Hakko FX-100 any good? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 24, 2015, 07:12:50 am
content: I'm now at a stage where I need a good soldering station in my home lab. I had a look at various products and narrowed it down to a few contenders I liked. However, for one of them (Hakko FX-100) I couldn't find any real-world reviews.So I wonder if anyone here has any experience with the Hakko FX-100 and could give me some insight as to how good it is?

author: deadlylover
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 24, 2015, 07:24:19 am
content: Hi mate, I have one but it doesn't come with a tip....so I can't try it out just yet.Tips are bloody expensive in Australia ($30-$50), and the local distributors don't seem to have any stock at the moment. If you give me a couple of weeks I'll be able to report back with my experiences with the iron.

author: coppice
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 24, 2015, 07:36:11 am
content: I find it interesting that Hakko have patents on the induction heating of soldering irons going back 20 years or more, yet only seem to have recently released this first product. I wonder what made them wait so long? The design certainly sounds like it should be the most responsive thing available. The reality could, of course, be very different.

author: John Coloccia
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 24, 2015, 10:09:46 am
content: Quote from: coppice on September 24, 2015, 07:36:11 amMaybe waiting for Metcal patents to expire? That's the obvious next question...this vs. Metcal. Who wins?

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 24, 2015, 10:28:44 am
content: Quote from: deadlylover on September 24, 2015, 07:24:19 amReally? That's a shame.QuoteThe situation doesn't seem to be much better here in the UK.QuoteThanks, but I'd have to make a decision in the next few days. But please still report your findings, at least I'll know what I missed or what I got myself into (depending if I go for the FX-100)

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 24, 2015, 10:30:23 am
content: Quote from: John Coloccia on September 24, 2015, 10:09:46 amWell, I know Metcal, they are great, but I don't want one for personal use.

author: John Coloccia
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 24, 2015, 12:30:08 pm
content: I don't understand. This thing costs about as much as a Metcal, and seems to use the same basic technology. Since you need to change tips to change temperatures, it seems like it's the same right down to using curie point regulation.

author: deadlylover
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 24, 2015, 02:20:11 pm
content: Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on September 24, 2015, 10:28:44 amWill do. RS wants ~$66 for a tip, ughhhhh.What I can say at the moment is that the transformer inside only has 220/230/240v taps, so I doubt we will be able to purchase a 100V model and rewire the taps. Hakko usually charges a premium for the ~230V models.I think the handpiece is nicer than the standard JBC T245, it's a bit shorter overall and the cable is slightly thinner and more supple. The Hakko grip is rubbery whereas the JBC is plastic fantastic. I do prefer the Hakko ergonomics.

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 24, 2015, 02:22:14 pm
content: Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on September 24, 2015, 10:30:23 amWhy not?Quote from: John Coloccia on September 24, 2015, 12:30:08 pmIt is.

author: John Coloccia
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 24, 2015, 06:27:32 pm
content: I sort of have to wonder what Hakko brings to the table with this thing. Does it perform better than Metcal? They seem to be priced about the same, so why buy the Hakko? At one time, Hakko was making products that at least stacked nicely. They seem to have become hellbent on not allowing that anymore, starting with the FX951 and FX888. I really like my Hakko stuff, but I'm starting to wonder about them.

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 24, 2015, 06:47:59 pm
content: Quote from: Monkeh on September 24, 2015, 02:22:14 pmMostly price (I could get the FX-100 noticably cheaper). Plus I somehow prefer the 'feel' of the Hakko handpieces I've tried. That doesn't mean MetCal isn't a top brand (which they definitely are). Just some personal preference.However, after further serious consideration of the alternatives I'm now down to the Hakko FX-951, simply due to the attractive price and the accessories (tips, handpieces) that are available for it, and also because it seems really a lot more difficult to get hold of FX-100 tips in Europe than for the other Hakko models.@deadlylover: I'm still looking forward read about your experience, I'm still tempted by the FX-100, and maybe I just get one later in addition to the FX-951.

author: John Coloccia
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 24, 2015, 07:49:38 pm
content: What's your source for the FX-100? Everywhere I've seen it's priced pretty close to Metcal. I'm looking at a Metcal now, not that I dislike my JBC, because I think JBC is the bees knees, but because I think Metcal's tip geometry is better suited to some of the things I'm doing now.

