PS3 Randomly Switching Off - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / repair

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 25, 2021, 12:09:14 am
content: Hi. Hoping someone can advise.My PS3 has recently and more frequently over time developed an issue. It powers off with 3 beeps and a red flashing power LED.Afterwards I just power it back on and it usually works fine until the next time I play but it is getting more frequent.I have owned the PS3 since new in 2008. It is an 80GB UK model without PS2 compatibility. It has always been well looked after, kept well ventilated and free of dust and never left on for extended periods.The hard disk was upgraded to a new 500GB WD Blue drive in 2014. I have pulled the drive and checked the SMART on my PC and it has not one single error.The fault happens usually when loading into a game but not in the menus or when playing a movie so it seems to be when the console is working harder then it suddenly shuts off.I don't think it is overheating as the fault can happen from a cold start within a minute or two.To rule it out I just stripped down thr PS3 completely and cleaned it, but it wasn't that dusty considering. I cleaned off and replaced the heatsink compound as it was very dry. After re-assembling the console there is no difference, the fault remains exactly the same.I have read about power supply problems causing this fault which I think is a good first port of call. Apparently there are some trimmer pots which can be adjusted?Has anyone got any information about this or any suggestions on what to try?Thanks

author: abdulbadii
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 25, 2021, 12:16:47 am
content: Is its manual tell us anything whatsoever so we examine here, esp fault code ?

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 25, 2021, 12:21:29 am
content: Quote from: abdulbadii on December 25, 2021, 12:16:47 amI wouldn't know where to find a fault code??All I have so far is the PS3 turns off and beeps 3 times then the power LED flashes Red on and off indefinitely until the power button is pressed. Then the PS3 is in standby as normal and pressing the button again will make it power up normally.I will pull it out tomorrow to get the exact model no. off the back.

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 04, 2022, 05:23:30 pm
content: Hi Everyone. Sorry for the delay in my response. Been very busy with work. My PS3 is a CECHK03 Model. Fat 80GB.The fault seems to be getting more frequent. It now turns off before loading games sometimes right at boot up.So far I have stripped the PS3 and cleaned it of dust and replaced the heat-sink compound. The PS3 now runs noticeably cooler and quieter, however the fault is still present so I am pretty convinced it is not over-heating.I have cleaned the hard disk SATA contact pins and re-installed it. This made no difference to the fault.I have swapped the power supply for another one of the same model. The fault still remained the same.I have hooked my voltmeter up to both power supplies and they are both steady at 12.1 and 12.09V with no fluctuations. I also cleaned all the power supply contacts.So not too sure what to try next. I have read up about the NEC Tokin Capacitors next to the CPU / GPU causing this kind of fault?? Can anyone shed any light on this perhaps?What is their purpose and how would I test these?When the fault happens the voltage remains at these readings and then after the red light starts blinking the 12V rail is shut off.

author: flolic
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 04, 2022, 06:06:43 pm
content: Problem is most likely with bad CPU. You can do nothing to fix it. Temporary fix can be to reflow the CPU on the BGA rework machine (and that will introduce another problem).You can also try to replace the NEC Tokin capacitors, but usually they are not the problem.Hundreds of PS3 consoles passed through my shop, and I still have around 20 pcs. waiting for the scrap yard. Virtually all of them with the same failure.I no longer repair them because it is waste of time.

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 04, 2022, 07:21:15 pm
content: Apparently there is a way of reading the fault codes from the PS3 motherboard using serial. Does anyone have any info on how to do this?

author: whatboy
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2022, 12:00:38 am
content: Overheating, you need to replace the thermal paste, but not only on top of the IHS, but underneath the IHS also, so you need to de-lid the CPU and GPU as well, de-liding the GPU is easy, but the CPU is another thing, you need to use a sharp-really thin object, there are sone youtube videos that can teach you how to do it!

author: whatboy
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2022, 12:04:41 am
content: So not too sure what to try next. I have read up about the NEC Tokin Capacitors next to the CPU / GPU causing this kind of fault?? Can anyone shed any light on this perhaps?What is their purpose and how would I test these?You check for ripple, if ripple is present, the PS3 will shut down with out a warning, no lights no nothing, just shuts off, so your problem is overheating!!!

author: flolic
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2022, 07:39:57 am
content: Quote from: whatboy on January 05, 2022, 12:00:38 amOverheating because of deteriorated thermal paste between CPU die and IHS is very common, but that can be easily diagnosed because fan will speed us very soon after power on.On "fat" consoles, IHS is glued to the CPU package with flexible silicone adhesive. Thin sharp blade or very thin steel wire ("piano wire") can be used to cut through silicone. Soak the CPU with IPA, it will make cutting much easier.But after all this trouble main problem remains, and that's problem with die underfill you can do nothing about.

