Little AndrewHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Justice): Thank you Mr Chairman. It's a great pleasure and an honour to take a call at this stage of this very important piece of legislation the Domestic Violence—Victims' Protection Bill. Like my colleague who has just spoken Louisa Wall I'd also like to acknowledge and pay tribute to the author and champion of this bill and indeed of this cause Jan Logie who is an outstanding under-secretary for Justice. And actually the energy that she has brought to the cause of getting domestic violence in the forefront of policymaking for this Government has been absolutely outstanding. It's been a privilege for me to play a supporting role in making sure that we advance that cause. And there's a very good reason and I think most in this Chamber know that. One of the biggest scourges that we have in this beautiful peaceful country of ours is the appalling record of domestic violence in this country. So many families are afflicted by it so many children are affected by it and it is an issue that simply we have to take seriously in this country if we are going to make a real difference and give the next generation and every generation that follows a decent chance of living a decent life.I know in my role as Minister of Justice that the price we pay for not doing better and not doing more on domestic violence is represented in our prison system and in other parts of our criminal justice system. It is not true to say that every child exposed to domestic violence becomes an offender themselves but we do know that a huge percentage—the vast majority—of those who offend and who wind up in either our youth justice facilities or our prisons are themselves victims of family violence. That is the price we pay. And so it makes absolute sense to me that we have a piece of legislation that allows victims of domestic violence the opportunity during work time to deal with that issue to sort out their affairs to see the people they need to see because that is the way we will start to make some progress in dealing seriously with this issue.I hear members opposite saying and you see it reflected in their Supplementary Order Papers (SOPs) Well why would you give 10 days' leave? Everybody will be taking it." That's the low trust model. And unfortunately historically that's actually the way the National Party regards working people. They regard working people as people not to be trusted. That's why they hate legislation like this which affords rights to people for important things and then sort of have to add so many barriers and hurdles. It is enough at the moment that the level of prescription in this legislation is as it is because the truth about employment-related legislation is that the overarching culture in this country is one of not trusting workers. Be that as it may but when it comes to an issue like this and provisions for those who are the victims of or who are deeply affected by domestic violence by violence in the home when they have their opportunity to extricate themselves from it to seek help about it to find safe refuge to talk to specialists and get the support that they need then why should they not have that opportunity available to them?Good responsible employers know that and understand it and afford that opportunity to people in that situation. There are plenty of employers who even without this would say to their valued staff member "Of course this is an important time for you in your life and I want to support you as part of my way of valuing you." This is not a right that is going to be exercised by every employee. The underlying premise to one of Mark Mitchell's SOPs—No. 41—is that somehow there's going to be a flood of applications for leave for domestic violence; it's not the case. But it is right that we have on our statute book a provision that pays respect to this as an issue and gives those affected by it the opportunity to do something serious about it. This is one thing. It is one thing that can make a difference and we should allow it to happen. It is one thing we can do that can seriously help to make a difference for the victims of domestic violence and really—especially—for children who are exposed to domestic violence. If a victim—more likely a woman but including some men—gets the opportunity to take time out from work without loss of pay without putting themselves under even greater financial pressure to get an issue sorted out that goes to the heart of who they are and can enable them to find peace and security and safety again then actually good responsible legislation like this should allow that to happen.This House discharging its responsibilities to every citizen of New Zealand and indeed to every business in New Zealand will know that the responsible course of action is to ensure that these rights are provided for appear on our statute book and the people affected can exercise the rights accorded to them under this bill. So the mere fact that we have to provide for the opportunity to request provisions like these in employment agreements is—well I guess we have to have it on our statute book because there will be some employers and I would hope a small number who will say "If it's not black and white if it's not in the law on the statute book then I'm not going to do it." I actually happen to think there are many more employers who will say "I value my workforce and for those who face tragedy in their lives I want to be a supportive employer and I know that we a run a business and run an organisation that can accommodate and provide for and be a supportive place for people in that situation." So we should allow that to happen.As it is the bill requires for those who take leave or apply for that leave—there are prescriptive processes to go through. That gives I guess some certainty to employers at least and indeed to workers who are availing themselves of this. But I trust the majority of New Zealanders in a situation like this when they have the opportunity to provide support to somebody in this situation that they will do so willingly without being grudging about it and knowing that it is the right thing to do. This bill achieves that and it is right that this House at this time should be making provision for it.The bill is necessarily prescriptive about setting up clauses in agreements and it goes through the various hoops there. It allows for mediation and intervention by the Mediation Service and labour inspectors to enable disputes to be resolved. I would hope that that simply is not necessary simply because the small proportion of the workforce who will be drawing on these provisions to enable them to get to a safer place and a better place are already facing a level of indignity. They have already been afforded a level of disrespect and I would hope that a culture would develop where actually they are not going to be revictimised through the processes that they need to go through to get to a point where they can get the support they need and make themselves safe again and spare any children in the relationship or any children exposed to domestic violence from continuing to be exposed.This legislation sends a signal that this country will at last take it seriously and this country through this Government joining with employers and the employer community are prepared at this point in our history to say "We are going to take this issue seriously. We are prepared to recognise the problem and we're prepared to recognise that a solution is that people affected by these insidious incidents can get the help they need. There will be no impediment and they don't have to bury themselves in shame in order to get that help but it is acknowledged and is something that we can usefully do something about." That's what this bill does.I'm not quite sure what the purpose of the Supplementary Order Paper calling for an education campaign is all about. Typically these things will be duly notified. With all due respect to the author of it from the party opposite it just looks like more patronising from those members who clearly don't seem to understand the purpose of this bill."