edithatogo/nz-hansard-corpus huggingface dataset:
Barker Rick: Credit Contracts and Consumer Finance Bill — In Committee 
Barker Rick: Credit Contracts and Consumer Finance Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:611;Page:8721] 
Hon RICK BARKER (Minister for Courts) 
: 
 I move  
That the question be now put 
.
Vote: Injury Prevention Rehabilitation and Compensation Amendment Bill (No 3) — In Committee 
Vote: Injury Prevention Rehabilitation and Compensation Amendment Bill (No 3) — In Committee 
[Volume:625;Page:20280] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the amendment be agreed to 
. 
Ayes 22 
New Zealand First 13; Green Party 9. 
Noes 96 
New Zealand Labour 51; New Zealand National 26; ACT New Zealand 9; United Future 8; Progressive 2. 
Amendment not agreed to. 
The question was put that the amendments set out on Supplementary Order Paper 365 in the name of the Hon Ruth Dyson to Part 1 be agreed to. 
Amendments agreed to.
Vote: Courts and Criminal Matters Bill — Second Reading Instruction to Committee In Committee 
Vote: Courts and Criminal Matters Bill — Second Reading Instruction to Committee In Committee 
[Volume:626;Page:21700] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the amendment to the amendment be agreed to. 
Ayes 27 
New Zealand National 22; ACT New Zealand 5. 
Noes 79 
New Zealand Labour 51; New Zealand First 12; Green Party 8; United Future 6; Progressive 2. 
Amendment to the amendment not agreed to. 
The question was put that the following amendment in the name of the Hon Tony Ryall to an amendment to clause 7 set out on Supplementary Order Paper 370 in the name of the Hon Rick Barker be agreed to: 
to insert in subsection (1) of proposed new section 280F of the Customs and Excise Act the following new paragraph: 
(da)any other information that may assist in the location of the specified fines defaulter.
Obituaries — Hon Arthur Ellis Kinsella 
Obituaries — Hon Arthur Ellis Kinsella 
[Volume:615;Page:11581] 
Obituaries 
Hon Arthur Ellis Kinsella 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I regret to inform the House of the death on Thursday 4 March of the Hon Arthur Ellis Kinsella QSO who represented the electorate of Hauraki from 1954 to 1969. He was Minister of Broadcasting from 1960 to 1963 Postmaster-General from 1961 to 1963 and Minister of Education from 1963 to 1969. I desire on behalf of this House to express our sense of the loss we have sustained and our sympathy with the relatives of the late former member. 
Honourable members stood as a mark of respect.
Business of the House 
Business of the House 
[Volume:625;Page:20468] 
Business of the House 
PETER BROWN (Deputy Leader—NZ First) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I apologise for interrupting the debate but I suppose to put it in simple language that New Zealand First has been caught somewhat unawares. We did not anticipate this urgent debate and Mr Peters is programmed to travel tonight so I am seeking the leave of the House to defer his Principles of the Treaty of Waitangi Deletion Bill. 
DARREN HUGHES (Junior Whip—Labour) 
: 
 Do you want to talk to us about it—talk first? 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Clem Simich) 
: Yes I think that that would be a wise course of action. In the case of leave it needs to be sorted out beforehand please.
Hobbs Marian: Public Records Bill — Second Reading Instruction to Committee In Committee Third Reading 
Hobbs Marian: Public Records Bill — Second Reading Instruction to Committee In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:625;Page:19997] 
Hon MARIAN HOBBS (Minister responsible for Archives New Zealand) 
: 
 I move  
That it be an instruction to the Committee of the whole House on the Public Records Bill that it take the bill part by part. 
Motion agreed to.
Mark Ron: Courts and Criminal Matters Bill — Second Reading Instruction to Committee In Committee 
Mark Ron: Courts and Criminal Matters Bill — Second Reading Instruction to Committee In Committee 
[Volume:626;Page:21686] 
RON MARK (NZ First) 
: 
 I seek the leave of the House to table a report that shows that in 1 day in Greymouth Judge Moran wiped $109000 in fines for four young men. 
Madam DEPUTY SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table that report. Is there any objection? There is.
Robertson H V Ross: Public Finance (State Sector Management) Bill — In Committee 
Robertson H V Ross: Public Finance (State Sector Management) Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:622;Page:17949] 
The CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson) 
: I thank the honourable member for clarifying the situation. It is much appreciated.
Donnelly Brian: Debate on Prime Minister’s Statement 
Donnelly Brian: Debate on Prime Minister’s Statement 
[Volume:606;Page:3311] 
Hon BRIAN DONNELLY (NZ First) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I seek to make a statement under the relevant Standing Order to correct an inaccuracy that the Minister repeated several times in his speech about some proceedings that occurred in the House earlier today.  
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: The member needs to seek leave to do that realising of course that any time comes off the debate. 
Hon BRIAN DONNELLY 
: It will be very brief. I seek leave to do so. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Leave has been sought. Is there any objection to that course of action being taken? Leave has been denied.
Vote: Health Practitioners Competence Assurance Bill — In Committee 
Vote: Health Practitioners Competence Assurance Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:611;Page:8078] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the amendment be agreed to. 
Ayes 48 
New Zealand National 27; New Zealand First 13; ACT New Zealand 8. 
Noes 69 
Labour 52; Green Party 9; United Future 8. 
Amendment not agreed to. 
