Smith Nick: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Smith Nick: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Volume:631;Page:3457] 
3.  
Hon Dr NICK SMITH (National—Nelson) 
 to the  
Minister of Energy 
: Does he stand by his statement “I do recognise that it’s my responsibility to ensure that … the lights don’t go out in New Zealand”? 
Hon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Energy) 
: 
 Yes I do. The situation in Auckland yesterday was unacceptable—as I said then. The Government is taking steps to prevent it from happening again. 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: Does the Minister accept he was wrong on 17 November last year to minimise concern about New Zealand’s electricity system when I put to him the concerns of Dr Keith Turner his own Ministry of Economic Development and Treasury and he replied: “… the problem is not as bad as the member and others would have us believe.” and how bad will it have to get our having had 700000 people and our economic capital brought to their knees for this Minister to accept we have a problem? 
Hon DAVID PARKER 
: I accepted at the time and accept now that we have a problem. The issue on which I disagreed with the member at the time I think related to assertions that Auckland was equivalent to a Third World city which is just not correct. 
Maryan Street 
: What is the Government doing to ensure that the situation in Auckland yesterday does not happen again? 
Hon DAVID PARKER 
: I will get a report within 2 weeks on why the wider system did not cope with the consequences of yesterday’s line failure at the Otahuhu substation. It will be urgently considered and remedial action will be taken promptly. As a priority we are investigating whether an additional substation is needed to share the load at Otahuhu. 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: Why did the Minister tell the people of New Zealand on  
Campbell Live 
 last night that a new circuit from Pakuranga to Penrose of 220 kilovolts was approved when that is not the case when that proposal is not budgeted for and when no resource consent has been applied for; why did he mislead the people of New Zealand last night? 
Hon DAVID PARKER 
: I did not. I was referring to the fact that it is approved by Transpower and is part of a request for information that it presently has out and is consulting upon. 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: You said it was approved. 
Hon DAVID PARKER 
: It is approved by Transpower. 
Peter Brown 
: Does the Minister accept that New Zealanders basically require three fundamental factors which are first a significant amount of new electricity second a fair and competitive price regime and third security of supply; and is he in a position to assure the House that those three factors will be delivered upon in this term? 
Hon DAVID PARKER 
: Yes I agree; they are three fundamentals that we are striving to achieve. 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: Does the Minister stand by his statement in the  
New Zealand Herald 
 this morning that he had requested Transpower “to investigate separating out parts of the Otahuhu substation under its plan to upgrade transmission into Auckland after 2013.”; and does he believe that the people of Auckland should put up with insecure power supply for another 5 years under his incompetent Government? 
Hon DAVID PARKER 
: No I do not accept that characterisation of it. What I did was refer to the current proposals that Transpower had already planned for the separation of some of the lines at Otahuhu to another part of the site so as to achieve some physical separation and I went on to say that I had asked Transpower to consider whether it should advance that plan or whether indeed there was a need for another substation at some distance apart. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: When—and I ask in the interest of learning from past experience—was there last a power blackout in Auckland how many days rather than hours did it last who had been in power for 8 years at that time and which party did the then Minister of Energy come from? 
Gerry Brownlee 
: I raise a point of order Madam Speaker. Because the member over there—the Government’s little lapdog—has referred to history— 
Madam SPEAKER 
: I know that it is the first day but when members are speaking to points of order they are entitled to be heard in silence. 
Hon Trevor Mallard 
: I raise a point of order Madam Speaker. Before we deal with that point of order an expression used by that member was absolutely unparliamentary. It should be ruled out and it should not be repeated. 
Gerry Brownlee 
: I withdraw and apologise. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: The member has withdrawn and apologised. 
Gerry Brownlee 
: Madam Speaker my point is in the interests of history and to assist you to work out whether that was a reasonable question. It is worth pointing out that the power failure in Auckland in 1998 was due to a large transmission line owned by Vector Energy not by any State agency and it had nothing to do with the Minister of Energy. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: I thank the member. That is not a point of order. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: I raise a point of order Madam Speaker. That member of Parliament has taken to raising points of order throwing in some bad language that is totally outside the Standing Orders and the Speakers’ rulings and getting away with it. Madam Speaker if I began my response to him by talking about “Mr Cellulite” or “Teletubby” you would stop me in my tracks immediately and rightfully so. He should be warned that if he carries on like that he will not get to make a point of order or ask a question. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: I thank the members. As I said we are starting a new sitting so let us keep the points of order that are raised to actual points or order. 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: To help the member who has asked the question I seek the leave of the House to table Mr Winston Peters’ speech in the urgent debate on the 1998 power failure when he said National could not be held responsible for it. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table that document. Is there any objection? There is objection. [ 
Interruption 
] The question can be addressed Mr Brownlee. 
