Gosche Mark: Aviation Crimes Amendment Bill Civil Aviation Amendment Bill (No 2) — Third Readings 
Gosche Mark: Aviation Crimes Amendment Bill Civil Aviation Amendment Bill (No 2) — Third Readings 
[Volume:642;Page:11957] 
Hon MARK GOSCHE (Labour—Maungakiekie) 
: 
 As the Minister for Transport Safety the Hon Harry Duynhoven pointed out in his speech earlier the Committee of the whole House debate on this legislation took place on the sixth anniversary of the attacks in America that happened on Tuesday 11 September 2001. I think everybody will remember those terrible scenes that unfolded on the television. Ever since those days the international aviation world has changed and it has changed dramatically. As I have said in earlier debates on this legislation we are doing things now that I suppose many of us would never have dreamt of having to do in New Zealand law some years ago. 
New Zealand is a long way from those tragic events and from many of the other acts of terrorism that have taken place on aeroplanes but that does not unfortunately leave us out of the loop when it comes to having legislation that enables us to ensure the safety of passengers flying within New Zealand and to and from New Zealand. Also as the Minister has pointed out there are international aviation agreements. There are standards that this country is required to meet both in the way we operate and in the way in which our law is written which do I suppose impinge upon the personal freedoms that all of us in this place hold so dear. It is a dilemma when we all want the right to be able to travel freely without impediment and without intrusion by bureaucracy or officialdom and we have to balance that against the need of people to be able to travel safely throughout the world and as I have said we also need to meet international obligations. 
So in dealing with this legislation we tackled some fairly fundamental issues in that respect. The thought of having armed officers on board aeroplanes flying in and out of New Zealand is one that none of us would relish and we probably all would like to be able to say that we should not pass a law that allows this. If we did not pass such a law and if international partners suddenly required that measure then very rapidly we would become an island that nobody could fly in and out of. So the way in which this legislation has dealt with that requirement is to allow for it to happen but it would not happen until a future Government a future Cabinet deemed it necessary to pass the next part if you like by an Order in Council which would authorise flights bearing armed officers to land in New Zealand and authorise those leaving this country to depart. That probably was the most difficult issue that the Transport and Industrial Relations Committee dealt with and certainly the Air Line Pilots’ Association which I have listened to over all the years that I have been in this Parliament and I have taken great notice of has always opposed this. In theory it still does but it also recognises the need for the law to be able to be changed rapidly if we reach a point where New Zealand can no longer fly in and out of all the destinations that we currently are able to. Because of that factor it is with some regret I would imagine that most of us who support this legislation will pass it but that is the nature of what has happened internationally. Governments around the world are having to take these measures even though in the sense of preserving our personal freedoms they are less than desirable. 
As Pansy Wong indicated the committee looked at what was probably the one contentious issue beyond that which was of a much more minor nature. That issue was around the confiscation of items that people can no longer take on to planes and whether those items would be kept recorded and made available for people who wanted to get them back. In the end we were convinced by the airlines airport companies and others that to do this would lead to significant delays for passengers trying to leave New Zealand or trying to travel within New Zealand. So we amended the legislation—sensibly I think—to change that provision. 
In regards to the whole concept of being able to carry on to planes things that in the past we would have given no thought to I had my eyes opened when I was the Minister of Transport which was when we first introduced these types of measures by going to Auckland airport and seeing the types of things that people thought were acceptable. Many thought that when we banned pocket knives and scissors it was silly but if people had seen the array of weapons I saw that had been confiscated—great big daggers axes and all sorts of things that we could not imagine anybody would ever think were acceptable to take on a plane whether or not the law allowed it—then they would be convinced as I was that these sorts of measures were in fact necessary. Even during the course of dealing with this legislation I received an email from somebody who was highly offended at the thought that he would not be able to take a chainsaw full of petrol on to the plane and if it was confiscated then how dare we not give it back to that person. I think that we have to get these things into perspective. 
David Bennett 
: What’s the matter with Possum? 
Hon MARK GOSCHE 
: I know that David Bennett would like to carry his chainsaw on to an aeroplane. He is from a rural background and he is a lawyer also but even he would have to agree that a chainsaw full of petrol is something that we would not want to let on the plane at Hamilton airport. 
But some people think that that right should be protected so we have to listen very carefully to arguments about those sorts of issues because sitting in below that is the need to protect people’s privacy as much as possible and to be as least intrusive as we can be. Some of the measures that are allowed for in this law which will now be passed take that matter into account. The Supplementary Order Paper the Minister brought in around the scanning done through people’s clothing so that security staff can see a body underneath is definitely banned in this law and that is a good change that the Committee of the whole House passed without any member opposing it. Also security officers and people working in airports will take account of the right of people to have some privacy. 
 I too like Pansy Wong was very happy with the explanations that the officials gave us as to the way in which they will deal with people with cultural differences—particularly members of the Sikh community but not just that community because there are others who wear headwear and who carry significant religious items on their body. Extra training will be given and there will be good consultation with those communities to make sure that our Government departments and officials are aware of those needs. As a result of hearing that it was deemed by the House and the select committee that there was no need to make any extra changes to the bill. 
In conclusion these are extraordinary times in which we live. Six years ago nobody would have dreamt that we would have to do these sorts of things but events on the international scene—like September 11 in New York—have led to Governments around the world having to pass these sorts of measures. This legislation will enable New Zealanders to be able to continue to travel throughout the world as they have always done. I do not think there is any member of the House here who does not want to be able to get on the plane and visit Australia the United States and Britain as so many of them do on regular occasions—except for me. This law will allow those members who like to do that to get on a plane knowing they can land at the other end and at the end of the day that is a very important right too.