Strong LED Panel Mount? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / projects

author: Stuey
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2016, 01:15:59 pm
content: I've been struggling to find strong 5mm LED panel-mount holders. I'm building a few things for my toddler, and he'll pop out LEDs from weak holders.The simple kind (example) don't have a lot of strength.I ordered ones (VCC 4304MC) that come with retaining rings for extra retention (DATASHEET), and while the clips are stronger than the other kind, I can't get the retaining rings on after the LED is inserted. I tried attaching the ring first, but then the LED won't pop into the holder.I emailed VCC for installation advice, and so far no response after 4 days. If you've used these before, do you have any advice? With an LED inserted into the lamp holder, I just cannot get the collar to slip over the arms, and that's the same with an LED and holder on my bench or installed in a panel. Sometimes, the ring will fit over 3 of the holder's arms, but it'll then bend the 4th one back. The panel is within the 0.125" thickness recommendation.The combo clip doesn't work for VCC-branded LEDs or any other standard T-3/4 LEDs I've tried. Without the retaining ring, it's still fairly easy to press on an LED from the outside of the panel, popping it out of place. For now I've resorted to using globs of hot glue, but I'd like to avoid that in the future.Separately, but related, does anyone know who makes Radio Shack/Tandy's 276-080 chrome LED holder? (LINK). Straight-from-China chrome holders are lower quality (thin, burs, ugly surface finish), and the only LED brand that I've found to come close is Bivar, but their recessed metal holders are a bit smaller and shallower, and they're not commonly sold without pre-mounted LEDs.Thank you!

author: bitslice
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2016, 01:23:57 pm
content: If it's for a 5 year old, wouldn't panel lights be more suitable?http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Panel-Mount-Green-Pilot-Light-Signal-Indicator-Lamp-AC-DC-24V-SP-/172252239024light pipes are another mechanical option

author: Stuey
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 21, 2016, 01:53:11 pm
content: Thank you, but I have other projects and very specific LEDs I want to use for them. Even if there's a control panel I'm making for my own use, I don't want to have to disassemble everything to reattach a popped-out LED.I prefer holders over indicator assemblies so that I can use any T 1-3/4 LEDs of my choosing - diffuse, bright, RGB, etc.The LEDs will be mounted with wires, and not PCB-mounted, which is why the retention needs to be in the holder

author: Stuey
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 22, 2016, 01:33:26 pm
content: Hmm, maybe a nut driver will work?

author: MosherIV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 22, 2016, 02:07:41 pm
content: HiThe metal type holder can be bought here :http://cpc.farnell.com/led-clipshttp://www.bitsbox.co.uk/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=172_239

author: Stuey
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 22, 2016, 04:00:17 pm
content: Quote from: MosherIV on August 22, 2016, 02:07:41 pmThank you, but I'm looking for the OEM version of the Radio Shack/Tandy part.All of the metal-type holders I've found so far are either far lower quality, or decent quality but much smaller in size.The Bitsbox one on that page, HW042, looks awfully close! Some of their other sizes look to be really bad quality, so I'm hesitant to make any assumptions yet.http://www.bitsbox.co.uk/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=172_239&products_id=1816But who makes it? I can't seem to find a datasheet or dimension for it either.

author: MosherIV
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 22, 2016, 04:11:00 pm
content: QuoteDo not know, I have not bought any. They tend not to have data sheets for anything other than silicone devices.Try emailing them (or even phone them if you can find a number).Bitsbox seem to be a small company so should be willing to help.

author: ajb
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 22, 2016, 04:11:41 pm
content: Another option would be something like VCC CLB300CTP. It's a snap-in lens that's installed from the front of the panel and then the LED is inserted from the rear, so it can't be pushed in, and it's low profile so it would be hard to pull out from the front. The LED helps lock the lens into the panel, and you can get retaining rings to suit different panel thicknesses.

author: Twoflower
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 22, 2016, 04:20:51 pm
content: Those metal holders won't prohibit the LED pushed inside. The only fixture is the black plastic part pushed in. If you like I can make a picture or two of this type showing how it works. Either you use glue or something else. If you're now looking for the type with the lens/IP rating: The lens can be unscrewed from the front...I think that's not the manufacturer from your specific version. Buthttp://www.signal-construct.deseems to build similar holders. Look in this part:http://www.signal-construct.de/images/stories/pdf/fpi/8mm%20Metallgehaeuse.pdf. They have a nice big selection. Maybe you'll find what you need.Edith: Added link to catalogue.

author: Twoflower
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 22, 2016, 04:39:56 pm
content: And one more thing as you requested to use your own LEDs: At least some of the Signal-Construct mounts are available without LED. Reichelt here in Germany has them without LEDs but they might got a special deal.

author: promacjoe
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 22, 2016, 05:10:31 pm
content: In my opinion, the metal LED holders are not suitable for use in a toy made for a toddler. They have a portion of the metal that protrudes out from the LED, And If the toddlers should fall against these protrusions, It could seriously injure the toddler. They also tend to's swing and throw things. You would be better off to mount the LEDs on a circuit board, and secure the circuit board to the panel. When it comes to making anything for a child, you need to consider their age, and safety relative to that age.Joe.

