The sun. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1916-1920, 1919-08-20

stand in this or that sense, or do not so
understand?
The President-Yes, cir ordinarily.
Senator Knox-That would be a mat
ter that would require very little time to
consummate 1t II these constructions
have already been placed upon 1t in their
conversations with you?
The President-But an exchange OF
notes Is quite a different matter from
having II embodied In the resolution Of
ratification.
Senator Knox-If we embody In our
resolution OF ratification a statement that
we understand section 10 or section 16
or section something else In a particular
sense, and this Government, through its
Foreign Department. transmits the pro-
posed form of ratification to the cham
cellors OF the other nations that are con-
cerned in this treaty, and If those inter-
pretations are the same as you have
agreed upon with them In your CONVEX
satlons. do not see how we would need
anything more than a mere reply to that
effect.
Tho President-It would need conhr-
nation.
Senator Knox-Yes, 1t would need con-
firmation in that sense.
The President--My judgment Is that
the embodying of that In the terms Of
the resolution of ratification would be
/ acquiescence not only in the interpreta-
ton, but in the very phraseology of the
Interpretation, because 1t would form a
part of the contract.
! Senator Knox-It might with US, be-
cause we have so much machinery for
| dealing with treaties, but in other coun-
tries where it Is much more simple !
think 1t would not be.
Treated as Legislative Matter.
The President-It is simple legally,
| Senator, but, for example, this treaty
has been submitted to legislatures to
which the Government was not by law
obliged to submit 1t, and 1t is every
where being treated as a legislative mat
teri mean, SO far as the ratification
! IL concerned.
! Senator Knox-You mean in countries
where under their constitutions there
, are provisions that treaties ordinarily are
not submitted to the legislative branches
of the Government this treaty is being
so submitted?
| The President-So understand.
| Senator Knox--Where there are two
branches of the legislative department
an upper and a lower branch-do you
know whether 1t is being submitted to
both?
The PRESIDENT think not. SIR.
am not certain about that. but my men,
ory is II is not.
Senator Fall-Mr President the idea
! has struck me, and I have entertained
the view since reading the treaty and
the league. that Germany, having signed
the treaty. but not being yet member
OF the league. any reservations which we
might make here would be met by Ger
| q
| fusing TO Join the league. 1t would not
be submitted to her at all now. because
! she Is not a member Of the league. You
| catch the point?
The President-Yes, I differ with you
there. Senator. One OF the reasons for
putting the league in the treaty was that
Germany was not going to be admitted
to the league Immediately, and we felt
that It was very necessary that we
should get her Acknowledgements
| ceptance of the league as an interna'
tional authority-partly because we were
excluding her, so that she would there
after have no ground for questioning
| such authority as the league might eN-
ercise under its covenants.
Senator Fall-Precisely.
| The Observation-Disclosures ! think i
would be necessary for her to acquiesce
ir a league the powers of which were
differently construed.
Senator Fall-Well. Mr.. President, OF
course 1t is not my purpose to enter into
an argument, but we are here for In
formation. There are provisions for the
amendment Of the articles. Germany i:
out of the league. Any amendment pro
posed by the other members of the
league prior to her coming Into tho
league would not be submitted to her
would II, she not being a member?
The President will admit that thai
point had not occurred to me. No, she
would not.
Senator Fall-Then so far as we are
concerned we could make a recommends
ton in the nature OF an amendment
Senator Pittman-She has already
agreed by this treaty that she has signed
that the members may amend IT,
The President-Yes.
Senator Fali-prec!se!y, and we cSuIt
come in with any amendment.
Senator Hitchcock-Did I understand
your first reply to Senator Fall to b,
that Germany under this treaty already
had a relationship to the league by rca