7. Child Poverty and Homelessness—Measurement and Role of Ministry for Vulnerable Children Oranga TamarikiJACINDA ARDERN (Labour) to the Minister for Social DevelopmentChild Poverty and Homelessness—Measurement and Role of Ministry for Vulnerable Children Oranga Tamariki7. JACINDA ARDERN (Labour) to the Minister for Social Development: What is the official measure and number of children living in homelessness and poverty in New Zealand?Hon ANNE TOLLEY (Minister for Social Development): In answer to all four of those questions the Government does not believe that one measure or number can accurately define these complex issues. In terms of homelessness there is no official measure of homelessness amongst children. There are a number of ways to measure homelessness or severe housing deprivation. In terms of poverty the Government uses the Household Incomes Report and the companion report using non-income measures produced by the Ministry of Social Development (MSD). These reports use a multi-measure multi-level approach to better capture trends including material hardship measures before-housing-costs income measures and both anchored and moving-line after-housing-costs income measures.Jacinda Ardern: When just a few days ago she stated that she told the United Nations Of course we do have an official measure of poverty and children who live in homelessness." what official statistics was she referring to when she in her first answer refused to give a number?Hon ANNE TOLLEY: That member has completely misquoted me—that is the reality but it is not unusual. However the answer that I gave at the United Nations Committee on the Rights of the Child was very similar but I did give them MSD's current figures which is one of the measures of homelessness but I also stated that there is no measure for homeless children.Jacinda Ardern: Will her Ministry for Vulnerable Children be required to adopt a plan to reduce child poverty?Hon ANNE TOLLEY: The member confuses the role of the Ministry for Vulnerable Children Oranga Tamariki which is the correct name of the ministry with the concept that only poor children are abused. In fact the focus of that new ministry will be on reducing the abuse and neglect of children. That is the intent of the ministry and that is its unashamed focus—and that goes across all spectrums of society. Jacinda Ardern: Is a child living in poverty vulnerable?Hon ANNE TOLLEY: There are families who do not have a lot of money—and there are many in New Zealand who do not have a lot of money—who look after their children extremely well. It is difficult but they look after their children extremely well. I find it offensive that the Opposition is suggesting that just because you are poor you beat your children.Jacinda Ardern: If based on her answer her ministry will deal only with children who are being abused is this just a rebrand of Child Youth and Family?Hon ANNE TOLLEY: Well we have had a lot of discussion from the Opposition as to what it thinks this ministry should be doing. I refer the member to the statistics that were produced by the expert advisory panel on the outcomes for children who are taken into State care. I have made it very clear this is not a rebrand of Child Youth and Family. We have had that many many times before and children continue to be abused and neglected. This Ministry for Vulnerable Children Oranga Tamariki is going to focus on making sure that those children who are being beaten and abused by the very people they should be trusting to love and look after them will get better care from this Government.Jacinda Ardern: Was the name of her department—the Ministry for Vulnerable Children Oranga Tamariki—the only option she advocated for or presented to Cabinet?Hon ANNE TOLLEY: Well Cabinet decisions have Cabinet responsibility. I proposed to Cabinet the name Ministry for Vulnerable Children Oranga Tamariki and Cabinet agreed."