Little Andrew: Oral Questions — Questions to MinistersText is incorporated into the Bound VolumeLittle Andrew: Oral Questions — Questions to Ministers[Sitting date: 10 November 2015. Volume:710;Page:7787. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.]1.ANDREW LITTLE (Leader of the Opposition) to the Prime Minister: What action if any has he taken to follow up on his statement to Malcolm Turnbull regarding New Zealand - born Australian detainees on Christmas Island “I think in the spirit of mateship there should be some compassion shown”?Rt Hon JOHN KEY (Prime Minister):My full statement to Mr Turnbull was: “where someone isn’t the highest risk where someone has a long-term community of interest in Australia I think in the spirit of mateship there should be some compassion shown”. That statement was made with regard to appeals by detainees. Since I met with Mr Turnbull Ministers Amy Adams and Michael Woodhouse have travelled to Australia and with my approval have met with immigration Minister Peter Dutton to get additional information about how Australia is managing the issue. Ministers and officials are working hard to ensure that what I agreed with Prime Minister Turnbull is implemented as soon as possible. Australia has doubled resources to speed up the appeals process. I have made my views very clear to Prime Minister Turnbull and I continue to receive regular updates on progress. I have asked Minister Adams to follow up with Mr Dutton and we expect an ongoing dialogue about where things stand.Andrew Little: What representations to Australia has he made in the last 2 days to raise concerns about events on Christmas Island or to offer his help?Rt Hon JOHN KEY: I personally have made none but of course the officials and my Ministers have worked their way through that process.Andrew Little: Which of his statements of earlier today is correct: his statement to Radio New Zealand that the New Zealand detainees are “free to leave” and “are staying there voluntarily” or his statement to reporters that the New Zealand detainees who wanted to leave face many weeks of delays in a remote detention centre before they can go anywhere?Rt Hon JOHN KEY: For a start I did not make the last statement. What I did point out was that it depends on the circumstances. In terms of an individual there are a number of factors that have to be considered: firstly as I pointed out this morning whether the person has travel documentation a passport; secondly whether the person has a history of violent or criminal activity; thirdly—Hon Annette King: You said it was easy.Rt Hon JOHN KEY: Well it is not actually easy because these people—some of them are rapists some of them are child molesters and some of them are murderers. These are the people whom the Labour Party is saying are more important to support than New Zealanders who deserve protecting when they come back here.Kelvin Davis: A detention centre; not a prison.Rt Hon JOHN KEY: Mr Davis if you want to put yourself on the side of sex offenders go ahead my son but we will defend New Zealanders. [Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: Order! [Interruption] Order! I am on my feet.Andrew Little: Given that Britain Canada France Germany Switzerland the US and many other countries all criticised Australia’s treatment of many of the Christmas Island detainees at the UN just yesterday why did his Government fail to raise any concerns at all about the ill-treatment of New Zealand-born detainees?Rt Hon JOHN KEY: Because we do not need to go to Geneva to do that; we do it in person with the Prime Minister of Australia. We have done that and we do it with the Australian Ministers. I say again that we have a responsibility to those New Zealanders and we will bring them home to New Zealand but we will do so by protecting New Zealanders. We are not on the side of sex offenders; we are on the side of New Zealanders. [Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: Order! [Interruption] Order! I am attempting to call the Leader of the Opposition for a supplementary question. It requires some silence before I do so.Andrew Little: Why is he so weak that he spends his time with Malcolm Turnbull talking about what ties to wear rather than having the moral courage to demand that Australia do what is right for the detainees?Rt Hon JOHN KEY: We spent a considerable portion of the one-on-one meeting that we had with Malcom Turnbull talking about this issue. Two Ministers have gone to Australia to talk to Minister Dutton about this issue. I have raised this issue with Prime Minister Abbott. There have been considerable conversations going on. When it comes to these people coming home to New Zealand they are free to come home and we will allow them to come home and we will ensure that they can come home as long as they have the travel documentation. They cannot go on a commercial aircraft if they are violent or if they have mental health issues. I have a responsibility to the New Zealanders here at home that they are looked after. What the Labour Party is saying is:“To hell with the rest of New Zealanders; these people should be put on a commercial aircraft and despatched to New Zealand.” Well you back the rapists; I—[Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: Order! [Interruption] Order! When I rise to my feet I expect the Prime Minister to then resume his seat.Andrew Little: Why has it taken an inmate to die a 2-day fire and a full-blown riot for him and his Ministers to finally lift a finger to do something about it?Rt Hon JOHN KEY: The member is just completely misrepresenting the facts. I raised this issue in February after it became Australian law in the late part of December. I raised the issue with Malcolm Turnbull all the way through this and our Ministers have been working on this issue. We cannot stop Australia having its sovereign right to ultimately decide to deport people who are serious criminal offenders. We cannot stop that any more than Helen Clark could stop the fact that back in 2001 a whole category of New Zealanders did not get the right to residency. They are the very people actually who if they had residency and citizenship would be able to stay.Marama Davidson: E te Māngai o Te Whare tēnā koe. Tēnā koe e Te Whare. Given that New Zealanders some of whom are people with disabilities some of whom are in there merely for an unregistered vehicle some of whom are in there for driving offences—Mr SPEAKER: Order! [Interruption] Order! I will certainly give some leniency to the questionerin that this is her first supplementary question butwe need to get to the question. There were a lot of givens. Maybe one is acceptable but a whole list of them will not be acceptable. I do need the question.Marama Davidson: Why did the Government not criticise Australia for its offshore detention