12. Question No. 12—Social Development and EmploymentHon LOUISE UPSTON (National—Taupō) to the Minister for Social Development and EmploymentQuestion No. 12—Social Development and Employment12. Hon LOUISE UPSTON (National—Taupō) to the Minister for Social Development and Employment: What is the percentage increase if any of people in receipt of jobseeker support for two to three consecutive years in duration in the March 2022 quarter compared to the September 2017 quarter?Hon CARMEL SEPULONI (Minister for Social Development and Employment): As the member has been made aware last week there was a minor administrative error in WPQ 12331. The correct number of people who had been receiving a jobseeker benefit for two to three years as at September 2017 was 11409. Of those 5745 received the health and disability exemption and 5664 were considered work-ready. As at the end of March 2022 there was a total of 24192 people receiving jobseeker support for between two to three years. Of those 11979 received the health and disability exemption and 12213 were considered work-ready. While the percentage increase is 112 percent it represents 12783 people of which 6549 were work-ready. The two- to three-year bracket of those on jobseeker represents those that came on to jobseeker during the height of the pandemic. Due to our targeted investment into work-focused case management we are seeing record numbers of job seekers moving off a benefit and into work and we've not reached the heights predicted by Treasury. Our interventions are working and while we are not out of the woods yet we are making good progress.Hon Louise Upston: When the Minister said The last thing that this Government wants is people on benefit for ever and a day." how long does this Government believe it is too long for someone to spend on the jobseeker benefit?Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: People have varying situations circumstances and we need to take that into account. What we do know is that it's really important to put the investment in early and what we do know is that when we took over the reins of office there had been an under-investment in front-line case management work-focused work. As a result of our investments we are seeing more people exit off benefit into work. We did not reach the heights of 487000 people on benefit as had been forecast by Treasury.Hon Louise Upston: Can she explain why when industries are desperate for staff the time spent on the jobseeker benefit has increased in every long-term category under her watch?Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: When the numbers of beneficiaries go up then in every category you do see an increase as well. But as I said Treasury had forecast 487000 people on benefit. We got to 397000; we are currently at 345000 people on benefit more broadly. We have one of the lowest unemployment rates currently in the world and I would like to add that two years after the GFC there were 13.1 percent of the working age population on benefit. Two years after the pandemic started we are at 11 percent of the working age population. We are doing what needs to be done as a Government.Hon Louise Upston: Is Mike Yardley right that "With tens of thousands of jobs currently going begging it surely remains a fiscal and moral failure that tens of thousands … able working-age Kiwis are sticking with the dole." and if not why not?Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: What I think was a moral failure was that the previous Government put no emphasis on upskilling and training for people that were on benefit. What that has meant is that over the years there are a number of people who may have gone off benefit but not necessarily into employment—may have gone off benefit into work but ended up back on benefit. The previous Government didn't think about the long term or the need to invest in people that are on benefit. And we are doing absolutely that.Hon Louise Upston: Why at a time when industry bodies like DairyNZ are calling for people to fill vacancies where all of the on-job training is provided has the number of people on the jobseeker benefit longer than one year increased by 62 percent?Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: The member's question is a reflection of the previous Government's oversimplified approach to people that were on benefit. There are a number of things that are happening in this space including I will add that it is sometimes difficult to match up those that are on the unemployment benefit with the jobs where they are; geography comes into account transport a range of other things with regards to getting to work. So our broader investments—some of which I've mentioned numerous times in this House—are all about responding to the complex nature of this and I do not apologise for being part of a Government that continues to invest in the upskilling and training of beneficiaries so that they can get into sustainable employment.Hon Louise Upston: Why at a time when businesses are crying out for staff are there 31000 more children growing up in benefit-dependent homes under her watch?Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: I will add too that the Ministry of Social Development has been working very effectively with industries across the country with regards to their workforce needs and shortages—where they are what they need. We've seen some very effective responses including at critical times being able to support beneficiaries into the jobs where there have been workforce shortages like in our supermarkets and in other places. It is important that we match New Zealanders up with the right jobs for them in the places where they live and that is a little bit more complex than what that member thinks."