The question was put that the amendment set out on Supplementary Order Paper 115 in the name of Pita Paraone to the definition of “professional peer” in clause 5(1) be agreed to.
Baldock Larry: Television New Zealand Bill — Third Reading 
Baldock Larry: Television New Zealand Bill — Third Reading 
[Volume:606;Page:3870] 
LARRY BALDOCK (United Future) 
: 
 In rising to speak to the third reading of this bill I say it is with some pleasure that United Future is able to see the bill come to this point in the House and that it was able to find a way forward through negotiation with the Government so that this bill did not sit and languish for ever on the Order Paper. Many people throughout New Zealand have been looking forward to an improvement in their television service and in their television programming and we believe that this bill will offer something of an improvement to viewers. I want to pay a particular commendation to my colleague Marc Alexander who has worked very hard through the Commerce Committee and the Committee stage of this House and has made many positive contributions to the bill. Television plays an important role in the lives of New Zealanders and we do look forward as we support the third reading of this bill and its passing into law to the delivery of some vast improvements for the public of New Zealand.
Dyson Ruth: Fair Trading Amendment Bill (No 3) — In Committee 
Dyson Ruth: Fair Trading Amendment Bill (No 3) — In Committee 
[Volume:609;Page:6860] 
Hon RUTH DYSON (Minister for ACC) 
: I move  
That the question be now put 
.
Rich Katherine: Care of Children Bill — Second Reading 
Rich Katherine: Care of Children Bill — Second Reading 
[Volume:621;Page:16431] 
KATHERINE RICH (National) 
: 
 It has been very interesting listening to the speeches on this very important issue but I do have some concerns about some of the things I have heard from United Future this afternoon. I fully understand much of the rhetoric about the importance of children having a mother and a father and how the research that demonstrates the success of the traditional family is very important. However when one looks at putting the child at the centre of the legislation as the previous speaker has just outlined then suddenly one has to look at things from the child’s perspective. In particular when a child has gay parents or when a child lives just with his mum or his dad we need to be very careful in the way we discuss the issue. We do not want to give kids the impression that somehow they do not make the grade because they do not have a traditional family and their situation is not as important as anybody else’s. 
Often when I am thinking about parenting I think of some friends of mine in Dunedin—a lesbian couple who have just had a young baby. They tried for quite some time to adopt but that was not possible for them. They both worked for Plunket so nobody would doubt for a moment that they had a very strong commitment to the care of children and an interest in children’s well-being. I look at the way in which they parent their two children and I do not think that anybody in this House could criticise them for their commitment and the way they take on the role of being parents. The people here who start to criticise some parents because of their sexual orientation forget once again to look at the issue from the child’s perspective. A child just wants to be loved and to have parents who are taken up with his or her care and interests. I totally believe that parenting is a two-person job. 
Debate interrupted.
Wilson Margaret: Visitors — Islamic Republic of Pakistan—Minister of Foreign Affairs 
Wilson Margaret: Visitors — Islamic Republic of Pakistan—Minister of Foreign Affairs 
[Volume:625;Page:20573] 
Madam SPEAKER 
: I have much pleasure in informing members that His Excellency Mr Khurshid M Kasuri Minister of Foreign Affairs of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan is present in the gallery. I am sure that members would wish to welcome him.
Vote: Foreshore and Seabed Bill — In Committee Speaker Recalled In Committee 
Vote: Foreshore and Seabed Bill — In Committee Speaker Recalled In Committee 
[Volume:621;Page:17102] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the amendment be agreed to. 
Ayes 10 
Green Party 9; Maori Party 1. 
Noes 110 
New Zealand Labour 51; New Zealand National 27; New Zealand First 13; ACT New Zealand 8; United Future 8; Progressive 2; Independent: Awatere Huata. 
Amendment not agreed to. 
The question was put that the following amendment in the name of Metiria Turei to proposed new clause 58 set out on Supplementary Order Paper 302 in the name of the Hon Dr Michael Cullen be agreed to: 
to omit this clause.
Prebble Richard: Motions — Terrorism—Madrid Bombings 
Prebble Richard: Motions — Terrorism—Madrid Bombings 
[Volume:616;Page:11627] 
Hon RICHARD PREBBLE (Leader—ACT) 
: 
 On behalf of the ACT party I wish to join with the Prime Minister in support of this motion and to say that it is appropriate that we as a Parliament interrupt our business to move this motion of sympathy. It was a horrific act of terrorism against innocent citizens and it is important that we express our solidarity with the Spanish people. 
In our lifetime Spain has gone from being a closed fascist State to being an open democratic one and it is a State that is now playing its full role in the world. As a consequence it has suffered this act of terrorism. We should as one of the world’s oldest democracies express our sympathy to the Spanish people and say to them that we realise what a terrible threat terrorism is to open societies and that we must combat it together. It is appropriate that we pass this message on and I hope Mr Speaker that you will take the opportunity as Speaker to make sure that it is passed on to the people of Spain. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I will do that.
Hunt Jonathan: Speaker’s Rulings — Questions for Oral Answer—Ministers' Replies 
Hunt Jonathan: Speaker’s Rulings — Questions for Oral Answer—Ministers' Replies 
[Volume:620;Page:15443] 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Last week I was asked to look at the issue of Ministers’ replies to questions. I do not intend to go over the rules on answering questions in detail again. There are many rulings on this given by me and my predecessors. These are set out on pages 144 145 146 and 147 of  
Speakers’ Rulings 
. 
