How's CS progressing? Is it no longer "beta"? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Pack34
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2018, 04:04:51 pm
content: It's been out for a while now and I'll be up for buying an ECAD license soon for personal projects. I have a v7 license for Eagle but since I'm quite proficient with AD I think it would be an easy transition. At only $500 it seems like a really nice price-point as I'm not quite up for paying 5k out of pocket for AD.

author: mars01
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2018, 11:23:49 pm
content: You can work with it but the last two yearly updates were tiny, no bugs solved. So it's not well maintained.Otherwise, get a trial and use it for yourself. It's the only way to see if it fits within your expectations.But one thing it's sure: it's not Altium Designer.

author: ahbushnell
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 22, 2018, 03:07:23 am
content: Quote from: Pack34 on September 21, 2018, 04:04:51 pmI use it and like it. Not perfect but better than Eagle in my mind.Get a trial and see what you think.

author: voltsandjolts
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 22, 2018, 12:41:40 pm
content: Like the OP, I was familiar with AD when I bought CS. I like CS and it serves me well for the type of boards I do - typ 4 layer, low frequency, medium density SMD.Libraries and schematics are directly compatible (both ways) between AD and CS. For PCBs, you have to export from AD in PCB5 format and import to CS - you lose the 3D step models but only takes a minute to update the parts from the libraries to restore 3D models and the 3D views are just as good as AD. This process is OK for one offs but if you are working regularly with other people using AD for PCB development it becomes a pain.The feature I miss most is outjobs. CS outputs are more limited but it gets the job done.You might also miss trace length matching, scripting, object selection by query string.Also, do not expect CS features to be under rapid development! The most notable feature added in the last two years for me was layer sets, nice but not exciting.You gotta accept that CS is not as well featured as AD and whether CS is suited to you depends on your expectations - definetly run the trial.As I said, I like CS but am just pointing out the negatives so you are forewarned. If you can accept the above then CS could work well for you.

author: IanJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 22, 2018, 08:17:48 pm
content: Hi,I moved from Eagle V6 to CS and never looked back. There are some quirks with CS like dropping via's and get the keystrokes in the wrong order can crash CS.......but overall compared to V6 Eagle it was like chalk n cheese!I haven't tried the more recent versions of Eagle so don't know how it compares now.My only wish with CS is that they put more work into development and fixing bugs......but it's just a crawl these days.Ian.

author: trevwhite
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 24, 2018, 02:10:16 pm
content: My experience is the same as others. It does the job but has its qwerks. For the money I am happy with the product itself.My one gripe is that support is a layer removed from Altium. I believe Farnell are supposed to support the product but if you have any difficult questions that require a response from the actual company, they pretty much are not interested. They do not reply to emails regarding CS issues. It leaves a slighlty bad taste in the mouth and is the reason I have stuck with V1.4 instead of paying the yearly figure to upgrade.The software does work and import of step files for library parts is a great feature. I just wish they woul emply someone to handle customer support.Trev

author: Joel_l
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 24, 2018, 07:13:00 pm
content: So, CS is a like/hate relationship for me. It has some nice features and you can definitely work with it. My biggest gripe is lack of Altium support. There was a post on the Newark/Farnell site where Altium promised a road map detailing CS plans. The date that was promised seems to have come and gone. I went back to look at that post and noticed it had been edited to no longer include any dates. To me, that signaled a lack of commitment for CS and just reinforces what has been observed in the past.As mentioned, try the demo, if it is satisfactory for the price point to you, then maybe. But have no expectations of anything meaningful getting fixed or upgraded.My only other issue is documentation, it is lacking. Some stuff to get you going but any non mainstream tasks you will have to figure out if it's possible on your own. Sometimes a Google search will help you find what you are looking for.Joel

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 27, 2018, 06:40:59 am
content: Still full of bugs! It's feeling like an indigogo campaign!

author: voltsandjolts
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 27, 2018, 07:42:49 pm
content: To be fair, you are possibly including bugs of your own making!!https://www.element14.com/community/thread/65016/l/unknown-pin-error

