New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1913-01-24


conduct of banking affairs in European
countries. Mr. Untermyer insisted that
England. France and Germany pre-
vented control of banks through in
terlocking directorates
Talk about concentration, why, We
haven't even started in this country, as
compared with the European nations"
was Mr.. Davison's reply to this state
ment.
Mr.. Dawson said he saw no objection
assets. IF the public thought ii de-
sirable." but he was opposed to any
law that would force banks 10 make
public lists Of their stockholders.
Doesn't Favor Holding Companies.
DO YOU favor the principle Of con-
trolling concerns through holding com
panies?" asked Mr.. Untermyer.
Generally speaking said Nj. Davi-
son, Il have prejudice against hold
ing companies"
Most of the companies your firm has
organized have been holding companies,
have they not? asked Mr. Untermyer.
Yes said Mr.. Dawson. and in this
respect | want to qualify my opinion.
on general principles | don't believe
in holding companies but think there
are circumstances which make hold
ing company the best means OF hand
ling the situation
DO YOU believe three or four or half
\ dozen men should be allowed to
mOnopolize any industry. So long as
they do not operate through holding
company
i don't know how you could prevent
il if they had the financial backing and
the ability 10 do it," asserted Mr.. Davi-
son. II have no objection to it, If it
was wrong it couldn't live. l see no
necessity for a law TO prevent it. 1t
| would fall Of itself in the making.
Are you opposed 10 trusts asked
Mr.. Untermyer
II would not say that / was wholly
was not opposed TO them after they
were made. | think they were a great
blessing TO the country.
Court Interference Bad
Mr.. Dawson said he thought it was
unfortunate for the people Of the en-
tire world that the courts interfered
with the trusts. as they have done"
DO you think il was wrong for the
courts to interfere" Mr.. Cntermyer
asked.
NO, but | think it could have been
approached better from the other dl-
rection-by regulation, not disintegra-
tion. You cannot any more dissolve
those trusts in effect, than you can
move this continent across the Atlantic
Ocean
MIR. Dawson said he believed a law
forcing banks in reserve cities TO be in
dependent, and forbidding combinations
through interlocking directors would
set us back fifteen years"
Before Mr.. Dawson testified state
ment Of the deposits Of j. z. Morgan 81
co. was produced. showing that the
firm on November |. 1912, had 81 900
900 on deposit with New York banks
and S6OO.Uo IN Boston banks. Mr..
Untermyer tried to get from Thomas
w. Joyce. an employee OF the firm. the
holdings of -. =. Morgan in the con-
stituent companies which were COM
bined in the United States Steel Cor
poration. Mr.. Joyce could not remem-
Der whether any such stock was held
Mr.. Dawson then testified that he
negotiated the purchase of the stock in
the Guaranty Trust Company for the
organizers Of the voting trust for the
trust COMPANY George F. Baker. he
said, had nothing 10 do with the nego-
tiations Mr.. Baker was at that time
connected with both the Mutual and
the Guaranty Trust. Purchases Of 5000
shares from Mrs. r., II. Hartman and
5000 from the Mutual Life Insurance
Company, Mr.. Dawson said, gave the
organizers control Of 1900 out of the
10000 shares of the company.
Voting Trust Worked We'll.
Mr.. Dawson said the Guaranty Trust
Company was acquired by himself and
his associates with the idea that it
would be merged into the Bankers
Trust Company. He made this state
ment as TO the voting trust agreements:
I'VE younger men organized the
Bankers Trust Company in 1903, and
at that time we organized the voting
trust. The purpose of this voting trust
was to preclude the possibility Of the
purchase of the control of the stock by
men active in New York at that time
whose credit and responsibility were
questioned. When we came to plan to
take in the Guaranty company the vot
ing trust had worked so well in the
Bankers Trust we organized the Guar
anty under the same plan also that IL
night easily be taken over
MIR. Untermyer brought out that sew
erai organizers Of the Bankers Trust
were widely known bankers sixty or
seventy years old,
On this question Of voting trusts