Mahuta NanaiaHon NANAIA MAHUTA (Labour—Hauraki-Waikato): Following on from the sound contribution of my colleague Ruth Dyson I want to make a comment on a number of matters that have been raised in the Committee but more importantly to ask the Minister for Social Development to clarify what evidence she has received to determine that delegating the authority or giving the chief executive power to delegate care and protection responsibilities in itself is a sound decision. For example if as I heard in previous contributions the Minister is basing that on agreements with iwi there would be evidence built into the memorandums of understanding that have been secured over the last 2 years when iwi have been giving feedback on the way in which better responses to child care and protection could happen. So I want to comment on the report that she recently received with regard to Mokopuna Ora and some of the reflections—let us say observations—that Waikato-Tainui have experienced in trying to make a care and protection system work well within an iwi context.There are a number of challenges. The Minister has been briefed on them and I know that she has been aware of the various aspects of the process by which Waikato-Tainui responded to the 87-odd cases that they dealt with within their contracted period to try to ensure that (1) mokopuna were able to go back into whānau (2) the process worked better for those who were caring for these mokopuna and (3) there was better coordination of the discussion with Child Youth and Family whose processes were not as accessible to whānau as they could have been.In working through the process just the amount of effort that the iwi went into in ensuring and identifying and aligning Child Youth and Family expectations of whānau who were able to be carers and the kaitiaki who were selected—there was quite a bit of intensive work to try to ensure the right whānau were being picked. By right" I mean whānau were being given enough information about their responsibilities but also about how to navigate the system in a way that was going to ultimately be beneficial for the mokopuna. A number of hui were held—wānanga if you like—and they made some I think useful observations to the Minister. Were it to be adopted there were things that were needed that were absolutely crucial.The other part of it was the iwi support advisers who ultimately were charged with working with kaitiaki and mokopuna to better ensure that whānau plans were being developed. From my understanding of the amount of intensity that went into this very little of that I guess engagement required a specific set of social work; it was more around case management. If that is the case—that case management or navigator assistance was at the core of the iwi support advisers and of being able to develop whānau plans for mokopuna that were not only going to be implemented but implemented to the extent that you would not see these mokopuna going in the revolving system of State care—there was a range of issues that were identified in making this work.Minister I think the concern that I am raising right now is that this at its initial stage was evaluated—this whole process. There were some insights gained. Obviously the extent of wraparound services envisaged was a lot more than was thought of at the beginning so it was a design phase that they went through. Once they presented the evidence Minister it would be I think only prudent to explain to the House again what justification to delegate State care has been received. From the information I have received there is still a lot more work to do within iwi settings in order to have absolute confidence that the care of mokopuna is at the heart of any decision-making process and that the core oversight of the chief executive of Child Youth and Family remains key to ensuring that children are not in a revolving system of State care but more importantly—and I think this is the insight from the iwi experience—that there is a greater emphasis on the role of whānau being responsible within the whole process.I am aware Minister that evaluations were made. There must be further evidence beyond the case that I am citing whereby you are making the decision to delegate—that the chief executive can delegate power—but on the basis of the report that I have seen it is too early yet. I would hate for iwi to be used as the gold star standard of the reason why such a provision exists when even they have observed that it is at a very early stage. Quite frankly our children are far too important to gamble on with provisions like this which do not give absolute confidence.So I am asking the Minister to take a call to identify the range of evidence that has been provided to her to give her confidence that the chief executive should be given powers to delegate the care and protection responsibilities to another entity. If that evidence is based on iwi examples I do think that needs clarification. I know that there is some nervousness that still remains with some of the iwi providers about ensuring they have got the best system possible before everything gets delegated to iwi.In saying that Waikato-Tainui have been very proactive in wanting to work alongside Child Youth and Family. They have observed that the processes are clunky and do not work in favour of informing whānau clearly of the court process the family group conference process and the consequent impacts on decision making. They do favour from the evaluation that I have seen monitored implementation of whānau plans for the successful placement of mokopuna. They absolutely favour that as a process. They raised with you Minister concerns about any prospect of changing section 5(2) of the principal Act and you may wish to take a call Minister because you have forecast future changes to the legislation. It would be—beyond Waikato-Tainui—interesting to know whether there was a consistency of evaluation feedback again that would give confidence around the models being embarked on within iwi to retain children within whānau kin group care and also to monitor the prevention of children going into the care cycle so that they are into long-term care placement. Kia ora tātou."