Uffindell SamSAM UFFINDELL (National—Tauranga): Thank you Madam Chair. Just going back to what the Minister was saying before about how things would be communicated out—and Minister you noted that it would be on websites and publications. It would just be good for anyone at home who's tuning in or may later want to understand where to look for this: on what websites and publications would notices be made available? You know 15 days is a pretty short time and a lot of people aren't as politically attuned as what we are. I'd imagine most members of the public aren't trawling through union websites to see when their collective bargaining process is kicking off and what their obligations are under that. So if there's a bit more clarity around that. I was also wondering whether the Minister had considered—if it is just going to be on a union website or on an employer's website—whether any research has been done around how often people actually engage with those sites; whether there are any other ways to notify. And Minister you mentioned phone calls. If you're looking at the retail sector for instance that's a significant number of phone calls. So I'm just a little bit concerned here around the practicalities of that and whether people will actually get visibility of what they need to. Around the 15 days I'm curious as to how that time was landed on. That is a pretty short time frame considering whether the penalties are not engaging and also perhaps people are completely unaware—I know a lot of people just watch sport and reality TV and aren't looking for this sort of stuff to pop up on their radar. All of a sudden an inspector turns up and says Boo! You haven't been doing what you're meant to." And all of a sudden they're faced with penalties. So I can understand the intentions around it but I would also want to wade through the—not saying that I agree with the intentions but I would also want to explore how practical all of this is and the communication to the key stakeholders involved. Going back to clause 29A(1)(b)(ii)—the test for initiating bargaining—"they have a lack of pay progression in their employment" how are we determining that? Are we looking through employment contracts and saying that they must be locking in a pay increase every year? I know in several of my employment contracts I haven't had anything stipulated around that. So is it a backward-looking thing? Because what this clause looks like is that it's a forward-looking piece and it is quite uncommon—well it's not necessarily common for employment contracts to stipulate that you will have your wage increased at X amount per year whether it be 2 percent 3 percent; heaven forbid for employers if it was at Consumers Price Index but I know the workers would definitely appreciate that. So just wanting to get a bit of clarity around how that was landed on.In the time I've got left I'd like to jump over to contractual uncertainty including performing short-term seasonal work or working on an intermittent or irregular basis. Look the reality is that a lot of people do work on a contractual basis. And some of that is just the way we've been moving; a lot of it is also just the way people actually want to operate. A lot of people are stepping out of traditional employment with a big employer and putting out their services as they see fit—as they should be able to see fit frankly in a free society—on a contractual basis. I'll take a couple of industries and I'll go with the tech one for starters: a lot of people there contract themselves out. A lot of people in that sector also don't necessarily get paid a lot because they're going into young companies—start-ups or whatever you want to phrase them as—and a lot of their pay isn't actually through wages but through equity. And they're buying something in the hope of being part of something that goes well. Are you then going to say to all of these companies which are on pretty short runways as far as cash flow is concerned "Yeah we understand that you've given your employees share plans but we don't really care about it; we're really concerned that you're paying them a low weekly wage;"—or whatever it may be—"we're now going to apply an industry standard"—which is inevitably going to be set by much more established players—"and force these little companies to have to cough up with a lot more than they would be able"—CHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salesa): Order! The member's time is up."