A Sad Invention - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: Cyberdragon
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2016, 09:23:42 pm
content: WARNING: MORAL DISCUSSIONI find it utterly disturbing to see that society has devolved into a state where we need this invention.https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/sense-a-life-never-forget-a-child-in-a-car-again-baby-kids#/

author: bitslice
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2016, 09:32:14 pm
content: I left the house without my iPhone once, hope I never have to go through that againActually I've seen enough sleep deprived parents to acknowledge that stuff like this could happen to anyone. If people want to buy gadgets that stop them from nodding off at the wheel or remind them someone is in the back seat, then why not. I can't see that this is necessarily a moral failing, more of a symptom that nobody lives in rose covered cottages any more

author: bitslice
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2016, 09:47:36 pm
content: The design is a bit boring, it would be cooler if it looked like this:especially if it could check your attic for xenomorphs

author: CJay
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2016, 10:02:44 pm
content: Having been a sleep deprived parent of two small people, I can tell you that it is entirely possible to do this, especially if you think your partner has brought said small person in from the car to their nursery and they think you have.

author: rrinker
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2016, 11:15:47 pm
content: Consequence of our video game addicted short attention span generation? I made it through 2 kids and never once even got to the "oops, the baby" stage where I had to go back and retrieve one of them, let alone actually leave one in the car for a while.

author: Brumby
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 01:50:30 am
content: Quote from: rrinker on October 12, 2016, 11:15:47 pmSame here ... and that was with 5.

author: Ratch
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 04:22:10 am
content: Quote from: Cyberdragon on October 12, 2016, 09:23:42 pmI don't think it is society's fault. The problem is with a relatively few members who, for whatever reason, don't keep their minds on the important things. This has happened since the year one, and the invention is not sad. It is instead needed.Ratch

author: NiHaoMike
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 04:42:06 am
content: TI actually has an example MSP430 project that's similar!http://processors.wiki.ti.com/index.php/SafeBABI

author: Red Squirrel
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 04:54:34 am
content: I don't get how people can even forget that. When I have a friend in my car and we're going somewhere I don't just somehow forget that he's with me. How can a mother forget that her child is with her in the car? It kind of boggles my mind. Same deal with pets.That said if such device can save a life, then good I guess, but will the people who are stupid enough to forget their kids in the car even know to buy one."oh that would never happen to me!"

author: Cyberdragon
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 05:06:43 am
content: Quote from: Red Squirrel on October 13, 2016, 04:54:34 amI think social services (in US the CPA) are a far better invention for this job. And you don't have to worry about changing the batteries.

author: sainter
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 05:11:41 am
content: As a parent of two, I can not understand how is it possible to forget your child in the car.

author: sleemanj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 05:12:12 am
content: Quote from: Red Squirrel on October 13, 2016, 04:54:34 amYou have never been driving and suddenly realised "wait, how did I get here"? You have never put down your keys and the next moment can't remember where? You have never asked yourself "did i lock the door?"In the modern world we have many things weighing upon our mind, it is easy to forget, even that you have a child asleep in the backseat... in this case, it only takes one time for it to be fatal.

author: Cyberdragon
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 05:21:36 am
content: Quote from: sleemanj on October 13, 2016, 05:12:12 amThere's a term for that, it's called ADD.

author: zapta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 05:22:08 am
content: Quote from: Red Squirrel on October 13, 2016, 04:54:34 amPets forgetting children in cars? Never heard of such a case.

author: sleemanj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 05:30:06 am
content: Quote from: Cyberdragon on October 13, 2016, 05:21:36 amNo, what i described is perfectly normal human behaviour, and has nothing whatsoever to do with ADD, to suggest otherwise is to egregiously trivialise that psychological disorder.

