Bench layout suggestions - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / testgear

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2017, 03:43:21 pm
content: We're going to finish some of the unfinished daylight basement rooms in our house, one of which will then become my lab. This give me the rare opportunity to lay things out from the start with development in mind.As we all know, there's no standard when it comes to the depth of test equipment. I have everything from a 70's Phillips analog scope (it's CRT-deep!), to an 80's HP cell test unit (also CRT deep), to modern DSO less than 6-8 inches deep, to power supplies and DMM's and all the rest. Add to that laptops and desktops and their keyboards/mice (screens are wall mounted).When you lay out all of this stuff on a bench, their front panels present a snaggle-toothed edge to the work surface. It's space inefficient. But if you line up their front panels, the shallower (more modern) units waste all sorts of useful space behind them and the work area in front gets a lot smaller.There's the old "equipment shelf" approach, above the work surface, but that doesn't solve the depth problem. If you have to make the shelves deep enough for the CRT based gear, you're still wasting a lot of space and now most of your actual bench is under a shadow.I like to arrange things around an L-shaped bench so that I can have computers on one leg and the actual workbench on the other. One idea I've had is to stick the deeper equipment in the resulting corner, where there is natural depth. But that's only one corner, so if you have many deep instruments there may not be enough room in the corner.So... what has everyone else done to address this? It can't be a unique problem. I'm interested in hearing how others have arranged their workspaces to maximize useable bench space while still keeping all of the test equipment close at hand.Thanks!

author: LaurentR
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2017, 04:03:11 pm
content: I have had the same issue and use a std depth bench (~25" deep).I ended up putting all the test equipment stacked on the right side of the bench with all front panels aligned (except for the scope, angled as it's big), so their depths don't matter (it's obviously taking space, but towards the length of the bench, not the depth). Scope and power supply at the bottom as they are used the most often and this reduces dangling wires.I am often using a computer at the same time (datasheets, compiles...), so I have a monitor hung on the wall above the bench.Old pic below, but still relevant to the question:

author: cdev
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2017, 04:11:51 pm
content: I have the same problem and one thing that I do now is- on my Tek scope, I have a power cord that contains an immediate right angle so I can rest the scope on its back facing straight upward on the floor next to my chair.. This obviously ends up not such a great solution, so its only put there while I am using it.Another idea which I saw done in a photo in the workbench thread recently is to have the scope's handle which can be fixed in a lot of different positions, on the top and tilted backwards so that the scope is at an approximately 45 degree angle facing downward, and then mounting the scope to the bottom of a high up shelf by two rubber coated forward scooping hooks which held that handle. Imagine you have an old school 2200 or 2400 series CRO, The handle rotates to any of maybe 20 positions, if you have the handle on top tilting backwards the center of gravity lets the face of the scope face downward when the handle is facing backwards. That seems like a really good, space saving way of using it. I am going to try that out. The photo is in the workbench thread and its fairly recent.Here, I found it for you!Quote from: rdl on October 04, 2017, 12:30:16 am

author: khs
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2017, 04:13:22 pm
content: For my Tek 7904 oscilloscope I use a scope mobile and for the other gear movable tables with rolls.So when I need an instrument I roll it to my desk - and my oscilloscope away when I don't need it.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2017, 04:18:57 pm
content: FWIW, I built mine 30" deep with adjustable shelves and a pegboard back for the primary electronics bench. Lighting beneath the shelves is handled with LED strips (5050's @ 5000K). Lighting is further assisted by the ceiling light and a swing-arm task light (Luxo), all running LED bulbs. Don't underestimate the need for lighting, especially so if you've little to no natural light to assist your requirements.The second bench is also 30" deep, but no shelving. It's used primarily as a computer table, which has an adjustable pull-out keyboard tray & monitor arm to keep the surface area clear. The uncluttered surface is meant to be used for disassembly; then carry the suspect board to the primary bench area and go to work. I'm less likely to knock screws or other small mechanical bits off this way as I can't reach them on the electronics bench (together, they're a bit over 10ft. long).Wire rack or some other form of stand-alone shelving is handy too in order to keep equipment, components, consumables, ... off of the bench top until needed. Drawers are handy too.In the case of a DSO, you can also attach one to a monitor arm as well to keep it off of the bench's work surface.

