Cheap new basic thermal camera on eBay - Multicomp / Uni-T + teardown - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 10:56:16 am
content: I spotted a Multicomp MP780429 compact thermal imaging camera on eBay the other day and thought I would share details with the forum.The unit is FLIR Lepton 2.5 based so is 80 x 60 pixels radiometric. We have seen it previously in its Uni-T branding but this unit is branded “Multicomp” which, from memory is the Farnell/CPC ‘own brand’. This unit is also sold under other brand names.Why do I mention this unit here ? Well it was being offered for £120 by the eBay seller the other day. He has several new units in stock. He dropped the price to £109 yesterday and offered me one for £100 today. I accepted his offer as this little unit, though basic, will be useful in the tool kitThe small screen is actually a benefit when working with a 80 x 60 pixel image as it looks better !So if you are in the market for a cheap, basic Radiometric thermal camera, take a look here…..https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/284478546915?_trkparms=amclksrc%3DITM%26aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20160908105057%26meid%3D44023bdd5a654ae98d8fe95f2d2df65c%26pid%3D100675%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D15%26sd%3D284478546915%26itm%3D284478546915%26pmt%3D0%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D2380057&_trksid=p2380057.c100675.m4236&_trkparms=pageci%3A96fa2a85-2cdb-11ec-97e2-328b3e11e722%7Cparentrq%3A7e667ce217c0ab9e64025fbcfff48b62%7Ciid%3A1I have no connection with the seller or the item that he is selling.Datasheet is here…..https://www.farnell.com/datasheets/2921203.pdfThe usual limitations of the FLIR lepton core apply. It is fixed focus so for close-up work you need to place a cheap ZnSe CO2 laser cutter lens in front of the cameras lens. All detailed in various posts on this forum.The claimed measurement capability is -10C to +400C which is impressiveThat is all for now

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 10:58:43 am
content: The Uni-T branded UTi80P version….https://www.aliexpress.com/i/4000152839386.html£208 to the UK on 30% discount so the EBay unit I bought is less than half that price

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 11:02:49 am
content: Farnell catalogue page for the MP780429 camera…https://uk.farnell.com/multicomp-pro/mp780429/thermal-imager-51-x-38deg-c-9hz/dp/3394756Looks like they are out of stock with a back order lead time of 148 days !

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 11:26:02 am
content: Video of the Uni-T UTi80P in operation…..https://youtu.be/Qvv2aXq1bBUA neat little unit in my opinionFraser

author: kripton2035
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 11:38:18 am
content: "May not post to France" ...

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 11:39:00 am
content: As stated, this camera is available under various brand labelling.Amazon have it under Huepar HTi80P for £280https://www.amazon.co.uk/Pocket-Sized-Huepar-Measurement-Temperature-HTi80P/dp/B082NXHZHX

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 11:40:45 am
content: Kripton2035,Just message the seller and do mention that you are from the EEVBlog. He may ship to you but you may have to pay your countries import TaxesFraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 11:47:27 am
content: Some more pictures from Uni-T…..

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 12:12:30 pm
content: I was going to build a DIY Lepton based thermal camera as a compact simple ‘quick check’ device. Granted I was going to use the lepton 3 that offers 160 x 120 pixel resolution, but I can honestly say that the offer of the above detailed device for £100 made the idea of a DIY mini self contained camera redundant for meNow before anyone gets too excited over this camera, a few things to note …….Pro’s1. The camera is self contained and very compact2. The camera is Radiometric in that it can provide pretty accurate temperature measurements3. High and low Temperature tracking is provided in the firmware4. There is the ability to save images for later use in reports or just as a record of the scene5. The camera provided emissivity adjustment which is important fir accurate measurements on various target surfaces.6. This particular Lepton core deployment makes use of both the high and low gain modes for a temperature measurement capability of -10C to +400C7. A close focus lens is easily added to the nice flat face of the casing for PCB work8. It cost me £100 which fir such a complete solution is excellent value even in the current market if less expensive thermal cameras coming out of China…… IF the resolution is adequate for the task though !Con’s1. The camera uses the Lepton 2.5 core. This core uses 80 x 60 pixels so image will suffer pixelation on larger screens. FLIR use techniques to reduce the effect of such low resolution but it will always be at the lower end of useable resolution. The image is interpolated from 80 x 60 up to 320 x 240 on the LCD display. My usual threshold is 160 x 120 pixels but I went below that for this low cost camera that has its uses to me.2. The Lepton core is not a great performer in low Delta T scenes like when looking at a plasterboard lined wall for the plaster dabs or battens ! It produces better images when there is decent temperature differential in a scene. Look at the above referenced video to see the difference in image noise content when looking at low Delta T and high Delta T scenes. Noise is a fact of life in microbolometer based thermography and, IMHO, only becomes a serious issue when low Delta T scenes are being imaged.3. The lens on the camera is quite wide angle at 51 x 38 degrees so the Instantaneous Field Of View (IFOV) is relatively large per pixel. This is not that great an issue for many users but does tend to highlight the low pixel count in an image. You have to move closer to the target to gain more detail. A 24 Degree HFOV might have been a better choice for PCB work. Not a deal breaker for me though.4.I believe the saved images will be just images and not fully Radiometric image files that contain the temperature of every pixel within the scene. This prevents easy Radiometric analysis of the saved image on a computer, but spot temperature measurements should be present so it is not the end of the World. This should be considered if intending to analyse the thermal image after capture however.Correction, saved images are fully radiometric and analysis software is provided.5. The camera uses a small, 2.4”, LCD display. This may be too small for some users ?

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 12:24:42 pm
content: SpecificationsSPECIFICATIONSTemperature range: -10~400℃Basic accuracy:±2℃ or ±2% (-10~140℃);±3℃ or ±3% (140~450℃)Resolution: 0.1℃Emissivity: 0.95 (0.1~0.99 adjustable)NETD: ≤150mK (0.15℃)IR resolution: 80x60Pixel size: 17μmPalettes: Iron, rainbow, greyFOV: 51º (H) * 38º (V)Image frequency: ≤9HzFeatures:High and low temperature alarmHigh and low temperature trackingBacklight: High, medium, lowDisplay: 2.4-inch TFT LCDDisplay resolution: 320 x 240 pixelsPower: Li-ion battery, 3.7V/1300mAhDisplay size: 48mm x 36mProduct color: Red and greyProduct net weight: 125gProduct size: 76mm x 76mm x 22mm

author: jeremy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 12:25:00 pm
content: I asked the seller, UK only I’m afraid. Bummer.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 12:31:25 pm
content: Sorry to hear that bad news

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 12:45:48 pm
content: If anyone is into the R-Pi scene and wants a Model 3B, the seller appears to have plenty at reasonable prices. You can even buy a pack of 10 !https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Raspberry-Pi-3B-Rev-1-2-Brand-New-/284486048385?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l49286&mkrid=710-127635-2958-0Memories of when Toploser used to buy surplus and returned stock !Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 12:52:24 pm
content: Details of a DIY Lepton based thermal camera. A great achievement but it also shows the great value that the MP780429 represents in the eBay auctionhttps://hackaday.io/project/20039-pocket-thermal-cameraFraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 12:55:01 pm
content: The Huepar version advert on Aliexpress…….https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005001369343687.htmlFraser

author: kripton2035
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 01:07:08 pm
content: sending in or out of UK since brexit has become a particular hassle ! not surprised the ebay seller don't want italso I may have €100 of taxes for importing it...

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 01:17:28 pm
content: For us in the UK it has always been importing from the USA that was very appealing but often spoiled by shipping costs plus 20% VAT on the combined item value and shipping cost. That has not changed but now we also have the same issue with buying from Europe and you have the issue buying from us. Such is lifeFraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 01:22:46 pm
content: The Huepar sales video….. very slick……and VERY deceptive where the example thermal imaging is concerned !I hate it when a seller uses top of the range professional thermal camera imagery on advertising for a budget product that can never produce that quality of imagehttps://youtu.be/tM8AkiqTxncFraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 01:31:23 pm
content: I just checked, it would have cost me the same amount of money, more in fact, to buy the Groupgets Pure Thermal Mini PCB and that is without the Lepton included ! DIY used to be cheaper than buying ready built…. Not in this particular realm though !https://groupgets.com/manufacturers/getlab/products/purethermal-mini-pro-jst-sr$109 + shipping + 20% VATPlus I would still have to provide a FLIR Lepton core, host processor board, software, Display, battery and casing.For me, the £100 Multicomp camera deal was a bit of a ‘no-brainer’

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 01:37:19 pm
content: The seller has 4 units left

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 03:39:18 pm
content: I just read the user manual.....Saved images are fully radiometric and the provided image analysis software provides various measurement functions.Fraser

author: Fred27
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 04:28:19 pm
content: I've got a lepton 3.5 which I'm currently using with a PureThermal 2. I'm almost tempted to go for this unit and see what happens if I swap the Lepton 2.5 for a 3.5.Then again, it's a bit of an assumption that the firmware was written with the foresight to upscale nicely from whatever it was given. Maybe if there was also an 180x120 model in the range...

