edithatogo/nz-hansard-corpus huggingface dataset:
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5448. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: No no no. Order! Order! The member is using a point of order to get involved in a debate and that is not what we are here for. The debate is concluded. I am going to put the question now. The question is that the motion be agreed to. This is Darien Fenton’s member’s bill. I am going to put the— 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: I haven’t finished tabling the documents yet. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: The documents have been agreed to be tabled. I am sorry to interrupt the honourable member. This debate is interrupted and set down for resumption next sitting day. The House is suspended and I will resume the Chair at 9 tomorrow morning for the extended sitting. Ka kite ano. Good evening. 
Debate interrupted. 
Sitting suspended from 10 p.m. to 9 a.m. (Thursday)
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5448. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. Just before I continue you recall very well that three times I have tried to have a bill discussed in this House with urgency and it is the bill that waits in my name on the Order Paper and on every occasion guess who declined me? Mr Brownlee and his colleagues over there. So let us—
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5448. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Is there any objection to that course of action being taken? There is.
Brownlee Gerry: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Brownlee Gerry: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5448. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Hon GERRY BROWNLEE (Leader of the House) 
: 
 I seek leave for the House to take the following course of action immediately upon the vote being taken on members’ order of the day No. 3 the Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill: for the House to then immediately vote on the third reading of members’ order of the day No. 4 the Reserve Bank of New Zealand (Amending Primary Function of Bank) Amendment Bill.
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5448. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Well can I just say to the member and advise the House that where a member has a number of documents as the Rt Hon Winston Peters did Speakers have allowed them to be tabled together. Where the practice is unclear the Speaker rules. The member sought leave to table a number of documents together. That is what he sought leave for. So I am going to put that the leave be granted. Is there any objection to that course of action being taken? It is already done? There was no objection.
Cosgrove Clayton: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Cosgrove Clayton: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5447. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Hon CLAYTON COSGROVE (Labour) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. [ 
Interruption 
] Somebody groaned—I was just wondering whether they were in pain. Is it a— 
Hon Gerry Brownlee 
: They’re shocked. 
Hon CLAYTON COSGROVE 
: Somebody has let the billows out again. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Order! 
Hon CLAYTON COSGROVE 
: Could I ask you is it a matter— 
Hon Gerry Brownlee 
: It’s the only way he feels good about himself. 
Hon CLAYTON COSGROVE 
: McDonald’s is still open. Is it a matter for you to decide not challenging—[ 
Interruption 
] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Order! I know that it is getting late. Can I ask the members to show some courtesy to each other. It is not impossible you know. When there is a point of order on the floor—as there is at the moment being taken by the Hon Clayton Cosgrove—I expect all other members to show some restraint. 
Hon CLAYTON COSGROVE 
: Thank you. I will start again. The point I was making and I am not challenging your ruling was that you said—I think the word you used was that it was a “decision” for you as Speaker as to whether a list of documents is tabled as a list or individually. Could I ask you to consider that because I thought that was in the hands of the member unless the member sought to table a list of documents in one hit. I may be wrong. I do not know whether it is a matter for you to determine whether Mr Peters has to table the list in toto or whether he can do it individually or whether it is a decision for the member Mr Peters to make. He sought to table—I do not know what the document is—a Christchurch document. That was not in the list because I took some notes of the previous list that he put forward. I take it it is a new document. What my colleague David Cunliffe is simply seeking is that given that we have had a hell of a lot of documents tabled tonight and there has been some confusion—in fairness to the chief Government whip and others—as to the content and nature of those documents we would hope that Mr Peters could determine whether he tables the list or whether he tables them individually and that he is allowed and required actually to give a fulsome description of what the documents are. We on this side may choose to object. Mr Brownlee’s side may choose to object. But I come back to the main point I was making—that is is it a decision for you as to whether a member tables a list or tables them individually or is it a decision that is up to the discretion of the member unless he requests that he table the documents collectively and requests that of you?
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5447. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Can I just say to members that where a member has a number of documents Speakers in the past have allowed them to be tabled together. It is a matter for the Speaker.