author: Cyberdragon
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 06:08:27 am
content: Quote from: sleemanj on October 13, 2016, 05:30:06 am(TRIGGER WARNING)No, I was saying specifically leaving the kids in the car is ADD. Keys and whatever else are not your offspring. Humans as an animal species have a natural hardwired instinct to put care of our own children over everything else for the survival of the species. If we have lost this ability for any reason it is by definition of Darwin's theories a major problem. Unless you are under the influence of a drug, this shouldn't happen under normal circumstances. The fact that it does isI agree the device should be used, but not depended on to fulfull a basic human instinct. If this device is used it should have a SIM card in it that contacts CPS (or your country's equivalent) if it gets triggered so they can monitor potentially irresponsible parents. Because just one trigger means the parents probably need some form of help, for whatever reason that caused them to forget where their child was.

author: timgiles
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 08:21:06 am
content: I can not believe that anyone can say there is an excuse for leaving a child in a car unattended.Excuse A. I am tired. Oh really, tired to the point that you can forget a baby in the back seat, then why are you driving? Putting yourself, the child and those other road users at risk.Excuse B. I forgot. You forgot. Really? I bet you didnt forget to check your iphone every 30s. Seriously - is this how you believe you should prioritise your life?Excuse C. I thought my partner had removed child X and they thought I had. Erm.... I assume you were in the car together, are you so infatuated with your phones/each other you have forgotten the life you bought in to the world. I mean come on!No excuse. Ever. These parents should be locked up, their other children taken in to care - since they are clearly unable to function at a level required for that responsibility. This is yet another way bad parents who prioritise anything in the world but their children and get by with that attitude.

author: CJay
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 08:32:59 am
content: Yeah yeah, I'm sure my children would thank you for having them put in care and both parents imprisoned for leaving them fast asleep safely strapped into a baby seat in the car for 5 minutes unattended on the driveway.Good for you.Go take your sanctimonious head and stick it up your arse.

author: HackedFridgeMagnet
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 08:40:36 am
content: Quote from: timgiles on October 13, 2016, 08:21:06 amMaybe before you hand me a life sentence you should rewrite your rules.I left my kids in the car yesterday.I don't think I know any parent who hasn't.Maybe all these parents should be locked up too and you could mind all our kids?

author: dannyf
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 10:08:33 am
content: QuoteYeah. The continuation of this "it takes a village to raise a child" mentality. where is the parental instinct? where is the parental love? I guess some people deserve to go extinct.On the other hand, it is a good thing if the device can save even 1 child.

author: sainter
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 10:48:30 am
content: Quote from: CJay on October 13, 2016, 08:32:59 amThis is the reason of tragedies like stolen cars with kids still inside, children choking on vomit or other things. You CAN NOT leave a child untended (for ages up to 1-2 years), no matter if he is sleeping or not.Do people think they can live like they used to live after kids.About the product. I don't believe single purpose items will be popular. They should be doing much more.

author: Hex173t
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 12:58:17 pm
content: I used to think similar to some of the posts above - How the heck can anyone leave their kid in a car??? What kind of idiot/self centered/more concerned about texting their friends piece of trash would do that???Well it happened to me. I had a 3 month old and a 3 year old and another private complication. I was dead tired. It was July in Texas, I had my 3 month old with me and I drove to get my 3 year old from daycare. Waiting among the parents for my child I noticed someones stroller. That stroller looks just like mine! How nice. Where's my stroller??? OMG!Anyone who has had kids know you don't get much sleep even with 2 parents when kids are tiny. I'd view this not as a sad state of affairs that we need this, more as it's wonderful this technology is there as a backup if things go wrong.

author: Cyberdragon
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 06:03:03 pm
content: Quote from: Hex173t on October 13, 2016, 12:58:17 pmWe have a customer...Quote from: CJay on October 13, 2016, 08:32:59 amIn some US stated it is already illegal and can lead to prison. So if your country adopts these laws...you can say that to the judge and see what happens.http://www.kidsandcars.org/resources/state-laws/

author: RGB255_0_0
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 06:09:26 pm
content: Honestly, they should have marketed to dog owners, although most dog owners who forget about leaving the windows open in the hotter months probably wouldn't buy it anyway.

