Is the hack/tweak/mod spirit gone? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: b_force
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 02, 2018, 08:07:10 am
content: Many years ago when I started with electronics, it was very common for people to hack stuff.In fact, in the community it was almost a sport/competition/art form to find the cheapest product that could be turned in something awesome with just a little effort.Maybe it's just me, but sometimes I feel that these days are unfortunately gone?As soon as people see "made in China" written on it, it's basically already crap and than it will be overwhelmed by just tons of negativity.To me it makes watching most product reviews on Youtube (also from EEVblog) almost lame and boring.As soon things don't have a decent brand (with a certain price tag) on it, it's pretty much garbage.People don't seem to think anymore what can be potentially done with it by just giving it some help and love.Or see the potential of a product in a different context.I would rather see ideas how something can be changed from trash into treasure.To give an example,Nowadays there are these cheap ass bench power supplies that can be bought for around 30-45 bucks.Performance wise they aren't the greatest, but to be very honest; just only a transformer, LCD screen and casing (and some knobs/potentiometers) will cost me more.So just rip out the guts, build/develop a new circuit and you have a very good performing power supply for just a couple of bucks more?

author: bd139
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 02, 2018, 08:17:12 am
content: I think the junk just got good enough that we dont need to frig around with it and can actually use it to make new things.

author: b_force
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 02, 2018, 08:20:42 am
content: Quote from: bd139 on July 02, 2018, 08:17:12 amMaybe you're right, but to be honest I always used to learn a lot with these type of projects (if not the most of all).

author: hamster_nz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 02, 2018, 08:29:21 am
content: Modding only makes sense if your needs are not met by the original product and the original product has untapped potential. In the late 80s I modded a cassette player to have CD inputs. That made sense.Now that everything is highly integrated and feature rich I can't think of many useful mods.Mod a laptop? Maybe swap the HDD if at all.Mod a TV? NopeMod a cell phone? Nope.Mod a Bluetooth speaker? Why bother?....Except removing any bright blue LEDs. That just HAS to be done.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 02, 2018, 04:30:03 pm
content: I know someone with a case modded laptop. Purely done to look cool...One could "mod" a non smart TV (or a smart one that's not well implemented) by adding a Raspberry Pi on the back, although that doesn't really count as a mod.Custom ROMs are common for smartphones, although that is really no different than installing a different OS on a PC.I have actually modded a Bluetooth speaker by upgrading the battery.

author: amyk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 02, 2018, 04:47:12 pm
content: The advent of Arduino probably contributed a lot to that --- a lot of beginners don't bother going through the basic lessons and understanding how things work, they just buy (overpriced) crap and attempt to glue it together with copy-pasted code and horribly written "tutorials". Ask how many of them have read the datasheets for the parts on their boards and you'll see what I mean...

author: The Soulman
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 02, 2018, 05:47:46 pm
content: Quote from: hamster_nz on July 02, 2018, 08:29:21 amI remember doing the exact opposite decades ago when blue leds just game out, at that time theywere the coolest thing ever and not much later it was common on many commercial products.The commonly available bleu leds since then only became cheaper and much brighter.As a result almost every electronics product now has a stupidly bright bleu led.I don't mind them at lower and more sensible intensity, but no, brighter is better, or so the designers think..

author: Rick Law
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 02, 2018, 05:53:34 pm
content: Quote from: amyk on July 02, 2018, 04:47:12 pmYou are right there.Arduino allowed me to experiment with my cheap PSU's to make them into a finer digitally controlled PSU. The original digital (and non-digital) do what I needed already, but the experimentation allowed me to learn more and try to make it do what I want.Besides improvement, it is also a good way of learning. In the old days, one can go to class to learn or join a club and learn from fellow members. But that is inconvenient and only available in areas of larger population.Withcopy-and-paste of others' work, it is easier to "stand on the shoulder of giant," learn from other's work, and build from there.I would estimate without the cheap stuff to lower the entry barrier, it would probably reduce the people entering the field as hobbyist.

