Is it not time for another multimeter shootout yet? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 12:14:23 am
content: Based on the all the talk still happening on the forums about multimeters, perhaps its time for an updated shootout(s).Maybe a clamp meter shootout? Pocket meters? Higher range meters in the $200 -$250 range?

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 12:26:31 am
content: Probably!But I look forward to editing that about as much as getting teeth extractedThere was a pocket meter shootout on the cards, and a list compiled on the forum somewhere. I think it got past 10. I never got around to actually acquiring most of them though.There is always need for an updated $100 meter shootout, as that seems to be the magic figure.What would people's "Top 5" sub $100 meter list be these days?If we could get a consensus on the likely best value top 5 meters, then I'll get them and make it happen.I'd like to deliberately exclude any known crap ones.Any new shootout I would like to keep much shorter than previous ones. Very brief side-by-side comparisons of each main feature. Like the teardown being say 1 minute commentary on each meter.Dave.

author: jnd
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 01:13:24 am
content: Is the Agilent U1231A still going for $99? With free Bluetooth adapter and possibly the calibration certificate? No current range but still pretty good, can't think of other really solid meter for that price.

author: dr_p
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 01:19:39 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 17, 2013, 12:26:31 amAmprobe AM-270Brymen BM867Klein Tools MM2000

author: Spawn
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 01:58:12 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 17, 2013, 12:26:31 amHere Dave, this is the list:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/most-compact-high-quality-multimeter/msg68284/#msg68284I like pocket meters, I believe I got 6 of them a shootout would be nice indeed. I would love to see around 200 dollar range meters too, but at the end everyone wants different price range or type so I am happy with any multimeter shootoutEdit:I am very interested inUEI DM5Bpocket multimeter for a while now because of it is current range till 5A and detachable test leads. Maybe I should stop buying every Fluke or Gossen second hand when I see them for a decent price and get the UEI DM5B

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 02:37:19 am
content: I realize it can go a few dollars over $100, but perhaps the Fluke 17b would be worthy of inclusion in that group.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 02:50:36 am
content: Quote from: nanofrog on January 17, 2013, 02:37:19 amYep, I agree. And I already have one.Dave.

author: retiredcaps
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 03:15:54 am
content: Quote from: dr_p on January 17, 2013, 01:19:39 amNo way the Brymen BM867 is $100. Franky was listing it on ebay for $285 USD.Klein Tools MM2000 is basically a UEI which Dave did in the $100 shootout.https://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/klein-tools-mm2000-multi-meter-review/

author: CHexclaim
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 04:28:46 am
content: Hi, I recently bought a Instek GDM-396 under $100It is a mixture of good and bad. I was dissapointed at first but then seems reliable.Maybe it is a unit that Dave can use to show exactly this, what is good and what is bad about it.I made a hack with a switch in the battery compartment so that I can turn off RS-232 output. As a consequence, the auto-sleep mode starts working.And the way you turn the back light on is just incredibly wrong. As I understand it is the way it was designed in the chipset. This reminds of some comments on why a low cost Fluke, which I don't recall the model now, didn't have backlight. I think it uses the same chipset. And it would be inadmissible for a Fluke to have this way of operation.Well, 2:30 am here, good night everyone. Good morning Dave!!CH!

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 06:23:16 am
content: Amprobe AM-240 $90USDAgilent U1231A $100USD, sometimesAXIOMET AX-176 $90USD, no idea who or what this is, just found it in the price range.BRYMEN BM815A $105USDBRYMEN BM907 $100USDJust some ideas. The problem as I see it with selecting a $100 shootout is that there seems to be a clear winner without even starting the war. IMHO, yeah right me humble, the Amprobe AM-270 beats everything in the $100 price range, and maybe even up to $170. The only things that I have seen that might make people pause is the backlight and its size and no frequency counter. If I were buying my first multimeter I would be buying this one. But that is what shootouts are for, to sort out the differences.I would still prefer to see a shootout in the pocket, or clamp meter, or $200-$300 range first. There hasn't been much that has changed in the $100 class since the last one. Maybe having another shootout with a new crop of different meters could be informative though.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 07:42:22 am
content: I've added a poll.Dave.

author: retiredcaps
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 07:44:51 am
content: Quote from: Lightages on January 17, 2013, 06:23:16 amI would prefer to see Dave review a different batch of manufacturers not covered in the previous $50 and $100 shootout.There is a lot of interest in Brymen so the Amprobe AM-270 or its variations would be a good candidate.Dave wants to do the Fluke 17B so that is two.Maybe something from Japan like a Yokogawa or Hioki in the $100 range?

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 07:49:43 am
content: Quote from: retiredcaps on January 17, 2013, 07:44:51 amIs the Amprobe a rebadged Brymen?Dave.

author: iloveelectronics
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 08:43:22 am
content: I believe so. From the specs I think it's a rebadged BM817a, except that the Amprobe doesn't have the USB data logging.Quote from: EEVblog on January 17, 2013, 07:49:43 am

author: retiredcaps
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 08:44:24 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 17, 2013, 07:49:43 amYour honor, may I present the following pictorial exhibits A, B and C. Namely, Amprobe AM-270, Brymen BM817a and Greenlee DM820.http://content.amprobe.com/HighResImages/am-270.jpghttp://brymen.com/product-html/cata810a/BM810a_Catalog.pdfhttp://www.1stplacesupply.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/3/3/332-dm-820_1.jpgAmprobe, from the little I know, doesn't seem to do any "engineering" or "design". The 34XR you reviewed in the $100 multimeter shootout was a Meterman product. Many of the Amprobe offerings seem to be from Brymen or APPA Tech OEM. This is ironic seeing how Fluke competes against some of the same products but in different manufacturer's clothing.edit: Apparently, Franky in HK, has faster Internet speeds than Canada. His post beat me by one minute.

author: retiredcaps
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 08:56:29 am
content: And if you are thinking of doing a 500,000 count multimeter shootout, you will basically be doing a review of one multimeter in various clothing/skins. See what I posted on Martin's sitehttp://mjlorton.com/forum/index.php?topic=111.msg699#msg699

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 09:04:01 am
content: Quote from: retiredcaps on January 17, 2013, 08:44:24 amYep, same heritage, but different cases, and hence likely different PCB designs inside?Which one to include in any shootout?QuoteThat's because Fluke actually bought both Amprobe and Meterman.They kept the Amprobe brand as a seperate line, and the Meterman meters were rebranded as Amprobe.Dave.

author: iloveelectronics
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 09:14:17 am
content: Dave,If you're going to do a $200+ meter shootout I'd like to offer to send a Brymen 521 / 525 for you to look at. Martin had a review on the BM-867 and there have been a few reviews and teardown on that and the 869, but not too many people seem to be aware of the 520's series. They are 10,000-count, dual display, data logging capable (both via USB and with internal memory). Difference between the 525 and the 521 is only the internal memory size and dual temperature measurement on 525 while 521 doesn't do temp.http://www.brymen.com.tw/product-html/cata520/Bm520L2.htm

author: retiredcaps
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 09:19:13 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 17, 2013, 09:04:01 amPicture of Amprobe AM-270 from FenderBender teardown posthttps://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/teardown-amprobe-am-270-digital-multimeter/?action=dlattach;attach=16622;imageI have a Greenlee DM-820 and included a picture of mine. Yes there are differences. Mine came with pre-blown fuses (seller tried to pull a fast one on me).

