The Indianapolis journal. [volume] (Indianapolis [Ind.]) 1867-1904, 1886-02-09
This Is Not a Government of Secrets, and the
Senate Is Entitled to All Papers that In
fuence the Action Of the President.
Power of the National Senate to Demand
Information Must Be Upheld.
Precedents Revealed by Senator Edmunds's
Search for Facts Connected with Remov-
ais by Authority of the President.
SENATOR sHERMAS.s SPEECH.

AcSos OI the 6enates
WASHINGTON, Feb. Sin the Senate. to- day,
IN discussing a resolution of inquiry as to the
conduct of government officials at New Orleans,
introduced by Mr.. Eustis, Senator Sherman said
the Senate had a perfect right to anything on
the executive files. Mr.. Sherman continued:
4 think We have a right to seek information of
any department of the government, whether the
information be on paper or by parole. I do not
think there is any doubt of it whatever. But
for that we could not ~legislate, we could not
even hold executive sessions. That has always,
from the foundation of the government, been
the established law. ANY information that may
affect the judgment or conduct of a Senator on
any subject of public duty is information that
the President is bound to communicate. There
ought to be no secrets whatever in this govern
ment of ours. It is a government of the people.
There is no rule or provision for keeping secrets.
We have no right to say to another department
OF the government, For what reason did you do
this thingg The President has no right to come to
US and say, Why did you pass this lawP He has
no right to cross-examine us. The departments
are separate and distinct. But all the informa-
ton contained on the files of any department. is
just as much the property Of a Senator as Of any
body else. There is no secret in this govern
ment that can be protected from legislative SUI
pervision."
MIR. Saulbsury-I differ from the Senator in
regard to this. If we have a nomination to
act on. we can call for information as to the
NOMINEES; but we go behind that, and ask for in
formation as to a suspended officer. The entire
discretion is vested in the President. 1 would
like to ask the Senator, as a lawyer, whether
there is any court in this country, from the Su-
preme Court down, that can control the discre-
ton of a trustee. however humble a trustee he
may be2
Mr.. Sherman-Is that not an evasion of the
whole controversy We do not claim to exer-
else any power whatever over the discretion of
the President. We admit, even, that we do not
ask for his reasons; but we have the power TO
control our own discretion. And we have a
right to all the information we can get from the
executive department to ~enlighten US. Nobody
| proposes to control the exercise of the Presi-
dents discretion-nobody He is as independent
as 70 are. But he must not control our discre-
ton. He must not prevent us from having the
same sources of information that he has. He
makes the nomination. Why did he make that
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man, a corrupt man, a thief, a d~efaulter. or the
like2 Our discretion ought to be enlightened by
all the information that the President has. I
say, therefore, that we have the right
to call for that information. At the same
time we should be, to the President.
always courteous; and if he should give any rea-
son for withholding a paper. for example, be-
cause it is marked CONFIDENTIAL, !" / should not
object to that. If there are papers not meant
for the public eye, and he should choose to with
hold those. as a matter of confidence, 1 would
say that that was probably a case for the exer-
else of discretion. If he should say, II DO not
care to talk about that; that came to me in con-
fdence;" that is one thing. But when he says
that papers upon which he acts, containing
charges made boldly and openly, controlled his
reason. controlled his conduct in making an ap-
pointment-papers on the public files, he has no
no right to withhold these papers merely be-
cause they came to him about an executive mat
ter. He ought to give them to us, unless they
are in the nature of secret, confidential papers.
coming to him privately. But they ought not to
be filed; they ought not to be there to poison the
fame Of a man or to affect his family in future
time. If they are not to be seen by us, they
ought to be put into the waste basket without
action. That is what I always do with anonyz
nous papers that come to me.
Mr.. Pugh-The call that you make upon the
President or upon any officer of the Cabinet,
is for public documents. You do not claim that
the Senate can call upon him for any other than
public or public records. The
character of those documents and those records
determines the right OF the Senate to their
possession; the character of these public docu-
ments decides whether the Senate has a right to
call for them. The use that the Senate intends
to make of them determines its right to make
the call. Who is to be judge of the documents,
as to whether they are public or private2 Who
is to be judge of whether this information or
paper in possession of the President, or member
| of his Cabinet, should be sent to the Senate2
Who is to be judge of whether the Senate has
the right to call for theml Some one must have
the power to determine that question. There
dent the power to determine what the character
of these documents is, and so whether the Senate
has the power to call for them.
Mr.. Sherman-Where did the Senator from
Alabama Mr.. Pugh] discover this new-fangled
idea? Where are the presidents that enable
him to say that the head of a department shall
say what papers shall be given to the legislative
department? When, in the hundred years of
this country's history, was such a doctrine pre-
sented befcres The Senator from Alabama lMr.
Pughl was a member of the House many years
ago. He Will remember that, time and time
again, we investigated the administrations of
Franklin Pierce and James Buchanan. We
called before US all the papers, secret and pub
lie. in regard to those administrations, and they
were never denied to US by the last two Demo
cratic Presidents. They never contended that
they could withhold one paper and give another.
On the contrary, in obedience to law, the Secre-
tary OF the Navy sent to the House Of Repre-
sentatives a private letter of James Buchanan.
which entered into the public records, aud was
commented upon and used. The idea of a dis
tinction between papers public and private
never occurred until during the present admin
istration. Why, Mr.. President, the law
is plain and mandatory. I happened to
hold the Office OF Secretary of the
Treasury at one time, and / was brought before
the houses of Congress, the Senate and House Of
Representatives, when they called on me for pa
pers in a certain eontroverted case, and | will
not refer to it at any length, because it was in
executive session. They not only called on me
for the papers, but they called on me to come in
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