Smith Nick: Debate on Crown Entities Public Organisations and State Enterprises — In Committee 
Smith Nick: Debate on Crown Entities Public Organisations and State Enterprises — In Committee 
[Volume:673;Page:19327] 
Hon Dr NICK SMITH (Minister for ACC) 
: 
 It is so appropriate that we go from the financial disaster that Labour left for this Government on rail and come to ACC. We know that in the last year Labour was in office this corporation lost $2.4 billion. In the following year the year that crossed over between the two Governments ACC lost a further $4.8 billion. That amounts to over $4000 for every New Zealand household—$4000 for every New Zealand household. In the course of that aftermath we had the inquiry that said that not only had there been these huge losses but— 
The CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch) 
: The member cannot say “Tell the truth.” I ask the member to apologise for that and withdraw the comment. 
Chris Hipkins 
: I withdraw and apologise. 
Hon Dr NICK SMITH 
: It is a matter of public record that the Public Finance Act was breached in the non-disclosure— 
Hon Maryan Street 
: No it’s not. That is absolutely untrue. 
Hon Dr NICK SMITH 
: The guilty lady Maryan Street the one who presided over ACC in her first year in good shape— 
Hon Maryan Street 
: I raise a point of order Mr Chairperson. You have just pulled up my colleague for requiring the Minister by interjection to tell the truth. The Minister then went on to say something exactly opposite to the findings of that public inquiry which was undertaken by Mr English. That is not the truth. 
The CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch) 
: These are debating points. The member will have an opportunity to rebut what the Minister has said as any member can. My previous point is a very clear ruling—I refer to Speaker’s ruling 43/1 which I brought up the member’s colleague for earlier. But the point the member has made is something that she can rebut when the time comes. 
Hon Dr NICK SMITH 
: It is a matter of public record that the Public Finance Act was breached and that is extremely serious. Maryan Street— 
Hon Maryan Street 
: I raise a point of order Mr Chairperson. I take offence at that. The Minister is perpetuating a mistruth. He is misleading this Committee. That is absolutely the wrong conclusion from that public inquiry which the Minister of Finance ordered. It came out and said there was no breach of the Public Finance Act. 
The CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch) 
: I have previously ruled that although the member is obviously not happy with what the Minister has said these are debating points and the member will have the opportunity to rebut them if she wishes to take a call. The Minister did not argue the point about telling the truth which was the point I brought up earlier on. There is a very clear ruling Speaker’s ruling 43/1 that states that saying “Tell the truth!” is out of order. There is a very clear message here. The phrase “Tell the truth!” is unparliamentary. The Minister did not say it. I say to the member that she will have the opportunity to rebut all the points that have come forward. 
Hon Dr NICK SMITH 
: I can understand why Labour is so sensitive about this point because it goes to the core of the issues and the debates this year about the competency of the Government to manage the public’s finances. It is a matter of public record that the previous Labour Government breached the Public Finance Act in not disclosing hundreds of millions of dollars of losses in ACC. That member Maryan Street as the Minister for ACC at the time must accept reasonability for that.