Evening star. [volume] (Washington, D.C.) 1854-1972, 1905-12-15

Assemblyman Rogers of the committee
here asked: when did you resign as direc-
tor of the Eanitable?
when the Frck committee made their
report. This was June 2.
The next interview with Ryan was the
Monday following the purchase of the Hyde
stock. said the witness. First, however,
l told MIR. Ryan had helped elect President
Morton. and Ryan said he wanted TO meet
me. and after Morton was elected Ryan
called me up and said he appreciated my
he would do nothing further without my
consent. and wanted TO meet me. made
an appointment to meet him.
An Act Of Bad Faith.
AT II O'Clock Mr. Cravath came and said
Ryan was sorry he had to proceed without
me. told Mr.: CraNath / considered this
an act of bad faith, turned my back on
Cravath anG walked away. Mr.. Ryan later
asked me TO come to his Office on Monday
and meet Mr.. Root.
"ln that interview with Cravath he told
me that Mr. Root mad insisted on the APP
pointment of the trustees of the Equitable
at once, and the announcement in the morn
ing papers was the first intimation that Mr..
Ryan had asked the trustees to act. / want
you all to understand that have something
BESIDES life insurance to do and think of.
Did you tell him he would have your help
If he gave you share?"
Il made no demand for the stock, but Is
IL
purity Of his motives, which he could do by
giving me q share
Did YOU tell him he could not succeed
without your help?"
To Center Control in Himself.
Il was convinced that he Intended to CEN
ter the control Of the Equitable in him
SELF and told him that my Influence would
be thrown against him. l told him 1 would
use every effort l could. 1t was not SO
strenuous an interview. 1t lasted only If
teen minutes"
Did you refer to legislative action or
say anything about the legislature?"
Il do not recall any such thing nor that
/ would do anything to induce legislation.
can't deny positively that l did. l don't
know that it would have been improper.
Everybody knew that there would be legls-
lation on the matter. If 1 recollected It
would be perfectly willing to tell it,"
Did you take any steps TO thwart his
plans?'
Not yet l had no conversation with
Gov Odell about the advisability of leg
isative investigation nor about any kind
of legislation whatever l knew nothing
about this investigation whatever"
Mr.. Hartman said he is in politics and
has some political influence. and he did
not consider it improper If he did use his
political influence against Ryan. Nothing
improper in Ryan's conduc; of the Equitable
has yet come to my attention., he said,
land l have not had time to attend to 1t.
If anything had come to my attention
should have acted"
What is your political infiuence?"
IL is such as any man of prominence has
who has never asked any one to do anything
improper. 1 have great interests in New
York and am often consulted"
Mr.. Hughes asked Mr.. Hartman what
was his understanding as to the absolute
transfer of the Hyde stock to Ryan
whether there was any understanding that
there was an arrangement that the stock
was to be carried for Hyde in whole or In
part
No" replied the witness; ''but that was
suspected by everybody
Mr.. Harriman said that he did not insist
that the two additional trustees suggested
by him should be appointed by him. What
he wanted. he said. was the appointment of
two absolutely independent trustees to act
as check on Ryan and the Ryan trustees.
What Hartman Did at Albany.
Mr.. Hughes asked what Mr.. Hartman
did at Albany to prevent the naturalization
Of the Equitable. Mr.. Hartman objected
to telling. but Mr.. Hughes insisted, and Mr.
Hartman said that in the Equitable trouble
Mr.. Hyde offered to trustee the stock, az
Ryan did later. A subcommittee of the
Equitable had recommended naturalization
1t was put into the hands of lawyers to take
care of this at Albany.
All last spring, during the Equitable con-
troversy, Gov Odell was not here; he was
not consulted. and had no hand in it what
ever. During that time l had legislation
watched at Albany to prevent one faction
in the Equitable getting in control"
Mr.. Hughes asked what he meant by
Odell's getting political interest through
him
Every man of prominence has certain
political influence"
Attempt to Buy Stock.
Mr.. Hughes read Mr.. Hartman previous
testimony, in which he said he did not try
to buy the Hyde stock, and Hartman said
he did not then have in mind his attempt
to get the Ryan holdings. but meant that
he made no attempt to buy the stock direct
from Mr.. Hyde.
MIR. Hartman asked Mr.. Hughes If he did
not think that answer was proper, and Mr.
Hughes said he thought 1t was, that Mr..
no offer to Hyde.
The Alexander faction went to Albany to
oppose the plan,' said the witness "and Mr..
Platt went, there to represent a committee
OF policyholderS. ! was neutral not with
either faction. l was In communicat tion
with men who were to inform me If there
was any possibility of the Alexander fac
ton succeeding. do not want to tell you
what they reported There was no bill in
troduced. took steps with some members
of the legislature to let me know If bill
was introduced"
Mr.. Hughes brought out the statement
that Mr. Hartman did not present a bin
being introduced and he was not Informed
that bill was going to be introduced. Mr.
Hughes asked with whom Hartman had
these interviews. Mr.. Hartman said he
would rather see the parties before answer
ing He offered to tell Senator Arms trong
or Mr.. Hughes privately. and If they de-
cided that he must he would tell.
Did Not Want Responsibility.
Senator Armstrong said neither he nor
Hughes desired to take such a responsible
ity.
II communicated with some members of
the legislature"
Senator Armstrong: I'VE commonly re-
ceive such communications from, our
friends"
Hartman: II told them what 1 wanted
to know. / don't want to go further but l
will consult with counsel and if they say 1
should I will do So"
Senator Armstrong consented and the
three men went into an anti-room to
confer.
Mr. Hartman had said one reason why
he did not want to disclose the names was
that he did not want to make sensational
headlines.
On Harrimans returning to the stand. Mr.
Cravath. Judge Lovett and Mr. Hughes
and Mr.. McKeen consulted with the COM
mittee, after which Judge Lovett talked