Transmit HD Video - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / projects

author: Cigarsnob
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2020, 11:12:27 am
content: Searching for information, app notes, ICs for transmitting and receiving HD video and audio.What pops up the most is Analog Devices parts, but not much else/more in-depth information.Any references is much appreciated.Thank you

author: Marco
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2020, 03:40:52 pm
content: Over what?

author: Cigarsnob
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2020, 05:54:38 pm
content: Hi Marco,Probably should have included thatWould like to transmit wirelessly. In terms of the frequency band, that's still something I'm trying to determine as I learn more about it. Not the most detailed response/original question, I know.

author: TheMG
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2020, 06:08:35 pm
content: What CODEC? Bitrate? Video resolution and framerate? Dedicated wireless data stream or would sending the video stream using TCP/IP and existing 802.11 (aka WiFi) technology work?There's a lot of different aspects you need to consider before you can even begin to look for a chip solution. Many different ways of doing this so you really do need to come up with specific criteria on what exactly it is you're trying to achieve. You won't find a single-chip one size fits all solution for this, there's just far too many variables and different standards when it comes to digital video.

author: Marco
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2020, 06:42:03 pm
content: Latency? Quality of the connection? You wouldn't use the same solution for say wireless VR and drone video.Very low compression rate HD video transmission is a valley of tears BTW. Lots of companies have tried to do it with double digit GHz RF, but between the problems of LoS signalling and boutique pricing it never really caught on. Trying to DIY integrate those ICs in a design is going to require some RF black magic.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2020, 07:21:38 pm
content: It seems like hi res video thats used for security installation is often sent unicast or multicast on LANS, WLANS, etc. (Including wifi of various flavors)When sent like that its not digital TV , its a networking format.

author: BrianHG
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2020, 07:26:57 pm
content: LOL, not a single one of you asked what distance as all the proposed transports capabilities deteriorate over distance and have potential third party interference.

author: Cigarsnob
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 07, 2020, 11:35:41 pm
content: Hey Everyone,Here is more detailed info. Any direction to app notes, IC transceivers would be much appreciated.Up to 30 feet unobstructed with oneway transmit to display only. Option to transmit video/audio to several screens.HDMI connection from game console to the circuitry that I need to designEDID/HDCPDisplay to have 720p minimum, 16:9 aspect ratiostereo audioFormats - 480i, 480p, 576i, 576p, 720p, 1080i, 1080p (I know I'm listing low resolution than the minimum stated above)video latency (to audio) 10msec maxlatency to display - 30msec max

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 08, 2020, 01:35:33 am
content: There's a $10 LG wireless HDMI kit that will do 1080p at less than 1ms latency. Not sure how common they are nowadays.https://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/teardown-$10-wireless-hdmi-kit/

author: Scrts
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 08, 2020, 03:08:10 am
content: Would you consider 3mm width coax cable or like 5mm shielded twisted pair for up to 50ft connection instead of wireless? In that case, you can use video Serializer/Deserializer like TI DS90UB949<->DS90UB948.

author: Cigarsnob
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 08, 2020, 06:28:18 am
content: It needs to be wireless

author: Miti
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 08, 2020, 11:54:55 am
content: Quote from: Cigarsnob on August 07, 2020, 11:35:41 pmEither one EDID or HDCP makes it bidirectional.

author: Marco
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 08, 2020, 12:09:08 pm
content: To me it seems that even ignoring the RF black magic, 60 GHz from ICs is unrealistic unless you're big enough to negotiate a deal with Lattice semiconductor or Displaylink. Analog/ST/etc even if they would sell to you, don't have everything around the wireless IC to get video across the link, Lattice and Displaylink have the complete package. Unless you want to R&D all that too.The easiest COTS solution in 60 GHz is TPCAST ... but it seems to me it's just new old stock being sold at this point. As I said, 60 GHz is a valley of tears.PS. or Acer MWiHD1, but is also old stock on firesale AFAICS.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 08, 2020, 12:40:27 pm
content: Quote from: Miti on August 08, 2020, 11:54:55 amEDID can be an EEPROM on the transmitter unit (that's how the LG does it) and HDCP can be decrypted on the transmitter. The receiver could insist on only outputting to a device that also supports HDCP if you want to prevent the system being used as a HDCP stripper.

author: Miti
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 08, 2020, 05:09:47 pm
content: Quote from: NiHaoMike on August 08, 2020, 12:40:27 pmDecrypt encrypted content and then broadcast it? Sure recipe for serious legal issues.And how would you make sure it is only received by another HDCP device?

