edithatogo/nz-hansard-corpus huggingface dataset:
11. Budget 2017—Financial Capability of Young New ZealandersALASTAIR SCOTT (National—Wairarapa) to the Minister of Commerce and Consumer AffairsBudget 2017—Financial Capability of Young New Zealanders11. ALASTAIR SCOTT (National—Wairarapa) to the Minister of Commerce and Consumer Affairs: How does Budget 2017 invest in the financial capabilities of young New Zealanders?Hon JACQUI DEAN (Minister of Commerce and Consumer Affairs): As part of Budget 2017 I announced an extra $10.2 million in operational funding over the next 4 years for the Commission for Financial Capability to scale up its Sorted schools programme and its community-based programmes. Once fully operational over 90000 Kiwi kids a year will receive financial education in primary and secondary schools throughout New Zealand. The community-based financial capabilities programmes will focus on vulnerable communities that demonstrate lower levels of financial capabilities or that have limited access to independent financial information.Alastair Scott: Why is building the financial capabilities of young people important?Hon JACQUI DEAN: Increasing the financial capabilities of our young people is important because it teaches them how to be better with money before they enter the workforce. We want to empower young New Zealanders to be able to make smart financial decisions and engage competently with financial products such as KiwiSaver. We want young people to understand the value of savings managing money and the hidden costs of debt and credit. People with good levels of financial capability are more likely to make good decisions with money.
10. Benefits—Sanctions and ImpactJAN LOGIE (Green) to the Minister for Social DevelopmentBenefits—Sanctions and Impact10. JAN LOGIE (Green) to the Minister for Social Development: Will she apologise to a young woman who had a child conceived through rape whose benefit was reduced for years because she didn't want to name the father?Hon ANNE TOLLEY (Minister for Social Development): Yes absolutely. As Work and Income has said itself it got it very wrong in this case. Although there is a legal obligation to apply for child support and name the other parent the law explicitly lays out circumstances where a person does not have to do this and this includes if a child is conceived as a result of rape. It is clear that in this situation Work and Income did not apply the law correctly and I appreciate that this was extremely distressing and upsetting for the young woman. I sincerely apologise for that. Jan Logie: Thank you for that Minister. My supplementary is: does she stand by section 70A of the Social Security Act which takes up to $28 per week per child from around 15000 poor women and their children because they like the woman I mentioned have not named the father?Hon ANNE TOLLEY: This particular provision has been around for decades and the intent behind the policy is to encourage the other parent to take responsibility and contribute to the cost of raising their own child. I note it was introduced in 1990 and in 2005 the then Labour Government increased the deduction by $6 per week. This Government has no intention to change section 70A but I have asked the Ministry of Social Development (MSD) to do some research to see the effectiveness of that policy.Jan Logie: Does the Minister consider it appropriate to deprive already poor women and their children of essential income when the reasons why parents do not name the other biological parent are often intensely personal and private and frankly none of the State's business?Hon ANNE TOLLEY: As I said in my previous answer the intent of the policy is to make sure that the other parent takes some responsibility for their child. That is what I have asked MSD to do some research on to see whether the intent of the policy is actually reaping the rewards that we want to be sure that it is.Jan Logie: Understanding all of that in principle does the Minister think it is right that women have to recount often traumatic and quite personal details to lawyers and untrained staff members often in open-plan offices in order to receive the financial support that they need; if not on that principle will the Minister commit to getting rid of this outdated law?Hon ANNE TOLLEY: Under section 70A if it is a woman she simply has to name the father of the child. That is all they have to do.
