what type of solder should i get? - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / beginners

author: carbon dude oxide
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2013, 08:17:09 pm
content: hello everyone the time has finally come where my first reel of solder that i got when i first started out has run out it was a maplin branded (I now work at maplin ^.^) 1mm thick solder reel a it has lasted me pretty well but i would like to get a new reel but i am unsure what is a good type to use(i know 1mm thickness is not going to do well with smd work which i am just going to start on soon)From memory i need 0.5mm or thiner, flux core (unsure which type), ive been told not to get lead free but i ahve not had any problems with the lead free stuff but i will welcome lead solder if it is betterI will be doing an order from RS in a few weeks so if possible one of there ones so that i can stick it onto the same orderthanks

author: mariush
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2013, 08:45:18 pm
content: Leaded solder is easier to work with and give you a better indication that a connection is soldered properly (shiny when done right).Most common leaded solder combinations are 60/40 and 63/37. Less common are the ones that have a bit of Cu (copper) or Ag (silver) in them, usually about 1%.I like 63/37 more because it's eutectic - it has a very "plastic" region, meaning it becomes liquid at around 183 C and stays liquid above that temperature and becomes solid almost as soon as it goes below 183 C. It's much better for environments where there's vibration or other issues when soldering as there's less risk of making bad solder joints due to moving the pieces you solder while solder cools down.60/40 has a much wider plastic region, it goes liquid at over 180 C but needs more time to go completely solid, so you have to keep the connection you solder fixed for a couple of seconds - if you move the wire or IC while the solder cools you may cause a bad solder joint.Anyway, either one will do.Make sure it has flux inside, 2-3% flux seems a good ratio for me. Stay away from water based fluxes. I prefer no-clean fluxes but rosin core or mildly-active fluxes are also OK (but you should clean these from boards with isopropyl alcohol or they may corrode in time the solder joints)I prefer Multicore, I work quite well with a Multicore 0.56mm 63/37 spool, but I wouldn't mind using Stannol or Kester solder.Since you're probably in UK, have a go athttp://uk.farnell.com/solder-wireWith Farnell, you may have to order a minimum of 25 or 50 pounds, but I'm sure you could find something to order besides just solder wire.. maybe get a flux pen or some ics to play with.Also checkhttp://uk.rs-online.com/web/c/tools/soldering-desoldering-tools/solders/they may have less minimum order.

author: carbon dude oxide
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2013, 08:57:00 pm
content: so this would be ok?http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/solders/0547304/

author: mariush
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2013, 09:30:20 pm
content: That one is 63/37 but it's made by MBO (a company I'm not familiar with) and has only 1.5% flux. Furthermore, the datasheet says 1% minimum - 1.5% nominal - 2.5% max ....I wouldn't like to use one with such low amount of flux.I don't see something good and relatively cheap at rs-online other than this :16 pounds Stannol 250g 0.5mm 60/40 with 2.5% flux :http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/solders/0518056/works out at 32 pounds for 500g which is OK price .26.8 pounds Stannol 250g 0.5 62/38/2 (ag) with 3.5% flux :http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/solders/0518040/kind of expensive.On Farnell there's a bit more choices, this one if you're fine with 60/40 seems like a good deal:0.46mm 60/40 3% 250g 13 pounds :http://uk.farnell.com/multicore-solder/d626-250g-reel/solder-wire-60-40-0-46mm-250g/dp/419308Farnell doesn't seem to have too many 63/37 but have plenty of solders with a bit of copper or silver.Edsyn also is a good brand, but check the datasheets to get something that's no-clean or rosyn based, which is easy to clean.

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 07, 2013, 09:57:57 pm
content: If you can get it, I would suggest Multicore Savbit alloy (tin/lead) with standard Ersin flux. It is some of the best performing solder there is.I'd love to get my hands on a reel but it is not readily available in the US.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2013, 01:23:05 am
content: Quote from: IanB on May 07, 2013, 09:57:57 pmNewark carries Savbit in 0.7mm & 1.22mm, but it's expensive since it's shipped from the UK.http://www.newark.com/multicore-solder/ds22-500g-reel/solder-wire-savbit-0-71mm-500g/dp/13J8705?in_merch=Popular ProductsNever tried it (or any other tin/lead/copper mix), so what's the performance characteristic/s that make it preferable to the more common 63/37 or 60/40 alloys for you?TIA.

author: mariush
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2013, 01:41:03 am
content: Here's the links on the UK version of their site, in case OP wants to look at them0.7mmhttp://uk.farnell.com/multicore-solder/ds22-500g-reel/solder-wire-savbit-0-71mm-500g/dp/4194611.22mmhttp://uk.farnell.com/multicore-solder/ds18-500g-reel/solder-wire-savbit-1-22mm-500g/dp/419450Looks like the flux is the same Ersin 362 flux that's in that 60/40 13 pound roll of solder. But this Savbit version melts at 215c, I guess due to the addition of Copper in the mix.