author: tld
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 10:12:39 am
content: Another shootout would be appreciated. While I don't have a full list, I'd like to just quickly mention two things.First is that the basic question most seem to have is something along the lines of:"If I were to buy a multimeter, that's not crap, and I won't regret not shelling out an extra couple of bucks to get a better one, which should I buy?", or perhaps "Without compromising, which multimeter offers the best value for money, and doesn't miss anything I'll miss?", or even "What can I buy without regretting? Either because I needlessly spent too much, or miss features or quality".I think people are looking for an answer to that kind of question, and that's probably more important to them than which exact price-point they find their answer at.Could be worthwhile to get a bit loose on the $100-mark, both up and down?When that's said, I'd like to mention the Uni-T UT61E. It seems to be that a lot of people have it, and are happy with it. Perhaps more so than any other single sub-$100 multimeter. If nothing else, that does make it a bit of a benchmark, and it could be interesting to see it included in the test. Call it a reference if you'd like.Also, I'm betting a lot of people *will* follow your words, both wisely and otherwise.(and I'm betting you won't bet against it... recurse that if you'd like...)For that reason as well, including the UT61E would be interesting. I'd hate to see droves of people rush off to get a $100 meter, if they'd be happy with a $50-ish one, or buy a single $100 meter, when they'd be better off with two $50 ones.(disclaimer; I do own a UT61E as well, but that's not why I'd like to see it included. Sure, it's always fun to see reviews of stuff you bought, but I'm looking specifically for something different for my next one, so I'm not asking for me, I'm asking because it's a pretty decent choice for your first decent-quality meter. Personally I'd like backlight and a couple of other things though).tld

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 01:24:59 pm
content: For those interested, the Brymen DM867/869A models are also branded as Extech (MM560A/570A respectively) as well as the Greenlee models listed in another thread. Might be worth considering for the $200+ category IMHO, if Dave decides to go this route.Hope this helps anyone that's interested.

author: mariush
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 01:47:28 pm
content: I second what tld says in regard to Uni-T 61E.I have it, I may be a bit biased, but anyway.Perhaps the price cutoff is a bit incorrect. Maybe the cutoff should be around $75 and $150. The dollar is not as "valuable" as it was in the last test.If you put a meter like the $55-60 Uni-t 61E in comparison to any $50 meter, it will probably win, but put it in contest with meters up to $100, it may not be noticed (the more expensive ones having better protection etc).Also, I realize you don't have so much time anymore but I'd really rather you make a thorough review instead of 1 minute teardown and all that, like you said. I don't know, make it a two part or a three part?A lot of people will point other people to these videos as guides for buying a proper meter and I'd rather see quality and in-depth analysis than something rushed.

author: Spawn
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 04:50:23 pm
content: Quote from: nanofrog on January 17, 2013, 01:24:59 pmNice you mentioned that, I am getting a MM570A from Extech it is already shipped out from US to me after this:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/teardown-extech-ex570-my-first-but-also-last-extech/I have high expectations about this meter, so we will see how it is.

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 05:43:01 pm
content: One item missed in the poll, clamp meters!I think that if a $100 shootout is going to be done then out of all the Brymens and Brymen "rebrands" then the Amprobe AM-270 is the right price for many people. The Brymens with the same specs go much higher than $100.If a $200+ shootout is going to happen then the Brymen BM86X has been discussed very much already and reviewed in detail by Martin Lorton. In that case it might be useful to review the BM857a as another model in a more traditional shape. I was thinking specifically for a $200-$300 range for that shootout because there are a few real alternatives to the $400+ Flukes and Agilents.If you do a $200+ shootout:Brymen BM869, or BM857a, Ignore the Greenlee and other rebrands as they cost 2x -3x as muchUEi DM397Extech EX570A (leaves a bad taste in my mouth right now even suggesting Extech)Any Agilent that fits the priceAny Fluke that fits the priceIn any case it might also be a good idea to review/inspect and comment on each meter's compliance to its labelled CAT ratings and the safest limit of use of the meter based on its actual construction regardless of its rating.

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 06:32:08 pm
content: Quote from: nanofrog on January 17, 2013, 01:24:59 pmCorrection. The BM85X series is the equivalent of the Extech MM560A/570A, but the prices are certainly not equivalent!

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 08:11:26 pm
content: Quote from: mariush on January 17, 2013, 01:47:28 pmIt would not be rushed, in fact it might take me longer to do a shorted video. It would just be a lot more concise and better edited.Dave.

author: tld
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 11:17:00 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 17, 2013, 08:11:26 pmWhile quality-mindedness is usually a good thing, keep in mind that a lot of your viewers are used to having our Australian meat served fairly raw. Trimming the fat can be a good thing, but serving things up overcooked and pre-chewed isn't really required with your target audience. It's even the subscript from your very own title-banner: "An off-the-cuff video blog... ".I'm sorry if this comes off as me trying to run off with the directors chair, that's really not my intention, but if you're bogging yourself down with chores (too much editing) on our account, when we like the off-the-cuff-format, then you might be trying to solve a problem you don't have.You bring a certain enthusiasm, and the surest way to kill that is to turn this - whatever it is - into a chore for yourself.tld

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 17, 2013, 11:57:25 pm
content: Quote from: tld on January 17, 2013, 11:17:00 pmIt's always going to be "off the cuff". I don't really know what I'm going to say until I hit record. That can't change, as I don't know how to do anything different.Regardless of how I do it, the editing work is the same. The last shootout IIRC had over 200 individual clips.But there can be differences in say making a conscious decision from the start to keep the length down. Then it's just some simple pre-shoot math:I have 5 meters, I have 5 different things I want to talk about that need personal commentary (e.g. teardown, look'n'feel), then if I limit myself to 1min max per meter per topic, that's 25 minutes of the episode blown right there. Then there might be say 10 other things I want to test/demo, but that can be all done together. Limit that to say 2 minutes per thing across all meters, that's another 20 minutes there. Toss in a 5min summary, and that's a 50min video. About the max I'd want.So if I knew I had only one minute to describe the teardown, then I'd be sure to think about a bit more than I usually would, and try to keep it concise.Now, if I didn't do those calcs at the start, then it would almost certainly get out of hand, and I'd end up with 2 hours of footage (not uncommon) which then I have to try and heavily edit down. Then is comes across as missing stuff, and leaving out stuff, and generally quite messy. I'e generally been trying to that lately, taking out umm's and redundant waffle etc, and some people have noticed the editing being a lot more choppy. But I think that's better than a longer video.Dave.

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 18, 2013, 12:02:35 am
content: Dave:I will also make an offer to contribute. If you remember this page I linked to a long time ago in a post:http://www.johannes-bauer.com/electronics/mmcomparison/app/index.htmlIt is a page to compare errors in measurements that a multimeter can have over its operating range based on its specifications. Once you have the meters rounded up for the shootout I will enter all the specs for the meters and provide images of the comparison charts for you to link to or use in the reviews or here on the forum. It is very interesting to see how creative marketing people can be in the specs to make things look better than they are.

author: jnd
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 18, 2013, 12:03:19 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 17, 2013, 11:57:25 pmI don't mind some chopper stabilized Dave which doesn't drift so much with ummmmmsI noticed some rough edges but it's not that bad, I'll happily trade that for shorter run time.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 18, 2013, 12:08:39 am
content: Quote from: Spawn on January 17, 2013, 04:50:23 pmAt least it's not made by CEM, so that might be a good thing.WhatMJLortonshowed of the BM867's internals in his review, it looked rather decent IMHO.Hope to see your posts on it after going through it, as I'm seriously considering one of these myself, or the older 857/9 models if I can find it at a good price (have a line on an 857, so I'm trying to do my research quickly before I miss the chance).Quote from: Lightages on January 17, 2013, 05:43:01 pmUnfortunately, Brymen labeled units may not be an option. For example, I've not been able to locate a vendor based in the US (not eBay listings), so to get one from a US source, it's either Extech or Greenlee and pay the premium it seems. Which could take some of the value out of the units (or a lot, depending on what Brymen can be had for).Between the two, the Greenlee is easier to read IMHO (don't care for the legend graphics on the Extech branded units nearly as much).Sent an email towww.tme.euas they actually sell the Brymen labeled unit to see if it's cheaper to import one, but haven't heard back yet. BTW, their price comes to ~$200USD (BM869A), assuming the indicated price includes VAT. If not, it goes up to ~ $250. Still cheaper than the Greenlee, but probably not by much once shipping is tacked on (seen the Greenlee version for $312).Quote from: Lightages on January 17, 2013, 06:32:08 pmHow so?I ask, as the BM557/9 seem to be older models from what I can tell. Similar guts as per features and specs, but in a different case (rectangular without any narrowing through the grip area as the BM867/9A's do). I have the spec sheets on all of them, and will spend more time to see what may have been updated/changed.Not that that may be absolutely critical, but the BM85xA series doesn't appear to be 100% identical to the Greenlee and Extech rebrands as the BM86xA series are (save protector color and silk screen). Unless you're referring to other Greenlee or Extech models (not the MM560A or MM570A for example)?Personally, I'm willing to consider the BM85x models if I can find them, and assuming they're at the right price (haven't located a BM859A yet).

