FS: SP500 motor/generator - all my electronics- coils, magnets, tools... - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Sebastian12345
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: November 30, 2021, 03:32:58 pm
content: Good day,here I offer a 12,5kw electro motor/generator built with the construction plan from Creative Labs (Fuellesspower.com), called SP500 Model 2.I lost my interest for this hobby entirely and therefore sell everything: all accessories for the motor, including tools, parts, many high-tech measurement instruments, relays, enamled and non-enamled copper wire, ring terminals, capacitors and more.I would prefer to sell it all as one set (apart from the crimp terminals, and copper wire) and first sell its parts when nobody wants the set.All as a set for 6600$ (5800€).(As a reference, creative labs sells it for roughly 12,000$, with much less included)Shortly, what it is:It is a heavy 1m x 55cm x 70cm motor made from HDPE, 30kg copper coils, 39pcs N52 2"x0.5" Neodym magnets, with conductor, capacitors and accessory. You can use it as a motor or as a generator, depending on how you set it up. The set includes everything you need for all variants.It also includes high-tech measurement instruments for a nice surveillance of what's going on inside.Further, the set includes all tools such as hole saws, forstner bits etc. as well as spare HDPE material for extending the motor.Here the parts list:- 3 HDPE stators, each for 8 coils, 50cm (20") high, 45cm (17") wide, 4cm (1.57") thick- 6 HDPE rotors, each for 8 magnets, roughly 40cm (15") diameter, 1,8cm (0.7") thick- 2 HDPE housing walls for the left and right, each 2cm (0.787") thick-20 coils with an inner diameter of 4cm (1.575"), an outer of about 9cm (3.5") and 4cm height (1.575"). They are made of about 30kg (66lbs) 17awg high temperature resistant enameled copper wire, and are hard glued with epoxy.-39 (and one broken) N52 Neodym magnets of 2" x 0.5" size (50,8mm x 12,7mm).- 1 keyed shaft made of C1018 Cold Drawn Steel with a length of 36" (~95cm) and a diameter of 1" (2,54cm).- the same keyed shaft cutted into 2 pieces- one more keyed shaft with the same properties but only 0.5" (1,27cm) diameter- steel bearings SF205 for all three shafts. They aren't fixed to 90° angle and the shaft could be positioned else.- 25 capacitors CBB65A 450VAC- 1 conductor for the motor made from aluminium, epoxy, and HDPE.- 10 coal brush pairs for the conductor.- a housing for the motorbrushes.- 1 ultra fast diode RHRP860 600V- male and female power plugs- several relays: SSR-40A-H, SSR-10 10A, SSR-40DA, SSR-40AA-H- heatsinks, not enough for all relays- 1 rectifier bridge diode KBPC5010 1000V 50A-DSO138 Oscilloscope- digital LCD powermeter, simple and cheap with 6 functions, 5KW 20A, and panel mount- multifunction power meter, 3 phases, alarm function, RS485 port, and panel mount- intelligent power meter, with 26 functions, 3 phases, alarm function, RS485 port, and panel mount- 4 split core current transformer with a ratio of 100 and stereo plugs for the power meters- 4 female stereo plugs- digital tachometer with alarm function, RS485 port, and panel mount.- 2 proximity magnet switches 12V- RS485 USB adapter- 3 mini 2 position switches 125VAC 6A- useful connection cables- 8x 8mm (0.314") 1m (39") long screw thread rods- 6x 6mm (0.314") 25cm (10") long screw thread rods- More than enough screw, nuts, washers, and medium split washers; 12mm, 8mm, 6mm, 4mm (0.47", 0.314", 0.23", 0.15")- 20x 6mm fixing screws for the keyed shafts, long- 20x 6mm fixing screws for the keyed shafts, short-spare HDPE sheets of 3 different sizes: 20mm (0.78"), 12mm (0.47"), and 3mm (0.113") thickness.- 1l (1 quart) epoxy- all hole saws for extending the motor; 140mm (5.5"), 2x 95mm (3.74") one deep-cut one normal, 90mm (3.54"), 60mm (2.36"), and a set of tungesten hole saw from 12mm (0.5") to up 55mm (2") of 16 pieces.- forstner bits mostly fitting the hole saw sizes, as well as a high speed steel set in a wooden box with inch sizes ranging from 0.5" to 2.125" of 16 pieces.- high-precision Automatic Voltage Regulator for 230V output- 5000 separated M6 ring crimp terminals- 5kg (11lbs) 19awg enameled copper wire- roughly 5kg (11lbs) 1,8mm diameter (approx. 13awg) blank copper wireAll about the motor:The motor is designed as having for each coil two magnets, one right, one left. You may have noticed that 3 stators each for 8 coils and only 20 coils won't work out. Thus one stator functions like a half-sized half-phase unit, either as generator or motor. Also the magnets don't suffice for 6 rotors neither. Therefore the third stator goes between the two rotors of the two other stators. Nevertheless there are 7 + 1 broken spare magnets for extending the motor, for one because the other rotors are already made. Or you use the magnets for other projects.The carbon brush conductor is made from HDPE, aluminum, and epoxy, like creative labs describes it. Also capacitors, the necessary diode, its heatsink, and if it was necessary rectifier diode are there. The capacitors are readily connected in a small HDPE housing, for security reasons. It has an easy connection through