BMW Key Compromised  - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Sionyn
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 13, 2012, 08:26:27 pm
content: Thieves have discovered how to steal BMW cars produced since 2006 by using the onboard computer that is able to program blank keys. The device used — originally intended for use by garages — is able to reprogram the key to start the engine in around three minutes. The blank keys, and reprogramming devices, have made their way onto the black market and are available for purchase over the Internet.http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006mg74/features/bmw-car-theft-technologybit they edited out

author: G7PSK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 13, 2012, 09:05:17 pm
content: Obviously there needs to be a mechanical lock as well as the electronic if you can use a blank key and just program it all the mechanical bit must be the same. The answer would be to fit a lock on the can bus socket so a key is required to get to it if that just doubles the time for the thief they will go elsewhere.

author: Balaur
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 13, 2012, 09:10:21 pm
content: Eh, this is nothing new.If physical access, I can re-program the security ECU on my Rover and MGF to accept a random key in literally a few seconds. The key can unlock and start the car, stop the alarm, etc. There is still the question of the steer column lock, however.Since the old Rover company had gone kaputt, I can no longer rely on specialist garages and so on. Actually, I never too much used them on behalf of them being completely clueless and incompetent, at least in my region.Anyway, I've geared up in repair and diagnostic material and a cheap Chinese device is able to do a lot of the things that the bloody expensive Rover T4 equipment. I'm rather happy about that since that means that I'll be able to keep my cars in good health.... However, the same cheap device is able to program a lot of other car ECUs.

author: AndyC_772
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2012, 06:58:19 am
content: Quote from: G7PSK on September 13, 2012, 09:05:17 pmI'd go with a firmware update that simply disables the particular features needed for key programming, unless the car has authenticated with the official BMW diagnostics equipment.I'd also implement a very simple lock-out feature: newly programmed keys don't become valid until the car has been started with a different, previously validated key.

author: Pentium100
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2012, 07:55:54 am
content: I still don't get - what's wrong with a normal lock and key? I mean that system is quite reliable (my car is 30 years old and the original key still works - still not too worn out) and the electronic stuff (RFID chip in the key or something) should be an addition to it, not a replacement.

author: mikeselectricstuff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2012, 08:16:58 am
content: This really isn't rocket science, but people like BMW just don't have the imagination to think like a criminal.For example : If the OBD port is accessed while the vehicle is locked, sound the horn/alarm for a few seconds then wait 5 mins before any access is allowed. Maybe also require the bonnet /boot/doors to be open for the 5 min period.And on cars with any sort of connectivity, require a remote authorisation.There may be occasions of genuinely lost keys where it is necessary to access the OBD port to program a key, but these will be so few that a little extra annoyance when doing so is not a big deal.

author: M. András
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2012, 12:38:10 pm
content: best anti thief system is to take out the onboard computer if it can be removed without tools as it can be done on some cars. good luck to steal the car without ityou would need a trailer for this

author: GnatGoSplat
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2012, 01:36:39 pm
content: Quote from: Pentium100 on September 21, 2012, 07:55:54 amMechanical lock and key doesn't allow for new technologies such as keyless pushbutton start. Most modern luxury cars come standard with keyless ignition and the majority of standard cars have it as an available option. Even economy compacts like my sister's Kia Soul has it. It lets you keep the key (which might not resemble a customary key at all) in your pocket or purse and simply push a button to turn on and start the car. I was surprised in that video that the key even had to be inserted into the column and rotated.Well, at least it takes almost 3-minutes on the BMW. Apparently, it's possible to steal a Cadillac Escalade in 14-seconds.http://www.wxyz.com/dpp/news/local_news/investigations/security-flaw-renders-cadillac-escalade,-other-ritzy-gm-suvs-targets-for-thieves

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 21, 2012, 01:58:46 pm
content: Quote from: Pentium100 on September 21, 2012, 07:55:54 amBetter still, hide horse! Thief cannot get car far without horse!

