edithatogo/nz-hansard-corpus huggingface dataset:
Shanks Katrina: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Questions to Members 
Shanks Katrina: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Questions to Members 
[Volume:675;Page:21048] 
KATRINA SHANKS (National) 
: 
 My question is to the Minister for—[ 
Interruption 
] 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I apologise to the member. I say to the front-benchers that please I have called Katrina Shanks. We have dealt with the previous question.
Vote: Education (Freedom of Association) Amendment Bill — In Committee 
Vote: Education (Freedom of Association) Amendment Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:675;Page:21093] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That clause 9 be agreed to. 
Ayes 63 
New Zealand National 57; ACT New Zealand 5; United Future 1. 
Noes 56 
New Zealand Labour 42; Green Party 8; Maori Party 3; Progressive 1; Mana 1; Independent: Carter C. 
Clause 9 agreed to.
Royal Society of New Zealand Amendment Bill — In Committee 
Royal Society of New Zealand Amendment Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:675;Page:21073] 
Royal Society of New Zealand Amendment Bill 
In Committee 
Debate resumed from 3 August. 
Clause 14 Elected Councillors ( 
continued 
)  
Clause 14 agreed to. 
Clause 15 agreed to.  
Clause 16 Co-opted Councillors 
Hon HEATHER ROY (ACT) 
: 
 I move  
That the Committee report progress. 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the Committee report progress. 
Ayes 63 
New Zealand National 57; ACT New Zealand 5; United Future 1. 
Noes 52 
New Zealand Labour 42; Green Party 8; Progressive 1; Independent: Carter C. 
Motion agreed to. 
House resumed. 
Progress reported. 
Mr DEPUTY SPEAKER 
: The question is that the report— 
Report adopted. 
Mr DEPUTY SPEAKER 
: This bill is set down— 
Mr DEPUTY SPEAKER 
: The process here is that I have to put down first that the Royal Society of New Zealand Amendment Bill be set for consideration on the next sitting day. That is first process then I can accept the seeking of leave. What we have done is adopt the report; that motion has been put. The next stage means that it cannot be debated today so I am putting it down for further consideration on the next sitting day as Standing Order 177(1) states. The member is seeking leave to depart from that. I am prepared to put that question to the House but first of all I have to say that the bill is set down for further consideration on the next sitting day. 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD (Labour—Hutt South) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I seek the leave of the House for the further Committee stage of the Royal Society of New Zealand Amendment Bill to be set down to be taken subsequent to the debate on the Education (Freedom of Association) Amendment Bill today with no debate. 
Mr DEPUTY SPEAKER 
: Are we all clear? Leave is sought for that purpose. Is there any objection? There is objection.
Amended Answers to Oral Questions — Question No. 2 to Minister 
Amended Answers to Oral Questions — Question No. 2 to Minister 
[Volume:675;Page:21129] 
Amended Answers to Oral Questions 
Question No. 2 to Minister 
Hon PAULA BENNETT (Minister for Social Development and Employment) 
: 
 I seek leave to correct a figure I gave earlier today in question time. 
Mr DEPUTY SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought for that purpose. Is there any objection? There is no objection. 
Hon PAULA BENNETT 
: My officials gave me the figure of $25.9 million for funding the Growing Up in New Zealand longitudinal study. They have since informed me of their mistake. The total funding figure should have been $23.3 million and I would like to correct that.
Kaye Nikki: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Questions to Members 
Kaye Nikki: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Questions to Members 
[Volume:675;Page:21058] 
11. 
NIKKI KAYE (National—Auckland Central) 
 to the  
Minister of Internal Affairs 
: What announcements has he made regarding the igovt scheme and increasing online access to government services? 
Hon NATHAN GUY (Minister of Internal Affairs) 
: 
 Last week the Electronic Identity Verification Bill was introduced to Parliament which will allow the igovt identity verification service to be used widely across Government and by the private sector. The igovt log-on and identity verification services provide an easy and secure way of accessing Government services online and proving identity. They have great potential to deliver better more secure and cost-effective online services to the public. I also announced last week an agreement that has been signed between the Department of Internal Affairs and New Zealand Post to develop and promote these services which will help make these services much more accessible to the public. 
Nikki Kaye 
: What kinds of services can the igovt log-on and verification services be used for? 
