Cunliffe David: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Cunliffe David: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Sitting date: 19 March 2013. Volume:688;Page:8611. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
10. 
Hon DAVID CUNLIFFE (Labour—New Lynn) 
 to the  
Minister of Revenue 
: Why has the Government decided not to change the fringe benefit taxation of employer-provided car parks in Auckland and Wellington but to leave in place proposals to tax cell phones and laptops? 
Hon PETER DUNNE (Minister of Revenue) 
: 
 The reason for the car-park decision was made clear in yesterday’s joint press release with the Minister of Finance. The proposals to review the tax treatment of the use of cellphones or laptops were included in an official issues paper reviewing the wider treatment of employee allowances and other expenditure payments. The Government has made no decisions on any of these issues but is currently undertaking consultation on whether the existing law needs to be updated. With regard to cellphones and laptops I will not be recommending any change to their current treatment unless the consultation process highlights anomalies or inconsistencies that need to be resolved in the interests of fairness and equity. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: What due diligence was done on the compliance costs of the car-park tax prior to Cabinet approval and his lodging Supplementary Order Paper 167 on the Taxation (Livestock Valuation Assets Expenditure and Remedial Matters) Bill and did this concur with independent analysis that showed the compliance costs would be far higher than the revenue gained from the tax? 
Hon PETER DUNNE 
: Consistent with the generic tax policy process that has been in place since the mid-1990s the announcement was made early last year that we were considering such a proposal. An issues paper was released and submissions were invited upon that issues paper. As a result of that issues paper recommendations were made to Cabinet which were included in legislation. The groups that led the campaign that became prominent last week did not make any submissions to any of those documents at any earlier stage. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: I seek leave to table a letter from the New Zealand Institute of Economic Research where it has identified gaps in the Government’s analysis which prevents the paper from being “required reasonable or robust” and concludes that it is not clear at all from the regulatory impact statement that the proposed solutions are superior to the status quo. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: What is the date of the New Zealand Institute of Economic Research’s letter? 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: The date of that letter is 7 March 2013. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table that. Are there any objections? Yes there is. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: I seek leave to table a document from accounting firm Lock and Partners estimating that the compliance cost of the car-park tax is roughly double the revenue that it would bring in. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table an opinion from Lock and Partners. There is objection. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: What due diligence has therefore been conducted on his next proposal to tax cellphones tablets and laptops and does he expect “even stronger” opposition to this such as the more than 90 percent of Stuff poll respondents who oppose the iPad tax and the proposed campaign by the Employers and Manufacturers Association? 
Hon PETER DUNNE 
: I will answer two of the three questions contained in that. Firstly the quote that the member referred to was mine so of course I stand by it. Secondly with regard to the development of the proposals relating to iPads cellphones etc. they are more to do with the consistency of the application of the tax rules than any revenue gain. The member may not have noticed but technology has moved substantially in recent years and there are anomalies within existing tax law in terms of their treatment. That was what the consultation process was seeking to resolve. As I said in my primary answer if I cannot be satisfied that there will be fair and equitable outcomes as a result of that I will not be recommending any change to the existing arrangements. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: I seek leave to table an email from the Employers and Manufacturers Association dated 18 March—yesterday—which notes the start of a new campaign against the taxation of work cellphones and laptops. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Whom is the email to? 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: Sorry? 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Whom is the email to? 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: The email is a circular email to the membership of the Employers and Manufacturers Association. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table such an email. Is there any objection? Yes there is. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: This one is internet-based but not generally available. I seek leave to table a snapshot of the Stuff online poll that shows 90.5 percent of respondents opposed to cellphone tax— 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Order! That is available if members so want it. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: Does he agree with Prime Minister John Key’s statements immediately before the House today that “There is virtually no chance of [laptop and cellphone tax] going ahead.”; if he does agree with that will he now commit to withdrawing this bizarre tax proposal? 
