Points of Order — Select Committees—Membership 
Points of Order — Select Committees—Membership 
[Volume:654;Page:3843] 
Points of Order 
Select Committees—Membership 
Hon DARREN HUGHES (Senior Whip—Labour) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. It concerns the establishment of committees of the House. I seek your advice for the Opposition. 
As you know Mr Speaker by way of motion the House has appointed a special select committee to consider legislation relating to Auckland governance. That motion has been debated by Parliament. As a result of that motion members are required to supply you with the names of the people whom they would like to represent their party on that committee. The Labour Opposition is having difficulty complying with that request because of a disagreement we are having with the Government. I would like to ask you to intervene or to offer some advice as to how we may have it resolved. 
Standing Orders 180 181 and 182 refer to the establishment of committees and to the requirement that as far as practicable parties be represented proportionately in terms of their representation in Parliament. On the committee that is under discussion a little over a quarter of the seats are available to Labour but Labour makes up a little over a third of Parliament. We are the party that is most disadvantaged by the way that the committee has been knitted together. The smaller parties are all overrepresented. That is completely appropriate because they cannot have less than one member obviously and we support it. 
We have put forward a suggestion that would not alter the voting balance of the committee—we accept that the Government has put together a majority on it—but would see Labour have a fourth non-voting member on the committee. That would make the number of Labour members on it closer to our proportion in this Chamber than the three members that the motion has set up. That was discussed yesterday as you know at the Business Committee. The Leader of the House advised me last night that he had rejected that suggestion—that he was not prepared to entertain it. 
Mr Speaker I am asking you to offer your advice or your assistance to a minority in the House who are seeking to be represented fairly but not to disturb the voting balance that the Government has put together. What I am proposing would not change the Government’s voting majority on the committee but would mean that Labour had four members on it which is our correct entitlement in terms of proportional representation in this House as set out in the Standing Orders. 
Hon GERRY BROWNLEE (Leader of the House) 
: 
 I will make a couple of points. Firstly the committee is not a standing committee of Parliament; it is a special select committee set up as the Hon Darren Hughes said by a motion of the House. The House has therefore dealt with this matter in setting up the special select committee. That is the end of the matter. Further in respect of the Labour Party’s plea that it should be better represented at the table I think that very few people who observed the extraordinary performance of the week before last—which demonstrated the Labour Party’s attitude towards changes to the governance of Auckland—would accept that Labour should be given a greater say. Parliament has spoken on this matter and that should be where it rests. 
Hon DARREN HUGHES (Senior Whip—Labour) 
: 
 Speaking further to the point of order Mr Speaker. 
Mr DEPUTY SPEAKER 
: I will allow the honourable member to speak briefly to that point. 
Hon DARREN HUGHES 
: The Leader of the House is certainly right: there was an extraordinary performance a couple of weeks ago and most of it was around his behaviour. Coming back to the— 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Order! 
Hon DARREN HUGHES 
: He invited that chip. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I accept what the honourable member is saying—that I allowed the Leader of the House to introduce material into his point of order that was unhelpful. I should not have done so and I acknowledge that but the honourable member must not continue in that vein. He must come straight to his point of order and there will be silence. 
Hon DARREN HUGHES 
: The Leader of the House referred to the committee being established by the House as though that was somehow different from the normal rules. It is true that it is not a normal standing committee of Parliament. It has been established under Standing Order 180(2): “The House may establish other committees.” The requirement for proportionality on those committees falls under Standing Order 181 and it is as a consequence of the decision to appoint a committee regardless of whether the committee is one appointed by a special motion or one of the standing subject committees that we have. I take issue with the submission by the Leader of the House to you Mr Speaker because I am referring to the issue of proportionality and to the easy offer that Labour has made available of a fourth non-voting member. That would not disturb the politics it would not disturb the Government’s majority but it would better reflect the proportion that the Labour Opposition holds in this Parliament. 
Hon RODNEY HIDE (Leader—ACT) 
: 
 We can all understand Mr Hughes’ concern but the reality is that it is not for the Speaker to intervene in the decision. The decision was made properly within the Standing Orders by Parliament. It is not then possible for a party that feels that Parliament made a wrong decision to appeal to the Speaker to override Parliament. The only way that the decision can be overridden is by Parliament itself. That is the end of the matter. 
Mr 
 SPEAKER 
: I do not need further assistance on the matter because the point made by the Hon Rodney Hide is absolutely correct. The Speaker cannot overrule a decision of Parliament. As the Hon Darren Hughes has pointed out Standing Order 181 requires proportionality as far as is practicable; it does not say there should be absolute proportionality. The only option available to the member is to pursue the matter further through the Business Committee in the future should he so wish. I cannot as Speaker interfere in the matter now. That is where the matter must remain. 
Hon DARREN HUGHES (Senior Whip—Labour) 
: 
 I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: As long as it is not questioning my ruling. 
Hon DARREN HUGHES 
: No it does not question your ruling Mr Speaker. I refer you to Standing Order 182 which takes up the point you have made. It states that the Business Committee may appoint members to serve for a particular time on a particular matter. As you know the Business Committee is not scheduled to meet until next week. I wonder whether you as the chair of that committee would consider convening the committee so that we can have the issue resolved. I understand that the Government wants to get on with setting up the committee’s work and the Labour Opposition does as well but we are asking for some fairness around process. If you could convene the Business Committee we should be able to have the matter resolved. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: The Business Committee considered the matter only yesterday. I do not imagine that anything will have changed since yesterday evening so I do not propose to do that. There will be a Business Committee meeting next week and there will not be much business conducted by the special select committee in the meantime. As I understand it the committee has been called to meet for the first time tomorrow afternoon. The matter can be raised at the next Business Committee meeting if the member so wishes. 
Hon Darren Hughes 
: Point of order Mr Speaker— 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I will take a dim view of any wasting of the time of the House Mr Hughes. I have ruled on the matter. 
Hon Darren Hughes 
: Point of order— 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I do not see how it is possible to raise a further point of order but I will be generous and allow the member to try. 
Hon DARREN HUGHES (Labour) 
: 
 I seek leave for a fourth Labour member with no voting rights to be a permanent member of the committee of the House to consider legislation relating to Auckland governance. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought for that course of action. Is there any objection? There is objection.