Rigol DS1054Z new unit check out testing - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2015, 01:40:05 am
content: HiI ordered a Rigol DS1054Z yesterday and was wondering if there is a way I can burn it in or test it when I get it?I have a Wavetek 145 but I do not know if it works so I do not want to use it.I have a DMMCHECK Plus that has some sort of square wave output but I am not sure what to do.Is there a way I can do a self test on the four channels without using any external equipment? If not I will use the DMMCHECK Plus.Edit : will arrive next Tuesday (6 days from now), also change some words in the title - took out "burn in"thanks

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 07, 2015, 02:29:27 am
content: Use the probe compensation test points.

author: Electro Fan
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2015, 03:51:55 am
content: You have lots of possibilities. (But there shouldn't be anything to "burn-in" and very likely there shouldn't be anything to burn out.)Like Lightages said you can start by doing the probe compensation; that's a very good place to start.You can use your DMMCheck Plus with the scope. Connect the probe to the V+ and the probe ground to the V-. You will be able to read the 5V (I think Vrms) on your scope when in the AC mode. In the DC mode will see 5V DC on the scope. I think you have to turn the DMMCheck on and off in order to switch between AC and DC.You can also check frequencies with the DMMCheck. When you power up in the AC mode I think you will see 60 Hz. If you go back to DC you will get another frequency (not sure what yours is set for, maybe 20 kHz?)You could do all of the above on all 4 channels. It will help you learn the some of the basic controls (Vertical, Horizontal, Trigger, etc.)You might find that the DMMCheck and your scope are roughly in agreement but maybe not exactly. I wouldn't stress over it too much - you can do that later but first you should get comfortable with the fundamental operations of the scope to make sure you have eliminated user error before worrying about your gear or the last decimal place.After you get the DMMCheck run through it's paces you can move on to your Wavetek.Use the function out - it is 50 ohms. Be sure your Rigol is set for 50 ohms (I don't know if the 1054Z is automatically set or can be manually set to 50 ohms; on older DS2072 models the scope only had 1 Mohm inputs so you would need a 50 ohm feed through terminator). Make sure you know if you are using 50 ohms or 1 Mohm - it will influence your measurements. Assuming you are set for 50 ohms the Wavetek and Rigol should be in "agreement", but nothing bad will happen even if you are set at 1 Mohm on the scope. You can use that nice big dial on the Wavetek to change frequencies from 0 to 20 MHz. On DC you will get a horizontal line. With the attenuation knob I think you will see your line go up and down as you change the voltage. (I'm just looking at a picture of the 145, I haven't used one; you might have to learn to convert between dB settings on the sig gen and voltage measurements on the scope). Next, you can move to the sine wave setting. As you change frequencies with the big dial you can then adjust the horizontal Time Div knob on the scope to see sine waves narrow and widen. You should begin to get comfortable with how the graticule markings equate to the signals generated by the Wavetek. Work on your ability to trigger using the scope controls. It looks like you also have trigger controls on the Wavetek; I'd be inclined to learn to use those after you learn to use the scope trigger. If you twiddle too many dials all at once it might become a head scratching multi-variable problem to solve - which is ok if you like to make things more complex or if you just like twiddling dials.After a while it should all work fine - in fact it will probably work fine from the get-go, but there is a learning curve which will help instill confidence. With just the Wavetek you should be able to keep yourself occupied for days if not weeks (or possibly longer) learning to use all the controls. Try to anticipate what is going to happen and then see if that happens as you twiddle the knobs. When you get sine waves figured out try square waves and then pulses. I think you are going to have a bunch of fun.Read the manuals and keep them handy for consultation; if you don't have them try downloading them on the web.Before everyone piles on here with their recommendations on what to acquire next I'd consider a breadboard, wire, resistors, LEDs, and a small power supply and a basic DMM - and then work to dial-in Ohm's Law. This should keep you busy for weeks to months; and there is enough remaining to occupy an entire life timeEnjoy!

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2015, 04:00:10 am
content: Quote from: ez24 on May 07, 2015, 01:40:05 amWHY?Would you not think the manufacturer hasn't done the burn in?Would you not think the manufacturer hasn't check it meets published specs?Just use it, but be careful with the BNC inputs, they're only rated to 300V.

