Cunliffe David: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Cunliffe David: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Sitting date: 11 September 2012. Volume:683;Page:5044. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
9. 
Hon DAVID CUNLIFFE (Labour—New Lynn) 
 to the  
Minister for Economic Development 
: What was the level of unemployment forecast for 2013 and 2014 in the downside scenario of Budget 2012 and what is the level of unemployment for 2013 and 2014 as forecast by the Ministry of Business Innovation and Employment last week? 
Hon STEVEN JOYCE (Minister for Economic Development) 
: 
 The answer is 6 percent and 5.7 percent and 6.2 percent and 5.9 percent. There are in fact a range of forecasts from different Government agencies. Treasury’s main forecast is for 5.7 percent and 5.2 percent and the Reserve Bank’s current forecast is for 5.5 percent and 4.8 percent. I am sure that somewhere within that range of numbers will be the right answer when it comes to pass. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: How many jobs were lost in the June 2012 quarter to the nearest thousand? 
Hon STEVEN JOYCE 
: I do not actually have that number on me. There was a slight decline but over the last year there has been a very significant increase in the number of jobs. There is no doubt about it it is a dynamic market at the moment. We are currently seeing around 250000 jobs created every year and slightly fewer than that being lost every year. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. The question as you will appreciate was a very straight and direct one. It followed directly from the primary question. The question was about how many jobs were lost not how many jobs were created. Perhaps the Minister could answer if it was to the nearest 10000. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: The Minister said that he simply did not have that information. There is nothing that the Speaker can do about that. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: What discussions did he have with NorskeSkog prior to its decision to halve production at its Kawerau newsprint mill with the loss of 100 jobs and did he offer any form of Government assistance as the Australian Government has done; if not why not? 
Hon STEVEN JOYCE 
: I was briefed by NorskeSkog at its Kawerau operations as part of one of my many regional visits around the country. It did not seek any Government assistance. It made it clear that it was contemplating this change which it then subsequently—very shortly later—announced for the first time. 
Chris Hipkins 
: Did he offer any? 
Hon STEVEN JOYCE 
: The answer to the question of whether we offered an additional subsidy to retain the newsprint production is no. The member may or may not be aware that the newsprint industry is in decline. What we are working on with NorskeSkog is development opportunities for its geothermal and wood resources in other industries. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: Why did he respond to the Kawerau job losses by saying that NorskeSkog is “very keen to grow their investment in biofuels” when one of the first acts of the National Government was to cancel Labour’s biofuel obligations? 
Hon STEVEN JOYCE 
: Well actually every day businesses and industries go out and invest in their businesses without requiring Government subsidies. In fact that is generally the preferred way unless you want to send the taxpayers into the poorhouse. We do try to seek to assist where we can in the research and development space but just running biofuel subsidies for the sake of it means that you would develop an industry that was not otherwise economic. These people believe that their industry can be economic and I encourage them to do so. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: Why then is the Minister prepared to subsidise casinos and media companies he used to own while leaving major manufacturers like NorskeSkog and Fisher and Paykel and all their employees to face the cold winds of an overvalued exchange rate and a Government that is missing in action? 
Hon STEVEN JOYCE 
: There are about six questions in there from the member. Let me address one or two. Firstly we are not seeking to subsidise casinos. We are seeking to set up a conference centre in Auckland exactly the same as the previous Government did. Secondly on media companies we actually made a loan at the height of the global financial crisis at market interest rates. In relation to the overvalued exchange rate if the member is advocating following Mr Walley’s advice and dropping the New Zealand exchange rate by 25 percent and seeking to actually reduce New Zealanders’ standard of living and purchasing power by the same margin he should just come out and say so. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: Does he stand by his statements that John Whitaker Chief Executive Officer of respected Dunedin exporter Farra Engineering “really does need to go and have a look around” and is “ungracious” and if he does should Mr Whitaker visit for example the Huntly and Spring Creek mines KiwiRail’s Hillside workshops NorskeSkog’s Kawerau mill or APN’s various operations which like so many other manufacturers have lost jobs in recent weeks? 
Hon STEVEN JOYCE 
: Well I would advise him for example to go and see Tait Communications in Christchurch Southern Cross Engineering in Christchurch Orion Health Xero and its growing business and Methanex in Taranaki and to talk to Bathurst Resources about what it is seeking to do on the West Coast talk to Marsden Point oil refinery for the upgrade there or talk to IBM and Unitech Industries which are setting up 400 jobs together in Auckland. The point is that we are in a very dynamic economic environment which we are always in and what the member is seeking to do is to protect jobs that have become uneconomic. It is very tough for the people involved but fundamentally the newsprint industry is going slowly out of business over time with things like iPads and iPhones. I appreciate that the member wants to prop up declining industries; we do not think that is the way to go. 
Louise Upston 
: Has the Minister seen any new ideas for increasing jobs in the manufacturing sector? 
Hon STEVEN JOYCE 
: Well I am not sure about new ideas so much as reheated failed old ideas from around 40 years ago. I have seen a proposal from a Mr Walley of the New Zealand Manufacturers and Exporters Association to somehow bet against the world markets with taxpayers’ funds and seek to devalue the New Zealand dollar by roughly 25 percent. That would reduce the purchasing power of every New Zealander by around 25 percent. It would increase food prices fuel prices and the cost of living by around the same margin and massively widen the income gap with Australia as the result of a 58c exchange rate against the Australian dollar. If the members of the Opposition want to sign up to that prescription then it is over to them but I cannot think of a more destructive economic policy for this country.  
Hon Damien O’Connor 
: Off my piece of paper—is it a higher priority for the Minister to preserve jobs for New Zealanders including those at Solid Energy or is it a higher priority for him to reduce costs and tidy up State assets for sale into the mixed-ownership model? 
Hon STEVEN JOYCE 
: The absolute priority of the Government is to work with Solid Energy on that case and actually give it the opportunity to be successful financially full stop. The fact of the matter is that the business is struggling at the moment as a result of a sudden change in international coal prices. The challenge is that the Spring Creek Mine is one of its more expensive mines but it is working very hard with the union and the workers at Spring Creek. We are hopeful of a positive outcome but it is very tough. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: I seek leave to table Budget documents showing the $2.1 million subsidy— 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Order! The member knows that we do not seek leave to table Budget documents which are available to all members of the House. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I understand that rule. Your ruling is that it is not proper to table documents that are freely available but the Minister said that he had not subsidised Skycity Casino— 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Order! Look the member is now seeking to litigate an answer by way of a point of order and that is just not on. That is totally outside the Standing Orders. Budget documents are available to all members— 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: Point of order Mr Speaker—a separate point of order Mr Speaker. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Well if you wait a moment first. 
Hon David Cunliffe 
: I seek leave to table a document compiled by the Parliamentary Library which tabulates 4188 recent job losses at workplaces including Canterbury’s Design Line Yarrows Colorado Group Pumpkin Patch KiwiRail Hurlstone Earthmoving Pacific Aerospace— 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Order! Leave is sought to table that document. Is there any objection? [ 
Interruption 
] Order! The House has got a sufficient guide to what the document is. Is there any objection to that document being tabled? There is objection.