Evening bulletin. [volume] (Honolulu [Oahu, Hawaii]) 1895-1912, 1906-01-06
Testimony Given By Ryan And Hartman Before
The Insurance Investigating Commission.
Playing For Stakes Representing Control OF
Hundreds CT Milois OF Collars

In the Hyde stock. | declined. He OBJ
jected to the trustees and wanted ia
name two OF them. He said he did not
think | could carry out my plan with.
out his aid. ] said I intended to dl.
vest myself OF control OF the Equitable.
and I regretted very much to have his
opposition, but | was going to carry
out my plan whether ] had his oppo
sition or not"
The purchase OF the Hyde stock. Mr..
Ryan said. was made on Friday, June
9th. Mr.. Ryan first heard from Mr..
Hartman on that day. Mr.. Hartman
said the witness, suspected that he
! (Ryan) was in on the deal, and had a
talk with him on that day. MIR. Har.
riman saw him again on the following
Monday or Tuesday In company with
Elihu Root and Paul Cravath. Most Of
the things said we're said at the second
interview. Mr.. Ryan told Mr.. Harri.
man who the trustees were to be. Har.
riman said that he had given much
1 time to Strengthening out the Equit.
able. The witness then said that Har.
riman gave no other reason than that
for demanding a share in the purchase
OF the Hyde stock.
Harriman's Purpose.
[ For what reason did Mr.. Hartman
want half the stock?" asked MIR.
Hughes.
For the reason that he had been
In the Equitable as a director and was
not satisfied the stock should he in
my hands" replied Mr.. Ryan.
HE said his whole influence would
be against me. He said his political
influence would be against me, but he
did not mention any names. He said
the Legislature would probably take
4 action, but ! don't think he mentioned
any investigation. | think he said that
Legislative action would probably re.
suit. and that his influence would be
important. Mr.. Hartman did not say
anything about legislative action in
the event that acceded to his request.
He did not say his action In the mat.
3 ter would be important" v
In reply to question by Mr.. Hughes,
MIR. Ryan said that Mr.. Hartman did
not say in so many words that his DC,
litical Influence would be against Ryan,
but the witness understood Hartman
TO mean his entire influence, whether
political. financial or otherwise. The
witness understood this to include the
possibility OF legislative action. The
witness was not willing to allow MIR.
Hartman to name two trustees, be-
cause he did not want anybody as
partner In the enterprise. The wit.
ness talked with Mr.. Hartman over
the telephone. and finally Mr.. Ryan
said to Mr.. Hartman that there was
no use OF talking about 1t. He would
ontchange his mind.
!srriman's Threat.
did Mr.. Hartman say there would
be anything Injurious to your inter.
ests II you refused to sell?" asked Mr..
Hughes.
He said his entire influence would
be against me-" replied Mr.. Ryan.
did he refer to the political infiu.
ence he would assert at the interview
at which Mr.. Root and Mr.. Cravath
were present." asked Mr.. Hughes.
MY recollection is that he did"
did he refer to the probability OF
legislative action at that same inter
yiew?"
"And you understood fully that in
refusing to meet his wishes you were
taking the chance OF whatever oppo.
'sition he could bring to bear upon
your"
81 did"
and you told him that you intend
ed that the management OF the Equit
able should be entirely independent"
Il did"
Independent of what?"
Independent Of me and everybody
else"
Did he threaten any action by of
GERS OF the State Government"
He did not"
Mr.. Ryan testified that Hartman Of.
Tered II Mr., Ryan would SELL 10 put his
share OF the Equitable into a trust.
MY conversation with him was
strenuous" said MIR. Ryan Il think
he said he did not want anybody to
control this property unless he had n
share in it, Mr., Hartman did not say
anything indlcrlng what action the
LEGISLATURE would take No other per.
son made any such threats"