Conrad Hughes: After the sock was blocked, I removed all primary sources.  I was left with only two, one of which has the subject talking about another topic (his school) in an interview.  This subject appears to fail WP:GNG , WP:NACADEMIC , and WP:NAUTHOR .  JFHJr ( ㊟ ) 00:33, 31 May 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] Delete .  Please see history for an extensive record of puffery.  Drmies ( talk ) 00:37, 31 May 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] Ah--this is where this came from: a socking case of COI-puffery.  JFHJr , in such cases, don't even bother cleaning up the article; not doing so makes the fluff stand out nicely.  Drmies ( talk ) 00:41, 31 May 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] I try to present each specimen in its most favorable light.  And without extraneous reading.  Anyone wondering about the application of my edits can see the history.  Thank you for your comment.  I always appreciate your input.  JFHJr ( ㊟ ) 00:46, 31 May 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] For everyone's consideration and time-sinking availability, this version is what we are talking about.  Cheers.  JFHJr ( ㊟ ) 00:53, 31 May 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] I'm opposed to you wanting to delete this article.  Looks like an attempt at illegitimate blanking.  Wikiviewer2 ( talk ) 21:48, 1 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] I am also opposed, who is crossing out wikipedia user's statements?  Jane asia ( talk ) 13:11, 2 June 2024 (UTC) — Jane asia ( talk • contribs ) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.  [ reply ] Same question!  Why are Wikipedia user statements being crossed out?  I'm genuinely curious as to why someone would be so determined to delete an article about a legitimate, leading practitioner in the field of international education.  Annabella25 ( talk ) 17:06, 3 June 2024 (UTC) — Annabella25 ( talk • contribs ) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.  [ reply ] Note:  This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Academics and educators , Authors , South Africa , Switzerland ,  and United Kingdom .  Skynxnex ( talk ) 02:14, 31 May 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] Delete .  Independent coverage seems to be limited.  Deb ( talk ) 08:07, 31 May 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] Not really, in the article you took down there were at least 10 independent references and there are many more out there, just look through the web!  213.55.220.222 ( talk ) 22:06, 1 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] Again, I'm left wondering: who is striking through Wikipedia user's statements, and for what reason??  Annabella25 ( talk ) 17:08, 3 June 2024 (UTC) — Annabella25 ( talk • contribs ) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.  [ reply ] I was surprised to see the previous article removed.  Dr Hughes is well known in international education.  Have you googled him?  Why should the article be reduced or deleted, according to who?  213.55.220.222 ( talk ) 15:24, 1 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] The article is not removed, and "well known" should be supported by reliable secondary sources.  "Have you googled him" is not a reasonable or helpful question to ask.  Drmies ( talk ) 17:26, 1 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] It's easy to find articles on him: https://www.k12digest.com/designing-and-implementing-educational-systems-for-the-future/ https://www.internationalschoolparent.com/articles/interview-with-dr-conrad-hughes-ecole-internationale-de-geneve-ecolint/ https://www.letemps.ch/economie/chatgpt-fait-son-chemin-dans-les-ecoles-privees Have you seen all the things he's published with UNESCO?  It seems a bit weird to want to remove him, is there some personal vendetta going on here?  - Lefka1 ( talk ) 20:12, 1 June 2024 (UTC) — Lefka1 ( talk • contribs ) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.  [ reply ] That's two interviews ( WP:BLPSPS ) and coverage that includes Hughes talking about a different topic (the in-depth coverage is not about Hughes but AI in private schools).  How does that approach WP:ANYBIO ?  JFHJr ( ㊟ ) 20:57, 1 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] So why are you deleting those two interviews?  In the article you removed there were lots of sources Wikiviewer2 ( talk ) 21:49, 1 June 2024 (UTC) — Wikiviewer2 ( talk • contribs ) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.  [ reply ] The interviews have not been deleted.  They're still at their URLs for anyone who googles this subject to find.  JFHJr ( ㊟ ) 22:00, 1 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] He has clearly made a widely recognized contribution that is part of the enduring historical record in education, just by his publications for the World Economic Forum, Springer, The Conversation, his doctoral research, and dozens of articles.  He's a well respected scholar.  This alone meets  WP:ANYBIO Lefka1 ( talk ) 22:01, 1 June 2024 (UTC) — Lefka1 ( talk • contribs ) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.  [ reply ] I agree!  Now, I'm genuinely curious about the motivation behind someone's relentless effort to delete an article about a reputable, leading practitioner in the field of international education.  Annabella25 ( talk ) 17:11, 3 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] You or whoever removed the first article took out lots of independent references.  There's an interview with the International Baccalaureate for example.  That's not a primary source, why are you removing it?  There was also an article in the TES about him and by Cambridge's SHAPE.  I am opposed to your proposal to delete this .  213.55.220.222 ( talk ) 22:04, 1 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] OK, I'm about to block a socking account.  The nay-sayers here likely have conflicts of interest, but worse than that they lack a proper understanding of what Wikipedia is and what the processes are.  Interviews and whatnot do not count towards notability.  If there is an "enduring historical record in education", there will be secondary sources that say that.  That someone published articles also does not make them notable--unless others have written about those articles.  If there's any more socking, this AfD will be semi-protected.  Oh, Lefka1 , if you make any more comments about "personal vendetta" or whatever, I will happily block you too.  Drmies ( talk ) 22:27, 1 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] Hello.  I'm intrigued by the controversy surrounding this article.  I have no axe to grind about Hughes, one way or another, and I don't necessarily espouse his views, but - whether one likes it or not - he is unquestionably prominent and influential in international education, and increasingly so.  