How to get my senior citz. parents TV without cable? 255$ month cable bill! - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Beamin
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 29, 2021, 09:16:05 pm
content: I'm sure some of you here have this delema: your parents are older, not technically inclined and have an outrageous cable TV bill for a handful of shows news, and movies they watch.They have a nice TV but its not a smart TV. Hooking the computer up to the TV through the HDMI port is not an option, they like their remote control and while they do own a laptop and ipad they use it for basic stuff and I cant really see them doing a remote monitor setup just past their level of tech. So what would you guys do?I was thinking they keep just either comcast internet only or fios internet only. Right now they have TV/Internet and with two leased boxes and fees and BS they are paying 255$ for what little they watch. I was thinking go aerial for their local/news stations but they tend to watch CNN. Unlike me where I just have youtube premium and internet only they like live TV for the News and football.So is there a solution/box they can connect to their wifi that includes a remote and to the HDMI port of the TV that essentially acts as thier cable box and they can stream? If it was me and I watched TV I would be using a raspberrypi/wireless touchpad/keyboard as the remote) as the cable box with a bunch of paid streaming services (netflix,HBO, Discovery+, hulu= 40$/mo.)but is too technical for them unless someone has come up with a specific remote and OS (great product to market BTW) but I cant find anything simple. They are willing to pay they just dont need to pay thousands per year just for TV. Whats a simple pay per month subscription/ solution that works with the HDMI port? What did you install in your parents house?

author: geggi1
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 29, 2021, 09:27:57 pm
content: There are some TV-settop boxes that are hackable. You can probably set this up to stream Tv stations over internet.

author: alpher
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 29, 2021, 09:43:48 pm
content: Genip.tv plus a settop box or even rasp. pi 4 running libreelec (that's what I did in exact same situation).

author: rsjsouza
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 29, 2021, 10:21:32 pm
content: Having moved from cable to the zoo that is the internet TV markeplace, I find the interface of the cable set top box to be light years ahead in terms of ease of use and performance - the various applets and internet TV gizmos have a wide variability in UI and performance.In terms of cost, we gave up on quite a few shows/channels to limit the monthly fees incurred in signing up to the various applets available (Disney this, Paramount that, something-something channel other thing, and so on) - otherwise, the monthly difference would be close to zero.All this to say that, in my opinion, leave the sleeping dogs lie. Otherwise there is a chance you will see yourself being their technical support or user's manual (that was my experience with my tech-unsavvy mom after my ultra tech-savvy dad passed away).

author: BrokenYugo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 29, 2021, 11:20:38 pm
content: Roku?

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 29, 2021, 11:55:01 pm
content: With the caveat that I watch very little broadcast TV, when there was a network TV show that I really wanted to watch rather than pay them for access when I would probably be only using it for one show, I decided to get a TV dongle to test the waters.That made it so I knew what channel were there. I am stll working on antennas, but what I did was this, I got a Silicon Dust IPTV tuner connect to it via my lan. Then you can put your broadcast TV tuner in an attic with perhaps one, perhaps several TV antennas.I got an old used one on ebay for around $25If your channels come from different directions, get a two tuner device and two directional antennas. Right now from the edge of the largest concentration of people in the US, I probably get around 45-50 channels. I can get the major networks. It doesnt include a VDR and that would make it much more complicated for your parents (or me) When I was a kid, getting old analog TV, much better signal strength, we probably got around the same number.., so I figure I am doing well. Before with no fancy antennas, I only got a very few channels. Its taken me much more work and knowledge and better antennas to do this, though.You can find listings of the broadcast TV channels for any given location, see if the signals come from multiple directions, and if they are strong or weak. That info will determine what kind of setup will work the best.

author: Caliaxy
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 29, 2021, 11:58:05 pm
content: Amazon TV? Apple TV? They might miss some of the live TV news, though.

