Dowie SarahSARAH DOWIE (National—Invercargill): Thank you Madam Chair. I rise to take a second call on this Conservation (Infringement System) Bill. I'm pleased that the Minister got to take a call to give us some answers on this bill. I'm not sure what the whips are doing over on that side of the Chamber but Deborah Russell should have given the Minister the call and yielded to her in the first instance.Hon Ruth Dyson: I think it's the presiding officer's call not yours.SARAH DOWIE: Well yes but you've got to show a little bit of respect for a Minister in my opinion.CHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams): Order! Order!Hon Ruth Dyson: Lectures on morals. Yeah. Don't get her started.CHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams): Order! Let's carry on with the bill.SARAH DOWIE: Thanks Miss Dyson. Thank you.CHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams): Order! Order to the House. Let's carry on thank you.SARAH DOWIE: Thank you to the Minister for making that call and giving us some answers with regards to her views as to how the infringement system will work. It still doesn't allay our concerns with regards to making sure that this infringement system is consistent and is fair across the board. As Mr Scott Simpson alluded to Fish & Game rangers are not State sector employees. They're not subject to the same codes of conduct as Department of Conservation (DOC) rangers.Notwithstanding that Fish & Game does some very good work again as my colleague Mr Scott Simpson said it's not about Fish & Game per se; it's about a non-governmental organisation having the powers to issue infringement notices.I was interested to note the Minister said that these infringement notices won't be issued in the field. Details will be taken and that information will be brought back to the office and then decisions will be made. But regardless decisions will be made with Fish & Game at their end and the department at their end. That doesn't necessarily convert to consistency between the two. So I would put it to the Minister with respect to her development of the policy that it will need to be tested moving forward and that objective parameters will need to be put around the administration of this infringement system and measured as time goes forward should this bill complete its progression throughout the House. So that is our concern: that there will be people out recreating spending their time on the conservation estate going about their business perhaps in the North Island and the same in the South Island and that there may not be consistency in regulating with respect to offences within New Zealand. So we want to make sure that any infringement system that is given to the Department of Conservation is fair and reasonable.We do support the Department of Conservation with respect to enforcement but it must be completed and administered in a very measured way. That is our concern with regards to extending that power to Fish & Game and hence my Supplementary Order Paper to take that away in this instance to delete references to extending that power to make sure that this infringement system is first of all given to the Department of Conservation that it is put in place that the administration of it is completed with due diligence and that it is administered fairly and objectively.As I mentioned before in my first call this bill cuts across a number of different legislation that relate to Department of Conservation functions. Quite frankly the logistics of the work that the Department of Conservation - run rangers undertake does lend itself to an infringement system. That's why we introduced it in the first instance under the previous Government. That's why it was introduced by the Hon Maggie Barry. Again bringing it back to our concerns this system must be fair it must be reasonable and it must be measured and consistent throughout all of New Zealand.