White Helen; Swarbrick Chlöe; Salesa JennyHELEN WHITE (Labour): I really wanted to take a call on this matter and I value the opportunity I have as a party that has honoured the conscience vote rules here because we will have different opinions on this and it's very important we're respectful of those opinions. They come from really deep places in our own experience.My experience was with a family member who was very addicted to alcohol and it made a huge difference and it harmed people around me. I have thought deeply about this issue—probably as a consequence. I know the reality of addiction and I also know the reality of the normalisation of something that can harm you in this way and how insidious it is.So I want to go first to the second part of this bill which is about the sponsorship for children's sports. This kind of issue is really about the normalisation of something that we don't want our children to think is normal. We want them to take this really seriously because it's that kind of normalisation that leads them into a vulnerable situation where they become addicted to something. It isn't just about adults making adult decisions; it's children becoming adults and hurting other people around them including other children. It's that serious and I've seen it I've had that experience in my own life and I wouldn't wish it on anyone. So that's a really important part of this bill for me.One of the parts of the debate here has been: well is it something where there will be a vacuum and something else will come in and fill the gap etc. or will it in fact leave a vacuum in children's sport? I had a discussion with a friend recently who said to me actually what they used to do for their softball club was they used to walk down the main street and get sponsors from the hardware store or from the supermarket. That I'd be happy with; that kind of response to sponsorship will fill this gap if necessary. I don't want to see sport being used as a conduit to our children and also to those who are watching those children. I don't want it to be normalised. So that's Part 2 of the Act.I want to talk about Part 1 of the Act which is the local control and I want to talk about the central issue that we've talked about tonight which is: is this a natural justice issue? I think we need to think really seriously about this not just here but everywhere. I am a big big fan of natural justice but I'm not a fool. I know when that term is being used to actually squash what is actually going on which is power imbalance because if you put a bells-and-whistles natural justice" around everything all the time what you end up with is a way of big corporates actually doing quite a lot of damage in our society because they can afford the lawyers. They can tie up the system and it's not a myth. There are six-week cases on alcohol hours etc.; little communities do get overwhelmed poor communities get overwhelmed by this stuff. This is really serious.So it is horses for courses here. We are intelligent human beings. We can work out the difference. We can design systems where local communities can have their say. And yes sometimes that means curbing the amount of natural justice. But what's natural justice about? It's about justice. And there's ways and means of doing that. And sometimes justice needs to be found in a different way. And this is actually a response to that.So though I love the work that the Labour Government has done in response to this issue too it isn't here yet. So I'm going to vote for Chlöe Swarbrick's bill and I'm going to vote for both parts very happily.I just wanted to talk about the difference between this and the bill that we just had from Ian McKelvie because in my first speech on this I said that I'm actually not a particularly judgmental person. I don't mind making things easier for people in social situations etc.; that is not the core of what is going on here. The core is the harm that's going on. And our duty as lawmakers is to look at a situation intelligently and not chase the rabbit of "natural justice" or find the excuse that we are just not being pure enough. This is practical this has to happen and I am going to support this bill. I commend it to the House.CHLÖE SWARBRICK (Green—Auckland Central): Point of order Madam Speaker. I seek leave to table the many letters that I have written to Christopher Luxon Nicola Willis and the Hon Paul Goldsmith about the Sale and Supply of Alcohol (Harm Minimisation) Amendment Bill.ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jenny Salesa): Leave is sought for that purpose. Are there any objections? There are objections."