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 28, 2018, 06:34:53 am
content: Quote from: voltsandjolts on September 27, 2018, 07:42:49 pmno, i am referring to the fact that they issued an update that just added some uncalled for bling and did not address any of the well known issues. Why are you persecuting me?I checked my template symbol, it is set to standard, the copy of it was set to mechanical! I also never called the issue a bug as it may have been something I did yet once again another of those complications without explanation. I then went on to get more errors that I ignored as they do not seem to affect the design and I don't have time to help E14 and Altium find bugs they have no intention of fixing, I have a customer that wants a quote! Ever heard of that? having to rely on buggy software to make a living? If I supply faulty goods I get them thrown back and have to issue a refund. But it seems you can produce software that does not work properly and that's OK.CS used to be $3000 now it's $1000, so does that mean E14 is ripping Altium off and this is why it is so shoddy? but that is not my problem, Altium is big enough to employ the layers to get this right!As I keep saying, Proteus is cheaper and more stable with free phone support and prompt bug fixing. I only stopped using it because I did not like the workflow and prefer the CS one, without the bugs of course.

author: voltsandjolts
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 28, 2018, 10:35:26 am
content: Quote from: Simon on September 28, 2018, 06:34:53 amSimon, I offer sincere apologies that my comments read that way and I value your contribution to the forum. Sometimes I feel that you concentrate on the negatives of CS but don't mention the positives, then I try to add some balance to it and end up sounding like/being an arse...

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 28, 2018, 03:19:41 pm
content: I'm still waiting for the promised road map and i live in fear that the product gets pulled altogether. Farnell/E14 are a bunch of useless wankers that don't even know what they have in stock. First they fucked their eagle customers over and fucked them off to autodesk who in turn are reputed to be ruthless bastards that don't give a toss about their products but only about how many people they can hold over a barrel.Then E14 had the fucking arrogance to invite eagle licence holders to come back and buy a cheaper licence to CS.And I'm supposed to sit back and feel comfortable. If this pathetic E14/Altium partnership falls apart you can bet CS will be pulled and we will have to buy an AD licence, or rather those with the money will have to.Altium have already made it clear they don't give a shit about CS as they contact all users after 9 months to invite them "to join the Altium family" which actually means buy AD, despite several people experiencing this James Hariman told me that they definitely do not do this when he took the trouble to call me on my mobile in the UK from Australia.Frankly this whole thing stinks and I'd rather they quit the politics and pull their fingers out of their ass holes and start to produce some engineering results!!!!!!!!!!

author: ahbushnell
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 29, 2018, 01:45:40 am
content: Quote from: Simon on September 28, 2018, 03:19:41 pmI think I have heard this somewhere before.Why don't you use something else.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 29, 2018, 07:57:57 am
content: Quote from: ahbushnell on September 29, 2018, 01:45:40 amProbably because it is still true. I just installed a fresh copy of CS and I did not even need the update it came in the download so that update that people paid for is not even an update.No I won't use something else, I have already spent a lot of money and time on software and I need to stop now. I can't keep remaking libraries.CS is priced at more than enough so I am sorry and I know it's novel for todays industry and in particular the software one but I want what I paid for!I'm also better off knowing an Altium product in terms of job seeking in the future. The problem is that Altium is no different to microsoft in it's attitude but we all put up with microsoft because we don't have a choice. It seems that Altium have the same tyrannical power.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 29, 2018, 07:59:17 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on September 29, 2018, 01:54:50 amYou are in china and I am in the UK the comparison is silly, my first car cost $600 and without one employers refuse to employ you.

author: Towger
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 29, 2018, 07:10:15 pm
content: Quote from: Simon on September 28, 2018, 03:19:41 pmCarefull Simon, I have a suspicion that one of those Autodesk/Eagle managers is an active member of this form. :-)At least it is still affordable, one package I started to use years ago and have not updated for years... Changed hands twice and in the process went from a few hundred to 12k dollars. There are several much cheaper alternatives. But they know it takes time/money move to another product, so are milking customers for all they can.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 29, 2018, 07:29:25 pm
content: careful? what of the truth? Autodesk don't sell software, they lease it. Work no longer uses Autocad because of this as it is not our main package. So all those that have been using eagle to my knowledge have to now remain frozen with the last version that in the future may have compatibility issues with windows. So those users who want to benefit from future versions will have to pay constantly for access to the software and once they stop paying are their designs still accessible?From what i can tell Autodesk has bought well established software packages to harness the profits from the change in licence terms.Perhaps an Autodesk manager can confirm for us what the new eagle licence terms are. The situation has also been discussed at length on here already.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 29, 2018, 07:59:22 pm
content: Your point is pointless. If you want to discuss the price/value of AD go and have a chat on the AD section of this forum. I have already told you that the price of CS is in excess of comparable products.

