DS1052E Up to 150Mhz - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: dimlow
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2010, 04:03:11 am
content: Found this scope on the nethttp://www.hb17.net/product.asp?id=3040,its 150Mhz, changed my Model Number to DS1152E and now it seems to be a 150Mhz scope! I dont have the equipment to test if it atually works but my timebase is now down to 2ns as with the 100Mhz. I recalibrated the scope and it looks like i see more detail in the waveforms.Others/Dave need to try this.

author: dimlow
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2010, 04:38:55 am
content: Yea, link seems dead here to strange worked a while ago. No I never learn from lessons. Anyway just search for DS1152E its a Chinese site but has specs you can read, i used google to translate. Upgrade procedure is the same as before.

author: dimlow
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2010, 04:41:54 am
content: @Shafri What time is it there ? are you a fellow insomniac ?I seem to be getting more wobbly bits now

author: rossmoffett
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2010, 05:38:31 am
content: Quote from: dimlow on October 11, 2010, 04:03:11 amI get an error at that site, but 150 MHz is consistent with what I got when I removed the filter entirely with a hardware mod. I actually measured the tipping point at around 140 MHz. It's a little tricky to interpret that data, and I'm not entirely sure of it, but I'm pretty sure the indication there is that I had a 140 MHz bandwidth.https://www.eevblog.com/forum/index.php?topic=30.msg2059#msg2059As I recall the datasheets for the hardware indicated that the weakest link was at around 150 MHz bandwidth too.Please note that this was posted before I fully understood the filter, the schematic is incorrect.

author: dimlow
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2010, 10:06:36 am
content: Ok Downgraded and done some test,Not sure now if it did work there does seem to be a small change in the trace from DS1102E to DS1152E, but nothing much, maybe i need to change the serial too.The scope was set to factory defaultModel Changed to DS1052EModel Changed to DS1102EModel Changed to DS1152E

author: scrat
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2010, 10:09:54 am
content: Someone already spoke about a 1152E/D model...Search for "1152E" here:http://www.eevblog.com/2009/04/05/full-review-of-the-rigol-ds1052e/.However, the link posted there doesn't take to anything about 1152E...

author: dimlow
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2010, 10:24:31 am
content: When i animate these three pics i get this.Also when i measure the rise time on my 400Mhz scope it tells me its 2.2ns

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 11, 2010, 10:41:25 am
content: Not sure if the difference between 100MHz and '150MHz' is large enough to be significant. The amplitude of the '150MHz' picture also seems slightly smaller. A Gaussian scope with 150MHz bandwidth should have a rise time of 2.3ns, so a 2.2ns pulse is not really fast enough to test it. I would also verify aberrations / bandwidth flatness to see if it's really flat(ish) up to the 150MHz -3dB point, and check if the attenuator is actually linear at this frequency. I suspect the attenuator is not even linear to 100MHz, but I've not been able to verify this in person.It seems really suspicious to sell a machine that can do 150MHz but not offer a 150MHz model for sale, suggests that they're not confident that it can actually reliably do 150MHz. It's hard to argue that they designed it for 150MHz and use identical parts for lower model to save costs if they don't sell a 150MHz version. If the ADC circuit was designed for 100MHz bandwidth, you might see more aliasing.

author: dimlow
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2010, 10:56:52 am
content: I think its time for me to hand it over to someone else thatA. Really knows what they are talking about.B. Has better testing equipment.Edit.. the rise time measured on my 400Mhz scope is 2.82ns (typo), i guess thats not fast enough at all.

author: Polossatik
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2010, 12:09:44 am
content: Quote from: dimlow on October 11, 2010, 04:38:55 amThe link ishttp://www.hb17.net/product.asp?id=3040without a , at the end

author: rossmoffett
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2010, 02:27:45 am
content: Quote from: shafri on October 11, 2010, 07:11:23 amI just looked back at that thread again, specificallyhere, and I don't think the hardware mod can do anything to bring bandwidth up to 150 MHz. There's nothing about those control signals that would make the bandwidth any higher, so if there is indeed any change it is not in the same section that affected the 50/100 MHz mod.

