Analog meter advantages? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: Hobby73
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 03, 2016, 11:40:51 pm
content: I was watching one of Dave's videos and while scanning all the equipment behind him I noticed everything is digital except for one unit which has an analog panel meter (shown just to his right in the attached screenshot). I thought modern digital displays are preferred for a variety of reasons and the analog display is a legacy visualization format. Is there any special case where analog meters are preferred?

author: MK14
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 12:46:43 am
content: Older equipment (still perfectly usable/useful today, in many cases) is my best guess. Before digital metering became commonplace.One of the main (still remaining) advantages to analogue meters, is that they will work, even in UNPOWERED (no need to plug into mains, or have any batteries) equipment. E.g. a light or sound meter, where the sensor creates enough signal power, to drive the meter. Such meters, need only tiny amounts of power.

author: AlphZeta
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 12:49:44 am
content: Also, if the voltage (or current) under measurement is oscillating at a low frequency (e.g. less than 20 Hz) you can actually see the needle swing accordingly. Whereas for most digital meters, the numbers just jump around rather randomly.

author: vk6zgo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 12:59:53 am
content: Quote from: AlphZeta on April 04, 2016, 12:49:44 amOr if you have to adjust something---a DMM,say,jumps from reading to reading,making it hard to find a peak or null setting.Youcan,of course,use an Oscilloscope to peak/null a voltage,-----a bit harder with current.

author: skipjackrc4
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 03:11:37 am
content: I have quite a few pieces of equipment with analog meters simply because they're old and still work. Things like electrostatic voltmeters don't need the visual precision than digital meters can give you since the precision isn't there in the instrument to begin with.

author: mos6502
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 03:21:08 am
content: There are no advantages. Analog meters are inherently inaccurate, hard to read and bulky.Yes, an analogdisplaycan be useful. But somehow everyone in this thread seems to forget that most decent multimeters have an analog bargraph, for exactly that reason. Only, the bargraph is better than an analog meter: it has no lag, no overshoot and decent meters like the Fluke 87V have a bargraph zoom mode that gives you a center-null bargraph with 10 times the sensitivity, which can be used with the rel mode even in the millivolt range, making peaking and nulling much faster and more accurate than with an analog meter. The Fluke 87 original series and 87III even have a high resolution bargraph that is at full scale at 1/4th of the range.

author: Hobby73
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 03:22:07 am
content: Quote from: wilfred on April 04, 2016, 02:18:43 amAh, good point on watches and clocks!

author: vk6zgo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 04:46:30 am
content: Quote from: mos6502 on April 04, 2016, 03:21:08 amAll the bargraphs I've seen on DMMsdohave lag,are too small for easy reading,& are basically just an "after thought",but I'll take your word for it.It is more than nostalgic clinging to the past-----many people find the analog meter format easier to use.There is no extraneous information,like a bargraph has----you concentrate on the "needle".A fast,large display digital "rendition" of an analog meter can be produced,which offers the best of both worlds.Ham Radio Transceivers tried going the bargraph route,but nowadays all have their "S"meter as a "rendered" analog scale.Automotive speedometers tried using real digital readouts ,but they were horrible,as it was difficult to see your speed at a glance.The next thing was digitally driven analog displays,& a very few bar graphs.Interestingly, mechanical bargraph displays were used for a while in the 1950s & fell out of favour,so maybe bargraphs looked a bit "retro",but not in a good way.Today,they are a mix of a few bargraphs & many rendered "analog" displays,with most people preferring the latter.

author: zlymex
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 06:22:36 am
content: I have at least five DMMs around me at the moment but there is one analog that I use the most often.A DMM need to press the power button to use. And in the case of Fluke 289, I have to wait 8 second while it boost, that is the thing I hate.

author: Brumby
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 06:39:42 am
content: My No. 1:Quote from: AlphZeta on April 04, 2016, 12:49:44 amMy No. 2:Quote from: vk6zgo on April 04, 2016, 12:59:53 amMy No. 3:No batteries required for voltage or current measurements.Quote from: mos6502 on April 04, 2016, 03:21:08 am- Accuracy depends on need. An analogue meter can tell me my 12v supply is alive and in the ballpark. It often doesn't matter if it's 11.8v or 12.1v.- Hard to read? Well, when you've grown up with them, I don't find that a real problem. Have to have a mirrored scale, though.- Bulky? In some cases, maybe - but my very first meter (analogue, of course) was about the same size as my BM235They are sensitive to rough handling, though.

author: Brumby
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 06:59:17 am
content: ... and excessive over-range.

author: ivaylo
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 07:06:12 am
content: They are "natural". If you are a beginner it's current through a coil what's moving that needle and that's all you should care about. No need to understand fancy voltage standards, sampling rates, averaging, integration and all that...

author: Brutte
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 07:09:09 am
content: Quote from: mos6502 on April 04, 2016, 03:21:08 amThe pros and cons depend on the level of discussion. Is it the front-end or the display that is to be compared?From robustness/mechanical accelerations point of view, at fixed price/accuracy/size an analog display is a delicate stuff. I'd say the advantage is that these things run on burden voltage, whole range (volts, amperes, frequency, power, power factor, etc). That is all the energy these devices need to operate correctly. I use an old bench analog ammeter just because of that - you can leave it connected to a circuit for months not worrying about the powering. Also, the advantage is the display size and ease of readout. Just a glimpse of an eye and you can tell if the readout is within expected range. No need to interpret the data, as with digital ones.I think mechanical indicator could be substituted with an LCD/bargraph/gauge but I have never seen an adequate implementation as available bargraphs are coarse/grained when compared to a smooth analog readout.The disadvantage of analog display w.r.t. digital is that it would have been darn hard to implement an autorange feature in purely analog way.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 08:28:18 am
content: Quote from: wilfred on April 04, 2016, 02:18:43 am"went"?LOL!

author: Zbig
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 08:56:45 am
content: One advantage is you can sell them to hipsters and spend the money to get a proper, modern, digital one.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 09:06:01 am
content: Quote from: Zbig on April 04, 2016, 08:56:45 amName another?