author: LaurentR
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2017, 04:22:16 pm
content: Bench thread (120 pages of goodness and inspiration):https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/whats-your-work-benchlab-look-like-post-some-pictures-of-your-lab/

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2017, 04:38:26 pm
content: All excellent responses so far, thank you very much!The "side shelf" idea is brilliant. One of those "obvious after you've seen it" things that I completely missed. I'm thinking the corner of my peferred L-shape might make a great way to take advantage of that idea.On the lighting: Agree 100%. I have one of those articulated "drafting" style lights with the big magnifying lens and a ring of LED's. Most of the time it's just a point source of light, and for that it's invaluable... being able to swing that arm right over whatever I'm working on is incredibly useful.Another question: What do folks like as floor covering? This will be in the bottom level of the house (i.e. on a concrete floor) in a cold climate, so carpet with pad is nice from a comfort perspective. But carpet can have static issues, especially in the low humidity cold months, so that argues for some hard surface (brrrr). I wonder if there are (semi)conductive carpets out there to address this exact problem. Or maybe a cork flooring product.

author: videobruce
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2017, 04:43:56 pm
content: Get rid of the power hogging 'boat anchors'?

author: rdl
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2017, 04:51:04 pm
content: One thing I learned from my 10 years in the closet was that I definitely don't like equipment wasting precious bench top space. When I moved out of the closet I continued with that way of thinking. There is no pile of instruments there tethered by power cords. If needed, the monitor and keyboard can be quickly moved allowing the table to be pulled out as far as neeeded from the wall to work on larger projects.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2017, 05:55:07 pm
content: IMHO it is better to store equipment on a shelve and put it on the bench as needed. The only things which are permanent on my bench are a soldering iron, bench-DMM, basic power supply and an oscilloscope. The rest is added on a when-needed basis.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2017, 05:57:39 pm
content: Quote from: videobruce on October 09, 2017, 04:43:56 pmIf I had infinite money, sure! But they work, and I don't have infinite money.I wouldn't get rid of the Phillips PM3214 in any case. Just too handy to have a pure analog scope once in a while.

author: LaurentR
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: October 09, 2017, 06:23:24 pm
content: Quote from: IDEngineer on October 09, 2017, 04:38:26 pmIf you put a shelf above the work space (I have one on my bench, not visible on the picture), you can populate the bottom with a big area light (one or more fluorescent or LED). It's not intrusive (no arm) and if you really spread it out, no shadow.

author: Shock
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2017, 02:33:11 am
content: When I was building mine I considered some my equipment is too heavy for normal shelves. 600mm deep shelves were required for rack sized equipment but both the bench and wall couldn't support the weight of the shelving and equipment. I needed a deep bench but didn't want shelving always hanging over my bench.So I decided to use longspan rack shelving, 2400mm long and 600mm deep. The height can be as high as you want to go. Everything is fully adjustable and you can add as many shelves as you like as well as extra spans.Mine is similar to the below photo except my bench actually sits inside the shelving frame and I can adjust back and forwards to become a shallow or deep bench. I get up to about 1200mm depth of usable bench if I need it. You can get these in other colors, mine is cream and looks very lab like.

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 12, 2017, 03:35:45 am
content: My workbench is 33" deep with 12" deep adjustable shelves above. Plenty of space for working and for gear. the big GW Instek power supply and Tektronix 2465 sit on the bench and everything else is on the shelf. I am planning a rearrangement as I had all my soldering gear on a small rolling unit under the bench and I ended up cutting the air hose on my ZD-985 with my desk chair. Time to re-think things and come up with a better solution for soldering gear. I have long arms so it is easy to reach the stuff on the shelves.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2017, 09:09:15 pm
content: Quote from: GreyWoolfe on October 12, 2017, 03:35:45 amOuch.At least it should be an easy and inexpensive fix.I like the idea of a small table dedicated to soldering gear. And as it happens, I've a small computer table that could serve this purpose. Currently it shakes too much for a microscope however, so I'd have to add some bracing/additional set of legs on the front (probably loose the ability to adjust the height, but I can deal with that).Mine uses the same construction as this:

