4. Question No. 4—FinanceHon SCOTT SIMPSON (National—Coromandel) to the Minister of FinanceQuestion No. 4—Finance4. Hon SCOTT SIMPSON (National—Coromandel) to the Minister of Finance: What recent announcements has she made about the Government's fiscal policy?Hon NICOLA WILLIS (Minister of Finance): Two weeks ago I released the Budget Policy Statement where the Government sets out its short-term intentions and long-term fiscal objectives for fiscal policy.Hon Rachel Brooking: How many pages?Hon NICOLA WILLIS: In summary—Mr Speaker isn't it funny that we have members opposite us who interject to ask us how long the statement was as if the definition of success is how many pages you can put in your document.SPEAKER: Yeah good. Just—Hon NICOLA WILLIS: Well here on this side of the House—SPEAKER: No—that's enough. Don't talk while I am. Just go back to your answer.Hon NICOLA WILLIS: What our fiscal intentions and objectives are are to return to surplus; to get debt heading down as a percentage of GDP rather than going up as it has been over the past five years; and to reduce Government spending as a proportion of the overall economy.Hon Scott Simpson: What is Government spending as a proportion of GDP?Hon NICOLA WILLIS: Well the half-year update in December forecast that core Crown spending in the current 2023-24 financial year will be 33.4 percent of GDP. Now to put that in context core Crown spending in 2018-19—just five years ago—was only 28 percent of GDP. Now clearly COVID disruptions were a factor in this increase but the crucial thing is that unlike in other countries there was no attempt to bring Government spending back down again after the temporary disruption passed. Spending was deliberately kept high and this Government is committed to bringing it down to ensure it is effective targeted and within our means.Hon Scott Simpson: What is the Government's objective for spending?Hon NICOLA WILLIS: New Zealand currently has a structural deficit and there are only three broad options to deal with that: borrowing to cover that deficit which is unsustainable; taxing New Zealanders more which most of the members opposite think's a great idea but which we're not big fans of; or reining back on spending. We will do the last of these. We intend to control growth in core Crown spending so that it reduces as a percentage of GDP and over time our objective is to bring spending down towards 30 percent of GDP.SPEAKER: It helps for order in the House if general statements about everyone's views are not made only those of the Government who is being held to account here.Hon Scott Simpson: How does the Government intend to reach that objective?Hon NICOLA WILLIS: Well this right-sizing of the Government's footprint will be achieved through ongoing restraint and reprioritisation across multiple Budgets. We cannot on this side of the House undo in one Budget what was created in six. The Government will be charting a medium-term course of fiscal consolidation and not overreacting to movements up or down in economic forecasts. We are ending the approach of recent years which confused spending money with achieving results and which doesn't believe that money can ever be saved within the public sector—Hon Kieran McAnulty: Point of order.Hon NICOLA WILLIS: —or ever be put to better uses.SPEAKER: You're probably only slightly ahead of me but point of order the Hon Kieran McAnulty.Hon Kieran McAnulty: Well Mr Speaker you'll note that this side of the House stayed silent for the majority of that exchange. We left it to you and you responded appropriately but the Minister appears to have ignored your advice and continued with her intent regardless.SPEAKER: Well only from the point of view that it was an incredibly lengthy answer—too long—and secondly as I said before it's not inappropriate for Ministers to refer to situations that they have inherited but I am watching very carefully for the attack aspect.