Rigol 5000 vs Keysight 2000 with hack? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: Ciel
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: April 14, 2025, 10:10:34 am
content: Hello everyone, I'm looking to get a nice first oscilloscope and I'm planning on putting some money into it. And I've landed on these two choices, the Rigol MSO5xx4 and Keysight M/DSOX2xx4(apparently logic analyzer is unlockable too?). I'm in China and the second hand price of 2xx4s look to be around 800US without accessories(regardless of the exact model cause they're all hacked anyway), but there is sometimes a nice deal that comes with a few probes. And the Rigol MSO5074 is around 1000US new and comes with probes. And I believe the Rigol can be hacked too for full capabilities(and it seems like you get all the options for free if you buy on one of the "big sale" days?).I saw a few posts comparing the Rigol 5000 series to the Keysight 1000, so I would have to assume that Keysight 2000 is a good deal, but I'm not sure about how much I should be expecting to shell out for probes and whatever else, plus a missing warranty. I see that a single new N2140A is around 136US so maybe it's not worth it?Another worry is potential fakes because... China D: is there any good way to determine if a Keysight scope is /gen? I can try find look for in-person listings if necessary.Thanks!

author: 2N3055
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2025, 12:42:12 pm
content: Short answer, old DSOX2000A design is worse than best DSOX1000 Device from Keysight.Also 2000A digital interface is horrible.Stick to MSO5000, SDS 2000X+ or something like that. Those devices are way more capable.Or some of the new 12 bit devices if MSO is not needed.

author: Fire Doger
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2025, 01:49:03 pm
content: 8Gs and 200 Mpts memory depth in MSO5000 may be more valuable than 12bit, depends on your use case.

author: Ciel
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 03:26:29 am
content: Quote from: 2N3055 on April 14, 2025, 12:42:12 pmI see, so step 1. avoid the 2000 second hands. Is the 1000 still on the table? The bottom model is a bit lower than the 5000 from Rigol and I suppose that can be "upgraded" as well. I'll look into the differences now, thank youEdit: Wait what, the 1204G is almost half the price of the 1204A on the official store(6969 CNY, nice, vs 12560 CNY), what's going on? The higher bandwidth models are also around the price of the 1204A so the 1204G is the anomaly hereEdit^2: After consulting the spreadsheet in this board it would seem as if the Keysight is worse than the 5000 at least on paper, should I just go with the 5000 or is there some "hidden mechanic" I should be considering like quality components and stuff that Dave mentioned in the video about why "namebrands" are expensive? How much do they impact me?

author: NE666
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 08:44:33 am
content: My personal view, YMMV, but there's simply no comparison in terms of value between the 1204G and the MSO5000.The latter includes a very reasonable LA/MSO implementation, and a vastly higher sampling rate, memory depth and bandwidth. However, as others have already said, it really depends on what your specific use case is. For predominantly digital / embedded work, it's the Rigol hands down. For analogue, the lower noise front end of the Keysight might be better however, there are other cheaper 12-bit scopes from Siglent and Rigol that would be better still at this price point. If you want to really trust the Bode plot capability, that crown might go to the Keysight, based on reported issues on this forum.So the answer is, "it depends". You need to consider in what ways these two scopes differ, and how that will affect what you want to be able to do with the one you own.You should also consider that if this is a personal, hobbyist purchase, then Keysight will have nothing to do with you (at least, directly), should you need product support.

author: 2N3055
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 09:49:22 am
content: Quote from: NE666 on April 15, 2025, 08:44:33 amYou are sorely mistaken. Keysight low noise front end ?Only new HD3 has one.Older 8 bit Keysights have similar noise to MSO5000.My 3000T has trace that is as thick as a finger at highest sensitivities....Siglent SDS2000x+ has real low noise front end. If that is worth price difference to OP is debatable..If directly comparing 1000/2000 series Keysights to MSO5000, MSO5000 wins hands down in every respect.Except Bode plot. Rigol Bode plot is really bad. Keysight has a good one, Silent has an excellent one, better than Keysight in capabilities, but a bit slower.

