Getting started with the eC-placer - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: liteyear
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 27, 2019, 08:52:59 pm
content: I'm on the verge on taking the plunge with theeC-placer,and given the dearth of customer experiences on the Internet, I thought I'd document my experiences. This effort is in the spirit of theSmallSMTadventure, albeit without an ulterior motive that seems to have derailed that thread.Background leading up to purchaseI run a small electronic product development consultancy. We have good relationships with manufacturers and use them whenever we have an order for more than about 40 boards. But we do spend a lot of time making prototypes and small batch runs. Quantities are probably in the order of a couple hundred a year. We've learnt that being hands on in the early days closes so many loops on the design that we can feed into improvements next time, and gives our customers a short, responsive design process experience. So, the question of in-house manufacture comes up a lot.We've got a process for storing and sorting components, a handy visualisation for quickly locating component placements on the board, a neat method of applying solder paste using a stencil, and we have a small IR reflow over that after lots of experimentation is starting to become set-and-forget.So the bottleneck is well and truly in the Pick & Place department, which we currently do with tweezers.After a lot of research, mostly on this wonderful forum, I've come to the clear but disappointing conclusion that a robot is not for us. For any jobs where an automatic PnP would be worthwhile, we'd just outsource it. So that's why a manual PnP is an attractive option.Options consideredI haven't been overwhelmed by the options on the market. We are not interesting in a DIY job - we all have plenty of things to do, would prefer to learn from those that have been there and done that on this one. So my shortlist came down to:vpapanik'sinstructionson building your ownAbacomezPick. Same as the FortexM1.SMT CaddyMPP-11Euro CircuitseC-placerI can't see us doing without a magnifying camera or somewhere to put cut tapes, so that pretty much rules out everything except the eC-placer. It's frightfully expensive at about $AUD3700 shipped to Australia, but if that means we can save a few days not mucking around getting it working well, then we can justify it.I'll be putting these arguments to our board in Wednesday, and short of any better ideas, making the purchase that day.

author: Jeroen3
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 27, 2019, 09:15:47 pm
content: I had the same problem. No way an investment of that amount was possible. However our boards are low density, with larger components.I bought two linear bearings with carriages from aliexpress and assembled it on a wooden plate. Much like the DIY from your link, but than with the bearings on only one side.Together withVisualPlaceassembly time went from one board in two days, to four boards in one day.Excluding rework.I think it depends if you will be running production or only prototypes with it.And also the board density.This ezPick however, I had not seen. I'm going to ask for one.With the armrest is looks almost what we have now, except not on plywood.The armrest is mandatory!I think you will be looking at the ec-placer and the SMT Caddy mainly, with their camera system.The ec-Place is an assisted system, it has mechnical stops and such. Might not be what you want.

author: kylehunter
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 27, 2019, 11:43:25 pm
content: That ezPick looks amazing. We have a full line setup, but for prototypes that seems like the best solution I've seen so far. My issue with the eC and the smtcaddy is that I fear that the cut tape setup will take too long and be more trouble than it's worth for a single board as a prototype. I'd rather just dump them out and let it rip. I seriously might buy that ezPick after watching the video.

author: mrpackethead
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 28, 2019, 02:09:17 am
content: i have a dima FP-600 (https://store.comet.bg/download-file.php?id=168). Even though i have a full commerical PNP line, This thing still gets LOTS of use.If you are doing short runs ( 1/2s ) then its a big step up for efficency without the investment of a full PNP line.

author: liteyear
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 28, 2019, 12:44:18 pm
content: You've got me re-considering. I feel like the wrong choice will become obvious, 10 minutes after purchase...For those that like the look of the ezPick: Would you miss a camera? What about upside down parts in the bins? What about mounting the board on the deck?For mrpackethead, what are the killer features of the FP-600? Solder dispensing? Reel loaders? Screen? Components on a lazy susan? Something simpler?

