5. Question No. 5—Prime MinisterDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader—ACT) to the Prime MinisterQuestion No. 5—Prime Minister5. DAVID SEYMOUR (Leader—ACT) to the Prime Minister: Does she stand by her statement regarding the Government's response to COVID-19 What I'll set out over the course of this month is how we anticipate transitioning from the restrictions that we have"; if so when will a full and comprehensive plan be announced?Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN (Prime Minister): Yes I stand by the full context of my statement where I said "What I'll set out over the course of this month is how we anticipate transitioning from the restrictions that we have things like limits on gatherings and our alert-level system shifting from that to the vaccine." Providing information is something we've been doing and will continue to do. The member will know we've publicly released the resurgence plan the alert levels framework our business support plans and of course our elimination strategy but as a Government we'll continue to build on this. Earlier this week we announced that every New Zealander will have access for instance to the Pfizer vaccine and today we announced the sequencing framework so that all New Zealanders will know where they sit in that vaccine roll-out. We will continue to give as much certainty as we can to New Zealanders in such an uncertain global environment.David Seymour: What information was in today's vaccine announcement that wasn't known 10 days ago?Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: We have put more detail—including the expectation of when we expect those in higher-risk environments and what we determined to be those high-risk environments—out in the public domain. It wouldn't be known for instance that we intend to treat those 65 years and over within South Auckland as being in those categories of high risk up in the higher parts of our vaccine roll-out.David Seymour: Can the Prime Minister understand why some people might think today's announcement about Pfizer was actually a bit of a fizzer?Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: No because I think every New Zealander understands that as fast as we are receiving the vaccine we are moving to prioritise the roll-out around those who are in the highest-risk settings. So I think they fully know and understand why we have prioritised those who are at the front line who are at the greatest risk of coming in contact with COVID and I think they also know and understand that from the middle half of the year we will be rolling out more broadly to the remainder of the public. I think that information we have reiterated but in between time we now have provided greater clarity around the sequencing before we get to the middle of the year.Chris Bishop: Why are the three component parts of the IT system required for the vaccine roll-out still under development and not ready to go?Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: The last Government never built a national immunisation system and we have had to build from scratch. We do have a system that's able to support the vaccine roll-out. That is not the issue—[Interruption]SPEAKER: Order! Can I just ask members to stop shouting down the Prime Minister. Interjections are meant to be rare and reasonable.Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: But if the member is implying for a moment that we are unable to roll out a vaccination programme to New Zealanders because of IT issues that is not true.Chris Bishop: Why is the inventory management system that actually tracks where the Pfizer vaccines are in New Zealand not ready to go?Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: We do have inventory management systems. We also have a system to make sure that we know who has been vaccinated. What we are building is an integrated system that will allow for instance people in different places—so GPs' clinics and pharmacies and so on—to work through an integrated system and that is being built. None of this will or is stopping our roll-out. We already have a system that is recording our vaccinations as we go. It is not an impediment.David Seymour: Does the Prime Minister stand by her position expressed earlier in question time that we cannot open our border to any Australian state because people entering New Zealand from that state may have recently been in another state that has COVID?Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: Can I get the member to repeat the first half of the question? I didn't quite catch it.David Seymour: Certainly. Does the Prime Minister stand by her position expressed earlier in question time that the reason New Zealand cannot open its borders to any Australian state is because people entering New Zealand from that state might come from a state where there is COVID?Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: That is not how I would summarise what I was saying. I've said that there have been outbreaks in Australia and of course that has caused complication. Then secondary to that it has been suggested that we could simply in those scenarios just not travel between ourselves and that state. The point I was making is that often in those outbreaks those borders are remaining open—in fact in the places where they haven't been doing that and they have remained closed they often do not have a direct route of travel to New Zealand nor have opened to New Zealand.David Seymour: Why doesn't the Prime Minister have confidence in the rules that every Australian state has used to successfully prevent interstate transmission to date?Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: Oh this is not a slight on the management of different states. They themselves would acknowledge though that often by the time a case is identified in one state—I'll take the Northern Beaches example—it has often already through no fault of anyone moved into another state. So I just think that's the reality of a mobile population.David Seymour: Will any transition plan the Government produces include vaccine passports for New Zealanders who are vaccinated to travel internationally and if so when does she expect those to be in place?Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: Well actually I think what's been recognised by the international community is that rather than individual states designing their own vaccine passport which we then would want to make sure were accredited in other parts of the world we actually already have a system in place through the International Air Transport Association that would be able to provide that mechanism. So that's been developed at an international level. We are staying in close contact as that work is done and no doubt we'll be inputting into that as other countries are as well.David Seymour: Will any transition plan that the Government releases include a plan to be included in a business travel network—as has been developed by countries such as Taiwan Singapore and Australia—and if so when would she expect something like that to be in place?Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: Again for those—you know Australia hasn't done that to date and most countries who have often don't have an elimination strategy like we do. I think to be clear for the member the goal at the moment that we are all working towards is a situation where as many New Zealanders as possible are vaccinated. So we move from a position of the border being our protection to us individually carrying our own protection. The member's suggestions around what might happen in the in-between time—so much of that relies on the data and science around transmission when you're vaccinated and one of the issues we have is that data and science is incomplete. We know that it has an effect but we know it will vary depending on vaccine. So there's a high amount of variation at the moment which will be very important for New Zealand to understand because we are a bit different in that we have an elimination strategy.David Seymour: If vaccines don't turn out to comprehensively protect us from COVID-19 what plan B does the Government have other than the tools it's used to date?Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: I think to be fair again we need to start talking about this as the vaccine not being an end point; it will be like the flu. So that means that we will annually have to make sure that we have a rolling vaccination programme so that we are providing vaccines that deal with variants and so on because this is not going to go away for some time. So ultimately the way that we will all deal with it is: (a) we have to get as much global access as possible—variants will continue to emerge so long as the world is not vaccinated; so that has to be part of our plan as well—and (b) make sure that our own population then has access and uses the vaccine.David Seymour: Point of order Mr Speaker. The question was about what other measures would be taken if the vaccines were not effective. The Prime Minister gave a number of answers about how she would promote use of the vaccine but the question assumed that the vaccine had been used. The question was actually what would happen if the vaccine didn't solve the problem—what other measures would be taken—and that wasn't addressed at all.SPEAKER: I was listening carefully to the answer and I was thinking about that. But I think the answer was that other vaccines would be used as opposed to the vaccine. Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: I'm happy to clarify. SPEAKER: If the Prime Minister wants to elaborate that's fine.Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: I'm happy to clarify. My reference to the use of vaccine for variants was that the greatest thing that puts at risk a vaccine strategy is the emergence of variants. That of course is problematic if we don't have enough access to vaccines globally quickly. That is why we have to make sure that we are only safe if everyone is. We have to participate in providing access to vaccines around the world and keep vaccinating our populations globally."