Rigol, Siglent, Hakko, cannot be exported from the US to LatAm - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: josfemova
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 03:45:30 pm
content: A little bit of context. In LatAm the usual way to get anything tech related is that unless it's a mass market product, you have to get it from the US and forward it from Miami because dealers just don't come here and if there's a local dealer they only have the shittiest version of anything in stock and at 300% the price. Mexico and Brazil are exceptions sometimes, but for central america we are usually limited to what we can forward from the US.I bought a Hakko FX-951 last year from tequipment. 0 issues, no complications. I wanted to get a little bit more into repair and having the capability to do micro soldering so I decided to search for the compatible micro soldering pencil + tips, went to tequipment again aaaaandOh noI was also going to buy more equipment as I'm building my personal lab bench but then...Changes in export regulations have been a PITA in the past years - last time I got denied an Xiao ESP32-S3 Sense and a ESP32-H2 devkit at digikey with a similar BS export control restriction (circumvent them by buying at seeed studio bazar so kind of pointless).Can I still get some of these stuff from other international dealers? Maybe, but the DHL/Fedex charges get somewhat ridiculous. To get the $300 awg you end up paying the $300 in export cost. I also prefer when I can buy my stuff from a reputable dealer like tequipment instead of having to rely on other sources. Best bet to get this stuff at a comfortable price is buying from some shady ebay/amazon seller and praying they don't squint.Also something that bothers me is that,Siglent and Rigol are Chineseisn't it kind of pointless to export control something that's already produced in a country allied with the countries you are trying to screw over?My country is not even sanctioned ffs, and we are supposed to be a submissive backyard partner.At least B&K is not an issue, currently asking for other brands to see what my options are.

author: bdunham7
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 04:09:49 pm
content: It doesn't appear to be an export regulation issue to me (although there may still be one) but rather a territory limitation imposed by the manufacturer on the distributor as a condition for being an authorized reseller.

author: ebastler
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 04:22:26 pm
content: Right, I would very much assume that Rigol and Siglent have appointed other authorized distributors for your country or region, and have given them (co-) exclusive distribution rights. So other dealers who are on a contract with Rigol/Siglent, but for other regions only, are contractually obliged not to ship to your country.

author: DaneLaw
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 04:24:49 pm
content: I dont know the import restrictions in Costa Rica, but usually, you can at least bypass regional restrictions from vendors with the use of parcel-forwarding companies.That will give you a physical address' that you then use when ordering, and then the forward company will forward it to your country.https://bluewaterpropertiesofcostarica.com/blog/how-to-send-a-package-to-costa-rica-4-options/Quite common in Europe from certain vendors inside EU or outside EU..fx eBay sellers that only ship to local addresses in their country, or even LIDL in Germany or LIDL Belgium (*Parkside power tools) where only a fraction comes out in the local LIDL stores across Europe and often with quite a mockup.

author: josfemova
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 04:38:33 pm
content: Quote from: ebastler on April 11, 2024, 04:22:26 pmMarket volume is almost none. There's a single DS1052E rigol oscilloscope on a hardware store that does not seem to have any deal with rigol, and the scope has been there for like 2 years because the additional cost is like 50% of the original priceQuote from: DaneLaw on April 11, 2024, 04:24:49 pmI'm already using one of these, but many sites have registered these places specifically to either comply with export restrictions or what they see as fraud prevention (e.g. I cannot forward anything from the adafruit store, but I can buy and import directly using Fedex/DHL)

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 04:39:18 pm
content: Yes. Using a forwarder is the way to get around sales regions limitation.

author: ebastler
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 05:08:26 pm
content: Quote from: josfemova on April 11, 2024, 04:38:33 pmEven more reason to grant dealers exclusivity for a region. If you expect them to spend money on inventory and on technical training for their staff, you need to give them some reassurance that they will get enough revenue.I would not expect exclusive dealers to be appointed specifically for Costa Rica or similar small markets. But there are authorized Siglent distributors in Colombia and Brazil, for example -- maybe one of them is in charge of Costa Rica sales?