author: Pack34
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 29, 2018, 10:05:54 pm
content: Well, this thread blew up...I've been playing around with the trial and the delta between AD and CS was a bit more than I was expecting. I thought it would be more-or-less a slightly different GUI (Ribbon) then have the Vault, Draftsman, and any simulator hooks stripped out.Am I missing something or is the "Properties" pane and the "Find Similar" tool not in CS?

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 29, 2018, 10:14:19 pm
content: Quote from: Pack34 on September 29, 2018, 10:05:54 pmWhat do you expect, The Altium and Farnell aliance have their crusaders, but nothing takes away from the fact that the software has bugs known to them and I believe about 2 years later and after a promise of an update nothing! except deception.You are talking about $7500 versus $1000, what did you expect? other than the politics.I'm not sure what properties pane you are talking about, can you be more specific?

author: Pack34
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 29, 2018, 10:21:14 pm
content: I'm expecting a paired down and simplified version of the full-featured product. Introductory and "prosumer" version that has most of the tools but anything to do with simulation or features that enable corporate use not to be present.For the Properties pane, I mean the Properties pane. You select anything in AD18 and it lists everything about the part in the pane automatically instead of having to open another window. This made some tasks really quick and easy. For example, if I wanted to quickly set a bunch of components to a common Y-axis value I could just select everything I want, fill-in the Y-Axis value in the properties pane and hit enter. It also felt a lot smoother workflow-wise then having to open countless popup windows when I'm adjusting simple things like text sizes, via diameters, etc.

author: voltsandjolts
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 30, 2018, 08:20:34 am
content: I think you are looking for the 'Inspector' panels:http://documentation.circuitstudio.com/display/CSTU/Sch_Pnl-SCHLIBInspector((SCHLIB%2BInspector))_CShttp://documentation.circuitstudio.com/display/CSTU/Sch_Pnl-SCHInspector((SCH%2BInspector))_CShttp://documentation.circuitstudio.com/display/CSTU/PCB_Pnl-PCBInspector((PCB%2BInspector))_CS

author: ahbushnell
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 30, 2018, 01:03:16 pm
content: Quote from: voltsandjolts on September 30, 2018, 08:20:34 amThis is great. I wish I had seen this yesterday.Thanks!

author: Pack34
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 30, 2018, 05:15:21 pm
content: Quote from: voltsandjolts on September 30, 2018, 08:20:34 amSweet!Thanks man!

author: voltsandjolts
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 30, 2018, 05:48:08 pm
content: You also mentioned 'find similar objects' which does not exist in CS unfortunately.'Filters' are OK but not as powerful (or maybe I'm using them wrong?)If you have a PCB already, cross-probing can sometimes help with selecting similar schematic components from the pcb, as decribed by user songshome:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/circuit-studio/globally-changing-footprint-references/msg1328518/#msg1328518

author: Pack34
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 30, 2018, 06:00:06 pm
content: Quote from: voltsandjolts on September 30, 2018, 05:48:08 pmThat's really unfortunate. It was a saviour when it came to configuring the default silk text to be more compact. I'm quite partial to 25mil height and 5mil thickness as a standard.

author: voltsandjolts
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 30, 2018, 06:06:08 pm
content: That's still easy if you want all silk text the same size (select silk layer, shift-s, filter text, select all), just a bit of pain if you want several different sizes for different components.

author: jmarkwolf
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 04, 2018, 07:33:05 pm
content: Quote from: Pack34 on September 29, 2018, 10:05:54 pmYes, unfortunately the "Find Similar" function does not exist in CS. You can, however, do a similar function with the inspectors panels.I used Protel/Altium for 20+ years when I was working. Bought CS when I retired for the occasional consulting job. It's not AD but it's close enough for 95% of what I need it to do. 20 years of files and libraries are all compatible. Menus are different and this has been my main complaint. I wish they had simply turned off (grayed out) some AD features rather than making the wholesale changes to the CS menus.Aside from that I would recommend CS, particularly if it's still only $500.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 04, 2018, 07:45:03 pm
content: I expect the people that got ripped off for $2500 for what was widely criticised as a buggy version 1.0 are very pissed off now. I think a lot of bugs have come out of the hacking apart of AD. They still won't admit that one software with tiered licensing is the way to go but then they want to make sure people feel like the rejects they are until they stump up the cash for AD. Proteus is tiered and that works great for them.

