Evening star. [volume] (Washington, D.C.) 1854-1972, 1885-10-22
GRANT AND JOHNSON.
An Exciting Cabinet Meeting I'm Recon.
structiOn Days.
THE RECORD WHICH Ex-PREsIDENT JOHNSON
SHOWED PROMINENT TENNESSEE NAN
GRANT DENoUNcED BIZ JOHNSON AND wELLEs

THE RECORD WHICH Ex-PREsIDENT JOHNSON
SHOWED A PROMINENT TENNEssKE NAN
GRANT DENOUNCED BIZ JOHNSON AND wELLEs.
Gen. Rolfe g. Saunders, of Tennessee who
has been prominent In the politics Of that state
for many years, in talking to STAR reporter
this morning declared, in the strongest terms
his disbelief in Mr.. Chauncy NJ. Depew's &C
count Of Gen. Grants recollections Of certain
interviews between himself and President
Andrew Johnson. "Why," said Gen. Saunders,
"Grant hated johnson worse than any man
the time Grant related his version Of the affair
~ Depew ne was q different man from what he
became later. After his afflictions and mis-
aEed Wits Bepsw be Was u OF
hatred of Johnson. In 1871 was sitting In ex-
President JohDson's library with him. in Green
as and remarRsd: l sPew Sos
some unwritten history. He reached up to the
business house. There were number of these
volumes ranged alongside each other;
hs LAID down before aSa m ansnea the t he n hss
a newspaper it was a detailed record Of
meeting. These volumes contained the min
utes of all the cabinet meetings of Johnson's
administration. The proceedings were set forth
In clear hand. read the record of the meet
ing to which he had called my attention. It
contained the expressions of the opinions of the
cabinet members concerning Grants course
with regard to the secretaryship of war. He
had as is we'll known, consented to take that
position tor the purpose of aiding the admins
tration to get Stanton out. In that very meet
ing he was accused by the President and his
cabinet ministers of treachery and dOuble-deal-
ing. Gideon We1les employed the strongest
Language in denouncing Grants conduct, and
L never read such an excoriation as the Presi-
dent gave Grant. In language as forcible as
Johnson could employ-and he knew how to
use vigorous Epglish-he denounced Grant for
his deception and treachery. He charged him
with having played the spy upon the admins
traiion and the cabinet. After having read the
denunciatfon,I asked Mr.. Johnson where Grant
wa, at the time. He replied with great earnest
ness
- him. as close to me as you are, and dur
Ing the delivery of my remarks l shook my
finger riga in bis face
"He, Grant, continued Gen. Saunders,
me ther looked up nor replied, so President
johnson told me. Now, IL is plain to be seen
that Grant was moved by vindictfve spite in
telling what he did. It's absurd. Mr.. johnson
was not socially tabOoed. 1t is true there were
people who didn't like him. but he was governor
of the state, United States Senator etc, and had
as high q social position as anybody. Again,
there were very few southern men here in
Washington at the time Grant refers to. I was
elected to Congress from the Memphis district
In 1865 and came on here, but never got my
seat. l know that very few OF the leaders of
southern sentiment and opinion were here
about that time. johnson never did say, either,
that traitors should be hung. He said treason
should be made odious and traitors punished