author: innkeeper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 02, 2018, 05:55:45 pm
content: I think modding has gone to a different level.the problem with most modern electronics is that it is too hard to mod .. being surface mount or chip on board.this doesn't mean it doesn't exist, on the contrary, its been supercharged in recent years.so now you can roll your own version of something, hack the underlying technology to do what you want. the maker movement is a good example of this next level. and just look at the number of processor boards out for the hacker these days. shields out the wazoo, and coding platforms etc. sdr receivers, people doing all kinds of things with technology and hardware, ... CNC, 3d printing... just go to a maker fair or a hackerspace in your area, you will see people hacking and creating all kinds of things.modding isn't dead, its morphed into something bigger than ever. the energy is there, the desire is there, the methods have morphed.

author: The Soulman
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 02, 2018, 06:08:25 pm
content: Quote from: b_force on July 02, 2018, 08:07:10 amThese days almost every product you could need is available at a modest price and can be ordered on the internet and shipped to your door, so there is isn't longer the necessity to mod something you have into something you need.QuoteBecause it is build down to a price to a point closely to where it even barely functions as designed.I planned on modding a (made in china...) psu only to find that the (230V rated) transformer saturates at 235 Volts and becomesquite hot with no load, running at 50 Hz also doesn't help, but we are not going to mod that.And overall the larger transformers I've seen from that same country are made sloppy, with inconsistently placedinsulation, sharp kinks in winding's, poor (hand) soldered connections etc.Either way they typically they don't last as long as you would expect.

author: b_force
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 02, 2018, 08:06:12 pm
content: Quote from: innkeeper on July 02, 2018, 05:55:45 pmI guess you're right. But still I find the general attitude towards cheaper gear pretty negative from time to time.And to be honest SMD isn't that much more difficult. In fact it's a lot easier to remove since you don't need to move the whole board upside down.As long as it's 0805 or 0603 it's perfectly doable.I don't know. It's more the "looking for potential and ideas" i am missing.Hard to explain.Or are we just getting used to luxury?

author: rhb
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 02, 2018, 09:44:57 pm
content: Where have you been? Read the F***Tech FY-6600 thread. How much more hacking do you want?

author: innkeeper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 02, 2018, 09:54:13 pm
content: ii think every area has it niche,take the audio crowd, constantly messing with headphone mods, and DAC mods. power supply mods.car guys, always moding their rides.i mean its out there. hey even test equipment right...how many people are into modifying upgrading restoring vintage gear.i could go on.

author: Rick Law
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 03, 2018, 04:21:10 am
content: Quote from: b_force on July 02, 2018, 08:06:12 pmYeah, 0805 or 0603 are doable, but it increases the difficulty level and slows the building process down a lot -- particularly when one has to work with plain non-printed PCB.That is where I got stuck. I did some SMD's with adapter boards, but I just found it a lot more fun when I can assemble my experiment quickly using plain prototyping boards with just grids of holes.

author: TiN
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 03, 2018, 04:49:01 am
content: QuoteIt's just you. Hack/tweak/mods are alive and kicking, they just mutated to different looking things, like above folks indeed pointed already.QuoteIn your example with PSU, if you can afford the time to reinvent the PSU wheel, sure, you can find many examples of people doing just that.But many prefer to tinker about their projects and use decent PSU instead (you can pickup very nice HP legacy PSUs from ebay for cost of shipping).I mod and tweak equipment all the time, this is what makes it more fun to me.Recent example is obsolete logic analyzer, tweaked with faster CPU, more memory and mods to accept other Tek LA modules.Core X9100 CPU is not supported by this motherboard, so I had to fish some infos on internets, put few jumper wires into socket to trick motherboard thinking CPU have 200MHz FSB clock instead of stock 266MHz (for this CPU), and bingo, all fly nice now. I was even able to overclock itDoes that qualify as example?