author: Pack34
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2018, 02:40:28 am
content: Quote from: Simon on October 04, 2018, 07:45:03 pmThat would depend on the software and the pricing tiers. In the lower-cost space it's hundreds and the business space it's expected to cost thousands.It would be smart to have the same backend, but different branding and limited functionality. Remove the vault, simulators, limit the size so you can't do large backplanes, limit depth to 8-10 layers, maybe simplify the GUI some, etc etc. Convert files UP to the premium but limit conversions down.Inexpensive CAD tools are great, but it just doesn't make business sense to cannibalize the primary product. The low-cost variant should be a lead-in and draw to the premium and not divert people away.

author: Kaziq
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 07, 2018, 11:24:14 am
content: Sadly still in beta...

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 07, 2018, 11:37:13 am
content: Yea the autorouter is not that great.

author: Kaziq
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 07, 2018, 11:40:17 am
content: Not autorouter. It's a hatched polygon with two clearance rules for different net classes.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 07, 2018, 11:42:03 am
content: Oh, well if AD has 2500 bugs then good luck with CS.

author: ahbushnell
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 07, 2018, 03:58:45 pm
content: Quote from: Kaziq on December 07, 2018, 11:24:14 amI don't understand the issue?

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 07, 2018, 04:02:13 pm
content: Quote from: ahbushnell on December 07, 2018, 03:58:45 pmIt's buggy! for example every project I do i have problews with importing from schematic to PCB, I now realize that most of the errors are false and it will still work. CS is a joke!

author: Kaziq
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 07, 2018, 04:57:43 pm
content: Quote from: ahbushnell on December 07, 2018, 03:58:45 pmThe hatched areas belong to a polygon, which should go smoothly around the traces and pads at a constant distance from them. Instead the grating lines stick weirdly out of the edges, and the edge shape itself is wrong. Here is the picture of how it looks (correctly) with the polygon set to solid.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 08, 2018, 08:58:43 am
content: If you want a good example of how redicolously shit it is: Yesterday I made a copy of a whole load of net labels I wanted to use again. They were in a long vertical line. I made the mistake of moving them from the top net and pushed the bottom ones off the sheet. While it is possible to put stuff off the sheet like this you then can't do anything with them once off the sheet. So I had to hit back and go again. Not a disaster but an example of how pittyfully raw it is in places.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 09, 2018, 11:43:08 am
content: the so called autorouter, these rule violations are so simply fixed yet the software is incapable.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 09, 2018, 02:10:06 pm
content: Also i have wasted over and hour trying to understand why the autorouter was executing with no errors but not placing any tracks. Aftor placing a via manually I found that my hole size and via size were back to front making a via impossible to place. So why could the numbskull fuck halfwitts at altium not program in checks and error messages for these basic setup rules.

author: voltsandjolts
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 09, 2018, 06:00:26 pm
content: Quote from: Kaziq on December 07, 2018, 11:24:14 amAD had some issues with that too. A workaround was to use multiple pours, solid near 'problem' areas and hatch fill elsewhere.What's your reason for using hatch fill?

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 09, 2018, 07:03:18 pm
content: The fact is the hatch fill crearly does not work. It's the sort of thing i expect from the likes of KiCAD not a near $10'000 pragram. If altium at $10'000 has 2500 bugs does that mean that the new fancy software they are launching will have a few thousand of it's own too? what on earth are they doing at altium? sitting around drinking coffe and having meetings about having meetings?