8. Housing—Supply and Government Measures to AddressDENIS O'ROURKE (NZ First) to the Minister for Social HousingHousing—Supply and Government Measures to Address8. DENIS O'ROURKE (NZ First) to the Minister for Social Housing: Does she stand by all her statements?Hon ALFRED NGARO (Associate Minister for Social Housing) on behalf of the Minister for Social Housing: Yes in the context that they were made.Denis O'Rourke: Does the Minister confirm that of the 34000 new homes in Auckland she has mentioned 8300 are replacements for existing State houses and therefore the Government has really committed to only 25700 houses over 10 years or only about 2500 per year?Hon ALFRED NGARO: What I can confirm is this: in the Crown building project we will see 8300 old run-down social houses replaced by 13500 new warm dry houses to support some of our most vulnerable New Zealanders. I can also confirm to the member that we are increasing social houses. There are 66000 social houses. We are planning to increase that by 6400 houses by 2020 to 72000 houses.Denis O'Rourke: Is the Minister telling the people of Auckland that 2500 more homes per year is the best her Government can do for direct investment in house-building in the face of the massive and worsening housing crisis in that city?Hon ALFRED NGARO: What I can say to the member is what this Government is doing is it is supporting families. We are spending $2.3 billion on housing support this year supporting 310000 families which will increase the accommodation supplement boost announced as part of the Budget. We are increasing social housing special-needs grants. We have paid out 9218 grants last quarter to 2616 families and individuals totalling $8.8 million. We have also too last year committed $354 million to emergency and transitional funding which means 8600 emergency housing places per year. I can say that this Government is doing its role in taking seriously the responsibility to housing.Denis O'Rourke: Would Auckland not be much better off if the Government committed to a much bigger investment in its house-building programme thus greatly increasing desperately needed housing stock than spending hundreds of millions of dollars more per year on the bottomless pit of accommodation supplements which will not add one more family home?Hon ALFRED NGARO: I can say to the member that last year there was an inquiry that had three different political parties that came together. Out of the 20 recommendations one of those was a review of the accommodation supplement which has not happened for some time. This Government has reviewed the accommodation supplement—the first time that it has done that—to increase that amount to those who are in need.
7. Emergency Housing—Demand and Associate Minister for Social Housing's StatementsPHIL TWYFORD (Labour—Te Atatū) to the Associate Minister for Social HousingEmergency Housing—Demand and Associate Minister for Social Housing's Statements7. PHIL TWYFORD (Labour—Te Atatū) to the Associate Minister for Social Housing: How many extra emergency housing places available to take referrals have been delivered over and above the 737 he reported for March 2017 if any?Hon ALFRED NGARO (Associate Minister for Social Housing): I am pleased to be able to report that as of today's date the Government has secured around 900 transitional housing places across the country an increase of 251 places over the figure reported at the end of March 2017.Phil Twyford: How can he claim It is great to see how the Government's … funding is making a difference in the community" when the number of people in the Government's at-risk category with severe and persistent housing needs has more than doubled in the last 2 years?Hon ALFRED NGARO: There has been a reduction in available places over that period primarily and that reflects that Te Puea Marae decided not to continue providing emergency housing over its service. The Government however has since made up some of that shortfall. Since 31 March it has secured an additional 251 new transitional housing places. Phil Twyford: What does he say to Rev. Emily Worman who helped to organise last year's Park Up For Homes in Māngere where hundreds of people slept in their cars overnight to highlight the housing crisis who now says: "In Māngere East there are more beggars outside the shop … a lot of them are sleeping rough. There's just constant pressure on food banks there are all these cars parked around just overcrowded and a lot of it is really hidden there's a lot of shame attached to it."?Hon ALFRED NGARO: I would say that the ministry is making good progress securing around 1600 places by the end of June with a balance of 2150 places to be delivered by the end of 2017.Phil Twyford: Why did he tell a National Party conference that the controversy over homelessness was manufactured by journalists?Hon ALFRED NGARO: I have apologised for those comments. They were misplaced and I have regretted those comments that I made at that time. Phil Twyford: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I asked why he made those comments.Mr SPEAKER: No within the answer there were two words that I think means that he has addressed that question.Phil Twyford: Why did he tell the National Party conference "I think that's a bridge too far." after the Prime Minister had said to him: "I need you to get close to Salvation Army policy analyst Alan Johnson. I need you to love him."?Hon ALFRED NGARO: My comments were about the work that we have been doing as a Government to work closely with community housing providers up and down the country. I have been doing that with them. It is a reflection of the work that we have been doing. I regret those comments that I made. They were misplaced; they were poorly made."
6. Budget 2017—Irrigation InvestmentBARBARA KURIGER (National—Taranaki - King Country) to the Minister for Primary IndustriesBudget 2017—Irrigation Investment6. BARBARA KURIGER (National—Taranaki - King Country) to the Minister for Primary Industries: What recent Budget announcements has the Government made regarding investment in irrigation?Hon NATHAN GUY (Minister for Primary Industries): Budget 2017 is a great Budget for the primary sector. The Government has announced $26.7 million over the next 3 years plus a capital boost of $63 million towards irrigation investments. While a reliable water supply for growers and farmers has made a major boost for economic growth it also provides real economic benefits. Irrigation and water storage schemes help maintain river flows take pressure off groundwater aquifers and also provide social benefits such as providing water into town supplies.Barbara Kuriger: What schemes and communities will this funding help support?Hon NATHAN GUY: I am sure there will be numerous support for communities up and down the country. In particular the Waimea Community Dam near Nelson the Flaxbourne community water project in Marlborough Hunter Downs water and the Hurunui Water Project are all potential candidates for investment. These schemes would provide a wide variety of land uses including horticulture sheep beef and arable. New irrigation schemes must meet stringent environmental tests. Any new developments or conversions must farm within very strict environmental limits set by regional and local councils.