author: SMTech
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 28, 2019, 02:27:46 pm
content: We have something called an MPI M250, in its prime it took mini reels on 20 little pneumatic feeders, combined with a dual 7-segment display a counter and some buttons it had a very basic interface that stepped you through the components, although it lacks a display or any way of showing you where to place what next. Before we had an automatic pick&place we used to build the small number of SMD boards we had on this, mostly this wasn't much more than the SMD only alternative bit in the corner of an otherwise PTH assembly but we also had jobs going though for up to 30 fully surface mount fairly complex boards down to 0603. A combination of careful setup those feeders and some parts stuck to boards would let a skilled user who was familiar with the board they were building hit perhaps 400 cph. That number goes through the floor for one offs, something like Visualplace or the interface expensive manual machines like Fritsch offer obviously would help but there are still limitations to manual placement once you are making more than a couple of boards.Boards size, the bigger the board is the more you have to reach over it and less room there is for parts on boards etc. It also becomes more difficult to see your alignment, unless the system has a topdown camera.Fine pitch, it can be quite hard to keep fine pitch steady and if everything isn't 100% absolutely level big flat devices will move as one edge hits the board before the others. I think the (presumably very expensive) LKPF system locks the XY and allows fine adjustment after that to combat this issue.Armrest/slider- you do often see these, helps keep you arm/sleeve off you board, I actually don't use it but for extended periods thats probably not a good idea, keeping your elbow up can get painful.High component counts - the higher your number of BOM lines or components the more likely you are to make a mistake, this type of building dictates the setup we had, reel feeders and strips all laid out, at some point your going to pick the wrong thing and put it in the wrong place or just forget to place it at all. People after all are not robots and this is a monumentally mind-numbing task. In my experience its going to be at least 10% of assembled boards. Equally the more parts you have the more issues you will have putting them somewhere to pick from.You pretty much need silkscreen as an assistant.These days now we have real p&p the manual machine still has its uses, primarily for putting on the odd components that come in silly packaging (e.g strips of 1/2/5 that) and very small simple jobs/prototype runs which often feature nothing but parts like that. However as our Essemtec is very easy to get new jobs into, my threshold for what I consider simple is quite low and I'm liable to put almost everything through the automatic p&P at least to fit the high volume common shrapnel like 0.1's, 10K etc as they will typically be on the machine already anyway, filling up most of the locations makes the manual pass much simpler. Personally I think this represents a bit of a sweetspot for reasonably frequent low volume manufacture, a little auto p&p pre-loaded with stuff you use all the time+a manual for the things that machine can't handle or you can't buy on a reel.I have never been fully convinced by the carousel features on some semi-auto machines - fine for melf & caps & super annoying for anything that has a right way up. On the MPI the pick head has several microswitches on it, pushing down to turns on the vacuum to pick and then the next push down turns it off again which is quite effective, although it can sometimes be easier to just leave it sucking and let the stickyness of paste pull the device off the nozzle, either way I suspect its slicker than a footpedal.I have spotted an MPI manual placer on eBay once, Dimas a couple of times as well as some OKI ones no idea what the situation might be on the other side of the world but its worth creating a sticky search to keep an eye out.

author: NorthGuy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 28, 2019, 03:17:42 pm
content: These things look strange to me. If you go the distance and build such a device, why not to motorize it so that you could place it with a mouse and a joistick (as opposed to your hand). Would be much easier and more productive. You could even instruct it to move the part to some place in the vicinity of the target footprint automatically. Then you could adjust and place it manually by looking on the screen and using your mouse.

author: SMTech
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 28, 2019, 03:53:56 pm
content: Quote from: NorthGuy on October 28, 2019, 03:17:42 pmWell unless your a professional FPS gamer, I suspect manually moving the arm where you want to go is quicker & easier and lets not forget with these systems your pick location is not predictable, it could be a scattering of parts in a tub/carousel or a jaunty piece of tape. In theory an "in the right sort of place" automated move might prove useful but combing that with manual adjustment and some allowance for health & safety might not be all that straight forwards.

author: NorthGuy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 28, 2019, 05:37:11 pm
content: Quote from: SMTech on October 28, 2019, 03:53:56 pmClicking the "rotate a little bit clockwise button" seems far easier to me than rotating the tool 0.25% while maintaining is steady in three axis. And you can leave in the middle of the adjustment and then come back and continue.Quote from: SMTech on October 28, 2019, 03:53:56 pmClicking the map of your table on the screen and watching the head moving to the position is as straightforward as it can possibly get. Even if it's a pile of components, it's very easy to click the one you want to pick, and then micro-adjust the head if necessary.

