Moku:go - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: richard_wood
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: April 29, 2021, 06:53:20 am
content: Has anyone had a good look over the Moku:Go?https://www.liquidinstruments.com/products/hardware-platforms/mokugo/the specs for each instrument function is pretty low; but for the price point and the number of basic level functions it has, it could be really, really good for students and beginner hobbyists?

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 29, 2021, 08:01:54 am
content: So... it's like an Analog Discovery butmuchlarger, with 'dark mode' low-contrast software and iPad app?(which isn't necessarily bad, apart from the low-contrast software)At the end of the day it it will all come down to the software, which is still in beta and doesn't appear to do much without the hardware.(nb. You can download the Analog Discovery software and use it with your sound card)

author: Anthocyanina
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 29, 2021, 09:03:47 am
content: I love how it looks, but then i saw this in the oscilloscope specifications: "Input noise 8 mV RMS (± 5 V)". Isn't that really really bad? why have a 12 bit ADC if the noise is 8mV in that range? am i understading it wrong? hmmmI'd also like to know if it has intensity graded display, that would be really nice!

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 29, 2021, 09:59:41 am
content: Quote from: Anthocyanina on April 29, 2021, 09:03:47 amIt has two fixed input ranges: +/-5V and +/-25V. (similar to the Analog discovery)The +/-5V range is 10V peak to peak so 10V/4096 steps = 2mV resolution. In practice the lower bit of any ADC is most likely just noise so that gives approx. 4mV resolution."8mV noise"? Sounds about right - at least they warn you!nb. The Analog discovery is 14 bits so it's a bit better in this regard.

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 29, 2021, 11:31:14 am
content: I notice that all of its power supply output voltages are positive, the highest being 0 to +16V. Not having a negative supply output reduces its usefulness for Opamp circuits.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 29, 2021, 12:01:07 pm
content: Quote from: Gyro on April 29, 2021, 11:31:14 amNo, there's negative supplies as well:

author: ebastler
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 29, 2021, 01:33:48 pm
content: Quote from: richard_wood on April 29, 2021, 06:53:20 amAny affiliation?

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 29, 2021, 05:07:34 pm
content: At this price point Analog Discovery is a way better option.I too suspect advertising. But you need to have a good product to advertise.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 29, 2021, 08:31:31 pm
content: Quote from: ataradov on April 29, 2021, 05:07:34 pmYep, that was my first thought too. Somebody signed up just to say that... very suspicious.Ifit's a company salesman who thinks he (or she) is being clever thentime for a reality check: You're not clever at all and you're totally clueless about these forums or how they work, you'll be found out very quickly. It's much better to come right out and declare your interests.Official representatives who actually answer technical questions and take criticism of their products areverywelcome here. We needmorecompanies doing that, not less.eg. Why is it so darn big? Students have enough stuff to fit in their backpacks without adding something that huge. The only excuse for the size would be if it has a storage compartment to put all the cables and accessories inside.

author: Anthocyanina
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 29, 2021, 08:41:11 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on April 29, 2021, 08:31:31 pmIs it really too big? from the pictures it looks like it's about the size of those hantek/owon usb oscilloscopes, maybe a bit thicker and a bit longer? like a large notebook!

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 29, 2021, 08:54:58 pm
content: Quote from: Anthocyanina on April 29, 2021, 08:41:11 pmIt's "The lab that fits in your backpack":The Analog Discovery does pretty much the same things and fits in the palm of your hand:(OK, that's without the BNC adapter... but it's not very big either - it's there in the background of that pic)

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 29, 2021, 09:00:38 pm
content: There are dimensions: 13 cm x 24 cm x 3.4 cm (5.1" x 9.4" x 1.5").It is huge for what it is. I'm kind of curious to see what's on the inside. It has to be half empty PCB. They probably used existing case or something like that.Analog Discovery also $200 cheaper and just includes all the features in one model.

author: ebastler
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 29, 2021, 09:08:16 pm
content: Quote from: ataradov on April 29, 2021, 05:07:34 pmI would assume that the real sales channel is not to hobbyists via electronics forums, but through universities who make it a required or recommended part of their coursework. Distribute via McGrawHill or such, sell via university bookstores.In that case it would be sold less on the merits of the hardware, but rather based on the courseware that is provided with it, printed and/or software.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 29, 2021, 09:10:29 pm
content: While we're at it: Those BNC connectors are totally exposed. I'm not sure it should be shoved into a backpack like that, they'll break off and/or fill up with backpack fluff in no time.