author: gandalfg8
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 03, 2011, 01:20:45 am
content: Quote from: shafri on October 11, 2010, 07:13:35 amAnyone feeling adventurous?:-)

author: tyblu
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 04, 2011, 02:19:07 am
content: I believe there are ten 40MHz ADCs clocked at 100MHz, giving 1GS/s, limiting ADC conversions to 500MHz. The limiting factors would be the analog front end (probes, attenuator and amplifier), clock jitter, and trigger noise. The analog front end is likely the largest contributor, though trigger noise would be close, especially for averaging periodic signals (like a sampling 'scope). Why do I mention this? The program may spit out values at 150MHz, but there is likely little gain. In fact, the DSP algorithms (decimation and resampling or cardinal spans) may be compromised due to lack of previous antialiasing. Be careful!Would love to see someone characterize the  inputs with a 1GHz+ VNA.

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 15, 2011, 12:37:07 pm
content: Exellent find, tinhead!Via google translate:http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fdrieg.sweb.cz%2Frigol%2Fupg.html&sl=cs&tl=en&hl=&ie=UTF-8Seems like the guy is offering to do "upgrades" as a service, and he seems to be a Czech Rigol dealer, and after the upgrade you still have a factory warranty? Converting Czech korona to dollars, the price is fairly high over there.Quote from: tinhead on February 15, 2011, 02:37:52 am

author: tinhead
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 15, 2011, 03:49:32 pm
content: well, actually Rigol DS1062CA costs 18 990 K?, that's 782EUR or 1056USD. If you compare to goodluckbuy you saving already 200USDand you will get the information (probably for free if you buy there) how to hack it to 300MHz.

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 15, 2011, 04:46:49 pm
content: Yes, that's a good price relative to $US, much better scope in terms of sampling and memory. But, I was looking at the 1000E series, e.g. 1052E, a 11,290 K ~ $625. Plus 2000K for the hack, if you want him to do it, pretty pricey in the end. I guess, he is trying to sell the CA series more.http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&sl=cs&tl=en&u=http://drieg.sweb.cz/rigol/ds1052e.html&rurl=translate.google.com&twu=1&usg=ALkJrhhCIDjDBfeY0zkBZAfbRcM3JTK1eAQuote from: tinhead on February 15, 2011, 03:49:32 pm

author: AlphZeta
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 15, 2011, 04:55:33 pm
content: From the link I am wondering if it is the same "Drieg" that helped a lot of folks on the forum...

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 15, 2011, 06:48:21 pm
content: If it is, drieg deserves our praise; I think he's the only one on this forum, probably online, who has found a quick way to repair bricked Rigol 1052Es. It also suggests he is the best person to do 'upgrades' with lowest chance of bricking, even as Rigol brings out new firmware.Quote from: AlphZeta on February 15, 2011, 04:55:33 pm

author: Regnirps
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: February 16, 2011, 07:47:23 am
content: From the table of equivalents posted earlier,If you buy from china:Hantek DSO5202M = Tekway DST1202B = Protek 3210Hantek DSO5102M = Tekway DST1102B = Protek 3110Hantek DSO5062M = Tekway DST1062BThis morning in Shanghai the Hantek DSO5102M can be found for 2800 RMB and the Tekway DST1102B for 3300 RMB. Are you sure they are the same? I'd rather not get both. I can call someone in Shenzhen to check the discounters in the SEG building.

author: tinhead
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 16, 2011, 11:47:43 am
content: Quote from: Regnirps on February 16, 2011, 07:47:23 amdude, this is wrong thread and yes they are the same (be careful, Hantek M not N)

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 18, 2011, 07:50:07 am
content: this is pretty amazing, the scope I bought for £239 and got a £50 discount on can do 150 MHz - WOW, wow.Time to go looking for my RS232 cable. let us know as soon as you have something certain chaps, I'm getting that exited feeling again

author: dimlow
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2011, 10:05:30 am
content: You lot have taken your time with this, i have had the scope at 150Mhz for ages now, its does work!

