Which logic analyzer for FPGA work up to 300-400 Mhz - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: suspension
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2023, 05:59:57 pm
content: I do quite a lot of FPGA work and use internal chip scope from Xilinx to inspect internal signals. The biggest issue with this approach is that any change requires a re-synthesis/implementation of the design which can take 5-15 minutes for complex designs. Therefore, I am evaluating a dedicated logic analyzer with good trigger capabilities and some support for protocol decoding.My budget is 500USD. Used ones are OK.Two main options are either to buy a used old HP/Agilent/Tek from ebay or buy a new USB based one from ebay/Amazon/Aliexpress. I prefer the first option but wanted to check others' opinions as well. Thoughts?

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2023, 06:30:32 pm
content: I'd get an old Tektronix like the TLA700 series (TLA715 for example). The triggering abilities on these are awesome and they have 56 bit timestamps on all samples so you can use an acquisition mode that only records where certain signals change allowing for really long recordings without wasting memory on useless information. In most cases I don't bother to setup a specific trigger.IMHO the TLA7AA4 acquisition modules are the nicest option because there also have 4 analog outputs that allow to watch any connected signal using an oscilloscope. The probes that use an elastomer connector are really cheap and some have posted break-out board designs for these probes on this forum. The TLA7AA4 modules can be hacked to allow full memory bandwidth and maximum state frequency in a very simple way by sending a couple of SCPI commands.You could use a scope hooked up to the analog outputs to do protocol decoding. I have written some limited protocol decoders (I2C and SPI IIRC) for the TLA700 series in the past as plugins but I have not managed to get these to work well with the most recent version of the TLA700 software.

author: mtk
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2023, 06:35:48 pm
content: Probably you could look at DSLogic U3Pro16 and DSLogic U3Pro32https://www.dreamsourcelab.com/product/dslogic-series/– 16/32 digital channels. USB 3.0 interface, Up to 1GHz sample rate, Up to 2Gbits hardware memo. The current price for 16-channel version on DreamSourceLab shop is 299 USDhttps://www.dreamsourcelab.com/shop/logic-analyzer/dslogic-u3pro16/.The software – DSViewhttps://github.com/DreamSourceLab/DSViewis not bad, based on sigrok – open-source. Has some issues, but there are people that provide technical support. And it will support much more decoding protocols in comparison to old alternatives.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2023, 06:58:33 pm
content: But the problem with the typical USB logic analysers is that they don't have the elaborate triggering posibilities of a real logic analyser. The ones from Tektronix (and I assume HP/Agilent) have trigger systems that are fully programmable where you can use timers, event counters, states, etc. Basically you can program these using a set of conditions that allow to capture extremely elusive bugs / events. At some point deep memory just runs out.Or put differently: if you have an oscilloscope with digital inputs (=MSO) + decoding, you are probably better off using that because it also allows to see the digital signals in realtime. Having a USB logic analyser doesn't add much value to your toolbox if you have an MSO.

author: RoGeorge
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2023, 07:00:01 pm
content: Quote from: suspension on January 06, 2023, 05:59:57 pmMost of the debugging should happen in simulation.Chipscope ILA is a last resort and only rarely used. Clipping probes at 300-400MHz most probably will ruin the signal integrity and make one chasing ghosts. Even if possible to clip the probes, it will take more time to physically attach the probes and to operate the external LA, than the 5-15 minutes needed for a new Chipscope setup. An external LA won't save time, quite contrary.Can you give a few examples with what kind of signals you want to probe and/or decode?

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2023, 07:05:07 pm
content: Quote from: RoGeorge on January 06, 2023, 07:00:01 pmNot really. In an FPGA design you typically have dedicated outputs to connect an LA to. In my designs I have a mux (somehow controlled) that allows to look at various internal signals. With all the modules together (and some internal software running in a softcore), simulation will be too slow. Simulation only takes you so far as verifying a module works but with the whole thing integrated and external signals in play, it is a different world and sometimes you need to know more about why & how something isn't working as expected.A logic analyser probe typically allows you to connect to signals with minimal disturbance if you hook it up using a special footprint that matches the probe. It is like having 16 or 32 active FET probes in a single package. For one project I bought an FMC connector breakout board to connect my logic analyser to the signals between the mainboard and a module. Works like a charm. See this topic:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/tla7aa4-p6860-probe-artwork/