Basically it is not the province of the Speaker to decide whether a Minister’s answer is correct or even whether it is adequate. The Speaker is not a quizmaster who decides whether the right answer has been given to a question. Many of the appeals that have been made to me on that subject treat the Speaker as if he is conducting some kind of quiz rather than a parliamentary question time. I remind members that question time is a political exchange. The adequacy of the performance of members whether in Government or in Opposition is judged on a political basis. The Speaker does not give them marks for performance as to the quality of their questions or their answers. Members cannot appeal to the Speaker every time they get an answer they do not like or are not satisfied with. 
On the other hand Ministers have a responsibility in the House and through the House to the country to account for the public offices they hold. Question time is an important element of this accountability. Ministers should therefore take questions seriously and endeavour to give informative replies to the questions that they are asked. 
Finally I want to add that I entirely reject the criticism that is made from time to time that our question process is inferior to that of other comparable Parliaments. That is simply not the case and it is an unfair denigration of this Parliament to say so. I have often commented on Australia but in the United Kingdom a question is not even accepted on a subject a Minister has refused to answer. Ministers in this Parliament are not so protected. Questions can be constantly addressed to Ministers regardless of how they have responded in the past. Our question time allows for a vigorous up-to-the-minute and relatively informative exchange between members and Ministers each day on which the House sits. That does not mean that a Minister’s answer will satisfy members in every case but there is nothing new in that.
Vote: Gambling Bill — Instruction to CommitteeCWH In Committee 
Vote: Gambling Bill — Instruction to CommitteeCWH In Committee 
[Volume:611;Page:8513] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the amendment be agreed to. 
Ayes 55 
New Zealand National 27; New Zealand First 13; ACT New Zealand 6; Green Party 9. 
Noes 60 
Labour 52; United Future 8. 
Amendment not agreed to. 
The question was put that the amendment set out on Supplementary Order Paper 110 in the name of Lindsay Tisch to clause 278A(5) to (10) be agreed to.
Vote: Immigration Amendment Bill — Instructions to CommitteeCWH In Committee 
Vote: Immigration Amendment Bill — Instructions to CommitteeCWH In Committee 
[Volume:611;Page:8294] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That Part 2 as amended be agreed to. 
Ayes 60 
Labour 52; United Future 8. 
Noes 56 
New Zealand National 27; New Zealand First 13; ACT New Zealand 7; Green Party 9. 
Part 2 as amended agreed to.
Vote: Wine Bill — Second Reading Procedure In Committee Third Reading 
Vote: Wine Bill — Second Reading Procedure In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:612;Page:9511] 
A party vote was called for on the question That 
the Wine Bill be now read a third time. 
Ayes 108 
New Zealand Labour 52; New Zealand National 25; New Zealand First 13; Green Party 9; United Future 7; Progressive 2. 
Noes 5 
ACT New Zealand 5. 
Bill read a third time.
Vote: Prisoners’ and Victims’ Claims Bill — In Committee Procedure Third Reading 
Vote: Prisoners’ and Victims’ Claims Bill — In Committee Procedure Third Reading 
[Volume:626;Page:20973] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the amendment be agreed to. 
Ayes 55 
New Zealand National 27; New Zealand First 13; ACT New Zealand 7; United Future 8. 
Noes 62 
New Zealand Labour 51; Green Party 9; Progressive 2. 
Amendment not agreed to. 
The question was put that the amendment set out on Supplementary Order Paper 371 in the name of Marc Alexander to omit clause 13 and substitute new clause 13 be agreed to.
Hunt Jonathan: Points of Order — Rodney Hide—Alleged Comment 
Hunt Jonathan: Points of Order — Rodney Hide—Alleged Comment 
[Volume:615;Page:10999] 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Well that is up to Mr Benson-Pope. As the member rightly points out it is not up to me to insist on that happening.
Peters Winston: Speaker’s Rulings — Privileges of the House and Speaker's Actions 
Peters Winston: Speaker’s Rulings — Privileges of the House and Speaker's Actions 
[Volume:611;Page:8739] 
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) 
: 
 I raise a point of order under Standing Order 364(2) which states: “Questions for written answer may be put to the Speaker relating to any matter of administration for which the Speaker is responsible.” The operative words here are “is responsible”. My complaint Mr Speaker is that you are not responsible for the matter that I raised and that there should be no implication that any exercise of your powers was carried out in an irresponsible way. I want to know where that leaves me in the sense that I cannot put a question to you on this issue because it is ruled out by that very significant Standing Order. If you have no responsibility then how can you possibly reply to me? I have asked for the police report. I want to see it. With the greatest of respect it is at variance with what you told the House today and until I see it I will not rest on this matter.
Vote: Television New Zealand Bill — In Committee 
Vote: Television New Zealand Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:606;Page:3834] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the schedules as amended be agreed to. 
Ayes 68 
Noes 48 
Schedules as amended agreed to. 
Labour 52; Green Party 8; United Future 8. 
New Zealand National 27; New Zealand First 13; ACT New Zealand 8. 
Bill reported with amendment.
Vote: Public Finance (State Sector Management) Bill — In Committee 
Vote: Public Finance (State Sector Management) Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:622;Page:17935] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That Part 8 be agreed to. 
Ayes 70 
New Zealand Labour 51; Green Party 9; United Future 8; Progressive 2. 
Noes 50 
New Zealand National 27; New Zealand First 13; ACT New Zealand 9; Maori Party 1. 
