level of Advertising is getting Ridiculous - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: jonovid
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 02:39:59 am
content: Just try watching anything popular with the general public on youtube! nowadays.example- A Burning CANDLE in Epoxy Resin posthttps://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/a-burning-candle-in-epoxy-resin/popular youtube videoCircuit boards with lights in epoxy in a table5,106,399 viewsyou get hit with waves of advertising mixed in with the video it self.this is getting ridiculous. advertising approaching the levels as free-to-air TV channelsanyone else experiencing similar things?no links to youtube neededby anything not so popular I am saying, anything that is hard core technical or specialist geeky.as I like to see most of the time.

author: Halcyon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 02:45:30 am
content: This is why I block all ads, including Youtube pre-roll video ads. I haven't watched an ad on Youtube for years. I use Adblock Plus in combination with the Ghostery browser plugin. It's extremely effective.Alternatively, can view Dave's videos onLBRYwithout ads at all.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 02:59:18 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on June 27, 2020, 02:51:52 amTrivial to spoof if there's a demand for it.

author: Halcyon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 03:37:47 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on June 27, 2020, 02:51:52 amThere is always that risk whenever you circumvent something, but as I said, this combination has worked for me for several years and it has never not worked. I doubt Google would bother putting too much time and effort trying to prevent a relatively small number of users from blocking their ads. It's just not worth it. If they can get 90% of users to display their ads, that's good enough. They won't ever prevent users who use ad blockers from using their services either, it would be a suicide mission, particularly as most modern browsers have built-in ad blocking.This method doesn't just block the pre-roll ads either, it prevents the ads which are interspersed within the videos as well.

author: Rerouter
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 03:41:16 am
content: Do not use the "youtube app", on any mobile device.On the website, I play a 3 hour video with no included ads, and it just plays this is with no ad blockerOn the app, it loads up 2 adds at the start. and includes and extra one every 15 minutes,I also suspect the creator is not seeing that ad revenue as the specific creator I was watching does not have ads set on any of his videos

author: Halcyon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 03:53:09 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on June 27, 2020, 03:42:28 amAs far as I'm aware, the vast majority of those ad blockers don't block YouTube's video ads.

author: Halcyon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 04:00:07 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on June 27, 2020, 03:55:56 amYep ABP does to some degree but I've had mixed results with it over the years. Also ABP isn't a built-in ad blocker that comes with browsers, users need to manually install it. My point specifically related to those built-in blockers which come as part of the browser itself without the user needing to install a third-party plugin. Google isn't about to block all those users out of their services (particularly those using Chrome). The latest "browser wars" have basically come down to Firefox, Chrome and arguably Opera. Could you imagine if Google's own products didn't work with their browser out of the box?With Ghostery, even the white screen is gone. No evidence of any ads or placeholders at all.

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 05:35:44 am
content: normally I am too lazy to install ad block but recently I noticed it was getting downright intrusive (same fucking soap advertisement showing bear men lathering themselves up for 3 minutes) on a 5 minute video just pissed me offnow I just buy giant tubs of synthetic detergent chemical blue color body wash.i want to see those fucking actors hunted down by the predator if they are so manly with the natural bar soap.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 06:39:14 am
content: I don't see any ads on Youtube because I have premium. A good way to avoid ads and give revenue to creators BTW (minus Youtube's cut of course).Creators have the option to enabled in-video ads either automatically or at specific points in the video.I've heard it's fairly lucrative but I don't do it because I don't want my videos interrupted with ads.

author: Halcyon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 06:48:14 am
content: I still get ads on my mobile as I use the native Youtube application and it's getting beyond the joke. In a 22 minute video, I had to skip 8 separate ads.

author: rdl
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 07:21:32 am
content: I use only NoScript and uBlock Origin on Pale Moon and haven't seen an ad anywhere for years. I use them on Firefox too, but I don't use Firefox enough to comment. I also use a hosts file, but haven't updated it in a long time.

author: chickenHeadKnob
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 07:29:32 am
content: Quote from: coppercone2 on June 27, 2020, 05:35:44 amLoL @ coppercone2.I have to wonder what is in your browser history to cause youtube to target you with those addsI get pickup truck, chocolate bar and more recently ads for that google-shit "honey" browser addon

author: Rerouter
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 07:36:27 am
content: just get endless 15 second long Telstra "where here to help" ads, and occasional KFC silent 5 seconds ads,

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 07:41:11 am
content: Quote from: chickenHeadKnob on June 27, 2020, 07:29:32 ami think it was bush crafting videos

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 07:43:18 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on June 27, 2020, 02:41:06 amYes. Use an AD blocker and disable tracking 'pixels'. I started the video from that thread but no commercials at all. I never have commercials in any Youtube video unless it is part of the content the Youtuber uploaded. I'm using adblock plus and Firefox (which also can block tracking pixels as part of the privacy settings; there is no use serving somebody ads if they don't know what to show).

