Vintage German Gear -- need help - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: 001
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 02:37:31 pm
content: HiIs anybody can say how good or bad Statron Power Supplies?https://www-user.tu-chemnitz.de/~heha/basteln/Konsumg%C3%BCter/Statron/TG%2015-0,5.pdfhttps://www-user.tu-chemnitz.de/~heha/basteln/Konsumg%C3%BCter/Statron/Typ%203201.pdf

author: mfro
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 03:22:38 pm
content: East-German (GDR) brand ( <> "made in Germany").Decades behind technology-wise, but as robust as a Russian tank.

author: 001
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 03:27:36 pm
content: Quote from: mfro on November 19, 2018, 03:22:38 pmThanxBut what does it mean?

author: HighVoltage
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 04:02:03 pm
content: Quote from: 001 on November 19, 2018, 03:27:36 pmIt means, it will probably never break.And if it does, its easily repaired, like most electronics from the eastern Germany time of the cold war.

author: 001
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 05:12:07 pm
content: Quote from: HighVoltage on November 19, 2018, 04:02:03 pmReally? it looks like prehistoric shitWhat about main parameters like stability/regulation/on-off pops etc?

author: mfro
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 06:25:00 pm
content: Quote from: 001 on November 19, 2018, 05:12:07 pmSo you are seriously asking if +30 years old Warsaw Pact electronics are worth more nowadays than just collector's value (for some)?I don't think so. And I think even hardcore East German nostalgists would agree.

author: 001
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 06:58:12 pm
content: Quote from: mfro on November 19, 2018, 06:25:00 pmDid You say that it is silly design?

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 07:13:15 pm
content: Statron still exists:http://www.statron.de/produkte/einfachquellenActually I own one myself. Anyway, these are not the sophisticated power supplies, but a used Statron lienar supply is certainly better than some cheap Chinese supply.

author: ch_scr
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 09:14:50 pm
content: My Father owns a Statron 32221. It's rather bulky. It's rather heavy. It never failed us. It never got hot. But because of the bulkiness, i decided to replace it with a Phlilips PE 1542. We seldom used the higher power capability of the Statron, and could use the space. When comparing the two supplies (both of comparable vintage) - also i had replaced the caps in the Philips, but not in the Statron - i could see it's noise was noticable higher. Like, almost double. Both are linear supplies, but the implementation in the Statron was better than the LM723 solution in the Philips.

author: 001
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 09:30:17 pm
content: Quote from: 0xdeadbeef on November 19, 2018, 07:13:15 pmWOW!Does they use same oldstyle circuits?

author: dzseki
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 09:46:52 pm
content: Quote from: 001 on November 19, 2018, 09:30:17 pmI really don't see your logic. You start the thread asking if it is good or bad, then you say it looks like "prehistoric shit" then asking if they are still riding on that?So what information you want to know then?

author: 001
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 09:57:28 pm
content: Quote from: dzseki on November 19, 2018, 09:46:52 pmSome people above says what it will be work to the end of timeSoIf circuit really good?

author: ch_scr
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2018, 11:24:47 pm
content: It always depends on what you need it for. We have lots of newer Statrons at work and most of them run a lot, they are pretty reliable. They had a bad run of transformer tap-switching relays (these only failed after prolonged usage, but still "early"). In newer units, they changed the relay supplier and thus fixed the problem. No "series faults" aside from that. They still use "classical" analog circuits, most of their products are around for a long time. They sure lack in the "bells and whistles" department but have "proven by time" reliability.

