Russell Deborah; McClay ToddHon Dr DEBORAH RUSSELL (Labour): Oh Madam Chair I do want to ask some questions about Part 2 of this bill. Part 2 of the bill is actually the bit that has a whole lot of schedules that change other parts of the law. Now as someone who is rather new to this I think I can go to Subpart 2 of Part 2—excuse me I'm sorry. I'm just struggling a little bit here—and in terms of—CHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger): Could the member please talk into the microphone? Hon Dr DEBORAH RUSSELL: Oh I am sorry Madam Chair. CHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger): Could the member please move back to her seat so that the microphone can pick her up. Hon Dr DEBORAH RUSSELL: Thank you Madam Chair. So I just want to go to Subpart 2 under Part 2—could someone just direct me to it? I'm just finding it a little hard to find it in the—Hon Matt Doocey: It's Part 2 just after Part 1.Hon Dr DEBORAH RUSSELL: Yeah I am looking for it—I am looking for it. Oh I've got it here Part 2.Hon Scott Simpson: On the wrong bill.Hon Dr DEBORAH RUSSELL: No I've got the right bill in my hands. We're just trying to make sure we actually give the Minister an opportunity to reconsider whether or not he'll actually answer any of the questions. So going to Subpart—Hon Matt Doocey: It's a good question so far. Hon Dr DEBORAH RUSSELL: I know I'm working on it—oh Subpart 2. Thank you Peeni. Thank you.So there's a whole lot of secondary legislation that is being revoked and I noticed that sitting in there is an instrument Subpart 2—so it's clause 18 of this bill and we're going to paragraph (d). we're going to the partial waiver of fees and levies for certain classes of applicants for registration as and registered log traders and advisers and so on. It's a partial waiver of the fees and the levies in this Subpart 2. I am interested to know exactly what is the partiality there—how much it was a partial amount. Clearly some of those fees are remaining. So if I could just get some explanation from the Minister as to that amount the division in the parts and how they arrived at that amount. Hon TODD McCLAY (Minister of Forestry): Madam Chair it's lucky trees take 25 years to grow before we harvest them. The point that I guess I would make to colleagues is that this is the narrowest part of the bill but I think it's the most important part of the legislation—Part 2—and the reason for that is we've taken on obligations internationally as well as under domestic statute around legal harvest and so we have agreements around the world and trade agreements and so on that we have to adhere to. This is a part of the original legislation. Actually it's a system we'd set up so that we can give assurance to trading partners overseas that when logs are cut down and exported from New Zealand and sold we'd meet the requirements we've taken on internationally but again amongst our domestic legislation also and ultimately the changes the member is asking about are not significant in the scheme of how we achieve this. But the one thing we are doing is pushing the date out by slightly more than a year and the reason we're doing that is so that one we can ensure that in establishing the new system in New Zealand which the previous piece of legislation allows us to do we get it right through consultation with all of the groups the members have mentioned from iwi to landowners—across the board.Secondly we also want to have the opportunity to engage with a number of international stakeholders—countries we trade with—to make sure that what we stand up through regulation meets their requirements also. So we've said that we want to give ourselves almost another year to be able to do that but we've also said that it is a year or it could enter into force sooner through Order in Council. So we're not saying it enters into force on that day—1 August 2027—but we're saying that it must be by that day or before by Order in Council. But we want to give ourselves time to be able to engage widely within New Zealand to make sure that one we achieve the obligations that we have and achieve the intention of the primary legislation and then secondly that actually it will fit with what we're doing elsewhere.Although this isn't part of the bill by way of an example of the reason we want to do this some members will know that the European Union has passed legislation previously about exports to their market and the impact that any exports—food as an example or trees—to the European Union has upon the equivalence of legal harvest. So we want to go through a process with them because what they are looking to do would place great cost on New Zealand because the things they're trying to stop are not able to take place legally in New Zealand and so actually our standards are the same or better than theirs. But the legal harvest provisions of this when the system stands up will perhaps give us an opportunity to show them that actually they don't need to check everything New Zealand does because we take our obligations seriously. But again this is the narrowest part of the bill. The changes here where it allows us to consult more and the other changes around wording and so on are to ensure that this legislation and—from Part 1—the bits that we are relying upon in as far as our definitions are concerned allow us to continue to do our work properly.