author: jogri
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 07:45:04 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on June 27, 2020, 02:51:52 amYT is already starting to do that since last week (at least for me), i get a white screen when i try to watch a video. Looks like i can't get around this as i already have ABP, NoScript and a pihole running... I wouldn't mind having the option to just see one ad per video to support the creator, but right now i can only choose between the full barrage of ads or nothing. This also goes for other website, a lot of them seem to have switched to two 1/4 wide video side banners on both sides (probably due to a massive decrease in ad revenue). I have nothing against a few nonintrusive ads but this is getting ridiculous, do they really expect that people stay on their site when half of your monitor is filled with annoing video ads?I can understand their motivation, they don't get as much ad revenue because more people started to use ad blockers-> they have to make more money with less ad views-> more aggresive ads->more people switch to adblockers.

author: Halcyon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 07:49:34 am
content: Quote from: jogri on June 27, 2020, 07:45:04 amTry the Ghostery browser plugin. Like I mentioned before, no placeholders and no ads.

author: HwAoRrDk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 09:38:04 am
content: Quote from: Halcyon on June 27, 2020, 06:48:14 amMe too. The amount of ads on some videos is atrocious. What's just as exasperating too is seeing the same ads over and over and over again. I swear Audible must have a bottomless advertising budget because they make up 50% of all the YT ads I see.One thing I have noticed is that the amount of ads is greater when you watch a video very soon after release. Wait a couple of days and there are far fewer (usually just pre-/post-roll).I would love to use a browser with ad-blocker on mobile to watch YT, but for some reason the native YT app is far more efficient at playing video. Playing in browser saps battery life and makes the phone hotter, presumably due to increased CPU usage.

author: engrguy42
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 11:42:21 am
content: Are you people unaware that the way the universe works is that people receive services, and pay money in return? That's how it works. That's how you have a job. That's how you have money. That's why there are businesses like department stores and supermarkets. That's how it works. You RECEIVE a service, and in turn you PAY for the service.Is there some belief that, for some insane reason, computer software and youtube videos are somehow different? They aren't. Advertisements are the way that you pay for the service. Ideally, you click on them so the poor youtube creator can make $0.00002 of revenue for his hard work.Yeah, great, block the ads. And as is happening now, tech and other useful stuff on youtube will dwindle to nothing, and all we'll be left with is videos of cats playing piano that get 25 trillion views.

author: Rerouter
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 11:47:15 am
content: engrguy42, In your context would you agree there is some threshold where there are so many ads you feel the service is not worth your time to watch? for many its once they have hit that threshold they likley went looking elsewhere, came back defeated and resorted to these solutions,For me, I am still left puzzled where the money exactly goes when the app crams in 10 ads, where on a non ad blocked browser there are 0 set in the video by the creator.

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 11:52:06 am
content: What's annoying is lots of the adverts are at random places, often in the middle of a word!I question how effective advertising is, because I don't even know what most of it is for. Often it's some stupid music, with an easily forgettable logo, I don't even recognise and have no desire to look up.

author: engrguy42
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 11:58:46 am
content: Quote from: Rerouter on June 27, 2020, 11:47:15 amGimme a break. "Not worth your time"?? Let's be honest here shall we? You're watching youtube instead of attending an important meeting? No, most people watch youtube for entertainment, and most videos are about 10 minutes long. You have time. Let's not act like we're so busy with important stuff, huh?You should be clicking ads, hitting the LIKE button so often you get carpal tunnel, subscribing left and right, and doing everything you can think of to support the youtube creators who provide useful stuff. Instead, most people feel entitled to get exactly what they want for free, and if they don't get it they click off and watch videos of cats.

author: Rerouter
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 12:07:50 pm
content: I do not use an adblocker on youtube on my phone. so I fall outside of your issue as that is where most of my content consumption happens, on the website youtube is below my threshold, for the app it is above it, so I dropped using the app,I'm also a patreon to my favorite creators, so your kind of white knighting at the wrong guy, I want to know where you would say "This is too much",News websites and other websites I have abandoned because there was too many or aggressive ads, Gizmodo for an example with autoplay video and audio ads that chase you around the page, but a quick look seems like they have reduced the number some what since then.My exact context is hours long scientific videos that I listen to while driving between sites, 5 minute unstoppable ads are way past the threshold that I am willing to deal with

