Sony VPL-ES3 fan failure? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / projects

author: GabYoung92
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 20, 2014, 11:44:43 am
content: I has just pickup up a sony VPL-ES3 projector which has an issue... The unit will will turn on, display the 'sony' splash screen, then will switch off and flash the 'fan/temp' light which according to the manual means a fan failure. (i can get the menu up, but the unit turns off before i can do anything)All 5 fans spin freely! (yes 5) 4 out of the 5 fans have a nice square wave from the taco line, and one looks like...The fan is fine, but the motherboard is causing this weird waveform. (i have tried trying different fans on this one plug)I can't get it to stop this error....Any ideas?

author: GabYoung92
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 21, 2014, 06:01:09 am
content: BumpI removed a cap from the one fan line and it is now square like the other fans.One fan was around the 50hz mark, and the rest around 110hz, so I wired the 'slow' one up to a fast line but still no luckhttp://diagramas.diagramasde.com/otros/SONY%20VPL-ES3.pdfI've been looking at this service manual while going through the unit. But it still points to a failed fanEven though the fans are spinning fine, producing a nice square wave, is it possible that a fan has 'failed' ?

author: amyk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 21, 2014, 12:09:37 pm
content: So have you narrowed it down to a fan or the motherboard? That would be the first thing to do. Swapping them around carefully might help - or using the speed output from one to drive several of the inputs on the motherboard.

author: What_NZ
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 21, 2014, 01:08:17 pm
content: Am I missing something with the Service Manual? There are no circuit diagrams, very scant information and just the Block Diagram. It must be a Simplified Manual surely. but alas it is all we have, as I checked the net and couldn't find anything better.Anyway......I see in the manual section 3-1 Troubleshooting it says to check the Fan Status and the Thermal Sensors. so it is possible that the Fan speed is a red herring and the problem is a Thermal sensor being detected incorrectly.When you think about such a design you would not only want the unit to shut down if the fan stopped spinning (speed sensor) but also if the air flowing into the fan was blocked (thermal sensor). Blocking the air would not necessary drop the Fan speed significantly but would cause a massive rise in the temperature.The manual in section 5 shows 3 thermal sensors Q1, Q31 and Q36 maybe worth checking them and tracing their path back to UF1,U35 Fan Speed Control.

author: GabYoung92
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 21, 2014, 11:49:41 pm
content: the manual is pretty useless but hey it's something from sony!Q1 is a little break out board with a small cap and a SOT23 package on it which is a diode of some sort. I have tested it using a diode test on a multimeter and its giving about 0.6v drop which changes when you breath on it.Also plugging it into the main board and testing with a oscilloscope gives a weird waveform but theres still something. When i unplug Q1 and turn it on the same waveform is present (but at a higher voltage of course). I can get the waveform from the oscilloscope if you think that its worth while looking atI'm still to find Q31 and Q36

author: What_NZ
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 22, 2014, 12:54:01 am
content: It is not going to be easy but I would suggest trying to trace the speed and temp sensor signals back to UF1,U35 Fan Speed Control. Because it is labelled UF1,U35 I think it two different IC's/circuits but it only shows one crystal and one set of control lines, confusing that idea somewhat.Yeah Q31 and Q36 could be mounted anywhere but most likely near something that is heat sensitive/critical. Good Luck!. While you are looking around keep an eagle eye out for anything that looks unusual too.I think we can dispense with Oscilloscope waveforms for now. i.e. You may discover something more obvious.I have already assumed based on you first post that we don't need to discuss the basics, do we? i.e. checking voltages etc.....I was hoping that someone may have had a circuit for you. I'm sure what you have is a Simplified or Preliminary Service Manual probably for basic repair and ordering of case parts etc. There will be a full Service Manual for Technicians to use. I don't know anyone in Sony Service so I can't help there.

