Mapp Wayne: Independent Police Complaints Authority Amendment Bill — In Committee 
Mapp Wayne: Independent Police Complaints Authority Amendment Bill — In Committee 
[Volume:641;Page:11540] 
Dr WAYNE MAPP (National—North Shore) 
: 
 I have been listening carefully to Dr Sharples and in particular to his explanation of his proposal for an autonomous Maori investigative branch of the Police Complaints Authority and what the functions of that branch would be. I have to say that his proposal is fundamentally wrong. This is simply not the way to develop the law of our country. I would like to think that the majority of parties will be voting against his amendment. 
I want to put on record why it is wrong. It is not to say that there are not many Maori people who appear before the courts and it is not to say that many Maori people do not have difficulties with the police. I have listened to Dr Sharples and that is what he said. I think he overstates the case and that statistically the majority of Maori do not have difficulty with the police. It is wrong to suggest that it is the normal or commonplace experience of Maori people in this country. 
Dr Pita Sharples 
: I didn’t say that. 
Dr WAYNE MAPP 
: Actually the member did. The reason why it is wrong to suggest that is that it reinforces and perpetuates the idea of victimhood the idea that Maori will always be the victims of the police the court system the penal system and so on and so forth. Surely we want a more aspirational message than that. Even if many Maori—not the majority but many—do have that experience surely it is better to concentrate on the successes of real people in life because they will be the best role models. 
I want to talk more specifically about the amendment itself and why I think it is fundamentally wrong. Dr Sharples pointed out that National has the principle or philosophy of one law for all. He mentioned it in a pejorative way as if it is somehow a bad thing to have one law for all. But he is actually ignoring the reason why the principle exists. Let us forget about the terminology that is used and focus on the principle behind it. It is surely fundamental that all citizens of our country irrespective of ethnicity or background are treated equally before the law. That is actually what the principle is about. It is about equality before the law. Each one of us irrespective of our background and ethnicity can expect fair and equal treatment by our institutions. Our institutions of course should reflect the totality of life. So when I hear the suggestion that Judge Joe Williams be put forward as an appropriate representative that is not because he is Maori; it is because he is a learned judge. He is learned in law and able to apply the law equally to all citizens irrespective of ethnicity. When we say as a nation that the law should be colour-blind we are really saying that the law should treat us all equally. 
I must say that I find this idea of having an autonomous branch inserted into the criminal justice system in terms of the Police Complaints Authority offensive. I find it offensive in the sense that it betrays the idea that we all have the rights as citizens to be treated equally and that we should endeavour that our institutions reflect the totality of life. If we want to solve the problem—and I think there is broad agreement that there is an issue to be dealt with—surely the appropriate way to do so is to ensure not separate institutions which is actually what this is but rather that the institutions we create reflect the diversity and totality of all New Zealanders. That surely is the best way to achieve this. 
I say to the Government which has the responsibility to appoint the relevant people to these organisations that it must be mindful of whom it appoints so that all New Zealanders have an assurance they will be treated equally and fairly before the law. I wanted to take this call after hearing Dr Sharples’ proposal to say why his amendment is wrong in principle and why it offends our deepest notions of what our democracy should be about and that surely is that all citizens have equal treatment and can trust the institutions of our country to deal with them fairly. The right way to achieve that is to ensure that people who reflect the diversity of our country are appointed to its institutions. 
I say to the Maori Party members that although their concerns are valid—I accept that aspect of the argument; the concerns are valid and people might feel that they do not receive equal treatment—the solution proposed is wrong in principle. I apologise if Maori Party members were offended by the use of the word “offensive” but I meant it in the sense of being offensive in principle to the ideas of equality and fairness. Although they identify an issue the solution they have come up with is fundamentally wrong. 
I say to the Government that when it appoints the relevant people to the Independent Police Conduct Authority it should listen to the concerns that the Maori Party has put forward to Parliament and take those into account—when the people are appointed to the institutions to the extent that the Government has that appointing authority. That is the way to deal with the concern. 
But I want to put on the record this particular point: our country is built on the principle that all citizens irrespective of race gender or otherwise are treated equally and that we should all be able to look to our institutions— 
Metiria Turei 
: What about the foreshore? 
Dr WAYNE MAPP 
: —to treat us fairly and equally. If things need to be fixed—and I acknowledge that things do need to be fixed—there are ways to do that without creating separate institutions. I ask the Maori Party and its Green Party supporters to think more imaginatively and more creatively on how the fundamental principles of our country can be realised in practice.