Hon NATHAN GUY 
: Currently about 30 services are available such as booking swimming lessons via the Wellington City Council or ordering a birth certificate through the Department of Internal Affairs. There are more than 320000 igovt log-ons in use. This is far more convenient for the public because they have to remember only one log-on detail rather than a whole bunch and they do not have to queue in line with different forms of ID. With New Zealand Post coming on board and ultra-fast broadband rolling out across the country we expect more and more services to become available in the future.
Vote: Employment Relations (Secret Ballot for Strikes) Amendment Bill — In Committee 
Vote: Employment Relations (Secret Ballot for Strikes) Amendment Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:675;Page:21124] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That clause 2 as amended be agreed to. 
Ayes 63 
New Zealand National 57; ACT New Zealand 5; United Future 1. 
Noes 57 
New Zealand Labour 42; Green Party 9; Maori Party 3; Progressive 1; Mana 1; Independent: Carter C. 
Clause 2 as amended agreed to.
Vote: Education (Freedom of Association) Amendment Bill — In Committee 
Vote: Education (Freedom of Association) Amendment Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:675;Page:21091] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the amendment be agreed to. 
Ayes 55 
New Zealand Labour 42; Green Party 8; Maori Party 3; Progressive 1; Independent: Carter C. 
Noes 63 
New Zealand National 57; ACT New Zealand 5; United Future 1. 
Amendment not agreed to. 
The question was put that the following amendments in the name of David Shearer to clause 9 be agreed to: 
to omit subclause (1)(b); and 
to omit from subclause (2)(a) “a member of the student association” and substitute “subject to compulsory student association membership”.
Vote: Education (Freedom of Association) Amendment Bill — In Committee 
Vote: Education (Freedom of Association) Amendment Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:675;Page:21102] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the question be now put. 
Ayes 63 
New Zealand National 57; ACT New Zealand 5; United Future 1. 
Noes 56 
New Zealand Labour 42; Green Party 8; Maori Party 3; Progressive 1; Mana 1; Independent: Carter C. 
Motion agreed to. 
The question was put that the following amendment in the name of Grant Robertson be agreed to: 
to add the following clause: 
10Review of sections 229A to 229CA 
(1)The Ministry of Education shall review the effect of the operation of sections 229A to 229CA 5 years after the date on which this Act receives Royal assent. 
(2)The review shall assess the impact of the provisions on students and the tertiary sector in accordance with the terms of reference established in subsection (3). 
(3)The terms of reference for the review shall be set out by the Minister of Education. 
(4)The Ministry of Education shall report to the Ministers of Education and of Tertiary Education.
Roy Eric: Employment Relations (Secret Ballot for Strikes) Amendment Bill — In Committee 
Roy Eric: Employment Relations (Secret Ballot for Strikes) Amendment Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:675;Page:21119] 
The CHAIRPERSON (Eric Roy) 
: Clause 2 is on the commencement which is a reasonably precise and tight debate.
Vote: Education (Freedom of Association) Amendment Bill — In Committee 
Vote: Education (Freedom of Association) Amendment Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:675;Page:21103] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the amendment be agreed to. 
Ayes 56 
New Zealand Labour 42; Green Party 8; Maori Party 3; Progressive 1; Mana 1; Independent: Carter C. 
Noes 63 
New Zealand National 57; ACT New Zealand 5; United Future 1. 
New clause 10 not agreed to.
Henare Tau: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Questions to Members 
Henare Tau: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Questions to Members 
[Volume:675;Page:21055] 
7. 
Hon TAU HENARE (National) 
 to the  
Minister for Social Development and Employment 
: What reports has she received on the latest benefit figures? 
Hon PAULA BENNETT (Minister for Social Development and Employment) 
: 
 Numbers put out today say that last month the number of people receiving the unemployment benefit was 55974. That is the lowest it has been since July 2009 a drop of 18 percent since its peak in January last year when 68369 people were on the unemployment benefit. In August the number of people on the unemployment benefit dropped by 1145 with half of the decrease due to more young people going into work. The overall number of New Zealanders on benefits is 328355. 
Hon Tau Henare 
: How many young people came off the benefit and went into work during August? 
Hon PAULA BENNETT 
: In August 2471 18 to 24-year-olds cancelled their main benefit to move into work. We have seen the number of young people on the unemployment benefit drop by 32 percent from 23545 in January 2010 to 15980—the highest we saw the numbers go down during the economic downturn.
Vote: Employment Relations (Secret Ballot for Strikes) Amendment Bill — In Committee 
Vote: Employment Relations (Secret Ballot for Strikes) Amendment Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:675;Page:21124] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the amendment be agreed to. 