4. Economic Outlook—ReportsBRETT HUDSON (National) to the Minister of FinanceEconomic Outlook—Reports4. BRETT HUDSON (National) to the Minister of Finance: What reports has he received on the prospects of the New Zealand economy?Hon STEVEN JOYCE (Minister of Finance): New Zealand's economy has now grown in 23 of the last 24 quarters and the prospects for future growth are positive. The ANZ Business Outlook yesterday shows a net 38 percent of companies expect their businesses to improve over the next year. That is 10 points higher than the historical average. The New Zealand Institute of Economic Research's quarterly predictions this week state: Recent developments continue to point to a bright domestic outlook and the construction pipeline remains solid." It also expects unemployment to fall to 4.3 percent. This morning's terms of trade data show another increase of 5.1 percent—the second-highest level that our terms of trade have been since 1957.Brett Hudson: What is underpinning these high levels of confidence in New Zealand's economy?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: The Government's programme of consistent economic reform is helping companies get ahead whether it is in simplifying their interactions with the Government supporting them into new export markets or providing the infrastructure they need to keep growing. The Government's strong economic plan is giving businesses the confidence to invest in their companies to hire new people and to compete internationally. In addition people can see they can reap the rewards of their hard work whether that is letting them keep more of what they earn or the Government investing in more social services in their communities.Brett Hudson: How is the strength and stability of New Zealand's economy perceived internationally?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: Moody's commented on last week's Budget saying: "The Government's ability to fund spending on new measures such as the family and incomes tax package and maintaining fiscal surpluses is the result of significant fiscal policy flexibility gained from consistent fiscal prudence." Fitch Ratings also commented saying: "If the Budget continues to improve there would be upward pressures on the ratings of New Zealand." The Australian Financial Review has concluded by observing that New Zealand has "a strong economy that remains the envy of developed country peers."Brett Hudson: How is the Government using this current period of economic growth to deliver for New Zealanders?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: Following the hard work of New Zealanders after both the global financial crisis and the Christchurch earthquakes the Government has returned the books to surplus and our economic plan is delivering rising wages rising employment and falling unemployment. This strong economic and fiscal position gives us the opportunity to invest $7 billion more in public services for a growing country significantly increase our infrastructure spend pay down debt as a percentage of GDP and deliver a Family Incomes Package to help families raise their kids or save for a house."
Tolley AnneHon ANNE TOLLEY (Minister for Children): I move That this debate be now adjourned.Motion agreed to.
Tisch LindsayThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Lindsay Tisch): The member's time has expired.Ron Mark: Mr Assistant Speaker.The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Lindsay Tisch): The member has spoken. Ron Mark has spoken in this debate.Ron Mark: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker.The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Lindsay Tisch): No my record shows that the member has spoken in this debate.Ron Mark: That is true. We are allocated two slots in this—The ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Lindsay Tisch): No you get only one. You can speak only once. So I am calling Simon O'Connor.
Urgent Debates Declined — Mental Health—Auditor-General's Report
Carter DavidURGENT DEBATES DECLINEDMental Health Services—Auditor-General's ReportMr SPEAKER: I have received a letter from Dr David Clark seeking to debate under Standing Order 389 the Auditor-General's report Mental health: Effectiveness of the planning to discharge people from hospital. This is a particular case of recent occurrence; the report was released yesterday. Although there is no ministerial responsibility for the Auditor-General the report covers matters for which there is ministerial responsibility. The test for whether a particular case requires the immediate attention of the House is a high one. The fact that the matter can be raised during the Budget debate is a relevant factor and I refer members to Speaker's ruling 215/1. In light of the fact that the House is debating the Budget I am not convinced that the matter is urgent enough to warrant setting aside the business of the House today. I also note that the member has not yet spoken in the Budget debate and may use that opportunity to debate the matter. The application is therefore declined.
Bridges SimonTHURSDAY 1 JUNE 2017Mr Speaker took the Chair at 2 p.m.Prayers.BUSINESS STATEMENTHon SIMON BRIDGES (Leader of the House): When the House resumes on Tuesday 6 June the Government will look to complete the Appropriation (2017/18 Estimates) Bill and the Care and Support Worker Equal Pay Settlement Bill and make progress on a number of other bills on the Order Paper.
