The Indianapolis journal. [volume] (Indianapolis [Ind.]) 1867-1904, 1885-11-09
GRANT AND TILDEN.
The Generals Position in 1877 in Reference
to the Disputed Presidential Succession.
Interview with Cart. A. K. Lee.

|
fully the assertions of Mr.. Chiids, telegraphed
to the Herald, Captain Lee said:
"Without denying, Mr.. Childs seems to dis
| credit my statement that General Grant told me
| that he would have hung Tilden had the latter
| undertaken to be naugurated as President in
| lieu of Hayes. Yet General Grant did make
that very declaration to me on two different oc-
| casions. We were discussing the threats of some
of the Democratic leaders-as, for instance. that
| of General Ewing, of Ohio, that an army 2OO,-
900 strong would march on to Washington in
support of Mr. Tilden's claims-and the inten-
| ton of Mr. Tilden 10 60 to Washington and be
sworn in President when the General
| marked
"IF HE meaning Tildenl HAD UNDER
TAKEN TO DO THAT, I WOULD HAVE
HUNG HIM.
''These were General Grants very words On
the second occasion the General, after saying
that he would have hung Tilden if the latter had
attempted to be inaugurated, added
| I would like TO have hayes know that
| Mr. Childs says notice, that such express
| sions as these attributed to General Grant will
be surprise to the gentlemen who knew him
| tGrant) intimately and that | must have mis-
| understood the General. There was no misun-
| derstanding about it, and General Grants utter
| ances startled me no less than they seem to
| startle Mr. Childs. Twas impressed by the Gen
| erals serious, deliberate and determined manner
| of speaking no less than by his words and both
| his manner and his language are perfectly dis
| tinct In my mind. 1t is quite possible that on
the morning next after the election General
| Grant may, Mr.. Childs says, have
| expressed his personal belief that Mr. Tilden
was elected Probably at that time that opu-
| ion was expressed by great many Republicans,
| who were just as positively of the opposite opin
| ION when they arrived at h better understanding
of the facts in the case. may remark further
! that IN the course of his conversations with
| General Grant never gave the slightest intima-
ton that he then believed, or had ever believed
| that Mr. Tiden had the slightest claim on the
| presidential office-quite the reverse The same
| is true far as | know as to General Grants
| position during the entire controversy between
the presidential election and the inauguration of
| Hayes Another thing which seems to discredit
| the Child's story is the fact (for have every
reason to believe it is a fact) that President
| Grant had made the most thorough preparations
| possible to thwart any attempt inaugurate
| Mr.. Tilden. On this subject had a converse
| ton some years ago with Gen. f. F. Noyes the
| minister to France. l understood General Noyes
| to say that he knew President Grant pre-
pared at the first show of violence or revolution
| airy proceedings in Mr.. Tildep's behalf to crush
and utterly stamp out anything of the kind;
| that for this purpose General Grant did not pro
| pose to rely upon the army, but that without
| calling upon the military, he had made ample
provision for all the force and all the assistance
necessary Now, don't pretend to know what
was meant by this General Moves can, no
! doubt ii he deems best, explain it; but my i'm
preston was and is that General Grant had a
police force organized, mainly from soldiers then
| in civil life, and that upon their loyalty and
| vigilance he proposed to rely in any emergency
in which other means might be improper or un-
| available"
You think, then, that Grants frmness and
| decision prevented a forcible attempt to inau-
| gurate Tidenl" the Captain was asked.
Il have not douot of it. But for that de-
termined man in the White House. we would
! have had trouble, and very serious trouble
| Grant had made arrangements to have Hayes
| safely installed as his successor, and when he
said to me that he would have hung Tiden had
| the latter attempted to be inaugurated, his
language was in exact keeping with his previous
| acts. may add that all this seems to me utter
| y inconsistent with the idea that General Grant
believed that Mr.. Tiden had been fairly and
| lawfully elected President The fact is and it
is fact which history will .corroborate, that no
President was ever more fairly and justly
| counted in than WAS r. B. Hayes"
| ION what do you base that statementg
| "Why," said he, lust look at the Louisiana
count. about which so much is said. That count
was made in strict accordance with the laws of
the State of Louisiana in force at that time, and
| had the count been otherwise made-that is to
| say, had it been made in accordance with the
face of the returns-it would simply have been
an outrage upon all law and all political Justice.
| To say nothing of the legality of the case moth
| ing could have been fairer or more just than to
| throw out entirely the vote of parish when it
| had been made clear beyond all controversy or
question that no fair and legal election had been
| held in that parish. That, in my Judgment
| ought to be done everywhere-that is to saw
| fraud and violence, whetherin Louisiana or Ohio,
| ought to vitlate the vote of a community which
| deliberately toerates and connves at such out
RACES. Such was the law of Louisiana, and it
gave that State to Hayes. Now, where the
| fraud in that2"
The interviewer gave it up and asked, "How
| about FloridaW
las to Florida, would say that when Mr.. W.
| e. Chandler went down there, as it was perfectly
| proper that he should do to see that honest Re
| publican voters were not cheated in the count of
| their votes. he voluntarily sent me cipher and
accompanied 1t with a note, saying he would
| keep me (which meant of course, the President
elect advised to the progress of events. He
sent me various cipher dispatches during his So
| journ in Florida. / remember that the purport
| of one dispatch was that the majority in the
State woIld not be more than forty or fifty either
| way but which way he was unable to state.
Now, If Mr.. Chandler had been there on mis-
| sion of fraud. he would have, of course, claimed
| everything, and claimed it with confidence. He
would also have been in collision, no doubt, with
others in this alleged scheme of fraud and he
would naturally have expected some kind of an
understanding or some sort of encouragement
from those who were to be the beneticiaries of
| the fraud; but don't believe word ever passed
between President Hayes and Mr.. Chandler, or
any other person engaged in supervising the
count in behalf of the Republicans, while the
count was IN progress
Il know, also, that Mr. Hayes seemed to be
about as Indifferent to the outcome of the whole
controversy AS any man could be. I remember
that went over to his house late one evening
with Geographic message in regard to Florida
which indicated that that State would be counted
for 1ilden: Hayes looked at the dispatch, and,
after reading it. simply remarked that he had
| thought the balance of chances was slightly in
our favor, but that he not at all surprised at
| this news and he did not seem to care farthing
about it one way or the other. In fact to me-
he seemed to be altogether too Indifferent In
deed, 1 may add that Hayes never sought the
| presidency at ALL"
Captain Lee was asked if he did not think.
as matter of fact, that Hayes wanted the nom
| inatiop.
Governor Hayes" he said, ibid everything
he could possibly to prevent his nomination
More than that he did not wish to run for a