Peters Winston: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Questions to Members 
Peters Winston: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Questions to Members 
[Volume:623;Page:18878] 
9.  
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) 
 to the  
Minister of Immigration 
: What has happened to the 400 non-genuine refugees I referred to in question for oral answer No. 10 yesterday who were not approved for residency and what explanation has he got for any of them still being in New Zealand? 
Hon PAUL SWAIN (Minister of Immigration) 
: 
 I have not been able to obtain the exact information the member has asked for in the time available but I will provide that information as soon as it becomes available. However based on previous data officials estimate that around 32 percent will have left New Zealand; around 53 percent would have appealed or withdrawn their applications and applied under another category; and around 15 percent may be unlawfully in New Zealand. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: Does the Minister fully expect that in a First World democracy in a country that claims to be the world’s oldest democracy we should put up with a shilly-shallying vague obtuse answer like that saying: “We’ve got percentage estimates.”? How many of the 400 whom he itemised in a question on 1 February and who were told they were not successful refugee applicants have gone? 
Hon PAUL SWAIN 
: If the member is frustrated it does not match the level of my own frustration. What I can say to the member is that the information will be made available to him as soon as possible. It is likely to be tomorrow afternoon. 
Hon Matt Robson 
: Is the Minister aware that in the two-step process to determine whether somebody is a genuine refugee many applicants are found on the first step to have a genuine fear of persecution but are found on the objective step as to whether there is a situation of persecution in their country not to have proved their case; and that in that situation the many applicants who are found to be genuine in their belief that they would be persecuted are not classed as non-genuine refugees? 
Hon PAUL SWAIN 
: Yes that is well summarised. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: How is it that since Labour came to office recent refugees to this country have sponsored an extra 1588 family members into the country with no obligation to support those people once they are here? 
Hon PAUL SWAIN 
: The first and obvious point to say is that since Labour has been in office the number of refugee claims has gone down. It is true that refugees coming in can then sponsor family members. By and large those family members come out of the quota which is around 750. However the ability for people to sponsor and the criteria and conditions for that are part of the review we are doing of the Act. [ 
Interruption 
] 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I heard it once but I will not hear it again. The member will stand withdraw and apologise. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: I withdraw and apologise. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: Will the Minister also provide tomorrow information on how much the 400 non-genuine refugees he referred to in his 1 February answer who arrived here in the last 3 years on false or missing documentation have already cost the taxpayer including the cost of their emergency benefits Housing New Zealand Corporation homes and legal aid; and does he not recall what happened to his predecessor when she proved to be incompetent in handling the job? 
Hon PAUL SWAIN 
: The information the member has asked for today will be provided. If it is information that requires other Ministers’ input then obviously the member should go to those Ministers. For example we do not collect information on welfare benefits. That is the responsibility of the Minister for Social Development and Employment. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. Out of interest—I know that it is your last day and you will probably find this question fascinating as well—how will I get an answer from the social welfare department if nobody knows where the person who is here illegally is or who he is? 
Mr SPEAKER 
: As usual the member has raised a very interesting debating point and has added to the contribution but that is not in order.