davidaulloa/AmericanStories huggingface dataset:
New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1900-06-10

pany before they were absorbed by the trust
he sold ice to both of them ana was a sto el,.
i Hayes sought to support the charge of con-
| spiracy. He tried to ascertain when Schoon-
| scheme. and whether not he was one of It's
! projectors. Delaney Nicoll objected frequent
| ~ and loudly to the witness furnishing evidence
! which might be used against him, and finally
/ Justice Gaynor ruled out the last question on
the ground that the absorption of the two COM
! panies by the American Ice Company was not
| relevant TO the issues before the Court.
Q;-Has the American Ice Company any contracts
,o-weIi who would know? A.-The in
eGrS H6 IS hf he G9ntraGf bd Mr. Winch
Don't you as vice president know anything
0MWnat you don't know that your company is
Mr.; ,NcoI registered another objection and was
upheld Id by the Court The Judge remarked that it
ters which were ere already on on record ''' mat
! SIS the Mayor personal friend of yours?
0.mpo you know Mr. Carroll? Al have a slight
>-Q.-7Do you know the Dock Commissioners? A
! NO. don't know any of them.
EXCUSE FOR RAISING PRICE.
QmWill you tell us why the price of ice was ad-
of the shortneSs of supply I'VE OoNp'''
A-Was that the sole reason? A.-That was
Q.-Was the supply. so short that ice could not
with the h supp apD d R t s s bss
~ Nouil diSo sustained an OD1ectlOn 10 TINS
question: ruling that it referred to statistics
Whlch were generally known, and that there
was no need to go into the matter. The lille
sallty of the continuation" Justice Gaynor OBJ
served. is something that / have nothing to do
with. The Attorney General is conducting an
inquiry into that phase
1t was part Of this inquiry, Mr. Peckham
pointed out, Ito find out if there was a con-
spiracy in the forming OF this company entered
into. AS l understand, Your Honor has ruled
that 1t would be an error to give the inquiry so
broad a scope and purpose. We would like to
KNOW whether or not we can go into that mat
ter
You have already brought out the facts
the question of constellation" Justice Gaynor
responded, and the different prices of fee have
already been shown. ! have nothing to do with
prices"
IT AIMED AT MONOPOLY.
1T is combination not only to advance
prices, but to gain monopoly of a commodity"
Mr.. Peckham remarked. and he went on to
show that while city officials held stock in the
knickerbOcker company. which did not do any
business in NewYork. they did not own shares
in the Consolidated company, which traded here.
Was not the purpose of the consolidation, Mr..
Peckham minated. to put the city business In
the possession of the city officials?
Judge Gaynor replied that far 1t con-
cerned the city officials he would permit the
scope of the inquiry to be broadened.
New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1900-06-10
JIMMY" HANDLER WINS ON FOUL.

Charlie McKeever. OF Philadelphia. lost TO
Jimmy" Handler, OF Newark. at the Seaside Ath-
letic Club. Coney Island. last night. by foung his
opponent in the sixth round of what was to have
been a twenty-five round contest At us pounds The
attendance was SLIM The bout. far it went
was 4 good ore, both men landing hard and often
with both hands Handler did his best work the
body. and In the fourth round scored clean
knockdown with q right the jaw. Mckeever in
the sixth round struck Handler low. Handler was
hurt and alleged a foul. which was not allowed.
minute later Mckeever deliberately repeated the
blow. This time he promptly disqualified.
New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1900-06-10
CoMpANy,s ICEHoUsEs BURNED

Gardiner Me. June s.-The cehouses at Dresden
owned by the American Ice Company were burned
this afternoon The buildings had a capacity of
thirty-hve thousand tons and contained twenty
thousand tons of ice. which was harvested in the
last winter A vessel being loaded and owing
to long run which the Ice has to pass from
the houses to the vessel IT is necessary TO use
endless conveying chain. which is run by an
engine. Sparks from the smokestack fell upon the
New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1900-06-10
STATE OFFICIALS. TOO?

