Testing out some nice high voltage caps (and hoping to promote my channel a bit) - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 30, 2013, 10:22:37 am
content: Hey all, here's a video you might all enjoy, testing out some high voltage caps that I got out of an APC symetra LX power module (I have a video of that too).I'm hoping some of you enjoy it and some of the other videos I have, I have a fair bit to upload still so there is a fair bit of new content just waiting on rendering/upload time as well as some cool stuff coming up. I'd like to hear your thoughts on the channel if there is much to say.I will say the video quality is nowhere as nice as many of the other people's, I can't afford a nice $600 camcorder so I'm just using an $80 point and shoot but I have a tripod mount for my iphone coming so quality will improve then.Content wise I just throw up random stuff I do on there, some high ish voltage relating to those caps, I have some videos of the air cannon I made (and more to come), and some projects. I also did a bit of a teardown of an old techtronics oscilloscope that I need to render. I don't have as much knowledge as dave, mikeslectricstuff or aintbigaintclever or the various others but I try.Anyways here it is, and I'd love to hear your thoughts on how I am charging the capacitors

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 02:35:17 am
content: Dear God, that's not a coil. It's a coaxial cable precision delay line. Used to delay signals so the trigger circuit can start the sweep circuit sweeping before the delayed signal gets to the scope's vertical amplifier. So you can see the trigger point on screen.But don't let that stop you discharging big caps through it for no particular reason. Btw, those caps are probably not rated for extremely high impulse current, and eventually the internal foil tabs connecting the terminals with the spiral-wound capacitor foil will fail.You know, casually handling tools wired to big caps, wired to bridge rectifiers directly off the mains... does tend to correlate with a severely shortened life expectancy. It's all good until you make a small slip-up, and then you're dead. Just so you know.If you want to live to see your channel subscriptions rise, I'd suggest using much less hands-on setups for high voltage play.

author: AndersAnd
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 02:50:14 am
content: You hooked up two bridge rectifiers in parallel? How would that give double the voltage?

author: c4757p
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 02:53:23 am
content: Oh lord.You need to take more responsibility for the stupid choices you might be suggesting to your viewers. How hard would it have been to take ten minutes to arrange your charging setup so that you're never reaching over live conductors? Better, so that the live conductors aren't exposed at all. Would that really be difficult? And take the time to explain what you are doing, because it looks like you're shorting out the mains. Do I know you aren't? Yep. Do your viewers?You might notice that many of the videos you see with "do not try this at home" warnings actually do take the time to do things safely. "Do not try this at home" does not legitimize your recklessness. You are going to fuck yourself up with that some day, and I am not going to be surprised.

author: calexanian
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 07:23:31 am
content: There are better and safer ways to test big caps.

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 07:38:50 am
content: Quote from: AndersAnd on December 01, 2013, 02:50:14 amI plan on it, I'm going to buy a proper enclosure and wire it up safely grounding the chassis and using a Cockcroft Walton multiplier to get the voltage up a tad higher. I definitely know it wasn't the best idea, but it was 3 or 4 am and I was a tad tired I still did take some precautions, working with one hand behind my back (well, at least far back from the capacitors)I also plan on grabbing an isolation transformer off ebay or seeing if the one from my APC power supply can be used as one but a proper isolation one is probably a better bet and probably fairly cheap on ebay if you look in the right section.Also, interesting, I didn't know it was a coax delay line, I figured that was just the coil used to align the electron beam, thanks for the neat info.This was also before I leaned as much about (relatively) high voltage than I have now, and I do recognize that it was insanely dangerous if I had made a mistake.Quote from: AndersAnd on December 01, 2013, 02:50:14 amI figured that paralleling up the DC outputs might give me 240 volts, and figured what the heck may as well see if my theory was correct, turns out it was not.

author: AndersAnd
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 09:59:13 am
content: Quote from: XOIIO on December 01, 2013, 07:38:50 amI think you should learn basic electric theories and play with galvanic isolated low voltage stuff before starting to play with any high voltage stuff.And when playing with electronics you should also use an galvanic isolation transformer in front of it to avoid killing yourself. Doesn't matter if you play with high or low voltage electronics, always use an galvanic isolated transformer in front of it instead of plugging it directly into a mains outlet.

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 10:58:33 am
content: Quote from: AndersAnd on December 01, 2013, 09:59:13 amI have a feeling you missed the part where it was middle of the night and I was tired, people don't exactly think best when they have been up for 14 hours. (yay insomnia). Besides at the time it made sense that you could boost the voltage that way considering you can do it with other voltage sources like variable power supplies (if they support it)Like I said I need to find an isolation transofrmer on ebay or at least get a price range so I can grab one when I can afford it.

