Dean Jacqui: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Urgent Questions 
Dean Jacqui: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Urgent Questions 
[Volume:634;Page:5421] 
10.  
JACQUI DEAN (National—Otago) 
 to the  
Associate Minister of Health 
: Does he believe the Misuse of Drugs Act 1975 is working effectively; if not why not? 
Hon JIM ANDERTON (Associate Minister of Health) 
: 
 Yes I do. I am aware however that any system can be improved and I understand that the Expert Advisory Committee on Drugs is looking at ways to strengthen the consistency of classification of substances especially new substances by having clear criteria for assessing any individual or wider societal harm they might pose. 
Jacqui Dean 
: If he believes the Act is working effectively why are district councils such as Queenstown Lakes District Council now so fed up with the issue of party pills that they are drafting by-laws to ban the sale of party pills in licensed premises or is he now content to pass off the matter as a local government issue? 
Hon JIM ANDERTON 
: I am very surprised the member should suggest that the Government is passing up this matter. She knows because I have written to her many times and answered many written questions that the Expert Advisory Committee on Drugs is considering as I speak and will be considering before the end of the year at least four research programmes that the Government has commissioned on benzylpiperazine and party pills in general and what harm they pose in a wide variety of circumstances and groups in the community. If the member is suggesting that we should act as a Parliament in terms of banning any substance on the basis of no evidence whatsoever before us and before we consider recommendations for change then her concept of the system is very different from mine. 
Jacqui Dean 
: Does he agree with Clayton Cosgrove that “… party pills are starting many young people on a dangerous path to harder drug use and the manufacturers and promoters of these pills can no longer deny this fact”; if so why will the Minister not take stronger action to restrict the availability of party pills and stop claiming that he needs further evidence from the expert advisory committee? 
Hon JIM ANDERTON 
: With all due respect to my colleague he does not have the evidence. The evidence is being considered by a wide range of research groups that will report to the Government and the Expert Advisory Committee on Drugs and then the Government will be advised on a matter of fact. The surveys that have been taken partly support the view that if people use benzylpiperazine it might affect their decision to use harder drugs but on the other hand there is sufficient evidence as well through those surveys that some people taking them are avoiding harder drugs so “You can pay your money and take your choice.” 
Sue Moroney 
: Has the Minister seen any reports on a party pill petition currently before the Health Committee? 
Hon JIM ANDERTON 
: Yes I did see a media release that I found somewhat confusing. It was a complaint by the member for Otago about the lack of progress over her party pill petition which she accused the Government of ignoring. I realise the member is new to Parliament but the Health Committee is not a Government committee and in fact four of her colleagues are on the Health Committee including Tony Ryall the health spokesperson for the National Party. I suggest she should talk to her colleague if she wants her petition to make more progress on the committee on which her party has four members. 
Jacqui Dean 
: Does the Minister believe it is an effective use of taxpayer funding to publish pamphlets explaining how to use drugs such as P which state: “When using a new batch always be cautious about what you are using and only try a little at first.” and: “If swallowing P put it in an empty pill capsule or wrap it in a cigarette paper.”; if not how does this discourage the use of recreational drugs? 
Hon JIM ANDERTON 
: Of course in a question like this in the House the member chooses selectively what she quotes. [ 
Interruption 
] 
It is true. I will read out other quotes that basically say P is illegal; do not use P. I wonder why the member did not quote those comments from the pamphlet as well. The pamphlet of course takes— 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Would the Minister please be seated. It is impossible to hear what is happening. A question has been asked and we are waiting for the answer. We are part-way through it. Would the Minister please finish his answer. I just remind members also that both questions and answers are meant to be succinct. 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: I raise a point of order Madam Speaker. The member’s question was quite specific about what a section of the pamphlet states. It did not invite the Minister to quote other parts. The Minister should address the parts on which the member asked the question. 
Hon Dr Michael Cullen 
: I have two points. Firstly of course the question asked about the pamphlet and therefore invited the member if he wished to address the pamphlet in its entirety including those bits that the member obviously did not wish to have covered. But that in itself did not excuse the large amount of barracking that broke out on a very simple kind of question and answer session—after all the promises we had that we were not going to have that kind of barracking in answers. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: I do not think Ministers should be so restricted but I do come back and say to Ministers to please answer questions succinctly. 
Hon JIM ANDERTON 
: This pamphlet from an independent non-government agency—[ 
Interruption 
] It is independent of the Government; the Government does not direct how the agency works. The pamphlet takes a harm minimisation approach which recognises that some young people do abuse drugs— 
Jacqui Dean 
: I raise a point of order Madam Speaker. I have not named the pamphlet so how does the Minister know which pamphlet I am quoting from? 
Madam SPEAKER 
: I do not think that is a point of order. 
Hon JIM ANDERTON 
: Ministers might be a bit more well informed than the member on these matters I can assure the House. A harm minimisation approach is taken by this pamphlet which recognises that some young people will and do abuse drugs so the information tries to limit the harm they may suffer. It is very similar to advertising that recommends that people eat a good meal before drinking alcohol and I do not think that the member would be adverse to that kind of advice. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Before the member asks her question I would tell those members in that part of the Chamber that they are on their last warning. If we cannot hear the answers then I will be asking members to leave. 
Jacqui Dean 
: How can he claim that the Misuse of Drugs Act is working effectively when medical professionals are constantly calling for stronger legislation to prevent the escalating problems seen with party pills when emergency departments are being inundated with teenagers suffering adverse effects and when we are being overrun with anecdotal evidence of the ill effects of party pills—when will enough be enough? 
Hon JIM ANDERTON 
: The Misuse of Drugs Act and the amendments that this Parliament has passed in relation to party pills with the ingredient benzylpiperazine are based on the 2004 advice of the Expert Advisory Committee on Drugs which carefully considered the evidence before it and provided recommendations to me which I put to the House. And I might remind the House that in trying to get the age limit for the sale of benzylpiperazine party pills restricted to 18 years and over it was done with a good deal of opposition from members of the National Party Opposition. I recall that very vividly and it is a bit rich for this member to be saying what we should be doing now when the National Party actually opposed even that modification. 
Sue Moroney 
: Has he received any further advice on party pills from the Expert Advisory Committee on Drugs recently? 
Hon JIM ANDERTON 
: I have not received direct advice but my office has been in touch with the chair of the Expert Advisory Committee on Drugs over a report that the Otago MP Jacqui Dean would be demanding that the Expert Advisory Committee on Drugs take urgent steps to recommend a ban on party pills. I am advised by the chair of the Expert Advisory Committee on Drugs that he is yet to receive any communication at all from the member. 
Jacqui Dean 
: I seek leave to table the following documents. The first is an article from the  
Otago Daily Times 
 in which the Queenstown Lakes District Council seeks to ban the sale of party pills in licensed premises. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table that document. Is there any objection? Yes there is objection. 
Jacqui Dean 
: I seek leave to table a Ministry of Health - funded pamphlet in which there is advice on how to take “nos” including the advice to use balloons when inhaling the gas. 
Document by leave laid on the Table of the House. 
Jacqui Dean 
: I seek leave to table a Ministry of Health - funded pamphlet on how to take P which includes the advice that “less is more” and to use smaller amounts. 
Document by leave laid on the Table of the House.