Oscilloscope recommendation  - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / beginners

author: CAG
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 03, 2024, 06:59:52 pm
content: Hey all, new user, not proficient with the search function, apologies in advance.I'm an automotive mechanic by trade. I have recently been tasked with dealing with all the more complex electrical diag work at the shop. I have limited experience with an oscilloscope. I know only the bear bones basics. Time to get one for myself, mostly for work but I'm also interested in some hobby electronics stuff and audio signal analysis. The pico scopes are popular in my trade but the price and need for a laptop turn me off. I hoping to stay under $800 or so. Looking hard at the rigol 800 and 900 4ch scopes. Looking for opinions from anyone in a similar situation. Based on my understanding the rigol has more than enough bandwidth and voltage limits for automotive testing. The 900 peaks my interest mostly due to double the memory. Some of the tests I will be doing will not require very fast sample rate but would be helpful to be able to record a signal for a longer time. Is it possible to dial down sample rate and increase recorded signal time on the rigol? Is there a formula so I can work out how long I can record/view at a given sample rate? Does this question even make sense? Lastly should I be looking at a different scope altogether? A better option? Thanks!

author: tatel
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 03, 2024, 10:30:45 pm
content: https://www.micsig.com/SATO/

author: CAG
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 03, 2024, 10:49:52 pm
content: Thanks for the recommendation. I mostly passed over the micsig. I couldn't find reviews on Amazon and the site seemed disorganized, showing different looking models in some pictures and stats that didn't Mach up to stats listed in other places on the same page. I'll look further into it as the portability would be a plus. Do you have experience with this scope?

author: DimitriP
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 03, 2024, 11:09:15 pm
content: QuoteIt sounds like "they" are "making you buy your own" scope.It's slightly location dependent but from what I hear it's easier for a tech to find a shop, than it is for a shop to find a tech.So I'm tempted to recommend the scope and laptop the shop will pay for.

author: CAG
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 03, 2024, 11:22:23 pm
content: True. Good take. I have wanted my own scope for a long time. I'm thinking about opening up my own shop in the nearish future. Adding a scope to my tool set now will help with that. You have a very good point though.

author: tatel
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 04, 2024, 01:20:25 am
content: Quote from: CAG on May 03, 2024, 10:49:52 pmAbsolutely not. The most advanced electronic thing my trusty, very old Citroen Berlingo has, are probably the relays for the signal lights. And I want it that way. Actually, I'm looking for another Berlingo of that vintage. I also have a more modern Citroen C5 with an ECU and all that electronic stuff. If one wants to, say, change the radio, one has to pay Citroen for the software. So, in some way, that car isn't mine, but it's still Citroen's. Vendor software lock. Meh.But on occasion, say, to check some sensor in another car, I use a really dirty cheap Zeeweii DSO154Pro.https://aliexpress.com/item/1005006504569477.htmlI'm not joking, that Zeeweii "toy" is able to do the same things than the tools many guys in this forum, had to use to learn some decades ago. They had to pay dearly then, but now these capabilities can be had for less than 40 bucks, shipped.I have a 4-channel digital oscilloscope, but the Zeeweii did make easier to understand the basics of oscilloscopes. Since you are wondering if halving the sample rate would allow for a longer capture, obviously you have to learn the basics. You should buy the "18 MHz" model, it has more bandwidth because it comes with a battery... and a real oscilloscope probe. After some learning, you will be able to make a much better decision.Here's a thread about that "toy". You'll find there what guys having 500-to-3000-bucks oscilloscopes have to say about that "toy".https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/new-toy()-scope-dso154pro-1ch-claimed-40mss/Since you made clear you need the oscilloscope for automotive work, and you didn't mention MicSig at all, who offers automotive oscilloscopes, I just linked that website for you to check.Here you have a thread about MicSig o'scopeshttps://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/the-attempt-of-a-micsig-(as)to11xx-general-purpose-thread-)/You could also look for "automotive oscilloscope" on Youtube. I bet you'll get many results, then you could ask here about them. One more recommendation, put the word "automotive" in the subject

author: CAG
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 04, 2024, 03:23:52 am
content: Thank you for the link. I did originally start this search with a Google inquiry about automotive scopes. The only scope I have used was a snapon branded older (2006) scope. The automated features it had for automotive testing were frustrating more than helpful for me. I really just wanted a couple knobs for time and amplitude and that simple stuff was buried in the software. It really wanted to autoscale everything. Anyway I was thinking of getting a more general purpose scope this time. I read the thread you provided and will do the youtube rabit hole tomorrow. Thanks again!