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 24, 2015, 08:06:34 pm
content: Quote from: John Coloccia on September 24, 2015, 07:49:38 pmPersonal contactsOtherwise they seem to be rare like hen's teeth (the only publich source in the UK I could is RS, which isn't exactly known for its low prices).QuoteIndeed, tip availability is certainly another factor to consider. Luckily I'm planning to use the new soldering station for basic SMT and SMD stuff, but I'd still want to have a decent selection of tips available. Which is one reason I ruled out the FX-888D right from the start (it also seemed to be designed more for the hobbyist market).I never tried JBC but just looking at them they come across a bit too gimmicky. Doesn't mean they are bad, I just don't know them. They seem to have very nice desoldering handpieces (I really hate the pistol format most desoldering irons seem to have, I prefer pencil handpieces).I'm grown up on Pace Rework Stations (PP200 and up), and some older Wellers. Most soldering stations at work are Pace (mostly Rework Stations), and I like them. Pace is my Plan B should I find myself unable to get a FX-951 for a decent price from a reputable source (well, the two listed distributors for Hakko) here in the UK.

author: John Coloccia
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 24, 2015, 08:24:53 pm
content: My experience with the JBC is it's definitely not gimmicky. I neglected to include thermal reliefs on a pour on a board I made some time ago. Instead of trashing $1000 worth of boards, I decided to give the JBC a try to see if it could just get through it. It did. They make an excellent product, and I think the only thing out there that can give it a run for it's money is Metcal.But my current boards are very tight, and getting good contact is difficult. I brought in some different tips and it's better, but the JBC angles and shapes are just not quite right to comfortable get where they need to get.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2015, 02:32:38 am
content: Quote from: John Coloccia on September 24, 2015, 08:24:53 pmFWIW,GreyWoolfehas both a Metcal MX-500 and Hakko FX-951, and has stated their performance is very similar to one another.

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2015, 05:36:23 am
content: Quote from: John Coloccia on September 24, 2015, 08:24:53 pmAs I said, I don't really know JBC, but it's good to hear that they make good soldering stations, too.Quote from: nanofrog on September 25, 2015, 02:32:38 amSounds good! The FX-951 is still my #1, and #2 the Pace ST50 with TD-100. But I'll definitely have a look at JBC before I decide, too.Choosing the right soldering station turned out to be more compliated than I initially though.

author: John Coloccia
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2015, 08:29:11 am
content: Quote from: nanofrog on September 25, 2015, 02:32:38 amWell, if that's the case then I can tell you that JBC's stations blow away the MX-500. As much as I like Hakko, I have a FP101, and have a lot of time on an FX-951, the JBC is noticeable superior. I find that disappointing, to be honest. I would have expected Metcal to be better than the FX-951.But just to be clear, I think the 951 is a FINE solder station.

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2015, 09:27:02 am
content: Quote from: John Coloccia on September 25, 2015, 08:29:11 amWhich JBC would recommend as a suitable equivalent to the FX-951 and the MX-500?

author: John Coloccia
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2015, 09:44:29 am
content: I use the Compact one: the CD-B.I'll be very honest, though, and tell you that unless you really need the performance for some reason, and most people just don't, I wouldn't waste my money on it. I think it's worth spending some extra bucks for the 951 over an FX888 for convenient tip changes and better performance, but I wouldn't bother with JBC or Metcal unless you really have some challenging jobs to tackle.

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2015, 09:59:32 am
content: Quote from: John Coloccia on September 25, 2015, 09:44:29 amLooks nice!QuoteThat's true, however while at the moment I just need a good soldering station for basic stuff this might change in a year or so, and since I can afford to invest a bit of cash I'd rather spend a bit more (even if that means "over-buying") to make sure I'm covered for the foreseeable future.Having said that, I still have to check how availability in my country is for JBC and Hakko tips and spares. It's very easy with Pace (I can just buy it from their website).

