Mahuta Nanaia: Maori Trustee Amendment Bill — In Committee 
Mahuta Nanaia: Maori Trustee Amendment Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:653;Page:2771] 
Hon NANAIA MAHUTA (Labour—Hauraki-Waikato) 
: 
 Anyone listening to the debate right now should know that that was a second-term Government member—unfortunately from the Waikato but who must have drunk too much water from another catchment. I say to Mr Bennett that if he had listened to the debate he would have known all too well that the Maori Trustee Amendment Bill as introduced was actually introduced by the previous Labour Government so that is half of his speech gone. On the second half about the issue of a stand-alone entity it is well agreed within this Chamber that people believe that the Maori Trustee should be a stand-alone entity. Really if Mr Bennett wants to get involved in debates such as this one he should take a leaf out of the old marae handbook: titiro whakarongo then korero. He certainly did not do any of that when he talked in this debate; I think his two mates next to him in the Chamber must have given him a big side ball. Anyway I appreciate his efforts to try to contribute to this debate. We all agree that the Maori Trustee should be a stand-alone office. But this is a Committee stage debate and Mr Bennett knows well that it is an opportunity to debate the clauses within the bill not just to talk at some random level. Everybody is being so polite to David Bennett in the Chamber. 
Anyway I want to get back to acknowledging the Minister in the chair the Hon Georgina te Heuheu. I thank the Minister for taking a call on the issue I raised. It was a very serious question about practicalities if a termination of a Maori Trustee did occur; there were some practical things that I thought were not as clear as they could have been. Firstly the issue of termination is a direct matter between the Minister of Maori Affairs and the Maori Trustee. It must occur in writing and the criteria are clearly set out in the bill. The reason I raised the question is that the bill also sets out the basis upon which a delegation occurs which must be by written authority. The Minister has clarified in part that the threshold for termination is very high and I accept that. But I do think there is the potential for a practical difficulty to occur when a Minister has had reason perhaps to suspend the Maori Trustee while an investigation is occurring. During that period of time at which notification occurs there has not been any authority delegated to the deputy trustee and it is not clearly expressed in the legislation what happens if for the practical reason of a time lapse the Maori Trustee is suspended before a written delegation occurs. That is the nature of the question but I accept the explanation that the Minister has given on the basis that it is a high threshold in the first instance. I just invite the Minister to maybe consider that there is a potential loophole there. 
Mr Henare made an interesting contribution as well. I often like to go back to what he said in the Chamber because holding him accountable is so easy. He said “National fully supports Maori economic development but don’t go and steal other people’s money to do it.” I re-state that on the record. He says time and time again that “We will privatise services and get people to use their own money instead.” In fact the Government has convinced the Maori Party that if we privatise prisons it will be a good thing for Maori. Maori can then use their own money to invest in rehabilitation programmes to try to improve the lot of those who unfortunately are in prison. That is the ethos of Mr Henare. 
But I have a serious question. I could ask the question of the member directly or of the Minister. I would prefer to ask the question of the member because he is the one who raises these types of issues in the Chamber and because he has been a Minister before. I want to know what assurance that member as a member of the Government will give that the retained earnings of the Maori Trustee will not be used by the Government for any other Maori development purpose. Would the member answer that because I think it is a very important question? Is there a commitment to ring-fence the Maori Trustee’s retained earnings so that the Government cannot draw down on that for any other development opportunities? There is silence. I could ask the question of the Minister but out of courtesy I will not. The implication of what Mr Henare said was that the Government will not touch it. The Government will leave it to Maori beneficiaries and not touch it at all. So I challenge that member to get up in this Chamber and be accountable for the information he gave that the National-led Government will retain the earnings of the Maori Trust Office in its own entity and will not draw down on it at any point in time in the future for Maori development. I suspect he will find difficulty in answering that question.