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 18, 2013, 12:28:54 am
content: I have purchased my BM869 from TME, but I did not have a very smooth ride with them. In the end all has worked out so I will give them another chance should I see something they have and I cannot get easily elsewhere.Extech MM570A from testequipmentdepot.comhttp://www.testequipmentdepot.com/extech/multimeters/mm570a.htm$330USD plus shippingBrymen BM859CFA:http://www.tme.eu/en/Document/3fb09a90418ec420315501d9d2f44376/BM859cf.pdf$250USD plus shippingas examples these two meters are not identical but so close they must be the same meter. The price difference is obvious. If you live in the US, then it might be equal or not too much more expensive to get the rebrands but here in Chile everything is imported so shipping is the constant for me on anything. In my case a shipment from Europe is the same as shipping from North America so the Brymen was much less expensive.BM869 from TME was $240USD, and a Greenlee equivalent DM860A seems to be going as low as $350USD as far as I have been able to find so far.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 18, 2013, 12:53:08 am
content: Quote from: Lightages on January 18, 2013, 12:28:54 amI still need to see what changed, but I'm by no means opposed to the older models.Especially if the price is right.Importing usually gets expensive, so I'd have gone the same route you did in your situation. Strongly looking like I'll grab a BM857 tonight (price is extremely tempting, but I don't want to leap too quickly and make a mistake as there's a "no returns" condition tied to it).

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 18, 2013, 12:59:06 am
content: The 857 does not have temperature and compared to the 869 which has 12kV transient protection the 857 has "only" 8kV.The 857 is only single display compared to dual display of the 869.Just some fine points on the differences.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 18, 2013, 01:40:17 am
content: Quote from: Lightages on January 18, 2013, 12:59:06 amThanks.Picked up on those. Also the x69 models have 1kV fuses rather than 600V units in the x57 models. Not a huge issue, but the additional protection isn't a bad idea IMHO.Backlight on the newer models appears to be better as well, but none of this kills it for me. I'd much prefer the dual display, but not if I have to add well over $100 to get it.My U1252B has that, as well as most, if not all of the missing functions.Spec wise, the 857 & 867 are nearly identical, though the 857 has a slight edge here and there. But not by a lot. Having problems with one of my other meters, so I could use a replacement. So I have an excuse to get one, and I tend to upgrade when I can. This one would definitely be an upgrade by comparison...

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 18, 2013, 02:48:53 am
content: Quote from: nanofrog on January 17, 2013, 01:24:59 pmMade a mistake here.The Greenlee DM-860A is the newer BM869, but the Extech's are the older BM857/9 series (MM560A & MM570A respectively). Very similar as to features and specs, but there are differences. Dual Display being the most obvious.BTW, just snagged a BM857A off of eBay as the price was way too good to pass up.

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 18, 2013, 04:28:32 am
content: That is what I have been trying to tell you. An that is why I was interested in seeing the older model compared in a shootout to see what the differences might be for the older and possibly better buys.So Dave, are you considering doing a shootout still with clamp meters? Do you want the reading error comparison graphs for whatever shootout you do intend to do?

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 18, 2013, 04:50:49 am
content: Quote from: Lightages on January 18, 2013, 04:28:32 amIt wasn't that clear at that time (frantically scouring the specs between the 4 models so I didn't miss a BM857 on eBay before it expired/was sold), that I hadn't paid enough attention to the Extech's physical appearance. Soft keys were another dead giveaway.Snagged it for $70 though.Given that the older series is still around, I agree it would make for a good comparison between the models based on value. Just not sure ifbothshould be part of a shoot-out though.I say this, as it could be argued that doing so would take a spot from something else, as Dave will probably be overwhelmed putting it together if there's too many.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 18, 2013, 05:28:02 am
content: Quote from: nanofrog on January 18, 2013, 04:50:49 amYep, I'd limit it to an arbitrary 5.More just gets too much.Dave.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 18, 2013, 05:28:55 am
content: Quote from: Lightages on January 18, 2013, 04:28:32 amI don't recall ever considering a clamp meter shootout.Dave.

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 18, 2013, 06:29:51 am
content: OK, must have been my imagination.

author: AlfBaz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 18, 2013, 01:35:56 pm
content: I know these would be hard to obtain but I'd be happy with a verbal roundup of high end precision meters, bench and portable in the $1000-$2000 range

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 19, 2013, 09:24:14 pm
content: From the poll so far it looks like people either want another $100 shootout, or an expensive shootout. Any 5-1/2 meter is going to cost more than $200 so you could almost put those two votes together. The 500000 count meters might be considered in the 5-1/2 digit class although they really aren't in the spirit of the poll I guess.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 19, 2013, 09:51:18 pm
content: Quote from: AlfBaz on January 18, 2013, 01:35:56 pmThere might be a (new) benchtop meter coming soon for review.Dave.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 19, 2013, 09:53:08 pm
content: Quote from: Lightages on January 19, 2013, 09:24:14 pmYep, agreed.So do we have a definitive list yet?Dave.

author: AlfBaz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 12:33:34 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 19, 2013, 09:51:18 pmYou seemed to have coined the phrase "Electronic Porn"What's this then, foreplay? O0

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 12:34:14 am
content: Amprobe AM-160 $270 big brother to the AM-140 already reviewed here on the forumsBrymen BM869 or BM869CFA or Extech MM560A or MM570 $250+ the 869 has been covered before but without video and proper teardown, the Extechs are basically rebrands of the Brymen BM85X series but people have mentioned the MM570A before in suggestions for videos hereUEi DM397 $250 never been seen in a review but seems to be a great value!Fluke 179 $300 a good comparison from "the industry standard"Extech EX570 $250 after your other Extech fiascoes and the one still ongoing, it would be nice to see if you get another good one or bad one and if it is actually a good meter.The above would be my list for $200+ meters.And if you want to blow the wad on a "way out there" comparison:Hioki DT4282 $500 but I doubt many people here would have any actual interest in buying one but would be interested in seeing one reviewed.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 07:29:19 am
content: Quote from: Lightages on January 20, 2013, 12:34:14 amThe Agilent U1242B would have to be in that list.I wouldn't bother with the Fluke 179, it's really an electrical meter.Dave.

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 07:42:34 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 20, 2013, 07:29:19 amSounds good to me.Looks like you have a good list of 5 now.....

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 08:02:50 am
content: Quote from: Lightages on January 20, 2013, 07:42:34 amThat's the $200 list. The poll says most want the $100 shootout!Dave.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 08:21:42 am
content: Quote from: Lightages on January 20, 2013, 12:34:14 amThe AM-160 is also rebaged Brymen. So only one of those 3. That leaves another slot available...Dave.

