I need help for streaming my wedding - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / projects

author: Zucca
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 14, 2020, 03:44:57 pm
content: So I went to the church were I will attempt for the second time (thanks corona) to get married.Of course everybody wants the online streaming, and I am the only hope to get it done properly.1) Internet Connection20MB DSL is available with 50m Ethernet cable, the upload is about 1MB sooo... no bueno but something at least.Using WIFI hot spot on my 4G phone I get 30-20 MB UPLOAD speed. I could not believe my eyes.Will 4G be stable on my wedding day?2) Audio and Video system.This is amazing. Built in the 90s, the system is all 100% analog.Boxes and boxes with self printed label, LED and switches, and inside some discrete electronic (what they told me)."It was build by a friend who did not left any schematics behind, we have no docs or manuals". Cool.The audio was expected, some cond mics and everything runs magically in a classis audio mixer. I can get the master audio from the church from there.The video is brutal. 3 Cameras, 2 are working. The third not working camera is the wide angle one with better specs. It send the video signal by a custom radio link and nobody knows exactly how. I saw the two antennas I suspect 433MHz link or so.The other two cameras are connected by cable and sent the S-VIDEO signal to the video mixer.3) The challenge: analog to digitalThere is also a DVD recording unit,thisone.This should eat the audio and video signal and spit out the HDMI.How to stream now and HDMI to the social? What is the best device?Somehow the dust on that device is not convincing me.What is the best device to convert these audio/video outputsto a social platform (youtube, facebook ot you name it)?Thanks for helping in this crazy times.

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2020, 04:30:33 pm
content: trying to capture a precious one time moment needs carefull planning, better from experienced people. you dont want to risk "burnt film" in the end. certainly you cant do it alone, you'll need at least an operator during the event. if you cant hire a wedding videographer, you can ask relative or friend to help. there are few levels of device "professionality" out there. if you want to go cheap you can get something like this...https://www.ebay.com.my/itm/Video-Capture-Card-HDMI-USB-2-0-HD-1080P-for-Live-Streaming-Recorder-Grabber/224020083369?hash=item3428a332a9:g:ZEYAAOSwvIJeyLwzbut you must get it early to test if the SW has live streaming function (for PC), for internet-connected smartphones probably should be available by now (i'm a bit out of date in this business) i used to have the analog version something like thishttps://www.ebay.com.my/itm/USB-Audio-Video-Capture-Analog-Video-Recording-for-Windows-Mac-OS-10-14/184324793855?hash=item2aea9d25ff:g:zaoAAOSwNYde4d05to broadcast livestream to audience in the hall, quite abysmal old cheap tech slow framerate by todays standard (i think USB data rate is the limiting factor). i dont know where i've put it now.if you need wireless, probably like this...http://www.seetec.cn/ShowInfo.aspx?id=215&py=SEETEC-150m-SDI-HDMI-Wireless-Video-Transmission-System-WHD150but ask your nearest videographer they should be up to date to the related technology.. but wireless is risky of dropped signal due to noisy environment. if you want full HD 30-60fps pro level rate, dont expect it to be cheap though. you can google how pro videographer do their work and the devices needed, then you can become one yourself (minus the artistic skills)ymmv, cheers and congratulation on your engagement.

author: McBryce
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2020, 04:40:52 pm
content: I'd ignore everything that's already installed and get a crew with experience (and their own equipment) in.McBryce.Btw.: Just checked the post box and my invitation still hasn't arrived

author: BU508A
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2020, 04:50:04 pm
content: Quote from: McBryce on June 14, 2020, 04:40:52 pmI second that. I'd suggest to ask somebody of these companies / folks (no affiliations):https://www.bb-technik.de/http://www.liveco.de/https://www.rent4event.de/https://www.videolink.de/en/Just my 2 Cents.Edit:Just a hint: In respect to this equipment: Don't take it apart, turn it on.Good luck to you and your family. Best wishes from my side.

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2020, 04:53:17 pm
content: Quote from: McBryce on June 14, 2020, 04:40:52 pmi think i have to agree. anything analog or that 433MHz video is before the age of HD resolution videos, at best he will get 360p 24-30fps out of it. but my bet is a blurred video like in 80-90s. imho not worth a risk, even todays video will probably looks funny in the next 10-20years.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2020, 05:07:34 pm
content: Do it the simple way: have multiple smartphones (cheaper/older devices are OK too) or Raspberry Pi cameras connected to one or more APs that is in turn connected to a laptop running streaming/recording software. If the lighting isn't that great, add some LEDs to improve it. Have the cameras recording locally to SD card and you'll have redundancy against wireless dropouts.If you decide to use 4G for the uplink and the signal isn't already maxed out at the location, get an old satellite dish and mount the phone where the LNB goes. Align at the nearest tower and you'll get a great signal.