author: mtk
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2023, 07:50:25 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on January 06, 2023, 06:58:33 pmSo the real logic analyzer are Tektronix and HP/Agilent ? For your information an USB logic analyzer can offer much more recording memory and it is quite questionable in most of the cases if timers, event counters, states … are need it at all. But in contrast from Tektronix and HP/Agilent probably those functions can be added.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2023, 08:56:15 pm
content: A decent logic analyser will have very powerful facilities for arming, triggering, and filtering the inputs. Those enable you to ignore irrelevant crap and only capture useful data. They will do that on the fly in real time, whereas a low-end LA will use post-processing.That means very long capture memories are less important.To give a contrived simple example, consider wanting to verify that that a pulse has a width between 100us and 200us and the period is exactly 1024us. You could set the trigger to be if the period is not 1024us or the pulse width is >200 or <100us. The high-end LA would sit there all day doing nothing until the single trigger occurs. A low end LA would capture a buffer full of data, then post process it while ignoring the input (and missing the problem). That is analogous to a scopes dead time.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2023, 09:07:57 pm
content: Quote from: mtk on January 06, 2023, 07:50:25 pmYou have to quantify that... The TLA7AA4 module has 32Mpts per channel. 128Mpts in quarter channel mode. And don't forget timestamped recording which I doubt USB LAs have. I have used the timestamped recording feature on my TLA715 + TLA7AA4 module to capture several frames worth of data from a TFT screen using a 500MHz sampling rate / 2ns time resolution. On top of that the TLA7AA4 has a short memory which is sampled using a sample rate of 8GHz (125ps timing resolution).Another very usefull feature is to have something similar to segmented recording like you find on oscilloscopes. When a trigger condition is met, the TLA700 series can capture a chunk of samples and then wait for the next trigger. Again, this allows for spanning timeframes that you'll never be able to achieve using a logic analyser that can only do a single shot.Bottom line: the USB logic analysers are nice for doing protocol decoding and light logic analysis tasks but they are absolutely not a replacement for a real logic analyser. Besides that, real logic analysers can be bought from Ebay for peanuts.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2023, 10:40:14 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on January 06, 2023, 09:07:57 pmLet's emphasise that with an example...Consder a system with a 100MHz clock, an address bus, a data bus, and an address valid signal. Every 1ms data is read, and you are only interested in reads from address in the range 1234 to 5678. You want to capture (up to) 10000 values read on the rising edge of the clock provided address valid is asserted and provided the address range is right.A decent LA will only capture <=10000 values during the 10s window. A low-end LA capture all the irrelevant clock transitions (i.e.2e9 !). It could probably post process those gigasamples to only show all data reads. You would probably have to write your own filter to see only addresses in the range.That is one very simple example of what a decent LA can do.Then consider only being interested in those values that occur after the sequence of signal X being asserted followed by signal Y being asserted for more than 1.5ms.Good luck doing that triggering with a low-end LA!General point: a good LA allows you to focus on the usefulinformation, by filtering out the crap from the data.

author: suspension
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 07, 2023, 04:10:50 am
content: Very useful info. I am biasing more towards the used hp/agilent/tek options.I see TLA715 is mentioned a lot in here as well in other threads. Any particular reason? Any other options that can be recommended?

author: Thomas
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 07, 2023, 05:31:57 am
content: Some USB LA's have advanced triggering. I have the DigiView DV-518:https://tech-tools.com/trigger-cfg.htmlDon't know how it compares to the old boat anchors, but it sure is more capable than the usual Saleae toys.Anyway, if I had the space I would probably go with a boat anchor too.

author: mtk
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 07, 2023, 07:19:39 am
content: Some of the PicoScope models also have Advanced Triggers capabilities, including: Advanced edge trigger, Window trigger, Pulse width trigger, Interval trigger, Runt, Window pulse width trigger, Level dropout trigger, Window dropout trigger, Logic trigger, Digital trigger ...https://www.picotech.com/library/oscilloscopes/advanced-digital-triggersUltra-deep memory - PicoScope 6000E Series oscilloscopes have waveform capture memories of up to 4 gigasamples.https://www.picotech.com/library/oscilloscopes/deep-memory-high-performance-oscilloscopesRegarding TEKTRONIX TLA715, the lowest price currently on eBay is US $699.99 + shipping from US $142.97 + import charges Est. $230.90, total US $1073.86. Doubtfully this amount can be called peanuts.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 07, 2023, 09:42:28 am
content: Quote from: suspension on January 07, 2023, 04:10:50 amA general point is that if you are interested in any serial interface's data for capture/trigger/filter operations, then a good tool might be a protocol analyser or printf() statements.Apart from that, andwithoutknowing the toolsthe picoscope advanced triggers mentioned would seem to be useful up to a point, but not for sequences of eventsthe digiview triggers seem usefulpresumably separate filters are also needed for capturing the dataIf you can, use a tool's manual to understand how you can/can't use the tool's features for your expected use-cases.If you go for an old machine, verify that it is fully functionalandthat it has all the necessary probe hardware. Just as with scopes, the probes are "merely bits of wire" that are become separated from the "big important box"