author: Ciel
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 02:11:47 pm
content: Quote from: 2N3055 on April 15, 2025, 09:49:22 amUhh I just checked and the lower 4 channel MSO5074 is 18 cny(~2.5USD) more expensive than the SDS2074X Plus which is siglent’s cheapest 4 channel and comes with a few optionals for free since theyre on a sale of some kind. Should I spring for that? What I see is that the Rigol has higher samples and the Siglent has higher BW once unlocked, if it can be.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 08:09:03 pm
content: Quote from: Ciel on April 15, 2025, 02:11:47 pmSDS2074X Plus is not available to the west, it is a prohibited China export.Sampling rate is determined by channels in use and/or which channels are used.There are two 2GSa/s ADC's in these units that support 2 channel pairs, 1&2 and 3&4.With all channels active sampling is reduced to 1 GSa/s and BW restricted to 350 MHz.1 active channel on each ADC provides 2 GSa/s to maintain 500 MHz BW in models that support such.Memory depth is divided in half with 2 channels active on the same ADC and each ADC has full memory support.You should consider how MSO5000 sampling and memory depth is managed by the # of channels in use.Things are not always as they seem.......

author: NE666
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 08:18:36 pm
content: Quote from: 2N3055 on April 15, 2025, 09:49:22 amThank you, that is very good to know. Not least of all since I own an MSO5k.I'd taken it as 'received wisdom', based on many threads on the topic on this site, that the MSO had a particularly noisy front-end. And indeed, compared to some other models and those of competitors, it is, relatively speaking. However, it's also good to know that it holds it own against at least something remotely contemporary wearing a Keysight/Agilent badge.

author: NE666
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 08:36:42 pm
content: Quote from: tautech on April 15, 2025, 08:09:03 pmThe sampling characteristics of my MSO5k comply with the expectations set by the published data sheet. In that respect, they are exactly 'what they seem'.That is:Sample Rate: 8 GSa/s (single-channel), 4 GSa/s (half-channel), 2 GSa/s (all channels)Sample Depth: 200 Mpts (single-channel), 100 Mpts (half-channel), 50 Mpts (all channels)Strictly speaking, the memory depths are half that indicated above in all cases, without the "Deep Memory" option installed. However, as for bandwidth increases, this is also modified by the 'unlocking' process.The logic analyser section uses its own sampling rates and memory. Max 1GS/s all channels, 25M points per channel.

author: 2N3055
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 09:20:29 pm
content: Quote from: Ciel on April 15, 2025, 02:11:47 pmIf you are going to do analog work, Siglent2000X+ is better. Maximum sample rate is not important in this. Both work just fine in that regard. Siglent will work better for higher frequencies because of higher max BW and 50Ω inputs.My preference would be SDS2000X+. Not that MSO5000 is bad, it is OK. But SDS2000X+has some things just done "kind of more professionally" for the lack of the better phrase..

author: Martin72
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2025, 09:48:55 pm
content: QuoteIf you have the opportunity to get an SDS2000Xplus for almost the same price as the MSO5074, then you should go for the Siglent.Elsewhere, there is still a price difference of around €500 between the two scopes.I bought the MSO5074 back in 2018 because at the time it was the best-equipped scope in its price range and beyond.I was annoyed by various bugs for almost two years and then when the SDS2000Xplus came on the market, I immediately switched.The SDS2000Xplus is the better scope in almost all respects, but it also costs significantly more.At least here in this country.A 2074Xplus is AFAIK completely hackable to the largest model, if it costs as much as an MSO5000, it's not a question in my eyes, which scope to take.

author: Ciel
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: April 16, 2025, 03:39:05 pm
content: Quote from: Martin72 on April 15, 2025, 09:48:55 pmHad to double check and I believe there is no compromise to go for it. I confirmed that the rise time and bandwidth can be upgraded and it comes with probes(it wasn't clear) so it is basically the same price as the MSO5074 and even a bit cheaper(also due to a sale thingy they upgrade to 100M for you for free as well as a bunch of decoding optional lol, tho Rigol is also doing the optional thing), also didn't know digital probes where that expensive, yikes. Anyway, I guess the Siglent it is. That's the price without discounts too, the Rigol is(at least on paper, idk the actual figures) 300 US more without a sale, so it seems like an easy choice, I don't think I would need the 8Gsa/s.P.S. 1k USD if I didn't mention it, I think that's not horrible?

author: KungFuJosh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 16, 2025, 04:20:49 pm
content: Quote from: Ciel on April 16, 2025, 03:39:05 pmThat's a great price. Here, the SDS2104X Plus is $1399.