New kick ass device !!! www.umbo.us - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Morgoroth
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 02:55:06 pm
content: Hi guys, actually I'm working on a new project called UMBO, we are testing the first prototype and just released the web page, we are aiming to a Kickstarter campaign, but not before polishing the web page.What we want with the project is to start designing the home of the future, the device is controlled by gesture control and ready to be integrated in short time with some voice services. We overpower the hardware to make it durable and able to get constant updates without changing the hardware.If there is any suggestion for the website, I'll encourage to do it through the site, and any other suggestion through here.www.umbo.usBTW, with the codeJCORDOVAEyou will have 100USD of discount, just for few days, srsly, we need to get those reviews and statistics.Now, talking as a user of this forum for a while probably is a risk to expose the device here in prototyping stage and with so many scams on hardware world. The idea is to get ideas from people of this forum to make the best product possible and understand how to give security about a product.Thanks in advance,JP

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 05:49:01 pm
content: Seems kind of pointless. Also, show this thing in realistic environments, not on ideally clean stock pictures of walls that don't exist anywhere.Also, where are the power wires? "Designers" seem to always forget the mess that power wires create, it ruins their perfect renders.Right now I put that into 100% scam or naive creators category.

author: trophosphere
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 08:26:05 pm
content: Nice looking website. The intention/function of the device is readily recognized within a couple of seconds upon visiting the website. Your FAQ seems to link back to the same page. How is the contrast in real-life during broad day-light especially if the sun is shining into the room in the background?

author: lwatts666
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 09:25:54 pm
content: I just love the way its shown projecting areas DARKER than the background. Must be using LADs (Light Absorbing Diodes)...

author: dr.diesel
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 09:43:51 pm
content: "We all dream about the home of the future, with automatically displayed content on our walls and intuitive gesture control for easy navigation"This might be the last place I'd dream to see content.

author: jancumps
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 09:48:37 pm
content: How do you project something that's darker than the background in the kitchen photo?

author: Corporate666
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 09:49:29 pm
content: It looks like a neat device and I think it would likely do well on Kickstarter.But to echo what was said above, one thing you must NEVER do is lie about your product. And by showing rendered/photoshopped pictures that show your product doing something it cannot do, you're lying about your product.That guarantees that customers will be disappointed, because there is a 100% chance they will be disappointed when they see that the reality doesn't match the claims. It also turns off people who understand that the claims you're making aren't real, because they realize you - as technical people - know you are making false claims, and this paints you in a bad light, because you are knowingly lying to your customers.It probably seems like I am overstating the point, but I don't think so. Making false claims about what your product is or can do is one of the most fundamental no-no's of marketing a product. You should never ever do that, ever.And following on that, I think you should get rid of all renders and photoshops until you have a finalized device. You're setting your customers up for disappointment at the moment, by ensuring what you deliver will be substantially inferior to what you are promising. You want to go the other way. Under promise and over deliver.

author: Corporate666
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 10:03:34 pm
content: Quote from: blueskull on November 06, 2016, 09:27:22 pmI bought an Acer K132 LED projector that I use for 3D scanning.It is substantially larger than the proposed device above. It is nowhere near as bright (based on the ambient brightness, projected image brightness and projected image size), and my Acer has an internal fan that runs at a pretty good clip to keep the LED's cool to achieve that brightness. It also cost $360.Add in substantial internal processing, a camera and more... and from a small startup who has nowhere near the economies of scale of Acer. I think it is a very risky proposition. I noticed they are taking orders (or pre-orders?). I am not sure if they are charging credit cards, but if they are actually processing charges, I hope they are very very clear about the rules on that - because every merchant agreement prohibits me from charging cards unless I can ship a tangible product within 30 days.

author: jancumps
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 10:08:26 pm
content: Quotethere's a link on the pre-order form that throws a 404 Not Found:http://www.umbo.us/terms

author: Cliff Matthews
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 10:13:43 pm
content: Besides the obvious PS-ing and no power cables on a power-hungry device..How do you propose to keep this thing cool while it competes with ambient light?

