Very first job sounds cool, despite one thing (Labview). Take it anyway? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Regingescom
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: June 03, 2016, 08:19:05 am
content: So I am done with my Electrical Engineering studies and applying for jobs at the moment. I found one really nice open position, and I am already quite far in the application process. It goes into the direction of testing/validation, and it sounds super interesting to me, because it goes deep down to the technological level of the products. And I love the company.But there is one downside: I asked, and they are using labview. But I utterly hate and despise labview. Its a cancer and it needs to die!To be honest, that they use labview didn't come as a total surprise to me. It wasn't mentioned in the job desciption, but when I applied for the job I knew that there is a chance to encounter it, because its such a standard tool in test/measurement jobs. I guess I was just hoping I could get around it.So what do you say? Am I to picky about that? Should I just overcome my hate against labview, because after all, its just my first job, so I will maybe do it for the next, say, 3 years? Or is it already a bad basis to start a job when I already know for sure that I will dislike a specific part about it? (but as I've said, the rest of the job is interesting me a lot: digging for potential problems, data analysis, automating tests, influencing product development, but also hands-on work in the lab)If you maybe have a similar story (not necessarily specifically about Labview) to share (both negative and positive) I would like to hear about it.Also please don't turn this thread into a Pro/Con Flamewar about Labview. I have worked with it extensively. I can see its advantages in easily interfacing with measurement instruments, and 5-minute-quick&dirty GUI frontends that a factory worker can interprete (I also have worked as technician in the past, so I have been an end-user of the labview outcomes).But all that goes beyond that is an absolute pain in the butt in my opinion. I have friends that *love* labview, and they tried to convince me. But every time they try I think:"seriously?You could've done the same in 1/4th of the time if you would've sat down for one week and taught yourself a "proper" programming language."

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2016, 08:38:01 am
content: You should still take the job if you like the other parts. Every job you lend will have something that you dont like. Whether it is the people you working with, your boss, company policies, ERP systems, bad projects, or a software. You need to compromise anyway, if I can choose I rather choose a software which is not the main one I'm using.Learning how to keep your head down is a skill, that is rather learned early, otherwise you will be the noisy new guy, who thinks that he knows better. You dont want to be that guy. So listen more, and voice your opinion less, and later.

author: DTJ
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2016, 08:39:00 am
content: I think you know the answer is to grab the job if its offered.Labview can frustrating but it is used in many places and its good experience that is transferable to other roles. Grab the job with both hands and be glad is being offered. Things are not so rosy in other EE job markets around the globe! Good luck.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 03, 2016, 08:49:40 am
content: Quote from: Regingescom on June 03, 2016, 08:19:05 amI don't need to read further, take the job.

author: AndyC_772
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2016, 09:03:26 am
content: Every company will have some kind of tool, process or person you don't like. Count yourself lucky that the stumbling block here is something inanimate that won't get upset every time you swear at it.Take the job - but if you're interested in R&D, don't stay at it for so long you get identified as a test engineer and not a design engineer. It can be hard to make the switch if your CV shows you've taken a particular path.

author: imidis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2016, 09:12:19 am
content: Take it, there are worse things.

author: Regingescom
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: June 03, 2016, 10:43:53 am
content: Thanks everyone for their advice and helping me clearing up my doubts.

author: VK3DRB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2016, 09:24:08 am
content: People who hate Labview are usually people who don't understand it or have limited experience with it.Like all languages, if the person who wrote the program is a clown, the result will be an unreadable and unmaintainable mess. I am experienced with Labview, and Labview is fine if it is for test, data collection and analysis applications. I have found Labview code is generally rock solid and rarely has intermittent bugs once it has been tested. It is also excellent as a tool to quickly get an application going. A major tech company in Melbourne had to get an application urgently written and a C++ guru took 6 days to write and debug it. A Labview programmer did it in one afternoon. The dislikes I have with Labview is the complicated deployment, the bloated drivers, and the very high cost. Visual Studio is free, but it has more than its fair share of issues. Try installing the Visual Studio Community Edition over older versions of Visual Studio and you might wish you were never born.If I were you, I would take the job and learn how to code in Labview properly. Labview does have a code inspector tool that will help train you to write better code. Look on the job as an opportunity and take the job with a positive attitude and you should do fine. It is sometiumes a mistake to be picky and choosy with your first job. After two years, if you hate it, look for another job.I once worked with a bloke who was a very good C++ programmer. He took a job involving Labview and grew to love it.

author: rollatorwieltje
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 04, 2016, 11:48:53 am
content: Labview is used everywhere, it's pretty much impossible to avoid. Depending on the company though, in the end they probably don't really care how you solved some problem. We're (automation manufacturer) using Labview as well, but there are plenty of setups and tests that don't use it. I know one team used a bunch of Arduino boards to do measurements, and PLCs are commonly used as well, or other more dedicated measurement tools.The only thing you have to realize is the mindset of the managers you're dealing with. They probably won't give you resources to build your own tools (because Labview it there, right?), so if you're not going to use the "prescribed" tool, you may have to put in some of your own time and effort. Once you can prove your methods work as well, they may become a bit more flexible (like give you resources for "personal development").

author: Yansi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2016, 11:53:32 am
content: Quote from: VK3DRB on June 04, 2016, 09:24:08 amYeah, my limited experience with labview? Utter piece of s*it. Sorry, but having to install ~1GByte driver package for a simple USB<>CAN converter, something must be really wrong with that software.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2016, 02:53:00 pm
content: Having used it before, Labview isn't that bad. The worst parts are the vendor lock in and how cluttered complex programs can be. But it seems like everyone's using Python nowadays and only a minority use Labview.

author: rstofer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2016, 09:59:20 pm
content: Pass on the job!Not only are you going to have to deal with Labview but you will probably be working for the person that brought Labview to the company! That would be unbearable...Oh, wait, it's a job! Maybe you need to pay rent or something... Better take it!

author: Aodhan145
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2016, 10:28:26 pm
content: Quote from: NiHaoMike on June 04, 2016, 02:53:00 pmPython is another cancer. What programing languages should depend on tabs in from the side. My C programs are normally a mess with tabs from the side or all in one line Curly brackets are the best thing ever for structuring code. Why would you not implement them into a languages structure.

author: Zermalmer
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2016, 10:39:47 pm
content: Lot of things said and all are good....I "throw in" another point... if you hate this tool but like the job....Take it as challenge... master your profession and eliminate the tool where you convince the other by a tool you like

author: chris_leyson
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2016, 11:16:50 pm
content: I never really liked labview, I had to uninstall and reinstall software so many times when trying to talk to different instruments, something to do with the drivers, I'm a hardware guy and can't understand all of this driver stuff, it should be plug and play. I've had better results with Matlab to be honest.

author: Tomorokoshi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2016, 11:38:15 pm
content: A lot of entry jobs deal with testing and validation. Many people may not like them. However, it gives you several things that will help you:1. Experience with LabVIEW. Even though you may not like it, you can still list it for experience.2. You may even wind up liking LabVIEW.3. Experience with testing methods, performance specifications, the existing designs, etc. This will become very valuable later.4. Experience with some of the other database systems around the company, along with introduction to the vendors who supplied parts that had problems.5. Introduction to varied people throughout the company. Don't underestimate how important this is.In a year or so when something opens up and you move up in the company, another new graduate will be hired to fill your role. Become the expert in it. Become the one with the answers. That will open up opportunities for those things you like better.