Oral Questions — Questions to Ministers Questions to MembersText is incorporated into the Bound VolumeOral Questions — Questions to Ministers Questions to Members[Sitting date: 27 November 2014. Volume:702;Page:921. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.]Questions to MinistersPrime Minister—Communications with Blogger1.Hon ANNETTE KING (Deputy Leader—Labour)to the Prime Minister: How many times this year and on what dates has he had communications with Cameron Slater?Hon STEVEN JOYCE (Minister for Economic Development)on behalf of thePrime Minister: My office has gone through my diary and there is no record of any meetings with Mr Slater. However in my capacity as Prime Minister I attend a large number of events and it is possible Mr Slater may have been at one or more of those. Over the course of the year to the best of my recollection my contact with Mr Slater has not been in my capacity as Prime Minister except for on the following three occasions. No. 1: I wrote to Mr Slater on 7 November in relation to his privacy complaint. No. 2: on Monday night I received an unsolicited text message from Mr Slater and there was a brief exchange of texts which have been publicly released. And No. 3: yesterday I communicated with Mr Slater asking him to forward me his copies of the text messages so that they could be publicly released.Hon Annette King: Given he said in September that “I took the liberty of changing my phone number.” when he gave his new number to Cameron Slater did he expect to maintain personal communications with him?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: My understanding is that the Prime Minister updated his number to virtually all his media contacts and did not give any thought as to the likelihood of seeking to receive communications from him or not.Hon Annette King: Why did he tell journalists on Tuesday that Cameron Slater had “sent me a text one time but I can’t remember when that was” when he had engaged in a text conversation with Mr Slater the night before?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: He has actually addressed that matter with the media today. He acknowledged with them that he could have been more specific. At that stage he was—[Interruption] Well he—[Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: Order!Hon STEVEN JOYCE: But at that stage he was late to get to the House. In fact members may recall it was on Tuesday when he actually arrived in the House and Opposition members were berating him for being late and arriving after the prayer so he was very aware he was late. He had been answering questions in relation to the Chisholm report and he also assumed that that was what the question related to.Hon Annette King: Is the “Jason” referred to in his conversation with Cameron Slater on 24 November one Jason Ede and does this level of cosiness not demonstrate that he Mr Slater and Mr Ede are in close contact?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: Well I think he is known to refer to most people by their first names and it does not imply any particular level of endearment.Hon Annette King: Can he assure this House that the conversation he had with Cameron Slater on 24 November which he published last night is complete and unedited?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: I understand that that is indeed correct.Hon Annette King: Did he delete from his ministerial phone text messages from Cameron Slater that he received on 24 November?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: I am not sure whether it was his ministerial phone but he definitely deletes all his text messages in case his phone is lost at any stage. That is why he contacted Mr Slater to ask for them to be provided if he had them so that he could release them to the media.Hon Annette King: Is the reason he has tried to cover up his relationship with Cameron Slater that it shows that he his office his staff and his blogger are engaged in operating one of the most vile smear machines this country has ever seen?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: I think Annette has borrowed Andy Little’s lines this afternoon—a little angry.Mr SPEAKER: Order! [Interruption] I do not need assistance. Could the Minister in responding address members of the House properly. It is not appropriate to address members simply by their Christian name.Hon STEVEN JOYCE: As I was saying I think Annette King has borrowed Mr Little’s lines for the day. In relation to—Hon Annette King: They’re true.Hon STEVEN JOYCE: No they are not the truth at all. They are not the truth at all. If there has ever been a vile machine on the ninth floor it was when that member was in Government and it was under Helen Clark and when Grant Robertson was in the leader’s office.Dr Russel Norman: In reference to his answer to the primary question what exactly was it about the nature of the text messages that have been published and which the Prime Minister has acknowledged he received as the Prime Minister that defined them that he was acting in his role as Prime Minister rather than leader of the National Party when he received and exchanged those texts with Cameron Slater?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: I would say that would be because of the nature of the report that was under discussion. The member will recall that the report was under discussion because Phil Goff had leaked it to the media on the Monday so it was being discussed up and down the country. I am assuming that that is possibly why Mr Slater texted the Prime Minister.Dr Russel Norman: In light of the Prime Minister’s statement that he deletes all the other text messages he got from Mr Slater how can he be confident that none of those text messages that would be in relation to his role as Prime Minister would be material and hence should have been listed in answer to the primary question?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: He is confident on that in relation to the subject matter discussed.Dr Russel Norman: How can he be confident on it when he has deleted all the text messages—how does he know what the content of all those text messages was; does he remember them all?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: I am assuming that he remembers the content of the conversations.Rt Hon Winston Peters: Can the Minister confirm that as early as 23 October Mr Cameron Slater was leaking parts of that report?