Holy overpriced bs batman - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2014, 09:15:26 pm
content: Well, I'm out looking for a 500ma fuse for my multimeter as I blew mine by accident, we have two electronics stores, one halfway across town that is too far for this and a small chain called the source (formerly radio shack), I phone them up since the automotive store had none, they have a fuse, but they want $5 for it. Is it just me or is that freaking insane? I can't imagine how much HRC fuses would be if they sold them, sheesh

author: Fsck
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2014, 09:22:54 pm
content: 5$ for a glass fuse? that's basically the cost of the cooper-bussmann HRC 440mA fuse from a major distributor..

author: Rory
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2014, 09:23:47 pm
content: Digi-Key wanted $31 for a fuse for my Fluke 77. Amazon $6.

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2014, 09:33:39 pm
content: Quote from: Fsck on May 09, 2014, 09:22:54 pmI know right?when I have cash I'm going to order fuse holders from digikey and convert my multimeter ASAP to some fuses the electronics store will actually carry. I'm thinking Canadian tire might have them as it's the same physical size that was in the old mastercraft.

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2014, 09:42:54 pm
content: Well, 66 cents at the industrial electronics store, but with traffic and lights it's probably a 20 minute drive :/Canadian tire probably has them but for a fair bit more and maybe a 14 minute drive, so not really worth it. Guess I just have to wait a bit.edit: fuck, that's right, the only good electronics store closes at frigging four oclock, so I'd never even make it.God I hate living in Canada sometimes, with all the electronics stores people talk about in the states.

author: KJDS
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2014, 09:45:10 pm
content: Take a nail and saw it to the correct length. You can then rest easy knowing that you'll never blow it again.

author: retrolefty
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2014, 09:50:42 pm
content: It's been a while sense I've looked in my fluke manuals, but I seem to recalled they were pretty specific as to the fuse type to use and to not just use any old fuse with the same current rating?And I bet the specific fuse they suggest is not a standard low cost type.

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2014, 09:55:27 pm
content: Quote from: retrolefty on May 09, 2014, 09:50:42 pmWell, this isn't a fluke (unsure if you were confused) but I double checked in test equipment to see what people thought/what the fuse voltage is usually rated, so I found out they are 4ag and 5ag fuses and found the appropriate holders on digikey, and they are usually rated 1000v and the specific amperage, and the local store sells fuses for flukes and amprobes so once I have it modded I'll just grab a couple four packs or whatever they have and be set to go.Having HRC fuses probably isn't all that important for my use, but it will be nice to have them just in case.

author: mariush
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2014, 09:59:18 pm
content: Is this on the uni-t you just received a few days ago?If so... sigh.. that's why you can't have nice things... don't you see a problem with blowing a fuse so soon?

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2014, 10:09:41 pm
content: Quote from: mariush on May 09, 2014, 09:59:18 pmThis affects you how aside from you having a crappy attitude in almost every one of my threads?

author: mariush
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2014, 10:34:06 pm
content: It doesn't affect me in any way, but since this is a free forum that gives me the ability to express my thoughts on this issue that you made public.As for my attitude, there's no rule saying that everyone should be happy for you that you are reckless with your equipment, especially when you complain about not affording stuff and that things are expensive. There's also no rule about people having to only answer in a positive way to your threads and encourage you to kill yourself in the process.Sometimes it's better to have some voices telling you to be more careful and maybe something sticks to you eventually.

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2014, 10:40:15 pm
content: Quote from: mariush on May 09, 2014, 10:34:06 pmYes, because dealing with a battery that was able to give out 500ma sure is reckless, I might just kill someone with that, good thing I keep it under lock and key, sure don't want that kind of power getting into the wrong hands.If you want to act bitchy about something than do it in a thread where you have a reason to, the past few times you have had no reason to, but I guess your hate boner is just too strong to resist eh?At least when I damage something it's not because I dropped it.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2014, 10:43:07 pm
content: Quote from: retrolefty on May 09, 2014, 09:50:42 pmYou're likely thinking of HRC types, where there's a rupture current rating (in the kA range). So long as the current remains below this value, the fuse won't burst open as a safety feature (human injury). Pricey vs. glass fuses, but far cheaper than expensive medical bills or even a funeral that could result without them.Quote from: mariush on May 09, 2014, 09:59:18 pmI get your point (reckless & perhaps should put a bit more thought into what he's doing before poking around).But keep in mind, he's still learning. Cheaper to learn on glass fuses rather than HRC's in such cases, and assuming mains isn't involved, it should be relatively safe for the user as well. Frightened perhaps, but no missing fingers, hands, or eyes at any rate, and the lesson still gets through.Hell, even the most highly experienced person can have an off day now and again (distracted, in a hurry, ...), and can forget to move the positive probe to the correct jack and blow a fuse.