author: hendorog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 07:05:52 pm
content: I can completely understand how a parent can leave a child in the car by accident. It has nothing to do with mobile phones.Kids often go to sleep in the car, and after a while your mind wanders to other things - like work for example.The human brain is not a simple stupid computer that takes the top item from a prioritised list of available options.Take a look at many aviation accidents. Often the thing that is forgotten is to 'Fly the Plane'. How can any pilot forget to fly the damn plane? But yet it happens.I cannot understand the judgemental nature of several of the comments above. You guys need to get out more.

author: John Coloccia
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 07:15:48 pm
content: Quote from: CJay on October 13, 2016, 08:32:59 amWell said. I'd like to see all the texting and driving a-holes tossed in prison first if you want to do something to help protect kids.I can't imagine doing it, but I can easily see how it happens. Mom is running around with a baby, doing errands. The baby falls asleep. She's on her 4th store to grab food for dinner and momentarily reverts to the old habit she's done for 30 years of simply leaving the car.Times have changed. Baby seats are rear facing now, and they're almost always invariably in the back seat. I have twin girls. Before they switch to forward facing seats you can't even see them because they're completely covered. Much different than when I was growing up, and the fresh memory of getting 2 little girls through the first two years makes it very obvious that a sleep deprived parent, with a sleeping baby and no visual cue that they're in the car, can very easily do something stupid.I don't know any parent that hasn't had at least one case of "OMG, I can't believe I forgot to close the gate!" or "How did you get that fork??" or some other completely stupid thing happen. If you're a parent that claims that's never happened, I'm going to call you a liar. If you're not a parent, you're so clueless what actually goes on that your opinion really is kind of worthless in this case. I know you think you understand, but as Pauli would say, "You're not right. You're not even wrong."Great idea to have a product that backs you up if your brain should ever check out.

author: Cyberdragon
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 08:22:46 pm
content: Quote from: hendorog on October 13, 2016, 07:05:52 pmI'm pretty sure there have also been firefighters that went into burning buidlings and forgot to turn on their oxygen, or parachuters that forgot to pull their chute. The point is instances where our basic instincts fail us should be quite rare. The fact that this is common enough to warrent an invention to prevent it is.To properly determine whether we humans are dumber than we look or whether it is a problem with society, we need to look at history. We need to find out whether leaving children in cars has always been a noticable problem (since say...the 1930s) or whether at some point in history it started becoming a noticable problem.

author: hendorog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 09:20:34 pm
content: Quote from: Cyberdragon on October 13, 2016, 08:22:46 pmOne 'new thing' in modern society is that parents are the only people looking out for their children. In the distant past entire communities looked after the children - there was a comment above about that. More children increase the size of the community and so were valuable to the community as a whole - more warriors, more farmers etc. Big families are good, contraception is bad etc. Big families mean older kids are around and look out for the young ones. Modern families are on average much smaller and so kids are of similar age.Another consideration is that lifestyle has changed radically, people are busier now, do more with their kids and duties are shared more. e.g. In the large families of the past the kids would stay at home with Mum or the nanny or an older sibling babysitter instead of being taken shopping. Fathers wouldn't take their child to daycare on the way to work either.

author: HackedFridgeMagnet
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 09:51:20 pm
content: Quote from: Cyberdragon on October 13, 2016, 06:03:03 pmFirst one on the list.CALIFORNIA: SB 255Unattended Child in Motor Vehicle Act “Kaitlyn’s Law”California Vehicle Code Sections 15620, 15630, 1563215620.(a) A parent, legal guardian, or other person responsible for a child who is 6 years of age or youngermay not leave that child inside a motor vehicle without being subject to the supervision of a personwho is 12 years of age or older, under either of the following circumstances:(1) Where there are conditions that present a significant risk to the child's health or safety.(2) When the vehicle’s engine is running or the vehicle's keys are in the ignition, or both.(b) A violation of subdivision (a) is an infraction punishable by a fine of one hundred dollars ($100),except that the court may reduce or waive the fine if the defendant establishes to the satisfaction ofthe court that he or she is economically disadvantaged and the court, instead, refers the defendant toa community education program that includes education on the dangers of leaving young childrenunattended in motor vehicles, and provides certification of completion of that program. Uponcompletion of that program, the defendant shall provide that certification to the court. The courtmay, at its discretion, require any defendant described in this section to attend an education programon the dangers of leaving young children unattended in motor vehicles.Well hopefully the Judge will read this law before he/she starts throwing parents in prison.By Californian Law, leaving a child in a car does not necessarily equal neglect, whereas leaving in infant in a car in certain circumstances would.Engineers should have no trouble with this logic.Also if people were concerned about child safety they probably should focus on the most obvious dangers first.Like accessible health care, clean water, road accidents and obesity.