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2020, 05:13:59 pm
content: yup look at the bright side, your smartphone is the asset you can need...https://www.thewrap.com/movies-shot-on-smart-phones-high-flying-bird-tangerine/but storage for hours of event is something else... planning

author: LaserSteve
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 14, 2020, 06:29:57 pm
content: Hi, I'm one of the three techies at my place of Worship. We have state of the art audio everything for our modest sized (150) person place. One of my duties is spectrum management, and I actually frequently bring in a Siglent SSA-3021 to deconflict the wireless microphones from the nearby TV stations and the cell site in the back yard. Because of Covid and an elderly congregation, recently we have had to get into streaming video in a serious way. We started with IPAD/IPOD video over WIFI and dedicated hotspot, thinking it would be easy and that we had plenty of bandwidth. Worked in an emergency, but we are moving off it as rapidly as possible to a dedicated hardwired system.So here goes:One. Blessings to you and your Bride on your special day..Two, Weddings are HER special day. You do not want to annoy her and your mother-in-law/future babysitter by futzing about with Mystery hardware on HER special day. Since she was about six years old, she has been dreaming of this going perfectly. Instead spend time learning to Dance, writing a speech, and making sure your best man is not a clueless person with no planning. All your focus should be on her. This is how it should be. Delegate stuff to mature individuals who have a clue.Enough said.Three: You touched the existing hardware as a professional, so if you stay there, so guess who is the new facilities engineer. Not listed in the Holy Books, but YOU are the new in-house techie by virtue of Marriage.Four:Despite having a really good WIFI setup with a business class Cable TV internet feed, care to guess what happens on both WIFI bands when 75 ladies and quite a few gentlemen turn on their phone with Bluetooth and WIFI? Also care to guess what happens to one sector of the local cell site? It is literally in the back yard there, is massive, yet gets overwhelmed. So it starts throttling.THUSHardwireeverything..... Even though we have dedicated WIFI nodes for audio and video, every phone in the place still pings them, or causes interference, causing dropped packets. DO NOT GO WIRELESS. Even a prosumer grade camcorder on a tripod beats the phone, except in resolution. Most newer camcorders can stream for you.Five: Have backups, two cameras, two audio feeds. We are amazed how often a musician or guest, or even just an excited congregant can cause a new issue, and the three of us have been doing this for years.Six: It is OK to stream, just don't count on it for anything permanent. Streaming seams simple, but you have very little, if any, controls over the automatic allocation of bandwidth in the downstream path. Trust me on that, lost packets was a major topic of our post service critique today. When we rehearse, things are empty. When we have an actual full up load, things are VERY different. Streaming services can do strange compression things when many people start viewing your stream. So stream everything to a dedicated local hard drive in the building. Edit/Example We had a measured 3 minute Facebook Video latency today.Seven, No plan of battle survives first contact with reality. Hire a professional with a track record. You don't want to be futzing hardware during the rehearsal dinner anyways. Have checklists.Eight: Reach out to others, another place of worship in town will often be able to loan you a techie, costs you nothing more then another plate at dinner. We get calls fairly often when another techie is out of town or ill. We go. It's odd doing a stranger's funeral or wedding, using some one else's setup, but rehearsal cures a lot of ills.Nine: Digital Processing Delays happen. Not fun when the audio does not match the video, its very annoying and visible.Ten, Don't forget the lighting. LED DMX rental fixtures add punch to wall up-lighting etc.EDIT, I checked with the software end of the team, HD streaming for one video at a time costs us a minimum of Three Megabits per second, and that is lossy with bad dropouts on the 2.4 Ghz WIFI we started with. I moved the team to 5.6 Ghz WIFI nodes last week to get that extra Bandwidth, now we have less problems but four active cameras pushes the limit on the WIFI. We select one IPOD/IPAD camera to stream using software at this time, but all four are always active senders. This is why I spent my evening learning about PZT cameras , SDI / HD signaling, VISCA, and video mixer consoles.Steve

author: Zucca
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 21, 2020, 02:14:11 pm
content: Thanks to everybody for your support! Amazing!Thanks especially toLaserStevewho wrote such a nice reply, may the low latency force be with you always.Sorry for the late reply I was planning my honey moon and doing some selling in the breaks.I was sure there is not a "magic box" to plug in and solve the problem.Right now this is what I will gonna do:1) Tripod and one phone for the streaming2) Upload the DVD in youtube after, recorded with two cameras. The one not working is on the back of the church.Done.