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2014, 10:45:25 pm
content: Quote from: nanofrog on May 09, 2014, 10:43:07 pmIt was not because I was learning, it's because the wire connected to the battery had a small break in it I did not see, I measured it on the amps range and picked up nothing, changed to miliamps and by moving the clip leads connected it fully allowing the current through.

author: rexxar
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2014, 10:59:15 pm
content: Quote from: mariush on May 09, 2014, 09:59:18 pmXOIIO made a dumb mistake and blew a fuse, what is your problem? He didn't wreck the meter or set his house on fire, so I'm left to assume you're just a dick.Besides, how a perfect stranger on the internet treats their equipment is not really any of your business to begin with. And it's not like this is some $3000 8.5 digit Agilent meter, it's a Uni-T, who cares? (besides pedantic dicks)

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2014, 12:30:00 am
content: Quote from: XOIIO on May 09, 2014, 10:45:25 pmIntermittent contacts has driven me crazy on more than a few occasions.BTW, did you use the REL button?Might help (zero out, and if no reading/value after probing, double check connections before moving the probe to a different jack or the range switch). I mention this, due to the cost and inconvenience (finding the one you need & quickly) of replacing HRC fuses.

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2014, 12:32:01 am
content: Quote from: nanofrog on May 10, 2014, 12:30:00 amNah, didn't hit rel, I just got a really odd reading at .1 amps or something, this meter isn't the fastest, so I changed over, shoulda tried moving it around a bit.

author: Joule Thief
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2014, 05:57:16 am
content: Reckless actions should never be wrapped in a protective shroud labeled "he is just learning". Recklessness is characterized by indifference to danger and acting without forethought. Quick searches of Youtube videos show this to be true.Unfortunately, recklessness has a spectrum which includes both blowing 500ma fuses and, at the opposite end, the loss of human life. You have already blown the fuse. You have already moved further up the spectrum by rationalizing how YOU don't need the safety fuses inside your meter. Please consider re-evaluating any attitude which enables further movement upward in this spectrum.Consider the responses to your post to be genuine concern for your safety and continued success in your future endeavors. Don't lightly brush off suggestions or corrections with which you may not agree and attribute them solely to someone's "hate boner" toward you.

author: miguelvp
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2014, 06:23:27 am
content: I was going to suggest home depot $3.74 for a pair 0.5A, 250V, 5x20mm, fast blown:http://www.homedepot.com/p/Cooper-Bussmann-GMA-Series-500-mA-Silver-5mm-x-20mm-Fuses-2-Pack-BP-GMA-500MA/100149086mouser search for the same part for datasheet:http://www.mouser.com/Search/Refine.aspx?Keyword=BP-GMA-500MAEdit: but not sure if Home Depot operates in Canada, I'm assuming it does.

author: kizzap
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 10, 2014, 06:43:11 am
content: Quote from: Joule Thief on May 10, 2014, 05:57:16 amIf I read correctly, the OP, with the meter with the blown fuse in question, wasNOTlooking to replace the fuse with a bodge. He was merely trying to start a conversation as to why fuses are so damned expensive, for what they are. Sheesh.@mariush: In no way was the OP being Reckless in his work. He had the meter on the current on the highest level and worked down when he wasn't getting a reading, obviously assuming that there was less current flowing then he thought. He didn't know that there was a significant break in a wire that was open-circuiting. For all we know the guy was measuring current from a simple 9V battery, which is more then able to output 500mAAdded to that. I would call a $5 fuse replacement a better lesson then a $100+ meter replacement, plus whatever medical bills would come with that.Obviously mariush/Joule Thief you think that anyone with a lower knowledge base then you should not be allowed to start to learn anything electronic. I believe you will have a busy life ahead of you, with all that travelling around the world to judge every Tom, Dick and Harry that wants to plug a cable in anywhere.

