Franks Stephen: Counter-Terrorism Bill — Instruction to CommitteeCWH In Committee 
Franks Stephen: Counter-Terrorism Bill — Instruction to CommitteeCWH In Committee 
[Volume:612;Page:9362] 
STEPHEN FRANKS (ACT) 
: 
 The Committee stage of this bill produces strange bedfellows and not only at this end of the Chamber. I was very interested to hear the Minister of Foreign Affairs and Trade who again creditably took a call to explain the purpose of Part 2 and what the objectives are. I was interested to hear him say I think correctly that the primary gain from this measure and his main pride in it was that it enabled us to be the first country in the region to sign up to 12 conventions. 
Hon Phil Goff 
: No I didn’t say that in that context at all. The member should have listened to what I said. 
STEPHEN FRANKS 
: I am afraid that is the way I read it. The Minister did explain the substantive reasons for it but he spent more time gloating at the credit he will get from his colleagues at the United Nations for having been an early signer of those conventions. I ask Mr Ron Mark to think about that. That motive is probably why we have the Mercenary Activities (Prohibition) Bill before the House—the desire to look respectable to people whom most of us would not even want to be seen with; Mr Goff’s desire to be seen holding hands with Yasser Arafat. We are looking at nauseating crawling. 
I wonder whether any of this is related to the forthcoming visit of the President of China. As I read section 5 of the Terrorism Suppression Act 2002 China could argue that its treatment of Falun Gong falls within it. In New Zealand “to unduly compel or to force a government … to do or abstain from doing any act” would probably to most people involve an illegal act some kind of threat of violence something that all of us would already recognise as completely unlawful and the definition of a “terrorist act” simply brings it in. However we can well imagine that the Chinese whose President is about to be hosted by Mr Goff would consider that they were unduly compelled by a bunch of elderly people doing exercises in a courtyard because for them it is undue to have disagreement. 
Dr Wayne Mapp 
: Do you reckon they will have another select committee inquiry? 
STEPHEN FRANKS 
: Exactly. For those people it is undue to disagree with their Government. I say to the Minister that the problem is that as I read this—and I am anxious to be told if I have misread it—as I look at the elements of a “terrorist act” the only one that I can see that would possibly protect us from an anti - Falun Gong type of move is the one in section 5(3) that requires that there be a serious risk to health or safety. My problem is that many dictators argue that they can suppress dissent because it would cause riots. In Islamic countries they argue that they can suppress missionaries because otherwise they would incite Islamists against them. As I read this section and go through Part 2 it does appear to me that the President of China for example could call on our Prime Minister to hand over under the extradition treaty someone who had done something that in New Zealand would never be treated as terrorism but under the law of a country like that might well be defined as terrorism in a cynical act of political oppression. 
That is why I agree with Mr Keith Locke that this part does raise serious questions about whether it could be misused despite the very sensible parts of it and the things that we would love to be able unequivocally to support. The fact is the select committee did not look at section 5 of the Terrorism Suppression Act and did not take the opportunity to modify it to make sure there was a definition consistent with New Zealand’s respect for human rights as to what is undue compulsion of a Government. This leaves me with the concern that this provision could be used to seize the cash of organisations or political movements. Governments that we regard with abhorrence in terms of their attitudes to dissent and their attitudes to minorities could use it to seize that cash.