author: markone
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 07, 2023, 09:50:41 am
content: Quote from: Thomas on January 07, 2023, 05:31:57 amI was not aware of this device, it looks quite capable for the price, does its windows application show captured data in real time fashion or you have to wait the end of recording phase ?

author: Thomas
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 07, 2023, 11:29:39 am
content: Quote from: markone on January 07, 2023, 09:50:41 amIt operates in the normal capture-process-display manner, with "Auto Run" or "Run Once" options on separate buttons. This can be fast or slow depending on sample speed, memory depth, number of signals and decoders, see under Performance section here:https://tech-tools.com/digiview-sw.htmlThe software also has Search on captured data. I haven't used it, but it seems comprehensive:https://tech-tools.com/searching.htmlOverall the software is a bit unusual and takes some getting used to, but it's always responsive and stable. Never seen a crash.BTW, I think this analyzer is a bit slow for the OP's applications.And a bit expensive

author: mtk
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 07, 2023, 11:58:33 am
content: Quote from: tggzzz on January 06, 2023, 10:40:14 pmDSLogic Analyzers have stage trigger supporting 16 stages of trigger flag. Each stage support logic operation (and/or) of 2 sets of trigger. Each set support edge/level trigger of all channels, invert and counter. There is also serial trigger -https://www.dreamsourcelab.com/doc/DSView_User_Guide.pdf. It does not look much convenient to set up, but it seems possible to filter the requested from you values ?

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 07, 2023, 12:49:54 pm
content: Quote from: mtk on January 07, 2023, 07:19:39 amAsking price isn't selling price on Ebay. You should be able to pick one up for $300 or so. Just make the seller an offer and you'll see pricing on logic analysers is very flexible. If not, then just wait a little bit for another one to pop up.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 07, 2023, 12:55:50 pm
content: Quote from: Thomas on January 07, 2023, 05:31:57 amThis looks like a neat tool but what I'm missing from the specification are the input capacitance & impedance. And the capture buffer is quite small. 128Mbit in total (14Mbit per channel for the 9 bit version and 7Mbit/channel for the 18 bit version).

author: markone
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 07, 2023, 01:12:48 pm
content: Quote from: mtk on January 07, 2023, 11:58:33 amSerial trigger does not work at all with async serial and it's a huge pita to setup with I2C and SPI, stay away this thing if serial decoding is your job.

author: mtk
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 07, 2023, 01:38:48 pm
content: Quote from: markone on January 07, 2023, 01:12:48 pmMine is in transit and can not test it right now. Have you tried submitting a support request via Github -https://github.com/DreamSourceLab/DSView/issues?

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 07, 2023, 02:12:10 pm
content: Quote from: markone on January 07, 2023, 01:12:48 pmArguably a protocol analyser can be more appropriate for such things.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 07, 2023, 02:21:05 pm
content: Quote from: Thomas on January 07, 2023, 11:29:39 amI think all tools will have that cycle to a greater or lesser extent, depending on what is meant by "process". The devil is in the details; manufacturers sometimes make it difficult to understand, and users don't always understand what they will actually need.For some use-cases involving rare fast short-duration events, a lot of the "processing" has to be donebefore and duringcapture and display. If not then the rare event can be missed while captured buffers are being post-processed to see if something "interesting" occurred.

author: Thomas
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 07, 2023, 08:03:07 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on January 07, 2023, 12:55:50 pmYes, the capture buffer is quite small. But as with many USB logic analyzers, only transitions are stored (often referred to as compression). They claim 100M transitions can be captured in most cases. This can be tested here:https://tech-tools.com/captures.htmlBut still - YMMV.One should always consider data sheets and specs carefully.Corner cases and unlucky circumstances are always lurking and waiting to ruin your day.In this regard I think the boat anchors are a safer bet - I think they have fewer "hidden" limitations and surprises.But then again - the DigiView is a lot smaller than the floppy drive of a boat anchor

