McClay Todd; Mallard TrevorHon TODD McCLAY (National—Rotorua): It's one thing for the Green Party member and the Minister of Conservation to come to this House and say she's listening to New Zealanders but when tens of thousands of New Zealanders over a 24-hour period express their concern over her decision to go out and cull very large numbers of an animal that has importance in New Zealand and indeed in the face of hundreds of thousands of New Zealanders who enjoy the outdoors recreationally who are hunters or who make a livelihood from tourism—for her to come here and say she won't listen to them and she's pushing ahead with this mass cull of up to 25000tahr is not a good thing for democracy. At least that's what she was saying yesterday because what we heard in the House in question time today is she's now been forced to postpone the start of the cull of tahr in the South Island from this weekend until she's done some more consultation. So yesterday she had consulted enough she knew what was going on she knew it would be best but overnight more than 20000 people have emailed her have signed a petition; newspapers and TV have started to be interested in this issue; and today she's come to the House and said the cull will not be starting this weekend because she needs to go and talk to and consult a few more people.The problem with that is that it's not great for our hunters and tourism operators and the reason for that is she has not committed to consult with them or their representatives. That is the reason that there is so much concern around the country. Now I've yet to meet anybody from the hunting or tourism industry and certainly the National Party who is saying that this species—and other species—does not need to be managed; certainly it does. But the question the Minister hasn't answered is why on every other occasion under us in Government and earlier this year when 3000 tahr were managed—were culled—she has instructed the Department of Conservation (DOC) to go out and indiscriminately kill every animal they can find as they fly around in helicopters including the bull tahr that actually don't add to the size of the herd. These are the animals that are hunted and others from overseas come and have the most interest in.She's received advice from representatives of the Tahr Liaison Group that she shouldn't be doing that yet she's disregarded that advice and she's just pushed on ahead. She said in the House today it wasn't 25000 animals that will be culled. Well she's wrong because if she goes and looks at her press release and the information that was put out—3000 were culled earlier this year—she announced that 10000 would be culled starting this weekend. Well she's postponed that. If the hunters themselves couldn't manage the part that they are responsible for DOC would do another 7500 tahr before April of next year and she's also said that in the two estate parks she wants to have every single tahr—every single tahr—annihilated.Chlöe Swarbrick: What would you do?Hon TODD McCLAY: The member of the Green Party asks what we would do. We would go out and generally consult. We would talk to these groups. We'd go and talk to the New Zealand Deerstalkers Association who have come up with a plan that the Minister has disregarded and won't look at that says over the next three years these animals could be managed in a better way that protects their interests protects a species that in most other parts of the world is now endangered and at the same time that means hunters have a say. What we would certainly do is listen but I get how the Minister doesn't want to listen because actually she knows best.So number one why has she back-tracked today in this House compared to her strong position yesterday? Well the Department of Conservation (DOC) has told her she hasn't consulted enough and she could be in trouble. Number two she's heard that actually hunting groups have got lawyers and they're about to start legal proceedings against her. So all of a sudden she said today I'm going to consult a little bit more." She's come under huge pressure over the last 24 hours. There are more than 20000 New Zealanders who are expressing very strong concern about her disregard for their right to have some say. She hasn't consulted with the Game Animal Council properly. In fact a month ago she was on Radio New Zealand saying she wanted to get rid of it. I'm glad that last week she put out a press release saying she may not but the hunters don't believe her.The final problem that she's got is that those who import ammunition from overseas have said they won't sell it to her. DOC don't have enough bullets. I'm glad she has suspended the cull just for this weekend. She needs to—SPEAKER: Order! The member's time has expired."