Might get a Hakko FX-888D tomorrow, thinking about what additional tips to get - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / beginners

author: Cyber Akuma
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: July 15, 2022, 07:23:20 am
content: I noticed that the Hakko FX-888D seems to be reduced to $90 at Microcenter, and I am going there tomorrow so there is a high chance I will buy it since all my other soldering irons are cheap $5-20 ones with no controls or temperature regulation.I figured the tip it comes with will be enough for things like soldering wires together, or wires to through-holes, dip packages, header pins, to the through-holes or pads of Arduino devices, etc. But some of the projects I want to do also involve soldering thinner wires to the pins of SMD ICs or to tiny SMD ceramic capacitors. And for this one I figured I would need a different tip to make it easier (Especially since past attempts to solder to SMD capacitor with larger soldering irons resulted in me just melting the capacitor off the board and frying it on the iron).When I tried looking up the different tips however (From what I understand the FX-888D uses "T18" tips) there were several dozen, and I have no idea which one to go with. Can anyone give me some advice on what tips to get? Microcenter seems to also have several tips in the $5-8 range:https://www.microcenter.com/search/search_results.aspx?N=&cat=&Ntt=t18+soldering&searchButton=searchI would assume that MicroCenter's inventory would not be bootlegs considering what a major chain it is, but if there is a risk I would like to know. This does almost sound too good to be true.Is anything else other than tips that's recommended to get to go with this iron for starting out on such projects? (Would I need Tip Tinner for example? Never seen anyone ever use that stuff.). I can't afford something like a Hakko FR-301 yet for the components I would need to de-solder, so I am hoping that "Engineer SS-02 Solder Sucker" that I have seen recommended as a cheap alternative will be enough for now.

author: MarkF
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 15, 2022, 07:51:09 am
content: I mostly use various size chisel style tips.T18-D08 - general through holeT18-D24 - larger heat requirementThen bevel sizesT18-C3 - SMD workT18-C4 - SMD drag solderingLast knifeT18-K - Nice wide knife can be used to remove SMD resistors, capacitors..I would stay away from the conical shapes.The only other soldering equipment I use isKester 63/37 solder (pretty much any 63/37 blend. I stopped using 60/40 a long time ago.)0.031" Diameter - general0.014" Diameter - SMDYou want some type of additional flex, solder braid, solder sucker (you already have)

author: MarkF
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 15, 2022, 07:56:38 am
content: You know thattEquipmentandSaeliggive 6% discount for EEVBlog members. Just search the forum for the discount codes.

author: Cyber Akuma
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: July 15, 2022, 08:17:25 am
content: Quote from: MarkF on July 15, 2022, 07:51:09 amI see, so the chisel tips would not be ideal for the smaller components or soldering wires to thin IC legs? I assumed their tiny tip would help with this, but I wasn't sure.So the beveled ones would be better for tiny SMDs and chip-pin soldering? I would have assumed the beveled age would make attempting to solder to such components harder.Also, what about the J/bent-tips, ever used those? Those look like they can help soldering to chip-legs. Is that what they are for or no?If I understood right, the FX-888D comes with a T18-D16 tip by default? That one appears to be similar to the D08 except with a slightly smaller tip, but I am not sure if there are other differences I am missing.QuoteI'm a little confused about how one would use that one. Looks like something that I would just cause heavy burns on the board with. I do need to remove a single SMD capacitor, but everything else I will either be soldering to SMD components, or stacking SMD capacitors. And the only other components I will be removing are large ones like potentiometers. Would I still need this knife tip?QuoteI see. Those are the ones I was most looking at for this kind of work. I guess I had to figured out completely wrong then if this was the main ones I was going for. What is the reason that they would be a bad idea over the others?QuoteHuh, everywhere else I had seen and tips I had gotten recommended 60/40. Did something change where this is not the recommended type of solder anymore? Kester, Maiyum, and MG Chemcials are what I usually try to aim for, with preference for that last one.Quote from: MarkF on July 15, 2022, 07:56:38 amHelpful to know, thanks. Though even with such a discount the soldering iron itself would still be cheaper at MicroCenter (It's $90, but in-store only). The tips might end up cheaper though as they seem to be roughly the same price at MicroCenter and tEquiptment.

author: MikeK
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 15, 2022, 12:44:52 pm
content: Quote from: Cyber Akuma on July 15, 2022, 08:17:25 amI like the stock tip. I use it for many things including some SMD work. D16 has a 1.6mm wide tip, D08 is 0.8mm wide.

