Questions about high-voltage power supplies for ion related devices - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / beginners

author: HcSvntDracones
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: July 07, 2018, 08:36:44 pm
content: I have some free time, and had built a simple 7kv ionizer for my studio, which was fun... until I came upon one site.. rimstar.org and his Enterprise model WORKING Ion Engines here:https://rimstar.org/science_electronics_projects/ion_propulsion_for_star_trek_enterprise_ionocraft.htmletting my imagination take over on hyper-drive. I am the type that learns very quickly by just doing, so I want to build several ion wind based devices, and other high-voltage toys to see where it takes me. Since this is a brand new potential hobby, I can't say if it will stick with me, or be well in the past in a week, so I want to start off as CHEAP and SIMPLE as possible, which means cheap power supplies, though I want to avoid building one as much as possible, so I can focus on just the ion part of the project.I have a few options for the 30kv range I need, Flyback transformer based power supplies or boost step-up converters, like this:http://a.co/bUoAB6nI know it can definitely put out 30kv, and beyond the heat issues, would this work for the stuff I am looking to play with, and if so, would I get any real use out of it beyond a few minutes?In terms of power-supplies under $75, I can go with a Flyback driver which includes an ignition coil:http://a.co/ew8whNx. They recommend a boost step-up, which is 3.6-9 volt input and up to 200kv output. I am a bit confused, what is the point of a flyback, when a boost step-up can make the voltage itself? Or is this just adding a flyback to a step-up to increase the vo9ltage even more?So, what is my best option from Amazon? My GOAL is to get a working power supply that will output 30kv, which I can assemble with very little work, for well under $50. I got a 7kv negative ion generator for $5 that all I had to do was solder on an ouitlet for the mains, and done. Looking for the same simplicity here. I will upgrade it and etc as my interest progreesses.

author: X
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: July 07, 2018, 11:22:55 pm
content: Is connecting the HT PSU to the mains an option? If so, you can use a CW multiplier circuit.Big Clivehas some good insight if you want to learn more about those.The advantage of a CW multiplier is a smooth DC output. The disadvantage is that the output can sag if your caps are not big enough. It also becomes less efficient as you go up in stages, due to losses within the diodes, etc.But 30kV is doable from a CW multiplier with decent caps and diodes (I recall using 30 KEMET caps, 100nF rated at 1.6kV DC and some 2kV rated low-leakage diodes). You should experiment with frequency as well, as there will be a peak in which these multipliers are the most efficient with the least output sag.You can use a 3-4 stage multiplier with higher voltage caps and diodes to shove onto the end of your flyback. You get voltage multiplication, rectification and smoothing all in one shot.

author: HcSvntDracones
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: July 08, 2018, 12:06:52 am
content: Mains power is available, and probably my route of getting power, however, the boost step-up power converter can take 3.6v to 6v as input voltage, making batteries, especially lithium Ion, a preferred source, but for convenience, I am going mains. My current 7KV negative ion generator take 9 volts and pushes out 7kv, so I just have a 9v AC-DC power adapter wired to it.I am pretty sure the 400kv boost step-up work for me, unless it does an on-off pulse thing. My worry is that it doesn't seem like something that will last terribly long, description even says heat is a HUGE issue, and in an effort to keep this initial endeavor under $100, I am looking for the simplest way to put together a 30kv power supply (without needing to really learn much more). The ZVS Flyback drive I found (Comes with ignition coil) is under $20, and looks as though all I need to do is add a switching power supply, which I have, and 3d print a case. The confusing thing is tons of references on the page and comments to needing a boost step-up with it. Is the step-up needed just to go beyond the output voltage of the flyback without increasing the input voltage, or is it needed for it to even work, and can it get to 30kv without?The 2-week "vacation" I am taking involves learning all I can about cubesat design and assembly, as I got picked to build a nanosat for a small group that already has launch funding, SO with that being said, I want to avoid circuit diagrams and instead look at pretty purple coronasHere are specs on both items:Features:SainSmart ZVS Flyback Driver● 12-36VDC input (recommend 24V 10A), output high voltage direct current, voltage of the input voltage of about 1000 times. The 12V input can reach 50-100W power, 24 V input max can reach more than 200W.● ZVS circuit. High output power, low heat, simply and reliable, has been widely used in the drive spark gap tesla coil (SGTC) and Jacob, ladders, Marx generator, etc.Notice:You will need to source it at least 10 A at input current for safety concern.Package List:● 1 x SainSmart ZVS Tesla coil driver board● 1 x ignition coilManual:https://s3-ap-northeast-1.amazonaws.com/sain-amzn/20/20-019-173/ZVS+manual+.docxDC 3.6V-6V To 400KV Boost Step Up Power Module High Voltage GeneratorFeature:The high-voltage module uses the principle Tesla coil is made of high-voltage pulse output voltage current- small size- high efficiency- simple external circuit(just plug in the switch- the battery can be) discharge intensity violent.Specification:Input voltage: DC 3.6V - 6VOutput voltage: DC 400KV - 600KV(Please note that when security)High type: pulse currentHigh voltage bipolar discharge distance: 10mm - 20mmOutput voltage lines length: about 100mmInput power cable length: about 10mm (red is positive)Dimensions : Φ24 x 63mmPower:3.7V Li-ion battery can be used single or two series- such as 18650- idle cell phone batteries ( to remove the protection board - the proposed capacity of 2000mAh or more ) or NiCd / NiMH battery pack- 4V or 6V lead acid batteries.This module is a small production with high-pressure science inverter transformer / booster finished module- the input terminal DC 3V - 7.2V can get 20KV DC high voltage (about 1-2 cm arc) at the output can be used as high school science experiments - electronic equipment- negative ion generator- high voltage source to use when making small science.Note:Avoid high-pressure high-voltage module load electricity use. Must adjust the high voltage side suitable distance (before electricity- battery voltage and capacity is proportional to the distance from high-voltage arcing used when testing the arc distance from short to long experiment- prohibited from beyond the arc when powered up- the energy can not be released due to high pressure- easily damage the module)Due to power- the internal heat is not easy- every power-on time should be controlled within a minute.Determine whether the battery capacity can be driven

author: HcSvntDracones
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: July 08, 2018, 12:24:35 am
content: Looking at the flyback driver, am I correct in assuming it will put out 12kv using 12v dc input? Also, how would the step-up boost converter actually connect? It is 3-6v input and up to 400v output, while the flyback is 12-24 input and well over 6v output. I can't see how they could be used together.... Am I just horribly confused? haha