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2015, 05:28:54 am
content: thank you Electro Fan

author: bitwelder
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2015, 05:32:25 am
content: Side-question: is there any counter on the Rigol from where it's possible to read how many hours has been powered on (and presumably put on the QA testing bench), if the final user does it e.g. the first time the unit is powered up?

author: Electro Fan
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2015, 06:30:18 am
content: Quote from: bitwelder on May 07, 2015, 05:32:25 amI don't know of such a counter but it raises a good point for customers of Rigol scopes. Rigol provides some number of hours at the outset of using a new scope in which the customer can try the various options for which Rigol charges extra. After the trial time has expired the options are turned off. It is kind of unfortunate for customers who need some initial experience with the basic operations as by the time some new users have become acquainted with the scope the options may have expired. So, I think a new user should have a look around at the options during the trial period to get a sense of what the extra features are about before they disappear. It's possible I have his wrong / maybe I don't understand how it currently works with new Rigol models - but it would seem that new users should be able to defer the start of the trial hours until they have figured out the base features and are ready to begin exploring the options.

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2015, 07:59:29 am
content: I am sure you will have more fun with your DS1054Z than with your XMEGA Xminilab

author: rob77
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2015, 08:08:28 am
content: as others mentioned - no need to burn in anythingwhat i did on my 1054Z whne brought it home:1. power up - basic checks (buttons working, display got no artifacts..etc)2. check all inputs using probe compensation3. feed sine from signal gen to check whether or not the jitter issue is present4. asked rigol (via form on their web) for firmware update (had the jitter issue)5. updated firmware6. become a happy 1054Z user

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2015, 08:16:00 am
content: Is it easy to check the production date?Given that most suppliers are short on stock, you should get a recent production scope I guess after you have waited?From which firmware and onwards was the jitter issue fixed?Did they only fix this in software or also hardware improvement?Is it easy to check the HW board revision? Can this be seen from the GUI, or do you need to open the scope?What is the latest known hardware revision out there at the moment?

author: rolycat
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2015, 08:45:13 am
content: Quote from: pascal_sweden on May 07, 2015, 08:16:00 amMost of this information is available from the main DS1054Z threadhere.

author: bingo600
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2015, 04:25:40 pm
content: Quote from: rolycat on May 07, 2015, 08:45:13 am@rc You gotta be kiddingWhy should the poor guy go through 94 pages , when someone here probably could answer it here ?@OP I'd check the probes x1 & x10 settings , there have been reports on probes x1/x10 switch being defective on arrival./Bingo

author: rolycat
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2015, 04:37:10 pm
content: Quote from: bingo600 on May 07, 2015, 04:25:40 pmHe doesn't need to go through 94 pages - a number of questions are answered in the first post.The rest of the thread contains a lot of useful information, and if the OP is seriously interested in buying the scope then it's probably worth spending a little time doing some research.Quote

author: paulie
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2015, 05:29:32 pm
content: Surprising how many samaritans will spend much more time and effort avoiding the question than answering it.

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2015, 08:11:21 pm
content: I found this video and I want to do this test if I can figure it out:[url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RvcByoEE5o]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RvcByoEE5othe "envelope" thing looks really coolhe also has several other videos on using this scope to do different thingsI will start with probe compsthanks

