Turei Metiria: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Turei Metiria: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Volume:610;Page:7644] 
4.  
METIRIA TUREI (Green) 
 to the  
Minister for Land Information 
: What proportion of New Zealand’s foreshore is either in private hands or subject to other restrictions on public access? 
Hon JOHN TAMIHERE (Minister for Land Information) 
: 
 Based on initial advice drawn from the work done by Land Information New Zealand so far I can tell the member that there is public access as of right to approximately two-thirds of the New Zealand coast through roads and reserves. Public access over the remaining one-third is potentially restricted due to private ownership or other restrictions. 
Metiria Turei 
: What proportion of the remaining one-third of land described by the Minister that is not open to public access but suffers restricted access is held in Maori customary title? 
Hon JOHN TAMIHERE 
: I have not received any definitive advice on that issue but I can tell the member that based on the information I have seen thus far it is clear that less than 10 percent of the land in question is held by Maori. 
Clayton Cosgrove 
: Has the Minister seen any reports suggesting solutions to that issue and is he planning to adopt or incorporate those ideas into Government policy? 
Hon JOHN TAMIHERE 
: Yes I have seen a range of ideas and suggestions including suggestions from the Hon Bill English to legislate for public ownership of private property through to suggestions from Dr Wayne Mapp who states that “Obviously pre-existing freehold title must be protected by law like mine.”— 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. Both Mr Mapp and Mr English are clearly on the public record as saying that it is the public foreshore and seabed for which title should be confirmed by legislation. The member is deliberately misleading the House as to their statements which are clearly on the public record. It is not for a Minister of the Government to say what might be the policy but I would be happy to table the statements from both Mr English and Mr Mapp. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: The member cannot say that anyone is deliberately misleading the House. He will stand and withdraw that comment. 
Opposition Member 
: Why? 
Hon Dr NICK SMITH 
: I stand and withdraw. I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: The member cannot say that anyone is deliberately misleading the House. That is a suggestion that a person is telling a lie and that has been ruled out as long as I have been in this House. 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I am still on my feet. Secondly I want the Minister to answer the question that he was asked. 
Hon JOHN TAMIHERE 
: The Government has indicated that it will more than likely follow the suggestion made by Dr Wayne Mapp as opposed to the suggestion of his leader. 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: Does the Minister stand by his statement to the  
New Zealand Herald  
that: “significant chunks of the foreshore”—not the Queen’s chain the foreshore—have private ownership title and that we are talking thousands and not hundreds of kilometres of private title to the foreshore? If he does stand by that when will he deliver the proof to back up that claim? 
Hon JOHN TAMIHERE 
: Given the preliminary work done and given the fact that it is a hugely complex issue I stand by those statements. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: Has the Minister received any reports from his Maori colleagues in the Labour Party caucus namely the Maori colleagues who promised the Maori people the earth before the election—and the seabed and the foreshore—and they will now see themselves losing their riparian rights which they have owned for a thousand years; and what sort of representation is that? 
Hon JOHN TAMIHERE 
: No. 
Gerrard Eckhoff 
: Given this Minister’s commitment to upholding the property rights of Maori will he rule out being a member of any Cabinet that moves to legislate away the private property rights of all New Zealanders; if not why not? 
Hon JOHN TAMIHERE 
: The member can rest assured that if any Government can fix this one we will. 
Hon Peter Dunne 
: In the light of that last answer can the Minister indicate what steps he is taking to ensure that all New Zealanders will continue to have access and freedom to go and use the facilities of the foreshore and seabed? 
Hon JOHN TAMIHERE 
: This is an issue that is deeply felt by Kiwis and we want to get it right. We have already said that the existing rights of Kiwis to take their babies down to have a barbie at the beach will be safeguarded. 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: How does he reconcile his statement to the  
New Zealand Herald  
that Maori could get some type of title to the foreshore with the statement made by Margaret Wilson and Helen Clark 4 weeks ago that the Government would legislate for Crown ownership of the foreshore? Which statement represents Government policy? 
Hon JOHN TAMIHERE 
: As a Government and as a Cabinet we can reconcile these matters. [ 
Interruption 
] 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I have just been reflecting on that too. Could the Minister expand on that just a little please? 
Hon JOHN TAMIHERE 
: There are work plans and work streams under way and the Government will make announcements in due course. [ 
Interruption 
] 
Mr SPEAKER 
: The Minister was asked how statements could be reconciled. I presume that he addressed that question when he said there were plans under way to do so. That perfectly addressed that question. 
Metiria Turei 
: Has the Minister seen any reports that suggest that the introduction of a concept of stewardship which is similar to the Maori customary practice of kaitiakitanga could assist with the active protection of the conservation values of the foreshore for the benefit of both the environment and the New Zealand public? 
Hon JOHN TAMIHERE 
: No. 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: Could the Minister advise the House which statement is correct: his statement yesterday that Maori could get some type of title to the foreshore or the statement made by Margaret Wilson and Helen Clark 4 weeks ago that the Government would legislate to ensure that title remained with the Crown? 
Hon JOHN TAMIHERE 
: In all matters I would prefer the advice of the Prime Minister. 
Metiria Turei 
: Has the Minister seen any reports that highlight the need to deal with public access to the foreshore over both private land and Maori customary land at the same time and equally rather than treating Maori ownership as a lesser right than the rights of private owners? 
Hon JOHN TAMIHERE 
: I have not seen any reports that opine in that way. 
Dr Wayne Mapp 
: I seek leave to table two documents one by the leader of the National Party Mr Bill English and one by myself. Both those documents will show an identical position on the issue of Crown ownership— 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table those two documents. Is there any objection? There is. 
John Carter 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. That raises a very interesting situation. We have a statement made by a Minister which is now on the record that claims that two members of the National Party the Hon Bill English and Dr Wayne Mapp made a statement that appears according to the documentation that Mr Mapp has to be quite inaccurate. Mr Mapp sought leave to table the documents so that it could be corrected and leave has been refused. How do we now get around the situation of correcting those statements? It is very clear that Mr Mapp was talking about exclusive ownership by the Crown. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Dr Mapp’s statement to this House must be accepted by every member as must that of anybody else. Any member has the right to reject leave to table but no one has the right to object to what any member said. I clearly heard what Dr Mapp said. He is entitled to say that and I take his word on it.