Ryall Tony: Courts and Criminal Matters Bill — Second Reading Instruction to Committee In Committee 
Ryall Tony: Courts and Criminal Matters Bill — Second Reading Instruction to Committee In Committee 
[Volume:626;Page:21694] 
Hon TONY RYALL (National—Bay Of Plenty) 
: 
 I ask the Minister in the chair Rick Barker to look at Supplementary Order Paper 369 in the name of the Hon Rick Barker. There are proposed changes on that to the Crimes Act which is what we have just debated in Part 1. I would be happy to entertain any changes that may be necessary there but I think he will find that there is a Supplementary Order Paper with amendments to Part 1 and we did not vote on them. 
Part 2 puts in place the information-sharing regime. There are quite considerable changes being proposed in this bill with respect to information sharing and I have put forward a number of amendments on that. Part 2 allows the Ministry of Justice to notify other agencies that people are specified fines defaulters. Members will recall that those are the people whom the system is designed to ensnare. The Government gives the impression—as it certainly plans to give in its advertising campaign I am sure—that people who owe fines will be stopped at the airports. In fact the number who will be stopped is very small. It is not people who owe $5000 worth of fines nor is it people who owe reparation. It is people who owe $5000 worth of fines and have an arrest warrant and people who owe reparation of any amount and have an arrest warrant. The officials said that was about 500 people in total according to the reports we have here. 
Let me go through who will be targeted by this elaborate information-sharing regime. Originally we were advised by Ministry of Justice officials that the bill as introduced by the Minister would catch about 35 serious fines defaulters a year. With the changes to the bill made as a result of pressure from the Opposition that has grown to 117 serious fines defaulters a year and the Government expects to collect $1.5 million from them. That is one fines defaulter every 3 days. I think the Government could go a lot further than that. 
The Minister has tabled Supplementary Order Paper 370 in his name and it is quite extensive. There are very significant changes in that Supplementary Order Paper and they have not gone before the Law and Order Committee. I want to look at the amendment to clause 7 to insert new section 280F. Those are the rules that will allow the Customs Service to supply information concerning specified fines defaulters to the Chief Executive of the Department of Labour. That in itself needs further explanation from the Minister. It allows the chief executive of customs to supply the Chief Executive of the Department of Labour with information about specified fines defaulters and that information can then be passed on to the Ministry of Justice. Is that not correct? Why did the Government not put that in the original bill? It is a very obvious question. It is something new. It has not gone to the select committee and the public has not had a chance to talk about whether customs information should be made available to the Immigration Service which would then make it available to the Ministry of Justice. 
Hon Maurice Williamson 
: Of course it should. 
Hon TONY RYALL 
: We think it should but we wonder why the public of New Zealand was not entitled to make any submissions on that provision. 
 We want to know why the Government would limit the amount of information about serious fines defaulters that is passed to the Chief Executive of the Department of Labour. There is no provision for any other information the Customs Service has that may identify a fines defaulter to be passed on. The Government is limiting it to a person’s name date of birth sex passport number and notice that that person is a specified fines defaulter. What if the Customs Service has any other information that may identify a person such as an address or the name of an employer? 
Peter Brown 
: What about an IRD number? 
Hon TONY RYALL 
: That is dealt with later on—we will deal with that in the debate on Part 9. Why is that extra information not being allowed to be sent forward? If we are serious as the Minister says why do we not have a provision that all the information the Customs Service may have on a specified fines defaulter should be made available to the system in order to locate that person? What if the Customs Service has an invoice a packing slip or a customs declaration that has the person’s name and address on it? Does this bill provide for the Customs Service to provide the Chief Executive of the Department of Labour with that information? No. What if the Customs Service gets some additional information at the airport that may help to identify a fines defaulter? Why will that not be passed on? We are limiting the information that can be provided to catch those people.