all my life, but I crashed it again, please buy more ..."... "Damn it, those are really expensive son, ok, but I have a smart idea, lets make some serious money, while you will have almost unlimited supply of new drones, cause I'm in the task of reviewing, making policy in improving our country's network coverage"...

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2020, 07:41:39 am
content: Quote from: BravoV on February 20, 2020, 07:07:43 amThe HW doesn't weigh much, say 40kg tops but the batteries and solar panels are an entirely different matter.This is a point to point backhaul link of some 400MB/s capability consuming 25-30W.Want some decent data throughput only cell towers connected to fiber can offer that and with your proposed balloon how on earth do you keep your HW orientated correctly ?At least a GPS capable drone has a chance of keeping HW pointing in the right direction

author: BravoV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2020, 07:46:16 am
content: Quote from: tautech on February 20, 2020, 07:41:39 amI thought Google use this balloon tech ?

author: Cyberdragon
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2020, 08:29:34 am
content: You can still have horizontal propellers on a ballon for orientation (basically like a powered hot air ballon but on all sides) that would be a lot less power than using them for lift and stability.

author: shakalnokturn
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 21, 2020, 10:40:44 pm
content: Drones would have to spend a lot of energy just to keep aloft a big part of which because of the on-board backup battery.Balloons obviously need less energy to stay up but could need quite a lot more energy than drones for position compensation when there's wind.How about inflatable pylons? They would still need some active compensation to keep the long distance radio link aligned.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 21, 2020, 10:46:39 pm
content: A balloon doesn't have to be expensive.It is idiotic to waste precious helium in unmanned balloons. Hydrogen is cheap, widely available, renewable and offers greater lifting capacity than helium. The flammability limits its use in manned vehicles but the small risk of a mini-Hindenberg disaster is not an issue for a payload of commodity electronics.

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 22, 2020, 02:02:40 pm
content: Quote from: shakalnokturn on February 21, 2020, 10:40:44 pmYes. And constant operation 24/7? Not sure the damn things would last for very long.Quote from: shakalnokturn on February 21, 2020, 10:40:44 pmIndeed. Some people are apparently going to discover there is such a thing as wind. Even big drones would just be busted by some moderately strong wind.Oh, and not to mention potential collisions with birds.So for both energy and wind issues, I don't see how any flying device could be a permanent solution meant to operate 24/7/I don't even get the benefits?What's wrong with poles? The only potential benefit of a flying object compared to a pole is that it can move and is not fixed, so the benefit would be to serve areas temporarily - I'm not sure I get the point. What's the use case? If it's going to be permanent, just install a fucking pole.Anyway, it's just the fricking trend these days: instead of trying to solve real problems with existing technology - starting with the problem, people are now just willing to apply existing technology to anything - taking the reverse approach: take technology first, apply it second. Same shit with AI, cloud and many other things. We're not trying to solve problems, we're just trying to find more applications for trendy tech, even when that doesn't seem to make any sense.