Ngarewa-Packer Debbie; Little AndrewDEBBIE NGAREWA-PACKER (Co-Leader—Te Paati Māori): Thank you Minister for receiving our questions. I'd just like to first also join with my esteemed colleagues and congratulate our chair of the Health Committee Liz on your new appointment.Just a couple of things for you Minister Little. Will the Minister support the establishment of a Māori director-general role with the introduction of the Pae Ora (Healthy Futures) Bill? And as the Minister knows I sit on the select committee overseeing the Pae Ora legislation—or sat. On a number of occasions I had raised the need to reflect and acknowledge recognition of Māori political authority tino rangatiratanga as was recommended in the findings of Wai 2575. The officials denied my suggestions stating that the Minister didn't want that reflected in the legislation the concept of tino rangatiratanga and I'd like to understand: why was this decision made and what basis does the Minister decide tino rangatiratanga should not be incorporated into legislation and why did the Minister knowingly ignore recommendations from the Waitangi Tribunal?Third the Pharmac reading is really dim and grim to be honest and some of the aspects that came out in the inequities report were shocking. What is it that you're going to do to ensure that it aligns more with Te Tiriti and is able to address specifically inequities in how it addresses Māori going forward? Kia ora.Hon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health): Thank you Madam Chair and I thank the member for her questions. In relation to the first question whether I support a Māori director-general role no I don't because I think at the moment with the Pae Ora bill what we're trying to set up is a system where we have the ministry Māori Health Authority and Health New Zealand as the important kind of triumvirate if you like and the Māori Health Authority although not the Treaty partner is a very important expression of the Crown's obligations under the Treaty and a reflection of a range of recommendations coming from the Waitangi Tribunal over time about what is needed to improve health services for Māori. So I don't see putting in place a Māori director-general alongside any other director-general in the Ministry of Health is adding to or changing what we're trying to do with the Pae Ora health model.In relation to whether or not there should be a reference to tino rangatiratanga in the bill I can tell the member that that was considered but the advice is that because of the jurisprudence that has developed around the Treaty and indeed the references to the Treaty and Treaty principles over multiple pieces of legislation over many decades now there is concern about what a court might do when confronted with the language of that. I think in light of the High Court's decision on the Ngāti Whātua Ōrākei case now is we're seeing a judiciary that says that it does not want to step into and tell Māori what te reo Māori phrases or terms mean.The other challenge I think there was too of course is that in the Treaty tino rangatiratanga stands alongside Kāwanatanga and if we are going to put expressions of tino rangatiratanga in legislation then we also have to then also acknowledge that is within a context of Kāwanatanga which is the other by-product of the Treaty. So that's why that is not in the bill.In terms of ignoring the Waitangi Tribunal the Waitangi Tribunal makes a lot of recommendations on a lot of things in the context of its kaupapa inquiries and its other reports and findings that it makes. Not all are taken up by the Crown. Indeed I think what the Pae Ora bill says by way of analogy in relation to the Hauora Māori Advisory Committee that advises the Minister on the exercise of powers in relation to Māori health and the Māori Health Authority is that if the Minister chooses not to accept a recommendation from that group then that has to be publicly stated so that that at least is transparent. I think that is a useful model.I didn't quite catch the last of the questions that the member raised. She might take another call and raise them again.DEBBIE NGAREWA-PACKER (Co-Leader—Te Paati Māori): Thank you there were two. So the question Minister was in respect to Pharmac and the report and the shortcomings and inequities specifically towards Māori. I guess a follow up to your second answer is: if the Minister is cherry-picking aspects of the tribunal recommendation in the Māori Health Authority how are you going to maintain or ensure the authenticity or the success of that model going forward?