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 11:16:23 am
content: After a quick browse on ebay I found these two that seem like the best deals, first one is for 230v though I doubt it can work on 120v, or maybe it can I asked for more specs on it. I really like the second one, but its a fair bit more expensive but I may try to save up and grab it if I get a decent amount of work.http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=331071295566http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Toroid-ISB-100W-Medical-Grade-Isolation-Transformer-8403D-/121145925452?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c34dc1f4c#shpCntId

author: Jon86
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 11:23:15 am
content: Hmm, I have to say I really don't like the look of this. No one's going to take you seriously if you're just messing around with High Voltage caps with no precautions. I think you ought to go back to the drawing board, rethink what you're doing and just act a bit more sensible.

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 11:55:52 am
content: Quote from: Jon86 on December 01, 2013, 11:23:15 amMost of the stuff I do doesn't even relate to high voltage, I just wanted to see how those caps worked and if it was effective with that coil. Aside from that all the stuff I plan is just low voltage stuff, some arduino/attiny stuff, and modifying things. I was going to build a coil gun but I lost interest in that. Besides it's hard to set up any proper precautions on a budget of $0

author: czdt8m
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 12:08:21 pm
content: Quote from: XOIIO on December 01, 2013, 10:58:33 amAll the more reason to take proper precausions.Electricity does not care how much or little sleep you had, or what time of day or night it is.But I expect you got that message by now.Having said that, I welcome anyone making EE content on YT. Just make sure you don't make any victims, including yourself.

author: TerraHertz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 12:15:36 pm
content: Quote from: XOIIO on December 01, 2013, 10:58:33 amArrgh!Here's another rule I've developed for myself over the years, by painful error. NEVER work on anything dangerous or tricky while tired.Not 'avoid if possible'. NEVER.

author: Jon86
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 12:23:24 pm
content: Quote from: XOIIO on December 01, 2013, 11:55:52 amThere's plenty of things you could've done to make what you were doing much less dangerous. Use insulating tape, a larger working area so things are less likely to fall over or come into contact, tidy up wires, use a proper mains switch or contactor.Also, if for some reason the mains wasn't properly disconnected when you shorted the caps, you might have not had a very nice time. There's potential for a good video, just try and be more professional about it next time

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 12:28:07 pm
content: Quote from: TerraHertz on December 01, 2013, 12:15:36 pmyeah back when I made this I pretty much had no way to handle my minor insomnia well at all, so I'd just try to do whatever was stuck on my mind to get it out of the way so I could actually sleep and that lead to occasional stuff like this. Luckily now I have a bit more control over it, I just need to remind myself to avoid stuff like that because occasionally I am still up at night and get an idea for something that could end badly when I'm tired. The good thing is now I remember to just letit sit to the next day. Repairing a PC power supply and accidentally touching the live heatsinks twice got the point across. (Interestingly it wasn't all that big of a shock, it was just across the forearm, not my chest or anything but I would have expected more from 120v, perhaps it wasn't mains voltage. I don't have a similar one to check right now)Quote from: Jon86 on December 01, 2013, 12:23:24 pmYeah, I made sure to use a good quality powerbar with a switch and I had something else hooked up to it so I was absolutely sure the power was turned off, that's one thing I was definitely cautious about. I didn't want to be able to pull whatever amperage (I'm guessing it would have allowed a full 15 amps before the breakers(s) tripped) through those powerful bridge rectifiers at 200v dc or so.

author: Jon86
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 12:32:50 pm
content: You could've got a lot more than 15A surge through that bridge, but at least you were careful about that.

author: Stonent
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 09:35:24 pm
content: 14 hours? Is that a lot or am I Superman for being able to work that long at work?

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 09:49:25 pm
content: Quote from: Stonent on December 01, 2013, 09:35:24 pmit was a few days of that in a row unfortunately, not just an all nighter.

author: AndersAnd
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 09:51:53 pm
content: Quote from: XOIIO on December 01, 2013, 09:49:25 pmMost people are awake well more than 14 hours every single day

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 10:24:13 pm
content: Quote from: AndersAnd on December 01, 2013, 09:51:53 pmFor me a day is just whenever I wake up from sleeping, and my sleep schedule switches around a lot, I really should move to Australia or somewhere on the other side of the globe since I always drift towards being awake at night, anyways that 14 hours of being awake was probably on only 6 hours of sleep or less. It's a pretty viscous cycle once it gets going and takes a good week to reset and usually a couple bottles of coke or pepsi to stay up at least 30 hours so I can sleep at a normal time.

author: BillyD
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 10:38:41 pm
content: How about using some sort of camera stand? My desire to avoid motion sickness outweighed any motivation to watch this for more than a minute or so!

