The great capacitor shoot-out- more stupidity at 3 sigma - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: subolg123
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2014, 11:26:16 pm
content: http://www.laventure.net/tourist/caps.htm

author: theatrus
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2014, 11:51:17 pm
content: Quotethat's really all you need to know about this article.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2014, 01:20:50 am
content: Quote from: theatrus on April 11, 2014, 11:51:17 pmExactly.I interpret this as there's enoughsuckerspeople that there's a business opportunity for the right person that can come up with the rightBSmarketing material and pretty packaging.

author: TMM
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2014, 03:06:52 pm
content: Quote

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 13, 2014, 04:02:09 am
content: Quote from: TMM on April 12, 2014, 03:06:52 pmNotice they say "... the scope's probe ground connectionwas consideredto be connected to the outer foil of the cap". This is their out. All they're really saying is that they had a method or process for making a decision, and stuck to it. They're not actually saying say it's the correct method, or a usable method, or even that it gives accurate /consistent / repeatable results - simply that they had a method, and themethod itselfwas consistently applied.It's both a blessing and a curse. On the one hand, it's a nice easy point for a later researcher to criticise - but, on the other hand, they then have to go through the whole process of proving the method is rubbish (and face the inevitable arguments with people who claim it isn't) before getting to present their own findings. And in the meantime there'll be plenty of other lazy studies which simply state something like "Our study used the method initially proposed by Bullshyte and Crapp, which was considered suitable for determining which lead is connected to the outer foil".You might be surprised to learn how often that particular manipulative construct is used in scientific literature...

author: BennyBoy
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 13, 2014, 11:26:59 pm
content: Really sick folks out there. Spending thousands on caps, when thousands of kids are starving.I blame the ignorant people for fuking without funds, but the poor kids should not have to pay with there lives, while A-holes argue over capacitors.

author: echen1024
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2014, 02:19:57 am
content: I need to start my own cap business...

author: sleemanj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2014, 05:10:53 am
content: As per usual for pseudoscience audiophoolery, they didn't bother with that whole rigorous scientific method thing.QuoteIt's not like it would have been hard for them to do it properly, put up a screen between test subject and test setup. Properly randomise the tests. Play the same music pieces for each test. And throw in a control of some bog standard cap. That's it. Nothing more complicated needed.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 14, 2014, 05:35:15 am
content: QuoteThat's all you need to know to brand this audiophoolery.You either get quantitative measurements (with say an Audio Precision), or you don't.You can likely make one sound better by smearing it with peanut butter - so what?

author: John Coloccia
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2014, 06:55:51 am
content: Quote from: TMM on April 12, 2014, 03:06:52 pmMeh...amateur hour. For only $200, you can send me your capacitors and I will use my x-ray galvanometer to PROPERLY and PROFESSIONALLY determine the outer foil. Then I will trim the leads of the capacitor to the optimal lengths....not necessarily the SAME length, btw. Only a complete novice would do that. They will be trimmed to take the differential capacipedance into account. Finally, they will be cryostatically biased. I feel this last step is critical to opening the sound stage and preserving the width and depth of the music, while at the same time dramatizing the length.In case some have forgotten here is a run down of my qualifications and equipment.https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/spotted-this-and-had-to-share/msg340855/#msg340855

author: amyk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2014, 09:17:40 am
content: By "aural memory" they're not referring to some weirdness of the caps themselves, just the listener's idea of remembering how the previous choice sounded.Quote from: sleemanj on April 14, 2014, 05:10:53 amAnd if you want to do the testing a little bit easier, connect up all the caps to random positions on a rotary switch. Ask the listener to turn the knob to the position that sounds best. Move caps to different positions on the switch, then repeat.

author: zimzom
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2014, 10:23:18 am
content: I think it would be a great kick-starter project.The angle that nobody seems to have explored is all these guys are worried about audio fidelity ect.. why not sell them hokum calibrated testing kits for the capacitors, resistors, valves, transformers ect. Have a little meter with "audio warmth", "aural memory checker" ect..The thing is all these fellas that prey upon the excess cash and naivety of the customers will have to buy into the scam because it perpetuates the overall market. They cannot call you out for fear of bringing down the whole house of cards.

author: AntiProtonBoy
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2014, 01:47:24 pm
content: One day, I'm going to make a troll site for audiofools, just for the lulz.

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2014, 01:53:26 pm
content: Quote from: echen1024 on April 14, 2014, 02:19:57 amThat would be an overkill. Just pay some taiwan company for custom labels like:"Omega OneWolfram Teflon Triaxial0.000001% THD 350V 125C"

author: echen1024
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2014, 04:19:28 pm
content: Quote from: NANDBlog on April 14, 2014, 01:53:26 pmGranted, I'm just gonna stick the cheapest caps I can find in Shenzhen electronics mart into a fancy looking wooden box, and then print off a crap cal certificate. Total cost to me? $20 at most. Sell it for $400.

author: station240
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 15, 2014, 03:00:09 am
content: Quote from: echen1024 on April 14, 2014, 04:19:28 pmBonus points if you find some of these at the markets and use them.And yes in the original story, those caps were installed in an amplifier.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 15, 2014, 03:09:15 am
content: I'm waiting for an amp that has homeopathic levels of distortion.

author: miguelvp
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2014, 03:17:12 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on April 15, 2014, 03:09:15 amThe thing is, they all do. But with the right tune, not the right cap.

author: BravoV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2014, 03:22:58 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on April 15, 2014, 03:09:15 amDave, ever consider to make a drive/walk through rant video dedicated on this audiophool matter ?Hopefully it won't increase your daily death threads list.

author: TMM
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2014, 04:23:22 am
content: Quote from: NANDBlog on April 14, 2014, 01:53:26 pmNah, wouldn't work. Audiofools disregard quantifiable measurements like THD and instead rely on their 'golden ears'.

author: Dave
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2014, 01:26:58 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on April 15, 2014, 03:09:15 amPutting more amps in series to decrease THD?

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2014, 05:14:47 pm
content: Quote from: Dave on April 15, 2014, 01:26:58 pmSadly that actually works. On opamp level.

author: Mark Hennessy
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2014, 08:58:31 pm
content: Quote from: BravoV on April 15, 2014, 03:22:58 amhttp://www.eevblog.com/2009/09/07/eevblog-29-audiophile-audiophoolery/