McKelvie Ian; Rurawhe AdrianIAN McKELVIE (National—Rangitīkei): Thank you Mr Speaker. I've listened to a few speeches today and I suppose the thing that concerns me or disappoints me most is that I've spent a fair bit of time listening to the Government telling us how we think and that's extremely frustrating for me. As Judith Collins said we supported the first piece of this legislation wholeheartedly. Some changes were then made to that legislation through regulation which certainly didn't help the piece of legislation and didn't help our people. But since then we've gone through a select committee stage on the second piece of legislation which I think there are many gaps in. The reason I think there are gaps in it—because if you look at what happened with the first piece of legislation we were given a whole lot of recommendations and information by the New Zealand Police. Some of that information was about the number of firearms that were out there and they estimated there were some 240000 firearms that should have been destroyed; in fact they destroyed 56250. So if that's the best information we've been given on this whole firearms piece of legislation I think it's hugely unlikely that when we get to implementing the register we're going to have anything like accurate figures or accurate information to run that register to buy. So I think the problem that I have with this legislation—I've got to say I fully support gun regulation that's reasonable and puts rules in place or legislation in place that controls what happens with guns. This legislation badly fails to do that. One of the reasons it badly fails to do it is because of the haste it's been introduced with. I've been around this Parliament a while now and sat on the arms inquiry—I think it was in 2016-17—where we learnt an awful lot about guns. We visited gun clubs we visited ranges we visited police armouries and we visited the place where the police keep the guns that they've confiscated. We even inspected some of the guns that had been confiscated and there are some pretty dramatic sort of homemade guns they'd picked up in their time. So we could see at that time and I still support the fact that there's certainly a need for legislation to manage the way these guns are out and about in our community. A problem with this legislation is it does nothing to take guns off the people that we wanted to take the guns off and the 2016 inquiry was entirely around trying to establish how guns got into the hands of criminals gangs and other people that don't need to have guns in their hands. We've achieved absolutely nothing in five years in my time looking at this gun legislation by the legislation that we're passing today. It's hugely disappointing I think to have got to this point and achieved very little to make New Zealand and New Zealanders safer in what they do. That's the reason that we oppose this legislation; not because we don't think as the National Party that we need to be in a much better space with respect to firearms in New Zealand. I think the other thing that occurs to me is when you put legislation in place in a hurry—and we've seen quite a lot of legislation put in place in a hurry including the last round of the gun legislation—then it inevitably leaves the shortcomings in the legislation and it's found later to be inadequate and fails. There's no question this legislation will have to be reviewed when we move forward. One because the gun register in its form that they've proposed—and it's not complete—won't work and the other is because some of this stuff is rushed and will not work. I think with respect to the register the security around the register is hugely daunting and challenging for all gun owners because effectively you end up with what's sitting in your house sitting on a register that's clearly been shown already not to be secure. I think that's one of the great concerns the gun people had. There's a couple of other things I want to very briefly touch on because I don't have long to do it. And that's where I think there are shortcomings in this legislation that may well criminalise people who have certainly no intent of being a criminal. I put myself in that place to some extent having recently shifted house. I had no idea or didn't think I guess to inform the police I had shifted house. Frankly I don't have a gun in my house but that's the other irony of this piece of legislation. I have a licence but I don't have a gun but because I have a licence I have to have a place to store a gun in my house—pretty extraordinary. I didn't know that either. So effectively you could end up—there's a lot of things that are going to be very untidy as this piece of—David Seymour: Lucky the member's in Parliament. He might not know otherwise.IAN McKELVIE: Ha ha! Yes—legislation gets implemented; I think it's going to take a long time for the dust to settle on it. I hope it gets implemented in a rational manner that doesn't end up criminalising a whole lot of people that shouldn't be criminalised and a whole lot of people who are innocent and very solid New Zealanders. Thank you Mr Speaker.ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Adrian Rurawhe): This is a split call. I call David Seymour—five minutes.