Delahunty CatherineCATHERINE DELAHUNTY (Green): Tēnā koe Mr Chair. Tēnā koutou e Te Whare. I find this a very complex and interesting bill and I am really wanting to just point out a couple of things in the very interesting debate that we have had tonight and the excellent Supplementary Order Papers that Eugenie Sage and the Opposition have put up.I also want to bring us back to something and I just want to quote the words of the kaihautū of Ngāti Paoa Iwi Trust and co-negotiator of the iwi's Treaty settlement Hauauru Rawiri: The bill is Treaty settlement legislation. For Ngāti Paoa to regain ownership and control of significant customary land at Te Tauoma is central to the historical Treaty settlement between the Crown and Ngāti Paoa. Without this land there will be no Treaty settlement between the Crown and Ngāti Paoa." That is where it gets complicated because this has undoubtedly been a messy process. It has undoubtedly upset the local people who live there at the moment very much. It has undoubtedly been a bad use in a way of the legal process because of all of the people who have been shut out. But there is a deeper issue as well which is why it is a nuanced and complex situation despite the failures of this bill.I live in Hauraki and I look across to Ngāti Paoa. There is not a lot of land under their control and they do not have all the opportunities in the world. Many people who are settled living in the city with their good homes and their gardens and their lovely views and their right to enjoy themselves need to also think about the history of colonisation in this country and how the Reserves Act in its previous iterations has been used to actually strip Māori land from people. So if we are going to talk about the word "reserve" we need to acknowledge some of the history.The other day I was up at Ngāti Whātua ki Ōrākei and I said to them: "What's your view of this bill? Because it's really complex and difficult and seems to be very badly designed." The people I talked to said: "It's Ngāti Paoa land—end of story." That does not make it any easier when the Crown has actually got another agenda but that is their view.I think it is interesting to consider the whole question of good faith here. Because this bill is so poorly designed and has created so much negativity it actually impacts on Te Tiriti settlement that Ngāti Paoa are trying to advance and this bill is part of that for them. That is where we need to be a lot more sophisticated in this country in the way that we deal with this because we do not want the population who currently live in Auckland to have a complete lack of understanding about what is possible. I think Ngāti Whātua ki Ōrākei give a good example of how you can have housing for income streams housing for papakāinga and how you can have high standards of environmental protection—in fact I would say that Ngāti Whātua have got some of the highest standards of community-based environmental protection across Tāmaki. Ngāti Paoa have indicated that they want to go down that track as well and have talked about how they might do it but that has become lost in the conflict over the inability of the Crown to design a bill that actually has good process in it.So it is ludicrous to pretend that this is a simple issue and that it is just about people having green space in Auckland because it is not. Once upon a time in Tāmaki-makau-rau that land was all land belonging to different iwi. Now they are forced into these situations where people are talking about them as if they could not possibly manage their land with conservation values—because only we have conservation values? I think that is really problematic and it is not helpful to the local people. Because they have felt really deeply excluded by the way that this has been gone about it is not going to help them to understand Te Tiriti o Waitangi and that is really bad for our country.It is really important actually that we look at Point England and everywhere else in terms of other mana whenua people who were there before who suffered the same if not far worse alienation from their land as the people in that area are feeling like they are experiencing now. It concerns me deeply when I see Pākehā people protesting on the reserve saying: "We're having our land taken off us." It concerns me deeply that people are saying that not understanding—because they feel abused by this process through this Parliament—that actually they need a relationship with the mana whenua that the mana whenua have legitimate expectations around their own land and that this is a pre-settlement bill but it has been done in such a way that it has caused people to feel like they are the most aggrieved party. But actually we have to understand history. If we look at the Reserves Act which is mentioned throughout this bill and has been treated cavalierly in many ways it has done some pretty bad things. If you look at Hauturu—Little Barrier Island—they did some pretty bad things to create that nature reserve.So let us try to actually include everybody in this conversation and let us have some faith that Ngāti Paoa and the local community with the right support could actually craft a solution to this that does not polarise everyone against each other and does not turn into supposedly the Treaty versus the dotterels which it should never be characterised as—and it is not because they also have a whakapapa connection to those manu. We have to be more sophisticated than this. We have to try to look at this bill and say that from the point of view of the manu whenua they are trying to work towards their Treaty settlement and this is the shot they have been given in Auckland where there is very little whenua. It is OK for them to want to have an economic base as well as a marae as well as a reserve which they have shown no interest in excluding people from in terms of its long-term future.But that has got lost because of the way that this bill has been structured the way it has been worded and the way the process has been managed. It has pitched the people—mana whenua and local people—against each other when instead the Crown needs to take some responsibility for this mess. It concerns me deeply because actually Te Tiriti is a good thing. Historical grievance needs to be resolved land that was taken should be returned and trust that has been broken should be supported on all sides. We need our local communities living on the coast in Tāmaki to understand that yes they want to keep their space but they can have that in relationship to other people's needs as well and recognise manu whenua and recognise Te Tiriti. But that has all got lost and it is very very disturbing.There are better ways to go about this. I was at Parihaka 2 weeks ago. That is a better way to go about it—where there was a genuine and careful process whereby the manu whenua got to advance their need for reconciliation before they got to settlement. This legislation is another form of pre-settlement but I just feel very deeply for all the people involved in this who feel they have been abused. But do remember who lost their land originally and how that happened and what pittance they were paid so that they could be alienated from that beautiful coastal land that lovely bit of coast. It is amazing around there.So if we are going to be precious about it we need to have a bigger conversation and be capable of more than just talking about one set of interests in the 21st century. We cannot escape our history. We do not want to escape our history. We want to uplift it and do better. This bill is written in such a way and has created such a lot of confusion that all it has done is make people feel that they should prescribe for Ngāti Paoa how they should be and what they are capable of which is actually not the Treaty of Waitangi Te Tiriti o Waitangi. It is not article 2 at all. So we have a problem and we need to be more creative than this bill is but not at the expense of recognising the legitimate and absolute right of the mana whenua to assert their relationship to their whenua. They have never said they are going to exclude everybody else. Sometimes when things have been done badly the people who have done those things assume that the other culture would do the same back. Let us actually be a bit bigger than that and let us have a bit more generosity.So I say it is complex. It is not simple and it is not going to be easily resolved through this bill. I am afraid of what gets left behind after the bill passes but I am absolutely committed to supporting Ngāti Paoa because they do not have the homes the land the income streams—"