During Mr. SCOTS examination Mr. Nicol re-
marked that the books. II produced. would be
found to contain the names OF State officials.
Very we'll: il will perhaps be shos:n that this
Is a broader kind OF conspiracy than has yet
been apparent" Mr.. PeckhaTn said.
You are suffering from deuslon." Mr. Nicoll
retOrted.
The name of Charles A. Winch. superintendent
of the company, was then called but there was
response Mr. NicoI explained that Mr..
Winch had been served only with a subpoena
signed by Mr.. Hayes The Judge held that
Winch had been subpoenaed by proper process,
and informed Mr.. Hayes that he could take an
attachment for the delinquent witness.
New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1900-06-10

roof and caused the fire. The Ice was valued at
$4,000 and the icehouses. boarding house. engine
house and blacksmith shop were valued at 5000.
bee Mutual Ice Company, of this city, and later
sold to the knckerbocker Ice Company of Phlla-
delphia which erected additional buildings. These.
with the other Knickerbocker property. were
merged into the Knckerbocker company of Maine,
and later into the American Ice Company. 1t Is
thought there is insurance.
New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1900-06-10
A FRIEND" ADVISED HIM.

Mr.. Murphy said he invested in the knicker-
becker stock che advice OF a friend named
John Mcdonald. who lived at the Hotel I'm
perial Mcdonald did not explain why the stock
would be 4 good investment, but the witness
bought II on his recommendation because he
knew that he (McDonald) was sTeculator.
Murphy admitted that he knew city officials
were not supposed to buy any Consolidated
stock. and it for that reason that ne bought
KnicIEer%ccker.
Odd you sell the men you bought
the stock from? A.-No. ] sold II TO man named
Donohue, as l have already said.
Q.-What did you get for your stock? A
Twenty dollars.
o-Why did Mcdonald consider the Knicter-
booker stock a good investment? Al did not ask
him.
Q.-Was he good terms with politicians and
city officials? A---Not that / know of.
do you mean to tell US that you made an in
yestment OF $4,000 upon other knowledge adj
vice but that a said IL good investment?
A.-That is the truth
OF seems 10 that you must have had some
more information which you have forgotten? A
j have told the truth.
O-Don't YOU think that Mcdonald had learned
from the city officials that the American Ice Com
pany would be good thing? A--No. sir
New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1900-06-10
ICE CASES SENT TO SPECIAL SESSIONS

The District Attorney held meeting OF his stan
yesterday and decided that the Ice Trust directors
held by Magistrate Zeller. In Jefferson Market
Court would be held for Special Sessions instead
Of General Sessions Magistrate Zeler held them
for General Sessions Section No, 400 OF the char
ter provides that all of misdemsanor shall
be tried by Special Sessions.
New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1900-06-10
TITLE TRANSFERRED TO r. H. DRESSED.

Title to property in East Seventy-thIrd-st-. COM
prsins No 23a to 23S. transferred from E. FL
lery Anderson F. II. Dressed for S122560.
recorded yesterday. The buildings occupy plot
New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1900-06-10
MURPHY's SENSE OF HONOR.

At the close Of Mr.. Grants examination q
recess taken. When the hearing
sumed Charles F. Murphy, Dock Commissioner
was called He stated in reply to Mr.. Peckham
that he a stakeholder In the American Ice
Company He had never owned shares Of the
Consolidated Ice Company. but had been in
terested in the KnickerbOcker company. He
held one hundred preferred and three hundred
common stock in the American Ice Company,
and did not see any objection to his doing so.
The stock, which cost him about $4,000 he sold
in March last for sol coo. 1t noted that
Mr. Grams holding Of the same amount as
the stock owned by the witness.
Q.-To whom did you sell all your stock? A-To
g man named DonOhue
DID you sell the Stock Exchange? A--No.
] sold il direct to Donohue.
o.-Who is he? A neighbor.
Odd you retain any interest in the shares?
New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1900-06-10
GELsHENEN's EVIDENCE.