author: tatel
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 04, 2024, 11:10:43 pm
content: I did a quick google search about automotive oscilloscope videos. This guy does interesting things:https://www.youtube.com/@MechanicMindsetHe's using different devices ranging from a DSO138 to a picoscope 2024A. Unable to find any videos about automotive grade picoscope or micsig oscilloscopes. He doesn't seem to need any special automotive feature.With a very very high probability, DSO 138 is really the cheapest toyscope in the world. Here's the video:Recommedation is for picoscope 2024A, I could get it right now for €138 from mamazon . It's a 10-MHz oscilloscope. Here's the video:Another channel, video about a "Secret $150 portable Automotive Oscilloscope Labscope". That oscilloscope has a "FNIRSI" branding on it. FNIRSI oscilloscopes are nothing to write home about. But, hey, if 10 Mhz are enough and signals are above 0.5 V, then even my zeeweii dso154 will serve me well. I would like to have CAN decoding on it however. The video:If youtubers are using those devices, it doesn't seem that neither broad bandwidth, huge memory, nor high sensitivity, are essential. Cheap grade oscilloscopes are already useful. Then, an automotive grade oscilloscope, either from picoscope or micsig, will probably look and behave like a jet fighter in comparison. I bet that would be a kind of pro badge, like using a fluke DMM. The guy in the video speaks about a 1000 pounds price for one of these automotive grade picoscopes? I guess you'd be able to find a similar-capabilities micsig in that range. I would contact a seller and ask about it, if no good info is found on the Net.IIRC, there was a thread about a guy using an automotive micsig, that had problems about a BNC connector getting loose from mechanic action. So you could be looking for models with recessed or somehow protected BNC connectors.I would be wondering about pro automotive grade or not, and about laptop needed or not.In your price range I could get from micsig.es either:SATO2002 for €650+VAT, touchscreen+knobs, 2 channels, 200 MHz, 1 GSa/s, 70 Mpts memory, decodes CAN.VATO2004, €500+VAT, picoscope-like, can be connected to and android tablet/phone, 4 channels, 200 MHz, 1 Gsa/s, 50 Mpts memory, decodes CAN Edit: that spec seems a little too much? I would say 100 Mhz for 1 Gsa/s and 4 channels?.Anyway, compared to a 1-2-channels devices boasting 10 MHz, 4Kpts memory, these are jet fighters. I'm sure picoscope will have something similar.Then I would open a new thread about the candidate, mentioning automotive use.

author: bdunham7
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2024, 12:28:48 am
content: Quote from: CAG on May 03, 2024, 06:59:52 pmTwo questions for you:1. Can you give 3 to 5 specific examples of how you would use an oscilloscope on an car or truck? By specific, I mean make/model/year and exactly what the issue is and how you would use the scope to test.2. Are you an IATN member?If both answers are simply "no", then I'd recommend you buy some cheap piece of junk that you can learn with. You don't need exceptional performance for automotive work but the mains-powered lunchbox style scopes you are considering would lead a rough life in an shop. Battery power, handheld and reasonably durable are pretty standard requirements. The Picoscope 2204A would be my beginners recommendation in most cases and having the laptop attached is a huge advantage IMO, but apparently you disagree. If you had trouble using a Modis (which is what I presume you were referring to) then you have some work to do. Just getting a signal on the screen is only the first step of effectively using a scope in your field.

author: Zenith
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2024, 11:19:19 am
content: I've never seriously looked into it but I've had the impression that oscilloscopes used in automotive work didn't need any advanced features or high bandwidth. They have have a hard life so need to be very robust or disposable. Battery power to avoid the need for power leads would be desirable. Are there special protocol decoding features that are needed or anything like that?There must be loads of handheld scopes for $50 to $100 or so that fit the bill.I certainly don't believe a $800 Rigol or Siglent would be necessary or desirable. If you want to buy one for other reasons, then great , but keep it away from automotive work.

