Printer - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: metrologist
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 11, 2017, 04:34:05 pm
content: As usual, Microsoft has deemed my printer obsolete. I think this makes 10 printers now, a nice Brother MFP laser printer has gone to scrap parts and landfill.Any suggestions on an inexpensive staple laser printer? I just want a decent regular black laser printer that can pump out like 4000 sheets before needing an inexpensive toner refill, and that will last a while.Thanks!

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 11, 2017, 05:01:45 pm
content: Have you tried inf install through device manager? Often this works, even if installation from exe does not.

author: SingedFingers
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 11, 2017, 05:07:56 pm
content: I'd just grab the cheapest brother laser you can and get cheap toner for it. The fuser/drum will shit itself after about 10k sheets but you're still up on cash over a better printer with a branded toner cartridge.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 11, 2017, 05:12:56 pm
content: Get an HP office/business laserprinter (preferably with a network interface) instead of a printer which uses the computer to do the heavy lifting (and thus needs OS specific drivers). It will work on any OS and any computer for the following decades.

author: Towger
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 11, 2017, 05:46:53 pm
content: As per nctnico, I got a HP 4250 from eBay a few years back for about 30 quid. I rate it as my best eBay buy, in use every day and I have only replaced the cartridge once.

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 11, 2017, 06:55:19 pm
content: A cheap Brother or Lexmark laser will suit you well.Lexmark offer some quite affordable network connected (ethernet: sort out your own wireless sorcery) lasers. You won't have obsoletion issues with those.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 11, 2017, 07:35:42 pm
content: Quote from: Monkeh on January 11, 2017, 06:55:19 pm+1 on getting ANY network capable printer. MS I'm sure just wants to make things as difficult as possible.In our office a still perfectly capable HP 6MP connected to a Win 8.1 box works perfectly well as it has for many years but over the network we've not get found a way for my bench PC running Win 7 to talk to it.Previously when both PC's were running Win 7 there was never a problem providing the one connected to the local printer was fired up.Whereas our colour OKI over the network works just fine from either PC, anytime.Look at getting a print server box and I think the better LAN switches have them so that could be something to look into.

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 11, 2017, 07:38:38 pm
content: I can't say any switch I'd class as 'better' has a print server in it.. But mine tend to have rack ears.Plenty of neat little gadgets you can use to implement a print server decently, though. I have a lot of fun with these:https://www.gl-inet.com/mt300n/

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 11, 2017, 07:45:43 pm
content: Quote from: Monkeh on January 11, 2017, 07:38:38 pmThose look a very viable solution with their USB 2.0 interface, thanks.

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 11, 2017, 07:48:22 pm
content: Quote from: tautech on January 11, 2017, 07:45:43 pmBe warned firmware is more or less your responsibility, their builds kinda suck. Flashed with a current build of OpenWRT, though - nice interface, AP, router, bridge, print server, you name it it does it.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 11, 2017, 07:56:51 pm
content: Quote from: Monkeh on January 11, 2017, 07:48:22 pmOK, hear you.Just to know something like these exist is a start, so time to get looking......

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: January 11, 2017, 09:31:46 pm
content: 4 or 5 years ago, I found a brother HL-1440 desktop laser with a toner cartridge and brand new spare cartridge for $10 USD. Mated it to an old HP JetDirect EX+ I got for free and everyone prints fine, Win 7 and 10, back when I got it, WinXP, 7 and 8. It is not a heavy use printer, I have only replaced the drum once.

author: DimitriP
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 11, 2017, 10:41:11 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on January 11, 2017, 05:12:56 pmAKA stay way from GDI printers.If the printer has a choice though its own menu system to print out the built in fonts, it's not a GDI printer that relies on a 200MB software "driver".As a bonus, it also means it can emulateHPLPCL in hardware so even if the "exact" driver is not available, you can lie to windows and set it up as HP4,5 6Currently I have a DCP-2450DW that at least one machine is using the HP 4 driver to print to it.

author: metrologist
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 11, 2017, 11:13:17 pm
content: Here is what I discovered. That glass for the copy machine part, it's tempered glass and shatters all over the room when introduced to concrete flooring at 9.8 m/s/s for a couple seconds.I'm not really feeling confident I know what to look for. GDI?This aint really cheap:https://www.amazon.com/HP-LaserJet-Monochrome-CE658A-BGJ/dp/B00847UWUE

