eBay T & M Selling Prices ? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Chris56000
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2024, 09:23:34 pm
content: Hi!Why have people got such stupid over–inflated idea of T & M selling prices, particularly for oscilloscopes?There's shitty old items keep being re–listed and re–listed countless times that nobody will entertain because of the stupid prices – does it never occur to these sellers why there's absolutely zero interest in their items?!Also what's happened to all the spare parts these days?! I've being trying to get some for months?!Chris Williams

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2024, 09:33:31 pm
content: Quote from: Chris56000 on January 31, 2024, 09:23:34 pmPerhaps your two observations are linked?

author: PlainName
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2024, 09:44:11 pm
content: Maybe the problem is that not many people want the old stuff so if you put it on Ebay starting at £1 you might be lucky to sell it for £1.50 and then pay shipping. Or you could list it at a price just one or two people might pay, and then wait for them to see the listing - you might have to wait quite some time for their view to coincide with the Ebay listing, but if they do see and buy it it's worthwhile.

author: bdunham7
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2024, 09:58:18 pm
content: Quote from: Chris56000 on January 31, 2024, 09:23:34 pmExamples? Some stuff is silly expensive, other times things are silly cheap and get snapped up. I recently got an email alert from eBay that there was a Tek TPS2024 for $450 but by the time I logged in it was gone. It looked OK and was described as working, but no power-on photos were shown and no accessories at all--power adaptor or battery--were mentioned.Parts are a lot of work to sort and sell, I used to do a bit of it but it just isn't worth it unless you have absolutely nothing better to do with your time. A more frustrating issue for me is that there often isn't a very large difference between a fixed, working unit and some clapped-out turd with parts missing. That means that something I carefully restore and calibrate may bring me, at best, twice what a non-operational parts unit would cost. That's bad both ways--no cheap parts and no reward for fixing something up nicely.

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2024, 11:39:59 pm
content: Quote from: bdunham7 on January 31, 2024, 09:58:18 pmParts or not working, 2000 dollar, 1000 dollar shipping, import tax and vat not included, no accessories, no returns, photo made by a Nokia phone from 2002. That's how they list an oscilloscopes.

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 01, 2024, 12:04:36 am
content: We've had similar discussions before. If the person listing it is an industrial clearance company, they might not care to let something sit for 5 years before it sells at the right price.If it is a private seller, maybe that is what they paid for it and they can't stomach letting it go for less, so it just sits.There is nothing you can do other than: making an offer to them, message them if offer is not available.Complaining here accomplishes nothing.Quote from: bdunham7 on January 31, 2024, 09:58:18 pmAgree, its also a huge risk if you are not sure if its 100% working and every function tested to list it as "used". So if I'm not sure I just put parts and write what was tested.

author: bdunham7
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 01, 2024, 01:05:37 am
content: Quote from: tszaboo on January 31, 2024, 11:39:59 pmIt's eBay, so there's a variety and no standards. But look at this listing:https://www.ebay.com/itm/126211252055I have one, I bought it for a few bucks needing substantial repairs. I'd consider this one, in near-mint condition, to be a bargain comparitively if it is all working correctly. I sold a non-A 60MHz version for $250 a few years back. So there's still stuff there if you are willing to sort through it, at least here in the US and especially California.If you want stuff cheaper than that, it just isn't worth anyone's time to do it for a profit, even as a weekend spare time extra cash sort of endeavor.

author: Chris56000
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 01, 2024, 01:47:25 am
content: . . .That's a very fair selling price for that Oscilloscope, but "Ask Seller For A Postage Quote!" is an instant red flag for someone outside the U.S., like I am – it usually means either the seller simply won't want to know or it'll be something absolutely crazy, nearer four figures than three!(U.K. sellers seemed to have a lot of reasonably priced T & M but within the last six months in particular the prices have gone silly!)Quote(Apart from that nonsense, it seems to be more and more common to stick up a "Photo To Follow Soon!" – are they frightened of truthfully describing an over–priced robbed wreck?!)I have bought a lot of T & M from the U.S. with no issues and I've far more things damaged from U.K. sellers due to careless couriers than from the U.S. – U.S. sellers who advertise international shipping pack things far more carefully!It's the shortage of cheap "parts mules" that's getting far more of a problem now – I need a couple of Tek knobs for a '468 but I can't justify spending over £200–£300 on a 3D printer just for two knobs!Chris Williams

author: bdunham7
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 01, 2024, 03:43:59 am
content: Quote from: Chris56000 on February 01, 2024, 01:47:25 amTime marches on, that's a 40+ year old scope and as they age out, both demand and supply wane. Surely there is a service that could print knobs? Otherwise, identify the Tek part# of the knobs you need and post them here, set up a saved search on eBay and try some quality Google time. Hopefully your needs aren't 468-specific, I think those would be pretty scarce. Buying a carcass for $10 isn't likely to happen either anymore.