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2022, 09:10:19 am
content: Quote from: flolic on January 05, 2022, 07:39:57 amSince replacing the thermal paste on top of the cpu/gpu, when my console powers on the fan is very quiet and there is no noticable heat being exhausted from the vents when thr fault occurs.Also even of the console has been off for a long time, e.g. overnight, I can power it on and the fault may happen right away, say after 30 seconds, and no part of the console inside or out gets warm to the touch.So in my case I think it is not over-heating.When the fault first started I could run the console for hours and hours without it happening, but only if I didn't give it much work e.g. watching videos or less-intensive games. It would then only YLOD when I would load somehing very intensive, such as GTA IV. But then simply rebooting the console and loading again would allow it to work normally for hours and hours without it etting YLOD.So the fault it intermittent and is getting more frequent over time but I don't think it is overheating as the fault can happen even when first powered on and still cool.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 05, 2022, 09:25:52 am
content: I don't think it's a CPU or GPU issue as it always boots and stays silent. Without making measurements with oscilloscope, bad Proadlizer capacitor is the best guess, since they are not reliable at all. Can be replaced with 4 aluminum polymer caps like discussed herehttps://www.eevblog.com/forum/beginners/good-quality-tantalum-caps/msg3757811/#msg3757811

author: Mario87
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2022, 10:52:29 am
content: Quote from: paul_g_787 on January 04, 2022, 07:21:15 pmInfo on how to do this is here...https://www.psx-place.com/threads/fault-finding-ylod-with-the-syscon-first-steps-and-error-reporting.30100/GitHub...https://github.com/db260179/ps3sysconPDF Guide...https://github.com/db260179/ps3syscon/blob/master/PS3-Uart-Guide.pdfAlso, if it was overheating as others suggest, I would expect the fans to ramp up to max load shortly after bootup before powering down. If the fans are spinning slowly and not ramping up, this looks like some other kind of issue. Getting the error codes from the SysCon is a good start!

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2022, 12:51:24 pm
content: Quote from: wraper on January 05, 2022, 09:25:52 amThat is what I am thinking also... my spidey sense is telling me capacitors but I need to find a way to prove this.As far as I understand it they are just local smoothing caps for the cpu and gpu voltages?So what DC voltage should I have on them? Some forums say 1V and others say 12V.So I guess I can use my DMM to measure the DC Voltage and check for AC ripple?

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 05, 2022, 01:28:44 pm
content: Quote1.something V. IIRC Proadlazer caps used in PS3 are rated for 2.5V.

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 05, 2022, 07:53:18 pm
content: Thanks for the syscon info but at the moment I don't think it will help much as the ps3 does not stay powered on long enough. (Unless the ps3 syscon can be read in standby mode??).OK so watched some you-tube videos on the NEC Tokin capacitors and got some useful info.My plan is as follows:Dis-mantle the ps3 again and firstly check the board model no.Inspect the NEC Tokin Capacitors visually.Test the NEC Tokin capacitors with my DMM for direct shorts or DC leakage.Test the NEC Tokin capacitors with my ESR meter and check the ESR against the Datasheet for the capacitors if I can find oneAny general tips?Are the NEC Tokin capacitors one or more capacitor? They have 4 pads on the PCB so is it a dual cap package?

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 05, 2022, 07:58:42 pm
content: Quote from: paul_g_787 on January 05, 2022, 07:53:18 pmIf you test in circuit, resistance will be quite low because large chips have very low resistance on Vcore. Proadlizer basically is a large pass through aluminum polymer capacitor.https://www.nec.com/en/global/techrep/journal/popular/2019latter/04.html

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2022, 12:05:21 am
content: Quote from: wraper on January 05, 2022, 07:58:42 pmOh that is quite useful documentation! Thank you.I can see the four layers inside, so am I correct to assume that this is this why everyone uses 4 tantalums to replace the proadlizers?So now I am asking myself why / how exactly do the NEC Tokin (Proadlizer) capacitors fail and cause the YLOD in the first place?Is there a way I can confirm which of the capacitors are faulty before blindly ripping them off the board and changing them?Or:Should I just change all of them blindly?Or just replace the two on the back of the GPU which a lot of people say are the faulty ones?

