Fitzsimons Jeanette: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume 
Fitzsimons Jeanette: Questions for Oral Answer — Questions to Ministers 
[Sitting date: 19 June 2008. Volume:647;Page:16753. Text is incorporated into the Bound Volume.] 
2.  
JEANETTE FITZSIMONS (Co-Leader—Green) 
 to the  
Minister of Transport 
: What advice if any has she received about the likely price path of oil over the next 5 years; and how will this impact on transport planning? 
Hon ANNETTE KING (Minister of Transport) 
: 
 Clearly oil prices affect the movement of people and freight and the amount of revenue from fuel excise duties that goes into the National Land Transport Fund. Officials are keeping a watchful eye on price movements. 
Jeanette Fitzsimons 
: Is the Minister satisfied that when Land Transport New Zealand determines the economics of new motorways it uses the 2002 oil price of $26 a barrel adjusted only by the consumer price index when today the cost of oil is over $130 a barrel; and when will the Minister demand that her ministry and Crown agencies use realistic oil prices in their cost-benefit calculations? 
Hon ANNETTE KING 
: When calculations were made for decisions around roads particularly in Auckland those decisions were made based on the best evidence available at the time. It does not mean the roads are not necessary—those roads will be built. 
Jeanette Fitzsimons 
: How long will the Minister accept the advice of officials who consistently undervalue oil prices undervalue carbon prices undervalue the time of public transport users compared with the time of drivers count the positive external effects of roads but not the positive external effects of public transport and use a ridiculously high discount rate when evaluating public transport options? 
Hon ANNETTE KING 
: I will continue to take advice from my officials because they also give me advice on our passenger transport needs and on our needs in terms of more cycling and walking. They also give advice on the need for roads. As the member herself said yesterday we will always have cars so we will always need roads. To believe that we will now stop building roads is just not realistic. 
Keith Locke 
: Given the Minister’s comments just now that the oil price estimates relate to decisions on road building in Auckland what price will oil have to rise to before the Government redirects its nearly $2 billion budgeted expenditure on Auckland’s Waterview motorway into better public transport for Aucklanders? 
Hon ANNETTE KING 
: This Government has in fact done both. We have directed considerable funding into public transport in Auckland and we are looking to do even more. We are also mindful that the western ring route State Highway 20 which takes traffic around Auckland rather than through it needs to be completed otherwise we have a part of a network of roads that do not link up. That would be seen by Aucklanders to be silly because on that road will also be trucks and buses; one needs roads for both as well as for cars. 
Peter Brown 
: Does the Minister share New Zealand First’s view that had roads been more appropriately funded in the 1990s by the then National Government we would not have the problem that we have now? 
Hon ANNETTE KING 
: That is a very good question. 
Hon Dr Nick Smith 
: 9 years! 
Hon ANNETTE KING 
: The 9 long years of this Labour Government have seen more investment in transport than this country has ever seen. We have seen investment in transport go from less than a billion dollars under a National Government to $2.7 billion this year. If National had invested in transport we would not have the congestion in Auckland that we do today. For the first time ever yesterday at a transport forum Maurice Williamson admitted that National had not invested into transport. The reason he gave the forum for that was that Ruth Richardson would not let him. 
Jeanette Fitzsimons 
: If the Government cannot get a majority in the House for the regional fuel tax ironically because petrol prices are becoming unaffordable will the Minister provide a funding guarantee for Auckland’s electric trains so they can be ordered now rather than leaving a part-network of rail system that cannot be used—just as she has provided a funding guarantee to 2011 for motorway expansion projects and as the Government has provided a funding guarantee for the Huntly gas-fired power station—or is Government underwriting available only for projects that increase our fossil fuel use? 
Hon ANNETTE KING 
: Obviously not because the Government has invested considerably in rail. We will get to that question when we need to.  
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: If the National Party had not stopped both the 1995 bill that sought to ensure that all road taxes went on roading and the 1998 budgetary measure that by compounding over 10 years sought to take 2.1 percent extra into the roading account would it have taken 9 long years for those measures to have happened?  
Hon ANNETTE KING 
: Obviously the answer is no. And there has been little—little—commitment from the National Party in terms of transport. But as we get to an election I know that National members are going around New Zealand promising absolutely everything. They will fix the entire transport network and—you know what—they will do it in a year they are so good! 
Rodney Hide 
: Could the Minister of Transport give a clear goal for this Government in respect of petrol prices: is it to put up the price of petrol and other fossil fuels to combat climate change through the emissions trading scheme or is it to try to get the price of petrol and other fossil fuels down which is why it is having an inquiry into pricing—which one is it I ask the Minister; does the Government want prices up or down? 
Hon ANNETTE KING 
: I have no responsibility for climate change or for the inquiry that is being undertaken. 
Rodney Hide 
: I raise a point of order Madam Speaker. I did not suggest for a minute that the Minister had responsibility for emissions trading schemes. But the question is down about petrol pricing and the price path of oil and my question asks whether the Government has a goal to put up the price. If the primary question is in order then asking whether the Government has a goal about that certainly must be in order.  
Madam SPEAKER 
: The primary question also relates however to transport planning. I listened to the member’s question and heard that it had several thoughts contained within it some of which were certainly not within the Minister’s ministerial responsibility.  
Te Ururoa Flavell 
: Tena koe Madam Speaker; kia ora tatou tenei rangi. Has the Minister seen the editorial in Tuesday’s  
New Zealand Herald  
that described the inquiry to examine the pricing behaviour of domestic suppliers as “a well-trodden path of inquiry unlikely to tell us anything new let alone offer a practical response to the oil shock.” and does she not agree that the Maori Party’s proposal for a cross-party commission on peak oil is a good idea that could offer practical solutions; if not why not? 
Hon ANNETTE KING 
: I have seen the editorial in the  
New Zealand Herald 
. I imagine that it would not matter what this Government did; it would get a negative editorial from the  
New Zealand Herald 
. 
Jeanette Fitzsimons 
: I seek leave of the House to table two documents. The first is an answer to a written question that shows that the 2002 oil price is still being used in land transport— 
Madam SPEAKER 
: Leave is sought to table that document. Is there any objection? Yes there is. 
Jeanette Fitzsimons 
: The second is the Government’s advice to Ministers on how to answer transport questions from the Green Party which shows where many of the Ministers’ answers come from. 
Document by leave laid on the Table of the House. 
Rt Hon Winston Peters 
: I seek leave to table two documents: the 1998 Budget that sought to take extra taxation for roading and the 1999 Budget in which National repealed that measure having of course signed up to it in the coalition talks. 
Document not tabled.