Rich Katherine: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Urgent Questions 
Rich Katherine: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Urgent Questions 
[Volume:636;Page:7000] 
3.  
KATHERINE RICH (National) 
 to the  
Minister of Education 
: Does he stand by his pre-election statement that “86000 children will definitely get 20 free hours under Labour”? 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD (Acting Minister of Education) 
: 
 Yes. 
Katherine Rich 
: Does he agree with the statement of Nelson kindergarten association general manager Wendy Logan that it would be difficult to continue under current funding arrangements when his Government’s 20 free hours policy is in operation and that many previously free kindergartens will be forced to start charging fees rather than have parental donations; if not why not? 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD 
: No because the funding will be adequate. 
Hon Brian Donnelly 
: Will the Minister assure the House that the per hour rate that will be struck will not be either the mean or the median rate but instead will be high enough to ensure that at least 99 percent of the early childhood education providers will opt into acceptance of the 20 free hours policy? 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD 
: It is my expectation when somewhere between $80 and $100 a week additional subsidy for the 20 hours is offered that there will be an opt-in at a very high level. 
Sue Moroney 
: What reports has he seen on alternative approaches to funding early childhood education? 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD 
: I have seen a report of a policy that would charge for the 20 hours provide assistance for working families only through a very complicated tax rebate system which would mean that the more someone earned the cheaper the early childhood education for that person’s children would offer no hope to low-income families or their children and would leave out beneficiaries totally. That was the policy the National Party went to the election on. 
Judy Turner 
: What estimates can he provide the House as to what the uptake rate is likely to be of centres participating in the 20 hours of free early childhood education for 3 and 4-year-olds when he is offering centres the average of what it costs to educate and care for those children so half of all centres will be underpaid particularly those in Auckland where costs are higher? 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD 
: I would like to give the member some advice. No offer has been made and she should be careful: she would be much better off if she did not believe the propaganda from the Early Childhood Council which is a subcommittee of the Business Roundtable. 
Paula Bennett 
: How many parents of 3 and 4-year-olds currently attending free kindergarten will not have to pay a fee for kindergarten as a result of Labour’s policy of 20 free hours? 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD 
: Clearly for the 20 hours none. 
Katherine Rich 
: Although the Minister earlier said that rates would be “adequate” how can early childhood centres decide whether to offer the 20 hours when the Government has not made clear what the rates will be; and why should centres hand out the Ministry’s misleading brochure  
Twenty Hours Free 
 when it only raises parents’ expectations and when the centre may not even offer the service at all because it cannot? 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD 
: There are a number of questions in there but it is my very firm expectation that—given the way the market works in this area and I have been involved in it for over 30 years—when there is $80 to $100 a week extra subsidy the centres will take it. 
Paula Bennett 
: Does he agree with the advice of a Ministry of Education official who suggested to participants at a workshop on 20 free hours that it would be a good idea to build another centre adjacent run it as though it is its own business and part-way through the day swap the children from one building to the other so that she could claim for each building’s service as if it were sessional; and does he think this kind of planning will become typical under such an unworkable policy? 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD 
: I do not believe that anyone with a future as an early childhood official would make such a stupid statement. 
Katherine Rich 
: I raise a point of order Madam Speaker. That cannot be a reasonable answer to that question—just slagging off the associate spokeswoman on education. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: I did not hear a slagging-off and reasonableness is not within the Standing Orders when it comes to answers. But the Minister did address the question. Ministers do not have to accept authentication of statements made in questions. 
Katherine Rich 
: Does the Minister think that his  
Twenty Hours Free 
 brochure for parents is misleading when it says under a heading “More good news” that centres will receive an additional 10 hours of subsidised support creating the impression that this is something extra when in fact that same subsidised support has been offered since the early 1990s? 
Hon TREVOR MALLARD 
: The effect of this policy change is for most centres and at most rates actually to double from about 10 to 20 the amount of free hours in early childhood care and education available.