BGA Rework Machine Technology (DIY Point Of View) - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / projects

author: Unelma
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: February 27, 2014, 01:07:15 pm
content: HelloMy name is Timo and I am hobbyist in BGA rework field and I see lot of people looking information about BGA/SMT Rework machines.We (me and my fried Jari) started to test/modify cheap cooking equipment in 2009.I started write my findings and results in various forums… more DIY bga reworkers started to join in the conversation... Forums get closed and the administrators change and everyone goes their own way… You know the story. We still have small group of DIY guys and we keep in touch using FB.We all have different ideas different controlling methods and tricks. Some of them failed some of them worked. This BGA rework information is hard to find. It is easy to google things and you find lot of .pdf and single projects. Where is the real field work? There are forums in this area of work but the main interested in these forums are the pcb repairing and making $$$. There are few of us who are interested in heating and the reflow process more than making $$$. (Trying to make home soldering cheap and effective)There is also one big problem more people stars to understand the process more they will hide the information or in other words they stop sharing. (I have noticed that I have become little like that also, things got to changeAlso people are scared to share their projects because they think it is stupid or they think people think less of them if it is stupid. I can tell you all testing is great failed or not. Lot of information get lost if you don’t have guts to write about it.Hey now I start sharing my reasserts in BGA Rework machine building element testing ext.My English is what it is but I try to do my best.I see lot of potential here and really talented EE guys.Let’s do some shiny solder joints now on)One thing I like to add. If it is possible don’t ask questions like: what is solid state relay?First try to google it, if you can’t find it in 2 minutes then you can ask it.Lot of great information gets lost if everyone wants to be spoon-fed.

author: Unelma
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: February 27, 2014, 04:29:16 pm
content: Today i am working on my reflow oven.The oven is controlled by cheap PID controller rKc Rex-C100 be were lot of "clone rex pid´s out there.So the Rex-C100 is modified relay out, it is converted to logic out and normal SSR is controlling oven quartz elements.So what is the point of this? normal oven without the fan has many different temperature zones.I try to get rid of the zones by adding normal ovens cross flow fan inside it.I am Using "triac" today i have kemo M0828N controlling the fan but if you are good at coding, writing simple PWM code will do the same thing. I am poor coder at the moment so i go around it. Similar triac controller is Fotek SSR-XX VA resistor controlled AC power dimmer 0%-100% of the power. (it works like light dimmer)Edit1: If you are making DIY reflow oven mount the PID controller out side of the oven case. Inside the case it looks great but the controller gets too hot even if you have insulation inside. I have to fix this also.But first i run some tests that i know what modifications i need...I post video when i have tuned the pid and airflow.

author: Unelma
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: February 27, 2014, 04:55:00 pm
content: This shows how the fotek ssr - xxVA controls ceramic IR element. You can see that it is really stable power control.

author: Unelma
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: February 27, 2014, 06:14:37 pm
content: I tell you about my controlling style. I have tested many different tc´s, big mass and small mass ones in oven.Many of you control the pcb temperature, nothing wrong with that.My method is to control the temperature always in the same point so every time when i run my profile it works same way.I have also noticed that big mass thermocouples near the heat element but not touching it. Can control the oven temperature same way as the small one on the air near the pcb. The big mass has slow reaction time but when the metal heats up it is same temperature as the small one is. so inside the oven there are +/- 3-5c temperature difference.I have found this really good way to control the oven. PID controller have to be tuned real good to make this work.It also has really good feature when you go to peak temp both temps are same. When it start to hold the temperature. Temperature drops 5-10C because of the big mass/slow reaction time. So simple pid controller makes oven perform like ramp and soak controller using big mass thermocouple and it is great.Big TC PID controller, Small TC meter.Now the movie time:

author: Unelma
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: February 28, 2014, 08:52:38 am
content: Direct Heat Stencil jig/holder idea. I am using this now and works for me.Aluminum plate and microscope clips.

