The Washington herald., 1909-01-31

tal1t Sitc same exposure ana tle same
inhalation would have nc greater effect
IA producing poisoning and death In the
case OF the gas containing = per cent
or per cent than with the gas con-
; tanning 10 per cent?
Mr.. Forstai-That is not my eonten-
ton. The same exposure is more danger
Gus with carburetted water gas than II
IS With coal gas. But. as ! said. and as
everybody who has Investigated this sub
lect mas concluded, practically the length
OF exposure is sufficient with the least
. dangerous gas 10 produce death. Taking
your smile. a man can drink enough
OF the liquid containing 10 per cent of
alcohol 20 get just as drunk as he could
possibly get BY drinklnk the liquid con-
tanning - per cent Of alcohol He gets
enough OF the gas containing 10 per cent
Of carbon mOnoxide 10 kin him, and that
IS as Far as you can 60 with a gas con-
tanning 30 per cent.
Sir. Sims-With coal gas containing >
per cent Of carbon H0noxide. and then
with water gas containing > per cent
OF carbon monOxide. what would be the
relative periods Of exposure necessary TO
produce death with those gases
Mr.. Forstail-It would be pretty hard
to say what the relative periods would
be. but there is no question but the man
would be killed by tie 3 per cent carbon
monoxide gas in a shorter time than he
would by the 5 per cent carbon monoxide
gas.
Mr. Sims-Then how do you arrive at
the conclusion that as a rule all ex-
posures are practically the same length Of
time so as to bring about practically the
same result7
Ar. Forstail-I do NOT think I stated
that. II ! did. 1 did not intend 10. What
have tried 10 express is this. There are
I any number OF cases that are nOnfatal.
do DOT now whether any record is kept
here in the District OF thOse cases
did not run across any such record, but
such record is kept by the Msssachu-
sets gas and electric commission. and
there are any number Of cases OF ex-
posture 10 gas where the people are made
unconscious and are taken out and finally
recover. and those cases occur both with
I coal gas and with carburetted water gas.
but in the cases that are fatal. investi-
CATION has shown that the exposure has
been Of sufficient length 10 nave killed
with the coal gas. As Mr. Murphy said
yesterday-and he supplied me with a
smile that I have been looking for for
week-the difference IN the effect Of the
two gases practically is the difference
between being shot with q revolver and
being shot with a rife, both IN the hands
OF good marksman, al the distance OF
six feet
Mr.. Sims-Supposing that Washington
City-if you could make such a SUPPOSE
tien-was without gas, and that you knew
the size Of the city and It's requirements,
and there was a bill before US 70 author
lie either the manufacture OF coal gas
exclusively OF the manufacture Of car
buretted water EaS-lOOking alone 10 the
possibilities OF injury 10 health and life
which would you recommend he adopted.
Il that was before you ss an independent
and original proposition?
Mr.. FoTstall-Entirely independent Of
any economic considerations?
Mr. SimS-TeS. from the standpoint Of
exposure and its consequent danger.
eliminating all question OF the cost -
manufacture or the cost OF the existing
plant
Mr.. Forstali-If I had not looked into
the subject as much as I have and did
not know as much as do. I think l
would probably recommend the c1ai gas:
but having looked into il. I DO not think
there is materially any difference
Mr.. Sims-SDeaking from your own
knowledge. and what you know about il.
II II was an original proposition. ynu
think there is practically such little
difference in The evil results that YOU
would not recommend the one OF the
other so far as accidents 70 health and
life are concerned?
Mr.. Forstall-I do aot think I would
make any recommendation against either
under those circumstances
Mr.. Sims-Having a water gas plant IN
operation here. and considering the pos
sibiiitiss entsiled Of increased cost and
increased capitalization. appreneud
you would certainly not advocate the
passage Of the present billg
Mr.. FOrstall-Oh. certainly. have been
instrumental in starting several CaTDu-
retted water gas plants myself. you
know. I should not have done It II I
had thought there was any Increased
danger 20 the user.
Mr.. Sims-There has been a tendency
in the last ten years. has there not, to
decrease the use Of water gas BY the
cities generally
Mr.. FOrstall-T think. without there
being anything that can be characterized
as a tendency. that probably in the last
ten years the amount OF coal gas dis
tributed has increased. because I have
seen statistics prepared twelve or If
teen years ago which showed that OF the
total amount Of gas distributed in the
United States % per cent was csrburetteG
water gas. while the Geological Survey
returns now show that 8 per cent only
is carbuTetted water gas. 50 that relative
y the amount OF coal gas has increased.
or rather the amount OF earburetted
water gas has decreased Actually alb
Soiutely. there is more carburetted water
gas being distributed to-day Than there
was ten years ago The actual amount
Of carburetted water gas Is more than
II was. but relatively 20 the total amount
Of gas distributed. / should say il was
probably q little smaller. The reason
for that is that during that time there
have been quite few coke oven plants
built. IN which by the manufacture Of
coke for metallurgical purposes quite a
large amount OF gas is recovered for
sale and the number Of those coke oven
Enthusiastically the one at Everett, near
Boston. and the one al the Maryland
Steel COmpany's plant ar Sparrows
Point, near Baitinore-are so located that
they can sell their gas 10 the companies
in the large cities. and the use Of that
gas, which is coal gas, has increased the
amount Of coal gas without the gas com
panies erecting any plants for its manu-
facture
Mr SimS-The fact that carbon mo-
noxide is a poisonous gas is not a new
discovery
Mr.. Forstail-No.
Mr. Sims-And It has been generally
well known
Mr. Forstall-It has been known ever
since have known anything about It.
Mr.. Sims-FoT number Of yeers7
Mr.. FOTstall-And I do not know how
long before that
Mr. Sims-As you have knowledge on
this subject, tell me. as a general rule
do mayors of municipalities or commits
sioners, where We have commissioners OF
cities, know about this: are they ac-