Potaka Tama; Woods Megan; Jackson WillieTAMA POTAKA (National—Hamilton West): I really enjoyed those comments around the aspiration for ownership particularly across whānau Māori and using the progressive home ownership (PHO) pathway—that specific Māori PHO pathway. I'm interested to understand how many whānau Māori eventually accessed and used the PHO pathway for homeownership? That's the first question. The other one is a pivot towards the income-related rent subsidy (IRRS) which is quite a topical one and it was mentioned in the select committee recently. There are 27 of 81 community housing providers (CHPs) which are Māori CHPs but only two of them have around 100 or more IRRS places. I'm wondering what are the messages that the ministerial team—the tag team—are giving to those Māori CHPs in order to access greater numbers of IRRS places because they've had to go through that quite strenuous process of becoming CHPs. Hon Dr MEGAN WOODS (Minister of Housing): I'm happy to take a first crack at that and I'm sure Minister Jackson will want to follow up. The reason why those by Māori for Māori community housing providers (CHPs) have such low numbers of income-related rent subsidy (IRRS) places is because they didn't exist until our Government was elected because ours was the first time that we actually had backed the aspirations of Māori organisations to have these by Māori for Māori solutions. In fact in our first few years in Government we spent a lot of energy time and resource building capacity for a number of very strong iwi and Māori organisations to actually become CHPs so they could be in this position. So I want to see those numbers grow. I wish it had been done the decade previously by a previous Government—that we had had Māori aspiration backed in that way rather than just left and nothing done about it. So we do want to see that grow. In terms of the progressive home ownership (PHO) numbers Minister Jackson may be able to fill us in on the detail but I'd just like to reiterate the conversation that we had at select committee. We could have filled the PHO numbers by having by Pākehā for Māori solutions. We could have had existing community housing providers be the providers that offered those progressive home ownership options for Māori. We could have had a number of organisations that wanted to do it and we could have taken them up on that offer. But instead what this Government has been committed to is working with our Māori providers to build the capacity for them to be the organisations that work with their communities to fulfil that aspiration. So I think we know that in order to build the capacity in the CHP sector so that we could get the hundreds of houses that that receive IRRS funding we had to be prepared to put in the work. I commend the work that Minister Jackson is doing to work with those organisations to make sure that we can have these solutions which make sense in our communities. Hon WILLIE JACKSON (Associate Minister of Housing (Māori Housing)): Can I just tautoko what our Minister of Housing has said. I commend her plus other Ministers and this Government in terms of what we have been attempting to do over five years. As that member Tama Potaka well knows as he's been very involved—and I commend him again. Over the years he has been trying very hard to get our people into the game—and that's what you're saying Minister. We have not been in the game. We've had community providers who've been shut out altogether so that member quite rightly points to the minimal amount of providers. But it's hard for our providers to even get the status to get the credibility so I just am so proud of the work that this Minister has done and that this Government has done in terms of actually going down the path of a by Māori for Māori strategy. I re-emphasise the Whai Kāinga Whai Oranga strategy as one of the most brilliant strategies we have ever seen in terms of housing and Māori housing in the history of this Parliament. I say that because in past years—I've just come on as a Māori Housing Minister in the last year. But in past years Te Puni Kōkiri (TPK) was always separate in terms of our Ministry of Housing. So Te Puni Kōkiri used to just do repairs fix up this and fix up that; we had Ministry of Housing who were doing their thing; and we just did not have a coordinated and comprehensive strategy. The Whai Kāinga Whai Oranga strategy brings together the two entities and why is that good? It's because you have Māori officials working with their Pākehā colleagues in terms of the Ministry of Housing and Urban Development helping them out in terms of the intricacies with regards to housing Māori because in terms of housing Māori you're not just talking about a house; you're talking about a community you're talking about whakapapa and you're talking about whānau. So Whai Kāinga Whai Oranga in 2021 when we came up with $700 million in terms of investment—it was absolutely unprecedented. The member asks quite appropriate questions but at the same time he must remember what we've already put in place and we want to build on that. So we built on that $700 million by adding another $200 million in the latest Budget in terms of Whai Kāinga Whai Oranga which is about getting our people into houses all around the country but we're not just looking at the repairs side of things which was the case very much with TPK. I'm proud of the coordinated comprehensive strategy we now have and we want the flow-on to happen into the areas that that member quite rightly points out. So I thank him for his question. Kia ora.