Smith Nick: General Debates 
Smith Nick: General Debates 
[Volume:616;Page:11725] 
Hon Dr NICK SMITH (National—Nelson) 
: 
 I welcome the opportunity today to confront the Minister of Conservation and this Government’s irresponsibility in respect of public safety over the lahar on the mountain and to confront the Minister on a number of issues that he has raised. 
First up the Minister said that we should not be worried because the lahar is only 150 percent the size of that which occurred in 1953. [ 
Interruption 
] 
The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) 
: I am sorry to interrupt the honourable member. I just remind members that interjections are to be rare reasonable relevant and restrained. Members should refer to Speaker’s ruling 56/1. 
Hon Dr NICK SMITH 
: I want to debate the issue of a lahar because the Government’s actions are contrary to the advice of the Ministry of Civil Defence and Emergency Management contrary to the advice of the Ruapehu District Council which has to put up with this risk and contrary to the advice of the regional council Horizons MW. 
I ask members in this House whether they would trust Chris Carter or the Ministry of Civil Defence and Emergency Management. It would have to be the ministry. Would they trust the local people in the local council in Simon Power’s electorate or George Hawkins? I know where I would put my faith and it would not be in the Ministers on the opposite side of the House. 
According to this report it would cost only $68000—3 days’ work—to remove the risk to the community downstream. 
Hon Chris Carter 
: Why did the member not do something? He had 4 months. 
Hon Dr NICK SMITH 
: The Minister has been there for 5 years and the report that was tabled in April 1999 did the proper investigations about the work that was required. I say to the Minister opposite that the responsible thing to do was to go ahead with that. This “Minister of Political Correctness” is more interested in cultural sensitivity and environmental purism than the protection of public safety in that area. 
I want to know from Chris Carter when that 1.4 million tonnes of material comes hurtling down the mountain what advice he will give trampers in the district. Will he advise them to run? Is that what his advice will be? Will he guarantee and indemnify the councils of the local area for any damage? 
 I invite any member of the Government to answer the question given that it has made a decision against the advice of the Ministry of Civil Defence and Emergency Management. Will it indemnify the local councils for any damage that is done to their property? No it will not. What is more this report says that the lahar will destroy the monument that was created for the 153 victims of the Tangiwai disaster. What sort of people would sit on their hands and allow the lahar to go down the mountain when there are practical measures that would resolve it? The Minister says there will be other lahars that we cannot stop so why should we stop this one? 
Hon Chris Carter 
: There’s been some already. 
Hon Dr NICK SMITH 
: That is right; there have been about 60. But interestingly they have been one-hundredth of the size of that which is predicted to occur in the next year. It is nothing less than dishonest of the Minister to make that comparison. [ 
Interruption 
] The Minister asks what happens if the crater rim collapses. He asks how that lahar can be prevented. The Minister is right. And does the Minister know the probability of that occurring? It is one in 2000. And what is the probability of this lahar occurring? It is 96 percent. It is guaranteed to happen in the next 12 months yet this Minister would sit on his hands. I say to the Minister that we on this side of the House will hold him responsible for any loss of life. 
The last question I have for the Minister is why for 5 years have we been told by him that he is not going to do anything about it because of concerns about cultural sensitivity of the mountain—and suddenly it is all about occupational safety? I ask anybody who has had any experience of bulldozers how it is so difficult to cut a trench 7 metres deep in the ash layer. [ 
Interruption 
] I would and I say to the Minister right now to surrender his ministerial warrant and I will do it today. Members on this side of the House will do it today. Why did the Government not— 
Hon Chris Carter 
: What stopped you the first time? 
Hon Dr NICK SMITH 
: That is a fair enough question. Let me answer it. I am happy to. The fact is this report was delivered in April and the Minister received the technical report— 
Hon Chris Carter 
: 4 months you had. 
Hon Dr NICK SMITH 
: That is right and the technical report on the engineering works was completed in June 2000. Who was the Minister in June 2000? It was Sandra Lee. I say to the Minister that public safety in this country should be put ahead of the political correctness from Chris Carter.