Jones Dail: Judicial Matters Bill — In Committee Procedure 
Jones Dail: Judicial Matters Bill — In Committee Procedure 
[Volume:617;Page:12880] 
DAIL JONES (NZ First) 
: 
 During my first call on this matter I drew to the attention of the House on behalf of New Zealand First the concern of the New Zealand Council for Civil Liberties and I also mentioned the New Zealand Law Society’s opposition to the bill. I wish now to turn to just one point in addition to the comments made by the National Party speaker Mr Worth and that is to point out that the commissioner must receive and deal with every complaint made under the bill about the conduct of a judge regardless of whether the subject matter of the complaint arises in the exercise of the judge’s judicial duties or otherwise. Or otherwise! So the point I was making during the second reading debate—for example on the types of speeches judges can make and the types of activities they can do—is that a judge may have a bit of fun at a racing club or polo club or something like that and if someone does not like it—well it becomes a complaint to this commission. 
It is very hard to get High Court judges today. The income is not all that great from the point of view of a High Court judge. Judges have a great deal of restriction placed on them already through convention and now this bill says that if they do something that somebody thinks is out of the ordinary they can be up before this Judicial Conduct Commissioner and this panel for misbehaviour. Let us take for example a judge of the Maori Land Court. 
Hon Dover Samuels 
: Who? 
DAIL JONES 
: Mr Samuels says: “Who?”. Well “Who who who?” I can tell you that “who who” is a judge of the Maori Land Court and that judge of the Maori Land Court comes within the control of the Judicial Conduct Commissioner. 
What is going to happen next? The judge is on the marae he does something that someone says is contrary to tikanga Maori and bang the judge is up on a complaint. I am surprised that this bill has no reference to tikanga Maori. This is one of the first bills involving Maori Land Court judges that does not have something about tikanga Maori in it. 
It may sound amusing and I see that Mr John Tamihere is the Minister in the chair but this is a matter that clearly the Government has not given any consideration to. Maori Land Court judges are affected by this bill. So a person goes along to the Maori Land Court and lodges an application for separation and for a share in the farm or whatever it might be and someone objects to the way in which the order is made. What next? A complaint to the judicial conduct commissioner perhaps? Someone thinks: “I don’t like the way in which the Maori Land Court judge made that order. He didn’t take tikanga properly into account.” 
This bill is opening itself up to all sorts of problems. I can see that the Labour Maori members have not given any thought to it. I can assure them that Mr Pita Paraone of New Zealand First drew this point about the Maori Land Court judges to my attention. In New Zealand First we are very concerned about the way in which Maori Land Court judges will be dealt with in terms of this bill. It seems to me that the Labour Party has not given it any thought whatsoever. But whether we are talking about a Maori Land Court judge or a District Court judge or whatever they will all have the same problem. A judge may go along to a marae to a function—a private function—and perhaps enjoy himself or herself a bit too much and partake of the hospitality a bit too much and then he or she is on a charge—virtually on a charge. 
Brian Connell 
: Don’t drink on the marae. 
DAIL JONES 
: Well some marae are more urbane than others perhaps. One may enjoy oneself too much and one may come up on a charge. 
This bill is a dreadful piece of legislation. It makes it almost impossible for people to consider becoming members of the judiciary. It makes it very very difficult for people to continue to become High Court judges. It will make it even harder still for people of the highest calibre to accept the position of High Court judge. New Zealand First thinks that this matter is one of great constitutional importance just as the Supreme Court Bill was and what will we have again in this House? I think it will be a vote of about 62 to 58 if that to push this bill through. 
Dr Wayne Mapp 
: What about the Greens? 
DAIL JONES 
: The Greens are supporting this bill—it is ridiculous. 
The CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson) 
: I am sorry to interrupt the member but it is getting a bit too noisy. Tatou tatou—together together honourable members. Courtesy is contagious and we will all prosper if we keep within the spirit of the Standing Orders. 
DAIL JONES 
: Thank you Mr Chairman. As I was saying we should have at least a 75 percent majority of this House amending the constitution on this issue and we are not going to get it.