What's this obsession with selling part models? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: ar__systems
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2017, 01:46:06 pm
content: Upverter launched "EE concierge", service that allows you to order part's libraries for ECAD systems.They had me at "USD 20 for a model (symbol + footprint) of SOT-23 transistor"Is there ANY CAD package that does not have SOT-23 in standard library?Why is it getting any traction at all? I mean, yes, creating package is annoying, but it does not take much time either, relative to the scope of the project. By the way, Digikey now offers part libraries for free (up to 30 per month), which is nice, unlike 20 bucks for SOT-23 nonsense

author: MagicSmoker
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 15, 2017, 12:19:31 pm
content: I find it incredible as well, but then look at this thread (and my reply at the end):https://www.eevblog.com/forum/eagle/library-with-toroidal-inductors-for-eaglecad/

author: ar__systems
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 16, 2017, 10:14:18 am
content: Yeah, I saw that thread... I refrained from replying just so I could stay civil.

author: Mattylad
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 16, 2017, 07:18:07 pm
content: There are cheaper services, it all boils down to how long it can take someone to make the part.Not all CAD package users are using it daily, often an electronic engineer may not make a new PCB for 6-12 months and by then is not that familiar with what or how to do it.So it can take them a considerable amount of time and we all know that time costs. So for a company to pay $5-20 for a part is actually saving them money compared to the time it takes for them to do it.Also when you are getting it for free you are responsible for ensuring that it is correct, when you pay for it the people you are paying are responsible.It used to take me all day to make something like a 1700+ pin BGA for in CADSTAR but now I can make it in 10 minutes, check it in 5 using excel, add another hour for further double checking and I'm done. Something like a transistor is a 5 minutes job.This is why I used to do a lot of library work as a service, leaving the engineers to get on with all the other jobs that they have to do.

author: T3sl4co1l
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 16, 2017, 09:44:15 pm
content: I took a look at their services; the quality is above average, needing only a little tweaking to fit my design process. 3D data and mechanical (assembly centroid, courtyard) data are included. The main quirk I noticed was the 3D models seem to be MMC, which gives them rather distorted proportions; this is understandable, as a more practical than aesthetic choice.Build-in libraries are notoriously poor, and rarely include either kind of information.If all you need is literally two pads and some silk, you can hack that together in a couple of minutes. Fine. Complete mechanical info can take hours. That's the difference between a weekend project, and a commercial design that's working tightly with the ME to minimize package volume, while keeping the PCB IPC compliant for ease of production.Tim

author: ar__systems
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 16, 2017, 11:13:16 pm
content: Quote from: Mattylad on June 16, 2017, 07:18:07 pmNope, you are still responsible. If they screw up: "Oops, sorry, here is your $20 refund". And you are left with a messed up board to deal with.

author: Mattylad
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2017, 11:18:01 am
content: Well yes, of course the recourse is always just a refund, but if you want repeat work then you work harder to get it right.The customer is always expected to double check what has been done, however stupid mistakes should never happen.For instance if the customer asks for xyz part and specifies it then that's what they get - not wxy part because its similar.As Tim says, the libraries supplied by all CAD systems are very poor, never up to date so all engineers using hte system will need to be able to obtain new parts, now they are often not going to be able to do this. Hence where other services come from -and although we may be able to make a part quickly, it does take a lot of time if you want the full shebang.Library creation services are an increasing thing these days.

author: Hensingler
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2017, 12:15:43 pm
content: Quote from: Mattylad on June 17, 2017, 11:18:01 amLike thiswho provide CAD data to RS Components?Bragging about the quality of their library parts while showing a schematic symbol for an AS2S1205 with 5 bits of a data bus on the left edge and the other 7 bits on the bottom edge because the symbol matches the LQFP package it comes in.I downloaded one connector model from them because the (cheap and Chinese) part datasheet had a very obvious dimension error. I didn't have a part to measure and thought I might get a correct dimension from their footprint. Their footprint had just used the incorrect dimension to make something which very obviously didn't fit the part. They also got the pin numbering back to front. Doubly worse than useless.They also have the most bizarre crap idea of needing to install a Windows service as a URL handler for their part description files which is supposed to let you install their garbage models in your CAD package with a single browser click. That crap failed to install giving no error message which frankly wasn't a big surprise. I expect they have a bunch of dumb CS grads and not one EE on the payroll.

author: Mattylad
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 18, 2017, 07:39:00 am
content: Yes like that. I concur that the service you have above are crap, the footprints are just badly made for my CAD package and its supposed to be integrated now - ha!Their tool that allows you to assign pads on the appropriate sides etc. is quite good, certainly better than whats in the CAD package but overall I do not like the output as it needs me to make adjustments to get them how I want them - there is also no adjustment of footprints within the tool, no user settings.I prefer the library expert for footprints, at least I can configure that well, output any CAD package and keep them in the tool for future reference/re outputting.Although that is only footprints so far, their will be a symbol generator but I do not think that is available yet.