Part 8 agreed to.
Vote: Government Communications Security Bureau Bill — In Committee 
Vote: Government Communications Security Bureau Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:607;Page:4391] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That Part 2 be agreed to. 
Ayes 106 
Labour 52; New Zealand National 26; New Zealand First 12;  ACT New Zealand 8; United Future 8. 
Noes 9 
Green Party 9. 
Part 2 agreed to.
Peters Winston: Estimates Debate — In Committee 
Peters Winston: Estimates Debate — In Committee 
[Volume:618;Page:14317] 
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) 
: 
 In respect of what Dr Cullen has said the Green member called for a party vote in addition to his having voiced his opposition. That is the sequence of events on the chronology. Surely there is no way we can have people saying: “Well actually I’ve been here a long time and you can assume what people are going to do next.” That is an amazing statement that Dr Cullen made. You called for the vote Madam Chair because it means something. You called for the vote because it is the only way you can measure where the vote might lie and anything short of that is expeditious nonsense.
Vote: Holidays Amendment Bill — Second Reading 
Vote: Holidays Amendment Bill — Second Reading 
[Volume:620;Page:15983] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the amendments recommended by the Transport and Industrial Relations Committee by majority be agreed to 
. 
Ayes 75 
New Zealand Labour 51; New Zealand First 13; United Future 8; Progressive 2; Maori Party 1. 
Noes 45 
New Zealand National 27; Green Party 9; ACT New Zealand 8; Independent: Awatere Huata. 
Question agreed to.
Hunt Jonathan: Visitors — Socialist Republic of Vietnam—President of the National Assembly United Kingdom—Parliamentary Delegation Commonwealth Parliamentary Association 
Hunt Jonathan: Visitors — Socialist Republic of Vietnam—President of the National Assembly United Kingdom—Parliamentary Delegation Commonwealth Parliamentary Association 
[Volume:618;Page:14293] 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I also have much pleasure in informing members that a parliamentary delegation from the United Kingdom branch of the Commonwealth Parliamentary Association is present in the gallery. I am sure members would wish that those visitors be welcomed too.
Motions — Motion on Iraq 
Motions — Motion on Iraq 
[Volume:607;Page:5033] 
Motions 
Motion on Iraq 
STEPHEN FRANKS (ACT NZ) 
: 
 I seek leave to move without notice a non-debatable motion congratulating our former allies in the coalition of the willing on the liberation of the people of Baghdad. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought for that purpose. Is there any objection? There is objection.
Fairbrother Russell: Wine Makers Amendment Bill — Third Reading 
Fairbrother Russell: Wine Makers Amendment Bill — Third Reading 
[Volume:607;Page:4520] 
RUSSELL FAIRBROTHER (NZ Labour—Napier) 
: 
 Speaking as the member for Napier which is in a province that develops many of the fine wines of this country I favour the passing of this bill because it continues to facilitate producer-driven regulatory and structural reforms. Sector-driven protected minorities are obviously in the public interest. If this bill is passed before August 2003 it will facilitate the meeting of the European Union regulation tests and ease our exports and imports. For those reasons I favour the passing of this bill.
Vote: Prisoners’ and Victims’ Claims Bill — In Committee Procedure Third Reading 
Vote: Prisoners’ and Victims’ Claims Bill — In Committee Procedure Third Reading 
[Volume:626;Page:20975] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the amendment be agreed to. 
Ayes 55 
New Zealand National 27; New Zealand First 13; ACT New Zealand 7; United Future 8. 
Noes 62 
New Zealand Labour 51; Green Party 9; Progressive 2. 
Amendment not agreed to. 
The CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson) 
: The amendment in the name of the Hon Tony Ryall to omit clause 14 is out of order because it is the same as an earlier amendment that was defeated. 
The question was put that the following amendment in the name of the Hon Tony Ryall to clause 14 be agreed to: 
to omit from subclause (1) all the words after “or tribunal” and substitute the words “must not award any compensation payout to any plaintiff”. 
A party vote was called for on the question that the amendment be agreed to.
Vote: Maori Fisheries Bill — In Committee 
Vote: Maori Fisheries Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:620;Page:15439] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the amendment to the amendment be agreed to. 
Ayes 58 
New Zealand National 27; New Zealand First 13; Green Party 9; ACT New Zealand 8; Independent: Awatere Huata. 
Noes 61 
New Zealand Labour 51; United Future 8; Progressive 2. 
Amendment to the amendment not agreed to.
Obituaries — Hon Sir Richard Harrison Hon Merv Wellington 
Obituaries — Hon Sir Richard Harrison Hon Merv Wellington 
[Volume:611;Page:8439] 
Tuesday 9 September 2003 
Mr Speaker 
 took the Chair at 2 p.m. 
Prayers 
. 
Obituaries 
Hon Sir Richard Harrison 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I regret to inform the House of the death on 5 September 2003 of the Hon Sir (John) Richard Harrison ED who represented the electorate of Hawke’s Bay from 1963 to 1984. He was junior National whip from 1970 to 1971 and senior whip from 1974 to 1975. Sir Richard was Chairman of Committees in 1972 and again from 1976 to 1977. He became Acting Speaker in 1977 during the illness of Sir Roy Jack and served as Speaker of the House in the period 1978 to 1984. I desire on behalf of this House to express our sense of the loss we have sustained and our sympathy with the relatives of the late former member and of all of those who are listening in to this at the funeral service. I now ask members to stand with me and observe a period of silence as a mark of respect for his memory. 
