Williamson Maurice: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Williamson Maurice: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Volume:626;Page:21202] 
5.  
Hon MAURICE WILLIAMSON (National—Pakuranga) 
 to the  
Minister of Finance 
: Did he personally apologise to the chief executive of the Auckland chamber of commerce for the behaviour of Transit board member Mike Williams at a meeting between Ministers and Auckland business organisations; if so why? 
Hon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN (Minister of Finance) 
: 
 I apologised to Mr Barnett but not in relation to Mr Williams’ behaviour in the meeting in my office. I did so—[ 
Interruption 
] I think that member should apologise for her behaviour almost every day. I did so because the Government values its relationship with the Auckland chamber of commerce and wishes to cooperate further in proceeding even faster in resolving Auckland’s transport problems. I note that the Auckland chamber of commerce has declined to sign up to the northern employers and manufacturers party political programme aimed against this Government. 
Hon Maurice Williamson 
: Was Mike Williams present at the meeting as Labour Party president or was he there formally as a member of the Transit board and if it was the second had he originally asked the chairman and did the chairman delegate it to him or did Mike Williams just show up because he is a political crony? 
Hon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN 
: Certainly Mr Williams is a political something; I would not describe him as a political crony. But my understanding is that he was there to give information about Transit’s position. Whether he talked to the board chair I have no idea in that respect. 
Peter Brown 
: Is this the same meeting that the Auckland chamber of commerce chief executive officer refers to in his press release today when he states that the use of borrowing will be examined to speed up the completion of Auckland’s western ring route network; if it is has the Government genuinely taken on board New Zealand First’s urging that Transit should be allowed to borrow against future income without the use of tolls and without any further increase in excise tax petrol tax or road-user charges? 
Hon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN 
: No what the Government has done already on one project has been to indicate that there will be the ability to borrow against a future income stream off that road. If one is borrowing against the future income to Transit how will one build the next lot of roads? 
Hon Maurice Williamson 
: Was Mike Williams one of the people John Tamihere was talking about in the  
Investigate 
 article when asked about the machine that existed on the ninth floor and he said: “Oh yeah there’s definitely a ‘machine’ all right. It’s formidable. It’s got apparatus and activists in everything from the PPTA all the way through. It’s actually even built a counterweight to the Roundtable—Businesses for Social Responsibility.”; was Mike Williams one of those tentacles? 
Hon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN 
: I have no idea what Mr Tamihere was referring to but I can confirm there is a formidable machine on the ninth floor and it is going to flatten the Opposition in about 3 months’ time. 
Peter Brown 
: Noting the answer the Minister gave to my supplementary question is he telling the House there will be widespread tolling of the Auckland western ring route? 
Hon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN 
: Legislation has already been passed to deal with the issue of tolling. We made it clear that the Albany to Puhoi realignment project would be subject to tolling. There is widespread support in the Auckland business community and in Auckland widely for some tolling for specific roading projects. If Dr Mapp cares to look at his own party’s policy there is support for that from National as well. 
Hon Maurice Williamson 
: Does the Minister have concerns that a board member of Transit was so ill-informed that he thought the major projects such as the State Highway 20 extension at Mount Roskill had already begun when clearly it has not or does he think Mr Williams was confused by a plethora of documents put out by Transit—for example one stating: “We expect State Highway 20 Mount Roskill to commence in September 2002 and to be completed by May 2005” or a householder 
brochure sent out in August 2002 to every house in Auckland which stated that the State Highway 20 Mount Roskill extension would commence in 2004 yet today the select committee was told the project has not yet started if so is that the reason why Mr Williams is so confused? 
Hon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN 
: I have no idea at all about those particular matters. What I do know—[ 
Interruption 
] I do not live inside Maurice Williamson’s head and I am very grateful for that fact. What I can say is that the roading projects under way in Auckland at the moment are worth more than ten times as much as those in the last year of the previous National Government when it talked about roads but did nothing at all about them. Now of course the Opposition is big on promises and has the ex - Social Credit finance spokesperson to front its roading campaign in Auckland. 
Hon Pete Hodgson 
: Is he surprised to learn notwithstanding the supplementary question previously asked by the member that when that same member asked the Chief Executive of Transit New Zealand at this morning’s select committee meeting whether the Mount Roskill project had begun he was advised that it has that the tender has been let to a good Dunedin company called Fulton Hogan that the pre-construction work is already under way and that one does not start up bulldozers in Auckland in the middle of winter? 
Madam SPEAKER 
: I note there was an interjection during a question. I am asked to apply— 
Hon Maurice Williamson 
: I apologise. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: The normal penalty is to leave the Chamber but I know you are in the midst of asking your questions. I ask everyone to try to exercise a little control. 
Hon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN 
: No I would not be surprised at all. I would not expect Mr Williamson to understand anything about Auckland roads if he relies upon information from Mr Alasdair Thompson the ex - Social Credit Party finance spokesperson. 
Dail Jones 
: Does the Minister of Finance realise—and adding to what has just been said—that the tender has gone out and that it is proposed to extend State Highway 20 through Mount Roskill to the New Windsor area to Maioro Street and that that is common knowledge in the Auckland area to most people although I would think most Aucklanders in that Mount Roskill - north-western area would not like tolls? 
Hon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN 
: It is not my understanding that the proposal is to toll that particular road but it would be quite foolish for any Government to forgo the ability to engage in specific projects related to tolling if we wish to accelerate infrastructure development within New Zealand. At the end of the day things have to be paid for. I am sure the member is aware that outside Auckland there is some feeling that perhaps Auckland could contribute a little more to its own roading network. 
Hon Maurice Williamson 
: I seek leave to table five documents. The first is a Transit document dated February 2000 in which it states: “SH20 Mount Roskill will begin in 2003”. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table that document. Is there any objection? There is objection. 
Hon Maurice Williamson 
: The second one is a Transit media release of September 2000 stating that it will begin in late 2003. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table that document. Is there any objection? There is. 
Hon Maurice Williamson 
: The next one is a major bulletin put out in October 2004 in which Transit brings the date forward to September 2002 for commencement. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table that document. Is there any objection? Yes there is. 
Hon Maurice Williamson 
: The third one is a 2002 media release stating: “Green light for Mount Roskill motorway given”. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table that document. Is there any objection? There is. 
Hon Maurice Williamson 
: The fourth is a media release from Transit from June 2004 stating: “Commencement later this year by Christmas”. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table that document. Is there any objection? Yes there is objection. 
Hon Maurice Williamson 
: The last one is the big household brochure that went out in August 2004 stating that it would start in 2004—which it did not. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table that document. Is there any objection? There is objection.