EEVblog 1556 - SolaRoad Solar Cycleway FAILS, AGAIN! - Page 1
Forum section: electronics / general

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: July 31, 2023, 10:26:08 pm
content: To everyones shock, a SolaRoad cycleway installation in Maartensdijk in Utrecht province of the Netherlands only produed 26% of it's projected output, AGAIN!When will this nonsense stop?https://nos.nl/artikel/2484255-innovatief-zonnefietspad-bij-maartensdijk-levert-bijna-niets-ophttps://www.dutchnews.nl/2023/07/solar-bike-path-fails-to-meet-electricity-targets-again/https://www.wattisduurzaam.nl/37168/energie-beleid/utrechts-zonnefietspad-op-koers-voor-40-van-beoogde-opbrengst/https://www.wattisduurzaam.nl/16140/energie-opwekken/7-veelbelovende-innovaties-die-de-transitie-geen-steek-verder-helpen/https://twitter.com/WattisDuurzaam/status/1525171198052782090https://www.businessinsider.com/worlds-first-solar-road-turned-out-colossal-failure-2019-8https://www.archpaper.com/2015/07/bike-path-pieces-skeptics-dismiss-dutch-solar-bike-path-solaroad-inefficient-cash-grab/Solar roadways BUSTED Playlist:https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLzET2ZHWnFA-6fnJu8WAhKmIruWDp8CQr

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: August 01, 2023, 03:56:14 pm
content: At least it doesn't fall apart so that is progress...

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: August 03, 2023, 09:28:10 am
content: Quote from: nctnico on August 01, 2023, 03:56:14 pm

author: benst
author_rank: Regular Contributor
timestamp: February 05, 2024, 06:07:22 pm
content: Aaaand.... they're bankrupt!https://www.rtvutrecht.nl/nieuws/3679604/bedrijf-achter-langste-zonnepanelenfietspad-ter-wereld-in-maartensdijk-failliet(English version available via button on top of page.)Ben

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 05, 2024, 10:57:16 pm
content: Who would have predicted! That's unfortunate. But good entrepreneurs don't let a failure drag them down. TIme to start a new solar road project!

author: Haenk
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2024, 11:23:15 am
content: Haha, I like that statement: "shareholders didn't want to invest anymore because they didn't see a future in the company".Now, how did they ever see a future in that company when doing their initial investment? This is really beyond me.

author: faststoff
author_rank: Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2024, 10:30:05 pm
content: I completely agree! One should hope though that they now had learned that this is inherently a horrible idea. However...https://www.noord-holland.nl/Actueel/Archief/2024/Januari_2024/Provincie_stopt_met_Solaroad_na_gezamenlijk_besluit_aandeelhoudersQuote

author: SiliconWizard
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2024, 10:49:54 pm
content: It's a bit like with proponents of any bad political regime - if it doesn't work, then it's because we still haven't tried enough of it.The similarity is precisely because those "green energy" projects are being pushed for political reasons (whether you think the cause is good or not is irrelevant). Politics ruins absolutely everything.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 10, 2024, 10:53:39 pm
content: The idea in itself is good (no matter how much people parrot Dave) as roads catch quite a lot of sun and have no building permit & zoning issues. Low hanging fruit if you can get the durability in order. This particular project most likely produced way less than expected due to shading by trees, fence posts, etc. Elevating the solar panels a couple of meters (as suggested by some people) is not going to solve the shading from the trees as you'd have to bring the panels 30+ meters high to reach over the top of the trees. For those not familiar with the Netherlands: as we have quite a bit of wind, trees are planted along roads and cycling paths to reduce the effect of the wind in the entire country.Dave did some videos on the effect of shading on solar panels and the effect is suprisingy large. From my own solar panel install I can also see that shade on even a tiny part of a panel, which is part of a string, has a huge impact. I have two identical strings with 6 panels each. A tree branch which casts a shade over less than 10% of one of the solar panels already cuts the power output for the string the particular panel is in, almost in half. And this is with a modern inverter. Judging from the pictures from the Solar Cycleway it looks like each concrete slab consists of the equivalent of 2 individual solar panels with all cells in series at a 90 degree angle in respect to the direction road. Ofcourse this is relatively easy to manufacture but this configuration is about as bad as it gets due to shading from fence posts and plants next to the road. If the system was constructed using smaller groups of panels with an optimiser per group and taking possible shading into account to get to an optimum group sizing versus costs, the output would be way higher.