author: Veteran68
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 01, 2024, 03:48:22 am
content: PCB fab services like PCBWay will do 3D prints, not to mention the specialty 3D print services out there. You might also look into a local maker space at a high school or college that would print you something for cheap. You just need to find the STL or design one yourself.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 01, 2024, 09:09:22 am
content: Quote from: Chris56000 on February 01, 2024, 01:47:25 amSure, there are many "red flags"; caveat emptor and all that.As for increased prices in the last 6 months - have thesellingprices increased? If so, then the sellers are right and you just have to deal with it.Quote"Photo to follow soon" is ridiculous. The only possible justification (and I use that word loosely) is that they wanted to place an ad before the time limit on an "80% off selling fees" offer expired.As for 3D printing your own knobs, by far the best way is to get someone else to do the printing:cheaper, down to <£5variety of materials, not just crappy PLA. I like sintered nylon (tough, flexible) and SLA (smooth, hard, fine resolution), or gold, brass, ceramic, ....no continual fettling with your own machineStart by looking at ShapeWays (many materials, but not cheap) or competitors, or DirtyPCBs (SLA stunningly cheap)SLA ~10cm*5cm, £15 inc P&P, 2mm thread works perfectly!PLA, yellow sintered nylon £15 for two inc P&P, white SLA £5 for two inc P&PFFI:https://entertaininghacks.wordpress.com/2016/09/11/renovating-a-tektronix-p6013a-12kv-100khz-scope-probe/https://entertaininghacks.wordpress.com/2015/04/23/scope-probe-accessory-improves-signal-fidelity/

author: chilternview
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 01, 2024, 10:08:49 am
content: Quote from: tggzzz on February 01, 2024, 09:09:22 amFascinating, I guess they need accurate drawings (dxf?) - how are you generating those?

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 01, 2024, 11:03:18 am
content: Quote from: chilternview on February 01, 2024, 10:08:49 amThey need .stl fileshttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/STL_(file_format)There are many tools for generating and checking .stl files. Upload the .stl files and the websites will give you a quote in each material, plus do a DRC on your design .OpenSCAD suits the way I think: "machining" by adding and subtracting spheres, cuboids, cylinders etc etc. There are many alternatives better suited to different purposes, e.g. "pinching and squeezing" artistic models like head-and-shoulders busts.Look for tools with available parameterised libraries; I wouldn't have wanted to create that screwthread myself!There are many websites containing .stl files which you can copy or buy, e.g. thingiverse.I'm sure there are many .stl models of tek knobs available.https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/replacement-knobs-feet-and-fittings-for-test-equipment/msg2255136/#msg2255136/ e.g. gold £6511+

author: BrokenYugo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 01, 2024, 02:58:17 pm
content: Same reason you can't buy WW2 aircraft radios for $5 anymore, due to it's nature, cheap surplus NEVER lasts. It was cheap because there was a big pile of it the seller wanted rid of, once the pile is gone so are the deals.I'll hazard a guess the only deals left on this sort of thing are the last day of a hamfest or similar electronics flea market event. You want to pick up a CRT scope anyway, too delicate to ship for a reasonable price.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 01, 2024, 03:10:49 pm
content: Quote from: BrokenYugo on February 01, 2024, 02:58:17 pmThey are shippable, with care. Start by following the manufacturer's instructions.If none, foam between front panel switches/knobs (so any impact transmitted to frame), multiple layers of bubble wrap (to spread impact across frame), tight fitting cardboard box, bouncy foam rubber supports, strong cardboard box. The last two crumple to absorb/deaden impacts.Takes time and adds weight - but can be done.