Wednesday 31 May 2017 - Volume 722
VoteThe question was put that the amendments set out on Supplementary Order Paper 311 in the name of the Hon Te Ururoa Flavell to the proposed amendments set out on Supplementary Order Paper 279 in his name to Part 4 be agreed to. A party vote was called for on the question That the amendments be agreed to.Ayes 62New Zealand National 58; Māori Party 2; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.Noes 57New Zealand Labour 31; Green Party 14; New Zealand First 12.Amendments agreed to.The question was put that the amendments as amended set out on Supplementary Order Paper 279 in the name of the Hon Te Ururoa Flavell to Part 4 be agreed to.A party vote was called for on the question That the amendments as amended be agreed to.Ayes 62New Zealand National 58; Māori Party 2; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.Noes 57New Zealand Labour 31; Green Party 14; New Zealand First 12.Amendments as amended agreed to.The question was put that the following amendments in the name of Meka Whaitiri to clauses 132 145 and 148 be agreed to:in clause 132(3A) delete paragraph (b);in clause 132(3A)(c) replace 25" with "7"; in clause 145(3) replace "may" with "must; andin clause 148(2) replace "with" with "who the chief executive determines has".A party vote was called for on the question That the amendments be agreed to.Ayes 57New Zealand Labour 31; Green Party 14; New Zealand First 12.Noes 62New Zealand National 58; Māori Party 2; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.Amendments not agreed to.A party vote was called for on the question That Part 4 as amended be agreed to.Ayes 62New Zealand National 58; Māori Party 2; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.Noes 57New Zealand Labour 31; Green Party 14; New Zealand First 12.Part 4 as amended agreed to."
10. Budget 2017—Investment in Science and InnovationDr PARMJEET PARMAR (National) to the Minister of Science and InnovationBudget 2017—Investment in Science and Innovation10. Dr PARMJEET PARMAR (National) to the Minister of Science and Innovation: How does Budget 2017 investment in science and innovation support a growing economy?Hon PAUL GOLDSMITH (Minister of Science and Innovation): The $372 million extra funding through the Innovative New Zealand programme in the 2017 Budget is designed to generate more of the skills the ideas and the scientific capability to drive the New Zealand economy forward. The funding includes $82 million for the Government's pre-eminent applied science fund the Endeavour Fund which supports excellent higher-risk research with the potential for long-term transformative impact in areas of future value; $132 million for tertiary education to ensure young New Zealanders obtain the skills we need; and $75 million for Callaghan Innovation's research and development growth grants. It is all about adding more value to our export volumes. Investment in innovation is designed to lift our productivity and thereby provide for our future prosperity. Dr Parmjeet Parmar: What does Budget 2017 provide for high-impact transformative science? Hon PAUL GOLDSMITH: As well as providing ideas and innovation to help our companies be more internationally competitive a strong science and innovation capability provides the evidence for fact-based decision-making for the Government and investors. It also provides solutions for many of our national challenges. Budget 2017 will invest an additional $81.9 million of new operating funding over 4 years to support high-impact mission-led programmes in science to the Endeavour Fund. New Zealand science already makes a powerful contribution to areas like improving water quality ensuring our children get a good start supporting good health in older populations and developing new industries that create exports and jobs. The Endeavour Fund complements the Government's other investments in mission-led science and demonstrates its commitment to creating a highly dynamic science and innovation system.Dr Parmjeet Parmar: Supplementary question. [Interruption]Mr SPEAKER: Order! If the member wants more I need less interjection from the Minister.Dr Parmjeet Parmar: How will Budget 2017's science and innovation investment contribute to the global store of knowledge?Hon PAUL GOLDSMITH: Of the new operating funding allocated in Budget 2017 $40.5 million is to help reduce the risk to life from natural disasters and hazards and to explore the unique environment of Antarctica. The $21 million over 3 years from 2018 that is dedicated to Antarctic research will provide an enhanced platform for new scientific discoveries by Kiwi researchers in one of the most dangerous dynamic and awe-inspiring places in the world. New Zealand has had a formal presence in Antarctica for over 50 years and the continent is a hugely important region for research in the natural world in the past the present and into the future.