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 22, 2014, 04:42:28 am
content: Check all the voltages on the PSU section. If one of them is too low it may fool the processor into thinking sensors data is out of range when it's not.

author: GabYoung92
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 22, 2014, 06:02:45 am
content: Psi: Just checked, voltages are all good, they are pretty much spot on to whats written on the boardAll three of the 'temp sensors' / diodes are fine. Not shorted, signal going through etc...However on the pic:1 - If the fan is left plugged in from turn on, the voltage only rises to 7.5V (5v drop across the transistor switch it on). If it is unplugged(while the unit is on) and plugged back in, it goes up to 12.6 volts (transistor fully switched on). This doesn't affect any of the other fans2 - This is the only fan which doesn't produce a signal, this is the only line i can't trace to UF1 or U35. (one fan goes to U35, where as all the others go to UF1)I couldn't find any datasheets on the chip UF1, I've provided a pic if anyone knows a datasheet

author: What_NZ
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 22, 2014, 07:53:19 am
content: This is really hard to see from the pictures so just to clarify, is this correct?J16 = Fan 1 and Fan 2J24 = Fan 3J17 = Fan 4J18 = Off board Thermal sensor going to Q36J13 is Fan 5?It doesn't look like Thermal sensor connected to Q31 is fitted as J23 is unpopulated, is that correct?Is J24 Pin 1 = Supply, Pin 2 = GND, Pin 3 = Speed, Pin 4 = Not connected?Is J17 Pin 1 = Supply, Pin 2 = GND, Pin 3 = Speed?Is the emitter of QF2 and QF3 at 12.6 volts always?In regard to your point 1 - I think the base of QF2 is being PWM controlled so that is why you are see the change in voltage to Fan3 on J24.Question: Fan3 is spinning with 7.5 volts, right?In regard to your point 2 - If it is Fan 4 it definitely shows speed feedback on the Block diagram. so you will need to find out why.oh just a final thing - Please could you mention the reference of the part where you are measuring - i.e Q10 collector is 12V goes to J37 Pin 1 this would be a big help.

author: What_NZ
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 22, 2014, 08:03:17 am
content: Also both of those pictures are UF1 so what is U35?Please advise which Fan # goes to UF1 and the one Fan # that goes to U35.

author: What_NZ
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 22, 2014, 09:15:19 am
content: Oh I forgot.This is the Company linkhttp://www.gmt.com.tw/and here is link to the Datasheet for UF1http://www.gmt.com.tw/product/datasheet/EDS-794.pdf

author: GabYoung92
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 22, 2014, 12:15:07 pm
content: Thanks for a link to that data sheet.J18 = fan 5 (To U35 (MAX6660))J16 = fan 1 & 2 (to UF1 pin 2 & 4)J24 = fan 3 (to UF1 pin 19)J17 = fan 4 (to UF1 pin 17)J13 = 2 switches for bulb and filter doorJ14 = remote temp diode (to UF1 pin 7 and GND)Q31 is a TO-92 which is soldered on the underside of the board (KN3904, connected to UF1 pin 9 and GND)Q36 connected to U35 between pins 3 & 4 only, no connection to GNDJ24 and the J17 is correctYes, the emitters are always at 12.6, they are shorted together. They are PNP transistors.I checked the bases, i couldn't see a PWM pulse on them.Yes, the fan is spinningThere was no connection to the chip, I've put a bodge wire between them but still goes into a fit. (i have verified that there is a speed signal on the line now)Also with the datasheet, it shows an ALERT line which goes high (5V) as soon as it is plugged in. Once the power button is pressed the line goes low (0V) and stays low. The unit continues to 'boot' for the 15 seconds then turns off

author: What_NZ
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 22, 2014, 12:42:37 pm
content: Oh ok.......Have you checked out where the break was in the circuit between J17 pin3 and UF1 pin17. Sometimes finding the break may reveal other breaks or maybe the bodge wire is now by-passing an important component.Yes, the ALERT output of UF1 is active Low. Therefore going to 0V means it is detecting a Fault. Unfortunately the data sheet just says "Alert Signal for Diode Fault, Fan Fail, and Fan Out of Control" what we want for correct operation is UF1 pin5 staying at 5V.Unfortunately this means checking every pin on UF1 and what it does especially the ones relating to the Thermal Sensors, Fans and Fan Speed feedback.The other information from the data sheet which is interesting -G793/G794 contains 3/4 controllers. FAN controller performsclosed-loop and open-loop control. G793/G794determines the current fan speed based on the FG inputsand an externally supplied 32.768kHz clock.So I would suggest checking UF1 pin 11 and pin 12 for a 32.768kHz clock. Y4 is the XTAL. Be careful of the scope probe loading the oscillator.Also did you put that capacitor back in?

author: breast69au
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: March 19, 2015, 09:43:12 am
content: Im just wondering if u found a solution to this problem?