Mallard Trevor: General Debate 
Mallard Trevor: General Debate 
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Hon TREVOR MALLARD (Minister for the Environment) 
: 
 I move  
That the House take note of miscellaneous business 
. I think that many members of the House will not be aware of the findings of the police announced this afternoon in respect of  
The Hollow Men 
 alleged theft case. People will remember that the National members claimed repeatedly that someone had hacked into their computers or stolen their emails from former leader Don Brash’s computer. The police have concluded today that this did not occur. The police press release states: “The investigation has concluded that no unauthorised or unlawful breach took place.” That makes absolutely clear that it was an inside job and I think that if we look at the network—the spider’s web—of who got one email we will see that it gets it back to English or McCully. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: The member will use the members’ full names. 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD 
: It gets back to Mr English or Mr McCully. 
Hon Member 
: The Hon Bill English. 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD 
: The Hon Bill English—they are all honourable men are they not? 
So which of the hollow men leaked the email? It is particularly important that we find out today because we know what the hollow men have said about asset sales. John Key was advised along with Don Brash and Bill English to inoculate the issue to get it off to one side and what did they attempt to do last weekend? Very very ineptly they tried to inoculate the issue. 
Hon Member 
: Very slippery. 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD 
: They were exceptionally slippery in their approach but that is typical of John Key. They did not rule out a whole pile of other things such as preparation for sales. They did not rule out the issuing of new shares in State-owned enterprises or their subsidiaries. They did not rule out the dilution of the ownership of State-owned enterprises. What those members have made absolutely clear—and Bill English made it clear in the House yesterday when he turned down the opportunity to have a debate on the sale of the Auckland airport shares—is that they do not like discussions about the hocking off of New Zealand’s assets to their mates and to foreigners. They do not like talking about it. 
National members are not prepared to get up in this House and defend their position of wanting to sell New Zealand assets to their mates and to foreigners. Asset sales will be a defining issue at the next election and the fact is that Bill English was not prepared to have that debate. He could not stand up in this House and defend his position. He knew even more that John Key did not have the ability to defend his position in the House and for that reason they blocked the debate yesterday. 
The other point of course is that there is not a position within the National Party on this issue. There is quite a degree of unanimity on a position but it is another position. It is the one that was espoused by Bill English less than 1 year ago. I ask Bill English how many rats he is prepared to swallow. It is bad enough to have John Key swallowing rats but how often is he prepared to have his integrity and his principles impugned by his leader? What sort of character is he? We always thought of Bill English as someone who would stand up for principles. We thought he would stand up for the things he believed in. He was a hollow man but he was at the edge of the hollow men rather than right at the core. 
Hon Lianne Dalziel 
: He leaked the emails. 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD 
: He might well have leaked the emails to get them out. 
Hon Lianne Dalziel 
: If he didn’t he definitely knows who did. 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD 
: I think it is fair to say he is pretty close to the person who leaked those emails. He knows about the leaking of the emails and it was just one of the— 
Nathan Guy 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I have been listening to this debate particularly in the last 20 or 30 seconds. The member keeps referring to “he”. I think he is bringing you into the debate. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Thank you. I do not think the member was doing that. That was a frivolous point of order which can lead to disorder. 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD 
: It is a question of using the second and the third person. If the member goes back to school he will work that out. Bill English is the person we are talking about. He is the one we are discussing. He is the one who knows who leaked those emails. He is the one who was close to that person and he knows he does not have the ability to stand up to John Key when John Key is being more and more hollow all the time.