New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1887-05-18
G0urp AND UNION PACIFIC.
.,rrsy,prrs nRenRn THE COMMISSION.

A
A. "A familiar 10 who daily frequent Wall street.
ar vttness chair before the Pacific Railroad Com
,.,.r chairman Pattison and his associates, H. Eery
Ira.rson and Mr. Uttler were promptly In their Places
80. tnro was NJ that hour slim attendance of spee'a
torn Congressman l. T. Payson, OF Illinois, men'eei "
enc Pacific Railroad Committee Of the House OF 'ep'
sentatiyes came In and nodestly took seat In the r
:, ,h rapor,ey tahle As the morning session advahee
however the room began 10 I'll up. This was osIT'
true when jay Gould appeared shortly before II
He came in accompanied By Aremas H. Holmes on. W., on
of the assistants In his Office. Ex-Judge piio" ""
present from the opening of the session. .. hi.
Mr. Pondir started out 20 give some l''"," -.
oor,or oonsoto, with tho Union Pacific Railroad Com
onv 90 az financial agent; but when the committees We
ean nrobns II appeared clear that nc ma" ii''' -
ipy Of absolute knowledge or value anu '''." 80.
nrotossed 70 know was based on hearSas S" ,
When the subject Of the sale OF tne u'' - % bc
manfred about Mr.. Anderson asAeo Nio "'',.'s 49,.
- 80 s,otno tnovledge that would tend TO snow "i"'
NJ conld or anybody else bought tho bonus ~ ""O
or,ce from Mr. Richardson and sold them 10 'no ~
Pacific at another. The reply was that in' S' -,
Id him ne was obliged 10 mako bargain WIN "ou" "
order to get rid of his load but ne M" i' ''''''
yond what Richardson had told hihl' ,
m witness WAS several times called to account by INC
Commission for his denuneiaory remarks respecting o'N
tain individuals among them John H. Aiey' ohSo w.
Mr. Anderson told him that the Commission soushU o"
Cor facts Mr. Pondir replied that the statements he WIS
max
them to vindicate the reputation OF oakes ana oes
Amss aPerbaps" said Mr. Anderson, they do not need
your yindication" Referring TO Colonel Ihoims a.
scots relations TO the road the witness SAID he had once
gone into tho Office of Mr. Carnegie In TINS CITY, "hee
Colonel Scott was seated alone. The latter poihtcd 10
some eighty railroad bonds and said they were to be dis
posed of for the account Of Mr. Baine tna' he ou noe
propose to pay for them. but that the company Woui"
have to do so. Mr.. Anderson asked
aDo you mean to state 10 this Commission that MI
blaine received eighty eghtywo bonds or any oter
number of bonds from the authorities OF the Union
Pacific Railway Company for some llegluhiate ooH'i
alton Is that what you mean I"
Tho witness REPLIED The bonds did not belong 10 the
Union Pacific but Tom Scott said they would have 10 DC
paid for by the Union Pacific Company for account OF
Mr. Blaine 80, ~
Mr. Pondr who had previously Numbered with snch
violence on the table when den0uncing John Is Ahey
that he was requested by Of the commissioners 10
desist as he interfcred With the work of the Official
looked around the room as II he hau pro-
duced a sensation. Judge Dillon then quietly asked
MIR Pondr you do not say that Mr.. Blaine was pres
emit"
"No, sir" was the reply.
And Mr.. Scott Is dead, believe"
ayes, sir"
aThen that viii do" remarked one of the commission
srs and the others nodded their assent
MR. GoULD's APPEARANCES AND MANNER.
Mr. Gould had meanwhile entered the room and taken
Ia
WAS unconscious Of his presence Mr.. Goulds eyes
twinkled humorousy at of the remarks OF the
witness After being told that his time had expired ana
that the Commission would be glad TO have hin bring MS
books before them which lie consented TO do MI Pondir
left the chair Turning he met Mr. Gould All" he
said goot morning, Mr. Goult and at the same time
extended his hand which Mr. Gould smllingy accepted
sIttn't say all know" continued Mr.. Pondir. but
left some tngs for you" Again Nr Gould smiled pleas
snty as he took his godbowed spectaces from his nose
i'll sfr.rs
memoranda
Immediately a hush came over the assembly and Mr..
Gould rising from the chair he had occupied took that
vacated by Mr.. Pondir He was dressed IN dark gray
business suit and presented his usual neat appearance
His well shaped head was shown TO good advantage
owing to the recent attentions OF barber He sat az
the corner Of the table next TO the chairman who was
seated at the end The official stenogapher sat on his
right Behind him was Mr. Holiness to his left. In the
rear was Judge Dillon; In front OF him Commissioner
Anderson, at whose left sat Commissioner Littler
At last Mr. Gould rose to take the oath. His face
assumed its customary grave and thoughtful expression
Then he resumed his and looked around the table
calmly 10 await the attack. There wac something dra-
matte in the this point and during the moments
of deep silence followed The neeks OF the spectators
who now crowded the were eraned and their heads
turned at angle the better to hear the t WORDS
which the witness was 10 utter
Commissioner Anderson funbled some papers, while
the dark eyes of Chairman Pattison were eyeed search
ngly upon the coGntenance OF the witness. Commits
noner IAer also looked the table If quietly
studying the characteristics OF the famous hnancler'
while Congressman Payson from his distant seat in one
corner manifested his interest by leaning slightly Tor
ward in az expeetant attitude The face of Mr. Gould
bore no trace interest in the proceedings The thought
ful lines Oh his forehead there the physical traces
his many years Of care in active business me- but
when he casually glanced up at those around MIN there
WAS auntire absence OF seconsceusness and only the
a. fita..q ina
of the world and the knowledge OF the possession OF the
soul behind it 10 meet them rs they came.
As usual Mr. Gould spoke in extremely low tone-so
low indeed that it was scarcely than audible to
these Immediately surrounding hmand Only OCCASIONALLY
to tie crowd that surged in the rear Commissioner
Itcr in response 10 request In behalf OF the reporters
asked Mr. Gould TO Try speak up he could be heard
The witness smiled pleasantly and raised his voice
slightly bat in few minutes it hal dropped 10 its nat
ural low tone.
FIRsT CONNECTION WITH THE UNION PACIFIC.
The examination was conducted by Mr. Anderson and
he first questions upon the earlier life OF the wit
cess have resided in NewYork since 1858 or 1851,
paid Mr. Gould, and have been connected with railroads
Tor many years since that time"
DO you recall any financial connection you had with
he Union Pacific Railway Company prior 10 1878 ." was
asked.
The witness replied that he had had connection with
the company previous that year that he could renem
ber In the spring of that year. he said met
Horace f. Clark Chicago He spoke highly of the
propery that sent an order NewYOrk TO buy Of
think IS downward from that figure
Mr. Clark was sick and about TO die His stock was sold
and my order caught much Of IT, The stock began 10 go
down and became alarmed. met Mr. Alley in New
York and asked him what the matter with the stock
The reply that the company had an immense floating
debt which being carried at rates of inter
est and there several millions OF bonds coming due.
The stock got down to about Ia shortly. then had
about 800 in It, Shortly after Inade proposition
that we should fund this debt and did fund IL into
honda served on the executive committee that was
appointed with Sidney Dillon Mr.. Dexter and others
Tie scheme worked well aud Of course as the property
improved the stock went VI. From 1874 to 1877 was
,member of the Board of Direction. and was familiar