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 05:33:12 pm
content: Historically products designed for the Lepton 2 will not work with the Lepton 3 series due to the different image creation approach of the Lepton 3 and increased image processing overhead. I have not seen a commercial manufacturer produce an 'easy upgrade' host for the Lepton series of cores. I can almost guarantee that the Lepton 3.5 will not work in this camera chassis so it would be a poor gamble for you to takeFraser

author: Fred27
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 05:55:39 pm
content: Thanks. Fraser. I'll hold fire then. The PureThermal 2 states it can take either which got me thinking about it, but I suppose that's a special case and not a commercial device.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 06:21:22 pm
content: Klein Tools sell the same camera with a modified case design….the TI250The Klein Tools version claims to use over 10,000 pixels and, at first, I thought this a deliberate attempt to confuse customers by quoting the LCD display resolution, but that does not compute either ! Everything about the Klein Tools unit appears to be basically a Uni-T UTi80P in a slightly different casing. We do not know what resides inside and likely never will. The sample images look the same quality as the UTi80p though ? I personally prefer the original UTi80P case design.The Klein Tools web page provides the user manual and a firmware update which might be an interesting 'read'. The Klein version does not come with a memory card and there is no mention of image analysis software either.https://www.kleintools.com/catalog/thermal-imagers/rechargeable-thermal-imagerUser video review…..https://youtu.be/xSRYMAEXK0kFraser

author: 5370H55V
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 07:01:16 pm
content: Purchased one from the seller for £100. Requested a total from him with a message mentioning I was in the US and he was willing to ship it for an additional £35.

author: ArsenioDev
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 07:03:05 pm
content: Fraser,I gotta dig up the code i had a while back that ran a Lepton 2.5 on a Teensy 3.2 at full frame rates, was a pretty good tech demo but now that I've got high performance thermals around it fell by the wayside.It's somewhere in my archives

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 07:23:37 pm
content: 5370H55V,Thanks for letting us know that the selelr will ship internationally now. Sadly the UK can be quite expensive for international shipping so I am not surprised that it is £35 to the USA.Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 07:40:27 pm
content: The 'mystery' of the Klein Tools camera and its claim of >10,000 pixels has been solved. Their claim is true. Uni-T make a UTi120P model with 120x90 pixels.https://www.uni-trend.com/meters/html/product/Environmental/Thermal_Imager/UTi80%20UTi120%20Series/UTi120P.htmlGuide Sensmart make a miniature "TIMO" microbolometer with 120x90 pixels.... I wonder if this is used in the UTi120P ? The specs seem to match. Note the increase in frame rate to 25fps ... this is a definite pointer to a China sourced imaging coreYoutube video of UTi120P.....https://youtu.be/77bFXmtWLmYFraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 07:58:34 pm
content: The possible move away from the FLIR Lepton to a locally produced Chinese microbolometer core by Uni-T, when developing the UTi120P from the UTi80P predecessor, does not surprise me and is likely a very wise move. FLIR are a US company with all the red tape that such involves when buying microbolometer cores from them. The cost and supply is also dictated by the US which can be a significant issue when it comes to costing the products BoM and ensuring a reliable supply chain. The Guide Sensmart and Infiray (IRAY) imaging cores may be lower cost and they are made in China so easier shipping and communications between OEM and camera manufacturer.Fraser

author: kripton2035
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 09:16:26 pm
content: UTI120P is available at eleshop for €165 + VAThttps://eleshop.eu/uni-t-uti120p-thermal-imaging-camera.html

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2021, 10:01:43 pm
content: Kripton5035,ThanksOnce you get up to that sort of price, the UTi260B starts to look appealing though. The UTi260 uses the higher resolution Core from Infiray(IRAY) and I would look at that or the Infiray C210 camera. The only reason I considered the UTi80P was its compact size and the magic price point that made the deal worth it for me. For others it may make better sense to go for the UTi260B or C210 as they are very competitively priced.Fraser

author: kripton2035
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 15, 2021, 06:37:04 am
content: I'm afraid the UTi80P on ebay UK, plus shipping and vat and customs to France, will not be far in price from the european Eleshop UTi120P plus shipping and vat...

author: Fungus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 16, 2021, 04:12:55 am
content: Quote from: kripton2035 on October 14, 2021, 09:16:26 pmDamn, that's less than I paid for my UTi120P a few months ago.I'm very happy with mine. I don't get how EEVBLOG isn't all over these cameras.I wonder if mine is hackable to the higher resolution.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 17, 2021, 12:00:52 pm
content: Fungus,The budget end of the thermal imaging camera market has literally ‘exploded’ in recent years. The availability of relatively cheap imaging cores has driven this and new cores are being developed in China that will further improve the situation in the market.The UTi80P is a novel design that sits in the ‘basic pocketable camera’ camp. We have seen the Lepton inside mobile phones, the FLIR C series and Seek Reveal and Seek Shot cameras. All of these are designed to offer basic thermal imaging functionality that fits easily in the pocket or tool kit. Sometimes you do not need or want a larger, bulkier, camera with you. It is a little like DSLR Vs Digital compact cameras ….. each have their pros and cons and are best suited to somewhat different roles. In the case of the UTi80P, it is a neat little unit but it is somewhat ‘resolution challenged’ for some tasks. It was such a pity that the higher resolution Lepton 3.5 was not used in it but that would have increased cost which may have been a factor. With the development of better, lower cost imaging cores by companies like Infiray (IRAY) and Guide Sensmart we are seeing more affordable cameras on the market. The UTi120P is a result of this core development and has better resolution….. but still falls short of the 160 x 120 pixels or higher that people are now used to seeing when a Lepton 3, Seek Thermal or InfiRay core is used. 120 x 90 pixels is definitely better than 80 x 60 pixels but since the UTi80P was released we have seen other cameras coming out of China that offer better “bang for buck” in terms of resolution, performance and functionality.I bought the UTi80P because it was offered to me for £99. That seems about the right price for me in terms of the units usefulness in my applications, so I bought it. I would not have paid much more than £99 simply because there are other, better, cameras on offer from Uni-T and Infiray for not a lot more money. That said, I would not have bought them either as I already have several similar cameras in my collection. The UTi80P is, IMHO, a niche product that appeals to some thermal camera users for its portability and simple measurement capabilities. The UTi120P is similar in this respect. Some members of this forum get excited about new thermal cameras that offer excellent imaging at minimum cost or at least lower cost. The Chinese cores are still not at bargain prices but the likes of the Uni-T UTi260B and Infiray C210 have shown that, at this end if the market, paying a little bit more than that being asked for a basic camera can gain the buyer a far more capable device. For a manufacturer, this budget end of the market must be a bit of a nightmare as he market is demanding cheap prices for traditionally expensive technology that can be relatively expensive to manufacture. Profit margins may be slim compared to other products produced in China.For those who want “pretty pictures”, the UTi80P and UTi120P would not be the best choice in the current market. From my perspective as a user of these ‘tools’ for electronics etc, the resolution just needs to provide the data points in a scene that are useful to me in interpreting the situation. XVGA resolution is just not required ! Comparing a decent (Fluke) IR thermometer with the UTi80P, I would prefer the UTi80P as I gain thousands of data points of reasonable accuracy plus I can see the exact point on the target that I am measuring. Context of measurement can be very important. Using a standard IR thermometer, you are kind of working blind due to the crude “spot size on target’ approach to that simple single pixel based system. Handheld IR thermometers and industrial static mounted versions definitely have their place in equipment maintenance and monitoring but comparing a decent FLUKE IR thermometer price to a reasonably priced and budget thermal cameras price shows the price gap is narrowing !