author: alsetalokin4017
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2015, 03:59:22 am
content: I see you found my videos. I was about to post a link to that one myself. It shows the need for burning in at home, to see if there are some defective component glitches that might not have shown up in the brief factory calibration. Yes, that unit did come with a signed calibration cert, etc. and the CH4 glitch developed (or was noticed) only after several hours of running and progressively got worse as I used the scope. It showed up in various other ways too that I didn't cover in that video. I would recommend simply connecting all four probes to the Calibrator output (it gets crowded but you can do it) and letting the thing run. Set up a Pass-Fail mask on one channel, run for a while, change the mask to another channel, lather rinse repeat.We contacted Rigol USA in California and also the vendor TEquipment, and were able to get a replacement scope sent out within a few days. I sent the defective one back on the Monday and received the replacement on the Thursday night, as I recall. The video documentation of the glitch was the key to getting the fast turnaround service.No, the DS1054Z does _not_ have 50 ohm impedance inputs, switchable or otherwise. They are fixed at 1 Meg. So when I first ordered the scope I also ordered the Rigol 50 ohm thru-adapter, for 18 dollars from TEquipment, as sometimes one does need the 50 ohm impedance input.Yes, there must be some kind of internal run-duration clock because the "trial options" time out after 35 hours of scope use. I don't know how to access the clock or whether it bothers to store times longer than needed for the trial options.Yes, I've made several videos concerning some of the features of the scope (mask testing, Runt and Nth triggers) and I'll be doing more as time goes on. Next on the list is to demonstrate the Trigger Type: Delay capability, which meets the specifications of a "period" trigger that was mentioned in another thread.I have had no problems with the probes, but the yellow insulator caps don't stay on. I generally keep the spring-clips on anyway. They take a good "push" to snap-lock onto the probes, so don't be fooled if they don't seem to stay on when you first try them. Just push harder until they "click" into place.All in all I am quite happy with this (replacement) scope. The more I use it the better I like it. There are some little weirdnesses, a few misspellings in some of the Help screens, and some things that should really be changed in the firmware, but these are mostly covered in the "wish list" thread and maybe Rigol will consider correcting or changing these with subsequent firmware updates.

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2015, 09:23:02 am
content: Quote from: alsetalokin4017 on May 08, 2015, 03:59:22 amGetting a replacement scope in time is a good thing. Still it would be good if they provide feedback on what the actual problem was. Did they promise to provide the failure report as well?Just replacing with a new one solves the problem in the short run. But the concern is still there that this might be present in other scopes, so the only way to address this is to get a failure report and a confirmation that this was an isolated case.I think more engineers here in the community are curious to find out more about the actual root cause of the glitch.Can you follow up with TEquipment about the failure report and root cause investigation, and update everbody here via your original post on YouTube and EEVblog?

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2015, 05:39:14 pm
content: thank you alsetalokin4017I look forward to more videos from you

author: alsetalokin4017
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2015, 01:28:36 am
content: @pascal-sweden:Yes, I'd like to know myself. But I haven't heard anything back from TEquipment about the returned scope, and I imagine it might be sent back to the factory for evaluation and repair... or, since they are so inexpensive, it might just get tossed in the recycle bin. What's shipment back and forth, plus a couple hours of technician time, worth against the cost of a 399 dollar _retail_ bit of kit? It's probably not economical to troubleshoot-repair.And nobody seems to have reported similar troubles, that I can find. Still, you are right, it would be nice to know.@ez24:You're welcome, thanks for watching the "TinselKoala" scoposcopy videos! They are pitched at beginner scope users for the most part. Several friends of mine have new DS1054Zs so I am going through some of the useful functions for them and for anyone else who may be relatively new scope users, or interested in becoming a 1054 owner. I am also having fun exploring the scope's capabilities; it has turned out to exceed my expectations by far.

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2015, 01:38:09 am
content: Can you ask feedback again from TEquipment?If I would be a reseller, I would be looking to find out more information about the root cause myself, so from that perspective TEquipment should support that the end user wants to know more about the root cause.

author: Lightages
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: May 11, 2015, 01:43:16 am
content: I would like to know how you can expect TEquipment to take the time to investigate and answer questions on what went wrong with a warranty item. They receive it, check that has the error reported, and send it back to Rigol. To go beyond this is just wasting time. A customer who demands to know what went wrong in this case is probably wasting their time. Isn't it enough that they take care of the customer? DO the really need to participate in everyone's curiosity to be aid to provide customer service?

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2015, 01:49:23 am
content: For an awkward intermittent issue like this, they should.Because it could be an epidemic failure in the scope, affecting their entire batch.

author: alsetalokin4017
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2015, 04:29:15 am
content: Has anyone else reported such a problem? If so, I'd like to know about it myself. But I'm not aware of any other cases. I know of a few that looked like software errors (crazy response to buttons, etc) but as far as I can tell I'm the only one who has had this kind of hardware glitch problem. Certainly the replacement scope doesn't have any problems like that.I realize that I may use my scope more intensively than some other owners, but surely by now if there were some big-batch problem, others would have noticed it and reported on it by now.

author: pascal_sweden
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2015, 08:49:57 am
content: Everybody should do your test with the pass-fail configuration.Very smart approach actually!