Has Windows become Spyware? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Karel
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2023, 08:18:39 pm
content: Microsoft's latest OS starts collecting telemetry as soon as the boot process endsMany of the Windows 11 initial DNS queries where designed to provide "telemetry" data to market research companies, advertising providers and even geolocation-related domains like geo.prod.do with no permission or web browsing activity needed. The latest and greatest in the Windows line of operating systems is seemingly designed to "spy" anyone and everything from the get-go, TPCSC suggests.

author: Ed.Kloonk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2023, 08:26:36 pm
content: RMS says hi.

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2023, 10:01:58 pm
content: And the answer is: what else?

author: YurkshireLad
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2023, 10:07:25 pm
content: The top 4 domains blocked by my PiHole instance are Microsoft.

author: Siwastaja
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 12, 2023, 09:10:47 am
content: Has Windows "become" Spyware? Are you asking seriously?

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 12, 2023, 07:43:23 pm
content: Quote from: Siwastaja on February 12, 2023, 09:10:47 amThat's the title of the video, and the guy shows that up to Win XP, there was practically zero telemetry. So, technically, it wasn't always spyware.Even on 7 there was relatively little (they added more in the latest updates), compared to 8 and 10. 11 is unsurprisingly worse yet.Pretty much all commercial software has become spyware anyway. It's almost like, these days, if you're a software developer and you're not including telemetry, you've wasted your life.Heck, even though it's admittedly not on the same level nor for the exact same reasons, even Gnome is getting telemetry built-in now (and it's been controversial.) Sure opting in is optional for now. But, yeah. My assertion above seems to hold fairly well even in the open-source world.

author: rdl
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2023, 01:05:44 am
content: Microsoft has been shipping mostly spyware/malware since Windows 10. I use a relatively non-updated version of Windows 7 because not long after Windows 10 released, Microsoft back-dated it to include similar telemetry. They probably did the same to Windows 8.

author: jonpaul
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2023, 03:08:21 am
content: See the may W10 / 11 utility to control telemetry, all OS parameters,O&O Shutup 10 ++https://www.oo-software.com/en/shutup10may morehttps://www.geckoandfly.com/25083/free-tools-disable-stop-windows-spying-tracking-you/PS USE WITH CAUTION default may stop VOIP, and other critical functions...for experts!Required on any MS OS install to crowbar out the horrible MS junk apps, (Cortana , MS Edge, MS paint,) and install WIN OS without a MS account.Been using them for many years.Also see classic Shell to return normal start menu like W7.http://classicshell.net/https://github.com/Open-Shell/Open-Shell-Menu/releases/tag/v4.4.170Jon

author: Karel
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2023, 07:36:31 am
content: I guess they can simply do this because the majority of the users don't care enough.

author: gmb42
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2023, 10:26:14 am
content: Quote from: Karel on February 13, 2023, 07:36:31 amOr maybe just not that paranoid?Serious question: What actual adverse effects have you experienced due to software related telemetry?

author: eutectique
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2023, 11:28:26 am
content: Quote from: gmb42 on February 13, 2023, 10:26:14 amWith this exact question the Russian propaganda tries to suppress any dissent:"Why do you hate Putin? What exactly he did wrong to you personally?"Sorry, could not resist.

author: Karel
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2023, 12:56:58 pm
content: Quote from: gmb42 on February 13, 2023, 10:26:14 amNo, I don't believe you need to be paranoid for that. I believe many people either don't know, or they don't care enough.

author: Ranayna
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2023, 01:06:07 pm
content: I find one thing related to the telemetry very curious.A couple of weeks ago, a windows update was released, whose sole job is to determine which versions of Microsoft Office are installed on the machine.I wonder why MS needs that update, i would have said that telemetry on default settings would transmit a list of installed programs.Three explanations come to mind:1. Telemetry does not transmit a list of installed programs.2. enough users have disabled that part of telemetry, if possible, or block it on their firewall. But would those install this update? Unlikely.3. MS is so compartmentalized, that the department that is responsible for the "Office Inventory" cannot get access to telemetry data.

author: madires
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2023, 01:47:42 pm
content: No surprise at all. If you want to be the owner of your PC then better stay away from MS. BTW, the data protection agency of a German federal state is pushing schools to drop Windows 365 (not GDPR compliant).

