Ryall Tony: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Questions to Members 
Ryall Tony: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers Questions to Members 
[Volume:638;Page:8399] 
6.  
Hon TONY RYALL (National—Bay of Plenty) 
 to the  
Minister of Health 
: What is it in the Auckland laboratory testing High Court judgment that prevents him from expressing confidence in Wayne Brown chair of the Auckland District Health Board? 
Hon PETE HODGSON (Minister of Health) 
: 
 The judgment is critical of Mr Brown in several places most notably in paragraph 155 where the judge said that although Mr Brown may have interpreted Dr Bierre’s statement that he was “mothballing” his activities as a promise that Dr Bierre would stop seeking funding Mr Brown should have clarified that. In other words if Mr Brown took Dr Bierre at his word he should not have done so. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: Has the Minister ever sought any assurance or advice directly from Wayne Brown or discussed with Mr Brown his handling of the Bierre conflict of interest prior to the recent High Court decision; if so when? 
Hon PETE HODGSON 
: Through the Ministry of Health I maintained a close watch on the contract as it went through its various processes: the letting of the tender the court case and the approach of 1 July 2005. In the course of that I have spoken to Mr Brown on many occasions and there has been no suggestion that any conflict of interest was material. In fact the board received advice from both the Audit Office and its own legal support that it was not material. 
Hon Phil Goff 
: Is the letter of 27 June 2005 to Wayne Brown as chair of the Auckland District Health Board from Dr Paul Hutchison which was signed by him in his capacity as National’s spokesperson for health therefore a ringing endorsement of Dr Bierre and the advocacy of his case; and is it a personal endorsement by Dr Hutchison or in fact an endorsement by the National Party? 
Rodney Hide 
: I raise a point of order Madam Speaker. This is of course a serious issue but in respect of the questions that are being asked the Minister has absolutely no responsibility whatsoever. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: I agree with the member. The first part of the question was all right but the second part was certainly out of order. The Minister may address only the first part. 
Hon PETE HODGSON 
: In answering the first part of the question I can confirm that the letter was signed by Dr Paul Hutchison as the National spokesperson on health and I note in passing that that was during the long 2005 election campaign. Had National won that election Dr Hutchison would probably have been Mr Brown’s boss. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: Can the Minister confirm that he met with Mr Wayne Brown within 6 weeks of the Minister first discovering the conflict of interest allegations involving Dr Bierre; and can the Minister advise the House whether he received any assurances or advice from Mr Brown personally at that meeting assuring him as to the handling of the Bierre allegations? 
Hon PETE HODGSON 
: Given that I meet with Mr Brown a lot the answer to the first part of the question is quite probably yes. However the answer to the second part is no because I had long since received advice from the Auckland District Health Board that it did not perceive there to be any conflict of interest. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: So is the Minister confirming that he met with Mr Brown within weeks of first being alerted to the Bierre conflict of interest allegation and that he did not raise that matter with Wayne Brown the man who was responsible for overseeing the handling of the conflict of interest in this matter? 
Hon PETE HODGSON 
: I am confirming that rather than waiting for weeks to get confirmation I sought and received confirmation within days. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: Would it surprise the Minister to learn that prior to Wayne Brown becoming chairman of the Auckland District Health Board members of that board were required to declare conflicts of interest at the beginning of every meeting as a standing item on the agenda and that one of Wayne Brown’s first actions as chairman was to ditch the declaration of interest as a standing item at district health board meetings; and does he realise that that decision by Wayne Brown may in fact have proved fatal to this contracting process? 
Hon PETE HODGSON 
: Far from it! After people were elected at the late 2004 election the Auckland District Health Board held a workshop. It was led by Richard Westlake who is a well-respected governor of many boards. I have read the notes from that workshop. They are very clear that conflict of interest issues matter and they are very clear about how they might best be avoided. Dr Bierre regrettably did not follow the advice he was given. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: Does the Minister realise that it now appears that every district health board in New Zealand except Auckland District Health Board requires its members to declare conflicts of interest as a standing item on board agendas at the beginning of every meeting and that the Auckland District Health Board appears to be the exception with regard to that because Wayne Brown ditched the requirement in his first act as chairman of that district health board; and does the Minister now believe that a declaration of interests should in fact be on the agenda of every single district health board in New Zealand? 
Hon PETE HODGSON 
: Managing conflicts of interest is the responsibility of boards and of the members who comprise them. The Auckland District Health Board went through a process to ensure that all its new members knew what the issue was about—and on top of that the Ministry of Health ran workshops as well. There is no shortage of information on how to manage oneself if one believes that one has a conflict of interest—no shortage of information on how to do that. It happens at Cabinet level often for example. We know how to do it; unless one chooses not to do it the rules are clear. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: I seek leave to table two sets of agendas. The first is that of a meeting of the Auckland District Health Board before Wayne Brown became chairman— 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table that document— 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: —which shows conflict of interest was— 
Madam SPEAKER 
: I am sorry; I am just giving a ruling. The member has identified what the agenda was. Is there any objection? 
Document not tabled. 
Hon Tony Ryall 
: And the second is a document that shows that Wayne Brown became chairman of the Auckland District Health Board and ditched the requirement. 
Document not tabled.