Key John: Public Finance (State Sector Management) Bill — Second Reading Instruction to Committee In Committee 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Key John: Public Finance (State Sector Management) Bill — Second Reading Instruction to Committee In Committee 
[Sitting date: 14 December 2004. Volume:622;Page:17895. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
JOHN KEY (National—Helensville) 
: 
 We are at the tail end of the Committee stage— 
Simon Power 
: We’re only halfway. 
JOHN KEY 
: OK we are getting near the tail end of the evening session. I see that we have a new Minister in the chair the Hon George Hawkins and I am looking forward to some comments from him. 
Dr the Hon Lockwood Smith 
: We’ll be here until Sunday morning. 
JOHN KEY 
: We are finishing on Sunday morning—OK. I want to look at clause 148 “Power to direct Crown agents to give effect to government policy”. That is interesting is it not? 
Simon Power 
: That’s reassuring. 
JOHN KEY 
: It is very reassuring. There is some flaky Government policy being developed and we are now going to be able to roll it out to our Crown agents to give effect to that flaky Government policy for whatever we want. So let us take a moment to dwell on what sort of Government policy we might possibly see from this Government. 
We have seen all sorts of things from this Government in relation to Government policy— 
Simon Power 
: Closing the gaps was one. 
JOHN KEY 
: Closing the gaps is the first one that comes to mind. That policy was rolled out by the Prime Minister— 
Dr the Hon Lockwood Smith 
: A flagship policy. 
JOHN KEY 
: It was a flagship policy. We had a situation whereby the Government’s policy was closing the gaps and many Ministers were running to their relevant Crown agents and telling them “This is the direction we want you to follow.” I wonder at what point when the polls were not doing too well— 
Simon Power 
: The focus groups. 
JOHN KEY 
:—and when the focus group was making the worm look as if it were about to crash into the earth the Government said that that particular policy was to be a policy no more and that Ministers had to run out and tell Crown agents that there was to be a U-turn and a new direction. 
There are many other such Government policies as well. For example there was getting back into the top half of the OECD. 
Dr the Hon Lockwood Smith 
: That was a good one. 
JOHN KEY 
: It was a good one. They even had graphs on that one. 
Dr the Hon Lockwood Smith 
: Signed by the Prime Minister. 
JOHN KEY 
: Yes there she was proudly down at the printers standing beside that thing except that nowadays we are not allowed to talk about that either. 
Simon Power 
: There was the change in the speeding policy. 
JOHN KEY 
: That is right. So it is moderately interesting that there is that power under clause 148 in Part 5 of the Public Finance (State Sector Management) Bill to direct Crown agents. 
It is very interesting that under clause 149 the same powers exist to direct autonomous Crown entities to have regard to Government policy. I do not want to spend the whole of my 5 minutes debating the failed Government policies of this Government— 
Simon Power 
: Go on. 
JOHN KEY 
: I could do but I do not want to rub salt into the wound. The Minister looks a bit tired. He has suddenly realised— 
Simon Power 
: He’s grumpy these days. 
JOHN KEY 
: He is a little grumpy. He used to be a lot of fun when I first came here. He was good when I first came here and he would not have brought in a 500-page doorstop like this then. But no problems—that is fine. 
Clause 149 is entitled: “Power to direct autonomous Crown entities to have regard to government policy”. The good bit comes as it always does when one reads on in this bill. It is really interesting; it is a bit like a fairytale. When we get to clause 150 we see that lo and behold Ministers have no power to direct independent Crown entities or Crown entity companies on Government policy. So the rules are that under clause 148 a responsible Minister may direct a Crown agent and under clause 149 a responsible Minister may direct an autonomous Crown entity. But lo and behold under clause 150 a responsible Minister may not direct an independent Crown entity. So what is the difference between an autonomous Crown entity and an independent Crown entity? 
Dr the Hon Lockwood Smith 
: Ask Christine Rankin. 
JOHN KEY 
: Yes. 
Pansy Wong 
: They can ignore Government policy. 
JOHN KEY 
: They can ignore Government policy. I ask out of interest exactly at what point something is Government policy because it is clearly not necessarily Government policy if the Government is still talking about it. We know for a fact that a lot of things Government members talked about are no longer Government policy—for example getting back into the top half of the OECD—so clauses 148 and 149 are very interesting. 
I now want to refer to clause 156 “Employment of chief executive” which states: “(1) A statutory entity must not agree to the terms and conditions of employment for a chief executive … without—(a) consulting the State Services Commissioner; and (b) … the responsible Minister.” That is an interesting provision. I actually agree with that clause and I am not arguing that it should not be there but my point is simply that when a chief executive makes a hash of something in a Crown entity I do not want to come down to the Chamber and have the Minister tell us that he or she is not responsible.