New-York tribune., 1912-03-17
DISCUSS CHURCH FUTURE
Cardinal Gibbons Says Religion
Is Now on the Decline.
BLAMEs PUBLIC SCHOOLS
Bishop Greer, on Other Hand,
Tells Republican Club Faith
Is Advancing.

The question Of whether religious faith
vas declining in the United States and II
So how II would affect the life Of the Re
public was discussed at the Republican
Clubs luncheon Yesterday by several
speakers. including Bishop David II. Greer.
the Rev. John F Carson Moderator Of me
Presbyterian General Assembly; Fred r.
Smith, chairman OF the Men and Religion
Forward Movement. the Rev. Or. Nehemiah n
Roynton. Moderator Of the National Coun-
ell of Congregs tional Churches, Or. Ru-
dolph Grossman. rabbi of the Temple Ro-
doph Sholom; the Rev. Edward Gregory
Fitzgerald and the Rev Walter Laid'aw.
Cardinal Gibbons had been invited ~ the
luncheon, but he was unable 70 attend
because Of III health. He sent lettAr.
however. in which he expressed his col
viction that religion was declining and that
the non-religious character of public school
training was ono Of tho prime causes. His
letter 70 Andrew r Humphrey, chairman
of tho discussions committee Of the club.
was as follows:
beg to acknowledge the receipt of your
esteemed favor Of the fth Inst, by whlch
you extend 10 me an invitation IN address
the SATURDAY, Discussions Assembly Of the
Republican Club of New J ork on the sub
ject is Religious Faith Declining in the
United States2"
While assure YOU It would be for me
real pleasure 10 accept this kind invitation
do so: for the last two weeks ] have been
under the care Of physician on account
of an attack Of the grin. and do NOT teel
as II 7 should run the risk Of journey
to New York
In regard to the subject above referred
to-, as I mentioned to you during our talk
on the 7th Of February, | fear that we are
all forced 10 admit that in certain sense.
there Is a decline OF religious faith in TINS
country for va SEQ evidences Of II on sll
sides There is nothing 50 sacred as not 70
be denied hy someone In regard 70 mat
ters Of religion, We SOC I'm an ever increas-
Ing number great deal Of indiferentism.
What arc the causes Of this | feel that
Il is largely due 10 the want Of respect tor
the Sacred scriptures 10 wor,diinesI me rr,n 10
ciple of authority, 10 the inordinate love or
wealth, pleasure and honors and lastly 10
our system Of education. according 10 WhICh
the education of the school must be inde-
pendent of religion. These. and others too
numerous to mention, are, TO my mino
the cause of such cligious'lndiherentisnl ~
this country.
Bishop Greer. on tho other hand, said
that he would like to refrain" III" discus
sion so that tho subject should read is r"-
ligious faith advancing, ard If So what are
the causcs?" lie said:
This "a A large question and 2 vital ono
Personally I do not believe that renglon'
faith is declining. ! heliev" church mem.
bership is increasing, de~plt" "hat II S''n
20 the contrary 49,,
What is IL that draws tho people into
the church to-day? l. II purely r"nS,ouH
faith? How much discount must we a',9N
for social reasons and other reasons! We
must study other documents than fh"Se
that simply give us statistical figures on
th' attendance in church. Th" sl,us,ion
docs not show that II the church Attendance
is Increased thai tie interest in religious
faith IL increased.
Th. greatest document 70 must NiudN rs
the political document II - SAID ina
sooner or later all political questions be
como social questions and that social qu"N-
tons sooner or later hecom. religious gnes
'iopS The whole trend or our s"ciaI ana
political life IS toward m" bett"rmenf Of So
cicty AZ large That T. the tendency. Bu'
We must not stop AZ this tendency WHY
must We be interested In the heit"rm"i'
~ society Tho very fact that such sub
ie"t is on the programme Of this political
club shows that political questions are be
coming social and religious questions. The
answer IS that We have FOUND. or must
sooncr or later hnd. that no matter what
tho question r. We cannot keep God ont "t
ary document or manuscript.
Fred r Smith. who followed Bishop
Greer. said that the best evidence that
religion vas not declining vas the fact
that II was put on the programme ot the
club for discussion. The other speakers
also took the stand that religious interest
was Increasing. although Dr. Grossman ad-
mitted that many Jews were ueglecting the
ceremonial and tho ritual for the ethical
and the spiritual
Among those present were Henry 'le"s;
George " Uinmlu of chicago. Colonel
George h Sellers. General lanes Grant
Wilson. General Frederick -. Grant Lean
der r. Chamberlain. tho Rev Thomas X
William II. Foulkcs. Louis I. Corsa. Mayor
George r. Lunn socialist Mayor Of Sche-
rectady: William Jay SchciNelin and Law
renee Abbott. editor Of The OUTLOOK.