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 09:27:43 am
content: I had one of thoseChinese crapTenma power supply on my desk, powering some equipment, which can (but shouldnt at that moment) draw a lot of power (300W). And the screen was glitching. And every time the screen glitched I had a small hearth attack that the thing on my desk is going to heat up explode, whatever. After I dumped that PSU for a decent one.So yes an analog meter has advantages. No firmware, no JTAG headers, no 50 lines in the BOM, trouble seeing awful LCD or having seizure due to LED multiplexing no bullshit. Connect, and it works.

author: sync
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 09:41:30 am
content: Quote from: vk6zgo on April 04, 2016, 04:46:30 amI have a digital and an analog speedometer in my car. I'm only looking at the digital one. Much easier, faster and more precise.

author: MrSlack
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 09:47:47 am
content: +1 for NANDBlog.I'll still throw a analogue meter in something over a digital meter if I need an approximate voltage or current readout In fact most of what I do is around the 5% tolerance mark anyway so it's fine for most things. 1% - probably still use one. Dead simple, requires only a shunt or series resistor for programming. No separate power supply. Need high impedance or low loading, just sling in a couple of JFETs. Takes virtually no current. Low brain overhead. Dirt cheap. Need a custom or calibrated scale (watts/dB/oC/lumens)? Dig out my 0.1mm technical pen and draw one.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 09:52:08 am
content: Quote from: NANDBlog on April 04, 2016, 09:27:43 amThe other reallybigadvantage is the meter response is slow enough to hide glitches.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 09:53:38 am
content: Quote from: MrSlack on April 04, 2016, 09:47:47 amYep. The burden voltage will ensure it'salwaysapproximate.

author: MrSlack
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 10:00:42 am
content: Quote from: Fungus on April 04, 2016, 09:53:38 amAmmeters always have a burden voltage. Some of the newer ones are horrible to the point I rarely measure current.Better to measure voltage over a known resistor in circuit using a high impedance meter (JFET+moving coil) or scope.

author: vk6zgo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 10:36:20 am
content: Quote from: sync on April 04, 2016, 09:41:30 amI think modern speedo update rates may be better--------the early ones I encountered were completely unreadable during acceleration.

author: MrSlack
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 10:50:54 am
content: If it's any reference, my 2013 Citroen C3 digital readout is shit. Every time I jam on the anchors when I see a speed camera it takes 1-2 seconds to let me know whether or not I am going to get a speeding ticket

author: sync
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 11:09:26 am
content: Quote from: vk6zgo on April 04, 2016, 10:36:20 amIt has about ~4 reading per second. It's close to my preferred 5 reading per second on DMMs.

author: Muttley Snickers
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 11:20:09 am
content: It might look a bit rough around the edges but this little gadget has come to the rescue on many occasions, It has lived permanently in the tool box of my boats over many years and mainly comes out when somebody down at the boat ramp is having trouble with navigation lights and the like.I won't be doing a teardown as the internals are all rather complex, at least they were when I put it together over twenty years ago, spare fuse inside for the current range and I've never blown one either, no batteries required.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 11:21:46 am
content: Quote from: mos6502 on April 04, 2016, 03:21:08 amTwit. Presuming you are not simply trolling, you are displaying narrow ignorance.Some advantages thatimmediatelyspring to mind:they can measure charge; I've yet to see a digital meter that can do thatno PSU, no batteries to run out - especially benefical in a shared environment where people adopt libertarian behaviour and don't behave for the common goodfaster when doing basic continuity checks: watch the needlestartto deflectvisible out of the corner of the eye when you are visually concentrating on the circuiteasier to spot changes and anomolies - that's why they are used for preference in all cockpits or power station control roomsfaster to read, thus increasing safety in cars. It takes longer to read 38mph than "just under 40mph". Digital = slower = not looking at the road to see the unexpected hazard aheadbetter at reading mean values - less susceptibility to circuit oscillations causingwildlyfalse readingsOf course digital readouts havedifferentadvantages.

author: HKJ
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 11:34:09 am
content: Quote from: MrSlack on April 04, 2016, 10:00:42 amThe burden voltage from a clamp meter is rather low and will often be present even without the meter.There do also exist current designs without burden voltage, I can do it with my SMU (But transient response is not perfect).I do generally not see any reason to use analog meters, usual the right digital meter can do it better.

author: mos6502
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 11:57:13 am
content: Quote from: tggzzz on April 04, 2016, 11:21:46 amPresuming you're not simply trolling, you're displaying the nostalgia-clouded judgment and hostility of old age.Quote from: tggzzz on April 04, 2016, 11:21:46 amMost of these are ridiculous. You're also confusing the topic of the thread (analog meters) with analog or analog type displays. Did you take all the meds the nurse gave you today?But whatever. It makes no sense to argue with someone who is stuck in the 1960s.Also, it's spelled "anomalies".

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 12:14:04 pm
content: Clearly a troll making strawman arguments.Evidence: you deliberately removed my statement that disproves your contentions. To make sure it can't be missed again: "Of course digital readouts havedifferentadvantages." inhttps://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/analog-meter-advantages/msg911228/#msg911228Evidence: you make wild generic mis-statements while declining to address specific points that were made.I'm happy to let others judge the validity of my statements.Quote from: mos6502 on April 04, 2016, 11:57:13 am

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 12:19:37 pm
content: You can of course get the best of both worlds....P.S. Can someone with the username of 'mos6502' really accuse others of "nostalgia-clouded judgment and hostility of old age"?

