element14's latest contribution for world peace - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Majorstrain
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 03:30:37 am
content: [Rant ON]It's been a while since I've ordered from Element14 but obviously they have been keeping track of my projects. That last thermonuclear device I exported to Libya must have stuck it's head up into the radar.Jokes aside,12 hours after I place an order for a Beagle board and some solder I get the attached "Honestly I'm not a terrorist" form via email to fill out.It's not so much getting the form that ticks me off but the fact that I have toPrintthe bloody thing,Fill it out, and thenScanit again tosend it backto them.If they must have my "Non electronic" signature, they could at least auto fill out the Name /Address , Full product description and part number section.They included all that information in the email they attached the form to.I lost half an hour to this crap and that added another $60 onto the parts cost.Bloody lucky I didn't order 100 different parts from them.[/Rant OFF]

author: Fsck
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 03:36:55 am
content: That's pretty funny. What exactly do they think you're going to do with a beagleboard though?I wonder if the EU policy is logical (doubtful) or just blankets vague categories.

author: 4to20Milliamps
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 04:04:45 am
content: That form sure looks like it would prevent most terrorists from building those things, most of them are fine upstanding individuals with the utmost respect for the law and would never lie when filling it out.Of course there is that 1 "dumb criminal" that would actually give his real name and address and disclose that he intends to build a nuclear bomb with the stuff.I don't know which is more frightening though, the thought of somebody blowing me up, or the thought of having people in charge of things like this that are so dim- witted that they think it will actually make any kind of difference.This is truly a scary world we live in.........

author: retiredcaps
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 04:24:30 am
content: Martin ran into the same forms wrt to the Agilent U1232A multimeter. The supplier was RS Components.The U1232A could be used as a weapon of mass destruction. Apparently the cheap $5 830 style multimeters on ebay aren't sufficient enough for that purpose.

author: ddavidebor
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 05:02:13 am
content: Next in all th eshop, terrorino, the new arduino-compatible board especially made for terrorist.With a bomb detonator with complete library, a rgb led and a temperature sensor.Make your bomb explode, check it with the temperature sensor and let your victimes see the liights!

author: Bored@Work
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 05:05:41 am
content: Whatever you answer, consider the result going straight into your PRISM record in the name of anglo-american friendship. And heaven forbid you make a small error, the system will flag any discrepancy. If they are clever they also tell Uncle Sam who didn't return the form, and those will be flagged too.You are doomed.

author: digsys
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 05:21:45 am
content: That's OK. Farnell aremorelikely to send you the wrong item, then tell you that their ISO9001 is only for thedeliveryof yourgoods, not what's inside the package. So that'll make the spooks MORE suspicious, and think you're part of a plot ... WOOHOOOO

author: Stonent
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 06:49:16 am
content: Judge Napolitano might make a good supreme court justice and I agree with him on most things, except for his view on immigration that I don't think I've heard anyone else have. He believes there should be no restrictions at all on immigration in the world, so anyone from anywhere should be able to move to any country in the world with no restrictions. If the entire US population decided to suddenly move to Australia, then sure no problems. Or a billion people from anywhere else wanted to move to the US, sure no problems.

author: Majorstrain
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 08:15:51 am
content: Yep now I know how Martin felt.Well here's the update,I just got another email telling me that my description was insufficient. I can only assume it's thePurpose of Goods:section because I cut and past their product description in for theFull Description of goods:section.My original entry was "Machine vision" for the beagle board and for the solder "General use".So I updated my Purpose of goods section.3. What will the goods be used for? Full explanation of the end-use/purposeBB-BBLK-000 BEAGLEBONE BLACK, CORTEX A8, DEV BOARD – It's a dev board, I'm going to generally stuff around with it re. machine vision/ 3d scanning and then throw it in a draw and forget about it.3096525-M SOLDER WIRE, 60/40, 180 DEG, 250G – I'm going to melt it and suck in the flux fumes and generally make a messThe time spent on this has now cost more than the parts themselves.Well now I'm committed to designing my Nuke use machine vision to seek out an borrow up the person responsible's butt at Element14 (Formally Farnell) b4 it goes off.Here's a except of the email replay to them and a copy of the latest updated form.This has now cost me an hour of my time ($130 AUD) which is worth more than the order itself.If the new details are not sufficient then cancel the order and credit my card.Do let me know if you take that action as soon as possible so I can order the parts though Digi-key with a hell of a lot less hassle and now definitely cheaper (including shipping).Do fix that bl##dy form that you send out.Get rid of the text highlighting where you want me to fill in the details. I have to do that for you so that I'm not trying to write over black areas from the print out.Not good enough Element14 (Formally Farnell)Won't be back, CheersEnough is enough, Monday was not the day for this to go down.Finding my happy place until tomorrow.Phil

