Andersen GinnyHon GINNY ANDERSEN (Labour): Thank you very much and thank you to that member James Meager for that wonderful contribution to the debate tonight! In fact the quality of this debate reflects which side of the argument has the stronger case because when I think about what is the best way of characterising what we are seeing just this bill is a really good example of the overall theme that this Government has been carrying over the past couple of months. The word that resonates the most with me is hypocritical" because when we look at what "hypocritical" actually means it means—Hon Member: Hey you can't use the "H" word.DEPUTY SPEAKER: No you can't call someone a hypocrite but you can call a policy—Hon GINNY ANDERSEN: Hypocritical—I can say it is. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Yes. Hon GINNY ANDERSEN: It is behaving in a way that suggests one has higher standards or has more noble beliefs than is the case and I think this is a good example  because to talk tough on crime but to actually have a bill that makes more victims and more offenders is hypocritical. Also to talk big about the cost of living crisis that all New Zealanders are currently going through but to bring here a bill to this House under urgency that will increase the costs on the taxpayer—that is hypocritical. So this bill is a wonderful example of the overall demeanour that this Government is bringing to New Zealand and my prediction is that that demeanour will continue for the next three years. The first point I'd like to make is access to justice. We hear that access to justice is important but the reality is that this bill removes access to justice. It stops people having access to reports that will enable judges to make better decisions and that is a real loss to our justice system. The two areas that it really affects the most and that concerns me are the victims of crime. So we have a Government that has spoken about how important it is to put victims at the centre of our justice system but we have a bill now that is passing under urgency where no victim's voice is being heard where there's been no victim adviser involved and where there's been no advocacy groups able to have their voices heard. So if there is a view that the victims' voices should be heard and put front and centre of our justice system would you not give them the ability to speak on a bill that directly affects them? But still we are told that this Government puts victims at the centre of our justice system. When victims do not get a voice we will have judges making decisions that do not take account of the impact on the victims because the funding for section 27 reports has been removed. The other point that is important to make is to reduce reoffending. This is where it gets really hypocritical because only in the last few days we've heard this great news that the corrections system is going to have increased rehabilitation—there's going to be hopefully more funding to go along with the increased rehabilitation—and heard how that's going to help there be fewer victims of crime and less reoffending. But in the same breath they're passing a bill that actually stops judges having the type of information before them at sentencing that will prevent reoffending and that is exactly what Waikato University research published in 2020 actually said. So there's not been very much research going on in this bill. We've heard that the advice already provided by officials to the Minister was ignored and that they were directed to go for option two—we know that from the debate earlier today—but the research that we have got from Waikato University that was published in 2020 found that lawyers who used section 27 reports had experienced positive results including better sentencing outcomes. It was a way to give the offender a clearer picture of the patterns involved in their offending and was reconnecting them with whānau and community it was educating the judiciary and court practitioners on cultures such as tikanga Māori and it reduced reoffending. So we do have some evidence there but that evidence clearly wasn't taken into account by this Government when passing a bill which they're claiming is going to be helping victims and also getting tough on crime. It's really important that we go to the costs of this bill and we've discussed this at the committee stage. There's been some excellent work—Newsroom one of them that's picked up on this; there's been some other really good reporting on this space: that back in December the Minister received very clear advice that the long-term outcome of passing this legislation would in fact have a heavier burden on the taxpayer. So in the long run we as taxpayers are paying more for a system that is broken. That is why this is hypocritical because to say that cost of living is number one; to say that we need to be assisting New Zealanders with the cost of living crisis yet passing a bill that is unable to be funded under current budget—given there's also a 6.5 percent budget cut—that is quite clearly hypocritical.The Legal Services Amendment Bill will remove legal-aid funding for a report or a statement. What strikes me the most is just the sheer entitlement that we can hear members from the other side popping up and saying "Well they're still there; we've still got them. Just whip out your Visa. Haven't you got one?" So it is actually quite shocking to hear that we must have a justice system—if you want access to justice you need to pay for those and if a person cannot afford to pay for that then tough luck; that's tough. Maybe that's where tough on crime comes in: it's tough on those who can't afford to pay. That's the tough on crime that this Government has. Hon Willow-Jean Prime: A war on the poor.Hon GINNY ANDERSEN: It is a war on the poor that if you can afford your good lawyer if you can afford a section 27 report that will help the sentencing outcome for your case.It saddens me—it deeply saddens me—that the bills this House is passing under this Government just create a further divided New Zealand society; a two-tiered society where if someone can pay if they have access to funding they get better access to legal services they get better access to a pathway in life. But if somebody cannot afford then that's tough luck; that's tough on crime. That is a real concern for the future generations of New Zealand. Because let's be honest: this disproportionately affects Māori and it is Māori who will see the real detriment from this bill when those factors are not able to be taken into account at sentencing.It's a common theme of this Government to have disregard to those obligations under the Treaty of Waitangi to have consultation with a Treaty partner when there is a clear obligation and there's a direct impact on te Iwi Māori there is an absolute disregard for those obligations that are underpinned within the partnership of the Treaty of Waitangi. Maybe one of those principles will be reviewed when we see the next bill come through the House on that one.I would like to conclude by saying that the real sadness going forward in this bill is: where does it set up our justice system? What is the future of our justice system if this is one of the first bills out of the gate for law and order that there will be a simple striking of the pen and the only justification the only rationale the only evidence the only info that we got through the whole debate was that this was an election promise this is in the 100-day plan "This is in our coalition agreement and therefore we're just going to go ahead and do it."?There is no requirement to consult te Iwi Māori; there's no requirement to consult victims of crime; there's no need to consult anyone in in the legal profession because going back to it that is what hypocritical really is: it's behaving in a way that suggests one has higher standards or more noble beliefs than is the case. That is the problem with this Government. There is a holier-than-thou approach that proclaims to make law on behalf of others that directly impacts the wellbeing and the outcomes of other people in New Zealand without any regard to those.So I congratulate the members opposite on ticking the 100-day box of the 100-day plan and I look forward to all the commentary that comes in the weeks and months that pass as this Government once again hypocritically rides roughshod over the rights of New Zealanders and democracy; of people having a voice and being able to say that this bill is just damn wrong. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Members the time has come for me to vacate the Chair. The House is suspended until 9 a.m. tomorrow.Debate interrupted.Sitting suspended from 9.58 p.m. to 9 a.m. (Wednesday)"