Ball Darroch: Oral Questions — Questions to MinistersText is incorporated into the Bound VolumeBall Darroch: Oral Questions — Questions to Ministers[Sitting date: 29 July 2015. Volume:707;Page:5428. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.]12.DARROCH BALL (NZ First) to the Minister for Social Development: Does she stand by all her statements?Hon ANNE TOLLEY (Minister for Social Development):Tēnā koe Mr Speaker. Yes with the exception of one answer to a supplementary question asked by that member on Thursday 23 July which I corrected in the House yesterday.Darroch Ball: When she stated in the House yesterday “I was making the point in the interview that I would be open to the private sector delivering some social services if it can be shown it delivers better results.” was she including Serco as a possible private provider in that statement?Hon ANNE TOLLEY: When I made that statement in the House yesterday I was making the point that this Government is open to working with a whole range of people if they are going to get better results for New Zealanders. In the interview the interviewer raised with me Serco which is a private provider but I repeat again I have had no conversations with Serco.Darroch Ball: In light of that answer given Serco’s—Hon Member: You weren’t even listening to the answer.Darroch Ball: I heard enough.Mr SPEAKER: Order! [Interruption] Order! I do not want interjection coming from my right-hand side and would the member simply rise and ask the supplementary question.Darroch Ball: In light of that answer given Serco’s poor international record and the current corrections debacle will she give her 100 percent guarantee that Serco will not be part of her privatisation plans for New Zealand’s social services; if not why not?Mr SPEAKER: The Hon Anne Tolley—either of those supplementary questions.Hon ANNE TOLLEY: I have no plans to privatise social services in New Zealand.Darroch Ball: Is it not true that with her dealings in the privatisation of corrections and specifically with Serco in the past it was her intention from the start to have Serco run child protection services in New Zealand; if not what other companies have she actually spoken to in regard to her planned child protection contracts?Mr SPEAKER: The Hon Anne Tolley—either of those two supplementary questions.Hon ANNE TOLLEY: I repeat: I have not spoken to any private providers about providing child protection services. What I repeat in this House is that this Government is determined to get services for vulnerable children and families that actually work and change their lives. Unlike that member we are focused on results and whoever can deliver the results those are the people whom we are willing to deal with.Jan Logie: When the Minister said yesterday regarding the possibility of offering Serco a social services contract “I think with any of them … actually the quality of the contract is the really important thing” was she saying that the track record of an organisation is irrelevant?Hon ANNE TOLLEY: I did not make that statement in the House; I actually made that when I was asked a question outside the House. The quality of the contract actually is absolutely important in the sense of the fact that it has to be focused on the delivery of results. For the providers it has to give long-term guarantees that if they meet those criteria they will continue to get the contract and that is of huge import to our NGOs for the professional development of their staff. Of course if things go wrong then the Government which is paying the bill needs to be able to get in to see exactly how many clients that organisation is working with and how that organisation is working on the ground with those clients.Mr SPEAKER: Order! The answer is going on for too long.Jan Logie: I raise a point of order Mr Speaker. Apart from the length of that—Mr SPEAKER: Order! Just raise the point of order.Jan Logie: —I listened very carefully and did not hear an answer about track record.Mr SPEAKER: I listened to the answer as well and it addressed the question that was asked.Jan Logie: Why has she not ruled out contracting Serco to provide social services for New Zealand children considering its overseas track record of significant contract failure falsification of hundreds of health records the sexual abuse of women by guards in its UK prisons—Mr SPEAKER: Order! Bring the question to conclusion.Jan Logie: —and putting children in cages in Australia?Hon ANNE TOLLEY: I repeat: I have had no discussions with Serco about providing services in the social sector.Jan Logie: Will the Minister now rule out offering Serco any social service contract?Hon ANNE TOLLEY: Should this Government decide to go out to the market for services that it wants provided to make a difference in the lives of vulnerable children and New Zealanders we will examine very carefully all the offers we get and we will be focused on getting results for those families.Jan Logie: I seek leave to table a photo of children held in detention—Mr SPEAKER: No. Order! That is attempting to make a political point; it is not a valid point of order.