8. Question No. 8—Social Development and EmploymentHon LOUISE UPSTON (National—Taupō) to the Minister for Social Development and EmploymentQuestion No. 8—Social Development and Employment8. Hon LOUISE UPSTON (National—Taupō) to the Minister for Social Development and Employment: Can she confirm that there are 13383 people aged 18-24 who have spent one year or longer on the jobseeker benefit and that on average just 178 participants in Mana in Mahi each year had been on a benefit for a year or longer when they started their placement?Hon CARMEL SEPULONI (Minister for Social Development and Employment): I can confirm that as at the end of the June quarter 2022 8388 people aged 18 to 24 had been receiving a jobseeker work-ready benefit for a year or more and there was also 4995 jobseekers with a health and disability exemption. Up until 2013 the jobseeker health and disability exemption used to be called the sickness benefit and included people like Daisy Bell who said yesterday in the media I don't know how sitting up at midnight hooked up to a dialysis machine screams free ride to you". I can also confirm that in the four years since it was launched Mana in Mahi has exceeded its target: in the time it has been operating it has helped 711 people who have been receiving a main benefit for over a year and who had barriers into employment and to work. I can also confirm this Government helped more people off benefit and into work last year than any time since records began—113000 to be exact with just over 35000 people aged between 18 to 24.Hon Louise Upston: Does the Government stand by its argument that Mana in Mahi helps the 13383 young people on the jobseeker benefit long term when just 178 participants each year were on benefit long term?Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: I certainly stand by the fact that we need a suite of measures to support people into employment. Mana in Mahi is an example of one of the many effective programmes that we have implemented as a Government. Also I want to make this House aware of the fact that we as a Government have been very focused on ensuring that we prevent people from coming on to benefit as well. We are all aware of the statistics and who might be disadvantaged in a tight labour market and who might be more likely to end up on benefit and receiving long-term welfare receipt. We are committed to getting in there early so that that doesn't happen.Hon Louise Upston: Does the Minister believe young job seekers who break their benefit dependency by remaining off benefit for 12 months should receive a thousand-dollar incentive payment and if not why not?Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: There are incentives already on offer through the different products that we have in place. Mana in Mahi—there is an incentive payment there. What I do not like and what I do reject is that the National Government's policy around incentives is somehow the silver bullet to the complex challenges that young people are facing. Also I do worry that the way in which the National Government have framed their policy means that they are actually incentivising people to stay on benefit for longer—rather than leave when a job may become available at six months they'll stay on for a year.SPEAKER: Order! Order! The member can't comment at length on previous Governments.Hon Louise Upston: What does the Minister say to 23-year-old Montana Mason who told Stuff she believed more support and job coaching was needed?Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: There are a range of different tools that need to be put in place to provide support for the young people that are on benefit or are unemployed. As I said earlier there are financial incentives in some of the products that are available. There is coaching in the youth service that was set up by the previous Government. But you need that suite of measures to ensure that you've got the right tools for the individual young person for their individual circumstances that come before you. What I would be worried about is the inference from that side of the House that they would be slashing front-line services to pay for that when actually front-line work-focused case management is important as well.Hon Louise Upston: Does the Minister disagree with Mr Copeland who is a 20-year-old who said that job coaching should be mandatory as people "spent way too much time on the benefit" and "I know I have and I regret it"?Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: As I've said in this House already job coaching is available through particular programmes and what we also have done is we have put into place the front-line work-focused case management that had been run down by the previous Government. The person I agreed with actually is Newstalk ZB's John MacDonald who said "When I saw the coverage on the TV news last night I thought I was back in the 1980s. I think this policy is a disaster. It sounds good but in my view it will achieve nothing."SPEAKER: Order! Order! The member does not have responsibility either for previous Governments or Opposition policy. I know that she has been asked a couple of times to comment on it and I probably shouldn't have let that happen but the member just can't keep on doing that at length.Hon Louise Upston: Does the Minister disagree with 20-year-old Leon Copeland who said "I've gone through other agencies as I realised Work and Income is horrible at actually helping people on the benefit with finding jobs. It's like they don't care anymore."?Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: I think our results speak for themselves. The June quarter saw 35000 people in that year—young people—exit benefit into work. That compares to the 22000 people that exited benefit into work back in 2017 under the previous Government. It is important that we have a suite of measures in place. This Government is focused on doing that making sure we have the right tool in the toolbox for the young person. There are no silver bullets."