Collins Judith: Parental Leave and Employment Protection Amendment Bill — In Committee 
Collins Judith: Parental Leave and Employment Protection Amendment Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:621;Page:16490] 
JUDITH COLLINS (National—Clevedon) 
: 
 It is great to be able to follow such a great contribution from my colleague Georgina te Heuheu on the Parental Leave and Employment Protection Amendment Bill in particular. If only this was a provision we could support because we would support it if it was reasonable and if it did not discriminate against the people who are the backbone of this country’s economy. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: The high-tech sector! 
JUDITH COLLINS 
: The farming and agricultural sectors in this country are the biggest contributors to our economy and they are being excluded. They get the joy of struggling to go out and milk the cows. They go and do that— 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: Queen Street farmers! 
JUDITH COLLINS 
: I raise a point of order Mr Chairman. That member is interjecting away from his own seat which I understand is over there. I think that breaches the Standing Orders. 
The CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson) 
: I say to the member on my right that members may change their seats provided they do not use the opportunity to interject. So I caution the member to desist. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: I raise a point of order Mr Chairperson. I submit for your consideration that while fully in keeping with your ruling in terms of the Standing Orders I have not moved seats for the purpose of interjecting. I moved seats for the purpose of preparing my submission. The interjections were both rare and reasonable and I thought they were reasonably witty. 
The CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson) 
: The Minister may not originally have moved seats to interject but he is now in a position where he has an unfair advantage. If he wishes to interject then he needs to go back to his own seat. 
JUDITH COLLINS 
: This bill is discriminatory against the most productive sector in New Zealand—the farming sector. The people in that sector are being excluded by this provision. They say as we say that people should be free to make their own arrangements. But if we are going to encourage working people to have children and by goodness we should then we should not discriminate against those who are in their own businesses. We should not give preferential treatment to certain sectors that happen mostly to support the Government such as some of the people in the teaching profession. Nurses are not included and that is very interesting. Some doctors and some teachers are included but nurses are not. That is what is so wrong. 
Opposition Member 
: Haven’t the nurses got it? 
JUDITH COLLINS 
: Well they do not need to help the nurses now because of course they think they have the nurses fooled; but the nurses are going to be told otherwise. They are being excluded. 
I would like to be able to support this provision but until it is reasonable I cannot. While it is so discriminatory I will not accept it and neither will the National Party. When I was self-employed I was in the situation of looking after a baby and I wonder about the fact that I had to provide for a locum to come in and work in my business. What if after 6 months she then become pregnant and decided to take leave? What would happen in that situation? Would I as a self-employed person then have the joy of giving parental leave to a locum who was on a fixed-term contract? I would like to hear from the Minister about that. Are these in fact some of the people who will be protected by this legislation while the poor old employer has to try to find someone else to fill the gap for 3 4 5 or 6 months or for extended leave? That is the difficulty—finding people who are often key people in key roles. 
I am one of the people in this place who has actually had a prospective employer say to me when I was in my 20s—which I am certainly not in now—“Oh well you might go off and have babies.” I have had that happen to me. 
Darren Hughes 
: The 1950s was a different time. 
JUDITH COLLINS 
: That young man over there should sit back and listen to someone who has lived a bit of life. Having said that I know it happens. Employers do think like that. They feel they are being absolutely targeted by this Government and that they are being punished for having the get up and go to mortgage their homes and set up their own businesses. Why can we not help employers in that situation—self-employed people and business people? 
My colleague Wayne Mapp made the point that most businesses in this country are small businesses. Most of it is not Telecom or Carter Holt Harvey. Come to think of it Carter Holt Harvey is quite small now and it is getting smaller. Most businesses are not big brewery companies. Most are mum-and-dad businesses—people who are panel beaters people who run garages small law firms and doctors’ surgeries. They are small-business people and they are the ones who are being punished by this Government.