Ardern Jacinda: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to MinistersText is incorporated into the Bound VolumeArdern Jacinda: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers[Sitting date: 22 July 2014. Volume:700;Page:19265. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.]8.JACINDA ARDERN (Labour)to the Minister of Police: When was the Minister of Police first informed of the misreporting of Police statistics in Counties Manukau and what did she do with the information when she first received it?Hon ANNE TOLLEY (Minister of Police):I was briefed by Deputy Police Commissioner Bush on 21 May 2012 that a small number of staff in Counties Manukau south had been found to be incorrectly recoding burglaries and that employment investigations of the staff involved would be undertaken. During this briefing I sought and received assurances that this was an isolated event and that police have appropriate checks and balances in place to ensure that crime statistics are accurate including regular spot checks and audits. I also gave Minister Collins as the local MP a heads-up on this matter following this briefing. Since 2012 police have established a national data coordinator recruited champions in each district to provide expertise to staff on data entry standards and have ongoing programmes of education and training to ensure staff fully meet requirements when entering data into the police system.Jacinda Ardern: Does she believe it was appropriate for Judith Collins to choose not to pass on information relating to the misreporting of police statistics when she was made aware of it earlier in 2012?Hon ANNE TOLLEY: I have no ministerial responsibility for any information that another Minister might have. However I am aware that when I briefed Minister Collins following my verbal briefing she had heard some gossip about a senior—[Interruption] If you let me finish—[Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: Order! Allow the Minister to complete her answer.Hon ANNE TOLLEY: Thank you Mr Speaker. She had heard some gossip about a senior police officer leaving the police.Hon Member: What was the gossip?Hon ANNE TOLLEY: This Government does not deal in gossip; this Government deals in facts and the facts are that crime has fallen over the last 4 years by 20 percent. This Government supports the police while the previous Government under which crime rose continues to try to undermine our police.Jacinda Ardern: When the Minister advised Judith Collins of the situation did Judith Collins give her an explanation as to why she did not ask the police to investigate what she has labelled as gossip?Hon ANNE TOLLEY: I repeat that I have no ministerial responsibility for the actions of another Minister. My responsibility—Hon Trevor Mallard: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. The Minister has absolute responsibility for whether she asked and that is what she was asking and to say that she does not is incorrect.Mr SPEAKER: The Minister is responsible now to answer to the House and how she decides to answer to the House is for her to judge and it is then for this House and the public of New Zealand to judge the answer.Hon ANNE TOLLEY: I have no responsibility for other Ministers receiving gossip. What I had the responsibility for as the Minister of Police was receiving information from the police that there had been a problem—a small problem—with statistics. Less than 0.5 percent of the Counties Manukau statistics had been incorrectly coded. What I had responsibility for was making sure that a full investigation had taken place and seeking assurances from the police that this was a small isolated incident that had been amended and that there was no further danger of statistics being wrong.Rt Hon Winston Peters: Could the Minister tell us whether under her watch and Ms Collins’ watch the numbers of police per capita have gone down or up? [Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: Does the Minister want the question again? Could the member please repeat the question as clearly as he can?Rt Hon Winston Peters: The police numbers per thousand under Ms Collins and herself—have the numbers gone done or up after 2008?Hon ANNE TOLLEY: That is very wide of the primary question. However—[Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: I have allowed the question so the Minister can address it.Hon ANNE TOLLEY: I am happy to say that there has been per capita as the population has risen—and despite the fact that this Government has paid for an extra 600 police—a slight decrease but this Government has provided the police with mobile phones and iPads and that has produced—[Interruption] Members may laugh but actually that has produced an efficiency the equivalent of an extra 354 police per year. So that has increased the per capita.Jacinda Ardern: Does she believe it was appropriate for Judith Collins in 2014 when discussing the declining crimes statistics to say “The results are due to the hard work and dedication of many sectors within justice and I know our Counties Manukau divisions are a big part of that.” given that she was made aware of the misreporting of statistics in Counties Manukau in 2012 and did not disclose that information to her or to the public?Hon ANNE TOLLEY: I think it is absolutely in order for Minister Collins to praise the hard work of the police in Counties Manukau which has seen an extraordinary drop in reported crime right across the whole of Counties Manukau and this Government—[Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: Order! Could Mr Mallard please get himself under control.Hon ANNE TOLLEY: What I do find astounding is that members of the Opposition are determined to undermine the fantastic work of our police right across the country when today’s front page of the New Zealand Herald actually talks about the hard work that they are doing on behalf of New Zealand citizens.Jacinda Ardern: When she indicated that she was satisfied that misreporting of crimes statistics from 2009 was an isolated incident what evidence had she seen to give her this confidence?Hon ANNE TOLLEY: I sought assurances from the Commissioner of Police—and I trust the Commissioner of Police; I do not believe that the Commissioner of Police lies—and he assured me that they had conducted spot audits. We are talking about 696 recoded burglaries out of a total of 1.25 million recorded offences. That is in the margin of error probably where the Labour Opposition enjoys wallowing.Mr SPEAKER: Order!