Recommendation for layout software? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / beginners

author: The Magic Rabbit
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 20, 2015, 03:22:15 pm
content: I keep seeing Eagle CAD mentioned, but are there any other good ones? I want to be able to draw my schematic and magically convert it to a PCB that can be tweaked as needed, then saved in a vector format (WMF, illustrator, etc.) - not very complex or large designs.Sent from my XT1039 using Tapatalk

author: radioFlash
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 20, 2015, 04:17:12 pm
content: Eagle, Diptrace, and Kicad are the ones people most often mention as good "free" options. There is no software that will magically create a PCB for you. Autorouters are pretty much useless. If you create a PCB for a PCB house to manufacture, they will expect files in Gerber format, not WMF or Illustrator, which all PCB software can create. If you want to share your design, or print it out yourself for making at home, you need to export to a PDF and print at 1:1 scale.Check out the forum bord for this topic:https://www.eevblog.com/forum/eda/

author: michaeliv
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 20, 2015, 06:53:16 pm
content: Quote from: radioFlash on September 20, 2015, 04:17:12 pmWhy are autorouters useless ? For simple circuits why does it matter that the routing is not optimal ?Auto-placers on the other hand truly are useless, so if you want to go directly from schematic to PCB you would get a terrible / inefficient layout.If you place your components well, good auto-routers can do a decent job.

author: The Magic Rabbit
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2015, 01:11:05 am
content: I need a vector format because I'm cutting the mask using a vinyl cutting system. I doubt SignPal takes Gerber files as they're very application specific, and would need converting to vector anyway. I could import a PDF providing its vector data embedded and not bitmap.Sent from my XT1039 using Tapatalk

author: rx8pilot
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2015, 01:20:24 am
content: Quote from: The Magic Rabbit on September 20, 2015, 03:22:15 pmMagically? It takes work, talent, and experience to layout a working PCB.Quote from: The Magic Rabbit on September 21, 2015, 01:11:05 amVinyl cutter? Why the heck would you consider PCB layout software to cut vinyl? What in the world are you trying to do?

author: The Magic Rabbit
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2015, 01:22:35 am
content: Vinyl cut the etch resist mask, stick on to copper clad board, etch, ta-da!Sent from my XT1039 using Tapatalk

author: dadler
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: September 21, 2015, 02:37:04 am
content: We bought a commercial vinyl plotter to make vinyl decals for my old business.It came with a photoshop plugin that could convert raster images to vector data for the plotter. I imagine there is something similar available for whatever system you are using.In that case, you should be able to use pretty much any EDA software.I use EAGLE myself because there are a lot of part libraries for it, and it runs natively on MacOS.You get used to its design quirks. It's rough around the edges, but there is immense community support for the product. For example, Adafruit and SparkFun use it to layout their boards.Plan to route manually, or at least use the follow-me style manual routing. Autorouters are only useful for signals that are unimportant, and these are the ones that are easy to route by hand anyways.If you intend to make high-end FPGA/DDR3 laden boards, you will want something like Altium. Get your wallet ready.

author: MarkF
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2015, 05:15:54 am
content: I'm currently working on my first PCB. I played with Eagle for a short period and just tried Diptrace. I found Diptrace a little easier to learn and use. Also, my understanding is that Diptrace can import Eagle libraries but I've not tried it.Good luck on your project.

author: picandmix
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2015, 09:06:30 am
content: Not heard of the Vinyl method and as EVB149 says , I would wonder how thinner tracks could be cut or transfered.Probably the most popular 'beginner' method is the toner transfer / iron on method where you laser print your mask and using a domestic clothes iron, you literally iron the toner onto the pcb, can be very effective, though a bit of practice needed.The other popular, but a bit more complex way, is to make or buy a small led or tube uv unit and use pre-sensitized pcbs.Both have loads of web tutorials and ytube to guide you.

author: The Magic Rabbit
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2015, 01:10:49 pm
content: I think the main reason vinyl isn't used may simply be that not many people have £1600 worth of high resolution cutter at their disposal. I can't imagine it weighs be very easy for complex circuits, but it boasts a 0.025mm accuracy. The harder part is adjusting for the turning radius of the blade, but PCB tracks don't tend to turn at very tight angles. That's well beyond the natural distortion of the vinyl though, so experimentation is needed. It might be if I try any very tight tracks that I need the higher precision blade.You don't cut the backing material, so once cut you just weed away any bits you don't want. Adhesion on a polymeric vinyl is very good, but I won't know until I've tried it. Polymeric vinyl is pretty acid resistant too. On since surfaces you need to practically dissolve it with acetone to remove it.Positioning is easy. You have clear positioning tape for that to lift the design from the backing paper in one piece and move to wherever it's needed.Fingers crossed!Sent from my XT1039 using Tapatalk

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2015, 10:33:32 pm
content: Good luck on your experiment, but I suspect you will end up using your vinyl cutter for the other projects you bought it for, and either sending your designs out for fab or using a more traditional approach. If you are using modern surface mounted chips the line spacing will challenge the cutter. Even if using older through whole components, the amount of weeding will be truly stunning. (Think of the two roughly 0.025 holes on each end of each simple component, and the 8 to 40 holes associated with each dip).

author: The Magic Rabbit
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 21, 2015, 10:58:52 pm
content: Well if anyone wants any car decals, wall art, window graphics etc. I'm your guy!I am very lucky because I got the cutter for nothing and reconditioned it. I plan to setup a small home business. Should be fun!Sent from my XT1039 using Tapatalk

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: September 22, 2015, 03:05:14 am
content: The model airplane community also seems to be a good market for cut vinyl. I'm sure there are others.

author: The Magic Rabbit
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: September 22, 2015, 09:56:04 am
content: I hadn't even considered that, thank you!Sent from my XT1039 using Tapatalk