Ryall Tony: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Ryall Tony: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Volume:633;Page:5290] 
6.  
Hon TONY RYALL (National—Bay of Plenty) 
 to the  
Minister of Health 
: Is he satisfied with the health workforce; if not why not? 
Hon PETE HODGSON (Minister of Health) 
: 
 New Zealand has a hard-working world-class and growing health workforce. There are 5000 more doctors and nurses working in our public hospitals than there were in 1999. This Government wants to do even better however and I have today announced a new task force to progress and finalise a series of changes to medical training. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: Has he seen the concerns of the surgical workforce and others reported widely today that district health boards have been culling patients without specialist clinical input and can he guarantee that across the country patients have been culled from waiting lists under clinical supervision rather than being culled by a hospital manager more accountable to the Government’s political objectives than to patients’ health? 
Hon PETE HODGSON 
: I have seen reports of that nature and I have also seen reports in the media correcting the facts. In Canterbury the Canterbury District Health Board has encouraged specialists to talk to their colleagues in primary care and will continue to do so. Members may recall public notices issued jointly by the district health boards and primary health organisation providers which is further evidence of improving linkages between the primary and secondary sector in Canterbury. 
Maryan Street 
: Has he seen any reports on respect and support for New Zealand’s health workforce? 
Hon PETE HODGSON 
: Yes I have. I have seen a report today that a doctor with 30 years’ experience as a cardiologist along with the Dean of Medicine at Auckland University along with two professors of nursing with over 60 years’ combined experience and further a former president of the Royal New Zealand College of General Practitioners have been attacked by Tony Ryall and the National Party as “do-nothing bureaucrats”. The new members of the workforce task force are some of New Zealand’s most well-respected health professionals and I find Tony Ryall’s lack of respect for them appalling. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: Does the Minister stand by his answer that he gave two questions ago which suggested that he believes that the surgeons are lying when they say they were not involved in the culling of patients from Canterbury and what would he say to that surgical workforce which says there has been no clinical basis to the waiting list cull and that patients will die as a result of the Government-ordered data cleansing of waiting lists—a view that has been supported by specialists and managers around the country today? 
Hon PETE HODGSON 
: Yesterday the Canterbury District Health Board publicly apologised to patients and staff as a result of the way some patients have been referred back to general practitioners. They apologised for the way they have been referred back so that would suggest that in some cases there have been difficulties but the corrections to the allegations made yesterday morning do stand and are valid. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: Why does not the Minister admit that the waiting list cull is not about health is not about patient care and is not about clinical safety—it is all about cynical manipulation of the waiting list to claim some sort of pathetic credit; and is not that the reason why the surgical workforce around the country is nearly unanimous this week in its criticism of the Government and now the Association of Salaried Medical Specialists members of the Council of Trade Unions have accused this Minister personally of political indifference a preoccupation with data cleansing and arrogant political interference? 
Hon PETE HODGSON 
: No one can argue that this Government has not invested heavily in health. No one can argue with the fact that under this Labour-led Government we have 5000 more doctors and nurses working in our public hospitals. No one can argue with the fact that we have built more public hospitals than any Government in New Zealand’s history. We are proud of our record in health and we will keep working with health professionals to add to our successes. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: How will replacing the Health Workforce Advisory Committee with a new health workforce task force fix the staffing crisis; and surely after 40 reports visions strategies and surveys and 7 years this Government could give the country some action on our workforce crisis? 
Hon PETE HODGSON 
: I will remind the member that in attacking the series of reports that have been produced over the past few years he is actually attacking the health professionals and medical and nursing organisations that have prepared them. What happened was that we came out of the 1990s and therefore—[ 
Interruption 
] 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Please be seated. It is impossible to hear. Would members please keep it down so that other members can hear the replies. It is almost as though members do not want to hear the replies. 
Hon PETE HODGSON 
: I will remind the member that in attacking the series of reports that have been produced over the past few years the member is actually attacking the health professionals and medical and nursing organisations that have prepared them. What is more those reports were needed because coming out of the 1990s there was a view about that the Employment Contracts Act would do it and that planning for workforce was a wrong-headed idea. That is why this country ran out of radiation therapists and dental therapists and why we had shortages all over the place. This Government is progressively addressing those things because we do not have a free-market approach to the health workforce of this country. 
Dr Jackie Blue 
: Has the Minister seen his ministry’s latest breast-screening data for women aged 45 to 49 years of age which shows that only one woman in five has actually been screened—which is exactly what the previous Minister of Health was told would happen—and what will he do to sort out the health workforce crisis so that women are not at risk of dying of breast cancer? 
Hon PETE HODGSON 
: The number of women with breast cancer is climbing very quickly. In the area of 45 to 49-year-olds it is climbing much less quickly but that is because this Government extended the breast screening to two separate age groups and as a result of that more women now have more testing for breast screening than ever before and more women are being protected by the early detection of breast cancer than ever before. 
Nathan Guy 
: Is the Minister satisfied with the full-time emergency ambulance workforce in places like Horowhenua where numerous emergencies are attended by single-crew ambulances—with one example being when a Levin patient with severe chest pains remained in an unstable condition all the way to Palmerston North Hospital with no one monitoring the patient—and will the Minister now acknowledge that lives are being put at risk as there are single-crew ambulances all over provincial areas of the North Island and what will he do about this extremely urgent health workforce issue? 
