Introducing my school to electronics - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: cborsky
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: July 07, 2012, 02:09:30 am
content: Greetings!I am coming to this community in search for some advice on setting up a small, beginners electronics lab, aiming towards entry-level robotics fora highschool.Backround, for those interested:My school isn't aiming towards electronics, so last year a teacher and I decided to work on a robotics club. We've set up simple demonstrations and power-point slides pertaining to basic electronics and robotics.We just got approved for a small amount of funding for the year, and I was wondering what would be best to get for building simple test circuits for LEDs, Motors, and so on.We've adjusted our slides, handouts, and demonstrations for next year and I was put in charge of gathering materials and tools for the club.NeedWe have a small budget of roughly around a thousand dollars.What tools and materials would be best for development using microcontrollers like Arduinos. We currently have TI MSP430 Launchpads that we have used for demonstrations, along with a few boxes of capacitors (ceramic, polarized, and decoupling), resistors, 10 DC motors, switches, pots, LEDs, and a few other little goodies.What would be a good place to start looking for possible buys within the New York area, preferably Brooklyn?What would be the best price range for tools to purchase?What online distributors would be good to buy parts and components from? (Jameco, Digikey, etc)What online distributors would be good to buy tools from?Any and all help and advice is appreciated.Thanks!

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 07, 2012, 02:58:32 am
content: My suggestion would be to start from a slightly different direction, and try to come up with some specific project objectives. For instance are there any local inter-school competitions you might think of entering? Such competitions might involve building a robot to solve a particular puzzle, or win a race through an obstacle course, or something like that. Failing that, you might find some particular challenges to solve, even without the competitive element.Perhaps even at the least try to find resources with specific plans and objectives to work through.Once you have one or two (or a few) project objectives, you could then create a shopping list for the particular parts and tools those projects might require.Otherwise, I feel you might end up spending your budget on various purchases without a clear direction or objective and get less value out of it.When considering your possible sources, don't forget the radio controlled hobby arena. There you will find loads of mechanical parts, motors, servos, controllers, etc. Hobby King is an obvious place to look for these, but not the only source.

author: free_electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 07, 2012, 03:27:23 am
content: Lego robotics system ?Pololu robotics ?Roomba platform ? They will sponsor schools !Your mayor hurdle is mechanics... Try to get a rolling platform with motors and sensors already on it. That way you focus on the real electronics and software.

author: FenderBender
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 07, 2012, 03:56:43 am
content: What would be a good place to start looking for possible buys within the New York area, preferably Brooklyn?Well I live near by to NYC, but I really wouldn't know a specific place...What would be the best price range for tools to purchase?$1000 isn't all that much; Electronics equipment adds up really quick. You probably won't be needing an oscilloscope for basic MCU controlled robotics and stuff. However, there is of course a few things that will be needed.Multimeters:I'm not sure exactly the magnitude of the program, but somewhere around 4 multimeters might be good for starters. I'm not sure if you need recommendations, but from personal experience, I'd recommend Amprobe multimeters. Meter's around the $50 mark would probably do the trick.Power Supplies:If these are all battery operated projects, you might not even have to worry about a power supply at all. I was in my schools electronics class and we just used 9V batteries with leads for everything. However, if you think that the lab needs an official power supply, there are many used lab supplies on eBay. HPs and Lambdas. Maybe your school doesn't want to buy used. There are a few cheapie lab supplies that would probably work fine. You can get a supply from $50-75 I'd sayMCU Dev Boards:Arduinomightbe the friendliest for newbies. This subject is very opinionated. Arduino boards are a bit pricey actually. $30 a board. Say you wanted 10 boards, that's $300 right there. Arduino is nice, and it may be the way to go, but other dev platforms that have more power and are cheaper if that's what you are looking for. You'd have to choose whether you wanted 8-bit, 16-bit or 32-bit MCU platforms. MSP430 Launchpad is a hell of a deal, really. TIreallywant everyone and their dog to have an MSP430 board so they get hooked on it...and it's a good plan.What online distributors would be good to buy parts and components from? (Jameco, Digikey, etc)Well, I don't mess with the more middleman distributors like Jameco or RSR too much. However, Jameco does have a pretty good selection of motors and some more obscure parts. Sparkfun has some good robotics stuff also. I would definitley check out their offerings.Now, if you just want regular old components, like LEDs and capacitors and resistors, it really depends. I personally use Mouser and Digikey, but if you just want to stock parts and don't necessarily care about having the best quality etc etc, then I'd go on eBay and look for resistor and cap kits like this one:http://www.ebay.com/itm/1-4W-Metal-Film-Resistors-Assorted-kit-56-Values-1-ohm-10M-ohm-1-560pcs-/260972873223?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cc3320607#ht_2077wt_1110Might want to also check out a place like this:http://www.goldmine-elec-products.com/departments.asp?dept=1409I've heard good things about that site.What online distributors would be good to buy tools from?There's a lot. Tequipment and Amazon are on the top of my list. Test Equipment Depot is also okay. If you want to solder, Sparkfun sells a really nice Hakko 936 clone for like $40. It's a hell of a deal.That's it for now.

author: cborsky
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: July 07, 2012, 04:32:37 am
content: Quote from: IanB on July 07, 2012, 02:58:32 amThank you for the suggestion.We will be getting into competitions, but currently we only have 2 members that know anything about electronics, programming, and mechanics.If you have any links to something that will provide a kit to a school, or something that you might have entered in before, I would be happy to take a look at them.Quote from: free_electron on July 07, 2012, 03:27:23 amHmm, I should look into sponsorships.We currently have a Lego NXT 2.0, and we've built and programmed a PID line follower, and we're working on an auto-calibration function for it where it will calibrate the best settings along the line for smoother and quicker line tracking.We might be able to get a platform with the motors and sensors, but that's for a later time.Thank you for your response.Quote from: FenderBender on July 07, 2012, 03:56:43 amThanks!We already have a multimeter, and will be purchasing about 2-3 more.A power supply has been modified into a bench-top power supply, and we have a few 5v, 6v, 9v, and 12v DC plug-in converters that are laying around.We are looking into buying about 4 Arduinos, because it's a small class of roughly 10 people. We might grow next term, but there's no guarantees, so no need killing ourselves on the budget.I am writing a library for the TI Launchpad MSP430 that will make it easier to teach basics with.