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 09, 2018, 08:19:32 pm
content: so at the moment I am trying to edit the board shape. All that happens is that I get locked into some mode that won't allow me to edit the board or go back! even using the back buttons. Yep, very betary shit that I paid for. If only that update had been an update!!!!

author: Kaziq
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 10, 2018, 03:50:52 pm
content: Quote from: voltsandjolts on December 09, 2018, 06:00:26 pmThe PCB manufacturer complained about uneven copper distribution on the layer, which could lead to copper being too thin in some areas, and to thick in others. By using hatched polygon I tried to reduce the copper density in the polygon area. But in the end I managed to solve the issue differently.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 10, 2018, 03:54:31 pm
content: At the end of the day if they put the hatched feature in it should bloody well work. Free stuff like KiCAD can get away with that sort of shit but this is supposed to be professional software and yet it is a joke.

author: ahbushnell
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 10, 2018, 04:55:30 pm
content: Quote from: Simon on December 10, 2018, 03:54:31 pmDeja vuQuit using circuit studio.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 10, 2018, 08:54:21 pm
content: Quote from: ahbushnell on December 10, 2018, 04:55:30 pmIf i take that attitude there is little i can use. I paid my money for a product and it does not work as described. If i walked into a shop and handed money over for something that was brand new only to find it was brocken I could go back for a refund or replacement and if they refused it would be called fraud. It does not work like that with software, you pay your money and take your chances because there are no laws to cover the suitability of software for the advertised purpose. Apparently AD has 2500 bugs so really I suppose we are supposd to be lucky CS fires up at all!

author: ahbushnell
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 11, 2018, 01:24:28 am
content: Quote from: Simon on December 10, 2018, 08:54:21 pmMy point is we understand your frustration but you are like a broken record.It's not perfect but I make boards with it and have learned to work around the problems.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 11, 2018, 07:24:21 am
content: Of course I sound like a broken record! so do Altium and Farnell in their lies!

author: IanJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 13, 2018, 11:56:05 am
content: Quote from: Simon on December 11, 2018, 07:24:21 amSounding like a broken record is sometimes the ONLY way to get things progressing.....so don't let up IMO!Personally, I am dismayed that we haven't had any updates or notices about whats happeneing next in regard to CS updates. It's almost like Altium have drawn a line in the sand and that's it! I do know that resources at Altium are split between AD and CS......but it's been quite a while now!I sooooo much want it to be better than it is in 3 or 4 areas, nothing drastic requiring NASA software engineers to get involved, just bug fixes and a bit of cleaning up some functionality.Please Altium!Ian.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 13, 2018, 12:29:58 pm
content: Altium costs a mint, they can't say they are not able to finance development. CS falls off of the back of AD and is more expensive than other programs out there that are way more stable. They have made a rod for their own back by not just doing tiered licencing of AD. they frankly do not understand how to develop a good product or the industry they are supposedly serving.

author: voltsandjolts
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 13, 2018, 02:49:22 pm
content: I've just finished my third board layout this week without a hitch. I find CS to be very stable, can't remember when I last had a crash.Ian is right, there are bugs which need attention but are fairly easy to workaround for now.Of course we all have new features we would like to see but it's a very usable system as is.

author: Joel_l
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 15, 2018, 01:26:20 am
content: A while back on the Newark support forum there was an email stating that Altium would make available a roadmap and development plans for CS. Said they would post such plans in 90 days or something like that. That date has come and gone a long tome ago. I went to look for that message a couple times, found it once but any reference to dates had been removed. Now I can't even find it. Guess it's easy to make promises knowing you can just delete them later.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 15, 2018, 08:26:20 am
content: I also started a topic asking when we would see the road map but as you have pretty much discovered they are simply fraudsters! I wonder how many people were tricked into handing over money under this false pretence for a license update expecting them to play nice now and that boys and girls is pretty much the definition of fraud in law! To take money from someone under false pretences! But aren't Altium now pretty much based in china now? so go figure! And of course the last time I downloaded CS it came with the updates already in it no need to install them after checking my licencse that was valid by a matter of hours before the year ran out, so I'm not sure why anyone had to pay money for the so called update if it now come updated for anyone....

author: IanJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 13, 2019, 07:17:51 pm
content: Just fired up CS tonight and there's a new Beta update to 15.2.30 available......no idea what the changes are, the beta forum is quiet.Ian.

author: ahbushnell
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 14, 2019, 01:57:59 am
content: Quote from: IanJ on February 13, 2019, 07:17:51 pmIf you try it out please post.

author: ahbushnell
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 14, 2019, 01:59:49 am
content: Quote from: ahbushnell on February 14, 2019, 01:57:59 am