author: jancumps
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 10:22:10 pm
content: The OP should disable the page that takes the credit card info until he has a working terms and conditions link on it.The same for the privacy. A credit card page with an invalid privacy link. Come on.http://www.umbo.us/privacy

author: jancumps
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 10:41:10 pm
content: First time that we're asked for our address and credit card info by a fellow forum member, to pre-purchase something that can't work as depicted, under unknown sales terms, with unknown privacy rules.

author: sleemanj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 10:47:41 pm
content: Quote from: jancumpsThe OP should disable the site1. Magic anti-projector technology.2. Highly unlikely form factor for required light output.3. Specifications of "Optical Engine, Quad-Core Processor, WiFi & Bluetooth" - no mention of any actual specifications, the least of which would be what looks to be the very high resolution and lumen output for a very compact projector.if you are going to post your project to the EEVBlog forums, at least try to understand that this is a technical audience, we are not blinded by marketing nonsense.

author: ovnr
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 10:50:09 pm
content: Yeah, this sets off the scam detector pretty well.It'll probably do splendidly on KS though, because people are morons.

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 10:52:21 pm
content: It is also not clear what reviews and statistics we can offer at that generous $100 discount on a product that does not exist?

author: fsaezc
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 11:23:31 pm
content: Quote from: trophosphere on November 06, 2016, 08:26:05 pmThanks for the feedback! I'm glad you were able to understand the value prop within a couple of seconds.All the pictures you see will be actual videos of the user experience with the product running so it will be clearer in a few weeks.We're a little behind with the videos but hopefully they will make it even clearer.FAQ are being uploaded tomorrow! Sorry, we're like soft launching and gathering feedback.Re: contrast/brightness... the whole LUMEN talk is very special, as some projectors use different measuring types of LUMENS so overall you can hear anywhere from 50 to 1000 lumens but the human eye see the lumens differently... for this extent, our finalized MP product will have between 110 and 300 lumens, but to be clear, we will upload real product videos so you understand the contrast + the final specs of the optical engine. Thanks!!

author: fsaezc
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 11:25:38 pm
content: Quote from: jancumps on November 06, 2016, 09:48:37 pmHi Jancumps... as you can imagine, those are photo-realisitc renders. We'll be uploading the final photos with actual product working very soon.Take a look of the bedtime video, thats the working prototype. Thanks!

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 11:27:10 pm
content: Quote from: fsaezc on November 06, 2016, 11:25:38 pmI can't imagine that. That photo realism contradicts laws of physics.Quote from: fsaezc on November 06, 2016, 11:25:38 pmSo this thing does not work during the daytime?

author: fsaezc
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 11:30:04 pm
content: Quote from: Corporate666 on November 06, 2016, 09:49:29 pmThanks for the nice words.Have you ever seen Apple videos?... do you think those are the working product? Ha! Nope, they're renders.So I disagree with your comment.The main idea of launching a website with renders is to validate the value proposition, customers won't be disappointed with a render-page, they will be only if the product doesn't meet the value prop, which we're working extremely hard not to go on that route.Our product can do all what we're claiming. Want to swing by a try it? Ping me.We will change the renders on our next photo/video session, but guess what?... we've pre-sold over $10k in just few hours directly on our site... so we're actually validating the need for a device like this... and also, our orders are 100% refundablethanks for the feedback! After all... time will tel...

author: sleemanj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 11:33:35 pm
content: So what is your answer fsaezc when a customer says"hello, I put my umbo on my kitchen counter exactly like shown in your photo, and... I can not see any black, in fact, I can't see anything in daylight I have to close all my curtains and make the room dark"do you say "that was just a render, you did not think it was real did you!"

author: fsaezc
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 11:34:37 pm
content: Quote from: ataradov on November 06, 2016, 11:27:10 pmIt does, I'll ping you once we update the content of the site. thanks for your comments.

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 11:36:04 pm
content: Quote from: fsaezc on November 06, 2016, 11:30:04 pmApple has a proven track record of delivering a working product.Quote from: fsaezc on November 06, 2016, 11:30:04 pmThat's like 35 units. Obviously there are at least this many people with no ability for critical thinking. Things will change once people actually get the product and publish bad reviews. And they will be bad, just based on technical impossibility of claimed performance.