author: Sionyn
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2012, 02:49:44 pm
content: here's a more upmarket version its features includes a screen (marketing blurb)https://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=X79qK7e-ZKAits been patched now move of memory addresses (i hear) however they still have not solved problem of authentic keys meaning you can't distinguish who programmed the key.thats what they need solve, any tom dick or harry programming their keys. its the old security problem authentication.

author: Sionyn
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2012, 03:06:58 pm
content: more informationhttp://www.autokeyprog.com/cat_doc/BMW_KeyCoder.pdf

author: Pentium100
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2012, 07:40:47 pm
content: Quote from: GnatGoSplat on September 21, 2012, 01:36:39 pmWow, I understand though, as it is so difficult to turn a key to start the car, that something has to be done, even if the security is reduced in the process. Do you also have electronic locks for houses? Because starting a car is easy, unlocking a house, now that's hard, the key must be turned two or four complete revolutions and (in case of my house), there is more than one lock (actually, there are three in my case).On the other hand, electronic lock in addition to mechanical lock would be more secure - the thief would need to copy the mechanical key (or bypass the lock) and copy the electronic key (or bypass the lock), making it more difficult and time consuming to do than if there was just one lock. Mycar has a custom security feature - to start it you have to turn the key (to ignition), then press a button (one of the standard ones - it normally has a different function) and then turn the key to start it - if you don't push the button, the engine gets no fuel. It is no protection against a good thief, but some drug addict may not be able to figure it out, even if he manages to bypass the lock.

author: GnatGoSplat
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2012, 08:26:29 pm
content: Quote from: Pentium100 on September 21, 2012, 07:40:47 pmActually, in the US, the answer is yes, we do kind of have electronic locks for houses. I don't know anyone who actually uses a key when entering or exiting their home. The average American single-family home has an attached garage with electric opener, and the majority of Americans use the garage remote (or exterior mounted keypad) to enter/exit the house. The front door with mechanical lock is typically only used for guests. There have been similar news stories in the past about how a hacker could use an RF receiver device to capture remote codes to break into peoples' homes, which is why all modern garage door openers now use rolling codes.Quote from: Pentium100 on September 21, 2012, 07:40:47 pmYes, but requiring a mechanical lock in addition to the electronic lock rather defeats the entire purpose of the electronic lock in the first place which is usually the convenience of fully keyless operation. Most people would likely rather stick to the conventional key than bother with a system where they have to turn a keyandpress a button.

author: Pentium100
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2012, 09:08:34 pm
content: Quote from: GnatGoSplat on September 21, 2012, 08:26:29 pmInteresting. Here the mechanical locks rule, I mean maybe some people have electronic locks for their houses, but not that I have seen, except in bigger companies where the employees have RFID cards that they wave in front of the lock (since otherwise they would need to carry a whole lot of keys and with the electronic locks it's easier to grant or revoke permission to access an area).QuoteHowever, requiring the electronic lock in addition to the mechanical one would make the system more secure, since the thief would have to defeat two locks (my dad's car has this - you need to turn the key as well as push a button on the remote). But at least have a fully automatic electronic lock, for example an RFID chip in the key - you have to turn the key and the key has to have the correct chip, otherwise the car won't start. My car was modified to require the secret button so that an incompetent thief would have harder time stealing it - the engine just does not start (there are no error messages, beeps or other indications that this is supposed to happen, the starter motor spins, but the engine does not start, since it does not get any fuel) and the thief might go to a different car instead of trying to figure out why this one does not start.

author: SeanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 22, 2012, 05:45:25 am
content: Very few houses have a garage attached to the house via a door that is unlocked here. Fire regulations ( brick houses unlike the US love of making houses that are so easy to burn down) mandate a fire resistant door that is generally not going to be specced by an architect. Thus it may be built into the house, but there is no door. Even the McMansions have a mechanical lock ( generally an ultra cheap one in an expensive ornate looking cheap and nasty door) on them, and a really high tech security system with armed response.