author: vk6zgo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 12:43:29 pm
content: Quote from: mos6502 on April 04, 2016, 11:57:13 amThe OP said:- ""I thought modern digital displays are preferred for a variety of reasons andthe analog displayis a legacy visualization format"That brought the whole gamut of analog displays into the topic's purview.QuotePerhaps you should check your own!QuoteHave you talked to anyone about your aggression problem?Quote

author: Zbig
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 12:51:09 pm
content: Quote from: tggzzz on April 04, 2016, 12:14:04 pmOk, let me try.Quote from: tggzzz on April 04, 2016, 11:21:46 amCare to elaborate? If by measuring charge you mean checking whether there wassomeundefined amount of charge stored in the cap by seeing the needle kick and then slowly decay due to ridiculously low input impedance of the meter, I could just as well argue that my DMM makes a great blunt weapon.EDIT:I can't believe you haven't seen a DMM with a capacitance range so I'm no longer sure what you meant.Quote from: tggzzz on April 04, 2016, 11:21:46 amAnd how does that:Quote from: tggzzz on April 04, 2016, 11:21:46 amwork without one, exactly?Quote from: tggzzz on April 04, 2016, 11:21:46 amThe needle a width of a hair is better visible than a big, high-contrast LCD? Seriously? What about parallax error?Quote from: tggzzz on April 04, 2016, 11:21:46 amWhich cockpits exactly? B25 ones? Or maybe you meant fully digital avionics with some parameters displayed as *cough* bargraph *cough* for convenience?Quote from: tggzzz on April 04, 2016, 11:21:46 amI'll never get this one. It's the polar opposite for me. I guess our brains are just wired differently so I think there's not much point arguing this. BTW, you do realize that what the "analog" speedometer in any reasonably modern car really does is "guesses"/interpolates the readings between subsequent digital samples? Just look what it does towards the end when you decelerate to a full stop at traffic lights.Quote from: tggzzz on April 04, 2016, 11:21:46 amThe very last thing I want from my meter is it lying to me, mis-representing a smoothed-out interpretation of what is really happening. This one is so silly I won't even waste my time commenting it.

author: JPortici
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 01:14:15 pm
content: If i may, analog meters have one advantage, which is that you actually learn how to measure and analyze results.. how measuring can interact with the system under testOr at least they gave me better understanding on the whole process while i was in tech scool, so i'd say they are great for educational purpose.I also find them more immediate to read in certain scenarios. I guess we are wired differently

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 01:37:01 pm
content: Quote from: Zbig on April 04, 2016, 12:51:09 pmStunning. In case you hadn't noticed, capacitance and charge are completely different concepts, and are measured in different units - Farads and Coulombs.Since you clearly weren't paying attention in school physics lessons, you might want to acquaint yourself with ballistic galvanometers, e.ghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ballistic_galvanometerQuoteSigh. If it is sufficient for you to be looking out of the corner of your eye, clearly  high precision isn't relevant. Hence neither is your point.QuoteAllthe aircraft I've piloted. And some of them are so "high-tech" that their construction techniques are only just beginning to make it into commercial airliners.QuoteI doubt it. It is based on fundamental human characteristics; see any introductory textbook on HMI.QuoteI didn't. Sounds like pessimal engineering,unnecessarilymerging the worst of all technologiesQuoteYou have an analogue meter that usefully displays a multi kHz/MHz oscillation superimposed on a DC signal? What type is it, because I would like to buy one.And that's why anything with semiconductor junctions can be a problem in some circumstances - their non-linearity plus internal capacitance can provide "interesting" and difficult to diagnose effects.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 01:39:10 pm
content: Quote from: Gyro on April 04, 2016, 12:19:37 pmI wondered about making that comment, but I thought maybe the moniker was somehow related to his/her displaying the antartica flag.

author: canthearu
author_rank: Newbie
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 02:27:11 pm
content: My first meters were analog. But they were crap cheapies, however, they weren't that bad to use. Wouldn't bring it near a high voltage circuit though.A lot of industrial equipment uses analog anameters to show how much power various circuits are using. If the circuit isn't using the correct amount of power (say because an abrasive wheel isn't applying the correct pressure) they can be adjusted very easily in real time.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 02:36:30 pm
content: Quote from: canthearu on April 04, 2016, 02:27:11 pmUnfortunately the same is true of some digital meters - see many threads and videos on this site.But, for reasons I've never understood, some people seem to trust electronic digits more than mechanical movement. The limitations of all equipment should be understood - anything else is (at best) intellectual laziness.

author: MrSlack
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 03:11:38 pm
content: Indeed. The only meters I've blown up are due to human error, both analogue and digital.Incidentally the analogue one was the only repairable one thanks to the protection diodes across the movement.

author: nowlan
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 03:21:40 pm
content: Some older cars used to pulse out an error code. You would see the analog meter kick the number corresponding to fault.A digital meter would flicker about.

author: mzacharias
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 04:14:23 pm
content: An analog multimeter can provide the current necessary to "pop" a loudspeaker for a quick check, and even run a small DC motor. (Rx1 mostly...) Digital multimeters generally cannot do this. Even the Fluke 289 can barely make an audible "pop" using the 50 ohm range.Rx10,000 will light white LED's, by the way. Only recently occurred to me to check this...

author: Smith
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 04:52:30 pm
content: A whole generation used analog meters, and they have build some awesome stuff, so they can't be that bad. I personally prefer digital meters, but nothing beats digital meters with an analog bar.Once I needed a current meter for a test setup. I did not have enough meters, so I used an old analog meter. It was then we saw there was a giant oscillation on the current signal (like 100%). The digital meters just showed the RMS value that was stable.

