New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1912-07-11
Witnesses Called to Prove Basis
of Fact Behind Contention
State Terms FanCiful.
OLCOTT TESTIFIES TO PLAN
He Says All Parties in Case Had
Understanding That Mattea-
wan Was Best Place for
Whites Slayer.

Inc Stdte SleE- nav llbu anu NlliNi' wv
states alienists testified Were indicative
of paranoia Thaws counsel. Clarence j.
Shearn. interrupted the examination of the
Thaw alienists to call lay witnesses to
prove that certain OF these alleged delu-
sions were founded on fact
The states forces have emphasized
throughout the proceedings the impor-
lance of considering two focal delusions in
forming the opinion TO Thaws mental
instability One was that he imagined
that his own lawyers, his ahenists, wealthy
friends of Stanford White and the District
Attorneys office. following his arrest for
shooting White. were parties to a con-
spiracy to railroad him to MatteaWan with
out a trial. so that the practices OF Nmte
and some Of his friends might be sup
dressed. The other delusOn was that
Thaw considered his great mission in lie
was to rescue and protect young girls from
q hand of rich degenerates, among Whom
he included White.
Judge William NJ. X. Olcott who was
first retained by Thaw 10 take charge OF
his case. was called as a witness by MI
sbearn. and testified that there had been an
understanding among all the interests in
the case that the best thing to do was 10
have a commission appointed for Iha"'
with the probable result that he would nave
been committed TO MatteaWan without ue-
ing tried for shooting White. Judge Olcott
was later discharged by Thaw because ne
persisted in believing that Thaw was IN
sane at the time.
Comstock a Thaw Witness
Anthony Comstock. of the Society for the
Prevention of Vice. testified that Thaw had
come to him in February. 1904, with COM
nlaints about White and other men, ana
that he had delegated agents of the society
IN watch White He said that before they
were able TO get any legal evidence against
White the latter vacated his apartment IN
D.b street where Thaw maintained some
of the orgies took place. Mr. ComstocK
said Thaw appeared entirely rational at the
time. and was apparently actuated Dy SIN
cere motives in wanting to run down lia'
particular form Of vice.
Mr. Shearn asked Judge Olcott II the eX-
animation of Thaw by hostile alienists IN
the library Of the District Attorneys once
Two DAYS after the shooting was made with
his consent The witness said it was
Did YOU have a talk with Delaney
Nicol and Lewis Delaneld about Thaw
going 10 Matteawan without trial. asked
Mr.. Shearn.
The question Of a privileged communica-
ton between counsel and client arose. ana
Mr.. Olcott explained at length his position
sn in che aIi5mEu TO me GoutI u
said that word had come TO him from Mr..
Nicoll, who represented the White family,
that it's members would be glad If the trial
did not take place, to avoid the consequent
scandal and publicity. He said he was
gratified to hear that there would be no OPP
position from that source to the course he
considered best for his clients interests
namely, to have him committed to Mattea-
wan.
II didn't understand whether the witness
said that Mr.. Nicoll represented Mp
Whites family or his friends at the time"
said William T. Jerome Special Deputy At
torney General.
Il am under the impression that it was
both" said Judge Olcott
Mr.. shearn asked the witness If he had
consented 10 Thaws examination by hostile
auenists I'm the District Attorneys office
only because ne had had the assurance
from the Distdict Attorney that he would
not oppose the plan to send Thaw 10 Mat
teawan.
After searching my memory very care
fully on that point" replied Judge OlcOtt,
Il know that ] had the impression then,
and have il now that all interests would
be satisfied II Thaw was sent to Mattea-
wan, because Whites family and friends
would be glad 10 avoid the scandal and
publicity Of a trial"
Lawyer Thought Him Crazed.
Mr. Shearu read from long statement
prepared for him by Judge Ocott in 1910
in regard 70 these matters and sir Jerome
scored a point by getting the statement in
evidence In il Judge OlCott told of how
irrational and irresponsible Thaw appeared
to him when he went TO see him in he
Tombs after his arrest.
"Thaw refused to discuss the case and
said he had plan Of defence well mapped
out and would speak about it when the
proper time came" the statement read.
He spoke TO Judge Olcott in most per-
.emptory manner as If speaking TO meni-
al and ordered him 10 send Evelyn, his
wife. TO the Tombs TO see him. Judge OIL
colt went away believing Thaw TO be in
sane, and to be rather proud of what ne
had DONE as II he had performed COM
8 mendable act in killing White
on cross examination by Mr.. Jerome the
witness said he had never entered into any
agreement with any one to send Thaw TO
Matteawan TO suppress the debaucherics
Assistant District Attorney Garvan was
the one who had given him assurance that
his plan to have Thaw committed would
not be opposed Mr. Jerome was away on
q fishing trip at the time.
Two other alienists testified yesterday
that they had examined Thaw and found
him entirely normal. with not even trace
of constitutional inferiority," as one Of
the Thaw alienists testified the day before
The witnesses were Dr. William A. White
superintendent Of the government hospital
for the insane at Washington, and DR..
Charles X. Mills. professor of psychiatry
ct the University Of Pennsylvania They
contended that Thaw had explained salts
factorily the basis for his acts and writ
inRs which had been interpreted as delu-
sions coincident with paranOia by the alien
lists for the state.
Mr.. Shearn had not completed his direct
examination of Or. Mills when court ad-
tourned for the day. Justice Keogh said
he was anxious to finish with all the testi-
mony in the case to-day. Mr.. Shearn said
he would he through with DR.. Mills in half
an hour more, and had subpPnaed all mis-
lay witnesses for to-day. Mr.. Jerome said
his cross-examination OF witnesses would
be short Justice Keogh announced that
he would hold court until o'clock, IL nee
essary, to finish with the testimony Both