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2013, 01:41:40 am
content: Quote from: nanofrog on May 08, 2013, 01:23:05 amYes, I've seen that it is available from Newark. But the cost is what makes me say it is "not readily available". If I found some readily to hand I'd get it, but I don't need itthatbadly.To a large extent solder is solder, but the Multicore brand just seems to flow and wet the joint surfaces very cleanly making it pleasant and un-fussy to use.Some other solders like to ball up and don't like to flow into the joint.I think the idea of the copper in the alloy is that it reduces wear on the iron. It probably doesn't have much effect on how well it solders.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2013, 01:54:24 am
content: Quote from: IanB on May 08, 2013, 01:41:40 amAh, makes sense. I wouldn't pay $50+/lb either.Quote from: IanB on May 08, 2013, 01:41:40 amWhy just substitute their 370 series then, as Digikey carries that at more attractive prices (assuming you're sticking exclusively to Multicore)?FWIW, Kester and AIM work quite well for me (wet well).Quote from: IanB on May 08, 2013, 01:41:40 amDoes it matter that much in practice or more peace-of-mind?I ask, as I've only seen faster tip wear with the lead-free alloys.

author: David_AVD
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2013, 02:27:30 am
content: Quote from: IanB on May 08, 2013, 01:41:40 am+1 to that. We use 0.71mm "Multicore Crystal 511 Flux" type. It allows us to solder significantly faster and neater than anything else we've tried. No cleaning required afterwards either.

author: eKretz
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2013, 03:41:58 am
content: Has anybody used Kester 63/37 with the 245 flux? I just got some but have never used it before; I'm accustomed to Kester 44. I'm curious how good the 245 is in comparison to the 44. I haven't had a chance to try it yet.

author: carbon dude oxide
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2013, 06:06:55 am
content: Quote from: nanofrog on May 08, 2013, 01:54:24 ami have noticed that my solder iron tips have been rusting quite quickly, i generaly only use a brillo pad to clean the iron as i found that a wet sponge just makes it oxidise very quickly. But the reason fr this might be because its a cheapish soldering ironas shown here

author: IanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2013, 07:32:53 am
content: Quote from: carbon dude oxide on May 08, 2013, 06:06:55 amRusting? WTF?That really shouldn't be possible. Do you store the iron in a damp place like a garage outside maybe?Make sure you are properly tinning the tips before you use them. When you have a new tip on the iron, thoroughly coat it with solder all over. The solder should wet it and flow over it for a length about 1 cm back from the tip, front, back and sides, not bead up and fall off. If the solder doesn't stick to the tip then use a tip tinning/cleaning compound until it does.The last thing you do before you turn off the iron should be to give it a good fresh coating of solder and wipe it clean so it is bright and shiny.For as long as the tip is coated in solder it should not be possible for moisture to contact the iron plating underneath and it should not be able to rust.The use of a wet sponge should have no influence since the iron is much hotter than the boiling point of water. When the iron tip touches the sponge there should be a sizzling sound and steam. No moisture can possibly remain on the tip at soldering temperatures.If you use abrasive items like a brillo pad you will damage the delicate plating on the tip and shorten its life.

author: grumpydoc
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2013, 12:17:29 pm
content: QuoteFor hobby SMD work 0.5mm should be fine. I find it a bit thin for general use. 0.7mm is probably OK.QuoteActually, no, it has hardly any at all. The "plastic" region is the temperature range over which the solder is partly solidified. As you say 67/37 is eutectic which means that it moves from partly to fully solidified as it cools through 183oC - 60/40 starts to solidify at 190oC ad is fully solid at 183oCThe disadvantage of the solder solidifying over a range is that if the components being soldered move you get a weak unreliable joint ("dry joint") so I prefer 67/37 if I can't get a good mechanical joint first.Quote+1 Completely agree - you really should not be cleaning your iron with anything like a brillo pad.Soldering iron bits are copper because it has good thermal conductivity. Unfortunately copper dissolves in solder so over time a pure copper bit becomes pitted and mis-shapen. The traditional fix for this is to file the tip back into shape.Bit life can be increased by adding a small amount of copper to the solder or by iron plating the bit. In this case any abrasive cleaning will ruin the relatively thin coating and you'll be left with a bit that starts to dissolve.Iron coated bits should be "tinned" with a small amount of solder and kept that way. Use a damp sponge to wip any oxides/burnt bits of flux from the iron.QuoteI suppose at one level this is true - for hobby use you probably won't notice much diference between the various brands, types of flux and exact alloys - except that lead free is crap to work with. I have a small reel for when I really need to keep something RoHS compliant (not had to so far) but otherwise I wouldn't bother.There's actually quite an extensive article on Wikipedia which shows just how much variety there is to soldering alloys -http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solder

author: mariush
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2013, 01:27:23 pm
content: Quote from: grumpydoc on May 08, 2013, 12:17:29 pmDAMN, thanks for correcting that. Seems I forgot to type a word there.It was meant to say : it has a verynarrow"plastic" regionThanks again.

