R&S RTB2000 Oscilloscope vs  Siglent SDS2000X Plus - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: Frank_MV
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 17, 2020, 09:08:29 am
content: Hi,where can I find a detailed comparsion (review) between the Rohde & Schwarz RTB2000 Oscilloscope and the Siglent SDS2000X Plus ?Thanks,Frank

author: jemangedeslolos
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 17, 2020, 01:47:23 pm
content: Hello,On paper, the Siglent is superior in many areas.But the R&S has lots of little details that make all the difference, such as the way in which the serial bus decoding is managed and displayed.True 10bit ADC. User interface that looks even better to me.The speed of decoding and statistics measurements......but the Siglent ishackablekeygenable, and to my knowledge, the R&S is not.So the price difference between a fully loaded RTB2000 and the SDS2000X Plus is huge.If the R&S was hackable, I would buy one right away.

author: Frank_MV
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 17, 2020, 02:43:12 pm
content: Ok, thanks.Yes the price diffrence is huge and I will the oscilloscope only use private for my hobby ;-)The Siclent has i2c, spi, etc. decoding on borad and for the RTB200 it has to be extra payed.In a video I have seen, that the Siclent takes 40 sec. to be operational and the RTB only 10 sec.I have search for a (video) comparsion in the net but I could't found it.

author: 2N3055
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 17, 2020, 03:26:52 pm
content: Actual question is how does RT2000 compares with Siglent SDS5034X, because the price range is the same.....

author: maginnovision
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 17, 2020, 05:07:37 pm
content: A forum user was selling his launch bundle for a very fair price. I'd see if he still has it.

author: 2N3055
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 17, 2020, 05:25:12 pm
content: Quote from: maginnovision on September 17, 2020, 05:07:37 pmStill going to be price range of new Siglent SDS5034X...That can be unlocked to much more and has superior capabilities in many regards....I'm not saying RTB2000 is not good..Just not very good price/performance..

author: maginnovision
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 17, 2020, 05:28:18 pm
content: No it's not. 2k for a fully unlocked scope is not 5k series money. Not even close.

author: Fixpoint
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 17, 2020, 05:39:27 pm
content: To the OP: I think you should keep in mind that it's not about the features. My advice is: don't listen to the gearheads. They will tell you that instrument X has better specs here and instrument Y has better specs there. That doesn't help you because you don't have any specific application in mind. At least you didn't tell us.So, what are you paying for? The UX. It's for your hobby, so the question is: do you LIKE the instrument? Do you feel good with it? That's what you are paying for. Don't buy something because someone says "it has better noise specs" if you don't like how it feels in your hands. I am pretty sure that some borderline specs don't matter for a hobbyist who doesn't do any specialized things. A hobbyist wants to have fun with the instrument, so use that one that is fun for you.Both the R&S and the Siglent will pretty much do the job, so the only question is: to which one do you feel attracted?I personally use the RTB2004 (all options) and are very happy with it. Of course it has some quirks, like every instrument.

author: Frank_MV
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 17, 2020, 06:11:35 pm
content: Yes you are right.Rohde & Schwarz would be the company I trust.Currently I have a Hameg Oscilloscope and it works finde since over 25 Jears ;-)Hameg was taken from Rohde & Schwarz but only the RTC Serie is continued.My new oscilloscope should be a measuring instrument for everything as i2c, spi decoding, HF and Microcontroler analysis.But Rohde & Schwarz is more expensive - that is the problem ;-)