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 08:33:28 am
content: Dave never reviewed the UNI-T UT71E. It could be included in the 200$ shoot-out, selling for about 170$ at the moment and still attracting a fair amount of interest.

author: PA4TIM
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 08:39:27 am
content: I have no wishes about wich meter , i have over 35 upto 7,5 digits so i can do my own shoot out if i want to, but I have a few suggestions.I think your shootouts are much used before buying a meter, it is good you look at things like fuses, safety, inserted screws ext but I miss the most important things. You buy a meter to measure so it would be cool to know if they do that decent.- change battery for bench supply and hook meter to voltagestandard and lower psu output to emulate a empty battery and if it affect readings- test resistance mesasuring a 1 Ohm and a 10K and 10M and 100M- input resistance ( i know a guy who asked advise after he bought a Fluke electriciens model to use for repairing tube amps, that was a waist of money (only low Z 110 or 114 can not remember)- tempco, what does it to at 20 degrees and what at 35 degrees ( must be easy in australia, measure indoor and outdoor)These are typical things that seperate the boys from the men. And this I would like to know when I buy a meter.I see to many tear downs here ( from users ) that do not include a true performance test. And then you get conclusions like the Mastech LCR meter is the same as the IET DE5000 because it looks like they use the same chipset based on nothing other then looks. But nobody mentions that accuracy is different, powersupply demants are different, it has no autopower off ect.

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 08:56:55 am
content: Unisource DM-931 $110Amprobe AM-270 $90Agilent U1231A $100BRYMEN BM815A $107Fluke 17B $100Extech MM570A at $330 or Brymen BM869CF at $260UEi DM397 $250Agilent U1242B $250Ideal 61-486 $210TPI 194 $250and of course if you want to swap in a UT71E for one of the others as suggested.My last shot at a list or two for these ranges of price and type. It is a bit of a pain selecting things for a good spread on a review isn't it?

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 09:02:08 am
content: Quote from: Lightages on January 20, 2013, 08:56:55 amThe Agilent doesn't have a mA range, so I''d rule it out.The Unit-T 71E is too far over $100Dave.

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 09:09:24 am
content: The UT71E was for the $200 range although not really above $200.If you want to through a Uni-T into the $100 fray, the n the UT71A for $115?

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 09:11:32 am
content: Maybe, the UNI-T UT71C then, as it can be bought for 120$, plus shipping of course.http://www.ebay.com/itm/Barnd-New-UNI-T-Intelligent-Digital-Multimeters-UT71C-/260824511145?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cba5a32a9It has the same features as the 71E, only lacking the power measurement function.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 09:13:41 am
content: Quote from: Lightages on January 20, 2013, 09:09:24 amI'd get lynched by the Uni-T fanboys if I didn't include one!The 71C is >$130 here. Too much over the the other meters?Dave.

author: iloveelectronics
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 09:26:29 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 20, 2013, 09:13:41 amPerhaps just throw the very popular UT61E into the $100 mix?

author: blackknife
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 09:28:58 am
content: Include also the "Prova 903 multimeter" !

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 09:34:03 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 20, 2013, 09:13:41 amGo for the 71A or 71B then, if you can get one for less in Oz. Same meter really, just lower count mainly.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 11:15:51 am
content: Quote from: iloveelectronics on January 20, 2013, 09:26:29 amPossibly, but it's more like a killer $50 meter really.I hate Uni-T, so many bloody options.The UT71A and UT71B are in the $110 price range in Oz, but wildly different specs.I chose the "wrong" Uni-T in the old $100 shootout and have been copping flack fr that ever since!Dave.

author: firewalker
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 11:30:50 am
content: Ask the companies directly. "What is your 100 $ DMM".Alexander.

author: tld
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 12:44:49 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 20, 2013, 11:15:51 amSo many bloody options, and *none* of them get it entirely right. Want backlight? Then you have to give up something else you'd like, etc.You'd think that when they put out a new model, they'd at least try to fix what's lacking with the previous, but not Uni-T.Anyway, the UT61E would probably serve you well as a "baseline" in the test, something for the others to exceed. It'd also provide a shared point of reference with the viewers, a lot of which seem to have it. There's a ton of reviews and teardowns as well, for those that might not.If you draw up the other meters on a scale (not necessarily literally), a shared point of reference will make the scale a lot more valuable.The other two videos ($50 and $100 shootout), have been somewhat of a go-to-thing for a lot of people, and they were how I found eevblog in the first place. Someone mentioned them on IRC when I was asking about a meter, or some such thing. Including a common point of reference, and what seems to be the most discussed and considered meter, would surely fit in such a picture.Could be worthwhile even if you'd have to do 5 $100 meters, plus the baseline?Other than that, there seems to be a lot of OEMing, rebranding and that kind of thing going on. I think the video would do well to not end as a review of two models of one model, three of another, but rather aim for unique designs. I haven't been able to keep up, so I have little to offer on which are rebrandings of others. :/(feels like I ask, but cat't offer, but... )Anyway, I'm glad you're doing this, and looking forward to the video.tld

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 01:00:01 pm
content: The Uni-T UT71 range is not fragmented like the UT61 variants.All the features found on the A model are carried throughout the range.Need temperature, higher accuracy or internal data logging (100 points)? Go for B model or higherNeed better accuracy still and higher count? Go for C model or higher (40,000 count)Need large memory internal data logging? Go for D model (10,000 points)Need power measurement function? Go for E modelQuite a logical progression and cost effectiveness according to one's needs.

author: tld
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2013, 01:03:26 pm
content: Quote from: Wytnucls on January 20, 2013, 01:00:01 pmSounds better range/feature-wise, but isn't the UT71 "known bad"?(I'm asking because I don't know, just seems to be claimed when discussion pops up around it on the interwebs).If it's "known bad", it might not make a good choice to include in the test, at least not for a baseline like the UT61E could be.If I'm just mistaken (which I hope), then it could be very interesting indeed.(I suppose both would be nice, but I'm not betting on Dave turning it into a Uni-T shootout.)tld

author: tld
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 08:05:42 am
content: Quote from: tld on January 20, 2013, 01:03:26 pmIf nothing else, then for the archive...This might have been my bad. I got a bit curious, worried that I might have spoken too soon, and it turns out there are several favorable reviews of the UT71-series, with some bad comments about the UT71E-model specifically. When I tracked down the references I vaguely recalled, they all seem to be from one user here on the forum:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/review-uni-t-ut81b-scopemeter/https://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/which-dmm/https://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/anyone-ever-use-any-of-the-uni-t-lcr-meters-any-internal-pics/Maybe differences between models, many be was extra unlucky with his, I don't know.Just figured I should add some balance to my previous comment, sorry about that one guys.tld

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 09:08:28 am
content: Well, the UT71 is certainly not perfect.The main criticism has been about its weak input protection and rightly so.Apart from that, it is just a normal multimeter, with an all-in DMM ADC and a microcontroller.Its accuracy is within the published specifications, garanteed for one year. Like any meter, it should be calibrated on a regular basis after that time period.A few vocal individuals have had issues with the cheap meters they bought on line, venting their frustration on blogs and YouTube, instead of sending their meters to a UNI-T repair center.One ignorant individual, with buyer's remorse, made some negative videos about perceived flaws with his meter, which didn't exist.I guess one seldom hears from happy customers.I own two of them and never regretted buying them, to the contrary. I do use them mostly as bench meters.If one needs a meter for regular work on high power circuits, there certainly are better options out there.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 09:23:16 am
content: Quote from: Wytnucls on January 25, 2013, 09:08:28 amGot a link for that?QuoteNot so, plenty of Uni-T and other cheap meter fanboys spruiking on here for example.People just remember the negative stuff more.Dave.

