Multimeter: Gossen or Fluke? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 02:35:54 pm
content: Hello at all!I live in Italy, and i am a huge fan of Dave!I am here to ask about multimeter, I want to buy a pretty good multimeter for electronics works, and i was thinking about Gossen Metrohit tech or the fluke 87V , i don' t know which choose, because the Gossen have a capacitance test end at 1000 Uf and somethimes I need to check capacitors of 9800, mostly i work on stereo amplifiers, breadboard projects, and repair electronic thingsHave a good day!Ps (Sorry for my english)

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 02:40:45 pm
content: If you have the money then get the Gossen.

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 02:54:10 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on November 02, 2016, 02:40:45 pmCan you explain why?

author: quarks
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 02:56:00 pm
content: I have several Fluke and Gossen DMMs.Both are very good manufacturers/brands and you most likely cannot go wrong, if you have the money.But in my opinion Gossen is unfortunately more overpriced than Fluke.And especially Gossen accessories are just insanely overpriced, which is not to justify at all.

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 02:59:31 pm
content: Quote from: quarks on November 02, 2016, 02:56:00 pmI have cheked some of optional of the Gossen... and yeah is insane, but i have heard the fluke 87V have some GSM problems

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 03:00:51 pm
content: Quote from: NiaDebesis on November 02, 2016, 02:59:31 pmApparently they're fixed:

author: mij59
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 03:02:51 pm
content: For capacitor checking a Peak ESR70 or DER 5000 would be better, have you considered Brymen 867 or 869 ?

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 03:04:31 pm
content: Quote from: quarks on November 02, 2016, 02:56:00 pmBut way cooler.

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 03:10:45 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on November 02, 2016, 03:00:51 pmPerfect, the only think is the Gossen is SLIGHTLY more accurated than fluke, and the capacitor mesuraments...i think the fluke 87V is better for me, the METRO TECH and the 87V is the same think more less, but the Metro is more cooler, but i still prefer fluke, I cant' t go wrong witch one of these, but i am confused

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 03:18:11 pm
content: Quote from: NiaDebesis on November 02, 2016, 02:54:10 pmBecause they're awesome.And you said, "mostly i work on stereo amplifiers"The Gossen has TRMS up to 100kHz, the Fluke only goes to 20kHz. The Gossen can measure power, distortion and all sorts of other things that the Fluke can't.

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 03:19:53 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on November 02, 2016, 03:18:11 pmWhat?? I have read 200Khz for the fluke...

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 03:22:46 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on November 02, 2016, 03:18:11 pmAnd i can mesury the W only if u have the GOSSEN ENERGY i want to take the TECH

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 03:23:12 pm
content: Quote from: NiaDebesis on November 02, 2016, 03:19:53 pmThe Fluke can measure frequency (ie. Hz) up to 200kHz, not RMS voltage.

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 03:26:56 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on November 02, 2016, 03:23:12 pmHm...BAD for me..the tech is better than the Fluke in all the mesuraments...yes for slightly but better..and have trms up to 200kHz... and before the post will be closed..the tech is affidable, accurated..to work in a electronics lab no?

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 03:32:35 pm
content: Quote from: NiaDebesis on November 02, 2016, 03:26:56 pmhttps://www.gossenmetrawatt.com/english/themen/calibrationquestionsandanswers.htmThe meters come with a calibration certificate in the box.

author: blackfin76
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 03:36:59 pm
content: There both good quality meters, so it would probably come down to the features you can afford with your budget.

author: mzacharias
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 03:57:11 pm
content: As I understand it Fluke's can be much more expensive in markets other than U.S.

author: MosherIV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 04:08:25 pm
content: HiQuoteThe capacitance test on DMMs are pretty poor, they use the time to charge cap method which is not that accurate.Treat the capacitor measurement feature as an indication only.QuoteThis is an LCR bridge type device, so is much better for checking capacitors. Personally, I would go for brands like Keysight (HP), Wayne Kerr or Racal for a LCR bridge.

author: HKJ
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 04:46:51 pm
content: One advantage with the Gossen is the single current input with autoranging, there is no risk of blowing the 400mA fuse.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 04:55:42 pm
content: Quote from: HKJ on November 02, 2016, 04:46:51 pmAlso: You can't turn the dial to (eg) the 'volts' range with the cable connected to the amps connector.(Yes, the Fluke issupposedto beep at you, but the Gossen physically prevents it)

author: WackyGerman
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 05:08:06 pm
content: Both multimeters are excellent . It s a personal decision to choose one of them . Fluke accessoires are not that much cheaper than the gossen . You also can look for Hioki multimeter if available in your contry