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: Sorry?Rt Hon Winston Peters: One more time. Can he confirm—Mr SPEAKER: Order! It is not—[Interruption]. Order! It needs to be stated only once I am sure. The Minister has heard the question unless the Minister did not—Hon STEVEN JOYCE: Sorry I actually did not hear it. That is why—Mr SPEAKER: Then I apologise to both members. [Interruption] Order! Would the Rt Hon Winston Peters repeat the question.Rt Hon Winston Peters: Can he confirm that as early as 23 October parts of that report were being leaked by Cameron Slater?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: I am not sure what ministerial responsibility there would be but I think I can confirm that no is the answer to the question.Economic Growth and Job Creation—Progress2.JOANNE HAYES (National)to the Minister of Finance: What progress has been made towards meeting the Treasury’s Budget forecasts for job growth in the economy over recent years?Hon STEVEN JOYCE (Minister for Economic Development)on behalf of theMinister of Finance: I am very pleased to report that there is excellent progress being made towards meeting Treasury’s forecasts for job growth. Members will recall that in Budget 2010 Treasury forecast that 174000 new jobs would be created across the economy over the 4 years to June 2014. As it happened 170000 new jobs were created over that period so we are very close to achieving what was then seen as a very ambitious forecast. But the news gets better: in Budget 2011 Treasury forecast 171000 new jobs would be created in the 4 years to June 2015. So far with almost a year to run 159000 new jobs have been created since Budget 2011 so we have around 12000 jobs to go. That is very good in terms of what we need to achieve for the forecast by June of next year.Joanne Hayes: How is the growing economy combined with continued high levels of business and consumer confidence influencing the outlook for employment and investment?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: The growing economy is supporting employment and investment—for example the unemployment rate fell to 5.4 percent in September. That compares with 6.2 percent in Australia. There were 18000 more people employed in the September quarter alone and the labour force participation rate increased by 0.1 percent to 69 percent which continues to be one of the highest in the developed world. Statistics New Zealand has noted that rising employment is more than keeping up with a strongly growing population and inwards migration. Although business and consumer confidence have come off their record highs they do remain at elevated levels. This indicates strong employment intentions—for example the New Zealand Institute of Economic Research quarterly survey of business opinion reported that a net 18 percent of firms expect to increase staff numbers in the coming quarter.Joanne Hayes: How are positive employment indicators being reflected in average wages and how do the latest average wage increases compare with movements in the cost of living?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: Cost of living increases are actually very low. Consumer price inflation was just 1 percent in the year to September. That is helping to keep interest rates lower for longer. Food prices actually fell by 0.1 percent in the year to September with fruit and vegetable prices falling 3.3 percent. By comparison average hourly wages rose 2.3 percent in the past year and average weekly wages rose 1.8 percent. Therefore—Dr David Clark: What about median wages? What about something that matters?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: Oh I think actually people’s wages and costs of living do matter. I think it is interesting that the Opposition does not think it matters but actually I think it does matter to New Zealanders. It probably matters a lot more than Dirty Politics and blogs and all the sort of rubbish the Labour Party focuses on.Joanne Hayes: What other indicators confirm the economy is heading in the right direction and will continue supporting new jobs and higher incomes into the future?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: Apart from low inflation low interest rates and real wage growth there are a number of other positive indicators—for example the economy grew by 3.9 percent in the 12 months to June which is one of the fastest-growing developed economies in the world. New Zealand’s households have now posted positive savings rates for 5 consecutive years. Just this week the Institute of Economic Research said that although one-off boosts to the economy are fading there is a durable underlying recovery taking place that is not built on borrowing. It is in stark contrast to the situation the Government inherited in 2008. Back then the economy was mired in a recession before the global financial crisis inflation was more than 5 percent floating home mortgage rates—you may remember—were nearly 11 percent and we faced a decade of fiscal deficits.Dr David Clark: Does he believe that the target of the Minister for Economic Development of reducing unemployment to 4 percent by 2025 is ambitious given it falls 14 years after the Canterbury earthquake and 14 years after the end of the global financial crisis or does he think we can perhaps get there just a little faster?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: Well the member is incorrect and I think he was told about this in the last session. It is not the target of the Minister for Economic Development and also by the way it is not even the target of the Ministry of Business Innovation and Employment. The ministry target is to maintain employment as much as possible and maintain unemployment below 4 percent and it is not specifically attached to 2025.Dr David Clark: I seek leave to table a document signed by the Minister—Mr SPEAKER: Order! I just need the source of the document.Dr David Clark: It is the statement of intent from the Ministry of Business Innovation and Employment signed by the Minister.Mr SPEAKER: Order! No that is a document that is freely available to all members. [Interruption] Order!Local Government—Māori Representation3.MARAMA FOX (Co-Leader—Māori Party)to the Minister of Local Government: He aha ngā kōwhiringa hou kua tirotirohia e ia kia nui ake ai ngā māngai o te tangata whenua i runga Kaunihera ā-Takiwā Kaunihera ā-Hau Kāinga?