Jackson WillieHon WILLIE JACKSON (Labour): Thank you Mr Chair. I'm really disappointed with the Minister's responses tonight—particularly in the democracy area where he waffles on about democracy but no one can actually get a line on what the heck he's talking about in terms of democracy. It's democracy according to the Minister. And I note that the former Minister of Education from National talked about democracy in a lot of broad areas in the last couple of days and said that democracy was about diversity and democracy was about treaties and democracy was about the Treaty of Waitangi. And my good friend from Gisborne there who knows Hekia Parata well would agree with me that democracy is more than just one person one vote which this Minister keeps waffling on about but forgets that there's lots of different examples as Hekia Parata has said of how democracy has been tweaked and how it's been changed. And she's particularly embarrassed by this Minister and his nonsense about democracy which brings us to just a couple of areas that have not been addressed. And that's why we want to support what Kieran McAnulty said—that the Minister does not address our questions Mr Chair. I talked about institutional racism earlier and so did the Hon Kieran McAnulty and he hasn't talked about it hasn't come back to it doesn't know anything about it. I know he's only about 21 but he doesn't understand—Hon Members: Oh come on!Rima Nakhle: Ageist.Hon WILLIE JACKSON: Well I can't help it if you put kids into these sort of jobs but the reality is we want answers over what institutional racism is and we've got nothing from this Minister.But I want to also back up what's been said in terms of new section 19ZB in terms of Electors may demand poll": "(1) A specified number of electors of a territorial authority or regional council may at any time demand that a poll be held on the question"—I think this question's already been put up but again we don't have the answer; this is 19ZB—"…(a) in the case of a territorial authority the district should be divided into 1 or more Māori wards;". The question here—and I think it's been well put—is that we're talking about a specified number of electors but we're only talking about 5 percent. That does not at all fit the descriptions of democracy that the Minister keeps talking about. You know there's this insistence that it's about one person one vote when clearly things have changed. And I just need some clarification from the Minister with regards to this. In terms of these electors demanding a poll it seems that Māori—and we've been talking about Māori all evening—don't have the rights.I also want to know from the Minister: if he does have any plans in replacing some of the Māori expertise that are going to be removed from these boards how do you replace that expertise when you know that we've finally got access to democracy finally got opportunities to getting on some of these boards? We have not had representation around the country in terms of councils. That's what's driven this bill. It gave Māori an opportunity to be on there. What's the Minister's plan in terms of replacing some of the expertise that's going off? You see we have the Māori statutory board. You have all that expertise in Auckland that the Auckland Council utilised. How many Māori have we got on Auckland Council? One.Hon Member: Three.Hon WILLIE JACKSON: Three. One and a half I think. We've got a James Meager type on there too I think.James Meager: Awww.JAMES MEAGER: I can't help it if Mr Meager says he's half a Māori. I can't help it if James Meager says he's half a Māori; that's his problem.Rawiri Waititi: Yep. That was his own admission.Hon WILLIE JACKSON: That's right. Not that I don't respect James; I respect him very much. But we're talking about Māori representation here and I'd like to know from the Minister: how does he respond to that question in terms of electors demanding polls? It's a really relevant question. I'd also like him to come back in terms of institutional racism. He still has not answered. That question was one of the first questions asked by Kieran McAnulty in the debate tonight."