author: mikeselectricstuff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 09:33:54 am
content: I think an email to their managing director is in order, asking why they employ people in their export dept who are so incompetent that they can't even pre-fill a simple form, and why their system is so badly organised that it results in unnecessary delays to orders and unhappy customers. Some people moan about Digikey's system (which could be improved by filtering to only appear when relevant products appear on the order), but at least it means orders don't get delayed.People like E14 are also sensitive to comments on Twitter.Having said that IME Farnell/E14 don't appear to care about dealing with user complaints about website crapness and how they could improve - all they ever do is send out bullshit click-through surveys that are no use to anyone. I've given up telling them what's wrong - they just don't get it.Under description, I'd have put "look it up on the website - you have the part number dumbass!".

author: Majorstrain
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 10:04:49 am
content: Quote from: mikeselectricstuff on June 17, 2013, 09:33:54 amThat's classic Mike, well done.

author: JoannaK
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 10:09:31 am
content: These export restrictions are *** pita. I'd really would like to know how many terrorists (or foreign coverments) they have defeated by harrassing hobbyists and small companies at western coutries.

author: amyk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 11:24:48 am
content: Just use Photoshop, GIMP, or even MS Paint to fill those in...I have a scan of my signature that I just paste in whenever I'm asked to do this sort of paper-wasting form-filling.It's not the solder they're worried about, it's the Beagleboard. I remember reading on TI's website somewhere that some of the OMAP chips "contain export-restricted technology", whatever that means.

author: chickenHeadKnob
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 11:45:02 am
content: I was cruising adafruit's website 3 weeks ago, which I rarely visit, and noticed they had Beagle bone blacks in stock. Made a semi impulse buy right there because I figured it would sell out quick. I was planning to buy one just not so soon. First time try with adafruit, they use regular post to Canada. Click -click and about 8 days later in my post box, no fuss, no forms. Maybe they ship to OZ.By the way extremely happy with the BBone Black, everything works that I tried so far, even like the Angstrom distribution, thought I was going to immediately install some debian variant instead, not so sure now. Anyway double plus good thumbs upfor Adafruit and circuitco/BBoneBlack.

author: free_electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 03:01:44 pm
content: The beagleboard is indeed subject to itar... Because it has encryption capabilites on board. Anything over 128 bit encryption is subject to export control. Don't blame farnell / element 14. They are just doing their work. Blame the makers of the beagleboard. There is no point having a crypto core int hat board. Disable it. Makes export easier.As for solder ... Does it contain lead ? Bingo . Shoot at the Rohs and Weee.

author: AlfBaz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 03:53:54 pm
content: Quote from: free_electron on June 17, 2013, 03:01:44 pmGranted that farnell (insert wanky silicon name here) have to comply with the law, that's still no excuse for such a stupid law to exist, considering AES-256 encryption can be achieved with just about any run-of-the-mill compression utility on the PC... Hell, they even have free android apps that do it

author: staxquad
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 04:06:47 pm
content: Quote from: JoannaK on June 17, 2013, 10:09:31 amit's called Full Spectrum Dominancethey rule you and you know it (and if you aren't being ruled by them yet, you will be is their thinking)

author: mikeselectricstuff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 04:34:16 pm
content: Quote from: free_electron on June 17, 2013, 03:01:44 pmYou can blame them for the inept way they handle it, causing unnecessary delay and inconvenience.

author: madworm
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 05:11:20 pm
content: Lets assume you order 2 of those DMMs, or several other parts that miraculously fall into that 'danger zone'.Do they send out these forms 'per item' or would one form cover the whole order?

author: SeanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 05:33:50 pm
content: If you order 2 then they assume you are building mass amounts......Then again Grandfather made bombs for the Allies, Dad delivered them all over Europe ( and spent a little time at a hospital in the Bodensee as a result) and I worked on the delivery systems for the same bomb designs.

author: madworm
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 06:06:10 pm
content: So I assume they'll send in the SWAT team...BTW, do they ask what kind of WOMD they're looking for (just nukes and the likes, or maybe even GMO, sugar, wheat and aspartame)?So far I haven't received that kind of nonsense from Mouser. Maybe I should ask them what I need to order to get such a form, so I can make fun of them later.

author: c4757p
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 06:08:01 pm
content: Quote from: madworm on June 17, 2013, 06:06:10 pmBridge rectifier. I don't remember specifically which part number - I think it was mistakenly listed as restricted - but they gave me hell over a standard GBU bridge rectifier at one point. They didn't have a form, they wanted a phone call.