[What initiatives has she investigated to increase tangata whenua representation on local and district councils?]Hon PAULA BENNETT (Minister of Local Government):I am always willing to look at how to improve representation overall with local government but I do not currently have any plans to make changes to the current settings. However in response to submissions made about Māori representation during the Local Government Act 2002 Amendment Bill (No 3) this year the then Associate Minister of Local Government directed officials to work with relevant parties including Te Puni Kōkiri and report back to Ministers in March next year with advice about Māori participation in local government processes and I will consider that advice when I receive it.Marama Fox: Kai te whakapono tonu a ia ki tāna e kī rā “he pai ngā tikanga kei te tū” mō ngā pōtitanga a ngā kaunihera ā-hau kāinga ā he aha te take kai te 5.7 pai hēneti anake o ngā māngai ā-kaunihera katoa huri noa i te motu he Māori?[Does she stand by her view on Māori representation in local government that the “right processes are in place”; if so how does she account for the fact that only 5.7 percent of all councillors throughout New Zealand identify as Māori?]Hon PAULA BENNETT: I do think the right settings are currently in place. As I have said before I am always willing to consider advice. I am not sure that it is a piece of legislation that Parliament should actually pass to change actually the representation that is on councils. As we have seen over time and in this Parliament itself we have seen an increase in Māori participation and I certainly encourage that. I think it should be in both local and central government. I personally though do not think it is a piece of legislation that does that. I think it is by being actively involved by how the process is and by having the kind of backing locally to put a strong candidate forward who can hold on their account. If they are Māori then I certainly encourage that.Marama Fox: Ka tautoko ā-waha ā-pūtea Te Minita o ngā Kaunihera ā-Rohe i ngā kaunihera me ngā koro matua hei whakapiki i ngā tāngata Māori kia tū ai hei māngai mō ngā kaunihera ā-takiwā huri noa i te motu mēnā kāre i te tautoko i tēnei huarahi he aha ai?[Will the Minister actively support and resource councils and mayors to increase Māori representation in all district councils in New Zealand; if not why not?]Hon PAULA BENNETT: I will not be supporting resourcing councils so we will not be giving them any other funding so that they can go out there and increase Māori participation but what I will say is that we actively support and encourage Māori participation on councils. I would like to see more standing but I would like them to get there on their merit. I think that there is a power machine behind our iwi particularly our iwi leaders as we see them now and if they were putting a strong campaign together behind that right candidate then they could get there.Rt Hon Winston Peters: Given the Minister’s second and third answer on the question of resourcing separatist systems what was the Government’s position with regard to the Auckland super-city where there is a statutory body resourced by the ratepayer as a result of central government legislation which represents not Kiwi over iwi but a principle that was sold down the drain by her and her Government?Hon PAULA BENNETT: To get past the grandstanding what I would say—[Interruption] Well it is. It was absolutely and that is fine; that is good. What I would say is that Auckland has seven councils coming together as one—well eight really. What we saw there was a number of different initiatives. We felt that it was the right step at that time to try to ensure that there was representation particularly in a place as big as Auckland. However I am always willing to have another look at whether or not the settings are right and it is one that I am taking an interest in.Rt Hon Winston Peters: Who was grandstanding when they said “Kiwi not iwi.” or “One law for all.” and then in the case of the Auckland super-city has a statutory body with millions of dollars of support now required to look at most applications for resource changes and is that a case of the National Party selling principles down the road?Mr SPEAKER: Order! In so far as there is ministerial responsibility—the Hon Paula Bennett.Hon PAULA BENNETT: I was just going to point out to the member that the year is 2014 and not 2005 which is when that was actually done.Air Services—China - New Zealand4.Dr PARMJEET PARMAR (National)to the Minister of Transport: What progress has been made on increasing air services links between New Zealand and China?Hon SIMON BRIDGES (Minister of Transport):I am delighted to inform the House that the number of flights between New Zealand and China is set to double following an amendment to the air services agreement arrangements between our two countries. The amended arrangement is a further reflection of the growing depth of the relationship between our two great countries and the arrangement will allow airlines from both New Zealand and China to offer 42 services per week per country. This is up from a limit of 21 per week at the moment.Dr Parmjeet Parmar: What forecasts has he seen on the number of visitors arriving from China by air travel?Hon SIMON BRIDGES: So far this year just over 250000 Chinese visitors have arrived in New Zealand by air travel. With increased air services forecasts indicate that half a million Chinese people will visit New Zealand by air each year by 2020. Indeed some commentators say those figures are conservative. Through the doubling of the number of flights between our countries we are taking steps to further expand tourism trade and personal ties between our two countries.Government Financial Position—Return to Surplus5.GRANT ROBERTSON (Labour—Wellington Central)to the Minister of Finance: What are the “other options” that the Prime Minister referred to in order to reach his Government’s surplus target for 2014/15 and do they include cutting funding for any existing programmes?Hon STEVEN JOYCE (Associate Minister of Finance)on behalf of theMinister of Finance: As the Prime Minister actually said there may be other options we choose to take. We will have to wait and see what the final Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update numbers look like. Whichever way they turn out they will just be the latest forecasts. We will know the actual result after the accounts close later next year when the Government’s annual financial statements are published. I can reassure the member as I did in a speech last week that the Government has a track record of sticking to our spending plans particularly to protect the most vulnerable and to provide certainty for public services. We will not be changing that approach.Grant Robertson: Is it correct that the forecasts for the economy for the rest of this financial year do not show any sign of the $5 billion hole created by lower commodity prices being filled by growth in other parts of the economy?