Very positive experience with PCBWin - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Corporate666
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 21, 2017, 11:05:08 pm
content: So first things first, I was not asked to post a review. I am not getting a discount, or paid or compensated in any way. I am simply posting this because I posted previously when I had a bad experience with PCBWay. I think it's fair to give credit when it's warranted as well as to give criticism where it's warranted.I received 1,000pcs of PCB's (actually the same ones PCBWay screwed up) a week or two back, but this time from PCBWin. The quality of the boards is fantastic. They are nothing too difficult to make, 2 layer, FR4, 1.6mm, ENIG, 0.006 trace/space, white soldermask, black silkscreen on one side, tented vias, 2oz copper, etc. The only things that were "different" about the order were that I asked PCBWin to panelize the boards for me, and I had somewhat picky requests about how it was done (because the boards fit into a very tightly machined housing), and for the same reason I was quite picky about the tolerances of the routing and that it was done cleanly without ragged edges.I was supremely impressed with the outcome. They used a smaller drill size on the rat bites for the panelization than I've seen previously which actually eliminated a secondary operation, and all the layers lined up perfectly. The quality of the boards overall is top notch - easily on par with the best from any other board house I've used. My previous go-to when I needed top notch quality was Myro, but for some reason their prices have gone through the roof. I'll happily be using PCBWin as my go-to for high quality production work, provided the quality on future orders matches this order.They also made stencils for me - they were framed and quality was also excellent. Couple of final points that impressed me were they had no problem at all sending me the Gerber files for the panelized boards. I know any good board house will do this, but I've had some balk at the request, so I was happy these folks didn't. And I've had excellent during and post-sale contact from Zoe. She checked in with me a few times to update me on status and actually gave me a phone call post-delivery to ask how I liked the boards.So... take that for what it's worth. I have 3 more PCB's that I am running low on that are a bit more demanding... one with even more finicky panelization. Another that needs high density drilling and filled vias, and another that's a long/thin flex PCB... so we'll see how those go, but I am optimistic! They weren't the cheapest option (although IIRC they were one of the cheaper choices on PCBShopper, maybe $30 more for the whole 1000 boards than the cheapest guys) and they weren't the fastest, although they were quite fast... but the boards were done in exactly the # of business days listed (counting from the day I approved the panelized Gerbers). Two thumbs up based on my experience thus far. Kudos to Moon (sales lady I spoke to at first) and especially Zoe who took it from there and answered a bunch of ??'s and kept me updated the whole way.

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 21, 2017, 11:19:50 pm
content: Can you also compare the price specifically against PCBWay at this quantity?

author: Corporate666
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 23, 2017, 10:28:01 pm
content: Sure, I list below the companies I have made these specific boards for me and the exact prices I paid, and my comments. Please read the comments before comparing only the price as there were some minor differences in the services:1) PCBWin. I paid $371.61 in total which included shipping AND included the cost of two framed stencils. The PCB cost alone was $216.37 for 1000pcs which they panelized for me.2) PCBWay. I paid $294.00 in total which included shipping but did NOT included stencils. The PCB cost alone was $233.00. The PCB is 23mm x 35mm and nothing special (ENIG, 1.6mm FR4, 2 layer, 2 sided, 8/8mil trace & space, 1Oz copper, no extra small holes, etc). If you use their online quote too, it states $142. They raised the price to $233 without explanation other than "the technology used" and in online chat with sales basically told me to take it or leave it. This was for 1000pcs which were made individually. You can look at my previous thread - the boards were crap and basically unusable (would be OK for a hobbyist but so much variation in size and alignment of layers that they were useless for a production environment). I ended up throwing away the whole batch. They wanted me to tell them how many had such bad layer alignment that the ground copper pour was exposed and they would re-make those boards and send to me, but there were lots of issues (including the perimeter routing of the board being so variable from one to the next and with such ragged edges that only about 5% of the boards fit in our PCB fixtures without sanding the edges smooth). The time it would take for us to sift through the boards would cost us far more than we spent on getting the boards made, so we just threw them all away. PCBWay claims they have since implemented QC procedures that will prevent such issues in future, but I am skeptical and I haven't used them since.3) PCBJoint. I paid $210.58 which did not include shipping for 1000pcs made individually. The price did include a $30.58 tooling fee which I believe would not apply to re-orders. Same exact board with same exact specs. I got these made at the same time I placed the PCBWay order... PCB Joint wasn't sure if they could ship before Chinese New Year so I placed this order and the one with PCBWay. They both arrived in time. The quality of the PCBJoint boards was very good, I would definitely use them again, but they do not do stencils, and I wanted stencils made this latest time around.4) Myro PCB. These guys were my previous go-to when I needed reliable high-quality and full featured boards. My last order from them was $460 for 1000pcs of this board which was a re-order price where I'd already paid the NRE/tooling costs. That did not include shipping or stencils - just the bare boards. The good thing about Myro is when I need more advanced features such as thermal plugging of vias, 2-layer metal core boards, blind/buried vias in multilayer boards and such, they can do that whereas most of the hobbyist services don't offer those features. But Myro's prices have gone up dramatically. I believe their last quote was $600 for the same 1000pcs.Hope this info helps.

author: SVFeingold
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 24, 2017, 05:25:21 am
content: Interesting, I'll have to check them out. The online quoting is certainly nice. I've used HQPCB.com for years now and I've always been happy with the quality, but they don't have as many options such as thicker ENIG, matte soldermask, etc... They do seem to offer smaller space/trace however, 3.5mil. Ordering from them involved having someone in China pay and receive the PCBs and re-ship to the US, but now they have a new site (www.nextpcb.com) where they ship direct overseas. The NextPCB prices however are higher than the china-only HQPCB prices. PCBWin seems somewhere in the middle. We'll see how it goes on my next order.

author: SVFeingold
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 24, 2017, 05:26:58 am
content: How is the silkscreen quality? HQPCB/NextPCB is not the best silkscreen quality, but certainly good enough for my purposes. Better than most of the "cheap" PCB houses I've seen but not at the level of a dry film process.Have any close ups to post? I'm interested in the quality of plated hole barrels, as well as silkscreen.

author: Corporate666
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 25, 2017, 10:56:37 pm
content: I would rate the silkscreen quality highly. It's dot-matrix printed, not an actual screened on layer, but the attached picture is an SOT23-5 component with the VREG text printed within the confines of the component leads, and the registration is perfectly acceptable, the lines of the text are thin and legible, there's no overlap between the silkcreen and pads, and all the characters are fully printed across the board.(I know the pedants will squeal about putting silkscreen that close to the pads - I don't care - I do it all the time and I'll continue to do it with a smile on my face).This board does not have any plated through holes, and the vias are tented, so I can't take a picture of the that for you, I'm afraid.