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 07, 2023, 10:40:45 pm
content: Quote from: Thomas on January 07, 2023, 08:03:07 pmYes and no. Typically I'd agree a boat anchor takes a lot of space and is a PITA to haul around the lab but the Tektronix TLA700 series is an exception. My TLA715 sits high up a shelve and I control it remotely from my PC. The probe cables are long enough to reach the desk below so basically I only have a few probe pods on my desk when using the logic analyser.

author: suspension
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 05:35:36 am
content: Quote from: nctnico on January 07, 2023, 10:40:45 pmDoes this mean we can control full logic analyzer functionality through a PC software without interacting with its display and controls?One more thing, which modules do you recommend for this unit? My main application is FPGA development and that can also occasionally involve debugging serial communication protocols like pciexpress/MPI/etc.

author: markone
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 10:08:06 am
content: Quote from: Thomas on January 07, 2023, 11:29:39 amDoes the "Auto Run" mode act like a DSO "normal" trigger mode, so it auto re-arm after serving a trigger event ?Considering its capability to define complex trigger / capture mechanism by a script plus graphical scheme it does not seem so expensive.

author: markone
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 10:28:47 am
content: Quote from: mtk on January 07, 2023, 01:38:48 pmNot yet, but I guess that it would not bring anywhere considering the way they implemented the whole mechanism, where an actual signal transition is needed to define a data bit position.So it's easy to understand why only I2C and SPI are supported, in any case the system implemented to define an advanced trigger is a huge pita to say the least.In my case the final nail in the coffin is the following "feature" : during the capture process DSView shows a progress round graph that drives you crazy in auto repeat mode rendering almost a flashing screenSo, if async serial trigger OR live screen update are a must for you prepare a place on a shelf to store the toy (like i did).

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 11:02:37 am
content: Quote from: suspension on January 08, 2023, 05:35:36 amYes. The application software that runs on the analyser itself does the same.QuoteI know too little about the serial protocol modules to answer this question. I never really looked into obtaining one of those.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 11:22:56 am
content: Quote from: suspension on January 08, 2023, 05:35:36 amThere are two independent parts to that: the physical layer hardware and the decoding.To me, Message Passing Interface is a software concept, and at that point printf() statements are conceivable. OTOH pciexpress is a physical and PHY layer concept.

author: mtk
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 11:31:13 am
content: Quote from: markone on January 08, 2023, 10:28:47 amThe progress round graph is really very annoying. I have already submitted a support request to be removed. It would be much nicer if there is continuous acquisition. Regarding the other issues will look at them too.From the inexpensive USB logic analyzers, DSLogic series seems to be the most advanced. Presume with time the software will improve. DSView is open source and hope more developers to get involved and improve it.

author: Thomas
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 11:41:32 am
content: Quote from: markone on January 08, 2023, 10:08:06 amYes. And "Run Once" is like "Single" on a DSO.

author: markone
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 12:23:52 pm
content: Quote from: Thomas on January 08, 2023, 11:41:32 amGood, do you have an idea about re-arm time ?I know that it's for sure dependent on capture settings, I need a rough number to understand how much the system is responsive.

author: markone
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 12:35:47 pm
content: Quote from: mtk on January 08, 2023, 11:31:13 amThis thing is so wrong that could lead to think that no one is really using this tool for real job, how is it possible that no one is crying about that ?Quote from: mtk on January 08, 2023, 11:31:13 amOne of the lesson learned in my life is the following : never rely in a open source development for serious things.My current feeling for my DSLogic plus purchase is that I threw out the window 130 euros, but as we all know sh*t happens.

author: mtk
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 01:15:07 pm
content: Quote from: markone on January 08, 2023, 12:35:47 pmI like many open source tools. Embedded Artist LabToolhttps://www.embeddedartists.com/products/labtool/is not bad, but EA stopped developing further the software. The logic analyzer works fine, but has very basic capabilities. Some of the stuff – size of the windows, signals, colors can be changed via the source code. I like the idea that a product can be changed from the user. Also the interaction with the developers, other users, meeting and discussing issues with other people. A person can purchase an old huge 30+ kg. logic analyzer that works somehow and can not change anything … and where is the fun with that ?I really hope DSView will improve. There is one saying if something ends badly, this in not the end.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 01:46:34 pm
content: Quote from: markone on January 08, 2023, 12:35:47 pmYou pay for experience with your money and/or time.Closed source commercial products are clearly the way forward. I recommend you spend time considering Microsoft Plays For Sure, Microsofts many GUI/Web frameworks (e.g. silverlight), Altium CircuitStudio(?), Micro-Cap simulator, Adobe Flash etc etc etcHint: there are no real general distinctions between open source and commercial products, but each product has its own relative advantages and disadvantages. It takes hard-won wisdom to choose.