author: Prizmatic
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2013, 02:42:38 pm
content: Stannol S-Sn60Pb40, reasonable price (if there is such a thing with solder). Very happy with it thus far.http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Solder-Wire-Diameter-0-7mm-22-SWG-500g-STANNOL-/360557396206?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET&hash=item53f2e540eeErsin Multicore is great but premium price, and not woth the extra IMO.

author: M0BSW
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 08, 2013, 05:30:35 pm
content: I like the really thin 40/60 lead/tin solder, the only place I find it was on ebay, so I bought a few reels to keep me going, I said a few reels that a lied I bought a lot of the stuff 15X 500g rolls to be exact, you got to think of the future , and any more dumb rules that come out banning the sales of it..

author: carbon dude oxide
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2013, 09:24:38 pm
content: That is definatly prepepairing in advance

author: smashedProton
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2013, 09:33:15 pm
content: Haha! There is a lot of that behavior around where I live too. My father bought a bunch of ar-15 lower recievers. They would sell for tens of hindreds after a ban

author: David_AVD
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2013, 09:34:21 pm
content: Just wondering - do the rosin cores in solder go "off" after a long time period?

author: Falcon69
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2013, 10:09:21 pm
content: I purchased some AIM wire solder. Sn63 Pb37. .020" diameter. Flux is 3%This was a good purchase. The small wire allows me to solder even the smallest of surface mount components by hand. Now, if I can stop the tombstone effect of those resistors. They pop straight up on end when I solder one end. LOLI built a reflow oven from a toaster oven and a PID controller, along with a DataLogger so I can see a the temperature curve. Works really well, no more hand soldering. But, the small wire, .020" and the 3%flux, makes it really easy if and when I do have to hand solder.I took Dave's advice when he did his segment on soldering and the tools to use, I think it was video #180. That was great advice!Before, I was trying to solder with that crappy stuff from your neighborhood hardware store. It didn't have flux, and it was large in diameter, about 3/32". I didn't know any better, and had alot of trouble trying to solder stuff. The solder just didn't want to stick.Take Dave's advice, get the 63/37 with flux and in a small diameter. You won't regret it.

author: eKretz
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 09, 2013, 10:19:39 pm
content: If you pre-tin a pad then use tweezers to place and hold down the resistor after you have re-melted it, that works pretty well to stop the tombstoning, lol.

author: nanofrog
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2013, 02:55:09 am
content: Quote from: David_AVD on May 09, 2013, 09:34:21 pmNot in my experience.Some companies, such as Kester put a shelf life on the flux (3yrs), while others, such as AIM, states their rosin core solder have an unlimited shelf life.BTW, all of mine is ~10 y/o, and works fine for most TH and SMD work. No extra flux needed. Other tasks however, such as tinning a heavier gauge wire or drag soldering, a bit of extra flux does wonders.

author: zibadun
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2013, 12:03:09 pm
content: Quote from: lemo connectors on May 10, 2013, 09:28:23 amWelding melts the materials being joined while soldering melts just the filler ?

author: M0BSW
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2013, 12:06:59 pm
content: Quote from: David_AVD on May 09, 2013, 09:34:21 pmgive me a few Years to find out , if I'm not put in a home for the bewildered

author: zibadun
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2013, 12:12:05 pm
content: Quote from: M0BSW on May 10, 2013, 12:06:59 pmSolder hoarding probably won't qualify :-D

author: SeanB
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2013, 07:15:33 pm
content: Depends on storage conditions, like everything else. Store sealed in plastic bag in a cool dry place and it will last for decades. Store in a hot humid cupboard and it will be useless in under 6 months.

author: M0BSW
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 10, 2013, 07:30:13 pm
content: Quote from: SeanB on May 10, 2013, 07:15:33 pmgood mines in its sealed bags in the cellar which is cool and dry,and soon to be my radio room.

author: cwalex
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2013, 10:37:31 am
content: Quote from: David_AVD on May 08, 2013, 02:27:30 amHi David, where do you buy your solder?

author: David_AVD
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2013, 12:38:21 pm
content: Quote from: cwalex on May 11, 2013, 10:37:31 amThe last couple of times we've bought 500g rolls from Prime Electronics. Sonar Plus also used to sell it I believe, buy may have only had the 250g rolls.

author: cwalex
author_rank: Frequent Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2013, 01:27:20 pm
content: Thanks, I'll check them out.

author: seb1982
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: May 11, 2013, 06:57:14 pm
content: Having just got back into the hobby after years out, I was using the end of a roll of chunky, cheap, nondescript solder. I couldn't get anything to solder at all!I splashed out on a roll of Multicore Ersin 362 0.46mm solder from RS a couple of weeks ago, and it's been an absolute revelation! Everything's suddenly a real pleasure to solder; joints wet beautifully, and it's so controllable.Makes all the difference in the world!