author: Zbig
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 04:59:33 pm
content: Quote from: tggzzz on April 04, 2016, 01:37:01 pmKeeping classy, huh?Quote from: tggzzz on April 04, 2016, 01:37:01 pmMy point is, the needle is harder to see, either straight-on or "out the corner of my eye". And yours is...? That it doesn't really matter because the precision isn't relevant anyway so it's... better? I'm lostQuote from: tggzzz on April 04, 2016, 11:21:46 amWell, I haven't piloted any. I've only been to four cockpits and only one of them: Antonov AN-2 was "100% analog" (you know, the bi-plane one). Boeing 747 used combination of analog and steampunky CRTs. Not sure if it's in service anymore. Last time it was Bombardier CRJ-900 and you're more than welcome to point all this analog stuff to me, please because I have trouble spotting it:https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=F2AEECE214DB131B!10837&authkey=!APtoY7Yrn7BKj1o&v=3&ithint=photo%2cJPGQuote from: tggzzz on April 04, 2016, 11:21:46 amWell, what could I say other than it's not really my problem if you doubt it or not?I recently got an analog (well, analog-display radio-controlled) clock because it looks good on my wall. Of course I can read it. But the signal path from my eyes to the realization what time it is is much shorter with digital clocks for me. Call me dumb if you like, I'm pretty sure I won't lose any sleep over thatQuote from: tggzzz on April 04, 2016, 11:21:46 amYou meant "digital", I presume? So, you say that the mere fact that we don't have ideal DMMs suddenly means that worse is better? I.e. if my DMM lies to me anyway, I should chose an analog one which distorts the reality much worse? What kind of broken logic is that?BTW, my DMM can display both the DC and AC signal components (subject to some limitations you mentioned, obviously).EDIT:And I can enable smoothing in it, with the window size of my choice, when I feel like it and I am aware of the implications.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 06:06:04 pm
content: Quote from: canthearu on April 04, 2016, 02:27:11 pmHa, funny how we all have a different interpretation of what's safe.Any of my old AVO's that I rarely use are the first I grab for anything exceeding 1kV.Many of them had ranges to 2.5 or 3 kV and factory flashover tests were conducted to 7kV.Few DMM's if any offer such high voltage capability without HV probes.

author: Neilm
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 06:28:13 pm
content: Quote from: Gyro on April 04, 2016, 12:19:37 pmPersonally, I would worry about that - my first thought is that they have a digital measurement engine and are driving a moving coil. I have seen that on several bits of equipment I have looked at.

author: HKJ
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 06:38:35 pm
content: Quote from: tautech on April 04, 2016, 06:06:04 pmDMM may not offer high voltage measurements but are tested with 8kV (Cat IV 600V).

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 06:50:01 pm
content: Quote from: Zbig on April 04, 2016, 04:59:33 pmAh, another person that deliberately distorts the context in order to (fail to) make a point. Here it is again: "Stunning. In case you hadn't noticed, capacitance and charge are completely different concepts, and are measured in different units - Farads and Coulombs."Ignorance of suchbasicconcepts should alert people to question whether yourotherpoints have any validity.QuoteMy principal experience is in aircraft that can and do fly higher than commercial airliners, are a damn sight prettier and more "sexy", andmuchmore fun. Trivial examples:, and a 747 pilot having fun on his day offNotice the cockpit in the latter. The rectangular screen is a moving map and flight management computer; a much better tool forthatjob than the slide rule (not calculator) alternatives.QuoteNot dumb. Ignorant, and dogmatically sure that your own limited experience is generally applicable to other circumstances.QuoteDoh! Quite right!QuoteYet again you don't read what I wrote, in order to make invalid strawman agruments. Since I have already repeated it once (i.e. written ittwicebefore your posting, here it isagain: "To make sure it can't be missed again: "Of course digital readouts have different advantages.""

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 06:52:32 pm
content: Quote from: tautech on April 04, 2016, 06:06:04 pmPrecisely. It is all about knowing the strengths and limitations of each tool.I wish all those confidently making statements would understand that.

author: XynxNet
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 07:12:54 pm
content: Quote from: Hobby73 on April 03, 2016, 11:40:51 pmIn basic physics education analog meters are preferred.You have no problems with non significant digits. It is more obvious to pupils that every measurement has an error margin.It is easier to understand how an analog meter works.Instrument specific error types are easier to understand.The necessity to convert the scale to get your measurement has a positiv effect on training to convert units.You don't need batteries for A and V measurements.In my experience education grade analogue meters can take more abuse than digital meters of a similiar price range. Be aware that abuse from a pupil is usually of a different kind than abuse from an engineer.Measurement ranges and fuse ratings of education grade analogue meters are often more appropriate for basics physics experiments than those of cheap non-autorange digital meters.With the last two points, keep in mind that schools often don't have the budget to buy top of the line digital meters.

author: G0HZU
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 07:47:37 pm
content: QuoteAs we all know, digital display technology is improving all the time in lots of ways so I can't think of many cases that still favour analogue meters but here's a few.I know this has already been mentioned several times already, but an old school analogue meter needs no power source to read voltage and current. So I would prefer to pack an old/cheap/disposable 20k/V analogue meter in my car for VI troubleshooting. I would also expect a typical (cheap/disposable) DMM LCD to have display issues at cold temperatures.Not my area of expertise but gas pressure is one area that still appears to be dominated by analogue meters. eg gas cylinder meters for divers or for other cylinders. Also fire extinguisher displays tend to be analogue. There may be digital alternatives but I don't think you need precision here. You just want a basic and reliable system that can work for long periods of time with zero maintenance. Just tap the dial and read the needle position?There may be other cases where the zero maintenance argument applies too. eg temperature or strain gauges for certain critical applications.The basic and cheap SWR and power meters used for CB/ham radio are another example where analogue still has the advantage in terms of not needing batteries. It usually doesn't need accuracy in the display technology either because the underlying uncertainty of the RF sensing system is far greater than the uncertainty of the analogue dial itself.There may be situations where you don't want digital logic causing noise pickup and an analogue display would be preferred?So I think the analogue display still has some merit in some areas?At home or at work I rarely use analogue meters for electronics based stuff even though I still have quite a few of them. I do like the analogue dB scale on my old Racal 9300 rms meter and my old HP431C power meter but these are only really at their best when tuning/peaking things.I usually connect a DVM to the 'recorder' BNC connector at the back if I need to get better quality readings than the analogue display can offer .