author: rhodges
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2021, 12:11:23 am
content: Quote from: BrokenYugo on March 29, 2021, 11:20:38 pmI was about to mention that. For $29, you can have streaming video over wifi. There are a lot of free offerings and a lot of free oldie TV series. They might really enjoy watching those classic TV shows again. Once you set up a Roku account (free), you can see all the free and subscription options. Some of them have a free trial period, and you can cancel before the first payment date. We did this with CBS, and watched the series of "Picard" (good show, in my opinion), then cancelled without spending a cent. We paid for a month of Disney+ and after watching everything worth watching, cancelled just as easily. I just added Peacock ("NBC"), and found that some shows are free, but some are not. Oh, well, they won't get a penny from us, but maybe they think we will watch their ads on the free shows.

author: Ed.Kloonk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2021, 12:44:37 am
content: The best thing you can do for your parents is to try and wean them off watching the TV altogether. I mean, really, is it healthy for them anyway?Buy them season disks of old TV shows and a DVD player.

author: Ed.Kloonk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2021, 12:51:09 am
content: I know you said a PC connected to the TV ain't an option but I can report a bit of success with a PC with a Logitech wireless keyboard/mouse. I occasionally SSH in and drop a few videos onto the Linux desktop. Tell the parent to move the mouse, click, press F for full screen and walla.YMMV.edit: forgot to mention most important thing. PC set to reboot at 3am every night.

author: Beamin
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2021, 03:43:23 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on March 30, 2021, 01:18:46 amComcast in MD USA for two boxes movie channels and sports channels.So a roku box then add services? I remember seeing an add "Live TV for half the price of cable for live sports news local" this sounds perfect but cant remember what it was, it was a TV commercial I saw while in hospital. Think it came with a box and remote that connected to your wifi and hdmi.

author: retiredcaps
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2021, 04:03:33 am
content: Quote from: Beamin on March 29, 2021, 09:16:05 pmHoly. I live in Canada and we supposedly pay the most out of the "developed" nations for our services, but $255 sounds ridiculous.Another option instead of changing up their entire setup and having to be technical support for them because they are used to a simple remote control, I suggest1) take a look at their bill and maybe share what they have here (minus all the personal info of course). They may be buying packages that they don't need or watch. They may be paying for equipment rental on a monthly basis where buying their own would be cheaper. For example, if they are paying $15 for wifi modem rental/month, it's cheaper to buy one and get rid of the rental.2) look at different providers in the area. Even if they aren't willing to switch, a phone call to Comcast saying the bill is too high and that competitor ABC offers the same or better at $150 USD might get Comcast to drop their price a bit. That's what I do with success.3) see if Comcast will lower price if they sign up for a 2 or 3 year plan. In my area, services can be cheaper if you sign up for 2 to 3 years vs month to month.

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2021, 04:38:32 am
content: See if Amazon Fire Stick will do it. Out of the box it comes with a lot of films and shows, then you can buy sports packages from your ISP or other providers to add to the stick. Comes with a remote but does need a HDMI input on the TV.

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2021, 05:30:35 am
content: you can take a little filter off the pole, it is a notch filter with a color band in it, i think crackheads stole it to make a pipe or something

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2021, 07:41:51 am
content: There are dozens of different streaming devices out there, almost any blu-ray player these days will have it built in, and almost all TVs do now too although I highly recommend not using the "smart" part built into a TV. The question is, can you get the content they want to watch from one or more streaming services? That's going to depend on the content. Personally I have not had cable in ~20 years and wouldn't want it if it was free. I'm 100% streaming and have my own server I've transferred my collection of discs to.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2021, 02:07:13 pm
content: They give a slight ($5) discount if you include your firstborn child in your offer. (joke)Quote from: retiredcaps on March 30, 2021, 04:03:33 am

