davidaulloa/AmericanStories huggingface dataset:
The Birmingham age-herald., 1920-07-13
COTTON MARKET HAD 4 QUIET DAY
 ON WALL STREET
Private Cables Reported a Much Better Demand From Manchester In the
 Liverpool Market
By Associated Pres,

Ft@c~efotou
 New York, July 12.-The cotton mar lSet was comparatively quiet during the greater part of today's reading. Local brokers attributed this largely to uncer- tainty regarding the actual progress of the crop. which. they said, was restrict ing business, and fluctuations were ir- regular, october sold up to S3.60 at the start on a continuation of the covering movement which had been in progress at the close of Saturday. This advance of about no points from the recent low level was sufficient to attract consid- erable realizing and the price eased off to 3s17 during the middle of the day Foreign trade buying helped to check the decline which was followed by ral- lies on covering with October closing at S3.S6 The general market closed very steady at a decline of 115 points on Au- gust which was under scattering liquida- ton, but generally unchanged to thirty points higher with July relatively firm
 The market opened at an advance of p to 40 points in response to steady Liverpool cables and continued buying on the disappointing private condition figures of Saturday. Another private re- port published this morning, made q more favorable showing, however, in dicating condition of 73.S against 69.S toward the end of June. and the market turned easier shortly after the call
 December sold off from 190 to 31. .55, or a shade under Saturdays closing figures. but the continued showers reported in the belt promoted apprehensions of in- sect damage, and private cables reported a better demand from Manchester in the Liverpool market.
 These features held selling in check and the market steadied up during the afternoon with last prices showing ral- lies of some ten to fifteen points from the lowest. July was quiet but steady during the entire day on covering.
The Birmingham age-herald., 1920-07-13
MARINE NEWS
BY AssocIatsd Pres.

Mobile, July 12.--Arrived: Herman Win ter, Port Barrios; Texico, Port Arthur Lake Giltedge, Georgetown; James S. Whitney, New Orleans: Bark Doon. Cuba: schooner Flechas, Havana.
 Sailed: Lake Arthur, Kingston. Ja- maica; Senator Bailey. Tampico schoon- CT Irnla, Trinidad.
 New Orleans, July 12.-Cleared: Hico, Antwerp, via Havre; Manuel Rionda, Santiago and Cuban ports; Omoa CHon- duran), Omoa. via Port Cortez Sahale, Mobile: Sag Harbor, Tampico. valdarno Qtalian), Italy, via Gibraltar for orders
 Cleared: Schooner Progreso S(Spanish) Alciante, Spain.
 Port Eads. July R.-Arrived: Atenas. Bocas del Toro; Augusta (Honduran), Port Cortez; Hamm (British), Norfolk; Lake Copley. Havana; -nanta, Porto Rico. Melania (British), Thames Haven, England; Truxillo. Tela; Yoro (Hondp- ram. Ceiba.
 Sailed: British Princess (Britsh). Havre and Rouen; Dorothea, Laguna De- carmen. via Campeche; Edward l.. Do- heny III, Rio Janeiro, via Tampico, Gansfjord (Norwegian), Bluefields, via Cape Gracias; Gudrun (British), Trieste, Italy, via Norfolk and Gibraltar; Keno wis, Genoa, via Bermuda
The Birmingham age-herald., 1920-07-13
REACTION IN THE LIST STARTED NEW WEEK AMONG HE TRADERS.
Rails as a Group Were Much Stronger and More Prom inent Tran Any Time of
 Recent Date
By Associated Pre-.

New York, July 12.-The week on the stock exchange began with a succession Of reactionary price movements which seemed to measure the less optimistic views of traders in connection with latest financial and industrial develop ments.
 Advices dealing with the steel and iron industry were once more disconcerting because of the increased freight con gestion and consequent fuel shortage. Many special stocks, such as textiles. feathers and rubbers. denoted the more unsettled trend in these and kindred lines of business.
 As group, rails were stronger and more prominent than recently. but buying or that division. which occasionally ex- tended to secondary shares, appeared to be little more than a screen for liqui- dation of less favored issues.
 Oils, especially the Mexican and Texas stocks; motors, popular steels,, equip ments and shippings comprised the weaker issues. losing to points, Pres sure was pronounced in the final hour, when shorts were most aggressive
 The money market was under careful scrutiny as a result of last Fridays 10 per cent rate for call money and the heavy shrinkage of reserves reported by the clearing house.
 Todays opening rate of per cent re- mained unchanged, any tendency towards ease being checked by relatively small offerings.
 Further gold imports, amounting to s. 150000, were reported, with an additional engagement Of s1,3oo.ooO in transit, but the f~.e1gn exchange market recorded no material alteration of rates to London or any other important quarter.
 Trading in bonds was unusually light and within correspcndingly narrow limits. The trend, including Liberty issues, was lowee.
 Total sales, par value, were s. .250, 600.
 Old United States bonds were un- changed on call.
The Birmingham age-herald., 1920-07-13

