Solder Selection - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: ChrisGreece52
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 19, 2017, 01:15:17 pm
content: Hello i would like to start saying i searched quite a bit about solder and decided to go with Dave's advice on the Soldering Tutorial videos and get some good solder preferably with lead with a 63/37 or 60/40 analogy and a diameter of 0.3mm provided it has a flux core. Problem is that living in Greece i have few choices of brands and stores mostly ending up buying stuff from Aliexpress , Ebay , Gearbest and Bangood. So what would you recommend for me to get?Cheap solder from china did the job for me till i got a piece of crap solder that got me cold joints even with the iron set at 400 Degrees C this is why i am asking for advice on the topic because i am tired of having bad quality joints even with a scorching hot iron.Thank you in advance.

author: stj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 19, 2017, 01:37:31 pm
content: what are you going to solder??0.3mm is very expensive and only usefull for touching up smd work.pricewise,0.7 - 0.8 is the usual size for hand soldering pcb's0.5 is used for precision stuff and costs about twice as much.0.3 costs twice as much again!!i have all 3 btw.

author: ChrisGreece52
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 19, 2017, 01:53:38 pm
content: Well knowing now that 0.3 mm solder is pretty pricey i would like to go with 0.8-1 mm since most of the boards i solder are through-hole and having a bit of 0.3 or 0.5 mm laying around for SMD repairs and touch ups .

author: nicalitz
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 19, 2017, 02:47:36 pm
content: 0.3mm is probably overkill for through hole work. i would however buy both 0.5mm and 0.8/1.0mm. use the 0.8 as your go to, cheaper to replace. i do often find myself reaching for the 0.5/0.3 for touch up or closely spaced joints, even when working with thru hole. would suggest going with 60/40. usually less expensive than 63/37, and works just as well when hand soldering.

author: stj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 19, 2017, 07:36:08 pm
content: i suggest leadfree solder from Stannol.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 19, 2017, 07:39:02 pm
content: Quote from: stj on December 19, 2017, 07:36:08 pmI don't like Stannol solder. IMO out ofexpensivesolders their products are among the worst.

author: ChrisGreece52
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 19, 2017, 09:13:19 pm
content: Hey and thanks for your answers. Problem is where should i get it from. I am a bit skeptical to buy solder from ebay since i will probably end up with a cheap low quality stuff.

author: stj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 19, 2017, 11:29:02 pm
content: i'm surprised you can even do that,i thought the financial terrorists had blocked greek people from sending money out of the country!

author: Cerebus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 20, 2017, 01:11:03 am
content: If you're limited to places like ebay then there's a Polish company called Cynel that makes decent solder that is well represented amongst vendors on ebay. I picked up a small reel of 0.25mm 60/40 RMA cored and it's decent stuff. (I don't get through much in such a small diameter and a standard full size reel from the usual suspects would have cost £50 and probably lasted me the rest of my life).Off topic: Seeing "Solder Selection" as the topic and, it being that time of year, I couldn't help being reminded of the "Selection Boxes" of chocolate bars I used to get given at Christmas as a child. I had a vision of a box containing several small reels of solder of different sorts, an idea Christmas gift for the engineer in your life.

author: mariush
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 20, 2017, 02:19:27 am
content: Quote from: ChrisGreece52 on December 19, 2017, 01:15:17 pmSee if TME.EU ships to you in Greece, they're a European company. Here's a selection of good solders (63/37, 62/36/2 , 62/37/1) :linkIf you want, I can mail you some Multicore 63/37 solder 0.56mm diameter with 2% no-clean flux from my own 450g spool I bought from Digikey one or two years ago.The exact part is this one, 82-129-ND :https://www.digikey.com/products/en?keywords=82-129-NDDescription 63/37 CRYSL 502 2% .022DIA/24SWGDetailed Description Leaded No-Clean Wire Solder Sn63Pb37 (63/37) 24 AWG, 26 SWG Spool, 454g (1 lb)I don't know, a thick padded envelope and postage to Greece is maybe 2-3$ for up to 100g of weight and I don't have a mg scale to weight the solder so i can't "sell" you anything by weight.Let's say i'd unspool around 30-50 meters of wire and whatever that ends up to, I'd give it to you for 2$, so if you paypal me 5$ in total then i'd be fine with it. I guess when i go to the post office they can measure and tell me the weight and if it's too low i'd send you back some of the money.... or if you figure a way to determine the actual weight per meter for this leaded solder, then i can be more exact.You could even pay me in Ethereum or Ethereum Classic .. if you have a modern video card you can make those 5$ in about 3-5 days (i can explain how if you're interested though private messages)

author: M4trix
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 20, 2017, 03:12:50 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on December 20, 2017, 02:31:17 am+1Me too (perfectionism). Sometimes it is very exhausting.

