Jones Shane: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Jones Shane: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Volume:658;Page:7631] 
8.  
Hon SHANE JONES (Labour) 
 to the  
Minister of Local Government 
: Will his proposed local government reform facilitate private ownership or management of council assets? 
Hon RODNEY HIDE (Minister of Local Government) 
: 
 The focus of the proposals is not to facilitate private ownership of existing council assets. They do however make it easier for the councils to use private sector management of council assets where this best suits council needs. In the context of water services the councils must retain control of policy and pricing. The councils can already contract any aspect of the operation of all or part of a water service. That was the rule under the previous Government; it will remain the rule. The change announced yesterday simply extends the period of the contract from 15 years to 35 years to reflect the life of the assets being invested in. 
Hon Shane Jones 
: Given the importance of water infrastructure to Auckland could the Minister tell the House who owns water? 
Hon RODNEY HIDE 
: Maybe I could ask the MP— 
Mr SPEAKER 
: The interesting thing about this question is that strictly water is not the Minister’s responsibility at all. Water is not owned by anyone. I guess the member may have meant certain water not just water at large. I invite him to make the question more within the Standing Orders then perhaps we can get an answer. 
Hon Shane Jones 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. In the Minister’s response it was he who focused on water infrastructure. It was he who raised the notion of private enterprise. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I have pointed out that the member’s question asked who owns water. That is certainly not the Minister’s responsibility. I invite the member to reword his question to make more clear what he wants answered. 
Hon Shane Jones 
: In the changes to the Local Government Act 2002 to address the concerns of the Minister in relation to infrastructure and the use of that resource called water what ownership rights does he imagine will be recognised and ought to be recognised to protect the public’s interest in water? 
Hon RODNEY HIDE 
: I will do my best. I am happy to have two goes at the answer if I have misunderstood the member’s question. 
Shane Jones 
: Well you were too scared the first one. 
Hon RODNEY HIDE 
: Look at this big boy! 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Not while a microphone is open will I have that kind of interjection made back. The Minister will just answer the question please. 
David Garrett 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. As I understand the Standing Orders it is contrary to them to suggest that a member lacks courage. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: That is a fair point. It is not helpful when members make that kind of interjection. I invite the Hon Rodney Hide to answer the question. 
Hon RODNEY HIDE 
: I will do my best to answer the member’s question. To make it clear to the House and to the public of New Zealand there are no Government plans to privatise water services. Ownership of water assets under the proposals would revert to the councils at the end of any management agreement; thus the councils would retain ultimate public ownership. What has changed is that the period has gone from 15 years to 35 years. I note also that there are over 1800 private water supply schemes registered with the Ministry of Health—that is 1800. They are privately owned schemes that existed under the previous Government and will continue to exist. 
Hon Shane Jones 
: It is a pity he is focused on plumbing and not water. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Order! 
Hon Shane Jones 
: Is the Minister actively supporting the plans for a $1 million super-city bash in the Auckland Domain and how does he reconcile that with his concerns about council-related spending being wasted on non-core activities? 
Hon RODNEY HIDE 
: To continue with the ownership of water it is true that the water in the pipes will be owned— 
Mr SPEAKER 
: The member’s question asked—[ 
Interruption 
] I am on my feet. The member’s question may not have been very usual but it sort of related to the primary question and I ask the honourable Minister to please not just ignore it but answer it. I think he has a fair bit of licence in answering it. 
Hon Gerry Brownlee 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. In order to be answered properly a question needs to be somewhat intelligible. I think asking the Minister whether he is happy about a bash a domain and various other bits and pieces just invites the Minister to take the opportunity to further elaborate on what he thinks the member might have been asking. 
Hon RODNEY HIDE 
: I will explain my confusion. The primary question was this: will his proposed local government reform facilitate private ownership or management of council assets? The question is about council assets. I then got a question about who owns water— 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I apologise to the Minister. I must say to the Hon Shane Jones that he knows full well that I am hearing a point of order but he has continued to interject; if he does that any further at all he will lose one supplementary question. I do not need to hear further on this matter. The question was a fair stretch from the primary question—I accept that absolutely. That said though I think it should not be ignored totally. It seemed to refer to a celebration that is allegedly being planned and certainly that is a long stretch from the assets of the council. One could perhaps argue a linkage and that is why I am giving the member the chance to answer it. 
Hon RODNEY HIDE 
: I am all for Auckland celebrating and having fun. I have to say that Auckland has been doing that ever since the last election. With the new super-city Aucklanders will have every reason to have a lot more fun than they ever did when Helen Clark and the Labour Party were in power. They killed off fun and laughter not just in Auckland but right through the country. 
Moana Mackey 
: Why were social or pensioner housing assets not included in his list of core local government functions and what specific representations did he receive from the Minister of Housing advocating for their inclusion? 
Hon RODNEY HIDE 
: They were not included because that was Cabinet’s decision. I have worked very closely with the Minister of Housing on this issue and also indeed with the Minister for Social Development and Employment. I know that is a surprise because under the previous Government everything was decided from the ninth floor.