3. Question No. 3—Public ServiceSIMEON BROWN (National—Pakuranga) to the Minister for the Public ServiceQuestion No. 3—Public Service3. SIMEON BROWN (National—Pakuranga) to the Minister for the Public Service: Does he stand by the statements of Acting Public Service Minister Hon Grant Robertson that I'm confident that the public service is delivering to New Zealanders" and "We'll always make sure that what we spend is careful"?Hon CHRIS HIPKINS (Minister for the Public Service): Yes in the context in which the statement was made.Simeon Brown: Has he seen reports that the number of comms staff across the Public Service has increased by 46 percent from 339 in 2017 to 497 in 2021 and if so is he convinced that spending an extra 64 percent on comms staff is a good use of taxpayers' money?Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: Yes I have seen that. I think it's important to note what we're talking about when we're talking about comms staff. The number of media-related comms staff—i.e. press secretaries and so on—has remained the same. The additional comms staff that are being employed are to do things like provide information to the public make sure website information is available in a publicly accessible form and respond to queries from members of the public.Simeon Brown: Why has the number of comms staff at the Public Service Commission which is a department he is the Minister for almost tripled from six in 2017 to 15 in 2021 and is this an example of careful Government expenditure?SPEAKER: Well I think I was the Minister of Education when that member was at school and we didn't do a good thing on maths did we?Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: The issue there is primarily one of coding. If we look at what those staff members do they're not responding to media queries; they're doing other activities that are classified as communications related.Simeon Brown: How can he say that the Public Service is careful in its spending when the Public Service Commission which he is responsible for has almost three times as many comms staff and more than doubled its spend on consultants since he came to office?Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: I suspect the member didn't hear my answer to the last question but I addressed that in my last answer.Rachel Boyack: What growth if any has there been in permanent employees in the Public Service in the last year and what have been the main contributors to that growth?Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: I appreciate there is a lot of public interest in this. The growth in Public Service employees last year up to the end of June was 3950 or a 6.9 percent increase. Half of that growth—around 50 percent—was directly attributable to the Government's response to COVID-19. That included people running managed isolation and quarantine facilities rolling out the vaccination programme supporting contact tracing managing the border and providing welfare assistance to people and businesses affected by the economic impact of COVID-19. About 40 percent of the growth was to support the Government's work programme including improving front-line services and help to individuals families and businesses; implementing the Government's reform agenda including climate change Resource Management Act reform and mental health service roll-out; and investing in the delivery of services such as more support for schools and teachers more protection for workers and consumers and businesses.Simeon Brown: Is he aware that the New Zealand Transport Agency (NZTA) has more than doubled its comms staff from 32 in 2017 to 88 in 2021 and if so with examples like this is the Government's priority to employ spin-doctors over front-line doctors in our hospitals?Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: Again I think the member should listen to the previous answer I gave. This isn't about spin-doctors; this about people who are engaging with members of the public. NZTA's very comprehensive work programme does involve engaging members of the public who are affected by that work.Hon Grant Robertson: What would the Minister's response be if as Public Service Minister it was brought to his attention that a pay system was introduced that had 90 percent of public school teachers mis-paid for two years and $45 million had to be spent to fix the system?Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: I think that's exactly the sort of example that we want to avoid where penny-pinching ultimately leads to services that don't actually deliver for New Zealanders and cost a lot more in the long run and Novopay is a really good example of what we get when we end up with a National Government trying to cut corners.SPEAKER: The answer to the member's question was Anne Tolley."