Woods Megan; Brown SimeonHon Dr MEGAN WOODS (Labour—Wigram): Thank you Madam Chair. I would like to move on to clause 3(2)(e)—far be it from me to deal on difficult". I'd like to thank the Minister of Local Government very much for the answer that he gave to my colleague the Hon Barbara Edmonds about why it was that there's so many redactions in terms of the questions around the funding constraints. I accept the Minister's answer that that's because there are some commercial sensitivities while Auckland Council establishes its credit rating and works through those things.But one of the questions I have for the Minister and I'd be keen to know is that of course credit ratings are something that are continually monitored by the ratings agencies so therefore does the Minister foresee that this information will never be made public that this isn't something that we can have some transparency around? I would argue that you could put the argument that you're continually and perpetually in a state of the credit rating agencies considering commercial sensitivities. So keen to hear from the Minister around that and what his expectations in terms of the public disclosure of that information would be if that is indeed the rationale that he sees as underpinning the withholding of that information. I think it is important for the committee to understand that in terms of the expectations going forward around how much information can be in the public domain.The other question I have for the Minister in terms of the purpose clause that we have very clearly that "The purpose of the Act is to establish the framework for local government to manage and deliver water services." and "delivers that purpose by" and we go through (a) (b) (c) (d) and (e). But one of the things that I would like to ask the Minister and it has been noted in commentary on the bill is that one of the key things that is identified from submitters is actually how are we going to pay for this and what is not in that purpose clause is—there is nothing about how these new water entities may be funded. The closest we get is the one that I asked about in here which is 3(2)(e) which is "providing a financially sustainable model for Watercare to be financially separate from Auckland Council and an interim economic regulation regime for Watercare [and] is administered by a Crown monitor."But let's take that up a level because I think that fundamental issue of how it is that these entities are going to be funded in other parts of the bill—and I don't want us to get into bits that that we are going to debate far more fulsomely as we proceed through this evening but at that very purpose clause why did the Minister not think of including as part of the purpose of this legislation one of those core issues that is raised by submitters and indeed I think everybody including the Minister accepts is as at the crux of this matter: who's going to pay for it? How is it going to be funded?We'll get into issues about balance sheet separation and debt ceilings by a number of the entities. They'll come in different parts of the bill so I'm not trying to traverse those areas. It's really that fundamental question that if we're considering why it is we're here in this House considering this legislation having this debate that very very core issue is not included.So keen to hear from the Minister on those two things. Given that he has cited commercial sensitivities does he see that there is an end point for those commercial sensitivities or does he see that the perpetual monitoring by ratings agencies will mean that we can never fully put that information out into the public arena? And secondly it's why when we're considering this legislation we're not considering the most core issue I would argue that lies at the heart of this legislation.Hon SIMEON BROWN (Minister of Local Government): In relation to the first question I have made it very clear that that is in relation to Watercare establishing a credit rating and this is redacted in order to not prejudice them establishing a credit rating. Once a credit rating is in place generally those are made publicly available and there's obviously processes that go on from there.In relation to the second question this is Part 2. There's obviously further legislation to come to the committee."