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: No I do not think the Minister could confirm that at all. We will have to wait until the Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update numbers come out. Other parts of the economy have been growing significantly strongly but there is no doubt there will be some impact as a result of the change in dairy prices.Grant Robertson: Why would he have confidence that there would be a surplus coming from other export products to fill the $5 billion hole in his books when today’s Statistics New Zealand figures show a 5 percent fall in exports across the board.Hon STEVEN JOYCE: I think the member is confusing income to the dairy sector with income to the Government’s books. There is no $5 billion hole in the Government’s books. [Interruption] No it is important for Mr Robertson to understand this because he is new to finance. Just because a certain industry does not achieve a certain amount of income does not mean the Government’s books do not achieve exactly the same amount. The Government is not the country even though I know Mr Robertson would like to make the Government the countryGrant Robertson: This will make for a good answer. Will he guarantee that a surplus will not be manufactured by artificially hiking ACC premiums or hiding expenditure for roading projects through loans as he did in this year’s Budget?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: I am sorry but there appears to have been a leak over here. I wonder whether Phil Goff has been over but I do not think he has. I can assure the member that when the Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update comes out we will see what the numbers look like. But again I tell him that he needs to be aware that projections do not always come true in terms of the final outcome. There have been for example projections over the last year that Grant Robertson would be the leader of the Labour Party and that did not work out very well.Grant Robertson: Is it not the truth that his failure over 6 years to diversify the economy grow exports or discourage housing speculation means that the real surplus has dissolved and any Budget surplus will result only from another attempt at cooking the books just like this year?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: I am sorry but that is a little rich coming from the guy who is known as the “Walking ATM” when he is actually prepared to hand out money to anybody who asks for any policy proposal and has opposed every cut in Government spending over the last 6 years. To turn round and say this Government is not fiscally responsible is truly unbelievable from Mr Robertson.Beneficiaries—Whiteware and Optical Services Procurement Programmes6.MATT DOOCEY (National—Waimakariri)to the Minister for Social Development: What reports has she received on the progress of the Government’s whiteware and optical programmes for beneficiaries and low-income New Zealanders?Hon ANNE TOLLEY (Minister for Social Development):As part of the Government’s welfare reforms beneficiaries and low-income people can purchase brand new quality whiteware and optical goods and services at a much cheaper price. Since May last year as part of a Ministry of Social Development preferred supplier agreement beneficiaries and low-income people have been able to get loans to buy brand new appliances from Fisher and Paykel Appliances. People are now paying on average about $70 less for new whiteware which come with 2-year warranties free delivery and installation and removal of the old appliance. More than 22500 people have benefited from the deal and the ministry has recently won an international procurement award for its success.Matt Doocey: What savings has the Government’s procurement programme for optical services delivered to beneficiaries?Hon ANNE TOLLEY: This initiative has meant savings for more than 6000 low-income people in need of glasses. Before May people were borrowing more than $500 for new glasses but are now getting them for just over $200. This is brilliant particularly for superannuitants who in the past were paying on average around $570 for new glasses. Plus the new process has now saved people the hassle of having to get multiple quotes.SIS—Report on Release of Information7.METIRIA TUREI (Co-Leader—Green)to the Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service: Does he agree with the findings of the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security’s inquiry into release of NZSIS information to Cameron Slater?Hon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON (Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service):As the Minister responsible for the agency I am not in a position to agree or disagree with the findings. I can and do accept the findings and recommendations and I am pleased the director has also accepted the recommendations and is acting on them now.Metiria Turei: Does the Minister accept the finding of fact by the inspector-general that “SIS information was disclosed by a member of the staff of the Prime Minister’s office to Cameron Slater for political purposes.”?Hon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON: I accept the findings of the inspector-general.Metiria Turei: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. That was not my question. My question—Mr SPEAKER: I invite the member to repeat the question.Metiria Turei: Does the Minister accept the finding of fact by the inspector-general that “SIS information was disclosed by a member of the staff of the Prime Minister’s office to Cameron Slater for political purposes.”