Rich Katherine: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Rich Katherine: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Volume:639;Page:8960] 
8.  
KATHERINE RICH (National) 
 to the  
Minister of Education 
: Does he agree with the statement of the Southland Kindergarten Association president Paddy Lewis regarding the 20 free hours policy that “If we don’t raise the fees … then we are not going to be viable.”? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY (Minister of Education) 
: 
 I note that the Southland Kindergarten Association has just issued a media release to clarify its position in which it notes that it is unfortunate it is being used as a political football. It states: “If parents bring their 20 Hours to a Southland Kindergarten they will not pay any fee they will not pay any optional charges—so any talk over increased fees is irrelevant to them.” 
Katherine Rich 
: How does he feel about being the guy who is through his 20 hours free policy turning the once-proud free kindergarten movement into one that is considering charging fees that in some cases are 700 percent more than the present donations? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: A whole lot better than the girl who seems to want to undermine a policy that is hugely popular around the country. 
Dr Ashraf Choudhary 
: Does the Minister accept recent survey findings that the vast majority of early childhood education managers teachers and parents support the principles of free early childhood education? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: Yes I do and the Labour-led Government will deliver on this principle. But I also challenge the National Party to come clean with New Zealand families and admit that by the next election it will support this policy too. 
Katherine Rich 
: The girl has this to ask: what did the Minister mean when he said that after the early childhood reforms are rolled out “the chances of making a profit” from early childhood education provision will be “very very low … simply because the sector will over time become more like the compulsory schooling sector and the chances of making a profit will be almost nil.” It looks like he is telling the 1100 private operators to get out of the business now. 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: On behalf of this guy can I say that the policy was never intended to make profits for particular centres. We are of course keen that centres make a surplus that they can reinvest in improving their property or wages or conditions or whatever they might want to do. But this policy has never been a profit-making policy. 
Katherine Rich 
: Why should anyone invest in early childhood education provision to reduce the current waiting lists that working parents face when he as Minister has gone out and said that he wants the early childhood sector to be controlled like the State sector is and that “the chances of making a profit will be almost nil.”—why does he think people invest? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: The second part of the question is wrong; I have not gone out and said anything of the kind that the member has indicated. But I would say to anybody who wants to go into early childhood education provision that the Government pays for the establishment of centres; we are both through Work and Income and through the Ministry of Education paying for this particular service; we are in the kindergarten area of course paying for teachers’ wages; we are paying for enhancement of performance; and we are paying for computers. I say that if I were looking at entering this area at the present time I would want in. 
Katherine Rich 
: Is the Minister now resiling from his comments to the  
Sunday Star-Times  
that for those thinking of getting involved in providing early childhood education “the chances of making a profit” will be “very very low … simply because the sector will over time become more like the compulsory schooling sector and the chances of making a profit will be almost nil.”; does he not understand that people go into business to pay their bills and make a profit? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: I think we have a divide between the two parties here. Of course we want to see all early childhood educators in a position to be able to provide high-quality early childhood education. I was pointing out that we are in the middle of a 10-year strategy—we are 5 years in and we have 5 years to go. As we move through that strategy for example we will build a fully qualified fully registered teaching workforce and all of its members will be paid proper teachers’ wages. Those are the kinds of things we are focused on; we are not focused on the notion that the member seems to be obsessed with which is that people should be able to make a profit. 
Katherine Rich 
: When the Minister’s own officials tell him that in the event that his so-called 20 free hours policy is a success—which we all doubt—30 percent of our communities will not have the capacity in terms of spaces does he think he will somehow provide that capacity through just the State sector without the assistance of private providers who invest their own money into setting up these centres? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: It seems to have escaped the member’s attention that the State owns none of the early childhood education sector. The sector is either community-owned or privately owned; we own none of it. What we are doing however is funding the most massive expansion of early childhood education that the member will see anywhere around the world. On top of that we are funding the professionalisation strategy the regulation strategy the building of these centres and the equipment of these centres. I am not quite sure what the member wants us to do. But I come back to the point that we do not own these centres. 
Katherine Rich 
: Why did the Minister single out Kidicorp for comment when he made the bizarre statement that the Government would trawl through financial reports to see whether centres were making a profit then look at whether the Government subsidy was appropriate when the Prime Minister had opened one of Kidicorp’s centres only a few weeks earlier thereby endorsing it? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: I too would go on record as endorsing Kidicorp as a quality provider of early childhood education. But I would single out all providers of early childhood education. We have a system for monitoring how they run their centres. We audit them every year. We do not single anybody out. But of course this money is taxpayers’ money and we will make sure it is spent properly.