author: CaptDon
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2024, 01:13:48 pm
content: As a locomotive electronics technician / troubleshooter / design engineer here is my take. First off, locomotives have most of the same CANBUS stuff that is used on cars and made by the same companies that make the car stuff. Diesels don't have spark ignition, but dual-fuel engines can. I never liked Pico Scopes with laptops BUT I can tell you that by far they are the most useful and versatile devices for auto / locomotive use!! First advantage, they run from USB power from the laptop. Second, the laptop can be located perhaps 25 feet from the scope via USB cable. Third, with proper settings the scope can capture waveforms lasting as long as the memory storage of the scope (you could track a crank sensor for hours and set the triggering to capture abnomalities). A final thought is that the waveforms can be saved as .CSV which would allow many forms of diagnostic statistics to be parsed with programs like MATLAB or the freeware version SCILAB. When troubleshooting circuit boards themselves we have very sophisticated scopes in the $250K price range. Those seldom go out in the field. But you could find an electronics engineer / QA/QC technician out there on a locomotive with a laptop and picoscope EVERY day!!!

author: xavier60
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2024, 01:50:16 pm
content: This might seem like a trivial point. Notice that with just about all screen shots of DSO displays, the trigger reference position is at the middle.For single shot use where as much as possible of the waveform needs to be captured after the trigger event, the trigger reference needs to be placed near to the left side of the display. Most budget DSOs don't have a proper setting for this. I have been led to believe that some Siglent models do.I still use a 25 year old HP 54645A which doesn't have this or any other annoyance.

author: BillyO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2024, 02:26:09 pm
content: Quote from: xavier60 on May 05, 2024, 01:50:16 pmWhich models are you thinking of? All the ones I have seen can do this, right down to the little $40 Zeeweii 154Pro. Not that I'm suggesting this is a viable option as a professional tool, but it can do what you say.Hantek make automotive specific USB scope kits. These are actually far nicer than their stand alone efforts.

author: xavier60
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2024, 02:33:10 pm
content: Quote from: BillyO on May 05, 2024, 02:26:09 pmI cant recall at the moment, it was a few years ago. With my HP DSO, it's a "Left, Middle, Right" setting.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2024, 02:39:32 pm
content: Quote from: xavier60 on May 05, 2024, 01:50:16 pmI don't know what you mean by "budget", but my two cheap scopes can do that without any problems.

author: pdenisowski
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2024, 04:37:51 pm
content: I have this book and it is really excellent:https://www.amazon.com/Automotive-Oscilloscopes-Waveform-Graham-Stoakes/dp/0992949262I also would agree the most automotive testing does not require a particularly powerful / expensive oscilloscope, especially if protocol analysis (CAN / LIN) is not involved.

author: xavier60
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2024, 11:07:34 pm
content: Quote from: xavier60 on May 05, 2024, 02:33:10 pmAllegedly, Siglent X-E models,https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/oscilloscope-confusion/msg1984631/#msg1984631

author: BillyO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2024, 11:14:16 pm
content: Quote from: xavier60 on May 05, 2024, 11:07:34 pmI think you might be reading that post incorrectly. Every Siglent scope I have, including an X-E model, allows you to move the trigger point where you like and it will not change with change of time base. It also has the feature (just like my other two Siglent scopes) to allow you to put it back to the center with a single button push.Maybe you are thinking of the much lower end SDS1052DL.

author: xavier60
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 05, 2024, 11:54:19 pm
content: Below, explains the relationship of trigger-point and time-reference-point on my HP.Many DSOs don't have the option of moving the time-reference-point, certain Siglent models being the exception although I don't fully understand how the function operates. I did ask for a demonstration, but my request wasn't important enough to them."At the top and bottom of thegraticule is a solid triangle ( ▼ ) symbol and an open triangle ( ∇ )symbol. The ▼ symbol indicates the trigger point and it moves withthe Delay knob. The ∇ symbol indicates the time reference point. Ifthe time reference softkey is set to left, the ∇ is located one graticulein from the left side of the display. If the time reference softkey is setto center, the ∇ is located at the center of the display. The delaynumber tells you how far the reference point ∇ is located from thetrigger point ▼."EDIT: I'm happy to add that the Rigol DHO800 series, possibly others, have this useful feature."Horizontal Expansion ReferenceThis function allows you to set the position that the waveform on the display isreferenced to when it is horizontally expanded or compressed when the horizontaltime base is adjusted. In the Horizontal menu, click or tap the Expand drop-downbutton to select the reference position. Available options include Center (default),Left, Right, Trigger, and User."