author: ElektroQuark
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 18, 2011, 03:33:31 pm
content: Firmware and detailed instructions?Thanks.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 18, 2011, 03:49:43 pm
content: yea, lay your cards on the table or stop braggingTo be honest who would think they could do 150MHz ? I mean they only went up to a 100MHz model. Maybe the 150MHz version was planned but never came to light. of course we also need to remember that at 100 MHz with 1GS/s (on one channel only) that's the ideal min of 10 samples per waveform, at 150MHz that's 6.7 samples per wave, although still fine on repetitive stuff

author: tinhead
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2011, 04:07:56 pm
content: Quote from: Simon on February 18, 2011, 03:49:43 pmyou can get easily higher than this, 5 samples per wave is common value giving of on single chan up to 200MHz and dual chan 100MHz.Rigol maybe never did it because of planned and now available 2GSs models, or maybe because the DSP was too slow to handle properthe data (you remember the two chans bug - running with long mem and 100MHz).

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 18, 2011, 04:52:16 pm
content: well to be honest I'd want to see 10 samples at least for "captures"

author: tinhead
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2011, 05:22:05 pm
content: sure, 10x oversampling is better than 5x, and 20x better than 10x ... the necessary oversamplingdepends at least on signal form, capture mode.For continuously signals reduced amplitude due bw limitation is worser than 5x oversampling,but i'm sure you know this.

author: dimlow
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2011, 05:33:42 pm
content: Quote from: Simon on February 18, 2011, 03:49:43 pmThe info for doing it was in the first post here, you just change the Model Number as before. There is a 150Mhz version of the scope that is not sold in the rest of the world. That's where i got the info from!Just search the net for DS1152E-EDU.Its a no Brainer

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 18, 2011, 06:55:18 pm
content: Quote from: tinhead on February 18, 2011, 04:07:56 pmSample rate closer to the Nyquist frequency does require a steeper filter roll-off of the input filter (eg. brick-wall response) and better interpolation (wasn't there a post about interpolation errors some time ago?). Maybe they compensated for poor interpolation and filtering by increasing the sampling rate?

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2011, 10:07:37 pm
content: I could hack my scope to 150 MHz at a later date, once I need to get higher than 50 MHz, under which I currently work, but one best be clear about the sampling artifacts that occur even at 100 MHz.The threads discussing it are all over eevblog. You can overcome the input filter, but the sampling and memory length are still the same, whether its a 50 or 150 MHz scope.See discussions and threads with posts by rf-loop, jahonen and others. I think rf-loop is also instrumentvu and posted this over 2 year ago:What is basically shown is that 100 MHz on a single channel on a 100 MHz rated 1102E, providing 1Gs/s is already tasking the scope, you can see the sine wave wavering about at 100 MHz, and its from a Fluke scope calibrator at that, so the signal source is good. When he switches on the second channel, it worsens, since the Rigol goes into 500Ms/s. Then he switches on long memory length it drops to 250 Ms/s, at 2.5x the Nyquist frequency, and finally turns off sinx/x and watch what happens. Why he got any negative comments for such a clear response baffles me. My guess, its a language barrier thing.What is shown won't change if you hack the scope to 150 MHz, those arereal timesampling artifacts. So if you do, even at 100 MHz, the basic 1000E hardware with 2 channels the scope is really best to 50 MHz at the default memory depth, and with long memory, its down to 25 MHz.Since I have an unmodded 1052E, I have reproduced rf-loops issue by switching on 2 channels with long memory, which turns the scope into 25 MHz, and looking at say a 40 MHz sine wave and it gives the same goofiness as the last images on the youtube link.The good news is you can overcome some of this by using equivalent time sampling, which isn't shown on the demo, so long as you are measuring repetitive signals. But if not, one should be aware of these limitations.

