Cosgrove Clayton: Estimates Debate — In Committee 
Cosgrove Clayton: Estimates Debate — In Committee 
[Volume:640;Page:10399] 
Hon CLAYTON COSGROVE (Associate Minister of Finance) 
: 
 That gentleman from the National Party Craig Foss is known for two things in this House. One is the fact that he spent all his time overseas when the National Party went into office and he returned to New Zealand only when a Labour Government came in. Secondly he waxes eloquent about tax but he is known for one thing on tax in this House: bringing up his own tax return before the Finance and Expenditure Committee and asking the Inland Revenue Department for advice on it. That is his limitation on tax. He asked about the Labour record in office. I remind him that while he was overseas when the National Government was in office—and he returned in around 1999 when we won—unemployment was at 6.5 percent. When he came back from overseas after National lost unemployment was at 6.5 percent which the Labour Government inherited. 
I remind him of the noose that hangs around Labour’s and Dr Cullen’s neck which is one of 3.4 percent unemployment. Two young people in Kaiapoi in my electorate are unemployed and on the Work and Income books. No one is unemployed in Papanui and Rangiora. That is the legacy and the noose that hangs about every Labour member’s neck. My word if it is a noose I want more of it I want it to be heavier and I want more of it now. Unemployment has never been so low since that member came back from overseas under a Labour Government. 
I will challenge the National Party. We have found out three policies. I could not believe my luck when Dr Cullen allowed me to act for him for a couple of days while he was overseas. We netted we snared and we punctured the big fish Mr English. What Mr English told the country—and I want every Grey Power member and every senior citizens club to listen to this—was that he raised the spectre of the means test on superannuation and the asset test on superannuation and said superannuation was too generous. Then he said—and this must be a sort of “blue youth” strategy—that one could not win the 20-plus vote by telling those people that they would be secure in their retirement and that superannuation was too generous. Well I want every person to listen to that because of the history of that man and his successor Don Brash who I ask members to remember raised the spectre of raising the age from 65 to 70. 
On 3 November of course John Key said the same thing: “We recognise that 65 is 65”. He then went on to say: “and we are honouring that but I don’t think there’s any doubt that the single-biggest way to reduce that liability is to raise the age of eligibility.” I tell members to believe what Tweedledumb and Tweedledumber say. They did it in Government. Bill English cut the pension twice. He was in a Government that raised it to 65. Don Brash said he might do it National says it wants to abolish the Cullen fund and Brian Fallow blew that one open on 3 November when he said: “National also wants to abolish the Cullen superannuation fund.” Brash said he would raise the age then we had Bill English; he could not be reined in by John Key and he raised the spectre again. I tell every elderly person in the country not to judge them by their words; they should judge them by their actions in Government. 
Then we have the other policy Working for Families. National wants to tinker with Working for Families and give a tax cut. It wants to give an across-the-board tax cut where Mr English gets $110 a week and 160000 families lose about $50 to $80 a week. If someone is on $52000 with three kids and that person has a mortgage and is eligible that person will pull in possibly $246 per week. That is 350000 families on average getting $110 a week. So what Mr English says to the country is: “Give everybody a tax cut.” and everybody says: “Hey this is a great thing.” until the communities do the figures and realise that 80 or 95 percent of them are out of the back door. So that is Working for Families. 
Then of course we have Muldoon Mark II. Mr English and Mr Key say they think they will tinker with KiwiSaver. Well we had a poll and did some research and a third of young people say they will sign up because they want to use the money for the first home that Mr Foss waxes on about when he talks about housing unaffordability. They want older folk to have security in their retirement. Those people who have never had the chance to get into superannuation want to have a go. And what does Bill “Rob Muldoon” English want to do? He and Mr Key have done 1975 all over again. They have raised the spectre that says when Kiwis get their statement next year that shows how much money the Government the employer and they have put aside for their retirement—but hang on; as we approach an election they should not tear that statement up because Bill English says he will pull the rug out so if National wins and it will not we will see the second-biggest piece of economic and social vandalism visited on this country. The first was Muldoon when he bribed people with their own money and pulled the rug out from under every superannuitant in the country. The second one is that he has raised the spectre of it again. 
So we have clarity at last around the Opposition we have clarity around Working for Families and 160000 people should now reflect that they are going to have the economic rug pulled out from under them because Bill English wants every member of this House—all of us top 5 percent income earners—to get 110 bucks a week. All those 160000 families gaining their own money back in tax credits—on average $110 a week—will get squat. They might get 10 or 20 bucks. 
I ask communities to reflect on that. I ask elderly folk and those in their 50s those who are 50 today to reflect on the words of Bill English that I predict will come back to haunt him if I have anything to do about it and will be drilled into him every time he tries to make a speech on superannuation. He wants to cut it—he said that. His leader has paraded around the country and said his party will tell anything to anybody it will promise anything it will ditch any policy and any moral fibre or ideology that it does have if it is deemed to be unpopular. 
But I must hand it to Mr English that maybe he has been honest—and I think he has been; he has been absolutely upfront and honest because he is a true Tory blue through and through. He will cut superannuation and he will nail every person on the cusp of retirement and every young person who wants to start to buy a new home. What good is a tax cut of 10 or 20 bucks a week to a mechanic or a young person on a low income who is saving to get a home when they can enrol in KiwiSaver and use the Government’s money their employer’s money and their own money to convert that into a deposit for a first home? I ask him to explain that and to go down to the mechanic’s shop and the chippy’s shop and all those young people who—at least one-third of them—are now looking at getting into the scheme. Then of course KiwiSaver—in the spectre he has raised—gets the rug pulled from under it. 
So I ask Mr Foss that great tax return expert to reflect on records. I ask him to remember when he came back from his lofty job and graced us the people of New Zealand with his presence on our shores—he came back when Labour was in Government—and to reflect on the situation then: 6.5 percent unemployment no apprenticeship system because National got rid of it students with debt up to their eyeballs a mortgage but no house effectively; and I ask him to reflect on the situation now: 3.4 percent unemployment interest-free loans and incentives to stay here a re-engaging in apprenticeships of 10000 and next year there will be 14000 young people in trade training. I ask him whilst he was overseas earning his big bucks to reflect on that record because that record stands in stark contrast to three cuts in the pension the rug pulled out from the elderly apprenticeships going and all the other insidious economic vandalism that National engaged in. 
Finally I invite all the communities to reflect very very carefully and not to be bought and sold by slogans. Tax cuts may sound great until the communities—and they are smart—do the numbers and work out the figures. I remember Gerry Brownlee—the man who has as much credibility as a Mississippi riverboat gambler—saying on the radio that people do not understand budgets they would not know a budget they do not understand them. I say that if people can balance their housekeeping if they can go out and get the groceries and sort out their bills they have a PhD in economics in the community. They are not silly they will read Mr English’s words which will be the epitaph on his political tombstone and they will be revisited time and time again on him. I invite him if he wants to to get up and deny anything I have said and to refute anything I have said on Working for Families on national superannuation and on KiwiSaver. Do you know what? He will not do that he cannot because at least he is honest about it.