Hon DAVID PARKER 
: The year was 1998. The number of days was more than five times seven—because it was more than 5 weeks—so it was more than 35. As a consequence of the dire straits of many parts of the New Zealand infrastructure inherited by this Government we are spending lots of additional resource on roads and public transport. In relation to capital upgrades to transmission lines the amount of the capital works programme is more than five times the size of that which we inherited from the National Government. 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: Does the Minister believe that this Labour Government has invested sufficient in New Zealand’s electricity infrastructure when it has taken over $2 billion in profits from consumers and spent less than 10 percent of that money on new infrastructure? 
Hon DAVID PARKER 
: The amount being spent on upgrades in and around Auckland this year is $83 million the total amount being spent throughout New Zealand in the coming year is more than $300 million and the total being spent over the next 3 years is more than $1 billion. If it takes more than that to do it to a higher standard and a higher standard is necessary we will spend that additional money. 
Peter Brown 
: Is the Minister aware that Transpower pays the Government dividends—albeit a modest $10 million last year—and in the light of the Auckland problems will he recommend to the appropriate Minister that the Government forgoes the dividends until the Auckland problems have been completely fixed? 
Hon DAVID PARKER 
: The answer to that is evident in the question. A dividend of a mere $10 million is not a capital constraint that is holding back Transpower’s investment in the grid. 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: Why has the Government ignored the calls from Transpower in the 2002 annual report the 2003 annual report the 2004 annual report and the 2005 annual report that the Resource Management Act must be reformed if Transpower is to be able to maintain and upgrade the grid in a timely way; and will this Government reconsider and reform that Act so that New Zealand can have infrastructure that will service a modern economy? 
Hon DAVID PARKER 
: I do not accept the proposition that the Resource Management Act is to blame for either the problems we had in South Auckland or the transmission upgrades we need to make through the Waikato. Further I would note that practical progress is being made by the acquisition of land on a voluntary basis through the Waikato. If and when Transpower believes that it actually needs assistance to compulsorily acquire land from those who are holding out I have no doubt it will come to the Government and ask us for permission to use the Public Works Act compulsory acquisition route. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: Has the Minister received any reports of the likelihood of his receiving an attack today from a political party that was responsible for a 35-day blackout in respect of a Government that is responsible for a 5-hour blackout? 
Hon DAVID PARKER 
: Incredible though it seems I expected it. 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: I seek the leave of the House to table Transpower’s annual reports for the years 2002-03 2003-04 and 2004-05 and its 6-monthly report all stating that the Resource Management Act needed to be reformed in order for Transpower to be able to upgrade our transmission system. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table those documents. Is there any objection? Yes there is objection.  
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: I seek the leave of the House to table the statement made by Dr Keith Turner in February last year that New Zealand’s electricity system was so bad that some lines and specifically the lines into Auckland could not be properly maintained because they could not be taken out of action for servicing. 
Document not tabled. 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: Noting that the Minister’s response earlier—in answer to my question to him about his having said that the problem was not that bad—that he had said that comment in response to my referring to Auckland as being of a Third World standard was not correct I seek leave to table the  
Hansard 
 from 17 November last year in which the Minister disputed Dr Keith Turner’s concerns and said that the problem actually was not that bad. 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table that document. Is there any objection? There is objection. 
Rodney Hide 
: Has the Minister received any messages in the past 24 hours regarding the power blackout in Auckland from the Minister with responsibility for Auckland Issues; if so what additional measures has he put in place for Auckland; if not is he surprised that he has not heard from the Minister with responsibility for Auckland Issues? 
Hon DAVID PARKER 
: Yes I have; indeed the Minister with responsibility for Auckland Issues sought and had an appointment with me to discuss her concerns that the outage of a line at Otahuhu could cause such a widespread power blackout in Auckland. She is very keen to be kept informed as to the remedial measures I propose.