What to use to hold things to solder? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / beginners

author: jtruc34
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2019, 02:55:35 am
content: I am going to have to solder a few SMD parts to 30AWG wire, and it is quite important that things don't move to much. In general, everytime I have to solder wire to something, I should have something to hold that wire because I have to hold the solder wire and the soldering iron.I've usually used a typical helping hand, with a cast iron base and two crocodile clamps. It has two major problems : the crocodile clips are really not durable. After two months of non-intense use, one has begun to fall appart and the other's parts don't line up anymore. The second problem is that it has a lot of play, and if I wanted to remove it I would have to tighten the screws very much.I'm not sure if it has to do with the fact that this unit was of very poor quality (it is actually from CFH, which I don't think is a very high quality brand), or wether those helping hand are inherently badly manufacture.Furthermore, if I type "helping hand" on TME, I don't find anything. Those things don't seem to be super common, or maybe TME labeling is too specific.What would be some alternative or what would be a better brand? I don't really know what's typically used in those circumstances when the budget is higher than nothing for the whole soldering equipment...Thank you for answering

author: JxR
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 22, 2019, 03:43:13 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on May 22, 2019, 03:12:54 amFound this:https://sensepeek.com/Is this it? I've still never found something I really like for doing work under a microscope. I currently just use a stick vise:http://www.stickvise.commost of the time, which does work fairly well. The PCBite looks low profile enough though that it might be nice to have.I also have a Panavise. Its pretty versatile, when I don't need magnification. Kind of bulky though.

author: Cliff Matthews
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 22, 2019, 04:20:28 am
content: Helping-hands alligator clips tend to last longer when both jaws are covered with heat-shrink (less damage to objects and less time fussing because the teeth don't line up correctly) YMMV.

author: Berni
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2019, 05:59:51 am
content: Quote from: JxR on May 22, 2019, 03:43:13 amYep can buy PCBite sets and get them shipped the next day.Came across them at a trade show in Germany, was pretty impressed and we bought two of them with a discount coupon code from they gave out at there booth.So far we are impressed with them. They are well made from anodized aluminium and they grip the board really well. For small boards you only need 2 of them to hold your board. The magnets grab onto the steel sheet really well (You can pick up the whole thing by the board and wave it around and it doesn't budge), they don't get in the way at all and will stand up to hot air guns no problem. The big benefit of PCBite however is that it grabs boards of any shape. We end up making a lot of weird non rectangular or even curvy boards and this grabs onto it solidly in every single case while our vices are often completely useless. My coworker absolutely loves it and i think he never used a vice to hold a PCB ever since we got these.These are not as low profile as you might think tho as the posts are pretty tall, but that doesn't bother me at all. Those "flying probes" also work quite well, but they are only usable as DMM probes. The signal integrity of the setup is so bad that it garbles anything highspeed on a scope. I need to experiment with bringing a coax right to the tip, or even better replace the tips with ones that include a active probe (Would improve the bad grounding problem)Oh and that low profile vice thing i might buy for myself. The boards i do at home are usually rectangular so that would work fine.

author: ebastler
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2019, 06:13:02 am
content: Quote from: JxR on May 22, 2019, 03:43:13 amI can't figure out from the photos what "PCBite" actually does. There seem to be holders for a PCB (magnetic posts going onto a steel base plate). Also, "probes" with a gooseneck -- these seem to have permanently attached tips for taking electrical measurements?But do they also provideclampswith a gooseneck, which can hold whichever wire or small part you may want to position relative to your PCB?

author: Berni
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2019, 07:00:08 am
content: The top end of the post is a fixed "mushroom" shape while the bottom part travels up and down and is spring loaded. You place the post on the steel sheet where the magnets grab it, push down while holding it to open its "jaws", slide it closer so that the board is inside the jaws and let go so it springs back up to grab it. Works well.The gooseneck probes just have a outside thread on the end where you screw on the actual probe PCB with the pogo pin. So if you have threaded nuts/inserts with the right thread you can have anything on the end. But the way these goosenecks work they won't really hold things in mid air that well. The end is weighted down to make it press the pogo pin down.But i never needed anything to hold a wire against a PCB for me. Its ether i just need to temporary probe something by poking a probe at it, or i want to solder a wire to a pin. If you need someone else to hold the wire for you as you are soldering it to a PCB then you are doing it wrong (Just pre-tin it and then tack it on with only a soldering iron).But if that's what you want then you are better off buying something like thishttps://www.amazon.com/Soldering-Helping-Flexible-Gooseneck-Station/dp/B07DVZGXSF