author: Dago
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 03, 2014, 06:54:42 am
content: Very professional looking setup you got there!I suggest you join us in #elektroniikka in IRCnet (Finnish channel)

author: Unelma
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 14, 2014, 08:15:08 am
content: Little tip what I found useful if you don’t want to invest 1000€ for Flir thermal camera.Normal Digi camera has IR filter lens inside the camera optics. it is usually small glass and when you turn it it shines little red and purple. When you take the IR filter off from normal camera it loses some focus if you don’t replace the filter with clear glass.Anyways now you have spy camera what can see trought dark ceramic glass and you can see how your IR elements are heating up or where you want to put your pcb…One spy picture from Ersa HR/IRHP 100:http://www.ersa.com/art-irhp-100-346-1482.htmlErsa IR heating element is Elstein HSR 800W:http://www.elstein.com/en/elstein-products/panel-heaters/hsr-series/description/When I test my machine... the camera shows different colors and how the elements pulses, so it is cheap good tool to have when testing. People give old digi cameras away for free.

author: Unelma
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2014, 08:48:25 am
content: In next two videos. (I take lot of videos helps to find ideas/errors)The camera angle show you the wire turning point that it is lot of hotter than center.I have blocked the hot areas and I am using the center only I have drawn how the heat/radiation moves in hsr2 500W. What I have tested it is great to have lot of power in the element but better to use less of it. Lot of power means excellent reaction but when power is too long at 100% you end up burning surface of the chip also known as popcorned BGA. The thing is that I like to test little different ways. I like to know what it does for real.Top IR radiator is 65 mm away from PS3 DIA-001 GPU. One picture of the graphics how they look.Thermocouples are mounted each side of the PS3 GPU Chip.First video: my bottom heater provides too much heat so top heater goes almost to zero radiation in the end of the profile.Second video is “missing the profile” I am trying to use PID algorithm to slow the pulsing down.So not using profile at all only one set point.

author: con-f-use
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 18, 2014, 09:10:15 am
content: Sooo awesome!

author: jeremy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 20, 2014, 08:29:06 am
content: This is really interesting, I do hope you continue to document your progress.

author: Unelma
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 20, 2014, 06:37:16 pm
content: I will upload video this weekend.I have now short wave IR halogen lamps and I can heat pcbs in industrial times. Ps3 pcb in really amazing time.Been busy Lately doing other things. Reflow profile monitoring software is almost ready... 6 channels tc monitor and visual Basic pc software for logging.

author: g***!
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 20, 2014, 09:15:49 pm
content: Looks very interesting,,,,unfortunately all the you tube vids are private (except one) which rather ruins the continuity of the thread.

author: Unelma
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 21, 2014, 05:55:29 am
content: I changed Google + settings and somehow all videos where private now 70% are active and end of the day all will be public. The videos are little boring because all the information is in Facebook. But you can ask here if some questions pop up.

author: Unelma
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 26, 2014, 03:48:29 pm
content: 6 * 1300w IR radiator halogen lambs. 2 pcs series, 3 * 650W = ?These are cheap ir radiator halogen lambs, they have the fastest heating power what i have tested. (Trough glass)My new design is not ready but i promise some innovative heating method when get it going.PS3 motherboard TC under the PCB, 3-4 cm above the radiators.PS. Some one asked me how to calculate element power if you put them in series. Normal ohms law :http://www.sengpielaudio.com/calculator-ohm.htmThe power is different in the meter because the halogen lambs are not 1300W the tolerance in lamb ohms are big.

author: Unelma
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 16, 2014, 11:55:12 am
content: Some Videos:Inside Honton HT-R390:(English)Sama Suomeksi:(Finnish)Honton HT-R390 GND Problem:(English)Basic tutorials:BGA Tutorial 1:(English)BGA Tutorial 1.1:(English)I try to make more basic tutorials when i can and when i have some time and inspiration. Now i am testing my Halogen setup and looking good. I think i will write Schematics because lot of people are asking it.Here is wiring diagram for 2 Altec PC410 pid controllers, dual modification for bottom and top heaters.After this you can auto start both controllers and make profile for bottom heat also.You all have great summer. Mr.T

author: Unelma
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 28, 2015, 06:21:22 pm
content: It has been long time... Now finally got some time to play with my BGA rework machines.I started testing some cheap 20 cent Pleomax 200w halogen lamps.Shitty result using one 200w lamp did not give good heat. Now i will wire 4 in parallel.The 1300w IR lambs are great red long ones really strong heat and fast.