author: SeanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 12:12:58 pm
content: Adverts in a video are for the non savvy, who are much more likely to click on the ad, and actually buy the product being advertised, than those who are able to use the ad blocker. If you are blocking the ads then the chances of you buying anything from an ad is so much lower than if you did not, so rather go after the low hanging fruit. As a plus most advertising is wrong, the art is in getting the amount that is wrong down low enough that you make a profit.the Audible ad is likely a placeholder ad, low price to the provider, and played whenever there is not enough info available in the algorithm to decide on a better targeted ad, so roll through the low cost ads in the hope to get more analytical data.At work not my computer, and I do enough random searches to confuse the ad algorithm anyway, plus never actually signed into my own account there ever, so the ads I get are random, or related to older searches. Did install adblock there for Chrome, more to stop annoying audio and video ads, than anything else. If I want personal email I use my phone, and the DuckDuckGo browser addon, which, while it does sweet FA about Google tracking links from Gmail ( go figure, if the mobile Gmail mail client cannot do a ping, then it simply does a redirect through google to get the data) or the other trackers, at least i do not waste the data I pay for on annoying underlay ads, instead getting just a black screen in place of them, plus almost no ads or trackers otherwise on pages.Only a couple of publishers who went online from print have the ability to serve all the ads they want to irrespective of adblocking and blacklists, because they did their homework, and host the ads themselves, and do all the analytics in house as well, so blocking the ads almost invariably ( unless you get very granular in the blacklist to block specific parts of sites) results in no content at all being delivered. However having the ad served from your own server means you control the type of ad served, and how much it can do as well. Much less chance of malware then, though it does mean you will have a proper web developer team, and vet every incoming advert as well.

author: jogri
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 12:15:43 pm
content: Quote from: engrguy42 on June 27, 2020, 11:42:21 amExactly, we are talking about products. If i don't like them, i don't buy them. Same goes for websites/videos: If i don't like the obscene amounts of ads, i won't view the ads. If a Youtuber or a website only has a modest amounts of ads and i like their content i'll disable my adblocker for them.It's their choice to plaster everything with annoying video ads if they want to maximize the profit per page visit, but that comes at the cost of annoying people-> not sustainable as almost all visitors will use adblockers or go somewhere else. Sure, switching to nonintrusive ads will lower the profit at first, but it is sustainable when frequent visitors don't mind having a few ads->they will switch off their adblockers, giving you a constant viewerbase that gets you money via ad views.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 12:16:56 pm
content: Quote from: engrguy42 on June 27, 2020, 11:42:21 amPayment doesn't have to be in money either, it can be in making a name for yourself, or just getting the warm fuzzy from the feedback etc.

author: engrguy42
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 12:46:40 pm
content: Quote from: jogri on June 27, 2020, 12:15:43 pmjogri, you're absolutely right. If you don't like them, don't buy them. And at the end of the day, the vast majority of youtube watchers ONLY are interested in mindless entertainment, and that's all they really like. And that's what they (somewhat unknowingly) support by clicking and liking them.But just don't come back here in 5 years or whatever complaining "Hey, where are all the serious tech videos?". Personally, I'm convinced that in the not-to-distant future there will be zero sustainable business model for tech youtubers who don't cave to the mindless entertainment crowd. I give it less than 3 years. And all people can do now is delay that a bit by supporting the tech youtubers with what I suggested. But at the end of the day, get ready for nothing but more ads and more mindless music videos and cat videos and cute stuff videos and goofy prank videos. Because that's what people REALLY want.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 01:10:10 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on June 27, 2020, 06:39:14 amHow much do the creators actually get? Last time I checked, it's something like 50%, which only looks good compared to record companies. If it's still low like that and the creators accept some better way for donations, you'll do better using an adblocker and sharing what you would have spent with them.What I would like to see is a way for individuals to add value to donations made by others. For example, if viewer A makes a donation to creator B, he/she would also be able to get benefits from "online service donor" C. C doesn't get a cut of the donation (so B is not losing out on anything), but A gets enhanced value from the donation and would get more motivation to donate. The kinds of services C could offer would likely be of the kind that need very little ongoing cost, for example offering time on a SDR receiver. If C is in a good place to install a good antenna and a bank of RTL-SDRs while A isn't, then A gets a good value from a service that costs little to run.

author: jogri
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 01:18:33 pm
content: Let's be honest: Most tech-YTers just won't survive on ad revenue alone, their videos are just too expensive to ever recoup their money via ads. According to Socialblade, medium-sized tech channels like Applied Science or Tech Ingredients have a monthly income of probably 300-800 USD while producing only 1-2 videos per month. They can't just spam out daily videos as the amount of work they have to put into every video is extremely high.They don't need 0.1ct per viewer and video, they probably need over ten times as much to break even. Ads aren't a viable solution for them, they need sponsors and Patreon to stay alive. So yes, viewing ads on their channels helps them a bit (and most of them only have a moderate amount of ads), but the entire ad revenue system just works against their style of content as it was designed for quantity, not quality content.

