Should I buy a HAM radio?? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / rf-microwave

author: raspberrypi
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 10:48:00 am
content: I was looking for a hobby to get into. I live in a house with a yard where I can put up an antenna. I have a 60' long wire out a second story window right now, I use that to listen to shortwave on my SDRPlay so I do know a little bit about building antennas. How hard or $ is it to get your license? What can you get without having to learn morse code?

author: W9GFO
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 10:57:25 am
content: Morse code is no longer a requirement, hasn't been for years.HamTestOnlineis probably the easiest way to study. A few minutes on Google will reveal other study guides.

author: vk3yedotcom
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 11:09:16 am
content: Quote from: raspberrypi on March 16, 2017, 10:48:00 amA 60' wire is a good length and will work very well on 7 MHz transmitting with a simple 2 or 3 part antenna tuner. It will also get contacts on other bands like 3.5, 10 & 14 MHz.While amateurs still enjoy Morse code, about 95% of amateur activities don't require it. And it's no longer a licence requirement.A one-off fee is charged to sit the exam. But after you've got your callsign many countries no longer charge an annual licence fee.Ham equipment is much cheaper than it used to be.The very cheapest amateur radio transceivers are available as a kit for about $10. However they are morse code transcievers with very low power and poor receivers so I don't recommend them.But you can get quite HF good voice transceiver kits (some of which are 95% preassembled) for between approx $60 to 200. These can have a transmitting range of 2000 km or more with the antenna you've got now. Another choice is a VHF/UHF handheld for under $100. This can go 100km in conjunction with a good local repeater.Digital modes allow longer distances with lower power than SSB voice or FM. Suitable software or apps is easily available. The computer then plugs into a transceiver to transmit/receiver.The $60 transmitter mentioned above (the Bitx40) used to be available a little cheaper but without stable RF oscillator. This is a review. It's included here as most of the basic circuitry is the same - only it's got a more stable DDS to control the frequency.These are two ends of the same 500km contact between two Bitx40 transceivers. I was using a wire antenna approx 60ft long.So to summarise, it's worthwhile, you don't need Morse to do a lot and it may be cheaper than you think!

author: NivagSwerdna
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 12:09:09 pm
content: I got my licence in the UK so national rules may differ but entry level is really easy, no morse required at all, in fact it is straightforward. I got a licence because I wanted to be educated for when the authorities knocked on my door for the various VHF radio modem 'experiments' I was trying at the time.Now the fundamental question... do you want a transceiver.... well it depends on what you want to do...... I had an interest and was very patient following ebay second hand equipment and got lucky and found a FT-890 from a genuine seller in the US. EBAY might not be a good place to buy as there are many sharks so it might be better finding a local club, radio shop or a ham fair and buying from a trustworthy source.I strung up a bit of wire in my garden and on my second day trying I managed a QSO with a Ham in Oz.... now that is pretty cool. (They had a great antenna set-up!), also had a lot of fun playing with digital modes and one day I will be brave enough to try out my morse skills I have been trying to practice in my spare time.So if you can find a decent transceiver... might be worth a go.At the moment my FT-890 is in a cupboard but when I am at a lose end I will probably get it out again...73M0ETA

author: KD0CAC John
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 02:56:44 pm
content: Since I do not know you , can not answer , it depends on what you knowledge base is , if you are familiar with electronics , RF , math .It should be easy , and if you are then you could possibly take all 3 elements [ tech , general , extra ] in one test session and pass .Of course then there are those that just take the practice test until they memorize the answers without knowing anything , but that sucks , because you will most likely be causing issues on the airwaves and asking endless basic questions .One good sign is that your listening to short wave , thats a big deal , getting familiar with how to operate , unless you follow the wrong examples .This could go on for a while , but I think a real ham is one that is technical by nature , and can build / repair a station , but that is not common now days , part of the reason is no real kits anymore .Maybe 1st , if you have to ask , then no , seems to me you should be interested in ham radio , not follow the others jumping off the bridge

author: w2aew
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 03:10:28 pm
content: I see that the OP is in the US. As others have mentioned, morse code proficiency is no longer a requirement. There are three license classes: Technician, General and Extra. Qualifying for each license is a multiple choice test. Tech and Gen tests are 35 questions each, and Extra is 50 questions. They must be taken in order - i.e. you must pass the Tech test in order to take the General, etc.There are some really nice no-nonsense study guides that you can find here:http://www.kb6nu.com/study-guides/Makes it easy to see where you need to brush up.I've personally used the Technician no-nonsense study guide as a teaching aide for Technician classes that I've taught, and have had very good success with them.FYI: The technician test has a lot more of the rules and regulations (i.e. memorization stuff) than the General and Extra. As you move up in ranks, the tests have less about the rules/regs, and more technical content.

