Albuquerque morning journal. [volume] (Albuquerque, N.M.) 1903-1926, 1907-11-14
Former Senator Spooner De-
fends Railroad Wizards Right
TO Refuse to Answer Com
missions Questions.
DEVELOPMENT OF ENTIRE
WEST INVOLVED IN ISSUE
Government Attorneys Claim
Right of One Man TO Control
Railroads of Nation Hinges
on Decision
IBy Morning journal Special Lsassd Wire

on Decision
IBy Morning journal Special Lsased Wire. !
New York, Nov. 13.--After seven
hours and half of argument on both
sides OF the question. Judge Hough, in
the United States district circuit court,
announced tonight that he would not
be ready to render a decision on the
petition of the interstate commerce
commission to compel r. III. Hartman
to answer certain questions propound-
ed to him last spring in the course of
the commissions investigation into
the so-called Hartman lines until De-
cember l. The opposing counsel We're
given the privileges of filing additional
briefs during the next two weeks.
The arguments, which were not con-
cluded until $50 p. m, took a wide
range and the privileges and powers
of the interstate commerce commits
sion were thoroughly gone into For
mer Senator John G. Spooner, of Wis
consin appeared for the first time in
the case and argued in defense of the
position maintained by Mr.. Hartman
that he is not required 10 tell the
commission what individual profit he
made in selling the stocks of other
railroads held by him to the Union
Pacific company or to detail the man
ner i'm which the famous 10 per cent
Union Pacific dividend was declared
in August, 1906. and its announcement
deferred for two days. Mr.. Hartman
has also declined to say how much
stock of the Union Pacific, If any. he
bought Just before the announcement
of the dividend.
John c. Milhurn was also heard in
defense of Mr. Hartman and in OPP
position to the petition filed by the
commission on behalf of the govern
ment, as represented by the interstate
commerce commission, the argume.ts
were conducted by United States Dis
trict Attorney Henry l.. Stimson and
Frank h. Kellogg, special counsel Tor
the commission.
Counsel for Mr.. Harrison stated TO
Judge Hough that the stock purchases
OF the Union Pacific railroad amount
ed to 50,000.O00 during one period
and about S1S2 900, 900 in the aggre-
gate. were made on the recommenda-
tion OF the executive committee. APP
proVed by the board of directors and
ratified by the stockholders. All that
Mr.. Hartman had done, Mr.. Milburn
declared. had met with the fullest APP
nroval of the stockholders of the Un-
ion Pacific. He further stated that, al
lowing for losses sustained in the re-
cent heavy slump of prices. the Union
Pacific had profited no less than S32,-
900, 900 by its stock purchases. Mr..
Mnburn said this fact should sile0ce
the claim of the commission that nc
stock purchase tended 10 impair the
effectiveness of the railroad eng ,ed
in interstate commerce.
Mr.. Kellogg I'm reply TO this ST ted
that the so-called market value OF he
stocks sold TO the Union Pacific was
nothing more or less than Wall
Street quotation. probably fixed by the
very pool Of men who. IL Is claimed
were behind the stock deals. As to
the impairment of the usefulness OF
the railroads, Mr.. Kellogg asserted
that the roads Of inflated values were
today unable to borrow money to
build the cars needed by them to carry
out their obligations 20 the public
THE same thing is true of the roads
without inflated values retorted Mr.
Milburn.
senator Spooner declared that the
stock deals between Mr.. Hartman and
the Union Pacific were matters or con-
Germ only between the individual and
the stockholders and had nothing to
do with interstate commerce. Mr. kel-
Iogg declared the commission had a
right to inquire into the uses TO which
the MONEYS Of a railroad were put
Judge Hough interrupted the attor-
news on both sides with many pointed
questions. He said. among other
things. that he did not exactly see
what the deferred announcement Of
the Union Pacific dividend had To do
with interstate traffic. He also asked
IT, after all, the commission was not
only seeking by the unanswered ques-
tions. 10 prove from whom Hartman
the Individual. purchased the stocks
subsequently sold to the company OF
which he is president and what pront
he. individually, made by the trans
action.
Mr. kellogg said the commission
had sought to get al the bona hde OF
the stock deals. In general. he de-
clared, the commission was making
an inquiry which involved the question
of whether or not the great western
territory OF the United States shall be
dependent upon one man for It's de-
elOpment-whefher or not there shall
be railroad competition between the
Missouri river and the Southern Paci-
fc coast.
Mr.. Kellogg. In including his argu-
ment. said the commission questioned
the propriety OF AFR. Hartman sitting
upon a committee 60 fix the price 81
stocks he held and was about 20 sell
10 the Union Pacific.
Il know" interjected Mr.. Milburn.
but what are you going to do about
it,
Walter ID. Hines appeared for Otto
II. Kuhn. Of the firm Of Kuhn. Loeb
d Co. who had held 10000 shares
Of Union Pacific stock for the direct
ors. He said Kuhn, Loeb a CO. acted
as the fiscal agents of the Union Pa
cific. II was simply practice. ne
said for the Union Pacific "a arrange
a hnsfa