removing stale cigarette stench from an IEEE-488 cable - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / repair

author: graybeard
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 17, 2020, 06:40:44 pm
content: I recently purchased a13 foot long Dupont IEEE-488 cable from fleaBay. The cable works well, and the connector contacts appear clean. However the cable insulation jacket reeks from the stench of stale cigarette smoke. I've had it sitting in front of a fan in my garage almost two weeks and it has not made a dent in the odor. Do you have a suggestion for a way to remove the stench?Thanks . . . . . Chris

author: Haenk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 17, 2020, 07:05:17 pm
content: The plastic mantle of the cable has probably absorbed the oily stinky smoke. You could try an ozone generator, but I fear it's impossible to remove the stench.

author: bob91343
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 17, 2020, 07:16:03 pm
content: This is a common problem with used gear. There is no simple solution. Sometimes leaving it outdoors for a few months helps. Washing it with all sorts of solvents doesn't really work, although repeated hot soapy water washes can often alleviate the stench.

author: schmitt trigger
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 17, 2020, 07:24:48 pm
content: As bob mentions.......There are few things better to remove bad smells than a bright summertime sun exposure.Of course if humidity is low, the better.

author: Syntax Error
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 17, 2020, 08:11:36 pm
content: I know the problem!You could try the old school trick of wiping the cable with hot vinegar and baking soda, but you'll probably get a cable that smells like a BBQ. Alternatively there's acetone or gasoline, but these are likely to dissolve the plasticOr just contact the seller to say it was not fit for purpose and give me my money back.

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 17, 2020, 08:40:04 pm
content: Can you imagine the aroma of that HP box the cable was plugged in to.

author: cheeseit
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: July 17, 2020, 10:06:02 pm
content: The plastic har probably absorbed a lot of it as mentioned but try cleaning it with Windex on a rag. I've found nothing as good as it for removing residue and smell from cigaret smoking.

author: coromonadalix
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 17, 2020, 11:33:31 pm
content: Isopropyl alcohol ?? could help a little ?

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 18, 2020, 12:29:33 am
content: I know you want to use the cable, but my experience is that two to three years of outdoor exposure is required to really knock the stench down. That is in a hot climate with long summers. I would assume that it takes longer in cooler, short summer locations. Exposure time will also vary with your sensitivity to the smell.Presumably a high temperature bake out in a well ventilated oven would work, and probably quite a bit faster. Something like 70C.

author: helius
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 18, 2020, 12:48:33 am
content: The ideal solvent for cigarette residue is supercritical CO2, but it is difficult to apply for obvious reasons.Second best would be triethylene glycol in alcohol solution. Isopropyl alcohol will do something, but may be slower than desired.Ozone treatment can also be effective, but as it is corrosive I would not recommend using it on GPIB cables.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 18, 2020, 12:50:21 am
content: Wash it with Oil Eater or a similar degreaser. Nicotine is oily and coats everything, a good degreaser often helps a lot by removing the smelly oil. You could also try wiping it down with a pleasant smelling product like orange oil based cleaner, that will remove some of the nicotine as well as adding its own nicer smell.

author: SilverSolder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 18, 2020, 12:57:21 am
content: Quote from: james_s on July 18, 2020, 12:50:21 amExactly - use an oil. You could try an essential oil - peppermint, lavender, etc. Who knows, maybe you'll make a new invention - scented cables?

author: duak
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 18, 2020, 03:56:38 am
content: I've found that Oxyclean powder in warm water is very good at removing organic stains from fabrics. It seemed to work fairly well on older clothing used by a smoker. Some plastic containers I have picked up either some tomato stains or just a general funkiness that Oxyclean took out after some day long soaking. Cables are less permeable than fabrics and similar to containers. I would suggest coiling the cable into a round container with the connectors bagged and sticking up and then pouring enough Oxyclean and water to make a paste and let it soak. If if's doing anything, the liquid will change color as the crud is drawn out.

author: graybeard
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 19, 2020, 06:33:05 am
content: I want to thank everyone for the helpful ideas. I started with the least invasive idea of putting it out in the sun.I put the cable out on the hood of our Black Miata were it spent two full days under the Southern California summer sun. I brought it in just before sunset so no dew would settle on it. In those two days the level of odor changed from an offensive smell if you were within a few feet of the cable to now not being able to detect odor putting my nose up to the cable. My guess is combination of the elevated temperature and UV exposure did in the odor.It seems to be better now, but I am not yet convinced it is a long term fix. If the odor has diffused into jacket, it may return as it diffuses back out with time. If the odor returns I will post again. But for now it seems OK.Thanks,Chris

author: Haenk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 19, 2020, 07:47:45 am
content: Be aware that the chemical softener in the cable might damage the paint on your car.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 19, 2020, 05:51:57 pm
content: Not only that, the high temperature can drive that plasticizer out of the rubber and cause it to turn hard and brittle.Washing it is a much safer method.

