Kedgley Sue: Third Readings 
Kedgley Sue: Third Readings 
[Volume:625;Page:19838] 
SUE KEDGLEY (Green) 
: 
 One of the reasons for the leaky building fiasco which Parliament had an inquiry into was that builders and developers were not following the standards and rules that were in place. That was one of the main reasons we concluded that this fiasco of the leaky building syndrome came about. Therefore to try to ensure that all builders would have access to all the standards and would not have the excuse that they did not see them we made a provision under the Building Act that the chief executive of the Department of Building and Housing must make all material incorporated by reference—and that includes all building standards—available free of charge on the Internet. Let us be under no illusion despite all the bland reassurances from Murray Smith a United Future member whose party is propping up this legislation that all documents would be available free of charge. I assure him and also any listeners that it is not true. Building standards will no longer be provided free of charge on the Internet. 
Just to confirm that—because Murray Smith was busily saying last night that that was not the case—this morning we tried to download a basic building standard. Instead we could not do so because it was blocked. Instead we would have to pay $232 plus GST to get a basic building standard that all builders in New Zealand would be expected to comply with. Murray Smith has just told us that that is not true. He has just told us that every compliance document and all of the rules will be available free. [ 
Interruption 
] He says that a building standard is not a compliance document but it is. The building standard is the standard. It is the rule that everyone must follow. It is the most important document—the building standard that builders must follow. Some builders do not have access to those standards. Already we have spoken to some builders who have said there is no way that they will spend $232 plus GST to download a basic standard. They will rely on old knowledge. 
That is completely contrary to the objectives of the Building Act and the reason why we said that important material like building standards should be available free of charge on the Internet. That is why in the debate on the Building Act we went to considerable lengths to say that we must make it an obligation on the chief executive to make documents such as standards freely available on the Internet. This bill removes the obligation on the chief executive to make building standards available free of charge; now they no longer are. It sets a precedent. It allows not only Standards New Zealand but others to start charging for information that should be freely available. The building standards in New Zealand are owned by Standards New Zealand. They are already owned by the Government so there is not a copyright issue. They are owned by the New Zealand Government and are standards that we require everyone to follow so that we hope we can avert another leaky building fiasco. But now builders are not allowed to download the standards for free from the Internet which was the purpose of the legislation. Not even the standards that are owned by Standards New Zealand will be published online. 
I can assure members that architects and builders are mystified. They are also angry about it. Why should they be required to pay for a standard that they must follow? What is the sense of that? With this silly little issue which is presumably all about allowing the Government to earn money by charging builders $232 plus GST for a basic standard are we putting the desire to make a little bit of money from selling a standard that is supposed to be free on the Internet ahead of the whole intention of our new Building Act? That intention was to try to prevent a leaky building fiasco from happening again. We are telling all the builders in New Zealand that they have to pay through the nose for the standards but there will be builders who do not do it. They will not spend the money and will instead rely on their old knowledge. We may very well find that we are contributing through this niggardly miserly provision to further examples of leaky buildings. 
As the Greens have stated before we have no problem acknowledging that international standards that are not owned by Standards New Zealand have copyright issues and therefore cannot be freely available unless the Government purchases them. To buy all the copyrights for all international standards is probably not realistic. But the standards owned by Standards New Zealand are owned by the Government. Every builder and developer in New Zealand is obliged to follow those standards. Now we are changing this legislation to say that builders and developers can no longer get the basic standards free of charge on the Internet; now they will have to pay $232 plus GST to download them. These standards are already blocked on the Internet. Murray Smith might like to check that he can no longer download from the Internet the basic standards that all builders are expected to comply with. The intention of the Building Act was to enable building standards to be freely available on the Internet—[ 
Interruption 
] 
I raise a point of order Madam Speaker. Could you protect me from the constant interruptions from the member to my left. He is obviously agitated. I ask you to get him to contain himself. 
Madam DEPUTY SPEAKER 
: The crosstalk does distract. I ask the member to desist. 
Murray Smith 
: I raise a point of order Madam Speaker. I have not been constantly barraging the member but when I hear so much drivel coming from the Green Party I cannot help but make some response. 
Madam DEPUTY SPEAKER 
: That is not a point of order. I also remind Mr Power that I am ruling on the point of order; he is not. He should not call out: “That is not a point of order.” when a member is speaking to a point of order. 
Hon Ken Shirley 
: I raise a point of order Madam Speaker. I do not think we adequately resolved that issue. The member on her feet quite rightly called for the protection of the Chair from barraging from the cross benches. I am sitting between the members and the noise was deafening. It was a constant barrage of drivel. I think the member is entitled to protection from the Chair in that situation. 
Madam DEPUTY SPEAKER 
: Before Murray Smith rose to speak to the point of order I had indicated to him that the barraging across the cross benches was not acceptable. That had already been dealt with. 
SUE KEDGLEY 
: Thank you for your protection and intervention Madam Speaker. Some of the regulations legislation and compliance documents will be available for inspection only in Wellington. Will we have builders flying to Wellington from around New Zealand? Will people from Whangarei fly to Wellington to look at these regulations? Obviously they will not. The Government has said it is trying to reduce compliance costs in New Zealand. It has a mantra that it is reducing compliance costs and protecting small businesses. With this legislation it is increasing compliance costs. It is charging small businesses—as builders often are—around New Zealand for a basic standard that they have to comply with. They will have to pay $232. That increases compliance costs; it does not reduce them. It goes against the Government’s stated mantra about reducing compliance costs. 
It is also against the intention of the Building Act which was to ensure that materials such as standards were available free of charge on the Internet so that we could avoid a repetition of the leaky building syndrome. Evidence was presented to us that one of the reasons for the leaky building fiasco was that builders were not following standards. We wanted to make it absolutely easy and simple for all builders to follow standards so that they would have no excuse for not doing so. That is why we wanted to make the standards available free of charge on the Internet. It is ridiculous that we require builders to pay to look at basic standards on the Internet for which reason the Greens will be opposing this bill.