the M6 crimp terminals, just like the stators. I obviously also made some fitting connection cables.The coils and motor are adapted to European 230VAC standard by giving the coils a one awg thinner wire and more turns. If you require 120VAC you could simply connect a transformer at the output, or even better an Automatic Voltage Regulator (AVR) for 120V. The one I offer here is for 230V only though.In order to be able to change the arrangement of the coils and their connection, they are currently only screwed in, and not glued in like the construction plan suggests. Once you have decide for a definite connection scheme and order, you could glue them in with the epoxy included in the set.To acompain the high-precision AVR, I bought some good quality, state of the art survailance and measurement instruments. I am especially proud of the tachometer, since it is one you just can't normally buy in low quantity or as a private person. Unfortunately I got the wrong proximity switches, for 12V and not like required for 230V. Yes 230V. That's another drawdown, you will have to use a transformer if you live in the US. Fortunately all other measuring instrument are designed for 100-230V power supply. All of them (apart from the cheap small one) feature alarm functions with one or more alarm outputs as well as RS485 port for surveillance via computer or even internet. Since this motor is rated at 12,5kw I equpied the power meter with some nice split core current transformers for measuring these high currents.Further, all measurement instruments are panel mount style with the same front size. I designed the housing of the motor in a way that they have space and that they will be mounted in a 45 degree angle. Also other wiring and transformer-similar stuff has space. This is also the reason why it is so big. If you put it all as close as possible together it would probably be just 50cm (~20") long. And therefore you could easily double the number of stators and power.The stators are 2x the 20mm sheet, and the rotors are 1x 12mm + 2x 3mm sheets. Since the magnets are just a bit thicker than the rotor disk, the two 3mm sheets have notches and serve as lids.You have all material and tools needed (apart from machines) to extend the motor either in number of rotors, size, or whatever other ideas you may have. Nonetheless, there are two things you will likely need the spare HDPE for. One thing is that there isn't a cover yet and since the rest of the 3mm sheet doesn't suffice, you would have to use the 12mm sheet. The second thing, which is the only major drawdown here, is that you may want to renew the holes of the rotor disks. I didn't have a high-precision drill press and the professional I paid apparently neither, and thus the holes aren't drilled in a perfect 90° angle. Therefore the rotors create some vibration and some wobbling. It still works on high RPM though. You could either use the circles, that are left over from making the holes for the magnets and coils, by enlarging the current rotor hole and screwing the circles onto them, or you make the rotors anew. However you decide, there is enough 12mm sheet for the cover and the rotors because there are more then 2m^2 (10.7feet^2) left. The 2m^2 is one big sheet, which I would cut for the shipment into your desired format. But there are also some more, smaller 12mm sheets left. From the 20mm sheet there are only small pieces left, like the circles from making the holes.I also built a mechanic translation with a belt so that you could connect another spinning force, like a windmill to it. I got the mechanism from a washing machine.Organizational matter:Preferably I sell it all as one big set, as one shipment to one person. Therefore, I will wait one or two months until I sell parts outside of the set. You can write me nevertheless and reserve the item, just in case nobody wants the set. If you have a question though, I think the best would be you post it here in the thread. Also, subscribe to the thread, if you are interested in something of it. I will keep you updated here.Nonetheless there are also things I sell outside of the set. If you buy the set however, you will get them as well, as per your wish.Shipment:The shipment will probably be parted into several parcels. Unfortunately it is very expansive from where I live and if you want a tracking code, it even costs twice as much because it's called premium here. I guess in the worst case might be 1000$, depending on where you live. If you live in Europe though, it will probably be just around 400€.Single parts like 20 magnets, one measurement instrument or whatever can easily be shipped for 50-100€ (60-120$)What I sell outside of the set:-The crimp terminals. Yes there are almost 5000 crimp terminals for M6 screws. You can solder a wire to them or use the crimp function. Both works well. You can have whatever quantity you like. I'll send it cheap as a letter, if you don't want all 5000 at once, obviously. I really want to get rid of them, so you will get them for a good price.-The enameled-and the blank copper wire are also both outside of the set available, since they don't have any function in the motor.

