Rich Katherine: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Rich Katherine: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Volume:641;Page:11480] 
5.  
KATHERINE RICH (National) 
 to the  
Minister of Education 
: Does he have confidence in the Teachers Council to monitor compliance with conditions placed on teachers with a history of serious misconduct including sex abuse assaulting children and drug dealing; if so why? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY (Minister of Education) 
: 
 Yes I do. The Teachers Council has assured me that it has robust and appropriate systems in place to monitor conditions based on a teacher’s registration. We are currently drafting an amendment to the Education Act to enable the Teachers Council to access payroll data in order to monitor all teachers not just the ones with conditions. However I am advised that in a specific case where there is good reason data matching with the Ministry of Education’s payroll system is already taking place. 
Katherine Rich 
: Why does the Minister have confidence in the Teachers Council to monitor teachers found guilty of serious misconduct when the principal of Kawerau College Steve Hocking followed proper processes but found out to his horror through text messages from students at other schools that the school had hired an art teacher who had uploaded over 50 pornographic pictures of himself on the Net and actively attempted to recruit younger girls and when he says that the Teachers Council system is “limp” and that any teacher “could quite happily and merrily be a paedophile” and the principal would never know? 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: Hopeless! 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: The member raises a very important point unlike the member next to her who could do with being quiet for a change. As I mentioned in my answer to the earlier question the system currently focuses on those people who have conditions attached to their teaching. This person of course did not. This is a person who has lost his practising certificate. In that case I think there would be some debate about the school and its ability to check through the information that was available for example checking through the person’s history and doing the normal checks as it employed the person. This might have been something that the school had done. Certainly to avoid that kind of problem I asked the Teachers Council in respect of an earlier question between myself and the member to come back with anything it thought might help close all loopholes. The council suggested it needed total access to the entire payroll for the Ministry of Education. That is what the legislation will do which will allow the council to run names against that database so that no one will be in a position in the future of being able to avoid the council catching up with him or her. 
Moana Mackey 
: What steps has the Labour-led Government taken to strengthen teacher registration requirements? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: People will remember that back in the 1990s the National Government made teacher registration voluntary. Although it reinstated registration in 1997 there was no professional body for teachers and no requirement for police vetting before a teacher was employed in a school. In other words it was basically open slather during National’s time in Government. Since then we have established the Teachers Council which has the power to deregister teachers and impose conditions on their registration and which requires all teachers who take up teaching to be police vetted. Unlike the previous National Government which removed teacher registration at the same time that it introduced registration for vets we are serious about student safety and ensuring that our schools provide a good environment for students. 
Katherine Rich 
: Why is the Minister giving answers in the House today that are almost exactly the same answers he gave when asked questions back in October and why was he so confident back in October when he said of the teachers sanctioned for a range of issues such as beating up children sexual abuse supplying drugs and having sex with students that “there is close monitoring of conditions attached to any individual teacher allowed to remain registered as a teacher” and that he had also received assurances that “conditions put into place have been followed to the letter” when a Teachers Council memo from the same time says: “I cannot find any evidence of the research team monitoring conditions placed on teachers” and that “it also appears there are problems in the monitoring of the conditions placed on a teacher’s registration”; and why did the Minister say in the House that the council was monitoring it when it was not? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: In answer to the first part of the question to be consistent. We try to be consistent in our answers to these questions. In answer to the second question the member will know that the newspaper article that highlighted this was the  
Herald on Sunday  
article and she will know that in that article the Teachers Council made it very clear that the member of staff who answered that question was a new member of staff who at that time was unaware of the conditions. The member needs to be clear about this. The Teachers Council is the body that looks after teachers. Unlike the member’s Government which focused on vets we are focused on teachers. The person concerned was a new member of staff. Yes this person did not know about the conditions but that does not make it any different: the conditions do exist. 
Katherine Rich 
: Why is the Minister trying to diminish the findings of a new employee a woman who held a similar position at the Medical Council who has worked in the Department for Courts who is obviously a capable person and who was charged with finding out whether there was evidence of monitoring or there was not—she found that there was not so how does he explain that? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: No one is trying to diminish anything. I am just simply relaying to the member what the chief executive of the organisation made clear to the  
Herald on Sunday 
. I am sorry if the truth is not adequate for the member but sometimes one just has to accept it. 
Katherine Rich 
: Why is the Minister making a song and dance of his reluctant decision to allow the Teachers Council to share payroll information—the only sure way of tracking censured teachers—when the council has been lobbying the ministry for years to get access to that information only to be stonewalled and asked the Minister about this a year ago and he is doing something only now? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: I know the member’s own history on this issue. Her party’s history would lead them to be anxious about it; I understand that. But what I am saying is that the member opposite will know exactly when she asked me the question about this and that led to me asking the Teachers Council to submit to me any changes it would like to have that might improve the situation. That is when the council told me. That is when we acted upon it that is why we are drafting legislation and that is why we will pass it through the House unlike the member’s party. 
Katherine Rich 
: Why should parents believe the Minister when last year he said that the Teachers Council system of monitoring was robust when it was not; that teachers were being monitored when they were not; and just recently when asked about whether a particular art teacher was teaching in a classroom he said he was not and we found he was teaching at Kawerau College? 
Hon STEVE MAHAREY 
: Starting at the back it is because when I answered the question he was not teaching at Kawerau College. It is an appropriate system and it is robust. I say to the member on the other side that the reason I would trust the Labour Government on this particular issue is because unlike her party which deregistered teachers while it registered vets we have done the opposite and have made sure they are properly supervised.