Vaping Device Teardown, Battery Waste and YouTube Ad Suitability - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: edy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 05, 2020, 05:04:05 pm
content: Hi folks,My dog almost ate a vaping device he found at night in a field. I noticed him holding some green cylinder in his mouth, so I promptly grabbed it. Then I noticed there was blue blinking light! How did it activate? I personally do not smoke or vape and never seen such a device before. After I figured out what it was, I decided to film a teardown to see what goes on inside.Firstly, I was not aware that Li-Ion or Li-Po batteries were used even in the DISPOSABLE devices. Seems like a waste, as I thought these could be recharged. I thought perhaps a different battery chemistry (non-rechargeable type) that was cheaper may be used. It looks like these DISPOSABLE devices do not allow exchange or refilling of the vaping solution so there's no point to having a rechargeable battery either.Secondly, I was confused as to the function of that sensor device that looks like a microphone/speaker, but I quickly figured it out after during editing so please forgive the stupid comments. I added text overlay to explain things later. I seems like the air pressure/flow sensor activates the heating element every time someone "draws" from the device and that momentarily vaporizes the liquid in the wick. Otherwise that current through the heating element is off. I believe the blue LED also activates at the same time to indicate when it is on.Thirdly, I have received limited ad suitability on YouTube for the video which I assume has to do with the fact that it is a VAPING or E-CIGARETTE type of device. It is not directed and does not feature children, and there is no mention of illegal substance use, etc. It is purely a factual scientific analysis of the device and teardown. I do not promote or advocate or even comment on my opinion of whether one should use this or not. I'm assuming YouTube will just mark anything having to do with these more "fringe" things as being advertiser unfriendly. I never knew this, now I know.Are these things even properly electronically vetted and approved devices or are they generally just made cheaply somewhere and sort of get distributed through some black or grey market? Are there any safety considerations (from the electronic design point of view) and is there any reason why disposable devices would still use what seem to be re-usable batteries? Is it because of the energy density/performance needed to heat up a wick element, or is the cost just that cheap that they can be charged and used once and dropped? Mind you, they do not seem cheap... perhaps the cost of the battery is peanuts compared to the rest of the device. Also, what is the shelf-life of a "precharged" battery like this?

author: amyk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 06, 2020, 12:31:36 am
content: bigclivedotcom has gone through a few of those (some of the later videos he has deliberately avoided the word "vape" or "smoke", presumably for the reason you found out) and also laments the waste of it all. In general I think lithium rechargeables have completely eclipsed primary cells and thus become much cheaper even in a disposable application.

author: eti
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 06, 2020, 04:01:06 am
content: Possession and use of "vaping" equipment is a really simple and effective moron detector.

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 06, 2020, 11:40:15 am
content: A couple of bits that could be put to someusefulpurpose then!

author: edy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 06, 2020, 12:19:02 pm
content: The video was opportunistic as I would never normally have obtained such a device. I probably shouldn't have been surprised that YouTube won't merge ads with it. I noticed even some videos by Thunderf00t talking about masks and COVID science were also affected because YouTube is lumping all such videos in the same "basket" of conspiracy theories and it can't tell the difference between proponents and debunkers. There are probably plenty of videos showing off vaping products that look exactly like mine but obviously have a very different intent.One interesting thought is that compared to vaping, smoking may be better for the environment! Think of all the acres of land devoted to growing tobacco and carbon sequestration. Yes eventually the carbon gets released again but there is a cycle present. With vaping, especially disposable, there has to be tons of waste and energy all used that goes to waste and ends up in landfill.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 06, 2020, 12:48:27 pm
content: Quote from: amyk on October 06, 2020, 12:31:36 amOr more likely, a way to "dispose" of rejects that do not perform to specification.Quote from: edy on October 06, 2020, 12:19:02 pmI wouldn't be surprised if smoking is better than not smoking in terms of carbon footprint because the shortened lifetime makes for less CO2 emissions. That doesn't mean environmentalists should smoke...