8. Budget 2017—Investment in School PropertyTODD BARCLAY (National—Clutha-Southland) to the Minister of EducationBudget 2017—Investment in School Property8. TODD BARCLAY (National—Clutha-Southland) to the Minister of Education: What investment is the Government making in school property in Budget 2017?Hon NIKKI KAYE (Minister of Education): I am pleased to advise the House that this year's Budget provides $456.5 million for education infrastructure and associated costs all over New Zealand. This will provide six new schools two new school expansions the relocation of two special education schools 11 special education satellite units and around 305 new classrooms nationwide. We inherited a school property portfolio with lots of issues such as leaky buildings poor maintenance and issues with earthquake strengthening. We prioritised extra money to tackle big issues such as earthquake strengthening weathertightness and major redevelopments to modernise and transform schools into 21st century learning environments.Todd Barclay: What investment will be made in school property in the Wānaka region as part of Budget 2017? Hon NIKKI KAYE: I am pleased to confirm that $19 million will be invested in Wānaka's school network as part of Budget 2017. This includes around $16 million for a new primary school in Wānaka and around $3 million for six new classrooms at Mount Aspiring College. This is about ensuring that we can futureproof for growth in Wānaka and give certainty to the community about education provision for many years to come. This Government has put more than $5 billion into school property. Further announcements will be made in the coming weeks.Chris Hipkins: Does she stand by her statement that the $350 million announced in Budget 2014 to get ahead of demand provides for nine new Auckland schools by 2018."; if so how many of those new schools will be open by 2018 as promised?Hon NIKKI KAYE: I do stand by that statement for a couple of reasons. In this Budget we will be ahead of the $350 million amount; it will be at $400 million so we are well ahead in terms of funding. We will be ahead over 17000 students and in terms of the new schools we have announced those new schools in this Budget some of them will take longer than 2018 but the overall point is that we will be definitely making that commitment of more than 17000 students and what is important is that some of them need more classrooms. That is why we have delivered them first."
5. Budget 2017—State Highway NetworkJONATHAN YOUNG (National—New Plymouth) to the Minister of TransportBudget 2017—State Highway Network5. JONATHAN YOUNG (National—New Plymouth) to the Minister of Transport: What investment is the Government making into New Zealand's state highway network over the next four years through Budget 2017?Hon SIMON BRIDGES (Minister of Transport): The next 4 years will see $9.1 billion in capital invested in New Zealand's State highway network continuing this Government's strong track record in infrastructure. This is the biggest ever investment in the country's highway network and it is a core part of the Government's commitment to building the infrastructure we need for a growing country. Budget 2017 provides $812 million for the reinstatement of damaged sections of State Highway 1 between Picton and Christchurch following the Kaikōura earthquakes. All up Budget 2017 provides essential investment that not only provides for a more resilient and safer transport system but also the increased capacity to support economic growth right across the country.Jonathan Young: What are the key roading projects that the Government will be delivering?Hon SIMON BRIDGES: The Government is delivering the biggest ever investment in the country's State highway network and there are many projects that the Government will be progressing over the next 4 years. They include the completion of Auckland's western ring route the northern and southern motorway improvements in Auckland the East-West Link in Auckland the Pūhoi to Warkworth highway the Huntly and Hamilton sections of the Waikato Expressway on State Highway 1 the Pekapeka to Ōtaki Expressway and many others. All up the Government expects to open 540 new lane-kilometres of State highway over the next 4 years. This will be the largest increase in State highway capacity in many decades. Jonathan Young: How will the Government's biggest ever investment in the country's State highway network benefit New Zealand motorists and businesses? Hon SIMON BRIDGES: The Government has embarked upon the most ambitious development of new State highway motorways and expressways seen in several decades. A key focus of Government funding will be the completion of the roads of national significance projects. These are lead infrastructure projects that link our major cities with the regions and link our export sectors with the key ports. They help promote economic growth while increasing the ability to move people and freight around safely and reliably. We are also investing more in regional roading projects right across the country which improve journey times and reliability and remove bottlenecks. The regional investments are also hugely important for our growing tourism sector.