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 01, 2024, 03:45:20 pm
content: This is from the other side of the coin, I've just read it in an item description.QuoteSo people will buy equipment, take the parts out to sell it or to repair their own stuff.Very sad.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 01, 2024, 04:37:03 pm
content: Quote from: tszaboo on February 01, 2024, 03:45:20 pmI've heard of such fraud, but not witnessed it. I have considered adding my own security labels before photographing and uploading the pictures.I've also heard horror stories about bricks (etc) being sent and/or returned, and the online websites only caring that something/anything was delivered.Very sad, as you say.

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 01, 2024, 10:12:39 pm
content: Quote from: Chris56000 on February 01, 2024, 01:47:25 amShipping a heavy CRT scope overseas will not be cheap. There is no easy way to get around that.A seller not wanting to enter postage for international locations is not a red flag at all. Prices change quite a bit, and buyer might have a preferred service, etc. Its just too many variables.

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 01, 2024, 10:35:16 pm
content: Yep. Shipping old scopes is a nightmare. Just too many variables depending on destination to give a fixed price for shipping. It does require a quote. Otherwise the seller will "overinflate" the shipping fee to cover most cases, which won't be good for the buyer either.As to the listed price, even if they don't sell, listed prices are what set the value of an item on the second-hand market, especially on auction sites such as eBay. If some seller lists some item at a low price and sells, then it does set the price of equivalent items and gets everyone down with it. That's how it works. So for a given market, sometimes it's best to keep the selling price high even if you don't sell, than selling at a low price. Unless the seller is desperate.As to overinflated prices everywhere in general, yes, that's unfortunately the trend. We have a rampant inflation almost worldwide that, I think, many people are still in disbelief about. But it's very real, and it's not looking like it's going away anytime soon.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 01, 2024, 11:11:25 pm
content: Quote from: thm_w on February 01, 2024, 10:12:39 pmI sell using fleabay's GSP, so I quote the size weight and UK shipping, and fleabay presents the total cost in the listing.The shipping USA->UK has become much more expensive in the past year or so - for anything, with or without a CRT.

author: watchmaker
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 01, 2024, 11:57:48 pm
content: Quote from: tszaboo on February 01, 2024, 03:45:20 pmThis is why I stopped selling on eBay. I joined in 1998 when it was about PEZ dispensers. Stupidly, never bought stock; I did not understand the business. I sold many expensive things. But buyer fraud was there from the start. I had a guy buy a marine chronometer and then try to switch detents, which are the heart of the instrument and for which I charged $1500 USD to make. This was during the period when we could leave negative buyer feedback, which was a very useful function. He had 5 such negs in a row and I nailed his butt.When ebay killed the feedback function and then required returns (at least in the US) around 2010, I cancelled my seller account. I have no idea how people sell gold coins. I buy on ebay and had mainly problem-free experiences. But I had a few problems that I needed to have resolved by the concierge service. Never been screwed although some tried real hard. Had one person send me a damaged thing hoping I would play along with their claim against the Post Office. Reported it to the Postal Inspector. Surprise!As someone pointed out in another thread, now ebay will remove negative feedback without notifying the one who posted it if the seller meets certain criteria and after being forced to accept a return.Over 40 years I have learned the importance of qualifying your customer. Without the original feedback system sellers are shooting in the dark. I am surprised there are not more instances where a cheater is not confronted at his door with someone holding a gun. $5K is a lot of money to steal.But buyer fraud is as old as ebay and even as old as retail. I know distributors who stopped selling replacement clock movements because clock repairers would return the movement they took out for a refund!

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 02, 2024, 12:21:21 am
content: With technology export controls continue being tightened, used T&M prices will continue to rise.

author: Black Phoenix
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 02, 2024, 01:37:09 pm
content: eBay has been dead for me since 2019. Last thing I bought there was the Fluke 87V, imported from US to Hong Kong and the Keyspan USB to Serial Adapter (who was later bought by Tripp Lite and now Tripp Lite by Eaton).And I have an account there since 2005, with more than 20000 euros dealth with and 400 positive feedback, 0 negative.Currently whatever they have there, I can get better deals on new stuff in Amazon or Taobao, and for used stuff Xian Yu, Carousell or Yahoo Auctions. Is that simple, now on eBay everyone thinks it have a gold mine on hand when in reality not even the price in weight values.