does air compressor produce ESD? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 13, 2019, 09:36:26 pm
content: Does anyone with a ESD meter also have an air compressor to test if it develops a charge, is it safe for dusting electronics?I know the compressor is grounded, but the hose can be made of many different materials.

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 13, 2019, 10:35:41 pm
content: https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&q=does+air+compressor+produce+ESDhttps://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/39220/cleaning-circuits-with-compressed-airhttps://esdsystems.descoindustries.com/QuestionsAndAnswers/ShowQuestion.aspx?i=446Ground the tip of the air hose (usually the tip is metal and the hose is some non-conductive material), and use an inline filter for oil/moisture as well.If you are a hobbyist then just use it and don't worry about it.

author: Red Squirrel
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 13, 2019, 11:14:57 pm
content: I never gave that some thought but I imagine it could... that said I've used it for electronics and never had an issue. I usually use it from a far distance though, like say 3 feet or so. After a while you also get a bit of moisture build up which would probably help with the ESD. By the time that happens I'm getting closer to the electronic parts. I always make sure the system is not running while I'm doing it. If I can I will plug it in but turn off the PSU, that way the chassis and circuitry etc is all grounded anyway.I can confirm that baking soda going through a very long central vacuum hose can produce a crazy amount of ESD. That was an interesting experience to say the least... Basically I was vacuuming up a bunch of baking soda I put on my couch to get a smell out and all my hair just started to go straight and I could practically feel electricity discharging through my arms. I felt like Palpatine. At some point my furnace started and my home automation system started to do weird things. Basically I was near enough from a sensor that it must have discharged into it. It didn't blow the control board (basically just a pic MCU) but it did require a reset.I need to experiment with that again some day, I bet some kind of blower air pump that can handle solids and a loop of tubing with fine powder in it could make a pretty skookum van degraff generator.

author: amyk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 14, 2019, 01:38:33 am
content: Yes, fast-moving air can cause charge separation. A few accidents have occurred where the discharge ignited something flammable.

author: raptor1956
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 15, 2019, 06:30:58 am
content: The flow of air, particularly dry air, will generate static electricity and it can be significant. In the semiconductor industry, which circulates large volumes of air through HEPA filters, there are usually ion generating probes scattered about the ceiling to neutralize the charge before it becomes a problem. Most of the process tools, which have there own air circulation loop within the tool, will also use ion generating probes. It's a piece of cake to generate 10's of thousands of volts just by scuffing your feet.Brian

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 15, 2019, 06:38:31 am
content: no one has one of those little hand held ESVM things?Also, duster spray?

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 15, 2019, 06:40:05 am
content: Quote from: coppercone2 on August 15, 2019, 06:38:31 amDuster spray is generally terrible for the environment.

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 15, 2019, 06:40:52 am
content: Vacuum cleaners can generate a lot of static electricity so by logical extension compressor air is somewhat likely to do the same.

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 15, 2019, 06:50:02 am
content: well a compressor might be different because I imagined a cheap hose might disinitrgate slightly while its blowing high velocity air and charge those up and bombard it with a meteor shower?

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 15, 2019, 06:52:19 am
content: Quote from: coppercone2 on August 15, 2019, 06:50:02 amI can imagine it spraying mice all over the place too but I'm not too sure how likely either is.

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 15, 2019, 07:08:05 am
content: So that harbor freight hose does not lose any particles as 120PSI of air shoots through it? they should be like piff balls

author: Mr. Scram
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 15, 2019, 07:48:01 am
content: Quote from: coppercone2 on August 15, 2019, 07:08:05 amDo you have any basis for your remarks or are you just posting whatever pops up in your head at the time? I mean I've seen the other threads so I think I can speculate.

author: coppercone2
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 15, 2019, 12:33:24 pm
content: Quote from: Mr. Scram on August 15, 2019, 07:48:01 am

author: Rerouter
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 15, 2019, 01:07:02 pm
content: the better your filtering, the worse it gets, most cheap, unfiltered air compressors will end up with a trapped body of water in there reservoir over time that does well to keep the air coming out somewhat humid, this humidity rapidly decays any built up charge, but comes at the cost of possibly making your board more dirty than it began (depending on your air inlet source and how often you empty the water)

author: floobydust
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 15, 2019, 07:22:53 pm
content: Anywhere you have friction and a dielectric, you get static charge accumulating. In clouds, to make lightning, or a Van de Graaff generator as an extreme example.Compressed air and vacuum cleaners make static charge, and can damage electronics. You can make an electrometer and observe for yourself the currents generated. It's only a problem if there is a stray capacitor somewhere which can get charged up enough to damage IC's.I used to see techs vacuum out computers and afterwards the 4000 series CMOS IC's would be damaged.3M came out with a line of "electronics" anti-static vacuum cleaners, I think it has just conductive plastic hoses but they are silly expensive >$500.Using compressed air, the metal nozzle in your hand is one plate (of a capacitor), and the other might be the PC board or object getting blasted. I think the charge accumulates on plastic wands but didn't investigate further. I keep one hand on the computer's chassis and it seems to work but I am not 100% that's the best way.

author: SparkyFX
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 16, 2019, 08:16:24 am
content: If the air gun is metal (usually the case) and is held in your hand, you allow the ions to recombine at the tip with separated charges during their travel, or dissipate charges in the tip through your body, no matter what hose it is.So i´d say the problem is no bigger than any ESD precautions in general than for handheld air compressor setups. Should you not have any other ESD precautions, like a wrist band, dissipative footwear, ..., you get the same problems.Of course the air flow does lead to more charges being separated through friction than without, but no one said how much rubbing on the carpet is acceptable before handling parts to compare the two forms of charge buildup - it can only be avoided by using ESD protection.QuoteHeard such cases as well. As far as i understand it, it will always be the the tool that has most of the charge built up, the air molecules themselves do not carry enough at once to have an electrostatic discharge that results in failure, right?So contact between tool and component is needed.

author: jmsc_02
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 16, 2019, 11:10:10 am
content: Is there no issues with the dust frictioning against the ICs while this cleaning method is used? (I am doing reference to the triboelectrical efect)