Hobbs Marian: Resource Management Amendment Bill (No 2) — Instruction to CommitteeCWH In Committee Speaker Recalled In Committee 
Hobbs Marian: Resource Management Amendment Bill (No 2) — Instruction to CommitteeCWH In Committee Speaker Recalled In Committee 
[Volume:608;Page:5522] 
Hon MARIAN HOBBS (Minister for the Environment) 
: 
 I have some clarifications that I would like to offer particularly on this area of historic heritage. Dr Nick Smith asked me in his first speech after dinner why the Government did not devolve the decision making to local government as the review said in 1998. The review said firstly: “Put historic heritage into matters of national importance in this Act.” The committee agreed with that at that time. Secondly it said: “Would you devolve the notion of what is historic heritage to local level decision-making?”. 
The Associate Minister for Arts Culture and Heritage in the newGovernment—in 1999-2000—signified to the Local Government and Environment Committee and I understand this from reading the notes of the report back that the Governmentdid not think that local government had the expertise at all 77 council levels to make that decision so it wanted that power to remain at the national level. I was asked about the two parts of the double. That is why the two parts were not given over. The committee did put “historic heritage” into matters of national importance in the Act but it left it to the Historic Places Trust to handle definition at the national level. 
I think there is still work to go on that particular issue and I understand from my colleague Judith Tizard that there is continuing and expanded work in this area. However the select committee agreed with the 1998 review and I want to read from the report of the committee on the No. 1 bill because some people are intimating that this issue has just come up in the No. 2 bill. It stated: “Government and Green members recommend that the definition of historic heritage be modified to refer to natural and physical resources that contribute to an understanding and appreciation of New Zealand’s history and cultures. We also recommend including the phrases spiritual qualities cultural landscapes wahi tapu and ancestral landscapes. However we recommend that the phrase historic gardens and reference to the contents of historic places be omitted from the definition.” That was not something that came out of the blue; that was as a result of submissions and argument and it was reflected in the report back on the Resource Management Amendment Bill (No 1). 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: When did the public comment on it? 
Hon MARIAN HOBBS 
: It came out of— 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: It’s 2 years old— 
Hon MARIAN HOBBS 
: Excuse me! Have I the floor or not? It came out of the discussions that were had and submissions to the bill that the committee reported back. That is no different. Had we continued with the Resource Management Amendment Bill (No 1) it would not have been sent back to a committee because the committee arrived at this decision and reported it back to the House. We amalgamated it by taking that decision into the Resource Management Amendment Bill (No 2). 
The third point I want to pick up on and I really agree with my colleague Georgina when she made the comment about the notion— 
The CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson) 
: The Minister must use the person’s full name title or portfolio. 
Hon MARIAN HOBBS 
: I am sorry. I really agree with my colleague Georgina te Heuheu. I want to make a comment about the definition of the word “spiritual”. I have to admit that I too have difficulties with the definition of this word. “Spiritual” is different to different people. The interesting thing about it is that when I have discussions with people from the Historic Places Trust they say that “spiritual” is a church. Looking at a good friend and colleague of mine in the gallery I would have to say that “spiritual” is a community that may use a building as a church. It is not necessarily the actual building itself. But there are definitions in the bill—namely about cultural and historic—that may well include the preservation of a church so I am kind of interested in the discussion occurring in the Chamber tonight on this issue. I wanted to clarify some of those issues with members and make a response to them.