William I. Gelshenen, president Of the Gar
field National Bank, succeeded the Mayor on the
stand. Replying TO Mr.. Peckham he said he had
been the president OF the bank since 1893 Coun-
sci went to ask the witness il he was q d.
rector Of the American Ice Company at one time
when Delaney Nicon protested against the in
troduction of questions the line pursued by
AIR. Peckham unless they referred to the docks
hut, IL being demonstrated to the satisfaction Of
Justice Gaynor that the questions relevant,
Mr.. Peckham was permitted to continue thus
Q-Do you know whether the American Ice Com
pany has been the lessee Of the piers and docks
OF New-York? Al do not.
Q.-Has the Garfield Bank advanced any money
TO the American lee Company?
Il object" cried Mr.. Nicof these questions all
enter INTO the wftness's private business"
Odd you ever hear any reference at directors
mee1nss 70 me Leasing Of city docks 10 the com
Q.-When the Garfield Bank loaned money to
Mayor Van Wyek-- A.-The Garfield Bank never
loaned money to Mayor Van Wyck
Morse. ~ -A
Q.-How much7 A.-The sum was $50 GO
.Q-Dic the bank know that Mr.. Morse was to
immediately transfer the money to the Mayor?
collateral attached, from Mr.. Morse 80
Mr.. Gelshenen's contradiction OF the Mavor,s
testimony that he had borrowed money from the
Garfield Bank gave rise to considerable com
nient in court. Remarks were heard jmplv,no
fective, or that his knowledge as to tust how he
came to acquire the Ice Trust stock WAS not so
clear as he sought to make out while ON the
stand " '
New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1900-06-10
VICE-PRESIDENT SCHOONMAKER

American Ice Company. followed and testified
that while ne was not officially connected with
either the Consolidated or Knickerbocker Com
New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1900-06-10
FER RENTALS DIFFER WIDELY.

now leased by the American lee Company and
also those which had been surrendered by the
trust No effort had been made to lease these
piers There were in all LOG free piers, which
were used for all kinds Of traffic. He knew Of
no reason why they could be used for ice. he
said in reply to Mr., CaGwalader. his counsel.
He was asked to explain by Mr.. Peckham why
the Ice Trust only charged yearly rental
Of 81 500 for the pier at Forty-sixth-st. and
North River, while a manure company was
charged 81 600 for the adjoining pier.
Well" answered Mr. Murphy, Il got a report
stating that only $1,000 had been collected from
the manure company. and as 1t is my custom 70
fix rentals the amount collected L charsed
the ice company $500, making it $500 in
crease over what was collected from the manure
company.
New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1900-06-10
HOW CARROLL GOT HIS STOCK.

''Of course we intend to them for other
purposes" Mr. Peckham calmly agreed. That
is what we are here for" Then the questioning
continued:
Q.-Have you the books Of your company in
court? A.-The secretary has, believe.
C-NaS there stock held IN trust A-1eS
in Mr.. SCOTS name.
Here Mr.. Nicoll interrupted. Was any OF 1t for
public oficia?'
No answered Mr. Morse.
Mr.. Hayes objected to Mr.. Nicolls interference.
and the trust lawyer rebuked
Odd your company ever give any stock away?
A.-Never.
Q-Or make contributions Tammany? A
Q-When the Mayor bought the $500 shares of
preferred stock did you give him the 300 shares
OF common bonus? A.-No.
Odd YOU know if Richard Croker. John f.
Carroll. J. Sergeant Cram and Charles r. Murphy
exchanged their Knickerbocker and Consolidated
for American Ice stock? A.-They exchanged some
and sold
Q.-Iiave you a book that will show positively?
Al don't think
No corporation IS without such book. inter-
jected Mr.. PeCkhan1.
Does such book exist. was II destroyed"
We object TO such insinuation." said Mr..
Nicoll. There have been books destroyed
Q.-Do you know how Mr.. Carroll acquired his
stock? A.-From me.
Q.-How much did he pay A.-The same the
Mayor: $4,000 and divided the same way as the
Did Mr. Carroll ever render any services to
the American Ice Company? A--No. sir.
Q.-Do you know how the Dock Commissioners
got theirs? A.-Don't know.
Q.-Do you know why the price of ice advanced
in New-York this summer? A.-Short crop.
Q.-And why did It drop TO 40 cents? A-Sharp
competition
New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1900-06-10
NOT A EIGILANT MAYOR.