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 09:55:46 am
content: Here is one video:You can find the others by searching for UT71.About happy customers, I was thinking of the UT71 owners in particular.I only know of a couple of them on your blog. There should be more, but they seem to keep a low profile or perhaps few people here, actually own this meter.Yes, I know, there are plenty of 61E fanboys here.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 10:18:52 am
content: HEADS UP:I've contacted Brymen and they are happy to send me the BM869 and BM857a for review. And for the $100 price bracket I suggested the BM815A, but they suggested the BM255 instead.Thoughts?Get your opinions in before I hit reply...Dave.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 10:40:27 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 25, 2013, 10:18:52 amAlthough it seems to be an older model, I'd probably be prone to consider the MB817A as it has a bit of an edge spec wise at a quick glance, including safety.

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 10:44:02 am
content: BM255: 6000 count and not even True RMS for 100$. They must have something better than that surely!

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 10:47:23 am
content: Quote from: Wytnucls on January 25, 2013, 10:44:02 amI'd at least go the BM257 which is slightly over $100 and True RMS.Dave.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 10:56:11 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 25, 2013, 10:47:23 amHow much over the magic $100 figure would you be willing to consider for a meter that's worth it (= excellent value for the few extra clams)?

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 10:56:45 am
content: The BM257 is a better contender, but for the 6000 count, with no high res mode. If there is nothing else with a higher count, that one should do.

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 11:05:07 am
content: Difficult question.If you need a firm cut-off point, I would venture 10% above threshold. Any higher figure would probably open up the competition to more expensive meters and make the restricted comparison meaningless.

author: Bored@Work
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 11:16:54 am
content: Quote from: Wytnucls on January 25, 2013, 09:08:28 amFrom Europe? Where is the nearest repair center? Somewhere around half the world in Asia? And maybe some day Uni-T will even provide the information on their web site that they have repair centers at all. And heaven forbid, maybe some day they they will manage to even provide their location and contact information.But as long as they don't tell their users that they have these repair centers, they aren't of much use.So they end up with pissed users who have no reasonable means to sort out an issue with a Uni-T product. And that is not the fault of the user.(But heaven forbid you suggest that people should not buy their unsupported, unsafe stuff ...)

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 11:24:36 am
content: Quote from: nanofrog on January 25, 2013, 10:40:27 amYes, better specs, and input protection, 60ohm range, but compared to the BM257 the BM817A is :- bigger- Maybe not UL listed? (I'd trust a UL listed meter with lesser CAT than a higher CAT with no UL testing)- No NCV EF tester- $15 more, putting it a fair way outside the $100 limit.Dave.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 11:33:12 am
content: Quote from: Wytnucls on January 25, 2013, 11:05:07 amLet me offer up an example of why I asked;I can get a UEi DM391 for $100, and the DM393 for $135 from the same vendor (just for comparison's sake, as the DM391 made the cut in the last $100 shootout). That seems about the going rate to add TRMS features to what is otherwise the same meter IIRC, and is outside of the 10% threshold you propose.Quote from: EEVblog on January 25, 2013, 11:24:36 amI was paying more attention to the fuse and transient values than the CAT ratings, given the CAT Fail thread (600V fuses & 8kV transient values for the BM817 instead of 500V & 6kV for the BM255).Given the underrated fuses vs. CAT ratings that have been seen, do you think the UL compliance testing claims are genuine?

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 11:34:35 am
content: Quote from: Bored@Work on January 25, 2013, 11:16:54 amUNI-T has partners in Europe (Conrad) and in the States (Tenma) with local warranty and repair centers.Instead of buying from these companies, most people go for the cheap option of buying directly from online sellers in China, often with no warranty at all and then complain when something goes awry.Regardless, all the UNI-T contact information is on their site, on the multimeter box, the DMM manual and the warranty card.They are very responsive and will advise you on the best course of action within a few days.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 11:37:48 am
content: Quote from: Wytnucls on January 25, 2013, 10:56:45 amI don't think Brymen have another suitable higher count meter near the $100 mark.The BM257 is about US$110 in EU conversion:http://www.tme.eu/en/katalog/digital-multimeters_112609/#id_category=112609&s_field=artykul&s_order=ASC&visible_params=2%2C1785%2C1786%2C1787%2C1799%2C55%2C1790%2C72%2C1794%2C1747%2C1796%2C1803%2C845&used_params=2%3A45315%3B(good price comparison list)But really, the $100 price category I think is not about the best accuracy or count for the price, but more about the best safety and build quality, and a few extra features features. i.e. that "step up" from the $50 cheapies.Dave.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 11:43:51 am
content: Quote from: nanofrog on January 25, 2013, 11:33:12 amBrymen have been in the game a long time, and make reputable (albeit low cost) meters. If they stamp US UL listed on the front, then yes, I'd trust that they have sent it to UL and it been tested and has passed that claimed ratings.Dave.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 12:06:10 pm
content: So the current $100 list is looking like:- Fluke 17 AU$102 (because it's a Fluke)- Uni-T UT71A AU$109 (the wizz-bang multi display 20,000 count, USB etc)- Brymen BM257 AU$129 (solid, small, UL listed, good brand meter)As definites.- Amprobe AM-270 AU$127 (but it's just a rebadged and repackaged Brymen BM815)- Slot open? An Extech? or other brand?Dave.

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 12:28:40 pm
content: An Extech would make sense, an EX430 perhaps (4000 count True RMS)?

author: firewalker
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 12:41:26 pm
content: Any BK-precision? Or something less known? Like Benning (I discover this searching ebay.de) or so.http://de.benning.de/en/corporate/products-services/testing-measuring-and-safety-instruments.htmlAlexander.

author: blackknife
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 25, 2013, 04:53:15 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 25, 2013, 12:06:10 pmThis one retails for only 129$ and has pretty impressive specs...http://www.nsiteck.com/tes-prova-801-803-digital-multi-meter.html

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 26, 2013, 12:07:14 am
content: I'd go for the BM257.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 26, 2013, 12:39:44 am
content: Quote from: blackknife on January 25, 2013, 04:53:15 pmThat one is $260 on ebay from Hong Kong. What's up with the $129 price? sounds too good to be true...Dave.

author: Spawn
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 26, 2013, 04:27:14 am
content: It is little bit pity that Agilent U1231A don’t have mA range like you said Dave, I was looking for a Agilent for my collection and a lower priced one was a good to start with.I got little bad taste of Extech after what I have seen with the meters I got from them, but maybe Dave can change that with a new one.Maybe a brand which people see as junk and need to prove itself like Mastech?Mastech MS8218Or Mastech-MS8228http://www.getprice.com.au/Mastech-MS8228-Autorange-Digital-With-Back-Light-Gpnc_501--67649965.htm

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 07, 2013, 10:55:36 pm
content: The Brymens have arrived.https://twitter.com/eevblog/status/299648739138732032/photo/1and I present to you, a nomination for the worst backlight in historyDave.

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2013, 11:21:34 pm
content: Well, glow worms are really energy efficient.Not sure what they feed on though...green solder mask?

author: Spawn
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2013, 11:33:41 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on February 07, 2013, 10:55:36 pmIsn’t it hideous? That’s first thing I thought when I saw those on my rebadged Brymen. Those 4 lights give some depth in dark it is really weird to see and the digits fade because of it.

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2013, 11:36:01 pm
content: Where is the UT71A?