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 05:16:28 pm
content: Quote from: WackyGerman on November 02, 2016, 05:08:06 pmAnd neither is perfect.eg. The Fluke defaults to AC measurements every time you switch it on. That would drive me insane*.Also: It might be better to get separate, specialized instruments for measuring (eg.) capacitance if that's important.(*) Especially since the Fluke allows you to configure all sorts of power-on options (including one which isonlyused for factory testing!) but not AC/DC mode.

author: WackyGerman
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 05:22:51 pm
content: Yes that s right . No multimeter is perfect , every one has it s pros and cons

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 05:47:29 pm
content: Quote from: WackyGerman on November 02, 2016, 05:08:06 pmI Have already a Hioki ^^

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 05:50:03 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on November 02, 2016, 05:16:28 pmFor know my decision is to get the METRAHIT TECH it seems to be better than Fluke

author: WackyGerman
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 06:15:52 pm
content: It s a good choice . I also have a Gossen . It s the Metrahit 29s . Unfortunately it doesn t have backlight but I am really happy with that

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 07:01:19 pm
content: I will get accused of being a shill again, but consider the Brymen BM869S. It is much less expensive and probably does anything you are considering.www.tme.euhas it and I am sure it will be much less than the Gossen. If you get the Gossen, we need a review!

author: Assafl
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 07:09:16 pm
content: Love the Gossen 29s. It is my default portable meter.

author: WackyGerman
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 07:27:36 pm
content: Yes a brymen is a good cheap alternative . It is not as well built like a gossen but it has a really good bang per buck . I have the Greenlee DM 830A ( rebadged BM 829 ) and I like it very much . The continuity tester is damn f***ing loud and that is good when working in the field . You cannot loose the screws when open it for changing battery or fuses .It is heavy and built like a tank . The only con I found is the brightness of the display . Looks really dimm when you look from the top and with backlight on you cannot see anything any more . That s the Brymen blue backlight issue , well known here in the forum . You also can buy the DM 867S atwww.welectron.com. It s cheaper than TME . But I haven t had any experience with Welectron and customer service . TME has not a good reputation with customer service so in case of warranty it could be annoying

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 07:46:04 pm
content: Quote from: Lightages on November 02, 2016, 07:01:19 pmI hope exhist in Italy Gossen, and yes, if i get the Gossen i will start immediately to write a review!I have heard now the conitnuity test...and, yea its okay, a little bit slower but pretty good

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 07:55:10 pm
content: Hello NiaDebesisIf you don't mind, how much does the Gossen you intend to buy cost in your country?How much is the Fluke 87V?

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 08:01:00 pm
content: Quote from: saturation on November 02, 2016, 07:55:10 pmHi ^^Fluke 87V 450 500€Gossen Metrawatt Metrahit Tech 450 500

author: rsjsouza
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 08:47:25 pm
content: Quote from: NiaDebesis on November 02, 2016, 03:26:56 pmAccording toGossen's page, the Metrahit Tech has a bandwidth of 10kHz for TRMS measurements.

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 09:19:06 pm
content: Quote from: rsjsouza on November 02, 2016, 08:47:25 pmAnd the Fluke in trms?

author: rsjsouza
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 09:27:13 pm
content: Quote from: NiaDebesis on November 02, 2016, 09:19:06 pm20kHzaccording to them.Since we are at it, please take a look at Wytnucls' excellentmultimeter comparison spreadsheet. You will find some interesting data there.BTW, I don't have a BM869S but it has great reputation around here at a lower cost. I have a BM857 from the same brand that is extremely well built, pretty accurate and it has great features. It is worth taking a look at its specifications and features.

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 09:28:12 pm
content: The Fluke 87V has a bandwidth of up to 20kHz with varying degrees of accuracy. The same is true for the Brymen BM869S, but the BM869S also can go up to 100kHz. The BM869S is 200 euro atwww.tme.euand the Fluke is 475 euro.

author: Frost
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 09:52:15 pm
content: I own hand multimeters from both companies.The 289 from Fluke and a Gossen MetraHit 28SBut the Gossen is my prefred mulitmeter I use it most of the time.

