Turner Judy: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Turner Judy: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Volume:609;Page:6199] 
2.  
JUDY TURNER (United Future) 
 to the  
Minister for Social Development and Employment 
: Is he satisfied with the quality of advice that he receives from his officials? 
Hon RUTH DYSON (Associate Minister for Social Development and Employment (CYF)) 
 on behalf of the 
Minister for Social Development and Employment 
: The Minister for Social Development and Employment receives a wide range of advice on a wide range of issues and overall he is very satisfied with that advice. 
Judy Turner 
: Does the Minister stand by his answer to my oral question on 1 April 2003 regarding sickness benefits that: “There has been no migration at all from the unemployment benefit to those forms of benefits.” when figures supplied by his own department show there were 13000 transfers from the dole to the sickness benefit last year which is a 13 percent increase in this type of transfer since 2000? 
Hon RUTH DYSON 
: In relation to the member’s question from 1 April that lifestyle beneficiaries are seeking the sickness benefit as an easier option to the unemployment benefit I repeat the answer to the question on that day and stand by that: people who are on a sickness or an invalids benefit are there because they are sick or have an impairment. They do not migrate on to the sickness or invalids benefit as an easier option. 
Georgina Beyer 
: Can the Minister identify particular advice with which he was satisfied? 
Hon RUTH DYSON 
: Yes he can. He was particularly pleased with the thoroughness and quality of the advice its timeliness and the cooperative approach his officials adopted in the work on the Families Commission proposal a proposal in which the views of United Future as well as of the Government needed to be taken into account. 
Katherine Rich 
: Does the Minister now accept that there has been a significant migration from the unemployment benefit to the sickness benefit? 
Hon RUTH DYSON 
: People who are entitled to receive either the sickness or the invalids benefit because of their illness or impairment may well have developed to that condition and therefore entitlement while on the unemployment benefit. 
Sue Bradford 
: Is the Minister aware that there is a difference in the level of payment between the unemployment benefit and the sickness benefit and the invalids benefit and that there has traditionally been a migration of a small number of people moving to that benefit because of the higher rate of pay; and has that been incorporated into work the department is doing around getting a much more even entitlement to benefits across the board? 
Hon RUTH DYSON 
: I am aware of the difference in both the level of income and also the work-testing requirement between the three benefits. I want to repeat that a person is entitled to receive the sickness and the invalids benefit only if he or she meets the criterion of being ill or having an impairment. 
Dr Muriel Newman 
: With regard to officials’ advice on drafting the Care of Children Bill does he agree with the Prime Minister’s comments yesterday that declaring a lesbian mother’s partner a child’s father is a trivial issue; and how does he think that all the biological fathers of New Zealand feel knowing that according to this Government a father is now just a drafting technique? 
Hon RUTH DYSON 
: Not only do I agree with the Prime Minister’s answer in response to the question yesterday but I also want to reflect on the trivialisation that that member makes of a number of very fine parenting contributions by New Zealand citizens regardless of their gender. 
Dr Muriel Newman 
: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. I think that the member used that question to put a slur on a member of Parliament and you should ask her to withdraw and apologise. [ 
Interruption 
] 
Mr SPEAKER 
: There will be no comments during points of order. 
Hon Dr Michael Cullen 
: It was a very political question which invited a political answer. What goes around does comes around in this place. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: Did the member take personal offence? 
Dr Muriel Newman 
: Yes I did. 
Mr SPEAKER 
: I would like the member to withdraw and apologise. 
Hon RUTH DYSON 
: I withdraw and apologise Mr Speaker. 
Dr Muriel Newman 
: Speaking to the point of order— 
Mr SPEAKER 
: No we have had that point of order and the member has made the withdrawal. 
Judy Turner 
: Has the Minister been made aware of the fact that the growth of the number of people on the sickness benefit in the last 3 years is primarily driven by an increase in just a few categories of incapacity such as depression which has increased by 17 percent; and other psychological problems which have increased by 58 percent; and that the number of people claiming the benefit due to stress has soared by 56 percent? 
Hon RUTH DYSON 
: Yes. 
Judy Turner 
: In the light of the increasing number of people on sickness benefit with some sort of psychological condition such as stress has the Minister asked officials to change the rules to require applicants to seek verification from a specialist in this area rather than a general practitioner who can write out a prescription for antidepressants without a clinical reference? 
Hon RUTH DYSON 
: I regret that I am not aware of that particular provision being considered by the officials but I would be happy to provide further information to that member as it becomes available. 
Judy Turner 
: If the Minister stands by what is said and his officials are so certain that the increase of those on the sickness benefit is not caused by transfers from the dole why has he announced that $400000 of the $8 million to be spent on social research will be allocated to investigate why the numbers on the sickness benefit are increasing? 
Hon RUTH DYSON 
: Can I suggest that the member initially reflects on the specificity of my answer to her primary question—which I now repeat because she has misinterpreted it: I do not support the view that she asserted in the House on 1 April that lifestyle beneficiaries are seeing the sickness benefit as an easier option to the unemployment benefit.