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 20, 2017, 03:13:56 am
content: Quote from: blueskull on December 20, 2017, 02:31:17 amWhy go with lead-free?

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 20, 2017, 03:21:53 am
content: Okay, so, no technical reasons.Leaded: Cheaper, quicker, better quality, less aggressive flux.Lead-free: You can be very very slightly less worried about chewing your fingernails, we'll just forget about the other contaminents..

author: ChrisGreece52
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 20, 2017, 02:05:24 pm
content: For me right now leaded solder is the way to go. I have a nail biting problem but when i solder i am quite thorough cleaning my hands. So lead poisoning is not a concern here. Also the low melting point is an advantage for me since i have a cheap soldering iron (i am planning on building my own Hakko 936 Clone in the future) but for now low melting especially for SMD work is a good selling point for me.As suggested above i looked up for CYNEL solder and i got very excited due to the low price mainly and the fact that i can get it with low cost shipping (7 EUR ).So what would you say about this one ? ( i have no idea about what the flux types mean and i have to do a bit of research on what blueskull said.https://www.tme.eu/gr/details/lc60-0.56_0.5/sundetika-ulika-kolliseon-surmata/cynel/

author: stj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 20, 2017, 04:13:46 pm
content: building a 936clone is pointless - the iron is junk.if your going to homebrew an iron, base it on a T12 - handles can be got from ali-express for as little as a few €, or about 8€ for a good one complete with rubber cable and nice plug.maybe use this as a starting point??https://manolena.wordpress.com/2015/12/28/diy-smd-soldering-station-with-avr/

author: Cerebus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 20, 2017, 04:17:17 pm
content: Quote from: ChrisGreece52 on December 20, 2017, 02:05:24 pmThat's an RMA flux, as in Rosin, Mildly/Moderately Activated. Generally held to be the best flux for general purpose electronics work although, as always, opinions vary (and there's bound to be 5 people itching to tell you theirs.)That's basically a thicker gauge version of the one I've had good results from, and coming from TME there's little chance of getting a cheap knockoff. I'm not saying that I know of any cheap knockoffs, but the way of the world in electronics at the moment seems to be that if there's a brand name out there with a good reputation, then there's someone who's ready to counterfeit it.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 20, 2017, 05:43:02 pm
content: Quote from: ChrisGreece52 on December 20, 2017, 02:05:24 pmYou'd be better off buying or building a T12 clone station or kit as it's a much better performer. Cost effective as well.Some examples, and stand recommendation (Aliexpress):All Inclusive KitFinished Stationwith a decent enough stand from what I'm seeing in the photos.Hakko 633-01stand if what you get comes with a rectangular bit of metal w/ a Y portion that you bend up that holds the iron when hot. Seller is in Japan, but ships free to Greece.If you opt for a kit version, I'd suggest a kit with an aluminum enclosure rather than plastic. For an suitable PSU, you'd want an SMPS that can continually deliver 24V @ 4.5A, and a Hakko 633-01 stand as none of them come with anything decent. There are less expensive options if you'd rather go that way, but the Hakko isn't easily turned over, and it comes with a brass wool tip cleaner (599B).Quote from: ChrisGreece52 on December 20, 2017, 02:05:24 pmI'd go with a 0.5kg roll of Stannol 63/37 in 0.7mm and HS10 flux (= RA @ 2.5%), also from TME (link). It will last you for many years, so don't base your decision on price, but rather quality. Saves you a lot of headaches/aggravation, as well as money due to fewer damaged boards and/or components.FWIW, I'd recommend keeping some additional flux on-hand; liquid for general purpose as it's much cheaper than disposable pens by volume, and gel/paste/tacky flux for SMD IC's.

author: ChrisGreece52
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 21, 2017, 01:16:38 am
content: The finished station which nanofrog suggested seems to be the best choice for me at this moment as i do not really trust my crappy iron to create a good solid connection with the solder i have on hand (which is the worst quality solder i have seen till now really).As for solder selection i would love to get the one nanofrog suggested as well ... it is not expensive and seems good quality (from what nanofrog said)-Correction there is a change a friend of mine might lend me his antek (mains) iron and a bit of good solder wire (till the good one arrives) to purchase and assemble the kit ... ill see into it i would love to get some extra tips with the iron as well.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 21, 2017, 07:37:51 am
content: Quote from: ChrisGreece52 on December 21, 2017, 01:16:38 amIn regard to the finished station, I'd go with the #3 set due to the stand. Don't expect much from the rosin or solder wire that any of them come with; but you can play with it if you like.Regarding tips, take a look atHakko's Tip Selectionpage to see what the different shapes are used for.There's also a number of threads here in the forum that cover tip selection for Hakko stations (both T15 and T18 series', with the latter being what the T12 tips are imitating). TheHakko Soldering Tipsthread would be one such example.

