The Salt Lake herald. [volume] (Salt Lake City [Utah]) 1870-1909, 1895-10-25


have been trying to stay the TIDE
against the party by alleging that
Poherts' desire for a separation OF
,1,,,rab and state has been acquired
since his nomination for Congress-
This is a palpable untruth to those
h,ho know the great orator whom the
democracy has delighted to hohor
and no nroof is needed for them. But
n satisfy others The Herald reprints
2 speech made by 5. H. Roberts at d
time when he was regarding himself
as ont of political life and was not IN
the field for any office
The occasion was the banquet given
to tbe DELEGATES to the silver confer
ence in May of this year and Mr..
Roberts responded to the toast
earhurch and state" Every visiting
elegate was impressed with the
sneeoh. 1t was made in the midst OF
the festivities. after midnight ana
after the gathering had been thor
onghIv worked up. The great orator
caught and held the attention OF all on
. eerious subject for fully half an
bo11r Next day everybody there, IN
Guiding Judee Goodwin, who was
postmaster. was singing the praises
of Mr.. Roberts. and at that time the
editor Of the Tribune was Wlhng 10
concede the seriousness of the subJecs
on which the great orator spoke. A
shorthand report shows the following
proceedings:
Judge Goodwin-The committee that
7,repared this programme, having an
idea, that something would be needed
TO bring men back to sober thoughts.
after Governor McConnelrs speech,
made the next sentiment, Church and
State" and they pnt down as the
sneaker Utah's most eloquent son.
aApplause). It gives me extreme pleas
Lre TO introduce to you the Hon. 3. H.
Roberts. applause.
Roberts Response.
Honorable POSTMASTER and GEN
+1en7en-T think for the first
+in,a in nv life appre-
ciate the feelings of the young shep-
herd. David, when Israels proud king
rlaced upon him his own plated ar
NOR; gave him a heavy gold shield
and a great spear with which to en-
gage in his conflict with Goliath, and
Dayid said: 4 am not equal to these
things. take them away" He ap-
ueared before his antagonist in the
simple garb Of the shepherd, with his
sling and few smooth stones. And
so. after the very flattering introduc-
ton that has been given me by the
honorable POSTMASTER of the evening
I feel myself unworthy to bear the
hCn7red title that ne has given me.
IT disclainn It altogether and say in
Esimple truth. I am not an orator, but
= as YOU all know, "a plain, blunt man,
capable only Of speaking those things
that you already know l therefore
most humply beg TO disclaim the
fv,FV E
the POSTMASTER would assign me.
l.. when 7 was Informed that ] would
o. expected to speak upon this staid,
Send I may say threadbare subject
HChurch and State" it appeared tC
me that the committee who had ar
ranged this programme had gone
somewhat out of the way in selecting
such a subject; but [ defer 70 their
Judgment and am willing 10 say it is
all right. but ask that you gentlemen
of the banquet viii not hold me re-
sponsibIe for inviting your sober con
federation to such theme in the midst
of such temptations to do otherwise.
(Applause).
The Three Relations.
There are three relations which the
church and the state may sustain 10
each other. First, the state may dom
mate the church; second, the church
NAV dominate Tie SAs@lS, anu, lnlIG-
church and state may occupy separa Il
Epheres. and be absolutely divorced
the one iron the other Those who
argue for the rightfulness Of the first
relationship viii tell you that the
state is not within the church, but
the church is within the state; they
viii tell you that it is the state which
rules the land. that wages war. that
Jevies taxes and governs at least the
external destinies Of the citizen, and
4hat whenever the religious creeds
&cease to be individual and result il
ssocistions those organizations come
vyithin the proper cognizance and au-
thority Of the state; and that the
state has a right to draw the lines OF
ecclesiastical policy. and to fix the con-
stitution ef the church as knowing
what is best for the general society.
Those who contend for the second re
lationship-that the church should die
tate to the state-argue that the
church, as the representative Of the
divine authority, is also the superior
authority; that indeed the state Itself
is but an outgrowth Of that superior
authority; that as the moon but re-
fleets the light of the sun, so The
state borrows whatsoever Of authority
II possesses from the spiritual author
f4v-the church. Furthermore, they
insist that in the matter Of chronology
scal order itself, the church antedate!
dhe State: il is the first society, print
1--WE and eternal, and hence has the
true sovereignty; that the state i: