The Intermountain Catholic. (Salt Lake City [Utah] ;) 1899-1920, 1903-11-14
Our Club Conversations
By Crestes a. BroWnson.
CONVERSATION XIII (continued.)

in the Catholic society,"" said O'Connor, 'the
family and the state are, in their order.
free in natural society, only neither nterprets
the law under which it holds for itself. Each must
take the law as infalbly declared by the supreme
pontiff chief of the supernatural society and head
of the Church, sole representative OF the spiritual
in regenerated humanity. Within the limits of the
law declared, the father may educate his chill
dren where and how he judges best, and the prince
may govern his subjects as seem to him good The
Church defines the secular tells us what is is
not secular, but within the secularity, she de-
fines it, she leaves the father and the prince. the
family and the state, to their wisdom and pru-
dence.'
The rule for our guidance in both public and
private, social and domestic life" said Father John,
lis that there rights against God
against his representative. | have no will that |
may set up against the Church, nor has the State
any rights that valid against the spiritual
thority. But from this it by no means follows that
there is no will, no judgment, autonomy but
hers. She defines the secular order, and the secu-
lar order has rights against her. but this is not
saying there is no secular order that the secu-
lar, IN face OF the secular, has no rights, pow
ers What really are the rights of the father, the
family, the school, the state, the secular society
are simply what God has wied they should have
and these the Church, his faithful spouse, must
recognize, confirm, and with all her power protect
and defend when assailed."
But / do not see," remarked De Bonneville
that Father Johns doctrine is much more liberal
than Mr.. Winslow's. Neither will allow the Church
can ever be in the wrong, or recognize in the State
any independence in face of the Church. Neither
comedies it any rights which it may hold up be-
fore her and say: These are mine; touch them at
your peril.
Il think that is very likely" said Diefenbaeh
"and [ have desire to belong to a church that
ever can be in the wrong. Individual bishops and
priests may be In the wrong, may act from their
own judgments passions instead of following the
law of the Church, which is as determinate and as
strict for them for the humbest believer; but
the Church, acting in her integrity, can never be
in the wrong. M de Bonneville wants what. as a
Catholic, he cannot have. He wants doctrine that
will justify the Byzantine emperors, the German
kaisers, the French and English kings, with their
courtiers, jurisconsuts and apostate monks, in
their bitter and protracted struggles with the SOW
ereign pontfs, and permit him to say: Caesar was
right and Peter was wrong: He may find it in the
four articles of the French clergy in 1852, drawn
up by order of his Most Christian Majesty of
France, but he will not find it in Catholicty; so he
may well make up his mind at once to say: Pc
ter right and Caesar was wrong"
Goods dominion is absolute" said Father John,
in conclusion, but he governs man as a free
agent, and in all his treatment of us respects the
freedom of the human will, not because free will
is a power that limits his power, or a right that
limits his right but because it enters into his pur
pose that should be free moral agent and
he cannot take away that free-wil without destroy
ing mans nature, for free-will is not mere adj
Junct to nature, but is essential to its exist
ence. The same princip pie runs through the whole
moral government of God His whole moral gov