Daily globe. [volume] (St. Paul, Minn.) 1878-1884, 1882-02-03


mistake about it.
Senator Windom-But the senator himsel
does not understand it.
Senator Vest-I will not let that senate
judge for me. / believe he has Violated tn
3 constitution, and am willing to leave the mat
ter to the people. Congress has pointed out
way to meet the emergency of bonds falling
due.
Senator Window, interrupting-Right a
that point, say the bonds did not become
: due. They were payable at the pleasure of TIL
government, and they so stand to-day.
Senator Vest-So much the better for my
argument. The sovereign power of the coun
try had spoken In regard to that, and had sait
the bonds were to be funded in per cents
The secretary then had the alternative eithel
to let the bonds remain as they were, or funC
at per cent, but he violates the constitution
in undertaking to legislate in regard to thu
obligations OF the government.
Senator Window said that at last, after hii
urgent call for three days for some one tC
point out the law violated, the senator West
had specifically indicated the law. 1t was .
law which the president vetoed, and which
never did become a law.
Senator Vest-If the gentleman is satisfied
with that statement / am. Let it go to the
country in that way.
Senytor Ingalls, said the transaction had
been presented here as simple voluntary re
lease on the part OF the boEd holders, and that
they agreed, without solicitation or action by
the government, to surrender their bonds and
release OK and IN per cent respectively on Is
and 5S, and that the government accepts the
proposition. Yet the language of the treas
ury circular giving notice was not that, if the
holders should request tie have their bonds
granted if the bonds were received
before certain time. Here was
proof of bargain proposed by an executive
| officer without authority of law, and in vio-
lation of the express declaration of congress,
made not more than three months before,
| that the only fund debt thereafter to be recog-
nized by the government was to be at 3 per
cent
Senator Windom-Will the senator refer us
| to that act?
Senator Ingalls-The senator is pleased to
| be jocular. He is pleased again to repeat his
| wittlcism that We are referring tn law that
| was vetoed | say that law was not vetoed,
but that by large majority congress ex-
pressly declared the debt should be funded at
3 per cent, and the fact that an alleged repub-
| lican president saw fit to veto it, does not af
| feet the accuracy of my statement. The
pretense that national banks were afraid of the
results of the Carlisle amendment was pre-
| tense merely. 1t was a subterfuge and insin-
| cere reason. Why capitalists were opposed to
the bill of the last congress was because of the
rate of interest in 1t and not because of the
Carslisle amendment. They use that as blind
and cover. 1t has repeatedly been shown to
| be not obnoxious to the arguments urged
against it. The treasury department, in ex-
| press defiance of the will of congress, invited
this transaction with the bondho]ders. The
senator from Minnesota had asked any senator
| to point to one feature in
which the operation was illegal.
He Qngalls) charged it was Illegal
| from its conce ption, as the secretary had no
| authority for it. Itwould have been as il
| legal, unconstitutional and without warrant
of the government, if he had bargained for 3
| per cent. or 10 per cent, and the argument
| that the government was benefited By it was
| one not 30 worthy of consideration, no re-
quest having been made by the holders
| for an extension. The second invitation
and their responses were made. These were
| not voluntarily made by the holders, as has
| been represented, and it was not time the gov
| eminent sat as an idle spectator In the matter,
| and it was equally untrue that the arrange
ment was without Its solicitation. The issu-
ance of the treasury noeces showed solicita-
| ton by the government. There was nothing
to show the bondholders' suggested plan.
| Senator's Ingalls, and Wyndom here became
involved in controversy upon the accuracy
of the formers assertion that the latter and
others engaged in the debate had repeatedly
declared the transaction was voluntary re-
lease ON the part OF the creditor without the
! governments solicitation, of l Y and Ok per
| cent
Senator Ingalls, reiterated the untruthfulness
| of this, and again referred to the secretary S
official notice in proof of the fact. He
added, this exchange of one for another issue
of bonds was the only one in our financial
| history that has been made without authority
of law and that its illegality was undeniable.
| Senator Window asserted the exchange had
been made precisely as all others were made,
| and that the authoril y for 1t was the same as
| in other cases.
| Senator Ingalls, expressed his regret that the
| senator's obtuseness rendered him incapable OF
| approaching the difference between this and
like transactions authorized by law. He then
| read the endorsement across the face of the
continued bonds, and charged that, being I'M
| authorized, this was an unlawful mutiatiOn
of bonds.
| Senator Window said the release Of the
creditor was On its face.
| Senator Iugalls-Who put it on?
Senator Windom-The printer.
Senator Ingalls-Then the holder of this
contract, against whom it has been forced, had
nothing to do with putting it on the bond.
Senator Windom-The senator believes the
whole transaction to be unconstitutional.
What does he propose to do about it,
Senator Ingalls-I propose to say it shall
be made valid.
Senator Windom-You cannot say that il
you think the constitution violated.
Senator Ingals-Well, can violate 1t just
as well as you can. Great laughter)
Senator Windom-Do you intend to vote to
return the difference in interest to the bond
holders?
Senator Ingalls-No, l don't. I propose
to say that as far as congress is concerned,
their acts shall not be disturbed, but when
the senator says it can be justified under the
laws and the constitution, deny it..
Mr.. Windom-Is It not the duty of the SEN
ate to take some step to refund the money
unconstltutionally withheld from these
people?
Senator Ingalls, don't think it is, would
rather pay it out of my own pocket. Laugh
teri
Senator Windom-Does the senator intend
TO pay it out of his own pockets
Senator Ingalls-I shall, if my bill passes to
that effect. shall pay my share of taxes.
Senator Window senator does not in
tend to do anything to return to these holders
the money he thinks was Illegally extorted
from them.
Senator Ingalls, have not said anything
about their right to release their interest