Honourable members stood as a mark of respect. 
Hon Merv Wellington 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I also regret to inform the House of the death on 7 September 2003 of the Hon Mervyn Langlois Wellington QSO who represented the electorate of Manurewa from 1975 to 1978 and that of Papakura from 1978 to 1990. He was Minister of Education from 1978 to 1984. I desire on behalf of this House to express our sense of the loss we have sustained and our sympathy with the relatives of the late former member. I now ask members to stand with me and observe a period of silence as a mark of respect for his memory. 
Honourable members stood as a mark of respect.
Vote: Hazardous Substances and New Organisms (Approvals and Enforcement) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Vote: Hazardous Substances and New Organisms (Approvals and Enforcement) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Volume:623;Page:18786] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the Hazardous Substances and New Organisms (Approvals and Enforcement) Amendment Bill be now read a first time. 
Ayes 113 
New Zealand Labour 51; New Zealand National 26; New Zealand First 13; ACT New Zealand 5; Green Party 9; United Future 7; Progressive 2. 
Noes 1 
Maori Party 1. 
Bill read a first time.
Pettis Jill: State Sector Amendment Bill (No 3) — Second Reading Instruction to Committee In Committee Third Reading 
Pettis Jill: State Sector Amendment Bill (No 3) — Second Reading Instruction to Committee In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:616;Page:12172] 
JILL PETTIS (Senior Whip—Labour) 
: 
 I move  
That the question be now put 
.
Points of Order — Question—Misleading Information 
Points of Order — Question—Misleading Information 
[Volume:609;Page:6329] 
Points of Order 
Question—Misleading Information 
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. You will recall that some of us have been very assiduous in demanding that Ministers who mislead the House come down to the House at the first available opportunity after their knowledge of misleading of the House and correct the mistake. It is clear that yesterday a question was asked in the House by Mr Hide the content of which was demonstrably untrue. I would like to give Mr Hide an opportunity to correct that information now before he mistakenly asks any more questions on it.
Newman Muriel: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Newman Muriel: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Volume:625;Page:20314] 
7.  
Dr MURIEL NEWMAN (Deputy Leader—ACT) 
 to the  
Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service 
: Does the New Zealand Security Intelligence Service scrutinise immigration applications; if so how did it miss the seven Iraqis?  
Hon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN (Deputy Prime Minister) 
 on behalf of the Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service: The SIS does check immigration applications from countries of security risk. It checks them only to see whether the individuals pose a threat to security. None of the seven has been assessed as posing a threat to security. 
Dr Muriel Newman 
: In light of the answers already given in respect of issues surrounding this can the Minister tell the House exactly who an undesirable applicant would be and who a security risk applicant would be; if a Minister in Saddam Hussein’s Cabinet and a palace guard are not deemed to be security risks are we to conclude that nobody from Iraq would be? 
Hon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN 
: On the last point no. What is a security risk is well defined in the SIS’s own legislation. No there is yet to be a definition of the term “undesirable”; that will require considerable work. It is most important that we do not throw out the babies with the Baath in this particular case. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: Does the Prime Minister ever intend to take her responsibilities seriously in respect of our national security and is she aware that the office of the Minister of Agriculture and Agrarian Reform in Saddam Hussein’s regime was as one of its responsibilities in charge of chemical weaponry production; would that not be an indicator that that man should not be in this country? 
Hon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN 
: That is why that man’s permit has been revoked. 
Hon Murray McCully 
: Has the Minister been advised that the former Iraqi Minister of Agriculture and Agrarian Reform who is now in New Zealand applied for a visitor permit without making any attempt to conceal his identity; if so what does that suggest to the Minister about the quality of the checks made firstly when he was given a visa and secondly following Mr Peters’ allegations last week? 
Hon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN 
: I am advised that that is not the case. The member has different Iraqis mixed up. 
Dr Muriel Newman 
: What changes to the directions given to the SIS to enhance national security has the Prime Minister introduced since September 11 and in light of the recent debacle can she confirm to the House how well she thinks those changes have been working? 
Hon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN 
: Recent events do not involve a person who is a security risk according to the SIS. The member has still not understood that very simple point. This person has been assessed by the SIS as not being a security risk. What I can say is that the SIS along with the other Government security agencies has had extremely large increases in capacity since September 11.
Benson-Pope David: Maori Television Service Bill — In Committee 
Benson-Pope David: Maori Television Service Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:607;Page:5070] 
DAVID BENSON-POPE (Senior Whip—NZ Labour) 
: 
 I move  
That the question be now put 
.
Points of Order — Presentation of Petitions 
Points of Order — Presentation of Petitions 
[Volume:620;Page:15527] 
Points of Order 
Presentation of Petitions 
The Clerk read petitions for presentation. 
LARRY BALDOCK (United Future) 
: 
 I seek leave to table a petition presented to me today by the students of Middleton Grange School requesting a review of the cap on their student numbers so that parents may have further choice in Christchurch. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: The member is seeking leave because the petition is not in accordance with the Standing Orders. Is there any objection? There is objection.
Hartley Ann: Visitors — Delegation from the Senate of the State of California United States of America Members of the Committee of the Office of the Deputy Prime Minister from the House of Commons United Kingdom 
Hartley Ann: Visitors — Delegation from the Senate of the State of California United States of America Members of the Committee of the Office of the Deputy Prime Minister from the House of Commons United Kingdom 
[Volume:621;Page:17012] 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: I have much pleasure in informing members that a delegation from the senate of the state of California United States of America is present in the gallery. I am sure that members would wish that delegation to be welcomed.