Ayes 63 
New Zealand National 57; ACT New Zealand 5; United Future 1. 
Noes 56 
New Zealand Labour 42; Green Party 8; Maori Party 3; Progressive 1; Mana 1; Independent: Carter C. 
Amendment agreed to.
Mallard Trevor: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
Mallard Trevor: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20832] 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD (Labour—Hutt South) 
: 
 Mr Speaker— 
Hon Simon Power 
: You have got to be joking. 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD 
: I am seeing a level of anxiety on the part of the Acting Leader of the House and the spectators who have come in to sit behind him. Some of them are looking in a certain state of disarray I might say. I cannot tell whether they are reaching for their Compaqs or their tweets. 
The Opposition supports the bill but abhors the process. It is a sad day when an offer to put a bill through in much much less time than this was turned down by the Minister in charge of the bill—all for the sake of sending it to a select committee for a couple of hours.
Nash Stuart: Education Amendment Bill (No 4) — In Committee 
Nash Stuart: Education Amendment Bill (No 4) — In Committee 
[Volume:675;Page:20834] 
STUART NASH (Labour) 
: 
 I am following on from David Shearer who obviously had an amazing contribution to make having been part of the Education and Science Committee. Like David I have a few concerns about this move. Education is obviously a very important export earner for New Zealand. It brings in a lot of dollars and I think it is one of those things that flies under the radar a little bit in the sense that not many people are aware of the good work that is done by our education sector in promoting New Zealand in a number of ways. For example I have heard many stories—well not many; a few stories—OK one story about people who were educated in New Zealand. They came over here got a good education— 
The CHAIRPERSON (Eric Roy) 
: I am sorry to interrupt the member but the time has come for me to leave the Chair. 
Debate interrupted.
Katene Rahui: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
Katene Rahui: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20831] 
RAHUI KATENE (Maori Party—Te Tai Tonga) 
: 
 If anyone was in any doubt about the impact of natural disasters on the psyche the well-being and the functioning of a nation a cursory look at  
Hansard  
for this year would put a stop to it. If one was in any further doubt one would just need to listen to members on the other side of the House and the way they have been filibustering these last 2 hours. The census of population and dwellings scheduled for 8 March 2011 was cancelled because of the 22 February 2011 earthquake. The Canterbury earthquake utterly affected the viability of the census in 2011 so the Governor-General has since revoked the formal proclamation of 8 March 2011 as the census date. The Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill responds to that situation and sets in place also the infrastructure and the administration required to run the next census which is scheduled to take place on Tuesday 5 March 2013. This bill amends the Statistics Act 1975 to enact the Government’s decision to defer the census to 2013. Basically the amendment in this bill removes the requirement that a census be undertaken this year. It is a mere technicality. There is no reason to drag this out any further. I commend this bill to the House.
Bakshi Kanwaljit Singh: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
Bakshi Kanwaljit Singh: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20831] 
KANWALJIT SINGH BAKSHI (National) 
: 
 It is my pleasure to take a call on the third reading of the Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Matters) Bill. This is a non-controversial bill and I commend it to the House.
Mallard Trevor: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
Mallard Trevor: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20824] 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD (Labour—Hutt South) 
: 
 The question now is whether the bill is appropriately titled. I think it is not. I think the title is an indication of a rort. It is called the Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill. Actually to be fair it should be titled the “Census Deferral Bill” or the “Ability to Appoint Your Successor for a Period of 2 Years Bill” as far as Part 2 is concerned. There could well be a number of better titles for this bill. 
I think part of the title works pretty well. The end of the title has the year “2011”. I think that is appropriate and I think it is pretty much unanimous that we will support that. But I invite the Minister in the chair the Minister of Statistics to consider even at this late stage whether he has a mind to—it is a bit like truth in sentencing; we could ask Rodney Hide whether he had a better name for it—give us a title for this bill that more accurately reflects its contents. 
The CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch) 
: We are actually debating clauses 1 and 2 not just clause 1. 
Hon Trevor Mallard 
: Oh I could have gone on for longer. 
The CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch) 
: I am just making it very clear. We will put the clauses separately when it comes to the vote but the question is that clauses 1 and 2 stand part.
