The copper era., 1908-04-02

would undertake now to predict what
is going to happen or to make'a COM
prehensive statement of present con-
ditions. There are too many moves
yet to be made before any negree of
stability is reached to make such
surveyspossible.' '---
"Who. is going to make them?p
"You know as well as'I do,' re-
turned Mr.. Hartman sharply. "Ths
people of this country haYe got to be
brought to a proper appreciation of
the INTERPOLATION between the
various factors in industry. Then
they must see to it that the admins
tration of law is conducted in their
interest and not as matter of per-
sonal caprice" .-5-
"And you are going to stay in the
game until this comes about, Mr..
Hartmann" the reporter asked.
81 don't want to say how. long
shall stay in harness. A year ago,
when the Interstate Commerce Com
mission was at work, said something
about retiring in another year.
Well, it isn't case of changing my
mind, but of not having had time to
think about retirement. 1 looked
then for some falling off in business,
but for nothing like what has occur
red. didn't expect to see so per
cent. of the decrease that has been
realized. > Under such conditions
there is nothing to do but to stick
until. matters get into competent
hands, at least, and until confidence
has been restored
"Just now we ARE Tearing about
the wages problem. But do people
appreciate that, with given oppor-
trnity for the development of bust
ness, the more we have to pay for
capital, the less we have to pay for
wages? 1 am not referring to the
scale of wages, but to the amount
that we can spend for wages. And
in order to get capital on reasonable
terms we have got to have good
credit, and credit must be maintained
by surplus earnings. There is the
whole thing in nutshell.
ga wrong idea prevails in a good
many quarters about this relation
ship of capital ard labor. We men
who manage the roads are not TIE
capitalists. The security holders
from whom we borrow the money are
the capitalists, and they are in part
nership with the wage earners in
trying to make fair profit out of
serving the public 1t is our duty as
managers of1the roads to preserve
the proper relations between the diff
ferent factors SO far as we can. But
what becomes of our efforts when I'M
wise government. interference, re-
sulting in such condition of distrust
as prevails at present, jumbles up all
the factors in one conglomeration?
"Be careful, now, not to confuse
the terms. By surplus earnings do
not mean the payment of dividends,
but the ability to earn something be-
yond what is required to meet bare
charges and expenses. So in speak
ing of the partnership between the
wage earners and the stockholders,
1 do not limit myself to the relations
that exist or that may exist
between the corporate or
CARNATIONS on the one side and the
labor Organizations on the other. [
refer to the fundamental relations
between those who furnish the funds
for Investment and those who give
their services to make the invest
ment. profitable,
sit is quite Obvious that restriction
of business brings about uneconomi-
cal conditions throughout the indus
trial structure. When men are
working on part time, or under limi-
tations as to hours and conditions,
there is a tremendous waste in earn
ing capacity and productive energy.
The whole fabric of industry con-
tracts. There is less money to be
spent by the workers and consequent
" less business to be done to supply
the wants they can afford. A family
makes one bag of flour go where two
were used before; the old clothes are
made over instead of having new
ones bought.
''Multiply this by eighty million and
you can see what it means to haye
the Nation economics. Add the dis
trust naturally produced among those
who have the money to invest, and
there is a combination of forces at
work with cumulative effect, the re-
suit of which it is hard to forecast.
Earnings decrease because of the
sIackening volume of business; capt.
tai becomes timid and rates for
money high, and there is correspond
ingly less to be paid for the labor
necessary to carry out the work that
we have before US. The question of
whether wages will decrease does
not depend Hp9p my attitude or the