points Closing bids: July, 12.S5c; Sep tember. II 7ec; October, 11.S3c; December, III soc; January, 119oc; March, 1194c; May, 2.02c.
 Spot coffee was reported dull and nominal on the basis of 5%c for Rio 7s and 1e1kc to 21kc for Santos 4s. Cost and freight offers were irregular, but averaged lover including Santos As. at 17c to 17.9oc. and Rio Is at 12.70c Ameri- can credits.
 The official cables reported an advance of $50 reis in the Rio market, with ram or showers in Sac Paolo and with frost in one district. The early cable showing a decline of PTS to 475 reis in the Santos futures seemed to overshadow the ad- vance in Rio, however, and later cables reported further decline of 15o to 4Ve reis in the Santos market. Receipts at the two Brazilian ports, S6,0o0: Jundfahy receipts, 30,0Oo. Rio cleared 21,ooo bags fos New orleans and Santos 6,900 for New York
The Birmingham age-herald., 1920-07-13
Port Movement


 New Orleans: Middling 32c; receipts, :. .n3s. sales. 1,1H; stock, 2s8,16S
 Galveston: Midding. 3s50c; receipts, 257: sales, 800; stock, 1a2.a19
 Mobile: Middling, 29.25c; stock. 1.SSs. Savannah Middling, 4o75c; receipts, 232. stock 73,212
 Charleston: Middlihg, 4o5oc; stock. 240,544
 Wilmington: Middling. se.5oc; receipts. 5s stock, 35,767.
 Texas City: Receipts, 113 stock, 27,549. Norfolk Middling, 40.50c; receipts. 177; stock. 37,S79.
 Baltimore: Stock. s322.
 Boston: Middling. 4o.50c; receipts. 7s; exports 60c; stock. 6,400.
 Philadelphia; Mddling. 4O.75c: ex- ports. 75; stock, 47e7.
 New York Middling. 4050c; receipts Ss9; exports, S50; stock, S4,7o2.
 Minor ports: Stock, 4,829.
 Total today: Receipts, 6,340; shipments, 995; stock, S76.442
 Total for week: Receipts. 99s6 ship
The Birmingham age-herald., 1920-07-13
Metal Market

By Assocfated Press New York, July 12.-Copper steady electroIytic spot and third quarter. .Sl9 Iron steady; No. 1 northern. s4s ood4s.oo; No. northern, s4700m4s.o0; No. ? south ern, s43o0a44.oO.
 Tin, steady; spot, July and August, S51.00.
 Anthony, S.75.
 Metal exchange quotes lead firm; spot and July offederd ss.60.
 Zinc steady; spot, s7.67ik bid 800 asked At London: Spot copper. e91 Is Cd; fu- lures, se93 IFS G. Electroltic, spot, 9105 futures, e110. Tin, spot, 264 15s; futures, 2n 5s. Lead. spot 34 10s futures, 931s Zinc, spot, G42 15s: futures, eA.
The Birmingham age-herald., 1920-07-13
Daily Financial Gossip
By HOLLAND