Hon PETE HODGSON 
: From memory approximately— 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Members ask questions on the assumption presumably that they want answers. So would they please allow the Minister to answer. 
Hon PETE HODGSON 
: From memory 82 percent of all ambulance services are double-crewed and 18 percent are not. This is a somewhat significant improvement on what occurred during the 1990s and as years go by we will improve the services still further. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: I seek leave to table the document “Meeting the challenges: Health workforce development plan 2000: September 2000”. 
Document not tabled. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: I seek leave to table the document “Cancer screening programmes workforce development strategy 2001”. 
Document not tabled. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: I seek leave to table the document “Health Workforce Advisory Committee annual report: Minister of Health 2001”. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table that document. Is there any objection? There is objection. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: I seek leave to table the document “The primary health care and community nurse workforce survey 2001”. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table that document. Is there any objection? There is objection. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: I seek leave to table the document “The rural general recruitment and retention in New Zealand report to the Minister: a first phase of analysis of surveys to assess the fluctuations in the workforce 2001”. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table that document. Is there any objection? There is objection. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: Well I also seek leave to table the documents “New Zealand annual rural workforce survey 2001” the “Clinical training agency strategic intentions 2002” the “Health technicians training 2002” the second annual report of the Health Workforce Advisory Committee 2002 the “Mental health workforce development framework 2002” the annual rural workforce survey of 2002 “The New Zealand health workforce: a stocktake of capacity 2001” the New Zealand health workforce “Framing Future Directions” discussion paper 2002 the “Disability workforce analysis report 2003”  
The New Zealand Health Workforce: Future Directions — Recommendations to the Minister of Health 2003 
  
The New Zealand Health Workforce: Framing Directions Analysis 2003 
 the “Clinical agency strategic intentions 2004” the “Disability support services survey provider survey 2004” the “Health workforce”—[ 
Interruption 
] Well that was a service provider survey from 2004— 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Would the member just read what is to be tabled please. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: Well Madam Speaker I am tabling them. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Continue please. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: The “Health workforce fourth annual report 2004” the “Health workforce”— 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: Yes. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: This is a list; there is just one question—the “National screening unit workforce development action plan” the “NZER ageing New Zealand health and disability demand projections report” the “Pacific development report”—[ 
Interruption 
] Oh I do not think that Mr Peters is interjecting on a point of order because he would not behave like that—the “Disability support services survey 2005” the “Health Workforce Advisory Committee 2005”—there is not long to go—the “Health Workforce Advisory purpose and practice 2005”— 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: I raise a point of order Madam Speaker— 
Madam SPEAKER 
: The member is on a point of order at the moment. The member will finish the point of order. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: —the “Strategic principles 2005” the “Care and support discussion paper 2006” the “Health workforce advisory fit for purpose and practice advice to the Minister 2006” the “Health workforce advisory national guidelines environment 2006” the “Health workforce summary of the national guidelines for the promotion of healthy working environments” and—the latest—the “Terms of reference for the new health workforce task force”. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table those documents. Is there any objection? There is objection. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: I raise a point of order Madam Speaker. I have never ever seen in my career in this House any member of Parliament abuse the House in that way with regard to what is a very special privilege: the right to publish documents that are usually—not in every case—not known to the public and have not been published. In this case every document is public and the member just sought to waste the House’s time. It is 1½ hours since we started question time we have got to question 6 and he tries that trick. What is so special about the National Party? The rest of us have certain rules we have to abide by. I think it is deadly serious that National members can with all the concern that has been expressed by members of other parties in this House today and before get up and carry on in the same darn way. Frankly Madam Speaker if they are going to behave like that I do not think a Minister has any obligation to reply at all. Not just one person interjected but about 12 people did at once. I do not think they should be allowed to carry on as though they are something special. They have lost three elections in a row. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: I am not sure that that was a point of order. Members on quite frequent occasions seek leave to table documents that are in the public arena. The only other comment I would make is that if members do not wish to hear the answers to questions then obviously it will be up to the discretion of the Minister whether to give them one. 
Nathan Guy 
: I seek leave to table the July travelogue from the pre-hospital care union which documents 16 shocking emergencies—that is one every second day—attended by single-crew ambulances in Horowhenua including the transporting of a manic psychiatric patient to Palmerston North Hospital. 
Document not tabled. 
Hon Harry Duynhoven 
: Does the Minister of Health believe that the list of documents just read by the member opposite and ridiculed were valuable pieces of information that the public should see prepared and that those documents were in fact a useful use of health professionals’ time? 
Hon PETE HODGSON 
: It is from that sort of effort that we have seen a very significant increase in Pacific Islanders in the New Zealand workforce a significant increase in Maori in the New Zealand workforce and a significant increase in the provision of breast-screening services throughout New Zealand. It is why we have ended up with more people in ambulances it is why we have improved our mental health workforce and it is why we have more than 5000 extra nurses and doctors in our health system since the change of Government. That is the difference between a Government that does something and a Government that does nothing.