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 17, 2021, 12:44:47 pm
content: Fungus,Regarding resolution improvement….At the budget end of the market the FLIR E4 is pretty unique in terms of the upgrade that provides full microbolometer resolution and additional functionality. Clever people reverse engineered the firmware to discover the camera (dirty little) secrets. This was aided by the use of a non secure operating system by FLIR, namely Win CE.FLUKE use the same resolution hobbling approach on their thermal cameras but, to my knowledge, the firmware has not be reverse engineered to discover ways to release the cameras full potential.The above cameras are expensive, even in their most basic versions. The modern low budget thermal cameras coming out of China are unlikely to use a microbolomter or core that exceeds the specification of the camera as that would potentially impact profit. There are cores that are offered in several resolutions so the OEM picks the core to suit a specific cameras specification. Recent camera releases from China tend to offer the best resolution that they can for the price point so are less likely to play the games seen with FLIR and FLUKE etc. The Infiray range of cores offer the Tiny1 core that is available in two resolutions, much like the FLIR Lepton core. The Sensmart Guide TIMO core comes in a single resolution of 120 x 90 and, from the UTi120P specifications, it would appear that this TIMO core is what resides inside that camera. It is already operating at its full resolution so cannot be enhanced in that respect. The UTi80P is an older design so all units sold are likely using the Lepton 2.5. Fitting a Lepton 3.5 is unlikely to work, as I previously stated.Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 18, 2021, 05:26:59 pm
content: The camera arrived todayFirst impressions are good. It is better than I had expectedIt’s diminutive size, similar to a 3 Metre tape measure, makes it very convenient to carry and it looks like it can survive a few bumps and knocks without breakingUnit is brand new and includes the following…..The thermal cameraWrist strapUSB A to Micro USB Charging cable16GB Toshiba Micro SD cardMicro SD card to SD card adapterSemirigid carry case.Instructions

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 18, 2021, 06:29:55 pm
content: The contents of the box

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 18, 2021, 06:35:57 pm
content: Some sample images I just captured and, of course, I took pictures of our cats as well as the ‘Coffee Cup’ test that I always doWe were having peas as part of our tea so I imaged them before cooking. Straight out of the freezer that is running at -22C ! Remember, this camera is specified to only -10C and calibration is not guaranteed outside the -10C to +400C specified range.As I expected, the wide angle lens works against image detail but as you get closer to the target, the image captured improves. Now I do not know where the focus is set so moving closer to the target may improve the image in one respect (detail), the de-focus effect can degrade that image (blurring).I shall have to experiment with the lepton focus pointFraserImages to be added in a minute…….

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 18, 2021, 06:46:23 pm
content: Our Lily in a monochrome paletteConsidering the FPA is only 80 x 60 pixels, I am pleased with the images that this little camera produces. The wonders of Interpolation ehThe images are interpolated from 80 x 60 pixels up to 320 x 240 pixels. IRISYS used to interpolate up from 16 x 16 pixels to 128 x 128 pixels on their IRI1001/1011 cameras !This camera is definitely very useable and not a toy. If you look closely at teh detail in the monochrome images you can see Lillys tabby markings that have different emissivity. I took these pictures of Lily at around 10 inches distance so likely seriously focus compromised.Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 18, 2021, 08:14:28 pm
content: The image analysis software for the camera is nothing very sophisticated, but it does basic measurments etc.I attach the PDF report that it produces.The software does not offer file type conversion from BMP to JPG or PNG and it automatically activates centre, highest and lowest temperature markers whether you want them or not. In a word....basicLook at the PDF file size that it produces.... 1.7MB ! The BMP thermal image is only around 225KB so where does the rest of the file size come from ?Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 18, 2021, 09:14:12 pm
content: I will carry out some basic checks on the camera to determine true minimum focus distance and the units suitability, or not, for PCB work when fitted with a 12mm ZnSe close-up lens. More to follow as I find time.I did just try a 6" focal distance close up lens on the camera when viewing Lily and it did permit more detail to be seen on Lily's face, including her wiskers. I tried a FLUKE X2 telephoto supplemental lens as well but the results were not as expected so something is amiss with that combination of lenses.Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 18, 2021, 09:22:41 pm
content: The picture I quickly grabbed of Lily with a very crude setup of me holding a 6" FL lens in front of the camera without perfecting focus as Lily was moving all the time !Note that her wiskers are easily visible in this image.Fraser

author: Vipitis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 19, 2021, 07:29:30 am
content: It's a variation on how the Lepton looks. There is some blurry upscaling, but not as horrible as the default FLIR One results. I still prefer nearest neighbor and will never forget the results I had a few years ago with my first camera. The noise also feels a bit different, perhaps they don't run any strong noise reduction before upscaling.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 19, 2021, 09:22:50 am
content: I will have a close look at the BMP file produced by the camera. I had to convert the images to PNG to post on the forum but I chose zero compression in the hope that it did not mess with the image too much.So are you saying that interpolation is not being used and it is just some sort of pixel duplication approach ? If that is the case, it is a pity as interpolation can deliver impressive results if employed correctly.Fraser

author: Vipitis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 19, 2021, 10:10:03 am
content: Even nearest neighbor (=duplicating pixels) is interpolation. That's not the case here. They use some filter afterwards. I believe the most common one is biliner (look at adjacent 4 adjacent pixels) or bicubic (look at 8 adjacent pixels). There is a bunch of options, but the basic ones aren't computationally expensive.I really want to take a course on image (and video) compression, but haven't found one yet.

author: jeremy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 19, 2021, 11:33:45 am
content: I forgot to post and say thanks to Fraser for sharing this; I picked up two of them shipped to Australia. Looking forward to the pocket form factor.Quote from: Vipitis on October 19, 2021, 10:10:03 amLook up "Discrete Cosine Transform" in any moderately advanced signal processing course, but be warned, compression is very mathematics heavy. There are however lots of course notes and example code available online.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 19, 2021, 11:34:54 am
content: Vipitis,I know nothing about how interpolation is achieved in thermal cameras so I did some reading on how IRISYS approached the challenge of turning their 16 x 16 pixel scene into one providing 128 x 128 pixels. It sounded like an impossible task but the ‘before’ and ‘after’ images showed the power of interpolation when true optical resolution is lacking. From memory the system they employed worked something like this….Pixel 1 has a value of, say ‘100’The pixel to the left has a relative value of ‘50’The next pixel to the left has a relative value of ‘0’The interpretation of the three pixels is that the middle pixel is half illuminated by the scene as it has ‘0’ to its left and ‘100’ to its right.In order to be half illuminated it must be getting the illumination from its right side as that is where the strongest ‘signal’ is present. The algorithm carries out the same comparison all around its pixel to determine delta T transition points and which side of a pixel the energy is positioned. The algorithm then calculates a value of a virtual pixel that would sit between real pixels. In the above example I suppose a virtual pixel of value ‘75’, or something like that, would be placed between the middle pixel and that to its right and another virtual pixel would be placed between the middle pixel and the one to its left, but the chosen value may not be the obvious ‘25’ as, remember, the middle pixel is believed to be half illuminated on its right side so a virtual pixel to its left needs to reflect the likely gradient across the middle pixel. The virtual pixel may be assigned a value of only ‘5’ for instance. This is a massive simplification of course as there will be pixels all around the three detailed here and they influence the virtual pixel values too. Done properly, this form of resolution enhancement can be very effective and repetition of the interpolation process may be undertaken to create larger pixel count outputs. The problem with this multi-interpolation pass approach is that the original pixel data can become effectively corrupted if not protected from change. Interpolation of this type adds visual enhancement but adds nothing in terms of real data points. Virtual pixels are just a ‘best guess’ after all. In a nutshell, the IRISYS interpolation method was able to determine from what side, or sides, thermal energy was illuminating a particular pixel by using the signals coming from the 8 pixels around it. Virtual pixel valued could then be placed between the central pixel and the 8 surrounding it…. That was then repeated across the whole array.I will see if I can find the paper that was written by IRISYS describing the interpolation that they used. From memory the process was used in their people counters as well as the IRI1001/1011 cameras.Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 19, 2021, 11:38:55 am
content: Jeremy,Thank you.I am not a lover of maths ! I use ‘operational maths’ to get through life and cope fine at the practical level. I avoid the maths heavy signal processing stuff as it hurts my brainMy overly simplified IRISYS interpolation process is likely a mathematical nightmare in real life and the paper I read was for the layman so even had pictures to help explain the processI will leave the maths heavy areas of image processing to those who love mathsFraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 19, 2021, 11:46:26 am
content: As a side note, my PM series cameras apply some form of interpolation when the eZoom function is used. This seems obvious of course as the output image size remains 320 x 240 pixels on the viewfinder, but the image quality is far better than I have seen on other thermal cameras that are in X2 or x4 eZoom mode. I did an experiment with eZoom comparing an image at 0.5m from target and then at 1m from target but with eZoom X2 enabled. It was hard to see a difference on the display between the two images unless you took a close look at the fine detail.Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 19, 2021, 11:51:56 am
content: I just found this guide to Bilinear (with mention of Bicubic) interpolation and, as I thought, my description, above, of interpolation is wayyyy over simplifiedhttps://learn.adafruit.com/improved-amg8833-pygamer-thermal-camera/the-1-2-3s-of-bilinear-interpolation

author: jeremy
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 19, 2021, 12:05:37 pm
content: Perhaps what they do is some sort of motion-based superresolution interpolation. Basically, it uses multiple images with very slight movement of the camera to interpolate far greater detail. This paper covers one type of it pretty well (Serious Maths(TM) warning), although there is an example "pretty picture" example reconstruction from a FLIR camera on page 23:http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.2.7447&rep=rep1&type=pdf

