Benson-Pope David: Resource Management (Waitaki Catchment) Amendment Bill — In Committee 
Benson-Pope David: Resource Management (Waitaki Catchment) Amendment Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:619;Page:15277] 
Hon DAVID BENSON-POPE (Associate Minister for the Environment) 
: 
 I would like to take a call early to correct some of the nonsense we have just heard from the previous speaker. First of all I say to Dr Smith that it is in sorrow rather than in anger that I respond to those ridiculous comments he made. 
One of the most characteristic things about this discussion has been once again the confusion we have seen from the National Party. Indeed there has been direct contradiction between the absent Dr Brash and Dr Smith in their undeliverable promises to their constituency which they used to think was in the Mackenzie Basin. That is clearly not the case. This bill and the difficulties that led to it are the result of a statute introduced by the National Party that was flawed in this regard from the beginning. That led this Government to act as it has in terms of the Project Aqua consents and subsequently in terms of the water consents that need to be made. It is unfortunate that Environment Canterbury has not proceeded with what one would hope was its statutory responsibility but I guess one can lay that directly at the door of Dr Smith his flawed party and its flawed legislation. Clearly the National Party— 
Hon Ken Shirley 
: I raise a point of order Madam Chairperson. The Minister has the right to take a call in a debate as we know. Opposition members like a Minister to rise to his feet to take a call but generally it is to answer questions and to make points. 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: No— 
Hon Ken Shirley 
: No you have not heard me out. 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: The member will be seated. That is not a point of order and the member knows it. 
Hon Ken Shirley 
: The point of order is this— 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: Please be seated. 
Hon Ken Shirley 
: Will you take my point of order or not? 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: I have not heard a point of order. 
Hon Ken Shirley 
: Point of order— 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: Please be seated. I am ruling on the point of order. The Minister was quite within the bill he was speaking to. That was not a point of order. 
Hon Ken Shirley 
: I raise a point of order Madam Chairperson. 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: A new point of order? 
Hon Ken Shirley 
: It is a new point of order—it is the one I was not able to put just before. The Minister is required to get up and address the bill. He did not address the bill. All he did was to start going on about National Party policy and about what happened over 5 years ago. 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: The member will be seated. That was not a point of order. The member knows it was not a point of order. 
Hon Ken Shirley 
: No I don’t. 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: If the member contests my ruling he will not be here much longer. The point is that the Minister was quite within his rights. He was speaking to the purpose of this bill. 
Hon Ken Shirley 
: I certainly was not contesting your ruling. I took exception to the fact that you told me as a member what I was thinking. When I called out “No I don’t” I was actually objecting to the chair telling me what I was thinking. 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: The member will be seated. Nothing the member raised was a point of order. 
Hon DAVID BENSON-POPE 
: I am not surprised that the National Party is embarrassed at the failure of its legislation to deliver what Environment Canterbury should have done. The Government is entirely supportive of this bill. The expectation is that regional councils will fulfil their statutory commitments. Nor am I embarrassed as the National Party should be and as the most medicated member of the National Party should be— 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: The Minister will stand withdraw and apologise for that remark. 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: Madam Chairperson— 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: I am dealing with the matter Dr Smith. The Minister will stand withdraw and apologise for that remark. 
Hon DAVID BENSON-POPE 
: I withdraw and apologise. 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: I raise a point of order Madam Chairperson. A colleague of mine made a similar comment and was instantly removed from the House. The Minister has made a highly offensive remark. I expect you to show the Minister in the chair some firmness and to take exactly the same approach that was taken by Speaker Hunt when another member of the House did that—the member was told instantly to leave the House. 
Hon Murray McCully 
: Madam Chairperson— 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: I have dealt with the point of order Mr McCully. 
Hon Murray McCully 
: No you have not Madam Chairperson. 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: I have made my ruling on it. The Hon Dr Nick Smith has made his point. I have made my ruling. 
Hon Murray McCully 
: What is it? 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: I asked the Minister to withdraw and apologise and he has done that. I have dealt with it. 
Hon DAVID BENSON-POPE 
: Thank you Madam Chairperson. I— 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: It shows how much trouble he’s in today. He gets all personal because he can’t defend his bill. 
Hon DAVID BENSON-POPE 
: I do not need to dwell on the unnecessary personal comments made by Dr Smith but I repeat that it does not surprise me that he is embarrassed by the failure of his legislation in 1991. What this Government is repeatedly having to do— 
Brian Connell 
: I raise a point of order Madam Chairperson. I look for your guidance on this now. In the 2 years I have been in this House there has been a clear direction from the Chairperson or the Speaker that any member on his or her feet must speak to the bill. This Minister has made no attempt to do that other than some vague references. We are debating Part 1 of the bill and the Minister has not mentioned that once. 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: The Minister has mentioned that. If the member goes back and reads the Minister’s  
Hansard 
 he will see that he has referred to the bill. 
Hon Murray McCully 
: I raise a point of order Madam Chairperson. 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: I have ruled on that point of order. 
Hon Murray McCully 
: I am well aware of that Madam Chairperson. 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: Do you have a new point of order? 
Hon Murray McCully 
: I have a new point of order. Am I going to be permitted to put it? 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: Point of order the Hon Murray McCully. 
Hon Murray McCully 
: The Minister who is on his feet has just been asked by you to withdraw and apologise having made an offensive remark in relation to one of my colleagues. I would have thought you would require that Minister to show some contrition and remorse in this matter rather than allow him to continue to compound his offence by attacking the very same member in respect of whom the apology has just been due. If it is your intention to preserve order and to preserve the confidence of the minority parties in this Chamber may I suggest that you need to inform the Minister to show some contrition and to stay away from that area in future. 
The CHAIRPERSON (Ann Hartley) 
: The member does make a fair point but I also make the point that there were interjections on both sides. I now ask the Minister to continue to speak to the bill. 
Hon DAVID BENSON-POPE 
: I am pleased to do so. The legislation tonight in my view continues the pathway that we as a Government have had to spend a great deal of time on in this Chamber as we correct failed legislation that has come from our predecessors. We are pleased to do that. We are pleased to face up to the issues. In respect of the issues Dr Smith raised concerning the wider issues about the Resource Management Act I say that he will be grossly disappointed in the next week or two when Cabinet makes decisions about wider changes to the Resource Management Act because he will find that they make major inroads into correcting the failings that he and his failed Government left in the Act.