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 10:18:21 pm
content: Quote from: sleemanj on October 13, 2016, 05:30:06 am+1 to that. I do that all the time simply because I can't remember, nothing to do with ADD. I am getting older (60 in December) and my memory slips all the time. The locked door part I am very paranoid about. I work from home and have company assets in my office. I NEVER want to leave to run a service call and leave a door unlocked. I have even gotten a couple of miles up the road and turned around because I was worried that I didn't lock a door.

author: VulcanBB18
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 10:27:11 pm
content: Quote from: GreyWoolfe on October 13, 2016, 10:18:21 pmAnd another +1Cyberdragon, it is painfully obvious you've never had children. This is nothing to do with instincts at all, and everything to do with the fact we are squishy, inefficient biological machines that are prone to mistakes, especially when fatigued and doing the same task repeatedly over a long period of time.I've been the young dude who said, "I'll never do that when I have kids!!" and looking back 16 years...yeah I think I did almost every thing I said I wouldn't....just a fact of being human.cheers,

author: iampoor
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 13, 2016, 10:54:42 pm
content: Quote from: Cyberdragon on October 13, 2016, 08:22:46 pmI dont think thats possible in this case. Who recorded that data in the early days of automobiles? Im sure previous generations would record leaving children in cars as accidents. Now we live in a state of liability and blame. I dont think there is a massive problem with parents leaving children in cars, but it is easy to overlook that...since News media LOVES stories that get a rise out of people. If a parent accidentally leaves a child in a car, isnt going through the grief knowing that they accidentally killed a child enough? No, now we need to add prison sentences, and write sensationalized news stories portraying these parents as monsters, when in reality, they had a simple mental slip. I do not have children, but have had some very large mental slips in the past. Devices like these are needed, because in the modern western world, a simple mistake can ruin your life. I think saving a childs life is far more important than most of our other daily pursuits. But hey, what do I know.

author: Cyberdragon
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 01:13:18 am
content: Quote from: VulcanBB18 on October 13, 2016, 10:27:11 pmI'm 20. Of course I don't have kids. Not saying I won't though. Of course I don't know what it's like to be a parent, but I know from others how not to parent, which is a start. Not saying I won't make stupid mistakes. I'm just saying that certain mistakes should be fundamentally harder to make then others. I have taken high school psychology, your brain should be thinking of your kids regardless of whether your mind is.(NOTE: I'm no expert, but I'm applying knowledge to create a logical theory of what is going on here. This is not a simple problem by any means, but I think we should find the best way to solve it.)I'm not talking about walking to the door of a supermarket having forgotten the baby, that is a mental slip. I'm talking about not suddenly realizing that you made an epic mistake immediately, which is not a simple mental slip. Life or death is more than a mental slip, it's a mental meltdown. Like I keep saying, and probably should explain better, is that parental instinct is a subconcious function. It should be fully automatic, just like adrenaline. It should be that little voice in your head that suddenly says "Where's the baby?" within at most a few minutes, regardless of what your concious brain was thinking (or not thinking). Your consious brain should have no bearing as to when your subconcious detects an emergency. The fact that the subconsious brain, which does alot of thinking that you aren't aware of, and has lots of mental alarms to protect life, can be defeated so easily is disturbing. You can't compare this to mistakes that are not life threatening because your subconcious does not prioretise them as important.Yes, your subconsious can make mistakes. The thing is that your subconcious only has one chance to stop your half-asleep mind from touching a hot pan or something. But your subconcious has many chances to realize that your child is missing, yet it just sits there. This suggests that sometimes we aren't as prepared to be parents as we think, I for one want me and my future wife to be as fully prepared as possible to have children. I.E. train our brains to catch stupid mistakes before someone dies.You may or may not have read all that and thought "What a load of!", but to sum it up, all I'm saying is I think some form of psychological approach, like parenting classes (before having kids), would be more effective as it would help the brain better cope with parenthood.But debating this stuff in the chat is pointless unless we have a statistical measure of the members of each stance...so...POLL TIME!