author: bdunham7
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 06, 2024, 12:25:04 am
content: Quote from: xavier60 on May 05, 2024, 11:54:19 pmI can't think of a single DSO that doesn't have this capability one way or another. It is a combination of horizontal position plus trigger delay in those cases where you can move it completely off the screen. Whether the visible position of the trigger point changes with the timebase is a configurable option in some cases or a fixed feature in others.

author: tatel
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 06, 2024, 02:31:21 am
content: Quote from: Zenith on May 05, 2024, 11:19:19 amYep. I would like to see some comments about CAN decoding and one of two channels. It looks that CAN signal is a differential one? I guess one just need to look if the signal is OK, and that it would be easier and cleaner to use OBD to see the decoded messages.I also guess that, while inconvenient, a one-channel device would be enough to look at both halves of the signal, even it only one at the time. After the videos, it looks quite easy to see if there's a 5V signal or is instead showing "flats"Edit: however it looks evident that having two channels is really handy.

author: aliarifat794
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2024, 08:30:50 am
content: Here is a long thread about the Rigol 800 scope. You can check this out.https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/rigols-new-dho800-oscilloscope-unbox-teardown/500/

author: pdenisowski
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2024, 10:41:49 am
content: Quote from: tatel on May 06, 2024, 02:31:21 amYes, CAN is differential, but some oscilloscopes support decoding CAN by looking at only one "half" of the signal (CAN_H or CAN_L).Not quite sure what's meant here by "ODB" - do you mean ODBII? Most modern cars have an OBDII connector near the driver position and attaching a breakout box to this connector makes it much easier to connect an oscilloscope for decoding or monitoring.

author: tatel
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2024, 01:31:08 pm
content: Quote from: pdenisowski on May 08, 2024, 10:41:49 amYeah, I mean OBDII - I guess that means OBD-2?. I think it will be easier to read CAN messages utilizing OBD than decoding the stream with an oscilloscope. In that case, probably I wouldn't care about the oscilloscope being able to decode it. Then, if only 1-channel device is available, looking first at one of the halves of CAN signal, then at the other, would be close to good enough to check if CAN signal looks rightSo, a so dirty cheap device would be quite useful, but being able to look simultaneously at compression/ignition, etc, comes handy. So it's clear to me two channels would be a good thing to have. Wondering about good examples about four channels coming handy, I guess there will be some.

author: rstofer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2024, 01:54:40 pm
content: Quote from: tatel on May 08, 2024, 01:31:08 pmSPI bus uses 4 signals: CS', SCK, MISO and MOSI. Probably not important for automotive...

author: pdenisowski
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2024, 02:01:56 pm
content: Quote from: tatel on May 08, 2024, 01:31:08 pmOne example that immediately comes to mind is power efficiency measurements: you would need to measure voltage and current on both the input and the output, so 4 channels would be needed.

author: pdenisowski
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2024, 02:04:59 pm
content: Quote from: tatel on May 08, 2024, 01:31:08 pmTo "properly" look at CAN, you would want to use a differential probe, and this would only consume a single scope channel. If you look at the picture I posted above, you will see that only one of the four scope channels is being used to decode CAN. You would only need two probes if you suspected an issue with the differential signaling itself (i.e. a physical layer, not a protocol layer issue).But again, it's often sufficient to simply probe CAN_H or CAN_L with a "normal" single-ended probe.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2024, 03:02:35 pm
content: Quote from: pdenisowski on May 08, 2024, 02:04:59 pmThe cheap DSO2000 has an option to decode CAN.I don't understand anything about it and the associated trigger options look very complicated to me.I don't think it makes sense to use this to decode OBDII.I can imagine that in practice this is only useful in a very limited problem area and only with a very good understanding of the protocol.Perhaps this is mainly intended for educational purposes.

author: pdenisowski
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2024, 03:38:11 pm
content: Quote from: Aldo22 on May 08, 2024, 03:02:35 pmYes, just being able to decode CAN frames isn't that useful unless you know quite a bit about CAN.The cheap handheld OBDII-connectable analysis tools (there's one in the picture above) are amuchmore user-friendly way of getting practical, useful data from a CAN bus if you're just trying to repair or troubleshoot a car.

author: tatel
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2024, 01:26:56 am
content: Quote from: pdenisowski on May 08, 2024, 02:01:56 pmYou are right, of course. My bad: I should have said "good examples about four channels coming handyfor automotive work" So far it's clear to me that, for automotive work, CAN decoding isn't strictly necessary; and that, while 1-channel oscilloscope is enough to do most of the tasks, there's at least one case when having a 2-channel oscilloscope comes handy. Then I was wondering about a case where more than 2 channels would be "needed". Since there are 4-channels automotive oscilloscopes for sale, one would think there's a motive for that.