author: AF6LJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 03:35:28 pm
content: Quote from: w2aew on March 16, 2017, 03:10:28 pmThis is very true...If you can read you can pass the Technician Exam.The general class in terms of theory isn't very difficult, and will get you more HF privileges.Since the OP is in the US, I will say the best place to get amateur radio related information in a forum style would be QRZ.com, I send plenty of people over for test equipment help and advice, Sending folk to QRZ for amateur radio related stuff is a sound choice.You can also find practice tests there on the main page, you would be surprised how well you might score on the Technician question pool just by using a little common sense./She who loves the ZED

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 03:51:26 pm
content: I have a technician class license, passing the test was trivial. As for whether you should get a radio or not, that depends on what you want to do. I have little interest in yakking on the radio, I got the license so I could legally run reasonably powerful video transmitters on my RC aircraft.

author: raspberrypi
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 05:07:05 pm
content: I'm used to tests. I have passed a Series 7, 63, Life/Health insurance and Annuities LTC and Med Supp. Those tests were eight hours long each.My boafung radio should be in the mail ($9.00 shipped) Ridiculous..

author: AF6LJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 05:11:34 pm
content: Quote from: raspberrypi on March 16, 2017, 05:07:05 pm

author: Lord of nothing
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 05:15:05 pm
content: QuoteYou can be happy.Here you have to pay a hight feel to the Exam + for the Callsign and Monthly for the Callsign.

author: Seekonk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 05:22:03 pm
content: It used to be if you were interested in electronics you became a ham.I saw something a while ago. Ireland or Scotland had a number you could call and it would connect you randomly to someone who had signed up to accept random calls from people in other countries. It actually sounds like a good way to connect to other people in the world.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 05:43:13 pm
content: The internet kind of killed it for me. If I had grown up a couple of decades earlier I'm pretty sure I would have gotten really into the ham thing, but these days there is a lot less magic in making contact with a distant person. I can pull my phone out of my pocket and call my friend in England on his US VOIP line any time I want, for free, and talk as long as I feel like without anyone else interfering. I can get on Google Streetview and "wander" around distant lands. I can hop onto a forum like this and converse with people all over the globe who share my hobbies and interests. There's still some "magic" about pulling in a distant signal but it's just not as exciting as it used to be.The thing I miss most are some of the mysterious signals that used to be on shortwave. As of a few years ago I could still pick up an eerie Cuban "numbers" station many times in the evening. There used to be a lot more of those spy stations that broadcast a string of numbers read out in a robotic sounding voice. Analog cordless phones were fun too, and back when most police/fire/medic stuff used VHF you'd occasionally pick stuff up from many miles away depending on atmospheric conditions. Much of that stuff is digital now and it's almost all trunked.

author: AF6LJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 05:47:12 pm
content: Yes you can pull your phone out and make a contact on the other side of the of the world.Look at all the help you had doing that.You used a third party with all kinds of communications infrastructure.There is something to be said for doing the same thing;With a radio you built or repairedAn antenna you builtHad to deal with the fickle nature of the ionosphereAnd did it without paying a monthly fee to do so.

author: w2aew
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 05:53:07 pm
content: Yes - today, ham radio isn't so much about the capability (talking to folks around the country/world, using satellites, etc.), it is more about the challenge and sense of accomplishment in doing these things, often with homemade equipment or antennas, or simply by doing it relying on knowledge, skill and luck rather than an established communications infrastructure.

author: Lord of nothing
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 05:56:25 pm
content: QuoteAnd today you hear the Powerline Adapter from the neighbours next to you. I try manything but I could not get any clear signals. The crap transmitt from ~2Mhz up to 30Mhz.Code:Much of that stuff is digital now and it's almost all trunked.And Encrypt.

author: W9GFO
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 06:05:05 pm
content: Quote from: AF6LJ on March 16, 2017, 05:47:12 pm...and will still be effective when the zombie apocalypse arrives.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 06:05:25 pm
content: I didn't say it isn't still fun, it's just not as amazing anymore now that long distance communication is the norm.My great uncle was a long time ham, he had cards from contacts all over the world, it was a really novel thing back then to talk to someone on another continent.If some kind of apocalypse arrives, we could be more useful setting up ad-hoc WiFi networks than relaying messages around on the ham bands. It's nice to know I have the option of using the radio to communicate should the need arise, but I don't actually expect it to be all that useful, it's just a hobby.