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 14, 2019, 07:57:29 am
content: Apparently mine is up to date, I assume it checks even if the license is expired to encourage you to renew?

author: IanJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 14, 2019, 11:50:34 am
content: Quote from: Simon on February 14, 2019, 07:57:29 amI tried to update to 15.2.30 beta last night but it kept failing with one particular component. I tried twice.I'm away from the workshop right now so can't check but maybe they've pulled it...…..I'm on the beta program so maybe that's why I got the notification....albeit it's been a while.I enjoy CS very much, the last bug fix update sorted most of my issues...…..there's just a few GUI issues and of course the Vault problems I wish they'd look into......i.e. navigating the vault, copy n paste footprints issues etc etc. At the moment I detest the vault with a vengeance and rarely go near it.....preferable to just create my own footprints or download off the web etc and be done with it...…..Ian.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 14, 2019, 12:29:27 pm
content: i didn't know there is a beta program. I don't bother with the vault as it never had what i want and if I make my own parts I get what i want on the BOM. You can still download integrated libraries, I use a 3mm grid so can't use any schematic symbols as the world is still stuck on 0.1" but I have taken footprints from manufacturers Altium libraries.

author: ahbushnell
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 14, 2019, 12:54:37 pm
content: Quote from: IanJ on February 14, 2019, 11:50:34 am15.2.30?

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 14, 2019, 12:59:31 pm
content: well we are desperate to see a return on our money that anything is better than nothing.

author: 2N3055
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 14, 2019, 01:22:40 pm
content: Well it seems it is still in beta...

author: voltsandjolts
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 14, 2019, 07:25:32 pm
content: I disagree.I find CS to be a capable and stable tool.Yes, its has some bugs and could have a few more features but for medium size layouts it gets the job done nicely.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 14, 2019, 10:02:21 pm
content: Quote from: 2N3055 on February 14, 2019, 01:22:40 pmWell Altium are all chinese now? maybe they misunderstand "beta" for "better" so a beta program must be a "better, better" program.

author: 2N3055
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 14, 2019, 10:03:42 pm
content: Quote from: Simon on February 14, 2019, 10:02:21 pmLOL!

author: ahbushnell
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 15, 2019, 03:00:47 am
content: Quote from: voltsandjolts on February 14, 2019, 07:25:32 pmI agree.

author: Zbig
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 15, 2019, 11:57:20 pm
content: A bit off-topic but I really hate how they keep spamming me with Altium Designer related e-mails (events, seminars, etc.) and fail to even acknowledge there is such a thing as CS. Couldn't make the fact they treat CS solely as a vehicle for shilling AD any more obvious if they tried. Do they really think folks who are into EDA software, of all people, are that stupid?

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 16, 2019, 08:15:19 am
content: Quote from: Zbig on February 15, 2019, 11:57:20 pmand yet when James Harriman from Altium took the trouble to spend 40 minutes on a mobile phone to me in the UK from Australia he assured me that altium did no such thing. But then everything coming out of Altium is a fat lie and they are clueless about their audience or they would never have even entertained the idea of circuit maker.

author: mc6800
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 05, 2019, 12:14:27 pm
content: They have released the 1.5.2 update now, but as far as I can tell all it does is fix the bug with fetching data from Digi-Key due to their API change (apparently notified two years ago). Oh, it also allows data from a number of new suppliers.In my case the 'update' came a few days before my subscription expires, so I'm not sure about renewing. There doesn't seem to be any sense of urgency from Altium/E14 about making new releases - will things change with Avnet in control now?

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: March 05, 2019, 12:18:39 pm
content: Avnet have potentially been in control for a while. It is only now that they are applying their branding and presumably tieing their stocks together. I doubt they will do much to CS for a while and are still at the mercy of Altium who seem to have no mind to change their screw the customer attitude.