author: ez24
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 01:32:44 am
content: I think a happy invention, not sad.Wish they would have one for me.

author: VulcanBB18
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 02:26:16 am
content: Sorry, but you assertions are just that - your conjecture on what "instincts should be".So basically, yes it's : "What a load of!" "As per the post above , it's really "a happy invention".Not the sign of breakdown of society, actually a sign that people give a $h!t.cheers,

author: sainter
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 05:25:50 am
content: Going apart of the moral issues and more to the product. I think creating devises that are self contained in this age of smart phones, a bit too wasteful. This device, that you have to charge and setup, can be substituted with a BlueTooth tag. So I would sayon this. There are better devices in market at the moment, witch doubles as child health monitor.

author: LordNobady
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 07:52:16 am
content: For all of those that are afraid that the dumb parents will protect there children with this. Those are mostly the ones that say it won't happen to me or the ones that don't care. Those won't by something like this.So all this is, is an extra Darwin moment.I think it is a good invention.

author: iampoor
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 09:38:57 am
content: Quote from: Cyberdragon on October 14, 2016, 01:13:18 amAre you implying that people who make a mistake "dont know how to parent"? And that a class telling them "dont leave your kids in the car" will really fix the problem? Sounds more like extra legislation, just so the DA can point the finger at the parent. The real problem is...none of this "should" happen.....but it does. Human nature is currently marred by the human condition. I dont think the human condition can be overcome by training. Maybe that is the fundamental difference in our thought process?A voluntary response poll is not statistically accurate either

author: John Coloccia
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 12:47:51 pm
content: Quote from: Cyberdragon on October 14, 2016, 01:13:18 amAnd all the pieces click into place. Maybe this entire thread will serve as a valuable lesson for knowing when to stop talking and start listening. Not everything can be learned by browsing websites and thinking about it. One day you'll become a parent and you'll realize just how incredibly stupid you are about the whole thing, just like the rest of us had to learn the hard way too. Parenting classes? ROFL. That would be like going to Lion Tamer classes. Nah. You don't know...you think you know...we all thought we knew....but we didn't know, and neither do you. You'll know someday and you'll laugh at this thread, assuming you have any operating brain cells left to even remember about it.

author: mzzj
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 01:26:06 pm
content: Been picking up my daughter from daycare for 2 years and now we switched around with wifey so that I will take her there in the morning.Yesterday morning I helped off her shoes at daycare, got interrupted by someone coming to chit-chat and got lost in plans.So I put her shoes back on and grab her to my lap to take her to home just like everyday for 2 years. At the door the daycare teacher ask me "where are you taking her"And I think its not too far-fetched that someday I will remember at lunch break that I left my daughter alone at homeProbably she would just be happy...Haven't forget her in a car (yet).Leave her at car intentionally pretty often but I'll always try to make sure it's a visible parking spot if I get struck by lightning at shopping mall etc. etc. while she is sleeping in the car.(and weather here is not like Texas)

author: aandrew
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 01:37:07 pm
content: Quote from: sainter on October 13, 2016, 10:48:30 amSo you sleep with your child in their room for the first two years of their life? Do you not think that most thefts with children in the car are a result of carjacking and not this "epidemic" of people leaving kids in cars?Give your head a shake. I've got six kids and while I don't recall ever leaving one of them in a car unintentionally I have lost them in a store or forgotten to pick them up from school because I thought my wife was getting them today. This kind of thing happens, and you can bet your arse it happened back in the 50s and 60s as well.This thread is such self-congratulatory, holier-than-thou shite.

