Macindoe Tim: New Zealand Flag Referendums Amendment Bill — First Reading Second Reading In CommitteeText is incorporated into the Bound VolumeMacindoe Tim: New Zealand Flag Referendums Amendment Bill — First Reading Second Reading In Committee[Sitting date: 23 September 2015. Volume:709;Page:6980. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.]TIM MACINDOE (National—Hamilton West): It seems to be my lot to follow the former member for Hamilton West in this debate tonight. May I say how disappointed I am to hear him again attacking the integrity of some members of the Flag Consideration Panel. I stand by the comments I made before—I believe they are a very fine group of people. They are a representative cross-section of New Zealanders and they have served our country well.Mr Mallard and before him Mr Robertson have again lamented the absence of a simple yes/no vote in the referendum process but there are two fundamental flaws in the argument that they and some others are putting forward. The first is that the construction of this two-stage referendum process is based on the very best independent advice that was made available to the Government. The Government listened to that and has acted upon it.The second point which I think is even more important is that the two main parties went to the 2014 general election promising to hold a referendum on this particular issue. Three out of four New Zealanders or slightly more than that cast their vote in favour of one of those two main parties so they have already had their yes/no option and now we are moving to the next stage in the process which is to say we will give people a range of things to choose from they can make a choice and we will put it up against the current New Zealand flag—which I acknowledge is an attractive flag in its own right—and we will let New Zealanders decide which one they want to have. That is a very democratic and appropriate process and it is one that I am very proud to support.I have been particularly disappointed to hear Mr Robertson suggesting that the National Party has been playing political games over this issue. We campaigned on this. We have been up front about it for a very long period of time. We have gone to the public and we are having the discussion with the public. We are listening to the public and we are listening to the public tonight by saying we will offer a little bit more choice than the Flag Consideration Panel has put forward. That to my mind is responsible and sensible government.I have to say to Mr Robertson that the gamesmanship here is from the party that wants to change the flag and that campaigned last year to give New Zealanders the chance to change the flag but cannot bear the fact that the flag might change while the National Party is in Government. So solely for that reason it is opposing it. That to my mind is the ultimate in political cynicism and gamesmanship and shame on the Labour Party for that.In the first reading of this bill Mr Mallard attacked the current Prime Minister and he has just repeated it with words to the effect that the Prime Minister should stand up for his principles and beliefs on this issue. He has attacked the Prime Minister for not having spoken in the debate on the bill. Well is there a single New Zealander who is unaware of where the Rt Hon John Key stands on this issue? I do not think so. The Prime Minister not only outlined his views very clearly in the Address in Reply debate this year but he has answered questions from the Opposition day after day after day in this House and has given his views very forcefully and clearly on this issue. He has attended numerous public meetings. I have been at some meetings where he has articulated his vision and he has listened to the public. The Rt Hon John Key is leading in a very honourable and responsible way and I am proud to support him in that. To suggest that he has in some manner kept his views to himself is absolutely ridiculous.I want to again state that I am proud that we in the National Party are delivering on our manifesto and in particular for the first time in this nation’s history we are giving the public of New Zealand the chance to have a say as to which flag they feel would best represent them. They have never had this opportunity before. If we vote for change the new flag would be the fourth flag in the history of this nation. So it is hardly credible to suggest that somehow the current flag should be respected and kept in perpetuity when we have already previously had three flags.I have to say I am not a supporter of Red Peak. On that I do agree with Mr Mallard. But I recognise that there are many who have indicated that they would like more choice and that they would like to consider that option. For that reason as I said before I am proud that our Government is listening to those people. I want again to acknowledge Gareth Hughes in particular and the members of the Green Party. We are not always natural political bedfellows but I think they are playing a very honourable and clearly constructive role in this process. I thank them for that. I think that the effect of the Green Party’s involvement in this particular issue tonight will be to ensure that it is more widely supported than it has been to date and that is a good thing. I genuinely thank the Green Party for what I think is a very helpful contribution.I am more than happy to see the fifth option go into the process but more important I am more than happy to respect the democratic will of the people. If they vote to retain the current flag so be it but I am proud that we are giving every New Zealander a chance to have a say. I believe it is the right thing and I am therefore very strongly in support of this bill.