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 19, 2021, 12:31:35 pm
content: That is an interesting paper. Thank you. I fear that the Uni-T UTi80P that this Multicomp camera truly is, would not employ super resolution as the price point is too low and the requirement for a decent processor would drive them towards simpler interpolation techniques. Getting super resolution on much more expensive cameras remains a luxury, or additional cost option. A pity as that mode has much to offer. My Agilent/Keysight 160 x 120 pixel camera has Super resolution on it to improve its imagery. That camera was made by NEC Avio who make some very nice cameras.I really should look deeper into recognising the sort of image enhancement and filtering that modern thermal cameras are using. Sadly manufacturers tend to hide such fine detail behind fancy names and give little detail of what is actually done to the raw image. Clever people on this forum can recognise certain tell tale signs of filtering, edge enhancement and interpolation, but not meFraser

author: Vipitis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 19, 2021, 02:22:56 pm
content: I am currently doing a deep learning course and might finish it was a homework project. There are already three ideas on my mind but only one of them is Pseudo NLP focussed. Doing image upscaling for thermal imaging based on compressed sensing doing to the sparsity of microbolometers might be an idea. However I think it has been done before. I have seen published research on it a while ago, maybe I dig them up in a "scientific publications on thermal imaging" thread I wanted to start a few times.2x "super resolution" and even 4x will usually look alright, since that's what we are used to with visible light color cameras. They prototypically use a 2x2 CFA (color filter array) with a R-G;G-B pattern. Meaning 75% of R and 75% of B pixels are interpolated (=4x super resolution in pixels, 2x in resolution). Non DRS microbolometers have an effective pixel area smaller than then pixel pitch. It's not quite 25% but it's not more than 85% either. So you could easily make up values for the "missing" space in between. So thermal cameras should always give you more pixels than you see. In visible light you have some overlap and correlation with R G and B, but it's usually not looked at(for highlight recovery it is for example).Upscaling and downscaling a digital image has been a task for a long time. There is plenty of different approaches (recently learning based stuff like Topaz for example), but it's all math. Doing it based on the physics of a sensor and maybe the point spread function of the optics... Is only something you find in scientific research for like space telescopes or Mars rovers.Doing it based on sparsity might work. But it requires a random sample, so your array won't do it. But the odd dead pixel would. And maybe even randomly angled lines was like a wavelet.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 29, 2021, 07:13:49 pm
content: A small epilogue to my Multicomp thermal camer purchase.....This diminutive camera has proven to be an excellent addition to my tool kit. I have been working on a number of old laptops that I am refurbishing for my lab use. Some of these were bought faulty and then repaired. I found the little Multicomp camera to be soooo convenient and quick to use when wishing to see what thermal activity, if any, there was on the motherboard. You grab the camera from the tool kit, push the power button and have a thermal image in secondsThis little camera helped me to diagnose three laptop motherboards that were suffering from failed DC-DC converters and failed bypass MLCC's. I would normally have used my FLIR E60+ camera, and indeed I would have, if the Multicomp camera had not been up to the task. The E60+ does produce a far superior thermal image but I was interested to see if the budget Multicomp camera was a useful tool or more of a toy. I am pleased to say that it has more than proven its worth to me in real world use.The camera does benefit from the use of a supplementary close-up lens when being used on PCB's. The common 12mm diameter ZnSe CO2 laser cutter lenses are adequate for the task. I purchased some accessory lenses for mobile phones as a potential lens mounting system but I have yet to take that project forward. The phone kits 'Macro' lens looks perfect for the role as its lens holder is 13mm diameter. The lenses are attached to the phone, or the Multicomp thermal camera, using a ferrous ring attached to the phone/camera and a magnetic ring on the lens. Whilst this is a very neat lens mounting system, it has a potential issue for use on modern mobile phones and even thermal cameras. That issue is the use of a magnet as modern auto focus and stabilized cameras use magnetic flux to function and the FLIR Lepton core uses a magnetic FFC flag acuator. I need to see whether the strong magnet on the supplementary lens effects the FFC solenoid operation once the magnet is attached to its 'keeper' ring.We shall see. These supplementary lenses cost less than £5 for a set so are very reasonably priced. The lens barrels are aluminium and the lenses are retained by screw mounts so may be easily dismantled for fitment of another (ZnSe) lens.I bought my mobile phone sets from this UK seller but he has only gold coloured lenses remaining as I bought the last two black sets.https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/162554583353Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 29, 2021, 08:08:43 pm
content: Just tested the mobile phone lenses on the Multicomp camera.1. The ferrous ring inner diameter does not fit around the Multicomp cameras raised lip surrounding the lens window so a double sided adhesive thin foam mount would be needed for the attachement as that is forgiving of the difference in height caused by the raised lip. Alterenatively the inner diameter of the ferrous ring could be increased slightly to clear the raised lip.2. The 'Macro' lens causes vignetting due to its small diameter..... pity. The much larger 'Fisheye' lens has a large flare on the lens barrel so only minor vignetting occurs. This is the problem when mounting a suplemental lens in front of a wide angle lens. The lepton has a 50 Degree HFOV which mean that it can see the supplemental lens barrel unless the supplemental lens has a much larger diameter mount and barrel.3. The supplemental lens mouting ring magnet does not adversely effect the Lepton FFC solenoid operation.Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 30, 2021, 02:44:58 pm
content: I am looking at another supplemental lens mounting system to see if it meets my needs. I have ordered the Kodak hone lens kit that comes with a novel retaining clip and two nice large diameter lenses….Wide angle and Fisheye. This lens system may be easily adaptable to holding a ZnSe lens that is large enough to avoids vignetting. The kit cost me less than £6 so not terribly expensive.I have looked at, and own, the ‘clothes peg’ style of phone lens holder but I do not like the pressure that the clip puts on the screen and the thickness of the camera is limited by the clips maximum opening capacity.I will advise on the Kodak clip system when it arrives. I need something quick and easy to put onto the Multicomp camera. Refined appearance is not an issueFraser

author: electr_peter
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 01:42:30 pm
content: FYI - MP780429 Multicomp Pro thermal imager is currently on eBay.com selling for 55GBP + ~22GBP shipping to EU + ~18GBP taxes =95GBP total. Seller is based in UK.17 units left. And it's gone.This not endorsement, I am not related to the seller or eBay. To me seller seems legitimate plus I have eBay/credit card protection so it is worth a look.Link -MP780429 Multicomp Pro thermal imager

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 01:50:32 pm
content: Brilliant dealThanks for highlighting it electr_peterThere were a couple that sold for £40 earlier in the month. I have to wonder whether Farnell have been disposing of stock at their trade outlets ? Good news for us though. £55 for one of these little gems is brilliant value for money (if you can accept the 80 x 60 pixel resolution imagery in your application).I have ordered anotherFraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 02:19:51 pm
content: Just spoke to the seller. These units are listed as New(other) but he confirmed that they are new and unusedI will be permanently mounting one of mine on my BGA Rework station to monitor preheating temperatures and thermal coverage. It may also help with the main IR heating phase but only when the IR illuminator is in its ‘off’ period. These little units could be considered an IR thermometer ‘on steroids’You can see exactly what you are measuring on the PCB.Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 02:30:21 pm
content: When you consider what £54 buys you on eBay in the way of a new thermal camera at the moment…….https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/294260756039A whole 8x8 pixels ! It puts this Multicomp deal into perspectiveFraser

author: kripton2035
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 02:39:16 pm
content: ordered one too ! thanks.now waiting for a good lens to have some macro inspection possible...

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 03:24:37 pm
content: This little camera could form the basis of a fun series of projects to enhance its capabilities within the constraints of 4800 pixelsA close-up lens is the simplest addition to impliment but there is great scope for creattion of lens mounts and different lens formats. A thermal microscope configuration maybeNow 4800 pixels will be a limitation but if looking at a target only 5mm x 5mm that is plentyThen there are are mounting options for use inspecting PCB's and image processing to pull greater thermal detail out of images. More advanced upgardes might include changing the lens fitted to the Lepton as the one fitted is far from optimal and degrades the image. A narrower field of view of 25 Degrees or less would improve the imagery produced. Bill_W is doing some work on Lepton lens upgrades. With these cameras being so well priced, there is less at risk when considering hardware modificationsThat said, there is only so much that can be done to this camera before it makes better sense to buy a camera with higher perfromance at greater cost. It is a fun little unit to 'play' with though, and a good learning experience for those wishing to dip their toe into thermal imaging without spending a fortune.Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 03:56:52 pm
content: Bill_W's thread on lens experiments with the Lepton core.....https://www.eevblog.com/forum/thermal-imaging/flir1-g2-lens-experiments/msg3623452/#msg3623452Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 04:05:54 pm
content: Decent CVD ZnSe lenses:https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/123079006101?hash=item1ca8149795:g:y~AAAOSwsWFg-P~jLook at their various offerings in thier listings. Many diameters and focus distances. CVD lenses are superior optical quality to PVD. You need to select a lens diameter that is larger than the minimum required in order to make use of the better performing central portion of the lens and to reduce edge distortions.Decent lenses do cost reasonable money so it may be best to avoid the really cheap offerings on eBay. That said, the 80 x 60 pixel resolution of this canmera will be very forgiving of lower qaulity lenses. ~$30 is about average for a decent 20mm diameter ZnSe CVD lens. Select a focus distance to meet your needs. I use 101.6mm and 50.8mm focus distance lenses. If you buy a decent 20mm diameter lens it will likely be useable on other, higher resolution, thermal cameras in the future. That said, a cheap ZnSe lens may still be the the best option if the budget is tight as it will still work OK on the Multicomp camera. The minimum diameter of useable lens will likely be 12mm and these are the cheapest.Fraser

author: kripton2035
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 04:55:32 pm
content: found these same lens on ali, almost the same price except no vat or customs possible surprise for EU shipping from Aliexpress(as nothing is clearly explained on ebay...)https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32234326702.html

