5. Question No. 5—Economic DevelopmentHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (National) to the Minister for Economic DevelopmentQuestion No. 5—Economic DevelopmentSPEAKER: Question No. 5 the Hon Michael Woodhouse. Marja Lubeck: No supp Mr Mitchell? Hon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (National): Thank you Mr Speaker. My question—SPEAKER: Oh be quiet Marja Lubeck. Sorry about that—the Hon Michael Woodhouse. 5. Hon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (National) to the Minister for Economic Development: How much money if any has been spent on consultants and contractors working on the Government's Industry Transformation Plans since 1 July 2020 and how much is expected to be spent on consultants and contractors in the next financial year?Hon BARBARA EDMONDS (Minister for Economic Development): Talofa lava. Fa'afetai tele lava Mr Speaker. Industry transformation plans (ITPs) allow the Government with businesses workers and iwi to help industries become part of a high-wage low-emission economy. ITPs reflect our strategy in Budget 2023 to strengthen the economy by investing in the basics for growth skills better infrastructure and science and technology. Responsibility for development and delivery of industry transformation plans rests across multiple agencies. For the five ITPs that fall within Vote Business Science and Innovation for which I am responsible approximately $4.6 million has been spent on consultancy services from 1 July 2020 to the beginning of May 2023. Scoping work to deliver on the ITPs over the next financial year is still in progress so no estimate is available for the second part of his question. Hon Michael Woodhouse: Can she confirm that that $4.6 million is part of more than $200 million the Government plans to spend on industry transformation plans and at a current cost of $75000 per page how on earth does this represent good value for money? Hon BARBARA EDMONDS: What I can confirm is that good value for money is lifting the productivity of the labour market and the environmental performances of key industries which is essential to underpin higher living standards in the future. Hon Michael Woodhouse: Well in that case does she agree with the chair of the Productivity Commission Ganesh Nana who said that ITPs were very small not attracting any non-government dollars and don't have connections to the researchers"? Hon BARBARA EDMONDS: What I do agree with is that six of the eight ITPs that have been developed and launched have actions already under way including through Budget 2023 where $29 million has been invested as a result of the ITP in the agritech catalyst. Hon Peeni Henare: Can the Minister confirm that the ITP development was done with the sector the community the workers and also Māori and unions to make sure that the planning process was done with sound research and sound information? Hon BARBARA EDMONDS: Absolutely I can confirm that industry transformation plans are a partnership both with business workers and iwi to help our industries become part of a high-wage low-emission economy. Hon Michael Woodhouse: Does she agree with BusinessDesk's Pattrick Smellie who said "If a listed company were to spend whatever has been spent so far on the ITPs to produce as little as they have shareholders sure as hell wouldn't be voting them a few tens of millions of dollars to keep going." and why did the Government vote itself tens of millions more in Budget 2023 to keep them going? Hon BARBARA EDMONDS: As I've said in my previous answer ITPs provide a way for the Government and industries to partner to transform industries for the future. You must have a plan in order to plan for the future as opposed to policy on the hoof. Hon Michael Wood: Does the Minister agree with the head of the Employers and Manufacturers Association Brett O'Reilly who said in respect of the advanced manufacturing ITP "We know through COVID there was a fresh appreciation of the contribution that advanced manufacturing makes to the New Zealand economy and people's livelihoods. We need to build on that and the ITP sets a clear path to achieving the growth and productivity gains our country needs to compete."? [Interruption] SPEAKER: Order! I am going to give Government members a warning. Simply standing up and asking a question such as that and we've had two so far basically almost giving a narrative at the end of them and they're clearly over—giving the answer to the Minister really is out of order. So I'm going to rule that one out of order. Hon Michael Woodhouse: Wouldn't she agree that with millions being spent on consultants and plans at a cost of $75000 per page the only industry this Government is transforming is the consultancy industry? Hon BARBARA EDMONDS: As I've said previously ITPs reflect our strategy to strengthen the industries for the future. Consultancy investment has been crucial to the development of ITPs—for example research to enable evidence-based decision-making market reports to provide baseline information and sector insight and business case development to support large investment initiatives such as the $29 million in Budget 2023 for the agritech catalyst."