Ardern Jacinda: New Zealand Flag Referendums Bill — In CommitteeText is incorporated into the Bound VolumeArdern Jacinda: New Zealand Flag Referendums Bill — In Committee[Sitting date: 29 July 2015. Volume:707;Page:5494. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.]JACINDA ARDERN (Labour): It is my pleasure to stand and take a call on Part 3 of the bill. I know that my counterpart Mr Mallard will be very pleased to take a call on this part as well.To date we have had a wide-ranging debate. The substantive parts of this bill are contained in Part 2. It sets out the way that the referendum would be conducted and it also sets out the provisions as to how this referendum would be slightly different from your average referendum. Coming to Part 3 obviously it is a slightly less detailed part of the bill and it includes miscellaneous provisions.It includes amendments to the Flags Emblems and Names Protection Act 1981 which sets out the various flags under which we already operate. This was a really interesting part of the discussion during our select committee. Although it was an interesting part of the discussion it is one I would like to give a brief call on for the benefit of my colleagues. Basically what we learnt is that there are a number of emblems under which New Zealand currently operates. There is of course the New Zealand flag as we know it—well as we know it; on that side of the House Jacqui Dean seemed to be of the view that not everyone in New Zealand would be able to identify the New Zealand flag. Obviously she holds slightly less hope for both our education system and the New Zealand public generally.The New Zealand flag as we know it is one of the flags under which we operate but also there is some provision for the 1902 flag already within legislation. I want to make reference to that briefly because I found that fascinating. Section 5A in clause 69(4) of Part 3 states: “(1) The 1902 Flag is recognised as a flag of historical significance to the Realm”—it is not often that we have that terminology in a bill—“Government and people of New Zealand. (2) Any person or body (other than a government department) may use the 1902 Flag except where required by law to use the New Zealand Flag or another specified flag for a particular purpose.”What is interesting there is that there are not actually many areas in which it is specified that you must use the New Zealand flag. The reason that this is interesting is that the select committee found that if we change the flag there will not necessarily be a requirement in many areas for the new flag to be used. In fact we could arrive at a scenario where we end up with both flags. You are still able to use the old 1902 flag as set out under the Flags Emblems and Names Protection Act 1981. You could feasibly still use the old New Zealand flag because under this bill we still would recognise it as a past flag of New Zealand. You could then have a third flag which is obviously the new flag if it were to be voted upon. Of course we would also have the Tino Rangatiratanga flag flown during Waitangi Day as well and in the military often you will see our soldiers wearing the kiwi on their arm. Technically that is five different emblems—five different emblems that we could feasibly have and be able to use by law.That seemed like quite a ridiculous situation but one of the Government’s arguments as to why the RSA should not be upset by this flag referendum was that it could feasibly still fly the old New Zealand flag anyway. New Zealand First could still have its flags on its boxes—great news. I know that you have invested a lot in buying some of those really great House boxes with the flag on it. You would not have to get rid of them—Barbara Stewart: Thank you.JACINDA ARDERN: I have noticed. You would not have to get rid of them. They would still technically be able to be used.On that side of the Chamber they thought that was a lovely elegant solution. On this side of the Chamber we thought that just seemed a bit bizarre. Under that Act we would have as I described the 1902 flag the New Zealand flag and any other flag that you may choose to have. It was really noted that in particular those in the armed forces may use whatever emblem they choose to and it might be the old flag. I think it is a confused situation and I think this referendum only adds to it. Another reason for there to be no change at all is the cost that we are incurring to have this debacle anyway. Thank you.