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 11, 2017, 11:15:10 pm
content: Quote from: metrologist on January 11, 2017, 11:13:17 pmActually yes, it is, but if you want the REALLY cheap end of the scale:https://www.amazon.com/Brother-HL-L2340DW-Monochrome-Wireless-Replenishment/dp/B00LZS5EEI/

author: metrologist
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 11, 2017, 11:29:58 pm
content: LoL, I was just reading cunsumer reports suggesting that Brother printer. I saw it had a 2.5/5 rating and when I tried to read some of the review, the pop-up was half off the screen. Yay for web technology.Not having anything to do with Windows or it's drivers would be ideal. I will go out of my way to avoid anything to do with Microsoft reliance, or anyone having to make some software for this device.I guess GDI is a feature to look for and then avoid.

author: DimitriP
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2017, 12:48:04 am
content: Quote from: Monkeh on January 11, 2017, 11:15:10 pmTHe HL-L2340DW IS a GDI printer : [ Emulation(s) GDI] ( HP hides the "GDI" by describing the emulation as "Host based" just like they do on the HP-1102W )THE DCP-L2450 and HL-L2360W are not:http://support.brother.com/g/s/id/htmldoc/printer/cv_hll2300d/use/index.html#GUID-870AF14C-F773-4F02-B2A5-E04CFD3CBCE5_243https://www.amazon.com/Brother-HL-L2360DW-Wireless-Networking-Replenishment/dp/B00LEA5EJM/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1484182033&sr=8-1&keywords=Hl-l2360Print Font(HL-L2360DW) - Prints the font list.Emulation (HL-L2360DW) PCL6Emulations(DCP-L2540DW/HL-L2380DW/MFC-L2720DW/MFC-L2740DW)PCL6, BR-Script3 (PostScript® 3™)

author: Rick Law
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2017, 02:53:39 am
content: Inkjet killed the printer business and made it into an ink cartridge business. Even printers are built like cartridges these days, and cartridges are built bathroom tissues - very limited life expectancy expect.My HP Laserjet 5P is still going strong but to do color I added an HP Color colorjet 2560DN. Works well but after about 10K prints, the 2560DN gives occasional "format error" (error 79, I think) than constant format error. Web solution search found some suggesting it could be cartridge issues but I am using HP cartridges. I replaced it with another 2560DN to minimize driver and software reload/reconfiguration. This one lastest perhaps 15K prints and begin to get the "format error". I am beginning to think it is perhaps a self destruct built in to the firmware.So, back to my trusted 5P for all my prints. It is robust and stands punishment. If I can get ink cartridges for it 10 years from now, I am confident that bugger could still be working. That one is no bath room tissue.

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2017, 04:42:55 am
content: Quote from: DimitriP on January 12, 2017, 12:48:04 am.. a wireless GDI printer. Wow. I did not know such a thing existed. I'll just reiterate my 'expensive' Lexmark suggestion, then.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2017, 06:52:17 pm
content: Quote from: Rick Law on January 12, 2017, 02:53:39 amI used to have an HP Laserjet 5P as well but after 20 years of service it started to print bad and a new cartridge didn't help. The replacement HP printer (P2055dn with network interface) was 5 times cheaper then the 5P so if it lasts for 4 years the price is on par with the 5P. Also the P2055dn can print double sided so suddenly I only need half the amount of paper.

author: Richard Crowley
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2017, 07:05:45 pm
content: Quote from: Rick Law on January 12, 2017, 02:53:39 amEpson now have a range of inkjet printers with refillable tanks exposed on the side.

author: metrologist
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2017, 07:28:28 pm
content: Oh, I was just noticing Amazon Dash Replenishing Service built right into the printer. What's that? A networked printer will have access to your Amazon account and have ink automatically delivered to you- the Amazon Dash Replenishment service measures the toner level and automatically orders toner from Amazon when low. This ensures that you never run out again., they say...All this does is make politicsseemmore pallettable...

author: vodka
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2017, 07:45:21 pm
content: Quote from: metrologist on January 11, 2017, 04:34:05 pmYou install a machine virtual with WIN XP on your PC, you turn on the VM and you intall the printer on WIN XP emulated.This trick i used when i used the WIN7 and the dickhead didn't want to acknowledge the drivers of the scanner or the camcorder.

author: CJay
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 12, 2017, 07:50:45 pm
content: HP networked laser of the same calibre as the 42/3x0 series, they're bomb proof and just keep on going.About 40 PPM, duplex option is dirt cheap, toner, buy original HP only and you'll get excellent quality prints and lots of them.Price, from £30 upwards.

