The Washington times., 1908-01-23

the first witness called to the stand
today
Attended Thaw on Train.
By LIT etpn;
Q.-You have seen this defendant.
Harry X. Thaw?
Al have.
Q.-Cea you recall when you were on
a train coming from albany IN April
1905?
Al can. I remember having seen
him while we were between Albany and
HuGson. I was called 10 attend him by
the porter Of the train. I spoke to him.
He did not. respond TO my questions, but
kept repeating "ShysteT. shyster, shys-
ter"
O.-What was his appearance?
Ale was anaemic. His eyes bulged.
gave him an injection Of morphine.
The porter had TO assist me.
O.-Had he been drinking?
A.-Yes. ] sat close TO him and de-
0.|what did his appearance indicate
A. thought he was crazy.
Odd you visit him in the Tombs?
Al did
Cross-examined by Jerome:
lis Pulse Was Rapid.
o-How was his pulse: over 70?
Al should say It was. It was very
rapid.
O-You said at that time you dag
nosed the case as one Of unsound mind.
Ayes.
Odd you ever see a man so drunk
that he did not respond to a question?
o.-Then all you know was that he
was a man who was talking ineoher-
Ayes. He was uttering meaningless
sentences and did not respond to my
questions
was OF unsound mind and proceed to
give him an injection Of half grain OF
morphine?
Al did.
Mr.. Bailey was then excused and Dr.
Charles q. Wagner, of the New YORK
State Asylum for the Insane, at Blng-
hamton. took the stand. The eXannin "a
ton Of DR.. Wagner was taken up
where It had been left of at the close Of
the session yesterday
Dr.. Wagner's Evidence.
LIttleton's first question brought forth
an objection from the district attorney.
Thaw's lawyer asked the alienist 70 re-
peat the conversation he had had with
the defendant August q. 1906, wheE the
first examination of the prisoner was
made in the TOmbs-
Justice Bowling ruled to allow the
expert to testify to what Thaw had
said in relation TO the particular time
OF the examination. Under the rule all
reference made by Thaw to his cOndi-
uon previous TO or on the night OF the
shooting was barred.
At the last trial Dr. Wagner testified
that Thaw told him he believed the
shooting was IAN act of providence
II was for the purpose OF keeping TINS
from the jury that jerome made his
fight today The expert succeeded III
saying that ''Thaw talked IN a rambling
manner and that he looked suspiciously
from one physician 70 the other, when
he was interrupted by Jerome.
ANY conversation related by the
prisoner at the time OF the visit Will be
admitted" ruled the court, but only
as having any bearing on his mental
condition at the time Of the eXamina-
tlOn by the witness
BY this ruling the testimony is Of no
value as evidence of unsOundneSS June
3, 1906, the night of the homicide.
Said It Was Providence.
Thaw told DR.. Wagner he had never
intended attacking White. but that
Providence took the matter In hand.
Thaw's manner he described as exceed
ingly dictatorial.
Q--The next interview YOU had with
the defendant was in September. 1906?
Ayes. I had fifteen minutes inter
view with him then. After his greetings
10 US he slipped up TO Mr.. HartTidge and
said, Where are those papers, Mr..
HaTtrldge said, Il have not got them,
Harry. I'll give them 10 you tomorrow
ThaW then said sharply. That won
do. ! must have them today. If / don [
get them today this examination Will not
30 on
Q.-You made another on septem-
A--Yes. I asked Thaw a number. Of
questions which he answered, COntin-
ually interfering reference 10 his own
affairs that were not answers 10 my
questions. He said ne had had St.
NituS' dance, mumpS, measles, and scar
let fever and that he had been told that
he had had commissions, but he was not
very clear about any of them In his
early years, re said, he went TO a kin
deTgarten and then TO other schools.
he said ne CnCe went TO Harvard be-
cause he wanted TO study law, but he
gave that up and in 1895 went to Europe,
thinking he would be a painter
He said he did not think that he was
utssiDated man in the ordinary sense
OF the word. He said he never drank
alone and never kept whisky in his
room When he drank ii, he declared,
IL was while with others for sociability
sake"
The examination consumed about an
hour and was devoted to an examina-
ton Of his physical person.
. Q.-Is physical examination a meth
Cd by which you determine insanity
A.-No. not exactly. but physical ex-
aminatiOns are In every way as i'm
pOTJant as mental ones in some forms
of insanity. In epileptic insanity. IL
We ind that a person had sustained
injuries as q result Of falls, they would
be suggestive.
Of any form of general paresis had
been present IL would have been dis
closed by your physical examination?
Ayes, sir. We only examined him
for symptoms Of paresis.
Wagner's Evidence Material.
The evidence of DR.. Wagner. while
Instructive and perhaps material TO the
case. had an effect on the jury which
had not been looked for. Juror George
c. Rupprecht listened for half an hour
to the description Of the nerves and
then turned Ills eyes and slept quietly.
Frank DOvale, in seat No. II, kept his
eyes open only when Or, Wagner halted
in his technical testimony.