Swain Paul: Estimates Debate — In Committee 
Swain Paul: Estimates Debate — In Committee 
[Volume:632;Page:4291] 
Hon PAUL SWAIN (Labour—Rimutaka) 
: 
 After a little bit of a false start I am very keen to take part in this debate. I have just changed my opening words as I thought they could have been a little better. I thought it was very interesting that the National member Katherine Rich who has just resumed her seat talked about State-owned enterprises but actually left out the most critical issue for National which is whether it will sell any. Of course the big problem National members have is that deep deep down they do want to flog off State assets but they cannot bring themselves to say it because if they say it they will not be elected. That is the huge dilemma the National Party has. So National members went into the last election with a whole pile of waffle around this area. In fact when they were pushed they could never get anybody to identify which State-owned enterprises they were prepared to sell off. 
In fact the leader himself said: “Well there are many State-owned enterprises we could privatise.” but when we asked him which one he said: “Well not that particular one maybe another one.” It goes back a couple of years but he has made many many statements on State-owned enterprises. For example in 2004 when pushed he said: “If it were up to me I would sell Kiwibank.” Then as it got close to the election and people started to wonder whether Kiwibank would be sold—and a lot of the people who banked with Kiwibank wanted to know the answer to that question—we heard John Key say: “Well in fact we wouldn’t sell it within our first term.” 
The CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson) 
: 2006-07. 
Hon PAUL SWAIN 
: Yes Mr Chairperson. So the question is as we look forward in terms of this debate what is National’s policy on State-owned enterprises? For example would there be any changes if the National Party were in power? Would we be having a different kind of estimates debate now? I think it was disappointing the previous speaker did not raise that issue at all. 
Having had the pleasure of being a former Minister for State Owned Enterprises I can say that our State-owned enterprises perform particularly well relative to the private sector even when we take out the fact that there are some monopolies within them such as Transpower. When we look into the future this Government has clearly said that it will not have asset sales. We are opposed to asset sales but the same old issues need to be addressed. For example how much should the companies retain as retained earnings for their own future work—because State-owned enterprises need to keep moving forward—and how much should be given back to the shareholder who ultimately is the taxpayer by way of dividend? This age-old issue is always debated. We have been engaged in a long-term hold project whereby we have been working out how to try to mimic the private sector without obviously the discipline of the sharemarket. In all of these things State-owned enterprises are looking forward to the future. 
Of course they have always been able to expand their business. It is only when it comes down to major issues and major capital outlay that they need to come back for a decision from the shareholder which is no different from the operations of any other major company. The board is responsible for the governance of the company and for making sure that the company is performing but if any major issues need to be decided or if any major investment is required then back to the shareholders it goes. I think that the State-owned enterprises model is a good one. 
It is clear that this Labour Government is committed to State-owned enterprises. We are opposed to asset sales. We are keen to ensure that in this financial year they continue to perform strongly and well and that there is a balance between making sure there are sufficient earnings so they can expand and how much should be returned as a dividend. We know that State-owned enterprises must be able to continue to develop because to stand still means to go backwards in particular in areas where there is international competition and in energy and other areas where our State-owned enterprises compete. The decision about how much there should be in terms of retained earnings and how much should be in dividend is a matter for the Government. I congratulate the State-owned enterprises which have been good performers over the last little while and will continue to be over the next 12 months.