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 25, 2015, 12:25:02 pm
content: +1 for the FX-951. I am happy with mine and with the TEquipment.net discount, I got the iron, 5 tips and tip holders and an extra brass curls for $287 USD. It is still on sale for $236.49 USD before discount. I also scored a great deal on a Metcal MX-500P II. I have the Talon tweezers, wand and cradles all in for $140 USD without tips. I got the Metcal after I got the Hakko and as much as I like the Hakko, if I had found the Metcal deal before the Hakko, I wouldn't have purchased it and would have kept my Hakko 936 as a second. Right now, I am using both about equally. The only change I am going to make is set the Hakko power save for 5 minutes instead of the default 0 minutes because it is a bit slower than the Metcal to wake up. If you do get the FX-951, make sure you put a piece of electrical tape over the piezo buzzer, it is annoyingly loud.I can say the 951 is a HUGE step up from the 936 (888) in every way possible. Faster heat up, faster recovery time, faster and easier tip changes, more comfortable wand-there is simply no comparison. I am not disappointed with mine and you won't be disappointed if you buy one. A sensible set of tips will let you do anything you need.

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2015, 02:30:38 pm
content: Ok, I've done itAfter long deliberation about principles (conventional vs induction) and a look at what the brands are offering I have now taken the plunge and ordered a Hakko FX-100The reason I went back to the FX-100 is because it uses induction heating (and different sources suggest that it's better at heating up and maintaining temperature than conventional heating), and the tips (most around around €11 to €14 + VAT) seem to be a cheaper than MetCal (plus they are supposed to be more durable, but I'm not counting on that). I also like that the FX-100 offers an overboost function to raise the temperature a bit when needed, something that seems to be absent from MetCal. And as a bonus, I really like the design (I know that's not very relevant, still I have to look at that thing!).Unfortunately the deal I was offered had now expired, but it's currently on sale at batterfly.com for €420 (approx £308) + VAT which I think is a pretty good offer. I'm sure the FX-100 will serve me well for the near future, and if I need special tips not available on the FX-100 I can still buy a FX-951Thanks everyone for their advice! I really have to say that buying something like a scope or a signal generator or other test gear is a piece of cake compared to finding the right soldering station, and I've seriously underestimated the complexity that goes into soldering equipment.

author: hayatepilot
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2015, 02:37:22 pm
content: So, when can we expect a thorough review of the FX-100 from you?O0Greetings

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2015, 02:56:43 pm
content: Quote from: hayatepilot on September 25, 2015, 02:37:22 pmI'll do one when it arrives and I'm done finishing my R&S CMU200/CRTU Review

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2015, 04:26:52 pm
content: Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on September 25, 2015, 02:30:38 pmNow, I don't have one, but from my perspective.. that's bollocks. The power supply can't change the laws of physics.It could simply be driving more power into the tip for a short duration (until it overheats itself), though.

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2015, 04:48:34 pm
content: Quote from: Monkeh on September 25, 2015, 04:26:52 pmThat's what it does, but it's only 5-10deg C more so not by much.Anyways, it might be that I won't get my FX-100 after allBatterfly has just informed me that the soldering station is on stock but none of the tips I wanted are, and even worse, I couldn't find another source who actually has them on stock, UK and abroad. I inquired with two Hakko distributors and both said they'd have to order them with a lead time of 4+ weeks. Batterfly said they'll inquire with their supplier and will come back to me, but considering that I couldn't get most of them anywhere else (well, I found a few on Amazon US, but the sellers there won't sell to abroad) I don't have much hope.I remember that the FX-100 came out last year, and by now I would have expected that the tips should be readily available. Which could explain why the FX-100 seems to be so rare.So it looks I'll be back to square one again