Q-Did you know anything Of these leases to
che Consolidated Ice Company? A.-No nothing
Mr. Peckham then read from the Charter show
ing that it was the duty of the Mayor 10 exercise
SUPERVISOR over al the city departments and to
Q-And despite this you did not know the Amer
tcan Ice Company secured from the Knickerbocker
lee Company the leases Of all piers in the city !?
That wiz do" said Mr. Peckham and the
MAYOR stepped down.
New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1900-06-10

sorbed by the trust he said We're the Crystal
Lake, Union. Independent and Hygeia
Chow did the American Ice Company secure
fits docks? A.-From individuals and private
Q.-DiG you bring minute BOOKS of the Amer
fcan Ice Company here? Al was not so di-
rected.
Q.-Did the American Ice Company own lease
any docks when they began business? A-Not
directly.
Q.-You have acquired docks since you have
been doing business here? A.-No sir
Q.-What other docks does the American Ice Com,
pany besides the docks of the Consolidated
company? CThe witness named them0
,Q;-Does the American Ice Company Use any
docks leased directly from the city? A-,,No.
Q.-Does II use any docks leased by other com
panies from the city? A.-Yes. the Consonoated.
Odd you consult the Mayor about your COCK
privileges? A.-No. sir.
directly the Dock Commissioners
Odd you talk the Mayor about his buying
stock in the American Ice Company? A-No. sir
Q.-You with him all the time down in
Maine and never said anything to him about IT?
A.-No sir.
Q.-Did you talk him about buying Amer
lean Ice stock? A.-When he first desired to buy
Il he asked about
New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1900-06-10
GAVE MAYOR NO ADVICE.

Q.-Did you ever advise the Mayor to buy the
stock? Al never did.
Odd you ever talk with Carroll about puyinS
stock? A.-Not previous to his original purchase
Odd You know he stakeholder in the
Consolidated Ice Company? Ayes did. .
Q.-And in the KniCkerbOcker Ice Company A
Il heard
ODD you know Mr. Cram Mr. Murphy; and
talk with them about buying stock? Al did not
Q-Are the dock facilities for the ice business
limited IN New-York? A.-They are not.
Q.-How many docks there for this purpose:
A.-Hundreds OF them have given up some
They We're not in the right place.
An effort to have Mr.. Morse admit that the
price of ice was controlled by the American Ice
Company was vigorously objected to by the OPP
posing counsel. The Court said the fact could
he established by legal inference. but Mr.. Peck
ham urged that the fact should go on record
That's just it, exclaimed Mr.. Nicoll. Ihat
is an avowal that these proceedings are to be
used for other nIIrnnSCS
Evening star. [volume] (Washington, D.C.) 1854-1972, 1900-06-09
VAN WICK TESTIFIES
New York Mayor Tells Of Hia Ice
Deals.
bad 4,2o0 SHARES In AMERICAN
Tells the Court How He Paid for
Them.
IGNORANT OF IT'S PLANS

NEW YORK. June 9.-Mayor Van Wyck
was called to the witness chair today in the
proceedings against the mayor, the dock
commissioners and Charles w. Morse. pres
ident of the American Ice Company. which
were begun some time ago before Supreme
Court Justice Gaynor. in Brooklyn. These
proceedings are designed to show what. if
any. connection exists between certain city
officials and the Ice company.
The mayor testified that he owned 1900
shares OF the stock in the American Ice
Company, which he had obtained from
President Morse. some of 1t in exchange
for stock in the Knickerbocker Ice Company
of Maine.
quently to becoming mayor OF the city,
Mr.. Van Wyck was asked.
II did
why did you purchase stock in the
Knickerbocker company?'
Because it was paying per cent on
common and q per cent on preferred stock.
When he made the purchase he did not
know that the American Ice Company in
tended to do business in New York city.
He had paid for his stock with a check on
the Garfield National Bank and borrowed
80 per cent of the purchase money.
when You made the purchase it was
agreed that you should borrow from the
bank?'
''Was there any guarantee TO protect you
against loss on that stock?'
NO"
Have you paid back the bank?"
Il have"
"Are you accustomed to such large f1nan-
cial transactions"
Il am.
For the money borrowed the mayor said
he gave four, five and six months notes.
He has paid two notes for $75,OCO each. and
yesterday paid one cash note for $4,000.
Continuing. the mayor said:
THE interest on the notes was per cent.
When l made the renewal of the note the
block of stock was worth $1,000, but |
sold it yesterday for $4,000. The note call
ed for s7o.NU SO 1 lost $1,000. 1 took no
active interest in the American Ice Com
pany. / never knew anything of its man
agement. I never knew that the American
Ice Company was to have any monopoly
of the ice business of the city. 1 never
knew 1t had any leases. I never knew
that the ice company stated to the stock
exchange that it had a contract for eleven
docks in this city,"
Evening star. [volume] (Washington, D.C.) 1854-1972, 1900-06-09
Overheard to Save the Fish.
.om the MinnpapOlis Trihuno