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 07, 2013, 11:38:26 pm
content: The UT71A is shaking in the corner......Seriously, it will be interesting to hear your thoughts on the Brymens. I can already see a big "FAIL" coming for that BM857 at some point

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2013, 11:40:41 pm
content: NOT SHAKING...JUST WARMING UP FOR THE FIGHT! %-B

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2013, 08:02:58 am
content: Backlight on the BM857A is rather poor, but the viewing angle is also fairly limited. So if you're looking at it sideways, forget it.FWIW, another thing to be careful with, is the fuses don't meet the CAT ratings in mine (CAT is 600V, and they used 500V fuses). Not the end of the world, and they can be upgraded with the correct fuses (just need the correct fuse clips soldered in). Rebranded versions may not have this issue (IIRC, the Extech MM560A comes with 600V fuses, which I presume was per Extech's request).

author: firewalker
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2013, 08:08:10 am
content: Any Amprobe on the list? Eg AM-270.Alexander.

author: dr_p
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 08, 2013, 09:40:22 am
content: Quote from: firewalker on February 08, 2013, 08:08:10 amQuote from: EEVblog on January 25, 2013, 12:06:10 pm

author: justanothercanuck
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2013, 11:21:37 am
content: Hey Dave, if you're doing another ~$100 shootout, how about the Extech ex430?edit: seems like I'm a page late.

author: metRo_
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 16, 2013, 06:42:26 pm
content: Will be any sub 50$ shootout? Thanks

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 19, 2013, 11:04:41 am
content: Quote from: metRo_ on February 16, 2013, 06:42:26 pmNope, they aren't worth arguing over.Dave.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 19, 2013, 12:04:37 pm
content: The UT71A is on the way.Still looking for some others.The Mastech MS8228 seems like a choice for a "cheapie" in terms of specs, paying for the wanky IR thermometer obviously.Dave.

author: iloveelectronics
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2013, 12:28:54 pm
content: So which meters exactly can we expect to see in the new shootout? Would you be interested to have a look at the Brymen BM-521? It belongs in the $200+ price range. I'm happy to send you one for review/shootout if you are interested (and have the time for it).Quote from: EEVblog on February 19, 2013, 12:04:37 pm

author: Spawn
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2013, 03:55:47 pm
content: You want two more Dave?You got most big players at the moment, Agilent doesn’t have one in that price range with mA range as we said before.Extech, you cover that with Brymen any other rebadged CEM is at the moment doing bad because of the craftsmanship but can be proved wrong of course if you have a good one in your hands.You are right about my suggestion with Mastech MS8228, it does look cheap but you never know, I am still eager to see a meter with a build in IR after my Extech EX570 fiasco but it is a lot more than 100 dollar range, and if I am only one, that won’t be fair to other guys with their suggestions earlier in the topic.What other good brands are left? UEI and Sanwa maybe

author: arekm
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 19, 2013, 04:22:00 pm
content: sanwa pc5000, sanwa pc7000

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 19, 2013, 08:01:01 pm
content: Yeah, you could include the Mastech MS8228, and maybe a KYORITSU KEW1011. I bet no one has seen the insides of one of those. I am pretty sure this one is not worth looking at but there is also a TPI 163 for around $100.Maybe the TPI 194 is worth looking at in the $200+ range.

author: retiredcaps
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2013, 08:39:42 pm
content: Quote from: Lightages on February 19, 2013, 08:01:01 pmThe outside case sure looks like the Elenco M-2625 that Dave reviewed in the $50 shootout. The Tekpower TP4000ZC also looks similar which Martin reviewed.Obviously the specs and features are different between the 3, but I wonder what ODM/OEM relationship might exist when the outside case/buttons have similarities.

author: ddavidebor
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2013, 08:47:28 pm
content: hi davei'm recently looking at this uni-t meterhttp://www.goodluckbuy.com/uni-t-ut70d-modern-digital-multi-purpose-meters-.html80.000 count for 130$, or ut70c is 40.000 for 110$... there's a topic on italso, this mastech meter looks pretty ruggedhttp://www.goodluckbuy.com/mastech-ms8229-5-in-1-autorange-digital-multimeter-with-alarm.htmland, finally, two mastech identical to uni-t ut61ehttp://www.goodluckbuy.com/mastech-ms8226t-true-rms-auto-ranging-dmm-digital-multimeter.htmlhttp://www.goodluckbuy.com/mastech-ms8226-digital-multimeters.html

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 19, 2013, 09:44:08 pm
content: Quote from: iloveelectronics on February 19, 2013, 12:28:54 pmThe list has been posted:- Fluke 17 AU$102 (because it's a Fluke)- Uni-T UT71A AU$109 (the wizz-bang multi display 20,000 count, USB etc)- Brymen BM257 AU$129 (solid, small, UL listed, good brand meter)As definites.Now maybe Mastech MS8228And I need one or two other choices.Dave.

author: ddavidebor
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2013, 09:49:29 pm
content: What about to test leads with an insulation tester?

author: KuchateK
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2013, 10:25:40 pm
content: Amprobe AM-270 would be nice. Brymen is not easy to get.

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 19, 2013, 10:36:45 pm
content: Actually the Brymen BM257 is VERY easy to get. Just contact iloveelectronics here on the forum and it will be shipped to you for $135 including shipping.I would also like to see the Amprobe AM-270 included but Dave does not want to do another re-branded Brymen against the BM257 in the shootout. The AM-270 is less expensive and has better specs but is only easily available to the US or from a retailer that ships world wide from the US for $40 for so in shipping.I really would like to see that KYORITSU KEW1011 included as it is not very well known in our circles here.

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2013, 10:58:02 pm
content: Shouldn't an Extech or CEM be part of the line-up?

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 19, 2013, 11:05:59 pm
content: Or should you say "shouldn't an Extech or CEM fall apart in the lineup?"

author: Spawn
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2013, 11:22:47 pm
content: Quote from: Lightages on February 19, 2013, 11:05:59 pmman that was good hahaha!

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 19, 2013, 11:50:31 pm
content: Well, if that is the way the cookie crumbles, so be it. At least, they would have had a fighting chance to redeem themselves.Based on my own experience with CEM, I don't have much hope.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 20, 2013, 01:02:53 am
content: Quote from: Wytnucls on February 19, 2013, 10:58:02 pmWhy not, which one?Dave.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 20, 2013, 01:09:27 am
content: Quote from: KuchateK on February 19, 2013, 10:25:40 pmAlthough the Amprobe is just a re-badged Brymen BM817, maybe it makes sense to include it because it is actually another major brand, and does fit into the line-up nicely in terms of bang-per-buck and availability?It's getting slim picking now...Dave.

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2013, 01:21:32 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on February 20, 2013, 01:02:53 amThis one seems to fit the bill: CEM DT9927T 6000 count, True RMS.There is also a similar 9938T 22,000 count True RMS, but it could be too expensive though.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 20, 2013, 01:34:22 am
content: Quote from: Wytnucls on February 20, 2013, 01:21:32 amThat looks hard to get.It's also an Extech EX520, but that's about $150 or so. The Extech 400 series is more in the price bracket.Dave.

