9. Question No. 9—PoliceHon MARK MITCHELL (National—Whangaparāoa) to the Minister of PoliceQuestion No. 9—Police9. Hon MARK MITCHELL (National—Whangaparāoa) to the Minister of Police: Does she believe New Zealanders are safer under this Government than they were four years ago; if so how does she explain the Salvation Army's 2022 State of the Nation report which shows violent crime overall has increased since 2017?Hon POTO WILLIAMS (Minister of Police): Firstly can I ask members of this House to thank our women and men of the police who are out there right now endeavouring to keep us safe from an extraordinary event that's occurring out there. We welcome the findings of the Salvation Army State of the Nation report and as a Government we're committed to keeping New Zealanders safe. That's why this Government has invested $450 million into police since we came into office in 2017 including $45 million into front-line safety. As a result of this investment the police workforce is the largest it has ever been with 15 percent more cops on the beat than in the last five years. In answer to the second part of the member's question the violent crime reported by the Salvation Army is primarily due to an increase in reporting of serious crime—in particular family harm—following legislative changes made in 2018. The changes made in this area have created more awareness and encouraged more people to come forward and report crime. I would also note that the State of the Nation report shows the number of offenders has declined and the estimated offending levels have remained relatively unchanged over the past year. I'm confident that the record investment this Government has made into resourcing our police is making communities safer.Hon Mark Mitchell: Then how can she explain violent crime rising 21 percent but imprisonment for offending falling by 36 percent?Hon POTO WILLIAMS: This Government is committed to addressing the long-term issues that cause crime. That's why we're partnering with communities and iwi to expand Te Pae Oranga to 30 locations across New Zealand to address the underlying factors of offending. We are also looking at additional pathways for rehabilitation to occur. We cannot simply arrest our way out of this situation; we must find alternative resolution services and additional pathways for rehabilitation.Hon Mark Mitchell: Can the Minister explain to this House then how her strategy is working when there's a 36 percent reduction in imprisonment for offending and a 21 percent increase—Hon Kelvin Davis: Point of order Mr Speaker. The Minister has no responsibility for who goes into prison. That is a matter for the courts not the Minister of Police.DEPUTY SPEAKER: It's been given in the context of the primary question so as long as you keep in that spectrum I will allow it. So if you can repeat the question for members—Hon Mark Mitchell: So my question to the Minister in relation to her last answer is: how can she support the Government's strategy when there's been a 36 percent reduction in offender imprisonment and a 21 percent increase in violent crime?Hon POTO WILLIAMS: I think the member believes that every crime should then be resulting in a conviction which results in imprisonment. Actually what we are trying to do on this side of the House is take an all-of-Government approach to look at what the key drivers of crime are and then provide alternatives. We are not going to arrest our way out of this. We are not going to be like that Government who wanted to throw the book at everyone when we know clearly there are opportunities for us to provide rehabilitation and other pathways for people like Te Pae Oranga which is a fantastic programme that we are rolling out to 30 sites. It is supported by Kīngi Tūheitia who believes that this is an opportunity for us to keep our whānau out of prison.Hon Mark Mitchell: Is there a correlation between gang membership increasing by over 50 percent and violent crime rising by 21 percent over the same period?Hon POTO WILLIAMS: There's no question that we've got to do everything we can to disrupt gangs and organised crime. The reality is that this Government has never been more active in targeting the gangs and criminal leaders and getting them off the streets. We've put a record number of police on the beat with a specific focus on gangs and organised crime. We've ramped up our efforts to hit gangs where it hurts—their pockets—and we've seized $500 million in cash and assets from gangs and criminals over the last four years alone.Hon Mark Mitchell: How can New Zealanders trust this Government on law and order when violent crime is rising; and how does she respond to the Salvation Army's 2022 State of the Nation report that clearly shows this Government is failing to keep Kiwis safe?Hon POTO WILLIAMS: There's something that really disappoints me about that member—Hon Member: Just one thing?Hon POTO WILLIAMS: No there's two. What really disappoints me about that member is that as a former Cabinet Minister he allowed the reduction of police on the streets. He sat there and allowed the reduction of numbers in police. The other thing that—Nicola Willis: Point of order Mr Speaker.DEPUTY SPEAKER: OK I think I know what the point of order is but we will hear it.Nicola Willis: It's a long-established expectation of the House that the Minister will address the question rather than enter into a political tirade.DEPUTY SPEAKER: That's absolutely correct. I probably should have stopped the Minister at the time she started but she needs to address the question.Hon POTO WILLIAMS: I stand by the record of this Government to invest more in police invest more in their safety. And by keeping them safe they keep our community safe. That member over there was in a Cabinet that allowed for police numbers to reduce. How can you keep a community safe when you reduce the numbers of cops on the beat? How can that former police person himself be so critical of our police?DEPUTY SPEAKER: Order! The member's answered.Hon Mark Mitchell: Point of order Mr Speaker. Can I read that question again please?DEPUTY SPEAKER: No. Question No. 10—[Interruption] Order! Settle down—in the name of Damien Smith.