Peters Winston: Oral Questions — Questions to MinistersText is incorporated into the Bound VolumePeters Winston: Oral Questions — Questions to Ministers[Sitting date: 31 May 2016. Volume:714;Page:11467. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.]6.Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) to the Associate Minister of Health: What is the real purpose behind his statements and legislation regarding tobacco product sales in New Zealand?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA (Associate Minister of Health): The real purpose behind my statements and legislation on tobacco product sales is that it saves many New Zealanders’ lives and it reduces the harm from cigarettes and tobacco.Rt Hon Winston Peters: If he and the Government sincerely believe what he just said then why does he and it not forgo over $1.6 billion in taxes on tobacco and cigarettes and just ban them now?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: No—the intention is not to ban cigarettes; the intention is to reduce the harm from cigarettes. That member knows that 4500 to 5000 people per year die prematurely from tobacco smoking and that is why we are putting in place these measures.Rt Hon Winston Peters: Why has the Government whilst filling its coffers with $1.6 billion in taxes launched this further attack on consumers of a legal product many of whom are poor and a disproportionate number of whom are Māori and Pacific Islanders?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: That member knows that the direct cost of tobacco smoking can be up to $1.9 billion. That member also knows that the intangible costs have been estimated to be up to $11 billion. These measures that we are putting in place are about reducing the harm to New Zealanders.Rt Hon Winston Peters: Minister—[Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: Order! I have not called the member yet. I am just waiting for a bit more assistance from my left.Rt Hon Winston Peters: If that statement was remotely true why does he and his Government not ban the smoking of tobacco and cigarettes and leave off this PC attack on the working people of this country when in fact that Government gains $1.6 billion - plus in taxes and does not tax multinationals for their $10 billion of transactions in this country—what is honest about that?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: We know that increasing the price on tobacco is only one tool to reduce smoking rates. That is why we have got face-to-face programmes in place for smoking cessation that is why we have got the Quitline and that is why we do media campaigns—in order to bring down the rates of smoking.Rt Hon Winston Peters: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. From the start of the answer to my second question onwards this Minister has not answered the question. I want to know why he does not ban it. All he is telling me is what he is not going to do.Mr SPEAKER: Order! I have listened to every question. They have been quite sizable questions and they have been addressed on every occasion.Rt Hon Winston Peters: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker.Mr SPEAKER: I hope the member is not in any way—Rt Hon Winston Peters: No I am not.Mr SPEAKER: Good. I will hear the fresh point of order.Rt Hon Winston Peters: I would like to know if I could which part of the Minister’s answers gave me the answer to the question which was: “Why will he not ban it?”.Mr SPEAKER: Order! The member is now going back and relitigating a decision I have already made. Go back and look at the length of the question. The member in asking questions put plenty into his questions giving the Minister a far easier job in answering those questions and addressing them and he has done so. I do not want this matter relitigated.Rt Hon Winston Peters: Point of order.Mr SPEAKER: No. [Interruption] Order! The member is not attempting to relitigate where we have just been is he?Rt Hon Winston Peters: No. I seek leave to table from the Parliamentary Library the real facts on the excise duty being collected by this Government—Mr SPEAKER: Order! I just want quickly the details of the information. I might put the leave.Rt Hon Winston Peters: The details are that 80 percent of the cost of a packet of cigarettes goes to the Government; the other 20 percent goes to everybody else including the tobacco companies.Mr SPEAKER: Order! The documents being described may be of interest to members so I will put the leave. Leave is sought to table that information from the Parliamentary Library. Is there any objection? There is objection.Marama Fox: As a result of Māori Party lobbying and the introduction of four pieces of legislation by the Hon Dame Tariana Turia related to tobacco how much have rates of tobacco consumption reduced since 2006?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: The rates of consumption in the last 5 years have decreased by 25 percent. Smoking incidence in the last 5 years has decreased from 18 percent to 15 percent and I would like to thank that member and the Māori Party and Dame Tariana Turia for the leadership and the vision that they have shown in this battle against this very large health issue.Rt Hon Winston Peters: Is the Minister aware of the research of Dr Mārewa Glover on this matter which utterly debunks the answer to the question that he gave to Marama Fox as one would normally expect?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: No I am not aware of that member’s assertion. There is clear evidence that lower-income members of society are more price-sensitive and that is how tax increases work. And I have taken Professor Blakely’s research on board in that tax increases have been effective in bringing down rates of smoking.David Seymour: In light of the Minister’s answer that 15 percent of New Zealand adults currently smoke what does he believe the percentage will be in 4 years’ time after the measures introduced in the Budget and today have been put in place?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: I do not have a crystal ball to be able to see what is going to happen 4 years from now but what I do know is that rates of smoking have consistently decreased since this Government has been in power. In fact there are 37000 fewer smokers today than there were 3 years ago.David Seymour: If the Minister lacks a crystal ball could he at least be good enough to give the House his best estimate on which he introduced these policies?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: Well history is a good gauge of what may happen in the future and history has shown that this Government’s measures have led to a 25 percent reduction in the consumption of tobacco. They have led to a reduction in the number of smokers over the last 7 years.David Seymour: Is the House to take it that he actually has no idea what the benefits of his policy will be even though the costs will be large?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: I refute that assertion by the member. In fact that member voted for these measures last Friday. So I put it to that member that what he voted for was clearly beneficial for New Zealanders it is going to bring smoking rates down and I suggest he thinks about why we voted the way we did last Friday.