3. Economic Programme—PerformanceTODD MULLER (National—Bay of Plenty) to the Minister of FinanceEconomic Programme—Performance3. TODD MULLER (National—Bay of Plenty) to the Minister of Finance: How is the Government's economic plan delivering for New Zealanders?Hon STEVEN JOYCE (Minister of Finance): This Government's plan for growth is sensible conservative fiscal policy; strong orthodox monetary policy; and an ongoing programme of microeconomic reform that is enhancing the competitiveness and confidence of Kiwi businesses. We have experienced positive economic growth in all but one quarter of the last 6 years. As a result unemployment has been steadily falling and wages are rising. Budget 2017 was an opportunity to provide a bit more support to New Zealanders to help them get ahead whether raising their kids or saving for a house.Todd Muller: What else is the Government doing to keep this economic plan on track?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: A key condition to enable a growing economy is the provision of new infrastructure for growth. This Government has grown infrastructure spending considerably and commenced major transformative investments such as the ultra-fast broadband programme and the roads of national significance. Budget 2017 boosted infrastructure spending by a further $4 billion for further new schools and health facilities key transport links like the City Rail Link and additional water storage through Crown Irrigation Investments. All up we are investing a total of $32.5 billion in new infrastructure over the next 4 years Todd Muller: How do New Zealanders know the Government's economic plan is working?Hon STEVEN JOYCE: This question could have been written for Mr Peters. New Zealand has a positive economic outlook driven by our strong economic plan and confident New Zealand companies which are investing innovating exporting and creating skilled jobs. Employment is forecast to keep growing strongly in the years ahead and unemployment is expected to steadily decline. Nominal GDP is now forecast to be a cumulative $23.9 billion higher over the next 5 years than was expected at the half-yearly update.Todd Muller: What risks are there to New Zealand's future economic growth? [Interruption] Hon STEVEN JOYCE: I might be looking at them. Under the Government's strong economic leadership New Zealand is shaping globalisation to its advantage. We are embracing increased trade new technologies innovation and new investment. But we must remember that as a small and open economy New Zealand is exposed to a number of risks some of which the Reserve Bank highlighted in its Financial Stability Report this morning. Our domestic sectors of dairy housing and banking all require ongoing vigilance to ensure any shocks are well managed and there are also political risks facing the global economy particularly among those countries looking to pursue more inward-looking and isolationist economic policies which of course could potentially affect New Zealand.
Whaitiri Meka; Mallard TrevorMEKA WHAITIRI (Labour—Ikaroa-Rāwhiti): In the time I have got I would like to talk to my two amendments that are on the Table and just by way of explanation draw the Committee's attention to clause 154. If you turn to clause 154 when looking at the bill one of the concerns I had was an accountability clause which was obvious when you went through the particular section in terms of—when we are talking about governance bodies—The CHAIRPERSON (Hon Trevor Mallard): Order! I apologise for interrupting the member but the time has come for me to report what progress we have made.House resumed.Progress reported.Report adopted.The House adjourned at 9.55 p.m.
Foster-Bell Paul; Mallard TrevorPAUL FOSTER-BELL (National): I move That the question be now put.The CHAIRPERSON (Hon Trevor Mallard): No I think it has all been relevant to date.
Paraone PitaPITA PARAONE (NZ First): I just wanted to make a comment on clause 165(1)(c). The clause is Grounds for rejecting application for registration of governance agreement" and that "The chief executive must reject an application to register a governance agreement if"—and this is paragraph (c)—"the Māori freehold land to be managed under the agreement—(i) is held by a sole owner or by joint tenants". It is that particular clause that I would just like some clarification on. What if the sole owner happens to be a minor and it is in the best interests of the minor to have that interest protected by the possibility of making an application to register a governance group for those interests? I just ask the Minister to make a comment on that.The other point that I would like to make is in regard to clause 170—"Registrar-General to record change of ownership of land". Now that is again a departure from what is in the process at the moment where the Māori Land Court keeps those records. This suggests to me that this is the first step to removing Māori land as such to become part of the general land ownership of the country by passing that registration to the Registrar-General. I just ask whether the Minister would like to comment on those two points please."
Korako NukNUK KORAKO (National): I move That the question be now put.
Doocey Matt; Mallard TrevorMATT DOOCEY (Third Whip—National): I move That the question be now put.The CHAIRPERSON (Hon Trevor Mallard): Oh Mr Doocey it is really unusual to do that after your own side has just had a call. It is an indication really of lack of confidence in Minister Flavell and I do not think you really meant that.