author: mariush
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2014, 07:04:01 am
content: edit. On second thought, maybe it's better not to say this.

author: Bored@Work
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2014, 08:27:55 am
content: I do get mariush's point. We are talking about someone who wants to start a youtube channel to lecture others about electronics. But has shown in other threads he doesn't know anything about electronics, can't afford it, and, possibly the worst, refuses to learn. I.e. just an attention seeker.

author: kizzap
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 10, 2014, 09:47:12 am
content: Quote from: Bored@Work on May 10, 2014, 08:27:55 amI point you to mjlorton's channel:https://www.youtube.com/user/mjlortonJust because something seems trivial to yourself, doesn't mean that it is common knowledge. For example, I only just found out that you can use a diode as a switch! Yet it is something that is commonly used by RF guys.

author: miguelvp
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2014, 10:18:34 am
content: Quote from: kizzap on May 10, 2014, 09:47:12 amCheck and Mate!

author: madires
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2014, 11:04:54 am
content: You can choose between a cheap standard glass fuse rated for mains voltage and intended to be used in your common electronics device, and an expensive DMM fuse rated for 1000V and able to break high currents while preventing splinters of glass all over the place. If you're just working with low voltages and currents the standard glass fuse is ok but you should put a sticker on the DMM stating that in case someone else uses the DMM, so he won't trust the CATIII or whatever rating printed on the DMM. And remember, cheap DMMs got cheap fuses.

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2014, 05:28:52 pm
content: Quote from: madires on May 10, 2014, 11:04:54 amYeah, around here nobody else is even going to touch it though, so no real need to mark it. I still plan on the upgrade.The worst part is that the 10 amp fuse is also a glass 5x20mm one. I can't see the 500ma shattering but this one, yes. I found a ceramic one from an old meter that is good though, so I'll toss that in with the new 500ma one until I can mod it.Quote from: kizzap on May 10, 2014, 06:43:11 amThank you, I don't know where he got the idea that I was saying that I don't need a fuse.Quote from: miguelvp on May 10, 2014, 06:23:27 amThey do, but I don't know if thy have those here, anyways home depot is a similar trip so I'll just get the ones for 66 cents. At least those ones are in a two pack.

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2014, 05:36:15 pm
content: UuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuugggggggghhhhhhhhDamnit, I forgot, they are closed on weekends too, I don't know why, it's such a damn pain when you need stuff.And of course home depot sells multimeters, but doesn't carry replacement fuses.

author: linux-works
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2014, 05:53:10 pm
content: just wrap some aluminum foil around it and replace in the slot. should be good for the next 1000 years.(is he serious? that's up to you to guess.)

author: Legion
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2014, 06:55:14 pm
content: Quote from: XOIIO on May 09, 2014, 09:15:26 pmI used to work at the shack in high school. I always used to wonder how they stayed in business until I worked there. The markups are just insane; the POS system displayed the cost and I'd routinely see items with costs around $0.35 which retailed for $19.99. I guess with markups like that you only need a couple sales a day to stay afloat.

author: miguelvp
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2014, 07:10:05 pm
content: Quote from: XOIIO on May 10, 2014, 05:36:15 pmThe fuse section is kind of hard to find. It should be where they sell fuse boxes etc, way far away from where they sell tools (including meters).In the one I go, it's on the far right corner area, three or two aisles back.

author: tom66
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2014, 08:05:15 pm
content: Monster products are a money maker for both Monster and the retail shop.http://consumerist.com/2008/02/08/monster-cables-monster-ripoff-80-markups/

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 10, 2014, 10:53:42 pm
content: I would say that whatever type of fuse is in it, replace with like, regardless of cost. Upgrading to the HRC fuses probably isn't a bad idea and may work out cost wise in the long run.