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 05:05:33 pm
content: With regard to modifications and enhancements to the diminutive Multicomp thermal camera...Some time ago I bought some Military surplus eyecup adapters that were designed to mount on a handheld military navigation and comms equipment. The Eye cup adapter is special in that it is equipped with a lens and also a eyecup 'iris' to prevent light leakage when not pressed to the eye (sniper countermeasure) I thought these unusual items would prove useful one day. Similar items may be purchased for modern DSLR cameras as well. As luck would have it, I knew where to put my hands on one of these military eyecup adapters amongst all my other 'may be useful one day stuff' ! It is a good match to the Multicomp camera display so I could make a thermal surveilance scope using it, or even a thermal microscope. The built in high quality lens in the eyecup adapter takes care of producing a well focussed image of the 320 x 240 pixel LCD panel to the user.Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 05:18:48 pm
content: See this thread for some examples of different mounts that may be used to hold small thermal cameras for PCB inspetion etc......https://www.eevblog.com/forum/thermal-imaging/review-dianyang-technology-ca10-circuit-board-thermal-analyzer-repair-rd/I placed the Multicomp camera on the Gooseneck table mount and it looks perfect for PCB work when a Znse close-up lens is in use.Picture attached.Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 07:53:12 pm
content: I thought some real world images from my Multicomp camera when viewing a PCB might help others to understand the abilities and limitations of a thermal camera that uses the 80 x 60 pixel Lepton 2.5 core. When looking at the following images we need to keep in mind that the thermal data is only 80 sample points wide by 60 sample points high and the IFOV is less than great due to the relatively wide angle 50 Degrees HFOV lens.I captured some images with a 20mm diameter ZnSe lens fitted. This lens has a stated focus distance of 4"/101mm.Upon fitting the supplemental lens I realised that there was not a dramatic change in the close-up imaging performance of the camera. The depth of field is impressive with and without the Supplemental lens. For this reason, I also captured some images of the PCB without the supplemental lens to show the "RAW" cameras apability when working close to a PCB.The test subject in the PCB imagery is a Haupppauge Video Capture unit and I include a visible light image to provide some context to the thermal images. I was interested in what parts, if any, of the Capture unit are working as the unit presents as totally dead. I captured an image as soon as power was applied and noted which IC's showed signs of life. More images were captured as the unit warmed up. Two IC's on the left of the PCB are clearly operating enough to generate some heat, though not excessive heat. The middle larger IC is also showing some evidence of thermal activity. There were no 'hot spots' of concern and I now know that there is some life in the PCB. Further tests with other test equipment will follow. Note: the reflective connectors in the images are reflecting my body heat so do not be confused by the 'hot spots' that they create.I also captured an image of my small Butane gas blow torch just to see how the camera behaved with the ZnSe lens fitted. No problem with that at all. I imaged my hand as wellOn with the images and remember...this is a 80 x 60 pixel image and so will not impress on the fine detail front....I believe it would display hot SMT resistors of small size though.Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 07:57:17 pm
content: The Hauppauge Video Capture Unit PCB.....Supplemental lenses fitted.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 07:58:11 pm
content: Continued....

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 08:00:41 pm
content: The Hauppauge capture unit using the same camera but "RAW" without a close-up lens fitted.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 08:02:51 pm
content: Direct comparison of images captured with and without the supplemental close-up lens fitted to the camera. The first of each pair of images is without the supplemntal lens fitted.Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 08:10:54 pm
content: My conclusion from this simple test was that the camera, as supplied, can image a PCB adequately due to its close focus capability.I will do further tests that are more meaningful to determine whether a supplemental lens offers any benefits on this camera. Clearly for optimum focus at very close range, some form of additional lens would be of benefit to the imaging, but for basic PCB imaging it seems to cope quite well without any additional optics.I will do a 'fine wire' minimum focus distance check on the camera as well.Fraser

author: Vipitis
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 10:32:18 pm
content: Buy like 24 of them and put them in an array. Try to stich it together.

author: Hydron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 11:12:17 pm
content: Uh... I think I just nabbed the final one- all gone in a day! Probably would have ordered a couple more for work if there was more stock, but toys for me come before toys for workCheers for the heads up Fraser & electr_peter - I have other cameras going up to VGA resolution, but they're certainly not as small and handy to use, and being designed for applications other than measurement they don't have nice temperature scales etc.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 11:23:58 pm
content: I just did a really crude minimum focus distance check on my camera with a warm Matt painted paper clip…… I was somewhat surprised to discover it is around 2” (50mm) !That seems awfully close for a fixed focus camera. I have a feeling that the Lepton core is set to favour closer targets, rather than distant ones. Bill discovered that the Lepton 3 focus was not optimised for generic use. In this case, that may actually fall in our favour for PCB useMore after a more formal minimum focus distance test tomorrow. When I have time I can carry out a distance focus test as well but that usually suffers as a result of the image noise present in these cores.Fraser

author: Hydron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 31, 2021, 11:41:23 pm
content: I've got a number of elements (both ZnSe and Ge) that I can try infront of mine, but to be honest if I need really close-up imaging (albeit without radiometric data) I've got other options - those close up lenses from ivaylo plus a VGA core let you image at least down to 01005s.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2021, 12:05:15 am
content: Hydron,I hope you find your Multicomp camera useful. It would have been great to get the 120 x 90 pixel model but at this price I could not resist itIt is like having a tape measure in your pocket or tool kit. Want to know your soldering iron tip temperature…. No problem, just check it with this cameraNeed to quickly check a PCB for basic thermal activity, no problem, this camera can often help with that as well. There are so many everyday uses for this convenient little camera and I have already forgiven its low resolution as it is adequate for simple tasks. As with you, I have better cameras that I can call upon if needed. There is a significant difference in convenience between my FLIR E60+ And this compact pocket camera. I could use one of my Seek Reveal PRO units but their form factor does not always fit some tasks, such as PCB inspection. I do like my Reveal Pro units though…. Very Star Trek !I have both FLIR One G2 and Seek Thermal Classic dongles but find them to be a faff to use as you have to get your phone, plug the dongle into it, start the app and then hold the phone right for imaging without dropping it ! The compact Multicomp camera is far quicker to use and is self contained, which I prefer. I would love a 160 x 120 pixel version of it so we need some very clever person to rewrite its firmware to accept a Lepton 3.5 as I have a few of those in stock…….. just kidding, rewriting the firmware for the Lepton 3.x series cores is challenging due to its quad image packet set that needs to be combined to form one frame, plus the greater processing overhead involved in the higher resolution images. I can dream thoughWe may yet see a higher resolution version of this camera if Uni-T decide to use an Infiray Tiny1 core rather than the Guide 120 x 90 TIMO core used in the UTi120P.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2021, 12:20:45 am
content: I just spoke with the seller again. As suspected, all cameras have been sold. I think he may have been pleasantly surprised at how quickly they soldFraser

author: kripton2035
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2021, 07:04:57 am
content: did you ask for a commission as "influencer" ?

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2021, 08:12:38 am
content: Nah,,that is not me at all

author: Hydron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2021, 08:30:18 am
content: Quote from: Fraser on November 01, 2021, 12:20:45 am... Or annoyed that that the price had been set well below what people might have actually paidThen again, I probably would have passed at £100, but it didn't need any thought at £55, and sometimes an easy sale is the best option.

author: Fred27
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 01, 2021, 09:08:25 am
content: Damn! I missed this. I couldn't justify the £100 previously but would definitely have gone for one at £55.Quote from: Fraser on October 31, 2021, 01:50:32 pmSomebody must be taking up the slack now that toploser has moved to France and stopped tempting us with all those deals on returns, etc.

