Brash Don: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Brash Don: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Volume:629;Page:1571] 
4.  
Dr DON BRASH (Leader of the Opposition) 
 to the  
Prime Minister 
: Does she accept the Hon David Benson-Pope’s statement last Saturday that allegations he entered the girls’ shower block and dormitories were “a nonsense”; if so why? 
Rt Hon HELEN CLARK (Prime Minister) 
: 
 The Minister was reacting to the  
Investigate 
 magazine website which clearly contained allegations that were sensationalist. I am satisfied that issues were raised with the school that it deemed not to be disciplinary matters but following which school policy was changed. 
Dr Don Brash 
: Is it the Prime Minister’s position in continuing to support her Minister that his statement of 12 May last year was correct because he had no knowledge at all of the complaint against him; if not what is her position? 
Rt Hon HELEN CLARK 
: In response to an earlier question I made it clear that I considered that the answer was an error of judgment. 
Dr Don Brash 
: Has the Prime Minister asked Mr Benson-Pope why he has stated that the recent complaints now backed up by a letter and by the former principal were “a nonsense”; if so what was Mr Benson-Pope’s response? 
Rt Hon HELEN CLARK 
: As I have said the allegations on that website were sensationalist. I do not intend to go through them one by one. Anyone reading them can see that they stretch matters far beyond the letter sent by the parent. 
Dr Don Brash 
: Is the Prime Minister telling the House that she is the only person in New Zealand who does not understand that Mr Benson-Pope’s earlier denials in this House and his statements yesterday are totally incompatible and why does she so resist coming to the conclusion that is blindingly obvious to everybody else? 
Rt Hon HELEN CLARK 
: The member seems determined not to take on board what I have already said today which is that the answer was an error of judgment but I do not consider that sufficient reason to dismiss a Minister. That is a judgment I have made. 
Hon Dr Michael Cullen 
: Has the Prime Minister received any complaints or material relating to other former teachers in this House including Mr Gerry Brownlee some of which lead to serious conclusions; if so why has she not used that material in the public arena yet? 
Madam SPEAKER 
: I would just remind members that when members ask questions they are to be heard in silence and that goes for all sides of the House. 
Rt Hon HELEN CLARK 
: I have indeed seen such material but have abided by the normal convention that such matters are not suitable for raising in this House. I would observe for the benefit of Mr Brownlee and other National members that people in glass houses should not throw stones and overturn the old conventions. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: Could I ask the Prime Minister who in her experience or opinion would be the more qualified to determine whether an action warranted dismissal: the headmaster who dealt with the matter at the time or someone who wants a Titus Oates Star Chamber procedure to be the way we do justice in this country? 
Rt Hon HELEN CLARK 
: Clearly the principal who has made it clear again today that he did not consider that the issues raised were disciplinary matters. 
Dr Don Brash 
: Does the Prime Minister stand by her statement that the recent complainants should “put up or shut up” by going to the authorities and is she concerned that young women may interpret her comments to mean that they can talk about and expose abuse only if they are willing to go to the police? 
Rt Hon HELEN CLARK 
: There was a 6-month investigation during which there was plenty of time to air these matters. 
Dr Don Brash 
: Does the Prime Minister not yet understand that New Zealanders have already reached a judgment about the credibility of the Hon David Benson-Pope and that the longer she continues defending her Minister the more questions will be asked about her own credibility? 
Rt Hon HELEN CLARK 
: As I said to the member in the House yesterday he should not assume that the conclusions he jumps to are shared by others. I have a stack of letters supportive of Mr Benson-Pope.