Webb Duncan; Rurawhe AdrianDr DUNCAN WEBB (Labour—Christchurch Central): Tēnā koe e Te Mana Whakawā and kia orana. Look it's just sad. I've already heard two things today. One is the National Party again trying to drive a wedge between farmers and Government and it's not there to be driven. The other thing I've heard is the arguments for austerity—to not spend to pare everything back—and do you know what? We've been there before and we don't want to go back. The fact of the matter is that there is no trade-off between the environment and the economy. The economy is a subset of the environment. Without a healthy and flourishing environment there is no economic prosperity and there is no effective farming and we know that good farmers are totally on board with that. Rivers and farms in fact go hand in hand when properly managed. Our farms depend on our climate and that is why this Government in this Budget has a comprehensive strategy to address this. If we're going to hypothesise an economy we must first assume a flourishing healthy and effective environment and this Budget sets out numerous steps across the board to effect that. Our environment needs to be one that sustains health and sustains a healthy population a population that can work and recreate in the environment; an environment that provides effective supply of food and trade and all kinds of exports and we want to do that; and one that also—and sometimes we forget this when we're talking about the environment—provides an effective urban setting somewhere where we can live and flourish. This Government across the board through this Budget has done exactly that. We look at the freshwater package that David Parker the Minister for the Environment has set out. It's something that strikes a balance—a balance to the farmers I've spoken to—that is recognised as fair and effective one that limits the amount of nitrogen that's going into our waterways and one that requires the offsetting of stock away from the waterways but equally one that recognises that farming is an important part of our economy and that it is possible to effectively and sustainably run dairy farms which are a critical part of our exports. We can do that effectively and a good farmer knows that to do that effectively we must do it sustainably. It's no good having adverse environmental outcomes that are just paid for but that someone down the road has to pick up. That's what we are picking up now. We're picking up the neglect of our waterways that the last Government oversaw—no action at all on cleaning up our waterways. They sat on their hands and watched as nitrates leached and algae grew in our rivers. But now with David Parker's freshwater plan genuine steps. A plan which sees hard bottom lines and which actually sets rules in place—that's what we're seeing and that's what we saw when we examined these Estimates. The Resource Management Act reform which is part of this process is a huge leap forward. These proposals which the next Government will be able to implement see not just the effects but they are also looking for positive outcomes. It's actually changing the way we think about environmental outcomes. We're saying that we mustn't just say that minor effects are OK and slowly see the environment sliced away by inches but that we want positive environmental outcomes. Of course the huge leap forward under this Parliament and one that this Budget will actually see is the emissions trading scheme reforms which James Shaw came and talked about in front of the select committee. At last we have a cap-and-trade scheme with a cap one where we can effectively price carbon. Carbon is not costless. If you look at coastal communities that are being inundated with flooding they're the ones that are bearing the costs of carbon emissions elsewhere. It's only right that we now have a cap-and-trade scheme an emissions trading scheme which correctly prices carbon and that we have a sinking lid on carbon emissions where finally the genuine price of carbon will in fact be paid. As for the response to COVID the environment is a huge part of that and in fact Eugenie Sage our Minister of Conservation has made some important initiatives there such as the $1.1 billion initiative which will see money spent now which will have returns for generations to come. Whether it be insuring our biodiversity through the predator-free scheme and by using that money so that people can get out there and hunt trap and otherwise eliminate the predators which are absolutely wreaking havoc in our conservation estate or the wilding pine scheme where people who have previously been working in the tourism sector—many of those people who are working in that scheme now are out there cleaning up our environment removing these weed pines and making huge leaps forward. Of course we can see looking across the board that in terms of the environmental sector we're making massive leaps and bounds which previously have been absolutely neglected and we're making great steps forward. Really what we have here is at last a Government which sees that left unregulated people will take. They will abuse the environment in a way which is nothing more than the tragedy of the commons that's been identified 150 or nearly 200 years ago. What we need are genuine rules in place national policy statements which set out some absolute dictates which say that no we can't privatise this—we can't privatise these gains and socialise the environmental losses—but we need to actually have rules in place which set bottom lines whether that be a freshwater policy or an urban development policy. The work that's been going on in this sector—in urban development—is really important as well to recognise that Government has a significant part to play in stimulating urban development and in absolutely indicating where urban development ought to occur enabling the finance of it and partnering with business and private sector where appropriate but also making sure that where there are uplifts there's an ability to ensure that the people who get the value uplifts pay out a reasonable price for it whether that be through targeted rates or other means. What we're doing there is making sure that we're integrating environmental outcomes urban design outcomes and transport outcomes and the work around Kāinga Ora has been real. Urban development and urban design has been critical in doing that and it's all part of this Budget package. Another thing we've seen in this Budget is for example the progress being made on waste. The fact is that we need to understand that waste is a problem in New Zealand and of course Angie Warren-Clark has made some significant gains in respect of food waste. But we're also looking at our recycling and the fact that our recycling framework in New Zealand hasn't really worked for a long long time and we need to address that. The waste levy is going up to properly reflect the cost: one the cost of disposing of that waste and two ensuring that we have innovation. Only recently there's $124 million dedicated to improving our recycling outcomes so that we're not simply trying to dispose of our problems overseas and that we're not sending all of our recycling and waste materials overseas which raises huge problems. It raises huge problems about us being able to manage in times like the present our own waste problems. So having a framework where we can do that is very very important. Of course we've seen recently the Green Investment Fund making investments into the Wellington port and making sure that the Wellington port can in fact go carbon-neutral—another fantastic step forward. It's not a grant but a loan because we know that when industries make steps like this there are longer-term gains to be made—along with the grants made also for schools and hospitals to become carbon-neutral. So this is a Government and this is just one example. This is just one tiny sector of all of what's going on in Government to show that we're a future-focused Government—not one that's here for immediate gains and not one that's here to immediately placate the electorate but one that's here to make the tough decisions to make sure that future generations don't bear the costs of what's going on here today. Whether that be the environmental costs or the wider costs we're a Government which is committed to spending the right sums of money now to avoid austerity to avoid environmental disaster and to look after the prosperity of our nation and our people today tomorrow and for ever. Thank you Mr Speaker. ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Adrian Rurawhe): Honourable members there's one minute to go if someone wants to have a go for one minute.