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 08, 2020, 05:26:47 pm
content: Quote from: Miti on August 08, 2020, 05:09:47 pmYou can always encrypt the broadcast with another encryption scheme and/or use a nonstandard protocol.

author: Cigarsnob
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 08, 2020, 07:47:41 pm
content: Sou from the looks of it, this sounds like a task that is not recommended. Am I understanding that correctly?Issues being:1. Getting the main transmitter/receiver parts from a company as I'm just a one man shop consulting businessAlthough this wouldn't be a starting point?:https://www.analog.com/en/parametricsearch/11353#/2. broadcasting legal issues (possibly?)3. Not much design support readily available such as documentation, eval boards, etc

author: Scrts
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: August 08, 2020, 08:22:51 pm
content: I am not sure if that latency is achievable with wireless devices... Certainly not with encoding. Unless it's OK with latency as long as audio latency is the same? You can look into Miracast.Also check this out:https://mtlynch.io/tinypilot/However, at least 200ms...Can you describe your problem/task/idea more, so forum users could think of other options?

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 08, 2020, 08:36:30 pm
content: If you are looking to do something thats non-commercial and for your own personal or educational use, to make friends, even, there is a huge amateur radio community, for our purposes here "radio" includes all sorts of different modes, both analog and digital. People are inventing new kinds of signals every day.You really should look into amateur (ham radio) television. With UHF and above, a tiny amount of power can sometimes carry an incredible distanceif it is lline of sight.Quote from: Cigarsnob on August 08, 2020, 07:47:41 pm

author: Marco
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 08, 2020, 08:42:55 pm
content: Quote from: Cigarsnob on August 08, 2020, 07:47:41 pmLattice is the most realistic source for a complete 60 GHz wireless chipset solution (WirelessHD) which includes all the encoding/decoding. But I'm not sure they are even making them any more, I suspect it was a giant dud and everyone is selling through inventory.Here'san off the shelf product from monoprice using the chips.If it has to be done with modules or chips and you can't get it from Lattice, I'd give up on 60 GHz. You might be able to find some suppliers for modules for low latency H.264 over 5 GHz WiFi.PS. just for a laugh, here's a pic of the WirelessHD solution including beam forming antenna array ... you think it's realistic to rebuild something like that from ICs up? I suspect all the third parties just use(d) their modules as is.

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 08, 2020, 09:36:02 pm
content: Quote from: Scrts on August 08, 2020, 08:22:51 pmThe LG kit does less than 1ms latency with the AMN2120 chipset.

author: janoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 08, 2020, 09:38:17 pm
content: You probably want one of these:https://www.vive.com/eu/accessory/wireless-adapter/https://www.displaylink.com/vrThere are a few more products like that available if you google a bit.Not cheap, line of sight only and any signal splitting to multiple screens is up to you (but there are off-the-shelf products for that). But you certainly won't be able to design and build this cheaper yourself.

author: Cigarsnob
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 09, 2020, 12:04:50 am
content: A bit more background, well...Kind of as it was already stated....I have a customer that wants to transmit video and audio from a video game console to a handheld display. 720p and stereo audio, minimum. This is something they would eventually want to sell.From the looks of it here, it seems like I need to get back to the customer and tell them it's a no go

author: Marco
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 09, 2020, 12:22:59 am
content: It's not a no go exactly ... but he'd be best off buying an existing off the shelf consumer device.The engineering to create it when you can just buy it is not worth it.

author: Cigarsnob
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: August 09, 2020, 02:07:35 am
content: Thanks. I'll look into the off the shell stuff that was suggested here and see what happens.