author: engrguy42
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 01:34:40 pm
content: Quote from: jogri on June 27, 2020, 01:18:33 pmI think you're looking at this bass-ackwards.The REASON why they can't survive on ads alone is because VIEWERS aren't interested in tech videos, and therefore don't watch, and the numbers that can be applied to ad revenue are tiny. But that doesn't mean ad revenue is useless. For some creators ad revenue is thru the roof. The problem is, in the serious tech world there are incredibly few people on this planet who are interested.It's up to viewers to value these things and support them by watching and liking and subscribing. It's the viewers fault, nobody else's. But viewers aren't interested. If they were, they'd be giving tech videos 12 million views like the latest cat video. (BTW, for reference, I think that at recent ad revenue return rates, 12 million views would amount to at least $12,000. For one video).Now as a side note, I hesitate to mention the elephant in the room, but this economic depression that's going on is just going to get worse, IMO. Much worse. Especially with the incredible spike in cases in recent weeks as economies open back up and a world full of morons has convinced themselves that the pandemic is over.I fully expect advertisers to pull back their percentages, as well as Patreons and anyone else you want to mention. So it will get even tougher for creators. Which means we viewers need to support them more, if we can. Or sit back and complain about ads and watch them dwindle to nothing.

author: madires
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 01:54:00 pm
content: Ads are the only working micropayment method in western countries.

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 03:14:48 pm
content: Quote from: engrguy42 on June 27, 2020, 11:42:21 amProducing a service is not the case with the most of youtubers. Ask them why they make their videos and they all tell you "because i love making videos!". So if they love making videos so much then they should make their goddamn videos and not complain about not getting enough paid.

author: jogri
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 03:49:54 pm
content: Quote from: engrguy42 on June 27, 2020, 11:42:21 amFirst the problem was that people aren't paying to watch tech videos, no the problem is that people are not interested in tech videos... How does this go together? The ad revenue doesn't even cover the cost of producing the video, so even if people don't use adblockers creators of tech videos don't get an additional budget for advertising their videos.And how many tech YTer REGULARLY get 1M+ views on their videos? They would need over 3-4M views/month to go fulltime and probably 10M+ views to create interesting content. Science isn't cheap. And even if a tech channel manages to get a video on the front page of YT it doesn't get them a lot of attention as most people that click on the video are not going to become regular viewers. So what to do? Blame people that they don't find a particular type of video interesting? Well, i don't enjoy watching Make-Up tutorials, am i to blame if a Make-Up channel runs out of money?Yes, in-depth tech videos are not for people who want shallow entertainment. If YT becomes a platform primarily for that sort of content tech videos aren't going to become more popular, but at that point you could also reverse your argument: Isn't it the fault of the video creators if they create content that a majority doesn't enjoy? If they want to make money they just have to produce more videos that cost less to produce and that are enjoyable by the broader mass of people... If people don't enjoy tech videos, then stop making tech videos if you want to make money.

author: engrguy42
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 03:52:06 pm
content: Quote from: Bud on June 27, 2020, 03:14:48 pmSo tell me Bud...Let's say you had a job that you enjoyed. No, let's say you LOVED doing that work. In that case is your employer not obligated to pay you? "Sorry Bud, but you really like this job, so you shouldn't complain if I don't pay you".Yeah, that makes sense. Assume all youtube creators love making videos and therefore viewers like you aren't obligated to support them by hitting a freakin' "like" button or watching a freakin' 12 second advertising video. Got it.

author: jogri
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 04:15:21 pm
content: Quote from: engrguy42 on June 27, 2020, 03:52:06 pmLet's just assume that most people work because they want the "your work vs my money" trade and not because they particularly enjoy doing the same thing until they are 67... You have a job to get money, and you have a hobby that you enjoy, but don't get money for. If a youtuber decides to go fulltime in self-employment, they have to do something that gets them money. It's their job after all.Do i have to financially support a company that produces a product no one wants? Well, they like what they're producing so you better pay for it. That's capitalism for you, people vote with their wallets. You produce something no one wants to buy? You don't get any money for it.You have to have the right mentality: Do i enjoy making videos and don't mind getting a little bit of extra money? You should start a tech channel (those are the kind of channels that get viewers, they would play around with tech and film it anyway, getting money to do it is just a nice bonus).Do i primarily want to make money and tech/science is one of my hobbys? You should probably look for another source of income...

