Self Study v.s. College - With Some Previous Formal Education - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: rstor22
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2012, 01:12:05 am
content: Hi All,I would like to get everyone’s opinion regarding self study v.s. community college/university when one already has some previous formal education however not directly specializing in the electronics field.I live in Ontario, Canada. I completed a 3-year community college diploma in Computer Engineering Technology in 2003. Recently I completed my Bachelor of Science degree in Computer Information Systems via distance education from a university in the United States.From my studies in Computer Engineering Technology I am really interested in electronics, namely embedded systems. I also enjoyed programming in Assembly and C. Since 2003 I have been working in the IT field in non electronics related positions. I recently decided to re-ignite my interest in electronics.I was thinking of pursuing a second diploma in Electronics Engineering Technology (community college level) so that I could have a deeper understanding of electronics and perhaps find a job in that field afterwards. Though some credits would transfer from my previous studies, I feel that I would enjoy self studying materials via text books. I wanted to get the opinion of others in regards to this.Question 1:If I was to pursue self study to gain deeper knowledge in the electronics field, would I be able to use my Computer Engineering Technology diploma/BS. CIS degree to get the interview, and then show off the skills I learned via self-study in electronics, for a job dealing with electronics at the technologist level where the job posting asks for a 3-year Community College diploma in Electronics Engineering Technology?(in the Canadian or United States job market)Question 2:What about the same situation as above but for a job requiring a degree in Electrical Engineering (B.Eng)?Question 3:When self studying electronics, to what level can one attain without needing to attend formal education? (e.g. the equivalent of a 3-year technologist level? B.Eng level?)

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2012, 01:23:40 am
content: This is a difficult question.With many (all?) jobs, the single biggest hurdle is "getting the interview". If you don't reach the point where a hiring manager can consider you as a potential candidate, then whatever you have going for you is all for nothing. There are many things that can bring you to the attention of someone who might want to hire you (connections to people with influence being really important), but if you don't have connections then your resume needs to get through filters. Two ways your resume can get through filters are qualifications and appropriate experience. If you can demonstrate an appropriate ability to do the job through prior experience, then your academic qualifications may not be so important. But if you don't have appropriate work experience then your academic qualifications are what can carry you to interview.So you perhaps can see the problem. If you do not have appropriate academic qualifications (due to self-study), and you do not have appropriate work experience (you have not worked in this field before), then the only way you will get to an interview is by who you know. You won't get through the HR filter mill just on your resume.My suggestion would be that if you are planning a career change, your chances are best if you acquire a suitable academic qualification in the field.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: June 04, 2012, 02:41:38 am
content: Quote from: rstor22 on June 04, 2012, 01:12:05 amAny level you like, it just takes time and focus.No reason why you can't be better at some level than someone with multiple masters and PhD's in a subject if you really wanted to.Reaching a level in formal education is not a magic ticket to being competent and fully knowledgeable at that level. If anything, it can be regarded as an expected basic level competency.Dave.

author: kiyotewolf
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2012, 04:23:50 pm
content: I got an interview, when I was still a High Schooler, when I asked for $15.00 an hour, back in 199X.OxO~Paul!It helps to ask for wages, well above the expected norm. That's a signal, you demand, no, you ORDER THEM, to pay what you command via your vast experience.

author: Architect_1077
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2012, 05:10:57 pm
content: Quote from: kiyotewolf on June 04, 2012, 04:23:50 pmDepends in what country you live in and what the demand for a job type is. In Portugal employers typically just tell you to F*** off, first and foremost because they are usually prehistoric ignoramuses that think a business is just a cow they can milk forever.

author: mukymuk
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2012, 05:33:39 pm
content: My experience is in the US market only.It's not clear to me if you want to do software or hardware. You mention shooting for a EE position, but you also say you enjoy embedded programming work.Which do you want to do? Yes, you have to choose. These two disciplines have some overlap, but not as much as you might think. Personally I do both, but professionally I've never really seen it work. Being a EE for a company is a full time job and so is being an embedded engineer.If you want to be a EE, then you really need a EE degree. Yes, there might be other paths to that goal, but all things considered, this is your best bet, IMO.Self teaching is fine (great, actually), but you need the paper.If you want to be a embedded engineer, you might not need a specific degree. 15 years ago, you certainly didn't need one, but things are changing. Many embedded folks have EE or CS degrees now. That's the majority of your competition.I think I remember an episode Dave gave on interviewing that talked about bringing your projects to the interview. I think that's an awesome idea. It might help you close the gap between yourself and people with a degree but no real passion. However, there will be a fair number of people that have both. That's really the bottom line. You want to have both.All that said, I think it's possible to teach yourself the equivalent of what you'd learn as a EE or CS major. Definitely not easy, but possible. However, very few companies are going to take a chance on you unless you can really blow their socks of with your creations. And if you can do that, you really shouldn't be working for them--you should be working for you.

author: djsb
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2012, 05:42:57 pm
content: First of all you must secure a job offer and THEN you can NEGOTIATE a salary level if given a choice. DEMANDING a certain salary at interview can price you out of a job.You have to get through the HR paper sifting and then the all important interview first. After you've proved your worth you are in a far better position.It's a good idea to get the names of some big companies on your CV (wether through agency or permanent work) and employers seem to like consistency as you appear a safer bet. The key thing from an employers perspective is COMPETENCE IN ACTION, be prepared to give examples of how you can solve their problems.The main thing is DO NOT LIE ON YOUR CV.Good luck.David.

author: Sionyn
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2012, 06:13:20 pm
content: the industry in uk is very accommodating join some hacker spaces ive been offered jobs there beforewe all know student who got certs that shouldn't

author: kiyotewolf
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: June 04, 2012, 06:17:08 pm
content: "DEMANDING a certain salary at interview can price you out of a job."All I did was put down $15.00 in the desired hourly wage.I didn't speak forcefully to anyone, my words [on the application] did the talking. It was a metaphor, for the message getting through.~Paul!