New York, July 12.-(Special). -Myron T. Herriek, formerly governor of Ohio, departed for Paris as soon as possible after Senator Harding was nominated Tor President at the republican conven- ton. The few who are familiar with the inside history of the campaign which had for it's purpose the nomination Of Senator Harding know that much of the success of that campaign was due 10 the counsel and aid of Governor Herrick Nevertheless. he did not permit himself to become conspicuous, having in mind only the success of the Harding cam paign.
 Governor Herrick has been much in terested in the meeting of the Interna- tional Chamber of Commerce, in which he is to participate at Paris, and he hastened from the United Staxes imme- diately after the republican convention adjourned so that he might be able to attend the first meeting of the confer ence. He had some things in mind which he hoped would be acceptable to the conference and if adopted and ut into effect would result in relieving some of the financial and abnormal con- ditions due to the war.
 Governor Herrick did, however shortly before his departure communicate with few personal friends in New York. What he said has been received with qualification, especially in the financial district and the business world so far as his comments were known. He called attention to the fact that Senator Hard ing has, especially since he entered the Senate, been strongly persuaded that the relation between the President and vice president should be close and that it would surely be to the advantage of President if he established warm and confidential relations with the vice president. Furthermore. Governor Her rick intimated that if Senator Harding were elected he would make a diligent attempt to secure for his cabinet as able and representative men as could be found in the country, believing that in their strength his administration would be greatly aided.
 GOVERNOR COX'S VIEW
 It is of interest to notice that some of those who are familiar with the po- litical career of Governor Cox are con- fident that he, too, in case he be elect ed President will as far as possible take the vice president into his family couhsel, for Governor Cox is strong enough man not to permit himself to be controlled by personal jealousies, be- lieving that if he has able men as coun- selors he will himself be strengthened. A report of this kind has been brought
The Birmingham age-herald., 1920-07-13

to New York. Therefore there appears to be certainty that whether Senator Harding or Governor Cox be elected President a new relation between the President and the vice president will be established and there will also be gath cred aL the cabinet table able and rep resentative men in whom the country will have confidence.
 VICE PRESIDENT
 Years ago newly maugurated Presi- dent purposed calling into his cabinet the vice president as an ex-officio mem Der and would have done so- had not the party leaders in the Senate objected. President Taylor was anxious to include Vice President Willard Fillmore in his cabinet as an ex-officio member. He gave what appeared to be excellent req sons for this view. He spoke of the vice president as really an understudy for the President He believed that the vice president should be familiar with the policy and purposes of the President so that if he was called upon to assume the office he would be well prepared for it's responsibilities. But, the party leaders in the Senate objected and Presi- dent Taylor was obliged to abandon his purpose.
 PRESIDENT LINCOLN
 President Lincoln was far more often
 
 nibal Hamlin than the public or even the members of Lincoln's cabinetsknew. Tn 1892, when Hamlin visited New York, he said in private conversation that many times Lincoln summoned him to the White House privately and that the conference which followed lasted some times far into the night. He further more said that President Lincoln be- lieved that the President and the vice president should make, to quote his own words, "a perfect working team" In these conferences Lincoln disclosed to the vice president some, if not all. his purposes and spoke to him frequently in the last year of his first administration of his plan for reconstruction after the war was ended
 But for the most part Presidents and vice presidents have been far apart Whether Senator Harding or Governor Cox be elected President it seems eer- tain that either Vice President Coolidge will be brought into constant and famil- far association with the President or else in case Governor Cox be elected he will maintain "A new relation to his vice president. calling into conference fre- auently Vice President Roosevelt, for whom Governor Cox has much admira- ton, and in whose experience and ability he will place confidence.
The Birmingham age-herald., 1920-07-13
Louisville Live Stock
Ccffee Market

New York. July 12.-The market for cof- fee futures lost the greater part of it's rally of late last week during today's trading, with September and December contracts again. breaking below the 12- cent level This was due to the re- newed weakness of the Santos market. nwhich seemed to be the more impressive, in view of the unsettled weather condi- tions reported in Sac Paolo, and after opening at decline of 8 to B points. active months here sold at q decline of 65 to 7s points. This carried Septembor the close was at the lowest prices of the day. showing . nst decline of . to v
The Birmingham age-herald., 1920-07-13
FTfrrETn

shipments. 557; sales. 437: stock. 7O,0y7
 Augusta Middling. 41c; receipts. 90; BIO; shipments, 561; stock. 16.5sS.
 Little Rock: Middling, 3950c; ship ments, il: sales. H.; stock, 17,793.
 Total today Receipts, 3,2s6; shipments, 5,124; stock, 642 4s5.
The Birmingham age-herald., 1920-07-13

