No need to apologise youre entitled to your opinions And my suggestion was a rather muted one hence the comment flag I do see the problems with it  And I take it you agree that we have consensus that some change is desirable  And Im even less comfortable about all of the suggestions to date Agree that Louis Martin father of Thrse of Lisieux is the best yet that doesnt violate WPHonorific But disagree that there are two perfectly good alternatives which do not break any guidelines Theres no way that either of the two original suggestions could be called  recognizable to readers WPAT of course IMO And if thats true then they both do break guidelines and in spades   But Louis Martin father of Thrse of Lisieux is quite a mouthful I think it would be worth breaking WPHonorific on this occasion and go with the natural and wellattested title instead  Unless we can do better of course I still hope we can Lateral thinking required