author: engrguy42
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 27, 2020, 04:29:17 pm
content: jogir, I have no idea what point you're trying to make. And honestly I don't give a F*** what you or anyone else here does. I'm just telling you that the whole youtube tech channel thing is a huge pain for creators, and it's getting exponentially more difficult and risky and limited in what's allowed. And more and more, those who do it because they like it are dropping off because it just isn't worth it. Too many risks, no rewards. And it's only gonna get worse, with more and more restrictions on what you can say and do.And what makes it worse is the viewers who have this arrogant, entitled attitude that they deserve perfection, and won't spend 0.25 seconds doing something that might help the creator. If you're fine with the small tech channels disappearing in the future, that's fine with me. Just don't be surprised. IMO, it's going to be nothing more than mindless entertainment for the masses in the near future. And IMO, we're pretty much already there.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 06:53:47 am
content: Quote from: engrguy42 on June 27, 2020, 04:29:17 pmAre you actually a Youtube creator?As someone who is one of those creators, and talks to other tech creators on a regular basis, I think you are way off the mark.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 07:00:53 am
content: Quote from: NiHaoMike on June 27, 2020, 01:10:10 pmYoutube do take 50% of the Premium service fee. But how the rest of your 50% monthly fee is actually spread across creators is a mystery algorithm. But about 20% of my Youtube income comes from Premium subscription users. But they don't tell you want percentage of viewers are Premium subscribers.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 07:11:40 am
content: Quote from: jogri on June 27, 2020, 03:49:54 pmCorrect. Take my recent ones that have done a smidge over 100k+ views#1301 - Arcade Machine $232#1299 - Dumpster Laptop $171#74 - 5G Causes EVERYTHING $273#1298 - 2000W Power PSU $215Lesser view ones like #1313 - Bad Luck Mailbag got $139 in revenue.And I'm a reasonably popular channel in the tech sector.If you want to do tech tutorial videos like say my whiteboard #1300 - "Parts Per" Notation, that earned me $65.

author: HobGoblyn
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 08:15:34 am
content: I watch a lot of YouTube on my Sony TV. There doesn’t appear to be any way of blocking ads on there.But most ads appear for only 5 secs before I can skip them. The most this seems to happen is twice during a vid and once at the beginning, so not something I’m that bothered about.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 08:27:37 am
content: Quote from: HobGoblyn on June 28, 2020, 08:15:34 amThat is entirely the choice to the content creator. We can chose skipable or un-skipable pre-roll ads, plus mid-roll and post-roll ads.

author: wilfred
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 09:09:39 am
content: Quote from: engrguy42 on June 27, 2020, 04:29:17 pmIt is never the viewers fault. If a content creator isn't making the effort to make content viewers want in order to reap whatever financial rewards are on offer then it is their fault. And as for "those who do it because they like it " dropping off, do they do it because they like it or not? If they're not rewarded by the satisfaction of the act of creation then they're doing it for the money or fame. In which case they can damn well make what the viewers want to pay for. Expecting anything less is arrogant entitlement on the creators part.It is exactly what is meant by the old adage "the customer is always right".

author: engrguy42
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 12:39:19 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on June 28, 2020, 06:53:47 amIn what way am I "way off the mark"? Two posts down you prove my point to some extent. You show that creators receive only like $1-3 per 1k views. And those views likely take place over years. How is that a reward? It takes years to get to where you'll receive over 100k views for a video, and in the end all you get for payment is peanuts? And you then pay high taxes on that income (at least in the US). And before you post it you have to verify that there's nothing that might upset anyone in the video by checking a long list of boxes? A whole list of crap that is undefined and left up to the same types of people like L'Oreal, who removes all references to the words "white/whitening, fair/fairness, light/lightening" in their product line so they don't offend anyone?? Did you use any of those words in any of your videos??And if you dare to do something that someone decides is against undefined COPPA limitations you can get huge fines (at least in the US). And, as you say, if want to produce serious tech stuff nobody's interested. They only want entertainment, like unboxing's, reviews, etc. And after years of effort, you can be de-monetized in a heartbeat for no reason whatsoever other than someone's belief you did something wrong. Or have to chase false copyright claims.I see a lot of risk, and very little reward. Unless you're willing to spend many years pumping out videos with little or no income, and make sure you don't do anything that might offend anyone, and make sure you're entertaining enough, and so on. And on top of that you have to listen to the arrogant, entitled complainers who feel free to post negative comments because THEY didn't like the way something was phrased or edited or how many ads you decide to use so you can get a few pennies more. They don't pay you crap for the service, but they feel entitled to complain. For those who are willing to put up with all that, then fine. But for the average, rational person, there are a lot of risks and costs and efforts, and few if any rewards.