author: aandrew
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 01:45:37 pm
content: Quote from: Cyberdragon on October 14, 2016, 01:13:18 amThen where the f*ck do you get off acting like some kind of know-it-all arse?Oh wait, you answered that. You're 20. I was 20 once too, but I had largely outgrown all my "I know everything" attitude a few years before that. Then when I turned 30 I realized that NOW I'd finally outgrown all my know-it-all tendencies.At 40, I still find pockets of it.Seriously though, until you've been there it's best to simply not pass judgement based on soundbites you heard on news or funny youtube collage videos about the world's dumbest parents. Having kids really made me respect my own parents. I did take a semester of parenting in high school, which I suspect is similar to the psychology class you took. Let me be the first to tell you this: you didn't learn *shit*.Stop being so judgemental. You come off as a total wanker.

author: 1xrtt
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 04:39:40 pm
content: Quote from: NiHaoMike on October 13, 2016, 04:42:06 amAlthough I believe that technology is not thebestsolution for this problem, this is a neat project. Integrating it with a phone application wouldn't be hard.The wiki have a link to a study on child hyperthermia cases due to being left in a closed vehicle.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 07:17:27 pm
content: It is human failing. I know someone this happened to. Fortunately a security guard saw the child and it turned out well. The problem occurred on transfer of responsibility for the child between two of the most conscientious and caring people I know.Punishment is not the answer in many, perhaps most, cases. If this child had not survived there is no worse punishment you could create for the parents. Taking the child away from these two people is highly statistically unlikely to result in better care for the child (who incidentally is now grown and an obvious product of a good upbringing as is the sibling). These comments obviously don't apply to the parent who deliberately leaves the child to go spend a few hours in a bar or something of that nature.I don't know how you would gather statistics to see how this has gone over time, but I suspect it hasn't changed much. What has changed is at least twofold. At the time automobiles became common family sizes were much larger and child survival rates were much lower. An accident of this sort would have been just one more of the many tragedies associated with childhood. Secondly, as mentioned above, television and the internet have made all news local news. These incidents are still quite rare, a few a year in the US. On the same order as being struck by lightning. But they get sensationalized. As does being hit by lightning.

author: Cerebus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 07:18:54 pm
content: Quote from: timgiles on October 13, 2016, 08:21:06 amWell, when you're a bit older and actually have kids and someday do something like this - because you will - I hope you have the good grace to remember today and immediately turn yourself into social services insisting that they take your children away and imprison you.

author: bitslice
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 07:21:49 pm
content: There is less likelihood of anything bad happening if drivers leave the Mother&Child parking bays free for people with an actual child, and not just those with an inflated sense of self importance.They are right by the entrance so hopefully an abandoned child will be quickly spotted.A quick hello to the twat I met in Tescos earlier, who I stood in front of - while looking at the sign and then at his car and then at him.

author: Cerebus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 07:37:56 pm
content: Quote from: aandrew on October 14, 2016, 01:45:37 pmForty? Huh, you haven't got a true handle on your own ignorance until you're at least 50!All the self-aware folks I know all agree that their own appreciation of their own ignorance only increases with increasing age. I used to marvel at how much I'd managed to learn in my life, now I marvel at how much I still seem to have left to learn. Some people are better than others at learning this earlier in life. Those that do, tend not to suffer so much from Dunning–Kruger effect and consequently disqualify themselves from being in charge of things; those that don't - by the same argument - tend to end up running things. Therefore I predict a great future in politics for some of the more judgemental contributors to this thread.