Frank Manner, insurance agent of Min
neapolis. will reach that city at S o'clock
this afternoon from Cass lake, accom-.
panied by big muskallonge which gave
him hard tussle
Mr.. Manner came to the lake yesterday
morning and with Police Judge Berlau went
out on Cass lake for days fishing After
having caught several bass, Mr.. Manner
tried a small spoon hook on a common s.
cent linen line and began to troll for pick
eIel. At 1:3O he got strike and instantly
the fish started OF across the lake. towing
the boat after him. Mr.. Manner and Judge
Berlau were afraid to try to stop the fish
on account of the line breaking 1t being so
small.
The monster carried the line almost
around Copper Island, a distance of two
miles. and then began to show sign of
weakening. When he gave a jump into the
air the fishermen saw their captive was
gigantic muskallonge. He twisted and
turned. but the line held.
Finally, when the boat was about five
rods from shore. the men jumped overheard
and made a dash In the shallow water for
the fish, catching him by the gills. They
succeeded in dragging him ashore, when
they found they had a fish weighing thirty
nine pounds two ounces and measuring four
feet. for their four hours work.
This Is the first case on record where a
fish Of that size has been caught with q
cane pole and a common cheap line.
Evening star. [volume] (Washington, D.C.) 1854-1972, 1900-06-09
HOTELS
This List Appears Every SATURDAY.
HOTELS.
Summer Resorts.
For rates. routes etc. call or address (send stamp,
Hotel Tariff Bureau,
s. Fifth Ave- New York

A.P.. American Plan: EP.. European: op.. openy
90 ........-- 800. Hotel Kenmore. A.P. - mp
ATLANTIC CITY. Nj Hotel Dennis AP 81 to s,
BADEN BADEN tSpec. rms with bath)Si ephanieHii
bAh HARsoR, Ne Porclpine. E.P. CIV wheaton,
noS'oN Mass. Hotel Vendome. APP. 50
90. Harry l. Brown The Westminster. f p. 81
bhookLfS N.i.Hotel St.George Fps AP..&3
CINCINNATI. o.Grand Hotel. E p 81 50: AP. S3uv
pobIIN Ireland. Observation-Disclosures. Hotel Metropoi,
lLfRACoMBE. Eng. Fac. Sea. Imperial Pri. Hote
GLEN SUMMIT Pa Glen Summit Htl July to Oct
GREENFIELD. Mass Mansion House. AP. 81 so 81
JAMESTowN.R.I.T Tie ThorndIke OPP. June 6 to Oct
KANSAS CITY No TheMidland f p. $fup: "A T. s3ul
LIBERTY, N. y. The Wawonda Bookleti
do. ...... Piuney House. Entirely new. sl0 weel
LONDON st. Esmin's identiai hotei Gne1ccie,i 70,
lcuisine. comfort Mod. tariff
NAHANT. Mass. Hotel Fudor, AP., $3.50 wk NJ
NEW YORK. .....F Fifth Avenue Hotel. A.P IS up
doHerad So tnew. freproof .3ith. w BY E.P.. $lbd
90 Chamters&w. B way Cosmopolitan. E.P. 81 up
do Brevoort House, EP.. 81 up; AP.. IS US
NEW ORLEANS, La. New ST. Charles. AP.. So up
N ADAMS. Mass. Wellington. f 81; A.P So. so VI
PHILADELPHIA. Aldine. E. 81 Soup: T.. So soup
PFrTSFlEID. Mass The Wendell. f +. slu?;A T. S3uy
PLYMOUTH, Eng. tNewProp. ] HSt anbury ,I;rand Htl
SARATOGA. n. Y. .Huests House. A.P s.. 50 Ut
WASHINGTON. d. C. Arlington Hotel. A.P. IS
90. .-............. The Raleigh. E. p. 81. so up
WATCH HILL. Il. l.. Atlantic House. Golf link,
WHITE MTS. The Waumek ID. b. Plummer,
DO. Profile House & Cottages Op. June to Oct,
Evening star. [volume] (Washington, D.C.) 1854-1972, 1900-06-09
NATIONAL SAENGERFEST,
Programs for the Two Principal Con-
certs Decided On.