author: BillyO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2024, 01:32:11 am
content: Quote from: tatel on May 09, 2024, 01:26:56 amWhile I'm not an auto tech, I have seen many automotive oscilloscopes that have 8 channels. Like this from Hantek:https://www.hantek.com/products/detail/13170I think Pico have them too. Others too.Must be a reason for it.

author: themadhippy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2024, 02:03:54 am
content: Quoteyou'd have thought one of the more expensive manufacturers would do a v12 scope

author: CAG
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2024, 02:45:37 am
content: Tons of good information, thank you! I'm continuing to research and try to educate myself before making a purchase. It seems to me the scopes advertised as automotive scopes are overpriced for the performance specs. I think you end up paying for some automated presets and simplified menus. Tools like that have always bothered me. I'm better off struggling through the learning curve with a more full featured tool. One that makes me set all the adjustments and understand what's going on. I had access to a snap on branded scope for several years. I used it successfully to do some diag work here and there. It was so heavily focused on presets and auto ranging with any custom settings buried is several layers of bs menus. Now even with that experience I'm not sure of what kind of specs I really need. I'm looking forward to having a scope with a few knobs and buttons so I can't start twisting and learning. I'm convinced I can cut my budget in half after reading all the posts here and learning some more. $400 to $475. I think that will get me something that feels like a jet fighter compared to that snapon unit. I'm really stuck on the rigol units. Trying to keep an open mind for sure but the form factor and Dave's review of the 800 series is stuck in my head. I know it's a bench scope but still very portable if need be. Mounting options are plenty. I'm still struggling to understand the relationship between bandwidth, waveforms per sec, rise time, and deep memory. Some specs seem redundant. Wouldn't sample rate mainly dictate how much resolution you could see on a given waveform? Also dictate the bandwidth the scope could be useful for? Also dictate how fast a rise time you could measure? But they are all separate specs. I'm missing something I'm sure of it. The hunt for knowledge continues! Thanks for all the advice and suggestions.

author: CAG
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2024, 03:29:59 am
content: I can defiantly name 5+ times in recent memory where a scope would have been useful. i know exactly what i would have measured and how i would have set it up. what im not sure of are the mistakes i would have made along the way and what the results would have been. All the cars im thinking of did get fixed and customers are happy. I do think the scope could have prevented a couple comebacks and saved some time though. I have attended several classes that went over testing methods and setups using scopes but i really am better off struggling a bit with something new, maybe even failing in frustration and letting that drive me to learn what i have done wrong. i never forget lessons learned that way. I have a quality dmm, a power probe, an amp clamp.... stuff like that. Im not totally new to electrickery but its an area i need to build more skills in for sure.

author: CAG
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2024, 03:32:26 am
content: Quote from: bdunham7 on May 05, 2024, 12:28:48 am1. yes2. no, seems like google searching IATN now would be cheating...

author: CAG
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2024, 03:34:31 am
content: looking hard at the 800. thank you for link.

author: CAG
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2024, 03:42:35 am
content: I think you might be right. I dont see anyone else using a bench scope in an automotive environment. Im thinking of buying a rigol more in the 450 dollar range and trying it out. it wouldnt be the first time i have worked "outside the box" and been happy with the results. if im wrong ill take it home and mess with it there. i am interested in electronics repair on a small hobby type scale. im not rich by any means but at the 400 ish price range im ok with a little gamble. i think ill get my money out of it one way or another.

author: CAG
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2024, 03:51:23 am
content: 2 ch is minimum for me. i do know that much. the scope i was using for awhile was 2 ch and fairly often i wanted at least one more. there was always a work around but it cost more time and effort.

author: CAG
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2024, 03:57:32 am
content: As i scroll to the end here it has come to my attention that I am not using the quote and reply options effectively. its getting messy. dang.

