Brownlee Gerry: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Questions to Members 
Brownlee Gerry: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Questions to Members 
[Volume:619;Page:15323] 
9.  
GERRY BROWNLEE (Deputy Leader—National) 
 to the  
Minister of Maori Affairs 
: Does he stand by his reported statement of 3 May 2004 that he would “leave Parliament if the foreshore and seabed legislation does not work out the way he wants for Maori”; if not why not? 
Hon PAREKURA HOROMIA (Minister of Maori Affairs) 
: 
 Yes. 
Gerry Brownlee 
: Will the Minister now leave Parliament since his own Te Aitanga-a-Hauiti tribal whanau and hapu have pointed out that the Foreshore and Seabed Bill will significantly advantage larger iwi at their expense and lead to serious conflict within Maoridom or is that how he wanted it to work out? 
Hon PAREKURA HOROMIA 
: No. 
Gerry Brownlee 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. We are left with a bit of a dilemma with an answer like that. Do we take it that this is not how he wanted it to work out and therefore he will not vote for the bill or do we take it that he is perfectly happy with it and will not leave Parliament? 
Mr SPEAKER 
: No the member said “No” and I do not know how the member could have a more direct answer than that. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I refer you to Standing Order 370 which states: “(1) An answer that seeks to address the question must be given if it can be given consistently with the public interest. (2) The reply to any question must be concise and confined to the subject-matter of the question asked …”. That is not happening in this House and it did not happen in respect of that answer. The Minister was asked an ancillary question and “No” cannot be the answer to both of them and you are about to let him get away with it. There is the Standing Order and I want to know how it is being complied with in this House. We are not getting it in this Parliament. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I think on reflection the member was asked two questions. He is perfectly entitled to answer “No. No.” but I would like him to answer the second part of the question again. 
Hon PAREKURA HOROMIA 
: I am half Ngai Tahu I am one-third Te Aitanga-a-Hauiti and that is a small group and I also come from Ngati Porou. I will make up my own mind in relation to where my whakapapa sits in those decisions as my people come here from all over the motu. 
Gerry Brownlee 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. You asked the Minister to address the question and we got a bit of genealogy given back to us. The question was very very simple and the second part was very simple: that his people had said this was going to lead to significant expense advantaging larger iwi; and the end part of the question was “lead to serious conflict within Maoridom or is that how he wanted it to work out?”. Now he may well have the genealogy that leaves him conflicted but he should give some answer that relates to the question. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I thought the Minister did address the question with the two answers he gave. 
Jill Pettis 
: Why did the Minister support the introduction of the Foreshore and Seabed Bill? 
Hon PAREKURA HOROMIA 
: I worked exhaustively over a long period of time with my colleagues to get the best outcome for Maori and all New Zealanders like my Pakeha ancestors the Rutherfords down south. We will wait with anticipation for the select committee report. 
Murray Smith 
: Is the Minister aware that Maori submitters have told the Fisheries and Other Sea-related Legislation Committee that if the Government entered into a proper dialogue with them they would be quite open to the concept of the foreshore and seabed being made public domain for the benefit of Maori and non-Maori alike as proposed by United Future; and given the huge public unease over this issue will he recommend to the Government that it enters into such a dialogue with Maori with a view to reaching an agreement on the basis United Future has proposed; if not why not? 
Hon PAREKURA HOROMIA 
: I always encourage people to participate in the select committee process. I am not a member of that select committee but I understand it has been run in a very proper and efficient way in order to hear the cases. I await the report back from the committee with interest. 
Gerry Brownlee 
: Does he stand by his assertion that it is “not true that a deal has been reached with Ngati Porou on the foreshore issue.”; if so can he explain why the Foreshore and Seabed Bill favours large iwi over hapu and small iwi by making it much easier for them to gain ancestral connection orders which are the gateway to territorial customary rights and compensation? 
Hon PAREKURA HOROMIA 
: At the time on the right date when that was made that was the statement. There have been negotiations with a whole lot of people as we are about to do shortly on the Aquaculture Reform Bill. 
Gerry Brownlee 
: Can he then confirm for the House that the Government has done a deal with Ngati Porou over the seabed and foreshore in their rohe? 
Hon PAREKURA HOROMIA 
: I can confirm that we met with Te Whanau-a-Apanui which is up in the Opotiki area and we have met with Ngati Porou and other tribes and there are ongoing discussions.