author: graybeard
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 19, 2020, 10:20:39 pm
content: As I had feared, the odor has diffused well into the insulation jacket of the wire and is beginning to return. Although it no longer reeks as before, I can smell it when I put my nose up to it and the intensity seems to be increasing. I have no way to quantify the odor intensity, the only instrument I have is my nose, and that is the one that really matters.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 19, 2020, 10:22:10 pm
content: There are no win-win solutions.Plasticizer diffuses out over time. Heat speeds that process. Same for the various chemicals involved in tobacco stench.Both plasticizer and tobacco stench wash out with solvents.In either case it is a race to see if the smell gets to an acceptable level before the cable becomes unusable. Hopefully the application doesn't require frequent or extreme cable flexing. If it does it is time to buy a reel of heat shrink and get busy with an Exacto knife.

author: jh15
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 20, 2020, 02:20:42 am
content: I found a total cure and still can't believe it. I bought a 2008 in 2013 Honda Element from craigs list. The girls owning it, were major smokers in it, and it was full of dog hair. I hate cig smoke, but the price was good and thought I'd air it out.I left the tailgate open for days neighbor asked if it had a dead pig in it, and removed the fake blue led cigarette lighter 'deodorizer, cleaned out hair, removed seats, blew out sand and stuff. No help, looked up fabreeze, steam cleaning, other car owners problems.One thing I noticed is commercial ozone process. Hotels use some machine or service to clean a non-smoking room of gig smoke. Also I saw stuff on car ozone commercial products.Being (I think I was in EEVblog then) a leg above, threw some experience in ozone diy stuff into mind.looking for ozone stuff (made things similar in youth from TV high voltage playthings) somehow I stumbled across a generator on Ebay.It is a neon sign transformer, and a ceramic plate with plated on spark discharge points similar to Dave's PCB discharge points.Aline cord and power switch.After worrying about how ozone will eat up all your car wiring, sour milk in your refrigerator, and make my male cat pregnant, I tried it.Twenty minutes I tried it on dashboard, thought I'd do it again with fresh oxygen if needed. It uses up oxygen but in my suv, it wasn't like a cardboard box with microphone screens I was building for another project to try.Gone! I was sure too good to be true. After winter, I thought for sure smell would come back when closed up next summer. Nothing!I'll post edit here the thing if it shows on ebay or wherever I bought it. Think it was 20 something doll hairs. USDIt didn't melt all my wiring, and maybe with some woowoo my Element hasn't broken down.Update: I don't see the unit I bought anymore. It is a small neon sign transformer with a ceramic plate. It was mounted on a wooden board with an electrical box, wall switch.I see stuff on eBay you could wire up. the xfmr to line, and a ceramic plate with toothed electrodes. Reminds me of Dave's arc discharge video on PCB's. Never needed it again. Sorry some repeats.

author: winniethepooh_icu
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 20, 2020, 03:08:14 am
content: Remove covers from ends and securely wrap and protect the metal ends from ozone, then leave it in a cardboard box with a miniature ozone generator for a few days to a week.If smell comes back after a while do it again, should not take more than two treatments.

author: graybeard
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 04, 2020, 10:39:50 pm
content: The stink seems to be finally gone It's taken about three months of airing out inside the garage at night and on the fence in the sun during the day.

author: SilverSolder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 04, 2020, 11:11:19 pm
content: Sounds like a good argument for not smoking!

author: graybeard
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 05, 2020, 04:07:52 am
content: Quote from: SilverSolder on October 04, 2020, 11:11:19 pmAlmost as good an argument as that it will make you die a slow, painful, suffocating death.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 05, 2020, 04:52:59 am
content: Not to mention the cost, it has always struck me as a rich man's pastime yet the poor statistically are much more likely to smoke. Never saw the point myself but it certainly seems to appeal to a lot of people.

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 05, 2020, 09:14:51 am
content: I think those vaping things are better (the cheaper the better) - all the excitement of not knowing when they're going to spontaneously combust on you, without high cost of adding gambling to you your list of addictions.

author: SilverSolder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 05, 2020, 12:23:20 pm
content: Our species is not entirely rational, if you haven't noticed!

