Hide Rodney: Business of Select Committees — Appointments 
Hide Rodney: Business of Select Committees — Appointments 
[Volume:651;Page:301] 
Hon RODNEY HIDE (Leader—ACT) 
: 
 I thank the Hon David Parker and Jeanette Fitzsimons for their contributions. I can understand their frustration because David Parker put a lot of effort into the emissions trading scheme and I know that for Jeanette Fitzsimons this has been a key policy for the Greens. Pete Hodgson also did a lot of work in the early days of the scheme and I can imagine the frustration of those members when we have an election and the scheme comes up for review but that is the nature of democracy.  
I should also say that this was not easy in our discussions between National and the ACT Party. National and ACT share a philosophy and a vision of New Zealand and therefore we were able to conclude our confidence and supply agreement quite quickly. I note that the Greens and the Labour Party or the Labour Party and the Maori Party have never been able to reach a confidence and supply agreement but between National ACT and the Maori Party we could do it in 8 days. For National and ACT working with John Key and the National Party it was easy and seamless because we share a vision and a philosophy. Our differences on policy were relatively small but this was one difference. The National Party had campaigned to keep the emissions trading scheme and the ACT Party had campaigned to dump it. As it turned out we got five MPs and National got—how many MPs? 
Dr Paul Hutchison 
: 58. 
Hon RODNEY HIDE 
: Overwhelmingly the vote went National’s way. But what I appreciated about John Key and the senior team of MPs he had as part of his negotiating team was their willingness to sit down and work with the differences we had not in order to get some political solution but to get a solution that was in the best interests of the country. That is what I appreciated about working with John Key. As it turned out even our differences could be worked through quite quickly. I contrast that with the Labour Party and the Greens who have never been able to work out their differences. As for the Labour Party and its appalling attacks on the Maori Party that we have witnessed in recent times there is absolutely no respect from Labour for other political parties and differing views. If that is the attitude of the Labour Party then it has not learnt the lesson of the 2008 election campaign.  
So what do we have here? We have a select committee looking at what Labour and the Greens should have done from the start which is to analyse this issue to consider it in a world setting and to consider the costs and benefits to New Zealand. I ask members whether they remember when Pete Hodgson came back from overseas. He glowingly told the House that he had done a deal that would see us better off—I think from memory by $500 million—because we were so clever. I think a year or two later it became a $500 million loss. The idea then was that taxpayers would have to write a cheque to benefit the Russians because their industrial economy had collapsed. The idea that Labour and the Greens think it is OK to be writing a cheque to the Russians because Pete Hodgson had signed some deal I have to say is nuts.  
Jeanette Fitzsimons 
: Read the bill. That’s taken out of it. The Greens got rid of that. 
Hon RODNEY HIDE 
: Oh the member says read the Climate Change (Emissions Trading and Renewable Preference) Bill. I am going over a bit of history here. The second thing to happen was when we had to have the emissions trading scheme in order to reduce the liability of the taxpayer but that liability was created by Pete Hodgson in his signing up. We have had a change of Government so I say let us look at it. It is called democracy. So what do we do? Jeanette Fitzsimons has criticised me for not turning up to the Finance and Expenditure Committee when it considered the bill. I made a deliberate decision not to turn up. Why? Because that select committee concentrated only on the bill.  
Hon David Parker 
: That’s its job.  
Hon RODNEY HIDE 
: That is right. If anyone came along to question the science or ask about the costs and benefits to New Zealand I am afraid they were given short shrift. I will tell the former Minister for Climate Change Issues David Parker what my job was. My job was to go out and get the party votes so we could establish this select committee and do the job properly in the best interests of New Zealand.  
First of all here is the issue of the science. David Parker goes around telling the world that all the scientists are agreed. That is a lie. That is not true. He goes around telling the world that carbon dioxide is a pollutant. That is not true. That is a lie. David Parker goes around telling the world that we are living in a carbon-constrained world.  
Hon Darren Hughes 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. The Minister of Local Government is making a robust contribution to the debate but he cannot as he has done twice now accuse a member of telling a lie or refer to a statement of a member as a lie. That is not within the Standing Orders.  
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Rick Barker) 
: The member is correct. By phrasing the matter in the way he did the member is clearly trying to say that a member of this House has told a lie. That is not within the Standing Orders.  
Hon RODNEY HIDE 
: The former Minister went around telling New Zealand that we are living in a carbon-constrained world. That is not true. The whole thing was just beat up on these particular stories. This is what we have. We have an interesting theory that has been around now for well over 100 years that says if we increase greenhouse gases in the atmosphere in particular carbon dioxide then we could warm the planet. It is a theory. It is a hypothesis. We then have computer models that work on that theory and hypothesis to produce projections 100 years out that say it could warm in this particular way. By the way the computer models must have a very interesting interaction between carbon dioxide and water because water vapour is the chief greenhouse gas. I remember Moana Mackey— 
Moana Mackey 
: Backbenchers? 
Hon RODNEY HIDE 
: I am sorry. I was thinking of the member’s mum. I was getting confused. When someone pointed out that we had pictures on Television New Zealand of water vapour going up chimneys Moana Mackey said water vapour is a greenhouse gas too. I thought this Labour Government will not only be controlling the dribble in our showers but also stopping us boiling the kettle because water vapour is the chief greenhouse gas. That is how silly they are with their science. I would have thought Ms Mackey who supposedly has a degree in science would understand a little bit more than the stupidity that came out in that select committee.  
So we have this model and we look at it and we find this—the data does not back it up. The models have never been verified. We had people coming to the select committee hearing pointing out the flaws in the model and the Government refused to hear them to question them or to take on board what they said.  
Here is what we have happening—it can move quite quickly; there is no need to take 5 years. Jeanette Fitzsimons might think that doing a bit of work takes 5 years but when we have the National - ACT - Maori Party Government things do not take 5 years.  
Hon Darren Hughes 
: Say it again. 
Hon RODNEY HIDE 
: I know that the Labour Party wishes the Maori Party did not exist but I say to Labour members to get over it because it does. Why does it exist? It exists because Labour screwed up. It tried to take people’s property rights and deny them the opportunity of justice. 
Hon Darren Hughes 
: Don’t patronise the Maori Party. 
Hon RODNEY HIDE 
: I am not patronising it; I am patronising the Labour Party because it had the attitude that Maori people did not have the rights of all New Zealanders—the rights that people fought and died for. Yes we are going to listen to and consider what scientists say. Yes we are going to look at what is happening around the world and see what other countries are doing and we are going to look at the costs and benefits to New Zealand. Then ultimately there will be a political response. That is what a democracy is about and it does not matter—whatever way it goes ultimately it is politicians elected to Parliament who will decide the appropriate response for New Zealand. The ACT Party says to get some evidence here because David Parker’s mind is made up Jeanette Fitzsimons’ mind is made up— 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Rick Barker) 
: I regret to advise the member that his time has expired.