author: bernie79
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 20, 2018, 01:02:42 am
content: I can second that, the eastern electronic was never 'sexy' and almost never 'state of the art', but they built this to last forever (no intention to sell more by creating obsolescence). If you look at the schematic, you will maybe recognize the germanium* based transistors. The most actual components seems to be the rectifier diodes, that can be translated to D15 or such. Its almost 50 year old (from the early 70s) and by western standard the style of the 60s. You can see the typical rectifier and regulator schematic, as if directly taken from the book, carefully choosen component values with enougth headroom to operate.I miss this style today: rock solid devices, you can always(!) count on. Today you can only get devices that runs on the maximum ratings and the only choose you have is how much after market service you want to buy. (for extra fee.).There is even a list of the components and their manufacturers. The transformer is made by Straton himself. They seems to know what they do.You should'nt buy this two devices, but you can study the schematics. There is even a description of the way this circuits works (google can help with translation). See how they crafted this design, look at the semics and the used window in the characterics, rebuild this in Spice and play with the component values. You can learn a dying art: 'how to design rock solid electronics'. Something that isn't teached at universities. Something that should be teached. IHMO its one of the key differents between a ordinary 'BoA paper owner' you could hire by dozens and an excellent engenieer that can build the well-known qualities 'Made in USA' or in ths case: 'Made in Germany'.Thanks for sharing this look inside.GreetingsBernie*a german electronic device made of germanium semiconductor. Pun intended?

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 20, 2018, 01:45:21 am
content: They are built to last. Thats a big plus in an era of disposable hardware.

author: shteii01
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 20, 2018, 07:26:17 pm
content: Quote from: 0xdeadbeef on November 19, 2018, 07:13:15 pmInteresting.I looked at several, they all build for European 230VAC. Would have been interesting if they had 110VAC models for US.

author: Wolfgang
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 20, 2018, 08:32:00 pm
content: Quote from: 001 on November 19, 2018, 02:37:31 pmHi, this is ancient GDR stuff, maybe 30 to 40 years old at least. I have a new Statron as well, these beasts are- low tech- robust- easy to repair- all components have a good safety marginbut never- rocket science specs- fancy design (who in the GDR would pay more for that ?)- lightweight... just workhorses for the GDR worker. If you can live with the performance offered, they will outlast you.

author: Kleinstein
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 20, 2018, 09:13:25 pm
content: The two plan linked are for really old one. So likely more than 40 years. Especially the 1 st. one is still using Germanium transistors - so it may be relatively robust, but those germanium part do age and the electrolytic caps may also be old - though the old ones where not as bad as the first low ESR ones.In the early days they made them mainly for the communist block, so quite sure no 110 V or 60 Hz. In the later time they also made lab supplies to be sold in western Germany. AFAIK some of the "Voltcarft" (from German Conrad supplier) were supposedly made by Statron in the GDR. Nothing special, but relatively robust, though the later parts were also build to a price.

author: 001
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 20, 2018, 09:48:10 pm
content: Quote from: Kleinstein on November 20, 2018, 09:13:25 pmThanx a lot! Can You help me with actual robust circuits from East Europe?it became more than interesting since I can`t google any official pdfs and service manuals

author: dzseki
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 20, 2018, 10:34:17 pm
content: Former hungarian manufacturer "FOK-GYEM" also made some beefy power supplies in the Eastern block. Model TR-9158A was for example a 40V 10A linear power supply, with SCR preregulator. The service manual is available around the net.

author: babysitter
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 20, 2018, 11:16:32 pm
content: I am just back from a certain makerspace where I was asked to fix a dual voltage Statron which failed after a blackout occured during charging a battery.(Actually I guessed the reason right, considering the owner profile.)Found a broken thyristor quickly, owner will check if replacement fixes it. Old style construction, cabling fixed with grease-thread, but besides lazy switches no other problems.

author: Martin.M
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 21, 2018, 04:13:03 pm
content: Quote from: dzseki on November 20, 2018, 10:34:17 pmElektronikus Mérökészülélek Gyára (EMG) is also well known for PSU and test equipments.about Statron: I own a 13,2V 20A with a loudspeaker in the front, made to power up any RX TX.The weight is OK, a fat transformer inside and well build. It loads also the car battery in very short time.Martin