author: mikeselectricstuff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 06:49:03 pm
content: Quote from: madworm on June 17, 2013, 06:06:10 pmMouser do indicate on the product page when items may be subject to controls, like this XBEE Armament...http://uk.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Digi-International/XB2B-WFPS-001/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMsjLMBIknjmkl5yqYT8IHUB3FIQGLbTz70%3d

author: madworm
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 07:13:52 pm
content: "This product may require a licence to export from the United States."Seems like their system is a bit brain-dead as well. It should know if I need a 'licence' or not, once logged in, and show something more useful instead of this vague 'one fits all' phrase.

author: mikeselectricstuff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 07:16:03 pm
content: If you want a laugh, search forexport licenseat Mouser, for stuff they won't even ship, even with a silly form.Mostly connectors - presumably the idea is that if terrists manage to get hold of some advanced military kit, they won't be able to plug it in

author: mikeselectricstuff
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 07:19:12 pm
content: Quote from: madworm on June 17, 2013, 07:13:52 pmI think the "may" means it depends on the destination country. The silly form is not an export license - AIUI there are different categories of stuff, and agreements with 'friendly' countries so you only need the silly form and not a real export license.

author: madworm
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 07:28:54 pm
content: Hell...time for... "Ministry of Silly Forms".

author: lemmegraphdat
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 17, 2013, 11:15:42 pm
content: This crap only makes micro sense if you realize that in the world of government these folks who would use this stuff to commit acts of terrorism, even tho they be Islamic Jihadists (and that's who they are really thinking about, but absolutely will not say so) are to be tried in a civilian court. PC and all that.

author: Majorstrain
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 18, 2013, 04:27:51 am
content: Quote from: mikeselectricstuff on June 17, 2013, 04:34:16 pmMike hit the nail on the head.It's not the requirement for the form that gets my goat, It's the fact that I have to re-enter all the description and part numbers manually on a form that is formatted with fancy font highlighting and such that I have to get rid of before I even get to fill in those details.Lets say you order 100 different items which happens to include 1 restricted item. You have to manually list the FULL description and part number for all those items.There goes half a day right there. Don't make a mistake of give insignificant info or you'll have to do it all over again.Then I have to print the form, and re-scan it after I have signed it or got the head honcho of the company to sign it.Luckily for me I'm the head honcho and the sh#t kicker all rolled up in one.Element14 have all the details of the parts and numbers in my order, they have my full name and shipping address already.For crying out loud Element14, pull your finger out and at least auto fill in the part description and numbers. At the very least, state which item requires the form so I just have to list the offending item.Quote from: mikeselectricstuff on June 17, 2013, 06:49:03 pmYep. being forewarned gives the chance to go elsewhere or at laest be prepared for this crap.

author: AlfBaz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 18, 2013, 05:08:15 am
content: Quote from: Majorstrain on June 18, 2013, 04:27:51 amWTF!They don't tell you which item is restricted? There has to be some kind of consumer protection law against that practice. I'll have to order something restricted and send a complaint to ABC's "The Checkout" show

author: ddavidebor
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 18, 2013, 05:14:20 am
content: Consumer law?We're talking about america? Never heard of an american consumer law

author: Majorstrain
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 18, 2013, 06:00:32 am
content: Quote from: AlfBaz on June 18, 2013, 05:08:15 amThat's a cool show, I love it. It has me rolling on the floor laughing all the time.For those who haven't seen it, you can catch it on ABC ivew.http://www.abc.net.au/iview/

author: Dreso12
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 18, 2013, 07:06:54 am
content: I have to buy sensors for my job, I mean pressure sensors, flow sensors, level sensors ...etc from different suppliers in the states, and everytime I am receiving this form. Do they honestly think that if someone was going to use them for terrorism they will just not lie in the form?.

author: AlfBaz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 18, 2013, 07:54:32 am
content: Quote from: ddavidebor on June 18, 2013, 05:14:20 amWe're talking about element14, presumably in Australia. If the purchase is conditional this condition should be madeabsolutelyclear prior to sale and would think it would be illegal to take (process) payment until that condition has been fulfilled.Quote from: Majorstrain on June 18, 2013, 06:00:32 amYeah, I love that show. Brilliantly done. Maybe Dave could do an "as a guilty engineer" sketch

author: peter.mitchell
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 18, 2013, 10:30:43 am
content: Quote from: Majorstrain on June 18, 2013, 06:00:32 amWhelp, there goes my evening.

author: Stonent
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 18, 2013, 05:39:17 pm
content: Quote from: peter.mitchell on June 18, 2013, 10:30:43 amGahh! Bananas in Pajamas is still around? I just had to see the screen shot and the damned song is stuck in my head.