Lees-Galloway IainHon IAIN LEES-GALLOWAY (Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety): Well the House heard it directly from Alfred Ngaro. I'll make as direct a quote as I can: we should not punish volunteer organisations by making them adhere to the Health and Safety at Work Act. He sees having good health and safety practices in the workplace as a punishment—a punishment. Well Mr Ngaro go and tell that to the families of the Pike River 29. Go and tell that to any family member of the tens of people who are killed in workplaces in New Zealand every year or the thousands of people who are injured in workplaces every year in this country.New Zealand has a woeful record on health and safety and thankfully because we were woken up out of our complacency by the tragedy at Pike River we are starting to improve things. But we are still a long way behind the other nations that we compare ourselves with. We're a long way behind Australia we're a long way behind the UK and we're a long way behind Europe—and why are we a long way behind those countries? Because we kill too many people in our workplaces every year and we maim too many people in our workplaces every year. And just when we were starting to get businesses to understand that good health and safety practice is just a normal part of doing a business—just when we had the changes that were brought in by a Government led by the National Party who when they were in Government and were receiving official advice and weren't just acting on their visceral most base instincts did the right thing—now we have this piece of legislation come along and undermine the whole concept of health and safety at work.Hon Alfred Ngaro: You voted against the Act Iain.Hon IAIN LEES-GALLOWAY: Yes we voted against the Act because it was too weak—because it was too weak. It was a good piece of legislation but it did not go far enough and I can assure you Mr Ngaro as Minister I will be fixing up the mistakes made by that previous Government.But here's what Harete Hipango said about the Health and Safety at Work Act for volunteer associations in her first reading speech. She said it creates too much compliance it creates too much burden—it creates too much administration for organisations. That is exactly the message that we need to move—Hon Alfred Ngaro: That's right. Burden eh? Is that what you want to do?Hon IAIN LEES-GALLOWAY: That's right." Burden—burden. Alfred Ngaro sees health and safety as a burden. That is the problem with the National Party. It is not a burden; it is a normal part of doing business. It is an absolutely normal part of doing business.Actually having good health and safety practices makes businesses more productive it makes them more profitable but people fear what health and safety regulation will do to their business because of the nonsense that we hear from people like Alfred Ngaro and I'm afraid the sponsor of this bill who I believe to be a good person with a good heart but is completely misguided by bringing this piece of legislation to the House.Health and safety is not onerous. It is not a burden. It is not compliance. It is not administration. It is doing good business.And I do not understand why being a volunteer worker means you have fewer rights in the workplace than being a paid worker. Why should you not—why because you're a volunteer should your employer not have a duty to engage with you as a volunteer worker on health and safety? Why? Why? I have not heard an explanation why a volunteer worker should not be engaged on health and safety in their workplace.I do not understand and I have not heard one credible reason why a volunteer worker should not work in a workplace where there is a duty to ensure as far as reasonably practicable that the workplace is without health and safety risks. Why should someone just because their workers are volunteers not have a duty to ensure that their workplace is without health and safety risks—and just to make sure it's not too burdensome that it's not too onerous those important words: "as far as reasonably practicable".This bill is about nothing more than fearmongering about health and safety and it undermines the good work that this Parliament has done and it's even undermined the good work that the National Party did when they were in Government. I would love to know what Michael Woodhouse says about this bill because he led a good piece of legislation through and it's been undermined by his own members."