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 11, 2024, 12:59:09 am
content: Quote from: nctnico on February 10, 2024, 10:53:39 pmAnd will never, EVER be cheaper $/W/lifespan than rooftop or other tradiational elevated panels. NEVER.Once all those rooftops and carparks are covered,thenwe'll talk. Until then it's just a stupid wasteful idea that only gets funding because idiots with money think it's "innovative".

author: Bud
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2024, 01:07:24 am
content: Netherlands should get their efking cyclists and cars off their lovely solar roads to prevent shading and increase output, problem solved.

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2024, 02:20:14 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on February 11, 2024, 12:59:09 amIf you start developing new technology when you need it, then you'll be a decade too late (*). The simple fact is that suitable roofs and land are finite. In the NL the largest growth of solar panels on homes is likely behind us. It would be outright idiotic not to explore other methods by which space can be used double. Also keep in mind that storage and transport costs will likely dominate the electricity prices in about 10 years in places where they have no hydro or nuclear power (OR keep burning fossil fuels). So the cost for generation is not a big factor in the consumer price.* As an example: one of my customers noted that GNSS systems are super vulnerable even though they are used for many critical purposes across the world. They started a decade ago with developing a wired system which can be mass deployed over existing infrastructure. Several decades worth of development time was put into it and nobody has anything like their system. A few years ago the US and EU started to realise there is trouble on the horizon. Worse enough for the US president to submit an Executive Order. Guess which system got installed...

author: EEVblog
author_rank: Unknown
timestamp: February 11, 2024, 09:24:50 pm
content: Quote from: nctnico on February 11, 2024, 02:20:14 pmAsk yourself why growth of solar on rooftop is slow? What would magically make pathways and roads a better commercially viable alternative?I'd be surprised if it's more than 10% of rooftops and car park spaces have solar. So the "finite" argument doesn't work.

author: PlainName
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2024, 10:16:28 pm
content: QuoteNot all roofs are suitable. We wanted panels here (not least because we would get paid for anything we generated, whether or not we used it or sent it back up the grid, and that for a guaranteed 25 years). Got a house and separate garage, and neither were suitable. Nor are they suitable now, some years later - it would just be a waste of money and time. Yes, even more so than a solar road!

author: nctnico
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 11, 2024, 11:03:44 pm
content: Quote from: EEVblog on February 11, 2024, 09:24:50 pmThe growth is slow because the point of saturation is in sight. Over 30% of the homes already have solar in the NL. A lot of older homes need the roof to be upgraded/redone before solar panels can be fitted so these won't get solar panels any time soon. In the NL homes are mass-produced so you have entire areas with exactly the same homes which all have exactly the same problem. The area my parents live in has been build in the 60's and the roofs on these houses are too far gone to put solar panels on. And good luck trying to find large parking lots in the NL. The ground simply is too expensive. At shops you typically find underground parking garages or ones several stories high with a relatively small footprint. Putting solar panels on top of existing garages means adding to the construction which in turn means dealing with construction, zoning permits and getting a bigger grid connection (which is really problematic nowadays; some companies are running from diesel generators while waiting for a grid connection).

author: thm_w
author_rank: Super Contributor
timestamp: February 12, 2024, 10:16:42 pm
content: Cool one I saw recently, solar walls might actually make financial sense (with bifacial panels):Of course you still need some free space around it.