Hon PETER DUNNE 
: The member should listen before reverting to invective. What I said in my primary answer was that I would not be recommending that this tax proceed unless there were significant issues of fairness and equity that could be resolved as a result of the change. That remains the position I think it is entirely consistent with what the Prime Minister said and it is a proper and responsible way to approach these issues. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: Did the Prime Minister consult him before ruling out the cellphone tax at 1.55 p.m. today; if so and he was consulted why did he not withdraw the barking-mad tax himself rather than wait for the Prime Minister to do it? 
Hon PETER DUNNE 
: I have had a number of discussions in recent days with the Prime Minister on these matters but I want to make the point clear to the member who seems unwilling or incapable of understanding it. This is not a Government proposal; it is a suggestion by the Inland Revenue Department out there for consultation. When that member was the Associate Minister of Revenue in a previous Labour Government I recall him issuing an issues paper relating to a capital gains tax on people’s offshore savings which I had to tidy up when I became the Minister. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I seek leave to table—[ 
Interruption 
] 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Order! A point of order has been raised and I want to hear what it is. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: Thank you Mr Speaker. I seek leave to table a statement by the Hon Dr Michael Cullen that shows that he considered but rejected the same tax the Hon Peter Dunne has just floated on the grounds of excessive compliance costs. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: What date is the statement? 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: The date is 2005. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: No that is not necessary. 
Hon David Parker 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I do not understand why that was not in order to be tabled. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Because it was a press release done many many years ago. 
Hon David Parker 
: It wasn’t a press release was it? 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Yes it was. 
Hon Trevor Mallard 
: Point of order Mr Speaker. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: Point of order Mr Speaker. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: No. Look I can deal with only one point of order at a time. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: In answer to the Speaker’s question it was an excerpt from a speech given by the then Minister in approximately August 2005. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Was it a speech given in the House? 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: By the then Minister of Finance and Revenue the Hon Dr Michael Cullen. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: In the House? 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: No in public. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Listen the easiest way to resolve this is. Leave has been sought to table a speech from Dr Michael Cullen. Is there any objection? Yes there is. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Question No. 11 Melissa Lee. 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: Supplementary Mr Speaker. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Sorry. Supplementary question the Hon Dr Nick Smith. 
Hon Trevor Mallard 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. You cannot call a supplementary question when you have called the next question. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I did not see it. 
Hon Trevor Mallard 
: He wasn’t standing; she was. You called her and once you’ve called her you can’t go back. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I am going back and I have given the call to the Hon Dr Nick Smith for a supplementary question. 
Hon Trevor Mallard 
: Can we go back to question No. 1 Mr Speaker? 
Mr SPEAKER 
: No but if the member carries on like that he will not be here for question No. 12 I can assure him of that. Right we—[ 
Interruption 
] Order! We have a supplementary question from the Hon Dr Nick Smith. 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: What reports has he received on proposals for taxing offshore bank accounts and would they require the disclosure of those bank accounts for those to take effect? 
Hon PETER DUNNE 
: I have not received reports in recent days but I do recall advice at the time I first became the Minister of Revenue regarding a Government discussion paper issued under the previous Government that was in vogue at that stage in the name of the primary questioner which proposed putting in place what would effectively be a capital gains tax on people’s offshore savings. It is interesting to note— 
Hon Trevor Mallard 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. Two points: first of all I am going to ask you to review on tape your decision to allow that supplementary question to progress and second I invite you to look at whether you should have cut it off when the area the Minister was responsible for had finished. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I thank the member for his assistance. 
Hon Gerry Brownlee 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I would never want to stop you from having the joy of watching yourself on tape in the late hours of the evening but I think you should rule on the second part of that question now. It was not out of order. The Minister was asked a fair question related to the primary— 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I thank the member. I have said I will have a look at the transcript tonight and I will. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: I seek leave to table a copy of the National - United Future coalition agreement a matter now of some— 
Mr SPEAKER 
: No that is available to all members.