New-York tribune., 1909-04-25
DISCUSS SUNDAY BARS
PLEAS FOR And AGAINST.
Brough Bill Supporters Ans5cer Op-
pOnentS at Citu Club Luncheon.

pOftC HLo W SttH StuO <-UiCtNN'e'
The Rev. DR.. John P. Peters and other support
ers of the Brough-Spieberg bill advocated by the
Committee of Fourteen. which permits saloons to
be open on Sunday during certain hours, answered
the arguments of their opponents yesterday at the
weekly luncheon of the City Club. There were
seven speakers at the luncheon. but when it was
over and general discussion began it was obvious
that the arguments Of neither side had moved the
other.
George McAmeny who presided. told of the poll
taken by the club. which reported in The
Tribune last week in which 277 members of the
club were found in favor Of the Sunday opening
feature of the bill and only SO against it.
Some few of those who took part in the discus
sion were observed to drink the wine served at
the luncheon. Frank Moss president of the Soci-
ETY. for the Prevention of Crime, noticed this and
mentioned in the Of his denunclation OF
saloons that wine drunk at dinner did little
harm. In the general discussion which followed the
set speeches Frederic ". Hinrchs said that it
seemed to him that the best way for reformers
and men of the upper classes to stop the work
lngman drinking would be stop drinking them
selves.
The opponents of the bill contented themselves
with criticism Of its Sunday opening clause. which
its supporters say, is of the strongest blows
against the Raines law hotel, and in declaring that
1t was simply compromise with evil and a legaI-
cation of Sabbath breaking. The Rev. James NJ
FAIR, president of the New York Presbytery's
committee temperance, whose stand in favor
Of the bill provoked much opposition within his
church. said that ne supported the bill because it
devised to meet and overcome the present open
and fragrant violations of the law The Rev. DR..
Hubbel. of the Sabbath Association. said he de-
plored the fact that men OF his cloth had joined
with the liquor dealers to desecrate the Sabbath.
He said that the bill would not prevent graft add
ing Il sorry to see the clergymen join in this
moral descent which will make every Raines law
hotel a house Of prostitution for which the Sunday
opening viii offer cure
The Rev. John Haynes Holmes OF the Unitarian
Church Of the Messiah, took issue with this remark
at once SAYING: THE present laws drives the liquor
dealers out Of the saloon business into the prostd-
ton business. and the Brough bill will drive this
kind Of hotel out Of existence
These Raines law hotels he continued, ARE an
unspeakabie abonination and the whole seat of
trouble in dealing with the saloon. And if the
of trouble is removed then there will be no
great trouble left You should allow DR.. Peters,
who has given his time and attention to the prob
lem. TO overcome this evil and drive the Ranes law
hotels out Of business. Regardless of whether the
saloons open or closed on Sunday, want TO see
that unspeakab bic plague spot the Raines law hotel
removed
THE whole question" said the Rev. DR.. James
A Patterson, state superintendent of the Anti-Sa
loon League lis whether New York City has failed
in home rule not. II II has, then receiver
should be appointed and should send for Agu-
nado, Castro Abdul Hamid who are out of a job
Just present"
He said that the law under the Brough bill would
be exactly what the saoonkeepers wanted, and that
blind tigers" and speak easies" would be more
numerous than ever for he declared that they flour
ished more in wet" districts than in dry ones
Professor Francis NJ. Burdick agreed with Magis-
trate Steinert who said recently that the excise
law at present the statute books was unen-
forceabe. due TO its unpopuIarity. Speaking from
his experience as Police Commissioner. Frank Moss
said that the bill could stop the police
graft
The gambling evil and the brothel evil not
comparable TO the saloon evil said Mr.. Moss.
"and this law will not correct conditions. 1t is
intended mainly to misead the community into the
idea that it viii. but it is framed to meet the
wishes of the liquor dealers-it is a truce to law
breakers"
DR.. Peters held that the Brough bill gave the
saloonkeepers a chance to conduct their business
decently, many of them wished to. but were
unable to under the excise law. This law he went
on had beer passed by upstate Legislators who
unfamiliar with municipal conditions and the
methods Of graft that could obtain under the Law.
The Sunday sales In accordance with the provisions
of the excise measure, he said, % per cent
greater than any weekday. that the effect OF
it utterly lost "As a further evidence OF the
universal acclaim that has greeted the Brough BILL"
DR.. Peters said. Il may say that the Roman Cath
olic Church is with in this fight
In the discussion which followed George Haven
Putnam said that it impossible get grand
jury indictments under the present law, and that
Tammany did not want any other law than that
in force as it would deprive II Of its snews
Of political
The Rev. Thomas r. Slicer attacked the pleas
for closed Sunday by referring to this argument
as fictitious sanctity," and he also ridiculed Je
rornes statement that with twenty he could
enforce the excise law. 1t a physical i'm
possibility for the entire police force make the
saIoonkeepers comply with the law. he said.
Mr.. jerome was frivolous In his assertion" Or.
Peters said later. 1T would cost several thousand
men 10 that rigid enforcement given to
the old law, which in my mind makes apparent
the need Of another law"