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 05, 2020, 08:12:05 pm
content: I suppose it helped that growing up I knew a handful of smokers and every one of them was repeatedly trying to quit. Throughout my life I think I've only known 3 or 4 people who actually successfully quit. My grandmother quit smoking shortly before I was born and 30 years later commented that she still had cravings now and then. I always thought if everyone is trying to quit and quitting is that hard, it seems easier to just not start.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 05, 2020, 11:33:40 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on October 05, 2020, 08:12:05 pmThat may be it. Or it may be some fortunate genetic makeup, or a social difference you aren't aware of. Many of us are not smokers, alcoholics, drug addicts or any of a number of other things due to good fortune, not any moral or intellectual superiority. I know I am in that category..

author: Cerebus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 06, 2020, 12:30:37 am
content: I know the OP has solved their problem, at least for the moment.But in reading this it occurred to me that one way of getting smells out of things in general might be to leave them under vacuum for a few days. Given that 'smell' is just slow out-gassing, deliberate out-gassing under vacuum has a good prospect of getting the out-gassing over and done with quickly.Obviously not a solution if you don't have access to a suitable vacuum vessel and a pump, or if you do have but if the materials you're trying to decontaminate are vacuum incompatible.This is pure speculation, I don't know if it'd work but it might be worth a try.

author: tkamiya
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 06, 2020, 01:10:49 am
content: I've dealt with this with eBay radios. You can purchase Ozone generators pretty cheaply and it is effective. I took a large cardboard box and cut out inlet and outlet. Put my stuff in it and direct ozone generator into the inlet. Takes 20 minutes or so and repeat treatment sometimes. But it works.Question for the chemists.... what about hydrogen peroxide?

author: SilverSolder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 06, 2020, 03:09:09 am
content: How does ozone actually work to kill the smell - does it strip the surface clean, or something like that?

author: Cerebus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 06, 2020, 03:18:21 am
content: Literally oxidises it, ozone ishighlyreactive. Unfortunately, it may react withotherthings besides the smell.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 06, 2020, 04:33:54 am
content: Ozone is nasty stuff, my hot tub has an ozone generator, it reduces the amount of bromine required to keep the water clean. It's hard on the vinyl lining of the cover though. I'd be hesitant to use it on a cable, it can corrode metal too.

author: BravoV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 06, 2020, 05:01:54 am
content: Quote from: SilverSolder on October 06, 2020, 03:09:09 amRemembered I was told by one of my kid which is a chemist ... "to you all avg.joe/jane, just see ozone is like a nasty acid, but in a gaseous form ... "

author: tkamiya
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 06, 2020, 05:03:08 am
content: I have Ozone'd a whole radio for 20 minutes. Nothing bad happened. I wouldn't do it for hours and hours though. It would be interesting to do multiple "shots" to see if there are any degradation on plastic bits. Hum.... tempting! I have enough scrap electronics to do this kind of experiment.

author: helius
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 06, 2020, 06:12:16 am
content: Ozone is effectively regular oxygen combined with an O radical which really wants to be somewhere else. So the O radical easily transfers to other molecules when ozone gets close to them. In biological systems this is referred to as "free-radical damage" and is one of the major causes of cells breaking down and dying. Adding an extra O radical can destabilize a molecule and lead to other rearrangements or decompositions.Hydrogen peroxide is similar in that it's water with an extra O radical. H2O2 is much more stable than O3 however, so the radical is less eager to leave.

author: David Hess
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 06, 2020, 08:09:34 pm
content: Quote from: SilverSolder on July 18, 2020, 12:57:21 amI would wash it with soapy water, and then rub it down with methyl salicylate a.k.a. oil of wintergreen which can be used to restore plastics.

author: David Hess
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 06, 2020, 08:11:44 pm
content: Quote from: tkamiya on October 06, 2020, 05:03:08 amIt will eventually bleach plastic but destroy rubber.

author: helius
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 07, 2020, 04:42:54 pm
content: Quote from: David Hess on October 06, 2020, 08:09:34 pmI'm not sure I believe that methyl salicylate can restore plastics. Do you have a reference for this?Natural (latex) rubber is made of isoprene units, and methyl salicylate is structurally similar to terpene, so it makes sense that it softens hard rubber objects.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 07, 2020, 08:26:21 pm
content: Quote from: helius on October 07, 2020, 04:42:54 pmIt certainly softens hardened plastic, makes it feel new and pliable. It's a temporary solution though, after some weeks it dries out and becomes hard again. I don't know what effect it has if you use it prior to plastic hardening.