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 09:55:00 pm
content: Quote from: rsjsouza on November 02, 2016, 09:27:13 pmThe Gossen is better on the paper then the flukeGossen min A res 1uaFluke 100nAIf there is in Italy i will get the Gossen

author: rfbroadband
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 10:25:50 pm
content: I agree...if your budget supports it go for the Gossen

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 10:33:14 pm
content: Quote from: rfbroadband on November 02, 2016, 10:25:50 pmI hopei can find Gossen in Italy xD as the power Supply of ELV they are german made and there arent in Italy

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 10:42:02 pm
content: Thanks NiaDebesis. With those choices the Gossen Metrahit Tech I think is a better buy in the EU.Some thoughts for you:Assume all the specs are equal, which is easier to service in the EU, if needed?Gossen Tech is slightly more accurate and higher precision. Its natively ~ 12,000 counts and accuracy is calculated so, while Fluke 87V accuracy is based on 6000 counts; at Fluke high resolution mode of 19,999 counts accuracy drops slightly as the LSD uncertainty increases x 10. So the Fluke LSD digit is more uncertain.US full list price the 87V is USD$450 or €406. In the USA the Gossen cost about as much in USD as in you would pay in the EU, all taxes etc., excluded. So, in the USA, the 87V is a better buy if the resolution is not an issue and the price is more variable, tending towards cheaper.Quote from: NiaDebesis on November 02, 2016, 08:01:00 pm

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 10:47:38 pm
content: Quote from: saturation on November 02, 2016, 10:42:02 pmI think the Fluke, i have phoned at several shop and no one have the Gossen, i have a friend which is seraching it for me, the fluke is easly to find in EuropeMy prices is for Italy, we have the "Iva" a tax of 26% on every product

author: saturation
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 11:39:35 pm
content: If the Fluke is easy to find, it might be easy to service where you are, if ever needed. You will know more than me.That said, Fluke USA has manufactured the 87-V line over 10 years, and the whole 80s line for 28 years, they make a lot of them very well. Its remains the common choice for use in all the most extreme locations in the earth by US military personnel, as learned by actual use is such places over nearly 30 years. That's why its still made today almost unchanged from 1988 and despite the 87-V being only IP-30 rated.Recently this was declassified. You can see how and where the 87-V is used today as well as the 77-4. "NSN" means NATO stock number.

author: P90
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2016, 11:58:10 pm
content: Gossen craps on Fluke.

author: Muttley Snickers
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 03, 2016, 12:16:54 am
content: Quote from: NiaDebesis on November 02, 2016, 10:47:38 pmJust a side note, I would be inclined to check the full terms and conditions of either manufacturers warranty status prior to purchase in your region, for instance Fluke are very particular in regards to purchasing equipment through an authorised agent or distributor and buying one from an online auction site or elsewhere may leave you exposed to future unforeseen problems, the last thing you want is a dead on arrival meter with no support from the manufacturer, probably unlikely on these brands but certainly worth looking in to.

author: zaoka
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2016, 02:46:30 am
content: Any better brand meter will last you for years...Get used Fluke 87V of eBay. You can get it for around $200 and most of the time they are spot-on accurate, you can always resell it if you dont like it.If you have latest Hioki meter, Fluke and Gossen are not any better. Also HIOKI is better for large electrolytic capacitors, it settle down right away while Fluke tend to change value and you are never sure of the value (this applies for older capacitors).Also check out new Siglent SDM3045X.

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2016, 06:54:52 am
content: Quote from: Muttley Snickers on November 03, 2016, 12:16:54 amI don' t buy nothing of not new, I huy all in real shops

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2016, 07:25:19 am
content: Quote from: NiaDebesis on November 03, 2016, 06:54:52 amIn that case you're probably going to buy the Fluke. Gossen can be hard to find.

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2016, 07:31:34 am
content: Quote from: Fungus on November 03, 2016, 07:25:19 amEh..i know, if i can' t buy the gossen because is not imported i'll buy the fluke

author: P90
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2016, 07:57:25 am
content: Quote from: Lightages on November 02, 2016, 07:01:19 pmBrymen quality doesn't hold a candle to Gossen.

author: oldway
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2016, 09:17:15 am
content: Gossen and Fluke are excellent multimeters but they are far too expensive.For a business, this might not be a problem, but for a particular/hobbyist, it can be.You should buy a Brymen BM869S, the same quality and performance at a reasonable price.