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2021, 02:12:54 pm
content: TV broadcasting is still free. Networks like CBS, NBC, ABC, etc, are broadcast over the air waves. (remember them) 100% free.Now I am starting to go grey so I am kind of old school, but I remember, when I was younger, television was completely free. No this is not a conspiracy theory.Quote from: rhodges on March 30, 2021, 12:11:23 amHere in the US the switch to digital TV was such a scam and it must have cost us all trillions upon trillions of dollars.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2021, 05:34:53 pm
content: Quote from: cdev on March 30, 2021, 02:12:54 pmIMO they should have switched cable to digital and left the analog broadcasts in place, I suppose they couldn't have predicted the streaming revolution though. I think very few people today are even aware that it's possible to receive HD over the air, and it is of very little value. At least it isn't as scammy as "HD Radio", what a joke that is, proprietary and closed, almost nobody uses it, the only place it ever gained any traction at all is car radios. Analog radio is superior in almost every way.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 30, 2021, 05:56:30 pm
content: Quote from: Beamin on March 29, 2021, 09:16:05 pmBefore jumping to any conclusions and throw in lots of different hardware I'd first sort out what kind of subscription they have and bring that back to normal proportions. Likely they are subscribed to many channels they don't need. Maybe they are even paying multiple subscriptions.Also remember that in the end it is their decission to pay so much of their hard earned money to watch TV.

author: pardo-bsso
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 12:23:19 pm
content: Buy the premium package and share it with the neighbours to split the bill?

author: SilverSolder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 01:29:16 pm
content: Do they really need two boxes? (doesn't that pretty much double the bill?)Use one box, and find a way to control it from any room.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 02:41:26 pm
content: if they caught somebody doing that here in the US they would probably go nuts. Make an example out of them!If they still had a Devil's Island they would get sent there.Stealing cable service is on the books here as a serious crime. (which is kind of ridiculous given the nature of much of what's on.)I actually watch almost no TV. Sometimes its useful for local news. They used to have public access cable TV which was fun.Quote from: pardo-bsso on March 31, 2021, 12:23:19 pmRight now the only TV I have thats officially a TV is broken and needs repair. Its likely the capacitor problem, its been like that for a year. Need to pick a supplier and buy a bunch of caps and recap the thing.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 02:55:23 pm
content: The whole point of doing all it was to get the bandwidth to use for more cellular services, which they hope, involves embedding communications in many everyday objects, so they can monetize every aspect of them with value added services. You'll likely have no choice. Its not that they are running out of space, they want more on principle, because they can. Its a one way spectrum grab that cant be reversed. They don't really need more spectrum in fact they need less. One digital TV channel can be five or more TV channels. Nor is the porgramming that much better or more worthy of your business. And on the new system they are putting in there is a two way data path. Your telescreen will communicate to the server upstream ( for what?? So they arguably should be paying you for all that info they plan to collect and sell. ) also, there will be a hypertext web like aspect to the new ATSC, Ive read. . Now, empowered with ownership of all sorts of new data, you can bet that they will scarf up as much digital property, as they can get away with. They want all your dataso they can sell it. Its officially their property now. They are collecting so much data and storing it but they still don't have the capacity to work with that big data the way they want. They dont even know what it is they will capture, all they know is that bthey want it, not the other guy. Info on the comments people make, info on who is watching the stuff they serve and when. They need the massive computers that can handle it all. Which don't exist in the quantity they need yet. They want your health data to protect you from pandemics if you are coughing, for example. (or seem to be coughing) Who wouldn't want safety from pandemic illnesses that"ARE KILLING SO MANY PEOPLE?"T will be like Home Shopping Network where they endlessly advertise alarm/surveillance systems.. that spay on people and everybody whyo visits them, uploading the data to Amazon and Google..and soon, I am sure also Facebok and Apple, hey wont be left out.. Of course THEY want you to buy more stuff. We'll be like that parrot who learned how to order stuff from Alexa..Quote from: james_s on March 30, 2021, 05:34:53 pmIt's signal travels too far and so less market for cable. Same thing with analog TV. it doesn't allow them to segment the markets by income as easily;. Also, its too easy to understand for normal people.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 03:42:32 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on March 30, 2021, 05:34:53 pmHere in the US its all about the upsell.. They want digital copy protection too. No "analog hole"Europe has DVB-T and better digital radio which is mostly free and popular. They are talking about getting rid of analog-FM too.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 04:12:54 pm
content: The best option is probably to call Comcast and threaten to cancel and switch to something else. And be ready to follow through in case they’re dumb and not willing to come down a lot. But they likely will. You never get a good deal by being a loyal customer to a telecom company. You do the best by switching and availing yourself of new customer promos and the special deals the retention departments can offer when you threaten to leave.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 04:57:10 pm
content: They build the mistakes and overbillings they do into their software. I learned that years ago when my then girlfriend worked as part of an education overseas program for a while (she was in the former USSR, not long after the transition) suddenly the telephone provider started making a bunch of billing mistakes, all in their favor. This was before it was easy to use the Internet. There were only a few Internet providers then there and their service was funky at best.you can bet I complained because the telecom firm was overbilling me quite a bit. I figured out that they must have thought I was Russian because who else would call there so often..(She had a lot of interesting stories to tell as you might imagine!) Firms that provide telecom services are basically utilities and they have you over a barrel. Often they have near monopolies which makes them eager to milk the situation for all they can. And they do.Unfortunately they also have international agreements that prevent governments from setting up alternatives of any kind..Quote from: tooki on March 31, 2021, 04:12:54 pm

