Can you identify this power socket? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: fudmuffin
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 24, 2018, 10:23:22 am
content: Hiya Forum. I have recently moved to a new place (New South Wales, Australia), and found outside a "Clipsal weatherproof IP53" AC socket. Please check the pictures.The socket has the expected flat sockets for Active and Neutral. What has me puzzled is the round socket for the Earth pin, where I would have normally expected a vertical flat pin.The socket runs regular 2-pronged appliances fine but a 3-pronged (earthed) plug won't fit into it, due to the Earth socket being this round hole.I have not attempted to open up the socket, or to test the Earth connection.Any guess as to what this socket is, or why it may not have been installed as a regular 3-flat-pronged socket?So far, I can't seem to find anywhwere on the internet a reference to this style of socket

author: Rerouter
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 24, 2018, 10:34:22 am
content: that is an Australian 110V socket (yes we have those)

author: dgtl
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 24, 2018, 10:44:15 am
content: A little googling:http://members.iinet.net.au/~cool386/plug/plug.html(scroll to bottom)

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 24, 2018, 10:52:19 am
content: Quote from: Rerouter on June 24, 2018, 10:34:22 amNever seen one here in NZ, what do you guys use them for ?Otherwise we have the same 3 pin single phase socket as you do.

author: Rerouter
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 24, 2018, 10:59:48 am
content: If you want to use a 110V device, but don't like a US or other reversible plugs, then the Australian one it is, also makes things 200% less likely to get stolen on site as when they unplug it the go "What the hell is this"Its from a time when universal power supplies and voltage switches where less common, so if a company was using a lot of US gear they would get a 110V tap into there premises and fit 100V Australian plugs and sockets because the american ones did not meet code.

author: BradC
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 24, 2018, 11:29:03 am
content: Round earth pin. Used commonly on lighting circuits but I've also seen them used on UPS circuits. I have a few lights plugged into them currently.

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 24, 2018, 11:35:55 am
content: Quote from: Rerouter on June 24, 2018, 10:34:22 amNope. 110V sockets are round live pins, flat earth.

author: Harb
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 24, 2018, 11:54:17 am
content: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AS/NZS_3112

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 24, 2018, 12:03:13 pm
content: Quote from: Harb on June 24, 2018, 11:54:17 amThat seem to offer some understanding that round earth pin sockets in our 230VAC installations seem to indicate a controlled supply, and maybe that makes sense.Quote

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 24, 2018, 12:20:17 pm
content: Maybe the previous owner had a problem with neighbors running a cord to his outside outlet, and mooching power?Anyway, just measure it to check there's actually 230V AC on it and the ground is good, then replace with a standard socket.

author: BradC
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 24, 2018, 12:44:47 pm
content: Quote from: TerraHertz on June 24, 2018, 12:20:17 pm... and check to make sure it's on an appropriately rated circuit before blindly replacing it with a standard GPO. It could well be wired in 1.5mm2 and on a lighting circuit.

author: Brumby
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 24, 2018, 02:25:36 pm
content: Quote from: tautech on June 24, 2018, 12:03:13 pmThis was my understanding.Several years ago I designed a sound reinforcement system for a venue that had the requirement for a "simple" user as well as advanced. The "simple" user just plugged in the relevant microphones and then switch on the system. For this user, all the gear (including the mixer) was locked up. Everything was preset for best results and there was a delay relay on the output.The "switch on" was done by a two-way switch circuit which operated a power point at the equipment end. Because this was a specialty circuit with the power point being turned on by a remote switch (four rooms away), the socket shown above was used. The equipment cabinet had a single lead coming out with the appropriate plug.This socket ensured nobody could plug in any regular plug and have it energised by someone out of sight.

author: fudmuffin
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 25, 2018, 06:12:21 am
content: Searching google for "Australian 110V socket", even if that isn't the answer that applies to me, does bring up responses that include the apparent socket shape I am dealing with... indicating it is for "lighting", "special purposes", and "controlled circuits"e.g.https://www.plugsocketmuseum.nl/Australian3.htmlandhttp://updates.clipsal.com/clipsalonline/files/brochures/a0000123.pdf(btw: seems there are lots of interesting plug configurations I never knew existed!)Quote from: BradC on June 24, 2018, 12:44:47 pmIf that were the case, what would be the reason for installing this particular socket configuration? As it still allows me to plug in any regular non-Earthed appliance - what benefit is it providing? (I'm unfamiliar with the implications of it being wired in 1.5mm2, and why this would cause this socket to be chosen.)Anyway, thanks all for the replies! Looks like I should ask my electrician when he next visits. I may ask them to replace with a normal socket, but only if he deems it to be safe.