author: engrguy42
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 12:59:59 pm
content: Quote from: wilfred on June 28, 2020, 09:09:39 amGood for you. If you're happy to have free, mindless entertainment when you go to youtube, then you're absolutely right. Give us mindless crap cuz we love it.I'm talking about the few of us who like to learn, and see serious tech stuff not mindless drivel. Y'know, those of us who are engineers and enjoy engineering. And learning stuff. Yeah, there are actually some of us out there. For us, it's a sad state of affairs. Because YT creators are being driven to entertain rather than provide serious tech stuff. Yeah, I suppose we're a dying breed, since our society now is all about entertainment. Aside from a bunch of sharp engineering students in India (where engineering is still a thing), we're all about music videos and watching others play freakin' video games and doing mindless pranks. That's what people want. And you're right...the customer is always right, so that's what we'll get.

author: SilverSolder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 01:09:52 pm
content: The real problem with Youtube is that people got used to it being free, with no ads. Of course, that was just to build up the business and lock out any hope of competition establishing itself. Now that Youtube is in an (almost) unassailable position, they start twisting the thumb screws. If they had used those tactics in an established business sector it would probably have been deemed unlawful...The increasing presence of unescapable ads has had the following effects:1) The perception of wasting my time on un-interesting ads is overwhelming, just like watching old style US television.2) I used to be able to quickly jump around inside a video to see if it might be interesting to watch the whole thing. Now I can't "go looking" any longer.3) Marginally interesting videos that used to be still worth watching in the background are no longer worth it at all.The net result is that Youtube is no longer a positive experience - it has become a drag - so I have cut usage back to a bare minimum.

author: engrguy42
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 01:46:35 pm
content: Right. It's Youtube's fault.Geesh.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 02:00:58 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on June 28, 2020, 07:00:53 amWhat benefits does it actually give you? If you can get the same experience using Adblock, then give to the creators using Patreon/Subscribestar/Bitcoin/whatever, 90% or more of your payment goes towards making the content you enjoy. (AvE even endorses using Adblock for his viewers who don't like ads, whether or not they're supporters.)I also realized that the idea I had for giving more value to donations could be implemented by the subscription services giving "tokens" which have no monetary value, but for which anyone could set up services like the SDR receiver example that accept them. (Unlike money, the tokens are no longer useful once "spent".)

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 02:45:11 pm
content: Quote from: NiHaoMike on June 28, 2020, 02:00:58 pma) Not all creators have ways to donate to them.b) Most people watch countless videos on youtube they don't subscribe to and will likely never watch again. So using Premium gives at least a little bit of money automatically to that creator because you fleetingly watched their content.c) Only a very small percentage (5% would beenormous) of regular subscribers/viewers actually "take action" and go to the effort to donate etc. So again Premium is the "lazy person's" way to support.I also have always supported viewers who chose to use adblock, I have never asked anyone to turn it off, ever. If that's what you want to do I'm fine with that.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 03:03:55 pm
content: Quote from: engrguy42 on June 28, 2020, 12:39:19 pmIn bold above. You are wrong no less than three times about content.1) Making videos is not "a huge pain" for Tech Youtubers2) It's not "getting exponentially more difficult and risky and limited in what's allowed" for tech channels. We can do almost anything we like. Only exception I can think of is a channel like Cody's Lab that has had a couple of videos removed because they involved dangerous chemicals or something.3) There are few "restrictions on what you can say and do" for tech channels.And, I'll take no answer meaning that you aren't a creator. So I guess, to use modern parlance, you are kind of a creator white knight?QuoteIt's not a problem for tech channels.I'm certainly no fan of what's happening on Youtube, the "hate speech" rules are abhorrent, but when it comes to tech channels you are wrong.QuoteDéjà vu. Sounds exactly like when I started 12 years ago....QuoteYou sound bitter some how?Maybe you'd like to make content yourself but couldn't be bothered having a go?Pro tip: do it because you enjoy it, not because you expect to make money from it.Pro tip2: Have a backup plan and other income sources. This wasobviousto me almost 10 years ago when I went full time at this.

author: vis1-0n
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 03:54:10 pm
content: I get the saddest feeling when I see a thumbnail of a video with a image and byline that looks interesting, I hover to preview and then move on. It has usually been recently uploaded in the last few days or weeks, sitting on a very low view count, it is of interest to me, it looks lengthy and may have been a lecture or institute upload, it looks to be of high content or production quality.Alas, I move on. I already know how to make a PCB at home within 30 minutes, I know how to make a ESP8266 range extender and IOT device, I have already been introduced to the ESP32-Cam and don't need another tutorial. Sadly, I won't click the link, I won't like, I won't subscribe, I will move on.If you want to make money via youtube advertising then your content needs to go viral.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 03:59:00 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on June 27, 2020, 06:39:14 amSadly selective adblocking is not possible and I have had adds that go on for minutes about stuff that is totally irrelevant to my viewing habbits or the video I am hoping to watch that could be shorter than the add itself. I use Brave but adds have started appearing again but generally hitting reload gets rid of them.