Williamson Maurice: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
Williamson Maurice: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20818] 
Hon MAURICE WILLIAMSON (Minister of Statistics) 
: 
 Just to deal with a couple of the matters that Mr Hipkins raised all we are doing is changing the wording of the Statistics Act 1975. In the wording it says that a census will be held “in the year 1976 and in every fifth year thereafter.” All we are doing is substituting “2013” for “1976”. So yes the wording “every fifth year thereafter” stays in the legislation and therefore there will be a census 5 years on from 2013. 
I also re-emphasise the point that Mr Hipkins gets and that Mr Mallard does not—that is there are different times during the course of a calendar year in which people are distributed quite dramatically differently over the country. For example members of Parliament would nearly always be back in their electorates from halfway through December to halfway through January but would nearly always be stuck here in Wellington if we were to conduct the census some time—I do not know—when the House is not— 
Chris Hipkins 
: That’s the Minister’s problem: he is completely beholden to the bureaucrats. 
Hon MAURICE WILLIAMSON 
: Yes I am beholden to the bureaucrats—that is right! I am beholden to the 4.2 million New Zealanders who like to move around. It is quite a clear problem if we were to take a census at a time other than March. There are also issues with regard to daylight saving. It is also about the enumerators wanting to be at the households where they have to do the drops and the pick-ups during daylight hours. We could not be doing it right now in June July or August. Then we have the Christmas rush and so on. I do not think any great deal of explanation is needed about it. 
The last thing that the member asked was whether I could give him an assurance that the census would allow for the electoral boundaries to be done. Actually that has had tighter time frames in the past. If we think about the census that was conducted in March 2001 we see that boundary changes were made for the 2002 election. It is nearly 2 years: the census is in March 2013 and the election will be sort of November 2014. So there is plenty of time for the Representation Commission to get its work done to get its draft boundaries— 
Hon Simon Power 
: Excellent contribution. 
Hon MAURICE WILLIAMSON 
: Thank you.
Dalziel Lianne: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
Dalziel Lianne: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20810] 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL (Labour—Christchurch East) 
: 
 I apologise; I meant to do this after my contribution to the debate. I seek leave to table the draft document for discussion marked “Confidential not Government policy”— 
CERA: Residential Red Zone Offers—Summary of Sale Process 
. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Is there any objection to that course of action being taken? 
Chris Tremain 
: Can I seek clarification about this document? 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Clarification? 
Chris Tremain 
: Is this document previously available in the public domain? So it has not been presented by the Canterbury Earthquake Recovery Authority in the public domain. 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL 
: No I downloaded it from a Facebook page. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Is there any objection to that course of action? There is.
Huo Raymond: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
Huo Raymond: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20818] 
RAYMOND HUO (Labour) 
: 
 Ni hao. I say a big thankyou to the Minister of Statistics for that valuable contribution—that excellent contribution. My colleagues Chris Hipkins Trevor Mallard and Charles Chauvel spoke earlier in a detailed way as to why Labour believes that it would have been very important to have a select committee hearing on the bill. There are lots of important issues that will not be addressed so it is not only about the process but also about the essence of the bill. 
For instance as I said in my first reading speech there is an increasing demand from iwi for statistical information as more Treaty settlements are agreed. Statistics New Zealand as I understand is working with iwi to identify what types of statistics would be most useful for collective management of transferred assets. I have two questions. Given that we are ramming the bill through under urgency and there is no avenue for us to debate this issue at a select committee I would be very grateful for the Minister to enlighten us. I am wondering whether the Minister has ever considered firstly whether the issue could be addressed in consideration of the 2013 census and secondly what types of statistics would best serve Maori to support the management of assets obtained from Treaty settlements. Those are my two questions and I would be very grateful if the Minister could enlighten us.
Goudie Sandra: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
Goudie Sandra: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20815] 
SANDRA GOUDIE (National—Coromandel) 
: 
 I support the previous contributions made by my colleagues and reiterate the fact that the Minister of Statistics has quite clearly explained this Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill. It would have been helpful to the House if the Opposition had actually listened to the Minister’s very good explanation and actually read the bill so they understood it. I am delighted that the Minister has brought this bill to the House.
Hayes John: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
Hayes John: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20812] 
JOHN HAYES (National—Wairarapa) 
: 
 That last 10 minutes of this House’s time was a very good reason why nobody in New Zealand should vote for the Labour Party in the next election. The issue in the second reading of the Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill is about two points. The first point is that a sensible decision was made to postpone the census following the earthquake in Canterbury and the second point is that the census needs to be held again as soon as possible within the law and this bill provides for that. I commend the bill to the House. Thank you.
