The sun. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1833-1916, 1913-06-26


question with him. as to his unwilling
ness to hold a conversation with q man
who declined to give his name
II am not able to state now whether
or not this man mentioned I.auterbach's $
name In that conversation. At all vents
he wanted to discuss with Cravaih the
question of employing counsel who
would be helpful at Washington. and
when Cravath repeated the convers, tion
tn me | stated to CraNath that II was
evidently another EFFORT to secure the
employment Of Mr.. l.auterbach.
so ! am uncertain. as | say. whet' er
this gentleman who spoke to Crava h
mentioned I.auterbachs name ,r
whether 1t was mentioned by me In the
converse tion. I know | mentioned II in
responding to Cravath that this was an
other effort Of several that had been
made to secure l.auterbach employ
ment"
Cut on the COnVersa lion.
Mr. Cravath. the Judge said. declined
to proceed with the conversation be-
cause the man would not give his name.
He continued:
"A few days later he called Cravath
again and persisted in his efforts to urge
lnt eHpIONlueHl. AZ tHdi tiUc,
! am quite sure. the name of l.auterbach.
but still refusing to give his name.
Some time later otto X. Kahn to whom
referred just now. reported other visits
from time to time from Mr.. Iauterbach.
In which Mr.. I.auterbach renewed the pre-
d'ct.ons Of trouble, as he expressed IL. at
Washington and on Monday. before the
statement 10 which you referred was Is
sued by me- Mr.. Kahn reported to me that
Mr.. Lauterbach had said in substance that
motion was about to be made, ] think
in the House .. Representatives. TO op-
pose this proposed dissolution or disposi-
ton OF the stock of the Southern Pacific
which was held by the Union Pacific. and
that 1t probably would also involve re-
opening OF the money trust inquiry |
think. and some other matter that had
been more or less discussed. | was more
concerned In what he said about the Union
Pacific matter than about these others
that were mentioned in the conversation
=. If YOU can remember what the
others were we would like TO have that
A. The money trust was one and the
financing of the Chicago and Alton in
1901 or 1902 was another. | do not re-
call any other that was mentioned
.. All right. sir, 20 ahead. A. Now he
said at that time that the radical party
as he called them. Or the radical faction
We're about to commence these efforts and
that they were going to make a point
about common banking control. i do
not think. however. should undertake to
give the conversation in detail know
those matters were referred to and ne
mentioned some Of the congressman who
would lead in this and indicated that he
might be very helpful in the matter and
that his services were available IL de-.
sired.
Y. Did he state what Congressmen they
Were \. Why Congressman Henry OF
Texas was mentioned as the leader OF the
radical faction. as ne called 1t. | should
like to state in that connection. however.
that | have known Congressman Henry
for great many Years and | never be
ieved for a moment that there was any
connection between this gentleman and
Congressman Henry.
Kahn Reported to Loveu.
Il had had several interviews with
Mr.. Kahn" added T.ovett moment later
1T was subject frequently discussed
between us that as l.auterbach would
call on Kahn to discuss these matters
with him Kahn always promptly de
Clined to entertain the suggestion. say
ing that IL was useless to discuss them
But as chairman Of the executive COM
mittee he reported To me what was said. "
What others We're mentioned in this
matter as having influence in Con-
gress"" asked Chairman Overman.
Il ,hinl<.you had better ask Mr. Kahn
about that" said the witness II know
that he mentioned Congressman Henry
and do not know what other Congress
men he mentioned"
=. Did he mention any other lawyers
or lobbyists or people OF influence who
could influence Congress a No not that
4
| with Mr l.auterbach about II at all myself
| on the subject OF course We all of us
had opinions. None of us believed that
, there was any fOunda tion for the reported
influence. but We had opinions as to Others
| being connected with the plan to secure
| money by means ~ alleged legal employ
| ment. but those were the only direct con.
versations.
Get Many Commu nica tioms.
= Did YOU have any conversation with
anybody else about anybody trying to get
| employment for the purpose OF influencing
Congress directly or indirectly" A. Not
in connection with any Congressional work
| In large matter Of this sort involving
| l26.OOo,00O In stocks to be disposed Of
| OF cours. scarcely a day. certainly not a
| week. passes when | have not had COM
| munications from somebody Offering II so.
| luton of the problem. Sometimes W. got
| dozens day and very often they seem
| TO be purely In the interest of public good
but more frequently those who offer them
| expect consideration. have had nc
others purporting to be in a position to
exert influence.
! a. You have not been approached by
any Congressman or ex-Congressman di.
| rectly or indirectly A. Not by any Con.
1 gresham or ex-Congressman directly oi
| indirectly so far as know except in the
| case ] have mentioned
will you kindly indicate to us whaI
YOU mean by common banking con,
| trol?' asked Senator Walsh There
was charge, ! understand, that II was
intended to have a common bankins
control"
IL was dealing more with the use OF
| that expression in the public press ant
in newspaper publication about tina
time" replied the witness. Il supposed
II was intended to convey the impres
sion that seems to he general, and ye
frequently erroneous. that certai!
group or differen, groups Of banker,
cOntrH different systems OF railroad
and II Is said that it was d deep lai,
! scheme for Kuhn, Loeb e. CO.. who wer,
generally recognized as bankers for th'
Union Pacific, To get control Of TN
, Pennsylvania. the Union Pacific. tn,
Southern Pacific and the Baltimore an,
Ohio and have a common control o
these lines through Arm of ba mixers
| q. That In to saw sustain about tn