author: SilverSolder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 06:50:59 pm
content: I recently called my cable company to complain that my bill is too high compared to the prevailing market nowadays, and that I intended to switch to a competing provider.Magically, they were able to halve my bill!

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 07:55:24 pm
content: Quote from: cdev on March 30, 2021, 02:12:54 pmIt isn't. Look up the ad revenues and (maybe) tax money that goes into making / distributing TV programs. You basically pay a TV advertisement tax on top of each and every product you buy. Heck even government information distributed through TV ads isn't for free so there goes your tax money. If you add it all up you'll see you pay a couple of hundred dollars a year!

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 09:22:17 pm
content: Quote from: pardo-bsso on March 31, 2021, 12:23:19 pmThat's a serious crime, get caught and you can get massive fines or even a prison sentence for it. Seems extreme to me, but it is what it is.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 09:24:35 pm
content: Quote from: cdev on March 31, 2021, 03:42:32 pmTheir worry over the "analog hole" is totally ridiculous. Absolutely nobody is recording an analog video signal onto VHS or even digitizing it. HDCP was cracked wide open long ago, it's trivial to record a perfect digital copy of anything that can be displayed on a TV.

author: rdl
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 10:05:04 pm
content: Comcast will increase your price every year. It used to be around $10-15 but a few years back AT&T ran fiber through this area and the annual Comcast price hike has dropped to about $5. You can call and gripe to Comcast to get a reduced price but they make it an immense pain in the ass to do so. My rate has more than doubled in the last 10 years. I'm way overdue for calling to get a better price - mainly because I was thinking to switch to the AT&T service, but then Covid-19 happened.

author: SilverSolder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 10:39:26 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on March 31, 2021, 09:22:17 pmIt's what you get when industry lobbyists write the laws?

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: March 31, 2021, 11:23:57 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on March 31, 2021, 09:24:35 pmMedia companies are about 20 years behind. It is only since a few years that you can buy MP3 without any kind of copyright protection. If they started doing that in the late 90's they would have killed off websites like Napster and Piratebay a long time ago just due to ease of use. It will probably be a while until you can simply download TV series from Netflix, Amazon, etc for reasonable prices.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 12:40:30 am
content: Quote from: nctnico on March 31, 2021, 11:23:57 pmYes it was one of the blunders of the century, waging a futile war against digital downloadable media and insisting on cumbersome DRM technologies that resulted in the pirated content being more convenient and easier to use on top of being free. Had they embraced the 99c DRM-free digital downloads in the first place it would have taken the world by storm and they would have raked in millions as people buy all kinds of songs. 99c is well below the impulse purchase threshold for all but the most poor/frugal people, it's not even worth the trouble to pirate if you can just buy the songs you want for that price. Instead of embracing it though they fought tooth and nail to stamp it out, accomplishing nothing other than alienating large numbers of potential paying customers by refusing to sell them what they wanted, while rampant piracy thrived. By the time they finally came around, the piracy culture had a lot of momentum and after the extortion tactics (pay us thousands of dollars or go to court and risk owing hundreds of thousands) against the public, they earned very little sympathy. A former coworker had to pay $5,000 because it some content owner claimed his young daughter downloaded a few songs, whether it was her or her friend or completely bogus he didn't know, and he was not particularly fluent in English or familiar with the US legal system so he paid up, the alternative was the risk of being ordered to pay vastly more.