author: mrpackethead
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 28, 2019, 06:24:07 pm
content: Quote from: liteyear on October 28, 2019, 12:44:18 pmI got my FP-600 2nd hand, for a $1000USD. It did'tn have the camera option, and i've not retropsectively added it. Its easy to place 0402 and moderate sized IC's with .. ( i do a 16x16mm QFN ), and you can place them more than accurately enough. The killer feature of teh FP-600 is how it controls its vacumn pick up. Theres no footpeddle, like on some systems. It quite simple but very effective. The moment you tocuh the part to pick up, the vacumn starts. then the moment you place it down, it stops. Its very well built.Paste dispense is nothing special, its pretty much like anyones paste dispenser. I guess its just handy that its built in. I mostly use stencils anyway. reel holders work.. The parts in the carosel work, but if they are upside down, you have no easy way to deal to them, and orientation is a problem. I tend just to use it for R/C's that are non polarised. Thats not really specific to the FP-600, but a problem that any loose part manual handling has.

author: liteyear
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 28, 2019, 07:57:43 pm
content: Quote from: blueskull on October 28, 2019, 05:42:00 pmNot yet. But you did ($USD2000 is nearly $AUD4000 once imported) and found it wasn't worth it. That's good to know. Why do you prefer tweezers for small parts? For $4000, this is surprising. How could the machine be improved? How much time do you think the machine saves you a year, and what makes you say that it is not worth it?

author: mrpackethead
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 28, 2019, 09:42:44 pm
content: Quote from: liteyear on October 28, 2019, 07:57:43 pmI can place ~900 jellybean parts per hour if i'm well organised, faster if the are coming off tape, slower if out of the bins.. There is no way i could do that with tweezers, and I'm much less likely to drop a part, or have it spring out of the tweezers. However the big difference between tweezers and a tool like the FP, or the ECpick, is that you have a way to rotate the part very easily and you just can't do that with tweezers as you have to swivel your wrist through 90degrees and it becomes ergonmically very tricky.

author: spongle
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 28, 2019, 09:50:24 pm
content: Or you turn the board instead. I try to arrange my placing so I do long runs of a single orientation (easier because I'm often doing a batch of 5 or so small boards).

author: mrpackethead
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 28, 2019, 10:40:37 pm
content: The next problem with using tweezers is that sometimes because parts are placed in tight proximity, its difficult to hang on to the sides of the part while not bumping other parts. When your holding it from the top this is not an issue.

author: NorthGuy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 28, 2019, 11:16:31 pm
content: Quote from: mrpackethead on October 28, 2019, 10:40:37 pmI don't use tweezers when placing stuff unless I'm soldering it at the same time. Air pickup tool works much better. I would guess rails would be of some help, but if you don't count the time for cutting and peeling off, you certainly can do 900 per hour with air tool alone. I only do prototyping, so I rarely have more than 30 parts of the same kind, so it is more of cutting and peeling off rather than actually placing.

author: Jeroen3
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 30, 2019, 09:11:11 am
content: With tweezers you can't pick up from tape. With vacuum you can.

author: liteyear
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 30, 2019, 11:35:35 am
content: OrderingOff to a bad start. Got approval from the board to proceed, so created the shopping cart this morning. Before hitting buy, I sent an email asking for clarification of what's in the box and whether I should add extra bits to the order. 14 hours later I had no response, so I tried using the online chat. A slow and broken conversation later I finally explained the situation, and then the chat was interrupted and I couldn't reconnect.Finally, I rang the Belgium number, sat on hold, nearly gave up and finally got through. Once we switched to English, I explained the situation again, and finally got the response:For about 4-5 years, Euro Circuits don't ship equipment outside the EU Zone because an American customer didn't pay their invoice and they had no way to pursue them.So that's a big fat failure. Thanks for tuning in and sorry for the disappointment. Back to the drawing board!