American Smelling & Refining 5s 77ss American Tel. & Tel. cv. 6s ... 93H Anglo-French 5s' '............. 99r2 Atchison gen. As ...... 72% Atlantic Coast Line 1st As. bid.. 70
 Baltimore & Ohio cv. ,4hs ..... ,5Sh Bethlehem Steel ref. 5s ... 7SB Central of Georgia con- >5s, bid TITS Central Leather 5s .......... 91 Chesapeake & Ohio cv. 5s ...... 75A Chicago. B. & Quincy joint 4s... 94 Chicago, Mil. & St. F. cv. Az 8 63 Chicago, R. l. & Pac. Ky. ref. As 65R City of Paris 6s ......... 94 Col. & Southern ref. 4hs, bid 67 Denver & Rio Grande con- As 62M Dominion of Canada 5s G931) 61s Erie gen. As 391s Illinois Central ref. As ........ 70 Inter. Mer. Marine 6s .......... S5 Kansas City Southern ref. 5s, bid 67 Liggett & Myers, 5s, bid ........ 77 ( Louis. & Nash. un. As ...... TIA Mo, Kan. & Texas 1st As =. 53A Missouri Pacific As ........... 53 New York Central deb. 6s ... S67s Norfolk & Western cv. 6s, bid. 91A Northern Pacific As ...... 72 Pennsylvania gen. 5s .......... S3 Reading gen. As .....-........ T6A Republic Iron & S. 5s f194o) bid S51s St. Louis & San Fran. adj 6s 61ss Seaboard Air Line adj. 5s ...... 33A Southern Bell Telephone 5s -. S0h Southern Pacific cv. 5s ........ 97 Southern Railway 5s .........- 80 Southern Railway gen. As 58R Texas & Pacific 1st ........... 76 Union Pacific As ............ 79A United Kingdom of G. B. &
 l. 5hs (1937) ................ S6 U. S. Steel 5s 92 Virginia Caro. Chemical 5s, bid. 92A Wabash 1st S2 Wilson & Co. cv. 6c .. S5%
The Birmingham age-herald., 1920-07-13
Hubbard Bros. & Co.

York Members New York Cotton Exchange New Orleans Cotton Exchange. New York Produce Exchange. Associated Members Lis. erpool Cotton Association. Orders solcitad for the purchase and sale of Cotton and Cotton Seed Oil for future delivery. Special
 attention and l.Neral terms given for con signment of spot cotton TOT delivery. Cor.
The Birmingham age-herald., 1920-07-13
Naval Stores Qv AxsoeiateA prees

Savannah, July 12-Turpentine. firm s1.41&1.43A; receipts, s51 shipments TIT; stock s,353. Rosin, firm; { sales, 1,179; receipts. 2.47e; shipments 1.792 stock, 3o,S41. Quote: B. SIPS; wv, s13.85.
The Birmingham age-herald., 1920-07-13
New Orleans Futures

New Orleans July 12-The cotton market closed steady at points up to 30 down, net.
The Birmingham age-herald., 1920-07-13

1 SIS; shipments, 1.4sl; sales, 100: stock. 227, ,ss4.
 Memphis: Middling Ss.5Oc; receipts I75s: shipments. 2,245; sales. 400; stock 294,7 TAP.
 St. Louis: Middling: s9.5Oc; receipts
The Birmingham age-herald., 1920-07-13
Rice Market

BY Ass0cIated PFbss New Orleans, July 12.-Rough rice. no sales, receipts none. Clean rice, steady Honduras, 1,971 pockets 5ta to 10; blue rose, 1,4o4 pockets, 6 to 91a.
The Birmingham age-herald., 1920-07-13
Spot Cotton Rv Aeeonistad praes

New Orleans, July 12.-Spot cotton, steady; quotations revised. Middling, unchanged; sales on the spot, 1.41 balesi to arrive, none. Low middling, 29c; middling, 3sc; good middling, 43c. Receipts. 5.o3S;, stock. 26S,1ss.
 New York, July 12.-Spot cotton. quiet middling, 40.05c.
The Birmingham age-herald., 1920-07-13
Potato Market

By Hss0cIated Press Chicago, July 12.-Potatoes, strong; Southern Triumphs, $7&7.25 cwt.
The Birmingham age-herald., 1920-07-13
New York Stocks

Sales. High. Low. Close. Amer. Beet s.. 700 94 9SA 94A Amer. Can .... 2000 43 Al Al Amer. c. & F.. 1900 1S91a 137H 137h Amer. H. & L.,
Richmond times-dispatch. [volume] (Richmond, Va.) 1914-current, 1920-09-19