Are the editors who propose the deletion of the article familiar with this field?  International educators throughout the world would be puzzled to hear that quite a small article devoted to Hughes has been earmarked for deletion, on the grounds of insufficient notability.  An article providing some basic, sober information, free of "puffery", about who Hughes is and does fulfills Wikipedia's responsibility to inform its vast reading public, in an objective and neutral manner, about noteworthy people and topics, with the support of solid citations.  I can't say I care enough about the Hughes article to do extensive research on its behalf, but as far as secondary sources go, you might look at the reputed TES journal (29 May 2020, "Rethinking school: a special issue", by Alistair McConville), the McKay interview with Hughes on World Radio Switzerland (29 February 2024), or the June 2024 "Formation" supplement ("Ces écoles centenaires") of Bilan magazine, page 4).  So my advice, as an experienced Wikipedia reader (though not editor) would be DO NOT DELETE .  All those in the field of international education understand why there is an article about Hughes in Wikipedia, regardless of whether they share his well-known educational goals.  By the way, I notice that some previous contributions to this discussion have been crossed out.  Why, by whom, and on what authority?  Those deleted comments are somewhat assertive, but by no means rude or irresponsible.  I hope that this is not how Wikipedia functions, with certain editors censoring the reasonable contributions of others.  83.79.254.53 ( talk ) 10:43, 2 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] You were blocked as User:Tamara Santerra pursuant to Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/A.  Roderick-Grove and now you're participating in this discussion logged out (block evasion).  Why do you think it's okay for you to continue trying to participate here?  (pinging @ Bbb23 : if you have 30 seconds for followup, as blocking admin for Tamara)  JFHJr ( ㊟ ) 16:47, 2 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] I've heard this speaker in conferences, he's well know in international education circles.  But when I go to wikipedia I see someone is trying to delete the page.  I am opposed to this page being deleted.  Jane asia ( talk ) 13:10, 2 June 2024 (UTC) — Jane asia ( talk • contribs ) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.  [ reply ] @ Drmies , since your comment re page protection, we've gotten 2 new SPAs here, 1 more SPA at this page's talk; a blocked sock trying to vote here as an IP; a second IP that certainly belongs to one of the others; and more talk about a personal bias motivation (vendetta).  If you have time today, could you please SPP this discussion?  Any feedback is appreciated.  Cheers!  JFHJr ( ㊟ ) 17:20, 3 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] JFHJr , just let it roll.  Don't respond.  Tag them as SPAs if you like, and straighten out their indenting.  I ran CU on a couple and they're all roughly in the same area, but not enough for me to block them on technical grounds.  I bet this will all be over soon.  Drmies ( talk ) 17:23, 3 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] Delete .  Seeing no evidence that article's subject is sufficiently notable re: WP:NACADEMIC and WP:NAUTHOR . The article itself is quite poor.  Boredintheevening ( talk ) 15:51, 2 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] KEEP.  Hughes is a widely known figure in international education.  To anybody who is knowledgeable about this field, that's obvious.  I'm surprised that this can be such a controversial issue.  Basic research about Hughes will confirm his notability.  77.59.138.101 ( talk ) 18:08, 2 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] The deletion proposal is not controversial.  It does not require controversy to happen.  Just a crappy article and crappy sources.  The only controversy here is all the WP:SOCKs , who are apparently determined to edit logged-out after blocks (editing logged-out is much like editing naked, leaves very little in doubt).  You're making it much easier to tie a single sock to multiple IPs, so thank you!  JFHJr ( ㊟ ) 18:16, 2 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] KEEP.  Dr. Hughes is a prominent figure in international education, widely respected for his significant contributions.  He has authored two important books and numerous articles published in peer-reviewed journals, and he leads one of the oldest and most esteemed international schools in the world.  His direct involvement with UNESCO and other international organizations, as well as his frequent invitations as a keynote speaker to global events, further underscore his expertise and influence in the field.  Moreover, he holds two PhDs!  Any attempt to delete his Wikipedia article may be motivated by personal bias rather than factual grounds.  It's deeply troubling and shameful to witness someone of such high regard being placed in such a situation.  Annabella25 ( talk ) 16:54, 3 June 2024 (UTC) — Annabella25 ( talk • contribs ) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.  [ reply ] Delete – WP:ANYBIO is clearly not met, and I can't see how he meets WP:NACADEMIC either.  As pointed out (repeatedly) above, secondary sources are required, and they simply aren't there.  -- bonadea contributions talk 17:23, 3 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] Delete .   The best case for notability is via NAUTHOR, but this would require multiple reviews of multiple works in reliable sources.   Reviews are not evident, and I did not find them on my search; noting that searching is complicated by the subject's common name.   The history of sockpuppetry and promotionalism here is indeed concerning.  Russ Woodroofe ( talk ) 12:27, 4 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] Weak delete .  Falls short of WP:GNG (the one Tribune de Genève article) and of WP:AUTHOR (I could only find two reviews of one book [48] [49] ).  Weak because he's partway there on both criteria.  — David Eppstein ( talk ) 17:43, 4 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] Delete per WP:SIGCOV .  Two interviews are not enough.  Bearian ( talk ) 15:14, 5 June 2024 (UTC) [ reply ] P.S. I have been taught at schools with IB and other independent ("private" or  "prep") school for 5 years.  I have never heard of him.  He is not known world-wide, or at least not in New York City.  15:30, 5 June 2024 (UTC) The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  Please do not modify it.  Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review ).  No further edits should be made to this page.

Discussion outcome: delete