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 06, 2022, 12:21:34 am
content: This is very interesting:https://chepgameps3.com/2021/06/10/tutorial-research-nec-tokin-capacitors-replacement-ylod-fix/What is everyone's opinions on the information in this article?

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 06, 2022, 09:41:24 am
content: They lose capacitance, increase ESR. If they started failing, it's better to replace them all since they are garbage by design. You cannot really test them in circuit reliably as they are also bypassed by small ceramic capacitors, so ESR will be quite low anyway.Quote from: paul_g_787 on January 06, 2022, 12:21:34 amArticle mentions tantalum capacitors. It's not the best choice (use what I suggested in another thread) and article also does not mention they must have low ESR.

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 24, 2022, 09:08:40 pm
content: Quote from: wraper on January 06, 2022, 09:41:24 amI have just been reading this thread as you mentioned:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/beginners/good-quality-tantalum-caps/What is the tolerance of the Proadlizer caps?The Panasonic Aluminium Organic Polymer Capacitors are 20%, so the 4x330µF ones would be 1320µF worst case 1056µF, so is this high enough?Using that information I think this capacitor would be a good choice:https://www.mouser.co.uk/ProductDetail/Panasonic/EEF-HX0E331R4?qs=XtgyILOJlWMkAvTRPAWp1g%3D%3DIt is 330µF, 20% 4.5mΩ ESR.So x4 in parallel would be 1320µF, 1.125mΩ ESROr if that one is not high enough value a 470µF?https://www.mouser.co.uk/ProductDetail/Panasonic/EEF-SX0E471E4?qs=MNPzkKEzRtSV%252BpABlh7BlA%3D%3D

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 24, 2022, 09:11:09 pm
content: Quote from: paul_g_787 on January 24, 2022, 09:08:40 pmJust found this datasheet that claims they are also 20% tolerancehttps://bulcomp-eng.com/datasheet/Tokin%200E907.pdf

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 16, 2022, 03:27:23 pm
content: Alright so I am re-visiting this one now as I really want to finish some games I was half way through.So my PS3 is a CECH-K03 and the board is a DIA-002It is the 80GB Fat model from the UK.Having a look I can see the Proadlizer ("NEC/Tokin") capacitors. There are four on each side.One of the two ICs has four 0E108 proadlizers by it and the other has four 0E128.I have just been having a measure of them with my meters. I cannot get a conclusive µF measurement or and ESR measurement in circuit as they just read OL.However I can see that all 8 of the proadlizers (4 each side of the board) are all connected in parallel??I found this datasheet here:https://bulcomp-eng.com/datasheet/Tokin%200E907.pdfI can see by the datasheet that OE specifies 2.5V and that 128 is 1200µF and therefore 108 is 1000µF and that also they are 20% tolerance.It also specified the ESR of the 0E128 is 2.0mΩ at 100kHzSo I want to check... I need to make sure the replacements have the same or higher capacitance, the same or higher voltage and the same or lower ESR?so 1000µF/1200µF or higher.2.5V or higher.2.0mΩ ESR or lower.

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2022, 03:13:46 pm
content: Alright my capacitors arrived today so I have made a start on removing the Proadlizer caps.Going well so far! Wish me luckI found the best method is to warm up the caps for approx 45 seconds at 380 degrees half power with my hot air rework tool. This softens the capacitor up a bit.Then get a thin screwdriver under the edge and pry off the lid of the cap and remove it.Then start levering the layers off applying a little heat when it starts to cool.Then use a screwdriver and hot air to remove the plasic bits left.Afer this I apply new leaded solder to the inner pads and scrape off the remnants with the iron.Then I apply new solder to the remaining 'legs' on the outer pads rubbing up and down to melt the solder, while applying a small amount of heat with the rework tool. Then the metal legs just fall off.Then wick the old solder away and clean the whole area with IPA.

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 18, 2022, 11:09:34 pm
content: Going well so far! Done one half of them on the back of the board.16 more to solder on tomorrowThen after all 32 caps are on I will add the wire links between the Proadlizer the anode pads.All looking good so far. I have been testing for shorts and good connections every single joint I have done to be safe.

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2022, 04:47:13 pm
content: So last night I soldered on the other 16 capacitors and also all the wire links.I have tested for shorts and all the joints look good, so now I will put it back together and see what happens.

author: Shock
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2022, 07:11:26 pm
content: My ocd really wants to scrape some conformal coating off.

