Joyce Steven: Estimates Debate — In Committee 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Joyce Steven: Estimates Debate — In Committee 
[Sitting date: 01 August 2012. Volume:682;Page:4219. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Hon STEVEN JOYCE (Minister for Tertiary Education Skills and Employment) 
: 
 I thank the previous speaker David Clendon for his lecture as to what a university does and also for his assertion that this Government is about rhetoric when it comes to tertiary education. I would like to now dispel that with some facts. I would have thought that somebody who lectured at a university might be focused on a few facts because facts can be quite helpful to discern the difference between what is actually happening and what could be known as rhetoric. So I would like to make a few comments if I could because I think this Government has made very good progress in strengthening our tertiary system. Here is some of the evidence. In 2012 we are funding the highest number of core tertiary places that have ever been funded in New Zealand universities and the wider tertiary system—13200 more places in 2012 than in 2008. It is not “bums on seats” either as we are also funding for performance for completing courses and for qualifications and every institution has 5 percent of its tuition funding at risk so that they focus on that. 
We are getting better results for priority learners than has been done previously for those who have struggled historically. For example Maori at university now have 5500 more places than in 2008 and their completion rates are up too. 
We are making great progress in literacy and numeracy. I note that the member for New Zealand First was concerned about that. Well she will be pleased to know that the expectation out of embedded literacy and numeracy at foundation levels means that this year there will be 122000 people taking courses at foundation level with embedded literacy and numeracy which is up from 36000 2 years ago and is up from 15000 just after we came into office. 
 We have also made great progress in simplifying and reducing qualifications in New Zealand which was a big issue when we arrived in office. People were crying out for a reduction in the number of qualifications between levels 1 and 6. We are down to 3500 and we will be down to about 1300 by the end of 2014. 
We have also made some very good progress in the industry training space which is very very important because the industry training space was not going at all well when we came into office: 53 percent of trainees in 2008 and 54 percent in 2009 achieved no credits at all—no credits. They were phantom trainees. They were trainees of the previous Government’s imagination. We have since seen a real lift in performance of industry training organisations. We have had a 19 percent increase in credit achievements from 2008 to 2010 and the provisional results for last year now suggest that we are getting a 70 percent credit rate achievement in industry training. So that is a good result too. 
On top of that we had the Green member saying that New Zealand universities were poor and struggling. Well I can tell him the good news. They may have been in 2008 but in 2012 we have now got university incomes up by 13.5 percent in the global financial crisis. So they may have been struggling 4 years ago but their incomes 13.5 percent higher today with a 2.9 percent increase in university incomes in the last year alone. So that should help Mr Clendon with his problems with the facts. 
New Zealand’s tertiary education system is healthy it is getting healthier and it is also doing it during the global financial crisis. And in Budget 2012 we are investing more. We are investing an additional $42 million in engineering over the next 4 years. We are investing an extra $17 million in science teaching at universities we are putting $100 million extra into research at universities we are putting in $30 million to reduce the funding gap between public and private tertiary providers and we are putting in 3000 more Youth Guarantee places over the next 4 years. That is what we are doing to invest in tertiary education. So we have a member popping up criticising the Government for being about rhetoric and telling stories and then doing exactly what he said the Government was doing. Then he sits down and he does not realise that all these facts say that the New Zealand tertiary system is going much better. 
What is more we are supporting Canterbury University. Yes it is in times of trouble. We have maintained its funding. We have made sure that we have stood behind it. We are working with the university in terms of investment opportunities going forward so that it can lift itself again to actually invest in areas where there is strong student support. We are taking that business case forward. Yes Canterbury University has had difficulties. One of its faculties has lost 1000 students as a result of the earthquake and the member seems to be suggesting that it should not adjust its staffing at all to reflect its new reality. Well it is tough and I feel for those people who are not necessarily going to be able to stay in that role but for the sake of the other 2000 people working at that university and the thousands and thousands of students we have to acknowledge the reality of what happened. We have to invest in the future but we have to take it forward and we have to be realistic about what is going on. 
We are investing significantly in the tertiary education system. Before I sit down I would like to make one comment for Tracey Martin the speaker before Mr Clendon who criticised the idea of international students coming to New Zealand as if it was a bad thing. Well it is not a bad thing. It is good for this country. It is good for this country to have the people-to-people links that international students bring to this country when they come in. Frankly when the Chinese the Indians students from the other Asian communities the English the Europeans and those from the US come here they do some learning. Yes they provide some income for New Zealanders and when they go back they are lifelong friends for New Zealand. That is helpful to have when you are a small country in a small waka at the bottom of the world. International education despite what New Zealand First members think is not bad. It is good for this country actually. Those members need to realise that it is a positive thing that we invest in it and happily it does not take away any places from domestic students. So it is all good stuff. 
So you can relax Mr Clendon because the tertiary system is in good hands. If you want to debate facts I am happy to do so at any time.