The Salt Lake herald. [volume] (Salt Lake City [Utah]) 1870-1909, 1902-01-25
HILL GIN THE
WITNESS STAND
-@
Veteran Railroader Gives Reasons
For Forming Big Combine.
THEORIES ON COMPETITION
TELLS THE COMMISSION ALL
ABOUT RATES.
THEORIES ON COMPETITION


the Great NCTthern railway, testified
for three and One-quarter hours before
the interstate commerce commission
here today.
In answer to questions tending 10
show ale effect of the community of
interests plan on rates, the veteran
railroader declared that competition
does not lower rates, but, on the con
trary, be believed that it advanced
them.
He declared that in the northwest,
where for twenty years the Northern
Pacific and the Great Northern mad
been at peace, where one road had
agreed with the other on rates and
maintained the agreements, rates were
lever than in any other part Of the
coGntry.
regard to the purchase Of he Bur-
lingtOn by the Northern Pacific and the
Great Northern, Nj. Hill said that the
purcha,e was a matter of necessity.
and was due to a movement in line
with the trust idea
Tie testified 10 the formation of the
Northern Securities company. and in
doing so gave a reason far more sim
pie than has generally been con-
5ectUred
Aged Directors Of the Road.
There are some old men-some very
I'D men-inSereSted in the manage
nent Of the Great Northern said he.
1.-Two of them are over 80 and several
Uver 20 years. They wanted to form d
close corporation, into which they
could confde their interests with the
assurance that the read would De man
aged along the lines which nave made
1t a success.
1T was to have taken over one-third
of the stock Of the road. The plan
seemed to be a good one, and then 1t
was proposed to let all the stockholders
in-Eot alone the few owners of the
One-third, but all of them. The plan
met with approval, and then it broad
ened into the idea of taking in the
Northern Pacific also. The roads had
worked in harmony for twenty years
and the change in the holder of the
secur' ties would make no difference.
1t can make no difference ard Will
make no difference"
In explaining his reasons for the
purchase OF the Burlington, MI Hill
went back to the time when he found
1t necessary 10 offer low rate to the
timber men of oregon and Washington
IN order to get loads for cars which
had originally gone west laden with
merchandise.
Measure of Self-protection.
I'm order to put ourselves in a safe
position" he said, I'VE had 10 buy the
Burlington road; it gave us the mar
ket for our western stuff that we had
- bring back, and it afforded us a
cOnnection,iu the cast with all the pro-
ducers."
He also dwelt on the paramount i'm
pOrtance of the coal problem in con-
nectlon with the operation OF. railroads.
We were," he said, far from coal
and far from a market for our timber.
We were at the mercy of q possible
coal famine, such a famine as would
DC existing now were it not for the
unusually mild weather. We needed
more than a connection: we needed a
connection which we could control.
Il was familiar with the railroad sit
uation. 1 knew that the Burlington
reached the Drairies where timber is
needed and l knew that by the Bur
lington we could have a connection
with the coal mines which would put
us on safe ground in respect to fuel.
the Burlington could be
purchased 81 TOO a mile cheaper than
any other granger road, everything
considered. a friend of mine, neigh
bOr told ME that for lumber market
he would rather have the state of Iowa
than any other five states. Perhaps
you can tell me of a good road which
reaches Iowa points better than the
Burlington. L know of none
Denies Forming Trust.
Mr.. Day attempted to show by
iSsS i.ne of questions that the real
reason for taking over the Burlington
was to form a sort of trust, whereby
rates would be absolutely
in the hands of Mr.. Hill and his
friends. To this Mr.. Hill reiterated his
previous statement concerning the pur-
chase of the @"
Mr.. Day: IS it true that before you
purchased the Burlington you wers
20 buy the st. Paul?'
No, sir. An offer was made about
selling the St. Paul ard J simply told
them it could not be lone, for two
because it was against
the law and the other that the St. Paul
gave US nothing that we practically
had not before we would buy it,"
Yet, before a fixed price was laid
in tae st. Paurs stock, were you or
y om colleagues not endeavoring to Sc
cure the St Paul?"
NO. sill The first thing [ heard of
it was when an officer connected with !
the St. Paul asked rs to take it. and !
told him no."
Mr.. Hills "Advice."
Mr.. Day then asked the witness if |
after the agreement to organize the |
Northern Securities company had been |
cached, he had exercised any control !
over or given any instructions to the /
officers of the Northern Pa |
life regarding its operation.
Mr.. Hi replied that he had issued /
10 instructions of any kind to the Off |
ials Of the Northern Pacific. He also
declared that he had issued no instruc- 3
ions 10 the officials of the Burlington. /
'ut when they had come to him for
ldvice' they had received il. Occa-
Ionally he had volunteered advice and /
thought they would listen TO IL
The witness then entered into a
engthy dissertation on the effects Of !
as ne had observed il. /
Commissioner Clements repeatedly
Questioned his assertion that COMPETE
ion 0ves -at lower rates or tend to !
over them, out each time the veteran I
saved his Eyeglasses emphatically /
nd reiterated his statement
The railroad is a sort of mercurial
Indication of the state Of the country /
TO it," he declared. IF the
ounty is poor the railroad will be
IoOr.
Competition Theory Again.
a low rate is not the result of
1t merely shows how low
rate the railroad can afford 10 give.
% you suppose that man in abso-
ute control of a railroad. having no
could raise rates to an
MUST degree and prosper? The min
te he did so he would hamper the
ommerce on which his road lived"
Mr.. Hill averred in answer to further
Interrogation in regard to the effects
f competition. that war between roads |