author: Zucca
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 01, 2021, 02:25:06 am
content: Well this is strange, fromFuellesspower.comSebastian12345are you aware in this forum we are almost all engineers?

author: mnementh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2021, 03:08:07 am
content: BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!Z, yer killin' me ovah heah!!!mnemThe 3 TRUE Laws of Thermodynamics:1: You can't win.2: You can't break even.3: You can't even get out of the game.

author: AVGresponding
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2021, 09:54:46 am
content: There's a reason why commercial manufacturers use metal for the structural components of motors/generators.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_motor#LossesHere's the abstract:"LossesMotor losses are mainly due to resistive losses in windings, core losses and mechanical losses in bearings, and aerodynamic losses, particularly where cooling fans are present, also occur.Losses also occur in commutation, mechanical commutators spark, and electronic commutators and also dissipateheat."These fundamental principles apply whether you use it as a motor or generator. Run that thing at anywhere near its electrical capacity and it's going to self-destruct as the plastic softens from heat, and the magnetic and physical forces acting on it exceed the mechanical strength of the material.

author: HighVoltage
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2021, 10:29:09 am
content: QuoteSeems cheap for a working free energy machine.

author: Sebastian12345
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: December 01, 2021, 10:38:33 am
content: Quote from: Zucca on December 01, 2021, 02:25:06 amYes, I am aware of that they sell it as free energy device. However I don't.I just hope someone can use it or at least the parts from it.Quote from: AVGresponding on December 01, 2021, 09:54:46 amSure, building it from metal would have made it much stronger, no question, but I think if these guys designed it with HDPE and have it run all day it will be strong enough. Apart from this there are lots of self-built motors made from HDPE, and the abstract doesn't say anything in this regard.So I really think the HDPE is strong enough for permanent use. I had it run as well for some time without noticing any degregation of it, inspite of the vibration.

author: PaulAm
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 01, 2021, 04:08:28 pm
content: Scrap price of copper is around $3/pound USD right now, so you should be able to recoup a couple hundred. You might be able to sell the HDPE to hobbyists or machinist as stock, although probably not the stuff with holes in it. Bearings and shafting aren't really worth bothering with, but you could put those on ebay. Somebody might buy the caps for a few bucks apiece. Sell the magnets on ebay, somebody will buy those.Unless you can sell it to a fellow "enthusiast" that's about the best you're going to be able to do.Hint: you won't find any "enthusiasts" on this forum.Ignoring the free energy thing and just considering it as a motor, even if the specs were correct, nobody who actually needs a motor would buy it when 3ph motors are a) everywhere, b) cheap and c) easily controllable. They also last forever and have standard mounting configurations. The last 25hp 3ph motor I bought cost me $50 USD (yes, it was at a garage sale, but still ...)