author: Unelma
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2016, 09:32:47 am
content: Someone asked me how i did my manual pulse mod to Honton.Simple Opto mod CNY17-3 and one resistor.So if you cant lift the BGA chip in the end of your profile you can pause the altec pc410 controller and add manually pulses to get few extra Celsius.

author: Unelma
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2016, 06:26:50 pm
content: Simple Hack for any relay out PID controller:- Remove controlling Relay, measure relays coil resistance. (In my case it was 400 ohm and 12vdc relay)- Then split the resistance and use two same value resistors as jumpers. (200ohm + 200ohm = 400 ohm).This will keep the current same and it will protect your PID controller if you make short-circuit in your controlling leads.- I did not have 200 ohm resistor i used two 180 ohm resistors.If you are beginner now you get the idea how to Hack any Chinese relay out PID controller to Logic out and drive SSR.I have used many times rKc Rex-C100 PID controller. They work really good and you can make +/- 1C temp controlling using it. (Tweaking the PID settings and Thermocouple place)ebay :http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dual-PID-0-to-400-Digital-Temperature-Control-Controller-Thermocouple-REX-C100-/170792022724?hash=item27c3ff72c4:g:lIsAAOSwBahVdqJV

author: RobertBG
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2016, 07:04:35 pm
content: Great stuff and thanks for sharing.I have found very little information on BGA rework at anything even close to a hobbyist level.This is just a thought but on the overhead IR lights do you think it would be beneficial to use a light mover?If you have trouble with hot spots it could really be of use.BGA work is quite far from anything I've done and I know they are completely different things but I do some work with UV cured resins and I've had really positive results using a light mover.Even on small parts it has helped quite a bit due to issues caused by the reflectors.I know it's been a while but if you still are looking for a proper pump I'd be happy to send you a few links to other options besides aquarium pumps

author: Unelma
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2016, 07:29:36 pm
content: Light mover is great idea. I am always looking new ideas how to modify things, how i can use them in my projects. I have similar rail system how i can move IR head sideways.But best find now is wrist support for pc mouse. I got these for free and the movement is really smooth and i can get anywhere using these.Yes i am looking for good suction pump. But what i have tested, all of them where poor.

author: Unelma
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2016, 09:44:51 pm
content: Lidl SilverCrest Oven modified to bake pcb and BGA chips using cheap PID controller rKc Rex-C100.https://youtu.be/mUWf_U0lEGEIf you are making DIY reflow oven. Metal resistor type element is slow for rework but good for baking moisture out. Quartz type elements are fast and really good for rework reflow.Make sure that oven has fan inside the oven it makes the temperature better. Install the PID controller out of the oven, it will get too hot inside and you need cooling fan for it. (like me)Good insulation for the oven can be found in normal stove. (High Temperature Insulation Wool)If you cant find oven with quartz elements and fan, buy one with the fan and change the elements. I have to do this modification also.What i want is industry 3 - 4 min profiles.

author: al3x
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: July 15, 2018, 06:57:11 pm
content: Quote from: Unelma on May 26, 2014, 03:48:29 pmfriend I have a question, what kind of glass do you use between the IR lamps and the PCB card?

author: tretecou
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: January 07, 2023, 12:42:28 pm
content: This is a glass-ceramic panel from a basic cooking ceramic heater you often find in kitchens. You may find non working ones with good condition glass in local second hand shops or craigslist, ebay whatever...

author: Jeanmi33
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: October 27, 2024, 08:05:18 pm
content: Quote from: Unelma on July 16, 2014, 11:55:12 amHello dear UnelmaI come with this post for to know if you can give me help , i have find a very old Station Rework BGA without Name and model , but she have a large hot table working and she have 2 PC410 and 1 PC100I have open this station and the inside is very very Basic wiring connection diagramI want to know if you can give me help for try uprgrade this station with how can I connect the 2 Pc410 together with a DB9 RS232 or RS422 connector in order to manage them with a computer , Also if there is possibility to improve the security with other Relays and alert button, and is it possible to add a speed controller for the bottom hot air fan.I would like to modernize it a bit and why not add a Laser like you did.I also have in stock a new complete heating element in Ceramic IR, do you think the best is the original Hot Air one or the Ceramic IR one?I hope you understood me because my English is not great.I thank you in advance