SARS-nCov-2/Covid fueled hype-enabled ventilators - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: nuclearcat
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 25, 2020, 06:57:41 am
content: Did anybody noticed tons of "made from car parts by some kid" ventilators hype in media?Once this situation hit Lebanon i noticed a lot of hype that "DIY guys can save us and make ventilators on arduino", then i saw "Designed by MIT" (their old Ambubag design) devices popping up overnight, and was ecstatic too, until i talked with real anesthesiologist, who told me people gonna die with this devices and it will do worse for them, instead of saving them and even he didnt have technical knowledge, he told me about issues with oxygen supply regulation, positive pressure and etc.After that i found out that one of my friends is EE who designed certified ventilators years before, and he spent several hours explaining to me how this stuff works.And then told me story, how in exUSSR countries such hype and abundance of fake "experts" driven government to buy first non-professional devices (for apnea at home) for professional purposes, and now current hype might cause them to buy instead of ventilators some arduino-powered completely useless stuff.Worse i can see now tons of mechanized ambubags with shiny looks in relevant groups, but those engineers who does really cool stuff are left unnoticed, because they spent more time on functionality, than aesthetics.Because of that, now i am not silent anymore when I see this "ambubag-derivative" disgrace and trying to explain, that if people keep supporting this illiteracy, tomorrow they will see at dentist hands brightly colored branded wire pliers, instead of professional tools, because "you know, if it can save the day and it's cheap, let's use it".

author: SerieZ
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 25, 2020, 09:34:55 am
content: Yes and you are absolutely correct in that these "Arduino powered Car-part Ventilators" are BS of the highest Order, especially for COVID-19 cases.I can also shrug at the efforts by Tesla wanting to develop one themselves. These machines have been built by specialized companies with decades worth of amounted know-how and are extremely complex to be able to actually make a difference and save lives.I understand that people just want to help but this is not the way to do it.

author: Cyberdragon
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 25, 2020, 03:33:54 pm
content: DIY ventilators are entirely possible (risky, but possible) if you know what you are doing. There are several old threads in general that go into detail on this already.

author: nuclearcat
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 26, 2020, 12:13:32 am
content: Quote from: Cyberdragon on June 25, 2020, 03:33:54 pmOf course possible.But this is not the case, those who can make them are usually experienced professionals, and they are not material for headlines, they are boring, often old guys, they care about functionality, not visual part, so they wont make to headlines, wont get likes and as result wont get support.I believe that the lack of criticism for unreliable and false inventions, the silence of professionals - led to this, creation of false values and perception of inventions and DIY.

author: daqq
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 26, 2020, 08:02:56 am
content: This is mostly a classic media reporting issue.The students/hobbyists etc. meant the ventilators mostly as a desperate last means, when the alternative would be for the doctors to hook up a patient to a vacuum cleaner they borrowed from the cleaning staff or let them die. Everyone knows it, the makers know it, the doctors know it. And only a few of the projects (there's actually a very good list of open source projects on this here:https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1inYw5H4RiL0AC_J9vPWzJxXCdlkMLPBRdPgEVKF8DZw/edit?usp=sharing, mind you, given the numbers it's incomplete and only the most serious projects are even mentioned) are actually really serious, most of them were just "huh, wonder how it works.".The media reported this as "These brave local* lads created a device that is the same as a 10kUSD device that's being sold by the large corporations. All they needed was this balloon, a motor and a lot of duct tape."It's really the fault of the way that the media prechew and dumb down the information. Instead of:"This device, provided a lot more time and development is done, could be used, in the worst case scenario, to help in a very specific set of cases."we got:"This cheap fully working device can easily replace this 10kUSD machine! Rejoice, we are saved!"* - this happened in many countries - here (Slovakia) as well, we had a report of at least 3 independent ideas.

author: SerieZ
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 26, 2020, 11:03:52 am
content: Quote from: Cyberdragon on June 25, 2020, 03:33:54 pmSorry for my laziness but can you hint me to one which is able to suction out fluids while providing correct airflow reliably and safely while monitoring the patient because I honestly find that to be quite a feat.Again I am very serious when I say that I doubt that Tesla Engineers could produce such a thing on short notice and they have a huge team of good Engineers.A gimmicky McGuyver style Ventilator aint gonna cut it during a Pandemic TBQH

author: Cyberdragon
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 02:26:10 pm
content: Quote from: SerieZ on June 26, 2020, 11:03:52 amSuction lines were discussed in the original thread(s).