Nash Stuart: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Questions to Members 
Nash Stuart: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Questions to Members 
[Volume:675;Page:21057] 
10. 
STUART NASH (Labour) 
 to the  
Minister of Finance 
: Does the Government’s privatisation plan include parameters which would cause it to cancel sales such as low sale prices or high dividend yields; if so what are the parameters? 
Hon BILL ENGLISH (Minister of Finance) 
: 
 In the first place the Government is not getting ahead of itself. It has always said it would get a mandate from New Zealanders before proceeding with the detailed plans for the sale. The mixed-ownership model is about achieving long-term value for taxpayers. The Government has said that if it is re-elected such a programme would be spread over 3 to 5 years which gives the Government ample flexibility to adjust to market circumstances. In the current environment demand from New Zealand investors is likely to be strong. The NZX 50 Index has risen 27 percent in the past 18 months and that looks reasonably favourable at least at the moment. 
Stuart Nash 
: Has the record $900 million of dividends returned to the Crown by the State-owned energy companies in the last year on top of an average rate of return of 17.5 percent over the previous 5 years caused him to reassess the economic case for selling these highly profitable State-owned assets? 
Hon BILL ENGLISH 
: As I pointed out yesterday of the $900 million the member is talking about at least $500 million is a one-off capital release as a result of the sale of assets between Genesis and Meridian Energy. The fact is that until this Government came into office and lifted the performance of these State-owned enterprises they were pretty abysmal. They are better now and under the mixed-ownership model they will improve further. 
Stuart Nash 
: Given that 75 percent of New Zealanders earn below the average wage of $50000 and only 1.5 percent earn above $150000 what percentage of hard-working Kiwi families does he think will be able to afford $4000 to directly buy shares in an asset they already own? 
Hon BILL ENGLISH 
: New Zealanders will have the opportunity to own these assets in a number of ways. First the Government will retain 51 percent ownership. Second we expect significant investment by the New Zealand Superannuation Fund which holds assets on behalf of all New Zealanders. KiwiSaver funds which— 
Stuart Nash 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I have listened to the other two answers and they have really been off the point. This one really I do not want to know who will own the shares I just want to know what percentage it will be. The question asked what percentage of New Zealanders—just a rough percentage—he thinks will be able to afford to buy these shares. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: With respect the Minister was in the process of explaining why he believes that some percentage of New Zealanders will be able to afford to own them. He was talking about the Government owning 51 percent; I think he was going on to talk about funds owning some of these shares. When the member asks that kind of question which is a hypothetical question he cannot expect a precise answer. I think the Minister has some latitude in how he answers it. So far he has been answering the question in terms of why some percentage of New Zealanders should be able to own those shares. 
Hon Trevor Mallard 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. With all due respect the question was about direct ownership not about indirect ownership via funds or via the taxpayer. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I do not recollect the question being quite so specific. It talked about if I remember correctly where people with $4000 could be found to own these shares. The question was hypothetical. It is not the kind of question for which I can insist on any particular answer. I think the Minister was not criticising the questioner; he was explaining why he believes New Zealanders will be able to own these shares. I do not know whether he was arriving at an estimate but I cannot stop him at this stage when he has not departed from the Standing Orders in answering the question so far. I ask the Hon Bill English to finish his answer. 
Hon BILL ENGLISH 
: Using the term the member uses that New Zealanders already “own” these shares then any of those who do not actually put up cash to buy some of the shares will already own the shares that the Government already owns.