Pugh Maureen; Bennett Glen; Bidois DanFAIR TRADING (GIFT CARD EXPIRY) AMENDMENT BILLIn CommitteeClauses 1 to 10 and Schedules 1 and 2Suze Redmayne: Point of order Madam Chair.CHAIRPERSON (Maureen Pugh): I've just got a little bit to do before we start. I appreciate your keenness though. Members the House is in committee on the Fair Trading (Gift Card Expiry) Amendment Bill. The bill is drafted in clauses. Members will debate the bill clause by clause starting with clause 1. Members may wish to consider Speakers' Rulings 127/2 which indicates that clause by clause debates are generally narrow and should confine themselves to the words of the particular clause and issues contained in them. Members we come first to clause 1. Clause 1 is the debate on the title. The question is that clause 1 stand part.SUZE REDMAYNE (Junior Whip—National): I move that this question be taken as one part.CHAIRPERSON (Maureen Pugh): Are you seeking leave for that?Suze Redmayne: I seek leave.CHAIRPERSON (Maureen Pugh): For that.Suze Redmayne: For this question to be taken as one part.CHAIRPERSON (Maureen Pugh): Leave is sought for that purpose. Is there any objection? There appears to be none. The new question is that clauses 1 to 10 and Schedules 1 and 2 stand part.GLEN BENNETT (Labour): Kia ora Madam Chair thank you for this opportunity. This is non-controversial; it just seems like a common-sense piece of work. I just want to note as I come to my question to the member in charge of this bill Dan Bidois that this has had a life of its own this piece of legislation. It's gone from the Hon Jacqui Dean I think it then moved its way to the Hon Melissa Lee and now—I'd say the not so honourable"—the member Dan Bidois is shepherding this through the House. So I just want to commend you on taking this.I think from our perspective it is good to see. I know that for myself—and I think if you look at the research you'll see that you know gender norms are one of those challenges—men are terrible at this thing. I did look through my wallet this morning and I do have two expired cards. Sorry to whoever gave them to me for my birthday three years ago.But anyway I just want to reflect and ask the member in terms of looking at new Subpart 3A of Part 4A inserted by clause 5 which obviously is the main body of what this is about: the definition. Also I guess in general comment if I can and then to go into my substantial question really it's around the definition of obviously what a card is. I just want to ensure that the definition—and I know it does talk about things like vouchers. I guess when we say gift card when it says it on the tin it's actually a plastic card but the question really is: when it comes to gift cards and vouchers how do we make sure it's really clear that this is purely online? For example an app you might have with Barkers or the Barkers website as an example—not that I have any expired ones from those that's way too flash for me. But the question is just to clarify around the definition particularly looking at Subpart 3A section 36WA(d) "a card or voucher supplied"—it says that several times through "a card or voucher". Just want to make sure it's not—because obviously as the world continues to move on how do we make sure this legislation is enduring so that actually it's not just a physical card or a physical piece of paper or something you get out of your birthday or Christmas card it actually is the fact that it's on your phone or the fact that it's on a website that you access through your emails.So I guess my question is just to confirm: can you give us assurance that it really is clear that a card or voucher is something that is electronic is something that is in the cloud that is something that's on an app rather than just a physical document.Dan Bidois: Do I need to?CHAIRPERSON (Maureen Pugh): Yes.Dan Bidois: OK—Madam Chair.CHAIRPERSON (Maureen Pugh): Dan Bidois.DAN BIDOIS (National—Northcote): OK—sorry. Look it's a pleasure—thank you very much to the honourable member for the question. Before I answer it I'll just maybe say thank you to Minister Melissa Lee and to the Hon Jacqui Dean of course for originally shepherding this bill to this stage. It's my pleasure to take it on board. Unlike the member I actually don't have an issue with spending gift cards. In fact if you ask my wife I try and do it as quickly as possible and try and get the full value of such gift cards. So look it is a good bill. I just want to also thank the Economic Development Science and Innovation Committee for their work in shepherding it to this stage.The aim of the bill really is to make sure that consumers get full realisation out of gift cards therefore applying a minimum expiry date of three years. To the member's question the bill actually is very clear on the definition of what is and isn't a gift card. The select committee which I'm actually a member on spent quite a lot of time discussing the extent of what is and is not a gift card. So allow me to just clarify for the member that any kind of e-gift voucher or card is included in the bill. So if there is a Barkers gift card that you have on your app then that will of course become under the definition of the bill. The key here is that they are gift cards or vouchers redeemable for goods and services. And I say "redeemable for goods and services" because there are other such cards that are of course redeemable for cash for example and that wouldn't come under the bill. So that I think answers your question of what the definition is of a gift card.Also just to take note that the select committee spent a fair amount of time talking about open loop versus closed loop gift cards. Just for the House a closed loop gift card is essentially one that you get and it is typically redeemable for one place or one chain in New Zealand. An open loop gift card is essentially one that is redeemable for many different types of retailers. The place where the select committee got to is to include open loop gift cards. That covers things like Prezzy Cards which are actually redeemable for a dollar value at any particular outlet that comes under the Prezzy Card family. So that's what is included in the gift card definition.There is of course a clear set of things that are not included as gift cards. I'm happy to go through that as well while I've got the time. Goods supplied or cards supplied in substitution for return goods—for example if you take something back in you get a gift card as a result—is not included in the definition. Prepaid cards for utility services are not included in the definitions. Debit or credit cards—things that you can withdraw cash with; typically supplied by financial institution—are not included in the definition. Cards supplied as part of a customer loyalty program are not included in the definition. So for example if you get an enough points with Air New Zealand and Air New Zealand gives a New World voucher then that actual voucher is not required to have a minimum expiry date of three years.There's also other areas that the select committee talked about with respect to cards or vouchers at limited events. For example your Gisborne once-a-year annual events or things like that—you won't need actually a minimum expiry date for.Finally second hand gift cards. If you on-sell a gift card you won't need to have a new expiry date. Of course there could be a private market for gift cards but part of that is just the practicality nature of as well. Also cards sold for charitable purposes are also not included in the bill."