what would a passanger rocket plane look like? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 13, 2025, 11:15:48 pm
content: Birds cause problems for aviation because of air intakes. It seems to me that using rockets would get rid of the bird problem completely, there is nothing the plane is taking in that can get damaged or clogged.Either you can have 100% rocket power for the whole flight or a reserve rocket power (i.e. for low altitude flight), and theoretically its possible to make a compressor on the airplane to fill up tanks high up in the air for oxidizer.Right now it seems that its too heavy to do so. And having 100% of the oxidizer on board is also very dangerous.Where are we on that kind of technology? One future technology that might be relevant is plasma coolers, its like the peltier plate vacuum tube that has high efficiency for cooling. I believe it requires large surface area plates that have a surface finish at least 10 times flatter then a AAA surface plate to manufacture, and possibly exotic emissivity coatings/surface features (not to mention thin substrates that are very liable to warp) (for a solid state cryo condenser that can liquefy significant amounts of air).... its something like making vacuum tubes with kashmir energy (related to 'zero point energy' ) experiment setups that are connected to heat exchangers. Trying to do this with peltiers as is would probobly end up weighing 1000+ tons. My heavy benchtop setup using expensive peltier modules managed to get to something like a ounce of well insulated material to -50C after an hour. However, IIRC the math behind plasma 'heat exchangers' works out to be quite efficient despite the nearly impossible geometry required for them (and unknown behavior of plasma/electron beams? in micro channels or something like that, way over my head)Some kind of mechanical contraption, a light weight super compressor would be interesting too.

author: Doctorandus_P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2025, 03:14:28 am
content: Is coppercone the new faringdon? Looks like he creates about half the topics on this forum lately and it's becoming a bit annoying.

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2025, 03:37:40 am
content: its a fun/concept thread you don't have to post in it, its not like you post anything on this forumnot to mention treez asked for specific solutions to low cost industrial electronics problems aka outsourcing his work design (if you can call it that) work to random people without pay. This is just spit balling some concepts. Basically I think you are just name calling me.Its not like this thread is PLZ HELP MY BOSS WANTS ME 2 FIX A MOTOR CONTROL IN THE FACTORY WITH CHINESE PARTS BEFORE TUESDAY!!12! + a politi-economic rant written in the margins.And I think you will find that if you actually invest some time into doing something difficult that is poorly documented or not on the front page of every electronics or engineering thing ever for the last 30 years (i.e. MCU code and digital design) you will have alot of questions and require alot of advice.

author: TimFox
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2025, 04:10:44 am
content: Would the plane look like an X-15?https://www.nasa.gov/history/65-years-ago-first-factory-rollout-of-the-x-15-hypersonic-rocket-plane/

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2025, 05:42:51 am
content: I saw that one but its a one or two seater I mean like a commercial aviation planeThe only thing that I have seen even gets close is those rocket assists for a cargo planeI think if they can one day people will want to put their foot down and say that they want a plane that won't get destroyed after hitting a genetically modified americanized 50 pound Canadian goose swarmAnd the threat will get much worse when they have heavy autonomous drones flying around delivering heavy packages and stuff. Like a malfunctioning amazon drone carrier hauling a BBQ from home depot... stronger engines and no intake means you can put like a plow on the wing tip to bust up drones. Construction materials might be common too, that can be bricks, pipes, beams, pumps, car parts and all other manner of heavy objects.The more common it gets, the more airports are going to keep getting shut down by minor airspace violations and malfunctions. Short of shooting it down all you can do is toughen up the airplane. Something makes me think with the potential payload of cargo drones, no turbine intake will be safe.

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2025, 06:43:31 am
content: .

author: jpanhalt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2025, 09:06:42 am
content: Quote from: coppercone2 on June 13, 2025, 11:15:48 pmThey also damage windshields and flight surfaces. Ban birds. Of course, even that will leave the even more dangerous idiot-controlled drones.QuotePresumably in an anti-gravity propulsion system weight won't be a problem, but stopping the resulting huge mass might be. What you need are fixed stations in space with long cables to attach to cargo on the ground.QuoteWhy is oxidizer more dangerous than fuel? Some might suggest batteries, but those also need oxidizers.The ultimate answer is Greta Thunberg .

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2025, 09:20:34 am
content: I doubt anyone will be banning anything when drones eventually net billions of dollars+ per year in shippingI think there is so much money in drones that the government would make you take a boat over seas instead of halting the economy for a passenger plane. It will come down to which is the higher earner. I think there will eventually be a confrontation even with all the 'legal measures' taken on drones, they are cheap and numerous. They are gonna be like ..... so citizens do you want higher taxes or drone related subsidies.

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2025, 05:47:46 pm
content: Quote from: coppercone2 on June 13, 2025, 11:15:48 pmI remember all the fuss and public protests there were over noise levels when Concorde was getting approval to fly into New York. I also remember the shrill screaming of non bypass jet engines when my parents used to take me to the observation platform on the Queen's building at Heathrow as a kid. I can't see the public being terribly accepting of the noise generated by rocket engines!More exotic engines have long been mooted for high altitude, hypersonic use but, of course, there are no birds up there.

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2025, 06:02:22 pm
content: how about some kind of hybrid turbine that can have a flow diverter and run on LOX for a short while? (closed air intake)The volume of gasses would be too low ? I swear I read some snippet some where about some engine that got a boost from liquid oxygen but I don't think it was actually closed off which does not really solve the problem. Unless you can close it up ALOT (i.e. big flaps that protect it) and reduce the air intake requirement.Hopefully if they could actually make a bunch of liquid air using a advanced cooler you could also remove the nitrogen rapidly to possibly allow for some higher performance combustion to occur, though the plane generating its own N2 (distilling it or some kind of filter) would also be useful for fire suppression reasons... that is a bit like having your own halon factory onboard to continuously try to keep fires down in areas that have fire if the draft is not too bad. That is something that can keep the wiring (fiber too) intact a little longer, especially if it had its own pipe work, since the conduit would be its own gas heat exchanger.

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2025, 06:13:50 pm
content: If it can't operate (intake air) at low altitude, how does it meet the premise of your OP?

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2025, 06:15:11 pm
content: I guess I did not notice the flaw you did , I am not a turbofan or rocket expert