author: vk6zgo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 25, 2018, 06:39:11 am
content: it's a20amp socket.Aussie sockets go from the well known 10amp one, to the 15amp with a larger flat earth pin, & finally, the 20amp, with a round earth plug.It is bad practice, but not uncommon, to file the earth pin on a 15amp plug so it fits a normal socket.Thankfully, you can't do this with a 20amp plug.Oops, I lied!!---checking, the 20amp one is just a version with larger flat pins.The round pin one is a special one for controlled outputs, such as are used for studio lights & similar devices.

author: Brumby
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 25, 2018, 08:18:21 am
content: Here....

author: innkeeper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 25, 2018, 07:53:15 pm
content: My generator uses that socket type for the 12V output.

author: Cyberdragon
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 26, 2018, 04:02:38 am
content: Quote from: innkeeper on June 25, 2018, 07:53:15 pmThat's a problem...In fact it's probably illegal.https://www.voltimum.com.au/articles/unsafe-small-portable-generators-and

author: BradC
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 26, 2018, 06:03:27 am
content: My Grandfather had a standard 10A surface socket mounted to his towbar, and a standard 10A plug on the 12V fridge in his Caravan. He got quite upset when I cut it off and replaced it with an Anderson connector. Then again, the connections were also twisted together and insulated with Elastoplast so having a 240V plug on a 12V device is probably the least of the problems.

author: helius
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 26, 2018, 06:07:06 am
content: Quote from: Brumby on June 25, 2018, 08:18:21 amI surely can't be the only one to whom this looks like a series of interpretations of Edvard Munch's "The Scream".

author: Nusa
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 26, 2018, 07:18:53 am
content: Quote from: Cyberdragon on June 26, 2018, 04:02:38 amNot in the US it isn't, and you responded to a US author. Pay attention to the authors country tag for this kind of topic. Decades ago that outlet type was used in some North American RV's for DC outlets. And still used on some generators, as you've observed.

author: Halcyon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 26, 2018, 08:10:46 am
content: Quote from: Monkeh on June 24, 2018, 11:35:55 amNope, they don't always. As the standards dictate.In case anyone is interested, there is also another connector used in Australia which is for low voltage applications known as a "T-Pin". It's usually found in vehicles/automotive applications operating at 12-24 VDC up to 15 Amps.

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 26, 2018, 10:12:22 am
content: Quote from: Halcyon on June 26, 2018, 08:10:46 amPlease elaborate. You clearly know the standards, and I'm clearly not paying $220AUD to find out what they contain.

author: innkeeper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 26, 2018, 05:39:39 pm
content: Quote from: Cyberdragon on June 26, 2018, 04:02:38 amhmm interesting.... seems its a pretty popular plug type for 12V. my generator is a Homelite/Colman, and i have seen it on Honda generators, and have seen them on other generators... i know doesn't make them legal though. but, you gotta figure there legal in some countries. like the usa...

author: Halcyon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 26, 2018, 08:38:28 pm
content: Quote from: Monkeh on June 26, 2018, 10:12:22 amThe sockets you're thinking of are used in hotel rooms, where international 110V devices can be plugged in. But in special use cases, the round earth pin variant can also be used. Those are not really used in general or residential areas.

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 26, 2018, 08:48:32 pm
content: Quote from: Halcyon on June 26, 2018, 08:38:28 pmThat doesn't make it 'an Australian 110V socket'.This is the 110V socket:This is one you saycanbe used for 110V:The distinction seems fairly important. One is a socket used specifically for 110V, one is not.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 26, 2018, 09:17:49 pm
content: Quote from: Cyberdragon on June 26, 2018, 04:02:38 amIf somebody is dumb enough to "force" the 12V charging cable into a mains voltage socket then there is no saving them from themselves by using a different socket. Whether legal or not, I certainly wouldn't worry about this.

author: vk6zgo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2018, 12:43:30 am
content: Quote from: Monkeh on June 26, 2018, 08:48:32 pmCalling the second one a "110v socket" is a dangerous practice, as it is much more likely to be 240v in any normal usage.The use as a 110v socket in a domestic setting has nearly zero probability.Australian power authorities do not make 110v available in such situations, so if you want that voltage, it will be at the output of a transformer owned by the user.Plugging a 110v device into any random socket will almost certainly result in the demise of that device.

author: Brumby
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 27, 2018, 02:42:02 am
content: Quote from: vk6zgo on June 27, 2018, 12:43:30 amI know of one person who moved to Australia from the US and brought all his gear with him - inclusing his vacuum cleaner.Apparently it worked really, REALLY,REALLYwell for the first couple of uses here ... and then promptly "let go" in a dramatic display.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2018, 02:45:59 am
content: Quote from: Brumby on June 27, 2018, 02:42:02 amReminds me of an ad on TV.....vely sucky motor !