Turei Metiria: Oral Questions — Questions to MinistersText is incorporated into the Bound VolumeTurei Metiria: Oral Questions — Questions to Ministers[Sitting date: 01 March 2016. Volume:711;Page:9199. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.]2.METIRIA TUREI (Co-Leader—Green) to the Minister for Building and Housing: Will the Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill guarantee that no New Zealand renter will live in a cold damp mouldy house that makes them sick; if not why not?Hon Dr NICK SMITH (Minister for Building and Housing): This bill will make 180000 homes warmer drier and safer without imposing excessive compliance costs on landlords that would inevitably be passed on to tenants. The bill requires that all rental properties have a smoke alarm by 1 July this year and that they are progressively insulated over a period of 3 years. No bill provides an absolute guarantee; it is as foolish as pretending that our criminal laws prevent all murders or that our road safety laws prevent all motor accidents. [Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: Order! Can I just before I call the member mention the level of interjection. We have been away for a week so I would expect some level of interjection but if it is going to be disruptive then I will start naming members mentioning their names and then if it continues beyond that I will with regret be asking some members to leave.Metiria Turei: Will the Minister take the advice of the Child Poverty Action Group and include a rentals warrant of fitness in the Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill to provide a more comprehensive improvement in the warmth the dryness and safety of rental houses?Hon Dr NICK SMITH: There are two problems with the warrant of fitness proposal. I am advised by officials that it would cost $225 per home or $100 million per year just for the compliance and the administration without fixing a single house. The second concern I have is the pedantic nature of having “Clipboard Charlies” putting in unreasonable requirements. For instance if I look at the member’s own bill it would assess my Beehive office as unsafe because I do not have a safety strip on my window or my flat and I do not think that is reasonable. The third part is of course that any cost that you impose actually goes on to rents and if you are going to put $225 on the cost of every rental property in New Zealand that is actually a cost that will impact on the very families that we should be helping.Metiria Turei: What then is the cost of the lives of the 15 children who die each year from poor housing and the 42000 child admissions to hospital each year from cold damp housing and poverty?Hon Dr NICK SMITH: This Government has made more progress on getting our homes insulated than any other Government in history. That is why we have a bill before the House that is going to require all homes to be insulated by 1 July 2019 and to require a smoke alarm because there are too many New Zealanders who die unnecessarily as a consequence of the lack of those things. What we are not going to do is impose a massive bureaucracy that will impose costs on the very families that we are trying to help.Metiria Turei: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. The Minister referred to the cost of a warrant of fitness scheme. I asked him the financial cost of the deaths of 15 children and the 42000 child hospital admissions. He did not answer that question—Mr SPEAKER: Order! And nor could you expect a Minister to do that. When you consider that it is a supplementary question I do not think the member could rightfully expect the Minister to put a dollar value on to 15 deaths and what I think were 40000 hospital admissions. The question was without doubt addressed.Metiria Turei: Has the Minister sought any advice on the cost of 15 child deaths and the 42000 child admissions to hospital caused every year by cold damp housing?Hon Dr NICK SMITH: Yes I have. There has been extensive cost-benefit analysis on the Government proposals. The analyses showed that a warrant of fitness imposed more cost than benefit and that the proposal that we have in the bill is the best way in which we can address the very issues that the member is concerned about.Joanne Hayes: What progress has been made in improving home insulation over the past 15 years?Hon Dr NICK SMITH: The previous Government managed to do 2000 home insulations per year or 18000 over its 9 years. We firstly put a focus on insulating those 30000 State houses. We then provided for Warm Up New Zealand: Heat Smart and Warm Up New Zealand: Healthy Homes which provided for 290000 houses. This bill provides for a further 180000 houses a total of 500000. I do find it a bit rich for members opposite who did fewer than 20000 to criticise this Government for doing 500000.Metiria Turei: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. The Minister was not required to answer my initial question on the costs of deaths and child admissions because he did not have the information. He just admitted that he does have—Mr SPEAKER: Order! The question was whether the Minister had sought any advice. His very first answer was yes he had sought advice on that issue. Without doubt the question was answered.Hon Dr NICK SMITH: To help the House because there have been some questions about the cost-benefit analysis a review has been done by Arthur Grimes and I seek the leave of the House to table that review of the cost-benefit analysis.Mr SPEAKER: Leave is sought to table that cost-benefit analysis. Is there any objection? There is none; it can be tabled.Document by leave laid on the Table of the House.Metiria Turei: Is the Minister denying the evidence of the Victoria University of Wellington Students Association which reports students—[Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: Order! Start the question again.Metiria Turei: Thank you Mr Speaker. Is the Minister denying the evidence of the Victoria University of Wellington Student Association which reports students having to spend over 98 percent of their student living costs loans on rent for cold damp mouldy homes which make them sick?Hon Dr NICK SMITH: The member wisely makes the point that there is a connection between making sure homes are affordable as well as good quality. What the member needs to look at in this bill is the new enforcement provisions. The Government’s view is that rather than spending on a compliance cost that has a warrant of fitness over all 500000 homes what we actually need to do is to enforce the existing housing regulations which many of those student flats breach and actually give my ministry the powers to prosecute those landlords and that is what is provided for in the bill. The member may be interested that when I met with the students association it was very positive about those provisions in the bill.Metiria Turei: Does the Minister dismiss the evidence of the Auckland Regional Public Health Service the Public Health Association and the nurses’ associations which all say that the bill does not go far enough to protect health and that what is needed is a proper warrant of fitness in this bill?Hon Dr NICK SMITH: Where those groups are incorrect is that they do not look at the $100 million cost of the bureaucracy of a warrant of fitness over all 500000 rental properties in New Zealand. And what is a far more sensible response—that is what is provided for in the bill—is for us to actually focus on those homes that are substandard and breach the current housing regulations and to actually get on and enforce those. That is a far more sensible approach to this issue than a warrant of fitness over all 500000 homes.Metiria Turei: If the Minister will not take the advice of these groups will he take the advice of Andrew King of the Property Investors Federation who agrees that cold damp rental homes are a problem in New Zealand and that the Government should fund power bill vouchers to the 30000 families with children who have cold-related health conditions from rental properties?Hon Dr NICK SMITH: Mr King has made very plain to me that he does not support a warrant of fitness. What he would wish is that the Government either through tax or other grants pay for the cost of landlords getting their properties up to spec. It is the Government’s view that landlords do have responsibilities and although through Warm Up New Zealand: Heat Smart we have provided $500 million for insulating houses landlords also have responsibility to have their rental properties up to standard.