author: innkeeper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 03, 2018, 06:08:51 am
content: lets not forget about hackadayhttps://hackaday.com/

author: bd139
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 03, 2018, 06:23:38 am
content: Quote from: Rick Law on July 03, 2018, 04:21:10 amThis is the intermediate stage of confidence. Eventually you just get fed up of that shit and get some PCBs ordered from the lowest bidder. If they don’t work you scratch off the tracks and bodge wire and tombstone all the parts that are wrong. Then you order another PCB with all the shit fixed.I will test small circuit fragments with SMD adapters on a solderless breadboard but that’s about it these days.The sick twisted half of me likes arguing with SMD parts.

author: bd139
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 03, 2018, 07:12:58 am
content: Did my first 0402 last night. Was less hassle than I expected. Biggest problem was heat conduction through the part. Get in quick and out quick and not a problem.

author: b_force
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 03, 2018, 07:44:48 am
content: Quote from: TiN on July 03, 2018, 04:49:01 amIt's not about reinventing the wheel I think?It's about the challenge to make something awesome within a (very) small budget.Most cheap products have tons of potential, but they mostly just cut corners on the wrong parts.Doesn't mean you can't use the other parts for something else.I am very familiar with hackaday, awesome website for inspiration.But to be fair, most ideas aren't hacks anymore, but just new products and ideas (if not a clone from a clone)@Rick LawTo be honest, I solder 0805 and other SMD parts much quicker than through hole.

author: Cyberdragon
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 03, 2018, 02:40:15 pm
content: Back in high school I modded a cheap mini AC/Battery "boombox" (radio only) from the 1970s or 80s that sounded awefully "tinny" and weak. It's a transitor front end, to an IC demultiplexer, to two SIP audio amps. First thing I looked up and found was the full datasheet on was the demodulator IC. There was a whole small paragraph about how the input decoupling capacitor had a critical value of 4.7uF, otherwise the symptoms observed would result. Sure enough the idiots had a 1uF!I replaced it with a 4.7uF from the junk bin and once turned on it immediately blasted some mediocre rock and vibrated my hands.

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 03, 2018, 04:00:32 pm
content: There are huge threads on this forum on modding Keysight oscilloscopes and Flir thermal cameras, what you are talking about... Could not dream about that level of hacking in my early times.

author: Rick Law
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 03, 2018, 06:23:06 pm
content: Quote from: bd139 on July 03, 2018, 06:23:38 amre: "...Eventually you just get fed up..."I am not sure how typical a hobbyist I am, or not - I ended up finding something that doesn't get me fed up.My interest is still there (I am still reading this...) but my interest is much tempered by "being fed up" as most of the stuff on my next-step are SMD using stuff.My goal is fun and learning. Every board I have done it got changed again and again for experimentation. So two issues I have with getting a PCB made:1. It adds time to each cycle - like letting the air out, it deflate the interest level.2. It is troublesome to redo - more troublesome than a through-hole.The through-hole experiments I soldered. That gave the experiment some permanence to it. I can still dig out my first (very simple) OpAmp based square/triangle wave generator and play around with the caps/resisters to change the frequency and enjoy the fact that "I made that work." You may say, the reward keeps coming.My SMD experiments - once I got that working, I change it again and again - as most other projects, it never got to a stage that I feel it is time to make it permanent. As such, when I need the breadboard again (I have three, but eventually I need to recycle), the SMD based experiment on that breadboard becomes just notes on my notebook. With though-hole, that same experiment would be on prototyping board before disassembly. But with SMD, I don't want to wait that long (to get it transfer to PCB) before I start my next project (reason why I need the breadboard).As notes in a notebook, it is no more than say something in a magazine article - it seems more distance, far less substantial, and certainly far less physical.I do have a couple of SMD experiment/project that I ended up keeping - with wires soldered to the SMD to make it a through-hole part on my prototype board.

author: JCHaywire
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: July 03, 2018, 11:55:26 pm
content: That spirit is alive and well here. Jonathan in MSPSent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

author: CopperCone
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 04, 2018, 12:08:33 am
content: https://www.eevblog.com/forum/projects/can-you-put-a-vfd-on-a-regular-air-conditioner-or-refrigerator/now thats a hack