Philips PM3565 and 3570 - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: Norbert67
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 29, 2022, 01:24:44 pm
content: Hello!I have the opportunity to buy a pm3565 logic analyzer for a decent price. It is without probes but according to the seller its working properly.Unfortunatelly I haven´t found anything about these two types besides that the 3565 is 100MHz and the 3570 should be a 400Mhz analyzer.Does anybody own this analyzer on this forum or knows anything about the specs of these instruments?A link for a manual should be great, because options are installed there and I don´t have any clue what pm5583/50, 60 or 80 are stand for. (maybe extended IO?)And for last, the probes: do they used some kind of customised ICs for the data pods or it can be replaced by some other manufacturer´s pods/probes?Thanks.

author: Inside21
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 29, 2022, 02:53:22 pm
content: https://archive.org/details/PHILIPSPM3580PM3585Userand if u need, i have reference guide, getting starting guide, service manual and software diski may sending it`s by e-mail

author: Norbert67
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 29, 2022, 03:25:43 pm
content: Thanks, but the link is for pm3580 or 3585 types.

author: Inside21
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 29, 2022, 05:59:06 pm
content: sorry, but thats all.very, very old model. rare.

author: alm
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 29, 2022, 07:38:33 pm
content: I wouldn't buy a logic analyzer without pods, unless maybe when they're very common (the HP 40-pin pods). Especially not an obscure type. If you find them, you'll probably end up more for the pods than you paid for the analyzer.The pods could be either active or passive. You'd need to find schematics to figure that out. Pods may be exchangeable between different models of the same manufacturer, but I've not heard of pods that work across different manufacturers.

author: Norbert67
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 29, 2022, 08:34:01 pm
content: My considerations were:The instrument looked pretty decent, probably not so full of custom made ICs but more discrete parts and less unobtaniums like the ones in modern tools nowadays.Yes, many modern small LA has much more internal memory to work with and other functions, but: this philips can also translate words to hex show the logic diagrams and that PM3570 even to 400Mhz. Oh, and it doesn´t need a PC. Yes, it has a small memory but for that purpose it is more suitable a modern cheap and small LA.BUT: the least I want is to buy an instrument, to which I wont be able to find any probes or pods and it will render it unusable.The lack of information about it drove me to the forum, but as I see it now it was a really rare test gear.Passive pods in my understanding should be shorter because of the high frequency limitations, right?I liked the specs of the HP1663EP for example too, but I don´t know what typical problems can occur with these or if there are parts available for this LA.The second thing is the the ones with pattern generators are rare too.But I would really like to make this philips work if its possible, because I simply like old gear.

author: Zenith
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 29, 2022, 09:07:23 pm
content: I've looked on the WWW and about all I could find was a few pictures and a catalog on ebay. A search on the forum produces nothing but this thread. None of the usual sources of manuals have one. With no manuals and no pods this seems likely to become a doorstop very quickly.Unless it's being more or less given away, it's one to steer clear of.

author: alm
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 29, 2022, 09:39:53 pm
content: Quote from: Norbert67 on July 29, 2022, 08:34:01 pmNot necessarily. HP used tiny lossy coaxial cables of about 2m with their passive pods up to about 400 MHz. In theory (everything else equal) active probes would have a lower circuit loading, but in practice you mostly see active pods in older logic analyzers. Logic analyzers made since the later eighties that use pods (e.g. HP, Tektronix) mostly use passive pods, as far as I know.Quote from: Norbert67 on July 29, 2022, 08:34:01 pmGenerally parts for HP logic analyzers from the 1650/16500 up to and including the 16900/1690 series appear to be the most common, with the Tek TLA7xx/7xxxx series second, and everything else a distant third.Quote from: Norbert67 on July 29, 2022, 08:34:01 pmGood luck! Better start collecting documentation.This Dutch guymight be able to help (for a fee). The PM3565 and 3570 are in hisindex.

author: picburner
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 30, 2022, 06:38:20 am
content: I have the PM3570 user manual copy purchased centuries ago from ManualPlus when they still existed.Unfortunately there are hundreds of double-sided pages and converting it to pdf would be a nightmare!At the time I made the pcb of the pods (PM8821) but I had many problems (auto-oscillations) probably because I wanted to do it smdinstead of keeping the original format.I finally sold my PM3570 and bought a Tektronix TLA715 with all accessories that works perfectly.

author: Norbert67
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 30, 2022, 02:29:10 pm
content: I´ve found a manual about the PM8821 and it was designed for the 3551 series for a max freq. of 20MHz.Now I understand that the timing and state analysis at that time required different pads too. Maybe the PM8825 was for timing?After searching for pods for days, I am starting to see why buying a LA without pods can be a big headache later.Searching for disassembly videos about TEK/HP LAs I ´ve found that many used NVRAMs. If these fail, what data were usually stored on these, just user settings?And if these fail, the instrument can´t even boot up or just the settings are cleared?I ask those members who had the opportunity of using both the Tek TLA, the HP166x series or even the Philips PM358x, what are the the pros and cons of these analyzers?

author: Inside21
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 30, 2022, 03:25:20 pm
content: sorry for question: how much channels & speed u need for real work?i have hantek 6022 + sigrok software and dont need any more for work.https://sigrok.org/wiki/Protocol_decodershttps://sigrok.org/wiki/Supported_hardware

author: Norbert67
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 30, 2022, 04:37:20 pm
content: It would be great if I could measure parallel communications as well as serial. So I think 32 channel would be adequate.

author: Norbert67
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 30, 2022, 04:38:30 pm
content: And around 50 to 100Mhz

author: Inside21
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 30, 2022, 08:16:56 pm
content: = Hantek 403232 channels, 150 MHz, 2Gb depthand it does not take up space on the table

author: Norbert67
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 31, 2022, 08:03:49 am
content: It looks good. But why does everybody using the sigrok software? Is it any better?

author: Inside21
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 31, 2022, 08:38:45 am
content: software writen by hobbists on Phyton, its free, have maximum protocol decoders and may be modified by you

author: Zenith
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 31, 2022, 08:59:25 am
content: As a general rule, if you want some piece of equipment purely because you want the functionality, such as a scope, or spectrum analyser, or whatever, and you want to get on with using it - not because you like messing with old test equipment, it's worth checking out the reasonably priced modern stuff.For instancehttps://thedebugstore.com/collections/32-channel-logic-analysers-catalogue-uk

author: Norbert67
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 01, 2022, 05:44:39 pm
content: I tried both the original and the sigrok software - and now I understand why people prefer the latter.But I also saw somewhere that people were complaining about the software freezing.This problem is still an issue or it is already fixed?Or it was a hantek-software-specific problem and did not occurred in the sigrok software?

author: Inside21
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 01, 2022, 07:37:10 pm
content: I haven't seen any software freezes

author: Norbert67
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: August 03, 2022, 03:38:41 pm
content: I want to thank all of You guys for the help.