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 25, 2015, 05:29:18 pm
content: Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on September 25, 2015, 05:36:23 amFWIW, the JBC will outperform the FX-951 (not tried the Pace), and availability won't be an issue in the UK.BTW, have you considered an Ersa i-Con Nano?Performance is on par with a Weller WS81 or WD1 w/WP80 or WSP80 irons, and FX-950/1 for example. Excellent tip quality, they're in expensive, and have an excellent selection. Availability is good as well (multiple sources).Quote from: John Coloccia on September 25, 2015, 08:29:11 amThe FX-951 is a fine station, and one heck of a value in the North American market at least (especially when you take TEquipment's current pricing into account).Well worth the extra money as an upgrade to the FX-888 IMHO (~$200 less than a JBC Compact w/ 245 iron IIRC).Makes JBC's performance gain come at quite a premium here at least, so I do understand your point of only going after it if needed. Not so sure this works out the same way in other markets though from what I've seen of UK/EU pricing for example.Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on September 25, 2015, 09:27:02 amAny of them that uses the 245 iron. The compact model mentioned will be less expensive than the modular versions, but the trade-off is you can't use other tools with it (can't change the stand).Quote from: John Coloccia on September 25, 2015, 09:44:29 amThe value it represents in the US doesn't cover all markets unfortunately, potentially making other brands/models a better choice (spares & consumable availability as well).For example, the Ersa i-Con Nano is a better value in the EU market IMHO (i.e. 177EUR for the Nano vs. 300EUR for the FX-951). The FX-950 is closer @ 225EUR, but you lose features (analog version for 220/230/240V markets).

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 26, 2015, 03:55:49 am
content: As a point of reference, I looked at the JBC CD1-BD. My problem was the $230 USD price difference before tips. I simply couldn't justify the cost difference. There was even a real difference in the cost of tips. I ended up adding the Metcal with 5 tips for about $190 so for about the cost of the CD-1BD without tips, I have the FX-951, the MX-500 and tips.I haven't yet done a lot of soldering with both stations yet, just initial impressions on how they work. I am currently soldering 2 Arduino Uno proto shields for Jack-o-Lantern projects for the grandkids. I am doing 1 with the Metcal and will do the other with the Hakko, just to get used to using them. I have some smd practice boards, protoboards and components coming in and I will be doing a side by side comparison between the 2 stations. Some of the tests include timing how long it takes to solder 5W resistors to 1" square copper pads, see if there is thermal drop off while soldering 100 through hole resistors onto protoboards with through hole plating as quick as possible, and soldering Western Union splices on 12 and 10 AWG wire (with timing). I'm going to try to give them a real workout to see just what they can do. That should be sometime in November/December as some stuff is on the slow boat from China.

author: John Coloccia
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 26, 2015, 07:14:02 am
content: You're not in the Connecticut area, are you?

author: Armxnian
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 26, 2015, 07:34:09 am
content: What are the advantages of these high end soldering stations compared to a fx888d for example?

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 26, 2015, 12:50:00 pm
content: Quote from: John Coloccia on September 26, 2015, 07:14:02 amNo, the sunny state of Flori-Duh.Quote from: Armxnian on September 26, 2015, 07:34:09 amI started off with a Hakko 936. The warm up time on the 951 and MX-500 is a few seconds compared to 30 for the 936. Thermal recovery between joints is instantaneous. The thinner wands are much more comfortable to use and the closer tip to grip gap gives more control. Tip changes are easier and faster. The 951 and MX-500 heat the joint to be soldered much quicker so less thermal stress. The auto sleep and auto off functions are nice to save tips. I would still forget to turn off the 936 even after adding a power LED. My 936 served me well but it is going to a new home.It really comes down to your needs and budget. Did I need the 951 or the MX-500. Nope. I just wanted a nice soldering iron. We live on a tight budget but I was able to clean some stuff out of the garage to fund the purchases of the 951 and the MX-500. SWMBO has always supported me on spending money on tools I actually use. If you do a lot of soldering, it is well worth the money to upgrade to the better equipment. Taken care of properly, they will last for years. If you don't just look at price and look at total cost of ownership-ease of use, flexibility, better work flow, less frustration at limitations-it just makes good sense to get the best you can get. Many posters here on the blog have said that the soldering iron is probably the one piece of gear that you will use the most. You might as well get the most iron that you can.

author: John Coloccia
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 26, 2015, 01:28:23 pm
content: Quote from: GreyWoolfe on September 26, 2015, 12:50:00 pmToo bad. We could gotten together and put your Metcal and Hakko 951, and my JBC, head to head on some of my production work. That would pretty much put to bed once and for all who's king when it comes to this sort of stuff.Incidentally, if anyone IS in the Hartford area with a MX-5200, or something like that, and you want to drop by the shop to do a little shootout with the JBC, let me know and we'll see if we can work it out.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 26, 2015, 02:34:44 pm
content: Quote from: John Coloccia on September 26, 2015, 01:28:23 pmThere may be a way to come up with a meaningful enough comparison test, despite the distance.PM sent.

