4. Question No. 4—FinanceNICOLA WILLIS (Deputy Leader—National) to the Minister of FinanceQuestion No. 4—Finance4. NICOLA WILLIS (Deputy Leader—National) to the Minister of Finance: What update on the fiscal outlook if any have Public Service chief executives been informed of at recent meetings reported to have been held with him and what updated requests for spending restraint if any have been directed to those chief executives?Hon GRANT ROBERTSON (Minister of Finance): In answer to the first part of the question I met with Public Service chief executives yesterday as I have done several times in the last three years as part of the Government's fiscal sustainability and effectiveness programme which we announced in Budget 2023 in May. Public Service chief executives are aware of the most recent update of the fiscal outlook as other New Zealanders are and the Government accounts for the 11 months to May 2023 that were released in July. The next update will be the pre-election fiscal update in September. In answer to the second part of the question public sector chief executives are aware of the need to continue to make efforts to meet the Government's fiscal rules and return the Government accounts to a more sustainable fiscal position following the significant investments required to deal with the effects of the global pandemic.Nicola Willis: Is it correct that specific Government agencies including the New Zealand Transport Agency were directed to find savings of at least 2 percent?Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: The Government's fiscal sustainability and effectiveness programme is an ongoing programme. Any decisions that would affect departmental budgets will be dealt with in the same way that all Budget requests and decisions are made and will be announced when it is appropriate to do so.Nicola Willis: Is it correct that the finance Minister at the very last minute has realised that the pre-election fiscal update will be a complete debacle and so is trying to quickly get decisions into Cabinet minutes to try and paper over the crevasse in the Government accounts?Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: The member clearly wasn't listening to my primary answer. In the Budget in May we had $4 billion worth of savings that we found and we announced our fiscal sustainability and effectiveness programme—page 64 of the Budget documents for the member's reference. It is an ongoing programme of work because we are a responsible Government that seeks to make sure that we manage what is in front of us and seeks to make sure that we get a balance between fiscal sustainability and supporting New Zealanders. The only person who should be worried about a fiscal crevasse to use the member's words is the member who cannot pay for the promises that she is making.Nicola Willis: Why is it after six years of spraying New Zealanders' money around with wild abandon that he has at the midnight hour worked out that perhaps the bureaucracy should tighten its belt and only now started issuing those directives?Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: Again I repeat the answers that I have given. In Budget 2023 there were $4 billion worth of savings identified. We have an ongoing sustainability and effectiveness programme. I think what we're seeing here is a member who can see in front of her the fact that she couldn't pay for the promises that have already been made and if she hasn't been keeping up with where the Government accounts are that's not our responsibility. She now has to be the one to find some way of repairing the fiscal hole in National's plans.Nicola Willis: How big is his hole and do—[Interruption]Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: That is not in the public interest I can assure you! Nicola Willis: Apologies Mr Speaker. How big is the New Zealand Government's financial hole and what credibility will any commitments he makes to fixing it have when in every Budget he has delivered he has spent more than he said he would six months prior—on average $600 million more than he promises in his Budget Policy Statements?Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: As I indicated in my primary answer the latest accounts for the Government were made available to the public in July. They did indicate a softening in the revenue stream for the Government. The finalisation of where that reaches will be in the pre-election fiscal update. But I say to the member: just today in the questions that I've answered already we've noted that Moody's one of the most important rating agencies have given a tick of approval to the economic management of the Government. When I look at the Budgets that we have produced over the last few years we have struck that balance between supporting New Zealanders and being fiscally disciplined. That is clear in the outcomes we have seen with some of the lowest public debt in the world with an economy 6 percent bigger than it was before COVID and with record low unemployment. We are proud of our record and make sure we look after New Zealanders and look after the books.