Flavell Te UruroaHon TE URUROA FLAVELL (Minister for Māori Development): Tēnā koe Mr Chair. I just wanted to take a quick call really to address again some of the issues that have been raised and indeed to address the Supplementary Order Paper (SOP) that has been tabled under the name of Peeni Henare. I think it is appropriate to do so tonight in particular as we sit around Part 5. But if I can just address one or two of the matters that were raised by members just to say again a kaiwhakahaere is needed only if there is no governance body in place to implement and not make owner decisions to sell if they meet the 75 percent threshold. That is the first point. It is important just to set that out and say it absolutely clearly.That leads on to the issue that the member Peeni Henare has in his SOP. I would suggest to the Committee that the amendment proposed in the SOP is actually unnecessary because the bill already makes discretionary provisions for the owners to be kept informed. I refer members to clause 191 in particular subclause (2). It sets out the responsibilities of the kaiwhakahaere. Under clause 191(2) A kaiwhakahaere appointed for a purpose"—blah blah blah—"must (a) consult with the owners about actions the kaiwhakahaere proposes to take on the owners' behalf; and (b) keep the owners informed about actions the kaiwhakahaere has taken …"—you can read the rest. Pretty much it is setting out very clearly what kaiwhakahaere can do and it covers off those issues that the member Peeni Henare raises.If I can go to clause 197 again it sets out what the court may require a kaiwhakahaere to report to owners. It basically addresses the issues that the member raises. It already gives the Māori Land Court the power to direct the calling of a meeting of owners at any time and to direct the kaiwhakahaere to report to the owners on matters specified in clause 196 which is obviously the clause ahead of it. So in terms of addressing the issues raised by Peeni Henare I believe that those issues are already covered within the bill and therefore we will be voting accordingly and not support that amendment.Adrian Rurawhe raised in clause 156(2) I think it was an issue about beneficial owners. This is just to advise him that under the current Act the owners are the beneficial owners and the trusts and incorporations are the legal owners. This is the same under this bill and allows the governance bodies to manage the land effectively for the owners. There is the element of difference between those two definitions. The beneficial owners have the benefits of ownership and the legal owners have the responsibilities of ownership. That I hope addresses the issues raised by the member for Te Tai Hauāuru. A number of members have raised the issue about a Māori Land Service and I know that it is not in this particular part. Suffice it to say that that is still being built and any conjecture in respect of the appointment of chief executives etc. is a little bit early. We can come to that later on in the discussion. I hope that has been helpful to members."
Davidson MaramaMARAMA DAVIDSON (Green): Thank you Mr Chair; I did call only twice this time. I have just a couple of quick comments probably more than queries. I too want to add a Green Party query. I note that in Part 5 of the bill Authority to act in relation to Māori freehold land" clause 154(2) "A governance body whether it is a body corporate …" it comes down to the use of the word kaitiaki—"… kaitiaki being the persons who occupy a position in the body that is comparable with that of a director of a company." It was important for me to make sure that I queried that sort of comparative mention inside the actual legislation where the notion of kaitiaki can be seen as being quite different to that of a director of any company being driven from different agenda and different purposes. I think it is important for me to be able to put the Greens on record in highlighting that feeling which is quite disconnected for me a little bit.My understanding in Part 5 and I think the Minister laid it out at the beginning was that this enables owners to appoint different governance bodies and kaiwhakahaere—that is fine. I think my understanding is that the bill in Part 5 is shifting the right to appoint governance bodies for Māori freehold land from the Māori Land Court to the owners and it also widens the range of options—I think that is my understanding of Part 5. It would be appreciated if I could have some confirmation of that understanding. So we are shifting that appointment right from the Māori Land Court to the owners and then we of course are opening up I think the range of options for what those governance bodies will look like.I appreciate the Minister outlining that the new rangatōpū model seems to be a better alternative to the current ahu whenua trusts in some cases. But also—and I think this was the important thing for me—there is nothing to compel current land trusts or governance bodies to switch to that new rangatōpū model if they do not want to. However what I think I am getting at for this whole Part 5 of the bill is that inequity comment. While some of the submitters absolutely commented on a need for wider alternatives of governance is there going to be an equitable opportunity for all governance models or land organisations to be able to move over to the better model if it is going to be a better model?Some are querying and are worried that this availability of a new model is a good thing but they are unsure or are not confident in their own ability to actually be able to transition over. I think what I am trying to get at here is the difference in equity when it comes to how established or how organised different trusts or governance bodies is around the different whānau parcels set up around the country and regardless of what Part 5 is trying to do with good intentions in the legislation whether or not any of that will actually change the equity problem and the difference between less-established and more-established governance bodies that currently may or may not be able to benefit from the new options and the wider range of governance options that are available. So I think that was my main query at this point. Thank you."
Mallard TrevorPart 5 Authority to act in relation to Māori freehold landThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Trevor Mallard): We now come to the debate on Part 5 which is a debate on clauses 154 to 201 and schedules 2 3 and 4 in relation to those parts.
Paraone PitaPITA PARAONE (NZ First): I just want to move the discussion to clause 144 where reference is made to recording dispositions on the Māori Land Register. The bill is quite clear where it says that any instrument affecting the disposition is to be recorded on the Māori Land Register. I can only assume at this stage that the Māori Land Register will form part of the Māori Land Service. What I would like to have some clarification on is where physically those records will be held. Will they be held in one central office or will there be several offices of the Māori Land Service?I have some difficulty in accepting what is here in the bill without knowing just exactly how and what the Māori Land Service will look like because if we take for instance the transfer of Māori land and the succession to Māori land the actual records are retained by the Māori Land Court at the moment and there are I think seven or eight different registries of the Māori Land Court. I know that the whole issue of the Māori Land Service is a contentious one and probably forms the basis of some of the reasons why there are objections to the bill but I would like to have some clarification from the Minister as to what the physical service will look like because that will take a lot of space in terms of the different documents that will be involved.Hon Te Ururoa Flavell: For another day.PITA PARAONE: Yes I would certainly like to have some clarification but the difficulty is that we do not know just what that service will look like other than that—according to this clause—the records will need to be held on a register. But we do not know and we can only presume that that register will be held by the Māori Land Service. That is in clause 144(1) which says: This section provides for the recording in the Māori land register of an instrument executed by the parties—The CHAIRPERSON (Hon Trevor Mallard): Order! I am going to haul the member back now. In Part 8 there are extensive provisions about that area and I am going to rule that that is the right place to argue about the location of registers because that is the part that is about registers. Does the member want to continue now on another topic?PITA PARAONE: No I will not."
