Mitchell MarkHon MARK MITCHELL (National—Rodney): Thank you Madam Chair. Thank you for a call on this the Electoral (Integrity) Amendment Bill speaking to the title clause. Can I just start by supporting the opening comments made by the Hon Dr Nick Smith and speak to the Minister in the chair Andrew Little in relation to removing the word (Integrity)" from the title and making it instead the "Electoral Amendment Bill".You're hearing very clearly in terms of the calls that have been taken today in the committee the reason why we actually feel very strongly about the fact that this bill actually lacks integrity. One of the issues that I wanted to address with him when he stood and took a call—and I want to acknowledge that he is taking calls on this bill. That is important. I'd invite the sole New Zealand First member in the Chamber Darroch Ball to take a call. He has a lot to say across the Chamber. Take a call and tell us exactly what you're thinking.But I'd just like to address one of the comments and it was his final comment that he made around members of Parliament coming to this House and then feeling like they've got the freedom to do what they want when actually they should be adhering to what the party wants and effectively toeing the party line. If that's what he really believes that members of Parliament that put themselves out there and go out to their constituencies and tell them what they believe in and listen very carefully and understand what's expected of them—because they are elected as the constituency as the electorate member of Parliament their person to come to Parliament and be able to advance their issues.Now a part of that of course is yes you do tend to run in parties because you tend to be drawn together by a common set of values and a common vision in terms of what you're trying to achieve for your country and for your nation.However I don't believe for one minute that when voters go to the ballot box—although they recognise that yes there will be some level of responsibility and probably they have some expectation that there'll be some discipline around how you conduct yourself in the House of Representatives and how you conduct yourself with your party. But I'm sure that when they go to the ballot box they also feel very strongly about the fact that they want a member of Parliament that will come down here into this House of Representatives and that when there's an important issue when there's a burning issue in the electorate that they feel strongly about their MP is prepared to advance that even if it means being a bit uncomfortable and even if it actually means at times—and we've seen it in this House many times—that you have to take a stand or a position against your party and it's up to the MP and the party themselves in terms of how they manage that.The proposition being put to me was this: once elected—once the country has spoken and once you come to this Parliament—you become a creature of the party. That's it. Forget about being able to take a position or a stand even if it puts you in direct conflict and there's some friction that's created between the individual MP and the party. Actually that's not an expectation that you have—or that's not an expectation that the Minister has—and that's why we have this Electoral (Integrity) Amendment Bill in front of us.I just want to speak very quickly to the one point. If I decide to take a position against my party on something—and actually later on in the debate I'll use three examples where I've had to do that. If this bill is triggered and the leader of the party—and of course two-thirds of the caucus is always going to support the leader of the party because—Darroch Ball: Ha ha!Hon MARK MITCHELL: —otherwise it becomes a referendum doesn't it? Mr Ball laughs at that. I'd like to see Mr Ball take a position against Mr Peters. That would be very interesting to watch. Maybe he could take a stand and actually just reconfirm for us that he would do that if there came a vote inside his caucus for expelling another member of his caucus—MPs expelling another MP.But the reality of it is this. Let's look at proportionality because again we're coming back to what the Minister in the chair said—that the integrity around this bill relates directly towards making sure that we maintain that proportionality in this Parliament. So what would happen in the case where I as an MP I took a position against—[Bell rung] Madam Chair.CHAIRPERSON (Hon Anne Tolley): I call the Hon Mark Mitchell.Hon MARK MITCHELL: Thank you Madam Chair. So let's run this scenario past you. What if I decided that as the chair of the Foreign Affairs Defence and Trade Committee—and the committee as a whole felt very strongly—we should increase the number of refugees that we're actually bringing into the country and that it was time to do that but actually that was directly against the policy of the Government of the day and the Government of the day was a very strong very good coalition that was providing very good governance for the country led by the National Party—led by my party. That's