The Salt Lake herald. [volume] (Salt Lake City [Utah]) 1870-1909, 1909-08-04
ASYLUM DOCTOR
DECLARES THAW
IS NOW INSANE
Continued from Page 1.

signs of paranOia during his first three
months at Matteawan, under Mr.. Nor
schauser's examination today, ne
declared he could not remember ever
having made such a statement. He ad
mitted ne might have said il.
The story of Thaw's life at the asy-
lum continued. The witness said the
patient was allowed to stay up until s
p. IN. until his first sanity hearing at
Poughkeepsie. After his return he was
forced to 90 to his room and put out
the lights an hour earlier, He arose at
about a. IN.
Mr.. Morschuaser went after the wit
ness, aided by a memorandum prepared
with the assistance of his client last
night.
Did you ever tell Mr.. Thaw," he
asked that there was nothing the
matter with his brain?"
mo. sir
Sent to Bed Early.
Did you ever say TO him that you did
not believe ia souls?"
Il cannot remember"
DR.. Baker said the patient had been
sent to bed an hour earlier because he
had persistently violated the rules
against smoking in the visitors room.
Mr. MOrschauser tried to show that
the witness had testified only to such
statements and acts of Thaw as might
point to insanity.
The witness admitted having said at
the POughkeepsie sanity hearing that in
Thaw's case the diagnosis of maniac
Oppressive insanity had never been es-
tablished. On that occasion he was
asked whether or not he would certify
Thaw as insane from his personal OBJ
serVation, aside from the Stanford
MI. fa1a T1ea 70
peated today, was that on several Oc-
casiOns Thaw had shown bad judg-
ment." He then admitted that under
such circumstances he might hesitate
about committing the prisoner to an
asylum.
confers With Client.
During this part of the examination
Mr.. Morschauser conferred with his
client before almost every question.
Thaw, however. never interrupted or
volunteered advice. At least three
quarters of the statements attributed to
the witness by Thaw were denied by
the former when the crOss-eXaminatiOn
was had Mr.. MOrschauseT was con-
stantly baffled by such answers as Il
don't know" I cannot remember" Il
cannot TecOlleCt just what was said.
DR.. Baker told Mr.. Jerome that when
he expressed his opinion regarding
Thaw's freedom from paranoia that he
had not had a clinical record of the
case. He explained that taking clothes
from paTanOiac patients at night was
a general rule to prevent them injuring
themselves.
The witness said he had seen no
change in Thaws mental condition
since Judge Morschauser's decision at
PoUghkeepsie declaring him insane.
IA. "a
about Matteawan's concert, alleged to
have been arranged for the purpose of
showing up" Thaw before the alien
lists. The witness admitted that he had
given orders not to let Thaw know of
this affair in advance, but denied that
he had invited several newspaper men
to attend so that they might observe
Thaw.
Dr. Flint said that before Evelyn
Thaw testified against her husband at
the first week of the hearing she hac
volunteered before him and counsel TO
give any information they wanted.
Dr. William Hirsch followed DR..
Flint. He called Thaw a degenerate
pranois and incurable."
Is True Paranoiac.
Mr.. Jerome called Dr. Austin Flint to
the stand. The district attorney re-
minded the court InaL all OF the IOuF-
teen alienists called at the second trial
agreed that Thaw was insane when he
killed White. Where the seven experts
differed with the alenists for the pros
ecution was in regard to the nature Of
his lunacy. The latter cOntended that
Thaw understood the criminal nature Of
his act. The physicians who testified
for the defense held that, while Thaw
had knowledge, it was insane knOwl-
edge" and he was unable to control
himself.
ct imagine that distinction is not Of
much consequence here said Justice
Mills Mr.. Jerome agreed to this.
Dr. Flint was shown Thaw's notes
containing suggestions to Attorney Del
mas and various other bits of the pris-
oner's writings. Considering these facts
and exhibits. DR.. Flint said he thought
ThaW was now insane-a true paranOiac-
The witness described paranOia. An
swering Jerome's query as to whether
or not a paranOiac was dangerous TO be
at large, DR.. Flint said.
"A prosecuted paranoiac is the most
81.