SpeechLOUISA WALL (Labour): Tēnā koe e te Māngai o te Whare. It's my pleasure to speak on this the second reading of the Lawyers and Conveyancers (Employed Lawyers Providing Free Legal Services) Amendment Bill. I too would like to commend Chris Bishop who actually—his intention has huge merit. In fact allowing a lawyer who is an employee to do free legal work pro bono other than for the lawyer's employer on conditions set by the New Zealand Law Society as many have said had universal support at first reading. The merit was about improving access to justice and actually that remains I think an intention that we are committed to improving through I guess the assessment and analysis of this bill. Having not sat on the Justice Committee I want to congratulate and commend Ginny Andersen and the team within the Justice Committee. I've had personal experience with their work so I have no doubt that full due diligence was undertaken and they in good faith tried to find a solution to some of the issues that were highlighted.I think it's really important that people understand what those issues were. In fact the New Zealand Law Society in their submission did highlight the fact that an employed lawyer is potentially guilty of misconduct if they do legal work outside of the lawyer's employment. But more than that there were issues about providing free services and what that means in terms of adequate consumer protections. There are supervision requirements for example within those law practices. There are approval processes that have to be adhered to. There are client care obligations and actually the handling of client moneys. So the liability—nobody could ascertain where that lay and in fact if there was poor legal advice how could we then help the person that the system was being designed to support and would there be a requirement for that lawyer to hold professional indemnity insurance? Too many questions unfortunately that the select committee process could not answer.I do want to acknowledge the 22 submissions and the nine oral submissions. So the Law Society as a regulator—they in fact made a supplementary submission. There was a lack of policy work on the effectiveness of the proposed scheme. There had been no costing of the scheme and the best method to meet the unmet need had not been ascertained. So the intervention logic wasn't there but as I've said there's intent from the Government but also all the parties involved and the Law Society.I also want to highlight Community Law Centres o Aotearoa who acknowledged issues related to access to justice but from their perspective the issues related to access to justice are for specific groups of New Zealanders. Those New Zealanders are people with disabilities. Those New Zealanders are Māori tangata whenua. Those New Zealanders are single parents. Those New Zealanders are those who suffer economic disadvantage. So in fact the biggest issue that they had and the select committee had was matching that need with this proposal and matching that need with new investment that is obviously needed to make the intention of this bill actually work. That is the issue. That is the issue because if we allow this bill to go through in fact we probably would have exacerbated access to justice issues which would continue to contribute to inequitable access to lawyers. So that is at the heart of the select committee's recommendation to this House by majority that this bill not be passed.So I commend Chris Bishop for bringing this kaupapa to the House. I commend those 8000 lawyers who would like to contribute. I commend the Law Society for their contribution to this discussion. I commend Community Law Centres o Aotearoa. But at the end of the day it's pretty clear that any investment in this space any new resource must be targeted to ensure that those who are most disadvantaged in accessing legal services can receive them. Therefore I stand with my colleagues unfortunately for Chris Bishop in opposition not to his proposition not to his intention but to the fact that this bill unfortunately is not fit for purpose. Kia ora.