Alexander Marc: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Alexander Marc: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Volume:621;Page:16701] 
1. MARC ALEXANDER (United Future) 
 to the  
Minister of Justice 
: How much funding has the Government committed to YouthLaw through the Legal Services Agency and is that funding likely to continue beyond the current contract? 
Hon PHIL GOFF (Minister of Justice) 
: 
Firstly the funding for the YouthLaw organisation is not predominantly from the Government; it is actually from the New Zealand Law Society’s special fund. Secondly under its current 3-year contract with the Legal Services Agency YouthLaw is expected to receive about $407000 this financial year. To the best of my knowledge it has been funded through the Legal Services Agency and before that the Legal Services Board since the early 1990s. Funding for the future is a matter of negotiation between the Legal Services Agency and YouthLaw rather than the Government. 
Marc Alexander 
: Why does this Minister’s Government despite his answer to the first question at least partially fund YouthLaw when the organisation’s website explains to young people how they can avoid apprehension for drug offences and is accompanied by a picture that shows a young man taking a hit from a P pipe; and does the Minister see any contradiction between supporting this organisation and the Government’s claim that it is taking a hard line on drugs? 
Hon PHIL GOFF 
: My first answer might have been inconvenient to the member but nevertheless it is predominantly not the Government that funds this organisation but the New Zealand Law Society fund. 
Lianne Dalziel 
: On what basis and for what purpose does the Legal Services Agency contract with YouthLaw? 
Hon PHIL GOFF 
: The Legal Services Agency funds YouthLaw as a specialist community law centre. The purpose of funding that organisation is to meet identified unmet legal need. Therefore YouthLaw will be funded to tell young people about their rights even though that may not be convenient from the viewpoint of those who are trying to enforce or take action against them for things such as drug abuses. 
Richard Worth 
: Why does the Minister say that the substantial proportion of funding is from the Auckland District Law Society as he did in answer to the primary question when the YouthLaw website says that most of its funding is in fact derived from the Legal Services Agency; and is not the question asked initially correct in that we have a situation where the centre is accepting of the drug culture and more concerned about identifying the rights of drug dealers and users than curbing the culture? 
Hon PHIL GOFF 
: If the member is going to quote my first answer he should take care to get it right. I never suggested it was funded by the Auckland District Law Society although the society through its $50 levy does put $30000 a year into YouthLaw. Predominantly the funds come from the Legal Services Agency and as the member should know that is drawn from the New Zealand Law Society’s special fund which is the consolidated interest rate on lawyers’ trust accounts. The member as a lawyer should know that. 
Craig McNair 
: Is the funding that the Government has committed to YouthLaw issues resulting in improved youth offending figures; if so in which specific areas? 
Hon PHIL GOFF 
: I can quote the Principal Youth Court Judge who said that youth offending figures have remained remarkably consistent over the last 5 to 7 years. That is a good thing because the proportion of the population that is in that youth bracket has doubled over that period of time. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: Does anyone believe that? 
Hon PHIL GOFF 
: Obviously the Principal Youth Court Judge does. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Has the Minister finished? 
Hon PHIL GOFF 
: Well I could take a number of— 
Mr SPEAKER 
: The Minister could if he wanted to but he would be holding things up. 
Marc Alexander 
: Is the Minister aware that the YouthLaw website advises young people that they can escape apprehension for dealing class C drugs such as cannabis if they give them to others rather than sell them and is he also aware that the website tells young people that if they are under 17 and are caught dealing drugs they are unlikely to go to prison and does he condone this? 
Hon PHIL GOFF 
: I do not condone anyone who promotes the use of illegal drugs but there is nothing to stop the YouthLaw centre explaining what the law requires and where it operates. 
Nandor Tanczos 
: Does the Minister agree that in terms of the statutory direction to the Legal Services Agency in particular regarding community law centres to address unmet legal needs one of the greatest areas of unmet legal needs in this country is young people and that the YouthLaw project is the only community law centre to focus exclusively on young people’s legal needs? 
Hon PHIL GOFF 
: What the member has said is I think substantially correct. Young people have few resources and therefore they cannot afford to meet their legal needs. 
Marc Alexander 
: Is the Minister aware that the YouthLaw website refers young people who want further legal advice on drugs to NORML the lobby group for the legalisation of cannabis; if not why not? 
Hon PHIL GOFF 
: I have not looked in detail at the YouthLaw website nor indeed the websites of the other community law centres. As I have said to the House before I do not support any action that encourages people to use illicit drugs or creates an environment where they are more likely to do so. If that is implied in any of their material then I deplore it. 
Stephen Franks 
: How does the Minister distinguish his position from a view that telling people their rights is the same thing as telling them how to avoid being convicted instead of telling innocent people how to insist on due process when the Minister has just heard the description of the advice on the website which is not advice on how innocent people can show their innocence; it is how to take drugs without being caught? 
Hon PHIL GOFF 
: I guess most lawyers in this country earn their money by telling their clients of their rights and doing their best to get them off charges if they face them—probably including the member in his time. 
Nandor Tanczos 
: Is the Minister aware that in the year 2000 YouthLaw received the Human Rights Commission millennium award— 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I do not think it is appropriate that the Minister should accuse another member of Parliament of committing illegal acts that were such that he would need a lawyer to defend him which is what he did in the last part of his answer. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: He did not accuse him of illegal acts. I listened carefully to the answer that was given. 
Nandor Tanczos 
: Is the Minister aware that in the year 2000 YouthLaw received a Human Rights Commission millennium award for its legal services to young people and would he not expect the YouthLaw community law centre to refer young people to factual information about the law with regard to young people regardless of the source of that information and as long as it was factually accurate? 
Hon PHIL GOFF 
: Yes I would expect YouthLaw to provide factually accurate information. I think that by and large YouthLaw probably does things that most members of this Chamber would strongly agree with but there may be exceptions to that particularly in the drug area. 
Marc Alexander 
: I seek leave to table a picture showing a young man taking a hit from a P pipe from the at-least partly Government-funded YouthLaw website. 
Document by leave laid on the Table of the House.