author: 2N3055
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 17, 2020, 06:18:04 pm
content: Quote from: maginnovision on September 17, 2020, 05:28:18 pmFully unlocked RTB2000 is very good price if you can get one.. Agree..Quote from: Fixpoint on September 17, 2020, 05:39:27 pmYou speak like it's a girlfriend, not a scope....Jokes on the side, if you read again, I specifically said capabilities.... I don't care about features that are only on paper.I understand what you're saying, I was looking at Rigol MSO7000 and wasn't impressed by baseline noise and general "feel" of the instrument.If RTB2000 is good for all your need, I'm very happy for you.RTB2000 has nice math (it didn't initially but was added later). Decodes are nicely made. I really like bit pattern generator.When fully unlocked it is a nice scope.OTOH, it doesn't have histograms (very useful), TIE jitter measurements (very nice), 50 Ohm inputs... etc etc..SDS5000X is an instrument one level up in capabilites from RTB2000. It is not as refined visually (yet?) as RTB2000 in look and feel, but nevertheless very good user experience. It might not look so fancy, but it is very good. Unlike Rigol that is sometimes laggy and, in my opinion doesn't have most useful screen layout. But, if I had it on my desk, it would do the job. You simply wait a second sometimes and that's it. If it's for hobby, even more important to not spend equivalent of the house just to poke some signals every now and then...If I were OP, I would buy SDS2000x+ and be done with it. For a hobby, even that is total overkill.And for the rest of the money, invest it in good soldering equiment, microscope, some multimeters maybe, PSU, and most of the all, materials for my projects..Because it's all about equipment that allows us to do projects..Otherwise it is "instrument collector" hobby, not "electronics" hobby. Nothing wrong with that, mind me, but just saying...Regards,Sinisa

author: mawyatt
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 17, 2020, 06:26:12 pm
content: I was in the same situation when I retired, having only used and purchased Tektronix and HP/Agilent/Keysight, and a few R&S instruments during my career, I went on eBay and picked up (and repaired) a couple HP/Agilent 34401A DMMs, and a couple Tek 2465 scopes (long story how I ended up with two of each). When I needed a really accurate DMM, to use and also check the calibration on the very old 34401A DMMs, I went with the Keysight 34465A and paid a premium, no regrets tho, absolutely superb DMM.Later I started wondering about a DSO, since all I had access to for a DSO was an old LeCroy (which never impressed me). I've never considered HP/Agilent/Keysight for scopes, only Tektronix in the past, but I haven'y been impressed with Tektronix in some time so starting following all the discussions here on EEVblog, and there are lots of discussions about the various types and how to hack and the risks of suchI shied away from the hack advantages since I'm not that good with software/computers figuring I would end up with a brick. I finally decided to give the Siglent DSO a try, I never even heard of them, or Rigol, before joining this EEVblog. I wanted to try the SDS2104X Plus but that was backordered so got a SDS2102X Plus from Saelig (great resource for US).My prior experience with electronic equipment from China hasn't been good, so didn't expect this new DSO to be much better. I was completely wrong, this DSO far exceeds my expectations in very aspect in features and performanceI've been so impressed with this DSO that I purchased a SDG2042X AWG, then a SSA3021X Plus. Later I got enough nerve to try and upgrade the AWG which was successful, then the DSO which was also successful, then final the SSA3021X Plus also a successI got lucky, and with help of many folks here have some equipment that is loads of fun to play with, and do serious work if requiredI agree with Fixpoint that the specs are just well specs, and this is a hobby which is supposed to be fun so go with something that you like and will enjoyGood luck with your decision and selection.Best,

author: 2N3055
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 17, 2020, 06:34:13 pm
content: Quote from: Frank_MV on September 17, 2020, 06:11:35 pmSorry to disappoint you, but if you buy 100 000 € spectrum analyser from R&S you will get fantastic equipment and support. Their entry level equipment gets entry level support...And I wouldn't want to keep scope for 25 years. Every so and so years, capabilities get pushed forward. You miss out on progress that way.If I were you I would go and decide bandwidth needed, do you need built in 50 Ohm signal path, what protocols decoders you need.For instance, GW-Instek has killer Spectrum mode on its MDO2000E series. They go to 200MHz.. Maybe that is important.Take a piece of paper and write down hard specs, milivolts, megahertz you need. That will define a set of scopes that are good for you.Then from those decide how much money you have. For that money buy one that "speaks to you", that you think you would enjoy using most, like Fixpoint said.. And that's it.

author: Fixpoint
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 17, 2020, 06:53:02 pm
content: Quote from: 2N3055 on September 17, 2020, 06:34:13 pmWell, it's a mixed bag. If you buy an RTB of course they won't send you your personal key account manager to your door, but with the entry-level NGE power supply (it's actually designed for educational use in schools and universities according to R&S marketing material) I have made the experience that they indeed updated the firmware after I and a distributor made a request. (However, the way they changed it wasn't the right one. Another story.)QuoteIsn't it something like that? I should probably give it a name, maybe Marjorie or Harriet.Admittedly the RTB2004 is overkill for me. I don't think that I will ever be able to use it to its full extent. It is considered "entry level" but today "entry level" means something that is far beyond what the common hobbyist does. I only have all the options because incidentally I was able to get a new, fully equipped RTB2K-COM4 bundle for a fraction of the regular price. Otherwise, I don't think that I would have bought this scope. It would have been crazy, just overkill.

