Siglent SDS5000X - feedback? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: bson
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 07, 2021, 05:04:38 am
content: So I'm seriously considering one of these as an upgrade to my LeCroy WaveSurfer 3054. In particular the SDS5054X model.It comes standard with decoders for I2C, SPI, UART and CAN, right?Has anyone tried to use the LPA10 adapter with LeCroy ZS1000 probes? I'd get it to use with my AP034 (differential LV probe), but if it works with the ZS1000 that would be great. (I see Siglent only mentions the AP033.) Otherwise I'd get a Siglent AP and in the long run probably two.The 5GS/s seems like it would limit the 1GHz model, in that realistically only one channel can sample signals at this bandwidth. But maybe two channels could look at 750MHz? To be honest 500MHz is plenty for already as it is. What is the actual -3dB bandwidth?How is the logic probe (SPL2060)? Just works?Does it have an external trigger out?How is the software? I like the way LeCroy handles zoom with zoom traces, including for things like decode, and can tabulate decoded transaction. Tap a row in the table to jump to the corresponding signal capture.How similar is the firmware to LeCroy XStream/MAUI?How does the scope feel? It seemed pretty responsive and with nice update rates in Dave's review a couple of years back. (With early firmware.)I assume the firmware is mature by now.Can it save screenshots to remote file mount over the network, similar to LeCroys?Has anyone hacked it? I wouldn't mind saving a few bucks by not buying the MSO software option... buying the probe it should just work, like any other probe. I find it a morally dubious practice to sell software to enable use of the hardware you just bought. Just charge more for the probe, or eat it.Are there any specials here in the U.S.? I notice the usual suspects charge MSRP... (Although there's always the eevblog discount, of course.)

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2021, 08:15:41 am
content: Quote from: bson on November 07, 2021, 05:04:38 amI have one.QuoteAFAIK the online scripts work just fine and now I don't remember how I got the BW upgrade license for mine.QuoteYep plus more optional protocols.QuoteYou need read this:https://siglentna.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/LPA10_TPA10_Datasheet_DS060APA_E01A.pdfTaking note of the mention not all LeCroy probes have been tested. However LPA was specifically developed for Probus probes.From the datasheet:Probes with LeCroy Probus interface can be automatically detected by using the LPA10 and proper oscilloscope firmware.QuoteYou overlook these have dual 5GSa/s ADC's, each with 250 Mpts memory support therefore 2 channels can be used with full sample rate and memory.QuoteIIRC Performa01 posted some 1.08 GHz. Can test if required.QuoteSPL2016 works fine with these and 2kX Plus, the older 2kX and the new 6kA.QuoteAux Out which is also used for a Mask test triggered output.Quote^ Comment best left to someone that has experience with both.QuoteGood although I don't have other brands to compare with.QuoteYou can check the last 4 versions release notes here:https://int.siglent.com/download/firmwares/?ProId=4Or if you download and unzip any version a PDF with all changes is available to study.QuoteBeta testers are polishing this in the 2kX Plus which they might implement in 5kX, IDK.Screenshots below with I/O options as they are now and some other stuff I've been playing with.

author: luudee
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2021, 09:31:00 am
content: I have a SDS5034X, liberated it to full 1GHz bandwidth and enabled all options.I also have the SPL2016 logic probe, it works just fine, can trigger on any of those digital channels.I have never used a LeCroy scope, so can not compare. BUT, I love the zoom function,well thought through, and really useful. I use it all the time.I used only the SPI decoder so far, and it is very helpful if you need to decode what is goingon. In my case, I was mostly interested in the electrical functionality and signal quality ...The print function is great, it saves screen captures to the flash disk. Network drive wouldbe fantastic!Overall, I really love the scope, specially for the amount of money I paid ...Cheers,rudi

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2021, 09:55:38 am
content: QuoteI have the SDS5034X with all options and upgraded to 1GHz (but the real bandwidth for the 350MHz model is limited to ~750MHz or so). I'm using a LeCroy 6zi at work more or less every day and also know the Wavesurfer 3000.Some comments on the GUI:# The zoom function on the Siglent is quite a bit different compared to LeCroys. I.e. you can't draw a square around the region of interest to zoom in. I miss that to be frank, but the zoom itself works OK.# The cursors work differently. While on the LeCroy, you will get the value for all channels on the cursor position, you will get only one on the Siglent. I.e. to measure two values at the same position, you need both cursors. That was somewhat of a let-down for me.# There is no way to change the edge of the frequency measurement and similar measurements, which is a bit annoying. Actually, there is generally no edge selection but only a 2nd type of measurement which is not ideal# There is nothing like the WaveScan feature of LeCroy scopes# The ERES feature can be only turned on/off and configured globally while on the 6zi it's a channel function. Then again, as far as I recall, it's only a math function on the WS3000# The GUI is pretty fast, certainly faster than on the WS3000 where sometimes you feel like controlling a Mars Rover. Didn't use the WS3000Z yet though.# There is a certain weirdness regarding the interpolation or intensity grading where most points will be at least two pixels high independent of resolution. It doesn't bother me as much as others, but it's still a bit weird.I made some suggestions for improvement here in the forum and writing to the customer service but was ignored. So I don't think that things like the Zoom, missing edge selection or Cursor measurements will ever change.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2021, 09:57:11 am
content: BTW bson, have one of the SAP1000 probes too if you need to know anything about it.https://siglentna.com/product/active-probe-sap1000/With the release of SDS6000A a couple more active probes have been added to the Siglent range and one of which is a 2.5 GHz differential probe however these are not exactly cheap.https://siglentna.com/products/accessories/probes/active-probes/

