Section for Home Automation - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 15, 2024, 04:41:01 am
content: I saw in a recent video Dave was setting up Home Assistant to play with, and I'm also using HA.Just wondering if there might be enough demand for a home automation section on the forum.I would be down for a Home Automation section.There's lots of electronics engineering and hackery being done in Home Automation.Reflashing consumer Wifi/BT/Zigbee wall plugs, lighting controllers, dimmers to run locally instead of routing everything through china. (ESPHome, tasmota etc..)I'm actually reflashing some Shelly devices to ESPHome while writing this, just waiting for Home Assistant to finish compiling ESPHome firmware.https://www.shelly.com/products/shelly-plus-2pmToday's lesson is, use 64bit RPi and 64bit home assistant, for some reason the 32bit version has a broken build chain for ESPHome ESP32-C3 using the esp-idf framework

author: Halcyon
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 15, 2024, 08:44:26 am
content: I'd support this. I think it's becoming quite a popular thing and niche in and of itself.I don't have the authority to make the call. Entirely on Dave.

author: John B
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 15, 2024, 09:09:36 am
content: Yeah there's a ton of specific topics within home automation, especially when talking about purely local control.I run a Home Assistant test setup, but my favourite software, and the one I think I will permanently implement is OpenHAB.I've made my own network of lights, motion sensors, rollershutters etc over an RS485 network connected to a RPi. It's also further expandable by the local network for any other communication like MQTT messages.There's a ton of stuff to brainstorm.

author: SteveThackery
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 15, 2024, 08:35:21 pm
content: I think it's a good idea.

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 16, 2025, 12:05:58 am
content: Really keen to get some movement on this.A Home Automation section would be awesome.

author: WattsThat
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 16, 2025, 12:44:07 am
content: +1 for a dedicated HA section

author: JoeyG
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: July 16, 2025, 01:02:47 am
content: HA is a learning curve, however putting in the "hard yards" means you build it up and you own it.(and can configure and adjust later and expand on never ending home automation devices)With experience and Q&A to the HA group you can learn and grow.Otherwise - just get a "locked-in" - pre built home automation system that suits your needs for a particular task

author: Mr.B
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 16, 2025, 01:16:42 am
content: Quote from: Psi on July 16, 2025, 12:05:58 amMe too!

author: brucehoult
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 16, 2025, 04:19:46 am
content: Quote from: Psi on November 15, 2024, 04:41:01 amEeek! Do you really need to do that?Many years ago I was using Jaycar 240V switches that were controlled via 433 MHz carrier modulation, which I did from an Arduino.Recently I've been enjoying the TP-Link "Tapo" range. For US$15 the P110 lets you not only turn stuff on and off but also query the current Watts and accumulated Wh and other things. I *think* it's all locally -- I just tried for x in range(100): print(e3600.getEnergyUsage()["current_power"]) and it took 4 seconds so 40ms each. I can't even ping Australia in 40ms let alone China. Anyway you can look at the library or sniff it and it's a simple http request direct to the local IP number.I also grab frames from a C110 "security" camera with a simple "rtsp://{USERNAME}:{PASSWORD}@{CAMERA_IP}:554/stream1" query.So I don't see a need for reflashing?Are tasmota etc actually useful?I'm just using simple 10 line Python scripts triggered from cron on a Raspberry Pi-class RISC-V SBC, with state kept in the filesystem at the moment .. could use sqlite or mysql or PostgreSQL, but I can't be bothered so far.I do need some relatively complex logic. For example, it turns out to be bad to turn off the AC to my "battery generator" while the air conditioner I run from it is actually running -- the compressor motor doesn't like half an AC waveform missing and its reaction to that can sometimes (1 in 5) overload the inverter and shut the whole works down. So I have some logic to make sure the aircon is not running at the time -- and being very paranoid to also make sure it doesn't start up in the short time between checking it and turning off the power to the battery generator.Code:aircon = outlet("192.168.1.31")e3600 = outlet("192.168.1.41")def aircon_running():# using more than 100W?return aircon.getEnergyUsage()["current_power"] > 100000while not aircon_running(): sleep(1)while aircon_running(): sleep(1)e3600.turnOff()I'm going to extend that soon to keep track of the last times the aircon cycled. I know that when it turns on it is for a minimum of 35 seconds, and when it turns off it is for a minimum of 3m30s and at any given time it is doing one of those and a longer time for the other (or if it needs 14% duty cycle in the current conditions then both of those...). So I'm going to update that to checkaircon_running()every second or every 10 seconds or something, all the time, and only wait for the aircon to turn on (and then off) if it's more than 3m20s since it last turned off and near to the recent length of OFF cycles.Can the GUI-based home automation systems cope with that kind of logic?p.s. yes, obviously I think some kind of section or at least child board for home automation is desirable.

