9. NCEA—Suitability Standards and Māori and Pasifika AchievementCHRIS HIPKINS (Labour—Rimutaka) to the Minister of EducationNCEA—Suitability Standards and Māori and Pasifika Achievement9. CHRIS HIPKINS (Labour—Rimutaka) to the Minister of Education: Is she satisfied that increased rates of NCEA attainment are leaving school leavers better prepared for further study training or employment?Hon NIKKI KAYE (Minister of Education): Yes because under this Government there are more young people leaving with a qualification fit for a diverse economy and further study and training. However we will continue to work hard to improve our system.Chris Hipkins: How can she claim that they are better prepared for further study training or employment when 64 percent of year 13 students achieved NCEA level 3 last year but only 49 percent achieved university entrance—fewer than in 2008?Hon NIKKI KAYE: Because in 2014 we made university entrance harder and the reason we did that is we could see that a group of students were struggling. But what I can confirm for the member is that we have seen increases in the number of young Māori and Pasifika students graduating with Bachelor's degrees and we have actually even though we have made it harder seen an increase in those young people getting university entrance.Chris Hipkins: In that case is she concerned that last year there was a 12 percent gap between the NCEA achievement at level 3 of European students or Pākehā students and yet for Māori and Pasifika students that gap was 23 percent and 30 percent respectively; if so how are Māori and Pasifika school-leavers better prepared than they were in 2008 when the gap was between 3 and 6 percent?Hon NIKKI KAYE: Obviously as I have said before we will continue to work hard to improve our system. However the reason we are very confident that we are strengthening Māori and Pasifika achievement is that on a range of levels they are doing better. They are doing better not only in terms of more young people staying in education longer and we can see that in NCEA level 2. We have seen a 17 percent increase for Māori—those 18-year-olds leaving with NCEA level 2—and 17 percent for Pasifika students. As I said before we have seen a 9 to 14 percent increase in those leaving with Bachelor's degrees for Māori students and an increase from 7 to 10 percent for Pasifika students with Bachelor's degrees.Chris Hipkins: How are Māori and Pasifika students better off as a result of increased NCEA attainment when fewer of them are gaining university entrance relative to European or Pākehā students under the current National Government?Hon NIKKI KAYE: There has always been a gap. Our point would be that—Chris Hipkins: It's getting bigger.Hon NIKKI KAYE: I do not agree with that. As we have said before we have made university entrance harder. We did that on purpose because it is not in the best interests of students if they are taking out student loans and then struggling to pass. If I actually look at the numbers that are in front of me in 2011 the year 13 students with university entrance—and this is before we made it harder—was 30.6 percent New Zealand Māori and it is now 31.4 percent. In 2011 the number of Pasifika students was 27.4 percent and it is now 30.7 percent. But again we made it harder in 2014.Chris Hipkins: Does she think the disparity between groups of students is being improved by the significant differences in subject choices being offered to students—for example the fact that Māori Pasifika and low-decile students are more likely to be in non-academic subject areas?Hon NIKKI KAYE: I make a range of points here. The first point is that it is up to students parents and whānau what subjects they take; it is not the Government. The second point that I would make is that the National Certificate of Educational Achievement (NCEA) qualification is made up of unit and achievement standards and for every student there are basic numeracy and literacy requirements so we have a lot more Māori and Pasifika students—as result of our Government's investment and all of the hard work of teachers and principals—who are leaving with those basic requirements. If the member wants to make a range of judgments about some of those unit standards he needs to understand that their qualification is made up of a range of components including numeracy and literacy and I would challenge him to start naming those unit standards and walking in and meeting some of those people who have those unit standards and telling them to their face that he thinks their qualification is inferior.Chris Hipkins: Did her predecessor receive advice suggesting that the National Government's change to the minimum literacy and numeracy requirements for NCEA was resulting in students having worse literacy and numeracy when they obtained NCEA but that changing it would compromise the Government's ability to reach its Better Public Services target of 85 percent of students receiving NCEA level 2?Hon NIKKI KAYE: It is a bit difficult because I have been in the role for 24 hours to determine what advice the previous Minister received. But what I can tell the member is that I am very proud that our Prime Minister in terms of numeracy and literacy today announced that we are setting new Better Public Services targets which will see us have a target of 80 percent of year 8 students having numeracy and literacy requirements. But also it is backed up by a $40.7 million investment in areas like severe behavioural issues but also oral and language communication issues. So we are prepared to invest to lift and raise achievement and we are walking the talk as we are today.