The sun. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1916-1920, 1919-08-02
Indiana Senator Leaves White
House More Than Ever OPP
posed to Treaty.
AGREE ON RESERVATIONS
President Also Admits Reason
ableness in Opposition to
Shantung. '

senator watson (Ind. and learned that
the Hoosier Is irnmovable in his insis-
tence that the League of Nations cove
nant cannot be ratified unless specific
and effective reservations are made in
regard to t.
AT times" said the Senator afterward
in describing the interview. I'VE became
30 enthusiastic that each had to laugh
at the earnestness of the other"
Mr.. Watson declared he had enjoyed
the interview thoroughly. though 1t had
left him II anything stronger than ever
in opposition to the league In its present
form. At the outset he paid his COM
pliments to the President on the loyalty
and zeal Of Bernard NJ. Baruch. chief
economic adviser to the American COM
mission In Paris. Messrs Watson and
Baruch are personal friends.
Senator Watson told the President
that IL they were going to get anywhere
In their conversation 1t was necessary
that they be frank. 81 want to inform
you. Mr.. President, that cannot vote
for this treaty unless very definite and
effective reservations are made which
protect the interests of the United
States" he said.
Not an Internatfona1ist.
Senator Watson said he was not in
any sense an internationalist that he
was a believer in nationalism and espe-
cially the nationalism OF the United
states. Referring to the Presidents
speech presenting the treaty Of peace to
the Senate. he said:
'Mr. President. there was one sentence
In your speech which Just raised me up
on tiptoe and aroused a feeling of the
most intense opposition TO your position.
That was the sentence in which you
spoke of the necessity for entering this
combination no matter what the cost
might be in independent thought and
action"
That sentence. in my opinion. ex-
pressed clearly doctrine of internation-
aiism."
President Wilson then denied that he
was an internationalist and asked that
Senator Watson not Judge him by one
sentence.
you are such master OF English" re-
piled Mr.. Watson, that l assumed that
you used these words TO mean what they
said"
The President laughingly rejoined that
possibly he was not so accurate In his
choice Of words as most people commonly
believed.
Favcrs Three Reservations.
Continuing the discussion of the reser-
vations Senator Watson found that the
President did not oppose at least three
of the reservations which he himself re-
garded as essential. The President Is.
tion on Article Y. He said that the in
depreciation of this article which the
Senator's desire to make is the interpre-
tation commonly placed on the article
by the other nations.
Then IL that is so. Mr.. President, why
not make II very clear that this is the
meaning of the article by declaring that
to be the understanding Of the United
States and asking the other nations to
accept that understanding as part of the
agreement asked Watson.
Then the President said in effect that
" this were done every other nation
would pick out this word and that word
and make a reservation In regard to their
understanding of what 1t meant.
Would Not Sacrifice U. s.
Senator Watson said he did not believe
American interests ought to be sacrificed
to prevent other nations from declaring
their understanding of the league.
To this the President replied that IL
such thing happened the whole winter
would be taken UP with the effort to
have the league ratified.
The Indiana Senator said he did not
think little delay would hurt the
eventual effectiveness OF the league.
That would be very well. the Presi-
dent answered, were It not for the dan
ger that some OF the European nations
would break down before the agreement
could be completed. II the League of
Nations is once established, the Presi-
dent said, these nations can be taken
care OF and held up.
.'Mr. President" said Watson in re-
ply. ~ believe our strength has been
due to our absolute independence of all
others and / believe we can help the
others more by remaining strong our
selves than by weakening ourselves In a
vain attempt to hold them up. / be-
lieve our effectiveness in the war and all
that you were able to accomplish in the
peace conference were the results of the
strong and independent position occupied
by the United States"
Worry over Russia.
The President partly agreed with this
statement. but again urged conditions in
Europe as the reason why the Senate
should Immediately ratify the league
without reservations. A little later the
Russian situation was mentioned, and
the President said worry over Russia oc-
cupied much Of the attention of the peace
conference, and IL was finally taken by
consent that Russia should be left to
work out her own salvation.
II believe that the other nations will
have to be left to work out their own
salvation with our friendly aid" an
swered Mr.. Watson.
The Shanturg situation was discussed
with equal frankness. The matter came
up when Watson said there was one pro-
vision of the treaty which he could never
vote for even II all else were satisfac-
tory.
The President smiled and said the de-
scription fitted Shantung He gave Sem
ator Watson to understand that he him
self did not like the Shantung arrange
ment, but Chat before II was concluded
the japanese made certain concessions a
copy of which 10 in the possession OF the
President. He repeated TO Senator Wat
son what he has told other Senators. to
the effect that unless Japan sees At soon
to make this matter clear that he him.
self will be compelled to divulge the
terms of these concessions.
CANADIAN MINISTER RETIRES.