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 21, 2020, 02:57:45 pm
content: Quote from: Zucca on June 21, 2020, 02:14:11 pmi suggest..3) Tripod and one phone connected to external 1TB storage for local recording (from same or different angle) and as a backup for (1) and also as a master copy (HD 60fps). if internet line dropped, so is the fps, you will not be able to recover the dropped frames from youtube and then you'll have a laggy HD copy of your wedding for the rest of your life.and also (4) an operator to make sure they are no problem during the event. but well, if you want really cheap, you can drop (4) and then (3) and back to your plan. cheers.

author: DaJMasta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 21, 2020, 04:21:54 pm
content: There are absolutely devices designed for this kind of thing, but they are on a for-rent basis and need a fair amount of paperwork because they are essentially a collection of cellular modems. Something like this:https://www.gunrun.tv/backpack. There are more commercial variants that exist (most TV news crews use cellular streaming when they don't have the satellite van), but probably not near a comparable pricepoint.You absolutely want a local recording device as well, since even half a dozen modems on different carriers can't guarantee you a continuous stream in good quality, and you absolutely want the whole contraption to be run by a photographer with experience using this kind of equipment. This kind of tech problem is not something you want someone part of the ceremony to have to deal with, and it's not something you want someone still learning to do when you're only going to have one chance to get it right. Just the assurance that there is an experienced user of the equipment with a backup policy and experience in similar situations is worth the price of admission for a professional, imo. Odds are good that a wedding videographer will even have experience with streaming setups, to give you a live version and a hard copy to be sure the footage makes it out of the day intact.And as said, dealing with SD video is not even worth the time and effort. A cell phone will give you significantly better performance and is entirely integrated, and even an over the air twitter livestream will give you better video quality than the best SD video systems with any decent signal strength. A videographer will likely use a DSLR with 4k60 capability or better, and will have the lenses and knowledge of lighting and shots to get you better considerably better picture quality than most ad-hoc setups.

author: Mechatrommer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 21, 2020, 05:48:11 pm
content: Quote from: DaJMasta on June 21, 2020, 04:21:54 pmwithout zoom lens on the smartphone setup, bride's face and smile will be missed, i'm guessing the view will only cover all people in the hall. lets hope there is enough resolution for facial expressions. without an operator (or photo/video grapher) there will be only one angle. so its either pastor's back, bride&groom's back, or the side wall (or whatever the background will be)... composition.

author: wizard69
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 21, 2020, 07:35:15 pm
content: Honestly I wouldn't want anything at all to do with this!!!!!! If "somebody" wants to stream a wedding (why in the hell would they want to to that) that somebody needs to go out an hire people that do this for a living. If you take on the responsibility and something goes wrong guess who will be blamed for the rest of their life. The sooner you wash your hands of this responsibility the better.Beyond that who is going to be operating the cameras, managing the computer stream, and otherwise coordinating the production. This is a significant amount of work that you can't handle while participating in the wedding. Frankly the people doing this should be recording all streams at the same time they are being broadcasts. If this is 4K or better then you need a lot of storage and and dynamic compression capability. 4K s pretty minimal if you want the "wedding" to hold up in the future. If you can get this done for $10,000 I'd be surprised. If they need to install a temporary high speed data line well you will be starting out your married life in the poor house.Frankly if it was me I'd skip the stream 100% and go for high quality video production. Find somebody with a Red and get them to record the wedding at high resolution and get it down sampled to 4K and compressed to send to your friends. This way you avoid the real-time complexity of keeping a stream up and running at a remote location.By the way decades ago, in my youth, I actually contemplated getting into photography as a business. Sadly the reality is that I can make more money fixing automation equipment for a big manufacture. It doesn't matter if you are into wedding, porn or something in between, photography isn't a way to a decent living for most people. So when you go about getting quotes don't be surprised to find that it will be very expensive to employ somebody that has experience and the crew to do what you want.