Franks Stephen: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Franks Stephen: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Volume:623;Page:18313] 
1. STEPHEN FRANKS (ACT) 
 to the  
Minister of Police 
: Did it occur to him to ask the police what evidence they were still seeking when they informed him they were still investigating the Tame Iti case when Tame Iti was seen on television brandishing a shotgun which he also discharged to shred a New Zealand flag and what assurance can he give that all New Zealanders are treated equally under the law? 
Hon GEORGE HAWKINS (Minister of Police) 
: 
 The district commander for the Bay of Plenty Superintendent Gary Smith has said today that no shortcuts will be undertaken in this case. The laws of New Zealand apply to all citizens. Where offences have occurred and there is sufficient evidence to warrant charges the police will act. The police say that a thorough investigation is under way. 
Stephen Franks 
: Has the Minister ever instructed the New Zealand Police to treat Maori protesters like every other New Zealander; if not why not when plainly their law-breaking can go on for days or months without enforcement. 
Hon GEORGE HAWKINS 
: The police enforce the law equally without fear or favour and that is something New Zealand should be proud of. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: Is it not a fact that this is another example of Labour’s two standards of citizenship in New Zealand where the Government allows—[ 
Interruption 
] 
Mr SPEAKER 
: There were interjections from about 10 people on both sides of the House. That is the only warning today. I now want to have the question asked again in silence. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: Is it not a fact that this is another example of Labour’s two standards of citizenship in this country where it allows the Maori hikoi to cross the Auckland Harbour Bridge in protest but non-Maori protest groups are denied? 
Hon GEORGE HAWKINS 
: We treat everyone equally in New Zealand. Operational matters are entirely for the police to decide on and not for any member in Parliament to direct them on. 
Ron Mark 
: Why in this case have the police been dithering for 2 weeks when we all know that Mr Tame Iti who is oft described as an “extremist Maori activist” has also been convicted in 1997 on firearms and assault charges for which he received a 6-month jail sentence and was also seen on national television in September 2000 assaulting John te Kaha and a camera crew with a taiaha; and is the reason the police are dithering over charging this man—something that would have happened immediately had it been anyone else—because this Government is exerting its influence over the police officers involved? 
Hon GEORGE HAWKINS 
: No. 
Heather Roy 
: Is it a lack of resources or just pressure from New Zealand’s crime wave that has stopped the police from asking Tame Iti a few questions since the incident at any time over the last 2 weeks or getting the film evidence or getting a warrant for it as of this morning and if the Minister does not know why has he not asked? 
Hon GEORGE HAWKINS 
: The police are going through a thorough investigation and of course crime is dropping in New Zealand—and that person cannot deny that. It is at its lowest level for over 20 years. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: If this Minister never interferes with police activity why did he issue a press release telling the police to issue a press release on Mr Tame Iti’s firearms incident? 
Simon Power 
: Oh dear me. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Mr Power I would like you to stand withdraw and apologise for that interjection or whoever it was. 
Simon Power 
: I withdraw and apologise. 
Hon GEORGE HAWKINS 
: I did not instruct the police. If the member learns to read and interpret properly he will know that. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: Given that Mr Tame Iti was shown on national television discharging a gun then baring his bum for national television again—which would surely be two offences—could I ask the Minister whether the police intend to treat that matter with the same alacrity with which they might treat the question of Jason Ake a Prime Ministerial employee whose home or the pathway in front of his home suffered a graffiti attack last night following the allegations in the  
Independent 
 regarding the Maori Party activists and targeting of Maori MPs in which what they wrote on the footpath whether that is right or wrong read: “Labour sucks”? 
Hon GEORGE HAWKINS 
: I have no information on the latter case but I can tell the member that the police are leaving no stone unturned to make sure that if a case proceeds to court they will be successful. 
Deborah Coddington 
: How can he say that the police have enough resources and that the laws apply to all citizens in New Zealand when today’s  
Time 
 magazine reveals that 4 months ago US Customs gave the New Zealand Police scores of names of New Zealand suspected paedophiles in an international paedophile ring but nothing has been done here to arrest anyone; and has he been briefed on this Operation Falcon? 
Mr SPEAKER 
: That is very wide of the original question which has no reference to that matter. The Minister if he wishes can comment but the question is very wide indeed of the original question. 
Hon GEORGE HAWKINS 
: I cannot comment on that article. I have not seen it. But I can say that the police are leaving no stone unturned in their investigation on Tame Iti. 
Deborah Coddington 
: What is the delay when the Minister says that the police are leaving no stone unturned that prevents the police from arresting Tame Iti and from acting on information supplied 4 months ago by US Customs; and when did he first learn about this Operation Falcon? 