author: miguelvp
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2014, 12:28:21 am
content: Quote from: GreyWoolfe on May 10, 2014, 10:53:42 pmHe has a UNI-T 71 series as I do, the manual specifies just what I told him to get. 0.5A, 250V, fast type fuse 5x20mm.

author: Tinkerer
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2014, 01:07:19 am
content: Quote from: linux-works on May 10, 2014, 05:53:10 pmIn all seriousness, you could use a piece of wire(or in this case foil) to act as a fuse based on the fusing current of the size and material. Just that once it melted you would have little metal droplets laying around instead of contained.Heres an interesting chart because I was curious:http://www-d0.fnal.gov/hardware/cal/lvps_info/engineering/wirefusing.pdfI myself have a UNI-T 61E. I also have a crap meter to use if I am worried that I may have made a mistake in knowing how much power something has.(if its something that might be powerful enough to blow up a meter instead of blowing a fuse/simply frying it, then I will take safety first)

author: Stonent
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2014, 03:34:52 am
content: I refused to pay RadioShack $3 for a 200ma fuse for my meter. So I ordered a 10 pack from China for $1

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2014, 02:48:55 pm
content: If you bought it from eBay I'd sacrifice a few of those fuses and test they actually open at ~ 200mA. Many fuses I've tested from friends do not blow at the rated amps.Quote from: Stonent on May 11, 2014, 03:34:52 am

author: madires
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2014, 02:59:54 pm
content: Quote from: Stonent on May 11, 2014, 03:34:52 amWow, $3 for a standard fuse. A pack with 10 glass fuses from ESKA costs €0.70 at a local internet shop.

author: KJDS
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2014, 03:04:46 pm
content: A 200mA fuse should conduct 200mA continuouslyhttp://www.littelfuse.com/~/media/electronics/datasheets/fuses/littelfuse_fuse_201p_datasheet.pdf.pdfThe graph on page two shows that for a fuse to blow in 1 second takes about 2 to 5 times the rated current.Running at 1.4x rated current and you'll have a very long wait indeed.Quote from: saturation on May 11, 2014, 02:48:55 pm

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2014, 04:13:51 pm
content: Yes, meant more at rated amps as per spec sheet. We know fuses are rated to pass the 'labeled' current but how long depends on type, from many hours to indefinitely. Most DMMs that use glass fuses are fast blow type which is ~ 1.5-2x rated amps, or 300-400mA should be nearly 'instant'.Quote from: KJDS on May 11, 2014, 03:04:46 pm

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2014, 05:06:30 pm
content: I'm curious, are there any multimeters that go above 400ma before switching to amps range? It kind of seems like there might be some that go up to one amp, but maybe it's a limitation of what's used to measure more accurately?

author: nerdyHippy
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 12, 2014, 12:33:27 am
content: Quote from: Legion on May 10, 2014, 06:55:14 pmI find that hard to believe; why would they have that info available to cashiers?

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 12, 2014, 12:39:36 am
content: Quote from: nerdyHippy on May 12, 2014, 12:33:27 amDepends if the store operated independently/the software they used, I worked at a local PC shop and when I ran the till as well as adding inventory I had full access to the markups and original prices.

author: Legion
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 12, 2014, 02:24:40 am
content: Quote from: nerdyHippy on May 12, 2014, 12:33:27 amI remember it distinctly, since I naively revealed the cost to a customer complaining about the price of an item. "You're right, that is a ripoff! It only cost 35 cents!" My manager was less than impressed.

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 12, 2014, 02:26:01 am
content: Quote from: Legion on May 12, 2014, 02:24:40 amI can imagine.

author: TMM
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 12, 2014, 04:28:22 am
content: Quote from: XOIIO on May 11, 2014, 05:06:30 pmFluke 87V goes up to 600mA and the fuse lasts minutes up to several amps iirc. Limitation is the range of the ADC.

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 12, 2014, 07:54:58 pm
content: Yup, phoned in, they are sold in packs of 5, and still will cost less than a fiver.

author: mzacharias
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 24, 2014, 09:04:51 pm
content: The Tektronix TX-3 and at least a couple Gossen models use mosfets to seamlessly switch from microamps straight through to their higher amp range, using only their three input jacks.