Mains stabilizer 2KVA  -  Heavy metal  (warning )  - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / projects

author: Kiriakos-GR
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 12, 2010, 09:43:27 am
content: One friend of my and customer , upgraded his " mains backup " electrical equipment in his medic lab,and gave me an gift of more than 60 kilos weight ..It must be an Mains stabilizer at 2KVA , its made in Greece from some company in Athens .It must worth an small fortune , at list the transformers do.Tested it with 220 AC , it looks to keeps the voltage stable at anything above 227 volts as input .I deliberate feed it with 110V and it gave an output of 140V .. = 30V above the input.Currently I have no use for it , but I am unable to trash it too ..Enjoy the pictures ....

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 12, 2010, 10:16:01 am
content: yep a testimony to the poor quality of power supply greece (and italy) used to suffer. I think things are much better now and with most stuff running off SMPS it's almost a non issue

author: Kiriakos-GR
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 12, 2010, 10:26:06 am
content: Well this device are operational for more than 15 years , and I blasted it with allot of compressed Air ,so to move the dust away .. And it is still shinny , clean , no marks of smoke , an perfect tool .And it still works too ...Only one small transformer from the many does an light buzzing ( needs some tightening in the screws ).By my taste, I prefer true made tools , that have some mass and real components .I have no idea about the efficiency factor of it ( yet ) , but I will use my AC/DC clamp to measure it.

author: jahonen
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 12, 2010, 11:30:15 am
content: Slightly off-topic question, isn't the common mains voltage supposed to be 230 VAC (220 is the obsolete old standard) in Greece, like here in Finland? Or actually single phase voltage is not directly defined, but the voltage between legs of 3-phase system is defined instead as 400 volts, which makes 400/?3 = 230.9 volts single phase.Regards,Janne

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 12, 2010, 11:37:27 am
content: yea we should all be on 230V I think Italy is as i measured it when i lived there

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 12, 2010, 01:39:15 pm
content: Why not try flogging it on ebay?

author: Kiriakos-GR
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 12, 2010, 02:33:55 pm
content: Quote from: Hero999 on September 12, 2010, 01:39:15 pmIts unmovable ....it has almost the weight of an human...

author: PetrosA
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 12, 2010, 02:34:27 pm
content: IIRC, 230V is the standard that manufacturers need to produce to for appliances, machines, etc., but power suppliers may still vary from that depending on existing transmission infrastructure and distance to customer. 220V supply is still within 5% of the 230V standard, so it would be acceptable in most cases. I would be VERY impressed if there's even one power company in the whole EU which can guarantee exactly 230V to every one of their customers over any distance and under any load.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 12, 2010, 02:41:17 pm
content: well i measured 229 in italy i think the idea was that the highest in the EU was 240 (UK) and lowest was 220 (Italy, greece and most others) I think a few used 230 already so they chose 230 as a unified value because it is within 10% of all the others and by definition any main appliance must work with +/-10% the nominal supplyThe unit in question is probably worth more in scrap metal

author: Kiriakos-GR
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 12, 2010, 03:28:59 pm
content: Quote from: PetrosA on September 12, 2010, 02:34:27 pmI will agree with Petros on that , personally I have no issues at all on my City Volos , that is the fifth larger in size .I measured before two minutes the mains with the Fluke 87 , it was like 225 - 226 .But, I have pay over 500 EUR for the APC UPS , and it does do logging so here is the facts.

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 12, 2010, 03:29:34 pm
content: Quote from: Kiriakos-GR on September 12, 2010, 02:33:55 pmNo problem: pick up only and if you don't have a forklift, tell them to bring one.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 12, 2010, 03:35:46 pm
content: Quote from: Hero999 on September 12, 2010, 03:29:34 pmyou talking about greece hero, the closest person interested and with a fork life will take a week to get there on it

author: Kiriakos-GR
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 12, 2010, 03:52:24 pm
content: About the device , I did an WEB search and found no trace of the maker ...All the capacitors are from Philips , the transistors are Motorola , the front panel all from Hager (germany) and it uses HRC fuses ...This is an example of fine contraction with quality parts , and I believe that we have to start again makingour own equipment ..So, if I trash it, dear Simon , the replacement will look as in the bottom picture !!.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 12, 2010, 03:58:30 pm
content: the question is do you still need these units ? surely the power supply in Greece is not what it was 30 years ago ?

author: Kiriakos-GR
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 12, 2010, 04:16:30 pm
content: This specific device was serving as stabilizer and protector on a medic lab,that they do blood exams ( tests ) .There was on it as load , about four professional blood analyzers ...The reason that it was removed , was that it did not had an battery backup option.The specific design with the 220/220 transformer , it does eliminate the (live phase ) issue,so you have clean AC (no phase ) , plus some active stabilization .I was hopping that those pictures will ring a bell to some one , as design,and I could possibly learn more about it, as specs ..About need ... what can I say ...1) what it will cost an modern APC 2KVA unit ?2) Every serious electronics repairs shop , always had an 220/220 transformer as phase isolator ,the 2 KVA it is an overkill .3) I will probably keep it for future use , its a monster , it can protect loads of sensitive equipment .And about my concern of data specs , it uses Thyristors , so the "efficiency factor" it must be related to them ...We need an True electronics engineer , to evaluate it even from the pictures , and to offer his thoughts about it..

author: PetrosA
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 12, 2010, 05:44:24 pm
content: Hospitals here still use isolation transformers for sensitive equipment. A UPS can always be plugged into the isolation transformer for additional backup. They now make wall mounted units that plug in to a non stabilized wall receptacle.http://www.iso-puck.com/contents/en-us/d6_50_60hz_iso-puck_specifications.htmlThe 2500VA 50-60Hz version costs $620

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 12, 2010, 06:37:14 pm
content: I'm sure it's possible to design UPSes with built-in isolation, it'll certainly be smaller and lighter but probably not as efficient though.

author: PetrosA
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 12, 2010, 06:50:11 pm
content: Quote from: Hero999 on September 12, 2010, 06:37:14 pmActually, the true UPS (online vs. offline or line interactive) isolates the load completely from the line side. The problem is size and cost. They are much bigger (to fit the banks of capacitors needed to provide isolation and power during the transfer) and much more expensive, usually starting at about $1000 US.Edit to add: I did find ones cheaper than $1000. This one from Eaton is a 600VA unit and lists for $620 US:http://powerquality.eaton.com/Products-services/Backup-Power-UPS/EX.aspx

author: Kiriakos-GR
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 12, 2010, 06:50:47 pm
content: The above link points to an device with 17 Kilos ( 38 lbs ) weight ...Check out this pictures ... ( ok its not 60 Kilos but it is 38 Kilos ) even so my back feels the load as 60 Kilos ..40Kg its the weight of an sack of cement .. and the 38 Kilos translates to83,77 lbs...