Ryall Tony: Third Readings 
Ryall Tony: Third Readings 
[Volume:630;Page:2391] 
Hon TONY RYALL (National—Bay of Plenty) 
: 
 I agree with Mr Ron Mark and also with the comments made by Mr Brian Connell who like me and together with Mr Mark was a member of the Opposition team on the Law and Order Committee in the previous Parliament. 
For those listening at home and for those in the House it is important to put this legislation into some context. It enables the Ministry of Justice to improve the collection of fines from fines defaulters in New Zealand. What we know is that the amount of outstanding fines in this nation has now exceeded $600 million for the first time ever. Large amounts of fines are owed. We also know that the courts are similarly wiping huge amounts of fines. If only the pain and anguish of those who are offended against could be so easily wiped. 
But the Government made big store of the fact that this legislation will give it the power to stop fines defaulters at international airports. When it made that announcement of course there was a big front-page story in the  
New Zealand Herald 
. Mr “Get Tough” Goff was going to have fines defaulters stopped at the airport as they tried to leave the country. Everyone thought that that was pretty tough. It is tough to say that if a fines defaulter is going to leave the country he or she will be stopped at the airport and his or her bags will be taken off the plane unless the fine is paid. I thought it was pretty tough. 
Then we came to the select committee. Doing our job as Opposition members do we asked how many people would be stopped at the airport under this tough new legislation. Do members know what the answer was? 
Lindsay Tisch 
: No how many? 
Hon TONY RYALL 
: Thirty-five. Of the tens of thousands of people who owed fines in New Zealand Mr “Get Tough” Goff said 35 people would be stopped at the airport. Well that is hardly worth an article on the front page of the paper is it? So after some quite intense pressure from the Opposition parties on the select committee the Government caved in and dropped the threshold at which fines defaulters could be intercepted at the airport to $5000. We thought that figure was not very good but—wait for it—I ask members how many people will be stopped at the airport under this Government’s “get tough on fines defaulters” law. 
Lindsay Tisch 
: Well let’s hear it—how many? 
Hon TONY RYALL 
: It is 117—zip. Only 117 people will be stopped at international airports in any one year to be prevented from travelling overseas. That is it—117 people will be stopped. That is one fines defaulter every 3 days. 
Is the Government serious about trying to whittle away the $600 million debt mountain that is owed by fines defaulters? It is hardly worth coming to this House to pass a law— 
Ron Mark 
: They catch more pensioners coming back. 
Hon TONY RYALL 
: Mr Mark says the Government actually catches more than 117 pensioners coming back. Well that tells us about the Government’s priorities. Do members know how much money the Government has estimated it will collect by stopping 117 people? It is $1.2 million. We have spent $1.2 million of public money with the amount of time and effort Parliament has expended to put in place this legislation. The sad part about this is that it is absolutely consistent with the approach the Government takes in all law and order policy. Whatever the headline is the substance never matches the rhetoric. 
National will support the passing of this legislation but when we are the Government we will change it so that more fines defaulters are stopped at the airport. We know we will have the support of Mr Ron Mark in making those changes when we are in Government. Let us have some legislation that actually has some teeth and that is designed to get some action for those many thousands of New Zealanders who are owed reparation by criminals and for the Crown which is owed $600 million - plus by fines defaulters in this country.