Whaitiri MekaMEKA WHAITIRI (Labour—Ikaroa-Rāwhiti): I do want to acknowledge the submitters. I opened my contribution tonight with the importance of this part Part 4 which is about the disposition of Māori land. I did have a contribution around the preferred recipients but this is a completely different point and it is in relation to the preferred entities.I do want to acknowledge the many submitters—very expert submitters—who came in front of the select committee. Two in particular were the Māori Land Court judges and the New Zealand Law Society in relation to the preferred entities. They believe that the definition was poorly drafted; that is what they said. By way of an example to express what they meant they talked about incorporations in all areas—my area Te Tai Rāwhiti—with perhaps 10000 shareholders and one shareholder who is by reason of separate whakapapa a preferred recipient for land in the Taranaki area and then Te Tai Rāwhiti incorporation being regarded as a preferred entity for the land in Taranaki.So the question there which both the Māori Land Court judges and the New Zealand Law Society said is that by allowing this particular preferred entity—in terms of I believe either iwi authorities or post-settlement entities—there is potentially a risk there if there is someone who may have an interest in another part of the country that that land could actually go to an iwi that is totally not related to the land. That is a submission put in by both the Māori Land Court judges and the New Zealand Law Society. It was just important for me to make sure that I raised that particular point because this bill actually does allow post-settlement governance to be considered preferred entities.In fact it is interesting to note that—and I am quoting from the official detailed submission analysis for the Māori Affairs Committee where there is a reference in there around governance groups. This is the officials' comment on page 70: Amongst other struggles with large governance bodies is actually finding and identifying the owners of the land that they are administering." So I just wanted to put those points on record that both the Māori Land Court and the New Zealand Law Society really had some concerns around the definition of preferred entities. I just want to note that their suggestion was factored but it did not result in any changes to the particular clause 96 which talks about the preferred entity. So it is important to acknowledge the many good submitters who came through in front of the select committee. Thank you."
Korako Nuk; Mallard TrevorNUK KORAKO (National): I move That the question be now put.The CHAIRPERSON (Hon Trevor Mallard): One more.
Paraone PitaPITA PARAONE (NZ First): How long Mr Chair?The CHAIRPERSON (Hon Chester Borrows): 3 minutes.PITA PARAONE: Oh good. Last night when I was interrupted I was talking about the issue of mortgages and the possibility of the likely unwanted disposition of land due to non-payment of a mortgage. We have heard from those who support the bill that this is a bill that strengthens the retention of Māori land. Can I suggest to this Committee that where Māori land is to be subject to mortgage then there is every likelihood of the possibility of land being lost to those who lend money. I know as a trustee on a forestry land trust together with my tuakana Peeni Henare that we have as a term within that trust that we cannot mortgage the corpus land. If that is what is intended in this bill then I do not have an argument. But I am not quite sure whether in fact that is what is covered in this bill so I would like some assurance from the Minister that that is indeed the case and that the land will be secure.That is not to say that governance bodies should not be allowed to raise money by mortgage but the security should not be against the land—maybe against the crops maybe against the trees that are grown or maybe against any other asset relating to the land but not against the land itself. I think that the intention of the bill to minimise the risk of Māori land being sold—that will increase if that is the case. So I would just like some assurance from the Minister for Māori Development as to whether or not that is the intention—to allow those in governance bodies to be able to raise mortgages against the Māori land.
Borrows ChesterTE TURE WHENUA MĀORI BILLIn CommitteeDebate resumed from 30 May.Part 4 Dispositions of Māori freehold land and other land (continued)The CHAIRPERSON (Hon Chester Borrows): When we were last considering the bill we were debating Part 4. Pita Paraone has the call. He has 3 minutes' time remaining.
Finlayson ChristopherHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON (Attorney-General): I move That this debate be now adjourned.Motion agreed to.