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 11:38:06 pm
content: Quote from: fsaezc on November 06, 2016, 11:34:37 pmJust show us a picture taken at a daytime. No need for professional photographers, simple phone camera picture will be enough.

author: fsaezc
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 11:38:25 pm
content: Quote from: Cliff Matthews on November 06, 2016, 10:13:43 pmHi Cliff, we'll be updating the media on the site shortly.This is a power-hungry device as you say, it doesn't use battery, it uses USB-C power connector.We hope to make these points clearer this week.thanks!

author: fsaezc
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 11:40:16 pm
content: Quote from: sleemanj on November 06, 2016, 11:33:35 pmWe're working so when this product is shipped, there is no way to get that question.

author: fsaezc
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 11:45:38 pm
content: Quote from: ataradov on November 06, 2016, 11:36:04 pmAlex, we could be discussing this for hours and hours...We're entrepreneurs trying to do something hard, but something non the less...You're giving us great points here but with a sad "glass half full" view... You'r comments are fuel to us so keep up the hater work!Either you're part of the solution or you're part of the problem...We'll take reasonable time to execute on our roadmap, invent new technologies and hopefully I'll come back and tell you "Alex! You were wrong! " So time will tell!Thanks for your feedback!

author: jancumps
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 11:49:38 pm
content: Quote from: fsaezc on November 06, 2016, 11:40:16 pmA bit late for the 10K$ that have already pre-ordered, right? Lucky for them, your terms&conditions apply.

author: Cliff Matthews
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 06, 2016, 11:58:17 pm
content: Quote from: fsaezc on November 06, 2016, 11:38:25 pmWith that puny lens, it'll need a roaring fan and 500 Lumens (or most customers will "batterize it" with a hammer)

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 01:27:50 am
content: On the team of 7 people why do you need a Chief Technology Officer if you have an EE ?

author: Dubbie
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 01:35:28 am
content: Just a pro-tip for you. In your compositing software set the layer to "add" mode to see what it will really look like. Or if you are using photoshop, use "screen" mode. This will give you a realistic simulation of what a projection will look like.Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

author: Delta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 02:00:35 am
content: Scam scam scam scam scam scam SCAM!Get thee onto Indegogo, you'll make a fortune!Then use the money to buy a physics book...

author: Corporate666
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 06:53:33 am
content: Quote from: fsaezc on November 06, 2016, 11:30:04 pmApple does not show their products doing things that they will not be able to do when they deliver them to the customer. To do so is fraud.QuoteI can't believe what you're saying. You're justifying lying to your customers so long as your device fulfills enough of it's promised capability to be useful - and you are making the determination about how much of that need you need to fill to have delivered on the promise. That is tantamount to a scam.QuoteIt can project dark scenes onto a bright wall?QuoteThe fact that orders are refundable doesn't matter. Have you actually checked what the terms of your credit card account state? Others mentioned in this thread that you didn't have a privacy page (but you seem to have quickly added one). You are not allowed to just take people's money and say "it's cool, we'll refund people", just like you aren't allowed to make false promises and say "it's cool, we're validating a concept".You guys are behaving like scammers.

author: rt
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 07:27:43 am
content: Quote from: fsaezc on November 06, 2016, 11:45:38 pmAn almost verbatim Ubeam quote.Either you have a working prototype and believable physics or this is a scam.

author: jancumps
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 08:20:01 am
content: The 'kick ass' part from the subject line turned into an ass kicking.

author: prasimix
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 09:56:21 am
content: A specific odor of psychopathic traits can be smelled in umbo's replies. That's give them a great chance to make another unforgettable campaign on the IGG or KS. If you think that is exaggerated take some time and read thisbook(it's free and open source!). It comes not from academics who is theorizing about psychopathy but guy who had a lot of opportunity to detect psychopathy and clean a mess caused by it.

