Peters Winston: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Peters Winston: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Volume:610;Page:7343] 
1. Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) 
 to the  
Minister of Immigration 
: At what time and what day was she first briefed on suspected terrorist Ahmed Zaoui’s arrival in New Zealand and how soon if at all after that time and date was New Zealand Immigration Service spokesperson Ian Smith first briefed on that matter? 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL (Minister of Immigration) 
: 
 I recall being given an oral briefing by telephone by the New Zealand Immigration Service on the matter on 6 December 2002 with the individual concerned having arrived on 4 December 2002. I am advised that the New Zealand Immigration Service’s spokesperson was alerted to the situation without full details at around the same time as he did not have a sufficiently high security clearance to receive a full briefing. That clearance was subsequently given and further details were provided to him. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: Could the Minister tell us why Mr Smith who was the senior Immigration Service spokesperson recorded the following: “I was let down badly. Everyone had agreed to lie in unison but all the others caved in and I was the only one left singing the original song.” and what does she know about that? 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL 
: Obviously I cannot answer for him as to why he said it. I can say that he has apologised to me and has said that it was not an intention to say that anyone was lying about the matter. There was no agreement to lie and I accept his word for that. 
Hon Murray McCully 
: Does the Minister stand by her statement regarding Mr Smith this morning to the Press Association that: “He didn’t actually answer the question untruthfully but on reflection he did know about Zaoui.”; if so is she asking the public to believe that it is pure coincidence that Mr Smith provided a completely incorrect answer to the media on 12 December only 5 days before writing in a memo “Everyone had agreed to lie in unison”? 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL 
: The question I am advised that the journalist asked him was whether he was aware about somebody who had arrived the night before. He said no he would have been given information if that had been the case and he had not been given information. Today I have discovered that in fact Mr Smith was not given a full briefing on the matter. I knew more about the subject than he did because he did not have a high enough security clearance. 
Keith Locke 
: Has not the unreasonable secrecy around the detention of Mr Zaoui and the over-the-top security measures against him been the product of an anti-terrorist hysteria largely generated out of the United States; and will the Minister agree to abide by the Refugee Status Appeals Authority decision if it grants him refugee status? 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Part of that question was not in order. The Minister may comment if she wishes but part of that question was not in order in relation to the Standing Orders. 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL 
: No. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: Can I ask the Minister in respect of the comment by Mr Smith that: “Everyone agreed to lie in unison” what role she played in that agreement to lie bearing in mind that in explaining this matter away she and two other immigration officials have now used the same word in describing Mr Smith’s comments in that they have been claimed to be “flippant”? What role did she play in the agreement to lie? 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL 
: There was no agreement to lie. I spoke to the general manager of the Immigration Service last night once I became aware that the media were interested in this. I was not aware of the document until that time that the media raised it with me. I was not aware of the commentary that he had attached to it. Mr Smith was at the other end of the phone with the general manager. He advised me that the comments were flippant. He apologised profusely for having made those comments and was mortified that it had become the subject of media attention. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: Why did the Minister make this claim back in December of last year: “The fact that he was picked up represents the security system working well”; is part of that security system an agreement for everyone—as Mr Smith said—to lie and what responsibility will she take for that? 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL 
: There was no agreement to lie. I received advice from the director of security that there were security concerns and that nothing further could be said publicly and that it had been agreed by agencies concerned that the only public comment would come from me as Minister of Immigration. This was after 13 December.