Port movement:
New York-M.ddlinE. 81 %; stock % a.
Minor Dorts-Stock. LIS.
Total ;oday. Receipts. l2.ll;: exports, ).
Total for week-Reeeipt,. !,I5: exports
Total To-! season-Rcce!p,s. as22e5: c1
Richmond times-dispatch. [volume] (Richmond, Va.) 1914-current, 1920-09-19
ERIE STOCK is FEATURE
OF TRADING ON MARKET

Continued from First Page.)
appeared from Wall Street today ex-
'tpt on the part OF shorts. The gov
'rhors Of the stock exchange were
N'crywhere praised for their wisdom
~ stopping trading when the e1plo-
ION occurred, thus preventing panic
%hd Tor ignoring tho explosion the
,n!Iowing day. President Remlck was
'Ac leader In both these decisive acts.
purchase by The Consolidated Tex
,.r interests OF the Knight mills at
lfovldcncc caused an advance OF
more than two points IN the stock OF
.ns company. Toxtilc earned above
share befo. taxes. in the first
six months OF u, year. II has In
alEurated a systt ~ OF handling labor
mat has kept II from strikes during
"l the troubles OF other spinning
COMPANIES.
Further confirmation comes from
London OF the iiasc0 that the govern
ment believes the British coal strike
viii prove. Tho strike Is called for
next Friday. American correspond
.nts OF British banks are advised TO
lot the strike have no influence on
,hrtr present plans.
Report In the street is that the
Mon Pacific Is planning 10 take con-
Irol of tho Chicago Great Western.
This is one OF the short Independent
mes that has always been II dis,urber
"Ithout profit to Itself.
Balnwin shorts took fright in tho
ist hour. but had no opportunity to
over any large lines Of stock owing
70 the narrowncss OF the market
Richmond times-dispatch. [volume] (Richmond, Va.) 1914-current, 1920-09-19

closed. Interest was conferred In sugar fu.
turns. here onlY u few tots changed hands
WITH operators inclined To hold off and
AWAIT dcreIopmsnt In the spot market.
pris:s weir IRREGULAR and closed at 70
poin's decline to points advance. with
trading confined TO the November and
December positions
Richmond times-dispatch. [volume] (Richmond, Va.) 1914-current, 1920-09-19
COTTON MARKETS.

NEW YORK. Sept !.-Oenets!iy the
cotton Fnacke; was weaker today. but hear
the close prices improved sharply. Al
though the nnals were lover Favorable
Weather IA u. south. less encouraging re-
nnits !eraEdIng the labor situation in
Urea; Br!ia!n ana poorer adv.ces from
the West az 20 dry goods aTnonE
inc factors emphasized on the decline.
The start was easier at a dcciin. u 10
10 u points. bct later tho list rallied on
Weekend Govcr!ng. The South was a
LS'IeT carly and room traders also solo:
The increased demand in the dry goods
trade. according TO come authorities had
not resulted IN much actual business. Ex-
cot 70, eoTerinE or proht-tak!ng there
APPEARED to be little SUPPORT in the mar
ke; October drooDci TO a net loss Of
- points ana :aier ctt.ons showed losses
OF 90 to 81 points later under Soutnefn
selling. !iau.d.,io's. Wall Street aud local
Toward the end OF the session tn. mar
bet had strong rally OF more ;han 10
p9ipts on covering and buying b. trade
aud New Orleans interests. but cas-d
somewhat In the las, few minutes undo :
no. lower.
k.ceipis a. the ports for the dag wer.
a6ont 1902 bales. compared with e5ie
Richmond times-dispatch. [volume] (Richmond, Va.) 1914-current, 1920-09-19
CHICAGO GRAIN Al.ARKEr.