author: Cerebus
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 07:45:46 pm
content: Quote from: bitslice on October 14, 2016, 07:21:49 pmI have to confess when I see those parking spots wondering why the young and fit parents get special parking spaces near the store when those of us who are getting a bit old, wheezy and arthritic, but not yet actually officially handicapped, get relegated to the furthest reaches of the car park.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 14, 2016, 11:28:08 pm
content: Quote from: Cerebus on October 14, 2016, 07:18:54 pmPeople who make assertions like this are seldom self aware enough to realize that a mistake has been made - unless it has tragic consequences.

author: Don Hills
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 15, 2016, 02:33:25 am
content: When I was 16, my parents didn't know anything. By the time I turned 21, I was amazed how much they'd learnt in just 5 years.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 15, 2016, 04:32:57 pm
content: Quote from: Don Hills on October 15, 2016, 02:33:25 amYou are precocious. My parents didn't start getting smarter until I was in my mid-20s. But I am a slow learner.

author: nuno
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 15, 2016, 05:04:16 pm
content: Sleep deprived people shouldn't be driving in the 1st place... specially the ones deprived to the point they can forget their off-springs in the car (or somewhere else for what it matters).

author: Circlotron
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 15, 2016, 07:53:40 pm
content: And just as surely as the time will come when nobody will know how to read a map or parallel park a car, or even drive a car for that matter, so they won't have the brain power to remember anything when it's all done for them. What fun when the power goes off.

author: dannyf
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 15, 2016, 11:13:58 pm
content: Quotetechnologists have foreseen that for a long time: as we rely more and more on machines, we will develop ourselves less or even degenerate. ....

author: bitslice
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 16, 2016, 03:05:51 am
content: Quote from: Circlotron on October 15, 2016, 07:53:40 pmIt's OK, we will all sit around like the Greeks, discussing Philosophy while our robot slaves do the menial stuff.Or more likely, die in a muddy trench because we didn't want to share our water resources with 10 billion other people.

author: sainter
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 16, 2016, 01:41:45 pm
content: Quote from: aandrew on October 14, 2016, 01:37:07 pmActually I do, further that, I use quite brilliant peace of technology. Baby breathing monitor, it combines regular baby monitor with breathing tracking pad, that alerts if an infant stops breathing.Second, it's dangerous to drive with a child in back seat when he's facing backwards. You can't see him. And I never keep baby seats in the car. This way if you see a seat, that means there is a child in the car.Many thing you do for sake of convenience, makes this kind of things happen. You can prevent accidents, by changing your actions. Inconvenience yourself in sake of your children.Additional help from technology is welcomed one way or the other. But I should be second line of defense. In case you brain went on a vacation. But never to help you remember day to day. Keeping that in mind, buying a product with just one function is wasteful. It's like having one gadget for pealing oranges, other one for apple, second for potato and so on.

author: johansen
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 16, 2016, 02:22:48 pm
content: Quote from: iampoor on October 13, 2016, 10:54:42 pmnothing has changed in thousands of years as far as mistakes go.Quote from: nuno on October 15, 2016, 05:04:16 pmyes, that is one of the elephants in the room. how many more children are killed in auto accidents caused by others who took intentional risks as opposed to mental slips by either the parents or the others involved.intentional risks.. driving while high, drunk, driving on prescription drugs, sleep deprived.. etc.how many accidents are caused by drivers who had a mental slip although they've driven the same route thousands of times....my guess is very, very few.. but still orders of magnitude more than the percentage of children left in vehicles who died. meaning, the risk of your child dying while being left in a vehicle is orders of magnitude less than the risk that a mental slip while driving will kill your child.dependence on technology is not a good idea in general, it just leads to more dependency even if it improves quality of life. for example, recently i rode in a chevy volt. those cars have blind spot detectors.. do you trust them? how many accidents will be or are already caused by a driver forgetting his bro's car doesn't have backup collision avoidance.. or blind spot detectors.. or xyz.

