Pittsburg dispatch. [volume] (Pittsburg [Pa.]) 1880-1923, 1890-03-16
THEFAMOUS FORGERY
Once More the Subject of a Congress
sional Investigation.
COL. SANDS AT LAST ON THE STAND.
He Tells What He Knows About Foraker,
Wood and the Ballot Box.
SOME OTHER STORIES CONTRADICTED


WASHINGTON, March 15.-After a recess
of over a month the special House commit
tee charged with an investigation of the
Ohio ballot box forgery, met this morning
to conclude the taking of testimony. A. U.
Sands, of Cincinnati, was called to the
witness stand. He told the various public
Offices he had held, being United States
Marshal for the southern district of Ohio,
United States Railroad Commissioner, and
President of the Cincinnati School Board.
He was a member of the Republican con-
vention which last nominated Governor
Foraker, and was on very friendly terms
with him and with Mr.. Kurtz, his secretary.
On September 80 last witness met Kurtz
at the Governors Office. Did not tell him
that the Governors ballot box speech was a
cracker; that he had been to Washington
about the ballot bill; that James E. Camp
bell had seen the President to facilitate the
passage of the bill; that leading Ohio Re
publicans were interested in the bill, and
that he (witness) had seen the contract.
A GENERAL DENIAL.
Witness never did come to Washington
to look into the ballot box matter. There
might be some truth in Kurtz's statement,
but witness had never told him that he knew
of these things of his personal knowledge.
Did not make any communication to Mr..
Halstead to the effect that he knew anything
personally of the ballot box matter. No
vember IA witness received letter from Mr..
Kurtz asking to see him as soon as conven-
lent. 1t was a private letter, and the witness
did not care to produce it, but yielded to
Mr.. Grosvenor's demand.
The letter was dated Columbus, Novem-
Der 13, and in it Kurtz says he fears Sands
may think he is responsible for the CONNER
cial Gazette publication, but that he is not,
and adds that he wishes to have a chat with
him at the first opportunity. 1t was marked
"private."
Witness went on to tell of a conversation
he had with Kurtz at the Gibson House,
during the course of which Kurtz declared
that he was not responsible for the publica-
tion, and said that the Governor had made
a mistake in saying anything to Mr.. Hal
stead about the talk in the Governors office
that day. The publication referred to was
a suggestion that Sands be called as wit
ness, as he could tell something about the
ballot-box forgery. The Gibson House in
terview as testified to by Kurtz was read to
witness and he was asked whether it was
correctly stated.
A DIFFERENT ACCOUNT.
In answer he gave an account of the con-
versation, which was to the effect that he
had told Kurtz that he believed that he had
destroyed his letter of November Is, but he
denied having appealed to Kurtz to say
nothing about the conversation at the Gov
ernor's Office. Witness had said that he might
be called as a witness. Kurtz replied that
he would not, as his testimony would con-
Germ a private conversation. Witness had
said that he did not care if every word he
had said was published, provided that Gov
ernor Foraker's statements in the conversa-
tion were also published. If the conversa-
tion was published the Governor would get
the worst of it.
fiThe witness next told of his conversa-
tion with Governor Foraker at Col
umbus September 80. The Governor
had told him that Wood was tired of the
gang and wanted to down them. Witness
told him not to place too much trust in
Wood. They spoke of Woods candidacy
for the smoke inspectorship. Witness had
told the Governor that Wood had told him
he was friendly to Foraker, but was going
to work quietly for Campbell. When wit
ness told him it would keep him busy riding
two horses in opposite directions, Wood had
replied that was all right, and that they
must have his ballot box in any case. All
this witness told Governor Foraker, as he
was afraid Wood might lead him into
trouble. He also told Kurtz that Wood was
not friendly to Foraker.
FoRAKER's PLANS.
The Governor mentioned Camnbell az
being connected with the ballot box scheme
and said that Wood had told him others
were in it. Wood was to furnish him the
contract and subscription list. If witness
had known that the Governor had the
papers then, he would have stopped the
whole business. He had influence enough,
he thought, to do that, and would have
stopped it as soon as he saw Senator Sher-
mans name.
On cross-examination, the witness said
that he had not spoken to Kurtz at the
Governors Office about the ballot box. He
was not surprised to get Kurtz's letter as he
supposed they were anxious about the pub
location and might fear that he would say
something. The Chairman wished to know
why, if he had said nothing to Kurtz, about
the ballot box, witness was not surprised to
get his letter.
Witness replied that he had cautioned
Kurtz against Wood and had quoted his
conversation with Wood-that might have
been the basis of the letter. He had not,
however, repeated that part of the conversa-
tion where Wood said Campbell had gone
to the President to help along his bill.
At this point the further examination was
postponed until Monday.