?Hon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON: As I have said yes I accept the findings of the inspector-general as she has stated them in her report and it is important to emphasise I accept them as stated by her in her report—not necessarily as characterised by other members.Metiria Turei: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. The Minister has not answered my question. My question concerned a finding of fact that the inspector-general made.Mr SPEAKER: If the member has an opportunity to go back and look at Hansard she will see that in the second answer given by the Minister he has answered the question the member raised.Metiria Turei: Does the Minister agree with the Prime Minister that the inspector-general’s finding of fact that Jason Ede passed SIS information to Cameron Slater for political purposes is “highly contestable” and if he does not agree why not?Hon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON: I agree with everything the Prime Minister says. He said he accepted the findings. He did acknowledge however that some matters in the report were contested by one or other of the parties who gave evidence.Metiria Turei: Does the Minister accept the finding of fact by the inspector-general that Mr Slater provided emails to the inspector-general in which Mr Ede by his own admission said he “might be in the shit” over his use of New Zealand SIS information?Hon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON: As I have said I accept all the findings of the inspector-general particularly as characterised by her as opposed to what some people may say are her findings.Metiria Turei: How is it that the Minister can say he agrees with the findings of the inspector-general if he is also saying he does not accept the findings of fact on which her conclusions were made?Hon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON: Sadly that question was drafted before the answer to the primary question. I said I was not in a position to agree or disagree. I was not a primary fact witness and I was not Cheryl Gwyn who decided the matter. What I can and do say is that I accept her recommendations I accept her findings and I am very pleased that the director is acting on the recommendations now.Metiria Turei: Does the Minister agree with the facts set out by the inspector-general which she states and I quote from her report: “SIS information was disclosed by a member of the staff of the Prime Minister’s office to Cameron Slater for political purposes.”?Hon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON: Regrettably I think that question could have been drafted before the answer to the primary question as well because what I said was that I neither agree nor disagree as the Minister responsible for the agency but I accept her findings.Metiria Turei: Perhaps the Minister could make it clear to the House and the public on whose side does he stand—the side of the facts found by the inspector-general that Mr Ede gave SIS information to Mr Slater to help him write an Official Information Act request; or the side of the Prime Minister and Cameron Slater who consider those facts contestable?Hon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON: As the Minister responsible for the agency I am on the side of making sure that the agency at all times acts in accordance with the rule of law and particularly observes that very important principle inserted in the legislation about political neutrality. That is my concern.Countering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill—Consultation Period8.DAVID SHEARER (Labour—Mt Albert)to the Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service: Is he satisfied that the timeframe for submissions on the Countering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill allows sufficient time for public input?Hon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON (Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service):Yes.David Shearer: Does he agree with the opinion of the New Zealand Law Society which presented its evidence today orally because it had had no time to prepare written text that “rushed legislation often misses the target has unintended consequences and often gets it wrong.”?Hon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON: The matter is before the select committee now but I would say as a general principle that I agree with that proposition. Rushed legislation often can miss the mark; so can carefully drafted legislation. The important task before us in this piece of legislation is to focus on the particular issues bearing in mind that it is interim legislation and bearing in mind that it is going to have a sunset clause to ensure for example that we comply with the requirements in the Security Council resolution while we plan the full review.David Shearer: When he referred to a full select committee process this morning as “a 6-month chit-chat” was he referring to the submission from the New Zealand Law Society the Human Rights Commission the Privacy Commissioner or the many New Zealanders who are queuing up to make a submission on an important bill?Hon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON: No. I wondered whether that would come up. As soon as I said it I thought it was uncharacteristically flippant. The focus really is on the interim legislation. I am very firmly of the view I say to that honourable member that next year there is going to be a full and comprehensive review of all the legislation in this area and it is incredibly important that every person has an opportunity to have his or her say. It certainly is not chit-chat and as I say—Hon Annette King: Apologise.Hon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON: I apologise. As I say the interview was at 10 past 6 and I had just awoken from my slumbers.David Shearer: I am astonished! Given that in Australia and in the UK the threat levels are considerably higher than they are here in New Zealand and they are also passing parallel legislation in accordance with Resolution 2178 does he consider that the weeks they have to consider that legislation through their own respective select committees are also chit-chat?Hon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON: I do not know the parliamentary procedures of other parliaments. What I can say is this: I have read the speech of Theresa May on what is proposed in the United Kingdom and I have spoken to Senator George Brandis about what is going on in Australia. I am very conscious that their legislation goes beyond what we are seeking to do here and it is not interim legislation. The opportunity for the full submissions will come next year when we review all this legislation.David Shearer: If New Zealand citizens have fewer than 48 hours to prepare and present a submission to the select committee would the Minister agree that the SIS should not need a 48-hour period to spy on New Zealanders before getting a warrant?Hon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON: I hear what the honourable member is saying but what I do say is this: this is modelled in part at least on what is contained in the search and surveillance legislation with other safeguards that I was very keen to see inserted. If there are other safeguards that are suggested as a result