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2022, 09:39:51 pm
content: I've recently found a load of these vape devices discarded on a green, near where I work.I also have a need for a 500mAh battery. I have an old USB rechargeable bicycle light, with a dead battery and the flat Li-ion battery in one of those vape devices fitted perfectly. Unfortunately I've left it on charge at work, so won't be able to tell whether it works, or has blown the place up, until tomorrow.One word of caution: the batteries used in the disposable vapes don't have any battery protection circuitry. Always make sure you salvage the battery protection board, from the device you're replacing battery, or buy one, if it's for your own project!

author: eti
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2022, 04:53:30 am
content: Quote from: eti on October 06, 2020, 04:01:06 amYes. People are extremely gullible to pump chemicals into their lungs, just because they BELIEVE “it’s harmless, unlike tobacco”.Stupid to the power of infinity. To add to that, they also think they look “cool”, whereas they look like dorks.

author: magic
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2022, 07:48:00 am
content: I wonder what can be said about agreeing with your own posts a year later

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2022, 08:32:49 am
content: Quote from: edy on October 06, 2020, 12:19:02 pmWhat's worse is genuine medical doctors have been censored, for stating things which were widely regarded as true, until recently and have been proven by the Centers for Disease Control, this week.Quote from: eti on January 26, 2022, 04:53:30 amWhat a load of bollocks.Those who I've spoken to, who vape, don't think it's completely harmless, just that it's an order of magnitude less harmful, than tobacco.Anyway, my bicycle light had been charged and is now working. I don't know how long the replacement battery will last. Now, I don't know what to do with the 15 odd remaining disposable vapes. I will probably be in need of a 500mAh battery in the future, but can't see myself using them all, assuming they're all good.

author: amyk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2022, 02:35:49 pm
content: I thought this thread got bumped because bigclivedotcom recently posted another video on the topic:Not just battery waste...

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2022, 03:07:13 pm
content: Yes, I have seen BigClive's video recently, but I also remembered this thread and the original poster's video and decided to bump it, rather than create a new one.

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2022, 11:15:39 pm
content: Was curious about the costs:Here they have the aquavape for 6 for $30 ($5/ea):https://www.aquavape.co.uk/product-category/disposable-e-cigarette/smok-mbar-pro/QuoteThe cheapest model was $3.50 each:https://www.aquavape.co.uk/product/ultd-puff-bar-apple-blow-20mg/with a 280mAh cell.Of course disappointing they are even allowed to sell disposable batteries like this, but also there is no mention, that I see, of responsibly disposing of the electronics. So 99% of people will toss it in the trash.

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 27, 2022, 08:48:15 am
content: Or worse, dumped on a green, or in the bushes, where the nasty chemicals leak out and cause pollution.The trouble is, they're much cheaper than a packet of fags. There's a huge duty on cigarettes in the UK, whilst I believe vapes are only subject to standard VAT.Clearly something needs to be done. They could put a huge duty on vapes, but make replacement batteries and refills cheap, or perhaps the single use variety should be just banned. A recycling scheme is another option, but I doubt it's economical to clean, recharge and refill them and many people will be a funny about using a refurbished vape.

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 16, 2022, 08:25:18 pm
content: Quote from: kerencostley on May 16, 2022, 02:26:16 pmThat's a valid concern, which can applies even more so to cigarettes, which are cheaper to produce and subject to a much more tax.

author: eti
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2022, 06:16:04 am
content: Substance addiction, falling for fads, wanting to "look cool" and "my mates all have them" seem to override uncommon sense. LOL

author: AndyBeez
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2022, 04:35:20 pm
content: I saw one of those vape things abandoned in the street yesterday, laying part crushed by the curb. It did cross my mind that there could be a really decent LiPo cell awaiting salvage - a la Big Clive. Then I thought, let's do the right thing and kick it into the drain, before anyone catchesMonkey Pox. No, it didn't spontaneously explode on water contact.A question, how exactly does China/Vietnam/Cambodia manufacture and FULLY charge LiPo cells so cheap for single use? UK wise, ajuicey-flavavape is no more than £5 full retail. Bulk discounts available. The LiPo cells must be no dearer than a PP3 cell?