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 08:21:33 pm
content: Quote from: G0HZU on April 04, 2016, 07:47:37 pmI don't think it's about maintenance, I think it's more about "doesn't need batteries".

author: G0HZU
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 08:33:33 pm
content: QuoteYes, that's basically what I was trying to sayMonitoring and physically replacing batteries that power the digital display would be the maintenance I was referring to.

author: G0HZU
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 08:59:45 pm
content: I had a bit of a rummage on my TE shelves and I could only find these items that have an analogue display:Altai YN360 multimeter 20k/V. I bought this in the 1980s when I was a student.Racal 9300 true rms RF voltmeter (made in the 1980s)Racal 9008M Modulation Meter (made in the 1980s)HP431C RF Power Meter (made in the 1960s)HP432A RF Power Meter (made since the 1970s)Welz Ham radio power meter (cheapo basic power/SWR meter from 2-145MHz, Made in the 1990s?)HP8405A Vector Voltmeter 1-1000MHz (made in the 1960s)Four of my bench supplies have analogue displays for V and I although I now only use these (25-35year old?) supplies when I need a PSU away from my main workroom.All of my 'daily use' bench PSUs have digital display.You can still buy old school analogue multimeters cheaply here in the UK. Not sure I like the colour though!http://www.maplin.co.uk/p/mt-2017-large-analogue-multimeter-n60lk?cmpid=ppc&gclid=Cj0KEQjwoYi4BRDF_PHHu6rI7NMBEiQAKZ-JuAnZe-dxNrso3am2BGUmu5Zvdmi4crJunkA3STmg1AsaAsPR8P8HAQ

author: TheSteve
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 09:13:41 pm
content: I was peaking the transmitter stage in a radio last year. I had two different service monitors I could use at the time - an IFRS 1200S or a General Dynamics R8000. The IFR had an analog meter movement that gave instant response and worked great. The power meter in the R8000 was stupid slow even though it is a current(and very expensive) product. So an analog meter movement can be useful, but I'd still prefer digital assuming it is designed well.

author: G0HZU
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 09:30:04 pm
content: I couldn't resist reading the blurb about the big green analogue multimeter from maplin here:http://www.maplin.co.uk/p/mt-2017-large-analogue-multimeter-n60lk?cmpid=ppc&gclid=Cj0KEQjwoYi4BRDF_PHHu6rI7NMBEiQAKZ-JuAnZe-dxNrso3am2BGUmu5Zvdmi4crJunkA3STmg1AsaAsPR8P8HAQQuoteTake a bitch slap from the MT-2017 all you HP 3458A owners! It says it in black and white on the Maplin website so it 'must' be true

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 04, 2016, 10:39:07 pm
content: Quote from: wilfred on April 04, 2016, 02:18:43 amHow many people wear wrist watches these days?And even an analogue display watch is no longer really analogue. It has a quartz oscillator and digital divider with some digital compensation to improve the accuracy. True analogue watches went out of fashion many decades ago.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 05, 2016, 01:54:16 am
content: Quote from: wilfred on April 04, 2016, 02:18:43 amThis.I don't recall what issue it was.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: April 05, 2016, 01:54:59 am
content: Quote from: Hero999 on April 04, 2016, 10:39:07 pmI freak out if I leave the house without my watch.

author: Zero999
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2016, 12:20:38 pm
content: Quote from: wilfred on April 04, 2016, 10:55:24 pmYes, you are correct and if you look at the speedometer on a car's dashboard, it has a analogue display but the electronics are digital.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2016, 01:31:00 pm
content: Quote from: Hero999 on April 05, 2016, 12:20:38 pmSigh. The question is about analoguemeters(e.g. moving needles, or spots of light etc) vs digitalmeters(e.g. LEDs in the shape of numbers "1.2345", or dekatrons etc). The discussion isnotabout what isdrivingthe meter. Hence your point, while correct, is irrelevant to the discussion and is (deliberately?) obtuse and confusing.If you really want to go down your unhelpful path, why don't you just skip to the logical endpoint that "all electronics is digital, in units of one electron (or one photon)".

author: andy2000
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2016, 02:34:15 pm
content: I still prefer an analog meter for general continuity / short checks and basic semiconductor junction tests. It's quicker to interpret than at a glance and is less effected by a tiny residual charge on caps.One of my favorite pieces of test equipment is the hp 428b clip on DC milliammeter. There's no breaking the circuit and you can safely use it on high voltages as long as the wire is adequately insulated and will fit through the probe. I think it was the last piece of tube equipment hp made.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2016, 05:25:23 pm
content: Quote from: maplin

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2016, 05:34:59 pm
content: Quote from: MrSlack on April 04, 2016, 03:11:38 pmAll the hundreds of thread on here about how input protection is important? They apply.Quote from: Smith on April 04, 2016, 04:52:30 pmIf a digital meter is showing an RMS value then set to AC mode, in which case the reading is correct.If you were expecting a DC current the DMM should be set to DC mode, in which case you'll see a fluctuation on the numbers (anything slow enough to move an analog meter 100% of scale can't be much more than 1Hz). A decent multimeter will also have a bar graph where fluctuations are visible.Looks like the phrase "confidence in the reading" rears its head again. This is why people pay more for a decent meter.Sure, you foundonecase where an analog meter caught an operator error but a good DMM is far superior to an analog meter in general use.

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2016, 05:40:33 pm
content: Quote from: Zbig on April 04, 2016, 04:59:33 pmMightbe true...ifyou're measuring several things that are supposed to give the same reading (eg. a line of identical resistors). After you see a couple of readings on an analog meter you sort of get an idea of how the needle is supposed to move for that value of resistor. The rest of the readings will be quite fast.

author: mzacharias
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2016, 06:58:48 pm
content: I have noticed some analog movements are over-damped (slow) and seem to require tapping the meter face to get a good final reading. Others are faster but overshoot and require at least two or three "cycles" to settle down. A good taut-band seems to go right to the desired final reading quickly and with practically no over-or-undershoot. My Bach-Simpson 635 is really good like this. I think my 270 was also - but it's packed away right now and I'm not positive...