of the good work of the select committee I—I am not the Government; I should not speak for the Government—and other members of Cabinet will have a very close look at those. I emphasise to the honourable member that what we are seeking to do is not give these powers to the SIS in perpetuity. There will be a sunset clause in this legislation—Denis O’Rourke: Too long.Hon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON: —and there will be an opportunity for full review. I say to Mr O’Rourke that if it is too long well let us have a talk about that as well.Rt Hon Winston Peters: Why would a political party give support to this legislation with such constricted time for consideration when the very bodies he seeks to give expanded powers to have shown themselves to be so politically biased as to favour one political party over another?Mr SPEAKER: In so far as there is ministerial responsibility for that answer the Hon Chris Finlayson.Hon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON: Yes I think in answer to the right honourable member it is very important to concentrate on the facts and what the findings were and instead of engaging in third-rate rhetoric about bias focus on—Rt Hon Winston Peters: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. [Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: Order! A point of order has been raised. I wish to hear it in silence.Rt Hon Winston Peters: I asked this Minister who is in charge of this legislation as to why a political party would support it given a certain event in the past. He has a responsibility. He is after all the man in charge of the bill—so that is the responsibility—and I do not want a lecture from this overblown—Mr SPEAKER: Order! The member will resume his seat. I invite the member to go back and carefully study the question he asked and then consider the answer. I think the question was addressed by the Minister satisfactorily. [Interruption] Order! The member will resume his seat. When I give a ruling I do not expect a senior member to yell out disputing a ruling I have just given. That lowers the dignity of this House and it is happening frequently from that particular member. It is time he showed more respect to this place.Rt Hon Winston Peters: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. Do you—Mr SPEAKER: Order! [Interruption] When the member rises he calls “Point of order” and then I call the member and then he speaks. A point of order has been called.Rt Hon Winston Peters: Do you Mr Speaker think it is fair that in a response that the Minister is responsible for because he is in charge of the legislation he should then be allowed to launch a personal attack and then you find it suitable and appropriate?Mr SPEAKER: On this occasion I do believe the answer was appropriate when I consider the tone and the language used by the member when he asked the question. That is why I invited the member to look carefully at his Hansard when he gets an opportunity.Student Achievement—Partnership with New Zealand Rugby League9.PAUL FOSTER-BELL (National)to the Minister of Education: What recent announcements has she made about partnering with sports codes to improve the education of young people and families?Hon HEKIA PARATA (Minister of Education):Tēnā koe Mr Speaker. I was really excited to announce recently a partnership with New Zealand Rugby League called It’s More Than Just a Game. New Zealand Rugby League has a strong relationship with 40000 players their families and fans across the country many of them in Māori and Pasifika communities. The Government and New Zealand Rugby League want to see the kids in these families and communities succeed on and off the field.Paul Foster-Bell: How will this partnership support communities to raise the achievement of their children?Hon HEKIA PARATA: The Government is investing $250000 into this initiative this year. New Zealand Rugby League will assist 300 junior players to achieve the National Certificate of Educational Achievement level 2 and expand early learning through formal playgroups in clubrooms across the country. I want to thank New Zealand Rugby League for its leadership and for seeing and seizing the opportunity to partner with us to do better for our young people and families. I want to acknowledge the particular achievement of the New Zealand Kiwis winning the Four Nations title.Corrections Department—Management of Phillip John Smith Case and Mt Eden Prison10.KRIS FAAFOI (Labour—Mana)to the Minister of Corrections: Does he stand by all his statements?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA (Minister of Corrections):Yes in the context in which they were given.Kris Faafoi: Does he stand by his decision on Monday to make no statement to Radio New Zealand on the issue that Mt Eden prison New Zealand’s only privately run prison has the highest number of prisoner assaults over the last 3 years; if so why?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: I did not make a statement on Monday in terms of Mt Eden prison. [Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: Order! I am going to ask the member Kris Faafoi to repeat the question. If we could have some silence it would assist the Minister in hearing the question.Kris Faafoi: Does he stand by his decision on Monday to make no statement to Radio New Zealand on the issue that Mt Eden prison New Zealand’s only privately run prison has the highest number of prisoner assaults over the last 3 years; if so why?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: Yes.Kris Faafoi: Why?Mr SPEAKER: I think the member should just elaborate. It was the second part of the question that was not answered before. The member has now—Kris Faafoi: I will restate the question?Mr SPEAKER: Yes.Kris Faafoi: Why is he happy to stand by that decision?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: It is not related to any statement I made in terms of Mt Eden—Mr SPEAKER: Order! The Minister was asked a particular question and the second part of that question was: if that was his decision then why was it his decision? The Minister chose not to answer that which is perfectly in order. If supplementary questions contain two legs only one needs to be answered. The member then asked in a second supplementary question why the Minister made that decision. That needs to be addressed by the Minister. I call the Hon Peseta Sam Lotu-Iiga. Would it assist the Minister if I got the question asked again?