author: Ontaelio
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 11:03:34 am
content: Well, Lenovo has a tablet called Yoga with in-built projector. Not being an IT journalist anymore I wasn't able to lay my hands on it, but people who did say it is surprizingly efficient. Not on par with normal projectors, sure, but enough to watch a TV show on a ceiling in a darkened room.Thus I'm even a bit interested in this device. I won't ever buy a tablet just to watch TV shows, nor will a buy a thingie that's projecting my phone screen on a wall, but if this device were capable of streaming video off a phone/notebook (or even better a memory card) and had a headphones jack... which it doesn't.... well, I would have at least thought about giving it a try.Really, really remove these offending images with darkened walls from your site. This is not marketing, this is an abuse to anyone with at least some ability to think.

author: Cliff Matthews
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 12:40:30 pm
content: Quote from: prasimix on November 07, 2016, 09:56:21 amI think some EE Enthusiast types have our own bent and as such, we overlook things you picked up on. I see it can be bought (if any still use paper here..) on Amazon and has some good reviews! It'll be a break from the datasheets, Thanks!https://www.amazon.com/Psychopath-Code-Cracking-Predators-Stalk/product-reviews/1514342022/ref=cm_cr_dp_see_all_summary

author: jancumps
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 12:59:01 pm
content: Pieter Hintjens was from Belgium. I know first hand that there's plenty of study material around here.(It's good to see his name mentioned - he passed away last month)

author: Morgoroth
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 01:53:29 pm
content: I start this thread and never think the project were beaten in this way, so is time to explain some details:We are aware of the luminosity limit and usability, obviously, there is no device that works at sunlight or really bright room and we don't pretend to lie about that, but our projector is quite powerful given the size and proved to handle well on artificial light and not direct spotlight over it. Sadly I can't share all the information right now given NDA signed with the manufacturer (the new projector will be released in Q2 next year), I think all understand that. Maybe for PM I could share more information if someone is really interested.One of the objectives to share the website was to polish it and I think we did it with all the comments.... even the bitter ones, and indeed the renders are just while we finish the prototype and test it as unit to take the pictures, we KNOW that the renders are not real/best approach and we don't want that, seems like I just don't insist in that enough.Now we have the device working over EVMs and ugly cables, just this Friday we received the integrated PCBs and sadly I had to go out f the country to renew my VISA (SF, CA) and I couldn't finish the integration and testing, so all is delayed a couple of weeks. Should be a startup visa kind.@prasimix: I just start reading the book and looks very good, thanks for share it.Other details I can share, the device use USB type C with PD, so we have up to 60W to play with it.The processor is Smartdragon 410E, but I'll try to go for the Snapdragon 800 if Qualcomm gives us a decent price for it.3GB of RAM.No need of headphones connector given the bluetooth 4.1 integrated to it.And please don't beat us for a mistake, all the comments are welcome, but calm down, that's why we are here, we want professional opinions to do it well.Best regards all,JP

author: StuUK
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 02:26:51 pm
content: I've got Deja Vu

author: prasimix
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 02:33:32 pm
content: The "main" problem with suggested book is that it can gives real psychopaths a new idea how to "polish" their strategies and to look more human when hunting for their (human) pray. Good luck.

author: free_electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 03:40:59 pm
content: Is the projector you are using still suffering from sparkling ? or has that been solved ?For the naysayers : this technology is perfectly possible. It is a called a laser picoprojector.http://www.st.com/en/imaging-and-photonics-solutions/pico-projection-video-processors.html?querycriteria=productId=SC1600i have seen this thing already in 2013 and it works really well.http://www.picoprojector-info.com/tags/companies/sthttp://www.kguttag.com/2015/06/21/lenovos-stmicro-based-prototype-laser-projector-part-1/http://www.chipworks.com/about-chipworks/overview/blog/stmicroelectronics-micromirrors-microvision-and-sony-bring-picoSony has had video camera's with such projectors in them for at least 2 years.

author: Cliff Matthews
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 03:59:40 pm
content: Ok, reasonable response to nay-sayers...So is this capable of running stand alone slides? (ie. In case the BT rmt. gets lost or dropped, and will have a uflash slot?)... and thank you to free_electron for the good links!

author: purfield
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 08:59:18 pm
content: I'll defer to more experienced engineers on the feasibility of this product, but as an average joe I can speak to the "value proposition" of the device. To me, this seems like something I would use once or twice, and then a few years later it would end up in a landfill. I see no need for it, and it strikes as little more than a cash grab. How many permutations of wifi/bluetooth connected ARM processors driving a display/sensor are we going to get? /rant