author: grifftech
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2019, 05:09:04 pm
content: blutachttps://www.amazon.com/Loctite-Fun-Tak-Mounting-2-Ounce-1087306/dp/B001F57ZPW/ref=sr_1_2?crid=3OVOATX6VFE7A&keywords=blutack&qid=1558544827&s=gateway&sprefix=blut%2Caps%2C181&sr=8-2

author: KL27x
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2019, 05:36:50 pm
content: QuoteYou don't have to do this, ever. When feeding solderwire requires a third hand, you can NOT feed solderwire. Put flux on the board/joint. Then hold the wire in one hand and the iron in the other hand. Pick up some solder with the tip of the iron and just touch it to the joint.Be warned that pointy conical tips are among the worst tip to use for this method of soldering. The bead will tend to slide up away from the point, and touching the point of the iron to the joint won't wet the joint. If you have the right tips, you will never have to feed solderwire.If all you have is a conical tip or small chisel, you might find it works a bit better if you can tin one or both things to be soldered, first, with a bead of solder. (It is possible to get a tiny bead on the end of 30AWG, but it is a pain.) Add a little flux. Then reflow.My panavise mostly collects dust. The only times I ever use it involve soldering of thru hole components onto a PCB. I've had a couple helping hands that I just end up throwing away. I feel like people who use these don't know how to solder. Once you know, helping hands are not helpful. There is almost always a more efficient way to solder things.

author: Wimberleytech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2019, 09:31:57 pm
content: I printed this on my 3D printer. I can move the clips to different holes if I need more space. I use this jig for soldering two wires together generally. I have another set of clips with heatshrink on the jaws.I am pretty good at using one hand to hold something and feed solder while using the soldering iron in the other hand.My panavise gets some use as well.

author: MarkF
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 22, 2019, 10:00:01 pm
content: I use one of these from my woodworking hobby to hold PCBs and wires for soldering.It grips wires without biting into the insulation.

author: David Hess
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 23, 2019, 01:54:11 am
content: Quote from: jtruc34 on May 22, 2019, 02:55:35 amI replaced the crocodile clips on mine with better ones and used brass tubing to strengthen the joints at the screw clamps.

author: RobertHolcombe
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 23, 2019, 03:06:14 am
content: I have a few sets of self-closing aka cross-locking tweezers for non-specific holding tasksHeatshrink on both jaws makes them more suitable for holding small objects, the rubber conforms to and holds items more securely

author: Gregg
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 23, 2019, 03:12:02 am
content: This is one of the more versatile devices for the price:https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01JP865B0You can add your Panavise to the middle and it is steel which is handy for keeping small magnets to hold screws etc.

author: Berni
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 23, 2019, 05:16:35 am
content: Well there certainly are uses for helping hand jigs.I tend to use mine for soldering wires to other wires or to connectors. Still mostly using the method of pre-tining and then tacking on. Not having whatever you want to solder the wire onto move around is very helpful. I have also occasionally used it to hold a scope probe.I fixed mine up by wrapping wire around the back end of the crocodiles and soldering them closed into a solid tube. Some fine adjustment to adjust the turning friction can be made by squeezing the tube with pliers into a more elliptical shape to make it squeeze down on the thread some more.As for tiny PCBs that love to move around when soldering i sometimes just stick them down to a larger PCB with some double sided tape or kapton or something.

author: jtruc34
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: May 23, 2019, 04:30:51 pm
content: Thank you for your replies.A holder is indeed not always mandatory as pre-tinning often works pretty well.Also another question: have you noticed any difference between crocodile clips of different brands? I'm about to change broken clips from different devices, and I wouldn't like to rebuy things that will fall apart in two months.

author: Berni
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 23, 2019, 05:10:47 pm
content: I seen huge differences in quality among non brand name crocodile clips.I had some that had jaws so out of wack that it looks like they just lost a kickboxing match, upon trying to align the jaws a bit better the whole thing just fell apart completely. But then i also found no name crocodiles that are are really good, the jaws close properly, bite just fine on thin wire, no weird side to side play, the covering rubber is nice and soft even after many years etc. Similar deal with ready made crocodile cables, some are shit some are good, but sometimes its only the cable that's crap and you can easily replace that with your own.But if you go for the cheapest crocodiles you can find on all of chinese ebay then you can generally expect to get useless garbage.

author: jtruc34
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: May 24, 2019, 07:41:06 pm
content: Ok! That's pretty interesting. So, I'll have to rely on luck on that's all? Or is there any criterion to now in advance?