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2021, 09:49:06 am
content: I'm somewhat confused how they can sell this camera for ~100 USD, when the Uni-t branded one is ~300.In any case, I hope they will be able to fit a cheap 120x160 sensor with a cheap camera sensor into a USB-C plug sensor, and have something like the Filr one pro. Or at least integrate some cheap Wifi image and file streaming into a standalone unit.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2021, 10:00:23 am
content: I am pleased to say that the seller is not annoyed at the price he sold at. He is selling stock that he no longer needs. I have pointed him in the direction of the EEVBlog buy and sell area as a possible additional sales outlet. As has been stated, we miss having Toploser around to tempt us with his excellent offeringsAs to the amazing price that many of us have benefitted from. I have no idea how these units can be sold so cheaply. I can only assume that Farnell are discontinuing the product so effectively ‘dumped’ the stock via their trade counters. I saw that Newark/Farnell Canada had these units heavily discounted, but nowhere near the prices we have seen in the UK. As I stated, one seller offered two of these at £40 each in October so we can assume that he paid less than that for them from Farnell !Toploser would have more of an insight into how Farnell and RS discount unwanted/discontinued products.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2021, 02:28:13 pm
content: Newark (Canada) have this camera on discount at the moment… Ca$375.31 from an original Ca$466.31https://canada.newark.com/multicomp-pro/mp780429/thermal-imager-51-x-38deg-c-9hz/dp/68AH8496?st=multicomp%20cameraThey do not appear to be disposing of their stock.Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2021, 02:36:25 pm
content: Farnell UK are showing new stock arriving 28th March 2022, so it does not appear that they are not discontinuing the camera. They are asking £238.99 +20% Vat for it !https://uk.farnell.com/multicomp-pro/mp780429/thermal-imager-51-x-38deg-c-9hz/dp/3394756?st=multicomp%20cameraI think those of us who bought one of these cameras in the latest eBay sales got a good deal on them, even at the £99 price pointThe mystery of how these cameras came to market so cheaply remains but the fact that both sellers were also selling many R-Pi units suggests a Farnell Trade Counter deal….why do this when new stock is not arriving until March 2022, I have no idea. A mass return of unwanted unit’s from organisations that bought them for Fever Detection maybe ? If so, that was a poor purchase choice.Fraser

author: tszaboo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2021, 02:51:36 pm
content: Quote from: Fraser on November 01, 2021, 02:36:25 pmB-stock, water damage, damaged packaging, "It fell from the truck and we found it on the side of the road".

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2021, 02:59:34 pm
content: I do not think so. No water damage, no packaging damage, no evidence of use and no attempt to sell surreptitiously by removing serial number labels. Legit sellers from what I could see. In some cases, an item that is sold and then returned, even if unused, cannot be sold as brand new again. I am no expert on consumer law and returns procedures though.

author: Bill W
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 01, 2021, 11:03:35 pm
content: Quote from: Fraser on November 01, 2021, 02:36:25 pmFarnell selling at £240 suggests a wholesale price of £120 (RS and Farnell simply double their purchase cost for simpler items). As such £99 for the previous batch could be 'at cost' given shipping costs etc since thenBill

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 02, 2021, 10:41:30 pm
content: My Multicomp thermal camera arrived safely today. Brand new with no signs of useVery happy with itFor those wanting the PC software I downloaded it from the Uni-Trend web site as I could not find it on the Multicomp site.Fraser

author: Hydron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2021, 10:41:55 am
content: Mine arrived this morning - very happy with the purchase. Thanks for the heads up about the software.

author: electr_peter
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 03, 2021, 11:22:50 am
content: It seems that shipping is quicker for some than others.Photos by @Frasershow this camera is useful for board work even with no lenses as well as for general use - incredible valueFor a reference, PC SW can be found on UNI-T website. Downloads is ~50MB and it takes long time.https://www.uni-trend.com/meters/html/product/Environmental/Thermal_Imager/Portable%20Series/UTi80P.htmlUTi80P software installation file (.exe)UTi80P software installation instructionUTi80P software installation file (.zip)Would SW by @joe-cwork with UTi80P/MP780429 camera?freeware-software-for-thermal-analysis-thermovision_joec

author: kripton2035
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2021, 11:46:42 am
content: mine is announced for 16th nov...but hey it has the Manche sea to cross !before brexit it took a week for a packet to come from UK to francenow it takes more than 2 weeks !and I'm not sure it will not be refused by customs...

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2021, 11:52:25 am
content: Refused by customs ? Why ?eBay sort out the Taxes for you as part of the auction administration so French Customs should be content with that side of things. It does contain a Lithium Battery but is otherwise a non controlled product. It’s not like it’s British fish is itHope all goes well with the delivery for you. The arrival estimates can be very pessimistic so it may arrive sooner than expected.Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2021, 12:37:49 pm
content: For anyone wanting the flexible gooseneck mounting solution, you need two parts if you buy what I did. The gooseneck mount plus a thread adapter.I provide links to the two parts below……https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/202077414317Cost :£14.95 but very high quality with a nice heavy cast Iron base. The brand is “Pulsar” and it is a microphone stand. It is unusual in that it has a 3/8” male thread at the top that is fitted with a 3/8” to Microphone stand male thread adapter when delivered. Just replace that adapter with the 3/8” to 1/4” type and you are all set up for PCB inspectionThe thread adapter 3/8” female to 1/4” malehttps://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Male-1-4-to-Female-3-8-Threaded-Screw-Converter-Adapter-for-Mounting-Camera-and-/313667370475?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l49286&mkrid=710-127635-2958-0There are cheaper versions but this one is good and solidThis one costs £3.60 and is a generic brand.Fraser

author: kripton2035
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2021, 12:39:04 pm
content: it's square, it could be assimiled to some breaded fish with no chips...oh wait ! there ARE chips inside !

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2021, 04:28:03 pm
content: The Kodak supplemental lens set for mobile phones has arrived. It is well made but I am not sure I am sold on the mounting arrangement. A custom 3D printed supplemental lens holder would likely be a better option but that is on the to-do list and may never get done by me. The lenses in the kit contain glass lens elements and are easily dismantled to permit re-purposing of the lens barrel. I saw no vignetting in a quick test of the 'fisheye' lens barrel.All in all, an interesting design and you get three different lenses (the Macro lens is part of the wide lens) plus two of the lens mounts for around a Fiver so not bad value really.Fraser

author: Hydron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2021, 09:20:22 pm
content: Quote from: electr_peter on November 03, 2021, 11:22:50 amJust tried it, it can read it partially in "Uni-T" mode but the image is corrupted - probably due to the wrong resolution image being supplied (the Uni-T cameras on the support list are likely higher resolution). It is however reporting the same min/max temp range, and there is recognisable detail in the image, so hopefully an easy change by JoeC to add support.Btw it's easy to get into the camera (just requires a philips #1 with a reasonably slim shank). I didn't pull the screen off however to check what micro is in use (it lives underneath, nothing interesting to see without removing it other than the sensor), as I didn't want to worry about getting dust or fingerprints on the screen (which is behind a plastic cover). There is a SWDebug port present if somebody wanted to have a go at some reverse engineering.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2021, 10:14:07 pm
content: I just completed a very simple focus test on the Multicomp thermal camera using my hot wire thermal targetDetails of the test target used in this test.The target is 0.38mm diameter Nichrome wire mounted on a circular frame to form a cross. There is an insulator at the crossing point of the wire in the centre. The insulator is a nylon 'top hat' type normally used on TO3 transistor mounts. The Outer diameter of the insulator is 8mm and the outer diameter of the smaller central section is 3.9mm. The hot wire trarget frame diameter is 255mm. As will be seen in the test images, the hot wire is not actually run hot, it is operated above ambient. I normally run it at less than 30C. The Nichrome wire is painted with matt enamel paint that can easily cope with the temperature that I run the wire at.The target is operated with the crossed wires in an 'X' shape to produce an angled hot wire across teh cameras image that shows more pixel detail than a wire in the vertical or horizontal plane.The Test.The testing of the Multicomp camera comes with its own issues due to the low pixel count and relatively wide angle lens. This combination results in a relatively large IFOV. This needs to be considered when carrying out a fine wire test as the 0.38mm thick. wire may be imaged at close range but as the camera moves away from the fine wire, the number of pixels that see its width will reduce until only one pixel registers the wire width. Beyond that point, the wires width will illuminate less than one pixel with associated imaging degradation. This is why the fine wire target is not appropriate for use in a long range test of the Multicomp camera. I may go into more detail on this topic later but for now, I present the results of the close range test for your delight and delectationThe test was carried out at a number of distances between the camera and the hot wire target. I have annotated each picture with the distance at which it was taken from the target. There are two sets of tests, the 'hot cross' and the 'hot angled wire'. Each has its uses but in this case it is showing quality of focus at different distances. The results are interesting.Enjoy !FraserFirst the 100cm to 10cm 'Hot Cross' test.....

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2021, 10:15:29 pm
content: Continued... The 'Hot Cross' 10cm to 1cm test

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2021, 10:17:17 pm
content: The 'Hot angled wire' test.......