author: OleMi
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2019, 09:12:27 pm
content: To me it's not beta, but alpha. Altium seems not keen to fix multiple bugs and there is one annoying bug that doesn't allow to work efficiently at all. It loses focus and jump to other windows on PC. Once I deleted my project instead of deleting tracks, because on delete operation it kicked me off to explorer. I described the problem with some video proof on their forum and heard that Altium has no roadmap for bugfixes.They probably will fix them when more of our licenses will expire so that we are forced to pay-off them their bug fixes.I am with @Simon about Altium's arrogant pitch to Egle users. Altium claims about Eagle: "They make you pay again and again for the same tool". In fact we will do the same just to get bug fixed, because CAD is quite raw. My 15-years Layout 16.2 does much better, but has no multiple undo and 3D.For new-buyers my advice: do NOT.... until Altium begin to have a clear policy and roadmap for bugfixes.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 03, 2019, 07:48:33 am
content: Quote from: OleMi on April 02, 2019, 09:12:27 pmNo that is Farnell that have short changed Eagle users. The problem is that we have two bad coampanies involved. Altium clearly do not care but we do not know what deal they have with Farnell that play silly buggers with the price. A program that launched at £2500 is now under £400, soon you will be getting a licence with your cornflakes! I'm sure those that were ripped off by Farnell for £2500 are furious and I am not happy to see that a program I paid £800 for is now less than half of that and that is about all it is worth when compared to the alternatives. To me the dropping of price is admitting that it is shit and that they do not have serious plans and I doubt there is any judge in the world that would rule in a court of law that they have to support what they started. I fear that the CS user will be well and truly fucked over worse than the Eagle ones were, they now have to pay a yearly fee if they want to update but they have a program, we CS users may end up with nothing at all and have to start all over again. I hope all of the other package suppliers are looking at this fiasco closely and are ready to step in with Library and project converters so that we can move to another package once Altium and Farnell have finished CS off once and for all.

author: OleMi
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2019, 06:49:33 pm
content: I read the arrogant claim on Altium website so I said Altium.For me as the guy who was in marketing for many years the purpose of this Altium’s branch is obvious - PR of the supplier, Farnell. Other suppliers on the list are just for anti monopoly law. Farnell come with the idea of “cheap” CAD and sponsored it. This is common business model in many industries nowadays. The reason why we see bugfixes mainly related with vault is because of that goal. I am ok with this business approach and ready to “see ads” unless I didn’t supplied with buggy-solution. Probably sponsorship fee was not paid off, their marketing plans failed and we have what we have.

author: kaz911
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2019, 06:24:51 pm
content: I think Altium is just killing CS on purpose.I think the strategy is : Do not update very often and only push small updates. That will stop people paying for update subscriptions. Then Altium can say "well CS is not doing great - we have very few subscribers left - so lets just cancel the product"Typical "Big Company" politics.So my guess - in a year a so - CS will be canceled - and anyone still paying might be offered an Altium upgrade FOC - as at that time it will be cheaper than doing updates and develop CS. But the end user base need to be small enough for them to do a positive cost benefit.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 04, 2019, 06:41:36 pm
content: Yea I have been wondering the same.

author: Warhawk
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2019, 06:53:46 am
content: I can't believe how much the price has dropped. Also glad that I did not buy it and invested my time in something else.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 05, 2019, 06:57:11 am
content: Yea £2500 down to £380, I am a firm beleiver in "you get what you pay for" or should. So was it only worth £380 when being sold for £2500. Maybe James Harriman of Altium can tell us if he is not hiding.......

author: mc6800
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2019, 04:21:02 pm
content: I would say £380 is a closer estimate of its true price. For example, one competitor is EasyPC, and that costs about £500 for the "unlimited pins" version (compared to the ~5000 pins maximum for CS).I must admit I really don't understand why Altium/E14/Farnell didn't just create a feature-limited version of AD, instead of a new clone with some bits disabled, others badly removed, new UI etc etc. It would have made updating it so much easier for them. They could have just limited things like pins, layers, board area etc in a fraction of the time that making an entirely new system required. If they really wanted to stop substitution for AD, they could have made the file formats compatible upwards (ie CS to AD) but not the other way round.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 05, 2019, 04:29:16 pm
content: Yep, told them that and many think it but as we all know Altium are incompetent,

author: kaz911
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 25, 2019, 09:11:33 pm
content: Happy Birthday CS 1.5Now it has been a year with only tiny "bug fixes"

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 25, 2019, 09:15:04 pm
content: Quote from: kaz911 on May 25, 2019, 09:11:33 pmYea, that was £1000 down the drain that I will never get back. Currently working with KiCad again, screw CS and all the various wanker corporates behind it.

