Jones Dail: Lawyers and Conveyancers Bill — Instruction to Committee In Committee 
Jones Dail: Lawyers and Conveyancers Bill — Instruction to Committee In Committee 
[Volume:624;Page:19500] 
DAIL JONES (NZ First) 
: 
 As I was saying before conveyancers are going to have some great difficulties in complying with the requirements of this legislation. If I were a conveyancer I would be having second thoughts about what it was I had let myself in for because conveyancers are going to have to compete with lawyers on a relatively even playing field. That was one of the requirements that New Zealand First would have wanted if there was to be a situation where lawyers lost their so-called monopoly on conveyancing. So many lawyers are doing conveyancing today at such small rates that one would wonder how anyone could possibly say there was a monopoly. But that is fair enough. As a lawyer who did a lot of conveyancing I have no problems with conveyancers coming in and doing conveyancing provided it is done on a level playing field and provided that they are largely separated from lawyers. The last thing a lawyer would want would be to be subjected to any losses resulting from the way in which conveyancers might try to interpret a complicated agreement for sale and purchase. Bearing in mind the way land agents prepare agreements for sale and purchase which are often totally unintelligible even to the land agents and to the clients somehow the two lawyers involved on both sides have to bring some sense to it and bring a reasonably quick and efficient and cheap resolution to the problems created by agents—problems that never go before the courts because lawyers are interested in just acting in the best interests of their clients. So that will be interesting. 
One other thing I am pleased with in looking at Part 1 is the creation of and the reference to the incorporated law firm. It will be of considerable interest to lawyers and the Law Society to see how they work out. Of course there will be incorporated conveyancing firms as well so when we talk about the costs associated with setting up a conveyancing firm that is another cost that they will have to think about and there will be another bonus for a lawyer probably in setting up the incorporated conveyancing firm for a conveyancer. 
But I tell the public too generally that they will now have to be a lot more careful in who they instruct to do their conveyancing. Because an incorporated conveyancing firm and an incorporated law firm being incorporated will have a different form of liability in many ways than the ordinary law firm whether it is a single lawyer on his or her own—virtually a sole trader as we would say—or lawyers in partnership whose personal assets are up for grabs if any partner does something wrong. 
One of the problems that might be experienced is that if there are too many claims on a lawyer they may lose their legal negligence protection. Then if they do something wrong and they are an incorporated law firm for example what will be the amount that any client could ever get out of that incorporated law firm? The same goes for an incorporated conveyancing firm as well considering the question of legal negligence liability policies with which Dr Worth is very familiar. 
The bill is an interesting piece of legislation. New Zealand First will support the aspects of the bill that say it can proceed in its present form as far as lawyers and conveyancers are concerned. But for the future I would be looking at another piece of legislation that would split lawyers from conveyancers. But for the time being we will go along with this bill as it is. It is the best of a bad job at the moment. The Law Society has said that it wants it and I emphasise in this first call that the main reason we are supporting this bill is that the Law Society says it wants this bill in this form. I think every lawyer knows that this is not the best form of the legislation and lawyers do not want to be associated with conveyancers. It is like midwives and general practitioners being forced into the same relationship. Midwives and general practitioners in past times did not get on very well at all and in a similar way lawyers and conveyancers have not got on very well. But I suspect that once this legislation is passed and conveyancers can go their own way and lawyers can go their own way and do their conveyancing that situation might improve.