author: tinhead
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2011, 11:05:15 pm
content: yes it know his review, the first thig i checked on my Tekway was exact same setting with a bit different results. With 100MHz test signal and 4kpts the aplitude didn't change if you enable ch2.You can't see any influence at all. Of course if you increase the frequency the signal becomes more artifacts, but the overall amplitude stay the same up to 200Mhz.This of course change as soon you enable 40kpts (or 512kpts), which is basically caused by SRAM speed.All these designs (Rigol, Tekway, Hantek, UNI-T, Instek) have one big gap, in long memory mode you can't just capture more than 100MHz signalsand if you enable second channel it if even worser (max freq. on Tekway/Hantek is 90Mhz without any signal aplitude lose).This is probably why Rigol never (really) produced D/E series with more than 100Mhz bw. Becuase of much higher wfrm/s and better filtering Hantek/Tekway are able to do this,but only with 4pts memory enabled. As i remember Instek and Owon (and probably Rigol in CA series) is interleaving SRAM, that's the way to go with external memory.In eq. mode or avg. mode signals are of course very clear (talking about repetitive signals), but that's nothing new. For single shot i already accepted that more thanthe FPGA integrated memory is not possible with this class of DSOs (just because of end price), which is sad (still comparing to my old TDS754D)but as always, you get what you paid for (which is still much better than TDS2000C series btw.)

author: scrat
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2011, 08:51:06 am
content: Although this was not sufficiently pointed out about the Rigol, of course if one knows sampling frequency is halving each time you enable a channel or the long memory it is possible to predict those artifacts.However, another problem with aliasing is the possibility of an (unwanted and unknown) input at frequency over Nyquist being easily read as a low-frequency signal, even considerig the selectivity of input LPF (which someone has shown to be poor). The problem is quite common, however (even where you don't expect it). Let me make an example that may sound h awkward: you frequently have to pay attention to aliasing on a mid-end (5000) Tektronix, too, since its default timebase/sampling frequency ratio was badly choosen (at least for long time windows). The fact is, of course, on the Tek you can rotate the knob to increase sampling rate, while in the Rigol...

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 21, 2011, 06:11:50 pm
content: Agree fully with you, scrat, folks need to be aware that the hack isn't the end-all be all of getting the scope's bandwidth improved; you need to pay attention to the sampling frequency and memory depth. Dave's review of the new Agilent Infinivision scopes is what you'd expect in a scope rating, its 2Gs/s single channel, but it remains at 1Gs/s up to 4 channels, for a scope rated at 70MHz, a conservative rating that the sampling and bandwidth will clearly support. Now, the top scope in that series is 200 MHz, how those scopes maintain the sampling rate on each channel would be good to see.On the Rigol, it isn't made very clear, but if you press Horizontal MENU button, the sampling rate will appear. You can "adjust" the scope sampling rate by going to Acquire, and turning sinx/x off or on, and adjust long or normal memory depth, and watch the rate change. Finally, adjust the time base, you can see the sampling rate change, and try to balance all these controls for the best balance.Quote from: scrat on February 19, 2011, 08:51:06 am

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 21, 2011, 06:20:38 pm
content: Yes, tinhead, as always this is great information. its good the Tekway performs a bit better. Users need to be aware there's more than the amplitude at issue, its the quality, just be aware of sampling introduced distortion as you approach the bandwith roll off, so there are some other limitations happening that isn't tested by just the rise time.In equivalent sampling the wave form can appear better, but its still richer in artifacts, you can see this when doing FFT. You can 'smooth' the artifacts out by using averaging acquisition, but clearly, you are at the scope's capacity limits.In Dave's current review on Agilent's new Infiniivision 2000X doing 50,000 wfms/s, he was able to calculate the Rigol 1052E wfms/s rate, using an Agilent 'glitch' generator as a guide, the Rigol rates at ~ 800 wfms/s, in single channel mode; it would be good to see what this rate is when 2 channels are engaged.Quote from: tinhead on February 18, 2011, 11:05:15 pm

author: scrat
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 22, 2011, 12:03:26 pm
content: Since the Rigol doesn't use color grade code for representing "statistically" how much the signal stays on a point (as the Agilent and Tek phosphor-like visualization do), the wfms/s rate is the real graphics refresh rate (graphics, not display). I expect this to be even worse than 800wfms/s, at least in zero persistence mode. This is a great difference, since infinite persistence isn't that comfortable to use, while on good DSOs you can see infrequent signals in normal persistence too.However, to make an acceptable comparison, many glitch catches should be made...Quote from: saturation on February 21, 2011, 06:20:38 pm.

