New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1894-08-21
DEBS ON THE WITNESS-ST1 AM.
HE SAYS HE HAD NO VOICE IN okDhh-
ING THE STRIKE.
.or,,rp GRIEVANCES BESIDES THE PULLMAN
TROG'BLE-MR. PULLMAN ASKED ~ ~"
PEAR BEFORE THE COMMISSION

Ch,oo,o Aug 9o-President Eugene V. Debs, or
tho American Railway Union occupied 'he s''
for nearly four hours to-day before '''e
Strike Commission. He advocated cooperative
,.-.,o,,,b the abolition Of the wage system
and tho Government ownership of rallroads. ne
tall his side of the strike as conhecte" "a'
tive. which was frequently Interrupted pS 'Pp'""'
from the laboring element present
= H. Morrssey. First Nice-Grand MASTER VI VI.
order of Railway Trainmen, and Grand 'ne'
clark of the order of Railway Conductors "''o
testified. ,,,r,v
President Debs said that he was th'r's
eight years old and. in addition to being "' III.
head OF the American Railway tnloh was ''
Of The Locomotive Firemans Magazine ~ "
| titled that from the beginning he was opPostA ~ g"
strike and told vice-Pre'dent Howard III '''
continued:
twice went to George NJ. Pullman ana 10 co s,l
,orn ~ Pullman to thoroughly investigate me con
ditlons existing at the carshops oui'u enough 70
ys bu, were daily getting deeper into ne deD' ,b S
the Pullman Company. No matter no" (i ~ s,Ih
cn,dI,Ions were there the men were oD'lseu 49,, ~
cynuit'on ~ WIEN I found out Al. these things
immedlate.y determined that the Ameri.dn ofSr
Union sho"d s W to bt tn that any fair Board .,
Arbitration would have declared III h,ation This
I'M p,,l,nan COMPANY arbitrarily refused Not OILY
this but when asked them 10 eNd,,, ,, ANYTHING
question to see whether or not tnere "'' aug
| To- arbtrate they also refused TINS uood ran
Vnrv much has been said about an a hi che me
spracy asa,s , ~, coIi the attention Of this com
mission to the fact that every mgeons nn doors and
hat reprcsentatives Of the press were allowed % ~
present II there had been any cGnsp''% moro secret
nnis;ed W. certainly should have been more '7O'''
about 1t.
Mr. Debs ,hen tod OF the several fai urcs OF 'ne
| American Railway Union to secure hearing iio."
the Pullman Company and the subsequent '''us'
ration OF the strike. He said:
Not only did the employees OF the yarsoIs 3n ," 70
toans piirSa, emnloves but because the various
roads had grievances Of their own wnicH IL d,nnra
- ,revent strikes during the Worlds FAR as we
did not believe 1t just TO the pupS TO- cnd he
donc bv the leaders OF the labor unions 20 prrreh
a strike. In view OF the men TN panv Of the
roads promised Increase OF wages an n a'
fair over Instead Of c inte5 't TO- begin sys-
tematic reduction OF wages througho"e ~ ~ .orno
try No two companies redus.I w1gsrii@ant action
II shows me that there was a conC.it % a. 80,
sh io arouse the antagonism Of too many rail-
road employees at the same tinc $40, Il, con,
When in nne chicago on june a. It confronted
by those conditions as wei as inc S'''' Va ""'''
at Pullman.
WAS this convention called TO consider the re-
ducton Of wages or the Iu'l'la" "
Commissioner wright.
| ..rb. convention was called for no specific pur-
nose II was the regular quadrennial cohVe"''o"
providcd for by the constitution.
The witness then enumerated the faiure Oh '''
old labor organizations TO gain redress Tor '"e
er,evances OF the employees and asserted that they
~, ,bo,r only hone lay IN the American Railway
r.,lo, IN which they finally turned for help. When
| ass.d what the outcome OF the convention "hich
declared the boycott against Pullman cars "ould
have. been had 1t not been for the grievances OF
p,ll,nan euployes Mr. Dcbs said there would have
h..n no strike but FOR the Pullman trouble as the
American Railway Union. owing TO the depressed
condition Of the country deemed II an inauspicous
time TO strkc.
| 81 would Ike 10 state" said Mr. Debs, that the
railroad companies have never raised ""Fes o'
their own accord. Every Increase In wages mas
hecn wrung from them by organized labot
.r hs1 no voice IN ordering this strike myself
| s,a tho witness but II had had voice In IT,
would have ordered IT. have no desire 70 shirK
any responsibility. My record Will show also that
have always counselled against violence The tee-
gram attributed 10 me which read save your
money and buy "A gun though sent over my sig
no,u-. | never saw. IL sent by our sienog-
,,n.r I, his superior In Montana, and was not IN
| tended literally It merely a playful express
sion current In Montana.
Debs claimed that the men would have won me
| strike hal not the courts interfered
1T was not the Hers" h. said nor the OH
| labor organizations but the Federal courts that
KEEP, Us from winning By the arrest Of the leaders
the ranks Of the strikers were demoral'zed"
lie charged General Niles with being IN league
with the railroad to suppress the strike
and related instances where. AZ h. alleged men
were made 10 work at the point OF the bayonet The
refusal OF the general managers to accept the ~
| Il Us proposition 70 end the STRIKE was then re-
| cited MIR Dehs denied that the \. r. L. had any
antlpa,hy FOR the old organizations. lie added
Within tho next three days We are going TO take
steps 70 unity all railroad labor nfslnlzitohs. "
are willing 10 give up our positions ana s,'rIce
| the 4 T. l. q accomplish this result. and agree
no, accep, official position at the head OF the
How would you gain the demands OF lahorers
on quasi public corporations! asked Judge worm
There are two ways. one Is the way adopted by
the old brothcrhoois. That IS getting "A schedule
OF wages gradually from the companies There has
been llttle good In this mode OF procedure IL taxes
| n strike 10 win sometimes. but don't belieV" the
railroad employees OF this country coull win
strike to-day If they were all orsanlar,d IN one
show in twenty years OF wiring th hn ths sys
are times when they are justihable. no matter how
much the public h. disconnected.
arhitrot ion ana | do not think the Government
supervision OF railroads would answer the purpose;
In such a case ms that OF the Pullman COMPANY
believe compulsory arbitration would be OF benefit
4 state court might be- of some good Tor Ordinary
a riai Of the difference by jury am in favor of
some system however that VII result III mutual iI
Arbitration can result In anything but III feeling
in favor OF bo csnsnE tnc %Sse said
the witness. u believe In cooperative oo''''''"
wealth" Co.. e,.t,,, :.
"In other words you believe In state Socialism,
said Chairman Wright.
We'll I'm the essential points OF State Socialism
The wage system is nothing more than sInVery'
George NJ Pullman has been asked TO appear
hefor. the Labor Commission To give testimony as
TO the difficulty between himself and his employees
II WAS said to-day that Chairman Carroll ID.
Wright OF the Commission. had "A personal inter
view ON Saturday with Mr.. Pullman and informed
him that he would requested u testify. Whether
Mr. Pullman had acccded to declined t. comply
with the request and what course the Commission
would pursue In the event OF Mr.. Pullman proving
contuma cous would all appear In proper time IN
the nrocccdngs of the Commission Mr. Wright said.
II was said that requests similar to that sent
to Pullman sent to several OF IN" gen
eral managers. SO far could be learned only one
OF them has responded thus far.
GOVERNOR ALTGEID VISITS PULLMAN.