author: liteyear
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 30, 2019, 08:34:42 pm
content: Ordering: Plan BAfter licking my wounds and burying the sunk cost of not being able to buy the eC-Placer, I came up with a new plan. Although it is missing a few essential features, and has some questionable ones, theezPickis the next best option for us because its low price justifies a bit of effort to modify it. I expect it will end up costing us more than the ec-Placer in time and materials to get it where we want it, but it's all a learning experience anyway.I've ordered the right-handed ezPick with the foot pedal option. I intend to do the same mods for the same reasons as MagicSmokerdescribes, namely, replacing the silly looking lazy susan for a larger flat bed that can be earthed and have magnets stuck to it. I also intend to create a cut tape holder for it and add a light and magnifying camera.The initial search for a magnifying camera was long and painful. It's hard to know where to start, and Google searches return mountains of garage to wade through. In despair, I ordered theAndonstar USB Digital Microscope, largely because it's the only camera I could find that had any sort of trustworthy information on it. It claims 500x zoom and 2MP, and has an 8 LED light embedded around the lens with a dial to adjust brightness. I'm hoping it will be light enough to mount to the ezPick moving head with a 3D printed bracket, but if not it will just be a microscope for the lab.I then spent an equally painful period looking for a suitable screen for the camera. I still haven't found one. I'm going to try a Raspberry Pi 7" screen because we happen to have one lying around, but it's not clear what the performance will be like.The ezPick cost $USD899 including $USD250 shipping. At that price point we'll probably also pay $AUD200 in import duties too. Order has been accepted but I haven't received a shipping date yet.

author: pisoiu
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 30, 2019, 10:53:24 pm
content: Quote from: liteyear on October 30, 2019, 11:35:35 amSorry for being off topic but I don't get it. I am in EU zone and for the same reason I sell outside EU only with full payment in advance. Why they don't want to sell to you? Or you are not willing to pay in advance?

author: mrpackethead
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2019, 12:48:44 am
content: I'd not worry about the camera untill you've had a play with it. My practical experience with the FP-600 showed it was pretty much un-needed.

author: DTJ
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2019, 02:30:00 am
content: For what its worth, I built a couple of manual placers.The first one was the linear slide XY configuration. I worked but I found it laborsome to have to move. Then I saw a different design with two arms linked with bearings. It's very smooth and easy to operate, you still need the arm rest but its a breeze to use.This is the design that I copied:

author: liteyear
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2019, 06:18:21 am
content: Quote from: pisoiu on October 30, 2019, 10:53:24 pmHad the same thoughts, but at international mobile phone rates, didn't want to go in to it. I was expecting to pay upfront by credit card.Quote from: DTJ on October 31, 2019, 02:30:00 amVery interesting! Love the compactness and the ease of use. Otherwise I'm attracted to the XY slides because they allow you to constrain and/or nudge one direction (with mechanical stops or even your finger), which I figure would be useful for precision placing.

author: SMTech
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2019, 09:32:51 am
content: Quote from: liteyear on October 31, 2019, 06:18:21 amI'd certainly think a slide was better not least because that gives you a square range of motion, circular ones can be quite frustrating. The slide mechanism on our MPI manual p&p sandwiches the round tubing that makes up the Y arm and X slide with 2 wheels each side. I've no idea if its a standard thing they took off a shelf or something custom made, although nothing else looks custom to me, its very free running, much more so than the ones I have seen on a super cheap CNC router.The important thing to remember is these systems only work up to a certain scale, lots of boards or lots of parts rapidly bring in massive ergonomic headaches on where those parts go prior to picking, how to keep them organised, how to replenish them and how to keep the operator fully engaged and so keep errors to a minimum.If you do decide to make your own, take a typical board, get all the parts (or a cheap representation of them like empty tape) lay them out how you think your system would work.Boards with a low BOM line count, low component count or where the parts on the PCB happen to be laid in in a predictable & organised manner (straight lines or repeated clusters) are by far the easiest and are the natural form of some applications.Doing jobs of 1 or 2 (or however many you can fit in your place area at once) are also simple because then you can work through your parts kits one part number at a time and cross them off as you go.Go on youtube and watch mikes videos of the Versatronics and watch that automatic machine place parts, that is a machine managing about 1K components an hour, I'm sorry but anyone claiming an actualized & averaged place rate anything approaching that with a manual system is talking complete tosh.

