4. Question No. 4—FinanceHon BARBARA EDMONDS (Labour—Mana) to the Minister of FinanceQuestion No. 4—Finance4. Hon BARBARA EDMONDS (Labour—Mana) to the Minister of Finance: Does she stand by her statement It's my view that the board [of Health New Zealand] didn't even know what questions to ask"; if so does she agree with the Prime Minister that they lacked financial literacy?Hon NICOLA WILLIS (Minister of Finance): In answer to the first part of the question yes in context. That context was a botched merger of district health boards (DHBs) where national planning and budgeting was disconnected from local management where financial reporting was ineffective where data systems were fragmented and where in consequence there was limited oversight of financial performance. In answer to the second part of the question that was not what the Prime Minister said. He was talking about cash-flow analysis and said "To even get an understanding of cash flow from the system has been incredibly difficult." and that is exactly what I've just been saying.Hon Barbara Edmonds: When did the Minister of Health communicate to her that the Te Whatu Ora board rejected her allegations about their performance and did she seek a meeting with them in light of their letter to the Minister of Health dated 22 March?Hon NICOLA WILLIS: I would want to check my records to give an entirely accurate answer to that question. I do recall being given a copy of that letter.Hon Barbara Edmonds: If she recalls receiving a copy of that letter and she knew that the board rejected these allegations why did she make comments this week about their competency?Hon NICOLA WILLIS: Because I did not entirely agree with the characterisations in the letter and the comments I made in my letter were consistent with the advice I received from my officials.Hon Barbara Edmonds: Should then directors working for her Government be aware that their reputations can be defamed without due process if it is politically convenient for the Government?Hon NICOLA WILLIS: I reject the characterisation that the member has made and that's for this reason: I would agree that each of the individuals who served on the Health New Zealand board are capable individuals and I believe that every one of them was on that board because they wanted to do better for New Zealanders in the health system. It is also my view that they were given an almost impossible task by a Government that completely botched an ideological merger of the DHB system and left them with entirely inadequate systems and planning and in that context they had a very hard job to do. The thing that's important to New Zealanders and that this Government takes very seriously is that we ensure that the health system can better deliver to New Zealanders in our hospitals and doctors' surgeries and we've taken decisive steps to ensure we can give them that confidence.Hon Barbara Edmonds: Given her concerns why does she feel more qualified than board members whose experience includes overseeing the largest Government IT project that was on time and under budget the executive of Air New Zealand and NZX50 companies and a former National Party finance spokesperson?Hon NICOLA WILLIS: Well as I've just said I believe that each of the individuals on that board are highly capable people with particular strengths. What is also abundantly clear to any New Zealander observing the health system right now is that it is facing fundamental challenges. What is also clear from the exchange that has occurred in public over recent weeks is that there was disagreement between Health New Zealand and monitoring officials about the financial performance of that organisation. What that has shown in due course is that actually the financial position was a lot worse than was made clear at the time. What is important and what I wish the member would join me in is fixing it.SPEAKER: Have you got another supp?Hon Barbara Edmonds: No no. I'm good."