Flavell Te Ururoa: Gangs and Organised Crime Bill — In Committee 
Flavell Te Ururoa: Gangs and Organised Crime Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:658;Page:7526] 
TE URUROA FLAVELL (Maori Party—Waiariki) 
: 
 Kei te pai. Thank you very much Mr Chair. Firstly I will speak with regard to the terminology. If we ask most New Zealanders about the word “gang” the notion that would come to the mind of most New Zealanders would be that of Black Power the Mongrel Mob maybe some bikie gangs people on motorcycles and that is about it. Carmel Sepuloni raised the issue of colours and after talking with some people in this particular area I say that those people do not seem to be classed as gangs in a sense. So I want to check with the Minister in the chair the Hon Nathan Guy about what he said a little bit earlier by raising the point about the definition of gangs how far and how wide that particular definition goes. Mr Cosgrove has raised the point of whether white collar crime fits into the notion of gangs and there might be some catches. It might fit under the other part of the title of the bill—“organised crime” and so be it. But I make the point that the connotation of “gangs” is around the notion of Maori gangs or those that let us say affiliate to those Maori gangs. That is the first point. 
Mr Cosgrove raised the notion of the cost in finding solutions. I raise the point again that I had talked about at least one community taking an opportunity and that I supported them on that particular notion. That is what the Maori Party says. 
Hon Clayton Cosgrove 
: Six and a half thousand bucks! 
TE URUROA FLAVELL 
: I will come to the $6500 shortly. If there was support to allow those communities to get on with those solutions then we would be happy because that at least is dealing with the problem and will get away from going to the next part which is the $6500. Mr Cosgrove talks about the cost to the taxpayer yet the end result of this bill will be to lock up more people no doubt; therefore there is a contradiction in what he is talking about in that regard. 
The third point I would make is that already now in law there are opportunities for the police to move in on gangs. We know that because that is exactly what happened in a number of scenarios that people will be well aware of. Sure this bill might harden up the legislation and sure it extends certain terms but the law as it stands at the moment is able to deal with those issues. I respond by saying that that is one line. The law is already there that can take care of those issues so what do we do to deal with the situation afterwards? We are just breeding more and more and more of it. 
The Maori Party approach is that we need to look at alternatives. That is not to say that we should not throw them into jail; I told the Chamber before that those who do the crime should do the time. There is no doubt about that. We do not have a problem with that. But we are saying that we should look at other solutions. At least one community has put its hands up over the issue and we hope that that spreads. It is not to say that Murupara has all the answers. It does not but at least it is right for people there. Other places will have different solutions. The point about back-up too is exactly right. We hope that rather than put $6000 or whatever into sending a person to jail we put $6000 on issues of rehabilitation. That would be helpful; that would be really helpful. 
Hon Shane Jones 
: Mr Chair.