Newman Muriel: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Newman Muriel: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Volume:606;Page:3849] 
1. Dr MURIEL NEWMAN (ACT NZ) 
 to the  
Minister of Social Services and Employment 
: What is the proper process by which Ministers with innovative ideas on welfare reform present them to Cabinet for consideration and has he received any Cabinet reports prepared by Hon John Tamihere challenging the Government welfare monopoly and calling on the Government to unleash Maori communities from state dependency by allowing “communities to take back their ability to be responsible for themselves to manage themselves and to grow a work ethic commitment and responsibility themselves”? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY (Minister of Social Services and Employment) 
: 
 The proper process for Ministers with ideas on welfare reform is to present them to Cabinet for consideration either by raising them with me as the relevant portfolio Minister so that they can be addressed in a paper I submit to Cabinet or by raising them during a Cabinet committee or Cabinet discussions on papers on welfare reform. I have not received nor would I expect to receive papers on welfare reform submitted directly to Cabinet by the Hon John Tamihere as welfare reform is outside his particular portfolio responsibility. 
Dr Muriel Newman 
: Given that the Hon John Tamihere has not arranged for the work to be done has the Minister asked his officials to prepare full and comprehensive reports analysing the merits of his colleague’s policy proposals; if not why not? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: No I have not asked for work to be done on the privatisation of welfare. However issues like decentralisation and devolution are part of our work programme. 
Dave Hereora 
: What innovative ideas on welfare reform is the Government pursuing? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: The Government is moving from what is called a social welfare approach to a social development approach as I outlined in a paper I tabled in the House on Tuesday. I shall cite three examples of the work that is currently in practice from that approach. We have decentralised work and income services of the Ministry of Social Development itself a new organisation to focus on regional labour-market needs and that has been very successful. We scrapped the work-for-the-dole scheme and focused again on real jobs with real wages. We have introduced an enhanced case management process for the domestic purposes benefit and widows benefit that we think is already working very well. 
Katherine Rich 
: In the light of the Hon John Tamihere’s “verbal bazooka” relating to disadvantaged youth: “There are third or fourth generation kids who believe that a Lion Red means everything is going to be great; that burglary is good because they’re going to eat. Now the do-gooders at WINZ they can’t change that.” can he confirm that the Minister of Youth Affairs had shared those views with his Cabinet colleagues prior to his knowledge wave speech; if so when and in what form? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: The Hon John Tamihere for many years prior to entering Parliament since being a member of Parliament and since being a Cabinet Minister has well-known views on the issues of welfare and they are known in the media as well. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: Having regard to the provisions of the Maori Development Act and the monitoring requirements of the Ministry of Maori Affairs is he telling us that that Minister has made no submissions whatsoever either in his associate portfolio or his primary portfolio to him on the issue of juvenile welfare; is this just a case of Mr Tamihere opening his mouth and beating his gums with no prior preparation whatsoever? 
Mr SPEAKER 
: All but the last comment can be commented on. 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: I can tell the member that the Hon John Tamihere has signed papers through Cabinet as is appropriate in his portfolio area. He does the work he is supposed to do from his area extremely well. 
Sue Bradford 
: When is the Government going to tell the House and the public when its long-awaited benefit reform programme will commence and of what it will consist given that there appears to be no welfare reform legislation at all on the Government’s agenda this year? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: As the member will know benefit reform has always been focused on for this second term of a Labour-led Government and she will know from the Prime Minister’s speech to the House at the beginning of this session of Parliament that we have slated some small changes in that area this year with major changes to be made in next year’s Budget. 
Hon Peter Dunne 
: Following on from the fulsome praise of Mr Tamihere that the Minister gave in the House on Tuesday will he be taking steps therefore to ensure that Mr Tamihere can present his views on welfare reform to Cabinet: if so when? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: As a former Cabinet Minister himself the member will know that there is a process to be followed in this—that is either the member can raise those issues with me or discuss papers as they come through. There are many channels to be used. 
Dr Muriel Newman 
: Does he find it helpful as a Minister to have a Cabinet colleague who assesses his policies as being “dumb dumb dumb” and does he believe such a public attack of his policies is consistent with the rules on collective responsibility as set out in the  
Cabinet Office Manual? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: The comments in relation to housing policy which was the quote around “dumb dumb dumb” of course do not reflect Government policy. No it is not helpful and no it does not reflect collective responsibility. 
Rodney Hide 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I do apologise. I do not think that members could hear that answer. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Please be seated. I heard it. 
Rodney Hide 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker.  
Mr SPEAKER 
: It had better not be in relation to this. I am not having points of order like this raised frivolously. 
Rodney Hide 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: On another matter? 
Rodney Hide 
: It is this question. It is a test whether you hear it Mr Speaker or members hear it. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: No it is a test whether I think it is a reasonable point of order and the member’s was not. 
Hon Peter Dunne 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I hesitate to support the member but there has been a problem all week in this sector of the House with the amplification system and the member may well have a point about the answer not being heard. I do not sit very far away from him in relation to the Minister and I too found it difficult to hear. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: The best way to have no problem at all is to have absolutely no interjections whatsoever. When I was in the European Parliament I found that to be the case and that was a very refreshing change and I acknowledge the delegation in the gallery today. This is a Parliament based on a robust exchange of views—I do not want to do that; it lies in the hands of the members themselves. However the point having been made I will have the matter looked at over the weekend.