The Indianapolis journal. [volume] (Indianapolis [Ind.]) 1867-1904, 1902-01-26

TO sell again. He replied that it made no
difference really who ownd Northern Pa
cihc.
Commissioner Prouty asked: eff you
had secured a few more millions of North
ern Pacific. il would have made a differ
ence, would il not?'
1--WE could have it" was the reply.
The question as TO just why Mr. Harri-
man had disposed OF his Northern Pacific
holdings. what was lost or made by the
transaction, and whether Mr.. Hill had
made some agreement in case the holdings
were sold. brought from Mr.. Hartman the
response that natural conditions con-
trolled. He said he did not know Of any
thing made, except that his interests found
out that they were strong enough TO hold
their own in Pacific traffic. He said his
impression was that the Oregon Short
line had not lost by the transfer. He said
Mr.. Hill had given no assurances of any
division of traffic and that the motive OF
the original purchase had been that of
preserving TO the Union Pacific system the
avenues OF traffic open to ii.
You wish to represent that no one OF
the other Northern Pacific interests made
any promise in control"
A COMMON INTEREST.
Mr.. Hartman replied: There is COM
mon interest among us all, and we believe
that common interest will be served re-
CARELESS of holdings. That common inter-
est can be served by natural conditions.
Our interests are so in common that We
cannot injure others without injuring
selves"
Mr.. Hartman insisted that the common
interests of all systems now affiliated under
the Northern Securities Company must be
considered rather than the so-called ''com-
munity of interests" He said he was a
member Of the board OF directors of the
Securities Company and Mr.. Hill was its
PRESIDENT put the combination under that
company affected rates in nowise. He told
how, shortly after the scramble over
Northern Pacific stock, Ir. Morgan had
been given a proxy by him in order to sell
sale was to be affected in cash and securi-
ties-the latter in the Northern Securities
Company. If 1T should be organized. Mr..
Hartman eventually controlled about $780,
100000 Of the stock of this company
When asked If the formation of the
Northern Securities Company and the as
ISOLATION of so many roads might influence
rates Mr.. Hartman said: 1T may enable
rs, when brought so close together, to
eliminate the prevailing distrust as to the
various lines maintaining traffic rates. The
complaint has been OF too high rates. We
may be able to stop the discrimination in
rates of shipper against another He
stated that this, however, need not have
been done in such a company. The SuggeS-
tion made by the commission that this
company might also prevent reduction of
published rates by competing roads. He
power of concentration for pooling. Other
larger considerations than stOckholding, he
held, Influenced rates. IF Mr.. Hill or my
self owned all the roads people would get
better rates because OF conditions. With
freer hand we could the better regulate
rat ties to any point. The prevailing move
ment of cars etc, influence He added
that he did not think competition ever re-
duced rates more than temporarily.
At the conclusion of his testimony Mr..
Hartman took a special train for New
to the stand, was excused and accompanied
Mr.. Hartman.