author: W2NAP
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 08:20:32 pm
content: yes, get a ham license. only go right for general. that way you can get on HF voice,cw and data

author: apelly
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 09:04:37 pm
content: You can tip in a lot of money and effort for very little useful outcome. I love it and recommend it highly!Quote from: raspberrypi on March 16, 2017, 10:48:00 amMe too. And it's awesome. A whole host of new, (sometimes) expensive and useless toys.

author: raspberrypi
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 10:23:54 pm
content: I am so buying that. I like the beach shots, but your January's in aus have just terrible weather. Whats a trusted source to buy one? I talked to some old kodger today about going to a meet up and getting the extra class lic. instead of borrowing a dead persons call sign, he explained how that might not be a good idea.

author: VK5RC
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 11:49:22 pm
content: +1 re getting gear from another Ham, esp a local, he is less likely to sell a dud, do check it out though, or have someone else.The whole idea of Amateur radio is not really to talk to another Ham but as a means to self experiment and learn about electronics esp rf.From a learning perspective I feel, the license or licenses are just the beginning.Talking to another, especially with the same interests as you, can be of both educational and social interest.73 RobertVK5RC

author: AF6LJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 16, 2017, 11:57:26 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on March 16, 2017, 06:05:25 pmThere isn't anything amazing anymore, life is all about settling into what you want to do/learn and enjoy a peaceful existence.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 17, 2017, 12:10:46 am
content: Sure there is, I've seen more amazing technological developments in my lifetime already than I ever would have imagined possible. I mean if 20 years ago someone told me that today I'd be able to buy an inexpensive fingernail sized memory device that holds 32 gigabytes I'd have thought they were on drugs. The fact that I can pull a tiny phone out of my pocket, call someone on the other side of the world and talk to them like they're in the next town is still pretty amazing. Being able to download several gigabytes from a server in another state/country in a short period of time, that's pretty amazing.

author: raspberrypi
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 17, 2017, 12:52:08 am
content: Quote from: james_s on March 17, 2017, 12:10:46 amIf someone told me that 20 years ago, I would ask why aren't we using jet packs and hover boards? Replicators (no not goo out of a slow noisy 3d printer)How about a cheap SouthWest hyper sonic flight to Honk Kong that takes 3 hours and costs 89 bucks? Instead we have the same shit as 20 years ago, just a little bit smaller and faster but just as expensive and now with 2 year contracts and convenience fees. My glass is half empty, BUT it's the cups emptiness that makes it useful. You can't do much with a cup thats full except dump it out.Yawn.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 17, 2017, 01:01:40 am
content: The problem with hover boards is physics. The problem with cheap hypersonic flight is both physics and thermodynamics. Pretty much the same deal with jet packs, you have to be able to carry the fuel required to provide the lift, and look at how some idiots drive, do you really want those same people zipping around with jet packs? You can't beat the laws of the universe. Traveling fast through the earth's amosphere requires a LOT of fuel, lifting straight up off the ground requires a LOT of fuel, there's just no way around that.Maybe you aren't old enough to really appreciate how far things have come in the last 20-40 years but we have technological developments that one could hardly have dreamed about back then. Computers are not only cheaper but orders of magnitude more powerful. Communication is cheap and readily available, rather than slogging through the primitive internet that was just becoming a thing in the late 90s on a 9600bps dialup modem we have always-on broadband that can transfer tens of megabits per second. Progress has occurred faster in the last few decades than any previous time in human history.

author: AF6LJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 17, 2017, 01:38:29 am
content: If I had come forward from twenty years ago I would be asking..What happened to those carbon based transistors that were suppose to operate in the mid terahertz range?Where is my designer genetic modifications, I want green shoulder length hair, without all the hassle of dying it.