author: markone
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 01:55:39 pm
content: Quote from: mtk on January 08, 2023, 01:15:07 pmAnchor boats are far to be of my interest, old LA in particular, they have ridiculous performance in rapport of current standards.Quote from: mtk on January 08, 2023, 01:15:07 pmI hope to be wrong, but being the project out from many years and given the importance of current shortcomings the chances to see them solved in reasonable time (weeks, months ?) seem close to zero.Dunno if you have ever used Pulseview, with all the respect for developers group it could be good for a newbie in conjunction with 10 dollars Cypress 8Ch LA dongle, for a professional is a joke.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 02:00:37 pm
content: Quote from: tggzzz on January 08, 2023, 01:46:34 pmAgreed. Both commercial and open source software can be excellent or suck badly. You can't tell before you investigate a particular piece of software.

author: markone
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 02:05:45 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on January 08, 2023, 02:00:37 pmCommercial products have to satisfy many requirements, if the commercial company fails in that lose customers confidence and go bankrupt, open source projects often are simply training ground for budding programmers.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 02:24:26 pm
content: Sorry, but you are wrong here. There are lots of examples of good open source software. Keep in mind that commercial parties do work on open source software to basically join forces without needing specific agreements to do so. Kicad is one of those examples but there are many more.

author: markone
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 02:33:22 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on January 08, 2023, 02:24:26 pmI said "often", not "always", IMHO Kicad is the only open source tool usable with profit (as I do for small PCBs), otherwise I have more positive examples for HAM radio SDR application than professional electronics.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 03:09:44 pm
content: Quote from: markone on January 08, 2023, 02:05:45 pmYes, commercial products are solely designed for the customers benefit, are never a training ground for marketeers/executives, are never abandoned before or after delivering those benefits nor when paying customers are still relying on them, and are never used to gouge unjustifiable sums from customers.

author: markone
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 03:16:31 pm
content: Quote from: tggzzz on January 08, 2023, 03:09:44 pmSarcasm detectedAre you a keen / proud open source developer / supporter ?Remaining in thread, do you have an example of open source LA SW / HW system that is barely comparable to a professional product ?

author: mtk
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 03:38:42 pm
content: Quote from: markone on January 08, 2023, 01:55:39 pmThe initial release of KiCad was published in 1992 or 31 years ago. In comparison the stable release of libsigrok was released about 3 years ago. Some claim that the sigrok main developer abandoned the project, but as far as I am aware other continue to developing it. There is much more to be desired in terms of capabilities and it takes time and devotion. The main issues with logic analyzers probably is that the advance triggering and filtering suppose to be performed on the accusation module presumably on the FPGA or MCU. In other words, such project suppose to developed the device firmware as well. This might be an issues in most of the cases. Currently, an interesting implementation is sigrok-picohttps://github.com/pico-coder/sigrok-pico. It is my understanding that can achieve 250 MHz sampling rate. For 6 USD (WiFi edition) I would say, it is quite an achievement, still there there is lots of work to be done about the WiFi connectivity as well as how this logic analyzer works as whole.

author: markone
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 04:14:51 pm
content: Quote from: mtk on January 08, 2023, 03:38:42 pmAs you said, Trigger / Conditional Capture are the aspects where Sigrok fails to satisfy any even barely serious demand.HW wise you have no input protections and no variable thresholds, software wise you have basic (to say the least) selectable trigger mechanism (rising/falling edges, advanced ones are in another world).Dunno if this specific branch goes beyond "standard" Pulseview in any aspect, but if I go to its Github page I read :At this time my pull request into the main sigrok repo has not been accepted.Thus mainline releases of sigrok cli and pulseview do not support this repo.so, for instance, you can forget to try it under Windows with an official binary release, you want to venture out in Windows compile process (good luck).As I said, for a newbie / hobby works those are great tools almost for free, but we are far from something that is remotely comparable to professional ones.My understanding about DSLogic LAs is that they are mainly used by hackers to trap external memory access in order to exploit application protection mechanisms.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 04:15:44 pm
content: Quote from: markone on January 08, 2023, 03:16:31 pmI am neither religious nor political. I look for tools that are fit for purpose, easy to use, and do what I need. Sometimes those are free as in beer, sometimes free as in air, sometimes extremely expensive.All that implies understanding why different types of tool exist, their relative advantages and disadvantages - and not falling into ideological ruts. And also using whatever is available creatively and to best advantage.Everything in my .sig is there for a reason.