Cunliffe David: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Cunliffe David: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5447. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Hon DAVID CUNLIFFE (Labour—New Lynn) 
: 
 The member’s present action now does not satisfy the point because rather than tabling a group of council-controlled organisation documents from different jurisdictions he is still tabling a group of documents from each one. The House does not have knowledge of the nature of the individual documents and therefore members in good conscience are unable to ascertain whether they should grant or withhold leave on a document by document basis. So I would like through you Mr Assistant Speaker to invite the member to be more specific in the description of the documents which is—
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5447. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) 
: 
 The point of order of my colleague is entirely right. I was just trying to save this House time but to do it properly the correct way to do it is for me to table them city by city one at a time. That is what I now wish to do and seek leave to do just that. But I seek leave first of all that the associated company documents and holderships of the city of Christchurch be the first set of documents that I table.
Cunliffe David: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Cunliffe David: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5447. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Hon DAVID CUNLIFFE (Labour—New Lynn) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I think the House may be in some degree of difficulty here because we were in fact as I understood it from my colleague’s previous point of order—which sought clarification from the Speaker as to whether the proper process was for the member to table individually the documents that he is now collectively referring to—seeking guidance from the Speaker on the propriety of that practice. In fact the opposite has now occurred. The member has sought to speed things up by not only tabling a collective group of documents but in fact not even naming the documents and tabling them as a genus. We would welcome your guidance Mr Assistant Speaker.
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5446. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Leave is being sought for that purpose. Is there any objection to that course of action being taken? [ 
Interruption 
] Well I want to find out whether there is any objection to that course of action being taken. There is none. There is no objection. 






Documents by leave laid on the Table of the House.
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5446. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) 
: 
 So that no one is left in any doubt I want to table those companies that are under the control of local bodies from the following cities of this country. They are—those ones hitherto unreferred to—the Wellington City Council the Hamilton City Council both the Napier and Hastings city councils the Dunedin City Council the Palmerston North City Council the Nelson City Council the Rotorua City Council the New Plymouth City Council and of course the Whanganui City Council—with an “h” now—and the Invercargill City Council to make sure that we have not left anyone out.
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5446. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Well I can only go back to what happened when this occurred in the previous Parliament. It went on for some time and in the end when there was a changeover of Speaker the House came to its senses as I recall and it decided to move on with the debate. As a result the debate continued and members appeared—or were—reasonable in allowing that to happen.
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5446. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) 
: 
 Mr Assistant Speaker in your very helpful judgment at one point you referred to the reasonable tabling of documents. I think that that leaves us in some slight doubt. I was wondering whether you could perhaps describe for us or expand for us what you would deem reasonable tabling of documents to be in this case.
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5446. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Is the member seeking to speak on the point of order? The Rt Hon Winston Peters.
Cunliffe David: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Cunliffe David: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5445. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Hon DAVID CUNLIFFE (Labour—New Lynn) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I would like to draw the House’s attention to Speaker’s ruling 146/5 which says: “A member is entitled at any time to seek the leave of the House to table a document. There is no debate about whether the document should be tabled.” Further Speaker’s ruling 148/3 says: “Members do not have a right to table a document they always have to seek leave and it is entirely up to members whether or not they object. It takes only one member to object and leave is not granted.” That makes very clear that it is a member’s entitlement to seek leave and that members opposite have two options—to either grant leave or not grant leave. Any way you look at it the Leader of the House is out of order for having raised an objection not by way of denying leave but by way of imputing motives to members of the Opposition and that is out of order. I would ask that you ask the Leader of the House to stand and apologise and withdraw the imputation that he has made on the ethics of members on this side of the House. It is completely contrary to Speaker’s ruling 146/5 and frankly quite offensive.