author: george graves
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 13, 2017, 11:58:31 am
content: The last great HP Laserjet was the Laserjet 4 plus. I hear the 5 isn't too bad - but the 4 plus is a work horse group printer, totally serviceable(side panels just pop off and you can replace anything), and under $250 on ebay.I print about 5 pages a day, and at this rate my toner will last 10 year or more? It's crazy.They are a energy hog, even in "power save mode" - so if you turn it on and print, and turn it off, it's all good.I use it to print instruction sheets in bulk (usually 100 at a time) and picked it cause of the low cost per page, and having one in my office while working for AMEX, back in the mid 90's I knew it was indestructible. It's also awesome at small sheets in the drop down paper tray. It can print on something like a check without it getting bound up.

author: CJay
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 13, 2017, 01:32:01 pm
content: Quote from: george graves on January 13, 2017, 11:58:31 amThey were damn good machines but finding one these days that's not been bodged up from scrap is not easy.I'd also add the Laserjet 5 as it's the same machine but has a facelifted user interface.The only problem with them for someone like me who can occasionally print half a ream of paper in a day is that they're only 8PPM and I don't remember if there was an add on duplex unit or if you had to buy a special version of the printer?I would put the Laserjet 42x0 and 43x0 printers as worthy successors.

author: metrologist
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 13, 2017, 03:42:34 pm
content: HP seems to have M4x2 model printers, or I am not seeing any 42xx or 43xx. I was looking at a M452dn or dw (wireless).Then I saw that it uses JetIntelligence toner cartridges and that gave me the urge to run for the hills...I only print a few pages per week, sometimes I go months without printing anything.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 13, 2017, 07:06:18 pm
content: Quote from: george graves on January 13, 2017, 11:58:31 amOur 6MP has been good too and we get ~5 years from toner cartridges.If I get one of those LAN to USB adapters that monkeh linked it'll be the perfect cheap laser printer....hassle free.

author: CJay
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 13, 2017, 07:10:47 pm
content: Quote from: metrologist on January 13, 2017, 03:42:34 pmThey're not current models, the one under my desk is now a good few years old.

author: george graves
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 14, 2017, 12:35:38 pm
content: Quote from: CJay on January 13, 2017, 01:32:01 pmYou might be right. I had to replace a roller and the fuser in mine shortly after I got it - but it's actually kinda fun to work on. It reminds me of a 1970's American muscle cars. Really simple, lots of room to work, and parts are dirt cheap.I think I paid $20 for a new fuser and $30 for a new roller.

author: cheeseit
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 14, 2017, 09:20:00 pm
content: My Samsung laser printer which has served me somewhat well is running low on toner. It is of course and unfortunately way to expensive to buy an original toner cartridge, compared to the price of a new printer though I've read that they have started to ship new printers with a minimum of ink or toner to counter that. Anyway, I mostly use my printer for toner transfer or transparencies which the Samsung does so-so, and am kinda in the marked for something new so what would you suggest that excels at this? Preferably something with cheap toner cartridges and not that expensive.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 14, 2017, 09:25:37 pm
content: Quote from: cheeseit on January 14, 2017, 09:20:00 pmIf the OEM toner provides results that you can live with replace it before it runs out with an aftermarket cheaper toner and save the remaining OEM toner for when you need it. You might get lucky and the aftermarket toner is better.

author: CJay
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 16, 2017, 10:11:03 am
content: Quote from: george graves on January 14, 2017, 12:35:38 pmTis a shame you're not UK based, I think I have a brand new fuser and possibly even some other bits for those that you could have for cost of shipping, they're too good to throw out but of absolutely no use to either of us as shipping would be extortionate and the fuser is 230V.

author: george graves
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 16, 2017, 12:08:02 pm
content: I have spares.There is a semi-interesting forum on reddit called "buy it for life". An old HP laserjet is kinda like that.Here's a link to the sub reddit - don't click if you don't have an hour or two to waste - it's addictive.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 16, 2017, 07:19:53 pm
content: Quote from: CJay on January 16, 2017, 10:11:03 amWould you mind posting or PM'ing me the part # ?

author: CJay
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 16, 2017, 07:21:41 pm
content: Quote from: tautech on January 16, 2017, 07:19:53 pmI'll PM it sometime this week when I find it but I'm in the UK so it's not going to be a cheap part to ship

author: XynxNet
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: January 16, 2017, 07:27:10 pm
content: Is your printer supported by linux/cups?Just build a cheap print server from a raspberry our a similiar board. Bye bye MS driver dependence..

