Jones Dail: Foreshore and Seabed Bill — Second Reading Instruction to Committee In Committee 
Jones Dail: Foreshore and Seabed Bill — Second Reading Instruction to Committee In Committee 
[Volume:621;Page:16981] 
DAIL JONES (NZ First) 
: 
 I have sought a call although it seems almost superfluous for me to speak in this debate my having been mentioned so many times in despatches by members all around the Chamber! It has been a great honour to take part in the work on this legislation to ensure the protection of the national interest and to have the foreshore and seabed in the ownership of all New Zealanders. New Zealand First is prepared to show leadership in this matter among the Opposition and that is embodied in no better form than that of our leader the Rt Hon Winston Peters. 
I particularly wanted to follow on from Larry Baldock because of what he said. He referred to the discussions in the Fisheries and Other Sea-related Legislation Committee on effectively clause 2A. We in the committee said—and I am sure that Dr Mapp will remember—that we wanted a clause in the bill that would state something along the lines of what is in clause 2A: “The object of this Act is to preserve the public foreshore and seabed in perpetuity as the common heritage of all New Zealanders …”. That was a point we wanted to emphasise. We asked the officials whether they could put something together to reflect that view as that was what the members of the select committee wanted. When clause 2A came forward I could see exactly what the officials were getting at. It reflects the views and wishes of the select committee as a whole—including at that time the National Party members on it. But of course National members are always ready to oppose anything even if they might have supported the concept of common heritage and of having something extra in the purpose clause which is what clause 2A achieves. 
Many people might be interested in what the bill actually says. I know that various Kawau Island groups including the Kawau Island ratepayers were concerned—as were others—about for example the definition of “foreshore and seabed”. They may not be able to get a copy of the amended bill immediately but I tell them that we have made an alteration to the meaning of foreshore and seabed. It now: “(a) means the marine area that is bounded—(i) on the landward side by the line of mean high water springs;”. That is the meaning that is now in the bill. We have removed the reference to “high water line at mean high water spring tides”. As I understand it some people were concerned that the previous definition effectively took it too far. We now have a more reasonable definition of what the high-water mark is and what the marine area is on the landward side. On the landward side it will be bounded by the line of mean high-water springs. People who are interested in the bill should perhaps take more note of that. [ 
Interruption 
] 
Mr Mapp keeps chirping away. I was disappointed that he tried to make a personal reflection on me when he spoke. That was quite unusual for him. He had become quite excited by this legislation and I regret that I had to raise a point of order on him about it. Obviously he is concerned that he has been totally unsuccessful on behalf of the people of the North Shore. I can tell him that I am trying to do something about that matter with the Minister now and there might be some improvement in that area before the day is out. The North Shore City Council did not get hold of New Zealand First to deal with that particular issue but I think it has realised its mistake and now we are trying to do something about it. We will see what might happen later on and whether we can achieve something in the meantime. 
There are various new definitions in the bill such as “guardians” and “kaitiakitanga”. [ 
Interruption 
] I thank members; I admit to being an absolute novice but I am prepared to learn even if Georgina te Heuheu’s National Party members are not prepared to learn about Maori matters. That is why they have dismissed her from the National Party altogether. I as a member of New Zealand First a recent immigrant am prepared to learn about Maori things even if— 
Hon Ken Shirley 
: What does it mean? 
DAIL JONES 
: It means guardianship. Mr Shirley does not know what it means so I will help him. The use of that word is extremely important because time and time again Maori submitters to the select committee said they wanted to retain guardianship. It really impressed me and that is why New Zealand First has made sure that any foreshore and seabed reserve is protected by guardians. It is so much common sense really. It is good to see that New Zealand First has been able to achieve that in the legislation. Simply put this bill protects—[ 
Interruption 
] I have to put it simply for some members of the National Party whom I am always willing to help on this legislation—as I did when it was first introduced.