author: mrpackethead
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2019, 06:08:18 pm
content: Quote from: SMTech on October 31, 2019, 09:32:51 amOr they have actually done it. I had an issue where we were not able to get a SMT Fuse/Holder in on tape. Just loose. And time was against us. This particular pcb had 26 Fuses on it. ( LED controller, had a fuse per output ). We put the Dima "Inline" with the PNP ( i use 'inline" loosely ) and hand placed those fuses with it, and where able to do a board in less than a minute, ( including taking it off the pasted rack and putting it on the PNP conveyor. ( three boards per panel, but the placement rate was around 25 parts per minute ) ( 1500/hour ).. Yes, a very optimal problem for it. But I stand by my comment of before, if you are well organised, have a good placement assistance software package ( theres a great free one ). 800-1000 parts per hour for a well practiced operator is well acheivable.

author: NorthGuy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2019, 09:19:47 pm
content: Quote from: SMTech on October 31, 2019, 09:32:51 amLook. Let's say I'm assembling 3 boards. It takes really long time. Why? Because what I need to do is this:1. Look at the BOM. Select the next component (say it's three 0.1uF cap). Look at the board map, see where I need to place them. 30 seconds.2. Go find the reel or bag where the component is stored, unpack, count 9 pieces, cut off, pack back, put back into place (so I can find it next time). Bring the strip back to the table. 1 minute.3. Stick the strip to the table, make sure it's firm, peel of the cover. 30 seconds. If I screw up something, it may take much longer, and may require going back to step 2.4. Get an air pickup and place 9 capacitors at the desired places. 30 seconds. BTW it's 1080 parts/hour rate.If you sum this up, it's 2.5 minutes. If I could get a magic tool which would do step 4 momentarily, it would be 2 minutes. This would save me whooping 20% of my time, and instead of spending 5 hours on my 3 boards, I would do it in 4. Not much, huh. Why even bother?But, if I had my components in feeders with automatic PnP machine, all I need to do is load the boards and press a button, and at the same 1080 parts/hour rate it does the whole job in 30 minutes while I'm away drinking coffee.Same placement rate. Very different results.

author: lilstevie
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2019, 12:21:10 am
content: Quote from: mrpackethead on October 31, 2019, 06:08:18 pmAny suggestions on this? I've just been playing around with MeatbagPnP and it works, but there's definitely room for improvement

author: mrpackethead
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2019, 09:36:54 am
content: Quote from: NorthGuy on October 31, 2019, 09:19:47 pmwhat you describe is the reason why i have both a PNP line with 250 reels of parts pretty much peromantly on it, and a manual pnp. Its why civil contractors have 30T diggers and a shovel. its why Logistics companys, have motorbike couriers and container ships.

author: spongle
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2019, 10:28:13 am
content: It doesn't help with part organization, but Kicad IBOM (https://openscopeproject.org/InteractiveHtmlBomDemo/html/OSPx201.html) is pretty fantastic as a board guide. I have an old ipad dedicated to it at my assembly station.

author: SMTech
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2019, 12:05:51 pm
content: Quote from: spongle on November 01, 2019, 10:28:13 amoo I like that, could even be a handy inspection aid

author: spongle
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2019, 01:16:38 pm
content: Quote from: SMTech on November 01, 2019, 12:05:51 pmYep, in the latest github versions they even show the traces and you can click on a pad to see all connections. My dream is something like this combined with computer vision for an augmented reality overlay on the physical board.These guys are working on it, but I think the display tech isn't really there yet:https://www.inspectar.com/

author: Jeroen3
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2019, 06:25:36 pm
content: Quote from: NorthGuy on October 31, 2019, 09:19:47 pmThis is why we just order all parts counted and bagged from Mouser.And assemble with VisualPlace.There is work that entails sorting the bags to bom order, to prevent playing memory on one big table of mouser bags, but otherwise it’s all sitting: open bag, look at board, place parts, F7 (i think).

