Court SimonSIMON COURT (ACT): Thank you Mr Chair. That was actually a very useful question from Barbara Kuriger. But Minister before you get around to answering that can we just come back to the transport stormwater system. The road corridor whether it's in a city or on a State highway is usually impervious from boundary to boundary. It's concrete footpaths or asphalt roads and that very large surface area contributes a lot of stormwater to the urban stormwater system—much much more than would typically be contributed even by roofs off residential buildings. So up until this point in time with local councils being the road controlling authority and owning the stormwater system they've been able to balance internally the cost of managing that stormwater through stormwater treatment ponds or collection.Where I live in Te Atatū Peninsula in fact there's a whole series of wetlands being constructed as part of new subdivisions which take stormwater off the road network as well as the residential roofs and driveways and filter it and treat it through a series of ponds. In fact it's already filtered and treated to such a high standard that we have all kinds of native ducks dabchicks and other rare and threatened species that have decided that the stormwater quality in Auckland's Te Atatū Peninsula is so good in the Harbourview Orangihina Park that they've decided to call it home at least on a temporary basis during nesting season.But all of that stormwater that comes off roofs or roads has to in the future under this model be attributed to one entity or the other. Now if it's coming off roofs then we could assume that maybe it's local councils or residents that have responsibility for paying for the collection treatment and final discharge of stormwater. But if it's coming off roads then we would have to assume that the road controlling authority which would still be local councils would need to make some kind of provision for paying for the treatment of all the stormwater off their local road network. So Minister what do you expect relationship agreements to include so that that cost could be evenly attributed? I'm pretty sure that councils and their ratepayers won't want to have to pay for a whole lot of stormwater that isn't theirs. But again if councils are still the road controlling authority will they still be paying for it?Now all of this is not determined Minister. While you in your role as local government Minister and previous Ministers have claimed that there'll be significant reductions in the cost of three waters for current and future ratepayers actually if we think about the volume of water that councils will continue to discharge to the stormwater networks operated by water services entities Minister isn't it likely that councils—and therefore ratepayers—will continue to pay a significant amount of money for stormwater in addition to what they pay water services entities? And I'm assuming that at some point in the future they're going to get separate bills; one that might say Water Services Entity A" and another "Water Services Entity B"—or "Water Services Entity 10" or however many eventually get stood up. So Minister how can you be confident given it's not clear who's going to pay for stormwater and whether it comes off a road or whether it comes off a residential property or whether it comes off council parks and reserves how this is going to be allocated? And what if any savings can ratepayers expect from the stormwater service component of their rates that they currently pay?"