author: TAMHAN
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2017, 12:23:34 am
content: Xerox Phaser 3020. 50USD, has WiFi. Bought it for PCB manufacture, since relegated it to main printer duty. Prints from Windows 10 and Ubuntu, probably also from Android if I fart around enough.

author: amspire
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2017, 12:43:47 am
content: Quote from: SingedFingers on January 11, 2017, 05:07:56 pmHave to agree with this. I got a Brother HL-2170W about 5 years ago for A$90 and two $10 toner refills from Hong Kong. Done 4600 pages and haven't spend an extra cent on it yet except for paper. That is a total of $110 Australian.Might need to spend another $10 for toner next year sometime. The drum still has 7400 pages of life left. WiFi works perfectly, so I just move it to where I am working. Manual duplexing works great.

author: tpowell1830
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2017, 12:52:31 am
content: Ok, here is what I do to keep from having obsolete printer drivers for newer OSs, like Windows 10. I have an older desktop that is networked, but is not connected to the internet, so it is somewhat safe from viruses, and it can't automagically update itself to Windows 10 on the internet. It is running on Windows XP. I send my files to the file share on the old computer, I manually print it on the old machine.. voila!It is an extra step, but solves the problem.PEACE===>TUpdate: I should also say that I am running VM ware and access the old computer from my main computer, so I don't have to get up.

author: metrologist
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2017, 11:16:51 pm
content: I was at the local retail store and looked at printers. The sales folks descended in numbers to set up for the kill...I saw HP LaserJet m102w and Samsung M2830DW. The sales folks insisted the Samsung because they do such good business with Samsung.Then I could not remember what I was supposed to avoid, a GDI printer (had to come back here for a refresher). Of course, the box is not going to say anything about that, and the sales folks are totally clueless. Well, I'm sure they know about their commission... They were not willing to discuss the Lexmark much, other than saying the tag I pointed to was not in stock.Now, I suspect that since the LaserJet has USB (and WiFi), that it is going to be a GDI. It's $120. The Samsung is ethernet or WiFi and it's $70. I do not know if either of these have smart toner cartridges that do not allow refills.

author: metrologist
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 13, 2017, 11:30:44 pm
content: I just saw they have a Samsung M2625D for $18. It has USB interface and a list of required OS. Then I read about SPL (Samsung Printer Language) and decided that you could not give me any Samsung printer for free, unless you provided a bat and refuse bins.

author: metrologist
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2017, 07:53:06 pm
content: I bought a new Lexmark MS312dn because it was a network printer and it listed compatibility with about every OS I could imagine (mac android windows, etc.). I'm trying to avoid GDI printers or whatever it takes to stop microsoft from telling me when to buy a new printer. I might have made a mistake because this printer:-has a big fat parallel type of connector in it. That is archaic and I am afraid it is already an obsolete printer. I have not seen a port like that since computers came in cream colored cases.-does not connect via its USB port. The port is taped off and there are notes not to use it, but to instead use the Ethernet port.-Ethernet port connected, Windows10 sees the printer on the network and you can open its web page and twist all its knobs, but NO APPLICATIONS can see the printer at all...?I tried to add a printer through the MS Word add printer button and got an immediate error message that the 'active directory name service' is not available. That is out of the box Microsoft BS and not related to any printer.So here I am again with MS in between me and my brand new printer. I hate MS with such a passion now. It stinks!How do I make my applications see this jeezless thing? It's not supposed to NEED a driver? I want a printer that works without one.Is Windows going to wake up one day and tell me my printer is not compatible with it, and then remove it?Should I get my money back?And why did anyone recommend Lexmark? I discovered their printers have toner chips that you have to hack or buy a hacked chip to refill the toner, so the kit and chip cost about as much as a new toner cartridge. That stinks too!

author: madires
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2017, 08:23:55 pm
content: Of course you have to install a driver (or select one already installed). If no dedicated driver is available you can choose a generic Postscript or PCL driver, but those won't support duplex printing in most cases. And yes, Lexmark isn't the best choice. I'd recommend a cheap Brother for low volume printing or a Kyocera for high volume printing.

author: helius
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2017, 09:09:25 pm
content: Printers that have Ethernet ports should support LPD (port 515). This does not require client drivers, the client simply runs lpr and submits a job to the printer.