author: Sorama
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 16, 2025, 04:36:27 am
content: I wouldn’t call HA home automation, but instead visualization zorg some logic you can build in IF you have programmable relays and other devices that allow to be controlled through a standardized protocol.Real home automation are standalone systems ( yes, closed systems) that are very robust and do not depend on some software and databases running on a server that needs support and maintenance.On the other hand, smart home devices -for those who have no central wiring system and a central system installed- nowadays can make things automated like an automated light in the toilet, or light in the hall when there is movement and it’s dark.I have been using -although I have real domotica systems on both premises- Aqara to visualize things ( which my domotics can not because of its age) and to add some wireless control over things like garage door, or monitoring temperatures in every room that needs to be monitored and then control the airco.

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 16, 2025, 10:54:06 am
content: Quote from: brucehoult on July 16, 2025, 04:19:46 amNope you don't. You can buy off the shelf stuff that works directly with Home Assistant and its just plug-n-play for the most part.But a lot of the time the manufacturer offers that plug-n-play API integration to their IOT devices through their cloud server and many people do not like that one bit. It rubs people the wrong way, we want full local control that will still work 20 years later.There are definitely options for fully local control with off-the-shelf devices, but it's a much smaller pool.And even then it's usually closed source so you're still putting devices on your network running firmware that could be doing anything. And often they will still phone home and auto firmware update themselves. etc.. even if it's local control its often still undesirable so you have to setup firewalls/vlan if you want to get local control while blocking them from internet. It's just annoying.However, there's so many random closed source devices out there that can be reflashed to run opensource ESPHome or similar because the ESP8266 and ESP32 are in some many devices. So tech savvy people find it fun to do that. Just need to map out the needed GPIO then create an esphome config file and reflash. And you have a new device to automate cool new things.

author: John B
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 18, 2025, 09:21:22 pm
content: Quote from: brucehoult on July 16, 2025, 04:19:46 amGenerally speaking, yes, but only because the most prominent home automation software in the open sourced DIY space offer coding functionality alongside the GUI.The best contender for this IMO is OpenHAB. Out of the box it has a JavaScript engine that allows you to run scripts and could easily implement what you describe. There are also other engines for other languages (Groovy, Ruby etc) with a python 3 engine in active development. JS will do everything you want, just avoid JS clowncar logic with data type conversions and date objects etcHome Assistant is the main name in the DIY space, but I find it's scripting capabilities to be a lot more limited without installing addons/integrations, github accounts etc.

author: themadhippy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 18, 2025, 09:36:27 pm
content: Quotewoz doing that 25+ years ago with nothing more than a pir

author: Psi
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 19, 2025, 04:23:59 am
content: Quote from: brucehoult on July 16, 2025, 04:19:46 amYou can do a lot with HA GUI out of the box, nested If/else statements, variables, delays, waiting for things to happen in the middle of scripts etc..If its really complex it's often easier/faster to type it out in their YAML based scripting language once you know it. And you can switch back/forward between the GUI and the text language so you can see how things are done in text. Which makes learning easier.If its extremely complex you probably have to install something like NodeRED into HA so you have lots of functional blocks you can play with. But that is for advanced users.

author: Sorama
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 19, 2025, 04:41:43 am
content: Quote from: themadhippy on July 18, 2025, 09:36:27 pmthere were cars 50 years ago also: do they perform the same as today?Some relays (if any) and a PIR is no home automation.

author: themadhippy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 19, 2025, 02:32:14 pm
content: QuoteAint it? its automatically completing the tasks you mentioned ,without the added bullshit of computers.What about x10 ? should they be sued for misadvertising because its not home automation according to your narrow guidelines?

author: John B
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 19, 2025, 09:35:03 pm
content: Quote from: themadhippy on July 19, 2025, 02:32:14 pmOne man's bullshit is another's playground.I purchased a tray of PIR modules off LCSC a while back. Not only are they super cheap per unit, but they consume almost no power. One thing with usual PIR + mains relay units is that they waste power in their capacitive dropper + zener dropper regulators, and the output isn't really flexible in it's usage - it's just a mains power switcher. If you need a lot of them, the cost adds up quickly.It's easier to utilise sensors if you just pipe them into a computer system as a logic signal.