FLIR MS / PS / LS series scopes - anyone know of any modifications? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 04, 2016, 09:27:00 am
content: I have just added a FLIR MS-224 thermal spotting scope to my collectionIt is faulty and will need some TLC, but that is what attracted me to it. It is a project and was very cheapFLIR produced at least three types of these spotting scopes, the MS Marine Scope, the PS personal scope and and the LS Law-enforcement scope. I believe all share the same hardware but have slightly differing firmware to suit the intended market.Does anyone know of any investigations into releasing the full resolution of the microbolometer in these units please ? I believe the PS24 and PS34 use the same microbolometer so this looks like another FLIR configuration constraint. From what I understand though, theses scopes use the USB socket for charging but FLIR have not opened the port for PC connectivity. That will be a priority for me if I am to 'hack' it. I am assuming firmware updating is done via this port so maybe there is a button sequence to activate the firmware loader and USB connectivity ?I would also be interested to hear from anyone who has opened the casing as mine is waterproof so any fixings may be hidden.I will X-Ray the unit and post a teardown on this forum as I have yet to see such anywhere on the Internet. Considering this unit is circa 2011 I would have expected more experimentation with it and even disassembly pictures.The scope arrives this week so expect another post on it soonFraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 04, 2016, 09:56:58 am
content: Pictures of the three types of FLIR Scope. Each 'tuned' to the needs of the intended use.MS - 'First Mate' marine version for spotting other vessels and people in the water etc.PS - Personal version for trekking, SAR and hunting etc.LS - Law enforcement version for security, human tracking and searching.Each type has subtle palette mode differences. i.e The MS has White Hot, Black hot and RED hot (to aid night vision retention), whereas the PS has White hot, Black hot and hottest object alert (with the object highlighted in red). From what I have discovered so far, an MS can be changed to a PS by making an 'internal' change (not specified).FRaser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 04, 2016, 10:23:56 am
content: I forgot to mention. The MS-224 has a resolution of 240 x 180 (weird) and the MS-324 has a resolution of 320 x 240. Hence why I suspect configuration shenanigans like in the E4Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 04, 2016, 10:45:55 am
content: Yay, I just found something interesting relating to firmware uploads and USB daa access on these units:https://flir.app.box.com/s/s9hqyuesr945k0bjhqemThe developer has made it possible to access the camera via USB and change firmware settings .... Hmmm sounds promisingMore about the firmware manipulation here:https://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=6&f=18&t=393820Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 04, 2016, 10:56:08 am
content: A-Ha, its a FLIR utility !FLIR released it to permit minor changes to configuration and also firmware upgrades.http://support.flir.com/SwDownload/app/RssSWDownload.aspx?ID=181Still interesting thoughFraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 04, 2016, 11:38:30 am
content: More interesting revelations......Having read the FLIR 'End User' configuration manual I have been reminded of something I read several years ago. The FLIR MS/PS/LS scopes use a standard Tau thermal camera core and will respond to the Tau control softwareFLIR also used a nice large 19mm lens in the unit. I have read that it is Germanium, but I will need to check that for myself as this scope range seems too cheap to use such expensive lens material.Oooooh I could have some fun with this if I can get it running againFraser

author: sam1275
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 02, 2016, 05:58:03 pm
content: No reply? Good post!I also love those unusual toys, I have a Bullard and a MSA 4000 in my collection, both are 320X240 fast rate, and both are firefighter series, so they are rugged and have very huge FOV(near 60 degrees), the bullard is BST sensor and the MSA is VOX sensor, the MSA is even faster than bullard(maybe 60Hz?), and the VOX picture have more gray-detail than BST, but it need shutter to calibrate which may interrupt the video, however the BST use a continues chopper, and the picture have a black contour around hot(white) things...So will you be able to hack a scout 160 or 240 to 320? I think 640 is not the same hardware so I didn't expect that.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 02, 2016, 09:20:12 pm
content: Hi Sam1275,I was not surprised to not receive any replies to this Post. It was just to see if anyone else had played with these scopes. I have done a teardown and repair thread here as well. The unit is now fully working in a replacement case and with a PS32 SCOUT II controller PCB and upgraded VGA viewfinderThe scopes come in 2 resolutions 240 x 180 and 320 x 240. Hacking of the TAU is what people think needs to be done to get a 240 x 180 camera up to 320 x 240 resolution. There is no need to hack the actual TAU core.Fraser

author: Hard_ware
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: September 05, 2016, 06:02:34 pm
content: Nice tear down, units are popular in the US.

author: cejoba
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 10, 2022, 12:59:50 pm
content: Has the resolution been hacked yet?It seems to be down-sampled, instead of windowed(from spec sheet). But I don't see any related option in TAU GUI.What resolution will the core direct output without the Scout's additional circuit?

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 10, 2022, 01:27:37 pm
content: Since first commenting on the Various resolutions of FLIR scope, it is now clear to me that the TAU core may be configured to present various resolutions below its native pixel geometry. Sadly I have not seen any discussion of how this resolution reduction is accomplished or how it may be changed to release the full native resolution. I have a TAU 160 that is configured to produce only 80 x 60 pixels. There will likely be a configuration file in the TAU that controls the output resolution, but sadly I have no information on that or how it may be accessed.Fraser

author: cejoba
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 10, 2022, 03:19:41 pm
content: Thank you Fraser.So is there any way to identify the real resolution without guessing from the image? Like serial number or TTL communication?

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 10, 2022, 03:48:20 pm
content: The Tau series comes in Standard physical resolutions of 160 x 120, 320 x 240, 336 x 256 and 640 x 512. FLIR advised me that they do not make other resolutions so lower resolutions will be scaled down from a higher native resolution. The TAU160 was deleted from the range some time ago and I believe the TAU336 has replaced the TAU320. The newer TAU2 offers improved Imaging performance.Whatever the stated resolution of a camera that uses a TAU or TAU2 core, the true active resolution of the core will be one of the above, normally the closest higher resolution. The TAU models are named TAU160, TAU320, TAU336 and TAU640. The FLIR part number on the outer casing will usually track back to a certain model and lens combination.The TAU GUI will show the model number of the core as programmed by FLIR but this may well be related to the host cameras chosen configuration, rather than the cores native resolution.Fraser

author: cejoba
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2022, 08:12:14 am
content: Quote from: Fraser on October 10, 2022, 03:48:20 pmThank you for reply, but sorry you may not understand my meaning...I mean a certain method to know the output resolution, not the native physical one.(Since there's currently no method to unlock a downsampled full FPA, output is what we cares.)BTW, from the datasheets, TAU2 160 is downsampled 320, I don't know if the 240 Scout use the same method.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 11, 2022, 09:40:54 am
content: I have TAU320 cores and the reduced resolution version from the MS224. I’ll take a look at them and see if the GUI can tell me the difference in resolution. I am a bit busy today but will look at this when I have some spare time to connect the TAU’s to a PC.Fraser