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2017, 09:48:02 pm
content: Quote from: metrologist on April 03, 2017, 07:53:06 pmIt's called 'legacy support', it's a bit of a thing in business products. You don't have to use it.QuoteNews to me.QuoteHow the fuck do you expect applications to see the printer if you don't tell them where it is?QuoteNot on the printer at any rate..QuoteWelcome to the printer game.I recommended Lexmark. Why? They're cheap, work well, tend to Just Work..Go install their nice universal print driver. It'll give you lots of options you won't know about: Just keep clicking next. Hey presto, printer, working, and Microsoft have no say in the matter.

author: CJay
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2017, 06:36:35 am
content: You clicked next when 'Search for a printer in Active Directory' was checked in the add printer dialog, unless your PC is a domain member on an AD network you did it wrong.The USB port being taped off is a standard thing on a lot ofprinters where the manufacturer wants you to install their software/driver before you plug in the printer.It is preferable to use the Ethernet port instead of USB anyway, it's way easier to share the printer around a network that way.

author: madires
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2017, 09:45:45 am
content: Quote from: helius on April 03, 2017, 09:09:25 pmHow does the OS know about the printer? How can the applications know about it too? Does the printer convert a pdf or Excel sheet into its native printing format to be able to print the document?

author: Jeroen3
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2017, 10:01:50 am
content: I have a HP Deskjet 950C that is supported from Windows 3.1 to 8.1.It has a physical LPT port and a USB port with USB-LPT converter inside. It's so stupid it even moves without cartridges.

author: helius
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2017, 10:29:38 am
content: Quote from: madires on April 04, 2017, 09:45:45 amThe OS doesn't have to know anything different from any TCP/IP service. Applications would add the IP:port to a list of printers along with a PPD file that describes its capabilities.

author: ralphrmartin
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2017, 11:48:40 am
content: If you get a postscript printer connected by Ethernet, it wont need drivers, and wont go obsolete...

author: madires
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2017, 12:25:05 pm
content: Same question againWhen I run "lpr my-picture.jpg", how is that picture converted into PostScript for the PostScript printer? Maybe by some sort of printer driver?

author: metrologist
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2017, 03:37:08 pm
content: Quote from: CJay on April 04, 2017, 06:36:35 amNo, I opened Word, clicked File->Print. Then there is the current default printer listed on a button. Click that button to get a drop-down list of available printers, and at the bottom of the list is the Add Printer selection, without any checkmarks or etc.... Click that and I get instant active directory unavailable message. I think that is a MS bug as there are many people having that issue with various solutions.This is entirely a Windows problem.An iPad saw the printer and printed NO PROBLEM! No Driver. No Nothing. Why can an Apple app see the printer and print but not a MS app?MS Stinks...and the chipped toner cartridge stinks too.But the printer printed something, so Yeah! (I was doing my taxes and that happens on an offline PC - which may end up using the parallel port)Oh, I recall at work when we got network printers. We just opened Explorer, navigated to the printer on the network, and double clicked the printer and it seemed to become instantly available in all MS apps.

author: BradC
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2017, 04:04:45 pm
content: Quote from: madires on April 04, 2017, 09:45:45 amReal printers, and real operating systems support PostScript. When you print from an application it gets converted to PostScript and sent to the printer. The printer knows what to do.

author: CJay
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2017, 04:31:35 pm
content: Quote from: metrologist on April 04, 2017, 03:37:08 pmI think you have a print server on the network somewhere which 'publishes' the printers to the network, then you can navigate to them via explorer, the print server has the drivers and when you double click on the printer it makes them available to your PC which installs them

author: rrinker
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2017, 06:05:13 pm
content: Quote from: CJay on April 04, 2017, 04:31:35 pmYes, this is how Windows Server operates. Install print drivers on the print server, and you can install multiple versions to support different client versions, and the driver gets installed when a user connects to the printer.

author: SeanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2017, 07:26:01 pm
content: Provided the printer manufacturer has supplied them all you could have drivers that supported XP32 bit, XP64 bit, Windows 7 32 bit, Windows 7 64 bit and such all on the server, and it would identify the client and install them automatically ( aside from needing a reboot of course with a lot of clients) the first time.Fun when this does not work though, can really mess things up

author: Debect
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: April 05, 2017, 06:26:29 am
content: Hello mate, i have an Canon i-sensy LBP3010B, works nice, i print like 500 sheets without refeel, never gave me anyheadaches.

author: ralphrmartin
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2017, 08:43:13 am
content: Quote from: madires on April 04, 2017, 12:25:05 pmYes, but a generic postscript driver, not some manufacturer specific driver for some weird and maybe obsolete protocol.