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2013, 11:28:11 pm
content: Quote from: BillyD on December 01, 2013, 10:38:41 pmYeah I got a cheapo ($50) tripod, I had misplaced it at that time, but I found it again (albeit with a broken leg, it still works) and I have an iphone tripod mount from ebay coming so I can use that to record some decent looking video. My olympus point and shoot has really crap quality 720p for some reason, I guess because it's just a gimick they add to those cameras.Most of my stuff is on a tripod unless it's a really quick thing that doesn't show much.

author: Stonent
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 02, 2013, 12:19:59 am
content: Quote from: XOIIO on December 01, 2013, 10:24:13 pmI get around 4 hours of sleep regularly. I go to work every day when most people are leaving work and work until 1, 2,or 3 in the morning. When I get home I'm not really tired and end up going to sleep around 7:00 or sometimes 8:00AM. But it seems something tends to wake me up before noon.

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 02, 2013, 12:43:13 am
content: Quote from: Stonent on December 02, 2013, 12:19:59 amWell, I wish I could survive on that much sleep regularly, it would leave a lot more time to get stuff done although I'd go bat shit when all the stores for parts are closed and I run out of stuff to do.

author: c4757p
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 02, 2013, 01:03:40 am
content: You might do better if you slept more regularly. I'm a lot more tired and need a lot more sleep when I wake at random times. I usually feel more well-rested if my alarm wakes me at 6 than if I sleep until 8.

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 02, 2013, 01:26:53 am
content: Quote from: c4757p on December 02, 2013, 01:03:40 amheh, alarm waking you up, luckyI do plan on modifying an alarm to give a small electric shock through a wrist band (like an ESD one) to wake me up because I sleep way too deeply when I sleep.

author: smashedProton
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 02, 2013, 08:59:36 pm
content: You're learning. I was doing stuff just as stupid as you are doing now a couple years ago. That doesnt make it right... learn the properties of high voltage/high current. My advice is to design a simple switchmode boost converter. A super cheap one with a 555 timer and a comparator would do. also, get a safer trigger circuit. A scr with the gate opto isolated would be alright. A hand wound coil would also be an improvement. Also, include a flyback diode so you don't fuck your shit.

author: smashedProton
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 02, 2013, 09:00:41 pm
content: Quote from: XOIIO on December 02, 2013, 01:26:53 amIs your name by any chance Doc Brown?

author: SLJ
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 02, 2013, 11:18:13 pm
content: XOIIO - It's been a day since your last post here. Are you still alive?

author: c4757p
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 02, 2013, 11:26:46 pm
content: Quote from: SLJ on December 02, 2013, 11:18:13 pmHis electric shock alarm clock probably gave him a heart attack.

author: Phaedrus
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 02, 2013, 11:50:30 pm
content: I've accidentally shocked myself on 400-450V caps charged to 100-350V before. With the 350V my heart skipped at least two beats. If I were older or in worse shape I might have died. I take precautions now to avoid that sort of thing. A painful zap is one thing. Feeling your heart almost stopping is another.Only needed to feel that once to go from "Yeah, I'll take some precautionsunless I'm tired or in a hurry" to "This shit gets discharged safely now, or if I can't do that, I wait until it discharges naturally. No exceptions, and damn the time it takes." Deliberately charging a cap to high voltage and discharging it for fun,withouttaking extensive safety precautions before-hand... Is something I'll leave for those who place a much lower valuation on their life than I do.High voltage is dangerous, kids.

