Brown SimeonSIMEON BROWN (National—Pakuranga): Thank you very much Madam Chair. It's a pleasure to be able to take a call on the Social Security Legislation Rewrite Bill. I've got a few questions that I would like to ask in regards to Part 4 but firstly I just thought that Chris Penk made an excellent contribution in relation to his amendment and I was a little uncertain around what the Minister Carmel Sepuloni means by policy-neutral because his amendment is an excellent one and it is policy-neutral. Earlier on this afternoon I heard the Minister complaining about amendments not being policy-neutral and now we get one which is policy-neutral but it's so policy-neutral that it's not a good one!So I think the House would benefit from some description as to what the Minister determines to be policy-neutral and what the Minister doesn't determine to be policy-neutral because I think there's a bit of confusion being given by the Minister. We've got a number of amendments and these relate to the bill very clearly—trying to improve it trying to make it better. We want to ensure that this legislation is put through in the best possible form as any good Opposition would want to do so having a definition of what policy-neutral means would help us and assist us in this debate as it continues and I'm sure it will continue for quite some time.I have a couple of questions and my questions relate to clauses 203 and 203A. These clauses relate to benefits not being payable while a beneficiary is absent from New Zealand. Rightfully so there are some exceptions to this rule. Those exceptions relate to those who are receiving New Zealand superannuation veterans support and any reciprocal agreement with another country. So there's a number of exceptions to that rule. And then a new clause has been added in by Supplementary Order Paper 25 section 203A which relates to the winter energy payment. There are a few questions that I'd like to ask. My first question is whether that's a policy-neutral change which has been made by the Government because that's a big debate—it's a big debate the policy behind the winter energy payment. The Minister has made it very clear that this bill is not about changing policy—it's policy-neutral—however that was a budgetary measure which was put through. The Opposition opposed it. It was an election promise. There is a lot of debate over whether it should be. I mean we had questions in question time over this issue. So to have something which has been questioned about in question time by the Opposition and then to argue that it's policy-neutral is something which I think is a little bit of a stretch and I would like the Minister to clarify whether this section is policy-neutral and if so why it is policy-neutral.Greg O'Connor: You're confusing it with being policies-neutral.SIMEON BROWN: Well you've got very weird policies on the other side of the House don't you Mr Greg O'Connor? So the next question I'd like to ask is around why the decision was made for it to be four weeks during the winter period. So if someone is eligible and receiving it—there's the opt-out clause there as well but if someone is receiving it and they leave the country for four weeks then they become non-eligible. So why was the decision made for four weeks?I guess that flows on to my second question which is: how is that measured? Is there a registrar for registering that you're going to be overseas? Is that information picked up by customs? I'd find it helpful if the Minister could clarify how that information is collected and how the ministry or the department—I think it's the chief executive has to be satisfied. In clause 203A(2)(b): the chief executive is satisfied that the 1 or more absences do not affect the beneficiary's eligibility for the payment under section 65C." So I'd appreciate some guidance from the Minister on how the chief executive is satisfied in relation to the winter energy payment—that they know that the person has been away for four weeks. So there are a number of questions but basically it's the process for the information in relation to the winter energy payment. I guess what measures are in place to ensure that the payment is then stopped? Does that automatically happen? Because I understand that you don't automatically opt out; you have to physically opt out. It's not an opt-in scheme; it's an opt-out scheme. So is someone warned or are they given a letter to say that they are no longer going to receive that payment from a particular time? So there's a number of questions around how that then affects their benefit. Is it automatically cut? What is the measure? Thank you very much."