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2016, 07:31:45 pm
content: Quote from: Fungus on April 05, 2016, 05:40:33 pmPrecisely. Also works for basic continuity/short/open checks as well.Clearly you are someone that has actuallyusedandunderstoodsuch toolsUnlike the other people that make dogmatic pronouncements.

author: retrolefty
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2016, 08:07:15 pm
content: Well the built-in analog meter movement on my Kenwood Hybrid TS-520S is the best instrument to tune up the vacuum tube final amplifier. QUICK peaking, dipping, and loading to required output power is required rather then absolute digital numbers.If you agree, cool. If not, then you can just get off my lawn.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 05, 2016, 08:45:37 pm
content: Lots of answers here that have little to do with analog/digital display. There is one place where I believe a properly designed analog display system is superior to digital. Regardless of whether the display is implemented with old fashioned moving coil meters, solenoid flipped digital panels, 7-segment LED displays or some flat planel programmed for display. It has been mentioned here already. That is display of multiple operating parameters of some large system, be it an aircraft, power plant or whatever. A properly designed analog display system will have all the pointers at the same angle (usually vertical) at the nominal operating point. Makes a quick scan for nominal operation easy, even for an inexperienced operator. And even in this case, some will prefer a digital display with alarm points that changes display color or some other indicator of off nominal operation.There is some advantage to the old moving coil VOMs. Their extremely simple construction means that they are more likely to still be operating after 25 or 50 years than most of the sophisticated DVMs of today. Between dried capacitors, various things that go wrong in plastic IC packages, generally weak interconnects to LCD displays and other things these new digital things will not be fueling arguments between future engineers about the new technology vs the ones the old guys grew up with.

author: vk6zgo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2016, 01:26:41 am
content: Quote from: tggzzz on April 05, 2016, 01:31:00 pmThis is what I tried to point out---there are many "rendered" displays which look like an analog meter face,with the "guts" being digital.Equally there are displays driven by analog circuitry (or often mechanisms) which display in the form of numbers.(old type vehicle odometers/trip meters,hour meters,etc).The discussion should really be on the pros & cons of "pointer type displays" & "numeric displays".''Bar graph" displays are really a special case of the former,with all its disadvantages & few of its advantages.And,yes,they can be driven by digital or analog electronics,or even mechanically ---we just see the display!I haven't used an analog multimeter for decades,but in the main,I have replaced it with an Oscilloscope,rather than a DMM.Most of the adjustments that are easy to do with an analog meter are equally easy with a 'scope,except of course where the monitored variable is current.As various people have pointed out,in many cases (& in the overwhelming majority when troubleshooting) great precision is not necessary---most circuitry doesn't really care if your "5volt" rail is 4.8v or 5.2v.If you need greater precision ,just grab the DMM.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2016, 08:36:29 am
content: Quote from: mzacharias on April 05, 2016, 06:58:48 pmIt's very likely the quality of the movement has the most influence and how well it's sealed from contaminants.Google for AVO service manuals and you'll see the trouble they insist you go to to prevent dust getting into a movement when serviced to ensure trouble free operation.Much like a POS display on a modern instrument makes it a drag to work with so it is a for poor movement in a analogue meter, whatever it may measure.

author: retrolefty
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2016, 11:54:24 am
content: Quote from: tautech on April 06, 2016, 08:36:29 amI thought "sticking needle" symptom was caused by static charge building on the plastic meter face, not anything to do with the basic meter movement?

author: Gyro
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2016, 12:09:42 pm
content: All pivots (bearings), no matter how good, have some degree of stiction, tapping rattles the pivots slightly and allows the needle to settle more accurately. The better the movement the less stiction, harder pivot points and jewels. Taut band meters don't suffer this problem because there are no sliding surfaces.Static buildup tends to cause movements to not settle to zero or 'hover' near charged areas, affecting their linearity. Fabric conditioner makes a useful 'discharging cream' for plastic faces.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2016, 03:08:02 pm
content: After much thought the easiest way I can say it. Analog is better for monitoring, digital is better for measuring. Totally independent of how the display is generated.

author: RiverTown
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2016, 03:41:20 pm
content: Quote from: Zbig on April 04, 2016, 04:59:33 pmI can't view yout picture, but there is a picture, from the internet, of the Bombardiers CRJ-900ER NG (CL-600-2D24) cockpit while landing.http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/photos/8/3/8/1855838.jpgThere are at least 9 analog displays...

author: sync
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2016, 03:48:33 pm
content: Quote from: RiverTown on April 06, 2016, 03:41:20 pmBut they don't have a scale. The value is digital displayed.

author: rdl
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2016, 04:56:13 pm
content: When a signal tends to be relatively steady and its actual value needs to known, digital displays are better.When a signal tends to vary and you need to know how it is acting or trending, analog displays are better.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2016, 04:58:44 pm
content: Quote from: sync on April 06, 2016, 03:48:33 pmGood luck trying to fly an aircraft with an artificial horizon where the angle is displayed only in digits. Make sure you have made your will before you attempt it.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2016, 05:05:55 pm
content: Quote from: sync on April 06, 2016, 03:48:33 pmThey don't need a scale. It is sufficient to know that "vertical is good", "a bit left is OK", "far left needs correction".OTOH seeing "318.65" probablyisn'thelpful, because it will take time you don't have to remember whether 300 is good, 400 is good, 500 is better etc.Now repeat that for all indicators.And make sure you scan them all once a minute.And scan them again when an alarm is sounding, to find out which is/are indicating the problems.By the time you have done all that you are probably inside a lawn dart or barbecue.

author: sync
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2016, 05:16:24 pm
content: Quote from: tggzzz on April 06, 2016, 04:58:44 pmI talking about the displays in the middle which shows scalar values. The artificial horizon is a complex instrument and it's not comparable with an analog meter.

author: rdl
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2016, 05:51:41 pm
content: I have no idea what those gauges are displaying and I can't even read the numbers actually, but the instant I looked at it I knew all was good.Quote from: sync on April 06, 2016, 05:16:24 pm

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2016, 06:34:23 pm
content: Quote from: sync on April 06, 2016, 05:16:24 pmNonsense.The artificial horizon is a very simple instrument; it shows two angles, and that is all. Good luck trying to interpret a roll angle of 33 degrees, no 38 degrees, no 48 degrees.

author: Hobby73
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2016, 07:02:18 pm
content: This is the OP ... thanks for all the spirited replies to my question. On reflection, I was dead wrong about characterizing an analog meter as a legacy visualization format, as it's clearly the best choice for many use cases as you've provided examples for.