author: Styno
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2019, 09:12:50 am
content: It looks like I have the same experience asmrpackethead. We have a vintage PnP machine but still use our manual Essemtec Expert quite a lot as we have for the past 20 years. It was quite an investment back in the days, more than 4000 EUR if I recall correctly, but we built many thousands boards with it. I cannot imagine that we would/could have done that with tweezers (the horror!).It's mainly used for prototyping and weird components nowadays.For very small runs the manual easily outruns the automatic PnP machine but when you start thinking about manual runs that last more than a day that starts to depend a lot on how smooth you can setup your workflow on both types of machines. One-off and small strips of cut-tape on a real feeder is always a pain to set-up (leader, trailer, feeder adjustments and fine tuning), the initial setup component loss from the automatic PnP is also quite high.So yeah, there is definitely a use case for these manual machines. But -as with automatic ones- it might be difficult to find the right person willing and capable to operate it in a small company, especially if you cannot hire someone specifically for this as a full time job. We are primarily a software company and very few colleagues are willing to spend more than a day placing components (one of our receptionists likes it and is meticulous as well so she's a great asset!).

author: liteyear
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2019, 03:57:53 am
content: Yes, we're big on only buying equipment we're willing to become adept at and have good workflows around. Too many shops with all the gear and no idea.Shipping UpdateFinally, a week after placing the order, it was marked as complete and a tracking number issued. It has not shipped yet.

author: SMTech
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2019, 12:01:24 am
content: Here's one of the manual machines that pops up on eBay now and thenhttps://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/OK-Industries-SMT-8001-SMT-Placement-Machine/362401276626?QuoteThat has be be highly dependent on the machine, I don't really have any of those issues bar the one-off parts and very small strips (5 is too short, 10 wouldn't mind a trailer on it), also not a fan of SOICs in a tiny cut off piece of tube.

author: Jeroen3
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2019, 06:48:41 am
content: Quote from: SMTech on November 07, 2019, 12:01:24 amWe just discarded one of those because of missing parts and no recognizable branding or model whatsoever...

author: kylehunter
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2019, 09:04:33 pm
content: Quote from: liteyear on November 06, 2019, 03:57:53 amAwesome! Please let us know your thoughts. I will be buying it depending on your thoughts.

author: kylehunter
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 23, 2019, 05:41:51 pm
content: Quote from: liteyear on November 06, 2019, 03:57:53 amAny update? You received it yet?

author: liteyear
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 26, 2019, 08:38:35 am
content: Arrival!The unit actually arrived on 11/11/19, but a few days prior my wife gave birth 4.5 weeks ahead of schedule so the great unboxing had to wait a couple of weeks!Anyway, here's my immediate reactions:Well packaged, with custom foam protection everywhere.Not much assembly required - basically just bolting the arm tower to the base.Instruction booklet surprisingly poor for an American company - unclear photos and missing steps.The lazy susan rotating base is a solid bit of kit - serious ball bearing design and high quality materials. Bit of a pity, because it seems to be the least useful part of the machine. Our intention is to ditch it for a custom non-movable base.Pump, pedal, switch, etc. all are intuitive and feel fit for purpose. The power pack came with an American plug, but a few seconds with the pliers and we have a perfectly fine Australian version.The pump hose fits loosely into the top of the pick-up tool, and each of the pickup tips fit snuggly on to the end of the pick-up tool. So easy, toolless set up.Something, probably the aluminium component bin case, has sharp edges. Pretty easy to end up with painless bloody cuts after handling.The hand rest truck and the slides it sits on are all very smooth and comfortable - but only if you're positioned higher than I was expecting. That is, your forearm really needs to be horizontal so it can move in a x-y plane, which means your shoulder ends up an upper-arm's length above the hand rest truck. That puts your head at least 50cm from the pick-up tool tip, which for me is uncomfortably far from the circuit board. But I might get used to it over time.Up/down motion, and x-y motion is well weighted, but both suffer from non-consistent stiction. In the up-down direction the collar often catches in a stick-slip fashion, and in the x-y motion the movement is smooth in the arm but then high-friction once the arm mounts have to slide on their shaft. This results in some awkward movements, that I'm not sure will become more natural with time. Given that it's this x-y-z movement that the unit fundamentally provides, I was expecting it to be more consistent.As well as 3 different sized pickup tips, 3 different suction cups are provided, but there is no instructions on how to use them. I assume they become female parts to the pickup tips, but they don't fit well so I'm not sure how to get the best out of them.All I've done so far is pick up a few grains of rice and drop them on a postcard. It works! This week we'll be putting the unit to task on an actual PCB, so stay tuned for the usage report.