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2022, 07:08:23 pm
content: Quote from: AndyBeez on May 22, 2022, 04:35:20 pmIf you weren't interested in salvaging anything, the best thing you could have done would have been to pick it up and throw it into the nearest rubbish bin. Kicking it down the drain was a bad idea, because most drains in the street, go into the local lake/river/groundwater, where any nasty chemicals such as those found in batteries, can harm the environment. If you didn't want to pick it up, then you should have just left it, for someone else to dispose of.QuoteI honestly don't know. Tobacco is highly taxed in the UK, so any alternative will be cheaper to buy, even if it costs much more to make. The government don't want to tax vapes because they're over an order of magnitude less unhealthy, compared to tobacco. Banning the single use variety is a much better idea and would probably even benefit the user more.

author: themadhippy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2022, 07:26:00 pm
content: QuoteAnd these nasty chemicals are? propylene glycol and vegetable glycerin ,both widely used in the food industry.

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2022, 07:37:13 pm
content: Quote from: themadhippy on May 22, 2022, 07:26:00 pmThe counterargument is those chemicals are used in food, rather than inhaled, but it's a moot point, since there are far more dangerous chemicals in cigarette smoke.

author: hneve
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2024, 07:09:17 pm
content: I've always been curious about the tech behind these gadgets but never delved deep. It's surprising to hear about the use of Li-Ion or Li-Po batteries in disposables; I would've guessed they'd opt for something less sophisticated given the single-use nature. Your teardown sounds like an eye-opener, especially with the sensor bit. It's a smart way to control usage, but yeah, the disposable aspect does raise questions about waste and environmental impact. As for YouTube's ad policies, they're pretty strict with anything that could be seen as promoting smoking or vaping, even if it's educational. It seems like a fine line between sharing information and unintentionally promoting use.Regarding your point on safety and market distribution, it's a mixed bag. Some brands are diligent about safety and compliance, while others might skate by with minimal oversight, especially in less regulated markets. The use of high-performance batteries probably boils down to ensuring a consistent experience, even if it does seem like overkill for something you're just going to toss. For those looking at nicotine alternatives that might not involve as much tech or waste, you couldbuy zyn online. It's a different way to approach nicotine, without the complexities of vaping devices.

author: Andy Chee
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2024, 07:34:17 pm
content: Quote from: hneve on February 08, 2024, 07:09:17 pmEconomically speaking, it makes sense to utilise existing Li-ion battery production lines, rather than build a new factory for single-use vape batteries.

author: slybunda
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2024, 07:40:50 pm
content: people are throwing these things away all the time. im going to collect them, the battery can be used in small projects.

author: RJSV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2024, 10:35:58 pm
content: Ha, first thing that came to mind, was observing a guy that just exited from Calif. DMV(Motor vehicles); He must have been stressed, to the max, inside the place, literally PACKED to the gills with folks waiting for turn at counters with an agent. The dude had the thing going on step #3 as he exited the place. Hope that was only tobacco, there, as there are Cannabis extract vapes also.In California, some THC containing products are sold, and I've noticed that various underprivileged folks gravitate to the small shops, in order to make a living as employee...when perhaps some major conviction and lack of quality education precludes more formal work. So they view that as an alternative work or business option.Anyway, it certainly would make sense, to get collection of the used parts for re-extracting lithium, for one example. In future years, many valuable minerals will, essentially be forced into modes of sales that ensure proper recycling...if not also proper waste isolation (and long-term storage.)God help us, if somebody figures out a route for including Fentanyl as a potentially deadly ingredient, (if not already!).

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2024, 10:32:37 pm
content: Quote from: Andy Chee on February 08, 2024, 07:34:17 pmYes, that is the reason. But that's of course unfortunate. The reason beyond cost is that of energy density. It's hard to find the same kind of energy density in a primary battery, at least with a chemistry that is safe and with a low cost.Alkaline batteries would probably not cut it, or be much too heavy for the purpose for the required capacity. You'd need more like LiSOCI2 batteries or similar, but these are expensive and I'm not even sure you can find them in the required volume and weight with enough output power. So, in the end, the choice is quickly made.

author: Andy Chee
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2024, 12:38:18 am
content: Incidentally, due to the slightly different mechanical attributes, notably the lack of "nipple" terminals and metal case, vape batteries will have minor omissions in their manufacturing process compared to the average 18650 cell production line. However, the raw ingredients remain the same.And just for comparison, the somewhat "dirtier" looking AA battery manufacturing process.