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 04:13:32 pm
content: technology ads on youtube : sell hobbyist custom engineered metal printed 3d subassemblies and asics for 50kmaybe we can machine a power plant turbine for you alsoI think they want me to start the cyberdyne aerospace corporation in my garage from what material they provide which is 'relevant'.I don't think I can even afford to build the mock up system out of plywood for the things youtube advertisements seem to want me to build.patereon : help me reach this $2B starting point.

author: madires
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 04:45:10 pm
content: Over time I've developed an ad-adversity syndrome which results in boycotting specific products/services or even companies when ads are bothering me too many times or are too annoying.

author: engrguy42
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 04:56:18 pm
content: Maybe you guys should consider starting your own YT channel if what you're seeing is beneath you. As Dave says, it's not difficult at all. Then you can all single-handedly raise the quality of tech content on YT.Just make sure to TURN OFF any sort of advertising for any of your videos in, say, 2 years when you get to enough subscribers to be able to enable monetization.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 05:23:32 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on June 28, 2020, 02:45:11 pmSo it looks like one big problem is the lack of apparent value in supporting creators. Hence why I like the token system idea for offering additional rewards for those who support creators.I seed a bunch of (legal) torrents to give back to the community, but I would like it better if I could install an addon that prioritizes uploading to those who support the content I enjoy. And those torrents could include the content the supported creators make.

author: SilverSolder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 05:25:04 pm
content: Quote from: engrguy42 on June 28, 2020, 04:56:18 pmIt is almost as if you can't imagine any other way of supporting content creators than ruining the user experience by forcing irrelevant advertising down their throats?

author: SilverSolder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 05:26:42 pm
content: Quote from: madires on June 28, 2020, 04:45:10 pmI haven't gone that far, but I definitely prefer to do other things with my time than viewing advertisements that are not relevant to my life or work.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 05:46:56 pm
content: How much does youtube premium red or whatever it's called actually give to creators? I did sign up once but I was hoping for more access also to films rather than just youtubes own. I mean netflix is only £5.99 a month and youtube want twice that.

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 28, 2020, 06:16:46 pm
content: Quote from: engrguy42 on June 28, 2020, 04:56:18 pmI do not know why you are coming from the assumption that every content creator comes to youtube to make a living out of their videos. This is a grossly faulty assumption. Many tech and other content creators just want to share their knowledge and experience, some want a bit of recognition or fame, other reasons too. Invasive dilution of their videos with ads may hurt them as much as it annoys their viewers.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 02, 2020, 07:00:56 am
content: Quote from: Simon on June 28, 2020, 05:46:56 pmhttps://support.google.com/youtube/answer/6306276?hl=enQuoteBy "most" they mean at least 51% of your Premium membership goes to creators.IIRC they have never released details of the algorithm (because then it can be gamed), but it based loosely on how many videos you watch and for how long etc. You money if then divided up among those creators.The problem is money will even go to videos and creatorsyou don't like, unless you logged out to view them.

author: MrMobodies
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 02, 2020, 09:08:29 pm
content: I pay for Youtube red or premium so I don't see the adverts.I don't watch free to air television anymore only the news sometimes. The channel logos put me off and sometimes when I am interested in something I hear background music so loud I can't hear what they're saying. The adverts were very loud when they during the breaks so before they come on I got use to hitting the mute button to save myself the trouble of being shocked through my ears.So many good old documentaries on Youtube and then there are the creators channels where I learn new things and that makes it my worthwhile paying for it.EevblogBigcliveFran BlancheThundef00tColinFurze and many more.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 02, 2020, 09:27:54 pm
content: Some youtubers are joining curiosity stream or nebula, but i don't know how easy it is to go it alone and "democratize" it, curiosity stream does not always have the best compression quality and buffers often.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 03, 2020, 04:23:41 am
content: Quote from: Simon on July 02, 2020, 09:27:54 pmThat seems to be a small collection of science/info type channels who all know each other and hang out etc. AFAIK the invitation has not been extended to channels outside their little club.I cannot find any info at all on how creators can "join". Not surprising though given the high production quality nature of the content.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 03, 2020, 05:19:14 am
content: Quote from: MrMobodies on July 02, 2020, 09:08:29 pmThose channel logos drive me crazy, that's 99% of the reason I cut the cord 20 years ago and never looked back. They do work to prevent me from pirating OTA content but it's because they drop the value of the content to zero, I don't even want it if it's free. Even worse than that are the animated ads for other shows that go across the bottom of the screen during a show I'm watching, and then often during the credits some announcer starts blathering about some other show. Just let me enjoy one show at a time! I won't watch anything that has ads or logos anymore, my tolerance has fallen to zero.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 03, 2020, 05:35:54 am
content: Quote from: engrguy42 on June 27, 2020, 11:42:21 amI really hope you're not saying Youtube content quality went up with increased monetisation. Early Youtube was quite creative and without immense pressure on likes, subscribing and views. Money does open some doors but it mainly brought endless amounts of cookie cutter and clickbait content. With money the worst of TV also came over.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 03, 2020, 06:17:39 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on July 03, 2020, 04:23:41 amYes that would appear to be the case. I don't know how successful they will be. At $20 a year they can't match youtube for bandwidth and it shows.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 03, 2020, 11:45:06 pm
content: Quote from: Simon on July 03, 2020, 06:17:39 amI think I got a half price thing like $10 for the whole year for both CuriosityStream and Nubula.They can't stay in business at that level.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 04, 2020, 02:35:45 am
content: Quote from: Simon on July 03, 2020, 06:17:39 amAll they have to do is adopt Bittorrent as a content distribution system and offer a small discount to those who generously seed. Make a ready to go image for Raspberry Pi or similar to make it easy for anyone to make low power 24/7 seeding nodes.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 04, 2020, 08:13:51 am
content: what like lbry? You also need 100's of GB of space. People are already complaining that lbry fills their hard drives and with 160GB on mine now that I found it I will be trimming back soon. I don't even see my wifi working in upload so doubt I happen to have the same interests as others