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 29, 2021, 09:15:11 pm
content: Quote from: ebastler on April 29, 2021, 09:08:16 pmThey are clearly bad at marketing, as you can see here.And with inferior and more expensive product, I guess it is not easy to market it even to universities.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 29, 2021, 09:27:39 pm
content: Quote from: ataradov on April 29, 2021, 09:15:11 pmI await "richard wood"'s next post with great interest.

author: Anthocyanina
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 29, 2021, 10:01:33 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on April 29, 2021, 08:54:58 pmOh wow, yeah, i totally missed that one picture with the backpack. from the dimensions i compared it with my drawing tablet, which does fit in my backpack(h640p), but it's of course a lot thinner, i guess you'll need quite the chonky backpack for it

author: richard_wood
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: April 30, 2021, 08:06:28 am
content: Quote from: ebastler on April 29, 2021, 01:33:48 pmhaha no affiliation.... just another pleb who wishes he had the $$ for a R&S 2k series

author: richard_wood
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: April 30, 2021, 08:11:23 am
content: Quote from: Fungus on April 29, 2021, 08:31:31 pmI'm not a sales rep >.< why is everyone assuming that?....I actually signed up because I've been watching Dave's YouTube for a bit and am starting undergrad EE at Curtin next semester...........

author: richard_wood
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: April 30, 2021, 08:15:43 am
content: Quote from: ataradov on April 29, 2021, 09:00:38 pmI would have to assume the size difference is due to the on-board power supplies?

author: richard_wood
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: April 30, 2021, 08:18:32 am
content: Quote from: ataradov on April 29, 2021, 09:15:11 pmrefer other quoted posts re: me NOT being a sales rep or affiliated...... sheesh so much hate here.

author: ebastler
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 30, 2021, 10:08:54 am
content: @richard_wood: No hate, but some skepticism. Both regarding the nature of your post (we have certainly seen "covert" product placements before) and the technical merits of the product.If you are indeed just a hobbyist wondering whether the Moku is right for you: No offence intended, and please consider the advice from multiple users above: The Digilent is probably the better product for you, at a lower cost.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 30, 2021, 11:06:44 am
content: Quote from: richard_wood on April 30, 2021, 08:15:43 amAnalog Discovery has 2 power supplies.OK, they're not as capable but DC-DC converters are only three or four small components these days. There's no way the power supplies justify it being so big.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 30, 2021, 11:12:00 am
content: Quote from: ebastler on April 30, 2021, 10:08:54 amThe Moku:go has better specs in some areas and it has an iPad app (presumably with low contrast Californian-startup graphics).It all comes down to the software though. AD II has a downloadable demo that works with your sound card so you can try it out, the Moku:go is completely unknown right now.And it has a name that's painful to type.

author: richard_wood
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: April 30, 2021, 12:08:55 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on April 30, 2021, 11:06:44 amI suppose it wouldn't been the first time form hasn't followed function; must be trying to distinguish itself based on aesthetics, much like apple used aesthetics to help distinguish itself from PC's

author: richard_wood
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: April 30, 2021, 12:13:38 pm
content: Quote from: ebastler on April 30, 2021, 10:08:54 amthen maybe wait for a reply to initial inquiry about affiliations instead of going on a multi post rant? was a hell of welcome the forum...... thanks chaps.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 30, 2021, 12:22:28 pm
content: Quote from: richard_wood on April 30, 2021, 12:08:55 pmIt looks expensive?It's supposed to be portable though, they even call it "The lab that fits in your backpack". Technically true, but it almost needs itsownbackpack.Maybe they're planing an innovative "mini" version in the future.

author: ebastler
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 30, 2021, 12:49:44 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on April 30, 2021, 12:22:28 pmDid anyone mention that the :go alreadyisthe innovative "mini" as well as "low cost" version?https://www.liquidinstruments.com/products/hardware-platforms/Moku:lab, starting at $3500...

author: SMB784
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 30, 2021, 03:02:42 pm
content: Quote from: ebastler on April 30, 2021, 12:49:44 pmThese guys reached out to me after I gave a talk at a conference. I had a meeting with them about their product (in this case, the Moku:lab) and how it could address my needs. The basic takeaway from this meeting is that the Moku:lab is intended to function as many instruments in a start-up lab environment, e.g. you just got your funding and you arent 100% sure which devices you need to get your experiments going, so you get one of these and it has the ability to function as a lower-end lock-in amplifier, a mid-range arbitrary waveform generator, a tunable filter, a mid-range oscilloscope, etc. You can even chain a couple of instruments together in one FPGA configuration so it can function as more than one device simultaneously, e.g. a lock-in amplifier fed to an oscilloscope, etc (again, depending on the devices, some devices cant be used together).Given that the lab that I work in is already established, the Moku:lab does not have the specs to compete with our top of the line instruments that we already have, so it doesn't have a place in a well established laboratory in my estimation, with the possible exception of an established lab looking to move into new experimental territory.The most interesting aspect of the whole conversation was what they were planning for later this year. They mentioned that they were going to release a much beefier version of the Moku:lab with way better specs (still not top of the line, but much more competitive), and they are going to open the FPGA so that you can add your own custom IP to interface with their existing IP-based instruments all on chip. That seems like a more compelling option, but they have yet to release the details so who knows how it will eventually end up.

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 30, 2021, 04:23:05 pm
content: Getting funding is the reason to get real equipment. If you are not even sure what equipment you will need - what are you doing getting funding? For $3500 it is a huge waste of money.And I'm with others - sorry for the reaction, but this style of drive-by advertising is very common. If you are considering that thing, look at Analog Discovery closer. Download their software - it is functional without the hardware.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 30, 2021, 06:07:17 pm
content: Quote from: ebastler on April 30, 2021, 12:49:44 pmNo, no.... the real "mini" version will be more expensive. Everybody knows that smaller/thinner things cost more.