List of cargo airlines : This article was moved to draft space in 2020, and was declined via AFC, and has been moved back into article space, so that this is a slow-motion contested draftification.   See the guideline on list verification , which states that stand-alone lists should cite sources.  Draftify as nominator.  Robert McClenon ( talk ) 21:06, 11 May 2023 (UTC) [ reply ] Note:  This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Aviation and Lists .  Robert McClenon ( talk ) 21:06, 11 May 2023 (UTC) [ reply ] Keep WP:LISTVERIFY clearly states: It is generally presumed that obviously appropriate material , such as the inclusion of apple in the list of fruits , does not require an inline citation.  If the article linked to says its a cargo airlines, then it doesn't need any citations.   Most of the entries even have "cargo" in their name.  D r e a m Focus 23:31, 11 May 2023 (UTC) [ reply ] Keep (as article creator) see WP:BLUE — Preceding unsigned comment added by SurferSquall ( talk • contribs ) 00:53, 12 May 2023 (UTC) [ reply ] Keep .   Nominator is simply wrong that references are required to be included in a Wikipedia article.   Obviously sources do exist.   Nominator is advised to conduct wp:BEFORE .  --Doncram ( talk , contribs ) 18:42, 14 May 2023 (UTC) [ reply ] Keep - I'm going to start out by saying that I completely disagree with all of the above ! voters except Robert McClenon .  It is absolutely not acceptable to have an entire list-article with no citations.  It is far from "sky is blue" to say that, for example, Uni-Top Airlines was a cargo airline.  Wikipedia is not a reliable source so we cannot simply rely on Wikipedia articles (many of which are themselves poorly sourced) as a source for whether an airline is a cargo airline.  I think all of Robert McClenon's concerns are entirely reasonable.  It is not sufficient to simply cast aspersions on whether BEFORE (which is ultimately not a mandatory process) was done - you have to go out there and find references.  Particularly, there has to be at least enough to pass WP:LISTN and in this case maybe WP:CORP as well.  However, doing looking into this, I see that there probably are sufficient sources to keep this article as a list, though I think it needs a heavy edit.  Specifically - Cargo Airlines by Alan J. Wright (whole content) The environment of international air carriers in the development of freight markets by Stanley H. Brewer (particularly p. 41-42) The history of Air Cargo and Air Mail by Camille Allaz (particularly p. 348), though this one is a bit dubious since the ICAC was involved in making it.  This appears to be one of those classic cases where an article was not ready for mainspace, got moved there anyway, and no-one wants to actually do the work of proving that it should be here.  No, we cannot simply take a holiday from WP:V and WP:N just because "of course it's notable" - do the work to show that it can pass and ideally add that work to the article.  FOARP ( talk ) 10:53, 16 May 2023 (UTC) [ reply ] The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  Please do not modify it.  Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review ).  No further edits should be made to this page.

Discussion outcome: keep