Dalziel Lianne: Sentencing and Parole Reform Bill — In Committee 
Dalziel Lianne: Sentencing and Parole Reform Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:663;Page:10944] 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL (Labour—Christchurch East) 
: 
 The Sentencing and Parole Reform Bill will apparently be called the Sentencing and Parole Reform Act 2008. That is what the title clause of the bill says. But that title implies that there has been a reform that something positive and good has happened to sentencing and parole. I think a better title for this bill would be the “Removal of Discretion that Resides with Our Judges and with the Parole Board in Favour of Those who Want to Sloganeer Their Way into a Particular Position with the Public Bill”. 
This bill is based on a fiction. It is based on a lie. It does not represent any truth in sentencing or in parole. It does not act as a deterrent. It does not make our communities safer. I say to every single person in this House who has stood up and has said that they are on the side on the victims of crime that we on this side of the House would like to see fewer victims of crime. We would like to put our energy and our effort into removing some of those drivers of crime which I know that some elements of the Government are interested in addressing. We started off down that pathway and I am glad that some members of the Government are willing to pick it up and run with it. 
Maybe that explains why this Sentencing and Parole Reform Bill is in the name of the Minister of Police and Minister of Corrections instead of being in the name of the Minister of Justice which is where this bill rightly resides. The Ministry of Justice develops policy for Governments based on the policy decisions that they make. It translates the policy ideas into legislation. 
This bill started off life I think as the orphan child of one David Garrett as a member’s bill. I ask whether I am right about that. It was picked up by the Government as a Government measure as part of the arrangement that National has with the ACT Party. I think that that is a shame. We are hearing all of the language that is associated with the “three strikes” law in the United States of America when we know that the “three strikes” law in America has not made those states any safer than any of the other states of America. In fact we know that the two groups of people who are less safe when this kind of law is passed are prison officers and police officers. They are much more at risk when there is nothing left to lose and that is exactly what we will be saying to those who will remain in prison for the rest of their lives. The numbers will increase over time and those individuals will be putting at risk police officers and prison officers. 
The title clause states “Sentencing and Parole Reform Act 2008” but it is not sentencing and parole reform; it is removing discretion. It is mandatory sentences. This legislation should be called the “Mandatory Sentences Law Reform and No Parole in Particular Cases Bill”. People should think very seriously about the impact that this legislation will have on those two groups—the prison officers and the police officers. When one has nothing left to lose then the person who is standing in the way of one confronting that reality will be very much at risk. There have been many examples in the United States of police officers who have been shot going to arrest somebody for what would be a third strike. 
The other thing is the nature of the charges that will be brought against the individuals. This is another name we could give this bill: “How to Lock Up More of Our Maori Population Bill”. That name for the bill would have more truth in titling than anything that we have had before us today. We know that Maori are much more likely to be stopped in the street. We know that Maori are much more likely to be arrested if stopped. We know that Maori are much more likely to be charged if arrested. We know that Maori are much more likely to be charged with more serious offences if they are charged. They are much more likely to be convicted if they face a court hearing. They are much more likely to go to jail if they are Maori. That to me is an indictment on our entire system and this bill will add to it. 
Anyone who has had a misspent youth facing a charge will know that they are not all in the category that has been described to us. Of course we have very strong feelings about murder rape sexual violation and those things but there are other charges as well that are not as serious. They cover a magnitude—a full range of offenders are covered under the same charges. 
David Garrett 
: What is a minor one? 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL 
: I am not saying that any of them are minor; I am just saying that there are circumstances where somebody gets a conviction for manslaughter because he was involved in a suicide pact with his wife. In that particular case the man pleaded guilty to and was convicted of murder. He had entered into a suicide pact with his wife. She was successful in completing her suicide with his assistance but he was not successful in killing himself. He was resuscitated and charged with murder. He pleaded guilty and got home detention. Under this legislation if he had also had a misspent youth he would have been locked up for the rest of his natural life. 
All I am saying is that there is no capacity in this legislation for any sense of forgiveness. There is no chance of redemption or for anybody to turn their lives round. How many senior gang members do people in this Chamber know who are now respected members of the community? We know that former gang members came to the ministerial Drivers of Crime meeting because they are now giving back to their communities. This bill says that they should never have been allowed out of jail and that they should have— 
The CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch) 
: I just remind the member that we are on clauses 1 and 2. It would pay to mention the title and commencement. You have mentioned them a couple of times but I would like you to come back to the title and commencement clauses 1 and 2. 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL 
: The title of this bill is misleading. It talks about reform. What I have just described to this Committee is not reform but a huge backwards step. It says that nobody can change. It is unfortunate that this Committee is debating something that is called the Sentencing and Parole Reform Bill when it should be called the “Misrepresentation of Three Strikes (a Failed Policy in the United States) Bill”. It should be called the “Let’s Make Our Communities Less Safe Bill”. It is about locking up more Maori and about making sure we give no chance to anyone to redeem themselves no matter what crime they have committed. Some of those people now contribute to our society in an extremely positive way. 
I would rather be debating something that was genuinely about reforming sentencing and parole so that we could have a safer society and so that those who were capable of redemption were able to redeem themselves and front up to the victims of their crimes. We keep forgetting that this is supposedly about the victims of crime but how is this bill looking at the victims of crime when they are not even mentioned in the title of the bill? 
Unfortunately a lot of offenders leave prison saying that they have paid their debt to society. What about their debt to the victims of their crimes? What about their debt to their victims’ families and to the community which has been upset by the crime that was committed in its midst? I think that if this bill was genuinely about sentencing and parole reform as the title clause describes it would be doing something quite different from what is presented here. This is about “three strikes” about emulating the United States and about not caring whether we end up spending 20 times the amount on our corrections system than we spend on our education system. If we go down the track the United States has that is exactly the direction we will be going in. I think it is a tragedy that we are debating something called the Sentencing and Parole Reform Bill when there is nothing reforming about it at all.