author: David Hess
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 08, 2020, 01:39:17 am
content: DEET also softens rubber and some plastics, but I do not recommend using that.

author: tkamiya
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 08, 2020, 08:18:26 pm
content: Quote from: David Hess on October 06, 2020, 08:11:44 pmYes, I know. But at what time-scale? This ozone destroying plastic and rubber thing is repeated through internet. But it is often the case that magnitude of such effects are not specified.I'd like to first know what my O generator is making, then determine how long of exposure of what material causes a given level of damage.It is obvious that careful and limited exposure does not cause material amount of damage. I've done this and I know. Maybe I'll just go ahead and get a baseline data for my unit. As a frequent buyer of eBay goods, I have used it successfully for few applications.

author: SilverSolder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2020, 01:42:11 am
content: Many nominally scary things used carefully and in moderation will be safe. E.g. I use phosphoric acid to clean steel before painting. But I don't leave it in the bath so long that the item disappears!

author: helius
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2020, 01:45:09 am
content: While on the subject of fumigants, does anyone here have experience using formaldehyde fumes to sterilize items? How corrosive is it?You can generate the fumes in a container by mixing paraformaldehyde and sodium hydroxide in water. Heat will accelerate the evolution of the fumes.

author: tkamiya
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2020, 01:50:03 am
content: Exactly....But this being the Internet, something someone heard from somewhere becomes gospel and suddenly, that's all we hear. Context is often lost along the way. You can't stop stop all people from doing things without thinking and causing harm. What we need to do is make sure WE gain enough knowledge to use whatever we are using to do it safely and effectively. This is the internet pet peeve thread, right?

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2020, 06:29:57 pm
content: Quote from: tkamiya on October 08, 2020, 08:18:26 pmIt depends on the material and the amount of exposure. It certainly has done a number on the wire insulation inside the ozone generator my hot tub uses, I've had to rebuild that a couple of times. The aluminum housing seems fairly resistant though. Limited exposure to remove odors is probably not going to be a problem.

author: Krisby
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: October 10, 2020, 11:28:29 pm
content: I was going to mention "methyl salicylate a.k.a. oil of wintergreen" as suggested by David Hess. I bought some to "rejuvenate" a vinyl motorcycle seat cover, but haven't used it yet. One thing about the "oil of wintergreen" is that it has a strong mint-like smell, which may have an effect of masking the original offensive odor.One idea that has come to mind about this problem of tobacco smoke odor in the plastic cable insulation: In my youth, we used to apply tomato puree to our dog's fur after she had encountered a skunk (So. Calif.), which was the recommended remedy. Maybe it would work on this issue of tobacco smoke smell?

author: David Hess
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2020, 12:09:45 am
content: Quote from: tkamiya on October 08, 2020, 08:18:26 pmOzone degrades rubber very quickly and is one of the reasons car tires do not last as long in cities with a lot of air pollution. The rubber rollers in laser printers also degrade more quickly than those in inkjets. Time scales of months are typical but degradation is much faster at higher concentrations.I once setup my Jacob's ladder inside of a large bell jar on a linoleum table and ran it for maybe an hour during which it became more and more difficult to see because of the brown nitrogen dioxide produced. When I pulled the bell jar away, you could see the brown cloud rise. The steel wires of the Jacob's ladder had rusted so much in an hour that they left a trail of rust underneath them, and the linoleum tabletop under the bell jar was bleached white.

author: helius
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2020, 06:16:07 pm
content: Linoleum is made of polymerized linseed oil with wood dust and talc filler. Was it noticeably degraded apart from being bleached?

author: David Hess
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2020, 01:59:53 am
content: Quote from: helius on October 11, 2020, 06:16:07 pmAs far as I could tell, it was just bleached. The surface texture seemed the same.

author: geggi1
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 17, 2020, 08:41:07 pm
content: Start with something simpel.If the cable got removeble hoods on the plug remove the hoods and clean them with dishwashing deturgant and lunk warm water. Dishwashing deturgant is ment to remove grease and oily substans and will normalt not damage most materials. You might let it soak and brush with a tooth brush.Try to whip the cable down with a lunk warm dishwashing deturgant sopp rag.Rinse and repeat a few time to see if it get better.Citric cleaner is also a possible cleaner but I have not teste it.As a general roule start with the midler kind of cleaning and go rougher if the mild dont work. But do also consider several repetision with the mild will can be as effektive as onece with the heavy.