author: tech_builder
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 31, 2020, 02:22:57 pm
content: Hi,I am curious about your thoughts after having had the machine for a little while now. Did the stiction issues clear up? Did any other issues arise that weren't obvious at first?Thanks

author: VladaAca
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2021, 07:41:02 am
content: ...can You align and place accurately QFP's without camera?

author: liteyear
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: July 11, 2022, 02:36:00 am
content: Yeah sorry for the radio silence. As I mentioned, we had a baby and 3 years later I still haven't recovered.We did end up putting theezPickto work. After a bit of experimentation we ended up creating a dedicated "Population Station" for it which housed the ezPick itself, pump, foot pedal, lights, reflow oven, IPA, brushes, squeegee, etc. And we created a few accessories for it, like:a long sheet of ~6mm timber to use as a work surface, instead of the included turntable. It can slide left and right to facilitate loading and to maximise the reach of the ezPick. I even added a solder inlay of our logo. Alas, no photos.3D printed runners for aforementioned timber sheet.Various tubs for component and accessory storage.3D printed c-section to clamp the ezPick to the bench, so it doesn't tip over when you lean on it.And we iterated on a scheme to convert you BOM from boxes and boxes of bags and bags of components, into a sheet where all components are laid out and labelled for speedy picking and easy storage.Unfortunately I have few non-baby photos from that time and it was all a blur. But there were some really cool ideas that came out of it.Now, usability:yeah we smoothed the stiction issues sufficiently with a bit of lubricant (mineral oil I think).there's no better way to pick and place than with a vacuum pen - picking from cut tape is a nightmare without it, and rotating prior to placement by rolling your fingers on the pen is a dream.coupled with iBOM, it's a great to have your components laid out before you start a population, so when you inevitably get interrupted, everything is where you left it and iBOM tells you where you were up to. We ended up adding a touchscreen on a floating arm so iBOM was always within reach.because there's a setup time, it's important to have a dedicated station with power, the pump, the screen and all the nozzles and accessories ready to use, otherwise it's too tempting to just grab some tweezers and get going - that's always a more frustrating option but just so convenient. So using the ezPick has to be convenient too if it's going to become part of your normal process.Conclusion:this is a way more comfortable way to manually place, with far fewer risks (dropping parts, losing your place). But the workflow has to be a bit different to not require excessive setup/pack-up time. So if you're used to dumping the contents of your cut tapes onto the all-purpose soldering mat and going to town with tweezers, then you have some new habits to practice. It's worth it, but the gratification is delayed.Final thoughts:I just bought a "hobbyist" automatic pick and place. Regardless of how convenient the ezPick is, manual PnP is mind-numbing, requires a lot of concentration, and absorbs the time of a human whose mind could be applied elsewhere. Beyond a couple hundred components (eg. a couple of complex boards or 5-10 simple ones), it's robotic work for a human. Automatic PnP will never fully replace manual PnP, but as I get older I get more interested in robots doing robotic things and humans doing human things. My hope with the "hobbyist" PnP is that I can massage it into being my co-bot - working alongside me on the mundane while I focus on the bits that require squishy fingers and grey matter.In the last image (IMG_4117 2.jpg) take note of the two sheets of card towards the centre of the photo with the cut tape stuck on them. The sheet material is the stuff our stencils come packaged in, the cut tape is stuck down with two-sided tape, and the BOM printout is autogenerated from a KiCad script. This is the process we were iterating on to go from DigiKey bag to ready for the ezPick. You can just drop these sheets on to the ezPick table and pick from there.

author: liteyear
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: July 11, 2022, 02:42:16 am
content: QuoteWell, in my mind you can do that with tweezers, provided you have a steady hand and good visual guides on the board. And the ezPick is quite a bit more steady (no tweezer shake), so it only gets easier. If the paste is bad or the visual guides are poor, then all bets are off.A camera probably makes it quicker because you can be more confident in your alignment as you make the final z-axis movements. Without the camera you need to pause just above the surface and confirm with your eyes. But in our experience the camera looked like a cool novelty that we never justified doing. We had a trinocular microscope for big screen visuals.