author: stj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 21, 2017, 11:03:17 am
content: those kits have a really crappy handle,and there is a better version with an oled display.so i wouldnt get any of those linked kits.

author: ChrisGreece52
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 23, 2017, 09:01:18 pm
content: I was ready to order the kit before I checked the forum again. This kit seemed the best solution for what i need and i love that is compatible with the original hakko tips

author: stj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 23, 2017, 11:13:59 pm
content: there are very similar kits with oled displays.just search T12 oled kit

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 24, 2017, 01:02:24 am
content: It was meant as an example, not the"be-all, end-all"of T12 stations.My main objective was looking for a full station that worked at the lowest cost possible with a decent PSU, including stand if at all possible. And FWIW, the Hakko 633-01 is a bargain as it includes a high quality tip cleaner, but it's not the least expensive way to go for a workable stand.

author: ChrisGreece52
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 24, 2017, 11:29:59 am
content: Thank you very much for your answer i will get to it.

author: ChrisGreece52
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 24, 2017, 11:32:05 am
content: Also i have heard very good things about the stand here but i will have to get a cheap one first till i find a way to order it.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 24, 2017, 11:58:29 am
content: Quote from: ChrisGreece52 on December 24, 2017, 11:32:05 amThe eBay seller linked has it available to Greece, and the shipping is free.FWIW, I've bought stuff from Japan from multiple sellers, and have never had a problem.

author: aabbcc
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 24, 2017, 01:08:13 pm
content: Quote from: nanofrog on December 20, 2017, 05:43:02 pm

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 24, 2017, 02:26:02 pm
content: Not IME, but be sure it's up to room temp before using it.

author: Monkeh
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 24, 2017, 02:29:53 pm
content: Some fluxes are a bit splattery at higher temperatures - stick to RMA types and it's usually not bad.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 24, 2017, 02:51:26 pm
content: I forgot to mention, the smaller the diameter, the worse the spattering tends to be. The reason for this is it's harder to keep the flux contiguous the smaller the wire is drawn (no gaps/voids in the flux core).

author: stj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 24, 2017, 04:14:31 pm
content: good fluxes like krystal505 dont splatter.

author: aabbcc
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 25, 2017, 12:01:12 pm
content: Thanks for the replies! The thickness I use is 0.7mm.Regardign the Kristall 505, it seems like it contains halides, how much of an possible issue is this with a no-clean solder? Is there any actual risk that stuff might corrode over time? Or should I be looking for a halide free solder.

author: stj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 25, 2017, 06:19:18 pm
content: 505 has a small amount of Halide,you NEED Halide to solder to things like brass - i wouldnt touch Halide-free solder.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 25, 2017, 10:29:54 pm
content: Quote from: stj on December 25, 2017, 06:19:18 pmFWIW, I'm a fan of having a non-halide free flux as well. In my case, my general purpose is Kester 44 (RA). Great for both new stuff, and old (highly oxidized).

author: mikerj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 28, 2017, 04:19:04 pm
content: Quote from: stj on December 25, 2017, 06:19:18 pmI guess no one ever mentioned this to the numerous bits of brass I have soldered in my life, using electrical or plumbers solder. The first project I ever made was an AM radio with components soldered to brass screws, screwed into a bit of old pine.

author: wraper
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: December 28, 2017, 04:34:50 pm
content: Quote from: mikerj on December 28, 2017, 04:19:04 pmI guess no one mentioned to you that vast majority fluxes for electronics contain halides. And If they are for plumbing, then they are much more active.

author: stj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 28, 2017, 05:41:55 pm
content: it's only in recent years they even tell you what's in the flux!

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 29, 2017, 10:32:30 am
content: Quote from: stj on December 28, 2017, 05:41:55 pmPlease, stop it!You're making me feel ancient, and I'm only in my mid forties.

author: stj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 29, 2017, 12:05:15 pm
content: that just proves that a couple of percent of Halide in your solder wont kill you!

author: ChrisGreece52
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 02, 2018, 02:50:25 am
content: I had no idea about that .... it would be nice to do a bit of research on it.

author: Neomys Sapiens
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 04, 2018, 12:47:21 am
content: Quote from: Cerebus on December 20, 2017, 01:11:03 amIn my toolkits, especially the more compact ones, I keep various sorts and diameters of solder as well as bodge wire, waxed tie-off cord etcetera on little sewing machine reels, which I keep in a cigar tube or a small flat box.