author: djacobow
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2017, 04:21:08 am
content: First of all, I'm a pretty new ham operator, and I love it. Of course, it borders a "useless" activity, but it's fun and satisfying. I really enjoy the idea of working against physics rather than dealing with someone else's infrastructure (and associated tolls). There are all kinds of modes and experiments to get into. As an EE who avoided RF for most of his career because it was mysterious and my undergrad curriculum as almost none of it, I feel like a proverbial pig in sh$t, now that I have just jumped in.I also agree with the other posters that there does seem to be something "off" about what is amazing about the modern world. One of my personal stalking horses is Moore's Law. Many people see this as some kind of amazing continuous revolution of innovation, but I see it much more as the slow-motion advancement to the logical end-state of the planarized transistor. And now we finally seem to be here at the end of that road.We've made great strides in information processing, and have gained major efficiencies in problems where information processing helps a lot, but in a lot of ways we haven't moved far in my lifetime. Air travel is a little slower in the air and a lot slower parking lot to parking log than it was when I was a kid. (It is cheaper, too, though.)We asked for flying cars and got Uber instead. Yay.

author: vk6zgo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2017, 05:49:07 am
content: Quote from: james_s on March 16, 2017, 06:05:25 pmIt wasn't amazing then, either.Long distance communications using HF radio was mainstream knowledge.Indeed,until the advent of Satellite communications, it, and undersea cables were the only useful methods of overseas speech communications.Years before I was born, (& I am 73), "shortwave" coverage was common on domestic radios.What excited people was that someone could do this stuff at home---like they would have been astounded that someone could have a machine shop in his garage.QuoteYes, not because it wasn't possible, but because for normal folks international phone calls were prohibitively costly.QuoteYes!

author: Lord of nothing
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2017, 10:54:05 am
content: QuoteWell the US is behind the Time.Fast and Cheap Cellphone Service?Fast and Cheap Railway Service?Quotelol6GB Data for 45USDIn Austria 5GB cost 10€ (or less).

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2017, 06:41:53 pm
content: Quote from: Lord of nothing on March 18, 2017, 10:54:05 amI'm not sure where you got those numbers. It varies widely but I pay USD30/mo for unlimited text/voice/data on mobile, and USD40/mo for 30Mb down/up with no cap, fiber to my house. This is comparable to much of the rest of the developed world as far as I can tell. My electricity is also only about USD0.08/kWh, about 1/3 what my friend in the UK pays.It's true that we do have parts of the country with rather poor communications infrastructure but these are rural areas. The USA has vast swaths of sparsely populated rural land in the middle, areas larger than many whole countries. It's just not economical to install high speed communications in areas that serve so few people. You probably won't find cheap high speed internet in the Australian outback either, or the middle of Siberia.

author: Lord of nothing
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 18, 2017, 06:50:47 pm
content: QuoteAT&T Webpage. In Canada a Prepaid is very expensive:http://www.fido.ca/web/Fido.portal?_nfpb=true&_windowLabel=prepaidLanding_1_1&prepaidLanding_1_1_actionOverride=%2Fcom%2Ffido%2Fportlets%2Fpackages%2FplanPhoneBuyFlow%2FgoToPrepaidRates#minQuoteSo what is "Unlimited"? In the most Country there is a litmit.Quotethere is Sat. Here in Europe Astra launch an Sat for Internet connection the price is ok for Sat Service.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 19, 2017, 01:26:37 am
content: I'm sure there's a limit somewhere, but I've never hit it. I'm not one of the small percentage who consumes multiple terabytes of data per month.

author: NA5WH
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 19, 2017, 04:43:22 am
content: Quote from: raspberrypi on March 16, 2017, 10:48:00 amI currently have a little less than 40 feet of random wire outside in my small little "back yard" (if you can call it that here in Miami... its like 25 by 25 feet if that, and it has to be below my fence line and basically invisible because, you know, 5000 people per square mile etc. And I've worked just about everywhere. Obviously low power and non-optimized antennas do complicate the ability to communicate, but that is part of the challenge.License fee can be anything that the VEC wants to charge, but typically small lunch a test attempt, and typically you can take all the tests from in one sitting for one price if you pass them all. When I first got into ham radio they had just dropped the morse code in the entry level class ("Tech No-Code") .. but still I think it is a good idea to learn. I progressed all the way to Advanced (which at the time required code).As for preparations, there are quite a few good places online (not sure what the rules are on suggesting sites on this forum)... and there are some decent study aids on youtube as well (for the US exams). For the US exams, the FCC release the full list of all questions that you could be asked, so you could learn by rote, but of course naturally the only things that one interested in electronics really will need to 'learn' are the band limits, FCC rules etc, as the entry level electronics questions are pretty easy.Really you will spend more on radios, especially if you are going to use random wire as you will need some sort of antenna tuner. But luckily it can last years.All in all, I'd really recommend finding a club near you.. almost all of them help new people get started.