Stanford Erica; Salesa JennyERICA STANFORD (National—East Coast Bays): Thank you Madam Speaker. I'm pleased to take a call on this bill. As we know this bill will be passed today and I know that the three wānanga who are represented here today will celebrate the new Government's framework that will be created from this bill. I think Penny Simmonds made this point and I'd like to reiterate this point that we support this part of the bill.We have made some comments around the fact that we're disappointed around the fact that we weren't quite able to get everything that I know the wānanga wanted in terms of the terms that were placeholders in the bill—A B and C—which we didn't think were perfect and we would have liked to have seen worked on a little bit longer and made sure that in the bill we had the proper terms rather than those placeholder terms. I thank the wānanga though for their patience and for agreeing to A B and C even though I know that they would have wanted proper terms but I know that the wānanga just wanted to get this bill through. So thank you for your patience. We did make the point in our differing view—the National Party and ACT Party differing view—that we were not happy with the placeholder terms of A B and C. We also made it clear that we are very supportive of protecting the term wānanga"—and we all understand the problems with that which were raised on both sides of the House today. But I think we've put on record that we support very much the protection of that term that the wānanga deserve that. I do hope that in the future we can get to a point where we are able to do that. It was a shame that there wasn't the ability to get there in this bill but I think we've put on record today our support for that and that we would like to see that happen in the future.I'd also like to put on record the National Party's support for choice in education especially in Māori education. I'd like to put on record that the first kōhanga reo in this country was set up with the support of a National Government. The first kura kaupapa was set up under a National Government. And in fact the charter schools that were set up under a National Government and supported at the time by Minister Willie Jackson and Minister Kelvin Davis who very quickly changed their tunes were set up under a National Government. And many of those—many of those—were run by incredible Māori educators that we support and in fact we would like to see more of. We want to see more choice in education; we would like to see more choice in education. We would like to see more incredible Māori academics and Māori educators setting up charter schools that provide choice for Māori students in this country. And I know that Kelvin Davis and I know Willie Jackson supported them—until they didn't.But I'd like to move on because I think I have quite well put on record our support for that part of the bill. It has been incredibly frustrating that this bill was not just about the wānanga. From our perspective we would have liked to have seen a piece of legislation that respected wānanga that was just for you but instead we got a bill with lots and lots of other pieces jammed into it some of which we oppose. But I want to make it very clear today we are opposing this bill not because of the changes to the wānanga but because of other changes in the bill that I think I made clear earlier in our committee process. And I'd like to move on to that part of the bill having made our intentions very clear around the wānanga.I do want to move on to the part of the bill that we are opposing. Unfortunately my SOP my Supplementary Order Paper was not accepted but I think it made the very clear point that we don't need and we don't require a very not a long list but a list of different groups of people that boards need to take into account when they are making co-options to their board.The Minister made it very clear in her contributions that she trusts schools. She trusts principals because they know their communities best. Well what better way to trust communities to trust boards to trust schools than to let them make their own decisions? They don't need prompting. And the reason—and I found some of the submitters at the Education and Workforce Committee made very very good arguments around why those "prompts" as the Minister now calls them were not required. I think it was very strong the submissions that were made—especially from those rainbow communities who said that they do not need to be singled out that they are perfectly capable of being elected on to a board because of their skill and their ability; that they didn't need to be singled out that they felt like this was marginalising them even further. Those were their comments and they meant a lot to us on this side of the House when we were listening to the submissions I thought they were important contributions.I think that what it led on to was a whole lot of problems that this throws up around definitions of the difference between sex and gender that we're leaving up to schools—the fact that it is very very difficult to determine without asking awkward questions or collecting data people's gender or sexuality. The ministry seemed to say that it wouldn't require any collection of data or any asking of awkward questions but the people who submitted to our committee overwhelmingly said that actually this would lead to awkward questions. And many of the people who served on those boards said to us that they didn't even know what the sexuality was of the people who were sitting on the boards they just knew the capabilities and the skills of those people in getting the jobs done that they needed to get done properly. So we are very worried about the definitions we're very worried about the collection of data and asking of awkward questions.It's the same when it comes to those low - socio-economic groups of people who are—the Minister said in her contribution she called them well she said that they didn't have confidence but she never actually talked about the fact that they were potentially from low-income communities. Again we have problems with the assumption that people are from those communities. Again the Minister came back to "Well we just have to trust the boards and they know best." Well if that is the case then there is no need for this part of the bill. It's unfortunate that we couldn't get to a position where we just accepted that every board should reflect the diversity of their students and their communities. Because I think that by having a list of people that need to be considered leaves many people out causes more problems than it solves and is throwing up a lot of issues for boards now that they're going to have to think about it—that I imagine will cause more confusion for them when actually they were already taking into account the make-up of their school communities and their student bodies.I think one of the telling things from the Minister when she was asked about the data was that she didn't have any data. She makes claims that these people are underrepresented on boards and the claim from the rainbow communities that submitted to our committee was that they don't feel that they are underrepresented on these boards and that they are able to get there on their own. And so when I asked the Minister if she had any data she was not able to point to a single piece of data that showed that the LGBT community is underrepresented on our boards.Angela Roberts: This is shameful.ERICA STANFORD: The members opposite like to say that "this is shameful" but I am reading directly from submissions that were given to us by submitters. Now if the members opposite would like to maybe email those submitters and say that their submissions were shameful well then I welcome them to do that. But I am reading out what their views are that they said to us that they didn't feel like they needed to be separated out and they wanted to know whether or not there was any data that actually showed that they were underrepresented. When I asked the Minister she was not able to give one single bit of data that backed up her claim that we needed to have this in there. Those communities said to us that they doubted whether or not it needed to be in there they didn't support it and the Minister wasn't able to back her claims up with any data—as per usual.So while I welcome very much today the inclusion of the changes to the governance structures for wānanga and while I have put on record our support for choice in education and the setting up of more choice in the form of charter schools or designated character schools led by amazing Māori educators—Penny Simmonds: Like Willie Jackson.ERICA STANFORD: Like Willie Jackson—ha ha! We do oppose this bill not for that reason but for the reasons I've mentioned around the options to the boards which will throw up more problems than they will be solving. Thank you Madam Speaker. ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jenny Salesa): Before I call the next speaker can I just remind members around the House that it is actually hard to hear the speeches in the debate not just for me as Speaker but for those who are actually watching either online or right here. Can we please keep the heckling to a minimum."