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 09:26:46 pm
content: Quote from: purfield on November 07, 2016, 08:59:18 pmYes, that as well.It is not clear how the gesture detection will work. If this thing is installed on my bedside table, and I'm in the bed, will it be able to detect my gestures? What type of gestures are supported?What about image distortion? I want this thing to sit in the corner of a room and project into the middle of the wall. Is this going to work? There does not seem to be any optics to speak of, so does this mean that correction is digital? Does it reduce usable resolution? What is the resolution in a first place?At the moment there is enough material for a scam IGG campaign, not much else.

author: timb
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 09:41:08 pm
content: Quote from: free_electron on November 07, 2016, 03:40:59 pmNobody said it wasn't possible... It could be done with TI's DLP micro mirror technology as well.The problem we're all bitching about is this: The "concept renderings" from the OP's website show an image containing black being projected on a wall in a bright room. That's physically impossible and very deceptive.Hopefully I don't have to explain what additive colors are, right?So, this isn't possible:

author: Morgoroth
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 10:12:41 pm
content: Quote from: ataradov on November 07, 2016, 09:26:46 pmWe are aware of the phenomena of obsolescence by only use (I just made that name, not sure is there is one for that), but I'm allowed to say that in the roadmap we have:1.- Open SDK for widgets developments.2.- Voice services.3.- Machine learning to adapt to users use.4.- Home automation integration.Plus, if you guys want to know, we are using TI technology and we checked laser and diode technology to get the best in the market at a decent entry price.And yes, we have a 500 Lumens device in the roadmap for the next year.The device is only the beginning, we want to integrate all the life of a person, something that goes with you all the time and is a help, that let you control the house by voice, while you go to the work, while check your agenda and watch the traffic to let you know how late you gonna be, whatever, a smart tech partner.Respect of the gesture control, the device have a camera and we are using OpenCV to recognise gestures, actually, we have very basic stuff working and part of the $$$ will go directly to make it works well.JP

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 10:30:21 pm
content: Quote from: Morgoroth on November 07, 2016, 10:12:41 pmThe phone does this with a very rich, fluid and reliable UI.Quote from: Morgoroth on November 07, 2016, 10:12:41 pmHow will that work if this thing sits on a bed side table? Or do I need to put another table in front of the bed?Where was the device located in that one non-bogus video?

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 11:05:21 pm
content: Quote from: Morgoroth on November 06, 2016, 02:55:06 pmWhen I go to your homepage, it shows nothing but uninteresting pictures which wastes my time trying to navigate to something meaningful. Seems this design shit (large sliders) has taken over web design and the fact that web pages are getting worse is driving me nuts along with the goal of never visiting the site again.If you want a meaningful page, inform the user with some info when they first see your page. Not four meaningless pictures in a slide show that shows no skill in making web pages. Get away from those damn sliders.Hope this was useful to you. (I still do not know what you are doing)

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 11:07:45 pm
content: Quote from: ez24 on November 07, 2016, 11:05:21 pmThat would imply that you have something meaningful to show. Most of those "startups" don't, and this one is no exception.

author: Morgoroth
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 11:08:00 pm
content: Is not the same, or at least is not what we want to do, we want much more, but is our fault not be able to share the idea properly and one more thing to do.The camera is at back of the device (very small hole), so the camera is looking to the user all the time while the images are at front of the user.JP

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 11:11:05 pm
content: Quote from: Morgoroth on November 07, 2016, 11:08:00 pmAgain, I'm having a really hard time placing this device anywhere in my apartment, where it will make sense.I don't know if your designers ever been to a real kitchen, but you can't place something like that in a middle of a counter. People actually cook in the kitchen, and it can get messy.Also, clean desks with nothing but a plant and a computer only exist in designers dreams. So now this gizmo will require me to not put anything in front of it on a desk, wasting valuable surface area.As for bedroom, I have no place in front of my bed, there is a gap and then the wall. This is typical for bedrooms, as far as I can see. So where would I put that? Do you have like a floor plan of a bedroom you are envisioning? How can I place this device, so it projects on a wall in front of my bed, but I still have control over it when in bed?

