8. Question No. 8—ImmigrationERICA STANFORD (National—East Coast Bays) to the Minister of ImmigrationQuestion No. 8—Immigration8. ERICA STANFORD (National—East Coast Bays) to the Minister of Immigration: Does he still stand by his statement that There's some evidence that when people come from offshore and get into nursing roles that they might leave a bit sooner – if they get residence"; if so how many of the 6 percent of migrant nurses that exited nursing in 2020 referenced by the Minister in the House yesterday did so after gaining residency?Hon KRIS FAAFOI (Minister of Immigration): Yes the exit rate data that is provided by the Nursing Council to the Ministry of Health is based on the overseas origin of a nurse's qualification rather than their visa status. Another useful measure for exit rates and retention issues was stated by the Aged Care Association in both the consultation with officials and in public statements by the chief executive Simon Wallace that they have a significant retention issue which can be as high as 48 percent. In addition the Ministry of Health shared concerns with the Ministry of Business Innovation and Employment officials about the retention and exit rates of nurses. This was the point of having a two-year work-to-residence requirement which the Government has extended to 13 classes of nurses. As I've said before we welcome nurses to New Zealand and offer certainty of residency under our settings. Workforce participation data is not recorded upon the grant of residence for any migrant as from that point they are free to work for anyone anywhere.Erica Stanford: Point of order Mr Speaker. The second part of the question on notice—how many of the 6 percent left after gaining residence—was not addressed answered or even got anywhere near addressing.DEPUTY SPEAKER: I'm going to get the Minister to repeat the answer to that part of the question.Hon KRIS FAAFOI: As I said in the primary answer workforce participation is not recorded upon the grant of residence for any migrant as from that point they are free to work for anyone anywhere.Erica Stanford: Does the Nursing Council data the Minister used yesterday in the House to justify not offering nurses immediate residence specifically record whether a migrant nurse gained residence before exiting the profession?Hon KRIS FAAFOI: I will repeat the section I just repeated: workforce participation data is not recorded upon the grant of residence for any migrant as from that point they are free to work for anyone anywhere. Erica Stanford: Then how can the Minister use and rely on that data provided by the Nursing Council to show that nurses are more likely to exit the profession after getting residence if that data doesn't actually record that?Hon KRIS FAAFOI: We didn't rely on that data alone. As I have said a number of times to a number of questions to the Minister as well as that data we engage with stakeholders who told us that there were retention issues and also with the Ministry of Health who also told us there were retention issues. That is why we offered a certainty of a two-year work-to-residency pathway for nurses so we can have them have certainty and also have nurses actually nurse. Erica Stanford: The retention issues that the Minister is talking about are those retention issues related to migrant nurses getting residence and then leaving the profession as he keeps stating ad nauseam in the media?Hon KRIS FAAFOI: As the data suggests there was concern about migrant nurses and retention as a whole. When we looked at the data and again with stakeholders and discussed the policy settings with the Minister of Health there were general retention issues as well. This is why we made sure that there was certainty for those migrant nurses who come to New Zealand with a two-year work-to-residency pathway.Ricardo Menéndez March: In light of his previous answer will he take broader consultation with the likes of New Zealand Nurses Organisation and other migrant nurses to review the residency pathway settings and ensure migrant nurses have equitable pathways to residency to match the likes of doctors and engineers?Hon KRIS FAAFOI: As we have said we have broadened the access to residency to one type of nurse to 13 types of nurse occupations and also given them certainty around residence. Again we are happy with the settings that we have undertaken because we looked at the data and engaged with the stakeholders who told us that there were retention issues. We've engaged with the Nurses Organisation since the rebalance. They've given us their concerns. We're taking that on board but we're happy with the settings as they are. Erica Stanford: How can he claim that there is evidence that migrant nurses stop nursing as he keeps saying in the media when they get residence when the only two stakeholders he engaged with have stated they have given him no such evidence; the Nursing Council data doesn't record whether or not they leave when they get residence; and the DHBs don't record whether or not they leave when they get residence?Hon KRIS FAAFOI: I can do that quite easily because the consultation and the issues and the data that we looked at led us to the position that the right setting was to make sure that when nurses come to New Zealand they actually nurse and that we give them certainty of a two-year work-to-residence pathway. Thank you very much.Dr James McDowall: Why doesn't the Minister just meet them in the middle and use section 50 of the Immigration Act so that he can fast track residency for nurses and to stop the problem that he's going on about?Hon KRIS FAAFOI: I will repeat the answer that I made in the previous answer: because we believe we've got the settings right."