author: rvalente
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 05:10:04 pm
content: Get it on aliexpress or use a friend/relative to ship to with a courier like fedex/ups. If costa rica is a tax madness like brazil, be ready to pay high import taxes.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 05:49:05 pm
content: Quote from: josfemova on April 11, 2024, 03:45:30 pmWe are bound by territorial agreements.You may find a local dealer for Siglent in the list here:https://int.siglent.com/map/

author: josfemova
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 05:55:23 pm
content: Quote from: ebastler on April 11, 2024, 05:08:26 pmSouth American dealers seem to either have almost non existent stock, and also they only ship locally so I'm still screwed. Will probably contact siglent/rigol sales to see what options I have to see if it's still possible to get their stuff without breaking the bank

author: ebastler
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 05:59:05 pm
content: Quote from: josfemova on April 11, 2024, 05:55:23 pmI think that's the right step. There must be some dealer somewhere who has the (exclusive) right to sell to Costa Rica, otherwise it wouldn't make sense to bar the North American dealers.

author: josfemova
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 06:11:44 pm
content: Quote from: ebastler on April 11, 2024, 05:59:05 pmYou would be surprised of how hard it is to get quality gear here. Only official distributor for decent gear seems to be a GW Instek one and they target the EDU market so prices are not only inflated, they are absurdly inflated (and will probably require a minimum number of benches to be equipped). Everyone ends up getting FNIRSI, Hantek or Hanmatek (and the other clones) if they need test gear. Universities rely on embassy donated gear and that Instek distributor.

author: Njk
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 08:19:26 pm
content: That's pure American issues. The US is near, perhaps it'll make sense to make a trip to buy the Chinese equipment there

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 09:48:29 pm
content: Quote from: Njk on April 11, 2024, 08:19:26 pmRubbish.We are bound to not export from our authorized area.Further, some models are only available in certain areas and wobetide any reseller that gets caught exporting these models as they will suffer some harsh penalty.

author: bdunham7
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 09:51:57 pm
content: Quote from: ebastler on April 11, 2024, 05:59:05 pmCompanies very well may decide to simply not import their products at all into certain countries through any channel for various reasons, such as regulatory hurdles, liability or consumer protection laws.

author: bdunham7
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 09:53:54 pm
content: Quote from: ebastler on April 11, 2024, 05:59:05 pmCompanies very well may decide to simply not import their products at all into certain countries through any channel for various reasons, such as regulatory hurdles, liability or consumer protection laws. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if Siglent simply decided not to allow any sales at all to Costa Rica. Also, the distribution contract between Siglent and TEquipment will likely not bar specific nations or areas but rather will specify the territory that they are allowed to sell to, most likely either the USA exclusively or North America.

author: josfemova
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 10:34:06 pm
content: Got some more info about other brands, don't know if this applies to all sellers but essentiallyExport OK:- Weller- Quick- B&K Precision- GW Instek- UNI-TEither export controlled or NA vendor cannot sell for final destination outside US/NA depending on contract (freight forwarder option not viable either)- Siglent- Rigol- Keysight- Teledyne LeCroy- TektronixDepending on brand a local distributor is available, for my case the brands that technically have a distributor assigned:- Keysight has a distributor in El Salvador without online store- Tektronix and Fluke have a local distributor (Elvatron)- Teledyne LeCroy lists digikey, mouser and RS as distributors for Costa Rica

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 10:52:50 pm
content: Quote from: josfemova on April 11, 2024, 10:34:06 pmSiglent HQnotNA is responsible for Costa Rica.Did you look for your local reseller in the Siglent Map link I posted ?Later today I can check with HQ if you have a Costa Rica seller.

author: Njk
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 11:03:04 pm
content: Quote from: tautech on April 11, 2024, 09:48:29 pmNo vendor can ignore the US market, it's too lucrative. If the thing is available in US and not available in Costa Rica, what can prevent a local individual from visiting the US with the purpose to buy it from any dealer there for personal use and to bring it with him on the return flight. After all, the distance is not too long, the product is not an expensive technology masterpiece that can trigger the export regulation and custom fee issues. Where's the rubbish?