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2017, 09:24:25 pm
content: Quote from: nanofrog on October 12, 2017, 09:09:15 pmI like that idea too, but right now my "dedicated soldering station" is an old card table at the end of the bench!The bench was overwhelmed already, and moving the soldering equipment off the bench to the little table freed up quite a bit of bench space. It does mean I have to move projects back and forth a bit, but for quick jobs I just stretch the iron and its stand over and leave its power unit on the card table.You can see why I'm excited to be finishing out a proper lab room.

author: neo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2017, 09:25:56 pm
content: Well what i do is i make a C shaped table area out of tables. iI currently have a big shelf for the huge stuff, think 608C analog oscilloscopes and power supplies. Any space i waste on the rear of the shelf doubles as a cat bed or storage depending on who you ask.Then i have two main work benches, one for parts one for actually working on, both have an overhang shelf . On my workbench for actual work the overhang holds my main power supply, a monitor, two multimeter's and my soldering station. The other overhang shelf has, HP 5340A (it doesn't fit perfectly but well enough) as well as a couple more multimeters and power supplies.Now this only leaves the third table, the one that makes it a C, and there i have two secretaries table's, my laptops and more small parts.EDIT: It should probably be noted that i am working out of the equivalent to a large broom closet, about 36 SQ feet.As far as functionality is concerned it works quite well, bit of a mess but it does work. I find it is useful to keep somethings, like the oscilloscope, frequency counter, or function generator at eye level when you sit, good for both readability and adjustments of them.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2017, 09:40:38 pm
content: You've taken my L-shaped workspace to the next level with your C-shaped tables.I like the L shape because debuggers, etc. require a PC, and often development involves measuring with test equipment while stepping through code. So I keep the main workstation on one leg of the L and the main workbench on the other. This allows me to reach both at the same time, to hold probes or operate scopes or whatever with one hand while stepping through the code with the other.I might have to give your C layout some thought, though, as I'm finding TWO PC's are becoming the norm. One for code development, the other to interface with the device under development (Ethernet, CAN, etc.). I've found it's better to not layer up too many tasks on one PC, but it does mean more table space for additional human interface peripherals!

author: neo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2017, 09:50:35 pm
content: The part about this setup i have that i like is that everything important can stay well within reach.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2017, 10:06:42 pm
content: Quote from: neo on October 12, 2017, 09:25:56 pmWish I could (or even an L), but the way the room is laid out, it's not really feasible.Quote from: IDEngineer on October 12, 2017, 09:40:38 pmWhy not use a software KVM combined with split screen software in order to display both systems simultaneously?Works great with a widescreen monitor.You might also want to consider a monitor arm (dual or single) to get it/them off of the work surface (not sure what your current monitor situation is).

author: neo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2017, 10:10:08 pm
content: Quote from: nanofrog on October 12, 2017, 10:06:42 pmHow is your room laid out?

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2017, 10:19:24 pm
content: Quote from: neo on October 12, 2017, 10:10:08 pmSimple rectangle (11' x 13').But it also serves as the spare bedroom, so the furniture is also sucking up space.Currently, the benches are end-to-end along an 11' wall. Toss in a couple of wire rack shelf units as well as the bedroom furniture, and both the wall and open floor space is accounted for.

author: neo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2017, 10:21:33 pm
content: You have the raw space to do what i did with mine, however if there is other furniture there then, sorry, you are unfortunately out of luck.