author: John Coloccia
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 26, 2015, 02:43:34 pm
content: I'll do what I can to help.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 26, 2015, 02:56:06 pm
content: Quote from: John Coloccia on September 26, 2015, 02:43:34 pmIt will be appreciated, thanks.

author: Fat
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 27, 2015, 08:53:18 pm
content: Just picked up a Metcal PS900. More of a hobbyist model than the others the produce, but it still blows the socks off my Hakko 888 (which is still a great iron). I paid $180 for an open box with five tips, a bit of solder, some flux and a few other things. To my disappointment it didn't come with the sleep mode stand and I had to order that separate. Still a very nice iron and it really puts out the heat on a ground plane.Fat

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 28, 2015, 01:10:37 am
content: Welcome to the Metcal Club

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 28, 2015, 11:28:28 am
content: A little update: I'll get the FX-100 after allBatterfly has some T31 tips on stock which weren't the ones I wanted but they'll do for now, and I'll see when they get the other ones I wanted and then order them separately so that I'll have a good selection of tips available.The soldering station should arrive this week, so I'll probably be able to take it for a ride around the block during the weekend

author: Erythros
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: October 07, 2015, 08:55:31 am
content: Has it been delivered yet? If so could you open it up and take photos of nice resolution of the innards? I am very interested.Thank you.

author: deadlylover
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 08, 2015, 07:36:23 am
content: Quote from: Erythros on October 07, 2015, 08:55:31 amHere are some crappy pictures, I'm using a kit macro lens that's as slow as a wet week...If there's something in particular you want to see, let me know, I still refuse to pay $66 for a tip so it's not like the iron is being used at the moment.The part # for the heatsinked devices:LM2576HVTIRFI510GIRFB4020

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 08, 2015, 10:54:41 am
content: I have the oddest feeling that'll turn out to be a near exact copy of a Metcal.. Pieces of it certainly are.

author: Tech.DHarmer
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 01:47:05 am
content: Well I just ordered one of the fx-100s today. Hoping it turns out to be a good investment. Especially since mcm I think miss marked the price.

author: labjr
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 24, 2017, 04:52:22 pm
content: Quote from: Tech.DHarmer on March 16, 2017, 01:47:05 amDid you get the FX-100? What was the MCM price?

author: KL27x
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 25, 2017, 08:56:48 pm
content: QuoteIf you ever tried to remove SMD parts from ground plane in tight spots on multilayer board, it simply doesn't work very well or even at all with a regular iron. Ability to get a lot of power into a small tip will be gold, if this is a routine thing for you. These kinds of boards are usually assembled in an oven, but repair and rework are going to call for an iron.JBC has additional advantage if you are on the other end of the scale, too, soldering railroad spikes and the like.FWIW, the 888 and the 936 are not the same thing. The 936/7 has 45W. The 888 had 65W. The cold start up time is about 20 seconds or less on an 888. This difference of 44% more power is not insignificant when it comes to soldering temp retention/recovery.The 951 only has 75 or 80W.... but the integral heater is supposed to make it more responsive and efficient... a few seconds cold start on it, per Greywolfe, shows how big a difference the heater/tip design can make in efficiency, even without factoring in the improvement of the sensor feedback loop. It's not all about the power rating of what the PSU can give. One might extrapolate that the 951 is only 15% better at heating up your lab, but that it might be at least 300% better at getting the power to the tip of the iron.I have 888. In practice, this means when I come across a non thermally grounded thru hole pin or pad, I have to crank up the temp to compensate. This is pretty rare, for me. And there are things I could not do, at all, on multilayer boards. Which are even more rare, for me to be reworking. Hot air and a third hand to hold it can do as a bodge. Low temp soldering alloy. And the "two iron" trick can usually get me thru this rare case. But I'd upgrade in a heartbeat if I knew I was going to have to do this in advance.The things that the 888 can do very well are many, and I'm sure it would be awhile before I could completely replace it. Tip selection and all.