Pettis Jill: Judicial Matters Bill — First Reading 
Pettis Jill: Judicial Matters Bill — First Reading 
[Volume:611;Page:8308] 
JILL PETTIS (NZ Labour—Whanganui) 
: 
 I rise in support of this bill. It is a good bill and I think we should facilitate its passage through the House. I am pleased to support it.
Barnett Tim: Education (Establishment of Universities) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Barnett Tim: Education (Establishment of Universities) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Volume:620;Page:16209] 
TIM BARNETT (Labour—Christchurch Central) 
: 
 I speak as the member for Christchurch Central. Christchurch is a city of one-third of a million people and two universities and when one hears that one thinks that maybe this sector is crying out for a proper strategy. This bill is a flaming beacon of strategy in the area of tertiary education. This bill clarifies the law. The Minister must first make a decision on the strategic implications to the nation and to the tertiary education system of the setting up of a university. It allows the Minister to decide to reject a case if he or she is not satisfied on national-interest grounds and it ensures that any current proposals to become a university are considered under the processes clearly laid out in the bill. Who could possibly argue with that kind of logic? I commend this bill to the House.
Pettis Jill: Taxation (Base Maintenance and Miscellaneous  Provisions) Bill — First Reading 
Pettis Jill: Taxation (Base Maintenance and Miscellaneous  Provisions) Bill — First Reading 
[Volume:622;Page:18057] 
JILL PETTIS (Labour—Whanganui) 
: 
 There are many important parts to this omnibus bill but some in particular will appeal to my constituents. One of those— 
Brian Connell 
: Name one—the only one! 
JILL PETTIS 
: I tell the member to settle down it is late. One issue in the bill that will appeal to my constituents is the introduction of new regulations to ensure that foreign-owned banks pay their proper share of tax on their New Zealand income. I think that everybody in this House would see that as a good thing. Even Mr Connell’s constituents would see that as a good thing. This is part of the Government’s commitment to a fair and just taxation system and I look forward to seeing this bill when it is reported back from the select committee.
Vote: Health Practitioners Competence Assurance Bill — In Committee 
Vote: Health Practitioners Competence Assurance Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:611;Page:8090] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the amendments be agreed to. 
Ayes 60 
Labour 52; United Future 8. 
Noes 57 
New Zealand National 27; New Zealand First 13; ACT New Zealand 8; Green Party 9. 
Amendments agreed to.
Vote: Tariff (New Zealand - Thailand Closer Economic Partnership) Bill — First Reading 
Vote: Tariff (New Zealand - Thailand Closer Economic Partnership) Bill — First Reading 
[Volume:625;Page:20619] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the motion be agreed to. 
Ayes 61 
New Zealand Labour 51; United Future 8; Progressive 2. 
Noes 59 
New Zealand National 27; New Zealand First 13; ACT New Zealand 9; Green Party 9; Maori Party 1. 
Motion agreed to.
Vote: Human Assisted Reproductive Technology Bill — In Committee Procedure 
Vote: Human Assisted Reproductive Technology Bill — In Committee Procedure 
[Volume:621;Page:16355] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the amendment be agreed to. 
Ayes 103 
New Zealand Labour 51; New Zealand National 20; New Zealand First 13; Green Party 9; ACT New Zealand 2; United Future 6; Progressive 2. 
Noes 13 
New Zealand National 4; ACT New Zealand 6; United Future 2; Maori Party 1. 
Amendment agreed to. 
The question was put that the amendment set out on Supplementary Order Paper 267 in the name of the Hon David Benson-Pope to clause 70 be agreed to.
Hunt Jonathan: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Hunt Jonathan: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Sitting date: 19 June 2003. Volume:609;Page:6424. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Before I go onto the next question I say I have consulted my list and found I have called Mr Donald three times only. He wanted to have a fourth supplementary question and seeks leave to do that. Is there any objection? There is not. I am sorry for the error Mr Donald.
Samuels Dover: Television New Zealand Bill — Instruction to Committee In Committee 
Samuels Dover: Television New Zealand Bill — Instruction to Committee In Committee 
[Volume:606;Page:3740] 
Hon DOVER SAMUELS (Minister of State) 
: 
 I move  
That the question be now put 
.
Franks Stephen: General Debate 
Franks Stephen: General Debate 
[Volume:621;Page:16334] 
STEPHEN FRANKS (ACT) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I would ask you to take into account when you do give this the more timely consideration you are planning that that is an honourable tradition. Indeed from my days in the Labour Party I recall a number of early Labour heroes who were in fact supported by their unions to be here. If the Speaker is to rule on that it would be helpful to look at older history from an earlier period. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: No I am interested in finding out whether there was any statement made that was out of order. There is no doubt in my mind that if a member is paid money in order to influence him or her in the decision making that is totally out of order. That is where the matter rests at this stage.
Points of Order — Question No. 4 to Minister 18 September 
Points of Order — Question No. 4 to Minister 18 September 
[Volume:612;Page:8886] 
Points of Order 
Question No. 4 to Minister 18 September 
Dr DON BRASH (NZ National) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. On the last sitting day during question time I asked Mr Cunliffe for a comment about compliance costs. I believe he made a quite erroneous answer to the House. I wonder whether he will correct that misleading impression. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Although that is not a point of order I can tell the member that I discussed the matter just before the House sat. The member has been discussing the matter with the Clerk and if necessary he will be making a statement to the House.