The programs for the two principal con-
certs of the nineteenth national saenger-
fest. which will begin in Brooklyn on June
80 next, have now been decided upon by
the musical committee and there is no
doubt about their meeting with the approval
oe all lovers of music. Chorus singing has
been judicously blended with the renditions
Of soloists and orchestral selections. and in
many instances the audiences will have an
opportunity to listen to compositions that
have never been rendered In public before.
Tho programs are as follows:
1. Concert. July 2. p.m.-Overture from
"Rienzi" Wagner; song. Awake, It's Day.
break" A. Kirchl, chorus and orchestra.
soprano solo. Thou, Dear Hail." Wagner,
Miss Louisa B. Weight; mems chorus la
The Bard silcher, monster chorus;
Prologue to the Festival, symphony. F. van
d. Stucken, orchestra composed especially
for the saengerfesO; baritone solo from
con-Davies; special chorus-(a) "At the
Shore" and (b) Bird. Whittier so Quick"
s; L. Hermann. Maennerchor of Philadel-
Raa and In e, the bs MS5nns KIM A'1s
Grieg, second prize chorus of the saenger-
fest; duet from 1.-The Flying Dutchman,"
Wagner. Miss Louisa B. voigt and
and orchestra; Hail Columbia
2 Concert, July 3. p.m.-overture. "The
Meistersinger,'' Wagner. orchestra; "a
Stormy Night" c. Attenhofer, chorus and
orchestra: baritone solo. by Mr.. Carl
Schlegel; alto solo, .'The Fiddler of
G'muend," Hermann, Mrs. Josephine ia
CODY: a. "Motherlove," H. voigt; b. who
Knoweth Where" L. Koemmenich, first
prize chorus; overture from "Egmont,"
Beethoven; soprano solo, air from "Obe-
ron.'' Weber, Miss Louisa B. Voist; a. my
Old Kentucky Home" c. Foster; b. Lore
ley" Silcher. monster chorus: Emperor's
March. Wagner. orchestra; Song Of Tri-
umph Of the Germans" Franz Abt.
Evening star. [volume] (Washington, D.C.) 1854-1972, 1900-06-09
A shrewd Negro and the Eclipse.

ShfeWO negro ana tnc Eclipse.
From the Galveston Daily News.
Sunday night, while negroes from several
large plantations in the eastern part of the
county were at church. a strange negro
appeared and told them that he had been
told in a dream that early the next morn
ing a small black spot would appear on
the sun which would grow larger and
larger until finally the sun would become
almost obscure. This. he explained, would
be sign of Gods displeasure at their sin
full ways and of their misery gifts to the
church and the poor. and that In case lib
eral donations were not made to appease
Gods wrath awful things would happen.
He Furnished a member of each family
with a darkened glass, with Instructions
how to use IL, and warned them in case
the spot appeared to lose no time in get
ting to church and to come prepared to
make liberal gifts and to pray
The game, it is said. worked like
charm. and as soon as the spot on the sun
was observed the negroes FASTENED to
church with whatever small change they
had. which was turned over to the strange
negro. Shortly after the eclipse the negro
left on his errand to distribute the gifts
to the needy and has not been seen since
in that section.