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 11, 2024, 11:19:02 pm
content: Quote from: Njk on April 11, 2024, 08:19:26 pmQuote from: Njk on April 11, 2024, 11:03:04 pmYour original statement added for context.Unless you are in this game you would not know we are bound by our territorial agreements, pure and simple and nothing at all to do with the US marketplace.However nothing does prohibit the individual to source product from wherever they like but when they do have local representation those representatives might be less than impressed when you go to them for aftersales support.

author: josfemova
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2024, 12:27:44 am
content: Quote from: tautech on April 11, 2024, 10:52:50 pmAlready checked, no distributor listed for Costa Rica although there are a bunch for individual countries in South AmericaQuote from: tautech on April 11, 2024, 11:19:02 pmI mean, is the intent to circumvent not enough to deny the product? Here my order is being denied even with a shipping address in the continental US because at the end of the day final destination is still Costa Rica. Wouldn't the same apply if I physically go there to try to buy it? I mean both billing and physical address would remain the same, and the intent to take it back with me to CR wouldn't change, I don't see how that would be different from using a freight forwarder.I don't care for the aftersales support really, in this region it's a given that it always sucks or is non existent. Any time I buy something and send it to the freight forwarder I'm well aware it's a gamble because warranty and support terms don't mean much once the product lands here

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2024, 12:46:40 am
content: Officially CR is served from Mexico:Logicbus SA de CV(33) 3854 5975www.logicbus.com.mxsupport@logicbus.comHover a mouse over the map:https://siglentna.com/how-to-buy/

author: josfemova
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2024, 01:18:50 am
content: Quote from: tautech on April 12, 2024, 12:46:40 amSent them an email to see if I'm forced to buy via the Mexico store and ship from Mexico. Some stuff has similar prices to the US store, but for something like a 2104X Plus the prices go up like $347 and probably would be forced to ship via Fedex/DHL which makes the cost even worse. I was already going over the initial budget with the US price :'(. Will have to reevaluate my options, probably more cost effective to get something from the brands tequipment is allowed to send me.

author: KungFuJosh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2024, 01:36:32 am
content: Quote from: josfemova on April 12, 2024, 01:18:50 am$1399 is the normal price:https://www.logicbus.com/SDS2104X-Plus_p_23915.html

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2024, 01:38:28 am
content: Do be aware SDS2000X Plus is under promo ATM with an additional very well priced option bundle.https://siglentna.com/news-article/permanent-analysis-bundle-on-your-new-oscilloscope/

author: josfemova
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2024, 01:55:25 am
content: Quote from: KungFuJosh on April 12, 2024, 01:36:32 amyep, it's at $1756.58 at the Mexico store. Not taking into account shipment + México sales taxes + import taxes + local sales taxes on the shipment service, also no inventoryhttps://tienda.logicbus.com.mx/SDS2104X-Plus_p_24317.html

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2024, 03:49:56 am
content: Quote from: josfemova on April 12, 2024, 01:55:25 amSupplied from NA so if you commit to purchase they will order one for you.First ask for a lead time.

author: Performa01
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2024, 06:23:13 am
content: Quote from: josfemova on April 12, 2024, 01:18:50 amYou say you want an SDS2104X Plus.This happens to be the most popular upper entry level scope from Siglent.BK Precision happen to rebadge Siglent oscilloscopes. Not the latest ones, but certainly the SDS2104X Plus – it’s called 2565B there.Tequipment would ship BK Precision to your country, as you say. Unfortunately I see a price of $2340,- for the 2565B, so buying the original in Mexico might still be the better option…

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2024, 09:51:10 am
content: This isn’t a Latin America problem, it’s one that exists everywhere, because of the territory agreements already described.Switzerland is right in the middle of Europe, yet some items are very hard to get because of such agreements, which sometimes end up with Switzerland having no official distribution channel, yet distributors in neighboring countries contractually barred from exporting to here. Sometimes it even depends on the product line, with some of a manufacturer’s products being trivial to get while others are nigh on impossible.Heck, it happens even to USA sometimes.

