Macindoe Tim; Tolley AnneHon TIM MACINDOE (National—Hamilton West): Thank you Madam Chair. I wasn't planning to take a call but after listening to that utterly vacuous and disingenuous contribution from the Minister in the chair the Hon Andrew Little—Hon Gerry Brownlee: No facts.Hon TIM MACINDOE: —I have to respond. Absolutely no facts as the Hon Gerry Brownlee has just said. To accuse the current Opposition the National Party of lacking a commitment to security issues and of behaving in a disgraceful manner is so far from the truth that it has to be refuted. The fact of the matter is that there is no party in this Parliament that has a prouder record in defending the security of this nation—absolutely no party that has a prouder record than the National Party. The Minister in the chair knows that.The Minister in the chair also knows that he wanted initially to have the support of the National Party but after he said Do it my way. Be reasonable. There is no other way. I'm not interested in negotiating with you I'm not interested in compromise; I simply want you to do it my way for you to lie down roll over be a poodle in the corner." well the National Party said that isn't good enough. At that point the Minister said "Well I don't have to deal with you. I'll go and talk to the Greens and instead I will compromise till the day is long. I will do all sorts of things that I would never consider doing if I was really going to take a responsible approach to national security."And isn't it interesting that the Minister's head is suddenly down? He has stood up for the last five minutes and lambasted the National Party Opposition he's accused us of all sorts of disgraceful things and now suddenly he's more interested in what's on his phone. Well Minister I say to you you did not negotiate in good faith. You certainly did not negotiate with the National leader or senior figures in our caucus in a way that was open and honest and upfront. Instead what you did was say "I'm not interested in anything that the National Party puts forward." because the National Party had a number of very clear lines.I say again that there is no party with a prouder stronger record in the defence of the Realm than the New Zealand National Party.Hon Aupito William Sio: Oh say it with some conviction.Hon TIM MACINDOE: It's one of the reasons why I am so proud to be a member of this caucus—and the Hon Aupito William Sio may wish to call out an inane interjection but he knows that that is correct and more importantly so do people listening to this debate because it comes down to the fact that the Minister spoke a moment ago about those who are entitled to return to our shores. That was the phrase that sticks in my memory from the Minister's contribution: "those who are entitled to return to our shores." Well I hope that he was listening to the Hon Gerry Brownlee's contribution a moment ago and in particular those who are listening watching TV or on the radio will have listened to what was being said.Hon Clare Curran: They'll be disgusted with you.Hon TIM MACINDOE: Oh isn't this fascinating? We now have the Hon Clare Curran telling me that to side with the Hon Gerry Brownlee in saying we don't want this person who was so misnamed as the "Bumbling Jihadi" coming back to our country and threatening and imperilling the safety of New Zealanders—the Hon Clare Curran thinks it's disgusting for me to say that.Hon Clare Curran: No I think that member is disgusting and particularly that one there.Hon TIM MACINDOE: Well I would make the point to her that—OK so now I am disgusting. I have no idea why the Minister thinks that other than her visceral hatred of the National Party.But the point I am making is that New Zealanders need to be protected from people who have been radicalised overseas and who have gone to the extent as Gerry Brownlee said of destroying their passports after making very very serious threats against New Zealanders and only when they discover that the world has changed that the security situation has changed and suddenly it is no longer convenient to be incarcerated in one of those countries "I would like to play the card of the victim and to be portrayed as the bumbling jihadi." Well it is absolutely disgraceful for anybody to accept that description. That man is seriously dangerous and he imperils the safety of this nation. The very least we should do is have legislation that protects New Zealanders against him and others of a like mind should they ever be returned to our shores.This legislation doesn't cut it. This legislation is weak and ineffective. There are so many holes in it you could drive a bus through it and if it is enacted as a result of this very weak process we will be worse off in our security legislation not better off. I am desperately disappointed having been a member of this House for 11 years that I can't support a security measure for I think the first time in my years as an MP. But I can't because I will not imperil the safety of New Zealanders. I will not kowtow to the very weak demands that are being made by this Government's coalition partners. This is a seriously flawed bill. The very least that could be done is for the Government to adopt the Supplementary Order Papers that are being advanced by the Opposition to strengthen the measure. Should they do that there may be some hope for it but at the moment it is hopeless.CHAIRPERSON (Hon Anne Tolley): I call Simon O'Connor. Before I do this is Part 1 we're on."