Wagner NickyHon NICKY WAGNER (National): Tēnā koe e Te Mana Whakawā. National does not support this bill and even though Rino Tirikatene does not want me to appreciate his work I just want to note the work of all the Māori MPs who have brought this bill to the House. I sat on the Māori Affairs Committee I listened to the discussion and I thought that the process was very worthwhile. It's interesting that currently there are very few constitutional provisions that are entrenched in electoral law in New Zealand. In fact there are only six. There's the term of Parliament the age for voting the division of New Zealand in terms of general electorates the adjustment of the electoral allowance quota the use of the secret ballot the fact we have two votes under MMP and the establishment of a Representation Commission. As we know originally Māori seats were introduced as a temporary solution to the condition that property ownership was a prerequisite to be able to vote and communal Māori land ownership meant that Māori did not qualify. This of course in the days of universal suffrage is no longer relevant and even at the time it was never expected that the Māori seats would be a long-term solution. In fact until 1996 and the introduction of MMP there were only four seats which meant that the Māori vote did not have the same weight or influence as a general seat vote. However with the introduction of MMP in 1996 the number of Māori seats was set by the same calculation as general seats. Today a vote in the Māori seat is exactly equal to a vote in a general seat so separate Māori seats do not give Māori any greater voting power.Also the importance of individual electorates—general or Māori—are not as great under MMP because the overall number of seats gained by any party is not determined by the electorate winnings but by the party vote.Now back in 1985-86 there was a royal commission on the electoral system. That gave considerable thought about how we should run our elections and what we should do and the future of the Māori seats. They concluded at that time that the Māori seats had not helped Māori and that they would achieve better representation under an MMP system. They recommended that New Zealand adopt an MMP system which we did. They also recommended that New Zealand abolish the Māori seats which we didn't do. As previously discussed since 1996 and the introduction of MMP the numbers of Māori seats have been set at the same quota calculated for general seats so Māori have equal representation in the New Zealand Parliament.Now I really enjoyed listening to the submissions at the Māori Affairs Committee. We heard a variety of opinions about the Māori seats and about their entrenchment. Some saw them as historically important and as a taonga that should be preserved for ever. Others saw them as separatist and bad for New Zealand. Some believe that the entrenchment of the Māori seats is consistent with the principles of the Treaty of Waitangi. Others disagreed and believed that it would undermine the principles of the Treaty and the ability of New Zealanders to be equal and to move forward together.Some said that the Māori seats were essential to give Māori a voice but others disputed that saying that Māori are already strongly represented in general electorates and in party lists. In fact it's really interesting to note that Māori are represented in the leadership of all major parties in this Parliament. As a National MP I'm very proud that both our leader and deputy leader are of Māori descent.Now if we go back to the original establishment of the Māori seats and the debate in Parliament at the time Hansard tells us that they were seen as a mechanism to bridge a gap—to bridge a gap—until Māori could sit side by side with Pākehā and be elected into Parliament as of right and on merit. Now today there are 30 MPs in the 52nd Parliament across five parties. The majority are not here because of the Māori seats. They have come through the general seats or they have come on party lists. They have come on merit. That tells me that Māori have indeed bridged that gap and today that Māori and non-Māori and I can see it across the House sit side by side and on an equal footing in this Parliament.Now it's interesting to see that not all Māori choose to be on the Māori roll. The number of electors of Māori descent choosing to enrol in the Māori roll increased really sharply between 1993 and 1996 because that was coinciding with electoral reforms which allowed the number of Māori seats to reflect the result of the Māori electoral option and changed the days of the four seats.There was also another increase between 1999 and the 2002 election. That saw the number of Māori seats increase to seven. That was followed by a plateauing and since 2011 the enrolment of electors of Māori descent has been slowly decreasing. Currently just over half of those of Māori descent choose to be on the Māori roll. In 2017 there were 476798 electors of Māori descent enrolled. Of those electors 52.8 percent were on the Māori roll and 47.2 percent were on the general roll.As I have said previously and want to make it very clear whether you are on the general or the Māori roll your vote has equal influence or weighting. National believes that it's a good thing that Māori representation has increased and we're seeing Māori in both general and list seats across all parties. Our policy is that we will not remove the Māori seats until Māori decide that they are no longer needed. Our priority is to conclude Treaty settlements and processes and to support and encourage full potential of Māori.We're committed to ensuring that Māori succeed alongside other New Zealanders in terms of health quality of life and socially culturally and economically. The social investment approach and Whānau Ora have been hugely beneficial for Māori in past years. We want to see them continue but we don't believe there is a good reason to entrench the Māori seats. Indeed we believe it would be very odd to entrench the Māori seats when other important aspects of the electoral system are not entrenched. For example it's not entrenched the number of MPs. We haven't entrenched the MMP process for selecting candidates. We haven't entrenched the 5 percent threshold. So despite the interesting discussion that has happened through the select committee despite the work of Rino Tirikatene and previous Māori MPs National will not support the entrenchment of the Māori seats. Kia ora.