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 22, 2011, 02:54:59 pm
content: You're right scrat, good point, the only way to see those glitches with the Rigol was to use persistence mode and its 800 wfms/s shouldn't be based while in persistence mode, my mistake, but its the only way you'll ever see the glitch with a Rigol 1000E series.Quote from: scrat on February 22, 2011, 12:03:26 pm

author: therian
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: February 23, 2011, 12:35:16 pm
content: I want to clarify:1) model #, change it to DS1152E or DS1152E-EDU ?2) 5th letter in serial change to F ?I did the first variation above and my info screen say DS1152E without -EDU part, please tell me did it work or I have to redo it ?

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 23, 2011, 10:09:47 pm
content: Quote from: saturation on February 18, 2011, 10:07:37 pmThis is need correct. I'm not instrumentvu!I have only tell something about wrong sinx/x issue. Simple, Rigol do not any sinx/x calcualtion. It is only some kind of dsp filtering what try some kind of "sinx/x" like picture. This scope and its way to do Sinx/x is just nearly as "do nice picture". And with some wrong parameters. It can see in my pictures what link is in original thread.Before and now I tell that I'm tightly with this:Agilent, Chris Rehorn: Sin(x)/x Interpolation: An Important Aspect of Proper Oscilloscope Measurements(http://i.cmpnet.com/planetanalog/2009/02/Sin(x)x_Agilent.pdf)Also I have one OLD tektronix scope (Digi but crt) and It seems do nearly real sinx/x. It can show also highlighted all real samples and then curve what it draw just as sinx/x and there is huge difference between Rigol DSP filtering and Tektronix expensive solution. Rigol sinx/x is only cosmetics. And it breaks all basic principles. Lot of below nyquist it product huge attenuation - really wrong if think measurements and not stupid picture art on scope display.. Alone this tell that it is not anything else but bad filter for cosmetics. Measuring equipments need different thinking and nice free art picture need other.Also analog channel frequency response is very bad, And also it do not adjust frequency response as samplerate change and also there are not any kind of care about aliasing, not even warning about aliasing situation. ( Even My old -80's HP digi have - but it have no sinx/x becouse it always show only and alone real sample points and not any cosmetic stuffs) Also Rigol is bad gaussian what make aliasing problem really bad.. But if think price and if know limitations... it is acceptable.Good analog channel for (high-end) digital scope is reaaly difficult to do and expensive - there is not so many who can and even less who want pay it... so.. Rigol is not high-end... not middle-end and it do not need it... but Rigol can littlebit adjust this filter... if they care anything about customers - but this company really do not care anything. They do as they do... and peoples buy if they buy. Simple strategy. If they care customers they do corrections... also other... nearly all what they want do is try make modification more difficult. This is they customer care policy.But it is not only Rigol... there are some others that make real garbage.Entertainment display and measuring equipment... measuring is numbers, in this case digitized samples, art is example nice figures... this they have littlebit forget in Rigol company (and many other company)Most bad is that Rigol destroy only facts... digitized real samples... they are only "true" and these they put to garbage and then draw some kind of nice looking curve where is in worst case not any true points. This is not Sinx/x idea. Drawed curve do not fit these sampled poiints at all. This is real mistake. If they do not understand ... more bad. maybe they get more money if they start making boohoo teddybears. Yes, I can shut off this but I can not understand why they do not repair it. I know, they do not care. And most of customers do not understand... becouse they just look onlu nice pictures, maybe not do any real measurements.Rigol is ok, with its price and limits. manufacturing quality is not bad...But in Rigol sinx/x can shut off... HanTekway can not... I hope it is better.