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5445. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Can I just remind members that I remember the last time this happened. The Hon Margaret Wilson was in the Chair and I came in and I took over the Chair and there had been some agreement made between all the parties that the issue cease. At the moment under Standing Order 374 members are perfectly entitled to seek leave to table documents. If it ended up at the stage where it was becoming unreasonable then I could understand people getting upset. However I am guided by “Documents tabled by leave” which is Standing Order 374.
Parker David: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Parker David: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5445. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Hon DAVID PARKER (Labour) 
: 
 Can I mention another reason why the process of at times slightly delaying the process of this House by way of point of order is in order. You can see how the Government if it wants to get a piece of legislation off the agenda of this House can take very short calls as we have seen on this very bill. Repeated short calls are being used by the Government to try to manipulate the process of this House in order to meet its procedural purpose. If it is OK for the Government to use the processes and the Standing Orders of this House in order to manipulate things in that way it must be in order for the Opposition members to use the point of order process within reason to slow down the processes of this House a little bit so that the Government does not have its way by its attempt to misuse the processes of this House.
Cosgrove Clayton: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Cosgrove Clayton: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5445. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Hon CLAYTON COSGROVE (Labour) 
: 
 Given that Mr Brownlee addressed my point of order I want to address his. You will also recall and I suspect you may have been in the Chair when we were on opposite sides to now and National was in Opposition and what was ruled as spurious in terms of tabling documents—and I remember the debate quite clearly—was Mr Brownlee’s attempting to table every page of the Standing Orders  
Speakers’ Rulings 
 and I think the  
McGee 
 volume as well. What was never ruled—[ 
Interruption 
] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Order! The member knows and I have said it twice now that when there is a point of order on the floor it must be heard in silence. 
Hon CLAYTON COSGROVE 
: So as I was saying my recollection to deal with Mr Brownlee’s point where he is is that what was ruled as a spurious abuse of the process was when he attempted when he was in Opposition to table every page of the Standing Orders every page of  
Speakers’ Rulings 
 individually I might add and I think every page of  
McGee 
 volumes 1 and 2. What was never ruled by any Speaker to my knowledge as an abuse is where a variety of members tonight have attempted quite rightly to exercise their rights and table individual and different documents. As I understand it it is either for you to rule that they are publicly available etc. and therefore the leave cannot be sought or for the House to determine whether it will grant leave—not spurious points of order by somebody who may have sort of imbibed tonight.
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5445. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) 
: 
 The Leader of the House cannot make that statement—twice. Mr Assistant Speaker he was counselled against it by you the first time but he gets up and says it again in the same way. Then when Darien Fenton was trying to table a document he shouts out “Yeah get on with it.” That is really a challenge to your conducting the affairs of the House in a proper way. It is no reflection on you; it is a reflection on his bad manners. It is reflection of his behaviour when he gets down to the House— 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: It is one-all at the moment.
Brownlee Gerry: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Brownlee Gerry: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5444. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Hon GERRY BROWNLEE (Leader of the House) 
: 
 I am helping out your cause. You do not want to get to this bill tonight. I am helping out your cause. [ 
Interruption 
] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Order! Look can I just—[ 
Interruption 
] Order! Can I just remind members that when there is a point of order on the floor it is to be terse and to the point and there is to be no interjection from anybody. 
Hon GERRY BROWNLEE 
: The point that Mr Cosgrove makes is a correct one. People can seek leave to table documents. But it does have its constraints. The member will remember as I am sure you will Mr Assistant Speaker the occasion when under the previous Government there was an attempt to systematically table every Standing Order from the Standing Orders document. That was ruled to be trifling with the House. I think we are in that situation here. I am desperately keen to hear what Mr Peters has to say about the bill that he clearly does not want to talk about tonight.
Cosgrove Clayton: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Cosgrove Clayton: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5444. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Hon CLAYTON COSGROVE (Labour) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. Last time I checked Standing Order 374(1) and (2) read: “(1) A member may table a document by leave of the House or a committee of the whole House. (2) If leave has been given for a document to be tabled the document must be tabled within a reasonable period as determined by the Speaker.” I do not know what the Leader of the House—apart from scoring political points—is attempting to do but it is the right under the Standing Orders of any member of this House to seek leave to table as many documents as they like and the House or your good self Mr Assistant Speaker determines whether they are not within the Standing Orders rather than the Leader of the House standing up and in his usual bamboozled way making spurious points of order— 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Order! The member was doing OK.