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2021, 10:29:21 pm
content: So what is the minimum focus distance of the Multicomp camera ?Well from what I can see, I would say it is at around 100mmThis is why a 100mm focus distance ZnSe close-up lens made little improvement in the produced image.Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2021, 10:38:32 pm
content: I forgot to post a picture of the test target so here it is......

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 03, 2021, 11:30:12 pm
content: I just looked up the data on the FLIR AX8 as that uses the Lepton 2 series and will be very similar to the Multicomp camera in terms of its imaging performance and IFOV.There is some useful data included on this page…..https://flir.custhelp.com/app/utils/fl_fovCalc/pn/71201-0101/ret_url/%252Fapp%252Ffl_download_datasheets%252Fid%252F17I will repeat some details here……Focal length : 1.54mmClose Focus : 0.1m (10cm)Hyperfocal distance : 0.07m (7cm)IFOV:At0.5mdistance from TargetHFOV : 0.44m (44cm)VFOV : 0.33m (33cm)DOF Near : 0.06m (6cm)DOF Far : InfiniteIFOV : 5.52mmAt1.0mdistance from TargetHFOV : 0.88m (88cm)VFOV : 0.66m (66cm)DOF Near : 0.07m (7cm)DOF Far : InfiniteIFOV : 11.04mmConsider the IFOV in my tests against a 0.38mm wire !The Lepton 2.x has too wide a field of view and IFOV for my liking but if you can get close enough to the target it delivers decent imagery.At the closest distance that decent focus is present, namely 100mm the figures look like this…..At0.1mdistance from TargetHFOV : 0.09m (9cm)VFOV : 0.07m (7cm)DOF Near : 0.04m (4cm)DOF Far : InfiniteIFOV : 1.1mmThis is closer to where we need to be for PCB inspectionFitting a 50mm focus distance ZnSe supplemental lens may improve matters further but anything greater than that is unlikely to offer much improvement due to the Leptons standard close focus abilities.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2021, 12:11:42 am
content: For anyone wanting more technical detail of the FLIR Lepton 2.5 imaging core that is at the heart of the Multicomp camera, here is the detailed technical documentation from FLIR…..https://lepton.flir.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/flir-lepton-engineering-datasheet-203.pdfFraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2021, 06:00:57 pm
content: A simple range test was completed todayBefore we look at the pictures we need to look at the effect IFOV, as we did previously with the close range tests.The IFOV of a camera and lens system will effect what can be seen at range and how many pixels are able to see the target at any instant in time. Why is this important ? Well if you have a 1000 pixels seeing the target, that may show a nice thermal response on the display. If 100 can see the target, a lesser, but still useable thermal response will appear in the display. Even at 10 pixels seeing the target the user will be able to see the target. At lower than 10 pixels seeing the target, life can become more complex, especially if there is noise in the image. As a rule the minimum number of pixels you need seeing the target, for it to be discernible, to the user is 4. Less than that and there is a probability that the camera and user will not provide reliable results. The Delta T in a scene also effects the users ability to see the target as a low Delta T scene may mean a narrower span is in use and the noise level in the image can rise, disguising the target. The other posbility is a very large Delta T that forces an auto ranging camera to set a very large span that lessens the contrast in the image.In this range test I am expecting the camera to struggle due to the combination of its 80 x 60 pixel FPA and and 50 degree wide angle lens. I saw the expected results in my testing. I will detail the IFOV figures below so that readers can see the dimensions of a single pixel 'on target'. If this is unclear.... if the IFOV at 2m results in a pixel size on target of 20mm then a 20mm x 20mm target will illuminate just one pixel. A 40mm x 40mm target will illuminate 4 pixels and a 80mm x 80mm target will illuminate 16 pixels. Bearing in mind my previous comments, the camera will struggle with the target that is less than 40mm x 40mm in size and will not show any shape detail (other than square!) until any least 80mm x 80mm in size.Multicomp thermal camera IFOV at defined distances:1m : 11.04mm Recommended Target size for 2 x 2 pixel detection = 22mm x 22mm2m : 22.08mm Recommended Target size for 2 x 2 pixel detection = 44mm x 44mm3m : 33.12mm Recommended Target size for 2 x 2 pixel detection = 66mm x 66mm4m : 44.16mm Recommended Target size for 2 x 2 pixel detection = 88mm x 88mm5m : 55.19mm Recommended Target size for 2 x 2 pixel detection = 110mm x 110mm6m : 66.23mm Recommended Target size for 2 x 2 pixel detection = 132mm x 132mm7m : 77.27mm Recommended Target size for 2 x 2 pixel detection = 154mm x 154mm8m : 88.31mm Recommended Target size for 2 x 2 pixel detection = 176mm x 176mm9m : 99.35mm Recommended Target size for 2 x 2 pixel detection = 198mm x198mm10m : 110.39mm Recommended Target size for 2 x 2 pixel detection = 220mm x 220mmNow before anybody gets too excited, remember that the above is just for "Detection" and those pixel on target sizes will also dictate how much detail may be seen. That is to say, if a large target contains fine detail, that may not be seen if that details size falls below the threshold of detection. Interpolation of the low resolution image can assist in improving the appearance of an image, but if not enough pixels actually see the detail, interpolation cannot help much, if at all.The test target that I chose to use in this test is a Leslie's Cube. This is a thermography training device that is a copper hollow cube that has diffrent emissivity surfaces on four of its sides. The copper cube is filled with hot water and the difference in surface emissivity, and its effect on IR measurements, is shown to the students. I am using it as a simple 100mm x 100mm high emissivity thermal target. Its known emitter face dimensions may be used with the IFOV to test the theroy of what I detailed above. For decent detection with the stated IFOV on the Multicomp camera we should image the cubes 100mm x 100mm face at no greater than 4m. We shall see what happens after that 4m point in the images that follow. Remember what I said earlier, we want 4 pixels on the target, with anything less risking issues for the camera and user and there will still be no real detail in the produced target image. In this case we are using a square emitter surface so the shape identification is not demanding ! As we move futher away from the Target I believe we will see the cubes square face lose its edges and become a 'blob' of no defined shape. At a distance from target of 9m, the camera will have only one pixel 'on target' and the camera will likley stugggle to show that clearly to the user. The cameras auto span system may also struggle at this point to set the correct span if the measurement system does not get decent data from the single pixel that sees the target. The targets energy can bridge across two or even more pixels but the pixels will output poor data.So with all of that out of the way... to the pictures......Each picture has the distance to target as its name. I produced two test runs. One with center spot measurement, and one without, to give a clear view of the cube to us.The first pictures are of the Leslie's cube.Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2021, 06:04:25 pm
content: Range test with centre spot temperature measurement active.Tests occur in 1m steps starting at a distance of 1m from the Leslie's cube.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2021, 06:07:09 pm
content: The same test run without centre spot temperature measurement.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2021, 06:11:52 pm
content: In the images, above, note the issue that occurs at the greater distances when the sky becomes visible to the cameras auto span setting system. To avoid this effect the cameras field of view needs to controlled to prevent the cold sky being imaged.Example images folow. Some of these were at a distance of 7m :

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2021, 06:15:32 pm
content: Some more images that I captured whilst in the garden.These include views of the tree line including the sky and the gas boiler exhaust port.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2021, 06:20:28 pm
content: As a final little test, I imaged teh Leslies cube sidesBlack, Black, White and bare dull Copper

author: electr_peter
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 04, 2021, 06:27:22 pm
content: Pictures of a cube above would be more comparable if temp range was locked to be the same (same color would mean same temp). Sky above the house influenced scale too much, contrast is gone. Noise may be an much more visible with narrow temp range though.Would it be possible to adjust temp range coloring in UNI-T SW with post-processing? Or any other SW for that matter? @joe-cSW is not available as of now for UTi80P (fingers crossed).Quote from: Fraser on November 01, 2021, 02:36:25 pmBased on my experience with thermal cameras detecting fever is not as easy as it looks (measurement is person and body part dependent, small temp. difference and accuracy issues, etc.). There are commercial products that claim fever detection on customers entering shops and such but I have not seen effectiveness metrics or actual data.Do you know of any literature on human temp reading with thermal cameras (how accurate it is, any issues with it)?