Bakshi Kanwaljit Singh: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
Bakshi Kanwaljit Singh: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20803] 
KANWALJIT SINGH BAKSHI (National) 
: 
 I thank Mr Assistant Speaker Roy for the opportunity to participate in the first reading of the Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill. This bill allows legislation to be changed in order to hold the 2011 census in 2013. The census of 2011 was postponed following the 22 February earthquake in Canterbury. 
This bill also includes amendments to modernise the delegation powers of the Chief Parliamentary Counsel to enable the delegation of his or her functions responsibilities duties and powers. I commend this bill to the House.
Hayes John: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
Hayes John: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20798] 
JOHN HAYES (National—Wairarapa) 
: 
 I am absolutely dumbstruck and dumbfounded— 
Hon Trevor Mallard 
: Just dumb. 
JOHN HAYES 
: —or maybe just dumb probably like the last speaker—because it is just astonishing. We had an earthquake in Christchurch and we have a legal obligation to conduct a census every 5 years and that last speaker Raymond Huo said that Labour would not support the Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill. It is absolutely astonishing. That member is an accountant and he is locked up in the figure of $17.685 million of whatever. That is irrelevant. The core issue is this. It is very simple. We made a decision to postpone the census following the 22 February earthquake in Canterbury. The census collects vital information. We cannot do it at the moment because of the problems in Canterbury. That is why this legislation is before the House. This evening I have been using—and I just show my colleagues—a diagram I have discussed with the Prime Minister based on the 2010 statistics. They show how people from Masterton and provincial New Zealand are moving into our cities and we have a waist in the demographic of missing 20 to 50-year-olds in our workforce in the Wairarapa. This is very important information and this is why we need to have a census. As I said because of the legal obligation we must pass this legislation through the House tonight. Thank you. 
I seek leave to table this original piece of work on the floor of the Chamber. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Eric Roy) 
: What is the origin of that document? 
JOHN HAYES 
: Me based on Statistics New Zealand data. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Eric Roy) 
: It is not a public document. It is a piece of information produced by the member. Leave is sought for that purpose. Is there anyone opposed to that course of action? There is.
Goudie Sandra: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
Goudie Sandra: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20805] 
SANDRA GOUDIE (National—Coromandel) 
: 
 I am delighted to get up and talk to the Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill. I commend the Minister of Statistics for making the sensible decision to postpone the census following the 22 February earthquake in Canterbury. This census could not have been successfully completed given the national state of emergency in Christchurch and the probable impact on census results. Of course there has also been significant impact on census staff and extensive damage to Statistics New Zealand buildings in Christchurch as well as upheaval for the people of Christchurch. 
I note the example of the hypothetical family of Cherie Richard Cherise and Darien who have had to relocate from their home and who have no idea when they may go back into their home. That would affect a census whenever it was held and I commend the Minister for his excellent response to this crisis.
Vote: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
Vote: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20806] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill be now read a first time. 
Ayes 76 
New Zealand National 57; Green Party 9; ACT New Zealand 5; Maori Party 3; United Future 1; Independent: Carter C. 
Noes 43 
New Zealand Labour 42; Progressive 1. 
Bill read a first time.
Kaye Nikki: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
Kaye Nikki: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20801] 
NIKKI KAYE (National—Auckland Central) 
: 
 I am delighted to speak on the Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill. This bill is supposed to be non-controversial. However I am absolutely shocked that Labour is opposing it. 
We understand why this legislation has to be before the House. The census was postponed as a result of the Canterbury earthquakes. The earthquakes were devastating to our country. Over 180 people lost their lives thousands of people lost their houses and some people lost their limbs. This bill is about restoring our ability to hold that national census. Actually it is about restoring the heart of our democracy in this country. We know that many people have shifted between electorates and I am shocked that Labour does not support this legislation that will enable us to determine how many people are living in electorates. That cuts to the core of our parliamentary democracy. 
I commend this bill to the House because it is about restoring what happened as a result of Canterbury and ensuring parliamentary democracy reigns. I am shocked that Labour does not support this bill.
Vote: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
Vote: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20777] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That clause 2 as amended be agreed to. 
Ayes 66 
New Zealand National 57; ACT New Zealand 5; Maori Party 3; United Future 1. 
Noes 53 
New Zealand Labour 42; Green Party 9; Progressive 1; Independent: Carter C. 