Hon GEORGE HAWKINS 
: I can only comment about the Tame Iti one. I can say that the police have all the resources they need and of course crime is going down. It is at a 20-year low—something to be pretty proud of. 
Dr Muriel Newman 
: How thorough is this investigation when the police have not even bothered to pick up the videotape from TVNZ on the Tame Iti issue other than to make a phone call to be told they need a search warrant? 
Hon GEORGE HAWKINS 
: I do not get involved in being a know-all of what the police should do or should not do. That member might want to. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: What evidence do the police now need given that they have got everything they could possibly want on that television programme in terms of arresting the man in question and having regard to his last statement why is he wasting the taxpayers’ money as a Minister of Police if he has no purpose for being there? 
Hon GEORGE HAWKINS 
: I have to say in answer to the last part of the question that the police are well resourced. They have never been better resourced. When it comes to how the police deal with cases and solve them that is left to them. It should not be left to individual members of Parliament who think they know it all. 
Ron Mark 
: Can the Minister explain to the House why when he has recently announced that he will be introducing an amendment to the Arms Act when we have a known activist who was convicted in 1997 on firearms charges and on assault charges for which the police know he received a 6-month jail sentence when we have the same man charged with an assault committed on national television with a taiaha against a camera crew and John te Kaha— 
Mr SPEAKER 
: The question is too long. Would the member pleased bring it to an end? 
Ron Mark 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: No please bring it to an end. I have given the member very wide latitude. 
Ron Mark 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. The reason I am having to re-ask this question and use another one of New Zealand First’s supplementary questions is that that was the first question I asked—and the Minister failed to address that very point. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I have told the member that he can ask the supplementary question. However the supplementary question is already longer than his original question. I would like the member to come to the point. 
Ron Mark 
: Why did the police not immediately arrest that man for discharging a firearm in a public place and why are we still waiting 2 weeks’ later? 
Hon GEORGE HAWKINS 
: I think that most people in New Zealand would have liked Tame Iti to be arrested. The police however have to collect the evidence and be certain of success. That is why we have a record clearance rate by the New Zealand Police—up about 45 percent compared with a 29 percent result when National was in Government. Crime clearances are up and I am sure it will be in this case. 
Hon Ken Shirley 
: How does the Minister reconcile his belief that in his words he believes that the Tame Iti inquiry is thorough leaving no stone unturned with the fact that a fortnight after the event the police have not obtained the film evidence that the whole of the country has seen and as of this morning have not even applied for a warrant to obtain it—how does he reconcile those two irreconcilable points? 
Hon GEORGE HAWKINS 
: I do not instruct the police on how they investigate each case. We spend $1 billion a year on employing police to do that job. 
Rodney Hide 
: Can he see how Mr Tame Iti might well reach the conclusion that was reported today when he said: “The Minister of Police has no rights in Tuhoe country as simple as that.” and why has this Minister again today done nothing to disabuse Mr Iti’s view that the law of New Zealand does not apply to him? 
Hon GEORGE HAWKINS 
: Mr Iti’s comments in the  
New Zealand Herald  
this morning do not have any truth in them at all. There is only one law in New Zealand and it applies to everyone. That is what this Government demands of the New Zealand Police. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: I seek leave to table a video of the incident shown on television last night involving Mr Iti supplied by the Parliamentary Library which could be made available to the police. 
Video not tabled. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: I seek leave to table a statement made by the Hon Minister of Police suggesting that it would be helpful if the police were to release a press statement on the matter of Mr Tame Iti. 
Document by leave laid on the Table of the House. 
Stephen Franks 
: Mr Speaker— 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Is this a further supplementary question? 
Stephen Franks 
: Yes. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I would have appreciated that before the points of order. But that is perfectly OK. 
Stephen Franks 
: Did he really mean it just now when he said that it should not be up to individual members of Parliament to pursue this matter—when yesterday he tried to excuse police inactivity by telling me I should lodge a complaint when surely it is his job to ensure the police are upholding the law—and if I give him this complaint will he make sure that it gets to the commissioner promptly? 
Hon GEORGE HAWKINS 
: Yes. 
Ron Mark 
: I seek the leave of the House to table a couple of reports. The first one is from the  
Dominion Post  
of 8 December 2000 “Iti denies attacking television crew”. 
Document by leave laid on the Table of the House. 
Ron Mark 
: The second tabling is a report “Activist in court on kidnap charge” which details firearms charges and assault charges that were laid against Mr Iti. 
Document by leave laid on the Table of the House. 
Ron Mark 
: The third tabling is a report dated 9 May 1999 again outlining firearms charges. 
Document by leave laid on the Table of the House.