author: Njk
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2024, 11:37:18 am
content: Quote from: tautech on April 11, 2024, 11:19:02 pmPerhaps. But it's economy and probability. If it'll be more economic to dump the broken unit and to bring the replacement from abroad privately again, then why not. However, it can be not the only consideration.For instance, the Siglent brand is banned here through regulation. Here is an official registry for the T&M equipment, which is approved for use in the country. It's illegal to import a not listed instruments. Of course, every more less known brand is registered there. Even Rigol, as a favorite pet project of Chinese government, was provided with enough cache to pay all the necessary bribes for whitelisting. But Dingyang Tech took different approach. It partnered with the local distributor who's selling the same products under the distributor's brand, painted differently and at doubled price. That's total rubbish. Although it's not a problem to smuggle a unit or two from abroad, later the owner will have a warranty/service problems and moreover, the instrument can't be used in any legal business.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2024, 01:25:53 pm
content: Quote from: Njk on April 12, 2024, 11:37:18 amAre you sure your finger pointing shouldn't instead be directed to the owner of the AKIP brand and their decision to partner with Siglent for solitary RU import rights and therefore market for best profitability.Some Siglent models the west has never seen except in LeCroy colors and at LeCroy pricing.Also RU has its own technical industry to protect by way of import levies that can also impact savagely on pricing.Things are not always as simple as they seem.

author: KungFuJosh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2024, 01:32:49 pm
content: Quote from: josfemova on April 12, 2024, 01:55:25 amThe link I sent is from their "international store." Can you try ordering from that?

author: audiotubes
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2024, 03:48:11 pm
content: Quote from: Njk on April 11, 2024, 11:03:04 pmI found some Chinese radios and computers (two different, unrelated companies) that are not exported outside China. I sent a couple of emails. They both told me the same thing, China is a big enough market that they don't need to distribute outside their country.I'm sure this is not an isolated incident. As China's economy grows stronger, I guess this will get worse (for export sales) before it gets better.

author: normi
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 13, 2024, 01:27:15 am
content: 1. See if the item is available through Amazon, it is possible they don't check for restrictions.2. Try another freight forwarder, some have declarations that they are forwarding , others address may not come up as a freight forward address.3. There are sometimes US restrictions' on the export of technology but his would not apply here, so it is most likely protection for dealers. At work I buy from large suppliers and ship equipment to various countries where we have business locations and sometimes the orders have to be split because they would point you to a dealer for a specific region.4. Try Ebay.5. If you pick the item up in the US it is unlikely that customs would prevent you from carrying it to Costa Rica since this is not a US security issue but a manufacturer imposed restriction.I import most of my items from the US through various freight forwarders, some sites detect this and block sale but trying a different forwarder sometimes works. I sometimes buy things from China by send it to the US then freight forward as it is much faster than having it sent directly to my country.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 13, 2024, 07:17:05 pm
content: Quote from: normi on April 13, 2024, 01:27:15 amThey absolutely do.

author: josfemova
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 13, 2024, 08:28:25 pm
content: Quote from: normi on April 13, 2024, 01:27:15 amAbout this one, AFAIK Siglent store in amazon is managed by Tequipment :C they will definitely check.I'm taking a look at my options, a friend of a friend that had helped me get Home Depot stuff in the past could help us on this case too. If that does not work I'll try my luck on ebay with lower tier stuff, I was already going overbudget a little bit with the SDS2104X so I'm not really willing to pay what it takes to bring it from Mexico. Will probably go for a sub $1k scope if the "friend-of-a-friend" method doesn't work.There's for sure ways to circumvent restrictions, but I would prefer if it wasn't this much of a PITA to get the stuff

author: KungFuJosh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 13, 2024, 09:26:31 pm
content: Quote from: josfemova on April 13, 2024, 08:28:25 pmTequipment sells on Amazon, but they're not the only dealer selling on there. Amazon also stocks and sells Siglent gear directly.