author: IanJ
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 26, 2019, 12:14:04 pm
content: Hi all,Well, I have to be positive.....because thats the way I feel about CS.I came from many years with Eagle PCB, and Wintek's HiWireII/SmartWork before that.......and, I did try KiCad and DipTrace when I was looking to move from Eagle but found the workflow and importantly the GUI completely alien......yeucchhh!So, when CS beta came out I signed up and have not looked back.......it suits my workflow just fine, and the library management is quite flexible so suits me ok as well. The ribbon I really like, and just like when AutoCad went to the ribbon folks hated it......but once you "get it" (less experienced = quicker) you never move back.The word from Altium to me a few months ago was that their dev team is somewhat split between AD and CS, the latter taking a clear lesser priority. I was also told that the team were looking to move back to CS soon. Whether this is true etc I don't know.One wonders WHY Altium have so many apparent problems managing/fixing bugs versus adding new features (AD/CS).....it does seem like the accountants are running the company which is a shame.........but again, I am glad for CS as the PCB world is a better place for it........and will stick with it for now.Ian.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 26, 2019, 12:25:57 pm
content: Nah, CS is no better than KiCad, but KiCad is being worked on. The development team are not split betwenn AD and CS, they are trying to keep up with AD whilst launching a shiny new program that is even more expensive than AD. Farnell have tried to force interest in CS by cutting the price from £2500 down to under £400 and it has not had any significant work done since I paid £800 for it. I'm sick of it and I'm off. Christ they can't even put 4K support in whereas KiCad natively does 4K.i am not going to wait around for them to finally loose interest.Why they did not just do a multi licence of AD with features turned off I do not know, it would have been more efficient but like you say the company is run by accountants.

author: toshas
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 03, 2019, 07:13:16 am
content: Quote from: IanJ on May 26, 2019, 12:14:04 pmI have asked them around a year ago. Answer was the same : we will move back to CS soon and 2.0 will be released at the end of year.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 03, 2019, 09:37:07 am
content: even if they do, what about nexh time they need to do work on it but AD or their new $20K+ software needs attention?

author: kaz911
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2019, 06:59:34 pm
content: Quote from: toshas on June 03, 2019, 07:13:16 amYes V2 was supposed to be out late '18 according to promises made.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 04, 2019, 08:37:17 pm
content: Quote from: kaz911 on June 04, 2019, 06:59:34 pmIs AD ver 18 out yet? James hariman told me that they could not do CS until the latest release of AD, then that pathetic non update came along with the promise of a roadmap. And since then? nothing!With the price now reduced further I think CS is a binned project. They may tinker with it, make sure it runs on windows but I suspect the show is over. It was a disaster at launch and has not got much bettor, now standing at 15% it's launch price it's clearly a gonna. It has a bad reputation and it will only loose credentials as it is left to rot as the gone wrong project it is.The way i see it at the moment KiCad and CS are at about the same state. Mostly functional with bugs and with work to be done. But KiCad is actually being worked on and there is more transparency.. CS we get fed one cock-a-bull story after the other.

author: voltsandjolts
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 04, 2019, 08:58:19 pm
content: I use CS most of my working days and while it has some bugs and lacks some features, it works well for me.Its a good tool at a great price and helps me produce boards with a minimum of re-spins.However, more regular updates would give me better confidence in its future.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 05, 2019, 06:58:12 am
content: That is my bigger concern. Yes it works with niggles but given the massive price drop even from £900 down to £380 tells me that someone is not making as much money on it as they used to and they are admitting a failure. Even the way they did the price reduction worries me masking it as a "sale" except that sale just never ended. at £380 from Farnell, how much is Altium getting? has it reduced or was it always that bad?, you can see why Altium can't be bothered, it's genuinely not worth their money. I wonder if they are locked in a contract or if there will be a time out date and it will simply slip away as a now incompatible program.

author: plazma
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 06, 2019, 06:22:42 pm
content: Quote from: IanJ on May 26, 2019, 12:14:04 pmI have about the same experience. Free Eagle got too restricted so tried Diptrace and KiCAD. Bought CircuitStudio and have been happy with it. The routing engine is great.

author: Simon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 06, 2019, 06:25:10 pm
content: Their autorouter is not great. I found the manual routing fairly good but it can misbehave. Editing traces was impossible in one project but of course bugs are normal and they are not interested.