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 07, 2016, 11:22:53 pm
content: Quote from: ataradov on November 07, 2016, 11:11:05 pmA power cord is the last thing you want in the middle of that counter where you chop things with knife

author: Morgoroth
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: November 08, 2016, 12:10:58 am
content: Quote from: ez24 on November 07, 2016, 11:05:21 pmVery useful, thanks for pointing those things.JP

author: fsaezc
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: November 08, 2016, 12:32:45 am
content: Quote from: ez24 on November 07, 2016, 11:05:21 pmI bet you're a great engineer, but you must definitely not know about selling a product my friend.Selling a product doesn't start with the "what"... thats the engineering approach, that doesn't call to the emotion of the buyer, and buying is a process that uses a lot of emotions.That's why you start with imagery... you want to relate the customer to the user experience and "meaningless pictures" sounds very weird when we know that animage is worth a thousand words... right?Let me give you some exampleshttps://www.apple.com/https://nest.com/https://www.tesla.com/https://www.microsoft.com/microsoft-hololens/en-ushttp://www.sonos.com/en-us/homeI could go on for hours...Do you want me to pass along your feedback? I think they might not care.Thanks for your time anyways!

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 08, 2016, 12:38:47 am
content: Quote from: fsaezc on November 08, 2016, 12:32:45 amWhy did you put this stuff into engineering forum then? You may relate this way to mass market, not people actively participating here.So far I have only one emotion about this site and other sites like that - I'm being tricked and brainwashed by marketers.All the sites you showed are perfect examples of the same. And that's why I personally never go to a manufacturer site, it is useless most of the time. But in case of those products there are reliable places to get independent reviews, which would be the first to visit.I can't relate to a 3D render of a kitchen or a squeaky clean desk.

author: free_electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 08, 2016, 12:50:26 am
content: Quote from: ataradov on November 07, 2016, 09:26:46 pmimage distortion was already fixed in the mems device. they alter scan pattern.but themotion sensing is a problem.

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 08, 2016, 12:54:08 am
content: Quote from: free_electron on November 08, 2016, 12:50:26 amThis is awesome.Do you have a video of a working product based on the same technology? I'm behind the times on projector stuff, it would be nice to see the state of the art.

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 08, 2016, 01:54:21 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on November 08, 2016, 01:40:36 amWhat technology? We have no real information about the device. Even pictures of this thing in operation are apparently under NDA. Tech Specs section of the site is the most laughable one I've seen in years.Quote from: blueskull on November 08, 2016, 01:40:36 amHere is one - have a working product before you start marketing it. Then you can have actual reviewers look at your product and tell how it actually works, and not induce "good feelings" via marketing mumbo-jumbo BS.

author: ataradov
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 08, 2016, 02:04:27 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on November 08, 2016, 02:00:04 amSo what? Apple also has a core group that will buy any Apple product, however shitty it is. This company does not have this. And acting as someone is not a way to become someone.In may case, the best result for this is to be a tech demo before being sold to Amazon for integration with Echo. Provided it works at all.

author: edy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 08, 2016, 07:41:13 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on August 29, 1975, 06:33:56 pmThere is a fine line between embellishing a description of your products with language that highlights certain lifestyle and luxury, versus outright lying.For example, Apple uses emotional components in their marketing. They don't lie able the technical specs, but may bend the truth with certain benchmarks due to having ideal situations or software taking advantage of coprocessors.But if you market a product based on certain features, size and form factors, you'd better get something very close or exceed expectations otherwise that will be the last thing you'd company will sell. You will have a bunch of pissed off consumers making sure.If they can't show a final prototype even in a 3D printed enclosure, with even the most basic software running and projecting on various surfaces and provide real photo and video evidence, I would stay away. If they want people to buy this, that should be a minimal expectation. They are not Apple.