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2014, 04:36:24 pm
content: Quote from: c4757p on December 02, 2013, 11:26:46 pmLol, good oneI actually totally forgot about this forum post. I still plan on making the Shock Clock (patent pending), a couple hundred volts from bug zappers/camera flash circuits (without the caps of course) doesn't bug me at all, I got pretty used to it (not across the chest though, although I did that a few times) so just having the contacts close is enough to make my arm twitch a bit still until the third or fourth time and I'm used to it, the thing that's really stopping me is just finding a way to make a good wrist strap that will maintain good skin contact, I was thinking maybe some conductive thread, though that's a tad expensive I think, and there's still the matter of getting it to connect to the wires securely and durably, I was thinking maybe some elastic wrist strap and a couple metal buttons would work well (the kinds that snap together in two parts) because I could pinch the wires together between those.The shock clock is a pretty catchy name actually.Quote from: Phaedrus on December 02, 2013, 11:50:30 pmInteresting, any idea the current it was at? as I said in bit above I've been shocked with similar voltages though pretty low current across the chest and while it was a little big of a jolt, it definitely didn't make my heart miss any beats.Sometimes I think I have a weird resistance to electricity, I'd have to go to the police to volunteer to be tasered to see how much, but I seem to not be bothered by it as much as other people. A few weeks ago after finding some crappy jumper cable like clips (from an old spark plug tester gun sort of device, I still have the shell from it someone, a big chrome metal thing that fired up a neon tube I believe) I didn't notice the poor quality of the rubber, I had it hooked to the UPS transformer wired up to give 36v AC and I don't know how many, but it's a lot of amps (I need to buy an ebay clamp meter to find out, it puts out a buttload of current from what I can tell though) and god zapped a bit, thing is it wasn't bad at all, I wouldn't have done it again but I would have expected worse. The things were rusty as hell though so I doubt I made good contact.It makes me wonder if some people are more resistant to electric shock than others. Maybe it's just a combination of luck, having dry hands and being used to shocks, and a little bit of insanity perhaps.Heh, I remember my first shock, I had just had a shower (many many years ago by the way) and was going to plug in our TV, and I got zapped pretty darn good, I was stuck to the outlet for a second or two, I guess my finger was a bit too close or on the outlet prongs, but I remember thinking A: holy crap and B: that was kind of awesome. I did know better than to try it again, but I've always kind of liked electric shock a bit since then.... something's wrong with me isn't there? lol

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2014, 04:39:59 pm
content: Oh yeah don't know if I mentioned it at all but I was really surprised that that was a delay line and not the coil to keep the electron beam in line, I figured it would be fairly beefy, I guess you don't need a whole lot though since it is in a vacuum.I still kind of wish I could have figured out what was wrong with it but after turning it on when it had frozen the damn thing wouldn't work no matter what. Oh well, got some neat parts out of it and I only ever used it a bit as a neat music visualizer, would be nice to get another old analog scope someday to muck about with if I can.

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 05, 2014, 04:45:01 pm
content: It seems that this forum doesn't have an ignore user button. Would be useful.

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2014, 04:48:29 pm
content: Quote from: Lurch on January 05, 2014, 04:45:01 pmYou could also just do what regular people do and ignore it the regular way. Taking the time to post a useless comment is pretty much the exact opposite of ignoring something.Guess some people never learn these things though

author: Unknown
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 05, 2014, 04:50:51 pm
content: Quote from: XOIIO on January 05, 2014, 04:48:29 pmThat doesn't make any sense.On the subject of useless comments posted, I refer you to your OP, and also quite a few of your other posts where you seem to just insult people because you can't do something yourself when asked. Rather than getting angry at the fact that you are incapable of following simple instructions or doing things in a safe manner how about you like, I don't know, learn.

author: XOIIO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2014, 04:55:31 pm
content: Quote from: Lurch on January 05, 2014, 04:50:51 pmLike I've said before, when people offer tips in a shitty way with a sarcastic tone, or being a jerk for no reason or just having a shitty attitude throughout their post I'm not going to listen to their so called advice. At least my OP got some discussion going, what did yours contribute to? Apparently your lack of ability to ignore things and some personal grudge against me that you can't seem to get past, I guess that is why you insist on posting useless stuff instead of, oh yeah, ignoring it since the ignore user feature you complained about doesn't exist.

author: smashedProton
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2014, 08:20:50 pm
content: People are being passive aggressive because a video blogger and maker killing himself would make the hobby look bad...

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 06, 2014, 01:22:05 am
content: I agree with the tone of the posts, if not necessarily the language used. If you get the urge again to do something like this at 3:00 AM, please don't post a video of it. Don't give anyone with very limited knowledge any excuse to try it at home. You were lucky, someone else might not be. I don't know you personally, but you do seem to have a bit of a cavalier attitude. I wouldn't want to see you or anyone else hurt because judgement wasn't as good as it should have been. Over the years, I have found some very creative ways to hurt myself. In fact, my wife is no longer amazed, she just looks at me and shakes her head. And this with trying my best to take all possible precautions. OK, so I won't give up wearing shorts while soldering. Florida is just too hot for jeans and I will live with my choice there. Don't give up ever on learning and experimenting. However, fully engage your brain at least 10 seconds before you put your hands in motion. The life you save might just be your own.