CHICAGO. Sept. is.-Graln valucs took
8. downward trend today. there bc!ng
if9 an,5.;on a'9nt,tak!nns in whe., ana
nn!sh "hea; showed a ne; loss o: J.. cent.
March 2aa: CORN vac OF "a. 10 &c. oats
we're down = to Auto. while provisions
thbSed range Of from :tsc lower TO &c
higher: Wheat started with u nrn under :
tone. but this soon lost because o.
bgJinE by cash houses and selling % The
iDcA! traders on the weakness In cash
Ti-in. Prices a. q whole averaged lover.
Do!uth MAS reported TO have sold sDj. 90
bushes q durum 10 the seaboaEd aud
come business VAS nut through the
EL1- rally OF NOR. than 10 points from
tar inside figure IN sterling exchange also
VAS factor.
Liquidation. was on In corn and oats,
~iu the deferred deliveries OF corn nd
All deliveries Of oats at new low ngurcl
on the crop. There Mas absence u
sSppott z coarse grain. EXCEPT t;oH,
on evening IN the Ear o: shorts for the
Weather :on1!t.1's over the c,rn b.I,
we're favorable fUE maturing the n=< ECO
and there was better domestic demand
for corn and oats deyeiopcd on the az
eHocs. Packers noEShi October lard and
saSh trade IN tina. commodity. continues
br:sk- Weakness in grains led to somC
se!!!ng and the range was lower.
Richmond times-dispatch. [volume] (Richmond, Va.) 1914-current, 1920-09-19

strength on tn" close was due 10 rumore
t,scsiN,d here, via cables TO Galveston. that
EnSiish coal strike had. been settled.
While these rumors were entirely CONTRARY
70 earlier reports they had marked effect
The opening advance carried the markc,
10 TO is points over tho close OF yesterday.
out IL was soon wiped out In a rather
general selling movement which increased
when the weather map gas drawn and
the forecast calling for fair weather in all
portions OF the cotton region. A. 'he
lowest levels prices were q 10 81 points
under the finals OF yesterday. October
then fell on 10 oC.tj =
The stcadiness on the first call was gem
crafty asCrtbed to the IncreaHed activity
anu steadlcr prices In the SPOT markets
Richmond times-dispatch. [volume] (Richmond, Va.) 1914-current, 1920-09-19
cDTrovSrED an,

NEW YORK. Sent; H-Dwhiie no. active.
cott3hs"cd Oh was sharply higher for for
ward months on urgent demand from be-
isstcl shorts and scant offerings. Near by
deliveries were inclined lower with lard
and cotton. ana closed IA to 20 points
lower. while other positions showed ne;
gains OF 10 = points. Sales. Too barrels.
/ iCont.nued on Eighth PageD
Richmond times-dispatch. [volume] (Richmond, Va.) 1914-current, 1920-09-19
RICHMOND LIVE STOCK MARKET.

Richmond Union Stock Yards
, richmond. Va. Sept. - .5l)
terarks: Very good run %! cattle. Mar
tsi Sttady on common and medium cattle
sNlotN good steers. ! 10 lbs II,
Richmond times-dispatch. [volume] (Richmond, Va.) 1914-current, 1920-09-19
CHICAGO LIVE STOCK MARKEr

CHICAGO. Sept S-Cattie: receipts p
80; compared with a week ago: good TO
r--: beef steers. - To +)C higher: Others
Richmond times-dispatch. [volume] (Richmond, Va.) 1914-current, 1920-09-19

hlEh.t: other and bulls steady: stockcr.
Ior.. rasc gs,%iS 20 20 70 h.sh.'.
20 ;6c hlrher' closing weak on heavy mixed
ana pdCHi:iH grades: Top. 1850. BULK Agh.
and butchers. !5IOn ~. 6u,k packing SOW.
~ W'a; plrE mostly PC lower.
SAscD: reCcipts. 100: COMPARED with
H-rH ago; western lambs and common 10
Ncfiu'n natives mostly steady. uatiy.
sanDs - = &c higher: wcthcrs steady TO
&c lower: ewes q 70 nc tower.
Richmond times-dispatch. [volume] (Richmond, Va.) 1914-current, 1920-09-19

bales a week ago and 1905 bales a yea
SPOT here Gu:et and unchanged at 3IC
'or iniddling: there were no sales
spot at New Orleans steady. with mid
hlns UNCHANGED at z5c: the sales wer.
Richmond times-dispatch. [volume] (Richmond, Va.) 1914-current, 1920-09-19

NEW ORLEANS Sept 1s-con.,derable
selling pressure was felt by the cotton
market Today. because OF the reported
conference IN an unfavorabie way and the
clear and dry weather over the belt but
on the opening there were advances and
again on the close the market had an
upward swing 10 II so that final quotations.
were points uD TO points down net