author: MarkF
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 15, 2022, 04:45:33 pm
content: The chisel tips in various widths work well for through-hole and wire-to-PCB soldering. Being shaped like a flat screwdriver blade, you can place the flat in the corner between the wire and board to maximize heat transfer. The wide is pretty much a personal choice (within reason). You need to fit the width to the job.I believe I miss spoke earlier... It looks like the T18-D16 1.6mm width is the stock tip and best overall IMHO. 1mm to 2mm chisel is probably the best general purpose width.I tried the chisel tips for SMD soldering and they just aren't sharp enough. The beveled tips work better since you can place the flat part of the tip on the board and its edge against the pin (or on top of the pin) to solder individual pins or with a wider bevel for drag soldering. Refer to some You-tube videos for the technique. (I believe Dave did one.)I never tried the J-shape tips. They have a conical tip which is more of a disadvantage than the benefits of the angle. I just can't get the heat transfer to a board with conical tips.The T18-K knife works to swipe off SMD two-terminal parts (resistors, capacitors, etc) by placing the knife edge on the side of the part to heat both ends at the same time.63/37 Solder:"It has a melting point of 183°C, slightly lower than the more common 60/40 blend. The primary advantage of this solder is not the lower melting point, but its eutectic property. Non-eutectic solders, like the 60/40 solder, have a semi-solid state between solid and liquid. If a joint is moved during this stage, it can result in what is called a cold solder joint. Eutectic solders, like the 63/37, do not have this semi-solid state and are thus considered easier to work with as it produces fewer bad joints."

author: Cyber Akuma
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: July 15, 2022, 05:25:21 pm
content: Quote from: MarkF on July 15, 2022, 04:45:33 pmI see. So then just stick with the D16 over the D08?QuoteAh, thanks. Would these still work for soldering SMD components like ceramic capacitors though? I need to solder some 0805 ceramics next to some 0605s, and those would be too small single points to solder, not a series of pins like in a SMD IC. Would a beveled tip still be ideal for this, or no?For example, this is some of the (I admit, very unorthodox and hack-ish) trickier soldering that I am wondering what tip would be best for:(Notice that was done to capacitors C48 and C42 in this image)As well as what was done toe C48 in this image and the soldering wires to the SMD OC's legs:Would the beveled tips still work for this? Or would they work for the IC pins, but I would need something else for the SMD capacitors?QuoteI see, so 63/37 would be easier to work with it sounds, that would likely be more helpful for me since I am still starting out. Are there any disadvantages then to 63/37 since I see so many use 60/40?

author: MarkF
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 15, 2022, 06:43:29 pm
content: I believe the T18-D16 is the tip I use the most. I have some smaller chisel sizes I tried for SMD work but didn't like them. I pulled out a few tips when I wrote my initial post but it was 4am here at the time.If I was soldering the two boards in your pictures, I would have just used a beveled tip for everything. Mostly, you want to be able to get the flat spot of the tip onto where you want the heat.I would use a beveled tip for anything SMD related (i.e. resistors, capacitors, ICs). And if while doing SMD soldering I need to solder on a wire, I would just use the bevel tip I have attached at the time. I tend to only use 1206 and 805 sizes because at my age I can't see the smaller sizes and my hand isn't as steady any more. The SSOP sizes are my real nemesis. Add plenty of extra flux for those.That is to say, I don't go changing tips for each solder joint I do. There is no correct tip for the job. Some tip shapes just make the job easier. A little common sense goes a long way here.IMHO, you're blowing this up into a monster. It's not. For 99% of what I do, I only use two tips (one chisel and one bevel). I have a few others I only use on rare occasions. Just match the tip size to the joint. If the tip is too small you won't be able to get enough heat to the joint. If the tip is too big, you will just destroy everything around it. If you have two or even three different chisel sizes and one or two bevel sizes, that's more than enough.Time to stop. I'm just rambling on now...I believe the 60/40 solder blends are still used because they were the mainstay go-to solder of the time and people don't want to change. I have not found any downsides to using the 63/37 blend.

author: MarkF
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 15, 2022, 07:12:02 pm
content: My goto tip choices would be:T18-C08 Bevel 0.8mm SMD choiceT18-C2 Bevel 2.1mmT18-D12 Chisel 1.2mm general choiceT18-D24 Chisel 2.4mmT18-D32 Chisel 3.2mmT18-K Knife special purpose / re-workThe two choices (as indicated) for most work plus one or two larger sizes.If you need to do some real fine work, then go a little smaller.

author: mindcrime
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 15, 2022, 10:04:44 pm
content: On the whole "63/37" vs "60/40" thing, I would say it's mostly a matter of personal preference. Try both and see which you prefer. Note that there are other options as well, including solders that contain a smattering of silver, or copper, etc. Experiment and see what you like using most.Just stay away from the lead-free stuff unless you live somewhere where real solder isn't available or something.

