2. Housing—Supply and State and Social HousingANDREW LITTLE (Leader of the Opposition) to the Prime MinisterHousing—Supply and State and Social Housing2. ANDREW LITTLE (Leader of the Opposition) to the Prime Minister: Does he stand by his refusal last week to debate with me in public in Mt Albert on the housing crisis?Rt Hon BILL ENGLISH (Prime Minister): Yes I do. In fact after listening to Radio New Zealand this morning I can see now that there is no need for a debate because the member agrees with me that We've got to build houses … That's the critical thing. It's about building the houses; not worrying about prices which frankly are beyond a Government's control." I agree that building houses is the main issue and I do not expect there would be any debate about that.Andrew Little: If he will not front up for a public debate will he at least visit the Fa'avale family who lost their home after the father suffered a workplace injury and explain to their 4-year-old son why he is now living under a tarpaulin?Rt Hon BILL ENGLISH: If it is the case that a 4-year-old is living under a tarpaulin he can be assured as his family can that we have the resource to house those people properly. We do not need a debate in Mt Albert in order to solve that problem. In fact there is more agreement between myself and the Leader of the Opposition about the housing challenges than there is within the Labour Party about selecting candidates.Andrew Little: Why was one State house tenant forced to wait for 6 months for Housing New Zealand to fix his cockroach-infested home when Bill English was the responsible Minister?Rt Hon BILL ENGLISH: I have no knowledge of the facts of that case; I would be surprised if it is the way the member represents it. But Housing New Zealand I am sure will be finding that the standards set by some of the new providers for looking after their customers are going to be challenging for Housing New Zealand to meet.Andrew Little: Why in the middle of a massive housing shortage have more than 250 State houses sat empty for over a year as he tries to flog them off?Rt Hon BILL ENGLISH: It may be news to the member to know that Housing New Zealand as I understand it has around 68000 houses. There is quite a number of those that people in serious housing need will not move into because of the quality of those houses. You would expect that when Housing New Zealand owns one in every 16 houses in New Zealand it should be selling some of them at any given time so that it can renew its stock.Andrew Little: How on earth does he justify selling State houses in the middle of a housing crisis when Kiwi kids are homeless and living under tarpaulins?Rt Hon BILL ENGLISH: The member should study the policy because we are no longer limited by the number of State houses when it comes to meeting serious housing need. We now have hundreds—in fact shortly thousands—of houses supplied by people other than Housing New Zealand and the number of social housing places is increasing steadily.Andrew Little: Why when we have the worst housing shortage in New Zealand history does he have nothing to say about it but vague numbers—no plan and no commitment? Just what kind of leadership is that?Rt Hon BILL ENGLISH: There are more houses now being built in New Zealand on an annual basis than in a very long time and it is going to keep on increasing.Andrew Little: The population is growing faster.Rt Hon BILL ENGLISH: Well the member is right. This is a challenge of success—4 years ago 5 years ago 40000 New Zealanders left for Australia which emptied out a whole lot of houses that other people could move into. Last year net zero left so those 40000 New Zealanders each year are still here. Over 2 years that is 80000 people who did not leave and that is a great problem to try to solve.Andrew Little: So is not the situation now this: he does not turn up to Waitangi he turns up to the Big Gay Out but will not speak to New Zealanders he will not debate me on housing in Auckland and defend his Government's track record—or lack of it—and he will not commit to any plan at all for housing? When are we going to see real leadership? When are we going to see any leadership?Rt Hon BILL ENGLISH: When I was looking for examples of leadership I did not look at the Leader of the Opposition who went all the way to Waitangi to tell them why he was not coming. And we do not need a debate about housing because the Leader of the Opposition and I agree that the big challenge is getting more houses built. More houses are being built now at a rate we have not seen for decades in New Zealand."