Peters Winston: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Peters Winston: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Volume:627;Page:22167] 
3.  
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) 
 to the  
Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service 
: Is she aware of any terrorist groups operating within New Zealand? 
Rt Hon HELEN CLARK (Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service) 
: 
 As the member is aware I do not comment on operational activities of the Security Intelligence Service. As I said yesterday every society has people from a range of backgrounds who are of interest to the authorities but that is not to say that New Zealand is somehow under imminent threat. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: Does it concern the Prime Minister that a world-renowned al-Qaeda expert Dr Rohan Gunaratna who happens to be the head of the International Centre for Political Violence and Terrorism Research has spoken out to the effect that about 10 groups linked to international Islamic terrorist networks are operating out of New Zealand; does that not pose a great risk to this country? 
Rt Hon HELEN CLARK 
: The annual report of the Security Intelligence Service last year which got front-page treatment on the  
Dominion Post  
newspaper at least referred to issues that the service had investigated over the previous year which included apparent links between individuals in or from New Zealand and international terrorist activities and also the people who sought to raise funds for such organisations. The service also stated that it assessed that there were individuals in or from New Zealand who support Islamic extremist causes. I repeat: that is something known to the service and publicly reported on. It is not to say that New Zealand is under imminent threat. 
Keith Locke 
: Does the Minister agree that statements such as one made last Thursday that both “moderate and militant” Islamic groups “fit hand and glove everywhere they exist.” smear all Muslims and incite religious division and distrust; does she agree with Dave Moskowitz President— 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: I raise a point of order Madam Speaker. I am surprised you have allowed the member to go on for so long because the Prime Minister is not responsible for anything but her own and her Ministers’ speeches. That is my major point. More particularly she just told us that she will not answer any of those questions anyway because the matter happens to be within her portfolio and she leaves operational matters to the Security Intelligence Service. She is not responsible for the quote from that speech. Therefore the member is merely asking for an opinion for which she cannot have any responsibility. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: I thank the member. Yes the Prime Minister has ministerial responsibility for the Security Intelligence Service only so could the member please frame his question within those terms. 
Keith Locke 
: Has the Minister received from the Security Intelligence Service any report relating to extremist activities that gives any credence to the statement made last Thursday that both “moderate and militant” Islamic groups “fit hand and glove everywhere they exist.”; does that divert the Security Intelligence Service from its work and instead create religious mistrust and hatred—in the words of Dave Moskowitz President of Temple Sinai in Wellington such statements are “racist hateful and driven by greed for political power”? 
Rt Hon HELEN CLARK 
: Obviously I have received no such advice and it is no more fair to smear all Muslims because some people of that religion commit acts of criminal murderous violence than it would have been to smear all Irish people because of the acts of the IRA. 
Hon Matt Robson 
: Can the Minister advise the House what standard of proof would be required to establish that a group was carrying out terrorist activities in New Zealand; would it be higher than the proof given by the Rt Hon Winston Peters in the case of Omar Ali and Amer Salman? 
Madam SPEAKER 
: The second part of the question is out of order. The Prime Minister can address the first part please. 
Rt Hon HELEN CLARK 
: In order to suspect that someone is planning a terrorist attack one would have to have some evidence of it. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: On the question of evidence what connection does the Prime Minister have as the Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service when she goes on to Apna FM on 10 July at a time when there is vehement abuse and a tirade going over the airwaves about the West and about this country and appears smack in the middle of the programme; what sort of information is she privy to when she puts herself in that position and is she aware and concerned that that same outfit will shortly with its connections through Mirchee Television Network Ltd New Zealand open up our airwaves to al-Jazeera the unique Arab television and radio station that gets a direct line to Osama bin Laden and al-Qaeda—does she know about that? 
Rt Hon HELEN CLARK 
: I think I would have considerably better information than the member who denounced the station as being Islamic when I understand it is largely Hindi-speaking. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: I raise a point of order Madam Speaker. Hindi and Urdu are the same language. Let us have this Prime Minister be halfway informed about her portfolio. The second thing is: how many other radio stations are running Islamic prayers five times a day? So she is fooled again. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: I thank the member. That is not a point of order. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: My point of order is that the Prime Minister has clearly not given any kind of accurate answer as I have proved two mistakes. Could we now have the honest answer? 
Madam SPEAKER 
: That is not a point of order. The right honourable Prime Minister did address the question. The member may like to ask a supplementary question. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: I raise a point of order Madam Speaker. With respect I have proven categorically that the Prime Minister did not address the question at all. She made two palpable demonstrable mistakes. Could we have an answer based on the original question? 
Madam SPEAKER 
: No I have ruled that the Prime Minister did address the question—obviously not to the satisfaction of the member. 
Dail Jones 
: I raise a point of order Madam Speaker. Can I just say perhaps as a matter of information that the Prime Minister did not address the question. She does not realise that in India Urdu is called Hindi and Urdu and Hindi are the same language. Urdu is a Muslim language. So if she tried to avoid answering the question by saying that the radio station was a Hindi-speaking station and therefore had nothing to do with Islam that is absolutely wrong. Urdu and Hindi are the same thing and Urdu is Islamic. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: I think the member for his information but I would note that inaccuracy is not a legitimate complaint by way of a point of order. The original ruling stands. 
Keith Locke 
: I raise a point of order Madam Speaker. When I was speaking there was a reference to Pol Pot. I seek leave to table  
Hansard 
 of December 1979 at page 4844 when Mr Peters was in the National Government and where the Acting Minister of Foreign Affairs David Thompson explained that Government’s support—that is the Government Winston Peters was a member of—for what he called the Pol Pot regime in answer to a question from Stan Rodger. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table that document. Is there any objection? There is objection. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: I do not oppose the tabling of that document but I seek leave to table two documents that show effusive support of both Pol Pot and the Soviet Union’s invasion of Afghanistan by this reformed man Keith Locke who wishes to excuse his past stupidity and idiocy. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table that document. Is there any objection? [ 
Interruption 
] It relates— 
Keith Locke 
: I raise a point of order Madam Speaker. The member says there is a document he will table that mentions Pol Pot. I challenge whether he will table such a document. Such a document does not exist so how can he table it? 
Madam SPEAKER 
: I thank the member for his contribution. Is there any objection to the tabling of the document? Yes there is.