Collins Judith: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Collins Judith: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Volume:615;Page:11175] 
JUDITH COLLINS (National—Clevedon) 
: 
I seek leave of the House to table a facsimile document from Marshall Bird and Curtis which clearly shows that the document is marked with the name “Marshall Bird and Curtis” and the fax number that it came from. 
Document by leave laid on the Table of the House. 
Hon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN (Deputy Prime Minister) 
: 
 I seek leave to table a statement from the Mt Albert electorate office that the documents received in that office were from Marshall Bird and Curtis. 
Document by leave laid on the Table of the House.
Pettis Jill: Resource Management (Energy and Climate Change) Amendment Bill — Instruction to Committee In Committee 
Pettis Jill: Resource Management (Energy and Climate Change) Amendment Bill — Instruction to Committee In Committee 
[Volume:615;Page:11338] 
JILL PETTIS (Junior Whip—Labour) 
: 
 I move  
That the question be now put 
.
Turner Judy: Motions — Floods—Eastern Bay of Plenty 
Turner Judy: Motions — Floods—Eastern Bay of Plenty 
[Volume:618;Page:14294] 
JUDY TURNER (United Future) 
: 
 On behalf of United Future I extend our sympathies also to the people of Whakatane Edgecumbe affected areas of Opotiki and the Matata straight. I make the personal statement that I am extremely proud of my community for the way that people have pulled together and worked together through an extremely difficult time. I am very proud to be part of that community. 
Motion agreed to.
Mallard Trevor: General Debates 
Mallard Trevor: General Debates 
[Volume:611;Page:8539] 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD (Minister of Education) 
: 
 It is fairly rarely that Richard Prebble and I agree but on this matter we do agree. Maybe the right approach is to have a considered ruling later.
Vote: Land Transport Management Bill — In Committee 
Vote: Land Transport Management Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:613;Page:9738] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the amendments be agreed to. 
Ayes 69 
New Zealand Labour 52; Green Party 9; United Future 8. 
Noes 48 
New Zealand National 27; New Zealand First 13; ACT New Zealand 8. 
Amendments agreed to. 
The question was put that the amendment set out on Supplementary Order Paper 153 in the name of Larry Baldock to clause 79(1) be agreed to.
Pettis Jill: Courts and Criminal Matters Bill — Second Reading Instruction to Committee In Committee 
Pettis Jill: Courts and Criminal Matters Bill — Second Reading Instruction to Committee In Committee 
[Volume:626;Page:21706] 
JILL PETTIS (Senior Whip—Labour) 
: 
 I move  
That the question be now put 
.
Pillay Lynne: Television New Zealand Bill — In Committee 
Pillay Lynne: Television New Zealand Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:606;Page:3816] 
LYNNE PILLAY (NZ Labour—Waitakere) 
: 
 I move  
That the question be now put 
.
Prebble Richard: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Questions to Members 
Prebble Richard: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Questions to Members 
[Volume:614;Page:10374] 
5.  
Hon RICHARD PREBBLE (Leader—ACT) 
 to  
Steve Chadwick (Member in charge of Smoke-free Environments Amendment Bill) 
: Under the Smoke-free Environments Amendment Bill will crews on ships in New Zealand continental waters be able to smoke inside the ship; if so under what conditions? 
STEVE CHADWICK (Member in charge of Smoke-free Environments Amendment Bill) 
: 
 No. The bill’s provisions will not allow any smoking in indoor areas of an affected ship except in temporary residential-like areas such as the individual ship cabins for passengers or crew. 
Hon Richard Prebble 
: Can the member confirm that in fact the situation is that a Taiwanese crew on a Taiwanese ship in New Zealand coastal waters will be free to smoke on that ship but a New Zealand crew on a New Zealand ship which happens to be in Taiwanese waters cannot legally smoke; if so how did that unworkable politically correct nonsense come to be in the bill? 
STEVE CHADWICK 
: This law applies only to those ships in New Zealand waters. 
Peter Brown 
: Will an officer on watch on a vessel carrying inflammable cargo such as a tanker be allowed to smoke in the wheelhouse or does he have to go on to the wing of the bridge to have a smoke? 
STEVE CHADWICK 
: No.
Chadwick Steve: Counter-Terrorism Bill — Instruction to CommitteeCWH In Committee 
Chadwick Steve: Counter-Terrorism Bill — Instruction to CommitteeCWH In Committee 
[Volume:612;Page:9369] 
STEVE CHADWICK (Labour—Rotorua) 
: 
 I move  
That the question be now put 
.
McNair Craig: Relationships (Statutory References) Bill — In Committee 
McNair Craig: Relationships (Statutory References) Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:624;Page:19085] 
CRAIG McNAIR (NZ First) 
: 
 I particularly want to address this part of the bill. Earlier on I heard Stephen Franks put up an argument for his Supplementary Order Paper and on hearing it I felt compelled to support it—that is if what he was saying was true. 
Hon Richard Prebble 
: Of course it’s true. 