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2021, 10:04:00 am
content: Quote from: 0xdeadbeef on November 07, 2021, 09:55:38 amYes that's the shortcoming of the 350 MHz model that AFAIK uses the first revision of the mainboard although I had heard their -3dB point was more like 950 MHz .....just not quite 1 GHz so had to be respun.I waited for a while before getting 5054X to be sure I got the later PCB.

author: tv84
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2021, 10:20:14 am
content: Quote from: 0xdeadbeef on November 07, 2021, 09:55:38 amLoved the analogy!

author: 0xdeadbeef
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2021, 10:47:28 am
content: Quote from: tautech on November 07, 2021, 10:04:00 amI bought my model quite a bit later (Summer 2020, calibration 4/2020), so I would think it's not just a mainboard revision but really a difference in the frontend.I posted this before, but the rise time on my scope is around 550ps. Depending on the formula you use, this means something between 640MHz (0.35) and 820MHz (0.45) bandwidth. But 950MHz seems a bit optimistic.It's OK for me though. I would have loved to have 1GHz, but if it's "just" ~750MHz for a much lower price, that a fair trade-off.Also note that in this edge measurement, there are actually only 50 data points with 5GSa/s. Which kinda shows that sample rate starts to become an issue for this kind of measurements.

author: Performa01
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2021, 06:15:49 pm
content: Quote from: bson on November 07, 2021, 05:04:38 amWith a state of the art sin(x)/x reconstruction, 2.5 GSa/s is actually enough to reproduce a 1 GHz sine wave. Of course, if the input signal is not strictly bandwidth limited to 1.25 GHz, you might experience some minor aliazing.As the scope has two ADCs, you can have two channels with 5 GSa/s each.For the bandwidth with a direct coax-connection, I've measured some 1.176 GHz at 5 mV/div vertical gain. See attachment.I've posted bandwidth measurements for the active 1 GHz SAP1000 as well as the passive 500 MHz SP3050A probes. Both provide a system bandwidth well beyond 1 GHz (rather irrelevant for any passive high impedance probe like SP3050A because of the very low input inpedance at high frequencies).See reply #90 here:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/at-last-siglent_s-sds5054x-touchscreen/msg2165488/#msg2165488In reply #133 you can see a 220 MHz square wave within a 50 ms long record - not many scopes around that can do that...https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/at-last-siglent_s-sds5054x-touchscreen/msg2189114/#msg2189114Quote from: bson on November 07, 2021, 05:04:38 amIt is certainly very usable, but you'll still see bug fixes and maybe even new features - provided the internal resources permit.Quote from: bson on November 07, 2021, 05:04:38 amThat's available for other models aready. Since it doesn't require lots of hardware resources and all modern Siglent scopes build on a common software platform, it will very likely become available in the SDS5000X as well.

author: bson
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 07, 2021, 07:20:10 pm
content: Wow on the feedback - thanks guys! Super helpful.A liberated SDS5034X sounds perfect for my needs... Well, so I ordered one - plus the logic probe and an LPA10.

author: bson
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 07, 2021, 07:24:14 pm
content: Quote from: tautech on November 07, 2021, 08:15:41 amThanks! It explicitly lists the AP034 as having been tested, so perfect!I was a bit afraid the scope had to be able to identify the probe, but it seems even if it doesn't it's possible to set the gain and maybe manually zero it (though I assume the scope has an input zero offset it can apply, but it's of course better to zero the probe itself if it supports it).

author: bson
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 07, 2021, 07:26:46 pm
content: Quote from: luudee on November 07, 2021, 09:31:00 amIt should be even more handy on the Siglent, with its much bigger capture memory. This is part of why I want to upgrade...

author: bson
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 07, 2021, 07:31:18 pm
content: Quote from: 0xdeadbeef on November 07, 2021, 09:55:38 amIdeally of course the trace point should be a vertical bar, intensity graded to reflect the distribution of the capture data it represents...Or maybe it's anti-aliasing?

author: bson
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 07, 2021, 07:32:48 pm
content: Quote from: Performa01 on November 07, 2021, 06:15:49 pmAh yes, of course. It has two ADCs. I clearly wasn't thinking...

author: Martin72
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2021, 09:11:48 pm
content: Quote from: 0xdeadbeef on November 07, 2021, 09:55:38 amI will know it "soon", our awful slow ws3024 will be exchanged against a ws3024z model.I would order some SDS5K for our testfield if I only knew the probus adaptor would work with our lecroy current probes too.