4. Conservation Department—Ministerial Oversight and Response to Mining ProposalJAMES SHAW (Co-Leader—Green) to the Prime MinisterConservation Department—Ministerial Oversight and Response to Mining Proposal4. JAMES SHAW (Co-Leader—Green) to the Prime Minister: Does he have confidence in his Minister of Conservation?Rt Hon BILL ENGLISH (Prime Minister): Yes. Our Minister of Conservation is a vigorous advocate of conservation and I am particularly pleased with the work that has been done on Predator Free New Zealand a visionary target that goes to the heart of what it means to be Kiwi and engages thousands of New Zealanders in creating a better environment in this country.James Shaw: How can he have confidence in her oversight of the Department of Conservation (DOC) when it failed to oppose plans for an open-cast coalmine on Mount Te Kūhā which is a habitat for the endangered great spotted kiwi?Rt Hon BILL ENGLISH: You would have to address the detail of that to the Department of Conservation but it is not obliged to oppose everything. There are actually I understand over 40 mining sites on the conservation estate many of which operate quite successfully and I am sure that if there is any real risk rather than alleged risk to the great spotted kiwi that of course would be a central consideration in the process of considering consent for that mine.James Shaw: Does he not think it is strange for DOC to be neutral on the matter of a coalmine in a kiwi habitat on conservation land?Rt Hon BILL ENGLISH: First of all I would want to check the facts that the member is alleging. Secondly of course it is part of the capacity of Government to take a whole-of-Government view to take a view that something is a good thing that can happen with the trade-offs that are related to it. If the member is correct that there is some danger to the great spotted kiwi then as I said I am sure that will be a central consideration. The Department of Conservation is not obliged to oppose everything that the Greens are opposed to.James Shaw: To be clear is the Prime Minister saying that it is perfectly normal for nature's statutory defender to not be particularly bothered by a proposal that will knock the top off a mountain cut down 700-year-old rimu pollute the Camp and West Creeks with mining run-off and discharge toxic dust and 11 million tonnes of carbon dioxide into the atmosphere? Is that not strange?Rt Hon BILL ENGLISH: As is sometimes the case with the Greens they exaggerate to create a sense of catastrophe.Chris Bishop: Sometimes? Sometimes? That's very generous.Rt Hon BILL ENGLISH: Well sometimes they do not—let us put it that way. Of course if that was the activity then it would never get a consent but you cannot stop people making applications under our legal processes. The Greens might regard that as morally reprehensible—for people to be able to apply to do things—but people can apply. They will be treated according to the law with due process. DOC happened to be part of that process and I am sure the issues will be dealt with.James Shaw: Given that answer what has changed between 1996 and 2001 when DOC strongly opposed this mine and 2017 when it did not?Rt Hon BILL ENGLISH: One thing that has not changed is that the Greens are still in Opposition as it was then. Otherwise I cannot answer the member's question because I do not know what the application or DOC's attitude to it was in 1996.James Shaw: Did any of his Ministers give direction to DOC officials about the content of their submission on the Mount Te Kūhā coalmine application?Rt Hon BILL ENGLISH: That is a question for the Minister but if the member is asking whether DOC is completely independent the answer is no it is not completely independent. It does not have some kind of divine right to hold an opinion with no scrutiny at all from executive Government or the Parliament for that matter. That is part of the process. Its submissions will be considered within the Government as well as according to due process of law which is where its submission is relevant.James Shaw: Would he fire any of his Ministers if they were found to have put a muzzle on what DOC can say about coalmining on the conservation estate?Rt Hon BILL ENGLISH: No. DOC has some statutory roles but as I said it is not a nation unto itself. It is funded by the taxpayer accountable to the executive and to Parliament and that means its activities are open to scrutiny. And it may surprise the member but sometimes DOC disagrees with the Greens. It is not a statutory version of the Green Party.