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2021, 07:05:43 pm
content: What we have not discussed in these range tests is the quality of the optics and their effect on the test.The Lepton series of cores use a pretty heavily compromised Silicon lens system that does degrade the imagery that the rest of the core produces. We are aware that he lens system provides amazing close focus capabilities but what about its performance imaging targets at greater distances ? Bill_W has shown in his tests that there is definitely room for improvement in a Lepton 3 (160 x 120 pixels) core so the Lepton 2 is likely to also benefit from either focus adjustment or replacement of the silicon lens with something of better optical quality. Sadly a decent Chalcogenide or Germanium lens will cost far more than the camera is worth. If the focus is adjusted to favour distant objects, the close focus capability will likely be impacted so a close-up lens may be needed, just as with other thermal cameras.The design of the Lepton 2 core with its integrated FFC flag mechanism precludes manual adjustment by the user whilst the camera is in use. The FFC flag assembly is mounted in front of the lens rather than the more common location behind the lens.I may well experiment with the little Multicomp cameras Lepton core when I have more time.To my mind, this Multicomp thermal camera is intended for close target use of likely less than 2m distance. This would explain the amazing close focus capability. Image quality drops significantly as you increase the distance to target as shown in this test.Fraser

author: Caliaxy
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2021, 09:42:45 pm
content: Quote from: Fraser on November 04, 2021, 12:11:42 amNice little camera, indeed - thank you for the enthusiastic and extended review.Are you sure it uses a FLIR Lepton 2.5 core? The specifications seem slightly different. Uni-T/Multicomp claim a "basic accuracy" of +/-2C deg (or 2%) between -10C - 140C, whereas the Lepton 2.5 core datasheet states +/-5C at 25C. Also (if I'm reading the data sheets right), the sensitivity (NETD, Noise Equivalent Temperature Difference?) is different as well (<0.15C in Uni-T vs <0.5C in Lepton 2.5).It looks like the camera has better published specs than the Lepton 2.5 sensor.

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2021, 10:02:59 pm
content: The specifications of thermal cameras that use the Lepton cores seem to vary somewhat. The comparison of the FLIR AX8 to the Multicomp camera shows this. The AX8 has a stated NETD of 100mK and an accuracy of +/-2C or 2% (whichever is greater)FLIR state that the Lepton cores basic accuracy may be improved by the host processor system.https://www.flirmedia.com/MMC/THG/Brochures/AUT_017/AUT_017_EN.pdfFraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2021, 11:07:31 pm
content: A look inside the Multicomp/Uni-Trend thermal cameraThis is not a full teardown. I semi dismantled the camera to see what lives inside and found much of what I expected to see.The FLIR Lepton 2.5 is mounted in the usual socket but is retained in place with a nice solid plastic bracket that also incorporates the protective window. A foam dust and fluid gasket surrounds that window. The LCD display panel is mounted on the PCB using metal twist tabs and this module covers most of the PCB. The units processor resides under the LCD panel but I did not access this area. I would expect to find whatever processor Uni-Trend use in their other thermal cameras, or a relative of it. It is likely one of the many ARM processors as these are favourites for use in thermal cameras like this unit.There is a 24LC256 eeprom below the LCD panel. I also looked at the quality and mounting of the Micro USB connector and it looks solid enough.An easy repair if ever needed anyway. The battery is a single foil pack LiPO with a stated capacity of 1300mAh.Not much to see in this little camera but then that is no surprise. The tiny Lepton core does the image capturing and the processor 'just' deals with presentation of the data to the user and storage on the Micro SD card. With a 80 x 60 pixel FPA and only <9fps to present to the user, the demands on the processor are likely relatively low in this unit.The PCB is marked up as a UTi80P and dated 19 May 2020Fraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2021, 11:08:29 pm
content: Continued.....

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 04, 2021, 11:19:26 pm
content: For anyone wondering about the purpose of the 8 pin "TP4056" IC (near the Micro USB connector).... it is a 1A standalone Linear Li-Ion battery charger IC. Data sheet to be found at the following link and attached.https://dlnmh9ip6v2uc.cloudfront.net/datasheets/Prototyping/TP4056.pdfFraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 05, 2021, 12:05:59 am
content: My opinion of the design and build quality found in this unit ?More than acceptable. Very good in factFraser

author: electr_peter
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: November 09, 2021, 12:11:31 pm
content: Quote from: Fraser on October 14, 2021, 12:24:42 pmActually there are four different Palettes: Iron, rainbow, grey andfast(high temps in orange-yellow, lower temps in grey white). Turn of all menus with photo(back) button, then press right button to enable/disable "fast" color mode.Also, you can force camera to do a calibration routine. Turn of all menus with photo(back) button, then press left button to calibrate (it will click and show "calibrating" on screen for 1 second).

author: kripton2035
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: November 10, 2021, 08:15:31 pm
content: I received my device today, expected on 16th, received on 10th. nice surpriseand I must say that for the price it's a real nice little device, always on hand, ready to shoot some thermal image, not a lot of resolution , but enough for most.thank you Fraser and elect_peter to make me aware of this opportunity.

author: electr_peter
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 06, 2023, 07:51:35 pm
content: Uni-T offers some factory made attachments with lenses for other cameras asaccesories, but not for UTi80P/UTi120P range.Are there any thermal lenses available for Uni-T UTi80P/UTi120P cameras (for looking at PCBs at short range)? Or DIY solutions?

author: isecus88
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: October 10, 2023, 02:47:45 am
content: UTi80P resolution is 80*60, UTi120P resolution is 120*90.These resolution is too low. Even you add a micro lens, still can not see much details. So please please give up lolThe cameras are not designed for PCB inspection.That's why, UNI-T released several models from low to high resolution, targetting at different requirements.If you want for PCB inspection, invest on others models, such as UTi260B which is strongly recommended. Generally speaking, UTi260B is at high performance/price rate. As I know, it is the best selling model in their collection.See this video lol:How to use UTi260B to inspect PCB faulty points easily:https://youtu.be/xNmfwVD8b_I

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 10, 2023, 12:52:40 pm
content: With the release of the many new thermal camera models during and after the Pandemic it is fair to say that low resolution cameras, such as detailed in this thread, are now less attractive unless at bargain prices. Even at low prices it is worth considering the fact that cameras offering 256 x 192 pixels are now not that expensive. The improvement in image of those units over a 80 x 60 pixel camera is significant in almost all applications. I used to consider my minimum recommend resolution for PCB work to be 160 x 120 pixels but with recent camera releases, I agree that 256 x 192 pixels is a good choice if the price is right. I bought 160 x 120 pixel Hikvision DS-2TP31B and DS-2TP21B cameras at bargain prices and they are definitely very useable for PCB inspection work during repairs. So my 160 x 120 pixel minimum specification for PCB work remains valid, but 256 x 192 is obviously better if the camera is decent and the price competitive. 320 x 240 pixels is even better if the price is rightFraser

author: Fraser
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 10, 2023, 04:16:15 pm
content: Regarding whether an 80 x 60 pixel camera still has something to offer ….. in my opinion such a camera is definitely better than having to use an IR Thermometer as the pixel size on target is smaller and there is some context to a thermal image. I have tested a 80 x 60 pixel camera on PCB repairs and it is a fact that you do not need a high resolution thermal camera to see that a component or IC is getting hot when it should not. Higher resolution does make it easier to identify exactly which component is generating the heat, but the use of a 80 x 60 pixel camera plus some iPA for evaporation tests is still very effective in my experience. If you already own an 80 x 60 pixel camera, there is no need to upgrade unless finances make such easy. Spending $15 on a ZnSe CO2 laser focus close-up lens for such a camera is not a waste if it makes the camera more useable, possibly avoiding the need to spend more money on an upgrade.As a side comment,, a long time ago (in thermal imaging history terms) a company called IRISYS made people counting sensors that used a 16 x 16 pixel pyroelectric thermal sensor. That company adapted the technology to produce an affordable thermal camera for Industry. The IRI1001 was born. That camera used a 16 x 16 pixel FPA , the data from which was interpolated up to 128 x 128 pixels ! Now I would be the first to say that the capabilities of such a thermal camera would be severely limited by the very low resolution of ten thermal sensor array, but that camera was better than nothing in many applications where a ‘full fat’ thermal camera could not be afforded and it did serve its owners well until better affordable technology was developed. More recently that same company, IRISYS, developed the VT02 and VT04 “visual thermometers” for FLUKE. The VT02 was basically an updated version of the IRI1001/IRI1002 that used a similar 16 x 16 thermal imaging sensor array with its image data interpolated up to the resolution of the built in display. The thermal image was combined with a visible light image to provide context to the very low resolution thermal image. The VT04 used 32 x 32 pixels and was supposed to be the “advanced” modelThose visual thermometers were effectively a ‘poor man’s’ thermal imager but they were not so cheap ! FLUKE’s mother company ended up buying IRISYS for their advanced people counting technology.Compared to the FLUKE VT02 and VT04, a humble 80 x 60 pixels thermal imaging camera suddenly looks very appealing !

author: electr_peter
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 10, 2023, 04:24:46 pm
content: I use UTi80P as a general purpose camera around the house, it is actually useful to track heat/cold related issues, as well as quickly diagnose bigger electric circuits.But I agree with the point that such low resolution is may not be that useful for close up of PCBs. I will ask for a macro lens to try few times just to be sure.Form factor of UTi80P is very nice and portable, it does not require a phone to work. Any suggestions in similar form factor?