author: rsjsouza
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 01:30:22 am
content: Although the battle was fought for several years and at a certain point it was really clear it was futile (beginning of 2000s), you have to account for the fact that, for most of the century, they had an entire industry behind it: the disc press, artowrk and insert printing, box fabrication, distribution, etc. You don't turn this off wth a flick of a switch.Also, the online marketing and distribution was still early and it was not universal by any means: lots of people distrusted internet transactions and, at least in Brasil, prices per song were disproportionally higher.Despite MP3 format was king, the portable players were still raging a war pulling each to their standard - AAC, WMA, etc.

author: SilverSolder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 01:35:43 am
content: Funnily enough, vinyl records seem to be making a comeback, after all this... the youngsters all want record players and records now, it seems!

author: rsjsouza
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 11:44:08 am
content: Quote from: SilverSolder on April 01, 2021, 01:35:43 amThat is quite interesting due to the massive technological advance of the optical media, but not unheard. From time to time, nostalgia sets in a newer generation and creates these markets.For some of us that had no choice but listen to our favourite song in a record scratched by accident, the aversion is more understandable.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 02:23:02 pm
content: For an explanation of one argument for a revival of analog recordings, see here.http://www.anstendig.org/mainpage.htmQuote from: rsjsouza on April 01, 2021, 11:44:08 am

author: SilverSolder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 03:07:18 pm
content: Quote from: rsjsouza on April 01, 2021, 11:44:08 amThe social aspect of sitting down with friends, looking at album artwork and playing records while getting pleasantly intoxicated, is hard to recreate digitally!

author: DrG
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 03:45:56 pm
content: I know that I am entering the thread late, but I wanted to toss my two cents in anyways. I know that “seniors” are all individuals and what I am saying below does not apply to each one, but I have seen this repeatedly. Also, budgets are individual.+1 on work with the cable company to lower the bill. If you have more than one cable company to choose from, you can get a target price and, yes, you need to be ready to change, but you probably will not have to do so and even if you do, they are all about the same. Cable TV companies as anything more than internet providers are on the way out IMO. I have successfully done “battle” with Cable TV for more than two decades. They raise the bill, I call to get it lowered – repeat every 6-12 months. I have had so many “special promotions”, it is a joke. I recently had a promotion that they said expired because it involved equipment that they no longer supported (but were still renting to me). The only reason I ever rented anything was to get some promotion that got rid of the $35 bill raise…..it goes on and on. I am always successful and it is always a battle and sometimes creates odd situations, but so far, I have prevailed.-1 on any non-cable solution at this point and here is why… In my experience, many seniors do not want to learn new TV crap and it has nothing to do with not being technically inclined. I have seen this over and over again…accomplished professionals…years into retirement…they are frustrated with having to learn this ‘new’ technology because they have spent a lifetime where learning also means understanding. IOW they do not have the intuitive, “play with the app until you find that setting” that the 15 year old has. The difference is that the younger one has never known anything else. The seniors know what TV is to them and that it what they want – that is the place for TV in their lives.When I have tried to teach some folks how to do something on a computer or cable TV or whatever, it can be painful. They want to know the exact steps and they want to write them down and they want those steps to be understandable and to work next week and next year. After all, they grew up with only a few channels on the TV and likely remember when UHF channels were added. They remember actual TV shows that came on at the same time, each week, until summer reruns.They don’t need 4K or even 1080 because that is not, necessarily, their idea of TV. I try to appreciate where they are coming from and respect it as both their choice and moreover, a rational choice. The inclination is to get them to do all sorts of new things that are better – but they are not ‘better’ for them.Of course there are exceptions. I have one relative…I set up his first phone many years ago (and subsequently others)…started to explain all of these other things – voicemail boxes, phone number lists, one button dialing, ring tones all that crap. He stopped me. He only wanted to know how to turn it on/off and dial a number – nothing else. To this day, I do not believe he has ever answered that phone (or that it has ever rung). To him, it is a portable phone booth and that is exactly how he wants it to be.On the other hand, I once showed him how he could read newspapers from all over the world online. He liked that and he learned how to do that and he does it all the time – one of the few things he does online. If I want to send him a picture, I either send him hard copy prints or I email it to his daughter to be shown to him because he has no interest in email (again, if needed, he will have is wife or daughter do it for him). I accept that and I don’t try to change him unless he requests something specifically. That’s what I mean by respect.So, I say, let them have their TV as close as you can get to how they want TV, regardless of what else they can get that is cheaper or “better”….and if you are paying for it, more power to you!