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2017, 10:34:07 pm
content: Quote from: nanofrog on October 12, 2017, 10:06:42 pmYears ago I used KVM switches and a single monitor. That was back in the days when I'd also have paper databooks open on the bench. These days, more and larger screens have replaced paper documentation.As I sit here, I have four monitors surrounding me... two 32in units on the main workstation, plus the laptop and its external 27in screen. All of the standalone monitors are wall mounted to free up the work surfaces below them. (The 27in is over the bench and has three power supplies and a function generator below it.) When I'm working on the bench all four typically have things displayed - IDE in debug mode on one 32in, docs (pinouts, schematics, etc.) on the other 32in, I/O support (Ethernet sniffers, CAN monitors, USB debugging, etc.) on the 27in, and often some sort of data capture going on the laptop's internal screen. Sometimes if I'm working on dual-firmware environments (example: developing hardware that connects to a smartphone), I'll have an IDE running on both PC's so I can monitor/step through the code on either end of the connection simultaneously, watching how each interacts with the other.A KVM environment would be a serious step backward, at least in this environment. More and bigger screens is the present and the future!

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2017, 10:44:03 pm
content: Quote from: neo on October 12, 2017, 10:21:33 pmYeah, I know. Just have to deal with it.At an initial glance, it has available space. But I don't want to block off access to the closet, and I need to be able to move a chair between benches (or 1 per as I've 3 available to me).I still have to figure out a better placement for the printer, and find space for the small computer table.More thought is needed. Hopefully I'll get it sorted soon and get some pics posted.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2017, 10:56:45 pm
content: Quote from: IDEngineer on October 12, 2017, 10:34:07 pmThe reason I was thinking software KVM, is it would allow you to display both computers simultaneously on a single monitor (data of unit B is delivered via Ethernet). Works great with a widescreen monitor; say 29" - 32" range. Not terribly expensive either if you've the monitor for it (or are in need of an additional monitor).You've clearly got enough screens, but I'm not quite certain of what you're trying to do.For example, do you really just need to have a single keyboard that can access multiple systems?Or do you truly need to display information from 2 systems on a single monitor?For disclosure, I've a 32" LG that has this capability (Split Screen software). Currently it's only connected to a single system, but I do see the benefit of additional units.Currently I've 4 non-functional units that I may get lucky enough to cobble a working system together (IIRC, they needed motherboard repairs).

author: IDEngineer
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2017, 11:32:56 pm
content: Quote from: nanofrog on October 12, 2017, 10:56:45 pmI don't need nor want to change anything with respect to my display setup. This thread was started to discuss how to arrange things in a new lab, the screen thing is just a subthread. It's just too useful to have two fully functional PC systems available 100% of the time without having to switch the monitor-to-PC relationship, the keyboard/mouse-to-PC connection, etc.Have you seen stage musicians playing two synthesizers, one with each hand, on two keyboards at a 90 degree angle? That's how I work sometimes, with the chair centered between them....

author: neo
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: October 12, 2017, 11:35:58 pm
content: Thats how i use my two laptops at times as well, albeit not for anything near as complex as what you've described. Smartphones and the like are beyond my technical knowledge to work on at this point.

author: GreyWoolfe
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: October 13, 2017, 12:02:09 am
content: Quote from: nanofrog on October 12, 2017, 09:09:15 pmI had one of those sitting in my garage that i got for free. My intent was to use it for a soldering station but I could never figure out how to make it fit with all the other stuff in my office. It was in the garage for the better part of a year. We were cleaning out the garage (finally) after we got back home from evacuating for Irma and I put it on the curb. It was gone in 10 minutes. As for the hose, I had the heating element burn out on the ZD-985, so I simply got a complete replacement gun. It was the hose on the replacement gun that I cut. I took the original hose and replaced it. Next trip to the local surplus store, I will take a piece of it to get some more in case of more stupidity. I got the Tek 2465 off of the desk and on the cart with the GW-Instek scope so the 2 soldering stations are back on the desk and the ZD-985 and the 858D are now on the top shelf of the rolling unit I built , so the hose no longer hits the floorI do have a teacher's desk that has company equipment on it. The equipment is being phased out as part of a refresh to be done before the end of the year and will go away. I will have to buy a new LED shop light fixture for it, though. That is for pondering and ruminating.