Peters Winston: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Peters Winston: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Volume:606;Page:3553] 
1. Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader—NZ First) 
 to the  
Minister of Immigration 
: What were the total numbers of immigrants that came to New Zealand in the 2001 calendar year and the 2002 calendar year? 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL (Minister of Immigration) 
: 
 During 2001 the New Zealand Immigration Service approved 54262 individuals for permanent residence. During 2002 there were 49928 people approved for permanent residence. Approximately 40 percent apply for residence while on shore and for offshore applicants a residence visa is valid for 1 year from approval. So it is not possible to state how many of those approved came to New Zealand in those years.  
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: Given that the Minister has an LTD at taxpayers’ expense a residential home at taxpayers’ expense two ministerial cars at taxpayers’ expense and a highly inflated salary she—[ 
Interruption 
]  
Mr SPEAKER 
: Would the member come to the question not the introductory comment. I want to hear the question. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: Given those events and her highly inflated salary when will she in her fourth year of being a Minister—[ 
Interruption 
] If you cannot take it go home. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: On this occasion I am defending the member. I said questions will be heard in silence and I mean that. I do not want to send people for an early shower but I will do so today. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: Given the Minister’s lifestyle at the taxpayers’ largesse when will she do her job and tell us for example how many people immigrated to this country in the last 2 years or for example how many students were here from foreign shores in the last 2 years—another figure that she cannot seem to clarify in the public’s mind? 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL 
: I have already advised the House of the number of people who were approved for permanent residence and just like the member when he was previously the Deputy Prime Minister when he could not say how many of them were— 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. This is the second week of this Parliament and I have no intention of going through the year listening to that sort of obfuscation and evasion from this Minister when I am asking for precise figures like those for every other Western democracy such as how many people immigrated. Yet all we are hearing here in her fourth year as Minister is all this delay and dilly-dallying and shilly-shallying. We want answers and I think we are entitled to them.  
Mr SPEAKER 
: That was raised as a point of order but it is a political point. The Minister addressed the question that was asked. 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL 
: I can confirm that 54262 individuals were approved for permanent residence in 2001. I can state that 49928 people were approved for permanent residence in 2002. In each of those years 41 percent applied from on shore—they were already in New Zealand. I can hardly tell the member how many came to New Zealand. 
H V Ross Robertson 
: Can the Minister explain the distinction between residence approvals under the New Zealand Immigration Programme and the permanent and long-term arrival statistics contained in the Statistics New Zealand external migration monthly release? 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL 
: That is an excellent question. People approved for residence under the New Zealand Immigration Programme have the authority to live in New Zealand permanently and make New Zealand their home. Permanent and long-term arrival figures obviously include those new residents but they also include people who intend to remain in New Zealand for 12 months or more and they include Australians who do not require residence visas to live in New Zealand—and they are very welcome here indeed. 
Gerry Brownlee 
: Since the Minister has no idea how many people came into this country as immigrants in the years concerned how can this Parliament or this country be confident that the Government will not break the 45000 target that it has set this year particularly since we are now approaching 25000 permanent residence application grants in just 5 months of this year? 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL 
: The New Zealand Immigration Programme does not contain a target. There used to be a target when National was in office. In fact when National was in coalition with the New Zealand First Party it established a net migration gain programme of 10000 which meant that 35000 to 45000 residence approvals were granted. 
Gerry Brownlee 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. The difficulties of getting an answer from this Minister have been canvassed previously by Mr Peters. You made the point that we should not make political points during points of order. That is difficult when a Minister gives an answer that clearly is not correct. Why did the Government bring in the English Language Testing System if it was not to cap a target? 
Mr SPEAKER 
: That is exactly what I said before. That is a political comment. 
Larry Baldock 
: Does the Minister have any plans to improve the reporting systems for immigration figures so as to give the public and this House some clarity about the issue? 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL 
: Yes I have written to the Minister of Statistics to ask whether it is possible for the permanent and long-term residence statistics to be disaggregated in order to remove the confusion that exists in the mind of only one person. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: In an endeavour to remove the confusion that one member has—namely herself—can I ask the Minister why she answered on 12 February with a figure of 70500 but when I asked the same question today she gave the figure of 49928? If she cannot work out the difference between those figures why does she not resign? 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL 
: I do look forward to the day when the member does not ask me to resign. The answer I gave last week was in response to a question about permanent and long-term arrivals. The question today was about immigrants to New Zealand under the New Zealand Immigration Programme. They are two separate sets of statistics. In fact if the member had been listening to me last week he would have heard me quote from the statistics report which states: “Long-term arrivals include overseas migrants who arrive in New Zealand intending to stay for a period of 12 months or more.” I said last week that I could not make it clearer than that and I still cannot. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: If that is the case can the Minister tell us why she is informing the media of certain figures saying that they include overseas students when she told the  
Listener 
 just a month ago that the overseas student figure was 82000? How does she fit 82000 into the 49928 figure? 
Hon LIANNE DALZIEL 
: The permanent and long-term residence statistics include people who say they are going to be in the country for 12 months or more. Not all students are going to be in the country for 12 months or more.