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2016, 09:59:06 am
content: Quote from: P90 on November 03, 2016, 07:57:25 amI want to buy something thinking longterm and those multimeters are rhe best choose for my budget

author: HighVoltage
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2016, 10:05:12 am
content: If your budget allows it,take both of them!One can never have enough multimeters.

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2016, 10:14:01 am
content: Quote from: HighVoltage on November 03, 2016, 10:05:12 amEhhh too far from my budget xDI am buying the equipment for my lab and I need for now only one multimeter (in future I ll buy the second one) my budget is 500

author: sotos
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2016, 11:17:06 am
content: Quote from: HighVoltage on November 03, 2016, 10:05:12 amor maybe get 3 to be sure.

author: P90
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2016, 12:50:04 pm
content: Quote from: sotos on November 03, 2016, 11:17:06 amAt least three... LOL

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2016, 01:19:52 pm
content: Quote from: sotos on November 03, 2016, 11:17:06 amFor me 2 is more what I need ^^

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2016, 01:37:27 pm
content: Quote from: P90 on November 03, 2016, 12:50:04 pmMaybe in the future I ll buy a GWINSTEAK GDM-8342

author: MosherIV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2016, 06:05:52 pm
content: Have you seen this thread :https://www.eevblog.com/forum/buysellwanted/fs-%28uk%29-gossen-metrahit-23s-dmm/Not the model you are looking for but is it good enough for you?

author: vinicius.jlantunes
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2016, 06:56:47 pm
content: Quote from: HighVoltage on November 03, 2016, 10:05:12 amBeat me to it

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2016, 08:37:10 pm
content: Quote from: MosherIV on November 03, 2016, 06:05:52 pmYeah! But..I buy only in Italy, I don' t buy from private

author: NiaDebesis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2016, 08:43:29 pm
content: Quote from: HighVoltage on November 03, 2016, 10:05:12 amMan, for my first multimiter is better to take a bench multimeter (Keysight Technologies U3401A) or a portable multimeter (gossen tech)

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 03, 2016, 10:59:14 pm
content: Like it has been said in your other thread, spend more on the oscilloscope and less on the multimeter. The majority of hobbyists would be well served by the Uni-T UT139C, or Brymen BM235 or BM257S, or Amprobe AM5X0, or a Fluke 17B+, etc. You don't even know what you want to do with your equipment really from the tone of your threads. IMHO, get two of the meters I just mentioned, and spend the balance of your budget on a DS1054Z. You really seem to be approaching how to spend your money in a backward way. You might even have the money left from your budget to get a DER EE DE-5000 LCR meter. Having those three types of equipment will serve you MUCH better than a $1000 multimeter and an old analog scope.

author: Assafl
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2016, 10:29:45 am
content: Curious as to why you are insisting on buying new? I purchased an HP34401A, and Gossen 29s (the older version of the Energy meter) and an Agilent U1253A OLED Multimeter (love the OLED and the pitch based continuity is awesome - that or the 4-wire HP). Cost-wise, getting all 3 was substantially less than the price of either the HP or Gossen new (about the price of the Agilent new).If afraid of secondhand, there are quite a few threads on how to buy on eBay as well as testing of used products. A DMM check or an assortment of references (e.g. an AD588 based voltage source and a few precision resistors) - can go a long way in establishing confidence.Also, the process of establishing confidence in test equipment (new and old) is a good way to learn how to avoid measurement mistakes (by learning the real vs. theoretical limits of accuracy and capabilities).And there are even better deals to be had - got a Datel voltage calibrator for 20$ (had a broken LCD and wouldn't work). Contact cleaner got it working (and it still held calibration!) - and a replacement LCD was 25$. Not bad for a unit that I can use to check for DC biasing (can both source and sink) and costs about 700$ new...Heck - There are even Keithley 2015 THD multimeters on eBay that go for $250-400... Pretty amazing value for money (and put both the Fluke and Gossen in their back pocket)....

author: Assafl
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2016, 10:47:34 am
content: Another useful tool is a Scopemeter. While typically lacking in DMM functionality (mainly low resolution) - having floating isolated scope inputs make testing and measuring of power supplies and mains referenced circuits much easier. It is my go to for any type of circuit that I am afraid of....And like the newer Keysight DMMs - can plot trends (both scope and DMM trends).Above your budget, unless you are willing to risk as-is stuff. (I got a 196B for about $600 or so 8 years ago).