CRAIG McNAIR 
: Of course it is true. I would not want to question the member’s integrity. I have had a chance to look at the Supplementary Order Paper and am convinced I should be voting for it. After looking at the bill I am very convinced that I should vote against it. I am a bit puffed because I have been trying to round up as many colleagues as I possibly can to vote for the Supplementary Order Paper. In listening to the debate earlier on I was made well aware that if this bill goes through and if we do not support this Supplementary Order Paper in repealing a paragraph from section 21 of the Human Rights Act then for example a taxi-driver would not be able to turn down passengers who had just been through a civil union ceremony that is as I understand it. 
Hon Marian Hobbs 
: Incorrect as was explained. 
CRAIG McNAIR 
: The Minister is saying that is correct. 
Hon Mark Burton 
: Incorrect. 
CRAIG McNAIR 
: Well as far as I can understand if a church did not want— 
Dr Richard Worth 
: Correct. 
CRAIG McNAIR 
: I have a well-educated lawyer member sitting behind me saying that I am correct. For example even if a church disagreed with the whole idea of civil unions and it is entitled by law to disagree with that if a civil unionised couple wanted to hold a reception in the church hall after their civil union even if the church disagreed with it and did not want them to have it in the church hall it would not be able to turn them down. It would be in breach of the law. That is my understanding of it and what I heard earlier on. That is what I believe to be true. 
This Government is denying what I am alleging tonight as far as what I have just said about a civil union ceremony and a taxi-driver for example not wanting to carry a civil unionised couple after their ceremony or reception because he or she philosophically disagrees with it and that driver then being in breach of the law. I would not put it past this Government even though it is denying it that this is the fact. 
We have a Government that wants an inquiry into hate speech. As soon as the Films Videos and Publications Classification (Prohibition of Child Pornography) Bill sponsored by Anne Tolley a few years ago failed—I think it was the day afterwards—the committee at the time which was a Government-dominated committee decided to undertake an inquiry into hate speech laws along with the Films Videos and Publications Classification Act. Then when we had an election in 2002 the new committee which was still obviously a Government-dominated committee decided to continue or I guess officially reinstate that inquiry into hate speech its ultimate aim will be to stop freedom of expression.
Cullen Michael: Points of Order — Business of the House Allocation of Questions 
Cullen Michael: Points of Order — Business of the House Allocation of Questions 
[Volume:606;Page:3901] 
Hon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN (Leader of the House) 
: 
 I can assure the House that I did not pay Chen Palmer and Partners its usual fees for any such statement.
Vote: Appointments — Electoral Commission—Membership 
Vote: Appointments — Electoral Commission—Membership 
[Volume:624;Page:19007] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That pursuant to section 8(4)(b) of the Electoral Act 1993 this House nominate David Francis Caygill of Christchurch to represent the Government and John Kenneth Warcup Isles of Wellington to represent the Opposition parties each to be appointed by Her Excellency the Governor-General as a member of the Electoral Commission for the purposes of its jurisdiction under Part VI of the Broadcasting Act 1989 be agreed to. 
Ayes 80 
New Zealand Labour 51; New Zealand National 27; Progressive 2. 
Noes 39 
New Zealand First 13; ACT New Zealand 9; Green Party 9; United Future 8. 
Motion agreed to.
Urgent Debates Declined — Iraq—Draft United Nations Resolution 
Urgent Debates Declined — Iraq—Draft United Nations Resolution 
[Volume:606;Page:3785] 
Urgent Debates Declined 
Iraq—Draft United Nations Resolution 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I have received a letter from the Leader of the Opposition seeking to debate under Standing Order 376 the New Zealand Government’s alleged decision not to support the American-British draft UN resolution. I have examined the media reports on this matter provided by the Leader of the Opposition. The Prime Minister is quoted as saying it is not that New Zealand would not support the resolution but that New Zealand could not vote on it because New Zealand does not have a seat on the Security Council. She then goes on to say that all diplomatic means should be used to resolve the crisis. These statements were made during the course of yesterday morning. They could have given grounds for an urgent debate but they would have had to be raised yesterday. In these circumstances there is no particular case of recent occurrence that can justify an urgent debate today. However as I have indicated to the Business Committee provided a suitable matter involving the New Zealand Government’s responsibility arises over the situation in Iraq an application is likely to be successful at some point.
Simich Clem: Ngati Awa Claims Settlement Bill — In Committee Speaker Recalled In Committee Speaker Recalled In Committee 
Simich Clem: Ngati Awa Claims Settlement Bill — In Committee Speaker Recalled In Committee Speaker Recalled In Committee 
[Volume:623;Page:18724] 
The CHAIRPERSON (Hon Clem Simich) 
: I am afraid that I cannot resolve the matter for the member. We have commenced the Committee stage of the Ngati Awa Claims Settlement Bill. If the member wishes to pursue the matter of whether the bill should be withdrawn or referred back to a select committee then that is a matter for the Speaker. If the member wants that process to commence it is over to him.
Prebble Richard: Animal Welfare (Restriction on Docking of Dogs' Tails) Bill — Procedure First Reading 
Prebble Richard: Animal Welfare (Restriction on Docking of Dogs' Tails) Bill — Procedure First Reading 
[Volume:621;Page:16369] 
Hon RICHARD PREBBLE (ACT) 
: 
 I am sure I can help you. I think it is quite simple. I seek leave of the House for the voting on this bill to be a split vote and in the instance of a split vote the names of the MPs voting for the Ayes and those for the Noes to be recorded. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: The member has sought leave and the House is the master of its own destiny. Is there any objection to that course of action being taken?