author: 50ShadesOfDirt
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2023, 02:49:06 pm
content: Really, it isn't hard to stop/block all telemetry, all updates (except those you choose), and make the Windows OS your own (again).1. PiHole2. install OS3. disable telemetry4. install WAU Manager (carifred software)5. do whatever else you do to debloat any OSAnd it's yours ... clean, no ads/telemetry/update-heck, etc. All available with a bit of googling. WinXP, 7 ... these were good os's before the data collection, but the later ones can be made the same, plus you'll get at the newer features w/o the telemetry and other garbage.If you follow the money, MS will collect from majority of users, because in the USA (and many other, non-EU countries?) it's business first, customers second, and as stated above, most don't care or don't know.You can only research and educate yourself out of the way out of this nonsense ...

author: Karel
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2023, 03:19:03 pm
content: Quote from: 50ShadesOfDirt on February 13, 2023, 02:49:06 pmTo me it seems that it's easier to install & learn Linux

author: Marco
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2023, 04:34:01 pm
content: I'm fairly certain Microsoft is not data gathering for Valve. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence and a youtube video ain't.I'm going to simply say they did not do a clean windows install. Note that UEFI can install bloatware in Windows ... which is a problem Microsoft created, but still doesn't really make Microsoft directly responsible for third party data gathering by bloatware.

author: rdl
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 14, 2023, 12:43:53 am
content: I doubt Valve needs any help. It wouldn't surprise me to find they were the number three data mining/spyware company behind Google and Microsoft. Steam is absolutely insidious software.

author: Marco
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 14, 2023, 01:10:13 am
content: Quote from: rdl on February 14, 2023, 12:43:53 amApple is a tiny bit larger ... uses the data exactly the same too, to market their own stuff and push you around on their store where they have commission on everything.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 14, 2023, 02:02:12 am
content: It has been collecting telemetry data for a long time. That said, I'm much less bothered by that (and might even opt into it if it was transparent) than I am by the fact that it has become adware pushes advertisements and even software on users. The GWX program that was pushing Windows 10 was indistinguishable from malware, and the fact that it was automatically pushed out to machines as a security update bordering on a virus. It was GWX that made me disable Windows Update entirely and never look back. Just like that they threw away years of trust.

author: MrMobodies
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 14, 2023, 04:24:09 am
content: Quote from: Karel on February 11, 2023, 08:18:39 pmI had a very difficult time disabling the telemetry stuff on Windows 2016 LTSB. I got there in the end. It was easier with Windows 2019 as I made the same alterations and watched the firewall for traffic as I was testing the services.Joke: If I was given a COA stick/key I'd bin it.I know they may not have COA sticker anymore.

author: PartialDischarge
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 14, 2023, 06:37:22 am
content: Are people still doing new Windows 7 installs on PCs or VIrtual M to run legacy software?

author: BravoV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 14, 2023, 07:03:58 am
content: Since Windows 95 to be exact, as this version it has built-in TCP-IP stack "inside" the OS, so it can called mothership at anytime.For sure the later ones (XP) that needed online activation "and/or" with online OS self patching is built-in the spying routine hard coded.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 14, 2023, 08:47:21 am
content: Quote from: PartialDischarge on February 14, 2023, 06:37:22 amI did a new install on a PC not too long ago. If I ever get around to fixing my other laptop I'll be back on Win7 as my main OS. For the time being Linux has been getting me by but there is some stuff I'd like to use that I haven't gotten running on it.

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 14, 2023, 07:26:28 pm
content: 7 is still the OS I run on my main workstation.Sure ever since the end of support in early 2020, an increasing number of applications have also stopped supporting it.The nail in the coffin was this january with the end of the extended support - now the few vendors/projects that still supported 7 are all dropping support, including open-source projects.

author: rdl
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 14, 2023, 07:44:39 pm
content: I've never quite understood "support". You know, if something works, it works. If it doesn't, I just don't use it. I guess in some sense it means there are no new updates, but in many ways that's a good thing. I know with Microsoft it means no security updates but as far as calling them for help with some problem? Never done it. I guess what I'm saying is that for me, support or lack of it has never been a consideration when deciding what software to use.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 14, 2023, 08:46:58 pm
content: Yeah I don't get that either. To me when support ends it means they will stop screwing with it and it will just work. Software doesn't wear out, sure patching of security holes stops but once an OS is that mature surely most of the holes will have been fixed. Maybe I'll change my view if I ever see an infection that is the result of an exploit, so far every single one of the many malware and virus infections I've seen have happened because the user installed something sketchy. The user is by far the easiest and most common attack vector to exploit. The other stuff is hardly even worth worrying about. Security by obscurity is not wise for a corporate entity but for home PCs my observation has been that it works pretty well.