Dowie SarahSARAH DOWIE (National—Invercargill): Thank you Mr Assistant Speaker. I rise in opposition to the Conservation (Infringement System) Bill because of course we have very serious concerns regarding the integrity of the infringement system extending those powers to a non-governmental agency. I should preface this statement first: the decision to oppose this bill was not taken lightly. I reiterate what the Minister has just said that this was a National Party bill introduced by the Hon Maggie Barry Minister of Conservation at the time and that the National Party does support the Department of Conservation as one of the largest enforcement and compliance agencies that we have in our governmental system.I again support that with the fact that in the last Government we amended the Wildlife Act to extend the powers given to the departmental rangers with regards to collecting information of those where there was suspected to be an offence occurring—because of course when you have departmental rangers out in the field dealing with some of these complex offences relating to wildlife and issues that can occur on the conservation estate they do need the ability to take action swiftly. They do need the ability to take steps to understand what is going on to secure the identity of people that may be carrying out an offence and as such we did support the Department of Conservation with respect to extending the powers under the Wildlife Act to give them that ability to get on top of those offences.Again I acknowledge that given the nature of offences that occur on the conservation estate and given the logistics of departmental rangers being in remote areas and the wide-ranging nature of the offences—and the Minister alluded to this; it can range from things such as littering and unwittingly fishing in a marine reserve to more serious offences like spotlighting and using firearms in a dangerous manner—the department does actually need a midway point. We have prosecutions of course with respect to the more serious offending and departmental rangers use warnings when the offence is less serious. So we do support the Department of Conservation in their compliance. We do understand that they need a robust system and that this system with regards to infringements is a sort of ticket system and penalties would range from $100 to $500 in line with Ministry of Justice guidelines.However the big issue where this bill departed from where the National Party was taking it is with respect to extending those powers to Fish & Game a non-governmental organisation. It's not about Fish & Game per se. Fish & Game are very good lobbyists. They represent a number of different fishers with respect to their views. They run good systems with regards to managing sports fish and support obviously recreation on the conservation estate. But there are 12 regional offices that loosely report to a national head office—and I say loosely report. That is where some of the issue with respect to the integrity of any infringement system that is extended to an organisation that is not State. So we have questions about where the infringement system would end up about how credible it would be about how objective it would be and as to the accountability and administration of that system when it is unabated by the State.Full-time rangers with Fish & Game are not subject to the same codes of conduct that departmental rangers are subject to. They're not subject to the same level of training and they're not subject to the same level of accountability when they come back into the office and have that line delegation as the Department of Conservation has to check and double-check their work with regards to dealing with offences.I note that the Minister of Conservation says that she would be responsible for designing and overseeing a system that she believes would put in place those accountabilities. But when you're talking about 12 regional offices that are based out in the field that loosely report to a head office it seems at this point very challenging as to how they would report to the head office and how they would maintain that level of objectivity with respect to dealing with offences. And we certainly don't want that abused in any way.The other thing is that the Minister mentioned safeguards in this bill and we simply don't believe that not allowing a delegation from the director of Fish & Game is enough. Again with the Minister overseeing some of the system as to accountability it's just not enough when you are dealing with people in remote places looking at certain alleged offences in isolation and making judgment calls without that level of training and without that level of oversight and safeguard with respect to codes of conduct and with respect to line management and accountability moving forward.We believe that there really are too many variables to keep a hold of this system and to make sure that an infringement system is dealt with in a fair manner that it's primarily secured objectively and that there is a level a standard that is adhered to across the country so that New Zealanders and visitors know that when they go out onto the conservation estate they will be treated the same as their counterpart ranging from those that complete an offence or undertake an offence in Southland to those where it occurs in Northland.So again I say that there are far too many variables. For that reason we cannot support the infringement regime moving forward because this bill has simply departed from the intent as to where it started when the Hon Maggie Barry brought this bill into the House. I end with the fact that we are supportive of conservation and the department moving forward. We want to see whatever happens moving forward that an infringement system implemented is fair and objective. We want to see the Department of Conservation succeed and as such that's why you have seen our support of initiatives such as Predator Free 2050 and us investing in conservation including our partnership model that we brought in and heavily pushed to involve community at the coalface involving them in conservation efforts to get them involved in recreation and preserving and protecting our nature as is our birthright in New Zealand. But with respect to this bill there are not enough safeguards to maintain an objectivity with Fish & Game and we believe that this will undermine the integrity of the infringement system that is mooted in this bill.