English Bill: General Debate 
English Bill: General Debate 
[Volume:637;Page:7974] 
Hon BILL ENGLISH (Deputy Leader—National) 
: 
 Nothing Dr Cullen says can avoid the public sense of outrage that two people died at the hands of our justice system. And no one is accountable—no one. Dr Cullen came down to the House yesterday and moralised on how good people did their best. I say to him that it does not matter whether good people did their best: Liam Ashley was fed to a monster by the Government. Karl Kuchenbecker was fed to a killer by the Government—by the Parole Board the Department of Corrections and the probation service. 
Here is the story about Graeme Burton—some of it anyway. He missed a home visit in October. He was not there when the probation officer visited. On 30 November this well-managed offender’s home was raided by the armed offenders squad. He was on the zero-tolerance list. The armed offenders squad rang the probation service and said: “This guy’s not here and he should be.” The probation service said: “Have a look in the fridge.” They did and because there was food in it the probation service said: “That’s fine with us.” The Government said it is OK the chief of the Department of Corrections said the case was well managed and the Minister said—well I do not know what he said because Labour will not let him say anything. Oh he said he was apologetic because we have raised it. The Prime Minister says that so many Ministers are in charge that no one can be held responsible. The guy Kuchenbecker is dead and no one cares! 
Actually this case is as bad as the Liam Ashley case—a case where every skerrick of common sense told one that putting a mixed-up 15-year-old into a van with a convicted serious killer was a stupid thing to do. Imagine what experience Liam Ashley had in the back of that van—imagine it! It was a desperate terrifying paralysing suffocating deadly experience. The public believe that the Government should be protecting us—Karl Kuchenbecker and Liam Ashley—from people who are known to be dangerous and Burton was known to be dangerous. He had breached parole several times and despite the fact that he was on the zero-tolerance list the armed offenders squad raided his home. He was not there. He was in breach of his parole. The probation officer went on holiday—just like William Duane Bell. And that is why the public is angry. 
They are angry because the Government has no sense of honour relative to its obligation and of the terrible consequences of failing in that obligation. The public want to see and think that it matters enough to Helen Clark that she will take action to ensure such occurrences do not happen again and to show the accountability to make it happen. If I were a probation officer I would now know that I have the protection of the Prime Minister against anything I do. If I were a security officer involved in transporting dangerous prisoners I would know that if I do something really stupid like putting a kid in the back of a van with a cold-blooded murderer and the kid gets murdered the Labour Party will defend me. That is what it is doing: it is defending stupid people who did the wrong thing and who caused violent deaths to harmless New Zealand citizens. 
Those members opposite still do not get it. My colleague John Key is right; they care more about Labour than about the public. Helen Clark’s mantra is never to apologise—or to apologise only for things one did not do 50 years ago. But her mantra is never to apologise never to concede and never to look like one is not on top. The price that will be paid is the next death at the hands of the Department of Corrections.