author: aandrew
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 17, 2016, 01:19:30 am
content: Quote from: sainter on October 16, 2016, 01:41:45 pmWe slept with the infants too, but not at two years of age. I think they went to their own rooms when they were able to sleep through the night (it's been a while). Didn't have the breathing monitor, although I admit there were a few nights when I crept into their room because I'd managed to convince myself that there was something wrong. There was: it was me. :-)I am not sure how much I trust technology. There is quite the Twitter thread going on withhttps://twitter.com/JZdziarskitalking about the total failure of the Owlet infant pulse oximeter. Scary stuff to trust, but having been there and done that (babies) I completely understand the thinking.QuoteDangerous for whom? Statistically speaking, the infant is safest in a rear-facing car seat in the back seat of the vehicle. Safer because the parent isn't craning their neck around or asking the passenger to check on the tot? We had a mirror that you put on the rear seat headrest which you could use to see the infant in the rearview mirror, but it didn't get much use.Agreed on the car seats being removed; All of our car seats were the type with a fixed base and the seat which clipped into the base. Made having the baby in a shopping cart way easier as well!QuoteI disagree; If you can get *useful* multi-function devices then yes, but I would never substitute my drawer full of spanners for a single adjustable wrench. Ditto for my screwdrivers vs a multi-driver. There are many, many devices which are far better off being separate items than combined. Hell, my separate prescription sunglasses vs my chromatic regular eyeglasses, separate spoons/forks vs sporks a separate audio amplifier vs built-in speakers in the television, a separate stroller vs "Frame" for the car seat... the list of not-so-useful-as-separate-devices multi-devices really is endless.

author: CatalinaWOW
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 17, 2016, 04:13:38 am
content: I will guarantee that every parent has made some move that could have potentially resulted in the death of their child. The list of possibilities is endless. No matter how many risk mitigation steps you take, there will be residual risk. The most you can do is to take the steps that you feel are practical, necessary or comforting and pray that you do not win the negative lottery. For no matter what you have done, how careful you were, you will not be able to console yourself that you did everything possible if you are so unfortunate as to pull a "winning" ticket in that lottery.Not all of the children who die of accidents in childhood are the progeny of trailer trash, work fanatics, airheads or other folks dismissed so casually and pejoratively in this thread. Be careful of hubris in this area.

author: zapta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 17, 2016, 04:31:34 am
content: Quote from: Don Hills on October 15, 2016, 02:33:25 amThat's poor wisdom.

author: Ampera
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 17, 2016, 05:33:01 am
content: About the poll, does head implosion count as law and punishment?Honestly I can see how one can forget to lock a gate or wonder how their kid got a knife, but I don't see how you can forget a baby (Maybe toddlers if they can't speak yet? Idk) in the car THAT easily. They normally aren't the quietest things in the world.But for any excuse to how you can forget, it doesn't matter how you do it, it's your job to figure out how not to do it no matter how hard that is. I think this seat falls into a market of paranoia, how ungrounded that is, is debatable, but it could sell well.But I can be installing siding on a building and "Forget" to use the right size bolts on the scaffold and kill 5 workers when it all collapses.I can "Forget" to program in a specific security people and get hundreds into financial deep shit.You can make excuses all you want, and I am sure you can find it in your power in complete accident forget your mind in the car and leave without your kid, but it's as I said your job not your excuse to not kill your kid in a car. I do think it is a sad state when we need a product like this, but from a business standpoint it could sell to paranoid parents.And what if you forget your phone? Something I do on occasion (on purpose or by accident).And as a quick comment, on the features listhttp://prntscr.com/cv91bhNo, I want a device that is designed to protect my child to be unsafe for use by children.

author: HackedFridgeMagnet
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 17, 2016, 05:34:41 am
content: Quote from: zapta on October 17, 2016, 04:31:34 am... and there I was thinking it was one of the wisest things in this thread.

author: zapta
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 17, 2016, 06:12:30 am
content: Quote from: HackedFridgeMagnet on October 17, 2016, 05:34:41 amOops. I meant 'pure' but my phone's swipe keyboard disagreed.