Hipkins Chris: New Zealand Flag Referendums Bill — Second ReadingText is incorporated into the Bound VolumeHipkins Chris: New Zealand Flag Referendums Bill — Second Reading[Sitting date: 28 July 2015. Volume:707;Page:5360. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.]CHRIS HIPKINS (Labour—Rimutaka): I think it says everything about the current Government’s priorities that at a time when the economy is in serious difficulty when there are riots at privatised prisons when charter schools are falling over and when the Government is hocking off State houses and literally driving pensioners out of their homes—literally driving pensioners out of their homes—it wants to devote the time of this House to a referendum on the flag. And it is not just the time of the House it is using in this referendum process; it is also $26 million of taxpayers’ money. That says everything about the current Government’s priorities.John Key went on television a couple of weeks ago and said: “I as Prime Minister want overt signs of patriotism.” That is his goal—overt signs of patriotism. Well my message for John Key is quite simple. If he wants New Zealanders to be more patriotic and more proud of their country he should give them something to be proud of. A flag is a symbol but actually what Governments do is far more important.There have been moments when New Zealand Prime Ministers on both sides of the House have inspired New Zealanders to be proud of their country. David Lange stood up at the Oxford Union debate and regardless of what flag it was under he made New Zealanders proud to be New Zealanders. When Helen Clark stood up and took in the Tampa boat people she made New Zealanders proud to be New Zealanders. I have got to say as a New Zealander that I was proud of New Zealand when Jim Bolger and Doug Graham and those other people on the National Party side were leading the Treaty settlements process. That made me proud to be a New Zealander. That was not involving a flag; that was involving genuine action by the Government that made New Zealanders proud.So my message to John Key is that if he wants New Zealanders to be more patriotic and proud of their country he should give them something to be proud of. And it is not going to be kicking pensioners out of their State houses like this Government is doing. It is not going to be turning the other way when our primary producing industries struggle in the current economy which the National Government is turning a blind eye to. Those things are not going to make New Zealanders proud and a simple referendum on a change of flag is not going to make New Zealanders proud at the moment not at a time when there are so many other things New Zealanders are worried about.I have been very clear all along. I would like to see a flag that better reflects the New Zealand that we are today and the New Zealand that we will be in the future. I have been very clear about that—Hon Dr Nick Smith: Support the bill.CHRIS HIPKINS: —and I have got to say to Nick Smith that it is one of the reasons I do not want a referendum that is doomed to fail. What the referendum will do is actually take the whole issue away for generations. We will not get to discuss this again when this referendum is voted down and it is doomed to be voted down because of the mismanagement of this National Government.Let us be clear about how badly this issue is going for the Government. How many people showed up at public meetings? Just 700 people showed up at the meetings that the Government has been having around the country—739 members of the public. That is $550 per person just for the cost of the meetings. But if you add in the amount of money the Government spent advertising the meetings as well it is over $2000 per person who showed up at those meetings at a time when New Zealanders have much more important priorities on their mind. The Government sent out 1.6 million postcards. Only 15000 of those were returned. That is $93 per postcard returned. That is the cost that we are talking about. These are not trivial sums of money at a time when there are so many other things that New Zealanders want to their Government to be spending money on. But of course New Zealanders have come to accept waste as part and parcel of this Government.Finally I want to talk to Tim Macindoe who gave a very good speech in this debate. I want to commend him for his speech. He spoke about veterans of both world wars and his relations who were veterans of both world wars. I say to him that I admire the contribution he made to this debate but if the Government is so concerned about veterans and so interested in the views of veterans and what they fought for why did it give the RSA only 10 minutes at the Justice and Electoral Committee? Why is the Government willing to spend tens of millions of dollars on a referendum process when it is not willing to spare more than 10 minutes for the RSA at the select committee? So when National Government members show up to Anzac Day services or World War I commemorative services all around the country let them explain that to all the veterans who are at those events. Let them explain why they think the RSA is so unimportant in this process that they were willing to give it only 10 minutes. This is not the time to be doing this. This referendum is doomed to fail and that is why the Government should pull up stumps now.