author: Corporate666
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 08, 2016, 08:47:37 am
content: Quote from: fsaezc on November 08, 2016, 12:32:45 amAnd you will notice that none of those companies show their product doing things that it cannot actually do. Imagine if Apple showed a 2mm thick iPhone with a transparent screen, then shipped the iPhone 7 as it is? People would go crazy. If Apple's response was "it provides the same user experience, we were just generating interest", that would never fly. It would be all over the news, and there would be investigations by attorney generals of all 50 states.I also wonder if you have done any focus groups or engaged with customers to determine actual market demand? Or is this a product that exists because it is technically possible to exist and because someone thinks it was cool to develop? I realize you will write this off as someone shitting on your product, but the more I look at the pictures on the website, the more I don't see the point. In all the pictures, I see a sort of mobile phone home-screen with calendar, appointments, weather and such projected on the wall. What is the value of that? Why is that superior to simply having it on my phone? I think it would be better to have it on my phone where it's personal and only I can see it. I have my phone in my pocket always... with your device, I have to go to the location of the Umbo - so now I am tied to that location.I have an Amazon Echo and several Dots. I think that interface is superior. Gesture interfaces are a pain in the ass. They never work that well, and they require too much engagement. For the type of information I want from such a device (news/schedule/weather), sound is superior, I think. I can tell my Echo to tell me the weather as I am walking around the house getting my stuff before going to work, and I am not tied to a screen or a location. I also am free to move about during that process.Do you not think Amazon did substantial research on the interface and data its customers were using/looking for before designing the Alexa? I am curious if you have done similar research or just feel this is a good product because it seems futuristic.It sort of reminds me of the computer screen built into a glass-top desk. It looks cool, people think it's neat, but I am not really sure there is any application for it.

author: Corporate666
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 08, 2016, 08:56:27 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on November 08, 2016, 01:40:36 amIt's simple in concept.You design and manufacture a product that has enough perceived value that people are willing to pay a price that lets you manufacture that product and earn enough of a profit to run your business. Then you sell the product, stand behind it, honor your agreements and treat your customers with respect, and you will grow through word of mouth and repeat business. Of course you need to keep innovating and improving your products, but it's really not hard.It is absolutely not true that you have to exaggerate your product or lie about your product. Of course you sell the positive aspects, but flat out lying (i.e. claiming your product can project darkness onto walls, or claiming it can project a bright image in an already brightly lit room if it cannot do that) is lying and you do not do that. Doing that just ensures that will have huge support costs as you deal with tons of phone calls from angry customers who want refunds, and it ensures you will never get repeat business. You will also pay higher rates for credit card processing as you will get a lot of chargebacks and most processors won't touch you unless you're doing huge volume.The vast, vast majority of companies started small and grew honestly and through hard work. When you start, you won't have as much money or connections or the customer base you will have as a larger company, so you have to put in a lot of time and effort to overcome that. That's just how business works. Yes, it's hard.You can try to shortcut it by scamming your customer base, but that's not a good idea and only shitty business people do that and they generally do not succeed because most venture capitalists won't touch them with a ten foot pole and they usually wind up scamming their business partners and ultimately themselves in the long run.

author: madires
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 08, 2016, 01:56:55 pm
content: I'd be careful with creating expectations which can't be fulfilled. These things will backfire, especially in the age of social media. As already pointed out, the picture of the kitchen application would give me the impression that UMBO works well in daylight. If I would buy an UMBO for that particular reason, I'd be quite disappointed when finding out that it doesn't, and also would tell others about this.UMBO might be some nice gadget to play with for a while, but I don't see any benefit it could provide to me.

author: free_electron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 08, 2016, 04:28:07 pm
content: Quote from: ataradov on November 08, 2016, 12:54:08 amThe ST device uses a MEMS micromirror. ( single mirror )Trapezoidial distortion is simple to compensate ( simply reduce the horizontal scan range as you progress. )the demo device i saw had a menu where you simply set a slider. this compensated for angled projection. it was a manual process.many projectors have this.

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 08, 2016, 05:46:57 pm
content: Projectors also have lens systems, dont they

author: casinada
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 19, 2016, 07:33:47 am
content: http://www.banggood.com/DOOGEE-P1-DLP-Andriod-4_4-WIFI-Wireless-1080P-Portable-LED-Projector-HD-Home-Cinema-Beamer-US-Plug-p-1054645.html?rmmds=search