Turner Judy: Protection of Personal and Property Rights  Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Turner Judy: Protection of Personal and Property Rights  Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Volume:636;Page:7041] 
JUDY TURNER (United Future) 
: 
 I stand on behalf of United Future to speak to the Protection of Personal and Property Rights Amendment Bill. We are very keen to see this bill go to the select committee and I congratulate the Minister Ruth Dyson on introducing it. Certainly in the 4 years I have been in Parliament I have received on a number of occasions very very concerning letters from concerned family members mostly and some from senior citizens themselves who have got themselves into some awkward legal arrangements and are not completely clear about their rights. 
In preparation for this opportunity to speak this afternoon I looked at the website of Age Concern New Zealand. I commend Age Concern and Grey Power for the work that they do with their members in trying to give good advice to people who are considering these matters. I think that perhaps the most telling piece of information I got from Age Concern’s website was the advice that they give to elderly people who are considering forming trusts or giving a power of attorney to someone. Age Concern’s website advises people to ask themselves some questions and gives a list of nine questions. The very nature of those questions highlights the complexities that this bill needs to seek to address. 
The first question the website asks is: “Do you have absolute trust that the person you are appointing as attorney will always act in your best interests?”. That asks people to consider the character of the person. I could also add information on people who feel pressured by a family member to sign a power of attorney over to them. Often family members contest with each other to be appointed to that position. Another question is: “Will you appoint one attorney or two or more? Or will you appoint a trustee company?”. That explains that there are a range of options. Sometimes—particularly if someone has been put under pressure by people touting themselves as being concerned for that person’s welfare—he or she may not understand the range of options that are available. I think it is really important that people who are considering these things know there are some really good options available. 
The fifth question on the website is: “Do you want to give your attorney authority to take care of everything to do with your personal care and welfare or only some things?”. Again some people have had the misunderstanding that by signing legal documents they have literally given away all rights to all decisions on all matters. That question relates to developing an understanding ahead of time when one is discussing the matter with somebody who is going to have that legal authority and making it very clear to that person exactly what one is signing over and not signing over so that everybody involved in the arrangement is very clear on that. The eighth question is: “Do you want to give your attorney authority to take charge of all your money and property or only some things?”. The website asks people to think about whether they want a separate arrangement for the person who is able to take care of their property from the arrangements regarding personal care. One suggestion I read is that one should have two people with a power of attorney: one person to deal with one’s assets and property and one person to deal with one’s personal care so that the two never become confused in somebody’s mind—particularly if he or she stands to gain from any decisions that are made. 
Another of the questions asks what steps for instance people want to have taken to determine their mental capacity before their attorney can act. Some very good guidelines are given by Age Concern as to the kinds of things one can insist on about who can determine that one’s mental capacity has deteriorated to a point where somebody needs to step in and take over making decisions on one’s behalf. For instance does one want one’s attorney to be monitored and supported in his or her role? Or does one let that person become a law unto himself or herself? To whom is an attorney accountable outside his or her own counsel? 
One of the other questions Age Concern asks is: “If you have an enduring power of attorney already have you checked to see that still meets your needs?”. It is a very similar situation to appointing people as guardians for one’s children. When my husband and I had a young family one of the best bits of advice we were given on that matter was that as our children grew and the relationships we had with different people changed and adjusted over time we needed to revisit that decision every now and then. The people who may make appropriate guardians should a crisis happen when one’s children are very little may not be appropriate once one’s children have hit their teenage years so we need to review those decisions. So it is with this kind of decision. Over a period of say 10 years one’s relationships may change to such an extent that change is required. Often people are unaware that they have the ability to go in and make those kinds of changes. This is another area raised by Age Concern that I would like to see discussed in light of this bill. 
The final question was: “Have you consulted your own lawyer to ensure you have independent advice?”. It is not uncommon when family members are arranging matters such as this for a family member to say “Look Mum come and see my lawyer down the road. I’ve got to get a property thing settled—we’ll throw that in on the bill and we’ll get my lawyer to check that everything you’re signing over to me is kosher.” The advice here is no no no—one should have one’s own independent lawyer to make sure that the advice one gets is unbiased and is all about protecting one’s best interests on every aspect of what is being covered by the power of attorney. 
United Future thinks this is a very timely bill. As I said at the beginning I congratulate the Minister on introducing it. I am pleased to be on the select committee that it will be sent to. I will be taking an active interest in its development and I certainly look forward to the submission process regarding some of the issues I have raised in the House today. I look forward to the passage of this legislation.