Henare Tau: Holidays Amendment Bill — Second Reading In Committee Speaker Recalled In Committee 
Henare Tau: Holidays Amendment Bill — Second Reading In Committee Speaker Recalled In Committee 
[Volume:668;Page:15479] 
Hon TAU HENARE (National) 
: 
 Well here we go again. Let us rewrite the rewritten history. Let us rewrite it. The Labour-Alliance coalition—it was a member’s bill by Matt Robson— 
Darien Fenton 
: That’s what I said. I said that. 
Hon TAU HENARE 
: No no. You see the subtle difference is that that member tried to tell the Committee that the fourth week of annual leave was Labour policy. If it was Labour policy why was it not on the previous Labour Government’s agenda? Why did the person in charge of the House Michael Cullen who was in charge of the legislative calendar not bring the legislation in during the first year the second year or the third year? It had to come up in the House because— 
Darien Fenton 
: So? 
Hon TAU HENARE 
: She says: “So?”!Well here is the “so”— 
Darien Fenton 
: But you let ACT tell you what your policy is. 
Hon TAU HENARE 
: Oh my God! No wonder employers and employees did not like that member coming on to the blimmin work site. 
This provision of the Employment Relations Amendment Bill (No 2) is about a property right. What is it? 
Darien Fenton 
: Never saw you. 
Hon TAU HENARE 
: Well I was an organiser in the heady days with you Mr Chair and those were good times. We had a lot of fun. 
Here is the rub: why does Labour not want the worker to have the ability to trade one of their property rights? That is what a week’s holiday is. It does not belong to the Service and Food Workers Union and it does not belong to the Engineering Printing and Manufacturing Union; it belongs to the workers themselves. Helen Kelly and her mate “Stuart Little” cannot come along and say to workers that they cannot trade in their week. They think they know better than the workers—they know better than the workers! That is exactly what Labour’s line is. It harks back to the days of the dictatorship of the proletariat which said that they do not understand so we will make the decision for them. Shame on Labour—shame on Labour! If those members think that that is supporting workers then they are sadly mistaken.  
We can ask any worker on any job site whose holiday it is. In the Transport and Industrial Relations Committee I continued to ask that question of union representatives and of anybody who came to the select committee to make a submission. It was quite clear that the answer every time I asked it was that the holiday belonged to the worker. It did not belong to the union organisation and it certainly did not belong to the party in Opposition today. 
Darien Fenton 
: So why are you taking it off them? 
Hon TAU HENARE 
: I am not taking anything off employees. In fact National is saying to workers that if they want to trade one of their property rights they can go for it because that right belongs to the worker and not to the slimy little Labour Party and union organisers who are stealing money out of their back pockets—like the Service and Food Workers Union and the $300000 that they gave to the Labour Party. 
Darien Fenton 
: I raise a point of order Mr Chairperson. For the last week or so that member has made references to the Service and Food Workers Union stealing money from union members and giving it to the Labour Party. I say that that is completely untrue and I take complete offence. 
The CHAIRPERSON (Hon Rick Barker) 
: The member may take offence on behalf of the union but this is a Committee of robust debate. It is a Committee of free speech and the comments do not offend the rules of the Standing Orders. The comments may not be in good taste but that is for the member to decide. 
Hon Trevor Mallard 
: I think you would be aware Mr Chair that the person who took offence was the national secretary for the Service and Food Workers Union and would have been responsible for any such theft. An accusation of theft against a member even if the accusation was made about a period before they were a member is certainly offensive. If I made similar comments about Mr Brownlee or Mr Woodhouse they would rightly be offended. The member was the national secretary of that union; she was the person responsible to the national executive for the collection of subscriptions fees and disbursements including money paid to the Labour Party. I take offence. 
The CHAIRPERSON (Hon Rick Barker) 
: The member makes a point. But at no stage did the member speaking Mr Henare attribute theft to a particular individual in this Chamber at all. The member speaking just now Mr Mallard drew all of the connections; he put all the dots on the page and then drew a line between them. 
I say to members that it is not an easy task to find the balance between taste—what people think is fair—and things that are offensive. If this Committee is to have robust debate and if people are to say things robustly themselves then they have to expect that other things will be said in return. Members have the opportunity to later get up and state their case and to state the contrary. Those are the rules of the debate. If members want to have things ruled out of order because people are offended then the amount that people can say will contract and contract and we will not have a Committee of free speech. I am a defender of free speech; I think people should be able to say what they feel. In saying whether this speech has crossed the line I think we need to be careful about where we draw the line. 
I accept the point that Mr Mallard made but the Hon Tau Henare did not accuse an individual member of theft. Had he done that I would have stopped him immediately. 
Hon Trevor Mallard 
: I raise a point of order Mr Chairperson. I realise that I have put you in an invidious position because of your own previous work history— 
The CHAIRPERSON (Hon Rick Barker) 
: The member will not bring the Chair into the debate. If the member wants to make a point of order he should make it. It must be about order the Standing Orders and Speakers’ rulings.