RF Explores vs. HackRf+PortaPack as el cheapo spectrum analyzer - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 14, 2019, 10:12:14 am
content: While I neither have the need nor the space for a full featured spectrum analyzer, it would be sometimes helpful to check if there is some RF communication in a certain frequency range for troubleshooting. Mainly for things like Bluetooth or WiFi (2.4GHz and 5GHz) but it would be handy to cover the whole range from ~20MHz to 6GHz to also include RC toys, Z-Wave, mobile phones and the like.I guess theRF Explorer 6G Combowould cover most of my needs even though it only supports the ranges 15–2700MHz and 4850–6100MHz - so there is a gap between 2.7GHz and 4.85GHz. It's not like I'd use any LTE or 5G mobile equipment operating in this range at the moment, so it's not a major issue. Still.Then there's theHackRf Onewhich I understand can be used as a spectrum analyzer from 1MHz to 6Ghz due to its sweep mode. With thePortaPackextension, it becomes even portable (you still need a powerbank). Now my understanding is that PortaPack offers a scanning mode which displays only a waterfall diagram but not a classical spectrum analyzer view. I'm also unsure if it really supports the whole frequency range or how practical or limited this actually is. There also seems to be an Android app called "RF Analyzer" which provides basic spectrum analyzer features on the go but it seems to be more or less abandoned.Obviously the RF Explorer is closer to a serious measurement device and offers a real spectrum analyzer view (plus, there's stuff like the WiFi analyzer which might come in handy). Then again, I feel to observe if data packages are sent or not, a waterfall diagram would be more helpful which the RF Explorer only provides with a PC connected but the PortaPack offers on the go. Letting aside that the record/replay features of the HackRF/PortaPack are somewhat intriguing and there is no gap in the 3-4GHz range. So I'm leaning towards the HackRf+PortaPack even though I'm aware that there is not much of firmware development going on anymore and it's more of a RF hacking device than a spectrum analyzer.So did anyone here use either device to check for (visualize) the presence of data packages over some RF protocol? Are there maybe other obtainable (portable, up to 6GHz) devices in this price range (<500€)? E.g. there is a device calledArinst SSA-TG R2but it seems to be available only from the Russian Federation and doesn't offer a waterfall diagram even when connected to a PC or Android device. I guess a USB only solution that could be connected to an Android device would also cut it, but they all seem to be limited to certain frequency ranges (e.g. SDR sticks <1.8GHz, or only WiFi Ranges like the Oscium WiPry).

author: Bicurico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 14, 2019, 12:34:16 pm
content: My first suggestion: buy a cheap RTL2832 dongle and use it with SDR#. This will cost you around 5-10 Euro if bought from eBay or up to 40 Euro if you buy i.e. the Noolec dongle. Same thing, but slightly imporved (better cooling, better xtal, etc.). Take your time with exploring the RF bands of your interest (up to 2GHz) with this dongle. You will notice that spectrum refresh rate is great and so is the possibility to demodulate analog transmissions and even some digital ones (unencrypted Tetra, for example). BUT: you will notice that the bandwidth is far to small (around 2Mhz). You can't even render a whole DVB-T transponder!So here comes the HackRF:- Increased frequency range of up to 6GHz (let's not consider how good it works at that high frequencies)- Increased bandwidth - up to 16MHz - now you can see a whole DVB-T transponder and more on the spectrum- Can TX as well! But not in synchronous mode: either TX or RXBut: spectrum wise it is the same at the 10 Euro RTL2832 dongle.The RF Explorer is kind of the same: more a toy than a real spectrum analyzer. There are some applications where it is perfectly suitable, like monitoring wireless microphones. But don't expect any real performance and mind you, the refresh rate of the spectrum is slow!Please take a look at my blog and consider buying a SMA/NWT device. (Link in my signature)The other option is to buy a REAL spectrum analyzer, second hand. It is more expensive, bigger, heavier and you may have to do some repair. But believe me, there is nothing like browsing the ether with an HP 859x series spectrum analyzer - or a Rohde & Schwarz CMU200/CRTU: both can be bought at interesting prices.Regards,Vitor

author: DaneLaw
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2021, 02:25:29 am
content: sorry about the necrohumping, but would love an update from OP and what he ended up with..AS I been in the same situation this last ½ year, and ended up with 3 devices for semi-based RF explorer purpose.a 24USD PC based variant aka those cheap 31mhz to 4.4ghz variants with as I recall dual ADF4351 chips (sadly the MicroUSB port is lifted, likely from not having it in a case, so waiting for some MicroUSBsockets and will try exchange the socket) but until that happened it worked great when you have the price-paid in mine, though the software will be vital.(I got a few favorites).and also got one of those 21mhz to 6.2ghz that I recall are using MAXIM chips (2870E).. and it had way better sensitivity from my rookie perspective, then the 24USD variant, but also way more expensive and around the 100dollar mark.The cheap one on the left, and the more expensive one on the right.but the last few weeks, been having one of these HackRF+Portapack 3.2" (v3.3)the silver metal oneit was around 150USD (clone) though incl. 5 antennas and LIPO battery, it was preinstalled with Mayhem 1.2 and just needed assembly.so-far I'm very impressed with this SDR and some of the SDR freeware software for these SDRs are extremely polished when using it in HackRF mode on PC (even on windows OS).Here a brief video-look on an call with my mobile.and here FPV AIO cam.The signal generator on the SDR is valid for at least 6.2GHz.. I can't validate any higher than that, though the effect obviously varies across the RF span.The menu will take input up to 7.25GHz, but don't have any spectrum-explorer tools to validate above 6.2GHz, but the +7GHz mostly in theory and to see if HackRF vendor at Def-con2014 claims hold water..https://youtu.be/4Lgdtr7ylNY?t=1104What product did you end up with topic-starter?

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 17, 2021, 02:13:07 pm
content: I went for the HackRf+PortaPack mainly because of the waterfall diagram. As with all my toys, I didn't use it nearly as much as I originally planned though. My interests come and go.

author: DaneLaw
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 23, 2021, 05:20:18 am
content: Quote from: 0xdeadbeef on July 14, 2019, 10:12:14 amQuote from: 0xdeadbeef on January 17, 2021, 02:13:07 pmThere are constant updates and nightly builds and all that jazz for the Portapack, though the full releases will be displayed on Github, but the makers for Mayhem etc.. have a Discord were we discuss big and small and try out new things and implement features and codes and trial & error these...If you want a link, say so..// Btw if it's the waterfall that rocks your boat' there is also an Android app for the HackRF-part and I was pleasantly surprised with Dennis Mantz work, to an extent where I donated as gratitude for the work, not least as it is a full app-version that these years are completely free and works surprisingly well for what it is' with my HackRF Portapack (H2 v3.3) with an 20MHz span.vid.https://i.imgur.com/RMGEJWS.mp4and here Googles app-promo vid.https://youtu.be/r36fd_QhpNM?t=7Finally managed to nstall speakers in my unit' but they needed to be pretty thin as I only had around 4.7mm clearance inside and around the metal housing-speaker grill and the HackRF board.https://imgur.com/a/ZyjZMWL