what we did. That's actually what we did. This bill would have a chilling effect whereby I wouldn't feel that I had the ability to be able to support a cross-party decision that involved New Zealand First and the Labour Party and the Greens because I would now be in a position where the leader with the support of two-thirds of the caucus can expel me from this Parliament.Darroch Ball: Rubbish.Hon MARK MITCHELL: Well take a call. Take a call and explain why it's rubbish because Mr Ball is sitting over there as the only New Zealand First MP in the Chamber telling me that that's complete rubbish. So let's—Darroch Ball: I raise a point of order Madam Chairperson. That member has twice now referred to members not being in the Chamber.CHAIRPERSON (Hon Anne Tolley): I'm sorry I didn't hear that but if the member did refer to current sitting members not in the Chamber being absent from the Chamber—Hon MARK MITCHELL: Speaking to the point of order—CHAIRPERSON (Hon Anne Tolley): My question is: did you refer to the absence of sitting members in the Chamber?Hon MARK MITCHELL: No I didn't.Dr Duncan Webb: What Mr Mitchell said was that Mr Ball was the only New Zealand First member in the Chamber which by inference is saying that there are people absent from the Chamber.CHAIRPERSON (Hon Anne Tolley): But he's not saying that there are people absent. I just remind the member to be careful about how he phrases. Hon MARK MITCHELL: Thank you. Just seeking your guidance Madam Chair—so I can't refer to the fact that there's only one member of New Zealand First in the Chamber? CHAIRPERSON (Hon Anne Tolley): No you can't. Hon MARK MITCHELL: OK. All right. Thank you Madam Chair. So I would invite Mr Ball to stand and take a call and address the issues. He spends a lot of time shouting across the Chamber at members taking calls but actually he should just stand up and take a call. Write down the issues that we're putting forward to you. The Minister's done it. The Minister—all credit to him—has actually stood and taken a call and he's addressing some of the issues. Stand and take a call because it's your party that's brought this bill into the House. Show that you're actually willing to stand up and address some of these issues. So if we keep playing the scenario out that I was talking about which is that I take a position as the chair of the Foreign Affairs Defence and Trade Committee—actually this is a real example—my party becomes pretty unhappy at the way that that's been managed and the leader decides: "No he's got to go." Two-thirds of the caucus I assure you will support the leader. I'll tell you why: because if they don't then it becomes a referendum on the leader and the leadership. That's what it becomes. So if the Rt Hon Winston Peters was presented with a situation with Mr Horan and Mr Peters said "No I want Mr Horan out of the party." and he took it to a party vote you point to me one member of the New Zealand First caucus that would vote against their leader. Stuart Smith: None of them would. Hon MARK MITCHELL: None of them would. Mr Ball can stand and take a call and say that I'm wrong and then give me an example of why I'm wrong. He's very welcome to do that. So continuing on with the scenario that I was using I'm expelled from the National Party and actually I'm expelled from Parliament. I've got to go back to Rodney and I've got to say "I took a stand on something that I felt was important and I'm going to have to come back. I still want to represent you and I still want to be your voice in Parliament but I'm going to seek a new mandate." So I go out there as an Independent and for some reason I win the election and I become an Independent in Parliament. Tell me where your bill the Electoral (Integrity) Amendment Bill protects the proportionality. Just stand up and tell me how it protects the proportionality because the Minister stood up and he said that the reason that the word "(Integrity)" should be in this bill is because it has to respect and it has to maintain the proportionality of what the voters in New Zealand have actually delivered. They have told the Parliament—the 52nd Parliament—what the proportionality of Parliament is going to be on the day that we come into this House swear our allegiance and become members of Parliament. I want the Minister or Mr Ball to stand and take a call and be very clear and outline for us—because the argument has been that the "(Integrity)" inside this title relates directly to proportionality. So tell me how in this Parliament and in this term this bill is going to be able to maintain the proportionality of this House as we started at the beginning of this term. If you can stand and you can tell us how that proportionality is going to be maintained I would be very interested to know because reading this bill listening to the submissions listening to the speeches that I've heard and listening to the Minister no one has been able to explain to us how the proportionality of this House is going to be maintained and yet we're told that that's the reason why this bill is needed. Thank you Mr Chair."