author: JustMeHere
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: July 15, 2022, 10:24:21 pm
content: I use the biggest bevel tip that will fit for all of my work.

author: xavier60
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 16, 2022, 01:53:15 am
content: The T18-S4 does everything that I need to do, starting with SMD.https://www.devicemart.co.kr/data/collect_img/kind_0/goods/large/37240.jpg

author: Oilngas
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: July 16, 2022, 01:58:29 am
content: Whenever you decide to get additional tips, Kimco has free shipping on Hakko tips.https://gokimco.com/collections/hakko-t18-soldering-tips/free-shipping?grid_list=grid-view

author: rsjsouza
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 16, 2022, 02:00:37 am
content: I mention the probes I use in the second post of the similar discussion below:https://eevblog.com/forum/beginners/which-hakko-fx-888d-soldering-tip-for-drag-soldering-microprocessors/

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 16, 2022, 03:12:07 am
content: Quote from: MarkF on July 15, 2022, 07:12:02 pm100% top selection that will do most anything you need.What you call a Bevel and that's how it's described on the Hakko site many also know as a Hoof.This guy:

author: Cyber Akuma
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: July 16, 2022, 08:57:57 am
content: Wow, a LOT of recommendations here. Thanks everyone.So, compiling the list of all the recommended tips (as well as the D16 the Hakko comes with) this is everything I got:QuoteA lot of options for Chisel type, and a few for Bevel as well. It would likely cost too much to just simply get all of these, especially since I doubt I would just start out needing them all, so I am trying to narrow it down to see what would help cover most use cases... at least for starting out.For the chisel, considering the D16 it comes with is 0.5/1.6, I feel like either the D08 or D12 for a smaller tip and a D24 for a larger tip might be the most helpful. D34 as well as DL12 and S3 feel like they are a bit too big for the current project I want to do, at least for now. So would a D08 or D12 (or both) and a D24 be a good set of chisel tips on top of the D16 it comes with be a good set for starting out? Or am I heavily mis-understanding how tiny the tips are and I should go for some of the larger ones?For bevel, it's little harder for me to try to figure out what would be a good sort of starting out middle ground to cover most of my needs, at least for again, starting out on soldering SMDs and wires to SMD/chip legs. The C2 would likely be a good start, but after that I am not sure if I should also get a C3, C4, or C08. C3 and C4 seem pretty close to each other in size so likely would not be getting both. Not sure if CF1 would be too large or not, though I can see a benefit of the heavier angle on it. Maybe a C2 and C4? Possibly C08 as well.So that's about 2 or 3 chisel and 2 or 3 bevel depending, which seems to be what most use instead of swapping dozens of tips.Debating about the S4. Most did not recommend the conical tips, but it feels like it would be helpful to have at least one.And I am still not sure if the K would be helpful or not. Is it needed to de-solder SMDs or can I still do it fairly easily with the other tips? Something that large and bulky feels like it would be easy for me to break or burn something with it attempting to use it to remove components.And the T18-BR02 appears to be the only bent T18 tip. I still have no idea if this would help with attempting to solder to the chip legs or not since I can use it's bent angle to press the wire against the chip's legs.... or would that be a horrible idea and cause problems/not what it's meant for?By the way, I just realized. Since the Hakko doesn't really come with any type of tip storage in the box, it's unit, or in the Iron holding/cleaning stand, is there any cheap case or something meant to hold all these tips without them being loose?

author: xavier60
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 16, 2022, 09:19:10 am
content: The T18-S4 tip is unusually versatile because of its high thermal mass and low thermal resistance.This is an example of what it's capable of.The brass screws are M5x25. The the PCB is 2oz copper.

author: tautech
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 16, 2022, 09:23:47 am
content: Take this with a grain of salt as my 2c worth other than to back MarkF’s selection is all I use is a 1mm and 3.2mm Chisel and a K primary for rework and prototyping. Don’t focus on too many fine tips as you just won’t use them especially for their poor thermal mass properties.Don’t dismiss needing Bevel/Hoof tips for drag soldering and great thermal mass where they’re even better than most.

author: MarkF
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: July 16, 2022, 01:07:26 pm
content: Don't go crazy with tips. You just won't use them.I have only used 1/3 of the tips I bought.I feel like I'm pushing the T18-K knife (I don't mean to). But, you just can't remove a SMD resistor or capacitor unless you can heat both ends simultaneously. Your options are the Knife tip, solder tweezers or a hot air station.Here is a comparison by Hakko:https://www.hakko.com/english/products/hakko_fx8801_8805_tips.html#t18Also, I can't recommend the long tips. I haven't found the need for a long thin tip in practice.Talking about the difference between the T18-D12 and the T18-DL12 for example. 14.5mm vs 22.5mm length.