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 07, 2012, 04:34:40 am
content: If you wanted say 10 Arduino's it would be cheaper to build them in-house, as one of the actual projectsOf course it means students don't get to keep their work, which would need to be explained at the start.You could get the students to build quite a few useful things as projects- powersupplies from LM317s- signal generators from 555 timers- microcontroller boards from avrs/pics etc.Much cheaper than buying them prebuilt, but you'd need to put in time testing/repairing them as they wouldn't all work.

author: cborsky
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: July 07, 2012, 04:47:51 am
content: Quote from: Psi on July 07, 2012, 04:34:40 amI agree.I was thinking of getting the cheaper development boards, but I suppose having them build it would be better.Have them first breadboard the microcontroller, then have them work on printed perfboards. Would be an interesting projects, thank you for the advice!

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 07, 2012, 04:53:51 am
content: yeah, perf/vero board would probably be best.You could get them to etch stuff, but that's quite a bit of extra work dealing with chemicals.Best to avoid it if you can.If you can find general prototype boards for cheap that would be ideal.The kind that have all sorts or holes/pads various size IC's. Some even have a vero/perf board section to them.

author: cborsky
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: July 07, 2012, 04:57:31 am
content: Quote from: Psi on July 07, 2012, 04:53:51 amI was thinking of just etching some stuff at work then bringing it in to show those attending circuit boards, and probably go into it with a demonstration about breadboards, perfboards, and printed circuit boards.

author: pickle9000
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 07, 2012, 05:24:20 am
content: Have a look at the DuinoMite. Very good for school use....mike

author: T4P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 07, 2012, 05:28:16 am
content: DX has arduinos on the cheap

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 07, 2012, 07:07:54 am
content: in fact DX has quite a lot of cheap tools and gear.It's junk, but junk is better than nothing (as long as its safe)

author: Bored@Work
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 07, 2012, 07:59:07 am
content: Aren't there a few STEM initiatives in the US, targeting schools, sponsoring things and arranging competitions?

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 07, 2012, 08:04:57 am
content: Quote from: cborsky on July 07, 2012, 02:09:30 amAdafruit are in NY.Don't know if they allow drop-in's though.Dave.

author: tom66
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 07, 2012, 08:48:48 am
content: Also the STM32 dev boards start at £10 each, though the software is much harder to write for these and documentation is lacking. But 168 MHz of ARM processor with integrated FPU!

author: cborsky
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: July 07, 2012, 06:16:31 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on July 07, 2012, 08:04:57 amHmm, I suppose so.Thanks!Quote from: tom66 on July 07, 2012, 08:48:48 amI was looking at those boards.On digikey, there's a 48mhz version for $8 USD.

author: T4P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 07, 2012, 11:06:42 pm
content: It's not a "Version" but rather another Cortex-M3 .... not M4The 8$ version has a Cortex-M0 which is a low-end Cortex core and lacks everythingStill more periphery than an arduino

author: cborsky
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: July 08, 2012, 02:21:25 am
content: Quote from: DaveXRT on July 07, 2012, 11:06:42 pmAh, I see.Off-topic, which ARM development board would you recommend?

author: T4P
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 08, 2012, 05:50:05 pm
content: Quote from: cborsky on July 08, 2012, 02:21:25 amSTM32F0DISCOVERY which is the 8$ version and comes with a protoboardor the STM32LDISCOVERY which comes with a LCD and a capacitive touch thing

author: XynxNet
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: July 08, 2012, 07:03:05 pm
content: Talk to the physics teachers at your school. They should have all the usual lab equipment exept soldering irons.

author: cborsky
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: July 11, 2012, 01:20:57 am
content: Quote from: XynxNet on July 08, 2012, 07:03:05 pmGood idea! Thanks!I've started a list of supplies we will need, and a list of supplies that would be nice to have, and see what I could find online based on what people recommended here.Thank you all for your help!

author: Zad
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 11, 2012, 05:34:10 am
content: Adafruit have an education sub-forum on their site:http://forums.adafruit.com/viewforum.php?f=48And an educators blog section:http://www.adafruit.com/blog/category/educators/

author: kd7eir
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 11, 2012, 10:24:40 pm
content: When deciding on a platform, keep in mind the learning curve associated with it. Even the MSP430 has a rather steep learning curve, ARM is more like climbing Everest if you do not come into the game with a programming background.If your goal is to make things that work, that teach a lesson, and that do not require 2/3 of the development time spent on the programming rather than the electronics, then Arduino is really the only option.

author: cborsky
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: July 16, 2012, 05:59:21 pm
content: Quote from: Zad on July 11, 2012, 05:34:10 amAh, yes, I should have looked into that. I do follow them, haha.Thank you!Quote from: kd7eir on July 11, 2012, 10:24:40 pmHmm, yes. I am making a library for the MSP430 which will make coding simple things (pin on, pin off, pin mode, etc) easier along with clock settings and timers, interrupts, and a handful of other goodies.We are planning to get a few arduino unos