author: SilverSolder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 05:36:39 pm
content: I notice in myself, as I get older, I really hate having to re-learn something I think I already know how to do.Turning on a TV and tuning in a channel just isn't something that should be complicated or require several Houston-level remote controls controlling multiple boxes to do... that is just bad engineering.Another example: driving a car with too many controls to do a simple job is a real chore - I don't appreciate any of the benefits of a touch screen entertainment center in a car where I can't even find the button to turn the bl**dy thing on without pulling over and investigating the dashboard carefully and learn the "secret codes" just to listen to some music or news... WTF is up with that? - sheer incompetence.Nobody has tried swapping the brake and gas pedals yet, but you can be sure that if it wasn't because that is such an obviously bad idea that even a complete idiot can see how that is bound to fail, somebody would have tried it! It plays out on only slightly less obvious levels every day.None of the above means I won't put in the effort if there is something to be gained - like using a fitness tracker, or a cell phone, or a PC, or whatever.So, the main thing that happens to you as you get older seems to be: you learn not to expend time and energy on poorly conceived and/or badly executed products!

author: rsjsouza
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 06:22:16 pm
content: Quote from: cdev on April 01, 2021, 02:23:02 pmQuote from: SilverSolder on April 01, 2021, 03:07:18 pmNo question about the overall experience surrounded by friends and the crapiness that some of the most heavy handed digital re-mixing and re-mastering did to previous records, but the practical aspects are extremely unfavourable as well especially when listening on crappy 3-in-1 belt-driven systems or with bargain-store bought stylus.

author: SilverSolder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 06:32:31 pm
content: Quote from: rsjsouza on April 01, 2021, 06:22:16 pmSure, but the girls never seemed to mind!

author: Beamin
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 07:27:05 pm
content: Quote from: cdev on March 31, 2021, 03:42:32 pmI use analog fm radio 24/7 would miss it. Almost went to digital but found alot of BS with a proprietary box and subscription fee , I just want classical commercial free background music while I sleep. Nothing fancy just some noise so the thoughts in my head dont drive me insane, im not paying for that either thats why its a not for profit station i contribute to once a year.So look for a roku box or fire stick? Idealy it would be some sort of streaming interface with wifi on one end HDMI and a remote on the other. Then they buy a cable modem/router and take back the leased 14$/mo equipment. Thats what I did and lowered my internet bill 20%. Leasing the box used to cost 3$ a month now its 14$! WTF in 10 years. I bought a TPLink5ghz wifi/modem off amazon for 70 bucks shipped that pays for itself in months. That gets their base internet to 40$ a month then another40$ for netflix discovery+ HBO and another package. 80$ TV/internet bill with no slow as hell stupid cable box that costs 12$ a month to rent because its hidef. EVERYTHING is hidef how can they still charge extra? A coat hanger into the coax is high def now. Charge extra

