2. Question No. 2—ChildrenKAHURANGI CARTER (Green) to the Minister for ChildrenQuestion No. 2—Children2. KAHURANGI CARTER (Green) to the Minister for Children: What does she say to Tupua Urlich a survivor of abuse in State care who said of the proposal to repeal section 7AA from the Oranga Tamariki Act We know time and time again they place children with strangers who go on to physically sexually and mentally abuse these children." and "Whānau means more than mum and dad and uncles - we have a wider hapū and iwi. There is no way the state can turn around and say there is no one safe enough to look after these children"? Hon KAREN CHHOUR (Minister for Children): I would say that I am truly sorry for what he has been through. Some members in this House as well as members of the public may not be aware that just because a child is in the custody of Oranga Tamariki it does not mean they are placed with strangers. In fact around 70 percent of children in care are placed with whānau in what are called remain or return to home placements or in whānau care placements and this means they are being looked after by family or whānau. We know from reports such as the Independent Children's Monitor's Returning Home From Care report in 2023 and Oranga Tamariki's own Safety of Children in Care reports that children in these placements were being harmed or abused and are still at risk of being harmed or abused. A child must be safe first. If this can be with family hapū or iwi then this should happen. However unless we face up to the fact that harm happens everywhere including within family hapū and iwi then we will never properly address this national shame. Too often a child is killed in this country by someone they know someone that is meant to protect them and someone who is meant to love them.Kahurangi Carter: Was the royal commission of inquiry into abuse in care considered prior to announcing the intent to repeal section 7AA and if so why did she not wait for the recommendations before moving forward with the bill? Hon KAREN CHHOUR: I do not take that report lightly but what that report also showed us was that for far too long Governments and Ministers and people in places of power took too long to take action and didn't do what was right because they feared the backlash or they feared that they may not succeed. But what I will say to you is that I will do everything in my power to succeed and everything I do is with the safety and the best interests of children at the forefront of my mind. Kahurangi Carter: How does she reconcile the proposed repeal of section 7AA with the report's finding that "The State did not take the steps it should have when it saw signs its care system was failing people in care. Those steps should have included: … legislation specific to care settings to give effect to … te Tiriti o Waitangi particularly tino rangatiratanga"? Hon KAREN CHHOUR: I once again acknowledge the failures of the past and I can't take back the failures of the past but what I can do is make sure that we are doing the right thing for our young people and putting their safety and best interests as the first point of order when we are making decisions around their safety in care. To me that is the right thing to do. Laura Trask: Does she agree with the quote on the inquiry "This must be bigger than politics… This work will extend beyond the life of any one Government so we should work together to make sure this happens."?Hon KAREN CHHOUR: Absolutely. [Interruption]SPEAKER: Yeah just a minute—just a minute. I know that passions run very high around this particular topic but we still need to follow the decorum of the House and at least try to hear some of the answers given by the Minister.Hon KAREN CHHOUR: Absolutely. We stood in this House yesterday with joint agreement across all parties that what happened in the past cannot happen again. We have to make sure that everything we are doing in this place is with the best interest of our kids at heart.Kahurangi Carter: Does she agree that section 7AA when applied correctly would redress the report's findings that "Critical rights such as those guaranteed to Māori in te Tiriti o Waitangi and human rights that should have protected people in care were ignored and overlooked altogether."; if not why not?Hon KAREN CHHOUR: The repeal of section 7AA is about wanting there to be clarity within Oranga Tamariki that the interest in safety and the wellbeing of children and young people are at the forefront of all decision making. This is the core purpose of Oranga Tamariki to care for and to protect children and young people. Oranga Tamariki continues to work in partnership with providers communities Māori iwi hapū and whānau and nothing about the repeal of section 7AA will affect the support services and the programmes Oranga Tamariki provides for Māori or the partnerships it has and will continue to develop.Kahurangi Carter: What would she say to the survivors who not only experienced neglect abuse and torture at the hands of the State but also shared in the report that disconnection from whakapapa and Te Ao Māori "compounded the impacts of the abuse and neglect they suffered."?Hon KAREN CHHOUR: Once again I would say I am sorry for what they have suffered. Nobody should suffer anything of what they have experienced. I would never ever say that people should not have their whakapapa connection. I have never said that and I have constantly said that I find it important that young people know where they come from but their best interests and safety must come first.Kahurangi Carter: Will she commit to discharging the bill to repeal section 7AA as a sign of good faith to survivors and their moemoeā; if not why not?Hon KAREN CHHOUR: I cannot say this enough and I will keep saying the same thing: the best interests and the safety of our young people need to be the very first thing we are considering when it comes to the care of our young people. This does not mean that whānau hapū and iwi are not a consideration; it just means that safety and wellbeing come first."