The Daily bulletin. [volume] (Honolulu [Hawaii]) 1882-1895, 1887-11-22
AFTERNOON SESSION.


The House resumed at Pm and
continued the discussion of the
Loan Act.
Mr.. Castle continuing his argu-
ment, said On the ground Of pub
lie policy have few more words to
say. We will suppose person in
the country has a certificate for
bonds, he goes TO the house of Ma
theson q Co., presents his certili-
cate, and is politely informed that
there are no more bonds; he should
have come before. He then de-
mands the money and is told that
there is no money in their hands for
such purpose. Is he going to lose
money? No. He is going to his
Government and ask for help, and
they are going to help him. The
consequence will be that We will
have law suits on our hands and
they are expensive. In conclusion
would say, that it is important to
keep in view that this is question
between this Government and the
subscribers of the bonds. l say we
should issue the bonds to the
amount of 100000.
Minister Brown stated that he
should confine his remarks to some
assertions made by Messrs. Bald
nj
house of Matheson & Co. is as re-
spectacle n house as there is in
London. 1t has been said that this
syndicate is myth. l partially
endorse that, but Mr.. Armstrong
sold the bonds of this country and
the receipts were paid into the
bank. 1t has been stated that
49, 600 have been stolen, and for
argument sake we will say it has
been. What remedy do these gen.
tlemen propose? That we go and
steal this money from some one
else? If we could recover this mo-
ncy from Mr.. Armstrong, | say let
us do it, but two wrongs can't make
Alright, and fora reform Legislature to
recommend such aprocedure is incon
ceivable. If this agent of ours has
made charges not warranted by law,
we must go for him in q proper
way. There are no bonds in the
hands of our agent that we can at
tach; they are all held by innocent
persons who paid their money in
good faith. 1t is an advantage for
this Government to pay her indebt-
edness in pounds rather than in S.
gold pieces. Therefore, l hope the
the House will support the section
as read.
Mr.. Widemann reviewed the for
mer laws in regard to loans. We
had no credit in London then, be-
cause we had no bonds to give as
security. With such security we
can get money any where. l had
conversation with a gentleman in
London on the 9TH of July, who
stated that the $2,000,0 900 loan was
ready. What, said L, what loan :?
Why the Hawaiian Loan. L don't
know anything about it. 1t seems
that they knew more about Ha-
waiian loan than did, who had just
come from Hawaii, and the law au-
thorizing the loan was not passed until
September. So, gentlemen, you
can imagine where the loan was
conceived, and in August it was
published in London paper that
an agent of the Hawaiian Govern
ment was in New York to negotiate
100000 loan. There can be
no doubt but that the people hold
ing the certificates have paid every
penny that their certificates repre-
sent. We will call them the honest
creditors and we are the honest
debtors. For the honor of the coun-
try, not for its credit, they should
be paid. Can we keep this money
from them to repay us for what the
syndicate have kept back2 Unless
they are paid, the British Govern
ment will take up the matter and
there will be mischief to pay. If
we send the bonds to England, the
Courts will garnishee them, and we
will be obliged to deliver them to
the legitimate subscribers.
Mr.. Townsend said that the differ
ent views held were due to their
being based on different premises.
If all could agree that we were now
dealing, not with the syndicate or
Matheson, but with the English pub
lie, all would then agree that the
bonds must be delivered. If this
scrip were held as the pledge of the
Hawaiian Government as represent
ing those bonds then there could be
but one conclusion. He would there
fore support the bill as presented or
with the amendment of sendiag
representative to investigate.
Mr.. Wilder said he was at present
under a cloud. He was trying to
build railway. He went to London
to obtain the money and was within
twenty-four hours of success. Had
there been no trouble about the
bonds he would have been at work
now. He could not borrow the
money if these bonds were not
delivered to the London public. But
he did not wish the House to con-
slider that in the least. Mr.. Arm
strong came here and stated to those