author: kripton2035
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 17, 2020, 08:11:26 pm
content: the R&S2K are on sale with full features enabled on batronixhttps://www.batronix.com/shop/measurement/Rohde-Schwarz-FP.htmlshould be a good opportunity ?

author: Martin72
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 17, 2020, 10:04:31 pm
content: Hi,Yes, everytime a good question, the comparing thing..I take appx 1400€ and spend it to the SDS2K+.Then I´m going to unlock everything and got for the 1400 bucks a scope, which got 500Mhz bandwith, autosensing probedetection, internal 50 ohms termination, integrated AWG, bode plot, 200Mpoints memory, several decoding types including MIL-1553B, power analyzer, MSO function, etc.Which model from the RTB2K series you´ll get for 1400 bucks ?Right, none.In my opinion, there are two true adavantages against the siglent, the R&S got.Higher screen resolution and 10bit without bandwith limiting.But do you need more screen resolution and 10 bits ?To be honest, I´m a "Fan" of the R&S scopes - But in comparison to my actual scope from siglent, it´s advantages vs the siglent are too less, to spend much more money.At batronix, the fully loaded R&S with MSO and AWG, full bandwith 300Mhz will cost 3700€.Are the better screen resolution and true 10 bit worth the 2300€ additional ?

author: Joel_l
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 17, 2020, 11:35:21 pm
content: I went through the same exercise. I was about to pull the trigger on the Siglent SDS2354 when I ran across the RTB 2004-com4 deal that was too hard to pass up so I went with it instead and have not looked back. I do not think I would have bought the RTB if it were not for that intro price.

author: maginnovision
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 17, 2020, 11:58:54 pm
content: I got the original launch bundle for 2k and I wouldn't have bought it not at that price. I also wouldn't have considered the 2104x+ though for what they're asking. I'd be significantly more likely to go for the 5k series. For me the RTB still does everything I need for my primary bench scope but I have other scopes for other things. I wouldn't consider the 5K NOW because it seems like they have a single small dev team and so they only focus on the newest product then go round robin for updates. Currently it is or was the 2k+ now it's probably the 6k... I'll reconsider if they fix it up.

author: Martin72
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 22, 2020, 09:21:44 pm
content: QuoteYou´re maybe right, as the 5K´s last update was in 2019, the last "big" update of the 2K+ several month ago - They´re still some bugs waiting to get fixed for both of them.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 22, 2020, 09:42:34 pm
content: Quote from: Martin72 on September 22, 2020, 09:21:44 pmAll that Martin however the DSO product manager overlooks all the DSO's and you can be sure he knows of the few annoying little bugs that need be fixed. Many here and myself have reported them and they are common to 2kX+ and 5kX.It is true the 6k Pro has been a distraction however its UI mirrors earlier/other models and serves as another development platform to iron out common bugs.

author: Martin72
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 22, 2020, 09:45:58 pm
content: QuoteMhhh...That should be discussed in the sds2k+ bug thread, if they´re a little annoying.

author: noobiedoobie
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: March 09, 2021, 09:19:18 am
content: Quote from: Martin72 on September 17, 2020, 10:04:31 pmVery true. The R&S brand and marketing is very very tempting. But at the end of the what tangible benefits you get out of the scope is what really matters. So Siglent FTW

author: nictinkers
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: March 09, 2021, 11:09:15 am
content: When I was shopping in that range, something that I considered was whether I felt okay supportingpolitical rant removed by moderator, you are right but this is not the place.My experience with R&S was awful - it took several rounds of increasingly public complaint over several months before they would deign to lower themselves to sell to a filthy individual instead of a giant corporation - but the scope is great. I thought the 10 bit front end was gilding the lily until I used the captured data to do signal analysis of a sensor system that I couldn’t do with a lesser scope. The big screen and considered UI means there’s less friction fighting the instrument and more mental bandwidth for solving the actual circuit issue I’m investigating.I do protocol decoding with it much less than I expected I would because frankly a logic analyser connected to a computer is the far superior tool to use for those problems.