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: Yes.Mr SPEAKER: Could I ask Kris Faafoi to ask the question again.Kris Faafoi: Why does the Minister stand by his decision to not make a statement?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: This is ridiculous. I did not make a statement. I chose not to make that statement and that is entirely up to me whether I make a statement or not.Chris Hipkins: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. It is not unreasonable to ask a Minister why they chose a particular course of action and why they chose not to make a comment on something. Simply saying “Because I didn’t.” is not actually giving an answer. That is not an unreasonable question. There are reasons why Ministers do not comment on things and do not speak about particular issues. It is not unreasonable to ask why in this instance he chose not to comment.Tim Macindoe: The primary question asked whether the Minister stood by all of his statements. It is therefore illogical to the point of being a non sequitur to then ask the Minister why he does not stand by not making a statement. The two are not related and that could not possibly be a supplementary question to the original question.Chris Hipkins: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. [Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: Order! [Interruption] Order! Point of orders need to be heard in silence.Chris Hipkins: Supplementary questions are related to the Minister’s answer. In the Minister’s answer he stated: “I made a decision.” and therefore the supplementary question relates to that.Mr SPEAKER: Order! I have heard enough and I have certainly had plenty of advice coming from both sides. On this particular occasion we have had the question now asked twice. The answer has not been satisfactory to the member asking the questions and I can see why that has been so. I think the best way forward is that the member now has an additional supplementary question.Kris Faafoi: Given that his officials told Radio New Zealand on Monday that safety at Mt Eden Prison was an operational matter for his department why did he say in a press release on 21 October that he was focused on improving safety for staff and prisoners?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: I am focused on improving staff for prisons. That is why I visited in the last 2 weeks a number of prisons across this country. I have talked to the unions and corrections I have talked to the officials and I will continue to focus on that safety.Kris Faafoi: Why are privately run prisons more dangerous than State run prisons given that there have been 139 fights between inmates and 26 assaults on guards at the privately run Mt Eden Prison yet Christchurch Prison with a similar size muster has a total of 83 assaults and does he think it is because privately run prisons run with a much lower ratio of staff to inmates?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: No I dispute that assertion that privately run prisons do not run as effectively. In fact they are two totally different types of prisons. One is essentially a remand prison so I actually disagree with that assertion.Kris Faafoi: Why on 16 November did he tell me that Phillip Smith’s escape was an operational matter and not his responsibility and on Monday his officials told Radio New Zealand that assaults at Mt Eden Prison are an operational issue and not his responsibility?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: It is an operational matter in terms of Phillip Smith. I did order a review into the incident around Phillip Smith absconding. We have had 13 recommendations which the department is operationally adopting and I will be keeping as the Minister a close eye on those recommendations being implemented.Kris Faafoi: Seeing as the Minister thinks a lot of the things—Mr SPEAKER: Order! Can we just have the question please—[Interruption] Order! The member can see there the difficulty we get into if the—Kris Faafoi: If the Minister believes that a lot of the things that happened in his department are operational matters and not his responsibility why was he given any responsibility at all?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: As I said as the Minister I am responsible for fixing some of the problems that have been incurred in the Phillip Smith case. Some of those problems have been obviously at an operational level but I am here to fix them. That is why I am working alongside the department to take on the recommendations to fix these issues.Corrections Department—Management of Phillip John Smith CaseRON MARK (NZ First):My question to the Minister is: does he stand by all of his statements in the House yesterday?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA (Minister of Corrections):Yes in the—Tim Macindoe: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I apologise for interrupting the Minister. That is not the question that is set down on the question paper.Mr SPEAKER: It certainly is according to what I have in front of me. It certainly was asked correctly but we have now got a disrupted flow. I am going to ask Ron Mark to ask his question again.Rt Hon Winston Peters: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. [Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: Order! We have a point of order from the Rt Hon Winston Peters.Rt Hon Winston Peters: I am trying to help out the senior Government whip but maybe he has a different copy. [Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: I am not sure that we have a point of order here anyway. The matter has been disputed. I have got a copy in front of me. Ron Mark asked it correctly. [Interruption] Order! I am on my feet. The important thing is now that we continue with question time and I am asking Ron Mark to ask question No. 11.RON MARK (NZ First):My question to the Minister—[Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: Order! We seem to have a technical difficulty and the way we will proceed is Ron Mark will ask his question and the Minister will answer the question and assuming the mikes continue to work then we will operate as normal.11.RON MARK (NZ First)to the Minister of Corrections: Does he stand by all of his statements in the House yesterday?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA (Minister of Corrections):Yes in the context in which they were given.Ron Mark: Is the Minister aware that under New Zealand law a person subject to a sentence imposed by a New Zealand court the effect of which requires the applicant to remain in New Zealand may not receive a passport regardless of what name they use on the application?