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 08:34:22 pm
content: Quote from: SilverSolder on April 01, 2021, 05:36:39 pmThis is a huge pet peeve of mine, there are so many new things I want to learn that I hate having to re-learn old stuff just because someone decided to make changes for the sake of changes so that something would be "new" and "fresh". My dad had a late model Tesla and there was hardly a physical switch in that car, absolutely everything was controlled by a giant touchscreen, I hated it. Even regular cars have gone in that direction, "clean" dash layouts that have just a few buttons to navigate multifunction displays. One of the things I love most about my car is that there are rows of physical switches, buttons, knobs and sliders. I know every one of them by feel and can operate everything without taking my eyes off the road. I really hate the obsession with "clean" interfaces, which just means create extra work by hiding everything under layers. It's like the idiotic parametric search on Digikey that makes you click a button EVERY TIME in order to access the parameters you need EVERY TIME. I encounter that same thing more and more elsewhere too. If it's something I use frequently, I want it all laid out logically in front of me, it isn't clutter, it's tools that I use.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 10:00:08 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on April 01, 2021, 08:34:22 pmI get the feeling much of it is feature creep thats intended to reduce the amount of time before you buy another one, without being too obvious about it.

author: pardo-bsso
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 01, 2021, 10:29:11 pm
content: Quote from: SilverSolder on April 01, 2021, 05:36:39 pmRamen to that.I remember as a child having to stand up and turn a wheel that made a very satisfying 'clunk' noise to change the channel.Now the tv takes about three seconds to do that.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2021, 02:48:10 am
content: The thing that really made analog TV superior for me is that you could flip the channel and it was virtually instantaneous. Now digital TVs all take several seconds to lock and start decoding the stream and that just feels like an eternity. Not that it really matters anyway, the logos ("DOG"s) annoy me too much to watch.

author: SilverSolder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2021, 03:36:33 am
content: It is almost like we've gone full circle, having to wait for tubes to warm up before we can use the equipment!

author: rsjsouza
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 02, 2021, 10:13:12 pm
content: We did come full circle. Any solid state analog TV at power on shows an image faster than the latest models of a digital one. Shameful, really.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2021, 01:37:14 am
content: Quote from: rsjsouza on April 02, 2021, 10:13:12 pmSome (not so) "smart" ones, perhaps. Last year, my dad got a 27" Acer for working from home and that takes about a second to show the image. It was a modern version of what used to be called "HD ready" displays, no capability to play stuff on its own, just a Displayport input and a HDMI input.Not sure why so many smart TVs take forever to boot, they're pretty much very large tablets and a few milliwatts to keep the RAM contents is no big deal.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2021, 04:12:37 am
content: I hate the whole concept of a "smart" TV, integrate something with a 2-4 year life cycle into something that should have a 15-25 year life cycle, it makes no sense at all. On top of that, a lot of them now show ads in the menus! The whole reason it's so hard to find a non-smart TV is that the smart ones are subsidized by advertising and data harvesting. I just want a monitor with a bunch of HDMI inputs.

author: duckduck
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2021, 04:45:47 am
content: Quote from: james_s on April 03, 2021, 04:12:37 amAgree 100%. They sell "dumb" TVs for commercial use, like in videoconference rooms and to display the menu up on the wall behind the cash registers at the local fast-food restaurant. Warning: the doctors that perform lobotomies on smart TVs drive very nice cars. When you see the price for one of these "dumb" TVs you will make that sound that you make when you jump into an ice bath. I used to chat with the AV guys at my work, commercial TVs/monitors are what they all buy for themselves. I plan on investing in one when my pre-smart-TV-age Sony dies.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2021, 07:10:21 pm
content: There are a number of giant “computer displays” that probably can be pressed into service as a dumb TV, and don’t necessarily cost an arm and a leg.

author: tooki
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2021, 07:13:38 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on April 03, 2021, 04:12:37 amI find it incredible that they now have built in image fingerprinting that monitors the displayed image and identifies what’s being watched, basically the same way Shazam and SoundHound can identify a song via a 3 second recording through a phone microphone. Unfuckingbelievable that that crap is allowed. Even in places (like the EU) where that requires affirmative consent, they sneak it into the EULA consent on setup so people innocently agree to it. Scummy as all hell.

author: BrokenYugo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2021, 08:33:39 pm
content: Just buy the cheaper smart TV and block it's MAC in your router?Or have we already reached full cyberpunk dystopia where will it get pissy and not act as a monitor without a connection?

