Bayly AndrewANDREW BAYLY (National—Hunua): Thank you and I'm sure the Minister in the chair the Hon Kris Faafoi being a very skilled business practitioner is going to take the opportunity to address those questions that my good colleague Chris Penk has just raised because they are a very important feature of this bill. I'm just looking forward to his contribution when he has a moment.I just thought I might move on to something a little bit different. This is about portfolio investment entities commonly referred to as PIEs. I know that—Hon Scott Simpson: The Minister knows a bit about those too!ANDREW BAYLY: Yeah the Minister is very experienced with these. Of course the reason I'm raising this is that these are very fundamental entities that help KiwiSaver accounts. They are the way that many people invest their KiwiSavers and what a debate we've been having more generally outside this Chamber about another tax which of course—what's this bill called? The Taxation (Annual Rates for 2018-19 Modernising Tax Administration and Remedial Matters) Bill.Simeon Brown: What's the other tax Andrew?ANDREW BAYLY: Well I daren't mention it because Madam Chair might give me a hard time but the issue around PIEs is fundamental for people who want to invest in listed companies.Just so we all understand what a PIE is a listed PIE is an entity that basically invests in a whole lot of companies on a recognised exchange particularly the New Zealand Stock Exchange and provided it meets other requirements it is in a situation where it has preferential tax treatment. So rather than paying 33 percent it might be 28 percent and there's a lower threshold as well depending on the type of investment and the scale of it. And that's why it is so vitally important to KiwiSaver investors and we have a lot of KiwiSaver investors; we've got about $40 billion in the KiwiSaver accounts ACC—through those types of accounts. It's very important for the future of New Zealanders to be able to invest using these structures and that's why some of the other murmurings that we've heard in public that talk about what might happen to these PIEs has got to be treading on very fine ground because we do not want to disincentivise people from investing in good quality New Zealand businesses listed on the New Zealand Stock Exchange because we need capital coming into those businesses. We've got a stock market worth only $100 billion we've got a housing market worth a trillion and we need more people investing in them perpetuating and sustaining our New Zealand businesses.So to the rules here and it relates to clause 167 one of the things that this bill does is make two changes to the arrangements. The first one relates to the wind-up provisions of listed PIEs and what it does is give some transitional arrangements for an entity intending to become a listed PIE. It allows an entity that is not listed on a recognised exchange to become a listed PIE provided that it has a minimum of 100 shareholders or more; has resolved to become a company listed on a recognised exchange in New Zealand if it were to obtain the required consents; has applied to the Financial Markets Authority for an exemption from disclosing in a product disclosure document—this is a normal type of document that companies do when they have to list on any stock exchange—the full documentation around the nature of the company's activities its directors all those aspects and financials of course; and the fourth thing that it satisfies the commissioner that the company would apply to become a listed company if it were to obtain the required consents.What this does is give a provision for a listed PIE delisting as part of the process of winding up. And what we put in place as part of this are some transitional mechanisms to allow it to happen over a period of time and it doesn't cut to the core of the integrity of that PIE. And it has some aspects to it. For a PIE status for a listed PIE using this method it must have two years or longer from the date the listed PIE is delisted it must have a date specified in its election clause and it must specify when the number of shareholders reduces below 100. So I'm highlighting this issue because New Zealanders saving for their future is a fundamental issue for New Zealand. We need people to do it. PIE status is an important element in achieving that and we need to protect that.