Clause 2 as amended agreed to. 
Bill reported with amendment. 
Report adopted.
Vote: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
Vote: Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20815] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
The Duties of Statutory Officers (Census and Other Remedial Provisions) Bill be now read a second time. 
Ayes 75 
New Zealand National 57; Green Party 9; ACT New Zealand 5; Maori Party 3; United Future 1. 
Noes 44 
New Zealand Labour 42; Progressive 1; Independent: Carter C. 
Bill read a second time.
Dalziel Lianne: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
Dalziel Lianne: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20777] 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL (Labour—Christchurch East) 
: 
 I shall be mercifully brief as a result of the indulgence of the Committee. I wanted to take a call on clause 2 of the Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill because it is of course the commencement clause. There are several commencement dates. They traverse all the different elements of this particular bill. 
The reason why I wanted to raise this clause in the Committee of the whole House is there is a significant discussion in the regulatory impact statement about the trust law concerns that arise from this change to the law. This is the issue that I think is particularly relevant to the commencement dates that have been chosen. “The Law Commission is currently undertaking a review of trust law in New Zealand and is expected to release an issues paper shortly. Officials have met with the Law Commission to discuss concerns and will continue to follow the Commission’s progress. The review will broadly consider the various uses of trusts where legal ownership of property is transferred to a trust but control and enjoyment of that property is retained. New forms of regulation such as a central trust register and the compulsory filing of annual trust accounts are among the ideas that have been raised for reform. Such reforms would help deal with information concerns that may arise as a result of the repeal of gift duty. The Law Commission’s work is ongoing and may continue for some time.” 
The point I wanted to make is that given that work is being undertaken to address a number of the concerns we have raised about the exposure the Government allows by abolishing the gift duty for it to do so prior to the completion of this work and the work of a number of departments is I think more than unfortunate. 
The CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Thank you for that and thank you for the Committee’s indulgence.
Dalziel Lianne: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
Dalziel Lianne: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20776] 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL (Labour—Christchurch East) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Chairperson. I felt that you had sought the assistance of the Committee to deal with what is a difficult situation. I listened very carefully to the Chair and clause 2 was not called. If clauses 1 and 2 had both been called I would have taken the call then. In fact I leaned over to the junior Opposition whip and I asked when clause 2 would be called. I really felt that your asking the Committee whether anyone objected to my taking a brief call on clause 2 under these circumstances would be useful. I do not think there is any point in recalling the Speaker back for this if we can resolve it as a Committee. 
The CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson) 
: I accept what the member says and I am prepared to ask the Committee to let the member have a call. Is there any objection to that course of action being taken? There is none.
Dunne Peter: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
Dunne Peter: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20776] 
Hon PETER DUNNE (Minister of Revenue) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Chairperson. I just make a query as this is a matter for the Committee. You have put amendments to clause 2 have you not? So my only query is whether we have actually commenced voting on clause 2. 
The CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson) 
: We actually did vote on the Minister’s amendments as amended to clause 2 set out on Supplementary Order Paper 254 so because we have already voted on the amendments it means we are unfortunately unable to go back to clause 2. We have already voted on the amendments.
Vote: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
Vote: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20776] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the amendments as amended be agreed to. 
Ayes 66 
New Zealand National 57; ACT New Zealand 5; Maori Party 3; United Future 1. 
Noes 53 
New Zealand Labour 42; Green Party 9; Progressive 1; Independent: Carter C. 
Amendments as amended agreed to. 
The CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson) 
: The question now is that clause 2 as amended stand part. 
Hon Lianne Dalziel 
: Can I take a call on clause 2? 
The CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Technically when the vote was called for clauses 1 and 2—
Delahunty Catherine: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
Delahunty Catherine: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20776] 
CATHERINE DELAHUNTY (Green) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Chairperson. I have just been informed that we are not casting their vote so I am not voting. 
The CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Can the member be clear: is that for the Mana party or the Green Party? 
CATHERINE DELAHUNTY 
: The Mana party. 
The CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson) 
: We have had a number of votes for the Mana party. Are all the other votes in order? 
CATHERINE DELAHUNTY 
: No they are not. Could you just delete those votes. I have just been informed we are not voting for Mana at this time. 
The CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson) 
: So all those votes that were given for Mana previously are to be deleted? 
CATHERINE DELAHUNTY 
: Thank you yes. 
The CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson) 
: The member has to seek leave for that to happen. 
