11. Question No. 11—ChildrenDr PARMJEET PARMAR (ACT) to the Minister for ChildrenQuestion No. 11—Children11. Dr PARMJEET PARMAR (ACT) to the Minister for Children: What changes if any is the Government proposing to the legislation that governs Oranga Tamariki?Hon KAREN CHHOUR (Minister for Children): Thank you Mr Speaker. The coalition agreement between National and ACT commits to repealing section 7AA of the Oranga Tamariki Act. Section 7AA was introduced as a way for Oranga Tamariki to honour the principles of the Treaty of Waitangi. While it might've been well intentioned the law has had some serious unintended consequences. That's because section 7AA creates a fundamental conflict between protecting the best interests of children on one hand and honouring the Treaty in the other.Dr Parmjeet Parmar: What impact will this change have on the services and supports Oranga Tamariki provides to Māori children and young people?Hon KAREN CHHOUR: Nothing about this change will affect the support services and programmes that Oranga Tamariki provides for Māori. Repealing section 7AA is about ensuring the safety and wellbeing and the best interests of children and young people so that it's the paramount consideration of Oranga Tamariki. The Oranga Tamariki Act already has provisions which protect the rights of whānau hapū and iwi and I have also already made it very clear to officials that they should continue working with iwi and Māori organisations where this is achieving positive outcomes for young people.Hon Willow-Jean Prime: Given the ACT coalition agreement requires the Government to assess the quality of new and existing legislation and regulation will she commit to doing a regulatory impact assessment on the impacts of removing section 7AA on Māori children?Hon KAREN CHHOUR: As part of the coalition agreement between National and ACT we have committed to repealing section 7AA of the Oranga Tamariki Act.Hon Willow-Jean Prime: Point of order. The Minister did not answer the question.SPEAKER: Well we could have a repeat of the question but I thought that she did actually say what the coalition was prepared to do in relation to the question. [Interruption] OK well ask the question again.Hon Willow-Jean Prime: Sure. Given the ACT coalition agreement requires the Government to assess the quality of new and existing legislation and regulation will she commit to doing a regulatory impact assessment on the impact of removing section 7AA on Māori children?Hon KAREN CHHOUR: I repeat that as part of the coalition agreement between National and ACT we've committed to repealing section 7AA of the Oranga Tamariki Act and I wouldn't expect to receive that advice.Dr Parmjeet Parmar: Supplementary Mr Speaker? [Interruption]SPEAKER: Hang on; we're out of control here. Is this a question or a point of order? Kahurangi Carter: Supplementary?SPEAKER: Please ask your supplementary question.Kahurangi Carter: Does she stand by—SPEAKER: Sorry wait on; I've misunderstood. Point of order the Hon Willow-Jean Prime.Hon Willow-Jean Prime: Point of order Mr Speaker. Again the Minister did not answer the question.Hon David Seymour: Speaking to the point of order I listened very carefully and the Minister said I would expect to receive that advice" which I imagined was her reference to a regulatory impact statement. I recommend the member asking the question try listening carefully. She might learn something.SPEAKER: Just in any event I think the response given it was a question about the coalition agreement was probably reasonable. Can I call on Kahurangi Carter.Kahurangi Carter: Does she stand by the Crown's acknowledgment in the Wai 2915 inquiry that the principles of Te Tiriti o Waitangi require the Crown to take active and positive steps to address the significant disparity in the proportion of tamariki Māori in care and if so how do the proposed changes to Oranga Tamariki legislation achieve this?Hon KAREN CHHOUR: As I have stated in previous answers nothing about this change will affect the support services or the programmes that Oranga Tamariki provide for Māori. The Oranga Tamariki Act already has provisions that protect the rights of whānau hapū and iwi and that will not change.Dr Parmjeet Parmar: The question is: what will the changes that the Minister is proposing mean for children who come to the attention of Oranga Tamariki?Hon KAREN CHHOUR: The dilemma Oranga Tamariki faces between protecting the best interests of children and honouring the Treaty is causing harm. Section 7AA has resulted in Māori children being removed from safe loving homes they've lived in for years and being placed with family they may not know because their parents or their caregivers may happen to be the wrong ethnicity. As Associate Professor Nicola Atwell of Otago University says section 7AA has led to practice which is ideologically driven and neither child centred nor trauma informed. Ethnicity should not be a factor in deciding what is in the best interests of at-risk children.Dr Parmjeet Parmar: What other changes is the Government proposing for Oranga Tamariki?Hon KAREN CHHOUR: I believe there must be a greater level of public accountability within Oranga Tamariki for its performance. We need to put an end to finger-pointing whenever Oranga Tamariki fails. Better performance must start with accountable governance. Greater accountability will include creating a truly independent monitoring and oversight agency for Oranga Tamariki and will also improve attractiveness of caregiving to give caregivers the right to make everyday decisions about a child's life by default. In too many cases the State care system is failing children and young people and as the Minister for Children I'm committed to creating a system focused first and foremost on a child's safety. We need to eliminate the "sweep it under the rug" attitude which has been pervasive in the State care system.SPEAKER: A very long answer."