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 06, 2016, 08:03:05 pm
content: Quote from: Hobby73 on April 06, 2016, 07:02:18 pmSomeone that listens, thinks, learns and changes their mind. Good to have you on the forum

author: gb243
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 13, 2016, 07:00:12 am
content: After reading posts in this thread I have ordered a new analogue multi meter. I have some circuits to 'tune for smoke' and remember doing so using both hands. One adjusts a trimmer for a local peak whilst the other hand sweeps back and forward to find if the peak is global or local. Rather like tuning a tube transmitter final. Doing this with an analogue meter is simplicity itself and I could do this quickly. Tuning for peak with a digital meter would take ages if not actually be impossible.I have my Mastech and Fluke DMMs but whilst new analogue meters are still available I brought one. My resolution of not buying more test dear has yet again been broken.

author: woodchips
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2016, 11:02:29 am
content: An interesting question with many replies, just what a forum is for.I think that two points have been missed.Firstly, analogue meters were designed in the days when the manufacturer assumed that the person reading it actually wanted to see what value it indicated. So they provided a contrasting colour to the pointer and the scale, so they could be easily distinguished, at a glance, when not square on to the meter, in poor lighting. Now look at your LCD digital meter, grey on grey, limited viewing angle, not illuminated. Yes, you can get backlit ones but if you want a battery life it has to be turned off. My digital meters are all mains powered, with nice bright, easily viewable LED displays. Work a treat.Secondly beware if measuring high frequency oscillators such as HV inverters, they can have a nastly habit of crisping digital meters. Presumably the leakage capacitance bypasses the series dropper resistors and blows the electronics up. No such problem with an analogue meter.Slight digression, but when the BBC TV centre closed I bought a pile of the test equipment, and reading the manuals for items such as the 1781 and the WFM700 does indicate the difference between an analogue presentation and a digital, numerical, one.

author: Tepe
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2016, 12:04:08 pm
content: Quote from: tggzzz on April 04, 2016, 06:50:01 pmThis looks sexier to me:

author: tggzzz
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2016, 01:12:22 pm
content: Quote from: Tepe on April 14, 2016, 12:04:08 pmI'm more interested indoingthanlooking. And gliding is more extreme than most powered flying, in terms of height, G forces, acceleration, freedom, along ridges, and much moreOTOH, if merely looking is sufficient, thenhttps://www.museumofflight.org/aircraft/perlan-gliderhttp://www.whiteplanes.com/images/gliders/gliders42.jpghttp://flyinglessons.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/glider-flight-%C2%A9-Aleksander-Markin-2012.jpglooks much more sexy thanhttps://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/13/SAAF-Gripen-001.jpg

author: Rerouter
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: April 14, 2016, 01:41:12 pm
content: There are 3 main types of analog movements from my background in automotive instrumentation,first is a spring balanced galvanometer, its a coil, a counterweight and a hairspring to pull it back to zero with a tiny amount of force, this hairspring also dampens the meters response, general motion range is 270 degrees, but you can get to about 330 degrees if you really had to push it, if the bearing on the shaft are made out of quality material they can be surprisingly accurate, with almost no hysteresis, The cheaper mass produced ones will have no balance adjust on the middle of the shaft to fine tune the counter weight, and tend to use plastic bearings, in there use case they last and last, but they have about 1 degree of hysteresis (think holden VS commodore speedometer, yes even the police model)Next up is a cross coil movement, these tend to be between 60 and 110 degrees of deflection, there very fast, to respond, with a deflection time under 0.5 seconds, its literally 2 coild crossed at an angle, older ones where not perpendicular, modern ones are, there is generally no hairspring and rely on the force applied to hold it firm, while the limited deflection range limits the amount of gravity it has to deflect against, in reality tilting them on there side on most will cause a reading change, its a reference coil and a signal coil, adjusting the ratio of currents changes the deflection, its non linear on mostThird and final is a sin / cos meter movement, these are similar to the cross coil, but are not range limited, and the winding are generally tilted over being straight up and down, these are the most common on modern dashes, some have hairsprings but most do not, these have an unlimited deflection range as you can spin them as many rotations as you please, there main downside is they are bistable, if you rotate the pointer 180 degrees from its current position it will remain and track from that position, and again rely on the large power being driven in to fight gravity, so they have a tendancy to read low at lower speeds, and higher at higher speeds, this is part of the reason why so many cars have expanded scales, if they had 110kmph at the dead end of the scale the movement would end up sitting closer to 118 at the far end, while its pointed dead up its pretty on the mark,My favorite is the galvanometer type, as most you can easily tweak to be extremely linear and accurate, not to mention is the only type that tries to compensate for balancing issues, so that your speedometer doesn't gain 5kmph just by being on an incline,Both digital and analog meters have there place, it comes down to how your using it, and to previous posts, most analog meter drivers until about 2002 where analog frequency to current converters, following the old KISS principle, for most of those it was cranking on flat batteries of mechanical issues that led them to needing repairs,

author: sandos
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: April 15, 2016, 11:25:58 am
content: Quote from: Tepe on April 14, 2016, 12:04:08 pmNote the analog meters on the Gripen display!You can actually get much bigger views of these analog "steam gauges" on the displays if you want to. Also interesting: where are the backup instruments? Iv'e flown both A/B and C/D Gripen simulators and I had a really, really hard time to understand how they could remove the backup, analog instruments in C/D.... Turns out they have made the digital ditos as, or even more, redundant though, only it might not seem that way.