CATHERINE DELAHUNTY 
: I seek leave for the votes posted for the Mana Party to be removed. We are not voting on its behalf at this time. 
The CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Is there any objection to that course of action being taken? There is none.
Ross Jami-Lee: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
Ross Jami-Lee: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20775] 
JAMI-LEE ROSS (National—Botany) 
: 
 I move  
That the question be now put 
.
Adams Amy: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
Adams Amy: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20772] 
AMY ADAMS (National—Selwyn) 
: 
 I move  
That the question be now put 
.
Huo Raymond: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
Huo Raymond: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20763] 
RAYMOND HUO (Labour) 
: 
 With respect I think the Minister was wrong. 
Aaron Gilmore 
: Cutting. 
RAYMOND HUO 
: That member can take a call. The reason why I said the Minister was wrong is simply that estate duties were abolished in 1992 but gift duties remained in place not only for revenue but for a very good purpose. Gift duties remained in place to prevent people from giving away large assets in order to avoid paying creditors to obtain access to Government advantage or to avoid tax liabilities. 
I am inspired by the Minister’s press release published in November last year which I will read out: “Earlier this year I announced”—that is I the Minister not me—“that the Government’s intention to remove gift duty if concerns regarding creditor protection”— 
Simon Bridges 
: Who’s speaking? Is this Raymond or the Minister? 
RAYMOND HUO 
: —the member will listen please—“and social assistance targeting could be addressed.” said Mr Dunne. He went on to say: “Since my announcement there has been considerable work done by officials across government to assess the concerns. This work has revealed that the protection that gift duty offers in the areas of income tax creditors and social assistance has only ever been incidental and very limited.” That is a rather interesting position. 
I was not sitting on the Finance and Expenditure Committee for this particular bill but I had access to the submission from the New Zealand Institute of Chartered Accountants. I am sure the new chair of the select committee Amy Adams will be even more informed in this area. The submission from the New Zealand Institute of Chartered Accountants notes a number of tax-avoidance opportunities that may arise in the absence of gift duty and the institute established at least five such scenarios. The Law Society and a number of other submitters raised a further concern that the abolition of gift duty would create problems for the enforcement of claims under the Property (Relationships) Act 1976 and the Family Protection Act 1955. Of course those submissions are from the lawyers and accountants the Minister just described using very interesting language. 
Even Inland Revenue Department officials cautioned in the regulatory impact statement that tax avoidance could increase in the absence of the duty. I will quote: “it is not possible to precisely determine the extent to which gift duty alleviates issues such as income tax minimisation social assistance targeting and defeat of creditors.” On that note I wish that the Minister would take a call and enlighten us in that area. Thank you.
Vote: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
Vote: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20760] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That Part 1 as amended be agreed to. 
Ayes 110 
New Zealand National 57; New Zealand Labour 42; ACT New Zealand 5; Maori Party 4; Progressive 1; United Future 1. 
Noes 10 
Green Party 9; Independent: Carter C. 
Part 1 as amended agreed to.
Goodhew Jo: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
Goodhew Jo: Taxation (Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20773] 
JO GOODHEW (Junior Whip—National) 
: 
 I move  
That the question be now put 
.
Gilmore Aaron: Student Loan Scheme Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
Gilmore Aaron: Student Loan Scheme Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20752] 
AARON GILMORE (National) 
: 
 I am going to take only a very short call here because a lot of things have been said about the Student Loan Scheme Bill already. What this bill does is simplify the procedures for all those students out there across the country so they can access the information on their loans and we think that is a good thing. This bill also puts in place mechanisms to recover from those people who do not perform under the student loan contract. That is a good thing. It also puts in place a mechanism where those student borrowers throughout New Zealand and overseas pay some of the costs of the administration of that scheme. We think that is a fair thing. Those $40 annual administration fees will recover a fraction of the $22 million in annual administration charges paid by the Inland Revenue Department. If that turns out to be over-recovery in the future—and the Opposition seems to think that fear exists—there is the ability in regulation to lower the fee in time so it can be cheaper. Also with the $60 establishment fee that will be paid towards the $17 million that the Ministry of Social Development incurs there is an ability to reduce that fee in time should that be too expensive. All in all this is a good bill. It helps put in place a more efficient student loan system. We commend the bill to the House. Thank you.
Vote: Student Loan Scheme Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
Vote: Student Loan Scheme Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20753] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That the Student Loan Scheme Bill be now read a third time. 