Brownlee Gerry: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Brownlee Gerry: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5444. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Hon GERRY BROWNLEE (Leader of the House) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I know that the point of order process and the attempt to table stuff at the moment is a delaying motion so that we do not get to the Reserve Bank of New Zealand (Amending Primary Function of Bank) Amendment Bill here tonight. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: You can’t say that. 
Hon GERRY BROWNLEE 
: I can understand why the member does not want to progress it but I want to let him know that we are very eager that he should deliver that speech tonight. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: That is not a point of order.
Fenton Darien: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Fenton Darien: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5444. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
DARIEN FENTON (Labour) 
: 
 I seek leave to table a letter from Auckland Council Investments Ltd to the Maritime Union of New Zealand. It says that it has no accountability to anyone other than the Auckland Council and it will not be involved in releasing information to what it describes as third parties. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Any objection to that course of action being taken? There is none. 






Document by leave laid on the Table of the House.
Fenton Darien: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Fenton Darien: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5444. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
DARIEN FENTON (Labour) 
: 
 I seek leave to table an email from Gary Swift the Chief Executive of Auckland Council Investments Ltd entitled “Ports of Auckland Media Release: Mediation unsatisfactory; strikes to proceed”. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Any objection to that course of action being taken? There is none. 






Document by leave laid on the Table of the House.
Cunliffe David: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Cunliffe David: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5443. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Hon DAVID CUNLIFFE (Labour—New Lynn) 
: 
 I seek leave to table a document from Auckland Transport regarding the transport-oriented development in my electorate of New Lynn. It is a further example of a council-controlled organisation document that has not entered the public view— 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Is there any objection to that course of action being taken? There is none. 






Document by leave laid on the Table of the House.
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5443. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) 
: 
 I seek leave to table a document from the Far North District Council setting out a holding it has that in respect of this legislation would be affected. The company operation owned by the Far North District Council is the Far North—[ 
Interruption 
] What did you say a pig farm? No it is not. It is Far North Holdings Ltd—this document here. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Is there any objection to that course of action being taken? There is none. 






Document by leave laid on the Table of the House.
Williams Andrew: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Williams Andrew: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5443. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
ANDREW WILLIAMS (NZ First) 
: 
 The document is from Ports of Auckland—I will say it very slowly for the chief whip’s benefit— 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
:  
Order! No. The member may raise a point of order but it is to be terse and to the point and it is not to be used to score political points or I will sit the member down. 
Hon Clayton Cosgrove 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. With respect and this is a genuine point of order there was a member who expressed the fact that he either did not hear or did not understand what documents were being tabled. The member Andrew Williams quite courteously said that he would go through it slowly so that all of us could get a handle on it and we could then determine whether we object or not. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Members make disparaging remarks about each other in this Chamber all the time. It is a personal reflection that is out of order. I call the honourable member Andrew Williams. [ 
Interruption 
] We have a point of order? Another point of order? 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: I seek leave to table both the final and the draft versions of the Auckland regional events and economic development plan—another provided by a council-controlled organisation. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Is there any objection to that course of action being taken? There is none. 






Documents by leave laid on the Table of the House. 
ANDREW WILLIAMS 
: I seek leave to table a labour strategy memo from Ports of Auckland as an example of a document that would be obtainable under the Local Government Official Information and Meetings Act if the changes proposed by this bill are enacted. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Is there any objection to that course of action being taken? There is.
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5443. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Is there any objection to that course of action being taken? There is none. No objection.
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5442. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) 
: 
 I wish to table also—[ 
Interruption 
] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
:  
Point of order. 