centres in our submission on Australia’s human rights record at the UN yesterday?Rt Hon JOHN KEY: Because we raised it directly with the Australian Prime Minister.Marama Davidson: I seek leave to table New Zealand’s submission to the United Nations Human Rights Council on Australia’s appalling human rights record.Mr SPEAKER: Can I just check the source of this document?Marama Davidson: It is not public as far as I know and we have searched.Mr SPEAKER: I am in a difficult situation. I do not know whether it is public. The member needs to be very careful that she is not misleading the House. If the member says that it is not publicly available I will put the leave and it will befor the House to decide. I am just going to clarify with the member again whether it is publicly available.Marama Davidson: It is from a journalist as the source.Mr SPEAKER: Then I think that it is available to all members.Marama Davidson: Given Australia’s continued abuse of New Zealanders’ human rights on Christmas Island is it right for the Prime Minister to support Australia’s bid for a seat on the United Nations Human Rights Council?Rt Hon JOHN KEY: As I said earlier in terms of any concerns we have the Government raises those issues directly. We have said for a long period of time that we do not like this policy. This policy is not directed specifically at New Zealanders. It is a policy that they apply to all countries but as I said earlier when it comes to those New Zealanders—who are people by the way who do not want to claim to be New Zealanders; the whole point is that they do not want to come back to New Zealand—I have a responsibility to make sure that other New Zealanders are safe. The people who are in those detention centres have a criminal offence that has seen them incarcerated for 1 year or more or they have serious character issues. If they actually have connection with New Zealand the advice from the Australian Minister is that a third to a half of all those appeals are being accepted. I am sorry I am not just going to take people back into New Zealand without information and without being able to protect the New Zealand public and if those members want to protect sex offenders rapists and murderers go ahead. I am not going to.Grant Robertson: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I was going to wait until the end of the question but the Prime Minister has repeated what he said more directly in an earlier supplementary answer when he accused the Labour Party of “backing the rapists”. I am deeply offended at that and I ask that it be withdrawn. [Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: Order! [Interruption] Order! This is a political debating chamber. The member may well be offended by that but in the context of the answers given I am not going to take that as—[Interruption] Order! I do not want to start this week by asking a member to leave the Chamber but I want to make it absolutely clear that when I am on my feet there is no opportunity for members to continue to interject and that applies to both sides of the Chamber.Rt Hon John Key: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker.Grant Robertson: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker.Mr SPEAKER: I just want to clarify with Grant Robertson that it is a fresh point of order. I will hear from the right honourable Prime Minister first.Rt Hon John Key: I do not have the document with me but in the meeting that I held with Malcolm Turnbull—I am not sure whether I can actually table it; I might be able to—he gave a detailed outline of the people who are in question; the New Zealanders who are going to be deported—Mr SPEAKER: Order! The Prime Minister will resume his seat. That is not a point of order. I have dealt with that matter.Grant Robertson: I have taken offence at—Mr SPEAKER: Order! [Interruption] Order! On occasions in this House—and I have heard many rulings and I have given some—it is not a matter of whether the member was offended; it is a matter of whether the House was offended. [Interruption] I do not want to see the whole of this left-hand side evacuated. Members may be offended—[Interruption] Order! I have to judge the seriousness of the allegation and I have determined that the House should not be offended at that. [Interruption] Iain Lees-Galloway I ask you to leave the Chamber. I can only give so—[Interruption]Iain Lees-Gallowaywithdrew from the Chamber.Mr SPEAKER: Are there any further—Chris Hipkins: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker.Mr SPEAKER: Order! I will hear it in a minute. [Interruption] Order! I will hear it in a minute when the House settles.Chris Hipkins: I ask you to reconsider. There is nothing more offensive than being accused of backing rapists—Mr SPEAKER: Order! [Interruption] Order! We have covered that matter. If you take the contents of the Hansard—and I will certainly be looking at the Hansard; I give the member that assurance—as I recall the answers given by the Prime Minister he was saying that the people who are in detention whom some members of the left-hand side are expressing a great deal of sympathy for are there for reasons of serious crimes. That is how I took it. Now we have dealt with the matter. If the members want to continue to stand and relitigate or voluntarily leave they are welcome to do so. Are there any further supplementary questions?Metiria Turei: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker.Mr SPEAKER: I will hear it but if it is—[Interruption] Order! [Interruption] Order! The Hon Gerry Brownlee will also remain quiet while I hear a point of order. Before I accept the point of order I have dealt with this matter—Metiria Turei: Dealt with that matter. This is a different matter.Mr SPEAKER: Yes. Then as a fresh point of order I am happy to hear it—but it had better be.Metiria Turei: I take offence at the Prime Minister’s accusation that the Green Party and particularly Marama Davidson as our representative backs rapists and murderers—Mr SPEAKER: Order! [Interruption] Order! You are only relitigating where I have already been.Marama Fox: What do you say to the family of Kō Rūtene who is a decorated soldier having served for New Zealand in Afghanistan and who has committed no crime in Australia and no crime in New Zealand but who has been detained by the Australian Border Force and is being held in a detention facility in Australia awaiting deportation?Rt Hon JOHN KEY: I do not have the details of his case.Marama Davidson: Then will the Prime Minister today rule out supporting Australia’s bid for a seat on the UN Human Rights Council?Mr SPEAKER: I will allow the question. The right honourable Prime Minister was brought in in an earlier supplementary question.Rt Hon JOHN KEY: The Government put in the submission last night and we continue to support that submission.