Robertson GrantHon GRANT ROBERTSON (Minister for Infrastructure): Yes I think it is. Thank you very much Mr Speaker for that. The facts of what occurred on Monday have largely been laid by out by Barbara Kuriger in her opening speech and also by the Hon David Parker as well so I'm not going to dwell at any great length on those.I would note picking up a point that the Hon Julie Anne Genter was making just before she sat down that if the Government was involved at the level that National Party members seem to think we would be we would be getting the opposite criticism from them that Ministers are far too involved in what's going on here and that they actually shouldn't be dealing at this very very operational level. So the National Party can't have this both ways. This is the system that their party created that is now what is in place in terms of the way in which our electricity market works.Ministers are not happy with the lack of communication that came from Transpower in the first instance. We have made that very clear. Transpower have come into the Minister of Energy and Resources' office and apologised for that as the Minister said in his answers to the House today. They accept that communication was not good enough and new protocols are being put in place to deal with it. But the suggestion that somehow or other this level of operational involvement by Ministers is what the National Party wants is somewhat ironic and odd I think.What I do think is raised by what occurred on Monday night is the question of what one does in the face of market failure because it is quite clear that the electricity market—the system that has been designed—failed on Monday night. It failed to make sure that every New Zealander could be confident on one of the coldest nights of the year that there would be power available to them. In the end approximately 28000 households were without power at some point during that period on Monday evening. That is unacceptable—that is completely unacceptable. Even though the vast majority of New Zealanders went on unaware that this was taking place for those people it had very serious consequences and we do not regard it as acceptable.So then the question has to be asked: well what does one do in the face of that? That is why we have the inquiries that are under way. The first of those does have to go in the direction of Transpower. It is their job to do what they did on Monday which is to issue the series of notices that they did beginning at 6.43 a.m. and following that through until finally at 7.10 p.m. a grid emergency notice was issued. Through the process that Transpower has we want the questions answered of what escalation processes occur during that time and what they do to make sure that there is a response from power operators to their requests. The failure for that to occur is substantial in this case and the reasons for it is part of the inquiries that are now taking place.The role of the Electricity Authority is also a legitimate part of the question here. They are the regulator in this system and I agree with Julie Anne Genter that questions are raised about whether or not as the regulator they have sufficient powers to be able to perform the role that it is quite clear that all members of this House are now saying. But let's be clear about what that means: that means that the market-based system—the self-regulation system that was put in place by the National Party—is the thing that didn't work on Monday night. So the National Party and the ACT Party who will no doubt get up shortly need to be able to answer the questions themselves about what they think the answer is here because the answer isn't letting the market run rampant because that didn't work on Monday night.Then there is the question of what it is that the generators then did in response to this and obviously that is the focus now for another part of the inquiry that takes place. Why was from 6.43 a.m. followed by Transpower's further warning at 1.02 p.m. and then its request at 6.40 p.m. for the load shedding to take place—why through the course of that day was there not the response that we might expect from some of the generators in terms of what they would do in response?As has been clearly indicated both yesterday in the House and today in the House this was not a problem of whether or not there was capacity in the system in terms of generation it's just that that capacity was not unleashed. That is both the case in terms of the third Rankine at Huntly. It is also the case in terms of the fact that there was sufficient power being generated via the South Island hydro lakes but that was not finding its way to where it was needed in the North Island. So this is not a matter of whether or not the physical capacity was there; it was not utilised and that is a further breakdown and failure in the system and model that we have that is now being investigated.A third point that I don't think has been covered is actually the response that then comes from the lines companies and from those who distribute power directly to consumers. The amount of communication—and I take the point that Barbara Kuriger makes there about the communication to consumers—was at best haphazard and at worst did not give information to people in terms of what was about to happen to them. There is also a range of different responses what are called ripple responses which actually allow for some things like hot water to be switched off rather than the lights to go out per se. As I best understand it most providers of powers did use a ripple response but WEL Networks didn't and so that has to now be part of our discussion as to what technology was available to them and why they did not do that as others did and have done in the past as well when situations like this have occurred.So all three parts of that system do need to be well and truly analysed and thoroughly investigated. That is exactly what the Government—Barbara Kuriger: And the communication to the Minister's office.Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: —has now put in place. I do agree—and I've already said for the member's benefit—that the communication was not satisfactory. It was not satisfactory from Transpower and I don't believe as I've just said that it was satisfactory through the system at all. But that is the system that we currently have in place with us now.We've also heard in the debate various concerns raised about whether or not somehow or other a move towards renewable energy is likely to make this problem worse. As Minister Parker has argued that is not the case; that does not need to be the case. But if members opposite are concerned about the amount of generation capacity available right now today well if we wind the clock back to when you need to start a project in order for that project to be supplying power to New Zealanders today that would take us right back into the term of the last National Government. So it isn't actually how the system works to say that we can click our fingers and today that generation will be there. Seven years on average is the amount of time it takes. So Gerry Brownlee and Steven Joyce and the other Ministers of energy who were responsible for this during the last term of that Government might like to answer that question as to whether or not there should have been—Hon Gerry Brownlee: I will.Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: —further generation capacity available.In the end though Mr Brownlee that wasn't the issue. That's the point. It's a complete red herring that the National Party have been raising. That wasn't the issue—Hon Gerry Brownlee: Try listening!Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: Ha ha! Oh I have been Mr Brownlee and I have heard from members opposite their criticism of where we're at in terms of electricity generation raising completely irrelevant points about the offshore oil and gas ban the investment that is taking place now in renewable energy—and the Prime Minister outlined some of that in the House yesterday. But if members opposite are trying to claim that this was about a lack of physical generation capacity that is not true. The capacity was there it simply was not used on Monday night and that will now be subject of the investigations that take place.