# A Dialogue Concerning the Essence and Role of Information in the World System
## 2 The Dialogue
The definition of information by [PERSON] as _a difference which makes a difference_ may be used in the context of this thermostat example. Let us note that this definition of information implies a quantitative portion (_a difference_) and a qualitative portion (_a difference which makes a difference_) [23]. The quantitative portion is the _difference/error_\(e=T-T_{\rm o}\) that is calculated by the Comparator that results in the On/Off actuation of the air conditioner; the qualitative portion is that given by the comfort level of the person inside the room that controls the setting \(T_{\rm o}\). Furthermore, the person whose temperature comfort is at issue in the use of the air conditioner may have the use of a thermometer to compare its experienced comfort level. This is what drives the temperature setting. Here, we identify, for illustrative reasons that the _difference/error_, \(e\), represents Bateson _information_. This means that the terms _difference/error/information_ here are treated, although not reducible to each other, as equivalent. We further note that in this example, the _error_ is the term that acts as a cybernetic correction factor in pursuing the goal of achieving temperature \(T_{\rm o}\). In short, the four-step conceptualization of how this semi-closed-loop cybernetic feedback system consisting of a one-parameter _Sensor_ and _Comparator_ works is as follows:  
1. A _Comparator_ (thermostat) is set to a _reference parameter_ (room temperature setting);
2. The _sensor_ (room temperature sensor) distinguishes the value of the _detected parameter_;
3. The _Comparator_ obtains the difference/error between the detected parameter and the reference parameter;
4. The detected _difference/error_ is the _information_ needed to send a signal to turn-on/turn-off the system governing the level of temperature in the room. In summary, all living beings engage in a process of info-autopoiesis, i.e., in a process of self-production of information, which includes the capacity of information production by all artifacts that incorporate the designed means for such production. **M:** Your example of a thermostat is a good illustration of a possible interpretation of [PERSON]'s statement. However, what system creates information \(e?\) Is it a human being or the thermostat?Indeed, the human being only introduces \(T_{\alpha}\), while the thermostat constructs the _difference/error_\(e\)\(=T-T_{\alpha}\), and you interpret this difference/error as information. However, this example shows that even such a simple system as a thermostat creates information. Besides, when you stated before that \"matter _in-forms_ humans by reacting to the efforts of humans,\" it implied that matter created information. So, how to balance this with your previous assertion that only living beings create information? **J**: Human beings in the process of interacting with their environment conceive, design, and create devices such as the thermostat. Implicit in the conception, design, and creation of these devices is the inclusion of information in the devices by human beings. Furthermore, the implication is that if the devices serve a specific purpose for humans, the devices are designed so as to process specific information for humans and then to display that information so that humans can take advantage of it. So, your appraisal is correct: the thermostat does create information that a human can interpret and use, but at the behest of humans. This is the same as when I stated that \"matter _in-forms_ humans by reacting to the efforts of humans.\" Consider any mundane activity that engages a human being with matter, such as the cutting down of a tree. With each cut of the tree, the wood is acted on and transformed. This transformation, due to human actions, allows the human the opportunity to assess her work and decide what to do next. The in-forming of matter by the human has a purpose, which the human continuously assesses.