Kuriger BarbaraBARBARA KURIGER (National—Taranaki - King Country): Thank you Mr Assistant Speaker. We've heard a few speeches today that have talked about leadership. One of the messages that I wanted to speak to today is around leading by example and I'm going to get to a few things further down in my speech where I am going to refer to some things that I see that have happened in this situation that don't happen in the real world—OK? So I think leadership by example means that we have to set the scene and we have to act responsibly and in a way that we would expect anyone else doing an investigation outside of this place to behave. So it is up to us to set the standard and that is not a standard that's below the standard that we expect of other people. That is a standard that should be at least equal and preferably higher because when we talk about governance and management there is no bigger business in this country than this Government. So when we talk about the workplace this is a workplace that's actually much harder on the people who work here than any other workplace because of the events-based contracts and things that operate in this place. After an election there's no other place where you see people walking around in situations—particularly when there's a change of Government—not knowing what their future's going to be. Now you don't get away with many of those things in what I would call the real world outside of this place so it is really up to us to set the standard. We talk in this House—and it was very clear right from the start of this Government that it was going to be open and transparent. I don't think openness and transparency and standing up for what is right is delivering news on a Friday afternoon in the situation of the Clare Curran dismissal or on a Thursday afternoon before the Prime Minister heads off to the UN. If you're going to front up you actually need to stand up and front up and front the process right from the beginning. So I think that in this place in terms of governance and management standards and what our expectations are there has been some mission creep. They call it the most open and transparent Government ever on the other side of the House. We dispute that on this side of the House. We also hear that we're going to have a kinder and more caring Government and in the situation around Meka Whatiri yes some allegations are disputed. But we've also heard today that some allegations are not disputed and we hear that the report will come out. Will we get a sanitised version? We all respect the privacy of the staff member that is involved and we would expect that that privacy would be respected in any report that is delivered to us but in terms of the actual events and the happenings will we ever know? Will the report be released in its full version? We won't necessarily get the facts. So if this is an open and transparent Government apart from protecting privacy I would expect that we would get a very open and transparent report. In unemployment law the Government of the day is always advocating for the workers and they're always advocating against bullying in the workplace. Regardless of whether there was or there wasn't bruising—and that is at the allegation stage at the moment—it appears that some aspect of bullying in the workplace has taken place and that's simply not good enough. The next point I want to move on to—and we've had some discussion about the Māori caucus this afternoon. I commend the Māori caucus for standing beside their colleague. What I would like to know from that Māori caucus or from the Prime Minister or whoever is: what part did the Māori caucus play in the decision that was made? That is the question. It is not a question of supporting your colleague; it is a question of whether or not the Māori caucus played a part in the decision. We've heard a bit today about the way we work and There's nothing to see here. We're simply here to support our colleague." Well I would like to ask the Māori caucus today to see what sort of influence the Māori caucus is able to have on the rest of this Government because outside in what I like to term the real world I think it's really quite concerning. At the moment I'm looking into a situation where an investigation has been taking place by a Government department where the family of the person being investigated were asked to leave the house so that that person could be interviewed in private. That I don't believe is acceptable. I am following that up at the moment and it is not the first situation I have come across where people have been told that they are not allowed to have a support person when they were interviewed. So I think it's pretty good that Meka Whaitiri has had so much support from her Māori caucus and they were all allowed to go along and support her during part of her process with the Prime Minister. I think that we could actually extend that outside of this Parliament and have a look at some of our legislation—or perhaps I don't think it's legislation; it's probably more regulation—where we can support other people. Why are we above everybody else? I am also aware of the situation where a dad in a neonatal unit was hounded during an investigation—full well knowing that that person had been involved as a parent of a baby in a neonatal unit. So I think it's really important as I said in the beginning that we get the standards in this House high but we shouldn't have standards and see ourselves as being above the general population. I also think it's rather interesting that at a time where we need to have so many people going into an office to support a Minister at a time when a Minister is down and a Minister needs support this is a Government that has just put legislation into effect which allows warrantless searches on farmers. Do those people not have a right to have a full and fair interview and investigation into the process? What's even worse about that situation is that those warrantless officers will most likely do those investigations in people's homes and in people's farmhouses and yet this Government could not see fit to do the same thing in warrantless searches when it came to gang members. So we're looking at double standards here. We're looking at double standards. So I would—Hon Willie Jackson: Why don't you sit down. BARBARA KURIGER: —request today—and I'm sorry to tell the Hon Willie Jackson that I won't be sitting down because I've got two minutes left. It's all very well to stand up—and you probably will be having your turn shortly—and talk about the support for your Minister and that's important—Rt Hon Winston Peters: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. Now you can say a lot of things in this House but what you can't possibly do—and that member's been around for a little time now—is bring the Speaker into the debate. So words like "you can have your turn" and what have you just are so de rigueur they should be stopped when they first come up. ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Adrian Rurawhe): Yes—BARBARA KURIGER: My apologies Mr Assistant Speaker. I did use that terminology and I wasn't bringing you into—ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Adrian Rurawhe): Now I'm standing on my feet so you sit down. Thank you. Yes it is a common misdemeanour in this House. I try not to be the referee with the whistle constantly blowing it. If I did that ruling would be made quite often so I do want to remind members particularly the ones that have been here long enough to know better. So the use of the personal pronoun "you" should be limited. BARBARA KURIGER: Thank you Mr Assistant Speaker and given that a large part of my speech has been around setting standards thank you for upholding the standards within the House.I'm going back to my leadership setting the standard process. It is very important in this House that the process is kept but I would also ask that we have a look at our processes right through this House. We always need to be cognisant of the processes in our Government departments and we should not attempt to put ourselves as members of Parliament above the laws that apply to other people in this country.So there is some opportunity here I think for the Māori caucus to advance some of the causes that they have been talking about today in terms of supporting colleagues in need because lots of people have colleagues that are in need and I don't think it's appropriate that some people can be interviewed without a support person while Ministers can be interviewed and have the support of the Māori caucus. So we have to think about that. It's leading by example. It's setting the standard.If this Government is going to be true to the word and true to the Speech from the Throne and be a kinder and more caring Government then it should apply to the general population and not just to Ministers of the Crown. Thank you Mr Assistant Speaker.ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Adrian Rurawhe): I call the Hon Willie Jackson—five minutes."