Which one should I buy? Agilent DSO8104A vs Agilent MSO54832D - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: 2nOrderEDO
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 24, 2021, 08:43:56 pm
content: Hello folks,I have been presented a rare opportunity to buy one of these very nice Agilent scopes for a very resasonable price. Both are in really good condition, I must say.DSO8104Afor 1600 €4 channel, 1 GHz, 4 GSa/s8.4" Display with 1024 x 768 pixelsWindows XP Pro, Intel Celeron 3.2 GHz, 1 GB DDR264 Mpts memory optionGeneral Bundle, Application Bundle, Automotive Bundle, Power, USB, DDR1, etc...Doesn't include any probesMSO54832Dfor 1200 €8.4" Display with 640 x 480 pixels4 channel, 1 GHz, 4 GSa/sWindows XP, "none of that Windows 98 rubbish"8 Mpts memory optionLogic analyzer with fixture includedNo more optionsIncludes 3x Passive 1165A probes (with automatic x10 selection)Both fulfill my 3 main requisites:1. 50 ohm inputs2. High bandwidth (1 GHz at least)3. Smart probe interface for future use of active probes / current probes (I do mainly power electronics)Both models are 1 GHz, 4 GSa/s, 4 channel. MSO54832D seems to fit my needs for less money, but it is 8-10 years older than the DSO8104A. I would buy the DSO8104A because it is more modern, but it is hard to justify 400€ over the MSO54832D just because of this. The MSO54832D also includes the probes, which are not cheap, even if they are passive . I don't care about the logic analyzer since I already own a full featured RTB2000.I would like to hear the opinion of someone who has played with one or both of these scopes and hear your opinions about it. I included the datasheets of both just in case you need them.Kind regards,

author: Venturi962
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 24, 2021, 09:55:49 pm
content: Have owned a 54831B (Non-MSO, 600MHz brother of 54832D), you may want to see if you can determine the Serial Number of the scope and determine if it has the hardware for 64Mpts of memory. All options can be unlocked on these scopes, information is on the EEVBlog forum.From the Datasheet: "After-purchase acquisition memory upgrade option only available on 54830B/31B/32B models with serial number MY41003601 or greater, 54830D/31D/32D models with MY42001901 or greater, or 54833A/33D models with MY43000801 or greater"I'd vote for the MSO54832D, especially with the probes + logic analyzer cable.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 24, 2021, 10:13:34 pm
content: If you don't need the MSO option then get the DSO8104A. But make sure to check the noise specs first. You will want the scope with with lowest noise on the traces.Passive probes are super cheap. You can buy these for around 40 euros each from Testec. There is nothing special about the 1165A probes so don't waste money on them.

author: Wuerstchenhund
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 25, 2021, 09:41:02 am
content: Quote from: 2nOrderEDO on February 24, 2021, 08:43:56 pmYou mean '54832D'. There were no 'DSO'/'MSO' prefixes with the old 54800 Series Infiniium models.QuoteThat depends.We had 58432Ds and DSO8k's at work when those scopes were current, and I still have a DSO8104A as my personal scope. And I can say that, while overall both scopes are somewhat similar (the difference is in the acquisition board I/F controller, the PC part and the display), out of the box the DSO8k is the better scope in almost any way.The 54832D were still part of the old first-gen Infiniium architecture where the display output was created by an old-style hardware overlay between the Pentium 3 mainboard's AGP on-board graphics and a separate graphics card with an ancient Chips & Technology 65500 Series VGA controller. the C&T 65500 VGA controller was designed in the early '90s and even by 1999's standards was already very slow. The crude setup means that the display resolution is fixed to 640x480, which isn't much for a scope with a menu driven UI and a decent amount of advanced functionality. Because a lot of that functionality is controlled through the scope app's menu system, these scopes pretty much require the use of a mouse (there was an option for voice control which worked surprisingly well, which on the 54800 Series also required a dedicated special sound card).The Infiniium 8000 Series is the successor of the 5483xD and was the first Infiniium generation which uses a modern architecture using software overlays (which is much more similar to how newer Infiniium scopes work). The Infiniium 8000 has a Pentium4 PCIe mainboard with DDR2 memory interface for up to 2GB RAM (the 54832D uses PC133 SDRAM for if I remember right up to 256MB or 512MB) and intel GMA Express on-board 3D graphics (there's no second graphics adapter as the GMA chipset supports software overlay), which overall makes the PC and graphics subsystem notably faster than on earlier Infiniium scopes and allows the use of a higher resolution (1024x768) for the scope app.On top of that, the Infiniium 8000 also has a XGA touchscreen instead of the simple VGA display of the 54800 Series, although 8.4" is simply is too small to work well for people with large fingers. There is a voice control option for the Infiniium 8000 as well, and here it's just a software add-on (no additional sound hardware required due to the better on-board sound and higher CPU performance).Lastly, the Infiniium 8000's more modern mainboard uses SATA for mass storage (the 54832D uses IDE) which makes it simple to replace the spinning rust laptop drives (which are often Fujitsu ones which are notorious for failing silently) with s standard 2.5" SATA SSD, and the 54800's floptical drive was replaced by an USB port which in this day and age is vastly more useful.Early Infiniium 8000's can be easily recognized on the presence of the rear CD drive (which was removed in later production runs).There are ways to alleviate the 54832D's disadvantages. Some people have replaced the old mainboard and the dual graphics card setup in these scopes with a modern mainboard and a more modern OS with some success, although because the ATX I/O area in those scopes is part of the mainboard tray replacing the mainboard requires cutting an opening for a standard ATX I/O shield in that tray. If it's worth the effort I don't know (because Infiniium scopes are ASIC based scopes there is a limit to the performance increase you'd get with a new mainboard).Tl;dr: it pretty much comes down to what you need. If you have use for the MSO functionality then the 54832D is certainly worth considering (but check the S/N to see if the scope has the acquisition board with 128M sample memory), also if you plan to do some heavy modifications (like a new mainboard and screen), however if you don't need MSO and want to use the scopes pretty much as they are now then in my opinion the DSO8104A is well worth the 400EUR extra (however, I'd spend 5EUR on a faster Pentium4 processor instead of the Celeron and replace the hard drive with an SSD; maybe also consider upgrading RAM to 2GB).As to passive probes, don't worry about them, as Nico said you can get very good new ones for little money (I also concur with the Testec recommendation).

author: 2nOrderEDO
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 25, 2021, 12:30:42 pm
content: Thank you all for your nice insight.Quote from: Venturi962 on February 24, 2021, 09:55:49 pmI checked and the serial number of this 54832D doesn't belong to those that can be upgraded, so that is a down side for the 54830D.Quote from: nctnico on February 24, 2021, 10:13:34 pmWhen I first created the post (before editing) I had the prices the other way around. The one with the probes is 400 € cheaper. Anyways, It is a good point: probes are cheap, so I shouldn't bother.Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on February 25, 2021, 09:41:02 amThank you Wuerstchenhund, I really appreciate your long comment and your insight (I read it all, just quoting from the Tl;dr). I may upgrade the CPU and RAM of the DSO8104A, but I don't want to go into the rabbithole of a complete overhaul that the 54832D may need, plus the serial number it has shows it doesn't come with the 128 Mb of sampling memory.Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on February 25, 2021, 09:41:02 amYou totally got me there, I added the prefix out of my ass to make it match with the DSO8104A :-)I think for now the balance is much inclined towards the DSO8104A.