author: Stuey
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 23, 2016, 10:44:07 am
content: Quote from: MosherIV on August 22, 2016, 04:11:00 pmThanks, I might give that a try. But if it is the same as what I'm sourcing, I'm still very interested in finding the source brand and part number.Quote from: ajb on August 22, 2016, 04:11:41 pmI hadn't considered that. I have a few left over from a previous project that I'll try out.VCC is leaving me quite sour - 2 emails and no response yet.I did get in contact with someone at CML, the company that sold the component prior to selling/spinning the division to VCC, and they said it was designed to work with their LEDs that have a certain flange so as to not deform the holder when inserted. That series of LEDs wasn't in stock at any of the places I ordered from, so I went with other VCC LEDs and some other brands'. The VCC LEDs have the same dimensions, but deform the holder. It's bizarre.I managed to get 2 assemblies successfully connected out-of-panel using 2 sockets, so my next step is to use a nut driver or sockets for a panel install.Quote from: Twoflower on August 22, 2016, 04:20:51 pmI know. My interest in those is for another project. I figured that since I was already talking about LED holders, it was worth tacking that question onto the same post, rather than posting twice.The Radio Shack/Tandy version has a soft rubber plug. Most of the others I've tried since trying to find the OEM have hard plastic plugs.The reflectors are deep enough that it should be hard to push out an LED, but a drop of hot glue around the plug might help. Or cutting down the plug depth and placing a drop of hot glue within the socket.Quote from: Twoflower on August 22, 2016, 04:39:56 pmThanks, I'll check them out further!Quote from: promacjoe on August 22, 2016, 05:10:31 pmVery good advice, thank you. Please be reassured that I asked about the metal holders as a separate inquiry, intending for their use to be in a benchtop project of mine, and in future projects.For projects that will be accessible by my son, there are to be no sharp edges or potentially hazardous protrusions. And any assembly will only be in his reach when under direct supervision.

author: Twoflower
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 23, 2016, 11:08:58 am
content: Quote from: Stuey on August 23, 2016, 10:44:07 amI would say: Not entirely. I just tested this with the IP rated ones with the hard-plastic plug and I could push back the LED with my little finger. Yes had to push very hard but in the end the LED was loose. But if you can fix it with Epoxy even without the plug at all you might be good from the robustness side.For the toddler project: Thought about back side illumination? So no holes but reasonable brighter LEDs shining through the housing? OK, It does not work for all materials, but that would be a safe alternative if applicable. For the cost of more effort to mount the LEDs.

author: Blastcap
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 23, 2016, 11:58:06 am
content: Instead of having the led protruding, how about mounting it flush with the PCB (if its not already is) and use a light pipe that mounts flush (or close to) with the front panel.Like this little fella.http://www.mouser.de/ProductDetail/Bivar/PLP5-2-375/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMuu2qEGwSNRoAxi8StmCHJSyeTxvNFAn5c%3d

author: Maxlor
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 23, 2016, 12:39:14 pm
content: In case you have a PCB under that panel: did you consider using SMD LEDs and light pipes? Example:https://dlnmh9ip6v2uc.cloudfront.net/images/products/9/9/2/6/09926-01.jpgYou can get them in different lengths and with bends.You can mount those flush with the panel and either press fit them into a notched hole from the front or superglue them in place from the back. Either method makes them resistant to vandalism.Edit: D'oh, too late

author: Stuey
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 24, 2016, 06:52:58 pm
content: I don't plan on using SMD or PCB-mounted LEDs. I think that, at least with the different things I have in mind, lenses and 2-lead holders for the inside end would be the next best (or easiest) thing after simple panel-mount holders.VCC finally got back to me, my emailing me a copy of the datasheet. *rolls eyes*I spoke with someone at CML, the company that used to make this part 5 years ago, and they said that with the spec'ed LEDs, the holder should not deform and hand assembly should be possible. The VCC LEDs that were exactly specified are not readily available in the US, but I checked the dimensions and the other VCC LEDs I sourced have identical dome and flange dimensions.The CML contact said that LEDs should not deform the housing, but every single 5mm T 1-3/4 LED I tried does just that.I have had some out-of-panel success using small sockets, and will find some of my nutdrivers for in-panel attempts.Something seems to be wrong with the part tolerance, since it shouldn't be this hard to assemble the darn thing. The collar should slip over the LED holder easily, but they don't.As for the chrome holders, I just might order a liftetime supply from Radio Shack.

author: jitter
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 24, 2016, 07:16:29 pm
content: Instead of using a holder for a separate LED (which will be pushed in eventually), how 'bout something like this with an integrated LED (and not sharp, should be toddler and vandal proof):

author: Stuey
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: November 14, 2016, 01:56:06 am
content: So, it took a few weeks, but after several tries someone finally got back to me, and after going back and forth a few times things cleared up.Apparently there was a product update in July that widened the locking collar a little bit...*face palm*My usual supplier doesn't have inventory from after the part update notice, so I'll wait a little longer or try a different one.