author: bdunham7
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2024, 04:02:08 am
content: Quote from: CAG on May 10, 2024, 03:29:59 amI started using scopes in the automotive field over 30 years ago when the idea of using them for anything other than ignition was fairly uncommon. My first scope that wasn't on a cart was a Fluke 98, which I still have today. The first case that I remember where it saved me from a major headache is when I was given an an older Chrysler New Yorker (318 V8) for a tuneup and carb adjust/overhaul as needed. The complaint was hard start and rough run when cold. It was the cranking compression test that showed 3 bad valves that very quickly convinced the service manager to revise the work order. If I had just said "I think it has a mechanical problem because it sounds uneven when cranking" I probably would have been told to just do the requested work first. The Fluke 98 has a reasonably good array of special features that were very helpful in those days. OBD data has improved, ECUs are smarter and I actually think there is less occasion to use a scope these days. Setting up those specific tests can be done with a generic DSO but you'd really have to understand what you are doing.If you get a regular scope as you indicate, how would you use it on a road test? One of the most useful features of a scope with a recording feature is to solve the "what fails first" problem when dealing with intermittent issues. Perhaps I don't know the specific issues that you encounter so that's why I asked.QuoteSample rate will set an upper limit on bandwidth, but BW can be (and usually is) less than this limit due to analog circuit design and marketing. BW and rise time are correlated but not always in a simple way. Both are essentially irrelevant to your application. The Fluke 98 has 20MSa/s and 5MHz BW. Anything more than that is "enough".I asked before -- are you a member of iATN? If not, I'd recommend you have a look.I see you answered 'no'. That's the wrong answer! Given what your goals are--immediate and future--it would be insane to ignore that valuable resource. It's unfortunate that the waveform library isn't in the free section (it was all free two decades ago...) but you can get additional answers--and probably more relevant--to your questions in the forums.

author: BillyO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2024, 04:06:39 am
content: Quote from: CAG on May 10, 2024, 03:57:32 amJust a suggestion, but if you use "quote" rather than "reply" we might better know who you are responding to.

author: pdenisowski
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2024, 09:23:02 am
content: Quote from: bdunham7 on May 10, 2024, 04:02:08 amAgree completely. Graham Stoakes' book "Automotive Oscilloscopes: Waveform Analysis" (mentioned in an earlier post) is an interesting read as well.Quote from: bdunham7 on May 10, 2024, 04:02:08 amAside from powering a "normal" scope from an inverter, there are also battery powered scopes with recording / data logging features, e.g. our RTH series handheld oscilloscope. But I do wonder if the probe connections might be a challenge during a road test (?)

author: bdunham7
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2024, 03:28:00 pm
content: Quote from: pdenisowski on May 10, 2024, 09:23:02 amThe Fluke 98 and 98-II automotive-specific scopes were configured a bit differently from the rest and one big difference was that the scope is designed to almost exclusively use 1:1 connections. The inputs not only tolerate 300V+, they can actually respond to and display those amplitudes. This turns a probing problem into a simple wiring problem and they included a good assortment of connection methods in the original packages.

author: tatel
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2024, 04:32:12 pm
content: Since you are willing to struggle and learn with a non-automotive oscilloscope, perhaps it would be wise to get first a cheap 2 channel device.After that, you'll probably be able to decide by yourself which jet fighter is the one right for you.Of course I could be wise to buy that Picoscope, or perhaps the FNIRSI, or another device in the 130 bucks range, that could probably be put on sale when you are ready to upgrade. However there are even cheaper model that could quite probably do what you needThere's a quite useful thread about cheap portable oscilloscopes, so you could compare:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/portable-oscilloscopes-list/msg5194335/#msg5194335

author: aliarifat794
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2024, 10:50:10 am
content: Owon oscilloscopes are good.

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2024, 02:38:56 pm
content: Quote from: pdenisowski on May 10, 2024, 09:23:02 amBy the way, is it safe to use inverters to power oscilloscopes?I have generally had bad experiences with "modified sine wave" inverters, but I now have a "pure sine wave" inverter.However, I have never dared to use it with an oscilloscope.Are there any problems to be expected?The output of the inverter looks like in the attachment (On a fnirsi dso-tc2). Should be OK, right?

author: Aldo22
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 12, 2024, 09:35:31 am
content: I am answering my own question.Yes, it works. I can't see any excessive noise at first glance.This could be useful in certain situations, especially if you already have the inverter and a 12 volt battery.

author: perumethu@gmail.com
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: March 15, 2025, 03:46:49 am
content: Quote from: CAG on May 03, 2024, 06:59:52 pm

author: BillyO
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 15, 2025, 03:50:56 am
content: Quote from: perumethu@gmail.com on March 15, 2025, 03:46:49 amWell, that's all sorts of wrong.