Ayes 110 
New Zealand National 57; New Zealand Labour 42; ACT New Zealand 5; Maori Party 4; Progressive 1; United Future 1. 
Noes 10 
Green Party 9; Independent: Carter C. 
Bill read a third time.
Woodhouse Michael: Student Loan Scheme Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
Woodhouse Michael: Student Loan Scheme Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20753] 
MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (National) 
: 
 I will take just a quick call—in fact my only call today—on the Student Loan Scheme Bill. In the debate we have referred to interest-free student loans and indeed the Government has accepted that the electorate says that interest-free student loans are important. The Government commits to them. But it strikes me that the term “interest-free student loan” is something of a misnomer because of course the loan is not interest-free. It is just a question of who pays the interest. At this stage it happens to be New Zealand taxpayers. So while they have the burden of paying the interest on behalf of students I think it behoves the Government to ensure that the scheme is administered well and that the repayment levels are optimal. 
That leads nicely on to the second issue that is being discussed today. The problem right now is not whether the loans are interest-free but whether the loans are paid back. The fact is that at the moment about 45 percent of the loans are written off. Mr Hipkins makes clever use of statistics about the speed with which those who do pay their loans off pay them off which is true but the fact is that nearly half of them do not. Many of those people are overseas. So I applaud the improvements in the bill that will ensure that graduates and other borrowers have better mechanisms by which to pay. Like Mr Robertson I received calls from people overseas who said they would like to come back but the burden of the student loan had become so great that they were reluctant to do so. 
The third and final thing I will touch on is the basis of the administration fee which as I understand it was introduced under the Labour Government. Therefore it is not a question of the principle but of degree. Certainly the costs of administering the scheme have improved dramatically but an annual collection of $8 million to $9 million in fees represents only about 0.75 percent of the total loan base. So I cannot agree with Mr Robertson when he says this is interest by stealth. 
Overall I think this is an excellent bill and I commend it.
Vote: Student Loan Scheme Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
Vote: Student Loan Scheme Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20740] 
A party vote was called for on the question  
That Part 5 be agreed to. 
Ayes 67 
New Zealand National 57; ACT New Zealand 5; Maori Party 4; United Future 1. 
Noes 53 
New Zealand Labour 42; Green Party 9; Progressive 1; Independent: Carter C. 
Part 5 agreed to.
Dunne Peter: Student Loan Scheme Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
Dunne Peter: Student Loan Scheme Bill — In Committee Third Reading 
[Volume:675;Page:20740] 
Hon PETER DUNNE (Minister of Revenue) 
: 
 I move  
That the Student Loan Scheme Bill be now read a third time 
. The measures contained in this bill are designed to make it easier for borrowers to manage their loans and to pay back what they owe which in turn will help the Government to better manage this substantial Crown asset. 
The first of these measures sets the framework for consolidated loan information to be provided electronically to borrowers by the Inland Revenue Department. Borrowers will be able to access information on their loan balance and manage their repayment responsibilities wherever they are and at any time. This includes borrowers who are currently studying so they will no longer have to contact two agencies for this information. In addition the majority of borrowers with income from salary and wages only will benefit from reduced compliance costs as a result of the removal of the current annual end-of-year assessment. However borrowers who have significantly overpaid their pay-period obligation will be able to apply for a refund. The result of these changes will be a simpler more effective way for borrowers to self-manage their loan responsibilities and a more efficient cost-effective framework for the Inland Revenue Department to manage its interactions with all borrowers in New Zealand and overseas. 
At the same time the bill recognises the importance of borrowers honouring their repayment obligations. To further encourage borrowers to take a responsible approach to their loan the bill simplifies the current penalty rules that apply when borrowers fail to make loan repayments when they should and strengthens the ability of the Commissioner of Inland Revenue to recall a loan in cases of serious non-compliance. 
These are the main features of the bill. I would like at this point to acknowledge those whose efforts have contributed towards the successful passage of this legislation so far. I thank my officials and the drafters who have worked on the detail of the bill and those who made submissions on the bill to help improve the practical application of the measures it contains. I thank the Finance and Expenditure Committee too for its consideration of the proposed reforms and its recommendations to give greater clarity to the legislation. 
As it now stands this bill will make it easier for borrowers to take responsibility for repaying their loans and will make it easier for the Inland Revenue Department to administer this important investment for the future. Consequently I have a huge amount of pleasure in once more commending this bill to the House.