author: Thomas
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 05:09:33 pm
content: Quote from: markone on January 08, 2023, 12:23:52 pmIt will depend on a lot of things, including the computer it is running on.But with short capture memory I get tens of updates per second (20-50 updates per second? Not sure).Similar to my Analog Discovery 2, signals seems to update pretty much instantaneous, without any annoying delay.And a slow-ish FM signal looks like a spring compressing and extending.Seems responsive enough for me, no complaints here.

author: markone
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 06:04:37 pm
content: Quote from: Thomas on January 08, 2023, 05:09:33 pmThat seems great, this device is not cheap but seems to carry everything is needed for serious job.Noted for future need.

author: gslick
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 09:56:48 pm
content: For boat anchor logic analyzer fans, you can sometimes find reasonable deals if you are patient. The last boat anchor logic analyzer I picked up around 3 months ago was an Agilent 16902A, which included a 16910A 102-channel 32M-sample analyzer module (plus a couple of other modules) for a total of $200 including shipping in the US. This deal was probably better due to the 16902A lacking a hard drive, which was easy for me to replace and reload the OS and application software, as that is something I had already been through a few times.The Agilent / Keysight 16900 and 16800 series logic analyzers run Windows XP (or Windows 7 in the much nicer and faster newer versions), and can be remotely controlled by the logic analyzer application running on a remote PC. In some cases the remote control might provide a better user experience if the logic analyzer application runs on a significantly faster modern system than locally on the 1GHz PIII motherboard built into the original 16900 series logic analyzers.

author: mtk
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 10:49:09 pm
content: Quote from: gslick on January 08, 2023, 09:56:48 pmIn Europe they are more expensive. For example, currently in Germany there is one listing for HP 16500C (https://www.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de/s-anzeige/hp-16500c-logikanalysator-incl-erw-karten-und-sehr-viel-zubehoer/2245980136-168-4201) - 350 EUR. It includes the following modules:HP 16555A: Logic Analyzer, 500MHz, 64 ch, 2M-deep/channelHP 16533A: Oscilloscope, 1GS/s, 2 chHP 16517A: Logic Analyze, 4GHz, 16 chHP 16552A: Pattern Generator, 200MHz, 20 ch (40 ch / 100MHz)+ lots of cables and adaptersJust the shipping in Germany cost between 50-100 USD. If it has to be delivered to another EU country will cost probably at least another 100 EUR.Any comments about the quality of the oscilloscope ?

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 08, 2023, 11:20:43 pm
content: Quote from: mtk on January 08, 2023, 10:49:09 pmAgain, asking price ain't selling price. Just make the guy an offer; likely you can scoop it up for 200 euro or even less. The ad is on there for nearly 3 months already. It could also be the seller is stuck at 350 and is waiting for somebody to buy the device for that price -which may never happen-. Only one way to find out: make an offer. Do everyone a favour and don't ask whether it is still for sale or what the lowest price is; make an offer.

author: jhormilla
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2023, 08:04:26 am
content: Quote from: gslick on January 08, 2023, 09:56:48 pmWhats the going price for the Agilent/Keysight 16902A Logic Analyzer with a couple of modules? Looking into one of these but don't know the pitfalls with them. They look vary capable.TIA

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 12, 2023, 08:11:52 am
content: Quote from: jhormilla on April 12, 2023, 08:04:26 amhttps://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_nkw=%28Agilent%2CKeysight%29+16902A&_sacat=0&LH_PrefLoc=2&rt=nc&LH_Sold=1&LH_Complete=1

author: Evi
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 25, 2025, 01:35:14 pm
content: https://github.com/yyunju80/400Mhz-Logicanalyzer?ysclid=m7kiygvkcf338691810

author: asmi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 25, 2025, 02:46:54 pm
content: For what it's worth, I've been working with FPGA for like a decade now, designs include video streaming/processing, high-speed networking, multi-gigabit serial links, various memory controllers, specialized and general purpose soft-cores, etc. And in all that time I had NEVER needed external LA to debug anything, as ILA was more than enough, and it doesn't affect routing nearly as negatively as routing internal signals to IO balls do (because it's all internal component(s)).

author: RAPo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 25, 2025, 03:20:45 pm
content: Out of budget of the OP, but I really like theActive-Pro. You can debug your own firmware in real-time