New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1895-04-21

gave the names Of number OF iniornahtS'
among them Fireman James ID. Clifford the
president Of the Firemen's Mutual Benevolent
| Association. and FiIemen Frederick }. Rothen-
hauser and Timothy Regan Other Information
| had been given he said. by firemen whose names
he did not at the time remember
MIR. oI-IGG KNOWS LOU" PAYN.
There was a stir in the courtroom when Mr..
QuiSg with faint smile said he had got some
OF his information from Lou Payn.
Mr.. Root with feigned surprse)-1o you .d kho"
| Odd you have any conversation with him
about the amendment to the Firemens salary
Mr. Ranes-Wc object to the introduction Of
@ Qy Mr.. Rootl-Did Mr., Payn ,s say y,h he could
have The amendment passed? A;+he m ,dn oi1' regard
ing his action with reference to the amendment OF
h that G SO It ha, it would mprGy a told me he
had put the amendment on the Dill ana he "o"'u
Odd he say anything to you with regard to
any pecuniary benefit he was TO obtain
Mr.. Raines objected 20 the question. which
was therefore not persisted in.
anything done with that bill in the Committee of
the Senate? A-fes. sir a.. ,,os roe,rd
ing these Facts npo y4 %hh You are % speakng
No not just at the moment; mad. ~ tho hin while
it was in the Senate Commitee? A. the orig naI nal
bl was bin to increase the hreTen ne M paE Gr.t rrad
was sloo, the second s.lco and the third sl,2oo
year. The bill to increase the second grad
I biz passed the Assembly at the time II was IN the
Q.~Before your conversation with Mr.. payn vas
anything done with the bin in the senate? ~ -
the Cities Committee The Pavey bill vas not re-
be !a gR0n hi is va % Sae by n
was favoratly reported 10y the Senate Cltes ''h-
me1 Wha M!h waa a. 9he naSTt of this
A-The amendment ITacuralIy increased tne 1a.
Robertson IN vas reported from thG co cqmm''Ss tee
committee for further consideration
INTERVIEWS WITH MR. PAYN RECALLED.
Upon the suggestion of Mr. Root the witness
proceeded to relate the substance Of his inter
views with Mr. Payn:
that understood he vas not going to offer any
said that l said was Glad OF It.
Mr.. Root dnterpos.asl-Had there been, prior 70
and Nr Payn lead him to withdraw all op7osi-
Mr. Quisg Mr.. Payn did tell me that he had been
asked 70 abandon his opposition to the HI
which YOU had knowledge?
Mr.. PAYN COULD MAKE \ SACRIFICE.
Mr. Qulgg-wen. had requested certain persons
! 10 ask him desist in his opposition. Mr.. Payn
said ne had been asked TO abandon his opposition
10 the bill, ard that he was going 20 DO
it, But he wanted me understand that
II he did this. 1t would be at quite
sacrifice 10 himself l replied | DIS
tressed 10 hear H. on that occasion he loi me
that the bill would be reported from the Senate
Committee the next day. I asked him Il the bill
would be reported in It's original form. He said
Yes" / asked him II he was about that
and he again replied affirmatively. | asked him II
anybody else would raise objection to the promised
Amendment; He said nobody else would. That
amendment. | may explain. was for Increasing the
salaries OF the officers ! said ! thought | would
20 10 Albany on the following day and see II
| through. but ne said II was not necessary. But
| | said I would 20 anyhow. did go. and | saw
| Mr. Payn In the Senate Chamber asked him y
the Pavey bill going 10 be reported. and he
said II was. I asked him II Il would be done n
once and he answered. Yes. this afternoon" He
then said TO Il suppose you want this done
no matter how much this to me-" and
! replied Yes" He then said somethlng-I don't
exactly remember the precise words. but theiT
substance that he not doing II for my
sake.
asked him II he had seen Senator Robertson.
and he replied NO" but that he would DO so at
once | told him II he did not do It at once there
might be DELAY in the committee but he said need
not bother myself as the bill would come out The
bill did come that afternoon. but without the Rob
| Mr. Root-Did Payn say anything as 10 the nature
| Of the sacrifice he making?
| Mr. Qulgg-In the first interview he said; 1T viii
be quite expensive TO me" and upon the second oc-
! casfon he but This question: Il suppose you want
me?"
Q-You referred in the published article to ,'one
| Of the most notorious political lobbyists" Whom
| did you mean by that? Al meant Louis F. Payn
Mr.. Ouigg said he had got his Information
| about the proposal to raise money. and about the
| use 10 which the money was To be put almost
| entirely from Fireman Clifford.
| TESTIMONY OF COMMISSIONER SHEFFIELD
| The committee decided - defer the cross-ex-
animation Of Mr. Quigg until Fire Commissioner
| Sheffield had testified. The Commissioner told
about the services he had performed as the paid
| attorney Of the 1renen before he was appointed
to office in the department. and he said he did
| not know OF the raising Of any money In con-
nection with the passage Of the salary bill There
! was an understanding. he said, when ne under
took the task Of advocating the passage Of the
| bill that no money to be raised by the fire
men. anI that no political influence was to be
brought 10 bear to the passage OF the bill.
As the attorney for che iremen he SAID ne
though. he would have been In position 70
know IL money had been raised by the fremen to
secure the passage CT the bill and he had not
known Of the raising Of money.
Mr. Sheffield said that he had talked with a num-
ber Of Senators In advoca ting the bill before was
pa ssed and he remembered that Senators CoSge-
shall and Raines had declared themselves to be
in favor Of the bill and that Senator Robertson
had said ne was in favor OF raising the salaries
Of both fremen and officers. He had heard "A
ruuor about the raising OF money to secure the
passage of the amendment to the BILL but most
| Of his Information on that subject had been "b-
tanned from Mr. Quigg since the bill was passed
He had had frequent interviews with Mr.. Qugg'
as they had been mutually interested In the flre-
| mems bill and also in the judicial safes OH.
| JIe had talked with Mr.. Quigg at the newspaper
| once as late as last Wednesday evening about
| tho renorts that money had been raised, ana the
story was published on the following morning
| II was known on Wednesday evening, NJ sald;
| maj senator Raines had opposed the judicial
| Sales bill ,s,o.,o. ch.m.,,
| cnncluAnd (ie0rYc Ra.ncS neGdm lne