author: Tepe
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: April 17, 2016, 08:15:56 pm
content: Quote from: sandos on April 15, 2016, 11:25:58 amWithout the parallax issues

author: Vtile
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2017, 08:08:52 pm
content: Ok. This is old.. I skipped the page 2 and 3 when the aircraft display discussion started, sorry if I skipped something interesting or I'm repeating already said stuff.I have both, while I haven't any voltnut ones in digital or analog (old Fluke and Megger are crown jewels in build quality).I have three with analog meter movement, two of them are chopper FET input models (multitesters, FETVOM or alike) and handfull of 3½ digit DMMs in variety of grade. I have been thingking this same question in the past and I actually did buy my first anolog just to see what they were all about (then voltnuttery did bite a bit when I discovered the FET choppers.. Next stop is propably analog electrometer). I come to conclution that the analog meter in jobs that do not need extreme measurement spectrum unlike measuring 1mV in 100 volts range, they indeed are more expressive if the scale is good and big enough.In one evening when I were sorting/pairing my 0.1% resistors with bridge and a one of those choppers and chasing down all temp and ghost errors of the setup (with 10x instrumentation amplifier my meter would be on 5nV per scalemark and hundrets of picovolts eyeballing). This subject did jump to my head again, why the needle movement is so expressive. I finally did arrive to conclusion during that evening that it is not the 0..100% movement through the scale, but the actual change of the angle of the needle combined to that scaled movement that makes the difference. It is like looking throuh the straight line of vertical poles and you just notice the ones that aren't on line. While bargraph might show fluctuation they are still one dimensional, while needle with changing angle have more than one, like polar/vector graph.

author: rstofer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2017, 08:40:45 pm
content: Analog done right:http://www.avsim.com/pages/0808/Justflight/5-1%20XJ824%20Instrument%20Panel.jpgYou can mount analog meters such that 'nominal' has the needle straight up. Often you don't care about the absolute value, 'about' is all you need. It may also be all you have time to process.

author: Vtile
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2017, 08:48:44 pm
content: Damn flying contraptions.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2017, 08:55:08 pm
content: Old thread, but one advantage of analog meters that was overlooked last time is that they don't require a power supply. I have 50 year old meters that can still measure voltage and current without any maintenance. (I will grant that the ohms measurements don't work).I can't count the number of times I have pulled a digital meter out of the bag and it was useless because the battery was dead and I didn't have a spare at hand. It is worst on meters that have a push button on/off with no shut-down timer. Second worst on meters with a slide switch or rotary dial for power with no shut down timer.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2017, 09:08:52 pm
content: That is more like analog DMMs.I have a bunch of power supplies with analog meters and I'd really like to exchange those with accurate digital meters. After reading this thread (partly) it seems a bar graph might be a good idea as well.

author: rstofer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2017, 09:57:38 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on January 20, 2017, 09:08:52 pmFor several decades, the output from analog computers was displayed on a zero-center voltmeter and/or strip chart recorder.I am in the process of using a couple of Adafruit multicolor bar graph displays to produce the same kind of output. Zero volts is center and the bar will stack up or down as a function of voltage. I really think the analog nature of the display will be a lot more intuitive.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2017, 10:25:10 pm
content: Quote from: wilfred on January 20, 2017, 10:18:45 pmYou wouldn't say that if you ever worked on a battery powered gadget and used a power supply like the Agilent 66311B. It is capable of showing uA so you don't need another DMM to get an accurate current reading. I kinda got hooked onto that.

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2017, 10:36:33 pm
content: I prefer to have both around because in some situations movement of the meter deflection being movement will sometimes attract my attention more than the changing of digits. Also, sometimes you need to "tweak" something for highest or lowest value. Its not so frequently that this distinction is there so I usually use my UT-61e but once in awhile I find myself reaching for my analog VOM. I just like having the analog as an alternative.

author: Macbeth
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 20, 2017, 10:41:54 pm
content: The Rigol DP832 is a popular PSU around these parts. I would love to know if anyone has found the "analog" dial display has been useful at all vs the regular classic 3 column DP832 display? It even has a dedicated button for the useless dials.ETA: I could only find the "Hello Kitty" DP832A version of the dials on google image search. The regular DP832 version is the same but in monochrome.

author: PA4TIM
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: January 21, 2017, 01:24:35 am
content: I love to play with my analog meters. Most are far from precise but I have 3 that are very good. A beautifull small Pantec Dolimiti I got from a good friend complete with original probes and box. I had to repair it but the result is a meter that is spot on all over the scale. With the mirrored scale I can read it with a very good resolution.The second an old Philips PM2502, almost perfect, except resistance measurement. And a beautiful Simpson 260 in original leather carry-case. Not as good as the Pantec but it comes close.Besides these I have much more analog meters, passive, active, FETs, tubes, electrometers etcSometimes I use them while repairing old instruments of my own and just for fun. But after such a session I am grateful to have DMMs.- Analog meters are often not very accurate- The load your DUT much more as the avarage DMM- They are very slow compared to the 2 DMM's I use daily (Keithley 2000 and a U1252A from Agilent- No autorange- They only do I, V, R. Some can do C and L but you then need an external voltage sourcre. I have one that has a (fast) continuity beeper.- some have strange spaced scales that are very hard to read unless you use them daily. I have seen a meter that has a range but no scale for that. You have to multiply the reading by 2.- some use hard to find batteries.- Often the reading changes if you change the orientation- Static displays- No holdAvantages- often beautiful- I have some meters that have a resettable fuse. (like the Pantec and my AVO8's)I would love to have an accurate active analog+digital meter that has a Diode testfunction, continuity beeper (with ohm reading and led indication). TRMS, illuminated scale, capacitance and fast with a hold function. Also with autorange-

author: lordvader88
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 21, 2017, 04:45:32 am
content: I have a cheap and basic AMM from the 90s, and the basic design is probably from? IDK the 50s/60s ? or older if u swapped its transistor for a tube, I think it only has 1-2 transistors, probably for the continuity beeper.I've sort of foolishly left the 9V and 1.5V batteries in it for years and hardly ever used it, and yet they still work fine and never corroded up the thing yet.