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 23, 2011, 10:56:18 pm
content: Thanks rf-loop, at least then 2 separate people found added limitations with the Rigol 1000E series that folks should be made aware of, that the hack doesn't fix, and this goes back at least 1-2 years ago.It would be interesting to see if the Agilent version has the same problems.Quote from: rf-loop on February 23, 2011, 10:09:47 pm

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 24, 2011, 05:19:47 am
content: thanx rf-loop, maybe thats the answer why rigol sin(x)/x doesnt do me any good, i always turn it off, i prefer ugly random polygons, it has the feel of true sampled measurements. and i dont think the sinx/x will improve "enough resolution data" any better, i only feel it will only slow down the capture process.

author: therian
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: February 27, 2011, 04:09:29 am
content: Anyone ? the idea that I done something wrong keep bugging me

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 27, 2011, 06:05:11 am
content: you are allright therian, you dont have to (and should not) include the EDU.

author: dimlow
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 27, 2011, 08:18:44 am
content: There is no need to change the serial number, but you do have to send a serial number to the scope after you have changed the model number or else the scope will not store the model number change. And its a capital 'E' you need, DS1152E

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 27, 2011, 02:07:13 pm
content: Maybe all peoples who buy Rigol oscilloscope have not seen this Rigol official statement.http://www.progshop.com/pdf/oscilloscopes/Rigol/Statement%20of%20Rigol.pdf"Rigol doesn’t authorize anybody to sell Rigol products directly from China to Europe."Some sellers still argument that they are selling as "Rigol authorized distributor" (example for selling to EU)Exactly, they are not. (I mean these sellers what this paper is talking)Including DX, DeX etc.If not believe, ask Rigol.And, what about this:"Some products from illegal sales channels are not even originally produced by Rigol Technologies, Inc."

author: scrat
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 27, 2011, 07:18:01 pm
content: Quote from: rf-loop on February 27, 2011, 02:07:13 pmRigol has so large production numbers and cost reduction knowledge that I think selling a fake Rigol (with about the same features) at a competitive price would be a hard challenge!

author: tinhead
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 27, 2011, 08:42:29 pm
content: for every (not only chinese) manufacturer there are some necessary steps to be some day "brand name manufacturer"- you have to design good and cheap products (Rigol did it few yrs ago)- you have to be visible on local and international market (since some time they known everywhere)- you have to have some legal issues with ppl coping your products (actually Rigol did copied Instek and not Atten Rigol, or like the court decided - a 1:1 copy of example circuit from components manufacturer app note is not "genuine" product)- you have to get some "promotion" from other brand name manufacturers (like a product compare [yeah there are some Rigol CA and Agilent DSOX2000 compares on Agilent website but no single word that e.g. Hantek is having 800x480 display or Owon 8" display - in this price category of DSOs - because these companyf "didn't exists yet forAgilent", but Rigol does], or co-operation - like with Agilent in the past, no matter what it costs ...)- you have to have world-wide support and distributors (that's not the cheap sellers giving you no support)- you have to release "high-end" product (Rigol's DS6000)(additionally you have to have at least small office in US to be able to sell there your porducts)So what, there was no single Rigol clone, maybe only some hacked relabeled devices (but only maybe), all Rigol was to looking forwas to establish distributor connections and global support - like other brand name manufacturers have.For sure a manufacturer can decide if a specific product will be available internationally and if who can sell/give you support, nothing new - and many manufacturers are doing this (to maximize revenue? probably too). 2yrs ago i bought some products from good knows manufacturer, you can buy them directly in EMEA (but you have to pay 250% of local price) or you can buy in HK, ship them to India (which the manufacturer allowed), from there to Saudi Arabia and from there to Europe ... each of these steps was allowed by manufacturer - and i did saved finally good 150% of the EMEA price. The issue started as i tried to sell them here, i got directly tons of RFPs and court orders. Luckily i never did something wrong, a company policy was very clear (for my local court) " you have to import over official distributors", which i did (more or less) - so finally i did paid anything. The end of the story - this particulary manufacturer changed their polices, so you will be unable now to re-re-re-import their products. Did i care about ? No not really because a distributor have still to earn some money and manufacturer maximize revenues, i just don't like marketing tricks like "ohhh, ebay sellers having cheaper than our distributors, let's destory them and tell everybody that's are clones" - and of course everybody will believe that, because 99% of these sellers was located in china.Anyway, stay on topic - i believe what rf-loop is trying to tell is nothing else than "who cares, your product have anyway no warranty"

