Ngaro AlfredHon ALFRED NGARO (National): Thank you Madam Chair.Hon Kris Faafoi: Come on guys. Be a bit more enthusiastic.Hon ALFRED NGARO: Well actually I was waiting for the honourable member up there. He looked like he was about to take a call. But look Madam Chair it is clause 2 and it is about the commencement. I don't want to labour the point but it is significant—Hon Member: I see the pun.Hon ALFRED NGARO: Ha ha that's right. But the point that has been made and the Hon Nick Smith made it is that we are talking about five years. I want to also point this out because the Hon Andrew Little for whom this bill was the Zephyr Mark II Bill said—and he spoke very passionately—that it is about time that we do something for those who are vulnerable. He actually talked about the fact the importance that if we're going to care for those who are in need—they talked about the homes they talked about the fact that there are young children out there. In fact they used figures like 42000 children and so forth. Well if it's that important then why are we waiting five years? Why are we waiting five years?It's actually quite a simple point. Why are we sort of prolonging the aspect of being able to get on and do the business? The Minister knows this. He's actually spent as the spokesperson for housing almost six years—I think that's probably the period that he was the spokesperson for housing; he knows these issues—advocating for them very strongly. So if he knows what they are he knows what the regulations are—and also as Andrew Falloon has said he has also promised there's going to be a review of the Residential Tenancies Act too for next year and he knows these things—why are we waiting five years for the commencement of this?Now there's silence on the other side because I sense even they over there realise actually it is way too long. You see you are only going to have to wait another 2½ years when the nation will ask you this question: you went out and you promised these things that you would make these houses warm and dry. You turned around and said you're going to do the big KiwiBuild—sorry KiwiBuy" scheme now not KiwiBuild but "KiwiBuild and Buy"; it's a combination a sort of fried rice thing going on. Now all of a sudden there's the back tracking right? Because the realisation is this: when you are on the Government benches—right?—you realise that the aspect of being able to moderate what you promise comes into reality. You can be on this Opposition side all care and no responsibility but when you're over there now the responsibility lies with you. So the Government on the other side are going to have to answer to the public this question: we went out and promised that we would make these homes warm and dry. And you're also going to have to be able to compare that to the record of the National Government in five years: 31000 of Housing New Zealand Corporation homes insulated; 295 in the private market in rentals were insulated. You're going to have to be able to put that record on.But you are going to have to say this: "Oh that's right. We are actually going to take five years to get there. So we're going to need you to give us a bit more confidence to give us another term to get to that point where we can commence the work that we want to do." Now I have to say to you this—and on the other side I guarantee there are those that are now questioning—why is it taking so long? And I hope that the Minister in the chair will stand and give us a good rational reason why. In that reasoning will he talk about the costing of the reasons why? Will he talk about the implications of the change in the regulations? Will he talk about the impact on landlords the effect that that will have to those who are renting? Will he have thought through all the details? He's actually had six years in Opposition to speak to understand to meet the industry to talk about that because that's actually what he promised.Here on this side we can laugh a little bit we can joke and banter a bit but let's get down to the seriousness because you promised that. You promised the very people in those communities—even over in Porirua even in those places like that you said to them this: "We will if we become the Government make these homes warmer and drier." But guess what? It's going to take you five years to do it. Yet in five years under a National Government again 31000 of Housing New Zealand homes were insulated 295—you're going to have to stack up your record against that and I've got to say to you it's going to be pretty tough. How will you do that? How will you tell them? How will you speak to those people in Carterton and Masterton? How will you tell them that under this Government under this coalition with New Zealand First and Labour we agreed to this commencing in five years' time? What will you say to them? What will be your rhyme and reason? How will you explain it? You can blind them with science but the bottom line is this: talk is cheap actions speak louder than words. What will be the record that you put on record to be able to say "This is what we achieved."?So I think that in regard to the commencement I've stayed true to scope around the commencement date. I think actually the point is really clear—Hon Member: Just because you say it doesn't make it true.Hon ALFRED NGARO: And I hope the member will stand up and actually take a call."