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: My understanding is that prisoners do not automatically lose the right to be issued with a passport but that is a matter—as I said yesterday—for the Minister of Internal Affairs.Ron Mark: Is it not a matter for this Minister though that the responsibility for ensuring that communications between inmates and agencies outside and communications with inmates and associates outside that allow them to hoodwink and dupe his other Ministers’ departments is his responsibility? Can he confirm that?Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: It is my understanding that the Department of Corrections is responsible for communications from inside the prison to some agencies outside yes.Ron Mark: Is the Minister aware through the failings of his own intelligence-gathering sources of his department and his operational staff that even in the editorial this morning his ministry and his Government is becoming a laughing stock and can he assure the people of New Zealand—Hon Simon Bridges: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. This is far away from the question that has been asked—“Does he stand by all his statements?”—and now he is asking for opinions about an editorial in the paper.Mr SPEAKER: In actual fact it is a long-winded question and that is why it is creating some difficulty. But the question itself is in order. The member has then used the editorial that he has found in a particular daily paper to reinforce his question. The difficulty we have is that if the question had been shorter and sharper it would have been easier but I think we have got the gist of it. If the Minister needs any further assistance with the question I am happy for Ron Mark to continue but otherwise it can be answered.Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: Clearly in the Smith case mistakes have been made. We already know that. I am not happy about that and New Zealanders are not either. The recent review into the incident gave us 13 recommendations to improve temporary releases. We are adopting those and as Minister I am keeping a close eye on their implementation.Hon Trevor Mallard: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I have just been advised from outside of the House that while the mikes are working here the system does not appear to be working heading out of the House. [Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: Order! There is certainly nothing that I can do from this position to assist with that at this stage. We are going to continue with question time.Ron Mark: Does the Minister—accepting that he is new to his portfolio—Mr SPEAKER: Can the member please just ask the question?Ron Mark: Does the Minister recall previous gaffes by the corrections department and previous investigations of their failures and does he not accept that this latest huge gaffe which resulted in a vicious killer escaping custody is going to seriously undermine the confidence of the public in his department and in the staff if someone does not pay the price and we are given assurance that those people who failed in this case will be—Mr SPEAKER: We are now getting into speech material.Hon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA: No.Road Safety—Breath and Blood-alcohol Limit Changes and Other Initiatives12.SARAH DOWIE (National—Invercargill)to the Associate Minister of Transport: How will the changes from 1 December lowering the adult drink-driving limits improve road safety?Hon CRAIG FOSS (Associate Minister of Transport):Lower legal breath and blood-alcohol limits will help make our roads safer and save lives. From 1 December the legal alcohol limit for drivers aged 20 and over will lower from 400 to 250 micrograms of alcohol per litre of blood [Interruption]—the member may be quite interested in this—or from 80 to 50 milligrams of alcohol per 100 millilitres of blood bringing New Zealand into line with the majority of OECD countries. The alcohol limit for drivers aged below 20 will remain at zero. Lowering the adult drink-driving limit sends a clear message and signal that consuming alcohol at high levels and then driving is unacceptable. The lower limit will help save lives and prevent serious injuries caused by drunk drivers.Sarah Dowie: How do these changes fit in the Government’s Safer Journeys strategy?Hon CRAIG FOSS: Reducing deaths and serious injuries from drink-driving is a key plank of the Government’s Safer Journeys strategy which looks across the entire road system to improve safety through safer roads and roadsides safer speeds safer vehicles and safer road use. To make people aware of these changes a number of agencies are undertaking public information campaigns. Today the Minister of Police and I have launched the “Reach the Beach Safely This Summer” campaign an initiative led by the New Zealand Police that will also highlight the lower drink-drive limit. Each individual has a responsibility to ensure their families and friends are informed and make the right decisions. As this brochure from the New Zealand Transport Agency says be a legend: stop mates and family from driving drunk.CHRIS HIPKINS (Labour—Rimutaka):I seek leave to table the transcript of the text conversation between the Prime Minister and Cameron Slater on 24 November which was released yesterday showing—Mr SPEAKER: Order! The document has now been described. I will put the leave. Leave is sought to table that particular transcript of text conversations. Is there any objection to it being tabled? It will be tabled.Document by leave laid on the Table of the House.Questions to MembersCountering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill—Consultation Period1.Dr KENNEDY GRAHAM (Green)to the Chairperson of the Foreign Affairs Defence and Trade Committee: Will he consider extending the time period for submissions on the Countering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill given public submissions close today; if not why not?MARK MITCHELL (Chairperson of the Foreign Affairs Defence and Trade Committee):No I will not as the select committee is required to report back to the House on 2 December.Dr Kennedy Graham: Given that reply will he seek to extend the date for the report back to Parliament from next Tuesday given the public interest in the legislation; if not why not?MARK MITCHELL: No and I would just like to point out the fact that the secretariat is working quickly and efficiently and the select committee is committed to meeting the needs of submitters. To date we have been able to do that.