New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1919-02-23

came, though the Kaiser, the
Crown Prince and Hindenburg had
made 700 pounds Of pork.
he had seen was when his own suit
case was looted.
But all that sort of thing wa:
greatly exaggerated, anyhow he cx
planned. "There was not one Ameri
can struck by bullet, so far as car
learn, and most of those who tell oil
their hairbreadth escapes came out il
an international sleeper"
He admitted that Americans hae
been unjustly thrown into jail.
He went at length into the handi-
caps of the Soviets The property
owners had practiced sabotage, he de-
cared, and said one American had
boosted that when he came out he had
left the factory in such condition
that 1T could not be used for three
months They had flooded the mines
destroyed machinery. and done every
thing possible TO prevent the Soviets
maintaining Industries.
Some of the Difficulties
He summed up the difficulties as
consisting of the sabotage referred
to- the wine pogroms, of which John
Reed told Yesterday, to demoralize
and disorganize the Soviet forces; the
boycott of the Soviets by the intellect
ual classes; the eXcommunication by
the Russian church, because the So
wet had withdrawn the state support
OF the church; the trcachcry OF the
Germans; the systematic boycott by
the French and British governments
and plottings attempts at corrupting
hn
by the Allied diplomats
He promised details of what the So
vets have accomplished in spite of
these handicaps when he appears on
Monday
But against this" he said. eve
have this: Maxim Gorky stated that
history will hold up its hands in
wonder at the achievements OF the
SoViets Cor art and culture, and Lloyd
George has declared that the Soviet
had strong and growing army"
Tie had never run into the Ger
man influence personally, Williams
said, but it undoubtedly existed He
had the greatest confidence in Trot-
zky's moral integrity. He admitted
that the revolutionary tribunals
probably tried people without their
being present, but he said he under
stood this was only during the time
of counter revolution. He also admit
ted drastic suppression of opposition
papers at this time. Senator VOL
colt brought up the question of free
speech.
Il recognize that government has
Tie right to suppress speech and VIII
ing which advocate violent revolution .
Williams said. But should hope our
own government, and the Soviet GOV
eminent, too, would be IN so strong a
POSITION and so warmly supported by
their people that there would be no
need of even that limitation; that any
one who advocated such collse would
be laughed out Of court.
II and most of the people who cali
themselves agitators are quite as anX-
iOus as you gentlemen here to avoid
violence. But We only regard these
things as symptoms, and we think 'hat
instead of trying to suppress the symr-
toms you should get down to the root
cf the disease"
Explains the Red Flag
Senator Overman asked Williams
about the red flag. He admitted that
it was an Indictment TO violence in this
country, because of the attitude Of the
public toward it, but denied that it
carried any such idea in the minds
Of those who used 1t.
you mean" asked Senator Wolcott
that it depends on what is in the
minds of the people carrying it They
may be orderly Socialists or violent
revolutionists"
COR Harvard boys" interrupted Mr.
Williams, "but l don't think it makes
bit of difference whether it is sup
pressed or not so far as the forward
movement in this country is concerned
There are other things that can be
used as symbols. And all European
Socialists have the right to use it,"
II entirely agree with YOU" replied
Senator Wolcott There is nothing tt
be gained by suppressing symbols,
Senator Overman agreed, too.
Mr.. Williams was questioned abou
the l. w. W but said he knew littl,
about it. He had never supported it
but had not opposed it, as he under
stood it was not advocating violence
He did not approve Of its refusal tt
use the political means at hand for re
form. He was asked whether ne knew
Of any anarchists in this country
Eyes" he said, ~ have spoken befor,
city clubs and other organizations ane
heard people say that the only way t,
treat the radicals was to string then
up or shoot them down These were
mcr who believe in ruthless, ilega
J methods. ! call them anarchists il
! nirht placcs "