author: therian
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: February 27, 2011, 10:06:33 pm
content: Quote from: dimlow on February 27, 2011, 08:18:44 amOk here what I done nowscope was original ds1102e so the serial.using demoIDN.exe and usb ::INFO:MODEL DS1152E:INFO:SERIAL DS1EB1150****7I do notice a bit more ripple looking at square wave of 10 MhzBut whythis screen-shootshow model as full DS1152E-EDUand serial letter F don't belong to 50 or 100 Mhz versions so why it was changed ?

author: rf-loop
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 28, 2011, 06:26:08 am
content: Quote from: tinhead on February 27, 2011, 08:42:29 pmYou find a point.----------common comment:I have seen least one Rigol DS1102B fat was nearly as "sure" modified in China and relabeled. (but I can not anymore proof it was fake) We need also remember that we may think $50 is money what you do not want make lot of work... it still is more than 300 in china... if you live in china normal life... normal salary is around 1500 per month.. lot of peoples live with less. Not accurate but it is arount so that 1 RMB you there live just as 1 USD. So we may think that 100USD is not so much today. But it is over 600 there.Who want make copy, what business it is.Well, ask Atten - Siglent. (but they loose in China law room some time ago: Rigol - Atten, Rigol win 1-0)How about copy what also outside looks as Rigol... manufacturing this kind of copy is even more cheap than Atten-Siglent have done.Also money can copy.Who cares warranty - maybe nobody.But also we all know, Rigol (in China) have not "customer service". Customer care is commonly known it is really bad.That is why my next step is HanTekway.

author: Stonehedge
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: April 02, 2011, 11:39:41 am
content: Hi all, my name is Sten, I live in Sweden in the northern part of the European Union and this is my first post here.I bought a slightly used Rigol DS1052E from an internet auction and received it yesterday. It was running software 00.02.04.01.02 on hardware 58. I have "hacked" the oscilloscope using the instructions found on this site. It is now running as a DS1152E with software 00.02.04.01.02. There were no problems with the "upgrade".I used these steps:1) Downgraded to 02.02 using a USB flash memory with the patched file DS1000EUpdate.RGL2) Used the here kindly provided USB utility to update to DS1152E by editing the data to DS1152E and the serial number to DS1EF12........53) Upgraded to software 00.02.04.01. using my USB flash memory with the provided .RGL file with this softwareThank you all that provided files and utilities. You have made a great work. Of course am I not expecting any guaranty services from Rigol.My main use for the oscilloscope is measurements on audio and microcontroller lab work using PIC and other such controllers to different small projects. These are seldom clocked with more than 40 MHz so I should be fine using this oscilloscope. I also use a Hantek/MI USB oscilloscope with 60 MHz BW.

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2011, 12:47:19 pm
content: Thanks, when my warranty runs out I think I'll go your route. I have the same hardware, but I bought it new from an authorized dealer.Quote from: Stonehedge on April 02, 2011, 11:39:41 am

author: therian
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: April 24, 2011, 12:15:56 pm
content: anyone done some more tests and compare between 100 and 150 mode ? it must be investigated if precision or anything else suffer in this mode

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 25, 2011, 07:22:00 pm
content: See a summary here:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/index.php?topic=553.msg42974#msg42974

author: port513
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: December 01, 2011, 06:35:45 pm
content: Is there anything I need to do if I mod my scope to 150MHz?/Henke