Reti ShaneDr SHANE RETI (National—Whangarei): Thank you Madam Chair. To continue that dialogue the report on the terminal exception—which is what this clause talks to—needs to address a number of things. Again you can't list everything that should appear in a report but I think it's quite clear there are a number of really important things that we thought might have come up as being worthy of discussion in two years' time and I'll come back to that two years' time in the top part in a moment.But first of all understand that the terminal exception and statutory defence is an incredible liberty on some of the judicial processes. For example we know that under the terminal exception and the statutory defence procurement of loose-leaf cannabis will be illegal but possession will be legal. Wow! I mean is that entrapment if you encourage someone? Someone has to commit a crime for you to get what you want. Is that entrapment? That must be getting awful close surely. I think it's another discussion to have and maybe the report could talk to that.I think of how well the police are able to monitor and manage the terminal exception. We had some advice from them in the Health Committee that this was going to be a challenge. In fact what they said to us was We hope that we can call up GPs who will go to their database and tell us yes this person sits under the terminal exception or not." Wow! Think about that work flow. How does that happen? On weekends are you going to find the GP? Does everyone have access to all of the information all of the time? What makes you think that there's going to be a field on a GP database? Oh but wait you've spoken with GPs—no you haven't. We know that answer. Oh but wait you've spoken with software developers—no you haven't. We know that answer. There was just again another sparsity of detail around what that would look like and I think the review on the terminal exception—which is what this clause is talking to—could well talk to those things.Now the terminal exception is a temporary scheme—we all agree that—and this comes down to temporality. How temporary? Not even a discussion of the broader issues of when—and the report could talk to this also—the temporary scheme finishes and a full-blown medicinal cannabis scheme starts and my colleague the Hon Michael Woodhouse identified that in an earlier clause. What happens if under the terminal exception at the end of that period—this is the discussion we want to have; when that period is—you're OK and you're able to possess but when the medicinal cannabis scheme comes in the next day you're not? How is that transition going to work? No discussion—I think a report could talk about that. If in two years' time which is in the top part here as "not later than 2 years" in new section 35E(1) they are ready to conclude the terminal exception—this may be the guidance here that actually it's envisaged in two years' time. I'm drawing some indirect conclusions but that's possible. It would have been nicer to have just said it if it was. Now look if it couldn't be said and put in the legislation our Supplementary Order Paper (SOP) 179 does that. The 30 months that we're proposing is clearly another six months past the two years written into this bill. So you could have a review and report in two years draw your conclusions and then terminate it six months later—OK? Again how we got to that 30 months in SOP 179 was 12 months for the enabling legislation 12 months from seed to sale—because the industry has told us that roughly it will take them 12 months to start cultivating processing and manufacturing and then getting out into the retail environment. That's presuming there's a good approval mechanism through Medsafe for that to happen—unclear and that's exactly why we're saying that should have more clarity. But anyway when you've done that you've got to your two-year period and then we think there's another six months where you get slippage and some delays that are unaccountable. So our SOP 179 is totally consistent with this clause and the desire to have the report in two years' time. I've identified some of the issues that I think the report most certainly should address such as the ongoing illegal procurement of loose-leaf cannabis but the legal possession should be addressed. The police interface—how well have they managed that? Let's see if in two years' time as we were told in select committee GPs have a database the police can go into when they pull someone over and say "Yes this person meets the terminal exception." That's really hard. That talks to work flow. I've already indicated that that sort of work flow actually takes a lot of time and has a lot of unintended consequences. I would be pleased but I'm doubtful that that sort of work flow could be implemented in two years' time. I've tried to do something similar overseas and it's a lot harder than it might be just to write this into the bill. So I think as this clause talks about review and report we've put forward a solution. We've put forward something totally consistent with this clause and we'd ask the Minister to consider that."