The Washington herald., 1909-01-12
SCHIFFON The STAND
New York Banker Tells Of
the AtchiSOn Deal.
PLAN TO END COMPETITION
Purchase by Hartman Interests and
Placing of His Friends on AtehE-
son Board Followed Failure 10
Merge Northern Lines-Stuyvesant
Fish Called as Traffic Expert.

New York. Jan. u--TestIfyiag to-day
as a witness for the government. IN its
suit 10 have the Hartman combination
OF railroads declared Illegal. Jacob H
Schif, head Of Kuhn. Loeb & Co. said
that the 100000 OF Atchison stock pUr-
chased by Mr.. Hartman and his friends
IN 1896 and 1866 represented a personal n
vestment on the part OF Mr.. Hartman,
William Rockefeller. H H Rogers.
James Stllman. and his firm, and that
whatever reasons Mr.. Hartman and the
others may have had Kuhn. Loeb &
Co. bought the stock because Il was
cheap. and not that the two roads
might deal more frankly with each
other" the reason given by Mr.. Harri-
man.
It IS the contention OF the government
that following this stock purchase com
petition between the Atchison and the
Hartman lines practically ceased, and
the Atchison virtually became part OF
the alleged monopoly, but NJ. Schin was
quite sure that he was simply after
cheap stock. and having obtained a large
block Of Il. ne wanted representation on
the board 10 protect the stock thus pur-
chased. and not 10 bring about any
change IN the management
Earlier IN his testimony re told Cf the
old fight over the control OF the Burling-
ton.
Wanted Competition Removed.
Il appeared from the questions put to
Mr. SChiT concerning the old Burlington
struggle that the purpose Of the govern
ment attorneys was 10 show that the fail
ure 10 end competition among the North
ern roads had something 10 do with the
subsequent purchase Of Atchison stock IN
order 20 remove competition II that guar
te-
M Schin told OF talks which M Har-
riman and himself had had with Mr. Hi
over the Burlington situation, and said
that Hartman wanted the Burlington
to remain independent Explaining the
purchase OF Northern Pacific stock by his
firm. which stock was later turned over
10 the Union Pacific. Mr. Schih said that
II was TO maintain the status quo so
far as the Burlington was concerned
The Union Pacific he said. " had no
desire 70 control the Northern Pacific, but
il got control so that il could take care
OF this Burlington deal The Union Pa
cifc felt that while Il had a sharp II
valry with the Burlington it cold get
along with It, but might not be able to
with new interests in control Of that
road
Called as Traffic Expert.
Stuyvesant Fish. whom Mr.. Hartman
had deposed as president Of the Illinois
Central. followed Mr.. Schif as a witness
for the government, but It soon developed
that Mr.. Fish had been called only as a
traffic expert As such. however, Mr..
Fish was clearly for the governments
contention that the plans Of Mr.. Harri-
man had ended competition for rtans-
continental traffic. In speaking Of the
competition which had gone on between
the Union Pacific and Southern Pacific
for the business Of the Illinois Central.
Afr. Fish said:
''It was as active as between any two
Dads in business"
Mr.. Fish said that prior to the purchase
Of the Southern Pacific by the Union
Pacific, the Illinois Central had moved
business in the way that was best for its
OWN interests I'VE treated those best
who treated US best" he said.
What effect the merger had on the
Denver and Rio Grande. the Gould road
wa stOld by President T. 7. Jeffrey.
He said that the Union Pacific IS now
tbs preferential connection Of the South
ern Pacific. Asked IL the public isn't
suffering from this he replied he would
rather have the public speak for itself
The government v.l not call any more
witnesses tomorrow afternoon. Il Is the
intention 20 adjourn the hearing for two
weeks and then resume It at PittsbuTg.