Upston LouiseHon LOUISE UPSTON (National—Taupō): Thank you Madam Chair. I want to start my line of questioning around the wage subsidy scheme and in particular the wage subsidy extension. I have a series of questions—actually some raised initially by the union—around the number of businesses supported by the wage subsidy extension and the proportion of the workers that are getting the 100 percent pay 80 percent or just the wage subsidy level of $585 a week and what work has been done with those employers to ensure those that are paying the minimum are looking at how they can pay their employees the proper rate.Also interested to know in terms of the modelling around the economic impact of the wage subsidy extension how many jobs have been saved. We've heard on lots of occasions that the wage subsidy is all around saving jobs so I'm interested in the data that the Minister has used and we've heard in the Estimates and the appropriations in terms of exactly how many jobs have been saved by the wage subsidy extension.My third question on the wage subsidy extension is: does she support the decision that there will be no further wage subsidy extensions?Hon Carmel Sepuloni: I'll let a couple run if that's OK?Hon LOUISE UPSTON: If she's not ready I'll keep going. So obviously the wage subsidy—I'll just fill in some time until the Ministers are ready; maybe you give me a nod when you're ready to go—I think we're up to $13 billion that's been spent on the wage subsidy and the Minister's been quite proud of the fact that 1.7 million jobs have been covered by that. I'm sure I've got the figures right but maybe you can correct me when you do want to answer.So the wage subsidy extension and the fact that the Prime Minister has said there will be no further wage subsidies extended—I want particularly to know what analysis has been done on the impact on industries that cannot operate given the borders continue to be shut specifically in tourism and travel agents.Hon CARMEL SEPULONI (Minister for Social Development): Sorry just with regards to some of the questions that you've asked the honourable member Louise Upston just over $13 billion has been paid out in total for the wage subsidy in its entirety. Of that just under $2 billion has been paid out for the wage subsidy extension. The difference in the criteria between the original wage subsidy and then the extension was that originally we said that people had to be able to demonstrate a 30 percent drop and then we shifted that to 40 percent.In terms of how many jobs have been saved well overall for the wage subsidy we have subsidised around 1.7 million jobs—that includes the extended period. Our intention was always to support businesses as best we could to be able to keep them operating and obviously keep people employed but we've never shied away from the fact that there still will be some job losses. It would just be impossible for us to determine exactly what that number of job losses might be.I think it's interesting to note that we did do a survey on those employers who received the wage subsidy in May and at that time around about 90000 employers responded. At that time only 6 percent of them said that they still anticipated needing to make staff redundant. To put that in perspective though many of those that replied were small businesses and actually the larger businesses were more inclined to think that they may still need to lay off staff at the end of receiving the wage subsidy. So it is heartening that it was such a low number but obviously the Government is watching this space very very carefully.The COVID job loss temporary relief payment was put in place to support those who because of COVID have lost jobs—obviously a shock to their household budget and their household circumstances; obviously during a time where the labour market is not as robust. So as a way of alleviating the shock to the many families that may lose jobs because of COVID we put in place the job loss cover as well and that runs basically up till the end of October. If anyone loses a job between 1 March and 31 October they will be eligible to apply for the temporary job loss cover.I do need to reiterate that it's not the first time that we have put a wage subsidy of this nature or even the temporary job loss cover support in place. We have done that before and namely we did that following the Canterbury earthquakes. However clearly this is on a much larger scale given that there have been nationwide impacts of COVID—obviously global as well—and we are not alone. Unfortunately across the world what we're seeing is the economic impacts of this unprecedented health event and the impacts that it's been having on business and job losses internationally. So we wanted to soften the blow and to put measures in place that would be able to support businesses to continue and the wage subsidy has been successful at doing that. And now we watch this space very carefully as we move forward.I do want to also acknowledge with respect to the wage subsidy that the Ministry of Social Development moved incredibly quickly at a pace that I think is admirable. You know within two days of announcing they were already able to pay out. In comparable countries for instance like Australia they were able to announce in March but they weren't able to start paying out until May. There were criteria put in place that made the process as uncomplicated as possible because we knew that there was no time to waste with regards to injecting support into these businesses to retain their staff. And if we hadn't acted in haste I've been told by numerous businesses that they may have made decisions which would have included making staff redundant and so I do give my respects to the Ministry of Social Development for the job they've done here.CHAIRPERSON (Hon Anne Tolley): I just remind everybody Minister and members that this is not the old way of making five-minute speeches; this is a question and answer session that is time-limited. So just a reminder to everyone to help the whips who are trying to manage it.