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS 
: —in respect of the Far North District Council—[ 
Interruption 
] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: He has not finished. [ 
Interruption 
] 
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS 
: Drop your knees quickly! 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Order! Could I ask the member to just be seated. I had the understanding that the member had finished. The member over here wished to comment on that and I called him. 
Michael Woodhouse 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. Mr Assistant Speaker my shaking of the head was not to say I oppose leave; it was to say I do not understand what the documents are that are being tabled. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Well in that case can I ask the member— 
Michael Woodhouse 
: From what I understand what we have had are two types of documents. One is a list of companies and the other is statements of intent. We have been not declining leave for the lists but declining leave for the statements of intent. I would be interested to know what we just had tabled. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Can I ask the Rt Hon Winston Peters to explain. 
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS 
: I would be delighted to Mr Assistant Speaker. Thank you very much. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Briefly. 
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS 
: This comes from section 03 “Council Controlled Organisations”: “A Council controlled organisation is an entity in which a Council (or Councils) has a controlling stake. This is defined in Section 6 of the Local Government Act 2002. Waitaki District Council has four subsidiaries that fall in to this definition. They are:”—and they are listed by the council in its long-term plan for 2012 to 2022.
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5442. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Is there any objection to that course of action? There is no objection. 






Documents by leave laid on the Table of the House.
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5442. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) 
: 
 Before people rush to vote could I just say that there is more sad news. This is in respect of documents I want to table about organisations belonging to the Waitaki District Council. They are Omarama Airfield Ltd the Waitaki Development Board Ltd Waitaki District Health Services Ltd Whitestone Contracting Ltd and Alps 2 Ocean Cycle Trail.
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
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Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5441. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Is there any objection to that course of action being taken? There is. I call the honourable member Darien Fenton to sum up.
Williams Andrew: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
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Williams Andrew: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5441. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
ANDREW WILLIAMS (NZ First) 
: 
 I seek leave to table a statement of intent from the Auckland Waterfront Development Agency as an example of an official document that should be subject to the Local Government Official Information and Meetings Act—
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
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Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5441. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Are there any objections to that course of action being taken? There are none. 






Document by leave laid on the Table of the House.
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
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Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5441. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) 
: 
 I seek leave to table a list of council-controlled organisations from the Whangarei District Council that would be subject—
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
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Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5439. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Thank you very much.
Hipkins Chris: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
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Hipkins Chris: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5438. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
CHRIS HIPKINS (Senior Whip—Labour) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I just want to draw your attention to the fact that the Speakers’ rulings referred to in this discussion and I think it has been a useful discussion pre-date the change to the Standing Orders with regard to what can be tabled in the House. Further Speaker’s rulings from Speaker Smith were then I guess formalised in the change to the Standing Orders in the last Parliament. If we rewind the clock back several Parliaments it was the practice of members at the end of a question for example to seek leave to table large numbers of media clippings. They would go through them one at a time and it would take up a lot of time. One of the trade-offs with removing the ability to do that was that the much smaller number of documents that was permissible to be tabled had to be described in greater detail to establish whether or not in fact they did meet that criterion. It is important that the House take note of that. Some of these Speakers’ rulings pre-date the current practice of the House which has greatly reduced the number of documents that can be tabled.
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
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Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5438. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Thank you. 
Chris Hipkins 
: Point of order. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Well I think the issue is finalised now. It has been settled. 
Chris Hipkins 
: I just want to raise one final point. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: One final point.
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
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Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5438. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) 
: 
 In the interests of settling my colleagues concerned over there for the accuracy of the way it was presented the Christchurch City Council listed on a separate page each enterprise about which they speak. I happened to get a stapler and staple them together but they are all separate documents.
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
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Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5438. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Well that is what the member was doing. He actually tabled them one at a time. That was the way I understood it. The member wishes to speak to that?
Woodhouse Michael: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
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Woodhouse Michael: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5438. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (Senior Whip—National) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I wonder whether I could seek your clarification about whether the member was tabling one document or several because the Hon David Parker referred to them as several documents. My understanding of the process of tabling documents is that they should be done one at a time.
