need help to repair stairhouse-light - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / repair

author: Leland_Gaunt
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 21, 2024, 09:43:57 pm
content: hello Gentlemen.Our landlord doesnt seem to be in a hurry to repair or lights in the stairwayhouse. The light works, but it doesnt go off anymore, like it did after a few minutes. So now, all bulbds are turned out by hand, in the evening we turn in 1 or 2 bulbs. So they burn all night sometimes. I can solder, i have a multimeter and now how to measure, i just never had any contact with these installations. That copperspool seems to be responsible for auto-shut off. theres a black plastic-slider in front of it, i already tried to move it to different positions, doesnt do anything. Under the spool it almost looks like theres something going on with air-pressure or resistance. Looks kind of old tech.The circle is alway on. Can somebody tell me what to do please?

author: Poroit
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: December 22, 2024, 05:11:42 am
content: G'day Leland_Gaunt,Isolate the power and replace that old Pneumatic Switch with a new one of your choice.https://www.gordonmacs.com.au/time-delay-switch-pneumatic-10a-30s-20min-electric~31317You may need a wall box to projection mount it.One of your Electrical Wholesalers should be able to assist with all the gear you need but they may also try and push you towards using a Licensed Electrician

author: amyk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 22, 2024, 06:11:28 am
content: Pneumatic delay switch, the coil pulls the piston up to close the contacts, and then it descends by exhausting air via an adjustable bleed orifice (looks like the red part on the bottom of the cylinder) until it opens the contacts again. Perhaps the piston is stuck or the orifice is dirty.Whoever decided to use it as a convenient mounting point for cable ties may have also affected its operation...

author: Whales
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 22, 2024, 07:37:12 am
content: To be clear:- amyk is describing what you already have- poroit is describing and linking to an alternate that you install somewhere else (on a wall where people can push it).

author: Analog Kid
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 22, 2024, 08:10:26 am
content: Aren't there electronic (i.e., non-mechanical) delay switches that do the same function but won't get fouled up?Just guessing here, but I'd be surprised if something like thatwasn'tavailable.

author: Ian.M
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: December 22, 2024, 08:13:32 am
content: Yes, you wouldn't want a manual dashpot switch to replace a dashpot relay. *ALL* the momentary switches would need to be replaced with dashpot switches vs simply replacing the time delay relay. Nowadays an electronic time delay relay would be the best choice, but that would need both Line and Neutral from the panel to power the time delay circuit. As there are only three wires, and two of them must be to the momentary switches and the load (lights), you cant simply drop in a modern off delay relay. Assuming you cant find an exact equivalent, get an electrician to install a DIN mount electronic off delay timer in the panel . . .

author: bastl_r
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: December 22, 2024, 09:46:51 am
content: HiInstead this Mercury containing relays you need a Eltako time relays. Eltako is a, in germany, wellknown brand.This relaiys you can mount beside circuitbreakers, the housing.It cost roundabout 50€.Regards

author: Wollvieh
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: December 25, 2024, 10:15:02 pm
content: There are two ways how lights and pushbuttons can be wired, with 3 and 4 wires (Drei/Vierleiter-Schaltung, you'll find loads of schematics with that). 3 is the older one and most likely used in this case. Some Treppenlichtzeitschalter-relays can do both, some modern ones only 4 wires. You will be stuck with that what you find in your staircase.According to the photos there is enough space for a modern DIN-mount relay in the switchbox. But it takes a little bit of careful examination how many wires you have and which wire does what to not blow up the whole thing.

author: Leland_Gaunt
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 09, 2025, 02:49:42 pm
content: well thanks...but before i buy something, is there no way to test if maybe it isnt even broken? The door to this thing is open and everybody can play or mess with the buttons. I tried the lower red button, i cant push or pull it out, it can be turned with a "click"..but i cant see anything happen.what could i do to chekc if its still workinh?

author: Roehrenonkel
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 09, 2025, 04:49:29 pm
content: Hi Leland_Gaunt,...try the black knob.It should have two or three positions"Allways on/Auto" or "Allways on/Auto/Off"If that doesn't work replace it with an "Eltako".It looks old and beat-up and lost the cover.Time to replace it anyway.Good luck

author: Poroit
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: January 11, 2025, 09:37:18 am
content: Can you describe how this device operated before it failed.Do residents push the Red Button or rotate the Black Switch to activate the lights?

author: Leland_Gaunt
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: January 31, 2025, 05:50:20 pm
content: sorry for not answering so long.No, the residents are not supposed to touch these things of. they are behind a locked door. We have regular light switches like everybody else...ours just dont work the 2nd winter now

author: Poroit
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 01, 2025, 06:50:43 am
content: Thank you for clarifying the operation.Your existing system is probably wired as per the attached and could be replaced as other members have already suggested.Do you feel confident enough to SAFEFULLY try and identify the three existing wires?Depending on your experience......If you wanted to try repairing...I would remove the existing unit and examine/bench test it.

author: Leland_Gaunt
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: February 03, 2025, 01:39:26 pm
content: well i feel confident to identify the wires, sure and attach them to a new device...just im not gonna pay 100 bucks out of my pocket. Its the landlords job. If it was 20 eu, i would already have ordered one.I dont think i can find out what wrong with the old one. If already spent an hour just staring at it^^...I think it seems to be a mechanical problem, not any broken circui or components. Its always on, it just doesnt go off automatically anymore.

author: Roehrenonkel
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 03, 2025, 04:28:43 pm
content: Quote from: Roehrenonkel on January 09, 2025, 04:49:29 pm??

author: Poroit
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: February 04, 2025, 06:44:56 am
content: Staring at it won't fix it.Isolate the power and pull it off the wall and have a look behind it.Is there a relay there with contacts welded together?Is there a dead spider or cockroach stopping it from working?Is that mechanical linkage broken?Find out what the Black Knob and Red Push Button operate.Then let the forum members know what you have found.

author: Wollvieh
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: February 07, 2025, 08:12:28 pm
content: Quote from: Roehrenonkel on February 03, 2025, 04:28:43 pmI guess PISA. Section text comprehension.He shouldn't ask questions if he doesn't care about the answers.