Lees-Galloway Iain: Oral Questions — Questions to MinistersText is incorporated into the Bound VolumeLees-Galloway Iain: Oral Questions — Questions to Ministers[Sitting date: 18 February 2015. Volume:703;Page:1684. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.]8.IAIN LEES-GALLOWAY (Labour—Palmerston North) to the Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety: Is the definition of zero-hour contracts in his review of employment standards permanent part-time employment agreements with no set hours of work?Hon STEVEN JOYCE (Minister for Economic Development) on behalf of theMinister for Workplace Relations and Safety: As I mentioned to the member in yesterday’s question time the term “zero-hour contract” means different things to different people. It is of course not defined in New Zealand law and one of the things that we will look at with the review is the different ways in which it has been described. Some people appear to apply it to all casual contracts others to certain types of casual contracts and still others to the part-time employment agreements of certain types as well. The Minister is primarily concerned with reported practices where mutual obligations are unbalanced and has asked officials to go and talk to workers unions and businesses to identify specific issues and concerns so they can be addressed. The important thing is to address poor employment practices and ensure we maintain a fair and flexible labour market.Iain Lees-Galloway: Will he support an amendment to the Employment Relations Act to give permanent part-time employees certainty about their hours of work?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: If the member is referring to his proposed member’s bill I have had a look at it and unfortunately I do not think it would deal with the issues that he is suggesting that it would deal with. I think that is one of the challenges of just sort of roaring in and quickly trying to come up with an answer. I think we need to look at it properly and make sure that we get the answer that is actually going to deal with practices that we are all concerned about.Iain Lees-Galloway: Why does he insist on saying that people taking a stand against zero-hour contracts want to ban casual contracts when this is not the case?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: I think there are some different approaches that different people are taking when they are using the term “zero-hour contract”. And I think—Hon Member: Different people in the Government seem to be taking different approaches.Hon STEVEN JOYCE: Well no—I appreciate that Labour members have a view but as they find out from time to time theirs is not the only view in New Zealand society and actually other people have slightly different views and we have just got to work our way through it. There is no great conspiracy in this; it is just about looking at the situation and addressing particular issues that are there with particular types of agreements.Iain Lees-Galloway: Why does he insist on conflating two separate issues—zero-hour contracts and the deduction of wages—when customers drive off without paying for petrol given that in the words of his own pollster David Farrar “The latter issue could occur no matter how many hours you are contracted for and it is misleading to conflate those issues.”?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: The simple reality is that we are looking at employment standards generally at the moment and there has been a number of issues raised in recent months that need to be included as part of that review and so we are doing it. There appears to be some sort of weird conspiracy about the fact that we are doing it but the member’s point is completely lost on me.Iain Lees-Galloway: Why will he not just deal with zero-hour contracts rather than making misleading and confusing statements to distract people from the real issue?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: It would be very interesting to take up the member’s suggestion for just dealing with zero-hour contracts because I have read his bill and it appears that he wants to ban zero-hour contracts by insisting that employers put some hours in the contract. And the way the bill is written it seems to me that all employers that wanted to have zero-hour contracts could simply put 1 hour in the contract and continue on their merry way. That is why you have to be very careful as you look at these issues to make sure that you come up with answers—Iain Lees-Galloway: That is what the select committee process is for Steven.Hon STEVEN JOYCE: Well actually you do not put dodgy bills to a select committee and waste everybody’s time.