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
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Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5438. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Thank you. I had already done that. 
Hon Members 
: Point of order. 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: The tabling of documents is in order. I have made a decision on that.
Parker David: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
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Parker David: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5438. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Hon DAVID PARKER (Labour) 
: 
 In fact the Rt Hon Winston Peters did not do that. He described each of the documents. If the concern of the senior whip from the National Party was that the list of documents was too long then that would have been a different point order but the Rt Hon Winston Peters did not over-describe the documents. Can I refer you Mr Assistant Speaker in particular to Speaker’s ruling 147/5 which was one of the Speakers’ rulings to which the senior whip from the National Party referred. It says: “The strategy of giving a long explanation and then saying ‘I table it’ is not appropriate. When members are tabling documents they should seek leave give the purpose for the leave and then identify the document they wish to table so that other members can make an informed judgment on whether they should accept that.” Indeed even after his initial explanation a member from the other side said “What is the source of the documents?”. They were effectively asserting that Mr Peters’ explanation had been too brief rather than too long. So I would invite you to rule that the tabling of the documents was in order.
Woodhouse Michael: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
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Woodhouse Michael: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5438. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (Senior Whip—National) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I am not going to challenge your perception of how the document was described except to say that the point of tabling documents is so that members can see and read them. If the description is so thorough that they then go in  
Hansard 
 there is very little point in tabling documents.
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
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Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5437. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Can I—[ 
Interruption 
] No no. Can I just say that the impression I took from the Rt Hon Winston Peters’ seeking to table the documents was that he actually referred to only the actual organisations. He did not speak and I was quite happy to accept that.
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
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Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5437. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) 
: 
 The fact of the matter is that the Christchurch City Council is a substantial body and has a significant number of holdings. The minimum thing that I am required to do is to identify the holdings about which I speak from its official document to us to explain the ambit of the bill’s effect upon them and I have given it from the point of view of the general and technical information that was required. I could not put it any briefer than that and I did not make a long speech at all.
Woodhouse Michael: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
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Woodhouse Michael: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5437. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (Senior Whip—National) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. Over the last few weeks I have been referring to Mr Speaker in respect of the process and speeches that are accompanying the tabling of documents and I would draw your attention to Speakers’ rulings 147/4-6 in this regard. The House has considered this and the senior Opposition whip did raise the point that the document itself had to be specified with some degree of particularity—I think his words were—which is correct. But what we have emerging is a long dissertation about what the document says which I would suggest is starting to come into the realms of a speech. This evening I am struggling to identify the source of the document which is the purpose of the description but I get a very long dissertation about what is in the document. I wonder whether you would reflect on whether or not those tabling requests are within Speakers’ rulings.
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
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Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5437. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Is there any objection to that course of action? [ 
Interruption 
] Sorry? 
Michael Woodhouse 
: What is the source of the document? 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Would the member like to tell the House what the source of the document is please. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: Yes. It is general and technical information from the Christchurch City Council which I assume is 2012— 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: From the Christchurch City Council. Is there any objection to that course of action being taken? There is.
Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
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Peters Winston: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5437. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) 
: 
 I seek leave of the House to table a report from the Christchurch City Council detailing organisations under the control of the council that are not currently subject to the Local Government Official Information and Meetings Act. It is a list including Christchurch City 
Holdings the Selwyn Plantation Board Christchurch City Networks Christchurch International Airport Ltd City Care—I am trying to read it as fast as I can—Civic Buildings Ltd the Central Plains Water Trust the Lyttelton Port Co. Ltd Orion New Zealand Ltd the Riccarton Bush Trust Red Bus Ltd the Selwyn Plantation Board again Transwaste Canterbury Ltd—almost finished—Tuam Ltd and Vbase Ltd. And that is the complete list.
Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
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Robertson H V Ross: Local Government (Council-Controlled Organisations) Amendment Bill — First Reading 
[Sitting date: 19 September 2012. Volume:684;Page:5436. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: Thank you. Is there any objection to that course of action being taken? There is.