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2022, 07:46:53 pm
content: Quote from: Shock on February 20, 2022, 07:11:26 pmOh you mean to mount the capacitors straight? HahaI did think about doing that but I didn't want to risk damaging anything if I didn't have to so I just mounted them to the original pads.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 20, 2022, 08:23:01 pm
content: Quote from: paul_g_787 on February 20, 2022, 07:46:53 pmDon't your capacitors have a second negative pad underneath?

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2022, 09:20:10 pm
content: Quote from: wraper on February 20, 2022, 08:23:01 pmNo just one at each end.

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2022, 09:26:06 pm
content: Success!!!I put the console back togeher after giving everything a good clean and some new heatsink compound and it is working great!Just played a couple hours of GTA IV which would cause the console to crash before every time and all good so far!I have to say this is the first Sony product I have ever owned that has gone faulty.My 1977 amplifier and 1993 TV are still going strong.Shame their standards aren't what they once were.At least I learned something!That soldering was rather tricky but I just took my time and used plenty of flux and checked every joint was good.Hopefully it will last a long time now.

author: fzabkar
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2022, 09:35:52 pm
content: Quote from: paul_g_787 on February 20, 2022, 07:46:53 pmI just finished watching 8 seasons of Monk. That thought was in my head, too.

author: Shock
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2022, 11:15:26 pm
content: Congrats. Sony doesn't really do it for me anymore. They have had some really good products but fleets of TVs, receivers and consoles that have had issues. But for a while there they had some really good CRTs CD/DVD drives and amps, and of course the original PS. I mean the consoles were good regardless for games but the controllers were a great design.

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 20, 2022, 11:27:42 pm
content: All my old sony stuff works great and is still going strong!My 1987 amp, 1993 CRT, 1999 DVD player, my 2009 40" TV, my PS1, PS2, PSP and my PS1, PS2 and PS3 controllers are all still doing great.The only things I have had a problem with is this issue with my PS3 and the Dualshock 4 controllers are just rubbish and wear out in no time.I think we are starting to see the beginning of Sony 'selling out' and getting too cheap.

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 21, 2022, 03:26:07 pm
content: Well thanks to the helpful advice from everyone here I am pleased this repair was a success!Special thanks towraperfor all the useful information regarding the Proadlizer (NEC/Tokin) capacitors.Just to recap the information for those reading this thread:The fault was YLOD (Yellow Light of Death). The PS3 would switch off randomly and more frequently over time, particularly at high load (rendering lots of things on screen).The PS3 would beep three times and show a Yellow LED (which is actually just the Red and Green LED on at the same time).Then the PS3 would shut off and there would be a flashing red LED.There was no ramping up of the fan or excessive heat/noise, if there was it would indicate overheating, but not in my case.This is commonly the Proadlizer NEC/Tokin capacitors at fault. This can be tested for by measuring the DC voltage across them and also measuring the AC voltage to check for ripple.The replacement capacitors need to be Aluminium Polymer capacitors (NOT Tantalum). This is due to the frequency response (by my understanding).They need to have the same or higher capacitance as the originals (either 1000µF or 1200µF in my case).They need to have the same or higher voltage (2.5V).They need to have the same or lower ESR (2mΩ for each Proadlizer).So for 4 capacitors in parallel (to replace each Proadlizer).330µF × 4 = 1320µF4.5mΩ ÷ 4 = 1.125mΩSo as you can see the specification exceeds the Proadlizer's original spec.These are the capacitors I used:Panasonic EEF-HX0E331R4Mouser Part No.: 667-EEF-HX0E331R4Datasheet:https://www.mouser.co.uk/datasheet/2/315/ABE0000C90-1100919.pdfAnd of course the wire links need to be installed to bridge the points that are linked by the internal metal strip in the Proadlizer

author: paul_g_787
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 07, 2022, 04:20:33 pm
content: Just a little update. My PS3 is still working fine with many hours spent playing now!The fan is a little louder than I remember but nothing too bad and it is still nice and quiet and the temperature of the air coming out feels normal.If it gets any louder later on down the line I will look at de-lidding the CPU and GPU, but for now I am going to finish GTA IV.In preparation can anyone give me any information as to to the thermal adhesive that is used to glue the lid down on the CPU?It is not thermal paste like between the IC and heat-spreader. I mean the adhesive glueing the heat spreader to the PCB?What exactly is this stuff?