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2013, 01:48:51 am
content: Wow, so expensive. The Extech 430 has the required features and fits in the price bracket too, I think.http://www.ebay.com/itm/Extech-Professional-Multimeter-Model-EX430-/290812487061?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item43b5c66595

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 20, 2013, 02:05:25 am
content: We have already seen Extechs twice, once in the $50 and once in the $100 shootouts. Extech/CEM/Majortech have been reviewed many times on this forum and on mjlorton's and have always disappointed except for the one EX330 Dave reviewed in the $50 shootout. Let's have something different like the KYORITSU KEW1011. It is available at tme.eu, and at storeinifinity.com for around $100.IMHO including an Extech again seems to validate their existence and excludes other possible candidates.

author: mariush
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2013, 04:24:48 am
content: I was checking test equipment depot's site after today's video (with the hp bench dmm) and noticed a few that might fit the 100$ categorySperry DM6650T True RMS 10 Function Digital Multimeter 108$http://www.testequipmentdepot.com/sperry-instruments/multimeters/dm6650t.htmThis one I also see it's at walmart and sears and amazon and doesn't look that great with only 4000 count and 0.8% precision on dc v for exampleMegger AVO410 True RMS Digital Multimeter 128$http://www.testequipmentdepot.com/megger/multimeters/avo410.htmA bit expensive but looks like it has nice probes, isolated serial out, cat iv 600v, 6000 counts BUT worringly only 1.5 updates per secondHioki 3256-50 150$http://www.testequipmentdepot.com/hioki/multimeters/3256.htmeven more expensive but apparently industrial grade, has locking mechanism for currentHave you tried contacting companies like TED (short for the one I linked) to see if they'd be willing to give you a few for review?I understand you want a limited number of meters because you don't have as much time as before.If it's also an issue of money, have you considered something like asking people to donate small amounts of money and then pick a person's name from a hat and give one of the meters to that person?I'd be happy to give about $10 - with 15 people you have the price of a meter incl. the shipping.

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2013, 04:38:44 am
content: The Sperry is custom made by UNI-T to Sperry's lowly specifications, using a UT-71 shell. 4000 count only.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 20, 2013, 04:47:46 am
content: The Megger looks suspiciously like an IDEAL?Dave.

author: ddavidebor
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2013, 06:54:59 am
content: *wrong post

author: retiredcaps
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2013, 07:12:15 am
content: Quote from: Wytnucls on February 20, 2013, 04:38:44 amCorrect. I had the Sperry 6600 (the non True RMS version) and it was clearly made by Uni-T. I think I might have a photo of the internals somewhere.

author: retiredcaps
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2013, 07:15:23 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on February 20, 2013, 04:47:46 amIt is an Appa 70. One of your former members is scheduled to do a review on it.http://www.appatech.com/appa_product_home.php?pdid=2005102401295373290&&kindid=2005081003113623241

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 22, 2013, 12:27:30 am
content: Here is a UNI-T 71B for AU$110.00 in Sydney. Has better features, like temperature measurement, internal data logging (100 points), higher accuracy and 4-20mA loop, for the same price as the A model Dave will be reviewing.http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/UNI-T-UT71B-Intelligent-Digital-Multimeter-2-PC-USB-Data-Logging-/170988797862?_trksid=p2047675.m1850&_trkparms=aid%3D222002%26algo%3DSIC.FIT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D11%26meid%3D5761233466389153429%26pid%3D100011%26prg%3D1005%26rk%3D5%26sd%3D130743143940%26

author: retiredcaps
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 08, 2013, 09:03:46 pm
content: Dave,Since many USA viewers can get an used Fluke 87 (original) for about $100 on ebay, would you consider adding it to the new $100 shootout? It would be interesting to see if 20 year technology can compete with the new offerings?

author: ddavidebor
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 08, 2013, 10:21:47 pm
content: Don't look like a good idea..."let's add a 6.5 digit bench meter, i've paid it only 150 buck!"

author: kkelley311
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: April 25, 2013, 10:03:03 am
content: Hey,Maybe it's too late and you have already begun the testing, but I think that it would be worthwhile to add the winner from the previous shootout to your comparison (BK Precision 2709B). That way, you are in essence comparing 11 meters (assuming that in this shootout, you would test 5 new meters and the winner from the last shootout). This seems like it would provide a good reference. You know?Kevin

author: kkelley311
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: April 25, 2013, 10:10:20 am
content: Technically, if you only test 5 new fresh meters, that doesn't really tell us how they stack up against the last set of meters that you tested. Should you test only new meters, the winner (say an Acme M1A) could have actually fallen in 2nd or 3rd place had it been pitted against the set from the last shootout. Put the BK Precision model in there, and then your NEW favorite (be it the old BK Precision model or the Acme M1A) would tell us a bit more information while not adding a whole lot more work on your end. Seem reasonable?

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 25, 2013, 03:53:38 pm
content: That is a good idea IMHO

author: Mafketel
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: May 01, 2013, 02:59:17 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on January 26, 2013, 12:39:44 amSounds like an interesting one andit is based inNSIteckPO Box 6002Wellesley StreetAuckland 1141New ZealandSo It can't be that bad, ships over 200 countries they say, although I have not seen their shipping rates.Even at 260 with the dual measurement it is not that bad of a price.I take back what i said ... us$ prices for a company in New Zealand and the fact that:Registrant Contact Details:NSI Inc. LTD.Peter Zhuo Peng ()13 Qinyuan Rd., Tianxin,ChangshaHunan,410004CNTel. +86.13908456013although it has been registered in 2011 still sounds fishy to meAnybody wants to pass by their place?

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 18, 2013, 04:32:30 am
content: Dave:Any chance of the shootout still?

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 18, 2013, 05:29:36 am
content: Quote from: Lightages on May 18, 2013, 04:32:30 amYeah, just need to decide on and get another meter or two.

author: Fsck
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 18, 2013, 05:36:51 am
content: Totally need a high end shootout, something that few people can afford (the shootout, not the meters).Would love to see what meter will be king of handhelds. <400$ USD/CAD, and the unlimited budget shootout.

author: ddavidebor
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 24, 2013, 08:04:28 pm
content: maiby a little snack like a better teardown of a brymen multimeter should be nice.

author: marvkaye
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 26, 2013, 07:24:14 pm
content: What about the Protek 608? Tequipment is pushing them as the US$139 replacement for a number of meters that are no longer available... maybe too high priced for a $100 shootout, but still worth a look I'd think.

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 26, 2013, 09:29:35 pm
content: I thought too that the Protek 608 might be a great buy, especially when they had the price lower, around $125 if I remember. After looking at the specs a bit more it still might be a good meter but....It appears to be around 10 years old. It also is only rated CATII ! The weird bar graph almost looks useless and the update rate is 2 per second. Maybe for a bench meter it might be OK, but for its update rate really would be a pain. It also has RS232 included but who knows if the software works natively in Win7 or not, maybe in XP mode.I think it too old and too high a price to be used in a comparison.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 22, 2013, 02:44:27 pm
content: Quote from: mariush on February 20, 2013, 04:24:48 amThis thread ain't dead yet!That one looks ok.Any other $100 meters popped up since last time?

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 22, 2013, 03:06:40 pm
content: Dave:As mentioned here:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/suggestions/is-it-not-time-for-another-multimeter-shootout-yet/msg194082/#msg194082This is a made by Uni-T for Sperry and has lower specs than the UT71A which can be had online for $114 shipped. The UT71A also has a PC cable and software included and also has much better specs.

author: M0BSW
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 26, 2013, 07:53:46 pm
content: NOPlease not another multimeter shoot out

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 26, 2013, 09:21:50 pm
content: You don't have to watch it!