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 08, 2021, 04:57:22 am
content: So far anyway, every one that I've seen you can just not connect it to your wifi. Seems like I read somewhere that a majority of smart TVs never gets connected.

author: bson
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 08, 2021, 06:57:28 am
content: I don't think my Cable bill was ever much over $100, but I didn't have any premium sports packages, but did have Showtime and HBO. I had a DVR in the living room and a dumb unit in the bedroom. I switched to Sling on a Roku maybe 6-7 years ago, then to Youtube TV on the Roku, and currently YTV with Apple TV 4K. The ATV4K is mainly for other apps and services though that weren't available on Roku (such as Zwift). I rotate between Netflix, HBO Max (though I get that free with my AT&T mobile service), Disney+, and CBS All Access. Apple TV+ (their VOD service; it doesn't have live TV at all) has nothing I'm interested in, so I don't watch it though I currently have it for free for a year with the ATV4K. (I also get HBO Max free with my AT&T phone service, and one more year of Apple TV+ came with my iPhone.)

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 17, 2021, 01:23:46 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on April 08, 2021, 04:57:22 amThats what people think..They may look for a local big cable company AP (not yours) and connect anyway, via that. As long as the TV is plugged in/has power.And soon with 5G that will be everywhere and it provides enough power to power a small micro and transceiver. This allows devices to phone home without any network or user intervention at all. Unless you gave your entire home an aluminum foil hat so to speak.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 17, 2021, 01:30:21 pm
content: Smart TV is dumb, IMHO.I wouldn't ever buy one. They should pay you.They may have to register themselves via DHCP or similar with their mother ship, so to speak. Maybe establish a VPN tunnel to upload their proprietary data.That is a money stream for the company that sells it. Probably lowers the price of the hardware somewhat.ATSC version 2 I think is two way. Wonder what happens if you dont connect it to the net? Does it use radio?Quote from: NiHaoMike on April 03, 2021, 01:37:14 am

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 17, 2021, 04:21:10 pm
content: Quote from: cdev on April 17, 2021, 01:23:46 pmWould be interesting to hack one of those smart TVs to flood the telemetry with junk or even better hijack its connection for your own use.

author: james_s
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 17, 2021, 05:41:46 pm
content: Quote from: NiHaoMike on April 17, 2021, 04:21:10 pmThat could end up being a crime, you'd want to carefully check the laws to make sure you won't get charged with perpetrating a DOS attack or something.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 17, 2021, 07:22:35 pm
content: Quote from: james_s on April 17, 2021, 05:41:46 pmIf it's not connected to your own network, it won't be connected to your IP address. If you really want to be safe, buy the TV secondhand with cash and do the work from some place other than home. There's also an element of plausible deniability in that you were triggering the telemetry repeatedly when it's supposed to be offline so you can figure out where it's storing that information if it does. (Most likely it doesn't try to connect to neighboring wireless networks, that itself can be illegal in some areas especially if those networks are encrypted.)

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 18, 2021, 08:48:04 pm
content: Quote from: NiHaoMike on April 17, 2021, 07:22:35 pmIf you buy it second hand, you can pretend it came pre-hacked and you have no idea why it's doing it.

author: Ed.Kloonk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 18, 2021, 09:17:12 pm
content: Quote from: Zero999 on April 18, 2021, 08:48:04 pmIt doesn't always have to be second hand to contain malicious behavior.

author: rsjsouza
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 18, 2021, 11:00:14 pm
content: Quote from: Ed.Kloonk on April 18, 2021, 09:17:12 pmAnd here I was, thinking this was the actual behaviour of most of the new "smart" appliances...

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 20, 2021, 02:01:39 am
content: For a long time Ive been reading about how new wireless technology will enable a new generation of devices which can run off the power they collect from RF in a typical metro area's electrosmog, as its called.There are lots of designs for wearable computing devices that embed antennas that harvest RF to produce (tiny amounts of ) DC, by rectification. Could be fed into a buck-boost converter to produce voltage high enough to charge a battery and produce a much stronger (but very brief) signal. If its synchronized via GPS to be timed very accurately the signal could carry any kind of generic data, (for example, tracking pets like cats that maintain multiple "owners" in order to maximize their incomes. ) and brief high power blits could travel very far.