Entry level salaries for electronics design in Germany - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: ecstaticelephant
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: July 03, 2021, 03:52:52 pm
content: Hi, I recently graduated with a Master's degree in electronics engineering here in Germany.I've been on the job hunt for a while now and finally had two successful interviews with some smaller companies in Berlin (where I'd like to work), one for embedded software engineering and one for RF hardware design.Unfortunately I've found that the annual salaries they are willing to offer were quite low between 46,000 for embedded software and 48,000 EUR for RF hardware. For a beginner in the industry I was aiming for at least 52,000 EUR which is reasonable according to the IG Metall union salaries list in the Berlin area.I realize that the Berlin area and eastern Germany pay less well than in south-west Germany but tbh IG Metall aren't really considered top notch salaries either and these companies weren't even willing offering this much.I also realize that the big players like Audi, Mercedes Benz etc. pay better as well (they're also all located in the south).At this point I am considering getting a PhD as a fast-track into a management trainee program, because engineering salaries seem to be shockingly low. I'd love to work as an electronics design engineer but rents in many places in Germany are going through the roof, let alone property prices. At this point it could also be better to shift careers into the pharmaceutical industry ($$$).I know there are many people from Germany active on this forum. Does this jive with your general experience with the state of the industry in Germany or am I being taken for a ride by these companies?

author: m98
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 03, 2021, 05:29:11 pm
content: IG Metall tariff is pretty much what you'll get at most big companies, if you happen to get an entry-level job without having done an internship and/or thesis at the company. Which is short of impossible, at least in my industry (not automotive).48k doesn't seem low as a starting salary, I know some immigrant PhD computer scientists who work for under 30k.

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 03, 2021, 06:07:27 pm
content: Quote from: m98 on July 03, 2021, 05:29:11 pmDefinitely. Entry-level engineering EE jobs, the typical wage is around 35k I think. And yes, some will work for less than this.Of course, depending on the company and your profile, it may be a bit more than this, but 48k? That's daydreaming for a starting salary IMO. You typically need at least 5-year experience to get to that point. I haven't seen very recent figures for Germany, so I may be underestimating this a little by now, but 52k as the OP wants for a beginner? I doubt it.

author: tom66
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 04, 2021, 07:52:37 am
content: 48,000 EUR starting salary? I would have loved that kind of starting salary, I started on 28,000 GBP (about 32k EUR). I'm aware the UK isn't Germany but salaries across Europe are similar - it sounds pretty good to me...

author: ecstaticelephant
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: July 04, 2021, 12:36:23 pm
content: Quote from: m98 on July 03, 2021, 05:29:11 pmYeah I've had that same experience. Applying at the big companies for entry-level jobs (if they are even available) usually doesn't get me any callbacks. I'm kicking myself for doing an internship at a smaller local company instead of going to a big company.It's a shame that the immigrant PhDs get exploited like that. How do you expect to feed a family and afford living on such a measly salary? Even in the small, out-in-the-sticks university town that I'm from housing prices and rents are going nuts because of the low interest rates.Thanks for the replies so far, I'm surprised that 48 kEUR is considered high already.

author: nightfire
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 04, 2021, 01:07:47 pm
content: It also can vary a lot due to the area in germany you are working in. Exactly the same job in a big (and expensive) city like Frankfurt or Munich can yield easily 10k more than you would get in a smaller town.I work as a Sysadmin in a smaller company in town of 100k people, where some bigger and more prestigous cities are about half an hour drive away- and looking alone at the rent for an apartment, you easily have to pay 500 Euros more per month in a bigger city- or you are commuting a significant amount of time a day, which also leads to corresponding costs for your car...My colleague, that worked some time ago in one of those bigger surrounding cities in a federal branch made about 10k/year more that now, so thats a variation that can happen.But working in a smaller town and living where it is quiet also has some advantages ;-)

author: ebastler
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 04, 2021, 05:45:35 pm
content: Quote from: ecstaticelephant on July 03, 2021, 03:52:52 pmFound the contradiction for you...When you are an experienced specialist in a discipline which is in high demand, union salaries may not be generous since they don't reflect those specific boundary conditions. But entry-level union salaries probably are on the "very solid" side, and may be more than a small company can afford to pay.

author: ecstaticelephant
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: July 05, 2021, 08:12:21 am
content: Quote from: nightfire on July 04, 2021, 01:07:47 pmThat's a very good point. Do you think the 48 k already factor in the fact that the position would be on-site in Berlin? It's a big city with higher rents albeit not nearly as expensive as Munich or Stuttgart.Quote from: ebastler on July 04, 2021, 05:45:35 pmIs that the famous Fachkräftemangel thatpeopleindustry talking-heads keep complaining about? I'd think the big companies benefit more from a large supply of engineers than the small companies either way. No young person wants to work out in the sticks for 30k a year.

author: nightfire
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 06, 2021, 06:07:08 pm
content: Well, headquarter of my previous employer was in Berlin, and Berlin has become expensive over the last 10 years.When a colleague of mine moved to Berlin in about 2004, he got one months rent free just for moving in (into a small, not very accurately renovated apartment) and agreeing to be a good guy...Some years later, when I left the company and had some last business to do in HQ, colleagues told me the prices for apartments in the reasonable areas of Berlin, and I looked at them in disbelief, how much the average rent went up by then...Not to forget: When the field is a bit more specialized, like embedded systems, salaries are possibly a bit higher that average "ordinary stuff EE", especially when involving software.