The Indianapolis journal. [volume] (Indianapolis [Ind.]) 1867-1904, 1896-11-16
BRITISH SPY SYSTEM
DETECTIVE PINKERTON on THE
ENGLISH SECRET SERVICE.
Once Refused to Serve that Govern
ment and Spotted lie CarOn and
McDermOtt i'm This Country.

CHICAGO. Nov 15.-"The British govern
ment always has secret-service men in its
employ i'm this country endeavoring to un-
ravel any plots which might arise" said
William Pinkerton yesterday. as he spoke
of one Jones who gave startling testi-
mony in the Bow-street Police Court in
London Friday in connection with the
Ivory case.
The remark was partly a refutation of
charge made some time ago that the Pin
kertons had assisted her Majestys gov
ernment, and it proved the keynote to an
interesting recital of some inside history
connected with the LIE Caron and Red Nc
Dermott spies of few years ago. Mr..
Pinkerton said: a.
I'm connection with the arrest of Tynan
recently for some reason it was stated
that these arrests were made through our
agency. / was not here at the time, but
denied the matter in the San Francisco
papers. 1 want to derry here that we ever
assisted the British government. In a few
cases we have been called upon to assist
Scotland Yard in civil case, but have
never taken part in a criminal case. Dur
ing the Parnell suit against the London
Times the British sent representative
here to retain our services in that suit, but
my brother and 1 both declined the en-
ployment. The man who approached me
was an ex-detective, and 1 told him at the
time that | did not think he would make a
success at his business, and that the way
he was doing he was going to get himself
hurt If he didn't look out. He went to New
| York from here where he framed up
combination with some people. who got all
his money and sold him bogus information.
hot &c he lac lrr,nx of ErSr tcb do
tective looking for any information of that
| kind in this country. But this man did not
have the recognition of Scotland Yard.
1T now looks like those cases in England
| have been worked up by men such as lie
| Caron who have been for years In the Sc
| cret service of the British government lie
Caron lived here for several years and was
| never known or suspected of being what he
| was until year or two before the London
| Times cases came up. He used to run
| drug store here, and took a prominent part
| in Irish affairs
AT this time the late John Crawford.
chief clerk in the assessors office on the
| North Side. and Joe Martin. lately candi-
date for Congress on the Democratic tick
| et were en- route to Europe. On shipboard
| they picked up an acquaintance with lie
! Caron, who was going to Paris. AS he
spoke French fuently they kept up his
acquaintance and frequently met and dined
aboard the boat to return they were much
| surprised to find that lie Caron was 2 pas
senger with them. He seemed to stick
|
| on Crawfords return. We being very good
/ friends he called on me. and, among other
things: told me of the actions of this man.
| frequently talked on Irish national affairs
| and had tried to take him into some head
| quarters of that kind in Paris. But Craw-
| ford told him emphatically that, while he
was an Irish-American he was not mixed
up in Irish national affairs. and would not
| go where any of those leaders were or be
Introduced to them, and Joe Martin tod
| him the same thing.
| when they reported lie Caron's actions
| to me / told them / did not know the man
| nor had 1 ever heard of him. but advised
| Crawford to have nothing whatever to do
with him. Later on Crawford told me that
but 1 declined the honor / Crawford
at that time that believed aron was
| secretly employed by the ament of
Great Britain, and L wanted IA hing to do
| with him.
Later on. I'm connection with some busi
ness of the office Mr.. McPharlan, who is
now superintendent of our Denver agency.
and who worked up the MolIie Mcguire
brought in contact with lie Caron. On his
| return to the agency | asked him what he
thought of lie Caron. and. without any
secret service Of the British government.
So We were not surprised when. a few
months afterward; lie Caron SO boldly
the government for ten years.
Another secret agent of the British gov
| L.
all the old-time newspaper men OF Chicago,
| was Red McDermott who posed a news
| paper writer in this city and Brooklyn, was
a great leader in Clan-na Gael affairs, and
continually talking and denouncing as spies
people whom he did not like. He did this
so much that my attention was called TO
him, and one night in an argument which
was participated in by several politicians
McDermott was particularly loud-mouthed.
/ took occasion to call him down. said he
was a fraud and offered to bet him that
he was spy and misleading his. comDan-
ions. He became very indignant and
threatened to kill me If | did not retract
But | did not retract. and within ninety
days the papers came out with the report
that Red McDermott was not only what
said he was. but great deal worse. he
had been leader In Clan-na-Gael affairs
land for protection. and was by the au-
thorities there sent away. Whether he is
living or dead I do not know, for he has
never been heard from since.
While in London four years ago a prom
inent official and a friend Of mine asked me
if / would like TO go see lie Caron at his
! cottage i'm the suburbs OF London / told
him that had never met the man when he
was here. and l did not care 10 meet him
| abroad.
There Is no doubt that the British gov.
eminent il continually alert for plots In
this country. But the work Is all done boy
; British secret-service men,.
. Gathering of Irishmen Called.
NEW YORK. Nov 15.-At a meeting o
the Amnesty Aid Association to-day ar
. rangements were made for the holding o
a massive gathering of the Irish race in
, this city for the purpose OF augmenting tn
funds for the caring OF Dr; Thomas Gal
political prisoners. now confined in tn
sanitarium at Amityyille. Long island
| Delegations are expected from Philadelphia
I Baltimore. Washington, Boston and othe
? cities.