The Saint Paul globe. (St. Paul, Minn.) 1896-1905, 1902-10-22

ton to you concerning reduction In rates
following the acquisition by the Great
Northern and Northern Pacific Of the
Burlington system, and the question was
framed to give the impression that the
reduction of rates was caused by the ac
QUESTION of the Burlington Is that the
way you wish to have 1t understood-tha
it resulted from that and as q consequence
A. The increased traffic growing out of
the acquisition Of the burlington, or the
acquisition Of the Burlington. was in
measure responsible for a portion Of that
increased traffic The increased traffic
made it not only possible, bift We thought
1t wise to reduce the Tates. The rates
Of the growth Of the company's business.
Our company has had its dividend, that
is all the shareholders get. AS the vol
ume OF our trafnc increases ana our rev.
our rates, and hope to be able to continue
to reduce them for the same reason.
9. Did you cause a reduction Of the
to be made at the same time?
A. I had no desire and made no at
tempt to deal with the rates on the Bur
Q. The reduction applied only to the
Great Northern and the Northern Pa
A. Yes, sir In my testimony I alluded
to the reduction on the Great Northern
particularly. and also to the reduction on
the Northern Pacific which corresponded
with the Great Northern where they were
at common points.
O. You spoke yesterday, Mr.. Hill, Of
the vast benefit that is to accrue. to the
people of the Northwest from this &C
QUESTION of the Burlington by the Great
Northern and Northern Pacific; that by
reason of that acquisition you were go
ing to give them coal here in the Twin
Cities and in the manufacturing towns at
A. I would like the record read where
I said that think that is not "a fair
statement of what 1 said.
fair; that was the impression 1t created
on my mind Now. wish to know wheth-
er any reduction in the coal rate from
Minneapolis has resulted in the year and
half of your control OF the Burlington
system?
A. The Burlington has not been con-
trolled for q year and a half, to begin
with; and in the next place, l did not
have, nor is my language susceptible OF
that meaning. ! undertook to make 1t
plain that the acquisition of the Bur-
lington and the bringing of the interest
of the Burlington into that of the North
ern Pacific and Great Northern would
try and it was not possible to get GER
tain~supply of coal in any other way ex-
cept from Illinois.
O. Are the facilities for bringing coal
over the Burlington road from Illinois
greater by reason Of your control OF the
road than they were when the Burlington
was under an independent control?
A. The facilities and reasons for bring
ing it here are greater if we controlled
the Burlington than if we did not. If we
did not control the Burlington and they
, desired to send their coal to- other places,
we would fall very short Of compelling
them to bring 1t here.
@. Does the transportation line direct
where. commodity shall be shipped to-
or is it the shipper the conslgnor?
A. We could control that by buying
our own mines. and be certain that we
could bring it here. 100 re
A. We have to this winter. And I
will answer that question if 1T Is ger
to give our business away and advertise
1t to the world unless It. is necessary.
O. Has the Northern Securities com,
pany coal mines in 1llineis now, or nag
it at the time of the inception Of this suit!
A. No, 1T had not at the inception or
this suit.
The Northwestern Coal Supply.
@. You spoke Of the increase of bust
ness that had followed the purchase Oh
the Burlington system ..o =
dismissed, endeavor to clear that mat
ter?
MIR. Day: have no objection, Mr.. Hill,
to your making any statement you wish.
Witness: do not want to be misunder-
stood and from the questions I think
have BEEN The Great Northern Railway
, company and the Northern Pacific Kali
way company. have an interest In this
country and in the people living mere;
and inasmuch as our winters are cold
it would be difficult for them to live
Gus matter-it is a very. serious matter
for the railways. We don't know. now
that we would be able to run our trains
to the first day Of February With WITH tine me
coal from Illinois, and we don't know
but we would have to give up portion OF
our supply of steam coal to keep people
from freezing before spring-and 1t Is
not due by any means to the anthracite
strike, and I tried to make it plain yes
terday that it was not; but 1t is due to
Lake Erie and the mines in West Virginia,
Pennsylvania and Ohio to move the coal.
They are unable to move the coal up to
Lake Erie ports, and we are unable to
get a supply. At this time we have not
been able to get one-half of our purchase
for the year, and navigation will close
sometime next month. That is the i'm
portance Of the control for us Of access
to the coal mines of Illinois, which are
the nearest coal mines to this country,
and the Importance of that will be ap-
parent more and more as time goes on
@. A question was put to you by Judge
Young that left the impression upon my
mind that traffic in carload lots which
came to your line in Burlington cars des-
and reloaded into your cars before your
acquisition of the Burlington road Do
YOU wish to be understood as making that
statement?
A. I understood Judge Young to make
that statement applying to- all roads car
rying traffic from the South, not limiting
it to the Burlington. .s=-7s..
@. Did it apply to the Burlington road
when traffic came in Burlington cars, car
loads for the Pacific coast?
A. The same as it would1to other rail-
@. Was that the practice that it should
be loaded and reloaded into your cars,
or did they go through in CARROTS intact?
they could be, because the mileage on Gas
we call IT'D a foreign car, car of an
other company, going 2,000}nn was g.
very considerable sum; mileage OF "a OF a
cent mile amounted to $l5; S16 would
transfer quite a number Of cars. mean
ferring a number of cars.
O. You said yesterday that the rea-
son for transshipment is that the cars
were not large enough.
enough. think alluded to shipments
of cotton. that cars from Southern roads
carrying a hundred or, in some cases,
ninety bales Of cotton, and our larger
cars would carry $50 or 100 bales of cot
ton
O. Now, to get back to the increase of
traffic that was to come to you from
the Burlington road by reason of your
acquisition of it. Do YOU wish to be un-
derstood as stating that because the
purchased the Burlington road, traffic
was actually created by that fact? Or
did you mean to say that you would get
larger portion Of the Burlingtons traf-.
f1c by reason Of your ownership Of the
Burlington?
To Protect the Growth of the Northwest.
A. Not by any means The object was