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 04, 2020, 01:34:16 pm
content: Quote from: Simon on July 04, 2020, 08:13:51 amDisk space is cheap nowadays, $20/TB or less. They can also implement automatic seed selection that favors popular content.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 04, 2020, 02:25:06 pm
content: Yes but we are engineers, not the general public (civilians)

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 04, 2020, 02:36:26 pm
content: Quote from: Simon on July 04, 2020, 02:25:06 pmThe $20/TB figure was based on deals I have seen for hard drives on PC Part Picker. Connecting it to a Raspberry Pi is just a matter of plugging it in.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 04, 2020, 02:43:42 pm
content: Yes but you have to actually do this. most people are not interested, they just want to pay for a service and use it, plus it is copyright production so they would need to be sure it won't open up piracy. Just look at lbry.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 04, 2020, 03:00:35 pm
content: Quote from: Simon on July 04, 2020, 02:43:42 pmOffer an incentive in the form of a little profit (even for those who do not subscribe to the service) or at least a discount off their service and interest will grow a lot - worked for Bitcoin. Steam already uses Bittorrent in the background so there's a way to do it without increasing piracy.I can even see a workable idea of a very limited "free tier" where users get credit for seeding and can redeem that credit for viewing content.

author: MrMobodies
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 23, 2020, 03:36:00 pm
content: On some of Jordan Piers videos when he tests the picture quality I notice marketting channels and adverts and all the fancy decorations they put on it.Then I came across this advert on RotoRazer yesterday at the end of the RCA KCS136 Black and White TV Chassis Repair RE Re re Cap video 53:22 in the video:https://youtu.be/5-k8eYFj4lw?t=3201I remember that footage of George Carlin criticising the adverts. I didn't know which ones he was referring too but I can see it was targetted to that type now I have seen it which seems to me over excessive."Free this Free that" "Pay 4 installations.... Make that 3 we will pay the last quarter etc." .That background music in the advert sounds interesting... I think of it as "High pressure selling music" like that will inspire my considenceThere was another advert in some video before that spraying these shiny dust things inside and outside the house and a moving laser to light them up in the dark I think it was called "Star shower".

author: SilverSolder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 23, 2020, 08:02:37 pm
content: Quote from: Simon on July 04, 2020, 02:43:42 pmI have noticed that the Millennials are beginning to discover that all the monthly charges begin to add up, after a while. Younger son went pale when I asked him to multiply out his monthly subscription fees by 30 years... and that's before worrying about inflation, alternative investments, etc.!

author: duckduck
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 24, 2020, 12:19:17 am
content: Quote from: jogri on June 27, 2020, 07:45:04 amGoogle has been paying off ADP since 2013 (that we know of). Seehttps://www.adweek.com/digital/adblock-plus-takes-money-from-google-others-not-to-filter-their-ads/I mean, how much money does an adblock extension coder make in a year? If Google made it rain wouldn't you add a couple of lines of code? The hookers and blow will help you drown out your conscienceuBlock Origin worked well on Chrome. Last year, Google announced that it's going to limit the API that adblocking extensions use:https://www.ghacks.net/2019/10/12/the-end-of-ublock-origin-for-google-chrome/Since then, all of the cool kids have moved over to Firefox with uBlock Origin. I also recommend HTTPS Everywhere and either Privacy Badger (for the lazy) or uMatrix (for those whose sartorial sensibilities include aluminum foil headwear).