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 26, 2013, 09:30:08 pm
content: The UT71B can be had for 119$ shipped now. Much better specs than the A model, which goes for 107$ shipped.If you're looking for another one, the CEM DT9928 might be worth a look at, 105$ delivered.http://www.ebay.com/itm/DT-9928-Professional-Digital-Multimeters-New-22-000-counts-RMS-AC-Voltage-/310684120432?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4856377570

author: raiden
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: October 08, 2013, 05:59:00 am
content: What about the Brymen BM257? I love how tiny it is compared to most meters.

author: jmcdonald
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 08, 2013, 10:44:44 am
content: Quote from: eV1Te on April 15, 2012, 01:14:06 pm

author: brian851
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: January 06, 2014, 11:45:49 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on February 19, 2013, 09:44:08 pmWhat about the new UNI-T UT139C True RMS?

author: lpc32
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 13, 2014, 09:07:12 pm
content: Quote from: brian851 on January 06, 2014, 11:45:49 amLooks interesting. Though if it's a $100-range shootout, this one's half the price. But wouldn't it be nice if it were just as good?

author: Nursepeter
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: January 18, 2014, 06:25:56 am
content: Hi there, I'm brand new here and was really looking forward to seeing this test! I've had way too many cheap mm and my current one is its death throws.. Was looking forward to a relatively unbiased view on the UNI-T UT71A by Dave (or anyone) as its in the price range (AU$134 offhttp://www.ebay.com.au/itm/131064894151?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649I'm looking for something thats going to last, I'm really a complete hobbyist, many use the mm for continuity and 12v finding in the car

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 18, 2014, 06:38:52 am
content: The UT71 series are not good meters when it comes to continuity testing. The continuity test signal is latched but much slower than the average meter out there. Apart from that quirk, it would be fine for low power electronic work, but even then, the 71B is a more capable meter, at little extra cost.If you need something long lasting, with a fast continuity test and some basic features, look somewhere else, like the new Fluke 101 for instance.

author: Nursepeter
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: January 18, 2014, 11:35:29 pm
content: I ended up going for Wytnucls (thankyou) advice and went the Fluke route, though I went for the 17B as I am always one to get a tool that is above my capabilities as I am always interested in learning new stuff. (I have played around with electronics kits, so this might give me a good excuse to explore further)

author: GiskardReventlov
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 19, 2014, 09:28:11 pm
content: What's the list of must-have features for a DMM to make the cut to get into the $100 shootout? Is it just the price? That's a pretty low bar.I guess it depends on how many viewers are repeat viewers, but since the BK2709b was in the top in the previous shootout it may be interesting to include the BK again as a benchmark if for no other reason.

author: omgfire
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: July 23, 2014, 05:19:40 pm
content: As an idea for $100 shootout: treat a couple sub $50 multimeters as one sub $100 multimeter.For example, UT61E + UT139C complement each other. UT61Ehas better resolution/claimed accuracy, PC connection, bargraph. UT139C has temperature, NCV, Max/Min.Could UT139C+UT61E be competitive to single $100 multimeter?

author: nixfu
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 30, 2014, 01:19:53 am
content: Wow... I went back and watched the old multimeter shootout. Episode #99.Sure was fun to watch a video from back in the garage days.It really IS TIME for another shootout I think.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 30, 2014, 03:24:32 am
content: FYI, I have been slowly collecting pocket multimeters for that shootout.The problem with price based shootouts is just that, price.Is it fair to compare a $70 meter to a $130 meter?How much buffer do you put around that "price point"?The price point in which country?I'm leaning toward, like I am with the pocket meter shootout (it must fit in a shirt pocket & have attached leads, and be in some case or wallet), that it's simply better the group based on similar functionality, and be damned the price?

author: pickle9000
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 30, 2014, 04:48:15 am
content: Functionality over price.Perhaps not really shootout material but.- DC clamps maybe- A comedy featuring transistor testers in DMMs- I've always found the bare board esr meters interesting (cheap on ebay)

author: poida_pie
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 30, 2014, 05:55:22 am
content: Oh yes, do the big comparison first.And then sell on ebay all the meters, and include the auction prices as part of the results.Surely, those meters that are well thought of will attract the better prices.This is not a measure of selling for profit, more an indication of how desirable the meter isin the minds of other people.

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 10, 2014, 01:41:56 am
content: I would base the shoot-out loosely on price, with one meter from the most popular brands and the occasional worthwhile outsider for fun.In the most popular 100$ request:1. Brymen 257 ($135)2. UNI-T UT139C (60$) or UT71C ($130)3. Fluke 115 ($140)4. Amprobe AM570 ($110)5. BK Precision 2712 ($115)Outsiders:Vichy VC87 ($90)Fluke 8060A ($100)In the next most popular request ($200):1. Brymen 867 ($220)2. Agilent U1233A ($210)3. BK Precision 393 ($220)4. UNI-T 171B ($200)5. Hioki 3805-50 or Sanwa PC773 ($230)6. Extech EX570 ($200)Outsiders:Mastech 8218 ($200)Rishabh 18S ($200)

author: Legit-Design
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2014, 02:46:55 pm
content: Quote from: omgfire on July 23, 2014, 05:19:40 pmUT61E also has max min, but it's called "PEAK" pmax pmin on the meter, same thing. But in addiction to UT61 meters UT139C has MAX-MIN mode, that is MIN subtracted from MAX, might be useful for something.Having used UT139C I wouldn't put much if any value on having NCV, in my opinion it's way too sensitive for all kinds of fields. I actually went and got cheapest non contact volt meter pen from the store, it was 5€ and it can light led on which europlug hole is the live one. First pen I got didn't work a real piece of crap, even tried another battery, went to the store and got it exchanged and they even let me test the new was functional. Of course a meter is way too big to show anything with such accuracy, but UT139C picks up fields from all over the place. For example just measured full bars 80mm from my computer display that has ccfl backlight. If I bring my hand to closer to the meters sensor it will drop to 2 bars. A real non contact voltage pen doesn't react to display in any way. Also UT139C seems to pick up voltages from just simple metal surfaces around the room. UT139C thinks my headphone cable while only connected to computer has 4 bars worth of voltage, and I'm not even playing anything through the headphones can even disconnect and leave only the cable and it still thinks there is big voltages on the cable. Real cheapo voltage pen doesn't show anything for the headphone cable. Or maybe the unit I received is faulty and I opened mine and posted some pictures so it doesn't even have warranty anymore, or maybe it never had warranty since I bought it ebay china. I wouldn't advice anyone to trust their lives on UT139C NCV function, it's flaky and unreliable. If properly used a cheap non contact voltage pen might be something to rely on.

author: zapta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2014, 07:08:47 pm
content: Quote from: nixfu on September 30, 2014, 01:19:53 amIt should have been episode #100 ;-).

author: Wytnucls
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 08, 2014, 09:18:10 am
content: There are significant differences between Peak Hold and Max Min functions.Peak Hold is meant to be used with AC voltage and current only, displaying peak instead of RMS values, taking the DC offset into account. Sampling interval is high at 100uS.Max Min works with any measurements, with a lower sampling interval of about 2 seconds. In AC voltage or current mode, it will display max and min RMS values.The 61E has to be modified to be able to display Max Min values.

author: gildasd
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 25, 2014, 11:13:28 am
content: Quote from: EEVblog on September 30, 2014, 03:24:32 amAUS: makes your work easier and anybody with a half passing interest can do the conversions themselves.Don't be too nice to your users, most of us have a nice thick skin and we can take a bit of the old roughing up.We don't come here to get flowers from Dave, but for his lovely natural abrasion.Whiners make a lot of noise but are ultimately a minority.

author: nowlan
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 25, 2014, 12:00:35 pm
content: I think USD is what the price should be listed in. Let everyone else convert to local currencies.That $135 brymen is now closer to $166 au since au no longer at parity.I have friends who love their $10hobby kingdmm.If it breaks/lost they have a spare in the draw.Who is this shoot out catering to? First time buyers, or people with their $10 meter looking to step up.Where is the value add coming from? What does $150 more buy me? What will warrant me paying more.1. How many hobbyist will go near 240v?2. Better continuity3. Accuracy4. display readability5. update rateI was keen for a Brymen, but I think I be better off with a Der 5000 & cheapo uni-t for electronics work.

author: gildasd
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 25, 2014, 08:36:20 pm
content: I'm a hobbyist, but I also have a house and in Europe 240 is the norm.So right now I have a UT61b that sees a lot of mains work...Dual use stuff is also much easier to get greenlighted by my spouse

author: angelicterran
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: January 04, 2015, 04:33:49 pm
content: I almost bought the BK Precision 2709B after watching the $100 shootout then i realized it's a 4 year old video. Can't wait for this new shootout